WEBVTT

METADATA
Video-Count: 1
Video-1: youtube.com/watch?v=_-_dCfD0Tf0

NOTE
MEETING SECTIONS:

Part 1 (Video ID: _-_dCfD0Tf0):
- 00:00:00: Meeting Opening, Pledge of Allegiance, Roll Call, Agenda Review
- 00:02:17: 702 Summerfield Avenue Presentation Introduction and Overview
- 00:06:17: Doug Mlullen Civil Engineer Presents Parking Modifications
- 00:11:15: Discussing Meter Placement, Trash Room Size, Alleyway Easement
- 00:15:54: Trash Room Details, Alley Usage and Lighting Review
- 00:23:18: Pedestrian Safety, Drainage, Retail Space and Storage
- 00:27:25: Director of Planning Discusses Alleyway Liabilities and Ownership
- 00:34:33: Board Member Questions Retail Space Square Footage, Utility Access
- 00:38:45: Opening to Public for Questions to the Engineer
- 00:39:17: Matthew Seckler Traffic Engineer Presents Car Stacker Operation
- 00:44:20: Car Stacker Electric Vehicle Chargers and Space Allocation
- 00:50:06: Car Stacker Billing, Parking Permits, EV Chargers and Car Dimensions
- 00:55:27: Ceiling Height Dimensions, SUV Compatibility and a Traffic Study
- 00:57:25: Parking Study Review with the Traffic Engineer
- 00:59:43: Traffic Supply and Parking Space Inventory Discussion
- 01:01:07: Closing Questions for Traffic Engineer and Introduction for Architect
- 01:01:25: James Moner Architect Presents Floor Plan Updates
- 01:06:15: Addressing Knee Wall, Storefront Rendering and Wood Fence
- 01:07:04: Discussion of Basement Layout, Flipping Units and Balcony Addition
- 01:09:34: Addressing Rooftop Lighting, Screen Wall Setback, Phantom Door
- 01:11:59: Artificial Turf and Rooftop Details Review
- 01:14:24: Color Selection, Hardy Panel and Architectural Design Waiver
- 01:16:14: Lead Checklist, Certified Bricks and Sign Concerns
- 01:20:34: Questions Regarding the Variances: Height, Zoning and Incompatibilities
- 01:25:53: Open to Public for Questions to the Architect
- 01:26:07: Public Comment by Stephen Moroc on Parapet and Lighting Concerns
- 01:28:16: Motion for a Break
- 01:29:17: Christine Nazaro Professional Planner Testifies
- 01:32:14: Details on Three Minor Variances
- 01:34:56: Discussing Appropriate Population Densities and Civic Design
- 01:37:52: Reviewing Negative Criteria and Redevelopment Plan Goals
- 01:42:10: Discussion Topographical Features, Positive And Negative Criteria Review
- 01:45:38: Motion to Open the Public Comment Again
- 01:45:53: Public Comment by Stephen Moruck reiterates the Parking Concern
- 01:47:26: Board Member Comments and Discussion on Street Views and Storefronts
- 01:52:01: Stackers Discussion and Questions Regarding Their Safety
- 01:56:54: Resolution Compliance Conditions and Planning Board Vote


Part: 1

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Right. Welcome everyone. Today is Monday, May 18th, 2026, and this is a regular meeting of the city of Asbury Park Planning Board. Chairwoman Kurszac, can you please call this meeting to order? >> Yes. This meeting is being held in the complies the Open Public Meetings Act,

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chapter 231, Public Law 1975. Adequate notice of this meeting has been provided to the star ledger, the coaster and the maserie park press by publication of the annual meeting notice and post on the municipal bulletin board and municipal website. All notices are on file with

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the board secretary. Official action may be taken on the following matters before the board. This meeting is being recorded by APV for your future viewing pleasure. Please join me. Salute the flag. Pledge allegiance to

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the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. >> I'll take roll call. Um, James Banano >> here. >> Councilwoman Clayton

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>> here. >> Jim Henry >> here. >> Mayor Moore >> here. >> Jen Ser >> here. >> Dan Shaneo >> here. Bob Zuckermanman is absent. Kathy McGlaughlin >> here. Um, >> Vice Chair Gonan >> here.

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>> And Chairwoman Carzac here. >> Uh, first item on our agenda is the uh the Johnny back resolution. Uh, I do want to ask the uh, planning board members if they had I know that he came in late via email. I don't know if uh,

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if anybody did not get a chance to go through it, we don't have to deal with it today. But if you did get a chance, um, >> are we okay >> for Donnie Mack or did you not see that yet? >> Okay, >> I came in. >> It came in late.

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>> Came in late. >> I didn't read it, but if you guys said you read it, it's good. I have no problem. >> Okay. So, I don't think that enough people have had a chance to read it. >> Uh, since it came in late. So, let's move that to the next meeting. Got it.

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whatever the whatever that may be. All right, the next item on the agenda is 702 Somefield Avenue. >> So, while the applicate team is coming up, u Mr. Goon uh witnessed that he did he certified that he reviewed the uh um

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hearing transcript from the last meeting. I don't think there was anyone else who was absent at that last meeting. I believe everyone else was present. Is that correct? >> It was uh was it Bob? >> Bob, >> but he's not here. So, yeah. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Uh, good evening everyone. Jason

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Tubvel, um, attorney for the applicant. Um, I think the last time we were were here was on March 3rd. It seems longer than that, but about 2 and 1/2 months ago. So, if the board recalls, you heard testimony from our um, architect, our civil engineer, and our traffic engineer

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at that meeting. Um and we where we ended it was uh the board had some comments that they wanted us to address between the first meeting and this meeting. So what we did is we revised our plans. Um they were resubmitted to the board. Um we also had met with your

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professionals to go over what those plan revisions would be to get their guidance on on those issues. Um and those all were enumerated in the in the response letters that we provided. But high level and then we'll go through all the testimony. U with the witnesses is first

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we were able to get another six parking spaces at um on the plan. So we went from 27 parking spaces to 33. Remember there are 30 units proposed. So there's now more than one to one parking and we were able to do that without

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compromising the retail space. So we're able to get more parking and also keep the ground floor retail. We were able to uh add more storage units. That was something that the board had asked um for for the residents. We enlarged the trash room and had put shoots on each

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floor. That was also something that the board and the board's professionals had asked for. A compactor was also added. Um as well, we added a new bike room to add to get 30 bikes uh to be able to get parked there.

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We made changes to the uh roof plan in light of some of the comments as it relates to lighting and screening um that the board and some members of the public had. We'll also show an updated rendering showing the materials um and the colors that are being proposed as

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the board wanted some more specificity on that issue. And then finally, um, our civil engineer went through your board, um, engineers comment letter and also some of the comments that were made and updated the civil plans, um, to address those items. So, we I think we made some

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significant progress based on both the board and the professionals comments. So, Madam Chair, I have three witnesses that I plan on sorry, I have four witnesses that I plan on calling. Three, I'm going to call back. So, I'm going to start with our civil engineer, then go to our traffic engineer, just deal with the site and the traffic first. Then,

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we'll go back to the architect to go over those changes, and then hopefully we'll get to our professional planner as the last uh witness. >> Um, we we need to get the um we need to get this screen to >> show that. All right. Looks like uh we had to move

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it closer to the planning board. So, we'd like to offer if there anyone from the public that would like to also see this that they could want to move their chairs like behind our professionals so they could also view these if they would like. I figure that all of you guys know

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what it looks like anyway. Exactly. HOPEFULLY YOU KNOW WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE. >> There's >> Yeah. >> All right. >> Are we good? >> Okay, we're we're good. But you know, if the public ever wants to move over, feel free. >> Sure. >> Move your chairs.

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>> All right. So, what I'd like to do is recall our engineer, um, Doug Mlullen. So, do we need to reswear him in or >> We don't need to rewear him in, but but you do understand your cell growth, right? >> Yes, I do. >> Okay. Vic still current in good standing? >> Yes, it is. >> Okay, great. All right. So why don't we

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give the board an overview of the modifications that we made to the site plan in lie of the comments that were made. I would just just stick to the civil aspects of it and then we'll get obviously get to the architect afterwards. >> Yeah. And if you could blow that up a little bit so we could see it better.

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>> Yeah. And as um the board attorney mentioned, we're up to A4. So let's just mark this Doug if that's okay. >> Does this have a revision date? >> Uh it does. Yes. 5:1526 >> and it was prepared by Insight.

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>> Yes. >> Thank you. >> Okay. So, uh going over a summary of the changes from the prior plan. Uh I'm going to start with parking. Um our total our proposed total parking

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spaces is now up to 33. Um which is six more than we had previously. Uh that includes 28 ADA spaces, uh seven compact spaces, and 11 car lift spaces. Um >> and then how many are you short?

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>> So uh 45 are required. >> 45 are required and you have 33. >> Correct. Correct. in the new in the new world. >> All right. Can you can you go over how you came how you >> gained these spaces? >> I can spaces. So, starting in the

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southwest corner, uh we have seven compact spaces here. Uh previously we had six. So, by going to compact, we were able to gain one space. Um you know, with the column layouts, we took a look at we took a look at trying

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to maximize parking in every way possible. um column layout played a big role. Um we also looked into potentially losing more retail. Um and you know doing tandem spaces. It it came down to

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being able to provide sufficient turning movement. Um you know so it it it really wasn't ideal to lose more retail space. Um so instead we decided to go with this um automated car lift machine which uh

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it occupies six parking spaces on the ground and it provides for 11. So you'll see here there's a u a vshape that identifies it always keeps one space open uh and sort of shuffles the cars um you know so

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there's 12 spots one always remains open and ultimately it provides for um 11 parking spaces. So, is this not stackers? It's one of those. >> It's like a car. It's like a carousel. >> Yeah. >> Right. >> Okay. >> So, who who operates these? >> So, I was going to have if it's okay,

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Madam Chair, with you. >> I have the traffic engineer who is going to go into how how it works, how it operates. I just wanted Doug to do the layout. Okay. >> But, but I promise you, we looked into all that and we'll have all that information and obviously happy to answer questions if if we don't.

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>> All right. So, were there any compact spaces prior to you creating seven compact spaces? >> There were not. >> Okay. So, everything was a full space prior to this. >> Correct. But we were able to gain uh one extra space by going to compact. We

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looked at potentially using more, but um between the way the columns were lay out laid out, there really was no way to gain additional space by going by providing more compact. Um so, we're going we are sticking with seven compact for now. Um so as I mentioned for a 30

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unit mixeduse building with um 1962 square ft of retail um 45 parking spaces are required. Um that remaining balance of required parking spalls is proposed to be made up and offset by a payment in

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Lu um which is authorized under ordinance 2-87. Um factoring in the the compliance with the state EV mandate. Um we have an eight space deficit. Um and the compact

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stalls I mentioned were added in the southwest corner. Um which gained us one space and we gained five spaces by adding the car lift. Um, we did take a look at all of the parking spaces and confirm that, um, with a turning

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movement plan, including the car lift, that um, turning movement uh is safe and and entirely reasonable for all of the available spaces. Um, moving on to some of the other changes, we have uh a meter

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al cove that was added here on the western facade of the building. Uh, where we plan to propose an electric and gas meter. Um, water meters will be located out by the sidewalk. Um, one for fire, one for domestic. Uh, and then the

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electric meters in all likelihood will be uh internal to the building. Um, so they'll be adequately screened from public view. Um, the trash room. I know I know our architect is going Yes. Go ahead.

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>> Go back over that. What was that? >> What's on the outside wall? >> So, uh, one gas meter. >> I'm sorry. Did I have that wrong? >> There may need to be one electric meter there as well. >> Master service. Yeah, but um the water

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meters will be in the sidewalk um and then just just one gas meter. So, we're not doing individual meters for each unit. >> Okay. They're going to be inside in the basement. >> Correct. >> Okay. >> And no meters. >> Correct.

