going to be in a minute, right? Mayor Jacobs, >> I am here. Committ Hickey >> here. >> Mr. Walter here. >> Orana is not here just yet. >> She is here. Wow. >> Present.
>> Mr. Leonard >> here. >> Mr. Roius >> present. >> Mr. Gini >> present. Mr. Pur >> here. >> Mr. Wild >> here. >> Chair Roman Gota >> here. Adequate notice of this meeting of the Bedminster Township Land Use Board was
filed with the Township Clerk, sent to the Burnerville News and the Courier News and to all subscribers and hosted at the Township Municipal Building, One Miller Lane, Bedminster, New Jersey on January 10th, 2025.
Please stand. I salute to the flag of America for it stands one nation under God
indivisible for liberty and just that you send them to each other I don't know that I'd like to send if there's any who would like to discuss us uh anything that's not on the agenda.
How about online Janine? >> Online it is just Mr. Kennedy and Mr. Colum. So >> okay. All right. I will close it to the public and we have minutes that we need to approve from uh September 4th.
>> We'll make a motion. >> I'll second. >> All in favor? Anyone have to uh >> not yet? >> Yeah, not yours. Okay. >> All right. And we have a resolution for
Tiger Claw. I don't know where my resolution is here. >> Uh in a blue folder, so you can sign up. >> Oh, I see. Okay, you're set. >> Oh, okay. >> You've had a chance to read the uh resolution.
There's any changes or comments? We need a motion. >> I'll make the motion. >> Second. >> Okay. Roll call. Janine. >> Uh, Mr. Walter. >> Hi, >> Miss Orard. >> Hi, >> Mr. Leonard. Hi.
>> Mr. Reidius. Hi, >> Mr. D. Jeni. Hi, >> Mr. First. Hi. Uh, >> Mr. Wild. Hi, Chair Gacha. I resolution is approved. Okay. A ter determination of
completeness. Paul. Uh Madam Chair, the Tesla application for some superchargers on the Somerset Hill Shopping Center property. Um they submitted initially there was quite a number of items missing. They were submitted. I wrote a letter date of September 25th, 2025.
My recommendation that subject to the waiverss the application should be deacted. >> Okay. Any questions? >> I was under impression this was originally BOA. This is down. >> It's site plan. >> Okay. You want to have a
they've requested to be on the November 13th meeting. With me, you want to do a roll call? >> Sure. Mayor Davis. Hi, Committee. Hi, >> Mr. Walter. Hi, Mr. Orana. Hi, >> Mr. Leonard. Hi,
>> Mr. Reidius. Hi, >> Mr. Gini. >> Hi, >> Mr. First. >> Hi, >> Mr. WS. >> Hi, >> Chair Magacha. >> Hi. Okay. All right. All right. I think we're ready for our
application tonight. Hey, >> good evening. My name is Lawrence Escatello. I'm an attorney with Oul Screo Law Firm. Tonight I'm here uh on behalf of SK Bedron Associates uh otherwise known as uh KRE. Um we are
here uh tonight with respect to 135 Route 20220 for an informal concept of review of the power uh proposed amended site plan and uh development application. As you may
recall, uh Carrie has been working with the town for many years uh to develop a mixeduse multifamily project on this site. Um the project was uh initially approved in
2021 as you may recall uh as a bigger project, but that project uh unfortunately is no longer economically feasible um as you'll hear from our witnesses. Most recently, uh, over the last year or
so, K's been working with the town to come up with a project and a red a redesign that will work both for KRE and the town and help the town with its uh, affordable housing obligations with respect to the fourth round process
that's going on uh, as we speak. Um, with that said, uh, KE is, um, K's project will assist the town with its fourth round affordable housing obligations. The project itself from what was
approved in 2021 was uh, 160 units. We are proposing to reduce that project to 140 units. Um however um the um the number of affordable units
will actually go up based on um the units and credits that can be um given to the project. So in the in the original um project there were 136 market rate units and 24 affordable
units for a total of 160 units. In the revised plan that our witnesses will present to you tonight, there will be 112 market rate units, but 28 affordable units. So, the number of affordable units is going up and the contribution
that this site can make to your affordable housing um obligations will uh increase. Um and also in connection with your affordable housing obligations, the project has been included in the town's housing element and fair share plan for
the fourth round. And um we are um excited to in the future be able to come before the board with a site plan and development application that will help uh make those um make the project and the affordable units become a reality
for the township. Um, so with that said, I'd like to call our first witness, um, who is Noah Chrismer of K, who is seated to my right. And, uh, I don't think since we're informal, I'm not sure if we need to swear them, but it's up to up to you,
Madam Chair. It's >> up to the >> Yeah, Madam Chair, it's it's not a hearing, so testimony and swore notes are not necessary. This is a this is a concept review and concept reviews mean it's not binding on
the applicant and it's also not binding on the board >> and he's got an out of space. >> All right, welcome back and let's get started. >> Madam Chair, thank you. Um, and thank you, Mayor and Committeeman Hickey. Um,
and Paul and Frank and and Tom, uh, and the rest of the board. Um, as Larry said, and and just, you know, we're coming to you. We had a project that we really liked. We had a project that we think in working with you guys, you all really liked, um, an anchor to the base
of Pluckan Village. Um, and given circumstance and time and construction costs and capital markets, um, it it didn't work out, frankly, just to be frank. Um, and we couldn't get financed and our land value ended up being just about the land value that you'd have if
you had the bank and nothing else. Um, and so that was very frustrating and disappointing for us. Um, but we went back to the board and um, not this board, but now we are back at this board, but we went back to the drawing board and thought about how we might
