--------- Good evening everyone. It is 5:02 p.m. Today is June 17th, 2025. We are the City of Cape Canaveral Community Redevelopment Agency CRA regular meeting at the city hall. This time I call the meeting to order.
With that, council or board member Davis, would you please lead us in the pledge? I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation
under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Thank you, board member Davis and the council for being here. City clerk, please call the role. Davis here.
Here present. All the board is present. Supporting staff, thank you for being here as well. At this time we want we're on item number four to approve the agenda as written or with amendments.
Make a motion to approve the agenda as written. I'll second. Got a motion by board member Willis, a second by board member Davis. Any further discussion? Seeing none, city clerk. Board member Davis here. I mean approve.
Board member Jackson, four, Vice Mayor Kellum, four. Chair Morrison, four, and board member Willis, four. All right. Motion remains as written. Now, we have a presentation on
legislative updates and business support programs. Yes. Um, I have my name is T. I'm the community and economic development director for the city. Um, nice to actually get to be a part of of CRA today. Um,
and I just want to make sure I'm on it. Okay. Um, so just a quick recap. Um, our CRA is just an area that we uh designate. Uh, sorry. Oh, you got it. Okay. Sorry. What's
going on here? Um, okay. uh just an area that we've designated to um uh to freeze the freeze the tax revenue and then collect that so we can use it to address blight in the areas and we um in the
area within that boundary. Uh we've used it so far to uh improve make improvements to the Cape Center and C5 and um have been working on uh a master plan for the presidential streets. Um the legislation uh there was a a little
bit of uh uh scrutiny for CRAAS that came underway this year, but um all bills that were challenging them were withdrawn. Uh there was a I think it would just became a a little bit of a Doge was at the height and people were concerned about using them for events
and things like that. Um but uh but cooler heads prevailed. both sides of the aisle both realize that they like CRAAS and all the things that they can accomplish with them. So, the word in Tallahassee is that they'll be ready for next legislative session, but um but they're not concerned about CRAAS
getting uh uh repealed, clawed back, or not being able to um create new ones. And so our CRA, oops, sorry, sorry, there you go. Uh so our CRA is um set to sunset in uh
September of 2040. So we have uh time to continue to grow revenue uh increase the valuation and then uh use the funding for projects uh around around the city. And um so uh for what we plan on doing,
we've just increased the budget for uh to $75,000 for business and residential grants for facade improvements in the blighted areas. And we're working on streamlining our application process to consolidate that, make it more user friendly uh and uh and clear for the
applications so we can uh increase the usage and encourage businesses uh and uh and residents like to access these funds and invest in our community. Um we also have uh a a host of uh uh authorized
uses from our 2012 plan that are still in effect. And so that's for beautifification projects, uh, uh, resiliency, flood mitigation, public safety, and so on so on. Um, and so we've had, um, a lot of or we have a few
projects that are in the hopper for this year that are continuing, uh, through that have been approved, but are continuing through 2027, I believe. Um so in our current projects
um we will um we have uh we have approved that the um Canaveral City Park redevelopment and I don't know why I'm nervous. Excuse me guys. It just got to the tiny words. Sorry. Um and then the presidential streets master
plan which um uh addresses flooding and uh is is kind of a long-term project that we're uh beginning to work uh on addressing one street at a time. Um the uh and continuing on with those, we have
um the fire rescue station uh which should be um uh lighting, it's a lighting protection system uh that should be uh wrapping up towards the ends of end of 2025. And um we have the concession stand with
the parks recreation and also um Nancy Hansen recreation center maintenance that are all included in part of our CRA funding uh for improvements that are on through the coming year. Um in addition there's uh Oak Lane improvements and
then again I was mentioning before the financial incentive grant program trying to encourage access and use of of that that those resources. um we can uh so we can see how some of
those things um uh some other ways that we uh are using it um and some some recent successes. We've had um uh fence restoration project where the community
members are able to apply for grants. They have some skin in the game. They're funding it partially themselves and then we match them that make the area look a little bit better. So that's um Harrison Avenue. And then we have um another recent project with the um uh
Canaval Boulevard, the Canaveral Breakers condominiums. And so I have the little befores and afters in there for your view so you can see. That looks great. Thank you. That looks so good. Yeah, I really that before and after. Sorry to
interrupt. Oh, no. Please interrupt. I was I tried to keep it short and sweet so we could see. And then uh the last one is uh the commercial facade improvement we've done with um Mangrove Marketplace. And so one of the things that we wanted to do is create a targeted business outreach in blighted
areas along A1A and some other catalyst sites where we can explain to them how the program works and encourage application and use as well as just get to know our business community and reach out and uh say thank you for operating here and that we invest in you if you invest in us and uh create kind of a
bridge uh from government to public so we can continue to grow and address uh blighted areas and I keep like uh um and uh and uh improvements to the to the community.
That was excellent. I really I was thinking about some of the totals and I think from there we can get a high level add those up and essentially see what the CRA has invested. Yeah. Um and I think we have currently in our budget
and John correct me if I'm wrong about three and a half million Uh well let's go let's go two and a half million but but it would be a yeah it's coming
becoming available. Uh so let's two and a half million two and a half million. Yeah. So, and and then we continue to grow it until I think 2039 is the last year we collect. And the reason uh Tamson said three and a half million is that
we're 2 and a half million next year. And because we're not utilizing those funds for presidential streets this year, it could push it to about three and a half million. So, combined into two years, but Yes. Correct. Thank you, Tamson. Thank you so much for for presenting. Council, our board, do we
have any questions? Um, I do. Yes, vice chair. Hi, Tempson. Hi. Thank you so much. Very nice presentation. So, these before and after shots of this projects that we've done, that's out of the uh 50,000 that we allocated last year and
so we're adding to that for this year. Yeah, we're increasing that and we're reaching out to businesses with that 75,000 as well. Yes. Cool. Thank you. Yeah, we are as soon as we finish consolidating the application. Uh, currently they're all just labeled as
appendix A through D and people have had trouble figuring out which one they're applying for. So, we wanted to get that the application process tightened up and streamlined and then we'll roll that roll that out and we have a whole citywalk planned. All right. Thank you.
Yeah, my pleasure. It was a good talk. Oh, thank you. I guess shy a little board member Jackson. I wanted to say Oaklane looks lovely. Um I have driven up there since we've
gotten it completed and very happy with the results. I also want to say Director Carile came in under budget on that. Yay. He worked with um an existing pipe
and saved us quite a bit of money and so literally under budget on time and looks great. So, thank you. Thank you, Tim. Yes. Thank you, Tim. Great job. Talked about that project for a very
long time. Yes. Thank you. Any other questions for Tamson at this time? Very nice presentation. Is that something? Well, you might have emailed it whenever you're ready that we can Oh,
yeah. go back through and look at it again. Absolutely. Thank you. Anything else for us? No, not at this time. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Deleo. Anything on that that you want to add? No, sir. Good job, Tamson.
It's a lot of information and uh I she got her arms around it relatively quick quickly and I think she hasn't been here that long and that's some good stuff. Yeah. And and before you Tamson before you know it you'll be dreaming about
this stuff and you'll never forget. Yes. Thank you. Don't go anywhere. No, no. Later on, it's enough this time. Um, we are the public participation portion
of the meeting. I don't have any public comment cards and don't see anyone I think who intends to speak here. So, um, we'll go ahead and close public participation. Uh, bring it to the consent agenda, which is the approval of the minutes March 18th, 2024 regular meeting.
Make a motion to approve the consent agenda. I'll second. Got a motion by board member Willis and a second by Vice Chair Kellum. Any further discussion? Seeing none, city clerk, board member Davis, four, board member
Jackson, four, vice chair Callum, four, chair Morrison, four, and board member Willis, four. Consent agenda, minutes pass 50, which brings us to item number eight. It's a discussion item submitted by board
member Willis. discussion on the allocation of CRA funds to support veterans in Cape Canaveral. Board member Willis, the floor is yours. Well, as it as it states on the the agenda item, but I'm requesting that we explore the
feasibility of allocating a certain percentage specifically for our veterans. I know we've had a couple of projects that were taken on by the sheriff's department. There's other things that uh are needed for we have a
high population of veterans in the city. Now, I know we're focusing on businesses as well, but if there's any way that we can allocate a percentage or hold a percentage for veterans, preferably CRA or of the 75,000 grant
funding, the grant funding of the grant funding. Yeah. Um Oh, I'm sorry. Go ahead. um we'd have to um if we were to change the eligibility requirements, we'd have to put that through the board. Um but the application uh uh we could we can we
can change. Well, I'd like to get discussion on the board to to see your feelings on it, but I think there's a certain percentage we should, in my opinion, we should allocate for veterans
up, you know, and if we don't get enough veterans applying for it to fulfill that percentage, then it's open to whomever's on the on the list. But I think it would be good. Yeah. make make a certain percentage a priority for veterans, but
I'm interested in what the board feels. Yes, Vice Chair Kellum. Um I think that's a great idea. The only thing I worry about, Don, is um when we started this before we had the allocation of 50,000 for um it was always brought up
that we you can't pick winners and losers and you can't pick one group over another group. And that's the only thing that worries me. I'm all about setting aside money for veterans. I I just worry about as far as um maybe Anthony could
answer that about picking a specific group. Uh you know, I don't want to get in trouble with the Well, I I don't think it's any different than giving preference to veteranowned businesses. You know, I mean, when you when you're
awarding contracts, sometimes you have a checklist, and if you're a veteranowned business, you get an extra at a boy and you get to the top of the list, just as a a disabled or woman-owned business. I mean, we have we have one of those in
the city who's been awarded many many contracts from the federal government because it is it's a woman-owned minority disabled veteran owner. Yeah. Anthony, are we allowed to include any
type of Well, just for clarification, when you talk about veterans, I mean, are you talking about maybe establishing a preference for um an potential application on one of our brickandmortar uh program programs?
Well, because socially social social programs are very fraught with problems under the CRA act. Um, I I would question whether social programs would constitute a um a bonafide redevelopment activity under the act. But if you're talking about one
of our existing grant programs and maybe considering putting in a veteran preference, then you know that's something that we can maybe explore and then come back to the board with. Um, but preferences tend
to be applied and implemented when people are beating down the doors for a finite amount of money. So, I mean, if we haven't we can't expend all of the money we allocate in the first place, a preference isn't going to mean anything.
All the veteran has to do is apply just like anybody else and the money will be potentially available. Right. Well, I I can see under the current management of our CRA
that uh it's going to be advertised a lot more. I think it's going to be promoted more um because we have vitality in the department now. So, I think you're going to see more
applicants is my opinion. Uh I just want to be sure that uh we can uh assist veterans wherever we can and if it if it's to Mayor I mean uh vice chair
Kellum's point if it is u picking winners and losers. Okay. All right. I understand. But I think it's uh worth the effort to see if we can do it. Yeah. If you want to look at, we can look at certainly look at putting together maybe
a preference. I mean, that would be, you know, an allocation of funding and and a and a change to the criteria and as our community development directors indicating, you know, changing criteria for the program has to come back to the
board for approval, right? So, we can we can Yeah. Well, I'm I'm just asking I'm just asking the board if that's something they are amenable to agreeing to. So, I'm happy to go if you want to go. Council member Jackson, I'm always in
favor of assisting our veterans in any way we that we can. So, um city attorney, I'm definitely interested in the legalities of it to make sure that it is something we can do. Um, if the funds aren't used, then of course
we can let release some for other businesses in the area. But with us being here nestled in between four bases, it would be really nice for us to give that support to the veteran community. I just want to make sure that it's legal. That's where I'm coming
from. Yeah. In um previous grant programs that I've done out in Washington, we've just put at the bottom, you know, preference will be given to um bipok, womenowned, veteranowned, disabled, and in our case, in our area, rural communities. Uh so I
don't know if we could put just like a blanket thing in the um in the application, but we do have to post the eligibility criteria with the application. So I just want to confirm for my next direction. Would we be uh presenting the new application then to
the board? No. Okay. No, it's the criteria. If we're going to if the board wants to establish a a preference, that has to come back to the board, right? But the criteria has to be included in the application. That's what I just want to make sure before we before we go out
and Yeah. Until you have an existing application that you use, right, for any Mhm. you know, anyone who wants to apply today. Yeah. Right. So you need that application. So if the criteria changes, the application would change after that.
I mean certainly in the meantime, you know, the the city administration can encourage veterans to apply. Yeah. Um can't provide a legal preference, but can certainly encourage veterans, make a special effort to encourage them to
apply. Um but a preference policy has to be has to be by criteria. And we can I believe that Florida has a list of veteranowned businesses
or Yeah. Okay. I'll double check that, but I think that we can also just make sure that when we do put out the information that we'll we'll specifically outreach as well. Yeah. Remember Davis? Yeah. I I think it's a good I have I had tubes down my throat
so I can't talk, but I think it's a great diet. I and I want what you can come up with would be great. Sorry. Thank you. Bo member Davis heard you loud and clear. It sounds like everyone here really supports obviously veterans.
Um, I think when I go through those programs and if we analyze I guess the first question I have is to our city attorney's point in that it was the first year 50,000 that we did the grant program a few
years back. Do we know if all that money was used? It has not. And I'm sorry if we okay to and I think that's valid is making them aware but I when we look take a step back to And look at the this CRA. You said
blight earlier, blighted properties, which I agree. I I think that is what the state statute says. And so the intent of the CRA is to improve blight. Doesn't say blight for veterans. It doesn't say blight for, you know, any minority group out there. It's just
blight. But I would be interested to know what the if we could find out wherever that money flowed into private property. Um if any of them were veterans and if so, let's see where we are before we arbitrarily
just pick a percentage or a number. And we might find that in terms of quantity or measuring in dollars. Be interesting to see what the percentage is. And when I think about dollars, I think about Veterans
Park, which total probably close to a half a million dollars. So we think about as a percentage of CRA, we did that to honor our vets. And then there's other programs like Melbourne does banners and stuff, but
when we get into that, those social promotional things, I get a little nervous. And if it is about blight and improving those areas, the CRA district, wherever that property is within the
boundaries, however we can, it would be good to identify some ranking or severity of the blight because it's not all areas. And the things that I think about when I
think about blight and the CRA is Port Canaveral Trailer Park or Filmore Lincoln Avenue where we have veterans in in wheelchairs on that corner due to flooding and so presidential streets, you know, that's going to help that veteran on that
corner. But it's not. It's because or or like the FPL power lines going through Port Canaveral uh trailer park that's going over veterans homes in there. I'm aware of that. And I think
when we look at what we've spent, add in Veterans Park, add in, you know, VFW. Let's see what we've done already. And yeah, I'm with the whole board to say I support if it passes some of the legal tests to figure out what we can do and
help. So, thank you, board member Willis. I appreciate the board willingness to discuss it and let's see where where it goes and uh I appreciate everyone bringing up their viewpoints and I think it would be a good thing to
to see what we can do. Thank you. Yeah, pleasure. and good luck. Yes. Thank you, Tamson. So, Mayor Morrison, is it possible? I know we have our boundary for the CRA and we have one resident that BCSO and a lot of people helped
this past month, helped clean the property up, got it painted, and that kind of thing for one of our veterans. Um, so is there any way as we're looking at that blight to be able to look at those because if they're in the CRA, I want to make sure I understand if
they're in the CRA and their property is blighted, it doesn't matter that if it's business or or residential. Is that correct? Okay. All private property is eligible within the CRA boundary, I think, is your question. Yes. In terms of the grant program for facade or
paint, I don't have the policy in front of me whether it also applies to does it apply to residential? Okay. Okay. Thank you. One of my other CRAAS absolutely does not expend funds for residential facade improvements.
It's dedicated to commercial. Not to say that you can't have both, but I can't remember whether Cape Canal was resed with a business permit. We did just commercial and then we brought it open the residential. Okay. But if we have
properties that are veterans within those boundaries, whether they're residential or not, and they need cleanup and they need assistance on the outside looking better, that is the definition of blight. So, boy, I would be interested in helping those individuals. Some of those individuals
may not have family or friends to help them. And so that becomes a point for council member Willis's pro, you know, program for this that I think would be helpful. I have a question.
Can we proactively assist from those funds or do we we we would need to wait for them to apply? We can't disseminate them, you know, directly to them. I think um
we we can't come up with the project for them. They've got to want it. It's not how the program's designed. Yeah. No, we can encourage them based on them their circumstances. I think we could encourage um they it is for exteriors uh
um and uh and uh renovations uh signs and I think I think even loosely landscaping is included in that but I have to check a little further. Um, but to your point, I mean, we would it administratively, would it be something
that the board is amunable to in revising the application and the eligibility that we just add like a fivepoint weighted scale for underserved community members? And no. Okay. No, I
don't know what you mean by underserved. And I can just tell you that the recent trend in case law Yeah. regarding establishing preferences that may violate section 1981 of the U of the floor of federal federal code is in
play. Got it. Okay. Doesn't I don't think that applies in the case of veterans. That's why I'm I haven't brought it up until you said underserved. We have to be concerned about racial preferences. Yeah.
And things like that. Even, you know, womenowned businesses. There's questions about that now. Yeah. Um because of recent case law we will continue to adjust the application and promote it and then if
should we determine that a demand is needed then we can revisit the eligibility. Is that I just confirm that's the direction. I think I don't want to speak for the
chair, but No, your intent I think is Yeah, she's clarifying. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Yes. Thank you. Thank you. Uh, Vice Chair Kellum. Uh, yes. I just wanted to say that um when we originally
had brought this uh up and and got it funded, we also wanted to use it as a code enforcement tool for, you know, if they have, you know, people's houses that are blighted or their lawns are bad or whatever and they need help that
there's a tool that we have as a city that, you know, if you need help, here's the application or here's how you do it. And that and that's where I think that we were coming from because you know every little bit when people improve their house it improves the city as
well. But um I just I think that uh veterans absolutely if we can do that and we're in the legal bounds of the criteria we should definitely do that. So, but I think you're right on, you know, there's a code enforcement
case where a property is not being brought back into compliance and when we learn about their circumstance, there's some compassion of some sort and at that point they could come back the way the program was designed and the tool is to apply. Exactly. And then we know that
circumstance. We know the intent of the board was to help those people who are in most need and use that small city knowledge internal uh partnering with the community and and allocating 50,000 or 75,000 to help
those. There's a big difference in somebody who can't improve, you know, the sighting or some major structure on their home due to an unfortunate circumstance and someone wanting to, you know, that could have the means, but they're just going to take advantage of an opportunity the program and get new
pavers or something, you know, that maybe qualifies or new landscaping. But that's the tough part of all of it in city staff. I'm very sensitive to that discretion and and that go going in. So it's the clear criteria does, correct me
if I'm wrong, make your job a little easier. Yeah. So we do like to have that in the application so then they can see why we are evaluating things the way we are without question or
hurt feelings. Right. Yes. So but we'll get that we anything else. No, I just think that it's a you know that's what the CRA is for. a lot a big portion of it. You know, businesses are important, our residents are important. So, yeah,
we're lucky to have it and we need to take advantage why it's here. Yeah, we'll we'll get we'll make it known that it's here so people can start uh start using it and we can get it in get our get our hands in the in the in the
And the uh good news, Mayor Mayor, the good news is is we've never come close to even using the maximum. This is one budget that, you know, always has money left in it. So, um, there's an opportunity for people out there, but
we've never come close to even using the 50K. So, and now we're up to 75K. So, there's opportunities for people to do things. Well, that to the point to Don's point, I think it will be more advertised than it has been and pushed out into the community, which will help.
Yeah. To spend that money. Yeah. Well, the fact that it will exist, but not in the sense like we were talking, not not a come one come all type of thing, but but the sense that it exists and people know. Yeah. Because there's some good funds there that could do a lot of good.
So, yeah. Thank you. Any other comments, questions on this agenda item? Excellent. Thank you. And with that, I think we are now no uh to item nine. Old business, we
have none. There is no new business. Um do we not have reports typically on CRA? I don't think we do actually. Yeah. I because in my head I I wanted to um just ask a question but I if it's not
anything I want to take action on but not not typically do we have reports but something unique came up of course. Nope. Let's go ahead if council's okay we'll go ahead and adjourn. Good that all right meeting adjourned. 536
Lord not counsel. Part: 2
ready to go. Good evening everyone. Today is June 17th, 2025. It is 6:00 p.m. and we are at the Cape Canaveral City Council regular meeting, the City Hall Council Chambers, 100 Pulk Avenue, Cape
Canaveral, Florida. I call this meeting to order. And with that, our city attorney, please lead us in the pledge. Stand and face the flag. I pledge algiance to the flag of the United
States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Thank you, dear city attorney and councel.
