--------- Just be in person. Be ready to come up to the mic. Kean, are you you ready? Mhmm. K. I'll bring the, Charlottesville City Council 12/01/2025 meeting, to order. Miss Thomas, would you please call the roll? Councilor Ashran? Here. Councilor Payne is not here yet. Vice Mayor Pinkston? Here. Councilor Smith? Here. Mayor Wade? Here. Thank you. Is there a motion to approve or amend the agenda? So moved. Second. Okay. All in favor, please say yes. Yes. Yes. All opposed, please say no. This meeting, the motion passes.
This meeting will be divided into three sections. The first one will be a work session where we will hear, and discuss presentations that do not require a council vote, followed by a closed session, and then we will have our regular business meeting at 06:30. Today, we're gonna, get, all things transportation, in in a budget brief. So, city manager Sanders? Good evening, councilors and members of the public. This is, budget brief number two of three.
In the next meeting on the fifteenth will be your third and final budget brief. This, has been, part of the process that I've implemented in bringing to you, an opportunity to take a sneak peek into the budget drafting process. And the point of the exercise is to, in each of the of change and adjustment that fall into, these different categories. And the goal would be to help you begin to see, how how easy or
not so easy it is to pull the budget together and to, of course, bring you a balanced budget, which is what I'm required to do. But the desire that I have for you is just to highlight in these budget briefs, challenges that we are facing, and opportunities that we might be seeing. For this transportation conversation, I ask for, multiple staff members to be present so that they can join me up here at the microphone because they're the experts and can speak to some of the details that may be formed in the way of questions
from each of you. But I'm gonna walk you through a series of slides that just highlight, what I just described about, what's going on with transportation and how it is fitting into the budget for f y twenty seven. So I started in the with the first round of, the first budget brief to tell you that I was looking at three budget drivers, transportation, affordable housing, and schools as investments. And then I shifted and said that, nope. We should never miss an opportunity to talk about public safety. So we talked about that in the first round.
And then I pointed out to you that schools are to be determined. Your, joint meeting later this month with the school system will be the opportunity to hear from the superintendent where he will give you, an overview of where he sees things going in regards to pulling putting their budget, draft together for the school board to approve, and then we will, get that information and begin working that into hours as well. So just looking at transit, one of the things that we're pointing out to you and more or less revealing to the public as an additional approach to trying to
prioritize, changes for transportation. We have heard loud and clear that there's a push and a desire for there to be more drivers, therefore, enhanced service. So we have, identified in the f y twenty seven budget the opportunity for us to phase in changes over the next four years. This has been some serious work that we've done internally. We engaged our finance committee of which a couple of you serve on. We have engaged, Albemarle County as well because whatever we do in the way of
changing the service delivery, of transportation and it is increasing their costs, which is why, you see Ryan here. He's not infiltrating. He's learning as well and Trying to make sure that we have said the same things that we told him in meetings as well. But what we wanted to point out is that we see that things have changed and the update that we sought to get, for where we stand with being able to enhance the service. We've been operating, with with the optimization, study that was done that indicated that we needed 82 drivers, to be able to get, enhanced services.
We have now found that that actually requires more than that, by looking at just the the state of of of change today in this evolving world of transportation services. So what we did was internally spend time working through the idea of trying to figure out how the budget could support advancing in a significant way the number of drivers that we have available. We've identified that a 108 operators is the target that we're trying to achieve. Four years is the window that we have pitched as the opportunity to be able to phase that in over the next four budget cycles, assuming that that we can
handle the additional costs in each budget. Of course, relying on, the results of our various tax, tax, our taxes performing and the receivables that come in in various other ways, being able to manage our expenses as well would make it possible for us to see the absorption of about 10 to 11 operators over the next four years plus support staff, which we always try to remind you that it's not just drivers. When you add more drivers, there are other support staff that have to be available
in order for the whole service to work. And we will be trying to work in, the reintroduction of Sunday service, hopefully in the third year of this four year transition, but we won't be able to get to that point until we actually have 90 operators in place. So this is part of what we're trying to prioritize, being able to be responsive to the request that have been made by the public at large, by a number of you who have indicated that you would like to see enhanced service. I'm gonna go a little bit deeper into that in a minute, but the goal would be that we would try to target this as a plan for where we
will focus over the next four years. It doesn't mean that it can't change. We you have already made it possible for transportation plan to be developed. That plan could very easily come back and give us other ideas and other things that we could work on, and we will integrate those going forward. But this would be the commitment that we would like to make sure that we can kick off as a part of the f y twenty seven budget process. So we are now at how many operators? 66. And the plan before this revision would have been to move to What was it? 82.
82 was the number that we have been operating under as the low number with well as fiscal year. Well, not necessarily next fiscal year, but that was the number that we needed to get to. We had not yet committed to any other number. We were talking about six additional drivers at the end of your budget process last year. I remember. Yeah. So that would have been what we would have tried to comply with being able to figure out a way to make fit into the budget. So now I'm telling you that we're gonna be pushing for that number to be more like 10 or 11 based on what we can afford. Alright. And our is this might be happening later in the presentation, but, we've seen several
presentations where there's different scenarios. A 108 operators with this level of service, you know, all of that. Right. With one of the the points that we've discussed, is whether or not we need to get thirty minutes service on every route before you can get fifteen minutes on the routes that people are requesting the most. Right. Are we talking about those scenarios later in this presentation? Yeah. I'll show you. Okay. Yep. Thanks. I'll show you what we what we feel like we can see at this time knowing that this is the beginning of and and the goal would be to continue to try to perfect this as the as time goes by and more drivers and
support staff are added to the system. Transportation infrastructure, we have a commitment to be zero emission by 2050. We have a target that we as a as a city have set of 2040, we recognize that there's gonna be additional investments that are required. We intend for that to be a part of the 2027 conversation, not necessarily driving the 2027 budget, but we do believe that this is really, a conversation that needs further because that might be some places that we can consider to make adjustments to
be able to offset some of the cost that we're, facing with being able to enhance service at the rate we're now discussing. So what does, discussing. So what does service improvements look like if we were to get to 76 operators? Because that's the number we're talking about, adding 10 or 11 drivers, but if we'll go with 10, get you from 66 to 76, then what you see is green. Then what you see is green, more green, the top being weekday with existing 66 operators and the bottom being weekday with 76 operators. The key difference is that you see fifteen minute service pop into the picture where it has not been, and it is not something that we would anticipate being able
to get to without a significant number of additional drivers. And we were going to remind you that our a lot of our focus has been on rounds four, five, six and seven. We have focused on those because we know that there is a high degree of dependency of riders on being able to use those routes and individuals who have one car or less. So that dependency is is is really, identified by their inability to have other choices. So with what we're proposing to you right now is that this is what you will begin to see happening over the next four years of this transition.
