##VIDEO ID:bbXWwIwg4Vo## e if you wish to speak to any item on the agenda or during the public comment portion of the meeting please fill out a speaker card each person addressing the board shall have three minutes to complete his or her comments on each agenda item for which he or she has filled out a card the chair has the discretion to determine or alter the time limits on any agenda item the board of County Commissioners requests that speakers appearing under the public comment section of the agenda limit their comments presentations to matters relating to County Business that are within the board's Control Authority and jurisdiction good morning and welcome to the January 28th uh regular meeting of the board of County Commissioners we have a quorum I'll call the meeting to order uh we have invocation today by Reverend Jeremy Copic did I say that right is is he here from Faith Baptist Church no okay uh commissioner Goodson with the pledge sir of the United States of America and the for it stands one nation God indivisible liy andice for all you want to do it now uh this a little out of order and sorry for that but uh commissioner Alman offered to say an invocation for us you recognize sir thank you Mr please stand Heavenly Father we give you thanks and praise for this day we pray for your guidance as we seek to uh lead our County into the future we ask that your will be done and today let's remember those Seven astronauts that lost their lives on this day January 28th at the space sh uh Challenger we pray this in your name amen amen thank you for doing appreciate that commissioner Alman okay Commissioners we do not have any minutes for approval um and so we'll go right into resolutions and today we have a very special resolution recognizing John denninghoff yeah I think we're you know you gave me a long one so I think that means you got to stand up there sir stand before the bar a resolution on behalf of the Bard County Board of County Commissioners honoring John denninghoff for his outstanding service to Bard County whereas John denninghoff John denninghoff a lifelong resident of Bard County and University of Florida engineering graduate obtained his professional engineer license in 1987 and whereas John gained valuable Private Industry development and environmental engineering experience achieving vice president and chief design engineer position over 14 years in his early career and whereas Bard County Citizens and County leadership were fortunate to have John join Public Service in 1996 where he has since strived to uphold and require from engineering and professional colleagues the highest of integrity and standards to protect the citizens of Bard County for the last 29 years most recently as County assistant County Manager where he's provided unwavering support assistance and an exceptional work ethic to the county manager and in Prior positions as public works department director transportation engineering department director and construction management director and whereas Engineers who have worked alongside John express it has been a profound honor and that his leadership wisdom and dedication Elevate not only the projects he touches but also the people he works with he doesn't just solve problems he anticipates challenges inspires others and drives meaningful growth and necessary change and whereas John has overseen numerous critical programs projects and emergency preparation and response efforts and Rose to become widely known as a rock solid resource for staff County leadership and state representatives and virtually any emergency or critical situation and whereas John has been integral in hurricane preparation for the county and a steadfast leader during storm events for every hurricane since 1996 staying on duty 24/7 in the Emergency Operations Center ensuring County assets and operations under his control were ready his teams and infrastructure fortified and personally inspecting critical infrastructure immediately following the events and whereas a few of the major projects John has facilitated for Bard County Citizens include the replacement of the aax Brewer bridge in Titusville won the People's Choice Award in a national contest sponsored by the American Association of highway state highway and transportation officials Ellis Road I95 St John's Heritage Parkway interchange the Port St John Parkway interchange extension of the pinita causeway to I95 Construction of the St John's Heritage Parkway The Bard County Traffic Management Center the Vera Boulevard I95 interchange the newly constructed Emergency Operations Center development and implementation of the intelligent transportation system and elimination of the countywide road resurfacing backlog and whereas the aax Brewer Bridge Project resulted in a $10,000 uh in $10,000 that was used by Florida Department of Transportation to establish an engineering degree scholarship fund at Eastern Florida State College and whereas in 2013 John was named Urban engineer of the Year by the Florida Association of County engineers and Road superintendence recognized for criteria in project timeliness innovation leadership impact on budget and impact on the community and whereas John has served on the central Florida Expressway Expressway right of way committee for Bard County since 2017 extending application of his professional engineering to regional growth affecting Bard County and the surrounding regions and whereas John has announced his retirement effective January 31st 2025 and leave be leaves behind a legacy of professional achievements benefiting Bard County and its residents for years to come now therefore be it resolved that The Bard County Board of County Commissioners recognizes the exceptional service provided by John denninghoff and is grateful for his many years of dedication exceptional intelligence and in Innovation to the benefit of Bard County and its citizens done order and adopted in regular session this 28th day of January 2025 is there motion to approve move a motion by commissioner Alman we have a second by commissioner Delany clerk will read the commissioner Delaney yes commissioner Alman yes commissioner adkinson yes commissioner uh Goodson yes chair felner yes congratulations sir uh okay let's take comments from the board and then we'll let him have the last word do everybody everybody knows that about John he has the last word okay so all right sir you're recn nice some of that was um impressive but but uh I know you but the only thing I didn't see Sherman was the engineering of parting of the Red Sea but John you will be missed thoroughly missed you will come back as a the best known consultant I've ever met okay but good luck in your retirement and all God's blessed and everything like that who that took a lot thank you anyone else commission Commission Del you recognized I just want to say thank you so much for um all your help being a new board member is you know there's definitely a learning curve and having somebody with so much knowledge and experience is really um really helpful so I I just really thank you for um your cander and uh just always being there for uh advice or um you know any questions we have to that we have uh you always there with all the information which is um going to be greatly missed and so we'll we'll give you some time off in your retirement but then hopefully you'll let us call you well my phone number hasn't changed but thank you and enjoy your retirement thank you uh commissioner opman sir well I was uh one of the things I look forward to coming back to the commission was working with John of course now he goes and retires I um but the retirement well deserved and I just want to to thank him for his public service and he's kind of the guy kind of the person that makes this job enjoyable to work with such professionals and he's served our County well thank you so much commissioner ainson yeah so our time obviously been short together I know you're going to leave us in good hands but as was said here your leadership wisdom and your dedication is going to be missed truly missed by me thank you and and John uh I certainly appreciate your many years of wisdom your historical knowledge um I'll just tell the audience there's plenty of times where I think I have a good idea and I go talk to Johnny he goes no they they tried that in 2001 it didn't work and uh so he's a he's a really good sounding board uh he also lets me just walk into his office so um I take advantage of that and Sir you're you're going to be missed and I I think uh seeing all the people here today that it's a real Testament to your service to bvar County you recognized sir thank you so much thank you all for the kind words um yeah before I came to the county I was a Consulting engineer and I um took very seriously uh the engineering profession uh uh concern and dedication and commitment to the public and the public safety and and Welfare um I one of my consultant uh clients was Bard County and so I got approached by uh some staff members uh one of whom is sitting in the back of the room right now uh the U uh asking if I might want a job with at the county that was the last thing I ever was thinking about I was I was busy uh working and uh and uh I uh U got to thinking about it and eventually I I um I took them took up on that and uh the um I remember Henry minu asked me into his office on my first day and uh he uh sat me down and he said uh you know John uh we're here to work we're not here to sit back and relax and this is not a place for the for the uh uh Henry didn't use air quotes very often but he did that day and he said uh as a government employe employe or a government worker and uh and I can tell you that uh my family my parents my siblings um we held each other to a very high standard of work if you weren't working uh you weren't pulling your weight and and you needed to start pulling your weight and uh so I was never afraid of hard work never afraid of a challenge in fact challenges were uh accomplishments just waiting for you to uh overcome or achieve and uh the uh so I wasn't worried about Henry's uh admonition about working and uh the U uh the other thing was I thought I might only work for the county for maybe three years and uh well that changed uh because I sort of found my calling if you will uh um that commitment to the public uh as a as a Public Employee became a major thing for me so uh this was kind of my home and uh the team and the teams that I've had around me uh throughout my career have just been tremendous and they have made me uh look better than I really am and uh together we've achieved things which people didn't think we could do I can't tell you how many projects people said we'll never do and the pine extension the parkway there many more and uh the um so I'm proud that with the team that we had and the leadership that we had that we were able to get so many good things done um the uh sort of one of the things that I was always about was having a vision an understanding what the vision was and uh the its was an example of that and I insisted we had a plan we needed a plan and we got it and we started funding it and getting it funded and and so we've got it we've got an excellent system that many in the state envy and uh the uh because of so much hard work by so many good people who who knew more about it than I did and uh but that's an example of it and so now it's kind of come time for me to uh thank my family uh my wife uh my children my grandchildren they all in inspire me to continue to work hard to uh provide for them and for them to provide for me and uh support and strength that they give me I want to thank the the county staff all of them that have worked for me many who have passed on uh the U they're just tremendous people and I can assure the public that they work a lot harder than the stereotypical government worker uh and in fact when they needed to put in extra time they did and when I asked them to they did and when we needed it they did and uh so I'm just couldn't be more proud and honored to work with such a group I want to thank Frank he trusted me to uh bring me up into the county manager's office and um which I was completely uh uh surprised by did not anticipate wasn't expecting and uh I say he's not only trusted me but he's had my back he's stood shoulder-to-shoulder with me when I needed it and uh and we've achieved good things and uh uh for the people of this County and of this community and uh not just unincorporated residents but all residents of Bard County and uh so it's been an honor uh to serve and be allowed to serve and uh um I'm not coasting to the end I've got a meeting on Friday morning with the city of pal Bay it's going to be an important event and uh so we're going to keep working right to the end to meet the challenges that we have I hope I've left everyone uh in good hands um I'm going to paraphrase uh Great American uh Douglas mccarther and say it's time for me to uh uh as an engineer to to fade away and uh the uh there'll be good people that take care of things in the future and I have total confidence in that so that thank you all very very much hold on John we're we're going to take pictures okay we're going to take pictures I think Don's going to get some pictures for ready okay okay Commissioners we'll move on to consent agenda anything anybody wants to take off of the consent agenda I'd like to pull um F4 okay we'll take F F4 off anything else no all right um um let's give Kathy a second to come up here and we'll go ahead and get to F4 um yeah but I think I have F6 okay let's do F4 then I won't forget you okay whenever you're ready Kathy this is a request that the board of County Commissioners approve the commission District appointments reappointments the board approval of this item will acknowledge the district Commissioners appointments and reappointments and approve at large appointments thank you are there questions um well I guess not really a question okay we don't have any other cards on the issue we don't have questions go ahead in discussion okay um I just wanted to bring up a concern that I had about um item number six and my concern is about a possible conflict of interest and uh you know I just I don't feel comfortable with that so I would like to talk about that I you're going to have to tell us which which ones you're okay talking about here um the appointment to the board of adjustments Bruce Moya uh okay is that the only one that you have yes problem with any other Commissioners have concerns since we've opened this item up on um appointments I think that we should vote on any others yes sir what is the issue with Bruce Boya what's the issue commissioner Delany car answer that sure my concern is um that as a professional engineer um that he could there could be times where he could financially benefit from the decisions made on this board and so that that is troubling to me wouldn't you say that you could pull that card on about anybody we appoint um I don't know if I would agree with that H well would you agree that uh regardless of he's a is there any other professional people you don't want to be appointed like maybe an attorney because Bruce is an engineer so a builder is there anybody else we need to kind of do to the fact they could be politically challenged or something is there anybody else you don't like it's it's not a personal thing like I said it's I'm just concerned about a possible conflict of interest well chair sir wouldn't there be a need to address that if there was one but right now there is none okay let's uh I think I think there's a tie here uh how do how do we want to handle this we want to vote on every one of these uh do you want to vote on the one in question uh how how do we what's the pleasure of the board how do we want to do these today I'm fine with um if if the board