Go for it. Go for it. Alright. With it being 06:10, we are gonna call our meeting to order and start with the pledge of allegiance. Allegiance. I pledge allegiance to the flag of The United States Of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Alright. Just quickly roll call around the horn, please. Peterson. Laura. Striking. Nash. Olson. With that, we have our agenda. I didn't see any additions, subtractions. We should be good. I'll entertain a motion for our agenda. Motion to approve.
Motion by Nash. Second. Second by Bora. All those in favor, say aye. Aye. Opposed? Motion carries. We have our consent. Questions, comments? Hearing none, I will entertain a motion. Motion to approve. Motion by Nash. Second. Second by Peterson. All those in favor, say aye. Aye. Opposed? Motion carries. Peyton, has there been any, formal questions before council this evening? Not today. Once again, encourage the public to participate in our process. It helps us make some progress. With that, let's start with Park 6 Alpha. We have discussion or consideration of Ash Tree Park,
located on the Dilworth Lutheran Church property. Who's taking this one, Pete? I will take this one. So we have been in discussion with Dilworth Lutheran Church regarding Ash Tree Park. As most are aware, Ash Tree Park is located on the Northeast corner of, the property. And a little bit about this park well, here's a picture. But there's no formal agreements that have ever existed between the city of Dilworth and
Lutheran Church. There's probably been some handshake deals done through the years, like, in exchange for x. You can have, you know, clearing snow or whatever it may be. You can house equipment, out there. There's never been part of our CIP plan. You know, we don't add to our budget or, you know, review it on as far as from a park board consideration for new equipment out there. There's a little upkeep and maintenance that's done. I know they go out there and do some mowing out there. We've gone out there and made some improvements, to the park, and we do limited upkeep and oversight of the park.
But it's you know, we've never viewed it as an actual city park per se with it being on private property. And so we've been talking, with them about well, a proposal, you know, first came our way. And, when it first came to me, you know, I first wanted to get a sense from the park board if they were interested in having a presence over there at Dilworth Lutheran Church or at Ash Street Park trying to maintain it. And the park board, you know, reviewed the request,
had members from Dilworth Lutheran here just kinda talking about their concerns and considerations with it. And they ultimately said, yes, they would like to maintain a presence over there. And also as part of their recommendation, to keep it part of the or to keep it or bring it in within the park system, you know, a request to have it relocated to the northwest corner of their property. So over in this general area closer to the if you wanna call it the park or the school property across the street.
The I think the church feels like it would be a better location for it. And so that was part of the consideration discussion points that meeting. But, anyways, they forward on recommendation to, you know, maintain a presence at the park. They didn't really get into any of the other, you know, nuts and bolts type things that we're gonna talk about on the financial side of things. So really where the proposal is at this time is, they would like to see this be part of a lease agreement where we would
pay $1,200 a year. I think $700 would go towards the insurance because they still have to hold insurance on the equipment itself with it being on their property and then $500 for, the administrative expenses that go along with that. In addition to that, removing existing equipment, installing new equipment, and the lease agreement would be up to twenty five years or whatever the duration of the equipment is, which is usually beyond twenty five years.
They would continue Delworth Lutheran Church would continue to maintain the land below the equipment as well, so which is effectively just mowing the grounds. Now this would be up to the park board as far as determining what type of installation would go in, what type of park equipment would be there at that park. And, again, that determination none of that's been made at this time. So when we're getting to the actual, cost of it, we don't really know what that would be yet because park equipment can range, as you know, anywhere from $35,000
up to $75,000 depending upon the type and level investment that would go into it. And so I also had to involve legal and our insurance in on some of these conversations to make sure we're protected and all bases are, covered out there. So, again, we feel like we're in a place in talking with Katie, and I think I incorporated some of that into your staff report, some of her verbiage, that, you know, if, you know, we ever get to a point to where we feel like a lease agreement could come about, that's certainly something that she could help draft for us.
And it would spell out all these terms and handle all the, you know, the negligence and all the other legalese to make sure, we're protected in the event something were to occur by one of their workers on-site. Like, if it's something due to their negligence, you know, going on so that the city doesn't get, you know, sued as well as part of it. So we're trying we feel like we have all the bases covered there. I first wanted to make sure it was legal. You know? And, and also checking with our insurance trust folks, they they they seem similar or other agreements.
You know, they didn't really get to the financial side of things, but this is not an uncommon thing, to see something, like this and the city would retain full ownership of the equipment. Yes, sir. Just fitting in again. So question. Yes. So is this gonna be double insured then? Us and the church? Effectively. Yes. Is that necessary, or is that just by default because it's gonna be a city park? They would like it. Formal term. Yes. I think they're required they're required since it's on their property to have it insured. Again, I'm taking this coming from from an ignorant point of view. How I understand it is that since it's on their property,
they have to have it insured. Like, there's no other option. Since it's our equipment, we have to have it insured as well. Okay. And that's really how it comes in. They're coming to play there. Thank you. And so yeah. So, in fact, what I put together I mean, I guess we could go a different direction too, but three different options work on an actual lease agreement. Legal could help draw it up, decline to proceed, in which case and I even notified the church, you know, this with that being our equipment, we'd certainly assist in any way in getting the existing equipment removed if you know?
