push. I'm calling the Tuesday, October 7th, 2025. Press and hold till it turns green screen. Russell, where? Uh, too long. There you go. That's right. Following the Tuesday, October 7th, 2025
meeting of the Esan Medical Planning Board. So, order. Uh, the roll call will be Let's try this side. Rob Robert Terrell Cassandra Russell Denver Pete Punderson
Rob Machello director of planning. All right. Um I'm required to ask if there's anyone in the audience who might be recording this meeting. If so, please state your name and the method you're recording the meeting. Raymond Katuno. Real time court reporting and I'm stenographically recording it.
Sarah Hen reminder publishing audio. Thank you. Um, first order is the approval of the meeting minutes of September 3rd, 2025. Have a motion to approve. So move. Second.
Motion made in second. Any discussion? Hearing none. All in favor say I. I. Uh, so that passes and then the meeting minutes of September 16th, 2025. Do I have a motion to accept? To a move. Second.
Motion made second. Any discussion? Hearing none. All in favor say I. I. That passes. I'll abstain. One, two abstensions. Okay. Um, approval not required, Mr. Clerk. Uh, ANR. Yep. Okay.
Anr--2025-06. Request to combine eight small parcels into one new parcel on the corner of Nelson and Cross Street. assessor's parcel IDs 2 C-45-299 and 2C-44-28 located in the residents district
applicant that's sorry dead thank youski 1307 Tinkham Roadham mass 01095 the applicant here you want to come up and tell the board what you're
Oh, that's um so my father's just trying to uh build a 1,800 foot single family home with a twocar garage. Um that's really it. Okay. Rob, any concerns on your part?
No. So the only thing just to notice that this street here crawl street believe is a paper road and then Nelson Street is where the front of the buildings can be facing. But because it's on off streetet which technically is a town road even though it's not built it has two streets that front's
on. Other than that the lot does conform to our zoning. Okay. Any questions from the board? Hearing none. Do I have a motion to uh endorse the plan? Second. Motion made and seconded. Any discussion? All in favor say I.
I. Anyone oppose? Say nay. None. That matter passes. Thank you. So, we need to take a little recess until Mr. Pill's traffic engineer comes. Okay.
Hoping this may need a couple minutes to set up. And I did promise that we will provide a free open. Okay. So, he's got a couple minutes before we get to him then. Thank you. Okay. For your courtesy.
Sure. So, um, Mr. Clerk, do you want to read? Yep. Case site-20225-03 request for site plan review approval to construct four manufacturing warehouse commercial build manufacturing
warehousing commercial buildings combined total footprint of 455,936 ft with 398 parking spaces at 330 Chestnut Street partial ID 18-38-0 located in the industrial garden park zoning district. Applicant Vincent
Fishino 1260 Stelton Road, Piscatakqua, New Jersey 08854. Don't have it tonight. So, um, do I have a motion to reopen the public hearing?
So, moved. Second. Motion made in second. Any discussion? Hearing none. All in favor say I. I. All say nay. Hearing none. So I thought what we do is um there were questions asked by the board and there were questions
asked by the people in the a residents in the audience at our last meeting. So uh they were directed primarily to the the petitioner. So we're going to want to hear what their responses are. I'd like to ask a couple of questions of Mr.
with the planning director to kind of get us going and then um the representative from the fields of uh fields of chestnut uh has brought in a traffic engineer. So we'd like to hear what they have to say and
then if there are still individuals who wish to um speak on this matter certainly we will entertain you to at that time. Um so first I'd like to just ask Mr. would show you to uh let the auto know what has happened since we
last met. Rob, sure. So, basically what happened uh we asked the applicant to make a series of changes to their plans and requested updated material specifically focusing on traffic and pedestrian safety around traffic.
So, they have since worked on that, made those updates and has sent us updated materials including a new set of site plans which were dated October 1st. So very recent, they sent us a list of all the changes they made, which I'm sure they'll go into during their presentation uh later in the meeting.
Also sent us a truck turning diagram shows the um routes and turns from all possible angles on the road, every direction, left and right, that a big truck can make. And um I'll let the engineer describe the results of that
plan as well. Um, and they have also submitted a uh draft agreement. Uh, and I'll let the applicants go further into what that agreement is. U entering an agreement with the town in terms of contributing funds for traffic and
pedestrian improvements along Chestnut Street and the intersection of Chestnut Street Road. Um, of course, I'm not going to speak too much on that. That's up to the applicants. And here we are now. Mr. So Rob can just for people's education
so when a application like this certainly the size of this project comes in what steps does the planning department take after they receive this? Sure. So basically we expect the applicant to give us everything that's required up front which includes a set
of plans uh project narrative uh and everything else for all applications for the planning board. And usually what I do is I look at the um site plans to make sure they conform to our zoning. That's the first step. There's anything that's missing which during this review
process I have talked the applicant a few times. they've made those edits and once they conform to the zoning then they can go ahead and submit the application and during that period other town departments including the police department the fire department who both
did not provide any comments for or against actually the police department said they were for this petition um DPW health department and pretty much everybody else building department um they all had a chance to weigh in on the project and so far the comments we
received from those departments, Mr. Chair, be very minimal. Uh the only one that I'm aware of is just they have to go with the conservation commission after they're done with the planning board. That's a whole another public hearing they have to do after this concludes. Uh then once that's done, we
set up a hearing date and they come before the board and make their pitch. Um so Mr. Hill had requested all of the original documentation that had been submitted by the petitioner. When did you provide those to Mr. Pill?
So, I was given a flash drive from Mr. Lebec at the last meeting with all his presentation materials. As soon as he gave me those materials, it became public documents. Uh, Mr. P requested those documents that were used during the hearing and I provided a flash drive
with those documents on it to Mr. P. And and when was that done? That was done uh the day after the hearing. Last year, Mr. pill. It's not timed. Okay. Thank you. Yeah. Okay. As I indicated, so uh for
the petitioner. Good evening. Rob Lev from Arlo Associates. Here this evening with Jason Adams from Bowman. um Joe Marino the project proponent and Rachel Fancy from Fitzgerald Law. We're here this evening based on a continuence from the last
public hearing. We have as Mr. Wella had mentioned addressed a number of items that I believe we'll go through briefly if it pleases the chair and the board. Um and then I will turn it over to Mr. Adams will also go through some of the details of what we provided um and have
addressed. Um, attorney Fancy is here as well, um, and can answer any questions related to the proposed agreement, you know, whatnot. Um, that pleases the chair. I'll So, Rob, if you could hear our slide,
can you folks hear me? Thank you. And I'd like you to just point out any changes as you're going through this first hearing to now. People can put that into context. Absolutely.
So the very first slide that I have are site design changes since the last meeting. They're pretty basic and straightforward. Generally don't change the character of the plan. Um, as requested by the proponent, we added sound barrier walls to the edge of each
of the buildings. This is something they've done in other locations, very successful. Um, with the concerns that have been raised, we wanted to make sure we're mitigating sound much as possible. As you have seen from the previous plan, which I'll also show here. And Rob,
thank you. No need to come around. I'm just kind of hopping around. I'll use this. Um, so we've oriented everything to the center of the site, buildings acting as barriers and the edge of each of the buildings. We've added sound barrier walls that will help with that, but that
was one of the minor changes that we made. There was also some questions related to the parking calculations. Building number four had a square footage number that was transcribed. Um, so we've updated the required parking and the parking calculations. So if you
go to um next sheet if you don't mind the next slide that slide shows actually the sound barrier walls and then if we go to the very next one we've updated on our plan um we have
from the review sheet we've updated all the numbers so that everything corresponds there was a minor number that affected the parking calculation as far as requirements that's been updated and reflected in that uh and as well as our web. You go back to the
So, can you highlight where they are? Like right here. Okay. How tall are they? They're consistent with the walls of the building. So, they're the height of the building. Okay.
