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Video-1: youtube.com/watch?v=7BaTzDrkXd0

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And the contract will include digitization. Right now, we're analog. Everything that we say goes through the speaker, which then goes to our program for capturing all of our notes. That will no longer happen. It'll be direct. The chair will also have a mute button.

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There'll be a timer, digitized timer for people that they have public comment. You will also not be looking at that anymore. You will be looking at a large screen for all the presentations. And the public will also have their own large screen as well. And anybody that's watching the meeting, when we go to

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YouTube and go to a presentation, they will also see the presentation, not just hear people talking about the presentation. So, it's a full upgrade where you can bring us up to top-notch first class. >> Will we each get our own monitors? >> Okay. Are we ready?

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>> Yes. >> Thank you. >> All right. And we have Roll call, sir. >> Roll call. >> Roll call. She said speak up. >> Here.

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>> What's that? >> Here. >> Board member Robert Sher >> here. >> Vice Chair Kenetta Hardy >> here. >> And chairwoman Roger Glover >> here. >> City Manager Derek Martin. >> I'm here. >> Assistant City Manager CRA Bonnie Lope

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>> here. City Planner Mark Car >> here, >> City Planner Rebecca Cado >> here, >> and myself, City Clerk Sharita Belchure. And we do have a quorum. >> Thank you, Madam Chair, if I may. Yes. >> I want to introduce everybody to our new city clerk, Sharita Belchure.

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>> Welcome. >> Welcome again. >> You did a great job. So, thank you very much. >> Thank you. Um, next we'll have the approval of the May 21st, 2026

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minutes. >> I move that we um accept the May 21st, 2026 U meeting minutes. >> Second. It has been properly motioned and second

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to accept the May 21st Planning and Zoning Commission meeting minutes. All in favor? >> I. >> All oppose. >> Thank you. >> Yes.

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Madam chair, I wish to make a motion that we um move um item five uh new new items A and B uh next on the agenda.

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>> Okay, >> I'll second. Okay, it has been properly motioned and second that we move agenda item number five, new items, the variance request for 929 center street

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and 503 Vernon to the top of the agenda. Um, could you please um we're going to do a roll call vote. So, >> yes ma'am. Um, board member Brad Green on this already.

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>> No. What What was motion that we move items to the top of the agenda? Okay. >> Board member Brad Green. >> Hi. >> Board member Dan Dada. >> Hi. >> Vice Chair Kenetta Hardy.

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>> Hi. >> Uh, chairwoman uh Veronica. >> Yes. and board member Robert Sher. >> Yes. >> Thank you. So at this time we will move to the agenda. New items number five.

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A beer's request at 929 Center Street. Um, this is a request by Paul Judson and Ashley Dunn with DSW Homes on behalf of the property owner, Lasha Washington, for variance to reduce the minimum

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northern front yard setback requirement to replace an existing single family home with a new structure on six,812 point square foot corner.

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lot in the SR1 zoning district. Yes, this request is for a variance just to reduce the northern front yard setback. The property is currently developed with a single family home that was built in 1960. That home currently is non-conforming and has additional

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structures including a carport and a shed that are also encroaching over the property line. So with the construction of the new home, those structures will be removed and the property overall will become more non-conforming. Um in addition, the existing home does not

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meet the minimum living area of the SR1 zoning, but the new home will. And based on the variance analysis, the use is still compatible with the surrounding uses staying residential. It is the minimum action available to

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permit reasonable use of the property. If the variance were not granted, the building envelope would only be 15 ft wide and that would not accommodate the design of the new home. Um, in fact, that wouldn't even accommodate most of mobile home structures today.

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Okay, staff is recommending approval of the variance which would reduce the north front yard setback from 25 ft to 10.09 ft. >> From 25 ft to what?

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>> 10.09 ft. Okay. >> Anybody have any input? Yes, that's the location. >> So, so now there's actually some encroachment off the property. Is that onto the neighbor's property with

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carport? Is that correct? >> Yes. onto Yeah, it says over the property line side. >> Okay. So, what this does is it allows everything to come back inside the property lines and makes it more of a buildable lot because of the width

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because it's corner lot. Is that correct? >> Correct. >> Okay. >> Yeah. I just It says that's a pretty big building. um 6,800 square feet. >> Oh, that's that's the lot size. >> That's the lot size. Yes.

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>> The the area of the home will be a little over,400 square ft. >> And and the buildings that are there now are going to be torn down. >> Yes. >> Wow. >> So, this will be a brand new home that's replacing the existing non-conforming

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structure. Do we have any particulars on on the home like style? It's made from I mean is it corrugated steel? What is it? There are um there are plans at the back of the staff report that show

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the location of the proposed home as well as the location of the existing structures including the carport that encroaches over the Norman property line toward Second Avenue. And there are also building elevations

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included as well. and and of floor plans. Uh it's a it's a great improvement to the site and the in the area and it's a nice corner lot uh with woodland um

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beyond it. Um it's I I drove by it and uh um it's it's a very nice spot out there. I don't have any. I mean, by definition, it meant the requirements from what I hear.

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>> Okay. >> You could. >> Yes, ma'am. So, this is quasi judicial hearing. So, you should ask the applicant if they wish to had anything >> and then members of the public have been notified, so they should have an opportunity to speak. >> All right. Would you all like to come to

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the podium, Miss Washington, to speak to Miss Barnes? Good afternoon, Deborah Graham, and on behalf of 5 929 Center Street, I think this is the most advantageous thing that can be done. It

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will c certainly enhance the neighborhood and the improvement would be a major enhancement for a family. So, we are asking for your approval for that request. >> Okay. Thank you. Thank you. >> Thank you.

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>> Do we have anyone else in the audience that have any other input, questions, concerns? Take a a vote. >> I'll make a motion. I make a motion that we approve the variance as presented.

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>> Second. >> Okay. It has been properly motioned and second for the Baron's request at 929 Center Street. >> At this time, we will take a vote. Um, Robert,

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>> I board member Dan Dodge. >> I, >> Vice Chair Ketta Hardy, >> I. >> Board member Brad Green. >> Hi, >> Chairwoman Monica Glover. I congratulations. >> Thank you. >> Thank you ladies.

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>> Next item of business number five new items is Baron's request 503 Vernon Street. This is a request by Susan. Excuse me for pronouncing wrong the name wrong. Tadani >> Tadani

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>> Tadani I'm sorry for a Vance to increase the maximum allowable fence height from 6 feet to 10 ft in the rear yard of a 0.29 acre lot in the SR1 zoning district.

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>> Can I add important figure to that? 19 ft. It's only 19 ft on the property line up to the property line, I'm sorry. >> Okay. Okay. Thank you.

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>> And the description just provides the overall lot area. Um the maximum fence height in cider rear yards is 6 feet in all of the city's residential zoning districts. The owner has requested a variance for a taller fence that would be installed around a shed located in

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the backyard to prevent theft, trash, and other miscellaneous items from being placed on her property near the structure. The reflex does not meet the criteria in code section 3.2, sorry, 3.23.2G,

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2G, which allows administrative approval for fences above the height limitation if the property is situated significantly below adjacent lands or if it contains some sort of hazard that cannot be adequately screened by a code

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compliant fence. Since the surrounding properties are also residential and subject to the same six foot pence height limitation, it doesn't qualify for that administrative relief under the codes variance analysis

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criteria. The fence does not meet the um I'm sorry, the fence is not justified because there is no unique characteristic of the property. there's um no major change in topography or like I said there's no obvious hazard

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to children or pets in the area. However, the applicant has indicated that there are extendu extenduating circumstances um that they need the fence to prevent nuisance and um damages to their property.

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Based on the analysis of the variance criteria, staff recommends denial of the requested variance to increase the fence height from six to 10 feet. >> May I ask a question? >> Yes. >> Uh looking at that map, that's just around the actual shed and not around

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the entire property. >> Yes. >> Is there current fence around the entire property at this time, chain link or otherwise? >> Uh can I answer that question? I'll let the applicant speak as well. >> Okay. Thank you. Yes.

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>> Excuse me. Can um >> if you can come up to the microphone, state your name and your address, please. >> Thank you, Robert Tidani. On behalf of 503 Burns, Crescent City. >> Yes. the in the history of that property on

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lot one. Um that house, the yellow house on the corner that I help restore was the original house. And so what they did is and I was I said 1923 and I was corrected by my historian that it was 1924

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estimated when they started building that area. So, the way things were laid out, uh, was, you know, understandably quite confusing to people. So, we've had trespassing. We've had doors kicked in, we've had cars parked on the property

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with weapons in them that I was tempted to remove, but I negotiated them off the property. And I I wish I'd made a copy of this. Just recently, I got a whole bunch of stuff off the property by basically

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sending certified mailing to the people that placed the stuff on the property that they need to remove it off the property so that we could have our property peacefully. So this shed there's a guy collects trash. He comes

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in the area. He sorts through trash. He does stuff. I don't want to have the possibility of this guy taking up refuge in this shed. And and that's why I wanted to answer. I am in the process of putting in the sixoot fence, but this is just to secure uh the garage shed area

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so that we won't have thefts and breakins when I'm not watching over the place physically out there. So, it's just a request for 19 ft. Um I commissioned the survey.

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If you want to see where this shed is, I've got the paperwork right here. Thank you, Mr. manager. >> I've got more. You want me to get them all out and give them to you? >> It's the same one that's in the exact

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same staff. >> It is in the staff report. >> Yes, sir. >> The survey is in the staff report and then any photos that you distribute will also have to go to the spark. >> Okay. I just have unfortunately I have the photos on my phone. I wish I printed them up. I I just have this where I

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successfully been for years dealing with these people. I That's my copy. I'm sorry. I You can keep the photo stack at you know the the nuisance of having people building on your

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property and then trying to explain to them later and show them the survey spikes and they say the survey spikes aren't accurate. So, you have to get a survey out there and that cost $450 to knock on their door and explain, hey, you can't you can't have your satellite direct TV here, which I told them years ago when I wasn't there, they I was

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working in Arizona. I came back, they had it there. So, um it's just a good idea to not have people have access to that 1923 garage cuz I at this

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point economically can't re- roof it, which I will do, but I'm afraid somebody could walk in there and something could land on their head, god forbid. So, I think it's kind of a public safety issue and my own personal selfish way of

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locking up some tools in being able to drive back to the house 9 10 hours later and stuff will still be there. So, it's just >> um my question is um I'm very familiar

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with the home. Um how often are you all here? >> Intermittently. I'm the one that's probably got the odds on the place the most often >> and and nobody should be going on anyone's property. Um I'm not saying

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that and probably some of that issue is because no one is there enough and is open. But I don't see where um a 10 fence is going to change. Um what what

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is going on? Um I think if you put a 6ft fence I think that will be good. Do you have no trespassing signs there? >> Sure. Yeah. Is an abundance. >> Okay. Yeah. I I thought so I was making sure. Um,

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and I I I know in the past that probably that was a lot of the concerns because um, no one's in the house and people have a tendency >> Oh, I was in the house and people came in at the at the house with

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sledgehammers threatening, telling me what I was going to be able to do and what I couldn't do on my own land. um that individual uh is no longer in the area, but I don't know that for a fact. I do have

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individuals that come up when I'm there and they pull in the driveway to check on me. >> Do you have securities on on the house of the >> I don't have the money to keep the internet on all the time. So, yes and

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no. I have hard drive footage of these people, but I don't have hard drive footage when I really needed it when when the MS13 was on the property showing me their tattoos. So, yeah, six foot fence throw over that in seconds. I'm over it in seconds and I'm a

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middle-aged fat bald man, you know. >> I mean, I understand. I just, you know, when you when I looked at the definition and grant awareness and it was just an unnecessary unnecessary hardship. So I know it's an unnecessary hardship for

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you. Um so but when we talk about what we have to consider in granting the variance um and I don't know if that's a will be solved through the variance or if there's you know police involved or

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you know if you had any you know contacting any enforcement or anything like that. So >> yeah, I guess I should provide you a list of incident numbers and police reports. >> I um I sympathize with the property owner. I

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think that it's a matter of security and protecting protecting one's property. Um the request is not a perimeter fence. The request is is to secure a building, a structure. And um and when you drive

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by it, you clearly see that uh it's an open facility. The home itself is uh is an historic home. Uh and I the the gentleman has reported to us that

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there's been a series of of u people invading the property. And I can I can see that it's uh it's an invitation the way it is now for for people homeless people to move in not only in the garage

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shed but also to have eyes on the house itself. So to to me the hardship is to secure one's and protect one's property uh and to to keep to keep people out. They've already gone done the wise thing

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and have post posted numerous signs um around the property on both on both uh streets. Um so uh I can understand the request and I think that uh it's

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responsibility to to have it done. >> Thank you. It it is also it's uh it's just a block from from 17. It's also right on 308.

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And so when we have homeless come through our town, um they they often um get off 17 and do a parallel street. Um I uh I live on South Main Street and I

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can tell you um I' I've witnessed the abundance of it. >> Uh it is it is a problem and I've had people even though my property is posted um enter my property um and um I uh

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and the it's not just occupying it, it's what could happen. uh they they could uh unintentionally or intentionally burn the structure down. They could burn the home down. Um so uh

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I think it's a real issue that we need to address and I'm glad they brought it forward to us. >> Thank you. >> You're welcome. >> I can't stress enough how much I don't want somebody in there, not only for my own reasons, but just out of humanity.

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If if some piece of that roof falls on them, they're going to get hurt. You know, children could be lured in there. I I've picked up needles, bottles over the last 10, 12 years. It's just amazing. And and when I'm there,

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I've waking up 3 in the morning chasing someone out of there. I'm worried. I don't know if I'm going to shoot them or they're going to shoot me. I just want to be peaceful and have peace on the property. Well, it's u it's interesting

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because as I as I observed it's from the street uh two little girls on motorized scooters uh came by and so there is youth activity there uh as well. But um

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and I I also was pleased to see the condition of the home. it it appears you're maintaining the house and putting your efforts there, which I I can appreciate. Um, so I I assume this is a temporary situation where you want to

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wrap the structure and protect it with this 10-ft fence. And I again I think that 10 feet is necessary because it's um for pe people seeking shelter

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six feet doesn't do it. >> Thank you. >> Okay, let's back up. So you said I hit a little temporary. So you are just it's temporary and you're going to take it down

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cuz you said temporary. Well, I I said I assumed. Yes. Yeah. What are your plans for that shed? >> Well, I I'm trying to secure it so that I could store stuff there because, you know, we're trying to keep that corner

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cleared out. And, you know, there's a little area that's forested and I'm trying to keep that under control. And, you know, I check it for bugs and stuff like that. And I just uh I I mean would I'd be willing to spend

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vinyl coated. So in Holly Hill in Daytona Beach in several areas the permit process is streamlined and it's starts usually at 8 ft along a side fence so long as it's

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back off from the front ride away from the front of the house. and and that that's normal at 8 feet here. I realize it's six feet. So it's semantics. So I'd like to go up to 10 ft along that 19 ft

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in the back and then the rest is just on the side and the gated end. So it's approximately and on the my very crude technical drawing based on the uh plat maps which you know I talked about um

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it's that 85% of that area is the shed and I'm reinforcing that roof right now. So I I'd like to put up something and be able to leave it there for for a few years. I I just it's and maybe and I

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don't know if the um city manager whomever can I'm stuck on the legal definition of what a variance you know why we would grant a variance and I don't see a lane of hardship I mean it's a and I could be wrong you

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know so um I sympathize and I don't know if there is any other way in which we can help if you you know >> I I have another question too Um, and sorry not to not to cut you off there, but you talk about the roof falling on

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people. Is this a dilapitated structure? I mean, why are we trying to save the structure is dilapitated and obviously doesn't need setbacks? >> Oh, because the Well, the structure was there when the property was purchased and that's the way the property conveys. So, what I'm trying to do is make it as

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safe as possible. >> If I may as well. So, just a clear picture, and I think this was asked earlier, the fence that you plan on putting in for security and protection purposes of the building is going to be permanent, correct? Not temporary.

