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Nearly everyone we were expecting. I think >> we are recording. >> Thank you. Okay. Good evening. Seeing a presence of a quorum of all the bodies, but I am calling the June 8th, 2026 special

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meeting of the town council, CSSJC, and human rights commission to order at 7:33 p.m. Please be advised that this meeting is being held in person and that the remote option for members of the public is provided as a courtesy only. In the

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event of technology issues with the with the remote connection, the meeting will continue in person as scheduled as long as there is a quorum of the council present in the town room or through technological means. Chapter 2 of the acts of 2025 extended through June 30, 2027, the ability of public bodies to

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meet without a quorum physically present at a meeting location. Although we have a quorum of CSSJC in the room. Um but that is the only body we have a quorum in the room of. Um this meeting is being

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recorded and is accessible in real time via Zoom phone and as a live broadcast on Ammeris Media Channel 9 and at ammerismedia.org. At this time I will call upon each counselor by the name they have indicated that they would like to be addressed. This will indicate that we can hear you and you can hear us.

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Councelor Brevik >> present. >> Councelor Kenno Martin >> present. >> Andy Churchill >> present. >> Anna Deong Gothier >> present. >> Lyn Greimer >> present. >> Mandy Johanni is present. Councelor Lord >> present.

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>> Sam Mloud >> present. >> Pam Rooney is not here. Councelor Ryan >> present. >> Kathy Shane is absent. Jennifer Tub >> present. and councelor Walker is absent

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at this time. Um, I will now I now recognize the co-chairs of CSSJC to call upon each CSSJC member by the name they've indicated they would like to be addressed. This will indicate that we can hear you and you can hear us. Which

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one of you is doing it? >> Emerald Hannah. Erica >> present. Lette >> present. >> Deborah >> and I believe Bridgette was gonna join

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us online, >> but I don't not here yet. >> Okay. Thank you. And now I recognize um the chair of the human rights commission to call upon each human rights commission member by the name they've indicated they would like to be addressed. This will indicate that we

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can hear you and you can hear us. >> Okay. Um, Commissioner Clark >> present. >> Um, Commissioner Haggood >> present. >> Commissioner Khan >> present.

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>> Commissioner McClung, he's running late. He'll be here. >> Okay. >> And Parker, that's me. Yes. Commissioner Pelle, >> present. >> Great. Commissioner Tara Torina. absent.

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>> Okay, thank you. And I'm going back to Algra for another member. >> Bridget, if you could just unmute yourself and make sure that we can hear you. >> I'm here. Present. >> Thank you.

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>> Thank you. If anyone notices anyone an additional member come in, please call a point of information so that we don't we don't miss them because there's a lot of people to be looking at here. Okay. Um, if counselors or members of CSSJC and the Human Rights Commission have any

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technical issues, please let the council clerk know or call a point of personal privilege. There will be one public comment period during general public comment. If you are in the town room, please sign up with the council clerk to make public comment. If you are attending remotely, I will ask you to raise your hand in the Zoom application

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when we reach the time for public comment. Um, I just want to ask for patience from everyone. We have a lot of people we are managing tonight. So, um I will go through a little bit more after we finish public comment, but please be patient with us as we're going to be

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trying to manage hands appropriately and everything. Um so, we are now moving on to public comment. Anyone wishing to make general public comment who is attending remotely, please raise your hand in the Zoom application. If you are present in the

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town room and have not signed up with the council clerk, please do so now. Residents are welcome to make public comments on matters within the jurisdiction of the town council. The council will not engage in a dialogue or comment on a matter.

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I lost my script here. Comment on a matter um raised during public comment. Public comments are not reflective of the opinions of the town council. The First Amendment broadly protects individuals rights to address the government, to speak, and to express themselves, including their right to say

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hateful and offensive things. I am generally unable to shut those commenters down under the first amendment to the US Constitution, unless their level of speech falls within an exception articulated by the courts, such as fighting words, true threats to a particular individual, harassment of a

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particular individual, or incitement of imminent lawless activity. If a question exists as to whether a particular speaker is engaged in unprotected speech, I must defer to the principle of freedom of speech. Um there are two

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hands raised on Zoom uh of people who wish to make public comment. How many people in the town room have signed up for public comment? >> There's six. And I'd also like to recognize that councelor Rooney has joined us. >> Thank you. Councelor Rooney, can you hear us? >> Yes.

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>> Thank you. Um 6 and two is 8. Um, each commenter will have three minutes to make their public comment. Um, we will start with the town room. Evan Naymith. >> Evan, please come on up. State your name

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and where you live and make your public comment. >> Hi guys. Um, Evan Naymith, District 5. All right. Um, so I didn't have the heart to watch your deliberations last week, but my wife told me that you guys took 40 minutes to drag my name through

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the mud. Um, she told me that a counselor questioned my authenticity when using buzzwords like equity and progressivism. So, I just want to clarify. Um, back in college, I went on a public service trip to New Orleans, which had been devastated by Hurricane Katrina. For a week, my classmates and I

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lived in a gutted out elementary school in St. Bernard's Parish, just south of the Lower 9th Ward. We worked with Habitat for Humanity and built homes for America's poorest residents. It was life-changing. At the end of the week, I called my mom, who raised me by herself on a low income. I told her I was

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dropping out of college to volunteer full-time in New Orleans. I spent the next year of my life living out of that elementary school, sleeping on a cop. My only compensation was three meals provided by the Marine Corps who ran the camp. I quickly realized that the glamorous Habitat for Humanity work was

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the domain of the inexperienced college kids. The truly impactful work was gutting houses. In fact, the college kids weren't even allowed to gut houses because of the risk of black mold exposure. My crew and I, though, we could do a whole house in just one day. Occasionally, a homeowner would pop by while we were gutting their houses.

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Inevitably, we'd all start crying together. We'd hug it out before getting back to work with our respirators and wheelbarrows. By the time I left St. Bernard Parish, I was one of the five longest tenur uh volunteers in camp history. On my last day there, Lieutenant Derek Daart pulled me into

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his office. He presented me with a commenation all for building houses. Post New Orleans, I struggled with my own personal housing issues for a decade. Then my father-in-law died of COVID. He bequeafd to my wife the money

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to buy the Ammerst Woods house that that inheritance is a rare privilege. and we committed ourselves to pursuing ethical careers. We simultaneously reenrolled in college, both of us, in our mid30s. She studied public health and I studied public interest law.

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Instead of getting a summer job, I interned for Congressman McGovern, the district attorney, and the United States Attorney's Office under Joe Biden. My honors thesis advocated for using property law as a tool for anti-racism. My paper won the class of 1942

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humanitarian award from the honors college counselors. I appreciate that all of you chose to serve Ammeris, but I'm also trying to serve and most of your characterizations of me last week have zero factual basis. I hope you'll keep an open mind going forward so that we can find housing solutions that accord with those buzzwords,

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progressivism, and equity. Next week, we're back on schedule. I'll read an excerpt from CNN about mom Donny's housing policies. Then we'll discuss some hard data about the UMass off-campus population which has hardly increased in decades. Thank you counselors.

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>> Thank you for coming tonight, Evan. Um, next is Margaret Smith. Please unmute yourself, state your name and where you live and make your comment. >> I'm Margaret Smith and I live in District 4 and I'd like to speak about

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uh the issue of ICE in Ammerst and our response to it. Um, the grim news uh just doesn't stop coming. Reports of too many ICE and CBP agents acting cruy and illegally. And that's why I'm very grateful to everyone who worked to draw

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up the resolution and discuss it and pass it in this meeting and town council meeting urging that we hold uh Homeland Security agents accountable for breaking Massachusetts laws in our town should they do that. Um, I'm also grateful to

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Paul Buckleman whose executive order of March 3rd makes a good start toward laying out how we can act on the resolutions. What was proposed in the resolution? And I understood Chief Ting would be here tonight. Um, if he if he's not, I say I would have been grateful you here if

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Chief Ting joined us this evening since we're discussing law enforcement. It's essential that we have the guidance of someone with career law enforcement experience. Um, I The resolution urged that steps be taken to collect evidence of criminal acts committed by federal

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agents. And the executive order addresses this in part three, compliance with the law. But the executive order omits mention of the resolution's proposal that the town create and disseminate quote an accessible online

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tool for citizens to submit evidence. And I would just like to ask, why is this idea omitted from the executive order? Thank you. Thank you for coming tonight, Margaret Athena. >> Katie Lazowski. >> Katie, please come on up. State your name and where you live and make your

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comment. >> Good evening everybody. >> Can you check to make sure the mic is on? >> Okay, it was left on. >> There we go. Thank you. >> Okay, perfect. >> Hi everybody. I'm Katie Ldowski. I live in district 2 and I'm here speaking on

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behalf of you, but I'm representing dozens of folks who are involved in the Amorest hub of the Lucay immigrant justic justice network, a coalition of immigrant-led organizations that monitors ICE activity across Massachusetts.

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In your statement, Mr. Buckleman, you wrote that the Ammerst Police Department cannot commit in advance to a specific course of action in an imagined scenario. There's nothing imaginary about the threat ICE poses to our community.

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Immigrants are already living in fear, scared to leave their houses for fear of being targeted by federal law enforcement. Thousands of Massachusetts residents have already been detained or being abused, and some have died in ICE custody.

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The DHS has already injured and murdered people in the streets. The situation is not hypothetical. We are asking the town manager and the town council to take substantial concrete steps to protect Ammeris residents from the threat of ICE

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violence, including the kidnapping and deportation of our neighbors, our friends. We want clear specific protocols ensuring total non-ooperation from Ammerst police with ICE. I emphasize specific protocols because ambiguity

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does not make people feel safe. We also support increased funding and extended hours for crests who have been instrumental in providing security at our community safety trainings because we know that vulner vulnerable people are less likely to call the police when

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they think they might be deported for it and Crest offers that alternative. In addition, we call on Ammeris to network with other communities to advocate for the abolition of the existing 287G contract to end all collaboration between ICE and the state

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of Massachusetts. Every resident of this town deserves to feel safe in their homes, in their workplaces, and in their streets. This is an opportunity for the town of Ammeris to be proactive in defending the

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community that you all serve regardless of people's immigration status. We challenge you to cease that opportunity. Thank you for coming tonight. Katie >> Athena Arty Mcllum, please state your name. Come on up.

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State your name where and where you live and make your comment. again for one that I was very proud of when >> Sorry, I think the mic is off. >> Is the light on >> now? It is. >> Okay, it's very closer to the mic, too. Thank you. >> So, my name is Arty McCollum. I'm a

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District 2 resident. I am also a member of the Ammerst Lucay network. I am here to advocate again for the town council and the towns who work to support the immigrants immigrants nats. I also again continue to support the funding of

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crests at the full level as well as um again the other recommendations from this the SJJ SJCC. Again, I was very um proud of the town when Crest was created to again have up come up with some sort

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of alternative to the police because I know many neighbors do not feel comfortable feeling that being there. And so again, it's just another voice to add from the town to please ask you to do the job. Please support the immigrant neighbors to please support and you know the extension of Crest, more time, more

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people things. Thank you for your time. >> Thank you for coming tonight. party. >> John Bonafas. >> John, please come on up. State your name and where you live and make your comment. >> Good evening everyone. My name is John Bonafas. I live in District 1. Uh, you know, we're in a moment here where we

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have an authoritarian regime out of the White House that has unleashed a private army against our people, terrorizing people all over the country. That's where we are right now. And what

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I think many of us in this community are asking our town council and our town manager and our chief of police is to meet that moment to recognize that people in our own community are living in fear and in terror of these mass

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agents who disappear people from the streets who engage in kidnappings who engage in assault and battery who engage in illegal detentions putting tens of thousands of people in inhumane detention camps all across this country

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and yes who engage in murder. The district attorney of this region, David Sullivan, has issued a statement in January of this year making clear that no one is above the law and that if federal agents engage in unlawful

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actions here in this community, he will hold them accountable. Why is our chief of police not saying the same thing? Why is the town manager not saying the same thing? The resolution that this town council passed

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made clear that the town manager would be instructed to come up with protocols to ensure that when there are unlawful actions being committed by federal agents in Ammerst that the authorities in this town including the chief of

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police would carry out their duties to enforce state criminal laws. But we're not seeing that. We're not seeing that in the executive order the town manager issued after this resolution and we're not seeing it in the most recent memorandum submitted to this body before

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this meeting. So, we're here to urge the town council to ask the critical questions that need to be asked of the town manager and of the chief of police even though he may be absent today.

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>> He's in he's in the room. is here. And I'll just add, I'm glad the chief is here because as the chief knows, I was part of a meeting with counselor Brevik and counselor Churchill prior to the resolution being passed in February of this year. And the chief and his deputy

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captain made clear that they would not be engaging in any arrests of federal agents who engage in unlawful actions in Ammerst. they would not be engaging in any enforcement of state criminal laws against federal agents and they would

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pass the buck to someone else and I think the chief needs to answer to why that is their position. Thank you. >> Thank you John for coming tonight. Lisa Pierce Bonafas, please unmute yourself, state your name and where you live and make your comment.

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>> Yes. Can you hear me? My name is Lisa Pierce Bonafas. I am from district 1 and I'd like to first thank um those people who brought this joint committee meeting together because many people in our community have been asking questions

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about the executive order and uh especially where I work at Fort River Elementary that has been um affected by ICE uh activities. Uh we had a lot of questions that were not answered. So, I appreciate having this opportunity to

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ask some questions and I have a specific one. It comes from the the Ammerst Town Manager Executive Order. It's on the second page and it's the last paragraph where it says that townowned and

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controlled lands and resources um will the town will prohibit the use of its property including parking lots, garages, parks and other buildings including the interior and exterior areas of any parcel upon which a

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building is located. for staging areas, processing locations, operation bases for federal civil immigration enforcement actions. I work in a school and we're very concerned about ICE coming into our parking lots, coming

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around in our neighborhoods. And this isn't hypothetical. This is actually happening. So, I would really appreciate um an answer to the question, which is how are you enforcing that ICE will not be using these areas for staging areas

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or processing locations if they don't show up with a warrant? That's against the law. So, what is the police going to do in those situations? That's not hypothetical. It could happen tomorrow. and we as teachers need to know if our police chief and those there are going

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to protect the residents and their children in our town. Um the talk in the referendum and also this um memorandum only says that we will pass it to the next we'll pass it

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to the school committee. I'm sorry but this we don't have time in the schools to call the school committee and have a discussion about this. we need to call the police or we need to call loose, but we need answers and we need help and protocol and how to handle these situations because we love the children

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we work with and we love their families and as we welcome these families into our community, we need to protect them. Thank you. >> Thank you, Lisa, for coming tonight. Athena >> Marisol Bonafas, >> Marisol, please

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>> please come on up. State your name and where you live and make your comment and make sure the mic is on. Before you do, is this on? Yeah, it is. Okay, great. >> Good evening everyone. My name is Marisol Bonas and I'm a resident of district 1 in Ammerst, Massachusetts and

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a proud constituent of the trailblazer counselor Brevik. I am here speaking today in my personal capacity as a community organizer and youth activist in support of Ammeris taking bold action to protect our communities against ICE. I attend Columbia University in New York

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City. And this year, we witnessed a rampid amount of attacks on our immigrant populations. ICE came onto campus and detained a student at 6:30 a.m. in her dormatory in the morning. And families are being torn apart on the streets and ICE watch

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communities have been established, of which I am part of, as a college student with a whistle um to protect residents from being deported at any second. This is not a standalone incident. Around the country, college students are being deported at airport check lines, security checks, and simply on the

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streets as they go about their day-to-day lives. Many of my friends feel like they cannot attend a protest for fear that they will be deported. This should not be our new normal. Ammeris has the unique opportunity as a sanctuary city to take a stand to protect our immigrant communities

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because diversity should be a superpower, not the enemy. We must stand up to ICE and refuse their admittance into our city. And the Ammerst Police Department must oppose ICE officials and block them for their action. Ammerst police, you are here to protect us. You

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do not protect us with your overflated police budget. You do not protect us by pulling over our BIPO community members. However, you have an opportunity to protect us by standing up against ICE. And I advise that you take it. Thank you. >> Thank you, Marisol, for coming tonight.

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Dina Brooks Ballinger. Brooks, please come on up. State your name and where you live and make your comment. >> Okay, the light is on. So, I'm live. Okay. Brooks Ballinger. I live on Pot Wine Lane in Ammerst. Um and um I

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appreciate that the town council did pass a resolution um restricting ISIS activities and attempting to protect residents of Amoris from ICE abuses. Um and I appreciate that the town manager wrote up a directive uh following that

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um decision by the town council. I was troubled by the fact that um it was very vague and it didn't really tell me so what's going to happen. So, I have a couple of questions that are specifics, and I'm sure there's more that other people have have brought up as well. If

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ICE tries to enter a school building and there's a police officer present in the school building, what's the directive to that police officer? Does he just say, "Come on in, take whoever you want?" Because there's nothing in the directive that I understood that tells the police

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officer what to do. If that if that's not there, I'm guessing the police officer is going to do nothing because he has no directive from the police chief, from the town manager that he's going to stand up to a an ICE officer that's trying to get in. Same kind of

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thing. Um, if a resident is surrounded by ICE vehicles, by ICE officers in an attempt to abduct somebody, what does the police department do? In the town of Chelsea, a resident called the police chief of her town. He came, stopped the

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interaction, and drove her home in his car. I don't see that happening based on the directive and based on the statements that I've heard so far. So, those kind of situations, yeah, they're hypothetical. They haven't happened yet. Do we wait until some tragedy happens or

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do we like set a precedent right now that makes clear we're going to protect people before something bad happens? >> Thank you very much. >> Thank you for coming tonight, Brooks. Athena, >> that was the last name on the register, but I'd also like to note that Silus McClung, Commissioner McClung is joined.

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>> Okay. Um Ronnie, would you like to confirm that Commissioner Mlung >> Commissioner Mlung? >> Oh, you have to press the mic. Um there just ask if you can hear.