is okay with it I'm fine on approving all the others you just want to vote you just want a register a no vote on on that one on ver Moya um I'm okay with that as long as you know I don't know if any of the other Commissioners have a concern um so I don't know if we want to pull that one for for a vote on its own or if we just want to do register the board here uh anyone else chair I would move that we vote vote on them all and she can register a no vote I second that on the whole lot yes okay um okay all right we have a a motion okay is that it for consent okay we we'll just we'll just do all of consent commissioner Delany you can register a not vote is that what you want to do I'm Bruce okay all right so the clerk will record that no vote for her uh on the rest of consent sir is that your motion the rest of consent okay we have uh motion by commissioner Goodson for consent we have second by commissioner Atkinson um clerk will call the role Mr chair oh I'm sorry I'm sorry wait a minute uh since we're doing the rest consent I'm sorry thank you y you're on it I think yeah I Sandra sorry it's a little different um Sandra Sullivan sou Patrick Shores so I want to talk about the item to do with the uh golf carts and amending the areas in in Viera um um I've met with you about the County ordinance uh on golf carts uh in un unincorporated areas and have expressed concerns that need to be addressed sent many emails um so this is a a good opportunity time to fix some of the problems with the current ordinance that we have um we have a a golf cart issue and part of that lies with we have two separate State statutes one for lsvs and one for golf carts and if there was a way to have all of them go into DMV and be checked and so that the lsvs are licensed and plated as required lsvs have safety equipment that are appropriate for driving on roads like seat belts I can't tell you in my community golf carts aren't allowed but they're everywhere okay we do I do the best to educate them to be upgrade them to lsv get it get the safety equipment get the plates and as state registered then they have insurance what we have in Vieira and you're adding more area is you have lsvs and golf carts driving on the crosswalks which is not legal okay lsvs are for the road and and golf carts are for you know on the sidewalks and stuff but can go on the roads in areas that you are designating you're designating them to go in but there's no requirement that they have insurance or safety equipment we see two-year-olds on the back not l in so what we see is an uprise in the number of golf cart accidents this was a couple days ago I'm going to suggest there's liability for the county in failing to address and follow the law you have signs I've taken pictures of them that are greater than 35 miles an hour while you have golf cart Crossings which is a violation of state law in addition we had some legislative changes recently um this is 2023 and this says prohibiting a person under 18 years of age of operating a golf cart on certain roadways unless he possesses a learner's permit or a driver's license I went by Vieira High School there's plenty of golf carts there while I was standing went in there and got their form and they do not check that they have a driver's license when I picked up the form while I was there boom crash and I look over the golf carts and a kid slammed into the tunnel fortunately they weren't injured but you know you got to do a better job on this and start following the law lsvs have to be licensed and plated and there clearly lots of lsvs driving around in viea pretending to be golf carts and you need some education I've asked you guys to go to TPO and get some education for the public and for you guys to follow the law chair May thank you this is my item Commissioners I'll speak to it to a second go ahead sir okay I'd like to call Lisa Cullen up here to ask her some questions may I if she's so amenable I see her coming up so it looks like it thank you madam you're welcome you're question ma'am what you just heard referred a lot to state law was I correct is that correct so therefore does the county have a liability by not mandating something that state would not approve or could approve I don't know I'm asking I would be able to answer questions about titling and registering a low-speed vehicle versus a golf cart okay but not I understand your liability being that might be Mr Richard that being said tell me on licensing low speed or a golf cart talk tell me what state law well I haven't Revisited that lately but a lowspeed vehicle has the safety equipment on it um that a golf cart would not have so they can be used on the roadways and they are licensed with a license plate is it true then if you buy for example a rockar do you know what a rockar is Made in India it's a Jeep no sir I do not okay it's got It's got lights it's got turn signals it's got brake lights it's got flashing lights warning lights but yet uh I don't think it qualifies to be tagged I would have to see the manufacturer certificate of origin that would would go through Nitsa and anva and and different uh different uh associations that we deal with that would determine if that vehicle is street legal or not so I think what you're saying a certificate of origin will tell me a manufacturer certificate of origin will tell me whether a vehicle is street legal as being a lowp speed vehicle or being a golf cart can you make a golf cart street legal I like yes but then you have to have it inspected and your office inspects actually the uh dhsmv inspectors inspect them thank you so much you're welcome thank you chair while you're there at least I don't know if I know any more now than I did before is there anyone else has a question on this for the tax collector since she's gracious enough to be here no thank you ma'am appreciate it uh Commissioners this is my item it's it's not Vieira we're not trying to expand anything I don't want to um especially over on the beach I'm I'm sensitive to that but in sunry uh specifically the if you if you know sunry the Springs of sunry are outside of uh what was allowed so basically U members who uh members of the country club cannot take their golf cart from Springs of century but their neighbors can and that's what this was um trying to fix so um that's it there any questions on that all right I think we already uh now did we vote on consent I forgot we need to do that okay all right clerk will I think we had a motion in a second clerk will call the role commissioner Delaney I'd like to put for the record yes on the consent except for F4 item number six okay uh commissioner Alman yes commissioner adkinson yes Vice chair Goodson yes chair feltner yes okay okay thank you Commissioners we will go on to go on to the G comments Sandra Sandra Sullivan sou Patrick Shores so the way that this was presented in the last meeting so what this is is um authorizing the board of County Commission to approve a budget supplement um basically moving the money that CA the um the money not spent from the clerk of courts and the uh property prer office and having that money go to some parks issue from Hurricane Milton and what was represented in the last meeting was this was a kind of a temporary movement in the sense that once your insurance and feema paid for um the expenses that it would be reimbursed um unfortunately that statement and the way this was presented in the last meeting is not uh represented in the resolution it's simply a a budget change for roughly $2.3 million um with nothing about it being returned when those issues are are addressed um by Insurance I'd like to you kind of know when insurance is going to do this it seems like a lot of these items on the list have to do with shoreline erosion you know I don't know we on Beachside where we're pretty well affected but you know we didn't really have that much um damage from Milton um so I'm I'm at a little loss one two three four five at least five of them are shoreline erosion does Insurance even cover that I mean I just you know how much have you already applied to FEMA and do you have an intention in reality for this money to go back to the general budget um as was represented in the last meeting and how much do you expect that to be because I'd like to see that money go to fire that is a critical need that's way more critical than this at this time thank you thank you okay I don't think we have any other cards on the first public comments I see Commander making his way over okay Mark you're you're recognized sir we on H1 good morning Commissioners uh H1 is a petition of aada right away uh at Westways drive it's the McAdam subdivision um and requesting a vacate of a 50ft uh public RightWay um and we will receive back a roadway drainage and utilities mint uh we've received no formal objections I do have uh two cards on this um are there questions from the board first for Mark um and Mr Ramos if you want to speak we're going to need you to put in a card but uh we'll we'll take that up in a minute uh Marjorie Hartman and then after that and Mark okay recognize ma'am good morning morning um I'm on to Plane Road that backs up to that property on the side and I'm not sure why we're putting a trailer in whether there's a change in zoning that would allow a trailer to have this right away put in and that's my M main concern I really don't want a change in zoning that allows trailers and then more trailers to come in and that's the question here today that I'm looking at this right away and why all of a sudden there's trailers behind me okay we'll see if we can answer that for you here in a minute okay that's all I have to say okay thank you ma'am thank you and Mark good morning morning I'm Ian mark from 1861 Tall Pine that ABS the um pond in the back I guess it's is called the uh Wayside development um to put in order to put a uh Road in here I was looking at the map and I I didn't see that it was clear um that to have a throughway um that would only uh it it wasn't clear where the throughway would start or end and that that was my concern because it is a tight area with residential all around it and I also a lot of children and I be concerned about that and that's my main concern okay ma'am I think we have one of your other neighbors here I think he'll be able to explain it what he's trying to do okay thank you Marty willing to speak to us here for a moment tell us what you're trying to do sir I would love to and uh you'll do a card for us afterward okay with Melissa in the back thank you thank you no no just just talk here you're talking to the board my name is Martin Ramos I serve in the Marine Corp for 21 years and proudly I've served I bought this property when everything was awarded lot to include West way street I built a nice house the VA helped me the marineo helped me I served in Via nand dur in 1967 1968 I lost my friends I was the only one that made it home thank God and all I'm asking is my final years I'm 76 years old to be able to park my motor home in there so I could do some traveling the rest of my di thank you very much are are there any questions from Mr Ros anyone else yeah I think I understand that uh in in front of his property there he's he's looking for his own motor home uh but not a mobile home that people are going to reside in does that does that answer things is there fence around Marty is there is there going to be a fence by it Sor I have a he I if you're speaking to the board here just answer that question for us real quick sir if you would I'm sorry will there be a fence um in front of your mobile home uh no no no fence you have you some trees there though right it's it's a lot of trees back there okay all right okay Commissioners I'm I'm comfortable with what he's trying to do here so it's my district um is there is there motion to approve move to approve okay there's a motion by commissioner Delaney there's a second by uh commissioner Goodson clerk will call the role commissioner Delaney yes commissioner Altman yes commissioner Atkinson yes Vice chair Goodson yes chairman felner yes congratulations sir thank you thank you very much right Commissioners we will go to H2 J you're recognizing good morning Commissioners this public hearing is in accordance with board Direction received on January 14th and this budget supplement will recognize unanticipated balance forward and allocate those dollars to repair Parks facilities um the damages that were caused from Hurricane Milton okay Commissioners questions for Jill question commissioner Goodson tell me how long does it normally take for your money I think Frank answered it last meeting from uh of the federal government FEMA it can take it's a very lengthy process it could take anywhere between um five to seven years sometimes it's a little less than that but the FEMA Public Assistance process it is a reimbursement model so we have to show that we've completed the projects we have to provide a lot of documentation um so that can take time there's multiple reviews involved as well commissioner ainson when we do get those reimbursements where will that money go back to we work closely with County finance to make sure that any funds reimbursed go to where the funds were paid from so that would be the general fund in this case thank you commissioner delini um would you would you mind uh explaining that process a little bit for um for the public about like um how it's possible that we may not get reimbursed for this but we're going to go through the process and do everything we can to try to get reimbursed but will you kind of expand on that a little bit um yeah it is a a very lengthy process so the first thing that happens is there's a disaster recovery scoping meeting that we have with FEMA uh we work really closely with the uh departments and with staff to document everything uh we put together detailed damage inventory and then um FEMA schedule side inspection so they go out and visit all of the uh damages and make sure they're documented we then file insurance claims with our property insurance some things are covered some things aren't for example Shoreline damages those wouldn't be something covered by property insurance and then FEMA will only cover those things not covered by property insurance so um it's it goes through a federal review it also goes through a review at the state level as well and have we started the process with yes we have uh we have awesome thank you we have one card on this any other questions for Jill before we go to the card question sir could you if you know could you explain to me or the board the femos response on the bridge on merid island and when did you that was what seven years ago something Frank yeah John's very familiar with that because he was in involved uh in the initial submission so let him address it yeah the damage to the bridge occurred in 2017 uh I think it was Hurricane Irma and uh we immediately were seeking uh assistance through the core of engineers the uh Florida do and obviously FEMA and uh after a great deal of effort we uh we finally got a commitment of some assistance from FEMA uh we haven't received the money yet uh but we will be receiving that we expect probably in the next year to year and a half chair one more question to John yes sir first question then could you tell me cost of bridge and what you think you'll get from FEMA I don't recall the exact numbers at this point uh Mark do do you know what they are commissioner uh I I don't have the exact number but I think it was around uh one or 1.3 million or somewhere in in that uh ballpark uh but as John explained uh we've been working diligently since 2017 to recover funds and uh that is a fraction of what it will cost cost us to uh rebuild the bridge Commissioners I wanted to make sure you understood that that was just what we're going to get from FEMA the actual