We see students get hung up on failure all the time when it's part of science. Like it's not if, it's when it's going to happen. So having that example and being like look even in this like high stakes like real lifeish scenario like you're going to fail. And honestly kind
of good then you know that doesn't work we go back and do this or I mess up let's invent some new solution to do it. And I think that speaks a lot to the scientific mindset we want to foster in our students. This is going to be a bit of a different
episode than what we've done so far. This time we're tying education to current pop culture, specifically the new movie Project Hail Mary. It stars Ryan Gosling as Ryland Grace, a middle school science teacher who literally has to save the entire world on a deep space
mission. Throughout the movie, and even more if you've read or listened to the novel it's based on, Grace has to solve problem after problem with his knowledge of science. And it really puts science teachers front and center as the heroes they are. I'm your host, DCSD
communication director Jason Hackett. And after listening to the audio book, I put out a call to middle school science teachers to talk about this remarkable story. And two Rocky Heights middle school teachers responded. So, we're going to talk today with Erica Hamlin, seventh grade science teacher, and Sarah
Lochmiller, eighth grade science teacher, about how art connects to real life in their classrooms. So, welcome Sarah and Erica. Thank you so much. Let's have each person introduce themselves so people know whose voice is here.
>> All right. Uh, my name is Erica Hamlin. I currently teach seventh grade science at Rocky Heights. It's my fourth year here and it's been super awesome. I've enjoyed it a lot. >> And I'm Sarah Loch Miller. I teach 8th grade here at Rocky Heights and it's my
second year at Rocky Heights, fourth year teaching science overall. >> And we've all read or listened to the novel and we've all seen the movie, right? >> Yes. >> I'm going to warn everybody right now. If you're listening to this and do not want to be spoiled, maybe wait and
listen to this after you've seen the movie or even better yet after you've seen read the book or listened to the audio book because it's a great story and there's so much there and it's really hard to cover it without spoiling it. So, we're going to go ahead and spoil the heck out of this movie and
book. So, first question then, who did what as far as like uh reading or listening to the audio book? >> I've read the book. Okay. back in October. I read the book more recently. I think I read it in February. I did the ebook. >> Okay. >> So, on my Kindle.
>> Okay. And then I listened to the audio book because I'm apparently an audio person, right? Doing a podcast. So, it it's really interesting to think about all the different perspectives that everybody had. Do you prefer the book or the movie? >> I think I'm a book person.
Watching the movie, I understood a lot because of the book, but I really enjoyed the extra science that they put into the book that I don't feel like they had in the movie. Yeah, I would agree. I think the movie was really
good. It did a good job showing the science, but the book was even better cuz it can go in depth and you can kind of hear him talking and like the trial and error of it. And like the movie for the most part he tries things and they
work but in the book he tries a bunch of things and they don't work which is more like real life science. >> Right. That's what I wanted to get from both of you from the science perspective like and that I kind of agree with that because the book just blew me away and I I was so excited about this. Of course,
they have to boil things down for a movie, and it was a pretty long movie, even with taking a bunch of stuff out, but there's just so much science in the book part that was just fascinating. So, as science teachers, what did you think of how the science was presented in both
of those? I mean, there's science fiction, of course, but then he bases a lot of what he does on his knowledge. And he's constantly, you have that little thing that he says every once in a while. Well, I just know this cuz I'm a science teacher, right? like changing the calculations between imperial and
metric and things like that. So, what was your perspective on both of those? >> For me, what I really enjoyed about the science was he almost chunked it out and focused on specific science from specific times throughout it and did a
good job of I think the author actually set it up really well because he had lost his memory. So it's kind of someone who doesn't know a lot of science is now going through this pathway of with him of understanding how he knows all this science. And I think in that
perspective, it allowed for you to learn the science with him even if you weren't very aware of it. That's how I felt. >> That's a good way to put that. Yes. Cuz it kind of walks you through and it sort of explains it. >> Yeah. Yeah. And even if you're you don't know all of this stuff, you can still
kind of pick it up and follow along and >> Mhm. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Um I would agree with that. I actually wasn't interested in reading the book originally because I feel like a lot of sci-fi gets so like far-fetched with the science. It's like I kind of
wrote it off, but my husband and my brother-in-law read it and we're like you of all people need to read this book. And so I gave it a chance and I read it and I'd liked it and like it felt digestible kind of like Erica was saying where you could read it, you could understand it and he explains the
science, but for the most part it makes sense where he's talking about like electromagnetic waves and it's like hey I just taught that to 8th grade like as I was reading it. So I think it did a good job of balancing being mostly correct with being digestible for just
about anyone. You even have some scenes where he's in the classroom and and teaching some stuff. And I actually wrote this question out. I was like, I gota I got to word this exactly right. Is Ryan Gosling the coolest science teacher ever? Or is he shining a light