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>> Commissioner McClung, can you hear me? Are you there? >> Yes, I am. >> Okay, great. >> Thank you. Um okay. Um with no other hands raised. Um and no one signed up. Public comment. That concludes public

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comment. Um we will now move on to agenda item three. This is a joint meeting. The whole meeting so far has been joint between the town council, the community safety and social justice committee, and the human rights commission for the town

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manager to answer questions and provide more detail on statements and actions and action items included in the executive order issued by the town manager's office on March 3rd, 2026 as it relates to the interaction between town staff and federal immigration agents. And this is pursuant to charter

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section 2.8C. So, in accordance with the council vote, the town manager is here tonight to answer those questions and provide more detail. I just read the whole quote, so I'm not going to read it again. The manager will speak to briefly to the information that was provided

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prior to the meeting. After that, councilors and members and commissioners, members of CSSJC and commissioners of the Human Rights Commission will have the opportunity to ask questions. Our rules of procedure require that all discussion and debate focus on the agenda item being

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discussed. Therefore, committee members, I ask that you focus your time when recognized on asking further questions or seeking further detail on written responses related to the subject matter of the motion. Last week, we had some difficult

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deliberations as a council. Um, this may be the case tonight, but it may not be. But I want to remind counselors and other participants that our rules state that participants may speak when recognized. That they may not interrupt a speaker who has been recognized except if raising a per a point of order or a

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point of personal privilege. And that discussion shall be respectful and focus on the subject matter of the discussion and shall not include comments that focus on the character, motive or some other attribute of the person making the con the argument. and that participation

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participants should address comments and questions to the providing presiding officer. I will do my best and I have um let all the chairs of the three committees know that I am going to recognize people um when we get to that

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part by the order they've raised their hands in accordance with the rules which means if you raise your hand after you've been recognized a first time and there are people behind you that have not yet been recognized to speak at all I will pass over you to the people that have not spoken yet. Um, I'm going to do

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my best to keep a list, but but I ask for some patience. Um, okay. With that, I am going to turn it over to the town manager. >> Thank you. Um, and thank you for to the

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council and to HRC and CSSJC for the opportunity to to share information and and address questions that you've raised. Um many people in the community have been directly impacted or many and many more have expressed concern over

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the actions of federal government in the past 16 months and it's something that we all are feeling. So I think that that and and the question tonight is what is the role of local government and local police agencies that I think those where the where the questions were gathered uh

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as a local government. What do we what do we do about that? So, as a town, we have been outspoken and clear about our values as a community. I believe we were the very first town, I don't know if there was any other town that has passed an executive order order like we have. There are other cities that have done

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it, but not a community of our size. We're clear that we protect civil rights. We strive to treat all residents and each other with dignity and respect. As a town, we also have an obligation to respond to situations that are legally accurate and and

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operationally responsible. You have asked many questions and we have tried to answer them in a comprehensive way. Many of them don't have clear they may have clear answers but we um aren't giving we aren't responding to hypotheticals.

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The goals of the questions is to understand and qu and question how things would play out with some predictability. Many are drawn from observations and situations in other communities that we've all witnessed. Um I ask myself that question when I see things and I usually conclude that I

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don't know all the facts in a situation but we know what has happened and transpired and often on video which is incredibly disturbing. I realize that it may be frustrating to not have specific answers to specific questions. As public officers, we

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continue to educate ourselves and our staffs to assess situations, collect information, follow applicable laws, and exercise professional judgment um based on the totality of the circumstance. Now, that sounds like a bunch of gobbleygook because it's it's it's a

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very broad statement, but it's it's the reality of the world that we live in. every situation is different and there's a lot of judgment that's that's involved and um I think it's really difficult and and welcome to engage in this conversation about the spec specificity

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of responding to to a hypothetical situation. It's it's just because we never we don't know all the facts. Um but I can tell you two things. Um municipal municipal employees do not participate in the enforcement of federal immigration law. We've been

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clear about that for a long long time and this committee is not unique to this last few years. It's been um for decades. And second, town staff are committed to supporting residents who may be affected by federal immigration activities. And that takes the form of communicating, providing support,

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however that works out. Um, I want to recognize that tonight I'm joined by our chief of police, um, Gabe Ting, that we're joined by our DEI director, Pamela Nolan Young, and by our crest director, Camille Theak. We were all signators to

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the town manager statement that you're going to be talking about tonight. Um, one other person will sign on in the future. Um and that's our uh director of public health who has also um wants to be more involved in this issue because

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he sees this as a public health matter as well. Um in past statements I've included the superintendent of schools but we were anxious to move this out very quickly and the super and the schools have followed their own path in many ways but we are in good communication with them. So we can talk a little bit about that if you would

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like. Um, so with that, I'll if there are questions or clarifying questions, I don't know how much more clarification I can give you, but we'll give our do it our best. And if there's things that we can learn and go back and take to you review what we have done, we're open to that as well.

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>> Thank you. At this time, I will now open the floor up to uh questions and comments from counselors, uh, CSSJC members, and human rights commission commissioners. Um, please use, if at all possible, the

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raise hand function on Zoom. Um, I hope that will allow me to recognize people in the right order. And for those in the town room, when you speak, you have to push the button and hold the button that says push down to keep your mic on. Um,

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various mics have various sensitivities. Some have to be really close to your voice and others do not. you'll find out the first time you try it which which kind of mic you have. Um but but please um use your mic so that we can ensure

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that everyone not just in the town room but also um watching this on Ammerst media and um in the Zoom application can can hear you. Um, with that, um, if you don't have a computer with you and you're in the town room, just wave

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and I will try and catch you in the correct order. Um, okay. So, and I will do my best, but thank you for for asking that question. Um, Chair Parker, uh, we will start with um,

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Commissioner Pai. >> Uh, yes. Um my question uh uh is for the town manager. Could you please walk us through the process on how you arrived at the word hypothetical? I feel a

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little bit confused about that >> town manager. >> So hypothetical means what would you do in this situation? Um and I think not knowing all the facts and all everything that would be involved with that situation uh is very difficult to give a

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render a judgment. We what we re um base it on what we um hold to is what with the training that we have given to our police officers and crest um responder community responders and the kinds of responses that they are trained to

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respond to. and we hope that they and we expect that they would be um communicating with their superior officers or or with the director of crest in terms of whatever the situation is. So yeah, I think think I think hypothetical sort of explains what it

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is, but that's our our feeling on it. >> Thank you, Councelor Brevik. >> Thank you. And yeah, thank you so much. Um grateful for the answers you provided, Chief Tingham. grateful that you're here. Is there an opportunity for

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us to ask questions of both Chief Ting and >> So, what I will say is ask a question and I will I will recognize then the town manager who can then pass it on to the chief if he thinks it's better for the chief to answer. Okay, >> perfect. Okay. I wasn't sure just how

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that would Okay. >> Um, so my question follows Jay's a little bit um because I think It was noticeable that there was a good amount of space dedicated to explaining this idea that the APD doesn't create

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policy or procedure based on hypotheticals or imaginary scenarios or speculation. And I think what it's it's possible what you may be missing about the questions that are in this area is that I think people are looking to learn more about how you do

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create policy. how maybe how you have created policy in other areas of policing. Um since I imagine you don't, you know, I I imagine there are policies around things other things that have never happened here in

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Ammerst. Um and that we don't typically wait until a crime has been committed to create policy around it. So for everybody's benefit, I think it might be helpful to hear more um about that. You know, one commenter asked, "What will you do if ICE violates

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our sanctuary bylaw? What would a police officer do if ICE entered a school when they were not supposed to be present?" Um, so I don't think anyone's asking you to develop a policy here on the spot for those things, but I think there's interest in knowing how you will establish policy and whether you have plans to do so in

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this case. >> Town manager. >> Yes. So, okay, if we bring staff up to the table, I would say, you know, Chief Ting, and I'll go there and if um Pamela or Camille, if you wanted if you have things you would like to add, feel free to come up at your discretion.

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>> Thank you. This is the chief of police sitting at the table now. Chief Ting, please make sure the light is on and speak into the mic. Thank you. >> Thank you everyone for having me. I really appreciate uh being here this evening to have an opportunity to

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discuss this issue. This is an issue um that affects all of us as community members. Uh it specifically affects the police department as well simply because you know all eyes are on us in terms of looking at enforcement and how this gets measured out. So to answer your

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question, Council Brevik, uh in terms of creating a policy, we do have a policy. We have a policy on dealing with uh our immigrant community and it's been a long-standing one and it's one that um it's certainly it's it's on our website. It's open to anyone to take a look and

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evaluate and we are always open for new ideas. So when we establish a policy it's not specific to one particular entity for example ICE you know our policies are generalized towards every

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single entity. And that way we can specifically respond to any situation within that policy. So it's kind of no different than if if uh state police has an operation, another federal agency has an operation. When we participate, we

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follow our policies and our guidelines that pretty much gives us a general framework of how we're going to investigate a particular matter. Uh what what other part of the question did you have? Is there something

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for Prebe? >> I think you were geared it towards uh policy creation. So we do have a policy on our immigrant population. >> Followup councelor Brevik or not yet you can you can wait. >> You want to add?

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So again, I think what we said previously is that we we try to develop policies in response to things, which is what the executive order tried to do is it sort of addresses these concerns and establishes what the values of the town are and and it was concurrent with the

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town council's uh resolution as well. What we've what I've tried to do and what we I mean I really credit our team for drafting up the executive order. uh we try to align our executive order with the action of the governor and you know

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there's a and we're going we're reviewing it right now because the governor issued additional guidance on May 28th that had much more specifics in it that was actually quite helpful for certain areas like daycare centers and things like that and so we're evaluating that with our town attorney see what

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else we can do if we there's something else we should be adding more clarity to our policies but we haven't really gotten that to it it hasn't been reviewed enough to be able to be published or anything like that at this point in time. >> Thank you. >> So I think I think that it's really

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helpful because I think it is a different framing than what was kind of put forward in some of the answers to these questions and I think it is a more helpful framing. Um and I don't want to take up too much more space from my colleagues but I I just I think especially since some of these things

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are coming down from the state level too. I think that is what people want to know. How will you enact? What are policies that are forming um or that are adapting to the current moment? For example, somebody entering a space that

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has now been deemed by the state, by the governor, by the attorney general to be a space that ICE cannot be in you. So, that is now no longer something that you're you know, your your previous answer was that's a hypothetical that we can't answer. But, but then you're saying you do have policy. there's

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policy coming down from the state level. So you should be then able to answer what you would do in that case. >> Yes. So so what we have done in the existing executive order is to say that you can't gather on these in these locations. I think we somebody we've

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read that already where you can't have you know you can't use the town's parking lot. You can't gather in public areas. I think the the governor has more detailed guidance on that and will that will inform where we want to go. Um, and I also just want to be clear that, you know, as we learn more, this is an

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unprecedented situation. This is really like um just like federal government just we all know what the federal government is doing and we're trying to res respond in real time with what's going on and we're trying to maintain

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the allegiance to our the rule of law and our training and our practices. Um but also just um you know we really rely on guidance from the attorney general's office and from the governor's office. I'm not looking to reinvent the wheel

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here um or invent the wheel. Um but I think it's we there's a lot of lawyers that we talk to I talk to on a regular basis at the attorney general's office where they're always um connecting with us to say what's going on in your community, what have you seen, what have you heard? And we try to stay in tight

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alliance with our federal with our state partners who are the ones if there is an action here. They're the ones who are going to bring action against against ICE which is what they what they they're learning from their colleagues in Minnesota and other states. They're in tight communication with them and they

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are guiding us on what we need to produce. And what they're telling us we need to produce is observe, document, you know, and record everything that's happening as much as you can because that's going to create the framework for any kind of response at the local level.

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What they have told us is one of their strongest arguments is that ICE activity is infringing on the local government, the police departments of the local government doing their job. So if there are resources from the police department being diverted to manage an ICE

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situation that is their struct I think that's why am I saying this out loud? I don't want to give people guidance on how ICE might respond to things but their sense is that the more documentation we can provide the stronger their legal case is going to be.

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>> Thank you. Um, Commissioner Khan. Oh, wait. >> If I can just add one thing. I apologize. These are unprecedented >> and certainly with uh jurisdictional issues. This is something that that uh local state and law enforcement along with federal has never really faced

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before. And I think this gets lost in translation with the general public. There is a belief that us as a local, we're a local police department. So, we have to abide by state and local laws, not federal ones. Okay? So federal agencies when they are in operation they

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it is a federal jurisdiction. So they have total jurisdiction no different than if the state police comes in and they they uh have some type of operation that's state police jurisdiction. So those lines become really blurry under

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these times in terms of what is considered a violation or not. So, thus far, the guidance that we're receiving from the attorney general's office is not to say that we would not, when I say we, that includes the attorney general's office in the Northwest District

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Attorney's Office, that we wouldn't try to prosecute that. We're not a prosecuting a agency. We're an enforcement agency. That's one part of the puzzle. The next part of the puzzle is the prosecution team. Is it prosecutable because of the

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jurisdictional boundaries? And so I think that's a lot of the questions that that I'm hearing from the general public is if something happens in real time, you know, are we going to go in there and make a physical arrest? So the

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answer is probably no simply because that can be construed as interference or obstruction of justice. That's something that we cannot do. We cannot break the law to try and enforce the law. So, there's other means to apply a criminal complaint, and that's through the

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Northwest District Attorney's Office and through the Attorney General's Office. As the town manager had indicated, we would do that by observations, reporting methods, and whatever other investigative methods, and we would take that information, and as I as I heard

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from a commenter that we're passing the buck, it's not passing the buck. It's a collaboration. So that information will be transposed to those prosecuting agencies and they would make that decision if that's something that could be applicable or not. >> Thank you, Commissioner Khan.

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>> All right. Thank you so much for um you know having us um come and address this. Um I have two questions and the first one actually follows on as to what uh the policym and I

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want to concentrate on the town of Amherst as to what we are doing as policy wise we totally understand the federal pressures and we are you know my all of you are not superheroes are totally understandable but uh th this

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question is the two questions so they will follow on and I'll try to link think both of them. How will residents know if the policy is working? That is the question. And uh what measurable outcomes will the town use to determine whether the executive order so again as

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you will notice in my second question I'm focusing on the executive order because this was done by our town counselors is successfully protecting civil rights, maintaining public saf safety and preserving community trust. So there is no published document that

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appears to identify performance measures or benchmarks. So that is my first question. And the other one is the this is the quote um unquote from the executive order federal immigration agents to be held accountable for

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violations of Massachusetts criminal law. So basically it is there's a contradiction happening over here. That is the title of town council resolution. uh itself is you know a little bit provocative and it it is basically suggesting the

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possibility that federal agents could be investigated or prosecuted under and basically that is not happening under the Massachusetts law that there's this possibility that is coming out of that statement and it also raises legal

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questions about federal authority immunity jurisdiction and enforcement. Now, the question is, under what circumstances does the town believe federal immigration agents could be subject to Massachusetts criminal

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persecution? >> Thank you. Um, town manager or chief, do you have a response at this time? >> And so, uh, >> please speak into the mic. So yeah, that's that is that's the

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dilemma that we're facing right now in terms of achieving that goal. We've heard messages from our from our government leaders specifically stating that you know we will prosecute when I say we the state of Massachusetts will prosecute any violators whether they're

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federal agents or not. But it doesn't specifically talk about what those measures mean in terms of how that's meed out. And that's where we come into play the Ammeris Police Department. I think there's a misconception that we're going to go out there and put handcuffs

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literally physically and place an agent into custody if we perceive something as a violation. The problem with that as as explained was that that could be construed as obstruction of justice. So what happens is the federal agents will

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end up arresting our police officers for obstructing their duties. So there in lies the dilemma. That doesn't mean that somebody cannot be criminally charged. That just means that the physical act of actually going in there and interrupting

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that specific operation is not going to happen. >> Town manager, if >> I can add to that. So I think the important thing what we try to say is that we will collect information. We will document. We will observe. You'll have police officers and crest responders observing so they can be

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witness to what's going on. The town doesn't prosecute people. it's the district attorney or the attorney general. Um it's really it's the district attorney typically and we included his statement in our executive order to say this is what he has said he would do. So we're relying on that statement. I don't know if he's ever

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done if he's done anything with it but the fact that he came out and said that and I think one of the commenters said that wasn't significant to us. So that's why we include it in the executive order. And our our job, like any police job, is to collect the evidence and then present it to the district attorney who makes the judgment on whether to bring a

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charge. Um the attorney general looks at it a little bit differently. I think from our conversations, they're looking at a more global approach to things and like how is this affecting how many communities in Massachusetts so they can bring it to a higher authority versus an individual police officer.

