order for the Public Utilities Commission meeting for Tuesday February 25th 2025 roll call please since the last commission meeting we've received Patrick wo's resignation from the commission so members and
attendance Higgins here maton here oday angland here everyone rise for the pledge allegiance I pledge allegiance to the flag of United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one
nation under God indivisible with liberty and jce all right we'll move on to the approval of the agenda I do have uh three additions that I'd like to add under new business for item C it would be to
discuss backfilling the lineman position item D would be to discuss bus business district incentive recommendation and item D would be to discuss frozen water
lines does anyone else have any additions or to the agenda I make a motion to approve second okay any discussion all right uh to approve the agenda all those in
favor say I I oh we need a roll call for that too should we do a roll call for the agenda I'm sorry yes um I no I'm sorry okay all in favor say I I I all opposed same sign motion passes all right we'll move on to the consent
calendar notice to the public all matters listed are considered routine by the commission and will all be enacted by one motion there will be no separate discussion of these items unless good cause is shown prior to the time of the commission votes on the motion to be adopted by roll
call I make a motion to approve the consent calendar second okay we have a motion in a second uh any other discussion hearing none roll call please Higgins yes maton yes angland
yes motion passes we'll move on to public forum this time is allocated for citizens to bring matters not on the agenda to the attention of the commission time limits may be imposed is there anyone here for public forum okay seeing done we will move on
to the commission committee reports starting off with Personnel committee uh nothing to report we didn't have a meeting okay all right moving on to finance operations committee we do have uh along with that then there some agenda requests so commissioner Higgins would
you like to present those um what's that mean what do you want me to present yeah so the first one we'll talk about is the climate Vision lease okay so we had a meeting um talking about the clima vision clima Vision
lease um we have recommended that uh coming out of the committee is that we move forward with negotiating a lease between the commission and climate vision for the installation attachment of a weather radar at the state hospital
um can I guess I we make that recommendation I have some stuff to talk about but I think I would do that after during the comments period is that correct okay sure okay uh do let's see so the action here
is um that we will move forward so do we need to we need a formal action on that or yeah okay so so Mike would make the motion I make a motion that we move forward with uh lease negotiations with climate vision for the installation of the weather radar at the state hospital
site and I'll second for discussion okay we have a discuss uh a second a motion in a second is there discussion we made this motion last month to move it into uh uh direct staff to start working on a lease contract so I'm not sure why we
have it on here again but but I mean we can move forward again it just seems like a duplicate okay I have two two things to discuss um do we have St do are we going to be required to have staff there when they're working on the building maintaining the equipment or do
they get to come have a key to get up on the Water Tower and they come and go as they please that's something that in my opinion needs to be rote into the lease and if we have to have staff there I think we should be compensated for having staff there while they're working
on the Water Tower or they're or or if if we have to like if they call us and say we got to get up there and do something I believe that we should get reimbursed for our staff's expenses to handle that that was one thing I wanted to discuss and my only other uh concern
with that lease is the RightWay um disclosures with the state I have a copy of the lease that we did with the state and reviewed it it's pretty vague um the the rways it looks like there's one for a force main one for a water man and one
for the water tower um it's very old um and most of the covenants from what I can read I'm no lawyer but um ran out at maybe 20 years ago so I just think that
um you know do we use the same lawyer that the city the city attorney uses so I guess I would just like to make sure that those things are addressed by our lawyer um to make sure that you you know I I have experience
with a Toler and RightWay issues and it can be it's it's written very similar to this it looks like the same guy wrote it um you know and there's just no there's no bumpers so I'm them were my only two concerns with with that I would want to
see negotiated in the lease okay gron Charlie or someone what are your thoughts on staff being on site while they do this work any any idea about when they would be on site to do some work and to have access what are your thoughts on that um so at this point we're working
through the lease negociation with them so we can add these pieces into the lease so what staff's really looking for direction is these are great things We'll add into that lease I do not believe that there'll be much for staff time on this as the construction and um the projects being developed we've already indicated them that we would
have a third party um engineering service oversee that um so as they're welding on our Tower they paint there's all these different things that had to be done so we would have a third party um look at that and make sure that that is all being done correctly so they were they did have the appetite to um look at
what that cost would be and add that into the lease agreement so um as far as day-to-day operations I don't think uh public utility staff will have to be there much but that's definitely things that we can talk to and see what how often they are doing maintenance or how often they need to access the tower um one of the first things we did tell them
that we will not allow BPU staff to be on that Tower while the radar is operating ating they did prove to me with some different documentation that it is safe to have that OPP that Tower running while staff is up there but that' be an sop that we would write that we would not allow staff on the tower while it's operating so we'd have to
have means of Disconnect um some type of an S so with them as we're taking it on and off if we have to do service on the Tower or do inspections and and there again I just feel like there should be a you know if if they call and after it's up and we're
out of the third party stuff if they call and we got to send staff out there for 3 hours I just think there should be some compensation it's you know I understand we're you know not charging them for it but I just you know we got to not incur
costs like that so something simple I don't want to over complicate it but just something if if they call and we got to go out there it triggers either an hourly rate or a flat rate I don't care something that's direction we can definitely add into the lease and present back to you before it's approved yeah okay awesome Comm
uh so last month there was a bther plate lease that was provided to us for review and uh and there was some concerns that came out of that I think it might just be a little easier for everybody Once the lease is created for us to review it as you indicated um and then Express
concern rather than uh try to have you remember all of the concerns that we may or may not have at this moment is the City attorney aware that we need his assistance he will be we haven't sent it over to him yet we'll have something for him okay
good comments and uh so the direction here then the our action is to I mean do we we want this to come back at the next commission meeting then is that is that uh that seems like to make make some more sense we can come
back with it when it's been reviewed and we have a more formal draft for I would like a few days to review it before we come to our next meeting climate Vision does need it till the 1st of July so we have have okay both the finance and
operations committee meets again uh Mike you could certainly take a look at it so whenever you have it ready I mean I think that's appropriate you and Mark can take a peek at it all right okay so no action needed there any other discussion Mr chair oh there was action yeah I'm sorry yeah yes you have a
motion I was just yeah sorry thank you um so what so the motion is to so what was that motion do last month we had a motion to table it to committee it's coming back from committee with a motion to move forward with the climate
Vision lease so it's the motion was to move forward negotiating Rel yes okay all right so any other discussion okay uh hearing none then uh all those in favor say I I I I all those opposed
same sign motion passes all right moving on to item number two discuss AE updates and approve sale of excess capacity uh I don't know if Chris or Danny or Mike if you want to take this or all three uh thank you Mr President uh at
the January 20 uh 2025 commission meeting uh commission approved an extension for the purchase power agreement with a and at that time uh set a limit of 4970 per megawatt hour uh after that
meeting and working with a that day we were able to secure a rate uh for the uh uh 2033 2034 uh which would make the average out to be 4935 so it came in quite a bit under the
upper limit that uh commission had set so that's an update uh on February 5th 2025 staff met with a to review updates uh to the energy portfolio including potential opportunities for selling excess capacity selling this additional
capacity for May 2025 to May 2026 could generate approximately $163,200 in revenue for the utility uh for reference commission previously sold excess capacity for May 2024 to May
2025 yielding $233,300 uh the commission now has the option again this year to sell additional capacity ahead of the upcoming auction at a secure rate of $829 19 per megawatt hour day or uh
could also vote to wait and this number would be adjusted based on market conditions at the time of auction a has also identified a buyer within the uh region willing to purchase at the um
8219 price ensuring the transaction and current rate if we execute it promptly and then I guess third point is that Additionally the increase uh of going from the uh current rate to the
4935 uh will create under the 17th Amendment of the contract uh will increase uh Power costs obviously so we need to make some considerations as to how to implement a rate increase
for the power cost whether uh through a power cost adjustment or a actual rate change to be effective June 1st uh 2025 when the uh new 4935 takes
effect staff recommend staff recommendation coming out of committee was to sell the excess capacity prior to the auction and that we go with a power cost adjustment mechanism uh for the new rate uh any
questions or comments I can answer I have what was that sorry I have none okay yeah I don't either anybody else have questions okay I make a motion that we move forward according to the staff
recommendations I second that okay motion and second any other discussion hearing none all those in favor say I hi all right those opposed same sign motion passes okay we'll move on to the approved Baxter wholesale
rate who would like to take this so at our meeting um we talked about this quite a little bit and we came up with a recommendation that um for Simplicity for billing and achieving committee's
desire is to Bild back dur use at $492 per th000 gallons and credit any usage through October 1st up to 89 million gallons at a160 so basically as long as they use the 96 M or 89 million gallons we'll
sell it to them at 332 per thousand which is a we figure a wholesale rate the credit payment would be paid out December 31st 2025 if Baxter did not use 89 million gallons the rate would remain at 492 and I would make a motion
that we um move forward with this recommendation okay there's a motion is there a second Mr chair yes sir you can second if you pass the gavl what does that
