looks. Oh, I guess there's attendees there. >> There are attendees. Yes. >> Okay. Well, welcome everyone. I'd like to call this um community preserv P preservation act committee meeting of January 15,
2026 to order. Um we are holding this via Zoom and welcome everyone who's joining us in the audience and um I'd like to welcome
our newest committee member Mark Barrett. Um before I do that I just I'm confirming but I know already based on Tim's question that he is as he said he would taking minutes for today's meeting. Thank you, Tim. >> I confirm that.
>> Thank you. Um I really appreciate that. So, Mark, we're so glad you're here. I hope um you know, Mark is a member of the Ammerst Housing Authority Board of Commissioners and he's filling the
vacancy created by um Dr. Dave Williams who stepped down from CPA. And I just want to take two seconds to thank Dr. Williams for his many years of service on the CPA. I this is my sixth year and
he was on it before I started um and his commitment to the housing authority work that he had done for many many years and uh among other things for our community. So I just want to say that how grateful we are for his devoted service to the
community and um specifically to the CPA. Um, Mark was voted and approved by the town council in December and I think was uh sworn in this week or last week as a member of
the CPA. I think we've lost him though, so I don't see him. Maybe he was having trouble connecting. Do you see him in the audience at all, Lee? I don't I mean I can look too
I see him as an attendee. I wonder I don't Well, we can bring him in. Try it again. >> Yeah, I tried it again. >> Okay. Okay, great. I think we don't know if Mark, we'd love for you. Um, we're gonna
take a roll. >> Oh, great. We hear you. >> I am so sorry. My computer froze as soon as you started talking. >> So, I'm on my phone. So, I'm going to try to get on the computer also. But, thank you very much for all your help.
>> I'm trying to catch up as best I can. >> Yes. No, we we're grateful you're here. We appreciate you. We know it's um unusual to be added at this stage of the um of the process, but we're just
grateful that you're uh doing this volunteer work with the housing authority and with us. So, thank you. Thank you. Thank you. And I didn't know if you just could share a little bit about yourself as way of introduction. Then we'll do a roll call, you know, we'll roll call around um people can
introduce themselves. So you get connected. >> You want me to do it now, Katie? >> Yeah, that'd be great. >> Okay. Well, I'm Mark Barrett. I've been on the housing authority both in Beluretown and Ammerst. Uh let's see. I am also part of was part of the COA. I
run the Rainbow Coffee Hour and Ammerst for two and a half two and a half years. Um I I get involved in a lot of things. So, and I was also part of let's see what is it called? um I want to say one of the agencies for
and I want to say Highland Valley. So I'm very very familiar with what you guys do, how you get your money, where it comes from, and how you guys vote on it. So I did all my homework on that part. The only thing is I just I just got to figure out who put in
applications and catch up on that part. >> Yeah. Yeah. Well, that's just for everyone else to know that I you know I think Mark, you were sworn in last week or this week. Yeah, I think it was Monday. It went down Monday. >> Yeah. Thank you. So, you know, it's a lot for Mark to have to sort of get
caught up on all of since we have 16 proposals. We have a very that's a big year for us, Mark. And um it's hard for all of us to be caught up on these all the details. So, you know, we expect you, you know, feel free to ask questions or, you know, do what you need
to do to participate, but we're happy to have you. >> Well, thank you very much. I gotta figure out how to mute myself. I don't know how to do it on the phone. >> You did it. Great. Well, as we do, if we could just
go around and make sure that we can hear each other and um just say that say you're um here um and I will start with Jonas. >> Hi, I'm Jonas Cox. Um, I'm on the rec
committee and first year on CPAC. >> Great. Uh, Tim >> here present. >> Great. And Tim, you've been on the CPA for >> six years, too, right? Yeah. Five, six years. Yeah. >> Yeah. >> We always start things together.
>> Yes, I know. And I'm leaving you again. What can I tell you? >> Oh gosh. Uh, Angus. >> Uh, present. I'm Angus Mloud. I'm on the planning board and this is my first year on the CPA. >> Great. Thank you, Jason.
>> Here I'm Jason Dorney. I am on the conservation commission and this is my second year on CPA. >> Great. Thanks, Bob. >> Uh Bob Saul, this is my third year on CPAC. And uh Mark, it's nice to meet
you. >> Thanks, Bob. Robin. >> Uh, hi. I'm Robin Forom. Um, I'm a chair of the historical commission and I've lost track of how long I've been on CPA. >> That's okay. We keep track for you.
Ellen. >> Uh, hi. I'm Ellen Kaider and this is my first year on the CPA. >> Great. Thanks, Ellen. Um, so I think that those are all committee members are present and accounted for. We can hear
each other. Um Leah Carver, you've met through email. Mark and Sean Mangano and Dave Zo will be joining us for various portions of the meeting coming up. You've probably run into those two before as well. So our first order um is there are there
any other announcements? This was our announcement section. Any other announcements? Aside from the fact that we had a bit of a a tiny tiny wrinkle with updating the Zoom link, hopefully everyone, it looks like we have got a great crowd um in
attendance, 17 people and all of us. I assume that wrinkle is totally smoothed out now. So, thanks everyone for your patience. Our first order of business is to approve the minutes. um which uh
Jonas I think you provided. I think that was most recently. Is that right? >> Sounds right. >> Yes. Um those were the I just sorry I don't have in front of me but those were the
minutes from December 11th. Can >> check. >> We've lost Oh, there's Leah. Oh, Ellen, you have a question. Just saw your hand. Sorry. >> Oh, sorry. I'm not at home and I'm having major connectivity issues. So,
um, everybody keeps dropping out and I apologize. I'm going to try to move around to a better spot. >> Okay. Okay. You mean you can't hear us well or >> Right. Correct. It It keeps dropping. So, >> Okay. All right. Ellen, >> it might be helpful if you turn your
video off. >> Okay. You can >> um sorry also join join by audio only and um yeah just keep your screen up. That might help too. >> Okay. Thanks. Sorry I'm I'm at my
parents and the Wi-Fi is not good here. >> Yeah. Got it. We got that. Um sorry Leah. Is are we approving the >> I think it's the 121 18 minutes. >> Yeah. 18th. Sorry. Thank you.
>> Yeah. December 18th. >> Yeah. 12:18. So I didn't >> I would like a motion to approve the minutes or are there first if are there any comments or corrections? Angus. >> No, I was going to move.
>> Oh, >> and I will second. >> Okay. >> Jonas, those were great minutes. >> Yeah. And um hearing no comments, additions, corrections,
I will um call for a vote with a um roll call vote as we do. Um starting with um Angus. >> Yay. >> Jason. >> Hi.
>> Bob. >> Hi. >> Robin. Hi >> Ellen. >> Hi >> Jonas. >> Hi >> Tim. >> I
>> and Mark. We've got you two. I can see your profile and your but I don't have any audio on either one. So, I can't tell if you're voting or abstaining or Mark, do you have audio? Okay, that's a thumbs up signal because there's no
audio. Okay. All right. Well, those are um those minutes were approved unanimously. Thank you very much, Jonas. And thanks to everyone for reading them, reviewing them. Great. Okay, moving into
the next portion of our agenda which is public comment. I'd like to ask the attendees, folks who are um with us tonight by Zoom, if they
since there's now 16 of you, if you could um show by raising your hand in Zoom, if you're interested in making a comment uh this evening, just so we could see
how much time this portion will take. Um, I'm sorry, Katie. We're talking about making a comment on on the projects before us. Like short comment. Is that what we're talking about? Sorry. >> It's what we >> It's okay. Yeah. Public comment at the
beginning of every meeting. >> Okay. >> You know, we usually have a couple comments from people who are in the audience. Um, and I see that there's a lot of people. So, I just, you know, sometimes people are here just to watch live as opposed to the recording.
So, hard to know. >> My apologies. >> I was distracted and I thought you're talking about us, not the public. Thank >> Oh, excuse me. Yeah. No. Yeah. Um, so, so far I have three attendees who are planning to and wish to make a comment.
Doesn't mean you can't change your mind, of course, but just so we have a sense of whether or not time limits would be helpful so that everyone gets a chance to be heard. Any others besides
those who've raised their hand? Okay. Well, I think it would be great to um start you can lo well actually what we'll just go in the order in which we have them here. Um and you can make your
comment. I I think it would be good just state your name and where you live and um you know we'll try to keep it to three minutesish maybe three four minutes for sure. We have um we have a little bit of
time if we want to give about 15 minutes to this and others aren't interested in speaking but just uh participating. Um how does that sound to the committee? >> Good. >> Reasonable. Okay.
