Okay, we are recording then. >> Thanks, Betsy. >> So, >> our friend the handbook, >> our friend, the handbook. >> Now, I'm like, as I went through this, it was clearer to me why the prior
school committee never adopted. >> So, I'm I'm gonna start with a question. I mean unless some Yeah. Um, does anybody want to like I had this
question within it and we don't have to address this now, but I think it would help me to go back to sort of like what do people envision as the purpose because there's a certain amount of language that is kind of
welcome to school committee but then again I think we all find ourselves being like it's in the handbook or that should be in the handbook. book. So for sort of ongoing and then there's the question of like where does it become too much because
there's like some of this information is in other places so is it just links but I guess that's just always the question right is like the purpose and then level of detail >> and I'm sort of thinking of it trying to
think of it in the same way which is also not a concept that I've mastered. But like when I was on policy last year and we had an early conversation with the principles and we had a conversation about like there's policy
and then there's the school level handbook which is sort of like the way I think of like mass general law and then regulations promulgate >> the policy. So you have a policy and then you have a handbook that sort of
tells you how to execute that policy like nuts and boltsy and those are just some random thoughts. >> I like that approach because I like there to be the um policy separate just because I think that people do better
with less information and I don't think that there's any reason to have something in two places. Mhm. Mhm. >> I think we've gotten as far enough as we we went down the road of thinking we would have policy and handbook be one and the same. I have to observe that we've gotten over that hump and and
Mariah was saying like this is probably not policy anymore. This is probably just a handbook. So I think that given that I'm seeing us tend towards that direction in order to make the job smaller for us, I would love to see us
decide that this is a handbook for all members, not just new members. >> And I think that that would help us be more concise. So, um, should we have a like welcome for new like like there's a section that's like if you're a new member like
the onboarding section, but then there's just the like and for everybody else like like that makes clear that it's not like I guess my point is right now there's a thing called welcome >> which is I think what you're saying I'm just trying to map it onto the document but that that should essentially be consolidated with like so you've joined
the committee here's the 15 things that are going to happen to you in the next week like it should get rolled in with that. Is that what you're thinking? >> What I what I did is I took I made a new draft and I had the draft start out with >> you did. Where is that? >> Sorry. Let me send that email the other
day. Yesterday maybe. >> Oh, I'm ashamed to >> announce how many emails I have not read in the past week. It's a lot. >> So, what Let me say what I was going to say as I resend it to you. You probably already have it there, too.
>> It was yesterday at 10:07. Sorry. Go ahead, Sarah. >> It's called copy of school committee handbook, and I'm going to share it um with just you because I think that Carolina always already has her hands. >> And I admit I didn't even I didn't open this because I didn't even get through
where we were. >> So, this is what I did. And we can go we don't have to use this. We can go back to just what we have. But I took um what we had. I accepted a lot of the things that I wrote to Mariah. Let's accept this. Let's accept this. Once
you've seen this, accept it. And I accepted all of those to just to kind of like make it a little bit more simplified. I kept the other issues. >> And then I put roles and responsibilities at the beginning and I took out the language of welcome to the school committee. You're new.
>> So there's two different ways to go. Maybe we just need to do a vote. Would we like to continue to try to reduce the redundancies in that first document or would we like to move on to
the new document that has roles and responsibilities at the top? >> I don't want so the roles and responsibilities is in policy and is in a is a section in the MASC policy. So, I personally think
um that I don't necessarily want, let me put this a little bit of a different way. I don't want the same content in two places. Um and there's no like reason to say
that exactly what we have in ROS and respon it doesn't match what's MASC in general. The headings match, but the content doesn't. Um, so and I guess my question is, and maybe this is sort of what Caroline's talking about too, like if it's over in policy,
it's really pretty strict, whereas the handbook is more like guidance nudges as opposed to like something very firm. Like the the handbook I see is like things will go better for you if you do X, right? and
like the policy is like um this is like literally how the committee legally is going to work. Does that distinction resonate or no? >> So I'm not I should have and haven't
because I thought it would just further confuse me. I haven't been sort of referring back to policy even though we talked about that. So, it's section B. I And so I don't know. I >> I just need to talk to Rita for one
second. I'll be right back. >> You can keep talking. I didn't mean to say stop talking. Just Okay. >> Um, >> so, >> so I'll say to you, Sarah, I haven't been referring to policy section B and I
probably should. Have you I see. So like this is all this like this is how school committee meetings are run. But I have to say it's a new idea to me. What you guys are expressing is let's not have it. I I might have just said that myself, but that is new as of right
now to me. This idea of let's have it be in two different places. I um I want to respond to Mariah about Mariah. I wanted to respond to you Mariah that um while I
>> sorry if this sounds critical. While I accept the idea that a handbook is a more casual representation and a policy is more sort of like direct, I don't think that the language that we've used
to try to soften um like oh you know has always worked. Sometimes it sounds a little bit um degrading in the like, you know, you you don't really need to do this or some type of thing. I prefer straightforward language, but I I I'm with you in spirit. You know, I like >> let me but I don't I don't think I meant
more casual language. I meant like the wording itself is not what I meant. What I meant was policy has more force of law behind it. Yes. >> Like it's not the writing. Okay. It's not the writing style. It's like the we we like the committee is sort of bound
to policy in a way that it is that a handbook has no authority >> and the and the language we have used in the handbook when we have when you have tried to do that hasn't always been my favorite but yeah >> but in the >> wait say much more say more about that
>> sorry the way that you personally happen to talk when you're trying to make it like a little bit more sort of casual hasn't always worked for me the the actual language that you've put in there. But in in thought, I'm with you. Like the the >> That's fine, too. I was just a lot of it
was literally me just trying to like get some ideas out. I think I wrote even a couple places like no pride of authorship. It was just to get some concepts up. >> And so can you give I have two >> just came out. It might be Can you help Rita serve that thing?
