##VIDEO ID:7Y-TlhBc63E## okay all right we're going to call the order the um Cranberry Township committee meeting for the 2025 budget if you're able to please stand for the Pledge of Allegiance flag of the United States of America and to the rep stands Nation God indivisible with liy and Justice all we'll go to the open public meetings act pursuing to the open public meetings act notice that this meeting was sent to the cranberry press Trend times and home News Tribune on January 17th 2025 post on Township website and said to those requested copy of this notice move on to roll call Mr Christopher here Mrs H here Dr Rogers here Mr Scott is absent at this time and mayor kir here thank you start off with police sorry we're gonna start off with police Capital like we normally do because they have most of the items in our Capital if you go to the police tab you can follow along with um Lieutenant soon to be Chief chair yes they stay red okay good good evening everyone um I'm just going to go line by line um if you need some clarification um please uh stop me um for the 2025 uh budget year first line item are uh marked um uh police vehicles and the next uh one two three line items are um some of the upfitting equipment that's required for those vehicles um I don't want to say they self exp latory but um I know we have a new committee um every year we try to get at least two cars because if we try to play catchup it's impossible um and as it stands um we're behind not because of this committee's um um commitment to it but because of the inventory and the amount of availability of vehicles uh quite simply put we were supposed to have uh last year's order by um September and they're just coming into service now so we're always behind ail um but again the these are for uh marked uh police vehicles four-wheel drive we're not changing U much of anything um when it comes to the marked units good question yes um with regards to like when you purchase a vehicle and you receive it and you start using it how long do you keep it for in Patrol rotation we try to do a minimum of five years equivalent to about 100,000 miles um and then we still don't get rid of the car then we do it for supplemental um use for Road jobs extra Duty uh which we would then build an administrative fee accordingly to the contractors Etc to get the life so honestly it varies some cars we can get 10 years some cars we can only get five or six depending how they're used and obviously accidents play a part into that and you know we do nothing but drive all the time so and you can use those for uh Shadow cars right like the Dem like you had on Station Road we could as a deter absolutely we could yes 100% we have done that on Station Road yeah yeah absolutely we're we're on the vehicles yeah um yeah okay um so the environmental commission uh has a you know as a grant um in community energy like our whole cranberry energy use and um one of the things is was a webinar yesterday that they attended and and um you know how I've always spoken up every year about the envir you know EV can we do it you know of course we would need the infastructure but I think um what seems to be kind of um more relevant to a smaller town might be a hybrids and I don't know have you had a chance to look into that because this webinar says they come fully equipped and um they you know obviously they don't use gas when they're sitting there it's not an EV hybrid it's you know the H gas hybrid and um and um like a plugin it's not a plugin I'm not talking about that so um you know have you looked into that we have our current our current Fleet and vendor is Chevrolet um currently Chevrolet absolutely does not have it where they want it to be upfitted for a police pursuit uh vehicle um Barbara you and I have been doing this this is my 10th uh meeting in front of council and I will tell you that I've heard you Chief Owens has uh entrusted the faith in me to go ahead and do it and I am happy to report that um the two vehicles that we are just putting into service this year went from an 8 cylinder Tahoe to a four-cylinder they're the ammin cars they are the detective eventually detective Bureau cars their cars like I I hear you and we're trying we don't have the infrastructure um we don't have the state contract that says we can go ahead and do it and unfortunately right now Chevy is having a problem with EV vehicles um the crossover ones so um like even the ones that I'm talking about and I don't know if you saw it um it's uh not a Tahoe it's a Traverse a little bit smaller it'll suit the needs for what we need it for detective beer Etc they don't even make parts to put a cage in it to have people you know to have prisoners in the back so it's something we can't even entertain right now um we could look into what you're talking about and I watched the slides that you sent it's all Ford um and we're just not we're not on fors page right now um and to to your point that's valuable information but they're doing the city of New York they're not doing the the tow trip of cranberry which is this big they're outfitting 900 plus cars um and it's something that I I assure you as long as I'm here and in this position I take seriously and we will continue to look at it and any way we can try to lower that emission fuel everything we're gonna try to do it um I hear you but I'm Gonna Keep harping on it um yeah that's your job right um you know because it's not only you know emissions it's also cost-saving at some point too you know so you're idling and it's also brake pads are you know you don't wear the brake pads because it's engine slowing um you know oil maintenance Etc um so you know it's it's maintenance too I I get it and and and that commitment in these two cars that I'm talking about um they have the Auto Stop feature where you're added a light the RPMs go from you know 12 1300 to zero okay so again it's just not conducive for patrol work right now it's not we have highways here uh we have roadways in Access of 50 miles an hour um and to um lessen the uh strength and the availability of what we need to do our job unless we're going to put us in Teslas and Ford Mustangs with 500 horsepower which isn't realistic it's they're just not ready yet they're ready for the cities traton started them um you know where they're congested and their blocks and their neighborhoods we are very rural here right and we're just you know we're not there yet we might be so anyway I don't remember the recall the man's name that was in that webinar but he is available just as you know like consult like free Consulting on it so if we could yeah they not only have to be on state contract they got to be on our purchasing as well in order for us to even entertain it yeah and I don't know that yeah because I we just I said I I made four calls before I came to this meeting just to get that answer and unfortunately it's late so they're not State contract I don't know I I I literally made four phone calls before I came here but no one's returning because you know they work normal hours not hour hours so I will follow back up and I'll relay the information to Denise and she can pass it all I appreciate no words yeah yeah because you know every town has to do their part for us listen I can tell you in the history of cranberry Police Department we've never had a four-cylinder vehicle oh okay ever it's always eight cylinders always the biggest and the fastest and and whatever so I I hear you and you've been at it for about a good three years now so just takes a little bit okay thank you all right so we're going to go on to the next line I know um which is traffic safety so um for Traffic Safety um unfortunately uh I did my due diligence and applied for a uh50 something thousand grant