e
it's all just like that yeah your seats yes
like to call to order the S preservation Commission meeting on February 10th it is 602 in compliance with the open public meeting Act of 1975 adequate notice of this meeting has been provided if any member has any reason to believe that this meeting is being held in violation of this act they should state so please at this time hearing none i' like to invite
everybody to join us in the Pledge of Allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all so in January you may recall we had a reorganization meeting and as a way to sort of kick off this new year I would like to ask all of us if we could
just pause for a moment and reflect on why we're here and I'd like to ask each of you if you're willing to briefly say a few words one minute or less hopefully Regarding why you're caring about or what you're finding meaningful about serving on the city of Kate May's historic preservation commission shall we start with you and you'd like to do that before the roll call yeah we should probably do the roll roll call let's do the roll call thank
you Mr Becker here Mr Tesa here Mr Carol here miss bisagno it looks like she's absent Miss Wilson stck here Mr hammerin here thank you so Kevin why don't we start with you so what I'm asking is a few words about why you're caring about or what you're finding meaningful about serving on the city of Kate May's historic preservation commission sure so you know 40 40 years ago I made the the my wife and I
made the call this is where we wanted to retire and um you know there was a reason for that it was the charm and the and the loveliness and just uh you know the preservation of this beautiful little city and you know there are other places we could have chosen I mean you know whether that might have even made better sense for us financially at the time but this is where we wanted to go um you know we had been coming here for a while with our children when they were little and uh you know this
this this mattered us and so today um preservation matters I mean that's what's keeping Cape May the very City that I chose to retire to and so there's my reasons it's just that simple thank you Janice um well I've been coming to Kate May Since the early 70s and I witnessed and was part of in
a peripheral way the movement to preserve and um maintain authentic resources in that time uh I thought it was very exciting and positive and I've seen uh many positive changes because of our foresight but I've also seen development pressure and in some ways um the cost of our success so we are unique we have these wonderful
historic building buildings and all this character that other places don't have which has made it a very desirable place which has brought a lot of money into K May that wasn't here in the 60s and 70s and that's also brought a lot of pressure to expand beyond what I think is practical to replace authentic materials with
more durable or cheaper materials so it's complicated and I just feel like our character is worth preserving and I don't like being the bad guy but I'd like to be someone who could help educate people or guide things in a way that preserves our character thank you Mr Gillan Schwarz well I don't get a
vote um but I do get the opportunity to to support you all in the work that you do and I can tell you that um as a resident here and somebody that grew up down here went to grade school down here um getting to and going to high school in a place like Wildwood you know and you see the distinction between driving those streets and the streets in Cape May and you can see the the benefit that something like this can have on a
town to preserving character and and you know making it a nice place to you know walk your family down the street so um it's uh it's independent of the legal part of it it's definitely a net positive and in the towns that I'm sure we all go to these other places that have boards like this and it leads to a really nice downtown and and streetcape thank you Mr Tesla so
you reserve the right to go last is that the chair's prerogative um one of the advantages of being um like fourth or fifth is that you can agree with the values of everybody else who's expressed them before you and and and I do and I won't repeat those because they're all very good um I would just say that um one of the um the attractions and the things that I find uh really makes this much more worthwhile is that we have a small City and we have um various
attributes or our city government the it clearly the HBC has served for a long time it's been effective it's done its job it'll continue to do its job I think um my greatest satisfaction really comes from attempting to perfect the job that we do so that whether it be by the standards we adopted U by our rules by by anything else we do in our meetings we have to produce the best that we can produce for this city and so Excellence
is my motivation for being a member of the commission thank you Tom my wife and I moved to Cap May in uh the very cold month of December in uh 1969 and there was no such thing as a Christmas celebration or anything like that we fell in love with the town our first landlord was Fred cooner who was the first president of the Mac we moved into a house on Jackson Street to make it a BNB and our neighbor was Bruce
Minx the men the the mayor that started turning everything around and pretty soon I got involved with the historic American Building Sur survey that did all these buildings around which Kate May Mack made an exhibit out of them and after we used them in the carriage house I we came to the mayor and said this would be a perfect way to let everybody in Kate may know where we look what
we look like 55 years ago and what we've done every one of those buildings is still here 50% of them are vastly improved from what they were back then and it just warms my heart with how much we're getting done here uh I've also served on the New Jersey historic trust the New Jersey cultural trust the planning board for nine years so I've seen a whole lot of things and this is the board I really really enjoy being on thank you click yes
um well being the crossover member I'm clearly a non- voting member um but I think I have a purpose of being here uh which is taking a look at Trends and and what's happening if things need to change um from a uh from a council perspective but um even more more so I really enjoy I I enjoyed going through and um being part of the historic standards you know replacing them but I really think it's it it comes down to
educating people and doing it in a way so they can really appreciate what we have in this city we have beautiful buildings I mean you guys have all said you know pretty much everything but we do we have beautiful buildings um we're on the national you know historic register um we need to make sure that we maintain that but yet do it in a way that people understand why um but I I I I really enjoy this board I really do thank you so your turn
my turn one one one minute yeah so when my wife and I decided to move here and ultimately retire here we were of course attracted by the absolute wonder and beauty of this place in terms of both its natural and its built environment what we didn't really understand until we began to experience it is the amazing community of people that are here without which none of that beauty
would exist really and for 50 years or slightly more this commission has been charged with stewarding that and what I'm finding is that it's an extraordinary opportunity to make a contribution in terms of working with this community as a set of co-creators and co- stewards together in a community working on preserving that magic for Generations into the future and I that's it it excites me to be
in service in that way because just like to close by saying we are here to serve the public that's why we're here so thank you everybody now to some more mundane work uh everybody had an opportunity to review the minutes from January the 13th if so is there a motion to approve those minutes so moved Mr chairman hear a second second thank you
moved by Mr Tessa seconded by Mr Carrol all in favor oh we have to do we do this by ro go ahead Judy Mr Carol yes Miss Wilson stck yes Mr hammeron yes Mr Tesa yes Mr Becker yes thank you we have before us a bill that we need to pay and this is for um our legal services of of Chris Gillan Schwarz Law LLC
in the amount of $1,683 cense like to entertain a motion to approve this payment I move approved by Miss Wilson strick and seconded by Mr Hammer Judy I'm sorry I didn't get the um the motion and the second who motioned Janice Janice and Kevin Kevin thank you very
much Mr Carol yes Miss Wilson strick yes Mr hamran yes Mr Tesa yes Mr Becker yes thank you so we have three resolutions that are well need to be ratified the first is Ramo to 266 Grand Street resolution 20252 that's block 1019 lot 7 CMC of Kate May LLC 721 Beach Avenue block 1064 lot 16 resolution 20253 and 302
to 305 Washington LLC 302 to 304 Washington Street block 1035 lot 3 resolution 20254 do I hear a motion to approve those and ratify those resolutions I'll make that motion and I will second it moved by Mr Carrol seconded by Mr Tesa thank you Mr Carol um I'm sorry yes thank you Miss
Wilson stck yes Mr hamran yes Mr Tessa yes Mr Becker yes thank you we have a list of applications approved and denied and review everybody have a chance to review those so I would like to entertain a motion to ratify those applications approved in review can can I ask a question sure uh I'm looking at one application that is included uh and it's also included approved in review which one uh White am
I missing something 16 no I think you I think you've caught the fact that it shouldn't be approved should be appr unless unless it was approved with conditions y so let's should we remove that please please remove that from the list of what's being ratified thank you l so do I hear a motion to ratify the list with the exception of white 1623 New Jersey Avenue so move seconded moved by Mr
Carrol seconded by Mr Tesa Judy Mr Carol yes Miss Wilson stck I abstain uh for for reasons of proximity to um Demario and uh um Congress Hall other than that I I approve thank you Mr hammeron also from thank you Mr Tesa
yes as to all Mr Becker yes thank you okay moving on to Old business speaking of white at 1623 New Jersey do we have representatives of the project terrific so if you could please turn on your microphone tell us your name and your role in the project that'd be great my name is Marcelo mavo I am the contractor for Mr John White um we applied