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>> I'd like to make it I'd like to make it so that Yeah. So that there would be some security there so we could store some stuff. >> And you have And you're also planning on you're fixing this and reinforcing it now. >> Yes. and your concern is that because of previous crime activity that's happened

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that somebody could come into your property, you try to utili utilize the space while you're doing construction or working and they could have something fall on them, whether it's the structure or other tools. Is that >> Yeah. Like there's a valid safety situation there. >> And and I know we've had issues in the

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past with people going on properties. I think it's state of Florida insurance. It's it's horrible. But the owner of the property could be sued by someone that's homeless going onto the property and injuring themselves. In this case, um,

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and this is my personal opinion, you're the advisory board. If it were me, I I would say to to grant this for the fact that there's a security issue and a life safety problem here and an insurance problem and he's trying to upgrade the property and safe his keep his property

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safe. I don't have a problem with that in that sense. If Mark could answer the question on the variance, that I would appreciate it. We'll get back to that. So what you see in the staff report is a review based on the criteria that's in the land on the code. So the land

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development code tells you that in order to grant a variance, there must be something there must be a hardship associated with the property. uh there must be something peculiar or or you know different about this

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property compared to other properties in order for you to make that decision. So when we looked at the criteria in in the most strictest sense we didn't see anything property related. Uh so so that's why we made our recommendation

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uh for denial. Now, obviously, you're here in the public hearing. You've heard testimony. You can make decision as you guys uh see fit. >> I I also want to add, and this is just

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observing from from the street, I'm assuming that this structure is is also historical. >> Yes, sir. >> And that it was probably built at the same time the house was built. >> Yeah. I thought it was 1923, but I was informed it was 1923.

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>> Well, a year here or there doesn't make any point. The point is that uh it has the sort value as well as the house. So, sir, uh you uh the question came up u do you plan on

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re on doing work and restoring that structure eventually? >> I would like to. >> And then at that time, would you take down the fence? I I guess I guess I could I I thought that if I went with vinyl coated

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uh something that's not real noticeable from the street and then and my correct me if I'm wrong, Sharita, that you made contact with one of the two neighbors. >> I had one of the neighbors call in to give a comment

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and um and >> did they have any objections? Because I I hadn't read that. I don't >> we we have one uh one notice in in support of your request from a neighbor. >> Excellent. The other two are real quiet

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and they keep a low profile. I think >> we haven't any other communication neighbors. >> I I I'm looking at their fence and I don't I think they'd be they'd be happy to see somebody who would you know have a little pride and want to take care of stuff. So I would certainly help them

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agree with that. But I would help them grasp as I make that submission and help them fix their fence anywhere they want on their property just to try to be um decent about stuff. I um my

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concern is that as a board it is our job and responsibility to make the best decisions that is going to be beneficial um for everyone

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and at the same time making sure that we don't open a can of worms that um will cause a problem um having everybody come up here wanting a 10

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foot fence. And so that's a concern that I have. Also, you stated earlier when you were speaking that other issues are going on where

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um satellites on the property. Yeah, there's been a real um cavalier attitude by certain people to take over parts of the property and I had to really ratchet down and get a

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surveyor in here and they said, "Well, we'll get our own survey." It's like, "Fine, that means you're going to spend $500. I spent 450 and you're going to come to the same conclusion because Steven Schneider laid the spikes down there 30 years ago and they're sailing in the same spot and I could have gone

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over and found it. I didn't want to get my head blown off because these people have come at me with sledgehammers this day. Now they're coming over and shaking my hand because they realize any judge in Putnham County is going to look at them and look at me. I'm holding the survey and I'm saying, "Hey, you got

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your your your tomatoes, your tomatillos, your jalapenos, and this that everything, your satellite dish, your car parked in our yard. And if I don't do something, it's going to turn into that first possession." So, you know, >> I understand

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>> and and I I I I submit to you that I would only use solid quality materials because this neighborhood, especially that corner, is an area where people mitigate in from all different directions that especially, as the

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councilman >> explained, >> I live down the street. You know, >> I I'm from here and I grew up here and um and people have always

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walk and nothing has walked out of my yard like that. Okay. >> Nothing's walked out of your yard. >> Nothing's walked out of your yard. >> I have a couple questions. >> Wow. That's that's great. I haven't had that experience. >> I haven't either.

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And I'm just saying that that is >> send a little your car. >> People have always just walked. So that's not going to change because that convenience store is there. People have always walked. So I just want people that move into this community to

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understand. Okay. That people have always walked in that area. Okay. >> Yes. I I I pick up after him regularly. >> I I have a couple questions. It seems the the premise is that

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a six-foot fence is easy to climb over. >> So you want to add another four feet because it's a deterrent for people climbing over the fence and getting into your shed. Is that right? >> That's exactly right. >> Okay. >> Because that's not going to stop 10ft fence is not going to stop your

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neighbors putting tomatillos in your yard and parking their cars in your yard. So that's that's ill. >> I I agree with that. And that's I as that's about the satellite. >> Well, I don't think they're going to go around the fence. It's there now. It's not done. It's in progress. >> And the other thing is if we if we grant

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the variance on this, and you correct me if I'm wrong, >> don't we set a precedent so everybody else in that >> area code can come in and say, "Hey, I want a 10-ft fence." >> And we can't argue because he set the president.

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>> Yeah. They they have to have exact same circumstance. It's not a precedence in the same sense. If you grant, yes, you may get more requests if people believe you're you're open to that. But each variance is based on its own unique

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circumstances. And so you wouldn't be obligated to approve additional varian case by case basis. And if this if this body decides to move forward with a motion um in favor, there's still a permit process with the city that you would have to go through as well with a fee and an inspection as well.

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>> Sounds good. >> What What is this sideyard set back on accessory? >> Sideyard set back on. >> This is right on the property line. >> This is the what would we say we were zone?

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It's S SR1. >> SR1. >> You know, I look this up and I quote people all the time, but this >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, we like playing it out. We have to go out to the

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web. The shed is 150 square ft. >> Excuse me. >> The shed's 150 square ft. I know there's a size requirement. >> Okay. Yeah. So, if you're talking about the shed itself, I thought you were just

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asking. So, it's 5T. 5T. >> Can I ask one more question? What what do you actually have in the shed now? >> Um some bags of cement and some 2x4s and some ladders. >> That's it. >> Kind of locked together. >> And you're wanting to protect that or

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you wanting the bigger fence to keep out the roof rack? >> Yeah. Basically, you know, the 85% of what's inside that fence is already there and it's been there for decades. >> So, you're not really protecting anything like lawnmowers and

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>> Well, no, but I will. and and and yes, I will. I will. >> I think >> and I I need to >> I think from what I'm gathering is that you're you're it's more of a protection issue uh keeping you out of liability for people coming in that could cause damage to their to the property or their

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sales by the material not being finished. So, when you do finish the the restore, you're going to be putting expensive materials in there, I would imagine, locking them up. >> Yeah. because I would have at least be able to waterproof them and and and and you know the bill doesn't go through the

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roof. >> Exactly. Yes, sir. >> That's right. >> You said that people were coming in. >> Yeah. Three weeks three weeks ago at 3:00 a.m. in the morning, I chased someone out of that area. Whether they

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were in the shed, I don't know. I could go back and look at cameras. I had I had, if you look at my mailbox, it's reinforced with two 4x4s sister together in the ground and concrete. And I've had a a truck come up and whack into that

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mailbox and put a big dent in there. Luckily, I mean, I was lucky. I was able to take the mailbox off and redo it, and I I saved a $100 Amazon security mailbox. >> So, you do have a a Ring camera of some sort. You do have some type of security.

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>> Oh, yeah. I I you'll laugh. I caught the vehicle that did >> and and I tracked him down, but that's not been the case. I mean, we we we have an antique door, but mom has taken it to a a finished carpenter she knows. And the guy told her it'd be $1,000 to build

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a new one or repair the existing door. So, people kicked it in. And things have gotten a lot better. I mean, when I told you this MS-13 story that just the guy right next door here rolled his eyes at my mom when we went in to report

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what was going on. >> So, is it Yeah, it's time for a new Crescent City and they PCSO did a good job. My friend Robert Johnson was here. He was doing a great job, but now I'm

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getting off topics. >> Yes. Yeah. So, so in essence, you're having a trespassing problem. >> I'm having a breaking entering problem, a trespassing problem, a people using drugs on the property problem. >> No, no, I don't.

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>> Yeah, >> but people using drugs on the property isn't like people using drugs inside your shed, which you feel a 10-ft fence would prohibit that. >> It seems like you have a huge trespassing problem all around. >> Absolutely. And I don't know where the

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10ft fence is going to help with your trespassing problem. >> Um, well, I think that >> they're really going to when they see the trespassing and they see the 10 foot fence and they see me show and they're climbing up the 10 foot fence, I might have them at a disadvantage.

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>> Well, having a structure that has open doors and somebody who's homeless walking by, it's, you know, it's appealing to them for shelter. If I was in your shoes, I think the same thing. >> I can understand.

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>> Have you ever had this and respect it as to structural integrity? >> The No. You know, I hate to say it, but it might solve your problem just to tear the thing down if all you got is a couple

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bags of cement too much. >> Yeah, it's sort of nice having a dry space to store them in, too. >> Sure. What bags of cement? >> Yeah, material. >> What is your assessment of the structure as it sits?

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>> Does it have integrity? >> It it it can hold me. That's, you know, I'm 179 181 pounds. >> I understand it can hold you. Me if you sit on the roof.

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>> Yeah. But it is terite damage in the framing. That's more to my question. >> Is this pretty sound? >> That that is in the works and and no, it it isn't it isn't in great shape. It needs help and it's being reinforced

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when I can get in there and do that. Do you >> got some other work I got to do? It's like kind of balance it. >> Do you plan to restore it or just to button it up? >> Um I plan to restore it to make it watertight.

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>> Um I think that's not restoring it, that's repairing it or rebuilding it rather than restoring it. >> Yeah, I think that that's a good answer. So your goal is to secure it. Yes. So to make it waterproof

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and to secure it and you know it's a old it's an old old thing you know I mean when we're dust the next person might just tear it down but they might say hey this is at least this guy was trying to

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make it secure. Maybe they'll keep using it. It's right now I'm I'm I'm tying in some stuff to keep the uh um the truss usable meaning the roof.

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>> Sounds to me like this structure is in bad shape. >> Yeah, it's I'm >> I'm working on it. And >> yeah, you might be working on it, but presently it's in bad shape. And you say you're saying you're being kind of evasive about doing any repairs. You're

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saying, "Well, I might fix it down the road here. I might repair it. I just want to make sure that the water doesn't get on my bags of cement." Seems like there's a lot going on here other than a 10-ft fence.

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Yeah, it it it it needs the structure needs needs help, but it needs repair. >> Has there been any um increase um with the law enforcement like patrolling the area since your um you know your attacks

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or your your incidents? >> That I would say yes. I mean there's They they they've been helpful. Um they told me when I was in the process of getting some people's cars off the property that if I had to, they would

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come and help me in completely different responses from different deputies. Some that absolutely are 100% there behind you and then some that just say, "Oh, you know, this is a this this is another type of issue. This isn't a criminal

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issue. we're not going to help out. And then other people say, "Yeah, you know, it's trespassing. Call me up when you need me and we'll get them out of here." >> I'd like to add that there's been a a much improved uh sheriff's uh appearance in my neighborhood and it's

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made a huge difference. I'm very grateful for it. >> I'm very grateful the last contact I had, too. I just wish that all of them had been as good as the last contact I had. She said, "Robert, you just call me, you know, to get a hold of me. I'll

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be out there to back you up." I was really impressed with it. >> And just to clarify, you have not put up a sixoot fence. You want to just go straight to 10. >> Correct. >> I'm only putting up a sixoot fence where I I I made application for it. And then I was told I didn't even need an

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application, but the city was nice enough to give me an application. So if I had a conflict with these people and that's why I sent that letter and I had the survey done. So yes, it's only that 19 ft that is up to the person's property

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line. If you want me to put it 3 in inside, I can do that. I no way, shape, or for going to tamper with anyone else's property. I totally respect the idea that you got a guy who puts an

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embossed stamp on this document that shows where the property line is and the spikes are. >> So your your intention is to cover the entire building surrounding entire building with a 10 foot fence. Is that correct? >> That's correct. Just like Derek was

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saying. So that I have safety and people have safety. >> We covered that. >> Yeah. Sorry. >> And I I guess you would hinge it to get in and out of your structure. >> Correct. So one one side is a gate. >> And from what you what you've told us,

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it sounds like you uh uh you feel that there there is much structural integrity with the with the shed. >> There wasn't a few months ago until I started repairing the truss. So the truss is being repaired.

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And I guess I can speed that up. >> The fence is just around the sh >> just just around the ship. >> You said you're putting up another fence fence. Yeah, there's a sixoot fence on

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on up to the rightway on part of the northwest corner which is um the road to Waka uh Vernon and there is a a the 6T fence

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fence post up. I haven't pulled the the the chain link mesh and gotten the material for that. that's already been permitted and I've assumed the proof which and they told me I didn't really need a permit for the six foot.

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>> Where's the six foot going? >> Uh that is between the uh 517 um Main Street and 503 Vernon. >> So you're doing it on your neighbors both because you have two neighbors.

