Welcome to the board of health meeting of April 28th, 2025. Please note this meeting is being recorded and will be available shortly hereafter for scheduled and on demand viewing on any smartphone or tablet. If anyone else is recording this meeting, please notify the chairman. Pursuant to Governor
Healey's March 29th, 2023 signing of the acts of 2023 extending certain CO 19 measures adopted during the state emergency suspending certain provisions of the open meeting law until June 30th, 2027. This meeting of the Chattam Board of Health is being conducted in person
and via remote participation. Every effort will be made to ensure that the public can adequately access the proceedings as provided for in the order. A reminder that persons who would like to listen to this meeting while in progress may do so by calling the phone
number 1508-9454410 and the conference ID is 203284231 pound or join the meeting online via Microsoft Teams through the link in the posted agenda. While this is a live broadcast and simal cast on Cadam
TV channel 8 and 1072, despite our best efforts, we may not be able to provide real time access. We will post a record of this meeting on the town's website as soon as possible. I'll turn the meeting over to our chairman, uh, Dr. Noble Hansen. Uh,
thank you. It shall be the policy of this board to conduct its meetings under the open meetings law so as to encourage public participation whenever time permits and as part of agenda item discussions. Okay. So we have three things on the agenda today. But first
let's establish a quorum and when I call your name please say uh present. John Beckley present. Ron Bowman here. Dick Edwards present. Ron Weiser present. And Noble Hansen I'm present. And we have one alternate Joanna Kale present.
Okay. Um, first on the agenda is a definitive subdivision plan review for Eastwood Company Business Trust, 1551 157 Bridge Street, Clark Engineering. Good afternoon. David Clark, Clark
Engineering on behalf of Eastwood Companies. Uh Susan Leoo is from Eastwood Companies. Can you speak up a little bit more there? Um David Clark, Clark Engineering on behalf of Eastward Company. Susan Leoo is also uh here uh remotely.
Hello. Hello. So, uh the board saw this last fall. Uh it's a two lot subdivision on Brid Street. Um all the lots conform to u the zoning uh except for the one lot that's considered a panhandle lot
that which requires uh planning board approval under the subdivision control law. Uh all lots both lots have adequate soils for a title five system uh in that uh there already plans on file uh the
two previous houses that used to be on the property. So, uh there are suitable soils, uh town waters available on Bridge Street and both WS would be served. Uh under the subdivision control
law, the the board of health's review uh is to make a determination um which lot, if any, is unsuitable for the on-site disposal of sanitary sewage. Um, as I stated, uh, there are plans on
file for Title 5 systems that are in full compliance with the regulations. That's it. Yes. Can I ask is the plan for this subdivision to have a single shared uh, No, it' be separate systems.
Separate. So that Yeah, because it what it says here. It says if it's only if it's three or more do you have to have a shared I mean this this is a little confusing this oh on your nitrogen regulations. Yeah. Yeah. Three or more lotation. Yeah.
Um have you have there been any changes between the um preliminary subdivision plan and the definitive subdivision plan in terms of lot lines and offsets? No. No. We just provided additional details as required by the planning board. All
right. Um, David, did did they demo the h? Was there a house on there? There were two houses on the They demoed them three years ago, four years ago now. Oh, okay. And um Yeah. So, both lots will have to meet the nitrogen loading regs, but they don't need a shared system
because there's only two lots. So, so they're um I guess three bedrooms on each lot or Oh, that's that's the uh zoning buildable up. Yeah, I don't know what the upland is for us. Yeah, we would be able to include the portions of the
flood plane under the nitrogen regulation. So, uh um possibly four bedrooms for each one. Okay. Yep. Um, other uh questions or comments from the board? Um, any uh comments from the
uh public or online? I don't see any. No. Right. And then Judy has reviewed things and um has recommended that we um grant approval. Um does anybody want to make a motion?
I'll move that we approve this uh variance or this subdivision request. Ron second. Okay. And then um we can go ahead and take a voice vote. Um say I if you approve. John Beckley I. Ron Bowman
approve. Dick Edwards approve. Uh Ron Weiser approved. Noble Hansen approves. Okay. So that uh definitive subdivision plan is approved. Thank you. Thank you. So now this will come back to us when the houses are being developed.
Only if it needs a variance only if it needs a varian. Right. All right. Can you explain in section two of these regulations? The last line says each parcel affected by this section be allowed to have one additional bedroom
upon approval of the board of health. What what does what's that all about? division of land involving existing dwellings resulting in partial. That's interesting because that's was based on our regulation, our nitrogen loading regulation. We may need to look at that.
Um well, when they say uh each 40,000 square foot of No, no, I know. Just the in general yes regulation it says uh each par install an all site subserve sewage disposal system that
provides nitrogen removal technology. Does that mean an IIA system or is this just a standard? Yeah. So, it's saying that any new subdivision that has existing homes on it needs to add an IIA system and will
automatically be allowed an additional bedroom if it doesn't meet the existing regulation. So, say it was say there was a house on one of these lots that was um the lot they're creating is 30,000 square feet.