for for him for the for the U permits could you spell your last name please sir uh m o a v is and Victor e r o so the floor is yours thank you well having grown up here and gone to school at Star of the Sea I appreciate what you guys do um and keeping keeping Kate me the way I know it when I was a child um so we had applied to the historic uh Society for the Intex railings um I don't know specifically which ones um
Mr White had sanctioned through my office to uh to be approved but I'd running some samples here and I wanted to just give the give the facts as as I see them through Mr White may I interrupt for just I forgot to ask you um have you been authorized by the owner to represent their this evening yeah I have an email with him thanking me for going because he couldn't make it okay so it's your it's your signature on the application and there's been a communication that you're authorized I don't know which signature
is on there but I have communication authorizing well southwater construction is your company yes you submitted the application on behalf of the applicant correct right so just um Judy did you receive a but the owner just just confirming for the record that the owner it's not it's not you Mr yeah I understand it's just for our our recordkeeping purposes they did send an email prior to the hearing yes to the best of my okay
okay thank you so we're not questioning legally making more information the better fair enough fair enough the more information the better so um upon approval uh just to just to start uh from there inexs were uh ordered um through Mr White or Mr White through me um non fond unfortunately I believe but a couple of the ones that I just wanted to give you just the the 8819 KY Street uh two front yards um Intex was approved on both sides uh and that's a contributing structure I believe as well uh
and then the one the house this is 1623 uh New Jersey app the house to the left and house to the right both have Intex uh it's not wood um so these are the two samples I have um the the 2 in I believe is what is really um appetizing to whether it's wood or not because it has the historic look that I've seen it locally in Kate may as a matter of fact the house directly next to it on the left-and side from the front of New Jersey has both inch and 3/4 and 2 in
on the down rails side so it's not even consistent what I believe Mr White's proposing is this which is consistent with the the wood look that you you like so much and I and I I love as well this is a different one I wanted to bring to you that is actually real wood mahogany on the top as well um so that's really all I have to tell you is that that I have at least three examples uh would you repeat for me the the houses on New Jersey Avenue so 1623 is the one
proposing okay the one to the left and the right I don't know if the if it's 21 and 25 or if it's consistent or not numerically um I I had to go up to them to look like you this looks so much like wood you have to actually go like touch it sometimes um and especially if it's painted you can't really tell uh that it's even uh whatever Fab whatever material it is um it's consistent with the wood look uh looks identical to what I've done on other projects with real wood um so if it's the Aesthetics
you're looking for you're absolutely going to get it and here's an option with real wood on top as well so before I open it up for the other Commissioners to ask questions I just like to request one clarification sure we received on February 6th a revised application that actually has Intex crossed out and wood written in both on the front page and on the excuse me on the uh materials checklist say that again you you received it yeah on February 6th it was submitted um which would have been after the
review on Tuesday the 3D or the 4th rather that actually states that the Intex is being replaced with wood for the railings so what are we approving or what are you requesting to be approved well I'm unaware of the the whoever who crossed it out and what was applied for it the last the last application that I'm aware of was for Intex Judy can you clarify that HBC asked me to modify it with these conditions and modify it and
sent it out so you should have gotten this in email the modifi ver okay so so if I'm understanding it what happened is that that the approval that was given to you was an approval that was made conditional on the use of wood and you do not accept that and are here well this is on that's not that I don't I mean this is well your principle yeah the fact is that there was a there was a a a a an approval subject to the
use of wood and not to the use of Intex okay so that's that's where we are before you showed up here understood so yeah Mr Mr White received the email as well I assume because you had us all on there correct then you sent me an email sir and told me you had already purchased the in and that's why you wanted to come here no no I'm sorry I meant your original email saying it was approved that we were all on that correct that an original email that it was approved HBC then caught the error and they asked me to amend
the application and the conditions for wood I then sent that out to you Marcel 2.net and J okay so the I'm just trying got a response from you that you had already purchased this material was not refund you wanted to come to commiss yeah paron Mr White so if I'm just so I'm order I'm getting the order in in order yeah the the original email approval the original one said W no the original said Intex approve and and there
was an in review approval with an error we made an eror was Miss no no I understand we I'm trying try revise the approval to Grant it subject to the use of wood okay okay and and we understand that you're here now seeking to have Intex used yes sir okay and it doesn't matter who who authored the application the original one I'm just trying to catch up the speed on why Mr White
and you're here asking for Tex yes sir okay and then the the three that I have given you uh 8/19 Cy and the one to the left and the right and a lot of that whole block there believe it or not and and I know there's contributing Pockets has white vinyl which you can't even tell that's the white vinyl you can obviously tell um so Kevin can you Mike thanks and I just absolutely will tell you I missed the the Intex request because
had it had I noticed it at that time you know our position would have been no you have to go to the wood because you're contributing property that's what the material would have been constructed of and therefore you you preserve the historic character and material use um I think we caught it actually as it went from us into the um the inspector and so you know it never even got out of the building before we realized we had an error hence the correction um and and I think the uh
the important part now is unless there's a a reason to to to not go to Wood um you know that would be the material we would choose to to support simply because again it is the historic you know material that would have been in use at the time of the construction of so maybe I misunderstood what what Mr White had conveyed to me as far as the the uh sequence of emails and maybe he missed it if if he did get a an approval that did have something corrected on it maybe he just didn't realize that it was
correct that if his original email said approved conditionally I don't know if he did I think he was under the impression that the first one just was approved so that's why I think we had to pull the trigger on the may I ask you one other question sure what are the railings on that building now I believe they're wood but they're they're falling apart that's why he wants to redo it no I understand but they are wood uh yes yes so I think the the operative question is do you believe that the owner is would be willing to revise it as we suggested as a condition to make the railings out of wood as opposed to int
I I wish I could have his you know his opinion here but I I don't I don't know I'm assuming um because I'm here on his behalf that he would prefer the Intex having the neighbors have had it and then 819 Kerney has two front yards and that's contributing as well okay and his question was I I guess it's an obvious question in general anyway if if a19 cern's approved left and right of this are approved I mean why can't I and that's again speculation that's just the
obvious question well the the simple answer is that every project is reviewed on its own merits no yeah so Janice do you have any comments or questions I I I do have a question I'm sorry though and only because I'm trying to I'm trying to represent him the best I can um it's great I gu great looking stuff it is and I I I when I saw this for the first time I I mean I I prefer this because it looks like the traditional ballister of the 2 inch and then but this is this actually Israel wood but I guess my question I would have to his question would be I understand
this no there's no precedent I don't understand why but I understand that there isn't rules or rules so I guess my question would be from him what would be the reason if three other contributing houses got it why he couldn't well I I'll try to answer that you mind Janice um my guess is that um well I don't know if I should guess but there have been many changes to many buildings in town that were
were U subtle but degraded the historic character of the buildings and it's really a hard job to enforce this so we do depend on the good willll of our homeowners and contractors and the understanding of the principle which is that we try to protect and preserve original materials as much as possible and when we have to
replace them we have so far emphasized replacing with the authentic same material when it's available wood is certainly available so and and and I that's that's a great answer but I don't not I maybe I'm not getting what I mean it didn't he's going to ask me and if I were to regurgitate what you just said I don't know that he would understand the answers we we are we aren't going to we aren't going to be able to we aren't going to be able to to one at
a time have been done against our wishes or without review there have yeah I did 819 KY Street it was full review that's why I'm I'm again I I told him all this and I know I'm going to get these questions I'm not trying to be combative I just I'm going to need to to hand these answers to him so if 819 Kerney he's going to come to me and say if you did that there and that was a much much more I mean I don't know if you remember Carl Bach I grew up here I don't know if any of you remember Carl buck that was his house I was there when I was a kid um when we lifted that and we did what
