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Video-1: youtube.com/watch?v=D5g9LZlhY3k

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Um, I call the May 13 city council um special meeting to order. Madame clerk, will you please call the role? >> Council pleasure here. Councilor Asher >> here. Councelor Payne >> here.

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>> Councelor Smith >> here. >> Mayor White >> here. Uh um today um special um session is to discuss the state of homelessness in Charlottesville. The work session u we won't have a public comment for this um

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but we will um have a um lot lots of questions and information. So I turn it over. >> Oh yes. I'm sorry. Yes. Um is there let me see >> location and reason for

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>> Miss um Astran um Vice Vice Mayor Ashin will you please confirm your um location and um >> yes um I'm in Minneapolis for a conference. >> Okay, thank you. We won't be voting on anything today but glad you could join

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us. Um, is there >> I would move that we allow our participation remotely. >> Second. >> Okay. Um, all in favor, please say yes. >> Yes. >> All the post, please say no. >> Right. Welcome, Natie. Um, and uh, so do

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I turn it over to you? >> So, good evening, mayor, counselors, uh, members of the public. Uh this work session uh was really a desired by me specifically u as one who has to take action and move on all the different

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things that are floating around and turning them into what the actions will ultimately be. um felt it necessary that from our May 4th briefing uh that was the actual state of homelessness report from our providers um that that conversation we ran out of time that

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there was still what appeared to be questions that we needed to uh review and I believe we're all of the mindset that since that meeting all the various discussions and touch points that we may have received from the members of the public there are still questions uh and ideally the intent is that we can use

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this two-hour block to get through more of those if not all of those. That would be my preference. Uh and then we can hopefully walk from this room with an understanding of any specific takeaways and actions that need to be moved on. Uh

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that would be the desire. I have a few slides that I'm going to walk you through and I'm not going to complete it because I also have uh a request from our providers to speak about a certain set of topics. Uh, so we're going to do that because ultimately that's what I intended to do was to open this up for

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what questions actually exist so that we can make sure that nothing leaves this room unanswered if that is the desire for everyone present. All right, so next slide. I'm framing this conversation today about what have we heard. Uh there's

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just a couple of items that I want to highlight from what I believe we all agree that we heard whether it be from the presentation on the fourth as a part of the vision for holiday drive presentation that was also received by council and myself as well as ongoing

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conversations that have just been occurring whether it be with the city with nonprofits or just the public at large. Just wanted to make sure that we again set the table with what we all can hopefully agree that we have heard and then I will ask a different question.

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Next slide. So we've heard that affordable housing shortage feeds homelessness. I think we all can agree that we understand that and appreciate what role that plays. That rising rents lead to rising evictions. That is a phenomenon that is not new for any community, but it is a stark uh issue for us here in this

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community because it tends to lead to homelessness because the costs are so significant and moving from one place to the next after an eviction is very very difficult and that behavioral health gaps exist for unhoused which speaks to a need for continued investment uh in

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that space. Next slide. We have 200 people in need of emergency shelter today. And based on some of the reporting that we have seen and we know that those numbers vary, 246 people accessed P poschum shelter this past season and 433 unique guests are were

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served at the Haven. So that's an indication of what is the scope of the issue that this community faces right now. Next slide. Pajum offers and I my numbers might be a little bit off because I didn't do a whole lot of verifying because I was just trying to pull some things

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together. But Pum offers 50 cold weather shelter beds and I'm going to invite Cameron Shayla and Owen to correct me on anything and the major as well, but that number is different. We can confirm that as well. The Center for Hope will expand shelter beds from 55 to 110. I do know

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that I made that error. And that the lowberry shelter as presented today uh will potentially bring forward 83 new shelter beds. That's just more or less speaking to our ability from a sheltering capacity. How do we address the scope of problem that we saw on the slide previously? Next slide.

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[clears throat] And then what is really stark uh as something that I think we all need to appreciate that our issue is clear. It is evident and it is requiring a response. If there are 498 individuals

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on our by name list in 2023, that number is now at 703. that speaks to a need to do something different, something deeper, something more targeted, something more specific. And I think that is really what I believe that we have all heard through the indications

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of where we are. And the questions are what do we do? What are those things? How do we do them? Who does them even? I think that is what's important for us to not lose sight of. And then the last slide is what's missing? And I think that's

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the question that I would like to just pose in the form in in the this particular arena for what are the questions that we still have as it relates to what we've discussed. I could have added more slides and gone a lot deeper into that and I didn't want to. I

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chose not to do that because this is meant to be a conversation. This is not a decision-making uh engagement. There's no vote. There is nothing that will be finalized. I can tell you from the city's perspective, there is no announcement tonight. So, anyone who came looking for one, that's not what

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we're doing. The goal is to truly try to make sure that we can identify what questions may still exist and how best we can answer those if we can today or that becomes a part of the takeaway. And that is really what I will shift into note-taking mode because that's where I

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am at right now is to try to capture what are the things that we want to walk away from this evening focused on doing talking about researching and being able to come back for further conversation uh as we identify what actionable steps we can implement.

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So I'm going to stop there. Uh Remy, if you take that down u and again I know that we have some specific areas that are you saying you're prepared to talk about these? Is that what you're saying? Okay, great. We can we can go into

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discussion points about the COC and the city relationship holiday drive encampments and just the COC structure. That's basically what we have framed out is being able to discuss um I guess if you want to present anything. Sure. Yeah.

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>> Or talk about those things first and then have questions. >> Yeah. Maybe I'll just like lay out sort of the general framework. So when we gathered questions from counselors in advance and then questions we received during the work session last Monday and follow-up conversation since then we we

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really heard three major concerns buckets areas of concern. These are items four, five and six. And then from the CFC's perspective probably one of our biggest concerns is uh number three. So our proposed framework is that we

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spend a discrete amount of time tackling each of these topics. Um the COC has come with observations about the state of things. We would love to hear from city councilors and city staff about how y'all are seeing these discreet issues. And then at the you know towards the end of each of these times we want to

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identify capture the action items that the city's walking away responsible for that the COC is walking away responsible for and the ones that we're sharing together. Um, does that seem like a good framework for our time? >> I just want to make sure you said number

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three. Were you referring to number three on this list? >> I'm sorry. Yes. Yes. Yes. On the on the agenda. So, these times seem approximately appropriate for the scope of what the city's coming with. >> Yeah, seems reasonable.

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>> Okay. Um, and then Sam, are you willing to capture all the action steps and recap this at the end? I have all sections ready to go. >> Great. So, I hear I'm started to keep us on time. Um >> and um >> yeah, hopefully we don't need all of the time.

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>> That'd be amazing, but unlikely. >> Okay. Um >> Oh, wait. Natalie has a question. I don't think I have whatever number sheet you're looking at. >> You don't have a way to send it to, do you? >> Is that possible? >> Yeah, I'll I'll send it to you.

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>> Awesome. Thank you so much. Yeah, thanks. >> Okay, great. [clears throat] Um, so I I'll kick off number three. Um, and again, this is, you know, from the CSC's perspective. I

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think this is the issue sort of a structural issue that impacts all of the others and it's how are the city city staff the COC agencies and city council uh communicating with each other updating each other on what progress is

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being made. Um in in our observation, we were working really closely, really well with the city through phase one of the low barrier shelter design project, through phase two of the low barrier shelter design project, and then we we uh had a you know the presentation on

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March 25th to to you all in this room. Um and walked away without clear action steps of who was owning what next. And then there were no touch points for the next month and a half. And I do think that that resulted in a lot of confusion. Um and so

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um the first thing that we would love to address is what are the structured touch points that we need between the COC and city staff and and city council if city council is able to participate in some of those touch points and if city council members are not what's the best

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communication on like a monthly basis to update uh city council about those um touch points? I guess from the COC's perspective, we would like to request by monthly meetings with city with one rep from the city, one decision maker from

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the city um who who city manager appoints as their um representative and we would love to have one uh city council member as well present for those meetings. So, you're saying touch points

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on the status of the Lberry shelter or everything on this list? >> Everything on this list. >> And you say a month? >> Uh, I said I said twice a month. >> Twice a month. Okay. >> What you said was by monthly. >> I'm sorry. Yeah. Twice a twice a month.

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I'm sorry. >> Yes. So, every two weeks or sounds even better for me. [clears throat] >> So, um because that that sounds about right, >> right? Yeah. >> Okay. Um, >> Owen, do you mind just for the public to tell them what a COC is? And thank you.

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>> I'm very sorry. >> No, no, you're good. >> Jay, you wanted to >> Sure. The COC stands for continuum of care. So, Brack, the Blue Ridge Area Coalition for the Homeless is the continuum of care or COC lead agency, which means we're the backbone support agency for the direct services providers

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uh represented at the table. So, Patchcha, the Haven, um, a few other service providers in the community. We apply for federal funding through HUD for homeless services. Um we apply for state funding through DHCD or the department of community housing and development um on behalf of the direct

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service providers and we we do data quality data management um providing lots of policy and procedure to make sure it's consistent across the board. >> Thank you. So, so I kind of made our COC observations and then I jumped to the request for the action item, but would

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love to create space for city staff to give your perspective on, you know, what since March if that's accurate, right? Were we working closely together through the phase two and then what from your end went uh how did we find ourselves in

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different places? I'll offer that the the basis of where we are post the presentation of the vision for Holiday Drive is that um [clears throat] there has been continued work on the city side post that presentation because the requested

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deliverable was produce prepare and produce a presentation of a vision. You did that council received that. Uh what was presented is still a very costly operation vision and there has been

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considerable engagement with our philanthropic leads um CACF and BAMWorks identifying how we can go about raising those funds which was shared as a part of this conversation that the city's acquisition of 2000 Holiday Drive for

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$6.2 $2 million was as far as we could go in the setup of this vision coming to life and that we would say that number one >> 6.2 2 million was the purchase >> the purchase of holiday drives. So that was as far as we could go and our engagement in the conversations that we

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had was are we confident that we could raise that money locally whatever the vision cost at that time we were not sure that number came in with the three options that were provided by the loaria shelter group. Um I think everyone still felt that those numbers were high not

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that you did anything wrong in that they were just high. Uh and the question was because we also know that the Salvation Army as of yesterday announcing officially their capital campaign, but needing to also raise a significant number of dollars to make sure that the

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expansion could happen that those two moments happening at the same time for tension. And the question was whether or not we had confidence that this community would actually rise to that specific occasion. Um it wasn't that that's an indictment on would we part

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with the monies that is needed. It was just a question of could that amount of money for this one issue be dedicated at this time. So there's been a lot of ongoing conversations in that regard. There have been a number of questions and concerns about how do we pay for it