cost for the bridge was quite a bit more I think I think the bridge is around 25 I think I ain't sure but anyway thank you thank you both uh yes sir uh I'm Mark hold on one second uh commissioner ainson just one further question I don't know who's the right person to answer it but just to confirm these are not reoccurring funds that we can count on that's correct thank you okay done with questions sander suvin on H2 okay very good thank you okay okay uh discussion on the item Commissioners no is there a motion so move second okay we have motion by commissioner Goodson we have a second by commissioner Delaney clerk will call the rooll commissioner Delaney yes commissioner Alman yes commissioner Atkinson yes Vice chair Goodson yes chairman feltner yes Commissioners will show that passes 5 Z okay we're going to move into i1 C Peter morning Commissioners um i1 is the marketing support uh program coming back um there are three requested actions of the board um the first one is to provide Direction on the 44 events that were being recommended by the tourist Development Council okay uh let's let's sort of do these in pieces then um questions for Peter on that that item is okay question Mar um I just kind of wanted to clarify that we have a group of people who in good faith went through the process expected to be reimbursed for their expenses is that correct and they met the criteria that we requested yes ma'am the the application process opened in um October and they there are some events that have already occurred but they they did apply in good faith thank you other questions all right I have three cards Martha good morning Rec good morning everyone I'm Martha pasaro from 1280 Marshall Court in Meritt Island I'm representing the native Heritage Gathering Incorporated on behalf of the cultural Community here in Bard County with a uh eye on this program being one of the community support issues that we have an ordinance on and a vote for expenditure of tax dollars coming back to the community cultural grants and I was very much thankful for being a part of the workshop that was held to hear commissioner Thad Alman talk about the origins of this particular program I know I would like to see on behalf of the cultural Community a return to that sort of common sense that's inclusive of all of the organizations and certainly to make sure that we fund the ones that have already gone through process and have uh committed to their programs and need that reimbursement but we would also like to see some involvement with the ones that were knocked out by the requirement for the 5,1 attendance from out of County that's a really arbitrary number on my estimation based on what we've had to accomplish in the past and that rubric for coming up with that many outof count uh uh attendees was or it was iffy if anything for us to understand why that was the new cap on qualifying for this Grant and we thank you for going forward and working hard on bringing back the programs that are inclusive for all of our cultural communities it serves everyone including our constituents and the wonderful wonderful people who come to visit bvar County and I thank you for your time thanks Martha thank you George tret yes sorry should have said that good morning good morning I'm George trett and I am a surfing Santa if you'd have told me 16 years ago that surfing Santa would become what it has become a family friendly Community event loved by thousands I'd have told you ain't no way um but over the years Space Coast office of Tourism has been very kind to us the County Commission of course supporting them um and we've been able to put on what I like to call the greatest show on surf um surfing Santa it cost us about $30,000 these days to put on the event between between the stage and website and the things we do to Insurance all these things um and I'd say that that $30,000 expense is probably one of the best investments that the county could make um we have reached this crazy media success over the years billions of media Impressions uh like last year we had 2.1 billion media Impressions from our Goofy surfing Santa event meaning 2.1 billion times somebody somewhere saw something about surfing Santas and it was over a 42h hour period which amazes me if you do the math our surfing Santa event this year created 50 million impressions per hour for the first 42 hours when the when the report was run that came up with a 2.1 billion impression so um people all over the world all over the country all over the state are seeing things about surfing Santas so for a small investment $30,000 we're returning some $20 million value in advertising value to the county um I want to see the um cultural grants go back to the old way uh where we spend money and on the event and then get reimbursed through the county uh through the office of Tourism um so basically we support the old program if um if that's a possibility I'd also like to introduce space surfing Santa this guy's cousin went to space on August in August of 22 on a blue origin fight flight he was stuffed in a suitcase and I never got to see him floating in space and that's what I want to see so if any of you have any connections to SpaceX or blue origin and we can get this guy in a capsule and get him floating in space it'd make me happy and and we can make a pretty good media uh hit over that thank you thank you sir Angela Johnson good morning I'm Angela Johnson general manager of Coconuts on the Beach I think most of you know where surfing Santas has been held the last 11 years besides Co and we're very proud of that um I myself a background I grew up in Cocoa Beach graduated from Coco Beach High School and have worked at Coconut since 1999 so to say my heart and soul isn't in downtown Cocoa Beach is an understatement um and being supportive of surfing Santa is huge our staff looks forward to the event every year we're proud of it um we really went on the map as far as downtown Coco Beach Coco Beach in general because of surfing Santa I do believe that and we're really proud of it but as we know every year expenses raise every year we get quotes on how much things is going to cost that's going to cost everywhere but the event is expensive and we're asking for a little support um we support surfing sand as we are a huge sponsor um but our pockets are only so deep okay so I'm just asking for as George did to get a little to go backwards and how the money is spent for the that event in itself and overall the tourism Council so if you guys could reconsider that it would be much appreciated from us at coconuts as well as all of downtown Cocoa Beach um Kenny Wells is um Coca Beach Main Street you guys may know her we actually sit and look at some of these events we have a cookie crawl that goes on and a tree lighting which as well coconut sponsors and we said these are Hallmark moments you know this is our small little Beach town that is a Hallmark moment and we're very proud of that but we do ask for more support and we appreciate you considering it thank you so much thank you okay Commissioners that's that's it for the cards now Peter remind me we're back on the the preapproved uh yeah action one sir is uh to uh provide Direction on the uh applications that were already received the 44 events that the TDC is recommending and that totals tell me that total $85,000 just so the commission's clear on that all right Commissioners uh I think we already asked questions on that there is there any we or is there any comment on the 85,000 for those prior offense I I have a question okay sorry yes is is there any way that we could um approve the change of how the money is spent that we can allow these um organizations to spend the money how they need that's third the third Mo motion commissioner that's the third one okay yeah sorry I'm I'm trying to keep them sure in pieces too okay right any other discussion on on that commissioner ainson I was just going to move to approve okay we have a motion uh by commissioner ainson second there's a second by commissioner Delan clerk will call the hold on on sir we're voting on one is that correct option one Peter just say it one more time we're voting on The oh okay the 85,000 that the prior board saved for this board to approve I'm sorry okay yes sir okay all right we had I believe a commiss uh commissioner ainson made the motion we have a second by commissioner Delaney clerk will call the rooll commissioner Delaney yes commissioner Alman yes commissioner Atkinson yes Vice chair Goodson yes chair Felton yes we'll show that part passes 5 Z okay now Peter what's what's the next part when okay so sir the next part is to address um the potential adding of $100,000 for some of the smaller events um there were three options under that uh under that um the first option is for uh each district commissioner to allocate $20,000 to the event of their choice um the second option is to just do a distribution of the 100,000 across uh the 11 smaller events and then the third is to use the pre previous year's criteria across the 11 smaller events which comes out to a pro rated amount for each totaling 100,000 hey Commissioners questions on how this is going to work commissioner ainson I do have one question um so our third option which is to approve the use of the previous year's criteria um my question is to include the organizations that did not qualify and therefore did not apply who's that alluding to uh so there's 11 events listed on attachment B um I can read them off if if you'd like but there's 11 and so uh I'm I'm sorry I specifically mean the one who the ones that did not even apply none of those 11 applied as a result of them not qualifi okay thank you yes ma'am any anyone else and questions for Peter on this issue what's the what's the what's the thought process here in discussion what do we want to do with the 100,000 you want to give the 100,000 back to TDC you want to support some of these events Mr chairman you want to save it for lifeguards next year no M commissioner so one option is each commissioner we divide it up by five diff different uh districts and um so I provided the two projects I would support and the reason I pi picked those two projects they stood out they were unique they dealt with conservation preservation and historic restoration and ecoist tourism and I didn't see a whole lot in the budget for that personally that's probably my favorite type of Tourism so I put those two projects in um field met and Green Gables so if we were to take that approach that's those are the two items that I've selected although I think what that requires is the commission to vote on that doesn't doesn't and and we could do we could vote for the whole thing um or we could you know uh take up each um District's uh items and and vote we could do that too um I I appreciate that you picked one out of your District yeah I did I looked at conservation historic preservation I'm I'm thinking okay well I didn't even know that I think I have no idea we we no I didn't know that okay I I think we all we all go there for a nice lunch too uh so it's a historical house and it's it's an amazing property okay all right uh but we had we had two districts that didn't didn't put anything so let's let's go to that commissioner Delany what what's your thought here sure so I had a question um are we is it possible to give um if we did decide to break it up for 20,000 each um is it possible to give uh organizations that already received money extra money Peter yeah I don't whatever the board's pleasure I don't see an issue yeah the the those are unallocated funds so would be available with by board vote for whatever you decided and I really appreciated um commissioner feltner's suggestion of possibly saving this money for lifeguards I don't we haven't really talked about that at all so that um that day is ahead of us yeah so that's that's an option Commissioners we could just take that money and just leave it in the fund and give us a little room in the summer uh when that debate comes back up is that a possibility okay that sounds like there's one for that possibly two commissioner Alman sir I uh I would not be for using tourist tax dollars for Life cards I I think we should do that out of our general fund okay got got a lot of things coming out of the general fund this year uh commissioner Goodson sir what's your opinion on that I have number two on number three okay how do we want what do we want to do about the 100,000 that we have in front of us do you want to save that in a fund for lifeguard discussion later or do you want to appropriate $220,000 for items possibly in your District can we give it back to the TDC to decide what to do with it we could just leave it in the TDC do you want to do that commissioner Goodson nope okay nope nope can I make a motion sure okay I'd like to make a motion to um use this money for the lifeguards may I make a comment go ahead sir okay if you know anything about lifeguards you couldn't even get Coco Beach to agree to pay their full share so now you're going to give money back to lifeguards it's compos Coco Beach right in front of you saying okay you have the money pay for the whole thing that's my comment in debate I think uh commissioner delini had the light uh before you sir um commissioner Delan um honestly I'm I'm that's a fight for a different day at the end of the day I feel like Public Safety we have to I mean that's our number one job is to make sure that we have Safe Community safe beaches and if we have this money um we might as well save it for for that commissioner Alman the reason I um don't think we should use tourist development tax dollars for lifeguards is the fact that um if we were to make that a policy statement we could just clean out the entire TDC budget because lifeguard expenses quite High uh 100,000 is not going to pay many lifeguards NOP so I think that when we do spend the money from the tourist development tax revenue it should be spent in a way that has an impact um on the original intent of the statute that created the tourist development tax paid for by Hotel years we we had an original referendum that brought everyone together and they um built a compromise and pass the tax it took what three times to pass it twice it didn't so I think a big public safety issue like lifeguards we should anti up that's a public safety a very important Public Safety uh policy decision that we need to make and fund it through general fund and whatever it takes to work out whatever agreement we need to have with the cities we need to roll our sleeves up and make that happen so that's my opinion I thought I would uh okay sir voice that commiss Atkinson on old light or did you want to say okay um here's here's what we can do we could light I have light I didn't say it but yep yes sir thank you sir um as far as Public Safety we do pay for our lifeguards on our beach Coco Beach Satellite Beach those beaches said they couldn't afford it didn't want any part of it didn't care didn't even want tour us so make sure you understand vard County pays for their life cards on their beaches chair would you mind if I yes ma'am I I appreciate that but I I feel like um you know I was I was watching during that time and it was uh the heat was up and so I wonder if you know they may have a different uh um tone depending upon how we move forward and how we you know build relationships with our cities so I would hate for things that happened last year to um muddy up the great relationships we could have with our cities moving forward I commissioner I will agree with you that maybe a renewed effort this year hopefully we could get a better product in partnership with um the municipalities uh not for nothing the money that comes out of ocean rescue as part of fire rescue so anything that that we can do to help there um is Meaningful so we could