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>> What's the percent of the proposed access? >> So, uh >> this is in that alleyway. >> Yeah. We we talked about early uh at the last meeting. I I'll pull up an existing exhibit here so you can see. Um >> that was the first exhibit that was

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>> the same exhibit I presented last time. Uh it's dated 21226 and it's just an aerial view of the existing conditions. So there is an existing 7 foot wide alley here to our west. Um in real life

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it's about 10 ft wide like in terms of operationally and functionally. So, so part of it's on your property. >> Part of it's on our property. Yeah. So, in order to maintain that and keep, you know, keep it functioning as it is today, uh, we're providing an additional

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3ft easement to make that whole 10 ft. So, uh, you know, it it's it'll, you know, we're losing some developable space, but, you know, functionally, we understand it serves, you know, neighbors of the community. So, uh, we figured that was important. Uh, >> I forget. You put the fence there. No,

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there's no fence there now. I know there's a gate at the street, but there's no fence that goes down. >> There's a gate across, but there's there's no fence there. >> Are you putting a fence? >> No. >> So, I have a question about that gate. So, if this alleyway is for emergency

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egress because one of the staircases comes out that way. Is that gate like can I've never seen it locked, but is that >> lockable? I mean, it's like a city thing, right? It's a city city right away. I don't know who owns it or why or

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why it's there. Um, but it does appear to be open most of the time. So, it I, you know, it provides some security for uh the buildings on the front on Main Street. There's this courtyard back here that is

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used, I'm sure, by um some of the restaurants and stuff that are there. >> You know whose property that we don't know whose property? >> It's the city's property. It is the city. >> Yeah. It's not a separate privately owned lot. So that's why we were giving the city back that easement for the 3T >> public easement over that for the joint buildings.

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>> Yes, we're we're giving Yes, we're giving the city the 3 ft so that it could remain at 10 ft wide >> just as far as emergency egress goes. Is there a code like can that gate >> be there? I mean, >> right. Is there is there a door there so

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that people can get out in that alley in your building? Is there a door? >> If there's a door, then >> there's a door to the alley. >> No, no, the door right to the alley from this building. >> Yeah. >> Yes. Let's say let's say this building centers on fire. People will come down

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the staircase and go out to the alley. Are they now trapped? >> Well, we have to What happens to the gate? Cuz I think the gate has to go. >> That's up to the city. >> Yeah, we have no issue with that. Obviously, we >> we would we would support that 100%.

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>> Gate. >> Yes. But yes, but then if they're stuck, our city gets sued. >> We could we I think you could you could do it both way, two ways. You could either have no gate like you're saying or you just have one of those emergency fire push gates there where if the gate is closed, you could push it out in the

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event of an emergency where you can where you can go out like an emergency exit. >> I guess if it's a city gate, it's just not locked. >> I've never seen it. >> Yeah, I've never seen. >> But we're happy to coordinate that to make sure it complies with code. >> Okay. >> Yeah. Okay. Thanks. Sure.

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>> Um, moving on to the trash room. So, that was enlarged. It is now compliant in terms of square footage. It's approximately 396 square ft. Uh, it includes an area for a compactor um and easy access to bins that can be

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wheeled uh to the curb through the alley. Um, so there's no no dumpsters per se. Everything is um smaller bins that are easily wheeled. Uh we have a large uh overhead door on the trash room for easy access um through the alley. Um

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and we also intend on uh improving that alley as part of this uh development. So um you know fresh coat of pavement as well. Uh but it'll all help facilitate getting that that refuge out to the curb uh on Somerfield. >> Is your property a beneficiary of that

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east as well? I don't believe it's it's not an ement. It's a public rightway. >> Yeah, it's like a It says It says 7 foot alley on or on the tax map. So, it's really like a Sorry, >> it's a 7 foot access, but then the back

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lot is privately owned. >> Yes. >> So, the back lot right there. >> Yeah. No, I I know. So, is it all adjoining property owners have right over it? >> Yeah, this is right here. >> No, that's just their lot. So, the restaurant, the commercial space that's

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right there. I believe there was an arc in the rear lot. >> No, go by the alley. The alley would be public. Yes. >> Can you just point to the back lot? >> Sure. >> Yeah. Zoom out. Um Doug, just go maybe go back to the first exhibit. >> Yeah, this is it right here up. Let me

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go to the uh existing. So, uh lot eight. Uh the northern and eastern property lines are here. Um that's lot 8 block 256. >> Yeah. So they would benefit I guess from

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us giving the easement and also resurfacing and repaving that alley too. >> So >> it we don't know. Uh could be it could be employees. Um >> yeah it's not part of our development. >> It may be used as like loading for the

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restaurant uses there. >> Yeah. >> U speculating. But uh they also have this lot also has frontage on on Main Street. >> Okay. So um >> All right. How how much bigger did you

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make the trash room from? What it was and where did you get the space? >> So there used to be and this is I'm I'm stepping into Jim's territory here, but there used to be a bike room here. Um that bike room was moved to this uh

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souththeastern corner. It was enlarged and there's now room for 30 bikes there. And then the trash room was expanded to take over that space where the bike room was. Um and then additionally, you know, in terms of adding space to the lower

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trash room, it is now compliant in terms of space. We also added a trash room on each floor um that'll have a chute um leading to the compactor down at the the lower level. >> Yeah. And the architect will show that on the floor plans so you can see it.

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>> So we talked about the bike room um >> goes directly to the trash on the >> Yes. Yep. Trash room's uh in the same location on each floor and goes directly to the trash room. Um, regarding the fence, so we always

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had a fence uh starting here um where it says fence start and end. >> Just just for the record, just indicate where that is on the plan though. >> So that is the um southeast corner on the on this jog here that's shared with um that lot 8. Uh and

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then it follows the property line all the way uh connects to the bike room, comes out the other side and then connects back to the building uh here on the on the eastern corner. Um we clarified that that is a 6ft high um

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solid wood fence. Uh I did note that there was a a comment in terms of no color specified on our plans um which I will I will defer that to the architect. I'm sure that uh in terms of coloring um you know we'll find something that

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that goes well with the building or if there's something that the city would prefer to see. Um but we did specify wood um for longevity's sake and um it's 6' tall and solid. Um let's see here. Lighting. I did want

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to talk about lighting. We are >> solid fence. >> Solid fence. Yep. And before I move on to lighting, we did and Jim will talk about this too, but uh there was some concerns about security in the in the parking area. We have a garage door. Uh

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this was previously open here, the hallway on the western side. Um so we did add a door uh for security. So the entire perimeter of the parking area will be contained via a man door, a garage door, and then that 6ft solid

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fence. um lighting. We did revise the fixture utilized on the front facade of the building um to be a more of a widespread uh throw uh architectural wall sconce. We needed uh to use less of them. We

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have one, two, three, four on the facade of the building um which throw light out onto the sidewalk as well as um you know they have a pretty wide throw as well. created a lot better uniformity for the sidewalk. Um, we did not add the street

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lights only because I received direction from um the director of planning and redevelopment that we shouldn't do street lights. So, um, you know, if the city's preference is to have street lights, we're happy to work that out with the city. Um, but I will say the

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the overall lighting of the sidewalk is much safer, much more uniform, and uh casts a nice light over the sidewalk for uh for pedestrian safety. >> Are you lighting the alley? >> We are. Yeah, we are using um a little

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more muted of a light. We have three light fixtures on the alley uh with the understanding there are a few adjacent buildings here. So trying to minimize how much um heads their way uh and just kind of light that alleyway. But yes, we are providing light along the alley and

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then along the sidewalk. And then we also took the recommendation of your uh planner to provide ballard lighting. You can see that with these uh these circles here in the open air section of the parking. So, previously we had a few

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building mounted lights here. Um I think there was some concern about uh light spillage potentially glare. So, this brings the light down to the ground level um with ballard lights that'll be shielded by that 6ft solid fence. And

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>> how tall are the balls? >> Uh the lights are about 3 and 1/2 ft off the ground. with just the top portion has lens. >> Correct. >> Yep. Yep. >> Um we also did add a visual and auditory pedestrian warning system at the garage

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entrance. Um and then finally, uh the drainage system. Uh we took the recommendation of your board engineer um to eliminate all of those. We, if you remember, we had a bunch of curb perforations um along Somerfield being

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that there was was no infrastructure available. Um so we've pivoted to follow his recommendation and we have um a single exit point from the building that'll connect to a B inlet out in Somerfield Avenue. It'll have a sump. uh it'll be able to infiltrate some water

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and then the remaining water it'll essentially be a bubbler inlet where that water it's in the gutter and it'll maintain its uh path through the gutter all the way to the inlet out in Main Street. >> And thank you I think I feel that the city benefits from that but if you look

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at your grading plan >> Yep. >> you're going to be creating two low spots at each of the aprons. uh you reconstruct that concrete gutter. So page so you zoom in. So it's not it's not egregious, but you're going to be creating two low spots at the apron. >> Okay.

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>> You're already doing all the sidewalk. If you just reconstruct the concrete curve and gutter, you'll be able to catch that pitch from the inlet to where you're leading west. >> Okay. >> Six inches. >> So you're already going some. So if you keep going, >> not a problem.

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>> Yeah. We'll be able to um >> So you're saying to to redo the >> So if you reconstruct so you're doing like 28 >> reconstruct the whole gutter basically. >> 282 you're going you have six in you.

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So you have like six inches to play. >> Okay. >> Just right now you're making like two small bird baths at the end of the >> Yeah, we'll take care of that. Um not a problem at all. Uh that's about it in terms of the engineering changes. There's another a

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number of other changes uh made to the building um that we we we made after hearing your feedback, but our hap our architect will be happy to review those with you. Uh, real quick, the parking I know. So, just so the board's aware, we did have conversation about I don't want

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to take liberties of saying getting rid of retail, but the possibility of shrinking some of the retail and what g potentially gain from it. You're really not gaining much parking at all with removing the retail. With that being said, I do know that the board is very adamant about parking. So, if there is

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any consideration of adding things more stacking or carousel, the board will very >> Okay. How do you in that game pocket eliminate? >> So it's your travel way. So if you let's uh do >> you basically have to put another

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driveway on center field. >> Okay. >> That was three. It's just >> you can't get >> Well, unless you did tandem, but still you're the circular. >> Exactly. >> Yeah. >> Does the same. >> You probably get more from stack.

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>> Yeah. And like I said, the um the traffic engineer will go through the parking and the stackers and we could talk more about it. You'd also mentioned that more storage was provided. Can you show us what happened there? >> That that's in the basement. So in the basement. >> Okay. So that's a different >> I was going to have the architect show

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that >> fine. As long as as long as we cover it. >> We'll cover everything. >> As long as we cover everything. >> Yes. >> Sam, excuse me. On the uh inlet that you're putting in, >> is that having the a solid bottom? >> So it's going to be a sunk face. So what

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the sump face means is there's no solid bottom. It's going to have a circular hole. that's gonna be packed in stone and then wrapped with fabric. The idea is that any water that percolates into that catch basin will >> percolate hole per the ground. Yes. >> Okay. I just want to make sure you weren't going to get a septic action

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there. >> Okay. >> I know we'd also discussed um something about a knee wall. Is that is that Doug or is that someone else? >> That's someone else. Okay. >> And just for the record, the compact spaces are high.

