WEBVTT

METADATA
Video-Count: 1
Video-1: youtube.com/watch?v=unmQUZK1LVk

Part: 1

1
00:02:27.920 --> 00:03:24.800
Heat. Heat. Heat. Heat. Good afternoon. This is a hearing of the Chattam Conservation Commission being held on July 8th, 2026 in accordance with the Massachusetts Wetland Protection Act and the town of Chadam Wetlands Protection bylaw and regulations. My name is Paul Johnson and

2
00:03:24.800 --> 00:03:40.319
I serve as the chair. Please note this meeting is being recorded and will be available shortly hereafter for scheduled and on demand viewing on any smartphone or tablet device. If anyone else is recording the meeting, including the use of AI notetaking apps, please

3
00:03:40.319 --> 00:03:55.840
notify the chair. Pursuant to Governor Healey's March 28th, 2025 signing of the chapter 2 of the acts of 2025 extending certain COVID 19 measures adopted during the state of emergency suspending certain provisions

4
00:03:55.840 --> 00:04:11.840
of the open meeting law general law chapter 30A section 20 until June 30th, 2027. This meeting of the Chattam Conservation Commission is being conducted in person and via remote participation. Every effort will be made

5
00:04:11.840 --> 00:04:34.040
to ensure that the public can adequately access the proceedings as provided for in the order. A reminder that persons who would like to listen to this meeting while in progress may do so by calling the phone number 1508-945410. conference ID number 343-507076

6
00:04:34.960 --> 00:04:53.199
pound or join the meeting online via Microsoft Teams through the link in the posted agenda. While this is a live broadcast on Simocast on Cadam TV Xfinity channel 1072, despite our best efforts, we may not be

7
00:04:53.199 --> 00:05:09.919
able to provide real-time access. We will post a record of this meeting on the town's website as soon as possible. To all participants, whether attending by phone or online, please remain muted unless you have been recognized by the chair. When recognized, please identify

8
00:05:09.919 --> 00:05:26.560
yourself for the record. If you're attending by phone, you can mute and unmute using star six. If you're online and you're not a commissioner, please keep your camera turned off unless you've been recognized. Indicate that you wish to speak by using the raise hand feature.

9
00:05:26.560 --> 00:05:43.759
So that we have a record of a quorum. I will now ask each commissioner to indicate their presence. Vice chair Bob Delvecio >> present. >> Karen Latton >> present. >> Janet Williams >> present. >> Elise Gordon >> present. >> Eric Hilbert >> present. >> And I'm here. We've established that we

10
00:05:43.759 --> 00:06:01.680
have a quorum. Is there anyone who'd like to make any announcements, comments, or future agenda items for anything other than the properties on the agenda today? You may comment on those when the property is being heard. >> Before we begin the agenda, Bradford,

11
00:06:01.680 --> 00:06:17.840
are there any announcements about the any requests for continuances today? >> Yes, we have one continuance. uh 7D Queen Anne Road has requested a continuence to July 22nd, 2026. >> Thank you. At this point, Bradford

12
00:06:17.840 --> 00:06:34.960
Bower, Chadam's assistant conservation agent, will now lead us through the agenda. >> All right. Uh first up is an order of conditions for 70 Queen and Road. Um, Hajar Management Company map 13E parcel

13
00:06:34.960 --> 00:06:51.400
15-14 SC 10-3781. This was for construction of a new ADA ramp, drainage improvements, and site landscaping. Um, the applicant has requested a continuence to July 22nd, 2026.

14
00:06:51.840 --> 00:07:08.639
I move that we continue 70 Queen Road order of conditions uh to the meeting uh on uh July 27th, 2026. >> Second. >> 22nd. >> Oh, excuse me. Correction. Uh July 22nd, 2026.

15
00:07:08.639 --> 00:07:22.560
>> Second. >> Karen, >> I >> Bob >> I >> Eric >> I >> Elise >> I >> Janet >> I. >> And I say I. Next up, Bradford. >> Next up is an amended order of

16
00:07:22.560 --> 00:07:39.280
conditions for 504 Old Harbor Road. Uh this is for Blue Heron Trust, map 16H, parcel PB, uh D number SCE 10-3752. Uh this was this project was a relocation of an existing dwelling on

17
00:07:39.280 --> 00:07:55.199
dwelling onto a new foundation including construction of additions and renovations, construction of a swimming pool, cabana and hardscape and relocation of an existing driveway. Um mitigation as mitigation existing lawn was restored

18
00:07:55.199 --> 00:08:10.879
with native plantings. The amendment is to add a basement to the pool cabana and uh equipment and storage and add subsurface dry wells for storm water and foundation drains. This is phase two. >> Do we have anyone here for that

19
00:08:10.879 --> 00:08:25.280
property? >> Yes. So, hello. This is uh Peter Stevens. Um I work with Dan Gordon Landscape Architects. I'm here representing the homeowners at 504 Old Harbor. Uh so as uh um as you heard there from

20
00:08:25.280 --> 00:08:42.880
Brad, uh the project was approved uh in its entirety um uh last year. We also followed up with a field change request which is [snorts] approved. Um I can get you the exact date here. Uh the which

21
00:08:42.880 --> 00:08:58.080
was dated um in February of this year and approved. Um, we're requesting currently an amendment uh to include a basement in the pool cabana and include storm water infiltration system throughout the site to collect and uh

22
00:08:58.080 --> 00:09:14.399
infiltrate runoff uh for a 100-year storm event. Um, which I believe does achieve uh and exceed the requirements outlined in the order conditions previously approved. Uh, so I'm going to share my my screen

23
00:09:14.399 --> 00:09:31.600
real quick and just identify the locations for you of where the storm water would be. Um, please let me know if you could see my screen. [clears throat] >> Yep. >> Okay, great. So, the um the pool cabana

24
00:09:31.600 --> 00:09:47.440
is located in this location here. Uh, Old Harbor Road is to the left of the screen. um the ocean uh to the right um there is a resource area which surrounds the site on three sides with buffer

25
00:09:47.440 --> 00:10:04.560
zones that extend onto the site here. There's a small portion of the site in the middle which is shaded out kind of uh in this area which is outside the buffer zones but as you can see the the majority of the site is in or uh lies within the buffer zones of the resource

26
00:10:04.560 --> 00:10:21.279
area. Um we are proposing to install a series of dry wells. Um there's significant grade change on the property and there's also some interesting grade change at the existing and proposed resident location where we have uh an

27
00:10:21.279 --> 00:10:36.320
elevated driveway on this side that drops down to a lower drive under garage location here. So storm water naturally flows away from the site in three in four directions. this the house sits up on a a null. Uh the lowest point of the

28
00:10:36.320 --> 00:10:53.200
develop site. Uh what we're proposing to develop is the driveway here. Um we've broken up the drainage system because of this grade change uh into four separate areas. One off the back of the house and the elevated lawn. Um this would collect

29
00:10:53.200 --> 00:11:08.880
water from the rear roof as well as the pool terrace and the pool cabana. Um all hardscape is now being captured and infiltrated again to a 100 storm 100year storm event. Um the lower garage roof

30
00:11:08.880 --> 00:11:25.760
because of the elevation change down we need to collect in a lower system. So half of this roof here is collected in this system and then there's a foundation drain for this main house which goes into this system here. Um the driveway although it is

31
00:11:25.760 --> 00:11:41.360
semi-permeable Keystone uh we are proposing inlets to prevent any uh ponding because um there are some uh relatively flat grades in certain areas and then steeper grades in others which we want to prevent any uh you know

32
00:11:41.360 --> 00:11:57.040
runoff issues. So we have drains here, here, here um right along the driveway. Those are being collected in two separate systems. one at this entry drive which is a small infiltration system and then another one which is outside the resource area buffers um

33
00:11:57.040 --> 00:12:13.519
which collects uh runoff from a sport court and this section of driveway on this side of the of the property. Um the the cabana changes include the um uh basement. The basement's just for

34
00:12:13.519 --> 00:12:30.320
pool equipment access. Originally on our plan, we had the pool equipment located here outside the pool cabana. Um, but we're now locating it inside the cabana. Um, with the access here through a bulkhead. We've reviewed all of the imperous surface calculations. Nothing changes

35
00:12:30.320 --> 00:12:46.079
with this amendment. Um, all impervious stays the same. The amount of mitigation plantings remains the same. Um, and we're still meeting all of the meeting and exceeding all of the performance standards outlined.

36
00:12:46.079 --> 00:13:03.120
Can I answer any questions? >> Any commissioners have any questions about this? >> Sure. >> I I'm just wondering why are you moving the pool equipment from outside to the

37
00:13:03.120 --> 00:13:19.680
basement? Was there a thought process to that? >> Yeah, there's actually two reasons. Um, one is, uh, you know, preserving the equipment, right? That's going to last a lot longer indoors. Um, and the other is the hot tub that's located in this

38
00:13:19.680 --> 00:13:36.160
location. They would like to have running later in the season into November and December. Um, and that's only possible if we locate the equipment, the heater in and the pumps, etc. in a conditioned space.