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You're doing the sixoot fence on both of your neighbors. No, only only on the side on uh Main Street. Only between 517 uh Maine and then me being the next door

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neighbor 503 Vernon. So So that's already up and running except that I haven't >> is >> done the top rail yet and pull the >> chain link. Is there a fence now behind where the shed is over to the property on Vernon

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Avenue? >> There is something that resembles a fence. So the answer is yes. >> It's a falling apart fence. >> Which which is set back into their yard. So my fence would have to be on the

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property up to the property line. somewhere. >> Are you planning on putting a fence on that property? >> It's like a ch >> I'm planning I was just planning on doing this this fence just around the shed and and leaving their fence alone. >> Okay. Because if you're if we're worried

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about trespassing and worry about securing the property, it makes more sense to put a fence along the property line on those two sides. That seems to me it would secure your property a lot better. Have people wandering into it. though when you walk past on um on North

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Main, you know, you look right in. >> There's a big right there. >> See the opening with a, >> you know, no garage door, a building. >> Exactly. the the the the path of the the the people walking into the property

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traditionally has not been through the backyard on on the house to the west as opposed to the house from the south. There's been a lot more activity coming up from the house from the south and from the west now.

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Now people walking down the street. Yeah. And people driving off the road. Yeah. But that's that's not been an issue lately. It's been a long time since anyone's tried to run me over with a motorcycle. >> I think Chief Johnson got that guy. >> So, you're saying that people are

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walking from off Main Street and cutting across the back of the house. >> I had that happen about 3 weeks ago. Yes, ma'am. >> Mhm. >> At 3:00 a.m. in the morning, u my motion

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lights went off. I heard noises. I ran into the backyard and somebody took off and went through the backyard out towards the neighbor's house on Main Street. They came I mean on Vernon Street. They came in on Main Street and crossed over uh Mama Maria's yard.

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Forgive me, that's not the right last name. >> Okay. So, looking at the diagram, so I was thinking the 10 foot fence was going around the property. a regular 6ft fence is going on your property and that will

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stop them from having access just walking onto your property. >> Yeah. That will stop the people parking their car over there. I've talked to them and they said they said after years of doing it, they realized that the surveyor was right. And I believe that

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they have ceased and desist. They accepted. They moved their most of their stuff off there and they asked me what they were going to do with the I was going to do with the 13 trees and I said you could have them back and they said no that's too much dirt and sweat for us you can keep

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>> so chain fence around the property higher fence you want just to shed >> exactly exactly is ma'am. >> Oh, you got it.

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>> So, this right here, they don't need an extra copy. >> Everybody's got one. I just wanted to make sure. >> So, sir, you have two problems. Uh, you have trespassing from perhaps your your budding neighbor >> and then you have you have trespassing

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for people off the street. the the neighbors. You're you're securing up putting up a fence, >> a six foot fence around the uh the edge of the property and to to secure the the garage shed.

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You just want to surround it by a 10ft fence >> from people coming from the street. And then and then I'm you know if I walk out of here I'm 90% complete because most of the most of the work was putting up the the steel fence post. And you know I I

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if you guys like me to try to stick to black chain link it cost me a little few extra dollars. That's no problem. I I I wanted to make it look nice. >> Well that can easily be fined. So >> I think for >> I have no more questions.

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>> I'm ready for a motion. >> Yeah. >> Do you have anything else? >> I don't My last comment would be I don't I don't see how raising the fence four feet is going to help

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with all your problems because you you do a plethora of problems here. uh not necessarily associated with a city building which has open doors which is inviting migrants or transients into it.

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>> Well, yeah, that's that'll completely solve the problem because it won't be open doors anymore. It'll be a locked up secured area and I'll be able to store stuff there. >> And you're not putting wood, you're putting chain link, 10 foot chain link. It needs to be flat wood. That chain can

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be climbed just as >> a perfect ladder. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, >> I would I would I mean, if it were me, I would say my recommendation would be for approval for a a wood fence because you have one side that's going to be flat. You're not going to be able to climb that if we're looking for security. That's my That's my opinion.

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>> That makes sense. So, I just think that take away >> um the beauty of that corner >> and um so I just I just think putting a regular fence would make a difference

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around the the place just a regular fence. >> Yes. Okay. >> I agree. I agree with what you're saying. Um any anything else? Go ahead. Make >> I'm done. I I make a motion that we go with pass recommendation and deny the

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varants. >> I'll second that. >> Um it has been properly motioned and second that we go with the recommendation of

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the city's recommendation. Can we get a roll call, please? >> What is the city's >> that um I'm sorry. >> Member. >> Um, vice chair Daniela Hardy. >> I

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board member Dan. >> Yeah, I I agree. >> Chairwoman Veronica, excuse me. Board member Robert Shader. >> I agree. and chairwoman. I agree. >> So, no f no fence, no wooden fence, no

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tangling fence. >> Not 10 ft high. No, sir. >> Not 10 ft high, sir. >> It would It would help. >> Thank you for coming in. Before we get started moving further, I wanted to pass this out. We had a short

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notice of this. Um, this item came in from Mr. Danny Miller. I gave you yours. >> Okay. >> This was a little read ahead for tonight. Um, I apologize we didn't get this till the 9, so it didn't make the agenda. And I wanted to pass this off to everybody. You want to take a minute to

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go through that before we get on some of the other items here. Promised, but I would give it to you. Well, I agree. I didn't see her. back to >> this one.

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>> Yeah. Thank you. Sorry for the late addition everybody. It wasn't sent to the clerk so I apologize. >> No worries. >> I can tell Mr. I did it. Come on.

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Okay, we will continue our meeting with old items. Number 4, A, Central Business District Small Scale Comprehensive Plan

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Amendment. The smallcale comprehensive plan amendment and the mass resoning for the central business district were continued at our last meeting on May 21st. The future land use amendment includes three properties that are all associated

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with the former Miller Middle School property. Right now, they are currently designated public buildings and grounds and two of the parcels are proposed to be redesated to mixed use and one parcel is proposed to be partially redesated to mixed use with a portion remaining

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public buildings and grounds to preserve public access along the lakefront. Um the reason for that future land use amendment is to make that um the land use of that property compatible with the central business district zoning. Um and

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the map is up on the screen here for the proposed resoning. It includes 87 parcels within the downtown area. It's a total of 40.32 acres. The purpose of the central business district is to promote a more walkable

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mixeduse development pattern that fits the existing um traditional development that is there. As of now, we have had a total of 10 properties that were omitted through the opt out process. All of those optouts were submitted before our

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last meeting on May 21st. So, this map is the same as what we reviewed at our last meeting. Um and we had a couple of speakers at that spoke um at our last meeting as well. So at this meeting our questions for you

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um are regarding the map, whether you think there should be any modifications to the map, whether you think there should be any modifications to the proposed standards in the land development code, and what your recommendation may be.

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>> I have a question. What is the status of the historical ordinances? >> So the status right now is that we have a markup that came from um from Zev Cohen on the amended uh LDC that is now

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uh in the hands of our legal counsel. Um there was also some information that was given to us to forward to legal counsel which has taken place but that same information was not given to Mark because uh he had already done his work on that process. So was waiting for

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legal counsel to get back with Mr. Caret um on finalization information. >> Uh it came from uh the pen for the the peninsula historic the >> Franklin Peninsula Historic Society.

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>> I know of it. >> Yes, you yes. So that information was given to to the city attorney because Mark's process was already completed that of course they build us by the hour. So >> I didn't want to go back till the attorney has reviewed that information

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but Mark will be getting back in touch with that and I believe we're going to be bringing that back to to the body. >> Mark get the historical society's information after it's reviewed by the attorney. >> Yes sir. Right. The attorney is going to

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forward all that information back his comments. So Mark will get it after that at that point. >> Yeah. For efficiency. >> Yes. Yes, sir. And then we'll bring it back. Correct, Mark? We had to >> We'll then bring it to you guys as an amendment to the land development code. Yes. >> And when do you expect to do that?

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>> We were talking about it and I'm hoping that we can do it before August this year. >> Yeah. So that would put us on schedule to try to do it in July. >> In July. >> Correct. Correct. I like your smile when you do this. >> I haven't seen these changes yet.

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>> I don't know if there is this. >> Well, this is going to be no surprise as I stated last time. I I think they need to be done together this process. And I I I don't I think the quality of

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time to do them together um will create a better outcome for for all. I and I don't see a rush to hurry this through. Um and so um

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do you >> there are property owners who are waiting for this to go through. So there I got the >> and you know from my perspective you know that there are people there there are actual real estate transactions out

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there that are waiting for for this to occur. I would you know request that you guys make a decision tonight. If you don't feel like you have enough information or if you feel like the time is not right,

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I would suggest that you forward it with a recommendation of denial. Uh we'd like to take it forward to the uh city commission and present it to them and they you know they may feel

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like they want to take some time to look at it as well. I I do not know but that's what >> and we may have recommendations for you tax you to look at to bring back to >> yeah so you could certainly make a recommendation for modifications >> right >> you know as as well

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>> um how did this come about who who thought of this these changes to do this >> well I so let's go back to to last time when we redid the landomic code. We did

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a diagnostic report, right, of the strength and weaknesses of the what was the past LDC at that time. It was the current LDC. Uh so, and that also involved so it involved us

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reading the code. It also involved uh us doing some interviews with commission members and with the city manager. So out of that, you know, one of the the the biggest biggest weaknesses of what

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was the former code is that it didn't recognize the the commercial zoning didn't recognize the difference between what's going on in Central Avenue, this downtown area where you see buildings

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that are, you know, built, you know, to the property line in a sort of a traditional downtown that wasn't recognized in the former code. The code uh has had only the GC1 commercial district in

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it and that district is a uh you know autooriented suburban style commercial district that gives you a it regulates the building envelope.

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Uh and so it establishes uh the building envelope and it lets sort of access and parking kind of determine where the building is going to set. That's and you get that sort of result of that is that traditional

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strict commercial that you see on a lot of arterial roadways. And so as part of the new land own code, we developed the central business district zoning. Uh

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and and so this is a it's form conscious, right? It it regulates, you know, building placement, the scale, the design of the building. it these two zoning categories are basically

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deliver opposites in terms of what's real. So that's where it came from. It came out of the when we looked at the land and all the code initially uh we were going to do we were going to do the the map and the code at the same

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time. That was how it was all designed. What a good idea. >> Excuse me. >> What a good idea. >> It was a good idea. At at the last minute, the the former city manager I I think he

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felt like uh it it might have delayed the process a little bit, bring it forward, meaning that they would go together. But he thought he honestly he wanted to get the land on the code. He wanted to get the master plan done before he left. So he

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made a decision that let's separate these two so that the landl doesn't get delayed. >> And who was that? >> That was the city manager. >> Which one? >> Charles, >> right? >> Mr. R. >> Yeah.

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>> And this process has been taking place now for three, four years. is >> it's been until recently there hasn't been any progress. >> Well, former city manager Charles Rudd left,

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>> right? >> New interim city manager came in. One of my very first meetings with him was, "Okay, well, we now need to sort of pick this up. This these two things got separated." I told him my my sad story about you know how it wasn't you know we

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we we didn't get it completed and uh after talking about it for some time he said why don't you wait till there's a permanent city manager in place >> and so so we did

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>> jump on >> so and so one of the first conversations I've had with the new city manager was letting him know that there would you know this thing was out there. Thank you for explaining that. So I in hindsight it was a mistake not to continue to do them together in my opinion but anyway

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>> well my recommendation was to do them together. >> Yes. Yeah. So um does anyone else have >> comments on this whole thing? >> Yes. >> I have a bunch. >> Yeah.

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>> Whoever wrote this is spot on. I agree with everything that this person stated in here. This this is far too comprehensive to give it a car blanch. You know, I think I think if we if we approve this, we're going to open up

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Pandora's box to a lot of problems down the road. you know, he addresses in in this whoever that person was in this last minute letter that just passed out. He talks about parking and setbacks and all

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that. Now, if if you have a 10-ft setback, which is 10 foot off the setbacks occur, correct me if I'm wrong here, but you have the from the center of the road, you have a right away, okay? on both sides. Sometimes 50 ft,

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60, 100, depends on where you live. And then from that boundary of the center of the road, you're going to put in a sidewalk and you're going to put in buildings. Okay?

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So, in between there, you're going to put a 10 foot 10ft setback. So, you got 10 feet to work with. Then you got to put a sidewalk on there. That's another maybe six feet. >> The the the sidewalk typically is placed

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in the edge. It's placed within the rideway, right? If if we look right outside this window, you can see that there's a building that is placed directly on the property line, right? There's a >> so so the sidewalk >> the sidewalk is in in is in the right part of the private. It's a public improvement.

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>> Okay. But you still, you know, you have to think, >> you know, we went to a zoning meeting last Thursday. >> Yeah. >> Friday, >> Friday. >> Friday. Friday. >> Yeah. >> And I asked a lot of people about the setback issue. And some of the answers I

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got were, well, there's been a lot of rumors that if you use 10 foot setbacks, that'll encourage foot traffic. >> Well, I don't believe that. And and the thing is, okay, so you got you got building and

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what 10 feet to the to the edge of the sidewalk and you got three kids walking there and you got traffic going up and down the street. Okay. And your three kids are running around because they're excited about getting something, ice cream cone, something like that. I'd be

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fearful that they're going to run into the street. I mean that's that's a narrow pathway to have 10 foot set. I think 25 ft where it is now is much more appropriate. >> I I guess for me and I I went through it

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and I um trying to compare the um the map. So I guess the one question and this may be um a question that everybody probably knows the answer to. So when I look at the overlay and so the historic district

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so the the business district sits inside of the historic district, >> correct? >> Yes, that's correct. >> All right. For the most part for the most part. And so the those businesses that are that fall within the historic

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and the business district would benefit from both like CRA and historic potentially. >> Yes. So if you look at this map up here, I know it's a it might be a little hard to see, but the yellow um the yellow

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shading represents the core CRA. 81 of the 87 properties in the proposed resoning are in the core CRA. So, the majority of them are already in the CRA. Um, which comes with some grant opportunities as well as additional

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design standards, >> right? >> There are actually more design standards associated with the CRA and the historic district than with the central business district zoning itself, >> right? Um so there is you know some some working together there with these

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different overlays. So what is the greatest fear because I I remember I went back and looked at um past meetings and information and just trying to make sense of it all. And so it looks like the push is that most of

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the businesses that fall within the uh central business district rule to mixed use. >> Right. >> The the central business would allow that. Yes. >> Right. Okay. And so the the goal I'm

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assuming is to stim stimulate some type of economic growth and you know some more housing options and things of that nature. And I know that when we were going through the land development code, you know, they came in and kind of did a mockup of what it could look like. Um

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and I know we did have some um public meetings, you know, whether they were well attended or not. I know that we um did try. But one of the things that I do feel like um is true because there are pros and there are cons and um you know

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but whatever we decide to do um would we would have to you know look at smart growth and part of that is getting some community buy in and we did talk about that or they talked about that at the um the the workshop that we attended. And

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so I guess my question is, you know, just to understand what Dan was talking about and what Mark is saying, doing both at the same time would give us a clearer picture of

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>> we're talking about two different things, right? So because what Dan was saying is he he thinks we should look at the historic preservation ordinance in this at the same time. What I was saying is when we when we adopted the land development code

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u back in 2024 >> right >> I wanted to bring forward at the same time the map because so everything was was everybody it would have been fresh in everybody's mind what we're doing what the intent is you know a lot of what we've been doing through this process when we had the the large public

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meeting and then you know last month and again tonight is okay let's let's relive the history Right. And and so that if we had not waited a couple years might have been a little bit easier,

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right? >> A lot of the a lot of the properties in the the central business district proposed area, they're already developed >> and a lot of them do not meet the GC1 standards as it is today. A lot of the properties along Central Avenue do not

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have the amount of parking that's technically required by GC1. Some of them don't have any parking at all. >> So, let's say someone sells their property on Central Avenue and someone else comes in with a new use. If they want relief from the parking requirements, what they would have to do

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now is come through the variance process, go through the public hearing, um >> come visit us. >> Yes. Formally ask for that relief. The central business district would expedite that process by letting it be administrative. So they have more flexibility with the

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parking options, especially if there's on street parking available. >> It also reduces that that front setback that we've talked about. A lot of the buildings now, they're not 25 ft off the property line, so they don't meet that today. There are still some properties

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that even with the lesser lot size and even with the reduced setbacks would still be non-conforming. Um, but this would bring many of them actually into conformance. We would have less nonconformity than we do now with the the current commercial zoning.