And I think that would be their preference to you know, if we can't they can't come to terms, they would just request to have it all removed altogether out there. And but but if there's any other direction or questions, feedback, anything of the like that you would like for me to follow-up with, we can certainly look into all that. But, yeah, that really kinda captures it all. I know it was a lot of information within the staff report. It was a lot more involved. We're concerned it's just a $1,200 transaction on an annual basis and the purchase of equipment. But with there being two parties,
a lease agreement, land that we don't own, we looked at all different scenarios and felt like this would be the safest way to go about it. Because I even looked at a possibility, would we be able to actually acquire the land so it would be on our property altogether? That didn't that didn't seem to be a direction the church wanted to go. They still want to maintain the land there and just have it leased, to the city. Questions. Mister Steichen, mayor and Peyton, two things. I'm not against it or anything, but the last bullet point,
park board requested to maintain a park presence there. Mhmm. Is it important to have a park there? And does the park board Yeah. And and I've and sorry to I'm sorry, Des. Well, I mean, I just want they requested it to be there, but is that what the park board wishes as well? Yes. That's their request to have it, to maintain a presence up there. And that was an evaluation at the park board meeting trying to, you know, see where the other neighborhood parks are nearby, which nothing in town is too far away at the end of the day.
But there's not really a neighborhood park in, we'll say, that little quadrant, but whatever that square of town is right there, that would be the only park in the general vicinity. So wanting them to move the park, does that make it more entice of two people at the Marshall to go over there in the planet? Yeah. I think that was part of their determination. So that was a request that came from the Lutheran Church to have it removed from the from the right side from the Northeast side and move it over to
the Northwest side. They felt like that was a better location for parking purposes. If there's kids or if there's parents watching baseball games, whatever it may be, and they bring their kids over, they would be over at a playground set right across the street still on-site as opposed to down the road just a little bit of ways. The other thing was, can you go to that screen that has additionally insured? Probably the previous one. I I've been so far removed from my insurance when I had my company, but when I have trucks,
they want additional insured. I'm not I'm not saying it's the same thing here. There is just a requirement to be added on to an existing policy. But do you think it'd be two separate policies for this? Additionally, just meant the whoever whosever property was hauling or whatever needed to be listed. Right. In effect in effect, that's what it is. They didn't need to have a policy of their own. They just wanted to be added on to mine. Yeah. Okay. And maybe that's just a lost in translation. That's sort of what I meant is that we add them as an additionally insured
under our policy and vice versa. But you're not sure if both church and city has to have a policy? We do. You do? Yes. It has to both be covered under our policies. Because of the ownership of the Correct. Equipment and the ownership of the property. Julie? So having lived in this neighborhood and used that park, it kinda hurts my heart to think about some of this. But I saw the recommendation, and I have concerns. First of all, like, moving it to the northwest part of the property is away from the neighborhood. And
I could see, like and and it's closer to where we're proposing a big park, like, two blocks within a big park in our future plans. And moving it over there, there's no direct access to the South Side. Kids would have to come across a ditch. And via the baseball field, they have to go through a parking lot. There's no direct access from the ball field. The kids would walk through a parking lot, like, enticing them to, you know, like, migrate without parents, through that area. I just don't and plus you'd have to remove trees and everything in that area.
I just so for me, it makes no sense to me to move a neighborhood park away from the neighborhood. That's just my opinion on that. Part of the park, the volleyball court never gets used. I could see abandoning that right away. It's you know, the only people I see using it are the Lutheran church. And I'm not really sure. I guess one of my questions is I see they say they they put $2,400 into the park a year. I'm like, what is that $2,400 they're putting into the park? Because, basically,
the volleyball court's sand, so it's a tiny perimeter around it. We're mowing for a few months a year. Could the city I mean, we could save a lot of money taking over maintenance of it if that's our desire to keep the park. I'm not sure if the park board is ready to carve $1,200 out of their own budget. Like, they've got an extra $1,200 in there. What other park do we put $1,200 into a year in our on our own property? That's my concern. I mean, to pay and what precedence it's setting. Like, if another church wants a park,
are we now going to have to then also pay that church to put a park on their property? I I I'm a little I'm concerned about us paying to continue this park at that amount of money. It seems a big ask, you know, if it's a benefit to the church to have it there. I'm not sure where this came from. We inherited it. That's that's where we are. There's no plus or minus about that. But if the church wants to keep the presence, why are we paying all the cost for the church to have a park there?
I don't understand that. Anything else, Julie? Thank you. Comments? Ben? The the only, thank you, Mary. The only common I'll make is as far as the location of it goes, one side versus the other. I'm not sure they are I know that's the preference. I think if it were to remain at its current location, I don't know if that's I don't think that's a deal breaker necessarily for them, but that was the recommendation to have it on this side, on the Northwest Side. Well, so I was thinking it would be a future parking lot. We did kind of talk about all this at Park Board.
They the volleyball courts, we didn't really come to terms with that. If that's ours or theirs, there was and then the $1,200 part wasn't talked about either at that time. So when the park board did decide on this, those two things aren't really like, they didn't mention $1,200 renting or whatever it is. The thinking was there is another parking lot there for parents to park, so it's kind of the same. I mean, we're just moving it from one side of the block to the other. We didn't necessarily think that was taking it out of the same neighborhood, I guess. I'm trying to think of what else we talked about.
We did ask them if they were considering pitching in for any of the equipment. We didn't really get that settled either. They were gonna go back and talk about that a little bit more. So I guess that's all those extra details I can provide from that meeting. I'm trying to think if there's anything else. I think the only other thing I would add, because you're mentioning councilor Nash about the future park that we would put in. I personally felt like I think the park would felt the same too why they would because that point came up. You know?
But that's in one, we don't know when that's gonna be. But secondly, I think that's far enough away distance wise that we would not consider that within the vicinity of being within the neighborhood. That was the viewpoint, at least. Thank you, Amber. And and I had Julie, I I I deemed my initial concern was the same thing. Why why why would they move it? But I've also been around long enough where they moved a baseball diamond off of that same area. So I've I've been around for quite a while. I was like, why are they taking the baseball diamond away?