And so they're just on so they're in the area of the uh the loading itself. So where the the um tractor trailer trucks the trailers would be backed up to the loading docks, they're they're protecting that area. So
the the area of any sort of activity. Okay. Thank you. Yeah. Thank you. So um we have the site design, I'm sorry, the site updates. There was also minor um minor updates to the curb cuts. Each of the curb cuts into the site were revised ever so slightly when we were
working on the truck turning movements with Bowman. We noticed a couple radi that change for the radi on the way in got adjusted ever so slightly. But just that minor modification to the plant. And then in addition, when we were
reviewing our plans internally, we have a retaining wall that um is over 30 inches in height and we will need a fence on it. So we added that fence that would be updated in the construction site regardless, but we wanted to make sure it was reflected in the plan.
So that's what's what's the height of the fence? The six foot height. If it's okay with the chair, I turn it over to Mr. Adams. Are you going to go through the traffic counts, the updated traffic counts?
Yeah, I can I'll Jason. Um, we have a couple slides too, Rob, if those are on there just to to give an update and then happy to go through to as much detail as you'd like. Um the the big change since last meeting is that we
heard a lot from the board and members of the public about the need to uh produce improvements in the vicinity of the site to both improve existing conditions as well as uh offset any of the the impacts of the project. So we have submitted uh an improvement
package. Um I'll walk through that uh briefly on the next slide. Overall, we already committed to uh pavement markings or sorry, pavement monitoring and improvements as needed in the vicinity of the site drive. Um and we are now bringing forward an
improvement at the intersection of Ches Street and Shaker Road as well as at the Redstone Rail Trail um crossing upgrade the facilities there. Uh we're also in receipt of the uh peer review letter produced by the Butters traffic engineer
I believe is here tonight. Uh I'll just touch on that briefly. I know they're going to make their own presentation. Don't need to uh waste any of the board's time but happy to interact in that space as well. Uh Rob, if you could go to the next slide. Uh so this is just a concept overview of improvements at
the Chestnut Street bigger road intersection. Uh essentially what we'd be looking to do is add a new eastbound right turn lane. So the movement coming from project site um moving towards Shaker Road allowing for better movement
uh turning right to head south um Shaker Road as part of this uh all of the uh intersection corners radi would be improved. Um right now I know we showed last last meeting we showed video of of heavy vehicles making those turns today.
We understand there are still some concerns that are being raised, but as this is an opportunity for the town in concert with our project team to improve those radi and make sure that the WB67s can safely turn in and out that's of utmost uh concern for us as well. We we
need to have that operate for our our project as well as what's already out there today. Um so we'd be working through that. And then I I know one of the comments that was raised and we're very in favor of this was upgrading the existing rectangular rapid flashing beacon. The flashing lights there that
cross into the redstone rail track to provide passive detection so that someone doesn't need to press a button in order to activate the lights. Uh we can upgrade the the system to recognize when someone is present a pedestrian or bicyclist to activate those lights to to
give better visibility. Um then next slide if you could. So so just a couple quick points from our perspective on the comment letter received uh on Friday. Uh one of the big uh talking points was the trip generation that was used. I know this
was a big conversation point of the last hearing as well. Um the uh traffic engineer has correctly pointed out that there is new trip generation data. So when we had submitted our study uh we were using the latest available trip
generation data since that time there is our new a new addition of the institute of transportation engineers. So there there is more data available. They have presented out the idea of updating some of the trip generation that we have provided. Um I I think there's different
ways you can both select a land use code. I know we talked about this a little bit last time between warehousing and some of the other industrial uses. Um but the I think where the end result of this goes what is the impact project? Um we feel that by submitting the uh
level of improvement that we are now committing to that we're setting project impact. So uh it becomes a little bit more of a moot point about what those specific numbers are. I mean frankly we don't know exactly how many vehicles are going to come to and from the site. we're doing our best job from an
engineering perspective to estimate that and to give a reasonable um direction by the board in terms of what the expected project impact is going to be. So if those numbers were to change a little bit up or down um overall what we're trying to do is is solve for the a
greater um overview of the acceptance system. Yeah, I I think that's probably pretty good from from our perspective. Um well I know some people uh have been focused on numbers so I thought there was
discrepancy in projected number of tractor trailer trips. I think you originally had 195 to 200. There was a number that was unsure about number of
loading docks and the number of employee parking. So do you have estimated definitive numbers three things? Uh Rob, do you want to talk to the green spaces?
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I have a number of those items on the updated plans list that have been provided on October 1st. Um the first one I will go through is the parking spaces. We have 365
parking spaces. We have 106 loading dock space spaces and then we have trailer parking or 138 spaces. Is that that's it? Yeah. Thank you. Thank you,
sir. Um, questions from the board. Maybe at the moment you can ask I can ask you a question. So doing my homework over the weekend. I drove by Carter Monday which is on
Shaker Road. And from Shaker Road, you look into Carter Monday and you see a whole row of loading docks. And there might have been 30 track of trailers parked in front of the load out with
none of the doors being opened. So what would be I mean is it part of the industry that people go unload the vehic unload the tractor trailer and it sits there? Is that in
any way related to why you need 158 loading ducks and then I guess the question bays so and this is just me a lay person asking these questions so you know I think of so let's just think
of card Monday they used to run three shifts they might have had 600 parking spots for their employees and they had 300 people come to work at 7 a.m. and then 300 people come to work at
and then 300 people coming at 3 p.m. Obviously can't park where the people who came in at 7 a.m. are and is that the rationale why you have why a site like this would need so many park spots?
Uh yes, Mr. Chairman. um the shift change, the potential for people on each shift to overlap is a reason for the need for the the parking. Um as far as the logistical component of each of the businesses, obviously there's
variability. It's a multivariable analysis. However, um there would be the opportunity for them to have an empty trailer, multiple empty trailers. We see that in different distribution centers that um there's often a logistical component
where they'll actually have a yard truck move trailers, not this particular obviously, but they'll have a yard truck move trailers off site and store them empty until they can be picked up. So there's all different types of logistical mob that can be dealt with
with ample number of spaces storage as well as obviously the overflow between two shifts for park passenger. I think your assessment is correct. Uh questions from the board. I so I I Yeah.
Yeah. Thank you. So today I I was oddly enough uh was part of this southbound turn. Uh I was sitting in the lefthand turn lane heading to the gas station leaving the post office and a fullsize tractor
trailer, whatever you call those, uh came at me and I had to pull forward because he couldn't get around me. Uh I know you're going to modify that and I appreciate that. I'm wondering how much is this going to add because it wasn't even close. He he went fully into the
left turn lane only and was able to swing it. Um so when I got to the gas station, I stopped and watched and I saw many others swing it just fine, but the fulls size one, it wasn't even close, right? So that's I guess that's my main concern is heading southbound. What's going to happen to that corner,
right? And and so there's there's two pieces to this. One is one is a widening to add an an additional lane. So that's a you know typically about a 12T widening with associated shoulder. Uh the second part of that is the radius of the intersection would be adjusted. So
you know the WB67 is now the the standard design vehicle especially in an area like this to a you know an industrial project like ours. Um when this intersection was originally designed it was probably a smaller vehicle was a design vehicle and I think that's why there are some tight
movements for a WB67. um a WB62 or something that's smaller typically can make no turn, but some of the larger vehicles have a little bit of trouble and and that's why we see this as an overall improvement. So, it would be a combination of of widening the roadway. There'd be more pavement on the approach
as well as adjusting the radius to make that make sure that that vehicle can can get around safely as well as from other approaches too. Not even though the widen would be the the right turn lane there would be other modifications at the corners of the intersection to accommodate those vehicles.