for new radar units the last time we purchased radar units was in I want to say 2002 they've hit their life expectancy we're just spending too much money to try try to hold them together um and that's the better part of 37 $38,000 um so our vehicles need new radar units uh to enforce speeding and the remaining um will go for if you see like on station row there's flashing signs we're going to get another four of those and strategically put them throughout the town There's a couple that are going up um hopefully within a couple weeks I spoke to Jerry today that'll be Plains ro road and cranberry Neck Road is that the only design that that's out there or is that the design no that's the only as far as I'm concerned being fiscally responsible the only affordable sign because I can get beautiful big and they're $111,000 a piece right exactly and I'll get you the quote I have it so it's just they're just you know they'll they'll they'll sell you whatever you want comes a time where you got to say like enough's enough like we will do it we will enforce that will wake people up because those signs they wake everybody up when you're not used to it you know what I mean and you see it and it flashes you know know I think they do you're talking about the big ones is that the ones that are on Station Road that flash the light around that ring you know and then we still have our big ones which we rotate um every April to November they're on on rotation every every week 10 days they move how about how about those little the little sign that has the the the mph on it h there's that little sign isn't it on Main on Main Street there's the little that's not little that's the ones I'm telling you we rotate that's a 24 by 36 no no I was the little one on the PO on theashes it's just a it's a big white that's a 24 by 30 oh it looks small oh no that's not small that's that's the one that I'm talking about as $111,000 and we could do them permanently where they have solar and they would recharge themselves I thought very very expensive oh I think the is great in response to last night's public comment um so I I uh okay that's where we're at um the next one is the flock uh camera system we touched on this last year um it's available now um this is just to uh Shore up our town um to where um we are piggybacking off of a lot of towns that um Monro Township has 20 of these camera systems they don't take per personal information they literally just Mark license um they have been um instrumental in burglary stfts um any any any way our detective Bureau can track a car we could track it on our border from Monroe and then we lose a car so this request is for uh four of those cameras and those four once we have them up and run in the county has committed to giving us another two do you know where they'll be located they'll be strategically located they'll come they they're going to do an index of our uh crimes of our areas in relation to where the other ones are around South brunsw doesn't have them yet but they assure me they're getting them um and then you know we initially can just follow a bad individual wherever they go town to town and then you know peace meal it and and put everything together that we need to do so that is a uh annual cost the first annual the first year is a little bit more expensive because there's an implementation but year two you can see where it drops down almost $3,000 um we don't own those cameras they are owned by flock we essentially rent them but we own the data and that data is stored on their cloud and their system for five years we could retrieve it anytime we want is this like the way of the like it seems like this seems like I up everywhere yep you don't even know they're there that's the nice part about it and if they get damaged something excuse me if they get damaged or something they just flock deal with that yeah the only thing is if it's like stolen then we have to worry about it we'll have to put it on insurance but as far as like a crash a car accident they will come and they will they will do it all if it if it get stolen I hope they see the guy yeah yeah our luck will be a stolen tag and then we won't be able to do it again it does license plates so um uh again the next line item is standard cost of doing business it's a county radio system I apologize for the typo it's actually year seven and I have year six in the body of of it um this is no we have year seven no no you do but here in the body it's your it's your six I call my own mistake so don't worry I call my I call my own mistake it's it's your seven 100% um uh again uh this is something that um and I know there's new committee members here but this was done six years ago and we're just continuing with it uh the next line item is uh Firearms again we started this we we do this for a 5year cycle and then we replaced all our Firearms this started in 2024 and this is the amount that was a lot of each year until we hit that five years and then we go ahead and replace all our all of our Firearms um and I don't want to say the last item the next line item is buildings and grounds um Ever Changing um it's the continuing uh cost of doing business to just get our uh um infrastructure up and running um electricity poles I mean the the the long-term items that we need to set up uh monitors uh we literally just had um we have ke fob to Wanda everywhere they went could do like literally the whole system had to be replaced and it was $10,000 like that so you know it's unfortunately the equipment there is not lavish it's not it's $122,000 and that's uh a lot of it thankfully capital is allowed to be rolled over so if we don't use it we save it and we have it for the next year do I'm just curious about energy usage in the um do you have like uh they flick on and off when you leave the we we do for I would say about a a quarter of the department almost a third um I I did last year change half of all the bulbs to the high efficiency one and the remaining um hopefully once this passes will be done this year the remaining of the PD will all be um I don't know what they call it bar but you probably do but the high high efficiency uh bulbs probably probably someone's going to come in and talk to you about all that at some point so that we you will or somebody uh from the EC environmental Comm yeah I mean I no not me yeah no I I I listen I will't make myself available I know you will quick quick one sorry on the um Firearms after five years do they come to the old ones got got a service they do they get they get sold back to the manufacturer manufacturer we do not keep them we are not like the state police the only state agencies take them and will literally melt them um if I was to do that our weapons are probably in excess of $100,000 they actually give us a very good price for them that's how I'm able to offset it with the amount of money I'm asking and then we buy the new ones with it perfect thank you you're welcome good question um the next line item is our it uh infrastructure computers um servers you know unfortunately everybody knows about computers you buy a laptop today six months from that it's no good right so um this is just I ask our it uh individual that's in charge of the Township's account and the police departments tell me what we're going to need this year because it's above my pay grade I don't know um and there's no exaggerating there's a couple computers set aside we need to change this server we need to change that um and that's the price that it came up with you do some um some of your training on your computers too like or like you know do we do training on our computers yeah yeah that's about 90% of our training like you don't to go somewhere and train well we do for the ones that are