6. Um, it is now 300 p.m. We're going to go ahead and convene the community redevelopment agency special meeting. If you will please stand for the uh prayer and pledge of allegiance. Father, we thank you for this day. We
thank you for all your many blessings. Lord, uh we thank you, Lord, for um for allowing us to come together. Father, and do the business of the people and what you would will us to do, God. We pray, dear Lord, that you will keep your hand on all of our first responders and
our soldiers that are overseas at war today. Lord, we ask these things in Jesus name. Amen. >> Amen. I aliance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under
God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. >> Okay, we've got a few people here with us tonight. So, I'm going to go over a few housekeeping measures to start with. Um, if you have a cell phone, please ensure that your ringer is on silent or
vibrate so that it doesn't interfere with the discussions that'll be taking place. Um, if you engage in conversations out the audience, please take it outside. So, once again, so it doesn't affect those that are around you or online.
And we ask that everyone respects each other civily while we're all together. and then at the end we're going to add in public comment before the German and then allow all the members to speak one last time. So with that being said we'll
go ahead and get started. Um Mr. Executive director chairman um commission I think Jesse touched on it kind of my thought for tonight um the items are laid out in a particular way
if for some reason you know to do that but ultimately what we're going to do is we'll kind of introduce the item what the project is a little bit and then we should have a representative from either our tech architectural firm or the engineering firm that's doing the work
for CRA. Welcome to Zoom. Enter your meeting ID followed by pound. >> Enter your participant ID followed by pound otherwise just please enter the meeting passcode followed by pound.
You entered 8 5 7 1 1. This meeting passcode is invalid. Please re-enter the meeting passcode followed by pound. >> You are in the meeting now. >> Good job. >> There are two participants in the
meeting. >> Okay. Uh, who do we have? >> You have been added to the waiting room. You cannot talk. >> Who do we have online? >> Hey, it's Bradley Touchstone with Touchstone Architecture. >> Okay, thank you.
>> And so, we'll we'll they'll come up and speak on the project as well. I think some projects probably warrant a little more discussion than others. Um, some of these are have been completed. is kind of telling you where we're at and what we think the next step should be. And then ultimately, Mr. Chair, when we get
done with D before we head into E, I've got some comments I like to make some an idea just to have everyone's mind as we move into those projects. >> Okay. >> So, ultimately, we'll start with A, which is 27 Crescent Drive redevelopment. That's what Mr. Touchstone is on for. Um, but ultimately, that is the building that
CRA purchased, I believe, roughly two years ago now. Um they're on corner crescent south side of Baldwin Avenue. Um there you'll see in the packet here the final drawings for some the design redevelopment of that building. That was
also a I want to say at this point an informal partnership with the cultural arts alliance. There is no formal agreement in place yet. I have spoken to Miss Steel. She's here today the executive director with the Walton County Cultural Arts Alliance. And so um ultimately we're going to ask Mr. touched on to go through that project
kind of catch us up on where we're at what they're they envision us next steps and then again Miss Steel's here as well any questions of her and the alliance for this project so we'll go through it and then we can talk about what those next steps are moving forward >> okay
>> hey good afternoon um yeah so the 27 Crescent drive is the old um um textile building uh and we were looking at renovating that for general purpose. I know that the Cultural Arts Alliance has been identified as a potential client.
We work with them, but really what we're trying to do is make it as flexible a space as possible so that it could accommodate their needs, but it could also accommodate um other tenants if if it was decided to go in a different direction. Um we're trying to maintain as much as possible the kind of
architectural integrity of the envelope of the building. Uh you'll see in this rendering that we've um actually added a little covered pavilion space that's a flexible outdoor space for kind of outdoor activities. And then the the
front of the building would be anticipated as a gallery uh retail type space. And then if you want to scroll down to the floor plan, I can describe a little bit more about it there. >> Page four PDF Jesse.
Yeah, that's it. Okay, that's good right there. Um, it apologize for a little bit of a technical diagram, but you'll see on the left hand side the where it says gallery, that's the kind of retail gallery space with storage. Then there's a large event space on the interior of
our existing building. Um, that's flex space for um, you know, classes or any kind of um, event that you might have over the course of the year. Um, with respect to the Cultural Arts Alliance, they also have a desire for a clay
studio, which you see on the far right hand side, and some support storage space. On the upper section, there's a new portion of the building that was added, and that includes all of the ADA accessible bathrooms, a catering kitchen, and then some additional uh
secondary tertiary storage space. Uh, and so there's an existing leanto on the on the current building that would get removed and then that's where these uh bathrooms and kitchen and whatnot would be added. We added those on that
addition in part because that's really going to be the least expensive way to I think construct those um additional elements. And then you can see we have what we're calling a kind of covered pavilion space. Um it's not intended to be, you know, a major um
uh music venue or anything like that, but more f outdoor flexible space with speakers or or small events that might take place in conjunction with the activities of the Cultural Arts Alliance. Couple things to note about the existing building. Um although it
does have a new metal roof on it, what we determined was, you know, the trusses are a really curious thing on this building. Um the way it's framed really does not lend itself to the current hurricane codes. And after an extensive
amount of research and investigation with my structural engineer, we've determined that the the the most efficient and least expensive route is actually going to be to remove the existing roof off of the existing building, keeping the exterior walls, but then running a conventional truss
system um from front to back. uh that also allows us to to hang the the ceiling uh from with trust members, introduce modern lighting, mechanical systems, all those sorts of things. So, it was one of those things that at the end of the day, as much as we wanted to
kind of maintain the existing trust members, you might appreciate the fact that the the rafters run unsupported um they're like two out six raptors and they run unsupported lengths of of up to like 22 feet and and that would require
an awful lot of of um reinforcement to get those to work with our current wind load criteria. Um, we're also the gallery space is at a different in the existing building is actually at a different elevation than the body of the rest of the building. And so what we
would be doing is actually leaving the gallery space at its current floor elevation and then raising the remainder of the building uh the floor of it about 14 in or so uh so that everything is level uh is on a level u floor
elevation. that gets us away from having to do any kind of interior ramps at the sums and steps and and those sorts of things. Really trying to focus on again making it as um as accessible to the public as we can. In terms of next
steps, um our contract did not include any civil engineering. And so the next step really would be to engage a civil engineering firm to take care of the uh the site ser the site civil issues with regard to storm water and drainage as
well as some sidewalk reconfiguration. Uh and then also to do uh to to follow up on an initial parking study that was done regarding this building and and whether or not we would need to accommodate a handicap parking space on site and how we might do that. So that
that's really the key next step. Um the the architectural drawings and the structural drawings are at a a stage of completion uh where they're ready to be handed off to a a contractor for pricing. But that civil work needs to happen uh first.
>> Okay. >> So I'm I'm trying to find something but ultimately uh the proposal with Touchstone Architect was 26,250. Uh to date there's been 22,125 expended with a remaining amount of
4,125. We have received that invoice because Mr. Touchstone is firm. They completed that work. So they already paid for that. So ultimately the question is you know with information get this project to move forward this location would require like you said civil engineering to occur and get
contracted estimate. So it's up to the commission if you want us to continue to move forward receive a task for a task force for one of our engineering firms for that civil work to be done and see what that would cost. Um you can put pause on this and rec rethink the whole
project the partnership. Um, I will tell you I I personally believe this is a great partnership with the Wharton County Cultural Arts Alliance, whether this is where you want to do it or not. It's a different story, but I do think it's a great opportunity to bring them up in the city and have that here. So, it's up to all of you what you'd like to
do next if you want to go out and get a task for see what that would cost to have that work done or you have something else. >> So, would this be a two-part discussion then? one to go ahead and make the payment for the final invoice and then the second half to be the discussion on
where to move forward or >> I think the in the invoice isn't on here for tonight um ultimately right now that would be on your next agenda >> and then hopefully I would talk about bylaw revisions potentially coming up at our next meeting we can kind of streamline some of that we're going to
follow the way the city does it again I believe if y'all this board approves a task for a contract then I should be able to approve invoices within that that dollar amount that y'all approved. So hopefully we would reduce that much administrative work invoices ever made. So that'll come next. But I think the
question now is do you want us to move forward with getting a task order to bring that back to see what a civil work would cost or do you have a different idea for the project? >> Miss Hein, >> I'm curious. Uh I didn't follow all the CRA's detailed meetings, but this
project start to finish will cost approximately how much was the initial somebody had a vision that they were going to put, you know, uh put in X number of dollars to get this start to finish regardless of I understand. >> I've never heard heard of a an estimated
number. Um obviously they bought the property. That's what I'm trying to find now. I want to think that was 275 was somewhere around that ballpark. hard time. We have a file having a hard time getting into it. Um, so we bought the property and then my understanding only other thing spended to date is this $26,000 for this proposal for
architectural services. But in terms of a high level estimate, I've not heard one. >> So, and you know, for me that's going to be my main goal on all of these items that are listed here is okay for what we're going to do with the CRA.
My my initial questions probably for all of these projects are going to be what is this going to cost the CRA? You know, because we've only again going to have so much funds and we're going to have some priorities. So, it's hard for me to
make a statement to say what we've already done. I know we I understand we're going to have to pay for, but moving forward, I don't know that I can do that step by step on each one of these line items until the end till I understand the total dollars that we're asking to
spend on these individual projects >> on majority of these projects that already have engineers engaged. You're probably going to have that probable cost probable cost the high level probably out unless Mr. Touchstone has a number in his head or is willing to provide a rough number. That's up to him. A lot of people don't like to do
that because they want you to they don't give you bad information but um unless he's got that an engineer hasn't been engaged yet. So you have we there has been engineer have the opportunity to provide us a probable cost. So I guess that's where it's like you move into civil engineering and at that point they'll provide us a high level what they expect the cost because then that
would move into bidding out for a contract to come do that work. >> Okay. I just don't want everybody to be shocked if I start saying no because of unknown costs and I know that there's certain things that I want to see for example a portion of the alleyway if there was alter alterations made or
whatever you know I would want to guide the money towards that you know one or two other projects versus >> it's it's up to y'all we could I mean ultimately we could instead of going and going straight out and tasking out for the civil work to be done we could go
and have one of our engineering firms as they are on general services so they can bill us at hourly rate. we go and say, "Hey, please look at this plan set that's been provided and give us a high level number of what you think this would cost prior to going into a T >> and then limit and and limit that to
maybe like no more than two hours worth of." >> Yeah. get a little they would say, "Hey, you know, it probably take us two, four hours to do that and they would just bill us to our general services contract for those hours worked >> because um for me tonight a lot of this because it's only our second meeting is
to look at these projects and to kind of prioritize how we want to do that, but more so to look at what do we owe, where are we at on them, and then um then we may have to come back at that point and and go through this again." And I think
chairman of this project missile hasn't miss do you have any timelines or funding or anything associated with this potential partnership that may be in jeopardy if it were to slow down. >> Yeah. Is this okay? >> Yes ma'am. Please come. >> Hello Jennifer Steel Cultural Arts
Alliance Walton County. We do not have any financial commitments at this time. We have been um just letting CRA take the lead on this and we have been um just kind of waiting. We're here to be a partner if when and if the time comes.
Um we would love to be a part of um the transformation of this building as a cultural anchor. Um at the at a point in um the punia that is obviously you guys purchased the building. You knew that it needed to be um some some love needed to be put back into it and we um have been
working with the CRA from the very beginning of that purchase to just we started with with very loose discussions. We've made some presentations and um the CRA um up until this point has been supportive of a partnership or potential partnership. We
um we're just kind of on standby until you guys are sure what you want to do. >> Okay. >> And I could make more arguments. I I I will send um a presentation that we sent that we gave the CRA in the very beginning that could be helpful to you all regarding economic development,
economic impact um how arts and culture can help transform a community in a very positive way um and a very healthy way. So >> awesome. >> Thank you. >> Thank you ma'am. >> So I'll say that given that commissioners I mean if you want to again there's no there's nothing
associated with this from a time perspective that's you know we're in a hurry to do or we're locked in All we have left is the final invoice there. And if you want to, we can slow down a second. Let's see if we can get that high level estimate on what that looks like. We can bring it back. >> Everybody's comfortable with that.
>> General consensus. Looks like that's it. Yes, sir. >> Um, Mr. Co, >> I've got a legal question, but um, >> I'm a fair legal. >> Okay.
I'm just kidding. >> And a finance director and a city manager. And what else? >> Is it something we can come back to with him on this one later? >> I'd like to know what um what the CRA's legal obligation is to uh as far as the
financial obligation that um that we're handcuffed to on this project. What do we owe them? >> I can I can answer that one, I think, because that's what we were talking about a few minutes ago. It looks like we have one outstanding invoice of $4,125
at the moment. Is that correct? >> Correct. And they perform that work. So >> So that we are obligated to pay. >> Okay. So um if if we're legally obligated to pay that, we we need to pay our bills. Mhm.
>> But under the new CRA, the top priority when it was put into existence was blight. And there's too much unknown as far as money here goes. And as far as the order of
priority goes, I think our infrastructure takes priority and the city needs. Like for example, we've got citizens that live well inside the city limits that
don't even have city services like sewer stuff. You know, they have to have their septic tanks pumped out. You know, we need we need to focus our money on that. And I'm going to classify this as a want, not a need. And we need to pay our
bills. And I think we should probably make a motion on whe on to pay this uh $4,000 outstanding bill if and then um and and then we need to shelf this and and until we get our priorities
in order >> and and I think you're going to see that here, Bill, like Mr. Townsen said he was going to bring his invoice back at the next meeting and then to look at some bylaw changes then so that we can streamline that a little bit better. I agree with you. I just don't think it's
on this conversation for tonight. This is kind of a status of where all these projects are to let you know about them in case you didn't know about them and then we can look at that. That's why I made that comment at the last meeting about the the CRA plan. If you read through that, I think we can accomplish
a lot of what you're wanting to do through that plan. Okay. >> So, it's just understandable. >> Would it be um appropriate if we uh made a motion to shelf this until more information comes in? At this point, >> I I don't think we're going to have to
at this point based on the conversations out invoice and we're going to work to bring back a high level cost estimate for you all to review and at that point that would be the to me that would be the perfect time to say okay move forward or don't move forward when you get that number. >> So, this is just forformational purposes. >> Yes.
>> Okay. Thank you, counselor. >> Is Mr. Touchstone still on? >> Yes, sir. He's still on. >> Mr. Touchstone is you're talking about raising the floor elevation on part of the building. Would that be a wooden floor or would that be concrete floor?
I anticipate that that would be a wooden floor and that way we can run some electrical and other utilities under the floor as well. >> Gotcha. Okay. Thank you. I was just curious. >> Yep. Yep. >> All right. >> I think we're good. Thank you, Mr.