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>> Yeah. >> Thank you. If I can just add one last thing, uh this isn't this isn't a situation that's localized to the town of Ammeris. This is statewide. You know, every community in Massachusetts, every police chief, every law enforcement

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agency are facing these same questions. You know, I have constant communications with the Mass Western Mass Chiefs of Police Association and the Massachusetts Police Association, and we have asked the attorney general for this specific guidance. how do we act because we

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cannot jump in there and end up committing obstruction of justice that would be that just can't happen. Um so that guidance has been what we have so far. So, it's ever evolving and as the town manager mentioned, Mara Hilly has

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had uh put out some additional um instances and and guidance and that's that's continuing continuing continuing, excuse me, to evolve and progress. Um and unfortunately, that's at the that's at the status that we're at. >> Okay. Thank you so much. Thank you,

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Commissioner Parker. So I would like to begin my comments on a more personal level. Um I want to thank you also because I know you all got um this is the town manager and staff got 30 questions and you had to

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put it together somehow and try to answer them. Um I'm also grateful to the residents who showed up because civic participation is really really important. It's a fundamental human right. Uh without it, we won't have a good society. That's my lecture for the

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day. Um for the record, I also want to note that there were a number of questions that were not answered that were rather specific. For instance, the flock camera on Route 116 and Sunderland Road. So, I'd like to know the answer to

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that question. Uh I know others will raise other questions. So, I would like to say that since last fall, I don't drive very much. Um, I don't even drive one mile over the speed limit. Um, so if you see cars backed up behind a big

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black car, you'll know that's me. Although I try to be sensitive and pull over every time I see it piling up behind me. And why is that? It's because I learned that stopping people on the road is one of the most common ways that law-abiding citizens like myself can get

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pulled into a system that will eventually label me a criminal. Stopping me for how I look also is not a crime according to the Supreme Court of our country. So yes, I'm afraid. Every time I get into the car, I first

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make sure that I do indeed need to drive. Is there another way to do this? Then I check to make sure the Lucay hotline is on the screen of my phone. So if I need help, I don't have to search for it. I can just press the button and

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call for help. I have a copy of my passport in my wallet. I'm supposed to be safe. I've been a citizen for more than 40 years. I'm a person who's never violated the smallest laws. Excuse me. one who has

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also contributed my time and capacities as a volunteer since I was 16. And I can hire a lawyer if I need one. I can afford to hire a lawyer. Still, I'm here today to tell you I do not feel safe because I'm not safe because of how

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I look and I'm not alone. So, I'm very sensitive to the idea that our fears are hypothetical. That really touched something in me. Not real, but imagine scenarios not worthy of a response. Imagine how much worse for the Amoris

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residents with legal status who have their status revoked arbitrarily, then reinstated, then revoked, deadlines changed, reporting requirements changed, etc. The state office for refugees and

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immigrants recently advised as you know it's not easy to get asylum to begin with. They they advised them that they should check into their accounts every it used to be that they would advise that they should check their accounts

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every few weeks to see their status with our government because things change so fast and for no reason. But recently they said check every single day not only because things change fast but because deadlines are very short. So all

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these include all these individuals including many enamored some who I know a town packed with people from all over the world who are students and fa students and faculty farm workers and small business owners. They're all vulnerable.

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What is the town's obligation to these individuals? I'm not asking the APD to confront our federal agents, but I think we need to really get our act together. We need to think, not just among town staff, but we've got a group of experts

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here on safety, the CSSJC. Why not consult with them before an executive order goes out about issues like this? Anyway, the comments and questions presented to the town manager and our safety departments, the APD and

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Crest boil down to this. Is it the policy of the town to hold federal immigration agents accountable under the law? There's no need to get into hypotheticals in order to answer this question. When town resident what town

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residents need to know is whether as a matter of policy the town will take action against immigration agents who are acting beyond their authority who are breaking the law federal, state and local law or otherwise endangering the

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public. This means no more than applying the town's police policing authority, the very same authority that is asserted in every other local circumstance to federal immigration agents. Breaches by these agents might include conducting

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raids while wearing masks, entering non-public spaces without judicial warrants, pursuing or detaining people without probable cause, including threatening to imprison or deport individuals with no criminal record. disturbing the peace and using excessive

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force. Clearly, excessive force that we can see and that has been documented. Underlying this use of the town's authority are its police powers under the US Constitution, federal and state laws, and the town charter. Asserting

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these powers would mean a refusal to accept the unprecedented broad the unprecedented broad claims of authority and immunity by the current administration. Claims that have been and are still being litigated. In other

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words, not accepted as matter of settle law. Federal authorities such as DHS can assert the preemptive authority of federal law visa v state and local law. But Ammerst is not required to accept those assertions at face value. Indeed,

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the presumption should be exactly the opposite that those assertions of power are bogus, not justified under the laws and made in bad faith. So the question really is whether Amoris will do the maximum possible within its authority to

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protect the public by preventing and punishing lawless action by federal immigration agents carried out in the town. Even if this means challenging armed ICE agents, police forces around the world confront armed malifactors all

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the time. Should we expect expect any less from Ammerst and its police force? I encourage you to discuss with the community to come up with leaders who live here and have thought about these issues to come up with what we're going

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to do. I don't think it's within town staff alone, great as they are, of course. Thank you. Before I go to the manager or the chief to see if they have any response, I want to remind the public and our members sitting up here to please silence your cell phones.

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We've had a couple go off recently while while people have been talking and it is a distracting. One of them was yours so please silence it manager. Uh is there any response before I recognize the next person with a raised

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hand? >> So coun commissioner really powerful. Um, it's something. So, as I think about this, we got we have a police force, right, that has guns and they have authority to do

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certain things. And what you're saying is we should use this police force to do certain things along this lines. And that's sort of out of training for what the police department has been doing. I'm not an expert on on police departments, but I mean, I hear what

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you're saying and I I have that impulse as well. Why don't we go there and stop it? And I and talking with our town attorney and with the attorney general's office and and town staff, that's not

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the with my hat on as town manager, that's not the responsible thing to do for the town of Ammerst, the government of Ammerst, because um it's might not be legal and that would be a liability situation for the town and my job is not

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to create liability for the down. Um, my personal impulse, I understand what you're saying and I I I I hear what you're saying. I don't know if I can ever fully understand what you're what you're feeling and what you that sort of

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um, you know, I remember um, racism is real in in our country. I remember talking with the fire chief once and um and he said there's not a day that I don't leave my house that I'm not reminded that I'm a black man and

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that um just because of something it happens during the course of the day. It's real and it's even in a progressive town like Ammerst, it happens every day. Something and for me it happened because I said he brought it to my attention. I said something that was insensitive and inappropriate and he brought it to my

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attention. Um, but I I think it's really a public policy question in some ways and that sounds sort of academic, but it's more what do we do as a government when we have a police force that can do all kinds of things and where what are the

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lines that we're going to draw for that police force? Are we and um what we rely on is is established law and practices and trainings that we have our police officers go through and our community responders as well. But what's

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challenging is that this is such a different situation now. This is the federal government doing things that are way outside the bounds of anything that anybody ever anticipated and we're struggling with it. You know, we're trying to do the best we can and we're open to learning to do better. We look

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to our co our comm other communities that are doing are facing the same things. As the chief said, nobody's got the right answer as far as I can tell. Uh we see some communities more progressive on certain things like Somerville or Chelsea. We see a lot that

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are like not involved at all. You we're trying to find our way along the way. And so I think um helping I think you're right. Having people help us think this through is a is a good thing. We're open to that. >> I heard a I I will I wanted to follow up because you asked a question that I

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didn't hear a response to. So the flock the flock cameras. Is there a response to that? >> Yes. So the I don't believe it's it's I don't know if the company's flock or not. That's a traffic. >> It's a it's a traffic cam. So we confirm that with Guilford Moing the DPW

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superintendent that that's a uh camera intended for traffic purposes. So it's not for surveillance. >> So if I can just clarify. So there are um the town doesn't have we have a surveillance bylaw. So the town can't put up these cameras without permission

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from the council. Um, but there are cameras that look at traffic. They don't record anything. They just see, is there a line of cars there? Okay, turn green. That that car those cars should flow through. I'm not sure where this where this camera you said on Sunderland Road. And so, um, we we looked at it. You

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know, we talked with the dire the superintendent public works and the police chief and they didn't know who if it was there. We don't know whose it is. >> Commissioner Parker. >> So, it's in the town of Ammerst. It's not asking for any violence by anybody. Shouldn't we know whose it is? And

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shouldn't we know where that data is going? >> So that could be a mass dot camera. Uh that's something we can certainly inquire to. >> Yeah. If we just need we can talk afterwards, but if you give us the actual location, we will dig into it. We

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looked up Sunderland Road and >> at 116th. Yeah. Okay. >> Yeah, that's probably Mass Dot, but not possible. We will look into that. So, you're saying it's at the intersection of Sunderland Road and Route 116? >> Somewhere there. >> Okay. >> Um, I want to be sure we know where the

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data from this camera is going. And just to be clear, this is not your typical traffic camera that will take a picture when you go through the red light or something. This is a surveillance camera. This is a camera that's constantly watching who's going and it can photograph your license plate and

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track where everyone is going. >> So, we can try and figure that out. But the answer is not ours. >> Please don't interrupt and until >> Apologies. I thought you were done. >> Are you finished? >> I just wanted to say one more thing and this was this is about your response

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Paul that I do believe as you say everybody's going to the attorney general's office or to higher levels of police authority. I don't think you'll find the answer there. I think that we have an amazingly well-resourced community here and really

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have to work a lot more lot harder with us. Not that I know the answer but I know there are lots of people here who understand more about the fear and in the end I think it's all about that how how can we go about our lives without being afraid and I think the solution is

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somewhere here among the people who live in Ammerst that is not done. Thank you. Um so ju just um one thing that has heartened me has been my relationship with with the um attorneys at the attorney general's office. There are a

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lot of attorneys who are really focused on it and it's I'm so happy I live in a state where they are all in sync and they're trying to develop legal strategies and tactics to interrupt this kind of behavior. They're really they have the same issue that we have in

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terms of federal jurisdiction overriding state jurisdiction, but they are really smart people who are really working this through and trying to think of angles and opportunities to interrupt the behavior that's happening. And and I think having the governor who's a former

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attorney general who's also an attorney is a help help to that. But this is really coming from the attorney general's office. My experience from the people I'm talking with. >> Thank you. I want to thank the four people who have had their hand raised for a while for their patience as we work through it. So we are going to go

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to Deborah Deborah Ferrer. I just want to know that Emerald Henry also wants to talk. >> Oh, thank you. Yeah. All right. Well, thank you so much um Chief Tang and Paul for answering the question so far, but

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you know I I'm going to go as what Ronnie just kind of talked about. Ronnie Parker just talked about um our people are getting impacted, right? They're getting deported. They're getting harassed. Immigrants are getting harassed in our town.

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People are afraid to go to school. People are afraid to go to the doctors, to go to the hospital. People are afraid to go to the grocery store. I know at least two people that have been, you know, arrested, harassed, violently by

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ICE, taken from our community and one has been deported and one is in a filthy detention center having to deal with all these abuses. So people are being impacted. That's what we're dealing with. So, if you if

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we have an executive order with no teeth, which is what you're telling me, we have an executive order with no enforcement, then it's it's not doing anything. It's just a piece of paper. So, the police are here to enforce. They enforce the laws. They're here to

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enforce and they arrest people. They arrest a lot of people as far as I know. But yet, there's ICE and federal agents that come in here and violate the law. They are violating the law. I'm sorry. That's what they're doing. They're

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violating the law and you all are seeing them violate the law and you all are just going to observe, take pictures, and document while people are suffering and being taken away violently to detention centers and then deported. Is

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that what I'm hearing? That you're just going to take some pictures, but yet if I violate the law, you're taking me in. You're you're putting me in handcuffs and taking me to jail. Why aren't you willing to risk viol like making sure

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that they are following the law if you are a a a law-abiding place and if you are a a a police department who is here to make sure that people are following the law, they need to be held accountable.

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I'm sorry. So that's my first question. Why aren't they being held accountable? And I don't want to hear that it's because they're the federal agents. They're so on and so forth. No, you all could hold them accountable. You're choosing not to hold them accountable because you don't want to be arrested or

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what have you. But guess what? There's people that are that are are being violated right now. So why are their lives more important than your lives? Why are their safety less important than your safety if you're here to enforce the law? First question. and I'll go

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into the other two questions that you all were given before this. >> Any response, >> Chief Ting? >> So, I hear what you're saying. Uh, unfortunately, we we have to abide by laws, you know, there's rules and I

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think we already described it in terms of prosecution. So, if we go in there knowing that there it's not prosecutable and that potentially the liabilities on the town and the police department and that police officer potentially

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violating a criminal act in the eyes of the federal government, you know, those are risks that are that we can't do. So, I I understand I understand where you're coming from. However, it's a

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jurisdictional issue. It's a prosecution issue. We have to abide by these laws. We are a law enforcement agency. If we don't abide by the laws, then we are a rogue agency and we are not about to do that. So, I don't know how else to frame

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it. You know, I certainly I sympathize with what you're saying. I too am an immigrant. I'm a product of this community. I grew up in this town. I love this community. But I also have a job to do. And that job is to protect everyone and to work for everybody. So,

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you know, we have to abide by these rules and these laws otherwise we are not a legitimate institution. >> Deborah, I know you >> But how are you protecting the residents? You said you have to

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protect You're here to protect our residents and protect us. How are you protecting us by not arresting people who are not abiding by the laws? They're not abiding by the laws of our state and they're violating the laws. So that's

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why it's a contradiction. It's it's contradictory in terms of what you're saying. You're in one side. You're saying that you have to follow the laws, but you're not following the laws because you're not protecting us who are the residents in your town. So

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how do you explain that? You're protecting yourself, Chief Tang. >> So again, the attorney general and certainly the governor, they're the ones that outline our jurisdictional boundaries. They're the ones that outlined our authority. State law

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outlines our authority. At this point in time, it does not allow us to have that authority. I wish it did, but it doesn't. So that's something we have to abide by. No, certainly the the instance that you provided that if you were in violation, you would be arrested. That's

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different. You're not a federal agent. You are not conducting a federal operation. So, if you're in violation of state or local laws, of course, you're subject to potential criminal action. But if it's a federal jurisdiction, that boundary has been made and we

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cannot cross that boundary legally. >> Do you have further questions, Stepper? Well, yeah, I do, but I just want to end that. So, basically, they have protection to be criminals and they can do whatever they want as criminals and then us, we have no protection and you all cannot protect us. So, basically,

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this executive order does not protect us and and then I have yeah, I do have two more concrete questions too to go because obviously we're just going to continue to spin around, but I just wanted to make that statement that obviously an executive order with no teeth is just paper.

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Could you ask? >> Oh, yes, you you may. Town manager, >> if I could just say one more thing, you know, this community tries to support our community members as much as possible within our confines, within our control. You know, certainly we have we have our partners here. We have our DI

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department. We have our crest department. We are all partners in this. So, these are things that our community, our town can do to try and and help out our community members. Certainly, again, there's limitations. I I heard that there's members here uh who are partners

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with Lucay and certainly we've had a lot of discussions within our internal structures in terms of what we can and can't do. Um so there has been collaboration. We just don't publicize it as well as we probably should. But we

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are all in partnership here to try and support our community members. So these atrocities that you are talking about, we definitely we it isn't something that we defend by any means. You know, we are the Ammeris Police Department. We're not a federal agency. We care about this

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community. We're not a state agency. These people in this town are the ones that we care for. >> Thank you, Deborah. You have two more questions. >> And I do applaud Crest and DI for the work that they're doing. Obviously, it's after the hurt has happened. um

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unfortunately but a lot of times and sometimes preventative some preventative but you know I I I commend them. Um so one of the questions since the executive order states that no municipal employee officer or official shall obstruct

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interfere prohibit otherwise prevent the federal enforcement of immigrant laws including federal investigations enforcement operations of ICE detain detainers. This goes counter to what is stated in the TC resolution, town council resolution. Because what APD and ICE ask ICE why they are detaining an

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immigrant, especially since they are detaining immigrants based on racial profiling or detaining immigrants in violent ways in violation of their constitutional rights to due process or against their first amendment uh first amendment rights. So would you all even like ask them why they're violating or

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is that still something you you can't even do? town manager. >> I just want to understand the question. So you're saying >> so if you see something right, they're violating someone right there, right? The police are there doing the perimeter

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perimeter of safety to keep people out while I over there arresting someone violently. Would you all kind of at least say ask some questions like do you have an a warrant? Do you have probable cause? Do you have this that you know would some questions at least?