specialized but um since uh postco we do the better part of our training is online and we're actually going to be going to a training platform which will be online zoom and whatever because I know you have a lot of training throughout you constantly training it doesn't stop right right does this include cyber security excuse me does this include cyber security it does include cyber security um the next line item is our um uh axon I apologize it's uh it's it's phase two of of I apologize this is the one that was um okay this was previously approved last year it's the continuation of it it's a 10-year contract the figures in there I have to put it every year um so that you can see what it is it still is a capital item um but it's for our body cameras and our incar cameras I'll be more than happy to answer any questions for that but the next line item is phase two it's again um 9 years to coincide with the one year that we didn't do last year this will take care of our interview and interrogation rooms um as well as uh make up one vehicle that we're that we're missing for the camera system that way everything will expire at that 10year Mark and then we can do the whole package together great I try to be as thorough as I can I apologize for that one mistake but if you have any questions I will be more than happy to answer how dare you yeah it's all good it's all good um before you leave there's only one other thing that we discussed with the Personnel subcommittee um and that's the amount of officers that we have and so in the operating budget we have included two additional officers and so before you leave in case there's questions I just want um two additional officers to add to so that there can be um four on a shift correct four on a shift so our our minimum number and and I'm going to get to your question would be uh 23 um it would be four officers on a shift as opposed to right now daytime there's two guys two off I apologize two officers working um sometimes Friday Saturday and Sunday just on town because we just don't have the uh officers we need um if we're a approved for those two we will um commit to uh four officers on a squad there are four squads that's 16 Patrol officers um there are two traffic already and there are two detective Bureau um and that minimum number that we had discussed with the personel subcommittee would bring our Police Department to 23 officers I will tell you that we have been at um for 26 years of my career we the majority we we did get up at one point prior to Chief Varga leaving at 21 but through attrition we fell back down to 19 but the majority of our department with 17 officers and we just we're having trouble staying a float3 we're not at we're not at 21 we're at once Chief Owens leaves we're at 19 right we were approved for the 21 which we're going to be soon and what I'm asking for is the additional two to get us to 23 correct correct I just wanted to add that this is also uh in light of the fact that our population will be growing um already is growing right so we have uh aside from the affordable housing we do have residents still coming into the um the the property over what's it called on Old no well Old Trenton is another property but the the Toll Brothers property now what is that a third occupied we still have more to go 276 total yeah right so uh this is an anticipation of things to come this is a proactive approach rather rather than a reactive approach and so a lot of there was a hefty healthy discussion on this and with sort of real guidance from you we came up with that decision so I mean I he's here Lieutenant is here if you have any questions so this is for this year you hiring correct because it goes to the personel sub committee and then we bring it up at budget time you know you've been on the personnel subcommittee Barbara wants to be back on the personal self committing I can tell you that we're offsetting over time so overtime has been decreased slightly because there should be less overtime hopefully now of course if officers go out on workers comp or disability we're going to be back down from the 23 but that is the what we're looking to ABS absolutely and and I did make a commitment to this uh to the personel subcommittee that if we do have any known long-term injury I do have an officer out on disability right now I will I will plug that to the best of our ability with no overtime meaning I will move a traffic officer if I have to I will move someone in order to stop that bleeding if I know it's going to be a month or two um but this is uh unfortunately the cost of doing business we cannot operate in this Township with two officers on the road this town is too big we're getting too busy um and our numbers are through the roof we had excess of nearly 28,000 calls for service last year it's unheard of for a 19 man department and it's not 19 because the chief's not answering calls uh the administrative Lieutenant's not answering calls the operation Lieutenant unless it's the end of the world is not answering calls and I have detectives that have to detect um and they're not answering calls and the bulk of the the work is falling on when I was on the road for 16 years of my career um you know call to call to call and it just doesn't stop the way I described it when we were having our discussion was it always seems like the floor is always moving underneath you the best analogy because there's so much that's unpredictable when you're talking about injuries or comp or any of those things you you can't be predictive of that you just know that one of those things is inevitably going to happen and you you're trying to put a net under the organization and as Aman said be proactive with a population that's going to be increasing yeah and we have our struggles with hiring too so we we can give the the blessing and we don't know what the future is going to hold and as far as how I'm going to start being a chief I'm going to be as chair transparent as I can I was on the phone with Denise earlier she doesn't even know this I got a phone call and you know the individual we swore in um you know Aaron love love the God he quit I had a feeling what oh he called me I thought the director who's a personal friend of mine was fooling around with me and he said he's like um Chief I go I'm not Chief yet so again I thought he was fooling around and he said um your your officer's here he would like to talk to you and I said okay again you're stupid me I'm think we're playing a game here and um I answered the phone and and individual there and I said hello and he said hello chief and I said um who is this because I didn't recognize his voice he said it's Aaron and he was crying and I get it listen this job's not for everybody right and you know we're going to do our best we're going to do our best to put the most qualified we went through two process to get to this kid you know and and and I don't care I don't look at race I don't I look at the best candidate we can get and this kid beat an officer that is certified in my opinion and that's why he got the first nod um and not to say the other one's not worthy but just not yet so in that breath you know you know I I I can't convince him to stay he said I'm overwhelmed they took my phone I'm lost and I get it it's a culture and perhaps maybe this falls on us but we're not allowed to discriminate because of age right he has the age he's 22 probably the youngest we would have hired but he just presented like no like like he made me look like I was nobody back in the day do you know what I mean and I just hadic training right you don't know what's GNA yeah and that's what he said he said I I had no I go you didn't Google it they took your phone they yelled at you they yelled at me for 