Okay, I'm going to call the July 15, 2025 meeting of the EAN Metal Planning Board to order. Uh, I need to ask if there's anyone in the audience who might be recording this meeting. If so, please state your name. Sharon Hayan in Publishing. Thank you. If there is anyone else,
please state your name. Okay, so the first order of business uh is the call of order. I am Russell Denver Cassandra Cherro Rob Trell Pete Robill planning director and Pete Punderson our planning board member is is uh on Zoom. So first order
is the approval of the meeting minutes of July 1st 2025. Do I have a motion to approve? So moved. Second. Any discussion hearing? None. All in favor say I. Anyone opposed? Abstain. Extensions. Okay. First order business.
Mr. Clerk. Yeah. Case site 2000-2025-02. Request for site plan approval to construct a 4,837 square foot agricultural commercial building with 81 parking spaces at 896 Summers Road. Assessor's parcel ID
95-34-0 located in the residents a zoning district. Applicant we are farm LLC 896 Summers Road East Mass 01028 continued from July 1st 2025. So I just have a motion to uh reopen the continued hearing.
So move second. Any discussion? Hearing none. All in favor say I. I. I. Like to turn it over to our planning director just to kind of reset us to where we are. Rob. Sure. So um this hearing was continued from July 1st, 2025. The applicant is
here for site plan review to construct a 4,000ish square foot building uh in the residence a zoning district on a property that's on the state line and a butts in the town of Hampton. The applicant is proposing an extension of the existing agricultural use on the
property um which it might include on-site events proposing about 61 parking spaces and access driveway along the side and rear of the building. Um, so far we've received a few new materials since the last hearing,
including an updated traffic management plan. Uh, update site plans which show the uh suggested edits from the plane board, including the screening and then the apple orchard around the back and um other materials I'm going to let the
applicant bring up during their presentation today. But that's pretty much where we're at so far, Mr. Chair. Okay. So, just the issue on the use of the property if it's determined to be agricultural. Can you just reference who will make that decision? Go ahead. The building commissioner will make the
determination on the applicability of the use on the site. Uh if it's an exempted use under master loss chapter 48 section 3, the do amendment. Um that is not up for discussion at tonight's meeting. The point of tonight's hearing is to determine the applicability of the
building, the site layout, traffic, and storm water if applicable. So Mr. Stratton. You again. My name is D Stratton. I'm an attorney with Fitzgerald Law PC with an address here at 46 Center Square in
Nissan Meadow. I represent We Are a Farm LLC. I was here at the last meeting and I I would just like to um follow up on Rob's comments um kind of setting where we left off. Um, uh, Rob provided some
very helpful feedback to us in terms of the open issues, um, after last meeting and so let me just walk through those open issues and the order in which we're going to address them. So um, one of the requests was for more information on trash pickup. Um, the second item was
the apiary situation. Um, apiary being for bees, not birds. um traffic information with respect to the traffic management plan uh and then um the buffer line of sight situation involving screening of a butters and then more
detail on the plantings. I'll address the first three and then I'm going to ask um Rob Lec uh who's also on the developers team to address the fourth and fifth item the screening and plantings. So with respect to the uh
trash pickup um uh and this information was shared with the planning department recently and we discussed a few of them. Uh trash pickup will be coordinated and contracted with a private waste management company. As part of that coordination, the applicant will ensure
trash pickup occurs on a consistent schedule around ordinary traffic patterns. Trash collection will not be in the morning or late in the evening and will occur during the week and not on weekends. Um with respect to the apiary situation.