>> Oh, sorry. I thought I was on mute. My bad. >> So that's okay. So two things and I'll go back first. So, um, I'll take responsibility for the sort of roles and responsibilities suggestion because that was a suggestion I made and I referenced
mask and I think I still like that. Um, although none of this is a hill to die on for me to be clear. Um, because I think I actually think that's the kind of
thing that sometimes comes up, right? like is this in our purview? Who's supposed to is this a superintendent thing? Is this a school committee thing? So that's where for me the roles and responsibilities
that sort of came from mask and I didn't read it, but I saw like oh this seems clear and seems to hit some points that I think come up sometimes. And also for me um like where you say having it in two
places Mariah like that's fine if it's in mask but to me that's like two places to me would be like our policy and our >> I did I said it's all I was say sorry I can tell I was super unclear because my brain is distracted. We tried to get a
fridge today delivered and it couldn't fit through the door and they had to send it back and my kids are all like where's the fridge? Like that was the background conversation that was happening. Yeah. So >> good thing it was really annoying. I thought I'd measured the doors blah blah blah. Anyway, so
>> yeah. Yeah. Anyway, so um I don't mean that it's an MASC. I meant that our policy our policy structure, it's not like we made up that roles and responsibilities should be in section B. I meant that like not only do we have
it, but MASC has it. So, it's not something that I would say, "Oh, let's just pull it out and put it in the handbook." >> But, do we have it? And so, that's my other thing is now I'm looking at section B. >> Yes. And so there's two things like and I and I'm not super familiar with
section B and it sounds like you are and I also wanted to ask you like can you give an example of something that's like in section B that feels like too formal or legalistic
that is also now like you have the parallel. What I did was I tried to not replicate section B in my and and I tried to point over like for example I would feel really comfortable with let me give a proposal. We work on roles and
responsibilities for what we want it to be. we propose it for section B as an update. And then the handbook says, "Hey, you should really go look at like you might not look at the whole handbook right now or the whole policy manual, but you definitely need to go look at roles and
responsibilities because that is really important as you are like getting on board and living your life." >> But is there not but there so there's not roles and responsibilities in policy right now. Is that >> there is there is >> where
>> I'm gonna find it. Hold on. Okay, >> it's totally here. >> Authority and >> unless I'm like totally got myself so confused, but I could have sworn roles and responsibilities is here. I'm just scrolling to find it.
>> Betsy, can you help me? >> I'm looking right now as well. Yeah, >> it does have all of this. >> Oh, yeah. It's here in this um is it school committee blah blah blah relationship or that's a school
committee and superintendent? But that's kind of it, right? That's the roles and responsibilities bit. >> Can you give me a page number? >> Um B 19. >> And it does say at the end that it was taken from um MASC's. Ah, okay.
>> You know, from in 2005. >> Okay. >> And I'm just going to go find the online policy manual real quick. One moment. Oh, wait. That's not the one I want. I want the online policy reference manual. >> And um if you go to section B,
I'll just show you what um mask has. >> Where is it? >> Professional development. So, it's my bad if I made a suggestion and I even gave the link
to the mask page. There's no ruth to respon apologize because I actually see it the way that you do. But the problem is is that you and I are both like h whereas Mariah is a little bit more sure of herself because I would say like oh two you know outvote one but Mariah has
a a vision whereas you and I are both like not a you know sword to die on. >> Yeah but that's my personality as a steamroller like don't don't take that to the bank. I also just want to really confirm whether they are the same or maybe
>> well that's what I was saying is I'm pretty sure the headers are but now I'm also wondering because here's what I did when I got can I just tell you my process which was I was like okay so I'm going to look at like I took this the version you and Betsy had worked on
which was section B and then I was trying to merge that with some of the more colloquial folksy other documents we had. And then I was like, well, if we're going to But then I started to hit things in section B that I was like,
well, these really need to stay in policy because they're like like sort of like the like it was things like how we accept a resignation and like what the process, you know, like those things can't live in a handbook. They really have to be formal like yeah, like processes that the school committee is
agreeing to. So then I started pulling those out and then I was like, "Well, let me go look um at what MASC has because if we're having to rebuild section B to like pull some stuff out and some stuff keep it, then I was like, let me work off of the headings that
MASC has for B." So um and then I started looking though at the content and some of our headings were the same, but the content was different. And it turned into, just so you know, like this document got up to like 98 pages. You can actually look in the history of like the the version that I shared with you,
the version two, it got up to like 98 pages and I was like, "This is overwhelming. I can't detangle this. I'm too stressed out by trying to figure out section B. >> Let me like and I was also trying to align this with the headings from the and the content from the prior handbook
that I thought had some useful stuff in it, too. and I just couldn't see my own path forward that tried to like reasonably incorporate section B and be a handbook. So, I like I I deleted out all of the section B stuff and just sort
of like started clean with like, >> okay, I'm going to work sort of on the headings that the old handbook had and I added in some stuff that the more recent iterations of school committees had thought was important like um Demetri's document, the communications norms. Um
and and I said like let me not try like maybe the thing to do would be if this structure works for us then we go back and we say what things from B are are really not policy but have snuck into our policy manual because we didn't have a hand like we didn't have the like
right >> procedural aspect the procedural pair the way that um schools have like there's like the way you know there's the policy and then the procedure since now we have a procedure >> cell phones cell phones is a good example, right? Like the schools can decide
>> is it going to be a shoeholder or a lockbox or >> Right. Yeah. Exactly. So that was what I was like and I know that like I spent a lot of I spent so much time I think I alluded to this in my email. I spent so much time trying to do this other thing and it got so overwhelming for me to
process the amount of data I took it I boiled it back down. Um, so in a like and maybe part of why I feel so sure is because I'm like reflecting on my own trauma of having tried to like touch policy and then feeling like oh god policy was a disaster to try and
incorporate. So I don't know what to make of that. I'll just say that like my certainty about feeling worried about >> touching be was or like how to >> my certainty about not wanting to touch policy was basically born of this whole experience because I was very
>> yeah I think before that >> I really take that to heart. I think that we have we have tried not we you did it but it is given as a collective exper experience that it makes sense to have policy be a separate document and so this I would say let's have a
handbook that doesn't copy policy >> and I think what's important one thing you said that's important just now Mariah is that there may also be things in policy that don't need that aren't policy
and aren't helpful in policy, shouldn't be in policy, and would be better off in a handbook. >> And that's what I was thinking was could we sort of could we if we landed roughly on a structure for the handbook, then we could go back through. It's almost like flipping the experience of like rather
than trying to pull policy into handbook like before we've created the handbook, it's like let's make the handbook and then see if there's anything that we could clean out of the of policy. Yeah. >> So, for example, I'm looking in policy. Yeah. >> Like,
and also we don't, right? So, that makes sense. What you just said, I agree with because if we're trying to accomplish a handbook, we're probably best to just stick with that with a framework to the
extent that we can of like what it what function we want it to have, right? and then we can go back later and if there's things that need to move out of policy into a handbook that's fine but I think
it's so for me there's still just this struggle of like understanding what the purpose and use of it is will sort of determine the structure and the content and for example and you guys might not this is a question really like page five
of section B the code of conduct up >> that does overlap. >> Is that really policy? >> Right. Exactly. So, I pulled that over into ours thinking I don't like I sort of again like I was like I really feel like that's not a policy necessarily. I'm not sure though. I mean again this