10 hours yeah well you got about four weeks of that because whatever they do to you in there it's nothing what maybe will happen on the road right and I don't want to hide anything that is my goete I will always go to the nie first and the Personnel subcommittee but I'm as transparent as I can we're going to try to plug that hole um but it's going to be another process than you for Shar yeah microphone it's an immense loss I can't I can't even and I know how much energy you put into that oh my go um so it would be instead of two on the road you're going to have four on the road is that what you're trying to aim for or or is it like a shift oh yes four correct four total and in order to do that I just need two more officers I know I just lost him so I'm gonna say three but this one was they were already approved so I just need two additional officers and that's already in our Bud we budged for it yes okay if it's approved we can get there we're going to open up the academy um I I am fortunately it's probably about7 $8,000 just to send a recruit to the academy I am personal friends he he did me a favor this time I'm out four pair of pants and three shirts so the next one going will cost us nothing other than perhaps a uniform and I'm gonna try to use those even put them on so I'm gonna try to use those uniforms well I might you never know no we don't profile but I'm just saying like if we have to replace four un you know what I mean we know you do the best you can I'm going to and and my commitments to this town for as long as I'm here it's it's unfortunate because no one in this room is more disappointed than I am have no idea so back to the the request for the two so a I was gonna ask the overtime question and I think that is answered in to some extent I would imagine we would save overtime just by the sheer nature of having two more guys not two more officers I should say um additionally is there any like any potential breakage like as we as older we talk about breakage in education all the time right older more tenur teachers or officers leave they get replaced with well less costly we're always here right that's the greatest analogy and I've used it in in meetings and the grounds always moving right so we really can't because if you allow to do it sure I'll hire 50 guys you don't know what that is so what I want from the commitment if it's approved to say okay our number is 23 somebody puts their papers in give me the green light let me start the process because I'm G to start it in a couple weeks because it was already approved I'm not saying for the new ones I'm going to start it and if you say yes then it'll be for three as opposed to the one I'll start in a couple weeks from the time I started to the time it's done you're talking four or five months now if I have to send them the academy it's six months now when they come back it's three months before they're allowed on the road by themselves so we're talking we're talking a year you don't recognize the benefits of the the recruitment you it's unbelievable yeah and and and to Denise's Point like you know budget you just can't just say okay go ahead go higher and them when they leave they leave I understand that but we are in such a disadvantage in that regard because you're trying to get an officer for life here right you try to do the best you could do and you just don't know you don't you don't know and unfortunately I I'm beyond disappointed so and Denise just to double confirm that's in this budget already correct 100% yeah that's what I was curious thank you okay good on that young man to make the decision quickly though yeah and and listen I called I I called his mother and you know I was worried about his wellbeing Chief Owen said is it all right if I call him I'm like you're asking me you're still the chief so he's like well I have his number so I gave it to him he did call the check on him and you know we don't want bad things to happen and to him or I get it's not for everybody and and I did tell him that you know that he's like well can I just come tomorrow no the car has got to come today I need a letter today because tomorrow morning I'll move for termination and if I do that you can never be a police officer in New Jersey again that's the law when you don't fulfill and I don't want to do that because he's such a good kid so long story short I have the letter um was written in the academy and it's it's done you know it's unfortunate there's no coming back but it's not my job to talk him off the ledge my son was in the State Police Academy I would not talk him off the ledge I'm not there to say it's going to be okay it is what it is right that those streets whether they're cranberry or Trent and they're the same streets same people that drive through so it's not Doom and Gloom but the academy set there there to say it's really bad but out there could be way worse so yeah thank you we're good all right excellent if you need me I'm not here have a great night everyone yeah absolutely I live here take care okay so moving on the agenda um the next two I three items actually are in the budget they are the annual contribution for fire and first aid as well as loap I put them in the budget because I do know what do not know what is going to happen with the fire district right so if the fire district happens this year we won't pay it out um if the fire district doesn't happen we will pay it out we always give the maximum to the fire and the first aid and the maximum for losap which is State driven it's a number that's given to us so just so you know that what we're we're going to be doing it's not in capital Barber it's in operating um so I just wanted to let you know why that those are in there okay so we can we can keep going with capital go ahead they're in the operating budget under police Yep they're in the operating budget under police under salaries okay um okay so let's move on to the rest of the capital and go through those all right so starting with your spreadsheet in the front of the capital book we're only going to focus on 2025 because the rest of it is just placeholders it's a plan that goes in the budget document it may happen or may not happen in those years we revisit it every year So the plan doesn't um cause us any you know problems we just put it in there and then um the only way that the money gets spent is when we do an ordinance and that only focuses on what's agreed to for 2025 okay so the first line item is the first two line items involve Town Hall one is for furniture one is for security I can tell you that we don't spend much money on Town Hall ever are you sure everyone just spin their chair around at a 360 in all the years that I've been here so I think the the the building was redone 26 years ago is that the newest thing in the building um yeah it was because my daughter I remember I just had her and we were out of this building while they were renovating it she'll be 26 so that is the last time that really major things were done here except for we did have the building painted and new carpeting put in I don't know maybe about eight years ago so that is the only thing we have done and it's starting to see some wear and tear we need to update some things um so I went out and got quotes um from WB Mason who is under State contract as well as the vendor that the school used for the renovations they're doing over there um and the guy came in with you know government prices for us and to redo the furniture will be about $60,000 that includes file cabinets chairs desks all of that for the building um I don't even know if we can get it all done in one year it's a big undertaking but again Capital roles so I'm not too worried about that what will we do with the old items so now the