39
00:13:36.160 --> 00:13:51.760
>> Okay. Thank you. >> Mhm. John. >> Yeah. Just one quick clarification. So you said there's [clears throat] this amendment results in no change to the coverage calculations, >> correct? >> That have been So there's no additional

40
00:13:51.760 --> 00:14:07.440
coverage. Okay. I just wanted to make sure that that's got that for finding. Thank you. >> Yeah. >> Anyone else? >> So I think we're ready for a a motion. >> When's the next meeting date?

41
00:14:07.440 --> 00:14:24.079
uh July 22nd. Okay. >> I'll move uh that we continue uh 504 Old Harbor Road uh for an amended order of conditions uh for July 22nd, 2026.

42
00:14:24.079 --> 00:14:41.360
>> Second Elise >> I >> Janet >> I >> Bob >> I >> Karen >> I Bob [snorts] I'm sorry Eric. >> Hi. and I say hi. >> Thank you. Uh, one one question. So, a continuation to the next hearing. Um, is

43
00:14:41.360 --> 00:15:01.680
that just for a vote on the conditions? >> That would be the the uh what we just discussed today would be the written up, the amended order, and then if then you'll you'll have an opportunity to respond to those >> to those writings at that time. It

44
00:15:01.680 --> 00:15:17.760
should be pretty quick. >> Okay, perfect. I just wanted to make sure it wasn't an a continuation of the approval. It's just a a Okay. >> You're just going to be You're just going to be approving the conditions. >> Fabulous. Okay. Thank you very much. I appreciate the clarification. >> Thank you.

45
00:15:17.760 --> 00:15:34.079
>> All right. Have a good day. Byebye. >> Bradford. Up next. >> Up next is a notice of intent for 54 Rowland Drive. Uh the owners are Timothy and Katherine White. Map 13J, parcel 19-4,

46
00:15:34.079 --> 00:15:50.800
D number SE 10-3782. Uh, this is for demolition of a detached garage and driveway and construction of a new driveway and garage with living space above within the buffer zone to a coastal bank and bordering vegetated wetland. A portion of the driveways

47
00:15:50.800 --> 00:16:08.959
within land subject to coastal storm flowage. This was continued from May 27th, 2026, not 2027. Hi, good afternoon. Good afternoon. Blue flex design. Um, not quite sure where David Clark is, but um, I believe Oh,

48
00:16:08.959 --> 00:16:27.279
David's on TV. David, great. Um, I believe David was going to say that this was continued because we were waiting for ZBA. Um, ZBA has approved the plan and I'm sure David can give you more details. We did submit an updated revised plan dated June 3rd. Um and that

49
00:16:27.279 --> 00:16:43.600
was just basically clarifying some of the plan notes. So we added a note that three of the pitch pines being removed um were due to driveway construction and three were in poor health and infested with tarpentine beetle and are hazardous. Um we also added a note that 25 to 50% of the brush debris would be

50
00:16:43.600 --> 00:16:59.040
spread throughout the restoration area to decompose and part of the landscape. And then we added an additional note that this haninoi cypress tree in the front yard would be transplanted to um another area of the landscape. So I think that is all

51
00:16:59.040 --> 00:17:44.880
blue had to add and I don't know if David has anything additional. >> Is it possible to put the plan on the screen? Thanks. David, are you there? Well, while wait while we're waiting

52
00:17:44.880 --> 00:18:05.600
commissioners to >> David, you're muted. Can you >> Can you hear me now? >> Yes. Thank you. >> Okay. Sorry. Um yeah, as Trista um stated, uh this was approved at zoning board uh two weeks ago. Um they they

53
00:18:05.600 --> 00:18:28.640
didn't seem to have any issues with it. they uh approved it unanimously. Um so I really don't have anything else to add. >> Commissioners, any questions? >> I got a couple for Teresa.

54
00:18:28.640 --> 00:18:45.600
>> Teresa, the English ivy, how will that be treated? >> So basically, we we physically remove the English ivy. Um it's difficult to treat with a herbicide treatment. It has a very thick um waxy outer coating. Needs kind of a hot surfactant. We've have more success mechanically or

55
00:18:45.600 --> 00:19:03.760
physically pulling it. >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> And there was some um I think there was a down tree on the uh let's see uh >> Yeah, it's on the south side of the house. Stretches. Yeah, it stretches

56
00:19:03.760 --> 00:19:20.480
over the property line right about at the 100 foot uh buffers line. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Right about there. Yeah. >> And that's >> and most of it >> Yeah. Most of it's on the >> Yeah. Sorry. Most of it's on the neighbor's property at this point. Uh

57
00:19:20.480 --> 00:19:37.360
the stump is is is on our property, but most of the tree is lying on the neighbor's property. >> Okay. >> So, it's Yeah. All right, good enough. Thank you. That's all I had. >> Well, >> thanks.

58
00:19:37.360 --> 00:19:54.400
>> Any other commissioners have any questions? >> Uh, we're a little bit jammed up, David, for uh for the next meeting on the 22nd of July. But how soon do you need this order? Um, in this particular instance, zoning

59
00:19:54.400 --> 00:20:10.559
board did not impose a um no work in the summer restriction because the project's already ongoing. >> Okay. >> So, I I think I think the neighborhood would like the project to to keep going as quickly as possible. So, um we would

60
00:20:10.559 --> 00:20:26.880
yeah, if uh if we could get on the next agenda, that would be great. But I understand that if you have a lot to do and you need to push it back two more weeks, um >> I think we can handle one I think we can hand to one more order for that meeting. So, >> okay,

61
00:20:26.880 --> 00:20:43.679
>> if we can have a motion to continue this to July 22nd. >> I like I'd like to move that we continue 54 Roland Drive uh to the meeting on July 22nd, 2026 for an order of conditions. Second

62
00:20:43.679 --> 00:20:59.520
>> Karen >> I >> Eric >> I >> Elise >> I >> Janet >> I >> Bob >> I >> and I say I >> thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you >> Bradford. Next up

63
00:20:59.520 --> 00:21:15.679
>> next up is a notice of intent for 12 Clark Meadows Way. Owners are Jatine and Anna Patel. Uh, map, excuse [clears throat] me, map 5B, parcel 19 C-13C, DP number SE 10-376-9.

64
00:21:15.679 --> 00:21:31.520
Uh, this is for construction of an addition to an existing dwelling, deck, patio, stairs, and hot tub. Was continued from April 1st, 2026. >> Uh, good afternoon. I'm Paul Shay with Independent Environmental Consultants. >> Good afternoon. Um, [clears throat] also

65
00:21:31.520 --> 00:21:49.840
here with for the project is uh Terresa Sprag, uh the landscape designer for the project and Llaya Warner. She's the project architect. Uh since the last uh hearing we had, we have a revised site plan for you. Um we

66
00:21:49.840 --> 00:22:03.679
flagged the Coastal Bank, top of Coastal Bank on site with flags B1 through B9. Uh B1 on B1 through B7 basically run on the top of Coastal Bank right above uh

67
00:22:03.679 --> 00:22:23.280
Coco Cove Road and from B7 to B 9 is actually above the asphalt drive that accesses a bunch of the houses within that same area. Um the surveyors they they uh surveyed the

68
00:22:23.280 --> 00:22:39.679
10-ft contour line and staked uh staked it pretty much all through the property. Uh top of coastal bank again was staked. Um we have a revised 50 and 100 foot buffer zone based on the coastal bank onsite.

69
00:22:39.679 --> 00:22:54.320
Uh we've tried our best on staying outside the 50- foot buffer zone, but clearly they're going to be alterations within the 50- foot buffer zone. So we've proposed an extensive mitigation plan uh

70
00:22:54.320 --> 00:23:11.520
from uh Blue Flax Design and the proposed landscape plan by Blue Flax Design is mitigation includes 5,236 square ft. that includes new native

71
00:23:11.520 --> 00:23:27.120
plantings going in and also the removal of existing invasive plant species grown within that section of the property. Um, in terms of the uh the rest of the project, this we had to basically just

72
00:23:27.120 --> 00:23:42.559
move some of the features as much as we could to get it outside of the 50-oot buffer zone. And also the um one area was for the um

73
00:23:42.559 --> 00:23:58.320
there is a proposed PA patio roughly about 326 square ft that is on the plan but that again is going to be pvious and uh we pretty much eliminated a lot of you know anything impervious on the

74
00:23:58.320 --> 00:24:15.440
site. So almost all of the proposed alterations that we're dealing with are within areas of the site that have been altered in the past by it's really all grass lawn area. The site has been staked. There's

75
00:24:15.440 --> 00:24:31.520
a lot of sites uh stakes on this site. It's can be a little confusing, but basically um what we try to do is stay out of the 50-ft buffer zone for the coastal bank because it's coming in on

76
00:24:31.520 --> 00:24:48.480
one side in a westerly direction and another side it's coming in from a southerntherly direction from where that private drive is. And uh I'd be happy to answer any questions. I know that members of Bluefax are here to talk about the actual design plan.