So I I had the the same question as well. And I'm I'm glad that the park board kinda went through. It was like, okay. This we there's a lot of similarities because that answers a lot a lot of my questions. And the fact that, the park board wants to keep it. I I think that that carries weight and that has value. Yeah. And I I also like the idea of the kids being able to to go across the street and play if they're they're at baseball games and running around, and there's there's options. I think it is six and one and a half dozen in there, and I don't know what the Northside Park is gonna look like. If there will be amenities like that within a block or two and,
you know, how that that plays out, I'm not sure. I'm not opposed to this either. I'd I'd like I remember my days on the park board, and maintaining neighborhood parks was key. And when we're looking at this, I still think we have to make sure we're looking at the the best deal for the city of Dilworth in terms of the annual payment, you know, with insurance and everything like that. Peyton, I will put that in in your court to to come up with with a deal that, I mean, that's their ask. Right? And that that that's fine. They they should have an ask, but I think we should have a response. And and it's also gonna be important that,
like, we minimize and limit our liabilities. Like, that's the you know, if someone gets hurt mowing or someone gets hurt playing, we keep that as clean as as possible, with with a Nuance agreement like this. But I am not I I I don't wanna limit opportunities. And by taking away parks, we we limit opportunities, and that's the last thing that I wanna see happen. Julie? I'll just and I'm not saying take the park away. I'm just I'm concerned, one, about paying to keep the park there. You know? So if we need to look at another location where we don't have to pay
and we can keep or maybe we work with the school instead. Can we carve out an area over by the park to work with them to put a park closer to the ballpark if that's where if they really wanna the park so kids that are at the ballpark have somewhere to plan instead of kids in the neighborhood. Let's work with the school district. I don't think walking a block is gonna preclude anyone from going to a neighborhood park. Well, and I'm but I'm also it doesn't preclude them from coming from the baseball field over either another block. Totally agree. But I don't think we should pay if they want it on their property.
And since the press I mean, since we already have it there, I can see making some agreement to update the equipment, but I don't see a point of us paying them to keep it there if they want it there. That's fair. Mister Steffen? Julie, kind of, hit a little bit on what I was wondering, and I've seen the park there for years. Is what's there really obsolete, or is it marginal or is it dangerous or can it stay? I I think they want it removed.
Yeah. It's pretty old. And that was But then if we update it, would that does that go can we use the our investment in the playground equipment for the lease payment? We'll update the park. We'll carry some insurance, but we don't have any intention of writing you a $1,200 check every year to put new equipment or or there's a compromise in there somewhere. Kevin? Where did the $2,400 come from? Was that part of the church's proclamation? Because the conversations I had had over there were that they were just looking to
break even. Right? They didn't mind mowing it because, frankly, there's people that don't have a problem mowing that spot. They like the well manicured look of it. So if they were in charge of mowing it, they could ensure that it was gonna stay prim and proper. So where the 1,200 turned into 2,400, I'm not real sure about that. But the conversations that I had previously, which and this has gone over my head since then, was that they were just looking to break even. So
I don't think they're necessarily looking to cash in to the 2 and a $1,200. And I'm I'm I guess I would just I'd be curious to know where the 2,400 additional dollars came from because it looks like the 1,200 is pretty well broken out between, you know, maintenance and insurance. But Julie? And to to your point, this is what I'm again, it's I don't know that we deem that that equipment is dangerous or anything like that. It's the church that's requesting the equipment be updated,
which I don't have an issue with. I think there was an insurance adjuster that commented on it. I'm sorry. What? I think there was an insurance adjuster that commented on it. Yeah. And so and again, I'm It is the same stuff we played on when we were kids. Right. And I I again, they may comment on the age of it that it may be more I don't I'm not sure. But, again, if the request is coming from them for us to, you know, to make the improvement, I feel like that could be our contribution to it,
but I don't understand why we're making their insurance. They're they've made the request to us to upgrade the park, and then they're asking us to also then do all you know, pay the insurance and everything. And, I mean, even administrative costs for the year, like, to mow it for four months out of the year, $500. Well, doesn't the second sentence of that say in lieu of are they even asking for Well, I I don't wanna conflate a few things. So I received the original proposal from them.
And based upon our back and forth negotiations, that's where we're at at this time. The $2,400 is what was presented to me from Gilbert Lutheran Church saying that's what they put into the park on an annual basis, mowing it, insurance, overhead, whatever you wanna say. And where we got to at this point is the $1,200 number, dollars 500 or $700 a year insurance, I believe, and $500 for administrative costs. And and, Julie, again too, I I agree. Like, when we look at this, I mean, ultimately, if it's gonna be a lease agreement with the City of Dilworth and between City
of Dilworth and Dilworth Lutheran Church, I mean, it's still gonna be a park board decision as to ultimately what goes there, how it looks, and everything. Like, they they will use their budget to determine all of those elements. And, again, having that conversation about the finances and everything, I think, is a good move forward. And I do also value what you said, Julie. It's like, if we're gonna put because parking parking equipment is ridiculously expensive. We know that. And maybe that upgrade offsets any other additional cost or part of the other additional cost that we have.
