So, good to go then. >> Y. >> All right. Good afternoon, everyone. We have a special meeting of the city council of the city of Kate May. We are here in the Cape May city hall auditorium. Today is Tuesday, October
7th, 2025. The time is now 3:33. Please join me for the pledge of allegiance. >> I aliance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under
God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. >> Thank you. Under the open public meetings law, notice of the meeting was sent to the Kate May County Herald and the press of Atlantic City, and a copy of the agenda was delivered to each member and city council, posted on the city website and
city hall bulletin board. Notice is hereby provided that city council meetings are audio recorded and or video streamed live. Live video streams are posted to the Kate May city website. City of Kate May is not responsible if audio recording or live video streaming of a meeting is unavailable. Roll call. Council member Baldwin
>> here. Council member Bodner >> here. >> Deputy Mayor McDade is joining for close session. Uh, Council Member Meyer is absent. Mayor Mullik >> here. >> City Solicitor Gillan Schwarz is joining for close session. City Manager Dietrich >> here. >> Deputy Manager Riggs
>> here. >> Deputy Clerk Turner >> here. We have one resolution 288-10-2025, a resolution providing for a meeting not open to the public in accordance with the provisions of the New Jersey Open Public Meetings Act and JSA 104-12.
This is to discuss the UAW local 2327 Lieutenant Lifeguards Collective Bargaining Negotiations, the Prominade Preservation Project, Shyone Construction, Inc. and the propo proposed easement agreements with the county of Kate May for revetment. Yeah.
>> Yes. >> Along Delaware Avenue and professional services and the lead service line replacement program. >> If we have a motion to adopt. >> Do I have a motion? >> I'll make a motion. Do >> I have a second? I'll second. Roll call.
>> Council member Bodner. >> Yes. >> Council member Baldwin. >> Yes. >> Mayor Mullik. >> Yes. >> All right. Public portion. Is anyone here wishing to speak on this? Seeing none, we'll close public comment and go into close session. >> Time is 3:34.
>> Thank you. All right. Good evening everybody. We have a regular meeting of the city council of the city of Kate May. We are here in the Cape May city hall auditorium. Today is Tuesday, October 7th, 2025. The time is
now 3 5:00 p.m. Please join me for the pledge of allegiance. >> You have to close session. Oh, let's do that and we'll close it. >> Okay. >> I aliance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under
God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. >> Thank you very much. And to start the meeting, I'm already out of order. We need to close the uh close session. Do I have a motion to adjurnn? >> I'll make the motion. >> Do I have a second?
>> I'll second. And there is anticipated action being taken during the regular meeting. >> Okay. All right. With that, we'll open up the regular city council meeting. City clerk, do you want to give us the announcements?
>> Under the open public meetings law, notice of this meeting was sent to the Kate County Herald and the press of Atlantic City and the copy of the agenda was delivered to each member of council, posted on the city website and city hall bulletin board. Notice is hereby provided that Kate May City Council meetings are audio recorded and or video streamed live. Live video streams are
posted to the Gate May city website. City of Kate May is not responsible if audio recording or live video streaming of a meeting is unavailable. Roll call. Council member Baldwin >> here. >> Council member Bodner >> here. >> Deputy Mayor McDade >> here. >> Council member Meyer is absent. Mayor
Mullik >> here. >> City solister Gillan Schwarz >> here. >> City Manager Dietrich >> here. Deputy Manager Rakes >> here, >> Deputy Clerk Turner >> here, >> and council, I believe we have a few additions this evening. If you'd like me to go through those, >> please.
>> All right. We have resolution 298-102025. A resolution approving a memorandum of agreement between the city of Kate May and UAW local 2327 Kate May Lieutenant Lifeguards and authorizing the execution of a new collective bargaining agreement
between the parties covering the period January 1st, 2023 through December 31st, 2026. We also have resolution 29910 2025 resolution authorizing a contract with Delasio and Associates engineers for planning and design services for the lead service line replacement program to
be added to the agenda. Council, >> do I have a motion to add those resolutions? >> I'll make that motion. >> Do I have a second? >> I'll second. >> Roll call. >> Deputy Mayor McDade. >> Yes. >> Council member Bodner? >> Yes. >> Council member Baldwin? >> Yes. >> Mayor Mullik?
>> Yes. Okay. Anything to remove tonight, council? Are we okay? I >> think that's it. Go right into our employee of the month. City manager. Want to take it away? >> Thank you. Um, I'm going to ask uh Mike
Grande to come up from the Department of Public Works. That way he can stand up here while we talk about him and he can feel awkward and everything like that that goes along with being garnered the employee of the month. So, Michael's been employed with Kate May since 2015. Uh, he started
actually uh as a recreation aid in in that part of the the city, but during COVID when we kind of moved away from recreational programs and just, you know, Michael was able to stay on with the city and, you know, was able to move over to public works as a laborer. Uh,
and that's really where his, you know, his skills just really shown, uh, over at public works and was really, um, in 2023 was able to be promoted as public works repair. So, it just kind of kept moving him forward. Uh, he takes pride in his work and, uh, he's always out
fixing things and just keeping things moving up, whether it's the ADA mats or the gas lamps around the city. um kind of anything that Eric or the teams asks Mike to do, he kind of says yes and figures out a way and and just is a good team uh player within within the public
works. Uh in his off time, you know, he just really enjoys hanging out with his dog, Ziggy, and riding his motorcycle, though. Um I guess we needed clarification. What type of motorcycle is it? >> Well, it's a um it's a Honda. It's basically like a Honda Gro. It's like a knockoff brand of a Honda Gro. It's It's
like a mini bike, but it's still a motorcycle. There you go. It's something to save gas on going back and forth to work. >> So, so enjoys doing that. So, if you see him out there, make sure that you don't run him over and and stuff like that. So, >> there he goes. So, I just want to say
congratulations, Mike, for everything you do. >> Appreciate your little picture. It's great. >> Thank you. >> Yes. >> Thank you, Mike. >> Thank you.
>> Thank you, Frank. Thank you, Eric. >> Okay. On to updates and old business. City manager. >> Uh, hi. First thing I wanted to update the council is we did get the um we did that beach safety uh study. Um we've kind of it was done a couple months ago
before the summer. Uh but we didn't really want to present it and and and finalize it here because we're waiting to kind of one of the aspects that they were proposing for the next step. We kind of wanted to follow up and have that proposal to kind of suggest to move that forward. you know, they did a very
good analysis and and historic look at all of our beachfills, trends of uh how the beach profiles moving about and um looked at everything and then they came up with a couple recommendations and and I think really one of the the primary
things to focus on is I think we all, you know, with with a we know our beachfill template needs to have some work done on it and in order to change that beach template, we need to have an engineering study.
But before just running out and just letting the consultant just go at it and and make an engineering study, they in order to make it productive, we really need to work with our partners with the Army Corps and the D Bureau of Coastal Engineering to find out what what what
do they need to be shown and and what efforts do we need to do to to show that hey, maybe we can come up with a another beach template profile that still meets the Army Corps's need of providing beach protection. but also has a a a beach that is more
user friendly, a little bit gentler slope for people and familyfriendly to uh to you use to in a larger stretch of our beach. Um so that's what Taylor has come back with us as a proposal uh to um
to take a look at that. And um now that we've had this presentation, I'll sit there and and put the full beach report on the city's website so everybody can kind of take a look at it. Um but if if you have any questions about the full report, I'll be happy to
meet with you uh individually or, you know, and and answer any of the questions. But I think they did do a good job at kind of culling through all the data, you know, not only the Army Corps reports, but also integrating some of our Stockton Beach reports and and
kind of doing a really good deep dive on everything that is our beach. And uh I I think I think they have some thoughts on what they would recommend and and what to do and how to model a change, but we really have to have that discussion with
our D partners um in order to uh accomplish that. And I think they're I mean they're their price was not too exorbitant. They're they're asking uh and proposing for $12,000 to kind of move forward for a second phase to have
that interaction meetings with uh our partners and uh that would allow them to formulate a prop a larger proposal on what the engineering effort would be to uh model our beach to come up with a better template uh for us. So that's
kind of what what my recommendation would be. They had several other recommendations in the beach report, but I think ultimately that's really the focus of what the city should do to move forward. >> That's out of draft form at this point from ACT and Taylor.
>> Yes. >> Okay. Okay. Because there were a few um public members that were asking for it. Um and it'll go back on the website. Um >> it'll go up on the I'll get this as a final draft and then we'll put this as a final report. Yeah, this report was shared with the beach and safety
committee meeting. Uh uh Actton and Taylor did make a presentation at the beach safety committee meeting. So if if anybody from the public really wanted to look at that when I do the um >> put it up on the the city's website, I'll put a a link directly to the uh the
beach and safety committee meeting YouTube video. So that way if anybody wants to go back in and and check out that presentation, they can uh look at that directly from there. >> Yeah. We were we were pretty much very pleased with the report that we received. >> Oh, good. >> Very, you know, historically back to the
um 90s on So, >> Mhm. >> Uh the next thing I just to give the the council and the public a brief update, our construction projects are moving along fairly well and on target. Uh the the the biggest one I wanted to
highlight, we're anticipating having a pre-construction meeting next week for the uh police headquarters building. Uh once we have that pre-construction meeting, we'll be able to make an announcement of when we're going to have our groundbreaking uh some preliminary discussions with the contractor. They
anticipate after the pre-construction meeting starting within 3 to four weeks. So, they're looking to get right in there and start working. So, um we're looking forward to uh that groundbreaking. So, I'll keep the council and the public informed of when that date will be. That's all I had this
evening. Thank you. >> That's great. City solicitor. Uh just to update council, um maybe more so for the public, but the uh workforce housing ordinance that's been going through the the process of review was at
the planning board. Uh there were some comments made and an adoption or a recommendation that it was consistent with the master plan with some related comments. I have a updated draft of that which I think is going to be ready for council consideration at an upcoming
meeting. Um, but just wanted to update you all and the public on the status of that. >> Thank you. Okay. Uh, city council, any updates or old business? Okay. I just want to um bring up one thing actually on on the agenda tonight.