still be able to deliver a really good project that would help you all with the commitment that we made to you for the affordable housing units. Um, and that would still anchor Plman Village with a really attractive project um, and uh, and that would in fact have a little bit
less impact on the community in terms of water, sewer, traffic, etc. Um, so over the course of the last year plus, you know, we basically brought this plan right up to perfecting it. Um, we have our sewer approvals and water and everything else. Um, and just couldn't couldn't finance it. Um, so last year or
so, we've worked on creating a plan that we can deliver on. Uh, and that's what you'll see tonight. Um, we've spent some time with the mayor and with committeeman Hickeyi and with Frank um and Paul and others talking about how to finesse that plan, how how to bring it as close as possible back to what uh
what you all had seen before. And I think that you'll see in Mark's presentation tonight that it really is um it's going to remind you a lot of what you saw a couple years ago. Um, so we're hopeful that we can work with you guys again uh to to get this project approved um with your guidance to make
it a little bit better. Um, and then to have something that we can really deliver on. So main differences that you'll see, one, the bank is going to remain in place. It'll be subdivided and the mixed juice building will go next to the bank. Um, uh, and secondly, we have
eliminated the podium in the in the building. um the superructure for the podium with concrete and steel over the past couple years uh was really a big drag on our uh on our ability to finance the the project. It it's an enormous cost and when you don't have a project
of say 300 units which nobody here wants and which we don't want, it's very hard to spread that cost over, you know, 140 150 market rate units. Um so as Larry said, we're back in front of you tonight. The previous project was 160 units with 24 of them, I think. Yeah, 24
being affordable. That was plus or minus 17%. Uh, now we have 140 units, but 28 of them being affordable, so that's 20%. So, overall unit count down by 20, but the affordable unit count up by four. Uh, and I think with the guidance of of
your attorneys and planners, uh, there's also some bonus credits that are available on the units now because they're in round four that were not available uh, back in round three. Um, couple other things to note before I hand it over to Mark and he walks you through the sort of step by step of how we arrived at this plan. Um, which again
I think you're going to think is is is pretty familiar. Um, no changes to NJ DOT. Um, we've been in communication uh with your traffic engineers with Chuck Olivio um and Matt Seckler. Uh, that approval for the new traffic light and
everything is still in force. We just need to sign the agreement. This is less impact on traffic because it's a smaller project. So you don't have to go back and amend it or get a re-review. Same thing with water and sewer, less impact. We think if there's any amendment to the sewer or water approval, it's a minor
one. Um NJD, very little impact to the storm water. Um it's largely we've stayed outside of all of the constraint lines and everything that we established down there. Um so it's largely basically the same storm system. It's just the pipes have moved um because the building
is is slightly changed. So overall with respect to all the other entitlements that are already in place as I said very little change if any change at all. Um and so we we think that we can move on this project um in the coming year uh if the board sees fit to to approve the
project. Um finally I think it's 100% compliant with the zoning that we all worked very hard on. I think we worked on the zoning for about a year. Um with the one exception that the bank uh is uh is a standard piece. So, we'll talk about that a little bit later and I think Ron will will share his thoughts
on that. Um, but that's where we're at. So, we really appreciate your time. We know that this board spent a whole bunch of time on the zoning and the previous approval. We respect that and and appreciate that and we're hopeful that what we're bringing to you tonight is not too far off of that and still sort of delivers on the promise that we all
thought we had a couple years ago. Well, >> thank you, Joe. Yep. Uh, >> so I'm gonna hand it over to Mark. He's got the presentation. Good. Thank you. You share like the socks. >> Doesn't have a plan. Dad,
thank you. >> Oh, great. Thanks. Okay, hi everybody. I'm Mark Kushner. Uh it's nice to see some familiar faces. Uh like Noah said, uh we were very happy with where we ended up and we tried to
preserve as much of that plan as possible. Um and I'll walk you through just step by step if you can look on the screen. Um how we've adjusted the plan. Um but tried to keep the character of what we created together. Um just to uh Yeah, there we go. Just to remind you,
this is where we were uh with the previous plan. Really almost two inverted horrendouses combined uh surrounding a common uh amenity court in the middle and there's the bank building in the top left that's going to remain. So that's
the first thing that we started to respond to. And that leg of the building here in the top left of the site just give it a we remove there we go. We remove that leg so that the bank can stay in its
current position and the circulation around the bank can remain. And we remove the pavilion that we had on Burn Mills Road. Sorry there's a little lag but there we go. Um then we remove portions of the
footprint of the on the right hand side and the left hand side almost kind of forming a tree. Um and we replace that bulb. There we go. Into the center of the of the shape. So really we ended up with a
kind of donut building or an O. believe me also called it a Q because we still have this tail, but that's all within the footprint that we had presented previously. So, you can see that the bank lives here and now we've got this U shape
