Awesome. Thank you. Excellent. Thank you very much. Um well, I'll call the meeting to order on uh December 4th at 6:03 p.m. Welcome everyone. Thank you so much for being here. Um we'll start with some
just a few brief announcements and then go to approving minutes. Since we do have a quorum, we'll get rolling. Um, first order of business and announcements is um to ask for a note a
minute taker for this evening's session. If somebody's willing to volunteer and not be volunttoled, that would be great. >> I could do it. >> Oh, great, Ellen. Thanks so much. I appreciate it.
I had this thought of just assigning um dates to everyone. I was I was like it depends on people's lives and you know what you can get done and just know that it doesn't have to be done for next week. Um Robin's minutes were in this week's packet. Bob's arrived this week
so they'll be in next week's packet. Just, you know, we'll just keep them moving along. But um yeah, Jonas, >> are we okay with taking the transcript which is actually generating right now and using well AI basically
>> to crunch it? >> I've found good luck with that. Um usually have to look at the results and then make sure it didn't gloss over stuff. But I think that just helps Ellen not have to be typing constantly. >> Definitely. Yeah, definitely not. And
and really this the minutes summary is the most important thing is who's who's attending and what votes were taken and who voted for what things just to have that in written. I mean we have the video as documentation but
um >> how do I see the um transcript >> Leah uh >> under show captions >> um >> um at the bottom. Yeah. >> Oh, no. I'm tell you can see I can see it already. So, under clo under show
captions, there's a little CC button. >> Okay. >> Click click that carrot and then it should pop up on the right side. >> Nice. Okay. There's a way to >> Yeah, >> there's a little option to save transcript at the end. >> Thank you. >> Okay. >> And you'll get you'll get um Yeah,
you'll get a >> I'll email you the link with the recording tomorrow. >> I see it now. Yeah. Thank you. >> No problem. Thank you for um volunteering. I appreciate that. Um, >> so,
um, I just wanted to circle back on a couple of things that I said I would get back to you all on at our last meeting. And, uh, one was the question about, um, I went to the CPA, um, charter and the town council. There was
a question about can the town council increase, change, uh, do anything to what our recommendations are and they can accept them. they can reject them and they can reduce them. So that's what Robin had mentioned. I just wanted to verify that those are the confirmed
options. They cannot um increase any recommendations that we make. Um there was also a question around um open space and recreation can be combined together to meet the 10. So 10%
of what we um deploy from any one year needs to go to those two areas in a com in a combination whereas community housing and historic preservation each have to at least meet 10% or more so that there was some
uncertainty around that. Does that make sense to everybody? >> So of the funds we approve at least 10% goes in the bucket of historic preservation and what was what was it? um >> community housing. >> Okay. >> Yeah, those two pieces. >> Whereas it doesn't it doesn't have to be
10% for recreation and 10% for open space. Those two can be combined to meet that 10% threshold or you know minimum. That make sense? >> Um okay, great. And that
percentage does include um Yeah. Okay. So that that's that was one thing. And then there was this question about you know uh the t you know these are distribute we have the ability to make
recommendations on how to use revenue that comes into town through the CPA search charge right so these are town dollars these are not some other type of dollars they're town dollars that are um generated through taxes
um and so there are some questions out in the community and we've had some commentary come to us from members of the community around whether or not one of our projects, the Jones Library project, um can be
recommended by us and approved by the um town council um if they had made a commitment earlier not to increase any additional funds. that question we haven't um Dave and I have not yet
pursued together um to to sort of get any um definitive response yet. Um so and that we may not have that because we may just want to make a recommendation and have the town council make that decision since that is their decision to
to make. Um but I did promise that I would circle back to Dave on that and we haven't had a chance to connect because of the holiday. Um, okay. So, those were my those were my pieces. I'm just going to do one quick reminder that we have a lot of um
presentations tonight and we went I allowed um us Oh, Angus is here. Great. Welcome. >> Thanks. Um, I was just doing a couple of uh quick We're in the announcement period here
and circling back on a few things and um we went a little over time last time so we're going to try to keep to getting us, you know, in our two-hour window if possible tonight. So, we've got the proposals from folks for tonight. We have submitted questions to them. They
responded to those questions. So, if it's at all possible just to ask your clarifying questions, you know, that weren't asked yet in any of those processes, um, so that we can keep to our 20 minutes for each proposal. I think that would be super helpful. Um,
even though it's going to be hard. Um, I know I I couldn't keep us on time when we had those drone footage of the town roof. I was so enthralled last time. So, you can all keep me honest, but I'm going to try to keep us to 20 minutes. And I'll remind the presenters to that fact as well.
Okay. So, moving on. We should approve the minutes um that were in the packet from um our first meeting that Robin submitted. Do I have a motion to approve those minutes?
>> Uh so moved. Any discussion, changes, questions about them? >> Do I have a second? >> I have a second. >> Who is that? Is that Jason? I couldn't. >> That was Tim. >> Tim. Great.
>> Thank you. And Jason thirded. Okay. Uh >> and so all those in favor, we'll just um we'll go do a roll call vote. Um all those in favor of approving the minutes as presented. Um, yay or nay. Tim,
>> yay. >> Bob, >> yay. >> Jonas, >> yay. >> Ellen, >> yay. >> Jason, >> yay. >> Angus. >> Yay.
>> And I will also add to the affirmative. Yay. So, we will um approve those minutes as presented. Thank you, Robin, who um did those for us. Okay, it's time for public comment.
Um so I don't Let's see. Does anybody know we have some folks? Looks like we have a couple of um attendees and it looks like Maria has her hand up. So, if you're in if you're joining us and have a public comment to make, you can raise your hand as Maria
has done and we'll bring you in. >> Hi there, Maria Kapiki. >> Hi, Maria Kapiki. South Ammerst. So, I'm hoping that you guys can uh help me with locating um materials in the packet. Um, I know
that your web page is a little bit different from others, but I have been searching the 2025 folder and I can't find any um documents, but perhaps I'm just looking in the wrong place. So, the last
one I see is from June of 2025. So, I don't have any of your fall meetings and and uh information. So could you guys maybe give I know you don't usually answer questions but this is sort of a technical question if you wouldn't mind. >> I can answer that if you want.
>> Yes. Thank you Leah. >> I've been h we got the um meeting on the calendar and the agendas have been uploaded and I've been having trouble getting the link to the packets to work. Um there have been several people that have contacted me though and I am happy to send them out by email until I can
get those posted. Um because I do have we have everything that has been given out in meeting packets and shown in during the meetings. So if there's anything like you can email me directly. Maria, this is Leah. Sorry. >> Leah,
>> can you can you say again what is current? We have the proposals are there. I thought >> all of the proposals are there. Yeah. >> Um the meetings have been posted and the agendas are there. >> There is another link where you can put the meeting packets. >> Right. Right. Okay. Um, and for some
reason I can't get in it to post anything in that. >> Okay. >> Um, but all the presenta all the proposals are definitely on the CPA page. >> Right. I've I've accessed them there. So >> under 2027 though, correct?
>> It's 20. Yeah, it's for 27. So >> fiscal year 27. >> I wanted to make sure she wasn't looking at 2025. >> Well, the I'm looking for the packets for 2025. I I understand that it's fiscal year and that's and I I'm able to I I can find the
>> applications, but I'm looking for any other material, your questions, the the the financial information that was presented, all you know, everything that you do in >> Yeah, thank you. No problem. And just for the record, we
Leah offered to send this to anyone who sends her an email, but we'll get that link solved or create a new link so that we can get those um publicly available. Great. Thanks, Maria. Appreciate your
comment, >> your question. >> Okay. Do we have another any other uh public comment? Um I know there are folks in attendance uh who may wish to make a public comment. They're welcome to do
that now. You just raise your hand and you'll be >> invited. Otherwise, you may be just attending listening in which is great. Okay. Well, I don't see another hand raised. Um,
is there any other way for someone if they can't figure out how to raise their hand if they can just come off mute or Leah? I don't know >> um >> how it works. If you're an attendee, >> I can allow somebody to talk there. I think one is a presenter. >> Yeah. >> Um there's one on Denise's phone. I can
allow it to talk just for a moment, I guess, if you want to see >> Denise. Okay, this I think some people attend and that's great. So we can um close the public comment section of the
meeting. And do we have our is that the first presenter for is Linda the first presenter or >> um I believe it might be Sam G. >> Aaron. Oh. Oh Sam. There's Sam. Okay,
great. I didn't see it pop up there. Okay. Well, so Sam, I don't know if you heard me say before that we're trying to keep to our 20 minutes and so if you could keep to five to seven minutes if if that and then we'll have chance for questions would be awesome.