We're hiring a new CFO and uh that person is with us this evening and I'll and I'll get into that in just a little bit in the agenda. But I really want to uh thank Kevin Haney for his dedication to the city of Kate May over the last two years. He's really been a wonderful
asset for the city. Often kind of working behind the scenes. You know, people don't get to see all the hard work that gets done, but uh Kevin has just been a wonderful person to work with. Um Temple Box business grad and a CPA. Um really um just a really nice
person. um kind of moving on in a different direction for himself um but is leaving the city in really good financial hands and is also willing to stay on for a couple months in this transitional phase uh to a new CFO. So
we can't thank him enough for um his dedication to the city and and his willingness to make sure that uh the ship is heading in the right direction as as he goes out the door. So we we really appreciate that. Um, with that we will open it up to ordinances for
introduction. >> Yes, we have 580-2025, an ordinance to update the uniform salary and classification plan for the department of personnel positions in the city of Kate May. >> Do we have a motion to introduce? >> Do I have a motion to introduce 580?
>> I'll introduce. >> Do I have a second? >> I'll second. >> Any questions or if I could have a >> Sure, please. >> Um, just to make a quick comment regarding this. Uh there's about approximately 151 titles in in the uh salary ordinance and we're kind of we
did a a mass update because we had about six or seven contracts and collective bargaining agreements that all have been ratified over this past uh year. So the lion share so out of the there's 14% of the the titles in there that are not
covered by the collective bargaining agreement. uh the the maximum salaries were all adjusted for the duration of their collective bargaining contract so that we don't have to revisit any of the titles that are in the collective bargain agreement as part of that. And and the salary
ordinance is really just a salary guide, not it's not what the individual employees make. We set that at the time of our budget and um you know that's how the salaries are set. But I just wanted to let you the council know and the public know that there's 21 titles that
are outside of that that are outside of those collective bargaining agreements that we'll deal with as well as we are still negotiating two collective bargaining agreements uh the PBA and middle management. So obviously we haven't updated those salaries um
because they're still in negotiation. Thank you. >> So Mr. Dr. Dietrich, I'm I'm glad you clarified um some of that information. And one of the things that uh you and I had discussed is um salary ranges are really what the market bears. It's really what you get from the market. And
as you've indicated, you know, an individual salary could fall anywhere in that range. And I think that the other thing that you've shared, I think, with all of us on council is that none of no one gets a salary increase without council and the mayor uh reviewing that and um as part of the budget process. So
I think those are two points of clarification that are necessary both for us as well as for the public. So >> any other questions or comments? >> Yeah, just a quick comment and I've spoken to the um manager um manager
Dietrich and um uh M Mr. Riggs as well. Um just because this is being introduced um I would love to see a red line version and they're going to they're going to bring that up to us or back to us at that point. So, >> you'll have that later this week.
>> Yeah. Thank you. >> Anything else, council? Okay. Roll call. >> Deputy Mayor McDade. >> Yes. >> Council member Bodner, >> yes. >> Council member Baldwin, >> yes. >> Mayor Mullik, >> yes. >> We have ordinances for second reading
and consideration for adoption. uh 577-2025, an ordinance amending chapter 199 of the city code regarding the certificate of zoning compliance to include information regarding the applicability of the local historic district. And there is a public hearing tonight. Mayor,
>> is anyone here wishing to speak on ordinance 577? Seeing none, we can close public comment. Do I have a motion? >> I'll make a motion. >> Do I have a second? >> I'll second. >> Any questions or comments on this one, council? of course came from uh HPC.
>> Just uh just briefly, mayor, I mean um I think it's a this is a logical measure. I think um as far as having this uh this certificate, I mean what it does is it provides property owners of of notice. Um and we want people to be aware
particularly um when they purchase a property in the historic district. one um we all know and I think we all accept that there's a responsibility if those that own a property in the historic district. Some people consider it a burden. Um but at least you should you
need to know going in as far as whether your home is a a key property, a contributing property or non-contributing property. And by way of this notice, it assures that the city is providing some soft guidance for property owners and who purchase
properties um that they may need to work with the HPC if they want to do some external work on their property. Um I think what's significant as well though is for those that have looked at this, they should know it's just a notice
provision. It's it doesn't change what the zoning ordinance the zoning ordinance or the land use ordinance does right now, but it just provides information to property owners um of that they may have some additional responsibilities um that there may be
certain steps that they need to take if they purchase a property. So, I think it's a it was a really um I think it was a I appreciate the fact that the HPC brought this to the forefront um and brought this before um for our attention. And I think it's a it's a really good ordinance for us to be um to
be passing. >> That's great. Thank Thank you, Mr. Bodner. Any any other comments? Council, >> roll call, please. >> Deputy Mayor Mcnade. >> Yes. >> Council member Bodner. >> Yes. >> Council member Baldwin. >> Yes. >> Mayor Mullik. >> Yes.
>> 578-2025, an ordinance amending city code to include a prohibition on demolition by neglect with a public hearing. Mayor, >> is anyone here wishing to speak on ordinance 578? >> 578. Please, if you would just come to the microphone, state your name and
address for the record. >> Yes. Thank you. Um, my name is Sharon Wendell. I'm a resident at 506 Broad Street and I'm here in support of the ordinance that will not for no demolition by neglect. um passing some photographs of 505 Broad Street, which
I'm sure most of you are familiar with that property. Um it is we myself and the neighbors would really like to see that property not be um you know not be taken down obviously for historic reasons and and preserved. It has not
been inhabited for quite some time um overgrowth of the property etc. So anyway, we are in support of that uh ordinance to amend that. Thank you. Thank you very much. Anyone else on uh 570, excuse me, 578?
Seeing none, we'll close public comment. Do I have a motion? >> I'll make the motion. >> Do I have a second? >> I'll second. >> Any questions or comments, council? I I just uh again thank HPC for bringing this forward. I think it's another
obvious um uh regulation that uh is important in protecting our historic structures structures. I you know we just heard from a member of the public who is concerned about one of those uh structures and we don't want to see these beautiful old buildings um demolished by neglect. So I think it's
an obvious one. Any other questions or council? Any other questions or comments council? Okay. Roll call, please. >> Deputy Mayor McDade. Yes. >> Council member Bodner. >> Yes. >> Council member Baldwin. >> Yes. >> Mayor Mullik. >> Yes.
>> 579-2025. Bond ordinance providing for various improvements to the water treatment system by and in the city of Kate May, County of Kate May, state of New Jersey, appropriating $350,000, therefore, and authorizing the issuance of $350,000 of bond or notes of the city to finance the
cost thereof with a public hearing. >> Is anyone here wishing to speak on ordinance 579? Seeing none, we'll close public comment on ordinance 579. Do I have a motion? >> I'll make the motion. >> Do I have a second? >> Second. >> Any questions or comments? Council. Our
city manager gave us a review of this at the last uh meeting. So, thank you. Uh, roll call, please. >> Deputy Mayor McDeade, >> yes. >> Council member Bodner, >> yes. >> Council member Baldwin, >> yes. >> Mayor Mullik, >> yes. >> All right, moving on to the public
portion on the resolutions only. Mayor Okay. >> Do we have uh anyone I'm pardon me. Do we have anyone from the public wishing to speak on or on resolutions this evening? Anyone on resolutions this evening?
Stacy Sheen, 928 Columbia Avenue. Um my question, first question has to do with the addition of the Bellasio contract. Can we say what was that for and the cost? >> Um, that won't be in the consent agenda obviously, but it is a resolution, so
we're happy to uh go over it. Um, city manager, do you want to go into detail on that? >> Sure. This is for the uh lead service line replacement program. Uh, they submitted a proposal. Uh, this proposal is covered entirely by a grant and the resolution stipulates that no funds will
be expended by the city until the the city receives the grant for their services that they're going to work on. But it it'll cover uh them uh identifying all of our unidentified lead service lines, working on uh plans and specifications to apply for additional
uh principal forgiveness funding from the D to have a program to help replace those lead service lines for residents. >> And and what is the cost that they're charging for? 825,000 >> cuz I know we had last week it was um Remington Vernick at over 900,000 and
but in Remington Vernick's contract it talked about they're doing a lot of just um going through our records. Are they are they just going to go through records or they actually going to go to the house because it comes out to be about >> 250 a household to look at each >> Yeah, both proposals had uh processes to
both review records and do uh on-site inspections. uh the Delasio's proposal included a different type of a procedure where they'll they'll actually for the ones that we don't have identified they will visit the house and they insert a probe through the water meter that does
an electromatic uh analysis of the pipe and kind of like through orthoscopic surgery would do. They send a probe through the the pipe to identify what type of pipe it is and that better helps them identify uh for contractual process on the construction side of which ones need to be replaced or not
>> because I noticed in Remington Vernick's um the resolution he had last week it required the homeowner to be home. Is this going to require the homeowner to be home? >> The it they'll have probably different various stages. It's going to depend on where the water meter is located at. And
obviously, if we, you know, if we have to go on to a uh property owner's property, especially if the water meter, because there are some properties that have the water meter inside the house in the crawl space or in a basement, uh yeah, we will need access. >> But why why I'm saying that is because
we're getting to winter time with a lot of people are leaving >> and it would be nice for them to be notified ahead of time so they can give the city the okay before it gets winter time when we can't locate the people. Well, I mean, that'll be part of their process. This is not a process we're looking to have this all done by
January. This process will probably run into the spring. >> Okay? Because why when I read the proposal last week, it was they would only contact the neighbor, the homeowner twice and that would be it. And I just want to make sure the more we tell people this is coming around, the better prepared there will be to let them in.
