Okay, we're recording. >> Okay. Um, welcome to the February 4th, 2026 meeting of the school committee's finance and capital improvement subcommittee. This meeting has also been publicly noticed as a meeting of the full school committee which permits all members to participate in the
deliberation. I would note that we have a quorum of subcommittee members present and a quorum of school committee members present. Um, and as chair of the subcommittee, I will be leading today's meeting. Thank you, Betsy, for that wording. providing it to me so I could read that so eloquently.
>> Okay, first item on the agenda. Um I believe we just have two. Am I right, Betsy? >> Do we have minutes, too? Sorry, I'm like >> they're not in the agenda packet, but there's is an approval listed for them, but they're not there.
>> Okay. Um are they >> I thought it just says it goes to non-aligned. >> Non-aligned is the first thing. Am I right? We're looking at the school committee agenda. So remember, we are running two meetings right now. The subcommittee agenda is a separate um
>> I got to go to the other one. Sorry. >> Wait, I'm sorry. There's a different agenda for school committee. >> Well, there is because they wouldn't be taking up the subcommittee's minutes. So on their agenda, I started right with the hourly rates that >> Well, whichever one. No, no, because
whichever I mean, I clicked on the finance and capital one on Brooklynmma.gov of and I end up with a school committee agenda financing capital improvements meeting. So maybe I'm looking at the one but the meet the meeting material. It's okay. I don't know. I just can't see the minutes. That's
>> I do send the minutes out and um I don't normally make them a part of this meeting's packet because they aren't approved yet. So I wait until they're approved and then I attach them to the meeting that they are for. >> Okay. So can you >> We can put them off till next week if you prefer.
>> Do you mind? That way we can just go through the core stuff. Okay. >> Um, so the next thing is the non-aligned hourly rates. Betsy, do you want me to pull up the version that I have or should Can we just run off of yours? Is that >> I have it that you sent to me. So I'll pull it up if you'd like. Right here.
>> Great. So first off, I just want to deeply thank the staff, the senior staff who worked on the some of the updates you're going to see here because a lot of thought was put into this. Um, not all of the changes that we've talked about in the past have been made yet, but a lot of them have been. And I think it's really helpful to start to have a
structure um that grounds um the summer program um stipens. So, I think Betsy, what might be the most helpful is if you don't mind going to the last page so we can start on the last page and then we'll go back up to the historical document.
So, um, Karen or Robin, I don't want to put you on the spot, but does either one of you want to talk through this or do you want me to talk through what you did? >> Um, sure. Roman and I can can start and then feel free to jump in, Mariah. Um so just for a bit of context this um came
up last year shortly after I had started and at the time actually I think post your last meeting when you approved these in the spring um you had actually tasked Jod and I to sort of do the exercise that we we have now done uh which was really to look at all of the
summer programs which are very very different right there are different length of uh length of programming um number of students number of staff number of days uh the hours of the program and really try and come up with um a system uh in which there was some
equity and parity knowing that there lots of exigencies between the programs and we're not going to be able to cover for each one of them but we really tried our best to sort of think really carefully and thoughtfully with you know Robin and I and Robin particularly being
obviously new to Brooklyn um with you know the knowledge that we have of the programs um And um obviously we had last year actually had sent out a spreadsheet to all the program uh directors uh just really asking for data. And so the data
that people gave us was um the again the length of the program, the hours of the program, the staffing of the program, the number of students, uh the hours of the day. Um and so we really were able to sort of see what was the what are the differences. Um, and then again really
tried to come up with something that would feel fair, that would feel equitable. Some of the concerns that I certainly heard last spring and and Robin jump in because I know you heard concerns this year as well um were really around um that the rates for
directors and coordinators and we using director and coordinator interchangeably. it's just really what people have called the people, you know, who are leading the programs um were just really varied and didn't really often make sense based on what people were doing. I can speak just for the
program I have the most knowledge of which is ESY. So, for example, even amongst ESY, um we have ESY K through uh preK through 22. Um but the BEP and the BHS programs which you can see on the
form are very different from the K8 program. Um yet all the those rates were all the same. So all the coordinators who were really running you know our K8 program is very big. We have that huge grades span. We have 180 students uh 80 plus staff. Um
the person running that program received the same coordinator rate. And so I sort of know personally that there's really inequity even within that. Um and so what we did is um and then you know we know that um you know people who are
running the programs there's pre-work right you're hiring your staff you're prepping in terms of students there's work during the the actual summer and then there's postwork and again speaking of ESY people have to do progress reports the coordinators have to make sure that all the progress reports are
in and done and and there's work like that with all the programs um and so what we try to do is come up with a base rate uh which um looking at um what we felt was a really solid base rate in terms of what the teachers earn during
the summer and making sure that the people who are coordinating and leading these programs on a PDM basis are making more than um the people who are teaching in the programs. uh and really being able to try credit the work and then also then trying to on top of that base
rate adding a differential because again a lot of the pre-work is hiring staff and many of the programs use Brooklyn staff and the same staff often come back year after year that's a much lower load in terms of hiring than say for example programs where you're actually hiring
people outside of Brooklyn and you're going through an entire hiring process so trying to factor in again those kind of those kind of pieces and so adding on to the base rate. A differential for hiring, which as you can see on the form, um is um
uh 605 15 a $1,500 differential uh in terms of every for 60 per 60 staff hired. And then in terms of student, a $1,500 differential for 180 students. And then as you can see, it's prrated uh
in terms of the percentages looking at that differential. So that was the methodology. It's definitely imperfect. Um, and certainly, you know, but it it was sort of where we felt like we could create something that had some equity
and parity in it. Robin, do you want to >> Yeah, I I I think, you know, as we kind of went through this, we were we tried to be as methodical as we could, as Karen was saying, just look very clearly at some of those factors that might impact the load, understanding that
every program is different, right? So, it's really hard to capture it all, but at the same time trying to be as fair to the people that are leading those programs across the board. Um, and also to establish some kind of baseline. So, thinking about if programs change, if we're adding a new program, we have a
place to work from that we can budget for or estimate estimate like what that um that stipen might be. So, >> thank you both. Jesse, go ahead. >> Thank Yeah, thank you. So I had two questions on the two one on each table.
Um Aaron the one on the top well I guess one thing from a formatting perspective is that the upper table the rate for FY26 is like before the one for FY25 whereas the rates down below has FY25 then progressing to the right FY26. I
wonder if there was a rationale for not keeping them consistent. >> And then >> no. Okay. >> No rationale but good point JC. And the next one. Yeah. Well, in terms of, you know, normally the eye looks across, you're not even you're assuming that the years are going up and then I I was
caught on that. >> The second the second question, I guess there's a third down now. The second question is, >> is there a reason that Star Academy is the only one of the ones down below that that shows a reverse direction in the FY26 schedule of payments? Everything's
going. It's the the star academy teachers the per hourly doesn't say hour on the on the far right but for 4841 but it goes up uh but the director and assistant director both go down. Is that is there a reason? >> So >> those numbers switched
>> so when you look at the base rate um the that program runs for 15 days. So everybody starts with the base rate. So if you look at the top table, the number of days >> that calculates your base rate and the base rate >> go up see all the way to the just the white table. Yeah.