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>> And that's what I understood when I read it is that most of the um businesses or buildings are existing. >> So that they're not, you know, we're not looking at constructing anything. it's like they're already there. They've already been utilized to some extent and

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things of that nature. So, I understood that piece. So, um I don't know if the public is is not sure of what that actually entails or what that looks like. And so, um, the other thing that

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was mentioned, they were talking about the city manager having this power to just do all the things that, uh, you know, but I do, and just correct me if I'm wrong. I know we are a small, >> you know, local government. So, we don't

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have, um, you know, so of course that responsibility if I'm not mistaken. Not that he's the one that just to implement whatever we are um, proposing. So it's not that he can just come and just say, am I correct that he can just do

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whatever he wants to do? >> No, he can't do just whatever he wants. But but as you know, some of the properties along Central Avenue, >> there is no ability to to really, you know, have

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parking on them, right? right? You know, so so it it it doesn't necessarily require a great deal of deliberation to to understand that you know maybe you should wave that that requirement. So that was the thought that this would be something that could be done in this

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straight. >> Okay? You know, but if you know, if that is a a change that that you know, if you guys want to do all those variances, you want them to bring the board if that would would if that would suffice to get a positive recommendation of of the

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>> you know, we could we could bring forward at the same time we bring it to the city commission, you could bring forward, we could strike that language. You know, that could be part of your recommendation. You know, you you could decide tonight, for example, that you want to forward this with a positive recommendation, but

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we recommend that the, you know, the city man the variances that would be issued by the city manager be struck. So, you know, there there's a number of different iterations you you could make if you were uncomfortable with that. >> I'm not uncomfortable with it. I was just clarifying because sometimes

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>> to hear it again how it's supposed to what the meaning behind it is, but you don't because like you stated, we talked about it a while ago. And I agree with what what you're saying to on to some extent the

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the fact is is that most of this is already built. >> And that was kind of the the what I was trying to say at the last meeting was that we have very few lots on Central Avenue that are going to be developed. We have the Miller school. We have the old Miller property

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on the corner over here. Uh we have something across from A's Hardware, you know, and we have something next to Scott down there. Um there's not a lot of vacant property that's going to be the building here. >> Yeah. So, um, when it comes to what

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we're talking about in this particular zone, >> and it it seems to me it makes sense that if you're if you have a bunch of buildings that are non-conforming, that if you can do a zoning process that

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brings them more conforming, it's going to make it easier for people when they have that business or they buy this business or build it or whatever to not have to go through the the costly

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process of doing that reszoning or going through the variance and those kinds of things. So, you talk about promoting business and bring it into town. You want to try to limit those costs as much as you can. And if you can do it with a with a zoning process that brings most

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of those buildings into compliance, if you will, it makes sense. Um if if you if you bring somebody into town that wants to bring a business here and you so I work in Valuchia County and I will tell you sometimes it is very hard to

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get through the process in Bush County. Put Putham County and Crescent City has been a lot easier for everything that I've done here to to get to get through the process. I think if we want to um continue in that way, I think I think

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the the process needs to be streamlined a little bit and this does that. The other thing is with the parking, we've always talked about the parking on Central Avenue as being a community parking, if you will, for all of Central Avenue. So, that's the way it is. That's the what what you're saying is true.

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There's there's not there's no off streetet parking, right? Unless we build some off- streetet parking, there's no off streetet parking. So to put into the zoning like the GC1 talks about parking spaces and handicap spots and those

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kinds of things. Um it's hard to develop that the way that it is now. you know, if somebody buys it and wants to change the use of it or wants to change the business there or something like that and they have to conform to some of these other stringent rules that are in

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the GC1, which is fine out at Save a Lot. GC1 out there is fine because you got a whole parking lot and you got a lot of room to work with, but when you're in your central business district down here, it's hard to do that. So, you have to use that community parking. You

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just have to. So to make it an administrative uh process is is kind of a no-brainer because there's no way that you can really add parking unless you do a project like a parking garage or a parking lot or you it a PUB that brings

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in a section of parking. So, um, the other thing I had to say is that that we looked at this before when we were looking at the land development code and when we were looking at the future, uh, plan for Crescent City. So, we've seen this before. This isn't the first time that we've seen this. We've seen this

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before. This is just the first time that we're making a recommendation for the count council to look at it. And it when we were talking about the things that we wanted and we're talking about foot traffic and we're talking about um those kinds of things, that's that's what we

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all decided we wanted when we were going through that process. That's was this is what we wanted and we voted for it. And and so what we're doing now is we're just more more making it official. And

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it just seems to me like it would be um I I think it would be beneficial myself. I think that um having a 25 foot setback on off the sidewalk is is not conducive necessarily that's conducive to parking

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in front of the building. It's not really conducive to to um people walking up and down the sidewalk. and and like we're looking at now, our sidewalks aren't going to get any bigger. These these buildings aren't be

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set back any farther. It's not like we're tearing down the whole city and building something brand new. It's it's already here. It's just a very small section of what is available to so >> I u I need clarification.

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So we have um let's talk about central we have existing structures u there that are businesses and uh you're right they're non-conforming but their grandfathered in.

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>> So uh they still have their their rights. Um >> yes they do. >> And so why would they need a variance if a new owner came in? Give me an example. Well, any expansion that they're going to, you

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know, we have had conversation with people about making some alteration of these buildings. Usually, it's almost impossible to to do that and need to >> expand the square foot to expand the square foot. The other thing though is, you know, if a building were to come down, >> it could not be built.

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You know, David, this building, for example, if if if for some reason this building that we're living across the street were to have to be demolished and and rebuilt under its current zoning, it could not be rebuilt to the same

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setback. It would have to be set back at least 25 ft off. >> Uh >> so you'd have to go through a variance process. >> There's some exceptions though there >> not in the current not in the current GC1. If a hurricane comes through, kicks

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down structure, don't you have the rights to rebuild it as is uh with the with the limited setbacks? You still you'd still have to meet the you have to meet so you couldn't rebuild it in the same location. Now you you get into this discussion about the extent to

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which it was destroyed, what percentage of destruction it was. And so, yes, if it was, you know, less than 50, you know, if it was only 49% destroyed, you could rebuild it. >> Yeah. >> You could rebuild on the same footwork.

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>> But if it was more than 49%, you can't. >> Is that what you're telling me? >> Yeah. >> That changed, didn't it? I had this situation 20 years ago and uh it wasn't that severe in the state of Florida. I think that sense if it was a

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flood plan management ordinance for disasters and usually the property value is how they determine >> so if more than half of the property value >> if you have that much

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I've dealt with that in the past but this this over overrode that >> where 30 years ago >> was down in Broward County >> yeah it might have been might have been local or they might have suspended it because

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a lot of jurisdictions do have these same regulations. But in in disasters if they're sort of broadly based sometimes they >> this wasn't the within the the township or city it was it was a broader >> you know I thought it was the state

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anyways. Thanks. Um and um so I I certainly like the idea I think everyone does about walkability.

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Um but um but how do we address the the the parking issue? Uh I mean now we have great vacancy with our retail on on 17 on on on central and um and it has been

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for some time. Um but if this were to be successful, let's say central alone, um where would people park? >> If everything was built out, you know, everything was regular. >> They they would park on the street,

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right? I I mean I hope you get to the point that parking becomes a great problem >> and you know at that point you you know this the the redevelopment district the city will have to come up you know if if people say they're not coming to

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to what at this point would be a much more successful downtown than you currently have where it becomes a real problem if people then start saying well I'm not going to the downtown because I can't park the town is going to have to you know So he's going to have to find some parking and build central parking

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as you know this this is what happens at the land in Smyrna it you know yes if you're a very successful downtown you you know 15 years from now people may be complaining about parking

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>> well and so Mark what what it will do is it will push parking into the residential areas >> it it'll it'll ire that would be the first step >> when it's successful because there's no

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other solution uh if if central was full and as as we can see from the previous map uh you know the uh central is a narrow corridor of commercial uh it's surrounded by uh residential

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um the the next question I have is that uh in the language it uh it only allows uh residential on the second floor. Um why eliminate the first floor?

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>> The reason for for n on on the first floor again is to create a a what they would call a fine grain commercial district. That's why you you have limited building sizes. The idea is

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that you know res you want people to walk down the street. What makes somebody walk down a commercial street is that every so many feet they're looking at a new storefront, >> right? So I understand that. >> So So that's that's the that's the

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reason somebody wants an apartment in the back. Who cares? >> Well, some of them have the businesses all the way around you. >> Yeah. So, so that would you know that that was some of the discussion as to well we'll just make different you know

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again we're visioning a a a future where not only is uh the uh not only is the the main frontage of central a a a interesting commercial area but the there might be you know

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commercial along the side streets as well. So again it's the same idea. So just D choice I make um if in that scenario that is where we would come into play right that they could get a variance for having an apartment on first floor or would they

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>> well see that would be a use or I I think looking ahead we do have somebody who's who wants to come forward uh and propose that I think what will happen is that'll be done as a

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planned district and be coming forward to you, you know, so you will look at those individually. It just won't be a barness process. But >> but that's but just think about what um think about that. So if someone have a business on the bottom

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floor, their back door to their business is normally going out that back door. Well, uh, in some regards, >> you know, so, >> but, uh, sometimes there's not access

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the back and it's it's perfect for an apartment and, um, there's there's a lot, >> but I would say, >> you know, that you're comparing two different zoning districts and so there, you know, at some, you know,

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you have to decide what's most appropriate zoning. you know, >> for that situation, >> for that district, the the GC1 clearly there's a a very big mismatch between GC1 and the current development. There

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are some areas of the the new zoning and I know there will be we'll tweak that, you know, over time. You know there's there's this whole sort of process of you know you you develop a policy you apply it

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gets stress test by cases and situations and then you amend it but it's a normal process. We're never going to come up with a district that is going to that we're going to perfectly anticipate you know all future needs and

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>> unless we take the time to make it happen. >> Yeah. Well, >> still. >> So, let me give you another scenario. So, uh that was not central. So, if I'm on 17 and I, uh I have a business and I want to live in

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that business and the structure is only one story. Um this prevents it. Correct. >> Yes. In that area though, obviously in this area. >> Yeah. I

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um yeah I I question the wisdom of that. Um I could see it more on on central perhaps but >> well again that could be something that could be changed in in the zoning district

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where these the rules on this street elsewhere in the district it you know you can have problems. And I say that because retail is very difficult as we all know. Retail is closing down um a a lot.

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There's been a you know storefrontage uh has closed up um >> um again >> what' you say >> they're really on the comeback they have stores. So yes, but what's

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attractive is that somebody living where they where they're stored. So having a having a housing unit and then having your storefront makes it work, makes it very affordable or successful. Um

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>> so so Dan, are you are you talking about I mean because we can come up with a lot of different scenarios. When I think of mixed use making multi making multiple uses of limited space. So if I think of mixed use like if like in Palaka of

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Ter's building is would be considered mixed use because he has apartments up top and he has his law office on the bottom but then there's an entryway stairway coming from the back up. Right. So I'm not sure if I'm understanding what you are talking about. Like if it's

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not that then I don't see where we would be considering like making an apartment there. I mean you know so you look at the space and you take it one by one. I don't know if you're looking at just trying to come up with all the different

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scenarios. So when I think of mixed youth, that's what I would think of. You know, you look at areas like Savannah or things like that where a lot of the storefronts have apartments, condos or what have you. You have loss above the businesses and that is a growing trend.

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So, I'm not sure that >> and we we have people that want to speak, but I I agree in a city, but I with Crescent City, even though it's Crescent City, I think of this as a village and in uh villages,

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um it is common to to have a business, an apartment on the first floor. And uh it really makes it unique and to have um um and I like uh individuals own stores,

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you know, familyowned and operated rather than a chain. I think it makes it a property unique. And if you go to any resort town, uh, which I've lived in all my life being, you know, former resort

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guy, um, that's what makes it special. And so I don't want to take that away from what we have here, what we've always had, Crescent City. That's really my main motivation. >> So is what you're asking, I mean, but can that be done that consideration if

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it is designated mixed use? what can be done the way however we write it >> it can and I want to add this I think this is important just some people learn and see it on paper like this and some people visually kind

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of have a concept this is setting us up for comparison to like a mount dora >> picture Mount Dora the way you have the businesses downstairs you have lots you have apartments upstairs you have different mixed use you buildings that are, you know, they did this long time

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ago. They set it up. Now they have success. They have attracted people to come in. Right now with what we have, we may have beautiful God's gift of beautiful lakes that are underleveraged. But don't kid yourself. People see this area right now. We are at the very

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beginning of something happening here. I promise you, it's coming. No matter what we do, we have to properly plan for it. We can write it. Just like Mr. Dodge said, "We can make alterations to this, but we have to do something. We have to do something to guide the community to

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accept the new businesses and new families and people coming in the way we have it built right now. It will stay like this forever and we will not grow. The city will not add its tax base. It will not be able to add better services, better infrastructure. This is a bigger

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picture to add new services, new business, build a tax base, have better infrastructure, bring better water, better streets, better drainage down at the lake end, all of the things that we need. This is the start of that. So, I just want to put that picture out there for you all to think about. Um, I'm, you

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know, very happy with the way Mark's put the work together. I've read through it. I know what the previous city manager had intended. I came on and told him from the very beginning, I'm not coming to change any of that. If there changes come, it comes from the group. I'm here

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supportive. I'm going to give you my idea of it. When I see this, I'm thinking of what we can do, what Mount Dora did, what other cities like that have done. That's my my two cents on that. >> Well, I think that was a very funny speech, but I think you overstate the

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reality. just point out and I I appalled your been through you know your joy for it but however um I um and Mountor certainly is is a uh is a fine example

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and the anchor there is the Lakeside Hotel. Yes. >> Which really began it. >> Yes. Yeah. And uh um but these communities started they all started as a village and then they grew

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it and grew. Um it was then that premise that seaside in the panhandle started with store family stores on the first floor and apartments on the second floor or back. And um and I think as most of you

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probably know that expanded to other communities with in that area in the panhandle certainly Rosemary Beach is one and and many others now because I think it's been almost 40 years hasn't marked >> since 200.