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They are the city standard which is or maybe a little wider. They're uh 8 by 15. Got it. Thank you. >> Okay, that's all I have for for Doug. >> Okay, you said you talked to the director of planning about the street lights. Did you talk to the director of

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planning about this quagmire about that 7 foot alleyway that's going to become a 10ft alleyway and who's going to be liable for it when your custodian's rolling out the garbage and he trips? Is he suing the city or is he suing you? Why didn't you try to buy this alley

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from the city? Obviously the city knew nothing about it cuz we've never paved it plowed it in 35 years since I've been in the city. So, I mean, but again, if you're going to use this alleyway that's city owned to keep out take out your trash or anything, now

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you're putting the city in a liability if you got trips, somebody gets hit. So, you talked to her about lighting. Why didn't you talk to her about this alleyway? Um I what I would say is if we're giving an easement for the 3 ft there and we're

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going to utilize it. >> Yeah. If you're going to utilize the city 7 ft also and again like if your people get hurt who's being sued >> the owner of the city. >> Yeah. But it's it's already a right of way. It's it's already being used as as

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as public as a public right of way. So that would happen regardless. >> So I think what the mayor is asking though is if the city vacates the right of way being absorbed by you all and then you can make an easement 10 foot easement instead of three. Is that >> the thing is if you vacate it if you vacate it though um you have to split

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it. >> Yeah. >> So so if you vacate it if the city were to say we don't want this anymore >> and we're to vacate it. >> You don't you don't have to split it. So it'll go to each side first that would technically this is an easement by necessity because you need to have that parking in the rear

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>> in the back. >> In the back they have access to >> right so they have access to it. So you have an easement by necessity. So what that would create is even if it's both sides were to absorb, they'd still have to have that alley park. I'm not trying to play just but what what you're

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missing I think is it's it's lot eight who is using that alleyway. They would not get that other half. >> I I don't know what the lot is facing main street but it's the hardware that I'm saying is that you'd have an ether but so this is serveing so I'll speak on

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that. So you'd have an ether by necessity creating a a necessary access to continue that parking in the rear. >> But you have to >> but here's the only issue with it just to finish the the thought and I understand the thought which is let's say we were to purchase that from the

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city which is 7 ft wide right then now we would become a grand tour to lot 8 in the back and become their easement. We'd have to enter into an agreement with them regarding their property. Well, you bought the property from How hard would

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that be? >> No. >> Didn't you buy it from >> That's not L. >> No. Okay. >> Yeah. Yeah. I know what you're saying. The hardware store. It's not the hardware store. It's the It's the other It's the property to the south. It's the property to the south. >> Mhm. >> The Windsor building the corner.

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>> Yeah. So, but what we could do if you're worried about it from a a liability perspective is when we give the three-foot easement to the city to use our property, we can have a an indemnification provision in

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that in that um easement that I could work out with with with the board attorney on if you're worried about liability. I'm just saying we can control what we can control and I understand your comment to that in that regard. So we could we could deal with that specific issue as it relates to our

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property in in an easement. >> Couldn't you just put a fence through your three feet and then just use your three feet and have to worry about it? >> No, cuz you're you're allowed. I'm not I don't >> if he maintains the seven ft easement right away. He puts the fence on his property.

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>> So right now lot eight has vehicular access that you see it parked back there. I understand that. But only they only legally have the right over seven feet unless there's something else. You know, >> not really. >> But the point that's the point description. >> Yeah.

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>> I mean, do they need more than 7 ft to get through? >> Kind of. 7 ft's not really a travel way. Most like SUVs or trucks wouldn't fit. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. We wanted We thought we were doing the right thing by maintaining the tent so that they could still get back there, but technically the city could close it

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if they wanted. That could also happen. >> Well, that might be >> that's going to be my recommendation be taking >> seems like >> I mean why should the why take the chance on liability? >> Yeah. >> I mean again we've been lucky. This has

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been going on for 100 years and the city never knew they owned it. And now that we know we own it, I mean like >> I think lot eight would will be able to get easement out of necessity though because they even if we did vacate it,

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it would still have to be. >> Okay. Well, >> no problem. So long as the city's liability. >> I mayor, I understand the liability concern. That's why like I said if if we go down the route of easement I could work with council on

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>> but but it's not getting >> the other properties I I don't know how >> it's not getting rid of the problem with lot 8. >> Yeah that you would have to deal with as a count as the council. Yes, you have to deal with that separately. >> Could you actually identify the city for for a person that tended to be building?

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>> Yeah, you would you you could have language in there regarding you would have like No, no, no. It wouldn't be in the lease. It would be since it's a condo building because it's a condo building the association would be bound by the uh by the document but we would have like negligence provisions.

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>> You would have to have that in there as well. >> Yeah. In the comments. >> Yeah. Yeah. It would be subject to Yeah. >> Right. Cuz we're cuz we're not only dealing with the garbage, we're also dealing with emergency eress. >> Right. Not that you'll have to use it

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that often, but when you have everybody exiting the building, the mayor's the >> We could we could again as it relates just to us, >> we could work on the on the issue the mayor is talking about. >> And what about vehicles going down there hitting into your building?

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>> I mean, if that's a if that's a vehicular access, >> we're keeping it at 10 ft the way it's being used now. That's not >> that's a typical travel that can happen at any building, right? Yeah, 10 10 ft sufficient.

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>> Just go up on the sidewalk in New York. >> Well, I mean, you you can't you can't prevent that, >> but as far as a travel way, 10 ft sufficiently wide. >> Right. >> So, I I I do have a couple questions.

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What's the square footage of the commercial space? I know that your architect may talk about that too, but I just want to make sure we have it clear on the record. >> It is uh 1962 ft. >> Okay. Cuz I think >> there's a there's >> your comments a different number, right? >> It's 1,200.

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>> Everything says 1,200 because our plans say 1,200, >> but uh before the meeting we >> we resolved that it's 1962. >> Okay. And that's your plans and the architect's plans are consistent with that number. They say

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>> consistent with >> they will be consistent with that number. >> Yes. And we'll have our architect confirm that. >> Okay. >> Uh and then the other question is you're putting the master um access uh area for the electric and the gas in

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that little al cove. Are there any issues or concerns with the alleyway and and vehicles traveling up and back uh that alleyway? um recess >> there. It's not there. It's a recess. It's a It's a straight run here as well.

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There's no there's no turning that needs to happen in this area, but we we could implement a few ballards for additional safety. >> Okay. >> If the gate is there and the utility companies genuine question, if the gate's there and the utility companies say, "Hey, I'm not going down there because I'm going to fill up this gate."

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Where are they going to go? Uh we talked about potentially using um >> the wall of the bike room uh as an additional backup plan. >> But yes, we we hope the gate's not there.

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>> Yeah. >> Any other questions from the board? Sam, did you say if they got rid of all the commercial space, they wouldn't add that much parking? >> No. >> We looked at that with with them based on the last meal

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>> because they'd have to go tandem and they could do that with the carousel. >> So, there's there's two ways of doing it. You'd either throw tandem spaces in front of the ones that are already behind the retail space. So since they're tandem, we have the same problem

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we had before where how many people have to share which parking spaces. The other way is if you put another driveway on Summerfield and come in through the retail space and you just park on either side of it, >> but it's not that deep. So you really

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only pick up like three spaces tightly. >> That's all. >> Then you're going to lose the one that's all >> and then you lose the the two that are in Yeah. So, it's a net loss >> and you give the extra driveway on Somerfield. >> I'm sorry to bring this issue back up, but I just want to try to close the loop

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on it if we can. The alley, if if the board is concerned about the alley, we were going to give the easement, give the 3 ft. We thought that that was what the board would have wanted because to maintain, right, the access to the back. If the if the city wants to vacate that

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in the future or doesn't want to deal with it anymore, we can just put up a fence where the three like sort of what you were saying before and just use that to take garbage out to the um to the to the street, use it as our second means of egress and not >> that gets back to necessity that lot 8

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now saying, "Hey, restricting my access." That's >> I'm just >> we can just use what's on our property if that's if that's what the city would prefer. We don't have to >> adverse possession. >> Well, so adverse possession is different. So you adverse possession is a claim ownership that they've been

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utilizing for over 30 years. >> Well, then yeah, but it's adverse possession of having a beneficiary easement. They didn't have an easement. They they've only had, you know, an easement through adverse possession of their three chief.

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>> Yeah. I'm just saying we could if that's what the board prefers. We don't have a preference either way. >> Is it 30 years in New Jersey? >> Yeah. If it's a like a city, if it's Ball Street, it's 50 years. >> Yeah. If it's vacant land >> vacant land, it's I think it's 60 actually. Yeah. >> Any other

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>> We can revisit that. >> Yeah. Any other questions from any board members from our professionals? Are you satisfied with what's been uh discussed? >> You're good. >> Okay. Uh we'd like to open it to the public. If anyone from the public has

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any questions of the engineer uh on anything that was transpired today, please step up. >> Okay. Next. >> Okay. Next witness is our traffic engineer, Matthew Seckler with Stonefield Engineering and Design. He

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was also sworn and testified at the last meeting. So, we'll just confirm that he's on the road again. You understand that you remain under oath? >> Yes, I do. >> All right. >> Yeah.

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This is the only thing. >> All right, Matt, your license current in good standing still? >> Yes, they are. >> Okay. So, you've had a chance to review the updated parking layout that the applicant has prepared? >> Yes, I have. >> All right. And you're also aware that they're going to the goal is to

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accomplish this with a vehicle stacking system. Correct. >> Correct. >> All right. Can you give an opinion a on the on the new parking layout and also on the adequacy of the carousel or the stacker that the client is proposing? >> Absolutely. And you heard from the previous witness uh we will be providing

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33 physical spaces as part of this proposed development. I would note that based on the EV uh parking ordinance that would actually be 37 as it relates to the zoning calculation for parking we're providing but clearly there are 33 physical spaces out there in the parking

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lot which again exceeds the 1:1 ratio uh per unit. Uh in terms of the stackable spaces um what we have shown here and this is an exhibit that I prepared um >> so we're up to 85 just identify it for the record >> it's titled parking stacker operations

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claus multi parking and today's date what this shows is um generally how this uh operation works and I'll explain it both using these uh images as well as uh kind of explain it as a driver approaching the site as well but essentially what you have is you have an

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upper level and a lower level. The lower level just moves side to side and always has at least one empty space. So you only have in this case we have um you know we have six space rows. So you only have five parked cars in the lower level. The top level would have the six

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car stack but the bottom level only moves side to side and the top level only moves up and down. So essentially, if you were approaching and you had the you came from your apartment and you went downstairs and your car is parked on upper level three, which is the dark

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gray uh um car here. The first thing that happens is the lower level car is moved to the left. The upper level car, your car on the top, will then move down and then you'll be able to drive your car out. And I'll explain the safety measures and kind of how that operation works. But I just wanted the board to

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understand that essentially all the operations is the bottom level moves right and left. And when an opening occurs, the top level goes down >> each individually space. Right. So if you were number two on the top level, just the bottom, the gray one would move over and drop down.

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>> Exactly. Exactly. And if you were a ground level two, the gate would open and you would your car would be available. You wouldn't have to have anything moving around in that case. And and I guess Matt, if you were going to say this, sorry. If in based on where your car is, what's the length of time that it takes for you to get your car?