Right. Julie? I'm just gonna add one other idea, though. Because, again, if we're talking I mean, we don't have any other park that we have to spend $2,400 a year on. So if the church is spending $2,400 a year to keep a park on their property, why don't we work with the school who already has a park that would probably not have any additional insurance cost and carve out maybe part of their parking lot? Why don't we put the park over there and work out some lease agreement with them, you know, like with the pool, provide them park equipment instead of having someone pay $2,400
a year to have park equipment on their land. Doesn't it make more sense to move it another half a block, a block and a half, if that's your intent, then work with the school district so no one if it doesn't cost us anything to do a rider, I'm sure it doesn't cost the school district to add another playground rider. You you'd have to, like, remove a baseball diamond then? No. Like, if I mean, the parking lot or something you know what? I'm just saying. Why why not move again, we're putting it if we're moving it closer to the ball field, if you went and looked stood on that corner,
we you're going south as a ditch. There's no access to any other homes. So we're basically why not move it another half a block or see if the school district has a space that they would like? I mean, I don't wanna assume where they would want it. But if we're gonna move it anyway, if we wanna keep a park, why not work with the school district to see where they would want it? I think we should find out what the expectations are financially. And I and I'm also looking go ahead. I'm sorry. Go ahead. I think it's legit to ask the question that if the city was willing to make the investment in new equipment,
would there still be a financial ask? Or is that part of the nuance of a lease agreement? Does there have to be an exchange? There doesn't. Okay. Well, then I think it's perfectly reasonable to ask if there's an upgrade being made to your property to the tune of, I don't know, what's 1,200, $24,000. Right? Does that buy us twenty years worth of a lease agreement? Because I would just because that's, Sorry. Go ahead. Sorry. I thought you were It's not other than that's kinda apples to apples,
right, at that point? The the city is not paying any more than they normally would if they own the property. The church is getting new park equipment that would appease them. So I don't know. Is that And and I guess another park that we put a lot of money into that we don't own is the swimming pool. That's not a city park. We don't own Atlanta to lease. Right. And we dump in a lot of money into that place that we don't own. And I also look at this as a maintenance of existing infrastructure rather than something new. And if we move it, that's another conversation.
But I agree. Like, if we're gonna if we're gonna put city dollars, the park board says, yep. We want it to be here. We will the park board would be able to determine their investment, and that investment should offset our lease cost. Like, if we're making that capital investment, I think that's that's Did you ask that question? Well, we asked if they were going to put money money towards upgrading. This 1,200 wasn't in the conversation when we discussed at Park Board, and we did ask them to maybe go back and see if they were willing to invest some equipment, like, a little bit towards that,
and we hope we got an answer on that. Yeah. Well, a few things. I didn't want the Park Board getting to, like, a policy level. Yeah. We're recommending you spend $1,200, 3,000, $80,000 a year. In fairness to, the the Duluth Lutheran Church, they may not fully know the how much of an investment it is. They may think it's only, like, $10,000 that we're putting into it, not we're talking to be up to $70,000. Right. Well, I'd say $1,200 times twenty five years is $30,000. So if the city came back and or Park Board made,
if they if they suggested that the city invest $30,000 and anything above and beyond that, the church would be on the hook for. Yeah. Something like that. We've I mean, we didn't get too much into it because it was it wasn't it's like three guys from the church that came and talked to us. It wasn't Go ahead, Julie. I'm sorry. And I was just gonna add that it was kind of a split vote too. Right? Like, it was not like like, the park board wasn't they ultimately voted for it, but there was some dissension.
And that's where I'm like, I feel like this needs to be vetted a little bit more. Yeah. I think it's a fair expectation for them to contribute to the equipment. I mean, it isn't cheap. It costs a lot of money, especially if they think that there it's worth $1,200 a year for them. They should something more should be done, I guess, is my opinion. But I don't get to vote on park board. I'm just there to observe. So But then they they the city owns all of the equipment that was in the brief too. But Yeah. They asked general question kinda Julie hit on it earlier.
Not that it would happen. What if another church says, I wanna park I wanna park in our big area? I mean And I think that's an excellent opportunity where this the council at that time would be like, okay. You You go right ahead and you build one. That's on you. Unfortunately, the council that's sitting here at this time has inherited this little nuance of a park that maybe the city didn't wanna buy any land at the time, and the church generously donated to that city park.
So we get to kinda sort it out, but my recommendation to all future councils, and private private parties that wanna put parks on their land, that's on you. But this is this is a unique circumstance that we we get to delicately navigate through, right, as as we have this conversation. And, again, I brought my kids to that park. I sitting on the park board, I remember Milt Apatrel telling me how important, it is for community parks. They serve many different purposes, and I I I share many of the the reservations
that have been expressed here and also a lot of the optimism that it's an opportunity to enhance what's going on in the neighborhoods. I, for one, would like to see a continuation of the conversation to develop a lease agreement, Right? And have some concrete language that identifies the responsibilities of responsibilities and then also the expectations, of of both parties. But I'm of the mindset of the if the park board decides to make the investment, in some of the capital, projects or whatever,
like, they they're gonna put in a new swing set, jungle gym, whatever slides, that the the true costs of those items are shared, and that's our investment in in a lease payment. Our lease payment from my my perspective, if we're gonna invest City Capital in that, we're not making a lease payment. We can come to a happy medium in between there. I second that. Yeah. I agree. There's gotta be some kind of financial midway. I don't even know Yeah. What the correct word is, but there's gotta be something more than us just paying them and then paying for all the equipment that looks Seems like we're paying twice.
Yeah. That doesn't sound right to me either, so I'm in full agreement with that. We'll make the capital investment, but we're not gonna make an annual installment. Because that's also the other thing. Like, we don't have an annual installment for the swimming pool. We just maintain and upkeep the swimming pool. Yeah. We'll maintain an update Maintain the equipment up update the equipment as the park board would deem necessary. Go from there. That's my thought on the whole thing. Questions, comments? Thoughts on how else we'd like Peyton to proceed? Do you want a motion for that, Peyton? Or is that enough direction for you to continue to move forward?