Um, so one of the things that we learned between the last meeting and this meeting was that our site plan wasn't completely accurate and we updated it. The apiary is actually located in the town of Hampton. um it's not in the town
of Van Meadow and therefore with all due respect not subject to the uh planning board's purview uh in this meeting and to the extent that there are issues with uh the apiary um that would be an appropriate um issue for review in the
town of Hampton. Um, with respect to the traffic situation, there were questions with respect to the traffic management plan, uh, that came up at the meeting and there were some follow-up questions um, from Mr. Ratillaa. I'm sorry, am I your last name
can Watchilla? Okay, I think I get it right sometimes and incorrect on this. Uh, Mr. Roilla, um, we hopefully, uh, my colleague Rachel had had a discussion. We went over some of the um changes and
revisions to the traffic management plan which were intended to address those comments. Um I think one key item that we wanted to highlight and we added a a specific note to the plan was to clarify
the reference to building occupancy how it triggers this plan. So, um, and I think there was some confusion and perhaps on us for not explaining in the best way, but basically what we're saying is there's going under the the traffic plan contemplates
use use where there's significant planned events where there's going to be heightened occupancy and then unexpected heightened occupancy. And the occupancy that we're using, we're using the building occupancy as a measure to determine when the parking lot will be
at capacity because the parking lot is designed to accommodate the occupancy of the building. So at this property, it's possible that there will be many people outside, not inside. So, we're saying we're playing an event on the property
that exceeds the building occupancy, then that would be deemed a significant event where we need to plan for it because it's very possible that the parking lot would be at capacity. Um, we are in in we never expect to exceed the
building occupancy because the building occupancy is the building occupancy and we and we can't exceed that. So, um, we're using that building occupancy metric as the best metric that we can come up with to determine when there
would be, um, a crowd and possible traffic impact where we need to do some additional planning beyond ordinary course use. And so hopefully we've clarified that better in the traffic management plan. Um,
and I guess maybe I'll stop there on those three items and ask if there's any questions before I turn it over to Mr. LC to address the screening and the planting. So, curious um, and maybe in here. What's the building occupancy? Do you expect that to be?
The building occupancy is 176. There's You said 61. There's 81 per post. How many parking spots are there? 61. I believe there's a Yeah, it said 81 time. It is 61. There's a typo, I believe, in
that most recent version, but so quick math. It's been a long day. Yep. So, that's two people per car. That's 120 people. What happens to the rest of the cars if you're at 170? Where do they go?
Well, um I believe that the Rob maybe you could address where the the calculation of the building occupancy numbers based on the road the site I believe it's more than two in short answer and I I mean right and I'm just thinking out like because I know there's
conversions that we may talk about but I'm unlike in our downtown district area pick a spot I mean there's overflow in our square right has overflow parking the rockets and things. This doesn't have that luxury, right? You're in a can't park in the road. We've already
discussed that. Can't park down any of the side roads. I just I guess my concern is where do they where the rest of the people go? If you do hit 170, even 150, two, three people a car, 60 times that is you're full up.
Yeah. So, so I've with respect to an if there's an event that we the reality is we we need a trigger for this plan, but there if there's an event that's going to approach building occupancy where we believe we won't have
sufficient parking, we'll have to plan for it and and communicate. In the ordinary course that building occupancy when the farm is normal operations you're never going to you know approach building occupancy on the building right and people are coming and going it would
be an event. So say there's an event a planned event for which we don't have any intention of right now but to exceed the building occupancy. say it's a 200 person event, we're likely going to follow the same planning process if there's a planned 160 person event
versus 200 to ensure that there is sufficient parking. There is overflow space on site, but we'd want to coordinate that um with the town and and maybe that's my answer is there's as you continue down that proposed parking spots, is there on
grass parking things? Correct. There's there's space that could be used for temporary parking in the event. I I don't think anybody's questioning the regular use. I think it's majority of this is what happens when that day comes and there's 169 people in there almost at capacity. And where do they
all go? Right. There's multiple cars, things like that. Right. Okay. I see the grass on the side. Would assume that's where that can I approach? Sure. Come on. name and address please. My name is Jason Fitz and my address is
112 Long View Drive, Long Metal, Massachusetts. So there is additional parking on the on the property. So there is a field as the parking planned parking ends. There is a park there's a field that we do own that we
can park in. um it's not part of our overall building occupancy, so it's not on our plan, but that would be our overflow parking location. So, we can handle more parking than capacity for the building allows. Um we just in our
plan, we're here to address what what our goal is and that's to get the building built and you know, um so we plan for parking for that. So, um but there is so it's not like if we meet our maximum we have no place to put cars. we do and you know and um so as uh Seth
said you know if we do have events where you know we'll be utilizing all of that that would be when we would reach out to um the police department fire department talk about what the you know land is for traffic flow how we move cars in and out um
and and hopefully uh you know we'll we'll meet with them beforehand we'll have an event and then we'll meet with a master hand and and discuss you know how we handled it and if everything went you know, and then if um if they require a policeman or something on hand, then then we'll obviously abide by that.