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>> So I'll explain that as as we go through. So if you're a bottom level car, um essentially you arrive if you're walking up, meaning that you're coming from your apartment, most likely you have a key fob. You wave the key fob in front of the the basically the central command for this unit. It basically

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knows that that key fob is associated with let's say upper level three. What there's a gate to protect the system. so that people are not walking around the system when it's active. The gate would open. You would well first the cars would maneuver. The car would drop down to the bottom level. The gate would

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open. You'd be able to get into your car. When you get your car and you leave, just like if you had a garage door in a single family house, you have to basically press the clicker to close the system up again when you're done. If no one closes it after five minutes essentially, then the next person that

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arrives has to manually override the system with a little button just to confirm that there's no one in the system. When the gate is open from a security reason, you don't want a child, a ball, a bike, something to get into the system. Basically, you have to

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manually see that there is no one in the system. You press the button and the gates would close again. Then you could start your maneuver. When you come back and you're driving home, similar to having a, you know, key five or a garage door opener, you would press the garage

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door opener when you're in front of the unit, doors would open. It would basically, if you're on the top level unit, it would have made room for your car to just drive into, in this case, let's say, ground level three. And then you load up your car. You get out of the

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system, you press uh your key fob on the way out, so it knows you're out of the system, and it would raise your unit. bottom floor. Super easy. You just, you know, the gate opens when you're when you get there, closes when you uh return. >> And you are these assigned or you

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>> these are all assigned. So, you always will be on You always be parked in the exact same spot. >> And And I guess I guess they'll fight over who gets the regular parking space versus >> I guess. So, I will say we have agreed that these would all be EV parking um uh

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units as well. So if you are an EV parker, you would have one of these stacker systems. We were able to install. >> You'll have all charging built in. And they're also heavy duty. They're actually weighted for the additional weight. A lot of times electric vehicles are heavier than standard vehicles. So these are these are upgraded to be able

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to keep to that spot. Correct. That's not each time you spot. And I will tell you when you start the system, so when you um when management comes and you know people start moving in basically they could fit the parking space to each

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individual car. So because different cars have different let's say uh uh uh lengths between tires, they basically put a wheel stop in. So when someone approaches and they drive in basically they know when to stop. That basically is can be custom fitted for every single

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car that utilizes that that system. >> Well, is it open on the back? Is it open on the back? >> It It's against the wall. >> No, it's against the wall. It's against the back of the retail space. So, it's a one-way uh drive in drive out. In terms of time, between 45 seconds to a minute

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if you're one of the upper units, it's about 10 to 15 seconds if you're one of the lower units because it's really just the gate opening and closing. >> So, So, Oh, go ahead. Go ahead. Go ahead. So, my fault is going to automatically recognize that my car is on the second level and it's number

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three. >> Yeah. If you're in, let's say, upper level two and that's the spot you're assigned to. When you come down with your, you know, your work bag in the morning, you scan the fob, it knows that you arrive. So, what it'll do is in the bottom level, it would spread the two cars out and bring your car down because

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you're the top top car. And then the gate would open so you could get into your car. >> And if there's two people there at the same, >> it's 45 seconds. I mean, honestly, if you had this parking space next to mine in a normal parking space, you know, you can't both get in the car at the same time anyway. you know, if you're side by side. So, it's it's really no different

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in this case. We've put them, if you remember, I don't have the site plan up here, but in the spaces that are furthest into the parking lot back up to the retail. So, if there is a time that you have to wait for the 45 seconds for someone to get in and out, you're not waiting by the driveway coming in from Somefield. You're, you know, you're

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internal to the parking lot kind of waiting for someone to get in and out. Again, no different than if you're in a standard parking space and someone is getting in or out of the space that's next to where you're assigned. >> All right. So if so let's pretend let's just pretend that I have my EV car and I

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have my fob and I'm going in. Where do I stand to put my hose into my car? Where do I go? >> So I am Am I inside this mechanism? >> Yeah. When you get out >> I'm in the carousel. >> Yeah. Cuz you you're going to get out of

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the carousel. You're going to get out. You're going to park in the ground floor. >> Yes. >> Then you're going to open your door and you're on the machine. You're on the floor. >> Okay. Then you can walk around just as if you were getting groceries out of the trunk or something out of the side. You're the the basically the unit is

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just connected there and you basically plug it in. You could you have full access. You're not hanging over the ground or hanging off of an edge. You have full access all around your car. >> How wide. What's the dimensions of the each cubicle? >> So the um individual platform is eight feet 8 feet two inches wide. And

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obviously the parking space that it sits within is around, you know, nine and a half to about nine to nine and a half feet. So again, you could walk around the car, you know, outside of the platform itself. >> I have a dumb question though. I'm sorry I can't follow it, but if you if you're

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charging and you have your connector and then you're on the second level, >> how does that work? >> The connector is So again, you're pulling in on the ground floor, the connector is basically attached to your platform piece. >> There's enough length. So it basically it goes with your car. So >> I got you.

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>> Your your as the floor goes up, it's going up with you. >> So each car is on an individual tray. >> Correct. Correct. And your tray basically has a plug into it. >> Right. So is my does my tray that I have my EV vehicle in get charged to my unit >> in terms of who's paying for your power?

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>> Correct. >> Uh >> who pays for that power? I would assume since this is condo uh it would either be it either paid to the unit or paid from the condo association themselves. >> Well, you would you would need to know that ahead of time because they have to

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be connected electrically >> to your unit. >> Yeah, we can we can >> so during this process of building you need to know that. >> Y >> the the parking space would be connected to your unit. That's correct. The parking space

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>> there's an electrical outlet. >> Yeah. that goes up to your meter. >> Could be. >> No, it has to be. >> Well, no, because like in any condo building, when I put my EV in, >> I just scan my fob and it it knows it's

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my car, even though it's not my spot, right? It's any EV can park there, but it knows it's me cuz I I swipe my >> And how do you pay? >> I have an account. I swipe my fab. It knows it's me. And then it's like, what's charge of? So the condo doesn't pay,

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>> the HOA doesn't pay for this, >> correct? Especially if it was a if it was a third party power being provided to the individual EVs, you'd have to pay that part. >> Charge point or whoever is >> Yeah, they all they all work a little different, but they're all kind of the same. It knows it's you. It goes to your accountual

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account. >> The association's not going to pay for it. So ideally is going to make each individual pay for it. But that's their problem. That's not our matter. You're right. It is their problem. I'd like to know. >> Yeah, the client texted me cuz actually it was a good I I didn't know the answer either. >> Okay,

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>> so basically the charger monitors the usage >> and the property manager bills the owner from that charger that manages the the usage. >> Okay, another question. I have two cars >> and you've given me two spaces.

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>> How does that work? We're >> I have two cars and are we saying that you would give me two spaces on the carousel and each car has to always be in the same spot? >> Each each unit is only getting one spot. >> Okay. So, where does spot where does

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Okay, >> there's 30 spaces. Each one is getting >> there's 33 spaces. >> Sorry, there's 33 spaces. Each unit's getting one. >> Okay. >> And then um there's there's three left over on uh on the ground floor. Right.

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The handicaps wouldn't be assigned. >> How are they allocated? >> Yeah. Each unit would get one space and then there would be three left over. >> Correct. That's that's what Matt had said. >> Correct. As part >> there's two ADA spaces and we're not

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having those assigned not knowing what units may or may not need to have them. >> Okay. But the carousel you have to be an EV to >> No, they they will just happen to be watch. >> Yeah, we just wanted that to be an option. Just Yeah.

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>> I you know I think it sounds like an elegant solution, but I just something tells me I'd be concerned about the security and safety of this. And it really depends on the user, whoever is using it.

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>> And again, the good thing is is that it's your space that you own. So, it's not like an unfamiliar person is coming in and driving in differently every day. It's no different than when I drive in my garage every day. I know that it's tight on one side and I got to kind of stop, you know, 3 ft from where this

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mirror hits something. So, I feel like, you know, it is again, it's the repetition of the same person. And again, it's also an owner building, you know, it's a condo building. So, this is, you know, this is their space that they've theyed to their use. >> That's correct. >> So, they'll get instruction on how to use >> they'll get instruction how to use it.

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And as I mentioned, the building management and the operator of this of this car uh lift system, they basically come when someone moves in and basically fits the wheel stops to their car so that you know they drive up, they basically, you know, drive in and they can feel when the car is in the correct

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>> there's also I mean we can get into this detail if you like, but there's also protocol and maintenance of the of the of the unit they're >> Yeah. four time four times a year. They basically come out there, they they inspect, they spray, they make sure that, you know, all the parts are are lubricated in the proper manner. So again, they're they're active in in the

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process as well. >> Um, we've actually seen the noise. We've seen the noise and we've seen the noise um reports. Again, it's no different than what would be um I think they said it was less than 55 dB, which is what you'd normally have outside. And again, this is inside a a garage as well. So in

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terms of people living above, it has been rated to be basically underneath living conditions. So when you're if you live upstairs above it, basically you wouldn't hear anything different than a normal garage door opening or closing. >> No, like it'd be no different than a garage door opening or closing, you

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know, when you're living in the building. >> So if we're So if we're short roughly 12 spaces, >> physical spaces, right? >> 12 physical spaces. We're short 12 physical spaces. So, are we saying that

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does this unit area um allow for permits? >> No. >> Sorry. You mean that >> street? >> That street? >> Yeah. >> It allows for people to get a permit. >> Yeah. >> So, we're building this zone for residential permits.

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>> Okay. So, I I have two cars. I can request a permit. >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> So, sorry. You have two cars. What's the permit? You have to have a second person living with you. >> Yes. >> Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Second person name everything

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>> on the lease and or deed or whatever. >> Okay. >> All right. >> And I assume there will be some sort of mechanism that if someone moves in, they don't have a car. I know it doesn't happen a lot, but it could happen. That space could be reassigned to somebody else or they could sublet it to somebody

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else. >> No, it would be. Yeah. Is your is your concern that it could be used by like a third party that wasn't a part of the building? That would not be permitted. >> Well, no. My thing more is, you know, we say this is transit oriented development. It's close to the train station. Not everyone has a car. But now you're saying if I move in, I don't have

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a car. My spot just sits empty. >> If you're s if you're if if all 30 units are occupied and one space was was available or a space another space was available, I guess the it would be used by somebody within the building. Nobody could use it who did not live within the

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building. >> Yeah. I think about what would you do? You you leave it empty and then you let your guest park there. You have it available, >> right? But but but they're not adjusted. The wheels are not adjusted to fit. >> Right. If you own it, you're not going to sell it because >> Yeah. But but each each unit would come

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with that space deed to that unit. >> Yeah. It limit limits the flexibility for others that live in condos that understand how the parking shuffle works. But I get it. So then now it's very it's limited. It's strict. Okay.

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>> I I have a physical question. Sure. The ceiling height from floor to floor to ceiling is 12 ft and 4 in. That that's tall enough for >> two cars. >> Yes. Um basically this unit has varying

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heights that you could utilize. Uh let me get the one that we'd be utilizing here. Hold on. >> I had the same question. >> Yeah. When I looked at the plans, I was like, "Are we going down or are we going up?" And it seemed like somehow it just fit. >> Yeah. Let me >> They're really not that high.

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>> How tall are you? A regular car. They're not that tall. >> Uh, let's see. >> Right. There's only 12 ft >> and there's two cars when I get out of Oh, I guess when you get out of your car, there's not there will never be a car above you. That was my question. And when you hit your head on the platform

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above you, but it won't be there. Never mind. >> Yeah. >> Yes. Exactly. The way that it works, it's above you is is clear. Then it'll go up. >> Yeah. >> Right. >> You said that it's I guess tailored to whatever car is going to be in that.

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>> Yeah. I mean, within reason. I I don't know if like a you know, a massive uh if you have a massive uh pickup truck, you're probably parked in the regular spot and not working on this machine. >> Easily modified. You know, somebody gets a different >> Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yes, it is easily modified. And yes, I did check that, you

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know, their standard uh height systems would fit within the uh 12 foot and change that we have here. Okay. >> So, you're saying SUVs >> SUVs fit, but if you're F150, >> if you have a super wide car becomes an issue on the system,

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>> then you get the car. >> That's all I have, Matt. That's all you have. >> Um, we're not going over the traffic study. >> We did that the last time. >> Yeah. Um, I'd like to discuss A10 and A11 >> to find out where these 12 cars are

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going to go cuz you did a parking study. There's a parking field parking scope map. >> Yes. >> Um, on A10 and A1. And I'm just looking for where these cars are going to go because

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coincidentally when this study was done, it was in July 12th. School was not in session. So there's a lot of there's a lot of spaces on Summerfield by the school which is usually taken up by the teachers. Um but I'm just wondering where the 12

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cars are going. And again, I think in my testimony at the earlier hearing was also expressing the fact that this is a transit oriented development and that you know our expectation is that the parking demand necessary for this building would be less than one and a half spaces per unit. While that's

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obviously your ordinance and we are requesting a variance and utilizing hopefully the payment in loom. >> No, no, >> you guys said you were going to buy spaces. >> Yeah, we're going to buy the spaces. I take that back. we will be buying >> and it's only for the eight because of

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the EV credit I believe >> right >> I think that's up to the council to decide the number >> okay okay but regardless whatever is required by law for us to pay we would pay >> but I would like to just mention to the

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record I'm looking at A10 and A11 and I don't see 12 spaces >> yeah again just throwing that out >> there are some in summerfield as you mentioned this was >> but that's the school the school, it's summer. >> Correct. But on the flip side, summer in Asbury Park also sometimes is busier than winter in Asbury Park. So, while

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those two those two blocks may be uh a little more crowded during the you know, during the uh fall, there may be some other spaces, you know, on nearby streets, but we again >> I am I'm looking. I don't see them. I'm just throwing that out there. I don't see I

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don't see room for 12 spaces, but I understand what the rules are. I disagree with the rules. I don't make the rules. >> Understood. >> Anybody else have any questions regarding uh this testimony?