In effect, just going back and saying and explaining the city's position that the level of investment that is being made by the city should serve as any type of a lease payment. Got it. Again, $30,000 is probably very, very low. That's been not putting in much. Can you hear me? In a little it was a little thing you bought last week. It was like the little swing thing. Yeah. The little rocker thing was how much was that. Like, almost 2,000. Yeah. Park equipment's not cheap,
and some of the investments we make are once you get to site prep, all of that, we're there's a lot more distance requirements now that though that equipment may not be satisfying. You know, you have to have certain distance between pieces. Yeah. It can be anywhere from $40,000 to $70,000. I'll add that real quick. Julie? So but I think that's part of the conversation. Like, what do we as a city wanna contribute? And then, you know, so is it going to be full on city park? We're gonna decide what goes in the park,
or is it a conversation between what the Lutheran church wants to see there with us? Okay. So because I just wanna make sure that they don't have expectations that we're gonna put in a $75,000 park. You know, or something like I wanna make sure that what we go to them with is, like, we agree to put in, you know, something or, again, maybe it's just something that fits the space. So scalable to the that's agreeable to the park board and the council, maybe no number attached, but I still think that I agree,
but no lease payment that would Kate mentioned, like, the distance around the equipment. That's all changed since then, so we'd have a hard time taking something out and putting it in In that same Yeah. In that same footprint. Well, I can I I I don't think that the volleyball court, carries much weight with Anyone? Anyone. That's what yeah. That's what it's Anyone. So, I mean, I I I think the red box is the, is the the canvas. Yeah. And and I agree with you, Julie, 100%. If we create a a lease agreement between the city of Delworth and the Delworth
Lutheran Church, while their input is valued, right, because they'll know the clientele. I'd like, everybody knows I go to that church. Right? I mean, it's not a secret. But I'm not on the playground. The, you know, the kids are. That that decision rests within the park board. Like, to me, that makes the most sense. Now that the the work within church can definitely have input just like any other citizen and everybody else, But, again, we have the park board for a reason, and we give them the responsibility to develop that how they they see fit, in in continuation with that smaller scale neighborhood park.
Can I ask one more question? Absolutely. So I also I I know that you're saying that's the canvas but I also feel like if part of the negotiations and I shouldn't speak for the park board But if we had to give up some of the footprint in order to make the church just feeling okay with it, I mean, maybe the park you know, like, that could be part of the negotiation too. Like, how big of a footprint is the Lutheran church willing to continue in the lease agreement? Right. And then we'll make a we'll the park board will make a decision
on equipment based on the footprint we lay out, which we finally put in agreement and go that way. Again, I I'm okay with them adjusting the footprint because we have no say in it's not our land, and it's never been defined. So I feel like that should also be part of the discussion about what part of the land is included in that. That is a good point. Yeah. And we'd have to define it, right, within the lease agreement because, otherwise, how is your insurance covered? I mean, I'm making that assumption, but I don't know that to be the case. Awesome.
Right. And if taking out the volleyball court makes that area bigger for different equipment opportunities, who's taking that out? Us, them, who's paying for all that? Site prep and all that other good stuff. Yeah. Yeah. It's a lot of questions. And I don't I didn't anticipate an answer. I figured we'd at least lay out some conversation points to move it forward, see where it takes us. They might have different ideas once they're presented with these options we're talking about. I think Maybe, like, bigger, smaller, whatever. I think we kinda stuck to the narrative that the equipment would be somewhat equal
to what they have now. I mean, obviously, updated, but we weren't gonna go, like, Giant Jungle Gym or anything like that. It was gonna just kinda be the same theme. Yeah. But yeah. Any other direction or comment direction for Peyton or comments for the good of the whole? Again, great conversation. Peyton, do you have enough information to move forward? I do. Alright. So, again, thank you very much. And with that, we'll move on to number seven. Just have a general conversation in seven alpha discussion on the Eighth Avenue improvement project financing options. Paul, do I have questions for this one?
Pete? I felt like the tone and tenor of the budget discussion earlier regarding the community center was rather positive. And this is gonna be a little bit more of a hurdle, I I guess, for us. So I'm just gonna preface it that way. And the reason why I have this on the agenda, and it is, again, sort of ties into our whole budget discussion, it's trying to determine the direction forward if the city is wanting to make an investment into Eighth Avenue and the improvements that go along with that,
what type of financial obligation that looks like. We're scheduled for our improvement hearing here in a couple weeks. We're gonna stay on track with that. But I did have Nick run some numbers for us. Just one moment here, everybody. I wish I could bring him back on to talk to us. He's much more fluent at this than I am. Why is everything 10,000,000 Yeah. Everything's about $10,000,000 these days, it seems like here. Now now keep in mind, when we put forward all this,
it was a, I guess, we'll say a worst case scenario in the sense that we are extending over Eighth Avenue through our land, putting in some of the infrastructure like a path and other things around, the project or around like the retention pond that's going in. But what we're really what you're honestly interested at the end of the day is sort of the bottom line number. Now we are able to defray some of the costs here with or I'm going to say defray, but pay out of different funds for the water and sewer improvements
that are going into this project, each of those being just a TISH less than $1,000,000 But the improvement portion itself, we're still around $7,600,000 And, again, the deferred special assessments being the sort of the number that's going to drive the cost up for us on the land north of what Eighth Avenue would be. As far as like what we're looking at from a financial perspective on this, so this is just on the levy side alone. We're looking at about $118,000
$119,000 that will continue on through the duration of a twenty year bond, okay? And that's not covering sort of this deferred side of special assessments. I have it. Of a $193,000 as well. So you add those two numbers together, and you have the math as far as what the city's obligation will end up being, pretty much from the onset of this project. So the reality is
it's, you you know, it's it's a good and a bad problem. It's a great problem in the sense that we have people wanting to build, But it's also a challenge for us being in a smaller community, you know, with only so much financial resources to go into these projects, and we can't just draw and just raise the levy 100% or whatever that would end up being to it wouldn't be that much, but to make up the difference in there. And again, I know those are somewhat conservative numbers. And so a few things I am having Andrew do,
which is kind of part and parcel of the whole conversation today. I don't know if it's worth us really exploring these numbers much further. But him drawing back on some of the improvements that are being made, you know, and that'll be all be part of the improvement hearing discussion. And then Nick can run some different numbers from there and see how much that will take away, from, you know, our obligations through all of this. But I just wanted I thought it was important for the council to see that we did run the numbers. They were I don't wanna say they were higher than I was anticipating.