on an overlooked fact that science teachers are super cool and a well-kept secret? >> I think option two. Um, I think it's the best part about being a science teacher is pretty much
what they showed as little increments of our day. Best case scenario obviously, but I do think science teachers have not only classroom education skills, but they have the science passion like he
did of, wow, I would want to investigate that. I would want to do that. And so I definitely think that's how a lot of science teachers are for sure. >> In the movie, like I think it's right towards the beginning he's throwing the little earth to the kids and they're answering questions that feels pretty
real life. Students are like perfectly behaved which is awesome. But like that interaction with the students and I think it talks to a lot of science teachers are good teachers. They are into it. um not just for the teaching but also for the science for me. I
switched to teaching from doing research and part of that was I was working as a teaching assistant and I really preferred that to sitting in the lab and doing research like getting to work with other people and like seeing kids light up and like connect the dots
>> and I feel like the scenes where you get to see them teaching you kind of get to see that and that's what's important to me with teaching. >> Yeah. getting that that light bulb moment all the time and and seeing them make connections and then realize how different pieces of what they're
learning interact with each other. I mean from the standpoint of even the I mean the central problem in the movie right is the sun is being dimmed for some reason and all the different things that are happening because of that and
the book explains it even more in depth. If the sun were to be dimmed somehow, then that affects how crops are grown and how geopolitics would >> work when a certain portion of the population is starving and things like
that. So, so you get to see all of that interconnectedness and is that a lot of what you get to help, I guess, bring about for your students is that that broader understanding. Yeah, I think we often try to just do something whether it's tying in interests or current
events to make the science more relevant or like make it an investigation rather than like here's 16 facts on space like let's investigate why does this happen? Why >> do things with more mass have this different gravity? So like making it
more investigative and then connecting it to real world things or you know sometimes kids will be like hey >> I'm interested in this or like why does XYZ happen and we have the freedom to like kind of go into that at least a little bit and I would say a lot of fun
with science and I don't feel other contents could get this as much as we get so much investigating problem solving of here is the problem how our son is slowly fading How do we solve it? But we can take that
and we can do it in classroom with all topics, all types of science. It's really cool that the book creates basically an entire scientific method situation that these kids face all the time within our classrooms.
>> As I was listening to the audiobook piece, I was thinking about that, too. I had to go look up what the scientific method was again because I was like, "Oh, I think he's doing that." and like step by step, especially early on when he's trying to learn about astrofage and what's happening. And it's like, okay,
we've got a problem. So, I had to look it up. It was like ask the question slashobservation is the first step, right? Then background research, then the hypothesis, then test with an experiment, which he does a ton of experiments in this thing, >> analyze the data, draw conclusions, and
then communicate the results like that. I was JUST LIKE, "OH, WOW. This is so cool." because it is exactly what you have to walk through as scientists. So my next question I guess is then do you foresee a point in time when this story
this movie is at least well known enough that this becomes something that almost becomes a bit of a teaching aid? Have you had students that have seen this or read the book or anything like that that maybe the light bulb went on for them? >> What was cool is the book was actually recommended to me by a student. One of
my students said, "Hey, Miss Hamlin, I think you should read The Hail Mary Project." And I was like, "Okay." And the craziest part is I don't think the description of the book does it justice because I was like, "This book is the description sounds off. I just wasn't
interested." And then I read it and I was like, "This is exactly science." So, I think it could be a cool way to connect with your kids in the class of here's our problem. You could even do like how did he go about solving it? How
do we do this in our everyday life or something like that? I think it definitely has the potential for sure. I think so too. And one thing I really like in addition to like going through the scientific method is he goes through it and then it fails and then it fails
again and then he loses the astrophage and has to just, you know, build stuff out of everyday materials to try and fix his problem. And I feel like we see students get hung up on failure all the time when it's part of science. Like it's not if, it's when it's going to
happen. So having that example being like look >> even in this like high stakes like real lifeish scenario like you're going to fail and honestly kind of good then you know that doesn't work we go back and do this or I mess up let's invent some new
solution to do it. And I think that speaks a lot to the scientific mindset we want to foster in our students. >> And what was cool about the story as I was even thinking about it when preparing for this little chat with us was I felt like I I I didn't realize
this when reading the book or seeing the movie, but every big failure he had, it's almost that he maybe skipped some of the steps in the scientific method a little bit at times, right? and just didn't take the time to analyze the data
quite as much and he just got a result that he was happy with and let's go ahead. The biggest example being the the taliba becoming uh resistant to the xenonite, right? >> Yes. Yes. I was just thinking that one too.