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Professionals. Okay. Anybody from the public want to have any questions for this witness? >> So, I understand the traffic sign. So if you look at A10 and I guess if you look at the block uh Summerfield

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uh down by Grand. So was it the 12? So is >> that might demand and the supply is only one of them? >> No, that there's a missing that was 12 and 12. It didn't fit in the box. There's 12 spaces on that street. >> You would notice >> I thought this was my street

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>> there. There was I think if you look at uh A1 which is uh Thursday you'll see there's a 13 out of 12 on a street and four to three that meant there was an illegal parker or someone kind of snuck themselves in on a block or two. You can see that >> and also also for the board if they're not familiar or familiar with Somerfield

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there are quite a few 15minute spots there. So when we're saying seven of nine, >> right there, >> there's because of the hardware store, there's a number of them and there's also a couple more a little bit further down the street. >> So you're including the 15-minute spots in your account. >> This wasn't just seeing what cars are

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available. I would say that as part of this project, we are increasing the number of spaces by one on Somefield. I think originally we mentioned two, looking like measuring it out by closing the driveway that the one that is closest to the alley will be able to bring at least one parking space back. I know that's not satisfying. 15 uh you

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know uh potential spaces, sorry, 12 potential spaces. Uh but again, it is another space that's on the street uh after this project uh completion. >> Anybody else? Any other questions? Public? No. All right. Next. >> Our next witness is our architect, Mad

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Chair, James Mr. Moner, while they're setting you up, you do understand that you are still under oath. Correct. >> I do. >> Good evening, everybody. All right, Jim, you're still under oath. Your license is still current in good standing. >> Yes, it is. >> Okay. So, like this other witnesses, if

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you could just walk the board through changes you made to the elevations as well as any changes that you made to the floor plans as a result of the of the last meeting that we had. >> Okay. I have to push this a little closer to me cuz I can't see. Hope I don't turn it off. Um,

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so I first went in and tried to attack uh the parking and I did put parking everywhere I could and it just wasn't working. That's when we went to the automated system. Um, I went in and I I created a trash room and >> just indicate the ex the sheet that you're on.

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>> Oh, sorry. >> It's okay. I think this is a >> A102. >> A102 the architectural set. >> Got it. >> Um, so I was looking for a place for, you know, to get more room for the trash

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room. So, I ended up taking this hollow space in the back here and put a bike room in it for 30 uh bikes and that would be here and it would have a roof over it and it's a concrete structure. Then on the other side, I was

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able to remove the bike room and make this work much better where we have a compactor. And then I put a trash shoot in and the only way I could do that was to flip the unit upstairs. So, I flip it to I can go over that with you too. I don't know if it's that important to

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you, but I flipped a two and a one and was able to get the trash room in. So, there's a decent size trash room. Um, definitely handicap accessible. The compactor that I'm that I'm specking here now, I've used in the past. Um,

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it's a really nice, uh, compactor that separates the trash, crushes the glass, puts it in a container, like a tote container, and then it compacts all the trash, and it comes out into an easy an easier to wheel tote that goes to the

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curb and, uh, and a a private hauler would would take it away when they do that. Um we have extra room inside the um the trash room for extra tote bins. One would probably be for cardboard.

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There's extra um recycles. And that this is how the other tote would be attached to the compactor that loads up the uh the trash. I don't I don't uh I don't think there is any other thing on the first floor other than I added the brick shel. board

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members asked about the bike room. Can you explain that was open? It's a bike room. >> It's a It's an enclosed bike room with a door. Um goes all the way up to the bottom of the slab. So, it's >> open prior and now it's just >> No, it wasn't it was an enclosed room,

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but I moved it to another location so I have to put a roof over it over here. >> Yeah. Yeah. But it's fully enclosed so the bikes won't get destroyed by weather. >> Kind of nice. You pay a lot of money for bikes. outside. There's a little building above it. It's like

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>> There's no building above it. So, there's a little flat roof on it. >> Do you want to look at the basement? >> Just trying to make sure I didn't do anything else here. >> Sure. >> Where does that drainage go over that? Where's the bike road? It's outside now. Where is that drainage?

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>> It's going to go into the storage system. >> Yeah. Um I did add the bulkhead wall below all the storefronts. I still have the um the garage doors and the mimicking panels which I failed to write in there that it was frosted glass and I

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did check and we we got frosted glass uh so you don't see it into the uh the false panel and the door itself >> is is that what we were talking about the knee wall in the front? >> Yeah. Is that what that was? Okay.

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Here's the rendering. So I did the storefrontation. >> This was submitted. Yeah. >> Your letter says five foot high. That's >> that's six foot. >> He's back to six foot high.

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>> That's what it shows. >> And it's wood. So I'm assuming we're going to stain it. I I wonder if we want to paint it if it's wood. >> Okay. >> Yeah. It could be a solid stain, but it's going to be stained. Um, I'm just going to work through plans

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first and then we'll >> do the elevation. This thing is not moving. >> Why isn't it going to the next page? >> It's a different tab. >> Oh, you hear that? What am I doing?

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>> Somebody's going. >> So, when you go to this page, this is where the basement shows up. And I reshuffled the uh the storage bins to get make sure I had 30 of ADA space. I made them

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longer. I I made them kind of a bunch of different sizes, but uh I was able to get all 30 in there. So that all works much better now so everybody has a space. And then this is where I flipped the two units, which doesn't mean anything to

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you, but uh here's the trash room right here where I'm showing to you. You come down the hallway, it has a door on it. You go in, there's a shoe and the uh trash impactor separates for you. You just have one shoe. >> Mhm.

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>> Was there any impact to those two units? >> I'm sorry. I'm just when when you flipped them, was there really any substantive impact to the units? >> I not really. >> You lost the balcony. >> I lost I lost the balcony. >> I think it's I think that's

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>> Is there a reason you can't stick a balcony back? >> No, I can put the balcony there. >> I have to be careful because I'm close to the property line. I can put a balcony here, >> but I think >> I think that if if it fits and if it looks right. >> Okay. All right. All right. Only at the balcony.

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>> You know, >> the thing I don't like most is that trash room door. >> Which one? >> Right here. >> Yeah. >> What do you want to do? >> What would I do? >> I There's I can't come up with a solution. It's just if I'm in that unit,

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I'm going to walk out the door and surprise somebody's whacked me in the head with the trash room door. Yeah. >> Well, this this is one of the smaller units, too. So, it's not it's only one person. >> Yeah. I I mean, it's not like it's

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perpetual use. It's >> an inconvenience. >> I I I hear what you're saying, >> but yeah, I don't I don't see where else you can make it. >> It's not like you could open it the other way. >> No. >> You know, it has to >> I can open it in maybe, but it's not

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going to help what she's worried about. You are worried about it. I agree. >> Seeing somebody carrying our garbage to the garbage. >> You can't enter from the stairwell area. >> No, >> it's not allowed. >> Oh, no. >> Okay. >> That's a no. No. >> All right. >> All right.

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>> Fire Mr. Fire Marshall is not going to like you for that. >> I asked the question, that's all. >> Um, then >> I addressed the rooftop lighting. You can see we've added um ballards

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low low ballard to the plan and low lighting which I submitted these are the ballards. So our lighting is basically low low lighted ballard lighting around the the perimeter. Uh they're strewn about on the on the deck itself. Some

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are running across the back, some are running across the front. >> So what lights up on I see the diagram, right? Mhm. >> That's the top lights up and it lights down. >> Oh, okay. >> Yeah. >> And then we have all our screening. One thing the neighbor was concerned

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>> the lighting. There's a note from Donna that says the strip lights are >> We have them in the planters. >> It's but it said they're 3,000 Kelvin and be aiming up. >> No, no, they're in they're concealed in the planter to light down. But they light the pl they're lighting.

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>> Okay. You need a decal for that because the spec you've got shows them either illuminating sideways or illuminating up. So that's going to be just because below the plant. >> It's underneath the planter. So the planter's there and it lights up. >> Okay. >> Can you do 2700?

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>> It comes in 2700. >> I think so. We're going to make spec 2700. >> Okay. >> Is that the color you like? >> That's the color we like. >> All right. No problem. I can't do blue. It's highly recommended. >> Okay. I like I love that color.

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>> I have blue on my porch. >> Um, so also the neighbor behind us was concerned about the screen wall. So I've actually set the screen wall back up the facade uh further than I had it before. It's more like 3 ft back. And behind us,

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I set it back 13 ft from the edge of the building. So there's no way it's going to be seen from his unit and block any additional light. There was also a removal of a door >> on the east side on the roof.

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>> What? >> I have a note that says that we were going to remove a door on the east side on the roof. It was on A0106. >> I don't recall where that where that door was. >> Watch the hearing. It was like a phantom door that you said. You said it wasn't a

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door, but in the rendering there was a door. >> Right. Right. It there was a door in the rendering, but it wasn't a door. Right. No, it's not. It's not there. >> Is it gone now? >> Yeah, I don't see. >> All right. So, the phantom door is gone. >> Let's see. >> Okay. >> Yeah, it would have been right here.

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>> Okay. Then I guess I could go to >> There was also mention of artificial there. There is artificial turf on the uh >> There is currently Yes. >> artificial turf on the >> It's in It's in the back section. It's a strip. So, it's kind of like a lounge area/c

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cornhole or some kind of activity. >> Turf like permeable turf or more like putting green. >> It could be a putting green. We We're talking about potentially doing a putting green. Yeah. We're not doing a botch, >> but nothing nothing like permeable water.

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>> We're not talking something absorbing water. It's the >> No, it's just part of the roof system actually. the roof goes under it and drains the tree. Just uh it's kind of similar to the the planting trays we're using the trays that sit out. Now we have pedestals that line up with the

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trays. So the plants kind of line up with the pedestals. Um so in the front of the building, this is where we were a little confused last time. And I I think I was a little confused too because I couldn't really see the the rendering. But if if I go

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back to the rendering for you for a minute, I got more clarity on this. So this what happens is this piece of architecture, the main meat of the building has a twoft high parapit that runs back here

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and this piece comes forward and it kind of has the illusion that this goes up and around it, but that's part of the building. the actual railing for the um for the privacy railing to keep people from going to the edge is set back

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another 5T. So, you can't see that at all. And this actually helps that to relieve that uh visual visual thing, but it was right on the drawing. I just I could I don't know. I couldn't see it. I wasn't really sure what I was what I was seeing because I was looking over there.

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Um but yeah, this is correct. Oh, we've changed um what did we change here? We we still have our our pieces on the ed. So, we still have we're still asking for that. I think it's a design waiver, right, for the architectural features

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that I have going up four feet here, here, and here. Right. So, I think we have a waiver for that. Um >> well, technically it's just the one in the middle. >> Yeah. Okay. And then we are changing the color of the AAC to match the the U cast

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stone. However, I can't I can't I couldn't get a sample of it because I have to have it special made. So, we will coordinate that color with with the uh with the concrete color. So, it's going to be more of a a not stark white.

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It's going to be a little H. >> So, what is it? It's the Hardy plank. >> The Hardy panel. They match the stone. >> They will massproduce them in color for us. >> Okay. >> So, it's just getting the guy to give me a sample is kind of tough. >> And then the only other uh color change

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I I I made from the original was I changed the black to this bronze because I felt it was warmer and I thought the black would would be not as timeless as bronze. It is on that rendering, but it's so close to black that you really can't tell and the printer won't won't

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allow it to show up right. But I just I love the warmth of this and I think it's richer looking and it has like everything was bronze and history so you don't have to worry about it not being like a trendy thing and going out of style. So the windows would be bronze and the metal panels would be bronze but

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it's very close to black. I don't >> Did you Was there any other I don't think there were any other changes? >> I think that was all the architectural comments. >> I had a quick question about the lead the lead checklist.