As we add riders, you will see, performance improvement. In the past few years, we've been adding drivers and we haven't necessarily been able to tell you what the improvement would be. We've just added drivers because we know we needed drivers. So now what we're trying to do is tie the additional drivers to the actual service improvement that you can see. So, Sam, your previous slide said what it would look like in in in the next fiscal year. Yes. That's what this is. Okay. Because This is showing you what the next fiscal year service delivery would look like. The top being what it is today, the bottom being what it would be with
those additional drivers. Drivers. And then on your Saturday service lines, you'll see that there is, fifteen minute service, part of the trolley system, that comes in, on your Saturdays. And the goal would be again, as we add more, we get more. So we would try to to make sure that we can enhance that to the best of our ability over time. Why would you move to fifteen minute, service on the trolley on Saturday, but not oh, I I'm sorry. I was comparing apples to apples. I'm sorry. Never mind. No problem. That's a good question. Yeah.
Bottom is progress. That's why it's blue. Alright. Alright. So just the summary of the changes, just this was a lot. I'm not gonna read through all of it, and we'll make sure we get this posted because we were trying to make sure I had everything that I needed for this. But overall, the goal would be that 76 operators improvements that we would like to see, which are the items that you see bulleted down below on the second part of this slide. The things that we do get at the top is improved weekday frequency, and that's
something that we wanted to make sure what happened is something that we could really speak to. Why would we do this? Why would we prioritize this over something else? So that we could, really show you as counsel the trade off that you're willing to sign off on by investing this heavily and, transit this way. And then, of course, as I've continued to say and I'm saying it intentionally over and over is and as we add drivers and we get better service and all the things that continue to sit on the list of unrealized benefits today become reality
as we add those different folks. Mhmm. So Sam, do do we have any routes or services now that should be either eliminated, and maybe there's some areas that we're hearing from residents or from studies, whatever, that we should add that we don't have any now? There's always a request for service to go where service does not currently go. We recognize that we can't really try our best to make all those things happen because we'd be going in all different directions and that's not really a system that
you can manage. We have considered, do we make recommendations on cutting back? It's hard to take it away because we know that there are some people who are relying on it. And until we can really get, things to what I would consider to be a more optimal level where we're not seeing a sixty minute route anywhere in our network, then I don't think we can really trust that we've really proven that we know enough about our system and its mechanics. Right. I know we have some different routes. I just over it was Friday morning. I took a client, a resident of Pacham to Crozet because he had a job
out there. But I'm not sure, Mike, if it's a jaunt route or if it's, you know, that but it's it's a lifesaver. You know, it doesn't run all the time, but for for them to go out there to work at the warehouse and come back Mhmm. Is services like that that, you know, we're kind of piecing different things Yeah. Together. So Yeah. And I and like I said, I have others here and I'll I'll let Garland come up and explain anything else that we might wanna go into greater detail on. But I'm sorry. Go ahead. Quick just because it's kind of small.
Is that blue extension all the way to the airport? Yes. That is to Hollymeet. That's to Hollymeet. But it does include a loop to the airport. Potentially. I know we talked about that. Potentially. But that was that's part of that's part of the county's request to be able to reach Hollymeet so that then remain conscious of where it is that people are trying to get to in numbers that we can prove. So then we go into infrastructure for transportation, bus shelters and bus stops, have been
a hot topic. I've continued to laugh about the idea that when I had my first town hall taking this position, a number of the questions that came in were about sidewalks and bus stop shelters. And I'm happy that we've been able to deliver. So in 2025, you see there we have, shelters that were completed. Some that we did ourselves, some that we did in partnership, which is also great to be able to, to realize, especially when we partner with developers themselves for projects that they're doing and add a bus a bus stop or shelter.
And then we have a series, currently in design. So there'll be additional moments to see that this infrastructure is coming in to support the individual who are having to wait for the bus and give them the protection from the elements. I think that is something that we definitely wanna continue to prioritize and get them wherever we can make them make sense. And then sidewalks, as I mentioned, I guess that's probably become my favorite topic and I talk about it so much. We completed projects. We were able to add our own concrete crew back to the city itself. So we've been able to push, more projects out and and not find ourselves, focused
on trying to see if we can put enough projects together to get someone to bid on them. We've been able to do a number of things ourselves, and we have a series of projects and design, Prospect Avenue, 9th Street at Forest Hills, and a few other areas that are all related to, supporting safe routes to schools because a lot of our work today has been prioritized in that manner since our school routes, our walking zones have been increased or expanded. Urgent infrastructure improvements, you all heard me kinda share that term, in response to a
pedestrian fatality that occurred in October 2024 on Elliott Avenue. Avenue. It has really allowed us to, refocus the team on trying to figure out, what is our approach to prioritizing safety improvements. We were able to go back over a good number of lists that have been accumulating over the years. We hadn't necessarily been working each of those lists in the order that they even occurred in. We were able to pull the, bike ped advisory committee back to the table and engage in in a real conversation with them having, $500,000 that I requested of counsel
to make available to give them then the task of identifying which of these projects are urgent projects, how many of them can be done with the expectation that they will be done, by the end of this month, actually. There were 34 projects that were identified and a good number of them have, found their way to completion and are very close to being completed. Yeah. Alright. I'm looking at at Ben to tell me yes. So we've been continuing to push through on that. I described it as urgent infrastructure because, of course, it was a a finite amount of money that was made available for that series of projects, but all infrastructure is
urgent. So now we've been really able to to beef up our process and the goals that we can hopefully churn out infrastructure projects to completion. I mentioned safe routes to schools. We are always looking at additional ways that we can strengthen the routes that our our children are having to take on their path to school and that is walking and on bikes. So we prioritize a number of additional improvements that support their ability to do that. We have photo traffic enforcement in three school zones that we have not had before. We're still working to perfect that system and make sure that people, really honor the
fact that there are young people traveling, early times of the day and need them to pay attention to them. And we're gonna continue to do quick build interventions that we think will help support that in different areas that make it a little bit easier and safer. And then we have our ADA transition plan. A lot of the items that came out of the ADA transition plan were very much focused on sidewalks, or curb ramps primarily. We have spent a good number of years identifying the need to do these projects, and now we're going to focus on actually getting those projects done.
We've done a lot of internal shifting and changing to how the team will consider thinking about these projects and having completed the transition plan, earlier this year and now engaging the the public advisory committee, then the goal will be to prioritize projects and then begin delivering them with what you all agreed to in the last budget, which was to allocate $2,000,000 into each year of that five year CIP to make sure their projects can get done. And I continue to remind you that that is simply a down payment because that
transition plan identified well over a 150,000,000 worth of improvements that need to occur across the city. So $2,000,000 a year really is a drop in the bucket. And because we are doing this work to basically demonstrate best effort, that is the best effort that we can identify until more money would be identified through the selection of projects by the committee, which is what I will be looking for in future years, but also biding time for if we were to ever be visited by the DOJ, I assure you that $2,000,000 a year will not cut what they force us
to do. And we will have to do a lot more than that. So in in the interim, the goal is to get the team to really focus on collaborating with the public on identifying true urgent priorities and then being able to determine what is the budgets associated with getting more projects done, and it could come in well above $2,000,000 a year when we start consistently working on those. And we do have challenges. I don't mind telling you when we have troubles. It's it's sometimes easier if I try to hide it from you, but then you'll find out about it and you'll be bad at me. So I'd rather just tell you the truth.