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Chief Ting, >> sure. We can certainly ask and they don't have the answer. That's the unfortunate reality. We have no authority over them. >> Okay. And >> we can ask, we can ask for whatever we want to ask, but I just wanted to be

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clear that they don't have to answer. >> Okay. >> So, I guess my followup would be I hope you all are asking those questions and documenting and recording and keeping data on that at the very minimum. Certainly, we we've had an instance last summer with ICE activity here. Uh that

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was something that we investigated to make sure that it was legitimate the best of our ability. Um and certainly that was documented. Uh that's the only instance that I know about in terms of ICE activity in town. You spoke of a couple other incidents. I have no

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knowledge of that. >> Oh, of at least two that that happened. Um, and then lastly, there was there was this last question that was submitted to you all. Uh, it said, "A recent article about Shootsbury New Project bylaw say public data in Massachusetts show an

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increase in ICE arrests from police stations pointing to direct coordination and communication. Despite having a 2017 sanctuary bylaw, the town of Ammeris is included in the study's list of communities that permit information sharing and collaboration between law

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enforcement and ICE. Please explain why this data contradicts the executive order and statements and presentations made by Chief Tang. Chief Tang, >> I saw that specific article in the indie and I'm not familiar with that data and

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if you you want me to explain that we have had uh collaborations with ICE. We have in the sense of U visa applications. We had two victims in our community that were uh on visas and in order for them to stay in this country,

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they would need a U visa to stay in this country to act as victims for the prosecution. So those are two instances that we did collaborate with ICE in order to obtain those U visas for our victims to continue their case in a

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court of law. But other than that, there's been zero collaboration with ICE. We have a strict policy on it and this policy has been in effect for decades. Long stay. >> So just to be clear, you all have not shared any kind of identifying

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information, have not shared any names, haven't shared anything in any way informal or formal with ICE. >> Zero information. >> Thank you. >> Point of order. >> Um that was Andy Churchill. Your point

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of order. Somebody just texted me to say to ask the chief if he could speak into the mic. >> Some of the people online can't apologize. >> You have a mic that does not pick it up as well as some others. Thank thank you for that point of order. Um we are going to go to councelor Ko Martin and then we

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will move to Emerald Henry after that. >> Thank you. Um yeah, some of my questions have been answered so I have less which is good. Um so I wanted to ask about the question of uh training. Um, so that was something that was addressed um in the

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document. I think a lot of us, you know, are grateful that we have um the current sanctuary bylaw, but um you know are wondering how well our officers are prepared um in order to adhere to that by uh to that bylaw. So I just wondered if you could mention um you know what

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kind of trainings there are. It says internal and external. So if external, what are the entities that provide the training and what are some of the modules like what's a typ what are some typical modules that would be in that training? Would there be practice? Would there be drills um you know of what they would do if there was an ice action? Um

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and then my question number two is um it's about uh crowd ensuring crowd safety. Um so that was another question. if there was like an ICE enforcement action in town. Um, it said that the APD would one of the roles of the APD would be to manage crowd safety. And I just

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wondered if you could elaborate more on what that means because I know many of us are really concerned and scared watching what's happening in New Jersey around Delaney Hall where it seems like the police and ICE are just brutalizing protesters left and right. So um can you explain how you would act in that

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capacity to make sure that um that our people who are peaceful protesters are not brutalized? >> Town manager or Chief Ting, >> I'll try and speak closer. So first and foremost, you know, we certainly condemn those actions, these other uh law

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enforcement agencies. We see the same type of videos that everybody else in the public sees. We're just as appalled. Um, unfortunately, we don't want to be just because we wear the same uniform, we have the same uh job description, we don't want to be grouped in along with

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those folks as well. Um, so in terms of our training, you know, I don't want to toot our own horn, but I think that we're probably the premier agency certainly in Western Mass when it comes to dealing with uh large crowds and protests. You know, protesting is

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something that's that's welcomed here in the town of Ammerst and that's something the police department welcomes as well. Anytime that there's some type of scheduled protest or you know it's our job to make sure that's a a successful one. So that's something that we are very proud of. Um in terms of training

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external and internal you know uh we go through a lot of mobile field force type of training and that's crowd control in dealing with agitators. Uh we regularly send officers down to a training center down in Aniston, Alabama, which is the premier training center for these type

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of activities. Uh we've also had back on March 9th, we had a tabletop exercise with Amoris College relative to uh ICE um involvement if they were to come to the college or to the town. That's another tabletop exercise that we are

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formulating for the town of Ammeris that we want to include our partners over at the University of Massachusetts, Ammeris College, and State Police because certainly those are agencies that we would call upon for mutual aid assistance if there was some type of ICE

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activity that we knew about or something that we responded to. So, we are we are in the process of uh designing that particular tabletop exercise. So it's continuous and again the information that we receive as this is evolving uh

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really keeps us on our toes to make sure that we are on the cutting edge in terms of what our policies are. >> Uh town manager >> I think uh there are a lot of protests I'm going to talk generically about protests. Sorry I have to do it this

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way. um about in terms of there are a lot of protests in town that we we appreciate when protest groups notify the town. The police tend to keep a low profile and be available but be alert. What we have been able to use is our community

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responders, the crest responders, who are seen as being less intrusive in some ways, but more but they are there to help the protesters get to where they want to go and have a very light footprint in terms of enabling people to

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exercise their free speech rights. Um, so I think that that's that's an important thing that that's another tool that we had that we didn't have before is having the cross responders available. Councelor Kennel Martin, do you have any followup before I move to Emerald Henry?

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>> Yeah, I guess I um I guess my only follow-up question would be um you know, sometimes ISIS's tactics are not matching the tactics that you describe. So, if ICE does engage in those tactics, would you be able to to protect or at least put a line between um peaceful

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protesters in Ammerst and and the ICE agents? Chief Tang, >> we would certainly do the best that we could. Um, again, just to address that uh particular I guess we're talking about

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hypotheticals. Um, the reason why I don't like hypotheticals certainly because for example, if we were talk to talk about a hypothetical, if an ice uh there was a nice operation in town and we needed mutual aid assistance, I don't know how many officers you would be able

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to provide me at that moment. wouldn't know how many officers Ammeris College would be able to provide me. You know, if it's on this part particular street, it would be a different scenario. If it was on this particular street, it'd be a different scenario because of a different neighborhood. So, that's why

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when we're talking about hypotheticals, these variables come into play. And for me to be come out here and say this is what I would do or my department would do X, Y, and Z, it may not necessarily be be exactly what we do. And I don't want to be held to that particular

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standard by answering a hypothetical and that's the reason for that. Um but to answer your question absolutely you know we would do the best that we could. You know our job is public safety and that's to ensure the safety of everyone involved. >> Thank you Erald Henry.

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>> Thank you Mr. Town Manager and Chief T. Thank you both for being here. I know you're speak closer to the mic. So, I I I hope you guys fully appreciate that a lot of these questions were born

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out of fear and concern. And I can also appreciate that um there's anger and I also appreciate your boundaries and your limitations. And that's one of the downsides of being an attorney um and

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working in criminal justice system. But there are definitive questions that are not hypotheticals that have been asked and I still don't think um that there have been very clearly um articulated answers. So one of the very simple ones

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was about the school um if ICE tries to enter a school and that is not federal property that is not state property that is Amherst property. So the question

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very simple question is um and I believe I heard that there was some deferment to school committee. I I hope that's not the official policy um because I know they will say call the police. There is no expectation that or or

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rather um I don't think anyone in this room or in this community wants to hear that an Amherst police officer was shot by ICE or by a federal agent. So that is not the outcome. But very simply for the community, if ICE tries to enter a

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school, what is the town's policy on that? >> Town manager, Chief Ting. So certainly the superintendent has laid out their particular policies in terms of how they are going to respond with

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their staff members. Um we have urged them if there's any type of ICE presence to call us and we would we would respond. Uh we pride ourselves in responding to every single call. Uh, a lot of communities don't do that uh, for a multitude of reasons, but we want to

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always make sure that any call that comes in the Ammeris Police Department that you receive a response from a police officer in person. Um, so we would respond, we would assess the situation, we would investigate, we want to make sure that those are actual

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agents. We want to make sure that they have the proper documents, warrants, judicial warrants, what have you for them authorized to go in there. So if they have the proper paperwork, again, there are boundaries. We cannot

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prevent them from going in there if they have the proper paperwork. That would be our job is to ascertain if they have that proper paperwork. But again, we can't stop them simply because it's a as much as we don't like it, it's a

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legitimate federal enforcement operation. So, we have to abide by those boundaries. But certainly, we would be there a to keep the peace and b to make sure that what they're doing is on the up and up. >> Any town manager?

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>> I have not heard many instances where ICE is going into schools. It's more monitoring outside where they're not like because our schools are all locked. They would have to someone would have to buzz them in or get in some other way. So, but I what our worry is more someone traveling to or from school being

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monitored that way. And I think that's where the danger truly is. Um, and I think again I think the chief is important like call 911 if you have any concern about anything and they will send an officer or a crest community responder depending on the situation

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whatever is appropriate to to the to your concern to address your concern. >> Do you have any followup? >> I I do. Yes. >> Okay. >> So I want to go back to um the presence of ice in Amherst. So yes, the public may

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have word of mouth. They may have text chain and they may be able to know that, you know, ISIS is here and I know they have no obligation to notify um well, usually courtesy they would, but I know they have no obligation to notify APD

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that they're here, but there are not that many entry points into the town of Amherst. So, has there been any consideration for the town to say, "Okay, let's have some checkpoints to verify who's coming in because one of

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the things that's very public information is they're coming in unmarked cars, their masked, there's no definitive identifier that they're law enforcement. Can you talk about um checkpoints to verify before they get here that they're legit?

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>> Chief Ting, >> sure. Uh we are limited in terms of to answer your questions in terms of checkpoints. Um, we do have a surveillance bylaw that prohibits um the police department from utilizing certain technology. For example, license plate

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readers um are used for checkpoints. If you go down the mass pike, uh it's going to read your plate to determine if if you're uh to pay your toll. Uh for example, that's one use. A lot of parking enforcement agencies use license plate readers, and that is a tool that

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could be utilized for a checkpoint, but it's prohibited. Um so to answer your question, you know, one thing you mentioned in terms of ICE calling us to notify us, they they would not and they do not. Um certainly they understand

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that we are a we abide by sanctuary policies. They want nothing to do with us. So they don't contact us. Unfortunately, that's one of the byproducts that when they do come into town, we don't know when they're here. We have no information. So a lot of

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times we rely on word of mouth. We rely on social media information that we hear from the general public because we don't have any connection. I'll give you another example. Last summer there was an instance that we had learned about from social media in Northampton. My

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first call was to the chief of police in Northampton to ask him, "Hey, what's going on in your community?" He said, "I have no idea." So he had to start digging a little bit and he got bits and pieces of information. he's in the same boat as we are that we have no connection with ICE. So, he was able to

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piece together a little bit of information. Ultimately, it's totally unconfirmed because we do not have that we do not have that connection. So, to answer your question in terms of checkpoints, we don't have a checkpoint. Um, I don't know how that would be done

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uh simply because we don't know when they're in town. >> Thank you. Any further followup? Yes, go ahead. >> I think you've heard that the the community seems to want or

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demand a greater action from the police. And again, I understand the limitations um when it comes to state, local, federal laws. If an officer is at Fort River and um and this is for the town manager and by

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extension the town council. Um if an officer is at Fort River and in their best judgment they think that ICE is doing something unlawfully and they intervene against you know again they think they're doing their

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job. They intervene they get arrested. What is the policy on defending that officer um who did their job? >> Town manager, >> we defend our employees and their actions.

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Period. And you know, we will have representation. We have insurance for this purpose as well. Um for any kind of action like that. If it's criminal or something they've done something that's criminal, then that that protection is is vacated. But our first our first

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impulse would be to provide legal support for the the individual. >> Anything else, >> Chief Tang? >> Sure. And I certainly appreciate that. You know, certainly we appreciate the support from our town government and from the town manager. The issue with

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that, Emerald, is if one of our officers was arrested and found to be in violation, let's say the proceeding went through, then even if the town supported that officer, the post commission would not. So that job, that police officer

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would be out of a job to answer your question. >> So essentially, so essentially then there's a balance in acts with the police. They know that, hey, I might think this is unlawful, but

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I can't do anything because one, by the end of this, I'm found to be in violation. I'm on my own. Is Is that the understanding? >> Chief, town manager. >> You're you're you're the attorney, but I

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think in a court of law, if someone is found guilty of doing something illegal, the court will render a judgment on that person. It's not going to be the town that renders a judgment and depending on what that judgment is, it might we'll have to review what the employment status of that individual would be as

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would post. >> One of the things that was >> Oh, sorry. Could you turn on Could you lean into your microphone? >> Thank you. Thank you. One of the things that Dave Sullivan said was that um the DA's office would prosecute um federal

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agents who he believes have committed a crime, but one of the things I've heard repeatedly is that um you guys will not arrest officers. And I understand why they do. And you don't have to arrest a person for them to be charged with a crime. >> Now,

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one of the key elements of any crime is probable cause. And for the officer to be prosecuted, that information has to be presented to DA's office by the police. What is APD's policy on that? >> Chief Chen,

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>> sure. So, in any instance where a police officer witnesses something that they construe as possibly a violation or a crime, they would utilize documentation. So the tools that are available at hand, whether it's a cruiser camera, whether it's their physical observations,

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whether it's witness testimony, they would gather all of that information, generate a particular report. So again, you are correct in saying um probable cause is a huge key in terms of the standard of whether that's a crime or not. So the information that we give and

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this is no different from this scenario to literally any other investigation. So we have to follow specific elements to satisfy the standard of a crime. And once we believe that that's satisfied, we file a complaint to the court system.

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And in this particular instance, the Northwest District Attorney's Office would pay specific attention to this and they would make a determination if those elements satisfy the crime. So, like you said, um it's not incumbent on the officer to necessarily physically place

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somebody under arrest to apply a criminal complaint. That's something that can still be done. And that's something discretion is huge within our law enforcement profession. There's circumstances as well. When we talk about hypotheticals, there's circumstances that will dictate whether

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we place somebody into custody or we just go with a summon, which is a criminal complaint. So, in this particular instance, it probably would be a criminal summon, but again, there'll be consultation with the Northwest District Attorney's Office to

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see is this applicable or not. And that's kind of how it works. >> La last one before we have to give someone else a chance. >> Um, very simply, um, very simple question rather. >> Does Amherst PD have the directive to

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say, um, if I find or there's probable cause. I have the authority to report this to the DA's office. And has there been any complaints reported to the DA's office about ICE operations or ICE behavior? >> The answer is absolutely. Oh, >> Chief Chen,

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>> apologize. Um, absolutely. If there's a crime that we suspect, you know, that's something that we're going to document. That's something we're going to look into regardless of who the suspect is. Whether it's an ICE agent, whether it's a state police officer, doesn't matter to us. as long as there's a violation or

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there's a crime of foot, that's something that we would document and we would report that. The second part of the question >> any recommendation? >> The answer is no because we haven't had any instances that have been reported to us.

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>> Thank you. Um I we're about at 9:15. Um I again want to thank people for patience. We do have another part of the meeting. There are three people who have their hands raised who have not spoken yet. And then there are three people who have their hands raised who have spoken

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yet have spoken. So I will go to those three after the first three that haven't spoken yet. But I just wanted to put that out there um so people can judge their time. We go to Andy Churchill. >> Um I I have two questions I guess or two areas to to

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address. The first is that um the the memo that was sent to us talked about not wanting to deal in hypotheticals, but then I've heard tonight that we have done some tabletop exercises and by their very nature tabletop exercises are

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responding. How would you respond to a hypothetical situation? So, I'm actually glad to hear that you that you are doing those tabletop exercises and that you're working with Ammerst College and hopefully the uh UMass PD also on those. So, um I think that might be comforting

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to folks to know that that it's not just a a blanket we're not going to deal in hypotheticals, but that we actually are thinking about how will we respond if we hear something, which I think a lot of people want to know. So, that that's just the point I guess I

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wanted to make. The other is that I was on a Mass Municipal Association Zoom um with other communities that are also everybody's trying to figure out how to deal with this. And so um one of the comments that was made was that you

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know in in cases where these situations escalate, there's not, you know, often the police don't know what to do because it's an escalating situation. they know that they have certain parameters within which they need to operate but they're

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not in a situation that um is conforming to those parameters. So, um, it was suggested that, you know, given that there's evolving guidance from the governor's office and from the attorney general's office that the attorney general's office is willing to have

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regional sessions with police chiefs. And um, I'm just wondering if there's been any efforts to collaborate with other, you know, to to get the chiefs together to say, "How are you dealing with this? How are we going to deal with this?" and to get the latest guidance as

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hopefully the governor's office, the attorney general's office gets clearer about what we what we can and can't do. So, I'm wondering about that regional collaboration in terms of training and uh as things evolve, >> Chief Ting.

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>> Yeah, absolutely. U Councilman, thank you for that question. it. We meet with uh the Western Mass Chiefs of Police monthly and quarterly we meet with the Massachusetts uh chiefs of police association which encompasses the whole

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state. So this particular conversation is ongoing and again you know I'm not trying to throw the attorney general's office under the bus but we have been pressuring them for more guidance and that's been slow. Um so we have been

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collaborating together. we have uh tried to make sure that we are on a unified front so that as agencies together we're all doing the same thing. Um that just hasn't truly materialized. It's unfolding and it's evolving. Um but to

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give you that definite answer to say that uh some of the questions that the folks have asked here if we're going to uh enforce in a certain way right now is where it's at. you know, we we are not going to cross those boundaries until the law allows us to. So, yes, there's

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been a lot of collaboration and in terms of um our tabletop exercises, you know, certainly hypotheticals are discussed within those tabletop exercises. You know, when I'm saying hypotheticals, I'm just saying in a public venue like this,

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you know, my words mean things and if I say something, it's going to be held. Um, and I don't want to give false information. So, that's my explanation for that. >> Further followup, Andy? No. Okay. Uh,

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that brings us to Algra Clerk. >> Um, hi. I just wanted to really acknowledge um Commissioner Parker and Deborah Ferrer, my co-chair, and

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the show of emotion that clearly um so many of our community members are feeling around this issue. And so I do have a few questions and one also stems from councelor Cono Martin's um mentioning of protests because I think we're glossing over a really large

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protest that happened in this town two years ago. There was a large police presence and APD was there, state police were there, UMass police were there, a few other agencies were there, 134 of us were arrested for protesting.

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Um, I was videoing because again we want to document what's happening and I was thrown to the ground and my phone was knocked out of my hand. So that's what ordinary people who are trying to stand up and document what's going on whether

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it's with local police, state police, or federal police agencies. That's what we're up against. And so I'm I'm wondering if APD is going to stand next to the protesters and document with their own recording devices or if if the

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onus is going to be on the community still to be documenting what is happening. Um because if it's not a risk that police are willing to take, it's a really big ask for the community and and some community members who might be

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putting themselves at greater risk. Um so that is my first question. >> Chief Tang. So within our policy at the Ambers Police Department, we do have an onus to document any type of violations. Again,

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whether it's from a police officer or from a citizen. So if that's something that was witness from an Ammeris police officer, that is absolutely something that we would document. Um in terms of determining if it was uh a violation or not, that's something to be hashed out

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certainly again with the U. district attorney's office and the other agencies involved if it was a police officer. Um so again that's a hypothetical. Uh yes, we were involved in there. We were asked uh to assist with perimeter security and

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that's something that we did. We specifically indicated when we participated that we were not to participate in any enforcement actions and we didn't. Um this is kind of a similar situation because I've been questioned on that particular instance

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before. So in the event of an ICE agent um an ICE operation here in town, we would we would ask for mutual aid response certainly from the university police department, Ammeris College and Mass State Police. So there is a collaboration here. They asked us for

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assistance. We gave them specifics to make sure that we were not involved in that aspect of their operation and they abided by that and so did we. So when we asked them to come and assist us, we have to rely on them as well. And if

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we don't have that collaboration, they're not going to come. Um we only have three officers and one supervisor on the road per shift. So, if there was an instance of ICE activity, it'd be all hands- on deck. We'd be calling people from home to come in, and that takes

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time to assemble. Um, if we didn't have the luxury of of calling our neighbors to assist us, >> Algra, a followup. >> Um, I did have just one other question. Um, and so I was not present, but I was speaking with a friend who was at a

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district three meeting uh recently, and it's my understanding that you had been there talking a little bit about um some immigration and other things around the police department. Um, and there was a a quote that said that Ammerst is not a

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sanctuary city and I just I wasn't there. So I a wanted to clarify whether that was said and if if that is what was said what was meant by that and if that is what was meant what can the APD do to change the culture and and

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be brought on board with the sanctuary bylaw. >> Chief Ting >> if I can answer that. Yes. So I'm the one that made that statement. What I specifically stated was that we have to be careful when we are saying that we are a sanctuary city because that information that's being passed on to

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our community members, they believe that they have absolute protection. Sanctuary means protection. And what I'm trying to explain is that they don't have that absolute protection. We abide by sanctuary policies. So the way that we operate as a police department is our

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policies reflect on our sanctuary philosophies and certainly what that means is no collaboration with with ICE agents, not stopping anybody solely on their immigration status and so on. That's put forth through our policies.