mean give it to your Vice chair who isn't here oh Dolly your Vice aren no okay well oh I hear I see what you're saying yeah yeah understood okay I'm not going I'm not going to
second okay so it dies not hearing a second uh the motion does not um pass and uh commissioner mat do you have any I have questions but U I do thank you Mr
chair so I didn't uh I don't agree with the uh the Mandate for 89 million gallons to be uh to be the requirement I didn't agree with that I don't agree with uh the dollar amount because this is as we had talked about at our last
meeting this is uh you know this this is a a city that we are that we work with um that I understand can be seen as a customer also but they're doing the same thing that we are doing and they're trying to provide water to their resident and I feel sometimes it's no
different than when there's when other cities have major storms and we're there to try to help and vice versa I think it's a little bit of there's some fairness here uh Mr Evans went through a great deal of work to come up with our uh our cost to produce the water um and
then tacked on you know something because obviously we can't I I know we've gone backwards on our water rates for for years um to come up with a fair dollar amount I know there probably is still some negotiating room on on the rate itself um and I would be for me I
feel like I am willing to say at this point you know if we can come together or come to terms on a different rate and not mandate mandate that they purchase 89 million gallons because quite frankly if they want to put a water restriction on backer residents for not sprinkling
their lawns then then let that be um their decision not ours to mandate that they would be purchasing that much money so I would be comfortable um if we could come to terms on and I see that City of Baxter is here if we could come to terms on a different rate
um that would be more fair um to both both cities and that would be my comments I I agree I I uh had uh questions about the 89 Millions just having that mandate as you say and then uh you know the point of having a
reduced rate was so that there wasn't that Financial impact that they had to incur throughout 20 so I agree I feel like we should just negotiate that rate that we feel was fair to both and so and Mr chair I don't know if it if we could do that at this
moment do do we need to throw out a a dollar amount can I comment response from um to get some response from the city but I would propose somewhere around that $3.7 rate if that would be something that would be acceptable I don't know I
don't know the financial I know back SS for 386 so I don't know if that is uh still having an impact or not but In fairness to the city of braer and the rate payers I'm just trying to come to a terms with a a fair dollar amount okay
thank you yes commissioner Higgins so I understand your guys's concerns and my concern is that we're we're dealing with the infrastructure and water wells and water mains and and Sewer lines that are
crumbling and and we don't have you know our wells are 50 years old somebody said or 40 years old you know what if what if we start having problems with our wells because we're selling extra water to to our sister city and I said at the the
last meeting that I agree we should work with Baxter and we should they you know they are a partner and a sister city but you know I don't see why we shouldn't make some money on this we we and we should be taking this money and putting it aside so that we have have that we
can not run into the problems they're running into with our wells you know us selling water to to them because they're in a bind and putting more stress on our wells and our our infrastructure if we're not going to make some money and there's not going to
be some minimums it it doesn't make a lot of sense to me you know we we we're going to end up being suppressed someday because we're selling water to them because they have issues and and we're destroying our infrastructure and our wells at the same time so that's kind of what we discussed at committee and
that's why I we we we threw out these numbers it makes it worth it for both of us and it gives us some money to potentially put into new wells someday down the road okay thank you uh Chris can you
remind me what your rate was was it 370 from the last meeting uh from last meeting the rate was the 332 332 which was a uh was the number considered in committee and uh just to remind Council
that the 332 does include percentages uh for Consumer Price Index Debt Service reserve and margin so th those components are already in the
332 so that so that P the percentage for those four type activities is above the production cost could you go through those again please the Consumer Price Index adjustment uh provision for Debt
Service a provis provision for fund reserve and a provision for operating margin okay I guess the other thing is if we're giving the money back at the end of the year anyway um I I just what I struggle with was is just tying up somebody else's
cash temporarily just to give it back to him and and that CU I don't know that that's that's what it's all about I think is just that Financial impact so that's my struggle with it but I I I don't know the last time that we did this with them I felt it worked out just fine um I understand what you're
saying commissioner Higgins and and Matten um I don't know maybe we if we could do that now or the timing of our decision I I'll just ask the question to the City of Baxter what does this mean in terms of when do you need to know by and you know
what would be best obviously sooner than later but I don't know if either one of you gentlemen want to speak to that you should come to the mic if you're going to speak please yep he's coming uh thank you president commission um Trevor Walter Public Works director
for the City of Baxter um if you wanted to table it and go another month is not going to hurt us at all we're looking at I think in the letter we said the earliest we would need to start purchasing is May so we still have
another 60 days to figure it out so so if you want to table it talk some more we're okay with that is there anything in this proposal that you would be hung up with the 332 at least is giving us something that we're not going totally
backwards you know it's 386 is what we're currently at selling to our customers so 332 I think is fair I get where you guys are coming from I think you got everything built into it I mean you know you got a profit line you've got Debt Service you've got all
your stuff built into besides what your rate to produce is so that is what it is every City's different on what the cost to produce is so does the minimum give you heartburn not really as much as what if
we go over the 89 million I would think that it could possibly be more than 89 million depending on what the sum brings so I would rather not have an upper limit the lower limit yeah we'll just buy 89 million we'll just make sure we
do so I don't think we'll have the wells our new wells online until probably September October anyway so I don't have a problem there was no discussion on a maximum either I being in my industry I understand that working on these big
walls you can run into a lot of issues yeah I don't I don't think there was a a worry about going over the minimum was just put in place to make sure we're you know it's worth it to everybody to do something if we're at the 332 and we buy 100 million
gallons that would be fine with the city of backst stream okay so know yeah I I don't think there'll be a problem buying the 89 million to be honest after I've thought about it I seen it on the agenda senen your proposal and had time to little
think about it I don't think it'll be an issue but yes so I then knowing that I would make the motion then to I mean I know we could table it but I think hearing that I would be comfortable selling for 332 um
per thousand with no minimums and no maximums okay is that a motion that would be my motion okay again Mr chair if you pass the G it goes to the non-m motion or and then you can second
it okay I'll pass it to Mr Higgins and I'll second that motion you run to meet him Mr Higgins we have a motion on the floor any discussion so all in favor I I opposed
I motion carries what's up oh we don't have a Corum we got a we got a quorum have a quorum we needed three out of five one resigned so we still have a quorum have three out of
four you have a quorum three is a quorum of five or four actually because you have a vacancy M Mr BRS would confirm this correct we we had a legal opinion on this whole thing a while back it's okay so we're good good all right
okay thank you item four schedule public hearing project priority list request main lift station improvements all right so commissioner Higgins or anyone else want to take that one Chris yeah the uh project priority list
PPL is a ranking system used by Minnesota public facilities Authority PFA in coordination with the Minnesota Pollution Control agency mpca and the Minnesota Department of Health mdh to prioritize water Wastewater infrastructure projects for funding uh the list helps determine
which water Wastewater related projects receive state and federal funding including low interest loans and grants the goal is to improve water quality protect public health and maintain compliance with environmental regulations project on the list are not is not providing funding or considered
for funding until uh the projects are ranked or prioritized the submission is good for a 5-year period uh projects are ranked for several factors including public health impact environmental benefits Regulatory Compliance and Readiness to proceed uh as part of the PPL process a
submission of a facilities plan and public hearing must be scheduled the PPL application is due March 7th 2025 a subsequent public hearing will provide an opportunity for public input on the proposed improvements ensuring transparency andu uh Community
engagement in the planning process uh the discussion will focus on Project prioriti prioritization uh funding considerations and overall impact on the Wastewater infrastructure
U and uh we can answer any questions you have about the project again this is uh just uh giving us the uh go- ahead to be added to the PPL list this is not a not for to come back for funding at this
time this is just again to get the project put on the list so again any questions so you may have I make a motion to move forward with staff recommendation and get on the list second eight we have a motion to
Second any discussion yes sir on the recommended action we also had recommended a public hearing be held next regularly scheduled commission meeting that was part of Staff recommendation just add that to the
motion okay thank you any other discussion okay hearing none all those in favor say I I I I those opposed same sign motion passes item five discuss twio outage notification
roll out and employment did I say that right enrollment yeah all right who wants this one I can take this one you want that okay so as part of our conversations so over the last I've been here now a year and two months so over the last year and two months
we've been talking about a notification system for our customers and as that relates we have been pursuing this twilio notification system it's a text message notification system where when a customers meter goes out they would receive a text message we're at the
point now where we're ready to roll this out uh staff recommendation is to automatically enroll the known mobile numbers that we have from our customers send them a text notification saying they've been enrolled and they can opt
out at that time with the lead and copper service line work that we've done over the last two years we feel right now our customer list with the mobile numbers is accurate as it possibly can at this point with having all those touch points with the customers so at
this time that is staff's recommendation to roll this out with that automatic enrollment and we wanted to get committee feedback and I'll over to Trent to have just a quick clarification on that this would only be rolled out to residential customers so commercial accounts would not receive this