We've had some projects that remain stuck. These three on this page have been stuck. Meadow Creek Trail, Pollock's Branch Bridge, and the East High Streetscape. The East High Streetscape is actually moving. We've identified some ways to get the budget back in line. So we're working through addressing those matters, and we don't feel a need to come back to council to ask for money. But the first two, will probably be having to ask you for more money and it pains me to do so, but we're trying to not lose the projects. Metal Creek Trail really came in well over budget, for what we had and I'd
already come back to you. I think I've asked you for money twice now on that particular project and it's still not enough. And then the Pollocks Branch Bridge actually is a project scope change because, the construction in South 1st Street has required that it be moved. That now requires us to resurvey the area and to do some additional design work. So before we can even tell you what the needed, funds are, we have to complete that work and come back to you. So both of these are things that I'm working on right now.
Metal Creek is probably gonna come back before you in the first meeting in January, and then the, Pollock's branch bridge item, hopefully, we can make that happen shortly thereafter. Sam, do you know what's causing the backup? I mean, the with, the issues with Meadow Creek Trail, is it? It's been a complicated project. The the crossings have been hard to navigate. There is a Ravenna, easement that was really difficult to also navigate and require significant, construction intervention. And I just think overall, the project, once we were able to get it into
the hands of our capital division in public works, we found that when we started doing the work, we really needed to plan for bigger contingencies, and we've proven now that those contingencies weren't even close. So putting it out for bid because all that time had gone by putting it out for bid and coming back, the numbers just came in dramatically higher. Yeah. So that that's the project work that's happening right now. I think the team is probably done and waiting on me to decide if I'm gonna come and ask you for more money. So we're we're pretty close to making that decision. Success stories because I always love to focus on when we're getting things done because
I hear so often you should do this and you should do that. So this is what we did. We just cut the ribbon on the Rugby Avenue shared use path. I know that was a long delayed and much, debated and, project. And people asked me to go ahead and cancel the project and and take the barriers away, but we got it done. So now it is finished. The Washington Park connector is up next. It'll be shortly, before us, probably having another ribbon cutting moment for that moment of connecting to the neighborhoods and allowing people to have easy access to the park, the
lower level, and then being able to get up top. Our e bike voucher pilot program has been wildly successful. We're gonna be, our sustainability team with the transportation team will be doing assessments on that. I have no doubt they'll ask me for more money. I think they pretty much conditioned me to believe that that's what they're going to do. And I know one of you wants me to do that anyway. So, we're gonna be looking at that and looking support, HR enhancements in the way
of multimodal transportation to work. So we're gonna be looking into that as well. I showed you the picture of the bus shelter, Midway Manor specifically. It's a celebration moment for me because miss Carrie has been on my left shoulder reminding me that you owe me a bus shelter and you better hurry up. So we finally got that done as well. There's a lot more work that needs to be done in that space and we showed you how we've gotten some more done and we have more in the process of being planned. We know that alternative fuels transition is gonna be a big deal for cat. That's why we feel like we need to really take a look at the climate
commitment that we've made with now this new commitment to trying to enhance the services and how to make sure those two remain aligned and within budget. And then our improved collaborations and new opportunities, of course, with Albemarle County and VDOT. CARTA is a great opportunity for us to begin to reimagine regional transportation with our partners there as well as jaunt and find ways that we can serve as many people as consistently as we possibly can and where we can make, expansions. Mayor, as you mentioned, where we can make expansions to reach people and to take
them places that they can't currently go, then hopefully through those collaborations will be how those things happen. Upcoming construction. And before we move on there, I'll just say that with the county, we've been able to commit to, retaining fare free. So that'll be a part of the budget. You'll see that as a highlight in the budget as an expense that we're not asking you, to absorb what we're asking you to absorb, to be able to keep the service that way. We think it's important for us to be able to try to rebuild our ridership. And one of the best ways to do that is to simply say you can get on the bus whenever it passes.
Upcoming construction. Our public works team, that capital division that I mentioned has been working really hard. It's reconstituted team of project, managers, engineers that are working to get projects moving. We are slated to have a good number of projects underway in 2026. So we'll say out loud, pardon our progress. It will impede your ability to do some things, but when it's all said and done, we'll all be happy for it. And we have, projects planned all the way through completion in 2029.
And we have EV charging work. Our office of sustainability is working hard to identify, where we can put charging, how how much, what's the right amount, do we incentivize individuals for charging in certain ways? And we are really having internal conversations, with our fleet manager in regards to the municipal fleet. Where can we make the conversion? What is, the best way to go about doing that over time? We have started, looking at opportunities to begin that transition in the next couple of
years in our CIP. Therefore, accounting for some of the increased vehicles. But over time, we might also be able to, reduce the size of our fleet because we are finding that there are some moments of underutilization. So if we can eliminate, cars that we are currently carrying as a part of the fleet, then we can then absorb some of the cost that we may find in the higher cost for EV. And keep in mind that Charlottesville is quite small and electric bikes are EVs as
well. Yes, ma'am. Thank you. So I went through all of that because I really wanted to save time because I imagine that you may have questions, and I wanna let the folks who can go into greater details than myself, come up and and speak to you as well. But we have done the CIP public hearing with the planning commission that happened last week. If, you are interested, I would encourage you to go back and watch it. There were a lot of questions and comments that really lend themselves to the, that is politics, and I don't do politics. So you need to speak to counsel.
So there's some things that you might wanna go and take a look at, commentary that was shared in those moments of those are not my call and I pretty much made it that simple and clear in my response back to why don't we do this and can't we do this? We have this budget brief today. The fifteenth is the third and final one focused on affordable housing. And then on the eighteenth, as I mentioned, you have a joint meeting with the school board. I'll be making my annual presentation, on March 2. That'll be my chance to bring to you a balanced budget.
Right now, I don't see it. Working on it. We we have a lot of things that we still have to try to make come together. It looks a bit challenging at this time, but we'll definitely have more conversation over the next few weeks on how we reconcile that. Budget adoption is scheduled for April 9. So that's what we're charging towards is our mission that we must accept as it is presented. So that's it. If you have questions, I'll stop and let you pose any further questions, and I'll invite others to come up. And I'll actually extend to them a chance to come up if they want to,
if they wanna emphasize anything that I didn't go with. Before I ask counsel if they had questions that, did they did, yeah, others wanna come in up now or You have to feel Okay. Are you sure? Okay. That means I did a good job. See? I like that. I don't they helped me do this. So I I trusted them, and and I worked with what they did. Leaving you hanging out on that page. That too is possible. They know I can handle it. So are there any any other questions or thoughts that y'all are having about the budget transportation as well? I'm gonna offer the, invitation to to Jen if you had any questions or anything.