is all for up for discussion. >> I mean I guess and I I'm just going to like put my naive on the table. Like in a way I I'm almost tempted to Google like what is policy versus a handbook
and let AI tell me because policy is a funny thing, right? Like policy is not law, but it but it's pretty strict. Like it's sort of it's it's not mass general law, but I consider policy
sort of on par with like law. not not legal but like really shoulds of like this is how we do things. This you know like I think
violating a policy to me um you like if if something's done outside of the bounds of policy I'm really like oh that is like really not okay. And then handbook to me is sort of like sort
of how what you were saying like I might not put it the same way but like things are not I wouldn't put it as things although I agree with the statement things are going to go better for you if you do things this way but sort of just like here's how things go in practice
more like >> here's what Claude says. I asked Claude because I like the idea of just >> Claude is like a it's like a it's by Anthropic. It's Nor Eastern has a partnership with them which is why I just asked it. Um but it's it's the uh
>> it's like chat GPT only it's >> Claude the one. Yeah, Claude. So I just asked it that kind of question. It says handbooks better choice. And I like this sort of differentiation. And it's like policy manuals tend to be more formal detailed reference documents that
outline specific procedures, compliance requirements. I don't know about the operational protocols, but okay. Consulted less frequently and the handbooks are I like this idea of like the more frequently because it ties to what you were saying Sarah about like this isn't the document you read in your first week and then throw away. It's
hopefully something that like you might refer to. >> Yep. >> Okay. Okay. So, I wrote down a handbook um we believe is less formal than policy. Um um a handbook is consulted more frequently. What else do you want
to I'm just putting this right into our document. It's really to me it's sort of like the to how do you do things like part of what I find helpful in the handbook is the section on like email protocol because this comes up all the
time like if you get an email like who should you send it on to who should you not send it on to you know don't call a principal when somebody complains like that kind of thing. >> Yeah.
>> Um, >> the other thing I like about what this said was, and this is sort of a little bit like we're talking about, it says, "If your code of conduct is brief and focuses on expectations, and values, put in the handbook. If you have detailed compliance policies, reporting procedures or legal regulatory
requirements, you might include the core principles in the handbook and the detailed procedures in the policy management, which we don't like have that like there's no like if someone has violated the code of conduct, go to you know like do not pass go directly to jail. There's no censure mechanism for
code of conduct that would be tied to this. And then it says some organizations do both. a concise, readable version in the handbook with a reference to the more detailed policies in the manual. But this is all making me think it really belongs in the handbook. >> That is so funny. I never know where
you're going until you say your conclusion. Never. >> It's so Okay. Huh. >> Um the some child is at the door. Hold on. >> Oh, I thought you meant at my door for a second. That's just the day I'm having. >> Oh my god. her child will fit through
the door. So, okay. So, we probably I mean this is important and at the same time should we start looking at some well there's the question that Sarah
started with which is a fundamental question at this point which is like which document do we want to now work from? >> Yes. And then should we how do we proceed from here?
>> Sarah, can I ask a clarifying question there? So beyond the um you added the roles and responsibilities like the division of labor between school committee and superintendent there. Um which I also can live with. Like it's
okay with me if it's there. Um I think it like MASC wants it to be but we could put it over here. Um but like beyond that are there other huge changes you made or was that the big change? Can you just walk me like walk us through anything else you changed?
>> So what I did is I put any reference when um Caroline was going through and she was saying you know does this make more sense if does this make sense to be here? Shouldn't we have the um roles and responsibilities up front? I checked off
those comments and I put it there and then every other comment I have written to you at Mariah. Um I think we should accept this one and those are the ones that I accepted and then I kept the other ones. I think that we're we sort of have I thought we had gone down the road of saying we're not going to use
that second document. So, I think we just stick with the first But I no I hadn't gotten there because I think I like >> the more I'm talking about this I'm I'm willing to flex like if we're starting to pull stuff out of if we're starting to think about what things were
already we've like and as a three-person group are recommending that we pull out of section B already that if you two feel and I'm sort of on the fence but if you two feel that roles and responsibilities like that division of labor between superintendent and school committee really goes in the handbook
like let's do that that's okay with me, too. >> So, I should jump in. So, I'm not sure, but I can think about it that when I suggested potentially having the roles
and responsibilities in our handbook that I was thinking about it as division of labor, but like in fact, I was just going to say, do we need all the superintendent parts?
Because this is this is >> Yeah, I think that that's still >> I mean you could have in each one like at the B under school committee you could have like versus superintendent linked to mask.
I just fear having like so much >> content. Let's put let's put that aside because I do think that we could consolidate that. Let's just like as as if we were we were going to vote something. Do we think that we want to start out with roles and responsibilities in our handbook? That's
the question on the table. I think I would like roles and responsibilities in the handbook. I am agnostic at this point on order because there's for me still so much content that I am not decisive about what comes
where. >> Okay. But somewhere near the beginning, I think it makes logical sense. But okay, >> not a hill to die on for me. So I'm >> So So other than adding the roles and responsibilities and accepting the things that you were like, "Yeah, this
makes sense of Caroline's comments." Did you make any other big changes, Sarah? >> Yes. And I um took out any reference to this being to somebody who's new to school committee. >> Oh, okay. And then I made I started to say like this is what needs to be deleted if we go this route, but I
didn't delete it yet. >> Okay. But all those comments are in the prior version too, right? >> Yep. >> Okay. Um, >> and I still made a few more comments. >> That's what I'm confused by is like
>> Yeah, >> I was trying to keep plowing through it. So would it be possible would it be would it mess up sort of the track you were on Sarah? Would it
derail what you the direction you were going in to just take the roles and responsibilities and put it in the previous document or is there >> we can do that. >> Okay. only because I think we had
>> Why don't you go ahead and do that now? You can go. >> Let me take what you did and move it over. Hold on. >> Let's Let's not be in the cop. Just be very clear. We're not in copy of We're in the original. >> Yeah, exactly. >> And we're not going to look at copy of anymore. >> I'm just gonna You formatted the text
well. So, I'm just going to take what you did and drop it into the other one. >> I just love when people actually use the styles. So, thank you. Um you my techn lack of technological knowledge is so it's embarrassing like I
barely know how to use this like track changes like I was like how did Sarah get those things where it says delete and replace >> like I don't >> you just use suggesting don't you know how to use suggesting or no >> we should show you if you don't know
>> it's on suggesting no it's on suggesting and ultimately I figured it out that if I just pressed delete. But I think I was afraid to press delete. I didn't want to delete somebody else stuff. I didn't want to delete someone else's. I wanted to suggest and I didn't know
that that I mean it really just shows you like how very very small my life is. So not necessarily. But does it Here's one question I have though. Like should the headers be roles and responsibilities for school committee and superintendence
or like is really role and responsibilities for school committee and we sort of >> I think school committee roles and responsibilities. >> Yeah. And then and then the superintendent part is just like it's to show it's almost like in opposition. Oh, it's not it's it's different than that
other thing. Um but we don't name that it's for and superintendent. Now, what happens? Again, I'm just playing devil's advocate. What happens if a superintendent comes along and is like, "But your policy manual doesn't have any responsibilities for me."