notification it only be residential customers that would receive this notification at this time is there a reason for that our metering system right now uh 3phase system only is metering one phase so potentially a commercial account could lose one phase and we would not get an outage
notification on that so um that's more working towards our metering system and how much more we want to add into that into the future there's lots of cost typically when we see an outage on a three-phase customer we get other notifications that come to us through our ska system and that's how we react and uh dispatch trucks for those outage
Restorations residential ones typically are larger outages more customer impact so the intent would be that the customer would understand that we're aware of an outage to slow down some of our call volume that we receive during an outage helps us respond to calls better faster and the customer knows that we're aware
of it so it's it's tough when you call in and you get an answering machine and do you know that somebody knows I'm out of power this will allow them to know know that they're actually out of power we've received that and that's just a better communication piece or an attempt for us to make a better communication piece with our residential customers
okay thank you this this is just for discussion only so we don't have any motion that we're looking for but just to inform you unless you want us to change how we're moving forward I just have a few questions so is it a cost per text or is it just a Flatout
service cost per text okay and it was so we we absorb it initially and if they out that's fine um uh the acknowledgement then for renters and landlords then specifically are are both getting that text
message if the lter were to opt out the landlord still is getting it correct So currently right now anybody that has an account with B Public Utilities get the notification so in a a tenant situation just if they meter in their um lease agreement with their um apartment or
whatever housing um unique situation be in they would not get the notification if they're not getting a bill from bner Public Utilities so it would only go to who is actually paying the bill and there's can potentially be some challenges there um with the rate of rentals that we do have we're looking maybe for some suggestions we thought if
we'd roll this out initially there's potential for us to be able to have other people come in but my fear is that um those customers that are still experienced at out could still call in and send at this address they just wouldn't get the notification because they're not technically paying the bill so we won't have their account
information information at the ready like we would somebody that has a service application with us okay I guess the reason I'm asking is I I understand that initial role out but my my question is is it seems kind of reversed it seems like we might be throwing money at this if they don't if they're not even
acknowledging it don't want it but they don't take the time to unenroll so would it be better to at least make the announcement initially and then ask for to be enrolled and that way if we're paying per text it makes a little bit more sense not to just throw money way staff is looking for direction this is
minimal cost on these text it's very minimal um I think it's the attempt the staff's attempt here is to really just improve our communication with our public during outages um you know we're coming into some W nice weather now but when it's 35 below out and you have no heat in your house you want to know that somebody's coming and so this is our
intent to do that by Rolling it all out at first it gives them the option to say hey I don't really need to know you know or I want to know so staff can go either way with that I think direction is kind of what we're looking for and then one last question is this would coincide with operations of Whenever there is an
outage it's on our website and it's also on our answering service correct okay corre thank you any other I believe the numbers for the text it was under $500 for this initial roll out so that's the numbers we're talking about for text messaging thank you can this be used for
educational purposes too as we dig into our copper and Lead water line Replacements I mean a lot of times in my experience um sending a a a text message
out to people in a group that I deal with and keeping them informed on stuff besides outages just educational purposes um I think that's something that that is needed in the city of Brainard especially with BPU and
especially with some of the issues um coming up with with lead and copper pipe Replacements um PX in our waste treatment facilities you know there's a lot of things a lot of big scary words that that we could use this text message
um to educate people as well as as record outages so um you know I I deal with I deal with people across the fence at NP all the time saying we didn't even know there was a bar or restaurant at Northern Pacific Center and it's like I mean the amount of money I spend
marketing and and trying to educate people is unbelievable so I just think this could be a tool that we could use for educ strictly educational purposes for our community as well I think that's a good point if we want to have good participation in a town hall meeting it's yeah I mean I think that's a great
point just for clarification this original twio roll out will be just tied into our electric metering system we do have other programs that we're looking at um that this is kind of our first attempt to cut our teeth on it see how many people we do get response that want it and we definitely plan on growing
this our intent is to grow this for that messaging to come out it might not be the twillo application we use but it' be something very similar to that okay all right so no action needed just more uh uh informational but thank you for being proactive about this and
making it happen okay we'll move on to Old business unfinished business I should say all right so from a a BPU staff standpoint anything on this that is worthy of note that you'd like to have updates on yeah this was not
included in the packet there were just some updates to the verbiage on staff scheduling meetings but there were no changes as except for removing the one item that was requested to be removed last
month related to the customer communication policy and the credit card transaction fees would mooved to completed business that was the only change during um printing when I forwarded and emailed this to all Commissioners um there was a question
related to F on the electronic electric transmission services to brainer with Minnesota Power staff are scheduling a meeting on the next steps to ensure that that's happening those were the only changes we can answer any questions no action items needed on that memo today
chrisan mat yep I have have a few questions so on letter E I don't know if uh the community is aware of the uh I think it was Minnesota it was the University of Minnesota um I did identify and does have an electronic map people can look up their addresses on so
I don't know if it's on our website it may be but it is on our website we also have an additional update related to the funding and another link to that map going out today or tomorrow our website will be updated with addition we're just trying to get that out to the community and to people the more that know about
it the the better um and then the other question um I'm still a little confused I thought we were still talking about the credit card transaction fees I didn't know that we've come to terms on what we're doing there was a motion made at Commission in December's meeting to move forward with charging a transaction
fee and we're in the process of getting the administration of that done of the verbiage on it okay I think I'm just concerned about what's the verbiage say or what will it we had approved a 4.75% on all transaction on all transaction credit card transa okay all right thank you going back to letter e so I've had one
uh customer reach out and then they I believe reached out to you but how is that going with people asking about uh the lead service lines and all that it's been going well when we first had our roll out we had like two three weeks of a lot of questions it's really slowed
down we expect with updating the website this week we'll expect an increase in call volume related to it um but that's what we're expecting the all of the funding related to the lead service line Replacements or the Galvan the in this case galvanized service Replacements
will be coming through the utility so funding is required by the state to come through the utility we will be rolling out a plan and as that plan becomes available well more information to come okay think to commissioner higgins's comment earlier I mean it' be nice some
kind of a communication you know way to streamline that and online somehow I don't know but okay all right any other comments with unfinished business from anybody if not we'll move on to new business a authorized change in Bank
signers we have one one more item under unfinished business isor Bolton and M is here to present oh yeah the 20-year Wastewater study so Morgan and Mac from Bolton mink are here I will turn it over to Morgan all right thank you uh Morgan
Salo project manager with Bolton of in um so I really want to use this time today just go over a discussion of the 20-year asset inventory and capital outlook for the wastewater treatment facility um in your packets you have the report uh there's a lot of information in there so feel free to ask questions
um you know again I want to use this time as a discussion so that we can understand kind of what we're looking forward to in the wastewater treatment facility realm and then kind of talk about what the funding looks like for wastewater treatment facilities um and how to get on those lists so overall
again this report it's a guide and a framework to assist in that decision-making process uh you know with future limits with Capital Improvements at the wastewater treatment facility and so we want to use this to build a facility plan around it and the facility
plan is really that documentation it's the funding application for wastewater treatment in the state of Minnesota um and so in this report we kind of go through the planning period that planning period in waste water you got to look through the so in design conditions planning period um you got to
look at a 20-year Outlook and so our our design year is 2045 um for this report we had both communities Brainard and Baxter provide planning documents population growths um land use projections uh you know within both communities so that was very
helpful and understanding what the projected growth um looks like in the communities um and so it's a good idea though to like with all of these documents things change and they can change fairly rapidly um specifically if there's industrial users that come in or
large apartment complexes that can change the flows and loadings um and typically you really only want to look at that when you have uh Industries right especially Food Industries or metal platers or in some cases uh you know bottling Industries um that have
potentially significant uh significant high strength waste or high flows um in the report we go through the flows and loadings of the existing of what's happening today over you know over the past six or seven years or so um historically the the flows and loadings have been below the design
conditions of the facility um the tables in the report kind of paint that picture um as we kind of get through the report we talk about the existing facility um I'm not going to go into much detail on the existing components overall the facility has been fairly wellmaintained um Charlie and his staff have done a
phenomenal job of keeping things clean keeping them operable um and that comes at a significant cost though because these things are Wastewater equipments most of it's a 10 to 15E life um it's just it's a harsh environment and and specifically in headworks facilities and
biological treatment and biosolid Facilities um it's a very harsh environment so that that capital expenditure tends to increase at an earlier time than other IND or other infrastructure facilities um but overall liquid treatment and that's your treatment for screening so that's head
