all right mayy Jacobs I am here committ here Mr Walter here Mr Orana here Mr Leonard here Mr rodelius here Mr G jaini here Mr wild here Mr Martino here Cher I'm here
adequate notice of this meeting of the Bedminster Township L board was filed with the township CL sent to the Bernardsville news and The Courier News and to all subscribers and post hosted at the Township Municipal Building one Miller Lane Bedminster New Jersey on January 12
2024 pleas for theed States okay we'll open it up to the public for anyone who has something they would like to discuss it's not on the agenda um there is only one person that
is not identified online if you wish to um ask us anything or have a comment as long as it's not about the hearing for tonight you can raise your hand you can unmute yourself you can star nine if you're from your
phone can I just say hi would that be okay how come you guys are having so how come you're having so much fun when I'm not there is what I want to know I heard all that stuff there's really good cookies here Frank yeah I know I heard and somebody apparently hi Frank good to see you good
evening everybody yeah nice to be here okay I guess we have not we don't see anyone though we will close it to the public uh we have minutes from May 9th that need to be approved I'll make a
motion to approve the minutes second anyone oppos anyone need to recuse we have a few down here yes new members would you okay minutes are approved and um I just want to welcome
our two new members thank you yeah Brian and Vince correct yeah yeah why don't we get a little so um not a rose not yet well I haven't started
talking yet so uh so Brian is was poed um he is um a significant role in Bedminster with the fire department um Vincent has been on Board of Health for a couple years now
and just as Kathy was U serving as capacity is joint uh historic preservation commission I thought it was another um benefit to have someone from the Board of Health participate as well so to that
extent Vinnie can relay us uh comments and suggestions that come from Board of Health and at the same time bring comments and recommendations from L's board back to the Board of Health but with that let them let them uh give a little 30 seconds uh intro on their
own lived here for 21 years uh over on Ski Hill two daughters uh my wife as well my wife is now uh one of the board uh designes for Republicans at this point she just got
her seat uh very excited um got two big dogs bring them everywhere meetings get out of control we can bring them here at any time but excited to be here I've been watching from the sidelines seeing how things are going so I was exciting to be
a part and Vincent your your day job you're also associated with uh site Development and Construction yep general contractor mostly out of Manhattan some stuff in New Jersey but mostly Manhattan good welcome AB thank you Brian again thank you for the for the
welcome my name is Brian wild uh resident of old Stonehouse um living in town here just about 35 36 years now um kind of started High School in this you we moved in this area and just just kept at home ever since um been as was
mentioned been involved with the fire department here in town since was 18 U Been active member there member with the squad and other community organizations and just you know really enjoy doing you know seeing the town grow and seeing the town develop so uh you found an opportunity with us to be part of it and
excited to be here good welcome AB board thank you good to have you okay um do we want to talk about this resolution that we're not want to I didn't have anything but maybe Paul Madam chairman let me talk about that for a moment the
board recalls the van Ordon application on lamington road was approved at our last meeting the resolution is not on the agenda tonight I would respectively submit that the board should not consider adopting the resolution until
Mr van Orton gets it act together if you drove by the site tonight it's completely torn up he started his work even though I think I was about explicit as I could be at the last meeting about what the steps were before he could start this the site is a complete mess
um I saw his tenant who's significantly pregnant out there trying to work her way around these debris piles um he has ironically requested that he be allowed to move his tenant to the first floor because it's unsafe for her to be upstairs
that request was denied and I would submit that if it's unsafe for her it's unsafe for any tenant because you can't kick somebody out once they become pregnant I think he needs to revisit what he's doing on the inside of the building to make that safe
and he's gonna have to look at that but he's been denied the ability to move the tenant downstairs because he has no legal Apartments as we sit right now he's just been given basically a period of Grace until his approval gets done
he's made no effort to complete his resolution compliance I have don't have any new plans he has many steps to go before he's done and he has I I wrote him an email tonight and what I said was I didn't even know how to start it because I was speechless I
haven't seen anybody so blatantly and obviously just disregard everything in the town because that's what he wanted to do it's I will I will just say absurd that's that's probably the nicest word I can use this evening but I would
strongly suggest and I don't I can't act for the board but I would not recommend that you adopt the resolution until he gets all debris that's now piled out there because you ripped up pavement concrete everything so you can't even walk around the site that all needs to
be removed before I would suggest that you consider the resolution we told him we couldn't go vendant in there and we and of course he has it about County approval so yeah he's it's I I'm I'm at a loss for words which is actually
almost as challenging for me as it is for Larry I saw that all right um so is there anything you want us to do as a board no I don't think there's any there's nothing on the agenda and just leave it leave it that
way okay all right that's what we'll do that's easy yeah all right so we have some uh uh determination of completeness for some other application Paul you want to go over that sure the um there's three
applications for completeness the first is DNL Association which is the Redevelopment of the burned out Bedminster Florest um wrote a complete this letter dated May 15 2024 and there are some minor waivers in that uh
application it's uh to devarian and based of which submitted it's recommended that the application be deemed okay the board entertain it's a motion to deem the wave the remaining items for completeness as recommended by
the C vineer and to deem the application complete is there such a motion now Mak a motion confirm this is planning no okay yeah I'll second
excuse me one second I made a mistake so that was I would have the PB number yeah should be just a d variance well C Varian is in C um Tim you're making a motion I'm make a motion
yeah no Mr Walter hi Mr hi Mr Leonard hi Mr vilus hi Mr gine hi Mr well hi Mr G Martino hi chair hi they um are on the agenda for July
13th next Thursday June 13th junun 13 Jun 13 and those are the okay and our next one next one is 1525 bedm LLC again the board of adjustment application this is the Shell station uh
coming back in to expand the Dunkin' Donuts um my complet letter is dated May 14 2024 there are some waivers associated with the application um again it's I I think they the items can be waved the board wants more information
during the hearing obviously you and request that but again I recommend that deem complete uh with the waivers okay there's a motion thank you second Mr W hi M hi Mr Leonard hi Mr Mr
hi Mr hi Mr last jump on I'm sorry I should have said something with that uh the last sentences based on the above the application is may be de complete is it is or maybe maybe maybe maybe because I
can't I can't deem it complete you have to do that that was a the word is shouldn't be in okay that right okay the third application is one the Lang fhe property if you recall this is
on Rattlesnake Bridge Road they were previously in for a garage Edition in the in the front yard setback um this is the board of adjustment application but it's a c variance so it's my understanding the mayor and commit can sit in on this one um it it's a it's a
fairly simple application for the setback to the columns for the gate uh for the access drive again with the waivers requested it's recommended that be deem complete all right need I'll make the
motion second second makes up for other different order now I'm not used you're b top the lineup now you know Mr hi Mr Leonard hi mrus hi I
hi Mr wild hi [Music] Mr open it up anybody on the board theing Bo have anything they would like welcome to Brian and Vince okay good all right I think we're ready for
our hearing this is 202 206 and I am so glad you have a different name besides 202 206 right good evening Madame chairwoman members of the board thank you for having us tonight my name is Steve melenic from greenbound R Smith and Davis on behalf of the applicant which
is Route 202 and 206 LL um we are here uh for preliminary and final major site plan with various uh variances that we'll discuss today we have three witnesses that we're um proposing to bring today um for the record I just want to confirm with Mr
Collins that notice was reviewed and the board has jurisdiction to proceed tonight that's correct this is an application for a preliminary final site plan with C variances and the planning board land board sitting at the planning
board has jurisdiction to this matter thank you please go ahead gent thank you so we'll get right into it seated to my right is the project engineer Eric Keller um who I'll ask to be sorning yes uh Eric please raise your right hand do you swear from the tot TR
the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help you God I do please St your name and address uh Eric L Keller k e LL e r Omen Consulting Group six Campus Drive sweet 302 for siany New
Jersey we'll just confirm for the record that the board recognizes and accepts and his qualifications as a professional engineer please go ahead gentlemen okay why don't you put your uh just for the record Put your brief qualifications and education certainly U licensed
professional engineer in the state New Jersey uh my license is in good standing and current uh I have appeared before this board uh on the uh three prior U applications that were made for this
piece of property um and have appeared before numerous Fords and Superior Court throughout New Jersey uh on similar matters and I believe Mr Collins you indicated that he has been accepted as a professional yes by theard okay you're
also you probably don't need it but are you also a traffic engineer uh yes my area of expertise in engineering is as a traffic and transportation engineer and I will probably give a little bit of testimony on on that as
well thank you thank you Mr Collins so Eric you have uh the computer in front of you and the controls to share exhibits as they go they come up throughout your testimony I'll just ask you to begin by giving the board um overview of of the property it's in
existing conditions certain just describe for the record Vince can you see that um all right or should we tilt it if it can be tilted that would be great yeah it need to be tilted just a little bit not sure
why it's taking oh there there we go so I see the exhibit has been pre-marked as exhibit A1 but that that's better yes thank you certainly it this is entitled existing conditions areial lamington
Commons uh with six the date is 65 2024 this ISE this was prepared by my office um the property is known as Block 33 lot one can 2.45
Acres the property is split Zone with the portion rectangular portion fronting on lamington road being in the VN Zone and the balance of the track being in the ORV Zone you can see from this from exhibit A1 the property is very
unusually shaped with a very long stem that runs behind a number of the properties uh that front on lington Road um the uh property formerly contained a
office building that was demolished a number of years ago uh there is still a parking lot uh with an access drive to lamington Road and one to Route 206 the uh access drive out to Route
206 um was part of an access modification that was approved by the dot and built by the developer of the somerset Financial Center I'm not sure what they call it anymore uh and uh
um that was circuit 2000 um and we are maintaining that driveway as it exists other than whatever maintenance may be needed as that has been there for a number of years um the access driveway to
lamington Road was constructed uh as part of the 200 11 2012 safe plan approvals which were granted by this board by Somerset County and by the other applicable agencies at the time uh
and that included the sidewalk along uh the ramp from Northbound uh 206 to lamington road so that driveway provides for full inbound movements left and right in and a right only uh exit which
is how it was approved um as I've indic indicated there were prior approvals for this property by the applicant um I was the engineer I testified on those applications um and uh um the really the
main difference between that this current application is that we have moved and I'll show this shortly is we've moved the building to the east um closer to what was the coach stop saddle re property um with the rear parking
area that extends down the stem is essentially the same as what it was um one thing that has also changed since I last appeared here is with the passage of about 13 years what had been saplings
and so on are now uh trees that fall into the regulation by the township um the proposed building is two stories with the basement and contains 14552 ft not including the basement there are
four existing non-conforming deviations from the zoning requirements this is a bit unusual because of the split zone so in the ORV Zone which is the southern portion of the tract the lot area 10
acres is required it has 2.02 lot Frontage 400 ft versus 24715 ft exists lot WID 400 ft required 51.7 ft exists in the VN Zone the lot
area is 05 Acres required and the lot is 043 Acres uh there was a dedication uh of this property to the county back in 2011 or 12 um and that's
where the uh additional lands uh were eliminated from the property now we are also seeking certain variances due to the proposed development which our planner will discuss uh the one is in the ORV Zone
the side yard setback required is 100 ft the width of the stem at the rear the property is only 100 feet so where is no setback side your setback uh possible we are setting it back the building 74.3 ft
from the Southern Property minimum driveway setback 15 ft is required 6.6 ft is proposed uh parking setback from the property line 50 ft required versus 15 ft
proposed um in the VN District the maximum building size is 5,000 square fet the proposed building straddles the zone line and that portion of the proposed building within the VN district is 11,000
474 Square fet um there's also a variance requested for the minimum loading space size 15 by 40t required versus 14 fet by 35 foot proposed and uh maximum number of signs
two signs are proposed one on each Street Frontage uh and one is permitted also Mr banish uh identified parking is located in the front yard which is not permitted um and the refu and recycling
area is in the sidey yard and that is also not permitted so um the uses surrounding the site we have the advanced propert Advanced realy Property to the South a mix of commercial and residential properties to the east along
lington Road the new multif family building across lamington road to the Northeast and in various commercial uses in the Dyan Library to the west across 206 the site today as well as the properties uh immediately buding it
along lamington Road All Drain in a southernly to southeasterly Direction onto the Advanced Property and into the detention Basin that is located in the lower right hand corner of uh the exhibit