>> So and the director's coordinators the base rate daily is 500 and assistant directors and coordinators 375 >> the 15. Got it. Okay. >> Yeah. So that's really determined by your base rate and then as you'll see there's a differential. So um Star
Academy for example serves the most students at 325. So that has a higher differential for students and then staff. But that's that's what how it was calculated. Um and so it's it's just really going through the methodology based on how many days are people
working and then the differential for staffing which is you know your hiring and then your differential for students. >> So So that raises I guess maybe a second a follow-up question on that one. Is this impact the ability to attract or retain a director and assistant director
seeing the sort of a significant decrease in the offered um program rate for them for next year or for this year really meaning you know people who were like directing star academy for uh for 18,000
>> uh this year for the same days are going to get 11,000. though is that going to impact our ability to get the people we need to run the program in your in your you know from your perspective >> Robin do you want to
>> I'm I mean I'm I'm unsure um I think you know like in terms of but at the same time I don't think that we can continue with the stipend where it was and if we're trying to equitably distribute that
>> that formula Right. So, >> yeah, I get it. >> So, >> and then then the the final point was are there certain columns other than the ones that have the dollar signs in the upper table? The one Betsy just bring it down. Yeah, just a bit. Yeah. So, is like base and staff should those have
dollars in them so that we know that those are dollar values? >> What I mean? >> Yes, you you're completely correct. The base that's the base salary. There should be dollars. >> Oh, base. Okay. and base and then and staff. I think maybe each of those probably need to be
>> No, staff is is You're correct. No, no, no. You're correct. >> No, no, no, no. They're not 225 staff members. >> No, right, right, right. >> Those should all have dollar signs. You are correct. >> Whichever one should I Yeah. I was just going to suggest as a as a uh >> format. Yes, you're correct. >> A comment to to update the ones that
belong that should have dollars with dollars. >> There's a lot of formatting, Jesse, that I want to tweak on this to clean it up. I didn't get all the way through. I didn't get all the way through because of everything else. >> Yeah, sure. Of course. All right. Thank you. That's Thank you for this. >> Good good pieces for clarity.
>> Um, can I ask a slightly different question? So, I again I think this is great and the thing that came up to me was should Star Academy have two assistant directors given how much larger the student population is? I mean, it's like almost twice as big as
Project Discovery or ESY. and and you added, I think rightfully an ESYka assistant coordinator because of the um substantially larger program size than the other programs. And I'm just wondering whether Star Academy should have two assistant directors given that
it's again, as I said, almost twice as big as as ESYK8. >> Well, the one thing and and this you see it says TBD because we just there's some information and Robin could more speak to us. there is a team leader um star academy but I think that's a a good question to
>> to follow up with um >> okay >> in terms of you know is that adequate staffing um again we need more information on the I think >> the role of the team leader >> the role of the team leader um does and
as you can see that wasn't calculated because we weren't really clear what that role is and how to calculate that so that needs some followup >> um but I think that's a A good question. >> Okay. Um, two more questions which were here from before. Um, you said that the
beep enrichment director salary I I interpret that to mean it's set by some sort of contract. What is the which contract is that? >> It is in the it is in the um unit A bargaining contract. Um, I had reached out to Margaret. I went through the
contract and tried to find it um to try and get what the FY26 salary was and could not find it. But Margaret assures me it's there. Um, so we just need to get the it is called out in the in the contract >> in the bargaining contract. Just that role for some reason is actually
contractual. >> Okay. >> And Margaret is not clear why or how, but apparently it's been there for many years. So that's set by the contract rate. >> Okay. Sarah, I see your hand is up. >> Just again a thank you. Um, I think that
it it's really helpful for the educators that are involved when they know that what they're paid is meaningful, that it, you know, that there's been a way of thinking it through and that the person that's in a different um job at the same level as them that that's been thought through, too. So, just I appreciate all
of this work. >> Carolyn, >> is the BEP enrichment director a summer position? >> Yes, >> these are all summer. >> Yes. So beep runs
full year. The tuition for beep is a full year. >> There's a separate fee that I think we voted last year. Um I can't remember how much it is. I think it might be $600 a week for beep enrichment.
>> So is beep enrichment another word for beep summer? >> Yes. Okay. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> And maybe we should just put beep as we >> beep summer enrichment. But yes, it's it's sort of the beep version of summer enrichment. A summer
>> it's under the it's in the summer program rates table. So yeah. >> Yes. So one I have one other question. Is there a reason that we shouldn't just sort of for parody and to make people aware of the roles equivalency rough equivalency convert the coordinator
title to a director title so that we sort of have some standardization there >> because for the longest time I thought all the coordinators reported to a director like it didn't sound the same to me so that's why I'm suggesting it or asking >> so I think I mean again I don't know I
think it's always been coordinator and maybe because there are special ed directors who work for you >> and so maybe that's why it's been and the special ed directors are on site and are working and just you know um so I think that's probably why it's coordinate and the others all directors
>> makes sense okay thank you um and then the last question was at the bottom just there was a discrepancy there but I think we probably can't answer that without Margaret here because you all had in your table $47 an hour for beep enrichment teachers but last year we had voted $56 so I just wasn't clear what
was the actual but the 56 aligns with the ESY rate. All of the other gened programs are 47. So I wasn't sure which was actually right. >> Okay. But yeah, >> we'll have to check that with Margaret. >> Okay, Caroline, go ahead.
>> You're on mute. You're still on mute. Okay. I'm clicking back and forth to my Google where I can control what I'm seeing on the document myself. So, apologies if I missed this in the
initial explanation. Some of these because I'm just looking at this and it's a lot of numbers. Some of these are expressed as a salary and some are hourly.
Is the Did I just miss the whole part where above you're saying that you set the salaries based on a rate like it's difficult for me to compare
>> let me give you a little bit of background that might help. So the directors last year were some were the ones that felt really discrepant and we didn't understand. So the top two the top table really is for the coordinators and directors the rationale and then how that rolls out in their calculation.
Then the bottom table combines the fact that some people are stipened in other roles are um hourly or perdium. So that's like everybody working in the summer programs table at the bottom not just the directors that we had really asked them to dig dig deep on the
rationale and equity around the stipen they received. Does that help? I guess I'm wondering whether the positions that are listed in the larger rates table that are salaried
like I would love to see for example ESY beep coordinator FY26 13,167 parentheses blank per hour because some things are
listed per hour and some are listed as a salary. So, um it's feels like it's a little bit apples to oranges >> for me sort of looking at this without all of the background knowledge.
>> Susan forest, not the weed, not the trees. I think Susan's raising her hand to respond. You're on mute, Susan, in case you were talking. There you go. >> Yep. Um, yeah. So, some positions under labor law are hourly employees, and so
therefore, they would be paid by the hour. Other professional what are considered to be professional under labor law would be uh receiving a salary just like they would during the school year. So that's why you have uh a difference between some people getting
hourly and some people not. >> I thank you. I understand why it's shown that way or why or I understand that just for my understanding of the complete picture.