>> Yeah. >> Yeah. Thank you. I'm gonna Leah, it works for me to share my screen or >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> Let me pull it up. Well, thank you all for serving on this committee um and yeah, inviting me to present tonight. I know I did respond to
some of the questions that the committee developed um or asked of me for some clarifying questions, but I'll go through the presentation and then happy to answer question additional questions. Um so this is the request for signage or funding for signage for recreation and
conservation areas. We requested funding last year and we are looking for funding again this year to help us continue this initiative. Um so we've requested $100,000. The purpose is to support fabrication of signs and kiosks at all recreation and conservation areas as
well as cemeteries actually. Um and really the goal is to have updated signage. Um that will be bring awareness about the townland. Um ensure accessibility of the information on signage. um have branding and consistency um and
really just yeah help identify what is town owned land, especially all of our conservation areas in town. Um the signage will include welcome signs, trail markers, trail maps, kiosk signs, and some wayfinding signs. Um hoping to cover all of our 2400 acres of
conservation land. Um over 10 recreation areas and parks and our three town owned cemeteries. Um, I know I mentioned this is our second um, request for this initiative. So, where we're at now, we have completed the designs for all of the welcome signs for all of these
areas. Our contracted designer uh, this just this week sent out to get quotes for fabrication and installation and expected to hopefully be able to install those in spring summer 2026. And then kiosk and map designs are ongoing since we have to make a map for every single
uh, conservation area that we have a trail. Um, but we're hoping that those will be completed in the spring with installation in the summer. And then my next few slides are mostly just kind of photos of our current signage, um, which is like old or crumbling or for some areas
non-existent. There's lack of consistency, which causes confusion. Doesn't meet ADA requirements. Our new signage will, like I mentioned, have consistent style and branding, similar to what we did recently in downtown. Really just to add a level of
credibility and professionalism to the town signage. Um, there will be welcome signs, trail markers, wayfinding, as I mentioned. Um, and it will help identify town land resources, and which areas have parking or ADA accessible trails, which we're trying to do more of in
town. And then the big thing that's taking more time is kiosks. Um, so buying the actual kiosk as well as developing these um, trail maps with rules and regulations and contact information. Um, a big thing with this that we've gotten feedback from recently
over the summer with our public safety departments is since we don't have rules and regulations posted at a lot of our areas, they don't have a way to enforce some of the rules and regulations that exist. Um, so we're hoping that this is one of the things it will address. Um,
and so this is an example of one of the kiosk uh signs that we'll have um including some more information, but this is what fit to the screen. And so just to go through quickly some designs in progress. Like I mentioned, all the designs for these welcome area
signs are complete. So this is an example of one for Grath Park. It's uh modeled after the one at Kendrick Park. So, it'll be the same exact style and coloring and everything for all of our conserv or all of our recreation areas. Um, this is for conservation areas. So,
we have these kind of what we've been calling like post and panel like hanging uh wood signs or wood panel wood posts with hanging uh signs to identify all the conservation areas in town, including those with parking with ADA
accessible trails or just ones that maybe don't have a trail, but we want to let people know that this is conservation land. And then also some just basic signs identifying uh hiking um or trails since there are a lot of kind of areas to go onto trails off of
roadways but don't necessarily necessitate a full sign or they don't have parking. And then as I mentioned the cemeteries too, they'll be the same style as the recreation areas. Kind of that monumental um signage to really identify
those areas and bring consistency. Um to the right is actually a signage that the planning department recently did for West Cemetery. Um which they've already kind of completed and fabricated, but again it's going to help match the branding that we're working towards um
for all town signage. And then estimated budget. This is really estimated since we're still waiting for quotes for some things. Um I won't go through every specific number, but I can end up pausing on this slide um because you might have more questions about it that I can reshare. But we're
looking at for conservation areas, we'll be needing um 62 of those like post and panel signs to cover all of the conservation areas in town. Um also 20 kiosk that we'll be needing to buy new since many areas don't have a kiosk at the moment. Um an installation for those
items. Recreation areas, we'll be needing eight welcome signs. Um those big monumental ones with granite. We'll need some additional kiosks to share more about what exists at those recreation areas. And then cemeteries, it's the three welcome signs and installation. So the estimated total,
not even including the installation costs right now, is uh over $200,000. Um again, we have 100,000 from last year and we're requesting an additional 100,000 to help us continue to do this work for the fabrication and installation. And I think yeah, that's
my last slide. So, tried to keep it quick for you, but yeah, happy to um I can stop share for now and then answer questions and bring it back up if I need to. >> Great, Sam. Thank you so much. I appreciate that and I appreciate that you added in the budgeting piece a
little more detail for us. So, thank you. >> Okay. Um, as is our practice. Anyone have questions for Sam? Okay, we'll start with Jonas. >> Uh, yeah. Hi, Sam. Thanks for the presentation. Um they look they're
beautiful. I think they're beautiful signs. And I'm wondering um the the granite posts um so my first question I think you answered it was the posts are included in the cost and I imagine is that a big a fairly large portion of the costs. >> So we're still yeah we're working on
getting quotes. we did hear from our designer today who's contracted to also get those quotes that um one of the vendors offered to do um I forget what he called it but like it is like looks like granite but it's not necessarily granite so we're getting both options so that way we can yeah take budget into
account there >> thank you Angus >> yeah thank you um I I guess my question is about the the funding piece so you the budget that you just shared us is for $24,000, but that doesn't include
any of the installation costs. Um, so you was the um CPA grant last year for 100,000. >> Correct. >> Okay. And so then if we if we gave the full 100,000 this year, that would cover fabrication, but it would not cover installation.
That's what we're not sure about quite yet because we're actually need to see if um that's something that we would need from the vendors that were are fabricating or if it's something that maybe our conservation or DPW staff might be able to assist with. Um but
yeah, so we're still kind of looking at some of the where else we might get some funding beyond the funding that we've received and hopefully will receive from CPA. >> Okay. So, so odds are you're going to need some kind of additional source of funding, but you won't be coming back to
the CPA for that. that I don't know if yeah if Dave has an addition but I think the hope is um that we'll be able to do a lot of it with the funding that we have and we'll hopefully receive um this year but looks like Dave might have a >> Well, I was just going to say there's no guarantee
and there's no limit for not coming back you know so they folks can yeah can keep coming back depending it doesn't mean that we can or will continue to fund but it is up to >> and it wouldn't and it likely wouldn't need to be another hundred thousand, you
know. So, >> yeah. And I imagine Sam, you I was my question um was around sort of phasing like I I wasn't sure but I didn't get the sense or maybe you were going to fabricate them all at one time for a cost savings and then you know the
installation could happen in a phased way. >> Yeah, I think that's the idea. >> Couldn't happen. >> Yeah, we were waiting till we got all of the designs finalized. that way we can look to do a bulk fabrication. Um, plus that helps with some of the design details too, keeping consistency with
colors and whatnot. Um, but yeah, so we're definitely doing things to try to make it more affordable. And then also we'll figure out what the installation looks like after um, the fabrication phase. >> Okay, David, you had a comment. Oh, lost you.
>> I think Sam's covered most of it. um Angus's question about um >> yeah about um kind of installation. I think you know historically different departments have stepped up in that regard. We can't commit anything today
but you know in all likelihood I think DPW and and conservation staff would would hopefully team up on some of this. The other option is, you know, to come back in a future year for some of this and as Sam said, and phase it. Um, but
we'd like to we'd like to kind of do this as much as we can across the town all in one fell swoop if we can. And Sam mentioned something really important, which is color consistency. If you do different runs of signs, you're never going to get the exact uh color match.
So, um, that's all. >> Thank you. Other questions for Sam? Yes, Jonas. Go ahead. >> Wondering there's another proposal to um do some work on like large hill for
instance and um on the paths >> as an example is one one of the areas. Um would it make any sense to have those installations kind of happen in in tandem with or would that get a little messy? Um
>> in tandem with the >> with some of the work I mean people >> the bridges and those signs be placed near >> the trail work and >> a lot of the trail work that's happening anyway. So >> yeah, there's definitely a potential of um with the vendor that we or the
contractor we'd end up using for um some of the trail work could we could potentially loop in the installation. I think it will really depend on timing and kind of what the scope of those contractors are, but I'm sure that's something Dave and I'm assuming Erin um is the one who has that request could
kind of coordinate if it makes sense to do. Yeah, I think large hill is mentioned as one of a number of different areas that need attention in that second proposal that Aaron Jock is going to talk about.
So, um that might be one of the priorities, but there's probably five or six others that Aaron is going to talk about. >> Okay, great. Seeing no other hands raised, I just thank you so much, Sam, for being here tonight and for your presentation and
this good work. >> Yeah, thank you all so much for the time and for all that you're doing and good luck with the rest of the presentations tonight. >> Thank you. Thanks so much. All right, so um I think Erin is here. Did I see her?
Yeah. Okay, great. Yeah, we'll invite her in. Hi, Erin. Welcome. >> Hello. Can you hear me? >> It's a little low, but yep, I can hear you. >> Okay. Can you hear me better now? >> Yes. So, good.
>> All right. So, my headset isn't working for sound, but it's working with the mic, so I'm going to stick with that. Um, I can't see myself. I don't know if that um >> you you have a photo up, so we see a photo of you. >> That's weird. Okay. All right. I guess I can't see myself, but um uh Okay. Well,
uh my name's Aaron Jock. I'm the conservation agent for the town of Ammerst. I don't know why you can't see me, but that's unfortunate. Um so, I'm going to be um Is it okay for me to share my screen or >> Yes, that would be great. Yeah, I just have been saying to um presenters that,
you know, we're we're trying to keep to our 20 minutes with with questions. So, I know you'll you've done this routine before. So, um, just go for it. Even though we can't see you, which is unfortunate, but >> yeah, I mean, it's almost like I'm not a panelist. I'm a speaker or something. I
I don't even look like I have the opportunity to share my screen. Um >> Oh, >> not seeing that. Ah, there we go. >> Got it. >> There we go. That's a little better. >> Thank you.
>> There we go. Okay. >> Okay. Now we see you. Okay. Excellent. >> Thank you. >> Thank you so much. >> Real time. >> Okay. So, let me try to do a screen share. >> Okay. All right.