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alternatively if it's not only philanthropic. there has been engagement of UVA in addition to what uh was presented as a part of the vision that was presented by the uh low area shelter group to see is their interest in their u spending dollars on this. Uh we heard

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a number of responses so there's still work to be done in that space. So I I can acknowledge that yes there hasn't been further engagement uh and that was not um a knock or slight in any way that was we received the vision that was requested and we now we're working that

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vision. In addition to that there have been considerable internal conversations this team and others that are in the room have all been a part of how do we look at this particular issue as what is our way for operationalizing a city response. I think I've heard from these

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five individuals that we can't continue to not be a part more actively a part of the response and then the question is what does that look like? So we have not uh gotten to a place of being able to say that we know exactly what that looks like at this present time but she's

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sitting next to me because she's helping me figure some things out. So I can honestly acknowledge that that work is ongoing and we even met this week and have met how many times you've seen me in the past month now but we are digging into this because I think um the

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acknowledgement is mutual that we need to strengthen the connection and I think that's really what the focus is. >> Two two quick questions in response to that. Um well one's an observation but we have a number of identified touch points that

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we would love to you know find places for city staff and and COC to work on these discrete projects. Um and then um on the funding side um I I know that the state uh was interested in funding the

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Salvation Army Center of Hope project. Um has there been any engagement with state um senator representatives to forward that >> always? Yes. Okay. >> Confidently. Yes. >> Great. >> Um but there's no guarantee at this moment with the budget state budget

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being stuck. We are not receiving any confidence of what that's going to end up >> coming out to be. Um, I have continually um inquired about it because I have also wanted to make sure and I'll say it again publicly that I wanted to make sure that we expressed the support for

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the Salvation Army's capital campaign from the city's perspective. Um, because it was also communicated to me publicly that some thought that because we started activating this conversation about the low barrier shelter that that meant somehow we did not support the Salvation Army's expansion. It is both

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things that we are very much uh in support of uh because again as you look at the slide and the scope of our our needs, we know that we need both of those things and then some. So I'll say that again. This is not all that we have to work on to address this issue. Um we

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have to continue to do more than that. So I think that's um we can continue to cross our fingers and hope that out of the budget session we get something that lands and sticks. Um, but there's nothing that I've been given in the way of confidence that we will get anything. >> I I spoke with Senator Deeds today and

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he basically said don't expect anything until the end of June. >> Yeah. And that's the latest that I've heard is that we should not expect that the budget will come together by then. So that that impacts a number of things that we've been monitoring including this. >> Thank you. >> Um, city staff have thoughts on the

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cadence of touch points with the COC and who should be present at those? I think there's conversations that we probably need to have in that I know that we have city staff that are a part of B and I think we probably need to associate what other meetings need to happen in conjunction with those.

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>> Um [clears throat] I'll I said I told Misty I wasn't going to continually refer to her, but she's got to help me figure that out. >> I wonder if we could circle back to that one at the end because again we'll be identifying a number of like working groups that staff of different levels we'd like to invite into.

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>> Sure. Thank you. Any other thoughts on COC city touch points or communications? >> I guess I would ask the question of council in regards to a counselor participating. Um

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what is your take on that as a need and a volunteer? >> So um go ahead Jen. No, I'm just saying I'm I think it's a good um I think it's good to be included in those conversations and it again it can

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calibrate. Maybe now when it's most acute you need council support and then as it gets rolling you don't um and I'm willing to volunteer for that if you know that was it. >> I'm happy to defer. So, yeah. So, th those bi-weekly those

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those meetings that we have every two weeks. Um um yeah, so if you could, you know, let us know when it is. Sounds like um Jen would be happy to represent council on that because um this is an an issue not

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just an encampment just the housing affordability issue in general is something that we um get a lot of emails on on a daily basis starting first thing in the morning and through um like I don't know 10 minutes ago you know it's

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something that that the the public because it's so it's so visible it's so evident and So, um, and I'm glad that we have the the capacity hopefully to address it. So, um, that's that's what that, you know, that's what I tell the public, you know, that we it's

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difficult, but we're working at it. So, >> then I guess one one more follow-up question. It's awesome, Jen. That's an incredible commitment to be part of the group. um as far as sharing the info that you have with the rest of the counselors so that you have the most up-to-date information so that when someone is asking you what is the

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response, you can have a full informed, you know, response. H how how does that update work? Generally speaking, we can do that via email post the meeting um and just um make sure

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that the my report out matches the minutes um or have that be reviewed in some way. But that might be I'm spitballing, but that might be the most efficient. We don't have an official mechanism for that, but that might be an uh the easiest way for us to keep on track with that.

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>> Sounds great. >> Yeah. Yeah. We're very, you know, um, engaged, um, council and so we let each, you know, um, if we need to know something, we may ask Sam, but Sam always responds to, I may ask a

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question, but, he responds to all five of us type of thing. So, we um, but um, um, I've never felt like I don't know what the H is going on. Um u this is just a really a small community but it's

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very connected and you know although um Michael informed us something because I was out of town this weekend I didn't realize that there was a a fire um at one of the encampments I didn't know that I just just got back in town. So um but usually I I usually know what's

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going on. I'll say that there's there should be no concern about making sure that council receives any um notes from any conversations that are had because they will be shared. That is part of the process when I reference operationalizing this from the city's perspective. That would be one of the

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liberals. And then um are you envisioning um like a group where there's like secretary that's taking meeting minutes that are reported out afterwards or in the past we've done workg groupoups that

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were um recorded and accessible at least over zoom. Um I don't know what kind of what kind of you're thinking is >> I'm thinking zoom because the AI like note takingaking companion is pretty decent and it can be recorded for review. So we can do both those functions. Yeah, I know. I think either way it

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could work. I know in the past um there was some like zooms where like it was not publicly accessible sometimes. I think it was like a criminal justice work group where it was public facing even though not all counselors were at every meeting. I don't know if there's

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any perspective on kind of what the right approach is. I don't have strong opinions either way, but yeah, that I propose a Zoom meeting that's recorded and shared, but the city has other, you know, wants to do a different format.

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>> All right, I think that's number three and we've almost we're within our 15 minutes. So, thank you. Um, gonna hand off to Shayla for the holiday drive um portion. So, we've got 30 minutes aotted for that. Thanks. Um, so as Owen mentioned, uh,

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after our March 25th presentation to the council, we were at a a waiting point where we were hoping to get some kind of feedback from city council. And so, um, there weren't any really clear action steps for either party that were identified, I think, in that meeting. And so um what we have proposed is that

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um we we have some kind of operational plan that we draft for the C on behalf of the COC so that you all are aware of what we're trying to work with the programming we hope to operate within Holiday Drive and that would also include a budget that's very detailed per agency. But on the city's

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perspective we were hoping to have someone be assigned as a project manager on behalf of the city and maybe this is where Christy Graves comes in um or some other position. I know there's some other talks about other projects to to be tackled. Um, but someone who's devoting a certain number of hours per

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week to the holiday drive project to see that move forward. We were hoping that you all could at least vote on design options that we presented at March the March 25th meeting. We do have updated figures for the phase one option one design um that we've shared with Sam and we can share

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with city council as well if that hasn't been shared with you yet. Uh but if we have those parameters to work with, we have a solid design plan to move forward, then we can talk about what type of programming will be in that design phase. We also were hoping to get building code official review and approval for the

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interim use of 2000 Holiday Drive. There are some organ my organization at least B was hoping to move into Holiday Drive and have bigger office space and operate out of that versus city space where we're already getting a little cramped. And as you know, we had to review or

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revise our leasing um agreement with you all to expand to to four employees. So, we're hoping to get interim use uh voted on and approved by the building code official. Um we could also use that space for some temporary interim classes or courses for our clients and guests.

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Um not talking about a designated campground at that point. We're that's way down the line, but we could at least use that building for some interim uses for office space. So if we could get those two things voted on or moved forward by council that would be greatly helpful for us.

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>> So I I actually have to have a project kind of project leader vote on a um desired design and whether you can have interim use. Um so those three things. So you mean like at um I'll get you one

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second Natalie. I got you. Um at a future >> Reese um a near future council meeting. >> Got it. Natley, >> hey there. Thanks. Thanks, Shayla. Um you mentioned just now the designated

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campground space is something not on the table right now, potentially future down the line. Um, this might be jumping ahead to our encampment section, but um, why is it not something that we want to think about sooner?

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>> I think that is something we want to talk about when we get to the encampment piece, but we recognize that Holiday Drive might be limited in its capacity right now. And so that could be an option. Um, but I think for more immediate use, just using it as an office space for now and then talking

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through what that would look like for a designated campground. >> So, kind of like low tier, lowhanging fruit to use it as an office space for you all. It's not that it's down the line, but it's a more complicated conversation. >> Exactly. Yes. >> Okay, great. Thank you.

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>> Um, another thing we would like to do with the city in collaboration with us is to engage the holiday drive businesses. I don't think there's been much communication, at least not on behalf of the COC. We definitely want to involve them in these conversations because they will be affected um in some way by having additional traffic on that

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road. That's something that that the COC is happy to take point on if the city prefers or happy to defer to the city on that. That's like a shared action step. And >> so thank you. That is some, you know, um when we um voted on

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this matter back in September, we did get many of the businesses to come out and you know, we hadn't, you know, the course of my time keeping up with council and really never had them that engaged to come out. Of course, this

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would be something to do that. Um I had, you [clears throat] know, I had been thinking about like how are we going to to do that? So, um I had no I have no thoughts on it. I I don't know if other counselors have any thoughts on on that, but as you're thinking about that, um we also need to

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think about like and maybe Sam, it's a question for you as far as our agenda. Um how we're going to address the the questions of the project leader. Um the um you know, I haven't seen apparently

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some new numbers out. I haven't seen them yet and and maybe in some emails that I haven't had time to look at yet that which design and voting on the interim use of the space. And so I guess over the next, you know, few months or

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as soon as we can discuss it, get that information together so we can get, you know, if that's something that we as a council want to do. U Mike, I don't know if others want to chime in now. >> [clears throat] >> Well, I'm curious just right now, what

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is the structure of um how frequently meetings happen around holiday drive and who's part of that work group or steering committee? Is there currently like staff representation on that or that's a great question. So, you know, the way that the CSC is thinking about

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it is that at this point, the the renovation and the, you know, that aspect of getting the building ready to move in, we understand is in the city's court. We're happy to assist in the design however we can. Um, what we're working on is

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figuring out how our three organizations are going to colllocate there. And so we have begun monthly tri board ED meetings to I mean it's you know the operational plan of holiday drive is one topic that

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we're discussing but on a higher level we're discussing the structure of the COC and that's actually our our last sort of discussion item. So that's really where our heads and our focuses have been since March 25th. Um, and at [clears throat] this point, at least from my perspective, one of, if not the