That's why there is a an entire whole public outreach programs including mailings, website notifications, and and various outreach methods. >> And certainly they could Oh, I'm sorry. Go ahead. >> They could certainly prioritize those homes that they know where the meters are at the street, which is a number of
properties in Village Green. So, you know, there's an an ability to prioritize certain sections of the city uh in the winter months uh without with proper notification, of course, as well as, you know, taking the time to to roll through it accordingly. So, I think it's a great program. I'm just making sure
everybody is aware that it's going on. >> My >> Stacy, do you mind if I interrupt you for just a second just to because we're talking about it? Sure. >> We we will get a presentation on this uh in the future as part of that public outreach, but just while we're talking about it to to let people know what
we're talking about is um we are looking at a $2 million grant and out of that grant will come some of the proceeds of this uh study basically. But it is really interesting. It's a state-of-the-art um where they actually will insert I don't know if it's
actually a c it's not a camera, right, Paul? >> No, it's a probe. It's a probe >> that can tell um the uh presence of different materials like lead or plastic or galvanized. Um and uh so this will go
actually not just where the city um meter stops but into people's properties so that people can see okay yes you may have galvanized pipe and you may really want to look at that or uh you have lead pipe that's that's being shown on so
it's it's a really valuable um process that everyone will will receive and um but as you said Stacy public outreach on this is going to be key so I I'm sorry to interrupt No, that's fine. It's I think it should be noted what's what it's about. Uh my next qu question has
to with uh resolution 293, the appointment of Lauren Reed. It said four years, but the dates don't correspond to four years. So I was just >> That's a statutory thing. Um the appointment is relates back to January
1st of the year of the appointment. That's the way the statute reads. That's why you're you're thinking like why isn't it four years from today? >> No. Um it has January 25th to December 23rd which is only three years. >> And that was my question,
>> right? >> January 25 26 27 28 that's four years. >> December. Okay. I was thinking it was January or I was counting January. Thank you. >> Yep, >> it's correct. Thank you for your clarification. My next question has to
do with um resolution 292 for the temporary container and special event for the Shelfon Hotel. Um I noticed that the application was in it and the application kind of reads differently than
the resolution. So, I'm assuming the resolution supersedes the application. Are they backdating certain dates or is just the dates that are in the resolution? >> I can speak on that if council wants. Um, the application was submitted earlier in the season. Um, and it took
significant review internally. Um, they applicant ended up amending their request. So, you know, some significant time had passed. So, that's it. The application might have mentioned certain dates, but we're only well, council, if you authorize it tonight, would only be
authorizing the what's in the resolution basically. >> Okay. Because I think the one said there's drinking in the street, there's no drinking in the street. >> So, how does that I'm under the impression that this is going to be removed from the consent agenda um and discussed upon separately and we could
probably cover some of that information at that time if you're comfortable maybe talking about it at that time. >> Okay. Okay. Well, that's one of my questions. My other question host has to do is there a reason why this isn't gone before the planning or zoning board >> this for the the special
>> only because it affects neighbors and that's where I you know it's it's it's a change of use to a point. >> It is only it they went through the route of a special event application the same as we do for Oktoberfest every year. Um council considers allowing open consumption of alcohol for the October
Fest event. Um it's a similar where this is only a weekly event for a small period of time, not completely changing the use, you know, permanently. So that's why they went the special event route and it doesn't have to go before the boards.
>> Okay. So it doesn't that's why it doesn't have to go before the planning or zoning board. >> It's nothing permanent. It's the I can go into more detail. I don't know if you want to wait until it's >> Can you just give us a few minutes to get through the other res?
>> Just so if I can come back and if you can, Stacy, thank you. >> Anyone else on resolutions this evening? >> Jules, 10 New York Avenue. since you're going to bring it up and under the consent. My question is
relevant to 292, but it goes I don't really have any feelings as far as the current uh operation, but my big concern is, you know, what kind of precedent are we setting by just adopting um a program
to allow someone to have u an outside event without any any approvals. Um >> Mr. Rous, I'm going to ask if you could just allow us to pass through the rest of the resolutions. That's fine. And you can come back up and ask the questions. I think it just would be better suited
for the flow of the meeting if you wouldn't mind. >> No, don't at all. >> Thank you. Thank you. >> Anyone else on resolutions this evening? Seeing none, we can close public comment uh on the consent agenda. Um,
>> so council, would you like to remove anything from the consent agenda, please? >> Trying to get to that basically. Yeah, >> we would like to By all means. 292. You got it. >> And 297. Sure. >> And uh, actually 293 as well. >> Yep. I'm sorry. 293. >> All right.
>> Oh, yes. >> Any All right. So, then do we have a motion to adopt the consent agenda? >> Do I have a motion to adopt the the consent agenda other than those excluded? I'll make a motion. >> Do I have a second? >> I'll second. >> Roll call.
>> Deputy Mayor McDade. >> Yes. >> Council member Bodner. >> Yes. >> Council member Baldwin. >> Yes. >> Mayor Mullik. >> Yes. >> Can I bring forward uh uh resolution 293 first, please? >> Sure. Sure. So, we have 293-102025,
a resolution appointing chief financial officer for the city of Kate May. >> Um I just uh want to welcome uh Lauren Reid. uh who actually is not the first time to be in city hall. Uh Lauren was uh very helpful to us uh in a earlier
transition just recently. >> Working for you. Sorry. >> Why don't you give a nice wave? >> Lauren uh has basically close to 30 years worth of CFO experience. Uh I actually was reminding myself you went
to uh College of Charleston, which is which is pretty neat. and uh obviously has been a longtime CFO uh to one of our neighbors in Lower Township. Um and uh we're just so thrilled to have you and came with such high recommendation from
our auditor which uh you know when you get a recommendation from your auditor, you know that's that's going to be a strong one because we know he's tough. So uh we just really welcome you and thank you so much for your um your willingness to serve the city of Kate May.
Yeah. >> Thank you, Lauren. >> Welcome. >> Okay, we got to officially vote to welcome her in. So, >> do we have a motion? >> Do we have a motion? >> I'll make a motion. >> Do I have a second? >> I'll second. >> Any questions or comments? >> Roll call. >> Deputy Mayor McDade?
>> Yes. >> Council member Bodner? >> Yes. >> Council member Baldwin? >> Yes. >> Mayor Mullik? >> Yes. Welcome, Lauren. Thank you. Thank you. Uh, could we go to 297? Is that was pulled, I believe. Right. >> 297-10-2025.
A resolution amending council meeting times for the remainder of 2025. >> Do I have a motion? >> I'll make the motion. >> Do I have a second? >> I'll second. >> Any uh questions or comments, council? >> Uh yes, mayor. Um I would like to amend this resolution um so that it indicates
uh when closed sessions will occur. Uh, now that we're changing the meeting start time, um, I'd like the language to read that if and when we h are required to have a close session, those meetings will be held immediately prior to the 5:30 start time. Um, so Mr. Gillan
Schwarz, is that something that we could do here at the table? >> I would frame it just like that. >> Yep. Okay, perfect. >> Okay. >> So, do you want to make a motion to amend? >> I'll make a motion to amend. >> Do I have a second to the amendment? >> I'll second. Any questions or comments
on the amendment? >> Roll calluty mayor. >> Deputy Mayor McDade. >> Yes. Council member Bodner. >> Yes. >> Council member Baldwin. >> Yes. >> Mayor Mullik. >> Yes. >> Do we have a motion to adopt as amended? >> Do I have a motion? >> I'll make a motion.
>> Do I have a second? >> I'll second. >> And just a quick quick explanation. We we um are uh happy for Councilman Meyer who took on a new position. Unfortunately, that position is not allowing him to be here at 5:00 p.m. Um, so that's going to we're in this
resolution. We push it back to 5:30 to accommodate that new role. >> Anything else? Council, roll call. >> Deputy Mayor McDade, >> yes. >> Council member Bodner, >> yes. >> Council member Baldwin, >> yes. >> Mayor Mulik, >> yes.
>> Uh, would you like to go through the rest of the regular agenda before 293? Um, >> or do you want to come back for that? Or I'm sorry, 292. >> 292. >> Uh, yeah, please. >> The added ones. >> Yep. Thank you. I'm sorry. >> Yep. No worries. We have 298-10-2025,
the resolution approving a memorandum of agreement between the city of Kate May and the UAW local 2327 Kate May Lieutenant Lifeguards and authorizing the execution of a new collective bargaining agreement between the parties covering the period of January 1st, 2023 through December 31st, 2026.
>> Do I have a motion? I'll make the motion. >> Do I have a second? >> I'll second. >> Any questions or comments, council? >> Uh I I think I'll say on behalf of the entire council, we uh really thank our lifeguards for their service this uh season. They uh actually just finished
this week uh putting away everything and getting ready. But um it's really nice, especially for the locals, to make sure that we have some protected beaches, um you know, during what many of us call local summer. Um, so I I I really thank
them for their service and I I also want to thank um Sarah Warner who is u moving on, a lieutenant um that uh gave 22 years of service to the city. I don't want to get too far beyond this resolution, but I I want to thank all of our lifeguards for um their their
service this season as and as they've done for every season, a wonderful job. So, thank you. Roll call. >> Deputy Mayor McDade. >> Yes. >> Council member Bodner. >> Yes. Council member Baldwin, >> yes. >> Mayor Mullik, >> yes.
>> And 299-10 2022, a resolution authorizing a contract with Delasio and Associates Engineers for planning and design services for the lead service line replacement program. >> Do I have a motion? >> I'll make a motion. >> Do I have a second? >> I'll second. >> Any questions or comments, council?
We didn't have any public comment on on this one, right? It's a resolution >> on the uh >> you didn't request any public discussion on the no >> on the on this uh Okay. Thank you. >> Any additional Okay. >> Yes. Yes. Okay. Roll call. >> Deputy Mayor McDade.
>> Yes. Council member Bodner. >> Yes. >> Council member Baldwin. >> Yes. >> Mayor Mul. >> Yes. >> And so we're back to 292-10205. resolution regarding temporary open container and public consumption in connection with a permitted special event.