Touchstone. >> Thank you guys. >> All right. We can move on to item 2B. >> All right. Thank you. Uh 2B is the amphitheater. Um here with us, I believe Levi, he's my dad architect. There are
the ones that were tasked um to to work on the amphitheater. So in your packet, you're going to see the you the presentation of what we got so far, probable possible cost, um some financial numbers, some other data. So
ultimately, I'll let him go with that. And I'll say I'm having trouble finding the email, so I'm still looking for that. email address, >> what the task for, what the contract number was. I'm still trying to figure that out. Emails got through ting, but >> there's a handful of things there. So,
um, a project was broken up into a number of sort of tasks. We made up the nine tasks essentially. Phase one was sort of a kickoff listening session. There's been a lot of seen lots of you had. Um, we did site evaluation and due diligence which included surveys,
geotech, other things like that, an assessment of the existing structure to determine, you know, if it was viable, you know, to continue forward. Um, we had a number of CRA presentations where we were looking at stakeholder engagement. We did, you know, sort of three concepts
before we arrived at the final concept. And so that was phase one. And the intention and what was expressed at that time was to manage risk and understand where the community was going to be. that the end of phase one we would be here in this sort of a meeting proceed further or not that and so the total of
that number was 18700 so it's 180,700 >> and that's for phase one >> phase one and that included like I said all of the the geotech the surveying the civil the architecture acoustic consultants structural engineers and a
lot of different and so we are effectively completed with phase one. That's where we stand today. And uh I think many of you have already seen the concept package. I'm happy to present that to you. I don't know if that's necessarily the today's meeting. Feel like I'm more here as information
or if there's any questions or gaps that you need filled. >> Um >> did you have any more? Um do we have any outstanding invoices with you at the moment? There are a couple and I did not go through
but I know that you guys said I've had a hard time finding information through email on this one so far. I don't think that's anything hard but we do understand our we'll get those gathered into the next meeting but again that's work that has
been conducted and completed. Miss Heaven, >> is it is it the majority of the $180,000 or is it just has the majority already been paid and these are just going to be little stragglers towards >> like 6040 on that? There's been a you
know this conversation has been sort of stretching out since about November of last year and so that's sort of where we're carrying some of that left. So you're thinking maybe about 40,000 of the phase one cost is saying about 40% of it has been paid and 60% unpaid >> 60% unpaid. Okay. Thank you.
>> We'll have that we'll have that to you on the next meeting. >> That's fine. That's that's Thank you, >> Mr. Cos. >> Again, this is just forformational purposes only. >> Yes. >> Okay. Thank you. I think I think ultimately what he is
looking for though is do you want are you ready to proceed do we want to proceed what what is the next steps that's looking for guidance on do they start doing work in phase two um or do we do we stop review what do we do so ultimately I think I think what will be appropriate is I think you've all seen
the plans they all been out there I think do is talk about the cost estimate y'all provide what that looks like so maybe go to whatever I think it's number two Jessie >> I You know, part of this too, it would be great to realign priorities. We did
sort of the the path that we were asked to do was to engage community level, understand what we understood to be the community. You know, there was the online surveys, the in-person meetings, a handful of those types of things. We tried to have some meetings with with you all and understand, you know, what's the how do we define success? That was
where the goal was. And so through that process we arrived at the design that you see today and the cost you know which is escalated and so there's a question there about well you know what can we do for you know insert a different number and we could realign our priorities to say how far can we
push that if it's still a priority and so I really do think that a big part of this and as you guys continue to look at it is to say you know what does success look like how far do you want to invest into that at this time you know is this something that gets delayed like you said after more critical priorities.
We're here to be a resource and support, you know, whether it's something cultural or it's something physical or if it's something infrastructure like that's where our profession is is the community development. And so, wherever that lands, that's where we would just like to know, you know, how do we assist
that? And again, I think it's also being responsible. We don't want to be just spending money to take pretty pictures and then be in a meeting like this. So, you know, anything we can do on that great. So the way that this uh is basically broken out is by vision. And so if you kind of just scroll down,
there's a handful of tasks. Each one of these is based off of the plan that we have. There has not been a contract crisis at this time. Um you know, there was no sort of clear commitment or a actual set of engineered drawings. And so the items here are based on sort of
market pricing, linear foot, some uh conversations with a, you know, whether it be the water or the electrical contractor. Hey, what do you think this will cost? Here's what we're looking at. Here's a unit price. So this to us is a high water mark. This is sort of like, you know, we print, we made a beautiful
picture. It's got inlaid lights. It's got, you know, exposed steel. There's a lot of cost there. And um, keep scrolling down. It appears to be a $7 million project is wherever the states can get down to that and that's including all the site work,
the storm water, the demolition of the existing building and all of that. So somewhere in that >> So you said you would be interested in my thoughts. >> Okay. I'm sure there's five different answers
to your question. Okay. And just speaking for myself and nobody else, I think we need to cut our losses and uh not even consider this as a going forward project. We need to pay you what you've done, but
that'll be at another meeting. and and I think the information we've collected over time, it it's it's it's very valuable for us to look forward in the future if there's other sources of funding and um and that we are able to
because there's certain grants that can only be spent for certain things, but realistically we do have a lot of infrastructure projects that I believe that this board wants to focus on um as much as we can and then try not really forget hitting everything that we've
done so far because that would be a total waste. But to to think about that as we move forward and then see where we could align it, get things back in because either way we look at it, we we know we're going to have to do some work at that amphitheater. Um anybody that sat down there recently will know from
the splinters in in your on your behind that that it needs some work done. So, um, but I don't necessarily know at this point what priority this would fall under for the rest of the board. Anyone else have comments? >> I do.
>> Yes, ma'am. >> Um, this will be low on my priority also. And I think that we also discovered just through general conversations of our regular council meetings that I didn't even consider like uh the noise the noise that might
be created and is there a better venue somewhere within the city limits but not right there at the lakeyard although I know that's you know a really nice place where we have the one that's there. Uh but I would like to ask Mr. Clay something. Um,
what's the possib What What's the TDC money allowed to be used for? Are they allowed to help the city in the event of if we found a different location where there's parking, where there's not going to be so much noise pollution or less, you know, less neighborhoods, aren't they allowed to use a portion of their
money for things like this? >> 125104 would allow the North Wall TD funds to be used for an auditorium, which theater is just an up auditorium. Mhm. >> And I've given that opinion in writing and Mr. Towns has seen that both the TDC director and him when that question was
asked. >> Oh, thank thank you. Because for some reason I was thinking that they could and I think >> that's north money, not south money. North money. >> Yeah. Well, and what I was thinking was Yeah. put it on the lower list of our
priorities right now. But should we work with the county or the TDC, maybe this could come alive again or >> but but for now I just think for the CRA money I do think that we have a higher priority projects that need to be addressed and start to finish completed
um before we would do so. >> Mr. P. >> So so to answer the commissioner question so two things I'll say is I believe Correct. I believe that CRA started out approached the TC about cost share on
feasibility study that ultimately I think TDC kicked that back and wanted to share cost didn't want to do that at the time so they move forward. So that they've been engaged before on this topic. I think that's my understanding that is correct. >> All right. Um and then other things like you said it's the TDC the north. So that
north end fund I'd say what $800,000 roughly it is. I'll tell you there's an ask going to the TDC within the next few weeks to allocate pretty much that entire pot to another project under the north end of this county. So >> 600 and that 800 has already been recommended allocated by the TDC and now
there's a new ask for a different >> So there's been two recommendations on north end money. One was from the tourism staff on advertising marketing for pretty much 600,000 and now there's another ask going to the TDC to redirect that money from market advertising to the farmers market and mostly effectively
>> in fact correct. >> So that ass is coming you can if that money was spent it's pretty much completed that fund collects maybe $20,000 a month give or take >> since 2021 it's at $855,000. So I I'm just saying I'm trying to tell
you that it's a very small pot and there's other people going after it right now. >> Yes. Because if I'm not mistaken, I recall they were maybe not all in agreement. Who was the commission the county staff uh elected officials that were discussing it. I think they were
kind of split also on their on how they wanted to move forward. So uh thank you for sharing that. So I think that that is something that this board wants to see done. We probably need to move fast with that request, but just let you know that's where they're at with the money. >> Yeah. I just
>> in terms of the plan, we talk about the plan. So going through it, I think there's some key distinctions real quick. I don't mean to hear all too far. Um the redevelopment plan is a plethora of things, right? As long as you're doing things that meet the goals and missions of that redevelopment plan within that map area. Of course, we have
a very unique area. um you you know this project could be shifted around. It could be made a priority. It could be made not priority. I'll tell you in there you know again and there's projects listed in listed in the redevelopment plan. You don't necessarily have to do those projects. Those are projects are identified as being eligible redevelopment projects.
But if you in the plan when you have time to go through again page 82 it kind of lists out a couple of those projects and it has the amphitheater essentially behind three other ones. And I'll read you the first sentence. that once the previous projects are complete and the benefits are realized further investment
in the core district would maximize a development. So I go to tell you that I think has been laid out the plan that's identified that there are other things that could build up to this to show the need of it. So that's something to keep in mind as we go through here. We're talking about priorities. >> Some things fall in line rather than being the main you do other things first
see that make a return on the trust fund and what it's bringing to the city and then you can move forward the next. So that's something to keep in mind too. No, >> I think just a couple other just if I can speak into it since I have the chance here. One was um as we were going
through this in addition to the grant funding, you're looking at sponsorships because there is an opportunity the name on the theater and or the amphitheater and you how that would be purchased, paid for, you know, that kind of thing. And so finding other avenues for the community development is a huge part.
Second one was that you know the as we were going through this you know the process did start with sort of a well what's the the minimum effort you know let's put some paint let's replace the chairs and by the time you keep doing those sort of things you know are you actually netting a gain for the
community and so that was sort of where the line kept getting moved and I would just encourage you I do think that there's a lot of community development opportunity with something like an amphitheater that park is an incredible asset to this community and so anything that you can do down and lakeyard that
also feeds into the main street district and the rest of those. You know, it's all a cascading effect where that synergy really helps. And so, you know, whether it's this project or something else, I would say, you know, that is something that can be revenue generating which can help offset some of these investments as you play that out.
>> I agree. I think we've seen some of that previously about potential partnerships stuff. And again, based off y'all's direction today, you may say, "Hey, this isn't our number one priority, but it's there. It's alive. start looking for private partnership to help fund this to help bring this to life, right? And so that's something that continue all the
time. So, >> so we have a number of sort of like our asphelt survey, the all the documents, the individual uh surveys from community and things that we've taken. We packaged all that up. So, I'll to you so you have sort of a record copy of all the efforts
that were done. You know, the work product of this and we'll put that in record and then however you go and use it be great. >> Awesome. Yes, Mr. Harrison. >> Um, I I do have, you know, three three concerns with this. love music and
concerts and all that, but you know, I kind of got hunged on the feasibility uh study that not being a financial feasibility study that was that was done and and that calls for, you know, in I
don't know what page I'm on right here, but it's you have the the event types and the totals like 52 events a year. Uh annual attendance 34,700. Of course, these are these are estimates. I realize
that. But 52 events a year in the historic district in a residential area without a feasibility study as to whether the public in that area would would stand for that uh after
spending seven or eight million dollars um is a is a big is a big question for me. It's a really big concern. Um I don't know that that people sound travels over water. You know, you and I, we met and and with with Rob and
we talked about the sound engineering and what have you. And and I know things can be done, but every time there's an event there, the street has to be blocked off that Circle Drive. That cuts off a good portion of the city's access to downtown uh quite
frequently. If if if to generate the revenue that, you know, we would all love for it to generate. I mean, that would be amazing. Um I'm just I'm not sure that the public is would tolerate that um the residents in that area.
>> I do think it be wonderful for downtown. No no no questions but people's uh homes and their their lives and that kind of stuff is important. >> I was just going to share is that we counted you know movies on the lawn as an event as well. And so I think some of those are sort of the 100 person event
and then the 1500 person event. And I would agree that the 1500 person was more closing the street, but you don't close the street when you're doing the uh Christmas lights, you know, that kind of stuff. And so that's all baked into there. And so there would be a little bit more of a probably a more detailed
study that you could pull out of that report that would break out, you know, how many are actually impacting the community, what is just sort of, you know, ambient attraction versus a ticket event. Because that was the other part of that too was when they were building out that study, I think it was about 60% public only 40% paid. Again, that sort
of 6040 ratio because this is ultimately amphitheater, not some outside operator. And so, you know, if you're only having 40% of your events being ticketed and you're still able to turn the profit, you indicates that there's a lot of opportunity to grow that. And so, that's sort of some other pieces that are in
that discussion. >> And and and one of those things that you mentioned management that that's another big question I have is who who would manage this? Who would book these apps? who would who would do all this scheduling um and manage it because city certainly
doesn't have the staff. Um we would have to think about that at some point, but to me we should think about that before we keep pouring money into a project we don't know. We agree completely and we using some case studies and precedence to have the same sort of discussion. So
another time if we want to revisit that, I'd love to have a deeper conversation about that. >> Agreed. All right. Thank you, sir. All right. >> Thank you. >> So, I guess ultimately that's the question, right? Phase one. Are we
moving to phase two or is the board saying pause? Let's shore up our outstanding invoices and then come back with the contract and see where we're at on that. What that looks like. >> For me, I think much like the last one, I think we need shore up invoices and
then just go to a pause for a little bit. look for other sources of funding and ways to do it as we move along. >> Agree, >> Mr. Peterson. >> So, now question on the TDC. I mean, is that something that uh I know >> we can wait on that one a little bit?
We're going to have a a meeting tomorrow and I can bring back some information from that. >> So, are you um saying that this project could continue? >> We're not moving forward at this time. It's basically a pause and then look for
other sources of funding and in the future as we go along. But not to say that we're going to waste all efforts that have been done so far because there's been a lot of public input into this. There's been funds expended into this. There's a wellthoughtout plan here, but it's just not something we
want to move forward with right at the moment. >> Agreed. >> Yes, sir. All right. Uh we can go ahead and move on to 2C, the historic preservation design and standards. Uh this is this is one of those kind of update ones. I so the uh CRA provided this to the
I can talk in third person every time. So myself a few months a few weeks ago that is completed the design historic standards are done. And so ultimately it's going to come to the city council that final product we'll take that there and see if that's if we want to approve it if they want to approve it they don't
want to approve it if there's any changes made. So I'm just giving you a heads up. This is one of the projects that we're going on. It's completed. is paid out. Just letting you know that's going to go before the city council final product and be up to them to determine its use. >> Okay.
>> Thank you, sir. >> Uh D is dog parkway still Mr. Chair. >> Oh, sorry, Mr. Chron. >> Are we going to receive a file like a file that we then able to edit this? because as I was reading through this uh
the other day preparing to to speak on historic preservation standards um at an event um there are some things that I think need to be tightened up. So I would like to to see maybe some edits made to this draft before we we finalize it. So do we have a a copy that we can
edit we receive that? >> I have the PDF we can reach out for the we can edit the PDF. Um, but yeah, we can reach out and try to get whatever that word document is or where the rent and then when we bring it to the council council changes, we can make those. I'm assuming we'll need to note that on the documents we're changing some work
product. I assume >> that's exactly what >> we'll do that. We'll note that those changes. >> If we want to use as a functional diagnos um back when Josh Irwin was the um chair >> director
>> director. Um Chris Wallace, it was discussed would bear the brunt of approving and disapproving and all that. And he he's kind of up to here right now. And this would require more staff
members that, you know, right now we're not in a position to be able to fund. Um there there was some um there was some question on what's acceptable and what's what's not acceptable. And I believe I used my own
house for an example on um Tex decking and uh Hardy board siding and things like that. And I didn't get an answer. He said right now we just don't know. So I think there's too many unknowns here.