Okay? Michael, do you have any? With the drivers, what's the cost between the number of drivers we have now and that goal of it was a 108. Correct? I knew somebody was gonna you go over there. I knew somebody would ask me a question that I wouldn't have off the top of my head, and I told Chrissy she didn't have to come. Garland, director of transit. You asked to the 42 for the one o I mean, which one? To the $1.00 8? Yes. Compared to where we are now, it's the increase in cost. Just for the drivers, that is 3.3
almost $3,400,000 just for the drivers based on today's cost. So it's not counting for the time of adding some every year over the next several years in the inflation? Have collective bargaining changes that'll automatically increase that. Yeah. Sorry. I interrupted. Oh, you're good. So yeah. So over a period of years, just try to bake in, you know, at least 3.5, but more than that, into our annual operating budget, which I think is harder than, you know, the onetime expense of purchasing, you know, a bus. So, definitely, we'll take a lot of planning there. With, definitely, we'll take a lot of planning there.
With the recent state level election, are we anticipating, changes in the amount of funding that would be coming to public transportation for cat? I'm gonna there's a lot of proposals that are out there that could potentially change the funding model to, fixed route transit systems like myself and then for the rural side also like Mike. That's the current administration going out, and there's a recommendation that will go before, CTB,
the Commonwealth Transportation Board. Not sure if that's going to make it through the committee or not. So, I mean, there's a lot of things that are floating in in the air, but, with the current administration, there's some potentially harmful changes that will happen for for Cat. But the new administration going, coming in, there's speculation about, providing more money for public transportation. So we'll have to see how that pans out in the, general assembly session starting January.
But the baseline is we were potentially anticipating, like, a loss of funds. The new baseline is perhaps possible, likely. I know you can't speculate, but that's no longer the case and then maybe additional money on top of that. There's things that we can do as a, organization, as a region together to potentially find more money. But, as far as the incoming administration, there has been a speculation that there will
be more money for public transit don't know what that is, but, I'm hopeful that the potential cuts that, you know, for cat, there would have been somewhere between potentially 600,000 and a million dollars, will not materialize. So, let's keep our fingers crossed and that CTB won't elect those changes, out the as this administration walks out the door. Mhmm. And I know this has been explained before in the past, but why do bus shelters so one of the major reasons that, bus shelters take so long is there's
a huge planning process that has to go. There's a site plan for every single bus stop that has to be done. That site plan process can take anywhere from four to six months. And then, once that is done, then there is, the internal processes of each jurisdiction to get the the final okays, and then we can get to construction. Depending on when the construction processes are going to happen, if it's in the winter,
it's hard to to lay concrete in the middle of winter. So it's a timing issue of when we can make it happen also. So we're really only talking about spring, summer, and early fall. And if anything falls in the kind of winter section, we really have to wait, until the spring to kinda delay concrete and and make the the final pieces happen. So it's just unfortunately, it's just it it just takes a while. Is that state level regulations that are imposing the site plans and that length of process? Yes. It's it's primarily our, the the agreement in Vidot right away.
Has to have a hand in it and they have to help us and, approve there's an approval process on their side of the house also. So, I think part of what the frustration that we all have is, transit agencies are being asked to move faster and putting stuff in, but they wanna be, the the folks who are giving us the money whether regardless was the feds or the state wanna make sure that, that the infrastructure we put in is going to be permanent, that, you know, you don't get, a situation where you put down a bus
pad or put down a shelter. The community has a a complaint be asked to move. You have to continue to move it, so you have to start that process all over again. So that's really why this process takes a little while. I wanna make sure we've gone through all the vetting processes. And and if there's any community pushback, then we can alleviate that before we start actually implementing this stop. Mhmm. Thank you. Separate from transit with the quick build projects at this point, what is the feedback
you've heard or your assessment of how successful it's been? Hey there. Ben Chambers, transportation planning manager. We've gotten some mixed feedback on it, and we're also looking at big data to see if there are any changes to speed volumes, that sort of thing. We also have some quick builds that are still on the list, not the ones that were urgent transportation improvements, but ones that we have worked through in the past. They're up on our web page right now. We're looking at, you know, what's the priorities for putting those in next year based on what we've learned from this year. How how do we need to engage the community on things that we have identified
in the past but wanna make sure we're putting on the ground correctly in the future. Mhmm. Yeah. And, you know, it's it's hard to know any anecdotal, but, likewise, I've heard, you know, some positive things. And I think the negative thing I've heard the most is just that the plastic bollards are so quick and so cheap that they fall down in a strong wind and drivers ignore them, knock them over very frequently. And, I know that's kind of the in part the nature of quick builds, but I don't I don't know how effective the plastic bollards are.
Yeah. That's exactly part of the the purpose behind the quick builds is figure out, do the bollards work? That's a pretty quick cheap solution. If we can find scenarios where that does does work and isn't gonna get torn out of the ground very easily, we would like to be able to use that as a tool at our disposal. It's not gonna be the perfect tool for all uses, and we're learning which ones it's not a great tool for. Certainly. Yeah. And, obviously, you know, protected bike pedestrian lanes are the ideal, but I understand it's a long way to get there. We we do have some constraints with our right of way for getting there, but
we're working on plans for that. And with the safety improvements, you mentioned, you know, looking citywide at traffic safety improvements. What are those what is being looked at citywide, and what is the criteria for when a safety improvement should or shouldn't be made? Actually, we've done a little better than citywide. This past year, we adopted our region safety action plan that was done by TJPDC, along with all of the jurisdictions around us. And within that, we have a chapter that looks at just city of Charlottesville, what
are the hot spots that we need to address, what are the kind of projects that we need to look at, in fixing at those locations. Some of that includes stuff that we're already looking at, like projects that we're working on with, v dot, in the 5th Street Corridor, in the 29 Corridor, places that we kind of all in this room know that those are problems. We've we've got plans already in place that US council have adopted already, to guide us till we know where to put those. Mhmm. And, you know, not even necessarily for which projects will be immediately done or put
on, you know, the top of a list, but just to even make a list of something to be done. What's the criteria? You know, something meets v dot standards or it's v dot, you know, within their framework, something should be installed. Like, is that enough, or is it kind of ad hoc? What what determines what it is and isn't put on a list? So I I we may be talking about two different things here. So quick builds, determining what we're doing with those going forward. That'll be a conversation seeing if there are opportunities to move forward with those.
Identifying new safety improvements, that's forward with those. Identifying new safety improvements, through our safety action plan, move safely Blue Ridge, that lays out kind of what the improvements we're looking for in those areas are. We won't have to do too much research and work to come up with what the improvements are that we kind of agreed to as a region. Yeah. I hear that. It would just be great to have, you know, an objective standard. So there's maybe a little less perception of kind of it's ad hoc whether something
is or is not put on a list. And then I it's a little outside the budget, but I would just say I'm I'm concerned if we're looking at speed limit reduction citywide. I'm concerned that's gonna slow us down from actually making speed limit reductions because the lift of that is gonna be so big that it's just gonna drag it out when we could identify specific corridors and make those speed limit reductions, I think, on a much faster timeline. And there's already corridors we know, multiple ones that are probably our first priority for speed limit reductions.