We knew it was gonna be a hefty, ask just given the timing of the situation. You know, if we didn't have the community center project going on, which we do, which is an awesome thing, then maybe we'd be in a different financial situation with this. But at this time, I'm not sure if it's in the city's best interest to, do this project right away. But we're still gonna collect data. We're still gonna see where the numbers shake out in the end and make that final determination here in a couple weeks. Questions? Are you looking for input? I would agree with what you're saying.
I think we need to scale it back Yeah. Until a point that we don't have so much under deferred that we probably could then finally feel like we could put in those extra pieces we wanted. But not knowing when the rest of it's going to get developed, I feel like we pull scale it back. And the kicker with this though is that even scaling it back, we'll say it's still going to have leave a lot of deferred assume it just depends to the extent you bring over Eighth Avenue. I guess you can really cut Eighth Avenue short and just bring it down to
the residential piece and not even bring it through the other landowner's property, not even up to ours. Sure. I would like to see that option. Yep. We are. Okay. Yep. That's one thing Andrew's gonna look at. Sorry. I I'm I'm just overwhelmed by all that. Well, and and that makes sense. But, you know, at least the road through the park gives us options to utilize the land right now. And it's gonna be cheaper to do it now, but it's gonna be in five years. What is it? A block? Maybe two? It's probably, like, $2,000,000, but I I it's great to see it so we can determine whether or not
it's worth it. Like, I when when we look at this, do we have to defer specials? And what's the impact if we don't? What if we just put it all on the books right now? Can we do that? Like, if they wanna develop this, right, if we wanna move this forward, can we just levy all the taxes right now? And and just build Eighth Avenue, we'll say? Well, like, if we have Eighth Avenue, right, because if some of it's gonna be deferred or whatever, what can we just not defer the specials? Because we're on the hook for the deferment. We have to raise that without the money coming in. I'm not sure we can tax the farmland,
though. We'd have to defer that. Right? That's what I'm asking. Yeah. Like, do we do we have to defer the specials? I'm not sure if you're statutorily required to defer to specials. Again, we're we're having having a discussion as to how we wanna fund this because at our last meeting, I was like, this is this is a huge, huge build right now Where we're out with everything else, I mean, it it's substantial. And a big part of that is we don't get to capture we can't we right? We have to defer some specials. Or do we have to defer some specials?
Because now if we're able to capitalize on all of the options to to generate the revenue, does that make it possible? Or yeah. I don't know. I'm I'm just asking so I I know I can make an informed decision. Because I also know that sitting on deferred specials, they can expire, and then we have no recourse but to cap to try to capture them. And I don't I don't like that idea right now. I really like the idea of putting in Eighth Avenue and having all benefiting property
owners pay for it without deferment Or at least seeing what it show showing us what we can do. Just a question. So maybe we can have that kind of I I'm sorry. I should I should've allowed that with that one earlier, Peyton, but I I've just been kinda having a lot of, I mean, it's it is. This is the, potentially, the third project. Right? Fire department, $10,000,000. Community center, $10,000,000. Eighth Avenue, $10,000,000. I mean, ultimately, I only have so many $10 bills in my wallet, and, ultimately, we only have so many $10,000,000
bills in the city's budget. And I think we have to be very like, just ask all the questions so we can make a a quality informed decision as as we move forward. Mister Steichen, he look back, you wanna say? So you were I don't understand it as well as you do, but you're asking if the developers could take put foot foot some of the cost. Is that what you're kinda getting at? Or a big part of it or Ultimately. The deferments where they get to pay later once it develops on those. I I I'm not interested in entertaining that idea right now. Like, with all the money that we're investing,
I'm not comfortable with deferring I mean, what's the total deferment? Like, I'm not comfortable with without complete funding of the project and and outside of the city of Delworth. Like, I'm just guessing that does take place other places. That what you're referring to? Well, there's all kinds of examples throughout the state where if a developer's coming in, they foot the whole bill. Is that just what we do here or what past practice is here or in the area or The whole defer like, and I'm I can only speak from from my experience, mister Steichen,
is, yeah, the like, that's kind of part of the process. Even right now, we have deferments on Seventh Street from the projects that we've done because it's technically not developed. But what that does is it puts the onus of the financial responsibility on the established neighborhoods in the city of Dilworth. And I'd feel much more comfortable with this project at least looking, seriously, at it if we didn't have to defer specials. I agree with the mayor on that. I mean, I mean, I I agree. It's just something to consider and something to look at. And I and I and I'm all in favor of this. I want Eighth Avenue to go at least to the park, right,
that we own because I wanna I wanna get the parks built. I wanna do that too, but good lord. Probably another $10,000,000 I don't believe it's required to answer your question. Okay. And I and I think Too deferrant. Not required. Too deferrant. I'm just looking at the toolkit. There are three types of authorized deferrals, undeveloped property, which is what we absolutely do. There's a senior citizen, permanent and total disability, military service deferrals, which we have our own separate policy for. Mhmm. And then Green Acres Land, which is,
I guess, kinda tied to this too. But the yeah. I don't know if there's actual I don't think there's a requirement for this because it says cities are authorized to let property owner defer payment certified until a later date, provided the property owner meets the certain criteria. I can get clarity on that. I don't believe it's technically required. It's just something general practice that we've always done at least. It wasn't accepted, I guess. Until it's developed, you know, till there's utilities available, whatever that may be. We'd have water. Yeah. And and and I get that too. Again, it's just a conversation piece to see what how that might mitigate.
How does it change the numbers? It's just a question to ask. I mean and, again, like, I like the concept. I want eighth Avenue. Like, I I I think it's the first step in a long awaited plan, but it has to make financial sense. And asking those hard questions, I think, is fair. I agree. So as we're I mean, because we're looking at cutting off Eighth Avenue, which I think should be on the table. Can we look at cutting off the deferments, and how does that impact? And how does it impact both elements? Full fully partial Eighth like, Eighth Eighth Avenue through our through the city park?