Um I think this is a good idea. I think there's too many things uh unknown variables. Um but I don't think that this is on our priority list right now. Uh that's just my opinion. So >> yeah. So it's done. So this is completed. It's going to go to the
council. The council like like Mr. Dro said about edits that the council may want to see. What I'll tell you is speaking with Mr. Wallace previously I think and I think council made comments about this at meetings is that this may not become the ordinance. this may become a guideline for staff for city
staff to assist in that COA process. >> So, this wouldn't change the COA. Mr. Walls is still responsible for that COA in accordance with ordinances. Uh it's my understanding that this was done and been provided to be a guideline for something he can reference to say, "Hey, here's examples. Here's what we're doing." It was more so that that that
way. If that changes, that's fine. But I don't think it's going to cause any more work. It's actually supposed to be the opposite. Supposed to be an ability to look at and see what's uniform. So, so hold on. M, do you want >> before a per before a resident um say um
me and Glenn want to do something to our house since we live inside the city limits since we're in the historic district. Do we need to seek approval uh from uh >> the city >> from the city to be able to move forward? >> Depending on what it is, you need to get a COA, certificate of purpose.
>> Okay. based on these set of guidelines that you're asking already exist based on the city ordinance, >> right? But but you're saying it's coming back to the city for adoption. Correct. As a >> as a city council will review it and you'll decide whether you adopt it, whether you accept it, whether you make
it ordinance. >> But right now, simply a guide book. >> But right now, it's a guide book until we do something different. >> Staff's not even using it yet. Y'all have not seen it. The city council has not approved it. >> It It's intended, M. is intended to enhance the city of Orcus its ability
for people to see it. >> But Mr. Beerbomb just said, do we have the word document so that we can modify? He's found he's he's recognized it needs modified. So >> is that going to come back before the CRA to modify it since and I understood
the attorney to shake his head to say yes, can we make the changes ourselves? We don't have to have the vendor do it. Correct. >> We can just modify. Okay. >> If the CR wants to amend it, you can. And I think ultimately what he was that the city council is going to have some say in like make some change before they
give it to staff to use as a tool. >> And I'm just trying to get clarification based on what Mr. Cosen just asked. >> So would So would everybody like to see that come back before the CRA to make modifications and agree on it before the council or just let it go to the council
and then we'll look at it as the city council at that time? I would prefer just at the council level at this point since it's already done and written and it's already paid for. >> Go by the be clear. It does have to go to the pl just part of your standard process.
>> Okay. So it'll leave the CRA to the planning board. >> Next two stops will be planning board and city. >> Yes. >> There's no need for it to come back. >> Okay. >> I think I think this discussion is covered what I was going to say. >> Okay.
>> Okay. uh D the dog park facility. Uh Miss Miss Elizabeth Moore is here with Anchor to kind of go over that. But ultimately the uh dog park was an you know item that came before the city council from city tree board. City council asked them to
pursue the CRA on that. So they did. Um, there was a task order and I'm not seeing a task for amount. Oh, okay. That there was a design task order amount of $39,519.50 and at which point city got into construction. There would be a CI
monthly fee of $6,170 a month. To date, um, the CRA has expended $27,719.50 for design and $0 for CI. So, uh, if you're okay with chairman, Mr. M. Moore can come up kind of talk about the project. Um, go over her understanding
from from board and then the cost provided. >> Miss Moore, >> good afternoon. How are you? >> Good. Thank you, ma'am. >> And you all have this uh what's up here in front of you as well. >> Yes. Um so Elizabeth Warren and Jacob with anchor CI uh we um as you said we
were contracted with to completed design for the dog park that's be located right back here. Um the design is is fairly minimal. It's um it's got two side two sides to it. Small park small dog side and a large dog side. Um the site itself
that was identified is a little bit less than an acre. Um the design right now includes a pavilion for seating that would go to both sides, you know, so that if you have a small dog or a large dog, you can sit on the pavilion um and keep an eye on your your pet. And then u
we also have some additional parking that's involved. Um we did present some options for some bathrooms, free bathroom. Um and as we told the CRA previously, the bathrooms can go you have a lot of options for bathrooms. You can spend zero dollars and not have a
bathroom for people at all. Um, you could spend 80,000 to get a prefab building that's got two stalls in it that the city does a lot of the the preliminary work as far as building the pad. Or you can do a stick built for as much as 275,000 more depending on what
you want to do. Zer dog park, I think probably the lower end of that spectrum is where you want to be. Um, these pre-fabricated bathrooms um are very nice. We've had several clients that have used them. Um you can get them like I said as cheap as 80,000 or you can go
up from there on. Um the design included we're pretty much leaving there's a lot of trees on site. We're pretty much leaving those as is. Um in the current design very minimal grading. We did talk to city staff. They said that um we would have to have some storm water improvements made. So um that's really
the last bit of the design. We're about 80% done with that design. Um that includes parking uh path for bathrooms and sidewalks and fencing. So, um, and the only thing that's, um, outstanding is we do have a $15,000,
um, invoice that's outstanding out of the total 27,000 that's been >> that was 15,000 >> 15,190. And as I said, the total cost of the park, including $160,000 bathroom, um
parking a 20% contingency is about 400 to,000, but again, you know, you can move that around in there. So, >> yeah, because I saw the the bathrooms like 160,000 as >> I have some.
>> Miss, >> did I just hear you say $410,000 for this project? Keep in mind I I did I I figured that would be your response. Um so so keep in mind that that includes 160,000. So almost half of that is a bathroom. So if you go without a
bathroom that takes out a lot of that. Um and you take out a 20% contingency that's 70,000. So that takes it down to half of that. >> And this is over here by the police station. >> And again, you know, you can there's a lot of value engineering you can do there. It has a pavilion in it that's
around $40,000. You don't have to have pavilion. You could have, you know, um, shade sales, you know, that kind or you don't have to have any sort of seating. So, there's a lot of variables in there that I think this current board needs to. >> Mr. President, yes. >> Can we ask Miss Kim to come up? Because
if I recall properly, she was seeking private funding. Now, if private funding is going to play into this, I'm not my attitude might change a little bit on the cost of what might go in there, but I don't know what the status is of the
private funding source. >> Miss Camp, >> so uh private funding was a fundraiser that I was going to do. I put that on hold when it went to the CRA, uh to get the design and everything together. Um,
we certainly didn't have anything this elaborate in mind when we first proposed this. Um, we did not, and I appreciate the bathroom option, um, but we did not discuss bathrooms. Um and then also as a
reminder uh Northwest Florida fencing uh had said that he would if if we gave him a budget he would be very transparent with his numbers he would have labor for free for fencing and would only have the
slight a small markup on the um on the materials themselves. So um and he would show us all of that information. So I I feel like it's far more affordable than what it is looking like today. Um
certainly with you know the fencing should be far less than $28,000 would that's I'm this is my opinion. >> Yes. >> I believe it would be less than that. Um, we talked about, um, having a couple
of benches, uh, you know, some shade sales, uh, I think would be perfectly doable because right now, while we know the public has asked for one, we need to to prove this concept before we put
three or 400,000 into it. We want to make sure that the public does indeed use it after asking for it. So, I I think minimal having something for water, right, for the pets and for um and for the people. Um a couple of benches. We
did talk about having some um you know, people donating benches, right? Um so, that wouldn't be $2,000 a bench. It would be zero hopefully for the city. Um and I'm I'm happy to go back and look at
that fundraiser. I have estimated um that it would bring somewhere around 10 to 15,000 if it goes as planned. It's been a long time since I've looked at those numbers, so don't worry about that. >> Can I just ask one more question? Did anybody in in the surveys and stuff? Do we have
any idea how many citizens want to come and use this dog park? >> We had a a and I I've got it on my laptop. I can go uh look at the results, but there were several hundred people who filled out the results. This is when
we were originally looking over next to the um the tennis courts >> actually. So, this was back in 21 when this all started and we were looking at the tennis courts and there were >> I'd say 60 or 70 people that said
>> we want to to be a part of this. We want to know what's going on. uh we would be willing to donate, give, um volunteer in some way, shape, or form. Um so I I it was a it was a strong response.
>> Do you think those same people are still all in? Does somebody have a list of who those people might be? >> Somehow the list was not kept. We have we have the the survey responses
but somehow the >> Yeah. Okay. Thank you, >> Mr. Co. >> As far as careful when we interview people that they were from here, >> okay, >> this was at Lakefest.
As in some other projects that we've already gone over, um we need to pay the architectures for their work and they've done a fantastic job. Um I think we need to cancel their services now and wait until
Miss Winterberg comes back and let's see what she says on her figures. >> Okay. It's up to the board. I think my recommendation to you would be to move through the design, finish the design part of this because it seems like the
board previously has said yes. It seems like the council council was open to it. They just wanted to go to the CRA and have the tree board work to raise money. Um this cost has been budgeted. My my take on it old time I relate to the person who sat here previously twice is
to me it should be a phase design approach, right? Phase one is that very basic intro dog park. Let's see the use. Let's see if it's going to people how much going to use it. Second phase is start adding in amenities, a little bit of amenities. Third and final phase, the bathroom, right? Because not only is it
cost, it's who's going to maintain the building, who's going to maintain facility. That's going to be the city. And so we got to take that in consideration we're doing this. So I would say that phase approach would be my recommendation to you. Do a sign that shows one, two, three, and then you get calls from there. And I agree with Miss Winterberg. If you want to do it, take
it back to the community once we got those done if there's any changes to be made. But I can tell you that's going to be a very similar format to what city's going to start doing from a planning perspective from input and looking at phase approach projects. >> Yes, ma'am.
>> Just a quick question. You you I never asked this before with our parks and recreations, but I'm assuming this is going to be similar to the parks. How much liability insurance do we have to carry for people's animals or pets or whoever's going to use this? >> I look at that. I'm not sure we've asked
that question. >> Do we carry liability insurance at all of our parks? >> Yeah. >> Have we ever gotten a parent that their child has gotten hurt and have filed a claim? >> I'm just curious. >> Since I've worked with the city, the only claim we received is from Lake last
year, which ultimately fell on the vendor. That's why we make them make us an additional truth. But in terms of city parks, I'm not aware of those. Well, again, since Mark, >> it may well have happened, but I'm struggling over the past 20 years to think of one. >> They are covered as city property under our FMIT
policy. >> Mr. Co, >> for clarification, Kobe, are you suggesting that instead of paying them what we owe them that we that we keep them and pay them for this phase program you recommended? >> Well, I get >> just yes or no.
>> Yes. Okay. >> We're in the middle of design. So unless the board says you know what we're done with the project at all then I think you need to finish design you been budgeted you you sign the task for finish it show the the f because ultimately end of the day >> it's got to go to the city council for approve >> okay >> you can build on city
>> well instead of spending the money on designing something that may not even occur. How about if we terminate their services, let Miss Winterberg figure out how she wants her park,
and then we can take the money that we would have paid for designs that may or may not occur and put them on more priority items. So, I'm not going to agree to go ahead and keep throwing money at this. when
she come when Miss Winterberg came up with a very economical plan. So that's my recommendation. >> Yes, ma'am. >> The only thing I would add is that the only really outstanding design item left is the storm water. That's the one thing that we're working on now, which from
what I understand from city staff, that's going to be required no matter what we do out there. That was the last thing that that we were working on was just finalizing that. We finalized the plans themselves. The bathrooms are prefab, so we're not with that. So what we have so far is pretty much the layout
of what um of what what has been discussed previously even if it was phased in. Um and so that we're about I think 70 or 80% build out on it. So we the last little bit is this one where you'd have to have what I understand talking to city staff whether you put
fences around it and stop there. >> And from from what I see the original budget was like 39,519. We've expensed 27,000 so far to date. Is that the right one?
>> And then we still have 15,000 outstanding, but there's only if my math's right, there's only $11,000 within that original allocation. >> And what we could also, and I'm not trying to I'm not trying to get an additional fee out of this. That's not my intent. I just I want to make sure
that you get what you pay for which right now I think if we gave you the plans you would not be able to build it because you don't have the storm water design course and you don't have a storm water permit. So what we could do that was we would make sure that we did not progress any further on the rest of the design if that's you know anything that would not be included in what was
already discussed. >> What what's your estimate of performing a storm water analysis and getting that put together >> as far as timelines >> cost? Uh there's what we say $12,000 left maybe 8,000 of that. >> Oh, okay.
>> So um bidding and procurement I think was part of our task as well which >> you okay with that? >> I I am Miss >> He is the um what causes us to have to do the storm
water piece of the puzzle especially if the bathrooms and things aren't going in. Um, it's your city policy that whenever you have a development of this size because we called the planning department and talked to them. I was a little curious myself too because you really don't have that much impervious
and for you they don't have but you are you do have a development and so by the strict letter of your code of the city's code we do have to do but if that's cancel with building department ultimately building department county is going to issue permit they're going to require
your stormware design. Well, it's planning. Yeah. Priority problem. >> It's part of the do process, which is not >> But we're not going to build anything. Correct. I'm just trying to get some clarification. If we if we fail to do if we choose not to do the bathrooms and we choose not to do a pavilion
and there's no buildings going up there, do we even have to do the storm water is my thing. Because then why pay 11,000 for that to be in the design when we're not have no intentions of putting the back the buildings in? I mean, I guess ultimately if the
board's intention is to never put them in or you could do that now and then if in three years from now you decide to put those things in, then you just had to have a storm water design, >> but we could do it at that particular time, right? So, we could save maybe potentially whatever >> 11,000. >> Yeah. >> Yes, ma'am.
>> Um, I will say though that it it didn't have anything to do with the impervious versus impervious, which is what D and Northwest water management typically based on. It was just a major development on the trip. So, >> and and and I'm assuming that it's major because we there's two buildings planned
on that lot or >> I think it was just any development the way that they the development is defined in the land development code. This is considered a development. So, you have to >> I don't believe it has anything to do with the buildings, bathrooms or otherwise. It's the nature of the size of the development site the way you have.
>> So, just for I'm understanding it's just it's only going to be a fence that's cut in two. one for the large dogs and one for the small dogs or am I missing something? >> Parking lot improvements. >> There were improvements. But I tell you what, we we can do it this way. We will do a little bit more research. We will
get back with you all as far as and we'll get something in writing from the planning as to what is required. >> Very helpful. >> So there sidewalks as well. I think I saw 800 ft. Is that inside the fence around the perimeter or is that on the street?