just today say let's leave the 100,000 in um TDC and we could deal with this another day maybe when we're a little bit further down the road and have better information um that maybe be the safe course what's the what's the pleasure of the board we got to decide something here I'm okay with that all right commissioner delini is that a motion we'll leave it in the TDC okay all right uh commissioner ainson is that a second commissioner ainson seconds that we're going to leave the 100,000 in the TDC for now clerk will call the role commissioner Delaney yes commissioner Alman no commissioner Atkinson yes Vice chair Goodson no chairman feltner yes we'll show that passes 3 to thanks for all the input all right let go out and then option Sor option three sir is um just seeking Direction on the use of the funds um there's two choices one is just leave the current method as defined in the marketing Support Program criteria where the tourism development office would do the marketing or number two allow applicants to choose between marketing support um provided by the tourism development office or they could get direct reimbursements for allowable expenses questions for Peter on this item Peter I heard from the I mean I I think in the workshop which in my mind was productive hearing from everyone that you know there's a differing opinion on that I heard I think an equal number of people say that they appreciate that the TDC does the marketing on their behalf because they're not marketing professionals um you know they're they they're event professionals but then also heard people say that we you know it's not the marketing so much we're trying to deal with things like uh the cost of providing um day of event police and traffic control and those sorts of things so I'm sympathetic to that it would be uh uh my preference that probably number two would be a good would be a good fit um do you think that works for the TDC just as well we can make that work absolutely sir I think one thing nice about the TDC let me just say this that you know there should be economies of scale right when you're when you're doing these things they're doing a lot of marketing for events and so they know the things that work well the things that don't work well um where they've gotten good return on money so I would encourage all these groups to take the TDC up on that uh but Commissioners would there be a motion for the second option move we have a motion by commissioner Atkinson for option number two uh the hybrid option and we have a second by commissioner Delany clerk will call the role before we do I have just a clarification so this is to allow applicants to choose between marketing support provided by the tourist development office or direct reimburse reimbursement so they have that choice they can pick that sir yes sir sorry that wasn't clear that's okay okay clerk will call the rooll commissioner Delaney yes commissioner Alman yes commissioner Atkinson yes Vice chair Goodson yes chairman Felton yes we'll show that passes 5 Z thank okay all right Peter good job I to and commissioner is this is your you want to introduce this item sure okay all right you're recognizing thank you um so I wanted to bring forward the idea of um having all of your participation in a speakup Bard uh Workshop right now um when I checked last last night there are 46 um submissions to this and uh one of the things that is very important to me is trying to get the public back engaged in our government and this program showcases that and the more that we can bring the public in and give them a sense of ownership of the decisions and choices that are made um in this building I think the better I think it's going to help with our public trust issues I think it's going to help um you know bring the community back together and uh you know that's something that I'm very passionate about and uh so I have the dates on here for February 18th or February 27th at 5:00 and uh I was hoping to get some support on um this public engagement um Workshop are there questions of the sponsor yes commissioner Goodson for question is it true that uh staff has 120 days to review these yes okay will staff be ready by February the 18th if they have 120 days with uh my intention for this is not necessarily to get the staff's uh recommendation it's more so to give us the um a fuller better understanding from the people who are doing the proposing um of their item and then that way too I feel like the staff can get a fuller understanding as well while they're making their recommendations help me understand is it true this that these people come before the board they plead their case staff reviews it and then says well it's uh in policy 103 it's already being performed so what better under understanding could we have other than staff researching them studying them and telling telling us about them maybe there's um even if something is already going on within our uh within our policies it could bring something else to light that maybe isn't quite working uh well or it could be expanded or restricted um there's like I said this is this is about engaging the public and getting more public input to what we're doing do your constituents come to your office and complain about issues uh complain and you know have great suggestions all of that yeah okay good you know why don't you have a town hall meeting with your constituents and then bring back your findings to the board I would I talk to my constituents on a regular basis you know and I have Town Halls that you know I'm working on scheduling um but this program uh and this Workshop really was inspired by you commissioner Goodson last year when you um you know proposed this I really didn't know I was going to be inspired to have numerous Town Halls every time you turn around for issues that our County staff should work on and come back to us but that's okay a question commissioner ainson for a question um commissioner Delaney do you expect that um all of the people all the applicants will be bringing everything before us are we going to give staff a chance to like weed out some of the things we just don't have any control over at this point I'm open to that suggestion of weeding out the things that um that we have no control over and um yeah so I'm I'm definitely open to that any other questions for the sponsor I don't think we have cards those are on J how how uh how long do you to think a workshop I mean I I think it helps Commissioners to have a Time certain kind of situation when you're talking about a workshop sure we could um I think our our standard workshops are about usually two to three hours so I'm I'm fine like I said this is um I'm pretty open to what the rest of the board is uh willing to do even if this is kind of a trial run to see if this is something we'd like to continue doing every year um okay so you would propose possibly a three-hour workshop on this issue sure okay commissioner Alman sir what type of day what time of day are you proposing I originally suggested 5:00 that way people people can be off of work and whatnot but um if you know I'm like I said I'm open to that to changing that time really whatever makes this work for for the board well I would prefer evening okay and that make it more available by the public to the working public for sure commissioner would you consider uh taking the list pairing it down and then coming back to the next Commission meeting giving the list of items so that Commissioners could sort of make a more informed um decision on this sure are you open to that there any other thoughts on that okay I I think he could get it I I think we're we're getting somewhere okay um okay all right Let's uh you're you're going to bring that back to to another and it also closes right in a few days I understand on the1 31st so you'll have an idea uh what what the total is okay thank you board okay very good all right good job on that one okay we're going to go on to J J one one and we don't okay Virginia you have to explain this to us what we're going to do today good morning Commissioners this is appointments to the sa IR new Lagoon citizen oversight committee um sort of like the tourism item uh that went before this it's a multi-step um requested action three-step corre uh requested action so um the first is to consider confirming the appointments of applicants selected by the league of cities the second request is to rank the remaining candidates for filling the board's vacancies um read those selections allowed for the public record uh I will tally them and bring them back to the the chair while you proceed with your agenda um and then later in this meeting you can consider those uh tallied r rankings and appointment consider appointment of the top ranked candidates I'll tell you what before we get into this how about we take a five minute break um and we'll we'll just sort of start that again because this might take a a little bit of time in the next one okay five five minutes everybody thank you e we're we're going to get started here ladies and gentlemen gentlemen we're on J1 we're on J1 Virginia you're again recognized sorry about that good morning again all right this is appointments to the save our engineer Lagoon citizen oversight committee it's a three requested actions three steps um first consider confirming appointment of the applicants selected by the league of cities for their vacancies and then rank candidates to fill the county seats for your vacancies and then I will tally those rankings and bring them back to the chair for the board to consider appointment of the top ranked candidates and I have um blank rank ranking Sheets if anybody needs extra blank sheets we don't have cards on this issue um no I think we're going to the the process is they'll go down roll call um I think we're going your ranks are well I think eventually they know who who you voted for so a little it makes a little difference I we're we're yeah absolutely okay uh okay F first of all are there questions for Virginia yes okay go ahead and question so in the um in the agenda item it says that Kurt Smith that the league of cities um wants to appoint Kurt Smith for the vacant seat for the economics fin member yes so okay and then what was my other question all right I think I'm okay on that thank you and and if you can see in the in the yellow column there those are I I kind of missed that the other day the as asterisk there are the league of cities choices that's what that's what they voted for so simply on that sheet um you know if you want you can accept their um recommendations so um okay commissioner ainson commissioner delini can you just repeat what you were asking about Kurt Smith to make sure I followed you if you don't mind sure um when I originally looked at this I was um I didn't realize that Kurt Smith was being selected for by the league of cities for that position where we're responsible for the alternate I didn't either so thank you for clarifying that sure I suppose Virginia we we do this in a couple pieces and then some of these people if they're selected say from the space coast League of cities um uh slots then then they're out for consideration on the other sheet is that fair correct so action one is to consider appointment of the following applicants selected by the league of cities okay Kurt Smith who is the current alternate um for economics and finance they would like to promote him from the board's non- voting seat to their voting member seat um Richard Bankhead they would like him appointed for the vacant new Lagoon Commerce voting member seat Kimberly Newton they would like to promote her from the board's current alternate seat to the League's vacant voting member seat and Nick sanzon for the league of cities vacant science alternate seat and then you have okay all right Commissioners what's your pleasure on the league of cities appointments commissioner ainson I move to approve their appointments okay we have a motion by commissioner Atkinson we have a second by commissioner Alman for the league of cities appointments clerk will call the RO commissioner Delaney yes commissioner Alman yes commissioner ainson yes Vice chair Goodson yes chair felter yes okay Commissioners we'll show that passes 5 Z okay Virginia okay um step two is to review the applications for the remaining vacancies those are the ones listed on the board's ranking sheet the the League's appointments I put those in italics to try to make them easier to you don't need to consider them anymore because you just appointed them um so then based on the the applicants that are left to rank those uh with number one is your top pick number two is your second pick number three is your third pick uh the rest will be given a rank of four and for the public record um do the roll call with each of those rankings and I will tally them and then bring those results back to you later in the meeting okay Commissioners are there questions of Virginia on this portion of it take a few minutes to do this all right I think we'll pause here for a couple minutes wait for the Commissioners to I see I see some pencils down okay h commissioner Alman you y all set yes okay uh so we we'll do roll call Kim if you just Nicole if you'll call the roll and uh just announce your one two and three so right each C for each for each category right okay Nicole commissioner Delaney for the sign sence um I have Mark stro Aaron Adams and Frederick Goldstein for technology I have Sandra Sullivan Richard Nipper and Gary I'm so sorry Gary I don't know how to pronounce your last name um and then for ISM since there's only one choice um it uh it's Laura Lee Thompson and for Lagoon Commerce uh Steve Justice and then um Aaron Adams uh for economics and finance Steve Justice Bruce Larson Carol Spelman and then for Lagoon education Outreach advocacy um number one is stelle Bailey two is Sandra Sullivan and three is Nicholas sanzone or no I'm sorry Bruce Larson my eyes crossed on that one commissioner Alman science Donald de Richard Nipper mark Shope I say that right I think so um for technology Donald de Richard Nipper and Mark Shope tourism lle Thompson lagon Commerce Aaron Adams Steve Justice economics federick Goldstein Bruce Larson Carol Spelman do I need to give the numeric ranks on that for just the names I I think they assumed that they were one two and three I need to go back these are not necessary that way let me go back over that again is that right all all right I I need to because they're not necessary okay um Donald D number one for science number two Richard Nipper number three Mark Shope for technology number one is Richard Nipper number two is Donald de number three is Mark strope lle Thompson number one for tourism Lagoon committee number one Aaron Adams number two Steve Justice for economics number one is federick Goldstein number two is Bruce is Carol Spelman and number three is Bruce lson for Lagoon education number one is Deborah Harmon number two is Frederick Goldstein number three is stelle Bailey commissioner ainson for science number one is Donald de number two is Richard Nipper number three is Mark Shope technology number one Donald de number two Richard Nipper number three Mark strope tourism Laura Lee Thompson Lagoon Commerce number one Aaron Adams number two Steve Justice economics and finance number one Carol Spelman number two Frederick Goldstein number three Bruce Lon uh Lagoon education and Outreach number one Frederick Goldstein number two Deborah Harmon and number three stelle Bailey Vice chair Goodson uh science number one is Donald E number two is Richard Nipper number three is Mark Shope technology number one is Gary agagan I'm not sure Richard Nipper and Donald de tourism is number one Laur Lee Thompson Lagoon Commerce number one Aaron Adams number two Steve Justice economic uh Finance number one Frederick