77
00:24:48.480 --> 00:25:04.240
>> Yeah, let's hear from Bluefax and then we'll ask questions of everyone. >> Okay. >> Good afternoon, Michael. >> Good afternoon. Uh Mike Tennis, Bluefax Design. So, just to go over the existing conditions first, the property is located at the corner of two roads, Cole

78
00:25:04.240 --> 00:25:21.520
Cove Road and Clark Meadows Way. A small coastal bank rises from these roadways to a relatively flat upland developed with a single family residence. driveways, maintained lawn. The coastal bank and adjacent upland to the south along Cole Cove Road are vegetated with

79
00:25:21.520 --> 00:25:39.039
native trees, eastern red cedar, native oaks, and pitch pines. Beneath the tree canopy, the upland is maintained. It's mowed and maintained as Cape Cod lawn. Um the coastal bank supports a narrow vegetated buffer between the property and the roadway, kind of a low

80
00:25:39.039 --> 00:25:55.120
screening. This roadside buffer consists of a mix of native and invasive species. Along the eastern portion of the property, a hedge row of invasive privet was planted to screen the parking lot. Uh, and there's a bunch of native and aggressive grape vines growing

81
00:25:55.120 --> 00:26:11.760
throughout the hedge. Moving north along Coal Cove Road, it becomes more dominated by invasive shrub, honeysuckle, porcelain berry, and bittersweet. As you turn west along Clark Meadows Way, it transitions more to Rigosa Rose. There's also a large autumn olive in

82
00:26:11.760 --> 00:26:26.960
this area, and there's a few native shrubs in this area, including bay berry, sapling oaks, and pines. However, many of these native plants are being overt topped and suppressed by the invasive woody vines. um back to the southeastern portion of

83
00:26:26.960 --> 00:26:42.480
the property in the upland immediately above the coastal bank um where it's currently maintained through regular mowing, but the ground layer does include native ground cover species Pennsylvania sedge and low bush blueberry. So both of these persist

84
00:26:42.480 --> 00:26:59.279
despite the mowing, but they're not fully establishing. They're being suppressed. Um they're mixed with other fescue grasses and weedy herbaceous vegetation. So this shows good potential for natural regeneration following uh stopping the mowing.

85
00:26:59.279 --> 00:27:14.000
Our goals for this project are to improve the value and function of coastal bank as a vertical buffer to storm water and to improve wildlife habitat function and value on the coastal bank and buffer zone. We will accomplish this through removing

86
00:27:14.000 --> 00:27:29.600
invasive vegetation and reveating with native plants that are suitable to the site and conditions. Um we are and to establish a vegetated buffer to the coastal bank where none currently exists.

87
00:27:29.600 --> 00:27:46.559
Um this will restore vertical letter layers of vegetation including understory, shrub and ground cover layers. So, the project will begin with a selective basil bark herbicide pre-treatment of invasive species throughout the project area. Three to

88
00:27:46.559 --> 00:28:01.200
five weeks later, we'll cut and remove the invasive species. Some root material not destroyed will be left behind, and there is probably a substantial invasive speed seed bank throughout the area. So, follow-up treatments will continue for the next three to five growing seasons.

89
00:28:01.200 --> 00:28:18.000
The two trees proposed for removal, one oak and one pine are in basically dead or very close to it and they will be flush cut with the ground and the stumps will be left in place to biodegrade naturally. Any native vegetation damaged by invasive vines may be flush cut or

90
00:28:18.000 --> 00:28:36.000
regeneratively pruned to promote healthy and vigorous growth. Following the invasive species removal, the restoration area will be seated with a custom mix of native grasses and wild flowers. mowing within the restoration area will cease to allow the natural regeneration of that existing blueberry

91
00:28:36.000 --> 00:28:52.960
and and uh whatever other native vegetation is in there. During the first growing season, management efforts will focus on monitoring this regeneration, controlling the invasive species regrowth, and evaluating the process. After that, native woody vegetation will

92
00:28:52.960 --> 00:29:09.440
be installed in the fall. We're proposing 347 native shrubs and three native trees. Um, if natural regeneration of the native shrubs is sufficient, if it's regenerating really well, then we may reduce the quantity specifically of the

93
00:29:09.440 --> 00:29:25.520
low bush blueberry. Temporary irrigation may be installed for the first two to three growing seasons while the plants established. Once they're established, that will be removed. Like I said earlier, follow-up invasive species management will be ongoing over the next three growing seasons.

94
00:29:25.520 --> 00:29:42.720
Um so we believe that the proposed well the proposed structure is not in the flood zone and will have no adverse effect on the coastal bank's ability to absorb flood flood water and the proposed mitigation will be a net benefit to the resource area through reveating the various vegetative layers

95
00:29:42.720 --> 00:29:59.200
on the coastal bank and also establishing a vegetated buffer where none exists. And I'd be happy to answer any questions. >> Thank you Michael. >> You're welcome. I have a question for Paul. Actually, a couple requests. Um, I

96
00:29:59.200 --> 00:30:16.000
notice on your revised special permit plan, the new site plan, um, you have a a bro breakdown of the net change of proposed hardscapes and buildings from 0 to 50 and then 50 to 100. >> Yes.

97
00:30:16.000 --> 00:30:33.440
>> But um, we need to see the percentage coverage of those numbers. the the new percentage of of hardscape or or buildings in the zero to 50 and the new new percentage in the 50 to 100. >> Okay, >> so that's one request. The second

98
00:30:33.440 --> 00:30:50.320
request is >> uh I would love to see if you could reduce the size of that patio where the fire pit is on the east side of the house, which is a good portion of that is in the 0 to 50. If you could just cut that

99
00:30:50.320 --> 00:31:10.159
back, it would it would be appreciated. And that's all I have so far. >> That a possibility for that? >> Okay. Just um through the architect, the size of the patio was reduced on this

100
00:31:10.159 --> 00:31:29.240
newly proposed plan by 150 square feet. >> Okay. So there has been since from the previous plan to this plan, there's been a significant reduction in the size of the patio. >> And I believe it's pvious paver, correct? >> So it's allowing the water to drain in.

101
00:31:29.520 --> 00:31:45.440
>> Any other commissioners have any comments? >> Um, when [clears throat] I go to a property, I like to see who we're dealing with. Um, these applicants have been, in my opinion, good stewards. Uh, it's a Cape Cod lawn. I noticed they even mowed in

102
00:31:45.440 --> 00:32:00.640
two different levels which is a class act. They have their formal area and then they have a higher area on the border which was a good attempt. Um but you know you have to keep in mind that you know there's a asphalt road

103
00:32:00.640 --> 00:32:17.519
going from the property I even though it is in the 0 to 50 and for this project uh from what I see I see the mitigation u far exceeds the uh the encroachment or the increase

104
00:32:17.519 --> 00:32:33.760
uh from the 0 to 50. I I think it's a great idea. It's a great way to go. Thanks. >> Anyone else? Janet? >> Yep. I have a couple of quick questions. So, um, for Blue Flax, I know that we had talked before at the first hearing

105
00:32:33.760 --> 00:32:50.320
about, um, removing some of the lawn and and doing some restoration. I was trying to find, is there a figure anywhere for how much lawn is being removed? I could not find it. >> It's in the key of the planting plan. So it's um two >> 20

106
00:32:50.320 --> 00:33:05.519
>> 2874 square feet of lawn is being removed. >> Oh that native restoration that's so that's the area where the lawn is being removed. Okay. >> Correct. Yes. >> Okay. 2874. Got it. Um and for Paul we had

107
00:33:05.519 --> 00:33:22.357
said at the last hearing um we had asked whether that asphalt driveway would be replaced by something that's pvious. Is there doesn't look like it's being done >> right? I believe there were discussions with the property owners and at this point they'd like to keep the asphalt driveway.

108
00:33:22.357 --> 00:33:46.000
[clears throat] >> Anyway, uh let me think about that. Um, there had been I think Bradford had asked specifically for the coverage figures and um I maybe it's me and I apologize because it could well be, but I was having a problem reconciling the

109
00:33:46.000 --> 00:34:03.120
coverage figures that's on the chart at the top of your plan with what is indicated on the plan. So, for example, take my glasses off. uh within the no disturb zone, you're proposing uh 379

110
00:34:03.120 --> 00:34:18.159
square feet of structure and 11 of hardscape. But when I look down at the arrows pointing to the various components that are in the NDZ, so for example, the pvious pa patio is 405

111
00:34:18.159 --> 00:34:35.440
square feet. Um, and there are portions of the new addition that are in the no disturb zone. Um, there was something else in the no disturb zone. The second floor deck, the

112
00:34:35.440 --> 00:34:52.079
deck is in there, right? So, it they were adding up to more than that pretty quickly. I got uh a quick I did I got 758 square feet total in the no disturb zone of hardscape and structure. So, I could be really wrong and I'm misreading it. So,

113
00:34:52.079 --> 00:35:08.560
I'll just ask you, can you please go back and take another look at the coverage figures >> because we just have to have them clear for the um for the order of conditions. I think in the outer aura, they they look pretty good. Um, and then there are further figures in the supplemental

114
00:35:08.560 --> 00:35:24.320
letter that also weren't lining up with what was on here because you have 306 for the dining room, 326 for the pvious paper patio. This is 420 405. So, it just wasn't it wasn't working out. >> Okay.

115
00:35:24.320 --> 00:35:40.400
>> Can you please just clarify those? Mhm. >> Um the mitigation and uh and you did say at the last hearing that you did not want to move the hot tub out of the no disturb zone.