>> It's mostly along the street if I remember around the bathroom. having ADA accessibility to the actual park. >> Okay. So that's part of the stone stone probably >> just nonical I would suspect that would add to it. Um,
so the design that you have now, it would it be pretty easy to do phased approaches to getting this done over a period of time with the design that you have or would it have to be modified to >> allow it because you know I I see what
you you're saying the restrooms a huge cost there and it's not something we have to have immediately with it. Um, I know a lot has been put in this has been talked about for a long time. Um, And we are we are looking for money to do a lot
of lot of different things. And you can tell we're kind of gathering information here because we were not the CRA, but now we are. So we're having to we're having to digest all this information as it comes and it's fast and furious as a lot. And we don't we don't want to
discount everything and throw everything off the shelf and everything that's been done in the past just be forgotten about. We we have to figure out what what we can do realistically to do this. To me is something that can get started um at a fairly minimal cost and phased
in as we accumulate more money to do it. This is one of those quality of life things for our community. Um, and you know, it it although we Yeah, we we've got plenty of water, sewer, and street problems and and all that, but
I think we're capable of of of juggling a lot of things simultaneously. This man's doing a wonderful job of doing that. Um, and and the council has. So we we have to look multi-dimensional I think at these projects and and try to figure out how how to get them done and
at least move forward not just scrap everything right off the table if they don't want to we'll do that more work we get a letter under better understand why the storm is there we bring that back whatever meeting that's available then you all can decide do we stop design there leave stormware out
and we understand if we ever were to in the future add bathroom or other things that may require that sign to be complete. >> Good, Mr. Case. >> Or once we decide where we're going on this and how it's going to end up turning out, depending on circumstances
and finances, we could take we could address this problem then and not pay for it now. Um, we may need it, we may not need it. We may we may get a variance. I don't know.
But instead of sinking any more money in this project, let's just back off of it right now. And if we have to get a storm water plan in the future, we can get it. And just and just to clarify something, I'm not trying to uh there's something on this list that
I'm going to be very positive about. And uh >> we're about to get to it, too. >> Yeah. and and and and that's why I'm watching our watching our dollars. That is exactly what I'm we're fixing to get to the priorities in just a few minutes.
>> I think commissioner I think that's what you just say exactly what we're going to do because we're about to know they're going to pause. We're going to get the termination of storm water that's going to come back and you are going to decide on do we stop design there? Do we move forward storm water or not? Again, ultimate end of the day, city council's got to approve it before anything happens on the fish.
>> Okay. >> All right. Thank you. >> Can I ask one question? How long is the shelf life of this plan for the >> dog park forever? I don't see it change unless some sort of >> statute city regulations. And then if we get
>> So if we pick this up later on two years versus, you know, six months, >> it's still we can it's still >> still. Okay. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> All right. Um we'll move down to 2E. Chairman, this one again, this is just
one of those kind of checkins. This the downtown parking study. I looked, but it's it's completed, right? We we that we we've been through that the council city council have been presented on on that final product and recommendations there in I bring you out here as a segue into these last few
projects because you'll notice they're all within one area, right? >> And so my recommendation to the board and you can all tell me no co you want to do that or how you want to go about it. My recommendation to the board and what I have thought to be the way forward for a while is to get the high level picture of what downtown is going to look like and what this board and
ultimate city council wants to see downtown look like in conjunction with Main Street and other organizations and citizens who operate down. So just from my view, we don't have that currently today. Right? You've got six, five different projects that that have either
occurred or going on that are in independent design phases. They're independent projects one another, but in reality they are not. They're going to impact one another. We are going to hopefully we don't point to run to the point where we're going to redo work we just did and we sure don't want to get into that. It's going to slow us down.
It's going to cost money. So my recommendation to you as we go through these last few are to think about possibly on some of these one of them know but other ones maybe pump breaks a second let's go and let us coordinate the main street and the community let's better understand exactly how what we're
trying to do downtown fits in with Main Street master plan incorporate the parking study the recommendations are there and let's get that big picture together and these are all components of the big picture so that that's my recommendation to you have to answer me on that now but think about as we go
through these here how they're inter they're interconnected these different ones are >> Mr. Co. >> So parking study we've already paid $40,000 on a parking study right it's >> already completed yes
>> okay so that's the subject we're talking about right now correct >> so so if we've already paid for it and we've already got the parking study what what are we talking about parking for >> this was just my segue into downtown because one of two of the two of the um
I believe two of the projects coming up the restriping and the railroad were recommendations out of the parking study. I believe I think there's some other recommendations that park need to be considered as part of the bigger picture. So again this was a segue in down projects. It's not that we necessarily need to do anything with the
study. It was just >> okay. Miss Heaven, >> this is clarification. I'm city council. I recall them coming up explain it to us. I thought the parking study project was complete. We agreed.
It wasn't a wasn't a 5-0, but we agreed there. We were going to take this particular design and the parking spaces were going to go this way, you know. >> Oh, no. That's that's the resting I think. >> So, we did the council did accept. We're going to get to that. We're going to get to that one in just a second. >> Is that a different one on this one?
Which one is that? >> This one was the one where we went around the lakeyard and they analyzed the business activity throughout the daytime and then took peak hours and figured out how many cars were parking. And from what I I recall, they basically
the conclusion at the end was currently we don't have a parking problem, but eventually we will have a parking problem. But they kind of left it depending on how you looked at it and and there was only a few times that they actually came out and completed those
studies if I remember right as well. >> So the study's complete it's been accepted right and it exists. Some of these again are recommendations out of the study that the city council has given the green light on to go forward with. So, so it has been used. All I The reason I put on here was to say, "Hey, we're getting to the downtown. Part of
the components of downtown is this parking study. There are other recommendations in the study that have yet to be implemented and I think they should be in consideration with these other problems." And did we talk about those other pieces and parts of this parking study when Josh Irwin was the one? Because I my recollection is when
Josh was up here and brought a lot of this forward because I recall him saying okay uh didn't need to do it on this street or that street. And I kept asking, did anybody think about asking the fairgrounds, can we partnership with them and have, you know, they bought
those trolleys for the south end or whatever to to tote people around? And I thought, oh, when we have events, we could use fairgrounds for Is that the same parking study as we're talking about now? >> Yes. >> Will you Will you do me a favor? Because
I'm in agreement with whatever you said said for your segue. resend this to me electronically, please. Okay. Thank you. >> Yes, Mr. Cass. >> So, some information that we didn't have when we were talking about the parking studies and all that stuff and uh this
just this is new information that's only a week old. So, I was in the downtown area the other day and one of our businessmen, business person uh asked me uh about
utilizing parking where the thriftway was. And I said uh he said, "Can we use that parking?" And I said, "I don't know. The city doesn't own that. The county does, but let me make a phone call."
a county commissioner answered the phone and uh I said uh I'm here with a downtown uh business owner and wants to know if city events can utilize the county
property and he said not only are the are y'all welcome to utilize the uh the property where the thriftway was but we could make improvements on it. Um, and I I don't know if he was talking about paving. Uh, that was a possibility, but
he was talking about definitely talking about striping and adding a lot of parking places for us. So, that little bit of information is brand new. So, that would help alleviate a lot of pro uh parking right there when we have major events.
>> And I think that's that's that's my point, right? is to bring all the stakeholders together what downtown will look like incorporate that the county as part of that with that property now what is their future use of it how can they assist us in this because ultimately if you're going to do that you have an intended use for it there probably needs
to be some uh safety upgrades made at the crossings those intersections too so that that's my whole point of the segment >> okay >> agree was was there a reason why you put these in this particular order the way that
you And again E was the segway I did F because it's probably the biggest project and then obviously G and H will come together and I it's already completed again but I know S's talked about it and you've all talked about the lighting too. So that's the reason
they're in this order. >> Mr. River, do you have anything? >> Yes, sir. >> Would Mr. Harrison? >> Yeah. Well, you know, a lot of these projects have been talked about over over the years independently like like you say, and it just always seemed like
there's been not a lot of cohesiveness as to what the end result should look like in downtown. That's Main Street, Florida City, Main Street USA city. There there is a look across the country of Main Street towns and we're not
there. And so putting these things together, for example, the parking uh the one block, seventh to eighth corner of of restriping, reconfiguring to straight in parking, um and resurfacing that. We had
discussed, you know, amongst ourselves, Kobe and I have had conversations about uh storm water problem there. um water not draining and one end down on the south side of Baldwin across from the clock there at the bank 2inch pipe all
the street water comes and tries to go through that that needs to be redesigned and redone well paving that street restriping parking spaces doesn't solve that problem at all and so I think that's what uh Mr. challenge is interested in
accomplishing here is looking at all these these projects collectively and and then systematically getting them done. I mean, if you're going to do one block, why not do four blocks? You know, uh if it's just going to resurface uh
underground infrastructure, if if any of that needs to be replaced, that's the time to do it. You don't pave and then tear it up and replace. You you you just don't do things in that in that order. And we're talking about saving money. We can't save money by wasting money. And
so this is a this is a good idea to put these things together and and look collectively at downtown and the railroad crossings and all that could be done all as one project. The the string lights,
my opinion, no more string lights. I I I don't we we spent money on string lights a lot of time and they're not they're not working any longer. We need pedestrian lighting downtown and that's something that contributes to the main street wood. So I think we'll be way
ahead of the game by looking at these the overall downtown vision of where we want to go and then figure out how to get there instead of pieces and parts and then redoing things. >> Mr. Okay.
>> So, you gave me a a comprehensive plan on what the downtown section could look like um in a booklet that was uh produced by Main Street? >> Yeah, that was Main Street. >> Okay. So, we've we've already spent the
money to collect all this information. Is anybody looking at that or was that just another idea that >> I believe Main Street Main Street did that through a grant? if I'm not mistaken. >> Well, back in 22. >> Okay. >> Um and I'm not I don't think the city
council ever adopted that plan. My recollection is they have not. >> Would it be that? >> Again, that's part of that's part of my thing here, right? Is to include main, hey, you did this plan. Are there components of this plan that you want to see done? And if so, let's put let's factor those in. Let's talk about them. Let's see if they're feasible, if
they're if they make sense or not. Um and go forward there. I think the main street has ideas about the lightning as well, right? So, I think there's a lot of a lot that can be done there. Again, I'm not go too into particular, but I know Commissioner Gribb had his conversations. He's had ideas down there, especially on that block for power and some other stuff that he can
talk about later. Right. So, I think there's a lot there's a lot more to be gained there that's going to save us money in the long run that's going to make them a lot better. >> Yes, sir. Do you think it would be advantageous uh would this board be willing to look at that pamphlet that I'm talking about to
look at it and kind of cherrypick from it and say these are you know we got several really good ideas here. Do you have any more of those uh Main Street pamphlets that were published uh by any chance? >> Is that anything this board would be interested in?
>> I'd say yes only because I don't know what you're talking It's the downtown master plan, wasn't it? So, >> I'm I'm very >> So, what do you think? >> I I think that there there are certainly viable projects within that plan um that that we can certainly um adopt and and
pick up. Uh I again agree with with Kobe's direction here. I think I want to take it one step further. And I know Dan, you're probably going to want to throw something at me when I say this, but I don't I don't think it serves anybody
well to to have all of these different documents and then we're just pulling ad hoc from them and saying we're going to do this, we're going to do this. We really needed one cohesive document, which means we're going to need either staff or somebody outside to to take all
of that information and everything that we want, whether it's from the CRA plan, whether it's from the main street plan, whether it's from the water sewer master plan that he's working on, and bring all that into one cont comprehensive document that says this is our master plan for the downtown business district
or the main street district or what whatever boundary we want set. We I think it would be a disservice if we don't come up with that document and let that be a strategic long-term document that guides our decision. >> Yes. Go.
>> In response, my suggestion was we could look at what they what they presented and cherrypick from it >> and then put this into a new master
plan. taking the best of of the ideas and incorporating it into the master plan that you're suggesting. >> That's probably going to mean spending money on a new plan. >> We do a lot of that, don't we, >> Miss E? >> What What is the plan that we just did
with the fiveyear strategic exercise that we all came up here and and did? What What are you calling that? >> That's the city strategic plan. How do we incorporate what we're just now talking about into that? Can we or is it because we're the CRA now and that's not
because again we're that's another entity. So you got Main Street, you got us as a city and now you got us as a CRA. So I would like to see what Mr. Beerbomb just said and cherrypick out of this one and this one and this one and we're already paying this new vendor for a five-year plan. If that's part of our
goals, I would love to see that incorporated into that. Who was it? Rap Rep Rapellis. Was that the name of >> Who was Rapellis? I I would I would agree agree with you. They're getting close to finishing. I think that's the whole point of that, right? >> Maybe we need to put them on pause so we can do this.
>> We need to watch this. >> I think I think I think you're going the backwards way. >> Oh, okay. >> The five-year plan is what should dictate the CRA. It should dictate. It should dictate everyone below it. That's right. So that so I'm thinking I'm saying is they're moving forward right direction because you all identified infrastructure investment is a great key
prior to the city. Well this CR board can say hey we're we're meeting the goal of the city council on that as an infrastructure investment >> right so I think you're on the right path I don't think we slow them down they need to finish and then you can take those elements and say what >> but I don't know what the elements are that I'm just learning today as a CRA
commissioner Mr. Beerbomb just brought forward something that's now ringing in my head that oh wait I want to cherrypick maybe some things out of these other ones to incorporate it into the big picture so that >> that everybody is then
>> meeting complying with what the city wants as a whole from their council members. And if I may piggy back off this further, um >> I don't want to keep going too far off this, but one of the things we staff folks bring to y'all in within the next meeting or two is a plan for
>> for me again just like we're talking about downtown having that high level view that plan. What are we going to do? When are we going to do it things that could be done throughout the for different areas of the CRA map, right? We look and say, "Okay, let's look at the west side of town. Let's get a high level view. This is going to be the
westside neighborhood plan. these are the things we're going to complete over the next seven years. We're going to do these things, >> right? You could do that for various parts of the city. That's very common looking at other CRA very common to pull that together and we're going to do these in this area. We're going to do that and these are our target goals and these are our KPI metrics. So I think
that's something we'll bring forward. I think this is the start of this is number one and you can work out it. So instead of having I know Mr. comparison icon today. It's very difficult to see progress when you've got one thing here, one thing over there, one thing over there. Or if you've got this area, you're doing these three, you're doing
these two. You start to see progress. People start to see it. They start to see the city and CRA are working well together and getting things accomplished the tax dollars. So, I 100% agree with everything you said. I think you can take even a step further to really prog I just want to go ahead and put on the
record and and clarify um I'm I'm very familiar with the Main Street master plan. Um, it is my opinion as well as from what I understand, many opinions from current former board
members of the C of the of Main Street that there are elements within that master plan that the vendor included that they may or may not have agreed with. They were um blue sky, you know, you know, kind of like if we had blank
check type of thing. So I I want to to kind of go and put on the record that there are going to be things that even within the main street plan that I don't necessarily agree with. It's not it's not going to be a complete and total let's just adopt the whole thing as is. >> Sure. Pick it. >> Correct. Um and then if there's one
thing I I have learned sitting at this dest for seven years now is we may look at something as a as a conceptual plan and we may all think hey this is a great idea and we may vote to move forward and then we hear otherwise from the public. So, I
I think that when when it comes to altering and improving our downtown, that's something that we need to go in very carefully and methodically on because there are a lot of opinions on our historic downtown and what we should and shouldn't do, how we should preserve
it, how we should move forward. >> Can Mr. Harris? Well, yeah, if I can on on that there there and there are people that question, you know, why does a city or CRA whatever interested in putting so much money downtown? Well, if you
remember back from 1980s, 1990s, there really was no downtown to speak of. There were a lot of empty buildings after Walmart came in in town. So, it has come a long it has come a long way. And the reason it has come as far as it
has is because of investors uh such as yourself. You know, you own a building downtown. Uh Mr. Henderson owns several building. Miss Winterberg owns own bu So there's multiple people that have invested heavily in downtown. Why? Well, because they love this town and and it
it it grows from there. It just spreads. the the whole attitude about our city, our home, uh, spreads from that lake and from from historic downtown outward. We're going to have the the the big box stores eventually. We're going to have all the franchise stores. All that money
leaves here except for the employees and the sales tax dollars. Downtown stays here for the most part. And so, it's important and and it's it's a source of pride uh for our community. So, it is an investment. It is infrastructure. Um, if
these people are investing so much money in these buildings and and not not just just to buy them, but to renovate them. I mean, we got roofs on the verge of falling in and what have to be repaired and will be repaired because these people are dedicated to downtown. So, I
think the least we can do is be dedicated to ensure their success uh in making downtown um a pleasurable place for people to come visit. We know they spend a lot of money in areas like that.
