Good evening. Welcome to the Danvers Conservation Commission meeting for October the 9th, 2025. As a commission, we operate under the Massachusetts General Law, Chapter 131, Section 40, the Wetlands Protection Act, and Chapter 26 of the Town of Dan's
general bylaws, the Wetlands Protection bylaw. After each applicant presents his or her request and the board has said time to ask questions and discuss the project, we will accept questions from the audience. Because this is a public meeting is required by law that you give your name and address before you speak.
Although we may disagrees on the issues raised, all persons present during this meeting are expected to be civil to all other meeting attendees. This includes members of the commission, staff, abutters, concerned citizens, property owners, and project applicants.
We also request that you confine your questions to the project and only as it pertains to the wet wetlands act. We cannot handle nor do we have jurisdiction over matters such as noise or traffic. All problems not related to the wetlands protection act and the town of Danver's wetlands protection bylaw
must be taken up with other appropriate boards. Okay. Our first order of business would be members that are present. To my right is Lorraine Drapeek and to my left is Michael Splain and I am Peter Wilson. So, we have three members of the board. So, it's my
understanding, Emily, correct me if I'm not saying this correctly, uh, that any decision we any vote we take tonight needs to be unanimous for approval. Yes, that's the the information that I received from council. Okay, great. Uh, all right. First up is a request request for certificate of
compliance for 117 and 121 Elliott Street, D file number 14-1426. The applicant is a old friend of ours, Jonathan Garis. What's that?
Uh Jonathan Garis, 117 Elliot Street. Um I am uh applying for a certificate of compliance from the commission for my tree removal project. That pretty rotted out in the middle as you can see. That's probably why they're
dead and dying. [Music] How long ago were the trees cut, John? Uh, they were cut in January. Sorry. So, you have the a season's worth of growth. It's been that long since we approved that. Wow. Yeah.
Yeah. I slacked on coming back. You You had just got off then? I'm trying to remember. Were you on the board then? Yeah. You just gone off of gone off, right? Yeah. You left that night. And we haven't been able to replace you.
Yeah. Uh, okay. So, that the work's been done according to plan and Emily, you've been out to visit and everything looks like it's should be. Uh, okay. Mike, any questions? No. No. Lorraine, any questions?
No. Uh, okay. That's what we like to see. Coming back in a timely manner. So, if someone can make a motion, we'll uh grant a request first. I'll make a motion. I make a motion to issue a certificate of compliance for 117 and 121 Elliott Street, DP number
14-1426. Is there a second? Second. All in favor? I. Okay. Thank you. That was pretty quick. All right. Take care. Good to see you. Yeah. Thanks, John. You too.
Uh, next up is notice of intent for 46 Riverside Street, D file number 14-140. The applicants are Adam Wood and Genevie Fiorente. And I see here that they've requested to continue to our October 23rd meeting. And I'm presuming it's
because of the the number of commissioners we have here tonight. Okay. So, someone can make a motion we will continue that. I'll make a motion. Motion to continue the hearing for 46 Riverside Street, DP
number 14-1440 to October 23rd, 2025. Second. All in favor? I. Okay. Next up is a request for determination of applicability for 18
electric 18 electronics a RDA dcc file number 2025-05. The applicant is Old Neighborhood Foods. Good evening. Uh Connor Nagel with VHB on behalf of Old Neighborhood Foods. Um
you're probably familiar with the location of the the site 18 electronics a uh about a mile from here on the other side of the highway. Um Route One, right? The industrial park. Yes. Yep. Um,
so the what we're looking at is the addition of a uh wastewater treatment plant to treat some of the processed waste before it's discharged into the municipal system. Um, excuse me, just one sec. Is there a reason why the screen is not down? The
the thermostat's right in the the detail. I can ask Let me see if I can move this. I'll ask Dat. Yeah. That's funny. It just pulls down.