>> Great. Okay. So, it looks like >> I brought in um Yeah, I brought our first one in. Kent. >> Okay. So, Kent Berber, welcome. >> Thank you very much. I'm going to stay off video because I had a little face surgery this morning. You don't want to
know what I look like. Thank you for the chance to comment. Kent Fer 481 Station Road in Ammerst. And I did submit some written comments, but I just wanted a minute or two to amplify uh one aspect of those that has to do
with the suggestion that have been made that uh the Jones Library CPA application can't be granted because the town has bond authorized the entire cost of the project and the CPA grant would therefore replace or substitute or
supplant part of that. And this is just totally erroneous. It's a misreading of the facts and the CPA supplanting law. Um the CPA supplanting law comes from section 6B six of chapter 44B,
the Mass General laws, which was part of the community preservation act, which says the community presentation fund shall not replace existing operating funds, only augment them. The clear purpose of this provision is
to prevent towns from using CPA searchcharge funds to fund their general revenue obligations. And a CPA grant in this case would clearly not do that. Um so this prohibition wouldn't apply. In fact, the
borrowing uh authorization was not for the entire amount of the project. It had if you read the terms of it, it had to be reduced by the Mass Board of Library Commissioners grant and a specified amount to be provided by the Jones Library Trustees and a CPA grant would
help the latter, but it would not supplant any part of the town's contribution. The town's the eventual amount bounded. Nobody ever thought that the town would pay the entire cost of the project. It's its obligation was to
be funded at was to be capped at 15.8 8 million and a CPA grant would not reduce that. As an aside, in fact, some have suggested that the CPA grant be credited toward that pound part of the obligation, but that would clearly be an
obvious example of such prohibited supplanting or substitution. If the CPA committee wants to be absolutely sure that its funds do not replace general revenue funds, it it it could require that its grant only be paid at the
completion of the construction when the town's borrowing is clearly defined at the $15.8 million level. Such a grant then would only reduce the library trustee share of the cost of the project. The Bureau of Municipal Finance
guideline that has been quoted is is totally not applicable to this situation. It's aimed at the ordinary case where a borrower attempts to reduce the library it the liability it has already engaged to fund a project. It
does not in any way contemplate his project's unusual guarantee arrangement. that is the original borrowing authorization was a guarant simply a guarantee to the Mass Board of Library Commissioners that the project would go
forward um if if the MBLC made its grant. The only way a CPA grant might supplant funds from the town is if the trustees default on their obligation and then the CPA funds were used to defay the town's obligation to pay more than
the $15.8 $28 million. Again, if the CPA committee wanted to be absolutely sure that it didn't serve that purpose, it could condition its grant on that not happening. So, in conclusion, I would just urge that pretty clear that the CPA
law prohibiting replacing or substituting CPA funds for general obligation borrowing just doesn't apply to this situation. Thank you for the hard work you're doing on with all these applications. >> Thank you, Kent. Appreciate your public
comments. >> All right, so Jane Lithgo is the next uh welcome Jane. If you could just uh let us know where you live and you can get started. And Jane, you're on mute. If you've
already started, we can't hear you. >> Uh, sorry. This is David Lithco. Uh, I'm speaking for Jane. I'm using her. Uh, >> got it. Okay. >> Thank you for correcting me.
>> Uh, we moved here in 1977. Oh, just a second. I want to start my timer. Uh we moved here in 1977 to raise our our family. And uh uh over the years, while I didn't grow up in
Ammerst, Ammerst is now um my home quote unquote town. I heard a very interesting definition of the term uh home on a podcast recently defining home, the meaning of home as a place where one
feels connected uh protected and respected. >> Rather catchy. Well, every home uh every home needs a living room. And if Ammerst is my metaphorical home, uh the Jones
Library is the metaphorical living room. I can't think of any other location in Ammerst where everyone is welcome and feels um connected not only to the community
but connected to friends and family and uh protected and respected and I can't think of any uh location in town that preserves that feeling of home as
does the Jones Library. And so I feel passionately that uh the Jones Library renovation uh and expansion project preserving its historical significance should uh be supported by the uh by the
CPA. And uh the uh I'd just like to point out that you know we don't have a direct democracy in this town. We have a representative democracy. We no longer have town meeting. We have town council and we have extraordinary town council
members who have deployed uh you know expertise to closely examine evidence using that expertise to deliberate the difficult questions that a complex uh society like our town presents. And
that representative democracy has worked. Uh and so uh I urge you to uh take that into consideration when you consider uh the importance of the uh library to this town and its historical
significance and its preservation. And uh I hope I stayed under three minutes. >> You definitely did. And thank you so much uh David for your taking the time to share your public comment with us. Much appreciated.
Um, I think Maria's next. Oh, there she's coming in. Welcome, Maria. >> Thank you. Maria Kapiki, South Ammerst. Uh, I hope that members of the committee have read the document I sent you and have looked into the concerns I raised. I speak today in opposition to the
request for any CPA funds for the Jones Library Building Project. My objection is based on the fact that this request violates rules against the use of CPA funds for this project. Namely, one, the prohibition of the use of CPA funds for projects that are not in accordance with
the Secretary of the Interior's standards for the treatment of historic properties. This project was repeatedly denied historic tax credits for the same reason. CPA's rule CPA rules instruct that quote CPA grant awards for rehabilitation work on historic
researches resources should clearly stipulate use of these standards as a requirement of receiving the grant. It does not meet that. Number two, the prohibition against supplanting, which holds that quote, once a community authorizes a
borrowing with another financing source for debt service, it cannot amend or change the financing source to a community preservation fund financing source. I'm sure that Mr. Farber is not trying to represent himself as a legal opinion. And if there is any concern about this, you should talk to the CPA
on a higher level and to legal sources. This is not okay to use CPA money for this. and MCPA money that had already been granted as I mentioned in the document I sent you has already been
borrowed in an inappropriate way for work on special collections which clearly has not happened yet. The Amoris Historic Commission appropriately noted that the funding for the items named in the CPA request are already part of the $46.1
million total project budget, the borrowing for which has already been authorized by town council. The Jones Library building committee committee has explicitly stated that any additional costs for treatment of the windows and woodwork stipulated by the section 106
process will be covered by the project contingency funds which are included in the $46.1 million authorization. To be crystal clear, the decision before you is not about whether you or others are fans of the library building
project. It is also not about whether the project can or should move forward. The project is happening as we speak and will be completed regardless of your actions today. The pertinent question for you is whether it is appropriate or
even permitted to commit precious Emmer CPA funds to it. The evidence clearly indicates that it is not. You may you have many other excellent and worthy projects that actually need CPA funds to
happen at all. I urge you to recommend spending the $2.5 million fiscal year 2027 CPA budget on those instead of the Jones Library project. Thank you.
>> Thank you, Maria. appreciate your public comments and thank you so much. Have a great evening. Um, I'm looking Leah, I don't see any other hands raised for public comment. Is there anyone else who'd like to make a
public comment this evening? because once we close that part of the agenda, we will be moving into deliberations and that will be the end of public comments for this process.
>> I don't think there'd be anyone new. >> Anybody else? The last call to >> Oh, we have one ready. >> Yes. Yes, please. Gigi, welcome. And if you just introduce yourself, where you live, that'd be great.
>> So, Gigi Barnhill. I live at 54 Larksburg Drive in Ammerst, and I'm president of the Amoris Historical Society. I just want to say that we did make an application to the Massachusetts Cultural Council Cultural Facilities
Fund for half of the cost of our project. We won't know the results of that for some time of course, but I did want you to know that we had taken your advice and have moved forward. >> Great. Thank you so much for that
update. I appreciate it. And >> thanks. >> Wish you wish you the best with that. I hope that comes through. >> We do too. >> Thank you. Okay. Well, this ends the public comment section of
our meetings and our process this season. I just want to thank the public for all of their um for showing up to these meetings, for listening, for looking at the recordings and listening to those and um for participating in
public comment and the public hearing. And I just want to say that for the first time in my six years um to receive I think I added up close to 40 pages of emails
um in favor of and opposed to different projects. So that is an impressive amount of public um participation. So, thank you to the public for
being with us. So, we'll we'll um end the public comment portion and now we'll be entering into the deliberation stage. >> Excuse me, Katie. The financial update. >> Yeah. So, I I've sort of
>> the financial update to me is not really part of public. It's starting our deliberations. It's getting us information. So, we're going to go right in. We are going to go right into that. him and I I just want to >> say that we're going to start with deliberation I mean start our deliberations with the financial update
>> a chance for Sean to walk us through um the the debt service schedule for us to ask questions for us to understand you know what money is available and implications going forward should we make decisions about additional debt and
then I will describe sort of my proposed process process for getting us rolling into um discussion of the proposals. So, if that's okay with the committee, we'll start with Sean so we have as much of that information
um first. Does that all sound okay? >> Thank you. >> Okay, great. All right, Sean, you are up. >> Hi, everybody. Um can you hear me? Okay. >> Yes, >> sounds good. All right. I apologize if you hear any unicorn sounds in the background. I've got a very delicate
balance with my four-year-old watching a movie and it's like, you know, >> unicorns are great. Let's bring in more unicorns. >> If it becomes a distraction, let me know. Um, and so I'm going to share my screen in a second. Leah, if you could look for hands, I think the best thing to do would be if you have questions as
I'm presenting some of the the information, just raise your hand and we'll kind of address them as we go. All right. See? All right. Can you uh see the presentation on the screen? >> Yeah. >> Yes.
>> All right. So, the first thing we wanted to share with you is an update on your funding. Um, so there's been some uh shifts in a positive direction, and I'll highlight what those are and why I went went in that direction. Um, so we start
FY26 with 1.9 million. One adjustment we made is we've increased our estimates of the local search charge looking at what we've collected in prior years. Um, so we've increased that to 1.4 million for FY26 and then we increased it a little bit more for FY27. U, the local search
charge tends to grow a little bit every year just like property taxes grow a little bit every year. It's a it's a percentage. Um, so that's why when we look back at history that tends to grow a little bit. Uh, the state match I think was in there already, but we've updated the percentage. So ultimately
was a 22.8% match relative to the searchcharge dollars that we collected. So the available balance for this current year that we're in FY26. We take the beginning balance, add in what we're estimating that we'll collect in search charge, and the state match brings us to
3.7 million. Now we subtract from that the appropriations that were made for FY26. Um so this is another area where uh there were some really this was me not digging into this enough when we presented this before we uh included the number that the CPA committee
recommended last time around um which included about $600,000 worth of debt. Ultimately, what the town council approved for debt when they voted the budget um in June was only about 200,000 because as we spoke about, I think last time I was here, some of those projects
weren't ready to happen. So, if you go back and you look at this chart from last year, you'll see a bigger number for the the recommendation from CPA than the 1.8 million. Uh but ultimately, between the appropriations that the CPA committee recommended and the debt that actually got appropriated, the total was
1.8. So that actually put more money into your beginning balance um for FY206 for the year we're we're looking at. So then you go down um to the next half of this uh chart. So you start with 1.8 million and we've you add the assessed
local tax that we're estimating for this year 1.4 uh state match we're estimating about 320 and that gives us 3.6 available for this year. And then the only thing we subtract right now is the debt um the estimated debt for next year based on
the projects that have already been approved. So we'll look at that on the next screen. Um we feel pretty confident that the debt that we're projecting for next year is going to happen. We're getting ready to borrow for these projects now. Um so and last year we thought that was going to happen and it
didn't. Uh this time around feel confident that this number is ultimately somewhere around this number. We won't know till the interest rates are set, but somewhere around this 524 is what the uh debt payment will be from CPA next year. So that leaves the CPA
committee with 3.1 million um available for other projects. So this slide just kind of talks about some of what I just mentioned and you can see the projects at the bottom that make up that 524 for track and field there. There were
two separate CPA appropriations or debt authorizations for the track and field. When we go out to borrow, we're going to consolidate those. So you'll just see that as one one appropriation for the the combination of the two. And again, if you have any questions as
we go through this, just raise your hand. And you'll also see in that chart at the bottom, we put what year of the debt payment. So, for example, Beltown Road FY27 will be the fifth payment of 10 payments. So, that was a 10-year borrowing term. Uh, but for many of
these projects, you'll see that it's year one of 10. Jason, >> thanks. Sean, does that mean then that that Belchuretown Road was $715,000? >> Um, yeah, it was in that in that vicinity. Yeah, I I have to go back and
look if we did. So, we're going to talk about this in a couple screens. You can structure your debt to be level principal or level um payment. And depending on how that debt was structured, um the principal payments may be uh the payments may be descending over the term. So, I have to go back and
double check that, but it was some Dave, you may remember exactly what that appropriation was, but it was somewhere in that range. >> That's right, Sean. It was >> It was 700 something. I I I too am a little fuzzy on the number, but it was between 7 and 800,000.