we did there and Intex was approved on Franklin and Kerney two front yards he's going to say here here's the thing you can go back and tell him because once a month we have a the horse left the barn argument from an applicant and I figured you'd have an answer that's why I'm asking yeah but we you know if if every time a horse left the barn we just gave up a rule we we wouldn't have we wouldn't have a farm so that's the problem and it's it's it's a it's a challenge that not just this town but every other min IP ality faces
that doesn't have the FBI doing their enforcement we have only so many limited resources so when do we catch things this board is not an enforcement body so we catch things when we review you know the list of people on here and is this appropriate and sometimes things get missed but if the question is presented to this board about what material is appropriate the easy call is wood the the difficult call for your client to understand is stuff like that and not because it looks terrible or anything like that but because this
board has to protect the contributing structures so and that kind of that goes into more of a gray area where they can rubber stamp would and they tried to do that here um so if he wants to do something different he really needs to present to this board how that's not going to detract from the contributing status of the building independent of what happened on the the left or the right which happens all the time well I guess I guess he would say that um it's not going to detract because it looks identical that's that's what he would say cuz it look identical to
it just to to me to me it comes down to less a question of the Aesthetics and making an argument on the Aesthetics because I agree with you it looks aesthetically pleasing I can't tell the difference but what I can do is read the standards and the standards with respect to a contributing property in this town require that if it is available it be W so I can and we and we know that that's available so I'll just tell them that KY Street slip by you well
no know but what we do know is that what's before us now our job legally as a body is to uphold the standards that are written and are publicly available in fact I would I would invite your client to go ahead and go online and read what I'm about to read to you yeah because it's specifically about porch and interest standards and is that on your on on your like on our website this is on the website and it is newly adopted it's not a ago it's not like it's ancient yeah so it's um you can download a PDF file or you can order
a hard copy fair enough so specifically it says for porch and entrance standards for contributing structures on page 34 composite or imitative materials such as vinyl and wood plastic Blends are not appropriate for Visible elements of the porch including railings decking stairs trim and lattice work okay why so one of the things that's kind of I think unique about these standards is in the introduction before it actually itemizes what each of those standards are it
gives a little explanation as to why so I think it might be worth reading it real quickly because you might be able to share that with your owner sure and they might actually desire to be right part of that okay so the size design and materials of porches are an integral part of the style and significance of a building they form one of the most important visual characteristics of historic buildings and contribute to their historic character and significance replacement porches on contributing Properties or on additions to contributing properties should replicate
the original porch this also means replacement materials in both materials and design so it's based upon that philosophy that this standard is written as a specific standard for contributing properties maybe that helps I hope it does I give him I will give him the web page I'd like to make two other comments first of all um there there is a very distinct possibility that some of the things you mentioned as were said before just simply were not brought to the commission for approval okay
some stuff does get by us we're not infallible but we have a probably a a 99.5% success rate when it comes to figuring this stuff out so very little gets by some gets by because it just isn't brought here second thing I want to say is um I'm very familiar with the neighborhood um since I live only a few blocks away and you may not know this but um that area of town was developed part of what was originally called the
East Cape May development company and it was developed shortly after the turn of the century to the the 19th to the 20th century those houses on New Jersey and of which this is a contributing property are important contributors to that neighborhood and to both the architectural style and the materials I know that the original materials that were on that porch were wood um properly maintained they will last a very long time uh I think it's in the
interest of everyone including uh your client that uh that particular property um conformed to the rest of of the properties I'm not sure how things to the left or right could have happened but uh to to conform to those properties what is the proper solution it's pried by the standards and it's the best for the neighborhood Tom do you have any comments or questions the standards that you're that we were mentioning really come down from the Department of interior and that's the department in
the United States that gives us a National Historic Landmark status that is near and dear to us that's why all these things are around the room we have to live up to those standards and we've been threatened now and then when some things have happened like the old Admiral Hotel came down that caused a lot of questions other things in town so we need to constantly prove to them that we are doing everything can to Pro to protect the architectural in Integrity of
our historic buildings okay so that's that's why you know we deal with our friends and neighbors and have to say no sometimes and uh and we don't get invited to parties anymore listen I I'm just here I'm here trying to give every question here's what I don't want I don't want to go back to Mr White and have him come up with better questions than I do so I don't want to sound like I'm combative because we're we're all looking to be invited to Mr White's party so
the r yeah the so that's yes I just have a few comments to make um because when I opened I talked about the standards um and they all alluded to the standards but what I find really uh wonderful about this application is is you're adhering to the standards on everything else yes uh the porch I mean you you know you're doing all of that which I think is going to be a drastic improvement um and then you know we're we're looking at deviating from the standards for well I think and I if I if I may sorry to interrupt but the reason I
think they did that is if you look a lot of the houses um and and having grown up here I've seen a dozen dozens of them um the railings are often times the ones that look the most uh rickety for lack of reditor when they when they start to go they start to go right you see the wood splinter sometimes on if the if the deckboards are facing you but if it's picture frame you don't really see it but you can see the railings when the wood starts to rot or it's not painted properly it starts to rot I think that's why they went it wasn't just so much because they did try to
go for the design aspect mhm yeah you tell you can tell that I mean that is and I think that's I think that's why they went for just this deviating from what the other with the other products sure right but you know I also look at you know everything else that you're doing on that porch you're redoing everything with wood and I to bring it back to the original um I think that was the motive go with this sure so I just have a couple questions I didn't line you done I'm I'm good so yeah it's the physics of it is that those railings have the greatest surface area to volume ratio
of all the elements that you're producing therefore they have more susceptibility to the elements so I just want clarification is your facial your suets your siding The Columns and the decking most of them say like for like but don't specifically say they're would and some people interpret like they are they are that's I believe it's ePay we're using Okay so the only material EP and Poss mahogany or mahogany mahogany yes got it so the only material and that includes the columns too right absolutely and some of the fascia all everything will be that so as
Lorraine said everything else complies yeah right so um if that's the case would we like to entertain a motion regarding this project well uh with the condition that we we with wood being used I and I would make a motion to approve the application um but on the condition and and with no other changes but for the fact that the that would be used throughout uh and and not
yeah and I apologize because I was under the impression that the first approval received was not it was just an approval I didn't I didn't realize Mr wood I mean Mr White had wood on the approval I thought that was the followup yeah so that you're saying the original approval had would no no the original approval was this got by them is what you're saying yeah it got by and I think the only point of contention Mr White might have is I think those materials are already ordered that I mean just again that's
not my f look it was so quick that this was caught in in terms of municipal government it days I mean the two days yeah yeah to approv 23 and then I got an email on 25 yeah so I but I get it like everybody's trying to move on a project but before they take a vote on this I just have a practical question sure what you just indicating like you're doing Top Flight stuff on the rest of this like would replace correct for like it's not like just this
you're doing some nice stuff on the other portions so this this selection is not really like a cost thing for your client and well the only the only factor I could see where it would factor in the cost is if it's non-refundable um well I what I'm trying to think is and this is a more expensive product that's what I mean that's what this is it's more he didn't cheap out this is better than wood that's that's the point I was trying to make it's more expensive than wood yeah this this isn't going to be like save money it's actually going to be more I will second the motion but I