old items we I've talked to the vendor about it and once we're AO I will take pictures of all the old items and send it to him he has someone that may come and pick them up for free and do what they're going to do with them otherwise I'm going to have to pay someone to take them because there's nowhere for Public Works to to take all this old furniture um and put somewhere so those are the two options for the old furniture we don't have an ability to donate um again maybe if somebody wants it and they have a truck and enough people to come and take it I'm fine with donating it but when I spoke to the vendor he said typically either this vendor comes and we'll pick it up for free and take it and then either resells it or refurbishes it or does whatever he does with it and if it's too old and he's like no don't want that then we have to pay someone to remove it and dispose of it does the furniture include the chairs we're sitting on um no it doesn't include these chair these chairs are new actually we had we had hard we had those we had hard wood chairs well then I'm grateful for this very soft cushiony seat so these These are and these were given to us free from the Police Department because they didn't they didn't use them enough they wable probably not he said because because of their um guns side it got in the way and they couldn't them so so they gave them reuse repurpose question Denise what are we talking about actually I mean just the inner office spaces the desks nothing in here nothing in here carpeting anything structural no n couch out there no yeah no couch no room no room for couch yeah so just uh desk chairs file cabinets anyone who has a bookshelf that needs to be replaced any of the furniture in the offices okay yeah okay then Town Hall security um I put this in here and don't know if we're really going to use all of it um but we did have someone come over uh Lieutenant deer brought him over who helps them with the security over at the police department and obviously their security systems are like hundreds of thousands of dollars um but they did recommend cameras in the building um so that if something were to occur or we want to see who was roaming about we will be able to see that um it's not sophisticated it's really almost like a ring camera in a way um it'll upload on to my laptop so where you know wherever I am I will be able to if there's any problem see um and at least it deters people who know the cameras are there and it also allows us to see who is roaming around if we have a question about it um it it'll be an undertaking just because of the walls in here and he wasn't even sure he had to go back and kind of look at how are we going to do it um we had a hard time just getting you know a router um an internet connection because these walls are but there's so many Wireless options that are available right so he's gonna look into that he said they don't work as well and I'm like they'll work good enough for what we need because I don't think we're going to be able to like a grainy street view yeah they're not great but internally just monitoring inside at least so it'll be at the doors the front and the back door it'll be in the stairwells it won't be in offices but now we talked about the need of the front doors if we cannot get some something that is historically interesting it's still a municipal building and we have to look for a state vendor right and that could potentially fall under security in a way because you're looking for doors that I don't know closed yes yes right and are more secure yes so so as far as those front do who would decide whether or not the doors that are there today are safe enough like who would run a safety audit as we're talking about town hall security right would that be the police officers or the police department I should yeah I would work with the chief on it and they would help me determine I can tell you honestly they're probably not the best doors for security but I understand we're also not a police building or a school building and so if they would just shut and lock that would helpful but the back ones don't the back ones are warped the weather the winter and the summer they get messed up and if you don't slam them shut behind you the building is wide open all night and quite frankly it doesn't matter what that door looks like because it's not on a streetcape so it's not facing so there doesn't need to be a historical nature to that so of all doors that one could be replaced through this measure right because that seems like a very easy yeah replacement for sure yeah so so we'll I'll be working on that they don't it's our building they don't and so it's going to be up to you guys if you know well I've asked HPC to look into it they can find something that's more secure that's aesthetically pleasing to them if they can't then it's going to be not aesthetically pleasing if we need to replace them that's what's going to happen and I HPC thinks they can be replaced and refinished or repaired and refinished my God sure they can be refinished and then five years have to be refinished again but the PR is is the security of them change that can we donate it to that guy who accepts donations when he when he picks up the chairs hav them just take the doors with them yeah perfect does there need to be a fire safety component to the door no as long as you can get out of it and it doesn't it isn't locked from inside then you're fine yeah are we um looking into like a buzzer system I mean the doors will still be open to the buz no the doors will still be open I don't have the means for a buzzer system or anyone to answer the buzzer so sorry yeah so I was like in a fob system too and all that but that gets like and it's too and I I have to be honest with you there are people in and out of this building clock winders um Boy Scouts seniors Arts Council it's too difficult to do that doesn't work yeah it doesn't work yeah so but at least this would also give me new um keys because um everyone has a key to this building I'm not going to lie ask out on the street and somebody be like oh yeah I still have a key to town hall I found one right outside actually before I came in so I mean at least we would start AR fresh and know who has the keys because right now everyone has so yeah okay so moving on computers and Equipment um I didn't put anything in last year for it um but this year I spoke with it and I try unless I need something major not to you know um but we have to make sure we have some funds in there when computers crash as they get older and also our battery backup batter um battery backup in the basement continues to beep and he's like because it needs to be replaced and that's $2,500 Al loan so I put $10,000 in if I don't spend it I just roll to next year and as we need new computers um he did say our laptop my laptop which I'm fine with but he's like it's old and it's not going to be under warranty after this year if you're going to be getting video feed from security cameras you're going to want might so you know like there are those things which I don't get unless I need to but if I need to I need the money to be there to get them so your equipment needs to match the other things that you're doing right right so that's in here okay Denise this screen and the capability to connect to the screen does that fall under this category as well why do we need to do something else well I I I just bring up the whole conversation that I had with the planning board um with regards to can we start using it for presentations for SE and they can but they need right they need a longer cable the day well we need a longer cable to get it over there that's what we need you got the longest I thought Barbara this is the one back