And and again, the use we had to come up with some objective standard to it can't we couldn't say, well, when it feels like it's it's going to be too crowded, right? we had to use some standard and we felt that the building capacity which you know was what drives the parking lot
was the best objective metric to rely on to um make that determination. Uh so there was some consideration about moving the building closer toward the uh the pond. So how do we do on that?
Um the access road to service the building. Yeah, sure. So, it we actually have an overall plan as part of our plans which is uh drawing C3. And if you look at that drawing, you'll see that our building really sits in the backyard of
the original building. Um so there's a house, there was um two green houses set back and a barn on the side. If you look at the building, it literally sits in the backyard of those areas. So, we are in the general location of the of the
old building and that's kind of like always the plan. So, you didn't answer the question. The question was there were some concerns raised about how close the building is to the lot line on Anley Road. There was we asked you whether it was possible or
not to move that building further to the pond. It's either a yes or a no. If it's a yes, how much did you move? So, Russ, we did not. One or the other. want to take it. I can answer that. M. Um, so the building did not generally move. The the building footprint
changed. Um, as is in your packet there is a slightly different barn product that they're proposing while the Big Ben. Um, it's it's approximately the same square footage fits right in the same building book. Um to our point last
time, um there is a significant amount of um work that will be done to accommodate the building grading. What ends up happening and we looked at this very specifically in our design meetings with the with the team when you were if you were to shift the building to this
um you know kind of to the we'll call it to the east. What ends up happening is there's a drop off there. are pretty familiar this and we can I can show you on my contour on the plans showing the contours but essentially what happens there's about 10 foot rate change. So if you push the building over what happens
is you're pushing the barn and the the foundation and the slab for for the barn itself out over that slope which requires additional fill um from a geoteched fill. It also requires us to push the grading towards the wetland. Um, since
the last public hearing, we did secure a determination of of applicability from the conservation commission really good to us and we were able to work out some details on kind of restoring the area around the pond. Um, with that in that regard, one of the requirements was that we stay out of the the 100 foot buffer.
So, that was also coupled with the need to move the building over the 10- foot hill. That was our concern. Okay. Oh, I can if it's okay to keep going. Sure. I'd like to see the uh the first house on Aninsley. There were
some concerns. Are you going to show us what it's going to look like now? Yeah. Okay. Can I um interrupt one point real quick? So, um just legally speaking from the zoning bylaw, as long as that building meets the required minimum setbacks, we can't make them push any further,
but we can require screening, further screening. Y just want to make that perfect. Thank you. you can consider uh in and for the for the planning board's reference hopefully have a a smaller sheet that you can look at a little bit difficult I apologize to the folks in the audience will actually get over here um so
overlay as mentioned we wanted to plans sometime plan view is a little difficult related not taken yesterday but generally so um question about access points if you remember Previously, we had an
L-shaped building here. So, we've updated that for the Big Bend. Um, we've also taken the exit that was a little bit closer to the neighbors and we pulled it away. We wanted to and it requires a little bit of an S-curve for these folks, but we're because we had to
keep the building where we were, we at least wanted to try to accommodate the concerns of the neighbors. So, we pulled that curb cut. So, they won't be over here anymore. Now, they're let's say it's 80 or so feet away from where it was proposed. Right. Okay. So it's 80 it's 80 feet further away. Yes. Okay.
