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We are recording. Thank you. Good evening. Seeing a presence of a quorum, I am calling the June 1st, 2026 special meeting of the Town Council and Finance Committee to order at 6:30 p.m. Please be advised that this meeting is being held in person and that remote

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access option for members of the public is provided as a courtesy only. In the event of technology issues with the remote connection, the meeting will continue in person as scheduled as long as there is a quorum of the council present in the town room or through technological means. Chapter 2 of the

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acts of 2025 extended through June 30, 2027, the ability of public bodies to meet without a quorum of the council physically present at the meeting location, although a quorum of council is present in the town room. This meeting is being recorded and is accessible in real time via Zoom, phone, and as a live broadcast on Ammeris Media

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Channel 9 and at ammermedia.org. At this time, I will call upon each counselor by the name they have indicated that they would like to be addressed. This will indicate that we can hear you and you can hear us. Councelor Breick, >> present. >> Councelor Kennel Martin, >> present.

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>> Um, Andy Churchel, >> yes. >> Anna Deon Gothia, >> present. >> Lynn Greimer, >> present. Mandy Johanni is present. Councelor Lord >> present. >> Sam McCloud >> present. >> Pam Rooney >> here. >> Pam Rooney.

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>> Could you not hear me? I said here. >> Okay. Thank you. Councelor Ryan >> here. >> Kathy Shane >> here. >> Jennifer Todd >> here. And councelor Walker is not here yet. Um if counselors have technical issues, please let the council clerk

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know or call a point of personal privilege. At this time, I'll recognize Kathy to call the finance committee to order. >> I'm calling the finance committee to order. Um, members of the council have already indicated they could hear and be heard, so I'm calling on Jose of Jane,

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who is one of our resident members. >> Yes, I'm here. Thank you. >> Thanks, Joe. Thank you. At this time, this is the capital improvement program public forum. We will move to the regular council meeting immediately after this. Um, for those that are here

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for that, um, at this time I will recognize Paul um, for the capital improvement program brief presentation. >> Actually, I'm going to turn it right over to Sean Mangano, our finance director. >> Thank you everybody. Can you hear me? Okay.

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>> Yes. >> So, my name is Sean Mano. I'm the director of finance for the town and tonight is our public forum on the capital improvement program. Uh this year's plan is the result of a lot of hard work by department heads and our joint capital planning committee uh to put together a five-year vision for

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capital needs for the town. This year, like in past years, we started with last year's plan and then worked with department heads to identify what new needs there were and pull it all together. Um next slide. So this year's plan allocates 11.5

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million of uh funding, which includes everything but enterprise funds, which are supported by water and sewer rates. This does include debt and the roughly threearters of the funds are going to the schools, library and public works. Uh the schools and the library portions

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both include debt payments for uh new building projects that are anticipated. So that's why their slices are a little bit bigger than typical. And the public works slice includes all of our road investments, which is is pretty standard. Next slide. So some highlights of this year's plan.

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In economic development, there is $200,000 for the planning department uh to bring on consultants and experts to help them uh program the Wildwood site, which we anticipate uh being turned back to the town in the fall. Uh there will be uh community involvement in that

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process. And so uh these funds will help support that effort. And then the Hampshire College campus, which the town does not own, but has um an interest in what ultimately happens there. This will provide the department with any resources they need um to support that effort. And then in infrastructure and

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sustainability, there's 1.2 million for road repair and cash capital or road repair and um resurfacing. That's the cash capital component. That combined with chapter 90 will produce well over $2 million for road repairs. And then lastly, there's uh $200,000 uh really

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for our sustainability director to implement different strategies that are outlined in the climate action plan. Um and and we we can update the the group more on those strategies later. Next slide. Uh debt is a large portion of our

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capital improvement program. The first thing we do is subtract any debt from projects approved in the past. And this chart uh the top section is sort of our regular municipal debt that's been approved um in the the years going forward. The second section is our

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municipal debt that was funded through a debt exclusion, which is really just the schools. So there's an additional tax levy that's temporary to fund that specific debt. Next is our regional school uh district assessment which is the debt of the region but we are allocated a slice of that every year.

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And then the last section is our community preservation act debt. And the only difference uh between this chart and what was in the budget document that you all received is the war memorial bath house at the bottom. That project wasn't approved at the time we printed the budget uh but it is now approved. So

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we've put on this uh sheet the projection of that debt. Next slide. So as we uh look to the future, we use this five-year plan to guide our decision-m. Uh one key element of this year's plan uh which is really emphasized by the joint capital planning

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committee is no new debt and being really judicious with taking on any new debt uh before we take on the DPW because we want to keep our our debt obligations as low as possible to to make that as easy on the town as possible. But it's it's still going to be a challenge. Uh another component of

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this is that it allocates 10 and a half% of the tax levy, which is up a little bit from the prior year. And that's the level we think is necessary to uh complete our four building projects and also have some funds available to meet other needs uh in our departments every year. And so that leads me to the last

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piece of that slide, which is as we look forward um and you look at the the capital plan, the there's not enough resources to meet all of our needs. So, we're going to have to look work very carefully with our our department heads um to prioritize their projects, seek alternative funding sources, um seek alternatives to their projects that

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still can address the need. Um and that'll be a major challenge for uh the upcoming capital improvement programs. Next slide. There's a couple underlying plans that are are ingrained within this capital improvement program. The first is our road improvements. Um, a few months ago

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we proposed a plan that calls for $25 million to be invested in roads over the next 5 years. Uh, the first year of that plan is funded in in this capital improvement program FY27. And the key here will be in the coming years in the fall when we certify free

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cash and the town council is weighing uh what to do with free cash that we really prioritize roads um in order to to fulfill this plan. Next slide. And then the last piece here is our four building projects. Uh we have two projects that

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are anticipated to be fully completed next fiscal year. We are currently soliciting uh proposals from designers for our DPW. And once that is set, which we we think will be complete in the next month or two. Uh we'll have a much clearer timeline for the DPW project,

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but we think that's still a couple years away before it could potentially open. And that leaves us with the fire station, the the last of the four, which is we do not have enough funding currently to complete. We have $13 million set aside. We anticipate another four to five coming back after the

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elementary school project is complete from the investment tax credit and from rebates. Um, but that still leaves us 10 to12 million short of our target. Um, and we do have some designer funding approved that was approved many years ago. So, as we get closer to that target of $30 million, we can get that design

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work started. And with that, I thank you all and welcome any questions. >> Thank you. It is now 6:38. So, we will have eight at a minimum 8 minutes of public comment at this time. Um, this is public comment only for the capital improvement program. There will be other

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public comment later for general public comment. If you're attending remotely and would like to make public comment on the capital improvement program, please raise your hand now. Um, and if you're in the town room and want to make public comment on it, please sign up with Athena. Residents are welcome to comment or ask questions in this forum related

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to the capital improvement program and plan. It is not a general public comment period. That period will take place during the regular town council meeting that begins after this forum adjourns. >> Council workers joined. >> Oh, thank you. Uh, councelor Walker, can you hear us? >> Yes, I can. Thank you.

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>> Excellent. Thank you. Public forum comments or questions are not reflective of the opinions of the town council. Um because this is a public forum though, if questions are asked about the capital improvement plan, there is a potential for them being answered. We do not have any hands on Zoom raised. Has anyone

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signed up? Athena? >> Yes. >> Excellent. Can you call that person up? >> Did No. Vince Okconor. >> Vince, please come on up. Um state your name and make your comment on Vincent Okconor, 175 Summer Street,

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apartment 12. Good evening. I'm going to ask council members uh tonight to support who support our public schools to engage in smart, responsible budgeting to support both school budgets as voted by the respective school committees. To follow

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my comments, I would refer the council members to page 49, the manager's budget. >> The method is simple. The schools must know by November 1st how much money they have to hire staff and school staff must

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know by July 1st whether they will be retained or have to look elsewhere. Capital budget is budgeting is very different as many of you know from past five four or five years of adding all sorts of capital projects and capital spending in the fall or the following

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spring after the previous year's surpluses have been certified. All capital spending is not finalized or locked in by July 1st, but is spread throughout the fiscal year, which just begins on July 1st, whereas school

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budgets are locked in by July 1st. My request is that the council demand a June 1st, 2026 estimate from the manager and finance director of what surpluses or deficits both from the municipal and

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operating budgets and the all the reserve funds that are projected to be generated um by a post July 1st uh uh evaluation

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and that he provide or they provide um a revised page 49 for the council and include all funds and both operating budgets um for the past two years and the proposed years. With this

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information, the council either one could creatively and responsibly temporarily postpone some capital spending until the fall enough to fully fund the first year of our new elementary schools with the certain knowledge that in the fall the postponed

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capital spending will be able to be fully restored. or two, the council can look at various existing capital spending funds and decide that collectively these existing funds can more than cover enough proposed capital

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spending to offset the manager's $1.5 million cut to the elementary school budget. Um, so I'm urging the board, the council to look creatively at the capital spending proposal with the thing

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of of both assuring itself that the the spending proposed can be put in effect and that the elementary school budget to open the new school uh can also be fully funded as in the uh that the level voted

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by the ATL large elected school committee of Ammerst. Thank you. >> Thank you, Vincent. Is there anyone else signed up for the capital improvement program? >> Stephen, did you want to speak to the capital improvement program or general public comment? >> Okay. Nope, that's it.

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>> No. Okay. It is 6:43, but we must hold the public comment period open for the capital improvement plan until 6:46. Um so if we will wait for those three minutes. If anyone signs up in those

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three minutes um we will recognize them. While we wait, I figured I'd just mentioned that this is a requirement of the charter and the council has preliminarily voted to seek a change to the charter during our charter review committee so that we don't have this

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dead time in the future. Um, but that we still hold these cap the these public forums but without the required time that may be unfilled by comment. Um, we will have I will also say that we will have and I'll announce this again when

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we move to the main meeting. We will have a general public comment period and another special public comment period as required by our rules and regulations. Um, the water and sewer rules and regulations require a special public comment period on those rates. uh which we will do during the meeting when we

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get to that item in the agenda too. So there will be two other public comment periods, one of which will be a general public comment period, but right now we are waiting for the time to expire on the public comment period for capital improvement plan. If there's anyone that

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would like to speak to it on on remote, please raise your hand. And if you're in the town room and have decided you might want to speak to it, speak to our town clerk. Seeing that it is 6:46 um and public comment has been open for

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at least half the time of the meeting at this time I am going to recognize the chair of the finance committee for a motion to adjurnn the finance committee. >> Finance committee is adjourned. >> Uh we're going to take a motion. Uh uh I make a motion to adjurnn the finance

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committee. Is there a second? >> Second. >> And now I have need to Okay. Then I will call on the counselors first. Uh Sam Mloud >> I. >> Lynn >> I >> Kathy is a yes. Jill >> yes.

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>> Anna >> hi. >> And Joe Jane. >> Yes. Thank you. >> We are adjourned. >> Thank you. I move to adjourn the public forum for the town council. Is there a second? >> I.

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>> That was Lynn Greamemer seconding that. Um, we will now vote on that. We'll start with councelor Brevik. >> Yes. >> Councelor Keno Martin. >> Yes. >> Andy Churchill. >> Yes. >> Anna Delgen Gothier. >> I. >> Lynn Greamer.

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>> I. >> Mandy Johani is an I. Councelor Lord. >> I. >> Sam Mloud. >> I. >> Pam Rooney. >> Yes. Councelor Ryan, >> hi. >> Kathy Shane, >> yes. >> Jennifer Tob, >> yes. >> And councelor Walker, >> yes.

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>> The public forum is adjourned. Um, at 6:47 p.m., we will now move directly into the regular meeting. Um, there is still a present of a quorum.

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Uh, so I am calling the June 1st, 2026 regular meeting of the town council to order at 6:47 p.m. Again, please be advised that this meeting is being held in person and that the remote access option for members of the public is provided as a courtesy only. In the

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event of technology issues with the remote connection, the meeting will continue in person as scheduled as long as there is a quorum of the council present in the town room or through technological means. The meeting is continuing to be recorded and is accessible in real time via Zoom, phone, and as a live broadcast on Ammerst Media

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Channel 9 and Ammerst Media.org. I have already taken the remote the roll call attendance to make sure everyone can hear and be heard. As I stated earlier, there will be one public comment period during general public comment period and one special public

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comment period devoted to comments on the proposed FY27 water and sewer rates and amendments to the water and sewer regulations. Uh if you are in the town room, please sign up with the council clerk to make public comment at either of those sessions. If you are attending remotely at the time, I will ask you to

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raise your hand in the Zoom application when we reach that time. Um the announcements are in the agenda, but we have one additional one um that I'm going to recognize Kathy for.

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>> Yeah. Hi. Um, I didn't get it on the agenda, but I wanted everybody to know that on June 6, this Saturday at 11 in the morning, there is a celebration of the 200th year anniversary of the North Ammeris Church, that historic church

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that stands at the entrance to North Ammerst. It will be a celebration both of the history with some recounting of it, amazing food, and there's an extraordinary organ, and we have an organist coming. So, it is a you all come um and I just met it's it's going

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to have a terrific agenda. >> Thank you, Kathy. Uh there are no hearings scheduled for tonight. So, we move on to general public comment. Anyone wishing to make general public comment who is attending remotely, please raise your hand in the Zoom application. If you are present in the

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town room and have not signed up with the council clerk, please do so now. Residents are welcome to make public comments on matters within the jurisdiction of the town council. The council will not engage in a dialogue or comment on a matter raised during general public comment. Public comments

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are not reflective of the opinions of the town council. The first amendment broadly protects individuals rights to address the government to speak and to express themselves including their right to say hateful and offensive things. I am generally unable to shut those commenters down under the first

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amendment to the US Constitution unless their level of speech falls within an exception articulated by the courts such as fighting words, true threats to a particular individual, harassment of a particular individual, or incitement of imminent lawless activity. If a question

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exists as to whether a particular speaker is engaging in unprotected speech, I must defer to the principle of freedom of speech. Uh, there are no hands raised on Zoom of people who wish to make public comment. How many people in the town room have signed up? >> Three. >> Three. Each commenter will have three

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minutes to make their comment. Aina. >> Evan Naymith. >> Evan, please come on up. State your name and where you live. I think the light is probably still on, but on the on the mic, but if it is not, please make sure it's on and then make your comment. >> Uh, good evening, counselors. Evan A.

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Smith, District 5. Um, I hope you guys got the handout. We're going to discuss some numbers tonight, but if you get bored, just hit the trapoor button and poof. Um, okay. Economic progressivism means that wealthy individuals pay more than their fair share and less wealthy

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individuals get a robust social safety net. Just think about Bernie Sanders. That's economic progressivism. When we look at the raw numbers, it becomes clear that Ammerst current housing policy is not at all progressive. Over the last decade, the average Ammerst homeowner's house has appreciated in

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value by $21,000 a year. Those homeowners also obtain a $2,000 annual benefit from the state and local tax deduction, salt, and another 2,000 a year from the home mortgage tax deduction. Homeowners do, however, have to pay about one and a half% of their

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home's values in upkeep, averaging like 6,000 bucks. They also have to pay $4,200 in capital gains tax, but only when they sell their house way down the line. All in all, the average Ammerst homeowner profits about $15,000 per year just from owning their home. It gets

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worse, though. The benefits are even more extravagant for wealthier homeowners. I live in Ammerst Woods. Since I moved there 5 years ago, my house has appreciated by $200,000. That's 40 grand a year. The average Ammerst renter household makes only

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38,000 a year. That's according to your HPPP. In other words, I make more money just from owning my home than Ammerst renters earn at their jobs. Phrased differently, it's more profitable to own a home in Ammerst Woods than it is to have a full-time job paying $19 an hour.

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To top matters off, our black and brown neighbors are over represented by double in the renter category. If you want racial justice in Ammerst, you must start with housing policy. This is a policy choice, and don't take my word for it. Here's Bernie Sanders. quote, "The housing crisis in America is not a

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consequence of natural disaster. It is a consequence of public policy." End quote. I did not move to Ammerst, Massachusetts to live in a town that is socially progressive but fiscally conservative. The numbers I just quoted shock the conscience. They are a natural consequence of the town meeting

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government wherein homeowners wrote policy to benefit homeowners. But that era is over and we must change. Throughout this summer, I plan on introducing half a dozen bylaws, each aimed at increasing renter affordability. These bylaws are simply

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the codified versions of the HPP's recommendations that 10 of you already endorsed. Next week, I plan on sharing with you some inspiring and bold housing policy changes being undertaken by the most exciting mayor in America, Mayor Mom Donnie. Until then, thank you for

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your time. >> Thank you for coming tonight, Evan. Athena >> Stephen Casey >> Stephen please come on up. State your name and where you live and make your comment. >> Steven Casey, 26 Hock Street, Apartment 7. Uh, first I

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just have to say that is a very sharply dressed gentleman over there. And uh from what he was saying uh I agree with the concerns of the economic strain. You know, we see at this local level that we're not alone in that. We see that

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over the state in the country. And uh I'm actually here tonight because I I just cannot stand my idol. Uh one of the huge impacts on our economy is

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Hampshire College. Um the school is of great value to me personally and it should be to all of you. The loss of that school, the loss of the jobs with the staff,

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those are our neighbors, our community members, students losing their academic community for the alum. No more reunions. All that that school has given us.