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hardest challenges is, you know, once it's open as a a year-round lowbear shelter, there'll have to be 247 staffing, significant increase in case managers, number of staff that will be extremely hard to figure out how to um,

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uh, sustainably fund. Is there any um sustained conversation around kind of that fundraising challenge or like finding new permanent year- round revenue sources? >> I would say that is a subset of the

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bigger question that we are that we we have to figure out what is the structured relationship between the the organizations before we can go to funders and say this is what we're doing. Um, we also need, you know, a clearer. So, there's an order of operations and we're not at that

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fundraising step yet. >> Okay. >> But again, as we said on March 25th, we think that there's great potential in reimagining the COC, asking this question, what is the most effective

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structure for our COC given the fact that we're trying to level up our response in a significant way. Um and we we think there's a lot of interest in the community for solutions. This is a critical piece the strategic part of what is the COC structure critical piece

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of that narrative. Um so again we are looking towards um being in a place a year from now where we can articulate a narrative to the community that people will be excited to get on board with as volunteers, as funders, as community partners. So that that's something that

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is really continues to be exciting for the COC as we work through these sort of structural conversations. >> And that makes sense. I think part of it is it's just an inherently very difficult challenge to do something that's different and big. Um so it's

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inherently not going to be easy. Um I guess the final question is just to return. You said to something you said earlier. So you would hope sooner rather than later to get clear direction from city council on what design choice and

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then have a staff point person. Is there anything else that you feel like you're waiting on from either from city council in terms of direction or decisions? >> Yes. So just to clarify, so we would love for city council to vote on the design option or set new design

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parameters if you're finding that the cost is too expensive or some other parameter is out of line and we're happy to do a third phase of design based on those new parameters. Um so that that's probably the most critical step for council. Um

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I I um the project manager piece, you know, this is sort of an an internal city. I I guess we had um our our brainstorming and again happy to use this as an opportunity for

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feedback. Um but having a point person for holiday drive as a discrete project um either internal city staff or a funded COC position who's devoting we're not sure how many hours a week that is frankly because we don't know kind of

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the city procurement like um is this a full-time position? Is this a 10-hour a week position? We just don't know from our vantage point. But he do think that this project would benefit from someone assigned to project manage pushing forward the A&E design procurement part

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of this project. Okay. >> Um so that's the second request. The third hopefully the lowest hanging fruit is the building code right >> review. Um the fourth would be to have an engagement plan. How do you all want to engage the businesses on Holiday

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Drive? Cityled, COC, happy to go either way. happy to support but but we've glad to be part of those conversations as well. Um there is a fifth identified action that's Haven specific which is that um

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um the Havens board passed a resolution shortly before the fifth presentation explaining what conditions we are saying we're really excited about holiday drive excited to be a you know stakeholder in this project. there are conditions that we need to be met before Holiday Drive

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is open and operational before we can um move in. So, we do need um Haven leadership needs to meet with city staff to share that board decision and the conditions and then begin that conversation about how we move that ball forward. So, >> what are those conditions?

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>> Um I I I can send you the the proposal, but um it's addressing transportation. um they're drawn from the presentation that we gave as far as like what are the critical what are the what are the areas of concern right that we had when we did

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our feasibility study. So the one question that I I can't pinpoint uh where I got this impression but I have been under the impression that there was some fundamental agreement

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that you all the three of you need to come to before the design phase gets finalized. that there was some difference in the way in which certain things might get designed depending on different decisions that have to be made

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by you all. And so there's sort of a a putting the cart before the horse, which one's the heart, which card, which one's the horse, uh to figure out whether there is if if you all are in a position to simply say, you know, the the

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whatever issues there may be between either differences in the way that you operate or uh I mean, I I don't remember what it was. I thought at one point that that the agreement that the the area of disagreement dealt with something that would manifest

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itself in a different way that the space would be configured. Is that not the case? >> Yeah, that that's not the case. In terms of like methodology, we are all housing first and in terms of ours defined by the National Alliance in Homelessness.

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In terms of methodologies and approach, there's a difference because we offer different services versus night shelter versus day shelter. You know, there's differences in terms of that, but there's nothing impending in terms of this overarching thing that's going to prevent us from being able to work together. As Owen shared earlier, our

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executive committees and the EDS are meeting collaboratively. Our next meeting is on May 26. Uh, and that is again to continue that fine-tuning of when holiday drive is open uh for this to be a smooth selling effort. Okay, good.

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>> I'll offer that. I think the reflection is tied to that that hasn't always been the case. >> So, I think this is movement and I think that's just the recognition of that because we we know that there has been at times it hasn't been that move. Uh so that's just naming it for what it is.

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I'm going to go back through your list um as well and just speak to some specifics. Um the first reference was no clear action steps following the pres presentation. That is correct because the request was the visual the visioning that exercise was completed. So there

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should be no expectation of anything until decision has been made to move forward. Um I I want to confirm did I hear that you have an operating plan? >> No, we're going to be working >> you're working on an operating plan. Okay. I have, you'll see in the final

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slide that I'll show you when we're done that I tried to predict where this was going to go. Like to try to make sure I know what I'm doing. Uh so when I put that slide up, you'll see the reference to that. But the operational plan, I would agree. We definitely would like to see that is important for us to be able

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to get our hands on an understanding of the budget. I know Cameron has reached out to me specifically wanting to discuss the patch budget. So we're going to make sure we prioritize that. Um because in the presentation I do believe there was still confusion that remained in that what was presented appeared to

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be each organization's budget versus what was needed for the operations of Holiday Drive. So I think that distinction needs to be really highlighted and identified. Uh and there needs to be a touch point of clarity as to and the ask from each organization to

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the city is what because that did not ring true in the presentation. a dollar amount of what was uh being identified and I think I have heard that from council as well. Um >> just to clarify the second one um sort of the aggregated budget versus because

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again when we made the presentation the assumption was we are remaining three separate organizations. >> So >> what wasn't clear in that is that it appeared as though each individual budget was presented as what it costs to operate today. The request from the city

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is for you to colllocate at Holiday Drive. The question is, and what is it that you are asking the city to contribute financially to making that happen? That did not stand out as an answered question. >> I think again to this is back to uh

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councelor Payne's observation. It's going to take us a while until we can identify what are the gaps in the fundraising after we do our internal what are the other places we can raise funds from. So it just seems like it it

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is going to be a while before we have a clear sense of what the operational gap is that we need to fill whether from the city or from other sources. >> Sure. >> So >> I think that's part of the work. I think that's the clarity that's needed. Yeah. We I would venture to say that it's hard

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to make a commitment that we're going to work with funding agencies to raise six to9 million dollars to produce a space that we don't know if we can afford to fund. So there has to be some working through of that notion because the

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assumption has always been when I pitched this to council as the pursuit of this building would be $6.2 million. I said we're not paying for the upfit, but you need to be ready to pay for operations. That was not meant in any

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way to them as in total, but the question is what share of that? It's a fair question for you to even ask is what I'm saying as well. So having the clarity of that is important because as the manager of the budget, I need to know that too

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>> and to be able to time that of course so that it falls in line. And so, Owen, what I understand what you all are saying is that you all are just, you know, trying to answer all our questions and deal with this. You really haven't had time with your different organizations to go back and and

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determine like we don't know what this change, how this change is going to impact our fundraising, what we typically do and things. So, we don't know how much money we'll be able to bring to the table. Is that what I'm hearing? Um well I I I guess just to speak from the

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Haven's perspective because again we all have our budgeting processes but if we're talking about three years in the future um >> budgeting I'd shorten that. >> Okay. So so this is another [clears throat] again knowing what is the what is the

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timeline that we're working on shifts the urgency based on our you know sort of the information that we've gotten from our sources. We're hearing two to three years. But if this but if there's other information, we absolutely need that. Um, and I guess I I would put a

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pin in the budget conversation and add that to the last item as far as like action items coming away for the COC. So >> that's what I'm highlighting is that's exactly what I'm suggesting is that the operating plan, the budget, uh, yes, those are those are important matters.

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>> Um, referencing a project manager to be identified, that is part of this ongoing conversation. And I think that is where we have to determine how best to do that. I'm not sure that we will meet equally on what we suggest a project

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manager to be and do in this moment. That is still to be determined. But I agree that dedicating a connection between the low barrier shelter group is what I will I guess we can maybe stop saying that and just say the COC. That probably makes sense. the COC and the

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city directly establishing that line is a clear takeaway that we need to make sure clear connection. Um the desire on a vote of the design options I think part of that is is one additional checkpoint that I would have with council. I would lean heavily towards the answer to that question is pretty

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much determined. We bought a 27,000t building. We intend to open a lowberry shelter in a 27,000t building. What that does to the final version of the vision is a question that we need an answer from you the lowberry shelter group on

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because when we consider this there was no additional dollars to be identified for touching the building again. It was about we pass over this is the vision this is the space our friends were going to raise the money hopefully and then we

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would be in the meantime preparing an operating plan a budget and all the engagement work that you also spoke about. So for that then the question is are we at a point that you can quickly revise what the vision looks like if

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that is the case and what does that do to the vision would be helpful to truly appreciate and then we think at that moment we would be ready to engage the building official at this moment I can't give the building official speculative work that's not how he works so it has

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to be as close to accurate as to what we imagine happenings for him to be able to weigh in because the time is so critical When you say vision, do you mean design? You could go back. >> Yes. >> One more design phase. >> Yeah. >> To keep the design within the existing

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>> focusing on the idea that if you look at the option that was presented the the final option that was presented to council had the small addition to the building. Yeah. >> If that were removed, >> what is removed is the question. >> Yeah. >> How does that change the vision? update

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that statement of vision as quickly as possible and then we would really have something. >> So that would be our takeaway at the end. >> That sounds good. I guess I'm thinking of so this is bringing Aaron the architect back in to do another design

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um shorter design phase I I imagine. Um but it would be great to get like your param like you setting the parameters for her at the beginning of that design process so that we can give exactly what you are looking for. >> I think we can prepare that.

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>> I mean it'll be very plainly and in association with what I just said but I think I can go a little bit further forward what you're describing. >> The question isn't about the direction from us. The question is about what do you lose and that was in that space. >> Exactly. That's really the question.