would like to add that we would need we need drawings that show the dimensions on the design for the wood and I'm looking at the one on the left here which has a bigger ballustrade railing and and much more reflects the period of time but we don't want to say yes if if it's wood everything's okay and then find it a maximum Gap just between one in you know uh ballast rates here they
should look like that but being would so I think we have a motion that's been seconded to approve this application with the exception that the railings be of wood and a detailed drawing showing the configuration of the railings being proposed I'm just going to I'm going to take this information and let Mr White go from there is that an accurate assessment of the motion well do you do you want do you want the board to proceed with that Vote or are you asking to go back and talk to your client about that um well we could
table it well I mean it's if it's approved with wood and subject to conditions he can either follow it or not but I don't but I don't know what direction Mr White's I'm saying but he you you know if it's approved that way it doesn't mean he has to follow it he just uh he could do nothing but we'll tell we're saying what we what we're approving fair enough M I mean I don't know to I'm not a lawyer I don't know and I know you can't give me legal advice but I don't know to what detriment it would be to Mr White if it was if it was tabled or not if if it's approved you know what this board stance on
this project is um you know look I I'm just it's the applicants yeah understand I I think the only difference we have and we've told you the rest of story only difference we have for the application as you came in and where we are now is that there's a there's a motion here to approve it with wood possibly subject to submission of detailed drawings of the to the review board to the review Mr White had issue with with the decision he'd have to
reapply anyway or fight it wherever he fought it right I mean you have to do yeah you have to set submit a new application or he then yeah I don't see reason I mean it's only going to perpetuate yeah it doesn't save you anything if if this is the way you're willing to go but if he says okay I'll I'll do it then he then it's a move Point yeah yeah great so I think the motion on the table is that this is approved subject to the condition that the railings be wood and that we are given a detailed drawing of the configuration
of the proposed railings okay great that motion has been seconded yes yes that was me okay motion by Mr Tesa seconded by Mr Carol Mr Carol yes Miss Wilson stck yes Mr hammeron yes Mr Tesa yes Mr Becker yes thank you com thank you and and please convey to Mr White our apologies for making error um
the good news we caught it early so I just do the inext you guys won't drive by right actually we have a man posted watching you yeah uhuh you think that'll work huh yeah yeah okay so next on our agenda is Taylor Gordon 921 Washington Street that has been continued at the request of the applicant that has been
that has been moved to next month yes okay I'm I'm sorry you you told me that and I forgot it okay great so moving on next is Jersey Development Group LLC 359 Congress Street Mr Peter welcome back hello hello in the hot seat could you please state your name and your role in the project yes Scott Peter owner of the home owner of the property the floor is yours sir thank you good to see everyone uh
chairman board for the record Scott Peter applicant here tonight for a 359 Congress Street block 1031 lot 2.01 uh 2.02 here tonight seeking approvals for a new single family I did receive conceptual approvals uh for the new home uh the conceptual approvals did have some recommendations some of those recommendations were for proper spacing on the exterior deck rails along with a different type of kind of
Dormer on the front of the house and bfold shutters I was able to make all those recommendations in addition after submitting um the plans for the conceptual meeting and the recommendations from that um we actually had as you know Mr Becker um a sit down and content when the Review Committee had some additional comments um and some also some good recommendations some of those recommendations were to add additional Windows uh cover Upper Deck porch
quite a large bump out on the um the street side I was able to make all those suggestions as well so pretty much the original meeting I made all those recommendations happen and then this the the most recent one I was able to make that happen um happy to run through the plans um but I was able to make all the recommend recommendations so um before we go around the room I just like to state that to the other Commissioners that Mr Peter came before us with a
different set of drawings that was quite significantly different than what's in this packet now and we sat for maybe half an hour and walked through them together and kind of Coes co- redesigned it together and identified places to add Windows move Windows shift some proportions specifically around the entrance being much more important and um within two days Mr Peter returned to us a completely revised set of drawings that took every every one of them
into consideration so we thank you for that thank you for your time I got to tell you that is probably the most helpful thing you guys are offering nowadays from this side of the table is awesome so Kevin I can so looking at the front of the house it's what I call is just a reverse gable roof so instead of your traditional A-frame the roof changes Direction
so where we added the Dormer now moving on to the side it ended up Landing within the reverse Gable of that roof Scott which drawing is that on just so we that is on a 2.3 thank you
of M so are you are
do you find it appropriate or I thought I correct myself he made all the changes as we discussed except for this one see see now now now I'm a little bit confused um and and I no no
no I I understand Kevin what you're saying and I've marked the difference in the gables but my difficulty here in assessing this is I understand from the applicant that he made substantially all or made all and and I hear from and I can read the conceptual approval which I have but I wasn't present for a subsequent meeting there's no written explanation of what it is you all talked about but I understand what I'm hearing now to be saying that
except for the Gable everything Scott undertook to do was done is that my understanding including the Bold shutters correct correct okay that is accurate I'm a little bit at C because the step two I wasn't there yeah it was extensive um it's a substantially different I would I would suggest this this was a building and a project which could have used Improvement as you got the conceptual approval and there were additional condition conditions it it certainly is better
now than than it was and I'm willing to take that as as where we you know where we come on this um this application Janice well when I looked at it drawing I I didn't realize the shutters were bfold but when you spoke about them obviously they are so that that stood out to me because they look so skinny not sure what but shutters
look like in a two-dimensional CAD drawing uh I I really don't have other comments Mr Tes have you other comments or question no I've I've said my piece and and I'm going to you know one step after the second that's it Tom okay uh I'm sorry I was not there to be in the first review but as always I usually have some comments and I was certainly glad to see that the
uh the ballustrades have been uh readjusted although on the plans that I'm looking right now it still says 4 in spacing on the ballustrades on the porches and when we do this we want no more than three Ines in between them am I right on that oh I think you're the you're the space man space man comes to space
between ballustrades or or spindles you're the you're the SPAC man there's also um this is just in some of the window design um there you have an awful lot of Windows that have two panels on the top and on the bottom uh I've been all around this town and I've never seen anything that has Windows like that split with just one sash in
the middle but what I've seen a lot of is the upper sash having four panes or six panes and one window on the bottom in a very uniform pattern through the building uh some of these have split windows at the bottom and and then uh some have just an open one I'm I'm looking at a21 where I'm looking at uh some small Windows where
the bottom Windows have a split and the windows to the right of them have no split in the bottom there's just a real lack of uniformity in design which actually in Windows is the only real uniformity that gets split is sometimes when there windows on the first floor versus the second floor or the third floor and according to their size um with the way you're buying these
windows isn't it possible to say I would like a uniform uh either uh something over something yeah something over something you know and the best I think with the size of these windows would maybe be four at the top or bigger Windows the bottom six over one so that the window that people look out of has the biggest glass opening and uh gets the most use and the top one goes along with everything else in town um
I'm happy to make that change and if it works I can just call it four over one um on every window yeah happy to do that uhhuh great that would be consistent for all of them is that correct every single window to answer sometimes when we do a picture window we just do a one Grill got it down it because it's not a double Hong or you know two sashes but happy to do four over one so it's consistent So when you say double
double hinge Hing double hinge shutters I'm sorry uh that is one shutter that is hinged to an outer shutter that and when opened up would cover the exact area of the open window cor closed window and that's what makes it a bfold bold yeah yeah it's just an articulating shutter two shutters push together yep and now would would that that really wouldn't affect your your windows in most of the rest of the house
no I think it would really just be uh these ones in the front Okay so just to be clear I think what you're saying is detail Das 1.0 that drawing detail 21 dtl 1.0 is the standard configuration of the windows because that shows four over one yeah and I'll do it consistent on the elevations as well modify that and I'll do the the spacing too to be 3in spacing on the