116
00:35:40.400 --> 00:35:56.880
Um I we did take a look at that on site. Um Laya and I met out with the homeowners and and there really isn't another place to put it um without um being in the front yard um that's outside of the 50 foot buffer. So we we felt that in the footprint of the deck

117
00:35:56.880 --> 00:36:13.280
was the most reasonable place to put that. >> Okay. So So that said, um you didn't they didn't make you didn't make a case in the alternatives analysis for why we would approve a variance to put a hot tub in

118
00:36:13.280 --> 00:36:29.440
the no disturb zone. We normally wouldn't do that. Um it just said in the in the in the alternatives analysis that this is the alternative we prefer and the other two alternatives were not preferred and that's just not sufficient to make the finding that we will um

119
00:36:29.440 --> 00:36:45.040
grant a variance in this case to allow it. I I I looked at the site plan and I have to say I was coming out kind of where you are. I could [clears throat] not find >> a spot to put it. Um, but uh I think you just need to make that case. So again, because we're going to have to make very

120
00:36:45.040 --> 00:37:02.480
specific findings to justify a variance that >> Okay. And that's all I've got. Thank you. >> Okay. >> Bob, you have anything? >> I got a couple. Uh, so there's no intention of uh irrigating the lawn or fertilizing the lawn. It's a nice Cape

121
00:37:02.480 --> 00:37:18.480
Cod lawn now. It's going to remain a Cape Cod lawn. >> It will. Yes. >> Terrific. >> Yep. Uh and um those no no mo areas that you're talking about uh to let them regenerate um is there any way you can put any

122
00:37:18.480 --> 00:37:34.720
stones or something? >> We can absolutely and imagine that the commission would um condition that delineators have to be delineation markers have to be put in place to delineate the um restored area. So yes, we can do that and we can make a note of that on the updated on an updated plan.

123
00:37:34.720 --> 00:37:53.440
>> Okay, great. Uh, and you have in the in the notes here, um, you're going to, uh, seed, uh, with micro clover, uh, and fescue. Um, it's a pretty sunny area. Will the micro clover do well in that area?

124
00:37:53.440 --> 00:38:08.960
>> I actually think the clover will do better than the fescue in the in the hot sun. Um the idea is just to seed any areas that are disturbed with the construction of the patio um or the deck and then just allow that existing Cape Cod lawn to regenerate. >> Okay.

125
00:38:08.960 --> 00:38:27.591
>> Yep. >> Um and there's going to be crushed stone underneath the deck where the hot tub is going. >> Correct. >> Okay. Okay. That's all I had. Thank you. >> Thank you. I I just wanted to add one

126
00:38:27.591 --> 00:38:42.960
[clears throat] more thing. You said that the patio the stones are the pavers are pvious. What are they made out of? >> Actually, I don't have the answer to. It's just >> so I think the the they're going to be dry laid pavers. So, they're going to be

127
00:38:42.960 --> 00:38:58.160
on a sand and gravel base. >> Yeah, that's not really that's not really if it's raining hard. I mean, they're you know, the water's going to run off. I mean, if it's a sprinkle, maybe they'll absorb in between the cracks a little bit, but yeah, pretty much how we

128
00:38:58.160 --> 00:39:16.320
look at it that would be impervious. Um, >> okay. >> I just have something, Paul. >> Sure, Karen. >> Um, I had a note from the previous time that there was a kitchen that was going to be noted on here. Is is that out?

129
00:39:16.320 --> 00:39:32.640
>> That's out. >> And the steps that were going to be added, that's out. There is going to be a grill um on the south side, but it's going to be on the footprint of the patio that we're showing. So, yes, >> I had that there were steps that you needed to add to the plan. I'm not sure

130
00:39:32.640 --> 00:39:50.000
where they were going to be, but >> they have that delin if you zoom in. I can't really >> see it. Great. From here, it >> right. So, that see that dash line >> where it says deck. >> Oh, the deck is the steps. Yeah, the

131
00:39:50.000 --> 00:40:05.200
deck only comes out six feet and then a step two steps down. >> Okay. So, that little teeny red area is the steps. >> Yeah. >> So, there's going to be steps all the way around the deck.

132
00:40:05.200 --> 00:40:20.640
>> Correct. And it's going to go the entire looks like the deck it has steps on one side to it, but the steps are going to go all the way to the end of the patio >> because it looks like you have that that

133
00:40:20.640 --> 00:40:37.280
line going on one side of the the smaller side of the deck and then it's going the full length of the patio. Is that correct? >> Correct. So, what is the steps down from on the part that doesn't say deck

134
00:40:37.280 --> 00:40:52.240
>> here? >> The No, that's patio there where that arrow just was. Go up a little bit. >> Who's point? Go up. You see those steps? And then you're saying the steps >> those are those are previous,

135
00:40:52.240 --> 00:41:09.200
>> right? But then you're saying that dotted line goes all the way across the whole patio right there. that area. >> Yep. >> That blank area. What is in there? >> No steps. It's just going to be a less than 30 inch drop to grade. So, there's

136
00:41:09.200 --> 00:41:25.920
no steps that way. >> Oh, I thought you just said that there were in the whole >> Well, it it's the edge. So, there's an edge. >> Yeah, that part is not steps or it is steps right there that you're going up and down. >> Step. Step.

137
00:41:25.920 --> 00:41:43.440
>> Okay. But it's a step from nothing. It's from grass. I I'm asking that blank area. >> I think that's the deck. >> It's the deck that >> Okay. So, the deck is You have deck then steps and then more deck. >> No, I think it's deck that runs.

138
00:41:43.440 --> 00:41:59.839
>> You can't go up there. >> Yeah. The deck runs the whole length. There's steps that you can go to the patio the full width. So then what are the little steps that are existing? What are they? Is it different levels of

139
00:41:59.839 --> 00:42:16.400
deck? >> I'm just trying to understand the diagram. [laughter] >> Uh yeah. So >> okay, this >> she's asking the where it says deck in black. Is that existing? >> That's existing. >> That's existing. And then you have steps coming off that deck. And then you said

140
00:42:16.400 --> 00:42:33.680
the rest in front of the steps is also deck. So I'm assuming it's a twole deck. It's just not marked. >> No. Like so we have six feet out. You get the first step that's a foot and then a foot deep and then you have the

141
00:42:33.680 --> 00:42:48.960
second step and then you get to the patio and then a step down from the patio. >> I think I think Karen the confusion is the the piece that says deck and shows a couple of steps down that are in black. That's existing and that's going away. >> Okay. >> Oh, it's going away. It's going away.

142
00:42:48.960 --> 00:43:04.800
It's not marked that it's going away. No. So that's the way and the new deck is taking its place. >> Thank you, Teresa. >> You're welcome. >> So you may want to mark that all of it is deck >> going the whole way across because right now it looks like you only have a little

143
00:43:04.800 --> 00:43:20.880
bit of deck with a few steps. >> Okay. >> And then you have steps coming off of I didn't know what. >> Okay. >> Okay. Thank you. Sorry, I didn't >> I just wanted to make sure I understood the step part.

144
00:43:20.880 --> 00:43:38.079
>> I I think it's if you look at um if the blue flax plan is available. >> Yeah, I'm sure yours But >> yeah, we we eliminated that piece. That's going to be eliminated. >> Right. >> Right. Okay. >> Okay. I just with her plan, I wanted to be sure that we were apples to apples.

145
00:43:38.079 --> 00:43:55.040
>> Yes. and wanted to make sure because I had had that where there was a kitchen and I didn't see a mention that the kitchen was gone. >> It Yeah, it's not gone if you go back because it's part of that. >> It's right there. Yeah, >> grill.

146
00:43:55.040 --> 00:44:10.960
>> Grill. It's just a grill. Built-in grill. >> Oh, okay. An imperous built-in grill. So, that's been added to the your numbers, >> correct? because it's impervious, >> which which we will verify for the next

147
00:44:10.960 --> 00:44:27.440
hearing. Yes. >> Okay. Thank you. Sorry. Didn't think it was going to get that take that long. >> And you're the homeowner. Sorry. You're the homeowner. >> I'm the architect. >> Oh, you're the architect. Okay. I I wanted to add one thing here. I was I have to retract a little bit. I'm a

148
00:44:27.440 --> 00:44:42.800
little concerned when when uh the group was talking about a variance for the hot tub. Is that I mean if uh is this commission ever allowed that you know of hot tubs in the notice of syrup?