um we and they've had a four bedroomedroom house, we would make them put an IIA system in because it's non-compliant and we were allowing them to put an additional bedroom, which is what we used to do. So, we need to re
Yeah, we probably should regulation to state that it has to meet the current Yeah. bedroom requirements, right? and and um we have to look at you know we're going to talk about bedroom definition and those definitions are in our nitrogen loading rig so I can make the
changes at the same time if we make changes in the regulation as far as bedroom um definition so we can relook at that catch because I didn't catch that right but we would never
allow more than one bedroom than what you're allowed by right with IIA technology we would never go above that for any reason. Um, right. I mean, we're we are allowing one more with IIA now. If it's only, you
know, if it if they're just meeting it now, we would allow one more. But if it say it was a 30,000 foot lot and it already had five bedrooms on it, we wouldn't allow right that. Although reading this, it suggests that we would. Yeah. And I think the at the time the
thought was because we're taking a dwelling that's not changing, we're just changing their property lines that we would allow them to do that by putting in the IIA. I was at the meeting on Sun whenever it were last Friday or
Thursday with Andrew Gotautle about the water uh issues in Chadam. and he was talking about IIA systems and he made a point
that IA systems um in homes that are seasonal do not necessarily work because if the if the home is not occupied for
three or four months, the bacteria in that IE system is wiped out and it takes three months for the average IIA system to reconstitute enough bacteria for that system to work. And then I told him about our experience with the the board
of health testing our systems and he said yes. He that's exactly true. He says he's looked at hundreds and hundreds of systems on Cape Cod and a high proportion of them do not function at the 19 milligram nitrogen standard that they're supposed to. And many of
those are because of seasonal occupancy. He also said there are expensive systems and cheap systems and the expensive ones tend the work and the cheap ones like the fast system uh often fail. We and and so he is very anti-IA
technology. He's certainly anti- adding additional bedrooms uh uh with the excuse that IA technology solves the problem. Uh and at the minimal uh he would be in
favor of only allowing the IIA systems that are more advanced in their technology and better. But he's he he doesn't like IA systems at all in homes that are seasonal. So this this would
definitely be a topic we can get into more. But I do want to say that George Hoyfelder, who was is the guru for um innovative alternative systems on Cape Cod, um he's the founder of the IIA testing center, he always said that yes,
they don't work as well on seasonal homes. But you also have to factor in the fact that if a house is not occupied for three or four months or even six months a year, then you automatically have a 50% reduction in your in your nitrogen. So you they do take a while to
start back up in the spring. Um they need to you know they need to be fed in order for them to work. And on the third hand many of these systems are now seasonal rentals that are occupying far more people than
ever than ever occupied them when they were a single family. And those are all topics we've talked about. So like the house next to me currently has eight people living in it in April. So is there is there a
workaround? Is there a way to bring in a uh a maintenance person in January and uh and February and seed the system with a live I mean are there any I mean it it depends on the type of the
system. If it's if it's something that has to have a blower on, the system has to actually be working. It wouldn't do really any good probably to seed it. Um, if it's not I'm just wondering out loud. Is there Yeah. I mean, I think it would depend on the system. So, I I think that
this is a discussion that we didn't complete, but we were we wanted to look at the list of IA systems. Yep. Which ones work and which ones don't work. FAS is the least expensive, so it tends to be used. Are there ones more expensive that work better? Can we have a could we
have a shorter list than the state list? Um and then learn more about the IIA technology itself. But that's a discussion for us. So this not really on the agenda. We precondition the approval of of a u what's the system you just
said? Fast a fast system to couple that with an owner's uh commitment to uh for year round residency. In other words, could you put a condition that it's not used for short-term rentals? I think we've actually talked about and also that that
this house is going to be operated is going to be occupied year round. So then allow me to put a fast system in. But the whole discussion of IIA systems, there's a state list. Yeah. Could we have a smaller list? Yeah. Of systems
that that are, you know, work better uh under certain conditions. Yeah. I think and um recently we did have someone come in but they they had that one study which isn't a the whole picture. Who is Mr. Gotale? He's he's the uh he's the
director of the uh APCC the association for the preservation of Cape Cod and before that he was they're lobbying group they also water systems on Cape sort of a conservation activist he's very knowledgeable he's been an environmentalist on Cape Cod for right 30 years 40 years probably that that
would be yeah so wouldn't we have a big discussion we could that that would I think this would be an interesting policy discussion to have because there may be choices and conditions under which we could allow A
but not B. Problem with that we have to discuss we probably have to discuss this on an agenda item. House is sold. Just one quick comment that would have to apply to the buyers. I think I think we ought to do this sooner than later because we dance around this every and
we we probably chew up 15 to 20 minutes most every meeting dancing around the same thing. I think if we get an expert in here, right, and pepper him with the questions, I think or a couple legitimate decision. Um, that's right. And it all gets into when you test it, what the test means. They the test is a concentration. It's not it's not a total
volume either. It's so the whole thing is okay. So I can for another agenda, I'll get somebody from the county to come back. There's um new people on staff. They're they're doing best available technology reviews. There's a lot list of the system the state systems
which ones work better. Can we actually It's all It's all being wor looked at the data. That was one of the things that's it's kind of a work in progress, but I I definitely we'll we'll put it on an agenda uh for probably June maybe. One of the things that we should know
before that night is what a retrospective analysis of the last x number of years in Chadam identifies as the distribution of systems. In other words, during that 10
years have been 86 installations in Chadam. And here's the distribution. Of those 86, you know, 60 have been this type, two 20 have been that. kind of give us that slide. He had a slide. The woman the woman had a slide. Yeah.
Showed all that data. Okay. Uh the Cape for Chadam. No, for Chadam. Chadam. Okay. That that about 80 systems in Chadam. Okay. They said which ones were asked which ones were this which Okay. So it data exists already. Yeah. It's a major discussion. we have to put it on
as an agenda item and get get a whole thing set up because uh yes uh it wasn't wasn't on the agenda for today although it's an important topic. Okay. Um okay so now we have uh uh our second thing on the agenda is a
follow-up discussion uh revisions to bedroom definition and I would say this it's a discussion um we don't have uh a time frame of when this has to be done. It would require we're talking about a change in our uh
nitrogen loading regulations which would require a hearing and all that. So, but you know, we all know the problem. We look at plans of of architectural plans and we talk about whether this is a bedroom or that's a bedroom when you have and we have rules that are that are
sometimes hard to interpret. Mhm. Um so Judy has put together um some uh suggested changes to our board of health [Music] uh rules about bedrooms and did you want
to say something about that, Judy? Um well the last meeting we we briefly looked at this and then I also looked at the Hangingham um what their policy was which isn't all that different than ours. just had a lot of narrative around it. Um,
uh, so what what I did was basically we just handed out a copy with red so you could see the where the changes were. Yep. Um, down in where it says living rooms, dining rooms, like the second paragraph, living rooms, dining rooms, kitchens,
halls, bathrooms, unfinished sellers, and I I um or I guess basements, I don't know, sellers, basements. Uh, I put an asterisk and if you flip it over, the asterk means that it the definition of an unfinished means no drywall, finished
flooring, rough plumbing or electrical. And the reason why I think that's important is what we're finding is that people are rough finishing rooms, but they're putting the electrical and the plumbing in and then or or they're they're putting the drywall in and a
flooring and just rough roughing everything else. and then they don't need to get any permits to finish the room off after that. So, we come back, we catch them most of the time when we do real estate inspection reports. Um, but we come back and it's a bedroom, you
know. So, right, we want a a clear definition of unfinished. So, I added that. And then, um, down at the bottom of the first page, rooms over freestanding garages or or out buildings. I added that um that have
heat and a bathroom full or half. Um that's something we can discuss. But you know sometimes people do want a workshop with just a toilet and a sink. Then you find a lot of people are putting a you
know shower into. Um so I added that. Um, and then moving down to the section that describes lofts. Lofts or bonus rooms with one wall open to below or open stairways shall not be considered
bedrooms. However, any room with a full bathroom adjacent will be considered a bedroom if the board of health considers the room to have sufficient privacy. So, this one we can talk about. I'm sure you have. So, this is new. The red the red Well, it's not red here, but you got two