Okay. So we there they are coming into that you know residential house now and it is going to 12 beat on this uh chestnut and then they're going to turn at least shave off some of that corner at least. Right. So it is going to get larger. We're not just reconfiguring. Correct.
Yes. Uh you can I mean if you can see in there it's kind of hard to see there's a little red line that falls out the town layout. So on each of the corners of the intersection, there is available public right away to accommodate such a movement. So it it will adjust some of how the existing properties are laid
out, but not within their own right away. So that the improvement as best we can tell at this stage certainly there' be more engineering that would go into this. Um the the improvement we feel will be accommodated within the available public right away. All right. And the last piece on this, so I I know this was brought up last
meeting, but you know, typically this is coming, imagine where people are going to end up coming based off of navigation, right? They don't just read maps anymore. So this would be your Connecticut bound, New York bound, southernbound way coming this way, right? Presumably, there could be coming from
Boston and north and west as well. And they would come from different routes. I know the Long Meadow intersection was a question. And then how people are going to come through the Mass Pike, right? cuz I think everyone's concern is coming through the rotary and how something that you know can't even make the turn
is going to navigate that nightmare. So um was there any other thought put into the other two sections and how people would come in on those routes? Uh I mean generally we've been trying to understand exactly you know as best we can within engineering judgment where vehicles would be expected to come come from to make sure those can be done
safely. Um, I think that to the point of how people are going to get through the rotary and uh, certainly there are going to be wayfinding used. I mean, I think everybody knows that at least during peak period, if not all times of day, you're trying to avoid that. You know, the rockers are going to be doing the
same when you plug it into your GPS. It's it's very unlikely that you're going to have an option to go through that rodeo. It's going to I mean, there's a number of ways to get get to and from the site. Um, we don't expect there's going to be much truck traffic, especially not during peak hours that are going up and down. uh from the north
side of Baker Road. Okay. All right. Done. Yeah. It's on. It's on. Also, by working on the radius uh when you're exiting on the Chestn Street and heading east on Chestn Street, will that
allow the truck to be completely contained in the right hand lane? Are you talking about when exiting the project site or exit the project site by working on that radius? Correct. What will happen because it's going to happen when trucks come south on Shaker
Road from the center of town and we know that's going to happen. Um that the the turn taking a right-hand turn and heading down to the project. Is there a possibility of putting a different radius in that corner also where the shell station is at at the signalized intersection like
at the signalized intersection like the shaker turn on the chest you're talking about? Yeah, we would expect that as part of that improvement we'd look at all four corners to adjust to adjust the radio. Well, hopefully you won't have to do the the chest street corner cuz that's not a viable way of getting in and out of there in the winter time. That'd be
pretty pretty dangerous. Thank you. So just for the lay person and we we're asking a lot of questions. We know as a matter of fact that not everyone reviews all the materials before they come to this meeting. So we
try to get as much information out as possible. So I'm a little flumxed on expanding the radi if I said that correctly. So is there a taking of property occurring?
No. All of all of the corners of that intersection are covered by public right ofway. So it's it's land owned by the town and essentially it's set aside for the use of public way. So if you were to add a sidewalk, add a whatever you
wanted to do. There's and we're we're shown it on that and again it's it's a small red line. We would go through this whole exercise, but but there's not any property needed from any of the private properties at any of it's land already owned by the town. And so
what is the width that I'mma added to the pavement in the intersecting? So so essentially you're talking about how wide at its widest point. No. How much more concrete or pavement are you adding to
take a righthand turn from Chestnut onto Shaker to go down to Enfield? probably about 12 to 14 ft. Oh boy, they the town owns as a as a lane that I mean that's a typical So it's a whole new lane. It's a whole
new lane that fits within the public right away. Okay, Russ, I think that the town owns 12 ft in anyway. Yeah, we l All right. Um, other questions from the board?
Mr. P. The floor is yours. I can't remember. Oh, okay. Sorry. All right. Just because I foresee it coming up. Um, for the record, Rachel Fancy with Fitzgerald Law uh here on behalf of the applicant.
Uh, as the board will see and anyone who reviewed the submitted materials, there was a draft agreement which was submitted uh which is modeled after a previous draft agreement that was submitted with the prior one, but it is different. Uh this draft agreement seeks to essentially remove the ability to or
the requirement not ability to test for um traffic flow essentially. So rather than making it conditioned on certain metric being met for the fund to be provided, redevelopers is just providing that fund to the town and stating make the improvements. Let's do it now. It'll
be for the betterment of the site. It'll be for the betterment of the town. And that fund includes both the widening, some additions on the actual infrastructure that uh Jason touched on as well as improvements to the Shaker intersection or the not the intersection, the rail trail. And we're
sort of putting it in the town's perspective of what they think is best. It's not what a private developer thinks is best. What does the town think is the best way to do this. We've provided plans and suggestions and we are more than happy to do that should the town want it, which is why that's in a draft format. But we also realize this is
going to impact the town as a whole. We want the town to have that wherewithal to make those decisions. Again, we feel that the plans we have submitted sufficiently address that and will fulfill all needs that are desired, but to the fullest extent, we think it is in the best interest of the town for them
to have that option. But again, committed in a draft that they would like to toss it back to us. We are more than happy to do those improvements ourselves. figured it'd be best to put it in the town's hands and allow them to make the best decision whether it's DPW, fire, police, whoever it may be with in
hand our recommendations from our traffic engineer. Right. Any questions for that? Thank you. Thank you. Thank you board members. For the record, my name is Robert. I'm the managing principal of MDM Transportation Cons
Massachusetts. Um I've been retained uh through Michael Pill's office to continue our review of this particular site. I've provided testimony to this board on prior application. Um our commentary incorporated by reference
into what we'veeded to the board. Uh we've had an opportunity to look at what has been recently submitted uh and documented in the the 45 traffic report that put together commentary very much runs in line with
our original comments. Uh and they really focus on two aspects of the project and that is um how the project is being characterized in terms of its potential tenency traffic that might be generated by what
variety of different industrial issues. Secondly, um the maneuverability of the types of vehicles that are likely to use this site. So, we haven't reinvented the wheel in our commentary. Um I will acknowledge that uh Bowman had mentioned
uh and council has mentioned that the uh draft agreement so to speak that attempts to um update some of the mitigation commitments that were made in the prior application. uh those were along the lines of mitigation that we
had suggested would be appropriate to ensure that the project impacts are properly accounted for and and addressed. Uh I haven't had the chance to look at that draft agreement. I have not seen the conceptual improvement plan for the intersection. Although I think
the basis of our comments very much align with what they're now suggesting they will be willing to do, which is geometric improvements to Shaker Road and Chestnuts. We think that is appropriate to address existing known issues as well as the increase in
intensity of use at that particular location. Um we're glad to take a closer look at that off the record. So um secondly um to the impact of the project generally
um as Adams had pointed out there's been updates to standards that are typically applied to projects like this and the underlying issue that we've identified is that and this app applies equally to my firm and how we approach these types of projects many of these projects for
developers UPS Amazon etc is that we always look at the highest best potential use or occupancy of a site to understand what its potential high-side impact might be. Um, this could be a warehouse, it could be a light