>> Yeah, I know that's not going to happen. >> I think it's I think that's fair. I just um I don't understand does do superintendents have like there's no necessarily like a job description that they are working against.
>> I know this is addressed that elaborative one there there are there is there are accepted responsibilities of the superintendent but you're right that it's not at that level the way that I would proceed now is I think that it doesn't make sense to
go through and delete all that superintendent I think that that deserves a good edit because there might be like I think what I would do is I would take it out of >> oh I wasn't going to delete it I was just going to take it out of the header I think it's really important because it helps you understand where the line is >> I will spend the time to work in if any
of the part given to the superintendent needs to be done. But I think what I would do is I would probably put this stuff over not being bulleted. Um because it it doesn't need to go under a school committee heading, right? All of this yet. But then what I would
do is while I was formatting like that, I would read what it said about the superintendent and see if any of that needs to be put in before I delete it. >> I don't want you to delete the superintendent thing. I think it's I personally like I would like to say like like as you have the policy thing I like
the idea of like it's that's the that's the school or like it's clear that like this is the school committee responsibilities and then it's like you know in comparison these are the superintendent responsibilities or compare this with the superintendent role or something like that or your role
is not to be the superintendent who does this or something like that. So like >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. But but then are you but you're saying something different than the way it looks currently. >> I haven't um so if we look at page what page >> I understand what you're saying Sarah
and like it could even be I'm going to just this is just spitballing like it could say like parentheses versus superintendent. >> Exactly. >> And list and it could even just list thing. Although I like bullets but like it's almost
>> I personally like the bullets too. um or whatever it is, but like >> um >> it's almost an afterthought because what we really want to convey is our responsibilities, but but counterpointing it to the superintendent
stuff is is really helpful and for me it gives me a clearer view. >> Yes, me too. something like that like these are the role this is your job in policy whether it's whether you make it a bulleted list or like if it should be if there's room for bullets I prefer that because I have
like walls of text are hard to read so >> um however you want to format that was saying Sarah you're right Sarah that each one doesn't need to say school committee because that's implied >> exactly yes >> I like that I totally agree with and
then >> and somehow the finance word got dis it the formatting disappeared, but we'll sort that out. >> Sorry, I I'm working on that right now. >> Okay, perfect. >> And I guess page break >> and I don't care if you guys want to
work on order sort of early on. For me right now, there's so much and I'm still kind of digging through what's even in here that like I for me, I can live with like let's just keep working on the content and figure out the order later.
Like this might even end up for me being something I probably need to print out and then be like lay it out and be like because it's difficult for me on the laptop cuz it's so much and I
kind of need to see it. I I might print it everything out, lay it out and be like, "Oh, these are the parts that are repetitive. This should go here." So, I'm just putting out there that like
I don't um we might understand better how we want the order to be later. >> Okay. Um, can I jump to something else
or should we >> Yeah, I think that that seeing that I I do want to work for like another half hour and then be done. I think that I've gotten enough information to attempt to do that. The worst part is just the formatting is so messy that I can't get rid of like this page break right here.
But, um, other than other than that, I think I got what you guys want. Um, and yeah, let's go into something new. >> I'll just sort of throw out. So, I like I said before, for me, things that are helpful are these things like I'm now on
page 13, section 10.3, request for information from staff. So, for me, that's important information. I also feel like that keeps there's like a few different places and ways that that general topic is addressed. So, I hope
we end up with something cleaner, >> right? >> But I do think it's important and it's the kind of thing, right, that like keeps coming up like >> Yep. That's the type of thing that I if I spend, you know, an hour on this, I can um help us with.
>> Okay. And then I'm going to >> Sorry. Can you repeat the part about what you were just talking about? Sorry, I had a kid. >> I was just saying that I think like section 10.3 request for information from staff. I think this comes up
>> someplace else and it maybe it comes up under communication norms. So I would love to have that kind of guidance. So again, and this is a word I started to use in some of my comments. I think like for me it's helpful to have a
handbook for guidance like >> oh what am I supposed to do like I have something I want to talk to someone about but I don't want to do the wrong thing or step on any toes so how am I supposed to do that again so it's guidance um I do think the like
communication with staff comes up in a few places um >> and it would be good to just get it into one place whatever you want to call whether it's procedural or a norm or whatever. And then I'm going to say
something else that's totally unrelated. This whole section 10.4. Um I was sort of like, "Oh, now you're losing me." Like I don't really want a
handbook to tell me how to think. Like I can read a book about like this start. >> Yeah, I think that has to go. >> That's totally fine. I just I thought it was interesting from the old handbook and was sort of trying to like glean like wisdom people were sharing, but I do not care if it stays.
>> Okay. Okay, good. I didn't know if Okay, good. Cuz I thought you guys might >> I love that section and I'm willing to die on that hill. No, I'm not. >> Sorry. So, where is that? I've just lost that. >> It's um thinking about issues. It's 2.5.
>> 2.5. Okay. >> The one thing that I did like in this one actually um is and I didn't really like the part where it gets to like effective school committees follow rational decisionm but what I did like and maybe this ties to the bit about
roles and responsibilities is that first paragraph about theoretically the school committee makes policy and the superintendent makes administrative decisions but there's there's blurry bits. So that paragraph is the one I was like, "Oh, I like that paragraph." >> And I didn't understand it,
>> which doesn't mean it can't be in there. But >> yeah, but I guess that my my taking of it is that like polic people like to think that there's a stark line between policy and practice. But the reality is that your policy is essentially going to
often define your your procedures or your practice. and your procedure or your practice might really actually have like policy implications. So they really like there's like a a level at which they really start to bump up against each other and you can't detangle them.
Um and so it's like important for people to sort of have a more subtle >> Yeah. I have an existential problem with all of that. Like I I spend a lot of time thinking about that because um when you're managing a group of people um you can't always just be directive, right?