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That's what I meant by that. So I wanted people to be clear. I don't want to give the wrong message to our community members that you come into Ammeris and you are totally protected. That is just not true. So that's what I was trying to clarify in that.

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>> So I well we are a sanctuary community by bylaw. Um, but I think that that the chief's comment is really important because I I we I fear and sort of to Ronnie's comment as well that people will feel, oh, we're protected in the

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town of Ammerst. We know that you're no one is protected anywhere, even in churches where you used to have sanctuary any in, you know, courtrooms anywhere. We know that the activity of federal agents is has no

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bounds. So, we don't want people to feel like they are protected in some way um because it honestly it's just not true. You know, we can't control what's happening in our in when these federal agents come into our town. We can we

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have the policies and we abide by them ourselves, but it doesn't apply to other people acting. >> Any further followup? No. Okay. Um, Anna Derby, >> is that working? Hi. Um, I have a a

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quick comment and a question. Um, I'm here tonight as a member of the CSSJC. Um, but I'm also a member of the Amoris Lay Hub. Um, and so my my comment is, and I guess I'm going to shift this a little bit based on your last comment, um, town manager. Um I we've heard from

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a number of people here tonight um who are members of our immigrant community um who have expressed how they and their families and their networks and their communities don't feel safe here. Um and I just wanted to point out that um you've ever spoke to a couple of people who have actually been um detained, been

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kidnapped, been separated from their families who are now here missing family members. um but that in conversations with the community and trying to figure out how to make people feel safer. I've also heard um of three separate incidents of people self-deporting

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within the last year um specifically because they feel like they don't have that support within our community. Um so just want to point that out that um yes, it's important not to give people a false sense of security, but that if we don't make people feel like we have

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their backs, they will no longer be parts of our community. Um and I also have a question for Cheng. Um and this a point of clarification maybe it sounded like um earlier you said that you had been collaborating with uh Lucay in

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developing policies or just can you clarify what in contact or involvement you had? >> No I I think uh I never said we were in collaboration with Lucay. >> Sorry in conversation. No, what I said was that that the organization has come

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up before in terms of do we want to collaborate with USA and it's not in our interest to pass on information to an external source because we can't. You know, a lot of the information that we possess is

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protected and we can't give it to nonsworn entities. So that has come up in conversation. Hey, you know, if the police department receives information, can we pass that on? So to kind of

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in terms of solidifying communication, so the communication that I can pass on, I pass on directly to the town manager and the town manager, you know, from that point on, we will determine what the facts and circumstances are of the incident and determine do we need DI DEI

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to be pulled in? Do we need customs? So that's the collaboration that I was talking about. >> Thank you. Do you have any followup, Anna? No. I I want to note that um uh Commissioner Haywood is now in person

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in the town room. Hey, good. Sorry. I apologize. Hey, good is in person in the town room instead of online if people saw that disappear. Um we are moving on to Lisette Paradise. >> Hi. Um, I just have a quick followup kind of a couple questions.

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>> Speak closer to the mic. >> Yes, sorry. Thank you. Um, does Ammerst PD have body warn cameras, >> chief? >> We do not. And that's something that we would actively like to explore.

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>> Do they have cruiser cameras? >> Yes, we do. Um, so in the event that Amoris PD is present during an ICE altercation, are they since they don't have bodywn cameras, are they expected

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to document photographs and videos using their own cell phones? >> Chief, >> we do not use our own cell phones, personal cell phones for police operations. We would utilize the cruiser camera that's available to us uh but not

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personal cell phones. >> Um >> sorry. >> Uh thank you. Um, we can kind of see how that could be a challenging using a cruiser camera since the cruiser the

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angle um will likely not capture the whole ordeal given that oftent times you know bodies transition out of the camera pan. So how how will it be possible to document and

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photograph altercations? So our our vehicles are equipped with smartphones. Uh those are uh department issued. So the officers can utilize those. Can't utilize their personal phones. Uh so there is a medium for

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that. Uh and certainly body cameras are something that we would really love to have. >> Um and then I have another um quick last question. Um, we heard about an officer, um, from Edmold's question, an officer

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that aids an Ammerst resident and is then charged for obstruction of justice. Um, how that individual would be backed by the Ammeris PD um, and supported.

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However, is there a policy if an Ammerst PD officer was to violate and was to work along with ICE? >> Town Manager Buckleman or Chief Tang? >> I just want to clarify. Can you ask that

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question again? >> Sure. Um, a scenario. Um if an officer um if there was evidence or some sort of suggestion that there was an officer

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working for the Ammerst Police Department that had notified ICE or had some sort of contact or is helping in aiding ICE. What would be the consequences against that officer?

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>> Chief Tang. So I can't tell you what the consequences that depends on what the violation of our policies are. So certainly we would examine as in anything we conduct an investigation and figure out what's going on. And obviously at face value from what you're telling me that's an obvious violation

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within our policy. Um so the investigation would we take a look at our policy matched up with that investigation to see what has been violated and certainly that officer would have uh due process and it would go through a particular complaint process that we have in the police

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department for any type of consequences. >> Okay. Um and last question. >> Yes. um an investigation. I'm very unfamiliar with police investigations. Um so how long in terms of time would we be

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talking about? >> So I couldn't I'm sorry. >> I couldn't give you a definitive answer on how long that would be. That's very dependent on how long it takes. Um, if we're dependent on other people, for example, gathering information. Um, if

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we needed video footage from somebody else, it may take a day, it may take a week for them to give it to us. So, it's all kind of dependent on the variables that come into play. Sometimes investigations last a day, sometimes they last weeks. So, I couldn't give you an exact time

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frame. >> Yeah. Um, Commissioner Clark, >> thank you. Um I have a question specifically about the um topic of enforcement cuz um I've also heard

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stories directly from uh others who are US citizens and ICE detained them and they told ICE that they were a US citizen and showed them their real ID and ICE told them that their ID was fake. So, what type of protections in

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that case does a person have? Because at that point, at least according to the attorney general's um advisement sheet that was sent out, um it seems that uh enforcement action is uh really only legal for people who need to be removed

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or for people who are not citizens. So, if they're detaining people who are citizens, telling them their ID is fake and denying them due process, uh, if you were to get a call from a citizen who was experiencing such a thing, which would essentially amount to kidnapping,

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uh, is your office prepared to come and aid them or at least even prove that they are a US citizen or at least help them do that? >> Chief Tang, >> absolutely. If somebody called and they asked for assistance and to verify their

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information, we would do that. >> Do you have any followup, Commissioner Clark? >> Yes. Um, just out of curiosity, um, from your department, um, I'm not sure how many of your officers are uh, Amoris

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residents, but how will your department be aware of who's a resident? And you know, as far as familiarity goes, um are you is your like I guess is your office at least able to um I don't know, conduct some more activities or better

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meet and greets or know who is a resident of this town just in the case of being able to come up and be able to defend somebody. Um yeah, just uh yeah, as far as uh just local residents, I guess. >> So, it's a big community. Uh I wish I

435
01:58:22.719 --> 01:58:38.000
could uh meet every single resident in town. Uh we have almost 40,000 people in town. So it's just not possible for every officer to know every citizen from the town of Ammerst. Um we do a lot of meet and greets. We uh community

436
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policing is um the foundation of our police department. So we try to meet as many people as we possibly can, but we utilize our databases to determine if somebody's a citizen or not. So, we have a criminal justice information system

437
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database that we're able to access and that gives us somebody's address and motor vehicle history and criminal history and whatnot. Um, so that's how we can figure out if they are a town resident or not to a degree.

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>> Anything further, Commissioner Clark? >> Uh, no. Thank you. >> Thank you. Um, Commissioner McClung. >> Hi. Yes. So my question is in regard to this idea of reporting and transparency and so some towns such as uh Shootsbury

439
01:59:25.760 --> 01:59:42.080
have included provisions on implementation and recordkeeping and kind of public reporting specifically the the requiring of the town man administrator in consultation with the chief of police and other relevant uh town officials to to maintain records of of any civil immigration detainers or

440
01:59:42.080 --> 01:59:58.960
ICE administrative warrants um and and related interactions. uh and specifically issuing kind of an aggregate public report on this information online to to inform the community of of what's currently occurring. And so I'm I'm curious as to whether uh Amoris currently maintains a

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records of of this kind of thing and if not uh whether or not the town manager or chief of police would would consider adopting or or working towards a more uh transparent uh framework to provide information to the the town community.

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Chief Ting. >> So, every single uh week we do publish online um our police activities uh relative to arrests and things that are pertaining our police department in terms of activities. Um but it's also

443
02:00:30.719 --> 02:00:46.400
pursuant to public records laws. Uh so we're only to we're only able to disclose information that we can legally do. though. Um so certainly if there was an instance uh where there was ICE activity and we are able to disclose

444
02:00:46.400 --> 02:01:01.920
that we would um and there is a reporting system that we have and that's through the police department if it's police related with any police interaction. So we do have a CAD system and we also have an incident report uh records management system that we

445
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maintain. >> Any further f followup Commissioner McLuang? >> No, thank you. Thank you. We are now moving into second um recognitions. I do want to point out the time of 9:34 and we still have a big item to get to. Um

446
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so we're going to try and move these along maybe a little quicker so that we're not here all night. Um we're going to council Brevik. >> Yeah. Yeah. And I really just have a clarification or clarifying question um that because so much of this discussion

447
02:01:34.159 --> 02:01:51.040
is hinging on the idea of jurisdiction of federal officers and that the APD can't violate the law by obstructing the act of a federal officer breaking a law. And then thinking about the fact that a big part of the council resolution was

448
02:01:51.040 --> 02:02:07.760
to address the fact that this is incorrect and references case law and precedent that ICE officers do not have immunity to violate the law. I guess I'm just wondering if just really clearly how do you reconcile the statements that you're making that you can't intervene

449
02:02:07.760 --> 02:02:25.360
with this fact? >> Chief Ting. >> Yeah. So, so to answer your question, I don't think I don't think we ever said that it couldn't be prosecuted. I don't think that was the issue. The issue is a physical custody intervention or

450
02:02:25.360 --> 02:02:42.080
potential obstruction of justice. That's the crux that I'm talking about in terms of something that we cannot engage in. Um, there's a lot of complexities to that that would probably take all night if we were to discuss that. But in short, in general, that's something that

451
02:02:42.080 --> 02:02:58.719
we cannot violate. That doesn't mean that if if there was enough probable cause for a criminal charge to move forward, that that can't happen. That could happen. And that certainly would happen if that's reported correctly and if all the elements are there to satisfy

452
02:02:58.719 --> 02:03:14.560
that particular crime. Um, and again, that would be in collaboration with the Northwest District Attorney's Office. We would do the enforcement part and the investigation. they would do the prosecution part. I'm hoping that answers your question. >> Councelor Bravik,

453
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>> just quick followup because it's my understanding this applies to enforcement as well as to prosecution. Would you be willing to go into detail in the future or write something up or provide some sort of follow-up documentation of that complexity?

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>> Chief Ting, >> manager Buckleman. >> Yeah. So I think that would be a great question for our town attorney and I think that's a you know I think that's the level of legality is that I think that's would be something that we can frame the question out exactly what you'd like I think that's a really good

455
02:03:49.840 --> 02:04:06.880
question for our town attorney to address in writing for the council. >> Thank you. Okay. Um we are at Commissioner Pai. Uh yeah, this is an issue that I've been thinking about. Uh you know, things that

456
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involve um let's say impersonation. There have been cases I think at the beginning of last year when I think it was the Target store, you know, down the road. You know, they were selling I think tactical masks and gear that

457
02:04:22.000 --> 02:04:39.920
looked like ice gear was marked ice and people were buying that kind of stuff. Now, you know, I mean, how would uh our APD know if it's real or if it's an impersonation? And if they violated the constitution,

458
02:04:39.920 --> 02:04:56.880
let's say breaking and entering, right, some place that's a fourth amendment, uh how would you know whether it's an impersonation or not? And there are cases all around the country, this is not, you know, hypothetical. There have been arrests involving this uh where

459
02:04:56.880 --> 02:05:13.199
people have been abducted. They've been victims of rape, victims of you know all kinds of violence, uh theft, things like that. Um you know, things such as

460
02:05:13.199 --> 02:05:30.320
I don't know racial I guess profiling involving harassment, beatings, things like that. that has happened all around the country. These are not hypotheticals. I think it'll be more useful uh to improve the debate by saying if it

461
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happened somewhere else, what would you do if the same thing or a similar thing happened here? So, for example, you know, they shot somebody dead uh in the town of, you know, let's say Minneapolis, you know, would the police department

462
02:05:46.639 --> 02:06:04.000
step in to try to prevent such a thing or will they simply document? And so, you know, with that, I'm saying that's, you know, there's a lot of uh ongoings all around the nation and simply transfer those cases. If it

463
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happened here, what do we do? because we need to push the argument forward not just say but it hasn't happened here so what are we going to do after it happens here just happened in the country so we need to be prayed over here and the second point I want to make

464
02:06:19.199 --> 02:06:35.760
is that this is a college town and there have been numerous cases where professors and students have been profiled if they talked against Israel for example if we talk about Palestinian rights some of that's a crime

465
02:06:35.760 --> 02:06:50.960
And then they target these students. They get abducted. Real abductions. And that's a violation of the fourth amendment. All kinds of very obvious constitutional violations. If you're seeing those obvious things of

466
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abductions of breaking in and you know the taking away of certain people, how would you know that it's an impersonation? How would you know it's a real thing? And even if that's the case, you know, Massachusetts law also says that you cannot do that. So wouldn't you

467
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at least step up for the Commonwealth of Massachusetts? Follow the law, you know, do your job, so to speak, protect the citizens. So, you know, I'd like a response from that from uh Chief Ting. >> Do you have any response, Chief Ting?

468
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>> Sure. Again, in any circumstance, uh I've been using this term a lot tonight, um but it's the reality. We conduct an investigation. So, you know, if it's if we get a call of um somebody and I totally agree with everything that

469
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you've said, and I also agree that you can purchase uh in any public store, you can go to a an Army Navy store and equip yourself to appear like a police officer or appear like you are an ICE agent. um that's out there unfortunately. Uh

470
02:08:01.199 --> 02:08:18.079
that's the reality of it that that it is out there. So we would conduct an investigation for a call to a situation where there's a potential abduction or there's potential nefarious activity and we'd make that determination like we would in any other investigation. We

471
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would speak to the parties involved. Um, there's something that we recognize as law enforcement agents, how other law enforcement agents conduct themselves and how they act, how they appear, how they dress. The questions that they ask

472
02:08:33.280 --> 02:08:48.079
uh that we ask, the answers that they give is going to help us to determine, you know, if they are truly law enforcement agents or not. Certainly, we have asked that question within ourselves. If they produce an identification that indicates that they

473
02:08:48.079 --> 02:09:05.119
are a an ICE agent, we have no way of verifying that. There's no one for us to call. There's no database for us to check. It's very unlike a driver's license. If you produce a driver's license, I can check through the register uh registry of motor vehicles

474
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if this is you or not. But if somebody an ICE agent produces an ID, I have no way to truly verify that. So that is a sticking point that we have to deal with. So we have we try to employ as many methods that we can. We might run

475
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the license plate, we might run the VIN, we might ask them for uh a driver's license, something that we can verify versus an ICE ID. So there are methods that we can use to try and determine if they are actual ICE agents or not.

476
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>> Thank you. Is there any other followup, Commissioner P? >> No, thank you. Thank you, Deborah Pereira. Yep. Thanks. So, I just wanted to kind of follow up again based on everything that people have been talking about like Ronnie and

477
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myself and others. Um, and the fact that I think Chief Ting, I'm not sure if it was you or Paul, maybe you that you said that maybe one I don't even know if you maybe it was just one person or whatever that you know that was has been kind of disappeared by ICE, but like I said, I

478
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know at least two people that from this community that have been disappeared by ICE, you know, and and that have one has been the border, another one is in detention till this day has been months. Um, and so that worries me that you all

479
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don't even know that. Um, because if you're here to kind of protect the residents and everything as an immigrant myself, um, a proud immigrant, uh, you know, as Ronnie said, I'm afraid and and really live in fear that this is the way

480
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that, you know, things are being conducted in the town under which I live. But I wanted to kind of clarify a little bit more because I think someone said that there was um in Chelsea that the a police chief went and actually

481
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intervened on behalf of of someone that was being abducted and brought the person home. So obviously there's other areas in Massachusetts that are actually taking these steps. So why isn't Amherst doing that? Why isn't Ammerst pushing

482
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the boundaries? Why isn't Ammerst looking at like for instance I know that there's you know military that have been you know army people that go into other places and and are told to kill women children elders and they refuse to and then they get marshaled court marshaled

483
02:11:30.719 --> 02:11:46.960
and things like that because they know it's not the right thing to do. So, I want to know why Paul Wakamman as a town manager, why aren't you asking the attorneys as an attorney myself to really know how to defend our police when they're doing the right thing? This is the opportunity for the police to

484
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actually do the right thing to become champions of people for me to actually say yay for the police. You see what I'm saying? But yet, yet and still it's not happening, right? So, other towns are doing it, but Ammeris is choosing not

485
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to. and to hide behind well it's you know it's a federal government and we don't want to mess with them and so on so forth so they have the cover of law so they can violate the law so I want you all to kind of clarify that for me because I really want to know how others

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other towns other cities are doing it but that you all are not >> manager Buckleman >> so I don't know what Chelsea did I'll call the city manager there and find out what happened because that'd be information for us I haven't heard that

487
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example before. Um, in terms of um the the town can only work with the information that we have. We have one reported incident that was documented um uh on Northeast Street with with a resident. Um there have been lots of other I get calls at 5 or 6 in the

488
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morning from people in the school saying this this there's a rumor going around and we you know police the police chief and I both get these from you know employees at the school district and that we try to check it out and then you know we haven't heard seen anybody that

489
02:13:07.760 --> 02:13:23.040
other than the one that we've been aware of. I'm sure there may be others that we're not aware of. it doesn't mean that we don't and I think quite honestly there's a lot of the community who don't trust the town and don't want to report it. So I think that's very real and so I don't think you can count on the town

490
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knowing every incident with ICE and that would that is concerning. I agree with you on that. I wish we did but I I think you know we represent police and you know government as well. So there's a there's a break in that trust. Um, and I think there's that's

491
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something we have to work to rebuild over time. But this the you know the the external circumstances of the federal government are not helping that at all. But we I'll check with the city manager and uh Chelsea to see what happened up there. >> Further followup.