workor screening and grit removal your biological treatment which is a sequencing batch reactors that's where all the biological activity takes place um in the facility and your disinfection before it goes out to the River those processes are in pretty good condition those processes have capacity left in
them um they again they've been overall very wellmaintained however as we were doing a walk through and working with BPU staff on looking at the facility you know from this holistic perspective there are some deficiencies and some limitations with the biosolids so again wastewater treatment we have liquid
processing which is the liquids when you treat Wastewater you generate biosolids right that's a solid portion of the waste water that we then have to treat and so at the facility currently there's um storage tanks to hold the sludge once it's once
it's generated and then we thicken it so thickening is we're just removing some of the water getting into that 5 to 7% solid so it's still pretty soupy and then we have to digest it and so currently there's anerobic digesters digestors which we heat the the water
and the sludge in there and then the bugs do their work and they create methane gas and so that that gas is then used in boilers to again supplement heat for the the digestors and also flare it off um digestors typically have a very high uh onm cost to them and a high
Capital replacement cost and Rehabilitation cost and so part of where we wanted we were looking at this is that's the limiting factor right now with the Wastewater Plant is the biosolids processing um today like with all the other things going on today bile
is limit there's a figure in the report that shows the storage capacity versus um the holding time and BPU is floating right on that line so from 2014 to about 2020 there actually was not enough
storage capacity for the biosolids that were being produced and so that led to some significant shortfalls in the facility and I think staff did a phenomenal job at overcoming those um and and putting some Band-Aids uh on the facility to get through but there are
that is the limiting factor right now at the Wastewater Plant is the biosolids processing um and so essentially it is maxed out we're right at that line of storage capacity there's a lot of new things coming down uh you know from the state level and the federal level
there's a lot of terms we hear there's nitrogen implementation in Minnesota there's per floral alkal substances or pasas right that's a that's a very big one um right now both of those will impact biosolids in a significant manner
um because as you generate as you take more nutrients out of the waste water you generate more biosolids um and so in the report we kind of go through um again this is going to be a high Lev discussion we go through the inverse relationship between nitrogen and phosphorus removal so if you remove phosphorus your nitrogen goes
up the here's the thing in Minnesota there's a nitrogen reduction plan that mpca has released um and 2027 and Charlie can help me too with this cuz he and I have talked significantly about this 2027 there's
plans to start looking into more of those nitrogen uh limits within npds permits in Minnesota the goal is to reduce the nitrogen load going to the Gulf of Mexico by I believe 45% um by 2040 and so mpca has set this
timeline up um to have npds limits for total nitrogen reduction by 2027 typically there's a five-year compliance schedule um for permits um and so 2032 theoretically could be the first
year you start seeing limits come out for total nitrogen do you have something to add Charlie yeah so just so our our reissuance actually comes in our five-year permit in 2027 so we expire in 2027 which we then
go into so we're going to be right at that cusp of potential implementation early um and we want to be prepared for that so that's right around the corner all expiration we will start that renewal process 180 days prior to uh
expiration and that's when things could open the door to a temporary 15 uh nitrogen limit so and there's a phased approach mpca is using um they're they're monitoring now some facilities in the state are on a monitoring plan
for nitrogen um that if they're able to maintain a 15 that limit could get pushed out now this is dependent it has to go through Ru making process um that is a legal process um at the at the at the government level um that this still has to to go through and then they're
still negotiating power with utilities with mpca in the compliance schedule um for new limits so as a utility you have the right to work with mpca and and put a compliance schedule in of you know X number of years before you'd be required
to meet um a new limit and so um nitrogen is is is kind of the first em I don't not emerging contaminant first nutrient that we're going to be looking at that's uh spelled out in the report um if nitrogen improvements are needed that's a significant capital investment
um because you will need to meet both nitrogen and phosphorus um to the main nutrients in um degradation of water qualities in the in river systems and lakes um and so that that does require significant Capital Improvements um P
everybody's favorite word right p which is the the peroral alal substances so um mpca just in January released their biosolids management plan and so brainer in their liquid stream permit the npds
permit they have a pfos limit and so on the liquid treatment side for p again pasas is considered an emerging contaminant there's new stuff almost every month from EPA the health agencies the pollution control agencies on past contamination and various things that
that go along with that in human health and environmental um health and so um when we're looking at p in the liquid stream that's again that's a significant capital investment if limits were to go down and it all depends on the
classification of your receiving water right brainer is discharging to the Mississippi River it's a class 2B I believe water class one waters are the highest W uh uh classification of waters um that's usually where waters are used for drinking water purposes so surf
surface water uh plants you know St Cloud Upstream of that plant is is a Class one water you know uh Minneapolis and St Paul there's lakes that are class one Waters so they're the highest protection uh classification um it's unknown at this time about what that's going to look like with past moving forward there
there has to be more guidance from uh the EPA and and state agencies on what that's going to look like if they're going to reclassify waters for liquid treatment um we do talk about the liquid treatment here a little bit for past right now brainer is needing the npds permit limit uh for pfos
um the limit Charlie do you remember it's two it's 283 or 238 nanograms per liter so we're talking a small part has parts per trillion so that's a very very small fraction right seven parts per trillion
what was that is it like seven is it like seven parts per trillion are you are you questioning the current report that I just put in yes I believe last month was seven uh going out in
monitoring thanks yep and so with with past right we got to consider both liquid treatment and the biosolid treatment so again when we have pfest if pest is coming into the Wastewater Plant there's going to be a fraction that goes out in liquid treatment there's a fraction that's going to generate uh uh
combine with the solids and go into the biosolids so that's what mpca just released their guidance on um in January was the bio cells management with p and so what that essentially set up was a four tiered system that based on um
concentrations in the biosolids what was available for land application and there's certain criteria within that of notification of land owners um you know people that are renting the land and then just no land application whatsoever
um that's the highest tier Charlie I think we should stress the importance of the volunteers that we have right now that accept our biosolids I think that is a very uh uh it's it's all volunteer we own
nothing we have nothing that is we can go to so we have a one one phase approach and that is liquid biosolids we have no redundancy or Alternatives at this
time yeah and so there's there's just some risk right I mean this is that framework the guidance and so it does lay it out in there of kind of like okay you know if and when past it becomes an issue in the bile sols like what do we do landfilling may not always be an option because landfills don't have to
take it has to be certain criteria um a lot of the facilities that I work with it's difficult to get land landfill approval um you can't haul liquid biosolids to landfill they won't pass a paint test um then you got to be your metals and insecticides and herbicides so it's it's quite a process and it's a lot of money in test ing to be able to
go to a landfill um you know land application is the other very common use in Minnesota great beneficial reuse of a high highly nutrient product um with the bio salts a lot of nitrogen a lot of phosphorus a lot of carbon right especially for for hay fields and and
crop lands um but if past does become a concern and you can't dispose of the solids what do you do with them and so that's as you're going through this and you know you have questions feel free to reach out to me because it's it's definitely worth a lot of discussions to understand like what how does commission want to move this forward like what do
we want this to look like at the the Wastewater facility for the communities um because there's significant Capital Investments that have to occur in order to stay in front of all this and plan effectively um and
so with the the um thinking about biosolids you know as well the funding of all this right because that's what the biggest piece is funding how do we pay for this stuff well in the report we kind of talk through kind of some highle funding opportunities um the first step is to write a facility plan and get on
the funding list right and and I think the recommendation here is write a facility plan and we can phase in the improvements right like we may not need liquid treatment in the next four years but that facility plan is good for 5 years and then you can continue to update that and so the recommendation
looking at biosolids is with the current setup we're limited on storage we're limited on processing capacities if we were to look at facil facility planning for a bio cells treatment project look at dewatering so we'd remove more water create what's called cake um and then we
can go to a drying process so drying would remove even more water and potentially get you to 95% dry solids that does set you up for future pfast destruction if and when you ever did need to do that I'm a big proponent I'm planning for the future and looking at
different things but we also have to look at the economics of it and it doesn't always make sense to do you know everything in one shot that's why we look at the phased approach in a facility plan stage it's talked about in a high level in here but the facility plan does go into more detail looks at
onm costs looks at other revenues generated from various products um stuff like that so you know if you have any questions let me know the facility plan is that first step and so those are due always in March we just you know talked about having a public hearing for one for main lift station um so those are do
in March every year there's a second piece that goes along with that to be placed on the public facilities authority authority intended use plan and so with at the last commission meeting we were approved to write the PPL and iup application for drinking water improvements um so it's the same
process with drinking water and waste water the application for Wastewater is the facility plan you have to have that 20-year uh 20 years laid out with additional cost components in there um submitted to MPC for approval for the
clean water revolving fund c a question yes so where we're at currently with what you guys have prepared can you just uh speak to the timing of when we could get on a bonding Bill and what year would that be based on where we're at