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>> You were going to do a lead checklist just to show us. >> I'm sorry. >> Lead checklist. >> The lead checks. >> Um we didn't prepare. We did a Did we do a energy? Did you guys give us an energy sheet to fill out? Did you give us an energy compliance sheet to

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fill out? >> No, you guys were just going to tell us which features in the building we're going to solar. >> So, we're going to I didn't make a a total list, but our products will be uh leadcertified. Um Hardy is leadcertified. The the bricks are local,

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so they're lead they're valuable for points. We're going to use all the proper. So the building code now addresses what lead addresses. So we have to follow that. So we automatically kind of get there with the building code

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itself. Lead is kind of like a private entity that came in and and uh and and found a niche in the market and took that niche. But now the state has come and said look let's let's do our own energy code. And it's very strict. It's very strict. Like our our our values are

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like up to 40 something in the roof and in the walls are like 20. So it the buildings are almost too tight. So we have to bring fresh air in now. So we're not going to be lead certified, but I think we meet all the >> No, but I think we >> just ask for as if the board approves

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it, I will do a lead certified checklist. >> Yeah, that's >> I could I could get you one. >> Yeah, we'll we'll do that. I don't know why I didn't remember that. >> Anything else that I need? >> I think the sign is the signs are the

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only thing >> you concerned about. Can we >> do we have to do them on the corners? Can they be in the storefront? >> In the storefront. >> Yeah. Don't put rather than on the corners. >> Sure.

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>> That's the board. >> Go to the render. >> You had a color rendering of that. >> Go to the rendering. >> Just zoom in there. >> So, Donna, just describe what you were describing before. >> So, it's >> So, so the redevelopment plan says signs

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should be on a sign board in the storefront and the corners should not be disturbed by signs. That's an architectural feature. So the way they've got it configured, it's really more visible for like if you're driving rather than being at pedestrian level. So

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>> if that's something the board would prefer, we could make that change. >> Okay. >> Yes. >> Do you want me to take glass out to do that? >> Um we do a cooking exercise like a board

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hanging underneath the side. >> Oh, we could do that. >> Hanging on our side. As long as it doesn't go into the right away, right? >> That would have to be underneath the would have to be under >> for projecting signs. For hanging signs and yeah, for hanging signs as long as it's not right of way.

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>> Okay. We we we're not going to be a big retailer, so I'm thinking placard signs would be easily >> Yeah. I'd rather each individual come in for their signing permit, work it out with >> Okay. >> the office rather than do this. >> Yeah. I'll take it off of there. You're

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okay with the the number and the building sign. >> Where's the building sign? >> Is it Is it really 702 and 70? Isn't there like one number? >> It's two. >> Well, whatever the whatever the whatever

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post office says it is what it is. >> We'll find out as soon as the post office tells us. All of that. >> And then with the store signs, I know there's this is set up as three different things. If they combine, it's just one sign per tenant. Correct. >> Yes. Yeah. >> Okay. So, what's good about hanging

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signs like Thomas says, it's it's not going to disrupt the building when the tenant moves out. You just take the hooks off, >> right? >> Yeah. Will destroy the the architecture. >> Okay. I will change that. That's all I have for

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>> any other questions by board members. >> Yeah, I've got a couple. >> One of the things you're asking for is a uh variance for overall height. Mr. Fourstory building. What what has

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created this uh the problem? Normally a four-story building falls within that uh height range. It's It's the height of the parapit in the middle of the building where it sticks up. That part is too high. >> Yeah. Hold on. That's all it is.

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>> We'll show you. Mr. Henry, I understand the question. It >> Jim, can you just um zoom in? We'll look. We'll look here. >> It's not It's not the height of the whole building. >> It's just It's just that one spot. >> Okay. That was rather >> unclear from

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>> No problem. I'm sorry. Okay. So, that's that's where the uh >> it was just the that architectural feature, but the rest of the building complies. >> Okay. >> Along those lines, the

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excuse me, the master plan requires that the building be uh compatible in size with the neighborhood. Now, we're talking about uh the northern half of this lot

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on fronting on Summer Somefield. Um the rest of the buildings in that general area are twotory. What could you have done to this building to make it fit in

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more um make it more compatible with the surrounding area? Well, actually, I think I I did that because I carried lines from the adjacent buildings into my project itself. My windows line up with our

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neighbors. My floor lines change it changes material at the height of the the next building next door to the right. >> And um it it carries that linear >> line from our surrounding neighbor.

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That's that's what I did to do that. >> Okay. And we have and actually our pedestrian level lines up with our needle also the overhang on our pedestrian level. So that's continuous >> because on on that same uh block but on

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the uh southeast corner there is a a fourstory building but >> that's correct. >> It's not something you see from Somefield basically. >> No, I'm not. Yeah, I wasn't talking about that. I'm talking about our >> I understand what you're saying. >> That's that's what I could do. We're

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allowed the building height. So, we >> just seems to me this building by its scale, it's way out of proportion for the rest. >> Well, I don't I kind of disagree with that only because if you drive around Asbury, the building heights change a lot in all the different neighborhoods

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and it it gives it charm. It gives it class. >> I I understand, Mr. Henry. I think what we tried to do was take what's permitted by the ordinance and the plan and as Jim said integrate it nicely within the surrounding area to get that

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compromise of what you're talking about. Stick within the ordinance height limitation but also have it plugged in well. That's what >> and and our planner could talk about that also. >> Any other questions? I just have one more that the um so you're going to provide a lead checklist which I

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appreciate it and it was lead silver that was noted in the in the >> the first step. Yeah, the first >> just a checklist, but well silver is second, right? Cuz >> certified is first and then silver. >> There's no bronze first. I thought there

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was for some reason. Is it just go right to silver? >> Uh I think it might be right. Lead silver. Well, one's missing. Gold. >> Platinum. >> Platinum. >> There's a platinum one. Platinum's the highest, >> but silver is not the bottom. Like silver is not the >> But the point is we'll we'll do the lead checklist for the silver. >> For silver. Thank you. And I always ask

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this in the process, but I know you may come back, but when how would we see that? >> Do we do we check? >> Like how would we the board like if it's >> you won't it'll be condition of resolution compliance. >> That's always that's just like a thing I say out loud because it's that's why we

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ask for it is that we can so the board can see it because even though I trust that it'll happen. >> What we could do also um if you're okay with this also if the board were to approve it before you adopt the resolution, we can send you a cop. We could also submit that as well. >> So you can see that I was

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>> Yeah, I mean it'll be part of the public record. So the board members >> could view it whether they submit it before any resolution uh or not. But it would be a condition of a res resolution. >> Mhm. >> Yeah. And I don't mind spinning it earlier like that.

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>> I appreciate go back to the building height just for a second because I'm just looking at one of your elevations now. Is it true that the hardware store on the corner of Main Street comes it's like about the same height as the third story of your building? >> Yes. >> Okay. So, it's this is really only one

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story taller than the hardware store. >> That's correct. >> Any other questions by the planning board? Our professionals public any questions of this witness? Okay, come on up. Um, Stephen Moroc, unit 30177 Bangs Zav.

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Um, I appreciate the shifting of the parapit. Um, I do have one follow-up question on the stairwell bulkheads. You show new light at the lighting. Now, uh, I just wanted to clarify the height of those fixtures and then if they're on 24/7, the timing of those fixtures.

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>> Are you talking about on roof? >> Yeah, on the stair bulkhead walls. Um, they're 42 inch high walls. >> The stairwell? >> No, of the stairwell. >> Yeah. >> Isn't the stairwell internal? >> I only have one. >> No, on the exterior of the stairwell on

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the roof. The roof. Rooftop lighting. >> He's asking on the roof. >> Yeah, >> you have a stairwell, right? In the bulkhead, >> you have lights on that bulkhead, right? >> Yes. Outside the door. >> Outside the door. He's asking when where how high are those lights and when are they on? That's what he's asking. >> Correct. question. Um, that's a good

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question. I think they're probably 6 ft high. They're down lights. They're by the door along side of the door. And the door faces away from your building. >> Well, the door faces east. >> No, it faces east. So, the light would

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be in my line of of sight technically or my building's line of sight. >> The door >> because if you're six feet up, you're above the parapits. from the stairwell on the left. >> On the right hand stairwell, >> this one. Okay, I see what you're saying. >> The west stairwell.

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>> The west stairwell. >> So, it's a down fixture and it's over the door >> on those wet. >> Yeah, we could put that on a motion detector so that when motion happens, it goes on. >> Okay. I just concerned that Yeah, it's

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going to be >> Well, it is down. So, >> understood, but I'm I'm full. Show the picture. >> Show the picture. >> I understand it's pointing down. I'm I'm >> It's right there. >> I'm looking up.

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>> Hold on a second. Don't go away. >> There it is. >> It's right here. See the fixture? >> Yeah. No. And I I did see it before. >> We could have >> But my point is I'm I'm below. I'm on the third floor. I'm looking. >> So we could have that on a motion like we said. So

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>> if you see this light, you tell me. Bob. >> Okay. I'm just saying. Yeah. >> Want to make it happen? >> Yep. Okay. >> That that's all I have. Thank you. >> Okay. Next. >> Could we just take a fivem minute break? >> Sure.

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>> Five minutes. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Okay. Motion for a five minute. Take roll call real quickly. Um, James Banano >> here. >> Councilwoman Clayton >> here. >> Jim Henry >> here. >> Mayor Moore >> here. >> Jen Zouer

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>> here. >> Daniel Shaneo >> here. >> Kathy Mclacklin >> here. >> Vice Chair Gunnan >> here. >> Chairwoman Carzac >> here. >> Okay, let's go. >> All right. So, Christine has not testified yet. All right. Do you swear or affirm that the testimony you're about to provide will be the truth, the

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whole truth, and nothing nothing but the truth? >> Yes. >> And if you can state your name and spell your name for the record, please. >> Yes. My name is Christine Nazaro. N A Z A R O Kafone C O F O N E. Business address is 52 Ratos Place, Redbank, New

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Jersey 07701. I'm testifying this evening as a licensed professional planner. I've been testifying as such for 30 years in the state of New Jersey now. Um, I've testified here in the city on many occasions. My licenses are current and valid. I teach planning and zoning

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courses for the Rucker Center for Government Services. Um, I'm a courtappointed affordable housing special master, special adjudicator. Um, and my licenses are current and valid for >> with the board component. >> You answered all our questions. >> Okay, great. >> Thank you very much. All right. So,

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Christine, in preparation of the application, you visited the site in the surrounding area. >> I did most recently on Friday night. My husband and I went to Cook and Creary. It was fabulous as usual. So, I've been to the subject property. I reviewed all the application submission documents. I was here and present at the last

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hearing, although I did not give testimony. I reviewed your professionals um review letters um on this application. I had an opportunity to speak to your planner about this application a few times and I also reviewed the redevelopment plan um most importantly for this area. This is what

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I would really consider a substantially conforming application. We need very very little variance relief in conjunction with it. It is located in the city's CBD redevelopment area where the use is specifically permitted. The variance relief that we are seeking is

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because we are required to have 35% of our ground floor devoted to commercial uses. Along somefield, we only have 22.85% where we're required to have 35. Um, so we're required to have 3,500 square f

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feet there and we only have 2,353 ft of commercial space. We are similarly a similarly related variance to that is our ground floor commercial. We are required to have um a ground floor a percentage of our ground floor devoted

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to commercial uses and lobbies. where we have 130 ft of frontage. We only have 60 ft devoted to commercial uses and 10 ft devoted to our residential lobby and the remaining 60 ft is devoted to parking which is not permissible. The last

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variance we need is the height which I would say the the balance of our building is conforming at 45 ft. We need a variance for that middle parapit portion that was just described to you that is just under um 48 feet where the the zone requires 45 and that is the