>> Yep. Good. >> All right. Keep going. So um CPA committee can recommend projects be funded with debt. Um debt fund funded projects will reduce the amount of CPA funds available in future years because those debt payments take
priority over new projects. Um the ultimately the length of the debt term and the composition of the debt, how we structure it, that's ultimately a treasurer decision. Um and we work with we have a financial adviser that works for Uni Bank. Um has worked for the town for many years. So we work with them
very closely on all of our debt issuances and they help us come up with the most advantageous structure for the town. Uh but there are some decisions that we make based on different operational needs. Um and we'll talk about what some of those are. Some of the factors that influence the costs are ultimately the length. You know go out
for 10 years, 15 years, 20 years. You can't go out longer than the life of the asset, but you do have some flexibility to go out less if you want to pay off the debt faster. Um and as I mentioned, you can structure the payown of the debt. You can do level principal which will I'll show you an example on a few
slides. It'll lower the cost at the front end but it'll ultimately you'll pay higher interest or you could do um or sorry you could do level payment which will do that or you could do level principal which will pay it off faster um but you'll but it'll be higher at the
front end. And all the debt that we issue is competitive. So whenever we go for borrowing, we bundle all of our different financings that we have to do and it goes out on a market and banks essentially compete and so we get the to guarantee we get the best interest rate.
So this is that example that I mentioned. Um it's might be a little small but essentially it's just giving you um under understanding of what I just mentioned which is so level principles the top uh the top table here. So, this is if we were to do a million-doll project at 4%, which is
roughly what interest rates are right now, um, and we wanted to keep our principal payment level at 100,000 per year, uh, we would our payment at the beginning would be a little bit higher, around 140,000, but it would descend over the life of the debt. Um, and the net or the total cost, interest, and
principal over the life of that borrowing would be about 1.2 million. If we had a lot of projects and we were trying to figure out ways to get that uh those initial years to be less expensive, we could do level payment which essentially keeps a flat payment
over the life of the debt and it some some way is good for budgeting. Um but the downside of that is you actually end up paying more interest over the life of the borrowing. Um so that cost would be about 1.23 million. Um so in this example, not a huge difference in the cost, but those are some of the things
we look at when we structure the debt. Jason Yeah, Sean, you just uh both these examples are 10 years and it appears most of the things that we've seen are 10 years, but you just mentioned that you can't I forget exactly what you said, but your payment schedule can't be greater than
>> you can't borrow for longer than the life of the asset. So, let's say the asset had a a 10year useful life. We couldn't go out and borrow for 15 years. >> Most things we borrow for has a longer useful life. Um we work with you know we look at different sources to determine
useful lives. So many things we we find are 20 30 years. Um >> yeah Brenda watch movie please. >> Any idea what the useful life of a slate roof is?
>> Um well that could be you know upwards of 30 years. Now there are limitations. We um on the back end you can't generally go over 30 years. I think there were some exceptions made recently for school projects that allow you to go a little bit longer for school projects, but generally you can't go longer than
30 years. >> Okay. >> I think I was there another hand. >> Yeah, I my question was answered. I was going to ask the same question about the slate roof and the timing and the characteristics. I mean, and maybe just
one general comment. The slate roof seems like a great example of an asset that could be bonded um >> in the whole menu of all the things we have. And just general comment there. >> Yep. Yeah. Roof roof projects I would
say are generally good candidates for borrowing. Um the useful lives are pretty well established. >> Angus. >> Yeah. My question is just the most of the debt that the town issues uh because this would be folded into you said other you know debt issuances the town does
are they usually for 10ear periods or are they variable? >> They're variable. Um so we have like a ladder truck for example is $1.5 million. I think we're we're borrowing for 15 years for that one. Um some are
less than you know borrow for f five years. Uh there's two types of borrowings. There's bond anticipation notes, which is short-term debt. And then there's an actual bond, which is like a permanent, like almost like a mortgage. Um, some projects that are really um, you know, not that are less
expensive, we may just do a bond anticipation note and pay it off a little bit over five years, five or six years. So, it really kind of depends on the project. But no, there's nothing set in stone about 10 years. Um, but I think for CPA, that's just generally been where it's where we've come in at. And generally speaking, the longer we push
out the repayment plan, the more the greater the interest we'd end up paying in total. >> Yeah, exactly. You'll you'll lower your payments a little bit, but you'll end up paying more in interest costs if you go out too far. >> Thank you. Just one um I'm going to interject myself before Dave
is just to note that especially for new CPA members. Fortunately for us, we have an awesome director of finance and uh finance committee that makes all of those decisions about length and all of
that stuff. So it's really we sort of are told that it's a 10 year or a 12 year or 15 or whatever. So, it's we don't have to make those decisions, but we have to decide, do we want to take on debt that will affect future
um ability to to fund new projects. So, that's it's just helpful to get all this background. I so appreciate you Sean and >> giving us a better understanding but just to I just wanted to make sure in case people were thinking we had to we had to consider the different types of
debt or the different ways to finance or the number of years or anything. Fortunately, we don't have to do that. So Dave, why don't you step in? >> Oh, sure. I just um I didn't quite hear Jason's question about the um slate roof. Was it a question of what is the
the the expected life of that? I mean, I think >> Yeah. Yeah. What is the How long do those last? >> I mean, it's one of the longest lasting roofs. >> Yeah. >> I think we can put on the structure. I think actually some of the slate roof may be original. So, you know, I know
slate roofs that have lasted 75 to 100 years. So, >> yeah, it's over 100 years. A lot of it is original. It's not heard. So, >> yeah, we will not borrow for that long. Yeah, Sean answered that generally it's no not longer than 30 years, which was
>> essentially getting at when I asked the question. >> We would we would bond for 10, but that clearly has a lifespan of many many decades. Thanks. >> Investment. Thanks, Dave. Appreciate it, Jonas. >> Uh, yes. Would any of our
recommendations uh from this committee end up with town council and then be bonded and then the debt is serviced from the town rather than from CPA or maybe we shouldn't even bother with that possibility.
>> Yeah. No, I mean if it's recommended by CPA and approved by the by the city council or the town council through CPA, then it would come out of CPA funds. Um, the only way that would happen would be if this if this committee didn't recommend it and the town council wanted to do the project still or
>> or if it you did recommend it and the town council rejected it for some reason um and wanted to fund it a different way. But if you recommend it and they accept it, it's going to be funded through CPA. >> Well, also I think the flip was I think David mentioned that if we don't recommend it that the town sometimes
will come in and say, "Well, it's needed anyway and we're going to bond it and >> Yeah. Yeah, potentially. Yeah. Well, >> um my my question to you, Sean, is why would we recommend that something be
bonded if it reduces our future capacity to fund projects? And and I understand we're not playing chicken with town council to some degree. want to do what's right for the town, but just seems with limited resources, we would
want to preserve those resources. Can you help me get into a mind frame where we might um suggest bonding? >> Yeah, I think it just it allows you to support larger projects. Um and you
know, one theory behind borrowing is you sort of spread the cost out among the generations that will benefit from that asset. So, for example, the track and field is going to benefit people for 10 to 15 years. Um, if you were to say, "We're not going to borrow for that.
