All right. Uh it being a little after 7 tonight, um we will get started. Uh good evening. Um it is about 7:02 on May 14th and I'm calling this meeting of the planning board to order. My name is
Chris Lavali and I'm the chair of the board. Tonight we'll be following the posted agenda. Uh we do not have Zoom uh tonight. Uh but this meeting is being televised live and recorded by Chelms Teledia and will be available on their
website and YouTube. Um so tonight we're going to start with the public input. Uh is there anyone in the room who'd like to speak? All right. With there being none, our first item is going to be
Kate's Corner neighborhood discussion. Um, I'm hoping to try and wrap this up tonight. Uh, and the order that I'm thinking will go is, um, we'll start with the town council email, uh, on
zoning freeze. We'll talk a little bit about the Loheed Martin email, um, and then we'll use those as backdrops to the um, updated slides. Excuse me. and then we'll talk about the
manufacturing uh proposal after that. Uh so we will first start with the town council uh emails regarding the zoning freeze. If I can find my [Music] mouse. Um so Evan posed the question to
town council. Um, and essentially what it comes down to is that the um zoning freeze, if there's an ANR plan um filed for the property, uh the property itself
has the uh zoning freeze for the use of the land. um it does not apply to uh neighboring properties and it in the opinion of town council uh does not um protect from setback requirements in
those changes. So it would only be the use um freeze. So um that is the opinion of the council. Um, and again, it doesn't it in the case that we were talking about last time, it would have to be the neighbors
applying for the ANR and not Lockheed's property. The neighbors you mean for like if we were to change their CB to a residential or something like So the context that we were talking about this last meeting was
if we were to change those um commercial the the back half of those properties as commercial to residential um it would impact the setbacks and so that the the property owners of those
properties would need to file the ANR to freeze their zoning. All right. But it wouldn't affect their setbacks. Correct. Yep. But I think that's kind of the mood point because Lockheed Martin wouldn't
be able to freeze the zoning. Mhm. So, all right. The other item um is the graphic that Loheed Martin sent um with the
existing zoning uh proposed zoning um if we were to change them all RB um and then with the SEO overlay uh what that would look like. So, I'll give you a minute to look at that because these are fairly new
documents that came in late this week. And then the email that they sent um was based was their analysis. And in summary, what it said is that if we were to make these changes
on the underlying zoning, um they would not be able to redevelop that property uh because of the setbacks requirements. However, um the overlay would provide relief um and
with the setbacks that we have uh put into the overlay, it would give them enough um leeway to do some redevelopment on that property. So, I have a question on the um existing proposed zoning comparison.
I think this is locked the map. the map. Yep. Is this and I see the oh line the red dots. I guess it's the question to them. Is this a building dimensions or this would be like parking lot dimensions?
What what were we trying to show here? Looks like the setbacks but Yeah, the setbacks are the same. For the record, Connor Nagel with VHB. what the graphic is showing the red line is the building setback. H so the
developable area or building envelope that could be put on those uh in the various conditions the middle one being the proposed zoning versus the so special permit overlay. So, my understanding, correct me if I'm
wrong, sorry, my understanding, correct me if I'm wrong, would you were, and obviously things can change. I get that. Um, looking at this property as possibly being like a parking lot and building out your
current area. Is that still on the table that way or are we changing it? No. Okay. Yes, please. Yeah. Hi, Anthony Pitman with Lockhe Martin. No, the graph doesn't show any concepts. It was just trying to analyze
what the setbacks would do. So then we can go start coming up with ideas for either the parking or using the existing structure. So that's what the visuals intended to show. But the takeaway is we can use the CO8. It looks like the CO8 option would give us what we need to
start coming up with concepts. Mhm. Yeah. Okay. But the visual weird shaped building. So I was kind want to make sure yeah as Connor was highlight the red was just to highlight if we went with the proposed and didn't have coid we probably couldn't do anything anyone
would be limited uh but with coid we can start coming up with concepts within that red boundary. Okay, sounds good. Thank you. Thank you. Okay, before we go on to the slides, any questions on the town council email or
the Loheed Martin zoning. Okay. All right. Um, so what I did with the slides is I took the updates that Anita had in the um in the
spreadsheet and updated the slides. Um, put all of our changes in yellow. Um, sorry it's a little pixelated. Um, we went through all of these last time, so I'm not going to go
through them much this time. Um, that should be yellow as well. I had a couple quick questions. One, we haven't gotten to the page yet, but um, mult in the use table, multifamily is not
allowed. And in keeping with our kind of more general concept of village development with retail on the ground floor and potentially residential up above, I wonder if that would be
something that we would potentially entertain. Um part of the discussion we had last time is because this zone is intended to be a buffer between industrial and then you put don't put housing. Yeah, it's not
really the village zone. It's the buffer between other zones that would allow something like that, right? Like you can put like look at our commercial zoning and we could add something like that. Okay. Um this is more like these are just in industrial like Yeah. This is not all our zoning, right? But with a
seat overlay, you can introduce um you could y a special permit. So you could do this with the underlying with the seoid though. You could do that. Mhm. Okay. Um let me highlight
slide 12 and 13. Um so the parking lot accessory use is the one one of the open questions from last time uh that we were going to look at. Um so on this slide I have updated the note to show
accessory use parking lots are required to be either on the same lot with the parking generating activity or on any lot or premises a substantial portion of which is at least within 300 ft of such activity. Um and the recommendation last
time was that Wayland had a really good um description and this is essentially copied and pasted from them. Um Evan did provide some suggested text. Uh he suggested that we change with the
parking generated activity to as the principal use. So on the same lot as the principal use or on any lot or premises. So substantial portion of which is at least 300 ft. Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah, within 300 ft of the principal use. So
in keeping with the terminology that we already use. That makes sense. Anyone have concerns with that? Looks good. No. Okay. Um, all right. And then we will get to the
actual parcels. So this is what we had proposed that I had proposed last meeting. Um questions, comments? No, I think this is in line with what we were P is public just to Right. P is public.
P is public. Um the RB would be extended to the entire residential areas. Um, CBLT would be applied to all three of the commercial air the these three
parcels. These would stay CA. Um, the CA would be extended here and the P's would be extended here. Um, everything else stays RB. This would stay CB at the bottom. Um, I believe that's the gas station
near the the pond. Mhm. And then these would all stay RB. And then as we talked about earlier, the relief for that um odd-shaped property would come from the overlay. But this would allow us to apply this um
zoning in a lot of other areas, I think, too. thoughts. I think that looks like a good plan. I I think um we should see what the neighbors think at some point. Yep. You want to open it up to Yeah. Um if there are no other comments or questions, I'll open
it up for public comment on anything we talked about so far. Quiet crowd. Yeah. All right. You guys get a chance to look at these parcel zones. We outlasted them.