right now so bonding that's a good question um bonding is dependent upon the legisl legislature um you know putting an Omnibus spending Bill together um I'm always optimistic with Omnibus spending bills um because it is typically bipartisan
um the legislative session ends what in May of this year so applications for facility plans um are due in March March I think it's right around March 7th um so you'd be looking at submitting a facility plan in March of 2026 for the
fiscal for the following fiscal year and that's pretty typical with a lot of the planning phases in Wastewater um there is also Capital bonding requests that go along with that um to get direct Appropriations like what you receive for the the reclaim tank that's another
option um for that so we'd be looking at a March 26 submitt for fiscal year 27 essentially and then we get the money in 28 right is how that would work for the project I mean it's
appropriated but then when when would the actual construction take place and then when would we begin to incur costs it depend on when you want that project designed PFA likes to fund shovel ready projects so you can design the project today and then you know submit a
facility plan get that approved and then get it certified because you have to be certified once you're on the list um but you could by 27 once it's because you'd submit in 26 and then you would design typically that year of 26 into 27 submit
for approve or for certification and then go bid the project a year you know and and 27 spring or 27 summer yes um I don't know what they call it but 3M put a bunch of money in a fund to
deal with P yep there's a trust fund set up gone or is that possible to apply for some of that money as well that money was set aside for the East Metro specifically um due to the groundwater contamination for drinking water
specifically okay so Morgan yes jefff um you talked about drying getting the cake and then the past destruction what's the uh uh is it incineration at that point so pfast
destruction um it's uh I could talk all day on this stuff by the way um pfast destruction is a newer technology so what you need is I'll use the term thermal oxidation so you need need very high temperatures in a very specific environment so there are Technologies
out there that are being tested and piloted um I have co-workers that have gone to California to look at stuff the one of the promising Technologies is called paralysis um that is a high temperature um thermal oxidation process in the absence of oxygen and so what
they're doing is they're actually Breaking the Bond of the carbon Florine in these past compounds and theut nutrients that CU again bios Sals have a lot of nitrogen phosphorus carbon other micronutrients that that plants need and
but we don't want the pasas in it so the science and technologies that are out there they're looking at breaking that carbon Florine Bond of the pasas compounds um and and maintaining the beneficial use of the biosolids there's a lot of science there's a lot of research still being conducted um like I
said there's a few plants out there that are piling some of piloting some of this technology so thank you how far out do you think before this is going to be proven that's hard to say um there's a lot of promising research out there I was at
wtech last fall in New Orleans and there was a lot of presentations on not just liquid pfast treatment but bios's past treatment um because there are states out on the East Coast uh I believe Maine and Connecticut um that have outright
banned land application of biosolids like no way sweater plant can apply biosolids to any agricultural lands um and so if you're a Wastewater Plant what do you do there's no other alternative besides Trucking it out of state or destroying
you know incineration and going to Ash um so I I think it's it things are always changing it's ever moving um like I said there's a lot of good research articles if you're interested I have links to several of them um just reach out to me I I'm a nerd for that kind of
stuff um but it is it is very um very fast-paced Mr President yes yes thank you Mike Copic course Public Works director do you have a chronological timeline okay in 27 we need to do this and so forth we need to
have our applications in March 7th and so forth and the dollar amount with that so that's my first question yeah so if we were to look at doing a facility plan March 6 7th it's always that what the first week in March something like that we would want to submit a facility plan to MP
right and so that means you'd be um starting that facility plan writing this summer this spring and summer writing that getting it approved in January February and then submitting in in March um I mean that's the fast-pace track right for the funding schedule I mean you can always push things back
depending on utility expenses and funding um and then you would look at designing like I said in you know spring summer 26 to design the project cuz you again you can phas some of these things in we can do a phase one approach of
biosolids and and you know processing um and then uh the the liquid stream treatment I mean you want to be planned we want to understand what is the potential but you don't need to build that infrastructure today when there's no limit for it because you won't get funding for it unless there's a limit
right right so if nitrogen becomes a limit then you have the opportunity to go get point source implementation grant funding and by getting on the funding list with the PPL you also open yourself up to affordability funding with principal forgiveness other sorts of funds and it also looks very positive for legislators when you go for Capital
bonding uh direct request right um that's the first question that they'll ask you is are you on the PPL list right and then will will it be helpful for us to get a shovel ready contract and plans will that help us with that list will it move us up on that list it wouldn't
score you any higher um but it would help with PFA when they look at um placement on the iup side so PFA likes to fund those shovel ready projects they want to make sure that they want to make sure they're ready they want to make sure is they funding for that because
that's what would that cost be just roughly a million dollars to get a project like this shovel ready uh it really depends on the treatment technology the site plan I mean but ballpark we're not talking $100,000 cor no right no more more than that you know
more than fund is there funding for that so engineering fees are all reimbursable by PFA okay on the PPL list um reimbursable okay yeah once once you're certified you have to have a certified project first so we need okay all right
thank you you still you're still going right or no you uh and no I'm I'm good any other questions the funding process is a very I mean it's it can be complicated um but there's a lot of pieces drinking water is a little more simple because you write an application you submit it
to mdh and PFA and they they rank and score you based on certain criteria mpca is the facility plan um and that's where right the big long report it's adding on to this it about doubles or triples the size of this just in the report the appendices make that a fairly significant uh report so it's a pretty
pretty extensive uh evaluation um in addition to what this is so using this what decisions does the BPU commission need to make before we would start that facility plan like what would we need to
decide would we need to take the your report and make some decisions on the direction we want to go mhm and then and then we would hire somebody to start a facility plan which would take from what I'm hearing six to 8 months I in that
time frame yep um facility planning I always like to say is anywhere from that 8 to 12 month process depending on what you wanted if you're writing a big facility for you know plan for a a Minneapolis Wastewater Plant that's a a significant facility plan um but 8 to 12
months is is pretty typical uh in the industry for a facility plan for a full scale wastewater treatment facility um and that also includes time to work with staff to understand what other improvements how do we want it this because once you get that report written I mean that's what mpca is going to approve and say for the next five years
we're planning on you doing these improvements or or you know getting ready for these improvements um and so that's where if we we start looking at the bi out first cuz it is the limiting factor right now um we're very we're set up very well to take this turn that into that facility plan start putting
preliminary things together for that and getting that submitted by March of next year this is a good report I spent an hour this morning actually reading it I got three4 of the way through it I had a headache and I stopped but I I I it is
from my experience um I appreciate the report and I think you guys did a good job those are big numbers though they're they're big numbers yep especially when you start looking at additional nutrient removal and emerging contaminants uh
removals you guys are following the state and what's happening down there on our daily weekly monthly basis to be able to give us a heads up pretty much daily um from the engineering side of things we have I have a lot of contacts in different offices um you know that I
talk to quite quite a bit understanding you know what's happening at the state level with a lot of the stuff um we have our funding group is tied directly into people in the the funding world that PFA and mdh and PCA understanding what's
going on um in the the the limits and the funding and how we were able to capitalize on as much Grant dollars as possible um and then we have you know lobbyists that we work with to um to advocate for communities for
funding I'm ready to make a motion uh okay I'm ready to make a motion to accept uh accept staff's recommendation for accepting the final draft uh proposal for the 20-year Wastewater use in needs assessment and direct staff to schedule a joint Wastewater management
board meeting as discussed second okay there's been a motion in a second open for discussion I would like to uh Echo I would like to see a timeline from you because I know we this we've had this discussion um back when Jennifer was
around I think at BPU and we talked about it's been a long time and we now I feel like we're we're in the 11th hour trying to do some of this stuff now right yeah we did an evaluation in 20 uh with the bio cells issues that we had but just to make sure that everybody
does understand that the wastewater treatment facility isn't um we share some of the cost with backers so getting uh this in black and white so everybody can see what is needed uh and have that discussion moving forward and how we're going to proceed is going to be crucial
in keeping that communication open so I appreciate it yep and I can pull a schedule together and then when we have the joint meeting we can discuss that schedule as well so one of the the concerns I have is that we're approving this today and
we we haven't met as the joint uh Wastewater management board and so we met last spring we talked about the importance of this we talked about the importance of communication giving both cities the heads up on the cost right and so we had
a a great meeting last spring we were talking about potentially having that meeting follow-up meeting September October and so uh you know with that not happening and then we're going to approve this now so I'll just ask the
question have have we presented this to the city of axter no uh this present ation I would suggest that we table this to the next Commission meeting but we have that meeting or try to assign the meeting with the joint uh Wastewater board and
then move forward with any questions at commission level if you're in agreement Charlie I think that makes a lot of sense I I just think it's out of out of respect and you looked at the projected population increases I mean there's there's a you know Baxter
certainly um is a big player in this and so I think it is proven of us and it's respectful to have that opportunity to meet with the joint Wastewater or the joint Wastewater management board uh so that we can discuss this and review it