We're going to use our whole CPA allocation and not be able to fund any other projects this year because that's essentially what it would do." You know, it'd be great. You'd have the track and field and there'd be no debt associated with it, but you wouldn't be able to do any other projects and you'd essentially be using all of this year's money um to provide that asset for many years to
come. So, I think the the general reason why you do it is um to be able to take on some of these larger projects and spread out the cost um when they are larger. We don't, you know, we won't borrow for things that are under a few hundred thousand dollars. It's really the projects that are larger that um and if you look at this year, there's some
projects that if you were to not borrow for them, that would be the only project you could do this year with the money you have. I'm I'm just going to be an obnoxious ex exfinance committee member where um it it seemed like the burden
fell upon at the time town meeting or town council to make that decision about bonding these long-term projects and the CPA was such a small fragment of that with such limited resources that I I
couldn't understand where our role role is in helping to make that decision. I know that's a very vague comment, but maybe you could just shed a little light on that. >> Yeah, I don't I don't know. I think again
I you'll get all different types of projects that are submitted to CPA, some small dollars, some large dollars. And if you want to be able to make, you know, some combination of all of them happen, in the past that has taken borrowing to make them happen. Um,
again, if you look at a lot of our big affordable housing projects that have done a lot of, you know, a lot of good in the community, track and field and some of the projects that we have coming up with the with the library and with Fort River. Um, again, without borrowing, those would have been very difficult for CPA to support and I don't
know if they would have got support anywhere else. >> Thanks. >> Yeah, Bob, thank you for being our resident philosopher on this. It's important that we understand the reasoning behind it. And um
I I think one other thing I would add to Sean's response is that you know this is um a funding stream, right? And so, can we can we be diverse in providing options
for funding more things than we might otherwise be able to do? >> Um, and I think I'd like to I know Jason has a comment, so I just I want I'm really mindful of time because of the 16 projects we have to get to. >> I can finish quickly, Katie, if you want me to. >> No, I know Sean, you've got your you've
got your piece to share. And I think um one of the things I just wanted to put a pin in and I think I've said this in the past. I think another meeting in the future to pick up this idea of you know what the CPA is comfortable in what percentage
of the overall dollars. I mean now that we have more dollars it's even a smaller percentage um that is going to debt. It's currently about 18% of our total. Um, I think it's actually less now. It's
probably more like 16 or something like that. And it's going to stay that way if we don't add more debt for 5 years. And then it will drop to about 10% of our total. So it might be a good thing
u I don't think now but for the CPA to have a conversation make sort of a decision of a maybe a um a range we're comfortable with the total amount of dollars available being spent towards debt in order to do larger projects and have more you know sort of be able to
fund more diverse things over time. So, it looks like um we've got a little debt modeling, but Jason, do you have a question that you want to jump out now? >> Yeah. U Katie, you know, you mentioned I think that the
ultimately the treasurer, they make the decision. Sean, I guess you're involved as well. I would assume making the decision on how the debt's structured. However, in this instance, you know, especially with like the slate hall, the slate uh
roof, and potentially even the library, right? That's we'll just call it $2.5 million in debt, >> right? Right. >> For for bonding, and that takes away future dollars from CPA. If we think that the slate roof is going
to be bonded for a period of 30 years, let's just say in theory, >> yeah, >> $30,000 payment each year. If it's only 10, it's a $100,000 payment each year, right? So, we I think we need to have a little bit of an idea of what the
potential method will be or how long that bond will go out so that we know how much it will affect future years. Um because the difference, you know, $70,000 is
a good amount of money. I mean, there's a number of these projects that are like, you know, less than 70,000 or pretty close to 70,000. So, that's potentially the difference between one or two projects getting funded. So, >> I think that's important for us to know when we're making these decisions.
>> Respond to that, Katie? >> Yes, please. >> Yeah. So, so Jason, one thing that um we'll do, you know, you you guys are going to do your deliberation, you're going to, you know, evaluate the projects. Um once we kind of hear that and get a sense for what direction the
committee is heading in, we will bring you back some different options for what that would look like. And it'll include exactly what you um what you you know, you're identifying, which is what what could it look like? Um and we'll bring back some different scenarios for what it would look like. Um, and that is not to steer you in any one direction, but
it's to say, you know, you guys really like these 10 projects, you know, like there's other ones. Um, here's how, you know, a couple options for how it could be done. Um, so you'll have a sense of that before you make your recommendation. >> Yeah, thank you, Sean. I really appreciate that. And I, that was, you
know, kind of part of our deliberation process has been to get that support from the town after we've done our ranking tonight. Um so between you know this meeting and next getting that information is super helpful and some
you know some ways Jason I think you know that some ways to do this is to do you can bond the whole project you can use some of the current dollars so that the bond the debt part is lower potentially so you know I think there's a lot of different ways to to do this
and um first starting with you know first us starting with the merits of each project and and seeing what we want to try to do and then figuring out a way to do it. >> Sean, do you have additional >> I have two more things. It'll be really
quick and then and we'll send this out to the committee and post it online. So, this is just our um your current debt that is approved with what we've projected for next year. That's in the dark blue and the light blue is the forecast of the search charge revenue. So, I didn't include state aid in here because the state aid number fluctuates
up and down and if you want to be really, you know, sure about this um when you approve debt that you have the funds to cover it. Um I think looking at the search charge revenue alone is the safest way to go. Um so the the the lighter blue is the estimate of that revenue over time. So as Katie
mentioned, it you know it's flat for a little while and just drops off when some of those other projects get paid off in in about five years. And then this is just a um just to kind of help you see it in your mind if for every million dollars of debt additional debt
you authorize and this is just again over 10 looking at like a 10-year model what it would do to this model. So the dark blue is still your current debt. The grayish color would be a million dollars more than that. The yellow would be $2 million more and the the darker
blue would be $3 million more. Um, so just again hypotheticals, not tied to any one project, but just to um help you visualize how that would eat into the funds that you have available in future years. >> And that's it. >> That's really helpful, Sean. I
appreciate you taking the time to put those together, walk us through. >> Um, I was just going to ask if there are a couple of other questions for Sean before we move on. Angus, >> mine's really brief. It's just um I
think you said this, but originally you had y'all had estimated that we had like two and a half million to work with for this year. Is that has that estimate gone up, Sean? >> Yeah. Yeah. So that estimates gone up um to about 3.1 and the two biggest reasons
why are we increased our estimates for the search charge revenue which helped um and the biggest reason why is the previous chart we gave you um assumed all of the debt that the committee had recommended last year was ultimately appropriated but a big chunk of it about
$400,000 of the debt that you thought was going to be appropriated ultimately didn't um because those projects weren't ready. Um, so what that means is you kind of set that money aside of the funds you had last year and now it's back in your beginning balance. >> Got it. >> Thank you.
>> Such good news. Thank you. We need and we needed the extra dollars. >> Great. Jason, >> um, yeah. So Sean, could you just briefly the the three it's a three and a half% sir charge on everybody's property
tax bill. Correct. >> Yeah. So it I can send you out like the specific calculation and actually I don't know have you all received your assessor's newsletter? >> No get the assessor's newsletter. >> No >> well
in the next week and and if you don't get it let me know because we've got to talk to some some vendors if if you don't get it. Um, but you should all be getting an assessor's newsletter which actually gives the the calculation to help you understand what the CPA search charge is and how you know how your property um, you know, pays into it. U,
but essentially there's a certain amount of your property that's exempt. I think it's like 100,000 or so of the property sort of um, the first 100,000 it's not applied to and then it's a percentage above that. But I can send the sort of the specific calculation with an example out to um, the committee.
>> Yeah. So, and then as far as other than other than that kind of yearly incremental increase in assessments, um the only other way that that this fund available funds is going to grow is
if we have more properties come on, more new properties that are new are taxed. >> Yeah. more new properties get as new growth happens. Same like so new growth is a very important concept for us on the town side because that increases our
our overall tax levy but that also increases um who pays into CPA as well. So that can also result in um increases to the amount of money the committee has. >> Right? So if we build a thousand new houses, >> there's a significant amount of money
that will come into both the town and the CPA. >> Yep. >> Thank you. And the state match too, Jason, does fluctuate. So that could add or reduce. Yeah,
great questions. Thanks everyone. >> Okay, thank you Sean. Um so my um we have an hour and so my proposal I'll share
with you sort of what we've been doing as a process in the CPA for the last few years and it's um just I'll explain it and see if there are any questions or addendons to it. Um
but the goal would be that tonight we get um sort of a first and second step done in our deliberations. And the first step is to simply get a sense of how all of you feel about each of the proposals.
And the idea is to do this straw pole ranking live having it up on the screen and we go through sort of a roll call process in which you just share your ranking one through five for each proposal.
We're going to discuss each proposal eventually, but this is an opportunity to put a ranking up just so we can get a sense from this committee. Are we divergent on how we feel about the proposal or are we aligned? Because that helps us prioritize where
we're going to spend our time with conversation and deliberation. If we're highly aligned, we'll talk about those things and and devote a certain amount of time. Um, where we're divergent, we're probably going to have to spend more
time deliberating. So it's really just to get a sense of how we can prioritize for the the start of the you know each of the proposal discussions. So um based on a past practice it's like Leah will
enter each of the rankings as we go through. I'll just call in each person kind of in an order. we'll go in the order that's there and then we might go backwards in the order just so that um sometimes you get swayed just by by the way the group is um ranking so we want
to mix things up a little bit and if you're so compelled that you want to say the reason I'm putting a one when all of you seem to be putting a five is in some one sentence if you feel compelled to share that at this point you're welcome to do that but know that we're going to
discuss each proposal and you could have a chance to explain where you sit on that particular proposal and why you ranked it a certain way. Um, and then if we can get through that, it takes a little time, but it's worth it. Then the
second step is to kind of as a committee agree on do we want to start with those we're divergent on or do we want to start with those that were aligned on, discuss those proposals? And the way it's sort of clunky, but usually in the midst of the
discussion of a proposal, someone will say, well, you know, and I think this should be bonded or I think we should do instead of funding it at the requested amount of 100, I really think because we have so many proposals, they could do it at 80. And somebody will put an sort of
a proposed number out there. And that's when the kind of numbers start taking shape. But that comes after we've decided on how we're going to start our conversations, our deliberations, and then we'll we'll just we might be able to begin tonight a few of them. Um I
hope so. But um the goal ultimately is to get through all of these proposal discussions and giving each one their due and try to get input from the town as well. you know, based on where we're
where we're sort of leaning, what are some priorities um and some ways of funding things that we would like to fund. And then next week, if we're lucky, we might be able to get through and do some
voting at the end of next week. But I'm a realist and I think it could be since we're at 706 that we might have to have a third meeting. I don't know. I don't want to do that. But let's see how
we go. Um, we I'd like to have that conversation at the end of the meeting today to see where everybody stands on that and where we end up. Robin, you've been patient. Jump in. I just uh wanted to do a little uh
housekeeping because I am going to be recusing myself from discussion and voting around uh both the two projects that are this the Jones library project and the Civil War tablets project as they're related to the Jones Library
which is business still with uh MHC. So um just so everybody knows I won't be joining those discussions. I did not get a chance to reforward but we have I can represent representations from the historical commission for the other
projects and there is an email from um Walker our liaison to Leah that I can share which just talks about the recommendations for the two other projects. So, I just want >> I think that's that's in the comments for the Jones Library, too, if people
want to refer to that. And the reason Robin's recusing >> is because she's an employee of >> of >> the MHC. Yeah. >> Yeah. So, >> so not Yeah. Just to be clear why that is um in any conflict any appearance of
a conflict of interest. >> Thank you. >> Yep. Thank you. Um, so in regard to that process I'm proposing, are there any questions on it? Any amendments to it?