Goldstein number two Carol spilman number three Bruce lson Lagoon education number one Deborah Harmon number two Frederick ghost Goldstein number three Aaron Adams sherff elner fa science number one Donald de number two Richard Nipper number three Mark shup for technology number one Richard Nipper number two Mark sh number three Bruce Larson Laura Lee for tourism Lagoon Commerce uh Aaron Adams number one Steve Justice number two for uh economics Finance number one Frederick Goldstein number two Steve Justice and number three Bruce Larson and for Lagoon education Outreach number one stelle Bailey number two Frederick Goldstein and number three Deborah Harmon uh I guess we could yeah I guess we could turn these in is that what we need to do Virginia yes either turn them in to me and I'll come down there to the clerk I just want to check that I wrote them all down correctly and then I'll tally them so you can turn them into me or turn them into the clerk either way okay they'll end up with the clerk them okay Kim's going to bring those to you okay so that's we'll pause on J1 we'll come back to that right we'll go on to J2 thank you everybody all right we do have a couple cards on this or a few cards on this but we will uh start with Eddie and then questions okay sure ahead sir um good morning everyone um so item J2 uh this is a um seeking board Direction with regard to the request from space Florida to connect to the syes creek Wastewater um collection treatment plant um system um just to do a little recap we presented to the board at the December 3rd meeting um to kind of update the board about the request of space Florida their Dynamic and their request on how they were seeking a partnership with Bard County on utilizing the collection system in syes Creek um soon after which we shared at the December 3rd meeting um we met with uh uh delegation at space Florida on December 9th that included space Florida Bard County um EDC and um State secretaries from the state of Florida and we discussed at length about um ways we could make this work um that was concluded in essence of um you know what what would it take to make this um work and in your agenda packet you'll even see a letter dated January 10th from space Florida saying you know you know let's you know how what would what could this you know what would it take um now typically to go through a finite number it takes like months of um analysis but we've used estimation and obviously um looking at it from a conceptual side we've come up with what we feel is um an adequate number which is the 130 million that we seeking from space Florida to do the improvements needed at the syes plant in addition to some outlined conditions um that we would that we're sharing with space Florida so um for discussion purpose we're seeking direction from the board and obviously um it's a question of um you know whether we continue or not in our dialogue with space Florida and lastly let me say we have representatives from space Florida here if there's any questions let me add a couple of things um this letter was drafted because space Florida wanted an estimate uh from the county staff of what it would take to expand the Sykes Creek facility if we only looked at an expansion of the facility um we told them that um you know we would need more time to do that they needed it because of their timetable and so the due diligence that Eddie mentioned uh this is the best estimate that we could come in come up with in this short period of time if the and when I was uh when I helped draft this letter made the decision that before we even send a letter to space Florida and need to come back to the board just because of the sensitive nature of what was involved in all this and in light of the prior discussions that uh the board uh had uh when we discussed this back in December uh there's going to if in fact um this letter goes out and that's what we're looking for the board's approval so that we could honor that commitment that uh they asked for to give them some uh estimate of what it would be that's not a firm number um that is not a number that um there's a variety of contractual issues that would have to be looked at we've discussed it with the board we put it in Prior correspondence uh things about making sure that all our rate payers the board's ratee payers and utility system um are not going to be uh impacted negatively in terms of their rates uh because of the addition of space Florida that um the type of waste that comes had to be uh residential type couldn't be the Industrial Waste then that we would have very aggressive monitoring of the system all that would be stuff that we would still need to work on um if we move this forward if the board says move forward we send the letter and if they came back and said yeah we're willing to talk about it we would have to negotiate work all that out and then bring it back to the board in terms of what a real pricing would be and all the related items that I just mentioned as well as other items so I wanted to make sure that the board was clear that you know this we're bringing this because we're trying to have a fail safe uh not move forward on something that you know the board uh wouldn't have had an interest with once again we you know we we trying to do an expansion um figuring that we would have been utilizing the board would have been utilizing ing its capacity uh for uh the uh rate current rate payers and so if we were to expand the facility uh it does not eliminate the potential of what we're doing with the defense department and the Mir Grant um th those are separate uh dialogues that would happen uh at at at future time so um I just we're available to answer any questions on any of this that you might have okay Commissioners uh questions now I appreciate the space floor is here so we may have questions for you okay um you're prepared for that okay uh let's do first questions for staff are there questions for staff I have one I have two go ahead uh commissioner Goodson thank you um if it's $130 million and if they built their own plant and handled their own stuff what would the cost be to them roughly just estimate everything's an estimate um I you know there's a lot of conditions with that commissioner because obviously I don't know what their site condition is um let's assume it's perfect just assume something because are you telling me they're getting a wonderful deal I I think we're getting a I think it's a um I I I don't have a number to compare with with what regard to their cost would be wouldn't we want to know that cuz if you're you're giving them 130 million and their cost would be 300 million aren't they getting a hell of a deal yes thank you commissioner now can you tell I'm sorry go ahead sir can I help you out on that one just quick CU I I will tell you I went up to the meeting with space Florida and we're sitting around uh you know the big table and just started to add up the things that they would have to do and of course in full disc closure here Ed he doesn't have all of the factors we don't know everything up there but we very quickly got to a number that was something like close to a quarter of a billion dollars so they're getting a hell of a deal it's correct it it's it's they've sat there 70 years and all of a sudden they're getting a fantastic deal I think the rational Choice the rational choice for them is is hooking up to Sykes Creek no that's our choice well they want to do it because if it's 700 million I'd want to do it for 13 2 okay but that's me the Lesser cost option for them would be that a hell of a less now another question under industrial pre-treatment each sewer account with space FL will be responsible to report Wastewater flow the prior to the connection provide uh the industrial treatment Process Equipment that will be implemented to assure no distribution in the county system if you know anything about government that's a that's a hell of a statement implemented are you telling me that's going the equipment has has to be on their site prior to them allowing one gallon to flow South yes sir and that's that's not unusual when you do an industrial pre-treatment program um part of the reason of that is because every um every location will have a different Dynamic there would be reporting and this would be language that we would really tighten up with regard if we proceeded to an agreement form um the the protocol is if there is any kind of disruption at the treatment plant the reason too why we do that is uh there would be sampling points that we could go and actually do grab samples to see if there was any um um you know basically who the culprit is okay chair May one more for a question yes sir what happens if it if it is contaminated Industrial Waste and it's in the line headed to the Sewer PL on Maron what do you bring in trucks and pump it out and take it back up there and give it to them what do you do so we would continue to uh we would continue to treat it as best we could we would um obviously dispose of it through the Deep injection well and again when we um this would be language with regard to if we proceeded in an agreement form we would talk about repercussions um of any violations that would occur now don't you get chair I'm sorry chair may I have another another one go ahead sir don't you get fined by the D the minute they say something is bad in that sewage yes sir we would get a consent order go ahead you you would have to have indemnification language from space Florida for any violations that occurred okay I think that's it for now other questions for staff are there are there questions for I have a question I'm so sorry okay commissioner is there a way to guarantee that we know um if and when there were a problem with the Industrial Waste is there is there a way um after it leaves space floor to land and heads to merid Island um how do we prove that it's them so it's it's all about you know the the the first the first symptom is when we see A disruption at the treatment plan and obviously The Operators would know if there was something biological occurring as soon as that occurs we have we would have a protocol set up where uh grab samples at any known industrial pre-treatment site would occur um that's why uh we you know it was outlined in the letter about every facility having it rather than a common um because if you do it as a common then it's hard to Define like which of the accounts would it occur so that's how we um you know we could you know when we go through the agreement we can talk about there's there's there's sampling when An Occurrence occurs but there's still sampling when An Occurrence doesn't occur and we would to define the frequency um and we would use those as pre you know preventative measures is there a way that we could be the ones to choose who does the testing uh that could be terms in the agreement yes thank you any other questions for Edie are there questions for space Florida I love okay um Mike Dale somebody both of you avable okay Dale Commissioners D cat space Florida I live at 1175 Shady Lane merid Island Florida lifelong bardian question questions for Dale or yeah i' love to have how do you feel about the letter have you read the letter yes uh it's exactly what we wanted we asked the county give us a price we've said from the very beginning put it in writing numerous times we have a need for a additional wastewater treatment plant to continue to grow the cape um we have absolutely no expectation that anybody other than us will pay for that additional impact um we have resources Tallahassee and Washington are both very anxious to see this happen because this is a national imperative to continue to grow the cape um and we're you know we're ready to negotiate the issues of industrial Wastewater uh any sort of contamination there are hundreds of wastewater treatment facilities across the country this is not a problem that is unique to bavard County I'm not a technical person in Wastewater um but I can assure you that all of these issues are easily addressable are addressed at hundreds of locations around the country and we are more than happy to negotiate an agreeable package with the county to get this done great commissioner Atkinson had light before you sir that's commissioner ainson thank you um so a crisis of yours has become ours what are we doing what are your thoughts on when this reaches capacity do you guys have a plan for what you're doing after this doesn't work anymore well we've been working with a number of people for a long time on a broader Regional approach and and we're particularly excited about that because that brings in even more other people's money from Tallahassee and Washington to address a challenge we we consider ourselves part of bouard County the um the fact that the federal government has not kept up sufficiently to accommodate the commercial growth is a challenge for all of us uh but in their defense I don't think anybody expected the commercial space industry to Blossom the way it has um so we're you know it's it's a challenge it can be addressed it's you know it's not on fire yet but if we don't do anything it will be but this is all manageable the schedules that can work right now will work and we're anxious to move forward I hope that answers your question is that a old light commissioner Delan I was just waiting my turn okay M um I had a question about uh the cost of this and if it turns out to be much more expensive is there is there room in the contract that will be um presented to us eventually um actual costs versus estimated costs I I I would anticipate that would very much be a part of the negotiations with the county I think you would find if you look at what the prices that are being paid for similar facilities throughout the State of Florida right now there's lots of margin in that money right um but again that's part of the negotiation that's what we want to do with the county is sit down and and move forward to make this work thank you commissioner rman I I um I know we looking at launch schedules and Incredibly exciting opportunities are about to move to the cap I would assume that we didn't include the possibility of NASA moving its headquarters to Kennedy Space Center or would would would that growth be included in these numbers uh we could accommodate that because again NASA headquarters it's a federal bureaucracy so most of the waste coming out of that building is going to be domestic which is exactly what a wastewater treatment facility needs okay um we can again we can adjust for that we are pursuing that as per the governor's directive uh we were looking at that even in advance um but again these are all problems that can be managed this is nothing out of the ordinary thank you chair commissioner good no was that new light okay he just didn't hit this commissioner gson um known you a long time and it's really I find it interesting that you're not familiar with waste water but you're an expert on BS I I am a philosophy major so yes we now can you tell me in 70 years NASA did nothing no planning for 70 years since the 50s on NASA had its own wastewater treatment facility for the Apollo program and it's no longer they decided it was easier to just ship it all over to space force station now chair now you have the two richest men in the world MH okay and they can't build their own sewer plan uh that's uh certainly a possibility but it would be again because we are part of Bard County and it is an opportunity for additional other people's money to go into facilities it would be better to be dealing with this in our opinion as a regional effort to grow the Community collectively because it's much bigger than Wastewater okay chairman one more and I'll leave him alone I'll leave him alone I guess you are aware there's a federal law that says you can't tax federal