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extent of the variance relief that's required in conjunction with this application. We do need a handful I think about eight other design exceptions um including the parking um that were testified to by our architect but that's really the variance relief that we need. So pretty conforming,

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right? It's only three very minor variances. Um I would interrupt. >> Yeah, but we clarified before you're not getting a variance or a design exception for >> No, sorry. It was the um the size of the of the stalls >> the compact

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exception, right? Not the numbers as we are requesting if we request to the ability to pay into the funds then we don't have to ask for the relief. So the board though has to I believe approve us to pay into the funds is my understanding. Um, so that's essentially the relief that we're asking for in

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conjunction with this application. Um, if you had an opportunity and you're familiar with the site, you know that one of the benefits of this application is we're eliminating a non-conforming use on the property. And that's to me very significant. I'll get into that a little bit more when I talk about the negative criteria because I think that

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there are so many goals stated in that redevelopment plan that are advanced by this application. Um but statutoily this board can grant variances under the C1 hardship criteria or under the C2 flexible C. If you find that no hardship exists if we advance

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one or more purposes of the land use law. So I think that this is a C2 case. I don't really see a hardship here. I think that though there are multiple purposes of the municipal land use law that are advanced. I think that criteria A which talks about promoting the general welfare is advanced. I think

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anytime that you have um an area that you can reinvent and rehabilitate and repurpose a site in the middle of a downtown area that that is promoting the general welfare. So I think that that's certainly important. I think criteria E which talks about the establishment of

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appropriate population densities. I think that's important here. Um I know that you had questioned Mr. board. I don't recall your last name, but one of our board members questioned about the 4T, right? The the CBD zone allows 4 feet in this area. And our office looked

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at approximately a 500 ft distance and we found that there were at least 10 properties that were three or more stories. Right? If you look just to I believe it's the north norththeast of this property, there's an 11story building. And I think it was a

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great point that there are varying heights and in this city and any city there should be varying heights of buildings. Um, so I think it's an appropriate population density. I I think as a planner residential density is a gift that you can give the downtown. I've already testified and

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gave you my credentials that I've been testifying for 30 years. So you know that I'm not in my 20s. Um, when I was in high school, Redbank was a bad area. I wasn't allowed to get dropped off in Redbank and take the bus to the Eaton Town Mall because it wasn't a great area. Um, and what brought Redbank back?

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I think one of the things that did was residential density. God bless you. So, I think that this is an appropriate population density. And I will again talk about some of those goals of the CBD zone, but I think criteria E is appropriate here, that it's an appropriate residential density.

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Criteria I talks about creating a desirable visual environment through creative development techniques and good civic design. This is an application to me that's really about balance. Right? I've sat here and listened to all the comments from your professionals, your

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board. I know some of us might favor more retail, some of us might favor less retail in in favor of parking. But I think what we've really done here is we've programmed this with 30 apartments and we've programmed it with the potential for three retail spaces, right? Our ground floor has the

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potential for three 20ft square or 20 foot storefronts. It could be 320 20 linear foot storefronts. It could be 14 or 140 and 120. But it gives the opportunity to have commercial uses and it also gives the opportunity for

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parking to be here. And it also gives the opportunity for residential density. So I think when you balance those things, the board can certainly look at all of the ways that our architect and our team has created good civic design. We heard a lot of your comments at the first hearing and I think we

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incorporated them. There were some really good comments about the trash room, about providing storage, about providing bikes, about providing amenity space. In my opinion, the amenity package associated with this, we have a business center, we have a gym, we have rooftop

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amenities. This is not an application that has skimped on project amenities in favor of um another component of the project. So, I do think that this is a a good civic design. I think a lot of care went into considering the lifestyle of the residents that are here and how the

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project will function in relation to um the properties around it. Mr. Manifford testified specifically, you know, that he did consider the architecture of adjoining properties when he designed this site. So I think criteria I is also advanced. And then I think criteria M, which talks about an efficient use of

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the lands, is also appropriate here. So statutoily, I don't need you to agree with all of them. You can just agree with one and that still substantiates the burden of proof for the grant, the variance. The proof here that we have to justify is that one or more purposes of the municipal land use law would be

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advanced by the application. So I cited those four. So again, if you don't agree with all of them, as long as you agree with one of them, that would be justification for the bulk variances. I feel like you want to interrupt. >> No, good. He does. Sometimes he's

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getting he was getting ready. >> I've been worked I worked with him long enough. He's fighting the urge to not do it. So on the negative criteria and that's the positive criteria. So that's the positive criteria for the just justification of the C variance. There's also the negative criteria and

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regardless of the section of the statute we were asking for the relief under, we have an obligation to demonstrate that there's no substantial detriment to the zone plan or the public good. Right? And it doesn't ask you as a board or holds us or any other applicant to a standard that there be no detriment. Just that

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the benefits of the grant of the variance outweigh any detriment. The testimony we heard last month I thought was very compelling how that there's no storm water management on site today. So we will be introducing a better program for storm water management. We are eliminating a non-conforming use. We are

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creating a 12t wide sidewalk which is a great part of a downtown >> a warehouse. There's a yeah the warehouse. So that is not based based on my review of what is permissible in this district. Now can somebody continue to use that because it's a pre-existing

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non-conforming use? Yes. But is it contributing in my opinion anything to these goals and objectives? Right. When we get to looking at the CBD plan um and what it what it reads, right? >> So is the is the hardware store is conforming but their storage is not

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conforming. >> Correct. Right. The retail would be permissible but the storage aspect of it is not conforming. Um so it reads the reads the CBD redevelopment plan states the introduction of a significant residential component downtown has a number of advantages adding vitality and

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security to the downtown. However accommodating res residential parking is an important component to the revitalization. So I think you know you've heard a lot of testimony from the applicant of how we are introducing a creative solution to deal with our parking on site. But then it goes on to

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talk about the CDB CDB redevelopment plan and some of the stated goals in there. Talk about revitalizing existing business and commercial property by attracting new shoppers and investment, minimizing gaps in the streetscape. Here we fill in an existing asphalt parking

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lot to redevelop land occupied by obsolete structures and to provide for an enhanced pedestrian environment and create eyes on the street. Those are all specifically stated goals in the CBD redevelopment plan that I think are advanced by this application. So when

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you look at what the stated purpose of that is is the purpose of the CBD mixeduse district is to encourage the adaptive reuse and upgrading of the existing build buildings and businesses. FL first floor uses include a v a wide variety of non-residential uses with

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upper floors redeveloped either commercially or residentially. So here h almost half of our building on the ground floor is devoted to commercial uses and the other is devoted to parking and that's what we do as planners right we're balancing these things and trying

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to find ways to revitalize an area but still provide all the things that we need to plan for parking refuse um amenity space and I think that this application in my opinion does a fantastic job of balancing all that I think we meet the statutory proof for

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the grants of the variances is and most importantly I think we implement not only the stated purpose but significant numbers of goals and objectives stated in the CBD redevelopment plan and leave the site certainly far better and far

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more in line with what the CBD envisions than what is going on there today >> and just on on the height the the height variance it's very limited and just for a small architectural feature of the of the project correct >> it's literally the parapit so certainly it's not we're not asking for the height

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variance to contribute to any of the intensity of the building that really has more of a screening effect. So it's not like the additional height and and not that I think that there is anything with additional intensity because I think like I said residential density is a gift that you can give your downtown

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but here that height is really isolated to that power pit in the middle of the building which functions more for screening not anything as to the intensity of the building. >> So so the typical any typical issue associated with height wouldn't be present here. Correct. No, there's absolutely there's no correlation between that height variance and the

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intensity of its use. >> Okay. So, in your professional opinion, the relief sought as by by way of this application, the benefits of those of those deviations would substantially outweigh any detriments. >> Yes. >> Okay. Okay. That's all I have for Miss Capone. >> Any other questions from uh board

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members? >> Yeah, I have a couple. uh this particular site is there any particular topographical feature that would uh require the necessity of granting a

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variance? >> No, we're not asking for a variance with related to the topography. >> You're asking Okay. Uh and how about any other physical features on this site? >> Nope. And that's why I said I don't think the C1 applies. So this those would all be things relating to a C1

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variance. So if I were justifying the variance under the C1 section of the statute, then I would have talked about the unique physical features or the topography. And that's why I said in my my opening that I think that these fall under the C2. So in the absence of any of those conditions, the board can

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absolutely grant the variance relief under the C2 section of the statute if you find that one or more purposes of the municipalities law are advanced. And again, the height that we're asking for is not a result of topography. It is really just for that parapit in the center of the building. The height is

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not coming from the intensity or the building um or that the height of the actual building is out of character. It's for a parapit wall, not the balance of the building. The actual building is at the 45 ft >> and it's just a design choice. Right. >> Correct. It's it's really not the

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intensity of the building. Uh just to follow that up, what extraordinary or exceptional situation uh unique to this particular uh property would require or >> and so again

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>> facilitate the grant of variance. >> I'm going to tell you none. And that's the third prong of what what a C1 hardship. So, you're probably reading or referring to the C1 section of the municipal land use law, which talks about unique topographic figures, unique um or lawful unlawful pre-existing

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structures would also be part of that C1. So, all of the things that you're talking to would relate to the C1 section of the statute. So, if somebody were coming here asking you for a hardship variance, they would talk about um pre-existing conditions or they would talk about unique site features,

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topography, something like that, the unusual size or shape of a property. And that's certainly appropriate if those conditions exist on the property, which is why I was very clear in my opening statements here and my opening testimony that I was going under the C2 section of the statute. And that's why you didn't

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hear me mention any of that because I think that they're not applicable to the subject property. >> Yeah. and as part of a C2 argument the all that the statute requires is that the benefits of that's that's why I asked her about that specific U parapit

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the benefits of that which Christine discussed as being aesthetic and the other things that she mentioned there would outweigh compliance as to that 3 ft. So she felt the benefits from that um that it provides would outweigh any detriments and that it advanced certain goals of the municipal land use law.

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Correct. >> And that's the C2 section of the statute. So if you for if there were some type of topography or there was something irregularly about the property that we couldn't comply with a front yard setback or if it tailed off and it was irregular in shape and that caused us to have to, you know, request relief

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for a sideyard. Those would all be justifications on the C1, but I didn't talk about any of that because I think this is a C2 case. >> Okay. Anything else? Anything else? Does anybody else uh the

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public want to uh have any questions for this witness? Okay. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> We're done. >> That's it. We're done. >> Can I get a motion to open up for public comment? >> So moved. >> Second.

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>> All right. Anybody from the public that would like to make any comments about this project? You have three minutes. Fire away. While she's doing that, I'm going to swear you in. Do you swear affirm that the testimony you're about to provide will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? >> Yes, sir.

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>> And for the record, state your name and your address. And as soon as the three minutes are ready, you're going to start. >> Uh Steven Moruck, 707 Bangs A, Unit 301. Okay. Uh I just wanted to state I do agree with the parking concerns as a

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resident. um on the neighboring corner at 707 Bangs a I often have guests that can't find parking. So I just want to reiterate that I do think there is a significant parking concern throughout most of the year. Um additionally I understand the height variance is

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minimal. Um but I do as it affects my view from my windows as a neighboring unit. I do disagree with granting of a height variance. I know that I'm not the greater community but I just wanted to make that note. Um, and yeah, that's all

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I have. Anyone else? All right. Motion to close. >> Second. >> Okay. Any of the uh any planning board members have any comments that they would like toward? >> I actually about the three feet uh I

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think it's a design element. I haven't seen a a rendering without it, but I I actually think it's a nice feature. I kind of like it. I think it adds interest to the facade of the building. >> I was going to say the exact same thing, Dan. I think if we asked them to lop it

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off, they could lop it off and it would make the building worse. >> I I agree with that. >> Yeah. Uh I wish you could have gotten more parking and done away with residential.