City clerk, please call the role. Council member Davis, here. Council member Jackson, here. Mayor Prom Kellum here. Mayor Morrison here. And council member Willis present. We have all five council
members here. Thank you. Quorum certainly. And with that, we are at item number four on the agenda, which is the approval of agenda as written or with amendments. I'll make a motion to approve the agenda
as written. I'll second. Got a motion by Council Member Willis and a second by Council Member Davis. I do have some discussion on this. There was an agenda that came out on the
Tuesday before the meeting and then I believe we received a revised agenda yesterday. I just want to double check with our city attorney. The agenda that went out on Tuesday in order to add something on to the
agenda. We are at item number four. approve the agenda as written or with amendments, we can usually move things around. But if we are going to add something on after the deadline to post, I believe items are considered
before council needs to be obtained by consensus. If we're going to add something on and then effectively we could take the agenda and approve that format. The council can approve the agenda as amended with the additional
item or not. I mean, as part of the agenda approval process, that's where you can make the decision to add the item. Okay. It's a motion to approve the agenda with the additional one item that was submitted after the delivery of the
agenda or not. It's your call. staff has submitted the um item to be taken up tonight and the council just needs to decide to add it to the agenda. Okay. So, when the motion was made as
written, um I think we are being advised to say as amended. I'll retract the motion. Yeah. Yeah, when they said when you said as written, I just I presumed it was the original agenda that went out initially.
I think the clerk may have amended the agenda. Yes, that's with the supplemental agenda item that was submitted. So she's she's So they're asking that the council approve the supplemental agenda, not the
original agenda that um was was sent out. Thank you for the clarification. Council member Willis is Yeah, I'll I'll retract the motion and make a motion that we approve the
supplemental agenda as written. I'll second. Got a motion by council member Willis. Got a second by council member Davis to to approve the supplemental agenda as written. Discussion I have on this as well. Um
when we the the add-on item I think adding that on is a diversion of our procedure and what we were pursuing. So to
well to take action on it is a diversion of the procedure and I don't think that that's the right thing to do due to the fairness of it uh in the pursuit of the interview schedule and city manager.
I can expand further on what I mean by that. I' I'd rather not. And I think even if it was just something to to add on to consider, um that's not something that has been
communicated directly to me until this notice was made and I'm not aware of that's something that I'm not interested in pursuing frankly. So that's my discussion. Is there any other
So I I do not think adding this on as amended is the right thing to do. And if it was added on, what I'm saying is is I don't think it's something I would be interested even if we did add it on. Um Mr. Mayor, yes. Um I I kind of agree
with you. I think that um at this point in the interview and and application process uh in the um in the re um request for applications, we had a deadline and this
is after the deadline and I I don't think it's fair to the other um applicants. Um, you know, right from the beginning, uh, John said he wasn't he didn't want to do
this. And then, you know, I I just don't think that I I think if we do the interview with the people we have and we haven't selected one, then maybe we could go back out and John could be in that mix. But we borrow
I mean how does that make us look professionally you know to the people that have followed the rules and the process and so I agree with what you're saying. I don't have a problem with it. I'm I'm
I'm glad for him to be in. So I don't have a problem with it. Thank you. And well, I was going to say I wasn't here that meeting because my op I had our surgery, but you you had a limited time
and then you got five. So why didn't you do with this the three that you had? Cuz now it's going to cost the city a lot of money for those other people to come down too. So that's about $30,000 for the city. So
yeah, and I don't want to go too far down. It sounds like uh Mayor Perim Kellum, thank you. You heard as far as your position. Council member Davis, I think you want to support approving the agenda as amended and in adding that on. Um the reason we chose five to answer
your question is that was what was recommended by the consultant is to have a give a minimum of five due to dropout, but that's as I remember council member Jackson. Um, I think that putting this in tonight is premature
because it was delayed. I believe that if we um since we've gotten the to this point, we're already scheduling interviews, if we don't find a candidate within this group of interview uh interviewees, we had discussed being
able to bring more people to the table. And since this is not, it wasn't communicated to me as well. Um, and I appreciate John you willing to step up. I want to tell you that. Uh, but we're in the middle of the process. And so I
think we should continue with the process as we've defined it at this point. Also, um, it's got two two things combined. One is the schedule plus the additional applicant. And so to me,
those would have should have been like two separate things uh to vote on because and really I'm not sure we need to vote on the schedule. He has sent that out and defined it just um so I'm not sure that requires a vote. Does that
require a vote, city attorney, for this for the interview schedule? Um I thought um the dates were selected during the um discussion with Mr. Bezinger and they were Yeah. So, so I'm I'm unaware of what we need to vote on
that, but it's kind of two in items combined, but I really think since we're so far into the process that we need to at least try these candidates, see if there's any that that we're might be interested in, and then if we have a second group, then bring um our inter
room city manager in who's interested. Thank you, Council Member Jackson. Council member Davis, Anthony, is it all right to add this other comp uh compliment um applicant today or is that wrong if we add it today? Oh, but it's
totally within the council's prerogative. Okay. If you wish to add additional candidates. Yeah, that's what I just wanted to say. It's not it's a council it's a council decision because the council's already selected five candidates to interview.
Yeah, those that that slate of candidates was selected last week. Yeah. So, the council wants to make any adjustments to that slate of candidates. That's the council's prerogative. Okay. Yeah, I think I I understand that
we can, but I just to add a little bit more to why the position the advertisement that went out and it had a period from April 26 to June 2nd. That was the process that was communicated to all the
applicants with next steps and dates for interviews. It's on the back page of the brochure where the big things like compensation are discussed, residency requirements. I mean, really, if you had to go to one page to say what was important to the
this brochure, it was a lot of it was here, but the section uh titled internal candidates has its own section. And I think it's obvious why applicants want to know if they're internal candidates because internal candidates have
direct uh employment experience with the city and so clearly that is something that's going to be valued uh higher and they they went in with the brochure reading as I'll read it. We do not
anticipate any internal candidates. If there are, the council is committed to a level playing field and will treat all candidates the same when evaluating their credentials. So, the way to do that in my eyes is to not add on now. If
we go back out, yes, we can as our city attorney uh said, but it would it doesn't mean that it's fair because that's what was advertised. Like they say, we kick the ball. We're sort of moving the goalpost here. And uh I think
that that process that they had to follow if we go back out all candidates should follow the same process. As Mayor Pro Jim Kellum said we have talked in some conversations about the image that we're giving out for those candidates in
Cape Canaveral. We've talked about travel and hotels and all this this whole experience. I think this would be one of the worst things that we could do if those candidates who are likely to be watching this was to see at this at this stage in the process do that. That
changes everything and we have uh certainly the right to do it. I don't think it's it's now as I've heard I think from some of our council members as well. If there's not any other discussion, uh, we can Could I,
mayor, could I have a say in this since I'm the city manager? Absolutely. Um, so if and let me put I'm also for the audience, I'm also the finance director for the city. Okay? And I just want to
point out that, you know, council's prerogative, of course, not upsetting the process, whatever. So, council will next week interview five five people and one of those folks could very well be the city manager. Probably good chance
that one of those folks will be the city manager, but if council doesn't isn't satisfied with those, they're able to go back out. This firm allows us to go back out at no cost to pull more people in.
Um so if that was to happen then uh they could pull more people in. Probably going to go ahead and extend the period uh a couple months and uh I believe council is happy with my performance
otherwise I wouldn't be sitting up here. Um so it's going to extend out a couple months. So we're going to spend about probably 20k next week for the people coming in. If council says, you know, this isn't good enough, they could go out for more people. That's that's good. We don't have to pay for that. But then
when we bring three or five more in, it'll cost the city more money. And but but of course too, um this is an investment in the city's future finding a new city manager. So with that being said, all the only point I want to make
is that there is a good chance anyway that I will be the city manager here if that happens to happen for probably 10 months 10 months time. And I'm going to just give you my feelings towards this. Um and I respect council's I respect
council's opinion. Okay. Um that's council's job to make these determinations. But um the reason I did not put in earlier is that I was serving as the interim city manager wearing several hats which I am and I love my
job and I love these people sitting in this audience and these pe the people throughout the city that work for the city. And it came to me after a discussion with my wife and a a few others that if the opportunity is there
to go ahead and um put my name in the hat for the city manager, I'm going to do it because the way I feel about the city, and I do. I feel strong about the city. Um it's not about just personal personal gang. Uh personal gain. I've done a lot in my life. I've had a full
life. I have no no regrets. So I just want to put it in perspective for you that I felt the time if the timing was right because of the candidates were already chosen whatever I accept that I don't want to I don't
want to want to upset the apple cart and if we come down the road again and you have to select more people then at that time I'll make a determination if I still want to be uh considered for city manager. So I just want to make that
clear and council needs to know too. Of course this is a you know obviously there's this is a interesting situation in itself but um council needs to know too though that um they know who I am and uh I am going to support this city
and maybe someday I will be your city manager and that's all I want to say. Thank you very much. And just to clarify, what was the um about 10 months, I didn't follow that rationale. Well, based on the the schedule right
now, um probably our next city manager, even if you choose somebody, all I'm saying is I'm estimated probably September is probably when they would probably start in the city. I'm just estimating because that I think that's good. All I'm saying is if council says
this group wasn't good enough and then later on in July we're provided more we're provided more people because nothing's going to happen in the first week of July. There's there's there's a holiday uh and we've got the budget in the middle of the month. So I I would
see that maybe the next group might be interviewed like the third or fourth week of July based on what we get from the firm. And that's all I'm saying mayor. Then it might kick it out another month or so. That's all. And then that might push me into 8 n months as city manager. Maybe 10. That's all. How do
you go from 2 months to 8 910? You mean two months? I'm just I'm disagreeing with the se like the the idea that if especially if they're out of state the time, right? Right. They need to give 60 days notice to their employers. Maybe 30 days. That's what I'm talking about. Just the So that
would be September I think would be kind of farthest. We interview them in June. If there are any that a majority of this council wants to move forward with, we could call a special meeting early July or wait till the regular meeting. I think we would if we know right after
the interviews late in the month, we are going to need my opinion to hold a special meeting to either go back out and open it up or uh make a decision with with those candidates, not wait till right. And I'm and I'm talking about the second group. If you had to go
to a second group, it could turn into nine or 10 months. That's all I'm saying. If they did the whole process over with the same time frame. Okay, I understand. Thank you for explain. I'm I'm anticipating and as you know, the um city attorney drafted me a contract to September 1st because we saw all the
elements that were involved and that's how long we thought I would have to serve. So the September 1st date is a realistic date based on what's happening right now, especially with the interviews being scheduled next week. That's all. And Mayor Morrison, I know
that the recruitment firm in their materials in regards to the meeting next week, they literally have a meeting after we've interviewed individually and then as a group there's a council meeting on Friday where we discuss those
candidates. So, you know, we're already going to be in the process of doing that per the recruiters, okay, information that they've given. So, the to vote in the schedule, I think this was with
we did not have a standalone interval use schedule approval. My thing is we did already vote on that in the last meeting. It was the 25th and the 22nd. 26th is what we verbally said. However, my only thing with the schedule is uh what uh Colin had sent over in the
spreadsheet of dates showed the 25th and the 26th. Maybe that was way it's supposed to be cuz they're coming in the day earlier. Just want to double check that that wasn't a typo. And if yes, what I looked at today had the 27th on
it. So, I want to make sure I have the dates correct. Well, this one says 26th and 27th. The intention was a a Wednesday uh Wednesday and Thursday. So, if the dates on Wednesday and Thursday are not the 26th and 27th, then the 25th is is not
correct because the 26th and 27th were the dates that and that's what we voted. I thought I saw maybe there was another spreadsheet. If we're all in agreement on the 26th and 27th, uh that's great. And I uh I do believe we should have five minute buffers at minimum in
between that interview schedule if possible. I spoke with Colin about that. He said recommended at the meeting. So we're kind of in a weird spot because we're trying to add this on. Um if this was
I think these things can be handled administratively. It was a proposed schedule and if this council doesn't have any issue, they can they can run with that. And if it doesn't change, it's okay. If is there anything else on that uh consideration to approve the
agenda as a revised amended? That's the motion we have on the floor. Okay. Well, council uh council member Willis uh and council member Davis seconded that
motion uh to clarify. I oppose this. And with that, we can go ahead and roll call the vote. City clerk, please. Council member Davis. Council member Jackson against.
Mayor Prom Kellum against. Mayor Morrison against. And council member Willis four. The motion fails. Three to two. And with that, are there any other
motions to be made on a Well, we need a motion now to approve it. Uh, I'll make a motion to approve the agenda as written prior to the amendment. I'll second. Got a motion by council member Jackson, second by mayor per Tim Kellum. Any further discussion?
Seeing none, city clerk. Council member Davis against. Council member Jackson four. Mayor Prom Kellum four. Mayor Morrison four. and council member Willis against.
Motion to approve the agenda as written passes 3 to 2. This time we have presentation and interviews portion of the meeting. We are at item 5A 6:25 p.m. The first and only proclamation that I have tonight I'm
excited about. We have our our friends here uh with Aging Matters. And so I'm going to come forward and read this proclamation and believe we have some representatives here joining us here today. And when I'm finished, y'all can come forward and uh take a photo and if
you'd like have a a few words if you choose to say anything. So, I'll head down now. Okay, this is a proclamation of the city of Cape Canaveral. Whereas Aging Matters in Bvard, originally known as the Community Service Council, was
incorporated as a notfor-profit organization on June 7th, 1965 and today promotes the independence, health, safety, and quality of life of seniors countywide. And whereas Aging Matters is now the leading agency
providing direct services to seniors across Bvard County and is kicking off its 60th anniversary 2025 to 2085 champions initiative on July 1st. And whereas having grown alongside Bvard
County now employs more than 90 staff members and mobilizes more than 800 volunteers who drive more than 400,000 miles. And whereas together staff, volunteers with the support from a myriad of supporters provide
life-changing services annually to hundreds of seniors countywide, including 79,000 hours of championship, respite, socialization, safety, and wellness checks, and lighthousekeeping
in 2024. and whereas prepared more than 425,000 meals as its BARD community kitchen and distributed them daily through its meals on wheels program weekly at 13 seniors
at lunch community dining centers and monthly provided pet food to 160 clients through Pets on wheels and whereas installed 178 ramps and 2,100 00 grab bars
operated the Sunflower House, which provides critical caregiver support, recruited retired senior volunteer program RSVP volunteers for its own and many other organizations, and conducted
boneuilders classes for 370 seniors to prevent osteoporosis. Now therefore, be it resolved that I, Wes Morrison, mayor of the city of Cape Canaveral of Bvard County, Florida, do hereby recognize and commend Aging
Matters in Breard for 60 years of distinguished service to the citizens and particularly the senior citizens of Bvard County and congratulates the board of directors and leadership team for a job well done, signed and sealed this
17th day of June, 2025. Congrats. Thank you. [Applause] [Applause]
My name is Tom Camden. I'm president and CEO of Aging Matters in Bvard and it's an honor to be before you to to accept a proclamation from the city of Cape Canaveral. To mark the occasion of the 60th anniversary of aging matters in Bvard in 1965, local leaders such as you established the community services
council Bard County which was soon evolved into aging matters in Bvard. That original council included about 50 organizations considering a a wide variety of social and health concerns facing a rapidly change changing society and a rapidly growing local region. The
Space Coast had recently been born and BVAR County was at the center of national attention. 1965 marked many turning points in our nation and a momentous turning point for American seniors. As the Older Americans Act was signed into law, a national network of
federal, state, and local agencies was created to plan and provide services to help older adults live independently in their homes for as long as possible, saving seniors the stress of leaving home and saving the United States a great deal of money. From the original Community Service Council Bard, many
initiatives evolved and were undertaken by various council members. However, the council itself evolved into Aging Matters of Boulevard, a nonprofit charitable organization that would help establish a local network and join the greater USA aging network called the
older Americans act. It went on to become the lead agency in serving the needs of seniors in Bavar County in 1965. Right up until today, Aging Matters Boulevard has provided ever evolving services. And in your proclamation, you cite some of the services that are being provided today.
And the services are impressive, life-changing, and at times life-saving as we save lives. At least every year we save at least four or five lives. That's possible thanks to leaders such as you. As we celebrate our 60th anniversary, we are stopping to look
back to remember and celebrate the champions who made the moment possible, local champions such as you. This year we're also looking forward from 2025 to 2085 and asking who are those who are today's champions and who will champion the ever evolving services that will
keep that that will take to keep Bard County seniors independent, safe, healthy, and preserve their quality of life for as long as possible. This year we look at you and on July 1st we'll be launching the Aging Matters in Boulevard 2025 to 2025 2085 champions initiative
and campaign. We look forward to exploring, discovering with you how we will continue to provide ever evolving local solutions for our homebound seniors and the seniors in greatest need. We also look to you and our local community to call upon state leaders to
encourage our elected national leaders to continue to support the older Americans act which is currently up for renewal in the US Congress. Every dollar every dollar invested in aging matters in Bvard saves the government $10 and provides seniors with dignity. We look
forward to visiting with you further. We thank you sincerely for your leadership and for this proclamation and most of all for caring for our local seniors. We gave your press release for that meeting on July 1st if you'd like to join us. And on a lighter note, if you're um
on Saturday, we'll be at Karib Brewery because we're also doing an event where we're actually have a golf cart we're raffling off that was donated to us for at by Lowe's. So, we're selling route tickets back and also the Kore will be out down there just having a good time. It's close. Like to come join us. We'd
love to have you. So, no, I was going to say thank you very much because you helped my mom during her day. So, it's appreciated. We Well, we thank you for that and we appreciate that and and Mickey, we thank you for your service. Thank you. So, we appreciate what you did for Aging Matters. What time is your
event at Karee? Um, well, I I will be there from 12:00 on, but the official event is 5 to 8. But but please come come and have a good time with us. You might even see a CEO of pouring beers from behind the bar. That's usually what I get to do if I if I with the event and we're going to try and raise some
dollars behind there as well. Um, but the golf cart is is a fun thing. It's a beautiful uh donation that was given to us. Every dollar from that goes back into helping a senior. Well, and that's why I was interested in that. Let's let's help get some people there and buy some raffle tickets from them. It's a
$12,000 golf course. Beautiful. Excellent. Thank you so much. We appreciate you. Thank you, Tom. And the entire aging matters. I got a chance to volunteer on one of the meals on wheels and just one of the most awesome things to to really help and contribute and could not do it
without y'all's leadership and and mission and vision for this community. So, thank you. Thank you so much. You're welcome back. Thank you. Hopefully we'll see you soon. The marathon for kicks offer is July 1st. I'm sure you can go to the website
or find out more about that if anyone's interested. So, thank you. Take care. Okay, that concludes item 5A. Very nice. Going to item 5B, which is a library activities report. We have a
presentation by the Cape Canaveral Public Library director providing the city council with an annual report on library activities, metrics, and needs. That come welcome. Thank you. Thank you. Can you hear me? Yes, sir. All right. Uh
good afternoon and thank you for the opportunity to speak with you today. We're excited to share some of the outstanding work happening at the Cape Canaveral Public Library. My name is John Russell and I have the privilege of serving as the director of both the Cocoa Beach and Cape Canaveral libraries. I'm joined today by Tina Shelfont who is the head librarian of
the Cape Canaveral Library and Tina is instrumental in overseeing daily operations ensuring that the library remains a vibrant welcoming space for our community. Uh with that, let's begin my presentation or our presentation. First, we want to sincerely thank the city of Cape Canaveral for its steadfast
support over the years. Your annual contribution plays a vital role in the success of our library and its ability to serve the community. Because of your investment, we're able to do more than just lend books. We're able to launch new stories, inspire curiosity, and connect our residents to a world of knowledge and discovery right here on
the Space Coast. Your support helps families find their perfect beach read, encourages children to dive into stories that spark imagination, brings movie nights to life with our ever growing DVD collection, and empowers lifelong learners to keep new keep exploring new ideas and skills. We're incredibly
grateful for your partnership in making all of this possible. Now, I'd like to share a few key statistics that highlight Cape Canaveral Library's continued growth and engagement with the community. Over the past 5 years, the Cape Canaveral Library has circulated more than 384,000
physical items, which is a clear reflection of how deeply our resources are valued and utilized by residents. Each year, we welcome an average of 55,000 visitors through our door and issue more than 600 library cards, helping new members of the community connect with our services and programs.