B okay okay what about the door on a 21 the same one a yep it's not consistent with the rest so I think what you would be proposing for that door and actually um yeah well that door in particular would be just a a four four light door great and Tom are you okay with the windows on the front elevation being all on sorry the doors the three that are
stacked under the tower in the tower all the same yes okay great all doors for light no I think th is saying that the the yeah that the ones on the on drawing a 2.0 those three doors could be single glazed oh just no no no GRS I think Tom right who's that from Judy that's me have my back sorry j Tom are you in agreement
with that um well Jim was talking these are not divided lights is that you right with that great so nothing on the front elevation as far as just those three doors okay three main doors so but the side elevation 2.1 will still do four light on the door door got it so no girls front door yep and can these things come back to the subcommittee for final review really okay they certainly can the question is do we want to entertain a motion there's only three modifications
yeah I I would I would make the motion I would make it with the three conditions I don't think they're necessary to come back through the Review Committee I agree um because we'll be looking I mean that it's pretty easy I mean conditions are with respect to the windows the four over one with respect to the side uh door I can enter in record if it makes it and and the HPC compliance officer will be able to reference the resolution and make sure plans reflect sorry what say I would like I would like a set of revised plans
for the record just one set of course if you can send them to me electronically and one paper copy thanks Scott so we could we could make the motion to approve as submitted with three conditions the spacing on the railings to be no more than three in the windows to be four over one and the side door to be four light four lights that's perfect would be the three conditions that's the door on a 2.1 yep m do I hear a second I'll second it
so we have a motion that the this be receiving final approval conditional upon four over one Windows three in spacing between the railings and a four light door on a2.1 motion by Mr Tesa seconded by Mr Carol Mr Carol yes Miss Wilson stck yes Mr hammeron yes Mr Testa yes Mr Becker yes and I would like to just offer you our gratitude
for working so well with us as basically Partners in the development of this in a way that I hope you're finding extremely an improvement extremely great thank you Mr Peter thanks thank you all appreciate it okay on to new business um there is a change in the agenda the first project Burton has good night oh thanks good night good night Scott has been moved to the March meeting at the applicant's request
and what I'd like to ask is if everybody could please pass to me your packet materials for that project and for the Taylor Gordon project so we can give these back to Judy so that she doesn't have to make all new ones for next month which one would do Burton smartest thing I've ever heard this would be Burton Burton that was that was Judy's idea this would be Burton and uh Taylor Gordon what I do with Taylor Gordon here's Burton yeah there we
go okay okay did we get yours lastly our patient folks in the audience for Roth Reinhardt 1250 Lafayette Street please turn on your microphones and tell us your name and your role in the project good evening give us a moment to get out our oh take your time we're still collecting stuff so yeah yeah
you what
all right good evening is yours thank you all right thank you I'm Gary Roth I'm Patricia Reinhardt we're co-owners of 1250 Lafayette Street proud proud new owners and um hello board
nice to meet you all and I also just wanted to say how much I appreciated hearing all your stories John that was a great idea to go around we really appreciated that and it was really special because and I felt like oh geez we want to have our 6060 60c elevator speech about why Kate me is important to us because it really is but I think we probably we well really want to hear a great way to good good you're well within our time limits want to hear it sure yes okay okay well
um well I've been coming here for over 40 years we're ready love totally love Victorian architecture and everything about this town I mean everything the art the history the architecture the Christmas tours the restaurants um and I wanted to have a house here for like ever and but of course chiching every year you know it gets more you know interesting about affording it and also like where do you live you know love the point I love
Kate May City you know lower Township is cool West Kate May is cool like I appreciate like everything but anyway this house came up on 1250 and it just like really kind of fell in love with it so drug him along on the project and um so you know it's a sweet little House Lafayette Street is a little little challenging because of the traffic but other than that we've just really enjoyed like being homeowners but it's really I was saying I think to John Kevin at our little informal meeting and by the way thank you for that
and special kudos to to Judy she's been really so great before we bought the house and since we've bought the house she's let me bug her like every two seconds about all my questions um and where was I so but I just want to say that the um Journey so far has just been so wonderful like everyone we've met like just hearing each and every one of your stories we are all connected by how we feel about Kate me like I like I don't want to start crying because that's how much I think it all means to all of us so you know we want to do
what we have to do to follow all the rules you know we've got some thoughts too but we just really appreciate everything that you do and I think your slogan our future is our past I mean it's just perfect and right on um because we feel the same way you know Kate may just the bomb all the way around just it's my heart I just and when I come over that bridge I just feel like I'm home so you know it just means so much so so that was your entire presentation well I mean I could believe me I could say a whole lot more but anyway you get it
I love I love Kate may you know so but anyway thank you for the job that you do and it it's it's a hard job and I know it sometimes might feel like a thankless job because every time I have talked to people about what we have to do you know to our house and the approvals we have to get everybody just says well good luck you know and you know and I just you know it doesn't make me like it's like it's hard to hear that because I know you guys have a really hard
job to do this is hard what you do preserving this great town and everything in it but so anyway that's all I have to say but there's nothing I can add we love being here we just love being here follow that yeah what am I supposed to say I'm P 14 we have but everybody everybody we've met so far like the neighbors like I mean it's a small town you know a lot of people know a lot of people but we all feel the same way and you know
and we do too so anyway that's anyway it completely mention the bridge yeah when I come record anyway when I come down here normally when I take a week of vacation or two weeks of vacation if I ever really got that it would take me two or three days to relax you know just it to unwind enough to let go of the hospital that I was working at or whatever something about this place when I
go across that bridge I immediately relaxed and you know I could just put it aside it was amazing so I just I'm sorry roll down the windows smell the Salt Air and it's just it's just so calming you know anyway so but being a tourist and being a homeowner that's the challenge too right I mean because we can't get out of the house we keep saying all right that's it no more working it's 12 we got to go okay 1:00 for sure okay 2 o'clock we haven't had breakfast we haven't had lunch doing all kinds of stuff but we ultimately get
out but I can't wait till the work's done and we can have just have more fun that's going to be while okay anyway that's it do you want to do the merits of the application yeah yeah yeah all right so let's uh talk about what we're uh planning here this is our phase two our phase one was just a a repaint of the house which didn't require any input from you guys uh we we checked right um we hope you like the color yeah hope you like color um so
we we've got a collection of our next batch of improvements there'll probably be more in the future but for now uh we're looking at four things here uh one is replace uh the bulk of the fences on the property um the backside and front-facing fences are they're worn out okay so time to be refreshed and replaced um little bit of modification on one side uh was evident in the drawings and we can go in a little bit more detail um the second item
is uh we'd like to place a shed on the property uh the previous owners used the temporary uh like more like tent structures which definitely isn't appropriate so we want to put a more you know more appropriate uh shed structure on the property for the usual things like bikes and beach chairs and stuff right um we also would like our third item here is we want to add an outdoor shower to the house uh there
was something previously which was basically a spigot with no enclosure whatsoever which wasn't really private not right you know yeah so we're proposing uh put an outdoor shower around the back where no one can see it um with a proper enclosure around it um and finally um we're going to I guess we have to seek some sort of approval for this but we we're to restone the driveway pretty much
in kind um you know figured might as well put that in this application now when we get to Landscaping work in the spring we'll get that taken care of as well so great so that's kind of what we're looking at so um how would you like to proceed so um before we go around the room I'd just like to compliment you on a very comprehensive submission uh it was easy to review from my perspective and it gave me everything I needed to assess its appropriateness so let's start over with
Lorraine Lorraine let's start with you sure um where you're talking about the very back fence guess I guess my only question remove existing bump out I I wasn't sure what you what you were referring to oh yeah yeah yeah if um one of our drawings was actually a a survey of the property um the existing fence goes straight across the back line and then has a cut out like two or three