land okay land tax but you can tax structures yes sir okay and last year I think uh I don't know blue origin them paid and SpaceX about $6 million half of it went to the school board and half went to the county is that correct Frank something like that something close to that something close that okay so therefore uh thank you for that little bit of input but be careful on how you say you're part of Bard County because you know here's what I'm going to say too Bor best time in our life to put some of the North merid Island water back on NASA make that a condition too because they are adamant they don't even want to talk to us about helping drain into a ditch that was there prior to NASA's existence so if you don't get them now you'll never get them so you can sell that sir we aren't NASA NASA is its own you have the tie-ins you have the technical you know we have responsibility for the overall Cape canaval Spaceport our jurisdiction and our ethical and responsibility is for the management of the whole system which includes everybody outside cuz everybody works on no one lives at KFC or the Space Center they all work in if you want us to handle your poop then you handle some of the water on North Maron and I would make that a contingency okay we we would be happy to try to work with NASA on that because we we we have tried to help I think before with that thank you so much Mr kch than you commission you basically said nothing that's why you're good at  okay got a degree in it yes sir commissioner Delaney Frank I would like that to add really best time we could ever make it come to the table I just wanted to ask uh for the Public's sake if there were a an issue with the Industrial Waste that came from um from space Florida lands um it says something in here about penalties but from what we've seen in the past of penalties that sometimes is very little compared to the damage that's done so can I would like to see in this in the in the final contract something that um not only says that space Florida would have to fix the problem but then unfortunately also penalties um for having for County deal with all of that and so is that something that space Florida would be okay with I have to think in negotiating this again I would default to the fact that this is not a unique problem there are hundreds of other facilities across the country that deal with similar problems I have to think there is a mechanism and existing template uh and best practices for addressing just that need and we we want to make sure that our agreement with the county is something you guys are happy with because you know there's more to all of the this growth that's occurring out there than just Wastewater so we're looking at this as a long-term partnership because again Bard county is Bard County because of what's going on out there and we want to continue to see that growth be beneficial to everybody right so so good solid Agreements are a big part of making sure that happens in the future great and um I would also like to mimic what commissioner Goodson said I think that the storm water issue is um equally as important to our res um as this Wastewater issue so that I hope we'll be a big part of this conversation that that that again that that's a NASA issue we we we're not the landlords out there we can't give you access to canals that are on theirs we understand the problem uh we would like to help and we will continue but uh uh I I can't comment about something that isn't our responsibility well out to the to the universe out there who's listening to this I hope that NASA is willing to come to the table and talk to us about this I hope so too we will certainly encourage them to do so thank you commissioner good say something just real quick um um going to meet with our new Congressman um here soon and um and I'll mention that okay about the storm the storm water um in Meritt Island okay and if anybody else is going to meet with with him before he goes up uh we we'll do that too um certainly um sir I do have a question for you since um you're here you know we had this this date uh that you wanted from us February 1st that we make a decision and um I think I I asked uh when I was up there at space Florida um if you're pursuing a an appropriation from the legislature so I just have to assume since we've given you sort of a list uh what you asked for and staff came up with and I understand it because if I were sitting in a committee room and uh during Appropriations I'd need to defend uh that kind of amount of money is is that what you anticipate this legislative session making that that kind of ask uh yes we anticipate making a significant ask of the legislature to move this forward okay all right because they have expressed an interest in doing helping as well you've not seen a big ask like that yeah we we're transparent I uh commissioner Delany thank you um just while we're talking about this conversation I just wanted to put it out there that uh I've received a lot of concerns from um my community about the potential of a regional plant and and I just kind of wanted to put it on the record that before that is decided there's going to be a lot of public input there's going to be a lot of conversation and negotiation and all of that um and that's not the only option moving forward as well so you know I I just wanted to put that out there and you know if you wouldn't mind saying your piece about that too so that we have both sides on the record saying you know for the for the public I I I guess the best way to approach that is there have been numerous efforts led by others than us to address long-term wastewater treatment issues which confront every community and certainly here in Bard County particularly North Bard as I understand it and the concept of that advanced Regional wastewater treatment facility uh was part of studies and things of that nature it was conceptual at best because it was a very first step in in learning that and we're happy to continue to participate in whatever looks like it's best for everybody um we like I said commissioner Goodson might not think we're in Bard but we do um I think if the goal is our responsibility is is a vibrant thriving commercial space Port that happens because people are living outside the fence and are happy and are working and are living uh having a good environment a good Community is absolutely essential because keeping the talent that's necessary to continue to grow this you have to have a good quality of life so you have to have clean water you know a healthy River good housing all of that is a part of what we see as our responsibility I hope that makes sense thank you and I hope that our state and federal partners are listening to this and and hear this because this is a um this this is uh very strategic for our national security um it's for the Space Race for all of these great things that we're doing here um but we can't forget the people who live here absolutely and I we will be the first ones in the door in Tallahassee and Washington making that case Mr Goodson yes can you tell me what is your appropriation request it was nebulous I think it was about 75 million that's all out of you know so therefore you're going to Pony up 65 it it was I I I guess the best way to explain it is it was a placeholder okay and then what do you think you're going to request the full amount I I'll be honest with you I I don't want to answer that because it will be a decision collectively um out of the audience came one word transparency um well I don't know I I can't tell you what I don't public record soon sir I don't know no disrespect yes but very very soon it will be a public record once it has a bill number it becomes absolutely no I mean I I just don't know myself it's got to happen quickly because let me jump in because in Dale's defense Mike Miller work with space forward vice president external Affairs government uh yeah so what we're working on right now is this number that you're providing to us and then what we're going to do is we're going to work with the governor's office and the legislature to whether it's a 75 million or 130 million or even more we have not determined that until we had this conversation so we need to have this I know we're getting up against the deadline for the the filing but we also have the governor's recommended budget we also have the opportunity to work with both House and Senate leadership and the Department of Transportation and commerce and even education because that's part of the one of the secretaries that came to our meeting we want to collectively make this a a group effort not only for Wastewater but for the entire community so that the ask itself is still being made chair yes sir you know I I understand everything you said sounds great but if you were to ask for $160 million of our taxpayers money for other stuff we desperately need like roads Bridges stuff like that in this County would you find that strange from the two richest men in the world well commissioner I can't speak to the two richest men in the world but I can speak to the state's priorities and space is one of the state's priorities and so we are looking at this as an industry that we want to lead the world in as as commissioner Delaney said this is National Security this is the opportunity for us to go uh further than we ever thought and we can do that only in one place in the United States of America that's right here thought Texas was kind of good too but not not not better than Bard no we we we surpass them okay thank you chair thank you very let's make sure we all follow the budget yes we we'll be watching it understand those of us who worked up there will be watching it very closely all right uh is that it for the question you have one more no Gerald Gerald set I'm curious can it come out of a a committee or is it have to have a has to have a sponsor it would have to have a sponsor in both in both Chambers who's your as matter of fact commissioner may I so we don't this is not we're not in the position where we're actually sponsoring a a legislative ask at this point no this is our conversation right now is to go back per the meeting we had uh in uh December to talk to all of our agencies and then talk to the legislature and collectively figure out that's why Dale's when you asked Dale that question he was not sure where because we have to find out not only are we going to do it through an agency bud budget the governor's recommended budget and then the legislature so that chopping up if you will of the ask is still to be determined and so that that's what we're doing right now and then yes we will have to have a bill sponsor both in the house and the Senate and we have lots of friends in the legislature not only in this community but around the state they care about Aerospace so I do feel like that's still to be determined and we will like like chair feltner said that's going to be something interesting to watch but we're going to work very hard to make sure we get that number that's that's why we needed the number by February 1st it gives us the opportunity to be creative because clearly Tallahassee this is very important we'll figure out the clever way to make it happen commissioner I would just say this is a a beautiful example of government working together and I really appreciate the work space Florida's done and the staff on a project that's probably one of the most exciting things that ever happened to to Florida I I think a lot of the budget numbers will have to be flushed out because rate payers and users will pay for the probably the vast majority of of this Revenue Stream So determining how much the users such as SpaceX or blue or NASA or whoever they will be paying rates and it will have to be rates that are fair to the people of Florida people have Bard so I imagine there's going to be a lot of a lot of work on these budget numbers and it could be a it could be I assume it could be a member project or it could come out of a state agency as well part of a bigger pit picture what I'm hearing this is this is going right up to the top this is a national priority this is a national security priority as well as a going to come out of the Commerce uh package I feel pretty confident of that and if I could commissioner and Senator representative you know better than all of us up here uh that process so I do believe that it is is a multi-step process that we're going to use the agencies we're going to use the legislature we're going to use our our friends and to your point chair Goodson or commissioner Goodson we are going to it is a rate payer situation out there as well and so what whatever uh space expl origin or any space entity is going to be using in terms of Industrial Waste Water cleaning it getting it to to the facility at Sykes Creek clean that is going to be their responsibility regardless of the cost so I do feel like there will be participation at all levels okay any other questions for space FL we do have a few cards all right we're going to go to the cards gentleman thank you thank you Sandra Solin yes sir Sandra Sullivan s Patrick Shores so as a business analyst the first thing I look at when I read this all the costs are estimated I mean this is a a dart at at best at this point it's a guesstimate and so you're going to go and you're going to get legislation you're going to get money to come in and you don't know the actual number these guys are talking about OPM other people's money tax money okay but the fact is that they have been irresponsible and I've read I've done records requests for the blue origin contract it is right in there they're talking about potentially future use of our Bard County uh uh utilities so this has been in their mind for a long time and coming here and pretending that this is this is uh you know an urgent thing when you got to build and make all these changes to that plant and to build a pipe to to your facility they could build their own and you know what catches me is catch them here after a previous meeting saying oh it's not really industrial Wastewater so you don't have any control over what they're doing on the other side you don't have control over what you're going to be dealing with and you have no way to pay for that as a business analyst I just say you know this is a bad deal let's talk about the big secret the big secret in Bard county is that you know taxes aren't paid comment was made oh it's federal land they don't take pay taxes well actually I've looked at federal law and when you lease it to private entities including military DOD land then those entities pay the reality here is space Florida is an independent special district which means they are a taxing district they choose not to Levy any taxes and that's what's created this problem let's use OPM let's put it on the P let's put it on ultimately the taxpayers are footing this bill not the two richest men in the world and you'll have no control and no way for them to pay until they Pony up and they start doing some taxation um this is from the blue origin about how they don't pay taxes they don't even pay taxes they do this this this deal let's talk about what is coming I'm wearing a American flag and an eagle for a reason America First this is Airbus coming this is the secret deal for 1. $1.8 billion that's coming here and there's going to be a lot more growth that you're not even figuring out how that's going to get paid and this company's largely owned by France and Germany and I suspect building the satellites like what was just launched for UAE China's friend UAE coming here and going to be building satellites launching from here how about we have two tax rates we have one for America First and we have one for these foreign entities coming here on American territory and expecting the rate payers here in Bard County to pick up and