All right. Um, so we're accomplishing what No, it looks good. I what we wanted to accomplish. Yeah, I think so. Hopefully what they wanted to accomplish. And again, this is all preliminary. We'll still have to go through the public um hearing process for all zoning
articles. um which will be quite extensive I think for the next fall town meeting. Um we'll go over that later. Be a good idea to get started early. Yeah, we'll go over that later of how much zoning we might have to do in in the fall. Um but uh the
next item I wanted to talk through is the manufacturing proposal. Mhm. So I went back on this and took another look at this along with my friend chat GPT.
Um and so these are our current definitions now of the light and heavy manufacturing which we don't allow heavy. Correct. Correct. We have it defined as an exclusion essentially. Yep. Um, but I
wanted to keep it here as kind of a contrast with the light. So, those are current definitions. I took a look at Tukesbury because what I also noticed is that they recently had a town meeting where they did address this exact topic. Um, in
their spring town meeting and they redefined light industrial warehouse. um not exactly the same as ours but similar. Uh so this is what they passed in their town meeting. Um and they also
have specific um uses in the use table for research and development laboratory which may include accessory manufacturing of products in testing and development and high-tech biotech manufacturing. They don't have those defined in their zoning uh but they have
them in the use table. So I wanted to give you that information as kind of a and we're excluding the distribution. Yes, distribution is excluded. Correct.
All right. So this is what I am proposing for light manufacturing. Um I think this one is the same as last time maybe. And then the ultral light, I'm proposing
a new one. So, I left the the old one that I proposed last time here in gray so you can take a look. Um, but the new one is here. It includes some of the stuff that
we talked about last meeting, the small scale, small batch. Um it talks I'm hoping this covers the um locked case um but they can also talk
to that as well. Um where it talks about precision fab fabrication, intricate assembly, controlled treatment, packaging, distributions. Um typically operating at low and customized production volumes, smaller scale, specialized
equipment for precision and customization. Um limited loading infrastructure. Um we I have a placeholder here for docs in case we wanted to do that. square footage. Um operations confined to standard business
hours. Tractor trailer use limited to delivery only and no overnight parking of the tractor trailers. So that again pulls out the the really heavy distribution uh from this.
Um it does include a facility size. This was a suggestion from someone earlier and I did include a lot more um examples that we could use here as well. Um Evan did have some feedback on this
uh that I want to share with you. He does not recommend including a maximum facility size for light and ultra light industrial for the following reasons. most of the industrial most of the light industrial type buildings
already exist. So we may end up getting into non-conforming um use uh cases. Um and then we would need to figure out a permitting process for relief uh as well if if that
were listed there. Um and then he also reminded me that businesses over 20,000 uh square feet would still trigger a major business complex special permit anyway. Mhm. Um so adding the facility
size in here may not be necessary. Um he did say if the ultralight industrial is permitted by right then he could see potentially including a maximum facility size like we do with the um ware the distribution and warehouse or even the
retail in this Yeah. in this light zone. Yep. Um, the other thing I noticed is I don't have it here, but we do have an R&D definition in our use ca in our
uh use table as well. Um, so I wasn't sure if the locked use would fit under that as opposed to manufacturing for this facility. Um, that's something I I kind of wanted to raise to the Lockheed
folks. Um, because I don't want to if if it if the Lockheed facility here fits more into that use case, I really wouldn't want to twist things around too much to
make the manufacturing fit if it's if the primary use of that facility is more R&D. Yeah. And I I'm a little bit like I appreciate the detail, right? I know it's too it's too much. It's like I
think when you have a little bit more vague, it provides a little bit more flexibility, right? When you're very specific like this, then it doesn't allow like soon as we get this voted on, there'll be a case in six months that we didn't consider to think about and then it's too specific
and then it doesn't Well, actually, it's funny. I look at it rather differently but I come to the same conclusion which is that there are so many terms in there whose definition is subject wiggly to all
kinds of twisting. I mean I I I spent four years in night school learning how to twist language and this stuff could be twisted pretty badly. I mean uh and it may be as Anita says that
something a little more generic might actually work better in that. I mean I I try to think of examples that uh I mean somebody that had a little outfit processing
uh beeswax, you know, well they may not be making a final product with it. They may not be making the candles, but it's pretty tame. Uh, it's not intricate,
but it is small batch. But it is small batch. Well, it's how small is a small batch, you know? I feel like this is trying to give a feel of the Yeah. bread. And I like the feel of Yeah, I do too. But but but making it making it applicable from
a legal perspective concerns me. what was the what was the problem we're trying to solve with this? So there are a couple things I think. Um number one I think based on what I remember our discussion being is that
our current definition of light manufacturing is a little bit I think in some cases it could be a little heavier than we would want in some of these zones or in this zone specifically. Um, it's fine for the industrial zone,
but for this neighborhood buffer zone, it might be a little bit too heavy. Um, so the thinking is is that we should have something a little bit lighter um that we would put into this buffer zone. Maybe we should concentrate a little bit
less on the use and a little bit more on the results of that use. I mean, what is it that people don't want? They don't want noise. They don't want a whole lot of light at bad times. They don't want a pile of trucks in the in the driveway.