with me you I have a 25 foot one if You' like to use itug sneaky I'd like to have that conversation we never needed it before but something happen with the remote I thought you I thought one of you got the long well so then if we could that goes all the way down this is it though yeah that's what runs all the way but this is all the slack we have here oh for that that plug the we never we did never need that before I used to do my bud presentation from here plug in here I did not have to connect to there it worked right on the screen but I don't know what happened and nobody can fix it you saw what Mark did yesterday I can't I don't have he had a dongle he had a dongle and he had his little iPad and he connected very EAS stayed and then he was still able to do it from there confident that we can figure that out and it will not cost anywhere near $10,000 but that that that piece if we can maybe find you in that a little bit and maybe a um what do you call it one of those pointers an electric pointer really helpful I think he had one it didn't work but that was his personal that was his personal thing like I don't know if if that thing if you purchase that item specifically for the TV or is it specifically no it's for the computer I would think for my cat yeah yeah I remember what computer they have when they come the applicants but okay yeah I don't know why it didn't work on the screen okay all right thank um okay next one is senior center renovation so we had talked about this in the senior subcommittee um about making some changes maybe downstairs to the senior center while the seniors are out of it and over at the library understanding that we're still probably going to do a lot of the lunches and stuff over there because they enjoy it they like it and we want to grow it but to maybe make right and there's not enough room downstairs but to maybe make downstairs a room more for games like a senior recck room is kind of what we talked about and it would be really kind of cool because it's closed and so maybe at the time the parking lot opens we could complete this and it be like kind of an unveiling of a refreshed space so that would be like a multi-use room not not nearly the size of the library but like a wreck room literally you know painting it and getting games and doing that kind of stuff and we think we can do something worthwhile that would be well received for 10 grand the main thing they asked for was actually better lighting which is a very loow hanging fruit it seems like an absolute no-brainer which you could also do with paint like there's very inexpensive ways to refresh that that's right right an investment maybe in a TV so that if they wanted to do like some small exercise groups or a webinar or something like that then they could love the screen in the library you get to look at it on that because we don't have that downstairs television so yeah we've also invented fire in the wheel um since then so it should be I think for 10,000 it's a it's a nice in a space and if we need to do more next year then we'll right to Barbara there's also a um potential Grant through the quality Institute that I was looking at and maybe we can look at it together but they're specifically targeting senior centers and the upgrade of senior centers that sounds great but to to Rob's question is that enough I mean well we're gonna make it enough for this year that's what we agreed and we're going to start slow and see what happens the bones of that room are are correct are good I me yeah you can't do much yeah to the infrastructure of it we tried that nobody wanted to even paint it I love painting sign me up no it's like making your bed makes the whole room look well if we if we have that initiative right if you want to launch that as an initiative maybe this TC has you know a different set of connections lot good I mean I don't know we tried Ken tried and it was like you couldn't get anyone to help to do it and then of course you know the seniors can be a little particular so don't be skimping on things because if the scouts didn't paint it just so they're gonna notice so you know we have to also guide whoever's doing it and make sure it's getting access obious yeah oh yeah has to be yeah they only ping but just even lighting and a and a coat of paint will make space far more inviting yeah very true yeah but also we talked about not during election time we're not going to be doing anything we will not create any more stress for Debbie correct you they uh like we did talk about furniture compy furniture down not really [Laughter] furn I don't think F if you could get some Sweat Equity for people to like paint and we're not having the like use a professional painter and we take that money and then we repurpose it back in and figure it out also I again there's a lot of good stuff out there that people would donate and if it's in good condition acceptable condition we would look at taking it right actually when you're you're correct when the library uh was going through its sort of end end phase of construction um I think a couple of businesses or a business came in and said we'll donate X you we have some furniture so yeah those things can exist also I mean the school was saying and I don't know if they got rid of but they older stuff maybe better than what's down there I don't know and she's like take it because we're we're going to throw it out and I was like why don't are we gonna pay these chairs forward that were're S no these aren't that bad I know I mean I really appreciate this line item so thank you me too yeah really grateful for it awesome you really thank you um next is the only item that Parks and Recreation has asked for which is why this capital is going to go so very quick this year um Pavilion roof so we have an ordin into place already for $1,975 but it's approximately $330,000 to do what they want to do to it it's Cedar it's Cedar that's the issue Cedar for Cedar to keep the aesthetic so they are also though putting in for a grant so I'm not going to ordinance this money until we know whether we got the grant or not if we get the grant great if it's only partial okay we'll have to supplement more um but I have it on here so that I can if I need to um it'll go in the capital plan I recall that there was can't no was gonna ask on can you shoot I'm sure that um Jerry has looked at trying to refer like clean it right that was that was the it started with that discussion of cleaning it yes and that's why we're where we are we've been doing this for about five years yes exactly and then it was going to be cleaned and now it's not going to Bean cleaned and now they need to replace it so it could not be cleaned and okay correct wow how did those five years become okay okay okay so okay um the next two items are just engineering costs um we got grants for woff Mills Road and for Cedarbrook Road phase one however the grant does not cover certain engineering costs um those have to come out of our funds the doesn't come out of the grant funds and so these are the two amounts that Tom Decker is requesting um for their services for these to um you know preparing the bid spec and and any of the paperwork they need to do and some of the inspection doesn't get covered so those items are in here um so um that's 10,000 and 23,100 that he requested didn't you did was there a Shadow Oak survey that was already done was that done Decker already did for um um Shadow Oaks and so if you go all the way past all these police ones that we said yes to and you come down to the 1.5 million yeah that is what Tom is estimating Shadow Oaks will cost because at the same time that we do the milling and Paving there may be some curbing work not all some that needs to be repaired while we do