492
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>> What about in terms of talking with your legal in terms of ways to actually let uh protect police officers, right? because I guess Chief Ting said that you all would would would defend them but then post would fire them which I don't know if that's necessarily the case. I

493
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have to go verify that. I'm going to do my research u because as an attorney I'll be able to research that very quickly. Um, so I just want to know why, you know, why aren't you looking at the town attorney to make sure that they're finding ways to actually protect the

494
02:14:28.159 --> 02:14:45.520
police officers so that they can actually intervene on behalf of these folks that are being violated. >> Yeah, this could build on the question that councelor Breivik raised that we can sort of package into a question for our town attorney. >> Thank you. All right, you're good.

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I see no other hands at this time for this agenda item. Um before I recognize Commissioner Parker to adjourn or seek an adjournment of the human rights commission, I want to thank the town manager Buckleman, Chief Ting, um Crest Director Theoryak, who's been in the

496
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back all night, um and DEI director Nolan Young, who has also been here all night in case there were questions for them. Thank you for your time. Thank you for your cand. Um, I'm now going to turn it the mic over to Commissioner Parker to seek adjournment of the Human Rights

497
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Commission. >> Okay. May I please have a motion to adjourn the Human Rights Commission meeting? >> Second. >> Second. >> Thank you. So, uh, Commissioner Clark.

498
02:15:38.480 --> 02:15:53.920
>> Yes. >> Uh, Commissioner Agood. Uh, Commissioner Khan has left. Commissioner McClullen, >> yes. >> Uh, Parker, yes. Commissioner Ple, >> yes.

499
02:15:53.920 --> 02:16:10.960
>> And Tara Torina is absent. Okay. Uh, the human rights, this meeting of the human rights commission is adjourned. Thank you all. >> Thank you to the human rights commission. Uh the CSSJC and the council meeting will continue after a short five

500
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minute break. Um and we will reset and do all of that. But we get our break now. Okay, we have a lot left to do. So, if we could come on back and get receeded. Mandy, I'm back. My video is just off.

501
02:21:57.520 --> 02:22:35.920
>> Let's gather back together so that we can continue. If you are online um please turn your video on so that we know you are back. We are almost here.

502
02:22:35.920 --> 02:23:07.600
Oh, okay. Okay, >> Mandy, I'm here. >> Yep. Okay, can we please quiet down so we can get started? Thank you. We got a a lot to still do. Um,

503
02:23:07.600 --> 02:23:29.760
okay. So, we are those that are online. We've got counselor Ryan is there. Um, Ryan Ham. Um, Anna Delin Goth, are you here still?

504
02:23:29.760 --> 02:23:45.600
Still here. >> Okay. Thank you. Um, I think that's everyone that I can see. Okay. Next up, we are moving on to our last agenda item for the evening. Um, this is an information request from the council

505
02:23:45.600 --> 02:24:02.560
to the community safety and social justice committee under charter section 2.8B in accordance with the town council vote. CSSJC is here to give information regarding progress on the community safety working group recommendations and immigrant protection efforts.

506
02:24:02.560 --> 02:24:18.960
Because the council vote asked representatives of CSSJC to appear, I will preference recognizing the two co-chairs as the representatives, but CSSJC remains in a meeting and all CSSJC members can seek to be recognized to provide information during this

507
02:24:18.960 --> 02:24:34.720
presentation um and and information session. Um um I ask that CSSJC provide a brief presentation. Um try and keep it to 15 minutes. I don't know whether you can

508
02:24:34.720 --> 02:24:51.280
already at 10 p.m. Um to the council for the two items that are referenced in the motion, progress of the CSWG recommendations and immigrant protection efforts. Um as with the prior agenda item um per the motion um after the presentation I will open up to

509
02:24:51.280 --> 02:25:06.800
counselors who have questions. Um I will also expect during this portion that counselors focus their questions on these two items too. If a member strays from the subject matter of the motion, I will gently remind them to stay on topic. Um, and so I pass it off to the

510
02:25:06.800 --> 02:25:23.439
co-chairs of CSSJC, Deborah and Algra. >> Yeah, I think I'll take this one. Yeah, I was going to ask you that. And I I wish I was home too, you know, as opposed to here at 10 o'clock at night. So yeah, we will try to, you know, go as quickly as possible, but we understand

511
02:25:23.439 --> 02:25:39.520
that obviously this is very important um topic and critical in terms of the um community safety working group um recommendations. So you know, as the slide states, we're doing the status of the community safety working group CSWG recommendations presented by the

512
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community safety and social justice committee CSSJC. Um, I just want to make a statement that from when we met in November 2025 with the town council to now, little has changed except for a tiny number of calls being dispatched to Crest. Nothing

513
02:25:54.560 --> 02:26:09.280
of what we said back in November are sent to the town council and town manager because we've sent to the town council and town manager a variety of different communications about the budget about crest about um resident oversight board which we didn't get any

514
02:26:09.280 --> 02:26:25.040
responses back from um you know was taken into consideration for this budget season in order to make the CSWG recommendations a reality. Um, so we didn't see any budget increases for any of, you know, the different departments

515
02:26:25.040 --> 02:26:42.399
or to establish the youth empowerment center or the multicultural center. So we're, you know, eight months later and we're still virtually in the same place. Um, so we're going to showcase this by our uh presentation. If we can go to the next slide, please.

516
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So, we're going to do a brief overview of the community safety working group uh recommendations. We're going to do a status of the seven priorities adopted by town council and we're going to focus on some areas for further consideration which was similar to what we did back in

517
02:26:57.520 --> 02:27:16.319
November. Next slide. So, I want to point out that I was one of the original members of the CSWG after CSWG presented our part A and part B recommendations. Although CSWG's recommendations were not all implemented and therefore our work was not complete,

518
02:27:16.319 --> 02:27:34.640
the town manager chose to disband the CSWG as opposed to changing changing us from a working group to a committee. Thereafter, he established a successor group named community safety and social justice committee which is our committee. Um included in a as a part of

519
02:27:34.640 --> 02:27:51.120
our charge, the community safety and social justice committee will work to advance diversity, equity, inclusion, and community safety in Ammerst. The committee may provide advice and support to all town government entities, including the town council, town manager, and town committees to fully

520
02:27:51.120 --> 02:28:06.080
realize the resolution affirming the town of Ammer's commitment to end structural racism and achieve racial equity for black residents. adopted by the town council December 2020. The committee shall work to support all members of the Ammeris community to understand and enjoy the benefits of a

521
02:28:06.080 --> 02:28:23.120
community that is truly diverse, equitable, and inclusive of all and shall serve as a voice to marginalized and underrepresented residents. We can have the next slide, please. The CSWG was formed in 2020 after the

522
02:28:23.120 --> 02:28:40.319
murder of George Floyd. We were formed after the town adopted in December 2020 a resolution affirming the town of Ammeris commitment to end structural racism and achieve racial equity for black residents. The I want to read what we put on the slide which is amongst other sections of the resolution. As

523
02:28:40.319 --> 02:28:55.280
stated, Ammerst Town Council hereby affirms its commitment to eradicating the effects of systematically racist practices of town government and town affiliated organizations will review and revise its policies, procedures, bylaws, values, goals, and missions through an

524
02:28:55.280 --> 02:29:12.800
anti-ra racism lens to foster an unbiased and inclusive environment that is free of discrimination, harassment, and negative stereotyping toward any person or group. So we definitely took that to heart as CSWG members and now SCSSJC we take our job very seriously.

525
02:29:12.800 --> 02:29:28.479
If that's what the resolution that was put in place then we want to make sure as a as look at our name community safety working group dealing with social uh uh at that time looking at that part and then CS community safety and social

526
02:29:28.479 --> 02:29:44.560
justice committee we take those words very seriously it's not a game for us and so we want to make sure that people understand it. So with with CSWG, our charge, we were meeting weekly u from November 2020 to October 2021.

527
02:29:44.560 --> 02:30:01.920
Our charge was to one recommend alternative options to public safety services currently provided by the Ammeris Police Department. So we had to recommend that. I mean, that is a serious charge. And we did and we created Crest, but we didn't create Crest to be underfunded and understaffed

528
02:30:01.920 --> 02:30:16.720
and underresourced and not be able to carry out its its um charge and not have actual, you know, supposedly now there's dispatch protocols, but they're not getting the calls from dispatch. So

529
02:30:16.720 --> 02:30:33.920
we we did our job that was put in place but yet the um department is not being utilized to its full potential. Two recommendations for resident oversight and for policy reforms for the Ammeris Police Department. Resident oversight.

530
02:30:33.920 --> 02:30:50.000
Five years later there's no resident oversight board and no policy review at the police department. um our recommendations resulted in part A and part B recommendations that was made to the town council. These recommendations were made back in 2021, five years ago

531
02:30:50.000 --> 02:31:08.160
and now I'm going to go into the part A part B recommendations. If you can go to the next slide, please part A and we've already talked a little bit, right? Crest, the formation of Crest, um the creation of the resident oversight board, create a wellstaffed

532
02:31:08.160 --> 02:31:22.240
and well-funded department of diversity, equity, inclusion, create a BIPACled Amoris youth empowerment center and Ammeris Bipok cultural center, reduce the size of the Ammeris Police Department, and to continue the ongoing work of the community safety working

533
02:31:22.240 --> 02:31:42.080
group, which we are doing through TSSJC. Five years later, only Crest and DI were established and poorly resourced and funded. And Crest has been crippled by town government resistance towards provided the necessary support to actualize its full potential. As a League of Women Voters report stated,

534
02:31:42.080 --> 02:31:58.399
BIPAC and those on the margin are the ones that use Crest the most. So they we are the ones being impacted. The resident the um resident oversight board has not been established as an empowered oversight board to investigate law enforcement complaints. Bipogled youth

535
02:31:58.399 --> 02:32:14.319
empowerment center has initially had initially been earmarked 500,000. Then 50,000 was used until this day we don't even know what the 50,000 was used for. And now the remaining 450,000 which had been earmarked to establish the center is now in free cash. And no location has

536
02:32:14.319 --> 02:32:29.200
been identified to establish a center and no funding has been earmarked for the permanent staff and programming in the establishment of the multicultural center has hasn't even been mentioned. Bipok people in Ammeris need spaces where they can be themselves without

537
02:32:29.200 --> 02:32:45.680
feeling otherred. The April races letter that was leafleted about town demonstrated this fact 20fold. Lastly, the Ammeris Police Department continues with their overabundance of officers and command staff where only one of their positions were frozen

538
02:32:45.680 --> 02:33:00.160
and they still have 47 members while Crest continues to shrink in size and has no assistant director and only eight total staff. I mean, I I think there's large disparity there, like incredible disparity there.

539
02:33:00.160 --> 02:33:20.560
Next slide, please. So then we we did part B recommendations a few months la later in October 2021. I've already talked about the first two, but we um did the revise and update selected policies and contract provisions of the APD, use of force,

540
02:33:20.560 --> 02:33:35.680
consent searches, low-level and protectable vehicle stops, APD contract issues to be addressed in the next negotiations and other policies. And I know I went we went into a lot more detail in November, so I'm not going to go into detail here. The only thing that I'm going to say is that for use of

541
02:33:35.680 --> 02:33:51.040
force, CSWG recommended rew rewriting the policy and for consent searches, pre-textual vehicle stops, it recommended eliminating, prohibiting, and revising these policies. So I'll go to the next slide, please.

542
02:33:51.040 --> 02:34:06.479
So the other for the part B, we also uh recommend and create an online dashboard that provides transparent easy public access to data on APD vehicles, stops by race. And I know that when Algra talks about the seven priorities, the policies

543
02:34:06.479 --> 02:34:23.040
as well as communicating more more with the community are part of the priorities, the seven priorities. So, Algra will will talk a little bit more about that, but also we we we made a recommendation around traffic control and enforcement. Move traffic control from the Ammeris Police Department to a

544
02:34:23.040 --> 02:34:39.280
separate traffic control division under the Crest Department, leaving only jailable traffic offenses to the APD. as Ronnie talked about and as black people in Amoris, we are afraid a lot of times to drive around because that's one of the main ways that the police stop us,

545
02:34:39.280 --> 02:34:57.200
right? is protect um um um stops where it's like a broken tail light or you know there's a no light over your license plate or something silly like that that then you get racial profile and as a black person there's more opportunity for for you to get um racial

546
02:34:57.200 --> 02:35:12.319
profile and that's why CSW that's why we made that recommendation and till this day there hasn't even been a mention to that informing drivers who have been stopped why they're being um stopped pilot confirmation of racial identification and then pedestrian

547
02:35:12.319 --> 02:35:28.479
safety committee. Um number five was engage our town in an extended process of community racial healing and visioning and that has been happening through DEI um and through um hiring initially Dr. Barbara Love who is just excellent and who started doing the

548
02:35:28.479 --> 02:35:44.080
trainings around racial healing for our town. Um and then number six develop an anti-racist departmental culture in the APD. This is something that must happen if there's going to be trust amongst all the residents in Ammerst. The chief stated that he would be undertaking this

549
02:35:44.080 --> 02:35:59.840
when I attended and asked him this question. I asked him this very question at his candidacy open forum. It has not happened. ABD has not sent any clear message that they are actively anti-racist and they have not created an intentional culture demonstrating that that they are anti-racist. They need to

550
02:35:59.840 --> 02:36:15.520
contact Dr. love who DNI DEI contracted to do the visioning work to engage her to work with them on a long-term basis to become actively anti-racist. She has worked with the town before. She has institutional knowledge to be effective. I had made the same recommendation back

551
02:36:15.520 --> 02:36:31.760
in November and yet and still nothing has transpired. So that's why we're here. We're back here at the town council to really get a sense of when are some of these things going to take place. Um, now I'm going to hand I'm going to hand things over to Algra for the seven priorities, but I do want to remind the town council and the town

552
02:36:31.760 --> 02:36:49.319
manager that we are asking for kind of status updates on these things that we're not just making a report. We want to know where are these things at. So, at the end of our presentation, that's what we want to know is where are these things? What's the status of these things?

553
02:36:53.840 --> 02:37:12.399
Um so in 2022 there was a meeting of the town council following a incident that occurred on July 5th in Ammerst between a group of youth and the APD. So

554
02:37:12.399 --> 02:37:29.200
there were seven priorities from the recommendations of the CSWG and kind of impacted by the incident that the town council had chosen to prioritize. So we can go to the next

555
02:37:29.200 --> 02:37:47.760
slide. Um the first was to come up with a plan for community visioning with a focus on public safety and social justice. So again, the DEI department has been doing those trainings. Um, they have been engaging community members in

556
02:37:47.760 --> 02:38:02.720
becoming trainers themselves and having facilitated conversations. And this is a project that is taking on a lot of time and resources of the department, which is again severely understaffed for what they're asked and

557
02:38:02.720 --> 02:38:19.760
expected to do both from the town and from the community. Um officially there's been no further staffing added although they have had some interns join the department from UMass and there is currently a position

558
02:38:19.760 --> 02:38:35.600
posted from the grant that they received under the community heart and soul project which would be a part-time project coordinator. It is a limited time position. So again, it is a step in the right direction, but it is not a

559
02:38:35.600 --> 02:38:51.120
fulltime long-term position that would support the department in their work. Go to the next slide. Second is propose to the town council a plan for the creation of resident oversight board with possible assistance

560
02:38:51.120 --> 02:39:07.520
from and hires appropriate consultant to help with the development of that plan. Um I believe that the November meeting was the same day as the cons consultant presentation >> from um the second phase of the work

561
02:39:07.520 --> 02:39:25.040
that the consultants had done. Um so there was during that meeting a conversation about returning in April with some recommendations from go and it is my understanding that the first meeting of

562
02:39:25.040 --> 02:39:39.760
go to discuss the resident oversight board was in May of this year. So again, this is a recommendation that was made back in 2021 and there have been numerous studies

563
02:39:39.760 --> 02:39:57.600
that have supported it and the seven gen report supported it. The CSWG report supported it and the work by Rabbi Depp also supported it. Um, I think the

564
02:39:57.600 --> 02:40:14.800
current proposals are still out of line with what the CSWG had recommended for a resident oversight board and that was with much research and looking at different models. So again, the stress from our committee is that the

565
02:40:14.800 --> 02:40:31.840
investigatory model is what would more closely align with what CSWG recommended. Um, next slide. Organize a review of public safety protocols for handling

566
02:40:31.840 --> 02:40:46.880
public safety calls. I'm sorry, it's really late and reading is hard. Um, involving residents, including minors, in order to recommend changes to those protocols if appropriate. So, again, Deborah touched on this. Um, there was

567
02:40:46.880 --> 02:41:02.080
conversation about waiting until the new police chief had been hired for that to begin. And there are still very specific protocols that were outlined in the law enforcement partnership um report for

568
02:41:02.080 --> 02:41:18.319
CSWG, including the pretext stops, including the consent searches that have not been adopted. Those are things that there is a precedent for. the state of Virginia has actually um

569
02:41:18.319 --> 02:41:35.120
back in 2020, I believe it was, made those things, you know, remove those from being legal ways to search or to stop people. So, it's not out of the ordinary. It wouldn't be something completely new. It is something that

570
02:41:35.120 --> 02:41:50.640
again is a policy change. it seems like it would reduce the work of the department. And um again, those are all things that we're looking for. Um reducing any possible negative

571
02:41:50.640 --> 02:42:07.280
interactions between police and especially our BIPO residents when they're getting pulled over. Um since that again has been referenced many times as a significant source of contact that can lead to crisis.