A1 um we are proposing we identified 170 trees 173 trees that exist on site most of those trees 89 of them are between 5 Ines and 15 in in diameter of the
remainder uh I'm sorry 89 trees to be removed uh of that size we're removing a total of 95 out of the 173 that were located and that comply or conform to the uh
Township Code 89 of the 95 or between 5 and 15 in uh per year ordinance the total pre- replacement requirement based on the replacement factor is 540 trees to introduce exhibit
A2 this is the site plan rendering this is the same uh layout parking building location as shown in the site plan documents it is inserted into the aerial rendering that was exhibit
A1 um we've kind of screened back the existing U aerial image to highlight the proposed uh site improvements they indicated we're proposing a
14552 foot uh two-story building uh in the easterly portion of the lot adjacent to the former coat stop saddle re property we're proposing a total of 67 parking spaces which include the credit
for two EV charging uh spaces uh 23 of the spaces are located in the uh front parking lot in in this area uh to the west of the building the remaining 42
spaces um are located uh in the stem of the property um the two EV Make Ready spaces are located at the front of the building and they count as two spaces uh the township parking requirement for this
size building with the uses is um 65 parking spaces so we can plot actually we exceed it by two spaces uh there are 388 spaces let me just zoom in
on this so a little bit there are three Ada spaces in the front of the building uh approximate to the various building entrances um and uh as Mr Ferraro pointed out we will provide a flush
carbon herb ramp at the uh 5 foot access aisle also adjacent to the EV parking space so that EV parking space uh the northern one of the two would also be available for an ADA vehicle because
it's next to an accessi um the I mentioned that the proposed driveway or the existing driveway to lamington Road allows left and right in uh right out only the driveway to Route
206 allows right turns in and right turns out um the loading space which is located to the southeast of the building is of sufficient Dimension to accommodate the types of trucks and
delivery vehicles that will serve this proposed building the typical delivery trucks for box Vans panel trucks and the occasional single unit truck all of which will fit into the space uh and be able to move maneuver in and out of that
space um the refu and recycling enclosure is located opposite that uh loading uh Zone um it is in a convenient location to allow for trucks to come
oops come into the site from either lamington Road or from 206 to pick up the refuse and then be able to turn around and exit the site um we have screened that enclosure from the Advanced realy Property with a series of
green giant Barber VY um we are proposing outdoor uh Plaza areas with seating um and which are located to the north and south and then a smaller one
to the Northwest of the the building in anticipation of uh tenant needs for this building we don't have tenants for this building but we want to provide uh for opportunities
if there are some sort of dining facilities or uh delies or something like that where they would like some outdoor seating um that outdoor seating would be in conformance with the applicable Township zoning requirements
for those areas we would also provide refu and recycling containers in the outdoor Plaza areas so that any garbage or recycling materials would have a place to be disposed of um and as we
don't have tenant requirements or tenant needs known at this time uh we may be adding some baller lights um if we can we might like look to add some string lights in those areas um to provide for more aesthetic
lighting of those areas um but the lighting of the majority of the site is covered by the uh lighting for the parking lots and around the buildings which I'll talk about in a little bit uh the grading of the site generally
follows the existing topography the driveway coming in off lamington road slopes uh in a southerly direction through the parking lot uh and then uh the parking to the rear towards the stem
also uh slows slopes towards the bio retention Basin at the back uh the parking areas and the roof drains for the building will be collected in a series of inlets and pipes and piped to
the bio retention Basin um at the rear of the site um we have provided uh while off-site areas the lots to the north of the
property along lamington Road currently drain through this site and on into the Advanced Property they will continue to do so we don't want to capture that water in our Detention Facility our bio
retention Basin is designed to treat for water quality and water quantity controls so we have created a Swale uh along the northern property line on our site which will extend uh to the East
and into the the undeveloped and natural portion Eastern portion of the site where will allow to sheet flow across our property and on into the advanced realy uh detention Basin as it does
today um the discharge of this bio retention Basin has been designed in informance with current standards um it is a little larger than the basins that we have designed uh on the two prior
applications because the criteria have changed um this BAS will address not only the uh current 100-year runoff uh amounts it will also deal and address and accommodate the
year 2100 future rainfall amounts which is a requirement under the states uh yes M chairman I I share your pain my pain yes very much so um but the
discharge point from this Basin uh is generally in the same location as it has been for the prior uh detention basins there is a scour hole at the end um on the Advanced Property there is also a Swale that runs along the top of the
embankment to their parking lot and right where that discharge point from our Basin is proposed is where that swell on their property turns and runs down the embankment and on it into their
uh detention Basin so our Basin with the reduced lows because under the regulations we need to reduce the rate of runoff from our property by 20% for the 100-year storm 25% for the 10year
storm and 50% for the 2-year storm our Basin does that for each of the current run rainfall amounts and the future rain fall death so what is going into that uh Swale on advances property is less than
what goes there today um the bio retention Basin is underd drained there is a soil bed in that Basin to provide for water quality measures that are
required um we did a lot of soil testing on this site and I know you won't be surprised when I tell you that there's a lot of shell on this property um and elsewhere in the county um so we were
unable under today's soil testing requirements to find any location um within the development area where we could do infiltration so we have no ability to do groundwater
recharge um which is permissible in my opinion when the soil the underlying soils don't recharge today so um not only did we do Inu testing we also did they call Basin flood test you know we dug a big hole
put a lot of water into it and it sat there so um the U this is a major development we're disturbing over one acre of uh land and we are increasing the amount of imper regulated motor vehicle surfaces
by more than a quarter acre so we have to meet quantity and quality which we do groundwater recharge as I indicated we cannot comply with because the soils are unsuitable um Mr farar and I have spoken about his
review letter um we will work through the storm water comments um Saro and I have worked in a number of communities on storm water Commons and uh there is nothing in there that we cannot address
so other than coming up with a way to recharge water into the ground because it's not going to happen um sanitary water and other utilities will extend to the existing Mains in lamington Road um
or along the gr 206 ramp um we are going to reach out to New Jersey American uh and see if we can provide for the meter uh their meter and and back flow prevention uh valves in the building
itself and not have to put in a a hot box uh because you know we prefer not to I I know the township would prefer us not to as well um but we're driven by what New Jersey American will permit if we do have to put in a hot box we will
appropriately screen it um it would be on the Eastern side of the driveway so it would not be an impact to s distances from that driveway uh because exiting traffic is only going to be looking to the left because they can only make a right out
um the landscape plan uh provides a layering of different plant materials shade trees evergreen trees and various evergreen shrubs and ornamental plants um we are providing uh 12 shade trees which consist of Honey Locust and River
Birch 21 Arbor VY and 218 evergreen shrubs which will provide a screening of the parking areas of headlights so that that those impacts will not extend off the property um the
adjacent uh the only adjacent property that um is approximate to the parking area that is residential is Lot 4 uh which is the property to the east of the former coach shop and as I said before the Eastern
portion of the site will remain in its current natural condition the lighting plan utilizes a decorative light fixtures along the driveways and in the front parking lot and we use it more traditional parking
lot for lack of better term a shoe box type fixture though with the LED fixtures that we're using these days the uh crosssection of those parking lot lights is a lot thinner than the old style ones with lamps which they were
really two boxes more like a pizza box huh it's more like a pizza box now they're yes they're now like a a personal pizza box they're small um and uh um all the fixtures have a mounting height of 16 feet um and because they're
LED they can be programmable but in discussions with Mr farl uh what we're going to propose is that they will turn off either at 11:00 or when if there's uh restaurants or other dining type
facilities uh an hour after they would close um except for we would provide some security lights because we don't want the entire parking lot to be dark the the only comment I would make on that Eric is if you don't have somebody
who's open till 11 o'clock that they should be shut down earlier than that that's really tenant based but under the ordinance you're allowed to go to 11 right so we can we can accept that you know
okay um which you know will comply with what the township ordinance uh requires um there is one building mounted late um at the southeast corner of the building whose main which main purpose is to
eliminate the uh the loading area um the average Illumination in the parking lots range from 1.1 to 1.6t candles which is appropriate uh for the area and for the proposed uses uh the rear parking lot has a maximum
illumination of 2.2t candles but again the lights would be extinguished in accordance with the township ordinance um we are seeking a number of waivers uh from the township required
ments which are outlined in Mr Faro's um letter the I will note that the illumination levels at the property line of the northern property line uh those Lots at for on lamington road book handles at that property line are zero
so the good thing with I mean there's many good things to do dealing with LED lights um one of the other the big things is that we can direct the light and there is little light skullage behind the fixture
itself um Outside Agency approvals we have filed with the Somerset County planning board that is pending um we will be uh submitting to the somerset Union Soil Conservation District once we have addressed Mr Ferraro's stormwater
comments um and in my opinion we do not need to go to D for any approvals but I've in discussion with Mr were agreeable to submitting a letter of no interest to the do saying that the uh
amount of traffic does not violate the permit that was issued uh back in 2000 um we did as part of our submitt to um Somerset County we did look at the um
traffic comparison of what was approved um by this board and the County planning board back in uh 2011 here and 2012 at the county um and
uh and this is all using the current it Institute of Transportation Engineers trip generation manual um which is now the 11th Edition the previously approved which was for a
uh what the the it calls a small office building in a drive-in Bank um the current proposal is a again a small office building on the first floor strip retail what they what it calls strip
retail less than 40,000 square feet on the Upper Floor um and this current proposal will generate less traffic than the previously approved uh application for the small
office building and the drive-in Bank so um uh one other thing that um was raised by Mr Faro in his review letter was let me the rear parking
area um which contains as I said about 40 something spaces um does there's a a cutout at the rear but there is no turnaround area provided since we exceed the Township's
requirement for parking um we are agreeable to remove one of those spaces not remove it stripe it out so that it is usable as a turnaround area I believe that is the conclusion of my
direct testimony thank you Eric I have nothing further other than to note how impressive it was that you did not read your typo that we were marinating the driveway yeah I saw that when I was looking at it going AR what was I
thinking hry that's all the direct questions we have from does the board have any questions for this application for I have one for I'm sorry U maybe for you Paul this the rear
uh parking lot they're planning to put a swell along those back properties you think that's going to affect I guess the plan is to have the water run down into their retention Basin uh Bas do you think that's going to happen or do You'
see a problem with the water just running there and then sitting for those two uh properties there no it should it should run based on the slopes on the so it doesn't slope down yes it slopes back to the to the Basin okay is it running to the Basin or isn't
he didn't he say he was going runs around the Basin because they're bypassing that is that going to change the volume of water that's now hitting the advance since it's going to be redirected around something as a closer cascading down a
hill well it goes into the Basin today from the off-site areas and will continue to go um into the advanced Basin from those properties what goes into the advanced Basin today from our site is being the rate of that runoff is
being reduced because of the function of this bio retention base my question I guess was more that now it's flowing more generally across a wide swap of land and now you're going to redefine it and make it a little more forceful and swing around something that was question
well there there's a Swale that is at the rear of that property that that sends the water down that that sort of concentrates it now okay that would that was it was one of my concerns with the um the construction of the outfall and I noted in my letter that you know that's
something that needs to be watched and maintained by the applicant in the future because if there is erosion in there it's gonna they're going to have to go back and repair it eventually it will stabilize but it may require some effort to do that over time because there tends to be reconcentration of
runoff and it's it's it's not a problem it's just something that needs to be addressed sure need to change in the future and what we'll do is um we'll make sure it's in the storm water onm manual that they have to prepare right I just just for everybody's benefit I put
sheet five of the site plans which were submitted to the board on the screen and you can see the general Topography of the site was actually today kind of a concentration of flow
behind the U former coach stop property that comes down there is a Swale Along on advances property that comes along their Northern property line and then turns right at where our head wall is