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our local town leaders, our favorite places to eat and much more. But it has been, you know, stated that the current plan is not feasible and so there has to be a change

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and I I accept that and we accept that. But the current situation at Hampshire continues to deteriorate almost weekly. Right now, there are about 100 students there on campus who are working

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diligently to complete their program for the fall, working through the summer, and now they're being told that there might not be enough funding to see them through that plan. the students that have transferred to other schools are facing challenges

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where they are not receiving the same financial aid packages that were offered at Hampshire. For some students that were going back to school, this now places a huge block and hindrance on

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their academic progress. And so I would just like to use this platform to bring to people's attention the the need. Um I'm not savvy enough with all the different fundraising uh programs that are coming on and I don't

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I'm not as prepared as I I'd wanted to be today. But you know such is the such is the time. So the dream is to be able to purchase Hampshire. It's possible, maybe not in

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its entirety, but in pieces. Town residents have expressed their interest in parts of the land, and I would like to further that conversation and just urge you to support all the students at Hampshire cuz Ammerst is

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about education. Just look at the budget. >> Thank you so much for coming tonight, Stephen. >> Very well, >> Athena. >> Vince Okconor. >> Vince, please come on up. State your name and where you live and make your public comment. So, uh, Vincent O' Conor, um, 175 Summer

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Street, apartment 12. Um, I have comments about three issues. Um the first is uh about the governor's executive order regarding ICE activity. And I I have to say from what I've read

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and he heard reported, it has the same deficiency that the manager's executive order has. It says all these wonderful things, but it when push comes to shove, it doesn't

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say how where the teeth are, who is going to go out and while people are committing criminal acts against residents of this town and people are calling 911 and asking for help, it doesn't say. And

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that's because we have 351 communities and 351 police departments and so forth. But I I think that it's a serious problem to announce all these things that that sound good for people who run

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institutions, but for the people who are going to end up calling 911, where's the beef? Um so the second comment is has to do with the building projects for public works

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and then for the fire department. I I really think that the town is serious about listening to the the employees of those two uh departments that they should offer the unions that represent

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those departments the the employees of those departments matching funds5 to $10,000 so that the unions can hire competent professional people to participate in the discussion of what is going to be

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constructed and how it's going to be constructed and what it's going to include and not include. And I think that would that's the best way to partner with the employees. Um

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and finally with regard to public works road building um there are two streets that I'd like to mention uh station road between the the temporary bridge so to speak and the

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rail trail and the first half of summer street. These are streets that have been have have had potholes filled and the filling has evaporated, disappeared, been thrown out of the the potholes um

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since it was put in the streets that do that can that appear not to be able to be need to be at the top of the list because those are the streets that are essentially

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irreparable without substantial work. >> Please conclude your comments. Thank you Vincent for coming tonight. Athena, do we have anyone else? >> No. >> And there are no hands raised online. So that concludes general public comment. We will now move to the consent agenda.

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The following items were selected because they were considered to be routine and it was reasonable to expect that they would pass with no controversy. to remove an item from the consent agenda for discussion later in the meeting ask that it be removed when I list the consent agenda items. The request to remove an item from the

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consent agenda does not require a second. So, I will read the motion now, but I won't seek a second until we see if there's anything to remove. Um, and the motion is to remove to move the following items and the printed motions there and approve those items as a

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single unit. Item 8 D, approval of request for long-term use of the public way, Ammerst Mobile Market. Item 8E, approval of permanent changes to the public way, West Street and Mill Lane sidewalk redesign. Item 8F, approval of

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permanent changes to the public way, North Pleasant Street sidewalk and parking improvements. Item 8G, intergovernmental agreement with Pelum for treasurer collector services. Item 8H, acceptance of deed for watershed

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land. This is land that we um approved the borrowing or the money to purchase a couple of meetings ago. Um and now it's accepting the deed for that purchase. Item 9A1:2, approval of town manager appointments to

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the historical commission and a whole bunch of reappointments that are listed on the motion sheet and the agenda. And item 11A, approval of minutes May 18, 2026 regular meeting. Is there a request? Are there any requests to

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remove any items? Kathy Shane? >> Um I'm not going to remember the number, but the North Pleasant Street redesign with parking and sidewalk. >> So that is item 8F. >> Okay. >> Approval of permanent changes North

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Pleasant Street sidewalk. >> Yeah. I'd like to see a look at what that looks like and have a quick discussion. >> No problem. Are there any other requests to remove items? >> Seeing none, um is there a second to the

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motion that includes items 8 D, E, G, H, 9 A, 1, and 2, and 11 A? >> Ryan second. Um, we will now vote and we start with Sam Mloud. >> Can you repeat what we're voting on?

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>> This is the consent agenda without the North Pleasant Street items on it. >> It's on page two of the motion sheet. >> I you >> councelor Ryan. Hi >> Kathy Shane. >> Yes.

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>> Jennifer Tob. >> Yes. >> Councelor Walker. >> Yes. >> Councelor Breick. >> Yes. >> Councelor Kennel Martin. >> Yes. >> Andy Churchill. >> Yes. >> Anna Deongier. >> I. >> Ling Greamer. >> I.

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>> Mandy Johanni is an I. Councelor Lord. >> I. >> That is unanimous. Those items are approved on consent agenda. So now we move on. There are no resolutions and proclamations tonight. There are no presentations and discussion items, although the first

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action item was originally a presentation discussion item until we got a couple of motions associated with it. So, it's kind of a hybrid, I would say. Um, and we are moving on to action item 8A, Hampshire College property land use planning update, authorization for the town manager to enter agreements

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with Mass Development and a proposed council statement identifying key priorities for the next phase of Hampshire College land use. So before we're going to take a little bit of a presentation first and discussion and then we will move on to each of the motions starting with the motion related

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to um authorizing the town manager to enter agreements and then moving on from there. Um which is why I said it's kind of a hybrid of a presentation and a couple of action items. So I'm going to pass it off to Paul. >> Thank you. So tonight we want to give you an update on where we are in the

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land use planning for Hampshire, the land that Hampshire College owns. And Jeff Bagel will be doing a brief presentation. We'll also be asking you to approve and what we call an inter intergovernmental agreement with Mass Development to receive funds to help us

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in the planning process. And then I understand there's another motion that will be proposed by one of the town counselors. Um, a lot is going on with the college right now. I think you've received some of I've emailed you some information even as late as today in terms of the situation with the college

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in terms of its finances. Um, but we're focused tonight on the land the the use of the land and how um we think that the town should be involved in that. Later we will request that you go into executive session to consider potential

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purchase of land, but that will happen at the end of the meeting. So Jeff, do you want to go through your update? >> Yes. Great. Can everyone hear me? >> Yes. >> Excellent. Thanks. Um I'm really happy to be here. I wanted to um come to the

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council with Paul and announce that we are really pleased to um have a collaboration with Mass Development for what we're kind of describing as an extensive but focused initiative to prepare for future potential uses of the Hampshire College campus. Um, as you can

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see here, I'm trying to break down some of the key components, but phase one, um, we've we've received the letter today. I think it was dated yesterday. Um, so this is hot off the presses. We've been working on this for for several weeks to get to this point. Um, and what we're looking to do is have

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phase one, which I'll describe on the next slide, uh, begin pretty much immediately. And it will allow us, you know, access to basically a skilled team. um they're known as house doctors in this in this world with mass development. Um for us to begin to

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assess the land and this is stuff that we talked about last time, but assess the land, prepare maps and gather what's what's really critical baseline information. Um conduct initial public meeting. Um what we're trying to do is have a meeting uh occur in July to to

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give this opportunity for people to talk um and begin to help position the town to create, you know, thoughtful new zoning aimed at, you know, what we're what we're describing as kind of balancing preservation against the need for new housing and tax revenue.

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Um phase one, so we talked about that. Phase two uh will be part of a new rolling grant um that mass development is creating for other communities. There are some there are a couple other communities in Massachusetts who are also working through the challenges and opportunities of closed campus. Um what

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we're really appreciative of is Mass Development's effort to kind of carve off a phase one for us so that we can really start right now with with urgency. And I do want to give um note note uh note that Claire O'Neal is in

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the audience and she's from Mass Development and her and her team have been really critical to shephering us to this point where we're at today. And let's see a couple more notes. So as what's listed on the slide, I mean the goal is really to create a process

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for us to collect information and community input, create a vision for the developable portions of the campus and enact zoning to implement the vision over time. And what this will do is it will really enable us um enable the property to generate muchneeded tax revenue for the town. It's one of the

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overarching goals. It will allow for us to look at and understand and plan for various uh kinds of housing to be implemented over time. And so that is something that we'll continue to say is that we will be hoping to create the plan and the zoning and it'll allow you know something to be implemented over

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time. And then again balancing redevelopment with preservation of important resource areas and we're also embracing the existing cultural institutions. So we are really cognizant of what's surrounding the college campus and the importance of those entities.

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Phase two um we mentioned is going to be implemented for our project. It will seem seamless on the out on the outward facing view, but internally we have kind of this phase one moa that Paul described for for phase one and then we'll have a second agreement for phase

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two as mass development you know unrolls their um their program for the other communities to to join in. Um with that you can go to the next slide. So phase one, you know, is is as I described, kind trying to start immediately. And phase one is really

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targeting June and July. And the things that we talked about last time, you know, we're we're honing in on the things this the things that we want to identify in the activities is really just looking at the basic physical characteristics of the site. Um there's a lot to look at uh and examine which

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we've never really looked at before. So there's roads, there's infrastructure, there's developed areas, there's undeveloped areas. And so this team will really help us um look at that, understand it, map it, and then make that available to the public. Um we're going to look at the existing regulatory

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framework. So the two examples are zoning and wetland regulations, but there's a lot of other things that will probably get incorporated into that review. Um we are, you know, part of the team will look at the market, so the real estate market, the economic

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development components, you know, where where there might be interest. um for uses to look at the campus as well. Um looking at existing infrastructure and utilities. So we have had multiple discussions with DPW. They have some baseline information and understanding

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of what's on the site. But we really need to take a deeper dive into in terms of the location quality and capacity of some of that infrastructure. And that's really this baseline information setting, you know, setting the stage for what's out there today. And through

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phase two, we will start to look at what infrastructure upgrades might be necessary to support various scenarios. And I'll talk about that in a minute. In phase two, um we will look at the the condition of the buildings. It'll probably be visual um for now to just

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get a sense of the buildings. I don't think phase one will be getting us in inside the buildings to do a deep dive in terms of um the condition of the inside of the buildings, but it'll start to assess them for for for multiple different reasons. uh ownership, easements, and access. So, those are all

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things that we will we'll look at in phase one. And then to digest all of that, you we're the team's going to put together some educational materials. We want to do a series of interviews and stake and stakeholder discussions and then look at some development scenarios.

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And so it is noting that this isn't drawings at this stage, but this is to start to look at land area um identify land area that's developable and then start to understand some basic numbers about commercial um opportunities or number of housing units that could

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generally fit on the site just to give us this fit test information. And the proposal is to kind of make this digest digestible small chunks um kind of based on individual um issues or topics and um it doesn't

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say it here but it will be hosted on a website and so we will publicly make this information available and then so leading into July is our target to have a listening session with the community. Um you we would expect it to have an open presentation to present some of the

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baseline data mapping and early issues and opportunities that are just sort of the factual basis for us to start from and then looking at an overview of resource area constraints and kind of the impression of the real estate market. These are all to set the stage so that we're all starting in the same the same place the same page to start

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from. Um we will review community goals. So that's the master plan, the housing production plan, the the comprehensive housing policy and all those items will get factored into this first meeting. And we will we're mentioning again the cultural institutions um with the opportunity for public

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comment and um you know the the opportunity for people to to raise questions, concerns and identify their goals. So I think with that you could go to the next slide. And then phase two um what what we would be moving into is somewhere between you

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know between August and December is to really continue a deeper dive more intensive focus on on the data and information community input and kind of take some next steps. So this slide what I wanted to articulate is that we're

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we're laying out a three a three meeting uh process. So the first meeting will be a listening session in July. We would have a second public meeting a sharet style meeting in either August or September followed by a third public meeting um tentatively slated for

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October. And so in meeting number two, you know, the the concept at the moment is to do a Friday afternoon walking tour of the property and then follow it up on Saturday morning with a multi-hour kind of hands-on visioning exercise to look at all the components that we'll have,

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you know, information on gathered at that point. Conservation, open space, economic development, housing, the development opportunities, arts and culture, community facilities, trails, and recreation. And then from that from that session the team will start to be able to actually

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develop some some scenarios. And so this would be looking at maps talking about the size and location of potential buildings and just understanding the density or extent of new development opportunities within especially the core campus. and we will examine, you know,

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what people have been throwing out a lot of different ideas, but there's ideas of mixed use kind of village centers, um, a research campus, continued education, or various housing types. And so, this will allow us to look at the site and model out some of these and and

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start to demonstrate what it could look like and what the densities would be. And this would this would be the point when we would have illustrative plans, diagrams, cross-sections, and other supporting materials for people to look at. And then finally kind of in this realm is the fiscal analysis. So we

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could then look at a de a development scenario and understand some of the opportunities the impacts you know what it would provide or offer for tax revenue and we would have that fiscal analysis component here. then followed by the the last kind of big public

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meeting would be a sharet style in October gathering input responding to ideas and plans and then we would have a kind of this preferred scenario upon which we would um continue to work with the team to to craft some zoning that would

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actually allow that to be implemented in the future in the long run. So the goal is a intensive um but and thorough you know process to get us to some kind of zoning proposal for for December would be a target

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November December and uh there'll be a final report. There'll be information available. The team is set up to attend several meetings especially through the draft zoning amendment phase. So um really giving a lot of credit to Claire and her team. Um, we've been developing

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the the approach to this for several weeks and so we feel like this is a really good opportunity for the town of Ammeris to to jump in, have some facilitated discussions and really understand what potential options there are for the campus. So, I think with that, that's the last slide and I I'm

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happy to answer some questions. >> Can I can I just say um we're really really fortunate to have Jeff Bag here leading this conversation. Jeff came to Ammerst um ready and he knew that we had

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the Wildwood School on our on our plate and I thought well if you're if you're so good with the school how about a whole college campus and so now he has you know jumped full force with limited staff as you know our senior planner has moved on to the town of Hadley and he's

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just been really carrying this load uh with with support obviously but he is really the one conceptualizing this and moving it forward. So, I just want to thank Jeff publicly for all the work he's been putting into this along along with everything else that he's got to handle. >> Thank you, Paul. I was going to say some

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of the same things to thank Jeff and and frankly all of the town staff that has been working on this to get us to this point. I want to also thank Mass Development um for in some sense jumping into our call for help as as this announcement came through to to even get

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us here today and then to prioritize it so quickly. Um I want to remind the council we're going to open it up to questions and discussions at this point. Try and keep it to land use planning. Um there is an executive session tonight too that that can probably deal with

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questions not related to land land use planning. Um, I'm not going to make the motion yet on the mass development one. I'll I'll take questions and all first regarding a bunch of things. Um, we'll start with councelor Ryan. So I'm wondering what impact if any

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there would be while this process is on while it's going through if Hampshire College goes ahead and make some kind of sale um would it still make sense and help me understand how it would for us

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to continue with this process um because as we know they are under enormous pressure and it's I don't know how likely it is but it's possible that they will make a decision uh in the next couple of months, maybe during the summer, maybe in the early fall. Um the

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scenario you've painted is is I think an excellent one. Makes a lot of sense. But if something like that were to happen, um would you say that we still should continue with this process because they're really not connected? Um would the process need to be revised? Um

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that's my question, >> Jeff. >> Yeah, Council Ryan, I think it's a good question. We've grappled with a lot of similar questions. Um, you know, for the time being, this is full steam ahead. We we believe that this is a a great signal

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that the town is sending that we're we're prepared and very interested in looking at the parcel for sort of the developable portions for housing and for tax revenue. We want to we want to have that signal out there. Um, you know, the

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the best case scenario is that a a a potential purchaser or a an entity that does actually end up acquiring the property will want to engage with the town and will want to follow this process and and understand where the town wants to go. Um, so that we do we

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do in general feel like a partnership will will be the best case scenario. Um there are other scen there are other options for things to happen beyond our control and we we will adapt to that if necessary. Um but we think that in

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almost any case a a a buyer a purchaser of this land at that cost is going to want to have conversations with the town and be engaged in a process um to work together. That's our that's our hope. um we we will have to adapt if something

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changes that we're not expecting. Um and we're prepared to do that, but we didn't want to we didn't want to start with something like that. We wanted to start with this process. This is a normal um process, but it's robust and it's faster

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um because of that pressure. We we think that if we are um successful at coming out with a zoning amendment, you know, in December, November or December, that would be a great signal and that would show the cooperation collaboration that we're

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looking to have with with whomever's interested. And just one more thing on the zoning amendment because I don't want it to get lost is that would just be to get to the zoning. Then it would get submitted and it would go through the next, you know, process with town council and the planning board and CRC.