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>> Yep. Okay. So, this is not going back to scratch, bringing the architect back in. >> Just start over. Nope. I'm not endorsing that either. >> So, we would be moving quickly >> for sure. And and I guess I I the only thing I would name is that from the

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Haven's perspective, you know, our decision is based on the model that we presented. Um that was the best working model that we had. We didn't have council's decision. So if there are programmatic changes just you know our

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our committee will need to reassess and ensure that it's it's sufficient for the haven and I'm sure Potchum will need to do the same. >> That's the same for Pum. The decision was based on the amount of bids and what we thought we'd be able to realistically manage in terms of a 60% increase. um

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it's not a no, but I'd have to go back to my board to talk with them about what changes may be um not operating uh from a deficit, but what solutions could we do to be able to meet the need if the number goes up or if the number goes down? >> And this actually reminds me because we

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we're at 23 minutes. We got seven more in holiday drive, which is nice. um when we presented to y'all, we heard at least initial interest in getting more beds in the building. And so this is

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another possibility is getting more beds in the building and less programming in the building, whether it's less admin space or less day shelter or dining functions. So does this require more sort of conversation on the city side around because

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parameters are clear as far as within the boundary of the building but what program is the city willing to lose as part of this project and and and maybe that's a like one of those initial parameter setting conversations with Aaron to determine from

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council and the city manager's office what is going to go away. Is it clear what's going to be included? >> Very clear in the Well, I'm sorry. Um, >> well, you say take away take away from what group

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from? Is there a list that >> there are there are beds that would be lost if we remove the >> right you say if if we if we increase the number of beds, we have to take away a program >> because they would move. >> I assume you have a list of programs that you intend.

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>> Yes. Yeah. I haven't seen the list. Maybe I just haven't noticed it and it's come across my my screen, but I don't know what you're talking about removing something from. >> Yep. >> We can send you the list of programming

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that's within the building currently. There's a part of the presentation included like a pretty comprehensive programming list. And so if it would be helpful for council to review that and prioritize what >> I think the clarity the clarity that exists as the building is envisioned at

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this present time that you all are the ones who have the best visualization of what is actually programmed because the addition was what you saw as necessary that was a part of your conversation not a part of any other conversation. So I guess the question

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that would be a fair question from us to you would be what's in that space because at this moment that's what we lose initially then the question is and how could we augment what we lose by changing elsewhere in the building to

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accommodate if we value that more than what we might lose in its place. I think that's the exercise for re-engaging the architect. But before you do that, to counselor Snick's point, I think is what's the programming that we lose by not allowing that addition because I

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don't know that. >> And let me just say I I remember the presentation in March. U but I I frankly my takeaway from it was here are a lot of ideas, not here's a

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plan that we want you to endorse or not. And so I listen to here are a lot of ideas in a very different way from here's a plan that I'm going to be asking you to say yes or no to. [clears throat] >> And so maybe I don't remember at this

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point whether you whether there was a presentation of some sort. Um of course we would not likely have gotten that that we in a format that we could look at later. If there is such a format, I would love to see it or if there is some >> Well, it's probably more of the operating plan that you're looking for,

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I would imagine, because that's the specifics and that's what they're prepared to do next. >> Okay. >> But y'all are the experts and form follows function. So, we need a little guidance as to what you would not suggest dropping because it would set us

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up for failure. So, I kind of >> that's my point for framing it the way I did. We may not want to lose that. we might be willing to cut something else. That's the reason for me saying >> yeah because ideally we want we don't want you to give us something where you're like and this means the haven's

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out like it we want all the things. We want everyone to go together. We want someone to manage it and we want the programming to support the folks who are in it and to be successful.

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if I thought the addition was really just the clinic, but it's sounding like there were actually more things built into that design that I can't remember from the schema, but um only because there if you make sure it's clear to us what's critical

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and then what's nice to have and then what we we really could get rid of because we could maybe do it in some mobile or other supportive way that would be helpful. There's definitely no no we are we so the

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original design process was a much bigger footprint that was all of the things we trimmed those down to get to where we were where the the most recent design. >> So there there is no sort of fat to trim out. I I I guess I would

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maybe say the most effective next step is for you to convene with us and the architect to >> look at the design and [clears throat] assess what are the things we gain and lose um

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it is beds and and it is the clinic I said those are the primary things that are lost just just you know very very simple if posto needs to keep 80 beds for it to be on board then that pushes some admin out so um anyway

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>> Natalie oh I'm sorry >> hey so um I just wanted to before we're getting theoretical. None of us has the plans in front of our our faces, but from my memory, the we there was a version with just the clinic as the

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addition and you know the inside space had gotten all reworked and then I believe we've heard UVA is willing to do a mobile clinic which would mean we would lose the clinic addition. So how would that affect the rest of the programming space and bedc count

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negatively? Um the clinic is on the first floor and the space that the clinic clinic creates is on the second floor and that's programmed for um for shelter beds. >> So there'd be like a small amount of shelter beds on the floor above the clinic that we would potentially lose if

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we eliminate that small addition. >> Somewhere [clears throat] like 8 to 10 probably. Um so bring it from 80 to 70 to 72 beds. >> Okay. Thanks. So I just just poured this space um and the group

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that's going to be provided because we don't have UVA medical at the table. I mean today but they may be at your table. They they are saying that the mobile clinic can meet the needs that

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they feel that this center will need. um the the group that we partner with is separate from the the mobile unit. I don't know how UVA Health works, but they do not this the group who we've partnered with is not connected to the mobile unit. So, in our conversations

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with them, their alternative is well, we will use the dining room or some other sort of space that we can uh cordon off to make private. >> Yeah. um as a so and and and if there's conversations that we need to have to align sort of the mobile unit

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conversation and the >> I think that's the identification of the alternatives. I think I think what you're your statement there suggests that there's flexibility. >> I think what we're able to say is that we also have heard that there is flexibility of not needing brick and

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mortar because we have mobile. So if the mobile facility can be dedicated on some schedule that meets the needs that we envisioned, would that be satisfactory? I think if it's going to shave a couple of million dollars off the scope of the

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project, then the posture from this side is please, we need to try to make that happen because it's already hard enough to imagine how we're going to raise all of the money that is needed for the existing building alone plus what the Salvation Army is also trying to do at

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the same time. As previously stated, >> we're we're we're a little bit over time, but I would but I do want to just also add that the additional component of the addition is the elevator for um uh rem like evacuating people in

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stretchers that cannot that that currently needs to happen down a stair with the design. Um so that was the the other critical need in the addition was the addition of the elevator which is not a huge cost driver. Um but if the

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millions and is the millions in savings the shorter timeline for the project or >> it's the building as I appreciate it. >> Okay. >> That was my my answer that I received when I asked Erin that question. One more question. Recognizing over time, um

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are you looking at phasing at all in terms of there's that undeveloped parcel next to it in terms of you can open this and maybe five, six years down the line we could expand into that. >> Um because I do worry >> just because services will be

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centralized there. if it only meets say half of demand, it may would make it really hard to um you know open 60 beds at a completely different location you know five years later. Yes, it is designed for phases going out

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the east and possibly the north tub. >> And I'll just say that um from my perspective in the seat that I have there's been no expression of any commitment of that kind because that is a future decision and I don't make

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council's decision. So I have not offered that in any way. I think that is part of further engagement uh for additional thoughts as to do we see something else? Do we see an expansion of what exists after this is up and running? Do we feel that we want to just

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make it even bigger because we see that it is working and we just feel that the capacity gains is is more important. I think I am suggesting that the openness of the space by having additional land available is what made it attractive in

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the first place. It is why it was on a short list of the full consideration while the Cherry Avenue thrift store conversation was live for me actively engaging with the public about it. I was also holding on to the idea that if

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somehow this could happen. There's more than just this one facility with consolidated services on site because there is some buildable land. The site that everyone sees today is not entirely buildable. There is a gigantic easement there that does not allow us to put a

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building over it. So, it's very limited as to how far we can go with an expansion. >> Is that our easement? >> It is a water easement if I or a utility easement if I'm remembering. So, any any attempt to move it is gigantic and hugely disruptive. Um, so there is a

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limitation on the site, but there absolutely is an opportunity to add to the site and the question is what? And that's a future future question. I know Natalie has raised her hand literally and figured.

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>> Um, so I've got two questions. I I had one question and then the conversation went a little further which added a second thought. Um, the the I'll start with the second thought first. [laughter] um which is the the potential for a phase two of this project I think

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is important because we don't have the resources I think it we have to be real and notice in in recognizing we don't have the resources to make this perfect. So if we keep fighting for perfect, we get in the way of good enough. And later

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down the line, hopefully and ideally, there'll be an opportunity for expansion, you know, as we pay off certain debts, as we increase tax revenue, those sorts of things. We can get that bigger, better, perfect version that we all wish we could pay

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for and fund. Now, in the meantime, we can get something that that helps. And then for office space and capacity building, um this is not a question I I need answered at this exact moment, but

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um what about those uh like contractor trailers or trailers that students at large high schools that haven't expanded yet have classrooms in? What is the ability to put something like that on

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this property that is structurally sound, has air conditioning, and doesn't involve digging and doing a whole foundation? Um, and is that something that we could use to expand office and programming space for a lower cost?

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Just putting that out there as a thought. I don't know if it's been considered yet. I don't know how much those cost, but if that is a way where we can recapture indoor space so we don't lose programming capability or bed space because we can take some of that office and it's still on site, it's

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still nearby. Um I I don't know if that's something that might be a useful thing to consider if we're all brainstorming. I think that results from the conversation about the loss of the addition and the impact or the planning

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constraints on where else that goes. >> Could we recap action steps before we move on? >> Yeah. >> Number four since I think we have got a lot. >> Oh, hey. uh the production of an operational plan inclusive of a budget

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uh for participation in holiday drives separate from enhanced operations and and I put it I think reasonably we might be able to do that in six to nine months based on the other sort of structural

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strategic work we need to do internally. Well, actually, I'm sorry. I may have spoken out of term operational plan. We actually might be closer to having having a a a proposal for that than six to nine months. So, >> yeah, B is working on its strategic plan

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right now. We're trying to finalize that. We're working on a COCY strategic plan as well. That might take a little longer because we're engaging external stakeholders. Uh we we're working with CACF, the community foundation, to work on an operating plan as well. So not

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sure of that timeline but um hopefully within the next >> so we can identify the deliverable date. >> Yes. >> And same thing for post as well. Um had several points of restructuring so I feel confident in terms of getting that um sooner rather than later.

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>> You want to try to put a date on that? >> I'll be honest and just say where I am and it ain't popular. Needs to be faster. I'll just say that because I can. >> What does faster look like to you? So we get >> three months.