>> I'm going to recuse myself uh on this resolution >> even though I will say I have no financial uh uh gain from this unfortunately. But thank you. >> We'll come get you. >> I'll make a motion. Make a motion. I'll
second. >> Okay. >> Go for public. >> Yes. We'll open it back up um for public comment on resolution 292. >> There were some questions on 292. If you'd like to come up and ask them at this point, we can go ahead and um
answer those to the best of our ability. And we also do have the applicant present with their representative. So, if there are particular questions, we can also, if you're comfortable, invite them to make some comments. I'm concerned about the move that you're making
the door for another business you follow that last couple of years to just kind of move forward without any approvals from anyone for anything without any
limitations except the exception of following an application for city. >> Well, I'm going to comment a little bit um just on what uh has been shared with me um by the city clerk. Um one, they
filed an application. And I think that they went through the process that exists by ordinance in the city. Um so for a special event which this was classified under. There was an internal review that um the city manager participated in as well as the clerk along with the police chief and the fire
chief. >> That's okay. um to make sure >> that the conditions were appropriate uh which was you know why you saw some of the changes from the dates from what was originally um filed to being in front of
us now uh the other piece of this is um something that I always hear when we question does this set a precedent Mr. Rous is nothing sets a precedent. Um that's sort of the legal term that comes back to us. You take every case on its
merit. You review and most of this review was not done by this the individuals at this table. This was done by the professionals and the professionals are you know the city manager, the clerk looking at, you know, sort of the permanent process for this,
the police chief and the fire chief looking at the conditions. I'm sure that there were discussions um with the neighbors. I can't speak to that. that I will allow the business representatives to do that. But I think that when we feel that we're sending we're setting a precedent, my understanding and
certainly in this case, I feel confident that they went through the due diligence and it doesn't necessarily um support or negate someone from coming forth at some point in time and those conditions that are put before that body and then presented to us would have to be
appropriate. So I don't from my perspective and the way I'm looking at this, the way I reviewed it and the information that was shared with me, I don't think that I'm necessarily setting a precedent. These conditions were reviewed by the professionals and put
before us um to ask us to consider this application and I have to trust in their judgment because that is what they do and that is what their job is. >> This is a limited special permit. So, it's it's not, you know, an open-ended
special permit. It's limited to only the dates that are specific on here, which ends, I think, at the end of November. >> We're almost the end of the year left. Um I the applicant should they want to continue this next season
would have to reapply via special permit uh special event application and we would go through the same procedure with it coming before council if they wanted to um allow the portability of mobility of alcohol within the expanded event area. So even if you guys do decide to
permit it um for this year, it does not necessarily mean that you have to continue it for next season if there are concerns or issues. Um the applicant has also um applied for the appropriate ABC uh licenses through Posi for an expansion of premises permits for each
event date. As of right now, those applications are on hold pending the outcome of tonight. Um so they will if council wants to move forward, I will go in and approve those applications. If not, I will go in and deny those. So they have done what they need to do ABC wise
>> and >> to get to this point. >> And if I could just make a clarification. So the reason why they're here at council is because they wanted to alcohol beyond their property line into the public right of way. So you get so someone could ask well they operated
all season why are they just now here before council? Well they never had alcohol into the right of way. Their alcohol was always on their premises. They had appropriate ABC license approval to be on premises. They had a special event
permit with the city to be to occupy the city space as part of us closing the roads and we had internal reviews with police and fire and other administrative processes to make sure that that event operated safely just like we do every
other process. So it was not needing council approval until the request formally came in to have alcohol in the street. And that's why it took so long was we had a lot of internal review and discussion about now we're moving
alcohol into the public space. How do we control that? How is it going to happen? And that's what took, you know, the application was originally submitted early in the season. And it took that long to go through and and get to a point where the city administrative
staff was comfortable making a recommendation to council that we could do this safely for the city and our residents and the public and to help protect the shaon to operate a a good event. So that's where we have to do. So
if somebody's going to do something before, it took us 3 months to come to this conclusion. Um not >> not taken lightly. >> And just to clarify, the request is to
only allow the portability and mobility of alcohol on the sidewalks directly adjacent on on Howard and Su right basically where the where the event is. The closed street portion will not have alcohol in it. That is purely just for
event flow for people to watch. So the only place that they are requesting the portability of alcohol is the sidewalk area. The shelf is already licensed in their grass area. Their their full property is licensed. So it's just that expanded sidewalk area that is under consideration by council tonight.
>> And I think one of the one of the matters also that is taken into consideration is the enforcability of this as well. So, my understanding and I know that there are going to be I anticipate we'll get some remarks as far as how um how the property owner would intend on enforcing that, but um look,
first off, it's for a limited period of time for the the remainder of this year. Um part of the plan that was presented was uh to ensure that um people who are partaking in this do remain within
within the curb line and don't take alcohol out into the street area. So, I think that's um a great consideration and I believe that that was one of from my standpoint that the fact of that it would just be on the property itself
even up to the curb line is really a critical factor as far as consideration of this particular application. >> And the other thing because it is such a short um time frame and it's only a few weeks, we'll get feedback. will know if
we, you know, if if there's if it's going to, you know, if they apply for it next year. Um, you know, with the police, what the fire, um, they've already analyzed it, looked at it, um, you know, gave us that information, um, and and told us that they felt it was
very safe and secure. Um, and you know, we can always look at it after that. I I think the most important part is the the comment that um Miss Burke made which was basically this is just does not roll over till next year. This is a limited exercise. It's three hours one night a
week and we will learn from this in the the next month or so. But I I do want to assure the public that we this was given the full consideration um and included all of the professionals to make sure that what you know was coming forth in
this resolution was understood um and the conditions for this event were clear. The the only the only other issue I guess I have in addition to the president setting is the copycat
um uh potential from other businesses in town. This the the special permit is generally just that a special permit. In this case there's a special permit every week. That's not necessarily what I would call
as a as a special permit because it's it's a continuation. Um, I don't I don't know how I can make it more impressive on council that they they make sure that that this does not
become a a a pattern of allowing alcohol to be served outside, not only on the lawn, but now we're stepping out into public property. And you know, one of the the fights that many of the municipalities in the state have had is
the serving of alcohol on the beach. Uh, you know, we're opening up Pandora's box to to allow alcohol to be served on a public property, which is our sidewalk. Is the next one a street and the next one a beach? I would be uh highly
disappointed uh if it if if it kind of grows. >> Understood. Understood. which is why we're trying to emphasize that this is a one condition situation and it's not changing current, you know, ordinance or regulations or the requirements that
professionals have to review it before it comes to us. This is not us individually saying, you know, yes, we're supporting this. It was in the clerk's office and the city manager's office for months before it came to us. So, >> thank you very much. >> You're welcome.
I just have a couple clarification questions. Um because on the city streets, I guess I think I saw something in the packet with insurance being required. >> Yes, >> that's been provided. >> Okay. And is Howard Street's not going to be closed? Correct?
>> No. >> No. Just that one little section. >> Yeah. That small portion of sewing. >> Okay. And with the special events permit, is there a limitation for the number of days that somebody can have a special event permit >> for ABC or for the city? >> No, for the city.
>> Not that I'm aware of. >> Okay. I just wasn't sure how we worked and I don't I couldn't remember if there was one like saying that a special event permit is not 30 days or it's not you know what is the time frame for a special event
>> like as far as a reoccurring special event. You mean like is >> or or >> I think the duration the whole duration like can it go from January to June or can it go a full year or >> we think so I would think if if the applicant made it clear as far as like the event dates and the times and the
durations on the application that is what would be under um consideration by the manager and again it's only going to come to council because of the alcohol thing. Why why I'm saying this? We have limited um >> there's nothing >> rental homes >> to not allow them to have more than two
weddings a year. I think it is in some of their homes. >> Rental homes. You're not allowed to have you're not allowed to rent your home out and have weddings at all technically. >> Well, I think there's that now. I think that house across from Congress Hall, the yellow one, people rent it out and
they if they have less than I think a certain number of people, they can have their weddings there. But I think it's a whole house. >> That's a whole dicey. There's event house regulations. That's kind of That's outside of the special event permit. >> Well, why wouldn't would they be allowed
to go for a special event permit? >> Cuz that's not on city property. >> It's what? >> It's not on city property. >> City property. >> Yeah. Yeah. Special event. Yeah, that's private propert. So, I'm I'm just looking for clarification. So, special events permit is only for people that
want to use city property. >> Yes. >> There you go. I appreciate you. >> You can call it a use of facilities permit as well. We we interchange it. So, >> Okay. Thank you. I appreciate that. >> Of course. >> There's nothing in there. >> So, this is the applicant or the
representative for the applicant. >> Good evening, council members. Scott Silver from the law firm of Nimad Davis and Goldstein on behalf of King Edward Corp. Just for the record, when an original application was made to allow
use of the public property for alcoholic beverage consumption during the ramble events, the initial application asked for everything from the property line to include the entire street out to the far
curb. It's a result of the reviews that the council members noted by the professional staff and their determinations that the application both for the ABC permit and the Cape May city
permit were amended to say, "Okay, we're going to do this for the first time. We've had alcoholic beverages out to the property line with no problems. Why don't we try going out to the curb line? That will
allow additional area for people who want to observe and also have an alcoholic beverage. And it'll give you an opportunity to see what happens over the rest of this season with the anticipation that the applicant probably
will come back next year for a similar request. Um, and this is one of the things that makes Kate May special. Um, there have been, as far as I'm aware, no issues with alcoholic beverages going out to the property line. Again, there
will be no sales on the city right of way. Simply that people won't have to be jammed in if they want to have an alcoholic beverage. They can at least have a little additional room out to the curb. As we've done all along, there
will be force private security guards. There are also two Kate May duty officers and those individuals and those officers are responsible to ensure that people don't walk out of the designated areas with their beverages. They're
looking for any potential pass offs where someone over 21 gives someone under 21 a drink. They're looking to make sure that um everything is conducted properly, that there are no
glass containers out there um and that people don't bring their own alcoholic beverages into this area. what people do on the street. Although the street is closed and the shelf pays for it, the
shelf has no control over what may go on on the street, but it will have control over what goes on out to its property line and onto the sidewalk if this is granted. Um, representative from King Edward Corp is
here. If you have any questions for him or me, we'd be glad to address them. I would like to make note just for the public that the applicant is also paying for the presence of the police officers. There's no cost to the city incurred by the special event. The applicant is
bearing that cost. Are there any questions from the public at this time to the representatives? >> No council, any questions? Okay. Well, um, we can close public comment and thank you very much. >> Thank you very much.