572
02:42:07.280 --> 02:42:23.520
Next slide. Let me let me before going to the next slide, can you go back to that? Just to say and this was actually um communicated after the July 5th 22 incident where young people uh were told by the police that they had no rights, right? They were kind of set to the

573
02:42:23.520 --> 02:42:40.720
side. They couldn't leave so effectively detained outside and were told that they had no rights. So these policies are critical. You know, I I still have young people from that incident that come to me years later, right? 27 22 in 2026 still traumatized by that still reeling

574
02:42:40.720 --> 02:42:57.040
from that incident. And so for us we want and that's why we put in the slide you know we want these policies dealt with these policies need to be addressed and we we we're setting a timeline. So we want the town council to help us with that like tell the town manager to

575
02:42:57.040 --> 02:43:14.960
ensure that APD addresses these policies by December 2026. I mean, we can't continue just, you know, kicking the can, kicking the can, kicking the can. We have people that were injured by these things. That's why you all put these priorities in place back then was because young people were injured during

576
02:43:14.960 --> 02:43:30.560
that situation. And so, why is it that we're now, you know, four years down the road and still there's no review of these policies? Five years down the road from CSWG recommendations, still no review of these policies. Right? The excuse back then was, "Oh, when the new

577
02:43:30.560 --> 02:43:45.760
police chief comes in, then it'll happen." It hasn't happened. It hasn't happened. The police chief has been here. I asked him about it. He didn't do it and he hasn't been told to do it. It's not important, I guess, that our marginalized and our bipok residents,

578
02:43:45.760 --> 02:44:05.120
especially our youth, feel safe. Next slide. uh continue to develop protocols for crests regarding active engagement by community responders. Again, the last time we were here, there was a motion put forward to have crests

579
02:44:05.120 --> 02:44:20.960
um responding to calls from dispatch by December of 2025. And I believe that that did occur perhaps starting in January. Um so it's my understanding that the rate is still

580
02:44:20.960 --> 02:44:36.960
lower than what we would like to be seeing from dispatch I believe if and please correct me if I'm wrong but May the number of dispatch calls to Crest was six is that correct? >> Um and it's been averaging at like 2%

581
02:44:36.960 --> 02:44:52.880
for these months since January. Protocols were supposed to be in place in December supposedly they were put in place in January and been you know negligible. That's why we put negligible because 2%. I mean, what? Why is the dispatch calls at 2%.

582
02:44:52.880 --> 02:45:07.760
And I know that obviously and I know obviously Camille uh always and and I and I applaud her. She's doing an excellent job given what she's been given, right? But CSWG, I was an original member of CSWG. We were charged

583
02:45:07.760 --> 02:45:23.600
by the town council and the town manager to create a department that was an alternative to policing. That is what you all charge us with alternative to policing. That means dispatch calls need to go and need to be dispatched to

584
02:45:23.600 --> 02:45:41.760
crests and not 2% of the calls. The the League of Women Voters confirmed that most of the calls that that go to to um the APD are nonviolent. They are nonviolent calls. So why is from January

585
02:45:41.760 --> 02:45:58.960
until June, why is it only 2% of the calls? There's been months that where there's been one call dispatched during these last few months supposedly where the protocols were put in place, two dispatch calls to Crest. I'm sorry. This is resistance. That's why I started my

586
02:45:58.960 --> 02:46:15.520
commentary my comments with there's been active resistance from the town to impact and sabotage crest which is the the department where bipok people and marginalized people feel comfortable going to especially during this time we

587
02:46:15.520 --> 02:46:32.399
just spent an hour and a half talking about ICE do you think folks are going to and and I proved it right when I said people came to me when they were being deported they didn't go to the police because they are afraid of the police. They're not going to go to the police. So, they need to go to Crest. But Crest

588
02:46:32.399 --> 02:46:49.680
has six responders. Crest works 8:30 to 4. Crest doesn't have doesn't work during 4 to 12, which is when LEAP says, the law enforcement agency that we contracted said that 4 to 12 a.m. is when the most of the calls come in. Are you kidding me? This is active sabotage

589
02:46:49.680 --> 02:47:04.000
to the fact that Crest is supposed to be alternative to policing. Why is that not happening? Why are we here coming back from November to now?

590
02:47:04.000 --> 02:47:21.359
And I hear one call, six calls. So 2% of the calls are going to crest from dispatch. Okay. So, one of the other things that if you look at the town manager's budget um

591
02:47:21.359 --> 02:47:39.279
from for FY27, there's a table of the types of calls that the police receive over the course of the year and it compares it year-over-year. So, one of the categories of assisting

592
02:47:39.279 --> 02:47:57.200
um assisting residents has more than doubled. yet that's not reflected in what's being dispatched to Crest. So those are again disparities that we're seeing in Crest's utilization. Um and the slide does

593
02:47:57.200 --> 02:48:15.760
indicate Crest staffing versus police staffing. Um so I think we can move on to the next slide. um continue the work already begun on exploring options for a youth empowerment center. Again, there is the

594
02:48:15.760 --> 02:48:31.680
money that was from ARPA that some of it was used on a study. Some of it was then put back into free cash and and we understand that that was because we were afraid that the federal government was going to take that money

595
02:48:31.680 --> 02:48:49.200
back. We're hoping that with Wildwood going offline, that would be a potential site. Um, especially with the announcement that the wreck department will be utilizing that space. Um, again, the

596
02:48:49.200 --> 02:49:07.680
vision of CSWG was to have the youth empowerment center under DEI rather than the recreation department, but if there is a place that is being used for programming and positive activity for youth, it would make sense to at least have those piggy back together. Um,

597
02:49:07.680 --> 02:49:26.080
again, there the DE I would applaud the DEI department's programming initiatives that they've made with the youth, but programming alone isn't providing a physical space for kids to be. Um, so that is something we'd like to see

598
02:49:26.080 --> 02:49:42.720
and we would like to be getting more regular updates about what a plan would be going forward related to the youth empowerment center as it was a priority set. >> Well, let me let me chime in on this one because this one again is is one that I

599
02:49:42.720 --> 02:49:59.200
hear from the community all the time that this needs to happen. Like I said, this is a safety issue. We need a space for our young people, our bipok young people. It It's not enough to have some programming here, there, everywhere. It has to be a safe space where young

600
02:49:59.200 --> 02:50:15.359
people, our bipok young people, and those who are marginalized, it doesn't have to be just bipok. All those who are marginalized, LGBTQIA plus and so on so forth, need to have a space where they can go. There was it was $500,000 that was earmarked. Yes, it was to we were

601
02:50:15.359 --> 02:50:31.840
told that it went to free cash so it could be protected. But I've heard that there's town counselors that were talking about why don't we use that money that was earmarked for the youth empowerment center. So while it's in the free cash, it is being threatened. So therefore, it needs to be earmarked

602
02:50:31.840 --> 02:50:47.840
to the youth uh empowerment center. It needs we need the location. We have Wildwood coming up online that needs to be established for the youth empowerment center and a budget. So why is it that there hasn't been any budget line put in

603
02:50:47.840 --> 02:51:03.439
place for the youth empowerment center during this fiscal year for it to be established when we came in November we asked for it to be established for so that it could be in place by September 20 206 so September this September and also we still don't have any liaison

604
02:51:03.439 --> 02:51:20.399
that comes to our meetings on a monthly basis to tell us anything about the youth empowerment center because again I guess it's not important I do I do email Paul and Paul will provide us some updates here and there, but that's not sufficient. We are here to deal with safety. That is

605
02:51:20.399 --> 02:51:35.520
in our name, social justice and safety. This is a safety issue for our young people. Our young people who were told in 2022 they have no rights. This is all connected. So, this is important and we here to the

606
02:51:35.520 --> 02:51:54.319
town council to ask for timelines and deadlines. Uh, next slide please. Um, six was provide training regarding racial equity rights and other options for training to employees and members of the public. Um, DEI department has been

607
02:51:54.319 --> 02:52:09.920
actively engaging staff and the community in racial equity rights and anti-racism training. Again, they are a department of two people. They are overworked, understaffed. And again, the recommendation is that

608
02:52:09.920 --> 02:52:28.080
employee training needs to be mandatory for all town staff programs and volunteers as well as the town council. Um, and again, this is also addressed in the town manager goals of 2026.

609
02:52:28.080 --> 02:52:45.439
We can go to the next slide. Um the final one was develop a communications plan to raise awareness in the community about these efforts and the town manager will report on actions to be taken. Not

610
02:52:45.439 --> 02:53:09.760
and again nothing has changed from the November meeting. We can go to the next slide. I believe that's just >> yeah it's just that we we want to make sure that we're coming to meet with the

611
02:53:09.760 --> 02:53:24.560
town council like we've now we're getting on a schedule which is good but you know we want to obviously when we come to the town council is with that understanding that there's going to be timelines and deadlines and that when you know and that the budget is going to take that into consideration because if

612
02:53:24.560 --> 02:53:43.359
we're still coming back months later there's no budget line to these departments, then it's just going to stay as is and there's not going to be any movement. And then next slide. Um, you know, and this one was just to kind of showcase the fact that we've

613
02:53:43.359 --> 02:53:58.640
sent out all these communications, right? So, November 13th, 2025 budget request for CSSAC because we don't even have a budget, right, to do town forums, to pay for um translation, interpreters, um you know, we can't even pay for food

614
02:53:58.640 --> 02:54:13.200
when we do our retreats. We want to do at least two retreats a year to kind of talk through all of these things. And luckily, you know, uh, Crest Camille has been just wonderful, um, and DI also to provide us some food, but basically, we

615
02:54:13.200 --> 02:54:28.720
don't even have a budget for that as a town committee to be able to pay for some food. Um, never mind town forums and so on so forth that we want to do to get um, you know, feedback from the community in terms of what's happening in our town, right, around safety and

616
02:54:28.720 --> 02:54:46.399
social justice. Um then we November 18, 2025 letter to town manager and town council with budget priorities. So we got that in very early in front of the budget season. March 11, 2026 letter to the town manager and the town council on crest and thank you Emerald um Henry and

617
02:54:46.399 --> 02:55:01.840
then Erica also assisted with that to to to get that to um the town manager. really detailed letter around the importance of Crest and and upping its funding so that it can um have more staff and also add more hours. Um and

618
02:55:01.840 --> 02:55:18.880
then the March 20 23rd, 2026 letter to the G committee on the resident oversight board because that needs to happen not tomorrow but yesterday. Next slide. Um and then lastly, as we did last time, there was some areas um for further

619
02:55:18.880 --> 02:55:35.279
consideration. And so we we focused on five areas. Establishment of the multicultural center, equitable support to bipac owned businesses, protection of immigrant communities, the racist letter against black residents, opioid settlement funds because we've gotten

620
02:55:35.279 --> 02:55:51.040
requests from the community in regards to those funds and what are they being used for, and then translation services. So what I want to say about those is establishment of the multicultural center is critical. We have mentioned this time and time again. By when will the multicultural center be established?

621
02:55:51.040 --> 02:56:05.680
We can use the space at the Wawwood to establish it. So youth empowerment center and the multicultural center they have a space now. It would be it should be at Wawwood and we should utilize that. There shouldn't be any more discussion about where where can this

622
02:56:05.680 --> 02:56:23.200
happen? Well, there's a spacewood and we should establish them there. Um, it also needs to be fully funded. This goes handinhand with the racist letter against black residents that was sent in the end of April. Having spaces like that will make us bipac, people of

623
02:56:23.200 --> 02:56:40.080
color, um, you know, those who are marginalized marginalized feel safer. The letter was outrageous and we and we kept hearing from people that it was probably a hoax. I don't care whether it was a hoax or not. We need to take it seriously. And the mere fact that it was

624
02:56:40.080 --> 02:56:56.720
sent out is terrifying enough. Reading a letter that this is that like this instills fear and alarm in me as a black resident in Ammerst and other black residents in Ammerst. Everyone should have been enraged and outraged just like I was by the letter. But instead, we

625
02:56:56.720 --> 02:57:12.319
need to put pressure on the town to even get a statement sent out. It was a good statement, but we had to make sure monitor, right? I was on it monitoring making sure that a statement was going to was going to be sent out. And why didn't the town council send a statement condemning the racist letter? You know,

626
02:57:12.319 --> 02:57:32.240
bad people are under siege right now nationally and locally. We need to be able to rely on our town government to feel safe. How can we do so if our town government doesn't take our reality sa seriously? Similarly, the town needs to sit down at a minimum monthly and I we had made the

627
02:57:32.240 --> 02:57:48.160
same recommendation in November to meet and collaborate with the black business association at Bmer area. I'm wearing their t-shirt right over here. I don't know if people can see it, but they're a great organization that are there supporting our black businesses um that

628
02:57:48.160 --> 02:58:04.640
need the visibility, support, and funding from their town. Based on what was discussed in the first part of this meeting, our immigrants need to feel safe in our community. What is the town doing to send a message that immigrants can feel safe and are welcome here besides reacting to a crisis, right?

629
02:58:04.640 --> 02:58:20.000
Which is, you know, a lot of what we were talking about in the first part of our meeting, right, is reacting, right? The police showing up, so on so forth. We need to be preventative in our support and not just reactive. And I do understand that that that crest is is helping obviously and DI is helping and

630
02:58:20.000 --> 02:58:34.960
we have some messaging out there, but we need to do more. Our nation keeps sending messages that immigrants are not welcome. We need to actively change that narrative. The town needs to establish at least one staff person. One. I'm not saying two. I'm not saying three. I'm

631
02:58:34.960 --> 02:58:51.279
saying one staff person dedicated to supporting immigrants and those that are being persecuted by ICE. Also having a wholesome translation service. I know there's the pocket translators and so on so forth, but we need a wholesome translation service. We'll go a long way

632
02:58:51.279 --> 02:59:08.399
to helping our immigrants feel included. Right now, they are not able to take part in meetings or read different messaging because it is not in their language. How many immigrants who who English is not a first language was able to actually understand anything that was being said here today? You know, so they are marginalized. They're set aside. I'm

633
02:59:08.399 --> 02:59:25.040
an immigrant this country. I know what that feels like when you don't understand the language of the country where you're in. You're you're not going to know how to get services, how to get access. My parents were like that for many years until my me and my brothers were able to learn the language and then

634
02:59:25.040 --> 02:59:41.920
assist in that way. That is not okay. So, a robust translation services and we've made this recommendation time and time again has to has to happen. Lastly, we want to know um what the opioid settlement funds are being used for. Are

635
02:59:41.920 --> 02:59:59.120
they being used for bipok businesses um and to bolster establish the department departments centers we have discussed? All of these issues and many others are important to those who are bipok or who are marginalized in our town. We need to do more as a town and we need to do better. Thank you.

636
02:59:59.120 --> 03:00:14.080
And I would just want to hear from town council and town employees in terms of the status of these priorities and areas of further consideration. >> Thank you for that presentation. Um I will now um open the floor up to

637
03:00:14.080 --> 03:00:30.160
counselors um who have questions. Um, I ask that you focus your questions on the two items, the CSWG recommendations and any immigrant was it's called immigrant protection efforts. Um, and again I will

638
03:00:30.160 --> 03:00:46.160
recognize people as they've raised their hands. We start with Jennifer Tub. >> Um, thank you and thank you very much for that um, you know, really comprehensive presentation. So, I have several questions, but the what really one of what really stood out for me um

639
03:00:46.160 --> 03:01:02.000
was um Crest and Dispatch because we've been waiting a long time for dispatch calls to go to Crest. So, I would if the question can't be answered now, I would really like by the next council meeting, but hopefully it could be answered now

640
03:01:02.000 --> 03:01:19.200
as to why it is um such a slow roll out. Um I I was frankly really um stunned to hear that those numbers. I I thought that dispatch was proceeding. So I appreciate having that information.

641
03:01:19.200 --> 03:01:35.920
>> Thank you. Um is the manager prepared to answer that question tonight or should we just take a list of questions? >> Yeah, I'm not prepared to answer that question. >> Can you please write it down and include it in your next manager report or we'll talk about it at agenda setting as to when next time. Thank you. Uh, Andy

642
03:01:35.920 --> 03:01:51.760
Churchill. >> Uh, I've thought about this for a while and I was um interested to hear it also mentioned in um Deborah's comments and that most of the

643
03:01:51.760 --> 03:02:09.439
action for Crest would be between 400 pm and midnight. And um I'm curious why we haven't staffed Crest why we haven't made the working hours for the current staff 4 pm to midnight. Thanks. Again, we will note that

644
03:02:09.439 --> 03:02:25.279
question. Um, since this was an agenda item that was for information to receive from, uh, CSSJC to the council, um, it was not a request directly to the town manager. So, we may have to make specific requests later to the town manager to have him be able to

645
03:02:25.279 --> 03:02:44.720
answer the questions, but we will note these questions down. That one was crest hours. Is that correct, Andy? Yeah. Okay. Um, councelor Bravik. >> Uh, yeah, just another question and maybe hopefully one that we can answer.