turns and goes down into their Basin their Basin is located here so the water that we're diverting from the off-site properties to the North run along our Northern property line come to the far
side of the Basin and then as you can see the Contours run in a parallel condition in a Northeast to Southwest so that water then reconstitutes his sheet flow and ends up in the Basin any
okay I have several question several questions actually sure um first is that the topography there going from north to south on the north side of lington road it's uphill then there south side of lington road and then slopes down into this it's it's more like a little Gully
or Valley but it's it's fairly wide is is that land that that you call the stem is that considered Wetlands because I used to own a piece of one of those properties and there were times with two feet of standing water back there um
many times so is that considered wet wet Lings no we've we had environmentalist look at the property and he did not find any Wetlands I mean you know we've been I've been working on this property for
24 years now um I was 12 when I started um and and you know it has been looked at a number of times and there are there are not Wetlands on this property there is enough topography uh and and there are not soil conditions
that show any Wetland parameters okay um I have a couple other questions sure um so the the building that you plan to
build is going to straddle two zones correct is that correct o v and then VN VN and O RV yeah and 11,000 square fet of that building you plan to put into the VN Zone correct
okay and pretty much parking lot for 42 spaces also in the VN Zone the no uh only 42 spaces no most of the the only
parking that is in the VN zone are uh maybe half of the parking spaces facing the buildings the VN District I'm trying to understand where the line is that's what this vert this
North South Line out near rout 206 if you look up at the screen Oops why is it a little delay yeah and and it's different I got to look up at the screen second delay it's not gonna pop out we'll see okay oh you
may want to just walk up there and just yeah okay so what is in the VN district is the extension of the uh Southern property line of these Lots along lamington road coming across in an East
West Direction and then an extension of this line that is up near the BL 206 ramp that comes down so this rectang generally rectangular area is what is in the VN District
and I call it the Hammerhead of the frontage along 206 and most of the ramp and the entire stem are in the O Okay um and so I'd like you to explain
to me at least this calculation that you have here on um A2 sheet A2 maximum floor area ratio this is she2 of the sa plan we have some kind of formula where you I I really don't understand what I
got to it what it says so it's um sheet a A2 maximum floor area you have your whole table that's that's a large table yes and then you're adding some square footage from one zone and some square footage from the other Zone I'd like to
understand what that okay that means uh where is that oh here it is so the each Zone the ORV and the VN have different allowable F ARS so we take
those Fs in each district and then we take a weighted average the area of the entire lot the area of the lot within the ORV district is 2.02 divided by the total lot area of
2.45 we take that ratio that percentage times the allowable F in the our V zones and we do the same thing for the VN District we take 043 ided by 2.45 is around 25% times the allowable F
in that zone add the two together and that's how we come up with the allowable f for the lot as a whole as Eric said this has been around for 24 years and when the board of adjustment first looked at that and it had a similar
circumstance that's exact how the board of adjustment determined the permitted FL a ratio should be calculated is that acceptable okay because this the first time I've ever seen combination like you you won't see many properties like this right un property yeah okay could I mam
chair could I make a quick observation about that that might save us all a little time later uh the applicants done a great job of detailing the layout in each of the zones and how it affects the zones and what variances are required all of which is definitely needed for this but
because the office Zone was crafted with an entirely different intent than the VN they couldn't be more different so we're looking at a unified parcel and the distinction between the zones becomes a lot less meaningful because it's going to be developed in one of the two ways
so I think if we don't get too bogged down in all the minutia about these things and recognize that if f is not being more than what's previously been determined to be okay and the other variances can be weighed on their own Merit we don't have to spend too much time we could spend hours on this table
and I'm sure Eric's prepared to tell us all about it but but I suspect that we don't need to uh and I just throw that in to try to save a little time okay well that that helps clarify it a lot because I've never seen this kind of calculation with a mixed Zone
like this so yes okay I might have some more questions later but okay thank you you're welcome uh Paul any concern about planting honey Locus after some of our conversations with respect to the hills yeah and maybe we can can
reconsider some of those honey locust because there are some issues with them as they as they grow older and uglier okay um we can we can come up with some some other treats I'm not married to to them you know they're good for urban areas and you know
but there's a lot of plant material we can yeah there they have their advantage but they have some disadvantages too we can probably come up with something better that'd be good not a problem I have a followup question um because the majority of this
building is cons is is in the VN Zone um did you go before the historic commission to get any approval on the architectural yes I'm going to let the architect talk about that and you'll be happy to hear what he has to
say anyone else on the board I had a question regards to the uh square footage you mentioned that the square footage in the previously approved property and traffic would be less with your current layout what was the do you know what the square footage of use was
on the prior property with this one being at roughly 15 so the um the the prior uh square footage um was uh in total was 8,400
Square ft the difference is that Banks generate a lot more traffic than the type of retail that we would have on this site what standard is that based upon this is all based on the it trip generation manual 11th Edition
so Bank generates more traffic than a restaurant or anything along those Lin well at this point because we don't know what the retail would be it is all based on just general retail so um but even if there was a small
you know deli restaurant whatever in in the first floor um that would be probably more PM peak hour um but uh you know we don't have that number so we've just used the standard retail numbers
for now how much would it change if with the with the uh with putting Deli or restaurant because just hearing your discussions it sounds like there's going to be restaurants there which is fine I I'm not against it but I think that brings a lot more traffic in the area
than a bank ever would the other thing too with with a restaurant is that more of the traffic would be drawn from I mean we're at the corner of a state highway in a county road so there would be traffic that would be drawn from the existing traffic on the roadway um this
these are just raw numbers we haven't even applied those I don't know I we did not run the numbers I was just curious because you said it was less I was just shocked that how how could it be less with a smaller size building I just guessed that it would be a smaller size building because you're asking for a
variance to go to go larger so ER for a restaurant the peak hours are usually different correct correct how how many how many tenants are you looking at you looking at one large tenant or four different tenants I'm going to let the architect talk about that because that's part of his
plans but that doesn't that help or or change trip generation and all of traffic from a traffic perspective just deal with the square footage whether it's one tenant or 6 tenants it really you know from from our calculation
perspective it it doesn't change anything um unless as Mr IM Martino indicated one of them was a restaurant it may have more um but I had dinner down at the Pizza Brothers Place uh
which is a restaurant it was not very busy tonight I don't know maybe I picked the wrong pizza place that dinner not that good a good reason so it's the first one I came to so all right we'll get you to the right
one so you made a statement and I'm sure you you're correct in your statement true that this retail has less trip generation than a bank correct and that came out of a book but every bank I go to nowadays is empty because no one goes
to Banks any so you're comparing it to a bank which I think that book that wherever you got the number from is not 2024 yeah probably it is it is post pandemic it is current it is the most current data that
we have available um and you know people may not go into the bank but the bank that we had had drive-through links and a lot of activity uh is in the Drive-Thru Lanes ATMs everything else you know the
activity within the bank itself may may be off but this is a data that we use whenever we prepare a traffic study if I could just weigh in on the on the traffic issue for a second I know Vince Vince you're new so you haven't heard this before um and I don't know if I've
ever said it with with Lou with you in the room but we're talking about a permitted use per use virtually by definition says the amount of traffic that it generates is acceptable the both access points one the do and one the
county are regulated strictly by those agencies so we don't get to say anything about the configuration of those driers the impact that potential tenants would have is on the parking because different users have different amounts of parking those they they' they've provided a
certain amount of parking on the site when specific Tenants come in as part of the uh change of tency process the Z officer and I look at it to make sure that the parking that's there is going to work with the tenants that are being proposed so yes there may be more or
less traffic but from Strictly a planning board perspective it doesn't really matter because these are permitted uses and the consequence of traffic really has no bearing on the decision that you would make right so my
concern is that that location is a very very busy location and there restrictions on on Ingress Andress on those driveways someone coming if someone missed the
intersection and tried to make a left into that coming south on 206 would be a disaster so I'm just I'm just trying to understand that the location the traffic the returns all of that stuff
some of issues we talked about with the property dunad donut property as well so I just want to bring that up so that everyone is out on the table and maybe you have a traffic person or someone that could talk to us about that that's me Eric is the traing person
okay Paul I understand your point about permitted use but this is also looking for almost double the square footage that was originally intended so use the the answer to that is yes and no with the with the weighted floor area ratio
that's what the permitted area is with the with these uses and it's it's a complicated hybrid here it it really is and um you know a lot of and Eric gives a lot of traffic testimony and I've heard a lot of his traffic testimony and
there are some basic tenants of that and once you get into permitted use the board and and Tom can correct me if I'm wrong I don't think the board has any jurisdiction to be able to deny an application because of the use a permitted use generates
the amount of traffic can't be used as a justification to deny a permitted use what Paul is really getting at it and what Eric was using as an illustration was kind of specific to
this site he the site already received do approval to have the intersection the way it is they are the sole entity responsible for that for the access to 202 206 and
under the state highway management code we have no jurisdiction the lamington road was approved by the county of Somerset and is a County Road and we have no jurisdiction over that so this is different than a a property on a on a Township
Road but more importantly what he was using that number for was to help you know that the do actually already approves a use which technically generates more traffic under the calculations that you have to use for do
calculations based upon it and and that he doesn't even have to go back to the do because it already has been approved and built and that it's quite that sounds quite logical to me that is the way it
works um so I think the way to focus maybe gck could help you understand that he's probably also satisfied that The Interchange and the driveways are going to operate in a safe and effective Manner and that's basically inherent in what he's what
he's laid out as a site plan so if you're worried about a particular driveway you could focus on particular driveway or something like that but basically it's less impact than the previously approved and
built driveways okay thank you I have a question regarding des access from the stem back to the building is it through the parking lot or on your Landscaping plan looks like you've got
bushes yes mayor it is it is through the parking lot you know just up the drive aisle and then you get right onto the sidewalk and Plaza area just past the uh loading area we wanted to keep as much green to the perimeter as we
could just just a question about uh the tree count Paul your riew yeah they've got some tweaks they've got to do on that to to make that that right and I think at the end of the day you have
129 removed and 730 to be replaced um Eric testimony I think was 89 no 95 being remov 95 to be removed correct and 520 to be replaced uh 540 is a replacement
requirement based on the size of the trees being removed so you're saying Paul's wrong not saying that Paul is wrong we have a difference in calculation and I think what we can do is two things number one we will resolve
those numbers so we agree on that but fundamentally a waiver from the tree replacement ordinance is going to be required which is which is not unusual for a site like this one comment slash question I had related to the outdoor seating area I
know you don't really have anything for a tenant but I would suggest that there be certain things in a resolution about that for example there should be outdoor trash cans that are appropriate and that
look nice yes there are tables out there they need to be heavy tables and not plastic ones with chairs that blow around um I think we have to come up with some sort of General standards for that so when somebody comes in to do those areas the the right improvements
get put in there we don't get um my old backyard uh my question is is it just if you have a restaurant or whether you want those outdoor spaces anyway you know
emplo this point we're seeking to have those regardless how they are finished and you know we may not have all pavers as we show now we may put some small trees in there this is we
always when we lay out Plaza areas and we've done a lot of what work for this applicant um is we show the the most impervious condition because then because I want to make sure the storm water works and then we back off from there so you know there
may be tree tree areas there may be uh uh you know seat walls uh and not we may not put tables in there there may be some tweaks to that um and that is what we're kind of looking at depending on