>> Council, are we ready for a vote? >> Any additional discussion by council at this point? >> No. >> No. We already have a motion in second. We ready for roll call? >> Yeah, I'll make the motion. >> All right, >> I'll second. >> Perfect.
Deputy Mayor McDade. >> Yes. >> Council member Bodner. >> Yes. >> Council member Baldwin. >> Yes. >> All right. And I just want to add that what you know we certainly heard you and uh again when when and if this applicant comes before the city next year or
anyone we will have the professionals review these applications and give us their advice and counsel on how these should be handled um on an individual basis. Thank you. All right.
We'll wait for the retrieval of the mayor to move on. Yeah. [Music] >> He may have gotten coffee. >> Yeah, I know. Do you want to give the your announcements? >> Sure. I'll go through a couple of mine. Mine are easy. minor fun. Um, there is a
trick or treat uh trick or trails cleanup on October 30th from 3:00 to 5:00. Everyone is welcome to help go and clean up the Late Street Park nature trails. I'm hearing there might be a sweet treat involved at the end of that. So, the more the marrier. Um, we have
the Halloween parade is October 19th at 300 p.m. Um, and I'm found out today that they are doing trick-or-treating on the mall again. I don't know if everyone's participating, but I believe some of the mall is participating again. So, come on out for that. And then, of course, our trick-or- treat night for
the city is October 31st, um, from 5 to 8. I believe we are intending to close a portion of Washington Street. Again, I'm not sure which between which streets yet. Um, but probably same as last year, just for some safety. >> Erin, one more. The uh firehouse uh
>> Oh, yes. The 150th um anniversary celebration for the firehouse is also on October 19th. I don't have the time right off the >> 11. 11 a.m. Wonderful. Also, please please join us for that. It's my wedding anniversary, so I will not be at any of these. >> Everybody else should go.
>> Is Is there a um a rain date for the parade? Is it the following week? >> If we want to continue, I think it is the following week, but if you want to continue, I can confirm that for you. >> Okay. >> But it's not going to rain. >> But it's not going to rain. >> But it's not. >> It's not going to rain. >> My anniversary. We paid extra for the bubble.
>> Yes, that's >> I'll confirm that though if we want to go back to any maybe new business. Solicitor, anything for you? >> Nothing tonight. Thank you, >> city manager. >> I did have one thing. Uh I did distribute to council and I think I've
discussed it with everybody regarding uh we received plans for the renovations of the lifeguard station. Um, and I'd like to request authorization to go out the bid uh for that so that we can try to get this authorized possibly awarded at
the last council meeting in November so that we can try to get this under construction. Talking to the architect and a couple potential contractors that if we stay on this schedule that we could have this renovation complete for the the lifeguards at this before the
start of next season. So, I think that's a a worthy cause to try to get there. And I I'd like to request authorization. Uh if we could do a motion vote this evening and then we'll follow up with a formal uh resolution at the next council meeting, that would be appropriate.
>> I would make the motion. >> Do I have a second to that motion? >> A second. >> Any questions or comments, council? I I think uh just to say for anyone who doesn't know um I don't know what the
exact percentage is but the makeup of the um locker rooms and the facilities in the um um in beach lifeguard headquarters is probably something like 25 to 75 for
>> I think you're being generous. >> Yeah, >> I think you're being generous. and that when it was made that kind of reflected the population of of guards. Um at this point we are close to 5050 female tomale guards and bluntly the the female uh
facilities are >> not not are very lacking. Um so most of this project is basically expanding the female portion of uh the life lifeguard headquarters which obviously uh we would
love to have completed before June of next year. So that would be important. >> Uh so we have a motion and a second. Uh any other questions or comments? Roll call. >> Deputy Mayor McDade. >> Yes. >> Council member Bodner. >> Yes. >> Council member Baldwin. >> Yes. >> Mayor Mul.
>> Yes. >> Thank you. And the rain date is October 26th. >> Okay. >> October 26th for the Halloween parade. Thank you. >> Okay. C council members, any any uh updates? Uh Councilwoman Baldwin?
>> Yes. I just a couple of quick things. Um we had a really great weekend with the Columbia students that were here. Uh if you recall, we did that. Um they're doing uh a resiliency and historic preservation. They're also looking at communications and policy and funding as
well, but they were treated to a wonderful walk uh in the historic district. Um there was a Q&A. Um I'm seeing a few people in the audience. Uh Kevin was there as part of the Q&A, part of our HPC. Um, so there was a really uh
informational uh, you know, platform for them to ask questions and really glean a lot of what what we're considering uh, concerns as far as resiliency and historic preservation. Um, and Justine and Danny Merrell, uh, can't
say enough, but they've done a fabulous job. Um, which leads me into that communications part of things, uh, which is one thing that they were concerned with. There's there's one group of the the Columbia students that are concerned with that. Um, and Justine and I talked
a little bit about this as far as getting a community update forum. And I know that you talked about like some sort of uh town hall thing, but I think it might be a good idea if we look at um community updates, whether it relates to
HPC um with the new initiatives that they that they're seeing people on Tuesdays. the mission statement. You can go into the environmental commission and talk about open space. Just make it an open people in the city want to know what's going on. And I don't think it all should fall here on council. I think
having the other um community partners involved like you have um shade tree commission with the spotted lantern flies. Um and we can just do something maybe in the spring and in the fall for the community. um and just a couple minutes and then go into breakout
sessions and just inform people. I I would love to >> so sort of having a round table but with all of the the advisory committees or or or you know the boards present and just sort of do a 15minute and then people can say oh the workshop on HPC's over
here. Yes. >> And the workshop on shade trees over there and just having um Yeah. So you could set it up in in convention hall and just have people pocket it around. >> Yep. Very very easy. I just um I would be willing to head it up. >> Yeah. >> So u council member Baldwin mentioned it
to me briefly. We u talked about it. I would like to work with you on that if I have the opportunity to do that. So >> great. >> So you know we'll look at we'll look at >> two people volunteer on their own. Perfect. >> But >> no I love that idea. That's I think that's fantastic.
>> And that's all mayor. Thank you. >> Okay. Councilman Bodner. >> Sure. Nothing tonight. Mayor >> uh Deputy Mayor. No, nothing tonight. Thank you. >> I just want to uh welcome again, Lauren. We we really are thankful for you joining us and and uh really appreciate
your willingness to serve the city. Uh also, I want to thank everyone who came out for the beach cleanup. Um which did not include me. Unfortunately, I couldn't make it, but I I I know it was well attended and they got a lot of work done. So, thank you very much. And uh
and and just to echo uh what uh Lorraine said about columb the Columbia students and I just want to thank you for ho basically h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h hosting, you know, and doing a great job of hosting everybody uh to the city. They had a really nice time and I think we're going to see some um real benefits out of that program. So thank
you. With that, we'll uh open it up for public comment. Anyone wishing to speak on any and all matters, please come to the microphone, state your name and address for the record. Hi, how you doing? >> Mayor Mullik, how are you? >> Good to see you. >> You, too. >> Um, my name is Matt Moser. I live at
1351 Delaware in Village Green. um in a twin and I don't know probably about two or three months ago attended here and just asked you know some questions about being able to add on to the twins that
are there and there were three impediments that were brought forward. Um first was I believe look and feel. Um the second was parking and the third was the house foundation
and so different neighbors asked and you know said hey we'd love to be able to do it. Um and I said I'll come back. Um, I'm not kind of sure where we left off,
but like as far as the look and feel, it sound like everybody agrees like in just general conversation that both sides need to go up. It needs to be an architecturally beautiful reconstruction, lack of a better term, matching even if you want to call it
like KM May, maybe four or five different designs that are acceptable, that look good. um the parking um as I walk around the neighborhood and stuff like that, there are some houses that are being worked on. And one of the
things that they've done from the parking perspective is I don't know if I'm using the right term or not, but I'll call they were putting the concrete strips in with um which would lessen the amount of water um from the
permeabilities place or actually allow more water to flow into the spot and also increase the amount of parking that you're doing. Um and the last item was the house foundation. um talked to a couple of the builders
that were that are putting homes up there or adding on to the homes, the single one and a double. Um the single one they've already gone up top. Um I imagine it's the same fill that was
built upon back years ago that's there. Um whether or not they put any uh pilings in, I don't know, like initially. Um [Music] >> but um
like our builder who added on to the back said he's 100% sure the back would hold going up. The builder that was down the street um he like four or five houses down, something like that. Um he said he believed, but he said he would
have to check, right? He said he'd want to make sure before you would say anything. Um, so I guess I'm kind of wondering how do we get things to go forward if we do like are there any other impediments, other
concerns? I mean, I really don't know where to go with it, which is why I'm coming here. >> Do you want >> Well, yeah, I can certainly um, you know, um, you are aware I'm the president of the Village Green and also um, Mr. Bodner is also a member of the
board. This has been something that that neighborhood has struggled with a long time. Um, and I don't know that everyone's of the same mindset that they want to see second story homes in that neighborhood. Uh, it was originally designed as a campus setting. Um, specifically designed in the fashion of
those homes, the quads, the twins. Um, most of the single homes are in the R3, so they can go up to the second floor. Uh, there's a couple of models that were put in, but they're the smaller ones, the ones on the corner of Pennsylvania and Trenton. There's a couple on that block that are two-story ones. I think
some of the challenge was with this is that it has always been the intention of the city and and this is I've had that home since 1975 when my parents bought it. Um that it remain sort of as you know that kind of design. So the first thing is you know do we want to see that change? Do do the people who live there
want to see it change? Because now you're putting in secondstory homes that are next to you know one floor story homes. Is everyone prepared to be able to have their their house match their neighbors and in like fashion? And how long is that good for? You live next to
your neighbor now and it may be fine, but what happens in five years when someone doesn't want to take on the ownership of a second story home, etc., or they don't have the money to do it. Um, parking is an issue. Um, and it's becoming more problematic down there as more of these homes become rentals. Um,
so what you're taking out in the front to accommodate parking is you're taking out the grass areas. Um, so now we've got concrete pads on the front of houses as opposed to something that looks like green space or a tree or whatever it might be. Um, I'm not the arbiter on this. I'm just giving you some of the
background of the conversations. The board um, prior to my being on the board was very opposed to this. Um, >> planning or or zoning? No, I'm talking in the village green board was asked by the planning board to come forth do a survey and the survey at that time now it's been a couple of years has
basically said no we like our homes the way they we are we don't feel overcrowded um we're not you know um huge builds etc so I think this is beyond just you know coming and asking this the council to consider this there
are 600 homes in that neighborhood many people like the accommodations the way they are. So, I think it's a little bit more than that. Aside from the parking issues, aside from the engineering, and aside from the consideration, mo most of these homes are twins. There's quads.