It would be helpful not essential to see how the salaries end up comparing to the hourly rates. Well, >> not essential, but just again as someone
not sort of deeply connected to this and having a lot of background knowledge, um I think that if you wanted to, Carolyn, um you could basically just take that number and divide it by the number of
days and your choice of the hours per day. >> And the days is up above. >> It is. Yep. Exactly. So it gives you so you could say oh well that position is x days and I'm going to divide the total by x and then divide it again by you know whether you're counting as seven
hours or 8 hours or 6 hours or whatever >> which I don't know but >> well it's again it gets into this position of salaried and the part that they're getting that differential to manage all the you know >> wrap around. >> Thanks. Yeah. And I might I might also
just add is for like when you're considering part of like as we thought about like the structure for the people that are salaried >> that idea that if they have more staff there is work that is actually done beyond those you know those 15 days or 20 days or whatever it is because they
may be hiring all of that happens ahead. they may be doing reporting after things like that. >> Sure. And it may be that I'm asking this question because I was thinking about it with respect to um the earlier part of this document
which I assume we'll be looking at too. >> Yes, we will. I just I thought this was really helpful to frame then what we do above because and this is where the heart of the work is and it's really um nicely presented. So, you lead us to the next part of
this. Unless anyone else has any more questions on this, I want to go back up to the to the top. This is the original document. Keep going, Betsy, all the way. Um, so couple of things that are different. First off, I want to clean up
the formatting for this because the document itself, as you start to think about it, it has like basically some substitutes. It has summer programs and then it has everything else. But the way it's laid out now does not follow that format. So I think we can do some clean up in the next version. Um with that
said, music extension we just um that was the vote we took in June. And Robin, I don't know if you had the chance to check in with Kenny, but um my recollection was that we had hired we had voted last year that the minimum was close to what they're doing now or what
the actual was and the whole point was to give him plenty of flexibility in case he needed to increase the rate in future years. So that's why there's a range of 45 to 50 per hour. Yeah. Um >> then I deleted out adult education because that's no longer PSP program. Um
parent child home program. Uh one of you said I can't remember that Margaret said that the external rate is $27 an hour. And so we updated that from 20 that was before. >> I think I changed 24. >> You did but you wrote that it was 27.
She initially said 27 and then she >> she she said it's not. It's 24. >> Okay. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's 24. >> Um yeah, >> we will fix that. >> Okay. >> Um 24. Um and then direct service
provider we update. No, this is the number that was there originally and you are okay with that number Karen? >> Yep. >> Okay. Um then if you can just keep going. Um then this is the summer programs.
This is the format we had in the um prior year. But um I think again we should look at the the way that it was presented at the end and do a little bit of cleanup. Um but basically you can see all of the rates here um have just been
updated according to the earlier um table that we reviewed. The only one that was is there is a discrepancy is if you scroll down first off the team leader sorry a little bit up the team leader which we talked about earlier for
star academy. Um Robin you're still looking getting some confirmation on what that should look like. >> Y >> um and then the other one I wanted to mention was down the very bottom beep enrichment. again this question of the
the rate last year was 56 an hour but in the table was 47 an hour. So just confirming which which one should be used um with Margaret and then I want to get to the table on the next page. Um oh the student intern
rates I don't know if anyone had the chance to confirm or is PSB um is the actual rate $16 an hour right now? Caroline, hang on one second then I'll get to you. Susan, I saw you took yourself off mute.
>> Um I I don't know if I think it might have increased actually, but um I'd need to uh check and confirm that. >> Okay, because at minimum it would seem like it would match the living wage bylaw. Um >> so, okay, that would be good to double
check it will. And then um the non-aligned stipens section. This is where people had a lot of questions last year. And I want to acknowledge that with all the work you did for summer programs um there wasn't necessarily enough time to go back and look at um
all of this. Um so I think this is just a chance to perhaps um say that this is a future body of work for the most part. Um, but Carolyn, why don't you go ahead and ask your question and then I will also
find some of um, Donna's questions that she sent. >> My question is back um, on summer programs page two. I'm just curious what the security role is. >> The I think it's just the building
security like for the high school the regular security pairs that they have. I don't I guess I don't know that much about security paras BHS has >> I believe those are the campus aids the security
>> there's yeah there's a yeah there's I can't remember if there's two or four it's in that >> box's what's that role >> yeah there there's five and during the school year during the school year we have five and then in the summertime um
they have one or two that work during of uh you know the period of time in which we have summer school. So they are they are actually they fall under the parah contract which is why it's called parah here um oddly um as our IT staff are
also under the par contract but that's why the reference here is paras salary schedule because they are part of that collective bargaining unit. What what is that role at the high school? >> The campus aids their their their job is
to really monitor the the physical campus when students are in the halls or when they're not. Um that that is their function. So when people are passing
um their responsibility is also to sort of monitor the the space between 22 tapen and the and the main building the other buildings they um it's it's actually fairly intricate
space. Um, so they're they're really monitoring for safety and and um student conduct. It's a typical it's a typical position to have in high schools.
>> Thank you. >> Okay, I'm gonna I'm gonna ask some of Donna's questions. Um, if you could go back to the third page again. Um, Betsy. Um, one of the questions was, "Is this list of stipens um inclusive of all
stipens?" Um, for example, um, Donna didn't see the rainbow club that said Lawrence represented and she imagines that educator is paid a stipend. There's a provision in the teachers contract that um for smaller clubs like
that, they might uh get like a $500 stipen for certain certain types of things that um a principal might establish. There's also a whole list of stipens um that are in the teachers contract. So this is not excl does not include all
stipens that we pay everybody for everything. >> Thank you. Um, her next question was, "How does the $800 paid for a child study team member compared to the hourly rate for paid for project discovery teachers, for example?
I think it's sort of getting at sort of the equity and workload question." And you I can totally imagine you won't necessarily have the answer to these questions on the fly. Does it say again? She wants to know how much the child study who worked during the school year, how it compares to what the project
discovery rate for summer school. >> Is that okay? >> Exactly. Like how does the $800 compare when you were to if you were to convert it to an hourly rate? >> Okay. >> And I'm sorry, the lights in this room just turned off so I'm going to wave my arms. You you talk. Oh, there they are. Go ahead.
>> No, I just wanted to make sure I was clear about what she was asking. And that would so varial because child study works differently in every building. >> We could look at trying to come up with some average. >> That's going to be a hard question to answer, but we can try. >> I think it's pretty hard to come up with
how many hours are worked. >> Yeah. Yeah. But we can we can try. >> And I think the other part is is what's beyond the school day and what isn't because a portion of the work is done during the school day. So I think really apples to oranges here.
>> Yeah. Yeah. as the site would come into play if it's during your free time during the school day, right? >> Or if they're performing some responsibilities outside of the school day. Uh for example, if they're um meeting with other teachers outside of
the school day for particular purpose, but it wouldn't be all it's not it's not a consistent thing that that I think you could document and say it's always this. >> Summer school is different, right? It's it's it's beyond the school year. It's not during a regular
um time frame in which teachers in Paris would normally be working. >> Yeah. >> What does the coordinator of online learning at the high school do? >> It's a relatively large statement in >> that was on my list too.