industrial uh facility, it could be a mini fulfillment center or series of those. Our firm has a lot of experience with uh in particular fulfillment centers. Mini fulfillment centers are a fairly new uh type of of fulfill
fulfillment center. uh they're much smaller than what you would think of as a a big Amazon plant or UPS facility. They tend to be 150 to 170,000 square feet. Their shifts run much differently than what was discussed earlier terms of
the traditional 7 to3 type shift. uh many fulfillment centers, one of which we worked on and is now operational and that we've had the opportunity to actually count after the fact now that it's fully operational. Uh is 170,000 square feet. Uh it's got
4hour civilian driver shifts, they call them. Um uh very high generator, surprisingly high. uh you know on the order of uh just under 200 vehicle trips during peak hours, 2,800 trips over the course of an entire day for a facility
that is far smaller. Agree with us here. Um that said, we've suggested what we've done in our review is apply what we believe to be a more appropriate standard for trip. It varies from what has been submitted by the applicant in two ways. One is
that there are more trips associated with the with the use and the directional inbound versus outbound splits look much different than what a traditional warehouse or industrial use might be thought of. Um meaning that the trips tend to be more balanced inbound and
outbound. So what we've suggested in our commentary is that the applicant um take that updated information into account and ensure that whatever they may be contemplating for improvements account for that higher potential impact. Um you
know our commentary is not meant to derail a project or oppose a project. It's it's being provided on the basis of what standards we hold to ourselves as a company that work in the Commonwealth and based on our recent and ongoing with
exactly this type of facility. Um it's common on they get it right. They don't want it to fail or work correctly. Obviously community perspective you want to make sure that it works well. So there's mutual uh perspective here making sure
that this is analyzed correctly and that the mitigation that's put forth is appropriate and in context with with the project. Um that's the upshot of what we've got. I've got you know an half an inch thick document here. I'm not going to go through in detail on this. Um I
would suggest to the board that um uh the applicant at some point in its assessment conduct at least what we would call a sensitivity analysis to look at the higher generating potential and the newer standards. Look at the analysis
one more time. make sure that what they're proposing to do will actually offset the impact of the project and accommodate the types of vehicles WB67 in particular that contemplated. Um, you know, I I think even in videos and and
some of the observations of truck activity at SH Shaker and Chestliningly apparent that uh those types of improvements are needed. Uh, so, uh, with that, I'm glad to answer any questions the board might have, but all
of our comments are in black and white in the memo of October 3rd. Uh, and I'll be here for any questions you might have. Thank you. So, I'll I'll ask a question. So with the proposed changes to the intersection,
do you believe in your professional opinion that that improves, you know, there's a rating, I guess, from A through F of the intersection? And I think they had indicated last time it would go a C to a D. Uh, does the
improvements that are being proposed change that rating? Yeah, ju to clarify the overall intersection operation might be a letter of service level of service C or D or thereabouts. There are individual movements within the intersection that are failing or will
fail even with modest traffic. Um the left turn lanes in particular are subject to long cues during peak hours. Um I have not seen an analysis uh by the developer uh that would indicate what
those levels of service change to with the geometric enhancements. The additional lane that they mentioned uh they would be willing to implement. Um however adding lanes generally adds capacity
and they have committed to a retiming of the intersection which could address some of the uh issues at least some of the additional delays or trips that are being generated through the intersection. So what I would say is that um there's there's a high possibility that with additional lanes
and retiming that um the intersection or the impacts associated with the project may be offset at least uh it may not entirely address every queuing issue within the intersection. It may not necessarily completely eliminate delays to a point
where every approach works at a what we call a D or better an acceptable standard. uh but certainly uh the types of mitigation that they've just mentioned which we suggested and recommended in prior reviews is likely to be appropriate.
So the other thing I've had some um difficulty conceptualizing is um they indicate that so many vehicles are going to come from Long Meadow, so many vehicles are going to come from
Connecticut and then when they leave the site so many will go past, you know, go down to Long Meadow and so many will go up to Shaker Road. How is something like that developed? And use lay terms if you can. Yeah, sure. Um so there are two aspects uh employees who are going to come into
to and from the facility. Um those distributions are typically based on uh census data. Uh there's a category of data that is called journey to work data. Uh that would indicate for folks who live in East Long Meadow where they
work. uh and and based on that type of information, you can make educated estimates of uh what portion uh what what number of trips might be drawn from various communities and which routes are most likely to be used to get to or from
the facility. So there's the employee distribution that's usually census based to some degree. You look at existing travel patterns to justify some of that. Um and secondly, the truck related trips and that is very much dependent on who the tenant is of the facility. In the
case of a mini fulfillment center, you've got a combination of uh what are known as civilian drivers who usually use their own personal vehicle to load up uh Amazon packages for instance to deliver to to to folks. Um some of those vehicles may be larger box truck type
vehicles. Um and then there's the tractor trailer vehicles. uh and the tractor trailers usually have an origin point from a regional distribution center to a smaller facility like this. So it depends on where the regional distribution centers are located and
which routes most efficiently serve the locus. Uh so the truck trips are a bit trickier to to estimate. Um it depends very much on who the tenant is, where the distribution facilities are, where their customers are located. Um there may be local deliveries that are being
made by tractor trailers that do necessarily rely on local streets as opposed to interstates for instance. So a lot of that is variable. What we've suggested in our commentary is a post occupancy monitoring program. It's common to these types of projects. We
had to do it for Amazon and Westboro, the mini fulfillment center. Uh we do these uh we're now building a UPS facility in Shrewsbury. We're going to be subject to monitoring there. uh not only for vehicle trips for passenger cars but trucks. And that post occupancy
uh uh measure, if you will, validates whatever was estimated in this process. And if it's vastly different, materially different, then there's usually a provision that allows the town another bite at the apple, so to speak, uh to
work with the developer to address uh unforeseen issues that were not uh incorporated into. Right? So if 30% of the truck traffic's coming through five corners or you know a roundabout um that's not foreseen but it does happen
that type of monitoring would ultimately result in another view of what might be done. Uh it would be a management action that uh is applied to the project that specifically and expressly requires the tenant to advise truckers uh you know
deliveries not to use specific routes etc. Right? So, but monitoring is an important component is some if the board will allow me. I have a couple more questions. Please. Go ahead. You sure? Um, so last Tuesday evening there was a
presentation at the senior center and my apologies that we're not at the senior center. We got booted by uh a dance club that needed the needed it. So, sorry bud. Um um what was the name of the presenter Rob? Do you remember?
Jeff Spec of Spec MC. He's an urban designer. Yeah. And so he was uh he was hired by the town to do a study on essentially how to make the Rotary more walkable. And a resident there, a resident at the
meeting raised the question, well, what do we do if we put in a warehouse project on Chestnut Street and truck traffic? and his comments and please correct me if I don't get this correctly was essentially that um tractor trailers
are not a detriment to going around the rotary with respect to traffic accidents because if they come to a stop their their ability to get into gear to
get around the rotary is limited to any to gaining any speed to do any damage. Would you care to elaborate on that? Well, I I wouldn't agree that uh there's there's Did I get that right? That ring a bell?