it's a lot of information and so just to have city of bter basically just have to watch an agenda online and read about it is not proper I don't think it's the right way to do it and so and I really do want to have that meeting so
um yeah well I would be happy to resent my motion simply for the fact that I was not aware that they weren't provided this report I made the assumption that they were so um I would happily recall my motion Mr President yes also councilman
jesic I wonder if we bring this to the city council to bring them up to speed and also the possibility of uh you know plan design this is something I think uh the council needs to be aware of also I mean what what what is the dollar
amount we're talking here and I mean I see it in here but I mean what what it's between 40 million 75 million 60 to 100 million I was going to say it's way over a 100 before in 20 years 60 million on the low end
according to the report 100 million on the high end and that one3 Baxter 2/3 brainer so it's anywhere from 20 million Baxter to 300 or 33.3 million Brainard is 40 million to 66
million and Mr chair just for clarification that was the purpose of the that joint that joint uh I don't know what it was referred to as yes because we had two Council liaison from back to from brainer to be able to make sure that the councils were made aware
of what we were looking at um so essentially a committee within a council meeting so correct yep and Mr President just the drawings to get this drawing done to have us more favorable I know for lobbyists that is a big caveat to
have something shovel ready is a big caveat and that is what we would need to also discuss so thank you you bet and that's a great point so in terms of design and fees associated with that so that's something that we do we have that
budgeted for this year to jump into putting a facility plan together and then also you know I'm just asking that just from do we have that budgeted in on our capital budget that was approved we have 500,000 for25 and then 25 million over the next two years for biosolid
specifically City Baxter I'm just going to ask but just from budgeting or just identifying the impact of what this project would be uh we didn't have our meeting but so how would that look for you in 25 and just looking ahead I guess just
in terms of budget conversation and um Trevor Walter again with Public Works director forb we don't to have anything budgeted for for 2025 for the Wastewater Plant as it sits right now other than the normal fees the question is and that goes back to that management
board is how is brainer BPU going to pass that $500,000 on is it going to be part of the fee structure is that how it was is that how it's being presented that hasn't been I don't believe presented on our side as an
increase in the rates of the wastewater treatment plant so we definitely got some stuff that needs to be correct fully vetted out at the management board because then the council members from Baxter the council members from Brainard
and the BPU is all there and hopefully get on the same page so if we work out the timing of this so if we table this for next month last Tuesday of the month and then we have City Council meetings in between now and then so councilman lays
on Mr chz I'm I'm you know wanting you to weigh in on this too what when do we plan this next meeting joint joint Waste Water Management board meeting when do we get information in front of the city councils and how do we make a decision as a commission with confidence that it's been properly communicated to
everybody our leison our council members that are on the committee they would like a minimum of 10 to 14 day notice so we could have it as early as the middle of March in my opinion if we set the date today point of clarification Mr
President yeah so the recommendation from staff was to take the draft and then follow through with what what is our next steps so that the point of the recommendation was accept the draft and then move forward with scheduling something with the Wastewater management board and staff will work with backer staff to ensure that we get that
scheduled and everybody meets everybody's schedules okay good to know thank you for that I just in looking at that land item you know I just certainly want to make sure that we're communicating everything to everyone so um so I yeah go ahead mik um
I this needs a high sense of urgency um in my opinion um and we we need to get meetings scheduled and if the city council needs to weigh in I mean we got to move this is after reading this report and and talking to some people at
the state capital myself in the last week we need to we need to move on this in my opinion this facility's report needs to be it needs to go action not not meetings not talk I listening I've only been here a couple months but there's a lot of talk
on this and we need to take some action so just my two cents yeah and this can be drafted into that facility plan the first part of it is is done so we save some money yeah I think we do need to set a date for
sure um but I mean we need to reach out and see what the availability is so can we just reach out to those that would be attending that meeting and to try to schedule a meeting between now and the middle of March is that sound reasonable okay and so so I'm the the person right
so I would just work with Distributing an email out would you be available to be at that meeting as well y who is on who from the commission is on that the president of the commission and I think the more of the marrier it's a big deal I would like to be involved
yeah you um have to consider your Quorum so yeah yeah want more than two commission members on there like a committee almost so Mr President if you would include me too I would appreciate that thank you absolutely I'm sorry I think that if you
decide to do set a date why why don't we just adjourn to whatever date that you do set so if you are going to leave it open-ended until we come up with that maybe we can make that all right that way everybody has the ability to listen to and hear the discussions I think
that's a good idea and I agree there's a sense of urgency here and so okay well adjourning a meeting is one thing but when you adjourn and you have plenty of time for a public notice you need to give that regardless you don't
just adjourn and then have a meeting that the public isn't aware of so there has to be a notice given if you have an adjournment to tomorrow or or Thursday that's one thing but if it's two weeks out or you don't just adjourn to a future meeting so so the question
would be then Mr chesak could we adjourn to the um the joint Wastewater management board meeting once the date is set and still do a public notification as long as there's time for the notification sure I can I make that motion do I need
to make that motion see why you can't all right then that's the motion I'm making second okay any other discussions Danny it looks like maybe there is I'm we're adjourning to a meeting that we don't know the date so
we don't have that we'll work it out that's correct meeting yes and we'll set the date but we'll still do public notification because there will be time to do that because it's not going to happen tomorrow we'll have at least two weeks minimum notice once the DAT has been set
right right but I don't foresee them doing that we are looking at the middle of March just do it as fast as you can can I add a c real sorry for interrupting uh the same goes with baxer potentially with the public meeting too
not just the management board might be a good extension to have a disclosure throughout just kind of thrown it out up there we'll have it at our next city council meeting next Tuesday once we set it okay can I work with you charver to
know who the people are to uh extend that invitation to so do you want to just work on it on your end and then we can work with you as far as you guys the dates that work for us okay I'm guessing it's going to be the week of March okay thanks for doing that don't
make it on March 10th busy that day clarification Mr President yes so there was a motion on the floor by maton seconded by Higgins to approve staff's recommendation for the draft and then
scheduling a meeting maton you withdrew your motion um Higgins didn't say it specifically I'm assuming you agreed with that agreed and so now we're tbling it now we're adjourning to whatever the joint Wastewater meeting
date will be yep that is the motion that's been on the floor mat and Higgins that is currently the motion on the floor correct don't forget to include the public notice is given for that date as long as there's going to be a potential Quorum of the commission at
that so that was part of her motion correct okay good any nice work Danny any further discussion okay those in favor say I I all right those oppos same sign motion
passes thank you thank you okay now we're Mo moving on to new business I thought that was new business so sorry no you're good I don't consider you old business that was my bad okay uh authorized change in Bank
signers annual requirement for our finance positions with now the new finance committee and the change of the president we request approval to change the authorized signers removing Matten adding angland and adding
OD can I may ask a question yes um if this is a policy can we just again put it in position and make this a policy so we do this every February and not make this an agenda item every year the bank needs the bank requires it so we required to have can we can we specify
that it would be the current chair in the finance committee we can't do that no the bank needs it every the bank needs it manually to change the signers they need the motion and the SEC and the vote before they will change so it's a requirement by our bank and state St that with us too but we just have to
show who the current president is so that's why I I asked the question but that's okay I I was I was only asking it seemed weird to have to do this every every year as making an agenda item but okay so I'll make the motion question Mike
yes yes I believe the city Side all we do is we list it on the consent calendar so it doesn't have to be a separate agenda item but you still are officially approving it by listing as an consent item so a suggestion yeah thank you yes Mr I just oh
okay okay so we have a motion second we have a second any discussion hearing on all those in favor say I I those oppos same sign motion passes moving on to consider custom
credit request I can take that one Mr President we had a customer uh had experienced a leak in their crawl space that leak led to additional use that the water in the
crawl space was pumped out of her crawl space and did not enter the collection or the treatment system and she's asking for credit of her treatment and collection fees for Wastewater of $113.75 this has happened a couple times in the past and I make a motion to go along
with staff recommendations second okay motion a second any further discussion hearing none all those in favor say I I I same those oppos same sign motion passes okay move on to backfield lineman
position who would like to take that one I can take it Chris go ahead Chris thank you thank you Mr President uh yeah uh recently we had a uh resignation uh from one of our linemen and uh so I can defer to uh HR Director
uh Schubert for details and uh I guess just a game plan for backfilling the position so so last week I discussed this with Chris Evans and um just to clarify Mr chesak had talked about the charter a little bit as far as how
recommendations should be happening the charter language actually states that Personnel for for vacant positions may be recommended by the commission to the council as an example last year we hired several employees and the commission did not provide a recommendation to the
council for those positions historically and as far back as I can remember when backfilling budgeted line worker positions staff has been given the latitude to hire either a journeyman or an apprentice um level based on the applicant pool and the best fit for the Department for an example last year we
hired two Journeymen and one Apprentice line worker with that said if the commission wants to provide direction that we can only hire like a journeyman or an apprentice level that is a different situation so at this point um the information in my report was given