>> Um so I can speak to the knowledge that I have and Robin you may know. We we have egeneuity um and it's um all of our students who might access an online course for credit or for extension or for enrichment gets
m gets managed. Um and it's a pretty extensive sort of body of work that goes into managing our egenuity contract and programming. If that's what that's referring to, which I I think it is. >> I believe that's what it's that's what
it's referring to. And you're correct. Thank you, Caroline. Go ahead. >> Thanks. Um, so to Donna's question, the answer of of does this include is this inclusive of
all stipens, I think, was the question. And then the answer was no. So, um, can we at some point in the budget process
get a list of all >> I think Susan said they're in the contract. So, it would just be this plus the contracted the >> I guess I'm going to ask this a different way that I think might capture it better. What I'm interested in, I'd
be interested in seeing like last year for FY 20, what did we pay in stipens and for what? Like I'd love to just see a report. So, we see these are the rates
and all these different positions and then there's also positions in the contract and maybe there's some others and maybe some are grant funded. I'd love to really know like what what did we spend um on these? >> I would second that request, but I might
frame it a little bit differently rather than seeing like actual payments. What I'd like to know is in what I'd like to know is like for example, how many child study members do we budget for? >> I'm not even sure like is I'm a little vague on that. So is this 800 actually
8,000 or 80,000? I don't know what it turns into in the budget. So, some of these I imagine are probably one-offs and some of them are quite extensive and I think it's just a little bit of understanding how they fit into the larger budget for me. I don't mean to say Caroline that your approach is not
valid but >> that's a really interesting question too particular to the child study team. um like so I'm guessing it means 800 to participate
in a child study team and I think child study teams are probably really important um really important in the you know context of related to special education referrals
and other interventions. So, um, and then that's sort of related to just like what are the what are the is there an incentive to participate in a child study team, which I'm going to say is probably important
role, or what are we incentivizing people to do with the different rates and how is it turning out? So, um I know it's it's work to pull those things together, but I I feel that that's sort
of that backend information. Um feels important to me to understand. And sorry, I'm going to throw in one more, two more. >> Can I just speak to that for a second? Um and and at the same time as you're understanding all of that, we also have
to understand who would do the work if we didn't have the really expense, you know, really experienced teachers doing it, right? So are we actually in some way kind of saving um by having it be stipended work instead of bringing in,
you know, a salaried additional FTE? I'm not at all suggesting that teachers shouldn't do child study teams. I'm suggesting I'm asking whether we're incentivizing teachers to do child study team well
enough versus being a um music adjudicator. >> Thank you. >> Is this is the site high enough? Is that what you're getting at? I think the question is in general
the stipens priorit stipens incentivize the right people to participate where they should right >> it's not even a question of whether that stipend is high enough but I'm interested in the full picture and if a
maybe some stipens are too high for what might be less important work I don't know because a some are hourly expressed, some are flat rate expressed. Um, so it's
it's I I'd love to understand it better. And I did ask this last year just specifically with respect to the high school as well. Like it's just it it does turn out to be a lot of money. And so I think it's important for us to
know sort of where the money is flowing. And sorry I'm going to throw out my other there's calculus project is listed here somewhere I think >> summer one >> young scholars calculus project. >> So that's like the after school club.
Nope. Go back to where we were Betsy. It's right there. It's halfway down. >> Yeah. >> Right. The Young Scholars Calculus Project teacher. Is that what you're referring to? >> Yeah. It's mention It's mentioned somewhere else. >> Yeah, but here >> Yeah, >> I thought there was something that just
said calculus project. >> Correct. There there is. It's Yeah, there is. >> And so I just was curious about whether that's just I don't know what the >> Let me see if I can find >> in the summer programs you're referring to on the previous page. Can you go to
the previous page? >> I just wrote down calculus project question mark. >> Are you asking because We're still using that name. It just means the math summer program. >> I guess I'm asking because I don't know
what the status of the calculus project is. >> My understanding Bella is here, but my understanding is that we are still operating the math summer project program as we have always dealt or has as we have done at least for the last >> it has um it has a different name and
Robin might know the name. I think it's effects >> effects. >> Yeah. So it and um they're running the program as they have um but there's but Kelkco's project um
is a >> is is a brand name meaning I know that and that's >> sure and they used to pay >> um a sum just to be able to be part of calculus project and so but otherwise
they're doing everything as they would and they're is no longer paying the that administrative fee to calculus project. >> Okay. So it may just be that where this says young scholars calculus project teacher that maybe that just that nomenclature
>> also there's also appears on the prior page. Yeah, it's on the prior box on the prior page. Second box prior page from the top. Keep going. >> Keep going, Betsy. >> Keep going. There it is. Right there. There it is. Second one down. Summer VHS. >> Yeah. So Susan might know better but I
believe there is a young scholars project that is separate from what the calculus project was. >> Okay. >> So I don't really understand how to clarify that nomenclature but there is a young scholars program. >> Okay.
>> The young scholars at least as a parent was for black and latino students in middle school and there was an afterchool component to it. um both an in inday and Robin correct me if I'm getting this wrong but like there's inday and after school component to it
and so I believe that's what the later page refers to and then this one is referring to the summer program which is complimentary >> um >> to during to iny-ear programming but again some of the the young scholars was after school so I believe that's what
the stipend refers to >> and we and we just may need to be changing the name so the name of is if is FX. So as I said, so it's fostering excellence in mathematics. So capital F, capital E, lowercase X.
>> Um, >> thank you. >> Thank you. And then Excel program lead teacher. Why is that a >> Can you go back down to page three? >> Sorry, because I'm on my own document
here. Um, >> it's like twothirds of the way down for $3,000 >> a program under office of student services at the high school. Right. I'm just curious why that lead teacher
is this meaning for some like what is that? If Excel is a is an OSS program, >> how come the there's a lead teacher that's paid?
It's a nonaligned, you know, it's not. So, that is historical. Um, there has been a lead teacher in Excel since I was here the last time. So, that isn't something new. Um that is a a fairly large program in which um you know many of our other
programs like steps to success went through house all have program coordinators or program leaders that are um sort of full-time assigned positions. So that lead teacher
position has been in sort of the kind of makeup of how Excel runs sort of probably for decades. Um in terms >> that makes sense. I'm just wondering why it's here as opposed to at like an FTE
position if that question makes sense. >> I think it's here because it's not contractual. So it's nonaligned. It's not in the contract. It shows up here. Okay. I guess and that just was confusing to me since I'm assuming all
the rest of the Excel staff are aligned. So I just didn't understand why. >> So it's a stipen. So the person in this role would be teaching in the program and be getting a stipend after hours to do some of the coordinating
role and function for Excel. So that's >> I see. That's a stipen but it's not a >> this is a lead teacher who is a presumably a unit a teacher this is >> other work that they do >> correct
>> exactly beyond the school day >> is how you again it could have changed so it's been you know my experience is a long time ago so I don't I don't have but that's how that how that's how the excel in that um uh position had been structured But the
person is a teacher within the program. >> Okay, that's helpful. Thank you. And is this is there one of those positions? >> Yes, I am going to double check for you. But yes, there was one one person. And I actually believe it might be the same
person who's been in that role for for many years, but I will double check and confirm that. Um, I'm just going to take a time check and um, for Jesse and Sarah and I'm going to ask one quick question, but then I'll let you both go, but I want us to wrap up because again, I think the
the effort was really spent on the other side and I appreciate the staff taking our questions. You're sort of seeing what we're wondering about for this and this is like for future reference. My only question right now on this section is is there any is there any role here which you're having trouble filling that we should adjust? And you might not have that answer
tonight and that's okay. But that would be my big concern is making sure that your needs are being met and if you're not be able to attract people into key roles, we should address that. Most of these positions are filled. Great. In some cases where you have
multiples, you might not get all of them all the time. So for example, to answer the question about child study teams, in general, we budget eight at each elementary school. Um, in general, you know, those positions are filled, but you might have a school that has six,
you might have another school that has seven, you might have another school that has all eight. So, >> thank you. Okay, Jesse, go ahead. >> Um, quick sorry, um, quick question to follow then for to the extent possible
to just add a a narrow column on this table that just has the count of staff that are in that position. There's difference between the count of staff and what we budget. So I'd really maybe Mariah and I can sit and have a you know get some clarity around what I'm looking >> Well, I mean yeah I mean it could be
what's budget it could be what's budgeted in terms of FTE and also how many you know FY25 what do we have so we know what we're spending. Thank you. That's the only comment I had. >> Yeah, that would be interesting. Right. Just the rate for the individual and then the total budget for it would be exactly Go ahead Sarah.