So that and that and that is a very minor curb cut just for service access only. Okay. Uh in addition um the screening that we talked about last time we were contemplating what to do along the property lines, what to do around the building. And as we got to talking about
it, I sent Mike from my office out to locate some additional trees as required so that we could accurately depict, especially after some work has been done out there, accurately depict what's out there. So the trees that you see and I'll go back to the I'll go to the color
plan for a second. So we highlighted in in green basically the new stuff. I didn't I kind of tried to just focus on what we're talking about. So um other than these trees here which exist. So there those are the that's the orchard that's remaining, right? So it's just one really one row. There are trees off
property but those are generally on the neighboring property. So we didn't show them. But what we did do is locate back in this corner here. There's a bunch of existing mixed deciduous vegetation. So trees, there's some shrubby stuff, but there are there are there is a canopy
that exists back here. U we also located the approximately 60 arborites that I believe were talked about last time. They're new. Um there's probably three or four that need to be replaced as Mr. uh I think Mr. Paige had mentioned last time. Um also as part of what happened
with the conservation commission around the pond there will be some vegetation to be established as part of that. Um so this is kind of the existing vegetation um that had not been cleared. Um so this area coupled with what's existing for vegetation is what really is around the
perimeter. Uh as mentioned this well in this year like I believe it will be pumpkins but it is pumpkins already. Um so as as next year the plan is to then plant an orchard and that will be kind of a linear um north to south running
orchard similar to what you see in you know you know state-of-the-art uh facilities or or farms. Um so that all will also act as a pretty good buffer from the neighbors. So our thought was you know looking into an orchard is in in our mind is pretty nice. So, we really wanted to make sure we were
protecting the neighbors from the use and the int, you know, call it the back of house or the more intensive areas. So, what we did on this access road, um, we added a six-foot stockade fence that would, so we had a dumpster enclosure already. We're already planting arbor
vites around that. Um, so we have arborites that we were including and then we would have a stockade fence around all the way around all the way up to here at that corner. So basically any sort of service related access or any
activity will be screened from the neighbors rather than put it on the property line vegetation would be very difficult because of the canopy from the neighbor because of the canopy. So we thought okay let's bring it into where it will really be effective because also as the neighbors can tell you it kind of
look down on the property. So we wanted it to be kind of as close to that you know we have a little grade change here. The idea was to screen that. We also added a row to bring it a little bit farther out and we thought it was a little softer towards the street rather than have a fence that came out towards the street. We have a row of arborites.
We also have the plantings that we were already proposing. So those trees will you know help fill in and there will be landscaping around the building. So there's basically a screen of the entire facility um you know the we'll call it the barn proper um from you know from
this point to this point. Um and then the orchard and then the existing orchard will stay. Um and then we have some natural vegetation here. This area I believe is already planted with corn. Correct. Correct. So this is an act field here. This is an act field for this season, but we'll
transition into um uh orchard. I'll stop there for a second. See if you have any questions. Answered my questions. We do have Sorry, sir. Rob, I one question. The um I maybe I don't remember this from the last. proposed favorite paper patio that now I
was facing towards Summers Road is was that there and what what is the intent that's back of house is that's the opposite of the back of house. So yeah. So, so interestingly enough, so the back of the house is kind of this side of the strat tutor. Um, so this isn't necessarily back of the house. So this is more like an entry and then you know
if you were picturing coming into you know whatever the you know you know the normal event right coming in this is kind of the main access point. We have handicap accessibility here walking kind of into the front. We would expect somebody would come through the front and then you know this opens out as kind
of a a you know an area patio area. So, this is really just an entry pack. Yeah. Um, I did uh there was some questions about when are we planting, what's going to look like. So, we did provide and for anybody who wants to know what's going to be planted, we provided the species
and just general showing the general habit of each of the species that are right being planted. Do you have a photo of the inside of the building? Because I don't see it included in our packets and I know it was on the dry. They don't know that I do post and beam in general, right?
Yeah. No, the the interior design looked like it was all Oh, good question. So, there was a clarification, I believe, um of Bill who had suggested that um the interior of the building as shown is not laid out yet. Um so, they're going to the barn structure that
they're going to be purchasing will be uh detailed by an architect. you know, service rooms, handicap accessibility, dress, all of those items will be worked out with with the um those those layouts were from the
company, the barn company stock layouts. And then to Mr. Will's point um about uh how we're going to handle a couple things. So the parfait area was there was concern about dust. Great concern. Good question. So there is a poly pave
additive. Um there's a couple different products out there on the market that are safe uh and that allow the aggregate when you have an aggregate parking lot to bind um so that we won't get a lot of hopping box so to speak and won't get dust that you would potentially be
concerned with. So the idea with additive to areas that any any sort of vehicular traffic are on um and then we can paint we can strike the gravel um compacted gravel. It's we've been pretty
successful in the past where they've done that. Um and in addition stencil the the the traffic arrow. So the question was what's the circulation pattern? It was kind of undefined because it was gravel. So um as long as we have that poly pave would prevent the
the hopping of rocks. Um, and then we could certainly strike uh as necessary. And you know, certainly the areas for the handicap will all be strike per 521 CMR, which is the Massachusetts uh code for um handicap accessibility. Um and
then parking, you know, we'll, you know, it'll be formal enough that there will, you know, we'll make sure there's no issues. Uh rather than have a ton of signs, we certainly would add any signs that were recommended or conditioned by your planner, but certainly, you know, we want to keep the farm field as much as possible.