Yeah. Oh, careful. Much better. There was no screen. Thank you. Um,
so the the uh the work involves on the uh right hand side of the plan, the uh east as you look at it, we're adding a pump station uh to collect some of the process waste that comes out on that side. that's not within any uh wetland
or resource buffers. That connects over to the left side of the plan uh and to a treatment building. That orange uh small rectangle there that uh houses the the uh processing for the sewer waste that
is partially within the 100 foot buffer and has a connection to the sewer main that's just inside the 50ft buffer. It's all within the existing pavement, which is why we filed the um the RDA uh after
a consultation with with Emily. Um in terms of storm water, there's sort of a default uh minor improvement in that we're converting uh pavement to rooftop, which is a slightly cleaner runoff.
We're collecting those roof drains in a perforated pipe to give it a chance to infiltrate. But other other than that, there's no change uh to the storm water on the site or to any of the surrounding wetlands. It's all within the paved area
and the uh I'm sorry, are you done? That was it. Thank you. Um so this is some sort of filtering of getting solids out of the the waist stream. Is that Yes. Yep. cleaning up the process waste before
and the the the water part of the waste is just goes to the sewer. Yes. Yep. And the the solids that you collect where how are they handled? Uh I'm not fully familiar with the detail of what goes on in the building
of how it's treated, but I would assume that there is periodically uh a disposal of some uh solids from that. Um, but I would imagine that most of it is is just um neutralizing pH before it's released into the sewage.
Oh, really? Okay. So, is there is it an acid or a base that's eats whatever process comes off the the manufacturing pro the food manufacturing process or food processing that's going on in there. Um, that's really beyond the scope of what I know as a site civil
engineer to be honest. Um, okay. Okay, maybe it's not fair that I'm asking you these questions, but I will anyways. Where are there chemicals that you need to adjust the pH? Are they stored on site? And they're within that building. There is a like a garage door to that building uh
where chemicals will be stored. Up to code, I would hope as far as Yes. And it will require sewer permit from engineering DPW. Um so that that will all be taken care of with uh specific permits, a building permit for the building itself. Okay. And
uh I saw somewhere that there's you're requesting a waiver as part of this application for a six inches or so of pipe whereabouts. Is that on this drawing? Uh if I might just you want me to switch to Does that help?
Yeah, that's right there. This is the 50 foot uh buffer and so we're making that connection within the the 50 foot because that's the existing sewer line. It's tying into an existing hole right there. Okay. So, you're just going to excavate
and then fill after just open the trench for that that small length to connect to that manhole. Is there uh erosion control required for that? Yes. And there's erosion controls on the plans too. And in the um in the application, it outlines the erosion controls.
Okay. So, just to summarize, there's pretty much other than that waiver that you're requesting, there's very little disturbance to any kind of uh to the the surface at all. Correct. Right. And that was all it's all paved to begin with.
Correct. Okay. And the is this a new structure that they're building? Uh yes, to house the treatment facility. Okay. And that that the water that falls in that rooftop will be treated. Is that what you said? Yes. That will be infiltrated. So, it'd be a minor improvement to the storm
water there. Okay. Uh, all right. That's what I have for questions. Mike, any questions? So, um, the you're changing the process. Uh, what triggered that? Do you know? I mean, are they doing something different
in the plant that requires them to not to my knowledge and I don't have intimate knowledge of what's going on inside as the site civil engineer. Um, this is maybe more just bringing it up. a health issue. They said, "Hey, you you're putting too many solids into the
sewer and you need to clean that up or I wouldn't think so. My guess is it's more pH neutralization and just keeping with uh standards that are required before releasing it into the sewer. Yeah, but before you weren't doing that before.
I I honestly don't know what the process in there was before. Okay. Well, I guess that's a border of health issue. So the SCSD. Okay. And in terms of uh is there anything you're doing increasing
impervious? Uh no, it's all within the paved area right now. Um so as I said it by virtue of the fact that it's a rooftop for that small area now instead of pavement, it's it's an incre it's an improvement to the storm water.