And, also, when it comes to speed tables and reducing the speed through that that kind of infrastructure, how often at least we on council hear, oh, that's not possible because of fire trucks when if you just had an offset speed table, they could get through, and that is done in many local localities. Like, really, I guess, also kind of having an objective standard for when can speed tables be installed or not installed because it just feels at least to me, it feels kinda like a gray area. But I know, gray area.
I know. But Yep. So two two things there. The speed limit, discussion is something that we'll be working on over the next few months. It's tied to that big data, set that we're looking at that does speed and volume, and we are looking to see are there opportunities that are just low hanging fruit where we know that people aren't speeding there today and we can reduce speed limits. We're working through that analysis right now. That's also tied to that question about speed tables and where they can be placed effectively. We've put out several of these, speed tables that have the cutouts for the fire
trucks, through their urgent transportation improvements, over the past year, and we're watching those and seeing how have they, addressed speed in those corridors and what can we learn from those to apply to other neighborhood streets. Mhmm. And final question, you know, when we're determining what happens with speed limit reductions, you know, at a local level, are we following the updated Federal Highway Administration guidelines on the eighty fifth percentile rule, or are we still going with that outdated framework of, you know, that we consider that the rule in terms of what the speed limit
needs to be? By the eighty fifth percentile rule is actually the old rule. Right. So the new rule says you should look at the eighty fifth percentile rule, but you should also consider other contextual, things that would be significant. That's what we're looking at right now because the FHWA does not actually describe what those contextual things are specifically. It says things like, look where there may be major pedestrian generators. Well, how are we defining that as the city of Charlotte? So, those are the sorts of things that we're discussing and and looking into as part of that recommendation that we'll bring before you after we've completed some of that
speed data analysis. But we are following those updated guidelines and not approaching the eighty fifth percentile rule. It's kinda like an ironclad rule that we can't violate. Correct. Yep. Okay. Thank you. I'm done. Thank you. Thank you. Natalie, you have me? Yeah. Thanks. Thanks for your questions, Michael. So I had some some similar ones. Bopping back up to the earlier part of the chat, where we had originally planned on the zero emission transition by 2040, but now that was shifted to 2050.
Was that decision made in collaboration with our sustainability team? We haven't changed. The that was a reference to the the goal that is the larger much larger goal is 2050. We, through our planning effort here in the city, have adopted a 2040 plan. So the question is, do we make a shift so that we can get through the fact that the federal government today is not interested? Yeah. Very much interested in in supporting a transition such as the one that we've agreed to do ourselves, that we may need some time. So then we can shift from twenty forty to 20 something else and still hit
the twenty fifty goal. And I think that's what I've identified in conversations with our team that we probably should have as a conversation with you. And that you, think about that a little bit more and engage the sustainability team in that conversation. Yeah. Because I know that's something that was a big topic, starting before I joined council. But, in the intervening couple of years, there's not only kind of less federal support that's coming our way for that, but also if we're then having to make up that, local match dollars, is that the highest and best use of that money?
And so I know the kind of appetite for a quick fast transition of those is the context is different nowadays. I just wanted to make sure that our the sustainability team's part of that convo. Absolutely. Because I know they're gonna be, you know, they're pushing Mhmm. For for and so are some of our local advocates pushing for that. But with the broader context, it's gonna be hard to do that. For the bus stops, I think one of the other things that is a complicating
factor for improving bus stops that has mentioned before, and I wanted to bring that up and double check, is that anytime we touch anything about a bus stop, we have to make it fully ADA compliant. Right? Not necessarily. So it's if I move a sign that's not really affecting a bus stop. But if I pull up the if there is a bench and I pull the bench up, I actually have materially potential to change the bus stop. And we're also going through a review process of all of the bus stops anyway.
So if it's we move something and it's not ADA compliant, we do have to make that ADA compliant before we when we change when we bring it back up. So if we take it offline, we'd have to basically put it back as an ADA. And even if we wanna do something like keep everything the same, but just pop a bench in there, we can't do that because we would have to make the whole thing ADA compliant by adding a ramp and, all this stuff. Technically. Yeah. So, because you'd be creating an ADA violation if you did.
Yeah. So Right. The thing that we wanna make sure we understand is that, we we wanna make sure we're doing whatever we can to prevent individuals can can come back and make a complaint and say that we have materially changed this bus stop. We have not made it ADA compliant. Now we're in violation, which means there's federal, violations then we can be taxed. They can take money from us. They can do all sorts of things, and we don't wanna be in that situation. Right. So the city can't just do a bench campaign, unfortunately.
It seems easy. It it it really does seem easy. City can't. Yeah. Well, that's true. K. I I get what you pointed out. I think part of part of my re my review of some of the settlement agreements that communities have had to enter into, some of the reasons why they got into the hot water that they got into was not because they had ADA violations, period. Every community has ADA violations, and especially one that's been around as long as this one. The the reality is is that they're looking for us to be able to demonstrate
that when the law changed, what did you do differently? What have you continued to do differently to be conscious of the idea that people in your community are having an accessibility issue, and it is your obligation to do something about that? So if they see us creating new violations Mhmm. While trying to fix some of the long standing ones, then we haven't really really, embodied that demonstrated best effort legal concept that I've tried to use, practicing what I
would say on the stand if I had to go to court. I think, ideally, I'd wanna be able to demonstrate that we have clearly acknowledged our problem. That's what the ADA transition plan does. It does not hide anything. Again, a $150,000,000 worth of improvements around the city. A lot of places haven't done that because they don't want to know what that number is. I think for us in adding the money into the CIP was to say it's important to us. It's important for us to talk internally about a culture of compliance as it relates to ADA then we have to make sure that we're not creating new moments.
It's why the Dominion conversation, as tense as that conversation is, is one that we have not let up on. And we're trying to figure out ways to to help them work with us better so that they can then work with their vendors better. And if we say move that pole, it doesn't take three years to move it. Yeah. And that's just, I brought it up just to explain again, like, that's a problem that we're facing when we want to improve bus stops and shelters as quickly as possible as there's all of these other strings that are attached that we're having to
work through. Yeah. And I think our city attorney would advise us to whenever we materially are going to do some improvements that we follow the new law and get to the ADA standard. Yeah. He's shaking his head. And so, let me scroll down to where my notes are. One of the other things that, Michael brought up was the kind of cross purposes of wanting to do traffic call mean and also not wanting to break our fire trucks and how a lot of the traffic calming things that we would think would
be quick and easy and effective would make it harder for fire trucks to respond. And, of course, we want fire trucks and other emergency vehicles to be able to get to the scene as quickly as possible, but we also are aware that most fire truck responses are not for fires, but for medical emergencies or traffic incidents. So there's that catch 22 of if we make the street better, the fire trucks don't need to go as many places, but then by making the street better, the fire trucks have a harder time getting to the places when they're needed.
So something that I had brought up, I don't know when months ago, maybe last year, was a conversation about, smaller fire trucks, which is something that other communities do. And I'm wondering if there has been any continued discussion about that in the department. That so that came up in the CIP conversation last week as well, and planning commissioners didn't like my answer, so I'm preparing myself now. We have not looked to shift, the models that we currently use.