So I just want Rob just to one more time let people in the audience know on the placement of the build of the building. So if they meet certain criteria that are in our zoning ordinance Yep. then it complies and this board is
unable to require them to change that. Yes. So uh Rob, could you remind me again what the um setback requirement is from the sideyard in that district? I think it's 15 ft. Um yes it appears to yeah so in in the
either before now or after the meeting um the this the plans that we put together in one of our sheets we have a layout planned and we uh wanted to make sure we built distances so you understood where the actual bar was
going. So from the um M Adam property um we the building corner at the nearest point is 142 feet away from the sideline. Set back again is is 50. Yep. So as long as they meet the 15t minimum, there's legally nothing the
plan board could do to push the building further away from the property line. They can only require compliance with the minimum distance that is laid out in the zoning bylaw for that district, which is the 15 from the side. I believe it's 50 from the rear and then 50 from the front which it seems the applicant is meeting but the plane board can
require further screening from Bunny Properties if they feel that it's not sufficient as presented by the applicant. Just for the board's information, we are 71 ft from the front um and from the rear property
um we are 227 feet just to give you some perspective. I just wanted to clarify one more point about and I'm glad it came up about the image in the interior. So, in case there's questions or concerns that stock um drawing from the bar the barn
manufacturer included what appeared to be a stage kitchen areas, those are not part of the plan. Those are stock um drawings from the barn manufacturer. So would you just kind of reiterate just
if case there are some new people. So um this is not going to be a winery or a brewery, correct? And that any alcoholic sale of alcoholic products would be a requirement for you to go to the town
council to get a one-day liquor license. Correct. Okay. And then the only on the other question if I steal it from you Cassie. Uh so it's going to be an operating farm as well. So where will the farm you know
the tractor and all that other stuff be on proposed to be? You're up top. Yeah. So uh so right now it's currently uh the tractor is either on site if it's not on site it's actually being housed across the street at at the the
neighbor's uh barn. So, um, we haven't built a, uh, facility for the tractor yet. At some point, we may, if that's necessary, but at this point, we're just trying to Okay. Now, we don't have a lot of equipment yet.
Okay. Thank you for being thorough in uh, our response. Appreciate it. Thank you. I want to take a step back. Uh, public hearing is open. Anyone like to be heard on this matter, please give your name and your address. Come on down.
We just ask folks to put your name on the sign sheet so we know who you are for the sake of taking minutes later after this meeting. I have to pull your full address, but at least your name. Lisa Adam, 7 drive. Um before decision
is rendered, I'd like us to be able to have some time to take a closer look at the screening that they're providing because 5 minutes ago is about the first time that I've gotten to see it. Okay. Well, I'll tell you what we'll do is after everyone has had their say, we
will recess this for 15 minutes. Ask Rob to bring that out into the into the other meeting room and we can then u do other business. Call back in 15 minutes and we'll go from there. Thank you. How that sounds? And if there's Why don't we uh we'll
also share these pictures of what the plantings are going to be. If you haven't seen the proposed traffic management, we will put that out there as well. Um, yeah. Okay, sir. Good evening.
My name is John Bernie, owner and operator of Metobrook Farm. Um, like to discuss a few different things here. one, it seems like we really got the cart in front of the horse on this project. Um, we're talking about a site
plan review and the whole thing bases on whether or not this qualifies under the do amendment. That's the crux of the whole matter. In reviewing the state law, chapter 40, section three, it clearly does not fall under that
jurisdiction. And so for a town official to say at the last meeting that it it's covered under the Dover amendment, uh, that's not accurate. And I think any attorney looking at this would tell you that that's a stretch. So the the Dover
amendment requires three basic things. One, the primary purpose has to be for agriculture, commercial agriculture. We can debate that all night long whether or not this property does. But two, and more importantly, the building
has to support that commercial agricultural purpose. And to to put up a 5,000 square foot building to say it's going to support agricultural purpose from a 9 acre parcel of land when you're going to encompass more than half of
that with the building and the parking is preposterous. We we sell out of about uh 20 by 400 square foot on our place, not 5,000 square foot.