pay for the the uh uh uh infrastructure needed thank you thank you Jack rman Miss I'm sorry uh commissioner Delan um I just had a comment um I didn't know if maybe staff could uh start looking into uh kind of that America first uh argument of Are We promoting American businesses here in Bard you know what are we doing in that respect i' I'd really love to um to investigate that thank you okay Mr rman hi Jack rman North Merit Island homeowners association and I'm also with the north Mar Island special dependence District board first off I like to say that SpaceX NASA and blue origin they're not good neighbors everything they've built out there they push their flood water their storm water South to mirid Island goes all to Pine Island Road and started to flood them again goes to Broad acres and after the last two hurricanes those folks couldn't get to their home unless they had a four-wheel truck so uh the history is that they're not looking out after the needs of the citizen or North Mar Island and the $130 million um I think there ought to be a line in there that says all cost all cost if it goes above $130 million we have all cost in there then that'll that'll make them uh worry about what what they're going to spend and then it uh I took a look at their letter that they sent us and I quote space Florida will be responsible to report with with industry or what Industrial Waste will flow and they will do the the monitoring so now we're letting the the fox guard the hen housee they're going to tell us what kind of Industrial Waste they're pumping to us you know I I'm I'm not real comfortable with that then it says can Merit Island can we take all this waste from NASA um you know we have a 2,000 ft deep injection well that go goes below the a AER and if any of that Industrial Waste gets there it'll go below the aaer 2o uh I guess really the last thing I have is that I appreciate all the effort that the County Commission uh works for the community and I'd like to note Mr alman's um discussion this morning about the Challenger disaster this is the day and the Barge Canal Bridge is named Christy McCulla Memorial Bridge and because of his long involvement with the space industry and with NASA I think he should disqualify himself for many votes on this issue because of that that I don't think he could separate his last um relationships from this very important issue thank you Darren May good morning hopefully it's still morning morning it's been a long day um hopefully I am going to represent somewhere in the middle for this um just real quick background extremely quick is uh grew up here went to school fit worked here I've worked in the space industry um actually being involved with most of the environmental compliance and permitting for these facilities we're talking about um we've been involved with as my career I've been involved with all the construction aspects the design reviews all the things you had to go through with us so I've been through this uh many times many discussions for this um just to clearly state I'm no longer working for them I'm not speaking for anybody I'm speaking on my own behalf as a citizen growing up here and uh I like to try to see about try to get us more in the balance of the middle of trying to find Solutions we know we're going to have to deal with things but we have a lot of things to deal with um I I know I'm not going to have enough time I'm going to try to run through real quick but I wanted to just hit a few points in the letter that you have proposed and a lot of it has to come down with the flow I mean just real quickly the historical flows we've had at the cape and as public record it's been roughly about 5 to 600,000 gallons per day that's for both Kennedy and Cape that was also shuttle era to now okay so the mounts we're talking about going from that .27 to7 it does seem rather large you know for the percent that we're talking about of existing utilities so that does lead to the question again how much of that could be potentially industrial Wastewater again um there's a lot of industrial Wastewater components won get into that it's too much to get to but um so the the flows and all that stuff has to be addressed and I think it's something that definitely the public should be involved with and that as M miscellany has mentioned before um about the ownership for the lift stations is there going to be easements things like that rways how's that property going to be coming through because again if spills happen things occurred uh back to again how you going to basically trace it back to it now one of the recommendations in here is about metering based on water which is a typical thing for a city this is a different environment working at the cape you know the cape's a different different animal it is special here in vanderberg are two different completely different animals it's not a normal flow not Donal it doesn't act the same way it's stair steps that's why we plan you know to do those kind of things um I'm probably just not going to have enough time to go over all the things because I could hit every single topic you guys have talked about I really would like to do that my suggestion is to have that public input I think there needs to be if not a workshop a poster session in between this and making a final decision so you can get a lot of this input cuz we have a lot of people in the community that worked in this industry I do have one example I wanted to give to you guys as an option which is a potential for doing the agreement is you don't necessarily always have to have a gigantic plant to do this stuff and I'm always been a big fan of decentralized wastewater treatment one option is to have that treatment and there's one example that's called Hassel on E which is in Portland Oregon done 2015 real quick that it uh basically has an agreement that they hook to the city of sewer but for sewer connection but they have zero discharge and they do an on-site for four block section for their their Commerce area and if I could just finish real quick I'm almost done um just and what it basically is an agreement with they have they have a connection to sewer but it's for basically maintenance and emergency the incentive they put on that basically was to put basically an incentive that if you don't discharge you got credits back they were able to get millions of dollars of credit as an incentive for that company to come in and do the extra work we don't have a lot of incentives for a commercial to do that kind of stuff when we're doing things like this so there's ways to put that incentive in front to dangle the carrot to basically say you can maybe have a connection but can we reduce it but I think we need to definitely look at volumes and talk about the constituents for that and I do have copies if I could possibly pass it out to everybody just for that just for reference um thank you sir my chief of staff is sitting right over there would you mind giving her your contact information thank you all right sir okay Commissioners that was the end of the cards we're in discussion remember we're being asked to just approve the letter today that's going to space Florida so discussion on the item commiss commissioner delen uh I don't really have um more discussion on this item other than I just wanted to put it out there negotiation and final contract um will have board participation and final decision on the contract yes so nothing will be um accepted without all of our input without public input and a totally transparent uh situation going on agreed thanks for pointing that out I was going to say pretty much the same thing but you said it better okay other other discussion is there a motion to approve the draft letter motion to approve the draft letter okay okay we have a motion by commissioner Atkinson is there a second second we have a second by commissioner delini clerk will call the rle commissioner Delaney yes commissioner Alman yes commissioner ainson yes Vice chair Goodson yes chair feltner yes we'll show that approved 5 Z thank you Commissioners very much we will move into I think I see Billy making his way up here go back to results I think commission uh Virginia is going to come up afterward I believe Commissioners we're on j3 Billy sir you recognized uh good good morning chair the this is actually commissioner Del's item out of district one I'm here to answer any questions and respond to any any issues okay commissioner delini you want to sort of introduce your item sure okay um as everybody's aware our impact fees haven't been updated in many years and so I just felt like uh it's important to get this ball rolling um if this is something the board decides to look at because there's quite a lengthy process of getting this done so the sooner the better that we could get to the um to a better place um we my opinion is is that growth doesn't happen forever eventually we will be completely built out and this is um this is the time to get us to a better place in my opinion and I've asked Billy if you don't mind to um just do a short little presentation about where we are where where we came from all that kind of stuff as far as uh impact fees go I'd be happy to commissioner so Bard County last uh uh conducted an impact fee study in 2015 at a cost of about $164,000 that study was not limited to Fire and EMS it also included Transportation Correctional education and libraries in addition to EMS and fire um in September of 2016 the board accepted that impact fee study but retained the then current uh fee schedule in other words it did not act on that study's findings instead it in instituted 100% of the of the the previous 2001 rates so that's where we remain today as far as the EMS and fire rates uh they were last amended in 2001 the reason the board did that at the time was the moratorium on impact fees and this during the same discussion that was lifted so I I believe the board did not feel like it was appropriate to increase the fees at the same time was it was um lifting the moratorium so that leads us to where we are today if the board work to consider um increasing it any impact fees including Fire EMS it would have to do a study first because this our current data is more than four years old which is the threshold uh in the statute the statute lays out numerous benchmarks and the statute I'm referring to is known as the Florida impact fee act um it lays out numerous benchmarks when increasing fees for example if used to justify a fee fee increase the study must be adopted within one year of initiation of the study so it's really something to keep in mind it's there's a very strict timeline that goes along with these impact fees there's two processes for increase the impact fee one I I'm going to call the normal approval process that's required to be done in increments depending on the the amount of the increase but I'll note at the outset I'm about to talk about uh 25% 50% and over 50% but if the study only justifies a certain percentage that's always going to be you're not too exceed rate but assuming a study has uh verif supports an increase of an impact fee the impact fee cannot be more than 25% um if it's done up to 25% it has to be done in two equal increments over two years if it's between 25 and 50% it has to be within four increments now gener generally the statute says quote an impact fee increase may not exceed 50% of the current impact fee rate however it does provide for another process which I'm about I'll call the extraordinary approval process it's kind of a a second track assuming the study justifies that the increase increase of more than 50% is necessary you have to have adopted the study within one year the study must expressly demonstrate the extraordinary circumstances necessitating the need to to exceed those those time frame limitations as well as the cost limitations that I just spoke about there would have to be two publicly noticed workshops and importantly it would have to be approved by a super majority vote that's for any increase over 50% some other considerations that the board may want to consider is that taken together once a stop once a study is adopted it's good uh for one year to justify an increase over 50% and four years to justify increases below 50% impact fees cannot be used to fund previously approved projects and impact fees can only be used to fund the acquisition construction or Improvement of capital facilities that has a rational Nexus to new construction thank you questions for Billy commissioner Delany I just wanted to um make it clear that I understand this correctly all of our rates except for the Schoolboard rate um are from 2001 uh I believe solid waste and utilities I would separate from that all the other rates including Transportation yes okay thank you commissioner ainson Billy can you tell me um the study that was done in 2015 um that we didn't end up going with how much did that cost the county about $165,000 so can we assume that if we did this study it would cost what it would be speculation but I'm I would I would say you know double might be might be an estimate that I would throw out there okay thank you and is that for all of the fees or is that just the fire and EMS uh that was all the fees including educational commissioner I did go back and look at and tried to break out what EMS and fire would have been under that scope of services and include the general thing and the best I could come up was was 50,000 whether that firm would have taken that job for 50,000 I don't know but that if you break out that cost it would have been about 50,000 thank you I asked a similar question in my briefing about uh if you do the study does it cover all the fees so at least you'd be able to have that information um at the end of that so I think that was staff's sort of position then um okay any other commissioner are we on questions okay are are are there any other questions because we do we do have a couple cards I got one chair okay sir thank you if they had adopted it in 215 two 2015 how much money would it have raised you can be close I I ain't going to hold you to it that might be a better question for Mr denninghoff here I I really don't know what the because the board never wound up adopting it I don't know what the rates what the study could have Justified and the reason for not adopting it do you know yeah the board discussion at the time was there was a more in place it was kind of coming out of the Great Recession so to speak and so the board rather than lifting the moratorium and at the same time increasing rates chose to go back to the previous rate and did I understand you chair May did I understand you correctly to say the funds that it raises cannot be used other than for new construction was that was that correct New Capital facilities related to the new the impact of the new construction related to the impact of the new construction so what what does that mean well are very specific things that impact fees can be used or it's highly restrictive for example what it means you could not use it for um salaries or or maintaining existing equipment and things like that right thank you sir any question sure for a question um it's my understanding that this is for um if if the board decided to go with the whole study and for all of the different areas um rather than just fire an EMS if we decided to um go with an increased rate that could go to roads it could go to Wastewater it could or I'm sorry um uh solid waste all these different things that would that talk about growth and the impacts of the growth yeah each fund is treated individually so if the study justifies any of those individual impacts then the board would have that option thank you there's no more questions we do have two cards okay sander Sullivan SRA so Patrick Shores so first of all going back to 2016 when it came