to help clarify our process primarily for Mr Higgins since he is new to the commission um other than that is there any questions that I can help help with at this point anybody have questions yeah um yeah so um as far as U
Charter language I don't believe I mentioned that I just was referring back to what I recalled as far as the process U and I think it does retain to Charter language but uh you say typically we've just gone
forward without recommendation of Staff requests from the commission here to the city is that what I'm understanding yes when we have had vacancies we or when we hire new positions we don't need a a formal recommendation from the
commission as far as filling those positions if that's a budgeted position if we're backfilling someone that's already um budgeted that's it um however like when we had new positions in the budget for 2025 we did receive recommendations from the council or
excuse me the commission at that point because it was something different than what has normally been done in the past or a new position that was not in the budget thank you for the explanation appreciate it okay uh any other comments or questions about
this do we need to take any action that's just more discussion okay all right moving on to business district and Senate recommendations so my understanding is that uh city council would like more of a definitive recommendation from us regarding this
issue am I right in saying that at the last I don't not at the last council meeting council did send that to commission commission had it discussed at the finance committee meeting there was no recommendation coming out of the finance committee meeting there was some
discussion around it and then it's added back on the agenda here okay and so really the question is just waving all sack and whack fees for any permits within the river rail District right that's what we're talking about here again no no it's the
James is yeah so I can add to that um the central business district incentive policy was passed by city council um previous there was discussions from the commission on that city council did pass that so very similar to River ter rails um it weighs building permit fees um up
to $150,000 valuation and then all sack and whack fees Park dedication um so that's what's currently um within the policy uh so because there was changes to the commercial Corridor District that could have impacts on sack and whack charges that are are incurred by the
city um this was brought to the commission to discuss you know should there be anything else added or changed potentially to the policy I know one of the discussions um you know there could be concern from all charges being waved and that could be a recommendation another one thing that was brought up at
the meeting um at last month's meeting was that maybe uh sacking whack charges over a certain amount would go to the um Public Utilities Commission for recommendation to city council U so there's an opportunity to provide that uh documented recommendation and then it' be at the next city council meeting
they'd consider it yeah that's right okay so it was be it was expanding it from the river to rail District it was 210 all the way down south 6 and kind of everywhere right so we did make those uh comments or just recommendations but that wasn't
official enough so we need to offici uh provide those recommendation is it yeah through a motion um there should be um stated recommendations on what the commission would like to see if any changes um to the central business district inent of
policy did you guys already passed that did you guys already pass that city council yeah so that was passed um the Eda was the one that made kind of the formal recommendation city council before it went to the city council meeting um BPU commission um reviewed it had some concern
um noted at the council meeting I know um Council leaon chzo spoke about it at the council meeting about the concerns from the commission as well um city council ended up approving what the Eda had recommended was continuing essentially the same parameters of the river ter rails District except
expanded and now it's brought back because um the zoning District change um that we had now we allow mixed use development um on Washington Street that's why this was brought up again because there could be um Fe fees that weren't originally looked at from
the central business district inent policy because it was just commercial if you add residential to it now um certainly those fees could uh be much more substantial so that's why it's brought back here for review yes so something I've always just
it's it's concerning to me one I've never seen a map of these areas I don't really know what were what area and what it's encompassing so I have no idea what the financial implication is I've never been an advocate of just waving the sack and whack fees because I think we have a facility that we need to continue to
maintain and when we wave things like that I don't know how we maintain or and or upgrade um infrastructure when it is leading into to be able to service an area so it may not be directly infrastructure within you know that street or what but it may be leading up
to it and I'm just again not knowing the the area in which we're looking at I hate to just wave my hand at this and and approve and have no idea what we're approving so that those are just my concerns so we could just make a motion and we'll just I mean we could just say
what we think we need and that's essentially what they're asking for and then they'll make a decision yep that's correct okay so we could just say what we feel is necessary for us so if anybody wants to make a motion that outlines either a threshold or at least the opportunity to review a potential
project understand the financial impact of waving those fees maybe doing a study of the payback of the revenue generated by rates just throwing a few things out there like we talked about last meeting right yep correct okay anybody have a
motion I have to abstain from this okay so if we have two people we can't make a motion all right so there's an it might an abstention is not a per you still have three people
here so if you vote you motion um you can pass that to the person abstaining got it have a quum right now an abens does not mean you no longer have a quorum okay perfect thank you Mr chz okay well you so eloquently put it uh I
think that you should almost make the motion okay my motion my motion would be that uh the BPU commission would request the opportunity to review opportunities that that come
up and that would be to potentially provide some financial analysis of what waving sack and wack fees would would would mean and uh there's a threshold currently of
$150,000 where that doesn't I mean it's all sack and whack from my understanding that's what the policy is it's regardless right go ahead yep yep that's correct so for a building project it'd be um 150,000 so if you think of a single family home home you might have a
$250 to $300,000 valuation so it would trigger for pretty much every single family home um just so you're aware and if that's the commission's understanding you know sack and whack for an individual home would be $3,300 so those have been the ones that have primarily been coming through so
you know if if it's the commission's wish to review everything that you know that would be the recommendation or it could be at a certain threshold of sacking whack dollars okay here's my motion I move that uh we would have the opportunity to
discuss waving sack and whack fees on a project that exceeds 150,000 that's what my motion is second that motion okay there's a first and second we have a motion in a second discussion sorry
yep I think what we could also do then as part of moving forward is is um $60 to100 million report that could be made aware to city council members and and others that uh the Eda for example and
quite honestly just to have a face to face would be very beneficial so uh yes we can provide a motion but I think just having an opportunity to sit down and talk about it would really mean a lot as well so yes sir yes can I just clarify so the motion is anything under
$150,000 would be above uh over 150 we would like to have the opportunity nothing and there building valuation cost correct Y correct great thank you sorry I didn't mean to interrupt you but yeah I just want to make sure that
yeah any more discussion have a motion in a second all in favor I I post carries there you go thank you mik am I doing good Jeff good I I I just am I just like how easy it goes without
mark and um Patrick here no you didn't all right we're moving on to Frozen water lines uh to to discuss the brainer Public Utilities policy 20241 does anybody want to take this one as far as discussing what's going on
what we need to talk about essentially it's a discussion item to reiterate our policy that we approved in January 30th of uh 2024 in discussions as it occurs to the
responsibility of Frozen water lines our policy states and that clarification of who's respons possibility of the residential lines and Commercial lines residential being owned from the standpipe to the meter and
Commercial being from the main corporation to the meter those are the ownership of those water lines it also clarifies that property owners are responsible
for those Services meaning whether it's a frozen water line installation any work that needs to be done that is the responsibility of that said owner for whether it's commercial or residential it also states that all
customers are responsible for taking all the necessary precautions to avoid frozen water lines we do list some of those precautions at our website and then that the cost associated with that preventative measure will be incurred by the customer however if BPU determines that
there is a necessity to keep a main from freezing and we were onun water that customers would receive that in writing and those additional costs related to that running of the water to keep the main open would
be waved this policy had a change from what was previously done in which we no longer offer the waving of running water unless you receive written no ification from
BPU okay so it's just to confirm that that is our policy is that is that is the policy we adopted in January of 24 okay question would be if there are any changes I don't know if any other staff had other comments I have a question Mr yeah just
to clarify what you just said so a homeowner is responsible from the curb stop to the house correct the city of Briner is responsible from the curb stop to the main correct that right okay that's all
I got okay so no action other than just to confirm yes that's our policy and we still think that that's appropriate direction from commission if you want to change that policy but that is the policy as it sits that was adopted in January of 24 Mr chair yes Mr J why are
you bringing this back yeah I was going to ask that too we are having questions from customers on why the policy changed and what is the current policy so we're bringing it Forward today to clarify that this is the direction of commission
for this policy can you tell me what the policy was that they're questioning the change in Prior I I remember going through this last year but I'm not sure what the what is the change that they're concerned about thank you Mr chzo um the concern was
that in past years prior to the policy that again uh customers were either instructed or uh were allowed to flow water for the purpose or belief
that the flowing water would prevent the frozen pipes and that there was that that usage was discounted uh with the new new policy uh that discount mechanism went away so basically if a uh if a customer
is concerned that their pipes would freeze that you know they could just uh uh crank a valve faucet what have you in their house to drip to try to prevent pipes from breaking and uh so I guess it again it
was just uh some customers looking to be reimbursed for using the additional water uh so in other words if they maintain their line properly they wouldn't have to run the water because they're not maintaining their line properly they're worried about it freezing up they think they can run the