>> Yeah. Cuz he just he he just oh I got I got a good uh result. Let's go forward, you know, and didn't keep testing. So is that another piece that you also have to work with you know teaching your kids like even though you think you got it still keep testing all the way out test your hypothesis all the way right
>> yeah totally I think we I think it's also a culture thing once you think you have everything or the answer or once you think it's solved you're done and you're not looking at other parts of the problem and that can come back too and
be something that's really hard to deal with. >> Sure. Yeah. Yeah, I was thinking too about um when Rocky tried to save him and then he you thought maybe Rocky died. >> Again, spoilers and then he tried to help Rocky cuz he was like the the venting or whatever and he thought he
would clear out the vents for him >> and he just jumped into it and did something without really thinking it all the way through and then Rocky's like, "You nearly killed me." You know? >> Yeah. Well, I think that's it's crazy though because as I read the book, I
thought he was doing the right thing, too. Like I was like, "Wow, you're a great scientist. This is great." And then Rocky's like, "You ripped off my band-aids." And so I think that's another great way the book was set up is you were or at
least I as the reader was right there following along with he's like a really smart scientist and then he even fails like you said it's it's and it just shows how science is crazy but it's mostly failure and it's very limited
success and I think that book does a great job of showing it. That was a fascinating journey to go on with him and and the writer did such a good job of taking you on the road to doing all that. So, how much do you think he had to do for research to to come up with
all this? You know, he's got the science, then he's got these ideas for some science fiction pieces that are kind of related to it and he finds a way to tie them together. But then he also had to do a really good job, I would think, learning what a science teacher has to do and how a science teacher has
to think. >> Yeah. >> What do you think of that? >> I'd imagine he had to do quite a bit of research. >> Um, I know he wrote The Martian and everything, too. So, must be something he's really interested in and maybe like ongoing he does the research and then
like comes up with ideas is how my mind would go, but who knows? Um, but I think he does do a fair job of presenting those things and then like it did capture kind of the feeling of the middle school teacher even, you know, at the end with he goes back to teaching in
a way. Um, I liked that because it showed like he goes through this whole journey, saves the world, but then still goes back to teaching because it it's kind of like a bug, I think, for some people where it's great, I saved the world, but I can keep teaching and
inspiring people. And >> I agree with Sarah. The research had to be almost I feel like he had to do cuz those are a bunch of different types of science, too. It's not just biology or botney or chemistry. He was going in and
out of all of them and the the I don't even know how to say it, but the physics of the space timing and all of that. So, I definitely think he I appreciate how much he took the time to research this if he wasn't knowledgeable to become
knowledgeable. It was cool. >> Right. And to your point earlier, Sarah, like a lot of sci-fi just going we're going to make a bunch of stuff up and do whatever, but he was like dedicated to make sure like this was rooted in actual science that that you could follow along
and understand and learn from a little bit and then connect it to Yeah, this is then plausible as science fiction. So that was kind of fun. >> Yeah, I enjoyed. So my husband had read it before me. So I like to talk to him about what I'm reading and he's like so happy I'm reading this book that he
recommended cuz he recommended it but I'm going and like you know I'm reading about this problem coming up and then sometimes be like oh it's a centrifuge or something or oh did it have did he use this and he's like I can't tell you just keep reading but as a science teacher with like a pretty broad
background like trying to guess at like is he going to do this is he going to think about that was really fun for me. Mhm. Yeah. I agree. >> I think when we first I I emailed everybody and and the two of you responded. Sarah, you mentioned too like a a background and you said it earlier
like a background in higher ed of like which way do I want to go and there's a piece of that where he was frustrated with the machine of higher ed and he kind of got kicked out of the the group a little bit because he was extra controversial with his ideas. But that
idea of, you know, there's the there's the learning, the research side, and then there's the I really want to teach and and that, like you said, the bug that he it stays with him throughout everything. Like, can you guys talk to to that side of things a little bit more
about your inspiration for teaching and why why it's so important to you and would you do it if you had to save the world and then go back to teaching? For me, teaching was never really the plan. I did a bachelor's in biology and
then I went straight into a PhD program in plant biology. So, studying like little tiny plant structures, mostly like hydraulics and that was fun. And doing stuff in the lab was great. I finished all my coursework, did a bunch of research, and then co hit and that
kind of like made me re-evaluate. I was also teaching um introbiology labs at the same time and I found I really had a preference for the teaching part and like getting to explore all these different pieces of science rather than you know just this little plant and like