>> So, I think we we've gotten a little We're in it, but we're getting a little away from parking study. So, I'd like go into more of the actionables here and get into 2F with the downtown alleyway improvement. >> Yes. So, we're roll out real quick. I think some of these are probably going
to be much shorter now conversations basically in where we're at cost. Well, with all that said, um F downtownway improvements and Morg can come up speak on that. Personally, we're talking about the high picture, but this is a much longer process project, particularly highways. Um they're a little bit
segregated from everything else in downtown, right? They're between buildings. It's going to take a lot of coordination. So, ultimately what I think is what they're looking for tonight, what we're looking for is a little direction from all from all you. I think they're about 30% design so far. Do we continue with design? Do you want to pause it? What are some elements you
don't like? Again, we don't have to spend all night on it now. We can bring it back, but it's one of those in those alleyway stuff. It's a little bit segregated from everything we're talking about at the moment. So, continuing design probably isn't going to upend anything else at this moment, but that's the biggest project down there. Um, and
it can keep that rolling forward if that's what you want to do. If not, we put on pause until we do exactly what we just talked about. I think um if I in recent conversations the city council there was I can't remember exactly which design we went or they they selected at
that point um but is it the one that's included in the packet here >> because there were some issues with scuttlebutt about the decorations or little things or would the semitruck by Evans be able to fit down that alleyway or something but I I swear I remember
them saying that that alleyway way was wide enough to accommodate that. And um I'd like I'd like for Miss Moore to come up and and talk about that a little bit if she will because I think that might put our minds to ease on some of those questions now that the CR can decide
this. >> We'll do a quick intro where we're at and then >> yeah and actually um Jake has been involved in this from the very beginning as you recall Brian in our office first. I'm gonna let him give you a little bit of background first and then we'll be happy to answer your questions. >> Thank you.
>> Okay. So, my name is Jacob Brock. I work with Anchor CI. Uh the CRA previously task Anchor with producing a design to improve the water alley downtown between 4th and 11th Street. Uh the major design criterias that were identified were an improvement to the sewer system, an
improvement to the storm water system, and while we're in there, they wanted to um improve the gas system because it's on good fire protection right now. And then they also wanted to improve the overall like aesthetics and walkability of the alleyway. And we were going to move all the utilities underground while
we were at we coordinating with the utility companies in order to get prices and timelines for them to move all their utilities underground. And that will require more coordination in the future. Anchor is currently we've currently done our design and we are currently identifying the status of the water infrastructure and surrounding parts of
the island. So, real quick, piggy back together, the task order was uh designed in the amount of 129,700. The there was a CDI portion that would be $7,800 a month once you got into construction. And then there was a not
to exceed hourly for lighting and electrical coordination that would occur during design. So to date, uh, there's been $30,780 expended and again, it looks like we're about 20% complete so far on design. So again, we we're going to go to the
opponent, but ultimately end of this, we're going to want to know, do you want to continue move forward or do you want to pause it >> on design of the alleyway project that we wanted to borrow money for? We're only 30% complete. Is that what I just understood you to say? >> 20% is what I provided. >> And I should clarify that part of the
reason for that is because we want to save the city some money. We could have videoed it and hired somebody to come in and video this the storm sewer and the storm I mean the wastewater system. That's a huge part of this design is knowing exactly what's in the ground, where the connections are. We instead in
coordination with the CRA decided to have the city staff use their resources and so they video it. So they recently completed that and then we put it on pause due to the changes that were happening. >> Is that is that video available to us to see what's down in there? because I'd
like to see >> Yeah, it has been I think the only thing left we follow with storm water or do they >> storm water has not been completed >> all that as well. So does water and sewer is complete but storm water has been completed >> just the um uh just the sewer systems. >> Okay. Oh yeah
the I'm sorry the sewer system >> when you were saying >> that's done that's completed. >> When you were saying coordination with other utility companies further into the future how how much further in the future were we looking there? Well, that was like construction coordination and timelines and timets and making sure
that they do every they can get everything in efficient. >> Okay. >> Yeah. Basically to make sure that our design coordinates with their design because a lot of the utility companies like fiber optic and gas but um some of those other companies they're going to design um their portion
but it has to be coordinated with us. So they have to run engineers >> miss >> and and I'm only putting this a lot of this together recently. Um it's FPNL and like three communication vendors. Is that who we're talking about?
>> Yes ma'am. FPL and then there's three um fiber um fiber communication vendors >> and did FPNL did they start any I understood they haven't even started any of it. Is that accurate? >> We have a disposal from them and we were going to need the city to start make an
additional engineering fee. >> Put the project on pause, right? >> So, actually there's a there's a large kind of leadup point for FPL because they have to look at it and see what their design fee is going to be. And so, they recently got us that fee for what it would be that what they would charge
the city to actually do the design. And so, that's where we are and that's where they stopped. >> And I don't want to take up the time here, but are you all available? Like I want to be more educated from what y'all Okay. Thank you, >> Mr. Harrison. curious on the storm water because I I know you have it's not
complete the storm water aspect of it but will that include just the alleyway itself or once the water exits the alleyway into the intersection where it goes from there what >> a great question >> that's actually what we're working out
now is is what and I think >> yeah that's kind that's kind of the investigation we're currently in is to determine what is in the ground in the alley and then what it's connected to if it connects the functional storm water then we can connect it. If not we may need to address those concerns later in
terms of adding additional storm water >> down the fourth street. >> I know we were talking about different ways to get the water out of the alley with either curbing if we do sidewalks or V-shaped asphalt >> without sidewalk but once it hits that intersection does it does it pool it do
we have what we need for it to get on out? >> Yes sir. We'll address those concerns. >> Yeah. And we're very sensitive to that too. We don't we don't want to dump a bunch of water onto cross streets where people are going to be shopping trying to get to shops. We also don't we understand that the lake sensitive. There's highway 90 that's sensitive. So
there's some constraints there that we're working through right now. And actually that's where we got that was my biggest concern at that point was the storm water and where it was going to go once it leaves the there is going to be a significant amount of storm water. I mean it's not it's not a huge area but there's a lot of inquiries. There's a lot of rooftops. There's a lot of downspouts. We've driven through it
several times looking at what else is connected. And then you have to coordinate that with how to the storm waters I mean to the waste water so it doesn't conflict doesn't conflict and so there's just a lot going on in that valley >> so so that additional step looking at that is that included in the estimate
for the storm water aspect of cost >> I would say a preliminary portion is yes but then I think that we're going to have to come back probably to the CRA again and say okay here's where we are where do you want to go from here this is how much this could cost or we think we can get it by you know by just doing service range so we'll we're probably going to have to bring it back at some
point and more input. >> Thank you, Mr. >> When you were going over the underground utilities, I didn't hear you say um uh sewer, water or gas. Is that just a given? Are we >> the sewer and the gas we will be replacing? The water we were told was
recently replaced within the last decade or so. That was not >> Okay. Um would are underground vaults a part of your design or is that not necessary? >> Uh like the concrete vaults they put
down for underground utilities. So, I think if you're talking about just conveyance as far as um concrete, there's several different terms you could use for it, but to convey the storm water through concrete underground away from the alleyway, that is
included. Is that what you're >> Yes, ma'am. >> Okay. Um, if we could uh break this down into phases, for example, all the tearing up the alley, putting
the underground utilities in, um, making it to where, you know, during working weeks, working days, the alleyway is, uh, conducive for tractor trailers and stuff like that. um to get it as a updated
all the infrastructure all the underground utilities is up to speed. It's up to date and call that phase one. And then when you start working toward the bells and whistles,
uh that could be the different uh another phase because this is going to be a multi-year project, right? This is gonna this isn't going to happen in six months or or anything like that. >> M I mean ultimately it's not really multiace. You tear the road up time to
do it, >> right? >> Because once you put the road back down, no way to go back under is tear it up again. >> So that ultimately that's why we're having this conversation, right? Because if you want to pause and we get feedback, that's great because once you determine you tell them, hey, we want to see this underground, we want to see
this replaced, we want to see this done. When we get to the point of getting that to a contractor, we work on the schedule. That'll be a big deal downtown. >> Okay. >> To schedule your contract work to not impact hours and XYZ businesses, it's going to happen. It's going to require a lot of coordination main vendors and owners.
>> But once you say tear road up, it's time to do it. >> And we're talking infrastructure. I get it. >> But as far as uh the the the nicities and the hanging plants and stuff like that, that could be let's let's get that alleyway. necessarily think the hanging
plans are part of the project. That was just part of the visual the visual concept. That's up to the person business owner. So >> yeah, we're not putting anything on buildings. We don't own business. >> Mr. >> So
I think the way the way I understand it is that there was there was a couple of different elements to this, right? So there there's the infrastructure improvement side of this where basically the CRA is helping the city by we're doing this project to improve the
alleyways and while we're doing this we're going to partner with the city and we're going to improve the infrastructure but for and Clay correct me if I'm wrong here but for this to all kind of be rolled up into one nice package there had to be a beautifification component that
addressed blight because that was the that was the core mission of the CRA. Okay. So that that portion of it is the sidewalk and the improvements to make it walkable and address some of the blight that's down there. Eliminate the pole so that you you address that side of it.
You tie those two components together. Now it's one nice easy package and we we roll with it. >> Okay. >> For me conceptually the way I've always understood it, we would more than likely probably do this a block at a time is the way I would understand. I don't
know. I'm not I'm a computer nerd. I'm not a I'm an engineer and I'm not a not a contractor. But I in my mind I was thinking we would maybe take down a block at a time, do it, move to the next block. I I can't imagine us ripping up four or five blocks all at once. I don't
know. May maybe it's cheaper from a mobilization standpoint to have it all milled and just taken down all at once. I don't know. That that's kind of what I I had in my mind when it comes to this alleyway project. Um, I did want to kind of just I'm sorry. I did want to just
put on the record. >> I was I was never >> two things. Number one, if you go back there and walk the alleyways or and are familiar with the alleyways, the space that you'll gain by just simply eliminating the utility poles and and taking that that alleyway all the way
out to it to its furthest extent, you're definitely going to have the ability to to fit tractor trailers down there. even even on the Evans block as we kind of call it. Um secondly, I was never a big fan of the sidewalk, but the again the
way it was explained to me, the beautifification component ties this all together, makes this a possible CRA. So, I'm willing to accept it. It's not my biggest thing. I I personally, as I've said from the get-go, think that the alleyway should be reserved for the businesses to be able to have deliveries
and and be functional for utilities and for deliveries. But if that's how we get this thing accomplished, then that's how we get it accomplished. And I'm okay with that. Thank you, >> Miss He. >> I've talked to several people, too. I just want to and I kind of was I don't
know if y'all recall, and I think it was Kobe that was at the county commission meeting, and Mr. Drake said something that piqued my interest and I started doing some research after he mentioned that they want something of ours over in that Sixth Street complex. I don't know
what it is or what their big design is over there, but they need something that we have. And I was thinking I would like to see after the conversations that I've had with some business owners that the sidewalk portion of the be of the back
alleyway be eliminated because there is a lot of concern from people that use big trucks that do come back through there. I I understand what people are saying for beautifification and all of that, but I'd like to see that gone. But I actually reached out to the county staff to see do they have some things
that we might do in trade and that they might be able to partnership with us once this design and and plan is put together. And I think there might be uh an opportunity for us to work with the county. Uh
they've got people that can tear up the streets for us. They've got the equipment and the manpower to put the street back down for us. They've got there's a lot of things that we can partnership with. Um, and I I'm hoping that we would all start to think about
that. Um, but as as for the alleyway project, I don't want a lot of fluff. I want to just get it down to the basic needs of tearing up the street, put all the infrastructure down that we need to put down. I don't understand the timing
to be honest with you. I've kind of done some research on the fiber and the underground utilities and it appears that FPNL's got to do a lot of their own work. So, it's not going to be like a coordinated effort and I don't know how that Go ahead.
>> Yeah, I don't know how that works like putting the pipe down and they, you know, two stubs out on the street after the streets relay. I don't know how that all works, but the timing of going to be >> and and they're they're Go ahead, Cody. >> That's exactly what they're going to be doing. Yeah, >> they're gonna have to coordinate with
FDL's companies on their designs and put that in place. So, they may get done with design eight months from now, but we have to wait on those companies as well. So, it's >> exactly that and that's what and all that came to light when when we were asked to should we cosign on the
borrowing and that's when I've learned a lot of that stuff during that time like oh wait that's we're not even close to that part of the project yet. So >> now I will say that to Mr. Beerbomb's comments a minute ago that we have to
look at the fact of how do how are we able to provide that source of funding to provide this infrastructure down those alleyways and and that's what he's saying is with the sidewalks it goes to towards the black remediation but also
how you're saying that they've looked at the the size or the widths of the alleyway and they've taken all that into account to ensure that that traffic can get through there. Now, was that assuming that we would have oneway traffic going down that alleyway
specific directions because I mean that's the way it is today. >> Yeah, it was assuming that there be traffic. I think we use the FDOT recommended lane width of like 11 feet. >> Okay. >> Yeah, I'm sorry. I just got a few more things and then I'll can can I bring a
couple of the owners down that have a really big or or call you like we can do a meeting because it is so concerning to them and I want to make sure that we understand what those sidewalks are going to do for those particular businesses that are have the biggest concern because maybe my concern would
be go down if we if I know that their concerns are addressed and >> you know and maybe I don't maybe I'm not articulating exactly >> no any any information that we can garner at this point, whether it's just talking to the owners, one because we'd like to know what they think is going on
in the alley behind there because we don't have once you start digging up this alley, you know, it's it's we hope we have a good understanding what's in there, but the more we talk to the um people that have shops there and have property there, then we'll have a better understanding of a what's in the ground and b what they what problems they're having so we can better address them.