Um just fix my display settings. Okay. Um so, uh I'm here tonight to talk about our request for $100,000 for passive recreational improvements on cons conservation lands. specifically on trail and foot bridge improvements. Um
we would hope to um break the funds up a little bit this year so that um approximately 25,000 of the funds are used for some summer staffing to help support our two full-time um uh land
managers. and that 75,000 would be used for sort of more brick andmortar um on the ground um materials and and construction. Um, part of the reason for this is because of um funding cuts for our seasonal staff and uh the the great
amount of land that we manage and there's there's quite a bit of um infrastructure on these properties that requires um to be kept up and uh our budgets don't always keep up with the demand for repairs and and improvements
and replacements. Um, so the just to back up a little bit, the the 25K would go towards potentially some summer staff uh to help assist our two full-time people, but the 75K would
go toward our goals of improving conservation land. And primarily those goals are, you know, for passive recreational use, really for accessible use, multi-use purposes. um making sure that the trails
are safer, more accessible, correcting historic problems on the properties, and um adding structures where appropriate to make trails safer. And we do all kinds of work in our department to try to apply for grants, matching funding,
fostering relationships um to get projects off the ground. All of the money doesn't come from CPA um all the time. We try to partner to leverage the funds as much as possible. But some of the things we have to do in advance of
construction, our site survey, wetland delineation, design and permitting um and the you know building and construction materials are are a piece of that as well as uh in kind matches with staff time and the wetland
permitting and construction and labor that goes into this. So primarily the CPA funding goes towards brick and mortar to actually pay for the construction to take place. So we have a number of projects that are in the queue for 2026. Um I provided a
number of those to you in um the application, but uh here's another list and I'm going to try to run through some of these to show you examples. Um so Larch Hill is one that's at the top of my list personally. um one of my favorite conservation areas in the town
of Emerson. There's a pretty extensive almost I want to say almost 350 foot long boardwalk at um Large Hill which is handicap accessible or was handicap accessible at one point in time. Um it's it's really really degraded. Um this is
going to be a major project. Just this project alone for construction is going to be over $100,000. So, we have to do a ton of work in advance of um survey, design, permitting just to get to that step. But once we get through that, then
we've got to figure out where the funding is going to come from to pay for these um you know, for the basically for the replacement. And this this boardwalk we've has been maintained for decades. Um and it's really reached a point where it's kind of passed its lifespan. But,
you know, if you walk around um at Larch Hill, you'll see that there's other infrastructure on the property that also needs needs upkeep. Um, Wentworth Farm is a great example. Um, on the left you can see an old vehicle bridge that's that's
deteriorating. There's also the the what's sometimes referred to as the jump bridge, the two photos on the right, which is also in pretty rough shape. And then the photo in the center with the red circle, this is the National Guard Bridge which um is coming off of Wentworth Farm going towards the bike
path on the Harvey Allen trail. And you can see the bridge abutment falling into the hot brook there. And that's another area that's high on our priority list. Uh this is a photo of the POTC conservation area and um this is a spot
um a major major river system in the town of Ammerst carrying the Great Swamp Brook with a tiny 30-in failing um uh pipe that really need desperately needs replacement. And this is another one that's high on our list
and we're hoping to leverage grant dollars for, but a lot of work needs to happen here. Um on the left hand side we have some images of a bridge at Kushman Brook that needs to be replaced. On the right hand side you see some photos of Amethyst
Brook. Um we are hopeful to have some improvements made at the entrance of Amethyst in the near future. It's it's um really in need of a refresh down there. It's it's kind of in tough shape. the trail is is really um muddy and
mucky and needs to be sort of redesigned. There's also two coverts which are undersized which need replacement down there. Just sharing an example from 2025 of a project that we partnered to fund with CPA funds. Um the photo on the left is
what it looked like before. The photo on the right is the completed um project which was just recently completed. And so thank you so much for funding. And this is um this project was also I would say 75% funded by uh Kestrel Land Trust
with partnered with CPA dollars. So that was able to make this project happen. And then I know you've seen these before, um some of our um projects at Hickory Ridge that had CPA dollars that went toward them.
Um as well as 2022 and 2023 dollars going towards um various project sites, uh Sweet Alice, KC Trail Bridge, and Robert Frost Trail bridges throughout town. Um we also have Puffer Pond which is a
big big one that's coming down the line soon. Um right now we have a a grant from the dam and seaw wall um uh dam and seaw wall grant from the state to basically assess the dam and the dyke um at Puffers Pond. Once it's
um assessed, we're going to be putting together design and permitting to repair it. And in the course of that, the pond is going to be partially or hopefully more than partially dredged um because a lot of the there's a lot of accumulation of sediment and puffers. But along with
that, there's quite a bit of deterioration around the site and also dredging and the work it's going to take to repair the dam and dyke is going to do quite a bit of damage to our our beaches and our recreational passive recreational areas that people enjoy. um
probably one of the the I think it's the second most used conservation area in the town of Ammerst after Amethyst Brook. Um and so it really needs some love um in terms of uh repairing beaches um repairing trails. It needs that work
now, but after the the dam and dyke repairs and hopefully the dredging work is done, it's going to need even more. So, um that's my presentation. I hope I kept it about right in terms of time. And that's a picture of my son riding
his bike at the Hickory Ridge um uh property and it's wonderful multi-use path that CPA helped fund. >> This is great, Aaron. Thank you so much. I appreciate the photos and also seeing
the CPA dollars at work. Um really appreciate your hard work. It's it's a great it also just gives us a little bit of a breadth and scope of the amount of conservation land and open space and um you know all the trail system that we have here. We're so lucky in the town.
So, thank you very much. It looks like Bob had his has his hand ra maybe we can go out of um presentation mode. >> Yep. >> Sure. Yeah. Yeah. I second those comments. Katie, Erin, that was great. Um, it's nice to see our CPA dollars uh
in action. Um, I'm curious, uh, everything you've described is within the wetland buffer, so it's all got wetland requirements. Does the conservation commission have a fast
track for these projects that make sure that they can happen with appropriate safeguards, but also happen efficiently? How does that work? >> No, it's an excellent question. One of the things that we're working towards in the conservation department is
development of um what we would call an operation and maintenance notice of intent. And so the idea of that is that we identify I would say four, five, six, maybe more top projects that the conservation department has on its
priority list. and we do the sort of design, the the wetland delineation, the survey, the design. Um, and we we put all that together into a permit application along with all of our maintenance activities. So, that might be maintenance of beaver deceivers and
our annual mowing and all these pieces that come together for our management. And we seek approval of those in one shot from the conservation commission. Those permits are valid for three years. And the idea being that um and they can be extended for a three-year period. So
the idea being that as we acquire funding, you know, funding from CPA, funding from grants, funding from project partners, and and um we are ready to tackle a given project that we have those projects in the queues so we can take care of them and and get that
work done. >> Great. Thank you. >> Thank you. Appreciate that. Okay, Jason, you're up. >> Thank you. Thanks, Aaron. Um, can you explain the rationale behind
why you're asking for a a sum of money and then using it on like multiple different projects as opposed to bringing a project like the large hill boardwalk which was presented last year as well. Why aren't you focusing on one project?
because specifically that large hill project is going to be expensive and just getting that one done >> as opposed to using it using the money on a bunch of different things. >> That's a great question too. I mean I think um different opportunities pop up
for us. So just to give an example with the Sweet Alice Boardwalk. So, we we had filed that notice of intent back in I want to say 2021 and we had steadily chipped away at um four separate projects on the Sweet Alice project
between 2021 and 2025. Today, we had one remaining outstanding piece to complete that overall project scope and that was that boardwalk that you saw. Um it was it was one of the ones that we I presented to you last year as well, but
this year um Castro Land Trust came forward and they said, "Hey, we've got a chunk of dollars and we will basically pay for the labor and um uh you know, so they covered the entire labor cost which was substantial and we paid for
materials. So that was just an example. The opportunity arose and we said we're going to we're going to do this." um there's a another opportunity similar to that that may be happening at Amethyst Brook. And so um you know I totally
agree with you Jason and sometimes it takes a little bit of time and momentum to get these projects sort of um to to seek out community support to seek out project partners and with a project like Larch Hill that's going to take some time. So, while it is at the top of my
priority list, I recognize the challenge that that particular one presents. Similarly, like the National Guard Bridge project um on the Harvey Allen Trail between Wentworth Farm and the bike path is another one. I mean, you're talking 300 ft of of bog bridging um uh
you know, an engineered um installed plan that's going through very sensitive resource areas. So something like that is going to take a lot. It's going to take a lot of resources. So we while we wish that we could just do
that, I feel like we'd be moving much slower if we said we're we're going to focus on large hill and just try to get large hill done. I feel like it would slow us down when these opportunities arise at other spots where we have partner funding. >> Thank you.
appreciate that need for flexibility and the timing of this funding. You know, it's not until next July or after. So, that also complicates when you're doing projects like that, I'm sure. >> Um Dave has a comment.
>> Sure. Just to follow up on on Jason's question, I I think it's a great question, Jason. I think the way we think about this in large part is, you know, these are capital these are hugely important capital assets of the town. Um, many of them have not been improved
or or received funding or or any work in 30 to 40 years. Uh, the Larch Hill Boardwalk, although it is near and dear to Aaron's heart. I just don't want to overpromise that that is the number one um project.