Then 8 how does it impact Eighth Avenue up to the park? And if again, just more information for us to make our decisions that has value. And I know all those numbers are in here. I'm not smart enough to interpret it. I'm just being honest. Because because it is because he breaks it out by the they're all labeled certain things. I can't follow it, I'll be honest with you. I I will for Nick to explain it Yeah. To me. Social studies teacher. I would like to say, hey. This is what it costs with deferral. This is what it costs without deferment or deferral. Here it is.
This is the Long Eighth Avenue, and this is Short Eighth Avenue. And to me, again, the more information I have, I I think we will, as a whole, be able to make a a more informed and and better decision when it comes to paying for Eighth Avenue. So I don't have direction, Payton? Mhmm. Any other thoughts or processes? Remind me of, how long, if you don't capture, you got the deferments that Thirty years. Thirty okay. And how it and so typically what happens, like, at say this is a twenty year bond, I believe, is what you put together here.
So let's say in ten years, it develops. At that time, we tack on the twenty year repayment at that time. It's not just the difference between them. They still have to pay that full amount at that time. Is there a yeah. Is there yeah. That's another question. Like, time value of money, do we get the interest that we had to pay and all that? I mean, because we're paying those payments upfront. We're paying the interest on that and, like, like, remote. So with that one, we when and if we're able to capture the deferred payments, do we have that time value of money that comes in as well,
or is it just the interest? And I think we get the interest, but I don't remember. K? Again, I I say that because we're paying it. I just wanna make sure that the city and the citizens are are kept whole. Mhmm. Other questions, comments, thoughts, or directions for Peyton? It's a tough one. But just and and again, I and I appreciate the fact that, you know, we have, you know, Ehlers and and their team that can help me understand it. And I I think that's that's fantastic. And I have spoken to the developers. They're aware of sort of the situation just saying, explain to them this can be pretty tough,
and they understand. K. Any other thoughts, Kyle? Alright. So, Peyton, you have enough direction for that financing I do. Gentleman? Alright. Thank you very much. Let's move on to number eight in city hall, and here we go. Eight alpha. We have a public hearing on resolution twenty five forty two. And at 07:06, we'll call the public hearing to order. This is a public hearing on miscellaneous assessments for unpaid yard mowing. Is there anyone or staff presentation? Jim Yepsen paid bill. Alright.
Thanks for that presentation. With that, is there anyone here to speak in favor? Second call to speak in favor here or online? Hearing none, is there anyone to speak in opposition? Second call, either here or online to speak in opposition? Hearing no one. Can you hear no one to speak on having no one to speak on this issue, we'll call the public hearing to a close, go with counsel questions, comments, or concerns. Any? Hearing none, I will entertain a motion for resolution twenty five forty two. Motion oh, go ahead. So moved. Motion by Peterson.
Second. Second by Nash. All those in favor, say aye. Aye. Aye. Opposed? Motion carries. That brings us to seven bra or pardon me, eight bravo. We have a public hearing on resolution twenty five forty three. And with it being seven zero seven, we'll open our public hearing and begin with staff presentation. Peyton? Just a unpaid bill here. Alright. Thank you for that presentation. Is there anyone in the audience here or online that's gonna speak in favor? Second call in favor? Hearing no one to speak in favor? First call in opposition?
Second call in opposition? Having no one to speak on this issue, we'll close the public hearing, and go with counsel questions, comments, or concerns. Counsel? Outstanding. I will entertain a motion for resolution 20 five-forty three. Steichen, so move. Motion by Steichen. Second. Second by Nash. All those in favor, say aye. Aye. Opposed? Motion carries. With that, it does move us to eight Charlie. We have a public hearing on resolution twenty five forty four, miscellaneous assessment hearing for unpaid yard mowing. With that, it is, we'll just say seven zero eight. We'll open our public hearing and begin with the staff presentation.
Peyton? It's for an unpaid invoice. Outstanding presentation. Thank you. Is there anyone here to speak in favor? Second call in favor? Hearing none. Is there anyone here to speak in opposition? Second call? Having no one here to speak, we'll close the public hearing and go to council member questions, comments, or concerns? Alright. Hearing none, I will entertain a motion for resolution twenty five forty four. So moved. Motion by Peterson. Second. And a second by Borra. All those in favor, say aye. Aye. Opposed? Motion carries. With that brings us to eight delta.
We have a public hearing on resolution twenty five forty five, miscellaneous assessment hearing for unpaid utility bills. With it being seven zero nine, we'll open our public hearing and begin with a staff presentation. Peyton? Just for unpaid invoice. That's outstanding. Thank you for that presentation, Peyton. With that, we'll begin with, anyone here to speak in favor? Second call in favor? First call in opposition? Second call in opposition? Hearing no one willing to speak on, resolution twenty five forty five. We'll close the public hearing and go to counsel. Questions,
comments, or concerns? Alright. Hearing none, I will entertain a motion for resolution twenty five forty five. Steichen, so moved. Motion by Steichen. Second. And a second by Borah. All those in favor, say aye. Aye. Aye. Opposed? Motion carries. With that, it does bring us to eight echo. We have a public hearing on resolution twenty five forty six, miscellaneous assessment for unpaid curb stop. With it being seven ten. We'll open our public hearing with a staff presentation. Peyton. It's an unpaid invoice there. Is that all? Alright. Outstanding. With that, we'll move to anyone here to speak in favor?
Second call to speak in favor? First call in opposition. Second call to speak in opposition? With there no one here to speak on resolution twenty five forty six, we'll close the public hearing and move to counsel questions, comments, or concerns. Counsel. Alright. Hearing no questions, comments, or concerns, I will entertain a motion for resolution twenty five forty six. So moved. I have a motion by Nash. Second. And second by Borah. All those in favor, say aye. Aye. Aye. Opposed? Motion carries. Mercifully, we're done with those. With that, it does bring us to number nine. We have council members concerns and committee updates.