Okay. I have no other questions. Okay. Thanks, Mike. Lorraine, any questions? I I don't I don't have any questions. Um Okay. Are there any questions from the public? None.
Okay. Just let me review here what we need to vote on. Two motions. Okay. Okay. So, at first up, the the applicants requested a a waiver to allow for work within the 50ft no build zone and that that was that short length of
pipe that we needed to connect to the existing sewer line. Yeah. I just asked a question for staff. So, if we're going to issue a negative determination, we can still uh grant waiverss Yes. at the same hill. Yes. Yep. We've done that for other projects very recently as well.
All right. All right. Before I go any further, this is this is a public hearing that I need to close. Nope. You can ask for public comment if you want, but for um for RDAs, it doesn't Okay. So, there's no We don't need a motion to close the public hearing then. Uh Okay. Okay. So, if someone can make a
motion to grant that waiver. I'll make a motion that we grant a waiver on the 50 foot uh requirement uh for 18 electronic savcc file number 20250 is it?
Yes. I second. All in favor? I. Okay. And then we need a motion whether to grant a a negative determination of applicability or not. I make a motion we make a finding of a negative determination of applicability
uh for 18 electronics have RDA dcc file number 2025-05. I second. All in favor? I I I. Thank you very much. You're welcome. Good luck. Um okay. Next up is a notice of intent
for 36 Sherwood AB D file number 14-1443. The applicants are Daniel and Hillary Gordon and the applicants have requested that they continue to our next meeting which is on October 23rd. Uh so if someone can make a motion, we will do that.
I'll make a motion. Make a motion to continue the hearing for 36 Sherwood Avenue D number 14-1443 to October 23rd, 2025. Is there a second?
Uh second. No, sorry. getting ahead of yourself. Okay, second's been made. All in favor? I I Okay. Wow, this is moving way too fast. Yeah. Um, next is old or new business, the
minutes from the September 25th meeting. Um, has anyone has everyone reviewed them and someone can make a motion? We were I'll I'll make a motion. I make a motion to accept the minutes from September 25th, 2025. I you going to ask for a second?
You can just say second. Second. All in favor? I I Okay. Any other news? Emily? Um we have a a potential new member here. Paul, if you don't mind, just got to introduce you quickly. You don't have to go up to the mic if you want, but um Well, he could tell us a little about himself. Yeah, if you would like to. I don't want
to put you on the spot. You want to come to the mic? Yes, please. Yeah, if you're comfortable. Hi, Paul McNelie. Um, I guess I'll give you a little bit of background about myself. I've been in Danvers now for since 1987. Uh, been here with my wife and two kids. Went to Danvers. I um have
been pretty involved recently retire retired recently. She's retired about eight or nine years ago. Um, and fairly involved in the town. Have been very actively involved in the rail trail. I'm a member of the rail trail committee. All right. Um, have been on that for 10 years now. Um, so which is a lot of fun. good group
of folks. Um, and I'm also an active member. Actually, I was the president of watch Lake Association up in Maine. Uh, have had on the main side quite a bit of experience working with Maine DP um from the standpoint of wetland protection and shore water runoff
remediation, you know, that type of thing. It's not um the same as here, but it's there's similar types of uh issues, I think, from that perspective. And uh I got a call from Emily and uh and Aaron Henry's been trying to encourage me for years now. So you can do a little bit more. Um so I said, you know, I'd give
this a try. Come and uh listen to the meeting, see how it goes. And um and if you know, you guys think it works out, then I'd be happy to to join. I'm not at all knowledgeable about the uh the um rules and reg Well, I'm somewhat knowledgeable rules and regulations, but not the processes that you're following
and what's an RDA and what's a non-compliance. And we have to learn all that stuff, but Okay. and we'll help you out with all that. And this is when I say that maybe it's time for a new workshop. We've been talking about that at work or at the office. We've been um putting together all the background materials. Well, that would be great.