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>> Yeah. Exactly. So um anyway know I understand exactly what Dan is saying. I don't think there is an issue with I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't I don't think there's an issue with

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recommending that to the to the city commission when they >> um as a as a as a as a modification. >> We could modify it before presentation. >> I don't see or or you could even add an AU to it. You could add an accessory

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dwelling unit to it. That would be could be a small structure that's that's livable. You could add that. Now, Central Avenue, probably not, >> but over here, like if you bought the old guitar store over here, he used to live in there, >> but I'm not sure that that was the way

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it's supposed to be. >> So, yeah, the old music store. >> So, >> we have the new owner here right now. >> Oh, you do? You're the new owner. >> He used to live in the back there. So, >> yeah.

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Shower. Yeah. But to have the in this kind of area here, I mean that that's not a stretch. >> Yeah. >> You know, that's not a stretch at all. >> Thank you. >> And I I think that your point earlier was that we need to encourage

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investment. >> Yes, sir. >> And people come here. >> Yes, sir. >> But uh I I also uh you'll be say village >> and I think that's very important that we um we don't want to be it's a community. That's right. more community

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than just yeah I agree with Griffith show all over again right >> we know this public comment on this >> yes that's yes thank you >> um at this time >> Alice McCoy I live at 315 North Summit Street which is on Route 17

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I I can tell you I would not have purchased the building that I did four years ago here in Crescent City to put my business in if I couldn't have lived there. I live there. Part of the building is my business. Part of the

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building is homesteaded as my home. I think it's very shortsighted to limit it so much. This is this is Crescent City. How many twostory buildings do we have that people would buy and restore if

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they couldn't live in them the way and have their businesses and not have such restriction? So I think it's very shortsighted to limit that so much that you specifically say that you can't have residence on the

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first floor. So, I don't know if there's any way that you can alter as you go, you know, as we do this, alter that particular clause, but I'm telling you, there's a lot of businesses in town. My next door neighbor has a

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beauty shop and she lives in part of it and she has a very active beauty shop. Um, there's several businesses like that and I just think it's very shortsighted. I certainly would have put my life savings in this building and restoring

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it. I spent a lot of money on it and I would not have done that had I had moved to a town that had such restrictions. >> And and you're right and there is an example that we can choices over here is an example because there's

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an apartment up above. She had her her hair hair salon in the bottom and there's an apartment out back. It's like an ADU that's >> they're restoring it to the rest of the live and they actually >> that's kind of what

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>> that's exactly what just so they know Mark if I can I'll have Mark answer that that's actually a very um that's a unicorn over there. So I'll let Mark >> So I mean we just talked about the short that doesn't conform to the the current

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zoning >> at all or the future zoning >> you know or or the future. So that that is something that could be addressed. But you know, I think you you guys to look at what's the current zoning, which is the GC1.

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Is that appropriate for this portion of the city that you see on the map that we're proposing to resoning? I think the the answer is pretty clear. No. the the central business district just presented

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I think is much more appropriate for that area. Now there are tweaks that can be made. So if you would make a recommendation to forward it with those changes we will you know this will go to the commission. It'll take another, you

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know, so if if they do approve in a first reading for another month, at that point, we will be, you know, we will bring forward to you guys at next month's meeting changes to the central business district. >> Yeah. And I and I want to add to that that um I think it was probably less

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than a month um that I came into my tenure here that we had a meeting about this and this came up to the commission because this was already heard. enjoy scene. Um, and the first thing I had said was, well, we need to allow living

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on the bottom. That was my first behind the behind behind behind behind the business. That was my first idea. So, I I respect what you're saying there, Miss Alice. I appreciate that. It was met with >> slight hostility. It did not go well and and we had a lot of people in here. It

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was a 50-50 deal. We can change it and we can go back like Mark said. Um it's this board's recommendation to do any of that. Um listening to the public, we can do any of those things. Ultimately, the the commission is going to have the last say

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and decision. And um again, we just have to set the set the tone for success, whatever that is. >> So would that be because currently it's GC1. So would that be mixeduse with the stipulation that living can be on the bottom? Is

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that >> right? Yeah, we GC1 doesn't currently allow for the residential level at all, right? It's a commercial district. >> Uh so yes, we we could certainly

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change the central business district so that it will allow, you know, ground floor residential, you know, behind, you know, the storefront >> as an addition to the business, not as a

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uh primary. >> Correct. Yeah. Yeah. >> Here here's the other thought of it and this was brought up and my memory was jogged. I know that that the discussion was that if you did allow it and there were stipulations on that living space. You want the business to come in. Someone can have a good idea of having a

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business and then they're living back there. Something happens in the business, the business shuts down. Maybe they rent it, maybe they don't. But we could have where there are vacant openings for businesses and you have people living in the back and now there

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there's no storefront. So it looks like what we have currently in some of our buildings but people are allowed to live in the back. So there's pros and cons to think about it. I think the existing business owners and the existing businesses that are here um we need to

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accommodate as well as possible and get the word out and really explain. And I think I think Zeb Cohen's done the best job they can. I think the city can do a better job of forecasting that sending that message out. Um, but to inform them the best we can. We we put some fact

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sheets together on this. Um, and I think I think we can tune in a little bit better so people have a better understanding moving forward. This is a good thing. It really is a good thing. >> It's not a question of it's whether or not it's >> Yes. We're tweeting and giving you our

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input on how we can be much better. >> That's right. I agree. I agree. >> And I think you run into that situation no matter what. If you have a ride on the second floor, right? >> And it's not an unusual situation for a village, >> right? >> You know, so it's it's nothing new and

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and I think we all believe this is going to be successful. So the demand will be there and the whole effort is so that there's less vacancy. Correct. >> Because of increased demand. You want to

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>> Oh, I'm sorry. It was Go ahead, sir. >> I'm Frank Murray. I live at uh 505 North Lake Street. Uh I just uh wanted y'all to take into consideration that some people are handicapped and would not be able to make it into a second floor

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without serious money for elevators or some other type of lift to get up. uh maybe a consideration could be made to uh say no more than 25 or 30% of the floor space on the main level uh can be used for residential. Uh maybe you know

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those could be some considerations. I hear Derek too about the fact that uh what do you do when a store closes down? Well, I think it could be a stipulation of the properties that you have to maintain a business there in order to live there. uh that way you doesn't turn

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into a residential housing with empty storefronts. Uh these are just suggestions. I've I've uh been involved with planning and zoning in other uh areas. We're rather new to the uh Crescent City two and a half years. Uh so this is things that I have seen done

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uh in other areas that were facing these same issues especially with older properties that were already uh inhabited uh with stores. Uh and uh just to jump over to a little something else in regards to sidewalks, uh I think uh

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sidewalk setbacks are great. Uh we should have at least an 18 to 24 inch beauty strip between the curb and the sidewalks wherever is possible. Uh therefore, it keeps people from uh falling out into the street. Uh it's not just a matter of children running out

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into the street, but it's also when people lose their step. Uh, and we have an older community here, uh, older than many of the other areas, uh, in Florida as well, unless you're in the villages. But, uh, but so I would, if y'all would take those items into consideration. Thank you.

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>> Thank you. Thank you. >> I also uh um on setbacks, I um I have some concern um and and let me share with you. So if you uh Delray was

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a dead at night, nobody was there and and today it's turned around tremendously. >> Um with interesting shops, restaurants and the activities on the street that uh

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you know uh people love uh having tables along the sidewalk. >> Yeah. So, I don't think I think that's important for us that uh we're in Florida, people like to be outside and they they like to watch watch people

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pass by and so forth. But that's proven to be a successful formula. So, I don't think that uh I'm a little I'm a little concerned about the uh limiting the sidewalk uh setbacks uh especially on 17

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um just because of the traffic load, the multi-lanes uh and um and people tend to speed on 17. So, uh that's a concern I have.

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Um um Mark I have a question um on one on section um get to it but well let me say it's section six it says the ordinance should not be codified in the city code

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what is the meaning of that I'm sorry this ordinance should not be uh codified in the city code. >> Oh, >> are you talking about the future land use map, >> right? >> Ordinance. Yeah. So, so

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the does a change is a map change, right? So, it doesn't get codified in the same way a zoning ordinance would. It is basically just the the format

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with how the ordinance is placed into either landown code or the town's code of ordinances. So almost all municipal ordinances are either going to be non-codified or codified. So, if we were

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to change a map that's non-quatified, if you're okay, >> you'd have a copy of the map in the in the ordinance as well. >> Okay. >> 25. I think at the beginning you said that if the properties had opted out,

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can you know those addresses? >> What? I didn't hear you. Mayor, >> at the beginning they said that a few of the properties had opted out of the central business district. I just wanted to know about addresses.

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>> Rebecca, you have that information, correct? >> I did. It's an Excel file. Well, I can show you on the map. So now we've lost signal. Maybe you could just read them. >> I think some of my uh

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features of are disabled without the office. Uh I want to add a question. Can I ask you a clarifying class? >> Sure. >> So, our our goal hopefully tonight is to

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do two things. to um approve or not approve the changing of some properties from G from um that with their current designation >> to

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um mixuse. That's one of >> there's a few properties that that were realigning the the correct >> comprehensive plan. So those are going from public to mixed use. >> Right. >> Right. So So

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>> that's the one thing. >> That's that's the first one. >> Okay. And then the second one is just to um the reszoning of uh the central business district

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to um include those areas. the the the properties that are on on the map that >> I can one's opted out on the map and then I can follow up with an email with the list. >> Um

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>> she say she can show you >> I can show you on the map and then I'll email you the list. I'm not able to pull it up on screen for some reason. So, um we had a residential property here that opted out and then we had um a number of

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properties here, here, and here that opted out. And this property opted out as well. >> So, the one in red, those are the ones that opted out. Um

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>> the one this one opted out this property opted out these two properties. >> So they're they're saying GC1 >> GC1. >> Yes. >> And then there was >> there was res >> we have this parcel that's a residential

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property south. They opted out as well. >> I opted out and I'm still gray. Did you submit your form email via email or drop it off at city hall? >> I sent it registered mail and I got a response from city hall and they sent it

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to you guys and I got a response from you that you received it. >> Okay. >> We will make sure it's >> we'll make sure that >> what address is it? Could you just for the record what what address? >> 25 South Lake Street

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>> 25 South Lake. I have >> good now. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> I have a question on the uh historical school res school and so

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um The change doesn't include the five. >> Excuse me. >> Sorry. That's right. >> The change doesn't include the 5 acre parcel.

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Cypress, >> the southern portion of it was taken out. Yeah. At one point it included all the school property. >> Why take it out? >> Because we were asked to do so by the city manager. Well, let me tell you, um that's a

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perfect spot for a hotel and um it really could benefit the community. Um it's on it's on the water, it's got the acreage, uh you've got the

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school next door. Uh so I mean >> but the the thought was to leave it in its current zoning just because we're not in control of the property and there's deals if you will going on however it may be sold and figure that they could come

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>> come back >> come back and and get it reszoneed and pay for that and do that themselves. >> Why not make it more marketable by changing the zoning? >> Well, we don't own it. We don't have to. We can't. I mean, yeah. City doesn't own

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the property. >> No, I know. We didn't go ahead and sell it, >> but make it more sell it. We're talking about a zoning change in which we make. One was a boat ramp, right? >> The one blue section is the

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>> further down. That's the the city of boat ramp area. >> Yeah. Right. The the boat ramp right here, >> right? Yeah. I was thinking of this talking about this. >> Yeah. Yeah, I'll talk about >> So that's that that was the original thought. I mean, if there's another

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thought, then that's okay. I just I didn't want to convolute the situation. I figured we'd leave it as as public facilities and if and if it was purchased um then they could make recommendation to this board what they want to do with it.

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Well, you can see my point that it was changed be much more >> would it be >> attractive then >> would CV cover if they were to do either a hotel or if they were to do um not single family but I know that somebody was talking about doing multif family um

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structures there would that be covered or is that under a different would they need to change that zoning >> they could do a bed and breakfast that would be permitted >> yeah like a boutique you know it's really called boutique hotel. Somebody want to do something took the entire

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property want to do a hotel, >> right? >> We probably look at they they probably want pretty, you know, probably much more tents than than we currently have. We probably PD the thing. >> Yeah, that's what I was That was the only thought. >> What are you talking about putting a

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hotel? If someone were to purchase the property that's the five or four acres down there south of the school on east side on lake >> the soccer field or whatever it used to be whether we take >> So that was my thought was they could come in because they someone may purchase it and want to build multif

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family living there's not going to work for that >> so that be like and and they would need to come in they would need to pay the services for the city to do that bring it to >> yeah and you would want to know what that that is and be a part of that. So

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that that's why I took it out. >> Central business does promote more smaller scale development. So something of that scale would >> that would be considered more of a larger scale. >> So that would be more a plan. >> You know what have obviously it's not being used by the school board. So then

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that just becomes a holding category. If anybody comes in they're going to have to ask. >> And let me explain that bed and breakfast wouldn't meet the demands that the city needs. >> Understood. in hotel rooms. I mean, you need at least 40, 60. And then there's the feasibility, you know, financially.

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How many rooms does it take to, you know, to make it work? >> But both the Yeah, it's just off 17. >> Um the access to the to the water. Um, and

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then also, uh, if, um, if you're doing commercial business, you you've got a 400 room theater, you've got a gymnasium that you do exhibits on or, uh, events, um, banquetss, you've got breakout

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rooms. So, it it meets all the, uh, square footage of a convention that a convention hotel would need. um without building it >> then you you can rent it out if that is something in the future that happens of

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course >> but anyways I just wanted to share those thoughts. Uh so can we get back to um the uh the setbacks along um 17 and uh I I have concerns uh about them.

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Um let me go back to the map and see. >> Can I ask a question? Yeah, of course. >> Okay. I know we we've had a lot of conversations, some good conversations. So, when we were when we're talking about setbacks,

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um that's in that central business district which is which Summit goes through. Correct. >> Yes. So where where what what is falling

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along 17? I guess in an effort to kind of land the plane because I'm I'm so black and white. I when I look at this map and so that the current zoning map is like what's in red is what the current zoning is which is general commercial. We want to go

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um to the proposed which is changing those zone those zoning to multi-use. Correct. That's our one of our goals for today. Correct. >> Mixed use. >> Mix. Yeah. Mixed use. I'm sorry. All

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right. And so when we when we're talking about setbacks, we're talking about the concern of the of the committee is that the setbacks that's going through Summit needs to be a little larger. Is that our one recommendation?