We're good. Folks have their rankings ready to go. I mean, it's almost as good as March Madness putting my bracket together, but almost. It's almost. Um, okay. So, Leah, are you I've lost you. There you are.
Okay. We've got um this magical straw pull that I'm not going to be able to read, but that's okay as long as Leah can read it. >> Can you see it? Okay. >> Um yeah,
so as you can see, just to orient folks, there's the proposals. Um I know this was sent out to you in preparation. Um it's who who's applied um what aspect of CPA, you know, community housing,
historic preservation, openhouse recreation, and then um we're going to have the straw poll ranking right there where you see next to the just to the right of the yellow column. And then we'll be recording our votes at the very end in the next chunk there, further to
the right. So, I think Leah, is it um Oops, don't go too. Yeah, there you go. Would it be if we talk about um proposal number one
and then I just roll call um the folks and you put the rankings in. >> Sure. Unless everyone un Yeah. Either way. Unless one person wants to just do all of the rankings at once. It's up to you, Angus. >> Um, has a question.
>> Let's let's do it proposal by proposal. And if if people I we don't need me to call on you. I I don't think we need to go through that formality. So, I think can everyone see where you are, you know, Jo Jonas is first, then Jason, then Robin, like go
that way and just just you tell your ranking for each proposal. I don't Is that okay? Instead of me calling on you. I just think that takes more time. >> Yeah. >> Are people good with that? I heard Bob say yes. >> Katie, can I ask a clarifying question?
>> Of course, Angus. Yes. >> So, are we were we only giving a rating of one to five? >> Yeah. >> For five projects like uh was the the the point to give a high
rating like one sorry was every were we supposed to rate every single project on a one to five scale? Five being the highest, one being the lowest. >> It's not a ranking of our top priority is five, our lowest priority is >> You got it. It's >> okay. >> It's not a ranking of the projects
>> um against each other or in order or something like that. It's really a one being I don't want to fund this at all. There's no good. Yeah. And five is like I really really would like to fund this. Um, and four could be I really want to, you
know, I think it's really to me it's kind of very definitive. One and five and the threes and fours are, you know, somewhat positive with some reservation. Okay. Oh, Mark, you have a question. Mark, you're muted. Muted. Yeah. Let's
see. I wonder you could you can we use the chat? We don't have a chat. >> Oh, I think you're unmuted, Mark. >> No, no, we can't hear you. Um, I can't see my full screen with my >> There there isn't a Oh, yes.
>> No, Mark. >> Okay. Is that better? >> Yes, we can hear you. We heard you for a second. You were there. >> It's like a cliffhanger. >> Same suggestion about maybe turning off
the video. We would get a better audio. >> Oh, yeah. >> You could turn your video off, Mark, and then maybe we can hear you. >> There. Is that better? >> Yes. >> Yeah. >> Yes. Okay. All right. apparently have to
buy a better computer. Um, I'm just going to abstain from all the votes. I just want to tell you ahead of time because I don't know enough information. So, rather than me getting in the way, just put me as a zero for now and I'll catch up as we go along. >> Got it. Okay. Thanks, Mark. And we'll
Leah, we'll just leave it blank. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> All right. So, if everybody can see where you are in the order, we'll start with
ranking the AMD Street redevelopment project, a request of $450,000. And we'll start with Jonas. >> Uh, that is a five for me, >> Jason.
Five for me. >> Four. >> Five. >> Five. >> Two. >> Two for me. >> Uh five. So, the next project uh proposal number
two >> is the Ammeris Municipal Housing Trust request >> um for 575. I'm so bad. I'm like really squinting, Leah, so correct me if I don't get this. 575. That's okay. >> Um and we'll start with Jonas and go
down that way. Uh, four, three, >> four, >> four, >> four, >> four, >> four,
more. So, the the next project is um the history of the Mill River. Um this is the recreation request for signs. >> Sorry.
>> No, go ahead. Yes, go for it, Jonas. >> Yeah. Four. >> 3. >> 1 3 3. >> So the next Oh, go ahead. No, no. I I
don't I can't thank you enough for I'm I'm moving my head back and forth. So, and between two screens, so I apologize. >> Well, you're the last person to respond, so I I can look ahead. So, it's that I'm ready and you're >> This is the Mill River, right? The
completion of the history. Yeah. Yeah. >> Uh so four >> three >> three four >> 2
3 4. Next the All-Wheel Skate Park. Five. Five.
>> Four. >> Three. >> One. >> Two. A. Four. >> Five. >> And the slate roof.
One. >> One. >> Four. >> Four. >> 2 3
5 3. Next is the restoration and preservation of the Jones Library. >> Two. >> This is Yeah, this is Sorry. No, I just want to I'm squinting again.
>> This is not the Civil War tablets. This Yes, this is the um from the Jones Library, Inc. proposal for 1.2 million. Okay, go ahead, Jonas. Two. One. >> Abstain.
>> Four. >> One. >> Four. Two. >> Four. >> Now the part time planning and housing
coordinator. Five. >> Three. >> Four. >> Four. >> Three. >> Five.
>> Five. >> Four. And just like many of you, I'm sure some of these ratings will be able to share sort of that it's proposal related to merits and or to the amounts or you know
the limitations. So I understand that we'll have more detail coming. All right. War memorial bath house. Five. Three.
>> Four. >> Five. >> Five. >> Five. >> Four. >> Five. >> Next
is um recreation conservation area signs. Four. One. >> Three. >> Four. >> Two.
>> Five. >> Five. >> Four. Civil War tablets. Five. Five. >> Recuse.
>> Five. >> Four. Five. Five. Five. Looks like some alignment. Okay. um restoration in at the north and south
cemeteries. >> Three, >> two, >> four, >> three, >> two, three,
four, >> four. and the restoration of the Simeon Strong House. >> Four, five, >> five,
>> five, >> four, >> five, one, four. Um, Goodwin Church restoration. >> One,
>> two, >> four. >> I want it to be five, but I'm giving it a three. >> One, >> three, four,
four. Open space improvements application by the town of Ammerst. Four. Four. >> Three. >> Four.
>> Three. >> Four. >> Four. >> Five. Sorry. >> Bob, you're five. Okay. I'm four on that. And are we at the last one? Pickle ball. Am I right? >> Yep.
>> All right, let's go. Five. One. Four. >> Four. >> One. Two.
One. >> And I have um four. Okay. Well, as you could see in real time, we can um look at the, you know, sort of where we are in terms of the average
and sort of the outliers. You can see with the yellow, you know, the yellow and the light green. Oh, did I hear somebody question? Okay.
So I would say we have alignment in only a couple of a few of these. I I wondered if, you know, in the midst of all this rankings, if we might have if we were being swayed
by the limited dollars, you know, and or if it was all, you know, your ranking was really merit-based or were you swayed and making sort of it was a lower ranking um because you felt like, gee, it's too
much money or we won't be able to afford it or we can't, you know, we can't say yes to everyone. >> Jason, >> uh, my answer is both. The both the merit and the amount of money. >> That's what your ranking entails.
>> Merit and the amount of money and the long-term, >> you know, good to the community that I think it'll bring, >> right? Yes. That in merit. Yeah. That's Yeah, that's the merit and and Um, okay. That's Robin. Go ahead.
>> Yeah. I mean, like I would if I were looking at something as a five but felt like maybe the the number was adjustable, give it a four or >> three if I felt like it could be moved to next year thing.
>> Okay. Well, Jason, one second. I Or go ahead. Go ahead, Jason. >> Sorry. I just wanted to add also my you know Robin made a good point too. It's like >> the urgency of the project also and like the time like >> does this all have to happen right now? Is this something that's absolutely
needed right now or can it potentially be >> Yes. So for example, the slate roof might be a really amazing project and much needed. maybe it's 20 years too late and it's got to get done versus wait a minute one more year in
terms of urgency and sort of understanding that might be helpful just as an example of urgency. Okay. So if we look at this list, does anyone have a recommendation? You know, start we have a lot where there's, you know,
we could start with the, you know, anything that's under a three and talk about that because that's really a divergent or we could start with things that are above three um and just help prioritize our time. It's 7:26. We
can definitely get started on talking about a few of these projects. Um, so does anyone have a particular proposal they'd like to offer? >> Jason, >> I just suggest we start with discussing
the ones that are below three >> because that is seems to be the ones that have the most divergence. >> And I mean, I'll start um with what I think is probably >> Let's Let's look at if you don't mind.
Sorry, Jason. If you don't mind, I want to just see is it possible, Leah, for us to see which ones like maybe I don't think Can you sort a block or I mean I see a number of them.
>> Do you want just the ones under three? >> Yeah. I mean, we could just name them. I guess it's one is the >> Just sort the the U column, could you? Yeah, >> if you have the formula, someone's pretty good at Excel here. >> It's not me.