But he said okay. Okay. Most enough. Okay. Aspects of traffic safety that I would be concerned with. Um, you know, I I've been asked and have testified regularly to the safety aspects of travel in and
around certain intersections, roundabouts, etc. I do a lot of land court type cases. Um, I've been asked to uh most recently yesterday to be a participant, an expert witness in a uh in a fatal crash uh involves a bicyclist
and a truck um in Cambridge, another one in Somerville. Um, so as it relates to these larger vehicle types, um, the visibility or lack thereof from the driver's eye position to a pedestrian, a bicyclist, or even sometimes another
vehicle is somewhat difficult at best, depending on how they're trying to navigate an intersection. Um you might be familiar with a case involving one of the duckboats in Boston uh you know uh causing a fatality uh and the cause of
that fatality was the lack of visibility from the driver's position to be able to see you know uh pedestrian you know uh who is adjacent to the vehicle. So, um, you know, it may not be so much a capacity issue, so to speak, but it very
much is a consideration for pedestrian and bicycle safety. Uh, and that's, uh, something you'd have to take up very hard. My last question, at least for now. So, if you leave the project site at 3:30
and you take a left going back toward Long Meadow and you drive along the fields of Chestnut, there appears to Well, there is a rather large mound that separates the street from the residential properties.
Why is that built and what is the purpose of that? I I can't speak the exact purpose, but I I've got to believe that it's one for for privacy. Um, this is the BM in front of the entire development you're talking about. Yeah. Yeah. Um, my guess is that it it it shields
the site visually from the street so that you feel more encased, if you will, within a community as opposed to feeling like you live on a busy road. Um, and you know, I'm familiar with that site. Um I believe that as you're leaving the site uh the BMS are positioned in such a
way that it does not impair your build C. So it's probably and and potentially for for noise frankly so it it has a noise dampening effect uh because it's you know
those sounds into an embankment or or higher. Okay. Thank you. Thanks. questions. The floor is open. Whoever would like to be heard on this matter. Mr. Pill, thank you. Um, when we submitted our
stuff on Friday, I made it a point to transmit everything directly to the applicant and Robilla, let me am I pronouncing it right? Yeah. Okay. With a name like Bill, really try to be careful. Um, he informed me he
did. We had never received a copy of any of their most recent submissions and we would and that's not Rob's fault. That was their job by the way. And so um you know I'm happy to go get them. Are they on the website now? Okay then certainly
I will download them. I will forward all the traffic stuff to Mr. Misho so that he can review it and prepare a further evaluation and report. I also will take a look at the proposed agreement and I
guess I have a question. I I'm assuming those comments of course they would come to you but I'm assuming they should also go to the town attorney Jesse Belchure Timmy at DHY Wallace. Um everything everything's to our director. Okay. So I'll send everything Yeah. to the planning board chair of Rob. Um,
you know, I u I do recall last time there were some issues both with the text of the agreement and the amount of money the adequacy of the amount of money that was being offered. And so I want to take a look at that and I also want to have Mr. Misho look at the
agreement and we would very much appreciate that opportunity and um absolutely guess that's about it and I I certainly hope that you know um it sounds like we will get the opportunity to come back another
another time. Okay. Yeah. Then I guess I'll let everybody else know. I I will be voting for and I will be voting for continuence and I guess so. Yes. Respectfully request that the board authorize that to afford us the opportunity to do what I've discussed. Absolutely.
And I hope you will do that. Thank you very much. The floor is open. Whoever would like to be heard on this matter, please step forward. So just uh for the ground people to remember the ground rules from last time. Okay. Uh courtesy courtesy courtesy
respect for respect for everyone. Hi my name is Tom Sento. I live at 50 Fields Drive. I'd just like to add something to the discussion about the reconfiguration the rotary. What? There there's there's no plan to
redo the Rotary as of now. I understand. Okay. I understand that. I was at that meeting on Tuesday. Okay. Just like to add some additional comment. Yeah. That um the trail the trucks negotiating the rotary
would potentially not be a problem. But what was not addressed was the movement of the trucks on the reconfigurated streets in particular shake the dog laid from
Shaker Road to Naple because it looked to me as though there was not enough turner radius nor was there enough space for those for that traffic. Yep. So, thank you.
Thank you, Ann Kelner, 47 Fields Drive. I just had a couple questions. The um traffic study seems to always be from Chestnut onto Shaker and nothing coming from Benton Road onto Chestnut. And like Mr. Terrell
said, um we've seen trucks that can't make that turn. And there doesn't seem to be a lot of giving way that they could expand that issue. My other question is is no one seems to be talking about the commuter traffic that was going for people that are going to
be working there. If they have 380 or whatever it is parking spaces, people are going to be coming down Chestnut. And right now it's sometimes it's very difficult from people from Holly Drive, Marshall Street, as well as the fields to come on to make a turn on to
Chestnut. If we're going to be adding even if we say 200 people a day, two or three times a day, is there going to be some other provision made stop lightss there or how can we afford that? And it doesn't seem to be anybody's addressing
the commuter traffic. I mean the truck traffic is certainly something we need to do, but I was also wondering about the commuter traffic. Thank you. Thank you. Y John Power 17 Broadleaf. So it was discussed at length about reconfiguring the intersection of
Chestnut and Shaker Road. It was asked and I don't believe it was fully answered about the intersection of Chestnut Street and Benton Drive, Dwight Road. Mhm. My question is, has a study been done to
look at turning radiuses there? Because I have seen instances myself where in order for a truck building 67 coming from Long Meadow, Converse Street, make a
left turn onto Chestnut Street, have to make it from the right travel lane, not from the left turn lane. So, I'm just thinking that there's more mitigation that potentially needs to be done and I don't know if it's been looked at.
That's the only point I wanted to make. Thank you. Hi, I'm Jack Warren. I'm at 13 Fields Drive. I'm the current president of the board of trustees for the Fields. Um, I have made numerous trips from Boston to
the fields for personal reasons. And every time I plug in my trip home, it takes me down Route 84 through Stafford Springs and up 83 to make that right turn, left turn onto Chestnut.
And there's no way any tractor trailer can make that turn safely. Yes, we studied Shaker and Chestnut very carefully. As mentioned, we haven't studied Benton and Chestnut. We haven't studied the effects on Chestnut Street going all the way up to 83. We have a
very bad intersection at Chestnut and Prospect. No, nobody talked about that. The traffic studies are incomplete. We have to have all the intersections. They're going to be affected, looked at,
and evaluated. Anything less than that, we're going to see a large number of accidents. And we know a tractor trailer versus a vehicle, the car vehic the passenger vehicle is going to be a mess. We're going to see
increased insurance rates for auto and property damage. So, I think we have to consider how this is going to affect the lives of every resident of East Long Meadow. is going to have a negative effect for
everybody. Thank you. So, I'm going to ask both traffic engineers, what were the accident counts for Shaker and Chestnut? I think that one's best answered by Mr. Adams. Um,
okay. Copy of his traffic report with me, but we can get the answer. We'll get it right now for you. And here's a really difficult thing. I I believe Mr. Misha mentioned, you don't really know where the traffic's going to
go when it leaves the property. You don't know how much traffic there's going to be on any given day. There could be very little, could be a lot. And so these are estimates based upon professional standards that they rely on.