and here it is rendered with parking um and landscaping around it. What we've kept is that idea of activating the front of the building with retail. So, it'll be a really active lifestyle center. There's still 10,000 square ft of new retail that faces uh Bert Mills
Road here with a generous plaza uh for outdoor dining uh and and circulation. And then the amenity for the residential portion for the multif family is here in this really large courtyard in the middle. Um
from an elevation point of view, we also tried to retain the character that we had presented and gotten approved last time. So here's the plan that we had approved here. You can see with the bank on the right hand side, we lose that right hand
leg and you've got the bank building here. We lose the bulk on the left hand side. And what we've done is we've taken that exact same design that we had approved, let me go back for a second, which is uh two stories of residential over retail
and we move that shape and those exact forms that we all liked and we put it into the middle here to articulate that that shape. So here's that retail moment and we kept that sort of layering um and
differentiation of scale of the initial design all within this new proposal just this smaller and tighter more efficient footprint and that's where we ended up with the design that
>> yeah if there's any feedback or questions we're happy to answer any questions. I think that central element that you loop and change is stronger in the design than what we had before. And I think what we had before was kind of the collective sense that that was a good look. But looking at the drawing
just now, this looks a lot better than that. And the unfortunality of what you've taken off and added a lot of balance there. I guess the one of the things was kind of sold on I mean you sold us on the that element you were going to have out front that I think was
going away was going to somehow activate the streetscape a little bit. I'm not so concerned about that element but activation is I think the thing that we like that please try to do and I say that only go back to the >> back to the plan.
>> Yeah. I I have a question. >> I didn't I mean in a prior plan I had this sense although it wasn't u ruled to be a provision on moving forward that the parking on the retail
looked the whole thing to me looked like it was very tight. Has that been changed at all? In other words, the burnt the burnt Mills Road facing piece of the structure. >> How do you mean tight? I just want to make sure I answer your height. Like not
enough room. >> Um I I'll say that I think it's a more comfortable plan now. um from a from that perspective >> from from from a retail like from a from a a ratio of parking to retail and also
retail frontage there's um I think it's 42 dedicated retail spots that rent um for uh for retail plus the bank parking which is shared. So there's there's plenty of parking now for retail um and
there's 10,000 square ft of retail which is slightly less than there was before. So there's a a good accommodation and a slightly more straightforward plan. Before it was more ciruitous which I think was adding to maybe your >> saying that people driving and walking
you know it just didn't to me I'm not an engineer but to look a little funny if you >> it's a it's it's more straightforward now as a parking scheme. >> Thank you. >> Yeah. >> Are you guys dropping the an entrance?
Yeah, there's an existing is now >> there's an existing bank entry uh exit here. Yeah, >> that's going away. >> And that's going away. And we're But there's one right here that they that they'll be able to use. Let me move this. Yep.
>> Right there. On this drawer, what I was trying to get at Marcus, if you look at now in front of the retail, we basically have double limited parking. That feature in the middle is interesting and a little different. But in terms of a people place, it's really become kind of a
suburban shopping center parking lot kind of place and I'm trying to figure out how we can, you know, and I'm not suggesting that you might think other places just shut the building right up your but I'm just trying to
and we needed cars. So I think a little break I mean a little of that comes with activation that that's the way that we think about it. So we think about this public plaza as being you can see this is preliminary landscape plan but the idea is that this
is where tables will go. This is where you see it from the street. >> You'll see it from the street. Yeah. >> You got good cross. >> So how many spots are in front? I mean, if we do have a restaurant there and the tables there, how many spots will be cuz
I'm assuming the lost on the side will be for the residents. So, it'll be just in the front, right? Correct. So, these these spots are for are for residents and this is for retail and bank. And how many
spots are those? So there's 43 spaces for retail plus uh the bank parking which is 28 spaces that can be shared because the bank >> No, I'm just saying the bank that bank never >> that'll be so people use that. >> Yeah. And
>> per thousand for retail. >> It it depends on the type of use and the size. >> What is it? Haven't run any numbers. Do I didn't have any number? >> I have no idea how the 10,000 square feet is being divied up. >> Yeah. Right. >> Does that be enough for a restaurant?
>> Yeah, we're at we're parked at 1 to 225 which is which is code. >> Uhhuh. >> For the commercial. >> Yeah, it's 400,000 if we want to make sure that there's parking
lines here. Yeah. >> Anybody else on the board? >> Yeah, I have a couple questions. >> Yeah, go ahead. Um, you know, we talked a lot about Frank was talking about like a people a people gathering area, a little community gathering area. So, that's still being from what I can
understand that's still being preserved, but it's much more scaled down. Can can you can you show us on this plan right here kind of what that area is? >> Yeah. Can you blow up the front a little bit? Sure. Close. >> Yeah.
and and maybe even give us how much square feet it is, you know, like sometimes, you know, is it is it 350 feet or is it 950 ft? You know, >> I have a feeling Todd behind me is generating those numbers as we speak.