>> Okay, it's Sean. >> You can also just highlight on the left. >> Highlight. >> That's an easy thing to do. Yes. Thank you. I do it for you. >> A really nerdy comment, Leah. if you can change the scale from green to yellow to
green to red. It'll give us um I mean if you know how to do conditional formatting, but >> No, I don't. >> Okay. >> Sorry. >> That's okay. >> No, this is great. Just highlight the one just so I can sort of get them and then we could talk in this in this
order. Um, and I just want to reserve time, you know, maybe we get through two proposals and then reserve time to talk about, you know, what we might ask the town to um, if we had any questions for them if in
terms of pri asking them to prioritize some things for us and give us some options before next week and then think about whether or not we need to put a third um, 2026 meeting on the calendar as a
hold in case we need it. Okay, that's super helpful. Thank you, Leah. Okay, 1 2 3 4 five that are considered I would say super divergent. I mean, maybe there's a 3.1
in there for the cemeteries. Is that right? Why don't you why don't you highlight the cemeteries, too, and then we'll we'll consider those sort of as our first grouping. Is that good for folks? Oh, I see hands. Robin,
>> I was going to offer to jump in with um the Goodwin Church just because I had some specific something specific to recommend. Um I think the urgency there is really high, which is why I gave it a higher ranking, but obviously there were some issues with the application. Um and
uh I did communicate a little bit with um Walker uh Powell, our leazison at the historical commission meeting because like the Strong House, I think this particular property might benefit from being able to connect with some state
funds. And I I if I'm remembering correctly, Katie, I think when we were dealing with the North Church, we um we delayed discussion about the church uh to a later point when we could gather more information. So that would be my my
suggestion here. I think it's something from the historical commission perspective, historic preservation. It's such an important property and I don't want to let it fall by the wayside because of issues with the application um and communication, but um if there's
a possibility that we could set funds aside um and I would I'm going to be trying to connect and get information to them about connecting with the state on um either emergency funds that are available there or
um the Massachusetts preservation projects fund which would require a match. much. Um, so I don't know if that's helpful to anybody, but I just thought I'd throw that out there. >> Well, Robin, just to better understand that we're not I don't want to necessarily start with Goodwin Church,
but I are what you're saying is that you'd like to propose waiting for that discussion until maybe next week so you could have further information because the emergency funding at the state level would be more appropriate than our
funding at this moment. Yeah, I mean I I think I I just I I have I have some sort of memory of um a year where we were dealing with a project where we we set aside of funds. You know, we said we can't fund this proposal as it stands,
but we want to hold the funds in case we can come up with, you know, we can get the pieces together to come up with money. And that's something I'd like us to consider for this particular project. >> I see. Okay. So when we discuss it, we'll have we that will be a proposal. Just for folks who are new, that is
another option. We can reserve funding. Um as long as folks are given the time frame and it's completed and given to the town council to approve before the end of the fiscal year like this, that can happen in in sort of an outof cycle
option. So >> will there be to us though? I mean, we there was the invitation was out there for them to present to us. >> That's right. >> Presented. So, I'm just wondering why um we have all these other proposals
that have kind of taken up our mind space um to be creating like a special dispensation for >> Well, let's let's Yeah, that's a great question, Jonah. That's a great question. It kind of shows it shows the
urgency and the importance of the project >> by how it gets presented and the thought that goes into the presentation. >> Um, and 16 other presentations have put a lot of thought into the presentation. So, I'm just wondering I think that's a great question. I I I
don't feel like we've started deliberations on on each proposal yet. So I think bring that up when we get to that um that you know so we can have a we can have a discussion on that. I think that's a worthwhile question to
explore. Um >> sorry for jumping the gun Katie. >> No I I I allowed you to uh mo move forward but just I I'm I know Tim you have your hand raised. I'm going to get to you. I'm this is my proposal that we start with those that are yellow
highlighted. Um and and based on I think Jason made the recommendation to start with the ones where were more divergent. We'll get as far as we can with a proposal or two tonight. Um in terms of discussing
each one and then we could sort of get a sense at the end of this meeting like is this working? Do we need to set a time limit? How do we want to prop you know do we want to have another third meeting? Um etc. Now Tim did you have a question or an amendment to that? >> No I mean we can go
through this any way we want. At some point, I think we have to talk about each and every project and >> absolutely. >> Yeah. I am just intrigued where there are some of these where there's a huge divergence. Yeah. >> A bunch of fives and a bunch of ones and twos and I'm just saying, well, wait a
minute. >> Yeah, exactly. So, that's great. >> So, we could talk about that at some other time, but go ahead. Do your your way is fine. No, and that's I hope my way is what you're talking about because my expectation is we talk about each one of these, right?
>> Some will take longer than others, but we don't want, you know, one to take up an hour and a half if we can help it, right? And so >> we'll just have to work together on figuring out the best method. Um but if we start with the industrial history of the Mil River passive recreation
project. Um and whoever would like to speak to their particular rating and um that you know that would be helpful. Maybe Angus could start with the one and
then um Jonas with the four. You know however we want to do it. You can what you know like Ellen's popped her hand up. whoever would like to speak to why they voted in a certain way um and have a discussion about okay do we want to and you're welcome to change your
ranking as you hear other folks um you know reasons for ranking a certain way that is that often happens so you can just say okay now I see or I you know I feel differently I actually want to lower it or I want to raise it so um
we'll start with Mil River and Ellen had her hand up first go for it. >> Okay. Well, thank you. Um I think for me my thinking was there were two separate um requests here and I think that setting up the website and having the
signs is wonderful, but I would rather put my money my money our money um to completing the project first and then I feel like that's more the priority at this point than the passive recreation. So, I voted higher for the the second
one than this first one. >> Great. Thank you, Bob. >> I would like to change my score based upon what Ellen just said. I think that's absolutely the way to go is
complete the project, then give them more money to continue on. >> What would you like to change your ranking to, Bob? Uh, >> I would a solid four. Wait, you were a you were a three before.
>> I was a three. Now I'm up to a four. >> Oh, >> no. I'm sorry. For the completion of the project, a four. And I would like to drop my score for the um ind the
>> history. Yeah. >> Yeah. The the industrial history. I would drop drop that down to two. >> Leah, you got that. And then >> two in completion is a four. Correct. >> Yeah. >> Yeah.
>> I think that's a very good argument, Ellen. >> Thank you, Bob. Robin. >> Yeah. Um, I felt like this project could wait a year basically. >> Great. Thank you, Jonas.
>> Yeah, I can um probably lower mine as well. Um three three is seems about right. And then I have a question after this exercise. Well, two questions. One of them is are we
anticipating that, you know, we're starting with the this this uh this these proposals first. As we go down this list, we're assume there's going to kind of cascade back up where >> Yeah. >> Okay. It's hard to think about them all in >> I know
>> and yet individually. Okay. And >> I think it's it is clunky. Just so you I mean it will it'll start getting clearer because >> um even though we're saying excuse me we're saying we might be saying oh we're changing to you know
this is now going to be clearer that it's maybe less likely to be funded as we start putting dollars in. might somebody might make a proposal that says you know what let's I I'm just making this up like you could go back to this particular project and say actually we
have some money so let's get it started >> go back to the ice cream aisle get the >> Yeah it'll keep kind of going up and down. Yeah. And then how how are we what are what's our deliverable to the town council or um a this five the one to five scale and then
they interpret >> no no we'll have a vote on an actual amount we're recommending >> okay >> for we'll we'll have we we might vote not to fund some of these proposals but for those that we vote together to recommend
funding for we will send that recommendation within amount for each of the proposals we're recommending. >> So, it either be a non non-recommendation or a recommendation with a a dollar amount. >> Yeah, we we Yes, we will >> recommendation and not you know, a
non-endorsement or an endorsement with money. Okay. >> Yeah, we send a full report saying we didn't we voted not to fund these and then we fund we we're voting to recommend these. Great. Um, I actually want to change my vote, Leah, to a two
because of that. Um, I I really love this project. I I think it's um amazing that these residents have, you know, over many years have done some pretty remarkable work um to get this rolling.
And I do think funding the work to get the project over the finish line is a is a priority in a year in which we have limited funds. So Jonas, your hand's still up, but I am assuming you're good. Okay. Um, anyone
else want to make a comment on that? Bob, >> the just a very general comment. Um part of the you know mandate of community preservation funds is to keep the
community preserved and updated. So some of these smaller projects um I see as a priority to get them done because they can get done. >> Yeah.
>> Great. Thank you for that perspective. Okay. if we're ready to move on. And as Jonas said asked, you know, this isn't the end of that conversation, but it's it's, you know, we'll come back to it when we talk about funding dollars and
we'll do we'll come back and forth to these projects, but shall we move on to the slate roof? Great. Okay. Anyone have um explain your ranking or want to give for or
against? Jason, start with you. >> I ranked this as a one because um I feel that it is a project that could have been done any time in the last 20 years and uh we do have and it's asking for you know now 30% of the
available funds. Um but I do think that this is this project is uh I think like a poster child for bonding. It's a longterm. It can be a much more long-term, so it has far less
of effect on future funding. Um, it needs to get done. It was in terrible condition. The roof is horrible. I'm somewhat on the fence of whether it needs to be, frankly, to be honest. I did not even know the roof was red until
this project came in front of us. I've never really looked at it that closely. you know, it's like could it be done in regular slate instead of the red slate? I understand the historic significance and the preservation of it. Um, but but overall for those reasons and
specifically mainly for the fact that I think it would be better to try to bond this project. Um, that's just why I gave it a one. And Jason, just to clarify, you're we can bond it through CPA dollars, but I think what you're saying is for the town to
separately bond and not use CPA. >> No, no. I mean, for for CPA, I think that I think this is an appropriate project to come in front of CPA because it is preservation of a historic building. But CPA, if we bond it, I I'm saying we should bond it. I think if we
move forward with this project, from what I understand, it needs to be it needs to be the full amount. We can't peacemeal this. It should just be the roof done all at once. And if this can be bonded for 30 years or even 20 years,
um that will be better because it will have less of an impact on future CPA dollars. But I don't think we can I don't think we can fund this project as because it needs to be done. You know, they essentially need the million dollars and it needs to be done at once. I don't
think this year I think we either have to bond it or we can't do it. Um because >> I see I see. But you're not against >> you're you're saying I just I'm still not totally clear, but you're saying you're do giving it a one. >> Um
>> but >> I'm giving it a one because I don't think we should spend a million dollars out of the $3 million that we have available. >> But if we wanted to bond it, you
wouldn't. It wouldn't be a one for you. >> Yes. Yeah. Okay. Okay. I I recognize the need for it to be done and I think it needs to be done. >> Okay. >> I don't want to spend a million dollars of the three million that we have available on it. >> And if we were able to bond 500 and use
500 of the current use dollars, would that be >> I would prefer to just bond the whole thing. >> Okay. All right. Thank you. so much, Jonas. >> Oh, yeah. So, I've I've walked around the town since then and like like Angus
or um Jason, I didn't I was not aware of the roof. Um maybe subliminally, subconsciously um and I've noticed um adjacent properties that have part slate, part um shingle. My
assumption there is that uh they faced economic the economic decision and decided to replace slate with shingle. Um I think it's a shame that we weren't presented that option um given told what the costs were. I I assume it's because
the only way this and I I've learned the only way this gets presented to us is through the historic lens. Uh I don't think it um again if if we had red shingles there I don't think um we would
in a year um other than people who were aware of it um and were brought brought to their attention would notice the difference. So that's why I give it a one. >> Okay. Thank you Ellen.