What do you do with quads? >> Four people have to decide that they're going to elevate their house, >> right? I mean, you can well imagine what this could look like after a little while. If I could if I could add to that for a moment, I would I would just just add
>> that, you know, as as far as the idea of building second stories onto the homes, it's not consistent with the master plan as far as the layout of Village Green and the twins, but and as we have all
seen in Village Green, there's um it's the latest place where there's where there are a lot of changes um with renovation properties and changing the look of them and some of them are magnificent. People are doing a fantastic job as far as um
beautifying their homes and making them um with with with some very nice renovations, but there actually there is certainly a tension in Village Green as well with the changes. It's changing from what originally was supposed to have a a campus type of look, a
consistent type of look, which is how it was originally designed, which it it has changed. So, so what I'm saying is the issue that you are raising I think is part of a broader conversation regarding um village green and I don't know as you
said there may be some people who are in favor of it. I believe that there are a number of people who there people on both sides of of that conversation. I believe so. I believe so. Sure. There would have to be. I mean just when when we >> but I I think from I think from a from a
planning standpoint there needs to be it's not something that we could take up I believe by way of you know um at council table to um to to address um you know as well as I said there's um
there's there's a lot of um concern about development and development in I'll just say the right way in Kate May and some of that is you know it by seeing it and I think there's
some concern that that that happens in the right way. So I think that the any conversation regarding changing the look of of the homes in Village Green, that's part of a part of a bigger conversation, which is why I wanted to come here was to find out what
the next steps are because I don't want to step on anybody, lack of a better term, right? So that's why I'm here is like how do we >> how do we right like why I'm here. I I think the question is is whether or not the planning board or zoning board is
interested in undertaking an analysis as to whether or not they want to change the zoning ordinance which currently limits the height of a home in Village Green to 20 ft. >> Right. But we like as Mr. Bodner said, we already are outside of that in a number of homes.
>> No, we're not. that that that was put into place after all of the homes were put were built. And the ones that are second story are are that design is outside of the scope. Anything that's a twotory house, you know, there's like there's one down in Vermont, that's in
the R3. So when you see single homes that have gone to the second story, um most of those are single ones are in the R3. They're not in the R4. >> No, I'm referring to twins that are up. >> They were unfortunately they were not. they were done and they weren't as far
as I am aware permit it >> much as you know there are some other things that people have done in their homes that you know just they did not >> or if they were it predated the present land use ordinance that has the 20 foot the 20 foot um >> so how do we go about getting to resolution either one way or another is
really what I'm looking to see >> Mr. Moser, I think um the truth is not necessarily through city council who would ultimately need to approve it, >> right? >> But really our land use boards are who
dictate and and debate frankly um their changes that they'd like to make. They really work on those with the solicitor, you know, for the land use board. They have public discussion. The engineer obviously the um and have and and in the
past of course have had some spirited discussion on changes. Then that ultimately would end up on city council's desk for a vote at a at a later time, but the planning board uh will typically vote to approve or not approve recommendations that they're
making to city council. >> Okay. >> One of the things too, Mr. Moser is >> you'd be running into a master plan issue with this too. And that's really why probably the the starting point for this discussion is
probably best with the planning board because if if if we adopted something tonight that said, "Hey, we want to raise the roof." that that would go over to the planning board. It by statute we'd have to send it over to them for the review for consistency and then they would go through the master plan re-examination report
>> from 2019 and say, you know, is it consistent? Is it not? Point to certain things and the way it was reviewed. >> And it didn't feel this way maybe two years ago, but 2029 is not that far away at this point. And there's going to be another re-examination.
And as part of that, I think the city's going to be looking at it's going to be looking at each zone and it's an opportunity for stakeholders in the community to voice their, you know, uh, opinions about the merits of going up or staying where we are. And I think that's
one of the difficulties with this is there's not a clear consensus from within in that community as to what the outcome is. And really, if council were to take this up, we'd have two sides of the same coin probably saying do it or don't do it. And then >> I'm sure I'm sure you'd have some of
that. >> Probably the best. And and I think some clear examples of outcomes you don't want to see is like a quad with like one of them all the way up and the rest of the three. Like that's an obvious like obvious example of just an absurd example to a point like there's probably
some consensus on some of this but um it's really something that from my standpoint as a land use protect practitioner you probably want to see that come from within come from the people of village green what do they want to see for their future what do they want to preserve >> Mr. measure that that's how this has
occurred in the past. We the the board and has been asked to engage in these conversations with the planning board and have stayed consistent uh and members of the community were surveyed have stayed consistent. So, you know, you get beyond three bedrooms, you're up to two parking spaces. You get up to
four bedrooms, you're up to three parking spaces. Most of those lots are 5,000 or at best 6,500 square feet. you and so therefore you're now taking up every green space because you are required to accommodate parking on those
lots with 5,000 square feet. It it's almost you know impossible. So I understand why you know you may want it from accom from an accommodation standpoint for a family reason but it has impact on a community and there are many people who have lived down there my
being one of them for a great number of years and I like living there for the reason that it's quiet that we don't have this over congestion of rentals that are large and you know become an overwhelming process for the neighborhood. who also know the demographics, you know, you understand
that that's people like living there for that reason. >> Oh, I do. And we also have a lot of new people who've bought >> and they bought specifically because Village Green is a gem. Nobody's allowed to know that, but it is. >> Right. Right. And and and so I I'm passionate about it because I I want to
see us maintain that in a time when if you're going to make decisions about planning changes or ordinance changes, it needs to be smart and not just saying let's allow people to go up, you need to make smart decisions that impacts an entire community. It's just not one. So
agree but that was the reason why I came here to say what's the starting point that >> the starting point is the said is to go to to >> to go sounds like it needs >> planning planning and zoning make the decision zoning and it's master plan and as Mr. Gillan Schwarz has said that's
we'll start the work on that in 2027. And believe me, we are still looking at Z at master plan issues specific to the R4. You can look at the last planning board meeting. We are still going through the master plan from 2019. Specific to the R4.
>> Okay. >> So, >> yes. >> Thank you, Mr. Moser. >> No, thank you very much. >> Thank you. >> All right. Thanks. >> Anyone else this evening? Peter Cole, 1075 Michigan Avenue, president of the TPA.
Good evening. >> Good evening. >> Uh, the TPA recently received a copy of correspondence between businessman, business owner, Mr. Paul Johnston with comments from Mr. Johnson and a
letter he received from Councilman Meer. The TPA does not deal with individual personal matters, but I believe council was also copied in on the correspondence.
Can you say that you were? >> You were. Um, well, I'll pass this back to you to decide what, if anything, to do about it. Thank you. >> Thank you.
>> Anyone else this evening? >> Stacy Shan, 928 Columbia. Um, I'm just following up on some presentations that were done on the Jacob Jones, I guess about a month or so ago, and that the committee was going to go and
talk about a new location or the same location and size. And I know that some council members are on that committee. I want to know if there's been any progress made on or any changes to anything with the Jacob Jones. They they have not reached back out to the city to have any further discussions about
location or size or scope of that. >> So, as of as of right now, the Jacob Jones is still slated for the poverty beach area. Is that correct? >> No. No, that's not what I said. I said they haven't come back to the city with any revised location. They're still internally looking at what they want to
do. Well, we left that meeting with the fact that they were going to keep it down at Poverty Beach, but change it to maybe put it on the uh boardwalk area. >> I I think I made the statement that Poverty Beach location was not up and that we took that off the website to
acknowledge that the Poverty Beach was not a location. So, >> well, there's still stuff on the website about the Jacob Jones, just so you're aware. >> Yes. Not a there's no not about the location and they have >> not come back to the city. >> Not to myself and I don't think >> there's no proposal right now. There's
no proposal. >> Um the last meeting that we had where they where it was discussed as far as a location or the design of a memorial. There's nothing before city council to consider and
we haven't heard anything since then. Okay. So, I just know that some of these coun some of the council members here are on the committee. That's why I was reaching out to see if there's anything new. Uh my next question has to do with the lifeguard renovations. Is that those plans are on
the city website? >> The uh there were some preliminary sketch plans on there. Now that council has authorized that to go out to bid, I'll put a more formal set of plans up on the >> Okay. Yeah. because I thought before it goes out to bid that it should be made public the plan so that there could be
some kind of comment from the public in referencing the plans. >> Well, they are what you see on the I I think the the details that are now on architectural plans aren't of any significant change that what's shown schematically on the plan. So there's
generally sufficient information on the city's website for anyone from the public to have made comments about that project. Okay. Well, I'm only asking Paul, so don't bite my head off here. But I'm asking because we went at You're asking graph for bid and I just didn't
know if there was any changes because I don't know if there's any changes to height or anything. So, it's just basically the same. >> There are no changes. >> No changes. >> No changes. That's what I want. >> The schematic of those plans are generally the same. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Yep.