what the tenant needs are so we've taken in the worst case of showing some tables and having the whole area is impervious um so that we've addressed it from a pervious coverage and a storm water perspective so well how how do we
deal with potential lighting issues for those areas right because we've already they've already sort of said that they don't know what they want and there might be ballards and there might be you know some some additional sight lighting how do we put parameters because we've
seen some applications where the the balled lighting was a little yeah aggressive and that's that that's where in my opinion if they're gonna come in with something with Ballers through there and it's gonna not comply with the
ordinance I can't wave that at my level they'd have to come back here and talk to you about it things like string lights the board has seen before and board has approved before those are things that you see those are exposed sources that the ordinance generally does not permit but I think everybody
realizes yeah that's something that looks good in the context of an outdoor eating area it wouldn't necessarily associated with some sort of restaurant it's not necessarily what you would put around an employee hangout area but associated with the restaurant I think
it might be appropriate and I don't think there's a major problem if you remember the K application there was some of that in their Plaza question that loading spot you have there the truck is parked in there
and unloading things are they bringing it in right next to that t the seating area we would have to maintain a access aisle most likely along the building face which is why we're showing the tables further away
um you don't know there's no doors along the back of the building where is the property too close so loading is is through the front R correct right next to the seating when Mr Riker the architect gets up he'll show you the floor plans where
the doors are located and everything there are none to the back anyone else I just have another question so a question back to Eric and Paul um I forgot to ask this earlier you
use the same type of formula for the lot coverage that you use for f the weight the are we going to consider lot coverage the same thing because in in this situation you have lot coverage um is way over the zone or
the end like like way way over and it's all parking lot so are we going to say that it's a combined that again that's the way the board of adjustment looked at it 20 some odd years ago and basically established the way to
calculate it yeah the case law for and and our planner will get into this well he won't really get into this issue because it's not a variance um but when you have a split Zone lot it is based on the total area
of the lot but the requirement has to be based on a prata a proportionate share of what's in each Zone and that's what's calculated in here Mr Collins indicated um you know how much coverage
is permitted in each Zone and in its proportion based on the amount of area of the lot in each different Zone it's it was a brain twister it was easier this time because it was the the third
time that I did it um even though it was 13 years ago the last time I did it and I can't remember 13 hours ago so um uh and and the township has changed some of the criteria so we had to update all of our calculations but at least we had the
basic premise to work from I have one question just in regards to the lighting said that it was a 16 foot light fixture that's going to be going through the parking lots how will that relate to that uh Lot Number Four are Ang is going to be high enough that they can be seen
or or cause uh like to go towards that that one that is a residence the other ones I believe are still used as commercial yeah so it's not a problem for them but for some going on the second floor then I look out their window at a light that may not be so nice and I don't know if that was
eventually done to see where it be relatively in height the there are two light fixtures behind that property um the height is conforming with the zone and as I indicated the light
levels um even 10 ft behind the curb line are at between zero and 0.1 foot candles so um there is no light spillage to the rear
of those lot lights so and sometimes is a concern about glare and seeing Source one of our standards is you can't have an exposed source so you can't see that with this squat box kind of fixture all the
sources are up above the bottom of the light so if you're looking up into it you'll see it just like the lights here here but generally speaking it's that like a a source that s sticks down below that you'll be able to see Mr Keller be the rear of the
building is that grass behind the building or is that a purpus area no it's grass now I might be cing head but there's supposed to be a rear service path back there because there are doors in the back of the building am I miss missing
something uh I'm going to let the architect talk about the rear we we miss that Landing PS his nameing I I'd like to let that question go to the architect so he can talk about what the code requirements are okay so
if that area was that area the calculation behind there for impervious coverage was that grass or was that our plan show it as grass okay there there may be landing pads at the back at the doors at at you know but again I want to
refer that to the architect um as far as coverage goes um the the maximum lot coverage for this lot is 61.5% is permitted we're at
38.3% yes so I think we can accommodate if we need a little bit more approves we can accommodate that can you run down um going west to east the uh the different land uses sure
this is the first one Lots two and three is the Old Coach stop saddle okay so this this project does not involve any of the saddle re problem no okay no the next one is a residential
lot that's lot four lot six is a commercial lot that's is that the naal yeah uh lot s is also a commercial lot uh um and I don't recall what lot
seven is lot seven is a residential it is residential okay and lot eight which and and the area behind lot seven um and eight is undisturbed and you know behind lot six
which is also commercial lot um is really just half the detention fire retention Basin in natural areas would you describe the screening that you plan to put between uh the change in
zones um especially concerned about the residen L so let me go to the site plans it looks like there's grass but then you know what's screening so we this this is a residential lot
there are a couple of existing trees some large trees some evergreen trees in this area uh which we are going to uh maintain um the shrubs that we are planting along there
are oops they are inkberry Hollows and they will grow to four feet or so and that's a it's basically a hro but they're Evergreen uh plantings um and then we're maintaining
the existing um trees at the rear of uh that residential lot there is also a detached garage in the Southeast corner of that see that yeah yeah the four foot trees are the ones that are along the curb of the
parking right those are 4 foot evergreen shrubs and then we are uh proposing where is we can you tell me what the distance is there between the property and the shrubs yes give me
C the property line and the shrubs about 17 ft what kind of vegetation is existing along that line it looks like there's a like a tree there is is that remaining yes they're there's uh 10in Evergreen there's a 28
in deciduous another 28 in deciduous couple of 28 inch shade trees and there are these spy things are the evergreen trees um so this area from the and then
on the coach stop property which is here uh is wooded obviously we didn't locate any trees on their property but this whole area from the garage in a Westerly direction is all going to be maintained with the plant material
that's there today I go back to to day two I don't know you can see the vegetation that exists at the back of the coast shop and behind uh lot for and the house yeah
so the house seems to be pretty far away from the back of the property correct it is close to the to the county road yes do you know how far it is by uh from from the property line yeah from the property line back to the house
it's on that property I'm just concerned about the residential um property there bear with me a second I'll give you an approximate distance from the rear of the house to the property line
about 15 feet okay so there is a good distance there yes ma'am yeah good okay anybody else from the board no is there anybody online Janine we can
open it up to the public no we just have Frank Susanna and Eric because can't okay anybody is I'm not sure you were the architect is going to talk further about the signage yes yeah the architect the
architect is there that's I thought you said is the architect going to test I'm sorry I I misheard but there are two proposed and one is allowed but there two front engin right and our planner will give the positive
and negative criteria associated with those variances all of VAR okay we can I guess close it to the public you know I I do have one quick question this really for Paul um with the advanced project that was approved
um with an office building really r on the other side and with a possible retail maybe food maybe not doesn't make sense to have some connectivity uh we have a sidewalk that
ends at the crosswalk going towards uh 206 should should there be a continuation the sidewalk coming down to the Advanced Property also know that Advan was also not just
for that office building but for additional I think that's good question I think um any connectivity off of the road is challenged by the slope that exists there running into the back of the grading with a with a
freshman as far as going along the road um frankly KN how lazy people are they're walking someplace they're walking to one of the facilities in the Advanced Property and they're not going to walk here just not goingon to happen
you're not going to walk out to 206 206 and then up and into the site I think more likely pessian traffic from here will be coming from the Elite Property and some of the uh commercial properties along the road so think folks from fresh
pet would um walk up that hill they if it depends on how good the food [Laughter] is I was promised really good food yeah but I think that's early breakfast and I don't think fresh bad will be
over think you heard that you were promised as Vinnie Vinnie noted he's not from bed and and Vinnie is on the sport of H the inside excuse me I'll be right back so I I could just come back to that
sidewalk because um you know this if this goes forward this is one opportunity to get um EV to yeah I it is but it's hard to get two people
to such EAS or such well I Tom I it wouldn't be an easement connecting inside it would be a a sidewalk along 206 oh right but that's a bad location for people to it's not like they're not likely to go
there we already have a sidewalk and and a crosswalk um to the library uh Cuts right across um had folks come to the township committee uh talking about what we could do to actually improve the
connectivity across 206 crosswalk is also uh part of our hike and bike trail so that that walk and sidewalk does get used and I'd like to to say yes to that as well because we want to increase walkability Village
downtown all of that stuff we've talked about many times over so I'd like with Larry's concern I'd like to voice my concern as well no I do see that there's a problem is that the land was donated um well not donated it was uh
transferred to the who's who's got that do do this area here where the sidewalk comes down and goes across that's do that's not a right away that's actually it's no it's part
of the D 206 right away well is it right of way or is it still owned by the applic it's own by the do it's it's part of the right away of of the highway
I mean I think Larry makes a great Point as far as Now's the Time to do it you know you have a lot of development going on you got people riding bikes everywhere I think to if there's a way to connect
them it makes sense to certainly investigate it and look at it we side walk into I'm just trying to figure out how to get across that's F thank [Music] there so they just down
here weer a sub in that I I don't recall I I don't I don't think one of the comments I wanted to make but I don't know and was discussed and then never
okay we' only get we'd only get to hear anything further what do you think you know one of the one of the things that might be more practical than a sidewalk on 206 is an internal sidewalk on this property along
the parking lot in front of the parking lot between the parking lot and Route 206 and then a crosswalk on this property not on not in the right of way a little stub because there's only about 10 feet
between the curb and the Advanced Property and that way you know someone's they can do it at their own expense on their property and someone's more likely to walk internal of this property to cross over to get if
they're trying to get to the lamington road sidewalk area than they are to walk all the way out by 206 also they're more likely to want to use this property that way if they're closer to the building than if they're another 50 ft away from
the building so is Advance constructing I don't think so but it was yeah and that's a question I was asking earlier because I I remember question during the advanced application I'm not sure if it was deferred until there might be a need for
it or it was just not addressed so if it wasn't addressed then we' be putting it into the sidewalk no well you be people putting it in to get to the Advanced Property that's that's the I think the idea right you're going to have you know once again if you're going to have retail or and the
building is Right building is literally right but topographically right behind your parking lot topographically you're going to fall down the hill right to get to get to their get to their building it's a it's being regraded and lowered significantly yeah um I have a concern
about constructing the sidewalk just in front of this property because you're dumping people into 206 at that point and I understand the desire well there are exceptions for that as well um but I I I think there
are I'd be concerned about dumping the people out towards 206 if we're not running all the way up 206 and you know think about what's out there you've got a highspeed road no curb no guide
Rail and you know introducing pedestrians into that scenario is not great you know every couple of uh Saturdays we get you know couple dozen people hanging out at the corner across the street well they can
cross with the crosswalk and come and go to this place um once again I just look at this you've got um possibly you know uh maybe 200 uh
Folks at the Advanced Property um you're going have fresh pack you have the other buildings that are there you may have other retail uh to the extent that we are uh creating a little bit of a commercial District whether the sidew is near
adjacent to 20 206 or it's place a little further in off the road yeah it's it's a lost opportunity no I don't think can I weigh in on this one cross 206 to walk over to go to a
restaurant or whatever store is over there as well and Paul I do understand that people are lazy but in colins neighborhood I you know I see them oh yeah they walk constantly we're Walkers yeah absolutely could if I could just weigh in really quickly on this one I think
the arguments are strong in each each Direction but this is your one chance to get that at some point in the future may be much more sidewalk along Route 206 and Now's the Time to do this part of it but the other thing is if there are going to be people in or near the right of way and they have a sidewalk as an
option instead of being out in the road that's a good thing so anytime we do that we're making more of an opportunity for them to be off the road so I'm gonna weigh in on at the risk of agreeing with the mayor I'm gonna weigh in on that one I think that's a
first I Reser tried desperately not to him so and and look it may not be something that needs to be constructed immediately but Reser fut