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So even the first 6 months is quick and it's to get the input and get a get a a vision going, but then it would have additional input and process to to move forward with implementation. So um Mr. Ryan, I hope I answer that question to the best of my ability there. if I if I

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can just jump in on that. So what what we know is that Hampshire College is going out of business and it will not be in operation as we know it and so that campus will be moving into probably someone else's hands and what people do is they come to the town said what would you like to see there and we say what we

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think but I think it's this process that's going to help define it by actions by the town council in terms of what you want to see through zoning through your voices through zoning and so that's h exactly how the town will say what it wants on on that land. So, I

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think we need to know from the town council with the community engaged planning process, what does the town want with that land? >> Thank you, Kathy. >> Thanks, George, for being the first person out because that leads perfectly

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into I can build on your question. Um, I think this is a great plan. um and including that initial phase of doing an assessment of what exists that will be useful to any buyer uh in terms of the condition of the building, the

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infrastructure, u wetlands. So my question um Jeff is you have you just said this is a fast timeline and I would agree with it given the way we've moved in the past particularly on zoning but

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is it mine is is it going to be fast enough on the zoning side do we need um while doing the public engagement do we need need some potential scenarios of if it was only

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like this or zone like that because that signaling of what the town might be willing to do before we voted on it may be important as Hampshire is engaging with someone who might want to take on the debt. So, it's it's a t it's purely

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a timing issue. Um, and I know uh from the press release you'll have partners thanks to the state um and that list of the kinds of teams that are there. There's it looked to me a combination of geotechnical

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uh zoning and design and architectural is a is a good team to add to what we have and what the state would bring to be able to do some early visioning um you know on lot sizes whatever. So my

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question was just on the speed and even if we can't vote on the zoning changes, would we be seeing some of the ideas along the way? >> Paul or Jeff? >> I'll take a fair shot at it. Yeah. Um, Council Shane, I think it's a great

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question. In all honesty, we had a little bit longer timeline that we have been discussing the past couple weeks and we we recently shrunk it to to be more concise and upfront. Um so you know

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we we really want to be able to engage people along this path and I think um the team really advised to to make sure that we're we're allowing people the time and opportunity to have a voice in the discussion. And so what we recently

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came up with and we're we're finalizing the scope. still in draft, but we think we have a really good handle on how it'll unfold, especially this phase one is really having time to get some of that data together. So, mapping and understanding and and really dive into

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that and then be present in July with the community showing the maps and having the discussions and and starting to talk about what's possible. That's actually quicker than it was originally slated to happen. And so, we think that that's going to be good. you know, we

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were a little sensitive about doing too much during the summer. We want to make sure that there's opportunity for people to follow along. And so, um, we feel I feel really good about starting in June. I mean, we're starting, uh, we're meeting Friday, I think, and then next week, and we're we're really going to

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ramp right into this and then have that that first listening session in July. And um from there, you know that even though we're doing it in two phases technically behind the scenes with two contracts, it's going to be seamlessly going into August or September with that that second community meeting and that's

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when it'll be a sharet style. That's when people will understand certain pieces of puzzle that are available on the property and and I think we we want to make sure that we're going fast but not too fast. So So we did we did talk about that machine and I think we we

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landed in a really good spot. So, um um hopefully that answers your question. >> You did. Thank you. >> Thank you. Um my hand is raised next. That actually segs into my question and maybe this will do that well for the rest of everyone as we seg into each

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other. But um the summer meetings and the three public meetings I are not at ideal times. So I have a couple of questions related to that with some of them over the summer when people are traveling. um how soon can we get those dates finalized so that they can be out

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in the public um and and announced? And then also will there be an ability for people who cannot attend those meetings to basically attempt to submit or put in similar public comments? Um, a listening session might be easy, but I'm I'm

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looking at the sheret in August, I think it was, or early September that's a couple hours with maybe some diagrams and all that might be a little harder. But is there a way to make sure that some sort of ability is able for people who can't attend those to make similar

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comments that are undertaken um and considered as the next phase of the the work goes through? Um, Jeff or Paul? I I believe that we can make sure there's an opportunity for people who couldn't attend a meeting to have some

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way to communicate and I think the first meeting is really just to allow people to come and and understand what's happening and and see some information and so we do we will be providing a web a web page. So the

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consultant team, the Horsely Whitten Group is sort of the the um the overarching consultant team. And so they're going to host a website that can be um story map style. So it'll be easy for people to scroll through and find information. It'll be map based and

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it'll be much more interactive. No offense to our website, but it'll be more interactive and easier for people to to access the information. And I'm pretty sure we can at a minimum for the July meeting have an opportunity for people to provide comments. And then in

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terms of the second meeting, um you know, we did talk today about um maybe pushing it from August into into September sometime like maybe after Labor Day so that people are settled back into their routines. What that would do and we we would want to accommodate that. What it would do is

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just push the product out probably from November to December. But I think to be cognizant of people who might really want to participate in that really inerson shet style meeting, I think we could potentially talk about shifting the date a little bit from August to September.

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>> And and I think the idea would be to get the date in July. We don't have a contract signed yet. We need authority from you to do that. And then once we get a contract, I think mass development's ready to go. Um then once we have a contract, then we can start talking about actual dates. And you know

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it'll be hard to find a good date because it's there aren't but I think the alternative is to wait till after Labor Day which I think is not acceptable. Uh we just need to work on it. uh there will be uh plenty of opportunity and I think having online opportunities and recorded for Ammeris

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Media or whoever if we just do it through Zoom um I think the hybrid meeting is going to be the best way that we can do it because we want people in present but also if you're traveling you'll still be able to log in and watch it either in real time or or after the meeting's been recorded.

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>> Excellent. Thank you Lynn. Um I do hope the meetings can be held so that even people who aren't in town can participate actively given today's technology. So let me just paint a scenario and

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allow me to ask the then the question and the scenario is sometime between you know now and the end of June somebody buys this property and they buy it with you know the intention of having it be

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I don't know an educational something. It seems to me that even if they do that, we probably want to go ahead and do something with zoning because the possibility frankly of a higher ed institution surviving a

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startup in this day and age is zip. Um, so it I my real question then is would we just go ahead and do zoning regardless recognizing that whoever bought it is then going to want to influence the

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zoning so they can get the best dollar back. >> Paul or Jeff? >> Yeah, I think I think that's a that is a potential scenario, but I think even any kind of land purchase is going to take time. You know, no one's going to write a check. Maybe someone will write a

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check. I think Hampshire would love for someone to write a check, but if you're buying a major piece of land, you're probably going to need some due diligence, some time to get your financing in order, whatever that's going to be needed to be done. So, I think um and they're going to want to know what the town wants. If if it is a

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comparable educational institution, I think you're right. That doesn't preclude the town's efforts in saying if that institution were to move on, what would we what would we like to see on this land? and they may not want all the land anyway. >> Thank you. >> Can I just say one other thing?

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>> I also want to thank Mass Development for stepping to the plate. You've always been a good partner with cities and towns. Thanks. >> Thank you, Councelor Kennel Martin. >> Yeah, I I similarly I have a concern that the process is really fast and I think it's going to be hard to get the

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kind of community engagement that we want, especially given the time of year. Um, and also I'm concerned about accessibility to um to everyone in town to be able to give their opinion. So thinking about things like um language

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um are we going to have translation um for these materials into what languages? Um also thinking about times of day like people work at different times of day. So if it's an evening meeting, we might have people who work the evening shifts. So when would there be opportunity for them to to attend? um transportation,

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like where is the meeting going to be? Is it on the bus line? Hopefully, I maybe it's right here in town hall. But, uh I am just really concerned about about accessibility and about who who gets to give their opinion on this. And I know there's a lot of opinions. We've all been contacted um on the council.

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I'm sure because I've seen the emails that go to all of us and so there's a lot of people with a lot of opinions on this and it is a really monumental decision. So, um, yeah, I'm just really concerned about the community outreach process and how it can be as robust as possible and given a really short time

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frame. >> Thank you, Andy. I I appreciate mass development being represented here. And um I I don't know if if you're here just to watch or if you are here to comment, but

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if you're here if you were up for commenting, I'm curious what this situation looks like compared to are there any other parallel situations that you've seen? And if there is the ro the technical assistance role of mass development is that generally what what

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mass development would do or is there any we'll we'll discuss purchase scenarios in um executive session but is is funding for purchase ever an option? >> Claire, if if you would like to respond,

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you may come on up. Make sure the light's on. I don't know if it's still on. It's okay. Thanks. Thank you. Uh, good evening, members of the town council. Um, thank you to to Jeff and to Paul and your entire team

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for the work that they've been doing with us over the past few weeks. Um, first of all, I'm I'm very sorry for the situation that that Hampshire College finds itself in and therefore the community of of Amherst and Hadley and and indeed the region. Um, sorry, I

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should have started off by introducing myself formally. Bar O'Neal. I'm senior vice president of real estate planning at Mass Development. Um so I'm very much on that technical assistance side. Councilman said um

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we we we work as as the state's development finance authority and also land bank. Um we work with communities across the state. Um my team works with communities through grant programs that are through the onetop for community

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growth. We also work with um communities on an individual basis and also some nonprofits on an individual basis as well. We do a lot of work um on district planning which this kind of falls into.

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Um we do a lot of work on surplus public property planning which while this isn't surplus public property um I'm more curious about the Wildwood School. That sounds interesting as well. Um we um

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we unfortunately do find ourselves often working with communities who are facing a um dire or um negative change in their economy. Um I'm working with the town of Clinton right now. Uh, Jable is um a a

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company that owns or took over a 75 year old plastics manufacturing firm that used to have a thousand employees in the downtown. >> In recent times, it's been more like 500 600 employees in the downtown, but Jable

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has announced that they are moving those employees out of Clinton. And so we are working with the town to better understand what the impact is on not having 600 employees next to their downtown area. Um and also what the

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different redevelopment scenarios are both from a fiscal basis but also um that same multiplier effect on the downtown if the comm if the buildings become residential, commercial, industrial, mixture of both. you know, trying to understand what what

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the future of those facilities will be. So, I bring that up only because while that's a company and a downtown area, it's it's also about economic development. It's also about job loss. It's about the fear of the community as big changes occur. Um, and so I just

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wanted to give you a flavor of of another type of situation where my team works and uh, we we really value the opportunity to collaborate with communities and to collaborate with teams like you have in place and um, you

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know, while I won't say that we look forward to working on this issue because it's it's it's not necessarily a fun thing to do, um, we very much um, will be, you you know, step by step with you as we as we engage here. And we do have

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an excellent team um that's going to be working on the project with us. Porsley Whitten um they have fantastic team in Providence and in uh Massachusetts as well. They do work across the Americas. um but they are very um very much

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involved in sensitive environmental projects as well as straightforward civil engineering planning landscape architecture projects and of course they are teaming with um Dodson and Flinker who I'm sure you're all familiar with um

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and then um U3 is a firm again that I know you're familiar with and they have done some outstanding work across the nation um with colleges and and in different situations Um I've avoided the topic of purchasing property.

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Um we have a number of tools available to us to help um anywhere from from manufacturers, colleges, communities. Um we have a number of financing tools available to us and um so certainly I don't want to

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preempt anything that that you and the council may may discuss. Um, but you know, we we're certainly as the comm as the Commonwealth's land bank, we're certainly um we certainly have have access to tools that we would would talk

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with you about as if and when it's appropriate. >> Thank you so much, Claire. >> Thank you. Thank you very much. >> Um, Sam, >> uh, thank you, Mandy. Uh, I also would like to thank town staff and, uh, Jeff

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Bag. I consider uh today's announcement uh that the town is seeking to engage uh with uh the state uh to be a very good one. Uh it's clearly a very significant issue

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for our town. Um we all are hearing about it, seeing it and understand uh the impact. But I agree with comments that have been made that uh beginning the analysis and gaining information is

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a good thing. Uh information up front regardless if the town uses it or others uh will only be helpful. uh I share uh councelor Ryan's uh questioning of you know what may happen in the near time

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period and I thought to myself well uh what's going to transpire between now and December we don't know uh but I'm glad to see that the uh plan is to expedite to the extent possible uh the

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review process and the in and also uh I'm glad that there's an engagement component. I do think it would be good to make the engagement of the community as available and uh varying avenues uh as

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possible as councelor Kino Martin referenced. Uh but I think it's a necessary step. Uh and I'm very pleased to see that the town move quickly on seeking uh engagement. I think it's a good thing no matter what the outcome

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is. We don't control at present uh what's going to occur with the college. Uh there are some things out there right now that uh we don't know what's going to transpire. I'd like to thank uh Claire for being here and for

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communicating on multiple levels uh smoothly and informatively. Um the the town has uh this is a big this is a big issue for us and we should be deliberate and also

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um engaged with a sense of urgency I believe in our process. Thank you. >> Thank you Lynn. You know, this is a question going back to I'm sorry my voice to Paul and Jeff and

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that is will there be a committee uh guiding this or will it strictly stay within the staff with the consultants? >> Paul. >> Yes. So the intent is that the mass development will work with our staff with the team being led explicitly by um

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Jeff and then but it'll be a community engagement process and bringing in stakeholders um who've been who um have been identified and uh and then utilizing the committees the the normal process for changing uh bylaws like

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zoning the planning board the CRC and the council as being the decision-making process. So, no special committee or anything like that. Okay, >> I see no other hands right now for general comments. So, we're going to move to the motions. There will still be time to obviously discuss the motions at

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this time. Um, so I'm going to make the first motion, which is to authorize the town manager move to authorize the town manager to enter into any memorandums of agreement with the Massachusetts Development Finance Agency, Mass Development, and the town of Ammerst for

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the purpose of assisting the town in developing a communityinformed redevelopment plan for the former Hampshire College campus, incorporating site analysis, stakeholder engagement, redevelopment scenarios, and recommended zoning. changes to promote job creation

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and economic development the project within the town at 893 West Street Ammerst Massachusetts 01000 to the site. Is there a second >> second Rooney >> Kathy got you before got to you before

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you Pam. Nice try. You tried. Is there any conversation on this motion? Seeing none, we start with Pam. You get to be the first one to vote. You have to unmute. >> I did it three times. Uh, yes.

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>> Councelor Ryan, >> hi. >> Kathy Shane, >> yes. >> Jennifer Tob, >> yes. >> Councelor Walker, >> yes. >> Councelor Breick, >> yes. >> Councelor Cano Martin, >> yes. >> Andy Churchill, >> yes. >> Anna Deongthier, >> I.

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>> Lang Greimer, >> I. >> Mandy Johanni is an I. Councelor Lord. I >> and Sam Mloud >> I >> that is unanimous. We now move on to the second motion. I'm going to recognize Andy Churchill for this one um since he is the main sponsor

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of it. So Andy. >> Yeah. In your packet you have a memo um that describes the reason for the the motion and basically this is jointly sponsored by uh >> Can you speak closer to your mic? Sorry.

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This is jointly sponsored by um Jill Breivik, Lynn Griezmer, and Alicia Walker. Um but basically um uh with the unfortunate closure of Hampshire College, the town of Amoris has been presented with a rare

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opportunity to guide the reuse of a significant amount of land to meet the town's widely acknowledged needs for more housing and tax revenue. Um, we heard tonight uh an update on Hampshire College and and the work that is going

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to be done there. Um, at this time we believe the town council has the opportunity to send a public signal to potential biders on the property by articulating some key priorities for the next phase of the Hampshire College land use. So, uh, therefore we present the

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following motion for consideration by the town council. So, um, I move the future uses of Hampshire College land are of critical importance to the town of Ammerst and comprehensive, consultative, and inclusive land planning efforts are

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being undertaken by staff. As this effort continues and as Hampshire College decides what to do with its land, the town council identifies the following key priorities and stands ready to provide zoning and regulatory support for them.

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Buildable land. The first priority is buildable land should be prioritized for housing, small business development and other appropriate tax revenue generating uses. Second priority, sensitive habitat, farming or resource areas should be prioritized for preservation, creating a

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balance between potential redevelopment and preservation. Third priority, housing development should prioritize a wide range of housing types as reflected in the town's 2021 comprehensive C housing policy and 2025 housing production plan. And

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fourth, if components of the property could support identified town space or facilities needs, those needs should be considered. >> Is there a second? >> Griemer second. >> Do you have anything else to speak to the motion, Andy? I I think that basically covers it. It

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it it it seems appropriate to have this deliberative process and at the same time in our our discussions these these priorities have sort of emerged um I think fairly generally across the council. So um I and the co-sponsors

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felt it was important to send that signal now so that people who might be considering these types of uses would would feel encouraged to come forward. Thank you, Kathy. >> I just a short comment. Thank you very much for doing this and for the

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enumeration. I think it's a good idea what we you've done in this motion and I'm supportive of it. >> Thank you, Pam. >> Yes, thank you. I think your number two talks about um protection of of resource

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areas and I I think I'd like to um sort of hear the word non-buildable. I mean, we're talking about preservation of non-buildable land um which would include all of the above, but I don't want to I don't if you

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understand what I'm saying. So, I think you're potentially making a motion to amend to change the second bullet point to nonbuildable sensitive habitat, farming, or resource areas and the rest of it. Is that what I'm hearing? >> Yeah, that's good. That's fine.