We we don't budget them separately, but >> so we said we said at the onset that you know it's not perfect and we're you know doing um a pass now and this is something that we'll return to. So, I guess Karen and Robin, um I just hope in order to like capture the full picture
that we think about who has to do work outside of the hours that you know, like going back to the directors um in the summer, who has to do work outside of the hours um of the program, who has staff that does some of that work, you know, the communication with the
parents, the spreadsheets, the you know um enrollment and all of that. Um there's so many aspects to look at. So that's why I guess I kind of appreciated your your the way you led this conversation was to say it it's hard to make it perfect, right? But I just
wanted to note that all of those things as we try to get better and better at doing this that that's part of the role that we're looking at who's who's writing curriculum, who's doing office work prior to the summer, and who's or any of these things prior to the program and who's just showing up and putting in
the hours at the time. So, I assume that you probably already thought about that, but I just um seeing that we're having the conversation, wanted to make sure to put that in. >> Um I want to just build off of that. One of the questions that um Donna had was um there was data presented to ERSC
earlier this week and it showed that one of the high school plus ones is the queer student program. Um, and Donna asked because Donna's question was about the intersection between stipens and plus ones and you know are we not having any are there any stipended are there
any plus ones that are also stipended and so um Donna's question was about you know why was queer student program a plus one but perhaps there are other um student affinity groups at the high school that aren't offered in a plus one model. That's a little bit out of the scope of this question, but generally
just thinking about um what why is a program a plus one versus a stipend versus um and making sure that there's you know uh distinction between them. I will put that out there as a big comment not to respond to but for your future thinking on this.
>> Okay. Oh, and sorry. Um, and also what, um, if some of this is grant-f funded, does it at that point make sense to not have it be all aligned with other with other positions that we're paying for? Um, do you understand what I'm saying?
If if we're going to have um again going back to directors and assistant directors, have them be paid through grant money, um does it make sense to align those with other positions that aren't that we pay for ourselves? Does that make sense?
>> I think that like well my I I philosophically they should all be aligned because you shouldn't be treating other people's money differently than your local taxpayer money. >> Okay. And I think there's actually something like I don't want to get too far into federal funding and grant funding, but I think that there's
actually like requirements around this. >> Yeah, you can't pay more from other from federal funds than you would for your from your own funds, but I will defer to other people who know more about that. Um, okay, let's toggle over. Thank you all for this conversation. And I think our next step is we'll just clean I'll
clean up the document and um and I know that um Robin and Karen and Susan, you're very interested in getting this um processed relatively quickly so that we can so that you can post the positions you need to for the summer. Correct. Is that correct? >> Yes.
>> Okay. And this is on the agenda for tomorrow night at school committee. And I think what would make a lot of sense um is to um hopefully if we don't vote the whole thing at least vote like large swaths of it tomorrow so that you can proceed with key positions and then if we're there's other questions we can
resolve those like a little slower but they will be less critical. >> Thank you. That that's actually what I was going to ask if we could vote the summer so that we can post and hire um you know many of these ones that you've just been looking at are already in play for this year. Um, but the summer ones
we're hoping to post straight after February school vacation. So, it would be great. >> It would be great if those voted on. >> Do we >> Betsy? Should we have a recommendation from the finance subcommittee to do that? I'm just trying to think because full school committee's here, but I
guess that makes sense, right? To >> Yeah. >> Why don't you go ahead and make a motion, Jesse, regarding summer that we can >> Yeah. So, I'll Yeah. Let me let me move that finance and capital subcommittee um approve the summer rate plan and uh and
therefore allow it to move to full school committee at at their next meeting. >> I will second that with just a little like asterisk on it that um we're still going to get clarity hopefully from tomorrow from Margaret just on what the um staff rate should be for the beep summer program. But yeah,
>> but we'll move the summer program along with whatever Margaret tells us for that um right >> for that one position. So, so seconded it. Um Sarah, how do you vote? >> Yes. >> Jesse, how do you vote? >> Yes. >> And I vote yes. Thank you. Okay. Um I
think we're going to toggle over to building department. Um so Jesse and I met with Charlie Simmons and Charlie Young and Carol Levin yesterday. Um and we wanted to provide some updates to um
to you all on this. Um, so there was some questions. This is following up on our prior conversations that we'd had. Um, and we'd said, as we'd mentioned at the last meeting, we'd set a a meeting for with them um, separately. Um, and so this is just
meant to be a little bit of a review of what we talked about and what the action items are. So you can see that the top table there is what Charlie Young presented to us last time. Um it's one of the tables that we saw at our last meeting and some of the conversations
we'd had at our last meeting that then we followed up on. First one um the capital line that's the bottom line of building school plant you can see is 54,500. Um and if you recall from our conversation last time um Charlie Young said that the town of Brooklyn had had
deferred their vehicle purchase for the FY26 budget. Um, and they are also planning to defer. I don't think this was clear last at our last meeting, but he told Jesse and I yesterday that they're planning to defer for um, this upcoming year as well.
>> Yep. So, we talked about that and, you know, if PSB would also need to defer the vehicle p purchase, Charlie, of course, and I think we all agree with this, you know, we want to make sure that the overall fleet is able to operate and is, you know, not in the shop getting repaired all the time. But of course, we're balancing all the
different um considerations against each other. Um Bella got from Joe Albuquerque the nine vehicles that PSB has on its fleet. I I pasted that in just so you all had that. Um there were two that
didn't have a driver named and so we weren't sure if either one of those was suitable or available to be repurposed. Um, so I don't know, Bella and Susan, I imagine you can't answer that on the fly, but really the question was, you know, if if Charlie does need a vehicle
in the short run, um, he mentioned that the van that they would be replacing, I think was a is it a 2010, Jesse? I don't remember all the details of it, but it's an older vehicle. Um and you know is there any flexibility in existing PSB vehicles given that for
example um the prior superintendent um car was already repurposed this past year to it in sort of a similar situation. And the other one was I mean it would require some work is that the third one from the bottom that's not listed to anybody is a transit vehicle which means
I think it has rows of seats in it and that would have to be modified if we were if Charlie Simmons was going to use it for like HVAC people that carry lots of equipment around and stuff. We'd have to do some >> because it says it's a truck. Sorry. Go ahead. >> Actually, if I could jump in here, all four of the vehicles, the two listed,
they're all passenger vans. >> Yeah. Right. Exactly. That's what I was getting at. Yeah. >> Okay. So that requires some changes if we were, you know, it would require some cost to um retrofit for what >> I'm assuming they're not named for
anyone, but they're being utilized, >> right? You know, for for a purpose. So I don't know that they're free to >> But some of them don't have a name that >> Well, we don't know. We don't know where we don't know where. >> Is Susan no longer on the call? >> She's here.