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>> And let me leave off your question which is excellent. Um, >> yeah, go ahead. >> Yeah. Um, we're only dealing with the gray areas on the map, >> right? >> Blue gray. >> Yes.

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>> Oh, it's blue. Blue and gray. >> I see. So, >> whatever you call that that that color. >> If you don't like the color, we can change it. >> So, >> okay. So, we're talking about the block between on on Sun, we're talking about

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the block between Lemon and and Myrtle, right? Uh actually up to Cypress because there's blue there and then just a little between uh just south of Edward, right? >> I don't know.

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This is the map >> with the property. Yeah. Okay. Is >> that Yeah. in the show. >> Yeah. Maybe those two. Yeah. Um

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so anyways, um that's uh Did you see that Kim? >> Yes. That's why I was asking just what our goal is because I know we talked about a lot of different things. And so when I look at our old items, what I was understanding is that we're going from,

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if you will, red to blue gray as far as zoning general uh commercial to uh mix use and changing. Um so that was one of the

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things that we were talking about. And so my question was because when I looked at um item B and it was just saying that that prop the proposed resonant is intended to support a walkable mixeduse downtown environment through reduced

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setback requirements. flexible mixeduse development standards and incentives for pedestrianoriented businesses such as the cafes, the restaurants, the galleries, specialty retail shops and second story residential uses which is

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what when we were you know early on talking when we had the workshop that was the vision for that downtown area. So that is what we that's what's being proposed and that's what they're asking us to vote on. And so I'm asking because

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we've had a lot of conversation in that that is being proposed. What I was hearing a lot about was the reduced setback requirements. Is that what the concern was for us pre

452
02:14:39.360 --> 02:14:59.599
preventing us from voting on mask? Well, u let me let me ask what would be the setback on on 17 the proposed setback. >> 10 ft. >> 10 ft. Yes.

453
02:14:59.599 --> 02:15:17.199
>> 10 ft. >> 10 ft >> from the property line. >> From the property line, right? Because that's a state rideway, so it's fairly be fairly wide in a lot of places. Do >> you see it? That's an idea. Look outside the street.

454
02:15:17.199 --> 02:15:32.560
That's an idea. >> Oh, yeah. That's what I'm concerned about. >> So, if you think about what So, so the building would be set closer to the to the road, 10 ft off of it, right? And the idea is to force the parking behind

455
02:15:32.560 --> 02:15:50.320
it. So this area redeveloped you don't you get away from the pattern of you know street parking building >> like a lot in St. Augustine now like in and also it's behind the building. So

456
02:15:50.320 --> 02:16:06.239
Dan, that building across the street there, that would be the sidewalk. And then that building's built on the property line. >> Well, right. >> So it' be back 10 ft from there roughly. >> What's the requirement of the current code?

457
02:16:06.239 --> 02:16:24.239
>> 2025. >> 25. >> Uhhuh. when they come through with four laning mark whatever that may be will the rightway increase by which >> uh

458
02:16:24.239 --> 02:16:41.040
they will yeah then you know if they ever do this they'll have to acquire additional highway >> so it it will probably >> I personally

459
02:16:41.040 --> 02:16:57.120
I I think if if you give them more setback, there's more likely that they will widen this road. If you give them less setback, they don't like to buy buildings. They don't like to buy buildings like that. They like to buy

460
02:16:57.120 --> 02:17:14.000
they like to buy land that has no structures in it. >> Uh what about a historical building? Do they shy away from >> They do shy away from Yes. Yeah. They

461
02:17:14.000 --> 02:17:32.880
don't like to touch historic buildings. >> Thank you. >> Yeah. >> Cameron, how do you feel about that temp? Um >> well just in reading when you um look at

462
02:17:32.880 --> 02:17:50.479
the mix zoning that was within the definition from what I understood you know to encourage pedestrian walking and making more more use out of limited space. So I was just trying to see if I was thinking the

463
02:17:50.479 --> 02:18:05.280
right way or not. So that was in my question. I was just trying to clarify. So, I mean, I understood when I react, you know, you know, we can look at the figures, but you have to think about how am I going to feel

464
02:18:05.280 --> 02:18:22.800
when I'm walking down the sidewalk that has a 10 foot setback? I mean, how how am I going to feel? Is that going to feel inviting to me? It's going to feel like it's kind of squished in crowd. And if restaurant, you mentioned restaurants wanting to have outside seating,

465
02:18:22.800 --> 02:18:37.760
>> that will never happen. >> Well, they don't have to. They don't have to build it 10 feet. They could build it farther back, right? If they want to put a >> uh it depends what area, right? In some areas there's a bill too on like on

466
02:18:37.760 --> 02:18:52.800
central they're required to build to build two. >> Um elsewhere it's just a reduced setback that they could they could build. But but to answer your question, I think you

467
02:18:52.800 --> 02:19:09.359
know, think about where you see active pedestrian uh commercial areas. It's not along wide boulevards with, you know, Windixie or public set way back in the road. People don't

468
02:19:09.359 --> 02:19:24.960
typically walk down those streets. people walk down streets where there are shops adjacent to them and easily I think you're thinking about two different things like where do you feel where do you feel comfortable going for

469
02:19:24.960 --> 02:19:41.040
a walk for exercise or maybe you feel comfortable doing that in an area that's wider and more green space where do you feel like walking going shopping it's where the buildings are built up to the road

470
02:19:41.040 --> 02:19:55.520
So >> Mark, I agree with you. Particularly our two-lane road, Lake Central, but a throwway like 17. I don't even like crossing 17. >> Yeah. >> Now um

471
02:19:55.520 --> 02:20:10.800
uh so I um I don't quite get I understand what I'm trying to achieve. I just don't know if it's realistic on 17. >> Okay. So that would be you know again if

472
02:20:10.800 --> 02:20:28.399
you wanted to change the setback um you know obviously we have a certain area where there is already development that's right on the road. >> Oh yes. Yeah. >> Right. So if there's areas where you

473
02:20:28.399 --> 02:20:45.120
would like to change that, you know, we certainly can, you know, or or you know, I mean, do you you know, for example, if you were decide that the area south of Myrtle

474
02:20:45.120 --> 02:21:02.800
should remain GC1, you know, at this point, we we're just looking for, you know, a recommendation and decision. >> Well, and that I was just thinking of on 17 maybe the setback should be greater than

475
02:21:02.800 --> 02:21:19.720
10. That that's really >> how how much do you think? >> Um well, I'd like to hear from others whether they think that corridor should be a wider setback. >> I think part of it is a lot of it is just like searching a lot of it's already built

476
02:21:22.160 --> 02:21:38.240
>> now. Will this affect if this goes in effect? So you have Well, no it wouldn't the fish camp and then it would for the out parcel. So >> it would go that far up. >> It doesn't go that far. All right. All right. Other than that, I'm not 100%

477
02:21:38.240 --> 02:21:54.240
sure how much more new building is going to take place on 17. >> Central, we know a couple of the open spaces, but 17's pretty tight. >> It's pretty tight. >> Just come to the cross. Okay.

478
02:21:54.479 --> 02:22:11.280
Okay, >> I'll call you to go with >> I don't like that street either. >> I wish I wish they'd reduce the speed a little bit >> and put traffic in homing devices and we're we're talking to the DOT about it right now.

479
02:22:11.280 --> 02:22:28.600
>> So that Yes. Yeah, that's great. Yeah. and and maybe u a better sheriff's increased sheriff's uh presence. So, um,

480
02:22:29.920 --> 02:22:47.880
oh, last I want to talk about our city manager. Oh, no. No offense, uh, at all because I I think highly of him, but I don't want to overburden the administration of this.

481
02:22:49.600 --> 02:23:06.640
>> Okay. Are you talking about something? Yeah. Okay. >> Yeah. Yeah. The proposal is that the city manager uh have uh bride authority to wave or override development and uh I I prefer it be with

482
02:23:06.640 --> 02:23:26.560
us now and after experiencing it we may say hey we don't want this give it back to anyways that's my view. Well, I know in in the past um it is

483
02:23:26.560 --> 02:23:42.319
>> just like it's a recommendation made shared and then we just work from there. >> I don't know that we're going to have >> as soon as we pass this that there's going to be 50 projects that are going to fire off.

484
02:23:42.319 --> 02:24:01.520
>> So, I'm not sure that >> our city manager is going to be overwhelmed right away. Incredible. >> He has an assistant, >> but it gives us a purpose if we could recog we are the advisory, >> right? We're the advisor.

485
02:24:01.520 --> 02:24:17.040
>> And so, >> but you won't need to come to us. >> I still have to go to my commission. >> Yeah. >> And I run everything by the commission. I don't like to act without team. So, >> but we could still act as a buffer

486
02:24:17.040 --> 02:24:34.080
before it gets to the >> I personally don't have a problem. Whatever you all want to do. I'm okay. Make the advice and we'll take it to the commission. >> I mean, that's how we've always done. >> It comes to us, we discuss, and then the

487
02:24:34.080 --> 02:24:50.240
recommendation is made for the council >> and and not that anything's rushed. Um, one one point to make, and I understand um what Mr. Dodge is saying and I don't disagree with that. I mean I believe that having you all as a buffer is very important. There are situations though

488
02:24:50.240 --> 02:25:06.240
that um time is of the essence and investors and people and different things. So I but I understand but there is there is another piece to it where having the leeway to make decisions running them by

489
02:25:06.240 --> 02:25:21.760
the commission of course I run everything by the commission is important. Um, I don't think that we're going to have it blast off right away, but it's coming. Whether it's me as a city manager or somebody else, you do want to make sure that you have your your toes in the sand with them. I think

490
02:25:21.760 --> 02:25:38.800
it's important. Um, >> and if there's some hot issue, you can always call us in a special meeting. >> 100%. >> Yeah, >> 100%. And and and if it's me, I can guarantee that's going to happen. >> Okay. I can't guarantee with somebody else. So if we want teeth in it to have

491
02:25:38.800 --> 02:25:59.600
a little bit more oversight, then I would make that recommendation to the commission. >> You don't think you're going to change 20, 30 years. >> All right. Okay. Where are we in the process? >> Can I just make a comment before we commit to anything here? I I find this

492
02:25:59.600 --> 02:26:15.439
whole package overwhelming. I mean this there this a lot of good things and there's a lot of things that not so good you know just like you mentioned u only being able to live on the second floor

493
02:26:15.439 --> 02:26:29.920
where in this community it'd be advantageous for people to live on the first portion of business and then I agree with I agree with I don't see 50 or 75 people as soon as

494
02:26:29.920 --> 02:26:44.880
>> so just remember the current code says >> it says nobody can live >> right >> so this what's in the code now if you apply it it'll be second floor >> and then it can be tweaked but but

495
02:26:44.880 --> 02:27:01.920
what's allowed now not >> and the other thing if you have if you have businesses coming in and you have people that are coming to us saying this is what I looking for you can always make those changes yeah those changes can be made

496
02:27:01.920 --> 02:27:17.439
in in the in this issue. I think it's important that we add the first door. >> Okay. >> I I agree. >> It makes it more anyway. We'll see what happens.

497
02:27:17.439 --> 02:27:33.680
>> Yeah. I just I just want to be clear again. That's exactly what I had stated from the very beginning and I ran into a very solid wall on it. And >> you still might run into a solid wall. >> I'm just letting you know. Now you have our backing. >> There you go.

498
02:27:33.680 --> 02:27:48.880
>> That's what we're here for. >> What do you guys think about the the first floor >> living? >> What? >> The first >> the first living behind the business allowing first. >> Yeah. And what Mr. Murray um proposed if

499
02:27:48.880 --> 02:28:03.600
you are not >> running a business you can't live there. >> Um I I really like that because that's we want to showcase if it's here. So that was a a great

500
02:28:03.600 --> 02:28:19.600
idea. >> Ask you a feeble question here. I told you I'm overwhelmed with Is is there any way that we could have this presented in segments so that we could deal with living in businesses, you know, living

501
02:28:19.600 --> 02:28:37.680
with your business or let's deal with just setbacks and then talk all about setbacks and we'll come to a decision on setbacks. I mean you do understand that we this is already the C1 is already in the >> code when we did all those workshops for

502
02:28:37.680 --> 02:28:54.960
>> but what he's saying is we can the goal back to my the goal of what we're doing is to go from GC1 so that we can make some changes correct well we can have any limitations right now this GC1 right

503
02:28:54.960 --> 02:29:11.359
now is more limiting very much so >> than what is being proposed today. >> Very much so. >> And if so, I guess if we are adopting the proposed zoning map today, the way the code is written goes into effect the

504
02:29:11.359 --> 02:29:27.200
way it is written. >> Correct. >> So assuming >> assuming council Yeah. Right. But if we want to make those changes, we can say we want to adopt the proposed zoning map with the following

505
02:29:27.200 --> 02:29:42.800
>> um recommendations. >> Recommendations. >> Is that what we can do today? Is this the do that? >> Yes. >> Okay. So, we got to do we need to list those recommendations that >> Yeah. You have to tell me if you want to because what we will do is we'll bring this forward.

506
02:29:42.800 --> 02:29:59.200
>> We'll also then bring to you changes. It'll get to the council probably between first, let's assume they approve it a first reading. If we bring you guys next month, probably between first and second reading, they will, you know, might be

507
02:29:59.200 --> 02:30:14.479
able to see those, you know, actually in text form, but >> it will also have been explained to them at first reading that you guys are looking for some changes to the code. Now, they might tell us, don't change ground floor. We already told you not

508
02:30:14.479 --> 02:30:31.040
to. you know, >> but but yeah, I mean that's your prerogative to do that. So, >> okay. So, we we need to >> So, you want a list of >> list of the

509
02:30:31.040 --> 02:30:46.399
I'd like, you know, we need motions on the future land use change. We need a motion on the resoning and then we need, you know, any tweaks you want. And you can also state that uh those tweaks are going to be given to the city manager

510
02:30:46.399 --> 02:31:02.960
for uh implementation with planning and zoning. So you don't have to list them all out. You can just say what you're going to be doing. give them to me and and I'll give them to Mark to to include that that's that motion could be made >> or we could do nothing and just give you

511
02:31:02.960 --> 02:31:18.160
the changes and and uh and meet again next month when we'll have the uh silver ores and you know we'll have both together because then I'm still concerned about historic preservation protection

512
02:31:18.160 --> 02:31:37.200
um isn't historic it's just a separate it a separate ordinance whether we waited for it or not. >> No, by having both at the same time you tweak one or the other. >> Yeah. No, that's what you're saying. >> Yeah.