Exactly that. Yep. Absolutely. So, that's me in the main. Did you say you were uh so Watch It Lake, which is if you know where Sebago Lake is, it's about 8 miles directly west of the bottom of Sebago Lake. It's in Standish.
It's a small lake. Um pretty good shape right now. no invasive species, knock on wood, as they say. But, uh, there's always work to be done to educate people and encourage people to reduce runoff into the lake because that's really our biggest issue is, um, untreated or just
any amount of runoff into the lake, you know, phosphorus, algae creation, that type of thing. Oh, good. Sounds like he cares about the environment. Well, glad that you're interested in uh we'd welcome you with open arms. So, okay. So, when are you showing up? Next
meeting. a couple more steps. Got to get sworn in and uh yeah, I'll get you all the background info for next steps. And and the only caveat that I I gave to Emily is we being retired, we travel now and then, so I can make most meetings, but yeah, I will but I'm always know
well in advance uh if I can't make a meeting or two. So, I'll let you guys know. Yeah. Well, that happens with all of us. Yeah, I'm in the same boat. All of a sudden, I'm told that we're going on vacation. Have a meeting tonight. All set, sir. All right. Thank you. Thank you for uh for hopping over.
Oh, good. Thanks for your interest. Yeah. Okay. [Music] We're all set now. Okay. So, uh that's all I see in our agenda unless there's anything else. That's it. Next meeting is October 23rd. We have two two COC's and then the two
NOIs that were continued from tonight. Okay. All right. Someone can make a point to discuss about the quorum stuff, but we could do that after we close the meeting. or you want um I think maybe the document that I emailed to you once you read I have that actually. I think I already I think I already had that on my own.
Oh, okay. Yeah. Um any questions on that if you want to email them to me just because Oh, yeah. But when we journally cons I wanted to discuss it anyway. Yeah. Oh, no. I just didn't want to tell you the wrong thing because I saw today was Yeah. was today, too. So, I want to make sure that I'm speaking the correct legal
terminology with All right. Was that a separate email that I don't recall? Oh, yeah. was the document that Mike had asked for. I can send it to you. I requested some information. Well, we can we talk about it right now about the document that I sent to you. No, about the uh quorum issue requirements.
Oh, yeah. So, in in speaking with council today, she let me know that um for for voting on matters. Basically, it needs to be if we have three members here, the decision does need to be unanimous for the votes as opposed to a two to one. And she sent over um some documentation supporting that. So that's
what Mike had asked that I sent to him. And I dis and I looked I looked at I already had that what you sent. Okay. And I disagreed because uh our re our rig says that you you need for for a quorum in our
[Music] conservation commission regulations. Yeah. I mean what I just read you and said um that in the absence of statutory restrictions the general rule is that a majority of a council or board is a
quorum and a majority of the quorum can act. Now there is like uh zoning things like variances and stuff where you might where it says you need a four fifths vote right ours and I think I read I read you I
gave you that uh highlight and and what is it and it said yeah you have it so and this is our own reggg 310 CMR section 10 and and it simply says actions by the conservation commission not the board of
appeals and not the planning board states that any particular action is to be taken by a conservation commission that action is to be taken by more than half the members present. Well, two out of three is more than half, right?
A meeting of at least a quorum and a quorum is defined as a majority of the members than in office. So a quorum is the major. So we have a five member board but we have four in office. Yeah. But so the majority of that is three, right?
and uh a majority of uh the members present at a meeting would be two out of that three. So I mean it's like I said I can I'm happy to share those concerns with council. It's I'm I'm deferring to what I was told. Well I know and I've seen stuff both
ways. Yeah. Yeah. Uh and actually there was a note from the uh the from MAC that said that u there was some question about that because it of whether but we've done it in the past
but we've always done two out of three votes. All right. It's I mean I I'm just Well, let's go back to the I mean thankfully no decisions were made tonight, right? I think that's why everybody kicked it out because it was only going to be three. And I and I was going to disagree and say, "Well, we don't need
they don't need a majority." They I wasn't going to be the other. I mean, I was going to be saying, "You don't need a majority. You only need two of us. So, if someone votes no, you've got the major, you know, you've won, right?" So, Emily, can you go back to the town council and just
get a little clarification on that? Ask them why the reggg how how that sits with I'm going to give that back. Yeah, of course. How that sits because I mean that's what our regulation says. Okay. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely.