the road work and there's also going to be storm drains that need to be upgraded and replaced and that's going to have to happen all over town but as we do the roads we're doing them yeah the upgrading of the the upgrading of the storm drains that that's the retrofitting um they'll have to be some will have to be completely redone to so it's a storm drain it's not like a drywall it's a storm drain well it is like a well they go these are the ones that go into the streams yeah okay yeah these yeah so it's a storm draam I got to map all those I got to see every single one I it on I turn it off so they I'll leave it on but then nobody else can talk you leave yours on we'll work it out we'll work it out sorry I got to see every one of those grains quick question yes this will be unpopular with Shadow Oaks but when I had to redo my curbs I had to pay for them correct and we're not redoing all the curbing okay we are not but there may be some curbing as in other road projects where it is crumbled and when we go to do the road work it completely disintegrates at which time we will have to then replace the curbing but it's not the goal is not to replace all Curbing and Shadow Oaks and that's made clear to all the residents in there when they ask can I get new curbing no it's only what Tom Decker deems necessary when doing the milling and Paving okay do those residents have an option to pay for it since the work is currently sure they can reach out to the contractor that's out there and ask to have it done we ow I mean that's in any project yes they can and since they're already out there sometimes they do give them a better price because they're already out there um but we don't get involved in it but that include would that include sidewalks like if you're out there and you wanted a sidewalk redone at the same time sure if they if they want to they just have to get a permit from Tom though to do that he needs to be told and he needs to inspect it to make sure it's dumb proper yeah it's an advantage when they're out there for sure thank you okay um and then the last item is Cedarbrook phase two now we talked about this last year and we went out for a grant for phase one and we received the funding for phase one so I put it in there but we're going to go out for a grant again I can't promise we're going to get it I don't know what's going to happen with all this funding everything's kind of up in the air that but we are going to go out for um funding for it again that'll be Tom's when he comes to US every year and says oh what road should I go for now Cedarbrook phase two is is what we're going to be going for sorry where is Cedarbrook where is Cedarbrook out off Route 130 in the corporate Oh by die Road it's all corporate right it's corporate but we own those roads yeah I know yeah um so that's in there but it's not going to get an ordinance until I know about the whole Grant situation okay okay so we're we're done with capital for 2025 the other items again they're just placeholders they sit in there because I need to fill in my Capital plan but they may never ever happen um okay so moving on to the agenda the next item is the salary poll and I've discussed this with the personnel subcommittee as well and we are now um salary pool 5% that is what we did last year that's what we're asking for again this year um I've looked up what the standard cost of living is and what um increases are basically over industrywide and they're anywhere from four to six per. I can also tell you that the State Health Benefit cost went up significantly again they promised three years ago when it went up that wasn't going to happen and they did it again and some of my employees are actually making less money right now than they were at the end of last year until they get their increase it it it's stinks but we can thank the state for that because they threw the municipalities under the bus and their health benefits are less because we are all paying more but that's just the way it goes so and we need health benefits so um um so I put in it's already built into the budget 5% um salary pool is already in there where is this um well you'll see it in every single Opera where there salaries yeah there's a 5% increase okay um increases in line items in operating just a couple that I want to point out to you um legal there's an increase if you're in operating there's a spreadsheet in the front and Excel spreadsheet that has all the operating um but but legal's gone up and I can tell you why legal is going up and we may not need to use it but we have litigation going on for a couple of different things at this point and so we just need to make sure we have enough money to get through that litigation and if we actually need to pay anything out we want to make sure we have some funding there if we don't need it it'll roll into Surplus right in the front of operating where your summary spreadsheets are if you if you find these they look like this it says budget summary they look like this they right well Surplus is up front yeah so um okay so I'm just pointing out the increases that are somewhat significant yeah also keep in mind that Mo I mean probably three quarters of our budget is not even within our control things like increase in pension increase in health insurance our shared services contracts which we've already entered into um police salaries they're all non-negotiable um so a big chunk of our budget the the contribution to the library all mandated and spelled out and it's non-discretionary there's nothing that you can do about that corre me and our budget is very tight our budget doesn't increase much each year considering the fact that everything else has been increasing um but we we hold pretty I hold pretty tight when I go through the Departments and I kind of cut where I think now this is just a cushion we don't need it oh but now you're going to need $3,000 more in motor fuel because it went up so we I offset it for them which is why the budget pretty much stays level for some of these and obviously being the new guy I'm gonna I'm gonna lean on the new guy thing for a while to just get used to it till December at least at least is there a way to to Mark those line items in the budget as as like mandate we have no flexibility so I have when you go through the book any budget that's in blue paper or every year I use a different color paper NIS those are ones we have no control over got it any way we can do that on the summary as well sure that would be awesome awesome yeah thank you um okay so Senor Center that's new that's a completely new um department so that budget is new and that is for Donna's um as a senior center director and then the programming that she's asking for funds for okay so that's been pulled out of Parks and Recreation and basically put into the senior center okay um in addition to what she no that salary is not in addition to that's just split out between her different positions um round four of affordable housing so you're going to see that the budget for affordable housing is up quite a bit because in Prior years we really didn't need to use our consultant or our attorney for affordable housing but this year we're going to use them a lot so I was gonna ask where that was is that still under a professional it's under there's a tab for affordable housing I meant in your summary sheets in the summary sheet it's under it's outside cap so it's towards the back of the summary sheet because I have to do this by inside and outside cap so miscellaneous outside cap if you go to that next sheet it's right under PRS and before loap okay and that's pretty much it for the the things within our control that have gone up significantly I really I'm not flagging something that's $500 