versions. I passed you one that says that just came in just dropped on the desk as well. Anyway, the the the room with a full bath adjacent that's sort of a an out for the board of health if you know
if if we consider that there is substantial privacy. Yeah. Uh even if it's got a 4ft cased opening, right? You know, if it's far enough away from the rest of the house, we could just call that a bedroom. if it's got a full bath, right? Because that this is what we're
getting into. All of these offices and studies and libraries that have a full bath with a shower uh off of that that room, even though there are three other full baths in the house, uh it's pretty
obvious why those full baths are being built. and and you know once it's approved what's to keep anybody from putting a door you know on that 4ft cased opening nothing and then they've got another bedroom
so that if we see something because I think we saw one not that long ago that was just pretty obvious a room said to be a loft or a library or something and it had a full bath and there were three other full baths in the house. Yeah. But we but we have other definitions of what
makes a bedroom. Well, and and it sounds like you don't have to just make it up as we go along. If if if in our sense that room has enough privacy to be a bedroom, uh we can call it even if it doesn't meet the strict right definition
of privacy in these and that's what that was meant to do. Well, that's that's a good point. I mean what you're talking about though is kind of a subjective idea of the board of health whether there is sufficient privacy and then how do you define sufficient privacy but this
phrase that uh Judy has has put in sufficient privacy I mean that opens the door to us making a judgment which will be hard to um you know this precedent and being consistent and all that and then the architects have to know what to
do. Well Ron I you know I liked I like the Hingham one beautifully. I thought it was amazing. And one of the things I liked best about it was this notion of a 2 to one rule for total rooms and
bedrooms. And I it just seems to me if we did something like that that would eliminate to the point about a library, a loft, a study, a sewing room, and on and on. It can. Yeah. But that we already have that but that's not that
that's been in the uh that comes from the state uh it's not in the regulation but we do have it in our policy but that's not but that's we don't we don't always have it we don't always think about it but it's it it is there and it's something that can limit these it's not subjective either. It is to the
point that people will argue what's a room. So if you have a frontto back room that's a living room in the front and a dining room in the back and there's like a twoft piece that from the walls. I would call that two rooms. People would say, "Oh, no, that's I would too." And I
thought in the Hangingham document, they were very clear about casings and other things that would separate. They specifically address the problem of the great room. Exactly. And it says if there's some kind of an outcropping, a cabinet, railing, small dividing wall,
half wall, pillars built into something that that makes it visually uh or moving wise a separate room. You you can call it a separate room. Oftentimes the kitchen will be will have something that where you can call it a separate room. So that's two rooms and that goes
towards the overall count. I I agree. I think that we need to have that total number of room in the regulation, but we only want to use it because it can work both ways. Sometimes the total number of rooms divided by two is going to be less than what we think it is. Well, can't we
word it? Can't we do this? Can't we word it in a way that applies that rule across routinely in addition to the other way of calculating bedrooms and then say the the one that the highest number the
highest number in other words lock it in that way and that's kind of what I've been doing. I had a I had a um an architect come to me last week or the week before and he wanted to know he had a three-bedroom house and every bedroom
he wanted a separate office. So they had to walk through the bedroom to get to the office every single one of these. And um when I counted all the rooms it was like a you know 10 bedroom it was like five bed you know five bedrooms I think
it was 10 there were 10 rooms in the house. So I made him change it. I said, "You can't, you know, you got to get rid of one of these offices or something." So because he had too many rooms in the house and it was going to be more than the three bedrooms that they were allowed. So when you took the total
number of rooms divided, it's only nine or more in title five, I think it says, um, eight or more. Oh, eight exceeds eight. Not including bathrooms always. So, but Ron's suggestion is good in terms of having it be part of the
standard calculation and it is objective. I mean, it just uh it just seems to me since we've been doing this, we've hit a lot of these subjective things and we've never denied anybody. Yeah. You know, I mean, which says to me
I just I just don't think there's enough hard and fast reasons rules in it. And I and I do think if there was a hard and fast rule, an objective criteria, it probably would make it a lot easier for architects as well because they wouldn't have to work around on the edges. Yeah.
If if we could put the language together, but the architects definitely are designing to our rules. There you go. Matt, that the challenge is to write our regulations in a manner with a clarity that everybody understands. But
the Hingham I kind of that intrigued me because there were a bunch of things there. They they they call they they they use the term a degree of privacy and we've always talked about you have to have privacy. They're talking about a degree of privacy. So we see these rooms
upstairs and there's a staircase coming up and there's a little rail and the staircase goes into the bedroom and we say well there's no privacy but it has a degree of privacy. So is there some way to put language in there? Judy has done to a certain extent in and she's used
this term sufficient privacy but then we're left with kind of interpreting which is difficult but I think that's something that I saw in the in the Hangingham thing. The other thing the Hangingham thing address is are lofts. We see a lot of lofts. There's a rail there's one stairway going up. There's a
loft. Um and it you know it's it does you know says a loft addressed by a stairwell less than five feet. They're just try attempting to create some privacy. Um is a separate room regardless of the
openness to the room before. So do we call a would we call a loft a room when we do a total count? Of course. Yes. But we might not necessarily call it a bedroom if it's open to below. I don't think that's an open rail. We wouldn't call it a bedroom. Even though like in
the Caribbean, you know, hundreds of condominiums have their bedroom on a loft, right? We would call it a room. But what what what do we what what about the the upstairs bedroom that has the one staircase going up and there's a little rail and the staircase goes into
the room and it's all by itself like a bedroom over a garage. We me that would be sufficient privacy. Yeah, I thought we did that about a month ago or two months ago. There was a bedroom. There was a room over a garage. Had its own bath and it had a staircase going up
with an open rail and we said that room is segregated enough from the house that it provides privacy and therefore they removed the bathroom. We made them remove the bathroom. Full bath. They went from a full to half bath. They offered that as a way out. That's right.
Yeah. Yeah. Again, if we went with this ratio of total rooms to bedrooms, then you catch all the lofts, you catch all Yeah. But it doesn't work in every case because there may be a house that's mainly all bedrooms. You know, the new houses have
all these extra rooms and so that comes into effect. But if you have a house that's, you know, all bedrooms, then it then it doesn't so much, but it it it can at times. I guess my question to the board is, you know, right now this bedroom definition
is part of two regulations, the nitrogen loading regulation and the subsurface sewage rigs. So, because both of those regs, you know, obviously you need to know the bedroom number. So, I can't I'm I'm going to have to
change it or take it out and do something more like this, which is a policy. I think this holds more weight if it's a regulation. Do you see what I'm saying? No. Say that again. I Right now the the definitions is in two regulations. The
nitrogen loading rag and the and the subsurface sewage disposal regs which is our like local title five. So you mean the state title five? State rules. Our rules. Our rules. Two two different sets of rules. Our rules for subsurface
sewage disposal and our rules for nitrogen loading both have this definition of the of a bedroom in it. Our definition. So I can either change this which is probably the easiest way which is what when you say this changed our definition in our regulations. We'd
have to have hearings for both or we could probably have we'd have to have hearings for both, you know, to change the regs and then probably no one would come to them but and then we would vote and then we would change the regulations. Um the
other option would be to delete them from our current regulations and do this is a guideline. This is not a regulation. This is kind of a um talking about the town of Hingham. Hinghams. Yeah, I'm waving things around here. Ingrams is um a policy, a guideline,
which is why it's so descriptive. Um or we could we could enact something like this as a regulation as well, adopted as a regulation. I I thought that our rules, the bedroom rules came under the n our nitrogen loading
regulation. It does. And then you're saying it comes under some other regulations. It's in both of them. It's in both of them. What's the other one? the subsurface sewage disposal local subsurface that title. It's our Chattam title five. I'm sure you title five. Yeah, it's our local I'm confused by all
this actually. You guys also you guys both we voted these changes a year ago, right? But I I don't It's It's the idea there's two separate sets of regulations. We were dealing with the Cadam nitrogen loading regulation. That's the only one. We the other one too. We did both of them. Yeah, we have.