149
00:44:42.800 --> 00:44:58.960
>> Well, we're not keen on it. Well, it's the it's the deck that's number one. And so the deck will have stone underllayment, right? And then the hot tub sits into the deck. So the hot tub's not really >> So it's not additioned onto the >> adding anything. Right. So, so the they

150
00:44:58.960 --> 00:45:16.079
need a variance for all of this because a good portion of this is in the no disturb zone. So, um I do just want to state from our last time we did move it as far out of that no disturb zone as we could. Obviously,

151
00:45:16.079 --> 00:45:31.359
we're still not out of it, but we originally had our hot tub out here. So, it was much further into that. Um >> well buffer zone. So we tried

152
00:45:31.359 --> 00:45:47.520
>> Can you move it so that it's next to [snorts] that other deck that we were just talking about and outside of the 50 if you put the pointer. Yeah, that area. Well, closer probably

153
00:45:47.520 --> 00:46:03.680
to the you'd want closer to the patio, but seems like that's a spot. It's outside. >> This is their front door. >> It's their front door. So, it's kind of to have That's This is their only yard and they're just trying to not be on display if they're

154
00:46:03.680 --> 00:46:19.839
>> Yeah, we did. We did look at that. >> Oh, you wouldn't have to take your shoes. [laughter] >> You could just jump right in. It's also really exposed to the beach parking lot and um so that's Yes, we we really did look at this with the with the homeowners um at the site.

155
00:46:19.839 --> 00:46:39.760
>> I I don't love the hot tub where it is. Okay. >> Okay. So, we're obviously going to have to continue. >> Understood. >> Uh, >> sounds like July 22nd is not really going to be a good hearing. So, should we continue to the hearing after that to

156
00:46:39.760 --> 00:46:54.640
give you >> That would be August 12th. You have We have room on the docket for that. >> That would be great. Thanks. Is that okay? >> 22nd. >> Before we go to that, should we vote on the hot tub now before it goes to that point >> so we don't have to waste people's time? Because it sounds like some people for

157
00:46:54.640 --> 00:47:11.040
the hot tub where it where it's planned and not and why why not everybody vote on where the hot tub is before >> you know go through all this again. >> No, >> I don't know. >> Could we could we have an opportunity to

158
00:47:11.040 --> 00:47:28.240
um to enhance the alternatives analysis? >> That's what I want to see is that I want to know where else you looked at um that's behind that 50 line. Yes. >> Um like in the back by the back part of the house there's a fair amount of area

159
00:47:28.240 --> 00:47:45.280
you know why isn't that being considered? So that's what I want I was looking for in the analysis and that's I would vote based on what >> they say whether they convince me that there's no alternative >> to where it is. So, we would we would if we had had the opportunity to submit um

160
00:47:45.280 --> 00:48:01.920
a an enhanced alternatives analysis that explains the different locations we looked at then then um I'd just like to have the opportunity before we get a hard no. >> Yeah. Because you have to understand if we allow you know hot tubs and no disturb and then people see previous

161
00:48:01.920 --> 00:48:17.520
meetings and then it could open the floodgates. I I completely understand. This is one of those challenging sites where, as you pointed out, it's between diff it's between two asphalt roads and a dirt road. Um right on the Coco Cove Beach parking lot. So,

162
00:48:17.520 --> 00:48:34.640
>> it's Yeah. >> Okay. So, just to recap, so you're going to look at that >> nice alternative. We're going to Yes. We're going to enhance the alternatives analysis. We're going to check the calculations, the coverage calcs, and then we're going to do the percent coverage for the entire site to make

163
00:48:34.640 --> 00:48:51.599
sure we're at your at or under your 35%. >> That's excellent. Great. Thank you, Teresa. >> Okay. >> All right. So, we can move this. We can continue this to August 12th. To August 12th works. >> August 12th will work for me. Yes. >> Okay. >> I like this mitigation area, though. I have to say.

164
00:48:51.599 --> 00:49:08.160
>> Yeah. Yeah. Mitigation is terrific. >> Nice. Nice buffer strip between all that and the road. Very good. >> Okay. I move to uh continue 12 Clark Meadows Way to the hearing on August 12th, 2026. >> Second.

165
00:49:08.160 --> 00:49:27.440
>> Elise. >> I >> Janet. >> I >> Bob. >> I >> Karen. >> I >> Eric. >> Hi. >> I say I. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> All right. Next up, Bradford. >> [clears throat] >> Next up is a certificate of compliance

166
00:49:27.440 --> 00:49:44.480
for lot 59 Oldfield Bend Road. Um, also known as 146 Oldfield Ben Road. Uh, the owner is [snorts] Mark Plansky. [clears throat] Map 14J, parcel 59, D number SE 10-588.

167
00:49:44.480 --> 00:50:02.079
Um, this was for construction of a single family dwelling, uh, sewage disposal system and timber garden wall. Um [clears throat] if oh I don't remember when we continued this from um but uh the obviously this

168
00:50:02.079 --> 00:50:18.960
is an old uh D number um from when the house was built um during site visits we noticed that there was an unpermitted um rinse station and so we asked the homeowners to uh provide some additional

169
00:50:18.960 --> 00:50:36.160
plantings. Um they've offered to plant uh four swamp aelas near the road or the driveway um depending on kind of best location. Um but I think that that would cover the um

170
00:50:36.160 --> 00:50:52.640
the square footage for that uh rinse station and so I would recommend um approving this pending uh planting of those additional plants. >> Commissioners have any comments about that? I'm just wondering, Bradford, if uh is

171
00:50:52.640 --> 00:51:09.680
there room to plant by the rinse station to to absorb some of that? >> It's pretty tight back there. >> Um I [clears throat] had uh gone back and forth with uh Jamie Norcross a couple of times and um we thought the

172
00:51:09.680 --> 00:51:26.800
best uh location would probably be closest to the uh along the road or the driveway. >> Okay. >> Yeah. So, any anyone else? So, can I have a motion pending the uh planting plan?

173
00:51:26.800 --> 00:51:44.640
>> Okay. I'd like to move that we uh approve the certificate of compliance on uh lot 59 Oldfield Ben Road pending the uh outcome of the planting plan. >> Second.

174
00:51:44.640 --> 00:51:58.559
>> Karen. >> I. >> Eric. Hi >> Elise. >> Hi >> Janet. >> Hi >> Bob. >> Hi. >> And I say I. >> Next up, Bradford. >> Right. I'm going to read the next two in together. Uh next up are certificates of

175
00:51:58.559 --> 00:52:16.480
compliance for uh 325 Foxhill Road. Uh Roger and Nancy Ho. Map 10M parcel 7A. uh DP SE [clears throat] 10-2870 for proposed reconstruction of an

176
00:52:16.480 --> 00:52:34.720
existing licensed pier and SE 10-3287 of proposed reconstruction of an existing licensed pier. Um so the first one uh was issued in 2013. Um the pier was rebuilt

177
00:52:34.720 --> 00:52:50.160
and then during um the winter storm Riley in 2018, it was damaged and so had to be reperitted and rebuilt um with a two feet twoft elevation gain. Um [snorts]

178
00:52:50.160 --> 00:53:08.079
and both well the pier as it stands now looks to be in uh compliance with both of those um both of those plans. So, I would recommend uh approving both. >> Commissioners,

179
00:53:08.079 --> 00:53:29.440
anything? >> Okay. >> Like to move that we approve the certificates of compliance for 3325 Foxhill Road, SE 10 2870, and SC 10 3287. Second.

180
00:53:29.440 --> 00:53:46.160
Elise. >> Hi. >> Janet. >> Hi. >> Bob. >> Hi. >> Karen. >> Hi. >> Eric. >> Hi. >> And I say I. I'm sorry, Mark. Did you I >> No, I totally ignored you. >> I didn't have anything to say unless I needed to. That's the best way you could go. >> Okay. >> Thank you very much, everybody. >> Thank you. All right, Bradford. Next up.

181
00:53:46.160 --> 00:54:01.920
>> All right. Next up is a certificate of compliance for 8 Windmill Lane. Uh owners are Howard and Igna Walker. Uh, map 16A, parcel 22-H9, DP number SE 10-3506.

182
00:54:01.920 --> 00:54:17.040
Uh, this was for a proposed addition to an existing dwelling. Um, the last time we talked about this um you had expressed concerns about um the dead vegetation and um potentials uh

183
00:54:17.040 --> 00:54:34.640
irrigation of the and fertilization of the lawn. Um Chip is here the homeowner. Um he provided some uh [clears throat] progress um over the years um where they

184
00:54:34.640 --> 00:54:51.520
had planted some uh planted the mitigation plantings. Some of it had died back and they replanted in 2024 I believe. Um five or six additional uh vegetation. Currently they're around 80

185
00:54:51.520 --> 00:55:08.000
81% coverage. So they are still above that um 30 or excuse me 75% threshold. Um and I don't know about the irrigation so I don't know if you could comment on that. >> Sure. Did I [clears throat]

186
00:55:08.000 --> 00:55:23.280
>> Good afternoon. >> Thanks everybody. Um I'm Chip Walker the homeowner and um I did send around the sort of the schedule of plantings that went I submitted it last Thursday. So just tried to show you what we had done. I think there was some confusion with

187
00:55:23.280 --> 00:55:38.079
the when we did the request for certificate of compliance because the pictures were taken when there wasn't a lot of foliage on some of the plants. So it looked like a lot of dead plants. Uh it turns out there's like one dead plant. I think Bradford was out there yesterday. So they're doing pretty well

188
00:55:38.079 --> 00:55:55.200
with about an 80% survival rate after three years. So I think we've kind of um done what we we needed to do on the plantings. Um, I did want to mention that the the scope of the project did shrink from the original approval 5 years ago. It the ZBA shortened the

189
00:55:55.200 --> 00:56:12.480
deck. So, it I think we went from a thousand square foot or the the added building coverage shrank considerably like 25%. So, um, in some sense that's a good thing. Um, and um, with that I'll answer any questions.