more because that's just probably an increase in you know training or something but those are the significant ones with that being said um our Surplus is very healthy um and continues to be we um are fortunate in that we've been able to replenish what we used last year and so so with that being said and with the budget as tight as I keep it we are able to have a zero tax increase again this year um we'll use $2,220 th000 worth of surplus which is fine because we uh are replenishing we replenished two over two million in 2024 in Surplus so we're basically using and replenishing using and replenishing looking down down the road um our assessed value continues to go up um it will level off um by 2030 maybe um because everything will be pretty much built out at that point um and we won't have any additional ratables coming on but we also will probably be doing a reval at some point over the next couple of years not for the entire town but for the warehouse area um um and we will have someone come in in close session to talk to talk about that but um with that being said there will be additional Surplus most likely from that as well so um you know we like to keep our Surplus at at least 30% of our budget right our budget is 14 million that would be surplus of 4.2 5.2 and our Surplus is at eight million right now I yeah I mean doing quick math on this long sheet here if you look at it it's taken us 25 years to double our budget but based on this rate that we have it's going to take only six years for this budget to double again and that's just a sign of the times which means that we have to keep a surplus growth rate of about 30% which is exactly the point you're making in order to continue to draw replenish with draw replenish to in to make sure that we are overcompensating for that budget increase and I think when we message fast math when we message us to the community too I think it's important to say like because we often will and as not a an elected official before this you would hear like we're able to keep taxes flat because we're using the Surplus I think we also have to reiterate and we're replenishing that Surplus over the years like looking at this projection our Surplus is going to be even healthier potentially in a couple over the coming years but it's going to have to again you're going to double it by 2032 and your Surplus you're saying at 203 is already going to be meeting those 2032 budget numbers yeah which is why we are you're two years ahead of it correct on from a surplus standpoint right yeah and that's why we remain conservative right we keep it flat we don't do anything crazy and use the Surplus that we need to however just keeping in mind that 10 years from now this could be a little bit of a different picture with that being said 10 years ago we said that as well and nobody really can forecast the economy and exactly what's going to happen and but we knew we would be okay with what we were doing and so far we have a question why can't we estimate the recycling into our budget recycling tonage is in a grant okay okay so recycling tonage Grant I put in as a chapter 159 during the year because I don't have the number until they actually give me the number for it and then we use that Grant to um fund part of the public work salaries correct yeah because I mean it typically was about 109 like that's higher than we normally get from the grant like if you look at it over time it's typically around that number yeah but you can't estimate it not a grant you have to you have to have it awarded to you yep Any Grant has to be awarded to you and when it is I put it in the budget but it's done as a chapter 159 you won't see it in this I can't put it in this I can't guess a number for the clean communities I noticed that too yeah that that all when it comes in will get done as a chapter 159 throughout the year clean communities isn't used for um DPW salaries right that's is for extra stuff or is it um clean communities we use for equipment usually for um things like you know to clean like trash bags or um even equipment that Jerry has for clean community yeah the uh going back to the reval for a second what year did you say that was you think oh a total reval I I've no well I think statutorily it has to be done so many years but we've done what's called compliance plans throughout and so that's helped us to push that off and we're going to have a close session with the tax assessor at the next meeting so you can ask him all those questions this coming yes I almost feel like we should applaud yeah really I'd say that and also um some we have a history of fiscal responsibility in the town yes right so it's every committee I've had has been very good at working with me to make sure that we are in the position we're in yeah so with that being said we're we're up to public comment so if public okay come up come up come up sign your sign your name state your name address and we have our Standard time limit okay have three minutes just so you know can you push for those of you who don't know me I'm Alan stino I live in Shadow Oaks been here for I don't know 30 years more or less um so the reason why I'm here is first I wanted to thank Denise um we had some email back and forth Shadows has been looking a little shabby my words over the past you know five 10 years so I asked her how to go about getting things done like lights were out street signs were missing and gone and she guided me through that and so I wanted to thank you for that um the other thing we talked about was the paving of the streets and I think I heard today that you have $1.5 billion budgeted for that so I guess my first question is is you had told me that if the bids come in for that you move forward if the bids do not you don't move forward correct with that so how confident are you in that $1.5 Million number confident in my engineer and he's the one who gave it to me because that is not my area of expertise so um and if if it comes in his history being the um he's he's been on the mark we haven't had to reject one yet so he's been usually he is um puts in a huge contingency so that his budget's more than what the bid comes in at however when we go out to bid sometimes the concrete prices go through the roof and and we can't anticipate that but he's confident with that number um if it happened that that wasn't enough the whole project probably wouldn't be scrapped we would probably have to do it in phases that's what would have to happen all right good um so and then I heard about the curve so I'm happy because there's I live on distance the East Side Shadow and there's about a 200 foot section of curb there that is just crumbled there's like nothing left so I'm glad that that's going to be done I hate for the it to be paid and then a year later someone have to dig it all up and you know encourage no if it if it needs to be addressed the engineer will address it in the bid spec and it will it will be done and if he thinks it doesn't need to be addressed then it won't be but typically if it's already crumbling most likely it will have to yeah okay so hopefully he did like a fi he did they went out absolutely and I'm sure he saw um and the other thing was if this goes through the budget process when do bids go out and when would you expect it to be done so if the budget gets adopted in March we still have to do what's called a capital ordinance to put the money in place for any capital projects and that takes two readings and there's a 21 day a stole period so I tell everyone that the money is not really spendable until May and at that point then we have to get the bid spec together go out to bid and award the bid so probably the fall yes yeah late summer all right um that's it okay thanks [Music] 10