We did. Yeah. Let me just say if we go to the to the room count, it's got to be an addition to what we already have because an architect could design a house with a with a great room, a big kitchen, and four bedrooms. You
could build that on a quarter of an acre lot because it's only six rooms. That would say three bedrooms. Let's see. I think I think the Hangum policy deals with that because they talk about a great room and how it is actually subdivided by casings and well, it
wouldn't have to be subdivided. You could just have one big room, have dining area, but they always are. Well, but they an architect who wanted to to get around this rule wouldn't would make it just one room. But then they're making a ballroom. I don't think you want I don't think you want to have that
where the kitchen, the dining room, and the family. It it would the definition of a room gets to that total room count thing and then that's separate than the definition which we're talking about separately. Even if it was two rooms you'd have a
two room great room, a kitchen and four bedrooms. That's seven divided by two was three and a half. That would be three bedrooms and you could build it on a quarter of an acre. Right. Well, you you you've got to have an out. You can't just count rooms because they will get around that. I I dis I I really disagree
with that. I really do. And I think you're talking about an unbelievable exception. Somebody No, we we've had the ballroom. What's that? It's just two rooms. We could It could be a a living room, a dining room. A living room, dining room, kitchen, and four bedrooms.
That's seven rooms. That's three bedrooms. Again, if you read this regulation, I think that they really dealt with that very well. How did they deal with that? Because nobody builds a ballroom. No, no. I'm not saying a ballroom, a separate living room, a separate dining room, a kitchen, and
four bedrooms. That's seven rooms. And they tip in that kind of a room, they typically have some sort of a half wall. They'll have they'll have an island that separates the kitchen from the living room. I'm talking about totally separate rooms. A dining room, a living room, a
kitchen, and four bedrooms. I think Ron is talking rooms. How you Ron's talking about how you deal with a great room when you count rooms. No, no, no. But I'm You don't have to make it a great room. It can be two. It can be and a dining room and a kitchen and four bedrooms. That's seven rooms, right? By
the numbers, it's three bedrooms. But in in the five months that we've been going back and forth with this, have you ever seen an architect's plan that looks like that? I haven't seen a new house. I mean, I just saw a house that that had five that had five rooms. It had it had
three bedrooms and three um offices plus a kitchen and a dining room and a living room. So, but a but the great room we always say it's one room. If it's a if it's one big open room, but
then they hang them. If if you have a K a counter that comes out or you know a sitting a big sitting counter that comes out, right? Um and that would make the kitchen by their rules you have an a separate room. So that great room is counts as two rooms. That's goes to the
total count. Um but with Dick's point is that the total number of rooms in the house is an important one to keep in mind. I think sometimes we forget about that. Um there's other things that's in this Hangingham thing. One is that if a basement room is more than 50% above
grade, it is a room and presumably you could have a bedroom. We see some basements that have walkouts and windows and um you know that's the basement. We we just sort of let it go I think. No, no. If it's got a egress and it's got
windows that you can climb through if you can get we've considered those bedrooms. Okay. We've never said that no room in the basement can be a bedroom. We've looked at them. Yeah. Um but what do you I don't what do we do about the room upstairs that has a
staircase going up that's open into the room with with a banister and we look at that and say it's not private because the staircase the stairwell opens into the room. So we say well that's not not a bedroom I think was what we said. This I don't see anything in here where it
says you divide the total number of room by two. in what? In which in the Hingham? Uh just just describing what they consider a room. Um it's uh no it's it's the end of the of it's at
the end of the big purpose uh paragraph at the beginning a proportion two to one relationship between the total number of rooms and how many rooms are considered bedrooms. The the other aspect that I think has come up I'm just throwing these things out because I think it's complicated and
we're not going to solve it today. That's why. Oh yeah. What did you do about two or three meetings ago? We had such a very large large bedroom that went front to back. Um it had a you know like an eight or 10 foot between between
the two and it had a a king-size double bed on each side. Right. But by our rules, that is one bedroom. I I've seen it, but I couldn't go back and dig it up, but there is a town that puts a size limit, a bedroom above a certain square foot
that's presumed to be two bedrooms. Now, I for I don't know what I forget. I don't remember the town, but it seems because we looked at that plan and said, "Well, this is two bedrooms, but by our rules, we have to call it one." So, we all felt like we were the architect had done a good job for their customer. Um,
yeah. No, it's but I think but that's something to research I think and see if we can find the the towns have done that as a precedent because that I think that makes sense. I mean to me because we looked at it long or 40t long and it was
front it was 37t and they even they even showed a bed a bit a bed bed on either end. I mean hello I mean that couldn't have been telegraphed better. It's still a bedroom. It's still one bedroom no matter how many beds it has. So, but for
Judy, if she's going to make a revised thing, you know, I getting at this a degree of privacy or sufficient privacy. I mean, to get some language that helps us sort that out so we can be
consistent. All we need it to be is bulletproof. Yeah. That's why we keep revising this because we keep for the purpose of argument. Yes. And I'm not saying we we're going to do this, but let's just say you've got regulation in two
different pots right now, which we're trying to wordsmith to make it work. If you eliminated that, what two pots are you referring to when you say that? two regulations, the nitrogen loading rate and the subsurface sewer and the state
regul. Let's say let's just say you eliminated those and replace them with what's in the Hingham document with some word smithing. Would that work? Well, it sounds like I think it would. Yeah. Consolidating those two regulations and we would need to have
hearings if you want to formalize it and you wouldn't want to have it be a guideline. You'd have to That's That's what I'm saying. That's why I'm saying replacing replacing what's in there right now just with this word smith a little bit. No, you can't get rid of that. No, we're not getting rid of that.