One of our fastest growing areas is digital content. Through the Libby app, residents of Cape Canaveral borrow approximately 2,000 ebooks and audiobooks every month, a number that continues to rise as more patrons discover the convenience of digital access. These numbers represent more
than just data. They reflect the ongoing relevance and adaptability of our library in meeting the needs of a modern, diverse community. In the last fiscal year, the Cape Canaveral Library offered a total of 376 programs for youth and all ages along
with 315 programs specifically for adults. Some of our most popular or I'm sorry. Together, these programs drew an attendance of over 4,100 participants, demonstrating strong community interest and engagement across all age groups. Some of our most popular offerings
include our annual haunted library event, our weekly story times for children's, as well as crafts and art classes that provide a creative outlet for all ages. Looking ahead, we're excited to continue expanding our programming, especially by collaborating with local professionals who are eager
to share their expertise and stories with the community. These partnerships help us create enriching, relevant experiences that bring people together and foster lifelong learning. Over the past year, we have been proud to offer an offer a number of standout
programs that have really resonated with our community. I'd like to take a moment to highlight a few of those that we are especially excited about at the library. First was our discover boulevard series. This initiative brought in guest speakers from across the country to present or county, excuse me, to present on a wide range of topics including
local history, civics initiatives, and community organizations. This series was a tremendous success and received enthusiastic feedback from the attendees. We're eager to build on this momentum with more locally focused programming in the coming year. Another highlight was our music Monday concert
series generously sponsored by our friends of the library group. This program featured live performances by local musicians and helped foster a vibrant community- centered atmosphere within the library. And most recently, we just launched our summer reading program, a signature event at the
library. During the summer, we host special performers, offer reading challenges with fun prizes, and provide a wide variety of engaging activities to keep kids learning and entertained throughout the season. It's truly a special time of year for us and one that reinforces the library's role as both
educational and recreational hub for families. I'd like to now highlight some of the new services and enhancements we've introduced over the past 5 years to better serve our community, both inside and beyond the library walls. Many patrons may not realize how many digital resources are available to them.
Even if someone can't make it into the library in person, we can still reach a variet or we can still offer a rich variety of services remotely. Tina will go into that in a bit more detail in just a bit. On the technology side, we've upgraded our Wi-Fi access points to improve speed and reliability, and
we've implemented a new mobile printing service with a company called Princh. And this allows users to send print jobs from their phone or personal computers directly to our library printers. It's been so popular last year alone, we processed nearly 22,000 mobile prints at the Cape Canaveral Library. During the
pandemic, we introduced a curbside pickup service to support safe access to library materials. It was so wellreceived that we've continued to offer it and just all you have to do is just give us a call when you arrive. We'll bring your items right out to you. And finally, the library continues to serve the community as a community
gathering space, offering opportunities for people to connect through interest groups, educational programs, and networking events. It's more than just a place to borrow books. It's a hub for community engagement. At the Cape Canaveral Library, we're proud to be one of the many branches of
the Bvard County Library System. Being a part of a larger network allows us to share resources, collaborate across communities, and provide broader access to services for all patrons. That said, we never lose sight of what makes our location special. While we benefit from being part of a countywide system, our
focus remains on serving the unique needs and spirit of the Cape Canaveral community. This slide features a few photos of recent events that really highlight the local connection that we have. from our ever popular haunted library to a delightful moment during last year's summer reading program where
we actually hatched baby ducks right inside the library and kids were able to follow along through the whole process. These are the kind of moments that remind us how deeply connected we are to the community that we do serve. We're not just a branch. We're part of the daily lives, traditions, and memories of our neighbors. We're proud to be rooted
in this small but strong community and we're continuously inspired by the people who walk through our doors every day. From a real life astronaut inspiring young readers to a marine biologist from the proposed local aquarium sharing insights about our coastal ecosystem,
our programs reflect the unique identity and vibrant spirit of Cape Canaveral. Whether it's helping a child receive their first library card, hosting neighborhood gatherings like our circus carnival or masquerade ball events, or simply providing quiet, welcoming space to read or connect. Our mission is
grounded in service, inclusion, and hearts. We're truly honored to be your neighborhood library. Small in size, but big in heart. And with that, I will turn it over to Tina Shelfont, who will share even more wonderful things that are happening at the Cape Canaveral Library. Thank you, John.
I would like to begin by sharing the vital role our volunteers play in serving our community. Several of our staff and nearly all of our volunteers live in the near the library and are active members of this
community, bringing their passion and dedication to every program and service we offer. This photo is of one of our multi-deade friends of the library volunteers helping out in the library with her
daughter who grew up going to the Cape Canaveral Library and one of its various locations and is now a library volunteer in Sarasota, Florida. Our local teen and adult volunteers both give of their time
and talent and receive meaningful engagement, connection and opportunity to learn and grow through their service. Both the giving and receiving of service enriches our community.
Just as our ers are essential to the heart of our library and community we serve. We're fortunate to have a full-time library staff member who offers specialized services to help individuals navigate life's challenges
and to provide support beyond traditional library offerings. Bvard County Libraryies community support advocate travels to libraries across the county each week to offer direct assistance to community members from
helping with unemployment applications to navigating housing resources. She provides essential social services. Her work brings vital support to individuals facing tough situations, ensuring they have the tools they need
to move forward. Our library also supports our community by providing meeting room space to condo condo associations, homeowners groups, and other local organizations, giving them a welcoming space to connect, share
resources, and discuss important community matters. We are here to support these groups and make sure the community has a central place for dialogue. Last year, our meeting rooms hosted over 800 meetings
for a total of over 1,500 meeting hours. The library is home to many local groups that use our space to connect and grow. For example, our monthly book clubs where readers come together to discuss literature, share perspectives, and form
lasting friendships. and our Pearly Girls group where individuals share their love of fiber arts while making a difference with charitable pro projects. The packet you received includes a small sample of their work created especially
for you by the group members. Whether it's providing a safe place for important community meetings or offering a place to share hobbies and interests, we're proud to support local initiatives and help create bonds that strengthen
our community. As you can see, our library is much more than a place for books. It's a hub for connection, support, and growth. And That sense of community truly comes to life in the joyful moment moments we
share every day. Here we have some snapshots that capture the heart of our library in action. Families, children, and adults coming together to learn, to create, and to make new friends.
While our library is full of energy and connection in person, the support and opportunities don't stop at our doors. With a library card, our community has access to a wide range of free digital
resources that can be used anytime, anywhere. Let's take a look at some of the powerful tools available online through the library. And since we've been focusing so much on connection, I'd like to make this part of the presentation a
bit more interactive. As I introduce each of these digital resources, many of which have only become available in the last 5 to 10 years, I'll invite you to raise your hand if you've heard of or used it. I'm
curious to see which ones are already familiar and which might be new discoveries. Popular ebook and audiobook titles are available through our Libby app or via computer using Overdrive. A raise of
hands. How many of you have heard of or used Libby and Overdrive? I saw Donald's hand. All right. Hoopla is our digital resource for streaming audio books, TV shows,
and movies on demand. In other words, it's the free library version of Netflix. A raise of hands, how many of you have heard of or used Hoopla? All right, one. Our next resource,
LinkedIn Learning, provides access to over 16,000 ondemand courses taught by industry experts in project management, leadership, marketing, web design,
digital photography, basically anything you can imagine, much much more. A raise of hands, how many of you have heard of or used in LinkedIn Learning? Awesome. Peterson's test prep is a valuable online tool that students of all ages
can use for standardized test preparation, researching and selecting colleges and graduate schools, finding tuition assistance, and exploring careers. There is also test prep assistance for career certification exams and advice on resumeéumés, cover
letters, interviewing, and networking. A raise of hands. How many of you have heard of or used Peterson's test prep? Excellent. I should have made this a comp competition like we do at the library. Uh Gail Legal
Forms provides a wide selection of essential state specific and multi-state legal forms that can be customized for the most common legal procedures. These forms are the same forms used by attorneys and law firms, including real
estate contracts, wills, divorce, and landlord tenant issues. A raise of hands. How many of you have heard of or used legal forms? I wanted to make sure you didn't raise your hand. Anthony
city attorney never heard of that. And finally, Rosetta Stone is one of the uh premier language learning programs available, provides lessons for learning 25 languages, and is also available free
with your library card. A raise of hands. How many of you have heard of or used Rosetta Stone? Excellent. I think that was the the highest. You name him. Yes. Thank you for your participation in my little survey. And remember, this was
just a sample of the many digital resources available with your library of art. Thank you so much, Tina. Oh, I'm sorry. Please. More. more. In addition, there we go. To the powerful
digital resources you can access from anywhere, our library also offers hands-on tools you can borrow. Things you might not expect to find in a library. From ukuleles to blood pressure monitors to memory care resources, our
library of things is designed to support learning, wellness, and creativity in everyday life. As you have heard, there are many new things going on in our library. And in order to ensure our community knows about and has easy access to all our
traditional and new resources, we have also recently launched an app that ties everything together called BCL Go. The app can be downloaded, if I change the slide,
through our QR code, as you can see on the screen, through the library website, or through your devices app store. BCLgo provides one-stop shopping for account information, searching for and requesting items from any of our 17
libraries, links to our digital resources, and even selfch checkckout within the library using your own device. BCLGO makes accessing and managing our library resources simple
and efficient anytime, anywhere. We sincerely we are sincerely grateful for the continued support and generosity shown by the Cape Canaveral shown by the city of Cape Canaveral. Your annual contribution of $30,000 has
played a vital role in helping us grow and maintain a high quality collection of books and DVDs for our community members. After carefully reviewing cost trends over the past 5 years, we've seen an average of 3% increase in the price
of materials. To ensure we can continue meeting demand and maintaining the same level of service, we respectfully request an increase in funding to $31,200 for fiscal year 2526. This proposed amount reflects a 3% rise
in the cost of physical materials and an additional 1% to allow for continued growth and planning. That said, we would truly be grateful to continue receiving the $30,000 contribution if an increase is not feasible at this time. Your
ongoing support at any level makes a meaningful difference to our library and the community we serve. We are deep deeply grateful for the generous funding you've contributed to the Cape Canaveral Public Library over
the years. Your support has allowed us to continually expand and enhance our collection of books, DVDs, and DVDs, ensuring our patrons have access to the resources they love and need. Because of your investment, we've been able to
maximize our budget to offer even more programs and resources for the community. Whether it's youth programs, special events, or new services that bring people together and help them grow, your continued support helps us build a stronger, more connected
community. And for that, we thank you. Thank you, Tina and John. Very, very nice presentation, the numbers, absolutely fascinating on some of those things. Now I can raise my hand on all of them because I've heard
them all but this few. Um and thank you for for going through the end and even talking about budget needs. I know that we had spoke about it briefly because library is doing so much. It was the sign that kind of initiated like we it it was an effort of
of help. And in my time on council, this is the first one I've I've been able to to hear. And so I really appreciate you and Molly and everyone who is a part of making this happen. I think the community does. And I think you said in there that the library is not just a
place to check out books. It's a place to belong, contribute, and grow. And for me and mine, it's It's not just a line item for us either. We we genuinely are just wanted to learn more about where
that's going and all say is wow. Thank you so much. Very awesome council. I'm I'm amazed because I was saw that line item for um DVDs and I thought how many DVDs does a library need? And so as a
new council person that has not been aware of what all you all have done, it's amazing the programs that you're offering. And thank you Molly for bringing this together for us so that we know because there is I can absolutely
support what you all are doing for our community and I want to thank you for that as well. I was going to say thank you for what you've done and thank them for their Indians. I will thank the Pearly Girls. They're one of my favorite groups. I'll just say one of my favorite groups that
meet at the library of people. I just want to thank you for the support for the city and all that you do for us. Appreciate it very much. Thank you. Yes. I would just like to say thank you
and it's good to know what we're funding and and you know and I can obviously hopefully we can up the budget for you but it's amazing to see how much you guys do and and we appreciate it and all the children in our community really
enjoy the library. So thank you. Thank you. If you don't have anything else again enjoy the rest of your evening. We appreciate it. I just want to say I've only been in this position now for just a year. So, thank you guys for inviting us and please anytime you'd like to hear about what we're doing, we're happy to tell you guys. Thank you.
Thank you. Excellent job. Thank you. Well, that concludes uh item number five A and B. Very nice report from our library. And now we are at the public participation portion of the meeting. If
you do intend to speak tonight, we have public comment cards out front. I think I've got one. Thank you. Just one. As of now, for the sake of time, if you want to
come forward and speak and fill it out after, we can do that. Those of you listening online, we are attempting to try and give that access once we finish with the public comments here physically. we will give you an opportunity and we ask that you raise
your hand digitally online and we'll do our best to recognize you and give you an opportunity to speak. So with that, the first card I have is John Benton. Okay, I'm here again for my code reduction hearing.
That's I want to remind you guys that Mayor Randles when I came to the council meeting the very first time said that he knew I didn't live in that warehouse that I lived on Tyler and he said he was going to take care of it. Go see the city manager, Mr. Green
and Todd Morley was there and they wouldn't do anything and they wouldn't tell me why why they wouldn't give me a code reduction, why they wouldn't do anything after Mr. Randall said so. And then you guys called the FBI and
they came and they pulled me out of a meeting over there. But before they pulled me out of the meeting and I before I knew they were there, Randles was standing in the bathroom in the down near the library in the forer just me and him. And I just told him in years, three years before that, I only talk to
people who I like and who I can stand and I don't neither one him until he takes care of that code enforcement hearing. Well, I started going walking down there and there's Randall standing there all by himself. I'm looking down at my phone. I look up at him. He starts talking to me and I ask him, "What are
you talking to me for?" And you know what he did? He started clamoring, "We want to settle, John. We want to settle." I said, "Well, you get in there that council in that meeting in there and you tell what Kevin man how he came in and lied to everybody.
Don't you Why Why don't you do something like that and put your country first instead of religion? Because that's why you didn't do anything to Kevin. He's a deacon in the church and you want his votes. You're putting your religion first, man. Come on.
That's all they want. Yeah, we want to settle, John. Then he didn't do it. Then the FBI took me out there in the parking lot and barked at me about it. Why don't you Why don't you Why don't you guys say something? Do something. You guys are kicking the kicking it down like the very first council board
members that was there kicking the can, not taking care of the problem. You go around and bully people. You know what? They 10 people has been fired here. I am surprised that one of them hasn't come over here and caused the incident. People go and lose their jobs and they
get upset. They come back and shoot people. me. I just lost little money. I'm not worried about that, you know, except for them coming after me, which they have already done. One of them lived right across the street from you, and the police decided not to do
anything. And they had it on video that he assaulted me out there holding the sign that Judge Crawford asked me to bring here. And he called in 20 minutes before and said he didn't like my sign to the sheriff's department. And then he came and assaulted me, pushed me from
the back. I was over 65. He was probably 35. Then he ran off. I couldn't call him back. I tried to, but he wouldn't come back. And then your person with the sign up there didn't like my sign. My toy sign
came up and hit me from behind. Push me. That's all the speak, please. We'll make sure you're heard. We'll go online for those who are with us and continue to speak online.
Go ahead and close public. Go ahead and close public participation. Bring it back to this council includes item six. Item number seven, consent agenda item. Only one item tonight, the May 20th, 2025th regular
meeting minutes. That was our last regular council meeting. Mr. Mayor. Yes, sir. Uh there's just one date correction. Okay. Uh under reports item 10 uh 2005 Central Florida Safety Summit.
That should be 2025. Thank you. This is item 10 on the next to last page. on the minutes. Let's see. So, item number 10, it says 2005 Central Florida Safety Stu
Safety Summit. Should read 2025, page seven of eight. That was all you had. You want to make a motion? Make a motion to uh approve the consent agenda with
the date correction. I'll second the motion. Got a motion by council member Willis, a second by council member Jackson. City clerk. Does that motion changes?
Further discussion. Council member Davis four. Council member Jackson four. Mayor PM Callum four. Mayor Morrison four. and council member Willis four. Thank you, Council Member Willis.
Okay, that concludes the consent agenda item number seven. We are now on item number eight. We'll stay on A, B, C, D, and E. We'll go in order. Starting with item 8.
First item for action tonight is a storm water infrastructure proposal engineering services applied ecology incorporated. Motion to consider the approval of a proposal from applied ecology in the amount of 99,320
fellows 74 cents for engineering services for the implementation of storm water infrastructure along with magnolia and orange avenues and authorize interim city manager to execute the same. That's the proposed motion. Uh if this council
is ready, but we can go ahead and weave with the motion discuss anything if that's what we intend to do. I'll make the motion to approve this proposal from applied tech uh aology incorporated
for the engineering services for the storm water project. I'll second. We got a motion by council member Jackson, a second by council member Davis to essentially approve the motion as written here and provided. Any further
discussion on this, Mr. Mayor? Council member Willis. Uh the 99,320 for engineering services. Is that going to be a recurring expense um annually for subsequent pilot
projects? I believe we had it uh listed as five possible years. So the $99,320 is every other year for engineering. So you have one year for engineering, one
year for project, one year for engineering, one year for project for the next five years. Yes, sir. Okay. So for Magnolia and Orange Avenues, that's going to be in the neighborhood of what? Total cost. cost-wise with construction.
Yeah, we don't know yet. We don't know yet. Until we get the study back from Applied Ecology, we were guesstimating around 100,000 110,000. Okay. So, it's potentially $200,000. Okay.
Um, and what will that engineering study tell us the amount of water that will be handled by that proposed construction? It should have some kind of hydraological study with
it. Yes. Or shouldn't say should, it will depending on what product they decide to go with. Okay. And if it's if it's pvious pavement, will will we get any sort of estimate on the
maintenance of all of that? I can with the construction estimates. Do we know that? I would have to put that together separately. So that would be a total separate different cost depending on the product that we use. Yes. Okay. Well, my
the my point being I think we might be better served putting that money towards the potential development of the pickle ball courts that we discussed taking the place of
the uh shuffleboard courts that if we could put that money towards underground storage, water storage, it would handle high volume uh rain events better than pvious
surfaces will a pvious surface although it it's it's good um we should have pvious surfaces all throughout the city um it won't necessarily relieve flooding
from the large rain events that we have that unless the water is going to be somewhat stagnant and sitting there. Pervious surface alone is not going to alleviate that flooding. Correct. Okay.
All right. That was that's just my point. So, I have a question. Member Jackson. Yes. Okay. So having said that, um Tim, how do we know this was specifically to
handle water on the streets down by the Filillmore area that's low? So what assurance do we have that putting storm tanks in up in the park area up off A1A
is going to take water off the street during rain down there? Because to me, if you get 6 in up here and 6 in down there, tanks up here aren't going to keep it from flooding down there. So, well, what it what it what he's talking about, what it does is it actually
relieves the hydraological pressure throughout the whole system. When you have a reservoir or a pond or something of that nature that you can put water into that goes into the same basin, it relieves other areas of that same basin. So what he's talking about is like
putting it in a mass huge area um during heavy rainfalls um instead of like a trickling uh rainfall that would you know uh standing water would would be for pvious areas and stuff like that.
Both are are both are good. Um, I I'm always leaning being a storm water manager, I'm always leaning towards massive uh retainage because massive retainage is going to be like the flooding that you see. Um, the smaller areas though will take on to a certain
amount of rainfall per hour. I don't know the exact calculations, but if you have like a um 3 in an hour rainfall or 6 in an hour rainfall, um you're most you're most likely to get a a majority of that rainfall into a larger section
than you would of a pvious pavement area. But if you have a a smaller rainfall and you have standing water, that standing water will trickle down through a pvious pavement area. Does that make sense? Yes, it does. Because I know I was on Filillmore when that one
drain was blocked up with basically a couple of sea grape leaves. I was amazed and I removed those in the street drain like that. But until then we had gotten a picture of a car stranded in that spot and that spot is a low spot on
Filillmore. So going back towards a 1A is more of an incline, right? And so if that's the low spot, I'm trying to understand how tanks off of A1A would help that one spot. I'm not saying we
don't want the tanks, but this entire project was approved by council as a smaller project to eliminate or possibly alleviate some of the water down on Filillmore until we got presidential streets
up and completed. So whereas I think the tanks are a great idea um this was a separate smaller project. So my question for you um as we look at this is you're saying every other year we'll be doing
an engineering study. That's if we find that it works and helps alleviate some of the water on the streets in that those areas and that was identified in the past for other areas within the
city. So this was really a test run for the Filillmore Avenue. It doesn't mean we would go continue to just move forward automatically with an engineering study every year. Am I correct? Well, it wouldn't actually be an engineering study. the study that they're put part of the study that
they're putting in towards this price is going to be the finding of the best product. The best as you say bang for our buck. Um the product itself uh you know I've showed you some stuff up at at the office um of of ideas that I had. Um
but I said but we want to make sure that we're saving as much money as possible. We want the best product out there. We want, you know, the best uh item that we could get to take on the most water. Um, with that being said, that's part of the study they're going to be doing is trying to find the best product. Uh,
trying to find the most uh spongy, I guess you could use the spongy word, this product that's going to take on the most. So, I I do anticipate the price to come down a little bit. Surveying is involved. Construction phase service is involved. Um, the majority of the rest
of the price tag will remain the same. But when it comes down to trying to find the product, um I think it's a one-sizefits-all once they find the product. Okay. And then there were two options given within this bid. Um
and just a little bit of difference in those. Um is option one overkill for this? because this was really intended to be a small project once again to help alleviate some of that flooding on Filmore and um on
Magnolia and Orange and initially just Filillmore but I think since that entire block is covered in pavement almost that it makes sense to include orange which it seems like what you've done correct.