Um things practice really happens out of what people buy into and what they um you know, especially when you have people that are dealing with young people, right? Young people are so complex. So the practitioner has their way of going about things that works and they're not going to be going running
over to the policy book and be like, should I do this or that? Like >> exactly. Exactly. >> Like I've got 15 million decisions I'm making right now in the next three minutes and I'm going to go with that. You know, and so sometimes policy feels like not even important to me, right?
It's it's if it doesn't grow up from that real practice if you're not talking to the practitioner. >> Exactly. So policy like if policy is relevant it has to like for policy to be relevant it has to have like at some
point there's a blurry boundary because if it it somehow gets over to this idea of practice right like if the if the cell phone manual had said like um I don't know I'm trying to think of some like if the cell phone that students are supposed to have their
phones at all time and talking to people like >> I don't know I'm just trying to be like I really give it a >> yeah whatever the ridiculous thing is if something if it doesn't work, it's not happening. >> The practitioners are just going to be like, "Yeah, right." You know? >> Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. So, >> and and I don't mind if this stays in, I
still don't understand it. And it's super interesting to me listening to you guys who both have some understanding of this. And to me, it sounds completely esoteric. And it's interesting, too. And maybe hi, maybe Sarah, since you just went back to the classroom, you might
I'm guessing you really have like classroom on your mind, right? And it's so interesting now you're a school committee member and you're going back to the classroom. So I'm guessing you have like a lot of really interesting thoughts going on.
So and I guess for me like so when you started talking about practitioner I was like oh right cuz I don't even really think about that cuz we're a governance body. So like I don't like I just assume teachers are
doing their thing. It's not my business. Um >> I'll give a different example though that this has come to the school committee. So remember when Jim Marini decided that um buildings were going to be closed. >> I remember. Yeah.
>> Yes. This was like 2021 or something like that. Caroline, we had the pandemic. People used to be able to go. parents used to be able to pick up and drop off in the buildings and now you can't pick up and drop off in the buildings anymore. >> So that was an administrative decision that had quite a bit of policy, right? essentially it was saying that our
buildings are not you know like and so the point is that if we were to come up with a policy and we've al actually all been thrashing through this recently of you know what is our building use and access policy given this administrative decision that you know we've pushed back on in building principles have said very
clearly like don't do not like this is an administrative decision that they want to stay. So, how do we how does a policy be craft? How is a policy crafted? If we were to craft a policy that says buildings need to be, you know, parents need to be led into the buildings or have access to the hallways.
>> Oh, >> right. From 7:30 to 8:30 or students need to be in the building starting at 7 a.m. or whatever it is. It would not be adhered to. So, that's the point of like administrative decisions having policy effects and policy like there is right like that's the sort of Yes.
the gears where the gears start to engage at a very like this won't work if we don't do this right level. >> That makes sense. And again, if you guys want to keep this in, that's totally fine. And that's interesting. I'm
thinking about the line >> somewhere else about >> which I think we'll talk about too. Um, school committee meetings are meetings that are public but not public meetings. But let's talk about that when we get to
it. I feel like it's it's a bit of a who's on first for me. Um, but I'm glad you guys both like this paragraph and understand what it means. >> Okay. So, we can delete out the rest of that thinking about issues thing, but we can move that one into the roles and
responsibilities section. Does that make sense? Yep. >> Okay. I'm just going to drop it in the front and you can do with it what you will when you rearrange that bit. Um, and I'm going to get rid of thinking about issues al together. >> Thank you. And then there's a couple
places too. >> Wait, can we talk about meetings in public versus public meetings? >> Where is that? >> Um, I think it's the roles. Is it in roles and norms? I'm pretty sure it is norms and I know I
made a lot of comments but I just was >> I'm sorry I understand that one. >> It's the last one in ROS and norms under the first section. >> What page is it on? Can you give me >> 11? The very bottom of page 11. >> Okay. >> And so a public meeting is one that the public can participate in and a meeting
in public is essentially a committee meeting in public where people can observe versus um participate. So that's the difference. And where sorry where what bullet >> bottom of page 11. >> Oh okay I'll tell you why I struggle
with this statement because it is a public meeting. I mean maybe there's another way to put this and to me that's really important. Like it is a public meeting and that's why we have to um follow the open meeting law. like it
is technically and like we >> no it's a meeting held in public not a public meeting. A public meeting like by definition is one that the public can participate in and that they could ask questions they can comment on the topics >> like we don't do that. Are you frozen?
Can you hear me still? >> I can. >> Okay, Caroline, you're frozen. Oh, you're back. >> Oh, you were freezing for me for a second. So, it must be my internet. >> So, >> did you hear what I was saying about the difference? Yes, but I guess I want to kind of look that up because for me the whole thing
of open meeting law is that it's >> I mean maybe m may maybe open meeting law applies to meetings of public bodies. Is that what you're saying? >> Yes. Exactly. Exactly. >> And that a public hearing
is one is >> Exactly. And that's why on advisory, you know how they're like, we are now opening the public hearing. And then they close the public hearing and that's because that's the part of the meeting that's the public meeting as opposed to the meeting held in public. >> Okay. >> Yeah.