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>> Okay. Um, that is a motion to amend. Um, is if that's friendly, uh, Andy, you made the motion. Lynn, you seconded it. Do we need to take a second on that motion to amend or is it friendly for you to add those words? Um,

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we'll take a second on that and then ask questions. So, that there's a motion to amend to add those words non-buildable. Is there a second to the motion to amend? >> Second. >> Okay. So now um councelor brevik

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>> sorry just wondering if that then means that if there was land that would be considered sensitive habitat farming or resource areas that could technically be buildable but currently is not built on that that

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then wouldn't apply here. So if those this is my interpretation is if the words non-buildable in front of it in front of that second bullet point are added that means that the non-buildable ones are prioritized

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prioritized for preservation that doesn't mean the buildable ones aren't preserved by def like it doesn't mean the buildable parts couldn't be preserved but that the council would be prioritizing for preservation the

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nonbuildable sensitive habitat farming and resource areas if we add those words in there. That's my interpretation. >> Okay. And then just so it sounds a little bit like then stating the obvious. If it's non-buildable, we can't build on it. We wouldn't be recom I

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think what we I at least my understanding of the sentiment of this is that we want to preserve as much of the land that is currently preserved as possible whether it's technically buildable or non-buildable. And that's why adding this in was important. I think that might adding non-buildable

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might weaken it. Um, Anna, >> yeah, I think my my concern is in the same direction as councelor Brevik. Uh, there's a whole lot of land that is uh that is good to great to preserve for conservation that plenty of people will

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would want to build on. And I think that the entire point of conserving it is to prevent that that habitat even if it is considered protected under uh under bylaws, not you know, sorry, my brain's fuzzy today, but but not necessarily

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supporting uh passes from those bylaws in order to promote building. So unless there unless I'm misunderstanding and there's a comma uh that I'm that I'm missing here where it says non-buildable, and then all of the other things, uh I I cannot support that uh addition. Thank you, Pam.

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>> Commas are good. >> Did you say commas are good? >> I did. >> Okay. >> If she needs a comma there. So, obviously, if it's if it's a wetland, if it's if it's priority, habitat, etc. Um, I don't know what resource areas

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particularly mean. That's not spelled out, but you kind of get a sense of it. I'm just saying we have we have a lot of of uh protected and conserved lands in Amoris. There are some wonderful lands or portions of the Hampshire College

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site. Um but I but I want to just remind us that um with all of the with all of the setbacks, the restrictions and what other considerations, if something is is generally developable, then it probably ought to be considered

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for that. Um given that Anyway, that's >> Thank you, Andy. Yeah, the first bullet says buildable land should be prioritized for h housing, small business development, and

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other revenue generating uses. So, I think we don't necessarily need to say non-buildable land, you know, uh shouldn't be. I think this is an attempt to say we recognize that there are various types of uses on the property and there's a lot of land that's

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probably not buildable and some of it that it has some uses that might be wanted to be considered other than than housing. But um so I think the combination of the first two is an attempt to to strike a balance and

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understand that you know the core buildable area would would be prioritized for new uses but there may be some areas that should be prioritized for for preservation or other uses. So >> I would I would withdraw my my addition.

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I didn't have it written in front of me. I had forgotten some of the wording of the first item. Thank you. >> The second was by Andy Churchill. Are you okay with the withdrawing? >> Yes. >> I think procedurally we're allowed to do

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that. Athena is nodding. So, this is withdrawn. So, we do not have a motion to amend in front of us now. Um, we are back to the original motion.

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Um, are there I got two hands up. Andy, >> I was residual. >> Okay. Uh, Sam, >> uh, thank you, Mandy. Uh, I appreciate the motion uh from uh all the counselors

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and uh see the clarity of the communication. I do however wonder uh since we have an executive meeting scheduled for later today on the topic of potential purchase

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of Hampshire College if we're having this discussion slightly prematurely even though it's very important. So, I'm not expressing disagreement with uh what's being discussed here, but

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in my mind, there's an executive session where there will be additional information that I assume will be discussed. And as with any um process of decision-m, I like to hear

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whatever the latest might be. uh irrespective of the value of uh a proposal that could also be taken uh or brought up at a subsequent meeting. So uh that's my thought process. I kind of

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want to hear our executive session even though it may uh not be immediate uh directly associated with this. It might uh but I think we should uh hear everything first. Thank you.

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>> You Lynn, >> um I just want to say um when Indie came talked with me about this, what I felt it was, it really reflected the many many conversations that this group has had and it allows us to come forward

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with a statement that summarizes uh the kind of um feeling that people have had about this whole conversation uh both in executive session as well as outside. Um, and Sam, I'm just going to

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suggest to you that the last sentence, the last bullet actually takes care of any concern you might have. Thank you. >> And that bullet reads, if components of the property could support identified town space or facilities needs, those needs should be considered is what that

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bullet point that Lynn just referred to says. Um, we're going to go to councelor Brevik. >> Yeah, I'll just add to what Lynn said. I agree. And also the I think one of the parts of this that I liked is is the fact that this conversation is happening

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in the public part of the meeting. I think we have had conversations around this topic and but they haven't been available to the public and so I think this was an attempt uh to share our

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thoughts summarized you know to date on this topic and I think that's valuable. So if I think if there are things that people find that they would like to change or discuss in here, I I do think it might be helpful to do that now as part of this discussion to in front of

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the public. >> Thank you. I see no further hands. So we're going to move to a vote on this motion. It is as the motion stands right now as written on the motion sheet between pages three and four. Um and we start with councelor Ryan

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>> I. Kathy Shane. >> Yes. Jennifer Tob. >> Yes. >> Councelor Walker, >> yes. >> Councelor Brevik, >> yes. >> Councelor Kennel Martin, >> yes. >> Andy Churchill, >> yes. >> Anna Devon Gothier, >> I. >> Lyn Greimer,

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>> I. >> Mandy Johanni is an I. Councelor Lord. >> I. >> Sam Mloud. >> I. >> And Pam Rooney. >> Yes. >> That is 13 to zero. That item passes. Um, I believe we are done with this

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item. Um, since I see no other hands up, um, which means it is just shy of 8:00, we will take our break until 8:05 at this time and then we will come back at that

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time with action item 8B. So, we have a going to move the council back from break. Um, those on Zoom, if you could turn your videos on so that we know you've rejoined us, that would be great. And we

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will be moving on to item 8B. >> I'm here, Mandy. Just >> Thank you, Anna. Sorry. Um, we're moving on to item 8B, the human rights commission charge and bylaw 3.3, human rights and human rights commission. So, we are going to start

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with the first motion um and then once that motion is on the floor, I will move to the go chair um to talk about the go report on that motion in particular. Um uh the chair can talk about both motions if they they want at the same time, but

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we only have one on the floor at a time. And this one is to adopt the human rights commission charge as presented in the document titled08a go voted human rights commission charge 52626. Is there a second? >> Second.

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>> I think I heard Lynn first. Um so Anna as chair of go um would you like to present the go report? >> Um yes. Sorry I'm just pulling it up

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because I I think this is similar to what we discussed last. We're talking human rights, right? I pulled up the right report. >> Okay. Phew. I'm like looking at it and realizing so um this was the

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uh this was the replacement of the um Oh my god. Nope. I've pulled up the wrong report. I'm so sorry y'all. My my jet lag is kicking me in the butt right now. I'm really I apologize. Um so so G continued our discussion. As a reminder,

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the Human Rights Commission charge was the first piece of the discussion and then the bylaw was the second piece. Um, and so the uh the motion or the the decision that's in front of you today is on the bylaw. Is that right? Am I

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looking at the right >> on the charge? >> I mean, I'm so sorry. On the charge. Thank you, Mandy. Sorry about that. So, the charge, as stated, we worked through uh go with um the chair of the human rights commission along with the town uh

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the council for the town of KP Law. Um, and we essentially took the version of what used to be a bylaw and shifted it, morphed it into being a charge um, for the council to consider. This is, I know we've discussed this

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before, but this is essentially bringing this in line with the other uh, commissions that we have that are existing as a bylaw. And um uh I know that there is some discussion about amendments that I'll have my vice chair, counselor Keno Martin, speak to uh

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later, but um the the charge that's in front of you is the product of the draft or the revised draft that had been draft that had been in front of the town manager um co-created by the chair of HRC with the legal council. Uh if I'm if

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I'm um understanding that process correctly. The go the G report kind of goes into detail about the the specific points of discussion, but really ultimately at the end of the day, what we were focusing on was how to make the HRC have more agency

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over the items of their work that they really should be able to handle themselves without needing to go through an entire bylaw review process. And because my brain is fuzzy today, I'm happy to to defer to my vice chair and other members of G to fill in anything I missed.

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>> I was going to do that. So, Councelor Ko Martin, um I know there was this is a revised from the first read. So, can you speak to that part? >> Uh yes. So, um at our previous council meeting on 518, um I had proposed a

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couple of amendments um to the bylaw charge upon the request of the HRC chair and the HRC. Um and we took those up in G at our 526 meeting. Um, so the current charge that is in your packet is the most updated charge that we voted to

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recommend at the 526 meeting and we did actually um change the wording of the amendments. Um, not the first one. So there were two amendments. Um, the amendment to um item one um of the charge was kept as is and then item

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seven um was rewarded. I don't know if Athena wants to screen share. And I did send a red line version, but for some reason it the red lines didn't show up. Um, but if folks would like to take a look at it on the screen, it's um you

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can see how we rewarded item seven. >> I I do think the redline version showed up in the Word document, not the PDF. So there was one in the packet, I believe. I think this one was. Can you page down to item seven on the third page?

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Yeah. And I I can summarize what what the changes were. Oh, there you go. Yeah. Um if you go down a little bit further. There you go. Um yeah. So the commission may report,

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refer, and render recommendations on certain issues involving the town, including concerns as set forth in the complaint resolution procedures established by the commission. period. And then we added the sentence, this may include the recommendation to employ the services of an outsidequalified mediator

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or negotiator to clarify that the commission itself will not engage in mediation or negotiation, but can recommend the services of someone who is qualified to do that. And then the commission does not have the authority to subpoena witnesses or take sworn testimony or the power to adjudicate or

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directly mediate the resolution of disputes between individuals or entities. So we just added the word directly in there to again clarify that the commission will not engage in mediation itself. Thank you. Is there further discussion on this motion to

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adopt the human rights commission charge? I don't see any hands. So we will move to a vote. We start with Kathy. >> Yes. >> Jennifer. Yes. >> Uh, councelor Walker.

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>> Yes. >> Councelor Bravik. >> Yes. >> Councelor Kenna Martin. >> Yes. >> Andy Churchill. >> Yes. >> Anna Degier. >> I. >> Lyn Greimer. >> Hi. >> Mandy Johanni is an I. Councelor Lord. >> I. >> Sam Mloud. >> I. >> Pam Rooney.

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>> Yes. >> And councelor Ryan. >> I. >> That is unanimous. We move on to the next motion. The next motion is to rescend. I move to rescend bylaw general bylaw 3.3 human rights and human rights commission and replace it with the

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following text 3.3 human rights and human rights commission a no person shall be denied any rights guaranteed pursuant to local commonwealth or federal law on the basis of nationality race color ancestry national origin sexual orientation gender gender

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identity or expression age religion disability marital or familial status military or veteran status, socioeconomic status, and or ex-offender status. B. There shall be a human rights commission whose work is governed by their approved charge. Is there a

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second? >> Second. >> Oh, sorry. >> Lynn hands it off to Anna >> for the second. >> Um, I move to you as chair, Anna of G for the report on this one. >> Thank you. So this was the more of the

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logistical in nature need. Uh once we created a charge, we needed to resend the bylaw. Um obviously we didn't want to do this before creating the new charge. So you're getting them both at the same time. Um we took out all of the

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last bits of the bylaw that were uh really focused on the work of the HRC. And um I want to thank Lynn as a committee member for bringing forward the language here which mirrors what's in the bylaw. And really the idea here is to emphasize the importance of this

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work to the town um and to kind of enshrine the existence of the HRC in our bylaws. But we wanted to keep the anti-discrimination statement in uh just to emphasize its overarching impact and need on the other work of the

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town through our bylaws. And anyone else on go? I don't know if I was out on for the 26th meeting. So if uh uh councelor Kennel Martin as vice chair has anything to add? If there was for future other excuse me discussion on that I'm happy to defer as well. C

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>> councelor Kennel Martin I believe is your hand up to add or is it for the potential motion to amend? Okay. Um so I will recognize if if there's nothing more to add from councelor Kennel Martin or Anna Deongier on the report. Councelor Kennel Martin.

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Uh yes. So I am going to make a motion to amend item A um to add it to say no person shall be denied any rights guaranteed pursuant to local commonwealth or federal comma or applicable international human

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humanitarian law. So it's really just adding those four words and I think a comma would be in order um but people may disagree. Um but yeah, so just adding or applicable international human humanitarian law and so that was upon

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request again of the HRC. Is there a second to that motion? >> Second. >> I heard councelor Ryan first. Um is there discussion? So I just want to make sure. Um, we'll go to Andy first.

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>> Um, I I guess I'm just What is applicable international uh law mean? How do we know what is applicable and what's not? >> Uh, the question is what is international um applicable international humanitarian

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law? Um, councelor Keno Martin, do you have a response? >> I Well, I I have a response from me, but I I would love if if Ronnie Parker were allowed to speak. She's in the audience, but um I would just say that that my understanding is that most of our understanding of human rights and the

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framework for human rights comes from international law, such as the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. So, I think that's it's important to just name that. >> I'm going to have a follow-up question before I I I go to Ronnie. You you talked about the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, but this does not name

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that. It names just applicable international humanitarian law. Is it limited to the Universal Declaration of Human Rights or is it broader than that? This reference, do you know? >> I I would love to defer to Ronnie on that and I my sense is that yes, it

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could be broader, but I would um defer to Ronnie. Um the chair of the human rights commission is in the audience. So Athena um can you please allow Ronnie Parker, the chair of the human rights commission to speak to this? Thanks Ronnie. >> Hi. Um

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actually we were talking about very specific treaties that are international treaties such as the convention against torture that are signed and ratified by the US government and therefore they are American law as well. But they are, you

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know, they're signed by many countries. So the Universal Declaration of Human Rights is a declaration. It's not anybody's law. But there are treaties that we've agreed to. There is the ICCPR, the International Convention on Civil and Political Rights. We were very

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concerned about the Convention Against Torture, which we have actually ratified um because of what's going on now. And we have also cited these treaties that the US has ratified in appeal letters such as recently we sent a

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letter of clemency for someone who has been condemned to hanging. Complicated story but we were able to cite these laws because they are actual law. >> Thank you. So the intent of the word applicable then is to reference any law

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that has been any international law or treaty that has been signed by the United States >> and ratified >> and ratified by the United States. Okay. Thank thank you for that clarification. Um Anna. >> Okay. I I think that helps me to understand because my understanding was

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that inter international humanitarian law when I've seen it capitalized is specifically about armed conflict. And so I was trying to understand where this came in and and to understand the differences kind of between the the treaties and the

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different almost resolutions or things like that that we often reference and actual laws. And so I'm I'm trying to understand if there's an example, Ronnie, that of of an international humanitarian law that wouldn't be covered under federal

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laws since, if I'm understanding you correctly, you're saying that that the United States has signed on to them. >> Yes. Yes. So, so I just want to make sure I'm clear that one, you're not talking about the kind of uh, you know, sentence case international human rights law where it's referring to armed

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conflict or are you? And if not, kind of where can we make sure that we have a a list of these because we're we're talking about this kind of applying to all of our bylaws. And then second question is, are there any that aren't already covered by following federal? >> And what are they? >> Yes. So there is a list and I provided

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the link to u the go so it can it's it's on the one of the UN sites there's a list and it shows which countries have signed which treaties which have been ratified and so on and so forth. A good example of one that we have not ratified

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that I personally feel embarrassed about is the international convention on the rights of the child. The US has signed on to it but we have not ratified it and neither and the only other country that has not ratified it in the world is Somalia.

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So there is the international convention on the rights of the child which is fairly new which I've had very close association to and have worked with that protects um children under 18 years old

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against all sorts of stuff that we do like going to armed conflict being sentenced to death. There's all kinds of protections for children that the US has not ratified. So that's an example where we have signed on to it but we have not

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ratified it. Whereas the convention against torture, the convention on civil and political rights and there are many others those just come to my mind. Sorry I didn't research in advance because I wasn't expecting to speak. >> Thank you Anna.