>> Okay. I mean, Susan, do you know I mean, I'm assuming the vans are used. >> Yeah, we use vans for a variety of different things on a sign out basis. So, I'm guessing that's probably why it's not um named here, but um I'm also
not as familiar with every single vehicle that we have and and who is overseeing the use of it. So, we'd have to dig deeper on that. >> Yeah. And, you know, is it like are there two vans needed? if those are the two sign out vans, you know, are there two needed or could be one or there
really are two needed and we just defer for a bit. So, there's more conversation to have here. I just wanted to give people sort of the update on what we talked about yesterday and some of the things that were um on people's minds. >> Yeah, I guess I'm confirming confirming in that blank space what the purpose
really is would be of course, you know, helpful to have. >> Yes, Betsy, did you go away? >> I did. I It was getting a little wonky. I'm sorry. I have to open it again. >> Okay. I thought you had dropped and I was like, "Oh, no." >> Sorry. It wasn't It was frozen, so I had to restart it. Sorry.
>> No, that was quick. >> Um, so the second question was, "What the of the staff line up at the top? Do you mind just scrolling back up to the top?" Betsy, you can see the personnel line is increased by $5,700 from 27 to 26. And the question was just um who are
the staff and um and what are their roles in supporting PSB? So, if you could scroll back down, Betsy, um Charlie Young, um pasted a there's a he provided a table. It's on I think page three. Um but you can see Charlie
Simmons provided the roles. So, um and you can see the percentage which ties to that same table. So, um the first three roles, Dan, Charlie, well, we know what Charlie does, but Dan and Paul, and there's a description there next about um construction projects, permits, etc., etc. and then each of the roles below.
Um, this just came in a couple hours ago. Um, and I appreciate that, Charlie. You turned it around really quickly. Um, but I haven't had the chance to read it all necessarily yet. And um, and I think other people, too. >> Um, might have Yeah, this the percent
number, Charlie, what is that referring to? >> Betsy, can you scroll to page three? It has to do with the percent that PSB pays of their salary. >> That's what I was thinking, but there was no note about it. Yeah. >> Yeah. It's right um it's here. And actually Charlie Charlie Young's
document that he'd given to us um just FYI. Betsy, can you not make it blue? It's harder for me to read. Thank you. >> Yeah, this is >> Yeah. So the it had the the percentages in his document were not correct. I I fixed them. Um so you can see the the title on the far farthest left column.
You can see the salary and then the school portion. And you can see the percent allocation. And then you can see the difference in salary year-toear. So that's the you can see it's the 5,762. It's one here I'm sure due to rounding. Um
>> but that is the that is the source of this um and you can see that the numbers are relatively stable um over time. Some of them have varied and some positions I think um have come online. That was related to the override promise, right
Charlie? some positions and changes over the years. >> Yeah. So you can see um that. So that was one thing we talked about on Tuesday and this is the update and our prior meeting. This is the update to that. Wanted to share with the
committee. If you can go back Betsy to page two or three. Yeah. Uh three sorry. And I think we'll let people look at this offline because there's a lot of details there. and three for utilities.
Um, are there proposed changes to operations that town staff would suggest to reduce utility costs? So, we talked yesterday about some of the previous attempts to maintain temperatures at certain sort of fixed levels in the buildings and that it it just ended up
falling apart because um because it did. And so, you know, is there a culture change that needs to happen so that we can maintain some um discipline around building temperatures? Um, and Charlie Young suggested that Bella, Susan um
that you two and Joe perhaps want to talk with Charlie Simmons and Charlie Young about this. Um I mean the utilities are getting so expensive at this point that making some changes here would be um could be quite large amounts
of money. Um and other things we talked about were you know afterhour use um so the difference between um that we might want to think about about how we how how PSB chooses to run the temperature during the school day versus after hours and
weekends. Um and Charlie said that he has because of the energy management systems in Driscoll which are so modern, there's some um utility usage data he could share. So we thought like let's get 24 hours on a weekday and 24 hours on a weekend day to sort of see what's
going on with non-school um utilities usage. Just going to add, Maria, that that um one of the recommendations voted by expenditures and revenues earlier this afternoon had to do with finding
potential revenue opportunities by Charlie, you won't want to hear this probably, but you know, by um providing a reservation system that's open enough across the the larger community so that we can maximize um our afterchool um occupancy of programs and to make it
transparent enough so people can see it, etc. which would actually potentially increase the number of hours that the buildings are being used out of hours and on weekends which would either require potentially, you know, fee, you know, larger fees to cover the extra
utilities or some other um adjustment because then your buildings are being used even more. It's not like we're going to shut the buildings at 8:00 p.m. and keep them really cold till the next morning. So, just something to keep in mind that there's there's a revenue opportunity there that would have to
balance with this uh utility, you know, the c the extreme cost of utilities. >> Neither hang on one second, Caroline. Neither Jesse nor I were voting on these because um right the school committee is not voting on ERS or townwide officials
are not participating in the votes. >> But I think that um there's a lot of complex things going on here that are all intersecting around um use by other town departments of the space at no fee and a whole bunch of other things. But most importantly,
there are some things we can possibly control and other things that may be so complicated that they could be deferred. But things like um Carol Levin suggested and I think it's a great idea like you know having just like we've been doing sustainability education around composting and how do we get people to
you know maybe have a little competition around um who can reduce their utility usage which building can reduce the percentage of utility usage by the most and and having PTO's you know sponsor fleece wearing fleces or something like that like there's some behavioral stuff
too that could really support um there you go Caroline I like it Caroline Thank you. She's walking the walk over there. >> We got to in my house. >> That's kind of it, right? So, how do we I just think it's it's getting so expensive. And if you look at the year-on-year increase on utilities,
Betsy, if you don't mind going up to page one, >> um utilities is increasing by 10% in one year. Yes. And you know, so what can we do to change the arc? I think it's really important for us to
>> explore this further. Um, and go ahead Carolyn. >> Um, yeah, I think I just want to sort of echo this and um, sorry I stepped away for a minute so I don't know if it was covered. Like is there even a policy or
is that what you're suggesting in terms of like what temperature do we keep the buildings on the weekends? Um, are they too warm? Um, like with all the fancy technology, I would think we can I
mean I can change my house from the car. Um, so if there's an event at a building on a weekend, sure, heat on, but what's it set at and when does it go down? And I think we're probably spending a lot of
money heating buildings in off hours. So I I I just would support sort of continuing to to look at this and button this up. Thanks. >> Great. And and I just want to say I think it's probably not a policy thing because I think it needs to be agiley
managed by the operations people. Um but I leave that again the recommendation there from Charlie >> policy wasn't the right word but >> yeah some sort of recommended or whatever. Right. Um, if you could just scroll back down, Betsy, the conversation was really as it as it says, um, you know, Charlie Young really