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>> Three months. >> Just because I think where we are and our next topic is exactly why. >> Can I ask the in the weeds question was doing in the weeds questions? >> Sure. >> Okay. Could the operational plan

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have buckets that are TBD in order to expedite that process? So, you're restructuring your organizations, it makes it difficult for you to say we will do this and thus put it in a plan. But if you can leave a box that says someone will do this unidentified as of

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yet and but it will have these characteristics that might help us get a better sense of budget and which hand needs to be raised next. >> And if I could just tag on to that, I would say that um that's where I am. if

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we could um if we could confirm as much as we could confirm as quickly as we possibly can. That's the request because with that information then this engine can turn as well. And while we're turning on the

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parts of the engine that we need to turn, we will produce answers quickly and share in that. It's not the normal way of doing it. I get that. These aren't normal times and and I think what what would be helpful is to see what we

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could identify in the approach to operating this facility. What do we know for sure? Like what are the things that we're just confident of? This is how we would do this period. And if we can then highlight this is where we need to

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continue to work with our boards on getting some clarity um working with staff to figure out how that approach gets further informed. I think there's some sharing in that that maybe these conversations happening on this regular

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schedule could actually inform one another. >> And one thought that occurs to me is that I know it is uncomfortable to be asked to do this or to be doing it, but there's a certain amount of building the

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plane as you're flying it that's got to happen. >> Very familiar with that approach >> and >> and we just have to say, okay, it's going to have have to be that way. And now, [laughter] >> yeah, we can >> having been in that world, you know, I

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was in that world of nonprofit world, I get that. So, that's basically what I'm saying. >> Sounds good. So that's the first action step operational plan. Um as as soon as we can pull together. >> Yes. >> I will say that we as on the city side will be designating the project

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management component. Um I think it's internalizing our structure and then determining how best the linkage goes back and forth. Um I think you've heard the vote on the design that that I think we can further talk about it to your

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point of helping the architect appreciate what it is that is being said and then giving that direction to quickly revisit to bring back what is the impact. >> But when would you like to schedule that? >> I think we can do that as quickly as possible in the next week or so. >> So quick point. So three months from now

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is the 13th of August. Is it fair to ask that we have this done by August 31st in terms of operational plan? >> Yes. Hey, you're the one who volunteered. >> We're talking about council meeting. >> We're talking about two more weeks. So, I would say yes, that's fine because

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hopefully there'll be enough that could be known before then. >> August is always a mess. Thank I um [clears throat and cough] but I guess would it be maybe you've agreed on this and I just missed the the agreement. Do we have a sense of when

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the decision is going to be made about that fundamental design constraint of how many beds [clears throat] are we having a clinic in or out? >> I think that's the reason for pushing to get the architect engaged that that comes sooner rather than later. Yeah, >> we will know where we stand on that

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pretty quickly other than that. >> Good. Okay. >> I mean, and I feel like what we would know is we probably will and just kind of thinking about what I've heard and what I understand that we will probably surface conflicts with the impact of

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that change. That doesn't stop us from still moving forward with everything else. That just means that needs to be worked on and determine how best to do it. >> Will the next item is that the building code official is going out >> on leave. soon. [clears throat] >> So, I am extra motivated to ensure that

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that happens quick enough that I can engage him. I can engage him uh uh in an interim capacity at this point, but it's more conversational. I need to get the clarity of that piece being removed and then having him

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understand what is being proposed to occur inside the building and then he can give the feedback on that. The fire marshall has to be alleged in the same manner and both of them are waiting for me to tell them when we're ready. >> What's the time as far as the leave? How much time do we have?

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>> Oh, we're we're probably I can't remember like a month. >> Maybe that could be the second of um meeting that we convene. The first one could be Jen present design focus with Aaron

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>> and then building code could be second meeting. Yeah, I I I feel like I know what pieces I can produce quickly that would initiate conversation so that the meeting is about the report outs. >> I think that would be the approach to take. That's great. >> Um

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I think the questions of engaging the building in an interim capacity, I would still label those as TBD. uh only because I think the question the next conversation is important to

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appreciate as in association with that uh I will say the engagement of holiday drive businesses I have engaged the holiday drive businesses at the start of this conversation that is why they showed up during the presentation that was made about purchasing the building

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uh we are having conversations about going back to those businesses because I assured them that I would it is my desire to go back and deliver an update that I promised that I would give them before anything happens in the space. And then after that, I would say to you

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that I appreciate the notion of you wanting to go speak to them and I would wholeheartedly encourage you to do so because I know that you can anticipate what the thoughts are that everyone has about this as they surface just the same as the Cherry Avenue conversation and

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any other location that ever gets known gets named as a possible location for this type of service. So, um, being able to go in and answer questions. I mean, the pro the difficulty in having that particular conversation is the desire is to know exactly what is going to happen

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and you don't know that to some degree. You don't know that. But being able to explain how you plan to approach serving in that building and what services will and will not be available in that building, I think they would appreciate hearing that. >> And there is a feedback element for us as well. what are their biggest concerns

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and how can we design to mitigate against those as early as possible >> and they are absolutely prepared to share that with you. >> That's right. >> Um and and I assured them that this was never um I was never taken the position and it was the same message that I delivered to the Fville neighborhood. It

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is not my posture that I would come in and just simply say we're dropping this in your neighborhood and we're walking away. That doesn't work. This was always going to be about you will know what's happening. I can't solve for you liking what happens. I want to make sure that I solve for you understanding what's

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happening. And once you have an understanding of what happens, we do our best to mitigate concerns. So if you identify problems, we work to solve those problems. They share their concerns. They share their concerns about what's happening today and they share their concerns about what they

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anticipate happening with this being located there. So I think that's what you would be preparing for. What do you need from us to be successful in that engagement? >> We're pretty familiar with going into unfriendly spaces about the building

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from what we do. >> They didn't know if there I mean since you had already >> I think it's about the answers about the building is what I anticipate them needing because they know their programming. They know what they're going to be doing. >> Great. >> Shall we move on to encampments? >> Yes. Yeah,

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>> just want to um we would love to meet with city haven leadership. We'd love to meet with city staff that could I mean our concerns overlap with patchchum and racks as far as the conditions that we need met at the site. So I I I'm making a

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>> I think the identification of that change with staff is is probably a matter of days that we can conclude that. Sounds great. Yeah. >> Thank you. All right. So, encampments, we have 45 minutes uh slated for this. Might have

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to trim that down a little bit. Um >> we have 45 minutes left. So, um 35 minutes for this one. >> Um and first I'll share some COC observations. Um as of reported today, there are about 80 people residing at

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the free bridge and zero east high encampments. Um that number has reportedly increased over the last several months since January, potentially quadrupled um according to business owners along that stretch. Um these community members are at serious

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risk of death from flooding, from their personal belongings getting washed away. Um and we're working to rehouse these community members is a moral obligation for all of us. Um, we have partnered, Brack has partnered with Clutch Consulting to bring in their expertise

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about a direct to housing initiative. Um, we brought them for a two-day on-site training um, to our COC in midFebruary. We had some planning sessions and generated some initial cost estimates to rehouse 50 individuals from an encampment. Um, they actually

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provided updated numbers to us yesterday. So what an in one and a half yearl long initiative to rehouse 50 individuals would be $1,775,000. Um which is a lot less than the 4 million we initially proposed at the May

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4th session. Um I do have a breakdown of the numbers for case management, rental subsidies, project management, landlord engagement, all of that. So if you're interested in those numbers, I'm happy to share those with you. but 1.775 million. Um, based on our recent count,

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we would likely need twice as much money to rehouse all the community members at Freebridge and Zero East High. Um, just because of the cost of rent and security deposits in particular. Um, so the Brack board decided to table this conversation. We're still in engagement

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and communication with Clutch Consulting and Community Solutions, which is willing to sponsor Clutch coming here and helping us on site with this work. Um, mainly because of the cost. we didn't have the capacity to undertake this project and um the the rental

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vacancy rate is very low compared to some other cities across the country. Um we heard concerns from the city manager's office as well that the cost was a little too high um considering there's a lot of fundraising needs across the COC for the Salvation Army Center of Hope campaign and also for

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Holiday Drive. Um and so that's why we decided to table this. Um, we've communicated or BFC or Built for Zero has communicated directly with Mayor Wade and sent their proposal. Um, I think it was kind of at a stencil at that point just because we weren't sure how to proceed as a continuum of care

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with that. So, we've notified Clutch Consulting that we're still interested. Those lines of communication are still open and we would love some u next steps from you all if you're interested in pursuing this project. Um Owen and I have also been a part of the public spaces working group um which has been

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meeting since January to identify some short-term and intermediate term solutions for how to address the free bridge and zero east high street encampments. Um what we have identified as some potential resolutions just for the intermediate is additional portaotties, trash removal, more sharps

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containers. Um, and yeah, just addressing some of the sanitation needs and increasing mental health and behavioral health supports at the encampment. >> Can I pause you right there real quick? So, um, public space working group submitted a letter to council last

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Monday. Um, I have copies here if folks want it. Um, you might there was a lot going on last Monday, but um, this has been a really excellent group that had started meeting in January. Again, you know, Shayla and I are representing the Haven and Barack. Um, we have the Ravana

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Conservation Alliance who is focused on the stream the the river health and the environmental factors. Um, we have the Rebana Trails Foundation who is focused on uh community trail access and sort of the the friction points around people who are using the trails recreationally

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and the people who are living there. Um we have um the Ravena rafting company represented as a local business that's been seriously impacted by the encampment. Um and we've been able to um identif any anyway we've been able to identify even though we're coming from

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very desperate perspectives. there's shared solutions that we can all get on board with um to improve both the situation for the situation for the folks who are unhoused and the folks who are accessing the trail recreationally and the the general environmental

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concerns and factors. So, um that is a really effective um working group that's been working since January. again. Um we have um you know uh we did a little bit of partnering with parks and wreck when they did the recent cleanup. Um and that

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was that was a great beginning. Um they have found it hard to complete that project because the access to the trail is really challenging. Um I I don't know if you want to speak towards any >> Sure. I mean that pretty much sums it up. It is difficult due to the uh

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logistics of the trail and where it is especially with neighboring businesses. >> Thank you. Um >> could you walk through just in more specificity what makes it difficult to access what are kind of concrete barriers you encounter?

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>> Um sure. Yeah. So I mean we know that folks are staying there, right? But being able to navigate where people are staying um trying to decipher what is to go and keep um all brings a challenge. So, we use our internal resources to make that determination. Working closely with Lieutenant Wade, um, Sergeant

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Thomas to to use their uh their their relationships with the individuals who are there to uh make this as as smooth as possible. >> And I think to what we talked about last Monday, it's also not knowing where we're responding to when the call comes

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in or because it's not necessarily coming from a specific person down there. or it might be somebody reporting it from a business or something like that. And we get multiple addresses that are given to us through dispatch. And so >> accessing it by vehicle, you have to go through private property most of the

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time get there. But that's time obviously time. Um, so Shay is trying to identify this is a very complex situation, right? And the response is multi-level. There's immediate responses, there's midterm

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responses, and long-term responses. Um, so the the immediate needs are in regards to what Parks and Rec has begun to do around sanitation. Um, there are that project has not been completed.