Round the horn, please. I'm good. Good. Mr. Seiken? Okay. League of Minnesota City's policy committee on last Monday, they had a lot of discussion on policing issues, recruitment, retention, those kind of things. It was it's kinda interesting when you hear different incentivizing things that different cities have put out. And some have had pretty good some have had great success. One of them was the CSA or community CSA? No. What do you call it? CSO. CSO. They turn into police officers quite often.
So I think it was Duluth had a great, history on that. Then a lot of talk on cannabis. So, the counties we just approved another cannabis shop coming up, I think the second one in the county now. So, you probably have in front of you this flyer. It's the longest table. Julie and I have been to the ones that well, Peyton as well. This one's coming up September 18 at Trinity Lutheran. As of the other day, they only had Julie and I signed up from Dilworth. So I would make I'd like to see all the managers get one of these papers.
For those that aren't too much familiar with it, the whole idea is to bring people in from the community, and they're fully funded now. We got a huge sponsor list. And, early childhood I'll put a plug out for them. Early childhood, incentivize, Sanford, The Arc, Ward Public Service, Affinity Plus, UC Hope. And the whole idea is you get there and you sit down at a table, hopefully with someone you don't know, I guess, for that's the idea, and talk about, questions and ideas.
And they have a list of questions they typically would ask, if I could bring it up here. But, we met some I get turned into a family friend there. Friends that, were there. They feed you. It doesn't cost a thing. They feed you, and there's a list of questions at the table, and we were table hosts, and we talked to the people. And a lot of the, responses are reoccurring, you know, with, you know, childcare, work related, community related issues, especially with all the, I'm guessing this year it's gonna be more focused on the violence that's coming through
the neighborhoods. So, lot of it's mostly young parents that, show up at these things, but some of the questions are, what kind of food reminds you of home? How do you celebrate food in your culture? The whole idea is to get people from other cultures. That's a big part of it. How do you get your children to try new foods? Is it hard to find food and get healthy food in your community? Lot to do with hunger. So anyway, it's free, but you need to sign up ahead of time so they can get account. On this, there's a QR code on here you can scan. But if you just Google the longest table event in Morehead,
Delworth, it'll come up. Just register for tickets. So it's on the eighteenth from six to eight, and, hopefully, all you, managers back there take one back to your respective organization and hopefully get, I'm gonna hang a few of these up around town here. So, Julian aren't aren't officially on this committee thing, but we've been involved with it. So it's it's a fun thing. It's it's a I like it. I I I get excited about it. So, so with that, I guess, hope to see a few people respond to their request to get more people.
They got about halfway there. That's where I'm gonna end. Thank you, mister Steichen. Julie? Yeah. I will say it's a great event. So people out there haven't registered yet and wanna come meet other people. It would be great to have people from Delworth at a table when I'm hosting it. Last year, I think I had someone from Fargo. And, again, it was like a lot of the seats were still open, and I was like, well, why'd you come? And she's like, well, it looked interesting. I'm like, okay. We got someone from Fargo. Let's get some people from Delores that, you know, like, come and see that this is interesting. And and, again, it it's just a great app it's just an opportunity to mingle with other people
in the community and meet your neighbors. So if you have time, come join us. And another thing, if you have time, Night to Unite is now scheduled for September 3, and, the Rail District is also having their fall festival September 20. So that's two things. Thank you for going to that meeting for me. Awesome. Thank you. Yeah. And, my PSA for the night is I really want people in the community to also get their dogs on leashes. I am tired of having to walk through the grass and across roads and not get to use the multi use trials because of people that think their dogs are
so well behaved, they don't need to be on a leash. They need to be on a leash. Get them on a leash. I am tired of having to not use the trails I also help pay for. That's my okay. I'm done. Thank you, Julie. Pete? I don't have anything. Thank you. Alright. Mine's just real quick. Yeah. I mean, again, it was at the meeting for the community center, like, thanks for letting me I know. Feeling like I I don't know if I did you justice, but it was it was a great conversation in terms of, you know, some some of the nuances and and to be a part of it. And and some of the the details and the conversations that are taking place are
are are fantastic. And, again, it's a step forward for our community. And it highlights the other part too. I also got to do a little ribbon cutting with, U Haul, which has been here forever. And U Haul is is fantastic. I mean, we think back, we remember that corner. Significant improvement. The comments that came from the Chamber members about the transformation, the commitment and the growth of Dilworth, and I mean, obviously, very complimentary and everything like that, really a testament to everybody, our citizens and our investors and, of course, our staff and management and council decisions to make things work.
And, you know, we had an hour worth of conversation on just one budget item, you know, funding one budget item, prior to our meeting. We had the conversations, you know, about how does the future residential look like? How does the commercial look like? How do we how do we really massage some of the the old decisions of the past to make sure that we're we're, you know, leaving things in a better position. And and it's it's it's the meeting on the, community center and the conversations with U Haul and everything that's taking place that really,
brings me energy when we sit here and we get to have our conversations, because I I think we all wanna get us in the same direction. We wanna move the the city, towards the same goals, and and I do it. It's it's an honor and a privilege to sit here and be a part of the conversations with everyone at the table. So, the successes are for the city to share. The work is for us to do. So I look forward to what we have coming up. And I don't have anything else at this time other than we do have to move to number 10 and pay the bills. Questions on the bills? I will entertain a motion to pay the bills. Awesome. I have a motion by Peterson. Second. Second by Nash.
All those in favor of paying the bills, say aye. Aye. Opposed? Motion carries. And with there being no further business before council seating, we're going to call this meeting adjourn.