says, "This needs to be a staff conversation for you all to talk about what's possible, um, amongst yourselves." Um, number four, um, the repair and maintenance
non-salary budget. Um, we talked about is there anything left to be, you know, removed? Charlie um had said you said yesterday that you had already really taken out this the savings that can be taken. You've already removed those from next year. Charlie Young pointed out that you know we could consider taking
some of the um the anticipated you know 75 to $80,000 in savings. We could take some or all of it. We could take a fraction of it. And um as he pointed out um Charlie you've already done this on the town side with one person and
realized some savings. Um So, we could think about netting that out as well. Um, and I wasn't I I put questions in green. The action items are in yellow and the questions are in green. Not they don't need to be answered right now, but those were just
sort of um things I was not clear on. Um, and then CIP prior year balances. Um, there was just a question if there's any funds in prior years that could be, you know, used against current CIP needs. And um Charlie, the Charlies are
going to just pull that list. And I think Charlie Simmons, you said you'll just explain what the balance what the what your rationale is for the remaining balances. >> And I just want to highlight here, we talked about this yesterday, too, that a lot of Charlie's accounts are um both town and school building support. So if you see something that says like
elevator maintenance, it it doesn't mean it's just school elevators. It's it's both things. Caroline, is that a new hand or an old hand? >> Old hand, it looks like then. Okay. Um, and then the last thing we talked about yesterday, which I think is really
important, is um, we're talking a lot about Charlie's next year request, but we are potentially in this override year, and how do we manage, how do we get ourselves out of doing the same conversation for the next two years. How do we coordinate and plan? Um, on the town side, there there has been an
inclusion in the override of um, number that's been proposed for an increase. Um, do you know, Charlie, what that increase represents like as a percentage of your budget on the town side? >> Oh. Um,
I don't have that off the top of my head. >> Okay. >> Um, >> yeah, I haven't seen it in anything from Chaz either >> yet. Yeah. >> Okay. Well, it' be helpful. I think we should, it would be helpful to understand percentage-wise how that ties
out and then just thinking how we're going to manage this as well. Um, and Charlie, you were also go you were going to sort of advise on what you thought for a percentage increase for PSB for the outy years, what you were should, you know, what we should project for carrying. And then I I just put
something here that we didn't talk about yesterday, but it made me think about it. What we need to do for utilities. So, I mean, if we're going to get again behind the eightball because utilities are going to be a 10% increase, this this really ties to that prior conversation, but if we can change the arc of it, we'll do much better. But if
it's going to be 10% every single year, it doesn't matter what we put in the override because it's not going to be budgeted for next year and then we're going to be back in this >> quandry. Um, we we do have long-term contracts for the supply of electricity and the supply of gas and uh gas just went up
based on our contract and our contract the new ones go out two or three years and we always get contracts out in the future so you get better pricing. Um, so that that number we know and if you presume everything's the same whether it's kilowatts or therms, you'd be able
to predict going into the future what the number should be. But that doesn't happen. Uh, part of the problem is the weather, the usage, >> and then all these extra charges. I'm sure you see them on your bills. It's coming from >> both utilities. Um, that must be like 10
of them on the electric bill. And I've noticed just very recently that a couple of them just doubled. And it's >> it's something I don't understand why. And I'm not our consultants are not telling me about these things. And um it
has to do with what agreements they get with the state. Um so I did have a a long conversation with our Eversource rep and I'm setting up a meeting and I'll be inviting a bunch of people, Charlie Young and so on to try and get a handle on this because
it is a large chunk of the bill now. It wasn't, you know, 20 years ago. Um, and they're trying to use the money, I presume, to, you know, there's energy conservation, there's improving the structure, the new wires, new gas, and so on, but it seems awfully expensive.
>> But I think you're, you know, you're making the point of even if we don't know what they are perfectly, we really need to forecast it because, um, yeah, even if we're just carrying forward, you know, historical increases, there needs to be some sort of acknowledgment that we're going to be underwater if we do nothing.
Yeah. >> Um, so, so that's the that's the update from the conversations we've been having. I don't know that there's a punchline or a conclusion yet, but I think it was good to >> Go ahead, Jesse. >> Yeah, thank you. No, I good. I I guess
going back to number four for Charlie. Did we Where did we land? Because it'll come up before school committee again with whether or not he you know, there's a memo that we didn't post here. I mean it's in the meeting agenda we haven't in the packet but we haven't shown it up here in which Charlie made a request for
an increase from the prior year in order just to catch up from thing from the cut that the school committee made last year um because he didn't get everything he asked for. So I guess what's our strategic uh vision Mariah for how we're going to address his request for um an
increase for FY27 to keep >> the buildings as they need to be. Can you go up to the top? Um, Betsy, because I think it's easier if we talk about it. We use this chart here. So, just to highlight that the that the number
that's shown here for services, the 3633 number, that's only at the 2 and a half% that is not Charlie's full request. That's what's budgeted on the town side. It doesn't include what he's um asked for us in addition. And so I think that there's a couple different levers here
as we look at the total budget to answer your question. One is do we elect to forego the car, the vehicle that needs to um and so that would free up 54,000. Do we take the 80,000?
Um, and are there other changes that staff are willing to make in the um in the utility usage that we can use to um reduce our projected utility use? Um,
and that all those three things I think will really help us answer the question. But I don't think we have an an like I think that to me those are the three things. And I think the first two, the 54,000 and the 80,000 school committee can make a choice on those would chip
away significantly, Charlie. I know although we'd be borrowing from other sources of your money, but that would um allocate those over to um substantially to the delta between what you've requested and what's listed here for the 3.6 million. And then it's the question of the utilities. >> Yeah, it would help. Exactly. It would
help. >> Good chunk. >> Yep. And then the real question though to me like the you know the elephant in the room is utilities and you know can there be some sort of commitment to something and then can we quantify that? Um
and then how does that play out? I think the point again Jesse is how does that play out not just for 27 but for 28 and 29. >> Right. So Charlie, in your memo to the school committee and Bella when you requested the 3.9 million that's a
combination of personnel and R&M together because it's not represented in the table that you know that we're looking at here that's we're showing like you know we're budgeting >> it's instead of the 3.6 six
>> that number right >> I asked for 3.943 >> correct yeah 3.943 >> and so this is your >> that's for what >> that was just for services >> right right >> so you're asking for an additional
310,000 above and beyond what's shown here >> and we've just talked about >> potentially around 135 of that >> um We're still 130 of that 310. And then there's, you know, still questions of
what can we do? Um, if we can >> on utilities though, >> utilities. Exactly. Behavioral modifications or just I won't say behavioral, I'll say >> culture change. >> Yeah. Well, or whatever. It's going to be >> a little bit of a culture change. >> Decisions about utility usage.