needs would make more sense to do it do it as part of the site improvements now yeah yeah that you would do it you would do it now had issues with these deferred sidewalks and you know it's it's challenges what does it take to look into what happened with the advance
how that ended up I I'm virtually certain there there were no sidewalks POS there and it wasn't a condition that they have to be done in the future at the time it was sidewalks to nowhere but this would would make a big difference because you could connect those five buildings at the Advanced Property
including restaurants to the whole village right the street yes once you know similarly we're having conversations um in pluck with DOT about improving The
Pedestrian accessibility uh between both sides down there once this is not obviously pluckin uh but there is a concentration of commercial structures commercial businesses and once again in proximity to our
village so it's it's something I think that we could discuss and you know if a separate conversation needs to be help with advance that this would actually complement and uh help their both office
and potential retail uses maybe they'd be amenable to a connection well they have to come back to that's that's right pH two that's right good job I don't know if they do
have to come back for phase two that's true they they approval for both appr facing plan but there were elements that um they needed figured out right but I don't think it required coming back
here well that's subject to uh you know our engineer well right but but none of those dealt with I know I mean you started the meeting pretty
strongly so for our site well we could do is we already have a sidewalk connection out to lamington road we come in on the east side of the driveway across the front of the building what we could do is from
that Plaza area on the south side of the building is extend out um across the islands across the driveway throat out to 206 and then have a walk across our driveway and
a landing pad on the south side of our driveway and you know if you get Advanced to um do something on their side then they have something to connect to in this way
it provides a connection to our site it provides a connection to the rest of the Village area um and we don't have to really get out along the highway and and you know concerns about as Mr Faro indicated high speed no curbs
um and it's not really a a a pedestrian friendly area and we wouldn't have to make an application at the correct ER could you show that on the you know the site plan drawing like with your
pressure like where you're saying so this is already exhibit A2 so um we come across our driveway come along the driveway come through here crosswalk
across the southern right it would be a crosswalk here get to your existing your proposed part right and there would be a crosswalk here right and then that
you know this sidewalk connection would stop at the common property line and then that allows the uh through the internal sidewalk system to come out to lington
Road easy yeah yeah that doesn't propose anything for going across to6 right well on the drawing here it says proposed crosswalk cross The Jug
Handle and it says proposed crosswalk cross 206 not not this applicant but those are existing this is an existing crosswalk okay that was already built here and then there's crosswalks across lamington
Road and 206 at the signals so there Mr fr indicated people are lazy especially when they would have to cross a state highway like that with five Lanes right let's take a look we do it I know I know
we do I I I tell you I've I walk the dog we go down hike and bike trails that's how we connect um and once again so that crosswalk just for the board is part of our hike and bikes Network I see it says it says paint I
thought it said proposed but says painted crosswalks so those are existing yes yep and how about but how about the little sidewalk from The Painted crosswalk to this sidewalk that runs along the ramp and then along lington road is
already constructed that's there that's part of the underlying area okay well that sounds like a good idea right that'll be a change you nothing uh we did have an open to the
public and I think they closed it yes we did we don't have any public on and okay all right well thank you now like to follow up our second witness yeah architect breaker maybe we should have a five minute break
before we start our next witness yeah okay let's just do that five minutes you ready to go mad chair roll no okay y right is the project architect Jack raker of Minco who all ask to be sworn
in please raise your right hand do you swear from the tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth to help you God I do and please state your name and address and spell your last name my name is Jack Riker r a k e r ad Lambert Lane and Lambertville New
Jersey and if you can give the board the benefit of your qualifications I've been practicing in this field of architecture for the past 20 years I'm a licensed architect in the state of New Jersey and I've testified before maybe 100 boards in the state of New Jersey your license is been standing
it is I'd like to submit Mr raker as an expert in architecture the board will recognize and accept act Riker's qualifications as a registered architect is that right that's correct thank you please go ahead Mr you have control of the zoom and you
can share your screen with any exhibits that you'd like to introduce and I'll ask you to walk the board through what you did in connection with application and well that is really it has to go around the world Zoom
great so we're starting with a a view of the project just to get you a view from from sort of curve at uh lington Road in 202 uh this is what the building is going to look like I'm going to get more into this I have a perspective at the end and that's how it'll end but it's a it's a great way to sort of get you
accom as to what we what our real vision is here so these are the plants U I'll wait till they come up so the public who's watching online Bo okay so these are the plant uh of the project um they they're
conceptual at a essentially a maximum capacity if if we have a series of the most tenants possible we've shown a division here how that would happen uh the plan to the left is the basement so that's just an open basement there may
be some mechanical spaces meter rooms things like that downstairs once we coordinate and and we get our mechanical engineer involved uh we'll get those spaces put in there but essentially it's about 7,000 square feet 7200 square feet and it's it's um it's you know just used
as additional space the main floor is the middle plan here and uh the the uh oh well we just lost your laptop so I'm
gonna have to attach to mine I can I'm GNA have to um I'm gonna have to get your Wi-Fi though did number one no no I just promised the mayor by 10 always something winner winner just
get my plan open connect Ed Wi-Fi yes I will that's not correct yeah are dry
get to the's definitely to it questions says and then the one next to it you overt has a program over a new guy has to face
it just close your eyes and keep I I so when go rob back just gonna spin tumblers at random if we ask Robin if we're nice will she give us a secret code secret handshake to get in there hon she can't do
745 it's now it's 69 want to hear no complaints it take about a day to get at 78 so working it's it's just a box mount with nothing behind it random okay we're back we're back
apologize for the delay so this Center is the is the is the retail the lower level retail fronting the uh the sidewalk we have doors that access the front of the uh building uh each retail space we have five retail spaces at the
ground floor it's set up to do that it could just be one retail space if uh you know Banana Republic comes in and takes the whole ground floor uh but we whatever we can get so um you know we have some space at the end we've planned
for some uh some bit restrooms uh accompanying each space obviously these spaces will be customized so when the tenant comes in but we'll likely run all the plumbing stubs so that in the future if we have to subdivide the space or redivide it all the Plumbing's there and and we can move
forward so to the bottom of the page that's the upper level entry you see there's a set of doors here with a stairwell and then also an elevator that takes you up to the plan on the right where there's a hallway that goes down the elevator dumps you out here there's
a hallway that accesses addition an additional five spaces at the Upper Floor that could just be one space as well but you know until we get our tenant mix and they tell us the the square footage that they're looking for uh we can't really uh subdivide the
space but we know that would be the maximum five on the ground and five up up top and the ground floor each has their own bathroom that correct and the second floor has shared that's correct the shared
Gap there's doors to the back that's correct so yeah egoss requirements requires to have doors at the back but uh that would again as was discussed before pads it's just a coordin coordination issue on our part we'll get those pads put in uh toward the back yeah all those doors swinging in
including the front entry doors CLE which is kind so you don't think that truck backing out backing in to make deliveries is it going to use the rear doors you think they're going to just come around the front they'll likely come around the front these are these spaces are small enough where they they
can just come around okay I've been just told that they're going to add a sidewalk in the back and we'll do our deliveries that way yes okay and then also for the loading there's no there was no sidewalk around that that unloaded loading it would
connect that would likely connect yeah sense I I assume you intend to actually build the building and then try to rent it yeah so typically the way that works is we build a building and we do a we we don't pour the the ground floor slab we
stub some Plumbing in we do stone and we wait till we get our tenants once the tenants come in we pour the slab we divide the building and we put our stubs up to their custom layout they may have a layout that they like or they want the bathrooms in a different location typically work with them to get that
accomplished so uh so you don't complete the building until you have a tenant is that what typically typically no typically the way it's done is leasing begins before the buildings constructed you're G to go right okay they're gonna go right to the end and
build retail Is Not Great demand and typically we I mean you know typically do a what's we call it a stone but if they're going to build the building put in the plumbing stud in the plumbing if they've got to move stuff they just got to putut the slab and move the move the stuff it's not really a big a big task
would you actually have to move it I mean you have a basement I mean so you that's true we do have a basement so we can be more flexible yeah typically we do uh yeah it's usually slab on gra but we do have a basement so we can be much more flexible with the location when a a restaurant that's one of the things I do for a living is detect and you know with
a basement underneath it a lot of times they move the bathrooms further up so that they can have kitchen space behind it customers I used B right well likely if there is a restaurant we'll likely have some uh Service uh uh restrooms and then maybe some customer
restrooms I one question for you uh it makes sense from from a plan perspective that you have the lobby to the Upp space on the side of the building here but the only thing that I when I looked at the plan originally I figured it would be somewhere in the front where all the Ada spaces are and everything so it' be kind
of a long walk for the people more handicapped to go all the way around if they're going trying to upstairs to the second floor the way we looked at it is the location of all the parking a big majority of our parking is toward this back right side in the loading space yeah so we wanted to make sure that that
access was convenient to some of those spaces so if we did put it in the front nobody would want to park way in the back right it's think thanks any further questions on the plans I'm going to move to the elevations and then signage
does the board have any questions so far yes the spaces were going to be configured later on or as as per lease ex so so so these Square footages will change just depending upon who comes in there and such and could be potentially be reconfigured I'm just not sure how it
would get into space number three right now right with the bathrooms right behind it which it would either cut into four or to two I just curious if that's how PL work and just you configure it as need it there would likely be a hallway that get you to that space it's just until until we get those we we what we
wanted to show was the extreme the most the most tenants we could get so that's the the way the faces are shown divided on the and just to note there's a minimum square footage for a tenant of 750 square feet so they comply with
that it's pretty average small 1500 square feet and are you are you thinking the second floor is mostly office space not office tenant space it could be any number of of of uses that that are allowed in the zone we wouldn't we would
make sure that there would only be uses that would be allowed and um you know we want to make sure we're opening ourselves up to to to make sure these spaces get leased and get used any you want to go further great I'm
going to show you the elevations I'll talk a little bit about the materials but you know you get really the best view from the from the U perspective view just this start with the front elevation this is the front elevation a
blow up of the front elevation we have some uh very high quality materials brick cast stone um nice fabric canopies we've shown a location location of some of the signage we've also shown the lighting locations of the signage you'll see we have some over the signage we
have some bar lights some Led bar lights that will focus the lighting onto the signage so that light doesn't spill out we also have canopies metal canopies over that Center entral entry space signage there and those will be lit from the under lighting from the
canopy um nice detailing uh nice corales uh we got a very favorable uh reaction from your historic board they really did like the building a lot move over to the end elevation left side elevation
same similar detailing on this same materials metal canopy and fabric canopies so just that's the view from lamington Road this yes this would be the view
from lamington road if it does the building sort of CAD kind of angles but yes this is the view from lington Road and this is the view from the parking side where this office entry yes and the the double do on the right yeah these
this is the office entry here or I say office it's the up upper level entry and fabric canopies metal canopy so which is right and which is left only they both say left side they both say left the one this one we're looking at
is the right side elevation so is that three or two sorry that's three that's three that's three okay good that's right I didn't know if the delay was at another elevation so three is right two is left correct
okay and then lastly the rear elevation we continue the same materials around the back obviously there's not as much fenestration at this level on this side but uh we do add we do have some windows and uh showing the erress doors and then
we do have Windows in the in the units up above that face all the way on the back to the to the left doesn't have a rear access door that's behind the elevator
the El but it but still don't have a door that that proposed premises only has one it's on corner it's on a corner yeah outside don't so there is there is an