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>> Thanks Ronnie that's helpful. Do you think that we should just do you I I worry about the confusion for folks who aren't clear on kind of the the broader framing of international human rights law. Do you think we should say laws and treaties? Just to be very clear, I

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understand that a treaty is a law, but just for folks who who look up international human rights law, it looks like it's just the that you know the specific one about armed conflict. Um, and then do you see, or I don't know if this is a question for you, Ronnie, or for other folks, like is

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maybe it's something we want to dig into more, but are we ever setting ourselves up to be in a a space where we are upholding something that would be counter to a state or a federal law in one of those international treaties, which obviously there's a whole other mess of stuff you could unpack with that, but do you ever see a

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scenario where we're accidentally in kind of contradicting ourselves? Ronnie, >> I you know I'm not a lawyer, you should know. I did study human rights. Uh but um I cannot guarantee that. But usually

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I mean I don't see how uh I do see where you know our laws are not as strong in with regard to human rights as um the international standard believe it or not. But um that's why we said

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applicable human humanitarian law that is basically the ones the treaties that have been ratified those are solid they the US has already signed on to them. I don't see contradictions with state law. >> Thank you so much.

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>> Thank you councelor Ryan. >> So what about the suggestion of including war treaties? Is that attractive to anyone or should we just let that I thought that was an interesting suggestion just for clarity sake for people reading this would that

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help or is that that's my question Martin made the motion to amend um I haven't heard a motion to amend the amendment um but I hear a suggestion and you were the second to it so I will look to councelor Keno Martin if without

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an actual motion uh she would be amendable to a friendly amendment to add or treaties I think it was or right yes or treaties to the end of humanitarian law and yes yes and she has so the friendly amendment is the now the

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amendment the motion to amend on the floor is now to add or in applicable international humanitar law or treaties after the reference to federal law. Um, is there further discussion? Seeing none, we will move to a vote on

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the motion to amend. Um, we start with Jennifer Tub. >> Uh, yes. >> Councelor Walker, >> yes. >> Councelor Bravik, >> yes. Councelor Kenna Martin, >> yes. Uh, Andy Churchill,

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>> yes. >> Uh, Anna Develafier, >> I. >> Lynn Greimer, >> I. >> Mandy Johani is an I. Councelor Lord. >> Hi. >> Sam Mloud. >> I. >> Pam Rooney. >> Yes. Yes.

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>> Councelor Ryan. >> I. >> And Kathy Shane. >> Yes. >> The motion to amend passes unanimously. We are now discussing the motion to resend general bylaw 3.3 and replace it with the following text that includes the amendment that just passed. Um, I'm

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not going to read it again. Is there further? I just want to state out loud that this is a second reading under our charter. So, I want to make sure that that is stated during the meeting. Um, that we did have a first reading at the last meeting on this. And is there any

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further discussion on this motion? Seeing no hands, we start with councelor Walker. We're on the motion to rescend and replace the Human Rights and Human Rights Commission bylaw. >> Yes. >> Councelor Brevik, >> yes.

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>> Councelor Ko Martin, >> yes. >> Andy Churchill, >> yes. >> Anna Delongier, >> I. >> Lyn Greimer, I. >> Mandy Johanni is an I. Councelor Lord. I >> Sam Mloud. I >> Pam Marie. >> Yes.

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>> Council Ryan. Hi. Kathy Shane, >> yes. >> And Jennifer Tub, >> yes. >> That is unanimous. The human rights and human rights commission bylaw is rescended and replaced. And we have also adopted a human rights commission charge.

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Um that moves us to um item 8 C, the proposed fiscal year 2027 water and sewer rates and amendments to the water and sewer regulations. This is

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a first read and it will also include a special public comment period. We will make that we will I will open up that public comment period after we hear a report from the finance committee. Kathy, >> yes, you have the report from the finance committee. We had a unanimous

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vote to support the recommended rate increases. As you can see in the report and then the two documents that were submitted to us, the rate increases will cover expected increases in labor and

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benefit costs, including an additional person machine operator in both the water and the sewer funds to enable uh safer 247 operations and more effective operations and will cover infrastructure

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costs and debt service. uh these costs will still leave us um in the middle range or near the range of other towns. Um in our report back to you, we asked during our meeting about the future and

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particularly with the sewer fund because we know they're going to be a need for some major infrastructure investments. And the answer was yes, there will be rate increases for that in the future, but we don't yet have estimates of them. The one other thing I might point out in

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our memo is we recommend there is a study going on of potential rate structure changes. Uh a few residents had asked and we had in the finance committee had asked a few years ago whether there might be ways to uh set

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the rates. So large purchasers such of our water or sewer um use uh pay more such as UMass and we urge the study to look at those kinds of changes among

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whatever other changes and I think that is all I have to say and the report's quite short and the supporting documents are quite extensive. Thank you. >> Thank you. We are now going to under the rules and regulations, we need to have a special public comment period on these

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proposed water and sewer rates. So, I'm now going to open it up to that special public comment period. If you are in the town room and you have sign up with Athena, um if you are on Zoom and you would like to make any public comment related to the proposed 2027 fiscal year

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2027 water and sewer rates and amendments to the water and sewer regulations, which really are just changing the rates at the end of the regulations, um please raise your hand. I see no hands for the special public comment period related to the proposed

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fiscal year 2027 water and sewer rates and amendments to the water and sewer regulations. So, we are going to move back to discussion of the coun of the town council if there are any counselors that would like to have discussion on this or ask questions on this. This is a first read um under the rules and regs.

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We cannot change this until the second read. Is there any discussion on these rates? Councelor Kenna Martin, >> I just have a question. Um, does do we typically um change the rates every year and increase or is this the first time

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we'll be increasing in a while? We typically change them every year to increase. So, the rate increase is the is different every year, but they typically do change every year. >> Followup. Do we typically increase them by about 5% or is this like a larger

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increase to help cover the things that we discussed? Uh Kathy, >> this is a much smaller increase than last year was. Both rates increased substantially, particularly sewer because of major infrastructure. So if

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you look in uh uh the budget book I think but also one of the memos there's a forecast of where the rates will go and this is going to be in the range and the there if you again if you look at the budget for them a substantial amount

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of the costs are either debt service or direct payment for infrastructure and the labor side is a piece of it but it's not as major as the actual operations of the system. >> Thank you. You're welcome, Pam.

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>> Uh, thank you. Can you um can someone mentioned what the time frame is for studying the the large scale user fee structure and who will be doing that? >> Do you have an answer, Kathy, or should I go to Paul? >> Um, I think turn to Paul. My

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understanding is there's work underway um for contracting with someone to look at options, Paul. So, I'm not sure what the timeline is for that. >> I don't Yeah, I don't know the timeline, but we do have um a firm that's looking at the um sewer rates and the not the

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sewer rates specifically, but the whole sewer infrastructure needs of the town. So, and part of that study, I believe, will include in recommending rates to support that work. And and just so you know, it's not just the kind of change that I talked about,

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but Guilford has talked about block rates and a few other things that they wanted to look at as potential different ways um comparing the pluses and minuses compared to the way we nail bill. >> So, I'm going to recognize Sean Mangano,

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uh who has raised his hand. He is our finance director. Sean, >> you hear me? Okay. >> Yes. >> Switch to my my home computer. Okay. Um for the water rates, the plan is to have information in time for next year's rate setting. So that would be over the next six to nine months um before we set next

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year's rates. And that's on the different options for the water rate structure. The sewer study, that's probably going to be another fiscal year before we have good data in terms of informing the capital improvement program. We might have some preliminary

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data um for the next budget cycle on on capital improvements to the sewer system. Um, but the full report that's, you know, more informative will probably be FY29, uh, when we can factor that in. >> Thank you, Sean. Councelor Ryan.

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>> So, when I do hear from constituents about this, and I don't hear a lot, but when I do hear, obviously, their concern is always that they see these rates rising every year. And I think we have staff and and the report that finance has

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given and Paul has explained that there are good reasons for why this is happening. But um is there at some point in the various studies that are being undertaken and the various planning things that we are doing if we could give our uh residents some sense of what

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this is going to look like over the next five or 10 years. Are we looking at yearly increases of 5% pretty much going forward? Is that even possible? So, um, it's not a question that's to be answered right now, but it would be helpful in at least in talking to my constituents if I could give them some

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sense of what the future looks like so far as we can tell. >> Sean has raised his hand, so I'll go to Sean. >> Feel free to piggyback on this, but I think we do provide five, you know, provide five years of projections in terms of the rate. Um, so you can see

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that in the memo that we provided. Um what can change that is if collective bargain agreements come in more you know over or under what our estimates are at. Um if there's new capital needs that come inflation. Um but we try to factor in increases to account for all that. Um

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where the rates will likely come in higher is on the sewer side once we have the information from that sewer study. Um there are not you know we don't have any factor built in. It's just sort of our regular capital and regular debt that we currently have. Um, so the sewer rates could be elevated from what you

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see in the projections once we have the the study complete. >> Thank you, Andy. >> Do we do we have a sense of the scale uh you know when we're looking at are we talking about a new sewage treatment plant? are we talking about, you know,

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what kind of funding are we looking at down down the road for that that that we're preparing the the ground for in terms of sewer um infrastructure? >> I will go to Guilford Morin, our superintendent of the Department of Public Works for to attempt to answer

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that. Guilford. >> So, on the sewer side, uh the treatment plant is going to go through a major uphol overhaul. So, it's not a complete rebuild of the system, but it will be a major overhaul. We're going to have to add uh change our head works. That's the

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front part of the plant. If anybody went to visit, that's where the water comes in and gets separated and goes into the plant pumps and then gets pumped into the system. We'll have to change the headworks. Um we're going to change the chlorine. Uh we're going to probably have to add

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ditrification to the PL plant process. So, these are these are major changes. So, it's going to be some um major money. Just a I don't even know. I wouldn't even want to guess the ballpark. Um but it's

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probably more than $10 million, probably closer to 20 or more. >> Thank you, Guilford. Are there any other questions on this first read of our water and sewer proposed rates? Seeing none, we will move on in the

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agenda. Um, we completed items 8D and it 8E in the consent agenda. So, we will move to item 8F, permanent changes to the public way, North Pleasant Street sidewalk and

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parking improvements. Um, I'm going to make the motion which is to approve the permanent changes to the public way on North Pleasant Street as shown on the conceptual plan titled North Pleasant Street sidewalk and parking improvements dated January 2026. Is there a second?

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>> Second, Ryan. >> Thank you. Um, I will go to George, Council Ryan, um, for a brief update on the Transportation and Parking Commission's report on this item.

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>> So, thank you. Um, as stated in the report, um, this has been something that's been in the works for some time. Um the changes proposed are going to complete the Kendrick Park plan and that involves a sidewalk that surrounds the park. Um there will be

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some action to preserve a large large sycamore tree. Um there will be the removal of two of of of six current parallel parking spaces. Um but there'll also be the addition of four spaces on the east side. Um, so this is all in the uh packet and uh as I said this is

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something that is concluding or bringing to conclusion a long range project for that area for that um park and for the sidewalks and the parking connected to it. >> Thank you. Um Kathy,

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>> the the reason I pulled it out is um I may just have a clouded memory on this. I don't ever remember seeing the plan for that additional sidewalk that's being put in and I'm not sure I understand the rationale for that

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because there's a sidewalk just immediately across the street that people walk up and down and uh there is a crosswalk there. So, it's an added expense and an added sidewalk around a park. So, that that's my main question

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on it. Not not the parking areas. And I know that there was an allocation I think there was an allocation from CDBG for that additional sidewalk and I raised the same concern about that as opposed to sidewalk repair in other parts of town where the sidewalks either

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don't exist or deteriorating. So I would just like to better understand why. And if you see the picture of it, we've got a sidewalk all along the other side of Kendrick Park facing the big apartment buildings. There are crosswalks. Then

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there's this narrow piece of North Pleasant with a good sidewalk on the other side. And I don't understand why we're taking part of the greenway to put another sidewalk in. That's that is my only question on this. And I know this

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was part of the internal plan because it was proposed to CDBG and I questioned it when it was brought up there too. But um that committee had just thought it was already endorsed so I know there's money for it. Thanks.

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>> So I'm going to go to our superintendent of public works, Guilford Morin, who who may have a response to that. Guilford, >> I do. Can I share some pictures? >> Um yes. Do you need Athena to help you or can you do it on on your own?

437
02:09:15.199 --> 02:09:32.800
There we go. I >> think I got it. >> Yep. Athena taught me a lot. >> So, what you're looking at right now is the Cecil plan from 2011, which laid out the concept for the park. Um, the concept for Kendrick Park was to have a

438
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sidewalk all the way around it and then to have four distinct areas in the park. To the north end, where the cursor is now, was an open area. Then there was be a playground. And then this piece here, which nothing's really been done here, was supposed to be sort of performance area

439
02:09:49.440 --> 02:10:06.320
or possibly a a skating park. And then this end at the very southern end was supposed to be sort of an area you could have markets or gatherings and booths and stuff. Um, that's how it was laid out. But then the sidewalk was to go all the way around the park. And that's kind

440
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of what's been our guiding concept is to put the sidewalk all the way around the park. So, this project will put the last piece of sidewalk in, but you'll notice that the the um Cecil plan actually has angle parking here. And we chose not to

441
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do angle parking for two reasons. One, it does cut into the green space more than what we do. And the second one is it takes down a very healthy tree, which is this healthy tree here. So then our plan.

442
02:10:39.520 --> 02:10:55.520
Can every can everybody see the plan? >> Yeah. If you could make it slightly bigger. >> I can. >> Better. That's helpful. Thank you. >> So this is this is the existing conditions. And then right here, this

443
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little hump bumpout is where the tree is. So we wanted to keep this tree because it's a large significant tree. So, we got rid of a parking space on each side and we pulled the sidewalk out into this area and went around the tree. Um, and then we decided we would give

444
02:11:11.760 --> 02:11:28.639
extra add side uh parking spaces back on the west side of the road across the street. And then we also redid the sidewalk on this side of so there's a new sidewalk on both sides of old North Pleasant Street from Alex

445
02:11:28.639 --> 02:11:46.239
Street all the way to Triangle now. So, we've improve we've done both sides have done both sides of the street and new sidewalk and repaired sidewalk for both sides. So, that was how it went. Um, does that explain the question?

446
02:11:46.239 --> 02:12:02.159
>> Kathy, do you have any further questions? >> The 2011 plan we've departed from a lot um in terms of what the internal is. So, could you just explain to me why we need that sidewalk? I love it that you're

447
02:12:02.159 --> 02:12:18.800
saving the tree. And I don't have any question about the parking. So, why is that sidewalk needed all the way around the park? People walk in the park. They don't necessarily walk on the sidewalk. Why? Why do you need it, >> Gilford?

448
02:12:18.800 --> 02:12:34.719
>> The sidewalk is to give you um ADA accessibility all the way around the park without having to cross the road. So once you're on the park, you can enjoy the park without having to go off the park and come back on. That's the reason the sidewalk was all the way around the park.

449
02:12:34.719 --> 02:12:52.159
>> Thank you. Are there any further questions? >> I am not seeing any other hands. Um Guilford, I think you can stop your share now. Um Oh, we have one other one. Councelor Ryan, >> just want to note that the commission

450
02:12:52.159 --> 02:13:10.079
voted eight to zero with one absence in support of this proposal. >> Thank you. Um, seeing no other hands, we will Oh, Sam McCloud. >> Uh, just to follow up to the question of the sidewalk, I my mom, who was legally

451
02:13:10.079 --> 02:13:25.760
blind, used to walk down through Emerst, uh, from Pope Berry Ridge through the center of town. As I was listening to this proposal, uh that's who I was thinking of in terms of the ADA accessibility of not just a

452
02:13:25.760 --> 02:13:41.520
sidewalk, but rather a wider sidewalk. And I did listen to the comments from the ADA representative on the commission and provided weight to the the enthusiasm for it. Thank you. >> Thank you. We will now move to a vote um on

453
02:13:41.520 --> 02:13:57.440
approving the permanent changes to the public way on North Pleasant Street as shown on the conceptual plan that was actually put up on the screen. Um we start with councelor Brevik. >> Yes. >> Councelor Ko Martin. >> Yes. >> Andy Churchill. >> Yes. >> Anna Devon Gothier.

454
02:13:57.440 --> 02:14:12.880
>> I. >> Len Greamer. >> I. >> Mandy Johanni is an I. Councelor Lord. >> I. >> Sam Mloud. >> I. >> Pam Rooney. >> Abstain. Councelor Ryan, >> hi. >> Kathy Shane, >> yes. >> Jennifer Tob,

455
02:14:12.880 --> 02:14:28.400
>> yes. >> Councelor Walker, >> yes. >> That is 12 in favor and none opposed with one abstension. It is unanimous. The motion passes. Um we now move on. Um the intergovernmental agreement 8G and

456
02:14:28.400 --> 02:14:45.840
8H, the acceptance of deed both were um dealt with under consent agenda. um on appointments, the town manager appointments, both the historical commission and the reappoints of um approximately 16 different on onto 16

457
02:14:45.840 --> 02:15:01.840
different committees um were dealt with under consent. Uh that brings us to town council appointments. Um, we will I'm I'm going to

458
02:15:01.840 --> 02:15:18.960
make the first motion and then we will get a report on each of the individual people from the CRC chair um after each motion uh on a report on each of those individual votes. Um so the first motion is to

459
02:15:18.960 --> 02:15:37.119
appoint Jesse Major to the planning board for a term beginning July 1, 2026 and ending June 30, 2029. Is there a second? >> Second. Tab. >> Thank you, Jennifer. Um, Pam, please uh

460
02:15:37.119 --> 02:15:53.119
give a brief report on this motion to appoint Jesse Major. >> Hi. Uh Jesse Major has served three years, has served on the uh housing subcommittee of the planning board, and had the strongest support of any of the

461
02:15:53.119 --> 02:16:09.679
candidates that um that we uh considered for this round. Um, I want to note that the the CRC acknowledged that although we had a sufficient pool of candidates in terms

462
02:16:09.679 --> 02:16:26.560
of numbers of people, uh there was very little diversity uh between some of the candidates and or there was very little diversity in the in the group as a whole. And so this means that we are in fact sort of

463
02:16:26.560 --> 02:16:45.120
parsing out little differences here and there that um um are sometimes just opinion of a position and sometimes uh based on you know fact for what the person may have voted for in the past.