646
03:02:44.720 --> 03:02:59.439
The another concerning stat that I just heard was that the there's $50,000 that's not accounted for. So, if the initial funds, ARPA funds for the youth empowerment center were $500,000 and now

647
03:02:59.439 --> 03:03:17.680
there's $450,000 in free cash. Do we know what happened to that other $50,000? Uh, manager Bachmann, are you able to answer that one tonight? >> Um, yeah, it was expended on evaluating buildings, so I can get more detail on

648
03:03:17.680 --> 03:03:35.120
that as well. Could could I um >> do a quick followup on that? >> Yes, you may. >> Just that. Yeah, we've never gone this was years ago already and we've never gone as CSSJC was the one that's supposed to be looking at recommendations for CSWG. We've never

649
03:03:35.120 --> 03:03:51.840
known what those that $50,000 paid for what studies. We never received a report. So, I'm just saying it would be nice to get that information. Thank you, Councelor Kenna Martin. Yeah. So, I'll just I'll just mention a

650
03:03:51.840 --> 03:04:07.520
couple things that I'd like to follow up on. Um, the first one is on so on page six of the slide deck where it says revise and update selected policies and contract provisions of the APD. I guess my question is um is this something that

651
03:04:07.520 --> 03:04:23.200
the council could take action on um in terms of a bylaw? Um, and then my other question, um, would be in terms of I'm just going to try to figure out, uh, what page it was on. Um, yeah, so the review of the public safety

652
03:04:23.200 --> 03:04:41.399
protocols, this is page 11, um, for responding and handling public safety calls involving all residents, including minors. Um, so it sounds like it's not completed. I guess my question is, is it in progress? Um, and will it be completed by December 2026?

653
03:04:42.479 --> 03:05:00.000
Thank you. Um, I think to answer the question about whether a bylaw would be able to do something, we'd have to know what the goal of it is to see if it's something within our own jurisdiction to pass a bylaw. Um, whether it would be legally passable or not. So, I think I'd need more information on that to be able

654
03:05:00.000 --> 03:05:25.279
to answer that question. Um, I guess I would say it would address on slide number six at least A, B, and C. I'm making notes um because I don't think I could answer that tonight. I think we'd have to do a

655
03:05:25.279 --> 03:05:41.680
little bit of research on that. Um I believe policy revisions or public safety protocols are part of the manager's goals for the year as noted on on the slide. So, um, we will note a update. I'll make a note to potentially

656
03:05:41.680 --> 03:06:01.520
have an updated update on goal progress, um, and specific goal progress in the near future. Sam Mloud. >> Um, thank you, Mandy, and thank you, Deborah, Algra, and the, uh, CSSJC

657
03:06:01.520 --> 03:06:17.680
folks. Um, I have a comment. I listened to the presentation. And I just wanted to I guess advocate or lend support to the there were a lot of recommendations and I realize it's systemic in terms of the request but I just wanted to

658
03:06:17.680 --> 03:06:33.680
highlight the um the goal of a youth empowerment center. Uh you know as a kid my mom raised six kids by herself. Different time kids went to the boys club. Everybody

659
03:06:33.680 --> 03:06:48.960
went there. There's boys club, girls clubs, they had different hours. Uh it was a place to go all the time. I think youth sports and ammeris has taken an aspect of that. you know, coaches are driving around paying for kids, driving

660
03:06:48.960 --> 03:07:06.319
them, but I can't think of anything uh to me that has a greater impact uh on the well-being of our youth outside of school and and the home than a youth center of one form or another.

661
03:07:06.319 --> 03:07:21.520
Uh it's a gathering place. Uh it's social. Uh it's physical and I do think I don't know, you know, I know we've funded money or we're allocating funding for Wildwood Studies. Uh sure seems like

662
03:07:21.520 --> 03:07:38.800
it'd be a great spot. Um and it makes a difference. I've coached a lot of these kids in the years past. I'd be driving to all these different places and I can tell you when they have a place to go, not just, you know, my son loved playing, but I picked the pick

663
03:07:38.800 --> 03:07:54.960
these kids up who are great. We had a lot of fun. Their eyes light up. They got something to do. And uh kids in the, you know, activities, whatever. It doesn't have to just be sports, can be whatever. It correlates

664
03:07:54.960 --> 03:08:11.760
to the rest of what they have going on. I'm not speaking of this in terms of bipac or not because I can only speak from my own experiences but I've seen it and I just I just think it would be phenomenal. I remember when they closed

665
03:08:11.760 --> 03:08:27.200
the boys club in Ammer Steve Hamilton just an unbelievable guy who built that where the bank center is right now. Uh you know they tore it down because of whatever used to have a basketball hoop and the whole bit. They went to the new one no hoops. Kids weren't moving. they weren't, you know, they were out there

666
03:08:27.200 --> 03:08:44.479
playing games, but a place where kids, you know, right next to the fields, I've spoken enough. Uh, I just underline that as, uh, something that I think would be a great goal for the town to achieve for many reasons. Thank you.

667
03:08:44.479 --> 03:09:01.600
>> Thank you, Councelor Breick. Yeah, I just wanted to say I think you know I I hope that this is a council that is more supportive than maybe the council has been in the past and I can just say for myself that I watching

668
03:09:01.600 --> 03:09:18.479
previous presentations like this one along the way as a resident was one of the things that motivated me to run for council and just seeing the just extremely slow uh you know very incremental progress on these objectives.

669
03:09:18.479 --> 03:09:34.960
I think that we can start hopefully reporting out both ways where we're coming back with some things that we've done. You know, I'm happy to hear that there's this these sessions are being scheduled and that we'll have

670
03:09:34.960 --> 03:09:50.160
regular opportunities where you're not having to also then fight for an audience with us and that that's going to be built in. And so I think number one goal is to have things to report back on progress that we're making. Um

671
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and I'm I'm committed to that. And I think we know the things we can do. We know the tools that we have at our disposal. Um the town manager knows what he, you know, there's the staff side, but there are things, you know, that we can do

672
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with budget guidelines and the town manager goals and bylaws. And so I think we really need to start mapping out what that's going to look like and I'm committed to that. >> Thank you. Are there any other comments,

673
03:10:21.200 --> 03:10:39.439
questions? Um I see uh Erica Pady and then I >> Thank you. It's Pad. Thank you. Um, I just want to make a comment because we listened for over an hour regarding um, protecting the public here in Amherst

674
03:10:39.439 --> 03:10:54.160
and the fear and the concerns especially of people of color and um, people who are immigrants uh, or naturalized citizens because they're coming after us next. Um and so what I just wanted to say is that what we've proposed is

675
03:10:54.160 --> 03:11:10.880
public safety. And one of the biggest um programs alternative to policing is crest. Um and especially after hearing an hour and a half of certain people get protected and others don't. Um, even though you know we we heard about the

676
03:11:10.880 --> 03:11:27.840
limitations of of the police, but when you look at the police and the police resources and you look at EMhurst, we really have to think about what we want to invest in and public safety is more than just responding to 911 calls. Um,

677
03:11:27.840 --> 03:11:44.479
as we see from Crest data, um, I really think we need to really look at reallocation. I'd say let's study the impact of the police, but we actually have that study which is leap very clear. >> Um it's a roadmap that has never been followed. Um but if we really want to

678
03:11:44.479 --> 03:12:00.560
invest in public safety, let's look at reallocating resources to meaningful impactful programs like Crest, like DEI, like the fire department, and like public health. Um, so I really suggest

679
03:12:00.560 --> 03:12:17.439
that we take a broader look at who gets protected, how can we prevent um the lack of feeling of, you know, not being safe in this community and feeling included. And I think these other programs are really much more impactful than what I'm seeing in terms of APD.

680
03:12:17.439 --> 03:12:32.960
And I don't want to downplay the fact that yes, if you know my house is being broken into that I will call the APD and I hope that they will respond even if it's ICE. Um, but at the same time, when I think about long-term impact around prevention and inclusion and social

681
03:12:32.960 --> 03:12:48.479
justice, I think we really have to think about Crest DI um, board of health and the fire departments and reallocating some of the APD resources. Thank you. >> Thank you, Deborah. Yeah, I just wanted to to say thank you all for for

682
03:12:48.479 --> 03:13:04.800
listening to us and like I said, yeah, I think um, Council Breick, I don't know if there is a schedule. I think it was just good that we came on and I think you helped a lot to make that happen. But I I am saying that it would be nice to have a schedule um so that we can

683
03:13:04.800 --> 03:13:21.279
come back. But also I I really want to see I know a lot of notes have been taken and things like that. But you know really like timelines, deadlines, we put in a lot in our slides in terms of okay we want this to happen by this date you know because the thing is you know like even I was talking to my son when I was

684
03:13:21.279 --> 03:13:36.800
presenting today when I was preparing today and I was like it's basically the same presentation as back in November. You know what I'm saying? It's like I didn't have to really do much to to change it, you know? And that's doesn't feel good, you know? It doesn't feel

685
03:13:36.800 --> 03:13:53.279
good for a young person. He's 16 at Ammerst High. He's like, "Mom, why are you even doing it?" You know, if it really is not going to, and he's a black boy, you know, it's not really going to impact anything. They're not going to do anything. So, this is what a 16-year-old is feeling like. It's not going to do

686
03:13:53.279 --> 03:14:09.760
anything. Mom, look, you're, you know, you're volunteering your time. Spend time with me instead of doing a presentation that you're having to do every few months and cut and paste and sit there. But it's it's it's my spirit. You know what I'm saying? It's my energy. It's what I'm giving. and and I

687
03:14:09.760 --> 03:14:25.439
told my son, "No, I'm going to continue because it's important for the residents, for the people that contact me who are scared out of their minds." That's why I do it, right? And so for me, I'm I'm interested, you know, what's the timelines, deadlines, you know,

688
03:14:25.439 --> 03:14:40.319
let's get some of these things actually accomplished so I don't have to be back in another eight months and have to say the same things again. >> Thank you, Councelor Lord. Yes. I first wanted to say thank you very very much

689
03:14:40.319 --> 03:14:57.520
to um CSSJC for the work you do for this repeated presentation. Um there will be another motion about a regularity so that it'll just last for all times because it'll be written into something terms of bringing you before us and I do hope it won't be at such a

690
03:14:57.520 --> 03:15:13.439
late hour in the future and I just um yeah I support the recommendations. Thank you >> ever. Thank you. >> I I want to impart >> Please speak closer to your mic. You have one of the ones that requires it very near.

691
03:15:13.439 --> 03:15:30.479
>> I I want to impart in the committee that um crest has to be seen as a return on investment. It is the the big ticket items that's on our list all comes down to public safety and crest is a big

692
03:15:30.479 --> 03:15:47.120
factor in driving that. And one of the things that has to be articulated is that um in action is perceived as the town of Amherst not caring about um a part of its community. And when the

693
03:15:47.120 --> 03:16:03.600
community as a whole um works in concert with each other, it is a desirable place to be in a place to live. You heard tonight a lot of information about ICE and fear and kids

694
03:16:03.600 --> 03:16:20.720
and school. It all ties together and and that cannot be overlooked. There is no argument that a lot of these are big ticket items. It does cost money. But the question has to be asked is if

695
03:16:20.720 --> 03:16:37.760
we don't do anything, how much are we actually spending? And one of the conversations I've had with Chie and I wish he was still here is that there is full support for crest because funding crest and when I say

696
03:16:37.760 --> 03:16:52.720
funding crest I mean fully funding crest by the original design frees up APD to focus on other things that they don't need to do right now. There is support from APD. Those are cheating exact

697
03:16:52.720 --> 03:17:09.200
words. Um, so the question comes back to why does Crest have this budget that they cannot really do anything with? APD has a significant budget and

698
03:17:09.200 --> 03:17:27.359
I agree that if I call 911, I want the police to come. If I call Crest, it is because I do not need the police. I need Crest. I've had firsthand experience where people said, um, I called 911. What I

699
03:17:27.359 --> 03:17:42.000
really wanted was press, but the police came. Somebody was arrested that should not have been arrested, did not mean to be arrested. But when the police show up, they have very limited options. They have very limited options and that has

700
03:17:42.000 --> 03:17:58.399
to be considered. It is very problematic that we have this department that can do a lot of things that APD said, you know, they don't need to be doing, but we're not empowering them or funding them

701
03:17:58.399 --> 03:18:14.720
properly to do these things. So, when we talk about um people being scared to call 911, what is their alternative? It's you have a community that's living in the shadows that don't do anything, don't go anywhere.

702
03:18:14.720 --> 03:18:31.359
There is an impact to the community. It impacts people's mental health. It impacts people's way of life and quite frankly it impacts our economy. If people feel like a sanctuary city and we reaffirm a sanctuary city is not a

703
03:18:31.359 --> 03:18:49.439
sanctuary city, we are not going to have people want to come to Ampers, want to support local economies. Students are impacted, professors are impacted. If ICE is taking people from the community again, when school's not in session, we're not

704
03:18:49.439 --> 03:19:05.359
the economy shrinks and that matters. And so it has to be looked at holistically, not just in one singular piece. And appropriate funding, I would argue, is a long-term investment that will eventually save money for the

705
03:19:05.359 --> 03:19:22.160
town of Ammerst. It's if we do things peacemail or ignore certain things like Deborah says, we have these revolving conversations where nothing happens. All these additional studies, spending money, spending money, we did the studies. Let's act. we spend the money

706
03:19:22.160 --> 03:19:39.120
to do the studies. Let's follow the recommendations. Let's do what the study suggests. And quite frankly, every single person in here has a family, I imagine. So, we understand what it is like to budget. We know that there's things that you have to prioritize. We know there's things that

707
03:19:39.120 --> 03:19:52.880
you have to put in a different fiscal year. We know there are things you can say, "Okay, I may have been fully funded this year, but here's a line item or we thought we didn't have a surplus. Now, we do. we can go back and fully fund.

708
03:19:52.880 --> 03:20:12.160
Inaction is not the solution. And what and and I will close with this. I know it's at almost 11 o'clock. It's 2020 George Floyd 2022 July 5th. It's all been reactive. That should not be how town of Ammeris

709
03:20:12.160 --> 03:20:28.080
operates. It cannot be reactive as proactive. We label ourselves as very progressive, inclusive. If that is what we are, that is what we should be. We can do better and we should do

710
03:20:28.080 --> 03:20:46.960
better. >> Thank you. I see no other hands. Um so before I uh recognize the co-chairs of CSSJC to seek an adjournment of their portion of the meeting, um I want to say to my fellow counselors first and then

711
03:20:46.960 --> 03:21:03.920
I'll get back to the CSSJC. If there are any desired actions of the council or seeking of information from the town manager that come out of this, um please write your motions in writing under the rules. get them to us. If we receive

712
03:21:03.920 --> 03:21:19.520
them on a very quick turnaround, we might be able to get them on next Monday's agenda. Um otherwise, we will be discussing an agenda setting um when they might be able to go on um agenda setting. In the next week or so, we'll

713
03:21:19.520 --> 03:21:36.880
decide um whether we hold the June 29th meeting or not. It's always been a meeting scheduled if needed. We can't make that decision until after next week because we need to know what happens with the budget before we if if the budget is not passed on Monday or not

714
03:21:36.880 --> 03:21:53.680
fully acted on, we have to hold the meeting. But if it is fully acted on, we will be making decisions as to whether there's enough items on that agenda to hold it. So I would ask that if there's anything coming out of tonight's meeting that you would like on agendas, the sooner I know the better so that we can

715
03:21:53.680 --> 03:22:09.120
bring it to agenda setting to make those decisions. the meeting after um the 15th that will happen is in mid to late July. Um just keep that in mind. Um if if the June 29th meeting ends up getting

716
03:22:09.120 --> 03:22:26.319
cancelled and the next regular meeting after that is July 20th, I believe. Um so please keep that in mind. Anything from June 15th, next Monday, would need to be in Athena's hands by about um well, in writing by end of business on

717
03:22:26.319 --> 03:22:41.680
Wednesday, but we need to know about it earlier so that we can get it on an agenda before that because we we meet to talk agendas tomorrow. To CSSJC, I want to say thank you. Thank you for sticking it out till 11 p.m.

718
03:22:41.680 --> 03:22:57.359
Thank you for your presentation. Um, be in contact with counselors if there's things you want. Counselors just need to have stuff in writing and I will work on getting it on agendas. Um, I I look forward to working with you on other things, too. But, um, hopefully this is

719
03:22:57.359 --> 03:23:12.399
a meeting that seems to have been gone well compared to prior ones. So, so I'm I'm pleased that you were here, that you've stuck it out till 11:00 p.m. and that you took the time to make that presentation and work through uh the

720
03:23:12.399 --> 03:23:28.319
council liaison to come in front of us. So, thank you for that. With that, I'm going to pass it over to the CSSJC co-chairs to seek motions to adjurnn. >> Is there a motion from a member to adjurnn?

721
03:23:28.319 --> 03:23:45.920
Is there a second? Okay. Um, Emerald, >> Erica, >> yes. >> Lette, >> yes. >> I'm a yes. Deborah, >> yay. >> Uh, CSS Tracy is ajourned. >> Wait, Bridget. Bridget. >> Oh, oops. >> Yeah. >> Bridget. >> Anna.

722
03:23:45.920 --> 03:24:05.520
>> We're good. >> Anna. Yeah, I think she said you're good. >> She did. >> All right. Now, CSSGC is turned. And with that, is there I will make a motion to adjurnn the town council. Is there a second?

723
03:24:05.520 --> 03:24:25.760
>> Second. >> It it goes the second goes to to Lin Greamer. We start with Pam Rooney. >> Yes. >> Councelor Ryan. >> Hi. >> Kathy Shane is absent. Uh Jennifer Tob. >> Yes. >> Councelor Walker is absent. Councelor Brevik, >> yes.

724
03:24:25.760 --> 03:24:39.920
>> Councelor Kenna Martin, >> yes. >> Andy Churchill, >> yes. Anna Deon Gothier. >> Hi. >> Lyn Greimemer. >> Mandy Joe Hanicki is an I. Councelor Lord. >> Hi. >> And Sam Mloud. >> Hi. >> The council is adjourned with an unanimous vote 11 to zero with two

725
03:24:39.920 --> 03:24:43.840
absence. We are adjourned at 10:57