Jules Rous 1010. Just two quick items. I had an incident with a with an EV electric bicycle and um I'm very happy it didn't happen. We're seeing more and more communities
adopting ordinances dealing with electric bicycles, scooters requiring helmets. Has there any been any discussion about us doing that? because the amount of of bicycles and electric
vehicles in the town this year has been astounding. Um but my question is what how are we going to do >> Mr. R? We did we did um introduce one ordinance. I don't think we've had second reading yet. Um it was a resolution urging the governor to
consider regulations um similar to what other towns have been passing >> and that addresses um uh helmets and this is really covered by the state and uh I wish there was more that we could do and and other municipalities
but what we highlighted in that resolution and letter to the governor was really the importance of license plates um Because um if somebody goes by you speeding by and you don't have something to identify that, then there's
nothing the police can do. You know, you you you'd like to think that there is, but they they need at least a partial license plate to go off of and try to find out who who it was. We all know that mopeds are required to have uh license plates. Most people kind of
consider this very similar to a moped. Um so we we have made a strong message to the governor and to the state legislature that we feel that there really needs to tighten this down. Um the thing is that that for a lot of
people these have become bicycles. The bicycles are ebikes and vice versa. So the uh prevalence of them is is huge. Um but like I said I we even had a couple thefts this summer that were done on an ebike. So,
you know that >> doesn't surprise me. >> We have ways to view who's coming on and off the island. Um, but we don't if we don't have a license plate to go off of, then we really don't have a lot to go off of. So, I I think it's a major problem, not just the obvious issue of
safety, but of al also obviously police work and making sure we're uh monitoring, you know, actions that are that occur. It's um it's difficult, >> but but again, I think it it it really needs to be state legislation.
>> The the only thing um uh Jules, we did a couple of years ago, I don't know if you recall this, but we uh made sure that on the boardwalk or on the prominade that they couldn't be under power. Um and we put that in a uh in a resolution,
>> but that's the only thing that >> we all know there's there's an enforcement issue. Mhm. >> dealing with with all of these items. And I don't whether it's just me or my kind of attention to the traffic, but I believe this year, this this season was
considerably higher in issues dealing with our our ability to move around comfortably in town. Um, >> it's not just you. It's not just you. I agree with you. >> I agree with you. It's a it's a problem.
>> Yeah. It's become a significant problem >> and and it's not one easily solved by adopting the strongest worded ordinance for the city of Kate May. I see those things zip past my office every day. I have to look both left and right before
I go check my mailbox because there's just a string of them coming in and out of town. And that's why a state solution is really necessary. And I I agree with council and the rest of the municipalities calling for that because otherwise it's not going to make a difference practically speaking to the
people that are just zipping in and out of town. That's why it needs to be a statewide solution and there's there's definitely some options out there. But the legislature needs to do something. Well, the other the other increase in our population this season in my view is we've seen many more properties go into
the rental market and we are increasing the numbers of people that are coming on weekends along with cars and I'm wondering whether um council might uh uh pass down to the planning board the suggestion that they might think about
the number of cars that are permitted to be with a particular rental has some some form of requirements to see if we can cut back on the number of vehicles not only coming into town but occupying the space that you're that you've
mentioned. Um the only other item is we got a nice big parking lot that's being readily used at Lafayette Street Park and uh is that will that continue to to be free or >> until >> I don't object to it must understand me.
It's just I see, you know, when you when you see a 100 vehicles in there on the weekend, that's a lot of money that's uh that maybe could come to the city. Uh frankly, I know it's needed. Uh the parking area is certainly needed. Um and
when we start construction on the police station, that issue is going to become greater. Um >> it's it's a discussion. I I I just one personal opinion. I do love that we have some uh not not municipal city
employees, but employees um uh of restaurants and things like that that can that can park there for free. And I'd like to see that to continue. Um because we we really don't want them taking up a metered space anyway. I mean that metered space is going to get filled. We know that. Um I I' I'd much
rather see um >> parking meters were designed to to be used to control and have an a turnover. Yes. Of of vehicles >> for our guests who we'd like to have be able to find a parking space, you know. Uh so I I personally I'd like to see the um the workers um still park for free in
that area because they're willing to walk to work. Um uh but >> we have any liability issues? >> There's always liability issues, Mr. Rous, but we can deal with them. >> I don't doubt that we can deal with
them. It's a matter of whether you're doing deal dealing with them successfully or not. Um, >> we've been successful so far. >> Don't knock it. >> Pardon me. >> Don't knock it. >> Just as an aside, my father was the first parking meter salesman in the
United States. I I grew up knowing a little bit about parking meter. >> So, you have a conflict in this one, Mr. R. Yeah, you're trying to sell them. >> I'm I'm sorry. I forgot the one comment. Stacy 928 Columbia. Um that the low
income or low we call it um house on Lafayette Street. Where are we at with that? Has it been rented? What? What are we going? >> Yeah, I get updates every couple weeks. Actually, it's on my list. We rented the two-bedroom. The threebedroom had applicants. They were going through the
income process. I need to check back in with Triad. Um I've been, you know, talking with Susan um from Triad as well as Mike pretty routinely. Um it's a very drawn out process. Um you know, you first you have applicants, then you
identify, then you get income, and then you know, there there is a process. So um roughly, just to give you numbers on each side of those units, there was probably about 450 applicants for the one uh twobedroom. >> Clarify this. That's not the city. This is >> Oh, not the city. You're just talking
about the the property on Lafayette. That was a Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> But it's not a city process. >> Oh, did I say that? >> No. No. I just I don't want people to think that the city is like sitting on these applicants or something. >> No, I'm not sitting on any applicants and I apologize if I confused anything.
I just had a personal interest. >> I think we were both on that. >> Yeah. Which was why I was following. So, yeah. Last I checked, they were they were still doing their work. I I guess one question I have is I thought I can't remember his name. He was going
to be responsible for the upkeep on the outside of that house. >> Mr. Gonado. >> Yes. >> I couldn't speak to that part. >> Okay. Do you remember if he's supposed to be responsible for the upkeep of the outside? >> He's still responsible for the property. He's the owner. >> Okay. Because >> I mean he's an LLC owner. >> Yeah. Somebody came to me and say, "Hey,
that property, you know, is not being kept up and that's why >> I got set up to to make a comment. quick call to code enforcement and code enforcement would be able to take care of help. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Uh Raj Johnson, 826 Lafayette Street.
Really quick, um about the ebike uh situation, I um living on Lafayette Street, I I hold my breath uh seeing them speed by and the scooters. But I think you have to realize that uh a high percentage of
people that are using these ebikes are employees >> that are trying to get to their jobs. >> Um the bus schedule does not fit everyone. >> Um there is no parking for them. >> So how do they get to their jobs? They
have found a way. And I I um I just I just hope you realize that I'm sure you do that uh a high percentage of the ebikes are employees. I work with a gentleman. He used to take a bus, but he said that, you know, the bus just wasn't
um dependable enough for him to get to work and so he purchased an ebike. And I think I think that's um the situation that a lot of the people that work in Kate May are finding. And um I I also
hope that we always think about the employees that do work in Kate May because they are the people that make Kate May keep it going. Thank you. >> Thank you, Ros. >> What's that?
>> I think you're dead, by the way. Glenn Halls, 409 Jefferson Street. Question about code enforcement. We passed the code tonight talking about tear down through neglect. I'm not sure exactly how we enforce that or prevent that from happening because we already
have a code on the books about historical homes and maintenance and cleanliness and all that which you can walk around town is not very well enforced in my opinion. So, how do we enforce these types of codes? Mr. Celesteer, do you want to answer that?