Okay. So, you can report back to us on that at the the next meeting. And like I said, thankfully we didn't make any decisions. Maybe people postponed based on what they heard there, but uh probably not much damage done. Well, when you find out there's only three members sitting and you need all
three, it's prudent to go I guess. Go ahead. Being in healthare being in healthcare and not having a lot of time. If you can't, you know, if if you have a meeting of three people and you get and
only two of them agree and you can't get a decision, you know, there's a chance. What's the sense of having the meeting? What's the point? Yeah. What's the I guess I can't I mean being the devil's advocate continue if it's she's got a good point. Are we going to continue every meeting where we're only going to have three for a quorum? A
quorum means you can act and a majority uh to me a majority of the quorum. Yeah. Takes action. Yeah. Okay. I I will definitely get back to council on this and get this clarified. Yeah. Yeah. That that would be important. And I'll send the rest of you the um the
information that I had sent to Mike earlier today. Okay. Well, thanks Mike. Thanks for advocating. Well, I just because and you just I'm just to take you off the spot for a second, but couple years. No, I mean last year on the the airport
vote, there was a vote originally originally made with three people present. Yeah. And there was some some term that Brian used to said that that really wasn't a valid vote. Right. Because one of the voting members had missed that was for a different reason. Yeah. One of the voting members had
missed more meeting. Yeah. She hadn't been at the meetings and she had just come on. Yeah. Okay. Okay. That was okay. All right. Well, good. It's And I've had actually had stuff in this town before this town with where I was, you know, where I was
told there's only three of us. You need two out of three. And uh it was uh for apprentice landscaping and one for myself or a culvert under my driveway. Yeah. So I you know maybe that's a new change and maybe they want to be prudent. I
agree with Lorraine that if we only have three members, how do we hold the meeting if if you know if there's disagreement and we don't and only two of them agree. What is I mean I feel like not you're wasting someone else's time as well as our own, right? If we and there's always
that chance that one of us won't agree. So all the more reason to get a new member on board. Yes. Quickly. Absolutely. You I know you you you get what we're saying more or less. Yeah. I mean we deal with as well the rail trail committee at times. Yeah.
Um and you know the only thing I was unclear on I don't know who want this now public but it's just the question of um is the is the forum is the majority vote based on the number of members
of people commission members well for the work the number of members so we've got a seven member board we need to have at least four people voting you know, approving, let's say, granted
the stuff we do is not quite as whether where to put a board. I mean, it's not quite the same. What kind of board? It's a townointed committee. The rail trail. Oh, rail trail. Yeah. Well, you can have your own restrictions. And I think that's what that case said. I said
absent restrict statutory restriction. I mean, really, it's only come up once or twice. Yeah. But that's we've been working under I think under what you guys question. That's what Okay. Yeah. Understand? Well, then if that happens that from now on, we would just have to tell people,
you know, if you asking for a vote, you're going to need a major. You need all of us. Okay. Well, let's just get some clarification. Yeah. That's important. In the meantime, we've just kicked the can down the road in this one. Yeah. All right. Make a motion. Make a motion to adjurnn.
Second. You're supposed to say so moved. Now you see a second. Second. All in favor? I I Oh, I thought she made the motion. I I was Okay, good. All right. Thanks for coming. All right. And when's the next selectman's meeting
that maybe Paul would get approved? I believe the I believe it's October 21st.