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There was additional trash installed at the site and two sharps containers installed near the bridge. Um, and just just a there are really two distinct encampments. One is a free bridge. This

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is in the floodway. This is the most dangerous site to camp because when the water floods as it does regularly, um, there's rapidly moving water moving through all of those tent encampments. So that's a critical safety issue site.

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There's also a distinct encampment at Zero East High, the city- owned property, which is more of like a trail system. It's probably like a half mile south of the free bridge. Um, so the city cleanup focused on the free

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bridge encampment. Um, what we have heard is that the trash receptacles are weren't sufficient. they need more due to the number of people there. Um the sharps containers also they could use more and more broadly disperse through that area. Okay.

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>> And then the most critical issue is portaotties and I know Rion and the parks department has been working hard to try to site a portaotty here but um they are not able to get access from the property owners or or permission to put

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a portaotti anywhere in that area. Um and so this is one of the critical public health issues is that people are there's human waste everywhere in that site that gets washed into the river and this is health hazard

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community interest hazard makes the river less useful. So that is a critical need that again whatever the city can do to site porties in this site as soon as possible that is just the top of the

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immediate priority list and zero east high needs all of those same facilities. They have not um they have not there is no plan currently that we're aware of the parks and rec may be working on this to create additional facilities at the zero east high encampment.

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I don't think this was a very we heard the cost of this was $5,000 or less for the cleanup at free bridge. Um, so this is not a lot of money that city council needs to allocate to make the necessary sanitary interventions that

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are required to complete a free bridge and again understanding that the portaotty is the missing piece and additional trash and uh sharps. Um, but citing a citing several portaotties is a critical need and there's no restriction

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on zero east high. That's a city-owned property. Um the Ravana Rafting Company is happy to partner with the city um in so those are again we would love for these action items to be accomplished in the next two weeks. I I also think it's

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important some of the other you you hit you hit the nail on the head with a lot of those issues there, but there's also the issue and this came up over the weekend with the fire and I know >> Joe Phillips there the propane tanks. >> Those fires um one of them was venting during that fire is what I was told

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>> and so just I can't imagine those propane tanks being everywhere down there and those fires and being so dry. And so that is another immediate public safety risk that if we do a cleanup, I'm not sure if they can clean those up or how you dispose of those propane tanks,

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but that's going to become a real issue. >> And another um I know it's just one small piece of it, but um with the portaotties specifically is so who's so parks and wrecks would be responsible for them. I'm just thinking of

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the city has portaotties at a concert. If there's not constant maintenance, they're going to overfill have problems. Even at community events, some teenager will vandalize them or something. What

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is what would be the expectation for who's ma maintaining it and what's kind of the frequency of of being out there? >> Gabe, you want to speak to this? Do you have thoughts? Uh [clears throat] yeah, solar drive river company. Um I think I

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think that certainly maintenance issues, misuse issues, vandalism issues are all very possible. Um and and yet right now there is probably hundreds of pounds of human waste hitting the ground

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all along the river every day. So every day that goes by there's that environmental and public health and health in the camp's cost. So I think that the theoretical issues and and to be clear I'm not endorsing encampments along the river as a good

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solution for any people long term but in the short term since it exists it's our strong feeling that we should get the port of John's there and if a port of John gets destroyed at least we're still trying and we'll we'll take the risk at series 5 to

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contract to do that and provide be the middle middle person so to who can be responsible for it then. >> Understood. And and I think similarly it would seem to me if the city is going to even just for basic health and safety as

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I think we need to being going out there and doing cleanups as well as monitoring fire safety and to the extent possible trying to enforce basic fire safety rules and regulations. I mean, it would seem to me the city would need to be out there on

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at least weekly, if not, you know, almost daily basis given that there's, you know, potentially hundred people and and the trajectory is is is expansion or something raised. >> Um, Natalie,

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>> hey there. Uh, quick question about access. Um I is uh on said that the city hasn't been able to access Porta Johns on the east high half of the uh encampment. Are is

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the city not allowed to go down the Duke Street Caroline A corner access point? >> I don't think there are any access limitations on the Zero East High Street. I think there's plenty of access points. Is that accurate, Gabe? >> Correct. The access problem is at free

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bridge. Yeah, access is >> free bridge. >> Yeah. >> Okay. Sorry, I just wanted to clarify that. Thank you. >> Um, another question on like the propane tanks just because I mean at our last council meeting, >> I guess I want to I want to pause that because this is a fire rescue question

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which is critical um and could be incorporated into the public space working group as far as the near-term sort of concerns. It is a little outside of our scope. So I um and >> I think Joe Joe Phillips is going here too, >> but I I'll just say that there's there's

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no setting aside of the issue because the issue is a clear and present danger. >> Yeah. And I'm I'm I'm just going to raise it because at the last council meeting, we received very specific examples of um emergency fire safety and

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I think we're in extreme drought is the exact terms. Um and this weekend obviously there was a fire that by the grace of God there was not serious injury even though in the reporting that very easily could have happened and again by the grace of God it did not

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spread to other areas. Um but >> couple things go different someone easily could have died. So I ask um you know there questions of access to the site. I mean, were there difficulties accessing that situation and just kind

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of what other viruss are going on? I mean, you the continuum of care may not have the answer, but I just know Joe is Joe is on. I don't know if there's any Joe is on. I would say, and this might be a question for the city attorney, too. If

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it's that is city property there still, >> can the city say you can't you could be there, but you can't have propane tanks there? Like are we able to say you can have this and that there or >> as the land owner we can say anything can happen or anything cannot happen on our land.

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>> Okay. >> And as for the fire and access question I think Joe's on there and you can access it. >> Joe, you on? >> I'm on. Um, sorry I clicked on the, um, we got, you know, if if we can

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get lucky in a fire. Um, the access to the tent that was burning is the best access I have. Um, it was right there near the advanced auto and the stairs. We were able to go right under the bridge as well. Um, but you move it a

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100 yards more up river and it's a difficult access. Um that's you know um you know we we had the fire extinguished in about eight minutes. Um but the pictures of the fire before we got there

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are um enormous. So there was a lot of material there burning. Um and it's what the resident referred to as a workshop. It was not his living tent. It was his workshop, art studio.

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Um, that is what he referred to it. And then it spread to his tent. >> Wow. And, um, I know there's reference to sharp containers for used needles. Um, obviously there's there's a role for that. I mean, these are public trails,

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so obviously they're used needles in areas where any member of the public could be, children could be. Shouldn't the city be out there on a daily basis if there's a risk of children getting hepatitis from a prick or >> I guess the question that you're posing

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is should the city I think it goes both ways. It's the providers that are serving the needs of the individuals as well. I think we have to make sure that we are we're sharing the the scope of what this now requires. We are present on a daily basis. Park services this area on a daily basis. The sharps

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containers are serviced. And I'm just kind of speaking of a clip, but yeah, they're serviced as needed. If it's full, it is emptied. So, if it was full as of yesterday, it is emptied today. >> If it's full again tomorrow, it is taken away tomorrow. That is that is the posture. That is correct.

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>> That has been authorized for us to impact the changes that need to happen in this place right now. >> I think what I what I'm Are you finished? I I'll wait. Um well this is the first of four sort of

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responses to the encampment and um I just want to make sure we have enough time to the others include identifying and creating infrastructure [clears throat] for alternative encampment locations. One of the issues is that this is not this is not the ideal spot for a variety of reasons primarily because of the

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safety and and the floodway. quickly identifying an alternate location that could be safer, could have better fire management protocol, food, etc. It is where I would like to spend more of our time personally in this space. Though I completely understand

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the city's need to address the fire concerns and don't want to minimize those in any way, but our time is limited here. So, I I do want to focus on medium and and long term. >> I'll let you continue. I'll I'll just highlight again. I mean, any day some of them could die there. So, I don't think there's time to waste.

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>> I'll share I'll share that the any consideration of an alternative location for a campsite is my purview. That is not a heavy decision. That is not an easy decision for me to make. It is a very complicated matter. Um, and there is no decision that I can share

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with you at this time. So, the answer to that question is that isn't done. That isn't settled. Um, but I do think that the conditions that we see in this in this particular encampment has to be addressed and it's got to be addressed by all of us. Um, and and I'll just say

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plainly and clearly that what we are allowing to happen out there today is unacceptable. We cannot allow people to continue to be at risk of burning themselves with propane tanks that just should not be on

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site. The provision of them by whoever is providing them needs to stop. They can't have those. >> It is not being provided by our work. >> I'm not saying that it is. It is a threat to safety. That is a threat to public safety. We are in a drought.

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The rain that we got is not enough to prevent us from losing someone if a cooking instrument that is being manufactured on site tips over. We can't permit that. And that is a struggle that I'm having right now with where we are on this encampment space because there

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are things that we could restrict in the way of establishing rules because there are none today. And that is where we're going to have to go is the establishment of rules. And I'll call out Cindy because you gave me the language in the presentation that Patchum has rules and

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PCHM has the low barrier shelter and if we are in a posture that encampments are our alternative version of that outside then there must be rules. So, we're going to have to find a way to wrap our arms around the [clears throat] implementation of some parameters for

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anyone who is outside while we continue to work to try to get as many of them inside and make sure that we continue our service delivery, our comprehensive work to bring more services to these folks. But we all and we all acknowledge

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that the individuals closest to the river should not be there. So, they need to move and we're going to have to initiate that process. And what I would hope is that all parties involved in where we stand on this matter are going

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to support that because it is in the best interest of the individuals being in the most dangerous area of our riverfront that we should all be in agreement that they need to move and we should all work to help get them to move. And that is not what I anticipate

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we're going to find based on what our past experience has been. I'm saying this out loud because [clears throat] I tend not to hold back. Uh but the point of this matter is we are at a point of high concern that after the report that I received on Friday while out of town

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that there was a fire at this encampment, we cannot allow this to continue. So there's a there's a quick point of of reconciling that I want to talk about in terms of that shared responsibility in terms of what the cities do and the providers do. And I based off each

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organization in the COC, I I want to share that each of us are at capacity. This is not an abdication of the encampments. This is not in terms of these organizations feeling as though this is not our responsibility. We are currently at our max. And so in terms of that, BA's uh board discussed this uh

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yesterday. We've had conversations with folks in terms of um developing an RFP of what this would look like to help uh for someone to help us kind of conglomerate resources on how to address this, what would be the best approach um so that we have something tangible that uh council can take a look at u kind of

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sink their teeth into in terms of a viable option um and each of the organizations the COC stands ready to um ultimately whether it is a an alternative site or whatever the case may be to be able to do that. Um but I I want to make the point that those folks

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who are in the encampments and those folks who are single individuals, there's sometimes some conflation in terms of these two groups are the same. So for example, who would be served by holiday drive and who are in the encampments are not the same population, right? >> And so there has to be a a vertically