513
02:31:37.200 --> 02:31:51.439
>> It also >> I think they're unrelated, but >> Yeah. Well, thank you. But really um it also um uh

514
02:31:51.439 --> 02:32:07.840
gives Brad more more time to study it because he wasn't he wasn't here when we were going through the land use plan um which was quite extensive. And just keep in mind that these have

515
02:32:07.840 --> 02:32:24.560
already been decided when we are um come back tweaking some. So >> they had already been decided on these >> in workshops. >> I already threw a motion out there if you guys are >> entertain.

516
02:32:24.560 --> 02:32:39.200
>> Um so what what I I would make a motion that for the the two things in front of us which is the change of the future of land use map and of the zoning. um as presented to us the both of the maps. Um

517
02:32:39.200 --> 02:32:56.640
I would say that um we should adopt both those maps and we should adopt uh the future land use and the zoning as presented with adjustments if you will or

518
02:32:56.640 --> 02:33:14.319
recommendations to the city manager as presented by us to you present to planning zoning and also to the commission. That's my motion. >> I don't know if it's a good motion, but that's my motion. Presented to Is

519
02:33:14.319 --> 02:33:30.080
to to staff? That's your recommended changes. With your recommended changes, >> it has been properly motioned and second that we um

520
02:33:30.080 --> 02:33:45.760
agree with the changes of the C central business district and smallcale comprehensive plan and the zona map amendment reszoning. Um, with the >> you're going to have to vote separately

521
02:33:45.760 --> 02:34:02.240
on the future land use on that. >> Okay. Okay. So, the first one we're doing is a future land use map. >> Yes. >> Okay. So, um, it has been properly motioned and second

522
02:34:02.240 --> 02:34:20.160
that we um go according with the future land use map. >> Did I say it right? >> Yeah. That's official. >> All right. >> Board member Robert Chair. >> Hi.

523
02:34:20.160 --> 02:34:37.280
>> Board member Dan D. >> No. >> Vice Chair Hardy. >> Hi. >> Board member Brad Green. >> No. >> Chairwoman Veronica Glover. >> I moved. >> Okay. So, the next one we need for the

524
02:34:37.280 --> 02:35:02.080
resoning. I can make another motion. I'll make a motion that we uh >> um change the zoning as presented uh in the map that presented to us as well. it. I make a motion that we um change

525
02:35:02.080 --> 02:35:20.319
from the GC1 to the uh mixed use uh >> central business >> central business district and adopt the map as present. >> Now, does that conclude all the stipulations like setbacks and everything or you just talking about the

526
02:35:20.319 --> 02:35:43.680
maps? I'm saying we changed the zoning. >> So we we approved this whole package. >> I'm saying that we approved the zoning and the zoning >> to the mix >> the proposed zone.

527
02:35:43.680 --> 02:35:59.840
>> Yes. >> I hopped it out but it doesn't show it on the map. >> The map will be updated. >> We'll update it. >> We'll update it. Then don't you need to say that? >> No, they'll they'll take care of that. The map will definitely be updated. >> You already submitted your information prior. It's just an air. It's a scrier

528
02:35:59.840 --> 02:36:21.520
error. It's an error. We'll take care of it. I'll make sure of it and I'll get you a copy of it. >> I trusted that. >> Yes, ma'am. Thank you. I will do it. >> I'm a witness. >> We're all witnesses. >> Yes, >> about a second. Give me one second. Second.

529
02:36:21.520 --> 02:36:37.120
>> Okay. It has been properly motion and moved and second that the changes to the central business district from DC1 zoning to mixed use from the current zoning map.

530
02:36:37.120 --> 02:36:53.040
>> So it's mixed use because it talks about >> to the central business district. >> Central business district. I'm sorry. >> Yes. Board member Brad Green. No. >> Vice Chair Danetta Harding. >> I

531
02:36:53.040 --> 02:37:10.960
>> board member Dan Dodge. >> No. >> Board member Robert Sharer. >> I. >> Chairwoman Veronica Glover. >> I. So now we move. >> Now if you want to recommend we make changes to the central business district,

532
02:37:10.960 --> 02:37:26.960
you you can you can direct us to do that as well. >> Motion. So, we need a motion or two. >> They didn't vote on that because that motion had both. >> I can make another motion to say that.

533
02:37:26.960 --> 02:37:45.600
Um, I also move that we uh the board develop a list of changes that we feel would be appropriate and that we submit them to the city manager um and for him to pass them along to planning and zoning staff and to the commission when

534
02:37:45.600 --> 02:38:01.600
they uh review the project. >> I'll second and we'll bring back at your next meeting proposed changes. How will we will we make those recommendations individually to the city manager?

535
02:38:01.600 --> 02:38:18.720
>> You can you can email them to me individually or if you have right now you want to decide what they are. >> Well well we yeah I mean we know you have some concerns about the stuff along 17. You are concerned about uh

536
02:38:18.720 --> 02:38:34.640
>> first floor living. first floor living >> was that and what was that all >> the administrative approval >> right? So those three >> we know we're bringing back to you guys >> if there are more

537
02:38:34.640 --> 02:38:50.319
you you you can let the city manager know and at least we'll bring them back for discussion. Obviously, one individual can't necessarily change. We know those three that we just identified, there seems to be consensus for those changes.

538
02:38:50.319 --> 02:39:06.800
So, perhaps there'll be two lists. You'll come we'll come forward with text that shows those changes that you requested. And then we'll also say, here's a list of some additional ones that came up after the meeting. Let's talk about them.

539
02:39:06.800 --> 02:39:24.640
>> Okay. >> Is that fair? >> Yes. Hey, what Robert just said, wasn't that what your motion was? >> Yes. Yes, sir. Exactly. >> Okay. So, it has been um properly motioned and second that we um the

540
02:39:24.640 --> 02:39:42.560
changes that were requested by the board. And if there are any other changes that will be presented to the city manager for next board meeting.

541
02:39:42.560 --> 02:39:57.439
>> Okay. >> Okay. Roll call file, please. >> Yes, ma'am. Board member Robert Sher. >> I. >> Board member Dan Dodge. >> I. >> Vice Chair Ketta Marty. >> I. >> Board member Brad Green. >> Hi. >> Chairwoman Veronica Glover.

542
02:39:57.439 --> 02:40:14.640
>> I. >> Okay. All right. So, we move on to number six of the items. So there any staff comments? Um I I do something and I wasn't here

543
02:40:14.640 --> 02:40:33.760
last uh month um that in the past um as a board member when there were um new businesses or any changes coming into the community, we were informed

544
02:40:33.760 --> 02:40:48.880
>> um so we would know what was going on. So like uh Dunkin Don Donut is coming in we would have known about that application. >> Yes. um if um the new restaurant that you know where they were. So updates like

545
02:40:48.880 --> 02:41:05.920
that. So it sure could um have those updates because um my experience of sitting on this board for about 25 years is that um when people make comments about how the city is

546
02:41:05.920 --> 02:41:22.240
moving >> um we can you know you can say no that's not true. Um just for a perfect example, the McDonald's, right? >> All that time, um people in the community was blaming the city,

547
02:41:22.240 --> 02:41:39.359
>> saying they didn't want, um the McDonald's to come because they really didn't understand the process of what had taken place. And you know, I said, "No, that's not." So we voted on it twice >> before, you know, it came. So it has nothing to do with the city,

548
02:41:39.359 --> 02:41:56.319
>> right? you know, but if you know, people asking me about the m um the Dunkin Donuts and and just different um businesses of things that are going on here. >> Um at one time we we knew what was coming. We knew who presented an

549
02:41:56.319 --> 02:42:13.600
application. Even um like one time KFC and um Taco Bell, they presented an application, but they changed their mind. We knew they changed their mind, but we knew that at one time they were interested in opening a business here.

550
02:42:13.600 --> 02:42:30.479
So, just little things like that. Okay. >> Okay. >> On those lines, any word update with all these? >> No word on all these, but I do have a couple things for you all. Um, under staff comment, um, you all were emailed, our clerk sent this out a little bit

551
02:42:30.479 --> 02:42:47.439
ago. This was received earlier, but uh July 21st through the 25th, there's an upcoming preservation on Main Street conference. Um there's going to be two things there. It's it's going to be hosted. It's conference. It's a joint host conference by Florida Main Street and the Florida Trust for Historic

552
02:42:47.439 --> 02:43:04.000
Preservation. You all have a link. It's a great conference. I think everybody on this board and historic board should look into it and see if there's a way that you can attend. Um wanted to make sure that that got out to you. there is an email. Um, with that being said, uh,

553
02:43:04.000 --> 02:43:19.280
there's no current applications, but there will be, I believe, coming down the line for the out parcels where the fish camp is. I talked to the owner and they're going to be actively um, now that their plans are approved and moving forward with the with that process,

554
02:43:19.280 --> 02:43:35.200
they're going to be actively soliciting those properties out front for businesses that will enhance the the area. Uh and of course their their business with the uh the RVs and the fishing and all of that. >> So that's immediately south of McDonald's.

555
02:43:35.200 --> 02:43:51.439
>> Yes. Immediately south of McDonald's, correct? That will be coming when it happens. You all will know about it. Um Dunkin Donuts will be open hopefully mid August. Um they had a little issue with some permitting. Uh wasn't any fault of

556
02:43:51.439 --> 02:44:07.439
their own. Um and but uh things were out of their out of out of you know their control but they got what they need and they're moving now forward with the process for construction. >> Then they're renovating the current building. >> Yes, they are same footprint. Same footprint but they're renovating.

557
02:44:07.439 --> 02:44:24.160
>> Yeah. So so that was something that we didn't even see. That's all interior buildout on footprint. So >> and and the reason for that was because of the county's impact fee. the drive-through window, >> the drive-thru, I mean, the all all these different things. So, keeping that

558
02:44:24.160 --> 02:44:39.600
existing footprint was very important for them to save probably 50 to $60,000. >> Um, and you know, it's a drop in the bucket when you're talking about several million that they're already doing, but every every penny adds up. Um, with that being said, some properties have been

559
02:44:39.600 --> 02:44:56.000
purchased and some owners are making some moves. Um, we had the owner in here earlier. I'm not sure what he was in for. Maybe he wanted to just hear a little bit about our discussion. But um where the um >> the old music store >> the old music store is that is now going

560
02:44:56.000 --> 02:45:13.040
to be half retail and half of a gym. Uh so they are bringing Gladiator Gym from down south of town here into town. >> So what's right outside of town will be coming in. So we'll have a full-time gym there. Um,

561
02:45:13.040 --> 02:45:29.359
>> same owner. >> Same same I believe they're same owner. Yes. And they're they're working on that deal. Um, there's some modifications. They're they've got some per or some requests granted for CRA dollars. So, we'll see how that works. Um, another

562
02:45:29.359 --> 02:45:45.120
business that's uh possibly going to take place is an acquisition, I believe, of the Peacock Furniture, the old Peacock Furniture building. that most likely is going to be a new laundry mat for the city. Um, I hope that the

563
02:45:45.120 --> 02:46:01.279
services will include dry cleanings. It'll be a lot better than just a regular laundry mat, but >> we'll take we'll take what we can get and it's nice to have the space utilized. >> So, my question, I had heard that as well. Um, but parking >> parking's got to be in the back.

564
02:46:01.279 --> 02:46:17.120
>> Okay. >> And, um, we currently as the city, we just had a meeting with the USDA. Is that correct? for our rural grant, >> RDBG. >> Um we're submitting plans uh to see if we can get a parking lot back there and have have it done through a grant.

565
02:46:17.120 --> 02:46:33.359
>> Oh, okay. >> Where is it located? >> Uh it's right down here um >> next to Pal. >> Yeah, next to Palver. >> Right. Right there. That that vacant >> Oh, the vacant building. >> The faceelift to the strip mall. >> That's all happening on under CRA. But

566
02:46:33.359 --> 02:46:49.520
that is happening. Just so you all know, they they have submitted um grant request. It's not etched in stone yet because the commission has the final the final say on approval for the grant, but they did put in a grant. Beautiful facelift on Save a Lot parking lot. Um

567
02:46:49.520 --> 02:47:06.319
currently Save a Lot is looking to expand into the next um into the next uh >> storefront storefront that's next door, the next unit. Um, I believe Bonnie, is it 25,000 square feet or 50 thou? What? How many thousand square? It's a it's a

568
02:47:06.319 --> 02:47:21.680
lot because they're they're going to bring services that we've had at Windixie that that uh we don't currently have right now. So, they're really stepping up for the community. I hope everybody um you know supports them as they go through this. But that whole area is going to be really nice. They

569
02:47:21.680 --> 02:47:38.319
have a bunch of new um tenants that are coming in with other businesses and different things. a a restaurant that's going in there where Spankings is. Um there's a a new laundry mat that's that's going to be an updated laundry mat that's going in there as well. And

570
02:47:38.319 --> 02:47:57.920
>> three laundry mats. >> Yes. >> Clean city. >> Going to be clean. Yeah. Clean clothes. Clean clothes. So, >> but as far as business, that's the only that's the updates I have right now.

571
02:47:57.920 --> 02:48:15.520
>> Oh, uh I forgot 512 and 512 AM was purchased as well. That's over here. It's a historic building. They put in for CRA dollars, but they are um as we had in our CRA report, I believe they're putting in about a quarter a quarter million to half a million dollars in

572
02:48:15.520 --> 02:48:30.640
that building. They're going to restore it. Um the the roof was horrible inside. It's just it's really really bad. But they said that they were looking to do a rental lease space up at the top for residential and have retail stores at

573
02:48:30.640 --> 02:48:51.920
the bottom. Possibility of of a restaurant like a tapas bar, wine bar overlooking the lake on the on the rooftop. So it's not etched in stone, but it may happen. And that's what they But yeah, things are happening.

574
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>> Things are happening. >> Um, thank you so much for those updates. >> Absolutely. >> And nothing else. Um, any public comments? >> Okay. Um, any board member comments? Okay. All right. Um if there is nothing

575
02:49:30.319 --> 02:50:07.520
else, the planning and zoning commission meeting um June 18th is dismissed. This is almost like a regular rough. >> Yeah, it's a federal holiday.

576
02:50:07.520 --> 02:52:17.279
>> You guys aren't First What's it It is around. I'm sorry. Oh my god. >> Oh yeah. Last night was planning his own class

577
02:52:17.279 --> 02:53:29.479
>> and it was we were at a meeting at night. We were he wasn't but we all drunk together. Oh my god. I just um I know. >> Was born

578
02:53:54.399 --> 02:55:31.279
That was the first time. Here we are. >> So they are I can help you. Right back. I have some also relationship.

579
02:55:31.279 --> 02:57:29.399
Right, right, right. So anyway, water. We had And we had been someone. >> I'm glad my children So they retired when it was time. >> Yeah, we did.

580
02:57:38.960 --> 02:58:52.640
our localized I always wanted to go through. >> Yeah. You better get better. Come on. Talk to him. from 199. >> Anybody talk more than me?