Those are the things that see the impacts. I So, I would recommend I'm like reading this, right? It still has to come through the planning board. Um, we set setbacks I'm thinking maybe we let like let the
manufacturing light like let's see what comes in and whether because we can always deny something through the special permit process if it doesn't work and if we see that there's some something we're seeing that like for example the
contractor yard right we knew that that wasn't right for this area so we're coming up with a new zoning for it um it it's by right in our zone, right? But I assume these are going to be they're not going to be large if anything over
20,000 square feet has to come to us regard regardless. So it's still by right. Yeah, that's the problem is that if it's under 20,000 square feet, but it's still by right now anyways under IIA in the areas that we're
looking at. Yeah. Are gonna like So we're trying to change that. Yeah. And that's my point is that in these buffer areas, we wouldn't want that impact that right now the way it's defined that's going to be a significant
impact in in these buffer areas, but right now we have IIA which already is already this. Yeah. And we're trying to change that. Well, I get that we're trying to change it. Um, I mean, if you look at the 129 area. Yeah. Well, I want Well, the 129 and one
or neck. You're talking both. But 129 wouldn't change to No, it wouldn't. But you take some of those buildings right next to residential in this type of an area. Oh, so you put the bound the boundary
properties into this zoning. Yeah. [Music] I like a little bit about what Tukbury has in their definition where they're talking about van or small buck box truck for transit and tractor trailers. Can you turn the microphone? Is it close
enough? Um, I'm looking at the Tukberry definition and one of the things that I like about what they have and I think you put something similar into there where you're talking about utilizing a van or small truck for transit, tractor trailer use only for delivery. That's kind of important because using vans and
box trucks really limits what type of size of product they could be putting in there. So, that kind of limits what they can have in the area. Guess that's an important an important statement, you know, cuz you talk about small in a lot of places within this thing here. Um,
which small is relative, but you're limiting it by what they can pick it up in, which is pretty impactful. As far as the definition um for under version two, I mean two if we do rewrite it, two things that I would try to keep I think it's it's good that it addresses
is the loading infrastructure because to me it's a transitional zone. There's a big difference with a company that has two loading docks or 12 because it's all going to revolve around truck traffic in and out and then the operations for standard business hours because I think that's something neighbors would be
concerned about. you know, are we talking, you know, um, 8 to 6:00 p.m.? Are we And because you don't in a transition zone, you wouldn't want 247 or late night traffic in and out of that facility. Yeah. When you're talking about business
hours, I mean, it's one thing to regulate the business hours. It's another thing to regulate the hours at which transport can go in and out. Those are two different things. I think regulating the transport makes a lot of sense. I mean, if somebody wants to be
developing pictures or making beeswax at two in the morning, I don't think it matters much. Assuming transporting it or lighting the neighborhood up or making a loud thump thump thump. Yeah. And I think this is the key Yeah. sentence for that is that
the operations must be fully enclosed. Yes. Um with nothing external. That's the most important piece. Okay. Yeah, I think that's a good point. I don't know that we need So, what I hear you saying is you don't think that
standard business hours needs to be uh regulated. Well, I I think we need to regulate the things that bother people and somebody in a in a closed building doesn't really matter when they're there. It's just hard to bother the neighborhood. But what about
when they're driving there to go park or they're driving there to go leave and they're Well, it depends. If it's one car, you're going to have one car going by all the time anyway. You stand out on that road, you're going to see one every 10 minutes, even at night. Well, you might have a shift. You might have a
shift, you know, but typically the shifts, second and third shift, the only one that would be problematic would be a third shift start around midnight. And you know, if it's a shift of five people, it's one thing. If it's
a shift of 50, it's another. They could be having smoke breaks outside that they might be, but hopefully the property is big enough to handle that. And in the long run, that's I'm just saying I'm trying to think of how where people are, right? Yeah.
by didn't go through the lights are definitely going to be brighter. All right. Um, if folks want to send me suggested edits, updates, I can compile it and bring it back to the board another time. Um, I will ask for public comment in a
minute, but I did want to read what we have now for the definition of research and development facilities. Um, and looking at the use table, we do have research and development as a
special permit for this zone. So research and development facilities are those used primarily for research, development and or testing of innovative information, concepts, methods, processes, materials or products. This can include design, development and
testing of biological, chemical, electrical, magnetic, mechanical and/or optical components in advance of product manufacturing. Accessory development, fabrication and light manufacturing of prototypes or specialized m machinery and devices integral to research or
testing may be associated with these uses. Research and development related principally to computer software is not included in this definition. So software development is not included in R&D.
Hardware research and development related principally to computer software. Yeah. So basically programming is not considered R&D, right? In and of itself if it's associated with Don't take it personally. I just test them. I weird. I It does
seem counterintuitive. Yeah, it seems very counterintuitive because it's actually I mean to write computer software, it doesn't make noise, you know. It it doesn't light up the solution. Unless it stopped
working the programming there. All right. Seems like we'd want to allow that. Yeah. And and I think that most cases we probably would, but it's still a special permit because of the potential
variation that we could get. All right. Um, so I'm going to open it up to public comment on the definitions of manufacturing if folks have any input or ideas. If the Loheed
Martin folks want to also talk to the potential R&D definition as it might apply to Loheed, I don't know. I'm curious as to which which definition the Lockheed. Sure. Hi, Anthony Pitman again with
Locky Martin. Yeah, I we definitely fit in the R&D category, but I feel like we also fit into that light manufacturing because without a little bit of that first type of sentence describing small batch kind of high value small scale
production, I would fear that the R&D would just box us into all that pre- stuff. So, I'd like to take some time with my team to kind of study both and maybe give some recommendations. But at face value, the light manufacturing also, as I'm reading through, I'm like, "Oh, yes, yes, yes." I agree with
Michael on the standard operating hours because we do today discreetly operate second and third shifts, very small quantity, but security guards, some engineers, some light, you know, operators of equipment. So, it that would be something we we'd want to look at. Um and then agree with Evan's
recommendation not to limit the size of that just because we would be limited just by the footprint and the setbacks anyways. Um but those are just initial thoughts. Okay. But agreed the R&D matches but that light manufacturing at face value. There's some there's some
context in there that I think um because you're you're not just um you're also producing, right? Yes, sir. You actually are you producing or prototyping? Both. Both. Yeah. So definitely all R&D but we are producing we get into that once it's it's very small batch for they don't
hand it off to somebody else they actually Yes sir. Correct. Okay. And it gets scaled up someplace else. Uh no we just uh at our at our factory the rates are relatively small batch customized. So even though they're we think they're high rates in the grand context of
manufacturing they're they're they're very small. What would you consider your primary use of that facility? It's both. It's both. I mean, I think the type of work that we do that high tech
half of the workforce are design engineers designing that type of tech, prototyping, doing the testing and then the other half then once it's ready for production, they're building on that small scale. Okay. Yeah. Thank you. So, but we'll we'll take some time to look at it, but at face value, both of them
seem to capture the aura of of what we do today. Okay. Thanks. Yep. That's actually something to keep in mind as we're developing the definition and the use table. Um because if there are businesses that fall into both, we want
to make sure that they're not counteracting each other. Um so if we have one by right, we should try and have the other one by right. If they're if it's special permit, we should probably have the other one special permit. Um so that's something to keep
in mind. simply say if if two things apply the least restrictive shall apply another way at it. Yeah. I want to try and avoid the overlap as much as possible. That's a good point because it creates confusion.