feet in like four or five feet across uh and then back I see it okay right and and uh we've talked to previous owners uh not our immediately previous but the ones before that um and there used to be a tree there so when the last time the fence was replaced um they had to go around the tree per regulations that tree is no longer there uh The Neighbors in the back are currently using it for garbage can storage you know sorry we've already talked to them you yeah
they don't like that we're going to put the fence in stet within our property it's on your survey that you attached yours yes yes so naturally when we replace the fence we're just going to make it straight across the back okay um the other question I was looking at the top part of your 4x4 posts yes where you were looking at like a Gothic kind of style yes not not not interrupt but there's an inconsistency in the posts it yeah so soont I was going to say you
you have a shown on the back at least 4in posts and in the Murphy proposal they show 6inch posts he's clear about that six inches in the front 4 inch everywhere else well in any in any event I'm going to say that um given the size of the fence the height of the fence the wind load of the fence the substantial nature of how tall that fence will be relative to the post I would suggest that you use 6in posts which are nominal six in the back yeah Sy nominal six in I'm you're showing 4
in here in the back yeah well that's what's present and what was believe believe me you'll like a 6-inch post much better than a 4inch post thought sweetie it's going to be more expensive but no I agree it will it will be incrementally no difference if it's a Murphy Fence no right right I just asking for they didn't say anything about it the fence really is literally falling down and and when you look at your new fence which will be really nice in Cedar you want it and and you're making it full length it's not lattice on top so so you're you're going
to increase your privacy you're also going to increase your wind load yes it's a pretty windy Town we've a lot of a lot of wind load strongly suggest you use 6x6 posts they'll look better they'll be stronger we accept that uh modification okay I'm sorry no that's okay good yeah it's just it's just better for proportion and strength thanks and that and I was going back to that Gothic sort
of cap on it um I'm I'm thinking to match you know everything else that's you know that's in that area those caps that go on top not not the actual cutout of the wood Gothic yeah presently they are no presently there's caps in place that a lot and a lot of properties have that right um what I think is being proposed is um structurally part of the post it's just the way they shape the very top of it uh does that show the gothic it shows
the gothic top to it yes that's what we're proposing okay and that's where I'm you know I'm wondering would it be better um aesthetically uh with a cap on it well I'll let you speak to that you know what they offer is two Styles is gothic which of course our house is a Gothic Revival as you know um then the other caps are like a FL
um slightly bevel slight slightly which is what we've we've actually used on our own and on there now is one the choices are for Murphy and I think um dennisville dennisville also is one's a flat and then the other part the other one is like a little bit of raised above the flat I forget what they're called but um we didn't go with that BEC I mean and that is what's there in the front now right um but it's a straight picket fence we're going to do the sloping just because I like the shape a bit better the swoop and our neighbor has the
swoop and I'm just more of swoopy than straight so um that was what we were going to go with so and that would be on the front yeah so but we were switching that flat top to the gothic to just keep with the whole theme of the gothic around the back fencing and the front so so you're saying the existing fence on the right hand side that you're not removing has that Gothic yes it does corre it does okay yeah the exist on the right hard to see here right
yeah apologize how many photos we could just put in the package right but the existing fences around the property have the gothic top and they're 4x4 and and the um fence on the right side if you're in the driveway looking at the back that is a newer fence we don't have to replace that it has a lattice top with the gothic post already there so we just thought you know it'd be better we are changing it because to that kind of plain stockade fence around the rest of the the two sides across the back and the left South Side South Side yes uh
I forget the back and the left side yeah um but any we just figured for you know to keep it kind of the same would be the best thing so what we would also do with the change to the sixin posts on The Back Fence uh the Sha the shower enclosure we were proposing basically the same type of fence material yeah uh except just raise the floor up a foot um then we would switch the posts on that to be 6x as well to match the rest of the property you'll likely be happier with
that I think I'm I'm okay yeah mhm and if they make the 4in posts any smaller they're going to be 3in posts so fair enough yeah I know that I think it's they're nominal 4 in right there there are some people actually in one case actually packed out 4in posts to make them oh really you know what the existing uh 6in posts on the front of the house are packed out like they have a core and they've got a like facial on all four sides um it looks a lot
better too yeah I want they really look like they're supporting yeah okay okay there's a house on Hugh Street and it uses a combination I we asked Murphy about it because I really liked it it has the flat cap on the top but then there is a Gothic piece that's on top sometimes you'll see the ball one yes sometimes and this one is the only time only house I've seen in Kate May that has it I asked him if they could make that because I thought it was pretty cool but he said no it looks like a custom job so when you're going down Hugh Street it's that first sort
of pinkish purple you're talking about a final on top of the on top of yes right and um I I did take some been taking I probably have a picture of every house in town by now but um but he said they you may you may add it in the future I really like it I wish I could have that but then I'd have to have John J make that that would really probably cost up the budget of bit okay so all right I'd like to suggest one more change to the fence you
said on the one side the fence has lattice at the top correct looking at the property on the South Side on the right that is existing yeah ex half the property is uh by our neighbor y or half the fence is by our neighborhood the other half is associated with our property that is only like three or four years old and that has a lattice top on it so it's probably like a 4ft fence and two feet of lattice yeah you can see it in the photog it's two feet well I was going to suggest that you continue that around
the house to have a uniformity because when you come around the other side and you're going to drop down to a 4ot fence it gives a natural change from you know the base up to the lattice at the top uh it doesn't have the wind resistance it doesn't say uh screw you neighbor uh you know stay out of my yard uh it it's well on the on the um North Side okay uh we're one back from
Sydney Street yeah okay so I think we're a little bit concerned about noise it's really nois there and they were also uh that's a two-story structure of main house and also a uh shed which I another structure which I think they use as an Airbnb right so to some level we we're trying to maximize privacy so let's ask a question completely sympathetic to your to your privacy we know our neighbors and we really like them and they wouldn't be they here's a question they wouldn't it's not a screw there would be some
logic at all based upon what you said a lot it's harder to paint too and and there and it's dog friendly next door too and we love dogs but they're always kind of coming around wanting to get to know us and you know we would kind of like to have a little bit of Separation so they're not coming in our yard for obvious reason so as a potential reconciler I'm wondering if um you would consider doing the solid fence on the back but on the other side the west side where you're putting in the new fence doing the the lattice fence to match the
twoot lattice top on the east side there would be some logic to that because the back is different than the sides I understand what you're saying which would then minimize the noise issue that you're talking about from behind the house well the that's not where the most noises oh that's the Washington Street side I mean we do hear Washington Street but we hear it Sydney Street which is where we really I know what's opposite of the other side and we went round and round with this believe me because we were going to do with the lattice but then as we've been there
more and more and are hearing the noise you know we've got one pane windows we're we're we're surrounded by Lafayette and Sydney you know it's really loud and also the deck of what Gary was describing of the B&B property of Judy's property in the back is like I mean a couple feet from our window really and there's people sitting on the deck right there you know with a table you know and it's different people all the time and she's going to that's going to be rented a lot this summer I'm
sure and it's like I said it's pet friendly there's people there we really do want to have a little bit of privacy we have talked to Judy already about our plans and she's cool with it yeah you can see that in the photographs here thanks for that oh yeah and also um now I don't know how much it's going to prevent this from happening but they there is bamboo growing there and you know how that can come to sprout I mean very easily and we've already got some of that growing in in our yard because it's spread
into Judy's property uh with that um garage next to us our fence so I don't know what the lattice is going to let through that The Stockade would prevent but I mean every little bit I think just helps so although I didn't start out wanting to have different fences it really wasn't my goal to do that but I just feel that it necessitates it just with the traffic and the privacy and the Airbnb and the dogs and everything else if you fight to keep the bamboo under control which is a battle it can
be the greatest privacy and soundproof thing you could ever do and I'm not against I think I agree I agree but I just know it's it's already coming it's dropping into our yard you know yeah it's like a cypress tree yeah we had went through several iterations of what we wanted on the back and side fences and ultimately we decided to go this route you for all the reasons she stated yeah um but definitely will on board that the 6in post Edition I don't see