581
02:58:52.640 --> 02:59:15.080
>> Yeah, you did. Anybody talk more of me? God help. Am >> I getting enough? Where am I at? >> Over there. >> Oh my goodness. >> I asked you where you wanted to be.

582
02:59:17.439 --> 02:59:51.840
>> ADHD. You >> It's all good. It's all good. It's all good. Why did I take >> all kinds of approval stamps? >> What do you want to prove? >> Okay. The historical historic

583
02:59:51.840 --> 03:00:08.560
preservation board meeting June 18, 2026 will now come to order. >> I would like to make a comment. >> Yes. >> When you're sitting out there and we have no one out there, you cannot hear because you you all don't have your

584
03:00:08.560 --> 03:00:24.319
microphones anywhere near where you're talking and it sounds like you're just mumbling cuz I can't understand it. Miss Alice, you're the first person ever in my life told me that they couldn't hear it. I feel >> I don't even have to talk with them. I

585
03:00:24.319 --> 03:00:46.720
can my voice project. >> I didn't have as much trouble understanding you. >> Okay, that made me feel better. >> Yeah, right. They were both quiet. >> Thank you. We'll do better. >> So, I don't know how to record. >> Okay. Roll call, please.

586
03:00:46.720 --> 03:01:16.840
>> Bye. >> Board member Brad Green >> here. >> Board member Kenetta Hardy, vice chair >> here. Um um

587
03:01:17.040 --> 03:01:31.760
board member Dan Dodge >> here. >> Board member Robert Sher >> here. >> Board member Frank Murray >> here. >> Board member Alice McCoy >> here. >> Chairwoman Veronica Glover >> here. >> Assistant city manager Derek Martin.

588
03:01:31.760 --> 03:01:52.560
>> Oh, I'm the manager. Did I assistant? >> I'm sorry. our city manager and assistant city manager love >> and myself Sharina Ber the clerk then we have a quum >> okay at this time we have the approval

589
03:01:52.560 --> 03:02:09.200
of the minutes from November 21st March 19th April 16th >> did we get any >> did we I'm sorry we didn't get any >> in the meeting from No. >> No, you didn't get the minutes. My

590
03:02:09.200 --> 03:02:26.279
apologies. I'll bring them back the next time. >> Okay. >> Okay. We'll go to number four, old business item. First item of business is condemned properties.

591
03:02:27.439 --> 03:02:44.960
>> Um, >> any condemned properties? >> Nothing to report at this time. >> Okay. >> All right. How how many do we have? >> I'd have to come back and get you a number on that. I can get with the code enforcement and come back with a number. >> Um, no.

592
03:02:44.960 --> 03:02:59.600
>> Okay. >> All right. Demolition permit request. We've had zero this month. Zero. Okay. Thank you. New Moon Lodge. This is a good one. I could talk forever on the new Moon Lodge. Um, >> you realize it's 908.

593
03:02:59.600 --> 03:03:16.160
>> I do. I I absolutely love it. I will make it I will make it quick. Um I just got the final bill for the engineering schematics that is being paid now that that is done. I didn't want to have a bunch of payments. I we're going to do one one request to the state. So right

594
03:03:16.160 --> 03:03:32.960
now I'm submitting on Monday the um request for fund reimbursement for that project. And they should have schematic plans and all deliverables completed and delivered probably within the next week I would imagine. I I I thought I would have it this week because they're that

595
03:03:32.960 --> 03:03:49.200
close. They've already done the um um investigation the building. They had the architect come. They had the engineer come. They did uh inspections of the roofs, the trusses, all of the foundation. All that's been completed. Um really excited about it to be able to

596
03:03:49.200 --> 03:04:04.640
see and I've actually seen the plans. Um they just weren't stamped completed, but I've seen the schematics. It's really nice what what we can do there. >> That's good news. Thank Thank you. Good news. >> All right. Miller Middle School

597
03:04:04.640 --> 03:04:19.439
currently right now. Miller Middle School. Would you want me to talk up there? >> It would be wonderful. Just to make sure. I'm sorry. I'm not used to come up here. You know, my previous job I was so nervous coming up to this because the

598
03:04:19.439 --> 03:04:37.120
DAS was up high and I'm short already. So, you're looking up at this group of people. I'm just it was so intimidating. So, the Miller Middle School, um I don't have an update on that. The only thing that I have been that I have been told is that they're currently working on um

599
03:04:37.120 --> 03:04:54.399
a long-term lease agreement possibly that the county could purchase that property um from the school district. I don't have anything else outside of that. Um, I I will say this publicly and I don't know if anybody has has reached out um in regard to this, but I did a a

600
03:04:54.399 --> 03:05:10.479
walkthrough of that facility and there are some really um there's some really beautiful points to that property and to those buildings. I think they're underutilized. I think if we wanted to get funds I I and I had talked to somebody that I know uh who has contacts

601
03:05:10.479 --> 03:05:28.000
in Hollywood but you need to get TVs to TV shows to come and use that auditorium. I mean the school itself could be utilized for I mean you have you have a whole they don't Hollywood didn't have to build anything. They have it right there. You can do school shows.

602
03:05:28.000 --> 03:05:43.920
You can do you know 50s movies. You can you have the auditorium. you have I mean there's so much there that we're not utilizing and they paid big money for sets. They they paid big money for sets. The city could use that money. Um and and and they could also pay the dollars

603
03:05:43.920 --> 03:05:59.600
to do some restoration. I just think we just got to get the right the right audience. Um maybe showcase it a little bit. Uh pictures, videos, all that works. Uh but that's all I have for for the Miller Middle School. >> Okay. Thank you. the historic district

604
03:05:59.600 --> 03:06:15.279
report. >> Right now, I have nothing to to uh report on that. Um I believe that the funds have been um that the funds have been approved to to what I can tell or at least we've made it past that that level. The funds are ready to be signed

605
03:06:15.279 --> 03:06:30.399
and and still sitting up in the state of Florida, but I believe that's already been done. So, we're just in waiting process to get started on that. >> Okay. architectural and site guidelines. >> Um those are all uh in line

606
03:06:30.399 --> 03:06:47.520
architectural and site guidelines are in line with the LDC what we've talked about earlier. Those are going to be included in in that. Okay. And that goes to the next which is the historic preservation ordinance review. Um, as I told you earlier, we received

607
03:06:47.520 --> 03:07:03.439
some recommendations from an outside entity of this of this body. That still was um something that was considered. I sent it over to the city attorney. City attorney is reviewing the LDC and how to take what was proposed originally as a

608
03:07:03.439 --> 03:07:20.720
standalone um separate uh ordinance um which was written very well. Uh but uh but there were some conflicting um items in there with the current LDC and uh and I want to make sure that that uh you know it's it's correct. The first time

609
03:07:20.720 --> 03:07:35.439
it was recommendation from the city attorney to amend the LDC rather than having a separate standalone um historic preservation ordinance just for that fact alone. So right now it's in his hands. The recommendations have been given to him. Once those recommendations

610
03:07:35.439 --> 03:07:53.760
are reviewed and he has um a document, that information is going to be given back to Mark Caret for a final review and they're going to kind of have a little meeting. I'm going to make that happen where we're where we're, you know, we'll we'll be able to iron out any any differences or anything there

611
03:07:53.760 --> 03:08:09.760
and then we'll bring that to to this body. >> Okay. And who is that that you mentioned someone's name that's going to be handling that's >> the gentleman that was here earlier Mark Fred >> he's already made uh changes and sent

612
03:08:09.760 --> 03:08:26.319
over that LDC to myself I've already sent that to the attorney when I received the recommendations from the outside entity. I also forwarded that to the attorney as well. >> Thank you. >> All right. Um we move on to number five new business items

613
03:08:26.319 --> 03:08:43.760
discussion with Florida Department of Historical Resources. So questions came up in our CRA grant process this year on some of the buildings uh and some of the requests that were being made from some of these these uh

614
03:08:43.760 --> 03:09:00.160
business owners or building owners and the historic uh look and the historic buildings and what are the rules and how the how you know the guidelines for that. So we contacted the state and Bonnie actually had made the phone calls. We're currently waiting. I wanted in writing.

615
03:09:00.160 --> 03:09:16.479
We got phone calls about and and I'll tell you what it was specifically. It was this building across the street specifically about the windows. Um they're asking for money to replace the windows and we want to make sure that it doesn't impact the the historic

616
03:09:16.479 --> 03:09:32.960
significance of the building. Okay. Um there's a difference in opinion on what that means. Is it the look? Is it the material? Um, I I think we we try to fine line on that. You have a building that's

617
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beautiful. It's several it's hundred years plus old. You have windows that have wood that's petrified, possibly painted with, you know, um, >> you know, lead lead based paint. It needs to be abated. It's very expensive.

618
03:09:48.080 --> 03:10:06.160
Now, if the guy changes out the windows with a vinyl window that and Dan, you would know this, I'm sure. I don't know if you didn't mean to put you on the spot, Mr. Dodge. I'm sorry. >> That's fine. >> The windows, there's a name for those. They have nine squares and then an open

619
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there's a name for it. >> Is it nine over one? >> It's Yeah. >> Yes, I believe so. So, the question we asked the state was if they come back with vinyl that looks like that, does that impact the historical significance? The answer that we really got back was

620
03:10:22.640 --> 03:10:38.560
well if it's a if it's a historical marker. Yeah, >> that was really the the the the precipice that So if it if it was a registered historic marker >> national >> you want to

621
03:10:38.560 --> 03:10:55.439
>> national historic. Yesister national, right? >> That's right. Then it has to be treated a little bit differently. If it's a contributing structure like we have, it's not a register. Then the look is the aesthetic is what it is. You want to be able to get an a a a

622
03:10:55.439 --> 03:11:11.200
window that's going to be efficient for your heating, your cooling. You know, you want it to look the way it's supposed to look. I think there's a fine line there. We're going to get some specific answers from the state. That is where that's where we we we've got to go

623
03:11:11.200 --> 03:11:26.160
to them and we're going to get it in writing. When I get it in writing, it's going to be given to my commission. It's going to be given to you all. can be put into how we address these buildings to make sure that we're not losing a significant value there. That's the main thing. We want to do the right thing. If

624
03:11:26.160 --> 03:11:41.120
it means that it has to have a look, then we're going to make sure that paperwork says it has to have a look. If it means that they have to spend a lot of money on abatement and it's got to be that same window and they've got to put in glass in there and you're talking a difference from $1,500 or $2,000 a

625
03:11:41.120 --> 03:11:58.319
window to probably $5,000 to $6,000 a window. We tread the line of really holding people back for investment because I know for me I'm not going to I'm personally not going to invest if I'm going to have to do that. Now you have the right person who wants to invest in something historically they're

626
03:11:58.319 --> 03:12:14.080
going to do it and that's great. We got to find those people. Um but we have to be careful how we do it. We we want to make sure we're in line with the state. So that's what we're going to do. We're going to get the opinion from them from the resource coordinator and we'll have it in writing and we'll bring that to everybody and then that's how we'll

627
03:12:14.080 --> 03:12:30.960
we'll move forward with that. Um other than that that's that was our discussion with with the with the state. >> Okay. Thank you. Um current status of land development code. >> Well, we talked about that a little bit. Uh again, just to reiterate, it is in

628
03:12:30.960 --> 03:12:46.240
the city attorney's hands at this point in time. Um once I receive that back from him, I will bring Mark into the fold on what those changes were. Um and Mark will also get the um what the attorney got which was the

629
03:12:46.240 --> 03:13:03.439
recommendations and Mark will have comments on those recommendations and then we'll we'll have a meeting together and then we'll bring that to this body at a later date. My goal I mean again and I I like to be aggressive on those things because I like to move on to the next. Um my goal is to try to get the

630
03:13:03.439 --> 03:13:19.600
LBC um completed uh no later than August this year. Um, so that means I have to bring this to this body in July. And so I'm trying to get this to move and there really should be a reason we we can't. Um, so that's that's what I'm trying to

631
03:13:19.600 --> 03:13:35.040
to accomplish. >> Okay. We don't have any. Thank you. I think any public um guest at this time, so we'll move to number seven.

632
03:13:35.040 --> 03:14:03.600
>> Madam Chairman, I'll make a motion that we I have some questions. I have a list there. Um, >> got it. >> I I think we've set a new record since it's the longest meeting. >> Since I have here, I would like to say

633
03:14:03.600 --> 03:14:19.920
one more thing. But when we're building these um agendas, I can definitely go back to the old and grab some information. I have a lot of spinning plates, right? Any help that you all can give me an

634
03:14:19.920 --> 03:14:35.600
email. It doesn't have to be the group. We don't need that. The Sunshine Law, you know, says we can't do that. But and individually, if you have something you want me to research, something you want me to put together with an agenda form, uh Mr. Dodge and I have worked on that

635
03:14:35.600 --> 03:14:52.080
together several times. I appreciate it. You'll never bother me by sending an email saying, "Hey, can we look at this in the meeting?" I need that. I need that to be able to give to my clerk. We'll build a good agenda for you. I don't I don't want to come in and have no business or have her reach out and say, "Hey, we're canceling a meeting

636
03:14:52.080 --> 03:15:08.479
this week because or, you know, this month because we don't have anything." I want to load it up with the things that you all want to talk about, you all want me to look into. Um, I have a great commission. I work very closely with the mayor or ears to the ground. We want to make sure that we're bringing the things

637
03:15:08.479 --> 03:15:25.760
to you all that you want to talk about. So if there's topics, please give them to me and I'll make sure you have a good a good meeting for discussion topics. Okay, that's all I got. Thank you very much. Yes. as a as a

638
03:15:25.760 --> 03:15:43.120
>> we got to hear that first historical preservation board meeting is now a journal >> just just to give y'all a heads up uh how Memorial United Methodist Church um we're going to try to start doing some

639
03:15:43.120 --> 03:15:58.399
things like uh out on our property uh movies uh maybe uh once a month we'd like you to get in some gospel choirs uh to sing for us and uh and and different things. We have a beautiful facility over there that we'd like to utilize.

640
03:15:58.399 --> 03:16:16.560
And so uh there's a couple things uh I would love to uh I didn't bring in the card information on it, but I would like to get together with with all of you as well to get some ideas of things that we can do because we're very community based and I seem to have fallen into the

641
03:16:16.560 --> 03:16:33.120
uh head of getting things done over the church. So Okay. Uh, and I mean really we we're striving. It's uh our church is close to bankruptcy as many churches have gotten and we have a very small membership now and and not much money

642
03:16:33.120 --> 03:16:48.960
coming in. So we're trying everything we can to generate some funds as well as help the community to also we've been having flea markets and things people can sell things that it helps them out in these trying times. So we're going to try to continue with more things. The summer is going to slow us up a little

643
03:16:48.960 --> 03:17:29.600
bit, but I'm anxious to to have some things inside the air conditioning people come to. >> So anyway, thank you for hearing No, we were so sad >> and I don't know to you.