>> And I think I have two more things. So, I walked that whole alley and I've noticed that it's not the same width the whole way and it kind of it's jagged. So, this block it might be 21 whatever feet wide or whatever it needs to be,
but over at the next block it's not. It's more narrow and that's problematic for the people that are chatting with me. And so therefore, you know, I don't want to say blanketly that it's the same all the way down because it's not. I started at one end and walked clear down
to the other. The other thing I'm a learner so I need to understand what Mr. Beerbomb was just saying. So Clay, if this is a you question, >> what light remediation requirement is it that I need to go read so I can
learn myself on what the concerns are. >> I'm sorry. >> It's in the CRA plan. It has to comply with CRA plan. >> The whole purpose of the CRA is remediation. That's the founding formats in resolution. >> But do you know that out of all the money that they have, we only set aside
$100,000 for blight. Everything else >> we're doing with the CRA funding is >> Well, I don't want to say that it's want. I'm just saying it's not blight. So, >> it has to have a connection to it. >> Okay. A connection to it. >> Correct. It's not pure blight
remediation, but it has to. But is there something less expensive that we could substitute the sidewalks for? >> And I don't want to I'm not asking you to give me all those answers. I'm just saying >> can we change the plan so that it you
know is that an option so that it doesn't so that we can do >> I will say this though. I think that everyone needs to read the CRA plan and see what's in there because and it it's available on our website because I've already been through it and you just
need to go and that's kind of what I was talking about in the last meeting a little bit is to look in there because there's several advantages to how we can accomplish a lot of things for the city and and as a as a result of being the CRA and the mission that we have as the
CRA. You have to know what's in that plan and understand it to see how you can use that to your >> That is very helpful to me and now I can go educate. Yes ma'am. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Mr. Harrison first come. >> So I think we had a conversation in in a council meeting maybe about different
service I mean uh surfaces materials uh maybe instead of sidewalk which is elevated and creates the dumpster you know nightmare what we're going to do with trash cans and what have you. But seemed like we had a conversation about pavers where a sidewalk would be
instead. So you have still a level surface, >> right? Or or could even be asphalt with stripe. I don't know what uh I don't know what would be required safety wise there, but just different texture. So you know that this area is a walking
path or whatever. I don't know if that's even doable, but seems like we had Did we have that conversation? Yes, we brought um um Brian and and Jacob brought two different options to the CRA and that those were actually brought to I think to the city. >> Yes. >> So we did.
>> Yes. >> So that Okay. So that one option with a V shape >> they came to city council city council selected layout one >> but I didn't realize that particular pant plan had the uh >> I do not believe it did. I believe it was just a fee for it was the inverted
crown for traffic and then a striped off section for the dumpsters. >> Okay. >> Yeah, there was I think what you're getting at though is was there an option without a without a >> but to still have a designated obvious walking area. >> Yeah. And there and there's several ways to do that. But I you know again I think
we'd have to make sure that we were meeting the requirements of what the CRA requires. But there's there's certainly several different cross-sections that we could look at. >> Okay. >> To meet the intent. I think that's what Mr. actually have our conversation about what you just said. Council for Captain Berbomb,
Commissioner Bebomb brought about sidewalk. There may be if if you all want to look at there may be other ways to meet the mission without sidewalk, right? There may be some ways to work with business owners for the BL remediation portion or the redevelopment of the alleyway on side of the building, things of that nature. So that's something we can look at if you say,
"Hey, this is only one redevelopment tool to your to meet the plan. There may be others. um we can take time to look at that uh in that alleyway and work with business owners to uh Mr. He's point about meetings. That's that's what I was getting, right? Is face off
tonight. The next thing would be to go and have that deal with Main Street, coordinate that meeting to talk about all this. That's exactly what we're talking about. The alleyway, the roads, everything, right? And so that's that's what that one is for is exactly what you just brought up is to have that conversation with business owners. Um,
and then lastly, the storm water stuff. Again, I didn't mean that really, but the city's our pavement condition index. We've gotten that back hope city council soon for adoption with a plan. there's a number of streets downtown in Baldwin that's going to be in that plan. So we factor that in too, right? We sure don't city going to repave certain streets and
we turn out tear up. So again, that's the reason for the coordinated meeting effort that we talked about. >> No, go ahead. >> Texture thing. And that's what I was thinking about the black thing you said. If if if the walking area were a different texture like pavers or
something like that, would that be addressing black as far as appearances go? You know what I'm saying? That's why that's what bled my mind. >> Thank you, Mr. Co. So to to make this alleyway multifunctional
uh for deliveries during the working days and pedestrian traffic during the weekends and um what Glenn said about the pavers, if the alleyway could be as level as
possible with a almost invisible slope toward the middle where the drains are for the rain and water, that would be a lot less trip hazards uh for pedestrian traffic and hopefully um be able to have tables one day uh like
the old peddler's alley we used to have where the weekends was walking traffic and the back doors of the businesses were places to sit down and you know uh patronize their businesses. Um, I don't see how a raised sidewalk would
help any. It would, as a matter of fact, be a hindrance. So, you could incorporate a sidewalk, whether it's pavers or concrete or whatever, with the street level, and that would be a lot more conducive. >> Focus on absolutely. >> Okay. Yeah, I mean that was one of the
ones we did look at was inverting crown. We look at inverted crown with inlets and without. So these are all options that are absolutely available. >> And who would have to make that decision? The CRA or the or the city council? >> Ultimately the CRA you've already made the decision. So you have to reconsider
it and then resend it back up again. >> Is it and when would that be the appropriate time to do that? >> We would let them bring bring it back and >> you know I mean I think based on those conversations if you have concerns we move forward. We go and do we talk about let's go have the meetings let's get the feedback we bring them back say hey
these are their concerns this is what business owners looking for functionality and then you can reconsider it >> miss he love pavers myself but I'm thinking wheelchairs if it's if it's I didn't understand so I'm in my mind a
visual of this project I can see it was raised sidewalks and I'm a visual person so I'm thinking that we adopted something that was raised I didn't understand that. Hey, maybe we can address this by putting a flat surface and somehow making it pretty artwork or
whatever for this the bike the the sidewalk, but yet the traffic can still the big truck traffic can still feed the businesses that need that. And is that what I'm hearing? Did we already adopt a plan that had raised sidewalks? Is that
the plan that was Okay. Okay. That is that is the one that the public's bringing to me saying this is not >> really going to work. They were out there with the tape measure in their particular block. >> So, thank you because that is exactly but now I'm understanding we can change
it to maybe go to a more level surface the whole way and still accomplish >> and even wheelchairs could go if it was >> I want to know if The pavers would be a hindrance to
handicap to wheelchairs and stuff. I don't think it would be a >> second one is the one we need. Yeah, there you go. So, that was the one that was brought before the CRA and the city council. >> And that's the one that was adopted, the level one. And you're going to find a
visual of that picture for layout one >> or that's the one that Josh just showed me. the the second one or the one right above that one I think was >> no that one >> uh this one here's the one that's in the pack >> it's on one side
>> it's a one-sided raised >> it is raised okay so we have the option to make it not raised is that what I'm hearing right now because I would be more apt to >> go along >> if it wasn't raised it was just all >> yes
>> flat maybe the direction is at this point then is we need to revisit these different or maybe talk to the property owners. I would I'm going to try to do that in the next week. Is are you avail time for us if I do that? Okay, absolutely. >> Yeah, I think I mean you can absolutely
do that. I'm saying we're going to coordinate that, right? We're trying not to inate them, but that's what Jade and I are going to work on is have one meeting with downtown business owners and anyone else in the public to come and talk about all these different aspects are going on. What do you want to see? How do you want to see downtown move forward? Same thing with Main
Street Board with the main street master plan. But >> I'd like to be included in that from also because I'm learning and I I just I don't want to be educated twice or on my own or miss something. So I want to make sure. >> Mr. K,
>> the pavers um can you pick a texture or design of pavers for not just aesthetics but to accommodate handicap wheelchairs? I don't think we had actual papers and
they was always there was always a concrete sidewalk. But if you want something more aesthetically pleasing, we can absolutely do a stamp concrete or something like that. A paper to me is not an ideal situation for a city. >> Okay. We y'all need to >> maint So you're you're suggesting the stamped.
>> I was just concrete or either one just but some sort of just concrete. I would not do an actual Lego set of >> Okay. concrete. >> Just concrete. >> Okay. >> All right. So, this one along these other ones coming up. I think the next step is go get back and bring that back.
Then we'll get into the design. Do >> you want to get into um re >> I think we're good at this point. Thank you. Do you want to get into restriping before you hit the railroad crossing that railroad cross the same
time? I think effectively that that's that was really the two that and this is TJ's here TJ and I had a conversation they're being designed independently of one another again this is one of those things that and I won't go further a second that need to be the same function the same design package they're being
worked together but again that's part of the meeting down there better understand what all what needs to be done because we sure don't want to go and redo the railroads and only redo one section of street when in a year we're going to go redo three other sections of street we got to tear this out so um I I think ultimately I think we get a quick
update. I think we're going to ask the same thing. Let's pause it. Let's get that feedback and let's come back with that bigger plan of what it is we're all going to do because what we're talking about alleyway and the lighting stuff is going to affect their design as well. You talk about the rest.
>> Can you say your name for the cl >> TJ Kelly with? >> Yes. >> Let's just hit the railroad real quick and give a quick update on that. Yeah, the railroad uh we were approached about doing five crossings the railroad company being Pinsley and
these crossings were six, seventh, 8th Street, Crescent Street and 11th Street that's been following Avenue. So really what we got to um was about a 60% set of plans. It's really just a conceptual of how to make these crossings work. And so
we have not coordinated with the railroad company yet. that was our next step because our goal was at the time to come back to the city or to the CRA at the time and uh really see is this is this what you want you know what you're looking at so uh we we kind of just
paused when things changed and so that's where we are now just a 60% set of plans without any coordination with the railroad railroad company so uh and I think as far as invoices there's only one outstanding or >> I believe so the task order was a two-part test score design CDI design
was $55,80. Uh and CI was $16,670. Uh to date expended is $39,666.50. I mean, there's I think there's an outstanding again ultimately I think you see that
that ideas in there. Um again, if you go to look at more streets like in terms of the strip and we'll get to in a second with some other potential changes and the even some changes potentially to these railroad crossings, then it's probably our best interest to pause before we ever get to the railroad company because we don't want to go once
the railroad company want it and done. Do not try a rolling process. >> Absolutely, >> Mr. Mr. Rev. So, I'm I'm definitely in favor of of improving these these crossings. It was pointed out to me um
during the last Christmas reflection season when uh Main Street was having Mistletoe Market downtown. Um you know, there there was a lot of people that were transiting Mistletoe Market and then going down to walk the lights. Of
course, we as a downtown business experience that almost daily with people coming in to our store and then saying, "We're we're going to walk over and go see the lights later." So, seeing um what in particular what I was observing during that Missto market was people
trying to cross right there at uh 7th Street. Yeah, that's right. Um and having a terrible time and this was a family with a stroller with kids. you know, that that crossing right there is is not ideal at all. Um, and him trying
to do it with it poorly lit certainly didn't help matter. So, I'm all in favor of it. I wanted I see I see the box here highlighted um for basically what's directly across from 8th Street. So, that used to be a crossing there and you can actually still see that the concrete
structure um is actually in the ground still there. Um, so unfortunately opening that back up would mean taking out that oak tree there. >> Um, but I see people >> kind of risking their their own um
well-being crossing there anyway. That's a real steep area right there. >> What street? >> Which street? >> Eighth Street. >> I'll look at it on my >> where the opinion where the opinion place is. Right next to the opinion place where that oak tree is. That used to be open. And you can see the other
side of that. I've walked that I've walked that little hill to try to get over >> that actually used to be open and have a have a ramp that went down. >> I personally would like to see that reopened because people are already walking that area anyway. >> Has the tree board ever said anything if we wanted to take that out?
>> I don't know. I'm just I'm just simply saying that I would like for it to to be to make sure that that's evaluated as part of this. I don't know. I see like I said I see the box here. I don't know if it was evaluated. >> Yeah. >> Okay. Um, I just want to express my
support for reopening that because even had this issue um, very recently with with some of the main street activities. We had the TDC redo the bathrooms right there across the way there. And now, right now, currently,
people either have to risk themselves going down through that that narrow steep area or they have to go all the way down to seventh to come all the way back up by the depot to go use the bathroom. Why not have that reopen? I know that's one tree. I really need to see that one tree go, but again, I think
that it's it's worth worth looking at very very heavily because I think he's got >> I know that's not the one that has to educate me that just walked out, but >> will somebody educate me? So, this is apparently a blight project that we that the CRA chose at one particular
time and is that correct? >> This is all like just for to make it >> it's a beautifification project. Okay. And it was 6 7 8 11 and Crescent. Is that what I heard you say? >> Because I'd like to see a second street added because I'm going to And I don't
know if that's you know if we can go clear down to the second street or not too but uh that needs >> part of the original parking study, wasn't it? >> We weren't involved with the parking study. >> We'll verify that. But I >> would you please because if we could do the second street, I'd like to see that
added to this particular just make a note that we talk second street at the same time whether it's CRA money or not whatever ones we're talking about >> Mr. person.
>> I'm all for this. The only um not because it's got anything to do with blight, but this is all about safety. >> So, you have something to share? >> No, I'm I'm I'm good. It's something that needs to be done. I do I do I'm
curious about the I agree with you. the walk over there at the ETH, you know, it used to be there a long time ago. Would the So, it would be cross actually crossing the tracks. It would just be a level like sidewalk across there or something.
>> Yeah. >> Cross to. And do you think are you familiar with railroads allow that kind of in this day and age? >> It's uh really depends. >> Be wonderful if they did. >> Yeah. Yeah. I think they Yeah. I think you know I work with Pinsley on other
projects as well for other clients but they seem to be pretty good to work with. >> I got a good relationship with them but u you know I feel like it's definitely a possibility. So what our plan was to you know get the plans ready to provide to them to them sit down one time you know
say this is our plan because you don't want to go say this is what we're doing kind of say hey you what do you think about this is what the city would like to do and then you know have them have a buy in go from there so really just making it feel like a team and saying
this is what we city would like to do kind >> clay is it am I'm going to get too far out ahead of my skis here if we have the rightway versus survey discussion. >> Yeah. No, that's the conversation we need to have with the railway.