>> But I wonder if it should be reframed like the meeting unless otherwise noticed, it's a public it's a meeting held in public, not a not a public hearing. That might help. >> To me, that would be clearer. >> Okay. because I'm on the school committee and I didn't even understand
this >> and it feels like someone's trying to be cute and say something that I don't understand what they're trying to say. >> Yeah, I think you're right that there was a bit of like cuteness as opposed to but it got then it made the meaning the
meaning I feel like it's one of those things that leaves me just like what are you trying to say? Just say it. Like if you want to say something, just say it. Um >> unless
noticed as a public hearing, a school committee meeting um is just is not a public meeting. But and then here's a question too and again with there's probably nothing in here that is going to be a hill to die on for
me. But why do we have to have if we're not the public? We're on school committee. So why do we need to understand that our meetings are not public hearings? >> Do you know what I'm saying? >> I do know what you're saying, but I think it's the part and I think you're right. This whole section or this one
could be rewarded, but it's like they need to be efficient meetings. Like if we if say every time the public says like that's not true then the meeting got derailed or someone in the public said I want to comment on blah blah blah like have you been to our school committee meetings when for whatever
reason that has happened it like it really slows down things >> where that happens >> and then I guess I assume the chair gave >> not always and that's when things like once you open up the door to it then
it's like really unfair because why did four people get to talk and then the fifth one's like tries to talk and um and all of a sudden the chair is like too much. We can't have any more public comment. That's just not fair. I think
>> the third sorry >> that the reason it should be in our handbook is that you want members to understand when that circumstance happens. Th the
this is this is why the chair might gavel or we need to work together and be in agreement about how our meetings shall be conducted and not that's why you think it needs to my question still is like okay that's interesting and
important but why is it in >> I guess the way I'm think because like your questions are well put and to me the takeaway of that section was make sure our meetings are run efficiently like everyone gets the like everyone should show up understanding that like we're going to try to adhere to our times, like we're going to do public
comment at a certain time. It's respectful to all participants to not have like random public comment. Some people aren't allowed to um and that we end on time. We don't make people, you know, if we were going to if we said we're going to end our meeting at 9:30, it kills me every time
that we run off schedule, particularly when we run past the end of the night. And so that's what I think to me the critical part of that meeting of that sentences is like our meetings should be run efficiently and on time and like >> we welcome public like if you somehow
engage with the public it starts to like contribute to that but maybe that part about the public doesn't need to be there. It's just like respect the timing of the meeting and like it >> but it's but it's not just timing. I mean it's it's exactly everything that you said and it's also you know if you were to have a third party come in
that's not the not the um parents of school children and community nor is it school committee members and they are allowed to speak and sort of testify to something and they weren't on the docket that's not right either right like there's it kind of it's a it's a point
that precludes so many different things um it and to my mind it is kind of clear is that this is a meeting held in public for all the reasons that you've said. Plus, we're in control of the content. You know, we're we're the ones that are this is our our time to do this work because
we don't get to because of open meeting law, you know, do this at other places. We are here to do this work now. You know, >> that's such a good point. Like our our hours together are limited. We have to treat them as precious. >> Yeah. So, and again, all of that makes
sense to my mind. Like, and what you're saying makes sense, too, Sarah. I mean, this is my second year on school committee. I haven't seen like some like, I don't know, Raul Fernandez doesn't come in and start shouting in the middle of meetings. I'm using that
as an example cuz he's not a parent and um whatever else you said. But that I I don't know. Just like if a random person started talking then I assume the chair would gabble it >> but they haven't always that's the point it
>> okay then that's on the chair and I still don't see where that becomes sort of a handbook thing efficient and I would see and I also don't m I actually would see this sort of like >> I can see it being in the handbook that
you want us to all be on the same page in terms of public comment is limited to the public comment time, but like that's there. I don't know. I'm not I still don't It's sort of like what is that? Like
>> we have a thing about public comment. We all know the guidelines of public comment. Efficiency makes sense. I could see that being a bullet, but I don't see where like a handbook about what the
school committee is. Why we'd have a thing of like a random person can't come in and start shouting because that doesn't have to do with us. >> That's why I'm going back to the committee meetings are effective and
efficient. But also, I will say that um there have been times that our chair decides to suspend that rule and I find it I'm not saying our current chair because I don't think Val has done this yet, but I could be wrong, but chairs in the past have, and I find it incredibly
infuriating. And so to the extent that our chair needs to also be held to like account to by the committees, like this is a rule. We have a process. >> So, do we want to have a section And this and maybe it is in here somewhere
and I haven't gotten to it yet. Like is there something in here or policy about the chair? And also that reminds me is there something in here about
docket meetings? There is something in there about Yeah, it's explained. Yeah. Um I would say that like my um thinking about it is it's not just the chair and I'll give an example of something that I am guilty of which is
sometimes people say things in public comment and even though we're not supposed to respond I respond or but it's not necessarily one person right but like we might make something and we don't have to do that right like and it starts to disrupt the flow and then that person wants to comment back or add
additional you know like it it's a bad habit. that we shouldn't do and it's not all on the chair, >> but it's not a h I mean, you're saying you've done it. I can't remember a time you've done it and I certainly wouldn't characterize you as having that as a habit. >> I didn't say I don't think I said I have
a habit, but I have done it. >> Um, so >> and that's covered in public comment. >> It is. It's covered in the public comment policy which I think should stay in policy.
I don't know if if that's in two. I can't remember. I think that is in two or B not two. >> This section is roles and norms the school committee will. So again, like and this is just what it
this we talked about this a little last year and I remember at the time thinking like someone's trying to say something here that they're not just saying and and I I so um or if it's about in response to like
some discrete event that happened one time, I can understand people having a response to something that happened one time and maybe wanting it to not happen again, but I'm not convinced that that's
role norms of school committee. >> See, I I disagree. I think this is like the one of the most important things is like you can't you might come to the committee with your own set of experiences, but you can't let your parochial interests guide your participation, right?
So, are we still on this bullet about public meetings? >> I just wrote on that one something still to Wordsmith. I made a comment on it as we went along. I don't think we necessarily like my goal for this is
that we come to a first draft that we at least agree on like the basic structure of if not of every word and then we get input from the committee like are we even on the right track? I don't want to make some like perfect product or quote unquote perfect product and then like
the committee be like this was not what we were thinking at all. >> I don't know. Does that work for the both of you? Sarah, what do you think? >> Yep. That >> cuz like they might say I'm just giving one example like the rules and norms that you're asking about too. Like what
if we got to the what if we spent all this time on it and the committee was like we don't even want that section at all. Well, like let's not even waste our time on it, you know? >> Yeah. Okay. >> I would like to like things to me that are important are as I'm thinking about this right now like making sure that we
sort of have content in every section. Um or not. I'm okay with that. Not making sure that the sections are more or less what we're hoping for. Agreeing among the three of us that we're okay or not okay. And if we're not okay then we
need to figure that out. But like um okay with having a separate roles and responsibilities versus roles and norms versus member code of conduct like how we deal with that idea that there's like many different this like this this >> I won't say I hate the term skinning a