Yeah. Okay. All right. Any other items of discussion on this? All right. So I think we've wrapped everything except for this definition and the associated use uh line in the table. Um
so we'll pick that discussion up at the next meeting. Um and hopefully finalize that and then it should be ready for public hearing. All right. Thank you everyone.
We'll get there. All right. Huh? Excuse me. We have no new or continued public hearings. Um, surprising second meeting in a row.
Um, all right. Get used to it. So, now we get into some of the other topics of discussion. Um, the town meeting debrief uh is the first one. Uh so the 129 for those of you who
didn't follow the town meeting um 129 overlay uh was defeated. Um that is not changing. Uh the zoning changes for flood plane passed. Um and then
the zoning changes for the family definition and the school um removing schools from consideration for special permits um was defeated. Um am I missing anything? Oh, the
lighting bylaw was also defeated as well. Sorry, it was pulled. Sorry. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it may well be that the uh that not getting uh the family definitions change may be moot because that may just
be stuffed down our throat by a court anyway. Um if if uh if it comes if it comes up, I would like and we'll talk about it um further down, but I would like to try it again at fall town meeting. Um, my
takeaway from this town meeting is that we should separate all of the articles, um, any zoning that does not really relate to each other, we should keep it separate. It's going to make things longer. Um, but I don't know if the
school thing would have passed had it been separate from the family definition. So, um, that's my takeaway from town meeting is that as much as I would like to group them together, I think it causes too many problems and confusion.
I forget. Did the you say the flood one passed or didn't pass? I don't remember. Did it pass because they needed to do that one. Okay. Yep. Any other thoughts on town meeting? I think with this the whole thing with the school issue is some reps may have
misunderstood that you know we're not saying all of us you know and I I'm sure all of the reps know that there's definitely a cost to educate a child. We all know that but it's just we the state is telling us we cannot use that as a criteria to deny a project to deny a
project. So maybe that if we do take another crack at it. Yep. Um, I think that's where the disconnect was. Yeah, they seem very confused. And I was curious when we go to do this one in the fall if there was any way to present the material any differently cuz I don't
know how many people were understanding what was being told to them. They were all getting fixated on words when I heard them speaking like like the family that's all you heard for it was quite a while. Hours. Yeah, it was. But I and that's why I don't know if there's any
other way to twist the stuff. not twist it, but change the stuff so they're more focused on pieces they need to hear. Yeah. One of the other things that I realized, um, is that as a presenter up there, I cannot argue points. Um, I
would have to go to the microphone to argue. Um, so I can clarify things if people ask questions. So, one of the things that we might want to do a little bit more of um next town meeting is tag team, have other board members come up
and make clarifying points um or ask me as the presenter if I'm presenting um if I could clarify or speak to a specific point. So, that's something we might want to think about for next town meeting. I think that'd be a great idea because I saw you came off once to go
say something, but then you weren't up there to answer. So, yep. One to, you know, comment and one to ask questions. We'll be all set. Yeah. And there were a few points where I really wanted to clarify some incorrect information, but I couldn't because I
wouldn't be able to make it down and back. And so, okay. Anything else? All right. ADU bylaw. Um, so the uh where
is I don't think we need to put that up, but the ADU bylaw um update is that the attorney general did receive opposition letters um from a resident. I think they received three of them. Um and so
they've asked, the attorney general has asked the town to approve a 45day um extension to the 90-day review period um to be able to review the complaints
and it'll allow the town council to respond to um the complaints as well. Who is it that grants that? Is that the uh selectment select board? Uh, no. I think it was town manager gave We might as well. There's no reason. Yeah, town
manager approved it through uh town council and through us. I mean, we weighed in on it in email format, right? I I feel like I got something saying I don't think so. No, I would like I think you're right. I
think they mentioned it, but the town manager did. Yeah, they extended it. Um I I just wanted to stipulate that in my understanding see if it's what you guys understand as well that this is just by means of them
requiring a bit more time to review everything. It has nothing to do with that there's merit right or any judgment positive or negative. Correct. There's standard operating procedure. They got a complaint. They now we need to think about it more. started reviewing the
complaint however many days before the deadline and there's lots of other probably towns in similar situation so they y need more time. Yep. All right. So after the 45day extension I'm hoping that we hear something back one way or the other.
Um fall town meeting articles. Okay. So let me not do the massage special permit discussion yet. Um, but essentially what I'm seeing for Falltown meeting zoning articles is
the CR light or sorry CB light. Um the Kate's Corner resoning, potentially the Mill area resoning, um the family
definition, the school impact, the um if we do something with the industrial uh light definition, that will be included. Ed and then this um
issue on the massage services. So, there are a lot of zoning um articles that we're going to have to um refine and uh put to um public input or uh public process.
So, it's going to be a busy season. Yeah, but we've already done a bit of work on all of this except the massage. Yeah. And I plan on um in the next couple weeks, I plan on revising the family and um school impact based on
feedback tonight and feedback from town meeting and then I'll bring it back to the board again with uh draft. Are there any other things that we would want to bring to town meeting that you can think of?
I think that's a that's enough. I mean, there are lots of things we could bring, but uh I don't think we have the time to develop them. Say this fall meeting is going to go three days now. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So let's get into the
massage. Yeah. State planning grant next on the agenda. No massage. No, we just did state we just fall town meeting. Then the next item is state plan. Fall town meeting is the massage. Yeah. Oh, sorry. Triggered by the Okay. Sorry. I didn't finish reading the sentence. My
fault. All right. So, let me see if I can summarize this. It was a little bit of a confusing um thread, but I think there are couple different issues. The first is we have um a
definition in our uh use table that is different than the state's definition. and it specifically calls out massage therapists as exempt from or
not included in this definition. Um if if they're permit if they're permitted to practice under the rules and regulations of the board of health. the board of health no longer or I'm not sure if they ever did license or
permit um massage therapists. It's the state that does that. Um so at the very least we should remove this um section of that uh regulation of the
bylaw. Even if the state does like do give their license, does the health department not go in and check on occasion like inspect the area, the building, the space? They might. That's not on our Yeah. I don't know. I
don't know if they don't give them a license for space. It might be the state that does the inspections. I'm not sure. I can ask. Anyway, it's not us. Yeah. It's kind of like like a nail technician. Like a nail technician. Even if they do, that would have nothing to do with zoning. Yeah. Doctor's offices,
you know, the I'm trying to find governing bodies, not the planning board. And I remember something had to do with before like so I had a massage therapist who actually like changed locations in Chelmsford had to go in front of the
select board. M they have to go find some board to get approval. I think it is the planning board because the the location is permitted under special
permits for this use. So if they move locations and this is part of the confusion here is that the I think the question was does the special permit follow the person or is
it the because there's a little confusion between the licensing of therap massage therapists and the use as a special permit but but hold on a second like do we like the planning board doesn't approve nail technicians
or spas. Why? Why are we even bothering approving like massage therapists like they have I think plenty of state regulation massage in their lensure massage service establishment is board of appeals for
CABBC CD and CV. Okay. But but what about like hair salons, nails, spas? I I remember. So any needless to say, I remember I had to go in front like to speak in favor of allowing this
woman to change locations, which was, by the way, across the street, which was ridiculous. She went from one side of Chumps Street to the other. Um it just seemed silly to me. And she and her a lot of her clients were um because she did a lot of lymphatic
massages for people who were suffering from cancer. Yeah. Like so like why are we it just seemed odd that we do that. I mean you got to go back to the history of this. you go back 50 years and views were very very different, right? Um, and there wasn't a state probably licensing
board and there was probably a negative connotation to whatever ma like whatever. But like I think we we can move ahead like well we do if you look at the use table and the zoning we do
the same thing for medical offices and centers. We do the same thing for um medical clinics, tattoo parlors. So all of those are uses allowed in our zoning. Yep.