Um, so what do you think on the two options as far as your um expertise on which one would be best? Um, I'm a little panicky right now because I forgot to print that part out. Okay. One was table that was provided
the option. Yeah, I didn't I didn't print out. If you keep scrolling down, you're about to get to that. I think would at least help to have something. There's a table. It's on page four of five. And then there's also a narrative I think. Council member Jackson, is it
this page that you're referring to? Yes. Yep. Keep going. You're almost there. One right there. Option one and two. Okay. So, that's for the surveying part. That's for the surveying portion. Uh
we're looking at about $1,000 difference between the I didn't really look at these options too much. Uh we can um I I looked at the main uh description of of services, the task that we had tasked applied ecology with. Um
Applied Ecology likes to be transparent and puts their surveys to let us know that they're not charging extra for what the surveying company's charging them for, which is a nice feature because that lets us know that we're not being gouged. Um,
I personally don't think we need the drone survey. Um, I'm not sure what it consists of. I'd have to look into it to see exactly what the what the drone survey does. Um, it looks like it takes some work off
the twoman field crew. But I'd have to look into it. But but if if if I had to pick, I mean, it depends on what is in encompassed into what what's easier, what's going to give us the most information for those areas.
Okay. And how much I'm curious because I wasn't on council, so maybe someone will remember, maybe even our uh interim city manager. How much were the tanks under the C5 dollars?
cost or capacity dollars. How much was we got a grant, didn't we? But that does Yeah, we're talking the exfiltration baseball field SRF. Yes. Uh that was that was a healthy chunk of money. We
may have had some grants with that. We could get that information for you. I mean, I remember when Jeff and I were talk deeply about about that when the baseball field was going away. So, that's an easy thing to retrieve. You want to make a note and send council how
much it cost for the exfiltration under the baseball field. And I'm curious what the engineering would be on doing the tanks under because it sounds like you, Council Member Willis, are in favor of not doing this, which is was intended
originally to be a small project that could be completed quickly until we get something done with the presidential master plan for Felmore, which is going to take longer. and we got the um numbers back on that which it's quite
hefty. So we'd have to definitely budget that and plan that. Um so this was supposed to be a smaller faster fix. So I'm not sure it should compare as far as the projects and I'm not I'm not I think
storm water is good and that kind of thing, but this had a different intention when we when this was brought to council before. I'm the one that brought it to council. So, yes, thank you for clarifying that intent. I see council member Davis down there. Knowing
know the difference is I want to under resend my uh second motion. I wanted to send my I want to take it back. Resend it. Take it out. Okay. Thank you. Well, I mean, we need to be putting pvious
pavement around. I mean, we need to, but uh I don't want anyone to think that that is going to stop flooding because when we have high volume events, that water's moving and it needs somewhere to go. And all of
the reports, all the studies we've had in the past have suggested retention ponds. Well, we don't have property to put retention ponds, but we do have property where we could put underground storage, which is basically the same thing. And I'm not against a pilot
project, but I don't want people to think that it's suddenly going to alleviate flooding. I think uh we're going to need more than just that. And uh that's the point. And when you're when you're calculating the cost, you also have to look at the cost per
uh amount of water that it handles. So you have so many uh cubic feet of water going into a storage unit, but when you have pvious pavement, you've got to have the water sitting there and
just absorbing into that pavement. That pavement has to be cleaned and you can still have things that settle on it with a rush of water. Everybody sees sand going with it and it's going to get in the pious pavement. So, um, you know,
but I'm not arguing against pvious solutions. I just want expectations to be set that this isn't going to be an endall. We're going to need multiple things. Absolutely. Absolutely. And I think uh um you know,
doing a pilot project, if it helps with just uh small amounts of standing water, that's that's great. And it would be great if we could get some of these parking lots redone to a pvious surface. That would be tremendous. Maybe we
should look at trying to incentivize some people to replace their parking lots. Uh there's there's a lot of solutions that could be done. But um and that's that council member Willis is really that was part of the reason that that pro that
uh location was looked at is because it is almost entirely covered in pavement or concrete for that entire block the entire thing. So absolutely and I agree this was as we discussed filmore this
was to help alleviate it and see what kind of result we could get from having that imperous pavement where we would have some drainage. Um we've got concrete and and black top pavement all
the way to the dra to the guttering and the road. So literally and then we've got Filillmore that has storm pipes that are doing this. So until we get Filillmore completed on the presidential streets, this was
intended to see if this would help. And I understand you you really can't judge how much water you're going to have off of an imperous surface because it drains differently than a storm system that's holding your water, you know, and it's
certainly not the end all, you know, solution. But if that helps get water off the streets, that's going to be a good thing because that street filled up fast. Mhm. I've got video of that and I think we're
mid 15 minute drain. I I got to send that. Um Mayor Tim Kellum, right? Um thank you, mayor. I I I think I have to agree with council member um Jackson. The intent of
this was to do small projects to to move forward with getting the water off the street until we could come to a decision, you know, with the main um civic hub and and that all which is a
billion dollar project. Um but in the meantime, you know, if we can do something in little increments to to help with the flooding. My question is a a couple questions, Tim. Um this is storm water project uh 10 in our budget
book and I'm I'm just asking about the financing because it says it the 99,320 will be funded through the storm water fund. Um on page 161 of our budget book
um it has 1 thou uh 101,200 funded by ARPA and stormwater fund and then it says construction and build bid process. So I'm a little confused on
is this a separate thing before the engineering or is this the engineering or So what happened was originally we were going to buy a product through Ferguson Waterworks. Uh we found a product that we liked. Um and as we dug
deeper and deeper into the project, it got more hairier and more hairier is the best way I can say it. Um, there were things that needed to be done, surveys that needed to be done, surveys that needed to be done. Um, and then we we posed the
question. I think it was me, Todd, and Council Member Jackson were in uh Todd's office at the time. And Todd's recommendation, and I I agreed with him at the time, was that maybe we need to hire a engineer to make sure that what
we're doing is going to be the best solution for what council member Jackson is looking for. In other words, don't buy a product unless you know it's the best out there on the market, the best, you know, financial
uh asset that we have that we could buy. And so that's where the engineer got involved. So when I started, you know, uh doing the CCNA, I noticed that applied ecology had done these kind of projects before and they knew a lot about it and I said, "Well, this is what
we're looking for. This is what we need." Um here's our budget. We had $101,200 in the first year, I believe. Um, so when they gave me how much it was going to cost, I said, "Well, that's good because that's how much we have in the budget. Do not go over that." Um, but
that's with a study with trying to find the best product and everything. And then after thinking about it, I'm like, well, if we're going to do this from here on out, it's almost safe to say we can do engineering for a year to figure out everything and then do the
construction of the project the next year and then engineering. And that kind of draws it out. Yeah, we're we're eager to get these projects done, but that at least gives us a little time to be able to find out what we need for that project and and then we can go out to bid and do the construction part of it
afterwards. So, so is ARPA money involved in the 93 99? So, based on what Tim said there, if the um uh this particular project, if this particular project in that budget
book says that it's ARPA, then ARPA is being applied to that. Is that's what it's is that what it says in the book, but it says construction and this is more engineering. That's what my question is. So, it's I mean it's Well, can I see that book because
you got the previous year's book? Yeah. Let me see how it Well, this says construction and since Tim had to do his due diligence here for engineering services, then the storm water fund will handle that. Okay. And
is there still uh an ARP? Is there still a construction element to this particular project for next fiscal year and then next year they moved to next fiscal year? So that's the answer. Then then if you look when you see the next fiscal year you will see that ARPA funds
were applied are going to be applied to those stormwater projects. Also, ARPA too. Um, when Tim runs into these situations, um, a lot of the ARPA money now that we're using for storm water, which we have already talked about or whatever, are going to the higher
ticketed um, projects too. But that's what happened. So Tim had to do this engineering thing. we have this thing moved out and then in the next year the ARPA money will still cover that element of that project
and all our ARPA money has been uh obligated um and very well I may say to a number of storm water projects. So um so in the 2526 summary that we got it says storm water improvement projects
150,000. I'm just trying to figure out the money. Okay. So, are you do you have the um so S SW8 Let's see what it's S SW9 storm water improvement project
storm. Yeah, but see you're looking at last year's and because of what on the projects they're being completed. I have the new proposed budget in front of me which is not releasable yet because there's still changes going on. But I brought it for my own uh
convenience and it's in um this budget. Uh it's been moved to this budget as W8. But I don't want to confuse council because this budget is not complete yet. But I brought this for my thing. But that me bringing this and me looking at
what you're talking about helps me see a clear picture of things that are being carried over. Well, that's I'm just trying to get a clear picture on where how how it works out. So, um, that was my question on that. Um, I got a, uh,
report from the ARPA fund. Mhm. On what's obligated, what's, and it says here to storm water improvement projects. 50,600. So, that will go to the construction and then 99,000 will come out of engineering
covered by the storm water fund. Okay. Thank you. That's that's where I was. The storm water fund is one fund that is healthy in the respect is being in respect that so many ARPA funds are being able to be used over the last few
years in storm water. It has put storm water of course in a beautiful position because all that extra money and in the future of course we'll have to think differently because we won't have 2.6 six million that of that were going to say storm water funds in the last couple
years and one year forward you know um those funds won't be here so we'll have to think differently in the years to come but we have definitely been aided in storm water by ARPA funding big time so the 99,320
is engineering but is was that in this year's budget the one we're in right now if no it is under as construction because at the time we did not know that we needed engineering. Okay. That's where it changed hands and then in the the budget that's coming up it will
beified that it will be Yes. And that and that's very detailed now that I found out like like uh John said I did do a lot of due diligence in this. I didn't want to I didn't want to waste money. I wanted to try to make the best of our money. So when we discussed this, I was like, "Well, then in this next
fiscal year and five years out, we're gonna have to break this out. Break this up so that it's very um very transparent of which part is going to be engineering and which part's going to be construction." And I appreciate your due diligence. I'm just want to understand
it. And and Tim is in his position is saving the city a lot of money. And mayor, you may want to ask Tim at the end of 25 26. Tim, how much money did you save on these projects? And he might have a good total for you. So you might want to ask him that question at the end
of at the end of next year's budget. Just say, Tim, how much do you save us? I'm going to put that in my calendar. Put that on your calendar. Put a lot of weight on me. Tim, I have one more questions in regards to the project because when you and I were working with
the ex city manager, he had identified like six areas of the city. Was it six? I'm remembering that we have a map and I'm trying to remember because I've only been concentrating on the first four
areas of this uh of this scope of work. Um, but it was it was a limited number of areas. Yes. Where we have pavement going all the way to the road. Correct. It's like almost from building all the way out to curb is nothing but asphalt.
So, it's not a huge um area of the city where we don't have some grass or some kind of per uh impervious surface on the ride of ways. Correct. Okay. And again, if we decide to do this project and it doesn't live
up to what we would like to see, um, we have the option to pull it back out of the budget, you know, not seeing the results that we're looking for. Um, I like to call this a pilot project. Um, we're going to try to do the best we can on seeing, you know, on getting as much
water off the road um or on those um parking lots, but there is the option of removing it if we don't see, you know, what results we're looking for. It's great talking through it and helping go back to the intent of that small project. I think we we adopted a budget
last year as memb,000 to construct. We wanted to do a small project. We've learned that let's do some engineering first to figure out what we want to do. Exactly. And so that money is really just being the item the 154
the page is being amended to engineering or for that use and what we'll learn out of that you described if it doesn't work go in a direction but I just want to shed light on but if it does work uh we might be and if it works well uh cost
effectiveness however the people uh smarter than me figure out total dollar spent as council member Willis I think was talking to to how 20 gallons per day or whatever the things that that go into that we can make it determine cost effective. Uh and then uh if it means it
really can make a difference, not the end all beall. We've talked about doing underground uh storage under the streets if possible, wherever possible. And this to me is an exploratory pilot opportunity to do that small project.
And if it works, we've talked about bonds, we've talked about debts, and and whatever I think uh the circumstances and the challenges that we're going through with flooding at that time, we might have a product that we can scale and do on a bigger scale in comparison
with the obvious benefits of storage offsite. Uh so, thank you for working on it. I think tonight we got the motion to approve it as written. Are there any more discussion or changes to that motion? Council member Davis, I think.
Did you want to resend your second? No, I can. I'll have carried on the information. And if even if you second it, you could still vote, I guess, again. Okay. You got it. Thank you. If I could, just one last thing. I I do still highly
recommend uh council member Willis's idea of putting the storm water under the shuffleboard court if we do decide to go forward with the Fillmore Avenue Road project. Uh what would the what that would do and it's kind of like a it's kind of like a jigsaw puzzle where I try I'm trying to put together right
now on time. Mhm. Um what it would do is it would allow me because I believe um Molly's shuffle board replacement is 262 20 oh she's missing 25 26 26 27 I
believe I could help you out with that. That's why I brought the new proposed budget just to kind of give a a highlight of the whole picture. 26 2627 Tim. Okay. engineering and construction uh and the storm water fund be able to fund that
210K. Okay. So, what that would do is Parka would take care of the removal of the shuffleboard courts and put the raet ball courts or not raetball, I'm sorry, uh pickle ball pickle ball courts there. Um storm water would come in and put
underground chambers that's in 2627. Correct. But during Filillmore, while they have the road tore up, they would go ahead and pipe it and plum it to go to that area if we know that we're going to approve that project ahead of time. Now,
what they would do is they'd just put a pipe in the ground and they'd abandon the end of it. They would seal it up until we're ready to move on with the next phase of the project, which would be the underground chambers under the pickle ball courts over where the shuffleboard courts are original. Um, so
with that being said, I still highly recommend putting a big area over there of underground chambers to take a lot of that water off of the Center Street Basin. Um, you know, it was in the first report, I believe, that Meen Hunt gave.
Um, and and I believe Council Member Willis brought up a long time ago is they said, "Don't stop there. Try to find as many places as you can to relieve this flooding." I I see that as a a good, you know, plan going forward of getting some more water off that area
and and John, you said it was about what 250 210 210. Um, so, but that I just wanted to put that out there for the future. That makes more sense to me saying that you're going to do the low part of Filillmore first because I'm
like if it has if the flood has to go upstream to get to the tank that makes no sense. It it will have fall. Yeah, it will have fall no matter what. Well, when we get Phil more resolved in that spot that has a little craziness in it,
um then it would make more sense that it's got a more direct route to get to the tank. Correct. So, the order to me didn't make sense before. That makes more sense to me now hearing just hearing what you said. And also take into consideration that if when Filillmore goes forward when it's
approved, um I believe I got an email today saying that it would probably be ready to go out to bid around August, September at the latest October. So, we should have it full set of plans for uh Filillmore. Um, I will definitely make sure that it has every possible
thing that we can put in there for storm water so that the people on the 300 block, which I know very well, will not flood. You know, we'll we'll get as much rid of as much water as we possibly can. That sounds good. Thank you. Thank you, Tom. Absolutely, Mr. Mayor. Yes. We also
have a pipe running along A1A that feeds into the Center Street Basin that runs right by city hall, right by the parking lot, right by the Nancy Hansen
Center. That could easily be tied into and if FDOT wanted to could be convinced to help us with that. Sure. I think I think they can be um that just upsized that pipe was small
too I think around center street as well too. I don't know if it was me not those guys talked about oh when they come in and redo A1A if by expanding the diameter of that pipe. Yeah. But if we go ahead and remove it Mhm. at the
basically the headwater then you know we've got all of this coming from uh orange magnolia that could be routed into it but u I just think I think as
many solutions as we can put out there that are efficient would be great. Thank you. Anytime you can mix Filillmore flooding and pickle ball, you know you got a winner. Those are some big topics in our city. Thank you so much. Absolutely. If
there's not anything else, I think we got the motion in the second on the floor. We can go ahead roll. City clerk, please. Council member Davis, four. Council member Jackson, four. Mayor Prom Callum,
four. Mayor Morrison, four. Council member Willis four. Okay, that concludes uh item 8 uh A. I do we are at 7:40 almost. Let's take a quick recess if that's okay. Uh let's
try 10 minutes. Try to get back between around 7:50 on that clock at least and uh try to finish this item up. He's Preacher. All righty. I call the meeting back to
order. It is 7:51 p.m. here uh at our regular city council meeting. We are working through we just completed item 8A as under the items for action. We are
now on to item 8B which is the Thurm Boulevard streetscape project proposal like the last one engineering services with me and Hunt. And uh I won't read the the proposed motion but if there is
a if we want to lead with the motion I do think that works better but if we need to discuss we can. I'll make a motion to approve the uh item. I'll second. Got a motion by council member Willis, a second by council
member Davis to approve the motion, I believe as written, and that is a motion to consider the approval of a proposal from Meden Hunt in the amount of $101,741 for design and engineering services for Thurm Boulevard streetscape project and
authorize the interim city manager the same at this uh council. I think uh if any questions. Yes, Mayor Perim Kellum. Um yes, I have a couple questions. Um and
it the same thing with the money. Um budget book. The Yeah, the budget book. Um and my first question is it says in the summary um oh page 101 in the budget
book um 101 it says that Mr. Bard in 2023 was test um to wait a minute where I city test hunt to carry out the work that Mr.
Beard had begun. So Mr. Bicard Oh, here it is. Test in 2019 to perform a conceptual view of Thurm Boulevard's drainage outfalls and provided a report. So my question is um
after Mr. Bard left then me and Hunt was tasked with that and then on the description of services it says data collection and site reconnaissance utility coordination. So
in 2023 did Me and Hunt perform the data collection then or are we doing that now? 2024 is when they when they did that. It was for mainly for storm water. Uh during Par's term here when he
started this project he did not include storm water calculations which you need that's a major component of uh putting in a storm water system. Uh he said that he did not do it at the time. Uh they had some rough plans that they put
together. Um but that was what that was for. Uh the reconnaissance uh getting with St. John's uh saying that they could be permitted, what would be permitted. Um that's what that reconnaissance was for. Okay. So then if me and Hunt did
the performed the data collection in 2024, why is it part of the work that's going to follow? The data collection is again in the description of services.
You're referring to the agenda sum cover summary. Yes. Okay. What what task is that? It's it says the data collection. I see it. Utility coordination look. Okay. So, that's a little bit different. That's not really uh for storm water. That's
going to be for FDOT, for FPL, for all other utilities. Oh, okay. It's just included in their whole scope of work. So, when they do the project, um they're not going to worry so much about the storm water portion of it, but they do need to worry about tying in with FDOT's
A1A on that one side. Um they're going to have to uh work around with FPL on their poles and where their lights are and okay. Um so that's the data collection and site reconnaissance that they'll do for that portion. Okay. So the the one that Meen Hunt did is the
storm water part. That first one was storm water. Correct. Thank you. Absolutely. And then my other uh questions were um the uh amount of money um 101,741
out of the general fund. And then in the um the budget book um there's the 1,200 again construction and support engineering field beads and bid process.
And then there's 280,000 out of the general fund and 12 one I'm sorry 1,200 out of or one 1.2 million. Yes. Thank you. Yes. much of your luck. Thank you. All
these zeros. Gez. Um out of the impacts. Yes. So again, where are we with that? And this is um it's um
Mayor Promp. Yes. Um I'm here to throw you that life preserver. Um so uh yeah. So obviously Tim's got this portion done, but in 2526 we'll have a proposed budget of 1.4
million which is going to include that one for which 1.2 million of it will be covered by the impact fees. Okay? And this is a big project. This project's going to cost uh probably over
$3 million. So, um I'm just and and this is this is not complete yet, but um this isn't final, but I'm just letting you know that I'm letting you know that uh so 1.4 million is expected to be completed in 2526
and in 2627 1.4 million is to be completed. So, this project is going to stretch over the next two years after this year ends. And um so that's what's going on. And and maybe it showed there I don't have I I I don't
have that budget with me, but if it's showing that certain things were going to take place this year, well, they didn't because um uh Tim basically has gotten the meet and hunt portion, design and engineering services done, but
everything really begins next year. So this is going to be spread over the next uh two years after this year. What I what I've been told by me and Hunt is this portion of it will be the finalization of the design plans that
Picar started. Um they did have to redesign quite a bit of it because Picar didn't his were some rough designs rough rough designs on uh everything including like I said no storm water calculations. Um this will be I believe completed if
I'm not mistaken. They said if everything goes well with St. John's, which they do believe it will since they've already talked to them about this. Um, we were offered an exemption, which is a wonderful, wonderful news on the St. John's permit. Um,
they said I want to say they said around October, November, possibly December at the latest of when this could actually go out to bid. And if I when I start doing my timeline of how I do this whole process from beginning to end, I try to work with the
finance department as much as possible to do it where it benefits everything, you know, timewise and t timelines are very important with within project management. So I try to make sure that half of it could be done within a year and half of it could go
into the next year to help even it out. Okay. Um, one other question. Um, on again ARPA funds. Um, we have $14,683
that has been spent from ARPA funds for this project already. What would that be for? $14,000. Could I see what you're looking at? C Mayor Pro Tim Kellum, are you referring to a report that you have that? Okay. No, that's fine. Uh I just
want to make sure it's not anywhere that the council can go see. That would be that would be um related to and see how it says SW7 that would be related uh to storm water fronts.