>> I'll keep talking in the meantime where it is. So, it's it's here, right? And I think it's it's interesting to hear you uh emphasize people place. I think we should look at these, you know, these are just sort of notational, these green landscaping beds, but maybe we should really think about how to get as
many people in there as possible and keep the landscaping to the periphery. I I I I agree with you. It'd be great to get as many people in there as possible for things like farmers markets or outdoor events. >> Where's the event? Well, no, farmers market.
>> Sorry. Maybe on Sundays we'll be allowed to do parking there. >> We can we can negotiate the programming but we got active. >> So next to where the pav villa was going to be And you have PA event plaza.
>> Uh the the pavilion was going to be here where my where my finger is, you know, up against uh Burn Mills. Really kind of pushed up against to the right the PA event plaza. >> Yes, exactly. >> No. Can you talk about that? >> Right. Right here where my >> where my hand is. This was really what
we envisioned this to be sort of a a different paving pattern so that we would it would be raised and we could take it over for public events closed traffic so that traffic would circulate around it. Um but on a normal basis this would be pickup drop off for people but I'm
>> talking about closer to Burns Road there where you have all green where there is where on the plans you have this >> oh previously. >> So that's previous too. Yes. >> So, you're going to get rid of that also? >> Yes. >> And And so, what was the purpose of the
pavilion? What what were your, you know, hopes for that space? >> It was a retail space >> and with a with a overhang where people could go under, right? >> That was the intention. >> So, now there's no place where somebody can get out of the rain.
>> That That's up on the building on the >> No, we're talking about in this area. >> No. Okay. Now, so you've gotten rid of all that potential area for the public, >> that area up on Burnt Mills, and we've sort of replaced it with this plaza area
here, which is 4,000 square ft. >> Okay. And is there any coverage there? Any any of that covered? >> We weren't intending it. Is is that something that do you feel is Who knows? Maybe.
>> Yeah. I mean, I think I think I think that was a desirable feature of the pavilion. >> I think it's absolutely a design feature we could look at. We could look at awnings or some other protection. I I think that's a nice idea. >> Even a pergola or something where
>> it looks like it's, you know, >> Yeah. No, I think to make it an attractive place, I I think that's a nice idea. And look, we could think about, you know, maybe maybe it's periphery, maybe it's it's somewhere in the plaza as its own thing. I I think that's a great thing to explore.
So then you've used the you you've used that for parking. >> We've used that area. Yeah. Where parking? >> Yeah. Conceptually the pavilion is sort of the bank building as a stand the standalone retail pad.
>> So uh do you have the exact number of parking spaces that are required or you have a surplus of parking spaces? Um, right now we're showing the required number of parking for retail. It just seems that I guess this has been brought
up already, but just the bank doesn't need that many parking spaces. Bank needs like five spaces nowadays. You know, >> that's what they're saying, Lou, is that people will just migrate over into those bank spaces because nobody's using them. So, even though they're not, the 43 20
some are. The reason I asked that question was if you had a surplus of parking spaces, maybe we could take some away from the bank and create more people area, but I guess it won't work there. >> Well, Lou, let me when we come back,
what I would have for you, which I don't have right now, I should, is the exact number of spaces required by the lease with the bank. Um, so again, I think those are going to be shared because they don't use them, but they require a certain number of lease. So let let me just come back to you with that number and we can talk about the the sharing of
it and >> you know. >> Great. Exactly. Thank you. >> Anybody else on the board have any questions >> on architecture and layout or you have other uh witnesses? >> We have another
sorry I got one more question. >> Is there any area that uh dedicated for bike parking anywhere in this plan? I I think our intention is to get to that level. We had it last time and we'll we'll do it again in this plan.
>> There are good opportunities for it. Yeah. Where it'd be most useful. >> It's just preliminary. This this plan is preliminary. We will design that in for Yeah. for people to ride their bike here and go to the retail and then also residents as well. >> Yeah, I think that's a very good idea. >> Yeah, absolutely.
>> Is the amount of retail changed from the from the other layout? Is there less of it as a result of the >> Yeah, there's less retail, >> you know. Went from what? >> Was it 14,000 ft before the new >> left?
I think we had 18,000 last time. Now we've got 10,000 new retail and the bank is about 3500 uh square ft of retail. So, you know, >> 4500 ft less of retail. >> Okay. I had a question for Noah, but if you're getting to it with the next witness, my
recollection was that there was still one. The last time I remember seeing your name, I thought there was one more permit you guys needed. Am I wrong? Like a county. Maybe I'm making it up. It's highly
possible. I have >> I I think that was for the WER property up on the corner where they're at for the extension. >> Okay. Well, then never mind. You got everything. You've got all the all the ancillary permits. >> And then in the center, you're still
going to have some of courtyard or was that going to be in the center? Is that >> uh in in here? Yeah. Yeah. That'll be uh resident amenity space. >> Okay. No pool or anything like just a >> We'll see what we We'll see. I mean, we we'd like to get a pool in there. >> Oh, yeah.