We really haven't discussed that in great detail. It is near and dear to my heart because I was the director of the Hitchcock Center there for many years. I was actually there when the boardwalk was built, which would have been in somewhere uh boy, I don't even want to say late
90s or 90 maybe early 90s. Anyway, um I think we need to think about these things like we think about buildings. We, you know, $100,000 is pick a number, you know, onetenth of what we truly need out there. So, I
think the expectation should be that we're going to we're going to come back every year for a number and it might be a h 100,000 um just to build that that uh that that reserve up and when as Aaron said when the project is ready to go through
permitting through design then we launch. Um but we also have to be prepared for that unexpected thing. If that bridge at uh over the hop brook fails, we either have to fix it, repair it, replace it, or close that trail
until we have x number of dollars to to work on it. So, it's not ideal. It's not the best, but I I I think it's all about kind of capital planning long term, but you know, we could easily permit half a million to a million dollars worth of
projects, I think, on conservation trails if the funding was available. So, that's I think the best approach we have at this time. >> Thanks, Dave. Appreciate that additional info. Jason, you had followup.
>> Yeah, Dave, you just mentioned uh two things. one, can you tell us what other funding from the town uh because these are capital improvement projects, I would assume the town budgets for some of the maintenance of all of this. So, what other funding comes from the town
and then you mentioned build the reserves up? Um, are you saying that this money gets kind of just put in an account and then is spent as projects come along or how how does that
work or was can you just explain what you meant by build up the reserves? Well, yeah, maybe not the the the best choice of words, but um you know, Aaron mentioned last year's, you know, we made a $100,000 request last year. So,
it might take two years of CPA funding to actually get enough funding to do a project like a 300 foot long boardwalk at Larch Hill or a new bridge over the Hop Brook. So we may take an FY, you
know, 25 or 26 or 26 27 allocation from CPAC to um to be able to do a project. And the other thing Erin mentioned is just that that timing of permitting and design. Um you know 20 30 years ago these projects were not designed by
engineers. They were not stamped by engineers. Um many of them were not permitted way back when. We do all of that now. Um, and we hold ourselves to the same standards we would of any resident of Ammerst or any business in
Ammerst. Um, your other question, Jason, was about capital. Um, we do ask for capital uh funding for trails. Um, the capital budget has and will continue to
be under great stress and so there's no easy answer. There's no easy fix. Um certainly our capital plan doesn't have $300,000 or half a million dollars to put toward trails with all the other demands both from the town as well as
the schools. So we do what we can through the capital plan and as Aaron mentioned we we do very well with our partners also getting grants park grants uh and working with Gastrol and other partners. We also get donations, uh, people wanting to just help out a
conservation area that's near and dear to their heart in one part of the town or another. So, it's piecing all those things together and and trying to make make the best of it. >> Thank you, Dave. Um, we have time for
another question if anyone has it has one for Aaron. Aaron, you had your hand up, but maybe you >> I just wanted to make sure that Dave touched on grants. Um, because, you know, I think that was a big piece and I know capital, one of the big ones is
Puffer Pond that we have for thinking about the future there. So, um, so I just wanted to mention those things, but Dave happened to cover them, so I I >> He covered he covered the bases. >> Yeah. Okay, great. Anyone else?
>> All right, Erin, thank you so much. really appreciate the presentation and all the work you're doing. >> Thank you so much for your time. Really appreciate it. >> Yeah, thank you. >> Um Leah, do we have I'm just looking in. >> Yeah, I think
>> is Greg >> Linda next. >> Linda's next. Great. >> Yeah. So, let me let her in. >> Oh, it looks like you've stopped my video. Leah, >> me. >> Yes, that's what it says. But you don't
you guys don't need to see me. That's fine. >> How did I do that? >> Just It just made an announcement. Start. Okay, I have to >> Are you back? >> It said the host has stopped your video. I thought it was on purpose.
>> Um, great. Oh, hi Linda. Welcome. >> Thank you. >> Thank you for being here. um really appreciate your proposal and um thank you for answering so you and uh the group answering so many of our
questions initially. Um so we'll just launch into your presentation and um we have about 20 minutes together. So keeping that to five to seven minutes would be awesome if you can and then leave time for our additional questions
and clarifications >> be great. And yeah, I can show these myself. >> Okay. >> And that might be easier. Yeah, I have. >> Now, having said that, let's get it launched here. Sorry, I'm being slow here to find the
share screen. >> Oh, down at the bottom there, your little cursor has to light it up. Yeah. There we go. >> Great.
>> Okay. And we'll put on slide. There we go. Thank you. So, let me just begin by very quickly reminding you of the community land trust model. Um, I'm sorry to take up time if if you're fully familiar with
it, but I've found repeatedly that uh it's just different enough from what people think about every day and it's so fundamental to everything we do that I'm take one of my minutes here to give a reminder. The idea is that we partner with potential homeowners. uh we raise
funds in order to be able to come in with the uh price of a land or indeed whatever subsidy the homeowner needs which is often more than the price of the land and the homeowner then need buy only the home. Um and the relationship
between the land trust and the homeowner is governed by a ground lease. It runs for 99 years so effectively in perpetuity. And it has two key requirements of the homeowner. they must live there. So if their lives change in
such a way that they choose to live elsewhere, they can't run this as a rental property. It has to be sold back to us or to a family of means similar to theirs at the time they bought it. And that in turn is governed by a restricted resale price in the ground lease. So the
resale value of the house may rise, but only with the rise in area median income, not with whatever the market is doing. So effectively this model once a home is in this model it is affordable in perpetuity at the level um of the
family that first bought it and that varies somewhat with the circumstances. So let me u jump right to the project itself. Um and I've put a map up here the current uh site plan. This there's a
copy of this in the proposal and I'll just use it again to spend a a minute to remind you of the the vision that we have. This is the lot right in central Ammerst. You walk by it. If you walk downhill from the cinema, you're there within a block. Um and it's being uh
offered to us at well below its market value u by a family that wants to see it committed to affordable housing. So there's an existing building large enough that we can put three units in it with appropriate redevelopment and
there's also sufficient land um to build an additional duplex. Habitat for Humanity will be our construction partner. So the um summary of the funds needed um it has two um shows the phases
pre-development acquisition redevelopment and then homeownership and it shows both the funds that ACL will need and as a lump sum uh what Habitat will both raise and manage. So I'm not giving
the details on the habitat side but just there for context of the overall project. So focusing now just on the phase of acquiring the property. Um let me just say briefly we're in the midst of pre-development now and that's a
relatively uh small resource cash resource requirement compared to the other phases. So, I've left that detail off this table, but focusing on the cost of acquiring the property, that will cost $475,000,
which is $225,000 less than the appraised value of the property uh plus transaction costs, which we will pay out of existing resources. and then the redevelopment. By this I mean all of the construction
and its related site work um that will get us from the existing uh 200year-old building to the three modernized units that will then be offered for sale. And then the home ownership phase, uh there
will be three units for sale and at affordable prices for two three-bedroom units and a four bedroomedroom unit. Um it it calculated today again by a couple of years from now that might be slightly different but if if done using the
executive office of housing livable communities calculator for affordability at 70% area median income that would yield $732,000. So, uh, we've approached, uh, CPA for
$450,000 toward that redevelopment cost. And just for completeness of how we're handling the funding, I show here that we've approached AMAHT for a grant of $275,000
uh to go partly toward acquisition, partly toward revelopment and then mindful that they have a sum in hand from the payment in lie for the Hastings project, uh we have suggested to them that they be our bridge uh
lender uh project like this always requires a lot of upfront cost. The construction bills have to be paid before the revenue from sales are realized. And so we've invited them to consider being our bridge loaner, a bridge lender, which would offer them
the opportunity to put some of that money to work very quickly before they have other projects that are as ready to move as we are. uh but then that that uh money would be returned to them to then
spend in the future on uh something else. We do have backup lenders uh available. But just so that you see uh the different ways that we're asking the town to be engaged in that, we expect to also approach the Amelia Peabody fund.