But what what I'm saying is what was that for? Um, what I would what I would have to do what I would have to do since for that minute amount I could go ahead tomorrow and see exactly what the $14,000 was spent on. I could pull I and
I'm not trying to be it's just hard for and if it's hard for me to understand I'm sure it's hard for the public to understand. But you're looking at you're looking at a list it and it's telling you there's $14,000 that been spent. If you asked me, John, what was spent on
parks and wreck in the last six months on this particular project? I I'm good, but I not that good. I have to go look and see how much where it was spent on. I'd have to look at that. What I'm trying to say is to me, and nothing against anybody,
it just would make more sense and for me and the public to understand, okay, here's the project. This is how much it's going to cost on on this sheet too from ARPA funds. It says $285,316 in ARPA funds. Where does that calculate
into all of this? That is a report that we we give to convenience for that we keep to show we're tracking how the ARP is being spent. That is not specific to every task. We just know the overall amount of money that's going to be spent
on that capital improvement project. So that's the only thing you can use that for is to say they gave us 300k for storm water 7 project and they spent 14k of it. Now what you're asking me is John
what specifically did they spend that 14,000 on? And I'm telling you that tomorrow when I go in my office, I will go to my finance staff and say, "Please send Mayor Prom Kellum what we spent $14,000 on." Probably a PO for uh work
related work. But on that particular thing, that just shows you how much ARPA money is being spent on each capital improvement project. The purpose of that is not to co- is not to uh match against the budget book.
That's Morrison. M I'm okay. I'm just trying to say that it to me it you know you have like on page 151 of this budget book you have 600,000 then you have 1.4 four or
1,480 in and then 1,200 in impact fees and then I it just it's kind of hard to follow what's happening is all I'm saying. So, I think what you do is when you have questions like this, you
specifically ask me um what those questions are and I I I go to my staff and I go in there and look and I could tell you exactly what the money has been spent on, but I I don't know what other way you do it because somebody else
could ask me what was that $3,000 spent on in uh parks and wreck under operational expenses. I'd have to go look and see what it is. Can is there any way that we could do project costing on these um CIPs? She has a report
that's just shows we tried as a courtesy we give a report because we were asked to see how much money we're spending on each project in ARPA. Okay. Mayor Prom's saying, "Well, what was that 14,000 for?" And I'm saying I will let you know
what that 14,000 for. But that's what I'm saying. When you do a project of of any nature and you use a project costing worksheet, when you spend the money, you put what the money was spent for.
And when you're talking about, you know, a million over a million, of course, we're going to want to know what's being spent. And with that project costing work a sheet as you spend it, you know, that's not the purpose of that report.
No, budget. I'm saying I think we're missing that piece. Without that piece, it makes it hard for us to tell what is going on. But something that minute, if if you're asking for certain costs are, and the mayor's asked for this before, and we we
have sent a general ledger that shows each account how much has been charged against it. That's in our accounting system. This here is nothing more than showing you all the projects that are have ARPA funding related to it and we're just
showing you a balance of how much of it's been spent. That's all. So that's not the purpose of that report. Well, what I I guess I'm not making myself clear or making sense, but on the bottom when it says financial impact and it
says that this money is coming out of the general fund and there's money everywhere else that is going to this project. Yeah. I think that's an unfair assessment towards myself and my and staff because it's basically the way
you're explaining it is almost like we have money all over the place and we do not there's a logical explanation and and you know if people are watching in the audience you know they're thinking like well what's going on you know why is that over the you know I mean I think
what you do is you ask the question where the money's being spent and then we give you the answer because I can't give you the answer right now. Well, what I'm saying, John, is when we get this sheet, when this comes to us on the
thing, why can't we just have this is going to cost 101,000 or whatever, right? But this is this is the how much money we have in here, storm water, this that, whatever. I mean, just explain if it says it's coming out of the general fund, that's where the money
is coming out of. And then if you need to get more specific than that, I mean, this money has not been spent yet. You're approving this 101. And then when it's time to be spent, if you want a once the money once
the program's executed, if you want a report that shows how the general uh fund or general ledger is being affected, then we could show you what's been spent as as we spend the money. Uh but when we first do the project, we're
saying we're gonna this is costing $101,000. And then we have reports in our accounting system as we're processing POS and what have you that's going to show you how the money spent. Anything else? No, I just think there's a dis and it
and it's just because I've come from the other side where you're managing projects and when you're managing projects, if you do an expenditure, for example, with this pilot project on the concrete, now we know we're going to
spend 99,000 and whatever. And if a spreadsheet was kept to that where we could say what have we spent and you know and knowing now we've got this
budget here's where the money comes from here's what we've spent out of it so far and I think that's the gap that I am seeing there's respectfully there's no ga gap those monies are in our software system and we could run projects
whenever you'd Uh we could run we could run uh uh reports whenever they like and they could see what we spent. I I'm I I there's no gap and the language that's being used here is is you know it's it's
there there's no gap. I I I just uh John I'm just I just want to I'm going to get um it sounds like you're perceiving the language is to be negative. I haven't heard it that way. I don't think Mayor Bllum has asked for what it is now.
14,000. I think respect that when you get back, you know, that'll be able to be provided. Um, that's all I'm saying. Council member Jackson was raising that perhaps Mayor Pro in the future wouldn't have even needed to ask that question to
avoid it and to save staff time and try to set kind of a a format and standard moving forward. But, uh, yeah, I I I just want to make sure we're, uh, hearing each other the same. And it is it is tough. It is tough to follow. And
I appreciate the desire to help communicate financial data to council members and the residents. I'm here to do my job. my work to the world. But as the days,
you know, now the budgeting, you can go any click on projects and see breakdowns as council members. I just want to add one thing to this. I look forward to when we cla
Starting with 101 passion agenda item,000. Yeah. And and and that and that's all I mean. It's it's just, you know, the 1.4 million and then in storm water uh
project number seven, 600,000 there on one page 151. I'm just and you know 101,000. I just want to see where it's coming from. So, let me give you a a brief explanation of how I go about getting
this whole thing started from the time you see it in a budget book to the time that we actually get a PO. Um, when I get something approved like this that has $101,741 uh price tag on it, let's say that the
whole budget was $2.5 million. We're taking this as one of part part of that $2.5 million and we're taking it out of that those funds. Now, those funds might not totally be spent as this one's going to be rolling over to next fiscal year
for the project. But if I were to do the project and the project was three million and it involved three different accounts, storm water, um, general fund, general fund and and and another account, it would be wrapped up into one
PO. Now, once I get a pay app, once the contractor starts construction on that project, they submit a pay app for, let's say, $500,000. when I send that over to uh Donna. Now, Donna keeps a spreadsheet, which is what
you were discussing, that shows how much we have left on that project until we hit that 0 amount that the the PO's been expended. It's done. And let me stop let me stop you there. Okay, just to stop you there. So what he just said, I want everybody to take uh you know,
understand that that is exactly what council member uh Jackson was saying and you just answered her question. Yes. And those things are internal and they're in our system and if anybody wants to see them, they could see them, but they're not going to appear here, right? It's
too much data. We would be here for I don't know 12 hours explain this. So thank you, Tim. That was perfect because now council member Jackson knows tomorrow if she wants to come in and see where that $14,000 is, we'll just go show her. Yeah. Anam a good example is
um I believe somebody had asked me for how much we have spent on a project and how much we had left over. So I was able to go into BSNA and see how much we were how much we actually spent. Um, luckily I I got I get the pay app so I can see the ones that haven't been approved yet
that are still going through the system, but I can go ahead and deduct those and say, "Okay, this is coming out soon. We're about to submit a check for this." Now, when it comes down to what fund it's being taken out of that 500,000, that would have to be a John question because I don't know, they might take
200 out of storm water out of that 500. They might take 200 out of ARPA out of that 500 and 100 out of the general fund. And that's based on the project cost defined to the department, right? There's storm water money, there's infrastructure maintenance money. So,
it's being split and there's so much and those are the things that could be showed to council when they request that information. And I think that's where the 14,000 comes in because it's just a portion of maybe something that was bigger. Might it might Exactly. I'm not
sure. I'm just I'm not worried about the 14,000. And I I and I'm not trying to say I doubt anything anybody's saying or any of that. I'm just saying when we get a project like this and it says 101,000 and then I go to the budget book to see,
okay, let me see, you know, how much we and it says it'll be funded by impact fees or storm water fees and this says general fund. I'm just a little confused about that. That's that's all I'm saying is now I can tell you that Me and Hunt
was tasked with a uh originally a study. You know how you had just mentioned that and I had mentioned the stormwater study that was a total of 17,000 something dollars but I don't think they might not have build it all the way out yet. So
that 14,000 might be out of that 17,000 original PO that we had submitted for that study for the storm water calculations and this and the permitting. Okay. I I'm not doubting anyone. I'm just Yes, I know. I understand 100%. It's confus No, it's
confusing, but I mean it's confusing, but that's that's why you have us on staff. That's that's what you hire us for, you know. So we could provide uh we could provide anything you want by line item for any project and the spreadsheets are attached right the
spreadsheets are attached right to the purchase order. So anyway I know it's confusing it's it's it's uh it could get very confusing. I am very interested in getting to aware
we're not basic. have to ask today but I think we I just think it would be easier for us to understand and you know when a resident says to me well why are we paying 101,000 out of the general fund
and I go well I don't know you know um I would just like to be able to understand it so I can you know give the right answer to people. So anyway that's all
I was going to say there we could go to uh meetings before the me meeting today but we have a question I want to call a question we have a vote on so I want to call a question or take a vote get a motion and a
I had a question for 10. have a motion on the floor. It wasn't a second. So question I did I did second question. No, I'm just saying we've got
the the vote on I mean the the motion and the second. Thank you. And we've been talking about budget. So with the budget, we can go to the officer or whatever a before we go to this meeting. So we understand where the come the
funds are coming from so that we don't have to do it today and we have a vote on we need to vote. Call the question. But you have another council member that has a question. Yes, that's correct.
have privilege to ask the question. No, I know. But we've been going on for No, the point is that get on with it and call the role, but I think Jackson doesn't want to call the role right now. She wants another ask another question. It won't it'll be a
quick You're the chair mayor. Yes. Thank you. Uh out of respect to council member David's request, you would make a motion to call the question. It would get seconded. It sounds like council member Willis and if we want to call a roll call. Twothirds vote. I don't support that. I want to hear council member
Jackson's question. I would like to hear a question. So I don't think we have a twothirds vote but we can certainly I think for expedience let's allow this question. Thank you. That's fine. Jackson and it'll be a quick question. I
um Tim in regards to the actual and realize I wasn't in the planning and wasn't on council when we talked about the streets and what they would have on them. So, how different will this the features of
this street be compared to like Filillmore when we talked about removing some of the things on Filillmore? Um will it be glaringly different? Um, this this project is going to be a complete street project. And what I mean
by complete street is it will have the solar lights on the pedways. It will have the uh the bigger pedways. Um, if you look at from A1A to Thurm on Central. Mhm. It's going to kind of look exactly like that. So, it's going to
mesh all the way through to A1A all the way to A1A. Okay. From those two roads. And the presidential streets had a lot more features built into it. It seems like the presidential streets I down I I had a conversation with them. We um we
removed a lot of the I believe I spoke about this earlier about removed a lot of the artsy stuff. Um, we were trying to I was trying to pinpoint the uh severity of the flooding issue mainly and if any uh sewer laterals or sewer
lines need to be replaced or are removed and put somewhere else. Um, so those those took precedence on those pro on that project, Filmore project, right? Um, lights can be added later if if we want to. Um, our our artsy stuff can be
added later if we want to. I want to make sure that there's definitely a sidewalk on one side of the road that people can safely walk up and down, right? Um, and I know that that had been discussed with the non-presidential street sidewalks that we got done. Uh,
we wanted just to make sure that there was at least one sidewalk that people can safely travel. Um, they're not pedways, they're sidewalks. So there's a big difference with the Thurm Boulevard. It's going to have a sidewalk and a pedway on the other side. So the huge
difference in cost for the presidential streets is mainly storm related. Correct. Cuz it was really it came in really high compared to this. Yeah. Well, we'll see what happens once because I I want to say that they gave
the OPC the opposite the um cost estimate. The engineers gave the cost estimate with everything included. And since then though, I've taken some stuff out of it and we have made some revisions and we've changed some things. So I think
that when they submit over the final plans, they should have a no a new OPC included with it. So we'll be able to tell more of how much that Filmore project's going to cost. Okay. Thank you. And thank you for explaining about
how the jobs are costed out for you as far as documenting. Um, I think with council not having been in the BSA and a training that that kind of puts us at a disadvantage, um, it's too late because it's already happened. But I think that
would have been helpful if we were in it since that's where the information lies for us. But thank you so much. And I'm done. Yes, thank you. I do have one just small one. You said two dates. Fillmore August September earlier. I'm assuming that's
this upcoming August, September is the hope, correct? And then you had mentioned Thurm October, November this year is corre correct. Thank you. Okay, great. Council member Jackson, I think you're done with questions. Are there anything else? If not, we've got a
motion, a second on the floor uh to approve it as written. Ready? No further discussion. City clerk. Council member Davis. Four. Council member Jackson four. Mayor Prom Kellum
four. Mayor Morrison four. And council member Willis four. Right. Item 8B passes 50. We have one more uh item for action under item 8 C. This item here is an independent auditor
contract renewal and engagement letter. James Moore and Co. BL motion to uh well, I won't read it again, but it's a consideration of to renew the contract with James Moore uh the independent auditors and authorize the uh
interim city manager. I'll make a motion that we approve the renewal of James Moore and Company as the independent auditor. Second. Got a motion by uh Mayor Pro Tim Kellum. Got a second by council member Willis. Uh I do
have some discussion on this. Uh I believe uh well let me just get to the actual packet so I can reference. So 2010 was the initiation that the contract was
executed for a 5-year period and then it was renewed for a through 2020 uh five from 2020 to 2024. and and basically the
engagement letter here wants to renew uh for years September 2025, 2026, 27, 28, and 29. Um so it's basically another five-year
extension. It'll be our third one to bring it to the 15 years. Yes. Okay. Um thank you. When is the the deadline or the date of the le uh the original the anniversary
for this? Is it coming up in a month or two? No, it's already it's already passed. I had that uh letter that I I had uh shared with each council member that letter that I had wrote to discuss with council that after the um
after the audit was presented in February as it is each year that would be their last act and then then of course then you've got to go into a renewal and um so now we're at that renewal period. It really closed out
when we um you know when we presented the uh the audit and and got through the audit, but of course they kept servicing us to answer my questions. I mean they're I mean they're outstanding. I called them today and their their um
partner answered the phone on the first ring. So, I'm uh yeah, they're they're outstanding and thank you for sharing that with us. Obviously, in your capacity and the history of the city as finance director, you and chief financial officer really
the city, you've you've maintained that relationship and and shared that it's been positive. Um my request would be that we do not extend for a full five years. We should propose extending for one year. auditors. Uh, correct me if
I'm wrong. It's it's a healthy thing to consider ro rotating auditors from time to time. I don't know how many years we went with James Moore, but I was going to request that if their anniversary is coming up or we're passed or we have
time to postpone it, um, and I will consider the five years, but with a new city manager coming in who is coming into a five-year agreement, um, I want to do as little as possible long and to not bind them to any long-term
commitments so that they can come in and and make listen and and I I think we'll have one year at least and we could automatically renew. I mean, a city attorney could write it in a way where if council doesn't take action, it can automatically renew. That initiates on
us. But, uh, I I think 10 years they've been auditing us. Um, it would be best practice to go out and bid for either rotate auditors or go back out to
bid again um to see what types of services they can provide and and further I would be interested in other uh the other services the way that they help us. They are very responsive. I
think they would be uh tough to beat uh there but I think they've also performed other outside maybe the scope. I think it audits was mentioned in the past. Is that right? That they do one like it's every three years they'll actually could
send in an IT person that does an extensive audit. I mean it's it's a lot of it checks our it checks our our IT program. Yeah. And we've utilized that service as well. Oh, yes. Um, that's part of it's it's it's part of what they
do, but it's not done every year because they know there's a comprehensive thing that they do. I don't know in this contract when they would do that. Maybe two or three years in, but um in in reference to what you're saying though, I don't know.
I don't know. I'd have to talk. I don't know if they would if they will renew for only two years. And we're in this has been a hellacious year with the firing of a city manager and a lot of new staff. This is not the opportune
time to switch auditors. Now, if you want it, but I did hear you say, "Mayor, if we had him for two years, I mean, one year, uh, one year, um, that would mean that you'd have to, for instance, if you ever said we have to go out for bid, that would be very,
that would be very bad at this point because it'll take 60 to 90 days a council have to interview all the audit groups. If we get three, say, you guys are going to have to in interview them." And our pre- audit is would be scheduled
for the beginning of September with the final audit in December. We can't make that. And if I was the city manager coming in, I would not want to have that on my plate. So I don't think James Moore will just do it for one year,
mayor. Okay. Do we have anyone from James? I don't think anyone's here to verify that what you're No, you would have obviously said that. So, if they will not um I think we need to to know that their pre- audit work begins in September. Well, typically in the past
they used to do it in August, but they'll do it right before we do the first budget hearing in September and then in and then staff has a heck of a lot of work to do to get ready for they usually do it the first week of December. They do our final audit.
So I think that I'm talking about 2026 uh 20 the next year. Yeah. So so so we can roll with in I think business as usual with James Moore, but we have a year's ahead of time to go out uh and
and see if there are any options out there. if they're not uh that we are interested in or whatever the process is to comply. I think it's good practice to go back out and look at service providers uh from every I mean it's been 10 years
and now we're going to renew for another lock in five more. Yeah. I think the city manager coming in is going to appreciate that. Um it's going to be a load on a new city manager or she might immediately say no absolutely extended
another four. We we John it agrees fully with you but I've just like uh waste pro services or just like any other franchise or service provider when we hit 5 years I do want to just stop and look and and see uh
what other options are out there. Um, so do we know who did the audit for the city of Cape Canaveral prior to James Moore? I was I wasn't here, but I'm going to say it could have been like cars cars cars rigs or whatever their name was. Do you know roughly what time
that was before? I came on in 2013. James Moore was already here in 2010. Mr. Green, the former city manager, was hired around 2010 nine, I think. So the first thing he did when he came in before your time was discontinued the
auditing existing auditing services. I I'm not sure I could I could ask Cheryl Cheryl's been here changed. I agree and know how it changed. I don't think that's how it happened, but if I could make if I could just say this real quick, mayor, based on what you said,
let me make sure I understand what you're saying. So, you're saying when you turn to the attorney and say you would be willing to s because you could do a termination with auditors if that's what you want to do, but you're saying you would take on
the five years, but when the new city manager comes in, you would like to know that to give that person the option of potentially whether feeling comfortable with them or wanting to look at other things and if
you had the option a year later that that city manager whoever that will be would say I want to go out for and put it out for bid. I think that's what you're saying because you're not saying just John call these guys tomorrow and see if they'll only do it for another
year. I just don't want the city manager to be locked into a fiveyear agreement. Mr. Mayor. Yes. Council member Willis. Attachment A number 29. Mhm. that the city attorney would look at that and
there's an out where client may elect to terminate services rendered under the terms of the engagement for any reason or no reason at all second to last page. Yeah. But in where what are you you
reading the general terms? Yes. I have some issues with the general terms. There's another provision on um page 10 of the scope of auditing services that has a um different clause says the
engagement may be terminated by either party for non-compliance with the terms as noted in the engagement letter and you have to provide 60 days notice of intent to engage. So, you know, there's some provisions in
the general terms that have to be corrected like public records and most of the general terms don't even even apply to a public sector client, but they attached it. I guess that's just the standard practice. So, it's some adjustments need to be make be made to
this. What would you recommend? Well, if it's the desire of council to move forward for one year, we would need to um you know, either set this as a one-year term or keep it a 5-year term subject to
termination for convenience at the you know, at the at any time. That would give the council the ability to um consider going out for auditing services. And there's a there's a special
procurement process for that. I won't bore you with the details, but there's a special process to uh retain auditors. Okay. So, now keep in mind they're also they're also quoting um you know a five-year fee.