So, let's let's unmask this thing. Call call it what it is. Go for the proper zoning. Um Dan Rulier from Warthingington Ponds uh can tell you exactly what happens when you approve something under this basis. They've been
under numerous lawsuits, cease and desist orders, everything. The best thing to do is to call call it what it is. Go for the proper zoning and get the proper approvals. And the third the third part of that do amendment is with
an income requirement. 25% of the income generated from the property during June, July, August, and September has to be generated on that farm. And attorney Stratton said in the previous meeting that one of the sources
of income and I believe the major sources of income are going to be from wedding venues, renting it out to business people, birthday parties. That's certainly under is not considered commercial agricultural income. So le
let's not kid anybody. Let's call it what it is and uh go for the proper zoning and get it get it approved properly. So, Mr. Bernie, thank you. A great deal of respect for what you do and thank you. Um, at the last meeting, we
indicated that this board does not make that decision, that it's up to the building inspector to make that decision on whether it complies with the law or not. But that's a huge Hold on, please. So, um, that is beyond our scope to make that determination.
If these gentlemen wish to spend all of this money doing all of that with the potential that they're going to be denied, that's their money. That's not my money. That's not your money. That's their money. They're going to go through all of this. And if it's you, if the
town decides, the town official decides it's not an appropriate use to, you know, to comply with the law, then you're right, it comes back to us for some other use. But I mean that's a whole lot of responsibility to put on one person. That that's the crux of the
whole project here. And let let's get it approved the proper way. Get it done under the proper zoning. So there's not any we're unmasking the thing. And let let's call it what it is. Okay. But is it is the individual's job to do this though. It says that in the zoning language. So
seems like a lot. What that is and then the next thing is you got to go to the zoning board of appeals. Correct. Correct. The decision is made. That's if that's if they appeal the decision up front and and get this all ironed out front. And I I think if you were to question Attorney Stratton, he would
tell you that this is a stretch as to whether or not this is covered under the do amendment. Okay, questions. Thank you. Thank you. Sure. You have a hand on the Zoom. It's up to you. Hi. Can you bring in Mr. Dellesio,
please? I'm here. Hi. How are you? The floor is yours. Great. Thank you. Uh over the past since the last meeting, I submitted a letter which is on file with you people and I'd like to address some of the concerns there with that letter. I don't know if
you plan on touching bases with it, but have you I'm sure you had the opportunity to preview it and take a good look at I just wonder what your thoughts are off the off top of that after looking at that letter. Well, do you have a specific issue you would like to ask us about or to
address? Sure. So, uh they threw a traffic study waiver in front of you along with a wave of uh um whatever the storm drain, but the traffic one uh stands out as an a, as I
stated in my letter, um their current traffic study that they're relying on to fall back guys to allow the weight does nothing does nothing to do with what um exits and entrances out of the business during a particular time of day. We've
talked about large events, unplanned, planned, etc. And my concerns are in that letter that the line of sight exiting or entering that parking lot furthest driveway south um could be a hazard as we don't know what the speed
of traffic on Route 83 is. And no traffic study has addressed that speed, but there is technology out there to address the speed. And I'm asking the town to either have the applicant address the speed there through a traffic study and the number of vehicles for their business hour or the town
themselves address the speed. As I mentioned coming out of Connecticut, it's posted 40 and leaving East Salado, it's posted 45. Um certainly as I said in my letter also again that those speeds are really not uh realistic on
certain times of the day and the concern would be uh large unplanned events or even uh regular traffic especially if alcohol is involved in and out of that driveway. Can anybody give me a distance from the southern point entrance exit driveway to the connect line where the
line of sight is uh compromised by the curve in the road? Can someone you know that Rob and who would look at that issue? I mean is that a concern to the board? You know, so a a resident stopped me
before the meeting and u we had a we had a discussion about this issue. So Mr. Dlesia, I'm going to take you back to this board's decision as it related to Happy Acres. So, you know
where Happy Acres Subdivision is. And during our hearing on Happy Acre Subdivision, myself specifically and others on the planning board questioned whether we should ask the town to lower the speed
as you're coming down the hill just past St. Michael. You go past St. Michael's Parish Hall. You go down a little bit further. You go by the transmission place on the right hand side and it goes from 40 to 45. We asked the town
officials to look at changing that speed right there because you're coming over a rise and really kind of then going down to just past the Apple Place where it hits 50 just in like at uh Metobrook Farm. We got no response from the police