This project looks very close to the kind of thing that they like to do. And then as with the pre-development costs and the acquisition costs, um we have sufficient cash reserves to make up the total. If you add these numbers up,
you'll find they're 52,000 short of the full cost of the uh actual construction phase. Um and then we would recoup those funds um during the revenue from sales. And then finally, something that hasn't
been in anything you've seen yet. Um, just a bit of history that relates um both to the overall development of the Amoris Community Land Trust and the part that CPA has played in it. So, these pie charts show the revenue sources we've
had access to over the 10 years that we've been in business. And the small one in the upper right uh is a summary that's a standing that we'd be at today. This is what our treasurer says are cumulative sums to date. So we've raised
um a substantial amount in cash. The grants there, the green segment in the pie chart, um the community preservation act funds are our major grantee or grtor. uh you gave us $100,000 for our
very first project done in partnership with Habitat where we bought a piece of land and they built a duplex also include the CPA funds you gave to Habitat are included there so that with respect to our total holdings in
includes a previous partnership with Habitat. Um and then over the years um since that very first project we did in North Ammerst um the town has become increasingly aware of what we do and
that has led to what feels to me like an extraordinary outburst of generosity on part of the citizens. All that brown segment there is property that's been gifted to us for various of our projects. So um the we are asking for a
big fraction from the town of the costs of this project but in parallel uh we're we have three other active projects um and we don't require town funding on any of them again because of the extraordinary generosity of the citizens
who've become aware of our projects. So, we're with the the one that says with 61 Fearing Street is very close to what we have today, except that within two weeks, we're going to close on one more property. So, we had already summed in
the cash gifts that we raised. Um, the neighbors of this property donated uh over $100,000 in about two months to close a gap between affordability and what the family was able to accept for this. And that's already added into the
cash. When we close on the property, the then the property value uh will add to the total value of property that we hold. And then when the other three projects that are in process, one is the one that we're asking you to help with now. The
other two are both cases of families coming forward and inviting us to be partners in protecting their homes for affordability. One is a complete gift, house and land and $150,000 to improve the home. Uh that will make a
big difference in our totals. and the other is an offer of the land um and a commitment to affordable sale of the house in the future. The homeowner presently in place is making the gift of the land and will stay in residence
through the rest of her life. Uh but she will commit to the ground lease via her ground lease having given us the land that the home will be sword sold affordably. Um, so, um, I think that's probably a good place for me to stop. I wasn't
watching my watch, but I hope I stayed not too far off five minutes, and I'll be happy to answer further questions. >> Thank you. Thank you, Linda. Appreciate um the context, the history, and the update here um, and the work that you're
doing. Very much appreciate it. It's a complex uh proposal and I know Oh, Jonas has a question. We'll start with you Jonas. >> Sure. Uh thanks Linda for the presentation. The um so the current homeowners of AMD are willing to to sell
it for 475,000. Is that correct? >> That's correct. >> It's impressive because um I don't know the exact value of that land, but I imagine with its location, it's far more than that. So, um, and then
another question was, "Do you ever have issues selling the properties? I imagine they're in high demand and that they don't that's >> Yeah, that's a um it that's an interesting question. Um, home being an
ACLT homeowner is not for everyone. There there are pluses and minuses. uh the and I summarized for you again the restrictions that such homeowners agree to. Uh
that said, there are a lot of folks out there who would like to live and raise their families in Ammerst as I'm sure you know and the market prices are wildly out of line with even salaries of good jobs. the beginning salary for a
tenure or tenure track professorship at the university doesn't come even close to affording a house in so um there is in fact a substantial population u that thinks that the tradeoffs are
well worth it. the the thing that that um narrows the pool the most actually is that if any public money is used then we have to stay at the 80% below 80% uh area median income and there's not
much room below 80% area median income where you still can manage any mortgage at all. You know where the bank is going to be able to support um that purchase. And so in effect, you may have heard me say in the presentation that those
prices are based on affordability at 70%. That's the slice that we can serve. You can't make more than 80 or when you aren't meeting the affordability criteria of the public money that supports it. Um but if you're making
much less than 70, you're going to have trouble u just making ends meet. Um but um that said we have uh found that a piece of CPA participation that I didn't give you the detail of before I told you
about our very first project. But you also funded at um you gave us $275,000 a little over five years ago and that was u partly operational cost 25 of it.
Um but it was also $225,000 subsidies. Um and the um those were in um at the time that we got that grant
the um it was to support two purchases. In fact, we were able um to utilize it to put three families in residence because one of the houses that had been gifted to us, one of the people who turned up in the search for that
first-time home buyer program chose the house that had been donated. Um so the sort of overhead of of running the search actually yielded three families, but it was close. um that you know we had only a few more. Um I mean it's nice
for the ones it's tough for the families to enter into a lottery and not everybody makes it. That that's kind of heartbreaking. Um so I don't like to see actually 20 people in a lottery when we've only got two subsidies. But uh on the other hand, it it it
wasn't very much more than the than the the places that we had available that were actually um coming in. So I don't have any concern that these houses won't be won't find buyers. Um but it's not a slam dunk. We
have to work at it. >> Thank you, Linda. Appreciate that, Jason. >> Thank you. Um, thank you, Linda, for the presentation. In the packet, in your initial application packet, you have a breakdown of the costs,
>> and you were looking at um over $2 million in total for the existing building redevelopment and the new duplexes with the existing building redevelopment at >> $1.2
million. um with a per unit cost of $415,000. So, does that mean that the three units in the existing building are going to be sold for $415,000?
>> No, that uh they're going to be sold um I've forgotten the exact numbers. The three-bedroom units go I'm going to say 230, but don't hold me to that. They're in that range. I can um send you the
chart of the up-to-date numbers. Um the um the per unit cost has come up in various discussions of whether this is the best way to to use public resources or not. Uh I don't AMHT
uh had a seminar um oh about a year ago now in which various builders nonprofit builders um came and talked gave a reality check a sort of public reality check on what it takes to do a project
like this and they were talking in the range of 6 to $700,000 per unit. Uh and that was not with a lot of money, you know, going into speculators pockets that u but just
by the time you use federal grants, you're required to meet certain standards for bidding and for the use of um the certain salary scales. Um there are all kinds of things that enter
into that. So you might wonder how we managed to put people in homes for a per unit cost that is to the project itself, not to the home buyer of $415,000. And the answer is a lot of public
generosity. ACLT itself has one halftime staff member and a a board and a set of volunteers um some of whom have very substantial qualifications for this work that all
work proono um had the habitat model depends heavily on proono labor. Um and then there is the gift of the properties itself and the willingness of of our fellow citizens, our friends and
neighbors to come up with a significant fraction of the cash. >> Would it not be less expensive to just demolish the existing building and build new? >> No, it wouldn't actually. the um
new habitat builds about as cheap as you can build partly because they depend heavily um on uh proono labor and the perunit costs in this project for habitat are greater than the perunit costs for the rehab. It a huge amount of
construction costs. First of all, demo is not cheap. all that material has to go somewhere. Um and and then you have to redo the foundations. Um and that's a big chunk of any new
build. >> Linda, I'm just looking at the time and we have two more questions. So Jason, are you good with moving on to Okay, great. Thank you. Um Bob, you're up. >> Yeah, Linda, thanks for that presentation. Very clear. Um, a
question. You can answer this as quickly as you can. Um, operationally, does your organization have a drain from holding this land and houses in inventory? In other words, the those who are in the houses who are
there tenants for life, are you taking care of those houses for them? Are you taking care of the land? And does that diminish your effectiveness as an organization? And um the homeowners have the same
responsibilities for the home that any homeowner would have. Um the in fact they also care for the land. That's part of the lease. They mow the lawn. If a tree needs to be cut down, they pay the cost of cutting it down. Um
they they have all the costs of maintenance um that any homeowner would have. Um that said um the money that they spend um doesn't allow them to raise the resale price. The resale price
cannot rise faster than area median income rises. So there's um potential disincentive built in um to cut corners on keeping up. Um we uh and to counteract that to motivate
people and also just to make them feel like this the whole thing is manageable. Um we part of what we raise money for is a repair fund. So our homeowners can borrow from us at zero interest if um if
the roof needs replacement. And clearly there hasn't been financial preparation for that to come that to happen. We would come in with a zero interest loan so that the roof could get replaced before that it led to worse damage. Um
and the conditions of that loan would be to encourage the repayment of it as promptly as was feasible to them. But if that failed when eventually there was a reselling of the property first it would go to pay off their loan. Actually I've
had a recent conversation with Megan Mcdana Habitat for Humanity. They do something similar uh but it's somewhat more generous and and in some ways more realistic. If we leave 30 years is going to go by who's going to care, you know,
about whatever we loan 30 years ago. um they actually uh ramp down the loan with time whether it's paid back or not. Um so I need to learn more about that. I just heard about it the other day. But the >> that that Thank you. That was a very
very comprehensive answer. I appreciate it. >> Thank you. Thanks so much. That was a great question. Robin had her hand up. We are pretty much out of t over time, but Robin, did you have anything? I just wanted to note that that another complication of demolition is that that would be subject to demolition delay in
the town which could be another 12-month delay and make the process more complicated. So >> yeah, thank you. Thank you for that. Great. Well, Linda, thank you so much. I really appreciate the work you're doing and on behalf of the CPA, thank you for this proposal. We so appreciate it. As
you know, we've got >> way more requests in terms of dollars than we have to give. We wish we had it all, but um that just I know you know this, but just to to state it out loud.
>> Thank you. >> Yeah, thank you so much. >> Leah, sorry. Can you hear me? Okay. Uh yeah, >> this is so funny. It just said the host had muted me. I don't know what's going on. >> Um where
>> I'm not going to have a complex yet. Um >> so I don't >> I think it's Greg. I'm assuming it's Oh, it's Gaston. Okay. Are we ready? >> We are ready. Okay.
Oh, Greg wants. Let's see. So, Greg is here. And >> um and uh the trust chair, Gaston Deos Re should be in the audience. >> He's also here somewhere. Yeah, he's there. He's got his hand raised. Okay, there's Gaston. Okay. and you'll
move, Linda. >> So, welcome, Greg. Nice to see you. And >> welcome, Gaston. Oh, well done, Gaston. Yes. Uh, excellent. Um, well, welcome. We appreciate your proposal. Appreciate you being here and willing to answer
more questions of ours and to to put this proposal before us. um with the presentation. We're gonna get you rolling because we have just 20 minutes for this. So, take it away, Geston. Is he muted?