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I mean, commercial, even if it was three more spots because right now people downtown are saying there's empty stores all over the place. So, you're going to Somefield Avenue, you're not even close to the CBD. So, I mean, good luck renting your stores. I know you tried

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deeply appreciate it. Uh, I think it's a besides that, I think it's a good project. I think your architect did a wonderful job uh fixing things. My main concern is still this alleyway. And I'm not blaming you guys. I'm blaming you

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and the city. I mean, I'm the mayor and this is if I wasn't sitting up here, I wouldn't know this is going down. The city manager does not know this is going down. Cuz I texted him and he said, "What the I mean, so that that's my concern. The salivary, what do we do

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with this?" >> Can I can I respond? Is that okay? >> Mhm. >> Yeah, of course. No, no, I didn't want to interrupt if everybody was talking. Um, so I guess the way we looked at it, mayor, was that it's owned by the city and that the city wanted to maintain it

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the way that that it was. That's how we looked at it because on paper, if you look at the tax map, it's a it's an alleyway that's owned by the city. So, normally the city wants to keep property that that it owns. So, we were trying to actually be conscientious and keep give

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give the city the 3 ft in order to have the full 10ft width so that the properties in the back that are affected that aren't even our responsibility could still go in and out. That that that was our thought process there. But I'm happy as a condition of the approval

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because there was something that was noted I think at the beginning of this hearing about keeping that gate open as well that I'm happy to meet with the city manager, the city um attorney, your council here to discuss the easement

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issue and the gate issue so that everybody's on the same page. I just want to, you know, keeping that 10 ft. We were coming from a good place, but we're happy to work on it to make sure everybody's comfortable with the outcome of the alley. That's it. >> They say, "I'm not blaming you 100%." They say, "Doug talked to Michelle about

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lights and everything, but how nobody could talk to the city, nobody could talk to Mayor Council about a street we didn't even know we owned, and here we are." >> No, understood. >> I mean, I'm disappointed on both sides. So, >> but but but I'm happy to like I said,

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normally if you see like an like a paper street or or something that's on a physical map, this municipalities like to keep it, but if that's something that the city wants to alter it or work with us on that, we're happy to do that as a condition of the approval. Um we just want to make sure everybody's

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comfortable with the final outcome. >> No, again, I think it's a good project besides that one. >> Okay. Thank you. And if that wants to be a condition, we're happy to work with the city. Okay. Well, conference.

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>> Yeah. Okay. >> Are we done? >> I just wanted to add to just um that I would have preferred to have seen that lead checklist so that we could actually have a conversation about it here. um and you know that I was at the lead

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silver which is a second tier. So there's lead certified then there's lead silver. Um so not it just makes it uh frustrating to not be able to have that discussion here in public um as to what that like how you're achieving that or what what the goals are or anything. So

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that's just a frustration point. >> I'm sorry about that. >> I also think it's a good project. I think it will bring um and I I don't have an issue with the height. Um, it's just that that type of transparency is like better to have in public. >> Understood. And I and I promise we would

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submit that as as before you adopt the resolution if you were to approve, >> right? >> Yeah. Go ahead. >> Um, I I like the building and the parapit I think is great, but my

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question has to do with the stackers. >> Yeah. >> And do we know where they're currently being used? Is there any documentation about these stackers? Is there a track record? We're you're asking

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ordinary people to be able to come in and use them and think that they're going to work. So I I just would like more information about >> Okay. Um that's fine. Can I bring the um traffic engineer back up, Madam Chair? Is that okay? >> Sure. >> Okay.

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I understand I'm still under oath. Yes, you are. >> Uh, yes, these models are working in Jersey City. I think there's also New York City. So, these are working in this same region. I don't know of any specifically in Aspbury Park, but I do know again in Jersey City there are this model uh in in use.

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>> Yeah. and and I've worked on projects in in um in cities as well, Hoboken, other uh Jersey City like Matt was saying, where um the Klouse um brand is actually one of the premier brands of of stacked

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stack parking that is used within New Jersey and New York City. >> Do you know of any any issues that have arisen in your experience? >> Do you know? >> No, not not that I'm aware of. They come with, you know, a warranty. They come with uh, like I said, quarterly, you

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know, maintenance check-ins, and I, as far as I know, that's been sufficient to keep the system running. I haven't heard of any uh, issues with them. >> I think that one of the things that we might be concerned about outside of um, never having to experience this is that when you'd mentioned that that after

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you're done, if you don't fob out, somebody has to do something different. I'm concerned about that that part, you know, that one part because it's like then me coming in there because someone didn't do the right thing, I have to

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press something different than my fob and just go. >> It sounds to me, Madam Chair, that that is more of a a liability reason because if if it automatically goes off in five or 10 minutes, then someone can be there.

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>> Someone has to do something in the way. So that's I think that's probably why it's actually a safety mechanism that it doesn't automatically do that. >> Mhm. >> To avoid uh a potential problem that's that's unanticipated with no with nobody else around, >> right?

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>> Would they rather have no safety issues and then if there's neighbor disputes because there's one bad actor who's not pushing the button pushing the button >> then, you know, >> then the association has to deal with the assoc. And and I think both of the the two concerns that you both mentioned um would be more um of an issue if it

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was a a visitor parking lot or some sort of like you know parking lot. But here it's going to be run by the own it's going to be owners that are using it. So it'll be the same people over and over again. So there's going to be such familiarity with the with the system >> that it it should they they should have

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it uh you know they should have it down pretty quickly. >> What happens when if somebody parks? Do they have a a time limit to get out of the car if they don't get out of the car? >> Well, again, it doesn't the system doesn't close down on you. That's the thing. If you have >> it will stay open. >> It will stay open.

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>> That space will stay open. >> The only way that the gate will close either you close it or after 5 minutes if someone else comes in they again have to basically >> so sits in that car for an hour even the 5 minutes pass the gate will still be made. >> Gate the gate will be made over till the

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next person shows up. Yeah. You should get up, >> right? >> Go upstairs, please. >> Will the building have like an on-site manager? The >> Yes. Uh, this this will be a condo building, so an ownership building, but

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yes, they'll have a a maintenance um I don't I don't think living there, but I think by law they have to have their maintenance uh people within a certain distance on site. So >> So not on site, >> there's no super. A super would be in a

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rental building. So there's no >> Well, yeah, there's maintenance staff on, but I don't think there's um a living unit like you. >> Anybody else? All right. So, by uh because we opened it up again, get a motion to open to the

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public. Second. >> Anybody from the public that would like to uh make your comments again? >> All right. Motion to close. >> All right. Are we all set? >> Yep. >> Okay.

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Um I have I have a I have a number of conditions. I don't know if you want to read your conditions off or you want me to read my conditions off. What would you like to do? >> Um you can read yours off and I can I can add if you want. >> Okay. All right. Um, one of the largest things that we have to deal with, and

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I'm not quite sure how we're going to what the best way to do this is, and this is just one piece, has to do with the alleyway and the gate. I don't know if is this something that, Jeff, that we would have to do that we want to get that resolved before.

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So what my recommendation would be that is really an issue between the owners of the properties that we're talking about and those owners are obviously the applicants >> right >> and the city. >> Okay. So I I I think simply we can um

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identify in the resolution that the applicants uh shall work uh with the city to the satisfaction of the parties as it relates to the 7 foot wide alleyway and potentially an easement or some other um access. But I but I don't

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know that we as a board need to get involved with that. The building is at that 3-foot separation line. >> Mhm. uh so that they can accommodate whatever the city may require in those negotiations. But I don't think it's our our prerogative to dictate what what

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that is. >> But it should be in the >> but it should be in the resolution that the that the city that that the applicant shall um communicate with the city and resolve that issue. >> Okay. And and just on that point then just I think to alleviate the mayor's concern, we couldn't get signed site

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plans and move forward until that was satisfied that the city was satisfied correct on how we would proceed. That is right. So the city would have to feel comfortable before we Okay. I just want to make sure. >> Yeah. Okay. >> Um we I I believe that we' heard that uh we are going to use frosted glass on the

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garage. Correct. So we don't have to use that as a condition. >> That's correct. That was testified. >> Okay. That was already testified. >> Yeah. >> Okay. Um, there are a couple of areas where I'm concerned about light spillage. We had about the alleyway, the light that there shouldn't be any spillage >> to uh any adjacent windows in the alley

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cuz I'm not sure what's on that building that's next to the alleyway. And you'd mentioned that there were I believe there were three lights. We just want to make sure there's no spillage into if there are windows, if they're residences, there's no spillage there. >> That's fine. >> So, that's one place that um I would

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want that to happen. And also we had spoken about the motion detector up on the roof on the stairwell. >> Yeah, the gentleman who lives here over there, we indicated that we would put that on a sensor. Um, >> okay. Yeah, >> I'd like that as a condition, please.

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>> Um, there was an item about uh storm water management. There was some change that has to be made about grade >> curve and gutter will be readjusted, >> right? So, we need that as a as a condition. Um there is also uh we had spoken about

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a balcony potentially adding a balcony where one was removed >> that was in the unit by the >> Yes. The ones that was flipped >> by the trash room. >> My only concern about that balcony is that is it going to be facing a window? >> Yes.

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>> You know a window out. We don't want I don't want a balcony if you're facing somebody else's window. I mean, do you want to just >> I want I would like that as a because I I I don't recall where the windows are. >> The fourstory building we approved last

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year, right? >> It's going to be built right here. >> Right. It's going to be right there, but I I don't know where where the windows are. Is it on the side? >> Oh, it's the blue house. >> That building is closer this way. The unit with the balcony is closer to the Windsor building. >> So, it's So, do we know for sure that

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it's not facing somebody's window? Do do we want to just make it subject to your board planner? >> Right. That >> Yeah, it that's fine. And I I really don't want it to be facing somebody. >> Understood. Understood. Okay. >> So, add balcony on the southwestern

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unit. >> Yes. >> Possibly add in coordination with board planning. >> Okay. Right. That's fine. >> Right. That's fine. Um we wanted to get details about lighting under the planters. We want the specifications on that 2700 Kelvin,

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right? >> And we want the lead uh silver checklist. Yep. >> And that you were going to be using hanging signs on the retail. Yep. >> Correct. >> That's all I have. Does anybody else have something? >> I just clarify

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signs. The retail signs >> not necessarily have to be hanging signs. They just can't be signs on the correct corn. >> That's not on corners. That's right. But but my question is should they be consistent regardless of what they are?

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>> I think they said they want them each tenant to come in. >> You're okay if I guess the question is if you're okay if one's a hanging one's on the >> as long as it cannot be on the corners >> sign ordinance. >> Yeah. Is it meets the sign ordinance of Aspbury Park?

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>> Just just not on the corners and comply. >> I had two more. Go ahead. The hardy board color will match the stone material color on the facade. >> Yeah, that was the testimony. That's correct. >> Okay. And then u we still don't have a fence color or stain. So I guess that should just be approved by board

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planner, >> right? And it's 6 feet, not 5T issu >> and and plan shall be compatible. >> Correct. And obviously anything we agreed to at the first meeting that's not inconsistent with with this we we of

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course are still abiding by. >> Does anyone have anything else that we did not cover as a to note as part of compliance resolution compliance?

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Um if necessary the uh the master gas and electric meters shall have a a a ballard for some other protection. >> Yes. Right. I don't see that I have any other comments. >> Okay.

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All right. Um I'd like to make a motion to approve this application based on these uh conditions uh for the resolution compliance conditions. >> Second. Um, James Banano, >> yes. >> Councilwoman Clayton, >> yes.

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>> Jim Henry, >> uh, no. I'm going to vote no. I think this is a site that is being overdeveloped, so I'm going to vote no. >> Mayor Moore, >> yes. >> Jen Solder, >> yes. >> Daniel Shaneo, >> yes.

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>> Kathy McGlaughlin, >> yes. >> Vice Chair Gunnan, >> yes. Chairwoman Kerzac, >> I am going to vote yes, but I am very disappointed with the parking >> which I have voiced numerous times, but I am voting yes.

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>> Thank you very much everybody. Thank you. >> Okay, thank you. >> Motion to adjurnn. Motion to sorry. I I