464
02:16:45.120 --> 02:17:04.960
>> Thank you. Um, is there any conversation regarding the motion to appoint Jesse Major? >> Seeing no hands, we will move to a vote on the motion to appoint Jesse Major to the planning board. We start with councelor Ko Martin. >> Yes. >> Andy Churchill,

465
02:17:04.960 --> 02:17:19.599
>> yes. >> Anna Devongthier, >> I. >> Lane Greamer, >> I. >> Mandy Johanni is an I. Councelor Lord. >> Hi. >> Sam Mloud. >> Hi. Pam Rooney, >> yes. >> Councelor Ryan, >> hi. >> Kathy Shane, >> yes.

466
02:17:19.599 --> 02:17:33.840
>> Jennifer Tob, >> yes. >> Councelor Walker, >> yes. >> And Councelor Breick, >> yes. >> That is unanimous 13 to zero. We move on to the next motion. We'll handle this one the same way. The motion is to appoint Roy Johnson to the planning

467
02:17:33.840 --> 02:17:51.280
board for a term beginning July 1, 2026 and ending June 30, 2029. Is there a second? Second Greamemer. >> I heard Lynn Grieamemer's name first. So Lynn Griezmer is noted as the second. Pam, can you give a report on this one?

468
02:17:51.280 --> 02:18:07.679
>> Yes. And this is all in the extensive report that was um prepared by myself and the vice chair, Andy Churchill. Uh Roy Johnson is a longtime realtor in Ammerst. Uh has construction experience

469
02:18:07.679 --> 02:18:23.120
and is interested in building the tax base. He was interested in a tax base that would support our schools. He lives in district two which is otherwise not represented geographically on the planning board. Um he understands cost

470
02:18:23.120 --> 02:18:38.559
ramifications of what it takes to build affordable affordably and he is uh I would say sort of prodevelopment uh in his attitude. >> Thank you for that report. Is there any conversation regarding the motion to

471
02:18:38.559 --> 02:18:59.519
appoint Rory Johnson to the planning board? >> Seeing no hands, we will move to a vote. We start with Andy Churchill. >> Yes. >> Anna Delangier. >> I. >> Lynn Greamer. >> I. >> Mandy Johanni is an I. Councelor Lord.

472
02:18:59.519 --> 02:19:14.800
>> Hi. >> Sam Mloud. >> I. >> Pam Rooney. >> Yes. Councelor Ryan, >> I. >> Kathy Shane, >> yes. >> Jennifer Tob, >> yes. >> Councelor Walker, >> yes. >> Councelor Brevik,

473
02:19:14.800 --> 02:19:29.120
>> yes. >> And Councelor Ko Martin, >> yes. >> That is unanimous. Um, moving on to the next motion. We'll handle it in the same way. The motion is to appoint Fred Hartwell to the planning board for a term beginning July 1, 2026

474
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and ending June 30, 2029. Is there a second? >> Yes. Rooney, >> there were three. Athena, I heard Shane first. >> Kathy Shane is the second then. Um, we start with the report from Pam

475
02:19:47.599 --> 02:20:03.120
for CRC. >> Thank you. Um so Fred Hartwell is has um successfully completed one term on the planning board and um was noted that his experience in

476
02:20:03.120 --> 02:20:19.439
crafting bylaws, reading bylaws, developing code was um was a unique skill set and was um a good tool in all the zoning work that we have in front of us. Um he also acknowledged that he has

477
02:20:19.439 --> 02:20:35.359
a strong uh understanding of construction and the so and and also he made a a fairly strong statement about the um the uh benefits of having owner

478
02:20:35.359 --> 02:20:51.840
occupancy in rental units in town as it's a um it's a it's beneficial to the community to maintain a strong presence in the rental market. Um concern was raised

479
02:20:51.840 --> 02:21:08.479
that well so I just covered that point. Um it was noted that he has served three years excuse me he has served two previous terms on the planning board back in the in the 1990s and 2000s

480
02:21:08.479 --> 02:21:24.640
um with his current term. Okay. >> Thank you Pam. Is there any discussion related to this appoint motion to appoint Fred Hartwell? Councelor Ryan, >> I would like to make a motion to amend. >> Go ahead and make your motion. >> I would like to substitute the name of

481
02:21:24.640 --> 02:21:39.359
Evan Naymith for the name of Fred Hartwell. >> Is there a second to the motion to substitute the name Evan Naymith for the name of Fred Hartwell? >> Second. Devon Gothier. >> I hear Anna Develier seconding it. We are now discussing a motion to amend to

482
02:21:39.359 --> 02:21:55.200
substitute the name Evan Naymith for Fred Hartwell. um discussion should stick to at this point basically Evan or Fred Evan Naymith or or Fred Hartwell. I will let um councelor Ryan

483
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speak to his motion first. >> Thank you. A couple of points I'd like to make for you to consider tonight. I think first of all it's clear that CRC was divided. If you had chance to read the report or look at the meeting on

484
02:22:10.000 --> 02:22:25.760
tape, um there was in fact no consensus for a third candidate. At least two of the other candidates most likely would have gotten a 3 to2 vote. Second point I'd like to make is that in fact Mr. Hartwell is now served for nine years on the planning board. If

485
02:22:25.760 --> 02:22:41.760
reappointed, he will be served for 12 years. While understandable perhaps if there were a shortage of qualified candidates, this is clearly not the case. I'm very grateful for Mr. Hartwell's service, but offering someone, anyone,

486
02:22:41.760 --> 02:22:57.600
12 years on this body, unless under the most extraordinary circumstances, just seems wrong-headed, especially when we have candidates who are eager to serve and who have not been given a chance. So, I'd like to give at least one of them a chance.

487
02:22:57.600 --> 02:23:13.680
Obviously, I like very much what I saw in Mr. Naymith. He's clearly passionate. He's informed about housing and the kinds of housing issues the town faces. He clearly is not afraid to speak his mind. Um, you may not always agree with him, but he will be forthright. His approach strikes me as evidence-driven,

488
02:23:13.680 --> 02:23:29.840
not ideological. He seems to get the fact that we are in a housing crisis. Perhaps in large part because he's a member of that generation which is directly impacted by the h high cost of housing and high cost of running in our town.

489
02:23:29.840 --> 02:23:44.240
I was struck by the fact that he had clearly read the housing production plan and the council's comprehensive housing policy. He's clearly done his homework. He's shown the willingness to roll up his sleeves and get to work. on his own initiative. He reached out to tier two

490
02:23:44.240 --> 02:23:59.760
peer communities state college PA which is the home of Penn State and also West Lafayette Indiana which is the home of Purdue to talk with their housing directors to see how they are dealing with the challenge of communities that struggle with affordable housing in a

491
02:23:59.760 --> 02:24:15.439
market where students play a very large role. He's the only one that I noticed in the SOIS who mentioned renters and students and that someone needs to be a voice for those two crucial constituencies and their housing concerns.

492
02:24:15.439 --> 02:24:31.920
60% of our housing stock is rental. 60% of our population is student aged. It seems they should have a voice on the planning board and he has promised to be that voice. And finally, I think he he really represents the future of Ammerst. He has kids in our schools. Ammeris is

493
02:24:31.920 --> 02:24:48.560
going to be home for him for a foreseeable future and I personally support wherever possible putting people on the planning board will have to live with the decisions for some time that the planning board makes. So I hope you will consider this amendment and support Mr. Mason.

494
02:24:48.560 --> 02:25:04.800
>> You Kathy Shane. I will be voting against that strongly and um in addition to my watching Fred Hapwell and I do believe when someone has served three years unless there is a

495
02:25:04.800 --> 02:25:20.319
strong reason they shouldn't continue we should continue because you put a lot of time and effort into this. He's served on subcommittees and there are some zoning proposals he has advocated that I

496
02:25:20.319 --> 02:25:38.160
don't like at all but he is pro density so he is not against growth at all. So I'll just leave off on Fred. I want to talk about Namith and I was hoping I wouldn't have had to do this George. There is another candidate a fourth Hazelton who is very interesting and

497
02:25:38.160 --> 02:25:54.479
very strong and brings a set of skills. I really question I see the strong enthusiasm and he has been writing a lot but if you look closely what he's written including what he gave him

498
02:25:54.479 --> 02:26:11.439
tonight there are factual areas on a major level constantly there was a very interesting exchange in the airmers current where people were reacting to an article he had done and the back and forth was him changing his statistics

499
02:26:11.439 --> 02:26:27.120
when someone would bring in another fact and they said, "Oh, that's right. I got that wrong. Okay, let's change that. Let's look a different way." I think that is a very poor background to bring on to a planning committee. Um, the

500
02:26:27.120 --> 02:26:42.479
piece of paper we got tonight, I can respond to in other ways, but it looks like facts. It isn't. And I can redo the same numbers in a very different way. So it looks sophisticated.

501
02:26:42.479 --> 02:27:00.960
He and I had somewhat of a long exchange on another paper he wrote for the current and he had footnotes in it. So I read every footnote and I didn't think that the data he was bringing supported his argument. So again I respect his

502
02:27:00.960 --> 02:27:15.680
enthusiasm. I think he's got a lot to learn. I hope when he's a lawyer he doesn't go into a courtroom with the same kind of arguments and statistics because it wouldn't bode well. So I didn't want to have to talk about that because I think

503
02:27:15.680 --> 02:27:33.200
there is a fourth candidate Hazelton who I hope will apply again because he has all sorts of strengths that the planning board doesn't currently have but he didn't get a majority vote. So I am going to mainly speak against your

504
02:27:33.200 --> 02:27:49.680
amendment because of the person you talked about as the alternative. I think he would not be a strong candidate at all. The last thing I would say is I think we all heard where he lives. We have several on the planning board

505
02:27:49.680 --> 02:28:07.600
already who live in a particular district that isn't renters. He speaks out for renters, but he has a strong belief if we could only get to a housing glut, rents would come down. We all know that if we really want housing to be

506
02:28:07.600 --> 02:28:24.080
affordable, we're going to need state subsidies and other subsidies to set the rates lower for people with low incomes. The new housing that's being built, Northampton had a great piece on this. the new housing that's coming on. It may be new housing and I have nothing

507
02:28:24.080 --> 02:28:41.120
against it, but at market rates it's not affordable for renters. We don't we're not going to get to the point we have a glut. So the construction costs alone. So I think someone who speaks loudly and strongly should be supported by a fact

508
02:28:41.120 --> 02:28:56.319
base when they site facts. So I am speaking strongly against your proposed substitution. Thank you, Kathy Samoclub. >> Uh, thank you, Mandy. Um, I read all the

509
02:28:56.319 --> 02:29:13.200
six candidate statements and read the report and looked for all the information I could find uh regarding the candidates. Um, I did try to watch I couldn't find the video. Uh, I would have seen it. Um I I

510
02:29:13.200 --> 02:29:28.560
do think there there are a great many good candidates here. I think that the committee had uh a challenge. Uh I guess it's a good thing that uh there are so many interested parties

511
02:29:28.560 --> 02:29:45.120
u to serve and I think it had to be uh challenging to determine how to discern between different candidates. I was as I read it, it seemed to me that the third candidate uh discussion was truncated

512
02:29:45.120 --> 02:30:01.680
slightly. That's my perception from what I read. Um, and in that regard I looked at considering all the candidates and there are a few others who have not served the town in any

513
02:30:01.680 --> 02:30:20.880
respect who seemed to me to have strong uh resumes. Um, and in that regard I'm thinking nine years of service. I stepped down from the CPA chair after six that um it's not necessarily a bad

514
02:30:20.880 --> 02:30:38.319
thing to have somebody who's highly interested in the town invested to uh to serve on a on a board. Uh maybe new ideas, maybe uh maybe not, but um participation is a big part of it. Uh I

515
02:30:38.319 --> 02:30:55.359
have not spoken personally with uh Glenn Hazelton. his resume looked good. I have spoken on a a few different occasions with uh Evan Naymith who did show up today as well. Um

516
02:30:55.359 --> 02:31:11.439
I'm I'm impressed with the motivation that is to say the energy to serve. uh you know the planning board is a burdensome committee but it's one that uh individuals should be uh and I'm not suggesting that others aren't motivated

517
02:31:11.439 --> 02:31:27.840
as well but I've seen uh I I'm not speaking in terms of an ide ideological slant I'm just looking in terms of the interest in serving the committee and in that regard as I look at two candidates

518
02:31:27.840 --> 02:31:43.680
both of whom by the way are in my district. Uh I'm supporting the uh motion by uh councelor Ryan. >> Thank you. I want to remind the counselors that the motion is a motion

519
02:31:43.680 --> 02:32:01.280
to amend to substitute the name Evan Naymith and the original motion was to appoint Fred Hartwell. Please keep our comments to those two names only. Thank you. And Jennifer Tub. Um yes, I will be voting uh against the

520
02:32:01.280 --> 02:32:18.640
motion. Um I we already I feel very strongly that we the planning board is already very homogeneous just based on the current um composition of the board. Uh the only woman on the board is did

521
02:32:18.640 --> 02:32:33.840
finished her second term and didn't reapply. Um, we already have two men of the same generation with kids in the school from Amherst Woods. And I think to have three out of seven members

522
02:32:33.840 --> 02:32:49.120
of the planning board be from a small neighborhood in Ammerst, one that has the most um ex exclusive single family housing zoning and to have and rarely do

523
02:32:49.120 --> 02:33:04.720
um applications if ever come before the planning board for projects in or near that that neighborhood. I think to have almost half the planning board be rep be residents of a very

524
02:33:04.720 --> 02:33:22.479
small exclusive area does not well serve the town. And I did want to I didn't want to have to get really into this either, but I guess picking up on what um Kathy Shane said, I've um received several emails from Mr.

525
02:33:22.479 --> 02:33:39.200
Nmith and I have also found that they are factually often factually incorrect. So, a major pressure, housing pressure in Amherst is that we have so many students needing to live off-ampus. And

526
02:33:39.200 --> 02:33:55.920
because students share the rent, rents are higher and for for students and they that is how landlords set the rent to serve the market for which they get the greatest return on investment. Pam

527
02:33:55.920 --> 02:34:11.600
and I in district four have a lot of students in our district and we have had students that we have been communicating with that came to us and said they are very concerned that the off-campus prices for students are so high and they

528
02:34:11.600 --> 02:34:29.520
would like more housing opportunities on campus. So the the privately financed housing market serves the rental housing that is built in Amoris is to first and foremost serve

529
02:34:29.520 --> 02:34:47.520
the student um the student housing market because that's where they get the greatest return on investment. Um so this is what Mr. Naymith wrote to me on May 1st. He said, in other words, since um 20, he

530
02:34:47.520 --> 02:35:06.399
said, only 476 more students live off campus today than in 2002. And considering that 106 North Flats in Sunderland, opened in 2024, houses around 400 of these 476 students. There

531
02:35:06.399 --> 02:35:23.280
has been virtually no increase in UMass students living off campus over the past two decades. I mean that's kind of patently absurd that I'm sorry I'm

532
02:35:23.280 --> 02:35:38.160
I lost you for a minute. I'm overseas and it's uh 3:05 in the morning where I am. So I'm sorry if I'm not as articulate as I should be. But since 2002 um in Ammerst we've built um Kendrick

533
02:35:38.160 --> 02:35:56.080
Place 1 East Pleasant 13 East Pleasant Olympia Drive Spring Street Sunset Fearing One University Drive that's not a comprehensive list and mo the majority of residents in those built very large

534
02:35:56.080 --> 02:36:11.600
buildings are UMass students living off campus. So, there are thousands of more students living off campus today than there were in 2002. And for someone to be on the planning board that thinks that there are virtually no more students living off campus and that

535
02:36:11.600 --> 02:36:26.800
that's not what's driving our housing market, that is very concerning to me. So, that's just one example, I think, of what um Kathy Shane was also um uh touching on. Thank you. >> Thank you, Pamy.