cat but like you know this idea has been dissected in multiple different ways. Should we consolidate or not? That might be something we take to the full committee for guidance on. >> Yeah. You know we're never going to get through it if we if we approach it that way. I think it's I think it's much better to be concise to get rid of
redundancies and to show a completed product than to try with a group of nine to ask you know >> no I wasn't saying to them like tell us like like let's do this a group but saying to them do you do you want do you prefer to have different ways of
thinking about this issue so that different people have different thinking styles and one might resonate another or do you think we should have to your point one clear set of roles and norms that we stick to and like then say leave it all random give us one set then we go
ahead and we if it's the latter we go ahead and consolidate like I want a sense of the committee not them words smithing along with us if that makes sense >> I think I agree with Sarah here that it's going to make more sense for us to do I think there's still a lot of
consolidation that can happen here before we bring something to other people. >> I think so too. But on that particular whole area, I'm not sure. I mean, it's up to you all if you want to do that. Okay. >> It has to have something. And maybe,
you know, I can also take a stab at some, but we should maybe we should talk about how right there's roles and norms, code of conduct, and there's
in the I mean I think what matters in the end more is the bullet points and then we can decide what it's called whether it's called norms or code of conduct like those are kind of different
words for the same thing but the content and the guidance >> yeah I wasn't suggesting that the top level thing mattered it was more like are you trying to consolidate and if the two of you want to consolidate I would I think that will break my brain and I
would love to just stay out of that and let you two figure out like how to consolidate. So make decisions there whether you do it after one after the other or I also feel like I I feel too um I like
too much that's there. I don't think I can do the reason I'm fighting that is I can't like I'm one of the people who actually would appreciate multiple perspectives on it. So I don't think I can be good at >> Yeah. Uhhuh. >> Which is okay. It I don't like if I did
what I imagine I was a future school committee. What I don't know existed won't hurt me. Like if we come up with something good, that'll be great. There is so much in here. Oh my god. Cuz we are talking about this like esoteric
stuff like a meeting in public is not a public meeting. And then I'm scrolling down. It's like parking. Yeah. >> Um, so again, I want to be sort of flexible,
helpful, not step on toes if other people are committed to doing certain things. Sarah, what's your I would be perfectly happy to sort of I can envision myself printing out a bunch of stuff. all of the places where we have norms,
code of conduct, roles and responsibilities, and at least trying to sort of put it together and then suggest some edits. Um, unless Sarah you feel like committed to doing that yourself. >> No, that sounds great. You want go at
it? >> I can try that. And if you want to leave in some stuff sort of like Mariah's style, I can I can then help you out afterwards. >> Okay. >> And if you would both prefer me to just point out redundancies instead of get
rid of them, I can do that too. But what I need is I need like a clear clean document to start with like where we've dealt with like the sort of smaller issues. Um, and then I'm able I'm able to highlight for you and point out redundancies. Like I can put into one comment like, "Oh, look, this is spoken
about here and I can put number one in the comment." And then later on in the document when it's mentioned again, I can say see number one above and highlight it and tell you which of the two I would recommend to delete or rewrite. I'm I'm happy to do that. I
can't do that on top of all of our other thinking. >> Yep. I'm thinking that I'm gonna pull out everything that's in that realm and create a separate document that can then that I can then help you out with.
>> Okay. Um, does it also help like because I wrote it or I sent you the document on Monday or whatever it was and then I had no time to go back and look at the the comments you both made, but on the ones at least that Carolyn you made and Sarah said I agree like assuming I'm on board
too. Should I just go through and like I think it's helpful to start to >> that would be super helpful. >> Okay. So I will commit to doing that probably not today but like tomorrow if that's okay. What what I also would find helpful if you both are willing to do this is like
why don't if it's possible and I'm happy to help with the formatting of this or you could even do it like but keep it all in this one document right now if we're sort of on board with like these are roughly the headers like then um we can make like it like even if you do it at like the very bottom like Caroline
where you rewrite or just like in a new section you're like here's my new consolidated whatever you don't have to worry about the formatting of it but like keep it all in one place so that um we're working off of like at least for now one document. Is that okay?
>> I think it's okay except >> like I just get freaked out by all the scrolling. >> But you're just working and consolidating section two, right? Like I guess my point is even if you have Well, it's okay. I It's fine. do do whatever
works for you. >> But I hear what you're saying. I mean, there's a danger. Maybe I'll change everything that for me process-wise, it might help me to have a separate document. But I can take
everything that I move into a separate document and change the color of the font to green or something. I just want to know when I come back, what did I mess with? >> But you don't have to change. You just hit suggesting. I'm going to show you this so that you understand how it's
working. So like you know how track changes exists in regular Word documents. >> Yeah. >> Okay. So >> where are you? >> Hold on. I'm pulling it up. See how right here editing, of course, stupid Zoom just put our stuff in front of it.
Editing means you just edit. Suggesting once you toggle that to suggesting that's >> Yeah. So if you do that then it will show your text right there as like it'll be right there. >> I Yes. And that's what I was working in.
I just Okay, I'm going to do it the way I think I have to do it. >> Okay. Or like but if you have a whole section that's brand new, you can just be like this is my brand new section and just accept it, you know, like it's more to edit the existing text. Um, >> Mariah, would you be willing once you do
the little edits to it off to Carolyn by just writing her a text or an email to say, "I'm done." And then the time that Caroline has it, you both stay out of it. So, >> can I make one other comment? I somehow I don't think this was me, but I'm not
sure. Section five, which I thought was blank on subcommittees, now has all of the wording from policy in it about subcommittees. >> Yeah. So, I thought that that was fair game because you said um at a different point um fill in the rest of this thought and so I wanted that too. So, I
put that in for you. >> No, I was thinking not because I don't want to replicate policy. Um I was thinking more like more like how do subcommittees work? How do you know like >> is there different how does Go ahead and delete that. That's fine. >> Okay.
>> I know that now but I didn't know that before. Um, >> wow. There's a lot of stuff in here. >> It is a lot of stuff, but right now it's >> good though. >> 27 pages.
Um, >> that's not terrible. >> It's not when you think about the policy manual. >> I'm just looking at like a conclusion. >> I'm gonna let you guys um >> Okay. Finish up. Thanks. >> Thank you, Sarah. Have a great weekend. You Bye. >> Bye.
Okay. >> And like 27 pages isn't horrible. One, the first two pages are like a cover and a table of contents, right? >> And so here, well, and then let's finish. So conclusion, I'd have to look at what I said here. So like convince me
why do we have the mission, the vision, the core values just cuz like that's just good stuff to be reminded of. >> That's kind of what I was thinking is it's like it's not policy. It's something we have voted, but we also like it feels like >> it feels like Exactly. It's like so
fundamental. You should sort of have it in a reference manual. >> Yep. >> Yep. >> But also maybe it should go again. That whole conclusion I was like I'm not sure this is a conclusion. I think it really probably goes the beginning. So >> I was just going to say that it might even be the introduction. >> Yes, I think so. Especially when the
welcome isn't there anymore because the welcome's really going into the new person section. Um, >> and then here I'll say this and and I'll say for the millionth time I'm just saying stuff >> I don't care. >> I mean I care like it doesn't matter to
me tremendously. >> Yeah. >> Each year I don't love this. >> Maybe I'm just sensitive. Each year after an election, the composition and character of the school committee changes. >> I already I right now I already feel
like someone's lecturing me. I It sounds ped. >> Well, it's someone from 2003 because >> Okay, >> that came from 2003. >> Simple to maintain cohesiveness. And now I'm like, okay, you're opening with like the a negative. >> Yeah, I hear you.