>> I'm not suggesting that. I'm just wondering >> like a pool in the U earlier approvals. >> Yeah, it wasn't. >> I don't care. I'm just wondering. >> Yeah, it'll be it'll be an attractive landscape space.
>> It was open. >> Noah's zen garden. >> That's Yeah. >> The garden. >> The garden. >> Are the apartments the same size basically >> as what we proposed last time? That's the intention. Yeah, because the last time there were no threebs. Everything
was either two or one as I recollect. No, >> six which are required. >> Mhm. Okay, >> Mark. Open it up to the public. >> Question. >> Okay. >> The the apartments in the middle. How
far back are they offset now from the retail? Just rough justice. I'm I'm looking at your last diagram. So I'm just trying to now envision is this all mass up front or they offset some. >> You mean this where my hand is here? The second floor. Second floor.
>> The step back. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think it's it's like a is it a 10 foot setback? >> Yeah. It's either I think it's 10 ft. Okay. >> So yeah, there again like that's there's that layering that we introduced last time. >> So the apartments will be on top of part of the retail. >> Yes. But they'll be step out and they'll
have balconies that overlook and a a parapit wall. They'll >> feel really nice and the retail will have a kind of big presence that way, >> right? Cuts up the facade a little bit. >> Yeah. >> Okay. Okay. Anybody else?
No. Let's open it to the public. Janine, anybody? >> No. Online and not here. >> Nobody is online. Okay. And we'll close it to the public >> and we'll next week. >> Don't go Mark because uh we you know we
may fall back and Todd's you know generating more numbers. >> Our next one is is Ronald Kennedy of Gladstone Design. >> Okay. >> All right. I'll just get into some quick
numbers that we're talking about. 160 to 140 as far as parking spaces just for that use. 289 down of 246 required, right? The bank retail goes from 19,661 to 12,952.
Parking difference is 81 to 54. So that gets a drop, let's say. You know, as far as those things, the plan that Mark showed generally, not generally, complies with your requirements for parking. And I'll go through a couple of other slides that show how shared
parking and remember we have the office parking. that we had some shared parking in the original site plan as well for overflow. >> So, we're trying to really, you know, make this as efficient without overp parking the site at all. And we'll go through some of those things. >> Um, obviously F is being reduced. The
impervious coverage is slightly in lot coverage in your case from 66% to 67 change. It goes up by 1%. That >> why why is that? >> Just circulation and candidly getting the number of parking spaces. Before the parking spaces were underneath, you know, now we're on the turbons. Building
footprint got smaller, but you don't have the benefit of putting X number of hundreds of 100 spaces under the V. That's gone. >> Okay. So, the the the building's there. So, we were able to make it efficient. And you'll see some of the layout here is a little more efficient than it was
last time. And one of the things that Mark was talking about is along the frontage, we had a lot of variety of setbacks of parking along the front. So where we could add more green space along the frontage to Bert Mills Road and the original plan didn't. The
parking was right up against Bert Mills Road and the sidewalk against Bill Road. >> And if you look at the exhibit that that Mark was showing or readjust it again, as you can see, there's a fair amount of distance that is here in this area that we almost have
15 foot of landscape, right? And then other areas are tight where the bank is and then it gets a little less here for that area and it gets bigger and the islands are much bigger along there. So there's the ability to really do landscape features along there whether it's you know bigger trees we don't want
to lock out lock out the retail but there's things you can do there you know in in in areas that we can create and maybe there's some elements along that streetscape itself that may be important to the plucking the village that maybe there's some bike I'll say parking out there so it's not right up against the
build. There's a debate about that whether that's good or bad. You know, invite that sidewalk into this plaza better. We have two linkages here for the sidewalk itself, but there is a fair amount of green space here that we're talking to the landscape architects of how do we how do we create space there
that's good that that can use not just as a buffer. It's green along the roadway. It varies which I think makes some interest along that roadway. And then the plaza itself up against the building between the parking lot and the building itself was much tighter last time. Here has a lot more room. It's
almost 12t now. Before we had detention basins and little plazas. There was grain changes cuz we were sloping the building and stepping the building. This is a lot simpler and we can create some interesting space. The landscape architect hasn't attacked all that stuff
to make it more interesting, but there's a pretty good fabric of space that we have from the front door all the way to this parking uh the edge of that parking area is almost 30 ft. That's a pretty big space, you know. So, there there's room to create
from where to where >> the front door is here to this edge of the driveway right here. It's almost 30 ft. >> You know, that that's a lot of room to create some interesting space. there's nothing developed yet >> and that's that area and whether there's something that's permanent pergolas or
even something temporary that you have poles out there that you can run a fabric for an event time and you take it and change something else that you can we'll we'll come back and come up with some ideas for that but we did make the circulation simpler added more green
space along the burnt mills corridor now what to do with that again not sure yet but we're going to work on on that detail still keeping the circulation with the fang The driveway out to Burnt Mills stays in the same location. That doesn't change the access point on the
existing driveway uh of the loop road that will be cut into the bank in this location. And then we'll have the similar locations to where we had driveway cuts along loop road in the previous application. Um grading works a little simpler. The only
one area is where the drive-thru is up against the building itself. But the other one we had some transitions that were a little complicated. This one's a little simpler layout from that standpoint. The circulation in the previous plan, there was a whole series of dead ends in the parking lots. In
this case, we don't have those. It's a simple loop that comes all the way through. So, you can drive through and not have to back up in some dead end areas that we have in both plans. So, it is, you know, it has some simplicity to it that I think lends itself to making driveway and accessibility a little