So, I don't know how inclined they would be if if it's subject to if it's a one-year. They might jack up the price. Well, no. They might modify the pricing schedule. on page nine. Mhm.
So there's a fee city attorney. Yeah, there's a there's a pricing schedule for Oh, I see. year end um from 2025 through 2029. I see. that they're committing to a fiveyear this which is standard practice for the
auditor annual for the auditors is when they have these contracts is they have a standard uh fee for a number of years has a has a small escalator built into the long-term contract but if you only want a one-year contract
then I assume you know the 2025 fee will be the 54,000 plus the single audit fee of 4500 and a CRA a audit of 5,000. Yeah. The rest of the pricing wouldn't be relevant in a one-year contract, but
if they were willing to keep the pricing schedule and have a 5-year contract that the city can terminate for convenience, we'd have to go back and ask them whether they would stick to the pricing. if the council has the ability to terminate this um at any time.
I if if we can do that and just add in a termination for convenience and if they're willing to amend the agreement, I think that would that would be prudent. Um Council Member Davis, I would think that a new office manager,
we have this guy that's wonderful all these years. He doesn't want to have to go through um sorry my voice doesn't want to find another one. I think we should do the f
them for the five years and then after that if he's not happy with them after five years you can do it but he's he's he doesn't want to do this in the first year. He's got other things to mind look at. I will let them speak for
themselves. My response to that, Council Member Davis, is he would or she would walk into um the same auditor, exactly what you're saying, but they have enough runway in 2026 that if they want to change, they have the option to whether it be
termination for convenience amended, assuming James Moore would be willing to do that. Um or it's just for one year and uh whatever I think is in the best interest of the city. trust our city attorney. Um, and
of course, if that is the case where they go, I don't want to do this. You're absolutely right, Council Member Davis. They they have an agreement that's signed, executed, and they go, "Nope, I'm going to keep extending." But this right here, I think, assumes that they're going to get 5 years. They base
the pricing on five years. That's going to be 15 years with the same auditor. That to me does not seem to be like the best practice or healthy. We should rotate auditors every decade in my opinion and I'm actually I mean the
truth is I I think we should do it now and and let James Moore bid and and we go out and look at the others as well, but it what I'm understanding from our interim city manager is if they're going to get started in September, uh we don't have enough time to do that and our city
attorney highlighted a different process for that which I think uh usually means more cumbersome by state procedures I guess come into play when you're procuring services from auditing. Oh yeah. Yeah. I mean it's probably it's
probably going to be I mean 60 90 day process. I mean you'd have to there's a you have to form a committee. The committee has to prepare the RFP document and approve it. Then it has to hit the street. Then you have to get your responses back. And the committee
has to review um and make a recommendation to the city um to the city council. And that committee has to consist of at least three people and one of them has to be one of you plus two other people to serve on that at least two other people to serve on that
committee that are not council members. So I mean there's a you know there's a process that's it's just for auditing services. So, you know, my my suggestion is if there's a con there's there's a consideration. I don't know whether or not you can go out for bid now for your
next auditing services that are going to be required. It may not be enough time. I'll leave that to John. If there's not enough time, then I would recommend, you know, see if they'll keep the 5-year um 5year uh pricing schedule, but make sure that there's a termination for
convenience um clause in the retainer. So, if you want to get out, you can get out. Um, and the general terms and conditions need to be modified. Um, and I would not and if you go in that direction, I would just ask for the
leeway to go ahead and make those modifications to the to the retain a letter with uh James Moore. Mr. Mayor. Yes, Council Member Willis. with your intent being to give the uh potential new city manager the ability
to do this. I think we should go with the city attorney's recommendation because then it's up to him. If he doesn't like the service, he can terminate gave him an out. Yeah. But if he likes it, we're we're committed. We made it as easy as possible.
assuming James Moore is willing and and I guess the last question would be if we don't make those changes the the issues if they don't like the service and they don't want to continue the general terms as council member Willis those need to be changed I think
you said you can't just cancel at any time because you got some conflicting in the Okay um well unless you need clarity from us uh city attorney Um I think the motion on the floor is to pass it as
written. During discussion I raised uh pass it as written and I would I would ask that we amend it as as we discussed to allow for that one-year term. Um that's all
I think I made the motion. So, can I make I think um Well, I I have Wouldn't we be doing it for five years, but with the ability to withdraw from it uh for convenience?
So, we're asking for a change in the language, not necessarily the length of term. Yeah, that's if that works. I think that would so I think if we were to withdraw the motion but or amend the
motion to allow the city attorney to amend the contract or seek some amendment to the contract for convenience regarding termination. Yeah. Is that what we need? Withdrawal. Yeah, that's what you need. The only point, just of clarification, in the event that
they're willing to do a one-year contract pricing schedule, you know, would that be an acceptable alternative? Absolutely. Because they can. So, it's either a one year, I mean, one year at the price quota for 2025
or the whole five-year pricing schedule, right, with a with the ability to terminate for convenience. Excellent. I mean either one I think works for you. I don't know if what works for them as long as it has that effect to allow the
after after the next order. So if they disagree Anthony then they won't I can't if they did no if they did because I have to face constant audit questions. If they disagree
then I can't pick up the phone and call them no longer. your contract's done. So I have this city will have no money. Then you have well then then you don't have a contract and then we'll be back before the council and we'll get a committee organized and we'll go through and 90
days later. So this and I'll tell you based on experience and I've been here 12 years if we have to go out 90 days and then there's a committee and whatever who knows it might go in October. There's no way that this audit could be done on time next year in February. My I don't know my experience with James
Moore is they're extremely professional. They they are. But Anthony, you're not sitting in my seat and have to answer all these questions and whatever. With no disrespect, but you know, I'm the one that's stealing. You're not doing the audit for the city. I am. I mean, come on. No, I'm just addressing that. Yeah.
Whether they would leave the city out on a lurch, I I doubt that. Probably not. But if they say they want a greedo one year, I have nobody. Well, an if you are in a circumstance where you don't have a service provider, I'm willing to meet in an and certainly
if it qualifies for an emergency meeting. Um I hope that doesn't happen. Oh, me either. I I mean we could find a quorum and and and help expedite and do whatever measures we have. Um so so what's the motion then?
I mean, my my my re my I mean, my recommendation is is to um approve the retainer agreement for the for the five with the five-year pricing schedule, modify the retainer agreement to include a termination for
convenience. Um so when the city gets the next city manager, you know, we have some flexibility to just you know to terminate the contract and um modify the general terms and conditions uh that need to be modified in my opinion um
because a lot of it's just private sector general terms and I think it needs to be tailored more to the public sector and public records and things like that need to be addressed. I mean, with that, um, you're basically approving what they presented with a
change in the termination clause and some modification of the general terms and conditions, which I don't think a legally acceptable for a city client. So, do we need to amend the main motion? No, I think that's what I think that's what Councilman Willis was getting at.
Now if they don't the only op the only caveat is if you know they don't want to do that you know then would they accept just a one year a one-year term um based on the price that they quoted
and you know one of those options I I presume is going to be acceptable to them. If neither are acceptable, which I highly doubt, then we'll be back before you because John's got a pickle to, you know, do Oh, it's not This is It's not
my pickle. It's council's pickle. I'm here to do the job. It's not my pickle. They need to make the decision. Cuz I mean, right now, you don't even have a contract, right? Have a contract because they completed the They're still picking up the phone, though, because they gave me a renewal. I had to contact them.
Yeah. Well, they're Yeah. Very professional firm. Oh, they're fantastic. And the motion I don't think so. I think uh the motion on the floor was as written and the changes termination. Yeah.
Termination for convenience. It's either going to, you know, which would include a 5-year pricing schedule or just a one-year, right? Modification of the general terms and conditions that I think are legally acceptable for for a city client. Um, and then I think he got
a contract once we we finished the document. So, the city attorney, I think if I understand, he's heard the motion and he's also heard uh some changes as he stated the termination for convenience with the 501 and the modifying the
general terms. If we've heard anything that's a concern, I think he has stated the direction I would support with the motion that's existing. So just council is there any concern with
well the attorney? Yeah because I think if that one year is in there they're not going to do it. So we're going to be high and dry with about audited. But if we do the five years and we don't say anything about the one year and two
and a half years ago or three one two whatever we decide you we don't like you you know we want to change how would that be to get out of that contract. Not sure I understand that. I mean, well, we don't want to if we don't want
to weigh um one year in there, we don't want to put that in the TR contract, but two year two years we decide there's something that we don't like and whatever we want to change and get another one. Can we get out of that
contract without saying putting with the one year in there? Well, that's what I think what we're trying to do is trying to get a fiveyear five-year contract with the pricing schedule with a termination clause that gives that for convenience. I mean,
that's not a massive change to this um to this document. And then we have to change the general terms and conditions. Okay. Now, if for some reason they won't accept a termination for convenience with a 5-year pricing schedule, I just wanted a
backup plan and that is, you know, we'll do a one-year contract then. Okay. And I think in your example, it's a good question. In year two, as council member Davis said, if we get to that point, that convenience, if successful, will be there and you can Yeah. Or or you may
just roll it over for the ne to the next year. I mean, it's beneficial for them to have the 5-year with a, you know, termination for convenience clause. It may not be terminated. I mean, I think the point that's being made by some of the council members is, you know, let's
give our, you know, the next city manager, assume you appoint one, um, you know, an opportunity to deal with it. That's it. Thank you'all for hearing that out and working through. Um, if there's not anything else, I think
the motion stands on the floor. Our city attorney has communicated some of those changes with that motion and we can move forward as we discussed. City clerk. Oh boy.
Council member Davis. Four. Council member Jackson. Four. Mayor Prom Callum. Four. Mayor Morrison. four and council member Wittis four. Okay, great. Thank you all. Um I think
that concludes item 8 uh C. We are now at the public hearing portion of the meeting. Um we have the first one uh 8 D is in dog. uh second reading and public hearing ordinance 202502
on animal control. We took this up at last month uh before our city attorney I think as he gets ready to to read this ordinance. I am going to step out just for a second to the restroom and come back. But uh hopefully I'll be back in time. If not, Mayor Pro Tim Kellum need
a brief bait. He'll read this uh this ordinance and then uh we'll need to give the public the opportunity to speak. But I'm going to rush back as fast as I can. City attorney. Okay. Ordinance 02-2025, an ordinance of the city council of the city of Cape Canaveral, Florida,
amending chapter 14, animals article one in general and article 2, county animal control ordinance of the city code related to fines and penalties for animal control code violations providing for the repeal of prior inconsistent ordinances and resolutions.
Incorporation into the code severability and an effective date. second and final reading here. It's also a public hearing item. There have been no changes since uh the first reading. Just generally again, this ordinance conforms the uh
fine schedule for animal control violations under the city code with the fines that are in the Bvard County schedule of fines. And uh in the event there aren't any uh specific fines then um the fallback
would be under the general penalty section under the city code. Um so basically uh adopting Bvard County's schedule of penalties and fines for animal control violations. In addition,
as an aside, the council wanted a summary of the Pam Rock Act, which the legislature um adopted this session. I sent a a separate email this afternoon with that summary. It really doesn't pertain much to the the objective of
this uh ordinance, but you do have that summary um that I sent you, and I'd be happy to answer any uh questions at a later date regarding the Pam Rock Act. Mayor prom quick while he's the mayor's
still coming. Do we have any public participation? I don't I don't think we have any cards for this. Oh, you have a hand. Yes. Oh, Dr. Roberts. And it take your time as she's coming
up. Those of you who might be listening online, if you do intend to speak on this public hearing item before us, 8D, uh, ordinance 202502, we'll ask that you raise your hand and when she's finished and those here finish, we'll make sure you're heard. Dr. Roberts, uh, some of
you probably have noticed in social media that we've had a couple of instances with, uh, animals on the beach, and I'm just asking for clarity on this. Does this address does the Bvard County system address
animal issues on the beach? Yes, it does. BAR County's code does um Cape Canaveral's code currently does. Um except Cape Canaveral's code currently has a $35
um penalty for animals on the beach. And uh Bvard County has um um I think it's a $50 for the initial violation and 65 for any uh subsequent violations. So the adoption of this ordinance increases the
fine with respect to animals um on the beach subject to $50 instead of for the first Yeah. For the first violation, 65 for every other violation, the same person. Thank you. I know you all noticed that some of the commentary
depending on your point of view was that it seemed insufficient for the magnitude of the injuries that were incurred by those that were that's different influenced but that's different. I'm just asking that context. Yeah, thank
you. that would you know that particular I'm going to make a comment on that because I know it was an issue um that that involves um you know the dangerous dog declaration and and um Bvard County has um the regulations regarding the the
process to deal with dangerous dogs under the Pam Rock Act which was um enacted by the legislature. Um the legislature doubled the the civil penalty regarding uh dangerous dogs to
um from 500 to a,000 as the maximum civil penalty. Um and also made it um um more mandatory to um confiscate a dangerous dog um under certain
circumstances based on injuries that the the dangerous dog may have caused an individual. So that's that's under the state statute and Bvard County um administers that at least
and Bvard County is going to do they have to take any action at the county and I think that's what we were talking about. Yeah, they're probably going to have to do a little tweaking to their dangerous dog ordinance in my opinion. I tried to reach out to the county attorney today. He's out of the office.
So um they may need to make a Bvard County's ordinance in some respects based on my analysis is is actually more stringent than the Florida statute in some cases. So that that's permissible, but they have the ability now to kind of like up the fine. And if
they do, will ours automatically and do it? Um, if they decide not to up the fine, we could still go back and increase it under state law without then maybe some rewarding the way you have it today. Yeah, we might. Yeah, might have to come back and and take a look at that. I I would anticipate that BVAR
County is going to um you know, make these little tweaks to their code. Yeah. And I think that really we had one or two in our code and this expands and and provides uh attachment to the table
of violations to Dr. Robert's question and comment. um around aggressive dogs, dangerous dogs and specifies with those limits and escalators on some of them they increase. Uh before that, are there any
other public comments here that intend to speak? Seeing none, I don't see any hands raised online either. So with that, we'll go ahead and close public participation. Council, Mr. Mayor. Yes, Council Member Willis. Um,
after the last council meeting, our first reading of this, I reached out to Lieutenant Wheeler, the Bvard precinct, and uh suggested to her that uh we incorporate the COP program to
patrolling the beach and they are moving forward with that um with the side by side for the Bvard County Sheriff's Office and we'll be patrolling the beaches. is as part of their random patrols.
And although they can't find anybody, and Commander K can speak to this better than I can, but they can at least identify, warn people, um, you know, they can see what's going on.
And it also puts a BCSO presence on the beach a little more frequently than just having to respond. Uh I know a lot of several people have said, "Well, we never see them." Well, that doesn't mean
they haven't been there or aren't patrolling because they do. I know they do. I've seen them. I've almost got run over once by one. So, but Commander Kit can speak to all of this much better than that. That is correct. Yeah, we are incorporating that and it's an extra set
of eyes out there. And of course, we're in we're in constant communication with our coops. They have radios so when if they're out there and they they spot something, they can call us in and it actually kind of cut down on some of the time to relay. Um, and then in addition to a couple of things we've done here recently because this has come up in the
past. Um, if I don't know if you probably may have noticed at a couple of the beach accesses, we've got some a couple of sign boards up um kind of reemphasizing no dogs on the beach. There's one right now at Washington Avenue and I think the other one's at Buchanan and uh so to try and just reinforce that. And then one of the
other things that came up too was um Cherryown Park. I know it's it's very very limited. Um there is on on their sea turtle sign there's there's one one little blurb right at the very bottom if you if you read through the whole sea turtle thing it says no no no or animals
prohibited or no animals allowed something like that. So we have been in contact with the county since it's county park to see maybe if they would get something they put on the boardwalk to make it a little bit more obvious you know to to folks that are here because obviously we get a lot of a lot of folks that are here from in out of town and
visitors and stuff. Um so they they are willing to do that. um actually just talking to lieutenant earlier today, but I I guess they will what they would want to do that is a request from the city. The city would want they would want that request to come from the city um since it's county park and they would be willing to provide a couple extra signs
in there. So hopefully that hopefully those those additional things will kind of help out with with some of those. And um then to answer your your question, um there were a couple of additional citations issued too um after the fact once the investigation was completed um
for attack causing injury, which is like a 220 $25 fine. So I know there were two two additional ones issued for that um as well. So not that it makes up for for what happened, but at least it's a little bit more than that 50 $55 fine, I think, for the for the animal on the
beach. out yet. Thank you for that. And the um well, I will Are there any other qu I'm going to come back to that actually. Are there any other questions for Commander Kek on on this program? That's fantastic. The COOP program and uh being able to have extra set of eyes out
there. Uh if the county that was uh another question the perime the the boundaries of Cherryown Park I think obviously on the boardwalk on the beach were all in agreement but if it
is that parking lot I mean there's green spaces they regulate dogs is it their code that regulates that or is that ours is that designated as a dog friendly park in the lot. And the reason I ask is if they're
not allowed anywhere in there, would it be better to have signs? I think it's fine if you walk your dogs through there, especially the residents who want to use it, but Right. these these would be Yeah. exclusively say no no dogs on the beach. Addressing the dogs on the beach issue. Yeah. Okay. And if
somebody's just walking through with a leash, yeah, we're not, you know, we're not concern concerned about that. We don't have issues with that. So, and I guess that's allowed. they're allowed to have their dogs in the the park. If not, I would want them to be able to. And I just wanted to make sure that was clear.
And if for some reason, if they didn't, you know, you're coming in driving and you have your pet and you know, it hits you before you get out and go. However, um I think that park is that's not the issue, right? Uh thank you for explaining.
And the other issue I think we were talking about was how much the second offense increases for which one was it? There was just a few where the county really didn't
escalate a lot. It seemed Yeah. Some of them are significant, some of them are not. Progressive fine, but yeah. Like for instance, the one the the animal zombie, it's just a $10 fine whereas whereas some of the others are more you you almost double in cost and then
triple once you get to like a third offense. That was it. Yeah. So 1460b animal on public park or beach $55. The second offense goes like you to 65
and then it stays at 65 for the third and fourth offense. And so I think the challenge is if if we don't mirror the county, right, we're going to there's benefits in in referring to the
county and as opposed to try and change one of these sections or line items. Um I mean I think that based on you know your officer I mean they thought it would be more um convenient to have a uniform schedule of fines. It is
especially two since we do deal with the county area and the magistrate gone by the sea. Um so which is county area. So that way we're we're deal just dealing with one one across the board. And then and like city attorney mentioned because of the new law that the county may look to update some of their fines because I
think it's been a while since they've increased some of their fines. So they may even decide since they're doing that they may look at their fines and and and bump up some of the other ones that are up there. So, right, which if I'm saying if they do that, then obviously we will still continue to mirror whatever the fines as they go up. So, right, that's
that's that's what the code amendment does. So, whatever the county has in its fine schedule, then that would apply in the city of Cape Canaveral. And because we partner with BCSO, you would be notified at the county level anyways. And so therefore, we would
benefit in the city and know when those things go into effect. And we work obviously closely with our animal services officers. So, and it make would make it easier for them because that's that's of course what they're used to dealing with is the county fine. So, if they're and they do get called sometimes out here as well. So, if they're dealing
with something then it's it's just kind of a uniform for them to to deal with this and not not have to worry about a separate set of fines out here in the city. I understand. Thank you, council. Anything else for Commander Kek
or Thank you. appreciate that. I'll make a motion that we adopt ordinance number 022025 on the second meeting. I'll second. Got a motion by Mayor Pro
Tim Kellum, a second by council member Willis. Dr. Roberts, I heard you say something. We did close public comment, but could you please go Dr. Roberts? So the city clerk could I I can relay what she states. Yeah, but the city clerk mayor
can't hear. Yeah, I I I I'm okay with that. Okay. Yes. So, the uh she had asked that Commander Kek raised the point that the the county expressed a desire for the city to request that. Do we need to take any
action on that tonight and at least get consensus that we would like that? Would that Yeah, I can just I I get with the city manager or somebody and just just ask for them to do a formal request. We've got the contact with the county. So, I'm sure it's probably just either a matter of a phone call or maybe a a
email or letter from the city uh requesting that. So, no one opposes that for the sake of clarity. I think we're all That's great. I think that's good. City clerk, did were you able to capture that request? It was restating what Commander Kek, Dr. Shannon Roberts, she
stayed in her seat, but I want to make sure that is in the record that Yes, I will um get together with it. It was uh to clarify, it was the the county um parks and recck had just requested that
the city make a a formal request for the no dogs on the beach type thing that to come from the city instead of the sheriff's office. All right. Thank you very much. Thank you. That's great. Thank you. Okay, we got a motion and a second on the
floor. Any further discussion? Seeing none, city clerk, council member Davis, four. Council member Jackson, four. Mayor Prom Callum, four. Mayor Morrison, four. And council
member Willis, four. All right. Uh, ordinance 202502 regarding animal control passes on second and final reading 50. Thank you all for working through that. I look
forward to seeing those in improvements and been a long time coming. So, this is great. Now we move on to uh item
the second public hearing item which is item 8E is an elephant. Second reading and public hearing ordinance number 202503 regarding specimen trees. Mr. City attorney. Okay. This is ordinance second reading. An ordinance of the city
council of the city of Cape Canaveral, Florida, amending the definition of the term specimen tree in section 102-36 of the city code related to tree protection providing for the repeal of prior and consistent ordinances and
resolutions incorporation into the code severability and an effective date. So this is second and final reading. This ordinance modifies the definition in two respects. First, um, currently, um, a specimen
tree must have a caliper of at least 24 in or more in diameter. This ordinance proposes to reduce um the caliper from 24 to 18 in.