>> Tensions and conflict. Welcome to school committee. Tensions and conflicts arise in the group. >> Well, you know, I actually thought like for all people think that like our per, you know, our current like, you know, whatever they are, our current dynamics are somehow unique. This paragraph made
me like realize that like we think we're so special and we are not that special. >> It was a reminder. >> I actually didn't know who wrote this or when it was from. >> And I actually don't know apparently I want to say um in the handbook even it
alluded to it was it took its work from like a handbook in like the 1970s or something. So I was like we are really not special here. So, and but I actually do um I
>> I like the school committee is motivated by improved or just like or just this is probably what I said like I kind of like Brooklyn school committee members work hard. They b me like the rest everything
above there to me is pedantic and negative >> and just feels like if I was it just is like >> and like sure it's a group there are dynamics but like do we need to talk about that in a hand I don't know it
feels like self-fulfilling prophecy >> I don't know Caroline I think that like there's a lot of people who >> don't don't know organizational behavior theory, don't know. There's so much that people, you know, they come to this
cold. So, >> so I but I hear what you're saying about I agree with you that there's negative bits in there and maybe it's like you should, you know, like it's normal for groups to like maybe it makes it a little bit positive, right? This is sounding a little bit like your body in adolescence. Like it's normal to fight
with people or whatever. >> Those feelings you're having are normal. Exactly. But it's kind of like it's kind of like that. >> Yeah. No, that makes no ton of sense. No, I I you're convincing me, but I
think I do like approaching it more like we are a partic this Brooklyn has a particularly large school committee. Everybody brings a perspective. >> Yeah. >> Um
I don't know whatever you were saying and >> but I think you're right that bit is also in there a little bit and like saying like exercising independent judgment and sometimes that can lead to disagreements, right? But like there's a way to think about this of like but there's an opportunity for all of us to
disagree while maintaining like civility and you know >> collegiality. >> Yeah. Collegiality. Exactly. And like that's like that has to be a goal of the committee is to like maintain that. But I do agree with you and if you're willing to move this section up to the or why don't I move it up because it's
hard for you to do the formatting stuff. >> I think it's the introduction. Yeah. >> Yeah. I think you're right. So it can be the introduction and then we'll move that welcome when I go through and read the comments and the back and forth between the two of you again probably tomorrow. >> I'll move that up. I'll move the welcome if you're a new school committee member
into that section. Um, one other question I have though is, and we didn't talk about this, is like, was there anything where there was like a huge thing that is really important for school committee members to understand that wasn't already like as a heading because I wasn't sure. >> I don't know. I'd have to because I'm I
have to say I probably wasn't paying a ton. Um, I don't know. >> Okay, Betsy, are you still there? >> Because I think that would be a really awesome like Betsy, you're the like front line of like school committee questions, so Just repeat that. What would you like?
>> It was really just like what is the handbook not like not necessarily that the content of each section is right but like what are like did we miss any big topics that people ask about that like we should develop content for >> and because like right now the big sections are like this rules and norms
then like I'm a new committee member like what what are my first days are going to be like then it's like what is a meeting usually like like what are the sections of the meeting? Here's something that came up between you and I recently, Mariah, which was like >> I have I still to me a mystery is like
how do things get on the agenda? >> That was in there. >> That's in there. >> That's in there. Doing. Yep. >> And maybe as I'm saying that, >> maybe that I don't know. I think it's worth thinking about whether we want to
have a whole section of like expectations of the chair or roles and norms of the chair like well I have a section called people you'll meet at the committee and part of that is filling in like the chair does this. It's almost
like def like the student representative is this, the assistant is this and and so it's not like taking Bets's the description of the assistant job from the um policy manual, but it's more like how do you actually how what does Betsy do during the committee meetings and
that kind of thing. And so the role of the chair I think could also be like that, right? because and you know I'm on I'm on the second like honestly it's a like if I'm interested in whether something can be docketed and I email
the chair can I expect the chair as a courtesy to respond to me >> right and that's covered in the docketing that's covered in docketing already exactly that >> and then there was the thing of like how do meeting materials like meeting
materials that could be a thing right like >> how to meeting materials what I forgot >> like what is what go like if you want something shared with the committee at a meeting >> oh yes yes yes right >> what are the processes for that is there >> might be in there but we'll have to
double check that >> because I've never really >> thought this came up with the calendar like I had done some >> um mockups that I thought would be helpful
for discussion because it's too esoteric to be like throwing out dates that you have to imagine in your mind, but I wasn't expecting them to be meeting materials in so far as I didn't expect them to be like publicized.
>> And so that was I mean and that might be too much level of detail, >> but I think that's actually No, no, no. That's a really important point because once you present them at the meeting, they're supposed to be public and they get posted, right? So, um >> so fine,
>> but also it's important for people to realize that like if they send something to the committee for consideration for the meeting, they need to know it's like going to live in eternity for the meeting, right? It might make them think to themselves, I'm gonna read off of something as opposed to I don't know. I don't know. Just to be helpful for
people to know. >> Yeah. Anyway, >> I like it if they became meeting materials, but I didn't intend them or maybe the argument you and I had was I wasn't intending them or the lack of clarity. I wasn't intending them to be
um suggestions or drafts, per se. I really was intending to to be just like visuals of a conversation that I knew we were going to end up happening >> gonna end up happening which was like
what if we move >> blah blah to blah blah and then people are like and talking to their neighbor. So, >> but then it also ends up like this is important though because it's subtleties that people don't really understand and
like for example in the case of the calendar I think it actually does have to be published like so someone might like there's the thing they might want to talk about the thing they might want to have for consideration. It's important to help people understand these subtleties. >> Yeah. Um, I got to go, but Betsy, when you get a chance, Betsy, will you just
like look at it and make sure like >> that we haven't missed the most like obvious things to tell school committee members. >> Yep, we'll do. >> Thank you. >> Thank you, Betsy. >> Have a good weekend, both of you. >> To be continued. You, too.
>> Oh, everyone. Oh, >> Betsy, will you do one more favor? >> Um, can we think about scheduling our next meeting of this group? >> Sure. Yeah. >> Okay. >> Uh I'll send something out then and figure out what works for everybody since >> Yeah. I think it's going to have to be early January is my guess. But yeah.
Okay. See what see what you get. >> Okay. >> Thank you. Bye. Bye. >> Night everyone.