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integrated program in terms of these are people with pets. These are people who are are couples. They don't want to be split up um served by a program that has single or serve single adults. So there has to be some thought process in terms of what program model can vertically integrate to serve both uh subsets of

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that population >> who does that who produces that >> in terms of servicing both of those populations >> the recommendation on how to do that >> that's what Brack is doing right now in terms of soliciting for those RFPs um so that there is an outside approach or an

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outside set of eyes to say this is how you best solve this problem in tandem with our partners at the And to piggy back off of that as far as the capacity, you know, um the COC under B has one outreach provider, Same Mensah, who's doing an amazing job of

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providing of bringing services to the 80 to 100 people who are currently camped there. That's not an appropriate ratio. Um, so I I I I guess I'm um we need additional outreach capacity, right, to

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be able to serve these folks? Um, and and yeah, I I just just want to observe that. >> Does outreach capacity include assisting in the relocation? Um that's that has not been what what the COC outreach staff has done and in

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conversation with Ashley talked a lot about with us about and did delineate that if there were city funded outreach positions they would likely be assisting with relocation where that could be a more of a challenge for COC outreach

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positions who are more working on housing navigation or are housing focused. So, um, does the city have capacity for additional outreach >> a day? No. >> So, if we're both in the same boats,

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will we be able to get on the same boat? Because the problem is great size. So, two additional staff members handed to Misti is an option, but two additional staff members is not what it's going to take. >> Sure. If the request from the COC is

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additional supports to add outreach workers across all three of you or however it were proposed, it would come with that condition. >> Yeah, >> I guess that's the question is would it be met with we can do that? >> I'd say our request the way we would like to devote our resources would be to

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identifying alternate encampment sites that would be easier to access, e easier to service, easier to easier to provide safety. Um and th this is the kind of work that the public public spaces working group has been doing to identify alter alternate locations. Um that's the

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kind of work that we would like to if if folks are going to be forced to move there has the we would love for them to be able to move to a better situation that's not going to have these same issues in six months from now. So, can

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we and can we find a better location where we can admit we've identified the concerns. It's cooking, it's propane, it's it's the floodway. Can we identify an alternate location to quickly humanely

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from the from the CSC standpoint offer to folks from the city standpoint it might be require or so again this is where there is a little bit of a philosophical tension >> I hear a philosophical difference and that is problematic >> and a question

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>> well then let's let's let's resolve it because seriously I I I think if >> and I want to come together. Yeah. >> I want to just add an additional question is if the city did that, >> would the continuum of care consider it acceptable or feasible to in that new

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site have some level of rules? >> Oh my gosh. We have rules for all of our programs. We are we are that's >> and I guess the other question is it sounds like the capacity to operationalize that does not exist. we would need we would need a so part of

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our part of our need for this whole sort of subset of needs we have not gotten to the others we need a full-time project manager to coordinate our encampment response the setting up an alternate campsite getting the clutch consulting

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proposal rolling again like the there is enough work for one full-time staff member who the the COC would be glad to take on to well again we have boards This has been quick conversations. So, but the three of us are enthusiastic

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pending board approval to have a project manager who can hit the short-term needs, the medium-term needs, and the long-term rehousing needs. Get all of those balls rolling

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um with with in conjunction with the city. But so, so that that's something we we are eager to dig into. We do need funding for that position, right? Where we're all So that would need city would need to provide funding for at least, you know, one-year position for a

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project manager. Um, off hand, I would guess that like with benefits that would be around $80,000, but some of the, you know, obviously those details would need to be worked out, but that we we we see the need to respond. we do feel like we're well

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situated to respond in conjunction with the um so yeah that that's >> you had mentioned I guess maybe I'm applying a different verb than you did but there's a reviving or revisiting the

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clutch consulting project that works out to over $35,000 per person >> it does that's right >> is that >> 33 per person >> 355 Actually, if you divide 50 into 1775 >> spreadsheets,

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>> um my question is I I have no idea what is expensive within that field. That seems to my outside eyes as being ridiculously expensive, but I don't know what what

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standard to judge that against. At what point does somebody say there's got to be a cheaper way to do it than that? We're not going to pay $35,000 per person for 18 months. >> Yeah.

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>> Well, just to talk cheaper to hire the person and pay them to >> so big ditches. >> Specifically for numbers, 25 of that 35 are rental subsidies w with a with a average cost of living. We're estimating about $1,500 per month

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rent per person. That's $18,000 per person plus the additional we need to pay landlords additional security deposits um additional fees to so that they will take a take a risk on our folks. Some of those some of those funds

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we get back um but the majority of that is rental subsidy support for folks. The rest is um case housing navigation, case management support, the the that sort of project management and coordination piece, but the the the majority is

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rental subsidies. So, this is why Brad's board um made a pause in terms of this conversation because we saw the numbers. um Clutch and Community Solutions has worked with much larger populations and obviously uh there's a higher um affordable housing

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vacancy and so the thought process is to your point how do we find someone who has a more nuanced approach u that can take the time to learn Charlottesville learn Charlottesville specific needs and help us from that vantage point. So there was the conversation to say what can we find that's more um economically

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feasible for our specific area. >> Oh Natley. >> Hey thanks. Um backing this up. You had originally mentioned there were like four things you were going to talk about >> and we got stuck at the um the relocation. Was that the the fourth

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thing or was there another piece of the >> So so relocation are is the second and third thing the the so it's identifying and creating infrastructure for an alternative encampment um which we would like to propose Holiday Drive as an alternative encampment location

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>> since the city owns it. It is not in the flood plane. It is easy to access. Um the second piece is creating management protocols for for that alternative encampment location. what are the rules? What are the requirements? How do folks cook? Um, again, the public space

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working group has been digging into this. We've begun to like estab identify what are the management protocols we would need in place. Um, I guess I I would also add that there's a lot of the Ravana Trail Foundation, for example, has a ton of volunteers. The Ravana

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Trail reps think that their volunteers would be very motivated to help create campsites and infrastructure in another spot. um to again create an alternative that's attractive and well serviced and well-managed

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um to draw I I as many folks from the dangerous spot as we can. Um and then the fourth is leading the rehousing initiative. So that this is the clutch consulting effort. So we have touched on all four of them in one shape or form.

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Um we haven't talked about Holiday Drive as a possible encampment location. So um we have about eight minutes left before we need to wrap up. >> So the the clutch the clutch piece their

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focus is on rehousing not shelter management or what counts as housing for them? Is it hotel? Is it shelter? Is it long-term >> out housing? Rent rental market housing. >> Okay. And so in the interim,

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what are like how close is the city or the organizations or in partnership or with whatever grants we can apply for, how close are we to being able to buy or

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lease a hotel? And who's leading that conversation? Is that a conversation we've had? We've had conversations. We don't know. We don't have a point person identified for who would take that on

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>> because again it's a staffing capacity issue, >> right? >> What about at the city? Has the city >> offer from the city perspective that I have probably 10 different things on a list of active pursuits, but that doesn't mean anything because

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at this moment there's nothing that's landed. and and if there was a hotel that could be a destination for the direct the initi the the direct to housing initiative. So the direct to housing initiative is like the mechanism by which we get folks out of encampments into housing. The destination you know

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typically clutch puts folks into market rate market rate rentals. It would be a lot easier if we had an you know alternative or transitional housing option for folks. So that would expedite the process and possibly make it cheaper as well. >> Who would fun? So, initially when we were backing up a little bit to talk

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about who would be assisting or managing a relocation process, we're talking about that in terms of an alternate campsite, not a housing situation just yet. >> We're probably talking about all of the above. >> Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. So, um

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>> that's what makes it challenging because all these things are very expensive and the question is how much of them can we do at the same time? But the right approach would be an all of the above approach. >> So, so I mean what since we just

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looking at ideas, what if we you know look at you know I think we're looking at 18 months like what if we like said you you know use financial incentive to expedite the construction of the holiday

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drive you know reconstruction. you know, when I was in transportation and we would use incentives for them to finish projects, you know, I'm thinking about the big RO 29. I mean, that was done like months and months and months ahead of time because they had a financial

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they were working like round the clock on holidays and things. I just think we just need to a lot of this would be resolved if we get that holiday in drive done and and hearing about meetings and rein talking to architect. we just need to get the damn thing done.

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And and I know it's a lot of conversations need to take place, but if we do that, then we can be able to say, you know what, you can't be here. We don't want you here, but you know what? We have a place for you to go with services and things that you can do. And and that's, you know, but I know that

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it's going to take time for that. What's happening along river is not acceptable. It's not a lot of ideas out there. And, you know, um we don't have all the answers here. we not we won't be able to say do A, B or C um tonight, but um we we need to come up with with something

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because it's not acceptable for the residents there, the businesses or say for um our own house brothers and sisters there. We we we we can do better. we, you know, to to take care of of the those residents out out

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there. And um um we we have the the the brain power here and and you know, Clutch and others to um you know, to try to address it. It's just we we don't have enough housing, you know, and that's one of the reasons

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that it's so high and that's why, you know, that we're in this situation now that we don't have enough housing. So anyway, um Jen, do you have anything you want to chime in? >> Do thank you. Um okay, I I could use a

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better sense of who's willing to do what because if you say relocate to me, that is prioritizing indoors. I >> think that clarify that >> hotel something that is acting shelterish that is immediately

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available. So I think we would have to still have as you've mentioned in your letter all the things an outdoor encampment area because of pure numbers. We may not be able to fund or find hotels that are

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available. But I think putting all the eggs in the encampment basket is a bad move on our part because more people die in heat than cold. And we're about to come up on hurricane season in four weeks and heat two and it's just gonna the problem changes from fire to heat

404
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exhaustion. Indoors is the way to go and the most compassionate way we can address this. But it is multi-pronged because immediately you're saying even if we start tomorrow, we still need portag John's and wraparound supports

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and more engagement people down there to be mobilized and to strike that team tomorrow. 18 months is too long. We need >> what what is 18 months? >> That's the clutch timeline.

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So >> it's not 18 months to start. It's a It's an 18monthl long program. >> Placement >> placement to housing, right? But but could Clutch work on with us indoors as in a hotel? Would would that

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suffice? Are you saying that is an option for them or it has to be long-term housing? >> They consider they consider hotel like as a it's kind of it's almost like a shelter. But >> yeah, I think we can set this project up however we want to. Councelor Payne had the

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observation that if if um buying a hotel is more like operating an overnight shelter >> than market rate housing with dispersed case management. >> So >> I think we want to get to market rate housing. I'm saying in the phasing of

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this, are we ready to set some groundwork and rules on the city side that move folks instantly in the next two weeks out of the most critical zones of the river by with engagement and >> into the port >> the hotel

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>> um that would be ideal but just moving can can we do some engagement that says do you have anywhere else to go is there someplace to go I don't know how that process works because I'm not in your world but soon. >> If we displace people in two weeks, they will disperse. They will be camping in

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other locations in the city. >> So, we need in the immediate not only the supports down there, but the instant plan for getting the first priority set of folks into what I would say indoor housing would be preferred, but this

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other site. So, can you in tandem do the work to identify who's who needs to move and set up the um other encampment zone and a hotel? I mean, what do we need?