We have ongoing, cycle replacement. So, but we have not prioritized making changes yet. I think we've we've acknowledged that with the changes that we're proposing and we have yet to see materialize as a part of our zoning code change that we're gonna have more development. And for that, the bigger truck is probably the better answer for accessing where we may have density in places that the latter is the only way to really get to the fire. There's been a I'll say a a more than just a reservation.
I think we just haven't really prioritized the the analysis. But there's there's there's a reservation about the idea. Some indications, from some of the comments last week was, well, we have difficulty moving these big trucks down roads. I can assure you, our professionals have figured out how to move these trucks down the roads when they need to. Having ridden on one this summer, I was amazed. What they did with the biggest truck that we have, and still am amazed when I see it going down the street. I think we are probably gonna find ourselves closer to that question of do we
go with smaller fire trucks the same as we've been buses? It's not that simple. And I think where places have figured it out, part of what we need to do is figure out how did you conclude that when you made that decision. Because to go backwards to a smaller truck to only need to come back to a bigger one probably sets you up for, not really being able to serve well. But the answer is we haven't gotten here yet. And and sorry to butt in, but, I mean, I I would just agree that I mean, lots of localities have have adopted smaller vehicles for medical and rescue calls,
and they keep the larger one for natural fire. Yeah. And, you know, I'm just thinking I have a friend who would regularly do a totally legal, allowed bonfire. Every single time they did it, a neighbor would call the fire department. They had to come out. Every couple weeks, they're coming out with the whole truck to look at it and go, yep. That's fine. And that kind of thing's happening all the time, and that's just ridiculous. Yeah. Yeah. I get it. So it is it's part of the ongoing conversation. I'll just say that we we probably can continue to think about prioritizing it. We just haven't done that yet. Yeah. Because I I I would agree that it my vision would be that there's a
mix where, you know, for the the less We would absolutely recommend Yeah. The the the traffic situations don't need the hook and ladder. Yeah. Yeah. I'll say that one of the conversations that I've had with the chief specifically is, one of the things I remember talking to him early on was, do we know, do we need another fire station somewhere? And if so, where in the city do we need it? I think that lends itself to the idea that maybe we can try something, because of where we may choose to serve, from a proximity standpoint by having a different
truck and maybe that's the test case for starting something like that. That work has been done and, right now, waiting to schedule that presentation for us to take a look at that more closely. That could be a chance. We serve the university. That's part of our agreement. They are building a lot more on grounds today. They're building very sophisticated, facilities today that are gonna probably require a little bit more than just one truck response. So there's some questions there as well, and I think there's a real conversation that needs to be had with them. And I've talked to him about that as well.
And they pay us for that. Correct? And they do. And I don't know if they pay us what we need to do. Hey. There we go. Go. Budget conversation. Okay. Thank you. Thank you for that. Because because the the other thing that, comes into play with, and we saw this where it was a quick build by Summit Elementary, which is, you know, on the Safe Routes to School where the bike lane was on the inside of the parked cars, and that had to be reversed to allow a greater right of way for a fire truck to be able to get down that street. And so now the kids and families who were previously biking on the safe side of the parked cars are out in the middle the road.
Mhmm. So it's you know, that's It's the tension of it all. Yeah. Yeah. There's, that's that's too bad. And I wish, you know, the root if the root cause of that is the size of our fire trucks, we're building all of this infrastructure to fit those instead of fitting those into the infrastructure that we're Sure. And I think part of what you you've all heard me say as as this tenure of serving as city manager that status quo is not the land that I live in. I'm I'm constantly interested in in making sure that we have tested while we're holding on to doing this this way. And I think this is another reminder that maybe I need to remind folks that
they should come back and tell me something. Yeah. Especially because I know there's a long lead time on fire trucks the way there is with the bus. So if there's something we're interested in doing Yep. The sooner we're thinking about that, the the better. Yeah. I mean, if things were to change too much more, we might find ourselves being forced to do something like that just because the lead time has grown dramatically for fire trucks. Yeah. I am I'm thank you for including both the challenges and the success stories. It's good to have something to to cheer for and the upcoming construction. That's always something that people wanna know about Absolutely.
And not be surprised by, because that's, that's We're gonna make sure we announce things well ahead. Yeah. As we've talked about before, infrastructure is where people interact with their government the most. So as much heads up as possible, is is good to hear. And then for school zone cameras, are we able to expand them to all the schools, or what's the constraint for just doing it for a handful? Right now, that's your that's your call. We we made this a pilot, and we picked these three schools because this is
where, when the school crossing guards really, spoke highly about doing something because there were a lot of issues a few years back. The initiation of the idea of going with cameras was to pick the schools where we knew that there was significant issue. So the three locations have been selected and deployed for that reason. If that were to be something you all would look to do, I would probably say to you that it's best for us to give it a little time and see what we get out of, the violations that we identify and then determine if you wanna do that.
We I'm sure we can deploy them rather easily. We're still working through the management of that process, though. Okay. Thanks. It's it's still new because we just really started. And then for the the bus driver scenarios, is that gonna come back to us in more depth at some point? Or is that more depth as to I mean, it'll be high it'll be a highlight in the in my budget message to you. So there'll be more information pertaining to exactly what number of drivers, other support staff, all of that will be identified in there.
Okay. Great. Thank you. And then, just back to the school thing real quick. The I I I just went on a trip to a very, bike ped friendly city. And as I did the last time I did that, I sent all of council a trip report with photos of the infrastructure, so I haven't gotten a chance to do that yet. But I'll bring up here one of the things that they had in school zone areas was, the street signs had the regular street sign, and underneath, it said school
zone. So I think for safe routes to school purposes, some kind of delineation so it's visible for drivers. I don't know if that's signs on every corner or there's a blue line down the street that indicates, hey. This is a school zone. Heads up. But something where safe routes to schools are a little bit more obvious to folks who are not participating in that walk to school. I think that could be an interesting and safe thing to to He's making that interactive. I didn't even need to look around. But all the pictures of that, that I will send out Okay.
Along with, some really good daylighting and other things that I got the chance to enjoy bike lanes, that sort of thing. Thank you. Okay. Thanks. You did have a good time while you would have. It wasn't worth sharing pictures the whole Yeah. All my pictures are just infrastructure. There's not a single one of us. It was Main County. It was Dream County. I was I was in Canada. Yeah. Lily. Tired of that voice. Okay. Thank you. I did have a a follow-up one, with Michael, which you were saying about the the impact of funding.
You had mentioned the new administration. I'm thinking about I thought that a lot of our funding that we got for buses were from the federal government. Has that do you foresee that changing? What I was speaking to with the funding was the operation. So there's two pots of money. We get, federal money and then we get, state assistance. I was referencing the state assistance. Yeah. But on the federal side, for for our capital, we've known that, most of that money for alternative fuel vehicles has has dried up or will sunset this year.
I mean, there was just a round of, low or no low or no emissions grant. We submitted our application. Unfortunately, we were not successful. And I'm not I'm pretty sure that's the last year Yeah. That it's gonna happen. So we're probably looking at three years before that, if it's possible that it'll come back. What do we do in the interim? You know, part of that scenario is that we've already started. We've got electric buses that are coming. They're on order. Two of them will be here May '26.