I mean, well, they use the phrase a degree of privacy, which gives us tremendous uh latitude in determining what a better by just saying a degree of privacy. When when I read this document, I felt like this is a group of people
who have had the same problems. been dealing with for the last 5 months and they came up with a pretty good solution and they explained the rationale for what they're doing number of people in the use. I would assume that whatever we do because it's a regulation we're going to have to go through a public hearing
and and to make sure it's all nailed down there's no way no way around it. So but here's what guidance can we give Judy in setting up the next set of things to look at or think about. So I I think what I if I don't have a I like that
idea because it which idea taking it out of the other two regulations and then making a set aside regulation that's referenced in the other two for guidance. That's what Hingham has done. I think guideline for determining bedrooms. I don't know if this but you
could call it a regulation. It's set up almost like a regulation, but but I I think um I think I would assume that that's what Yeah. what what but they did it as a separate document with a justification for why we're being so picky with all these things and what we're trying to accomplish, which is
pretty we think you we all agree that it's to it's the total human flow that's going in there and out. I think it would make it easier for architects to have something like this to be honest with you. Well, I can I I I you can guess that
they're not going to like the um sufficient privacy as we see it case by case. But um yeah, it better be well what this document doesn't say is which document? the
Hangum document is if by the definition of a bedroom here privacy and 50% floor you know these criteria if this disagree you know disagrees with the 2:1 room
count what do they do right if the 2 to1 room count says there are three bedrooms and by definition there are five bedrooms the 2 to1 room count takes priority that that assumes the bedroom number no matter what else is in there only comes into play if you have more
than more than nine rooms. Eight rooms. Well, there's this says nine. I think title five says nine. I got to recheck that because I think ours says eight and I think that's a mistake. Eight is what we Yeah, I think that's a mistake. Um,
so yeah, I I think All right. So in that by that definition then if an architect did design a house with a living room, a separate dining room, a separate kitchen and four bedrooms, that would only be
three three bedrooms. No, you can't use that because it has to have a total of nine rooms then. So in that case, you have to count rooms. It's it's a total it's it's a a resident um
no the the the bedroom count by total rooms for a dwelling that has nine room total rooms or more about half of the rooms would be considered bedrooms regardless of their physical attributes and the other rooms a mix of living rooms kitchens dining rooms family rooms
or office rooms. So an 11 room dwelling half then round down you'd have a five bedroomedroom house. So it's a methodology even if there was only three bedrooms per our definition. Okay but that can work against you in other the
other way too and this defines what a room is. How does it work against us against well if there's more than 11 rooms and we count four of them as bedrooms. Say there's 11 rooms and in our minds four of them are defined as bedrooms but they're saying only that's
Yeah. You know, they're saying if there's a room, but that count doesn't that count doesn't give you the bedrooms. That count mean count means you have presumed five bedrooms and it's not allowed on your lot because you don't have a septic system for it. But
if they had a Yeah. If they right if they work and we count four bedrooms and they're saying, "Oh, but we can have five because we have a total of 10 rooms." We don't want that. No, but that wouldn't it's right. But I don't think it it doesn't allow them extra rooms because it still
has to conform to the septic system. Right. Right. Yeah. We wouldn't want them to have five. It's it's it's presumed five. So it it presumes we presume you this plan has more bedrooms than your septic system allows. So you can't they can't do it. Can't do it. Okay. Yeah. I'm getting myself confused.
Wonder why it's easy to do with this. Yeah, I I know. But I Okay. Okay. So, um, I think combining the plans and revise it. I think I think it's worth reading the Hangingham plan again. And seeing how they have put things
together. I didn't get a copy of that. It was It was in the packet. Not this time. It was the last time. Oh, you didn't hand it out. Am I It was attached to my um That's the old one. You You sent it out as an email a week or two
ago, but it came I'll make sure you all get it. my packet. I'll make sure you all get it. It was It was stapled to my bedroom definition that was in the packet that without the red stuff. It was stapled to that. Did I just get that? No, you should. I've got that. Everyone should have gotten it. So, look look on the second page of your bedroom
definition without the red print on it. Look at the sec the the bedroom definition without the red print that was in your package. Okay, got it. The second page should be the Hingham thing. Got it. Missing a page now that I'm thinking about. You might be missing a page cuz mine is That's why I was
getting confused. But I would I would say read it because it's obviously a town like our town. They are and they have dealt with this and thought about it a lot. They just don't have a they don't build and and what I'll do is I'll take it and I'll try and edit it for our purposes. I think and the other thing is
is there is there a town in that um uses square footage and presumes it two two bedrooms? I read that saw that somewhere I think but I have to because I think that's you it could be some large you know it doesn't happen very often but
yeah I'll have to was clearly that it was designed that way to me. All right. So, I'm gonna Okay. So, one rule only comes in terms of guidance for Judy to take the next step so we can have another discussion and make some progress. And I this we don't have a time schedule here because it's going to
require a public hearing and we can do it whenever. But I think if we do it, we should try to make real meaningful substantive change and not have to come back right away. That's difficult and and make it mean something and and and help us and help everybody. The
architects are just doing their job. So they'll comply with whatever we do, I believe. All right. So So there's two documents then. There's So are we all looking at this three-page document? Yes, it's hanging. That's That's what you sent out. Yes. Is that
was in the email? Yeah, that was in the email. I had Yeah. Well, somehow it's it's attached, but I think what's attached is only might only be two pages, only right here is only two, right? It's it's front and back. Yeah, it's you're missing a page. You're missing a page. I'll resend. It's
important because the whole room account thing is missing. Oh, okay. All right. So, we'll we'll get make sure everyone has So, how are you going to get you're going to email it out to Diane? So, the three-page Hangingham thing, which is worth reading and seeing how they did it
because I think they have really thought about the same problem we're trying to think about. I don't think necessarily go all the way, but there's a lot in there. That's good. Three pages. Three pages. Three pages. Yeah. Diane, can you mail me a copy because my printer's not working. Mail it. Yeah. The three page
come up and pick it up or let me know. Pick it up. You're driving wasn't included. I am driving now. Didn't pack it today. And Noble, can we also can we also take the premise that we'll get rid of what's the two
regulations that are Yes, that's what we're getting. Yeah, we're not getting rid of the whole regulations, but those sections. But we'll replace it with something that looks a lot like this, right? Okay. I like that. Okay. Yeah. I don't even Can Can you email me the the other
regulation that I don't even think about? There's nitrogen loading, but the other subsurface whatever. I'm not sure I have that. Okay. Other comments or anything else that would All right. So, what So, Judy will do some work. We'll consolidate. We'll come up with some more things. People
will get a copy, read the Hangingham thing, and we'll go from there. But I think that's helpful. Okay. Are we done? No. No. We have one more thing. Another one. All right. Now, this is another Okay. Take a deep breath. Um the
third on the agenda is review discussion of revised transfer facility regulation and proposed refu refuers registration form. So this has to do with um does all the waste coming
to the uh transfer station is it all in town waste basically Chattam waste and it's been brought up as an issue because Brewster does not accept any commercial um dumping in their transfer station. So the first question question is where is