any reason not to do that and also with the uh shower of closure we'll also switch that to 6inch posts to match you know so it'll be a aesthetically similar and structurally Sounder and the strength of those posts will pay off in the long time I'm glad you suggested it yep thank you Mr Tesa have questions or comments uh no I'm I'm I'm through the post and I respect your your desire for enhanced privacy
and sound blocking by the use of the full Stockade um without lattice so um close I I I would say that's your discretion and I wouldn't doubt your judgment on it thank you Janice um my only confusion is that this drawing doesn't look like shed okay and there's a very good reason for that I'm sure there is and and that reason is is um the drawing the more pretty drawing
one with is actually a more accurate representation of what we're purchasing whereas the uh drawing in your uh right hand there is a dimension drawing from the vendor of what uh the shed's actual dimensions are um which they don't customize for people right so that drawing in your right hand is uh 8 by 12 uh dimension drawing I think I marked
it up to indicate that scale yeah they didn't have the 8 by10 so that was yeah they wer unable to provide dimension drawing for an 8 by10 right so the the scale drawing is not is just kind of like the size of it it's it's scaled and dimensioned you just have to change a 12 to a 10 right but the 3D rendering of it in the yard that is scale that's what you're proposing the final product 18 that's your primary features of corre the
one you would like and then you have page 19 which is not preferred and it's a a rectangular door with um slided lights up at the top which look kind of weird so I agree the which part's weird Janice um well the the door on this one with the little lights at the top I oh with the lights at the top yeah now you like the one with the round yeah I mean I think it's better I I'm not a big
fan of these sheds but it's it's in your are it's for the property it's it's really a necessity because otherwise the bikes are and and we might point out that it is at the tiny shed that's that was built probably in the 80s custom designed um we have a key contributing property with no setbacks anywhere and The Sheds that we have were designed to go with our house and they have
the cedar roof and they're really cute they take some maintenance and then we have two sheds in our view shed which were put in without any approvals cool just what we love to hear I have a shed issue may I just ask you but yours is on your property it's it's contained by your fence yep and we're being careful with the setback and the only reason we're going with
an 8 by10 versus an 8 X12 is is proximity to trees okay and and for purposes of the record set bags I mean it's it's all compliant okay for purposes of the record what is the distance from the street to the shed oh oh gosh approximately hold on S plan yeah um so the property I can estimate off the top of my head I mean it's pretty far back and that's really where I'm going it's it's not it's not right in your face
it's an 8 by1 line right and that's where we're placing it I have a drawing that looks like this in the back and it says what I noted on there was 5T plus one or two to clear point I'm trying to make is it is it is distantly at the back corner as property you could put so an 8 by10 shed at that distance doesn't defend me Mr Ro the discussion we had on the phone this afternoon is null and voy correct okay thank
you yeah we took a second look at the trees and said no we just can't might be too close we didn't want it to get too close so to be clear just so we have consistent documentation that our field representative can use we're essentially actually quite literally deleting page 19 and 20 from your submission I want to say yes but now got to look at the pages and make sure 19 correct 20 is indicative
uh because that's a dimension drawing it's okay um I I would suggest we delete page 20 because it also shows you know yeah that's fine that's fine I t111 siding as opposed to clabber sighting yeah yeah yeah yeah that doesn't it's I'm going to put a big line through Page 20 and 19 great thank you okay so now you done yes are you sure yes Kevin no it's it's metal
proof it's going to be the clapboard horizontal style it's going to look like clapboard well as we discussed uh you indicated that um that the composite material was acceptable for a shed and as soon as you do that the lap became was originally our preferred option so we're going with that great stand
emate but not but not as the asbest shingle that we actually have right yeah if we only had clapboard we only could take the asbest off that may be a future effort can I make a suggestion yes yes yeah yeah no it's it's definitely um it's an LP I think they call it LP lap and it does
look like lap clapboard sting is the is the look we're going for the we are intending the colors to be similar to the house um yeah yeah in fact we're GNA paint it to match the house
okay I mean it it may it may well be if it does it'll need some kind of an encroachment agreement right I mean so so stay away from that if you can are your pins are your pins out there we
didn't see any well we had a proper marker surve pin your markers I personally don't know um I mean we had a survey done does it reference I you're looking at the place of beginning but it doesn't say how they began necessarily pin sets sometimes the the survey markers surveyors after they go out there and do your survey they'll leave their pins out there if they're they're not out there so the reason I say that is you're awfully closed to the what is actually your
front property line according to the survey your wood fence as it exists today is over the property line into the public RightWay so what you can do is if you can find the two Corner pins on the front you can have your fencing company you know you know locate those two front and then and then you can shift your fence so that it's on or within your property line is that is that a a zoning requirement to I mean your fence is supposed to be six in
behind the property line well no you can presumably you can put it on the property line but you what what I think what we're saying here is you shouldn't put it over the property line into the public right away because in some instances and our attorney can correct me but um there there usually can be there can be encroachment agreements that they' be necessary to have if if you do that so step it back so you're not in the public right away and and can it's usually six inches from the property line unless you get the consent
of the adjoining lot owner to put directly on in this case you could speak to the zoning officer about the placement of that fence on the property line rather than 6 in back got you because eventually we are looking at a porch addition to the property and the porch addition would violate current setback rules sure right so we're looking into what all that's entail with lot line averaging all this other Jazz this is something that the zoning board would pick up if you ever went into the application anyway because you'd have to provide A current survey it now
so you're you're you're probably best served by replacing that fence on the front along with the property line all right it's going to mess things up thank you for pointing that out Kevin so I think what I'm hearing is that the consensus that I'm hearing is that we are lining around approval with three conditions 6x6 fence posts everywhere and at the show mhm um the shed is depicted on page 18 thereby deleting
from your submission page 19 and 20 agreed and relocating the front fence to be within the property line okay agreed that's right so accurate it's so accurate would you like to make a motion no I wouldn't I would like someone else to if they I'll make that motion Mr Mr Carol's made the motion do I hear a second we give that to Janice so so moved by Mr Carol Ed by Miss Wilson strick okay Mr Carol yes
Miss Wilson stck yes Mr hammerin yes Mr Testa yes Mr Becker yes thank you thank you so much for your time we really appreciate good luck with all your projects thank you this has been so education really really appreciate it I I have the feeling you'll be back from time to time see the the fence issue was messing us up because we really want to put this front porch on and and that's going to be a problem now isn't it tell everyone it's not so bad no it's not
a problem so I wanted to make a suggestion if I may please and um about the sheds I'm driving all around the neighborhood today taking all kinds of pictures and all the windows and doors and Etc and I'm trying to see what kind of sheds everybody has but of course they can't can't go into people's backyards and I'm seeing all kinds of like Barn Barn shaped fences you know what I'm talking about you know in back of beautiful historic houses that were probably there free board you know and um I would
have to think they're contributing and so I'm trying to look at at at shed you know ideas and what's available and you know when you were saying sharing about yours and I think in the book The HPC book that I have that you have there does not really give any direction about sheds I don't know if that's something maybe to consider because I'm trying to do we're trying to do our own due diligence about every thing because we're not historians we're not Architects you know we want to
learn as much as we can and what we what's appropriate we want to do what's appropriate but we don't see anything in that manual and um I can't see we did see one um Victorian is um shed on Lafayette Street we didn't include that picture but it's very similar to what we wanted did did we is that in there okay so maybe a little time but um but anyway we I think that might be helpful to people yeah there's nothing in there I read it cover to cover there's
nothing about sheds and also just about architecture in general and um um I just think it'd be great to get something started that would be an informational kind of session for people that are homeowners whether it's contributing or not just about Kate May architecture that would be helpful I don't know in general a different sub topics but that's just me thank you you're appreciate because I want to learn as much as I can and it'd be