>> Okay, >> Miss H. >> How much money has been uh budgeted for this project start to finish? >> Anybody know? I mean, do we need to increase it if we're going to try to add 8th Street and Second Street? >> So, I think I mean, in terms I have to
go back and look in the budget. I don't think this was the construction portion was budgeted yet just the design and see task force. Um but again as we go through it and then we have that input where we bringing that back we get final termination with this board what you want to do again say the city council
for approval um then you'd have a high level cost estimate and then we have to start buding for that going in the next fiscal year. >> I see. Yeah. Okay. So we don't even know what >> and yeah >> what Mr. Beerbomb was asking for. What would that look like to to there by
that? I mean, what do you do? Go down the hill? Do you bring the dirt in and fill the hill? What do you do? How does that >> go? Go to page I think it was six or seven. >> Page 240 on the PDF, I think. Or no, I did everything.
>> Go back up to the the set of documents right above this. >> Yeah, keep going up >> down. Okay. So, let's real quick. This is What street is this? >> You're looking for eighth.
>> Eighth isn't on their list. >> Scroll all the way back to the top. Let's just go through >> right there. Oh, he passed it. Come back down. Put one more. I think >> is that it? >> Come down one more. >> Yeah, right there. The jagged one on the bottom. >> And honestly, I don't know. You know,
we've been when we stopped, we had to check the grades to make sure. And I personally think maybe a little more zigzag to keep it 88 to get it down. from the street down to the tracks. But I mean that's a for now that's a good I guess >> that probably be more difficult, right?
Because >> that's the most diff >> and that's why I say the cost estimates going to be a little ways out because until they coordinate the railroad understand all the requirements. >> Is that the railroad building right there? That little red must >> that's the history. >> Isn't that what you're talking about on
the other side closer to your to the opinion? >> Yeah, his shop's on the am looking at it upside down and the opinion polls right here on the >> opinion the opinion place is right there in the center. >> Yeah, come it's to the right of the wife in the middle of the document. >> There's a box right there in the middle
of the document. >> There is this Todd store >> right there. >> Oh, that's not the one I was thinking. I was thinking he's talking about the one. >> No, the one more closer to in front of Todd's building down. >> That's it. That's it.
>> Where's Todd's building at? And that's maybe somebody >> right at the top of the white mouth, >> right? Oh, where that mouth is circle and that's okay. Oh, okay. Now, is it the white? >> Is that what I'm Oh, I'm looking at this. I'm looking at the line in the center. Okay.
So is it stairs or what is it that you're >> Well, if we want to keep the ADA accessible stairs, but that's another conversation that we want to have with CRA. You know, do you make this a non ADA? You have to keep structing
and go back like a zigzag. >> And would it be wooden or the the zigzag? I mean, what what material are you all suggesting? >> We haven't got that far yet. >> Yeah. Not we we like less maintenance. I
think in the long run, I'd rather pay more and have less maintenance than the opposite >> to be honest with you. You know, I don't want it to deteriorate. If it came across scroll down >> came across here
we go. >> Yeah. >> We've had conversation and this the street came up about some of those islands or those shoulders there on this section but you also see you know this is seventh. So this is the main main crossings per se.
You'll see that they're basically just improving the existing layout but because on the left side you don't see the sidewalk contining down right. That's that's right now they're s on the north but don't continue to the south and then we've talked about the bushes there and re recount kind of looking at so again I think there's some things to
be looked at aesthetically views continue I think bringing back some more input to you all is what Mr. post. >> Um, go back to that zigzag. Um, >> eight street.
>> Yeah. All right. So, if if you came straight down, >> that's private property, isn't it? >> I think you're talking about >> Isn't that the county? I thought the >> if you went straight down from >> If you went straight down from Todd's store. >> Okay.
>> To Circle Drive. >> Yes. >> Buildings. >> Okay. Okay. So, that's private property. >> I see. >> We own the opinion building. >> Okay. What I'm getting at is if you went to the other side of the street and went
straight down, that's right there on city property and it connects you with our museum and our chamber. Correct. >> The corner of the museum. >> Correct. >> Wouldn't that be Wouldn't that be more
of a straight shot and be easier to do as far as grade goes with uh handicap instead of a bunch of zigzagging? Yeah, they're just reconfiguring. That's part of because there's a power pole layer. We have gas lines that run through there. So, you're already being sensitive to that.
>> Yeah, I mean that definitely possibility. >> Would that be would would that be engineer wise? >> That that whole situation going be tough no matter what, but it could be it could be better. We have to look at the grades in our survey. Uh, initially we were just told we want to connect right there
to that existing sidewalk on the I guess the southwest side. >> To be honest with you, I don't think that's I think that's the that's that road in between the that that's got that white ending where the original opening used to be. You can
see in some of the old >> that's why we didn't Would it be less expensive to go straight down and connect right there with the bathrooms and the museum and >> right there? >> Possibly. I think the uh there's still a
good elevation difference from the street down to the tracks no matter what. But we can absolutely look at that. >> You probably one you're going to need to determine if you want to ADA or not. If you said how we're going to save cost, this is not going to be a client. We just have to note that
>> probably be that one, right? >> Correct. Correct. >> And the others would be >> Yeah, that's our intention. >> This is really >> that's assuming the railroad will let us do all this because railroad the last time I tried to dig up some trees
anywhere near a railroad, it was a no. Miss Headlin, >> um I just have another quick question because when we go to the railroad, I don't know who's going to the railroad, but how do we get them to We're going to beautify this, which I love these ideas.
Uh but the wood that's on either side of the rail, some of these intersections, they have to be replaced because I mean they're just old and deteriorated. How do we do that simultaneously with the beautifification that we're going to do? Definitely a conversation to be had. >> I mean, is that something
>> another one of those, you know, the um it's not some trail, but the multimotal trail coming through, right? At some point, they're going to cross over one of these as well. So, you're probably thinking that's 10 years down the road or eight years in the road. Um but we can have a conversation road of the existing condition.
>> Can he talk on our behalf? I mean, is he or is this something that Clay's got to do for who's got to do this? >> He's our engineer. first and then >> so you'll be a representative of the city when you're talking to them to say, "Hey, do you know Second Street's really
bad where it comes to >> Thank you, >> Mr. Co. >> the the really bad humps as you're driving over the railroad tracks on these streets we're talking about. Is that within our purview or is that
totally railroad?" Again, I ultimately right now the designs are for those within the downtown district, right? So if you want to expand that out, >> no, I'm talking about the humps as you go from either circle to Ballwin or Ballwin to circle.
>> I think again right now I think that the task order is cross is not to improve the actual drive section. >> Okay. >> So that's conversation to be have the railroad if that's possible what it looks like and that's something you have to amend the task order to include because right now that is not included. Okay.
>> Gotcha. >> Mr. Harris. >> Well, I I was just thinking back to the main street master plan and of course it would put this out out of range, but there it's one of that pie in the sky thing. They had a had a bridge over the railroad was from from downtown. It was
gorgeous. Uh it'd be wonderful, but it would be incredibly expensive. I'm sure would even let us do it. >> Have you seen that? It was pretty >> elevator. >> Oh, wow.
>> I can't right now. Yes. I was um the Miss Henderson, I'll let you jump in real quick, but I'm going to try and hold public comment till the end here as much as possible. The original purpose of that crossing at 8th Street
historically was to connect the downtown with all the business, the amphitheater, the building, the library and all that to make a better flow. That's the way he designed it back in 1800. So we need to
think about that too. >> Which one are you talking about? the zig the zigzag or the >> okay >> so that's why it's over there next to that existing >> I probably break every time I go through there still today um all right is that
that about it on this one >> all right we can move on to the the next one then which is the restriping on 78 >> okay um this one had a task for design of $20,130 to date expended $1,530
and all that's remaining is the actual bidding services for uh building. So it the plans are complete to have this section of street and eight mil and overlaid and then well it's just stripping here. >> Yeah. Well there there is in the plan so
we have it in the plans for the contractor to get four coron because what you don't want to do is to mill and resurface that there's not enough asphalt out there. So without us having that information that wasn't part of our scope to get in originally just want to put that in the contract contractor to
actually go in get the core so then come back to us if there's enough asphalt for them to actually pl it and they need recommend that if not they'll resurface it. So we have two different details. One for planning and resurfacing, one for actually resurfacing existing asphalt basically having a lift right
there on the curve of other sections. Uh but yes, all that's in there that question. >> Yeah, that was so it's all done. Again, I I would say that these be a little more time put into it. Thought again, they did the task they were given, but I think we all at council me, we talked about this. There are utilities in the
road, particular AC water main running down follow you working with Elizabeth and them. they're doing that going through that survey. Now they've completed phase one which is this side of town. Um so to me that all needs to be considered and again if we get into that have those conversations and the PCI study with the city streets come you
know there are certain streets be redone to me that scope could expand to all to more parts of downtown. I think there's some more time to be put in thought if y'all want to do that rather than going and doing one section of the street because again it does not it's not coordinated TJ's coordinated he's one
did it but it's not coordinated with the railroad crossing design. So I just think we're do we're doing two things independently. So I recommend we pause a second. Let's get this feedback. Let's look at we need to expand the scope of these street pan over small factor in the park.
>> So you're just saying put this on pause. Put the put the street striping on pause. Is that what you're saying? That's a good idea. >> The layout the layout's been determined. The council already done. >> Okay. So >> delay the bed's
good design. So if if safety is our number one priority and we've got a very heavy senior citizen population and we could bring a
study before the board showing that the angled parking is a lot more uh conducive to uh having a a low or no incident accident there. >> Now the council approved
>> the straight in. >> Yeah. >> Right. The council approved the straight in. >> But if you had a study showing that the angle >> uh parking is uh is safer, would the board be real be able to possibly
reconsider that? >> You're going to lose parking spaces. That's >> Well, I know I know we're going to lose parking places, but what's more important? Safety or a couple of parking places? >> Take a motion to reconsider this. Yeah, it would have to be
>> but we don't even have to worry about the striping until after the milling and everything's done. >> I mean I think I think Paul would look we see the scope expansion that's going to have to occur. You're going to have to approve that. It's going to go to council for that expansion. So there's a few more steps to occur when you get to the point to where you where the city
council needs to make that final decision on striking later. >> Didn't Didn't we already consider Wasn't that already considered? >> Sorry. >> We did. We did. But but what I'm saying is your concern, isn't it already addressed in the study of the of the parking study? It's already in here. You
just got to find out. >> No, I'm I'm saying that that since we voted on this, uh an engineer who's a resident of our city gave me a pamphlet that showed where the angled parking is
a lot safer and has a lot less uh fender bender incidences. That's something they would need to go back before the council, wouldn't it? Or I don't want to cross I want to keep >> a motion to reconsider because you've already had this, >> right?
>> We we got to keep those lines drawn. I I don't want to get be very careful. Okay. >> Okay. >> But is everybody good for the pause on this then until >> next time? Okay. So, yes, Mr. Did we do
a pause on the um railroad crossing improvements? What did we decide there? >> He's going to continue working hard to get something to go to the railroad company and bring it back. >> Okay, good. >> Yeah, I mean I would recommend again we get that feedback, but yeah, ultimately you still got questions asked. You're
going to determine about e the eighth crossing where at and do you want to be an ADA ramp? You be stairs and then on the seventh, you know, there's some more questions we have. >> And and on the eighth street one, can it be nonADA? the rest of them be ADA, but can we designate since it's going to be
a little more complex on the one there by the opinion poll as nonADA? >> Is that what you're saying? Signage and everything else. >> Yeah. >> I mean, is that what you were suggesting? >> Yeah, it has to be Yeah. have to be very
well detailed signs or whatever that this is not crossing >> which is pretty stairs but you need to >> right okay
>> all right let's move on to two I >> okay uh this one again this is complete essentially we talked about a little bit a minute ago um I know it's been a conversation in the past about redoing those getting a new system down there um there it's not a great system works is there all the time trying to fix it and
it keeps something not working. Um, I've had conversations, yeah, the zigzags and conversations uh with Jay about this. I think he has some ideas. I don't know what they are yet, so I'm not going to talk about. But again, this is one of those things if you want to get feedback, we can go get that feedback
about the lighting. Is the overhead what we're looking to see. Do we need to do pedestrian lighting on the street versus So again, it's not you need to do anything right now, but ultimately if you say, "Hey, go get us a new system you want to put it in." We'll do that. If not, we'll get feedback and come up with some maybe alternative ideas. Miss,
>> can you can you just tell me because I know it's going to come up how much money was spent on all those lights because it was heft it was a hefty number. >> I don't know the exact number. I do know it was more than $20,000. I don't know the exact exact number, but it was more than 20. I know a lot of money was saved
with city staff assisting installing. >> Mr. Miss Bri, >> I don't remember the exact amount, but from what I understand, there was a quote there was a quote given that I believe was somewhere around give a very large
range. So, don't hold me to this, but my understanding is there was a professional company that gave a quote somewhere between 50 and 75 for a professional company to come in and put professional lights in. >> I agree more than 50,000. >> Yes. And then that that quote was pretty
much pushed back on by the CRA at the time and then the CRA director proposed uh basically purchasing it directly himself and then utilizing city staff and at that point it was under $50,000. I want to say somewhere right around $40,000.
I actually do pure happen stance when we were at market in Atlanta happened to run into the vendor that provided that quote um and had had a little bit of information given to me at that time about what they were proposing versus
not. And obviously we see, you know, when you go out and buy non-commercial stuff and try to do it yourself, even though I I again, I want to I want to make this very clear. The CRA director did the best he could given the budget
and and the situation that he was in. I am not dogging that whatsoever. I'm not disparaging what he did whatsoever. I think this is where a decision was made by the CRA at the time that if you go cheap by the CRA, you got what you paid
for. You bought cheap lights and they don't work. Again, I I want to be very very clear about this. I'm not dogging on the CRA director and what everybody did to make that happen because they did the best they could under the circumstances and the budget they were given. But this is a classic example of
if you go cheap on something, especially when it comes to commercials, you're going to pay for it in the long run because here they are less than two years later and they're not working. Whereas if we would have gone with the commercial product, it probably would still be up and be functional right now.