old Brewster's trash going? Um and then there's some tightening up but there's three three parts of it. One is um the application form which did not emphasize the fact that they can only dump Chattam waste. It didn't emphasize
it. It might have been in there. But the first thing is to tighten up the application so that it's very clear I think multiple times that it's Chattam waste only. They attest to it. They sign it. They initial it. Make it
really firm. That Judy can do on her own once we decide what we want to do. That's an annual document signed one time December. Right. Right. December. So do we have time? The second part is the fee schedule and I put in there put
together the fees and that that is that we can talk about that needs to be changed. That change would have to go through the select board. That's a that's a separate process. And then the third process that we would talk about is the um let me get my is is the solid waste
regulation where each the hauler is required to get out and go into the station and sign a document when they when they when they uh delivering construction debris and demolition debris. They have to sign in and attest to something. as far as we know, not so
with the regular garbage truck, commercial residential waste. But we should add, I think that they have to go into the they have to stop, go inside, sign a form saying that they are stating that this waste that they're dumping,
they picked up only in Chattam. It's not mixed. It's not from another town, just Chattam. Make them sign it. Um, make them that would be something that would be a part of our regulations. So, we'd have to go through a the hearing process and public hearing and all that, but
it's a pretty simple change and I could just talk about it now. I mean, we might not have to change it, right? Might not. We might be we might be able to just ask them to do it at the transfer station. This is our um transfer Cadam transfer station and
solid waste regulations, which we wrote that comes from the board of health. I didn't know it, but we rewrote it. And in it, it says construction and demolition waste. All loads are to be logged in at the gate house before disposal. There's no such statement if
it is just routine uh commercial and residential garbage that they're dumping as far as we know. Ron, every one of those trucks goes on the scale and gets weighed. Yes. So they're right there,
right? They're right there. 30 seconds. There's really no reason why they're getting it weighed that they can't attach that this is Chadam waste, right? The bigger question is how on earth Chadam's fee turns out to be half. Okay,
so that but let's just go by process. That process is a revision to our um waste regulations with a um hearing, but Judy can come up with language and where exactly to insert it in there and find out and then give us something that we
can look at that would address that problem. What the fees? The no the um saying that every single garbage truck with with just regular commercial and residential waste must stop at the waste station and log in and attest the fact
that it's just Chattam waste. Yeah. They do the similar thing for demo um in construction waste. They have to get out and and and log it in, but it's not written in there for the other stuff as far as we know. Now, we need to talk
to Mr. Fail because they But Judy can work on that, right, Judy? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So, that's one. Yeah. I gota I mean, and that'll be a process where we go through a public hearing and all that. Ron, what about the fee? Who's going to do that? Okay. The fees are separate. Okay. That's Yeah, that's one at a time. I'm going to number Okay. So, that's Judy's
going to handle that. That's going to be the um a change to our regulation. We'll go through the public hearing process. Judy will come up with some more language which we'll have to review. Okay. Back to two, which is the fee. Okay. And on there your your on your thing we have the fees and you looked at
the fee structure. Where did you get this? I went through and just I went to the different towns and dug it up. I the one this is according to me. Actually the one in your memo is the one I did. But there's no fees on it. Is there? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Oh yeah. I didn't even
Huh? The memo? Yeah. Yeah. The memo. Oh 905 per ton. Yeah. Yeah. Collected. Oh, this one. Yeah, those are the ones I did which are the same. Where's the fees? 90 per ton. 90 per ton. Oh, oh, oh. Okay, I got it. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. I didn't put
the dollar sign in. So, okay. Well, Judy, yeah. Yeah, we did the same thing. Um, so here's the key things. Haritch accepts waste from any town. They run it to make money. They're a regional center for trash. We don't really We don't want that, right? We just don't want to
create commercial waste construction. That's where the Bruce waste goes. That's No, this is like home and residential and commercial waste that they pick up in the garbage trucks. Commercial, right? It's commercial, right? So, Harage is a regional center,
$175 a ton. Um, and Russo doesn't accept any. So, in our regulations, Chadam is $90 a ton is about half. So, it's an incentive for somebody to dump waste in. Sneak it in. Try and sneak it in. And when Mr. Mr.
Failure was here and what I recall is he said that he doesn't really have the manpower. He doesn't really check. He can't check. So they don't really check. We're going to tighten up the attestation and all that sort of thing. But the basic question we have is why wouldn't the Chattam cost per ton be the
same as the surrounding towns so as not to create an incentive to dump other towns, especially Brewster's trash in our town? You're not really harming the haulers because that's that's the normal fee. It makes sense, I think. Well, unless you're from jail. We want
to increase the amount of waste delivered here because we make money. Well, the uh what's her name from the the trash lady? Plet. The trash lady. Colette from Chadam Recycles. Colette. No, it was the one that came in and talked here from the county. Oh. Oh. Oh,
Carrie. I'm sorry. She said that the $90 per ton did not cover the the the cost of offloading that trash to the regional dump center which they take somewhere in southeastern lose money right at that
fee. So that's what she that's my recollection of what she said. So um Judy, do you have something to I'm talking too much here. I I mean I I agree that these fees need to go up, but
it's not us that it's a select board that changes the fees. So what we need to do is recommend to the select board that the fees go up to match the surrounding towns and they need to make some kind of you know policy decision
whether they if they want to take waste commercial waste from other towns which I don't think we want. We don't want that. I wouldn't because that's we don't want that. So we would make a recommendation that in order to keep um the commercial haulers and the construction people from coming to
Chattam as opposed to going to because for construction debris Haritch breaks that out that's $25 a ton. So somebody building a house in Chadam if they you know they can dump here for 90 or if they're building a house across the line in Haritch they can bring it to right to
Chadam for $90 a ton. Our fees should be the same as Haritch. So there's no incentive for people to come here and dump. Yes. I think I think I think this is about the easiest decision in the world to select that I've ever had to deal with. Right. I mean well you haven't dealt with a lot then perhaps you simply you simply say you know it's
been brought to our attention that there's concern right that other towns are dumping trash at our transport station. And the reason that they may be doing that is because our fees are about half of everybody else's. Therefore, we're going to tighten our strictures,
our affidavits, and we want to double the price to double take away the incentive to come take away the take away the incentive and um we could add that why wouldn't you do it because it doesn't even uh cover the offload price and we would just be in line with all
the other I would want to confirm that. I would say that we don't know they're dumping here. We're It's That's why I said it's possible because doesn't get and we're a lot cheaper and right um now so what I can do and you're right it's
easy. We can send a um a memo or a letter to select board asking them to take the the um subject up at a future select board meeting. Um and that would probably require myself and Rob Philly to talk to the selectman select board
and um but it would be select board Jill Goldmith. Yeah. And Rob Philly, right? and then our rationale for it. And I would I would say if we if you can legally request that it go on uh as an agenda item for one of their meetings
because they may just could just sit on it if if unless that we that specific we would frame it as an agenda request. Can you make an agenda request by from the board of health? I think we can. Yeah. Yeah. I don't see why not. So we would make that request that it go on the agenda and we would know when it is and