So we're charging hard and getting the infrastructure put in place. We already have two school buses that are here. All the infrastructure is in. So that same process we just did, we now have to do it on the transit side. We still need to make some significant changes to our facilities to manage battery electric busses. That's pretty expensive. Which is why we went out to the low or no grant. So we can actually get a new maintenance facility. But that still doesn't stop the fact that we need to make some safety improvements to be able to handle that infrastructure that's coming.
We're we're working with the state to do it, you know, to follow their normal path. But that's two, three years out. So we still need to figure out something in the interim. So what I foresee is that all of the localities in the state that has a transit system and some great commercials on there talking about, you know, wherever you are in the state you can connect with transit. I think it's really good that everyone will be maybe vying for the state funds even if it's more, maybe more competitive because it's not any on on the federal
side. Yeah. And I think that's part of what we we hope that, our federal administration would calm down and return to focus. Because usually what happens from a Democratic to a Republican transition is that you see the priorities change, but the money still flows. Mhmm. And transportation, infrastructure, law public safety, law enforcement will be areas that they would invest in. That's not happening yet. I'm not sure when it might happen or if it will happen. That whole FedWatch conversation I started with you all last year, I still have a
folder labeled FedWatch. There's nothing in it. I haven't been told that we've lost anything. I still concern myself with the idea that we could. Yeah. I mean, that's thank you because I have no wood. But I think ideally that's just something that we remain conscious of. But what is materializing is less likely for these other investments that we would expect to come out of the federal government are not happening because they're being used in other ways. So that's the shift. So if we were to with the budget we approve on May I'm sorry, April
9. Improve, you know, approve 10 or 11 additional drivers. Right. First, would, you know, do we do you foresee any issues in hiring that many drivers in this in this environment? And second, will we What do you mean? Yeah. I'm sorry. You saw him look right at you? No. I asked that question. I'm sorry. Yeah. Would, and secondly, would we have vehicles for them to drive even if we we could? Take the vehicles, first. We are at a point now that, we have the capacity to add the additional,
bodies. So vehicles is not an issue until we get roughly around 90 to 95 drivers. So just keep that in mind. Okay. I'm hopeful, though, that we're talking about capacity to train folks and if we hire 10, I'm, I don't I would just say in the last six months, we have had more, applications processed than we've had in my six years being here.
It's interesting. You can see actually in in their resumes, their applications. Some of those have been let go from federal positions. So they are coming to what they perceive. I assume what they proceed to be is a more stable, work environment, with great benefit package, which the city has. I think our capacity is probably, fifteen sixteen is the is the max. And we've talked about that number that we feel comfortable with our, limited amount of,
supervision to train, because it's they have to get the number of individual hours, what they train her to be able to qualify. Fifteen, sixteen is probably the max. So ten is is a is a good number for us. Got it. And I would just say that we we have to be conscious of the cost associated with whatever the number of new drivers that we add, whether the market will produce 15 or 16 drivers as mister Williams is pointing out here, I then have to be pragmatic about the idea that I've gotta make it fit into the budget.
And I've gotta make it fit into the budget with eight other priority areas that you gave me because you all were unwilling to reduce that number for me. Yeah. And there are other things that aren't really on that list that still come at a significant cost. And it's it's the market producing the bodies to actually fill the seats, and then there's your ability to afford that just the same. So that is where that tension that we've talked about in your retreat back in August, that's what what we're really trying to prioritize. I would love to be able to say to the community at large that really
wants to focus on transportation, let's get 40 drivers. I don't know that if I said that we had the money to pay for it, we would find 40 drivers. That's that's a real question. And then on top of that, do we really have what we need in place today as they start to to join us to actually be deployed in an effective way that that screen that I showed you changes before it becomes painful that they're here and we don't even have a route for them to run or something like that. A lot of my conversation that I've had since I've been in this seat has really been not about rushing into doing things because we just want it done, but
it is pacing. And I know that's not comfortable for a lot of people, but I think that's what we have to do so that we can really do this right and do it the best way we can because I would hate to make the change tied to tax increases. And then it not work because that's that probably is the worst example of what we could do to our larger community to tax them and then not actually get them the enhanced service immediately. And it takes us forever to then fill all the seeds to get the enhanced service, but yet the money has come in and now I have a surplus, which I love surpluses.
Mhmm. But I don't want big ones. Because if I have a big one, then something's still off in how we're managing what we're doing. And my goal has been to try to help you avoid increasing just because. Yeah. And my last comment, and I know you have a couple more, is the comments about amenities. And, you know, when I'm out a lot of time, I may send you a picture or something that I'm walking and Mhmm. Of overflow trash can or something at a bus stop. Stop. And I'll send it to you, you're like, oh, Juan must be walking walking again.
So, but what is the process I mean, is there like someone that I don't know if it's if it's from CAT or Public Works that rides around and and look because that that's a big part of people who see that it's not, you know, tidy, then they may not want to get on it, you know, the bus. So we do have, I have very limited staff. I have two individuals that help with cleaning bus stop shelters. We do that periodically, twice a year, normally in the spring and the summer.
That's just the capacity that we have. But the the primary, pinpoint for us is pinpoint for us is when the public really tells us if they they spot an issue, and then we will send that crew out to take care of, whether it's, you know, a dog has used it at the at this bus stop or someone's hit the, a bench or something along those lines. We're relying really on the public at this point. I don't have staff that's able to, go around the the city and actually just
continue to monitor what the what our, amenities look like. I would love I'm not advocating for anything up here. I just wanna make sure mister Sanders understands that. Request. Yes. But I I wanna make sure that, our focus is on trying to get you the most reliable transit system that we possibly can. All those other support pieces as we build out, we will maybe able to shift people's, focus and their job duties to incorporate some of that, but that's not our
focus right now. And our focus is trying to get you, the people in the house and get them trained and then also get our, on time performance up, which is, we are struggling there. Right. But you you all see the connection between a tidy stop and people and all those things you mentioned. Mhmm. If people don't see that it's clean and all that, then they won't get on even if it's every five minutes. Yes, sir. Yes, sir. Yep. Yep. That's duly noted. It is part of what we are are looking at and why it it isn't just drivers.
That's that's an a great example of that. Net. Thanks. Quick follow-up, to Juan's question. If people do notice a trash can that needs attending, is a myCville request the best way to let staff know? That's the way we prefer so that we can manage it accordingly. Part of what the reconciliation has to be is that we need to lean on other departments to help because Cat doesn't have the staff to do that. So then the question is, is it parks and rec or public service? Mhmm. Those are things that we're trying to work through now. Okay. And, just in case people don't know, MyCivill is an app you can download and
post pictures and requests for anything from out, a a trash can that's overflowing to a streetlight that needs to be replaced. Okay. The questions that I had were, for these drivers, is this just cat service, or does this include pupil transportation as well? This is just cat. This is just transit. That's correct. Pupil transportation, we have had conversations with Kim and their team two weeks ago. So they will be making a request, as a part of their presentation. Presentation. Okay. Thanks. We'll put a pin in that.