536
02:36:26.800 --> 02:36:44.720
>> Thank you. Um, I I I can't vote for the substitution. I'm I'm disappointed because councelor Ryan did this again last year as well. Uh, CRC came forward with a with a a recommendation and councelor Ryan substituted someone and

537
02:36:44.720 --> 02:37:03.600
that has led to this um, preponderance of the same demographic, age group in the same geographic location, neighborhood in town. So, I I'm disappointed that he's going to do it for a a third a third person. Um, again,

538
02:37:03.600 --> 02:37:20.240
I didn't want to say anything like this in the interviews or in the discussions, but the the idea of open-mindedness is something that really worries me. As has been stated by several people here,

539
02:37:20.240 --> 02:37:34.560
Mr. Nay Smith has been making very strong statements whether it's in the indie or the current um and whether you whether you take his side or not um we

540
02:37:34.560 --> 02:37:52.479
have we have um not appointed people for almost the same reason that they spoke too strongly about their neighbors or they spoke too strongly about uh the need for for public input. And here we have someone speaking very strongly

541
02:37:52.479 --> 02:38:10.080
about another aspect of of life in Ammerst. You know, we're being a little hypocritical if if it's okay to talk about one topic but not another. Um I just his um aggressiveness in pushing

542
02:38:10.080 --> 02:38:26.479
his data which as someone has said is not is not always accurate. I have confirmed numbers that he has written as well. Um I I can't support this kind of substitution. I'm sorry.

543
02:38:26.479 --> 02:38:42.560
>> Thank you, Pam. Anna Donovia. >> Thank you. So, you know, there's talk of a of of a specific neighborhood, and I will clarify. I didn't go into everyone's um

544
02:38:42.560 --> 02:38:57.200
calfs to see specifically where they lived, but um a couple folks mentioned the specific district and I just want to remind folks that district 5 goes all the way downtown. Uh and and in fact, right now you are all sitting in district 5. It used to be much more

545
02:38:57.200 --> 02:39:12.319
concentrated in South Ammerst, but I I I struggle with district being used as the delineator when our districts are not are not balanced in the way of uh um in terms of kind of as we look at committees. So, that was just a quick

546
02:39:12.319 --> 02:39:29.600
note there for me. You know, it's it's clear to me that while I could explain why I believe that Evan Naymith is a great choice for the final spot on the planning board, I really think he did it best. In his words this evening, to be honest, I in his candidacy, I see a

547
02:39:29.600 --> 02:39:46.080
commitment to continuing to align with the housing production plan and the priorities that we as a council have set forth. I also see someone who's really willing and able to dive into policy and work through things as well as someone who's willing to hear other approaches

548
02:39:46.080 --> 02:40:01.120
and other opinions as they come forward. And then for me, most importantly is that he's the candidate that I've seen emphasize the need for our planning board to understand and utilize that policy in a way which seeks to make

549
02:40:01.120 --> 02:40:19.359
housing in Amorest a more equitable uh field. Right. in terms of who can access it, who can retain it, and all of the things that we talk about caring about. I think that Evan is bringing a voice that we would really benefit from having on the planning board with that

550
02:40:19.359 --> 02:40:36.960
uh with that bent towards equity within our housing. uh and looking at how can we utilize our policy and how can we, you know, continue to to follow that housing production plan in a way that makes it a lot better than how it has been, which has not been really

551
02:40:36.960 --> 02:40:51.120
accessible for a lot of folks. Um, so I've really I think that's for me what I've appreciated is his his willingness to learn and collaborate as well as his um strong backing in policy and his focus on equity.

552
02:40:51.120 --> 02:41:09.760
Thanks. Thank you, Anna. Andy Churchill. Yeah, I understand um that Evan can come on fairly strong or has come on fairly strong um at times and but I I think that I I've seen when he

553
02:41:09.760 --> 02:41:24.319
may when he takes a position and when somebody brings in new information whe in whether it's in the comments section or or elsewhere, he's willing to listen and he and he and he approach he receives that feedback with respect and he doesn't continue to he doesn't

554
02:41:24.319 --> 02:41:40.800
respond by blasting the person who's who's bringing the new information. He he incorporates it. And um I think to a certain extent he's learning the difference between an advocate, which is what he is right now, he's he's somebody a public person who

555
02:41:40.800 --> 02:41:55.920
can take a position and make it as strongly as as they want to, and then recognizing that when you're on a board, you need to be able to to learn and change your mind. I think he has he's gaining legal background um in land use.

556
02:41:55.920 --> 02:42:12.640
He's he's focused on these issues in his legal training. Um and I believe he still has a lot to learn, but he does represent a perspective um and a voice for renters and for students and for, you know, people who

557
02:42:12.640 --> 02:42:27.040
aren't otherwise represented on the planning board as well. Um so I I felt I'm on the CRC. I felt that our process was pretty clear on on who the first two uh members should be. And then I think

558
02:42:27.040 --> 02:42:44.720
when we got to the third um person, I think it was very it was quite close and split in different directions. And um I actually think there are are two members that or two applicants who could be considered um and Evan is one of them

559
02:42:44.720 --> 02:43:01.040
and I won't discuss the other one at this point because we're not supposed to. >> Thank you, Andy. Councelor Cano Martin. >> Thank you. Um, so I'm just going to start off by referencing the CRC report. Um, if

560
02:43:01.040 --> 02:43:17.040
everyone looks at page five, I just want to call attention to the demographic information of the six applicants. Um, if you can see that 100% were white and male. The current demographic mix is 100% white and male. and our applicant

561
02:43:17.040 --> 02:43:33.600
pool had 66% coming from district 5. Um, we've already got a total of 57% in on the board residing in district 5. Um, so I just first would like to ask the question, how did we arrive at this applicant pool? And I understand how

562
02:43:33.600 --> 02:43:48.880
hard it is to get people to serve. I'm very sympathetic to that. But my understanding is that we have a priority on having a diverse applicant pool that really has the diversity of our town in terms of age, in terms of race, in terms of gender, in terms of where they live.

563
02:43:48.880 --> 02:44:04.160
Um so, so my first question would be how did we arrive at this pool and how can we get a diverse pool? Um, I really think that that having um a pool of applicants that are in no way diverse and that looks like this is is not doing

564
02:44:04.160 --> 02:44:20.479
a service to our town um and our values. So, I don't have control over that because we're we are where we are we are right now. But I hope in the future that we can brainstorm together ways to get a more diverse pool and to work together to do that. Um, the second thing I want

565
02:44:20.479 --> 02:44:36.640
to say, and this is this is difficult to say. Um, and I I didn't want to have to share this experience, but I'm going to share it. And I will say that as someone who is in public service, who is now in office, um, we do have to develop a thick skin, and I completely understand

566
02:44:36.640 --> 02:44:53.279
that. I am working on my thick skin. Um, but I have received, um, some communications from Evan that have been aggressive in nature. Um, and also my my first interaction with him as a candidate involved him approaching myself and other female candidates and

567
02:44:53.279 --> 02:45:08.080
sitting us down and talking at us for about an hour about housing policy without almost letting us speak or asking us any questions about what we thought, why we thought that, or what our experience was. Now, it is difficult to be a woman in

568
02:45:08.080 --> 02:45:26.240
public service. Um, I know that to be a woman on the planning board, I think we've only had one in recent history, must have been really difficult. Um, I think it's okay to have men in these roles, but I think they need to be men who know how to listen and men who know how to listen to women. Um, the tenor of

569
02:45:26.240 --> 02:45:41.359
his emails have never been to listen. They have been to tell me what he thinks and why and why I should agree with him. He has never asked me a question about myself or my history or why I came into public service or why I believe what I do. he's only told me what he thinks and what I should believe based on what he

570
02:45:41.359 --> 02:45:56.960
thinks my values are. Um, I came onto this body um certainly feeling like there were people that I would never agree with on this council, but almost each and every one of those people has sat down with me and had a conversation with me in which we could

571
02:45:56.960 --> 02:46:13.040
exchange ideas in which they showed curiosity about me and my values and what brought me to this place and why I believe what I do. Something that Evan Naymith has not displayed. Now, had he displayed that and had he had been open to that, I would have given him this feedback myself and not

572
02:46:13.040 --> 02:46:30.640
in this venue, but he has not asked me. So, I'm giving that feedback here and I appreciate his desire to serve. God, I appreciate anyone who wants to serve. He's a member of our community. Um, he clearly is, you know, enthusiastic about it and he wants to be of service. And I

573
02:46:30.640 --> 02:46:47.040
I think that that should not be the only characteristic on which we judge applicants. Um, you know, there's a lot to be learned in this process of applying to something, applying to a body, and being a part of a body. And and part of that learning is receiving feedback feedback like this. Um, I think

574
02:46:47.040 --> 02:47:02.160
it's really important to be collaborative when you're doing public service. And being collaborative means listening. And I think you can listen to people who may have different opinions or ideas than you. And finally, when it comes to representing people who are marginalized, such as renters and people

575
02:47:02.160 --> 02:47:18.080
of color, um I appreciate what his words have said, but I would also say where where are his actions and what groups is he representing or allied with in town, what groups of people of color, what groups of renters, who has he spoken to um to hear about what their struggles

576
02:47:18.080 --> 02:47:33.600
are. Um, people who are concerned about low-income people, I think, should be standing up for rent control because we have 57% of people who are cost burdened to our renters in this town and rent control is currently on the table both as in the legislature and as a ballot initiative. I haven't heard Evan support

577
02:47:33.600 --> 02:47:51.720
either one of those things. So, again, words are great, actions are better, um, and there's plenty of time to develop and to do those things the longer that you live in community with people. And I hope that Evan will do that. Um, but I cannot support his candidacy at this time. Thank you, Councelor Breick.

578
02:47:51.760 --> 02:48:07.040
>> Yeah, I'm not going to add too much more. I think I'll just focus or expand a little bit on the last thing that Amber said, and I think um I will not be voting to support this candidate. And and I I guess before I make my my one point that I want to add to the

579
02:48:07.040 --> 02:48:24.479
discussion, I do want to say that I I support fully residents rights to come at us in any way that they want. I think residents can come and yell at us. they can come and if they're frustrated they can, you know, I I don't think we ever, you know, want to censor the way that

580
02:48:24.479 --> 02:48:42.560
the public interacts with us. But I think then it it does shift when someone is then vying for a a role, an appointed role. I think then we want to see that collabor, you know, ability to have discourse in a way that would be conducive to serving

581
02:48:42.560 --> 02:48:59.840
on uh something like the planning board. So, I think it's I think there's a line there. And so, not judging maybe past actions, but judging what what those actions or what more recent actions kind of mean for for how this person would likely carry

582
02:48:59.840 --> 02:49:15.520
themselves in that role. Um, I'll just and then just expand on what Amber said. I think in some of the communications that I've read um really feel to me like we're like this

583
02:49:15.520 --> 02:49:32.560
candidate is cloaking this desire for market rate housing more and more market rate housing being the lever that will make housing more affordable I don't think applies in Ammerst. I don't think it corresponds with our housing production plan and I don't think it

584
02:49:32.560 --> 02:49:48.560
really corresponds with the values and what most counselors really believe. I think we we if we want to serve low-income residents, students, renters, we need affordable housing. I don't think creating more market rate housing will do that. And it it feels like it's

585
02:49:48.560 --> 02:50:03.760
this top down sort of trickle down housing policy. But then being cloaked in this effort toward equity I find to be just something that I cannot like morally support using words like equity and

586
02:50:03.760 --> 02:50:19.680
progressivism and kind of trying to paint this gentrification strategy in that light to get more support in a town like this. I think it just shows me that it's someone who needs to get to to know this town a little bit better. Um, and gets to know

587
02:50:19.680 --> 02:50:36.560
get to know what will really work here versus maybe national trends or trends that are relevant in big cities. Um, and really get to know this community, how we communicate with one another, how we respect one another, and what we're really looking for to support our most

588
02:50:36.560 --> 02:50:53.760
vulnerable residents. >> Thank you, Councelor Lord. >> Thank you. Um, I wanted to speak quickly to a couple of things. I don't know much. I read all six of the statements of interest and

589
02:50:53.760 --> 02:51:10.319
um, I was actually very impressed with Mr. Nay Smith um, words he gave to us at public comment. If we're looking for diversity, we don't see it there, but I have heard that maybe one of them was a renter. So, wouldn't that be a place of

590
02:51:10.319 --> 02:51:27.279
diversity that might be privileged over lawyer and other stuff? I'm not sure, but I'm not supposed to speak to that. I'm mostly concerned about this process of a of a committee putting somebody forward and then just being able to to erase that or to not erase it, but amend

591
02:51:27.279 --> 02:51:43.040
it. So, I wonder if there's a different process when there is contention to say, okay, we can't come to a consensus. How do we bring it to the council? So, I'm not going to vote for this amendment because I'm uncomfortable with the process. It's not to speak out against

592
02:51:43.040 --> 02:51:57.359
things I do not know, but I'm uncomfortable with that process. Thank you. >> Thank you, Councelor Lord Pam. >> I want to say thank you to the comments. Um, it was in fact noted that we had a a

593
02:51:57.359 --> 02:52:12.240
really undiverse pool. I think Mandy Joe made that comment. Um, we recognize that terms end and positions need to be filled. So, it's a it's a catch 22 that

594
02:52:12.240 --> 02:52:27.920
we um we would encourage everyone to encourage their people that that have qualifications that would be helpful to the town to encourage them to apply for um positions. That said, when we have

595
02:52:27.920 --> 02:52:46.000
this wonderful public airing of people's characteristics and and foibless that make it very tough for people to say, I yeah, I really want to go through that process. I can't wait to have my my positions discussed by, you know, the

596
02:52:46.000 --> 02:53:03.760
the council. It is um it's counterproductive. Um, and I but I thank everyone for talking about the process and and uh we we will discuss it and see if we can't come to some agreement on how to proceed

597
02:53:03.760 --> 02:53:19.760
in future nomination processes. Thank you. >> Thank you, Pam. Anna Devongia. So, I I'm it's been an interesting conversation and I I do want to echo

598
02:53:19.760 --> 02:53:36.640
what Pam said about how the impact of this level of detail and a conversation on future applicants, frankly, for other roles. I think that this has been a a pretty detailed discussion, and I'm not saying that it it wasn't necessary, but

599
02:53:36.640 --> 02:53:51.680
I'm I'm I'm going to need to take some time to wrap my head around whether it was helpful. Um, you know, I think councelor Kenno Martin, with all all due respect to your experience, which is absolutely your experience and I'm not taking anything away from that. It has not been mine.

600
02:53:51.680 --> 02:54:07.920
Um, you know, I agree that I have had conversations that are very similar to what you were describing with many constituents, you know, including some who will text me during meetings demanding that I ask specific questions when I never even gave them my phone number. uh you know and and I agree that

601
02:54:07.920 --> 02:54:23.760
we sign up for a whole lot of ways of being accessed by constituents but I think that in these instances we need to look at the information that these constituents have presented to us as part of the application process um to go away from that to kind of just

602
02:54:23.760 --> 02:54:40.000
share my own experience I have seen this candidate asking questions and learning he has asked questions of me and and I'm sorry that that was not a shared experience with you um I uh I think that you're raising really good questions about planning board member members

603
02:54:40.000 --> 02:54:55.680
working on other levels and on other issues and I think that it's really important that we're asking these questions of all candidates, right? Like I don't think that it's fair to use this suddenly as a litmus test for one candidate um when it hasn't been asked

604
02:54:55.680 --> 02:55:12.000
to others. I've never heard I haven't heard from other planning board member candidates on those topics either. It would be great to know and I think that it's something that if if we feel that that is a priority, we should add it to the to the interview questions. The last thing I just wanted to say is is um

605
02:55:12.000 --> 02:55:27.600
councelor Revik, frankly, I strongly disagree with you on stating that we do not need market rate housing. Most students do not qualify for affordable housing. When we talk about affordable housing in the context of planning, we're talking about income required uh income requirements. Many students will

606
02:55:27.600 --> 02:55:43.200
not be able to qualify for that and many of our community members can't either. Market rate housing is what Ammerst needs and it encompasses that lowercase a affordable housing that our housing production plan does discuss. So I I think that you know as we're getting

607
02:55:43.200 --> 02:55:59.840
into this that possibly is a direction that isn't helpful for this candidate discussion and I'm happy to have continue to have that discussion. But I I do I do just want to emphasize that the market rate housing piece is getting at that lowercase a affordable um and and is a really critical piece of of

608
02:55:59.840 --> 02:56:16.800
housing production in our community. >> Can I respond? >> Um hold on before I I I I know you were you were called out. So so I I I will go to you because because of that mention directly >> responded to not called out. Sorry.