And I would see massages similar in that as medical office. So I think a the definition is problematic because I think it it's misaligned with
the state's definition. But I do think we should have it in our use table. Um do we so do we have uh salons in our use table? Yes, I believe so. And spas?
I think I think we have spas. Uh, I'm not sure what it's under, but I'm almost positive we have I I think spas might be covered under massage service establishment. Yeah. Under commercial excludes barbers
medical. If you look under the definitions, it excludes barbers massage service establishment art physicians and so and so on. If you look at that, they're all under the commercial of
uh 195 attachment one colon 3 body art health club massage. So I think the idea is that DBA. We're not looking to remove it as a use, but to redefine it using the state's definition.
I would redefine it, but I also like right now we have if you look at massage service establishments, it's no no except for CA, CB, CC, CD, CV. Yeah. Commercial. Those are all BA.
Yeah. Like again, like I don't know like That should be a BA. Like that seem like something would become in a planning board. I want to or VBA like again like unless you're building like unless
you're building like a huge facility that's like I don't know 3,000 massage therapists in there like like this is a small these people like there's not like I don't see nail technician has to go to the to the ZBA. I think they might
Where do you see that? Technician. Nail nail technicians. We don't go to hair hair salons. We don't do barbers, right? But we do do uh tattoo parlor. Yes.
Yeah. But tattoo parlor like you're sticking people with needles. Okay. So at a spa they that's my point where but that's spas not massage though yeah massage wouldn't do acupuncture we're basically
playing around with an idea of medical we should call it wellness yeah that would massage wellness I don't know I again I just thought it was really ridiculous this one woman who went from one side of the street to the next side of the street had asked me to go speak
in like me and some of her other clients to go week so she could get this approval. I thought that was a little over the top, intrusive. Yep. For again, I understand the history of the massage, you know, maybe there was a negative connotation, but the people that spoke
up for her were, you know, cancer survivors who utilize her. She, you know, she does regular massages for relaxation and, you know, tight deep tissue, right? to you know folks who you know have gone
through chemo therapies and lymphatic massages that they use as part of their recovery. So but that's the that would be the case with any change of use. Any change of use has to come before the board. I'm telling this is one sole proprietor going from one side of the
street to the other side of the street. But what was the use of the property? The same thing like it didn't change zone areas. No, but the use changed. The use of that the building they were going into might have been office use. No, no,
no, it wasn't. What was it? It was like other spa stuff. So, one side had spa, the other like hair spas, and it was literally going from one side to the other. So, that was a change of use. Oh, okay. But she had to come through because she's a massage had to go through the ZBA because she was a
massage therapist. Yeah. got to ask the ZBA what they think of this. But she wouldn't have had to if there was a if that new property was already as a massage therapist. Yeah. But it wasn't right. I'm guessing it has
a lot more to do to the fact that it's being regulated by the board of health because the other things that are being regulated by the board of health also show up in our zoning. So I imagine that those are probably highly related. So, I'm with you with changing it for like
making it mirror the state, but can we look at removing it? like not removing it, but at least give me an answer of why this woman had to go. Like, man, I was happy to do it as a client, but just seemed I
mean, we can talk to Evan when he gets back next meeting, but my guess is it's partially because of the change of use and partially because it was a use that is regulated by the board of health. Are there any zones that allow it or every time they go they need special? It
was VA. But like then why does like you know like a spa like where you go get facials not they can go anywhere like facials aren't regulated by the board of health and massages are so yeah facials should be massage massage massage therapists are regulated by the board of
health. But I thought you just said they weren't. If you read the definition of massage service establishment it makes reference to what we have is that they are regulated by the board of health. Well we're going to change that. Well, we don't if they are regulated by
they're regulated by the board of health. That's the health regulations to say about that. Oh, what? I just lost me on that. If they're regulated by the board of health, we don't have any influence on whether they're regulated under the health regulations or not.