>> Yeah. I mean, um, yeah. So, but that that will be a slow process. So, >> well, not necessarily, Jesse. I mean, people all over the world, like literally their countries tell them we're going into brownouts, and they change their behavior. >> That's true. >> Um, Bella and Susan, I wonder if you would comment on this conversation, the
whole thing, but particularly the utility use. >> I have to defer to Susan. I don't know that she's ready. Yeah, this is the first I'm hearing of it, so I'd like to uh >> Well, in fairness, um it has been
presented before, but Susan hasn't been available. Um understandably, >> well, I guess I'm not asking about the dollars. I'm asking about, you know, are as leaders in the school district, is there something do you think, well, this is something that we could spearhead to
reduce our utility usage in our buildings? Even if it's something like, for example, we're not going to run the buildings at I don't know what the exact number is, but let's say 71 right now. We're going to run them at 68. >> And no space heaters.
>> Yeah. >> Uh there are space heaters. Yeah. >> I understand. I think one of the challenges with it is when you make wholesale statements like that in my experience in buildings um you might have an average of 68 but
it could be awfully cold in one side of the building and very warm on the other side. And so I don't think it's as um simple as as just saying we're going to set it at 68 because there's going to be circumstances under which you're going
to need to supplement >> and you and you might just say it and then you you see how it goes. I don't think you're ever going to know for sure. I think in everybody in every one of our houses except possibly the most energy efficient super insulated of all
of us, >> we set our temperature somewhere and some rooms are warmer and some rooms are colder and we live with it. >> And I guess like this is the thing is like choices have to be made at some point. So, I'm really hoping that we can
have some, you know, affirmative decisions made here to support Charlie as we're trying to control the utility costs. >> I I could jump in here. There was, like I said two or three policies ago for 68
degrees and we set it at 68 degrees. That's a temperature sensor on the wall. And Peter O and I talked about it because there were a lot of complaints. And the agreement was is where the person sits, where the teacher sits, that will be 68°.
So it if the desk happens to be by the windows, it is colder. So I'd bump it up say two degrees to get to 68 because it was actually 66. And we sort of not globally, but we customized those areas
um as as people requested it. And most of the time it was fine. Um, and it made sense, >> but we're not doing that now. It's it's it's >> everything is 72. Yeah. >> 72. Okay. So, this is really helpful.
Sarah, go ahead. >> I know we don't have time for extraneous questions. So, you might say to me that this is not the time for that. I would love to have an explanation from you, Mariah. I still can't figure out um is a different question that we could ask
just like the one that you just asked. If we could pass the true expense of continuing to heat the building onto after school hours on to the vendors that operate in our buildings.
So, um I think we we alluded to this a little bit earlier. Some people are operating in our buildings. Um, and some people are at fees and some people like wreck or not. And but I think that the first step is if you go down a little bit, Betsy, to the part where we talked
about Charlie giving us the 24-hour >> sort of understanding like what percentage of our what percentage of our utilities, if we just use these two days as proxies, like what percentage of our utilities are actually school day expenses versus after school and or other after hours? um non-school
um utility usage. And so this is starting to get somewhat at your question, Sarah. Um because you know the reality is that like the PSP budget is being asked to carry a very large utility budget and and not all of it is related to school
activities and it may not be it's very likely it's not appropriately allocated in the charges to the for facility use. But um but again, not every user is even paying a fee. The buildings are a public resource. >> Go ahead. >> What's the temperature on town site?
What did they set it to? >> 72. >> 72. >> It was a It was a policy made at the same time. Um, both the select board and school committee approved it. But it was the same kind of situations. And frankly, you can walk around town hall and see electric heaters all over the place. >> Yep.
>> People actually my heat wasn't hasn't been working. >> Oh my goodness. >> Yeah. So, it's freezing and I haven't gotten a space heater because I know if I get one, everyone will say, "Okay." But, um,
>> it's it's Yeah, it's really >> I will fix your >> You got the right guy. >> Yeah. >> Yes, we got we got to keep you warm. >> But I think that's a good point too, Bella. I mean, I think it's >> I mean, I don't get one because I'm like opportunity.
>> So, I'm just trying to >> set an example, but it's it's really cold. Um >> I was just going to add um Mariah that um again as a followup to um Cliff
Brown's proposal about a town we'll say it townwide including the schools reservation system for rooms and Charlie Simmons's ability through sensors to know what's going on in the rooms of every building at least to more modern
buildings that if you merge to the EMS MS energy management system with the online reservation system. You'd be able to look from say a school community structure or whatever or he could when the when the room was um being used by the music program in the evening for a
concert. This is what the temperature was there when it was being used for the gym was being used. This is what the temperature was there. When there was a rental by an outside group that already don't you have that already or no? I think I thought that his I thought
that the EMS was fed by room occupancy data already. Jesse >> it um >> it it does the um we set a base schedule and if someone wants to rent a room a space it's put in through school dude which is now called Brightly and that
schedule gets approved and it automatically gets put into the energy management system and the heat or the air conditioning um and ventilation would come on automatically for that space for that time and then as soon as the program was over it shuts off but I
modified That's a little bit. What I do is I get the reheat ready and see if it was 8:00 at night and if no one walks in by 8:15, I just shut the heat off because I'm presuming something got changed or canceled and it just sat slowly drifting down and suppose it was
a half an hour delay. People would walk in be a little cool but it automatically come back up because it's still occupied and they'd be fine. And that's been working pretty good. >> Nice. You know, every once in a while there's somebody that doesn't put in a schedule
or, you know, screws up a day and they walk in on Sunday and it's cold. Um, but we, you know, we'll take care of it as long as we know. >> Love that. That's great. >> Yeah. I mean, it it sounds like there's a lot of opportunities here. Um, I know,
you know, I think in probably all of us at our house or most of us are running the temperatures at these more reasonable, more economic levels. >> It's true. I'm running at 65 at home. >> There you go. Right. >> I'm sitting in a jacket. Yeah, I'm sitting in a jacket for a reason.
>> Same. >> So, I think that this is something and I think that kids also they, you know, they care deeply about the environment and this is an environmental issue. So, there's something to be said about and I believe it does it aligns with our goals about how we should be um >> leading on environmental issues as well
and sustainability. So, um I think we have some next steps here, but I don't think we're going to solve anything tonight. um unless the subcommittee wants to, you know, vote to recommend that we would take the savings
from the car or the savings from the um HVAC tech um at this point. But I think we could also wait and have a little bit more information and conversation and then come up with something that has that has is a little bit more integrated and thinks about
multiple years as well. Are you sure? >> Are you asking about the car and the HVAC tech with just those two things? >> Just those two things. We could sort of frontload some of our decisions, but I think we can't we don't have the entire
thing ready in front of us. So, >> and those are pretty easy ones to like they don't require a lot of planning and thinking to understand. So, we could also just hold that until we have a little bit more information about a larger plan. I would vote to go with the larger plan.
>> It'll seem like we have it more integrated and, you know, thoughtfully put together. >> Sarah, are you okay with that? >> I think I need a little bit more time. So, yeah. >> Okay. Um, is there any other comments on any of this or any new I think we're at
the new business part of the agenda. >> I'm good. >> Okay. Thank you everyone. Um, much appreciated. Thank you Charlie, Bella, Robin, Karen, Susan. >> Thank you. >> Thank you all. Appreciate it. Have a
good night. >> Thank you. >> Thanks. Bye.