>> Um I respectfully disagree with that. I think um the red uh tile shingles are absolutely integral to the to the building. Um this is a historic structure. It's our town hall. Um it's
should be done the right way and um I I'm not in favor of saving money um for that purpose. It it it I think there's um I I know it's a lot of money, but I also feel um that the town is going to
almost put, you know, they're putting significant money toward this as well. So almost 800,000 or more. Um so it's not just CPA money that's going toward it. Um and I would have given it a five. I think it's it's a very important
project. I just don't think it has the urgency as some of the other projects. Um it's obviously been uh sustaining water damage for many years and um I I hope that one more year won't matter. I
don't think it's in imminent danger of collapsing. So um that's why I gave it a four, but I I absolutely um want to keep the historic integrity of the building. >> Thank you, Ellen. Thank you. Thank >> Yes. Thank you, Angus.
>> Um, yeah, I'll I'll say briefly, I don't have a ton to add. Um, apart from that the town has proposed a lot of projects um and a great deal of of money. Um, so part of a couple of things that I'm thinking about. One is um trying to
ensure that we're not only funding town projects, but actually funding projects from community members as well. Um, so that's that's one thing that's going into my consideration um in rating this pretty lowly. Um, the other thing is uh
I'm I'm worried about the uh going the bonded option for a lot of projects. Um, not just because it's it constrains future CPA committees, but also because we're we're paying interest, which is tax money going to private money
lenders. Um, which is fine. that's how, you know, our our whole financial system is predicated on that. I study school finance, so I'm very aware that that's how how how the world works. However, I would rather not have our tax money go to that if we can avoid it. Um, and so
generally, I think we're going to have to do some bonding because there's just so many projects and some of them are really important capital projects. But, uh, to me, this is one that could wait for next year. um or that the town frankly could pay for itself um if it
wants to. It uh is not routine maintenance in that it's historic preservation, but the roof of the town hall where town government is is also a routine maintenance issue. Um at least to me, and is something that the town should be paying for through other sources. Um so I I would actually lower
mine to a one if that's okay, Leah. But it's a beautiful roof and I hope I do hope it gets preserved. >> I like how your own comments convinced you to do to change your ranking. Thank you, Angus Robin.
>> Okay, so I gave this a four only because first of all, the historical commission does rank this as a high priority project from a um historic perspective. Um, I gave it a four only uh for wiggle room about whether the town uh if we
were pressed for funding, whether it could be pushed into another year or maybe half of it awarded. Um, but as far as the project itself and its urgency, um, I mean, I would give this a 4.5 if I
could. Um the other thing I just wanted to uh point out is that the reason that well one of the reasons that historic preservation exists under CPA is um for this for projects exactly like this
where you have um as Ellen said the the material of the roof is integral to the whole design of the building. It's iconic. It's the center of our town and CPA funding um requires that uh historic preservation projects be aligned with
the secretary of the interior standards and we've talked about that a little bit but one of one of the basic tenants there is that like material is replaced with like so if you have a red slate roof you replace it with a red slate roof that's in alignment with the
standards. There's some flexibility there for technical and economic feasibility, but that would be, as I think I mentioned before, something like uh a red slate um uh um use the word fake
um uh >> vinyl or imitation. Yeah, >> imitation uh slate which is coming into use, but I don't think that that's um that's appropriate at at this juncture. So that's the reason why the town
couldn't even come to us under CPA for a cheaper option. And there is that sense of the burden of of having a building like this is that you do want to have a historic sensitive um repair projects um
so that that the historic integrity goes forward and that creates an extra cost burden for the town. though I feel comfortable with the town coming to CPA for projects like that or for portion or um you know we can talk about that but um that's basically why I ranked it like
I did and I hope that that's clarifying. >> Thank you Robin. I appreciate that. Um it it is just a time check at 7:52. We're getting lots of comments on this. I will happily um extend us a little bit
longer but not too much. Um, so Bob, you're up. >> Uh, water damage is one of my pet peeves. It only makes things more expensive over time and we got a situation where that's going to keep creating a larger bill for this. I'm not
suggesting with my five that we fund this the full million. I think I agree with Jason that it is a poster child for bonding. What level we fund it at, I think is up for debate, but I think we
should debate a smaller amount. At least demonstrate that as a CPA, we want to participate in preservation of the most important building in our town. >> Great. Thank you, Bob. Jason, you have another comment to add?
>> I do. I just want to somewhat piggyback off of what Bob said and and address what Ellen said. Um, I'm sure this could probably wait another year. Uh, but this town seems to have a horrible, horrible track record of not repairing roofs. Uh,
whether it be the middle school, the DPW, and then waiting until it's like, oh, now it's an emergency and if we don't do it now, the whole thing's going to collapse, you know, or there's mold in the building and people are getting sick. Um, and having spent a
little more time in town hall over the last year, there's tubes coming down collecting water and trash cans. It's uh it's really not befitting of I think what we all would want, not just our
town hall, but any building that people use uh in town. And that's why I think um it's I think it should be bonded and I think it should be bonded at full amount and the project should get done as quickly as possible. uh there's already
been significant rot and water damage to not just the roof but the underlying structure and if some of those supports go um then this is an even this is a much much more expensive project and it's
going to get more expensive every single year um barring some sort of miracle. So Jason, are you saying you want to change your ranking? >> Yeah, I get I don't know how I'm using my ranking. I'll put it at a five, but I
want to put it at a five with a caveat that I want to bond the whole thing. >> Yes. Yes. I totally I we'll and we'll get to that. That's super. I think this gives the town a sense of where we are. Um and I too would like to change my
ranking. I would love to give it a 4.5, but I'm going to give it I'm going to give it a five because that's what it was on my ranking and I um I too think it's really important to the town. Um it's a perfect
CPA project. It's needed. I think it's urgent. It could maybe wait one more year, but I'd love to have the town weigh in on that and um would favor bonding as well. Tim, you're up. >> Yes. Uh, I agree with everyone's
comments about the necessities for this. I'm going to change my vote also to a five. However, I'm also going to when we get to the bonding or not, I'm going to propose we pay cash for that, not bond. >> All right. >> And we can talk about why later, but
just FYI, >> you're you're welcome to give your um reasoning now. That gives us a chance to think about it. And >> Okay. Well, the reason is if you if you bond the other very expensive projects like the bath house and maybe the Jones
library, the math works to reach our targets by paying the million dollars right now and not okay. I I I was doing similar math um acrobatics this week. >> That's my reasoning. I am I am very
concerned that we mortgage our future by bonding too many things, >> right? >> You think this would be a good candidate for just paying for it right now. >> And that's my reasoning. >> Tim, did you say so? >> I'm sorry. >> Did you say change it to a five? >> Uh, change it to a five, please.
>> Okay. >> Yeah. >> Okay. Um, thank you, Tim. And any other comments before we just regroup on you know having done two of these you know had the any other comments sorry I don't
want to on slate roof changes to rankings anything >> I think just the um it it's being presented that it has to be a historic and Robin you read some some of the legality of it but I mean there's no leg
there's no law compelling Ammerst no outside entity or agency or body that's compelling Ammeris to do this correct in in historical in a historical preservation approach meaning like for like that's
coming I just want to make sure it's that's coming from us >> and our our opinion of the importance of this roof as a small body by the way representing speaking for thousands of
people in Ammerst that we're we're not using that as a guise to um to just you know make this be a fate a complete that it's got to be historically preserved and it has to be
like to like >> I'm just wondering what the legal entity is that that tell us this has to be a slate roof. >> It's a that's a very good clarifying question and Robin looks like your hand is up. Happy to have you address that or we could
>> Yeah, I don't know. Um I mean the things that would that would force the hand on that would be whether the um whether town hall has a preservation restriction. It it might um because I think there was some mason maybe there was masonry work done in the past with
CPA funding. Um once you do CPA funding usually preservation restriction and the purpose of that is to maintain the historical integrity of the building. Um there are other things that that trigger other aspects of of things, but that's um you know, so it's a possibility that
there might be something in the background there that would cause this to be a project regardless of of where it was funded from that it would still have to align with secretary standards. Um, I just don't know specifically >> if if um
if a if a building is on the you know registry of historic blah blah blah does that what I I don't know my >> that's not um binding. >> Yeah. National register usually doesn't um uh have that impact. There's
>> yes >> yeah there are other issues with whether it's state money or federal money or they get much more complicated but the most straightforward thing in the Jones library um you know has a preservation restriction uh and I'm sure there are other buildings in town that have preservation
restrictions >> so that would funding that said so that's that triggers that for you know depending on the length of the restriction so I just don't know about this particular building but that is possibility >> well that would be a great Jonas you brought up Good question. That's
something that we can ask the town to get back to us on before we do any voting. Great, Tim. >> Yes. Uh, sorry for one more comment. I forgot. Uh, I rate many of these projects based on how many in people in
the town is b are benefited by the project. The town hall is no question benefited by just about every citizen in the project and it therefore think I think should be rated very very highly and you'll notice in other projects I
think the uh uh number of people that are affected based on the CPA funding is far far less and I've rated things lower because of that. So I just raised that so other people can think about that too. >> Yeah. No, thank thanks Tim. And I one of
the things I was going to say about this slate roof, just to add to my reasoning, is this roof is, you know, over hundred years old already. And so that's a pretty good investment. Um, not many things we're investing in, you know,
have that kind of longevity. So that's another part of it, too. Can we Can >> we clarify though? using the using town hall uh is not impinged if it's a shingle roof or a slate roof. >> That's what we're going to ask.