water and not be charged for it so that's the issue we Chang we changed it that's no longer allowed so that's why we had to change if I'm not mistaken so that's all I needed thank you okay any other questions Mr President is there anything that
indicates in the policy that homeowner needs to correct this for the next season nope the only issue we would see is if a water man would freeze so as long as a water me water me Ms are flowing water
there isn't actually an issue with so it's the service line correction do we have any water mains that are an issue we have some low water mans we have nothing Frozen as of today or in the last few years nothing has frozen 2014 though brings back a lot of harsh memories for people everything in the
state froze so the reality of it is I mean if that and that's just how we we can't see where the water is frozen in the pipes we don't have any technology to do that so if the neighbor if there's three houses and the one in the middle has a frozen water line but the Neighbors on both sides have running water lines the main is Flowing we can
flow hydrant to do that to prove that but there's no way for it to determine exactly where that might be Frozen it's a cheap insurance to have your water run a pencil lead um if you have concern with your water line and then reach out to a plumber as a the policy states and have a plumber come and take a look at
your side um sometimes installation sometimes driveways have been added over top to water lines so there's lots of reasons how this could change annually from somebody from one year to the next but that's on the customer side not necessarily the BPU um and and I I guess
I would just comment that as a customer that has had I haven't had water issues but I've had some sewer issues with City staff and um sometimes our staff can come off a little harsh in the way they verbiage it
their narrative and I think I think this is a good policy and it's a fair policy but I think some some a constructive narrative on there again education like we talked about with the text messages I just think we could be we could educate
our our our customers a little bit better they are customers and they do pay us for a service and um I just think that that some sort of a construct narrative wouldn't hurt anything but I do agree with the policy I think one thing I'd like to
just add to the conversation is it's pertinent for us to on these new installations going forward that we make sure the checks and balances are taken care of that these new service lines are installed in the proper depth and are maintained correctly most of these service lines are very they've been
established for many many many years and so many things can change over the years as far as landscaping and different things like that so I think there's a more conversations to be had to who has the onus between the city and the utility on those inspections on those new service line installations to make
sure that we are checking the box and that really boils down to the contractor installing it and that's our job to make sure that our citizens that are having this work performed that are getting a fair job done that contractors aren't burying things too shallow because it's hard sometimes it's not easy to dig 8 feet in the ground there's other means
insallation other methods that can be done but it's our responsibility to make sure that our customers are getting taken care of fairly to on that end good comments okay anything else yes yeah go ahead and uh state your
name and address if you would please uh my name is Heidi Anderson uh 9303 Virginia Street I've been without water for 4 days uh happened on Saturday um when I called BPU for an emergency service they came out and checked the
main I'm at the end the line um they told me to call I couldn't call a steamer because the contamination to the water I couldn't have a welder come out the welding company that I contacted had bought bpu's old
welder and I've been at this location for 19 years and this is I believe the fourth or fifth time that this has happened previous to this year BPU has came out and taken care of all responsibilities but now this year I am
stuck BPU won't help me I can't get a plumber out I can't get a welder out here I sit 4 days without water what are my options okay so from a staff perspective we went out and as as was stated we
checked the main and made sure that that wasn't Frozen am I correct yep that is correct in full disclosure I just got back in the country about 12 hours ago and I do plan on following with up with you today okay as oh go ahead so my question is if
we were able to help her would it be a fee for service no different than if the welder were to come out and be able to help her so there's those lines just yeah potentially there's a potential of running a temporary line between your neighbor's house and your house but
that's something that's on your side of it so that's a plumber so in the policy this is something that you would contact a plumber to have you assist with that in the past you are correct be you has done things like that when this policy changed in 24 that's kind of where we were unable to do that service
anymore what was done in the previous four times do you recall I have I do not recall um I have to follow up on that yet okay do you recall what was done maybe what BPU did in the previous four times they brought out the welder and ran grounded it from the two water stops
and circul circular the electricity from my understanding and it's been I think I believe 2014 since we've allowed welders on our system okay that's been a little while now I believe in 2016 you guys came out
I I could be off two years on that but I will follow up with you okay Trent do you think this is a main issue or not I do not I believe it's a service installation issue not def fault of your own but I think the main your service line is NE
not deep enough or not insulated but doesn't the city inspect that when there was a new house built in the past the city was doing those inspections not be Briner Public Utilities so we do not have any documentation of your service
installation so would the city that'd be a good question for the city they should yes when your house built 2006 so from the city Side who would who would uh hi do you reach out to on that
so we could provide um I could get you my contact information you could get that I could also provide those to brainer Public Utilities anything after 2003 I think should be in our digital um storage area so I mean and my other question is can
we get a welder in the city limits like there seems to be no direct documentation um of I just like brainer City doesn't allow welders to come in but there's nothing that we can find in written documentation that states that but I
mean now I'm sitting 4 days without water but just uh from what I'm hearing it sounds like both City staff and BP will help but it our last lines of our policy do indicate that we reserve the right to deviate from this policy um you know to to do whatever is in the best
interest so I think it's not going to get resolved here without anybody going being able to look at some historical records or figuring out something for you so I think that based on that you're hearing from both City and BPU that will discuss with you some potential options
and moving forward but I think the policy was changed or was modified last year for good cause um and you might be one of those where this summer look having a a look at your service line might be something that you should
probably consider on the ground is thought you know so we don't have this future problem year after year or sporadic year after year sound fair okay and if you're willing I will follow up with you directly after this meeting
okay okay what's your address 9303 Virginia Street I'm sorry I didn't catch it Virginia Street Virginia thank you okay well thank you for bringing this to our attention in coming today in person thank you and we'll follow up
with you thanks Trent for doing that okay anyone else any other comments okay uh hearing none then we'll move on to staff reports with the city administrator report not here today okay all right
Council liaison report Mr chog um I just want to thank uh chairman city council president uh Mike OD day for making this suggestion that we move these meetings here I think the public uh we can be very informed with seeing what goes on
because at the location in Baxter it works well um I I can actually hear the meeting now we're out there was very diff difficult especially with soft book and people like Mr Higgins here in the room and um anyway no but I I think this is a
wonderful move we made and I'm glad uh it seems like everybody here has got a smile on their face today and they're happy we're here thank you very much that's all I have okay thank you HR Director report nothing in addition to my report okay anybody have any
questions okay Public Utilities director report uh thank you Mr President nothing to add okay finance manager report nothing to add can I just quick thing can when we use acronyms can you tell me what some
of those acronyms are I mean you've got one under the community's local energy action program and I know you've got a few of them in your report I have no idea what those acronyms mean just because I don't walk the your in your shoes on a daily basis so just if you could spell it out one time that'd be be
great just so I can follow along that'd be great thanks you remember I asked about that before Dolly I missed it I I I enr is the energy laboratory the national renewable and renewable energy laboratory that's who're working with
with region five on our new best friends okay no that's a great comment all right operations manager report thank you Mr President nothing to add okay Charlie what to water nothing add no not
at this time unless I could you got questions okay all right thank you commissioner or commission member reports Mr Higgins um I'm looking forward to my tour my commissioner tour they told me about I didn't know I got
one of those so I can't wait till it warms up a little bit and I get to go see everything that's all I got you could see the dam probably I was driving around this morning and I'm like I've probably looked at the dam more than any human being in the world I think I might go
with you on that one M that tour if I said that I'd get in trouble okay commissioner M uh the only thing I would ask is that if we are setting up a tour that we do invite uh the new city council person to attend
also if possible uh so staff isn't having to or anybody else that would want to attend for that matter but so staff doesn't have to continue to do individual tours that would be great just at least extended invitation okay thank you uh the only
thing I have is is there a joint meeting coming up with BPU commission with city council with city council no we have a council Retreat on March 10th it's eight hours I think it's Public's invited that
would include you Mr England uh and anyone else who wants to go and it's uh believe I I I I only thing I forgot is the location can anybody here remember that it's a library I yes I believe it's
the library mhm okay so it starts at 8: a.m so it's not a it's not technically something commission goes to where we would have to adjourn to that potentially you would if you have a quorum so if a quorum is planning on you would have to adjourn to that as well I
plan on going I can't go cuz I'm out of town but and I won't be able to okay so we don't have to adjourn to that one thank you for asking a good idea um as far as the commission being there though is there a certain time frame or is it just come to the whole thing and well
again I I think once we get an agenda which I think will be coming out fairly soon I would imagine probably I'm guessing we might have that by the 3D okay I'm I'm purely speculating but uh I would think there's going to be some agenda maybe there'll be maybe Mr Hab
Hab a course yes I'm not I can't remember we just had a meeting yesterday but we're talking about something totally different I will get that information and I'll pass it on yeah that'd be great thank you yes thank you all right that's all I had motion to adjourn move second all those in favor I
those opposed same sign all right thanks everybody huh