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>> What's the timeline? Okay, so if we had a project manager, then they could probably working with the public space working group. the resources we have. I think we could set up an alternative

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camping location within three to five months if it at the same time we're engaging Clutch and getting the directed housing initiative going again. Clutch is very ambitious with their timelines and they

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could but but but that does involve staffing up, right? We have one outreach person right now. There there's just not the capacity. So, so the project manager is is like working on hiring and coordinating these different projects. So, there's no there's no twoweek

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solution that I can see. >> So, if you were saying if I was saying to you, what can we do in 8 to 12 weeks? And I'm choosing those numbers only from a very limited set of research I've done on cities our size who have relocated encampments and folks living in them inside to hotels is the only example I

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have and other encampment sites that was an 8 to 12 week so three month 8 to 12 week process what could we feasibly get done if magic genie lamp everything was available the staffing the project management in 8 to 12 weeks in your mind what would it do

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we know what it would take and what that >> I'm talking about a direct to housing >> talking about relocating encampment. So I from from from for from me being B's chair again I I think this is a much larger conversation in terms of like

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strategy and this is why B again has had conversations with various folks in terms of RFB to help us figure out what this process process would look like versus what apparatus we use in terms of the um I don't want to say the enclosing but getting the encampments taken care

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of in a humane process. Um, so I I think that that conversation again, we just started that conversation or we continue that conversation in terms of what's going to be the best fit and how we're going to get the best bang for our buck. Um, in terms of that, I will say in terms of the COC, the entire COC stands

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ready to collaborate with the city in whatever humane capacity is possible to solve this problem. We just need to have a chance to kind of gather our bearings, figure out what resources are available to develop that plan of action. But I emphasized to the board on yesterday, this is we need to move quickly. And so

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we we are literally I I'm I'm texting folks as we as we're talking right now in terms of I want to have something for the city to have like ASAP. >> Yeah. I don't think it's a tiny plan. I mean Owen to speak back to what you're saying. I think this is a plan that is massive that says step one port John's

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two housing and all the thread that connects it all are the people who help connect the people to the steps along the path. There's just an immediate like strike zone right now because of the environment bearing down on us with hurricane season and the state of the

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situation from a public health perspective and we have to work both micro and macro on it. So, I'm trying to figure out where we are we the we the city the overarching piece are we the strike

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piece and then we come in later like it would be great to see what we can accomplish to solve this on that long spectrum and what we need so we can say we actually need 12 workers five are working on strike five are working on long-term

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housing five are working on the crew you know we still have to identify everyone I mean we have to priority list them I'm assuming like we got to figure that out. I don't know if we know everybody down there, even though the the engagement has been amazing. So, it'd be great to see what what we need to be successful

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on the immediate and the long term. >> So, what would you like from the COC in regards to that plan of >> uh timeline? What you can do as a COC? But what if

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you had the right staffing and you had the right resources you would be willing to do? You're obviously like not going to say I'm going to make an ordinance. That's us, right? You know, like you I think define the roles and then um a reassurance that you could do that

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in tandem to number two because I'm not willing to give up on how you drive progress. Can they both be done in tandem? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Is is city council willing to fund project manager position to drive this forward with speed? Because with our current capacity, we cannot drive

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forward with speed on this project. >> Not how we do that. Oh, >> I'm sorry. >> Yeah, I don't know about these things. >> Yeah, >> we we I've captured the I've captured the question and I think that's that's where we are. I think what what I hear you saying is you would like us to try

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to help you frame it better >> so that then you can respond with this would be a proposal for doing >> I I think we have all the pieces it's and but yeah laying them out in a in a way that makes sense to everyone I think yeah we could >> would love to collaborate with you on that

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>> and I'll just say as a final statement for myself I think one of the challenges is we know the environment is immediately crisis level unsafe in terms of flood risk fire risk access and the city at least in my perspective is going

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to have to impose some level of structure and rules and uh relocation to safer areas on a faster timeline than you know five plus months. I mean I'm not a lawyer but in my mind I mean this is approaching an area of gross negligence where

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the city is this cannot continue as is. Yeah, Natalie, you had your hand up and Sam, I don't know if you just wanted any wrap up, you know. >> Yeah, I'll be really quick. >> Go ahead. I know we're we're running

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right. Um, so >> if you if we decide that Holiday Drive could be an alternative camping location, I'm nervous about the fact that 3 to 5 months was put out there as the time we would need to to allow people to get there. If that's a time

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limit that just is using the resources, the immediate resources of the COC, I think we probably would expand that into resources that the city has to go notify people and to help with the move the way that we did it a couple years ago. Um, so I would

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hope that that 3 to 5 months could be consolidated into a much shorter time frame. Um, is that a a reasonable assumption that if the city was if city staff and, you know, volunteers that you mentioned were able to, you know, give a week of notice,

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assist with moving items, like is that feasibly something we could do within 3 weeks? >> If if Holiday Drive is open to camping and there's time to prepare the site and generate infrastructure, we do need a

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project manager for this. So we need to hire someone. Um so it it it certainly shortens the timeline significantly from three to five months. Um but the rate limiting step there there are some rate limiting steps there still. Site has to be prepared. Project manager has to be

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hired. Um we can we can we can move quickly forward on those if this is what the city wants how the city wants to proceed. [snorts] >> And to clarify, I'm not making promises here. I'm asking questions about timelines. So, thank you. Um, and I do

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want to just one one quick thank you and appreciation note u before we close that. Um, the the conversation that you've driven today, you came outlined, you came organized with requests for specific actions. Um, I think that

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indicates that you're as a group, as three groups, you're working together well, which I think, you know, we we can kind of bank on that now, which is good. Um, but I know that there's still challenges from operations level to

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board level communication and then with city. So, I'm glad that we're asking for additional meets. Um, and I think there's a lot of if thens and as soon as one decision gets made, things will fall into place. And so, um, I'm looking

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forward to that moment. >> Other, um, comments. So, I think the first going to be some meetings that you're going to be involved in and, um, um, I think Sam is probably going to be getting back with us with some additional guidance. So,

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>> and then, sorry, I know I know we didn't get to assessing COC structure. Are we on a hard deadline or should we not >> get into it? I I don't know what our constraint is for time. >> Yeah, I I think we had promised staff we were on a hard deadline. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Okay. >> What I'll say to that um and really if

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you would pull up the slide deck and go to the last slide. Um what I'll say to the just item number six is the question that I would just there is what does that mean? What does assessing the CLC structure look like? and that becomes a

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part of this exchange that begins here that finds its way back to council as the way of information. My wrapup is before we had this conversation, I tried to predict what we were going to end up needing to talk about as next steps. So

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here's what I heard and I just I'm not prophetic but this is what I do. Um but the providers, how do you align to produce an operating plan for holiday drive? We have touched on that this evening. How would you activate overnight sheltering at Holiday Drive right now? That's part of what you just

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heard as part of a request that we have heard before. If we were to go that route in addition to or in place of alternative campsite, how would you activate holiday drive right now? I think that is a question we would love for you to give us an answer to. How will you determine and produce

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individual budget requests for a holiday drive project? We've had conversations about that as well. For me, how do you intend to manage encampments in the city of Charlottesville? It is my obligation and I have made it clear that what we see today cannot continue as is. It has to change. So I've began to work on that

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and I'll continue that work. I shouldn't say begin because I'm already doing it. How will you operationalize expanded homeless outreach capacity? I think we hear that loud and clear from the COC request and we have also indicated that we're having internal conversations about how we would do that as staff. City manager and council, how will you

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finalize the vision plan for Holiday Drive? I think we have shared exactly where we are at this moment. That 27,000 square feet is what we purchased. That is what we hope to activate. We need to know what the impact of that firm decision is so that we can then solve for the impacts of that and plan for

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alternatives or augmentations uh to that impact because the desire is loud and clear. We would prefer that all three organizations are at this site. That is the desire. That's where we started and nothing has changed in regards to that. City Council, how do you get comfortable

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with the tra t tensions and trade-offs that result from this effort? >> You know, those are my two favorite words as it relates to doing your job because it's never easy and you will never have an easy answer for any of these complicated questions and how do you prepare the community for this long and hard conversation because I think

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what we have also indicated is time is needed for everything. Nothing goes quick. None of this can be done overnight. And I would stress that we have to be careful if with any effort to rush because the community well-being

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report for the city of Charlottesville said that we have had a sustained presence of unhoused individuals at a very high number since 2007. That's what I'm trying to get everyone to not lose sight of. This has been

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going on for some time. We cannot fix this overnight. This is a longstanding issue that we are going to have to address and that is why all hands on deck is the request that I'm making. We have to come at it come at this from

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every angle that we possibly can. I think as a community we punch above our weight class as you know I like to say and for that I say that we should be able to do this. There is enough resources in here. There's enough brain power. there is enough commitment to wanting to care for these individuals in

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a way that is better than what we see today and that we can do our best to do it in a compassionate manner. I've been consistent about that. I believe that wholeheartedly and I recognize the job that I have is hard and it conflicts with that. So I'm doing my best to ensure that what actions come next will

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become will come from having thought this through and tried to plan for every version of what could happen and to ensure that if you ask the question of why I did it I have an answer and if you ask what are we doing next I also have an answer because we can't stop. That's

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where I am. So I think that's >> how I'll get off my soap box now. Could I ask one [clears throat] one thing? That would be that we just plan at every Monday council meeting to have at least

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a twominut update on where things stand. >> Sure. >> Thank you. >> I can commit to that. >> Can I ask that we can ask our ask for some help from our friends like other localities and missed municipalities to help us with this? We have I've I've had

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I've had a couple of engagements with our region. So the COC's region is my peer region. Um I've made a presentation to them of the concept when we were initially uh pursuing this property. I brought them in on the conversation when it was about Cherry Avenue. I've made it

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clear to all of them that I do intend to come and make a case for why they each should find money and be a part of this coordinated effort because everyone here is not just people who came from here and for that I think we should be able to rely on them to support us and I I

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think it was wellreceived because I did not hear a huff and a gruff in the room. I think everyone indicated that they understood that this is something that we all need to rally around and and do something about. So I do believe that we have the support and the interest has remained.

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>> Yeah. Thank you all so much for coming out and >> thank you. >> Is there a motion to adjurnn? >> So move. >> All in favor please say yes. Take care. Natie. >> Bye.