>> Yeah, the the code that was adopted tonight provides a very clear uh pathway for code enforcement and for applicants to navigate this process. Right now, we don't really have like a built-in process other than you might get a letter from code enforcement, but this
provides a number of tools to the city for a property in the historic district that may be deteriorating and it could be a portion of that structure. And we have all these property surveys. So, I'll just give you like to illustrate an example. The historic property survey may say, you know, this front porch is
really a contributing component of the structure. That's a key component. We don't want that to fall apart. And then years go by, it might be in an estate or there might be some issues with whoever's maintaining that property not keeping up with it. You could see the porch kind of deteriorating to the point of this looks like it's about to fall
over. And you know, the code enforcement officer doesn't need to run like some schematic test to come to the conclusion that there's probable cause that there might be a problem here. Um, but probable cause of, you know, a a a deteriorating condition would be enough
to send a notice to the owner and saying, you know, we we view this as a uh this is an estate of neglect. If you dispute this, you have a right to a hearing. You can go to the HPC and be heard by the HBC and the the code
enforcement officer will be there and say hey this is what we observed and then they can show up and say it's not deteriorating. I went there last week, you know, and I got the coat of paint. It's all on the back of the truck. I just need you know like that discussion can happen or if they they sit on it and
then do nothing after 30 days it's determined to be in a state of neglect. The city could actually take some affirmative action just like it could go fix a sidewalk. it could go maybe do some limited work if it chooses to reinforce that so it doesn't fall apart and that becomes not a tax on the city
but it could be assessed to the property owner just like a sidewalk repair or something like that could be or and or you could send a municipal court summons to get that process started. So there's multiple uh methods and tools for a code
enforcement officer though. I wouldn't say that we don't have any options right now without this code, but this is provides a much clearer pathway, a much clearer toolbox for the code enforcement officer to point to and for applicants to know that look, if I don't keep up on this type of thing, this is what I'm
looking at. >> I'm I've only lived here about 10 years, so I'm still catching up. But in my entire time here, 30 Congress Street has looked like a rundown, dilapidated, abandoned property. I know it's not because I see people there occasionally,
but the property itself is an embarrassment to our town. I would think it is to me. And so, but I haven't seen any change. So, I don't know if this ordinance is different than the one that's already on the books for maintaining this historic property and how that will be enforced or if we'll
apply the same enforcement process that you've just described against existing code that we have. >> Yeah. >> To kind of alleviate that kind of issue. >> And I didn't mean to interrupt you, but the the the existing code is more geared towards if somebody has a reason to interact with city hall, like they're
gonna make now we're gonna make a change to the building. So now we got to go to the HPC and now we have a discussion about what the condition of the property is in. This is more proactive on the part of people may observe a condition that is concerning that this is maybe in a state of deterioration. That can be a
referral to code enforcement officer, >> but ultimately this is not geared towards just like torturing people. It's geared towards compliance. So, what it does is it gives the code enforcement officer a reason to bring those people, call them in, have a conversation with
code enforcement and maybe the HPC about bringing the property into compliance. Um, so this, like I said, there may be some other existing tools and and resources, but this is a much clearer, cleaner way of package of of dealing
with this problem. >> Okay. Hope it works. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. Anyone else this evening? >> Hi Dennis. >> Uh, hi Dennis Crowley, 806 Lafayette Street. I want to revisit the discussion on the Lafayette Street Park for a
minute or two. And um, uh, I I think we've grown accustomed. It's almost like dealing with um a sort of an ailment that we've all been accustomed to living with the fact that this park has been delayed time and time
again for a whole variety of reasons and a litany of of excuses for why it isn't getting done. The uh the park was designed the current design we have is in phases. Two or three of those phases are done. Uh the middle phase is as I
look at the plans surface installations of uh pickle ball courts, basketball courts and tennis courts. And then the last of this piece is a parking lot which is going to be next to the uh new police station. Now now my question is
uh and we heard a comment earlier about getting ready for the lifeguard headquarters to be ready for Memorial Day. And and the question I have for you is, is the park going to be ready by Memorial Day? Because if it isn't, we
have we have escalated the problem that we have and and that is that we're using the section of the the phase of the park which is supposed to be the surface level athletic installations. We're using it as a popup free parking lot.
There's a problem there. I I have a problem with that concept for two reasons. Number one, at any given day during the summertime, you have 100 or more perhaps even as high as 200 cars using that facility. Uh which we all
know is an environmentally sensitive piece of land to begin with. Uh it's not paved, it's not organized in any way as a parking lot. It's just simply there that people come and go off of Lafayette Street. So, if we do that again next
summer, we're going to have two I what I would think with negative consequences. Number one, we have we're going to be accustoming the the visitors of to this town that there's a free parking lot on Lafayette Street, and let's let's use
that. The the the second is we have once again for yet another year deprived the residents and the taxpayers of this town the facilities that we promised them there. It's their park. Uh if you drive
through Sea Isle, you drive through Avalon, you drive through Stone Harbor, you get recreation park envy because those towns have beautiful facilities that have been put up and used very well by the they don't have many residents in
those towns, but we do and but they have a lot of visitors and they use them too. Those are facilities that we promised everybody that was going to be an integral part of a Cape May visit. It's not if it doesn't happen this year, it's going to make it worse.
The these are false. We're entering a term of false pro promises. If it doesn't get done, we have eight months between now and Memorial Day when we want to target the new facilities for the lifeguards. We have eight months to
complete the land installations of the athletic complexes of of those courts, basketball, tennis, and pickle ball. Those are and then the the original entrance to the park, which has a fountain in it. And and um I'm not sure
I know why we we can't do that in 8 months. And because we're not going to let we're not going to be able to get the parking lot built, that's going to be used to facilitate the heavy equipment building the police station. That's that's off the table. But I'm not sure why we can't just get in there and
finish that middle section of the park, get it ready for Memorial Day, and tell the people who come to this town, that's a new park. Doesn't it look great? Why don't you use it as well as you use the the nature trail? And and if you're looking if you're looking at using it as once again a
popup free parking facility, you're going to run into two problems. You're going to have to look at whether or not that's even legal based on our legal history connected with the environmental condition of that site. And number two, and Jules made that raised the point a
minute ago, you're you're basically depriving the city of revenue, which they need, which we need to help fund a real parking solution, which the planning board has a subcommittee put together to study whether or not we can
even do that. But the point is, it it's it's it's almost like a slap dash approach to two real problems. Number one, parking's a problem. Number two, the the residents of this town seem to be disheartened that we'll ever have a
park. And so I I I'd like to council to give me a commitment that will have the surface installations of the courts in the middle of that park up and ready for the for Memorial Day.
And if you can't do that, if you can't do that, uh we're going to have to know why. And secondly, you're going to have to come up with a better plan for the use of that free parking space because we have environmental concerns and these these state agencies have been up our
butts about this thing to begin with. We need to have a better plan for not only the whether or not we can use that >> mayor, >> but how can we recoup the revenue from it and thirdly, how is it organized because there is no organization in that
lot now. But uh you you could even put up one of our park mobile signs if you want to and send some and send some folks in there. That would be an easy solution. But the point is you either tell us you're going to have our park for our use by Memorial Day or you're
going to tell us why and then you're going to tell us how you're going to manage that parking lot because it isn't very well managed. Now, thank you. So, um, look, I've been very open about my own disappointment with the progress of
Lafayette Street Park, and it's been over a decade, um, if not longer. Um, and it, of course, it started with the uh, remodeling of the playground that exists today. We did uh just this year
add um ADA surfacing to the playground which was important because it it didn't meet handicap accessibility. Kids were getting hurt or weren't keeping the appropriate amount of mulch and things like that. But so an expensive endeavor that we did 50/50 with the uh the
elementary school and uh the board of education and the city of KMA. Obviously, Dennis, you know that they're working on a second phase of the park, whatever phase it is, another phase of the park uh right now as phase X and
that is uh actually my understanding is going to get um sod next week. Um the uh irrigation has been completed. Um they're looking at opening up the botchi ball court soon. Um, so I'm but I'm saying soon because I'm not positive, but I would say within the next 30 days,
you're going to see a big improvement in that area, a nice grassy area for ball playing, etc. Um, the the LA Go ahead. Okay. I I understand what you're saying. I agree with you. Everything is is it was
a little bit of a glitch because we had that problem. All that stuff is in the past. It's going to get done right >> as soon as possible. My concern is if we don't do something about the court situation, the athletic courts, if we don't do something about that within the
next 8 months, we're going to have another summer with two things. The the popup parking, which which may not even be legal, and and then we're going to have once again no more park for our residents and our taxpayers for yet
another year. And that and that's something that that seems to me I don't I don't know how many people even care about that but I care about it because I've been listening to the same dialogue that you have for the last 10 years and I was on that original committee many years ago that that designed that park.
>> So so what I'm saying is the let's start the clock now. It's eight eight months. >> Can I I want to answer your question. Okay. And I want I want other people to hear it too. Uh, we unfortunately had to really break this thing apart, which is to be honest
with you, our solicitor did a really good job. And I'm not, it's hard to pat anyone on the back for Lafayette Street Park, believe me. But it was literally a bowl of spaghetti that we had to individually unwind. And this list
included the D, the EPA, the uh New Jersey D, the Historic Preservation Commission, the State Historic Preservation Commission, the Board of Education. It included um housing, HUD, Housing and Urban Development,
JCPNL, keep going, help me, Kate May County. I I mean, I'm telling you, the amount of people that were involved in this was incredible. And and and every single person took forever to get
through the regulation and red tape and it is ridiculous. I I'm not going to defend it. It was absurd. And I went we went to Trenton and talked with the governor and met with the head of the D. And so bottom line, getting through all of that took a very long time. Uh and
now we still are waiting for a caffer permit. So we we need to get a caffer permit because uh those hard courts are near the wetlands. So anything hard surface we have to get the capper permit. The other thing that happened
during this entire thing is some of the grants that we had expired. So now we don't want to build something without grants that we know we can get. So, unfortunately, we're waiting for some of the last bits of red tape to be complete so that we can get some of those grants back, which we know we can, and that's
going to pay for probably at least 70% of the rest of this park. And that's that's kind of where we're at. Uh, >> okay. So, when we can get the grants, if we can get the grants, will we still have time to build the
courts? No, I think I think the goal is and it's a very legitimate goal that we start this project by this time next year. And that's the completion of the park. >> No, it's not. It we still won't have the parking lot built because we're using it
>> for the the park itself. I'm talking hard courts and and everything would and and and maybe the parking lot would start. I don't I mean there we got to work out how that's going to be a detail with the police station construction going on and whether we even want to have a parking lot that might get beat
up during that process. Okay. But uh every other aspect of the park I do believe we would be able to start in the fall the fall of >> So next summer we're going to be looking at yet another scenario. Same as last year, same as this year. >> No, no, because we'll have the new dog
park. will have uh the the new soccer field all brand new sod all all that area frankly in front of your house will be green sod hopefully irrigation >> okay so uh it's going to be a parking lot then you're saying
>> most likely >> so let me remind you that free parking in Cape May is almost like heroin once you get addicted to it you're gonna have a hard time getting off of it and the the the further number of years we
use that or misuse that piece of property based on its original intent, the harder it's going to be to explain why we let it go so long. >> I I hear you. I I believe me, I hear you. And there, look, there's going to be issues that we have to address. We
can't have RVs parked there and stay there. I mean, you know, so there's there's going to be probably a real reason that we're going to have to put at least some of the parking spaces metered or whatever. I mean, what So, it's it's going to be a discussion that we have to tackle.
>> That was my third point. If you're going to have it, it's got to be better organized, >> right? >> Thank you. >> Thank you. Anyone else? Seeing no comment, we'll motion to adjurnn.
>> All right. Thank you. Have a wonderful evening everyone. Thank you. >> Time is 6:52.