>> I don't hear Gaston. I don't hear you. Um, I see the slides. It's I got your one. Yeah, just a second. Yeah, got it. >> Okay, now you can hear me. >> There we go. Yes. Thank you so much. >> So, um, thank you uh, all for your time
and and I want to start by just reminding you that trust is a creature of state law just like your committee. We are uh we exist for affordable housing. One of the features of our legislation is that we can receive money from the
CPA without a specific project rather to have funds to support our our mission which is to respond to affordable housing needs as as we can nimly responsively as long as these funds are
are spent to uh advance our mission. We have recently adopted a strategy and I just want to give you the very high uh lights here. We're focused naturally on development. Two of the subpoints that are relevant right now. Number one, in addition to uh supporting the creation
of rental homes that are affordable, we also have a commitment to affordable home ownership which dovetales with the proposal you've just heard. And we're also committed to uh supporting the ecosystem for housing development itself. and we're going to talk about
that more in just a second. In addition, we want to secure funding. We're here to do that and educate and engage the the public and other parts of the town government that support our mission. We are um you know, the the labor of love of John Hornick who started the the
trust and continues to support us. Our membership today, we've been able to thankfully restore a full committee. We have uh diversity of strengths as you can see in terms of what the members do
and since 2023 we've had the support of of Greg Rashane and you know that transforms our capacity to uh to to make a difference. So I'm extremely grateful to be able to work with Greg. Um Greg took a leadership supporting the development of a housing production plan
on the agenda for town council to approve on Monday. Bottom line of this report, you wouldn't uh be surprised to hear we we have incredible needs for um uh expanding affordable housing. A lot of people in
Amherst who would like to stay and and aren't sure that they'll be able to do so. And uh before getting into the specific initiatives that we proposed, I just want to tell you that we are working to focus and activate our initiatives using calls for proposals.
something we have not done, something many other uh trusts in the state are doing. And so we're uh excited to u not just wait for someone to come to us to ask for money, but to reach out to the community and try to get great ideas and proposals to move things forward. So
first initiative that we uh include in our proposal is a $125,000 request to fund a housing ecosystem innovation fund. This is something that we would activate through calls for proposal. We uh have already been giving
a lot of attention to the capacity for uh ADU construction to enhance affordability and we have uh developed ideas that we would uh continue to um implement with such funding to get uh a
standardized approved design that would facilitate construction to um work with market rate developers and provide the funding that would actually make uh units affordable by our criteria. So we have a number of ideas. The key here is
bringing uh new ideas to us and funding uh small grants that we think can have a very high multiplier effect. We're also concerned to see how we can be a player that helps the ecosystem
that is as we all know uh getting bad surprises left and right in terms of funding from federal um uh all the way down. And so we are particularly concerned to see how we can preserve tenencies, preserve home ownership, whether that might be through uh
subsidies, responding to high utility uh expenses, supporting homeowners. You know, one among many issues facing homeowners is skyrocketing insurance. So we want to be able to respond um to to such needs, projects that suddenly are
missing uh key key funding. can we come in and and make the difference to keep a project on track? Uh and then finally, we have a $250,000 request for the bread and butter of what we've been doing, which is providing local equity
investments that provide the the key for developers to be able to get the majority of their funding from other sources. But um those other sources like the state like to see the commitment of local funds supporting a project and
seeing that as a sign of worthiness for for investment. And uh just want to underscore we are looking and uh securing funds from from other sources and we're focused on projects that multiply the value of of
those investment dollars. You can see that our current balance is larger than it has been in the past because we received money um in lie of three affordable housing units that were going to be part of a project in town. The
developer requested to uh make a payment instead of developing those units. So, we feel um uh extremely uh responsible to uh make that money work for for the town and do more than substitute the three units that that were not uh
developed. So, let me uh stop here. I'll I'll stop sharing and uh let's see how Greg and I can respond to your questions. >> Great. Thank you so much, Gon. I really appreciate the uh presentation and Greg
for your work. Um, appreciate that. Um, anyone have any qu I did have a question just this is just uh about your rapid response fund and whether or not um the trust had done this in the past for any emergencies
you know like COVID etc. if you had if you had had experience. >> Yeah. Greg do do you think you could speak to to the examples of how we've done this in the past? >> Sure. So before my time uh the most significant thing uh um there was a couple different town programs including
one from the trust that was I believe a rental uh subsidy program um >> uh you know dur during co um >> okay >> so kind and then more in a a slightly more programmed way we also um uh
backfilled some state funds uh to um support a a three-year um scattered site lease program uh through which uh is currently still being managed by Craig's doors I believe. Um so we kind of filled a hole there. Um >> okay
>> that was that was more helping organization than specific uh individuals but similar population targeted >> and and another good example um of a diff the different type that that we mentioned would be that we came in and provided a missing chunk of money for
the CLT to actually purchase a home >> Yeah. by a a local teacher in our schools with children and they needed, you know, $25,000 to get over the hump given what had happened to pricing. And so we were able to come in and and give
that rapid response and and facilitate that purchase. >> Great. Thank you, Bob. >> Uh yeah, that thanks for that presentation. Um, I'm I'm curious if could you just talk a little bit briefly
about your pipeline because that seems to be what drives your funding request is some crystal ball about what you're looking at. As I recall, last year the BFW was involved somehow in that
pipeline. So maybe just talk a little bit about that. >> Go ahead. Yeah, I mean so um uh at at the moment uh in in parallel to your committee uh the trust is also um uh talking to the Ammeris Community Land Trust about the Ammy Street project as
you just saw. And so we've had uh I think uh well one formal uh meeting with ACLT and a couple more informational meetings and and also um uh some you know some staff level meetings as well. Um so that's something we're we're considering in you know in this very
moment. Um and so the VFW continues to be on the radar for sure. Um you know, we hope to be taking some steps uh at the town level soon. Um with that, so um uh remains to be seen precisely when the trust might need to come into to that
particular project. Um uh but um you know, it's certainly within the you know, there's certainly a scenario where we get an ask within uh within a year or two. Um and that depends just a lot of variables of that project really. Um you know and then there's a couple other um you know ideas floating around there.
There has been some some public conversation around a potential larger developer looking at something in North Ammerst. Um you know that's not uh um that hasn't um arrived at with the trust yet. But I presume we're that to move forward they want to come see us um um
probably for one of those larger chunks of equity um you know uh which they'll probably be seeking from multiple sources. um you know and and then and then some some other things you kind a little further on the horizon for example like one property we're uh the town's looking at right now uh is a
South Amber school campus and and that's um something that um in particular might benefit from pre-development funding um you know if if it ends up going forward uh you know as a disposition um a property like that uh to attract an affordable developer especially might
want some pre-development resources from an entity like the trust. Great. Thank you. >> Thanks. Um, Angus, I think you were >> Yeah, my question's pretty pretty quick and Greg, maybe you'll be able to answer
it, but I'm just wanting to understand, I guess, how much support the municipal housing trust gets from the town itself. Um, you mentioned some of these properties that they're in conversation with, but I guess I'm I'm wondering about the financial support. >> Um,
sure. So if in terms of of uh like investments into developments, you mean? >> Yeah. And then also if there's any if y'all go to if y'all you know take requests like this to the town as well. >> Um um not precisely in the same way. Um
you know I mean we are you know as you know Gaston mentioned we were the bene are the beneficiary of um the fee in lie of affordable housing. That's not quite the same as us asking the town for funds. Um we don't uh there there's not really town funds that would route
directly to the trust and then out. Um there's probably scenarios where the town might have a resource you know like for example with ARPA the town had direct resources which routed you know directly into some developments and the trust also supported those for example um but not necessarily through us.
There's not really a mechanism for us to ask the town for resources outside of the CPA. the the the relevant resources that have been coming in that sort of way is actually funding Greg's salary. Um but in fact that's something that the trust is going to be moving to cover
more and more um uh rather than the town. >> So yeah, so at the moment the trust covers half of me and the town covers the other half of me basically. But the thing, you know, the work overlaps to some degree, but technically the work I do on the town side is are non-rust
projects and the trust resources support my support in turn of the trust. >> Jonas, >> you Angus, is that sufficient answer? I see. >> Okay, great. Okay, Jonas, >> you might want to weigh in too. I don't know if Dave has his hand up, but um go.