Right. The only question would be are we coordinating our activities of zoning with their regulation of activities. So I could bring it up with the board of health and ask them like So the question is we should ask the board of health whether they need to regulate this. Is that what you're saying? No. No. They
they are regulating it. There there I'm sure there's a health regulation that they're operating under. Okay. So I'm going to I well it's not according to this thread. It's not regulated by the Chsford Board of Health. It's regulated
by the state board of health. It's a state regulation. Should go to health also involved in this if they're local in our town? I don't think they are. I think it was written in a way that they would have been, but according
to this thread, maybe they were back then, but the state might have taken that over. I think that's when I was reading some of this thread, I was getting very confused. like why is it just the state not local board of health doing taking care of almost some of the stuff but that's also like I think
estheticians electrolysis right those are all regulated by state agencies nail technicians right and we don't call those out separate my point is we don't call those out separately I don't know I'm just trying to make it easier for like I'm almost I thought we
did Okay. So, action points. We're going to talk to the ZBA. So, I think I think and the board of health Joel can talk to the board of health next meeting. We're going to sync the
definitions. We will I will draft something about rewarding the definition to um refer to the state definition and then we can talk to Evan next week or next meeting about the regulation in the
use table. Maybe look at some other towns. Do you want to look at other towns? Sure. Okay. Okay. Yeah. Our current zoning makes reference to chapter 2011 board of health article
8 massage/muscular theapy. So unless that somehow magically disappeared. I think it did actually. and and looking at June 2024 that became but according to that thread the board of the Chelse board of health does not
license massage therapists it's the state uh well right I don't think they would right I wouldn't don't think they would license them but they do regulate regulate maybe yeah and they so there are clear at least according to this
There are clear chumps regulations under which the board of health uh regulates massage therapy. All right. So, no, I'll ask them. Yeah, ask them. Ask them if there's a reason why it go like it needs to be go through the
ZBA. Well, they wouldn't know that because that's I mean I I'll ask him if they know, but I would think Evan would know. Evan will know that. Who would be the if there's a history behind it maybe or I don't know. All right. My guess would be it's because if there's a board
of health regulated activity that you want to also control where that regulated activity occurs. It'd be my guess. That's the principle that's behind it. All right. So, we'll put that on the next agenda. Okay. Um All right. Next item. We're
going to talk about managing growth and the strategic plan first and then we'll go back to the state planning grant. Um so the the report the strategic plan uh report came out uh it's linked um in the
agenda and the next step is to set up an implementation committee. Um I am going to be meeting with Evan, Aaron, and uh Paul to talk through a
little bit about um what the expectation is, get a little bit more detail on the strategic plan and the managed growth strategy. Um, some of the questions I have around that is specifically around the terms managed growth because to me
managed growth means controlled and limited growth, not encouraging growth. And I want to make sure that we're all talking the same language. And I think you'll find you're not I think so too. uh and that's why I want to be clear
about what we are going to be that was an interesting piece of the conversation that took place with the strategic plan committee uh and there were clearly a number of views on how extensive or how limited
growth ought to be and there seems to be about a 50-50 split and I've said it before in this this meeting and I'll say it again zoning and planning boards are not designed to encourage growth and
encourage um expansion. We are designed to limit control and set the minimum standards. Where it goes beyond that is up to other
entities and bodies. um that can be in the in the form of tax advantages in programs run by the uh municipality uh to encourage companies and and growth to come in. Um but zoning as we've seen in
some of these overlays by itself does not encourage growth necessarily. So no, I think it can it can help. Yeah, it can to be able to help. We can remove roadblocks, but in encouraging growth
and enhancing growth, I don't think Well, if I if I read what I saw from some of the other committees, it's a hot potato and they're trying to throw it at us. I know. That's why I'm meeting with Aaron and wear your asbestous gloves.
Um, so we'll meet with with them um in the next few weeks. Uh, I think Paul's going to try and set up some time and then we'll come back to this board with uh some updates. In the meantime, I would encourage you to read the um
section uh I think it's R6 um where it talks about the managed growth strategy um and some of the areas in there. Yeah, I think you'll find there's not actually a lot of strategy in it. Nope. Uh again, punt us having
been part of the conversation, the idea was let's get the planning board to do it. Over there because we don't want to. So, well, you know, you were the some of that. Yeah. And so that brings me to the state planning grant. Um Evan was about
to hit the trigger and submit um for that grant uh for us to be able to get some assistance to hire a consultant for reviewing and updating the use tables and zoning map. But as he was thinking about it in relation to this um strategic plan, we're wondering if it
might make sense to incorporate that into this grant. Um because if we do get the strategic plan coming towards us and need to do some type of uh strategic planning that should probably be done first before we take a look at the
zoning tables and uh things like that. So good point. We weren't sure if we would replace the work that we would do with the tables and zoning with the strategic plan for this consultant
or that we would essentially add it to and kind of do a a step-wise strategic plan first and then look at the uh zoning and tables. Um but I think what we do with that will
come out of the discussions um in the next few weeks with uh the select board. So what is it what is it we're looking to accomplish uh on like when you say strategic plan what are we actually talking about?
That's what I'm trying to figure out because if you look at the strategic plan which I will bring up now find that section page 14. I mean, there's a lot of there's a lot of kind of managed,
controlled words in there. Yeah. In our goal, intentional, harmonized, balanced. But here's the whole thing. There's not a lot of ex like open space for us to grow. It's like we're going to like this town's going to change. It's really redevelopment. Yeah. We're in red. We're
not in a grow. Like there's no room for people to We don't have land for people to grow. We either need to redevelop or grow up and we don't really necessarily what page is want to grow up. Page 14. That
is 14. Okay. I'm on 14. I mean the the original thinking that at least I thought the at least in my mind the origin of applying for the grant was that we were um there were views
expressed that the board um was basically acting in a very protective um not wanting to grant things and not in a way that was conducive for um businesses to come into town. So basically it was being laid at our feet that that we
weren't, you know, aware of market conditions and we weren't aware of what we could do that could actually make things better and we're just making them worse. And so the whole idea was okay uh you know if you don't think that we know what we're doing then why don't we get
somebody to help us to know what to do and in particular to identify what is it that we think zoning wise is going to help and that in part that has to rely upon some idea as to what the projection of the market needs are going to be with
regards to land use and that's where you know we were seeking to get a consultant. So that's that's was really the driving force behind our getting the grant. Um to me it seems like that serves this purpose. It seems like it serves the other purpose. Yeah. I think it's I I think the grant is generic and
or general enough. General is the right word that we should probably go forward with it because I hate to leave money on the table. I think we're good. I think the main thing is that we weren't intending that with a with the consultant that we were going to sit down on day two and pull out the zoning
and start saying, "Okay, what should the zoning be?" It was for there to be researchers there for people to come and talk to us about so that we had some sense of what the needs are, what made sense for us to do and then to start to think about what would the zoning be to
correspond with that. So yeah, 100% accurate and with this new information, I think we need to get some clarity on what is being put at our feet with the strategic plan before we go there
because that what the scope of this may influence that. Okay. And yeah, you're 100% accurate of what we're looking but I I don't know. I mean, I don't necessarily think because like I'm reaching out to my network, right? because I know
um you know realtors and in you know in the greater Boston area that you know work with businesses. I'm still reaching out and trying to like I think the grant was for us to educate ourselves on the market conditions and I still think that's independent of the strategic
plan. Like we can still educate ourselves and find out what the needs are. I I' I'd love to have somebody just come in and give us a market outlook six or eight hours more than the market outlook. This is what the market is. This is how it goes together. This is what the pieces are that play in the
market and this is how you judge it. But I think if we can clarify this, that will help us get some perspective on what we're trying to accomplish from that market report. Are we looking to just learn about the market and
then figure out how we can respond to it or are we looking to use that data to figure out how to enhance growth or restrict growth or manage growth? Um so I think trying to figure out what guide
it I think we need to figure this out first before we um go to the grant. And I want to figure this out quickly because the grant deadline, I don't want to lose the grant. Yeah. Um, so the we we will submit something for the grant.