these couple little structures which is still important stuff but for me the passion was more in like getting to share all this science and getting to like help people think scientifically and analyze data. those are important skills for your life and that just felt more significant and like I would
essentially do more with my life. Not saying research is doing nothing at all, but for me personally that that's where I would more shine and more enjoy. So I switched to that and became a middle school teacher and now I get to look at all kinds of science all the time. Yeah,
I was going to say I was the same way. I got my undergrad in zoology and at the very end of that, my senior year of my bachelor's, I started working in a classroom with one of the classes I had. We went into high school and taught
ecosystem stuff. And I was actually like, "Wow, I really like working with kids because they're interested and it's fun to talk about something you're interested with others that are interested." Then I just took it from there. And I just think it's a really
fun opportunity that we get to come to our jobs every day and talk about science. And because I love science, I love investigating it. I love finding problems. I love nerding out on every
little detail. And they are pretty into it, too. And so I I think that's just so cool. And like Sarah said, I think it's really cool, especially in middle school, we go over a broad topic of different science content. And so, it's
really fun to just talk about it every day. I love that part. >> And this is strictly my own opinion, a long-held opinion going back, I don't know, 15, 20 years of working in communications in school districts. And
full respect to every other teacher out there, but middle school teachers I think have some of the hardest jobs I think personally and as somebody who raised two kids who went through those middle school years, that's difficult.
They're making that big transition from being kids to being more independent teenagers. And and they're all doing it at different speeds and rates. And you know, when the kids come into middle school as sixth graders or seventh graders, depending on which school
you're at in Douglas County School District, we kind of have both. But they come in and even just height is so different. You know, they come in and the girls are like way taller than the boys and the boys are still like elementary school size. And then by 8th
grade, the boys have hit that growth spurt and and now all of a sudden they're almost their close to their full height and you've got all of this stuff going on and they're they're different perspectives and they're trying on their different personalities and what do I want to do and how do I want to do
things and hormones and the whole deal and it's kind of tough to be a middle school person. >> Oh yeah. >> And then for you guys to like deal with that on a daily bit. You may not have the same student even though it's the same student. They come to school Monday and they're a different person the next
day. Is that fair? >> Yes. >> Yes. >> And so what does it take to be a middle school teacher period regardless of science? >> I think you have to be adaptable and you have to be able to take a joke at all times. Like you don't there's never a
boring day. You don't ever know like you can have the perfect lesson plan but you don't know exactly what you're going to come into. So, you have to be ready to like change it or, you know, okay, let's go investigate this or everyone's having a bad day. We have to do a little reset and you never know what's going to be
said. So, you just kind of have to be able to roll with it. And maybe that's part of Ryland Grace in the movie. like he's able to adapt and like obviously he's in a way crazier circumstance than teaching middle school, but like he stays relatively positive throughout it
and kind of rolls with the punches and >> he's adaptable with it and like he's able to like okay a new problem we just have to keep going. And that's kind of something you have to do with being a middle school teacher and >> if you don't have that flexibility I think it would be a tough time but I
think a lot of us do. Yeah. I was going to say and you it's crazy. You just have to be especially as a teacher prepared to fail. Like lessons never go the way that you want them to go. So you just have to be ready for the adaptability of
okay that didn't work. How can I do it again? We are lucky enough to have multiple class periods. So I think it's kind of fun to I feel like every in between every class period I kind of tweak it to be better or more time or something like that. So, also a lot of
quick adjustments. And I feel like we have to be really patient cuz a lot of kids are in the I can't do this, I can't be successful, I kind of phase and you have to really work with
them slowly to get them to start realizing like you can do this. It is okay to be that it's hard and that kind of stuff. I don't know. I always just said that I am the most embarrassing human in the world. So that's why I teach middle school cuz I'm just as
embarrassing as them. And I feel like that represents middle school. Like it's not it's not a fun time, but we all got to do it. So might as well cheer them on. I don't know. >> That's so cool. As you guys are talking about this, it hit me maybe that's some
of the genius of Andy Weir, the writer, because who better to go through that kind of challenge than a middle school teacher because of how adaptable you have to be and like >> yeah, >> you know, keeping your wits about yourself and kind of your sense of humor
and keep on going without like getting frustrated because you have so many different challenges. You don't know where they're coming from the next time. And and in a way at the beginning, Rocky's kind of a middle school student, especially in the movie, right?