So you're asking about adjustment. Yeah. the number of crashes. So, and if you have it at Benton that too summers and chest summers and chest Yeah. So, Shaker and Chestnut. So, we're looking at the most recent 5 years of available mass DOT data, which is 2017
to 2021. Just for framework, uh in those five years, there were 26 reported crashes at that signalized intersection. Uh that results in a crash rate of 0.62 crashes per million entering vehicles. I know that's a lot of words, but essentially it's the way that we can
determine how that intersection rates compare to other intersections in the state of Massachusetts. Um, and does that break down car on car, car on truck? Uh, we don't have that level of detail.
Um, but but overall the 0.62 is is lower than the Mass statewide average of 0.78 crashes or the Mass District 2. out out here specific to this area of 0.89 essentially indicating the crash rate at
that signalized intersection is lower than an average signalized intersection. And do you have any other major intersections in like within a mile of that site? Uh so we we did look at it and if you wanted me to talk about she
hasn't a bad wife Benon uh just as that that has come up in that same 5year period there were 16 crashes reported which results in a crash rate of 0.48 lower than Shaker and Chestnut and again
lower than both the Mast state average as well as the Mast District 2 average. Mr. Misha, anything you want to add? I I would say the only location that they've documented in their traffic report that has an above average crash rate, Dwight, Maple, and William Street
intersection. Um, that has uh a crash rate that isly higher than average. Um, so I I I think um clearly there are going to be locations that, you know, could probably um need a looking at
candidates at safety counter measures. Yeah, I think the the types of impro improvements that are being suggested for at least the nearest major intersection are appropriate and and to some degree might actually address some of those crash statistics.
Thank you. Excuse me. So, how do you figure in an inch and an hour snow and a tractor trailer coming down Chestnut Hill to the intersection of Shaker and Chestnut? And how do you figure traffic flow when a tractor trailer is trying to go up Chestnut
Street to get back to 84 trying to make a right-hand turn on onto Summers Road and go south on Summers Road? I mean, it's a nightmare. Like the cars get stuck on the hill. So, how do you figure in what's going to happen when tractor trailers try to go up the hill? I understand. I you know, I don't have an
answer for that, frankly. Um the the roadway characteristics that you're mentioning are challenging for sure. roadway grades and snow or wet conditions are absolutely a factor. Um you know I think in the context of what
applicant has uh studied um you know those certainly considerations the the principal impact of the project um you know has been documented but for higher level of trip activity that
okay and so I think it's important that you point these out that can still be a consideration having owned and driven oil trucks I've come down Shaker. I'm going to come down Chester Street with my right hand tire and the right hand rear rear tire in the
snowbank to make sure I can stop. It's a nightmare. I'm sure it's these are the things I think of. Hi. Hi, Bill Raldi 18 lav. Uh I hear a lot of talk about the site design and traffic patterns and such, but nobody's
mentioned the positives of bringing jobs to the town, bring an increase of tax revenue to our town, which we desperately need. Uh taxes in our town have gone are going to be going up after the school uh override kicks in. And I think this is a perfect opportunity to
introduce a new tax flow to our town to help lessen that impact on citizens. you. My name is Roland Baldo, 110 Smith Avenue. Uh, when you're talking about the snowbank
of going down Chestnut, the vehicle you were driving doesn't articulate. It doesn't bend. Imagine penhe and also you're talking about using the right of way coming from chestnut to
shake a road. From what I understand, I'm not a town engineer. And the right of ways are usually used for gas lines, plumbing, sewers, many other things. That's why they save that space on the
roadways is my view on uh if you use every inch of that right of way, what is left for right of way? that person's porch and when a driver makes a mistake and
goes up on the curb how close I don't know the distance it's 25 ft to of where your structure can be are we going to use of that to this person's front porch so when their kids come out of the house
I mean it to me it's absurd to use that amount why don't you say 12 use that closer to that house. Uh I'm wondering what the feasibility of that is using that right away before their
lawyers get involved with the town as well. Uh the other thing was u coming in from the other directions coming in. I did do a little bit of homework on this. I did use
Google Maps. Everybody uses it. Works very well. And that's a lot of what the GPS uses. There's also another system called ways and ways a lot of people are priced enough that they purchased it years ago. They're using that as well.
Uh so no matter what you're using, Google is involved. So I used Google and I looked at Boston. I looked from Northampton because we're coming in from the north and I looked from Hartford and most of your traffic is coming in 84
to 190 to 83 and then you're going to turn on to Chestnut where the church is. And everybody here has missed a turn on their GPS. Everybody here, if you follow
GPS, get distracted, whatever it might be, and you go by your turn, the next way in is the Rotary. And as far as a traffic study, well, let's go back to coming in from the
north. You're going to come through Long Meadow. Long Meadow a couple years ago wanted the traffic studies because they wanted to see what was going to happen with that influx of vehicles coming through their town. So, I'm just saying
be prepared to hear from Long, I would imagine, when all these vehicles start coming through their town and coming from Benton on to Chestnut. And coming up from the south, you're going to come up Shaker Road. Everybody's going to come in exit 48 off
of 91 and run through that congested area and up Shaker Road. Now, that's not our concern. That's Connecticut. Well, they're going to come up and try to make the turn from that left lane. And when they go to make the turn, you basically
have to rub the curb, if not go up on it where the gas station is on Chestnut Street, so you don't invade the left turning lane coming from Chestnut to turn left onto that Shaker Road. If a
car overshoots that white line, you now have a problem. I run across this problem daily as a professional driver. Uh the cars don't pay attention to the white line. So that's a scenario where you're almost on
the curb to make the turn and that's using the white lines. Uh so a lot of traffic is going to come in from Benton. I would have guessed most of it's going to be Benton. Most of it's going to be Shaker Road. Like I said, the drivers that come in from Boston are uh across
190, and that's the way the GPS tells them to come in. Uh, as far as your engineer or the person that talked about putting sidewalks around the rotary, the one thing I do understand is the
blind spots of a tractor trailer. I participate in a federal program called Share the Road and that is showing students how to drive around large vehicles, showing them where the blind
spots are. And the blind spots are right behind you. So your mirror can see everything alongside you, but right alongside you, it's very hard to see. It takes 3/4 of a second to
focus on the mirror on the driver's side. Takes twice as long to focus on the mirror on the right side. The right side has a larger black. We can park police cars around the tractor trailer, turn on the lights, get and a student
gets in the driver's seat, can see the lights, but can't see the cars. So, it's something that a professional driver has to get used to. And it's something that we rely on is looking at our round mirrors, which takes even longer to focus on. So that said, when
you're dealing with such large blind spots, we try to stay away from pedestrians the best we can. We try to stay best we can. We try to stay away from automobiles the best we can. Now 78% of
all tractor trailer large vehicle accidents are caused by automobiles. Now you want to interject 300 wheels, tractor trailers coming in and out of the facility. So your accident rate will
go up. I'll guarantee your accident rate right now is higher than that study from 2017 2021. Remember, we were in a pandemic and vehicle miles traveled from 2015 to
2020 dropped 4%. From over 3 trillion to 2.8 trillion. So, it dropped considerably nationally. So with those numbers, they're skewed because of the pandemic. Less people
were on the roads and you still had that many accidents. So we need updated numbers on the accident rates as well. So thank you. Oh, one more thing. When you involve tractor trailers and kids on bikes,
somebody said kids on bikes. I have a nightmare that sits in my head day in day out as I drive that something that happened in the 90s. Uh I was not involved whatsoever. All I know is I heard of it on Prospect Street
in East Harford, Connecticut. A child was riding school was a grammar school not far and he was riding his bicycle and it was garbage day. His pedal hit the garbage and it threw him underneath the tires of a trailer. Driver never
knew what happened. He got stopped and the child died. And it's a horrible horrible thing. So, and driver had no had, you know, nothing you could do about it. That road
is now shut down through tractor trailers. How long before Chestnut Street, God forbid, has any accidents and before the residents say curfew and all of your tractor trailer drivers that are coming in with the large vehicles,
the sleeper units, the this the 67 units that they they were talking about WD67. Uh those vehicles usually travel at night and the other vehicles that come in that are the 62s or 48footers that's
the LTL business. It's less trailer load business. Uh the trucking companies went out of business is yellow freight. Well, they come in and give you your stuff day in day out, but at night the other vehicles travel. So there's going to be an influx of vehicles constantly 24
hours a day. Thank you. Anyone else like to be heard on this matter? Good evening. I'm Jerry Cleti. I live at 385 Chestnut Street. I've talked to the uh board before in public. So, I just want to I got a few questions and
comments. Um will the traffic study being done by Mr. Pill's traffic guy be posted on the website? Yes, it's already um all the documents that are mentioned today are already on the website were posted before this meeting
post like the third or fourth, right? Uh usually I do it that Friday before the meeting. That's the third m you want to up. That's okay. Right here. Um, as far as the traffic
study that Bowman did, um, projected out for 2035, all you did was put percentages against the tractor, um, against the heavy truck traffic. Why didn't you project out numbers instead? Because you're going against a
very small number of trips. So, that's a question I have. Goes back to what the chair said. What's the actual numbers be generated by this warehouse? Because you're also projecting the number of uh passenger
parking spaces and truck spaces because it's going to be a warehouse. If it wasn't, you wouldn't be required to have as many um on the site. Also, between the buildings, what would stop them to connect that?