before the board uh where we were at we had growth higher than the pre-boom and at the time just so you have a number the transportation fee was recommended to increase for a single family home by 60 7% pretty significant um we have kicked this can down the road uh for so long for decades while we've had increases in transportation in some years 30% higher for asphalt paving Etc uh we've had a lot of inflation um and it essentially the fiscal crisis that the the county is largely in now is due to kicking the cost of growth down the road and it's uh it's coming to rear it's really ugly head uh at this time with more than a billion dollars in transportation deficit uh you know billions in infrastructure um etc etc uh Bard's pretty poor in many respects I just look at your buildings uh so but pertaining to this particular item my recommendation would be to move forward with only a fire and EMS at this time because as a small study this one could be completed quick more quickly with others I would recommend a full study for all of them um I want to just draw some information pertaining to fire and EMS specifically when we were looking at the 1998 referendum for the fire and EMS uh uh for countywide EMS the recommendation by the study at that time was to raise the the $38 for EMS to $35 to bring it uh to be comparable to the surrounding areas so it's been a long time so when you look at the county we're bringing in about $100 for fire and EMS um and um here's Le County which is slightly larger than us with $766 as a comparison the problem we're facing is in in 2021 we had a 33% increase at that time we anticipated in 2025 that the cost of growth would be $6 million in 22 we were $620,000 as a cost to growth and predict in last year's budget for 2025 to 2028 is predicted at 30 million now we're up to 48 million and if we don't get ahead of this growth we have very substantial tax increases coming to Bard County residents we would not be what's happened with our fire budget is we had a 33% increase in our fire assessment that was sold to us to address and bring those wages to be comparison and so much of that has gone to to addressing growth and not to addressing the promise that was made at that time so I hope you'll move forward with this thank you Diana Johnson hi I'm Diana Johnson I live on mered island uh the firefighters and paramedics have been there for me and my family many times every time I needed them they came quick this County needs to pay them accordingly you talk about keeping your talent let's keep this Talent we need this Talent thank you thank you ma'am okay Commissioners uh discussion on this item and I and I think the the action here would be that we would direct staff potentially to put out a request for uh a quote right for a study yeah procurement RFP okay okay we're in discussion commissioner delen thank you um I'm not sure if if you all had the chance to look at some of the attachments that I put on here it's just some of the uh the uh other counties impact fees and what they look like um St Lucy County actually put together this nice little chart that made it really easy to look at out of these 22 counties um in the study that St Lucy did we are the third lowest the 20th out of 22 um counties and uh when the formatting happened this got kind of messed up but this chart St Lucy county is not supposed to be um factored into this average the average um the average fee for all these counties including St Lucy's new revised um fee is $400 and we're at $93 and so um these impact fees could go towards uh firehouses ambulances fire trucks freeing up money for salaries and we're down last I heard was six ambulances so this money is desperately needed for the growth of our community to be able to to serve our people um with a standard level of service and I'm just going to make the pitch also for our other impact fees we have um a major deficit when it comes to our road infrastructure and our needs for our transportation and so um my first choice I would love to do an impact fee study for everything but if what we could do today would be um fire and EMS I that would be okay too with me thank you other discussion Frank FC reaching for your mic I'm just going to suggest if the board wants to look at it uh that you do comprehensive uh and look at across the board all because a lot of what you would be doing in the one and paying for the one is duplicative so why would you pay a second time um you're going to see uh when we have the workshop one of the first workshops we're going to be presenting to the board as public works and there are significant uh capacity issues we've addressed a variety of things as it deals with maintenance and we've made tremendous progress in that area capacity it's been at the cost of capacity so if the board's going to look at it I would just suggest that you might want to look at it uh a single RFP and go across the board and look at what uh the consultant can uh provide for the board so you have an idea of what the limits are of where you could go okay I I agree with that assessment okay any other discussion on this is there a motion U and in your motion you want to make it so that we look at all the fees do that yes okay if I could just um ask for motion okay go ahead if I could just ask one question about um the RFP process will uh Frank will that be just our vendors of record or will it go out to everybody it goes out to everyone and great and we will be even happy to bring it back to the board so you can see the RP you know we'll get it prepared and we can send it out and let the board see if the board has an interest in that if time is more of the Essence then you can just authorize today for us to do it when we do it we'll send it out similar to what was done in 2015 and we would um you know depending on what the board authorizes you know obviously the funding for it uh will identify that and come back to the board so whatever the board's pleasure is okay ready yep commissioner um I'd like to make a motion to go out for RFP for um our impact fees study and that's comprehensive yes comprehensive okay very good we have a motion by commissioner delini is there a second is there a second to the motion to do the RFP for impact fees okay we'll bring this up at another time okay commissioner doy would could we have discussion about that you're you're welcome to to Lobby your fellow Commissioners go ahead sure I'm I'm I'm a little surprised at this um and because of sunshine we can't talk about this outside of the public um and so I'm just curious if any of you would mind sharing what your concerns are and um you know if you have any other solutions to start combating our growth issues I personally didn't have a problem looking at this today so um but um I have to tell you as the chair it's it's not a something that I I want to start making seconds um so that's but I I think good information uh leads to good decision making so I don't have a problem with us um looking at this this summer so that's my input the when the study would come back I would um I would hope that we could get a larger crosssection of our community to get feedback before we embarked Upon A study those who were in the construction industry those who are uh working in affordable housing which has become a significant problem those who are um fighting every day to afford to get into a home a cost of housing has become serious uh I the larger economic discussion I I think it's worth looking at but I I would like to have a broader broader section of the community to give input I would have to think that this room would been filled many times over had we had a lot of different parts of our community knew that we're about to vote on a impact fee study so that's my thought second I would feel a little more comfortable if it I know I understand the benefit of looking at all the fees but I I would feel a little more comfortable if we were only looking at fire and EMS because that has been debated and discussed and it is a urgent issue that we know we have now but I think it's better we bring this at another meeting so we give ample public notice before we discuss it oh it was on the agenda in all fairness um commissioner would you would you be amendable to bring that back another date or do you want to try to amend your motion for just the fire um EMS impact fees I would like to amend my motion all right will you just say it one more time for the sake of the clerk sure I'd like to amend my motion um to go out for our uh our P for our fire and EMS impact fees okay is there a second I second that all right there's second by commissioner Alman clerk will call the role commissioner Delaney yes commissioner Alman yes commissioner ainson no Vice chair Goodson no sherff felner yes okay we'll show that passes 32 Virginia okay okay Virginia's in the Box I guess you want me to read the result of the ones that we voted on for sorl and in the science sector that's Donald dice in the technology sector that is Richard Nipper in the tourism that's Laura Lee Thompson in the lagoon Commerce that's Aaron Adams in the economics that's Frederick Goldstein and then we have a three-way tie for the Lagoon education Outreach advocacy uh alternate we have stelle Bailey Frederick Goldstein and Deborah Harmon now I think Frederick Goldstein though is in the economics right Finance area so you know he can't be elected twice right so we'll we'll remove him from consideration in the bottom part there so we have Deborah Harmon and stelle Bailey want to give each one of them up down vote is that what we ought to do how how should how should we do this everybody want to take take a moment and yeah I have extra she if you want can we just make a motion I'll tell you what we'll we'll make a motion you make your motion if it doesn't pass then then by default we'll be the other person is it is it that simple thank you you'd need a second motion if the first motion okay well we we'll all play along then at that point okay accept the the results okay commissioner uh Delaney with your motion I'd like to make a motion to appoint stelle Bailey to the advocacy alternate um is there a second for stelle commissioner opman I'd like to make a motion we appoint Deborah Harmon okay I don't think there's a second for stelle is I'll second that you'll SE second Deborah Harmon yes okay all right clerk will call the RO commissioner Delaney yes commissioner Alman yes commissioner ainon yes Vice chair Goodson yes chair felner yes congratulations to her okay everyone thank you for that we will move into board report excuse me I'm sorry I believe sorry that motion was just for the three-way tie so we still need a motion for the other five I'm sorry you didn't say that okay and um given that the the ranking was to promote Don dice who is the League's current alterate into the board's voting science seat um the league also provided a backup candidate a backfill candidate of Bruce Larson to backfill Don dice's seat so if that could be part of the board action okay so let let me clarify um Bruce Larson uh would be the the next um League um appointee and then we have uh by by our our votes uh Richard Nipper in the technology Laura Lee Thompson and tourism Lagoon Commerce uh Aon Adams and economics Frederick Goldstein and then finally Lagoon education we have Deborah Harmon is there a motion to accept all of those move to approve we have a motion by commissioner Delany is there a second second we have a second by commissioner Alman clerk will call the role on all of those commissioner Delaney yes commissioner Alman yes commissioner ainon yes Vice chair Goodson yes chair feltner yes okay very good thank you Commissioners that passes 5 Z okay now we're in board report Court no we're not I don't think we have one I I'm sorry sander I don't have it but you're welcome I thought that was unusual too Sandra Sullivan South Patrick Shores so I want to go back to the big secret about space Florida uh and the lack of Taxation one them as an independent special district and also the County's right to as the local jurisdiction and they talk about National Security and that this uh federal land is exempt under National Security the thing is not everything happening out in space Florida is National Security so whatever percentage is National Security yeah I get that that's that's an exemption but not all businesses out there are National Security and we are launching a lot of stuff for other countries particularly UAE which is is of uh concern to me so I think we need to address that they pay their fair share of taxes um I believe that the contract that that is being negotiated right now it's on bid on the county site does not have a specification other than the study done by the EDC that's not the way business is done there's no bid no specification document for that Regional sewage plan and my allegation here is that this is agenda 2030 happening right here that this contract is being parachuted for bright line which is majority owned by UAE as a toilet to tap Facility by the globalist movement America First 2010 the the property for the site planning and building permits for space Florida was done through the city of Titusville which is district one Mainland district one seems to space Florida is in District 2 on the Barrier island in the county jurisdiction not in the city of Titusville jurisdiction now why would that have happened well when you read the the space Florida agreements with blue origin just on phase two alone they brought in $7 million worth of fill you know what the consequence of that is on the flood plane hydrology study that the county did they're no longer on the flood plane interesting well that storm water on a 10-year flood plane has to go somewhere doesn't it so the 2018 small area study shows that storm water is increasing the flooding in the north Meritt Island residents so to Goodson's point I very much respect what he said the negotiation with space Florida must include taxes to address the impacts to the flood plane because it's well documented you guys are looking at litigation sit out to the table with space Florida and they need to pay their fair share of taxes because it isn't just this that they're expanding this is from the Lagoon board look they're expanding space Florida and on the flood plane very dramatically there's a lot more coming and I'm going to say that the county and in particularly one of our commissioners staff was on staff of of the County District when these uh under the table deals were made with Titusville you guys created this problem okay thank you okay board report Frank in board report I have no report Morris in board I have no report Mr chair okay commissioner Delaney in board report no report commissioner Alman commissioner Goodson none commissioner Atkinson no report okay uh we did have our first TDC meeting the other day uh with me as the chair uh it was pretty uneventful I think we had uh more discussion on picking a vice chair and uh but we talked briefly about uh some of the issues raised by the board before and we'll be revisiting some of the process that we brought up today so that'll that'll be coming in in the future and that was uh really about it for them so okay everybody thank you today I almost forgot it's 11 it's 11:59 so let's 15 minutes we'll do the executive session okay for the board okay 12:15 we'll meet the opinions expressed by any member of the public during any period of public comment do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of the board of County commissioners of Prov Bard County Florida Space Coast government television or the program sponsor and are solely those of the presenter the board of County commissioners of Bard County Florida Space Coast government television and the program sponsor hereby 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