department, DPW, etc., etc. So, they did not feel, the town officials at the time did not feel that that was an issue on that road. My experience, my experience alone from being in town for almost 23 years is
that that section of the roadway in front of Hawks Landing has much less traffic because you've got people taking a left on Hampton Road to go to Hampton. You have people taking a left just past
Peas Road. And therefore once you go past Metobrook the amount of traffic going into Summers is much less than the other parts uh from the roadway from the Rotary forward. So um I I'm feel
sufficient with what they've what they submitted. That's just me alone. So but can you do you know what that is? Distance and the other thing is and I'm not supporting developer or whatever. I'm just taking everything that I have in front of me. They they put forward a
traffic management plan for regular usage of the property. when they are going to extend the usage of the property like they've talked about, they are going to meet with the town officials and get a traffic plan in place, which includes bringing in police
officers to help direct traffic onto the property and off the property during those events are in place. So that does provide additional safety for people who are coming on and off the property
during those you know uh more usage of of the property for their special events. Go ahead Mr. Chairman. Uh the distance from the curb cut subtle curve cut to the state line is approximately 250 ft.
But the as you can see the roadway itself is a very subtle curvature. Okay. Um so that this is the this is the street here. This is the station. Mr. Dlesia, do you have other questions other things? And and I did read your
material. Thank you very much. Okay. So we're we're we're pretty set on the traffic speed issue on the street. Okay. You know, is is anything definitive or always, you know, 100% sure? No. No. But I guess what I'm asking you is
if you know what this feed is, then you can make a you can make a judgment judgement of what's going on. But um Okay. Um as far as outside, uh is it in your preview under the board to allow amplified mu amplified music or is that uh goes in front of somebody else under
this site plan? I think um that's a one-day event permit with the town council that falls under their purview. Did you hear that? The planning board does not have the I did that because it's not really something we can do with our zoning bylaw.
So, it's not a land use issue. Y the the amplification of noise I think as you as you know I think the noise ordinance is from 10:00 till 6 a 1000 p.m. to 6 a.m. and
that would be enforced by calling the police department to come and enforce that. Yep. The noise ordinance would govern that. I want to give them every opportunity. Yep. Yeah. And the um the poly pave pavement
they're talking about the additive there. Does that make the water permeable through the through the surface or does it stay on top and roll off? I'm gonna let the engineer answer that. Still per still permeable just binds the aggregate. So in layman's term
um the water will go through uh but it holds the the aggregate or the stone together. Okay. Okay. I just want to I just want to wrap it up. I heard one of the panel uh board members mention very good point that I was going to bring up. I'm going to reiterate it about the travel of the
seating of the 61 spots. Most people don't go to a facility, three to a car, which is the formula that they end up using the restaurant one. Um more like two two people to a car, maybe four if you're lucky, but mostly it's one or two people that that pushes the parking
limit out to the back on even a smaller event. And um I just see it as a a problem moving forward. Just a it's just a change of times and how people go into and from events. A lot of them don't uh necessarily we up in four in a car anymore.
So I'm I'm concerned about the allotted spot that uh it's on there for 175. Thank you. Hi. Hi. Can you remind us of your name? Yep. Not a problem. Uh John Dalton, 37
Ansley Drive, East Long Meadow. Uh last time I brought up the B issue. Um I I agree it is in the Hampton area, but I'm just asking if they can move it further in the Hampton area from our property line. My son was the one who got stung
by a bee and had allergic reaction like a day later when he was traveling in South Carolina. Had to cut off his ring. Had to cut off his ring. Yep. Um, also I've experienced a bee swarm soon after they've planted the hives. I don't
know if that anybody's seen a bee swarm before when they're mating, but it's extremely intense. I know the beekeepers are here. I mentioned it to them as soon as I saw it. Um, you see hundreds of thousands of bees spiraling like a tornado into the sky. It's a little
scary, but it's literally right near our property line. Additionally, in the spring, take my pool cover off. This when my son got stung, got nice fresh water. Since we've taken the cover off and started chlorinating
the pool, we don't see the bees. But before that, you could see the bees going from hive to our pool, hive to our pool. I mean, we're talking hundreds of bees. So, it's pretty easy to actually watch them. And there's question, oh,
could be any bee. Yeah, it could be. But didn't have a problem the year before as my wife had mentioned. The other thing we're concerned with too is the, you know, the property. My property line is currently right here. Yep. Okay.