easier. Okay. Um, as said, we we have, you know, D and all the constraints down there. We'll have to go back and it's similar, but we'll have to go back and visit them at some point along this journey um as well there. So, we all as a team have worked together to try to
make this work, reduce the square footage, still making a very efficient parking layout. And I do want to show and exhibit the ties and attempt of the different types of parking spaces that we could have
here. >> Does the bank currently have three drive-thru store? >> It's it's Yes. Okay. There's three, I'll say, lanes. There, one in the middle, really wide. >> Yeah. >> And then they have a drive-thru up in the building, >> and at the end they got this big box
that has a second drive or second ATM, two ATMs. >> Yeah. It's it's awkward. >> They're going to key their nest. All three are >> We're not sure. Okay. Again, Noah can talk about the discussions they're having with the BFH to try to simplify that. >> Yeah. >> And not have it. I'm not sure how that we haven't finalized that or they
haven't finalized that. You can speak to that. But that is something that that >> they're not utilizing that the nonATM lanes. >> No one is. >> It's in their lease. >> What's that? >> Yeah. >> If it's in their lease, it >> is. Yeah. >> So, what we did here with this exhibit is try to represent some different ideas
for where parking could be. And along the the the front for the 54 parking spaces that are retail, we have the colors that are the pink and the brown colors that represent generally 54 spaces. Okay. The green represents the
246 spaces that are required. And then what we start talking about the areas on the other side of the stream corridor and there's a bridge a pedestrian bridge that connects to you start to see some other parking that we have in here that
could be some shared parking with the office as well. And again, spillover space, the times that you may have uh, you know, more people on the property in the building that there's areas that connect to the office side of it that we talked about in the last application of shared parking. So, this is an area that
we think that we probably build now and have as part of the shared parking model. >> And that that was that little leg of parking that was previously approved and that's staying on the plan. >> It is. I'm not changing that design. It's just how you know activate that
because of the parking. So we don't more we build on this side of the office side the less you know that needs there more we free up for retail on the other side. >> And then in the prior approval there was um authorization for bank parking and
>> my four phases. >> Yeah there four. And so that bank parking will stay in the application in case it's ever needed for >> the office building >> if and when and the trigger is either by the applicant or by the town if it felt that >> or Paul's
>> of course. >> Yes. >> Oh yeah. >> Um you know the newer things we'll have to have I don't know if the last application had all the EVs but you know the EVs the EV credits for the parking spaces. So the more EV spaces we put in by law the more we can reduce the number
of required parking spaces. So, we'll take advantage of those things as well, not to quote unquote overpark the site. So, take advantage of those aspects that are allowed within the uh the the codes. So, that's it. It's a simpler layout. Um, and I think, um, we're just trying
to enhance the areas that we can that we've been talking about. So um question I'm not sure if this is for you for Noah uh but also in the prior approval and I believe uh maybe Tom or false uh it's built into the
ordinance the the perimeter drive uh would upon approval or maybe it's condition that gets dedicated um with public rights to get to 206 Yeah, it remains private but
it has full public access. Yes. >> And so that that stays as part of this project. Okay. >> So the details of >> have full public access. >> You're trespassing like >> there's nothing in the there's no
easement that says that. I mean have we been all driving out for the last 40 years? >> Okay. If we're going to travel a little when we go to the car wash and find a 2-hour line, okay, I don't turn around in 20 2206. I turn into here and
I go out to Burnt Mills Road and take the traffic light back >> because I don't want to wait 2 hours to get my car. >> Okay, let's we all use that loop. >> Um, all right. So, some of the details on from a zoning standpoint now is there there's a couple of things by doing this
that make um the application uh require uh relief from this board that didn't require before. Uh the the most significant one that banks are permitted uses when we wrote the zoning when we all worked together to write the zoning. But
using the plan, the concept plan that came to be um the ordinance says but only in mixeduse buildings. Okay, that word was put in there because the bank was part of the mixeduse building. >> This being conditional uses allowed in
the zone and this being a condition, we will not meet that condition. Can't it's separated by x number of feet. So that irrespective of subdivision just by having the bank not part of the mixed use building okay it will require a
Dvarian because we don't make the conditional use >> right so we will be before this board as a I assume a board of adjustment as a Dvarian for this use because we will not be able to meet that standard >> additionally the the it will be
necessary to create a separate lot >> yeah I'm just going to for that. So while the perimeter lot will comply as far as the perimeter the internal lot line we will not meet certain standards for setbacks and those types of things that we would see would need for more
sea variances than anything else. Um I'd have to look at and see if the the lot around the building itself just the 3500t bank if that has an F standard will probably exceed that for its small lot size that why do they have to create a separate lot? um based on the
discussions with the tenant or of the property >> that's based upon the bank's requirements >> in and I would say ours as well right like there there's an entity that owns the bank there will be a single purpose entity that develops the apartment and mixed use building and the binance and
it's not going to be shared between those two >> but well I it's not what I do for a living but they're pads all the time with separate financing >> you could I mean you say condo those two, you know, put condominium association with this. >> We would like to stay away from condominium, >> but the intent here is to sort of divide
that. Now, realistically, from a zoning standpoint, because we need the relief for ready because of the fact that we're devarian already. To me, it's it's somewhat of semantics. Anyone driving by this afterwards, never going to see a lot line that runs through the building. There'll be cross easements that will look the same.