And then I just wanted to acknowledge, the hard work of, folks who have been advocating for fifteen minute routes for a long time, and the fact that we're able to incorporate that into this 76 driver, scenario, knowing that especially the seven is one of our busiest routes, and that's gonna be really helpful for the folks who rely on it. My one question for that, though, is it looks like the fifty minute routes start at nine and end at five. Is there End at six.
But End at six. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. The 05:00 chunk. So for the people getting to and from work, are we able to scoot that out just a little smidge? Not without more drivers. We've looked at the numbers. The it really does fit into the the 09:00 because we're we'll be shifting, to get everybody to work as as much as we possibly can. We're shifting those to to incorporate the the 09:00 hour. So they're not going home. We're, you know, basically moving them from one route to, be able to give you more service on setup.
And would it be possible to since it's that x number of hours to scoot it forward so it would be from eight to five, there's fifteen minute routes? So we could get far actually would require full and no drivers to do that because the model just doesn't work. Okay. And that's part of what we have to look at. I mean, that could end up being a part of the scenario that I can bring to you as it relates to there being a budget gap because I'm anticipating that there will be one. And if that were the case, then that would be for a council then to be able to consider, are you willing to do what it would take to then
close that gap because that would then be a recurring expense if we were to add four more drivers. And that's part of what I will not be able to see without some assistance. Mhmm. Yeah. I just wanna make sure that if we are making it a fifteen minute route, it's the most useful fifteen minute route that we can make it for the folks there. Okay. Thank you very much. I've I've one last question. Meadow Creek Trail. Uh-huh. I'm not gonna use the word boondoggle because it is a project with a lot of positives, but my memory is correct. I think when this started years ago, the city's hoped for cost was 500,000.
I think we're at 3,500,000.0 now. And as you've mentioned, you've come back to us twice for request for additional money. What is the size of the request you're anticipating in January? 6 or 700,000. So Somewhere in that ballpark. Part of what I'm trying to what I'm wrestling with is coming back to you and saying that I think we may need to move on and not do the project, but I haven't been ready to do that yet because I wanna make sure that they have been able to check the numbers a third or fourth time and
make sure that we do have what really is the right number. I feel better about the work that's being done today to confirm what the cost is gonna be, but I think that's the number that has been floated. I haven't gotten an official number, but I think that's the number that's loaded. And and hopefully, there's a lot of value engineering to do, but, I think we've done all that we can. So that's why they're trying to probably figure out is there yet anything else we can do to get that number to stay in that area. A rope swing. Yeah. Zip lines. Not ADA compliant.
So no. We don't do that. Ferry. So it'll be, like, $4,100,000. And at that point, would there even be an assurance that that is the It would be because I'm not coming back. We would we really are at a point though, I believe that where we are is that, we would probably be be able to start next year, and it wouldn't take us too long to get started after we clear the long eared bat situation that prevents us from doing construction. So if we get that squared away, which is the spring, then I believe that
we would be able to make significant movement forward. But that's the reason why I've more or less pressed the team to make sure that if you come back, which they've said they've got to come back, then come back with a real number. And that number, I hope, can be in that range. What's the story with the bat? There's actually long there's bats? Long eared bats in Charlottesville. Yes. And we protect their habitat. So we can't always do things for that reason. Right. And Metaprete Metaprete Trail? I think it's just I think it's in that area. I knew there was an issue with Mhmm. There is an issue with the, it's come up before.
The garden. Yeah. It's it's come up before, I learned about it about three years ago. And we're handling it safely and carefully. Yeah. We leave them alone. Yeah. You know? Let them do what they need to do, and then we get back to work when they're finished. Yes. Any any other comments? I'm done. Appreciate our friends from, far interns being here. You guys rock. Thank you for, you know, coming for this year, seeing, you know, kind of how the sausage are made is made. So appreciate. And Alex with, Impact.
Thank you. So this is kind of, the work of, Impact and it's, the congregations and the mosque and the synagogue. So thank you for being here. That being said, we're gonna go into closed session. We'll be back at 06:30. I have a motion for a closed session pursuant to section 2.2 dash thirty seven twelve of the Virginia code. I move that the city council close this open meeting and convene in the closed session as authorized by the Virginia Freedom of Information Act as follows.
Pursuant to Virginia code section 2.2 dash thirty seven eleven a one for discussion and consideration of prospective candidates to be appointed to the following boards and or committees, the police citizen oversight board and to the city planning commission. Second. All in favor, please say yes. Yes. All opposed, please say no. We'll be back at 06:30. Thank you. Part: 2
Kina, you ready? I called the Charlottesville City Council meeting, regular business meeting to order. Miss Spinks, will you read us out of, closed session, please? I move that this council certified by a reported vote that to the best of each council member's knowledge, only public business matters lawfully exempted from the open meeting requirements of the Virginia Freedom of Information Act and identified in the motion convening the closed session were heard, discussed, or considered in the closed session. Is there a second? Second. K. Can we are we voting electronically, you know? I'm not hooked up yet.
Okay. All in favor, please say yes. Yes. All opposed, please say no. We'll have a moment of silence. Okay. Thank you. Are there any announcements? I have a couple of one is that there will be a two hour delay for city schools tomorrow, and then they will make the, you know, decisions of whether it's to be extended, later, in the morning, but it's a two hour delay. We got a notice of that, I'm sure everyone a couple hours ago. And, I wanna make announcement for d December 13, the Dogwood, Vietnam Memorial Foundation and
Mission Barbecue will have a wreath across America at the memorial, where they will be laying 66 wreaths for the lives that have been lost from this the young men from this, community and women from this community. And there's parking there if you if you need it in the in the in the back, but want as many people to come to that as possible. That's, December 13 at eleven. The, wreaths across America, and that's with Mission Barbecue and the Dogwood Vietnam Memorial Foundation.
Are there other announcements? Yes. I've got one. The final neighborhood walk, sponsored by the Charlottesville Bike Competition Advisory Committee and Ragged Mountain. Running Shop is happening on Sunday, December 14 at 1PM, and it will be the North Downtown neighborhood. These are monthly walks that happen throughout the year, each a different neighborhood on the second Sunday of every month. This will be the last one because it's December already somehow. So again, that is meeting at, 1PM on Sunday, December 14, and the meeting place
will be at the McGuffey Art Center. So I hope everyone can join. Yeah. Other announcements? We have no proclamations this week. So we will go right into the, community matters. And we have three names, signed up so far. The first name I don't see be, Joy Johnson. The second one is Wendy. I thought I saw Wendy. Yes, Wendy. Hi, everyone. My name is Wendy, and I'm an organizer at FAR. Something that we've encountered a lot over the last few months while organizing against this LD collective development and now the mark on 7 And A Half Street is the
consistent argument that these buildings are worth it because they will generate millions of dollars in tax revenue for the city. Tax dollars are great in theory because they fund the redevelopment of West Haven and Kindlewood and other affordable housing communities. But more tax dollars doesn't guarantee better social services and resources. Tax revenue is not distributed equally to