>> Uh Mr. Harrison, then I'll come back. >> Okay. Um yeah, and that led to an unexpected cost of holes, right, to hold the the weight without the bending and what had wouldn't work. So it just it just kind
of snowballed, but and and they're not they're not holding up. But anyway, um pedestrian lighting will be be good if we can get that done instead of the stream lighting. Um also, as part of this, Kobe, we we've talked about And I
think you have mentioned as well electrical outlets on the south side of Ber along the railroad rail the actual rail there. Um there's no electricity on that side of the street except one place at the middle pole I think there and the vendors need you know electrical
in that. So that would be to me I would love to see that included. Yeah, I definitely forgot to mention that in on the previous conversation I know you said numerous times about not only that power it'll reduce maintenance down there because that's just an aggravating little strip to go weed. So goes in
there other you know other ideas are looking at it's actually in a redevelopment plan as part of that downtown is put in look at bullets right especially in those very especially seventh and eight instead of putting up those sides >> can you put go ahead and put the hole in the ground that's got the lid and bullets come in and tie in. So, I think there's a lot of options for
functionality that need to be looked at that will help ease city staff maintenance. >> Miss Heftlin, >> I'm not I'm not quite sure how far down does the uh the criticism I've heard with those
lights downtown were uh they didn't go clear down to the last stop. And a lot of people like to go clear down to the last stop and they're there in the dark and that's exactly what they find themselves because there's not enough lighting down there. So, I do agree that it needs you you you get what you pay
for and and we do need to have some other type of system and and I'm not sure what we're what y'all are proposing. Are are you proposing like uh uh lamp posts or because it's not bright
enough too. I notice when I leave here at night and I always go home through Baldwin because I cut down through the circle to go home. It's funny because it's not very bright up there and it's if we were having a nighttime event actually I just judged something that a contest that they were having up there
and it was when it got dark if the moon if it's not a full moon night you you it was very limited lighting. So I I agree we need to put something else up there a commercial grade but I would like to see it go clear down to the fire. I don't
know where we're starting and stopping, but I'd like to see it go down to is that Fourth Street or >> Yeah. So, it is. So, I think when the initial system was put in, the last stop wasn't there yet, and so they stopped it. And now I know there was some Main Street volunteers that went and helped put in the new pole down there and the staff set in the new pole. So, there's a
pole there, but ever since it got put in, the system's been broken. So, there been no not been desired to extend it down. So, the system the infrastructure is there that if new system does come, it will go all the way down. How do we get it to go clear down to that like whatever street that is? That's where that Firestone Street is.
>> Sixth to Fifth. It's all >> Is that Fifth Street? >> Fifth is the one that cuts through the Firestone. Six and one right there. That is at >> bogeies is sixth street, right? Yeah. Uh Iron and Great. Thank you. Yeah. So, I'd like to see it whatever we do, I'd like to see it extended clear down
>> to where Firestone Street is. >> I agree, Mr. Bon. So, I'm I'm just going to offer my personal vision. When when when the conversations originally started about the string lights downtown, my personal vision was
coordinate with like PL or Chelco or somebody and put in a wooden pole that technically is somewhat historically accurate to what was there before because along that along that whole frontage right there, there used to be the original power lines that powered
that actually powered the crossings. the the crossings themselves were actually powered by that power line up until fairly recently. So, put in put back in wooden power poles strategically along that entire strip right there. But those
because those are substantial enough you could then attach more you could you basically do an X pattern down each block with with your beastro lights, your bro style lighting, right? But then on those poles, you could mount
something more akin to a flood light that could be controlled that when you have a large event like you're talking about that you need more flood light, you instead of having to get out the light towers, you would then have on those poles flood lights that could then be turned on and activated on those
blocks to provide additional lighting or even just for general pedestrian lighting to light up to light up downtown a little more. So you would have that flexibility. You'd have the string lights that are there that could provide that kind of ambiance for when you, you
know, you're maybe doing a smaller event, you just want the string lights. And then if you have a mistletoe market or some sort of larger event and you need more flood light type of, you then could activate those because there would be there would be enough of them on those wooden poles that it would provide
that light. And and they have it too where you can put those solar things on top there too to I don't know that those can be controlled but I like that idea about uh control for events. >> I think we're good so far. We're we're about to go in. Uh Jaden, do you do you
have anything to add to this? >> I can wait until that would be >> We're just about to get into that if you want to move into this. >> All right. Okay. We're gonna go ahead and close out the active projects at this time. We'll move into co public comment. If anybody has any comments,
you're welcome to come forward. Please keep your comments to three minutes or less. Um, >> thank you for There are pedestri railroad.
However, we are not used to that and it would be very easy and challenging for the safety for them to find it with the two arms on either side of the one that goes across. And you can get some very attractive um
gateways like the fence around the um um depot that go in and out and it would be timed with those arms and it would automatically close. When we did have Ever Alley um or
took that over, we did not get good cooperation from the merchants. They did not have the staff to open up any back doors. That's what we were hoping for. And um although the vendors, the
personal vendors like that personal profession alley, our main intent was to help the economy down and we were not successful with that. So
>> thank you, Miss Wbert. So, I found the uh survey results from Lakefest uh from 2021. We had 203 surveys collected. Uh in the question about would you be willing to donate to help create a dog park? 175 people said
yes. Um would you be willing to serve on a committee to help? 82 people said yes. We've already done that with the dog park task force. And uh and then would you like to stay informed of our progress? 49 out of 20
and just as a a point uh you all know I'm a big proponent of the dog park. Um but in terms of ROI impact um I I think this can be done very reasonably far more so than what you know you were seeing in the proposal and I think not
just for the citizens but for because of the location um which by the way you suggested it. Um, it was a great over all of our heads and really have some really nice when you make something
nice right there for all of those people coming through our town. I think it would make a really nice impression and maybe somebody wasn't stopping for the other things. Um, and I was out of town,
so I missed some of this. Were the for those CRA purposes of the boundaries, were those altered at all or is that something that is up for consideration at some point? I know it's been discussed a number of times.
>> It wasn't brought up at this meeting. It may be in the future, but not at the moment. >> Okay. And then um I'd like to know what expenses in the alley project would fall to the property owners. >> I don't know.
>> All right. Thank you. >> Thank J. >> Well, I'd like to start off by apologing for how I look. I was senior fire when I was headed over here. Um but just a couple quick things. Yes, co I do have a plan to run by you for the lighting
project. We just haven't had time to connect on that. Um but to answer quick questions, it would involve some underlining of the trees starting all the way back at Main Street Fitness. We have some are those dogwood trees up beside the um train tracks. doing some
underlining projects, removing some of the dro lights, adding some lighting to the buildings themselves, adding some lighting to the side streets to help encourage foot traffic on on that area, and then of course lighting up where um
last stop is. Um we did just get another business open beside Last Stop. They open on Wednesdays and Title Company. So, we're really excited to have more businesses to our downtown area and of course making it well lit and accessible. um is I I know everyone's
top priority, but I will go with Kobe soon and go over that proposal for the lights. Um one of the things Am I have three minutes? You guys can >> Okay, sorry. Um as far as the roads being done, I just left a a conference
over at Crest View. They've done an amazing transformation project at Main Street and the CRA B for uh working together to complete and they did a great job. And what they did, they went block by block when they redid their downtown. And what they did was as soon
as they tore up that area, they added a walkway so people could still access the buildings. Um um it was a bit Did they need to add that necessarily for the design? No. Or to tear it up later? Yes, they did. but it still allowed foot
traffic into that direct business to not hinder um any of those other um any of the other projects. So while the whole downtown area in Presby was 20 months um it did go block by block. So I
think they they averaged about six to nine months per block um getting getting their downtown area done. And as far as the railroad um steps go, I'm very excited for that project. I have one tiny suggestion. Can they make it where
a stroller could be like struggled up on it if we could just try to keep that in mind? I would personally I would love that. And you guys are right. I love the idea of having it where um Tor is because people are already walking that
way and it is going to connect all of that area together. So, anything that Main Street can do to help get this project done or any of these projects done for our downtown merchants and the community, we're happy to help. >> Awesome. >> Is that my time? >> Good. Okay. >> Thank you, ma'am.
>> Thanks, guys. >> Does anyone else have any further comments? All right, seeing none, we'll go ahead and close out public comment. Kubby, have you got anything else? Uh just real quick um on the forward opinion act one I know he asked me about it about the
logo on those flyers and those events. So that is because the CRA is providing income match contribution to the >> there's no cash involved. >> Correct. So that's what that was for. I know we had that conversation so clarify. >> Oh that's been a while. I had I had to stop and think what is she talking about? >> That's what you'll see here is there's a
partnership before the act. >> Yes. Somebody from the public was asking on that. That's not >> so so the CRA is doing what what is the inind trade the CRA and the University of West
Florida help with the planning and um forward to wrote the grant we're coordinating it um they are allowed to use the um shel building if there's nobody body else that's paid and we have had and
they have supplied that for us except for one or two times and we in this hiatus we paid for it forward if you did um we have paid for the advertisements the grant has um they have provided
advice they have been there to introduce themselves as the CRA at each thing that we've had except for the last So, will we keep doing that then as the >> Yeah, I mean I think this one proves agreed on. I think the grant's not fully closed out yet. So,
>> no, it will have like it says in there. We have at least three more and we've had requests uh that we probably need to write another grant to see about filming some of those things so that they would
be available in on a continuous basis. Um, we determined that um, when HP was trying to write the historic preservation uh, model ordinance that we were going to write the standards. Well, real
quick, it went from one historic district to three and we didn't have that capability and so CRA took that up and they hired the consultants. you are consultants, but we said look, people
don't understand the history of their town, so they couldn't value any standards. And so that's how we got started in this and wrote us to theseformational workshops.
>> Thank you. And then lastly, just to make sure we're all on the same page, there's a lot of tech. Um, Crescent Drive is on pause. Lake is on pause. The historic preservation design center are going to council. The dog park facilities on PS
more information on the storm water aspect from anchor. Bring that back. Uh, then the downtown parking study is done, but it's on pause. Uh, alleyway improvements are on pause for the long way. railroad crossing striping all so we can have a bigger meeting with
downtown merchants public and bring feedback so make sure we're all on the same page that move got a question for you >> is the CRA going to ask um Liberty Partners to help look for grant
money for the alleyway project >> I think some of that's coming up soon at a regular meeting >> okay and lastly that we have set up and you'll see it going out May 7th at 5:00 5 6:30 we're going to have a community engagement night at Tivy the Tivy gym
working on fin details to go over with the public CRA the programs off of there in the project so that's just we get another one of these updates but kind of let know get out there that's going to be occurring in May first >> awesome thank you sir uh Mr. Atson, you
got anything? >> No, sir. >> Mr. Fairbone. >> Um, I did want to maybe just request because it's not on this agenda, maybe for the next um meeting if we can have an item on there about um
the CRA application and data collection practices. Um, and I'll just go ahead and put it out there. A citizen came to me. they were helping someone else, an older person with the actual application for
one of the CRA programs. And they pointed out to me that the current application is over 37 pages long. And um what they also pointed out to me was that um for example, it asks for a lot
of information and it's almost a little bit of a cart before the horse type of application where you're applying but then you don't really know if you're going to get it or not, but then you got to disclose certain information, but then you can't really get that information till you know it's a little it's it's doesn't flow correctly is is
the way it was presented to me. for example, trying to get um trying to get contracts and that sort of stuff, you really have to again you have to kind of get car for the horse because you have to go out get all these quotes then you don't know if you're approved or not for it. So it's 37 pages seems excessive and
it's as someone that has previously worked on reducing paperwork for a government agency that struck a nerve to me. There's no reason why our application process should be 37 pages long. We we really need to look at what
we're doing there and and see if we can streamline that because I know for a fact in my in my previous serving in a government agency, we took a 47page employment application and got it down to 15 pages. So, I know it can be done. >> We can look at that. Mr. Strong is
already looking at bringing some ideas about consolidating some of these. So, we can have a look at how do we minimize that. >> And and it was pointed out to me that apparently we're asking for people's bank account balances. If they qualify, why are we asking for the victimis? Just it just seems
excessive. >> Mr. Harrison, >> yeah, we need to look at a lot of that. But um question about all the people. Do we have any more information yet as far as how many folks have applications pending and will will
we be able to address that in the next meeting? >> That's the goal. Doing that. >> That's the goal. Mr. TR have we been kind of going through emails and trying to consult that final paperwork. I know you've been working on putting list together of applications that are pending that already approved or so there's a lot outstanding. I know he's
already doing a lot of work getting that all gathered together. So our intention is to bring some back next meeting on that. That's our goal is the 27th. >> Mr. K, >> are the uh is is the money that the CRA gives the citizens uh for improvements
need-based? Um, well, they have to meet the requirements of the grant. Um, some of them are income based, some are not income based. >> So, they're not all need based. >> Did you have anything else, Mr. C? >> I think they should be uh income based.
>> I think Mr. Strondo, we he probably bring some forward to maybe consolidate requirements and I talked about a little bit. So, we'll bring that forward to you. Okay, Miss Havlin, >> I have a couple things since we're talking about the income base. I just had this conversation with uh Mr. Kobe
today that I'd like to see it based on income and I'd also like to have a discussion about if I'm a landlord and I have 10 properties, I get one try at the kitty. I I I shouldn't be able to get it
10 times for each one once for each property. So, I just think we need to re-evaluate. I like what uh Mr. Beerbomb is saying. We don't need that information. It doesn't need to be 37 pages. It needs to be simple, but I do think that we need to implement some
rules so that everybody gets an opportunity to use it. Uh and I I just learned today that there's two types of programs. One's income based and one's not income based. So I I would like to look at all those. So Kobe, if you could just kind of send those out to those of
us who would like to see those changes in advance of meeting so we know what the current rules are. I'd like to see the 37page application because that's ridiculous. Absolutely ridiculous. The other only other thing I'd like for everybody to consider, I wasn't I was
ill during the last meeting. It's very hard for me to come here at three o'clock and that that's my peak business time, you know, that I work with people and I don't know if we can reconsider and meet at uh five o'clock, but I know a couple other business owners that
would like to come >> and sit in the audience. Uh, yeah. So, if the board would think about that until our next meeting, um, especially with budget season coming up because I'm going to have to reshift my priorities in order to meet the budgets and the
once a month it was okay. You know, the last one of the month we were going to start at four o'clock, I could handle that. But pushing it back to three, that's that's a hardship for me, especially when there's multiple meetings. So, just that's just for consideration. Maybe we could talk about that at the next
>> Okay. regular meeting. >> I'd like to welcome a new member to our team, Miss Madison. We have a new clerk. She This is her first meeting as far as I know of correct with us. So, so it's nice to have you with us. Um Sumi, have
you got anything for us? >> No, sir. >> I know you've never been asked. Why not? Um, >> one thing I would like to see at the next meeting, if you could bring it back, I'm sure that you probably already think about it, is financial report. Let us see which accounts have been divied
up to and where they're at with that. And um, yeah, we will have that. I'll try. We'll probably have it on every every meeting just to have it on there to look at. Miss McDaniel did she sent me an email saying they got a big date. So, she has financials for the city and
CRA through March 31st. So, we do have those. We'll have it. >> And I'll say that the next meeting um because it's already set that one is before our city council meeting. So everyone please read your agenda packets before the meeting. Make sure that you've done your homework on what's
coming up. Kobe is going to try and put out the agendas. It was like the second Tuesday of every month. >> We're trying to do them by at least by the 15th of the month. So I give about two weeks to review. >> So that's ample time for us to go over the materials and then to talk to Kobe about any questions that we may have
with it. so we can keep on schedule with those and be on time for other meeting. All right, with all that being said, we can go ahead and call this meeting ajourn. >> All right.