opportunity likely if this Patty does get used There's an opportunity to get some doors here we may want some doors out to that patio versus the windows that we're showing current again some of this does get configured with storefront glass
accommodating the unit as it goes in left that's SL um you're showing a freestanding sign and you show where you want where you're proposing that I to get the
site is it okay that I did okay so sheet four on the on the Civil drawings okay we have a sign at the lamington road
entry that's this one here6 here and any other one here and then down two two free standing I'm I'm showing one on the lamington road entry side yeah if you look at the screen I I
I'm circling it right here and then I'm going to pan over to the2 entrance and we have that sign right here far enough back but visible so two
signs but one two signs at each correct one at each end um I have a question for you so um did you get historic commission approval do we have any paperwork on that J we get anything from the historic Commission
we did yeah we subm I don't know whether we got the paperwork I I I wouldn't know but I know they were very favorable in the meeting so yeah so what kind of let me ask you this question yeah there I'm sorry there
is an approval dated uh January 29th 2024 yeah oh okay any conditions on that approval poll have that uh the HPC approved the materials presented colored renderings detailed
site plan parking lots landscaping and signing HBC is supportive of sign variances that may be required to accommodate the height to make it visible from the intersection and dimensions to accommodate up to 10
tenant names and quantity one sign for Runk 206 and one for Ling R that's what they there you go that's what I was looking for from the sign committee okay thank you um I just want
the only question I would ask is what style architecture is this is there a period to this this style I say it's it's it's traditional but I I would still say there's transitional elements in this uh style so it's sort of like a
traditional building that's been updated just modernized with some metal canopy and some Modern details that's the that's the style I think it is but it's very traditional detail in the brick and
then all stone brick cast anyone else on Forge can you give us some examples of second floor tenants in other properties that you've done like this said that have gone in that would have to be a question for ownership because after the building is
finished and completed I don't really have a lot of uh understanding is ownership here tonight yeah you know what actually I did do um 100 Marketplace uh and we on the second floor of that we did have a fitness center that was that was uh very
popular oh that's gonna blow your traffic guy out I honestly I don't know what if that's being allowed in this zone so I'm just you asked the question and I that was a second floor T that we had in other space thank you is ownership here
today yes can we hear from them sure maybe what their view or ideas are about the whole property are we done before are we are we done with the architect why don't we we were not let's finish with the architect first and then um we'll go to
your question for okay um we work with the architect anybody else on the on the board do you have anything further I'm just G to show you what the sign look like and um if you have any questions we do accommodate for each of
the tenants in these signs um they are sized I believe to the speeds of the roads and the the the distance they are from these roads so um you're talking about the freestanding the freestanding signage yes anything on the free stand
free standing signage no noticing that is smaller keeping with the village yeah how they that was my question we were going to use um some landscape lighting to just light the
signage well it has to be down lit has to be down lit under the Orin that wouldn't be a problem because that top corn we could install some lights if okay anything on the other signers that's on the building anybody have any questions yeah um yeah you know you
technically you're only allowed one sign per site um so I think that additional signage on the building plus the two signs we're already giving a variance for is a little much and um I don't know
if anyone else has any concerns about that but uh I mean I I would say that you know retail needs a sign above the door you have to know what door to walk I understand what they need and then uh I'm just going to but this is what my understanding would be and then you know
to me signage is also something that it could cause accidents if it's incorrectly placed and it's incorrectly sized pass it people slam on their brakes or stop they miss the turn it it's I I I think these are
appropriately size signs for for the traffic that's out on the Ws right so as it is and maybe this is a question for fall or time are we approving signage on each canopy because that's
what's on this drawing and and like this corner building right here this corner has five signs we just we just have to be real careful about overdeveloping and
overdoing sign in the historic district we have many many other um owners and property owners and building owners that comply with the sign requirements well we would have five tenants and we would put five signs on
the building if there were five tenants there may be two tenants or and I I think I understand that but I think what the board of members asking about is you've got some of those endcap units that have signs on each of the canopies so it's not like like they have
one sign looks like they have five signs on the on the end you you've got three canopies in front and two on the side and they all have signage I'm showing five signs on the building I'm talking about the canopy
the those awnings those are signs approving this is too much sign I mean we I would say that we would only do signs if we had five Cs so the I don't think there's a request for a sign
there is a sign variance for the two freestanding signs on the lot but the the way I'm understanding the bulk chart is the signs on the building are going
to be 21.4 8 square ft and 10.48 square ft effectively on the two zones and the fine ordinance supposedly allows 75 sare ft or 5% of the facade area the building
so I don't think there's a restriction like you're thinking of loot I think it has to do with the to square footage I I I think what Lou is concerned about is again if you look at the facade of the building
and you look at the left unit and the right unit you've got signs on three of the canop I understand but I don't think there's a request for a variance so I don't think that those are the detailed sign what are we approving because you're you're you're approving signage
with the ordinance on the building that's my understanding maybe the applicant can explain yeah I I we would comply with the ordinance I and Tom I I don't mean to argue but I'm but I'm going but I'm but I'm going
to I have no idea I have no idea what the applicant is asking I'm GNA I'm G to bring up a contrary point because those two end units will have five signs each and it may comply with the ordinance as far as the area but there are two
freestanding signs for which a variant is required I think you know a more reasonable approach is for each of those end caps to get one sign facing each Direction but each of those tenants will have to come and and apply for those for
that sign that that's correct but they could come in with this and strictly comply with the ordinance but in the context of the variance that's being requested for the extra freestanding sign may be appropriate to limit the signs on the building I think one of the issues we
have here again we don't have we don't know who the tenants are right so the tenant is you know an eight letter word that's one thing tenant is you know three words together I don't know that we can limit in in a resolution the size so long as it totally complies that 75
square feet under the ordinance I don't know how I right and I think that's for example a bakery goes in you don't want to have the sign say Donuts pastries bread we're
agree three different signs for the same tenant if it's Joe's Baker there was a way to articulate that one side up to five signs but to find signs in a way that wouldn't limit us below what your ordinance already allows
sizewise we it shouldn't be based on the canopy we're focusing on the number of canopies and I don't disagree with that if if it were a single awning yeah you know that that would that would be different yeah I think we're just showing on the on the elevation
potential sign locations right but I I I think Lou asked is what what are we approving and I think that's what this discussion is and I think I I believe a tenant with Frontage on more than one street gets to
have a sign on each Frontage which which seems reasonable because the second one in then has one sign and then the middle showing here three and then one and then another five on the end C and that's on the canopy so I'm just wondering El
because we don't know how the it's going to get broken up we're showing all of the locations we can put signage yeah but the end cap is going to be one location no matter what right and that right now showing so the simple way doesn't your ordinance allow someone to have more
than one no are you sure I mean it's saying this this according to this it's saying one 5% of the facade up to 75 square feet so this is this is another issue what is the issue like we're
not like if if the ordinance requires that then they can't they have to comply with the ordinance I mean that's what they they have to get a sign permit before they put up a sign so just like anybody else just like any building if if you
need to sign and you don't have approval yet you have to go to the get a signed permit I sign I want to make sure that that that's an understanding I think I mean yeah they will have to get a signed permit but the question is what
is is is is the board okay with multiple signs for each use for any of the uses okay if I could just step in for a second if if let's say there's a corner unit and let's say we limit them to only
one sign per per face like one on each side so now they have two signs but they also have one on lamington road and they also have another sign on 206 so now that one tenant has four signs and that is really not consistent with our sign
so I disagree with that I think I think it absolutely is consistent with the sign ordinates and the and the pylons are directional right those are signs not they're signs but but they're but they're they're they're about traffic control they're about making sure people
know where to turn and what's in that location in that driveway right and we not not if it says AT&T the one Monument they have that's not does tell you where you know that's that's their sign but but but we allow right so so pretend this this only has one driveing
they're allowed one Monument sign and the facade signs right so they're coming to us to put a second Monument on a second Frontage and a second drive one I'm okay with that right yeah that doesn't change their their right to
facade size I think it does I don't think that's good system with our origin yeah a secondary oh I I think it does I think yeah I I've never heard this that um
having a sign in front precludes you from having a sign on building around on either side of the street that you're facing the issue is that they can do that because if you look at the hills they have signs on every tenant and they also have a mment sign that says you
know the hills Okay so my concern is that what are we approving because I I think each tenant should get one sign on the facade and the corner
properties can get two two signs not the sign you're looking at eight or nine signs no no these are we don't know ten know the name no you don't sir but I want to make sure that what are we approving you're you're approving are you are you thinking that the that
you're equating the ument signs with the facade signs no because that's what you said earlier no because you were count you were coun sign on on the mon how many signs how many signs does one tenant need if they get four signs that's
great eight signs that's what I'm saying that's what I I was trying to say so you agree you be each one will have one on the front and the ones on the end will have to simp yeah the interior units will get one sign on the
front the end caps you get one sign on the front and one sign on the end and the building signage will comply with the coordinates about 7 max 75 sare feet and they get monuments and what about the second floor yeah what about the second floor
they're G to have a directory inside the lobby right that's you know what that there would likely be a directory outside the door so that you know as you walk up to the building what door to go into you know I I I would imagine there'd be some
slard on the wall that directs you into that Lobby saying that they're second floor tenants I just what ease of pedestrian flow yeah them to be able to find where to govern the um the town the people in town are sensitive to signage they
really are and they have you know too many signs is will be a blowback forist it's something we have to resolve because any multi-tenant building this is going to come up yeah Absolut I think my only concern is if it's being built
and being tenanted in stages that the first tenant to move in doesn't maximize the allowable signage right so if you get a tenant for half the first floor or really all of
the first floor and they want a sign that is 75 square feet that doesn't leave any more signage available on the building for any other tent right however correct the the number one interest in the landlord is we have the rental that's that's that's
a limit issue yeah yeah and they have to comply with the ordinance which restricts it to the 75 Square F feet total they didn't ask for variance from this I think I mean the other idea I'm having and I I don't just throw it out
there is you know they might need some flexibility to make changes when they know who their tenants are and sometimes what we do is we say that the board has continuing jurisdiction to receive letter requests from the applicant to address the
particular tency and their signage it works kind of well but it doesn't they have to come back to the board they have to ask for you to review it I mean are you suggesting that in Le of a just a regular sign permit process
that for every sign I'm beginning to think it because I never really thought about it you can only that's I mean I like the con the condition that was offered before which is one sign per tenant except the corer units can have one on each facade I'm not sure our ordinance
prohibits you from having two facade signs that's as long as you stay under your number concerned with any we're not asking for variance no no obviously if we need a variance we would
and and tenants would need to get the appropriate permits to prove that they're in compliance with the ordinance and we've agreed to limit each space to one with a maximum of I guess seven because of the two ends sides yeah I'm I'm okay with that I'm
just I was just trying to I'm trying to understand what the board is it's a not clear to me what well I understand the concern of of signs but I think the renderings the elevation I mean they're tasteful they fit into the area um they shouldn't be objectionable and we want people to be able to find out where
they're going well we did it the king Shopping Center in the hill it it came back with a sign plan for a whole new set of plans and they came up with what I would call uh some examples of the actual
signs they're going to use for some existing tenants and the type of sign they were going to use for uh future tenants and where they would be on the facade and it got approved it had color
requirements it had size requirements it had location on the building but they sort of knew their tencies I mean I guess what I think Lou is saying is this particular drawing by the architect doesn't strike him as the type of