190
00:56:12.480 --> 00:56:29.040
>> Commissioners. Oh, I think the question we had is it was the lawn uh when you when the con were the plans for the construction and all the mitigation and the project was the was there previous irrigation on the

191
00:56:29.040 --> 00:56:44.640
property before the change? >> Yes, there was a pre-existing irrigation system before the construction and before the order of conditions from 2021. Yes. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Anyone else?

192
00:56:44.640 --> 00:56:59.280
All right, Robert. >> Move that we approve the certificate of compliance for 8 Windmill Lane. >> Second. [snorts] >> Karen, >> I. >> Eric, >> I >> Bob >> I >> Janet >> I. >> Elise >> I.

193
00:56:59.280 --> 00:57:14.880
>> And I say I. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> All right. Next up, Bradford. Next up is a discussion for violation on 434 Ridge Road. Uh this was the owner

194
00:57:14.880 --> 00:57:32.319
landowner is MMRS Realy Trust. Map 16. Oh my gosh. Map 6B, parcel G92. Uh this was for unauthorized cutting of vegetation performed by the owner of 44 Nantucket Drive. Uh

195
00:57:32.319 --> 00:57:47.200
>> Redford, would you mind giving us a little background information on this? Absolutely. Um >> so the conservation office was notified um around the end of April about some unpermitted cutting that had occurred.

196
00:57:47.200 --> 00:58:02.240
Um we Paul and I went out and checked. Um and it we could clearly see that there was tall trees and then uh some short short vegetation that had been cut. Um, so we sent out a violation

197
00:58:02.240 --> 00:58:19.119
notice um on April 29th. Um, at the time we weren't sure if it was the owner of 44 Nantucket or the actual owner of uh 434 Ridgeville Road. Um,

198
00:58:19.119 --> 00:58:35.119
>> and the cutting was done on 434's property. >> Correct. It was done on 434's property. Um, I met with the homeowner of 44 Nantucket Drive on May 15th. Um, and she had mentioned that it she was the one

199
00:58:35.119 --> 00:58:52.720
that had done the the work. Um, and I had recommended filing an after-the-act NOI. Um, where this gets a little bit more complicated is that, um, in our files, we have a violation notice

200
00:58:52.720 --> 00:59:10.079
from 2014 for the exact same, uh, activity where there was cutting that occurred on >> same home, same homeowners, >> same homeowner, same location of 434's property. Um, and so it kind of suggests

201
00:59:10.079 --> 00:59:29.520
this uh reoccurring violation. Um, even though it was 12 years ago, um, I would think that you would know that uh that was [clears throat] uh not permitted. Um, and what's more is in the the

202
00:59:29.520 --> 00:59:44.880
violation notice from 2014, um, you can see that there are limbs of pitch pines that were presumably removed at the time. I don't know if any restoration ever occurred from that uh,

203
00:59:44.880 --> 01:00:02.799
2014 notice. Um, but certainly now it's I think all of you have had a chance to be out there and there's a lot of invasives. Was there any restoration ordered after the 20 2014 finding? >> Not that we could find. Um the only

204
01:00:02.799 --> 01:00:17.680
thing that we have in our files is a um the violation notice. There's no uh restoration order or any follow-up uh communications that were recorded. >> So, I'm not quite sure what that out outcome was.

205
01:00:17.680 --> 01:00:38.880
>> Is there anyone here from that property? Can I ask just one thing? So the violations at 434, but 44 Nantucket did the work. So how I

206
01:00:38.880 --> 01:00:54.960
mean technically the homeowner 434 didn't violate anything. So how does that work for a violation? >> We spoke to him. >> Yeah. So, actually when uh Paul and I were out there, we ran into the the

207
01:00:54.960 --> 01:01:10.799
owner of 434 Ridgeville. Um he did not know about the the work. Um but he said he was willing to work with uh whoever did cut the trees down um to provide uh

208
01:01:10.799 --> 01:01:26.880
permission to do any sort of restoration. Um, so it it is a little bit unique in this situation that it's uh the violation occurred on one property, but it was actually >> right >> uh their neighbor that did the work,

209
01:01:26.880 --> 01:01:41.359
>> right? >> So, I feel bad for the homeowner who's now got a violation >> and they didn't >> Yeah, it it's Well, I know. But still, the the owner, it's not their fault. No,

210
01:01:41.359 --> 01:01:56.880
>> I'll just, you know, I mean, you know how I feel about these things. I would I would strongly oppose doing an NOI, an after the-act NOI, for lots of reasons. Um, if they don't comply with it, they can appeal it and they can get out from

211
01:01:56.880 --> 01:02:13.040
under it that way. We I would suggest we do a restoration order and we have them in the files. We've done several before. They're based on orders of condition. Um they have a lot of the same stuff in them and you can join both parties and you can make we can make it clear in the

212
01:02:13.040 --> 01:02:28.880
order that the owner of 434 is being joined solely for the purpose of providing permission and access to the property and then make the owner of Fort Nantucket deal with the invasives and I would suggest plant pitch pines >> like it. [snorts]

213
01:02:28.880 --> 01:02:45.200
>> Anyway, that's >> Yeah, >> I just want to add one thing. Attorney Riley did call me and uh indicated that uh in his view uh planting anything in that location where there was cutting would be futile. Any natives would be

214
01:02:45.200 --> 01:02:59.920
futile and I >> why invaded >> uh he didn't really give me a reason. Um you know I just told him the commission would probably reject that notion. Um and >> I mean you have you have trees you have

215
01:02:59.920 --> 01:03:15.680
trees. I think what he was meaning that the invasive would encroach again and take it all over. Is that what he's probably that's what he meant. >> Yeah, I think so. [clears throat] >> Having said that, I think that's Janet's approach is the direction we'll take if that's what you want us to do and we'll

216
01:03:15.680 --> 01:03:30.160
follow through with it with him. >> I agree with it. I do too. >> Yeah, I do too. So, how do we proceed with that then? I can I'll find um we haven't done one in a while, but I have a there's a template somewhere. I can find it pretty easily for the restoration order

217
01:03:30.160 --> 01:03:46.319
>> and it's you just fill in the facts and then we treat it just like a and then you um so it would be scheduled uh for a hearing on the on the restoration order and they get notice and they can come and you treat it not like an NOI but you

218
01:03:46.319 --> 01:04:02.160
treat it like an O order of conditions but it's a >> and we can do that on someone else's property. Um >> yeah, you issue it to both parties. So, so the >> one's giving permission and one's doing the work, >> right? >> Permission to access the land,

219
01:04:02.160 --> 01:04:17.359
>> right? >> Huh. And I believe uh Teresa from Blue Flax had also gone out and done a site visit um just to observe what the vegetation makeup is there

220
01:04:17.359 --> 01:04:33.680
currently. So, and she noted that it was nearly 100% invasives as well. >> Yeah. Yeah, the one thing that's missing is a is a a restoration site plan. A plan like what's being plant, what's being where is the actually the area. It needs to have a a site description and

221
01:04:33.680 --> 01:04:50.880
what's proposed to be planted. So maybe the first step is to issue a an enforcement order and say submit a plan for the restoration of this area and then we attach the plan to the restoration order.

222
01:04:50.880 --> 01:05:07.280
>> We did that a couple times. I forget. It's been a while, but it was it worked. >> It worked. >> So, we're not going to continue this violation then. We're just going to issue this order. This >> Yeah, I think that we can't. Yeah, we'll schedule a hearing date once the order is issued and give them a deadline for

223
01:05:07.280 --> 01:05:22.559
submitting a restoration plan. >> Should we as a commission vote on whether that is a good >> Sure. >> way to proceed? >> Sure. >> Okay. Robert >> make a motion that we issue an

224
01:05:22.559 --> 01:05:38.480
enforcement order um uh for the property at 434 Ridgeville Road. >> Second >> Karen >> I >> Eric >> I >> Bob >> I >> Janet >> I

225
01:05:38.480 --> 01:05:56.559
>> and I say I >> All right next up Bradford. >> All right. Next up is a discussion for the open space and recreation plan stakeholder interview representative appointment. Um so just a little background on this.

226
01:05:56.559 --> 01:06:12.000
Um Christina Grady, our town planner, is working with BSC group uh to update Chattam's open space and recreation plan. Um having an updated open space recreation plan will allow uh the town

227
01:06:12.000 --> 01:06:29.039
to apply for grants. um in the future that require having an open space plan. Um [clears throat] and uh there was a survey that went around um I think they sent it out in uh

228
01:06:29.039 --> 01:06:43.440
May. Um >> yeah, I think >> uh you guys may have seen the QR codes. Um maybe even responded to the survey yourself. um they had an open house um I think it was May 20th sometime sometime

229
01:06:43.440 --> 01:07:02.480
in May um to get some feedback from the public and now in this stage um they'd like to work with different town uh uh commissions and committees um to get their feedback as well. Um, so they've

230
01:07:02.480 --> 01:07:19.119
grouped us into different categories, recreation, conservation, um, and water resources. Um and so on August 6th, um BSC Group is

231
01:07:19.119 --> 01:07:37.599
going to be having a um holding these interviews. Um and they're looking for a representative from each of the commissions and committees to participate in those interviews. Um they sent out a list of interview questions

232
01:07:37.599 --> 01:07:53.599
last week. Um I think >> I forwarded that to all the commissioners. >> Okay, great. Thank you. Um, and so it's really just focused on uh, group two, the conservation questions. Um, there's seven of them. Um,

233
01:07:53.599 --> 01:08:10.559
>> and really only about four or five of them pertain to us specifically. >> Correct. Yeah. So, not all of them will be um, relevant to to our committee. Um, there's other groups that are going to be participating, not just town committees, but other uh, organizations.