The second change is to make a sign I think is just a significant clarification that a specimen tree must be a desirable species. What that means is if there are trees that are on the undesirable
species list, they even though they may be um they may meet the uh caliber size um requirements, they would not be considered a specimen tree because they're undesirable.
And both desirable species and the undesirable species definition is set forth already in the city code. So there should be no misunderstanding what desirable or undesirable is to someone that knows a lot about trees, I suppose.
And um and it it's going to be set forth in the current edition of the Florida Native Plant Society's list of native plants as applicable to the East Central Florida region. So that means a lot to somebody um that would be applying this
ordinance. Mayor, thank you. City Attorney Council, before we go out to public on this second and final reading, public hearing, are there any technical questions or clarifications we need to ask city staff?
Seeing none, this is a public hearing. Yes, I'm sorry, Council Member Willis. I would like to I mean I I probably should have looked this up before we came, but understory understories of trees or background
history. Yeah. Um, does that fall in the category of specimen trees? Uh, that is a great question. I would have to defer to Abigail for that one. Okay.
Is so we have no Abigail here? No, she Okay. Because There's a lot of problems with cabbage palms, palmettos, all of that. And if that falls into the category of a
specimen tree based upon the caliber, that that could be very problemsome for people with extended property. Okay. So, you know, I would it would be nice to know whether understory is going
to be part of that. No, you say cabbage palm. Yeah. It's got a big fat over 18 inch. It sits low. They pop up everywhere. Yeah. It's on the native plant species list is obviously well sable palm. That's like a native
the state and it's a native. So, um, okay. Does it necessarily meet that it's desirable? And then specimen. It's over 18 in. It's not dead. It's not hazardous. It's not diseased. It's not
structurally unsound. Uh and it cannot and it can recover from pruning. Yeah, I think is okay. Good question. But but on your question, there is a definition of tree and there there is a separate definition of understory. They're two different things, right? To be a
specimen tree, it mean yeah the tree has it has to be a tree, right? So and it has to be minimum DBH of 4 in, right? or and um there's there's rest to the definition. Understory is just an underlying layer of low native
vegetation usually associated with trees, you know. So they're not the understory is not going to be a tree. Okay. So someone wanting to clear cabbage palms out
is not going to be subject to this. Well, the last sentence is in at least 10 ft. So to city attorney's point in the definition of tree woody fibrous perennial plant with one or more upright limbs with a minimum of DVH of 4 in or a
sum of 4 in for multi- stem trees. Yes. And an average mature height of at least 10 feet. So that Yeah. Yeah. Okay. 10 foot cabbage palms
survive. Mayor, um, just little point of privilege. I'm gonna lose my battery and I prefer not to have that happen. I got to run out to my car to get it. We'll take it slow. Yes. Thank you. So, I've hit the board. Council member Willis, are there any
other questions at this time? Well, I you know probably should have asked this at the first reading but is there any particular impetus behind going from 24 to 18? Uh
this is uh to protect uh our reputation as a tree city and to set uh a precedent for uh protecting our our vegetation. Um and uh uh so this I believe this project
began July 2024 and so the first reading was in May and then we're compiling all of our um project timelines for uh communication as to when this started but the impetus was uh uh mostly about restoration and
uh resiliency to protect our shorelines. Okay. And does this apply to all types of property, commercial and residential? I believe so, but I'm not 100% sure. I'd have to Yeah, that's okay. I'm actually
just trying to confirm. It's not specific to any area of the city is if it's citywide. They don't. I know that one of u the citizens that I've dealt with had this exact same issue in a residential condo complex.
They had an issue with uh they desired to remove a tree and they were not able to in residential. So that would tell us. Yeah. Um maybe I'll just make a note and I actually even spoke to Zach about
that. So, okay. So, it's pulling from section 102, right? It's amending 10236 and it under the definition it it changes 24 to 18. Doesn't say anything in there. City Attorney, do you
happen to know if this is citywide or is it just specific to residentially zoned or commercially zoned properties? Is the ordinance citywide? Yes. Does it apply to all types of all zones in the
city? Yes. Okay. It applies at the time, you know, once a development permit is issued and a land clearing permit needs to be uh issued, right, for the removal of authorized
trees. Mhm. Um yeah, the staff applies the code. Um the section under the land development code tree protection land clearing as we said
it's really the undesirable tree that exists today. As our city attorney said, we have the definitions for desirable and undesirable. Um 10253
it defines dead, you know, hazardous disease, you know, hazardous. If if there was a a tree on property that now is 19 in right on the line,
is there a process for them variance or a procedure they could go to have it removed? I believe that would fall under our tree removal application form. That is a
little new to the process. There's uh there's there's there's the regular process, right, where they have to come an applicant has to come in and apply for a permit. Um then there's a specimen tree process. If if a tree this
ordinance only affects the definition of specimen tree, so it doesn't change any of the process. If a tree qualifies as a specimen tree, as the council knows, um the the removal of a specimen tree
requires the city council's approval. Okay. So, all other uh tree removals and land clearing follow the administrative process and don't come before council.
Okay. So, basically, it's uh the same as it's always been. It just now applies to bigger maybe smaller diameter tree. Well, it could also result in less trees. If some trees are
undesirable that would have qualified under the current definition of specimen tree, they would not qualify as a specimen tree under the proposed change because they're deemed undesirable. So I I don't you know how that plays out
is going to be completely sightsp specific. It's all about the live oaks. I mean that's really where the the most controversy those are desirable. Yeah. Right. And but when you get into the 18in
20-in live oaks on on those properties, it sounds like those are not fun circumstances. But we've had situations where the tree is in the middle of the building footprint on residential property off to the side and some of the tough votes and that was
uh you know under state law viewed as a threat to their ability to build and live in a home and you know same with the businesses. Can you make it work with the trees? We always want that and try to figure out how. And so
that going down to 18 in I think opened up a lot more trees, but with the designation of desirable, uh, yeah, I think they might be able to remove trees that they once could not. How do we know that it points to the
Florida native species list? Does it in the code does it state that uh we're adding in the specimen tree must be a desirable species and then when I go to desirable yeah it's selected from the desirable
species and plants in the current edition of the Florida Native Plant Society's list of native plants as applicable in the east central Florida region. Where is that? Um, that's in 102-52.
And then 102-53 refers you to a different list. Um, the the it's the Florida Exotic Pest Plant Council's invasive plant species list. So, you know what's on the list? I
you know, I can't tell for sure. I mean, one little quick Google search. I mean like undesirable or looks like we got plants like Brazilian pepper and acasia, old world climbing ferns, air potato,
Australian pine, water hyasent, lantana, Japanese honeysuckle, the old skunk vine, that Chinese tallow. He's having way too much fun here. Yeah, you're a tree. I'm
looking for the lasagna, but I don't Oh, we got an asparagus fern, though. So, 10253 mentions the Florida native plant, but we're not changing that. That's already there. Yeah, that's already there. It's been there for years. 10236 is the focus. uh the
process they can go through the same process they've identified now a specimen tree if they need to remove it and it's a healthy tree that's going to require a council vote um I I understand now
we've went No we haven't gone to the public yet did we it's getting late not we did not go to the public I don't think any more questions and city staff with this one. It's a public hearing item. If anyone intends to speak, thank you for your
patience. Uh we ask that you please come forward and speak. [Music] And those of you listening online, looks like Dr. Roberts is coming up to speak. If you do intend to speak, please uh please raise your hand and we'll make
sure you're heard. I just wanted to say two things. one I think the uh desirable part of it is always a little worrisome because in the eyes of the beholder desirable is very subjective and that's one of the things that we run into I know in our community
um and also the concern about the timing of looking at these trees um on Shorewood Drive in North Atlantic for example and I think it's Randy May's property I may not be right on that but there was a huge clearing of the land there and one tree was maintained, but
it seems like the definition of what we're now coming up with maybe would have preserved some more trees than what happened in that property cuz nothing's been structurally, you know, required there at this point. But I just wanted to mention that as an example of where I
think this narrower circumference that you all are talking about will be desirable because that will help us maybe preserve some trees if I understand it correctly that might otherwise have been taken well maybe it would it would enable them
to be looked at for preservation whereas otherwise they would maybe just be taken down if they didn't meet the size. Um and secondly, I'm just wanting to compliment Tim as our arborist because he has just done a fantastic job of
advising us on the dunes for example u because each of the communities has naturally um trying to keep our dunes healthy and Tim has been just great with advising us on those trees that are out there. So Tim Davis, our city arborists. Yes. Yes. Thank you. I just wanted to
compliment. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for that. And thank you. Yeah. I think if any trees were removed prior to this, if they were below 24 in, it wasn't considered specimen. They could have removed it. To your point, today there's uh now 18 can't be removed and
some of the other reasons the city attorney talked about desirable. I think we've lost a lot of beautiful trees in our city um since, you know, people building. And I know on Anchorage Boulevard or Street, they removed every
single tree along there. It was devastating. And if we had had this in place, they would still be there. So I am going to make a motion that we adopt ordinance 03205
on the second reading. Yeah. Let me just close public comment and I'll hear that there. There's clearly no other hands raised. So we close public participation. Um, just want to make sure no one intends to speak. Okay, so I look up. Thank you, sir. No one's here. Thank you very much,
Duncan. Got a motion on the floor from Mayor Pro Tim Kellum and a second by council member Davis to approve uh second reading of ordinance 20253, specimen trees. Any further discussion?
Seeing none, city clerk, council member Davis, four, council member Jackson, four, Mayor Prom Kellum, four, Mayor Morrison, four, and council member Willis, four. All right, ordinance uh 20250 passes 50
on second and final reading. And at this time uh I believe we do not have any items for discussion. Correct. Just want to confirm uh the agenda was the one that the original
agenda that went out in front of us on the computer screen. So okay, just making sure. Which brings us to reports. We're at 9:30 according to the clock. I got 9:28 on the phone time. And mayor, mayor, excuse me, if I may. Um, and maybe it's
coming up, but I don't see it any place. the and maybe Council Member Jackson's going to Council Member Jackson's going to bring it up, but we need a consensus vote tonight on the concerns of, you know, the um the candidates flying in
the PDM, the hotels and what have you. We need a consensus tonight so I could get my staff working on this because we don't have a lot of days and I'll put them on this tomorrow. So, there was two there was two messages I had received regarding this. And I mean, we're going
to need a consensus tonight on how you want to how council wants to handle this in terms of I think we can do that during the reports, but yes, that Thanks. I didn't know if it was in the reports. Yeah. Well, no, it's not. And and I think it your point is is is on the money. It needs to be clear
clarified and obviously saw some of the emails. So, with that, uh, we are at the reports, uh, section of the meeting. And so, Council Member Jackson, you want to Yes. Um, Council Member Willis had discussed
how we could handle the hotel piece of the interview. And Colin sent back what they normally do. And so we need to decide how we want to do it. I'm good with what Colin was
saying they normally do, which let me see if I can find it really quickly. Probably not. Which was very similar to what council member Willis said. Mhm.
Might have a Yeah, I'm trying to get to it. Okay, here we go. Thank you. Thank you. Okay. Um so, uh the recruiter said there's had talked
about some discussion. Normally the finalists arrange their own travel to the interview site. If they're flying, we instruct them to book coach class. If they use a rental car, they ask that they keep it reasonable. If they're driving, they get IRS uh mileage rates
of.7 cents a mile. For the hotel, that client has two choices. The candidate can book it or the client can book it, pay for it, and save the sales tax. Most of our clients opt for number two. Generally speaking, the client provides
a list of local hotels as a recommendation for where they stay. So sometimes a candidate compete completes his or her interviews and stays near the airport to make sure they get the flight out the next day or uh so I'm good with
number two and saving that sales tax. Uh we would just need to make sure that we're not cutting someone um off from being able to get to Orlando and especially since they have the bridge under construction at International
um out there. So past uh 520 and 528 one of the bridges under construction and it slows you down by an hour or so. So, I want to make sure that we have them taken care of if they
decide to fly out. If and if um Council Member Jackson, if um if council was to go with what Colin wrote on that second iteration here in front of you, then um we would the city clerk would convey that to him tomorrow morning and say,
"Hey, this is what council agreed on." and then he has to come back and let us know when these people are traveling. Uh and so the coordination, we've got just a couple days to coordinate here. So tomorrow, um the city clerk based on
what you're going to say here will go and take that and run with it. Then it'll come back. He'll confirm when people are flying. Then my finance director here will Cheryl will get on that and start uh and get with Lisa and
start doing all the the uh necessary things on the finance side. So we want to get right on this. And in the beginning when I first saw Council Member Willis's um email, I wasn't really I was I had a different opinion.
My opinion was that we have executive level people coming in here. They at U Colin had told us if we pay for anything and they drop out, if we've paid for it, we don't have the money
back. But hotels, you can get up to 6:00 that night. Um, free reimbursement if you cancel. Free cancellation is what I'm trying to say. I'm running out of steam, y'all. free cancellation. So, to me, it it makes
sense because they're still co they're still doing their rental car and they're still doing their um airfare and it would just be us doing the hotel just to save the sales tax. But I didn't want to give the impression that
we will control you. Uh because they're executives coming in here and certainly they wouldn't be traveling like the lifestyle of the rich and famous if they were if they were smart, right? So, um, so I wasn't sure, but I think the hotel
piece of it is a good idea at this point after he responded, um, just to ensure that we can save what we can save on the sales tax. And tomorrow after Esther gets a response from Colin, then we
could go ahead and inform him, Cheryl will get the information on the pdium so they know what the predium rates are for and you know for meals and what have you because he asked that question. So and then we'll have it all cured. Yes, please.
As far as as far as you know all the rates we really want to follow that I mean I understand their executives but I'm feeling that if we say okay let them have cart blanc it doesn't look good for us we're public sector so we do you know
in the past what we've done um with the past we did the past city manager we went ahead we talked to the local hotels we were able to secure rooms for them coming in and they were able to stay there at a good rate at that time basically you know if they're coming in for three nights we're going to pay for
three nights. If they choose to stay longer, that's on them. But I look at it that we need to make sure we follow what our our staff does, everyone else does. Even y'all, you know, we have a certain ordinances that we have to f follow on
that. We, you know, the PDM, like you said, it's 70 cents a mile on um on that. We if it's a full day, it's about $38 a day. That depends on GPS, I mean GNS. I'm not going to have it correctly here. what we follow that in what an
actual meal of it's breakfast, lunch and dinner. So we want them to follow the same thing. And in addition, I don't think any of these candidates are going to formulate any bad opinions based on what we provide and say this is what the rates
are or this is what you're limited to, whatever, because honestly, if you have candidates coming flying across the country, these people are coming here because they want this job. And if they're serious about this job, I don't think, you know, us a few hundred
dollars is going to make a difference in their decision. So, um, they're coming here for this job. They're not, you know, so, but we're going to give them their hotel, their plane fair, their meals, what have you, but we're also going to do it in in conformance with
the city, and then we're doing our job. And, uh, you know, it's pretty straightforward. It's not Okay. So the there's five candidates. Three need to fly. Three definitely will need hotels.
Three will probably need rental car or they drive. My thought was that um in in reading and following was that it would be there. I mean really if you look at every option in Cape Canaveral with an in I mean
excluding I guess the old Cape C or um out on the ocean holiday and the uh Karib what used to be Karib. Yes. I mean those are I think higher than your average A1. Yeah. They're resorts. Yeah.
$300 a night, I think. And I just thought about, well, what if they're bringing their families? What if they have pets or dogs? And I thought about the local candidates and what, taking a step back, kind of working in the end in mind, my hope was that they have a a a
very nice experience because I want the next city manager to live in the city of Cape Canaveral. And the way that we can do that and for them to make that decision is that they spend time. And as Cheryl said, I hope they do spend longer than 3 days, but I think it makes sense
to limit it to three days, just like you said. I didn't think uh you know, us taking on that pressure and the burden of booking the flights and scheduling. Oh, no. We don't book it. No. Uh we're not. They're going to book Oh, no. They book it. That's what uh council member Jackson was saying. That's the beauty of it. They're going to book their own
flights, rental cars, but we are going to book the hotels. How do we determine that's where needs can be different for for people, but couldn't we just reimburse at a flat? I mean, if it's the average rate is $250. I mean, on the
high end, we we're we're going to give $750. The daily per DM rate, whatever that is, is it $75 breakfast, lunch, and dinner? Add that up. Um, they can, as Colin asked for, a
reasonable rental car and a reasonable flight they'll book themselves. One's coming in from Orlando, one might be coming from down south. And I think we should offer the rental car, as crazy as this sounds, to both the Florida based candidates as well because I want them
to come in and I hope they do get a hotel room so they can experience Cape Canaveral where they can stay the night here. They can get up early in the morning and and be here and and see the city. And most importantly, we're treating all the candidates the same
way. We are sort of giving them the a controlled expense that if we locked in the the the rate they can book it the sales tax savings I don't know if that's going to I mean it's
6% I guess on it's going to be 7% any tourist tax and everything on top of that what we what we do is what we did last time is we contacted you know the Rison we said we needed x amount of rooms they gave is a great rate for all
the candidates and that's where they stayed in that hotel. So they were able I mean there's still I mean I know we have at that time this was back in 2009 that was basically the only hotel that we had in the area at the time. Now, we've got several hotels. We can reach
out to the other ones, ask them, you know, that we need to book five rooms. Just like if you're having a wedding or a party, we need to get a block of rooms. They'll give us a really good rate at that time. That way, that they're, you know, I hate to say that, you know, we've got somebody over here at the Rison, we've got someone at
Country, we've got someone over, you know, they're all over the place. That way when the Rison comes in, they say, "We've got your five rooms blocked." They we get one bill. It's one bill rather than us trying to deal with different bills. They don't have to worry about it. We take care of it all.
They show up. They'll just give their card for, you know, if they're going to do any extra expenses, the city will pick everything else up. We're not having five different, you know, bills coming in from five different hotels. And see, I see executives differently or people that travel because I was a road
warrior. And you may have someone like um the one Blaine that's coming from the West Coast when he travels he stays in a Hyatt because he gets mileage. That was my concern. And and
pets and then you have another that prefers Sheridans and they stay there because that's a predominant place that they use in their neighborhood now or their state. It doesn't um I understand what you're saying on the accounting.