>> Yeah, thanks for the presentation. I'm I'm wondering uh like for the ADUs uh like just increasing the amount of stock in Ammerst could have the could have the effect of lowering housing >> ideally and more supply. Do you was your
um your is your purview really only affordable that 100% or where does it kind of intersect at all with the town of Amoris and just like especially specifically with ADUs and because I could I could if I did it. I'm going to
increase housing stock, maybe have a rental in my backyard enough that's would be permitted um based on my zoning, but uh do you is there any kind of handoff between the town and you in that respect? >> Um that's an aspiration really. Um I mean and I think there's a a relevant
morsel in in the application which is and that's a really good question. Um, and you know, yes, I mean, the the trust, I think, has, you know, had, you know, some discussion around ADUs and just generally thematically how, you know, adding some small homes or apartments, you know, could really uh could really benefit the town with
supply. Our official obligation when we're investing uh equity or loans into um into new or renovated homes, you know, is there does have to be some sort of deed restriction that comes out of it. uh but one approach you know which is
kind of on that menu of ecosystem ideas you know which by the way we need to figure out which we could uh implement but one I'm particularly interested in which we're seeing around the country are pre-approved design models so the trust conceivably um and we have to sort of like kind of go down the rabbit hole here and and really figure it out if it
works but the trust could fund um a really strong set of plans for an ADU um and then in turn fund the development of one affordable ADU but the plans could also be a product and then get reused conceivably um as long as we build that one affordable ADU. Those plans could
get replicated again and again uh regardless of affordability and we might be able to find a way to make those available to affordable builders or any builder who or or private homeowner who wants to build something. Um and that that would take some doing and the idea would be to work with the buildings
department to um to sort of preapprove as much as possible of of that kind of development. um and then you know get some you know one or maybe two or three um uh pre pre-approved designs that folks could start with saving architectural fees etc. But that that
sort of >> peripheral output wouldn't necessarily need to be affordable. >> The the theory of change that you mentioned Jonas, we we buy that more supply is helpful, especially um more affordable things like ADUs. The investments that we can make into
deed restricted properties. We want to see how we can maximize the learning curve of the whole town to facilitate the the development of ADUs. Thanks, >> Dave. Did you have a um a comment or >> Sure. Yes. I could just go back to
Angus's question earlier, which I thought was a good one. Um I think what's really important for all the CPA members and anybody listening is is to understand how closely the trust and the town work together. This is really a partnership. It always has been. Um
although the trust has certain powers under state law as Gaston indicated earlier um you know the funds are managed by the town um we work very closely Greg is is embedded in the planning department so Greg Nate
Mallaloy Rob Moira myself our new planning and economic development director u um you know will all have all and we'll all continue to work on affordable housing you know daily. Um, you know, in terms of the town's
investment, when we think of properties like Olympia Oaks, the town actually donated that land for Olympia Oaks to happen. Uh, the Wayfinders project over on Belchuretown Road and and Northeast Street is land, the East Street School
was donated by the town. We bought the Belturetown Road property. So, it's really a partnership. um you know the north square wouldn't have happened without a tax increment financing program that the town was able to work out with Beacon. So we are deeply
committed uh to work with the with the trust and bring as many resources as we possibly can to the table so that we can all uh work together to to address some of the you know the issues that Gaston identified and and brought to all of our
attention earlier which which is we have a housing crisis in Ammerst the region and the state. So, um it's a partnership. It's a great partnership >> and and one that can obviously work much better since um Greg came on board. You know, one of of the other ways that
we're starting to think about how we can help is the town has land that they don't have the bandwidth to ex examine for its feasibility possibly. So maybe we can be the one that funds exploration of the potential of land that is
possible but outside of what is really at at at at the front of the list for the town to deal with. >> Thanks Dave. Thanks Gaston. Other questions on this proposal?
All right. It looks like you were super thorough in your uh in your presentation and in the proposal itself. I really appreciate the work you're doing. Um this is so important, such an important priority for the town. So, thank you and thanks for being here tonight
>> taking time. >> All right. >> Thank you all for your efforts and your time. >> Don't hesitate to let us know any other questions. Thank you so much. >> Thank you. So I >> um go ahead. I >> I think Nate Mallaloy might be the next I'm not sure.
>> That's our last meeting. Yeah. >> Okay. >> Was doing the housing coordinator. Yeah. >> Yep. >> Great. >> Is he there? Nate. >> Yes. Hi Nate. >> Hi everyone. Nate Mallaloy. I'm a planner with the town. >> Welcome.
>> I'll you know I'll discuss the request from the town for the part-time housing coordinator planner position. Uh you know it's Greg right now but you know the idea is to fund this position. Currently is being funded through the trust and CPA. We asked for you know we asked for and received a three-year
allocation. We're asking for another three years. uh the request expires or the funding would would um kind of run out next uh June. So we'd we'd pick up next fiscal year and then fund this position with a trust for another three
years. And so you know we see as a really cost-effective way to you know keep it's you know the part-time position works you know with the housing trust and also just on other housing initiatives in the town. So you know um that position helps with some zoning amendments. It's helped with different
projects, applies for grants, and so, you know, it's we see we see it as a really cost-effective way to increase staff capacity and not go on a project by project basis hiring someone or trying to hire an outside consultant. So, previously, the trust would go out every time they wanted to do maybe a
research project, we'd put out a request for quotes and hire a consultant maybe for 15 or $20,000 or whatever amount or try to reach reach out to different consultants. And we realized it was slow. it was actually more costly. And so to have a staff person in town really
helps, you know, keep things moving. Um, you know, it's a great addition to staff. It's something that, you know, we there's a lot of need for housing in town, so there's, you know, a lot of different areas the the position can focus on. And it's a benefited position. It's part-time, so anything over 20
hours is benefited. Um, and so the position, you know, is the CPA funding pays for the position and and you know, salary and and anything else associated with it and the trust covers, you know, the difference and the remainder or, you know, it could be about half or whatever
it is of that position. Um, the CPA coalition a number of years ago wrote an article and said that, you know, communities with housing trust, this is a really great way to staff the trust and work on housing in that community. So, they actually wrote an article. It's on the CPA Coalition website. It's a little dated, but it it said that this
is a really um great use of CPA funds uh to, you know, try to meet the different goals of a community's um you know, housing plans or the CPA itself. So, I don't know if there's any questions that, you know, I don't have a slideshow. It's just really here to help
clarify anything or >> Thank you. Appreciate it, Nate. Angus. >> Hi, Nate. This is my third meeting with Nate in the last 24 hours. So I feel bad for both of us in a little in a little
bit of ways. Um so uh my question for you is uh so uh this is Greg's position. >> Correct. >> Okay. And so is it uh Greg mentioned that some of his work is for town things separate from the affordable housing
trust. Is that did I understand that correctly? >> Yeah. I mean the you know so the trust has a you know it's part of the general bylaws and it says to further really affordable housing and so Greg focuses on housing. I think to Jonah's question, it's like, oh, could it be focused on other parts of housing that's not
affordable? And so, you know, sometimes we'll ask Greg to, you know, apply for things that are, you know, still related to housing, maybe not capital A affordable. And so, that's where, you know, um, some other funding would come in. It usually, you know, there's always some affordability component to what
Greg is doing, some kind of housing piece there. >> Okay. But the 25 hours 20 to 25 hours of work that he that that position does is supposed to be solely for affordable housing or sometimes it has this other component. >> Sometimes it has this other you know to
be honest I'm trying to really think you know what that is. I feel like to me there's what what you know we've talked you heard about like the pipeline of projects and what happens. I think Greg's been working on a lot of products and initiatives. So you know he helped the trust with their new strategic plan. He worked with a consultant on the
housing production plan. So to me, those aren't, you know, directly related to a housing project, but the idea is that they'll help, you know, get projects going. And so those are the kinds of things that he'd be working on. It's not like he'd be working on, you know, a transportation plan for the town. It's always going to be housing focused, uh,
to lead to affordable housing. >> And then follow-up question, um, has the affordable housing trust requested that the town council fund contribute funding towards this position in some capacity? Yeah, kind of to your question earlier.
So there's, you know, we're not, this position isn't part of the general fund or operating budget for the town. And so it's that's why we're making the CPA request and then, you know, the trust can fund it as well. And so there isn't a a place for it in the next budget cycle with the town. So as part of the
general fund of the town and so you know, the trust doesn't come and create, you know, like a capital request or get any other funding from the town. You know, there's payment in lie from inclusionary zoning. There could be there's a a percent from short-term rental fees. You know, some communities
will fund the trust through other fees, but it's not like a direct request from the trust to the town. It's, you know, set up as some proportion of of something that's received. And so, you know, some communities even from CPA, they instead of having a request every
time, they just get a direct allocation from the CPA funding. So it could be that 10% or 8% or some amount of all the CPA funding every year goes right to the trust and they kind of manage the housing piece of it. So the trust hasn't gone to council or or the or the
departments and said can we you know get some general fund. It's really through CPA and through other other funding sources. >> Okay. Thanks Nate and Angus and the CP since I've been on for the last few years we've had this conversation about
at some point when we have time we would like to bring up that topic for the committee to consider so that the trust doesn't potentially the conversation the discussion debate might be that they wouldn't have to keep coming back but that a percentage would
just be allocated um and maybe with contingency you know something but we haven't yet carved out the time to do that. So that might be something that we could be we could consider as a committee this year. >> That'd be great. Thank you. >> Sure. Jonas. >> Yeah. Um is the hope that Greg would
stay on? Um I would imagine like with most jobs, continuity is is is a good thing. Uh the longer he's there, the the better he'll be at the job. Excuse me. Um so is there I just got something in
my throat. Uh >> oh. Uh oh. Don't choke. We can wait a second. >> A second. >> We'll Yeah, we'll come back to you. >> You know, I guess I can infer the question. Yeah, we're not, you know, we would have Greg stay continuously with the town, right? There is this, you
know, benefit and, you know, um, you know, kind of institutional knowledge as you work longer. And so Greg's really been immersing himself in understanding, you know, kind of the housing systems, the different organizations and institutions. And so to me, it's, you know, there's going to be like this economies of scale to that position to
have all that knowledge. and then be able to further things, you know, uh, kind of quicker or, you know, have different ideas. And so the idea would be to, you know, continue that a position, you know, the same person in that position, right, to make that more more effective? >> Yes. Would the aspiration be Sorry, I
got my voice back. Watch out. Um, would the aspiration be to make it be a full-time uh to better obviously we don't know what Greg's future plans are, but it would keep someone in place more if it's a full-time, I would imagine. Yeah, there's been those discussions. I
think you know the town again it's really the kind of what kind of funding model would that look like from the town and you know CPA and the trust and so you know and would it then have you know perhaps I think I think there's enough work to be done to do that and so um you know we've have talked about it and you
know could it then also be funded if it did things outside of housing but we haven't really you know I think we're we're seeing where it goes. I think 25 hours 20 25 hours has been a good amount and you know it could be more you know um the trust could always you know if they needed to if you know for instance
if right now there's a cap on the hours and that's where it stays but if in the future we could have you know we could allow it to go more and the trust would pick up that difference if they really needed to get you know a certain project or initiative moving or you know
>> Thank you J Jason it looks like you're Next, >> thank you. Um, Nate, kind of piggybacking off of I think Angus' and Jonas's questions about um potential funding sources and the
potential need for a full-time position. Do the when these, and this is also relevant, I think, for the last two presentations, these when these affordable housing units are built, do they pay any property taxes? And if so,
who pays the property tax? >> Yeah, excuse me. Yeah, so they do. So, you know, they pay a prrated amount depending on the the amount afford of affordability. So, you know, it's like a prrated amount. So, you could say that if you know, a market rate house, say
we'll just do that. A market rate unit pays $10,000, something at 80% AMI might pay 80 80% of that. And then something at 60% would pay, you know, a proportionally reduced amount. So, you know, typically a comprehensive permit or like an affordable housing developer,
a nonprofit developer, you know, Valley CDC or Beacons develop things, they still pay taxes. And so, I think there's a misleading conception that a nonprofit developer might get these tax credit pro deals and work on a project and they don't pay taxes. They do. And it's a
reduced amount. And it's usually the for a lot of these they set up like a separate LLC or company because there's um if especially if it's a tax credit program and depending on the permitting there's restrictions on amount of um income they can earn in profit and so
they really you know create something that manages say that development or something but the it's the owner you know the developer then turned owner pays taxes on it and if it's a rental it's the same thing. So, um, you know, the Amoris Community Land Trust, those
properties pay taxes. Uh, the land trust, you know, and the owners will pay taxes on those units. A rental project like Wayfinders will pay taxes. >> So, sorry. So, like the Amity project, >> whoever purchases the units will pay the
property tax. I >> mean, land trust is is tricky because there's a ground lease and there's the unit. And so the model of the land trust is that, you know, the owner doesn't pay for the value of the land. They just pay for the value of the structure. In
Massachusetts, you can't separate the owner from the land, the building from the land. So it's a it's a combination of the land trust and the owner, you know, there's an there's an agreement there that those two entities both will pay. So, it would take a number of units
to to generate the tax income to pay for a full-time. >> Do you know how many units does anybody have any idea what that number of units would be with given the average property tax? >> Right. I mean, you know, we have a fair number of affordable units. I think the
the difference is the way where that money goes is, you know, the way it funds a position. It's not, you know, we we couldn't have it go right to this position. So, you know, there there are different kinds of funds in a town like
enterprise funds or certain funds that could generate money based on services. The tax revenue from affordable housing just goes to the town's general fund. It doesn't we can't send it to the trust fund, you know, or this or this position. And so it's really difficult
to to kind of, you know, itemize or, you know, kind of earmark those funds for this position. That's that'd just be part of kind of the general operating fund for the town um if that were the case. So we could draw on that, you know, like most salaries, but not specifically for that position.