Judy would show up and defend everything for us. Um and of course you could come or you know a representative from the board to have a proposed penalty for failure to comply that would be changing the regulation. Hope that's I mean it
could be that that that three uh uh lack of compliance events uh would prevent that caller from using the Chadam transfer warning one penalty uh or it could be a but but there has to be
some well I think yeah I think we we talked about it in if you put e fee structure penalty structure specific it gets complicated with other things going in but what we could say I think is that I had this thing. Holler non-compliance with the above will be reviewed by the
board of health and may require hauler appearance before board of health leaving the penalty up to our discretion. You would we would revoke their license to haul. So we put in a clause that says failure to comply means we will deal with it and you may be called to come before the board and then
the penalty is what we think is appropriate without getting then a whole bunch of other things drawn into it. What's the difference between commercial vehicles and licensed commercial? Commercial vehicles would be like trucks from from um my thought, you know, construction
people that are coming in with trucks and so licensed commercial. Yeah. Those are like the the rubbish haulers that are licensed through the board of health. Oh, okay. So, we give them a in the state law, you have to get a permit to
haul rubbish across. is a state law. Anyways, locally you're required to have a rubbish haulers. So, anybody who drives through Chattam with rubbish from a, you know, commercial two separate things. It's it's commercial and residential garbage. They pick up in the
garbage trucks, right? Go into the on the tipping floor and dump the whole thing. And then you have guys in um big pickup trucks, construction, full of demo stuff because they're renovating a house. And that's sort of a separate category. I haven't really been thinking about that so much. I think it's the the
garbage from commercial and residential that's gets dumped on the tipping room floor that's got all the junk in it and they have to scrape it up. That's the one that we're trying to deal with. I I wouldn't doubt that this the select board might look at having us a lower
tipping fee for the commercial people like Millie and because they don't they don't like I'm sure there'll be people I'm sure there will people will say we're picking on them and this and that, but to me the bottom line is we're we're not raising them above above reasonable rates. We're just raising them up
commercial surrounding towns in Haritch. So they really, you know, um they could and we're trying to remove the incentive. So I I would just leave it at that myself. So Miley and Nickerson, you know, the commercial
garbage haulers, they don't operate solely in Chadam, right? No, we don't really know, but presumably not. Well, then one of them is nausea nausea disposal. They're all over the Cape. So they're paying they they know they're paying a very slight fee here compared to what they're paying in Haritch some
place. How many tons do you think are in a garbage truck when they don't? Three tons. That's a good question. I don't know. That's a question I haven't thought about in a long time. We're really encouraging them to bring garbage from whatever is in their truck from
wherever they pick it up and it chat. We're encouraging that. We we we we think we're guessing that's what we certainly people people from the audience who have called in have said that we don't know for sure but it certainly looks that way. John um maybe
this is under the category of of anal retentive but in that one handout we have which gives a suggested word for the attestation as to the origin. Yep. Okay, that's that's
number one. Let's that's that's let's let's let's finish up with the fee thing. Okay. Okay. Let's finish up with the fee thing. Okay. Um so in terms of the fee, which is means Judy putting together a letter stating what we want the rationale for it and asking them to
put it on the agenda. It doesn't seem like there would be any reason. I mean my question would be why haven't we done this before? The question isn't should we do this? Why haven't we done it before? Judy better check with Farley and make sure you're on the same page. So that but so we're
we then Judy will make a letter, bring it back and we'll look at that. Does that sound good? Yep. Okay. And then um the third thing is the application at testation section and Judy has put together
a at the bottom of it there's a you know a check off box and that's what you were asking about John. Yes. The end of that sentence, the end of that short paragraph says, "Always commercial
residential transported to and deposited at the facility was collected and or generated collected and or generated within the boundaries of Chadam." I think does this allow waste to be
generated outside of Chadam but collected in Chadam to come in? Exactly. I think I took that wording right from the regulations. So, and or generated with So, so I'm thinking say there's a demolition being done in Harwitch, but
it's close to the Chadam boundary. Could they demo it and then drop it in a dumpster in Chadam and then have the I mean I mean that would be No, but I mean the intent of this is no, they couldn't do it. That's my reading. Yeah, I mean I can take that out. But I but I I sent
out my little thing here. I my thinking this is just me. um on the on the application form is that we want to be we want to make it emphasize the point that it's just chattam waste which we haven't done before. So to me it's an attestation
section multiple check offs. Judy's paragraph covers things but I think it's like three different things in there and it's it you you know it's the last sentence when you get into the chatum business. I would I would break that up as I did on my thing into maybe three different check offs and then I would
also ask ask them that to say they're not mixing waste because I can see a group exclusively and then picking up Chadam and think well it's all Chattam I'm just going to dump it there. Um well that's I think where the collected and or generated comes from. But my point is
that in order to part of emphasizing it and making it clear so that later on no one can say well they didn't really understand you have you break that paragraph into multiple check offs and make them read each thing and check off each one and then add the mix thing in there. That's that's what I think. But I
that's just me. Maybe collected or and and generated within the boundaries, not or and yeah, make it to be collected and generated within the boundaries. The way this paragraph is written now would
allow a contractor to take uh material from Chadam to Haritch, put it in the dumpster in Haritch or in Haritch and bring it to the Chadam transfer station, right? Because it was generated in Chadam, right? But it was collected in Haritch, but it might also have other
stuff in that dumpster. You know, there's no reason to. So, take out the ore. Is there is there any reason not to break that paragraph into three separate take out the or I can do that. Yeah, I can do that. And also I know it's redundant but mixed just say I haven't I'm not mixing things from different
towns because you can guess that they they probably with her everyday work that they do solely confirm that all Chattam waste from other towns and then again um this is the application. So Judy can do this on her own, but Sheila wants to generate something for us to look at.
And and when you get into penalties, it gets complicated, but we can again make that sentence that non-compliance will be reviewed by the board of health and dealt with that outer discretion, which gives us kind of the threat and the opportunity to whatever. We don't want the truck driver filling out this form.
We need to somewhere say this needs to be the man. Well, it doesn't say that. Yeah, this is form needs to be the owner or the manager. I just truck drivers won't don't fill this out. This is filled out by the the haulers, the the
owners of the company or their administrative staff. The guy that pulls up on the No, no. He's going to fill out a card at Lowe's. This is the This is the yearly application for the whole application. Absolutely. I'm saying on a day-to-day basis when a Millie truck
pulls in on a a May May 5th with a load and he's he's putting the truck on the on the scale he should sign a clipboard that that's a that's a different we already Yeah regulation the wheel that's your item number three right yeah yeah
okay um so uh change and I think this would be like an attestation section it's it's Okay. Owner of the of the hauler. How I can't do this until How many commercial for privileges in Chattam? Diane, do you know? I'm sorry. How many
haulers do we have? Three, I thought. No, there's more than that. There's like five. We have like Yeah, there's probably six. Five or six. Yeah, five or six. Not everybody who I mean, there's only two in town, but the other ones are Millie. We have NSET. We have Nickerson.