>> Yeah. >> It's just like, I'm going to go crazy doing whatever. >> And his humor, like that humor that Rocky has, I feel like is what we see in the classroom. Like it's very, very similar, right? >> Yeah. I thought that was good, too. >> That's a really cool insight. That's
that's funny. And so what does it mean to you to have this kind of representation in a really successful interesting book and then a big movie with Ryan Gosling in it? Like how cool is it to have representation for middle school teachers as the heroes?
>> I was really happy about it. I had gone in knowing he was a teacher, but I didn't realize he was specifically a middle school teacher. And I really liked that cuz I feel like middle school maybe cuz it's a bad time for a lot of people. like we just we don't talk about that. Like it never happened, but it did
happen. And like seeing an actual middle school teacher with >> like an actual science background being the hero felt really nice. Like, hey, someone knows we exist and isn't pretending that they didn't go to middle school and that, you know, middle school teachers have worth. Like he saves the
world and sometimes it does feel like we're overlooked. Um, so I really appreciated that and that he had so much like valuable scientific insight and it wasn't just like, oh, he can recite the periodic table. Like he's able to do that deep scientific thinking, but he's
still a middle school teacher and that's a lot of us. Like we're really into science and I'm sure the depth of knowledge like just in our department here, it's so deep, but not everyone like thinks to think about that. I couldn't have said it better, but it was so true.
>> Yeah. because of everything that you have to know. It blows my mind to think that you have to go from biology to physics to astronomy to zoology and all these other things like and you got to know a little bit of all of that stuff. Actually, a lot of it. Not just a little
bit, a lot of it >> because I'm sure at some point you've also got those really sharp students that come in and go, "Oh, what about this?" And they ask you like some hard question. You got to be ready to handle it, right? >> Yeah. Yeah. Oh, I wanted to actually say something from somebody who was an
English major, you know, like a whole other thing that's also really fascinating about this book and why I think it's just is super valuable in a lot of different ways. All the science in it is really cool, but also from the standpoint of the structure with which
it was written because of, you know, your standard storytelling and it so beautifully fits the classic story circle. the guy that came up with Rick and Morty, he really adheres to the story circle. And so that's in eight
steps. The first one is a character is in a zone of comfort. Number two, but they want something. Number three, they enter an unfamiliar situation. So as you're thinking about all this, >> Yeah. >> you've got Grace, you know what he was doing, and now all of a sudden
>> he's in a really unfamiliar situation twice actually, if you think about the flashbacks. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> And when he just had to learn what was going on with Astrophase, but then also the whole thing with when he's actually on the mission, right? Completely unfamiliar and doesn't remember who he
is at first, things like that. So, step four, he adapts to it. Step five, they get what they wanted. Step six, they pay a heavy price for it. So, think about that side of things, too. >> Seven, they return to their familiar situation.