>> So do they pay the 3% search charge for CPA fund? >> My understanding is if it's valued at over 100,000, they might. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Thank you, Nate. Appreciate those
responses. Any other questions for Nate. >> Seeing no hands raised, Nate, thank you so much. Good to see you. Appreciate your >> your help with this. >> Thank you. All right. So, we did it. We got through the
presentations. Um, I welcome feedback uh on or offline uh should you feel I'm taking too much time or too little time. Doing the best I can to keep us moving here. Um, the next item on the agenda is topics
the chair did not reasonably anticipate 48 hours before the meeting. I don't have any, but if anyone else has a topic that they needed to raise or a question, I'd welcome it now. Leah, are you saying >> I I just wanted to mention that in your meeting packet, which will also be
posted online, was the updated I think I called it the FY27 budget. Um, and it's the same form that you'd seen before, but we got the final numbers from the state match. Um, so it's just the number that's increased by I think it was 63,000. I can't remember the top.
>> Um, >> something like that. >> Just so you know, it's it's in that document now. Um, so that's our final number for FY27. >> Um, and then also I did Sean has agreed to come to the first meeting in January. >> Great.
>> From Mangano. So, he will that will be after all of the presentations before you guys discuss um discuss the proposals and he'll talk about all the debt questions that you have. So, that will be at that first January meeting. >> Thank you, Leah. I know that was
supposed to be during announcements and I forgot. So, I appreciate you >> coming up with that. Um but that is important. the the budget that Leah shared with us is uh pretty final so that you can get a sense that there's a few more dollars in
there for us, not uh you know three times as many, which is what would be nice. But um and Sean will go through that with us and answer any questions so that we're really clear before we start our discussion. So, thank you for getting him on board for that.
Ben, >> um I'm going to state the obvious and say reminding everyone of the 20 minute limit ahead of the presentations is a great convention. Thank you for that. I think that works very very well.
>> Thanks Bob. Appreciate Okay, great. Thank you. Appreciate the feedback. Um, well, if there are no other questions or announcements, >> I do have one. I just want to remind everyone that the next meeting starts at
5:30 because of the >> public hearing. >> Thank you. >> Public hearing next week. >> Yes. >> 5:30. Everybody >> remember that? >> It being open to the public comment. This is my first >> Say that. Sorry. Say that again, Jonas.
How is the public hearing different than just starting the meeting with allowing publics the public to come in and make comments? This is my first rodeo here. So, >> great question. I don't have I don't have the uh I don't
either. It's my first gave to you. >> So, so first off, it's a it's a posted public hearing. So, we have to do that as part of the CPA process. So sometimes there can be lots of people who want to
speak out in favor of a project or have questions or or just talk to you about projects they might support or projects they don't support. So it's an opportunity for the public to speak to you all directly and it's part of the process and um yeah sometimes there's
one or two people there and then then we have to wait till your next meeting starts at six. So, it's it's a designated amount of time, Dave. I'm forgetting. >> Well, you can't start your meeting until
six. It's not uh it's not designated, per se. >> Okay. I didn't know. Okay. If we had to have a a minimum amount of time. >> No, there's no minimum amount of time. >> Okay. Yeah. >> I will I will say in past years,
>> what's that? I'm sorry. It's kind of like an 30-minute open door and not close the door until 6. >> Yeah. In past years when there's been projects that have been, you know, of great interest to the community, we've had a lot of people come to these and
want their three minutes. And in some years, not very many people. >> Yeah. I I I feel like in my experience that the public comment um at the beginning of each meeting often relates to what's happening right in
that meeting whereas the hearing which is required um is you know through for for all things. So, if they've heard something, you know, two weeks before or something that's coming up, >> but I would expect some good Sorry, Dave. I would expect um some uh
>> some attendance next week for sure. >> You might also get somebody from a board or some someone related to one of the proposals coming and adding to what you heard from a nonprofit or or or whatnot.
So, >> yeah. >> Yep. Great. Thank you, uh, Angus. >> Yeah, just a a quick question. Um, for the I'm I'm thinking back to the general comment at the at the beginning. Um, do
we think we'll have the packets uploaded for the public in advance of that public hearing? >> Yes. Nodding. >> While we were online, Sam actually emailed me new instructions for a new link. So, I think we'll be good. >> Awesome. Thanks.
>> Thank you. Really appreciate that. Hi, Ellen. >> Hi. Sorry I was so busy taking notes um minutes. Um I I anticipate a large group um showing up for the public hearing next week. So I just recommend that we
do put a two or three minute time limit on speakers. Otherwise, not everyone may get a chance to express what they want and that might frustrate people. >> Yes. Yeah. Agreed. Yeah. And we'll um Lee and I are meeting tomorrow and we'll
try to organize who's doing that and how how we can ensure that. That's a great great point. >> Thank you. >> Yeah. >> All right. Well, I'll take a motion to adjourn. >> Oh, go ahead, Ellen. No, that's good. >> You brought this up at the beginning of
the meeting about the Jones Library. Um, will we have any more information about whether you get a chance to talk to Dave before the meeting or talk to town council or not before the public hearing
about whether or not this CPA funds are considered I mean would be considered addition to what the town has town council has already allocated, >> right? Dave, are are we going to have a chance to connect on that?
>> Um, >> well, let me just be clear on the on the on the public hearing. So, the public hearing is not um I'm not a back and forth with you all on the committee. It's really kind of a one-way street. >> We support the project. We don't support
the project. Give give them a lot of money, give them not much money, whatever people want to say. So, there isn't a lot of give and take at all. It's really >> there's no question. Yeah. >> Yeah. No questions. It's not a chance for you or staff to answer questions on the on the projects per se.
>> Um in terms of Yeah, we we can talk Katie. Um I want Yeah, let's talk offline and then we can bring information to that meeting. I I think I've gotten some guidance from the town manager on this
issue and so let me clarify that and then we can talk before that that hearing. I think it's going to be more straightforward than folks might think. >> Um >> I agree. >> Yeah. Uh so um let's talk here um and we
can email and then connect by phone and and and get a little more more guidance from the town town manager andor town attorney, but I I don't think it's going to be that complicated at all. >> I I agree. And so we'll circle back to
the committee. Um >> yeah, >> probably not in advance. Probably we'll just say I'll just share it at the meeting. Yeah, if I could give just one snippet on that, which is I think by and large it's up to the town council,
>> right? >> Um they they have the power to um to to you know to support this recommend this um this um request from the Jones
Library or not. But we'll we'll clarify that and we and Katie and I can can get a little more information, but it ultimately is up to the town council. >> Thank you. >> Awesome. Okay. Great. Any anyone make a
motion to adjourn 7:59? >> I move we adjourn. >> Second. >> All second. >> Excellent. All in favor? >> I. >> Okay, great. Thank you all. Really
appreciate you. >> Thank you. Take care. See you next week. All right. Have a good night. >> Thanks, Leah. >> Thank you.