234
01:08:10.559 --> 01:08:25.759
Um, the Chattam Conservation Foundation will be present. Um, I don't have the list of everyone that will will be present. Um, but they're trying to reach out to, you know, everyone that could possibly weigh in, um, to the open space

235
01:08:25.759 --> 01:08:43.199
and recreation plan. Um, so, uh, since they don't want to violate any open meeting laws, we just want kind of one representative from our committee to participate on, uh, August 6th. Um, it's

236
01:08:43.199 --> 01:08:59.679
just going to be that one-time uh, Zoom meeting. Um, it it's not going to be a huge time commitment uh, moving forwards. Um, so don't feel like you're committing yourself to a uh um a huge

237
01:08:59.679 --> 01:09:19.120
task. Um, and [snorts] by uh providing these questions now, they're giving us the opportunity to also think about it. Um, each of you individually can think about it, weigh in, um, provide comments, questions,

238
01:09:19.120 --> 01:09:35.520
concerns to, um, Paul or myself. um or Paul and >> well if Paul's going to if say if Paul's going to be the representative then he has to speak for everybody involved right? >> Yes. >> Yeah. And so I would like to hear everyone's in >> so let's go over the questions. >> Yeah.

239
01:09:35.520 --> 01:09:52.719
>> It's only 2 o'clock through 10. >> Sure. >> It won't take very long. Is everyone okay with that? >> All right. >> As confusing as they are. >> And so one of you are going to be there on that? >> No you are. >> Zoom call. >> No. They want one of us to be there as

240
01:09:52.719 --> 01:10:08.080
well. >> Yeah. Okay. >> So, [laughter] >> okay. So, yeah, I'll do that with you. All right. >> So, question number one. >> What aspects of Chadam's open spaces, natural resources, and conservation lands are currently working well? >> All of them.

241
01:10:08.080 --> 01:10:26.640
>> I don't know. >> I don't know. [snorts] >> That would be that would be a survey. That's a very hard question to ask because we really don't know. And so if we don't know, no news is good news. So obviously then it must be working.

242
01:10:26.640 --> 01:10:41.760
>> Well, they're wait they're in but but they're they're indicated they're covered well on the website on the Cadam website when you when you go through and ask for trails and whatnot the conservation foundation comes up. The

243
01:10:41.760 --> 01:10:57.760
rest of the website comes up. The trails are marked when you're driving around. you can see where the trails are. Walking the trails, the ones that I do walk, um they're very very wellmaintained. >> Yes, they are. >> Um, you know, I'm not going to weigh in

244
01:10:57.760 --> 01:11:12.800
on as a conservation commissioner on whether they should have boardwalks or anything like that at this point in time, but I I think they've done a very nice job conservation commission. >> So, there's no need to spend any more of our tax money. >> I agree. the foundation with its with

245
01:11:12.800 --> 01:11:27.679
its limited staff and limited resources and you know manages to to do a very good job taking care of those lands. What always sty stymies me is that there's a lot of

246
01:11:27.679 --> 01:11:44.159
there's a lot of townowned open space. Some of it has conservation restrictions on it. Um and for a lot of those we're in charge of them. you know, we have authority and we're supposed to be stewards of those

247
01:11:44.159 --> 01:12:00.800
and we don't generally deal with any of that. Like you go to was it uh Silven Gardens for example, when you walk in there, there's a large sign saying this is under the jurisdiction of the conservation commission. I really um and and so there's that that we don't even

248
01:12:00.800 --> 01:12:17.520
if we don't know then nobody else knows that these things are protected. We're supposed to be taking care of them >> if they're under the foundation. foundation, right? But there's a lot of open space that we're supposed to be taking care of. Um, and I we don't have staff that are dedicated to that

249
01:12:17.520 --> 01:12:33.040
purpose, right? >> We we have a lot of conservation areas that are maintained by the staff and >> No, you do a lot of that. You do? >> No, we we do. We maintain the trails and signage and updates. >> And those are the trails and osprey poles and >> Right.

250
01:12:33.040 --> 01:12:49.679
>> I just don't know what they are. They're listed on the they're listed on the town site >> on invation. They're separate separated between conservation foundation town and then they have a section that's beaches and some of the beaches have walks too, but the town their town ones are very

251
01:12:49.679 --> 01:13:05.920
specified on the site. >> Well, let me ask the agent. So, answer to number one. >> So, do you feel as though it's good? >> Yeah, I do. >> All right. And then number one is done. So, let's go to number one. I just want to make a point too. Silven Gardens has the friends of Silven Gardens. They've

252
01:13:05.920 --> 01:13:21.920
always maintained that area and have >> we have stayed out of the management of that area. That's >> is that the only one that has an independent um entity? >> And [clears throat] so the other question since this is about open space is that there's an awful lot of

253
01:13:21.920 --> 01:13:39.280
townowned open space that is not protected. Mhm. >> Um, and I don't know, you know, I mean, I I have I have my suspicions about why that is. Um, but um I guess we have no we have nothing to do with that. So um it's not

254
01:13:39.280 --> 01:13:54.880
>> Well, we could certainly ask. >> Yeah. Yeah. In in the midst of a conversation, you can always ask that. >> Some of them like some of them were beaches. You can see it on here. Like that's under parks and recreation. But >> you know, the one I always circle back to is Goose Pond. Um

255
01:13:54.880 --> 01:14:11.040
>> the open space committee is also working with um Mark I don't know what his last name is Mark Robinson >> um >> to do an evaluation of all the open space parcels and who has conservation

256
01:14:11.040 --> 01:14:27.440
restrictions and who doesn't >> that's what I'm asking is that I don't I'm completely unclear about >> he's basically just going through it to make sure everything was done properly votes were taken properly um Bradford and I have been working with him um uh to get some documents that he needs. So

257
01:14:27.440 --> 01:14:45.199
that's being taken care of. Um the open space map is a little bit deceiving because there are beaches and you know places like uh >> you know some some areas that are conservation that don't have any access at all that are small and just don't

258
01:14:45.199 --> 01:15:00.880
have any trails. But all of our trail areas that are open to the public are very very well maintained. Um >> marked. Yeah, >> you're good. >> All right, item number two. >> Well, I just like to add quickly that a lot of them are invaded with invasives, >> right?

259
01:15:00.880 --> 01:15:15.120
>> Uh and you know, I know it's a monumental task to remove all the invasives, but even if we >> impossible in some cases. >> Yeah. But um >> even if even if uf too

260
01:15:15.120 --> 01:15:33.120
>> we started small and you know worked on one area at a time or I don't know every year do so much >> a percentage >> are there any grant funds available? >> They have volunteers that cleared out invasives and and whatnot in Kate Ghoul Park last year. The friends of trees had

261
01:15:33.120 --> 01:15:49.120
somebody come in and do that. I wonder if whatever we do >> that's one of the groups that was invited to this. >> Yeah. Oh, good. >> Maybe we could have an invasive army, >> so to speak. [laughter] >> Invasive army. >> Army. I like that. >> Is that redundant? >> The only thing I've noticed is if they

262
01:15:49.120 --> 01:16:05.040
want to spend money, maybe, you know, handicap accessible uh would be good place to spend some money. >> That gets tough though cuz then you start talking about >> boardwalk. That's right. And we that's that's well I don't think we should be the conservation commission should be

263
01:16:05.040 --> 01:16:21.280
approving >> but they but they'd have a long way to go just to do the town before they even got that far if they were you know to spend some money in the on the public town areas that aren't involved with conservation. You know it would be good to have more handicap accessible so

264
01:16:21.280 --> 01:16:38.159
everybody can enjoy it. I mean, I don't know how much money they're talking they're going to get here, but um so I mean, there's plenty of place things to spend money on. >> Yeah. [laughter] Always >> before any grants can be applied for for um some of the things you're talking

265
01:16:38.159 --> 01:16:55.040
about, this plan has to be updated, filed, and approved by the state. >> That's right. That's what you began by saying that's the purpose here. Okay. We're we're on board for that. >> Y All right. So, I think we've already answered question number two because one of the examples was invasion. species management. So let's move on to number

266
01:16:55.040 --> 01:17:10.080
three. [snorts] >> I'm not even sure if this is Germaine. So number three is what barriers do residents face especially under un under underserved residents and vulnerable population such as older adult, youth, people with disabilities when trying to

267
01:17:10.080 --> 01:17:26.719
access trails and conservation areas. You just brought that up. >> Yep. >> And what steps could be taken to reduce or eliminate these barriers? >> You know, Fort Hill has done a nice job. I don't know if you've ever walked the Fort Hill out in East Ham,

268
01:17:26.719 --> 01:17:43.440
but we don't necessarily have a conservation area that that could be adapted to. So, I think that would be a real evaluation to see where you could put in boardwalks and make the trails wide enough for >> maybe you do a pilot as to one. So,

269
01:17:43.440 --> 01:17:59.920
Harwitch uh Trust did the one fully ADA compliant trail >> in one of their new uh cranberry bog restoration areas. >> Oh, yeah. Yeah. >> And it's wide and and they did put in a boardwalk because you have to do that for ADA. But maybe as as a pilot to see,

270
01:17:59.920 --> 01:18:14.880
can we make one of these areas completely accessible? >> Oh, interesting enough, Silven Garden does have access. >> Silven is good. Yeah. And there there's there's not boardwalk. It's on. They just keep the the ground as nice and flat. >> Yeah.