great to learn from you guys okay all right okay press my off button welcome to the neighborhood I live about two and a half blocks down from you on Lafayette so thank you folks than thanks for coming by so opening it up to public comment however there is no public unless you guys would like to make another comment I okay okay so closing the
um the formal part of the submission components of this meeting couple things as you all know we have a we've agreed to meet from 10 to two next Thursday In This Very Room um I'll be providing food so the one thing I I'll send out an email about all this by the way um to give it a little little background Janice and um J and I have formed a little subcommittee to co-design
this workshop and um we've had two hour and a half calls we have one more to go um we've identified what the real purpose of this is what the outcomes we're seeking and all we need to do now is work out the agenda and then what do we need to prepare for it with a stuff and food and all that um so with that said I have except for do I have everybody two three four five people missing so has
let me ask it this way has everybody identified their chosen sub not me Judy we give this to you and you're only allowed to have one so what I'm going to do is I'm also going to bring some sort of side thing like chips or something um but what I'm holding is that everybody bring their own beverage because beverages get complicated know sugar and soda and like all that sort of stuff right um caffeine so please bring your own beverages whatever
you prefer any questions about that okay um two other things and then I'm I'm I'm pretty much done with what I would like to chat about and that is on March 15th there's going to be I think a really cool Workshop that I would like to encourage all of us to attend if possible um and it is a a primmer for historic preservation Commissioners and planners so Judy would you like to say word about this this is up
in Moors um morst toown um sure uh I happen to know um from last year's Statewide conference uh I sat at a round table and a wonderful session and two women were there from moristown and they uh were very delighted that I was from Cap May and as you know we have a fabulous reputation Statewide uh they they are wanting to start a CLG there um and I believe they're holding this in mortown for that reason so it might
be interesting to see what how far they've gotten what they're doing how they've approached their Council um and Andrea tingy will be there from the state to present and I'm not I don't know a whole lot more besides that uh it looks very interesting yeah by the way after we spoke today it I'm available that day I do want to go because I think that would be a good opportunity for anybody who wants to go to meet and be in a personal relationship or
open one up with Andrea um because Andrea will be coming in the spring at some point during which we'd like to give her the revised Mac tour that's being created um as well as um maybe even attend one of our we talked about a session that we might do together with her and go to lunch with her and you know ask her to look at several of our projects to get her assessment as to whether or not you know particularly ones that we're maybe not as happy with with as we'd like to be and I think in particular we're talking about new construction well scale issues
we'd like to find out um if things we've approved and are built in the field would still be contributing additions large additions to the back and side um if we're if we're losing the status of contributing I think I think we' we'd want to know from the state you know why and so we could avoid that so we'll talk about this more but um if anybody has any ideas about any particular projects that you'd like Andrea
to review and assess for us give her give us feedback in terms of her assessment please let us know and Judy will capture that um the only other thing about yeah it's from it's on a Saturday Judy sent an email out about this right yeah I think I forwarded it to everyone yeah yeah and then following up on that is the is the Statewide chipo conference um on June 4th the 5th I think again it would be really good if we had representation there from as many people as
possible even if it's just one day and Judy you've already sent that no no there's not enough information about it yet I went on their website and they don't even have an agenda yet no but the dates you should save the dates um the city is happy to pay for your uh conference registration fee um oh speaking of which we spoke with Paul today about that'll be in Burlington city so not as like last year was Jersey city that was really a lot so in terms of our budget the city
manager um clarified for us today that they would pay the registration fees the city would pay the registration fees from our budget but not Transportation or housing or lodging if we or and there goes the bus so we're not buying dinner on the city I know Tom we'll figure out another approach okay um lastly the only other thing I'd like to mention is my hope is that as of next Thursday after next Thursday um I don't want to predict it but I'm thinking that one of the primary
objectives of that day is to build all of our will to really jump in and participate here and I'm hoping likely that it'll be followed up by at least one if not two more workshops where we can start to identify clear activities because next Thursday is not about we don't think at least we're not designing it this way to be about what is HPC going to do it's more going to be focused on Bel philosophies and principles what's our real purpose and
how we get there as opposed to prioritizing activities for 2025 and 26 which Judy and I have started to create a a long list that we have to organize into what's a priority but I'd like to do that with all of you so if you have any ideas about what you think are priorities for this commission to engage over the next couple of years please send them to me okay all right I'm done how about anybody else John yeah um Judy sent along with
other things a uh question for a a questionnaire that she would like to see an awful lot of people do in the city of k b about water consumption yes please talk about that it's 16 pages long and I cannot imagine many people in Cape May taking the time to do this even if us incredibly loyal people decided to do it if they really want to get a wide range of responses I think this thing could be
vastly uh cut down it's l do you have any any any information about that because I saw it too well I I I went through it yeah and it's like you're going to M multiple tests to every falset in your house I had how many times the same thought when I saw that I thought who is going to want to do I honestly thought somebody got out of control it's I mean maybe somebody in solitary confinement would have time to you know do that but I just
that was funny can't see many people doing that so Judy what any any thoughts about that I didn't even open it I just I was so busy today do you know that's half the battle right there just open it and we you get to it is it is prodigious I I can look into it a little further I think that was one that was the one thing that was on yes Columbia University but it can't be that extensive you respons us I'll
look into it a little further because it was it was a resolution that we approved um so okay okay well that's why I was wondering if there was any further those Ivy League schools who would that be colia it was columia well that explain never mind so I actually I when I I perused it I didn't look at it in detail I actually thought it was pretty good and it was really building the will for folks actually engage going to every faucet because if we're really concerned about
water conservation you any idea how many faucets that would in your house like 477 but the city does do a portion of that currently they do okay they act yes they do because they want to make sure that they're testing in different areas so that is being done um they test usually early in the morning um yeah so so they are doing a minimally but nothing to this extent yeah yeah what they even say what what what was your
water bill last year the year before I mean they've got all those records am I got to go through all my old bills to look up those things just get get that out yeah okay well they they that probably explains it yeah there you go so any other comments or questions or items for discussion I have one um I know we were
we talked about uh the HPC Awards um and then the the committee are we willing to continue with that that's a great question so lurine I have a a list I'm compiling a list that Judy and I have started to go through of it's it's sort of a wish list of all the things that are on our agenda to do things like getting hisor District map approved getting the bylaws revised getting the
Design Awards moving um and I'd even like to throw out that we Nam them the carollyn pits Awards but anyway um whatever that committee let's let's reconvene that committee so um how how would you like to proceed with that because we have a standing committee already right we do there's there are four of us onon that committee so it's you and Jake and Janice and pip yes no pip um she respect oh and Judy Judy yeah
so what do you guys think I would love to say please proceed and then we can talk about it every month as you give us an update how you want what what you're seeing and how you want to move forward with this how about we um resend the documents that we currently have M and just everybody look at it again um Redline it uh and then then we can take it from there at that point did you get coms we even got to that point excuse me I think they made a
presentation without you did make the I remember sending you comments but I don't know if you got comments there were very few that that uh but I I think we would really like to see comments could you please send that out to all of us again that'd be great yep and is there any did you guys after the discussions that we had this minimal well I wasn't there that night but the discussions that you had would there be anything that you would like to um revise from what you had submitted before or not I think that's why we're we're
looking for comments okay I mean you know and then you know we can we can reconvene as a committee um and then you know then come back with a final document at that point thanks for bringing that up it'd be great if we could get that thing rolling again okay yeah okay your free any other comments items for discussion concerns questions wishes
loves set them on over okay well hearing none do I hear a a motion to adjourn motion to adjourn the meeting Mr chairman so adjourn I vote no