>> And and um people will not fewer people it's not that fewer people will use town hall whether depending on what roof we put on the on the town hall. So it's a use it's vers it's use versus I guess appreciation. Maybe there's a distinction there. But um we're also
looking at down the list of like recreation that's I think more of a direct use, you know, if we don't not going to happen for those people versus I'm not going to stop going to town hall if we don't put a slate roof there.
>> Yeah. No, I I appreciate that. Thank you for adding that in, Jonas. And we'll get some detail on that. And please know everyone that you know this we may not come to a total agreement and consensus on these. We will be voting and there
will be you know a decision made um this is how it goes every year you know that that we won't all agree on um but the majority will rule in the vote. So, um, but that is we do need to get a little bit more information on the preservation restriction and what's legally binding.
And if this entire committee were swayed, um, to what you're saying, Jonas, the town would certainly have the ability to say, well, no, we want it to be red slate. We're going to bond it some other way and fund it some other way, just not through CPA dollars. But we might, you
know, maybe the majority says no, this is what we want and we like it and we want to fund it and you know we don't all agree on that. So we'll see. >> Great to this is yeah this exactly the deliberations we want the discussion. So thank you. Thank you. Thank you Ellen.
>> Yeah I just personally think that we should only consider this um project as proposed as the red slave. Um, they applied for it under historic preservation, but it wouldn't be historic if we replaced that roof with
asphalt shingles. It just I think it it just needs to be considered asis and not could we do it with contemporary asphalt. It's just it it that's not even historic preservation. I mean, that would disqualify the project alto
together in my opinion. >> Yes. And it's not in our purview to change the proposal. So that is for that's you said it a little more eloquently Ellen thank you than what I was saying which is you know >> yeah I mean no that was that was better said it's we do have to vote on the
proposal we we're it's not in our purview to tell the town to you know to do it to do the roof differently in this particular committee we simply say we don't we vote for it or we don't vote for it and that's it. Yeah we don't get
to change the proposal. Thank you. Um, okay. We're at 803. Who knew the slate roof was going to take us that amount of time? But, uh, how are folks feeling about, you know,
next week we have two hours together. We've gone through two of the 16. So, um, some of these may not take as long. We could give ourselves time limits. We
could say that in 120 minutes next week we can get through, you know, >> 10 um and need another meeting to finish up and vote. Um what are people's any
proposals from the committee? Bob, you may have a proposal or >> I have a proposal. I'm going to suggest that we schedule that third meeting. And I know it's painful, but this committee is the most active and intellectually
engaged committee I've been involved with um so far. And I think we're going to have lots of questions and the process is going to be more deliberative especially with the 2:1 ratio of requests. So, I would suggest that we end now, go to next week, see how far we
get, and probably plan to do that third meeting. And I will volunteer to take minutes in that meeting. >> Thank you, Bob. Um, do we have responses to that proposal or Jonas, do you have a different proposal?
>> Oh, no. No. That's a great proposal. I'm just wondering, do we have will there be public comments also next year? >> No. No, we're in we're in deliberations, so we just keep going with that. Yeah, >> that'll help speed. Yeah.
>> Yeah. Yes, exactly. Yeah. Um, how are we could do thumbs up? Well, maybe let's take down the straw poll so I could see you all and we could do a a thumbs up. Thank you. Um, how are folks feeling
about that proposal from Bob has come up with another date beyond next week, as painful as it might be? Okay, I'm seeing a thumbs up and acknowledgement that this is an unusual year with 16 and
the amount of requests, the dollar requests. Um, I would propose that we try to I I'm away the the January 29th. So Jason could um
run that show as vice chair. It wouldn't have me in the you know ability to vote. So I don't love that idea. But um could we come up with an we're on for next week the 22nd um with the 5th of February
and I'm also looking to leave if that's okay. >> Yeah, fine with me. I'm not sure who >> you're you okay >> you are you available
>> I'm available yeah >> I'm fine with it >> okay >> you're suggesting skipping the 29th and moving it to the 5th >> I mean I'm I'm not going to be available be >> okay >> in an airplane so >> think you should have you should be able
to vote >> yes >> I think there Yeah, I agree. >> Thank you. Um, anyone not able to attend on the fifth? >> Robin has her hand up. I don't know if
she >> Oh, sorry, Robin. >> I mean, I I hate to even say this, but um I feel like we've gone longer in past years. Can we do a longer meeting since we have so much to discuss?
a longer meeting next week. >> Remaining meetings that we have, you know, going past 8 is basically what I'm saying. >> I think if we have a I think if we do the 22nd and the 5th, we'll have enough time, but maybe the 22nd if people are
prepared to go a little longer, we could we could extend >> if that seems okay. Tim, >> yeah, I was just going to propose the same thing. I think if we're going to be around on the 22nd, let's stay for 3 hours rather than two and just maybe we
can knock it all off. So, who knows? >> How do people feel about that? >> I'm in agreement with that. Concom meetings go till 10 o'clock at night. So, >> meetings, >> this is great. >> I'm not a big fan. So, that's what you
could tell where where my my uh bias is. But yeah, I think that's if the if the majority of the group is willing, then I'm I'm absolutely happy to do that. And I think Tim, your idea is a good one, which is let's plan for two and a half to three hours
next week and maybe it's a short meeting the next one or maybe we don't have to have it. Okay, I'm seeing head nodding. And Dave, you have a hand up. Yeah, I know you're trying to to to end the meeting, Katie, but one question I think
for staff that would be helpful is we're kind of at that point, well, actually, we're not at that point where in previous years, for many years, the CPA has said to staff, and Sean alluded to it earlier in this meeting, okay, here's
here's where we are in our ranking. town staff, can you propose some alternatives as to how to fund what we how our rankings have turned out? So, even tonight, your rankings have changed pretty dramatically from start to finish
this meeting and we only got through a couple of proposals. So, all I'm saying is I'm not exactly sure where that point is. I I had envisioned having the or thought you might say, "Let's have the next meeting." Yes. try to wrap up as many of those proposals or those
rankings as possible and give staff some direction to come back to you to say, "How can we fund this?" I heard many voices tonight saying, "Okay, some of these larger projects, try to bond them." But you still have a lot to discuss here. So, I'm just kind of
putting the question out to you as chair to think about that. When when is that point when staff can come in and say, "Okay, committee, we think we can get you to where you want to your recommendations. Here's the a proposal or two."
>> I think that's a great question, Dave. And I my uh recommendation is that um you don't have enough information yet. So, so I think waiting until, you know, maybe I'll amend, you know, Tim's, you know,
add on to Tim's proposal, which is we go a little longer to get through all of our proposals next week >> gives the town a chance to come back to us because it will be very clear, I think, at that point, even if we get
through 90% or 99% that um we're going to need some help prioritizing because we just don't have enough money for them all that but we know which ones we are ranking highly. So that would be then helpful for us to come back and deliberate on the dollar amounts the
methodology debt not debt um in on the February 5th meeting to vote on it. >> Okay. The other last little point I'll make is that in that period I think that's a great idea. So we'll get a good sense after next week's meeting. We'll put pen to paper and and and look at
some spreadsheets and some numbers. In previous years, the committee has also put out there to some applicants, can they can they can they do a project for less? Can they take less than they've asked for? So, that's also that per that
point next week where you might say town staff, you know, is there a way for any of these applicants to do do a project for less? >> So, I'll just put that out there. That's historically been part of our process.
>> Yeah. And we we did ask that in most presentations. So I do know I have notes on a few of them. I I have to go back and look of like what they said about can't go forward at all versus well we would just do less >> and that goes for town projects as well as non-town projects. So
>> yeah. So that would be I'm sure we we would want to know that and at the end of next week's meeting we'll we'll I think we will ask you that. Sounds good. Thank you. >> Yeah. Yep. Thank you, Dave. Ellen, >> yeah, that was my question. You keep
mentioning town staff having a chance to respond, but we have to give all applicants a chance to respond, right? Not just town applicants >> in terms of responding to >> coming back with if they can do it for
less money or what? Maybe I'm misunderstanding. So maybe that was directed toward me Owen. So part of the town role the town every pro project that comes through CPAC works with a town staff member. So part of our
role in the past has also been if the committee says boy could project X or project Y uh proceed with fewer dollars. um we often have the liaison to that project in historic preservation or recreation or whatever it might be reach
out to that applicant and ask and have that discussion. >> I see. >> So we I just offer that as part of that process between your next meeting and the February 5th meeting. >> Okay. Thank you. Thank you. >> Yeah. And I I think if if we have some
of that information based on the presentations that we have good notes on, then we don't have to get this town staff to do that. But we might need a lot of it. Who knows? Um thank you, Ellen, for asking that.
Okay. Well, it sounds like we are um in agreement to proceed next week with a longer meeting, try to get through all of the rest of the proposals best we can, the majority of them. Um get some input from staff on
prioritization and methodology of potential funding before the February 5th meeting. Um at which time we'll either finish discussion and or discuss um dollar
amounts and vote. Okay, great. Um okay, so I think um we've got our plan. I don't have any topics that I did not reasonably anticipate 408 hours before
the meeting. So I think we can entertain a motion to adjurnn. >> So moved. I second. >> Yes. >> All in favor? >> I >> All right. I am so grateful to all of
you. Thank you for taking all the time um to be prepared and to have such great questions and good discussion. And Mark, thanks for joining us. Appreciate your you're intrepid and you're you know joining us at this stage. So thank you very much
and see you all next week. Okay, >> thanks everybody.