signage that he wants to see on the whole building yeah on the on the architectural drawing but that is necessarily what they've asked for they they actually said they'll comply with the ordinance which is they didn't ask for any VAR the historic commission aren't they just part of the yeah I
don't know that they but they haven't really asked signs they're not seeking your the of the signs except except the two freestanding signs I don't think our ordinance prevent you from having a freestanding sign at least one and that identifying
your tency or identifying your property and having a facade sign so I don't think that's a restriction so I'll defer to the board I I'm I'm comfortable with what they're proposing um and they be subject to sign permits but you some of you seem
to you know L particularly wants to maybe I don't know what if there's no then I don't see an issue yeah
yeah I agree I agree with that um I understand what Lou is saying he he just doesn't want to approve this as uh the signage so that if they follow the permit then they get one per per tenant
yeah I mean that's what's GNA what's end up happening but yeah we you don't want to have to say oh this was approved well that's not really well no it's not approved we agree it's not approved as this as it's
shown it's approved as per consistent with plus the condition the condition right okay okay I think we've settled settled that yeah yeah we have nothing
for anybody else on the board have any questions for the architect now we'll open it up to the public [Music] okay then we'll close it to the public and we'll have the next witness our next witness coming up is professional
planner for the application John T John please address the questions that you had for the owner regarding the uh poal tenants we should you want to do that let let the attorney you want to have
your plan yeah yeah Don please raise your right hand do you swear for him to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth to help you God I do and please state your name and spell your last names my name is John taen T is and Thomas a i k is a Kelly i n as a
Nicholas K I am the principal and owner of all things planning and development in South Bruns New Jersey that's smack in the middle of the state if anybody cares um I've been a planner since I finished my studies at r University in 1992 I've managed to keep my license for
the last 32 years just renewed it on May 7th I was asked that question actually Monday night if I actually R it um because they all come do the same time um and you will be my 160th board that II not that you're counting it I had an attorney about two months
ago madebe count I was on 151 then and I've just kept it going that was not me I've never been here but uh local towns I have been Harding moris town uh Bridgewater we ask that be accepted as a
professional planner yes the board will recognize and accept John teina as a professional planner please go ahead gentlemen thank you I'm gonna sit down okay yes I'm not sure you need the microphone no um and I do bring some energy to the to the thing I was told as well because I'm used to going at the
end so I have to kind of wake you up no um so I'm here to talk about uh the project from planning standpoint um our Witnesses did a a a wonderful job both in their exhibits and in their testimony in laying out the facts if you will so
I'm going to do uh the thing that I do at the end when the board's ready to listen quickly as they say um and not repeat myself so all the variances have been previously uh identified um the variances are a mix of
what we will call C1 and C2 variances that the board is enabled to Grant I would submit to you that all variances that relate to uh the existing site and the deficiencies thereof and the deficiencies that relate to uh the fact
that we're split zoned so the fact that lot area of 10 acres well we only have two lot areas of half an acre we only have point0 43 um minimum Lot withd 400 feet where we only have 51 uh lot
Frontage of 400 ft we only have 247 uh driveway setbacks of 15 ft we're 6 .6 exists um and the maximum building size of 5,000 square ft uh were 11,4 and 74 square feet as proposed in the VN
District all of those um variances I'd submit you all see1 variances the balance of the variances uh the loading zone size the number of signs um and the only variance we're seeking for signs is
to have two freestanding signs instead of one and I'd actually disagree a little bit with the architect I think they're tiny um they are well below the ordinance standard that you have um in both zones
so um that they are significantly undersized and uh will do a good job of identifying the property but they are in no way garish or will have any detriment in any surroundings um finally we have two uh locational things we have parking
uh located in the front yard um and then we have garbage and recycling in the sidey yard and again I'd submit to you they are C2 variances um the criteria for granting the variances I know you're very familiar with but um first of all we're going to relate them to a specific piece of
property secondly we're going to talk about what purposes the municipal Landes law are Advanced third we're going to talk about the hardships for the C1 variances we're going to talk about the C Tu variances with the benefits out wearing the detriments and as you know with all of your variances we're going
to talk about the negative criteria we're going to have no substantial detriment to the public good and we're not going to substantially impair The Zone plan or the master plan so um in this instance uh we certainly have a property that is uh almost goes right
down the list of the C1 criteria so it is exceptionally narrow in places as Mr Keller testified uh for our back stem of the property we literally don't have a building area so um we don't have any uh any area to put any uh structures at all
because of the 100 yard 100 foot uh setback that is required there um we have and we have a unique shape of the property so we have uh an L or a hammerhead as he said uh that shape forces us to uh and then it's also
irregularly shaped because of the dedications that have already been made uh along the state and the county highways um and what that did is that really presented a choice of do you um push the building forward and put the parking
behind um in compliance with that section of the ordinance but you'd be generating generally a front yard setback variance in that instance um and really which kind of which Choice do you make and uh interestingly in the 2011 12
approval that was the choice that was made they pushed the building forward and they had the parking behind um because it was a bank and they had to accommodate the drive-throughs so the drive-throughs there were really made in a different situation so in this instance with a general retail office building having that proximate building
uh approximate parking in the front is appropriate we have more than adequate setbacks your ordinance has a specific requirement for a 20 foot setback for parking we are well beyond that um we also have an an excellent Landscaping plan there uh so that any of the
potential negatives for headlights Etc are all mitigated um finally the architect talked about um the fact that we split the parking the way we did we have good parking distribution so we have approximate parking for all of our different uses and the tenants are going to be able to park employees in the back
I would fully expect we're g to have office tenants parking in the back or up upstairs tenants if you will and then downstairs tenants uh their employees parking in the back and their uh customers parking in the front um and so
as we say the strict application um would present a hardship in that it's finally uh we have the elment of the split zones and split Zone properties are are second on the list of most difficult develop uh right behind uh split Municipal properties they're
they're even worse when you when you split Two Towns I'm working on one right now in South brunwick that I have been working on since 1993 it's still not finished um because they get jerked around by Two Towns excuse me um they literally get pushed
back and forth between two we have a similar situation here uh with the two zones I think that your zoning board did a great job in 2000 of actually putting together a reasoned argument and process and formula uh that worked in 2000 and then
actually worked again in 2011 and 12 and then worked again uh in in 2025 2024 uh when we're able to to do that but that does present a hardship because it it raises doubts about what you can do how can you do signage is it 75 feet is it
5050 feet you know what exactly is it so all those things uh certainly represent a hardship um and finally in terms of uh in terms of the c2s uh again we we believe that the benefits outweigh the
detriments um in those instances and I'll ref I'll review them I do want to talk about the purpose of the zoning Advanced um I'd submit to you there are three uh first is g to provide sufficient space and appropriate locations for a variety of uh commercial
uses both public and private according to their respective environmental requirements in order to meet the needs of New Jersey citizens I to promot a desirable visual environment through creative development techniques and good Civic design Arrangement and finally M to encourage coordination of the various
public and private procedures and activities shaping Land Development with a view towards lessening the cost of such development and to the more efficient use to land and I'll actually start with them because that's actually my favorite one so the challenges here and and you actually did a really nice
job of we had the dot we have the county we have local municipality we have the planning board obligations and we also have the historic district obligation so it was great that that the applicant was able to go through and get the historic preservation uh approval first so that
then that approval could then inform your decision and that's exactly what this talks about when they talk about coordination of the various public and private procedures everybody has a job to do and all need to do it but putting it all together is up to the applicant
and I think the applicant has done a great job here of putting together a project that respects all the different jurisdictions certainly respects the historic preservation aspect of it um and by and large deals with a difficult Zone site a difficult shape site in a
very very good way um obviously I think it's an attractive building I think it's going to be very attractive site I think the materials are outstanding um and that's what really creates the the lasting presence I think the orientation on the site is appropriate um that it has the narrow
end towards lamington Road uh the VN District does have that limit for the size of the buildings and I think having that narrow end of the building there is certainly an appropriate accommodation as opposed to presenting a broad front uh to lamington which again could be somewhat out of scale uh you really
can't tell is it going to be 5,000 foot building or is a 15,000 foot building because you're only seeing the narrow end of it I think that that that Arrangement is a is certainly a good Civic design and then obviously I think it's an appropriate location uh for this use as do you all the uses are permitted
uh it's exactly what your Zone what your zoning as plan calls for uh it just happens to call for it in two different zones um and then obviously Eric talked all about meeting all the environmental requirements uh taking it from 2000 to
2011 and 12 and up to 2024 I think that's three different s water uh storm water regulation uh changes uh and certainly on a on a shell property uh that is extremely uh difficult uh in terms of the positive criteria the operative cases here um and again the
case law I say the case law because the case law is what provide your a road map of what does the board have the ability to approve how do they do it what are the things you need to find so those five things that I talked about at the beginning they were put in place by these uh case these cases that have come through by Boards uh before you so the
two operative cases are calman V Warren this was the case where literally the first time that C1 and C2 variances uh were discussed and balanced after the 1986 uh revisions um and it laid out all the things that I just talked about in
terms of how the um in terms of how the uh the ordinance is to be looked at uh when relief is necessary and the the F the F the other thing that it talked about was that um it also said that that the board should consider the extent to
which the property should be developed in terms of the hardships that it doesn't need to be a total taking so your ordinance uh sets forth uh F and coverages that we are a full uh onethird lower than so even with the complicated
formula the permitted f is 0.2 we're at 0.13 so we are literally you know 30 35% lower than the f is for the site because of all of these challenges that we have that are presented by the site um so
we're not meeting our full development potential um we're only meeting a third of it and your ordinance and your master plan Etc is envisioned that we would meet that full development potential that we would provide for uh those local Services provide for those local jobs uh
within this uh within the context of this Zone and then the second aspect of it is a case called long V Lang V North cordwell uh zoning board there um the thing that that came up is that um improvements need to be of a normal size
and shape even when the site isn't so um a a parking space is still going to be 9 by 18 it's still going to need 60 feet total for a double Bay Etc so for example in our back stem uh where we need relief uh for that for that setback
um we still need a 60ft parking Bay to put in the middle and what Eric was able to do is kind of Center Center it in between between kind of biased a little bit towards the Advanced Property because it is is largely developed and being redeveloped um and would have lesser uh lesser impacts there but the
fact that those um improvements could be normal sized that is exactly what the board should consider there shouldn't have to be abnormally size and shaped things uh just because the the property has a different shape and then finally polling V South planfield is the case that talks about the balancing of
positive and negatives uh in terms of the the benefits and the detriments uh and it asks you consider all of the benefits of the project um both the implementation the the attractiveness the jobs the services are going to be here and you balance that against um the
relief that is sought um and again it's it's the overall benefits of the project against that really di Minimus relief uh that we're talking about with the loading zone where we're uh you know a foot short and 5et short in length uh for trucks that we're you know we're not going to have track trailers on a site
uh the number of signs having one sign on each Frontage to provide identification the driveways is more than appropriate um the parking in the front yard we think is appropriate um because of the orientation of the building we think it's better to have um that setback that you feel from uh
206 uh that really governs in this instance that' be appropriate as long as we can we can dress up that uh that parking lot with appropriate Landscaping Etc and I think uh we did a great job with coming to a solution on the sidewalk question because uh pedestrians
are out there and being able to accommodate them is certainly a better alternative and I'm glad that we we came to a good creative solution there so all those benefits uh acre um so the requests are reasonable in the context of the lot and uh we think that the fact