Yeah. But the more clarity we can get on this, the better our grant chances are going to be. Main thing I don't I don't want to do is I don't want to lose our focus on what we're trying to do is understand what are the market needs. not not just what is the market, but
where do we think the market's going to be such that we can position our zoning to be effective. Yep. In that whatever else comes out of that as far as well that looks like managed growth and great whatever. But I think that we need to keep our focus on that because that's
really what we need. Yep. I agree. Yeah. As far as managing growth, I think a one huge thing that's just unique to Chumpsford is the the lack of sewer capacity. I mean, that's and we only have so many alternatives
there. And I know DPW is doing a study uh to see if it makes sense. So, what you know, what are the costs? Is it possible? And it will probably be 10 12 years down the road before if if we are able to connect up to MWR. We are but
residents have to have a say in that because guaranteed they're going to be paying a lot more for their sewer and that is the key that's going to unlock a whole lot of whatever controls you know not we're doing as planning board members but whatever controls or limits
that the sewer capacity is putting on when you unlock that that is now the key to unlock is much a lot of development and holding ll back too because is ll at sewer capacity is that their problem why we're not seeing they are I
mean they're they're they're working on they they have they get millions of dollars from the federal government because they have an antiquated system where their storm water mixes in with the sewer. It's not a closed system. So they're trying to work in neighborhoods to separate that storm water out that in
theory should decrease the flow to Duck Island. But still I mean this whole area greater LOL is grown so they're all there that plant is at capacity. That's my understanding. Yeah. Yeah. We have a dual tax rate. Not wildly dual, but we
have a dual tax rate. Is there any legal reason why we can't have a dual sewer rate? Well, we have we have a tiered sewer rate right now. Okay. We do have tiered sewer rate that was just implemented about roughly a year or two ago. Okay. So, you guys are way ahead of me.
Yeah. But that's my other concern about this is that no matter what our strategy is, um, if it's enhancing growth or encouraging growth, there are other limitations to growth that it won't matter what our strategy is. If those
aren't taken care of first, right? And I think John makes a good point. And if they are taken care of first, then it potentially unlocks an opportunity for quite significant growth that might be
more than we envision managing. Yep. All right. Anything else on the state planning grant or strategic plan at the moment? So, are we're going to tell is Evan writing this? Evan's
writing the grant. um he and I are aligned that we wouldn't miss the deadline, right? That we're going to try and get some clarity on the strategy first. If we can, um we may incorporate some of that into the the grant writing.
Um but if not, then we'll just continue and then adjust things as we need to. Yeah. So, we really have to have that set what we want by the next meeting because that Yep. due date the 5th. Yep. [Music]
So I mean the the first objective envisions guiding principles and core values for each component. All right. Anything else? All right. Climate resilience and sustainability design guidelines.
Um this is a task force that is being um brought about by the town uh to look at but there's a grant associated to this. There's a grant associated with this one too.
Um I don't know a whole lot about this um but it essentially is looking at how can we address as a town um climate resilience and sustainability um in a lot of the designs low impact
development uh things like that. So they're looking granted this grant or we're looking for it so far? Sounds like we're looking for it. Okay. Yeah, they're looking for it, but it's something that has been on it's part of what the town has been trying to do for
a while. Um, a lot of different groups are trying to, uh, move this forward. Um, so the town's bringing together conservation, uh, planning board, um, I can never remember the CAS acronym. Oh, clean
energy and sustainability. Thank you. That's a mouthful. uh DPW and then it'll include uh David Coons from conservation and Evan as well. Um they did conservation yesterday appointed Peter um as the member.
They're only doing one conservation member. Um we would like two conservation members and two planning board members on this task force. Um but take what we can get. So, we are looking for volunteers uh to
be part of this task force. I don't know how long it'll go for. I don't know the frequency of meetings. Um once we get the names, then uh David and Evan will start gathering um
communications and get people together. Mike. Yeah. So, it looks like they're going to have monthly meetings. If if nothing else, Peter's entertaining. I mean, month I I could do if it's a monthly meeting, which is what it says under Yeah. task
three. Um I could probably manage a monthly meeting. Okay. Mike and Dearra, would anyone else like to volunteer and then we can Yeah, someone else wants to volunteer. I'm interested too, but it depends on when
they have it if I can be [Music] involved. I'm guessing it would probably be in the evenings, but I'm not 100% sure because I know Peter does work.
Um, so Dearra and Mike, are there any other folks who would want it? Okay. Um, do two of you want to take the lead and then one as an alternative? I can be the alternate. I definitely
want to get involved with that. Okay. like and then Sera, you can be the alternate if one of them can't do it. Yeah. Okay. And that's nothing to keep all three of us from going to the meeting. Right. Exactly. All right. Cool. Any objections to those
three? All right. Sounds good. All right. Lazison updates. I had one. We had a meeting just before this meeting of the main preservation committee. We have three grant proposals
that were brought before us um from Concom andor the town. Um the most significant of them is to do a survey of Warren Po's um property and that is like 45,000 I think.
Um and that will come to town meeting at the June 29th town meeting. Um because of the dollar amount. Um and it in order to be in compliance with the community preservation law, I
think the one of the one of the things is that there has to be a um baseline survey um and that has to be approved by the restriction holder. Um, and then also I mean it and and the
and the town and the [Music] um anyway so that's um that I guess it's only 336. Sorry I overstated the amount. Um and then there's two very much smaller amounts that won't go to town
meeting. They just got approved by the CPC. And one is to um take um get invasives um out of
um Warren Poe and that was for I don't know 4500 I think. Yeah, 4500 and that's a project of the conservation commission. And then the other one is for $1,200 um to do a meadow management study
because the way in which Warren Poe is beneficial ecologically is if it's a meadow that's appropriately maintained. So they're going to have a a group a consulting group come in and advise on how to Yeah, there's some interesting issues be a meadow in that meadow. It's
not it's not quite as simple as mow it. Yep. All right. Anyone else? Todd, I have a NIMCOG or a Northern Middle Sex Council of Governments meeting next Wednesday, the 21st, and I have a Zoom meeting uh tomorrow with the NIMCOG director just
to go over some materials for that meeting. So, I'll have at our next planning board meeting, I'll have more of a report on NIMCOG. I didn't go to the ZBA meeting, but I did watch it the other day. Um there was a request for a special
permit for 32 B Rick Road for um it's a non-conforming structure. They needed some relief. Um it meets all the setbacks, but they wanted to add an addition. I believe that's going from a single family now to a two family because it's in RC. Um and then the
other interesting one was Crosby Village LLC. This is the one, the 40B proposal on 39 North Road and three Crosby Lane. Um the town Well, it was denied um based off of the town evoked safe harbor.