Having changed is number eight. just having changed, which is a really fascinating thing because you think about all the different times that he tried things through the scientific method and if he skipped a step or whatever, he, you know, that's where he
messed up. But by the end, especially when he has to go find Rocky, >> he does everything, all the steps the right way, right? So, he's like, "All right, I learned my lesson. I'm not going to skip any steps. I'm going to sit there and think about this and
analyze the data and go and he finds Rocky and he does what he needs to do. So there's the part where he changed. He learned what he needed to do. And then what's interesting is the step seven, he returns to a familiar situation. That's him teaching again.
>> Yes. I thought Yeah. >> How cool is that? Like I just find it super valuable that it's not just fluffy like beat him up uh superhero movies or something which I watched way too many of >> but this is like super thoughtful from the science standpoint, from the
storytelling standpoint, from a human standpoint. It's just it's oh I love this story so much. So that's why I wanted to get some other people on here to talk about this a little bit. I just think I really loved the way he could have just written the story and it could
have been this is a science teacher, here's his problem, here's how it solved, but the fact that he added in the flashbacks and then it all medically made sense as well was like mindblowing to me because it kept me as a reader so
interested in, oh, that was a flashback. Oh, now how he's is he going to apply it? Oh, and kind of on edge to keep reading and wanting to read because I needed to figure out he wasn't supposed to be on this. So, how did he get to it?
And that I think the overall like that's just another part of it that didn't even have to do with science. It was just good story writing that made you interested. >> Well, and the fact that he in the end you you find out like, oh, he was forced on there. He didn't even have a choice
at the end. Like that was one of those curveball things that I thought, oh wow, that's >> and he just says he adapted to that too and just said, I'm just going ahead cuz what else am I going to do, you know? >> Well, my boyfriend and I had a hard conversation after watching the movie of
do you return to Earth or do you stay with Rocky on his planet? And I was like, I'm staying. I'm not going back to a planet that did that to me. And he was like, "No, I would go back because I'd want to know that they were okay." It was like another whole mental
conversation you had to think about of do you stay or do you go? And I don't know. It was just very It brought up more conversations, I guess. >> And that's what good stories do. They keep you thinking about that stuff, too. >> Yeah. >> Sarah, what would you do? >> I think I would stay with Rocky. He was
really cute. >> And his little special Yes. Rock's students were really cute and they had like their special bond and like Rocky values him and he values Rocky and feel like the people on Earth he saved them
but at that point do they even know it's him? Like >> right >> how important is that? But I don't know. I would be a little fed up with the people that forced me on to it. And like if I had a little Rocky and his family,
I guess his kind that like were welcoming me, I think I would stay with that. >> Exactly. Well, and the part I thought about too was like if he were to go back, I mean, they established that he really had no other connections, which kind of made it obvious for them to,
well, you're going then, >> but anybody that he would have known was probably either, you know, 20 to 30 years older. I mean, depending on what happened on Earth, some of them might not even be there anymore anyway. And so, yeah, he kind of was like,
>> yeah, why not stay? And he got to teach. >> Yeah. So, how cool was that? I thought about this from the standpoint of years and years ago when Star Trek came out. It was this optimistic science fiction that affected a couple
of generations now. >> And so many people now that you see some of the technology that's been invented, some people go back the the inventors of that technology go, well, I was inspired by Star Trek and certain like communication devices and things like that. they were inspired by that and
certain people became astronauts because of what they saw and things like that. Do you have any indication or thoughts that something like this story could inspire another generation of kids that
could decide, you know what, that was a cool thing. And it it lights up their imagination and interest in science, things like that. I think if it were to ignite something, it would ignite the idea that there could be life outside of
Earth, but it doesn't have to be a green alien. Like, it could be a microbe, or it could be a small astrophase type of material or cell. Like, I could see people wanting to almost like weird
biologists of space. I don't know if that is something, but that's where I would take it of, oh, we should investigate what's out and about around the sun or something like that based on what they saw. That's what I was thinking. I think going off of that, um
I agree like it could inspire people to look into or reframe how they think about um extraterrestrial life, but also like with that reframing attitudes towards it. I feel like a lot of people like the idea that there's life out there is scary, but Rocky ends up being
like not scary at all and he's a positive influence. So like that's a possibility. And then the astrophase isn't inherently attacking. it's just going through its life cycle. So trying to figure that out and like reframing it like it is not trying to hurt us. It's
just trying to live and reproduce and take advantage of things just like living things on Earth. So I think kind of having that twist to it is a positive to get people to kind of consider the possibilities like there still could be bad extraterrestrial life but there's
also good or neutral. And I like that adding that like dynamic to it rather than just black and white. >> Yeah, >> exactly. Yeah, that was actually one of the things I was sort of surprised by when I first went through the story was I just thought the extraterrestrial life was going to be the astrophase and you
know something that's you know oh that's really interesting and it's a different kind of life form and whatever and it sort of surprised me that oh there's intelligent life now that's also interacting with him you know and and like you said like he didn't encounter any like weariness like it was a movie
from like Aliens or something like that or any of the other stuff that's like, "Oh, no, it's dangerous and scary and whatever." So, >> yeah, I I thought the astrophe was it like I I tried not to really read too much about what it was about. So, I was like, "Okay, and I was like really
excited when he's talking about at the beginning is like nonwater-based life." And then he's like, "Oh, darn. It's water-based life." And like I had thought about that before and like had discussions with other science people about like could this be possible? And so, I was really excited to see that show up and then I was like, "Oh, okay.