They'd have to come back in for a site plan review for a revision. Can't just do it. Just can't do it. Yeah. And um that's all I have right now. I'm assuming you're going to do a continuence. Yeah. So, we'll ask them to put corresponding numbers on those
percentages with your final draft or final report. Thank you. And again, if you're cutting in 120 plus doors and you have 19 130 something cues for trailers, as a former uh processing processing and
distribution manager, uh an electics manager, you're going to use them. So, if there's 120 cues, you're probably going to turn those over if you're uh moving a lot of product. So, have a great day.
Thank you. You Hi Tomo, 50 Fields Drive. I have question about the retaining wall. Um, how close is that retaining wall to the to the trail itself?
uh through the chair if you want to ask or get to the next question too. I'm taking a second get that information. Okay. Yeah. And and um my next question is going to be um what will happen to the trees between
the wall and the trail especially when you have to excavate to put a foundation in for that retaining wall. Um, same same person's gonna answer that question. Yes.
uh to the chair. Health uh sheet 1.03 vision sheet is the sheet that reflects the layout. Um specific to that, um thank you.
Specific to that, we have a 30 foot 17 feet from the edge of the building. 17.5 ft. We have a 30 foot wide drive aisle approximately 3 ft hanging wall off that drive aisle. Another 2 and 1/2 ft. Um
then we have about six feet. Um which brings us to property line. um few feet off of that just about 8 ft or so. And then the trail varies in location within the old rail rightway.
Um depending on where we are, it's another uh 10 plus feet from the edge of the uh the edge of the rail right away. No, you say
in the area of the retaining wall, the retaining wall to the trail. Again, the trail at that location is justified kind of to the um project side. Um but it's approximately 20 some odd feet.
And just uh just my personal opinion about the condition of the rail trail. It would be nice if all the businesses put up improved along the rail trail. I think everybody here can agree with that. Yeah.
And um I I was more concerned about trees rail trail. So the so in the plans there is a landscaping plan component component on all of that.
That is correct. We've also um we looked at that closely recently and updated one of our notes to to basically address any sort of clearing that needs to happen um specific to the edge of the rail trail. Um, we want to leave mature vegetation
where we can, but we're certainly committed to supplementing as necessary along that entire. All right. So, you would potentially add some trees in there because once you dig the foundation for that retaining wall, you're going to be absolutely
5t further out. Absolutely, sir. Thank you. rather talking about um the uh theoretical tax increase that we would see from that development.
I've done some research looking at a comparison between ASM that building ASM being across the street and Kamunda. Kamundday is about two and a half times larger has a 40% greater footprint.
Their tax rate is or their the taxes they pay is about 20 about um the the value of their building is about 21 million. this building. If you were to look at
other land use code 400 warehouses in the area on Industrial Drive and on Shaker, I think what you find is that the valuation of the buildings are about $25
per square foot, which would make this development worth about $10 million. If you were to com look at the $10 million and how that would impact the
average single home in town, which has a value of $390,000, that would equate to about $6.25 per quarter on the tax bill.
Now, anybody can go back and look at these things, but the tax benefit is not as great as what people think it is. And I would suggest that people do that. Thank you.
Thank you. Hold up. 110 Smith, just want to say one thing. I will never sell out for safety. Safety above all. So whatever the taxes are, whatever the benefit is, I can't give up on safety
burger 11 circle. Excuse me. I just wanted to respond to the gentleman who who talked about the benefits to the town and I don't necessarily disagree with you. Make it clear we at the fields are not trying to block development of that property. We love to see that
property developed. We are just as bold accept your concern about safety and one fatality would way override any benefit the town receives. Please don't think that we're trying to block it. We'd love to work with the developers. Um they tell us they have no no tenants, but
this is what they want. Well, it doesn't sound safe, particularly if you look at the worst case scenario. So that's that's what we are. But we'd love to see something. My name is Ruth O'Hayen, 23 Fields Drive. I just moved to the fields. Uh my
major concern, one of my major concern is is the increase in enormous increase in air pollution and how will that be mitigated? Has anybody addressed that issue? I hope they have and the deteriorating qual air quality that will ensue from so much traffic and what
about the the increase in noise as well. So that's that's very important to me. And has it been addressed? I I it has. and how will this so that is something that this board can place conditions on the development and
the prior project we spent a considerable amount of time addressing that issue and I would imagine that we're also going to do that at the continued hearing where we will do our very best to put conditions to mitigate those type of things.
So what and the noise level as well we will do our very best. So you know just you know our other thought here and we have said over and over and over and over again we don't make decisions on
whether the whether someone is going to sue the town or not. We don't do that. We try to make decisions on what is in the best interest of the town development wise. So you know we we do
that. We are lay people. We rely on town experts and you know there are individuals who have degrees in public health and other things and they believe that it is a detriment to you know the quality of life and to them personally.
There are other avenues that they can pursue like through the board of health and you know those type of uh entities. But I just want everyone to know we do not vote on whether you know we the developer is going to sue us. It doesn't
bother us when we make decisions. We've been I personally have been on this board eight years. I've been sued seven times. And I just want to make a valid point for anyone who's thinking, "Well, we're going to sue you if you vote for this." You don't sue Russell Denver
individually or Bill Fana individually. You sue us as members of the town of East Long Meadow Planning Board. So, you know that that's who you do. You end up suing the town. The town ends up
defending our decision, our vote one way or the other. And the town can spend 100,000, 200,000, 300,000. I mean, whatever they feel is appropriate. So, I just want to get that out out on the table on who who indeed you are suing because someone did come up to me in the
big Y last week and say, "If you vote for this, I'm going to sue you." And I go, "Oh, have at it. Feel free to do it. you know, be my guest. You won't be the first and you won't be the last. So, but yes, we will try to do our very best. Quality of life is very, very important.