>> It'll look the same going by afterwards. So it's more of an instrument of of of title as an instrument of a business deal as opposed to a site that's going to change things. Our floor area for the combined will be the same. Our our notion that we need relief from a
devariant standpoint is there because it's on separate structures not necessarily separate lots on separate structures that causes this. So even if we had it as one lot we still need to change. So that is, you know, the zoning
criteria, the perimeter setbacks. We meet all those standards. It'll just be this internal lot line and the fact that we will need a devariance for not having the bank in a mixed bill. Banks are allowed. That's in the zone. That's not that's not changing. Well, the retail's allowed, the residential's allowed, all
its allowable uses, but the language, the way it was written in the ordinance with the notion would be one building with the bank in it, it's not allowed. >> So, we'd have to come before this board for that. It's not considered a pre-existing non-conforming.
>> You mean the home >> wasn't built. Doesn't exist on paper. All right. Fair enough. >> Uhhuh. Okay. Okay. >> Anything else from the board? >> Any other witnesses? >> No other witnesses.
So um you know we talked previously about the connectivity between this project and uh schoolhouse park sorry um are there any design elements uh
enhancing the connectivity between this project and the park and a followup is uh to some extent you are losing a fair amount of amenity space. Uh, as Tim noted, uh, there was a fairly
high degree of amenities in the courtyard on top of the pavilion. I'm sorry, top of the podium. Um, you now have a much smaller um, courtyard area.
any thought about improvements at the park which essentially becomes I mean it it's obviously a municipal park but it really becomes the backyard for this project.
>> Yep. Um so the the the plans that we have from landscape perspective are not developed very well right now. We'll make a similar connection. I think so far what we're showing right now is a sidewalk that's going up to Bt Mills and then we would need to connect that to the park. Um, last time I think when we
started here, we had thought of like a connection that went through the woods and then we ended up moving it up to Bt Mills because it was just more feasible up there. So, I think we'll do that same thing here. Um, and then let us think a little bit about the amenities. Mayor, your residents
are really into pickle ball for >> Halfife. It's getting more than that. >> Really and really it's pickle ball. >> Okay. >> This project >> screams out pickle ball
>> pickle ball >> pickle ball courts at the next door park. >> That's our I believe our wreck chair who's here. Do do you agree with me? >> It's on my agenda. >> It's on
my right. Just saying. >> Got it. >> Okay. >> Or the same volleyball court, which No, >> really. >> So, but you've got the rest of that park. >> You know what? Go talk to Bill Rosen,
our rec there, and and he'll he'll let you know where he's thinking about. >> There's a little room in baseball. >> Yeah. Oh, yeah. Okay. >> It's a t-ball field, isn't it? No, it's actually it's a um 5070 regulation. >> Oh, okay.
>> Yeah. If just if you hit it out, you're hitting it on us and their views just bowed. >> Yeah, exactly. >> Uh okay. Noted. Yep. >> Just casual comment. >> Absolutely. >> Give, you know, take it for what it's worth.
>> Yep. Absolutely. But that would be really >> no lighting. >> Well, you can talk to uh talk to a resident from uh down the road. Lighting. No lighting. >> It's those baseball fields. So far back >> you essentially because back there you already have the lights from the
highway. But >> I have a question. What about the connectivity to the Chase Bank next door? Are they going to use a common driveway now? What's the >> Yep. Same. And that's the same setup as as last time. So with the currently
their driveway is on our property. We have an easement with them. The easement allows for that driveway to be modified so long as in the end of the day they still get access through it. So we would have the same thing >> same thing as last time L. >> Anybody else? Anybody?
>> No. >> Want to open it up again to uh I guess uh we let Ron would like to speak. He can come up to the podium. There's no one online. >> Okay, then we can close it to the public.