Did you say Ryan? Brian. Ryan. barrels. I was wonder. So we have Yeah. And they and they and that application is filled out in December. So we have time to get this squared up for the next round. The haulers are not going to like us requiring them to certify every load is
exclusively from Chadam. They're not going to like it. I suspect I haven't researched it, but I suspect that other towns are much stricter and more careful than we are in regards to that issue. So, it's not going to be something new to them. Yeah. And they'll do whatever
they have to do. It actually is vaguely already referred to. It just hasn't been emphasized. Yeah. They'll do whatever they have to do. And actually, the trash lady when she was here, she said that there are experts, Carrie, there are
experts you can hire who will come and examine garbage being dumped and make a a professional determination, expert determination of where that trash came from. She look for envelopes. She look for I'm not recommending we do that here in Chattam, but I'm just telling you that's the that's where their whole
issue is. You spot check loads on the floor and you'll know it. And you can do that for all kinds of things like whether they're getting the cardboard when they shouldn't be and um Yeah. All right. So other So I have my I have my um Judy Judy will do stuff and come back
with it and we can review it again. So that's good. Now is there any First I'm going to I'm going to meet with Rob. Yes, Greg. And we may need to have you come here and talk. I will I will also draft a letter to the select board about the fees and then you want to look at
that. So, it's those two things are the major things. Um and and when I talk to Rob, I'll talk to him about the transfer station sign off. See what he's doing right now. Yeah. And um and here's here's another question I have. If we go this way, are we I think what we're doing is pretty
reasonable and straightforward, but do we need to have a an opportunity for a commercial hall to come in and and and and present their side of the thing to us before we make a decision. Is that something we should do or I think it's up to us and it's pretty straightforward. It's we're not really
if I I think that you mean about the fees or Well, yeah. The whole Well, the fees and they're going to they're going to show up for any public hearing if they if they're uh the fees will be that'll be the select board. Yeah, that's the select board thing. Okay.
They may want to do that. Okay. Other comments are so Judy can go do the next step. I think but I think if we do those three things, I think it'll go I think you you you'll get, you know, 90 95% compliance because
I think they'll really be going out of their way to not comply. That's what I think now. Is there any input from the public or online or any comments? because we had some last time I think and we had the lady from the um
recyclable Chattam recyclables. Yes. Pette. Pette. I see. No, there's nobody online. Yeah. Okay. There's nobody online. All right. So, anything else we need to let we thoughts we have for Judy
or Diane? Okay. All right. So, that was that's a lot. All right. But I think we can I think we can do something that will really help. Okay. Okay. All right. So, okay. Now, minutes public public comments future
agenda items request anybody anyone? Well, we have we have other things that we've talked about airport. Get to them yet. Um, can I just Bill Hill? We don't have an update. We'll have try to have it next time.
Um what other issues are we working on? The airport, Milh Hill. Um we talked about um the IIA systems. Oh, the IIA system technology and that's a whole big topic that we ought to know more about it. Frankly, we ought we ought to. Yes.
Um airportled. Maybe we need to we don't want to get into a discussion here, but they were here was maybe a year ago now. It was just about a year ago. One thing they promised where they would put up lead warning signs at the airport, which I believe are not up, but we could we could review
all that. So, that'll be another. Okay. Other public comments, future agenda item requests. Y I'm just introducing something completely brand new. I don't have a strong feeling, but I I have enough of a feeling that I want to at
least bring it out and see what other board members think. And that is um leaf blowers. I was waiting for I don't know if
anybody else is bothered by hours and hours of leaf blowing noise in their community. Are there other towns that have addressed? Yes, there are other towns that have addressed it and there is technology out there. Have they addressed it through the board of health
or is it I'm not sure but but I've got a neighbor who brings it up to me every time he sees me and he rattled off three or four names of towns in Massachusetts that have taken action to
reduce the the decibels and the air quality by requiring requiring uh contractors ers to over time replace their gasoline
powered blowers with uh battery powered blowers and that have mufflings in other words. Muffles. In other words, you don't have you don't have the decibels and you
don't have the air pollutant discharges from a gasoline powered unit. And um I I find that appealing. I have no idea what everybody else thinks. I have no idea. I think that's a good agenda item, but we would need to know if it's in our jurisdiction, but I know that the
attorney always tells us I think I think a quality of life in the neighborhood is is a board of health issue. We have broad authority, but we could check our authority. I know some other towns are doing it. president from some other towns, especially in the Cape and put it on the agenda to talk about it because I mean when I when my next
door neighbors people come, they're there for three hours with multiple things. Change and you put a deadline way down there so people have time to adjust. It's not unfair, Ron. First off, I would imagine it is in our jurisdiction if no other reason than the
emissions, right? That's a health issue. I would think so. Second, I would think a simple internet search would reveal whether other cities in Massachusetts have taken similar action and then that would be our justification. I think it's a good and I think there is Nucket is
doing it right now just in the news really. Yeah. And the other thing we could do quite frankly is we could find a way to to poll to see what our what are what do our residents think. you know, how do there are there are ways to
gauge public sentiment on a question like this using um public health students or using uh high school students who want to do there's various polling sampling systems where you can
gather you can randomly ask 500 residents in various you know venues like at the at the entrance to the village market. You know, we think the board of health has to have a health reason for doing it, not a public
opinion reason. Arlington, and this is the kind of thing that often comes onto a uh onto the the town meeting. Somebody somebody puts a proposal at town meeting to have a a town regulation. Yes. to prohibit these things rather than the
board of health stepping in and saying we find it harmful to the hearing of the people in right in Chadam right that somebody has a I'm sure there's various ways but these are these are approved devices that are you know proof for sale
they could be bylaws we can get into the same kind of issues we get with pesticides and herbicides and and you know anybody can have a petition and take it to the town meeting, right? There's I mean, the guy that does my
next door, you know, that's a it's Delmare and like six people show up and they're there for four hours with an extraordinarily loud loud lawnmower and two or three blowers and there's no leaves around. They're they're basically
blowing mulch and and during I would say I'd say there's more than one way to accomplish something. Yes. By law or regulation. What we learned from short-term rental regulation was if you do it by regulation, the process is a little more streamlined. You can adjust
it and it and it works better and you're likely to get something done. So, I think the first thing would be for Judy to find out if it's in our jurisdiction, which it probably is under quality of life and then put it on the agenda and see if other towns have done it and kind of go from there. Just but I don't think we should have a whole discussion of it
now. We need to No, I I agree. But you know, there'll be lots of people who say it's too much regulation, but yeah, a lot of people will agree. You know, one thing, the batteries now are so much more powerful than they used to be. Sure. You know, I mean, you see them advertised on television all the time, how powerful they are. Okay. So, but
that's that's a it's a I think it's a good discussion. I mean, and then we can see whatever. Um, okay. So, we'll do that other Okay. And then we have one set of minutes. I think they're the April 7th minutes. Is that right? Yes. Anybody
have a correction or addition to those minutes? And if not, someone can make it a I'll make a motion we approve the draft minutes for April 7th. Second. I'll second. All right. And uh we can take a voice vote. I think all
all uh in favor of approving the minutes of April 7th say I. I. I. Opposed. Okay, that's done. And then um did we make a decision about the next meeting? We're gonna cancel it. We're we
have a meeting scheduled for May 5th, which is next Monday, but there's nothing on the agenda. Um I won't have enough time to put stuff together that we discussed tonight. So we figured and then the 19th is the one after that. So we figured we would cancel next week cancel next Monday's meeting because of
the holiday. We have them back to back. So then um can I get a motion to adjurnn the meeting? So move and a second. Second. Yeah. And all in favor voice vote u say I opposed. Okay. Hearing none
that is we are adjourned. Okay.