This is five people, right? And you know, so it's five. Well, and in answer to the mayor's other questions, the mayor was about to answer ask two questions which I'll I'll answer. So, um the mayor had said, well, you know, we don't know if they're taking their
families, whatever. when the city clerk sends the message tomorrow saying these are the parameters then Colin is going to come back and he's going to give us that information to let us know who's coming um as far as the person from
Felsmere even Colin put in his narrative there that person's you know a distance away a little bit you know he's probably going to want to stay at night but the gentleman up in Titusville probably there's a good chance he there's a good chance he's going to say,
"Well, geez, I could it takes me 35 minutes. I could drive home." Uh, so but hopefully that answers a couple of your questions. But back to the thing I'm wondering is why if we have a hotel per dam and we are going to give them the
the rental car per dam and this is what I went with initially until Colin responded. Why are we getting involved in that other than if the sales tax savings was a thing? M um now the thing is and as you say that if the hotel tax
is the same as short-term rentals and everything that's 12% Mhm. per stay y for the state the county and the bed tax. So it's not cheap. So if you look
at that times five that may be where you're saying we don't we want to let them do the hotel for them. Well, the thing is we want to follow, like I said, we want to follow the ordinance that the city has right now that applies to all staff and of course council and we
follow the GSA rate. So, we if it comes in and says you that's how we all have to follow. If it comes in and says, you know, it's $180 a night, we need to follow that. We need to stay with those guidelines. I mean, if they choose that, hey, I want to stay over here and it's
$250 a night. We really should come back and say that's fine, but we're only going to reimburse you for $180 a night. And I agree. That's what I was thinking. Let them book wherever they want, but we are I agree with you. That's but we're already telling them what to their
perdam will be on food, you know, what we want on all the guidelines. So, why can't we say if you go over x amount a night in our area? Because I'm going to tell you, I've looked at all the hotels and they're around 170 to 190 based on
what room you're getting. So, why do we need to be controlling where they stay because they may have different needs, right? I agree with that. Yeah. But I think if we tell them, yeah, they need to follow the GSA guidelines and it's just more work for staff for y'all to do
it all. And that's what I was thinking earlier is let them do it. That's the way um managers and up are kind of used to that that have to travel and then I guess we were just trying to
take the burden off of them that you know they cut they get here everything's taken care of go to the Rison go to the the Hyatt wherever we whoever gives us the best rate is what we're going to look for and they're they just walk in they can sign their stuff and they don't have to worry about a bill unless
there's any necessities that they chose to have But if we do come and say the, you know, GSA rate is $180 a night, then that's what we give them a night. Anything over that will be their responsibility. And they may get special rates if
they're uh retired military or if they're in the guard or do you have members, you got Hilton Rewards members, members, they want to run their car, do their thing. I think what you're saying I mean it makes sense and I and I've used it uh when I went to the League of Cities down in Lauderdale or what not
like it was very nice because me and it was booked it was done and with this you know we know the rates if with an exception of the rental car because there's that drop off after they leave here that that
might be a little difficult to know your total. But if we have this predetermined rate, one of the things was they show up. Um, and we can talk about this as as the date gets closer, but giving them some just basic materials, orientation, maybe a little gift basket, maybe that
list of restaurants here locally. I want them to go check out the port. I want them to go check out Cape Cana or Cocoa Beach. Those are two major places. I hope they stay in the city of Cape Canaveral, the new high. Wouldn't Wouldn't we ask them to? I mean, I think
that'd be like you said, if you want them to get to know the city, I think that would be a better place for them to stay. And I mean, not I'm going to go back like if we were to go ahead and take care of that situation and book their rooms for them, then we could go
ahead and have a welcome basket, welcome to the city of Cape Canaveral, that when they go to sign in, you know, I when my in fact, my daughter got married here at the Rison and we had more than half the family members, I did that. So when they came in and they, you know, we'd already, they had already booked their
room, we gave them a basket and they liked it. And we did the same thing because a lot of them came from out of state. So we could we could do the same thing. We could find out, you know, where they're at and make sure when they do sign in, we make sure that hotel has, you know, has a welcome basket form. I
mean, yeah. And I mean, you took it actually step further, better that than me. But I was thinking when they, you know, they showed up for the tour or whatever the first is they're given that and you could literally have their check right there if they in the theory that they booked their hotel, they booked
their car cuz this is the the maximum amount. I think some of those things that council member Willis was saying too, here's the hotels. We hope you stay there. Um, I know it's tough to to I just don't I see the benefits of putting
them under the example one hotel, but I almost want them to be able to choose the amenities they want knowing that, hey, we can book them all here on this date. We got a good rate or you can book wherever you want, but just like you said, here is this. They show up. Here's your reimbursement um per DM rate.
Here's if it's $3 $400, whatever it ends up being, here's your gift card for or whatever is appropriate for your meals. If they sit in their room and eat peanut butter and jellies from Publix, they can do that. But the treat them right. This
is the the the rate that we're enjoy Cape Canaveral come here not beyond what we do our city employees. So I think so. for the perdm rate. Not an endless uh amount to book, but I don't think
there's a scenario that really scares me other than they stay in Orlando at the Ritz Carlton with a family, you know, and block three rooms and turn in a whopping fourdigit reimbursement check. I don't think that's going to happen. Um, and I want staff to it be as simple
as possible knowing these folks are used to booking hotels and traveling. I do think if we had a predetermined amount for travel, food, hotel, and we issued that check. Uh, I think they would come with receipts before they leave and hand
them to us and then they, you know, they're able to give the gift back package. Please turn all your receipts in. Um, that was my my thought and hope. Uh, not to cut you off. So, what you're I'm just gonna I'm just trying to write notes. So, when we go because we are
going to, like John said, we are going to have a meeting on this tomorrow. We've got a small staff together that we can work with it. So, from my understanding, you're wanting to give them their PDM ahead of time, not before they arrive. They show up and the gift
bags, your checks already been issued for this. Okay. That was just an idea to simplify it for the city. We just know we still going to need to know how many nights they're staying. Correct. And they know we're willing to do three. Correct. They know we're willing to do reasonable rental car rates. They know
that we want them to stay in a hotel in Cape Canaveral so that they can experience it. We know those rates are right here. If you guys want to go book at one of y'all at the $500 an night or whatever it is, the holiday end on and one of you wants to go to the the lower
end, you all get the same rate. They can pay the difference for their luxuries. Um that Yeah, I know there's a bunch of scenarios, but you really don't know. I think it is worth the time. Last thing I'll say is contacting them no matter what at a minimum. And for all you know,
Cheryl, they all say just put I don't care. It's just me. like every one of them, right? I'm here for three days. Well, now we know and we'll take whatever you get us. And I would say if that's really what the circumstance is, your way is clearly better in my opinion because they've all agreed. So maybe
it's worth that preliminary call to say we're trying to decide and y'all have the option to say nope, they all wanted to book it. It's simple. Or we got one complex one. We booked four of them. The fifth one's going to handle it themselves. Okay. I I think what's going
to happen though is I think Colin when he gets your information tomorrow, I think those those folks are going to tell Colin that information then and convey it to us in the hotels and what have you. I don't think I don't think Cheryl will have to call because when I
look at Colin's message, he's he's basically the coordinator with them and it's going to come to us. So, I don't think we're going to if we get have to get involved with that, that's easy. But I don't think it's going to happen. I think be through Colin. Yeah, it's going to be through Colin. Absolutely. Yeah. Okay. But we need to give we need to
give Colin we need to give him the scenarios. That's what's going to happen tomorrow based on the consensus of council tonight. We're going to do that tomorrow. Are we clear or are on the same page on the dates? There might That's the other thing is the the cover sheet said the 25th and 26th. Initi
initially we thought we would do this on a Wednesday and Thursday, but when Colin came back with his attachment, he came back with the 26th and 27th, which is a Thursday, Friday. Thursday and Friday. So, we would have to determine like
right now if we're going to stick with the Thursday and Friday. If council's all available on Thursday and Friday, maybe that's best because I know Colin has not communicated anything to these folks yet until we get back to them because they we got to confirm the dates
yet. The candidates, we voted at that special meeting for the what was as it was written on the agenda, the 26th and the 27th, which was a Thursday, Friday. Okay. Well, then as long as council's good with that, then I that works for me. Uh that's how I have it on my
calendar. So, okay, then then we'll we'll lock that in. So, that's going to be part of our message tomorrow. So, if that's the case, uh their first um and if council would be okay, I would like to be a part of the tour. Maybe we
can rotate for once staff we figure out what does the tour. Um, that's really important to me to be a part of that. Every step of the way, if we could have a council member share in that, uh, we could maybe get do something creative. Totally optional. Um, and figure out how
that's going to work, especially if we don't know how many is coming. They want to bring if they have partner, spouses, whatever, they might want them to come on the tour. Are we okay with that? I would say absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. What we've done, I mean, I'm just going to go back in the past. What
we did at last time is we basically rented a van cuz we didn't have a van available. And in the van, we had all the candidates in the van and we had two people that were very knowledgeable of the city. Of course, back then we didn't have a lot of the stuff that we have now, but they drove them around the
city. They took them to the different facilities. They, you know, walked them through public works. You know, if June's out there or other staff, they would meet them. They'll walk them through the facility over now that we have the C5 and that it'll be Molly and probably John Mayberry. We'll walk them
over there. They'll hit the different areas and they can they can talk about it. So we have staff talking about it. Yes. On that just like I mean if they all meet here and that's one of the things we're going to talk they meet here, they get in the V. Well, right here we would go over here to the Cape Center. They could go to the dog park.
They could walk over to the Nancy Hansen. you know, you have somebody on like a walking tour, you know, talking about we've got this, we've got that. Come back here, get in the van, and then we can take them over to the C5. They can see the C5. In the meantime, as we're driving through, we're talking
about, you know, we've got Cherry down. They could go through Manatee Park, all the different parks, and then they would come back, you know, to public works and do the tour at public works. Thank you for explaining that. That's exactly how I thought I was probably start at city hall, hit all these Nancy Hansen walk
the prominade uh sheriff's department over the bus at the C5 or the the van, not the bus. It sounds like we have the van now. Well, yeah, we're what's going to what Unfortunately, the we do have the van, the PAL van. Okay. Unfortunately, we are not going to have that available to us because it's
already scheduled for something over in Orlando. So, we are going to have to rent a van. And we do have um John Mayberry is in the process of getting a 10person van that they can be in there. And you're right, I forgot about the sheriff's department. I forgot about the fire department. Yeah. All that. So we
could get them on board as far as you know, when we get there, you know, they have somebody that can take them through the sheriff's department and, you know, we can get with staff over at the fire department. They could take them through the fire department and talk so they could see everything at that time. But
like I said, as they're driving through the city, we could have John, we're thinking maybe John Mayberry and maybe Zach be able to be in there because they could talk about the different things. But when they got to that facility, somebody else takes over and then introduces that facility to those. I'll
probably be with them now that I'm not an interviewee. That won't be awkward since I'm not an interview. I could I could go ahead and be on the bus because and then I could ex I could introduce them to all my directors and what have you.
Um, and Esther has a question. If the Hello, sorry. If the council members are still interested in joining staff on the tour, then I'll have to take minutes and notice the meeting and everything else. And there has to be probably a bit more room, you know. I don't know. We might
need more room. I've had this experience before where we had a big coach or I don't know what you call it in America. Bus, you know, to accommodate including the public as well. So, um, yeah, you know, we might we'll we'll we'll adjust
to that situation. We know exactly how many people are involved. Mr. Mayor, it was one or the other. Yes. Council member Willis, I think it would be an excellent opportunity for staff directors to be able to meet all the candidates. Oh, yes. and just let them
do the tours because they can they can brag on their domain, if you will, and gives them an opportunity to interact with the candidates, get to know them, and I could tell them how wonderful this this job is, too. Well, I was hoping you
would tell them how wonderful council was, but guess I'm just going to talk about the job. I'm joking. talking about here city hall area Tamson can step in she can take you know she said this is my staff this is
what they do then they would move on they would go upstairs there would be Tim he would be able to do his portion of it you know then we've got Natalie she could talk about you know everything she does for HR Molly's up there she could talk about what they're doing there and then you know walk with them
over there to the Cape Center in that area. So, like like we were saying, that way they get to meet the directors and they get to meet staff, you know, and staff gets to meet them. I think that's a good idea. Yeah, we did that. We did that last time. It was really neat. They
did bring they brought they brought them in. They got to, you know, we got to meet the different candidates. We got to they asked us questions if they wanted to, you know, and we were able to talk to them. And I think it it helped not only the candidates, I think it helped staff. It made them feel, you know, at
ease at that time because when that happened is we had had that was when Bennett Bucher was let go and then and we'll be very nice to them so they'll want to come back. We'll be very nice. I think it's important that there's some member of the council certainly to our city clerk's point about well if it's
two there's a procedure to follow there becomes a meeting at that point publicly noticed and somebody sitting in the back of the van taking minutes but we don't want to be in that circumstance I don't think but if if if so I guess theoretically we could we'll take good care of I thought that um understanding
once we get a draft of what their agenda is going to be like I think it was proposed 1:00 p.m. on the thing or in the afternoon coming in. And so that was on the 26th was their first day. Okay. So,
do you want to do the tour on the 26th? Well, I'm not going that far. If the What was proposed on the 26th at 100 p.m. or in the afternoon? Tour the city. Tour the city. Okay. I think I'm fine with that. I'm just asking when did they come in? Do they come in on the 25th? I
think they need to come in. Yeah, they need to come in Wednesday night. So, they'll be fresh, you know, they'll be able to I mean, whatever time they want to come in, whatever hotel, like again, if they make their own arrangements, they can either come in at 6:00, they might get in at 3:00 in the afternoon,
and that would give them time to sort of explore the city on their own. So, technically on the 25th, it's kind of like a free time decompress. They can free check out the city and all those things. if something's going on, maybe we can tell them. But that really that next morning they wake up, the tour
begins in the afternoon. M Mr. Mayor, I make a motion we extend the meeting 10 minutes. Sorry. Second. Okay. Got a motion by council member Willis, a second by Mayor Perim Kellum to extend the meeting by 10 minutes. Right now I'm showing 10:00. Thank you,
Council Member Willis. So extending till 10 minutes. Any further discussion? City clerk. Council member Jackson, sorry. Council member Davis, four. Council member Jackson, four. Mayor Prom Kellum, four. Mayor Morrison, four. And council member
Willis, four. Okay. Motion to extend passes 50 to 1010. Um, the Okay, that is great. You know, this is one of the rare times that the council's making a hiring decision, and I agree that we want to
follow our employee policies. And I my hope is that we make it as simple on city staff as possible. And I do not know the scenario where they do not stay in the city of Cape Canaveral. Even I just cannot imagine that they
would not stay in a hotel. they can't do the short the seven-day minimum. Um, so short-term rentals aren't, but that experience starting as early as whenever they get in on the 25th, they
stay the night. Um, the tour, just to reemphasize is when it goes out to public works in your scenario late in the day. You know, June Clark and her team are the subject matter experts there. Absolutely. Um, you know, that that might be where
Council Member Willis hops in and and takes, you know, the next stretch if he wanted to. That's I was just thinking if they wanted to have a council member to be a part of it. Uh, or I might walk with them. And so, I was just thinking we could all divide up because we get to
see them in that capacity, too. They're not in the spotlight. It's just them on their free time. It's not under back and forth structured questions. and watch them engage with our city staff and watch our city staff engage with them. I think all of that is really important to
have a balance to where uh take advantage of every as much time as we can without overwhelming them to get to know them and and meet them. I think we clarified that the dates are the 26th and the 27th. There's three
nights. The city has a process they're comfortable with. Colin can find out some information on what their needs are and what do we want to do staff needs clarification uh
on handling really hotels right and rental cars well and you had said there would be no you can't imagine them not staying in Caveral but if I came in and I had my family with me my wife and
child for example And I wanted to be oceanfront. They're not doing it here because they're staying less than six nights and everything down on the ocean or short-term rentals. So you could end up with someone outside of the city if
they want ocean front. Yeah. If they wanted oceanfront because they had their family, for example. So my point is that'd be perfect if it wasn't, you know, and they're up in one of the hotels. That's the only choice they'll really have though with our six knot
minimum. So they could slip over the line to Cocoa Beach. That's something that could happen. You guys are coming a long ways to Disney. Exactly.
So I have a question. You know 26 is all about the staff and the staff gets to know them and everything else. So instead of council going there during the day, why don't we go to this reception and meet them then? Yep. There
will be a reception that evening here for and they give them, you know, their own bill, you know, questions and all that and their own thing with any pressure from us. Mhm. And just go to the reception. Yeah. There will be a reception planned for them. And that's I
believe it's going to be the night of the 26. I think that's Yeah. But yeah, because that way when we're around in city hall right here, right here in the lobby, we'll have it we'll have it all set up. Yeah, we'll have it set up. I say when they could do the tour, be
themselves with with with us around them. They're going to be comfortable here. They can do well, know more about the city and stuff and we need them at the meeting. Personally, if I was doing this, I wouldn't want us
there. I'd want to know the staff and go know the city with the council there. But that's me, my opinion. But I think, you know, if we're going to I I think there's a balance. But I mean, let's just I I got to tell the truth here,
right? I mean, we have a interim city manager who has expressed a desire very late and now that that's a conflict, right? That's an issue for me. I don't think that makes us look good that you want their job when they're
coming in and you're giving them a tour. That's not what we want. That is a conflict. And if we don't decide on any of them, we don't know and you might change your mind. You might want to pursue that job. and that's not fair to them. And so you are our interim city
manager uh who we've appointed. I think you absolutely should be a part of the process. But from their perspective, you want that job and you believe you have qualified to be the best option for that job. I would hope you would think that or you wouldn't have asked this. So
that is honestly a concern. This is a council decision from the agenda to the tour. We have got a great team who gives some structure to our chaos. Thank you, Cheryl. And I think that that reimbursement policy all makes sense. Some good ideas from Council Member
Willis and Council Member Jackson and Colin. I I I really don't at this point the worst case scenario really doesn't spook me. I just want to treat them right. Make sure that they know they're talking to people who are going to to
support them. That's 100% of our staff and that's all of us council. So, I planned on being at the reception. I certainly don't want to overwhelm them. Council member Davis, I hear you loud and clear. You don't want somebody over your shoulder. I was saying for a section, maybe it's just a part of it to
be there and to support and to say we are together. And mayor, I'll I'll meet them at the reception, that's not a problem because you're right, if something odd happens and people drop out and the situation turns and I decide on the next group, you know, to put to put my name in that situation, then
you're right. It doesn't create an because it may be an awkward situation that if somebody said, "Oh, yeah, he had actually interested." Uh, but now that's fine. I have no problem with that. Yeah, thank you for understanding. It's it
okay. Well, I think uh we we'll figure out if if council members want to go on the tour more than one. Uh we got a little bit of time to figure that out. I think for the sake of time and and rates, hopefully tomorrow we get some info from Colin and I I'm I'm okay with
whatever this council majority comes to. Are there any conflicting interests here right now amongst council member Willis? I think you'd send an email. Council member Jackson, Colin, we have three paths, I guess, and some overlap in those. But Mr. Mayor,
yes. I just um you know the daily the the ordinance that we follow as the council and staff is a great idea. I kind of like the idea of them all being in one hotel so we could make the welcome baskets like you were saying you
did for your family. I think that would be nice. Um I like that idea. And when they go into their room there's a Cape Canaveral stuff in it, you know. That would be I mean, would that would that be difficult to do if they weren't
staying in the same hotel? You still do. Well, that's what I'm saying. You could still do it, but it'd be more work for the staff if they were all at the Rison. Just say it would be easier for the staff to make sure they had a welcome basket.
What what they would do, Mickey, is when how we did it is when they checked in and they said, "Oh, I'm so and so, you know, John Brown or something like that, and I'm here for, as I said, the Paleo Green wedding at the time." They would, "Oh," and they would automatically hand
them a basket. It was there behind the counter. It wasn't in their room. Okay. It was there behind the counter. And would they automatic, you know, and it had stuff for, you know, family members and stuff like that. That would work if they were at different places. Yeah. We could still do that. Yeah. It wouldn't be in the room. So, if they do choose to
do that, you know, we just find out where they're at and we make sure that when they check in, they are given that basket and they'll have Cape Canaveral stuff. It'll have cookies, crackers, you know, water and stuff like that to help them get started. And maybe, like I
said, Cape Canaveral stuff in there. And maybe if we, you know, other stuff, flyers for the different um restaurants and stuff, we can put that in there. Yeah. So could we call them and say we are willing to do everything you said and I think what basically here's how we
do it. we book. If you choose not to do that, let us know now. You can book your own and we will be prepared to reimburse for your receipts and maybe it's only one. But if all five of them go Rison sounds great or Hyatt or wherever it is sounds great and they're all good and
it's a good rate and everybody's happy, I don't want to stand in the way. Col is going to let us know that mayor based on your message. He's just going to come back and he's going to say boom boom boom and oh this this. He's going to let us know all that. So we'll react to it. We'll be we'll be fine.
Okay. I I think that we just need a consensus. No. Any opposed to that that plan? Do we have consensus? Sure. We do. Is do you have to call all the names or I think it's and during reports we're
just clarifying some stuff that was going back and forth that was a little loose anonymous consensus. The the only other thing was the five minute buffer in between if you we can do that the day in those backto backtoback interviews. I'm just thinking they're getting out and they're walking
there's no cushion time to transition. But if it's if that happens that happens uh like I said earlier uh I did mention that to Colin on the call even if it's five minutes in between those interviews. We're at uh out of time. I don't want to
disrespect that. Um, I thought I had one other thing regarding that schedule. Is that everything? Are we clear? Okay, we're good. We'll we'll be on it tomorrow. We'll get the stuff from back from Colin and then uh
we'll be done by the end of the week. Great. Anything else, council? During we used up all of our reports to sort that out. Thank you all. And with that, we'll adjourn.