It's water-based." And then like Rocky's ship shows up and I was like, "Wait, there's another thing." And like, "Yeah, they're just getting to like the really good part." So that was that was exciting for me. Yeah, I totally agree. >> Yeah, that was that was the fun part of that. It's like, oh, we've completely
turned a corner here, you know? So, last question cuz you guys have been very, very generous with your time and it's after the school day has ended and you guys need to leave. So, one last question. Do you think as a middle school science teacher you could do what
Ryland Grace did? >> That's a loaded question. Oh gosh, I don't even know that like do you mean saving
like problem solving and going through all of the trials or do you mean going on an a not coming back space trip? >> Oo, that's a good question. I didn't think about it from that perspective. Yeah. I guess I was thinking more the first way. >> Yeah.
>> But yeah, the other part of it is like, oh, yeah, >> cuz you've got family and friends and all that kind of stuff you'd be leaving behind. Yeah. So, let's just focus on the first part. >> Okay. Okay. >> Just as science scientists and science teachers, >> I think that would be really cool to
have his kind of how his investigations worked out and they I think I would be more I would have a harder time with how many times he fails and just starts back up again. I don't think I could do that as well as he did, but it would be
really cool to do his investigations and the research and just trying to figure out what it's happening, how and I think it's so cool in the very beginning, too, how they just give him this cell and they're like, "You need to tell us
everything about it. Here's your lab of anything you want." and how he starts with going over what he should do to identify it and all of that. I think that would be a really cool cool thing to do. Yeah, I agree with like the problem solving. I'm less of like a
astrobiologist and astrophysicist than he is, but with the problem solving, I think I could do some of that. I've been in my research days, we're like, we have to prop this plant up, just this one leaf. Like, how do we do that? And our fancy solution was get a little florist
card holder and we used a pipe cleaner and we just wrapped it on there. So like coming up with like oddball things like that. Like they're like how do we get the astrophase? We just build another box. And then like I liked seeing them come out with like just tin foil and
putting that on there cuz I did some research with a particle accelerator looking at like pine needles and you would think like super fancy everything but like how do they insulate some of that stuff? they wrap it in tin foil. So like that aspect of problem solving and thinking out of the box or like figuring
it out with what materials you have, investigating the astrophage, I think that part, sure, but like getting to like all the calculations and stuff, >> that's not quite my specialty. Maybe more so the marsh and figure out how to get plants to grow in space that I could do. Maybe I think I'd be more competent
at that. But I think the mindset's there. >> Yeah, the mindset for sure. Yeah, that's that's where the two of you and all science teachers, I just bow to all of you because holy cow, the the knowledge that you have, the ability to translate
all of that and not just teach kids how to do it, but help people understand the value of it on a day-to-day basis is so cool and so valuable. And so, thank you for doing what you do and inspiring kids every year and and helping them figure
out how to be problem solvers and and make the world a better place. So, that's cool. >> Thank you. >> Thank you again for taking the time to talk with us about this. This was a lot of fun. It was just cool to like kind of nerd out about something and and think about it from a teacher's perspective
and this idea that a teacher saved the world, saved two different worlds, and that's what it takes. Who else but a teacher could do it? Thanks for listening to DCSD Notebook from Douglas County School District,
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