Okay. Anything else? Um, you know, >> no, I I think it it looks good. I mean, unfortunately, the economics are what they are. >> Yeah. >> Um, you know, this was podium always was um, you know, I think no one and I had discussions about
podium from the very beginning. Man, that was expensive. back when the rate was like zero or they were in. >> Yeah. >> But I think this accomplishes um a lot of the design goals, a lot of community
goals that we had um initially developed around this zoning. >> I think this fulfills that. At the same time addresses a fourth round obligation. So um I think that's good. Pickle ball would make it look even better.
is a great question >> because I mean it puts so much pressure on the hills with the pickle ball and we transformed one uh tennis court to two pickle ball >> but it's um not up exactly to par where
it should be and >> I'll say that location I think is perfect because you're far enough away from the residents here you have buffering you have nothing on the other side. So that >> click click >> the noise. Well, that's exactly what I
was going to say because at where our pickle ball courts are located are right in the middle of four oaks community and we do get the complaints of uh the noise particularly >> and we have to we have to have the hours
limited because you know people don't want to hear click click click it you know seven and if you're if you're here it's >> they're just going to walk across road and they'll be right there, but they'll be far enough away any along here. >> I think it's an excellent idea. Yep. And
we really do need them because it's so popular. It's just >> they'll be Yeah. Question. >> They'll be largely used by your tenants. >> Oh, I'm sure. >> Frank, I have a question for you. It looks like we're picking up four lower moderate income units
>> on this project. Is that correct? >> Adding you mean? >> Yeah. So, can you just give us a little explanation as to where those four are going into our counter or or how that worked out? >> Before we were counting on them for 24 units. >> Yeah. >> Now they're going to give us the four
more is 28 units. >> Yeah. >> Before they were part of our round three plan, but and they got reszoned and approved and all that stuff, but not built. This now we're in round four. We didn't build these in round three. We're we have an argument we're making that
these can be around four units and it's not double counting >> all. >> Okay. >> All 28. >> All 28 >> which would more than satisfy the obligation that we had. >> I think we took it because with the fourth round we could take advantage of additional credits that we didn't apply
for in the third round. And I I've been through the math with both uh uh John Bardo, Tom Collins, and many times with Frank. We've done the math and um just by reducing
this project from 160 to 140 we increase >> and we satisfy not just the third round obligations but we satisfy the fourth round >> obligations. Nice. Very nice. >> So a lot of lot of lot of math between
the uh one two three four five of us. Um but we got there. that and you should feel good about the fact that you know when when you zone for an inclusionary development the court assumes that you're going to get a variance free application and we're hearing now about
a variance that I have no doubt that you will grant but what's interesting is that there's frequently a relationship where the builder is somebody the town doesn't want to deal with and the builder sort of barges his way you might have heard about this happening somewhere near but what what's happened
here with KR is every step step of the way. It's been much of a partnering effort as you can have between the developer and the town and I think you're going to have a great product here. I liked it before. I like this better now. >> I do too. >> I think it's going to fit better. It's going to feel better.
>> Yeah. So, >> it's a little more comfortable. I think it's a little more comfortable. Yeah. >> Yeah. >> I do. Uh, you know, just the commercial part. >> I really want to see that developed. uh we need it and uh
>> right and just uh before the concept review ends and and Noah and his team are still here. So we uh just as we've done before um we're scheduling a uh meeting of the Pluckman businesses and property owners to do
another walk through. Um Robin is reaching out to Paul and Frank and we'd love to have you guys participate. >> Absolutely. >> As well. So because as this develops student into a full application
um we want to see how we integrate what's going on including uh the park that's being developed that we're developing um with what you have here and to make sure that you know everything fits nicely and that we
really create a place where people want to go right now. plucking place for people to drive through. We want to see if we can do some placemaking here. >> Absolutely. >> Absolutely. >> Yeah. And the parking is so necessary too. Parking. Yeah.
>> That's all right. Unless you have anything else you want to discuss. >> That's it. I would just say from a timing perspective, as you can see, we have some work to do on a landscape plan, but we've advanced. Like I said, there's not a whole lot of changes to the storm water. There's not a whole lot of changes to the grading. So, we've
advanced this plan pretty far. We'll submit it in relatively short order. I don't know if we'll get heard this year, but like there there could be something in front of you if if the board had time to take it up uh in, you know, before the end of the calendar year. >> Good. Very good. >> Ron, is there anything else you're
working on? >> Okay, >> that's it. You're done. >> Okay. Very good. Thanks for coming. >> It's good to be back in front of you and we'll make this one happen. >> Thank you everybody. I really appreciate it. Um, looking forward to being back in
front of you soon. >> Okay, >> we are >> I guess we've scheduled the 206 project for December. What a joke. >> It really is a joke. >> It is a joke.
>> Again, December. So, that's where we're at. Right now, we definitely have a November 13th meeting. Um, Somerset Airport came in. I don't know if by the time it is reviewed and if it's deemed
complete and then notice they'll be able to get on November 6th. We're we're we're starting >> then it's going to be tough again. But >> yeah, it so more than likely they'll be in December. Uh and that's kind of where we're at. So I I don't at this moment have anything for November 6, but
definitely April 13th. >> Were the variances if any for uh Somerset service? I have not believed that just >> you anticipate um work >> plan work. >> Okay. Do I hear
>> a motion? >> Do I hear a motion to adjurnn? >> One more thing. Yeah. Go ahead. You got something? >> No. I said I move >> just see if the board had anything else they want to talk about before we adjourn. >> No. Okay. Then we need
>> It's been a long time. A lot of time to say. Yeah. Okay. So, you have a motion in. Steve does. >> Anybody want second? >> Second. >> Lou wants to second it. >> We're ajourned. So put any justice