Um Oh, finally. We're there. We're there. Yeah. Uh, obviously they're going to they have the right to appeal our calculation and they're going to go through that process to appeal it, but
I think some of it's from the UMass property, right, that we that put us over. Yep. Yes. They're actually going to have people in that build in the one of the buildings by Memorial Day, I heard. Yeah. And I think I heard that we've got a bunch of new units coming
online soon that will also put us even further up. Yeah. So good. Board of Health. Um I was tasked to ask about the gap analysis, the AC for protection gap
analysis. So I did ask and uh they said that the consultant is putting together more questions based on the feedback that he got from the questions that he first put out. Uh he'll also be looking at other towns, what kinds of regulations, bylaws they have. Uh so
he's still doing initial research. Then he'll want to meet with groups. Uh and Donna said that he has basically a year on this project. I don't know exactly when he started, but Donna said that she will check and get back uh on what the time frame is for for this whole
process. So, as soon as I I know that, I'll I'll relay that. And then also on Hilddrth, um there's been no progress that they're aware of on the 21E and they can't progress until they've resolved that and it goes to D. Now, I'm
sorry, can you say that again? Yeah, the basically Hildrth the owner has to do a 21E and as far as they're aware there's been no progress on that and that has to be resolved. That 21E has to be resolved uh in order for them to be able to
progress with the development or with their appeal. Uh I would imagine that they could appeal independently but but as far as the you know progressing with their development they would need to have that as far as the the process with
the board of health in order to progress with the that process they need to resolve this 21E and it is going to the 21E is going to the D as well for review. Going to where as well to D. Oh, is there a timeline in which they are
required to proceed with the 21E? Um, I think they had a year to I think they have a year. Yeah. And how far are we into that? Um, 6 months. I was going to say actually, yeah, I think they have to have it done either by October, November. The 21E has to be done and that's the
current owner, right? Yes. Yes. Okay. That's the current That's not the um property possible, right? It's not the applicant. Okay. The owner. Okay. Anyone else? Le conservation meeting was last night.
Um it was quite interesting. Uh one really long meeting. Uh public input um was plentiful on the costou termination. Um they had three regulatory hearings. Uh one of which included the notice of intent for Old
Westward Road. Um part of the house was in the buffer zone. So they're going to based on um the peer review of the wetlands delineation, the wetlands delineation moved. So the house needs to
move which means the property lines have to move which means they're going to be coming back to us for an ANR at some point. Um this is that little piece of land the piece for the cow and the horse. Yeah. So interesting. They will be back at some point um with adjusted
lot lines for that. They're also uh talking with the board the the conservation commission about uh flood plane and going through some uh discussion related to that.
Um, as I mentioned, Peter is the um conservation representative for the climate resilience discussion and they're progressing pretty well with the wetland and bylaw review um that they're doing. They've
identified a few areas that they want to improve. They'll be drafting um some areas and then going before their full commission. they're leaning towards updating things with regulations instead of bylaws whenever they can um to keep
the overhead pretty low. And then they also did a really good presentation on their updated land management model and how they're going to be providing management for each of their sites. Um they listed who's going
to be the primary commission member in charge of the site. um stewards for the site in terms of trail maintenance and cleanup and things like that. And then they're going to be posting that on their website. Uh so they're doing a lot of updating on their website with the
new town site. Um so danger of of relying too much on your regulations is it doesn't carry the same weight as pilots. Yeah, they so I think they did mention that as a balancing act. So, yeah. So, they're
going to be more susceptible to appeal. Did it seem like um a positive like a reset of the contention between um depends on who you ask. Um yeah, I
think from the conservation commission perspective, it's a definite reset. Um from other perspectives it is not um because they're still doing actions there like all the time at least it
how their open space properties are being managed. Yeah. I mean, it's the fundamental problem is how do you get enough volunteers to do what you need to get done? And it's, as I've always said, volunteers get paid like anybody
else. They just get paid in a different uh medium. So, but they've got a really good plan that they've outlined uh for each of the properties. So, it's it's um I don't know if it's posted yet, but it will be
soon. Um they're also looking to um put in contact people for each of the sites. So if something's going wrong with the site, they'll have someone to to communicate with. I think it makes sense that it's driven from
that they're driving it. Um well, they have to in in most of these cases, they're they're conservation restrictions. legally binding and they have to abide by them. So, yeah. And they do
have I mean they do have their their volunteers. I mean Yep. They do have a good Yep. outside of outside of cost. Yeah. They've always had that. So, it just makes sense that any other uh
updates, any new business? All right. Meeting minutes. Has everyone reviewed the meeting minutes? We finally got the February 26 one. All right.
Can we do them all together? Uh, I don't think so because some people weren't here for them. All right. Well, I'll You want to start with motions? Let me pull up just so we know who is here for each one. I'm pretty sure I was here for all of
them. Yep. So for this one, uh this is 226. Yes. February 26th, everyone except for Sertha can vote. So I will take a motion. I will move that we approve the minutes of
February 26, 2025. I second. Mike made the motion and need a second. All in favor say I. I. All opposed. Unanimous approval. All right. Next one. The March
12th. Uh for this one, everyone same people voting. I move that we approve the minutes of March 12th, 2025. I second. Motion from Mike, second by Anita. All in favor say I. I. All
opposed. Nope. And the minutes are unanimously approved for March 12th. For the record, we the for the Mar we could have done all of them together. Same people. I'm just pointing
that I hadn't checked yet. Just we had to review the attendance to know that though. I just wanted to make sure because there were some that people weren't here. Day eight late dollar short. It's always safe to do them. So, all right. I will take a motion for
approving meeting minutes of March 26th. I guess I'm going to move that too. On a roll. I'll second. Motion by Mike, second by Anita. All in favor say I. I. Unanimous approval of those minutes, too. And next meeting
date is May 28th. Um, I may need to make that start date a little bit later. It depends on how much we have on the agenda of that that meeting. So, it'll be 7 7:30. Um, but
I'll talk to Evan beforehand and find out. I will take a motion to adjurnn. Make a motion to adjurnn. Second. Everybody wants Motion by Dear Deardra, second by Anid. All in favor say I. I.
I. Thank you everyone.