that um we're finally dealing with this vacant property at this prominent quarter is uh certainly uh befitting of of the uh develop we're talking here in terms of your master plan um and the negative criteria the most important goal in your
master plan is to maintain the special character of The Villages and the rural country atmosphere we think the plan does that we think we've done a nice job of kind of blending and being that transitional use between uh the O Zone out on Route 206 and the VN Zone on
lamington road and we think we have a very tasteful looking building that's going to that's going to really guide you from the from the highway into the village uh in a very appropriate way um the plan uh we think is going to be that balance and we think adhering closer
adherence to the VN standards is appropriate um that that it is on a smaller scale and I think the fact that that we've uh have a smaller scale property and a smaller scale building is uh is certainly appropriate the master plan re examination Visions walkable smaller scale office as remaining vital
even after and again your re-examination was 2023 so even post even post um pandemic the smaller Boutique office is the office that is coming back because people are running to the situation that I have for example I started my business
in 2021 and in 2024 my wife finally said to me so you're going to get an office um and you know those are exactly the and this is exactly the type of building um that uh that I'm going to be looking for um close close to my home so
I'm sure you have many many people in your community uh that are being asked to hey go find a space and this will this will be certainly be an appropriate for for some of those um finally told yes in terms that the last thing in terms of negative criteria that uh
there's no substantial detriment um these are relatively minimal variances uh the site fits very well it's well buffered it's well uh it's well landscaped it has appropriate drainage we have a very attractive building it's well lit I think the board does a very
nice job of of making sure that uh the lighting does not over uh really become an overburden to your neighbors and uh I think Eric's done a nice job with that in terms of the lighting um so I think all these requested variances are reasonable um any the the waivers are
reasonable and uh certainly would be a hardship if they weren't granted uh so for these reasons um the two best words you ever here uh planner say is in closing for these reasons I believe uh the board has the ability to Grant the relief uh re requested and I'm available
for your questions how many parking spaces in total are will be on the site 65 plus the bonus of two so we get 67 and we already said we're going to take one away so that we have a turnaround at the
end that is compliant 65 is the number and and what is it what is that compliant with it is compliant with the parking standard for uh retail for General ret retail and general office commercial uses so if you have 10
tenants with employees and 10 businesses 60 parment spaces is enough yes according to the ordinance it is based on square footage it doesn't change based on the number of tenants
and you know I'm I'm looking at it it's basically 4 and a half or five per thousand and in my world that is way overp parked uh General ret demand is down to almost 3.2 or 3.1 per thousand office demand is lower than that so uh
I'd submit to you this building is going to be going to I mean I I think depending on your tenants that's going to have a isn't that going to have a big impact foring and that's the purpose of the change of tency application that we have because there may be certain tenants in the building that have
different ratios we'll have to look at those as they come in and just like the signage if the developer gives all the sign to one tenant nobody else gets it if he gives all the parking to one tenant nobody else gets parking so that's he has to
manage that but the zoning officer and I will look at every change of tency that comes in and compare it to the ordinance requirements for that use and the available parking on the site is medical Medical's okay in that zone Medical's permitted there are
different part there are different parking ratio depending on the size of the medical I mean I would like you I would like to see a mockup of of of prospective tenants how much each parking is should be designated for employees for each of those spaces and
just ballpark your ordinance does that and we comply with it that that's that's why it's a general number because the or the ordinance and operating the building is going to do the same thing so um I mean
if you if you have 10 businesses minimum what two or three employees per business you don't know is it going to be one or two is it going to be 10 you have no idea and then you have one one restaurant or one or two restaurants I mean what is it 12 square feet per per a
customer I mean two two businesses could blow out all the parking Mr so that's the purpose of each tenant going in for that review at the time to make sure there there's not an under parking but maybe I'm missing something but it seems
like it seems like you're not going to be able to maybe get the best tenants you can if if you don't have if you've already used your parking well you won't be able to have 10 restaurants in this space well I get
that but and and at The Other Extreme if it's all office you've got way too much part okay and that's where the balance comes in as to the the specific tenants and the the the one way in which that is
controlled on our ordinance to some extent is the minimum square footage per tenant which is 750 square fet and they exceed that you end up with problems if you have 300 foot tenants in a building like this it blows all the parking calculations away that's why there's a
minimum of 750 per 10 well is there a scenario where let's say they have 10 10 spaces for rent and eight of them get rented and the last two goes to a doc two doctors which has a different and if you did the
calculation for that square footage they're over the over the permitted amount and the tency would be denied unless they came back here for variance okay just want to make sure that the ownership understands that because it's important when you're seeking ten
well because we always have to do that you know when we when we you know build out of Jersey mics or something you we have to do culations all the time if there's a change of right part of it thank you
anybody else from the board no I'll open it up to the public thank much thank you do you have anything further uh Madam chair I certainly want to commend the planner for I think he did a great job in laying this all out I had one question which really for the
architect and it implicates one of the points the planner made the cast con portions of the building which are accents that really make it very attractive I think we've seen in other cases locally where over some period of
years some natural and other activities degrade the appearance of that whiteness so that it ends up streak with like dark stains and I'm just curious it's probably not the planner question it's more for the architect but the planner talked about this you know charact the
visual character of it being pleasing and I agree with that but I'm always really challenge when I go look at these buildings 10 years later the stains are horrendous and the repair if it's going to be repaired they did it to the county courthouse in hunon
County a couple of years ago and they basically took the building apart and put it back together so I just want to make sure we're dealing with materials that we can have a high level of confidence we'll maintain that visual Integrity over time again probably more for the architect than the
plan yeah that is a great question and and actually that is something I've noticed over the years that the lighter cast stones do get off colored as they stain but there are ways to stop that from happening it's maintenance uh making sure you keep it clean uh this uh
client does do regular maintenance it keeps their buildings very clean um it's it's part of their scheduled you know maintenance of the building so uh it's something you have to done and we've also chosen a darker color cast stone for this it's it's a more of a earthy color it's not one of the lighter whiter
cast stones I appreciate the answer thank you very much that's all that's all I have Madam so that concludes our presentation I know for ownership bring them up we can do that so yes you swear from it's tell the
truth the whole truth and nothing about the truth so help you God and please state your name address and spell your last name my name is James wer I represent the applicant spell the name yes Wei CT thank you Mr
wer Mr wer there was a question posed by the board regarding what your expectations or your plan for for the tencies and Lease out of the facility Well ju just before I before I answer that question I just wanted to thank the board for taking your your time and interest in our application tonight uh
we really want to move forward with creating a landmark location on this very prominent intersection um in the heart of Bedminster that uh we and and even more importantly the town can all
be proud of uh in terms of the types of tendency uh what we would be marketing towards you know it it's it also is predicated upon the response of the market but the market that we would be targeting for the first floor a mix
of food service and uh retail product uh Merchants um so it could be a bakery a cafe it could be a clothes Boutique clothing boutique or Furniture Store as an examples of those types of tenants on
the second floor we would uh likely attract uh both Professional Services such as uh lawyers um accountants uh planners and um and uh and you know other other
professionals um as well as personal service firms uh which would most likely be the the type of personal service where there'd be booking appointments such as a a beauty salon a spa um you know a nail place uh potentially a a
train a a personal trainer um piz okay we you right there okay and and in any event um that's that that would be our Target market and and and I hope we can fill them with the top
quality businesses in in the area we hope you acquire them yeah too okay so who has any questions for the owner no yeah I just have a question slash comment and and that is that um it
is a very prominent corner and it is a Gateway area to our village neighborhood which is a historic district and um that's why I I was so adamant about the signage and I'd like just for you as as ownership just to be as understanding as
possible to to those very sensitive issues um where where we want to maintain the village appeal um even though we're one block into on 206 I mean I get it there's a zone change and all that but it it's still all attached
I I understand that completely and just as much attention as we place into the architectural design of the building a few you know poor signage can detract from the entire appearance and we'd like to avoid that thank you we understand if
if I could just make a statement to to vouch for the applicant because I dealt with him in other communities and he's in the process of doing a a project in mendum burrow which is a significant and important fix up of a historic structure
in town um and the plans he has for that building are are are very good and he's doing the right thing so there's a track record here thank you good to know thank you very thank you okay any other any
question no really own okay open it up you anybody showline okay we'll close it to the public and we made the 10 o'clock [Laughter]
bill you haven't got my 30 minute subm my my my six-year-old son has a a kindergarten graduation tomorrow morning at 9: Frank is actually zooming in from Spain and I believe it's four o'clock in the morning for a lot of mind keeping
him saying just keep going Frank I will leave it up to you to uh we thank we thank everybody for their thoughtful questions and consideration of of this application we think it's going to be a great application we ask that based on the proofs that were presented tonight rece
ITV hopefully we'll approve it again this time T this time we'll we'll be build we'll be building constructing it highall we keep Jim Jim we keep approving until you got it right I didn't hear yeah and I hope we did
this time so yeah I think you did nice job the the board is ready you can entertain a motion to approve the preliminary and final site plan and the related SE variances and site plan exceptions with the normal conditions
with the U conditions that were discussed in in Pauls and Frank's reports the conditions discussed this evening uh those included uh that the at a crosswalk at the southern end of the parking lot and a sidewalk to the end of
the Southern driveway um you know I I'm I'm sorry I just thought of something and I S I'm sorry to interrupt and I I know when we were doing Advance at the end we talked about bikes and they said oh we need to accommodate the bikes so I
don't know if you guys have any plans to accommodate bicycles but you may want to think about that I mean I I think there are Plaza areas where they could put a bike rack and that would probably be
appropriate okay okay so uh we add a condition about bike racks um or a bike rack um the sidewalk will continue to the
um uh to the edge of property at Route 206 and then at crosswalk across the southern driveway to the property line of lot the adjacent lot 12 own by
Advance they'll add a bike rack or bike racks U uh to the site plan uh they'll add a sidewalk to the rear doors and Landing areas for those rear
doors um the plans be revised to reflect that and the coverage increase for that is allowed uh they'll add they'll have external downlet sign lighting only on
the signs uh there'll be no up Lighting in general and they'll have one they'll be authorized to have one facade sign per tenant except that the corner tenants can have one on each facade
uh the upstairs tenants can place a identification of tenant placard on on near the door to the tenant area upstairs tenant
space and uh they'll use the darker colored castone as and careful maintenance of the castone as described by Mr um but by the applicants
architect um and that those are the conditions that I had you got the bike R my Tom my only comment would be the the signage restrictions per tency aren't
designed to limit the ordinance requirements to to require compliance with to require like they're not designed to to reduce the ordinance right pered signage under the ordinance square footage right I
understand you know what I'm saying yeah they have to get sign permits for by faade signage and for each of the time and the entire signage is the maximum of 75 yeah we didn't do no variance for the total signning so not not withstanding any of the
drawings it'll be consistent with the sign right and there such a motion so mov second hi hi Mr Walter hi M Orana hi Mr Leonard hi Mr Rus I Mr gini I Mr wild hi
Mr de Martino hi chair hi thank you all very much we hope you have a good project thank you all for your support and endorsement thank you looking I just wanted to go everybody
Qui so next week we have B yeah July 4th obviously is a holiday we will not be July 11th we will be here and baby has a small application it
have to yell Mark are you guys interested in participating in our puckman um walk you got your property for sale there okay okay
um uh July 11th we have a small application with them and it has to do with their front fence post and then right afterwards will'll be the beginning of 1525 B so we have two on that night but the one is is small
residential we like to get them done so they can get moving and then 1525 will go from there okay I don't know if they'll wrap it up in that will be they asked for two to start and I oh my God
so you're not anything else anybody anybody maybe we can create a cheat sheet for all these you know we need like give them all all ego names yeah right
okay so we need a motion to make motion toour ajour second in favor good say good night