271
01:18:14.880 --> 01:18:30.000
>> Yeah. And wide. >> Okay. >> Stole your paper. >> So that's 100% Paul. >> Excuse me. >> 100% uh accessible >> guidance. >> Yes. Yep. >> Yep.

272
01:18:30.000 --> 01:18:44.480
>> Okay. Question number four. Are there emerging interests that the town should better support or explore? examples coastal resiliency wildlife corridor connectivity. [snorts] >> Mr. Chairman, I I just want you when you

273
01:18:44.480 --> 01:19:01.520
say 100% is the whole Silven Garden area 100% handicap access. I I misspoke. It's not. There's one small handicap area that they can go onto and they get at the the best view of the property that you can get if you go out and look at it, but it's not

274
01:19:01.520 --> 01:19:18.159
>> uh something you can go through the whole area with. It's just one spot. >> I see. Yep. I apologize for that. >> Thanks. Y >> Sorry. >> All right. Are there any are there emerging interests that the town should better support or explore? Examples of

275
01:19:18.159 --> 01:19:34.320
coastal resiliency, wildlife corridor connectivity. >> What does that mean? Corridor >> connectivity mean [clears throat] of these open space areas be better connected. >> Yeah. trying to connect those open spaces so that they

276
01:19:34.320 --> 01:19:49.600
>> right >> wildlife can travel from one to the other. >> Okay. >> Given what we just passed, I think coastal resiliency is it's one of the town goals. >> Yeah. >> For the next five years. So obviously that's something we care about. We just

277
01:19:49.600 --> 01:20:07.440
passed the regulations to be more effective at coastal resiliency. So, I would say that um I'd love to see them get into doing invasive removal. >> Yep.

278
01:20:07.440 --> 01:20:24.239
>> I mean, if if they want the pie in the sky, [snorts] >> what what what irks me is seeing all the uh rafts and the >> Yeah. >> oats and the marsh. >> Yeah. In the marsh or in the side of a pond.

279
01:20:24.239 --> 01:20:39.280
>> Yep. Yeah. >> Um I mean, it's not enforced, you know, and it should be. >> It's so nice to drive around at this time of year and see people with the kayaks hanging on their >> proper racks that we peritted.

280
01:20:39.280 --> 01:20:54.640
>> I saw a bunch of them going back and forth to the post office. >> The worst is when you have Zia kayak and they're still laying in the marsh. One on that. >> Yeah. We just approved the CSA. >> That would involve more that would involve like a task force, more employees, more more

281
01:20:54.640 --> 01:21:12.320
>> Yeah. Bigger government, more taxes. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> All right. Number five. In what ways could conservation areas in Chadam foster community connections, public health and well-being? Example, guided nature walks, environmental education

282
01:21:12.320 --> 01:21:28.960
opportunities, volunteer stewardship programs. >> All of the above. >> The foundation does some of that. >> The foundation does do >> I think that's more of a foundation thing than us. Yes. I mean, we can't do nature walks. >> Well, again, these these questions are for all six.

283
01:21:28.960 --> 01:21:46.159
>> So, I'm saying I think and Lauren's on. So, >> yeah, >> I will say that we're working on kiosks um for educational purposes, environmental education. Um Bradford and I have been working on >> one particular site and our goal is to,

284
01:21:46.159 --> 01:22:02.719
you know, eventually have them all done, but we're budgetary wise, we're starting slow. Maybe there'll be some money coming later on. >> Um I can give you one example. Um you know up at Forest Beach Overlook, there's that Osprey um

285
01:22:02.719 --> 01:22:17.600
>> educational kiosk that's there. We also put one down at uh uh Valley Farm. And as far as invasives go, maybe Forest Peach Overlook, it's invaded with love grass has been for years. Um that would be an expensive proposition to deal

286
01:22:17.600 --> 01:22:35.520
with, but it might be manageable. uh Bob as opposed to some of the large sites because there's just so many invasives everywhere. Yeah, >> it'd be almost an impossible task. But >> so when we get to this point and start asking the questions, we can bring all these points up at the Zoom meeting.

287
01:22:35.520 --> 01:22:49.920
>> All right, next one. What land acquisition or conservation opportunities should Chadam pursue in the next 5 to 10 years to protect natural resources and improve coastal resiliency? Number one would be the uh

288
01:22:49.920 --> 01:23:05.840
upland areas that are adjacent to salt marshes that are in the salt marsh migration route. If if we don't protect those >> the salt marshes will go because there will be nowhere to go. So getting conservation restrictions and those have

289
01:23:05.840 --> 01:23:22.480
all those largely have been mapped. So the ECAC mapped some of the migration routes on the south side of the Nucket Sound marshes. They're working on the Atlantic side ones now. So that'll be done next year. And I think the Center for Coastal Studies also did some

290
01:23:22.480 --> 01:23:39.360
mapping of migration marsh migration routes. So we we know where they're where they're likely to go. So >> they did a whole Pleasant Bay, didn't they? They had which were the most endangered and >> Yep. Right. >> So we already have all that information. >> We have the data. It's just a matter of

291
01:23:39.360 --> 01:23:55.840
of figuring out, you know, how to how to protect those areas without it being controversial, without triggering takings claims, without, you know, stepping into landmines, you know. So you do it you do it carefully and

292
01:23:55.840 --> 01:24:11.199
thoughtfully on a onetoone basis with homeowners and you know >> talk see if they can be persuaded to provide conservation restrictions on the land that they can't develop anyway because it's going to be too wet. So they might as well get the tax benefit

293
01:24:11.199 --> 01:24:27.199
by doing a conservation restriction. And that's what Mark Robinson's >> expertise is on how to you know using those kinds of restrictions and getting people on board. and he's he's the guy who knows all the benefits. And anyway, I I think that's incredibly important >> because of sea level rise.

294
01:24:27.199 --> 01:24:42.960
>> Yep. >> Yep. >> This all ties into why we were doing the regulation modifications. So, I think we've done our part, >> you know, and continue to. >> Yep. >> And the last one is really just general. Is there anything else you'd like to

295
01:24:42.960 --> 01:24:58.480
share that could help improve the community's experience with conservation lands? Well, I I I've if I I think for to do an experiment or, you know, people who have

296
01:24:58.480 --> 01:25:13.520
handicap problems, they're voters and some of them have a lot of money. So, you know, if they sit around, they don't know what any all this nature looks like. They're going to be like, "Well, I I can't see it. What what do I care? Why why would I want to, you know, help?"

297
01:25:13.520 --> 01:25:30.000
But if if if people would were to see or had a little bit of access to areas whether it's uh you know the conservation areas or it's public then they can see wow there's a lot going on in chatam you know and I want to help preserve it right because if they don't

298
01:25:30.000 --> 01:25:49.920
see it then they're not going to you know then they don't care right >> right >> right higher visibility and and and more easy access >> yes access I mean, yeah. Y >> that's all I have.

299
01:25:49.920 --> 01:26:07.354
>> That's a lot for you guys to go and talk about. >> Yeah. >> Who's going to be the rep? >> I am. >> Okay. >> By default, >> you guys want to vote on that to make it official or >> All right. So, as I remember reading,

300
01:26:07.354 --> 01:26:24.000
[snorts] she doesn't need to hear until July 30th. >> Yeah. VP July 30th. >> So I'll I'll contact her and let her know. >> Okay. >> And I'll in the meanwhile I'll speak to which one of you are going to join me. >> Okay. >> Are you going to send me to the wolves by myself?

301
01:26:24.000 --> 01:26:40.840
>> No. [snorts] >> Thank you, Paulie. >> You love it. >> All right. Next item. >> Next up is minutes to be approved from May 13, 2026. >> And we were all here that day. >> Bob, take it away.

302
01:26:42.000 --> 01:26:58.480
I'll move that we approve the minutes for May 13, 2026. >> Second. >> Karen >> I. >> Eric >> I. >> Elise >> I. >> Janet >> I. >> Bob >> I. >> And I say I and the last motion please. Robert

303
01:26:58.480 --> 01:27:11.159
>> make a motion to adjourn the hearing. >> Second. >> Elise. >> I. >> Janet. I. >> Bob. I. >> Eric. I. >> Aaron. I. And I say I