609
02:56:16.800 --> 02:56:33.840
>> Hold on. Sorry. Hold on. I I want to state before I move on because right now all the hands up have already spoken at least once. Um and so I want to state we've been on this particular motion for approximately 30 minutes. Um we still

610
02:56:33.840 --> 02:56:49.840
have one big item on our agenda and I just want to keep people aware of the time and all of that. Um especially if conversation is not moving us or if everyone has made a decision on this motion to amend. Um maybe we can can can

611
02:56:49.840 --> 02:57:06.160
move on. Um but I I just wanted to make that notice and all um before I go and I will give councelor Brevik an opportunity to respond um if councelor Brevick would like. Just wanted to clarify that I was not

612
02:57:06.160 --> 02:57:23.439
saying that I am against market rate housing. I am for market rate housing in a mix that is I think that includes affordable housing and mixed rate housing. I I guess what I was getting at is the idea

613
02:57:23.439 --> 02:57:39.760
that I think has been discussed by this candidate that the creation of market rate housing has the effect of then reducing housing costs in other ways in that like trickle down approach. And that is what I was

614
02:57:39.760 --> 02:57:55.680
specifically referencing. Not that I am in any way against including some market rate housing as part of a well-rounded housing production plan. And as we included in the the motion earlier about Hampshire College, I think that this is

615
02:57:55.680 --> 02:58:10.960
something that most of us can agree on. What I don't agree with is that that being market rate housing being the sole focus and that and the implication that that will then solve the affordability the increase in amount of market rate

616
02:58:10.960 --> 02:58:25.279
housing will then solve the affordability crisis for our residents. I don't agree with that. >> Okay. Thank you. We have one more hand up and then hopefully we'll be able to vote on the motion to amend uh Sam. Uh thank you Mandy and thank you fellow

617
02:58:25.279 --> 02:58:43.439
counselors for your uh comments. Um I I would like to just add one thing which is that um I have had a a few different conversations with candidate Naymith and uh

618
02:58:43.439 --> 02:59:01.520
he he really did uh engage in uh productive debate with me on the subject areas. That is to say, I tend to get into details and um the conversations were focused specifically

619
02:59:01.520 --> 02:59:18.720
on whatever the topic was. It happened to be housing. Uh and I walked away from the conversation saying, "Well, here's somebody who uh has a high level of interest and uh is able to engage in a

620
02:59:18.720 --> 02:59:33.920
back and forth on the topic." Now, that was my experience uh over a couple of conversations, but uh you know, we didn't agree on every comment, but there was recognition. I understand what you're saying and vice

621
02:59:33.920 --> 02:59:51.439
versa. I'm only speaking to my own experience. Uh so, thank you. >> Thank you. We now have another hand up before we can get to the motion vote on the motion to amend Pam Rooney. Um, since we won't be discussing this further, I hope I do want to recognize

622
02:59:51.439 --> 03:00:08.800
that Fred Hartwell has been practicing what he preaches um for a number of years as an owner occupant uh of of a rental. he has purposefully kept his rents in the affordable range

623
03:00:08.800 --> 03:00:26.240
accessible to people um and as part of a strategy for for helping essentially keep affordability rates um where they should be. So he he is advocating that owner

624
03:00:26.240 --> 03:00:40.720
occupancy of rentals is very very different from um investor investor um invested real rentals. I'm not saying

625
03:00:40.720 --> 03:00:57.200
this very well but um I appreciate that he that he in fact does what he says and has contributed in that manner for a long time. Thank you, Councelor Walker. >> Um, thank you, Mandy Joe. I think a lot of folks have already spoke to a lot of

626
03:00:57.200 --> 03:01:13.920
the things that I wanted to say, but I did just want to highlight a couple of things. Um, one of them being sort of the lack of diversity of the pool, uh, which was something significant for me. Um, and I think when thinking about the planning board and I know that um, as a

627
03:01:13.920 --> 03:01:31.279
member of the CRC, we did have some uh, criteria that we were looking for and we had some guidance from the chair of the planning board in terms of um, what they were looking for for members to fill those three slots. And I think that that was helpful. But I think as someone who has grown up in this town as a

628
03:01:31.279 --> 03:01:49.120
low-income renter that it is really disheartening to know that we have we don't have uh anyone of my demographic even applying or serving on the committee. And it is really concerning to me because uh the committee is dealing largely with

629
03:01:49.120 --> 03:02:05.840
uh the housing production plan uh housing zoning all of those things. And um we have all recognized housing to be uh one of the particularly particular challenges in this town. Um and so I think it's going to be one of the most

630
03:02:05.840 --> 03:02:22.240
significant things for us to address and without bringing in the actual perspective of renters and lowincome folks in this town, I think that that is a miss. Um, so when we were doing the interviews for CRC, um, although we had

631
03:02:22.240 --> 03:02:38.240
the guidance, I had my own sort of personal rating scale and way that I was taking notes. Um, trying to be as unbiased as possible because again, you know, the the pool for myself is just 100% white men, which is the demographic that we have over represented on every

632
03:02:38.240 --> 03:02:53.439
committee in town. Um, and so just trying to be as unbiased as possible. And I did appreciate that Evan was the only person who did have emphasis on that idea. Not that he personally represents that category, but that he mentioned it. And so that did give him

633
03:02:53.439 --> 03:03:08.720
some more points for me personally. Um, however, when I when it all came to the end, my top three ended up being uh Fred Hartwell ended up being third in my rating score. And so that's how I voted. Um, and that's how the committee ended

634
03:03:08.720 --> 03:03:24.960
up voting. And I I did recognize in the meeting and I think other CRC members also did recognize that there was no real consensus on number three. Um and that a few members may have possibly been able to take the third spot depending on what motion came forward at

635
03:03:24.960 --> 03:03:41.920
what time. Um and so again I think this may be a a process issue that we might want to think about in term in terms of our process at CRC and maybe even at the council in general because I think this has happened on a few other issues. It's just whoever gets the motion out first sometimes is the winner. Um, but that's

636
03:03:41.920 --> 03:03:57.600
what happened. Um, and so at this time I do feel comfortable supporting the original in the original recommendation from the committee. But I did also just want to mention I don't know it's just a very unfortunate process because I feel it

637
03:03:57.600 --> 03:04:13.520
very unfortunate that we all had to come here and talk about people's character on a live recorded meeting because anyone interviewing for any job ever has to go through that. And for someone to have to interview for a committee for the to be placed on for the next three years without any pay, a significant

638
03:04:13.520 --> 03:04:29.840
dedication of their time and to then also be like publicly scorned feels really very unfortunate for to me and wanting to like appeal to other folks to apply to these boards. We want uh more hardworking folks who have jobs and we

639
03:04:29.840 --> 03:04:45.840
want more renters and nobody's going to want to apply for these kinds of positions if this is what they see. Um, so this has been like a little bit of a difficult uh conversation for me, although I understand that it's necessary and it's part of our job. Um, but I just wanted to voice some of those

640
03:04:45.840 --> 03:05:03.200
things and to state that I intend to support the original recommendation of the CRC. >> Thank you, Councelor Wal Walker. Um, I see no other hands. We are now moving to a vote on the motion to amend. An I vote would amend the motion to um put Evan

641
03:05:03.200 --> 03:05:18.000
Nate Smith's name in the original motion. A no vote would keep the motion as Fred Hartwell in the original motion. Uh we start with Anna Deon Gothier >> I. >> Lyn Greimemer >> nay.

642
03:05:18.000 --> 03:05:34.640
>> Mandy Johanni is an I. >> Councelor Lord. >> Nay. >> Sam Mloud. >> Hi. >> Pam Rooney. >> No. >> Councelor Ryan. >> Hi. >> Kathy Shane.

643
03:05:34.640 --> 03:05:49.200
No >> Jennifer Tub. >> No. >> Councelor Walker. >> No. >> Councelor Breick. >> No. >> Councelor Ko Martin. >> No. >> Andy Churchill. >> Yes.

644
03:05:49.200 --> 03:06:06.399
>> There are five in favor and eight opposed. The motion fails. The motion to amend fails. We move on to the original motion which is to appoint Fred Hartwell to the planning board for a term beginning July 1, 2026 and ending June 30, 2029. Is

645
03:06:06.399 --> 03:06:24.880
there any additional comment? Andy Churchill. >> I I I think that um Alicia was correct in that >> you need to speak closer with your mic on. >> This mic not very good. >> Yeah. Um, I think Alicia was correct

646
03:06:24.880 --> 03:06:40.800
that that that we're in a situation that's driven by a process that that we need to think about because I I think that the CRC was um when we went around at the beginning, we had we sort of listed one people we

647
03:06:40.800 --> 03:06:56.000
were interested in and and it became clear that there were two people that seemed to, you know, everybody sort of could come together around and then there were three others that, you you know, by by virtue of either incumbency or new qualities that they

648
03:06:56.000 --> 03:07:10.720
brought to the the table, um were were qualified but were but received split votes partially because I think of the process. And I think maybe going forward we might want to consider some sort of rank choice voting so that

649
03:07:10.720 --> 03:07:27.920
we could um have a a better way of of um assessing who's an acceptable candidate and if you know if they might not be my favorite but they might be acceptable and we might get a a stronger majority of people who would have acceptable

650
03:07:27.920 --> 03:07:43.840
candidates. Um, so I felt like we had two candidates that were uh that would bring new things to the table and I thought that Glenn Hazelton was a very strong candidate and brought GIS experience and planning

651
03:07:43.840 --> 03:08:03.120
experience and worked on boards. And for that reason, I'm making a motion that we substitute Glenn Hazelton for Fred Hartwell, who has already had nine years on the planning board. So I hear a motion to amend to um

652
03:08:03.120 --> 03:08:29.600
substitute the name Glenn Hazelton for Fred Hartwell. Is there a second? >> Ryan second. >> Is there discussion? Uh we start with Well, Andy, you already spoke to your motion. Um, so Sam Mloud,

653
03:08:29.600 --> 03:08:44.160
>> um, I was impressed with his statement of interest. Uh, I couldn't, uh, review the, uh, committee process. Um, he would be someone new who has

654
03:08:44.160 --> 03:09:01.680
significant experience in planning, uh, and, uh, clearly has other candidates is interested. Uh, I've from from my own viewpoint found him to be impressive. Thank you,

655
03:09:01.680 --> 03:09:20.080
>> Council Ryan. >> So, I cannot vote to put someone on this board who has already given nine years and we would be giving him 12. I just I I really struggle with that.

656
03:09:20.080 --> 03:09:37.120
Um, Mr. Hazelton offers, I think, a different perspective. Um, he offers a fresh view. I have no problem with his candidacy. So, I will vote to support this amendment in the hopes that we can get some new fresh perspective and ideas

657
03:09:37.120 --> 03:09:53.359
on a board that I think could certainly use it. I want to say something very quickly about process. However, um CRC does not decide who sits on the planning board. CRC makes a recommendation to us and I would expect as chair of any body certainly one that's making a

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recommendation to the council and I would certainly follow this that I would um seek to get uh consensus from my committee. Um that would be 4 to one or 50. 32 is not a consensus and in this particular case as I think councelor

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Churchill has pointed out um any number of candidates could have gone 3-2. So to leave this up to chance strikes me as just absurd. It's our decision. Ultimately, no matter what CRC decides, you have to look at the candidates and make your decision. This is an important

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body and it's going to be more important in the years going ahead. So, um, please don't let's not obsess about process. A fair statement would be that we had two candidates that had a consensus from the committee and we had the rest was all over the place and that leaves it up to

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us to make up our minds. You look at the SOIS, you uh look at the uh if you have a chance to look at the questioning period, you just have to do your homework and I know how hard that is, especially given all the things that we have to do, but that's what you have to do. And in this case, that's what you

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had to do. Um you can't just turn to CRC and say, tell us what the answer is. Um, so in this case, I hope you will follow the amendment, support the amendment, and put Mr. Hazelton on this body. Thank you. >> Thank you, Council Ryan Pam Ernie.

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>> Um, I I would like to point out that just last year, we reappointed Mr. Bruce who also had served with me back in n the 1990s and the 2000s for six years. So he is now into his uh fourth

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term and is doing a terrific job. It is not that someone doesn't bring really good skills to the table. I think this is, you know, let's not forget that people in fact do bring good skills to the table.

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>> Thank you, Pam. Sam Mlava. >> Uh thank you, Mandy. Uh, I'd just like to say that I uh uh have great respect for the chair of the uh CRC. Uh, and I'm not uh making judgments on the process.

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Um, and uh I appreciate the uh challenges that all counselors and all chairs in particular have. Uh, and I seek to make determinations based on my ownformational process. uh and in this

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case I reviewed everything that I could but I'd like to again indicate respect for uh uh the chair of the CRC. Thank you. >> Thank you Sam. I see no other hands on this motion to amend to substitute the name Glenn

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Hazelton for Fred Hartwell in the original motion. So we will move to a vote. We start with Lynn Griezmer. >> Abstain. Mandy Johanni is a no. Councelor Lord, >> nay. >> Sam Mloud,

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>> I. >> Pam Rooney, >> no. >> Councelor Ryan, >> I. >> Kathy Shane, >> abstain. >> Jennifer Tub, >> no.

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>> Councelor Walker, >> no. >> Councelor Brevik, >> abstain. Councelor Ko Martin, >> no. >> Andy Churchill, >> yes. >> Anna Delong Gothier,

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>> no. >> That is three in favor. Seven opposed and three abstensions. Um, that motion fails. We move back to the original motion, which is to appoint Fred Hartwell to the planning board for

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a term beginning July 1, 2026. and ending June 30, 2029. Is there any other discussion? Sam Mlab. >> He seems to be a very qualified candidate. Thank you. >> Thank you. Is there any further

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discussion? Seeing none, we start with myself. Mandy Joe Hanaki is a nay. Councelor Lord. The motion is to appoint Fred Hartwell to the planning board for a term beginning July 1, 2026 and ending June

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30, 2029. >> I'm sorry. He was the one that was recommended by the planning board >> by a 3-2 vote. Correct. >> Thank you. It's late. Um I >> Sam Mloud >> I. >> Pam Rooney. >> Yes. >> Councelor Ryan.

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>> Nay. >> Kathy Shane. >> Yes. >> Jennifer Todd. Yes. >> Councelor Walker. >> Yes. >> Councelor Breick. >> Yes. >> Councelor Ko Martin. >> Yes. >> Andy Churchill. >> Yes.

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>> Anna Deong Gothier. >> I. >> Lyn Greimemer. >> I. >> That is 11 in favor and two opposed. The motion passes. We move on. Um

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it is time for town uh committee and leaison reports. Um it is late. We still have an executive session to vote. Um I am going to ask that we keep the rest of this agenda as quick as possible before we get to the executive session. Are

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there any town council committee reports? I see no hands. Are there any town committees with councelor members that have reports? I see no hands. Are there any liaison reports? I see no hands. You guys are doing

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great. Um, approval of minutes was done on consent. Paul, for the town manager report. >> No hands. >> Are there any questions for the town manager report? I want to remind the council that the town manager will not be at the next coun well not be at the

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June 15th next regular council meeting um for reports. Lynn, >> I'd just like to thank the town manager for the extraordinary words he said at Connie Krueger's memorial yesterday and if possible I'd

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like him to share that with the rest of the council. Thank you. >> Thank you Sam. >> Thank you Mandy. Uh, I'd like to indicate I had a brief conversation with the town manager and I'm glad to hear that the DPW is pursuing

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uh interviews to fill vacancies with the uh highway department and I'm hopeful that that will continue until all the positions are filled because I think it's uh of great importance certainly to my constituents but to me and to people

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in the town. So, I'm glad to hear that the uh town manager has indicated that they're continuing with that and I'm hopeful that the hard work that the town did in terms of the renegotiation of all of the union contracts and in particular

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DPW may uh be of benefit in that regard. So, thank you uh to the town staff as led by the town manager for their work. Thank you. >> Thank you, Councelor Kendall Martin. Yeah, I also just wanted to say out loud that um really happy to hear that the DPW contracts have been settled and

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signed. Um yay. Um and uh yeah, maybe now we can get that uh DPW worker around the committee. Thank you. Thank you. Um town council comments. The president's report is in the packet. It didn't include much um

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this week. Although I did want to mention that the uh monthly legislative check-in has now moved to Mondays from Tuesday. So it did happen today. I will instead of waiting to that the full report on on the check-in for today will

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be in the next council packet in my president's report. Um but we have moved it to Monday's first Monday of the month instead of first Tuesday of the month. future agenda items. Next regular meeting is basically budgets. So

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we'll have a finance committee report and we will be going over all the budget motions and hopefully voting all the budget motions. Um any other councelor comments before we move on? Seeing none, there are no topics. There are not any topics not reasonably

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anticipated by the chair 48 hours in advance. That's a lot of knots. So, we will move on. I make a motion in accordance with MGL chapter 3A section 21A6 to enter executive session to consider the purchase, exchange, lease,

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or value of real property, property owned by Ammerst College by Hampshire College, 893 West Street. The chair declares that an open meeting may have a detrimental effect on the negotiating position of the public body. The town council will not return to open session.

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Is there a second? >> Second. >> I heard Lynn's voice first. Uh is there discussion? >> Ma'am, >> I'd just like to have a threem minute break uh between sessions >> if you're able and find it uh something

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to do. Thank you. >> We we will. Any further discussion? Seeing none, we start with councelor Lord. Hi. Sam Mloud, >> hi. >> Pam Rooney, >> yes. >> Councelor Ryan, >> hi. >> Kathy Shane,

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>> yes. >> Jennifer Tob, >> yes. >> Councelor Walker, >> yes. >> Was that a yes? >> Okay, thank you. There was a weird like echo. Councelor Brevik, >> yes. >> Councelor Kenno Martin,

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>> yes. >> Andy Churchill, >> yes. Anna Devlinia. Did Anna leave? >> Her neck got weird, but I'm still here. And I >> Okay, thank you. Lyn Greimemer >> I. >> And Mandy Johannicki is an I. That is unanimous. We are now in executive

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session. Um, so we will leave this Zoom and sign on to another one.