Yep. Think of that. Paris Oxner near 40 Fields Drive. I just have a question. Um, what is the difference from this proposal from the last proposal? I am glad you asked. I wish Mary Hurley were here this evening.
So, the last project, and let's kind of do a quick recap for everybody in the audience. The last project that we're not acting on because it's a different project, was 565,000 square feet, one building, and every single speaker came up and
said, "It's Amazon. It's Amazon. It's Amazon. It's Amazon." And it was never Amazon. Period. This project is four separate buildings totaling 465,000
square feet. Math majors and I'm not good at math. That's about a 17.5% decrease in the amount of square footage. That's a lot. If you're making $1,000 a
week on pay and someone only pays you $825 instead of a,000, that's a difference between 17 and a half%. So, is Amazon going to move into one of the buildings that has 90,000 square feet? No.
Look at the other Amazon projects in our region. You go down the Bradley airport, there's about a 2 and a half million square feet building as you're going down that roadway. There's a Amazon building up by Hoyoke Mall that's well
over a million square feet. So if anyone is out there saying it's Amazon, Amazon, Amazon, think again. Yeah, but couldn't they still utilize those four buildings the same way and not be Amazon? So, we went through this whole thing with all the trucks. Nothing
has really changed. So, you know, I just I'm not understand. Is it is it It's difficult for this board and difficult for all of you to not know exactly who the tenant is, but the potential is the same. Here's the potential for different buildings.
The potential is right behind you. Allowable uses. There they are. Allowable uses with a special permit. There they are. What cannot go in there? Period. And to go way back.
So I think Pete and Cassie and I were on the planning board way back when there was a proposal that this board approved to put in a special overlay district which would have allowed allowed housing to go on there.
We went back and forth with the developer for over a year. Came up with a plan. They went to the town council. They they changed it considerably. But still was the ability to put housing. COVID comes, they don't want to do
housing. That's their right. They own the property. So if it's one of those uses and we have to look at things like traffic and sewer and you know th those type of things, you know, it's it's hard it's hard not
knowing who it is, but they're under absolutely no obligation whatsoever to tell us who the tenant is going to be. And have we done that in other locations in town? Yes, we have. We put up proposed medical buildings. didn't know who was going to go in there, but it had
to be a medical use. They're telling you it's going to be a warehouse use. It's allowed as a matter of right. So, you really have to think of the the most that they would use it. So we have to try to think we have to try to think
what can this board do to mitigate issues associated with potential uses on that site right or say no that's why with the traffic you have to think that they're going to utilize all
four and you know I I am sure the developer wants to utilize all four they want to get paid and I'm sure They do. So that's why you have to think of the traffic with all those units being and and the last time there was a
condition and please correct me if I'm uh incorrect, but we were going to require them to come back to this planning board whenever they were going to put in a new tenant so we could reook at all these issues, right? And that may be one condition that we put on
next time. the the woman who talked about air pollution. One of the conditions that we had put on last time was, you know, doing something and Mr. Bould says it doesn't work, but you know, we can disagree. Um, but it's it's our ability to do something like that to
try to mitigate. All I'm saying is tra we still had the same issue with the trucks the last time. Well, and it's the same thing. So, would you would you think and regardless of Mr. pill now using a
different phrase for the type of warehouse that it's going to be. Okay. Would you use the general assumption that if you reduce the amount of square footage, there's potentially less
vehicles that will use that site? Not a guarantee, but potentially. So, but I'm not going to debate it. I Yeah, we can't debate it. Well, I tried to answer your question. Thanks. Yeah. So we're
sir standing in back or are you going to Okay. So are we we're going to continue it. So there are some takeaways that both Mr. Pill, Mr. Misho, the petitioner would you please address
with our planning director so that we can get everything together. I I would suggest that we vote to continue to we can't do our next meeting. So, it would be the first Tuesday in November, which I believe is November 4th.
Yes. But you also have uh Pioneer Valley coming to that meeting as well. So, you've also pushed them off for two months in a row. Um so, I don't know. So, let's do let's try to do November 4th at 6:30.
6:30. And uh please there there obviously have been upgraded materials, updated materials. Go on to the town website. These are you know all of that material is there. Um it's there
for all of you to be able to review it and see it and try to understand it. So I thoroughly encourage you to do that. And folks who want to find that information, just go on to the town of East Law Meadow web page, east lawm.gov,
and look for the planning board specific page. Look for it says active case files. Click on that. It'll take you to all the active permits for the planning department, planning board, zoning board, everybody. And if folks have trouble finding that, you can always reach out to my office. My name is Rob
Willa, director of planning, community development. You can stop by, give us a call. Be willing to help you out. That's what Rob said. So, the first Tuesday in November is November 4th, correct? Okay. And we will try to do our very
best to not get kicked out by the dancing group and have it back at the senior center, but certainly go on on the site to make sure that we're location for it to be here for now. Uh, but we will definitely post the location a week before the meeting on the town
website, folks, so nobody gets lost. Uh, Mr. Obec has his hand up. respectfully chair just wanted to make sure that wasn't it. I don't think we have a we don't have any state elections so it impacts other states but not ours. Yes.
Yeah. So um do I have a motion to continue the public hearing until Tuesday, November 4th at 6:30? So moved. Do I have a second? Second. Any discussion?
Hearing none. All in favor say I. I. Anyone oppose? Nay. Hearing none. That item passes. Thank you all. Thank you. I have a vote to bring it back into open second. Oh, second. All in favor say I. I.
Just confirm the broken by seconded by P for the minutes. Thank you. Sorry. Yeah. That done. Yeah. Okay. Let's get this over with. Okay,
spotlight. All right. Uh, let's see. Quickly because I have to get on to um I put your next five meeting dates to guess the end of the year. We still have to approve the meeting dates for 2026. So, if you guys want to get these down on your calendar as of right now, you do
have two public hearings coming on the 21st listed right there. The first is for a combined site plan view special permit for the altering and enlarging of a non-conforming structure adding additional 1500 ft to a commercial building.
That's what's on my leg. Proposing a warehouse at Shaker Road 18 Shaker Road. And the other public hearing on the 21st is for site planner view to construct a 5700 square foot commercial office building
at 95 Shaker Road. I love that project. Um, as we mentioned, Ken Kia from Pioneer Valley is going to be attending the first part of the meeting on November 4th to discuss the housing production plan with the board. Um, some ongoing projects. So, we are
still working on the mixeduse bylaw. We do have a final draft. I'll be coming to the town council very shortly. Uh, we're still trying to decide which meeting to bring that to them. Uh, and then the traffic and pedestrian report. I've actually started working on this after pushing off for three months. Uh just
want a quick blurb. So the Jeff Spec thing did happen on September 30th. Uh Mr. Chair said he liked the results of that. I thought it was very fascinating. He did a really good job presenting. He's actually given us that liver bowl that he presented to keep use for our
rotary feasibility study when we go out and advertise for this. There you go. Uh but other than that, that's all I have, Mr. Chair. Thank you for your time. Right. Any other business in front of us hearing? Done. Motion to adjurnn. Second.
Any discussion hearing? None. All in favor say I. I. I.