We don't have a fence. There's no trees, no buffer here. Okay. I think in the newspaper it said buffer. I was concerned about people not necessarily running, you know, going through here, but if they're talking about having school kids go out to see the bees,
things like that, or pumpkin picking, it's all open to my property. My pool is right here. I do have a fence around the pool as required by law, but I have nothing protecting young kids from wandering into my property. Um, early on
when it started developing, you know, I asked, are they going to extend the trees? are going to put a fence. They said we'll see see what happens. Okay. Um they did plant the corn July 4th
11:00 at night. The tractors running back and forth. It probably finished somewhere around 3:00 in the morning. Little concerned with that. Hopefully, it's not going to I know you're rushing to get things done and I'm all for improving the property, but that was a
little ex you know, we're here. I have it on tape. I mean, you can hear it. I mean, I know when you cut the lawn or cut the grass, you hit all the rocks. So, we're here to address land correct issues. Correct. So, not them working at 3:00 a.m. in the morning. Okay. Yeah.
But, which is really rude, but go ahead. Okay. So, but once again, what is the timeline for their operational hours? Does that fall under you or Yes. Okay. So, you said 10 I think 10 10 p.m. to 6:00 a.m.
That is the noise ordinance. Okay. Yep. And it's enforced by the police department. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. I figured July 4th they had enough to do that night. So, anyway, but right now the a is here. I don't know if it's
going to be moved. I don't I mean we just saw bears in the area recently. Neighbor of ours notified told my wife there's a bear on Angley Drive. One more concern, you know, we know a friend of mine had a hive get attacked.
Um but it's on our we want to see progress but and then with the parking situation because they have limited parking where they are
is there their property actually butts the corner here of Anley Drive. Is there are you g is the town going to be put posting signs no parking or residential parking only? Yep. How's that? So I think I mentioned this last
meeting. So we had to approve the site plan for Live High School. Mhm. and you know after the vote and and all of that and uh Cassie here specifically uh asked the town council that was here
because they town council handles what are referred to as rules of the road and rules of the road deal with speed. They deal with no parking signs. They deal with all the things associated with roads. So, we certainly can ask the town
council through our planning director to indicate that we would prefer that they put in no parking signs along Ansley Road. That's the best that we can do. Now, with respect to the high school, they did they did that. So they went 200
feet down 250 but you have to go to the council meeting yourself and then ask for it there too because it's not not necessarily that they'll approve it even though we say it so you got to go again. Understood from council. Yeah. Yeah.
I went I asked I got a phone. Great. Thank you. Thank you. Are you going to come up and ask those questions? Just waiting. Bill Adams, 58 Brimmark Drive, East Men.
You answered most of my questions, but I do have a couple. Sure. That I'd like to share with you. Uh the first question is u is there a report available for the residents to look at pertaining to the contamination and or cleanup on that property?
So I'm going to ask Rob to address that if you know if that was addressed during the conservation commission meeting. I don't know of any that was given to me or to conservation because that's within my department as well. Um I don't know if Mr. wants to address that or if there's anything that might come up.
Yeah, sure. That's so it's not necessarily our purview. It's like topic. I'm not an LSP, but there are licensed site professionals that are responsible for cleanup of dirty sites. Uh in particular, there's also demolition requirements as well as fire
department overseas hole if there was an oil tank. So all of the demo and all the removal of the material would have had to be done under that u uh process. Also typically you may have had a phase one they had a phase one environmental site
assessment done. It's typical for a transaction when you're purchasing property and that's basically a historical that historical reviews what was on the site where they would like to look. Uh if they decide that u it's necessary they would do a phase two. So that was all taken care of before
purchasing the property and then obviously the dental permits would have had to been secured. So all of that is arguably kind of behind them. So they're in the process of arguably moving forward. Do the phase two. That's usually when they start digging with an augur to test soils.
Yep. Mr. Chairman, the reason I asked the question is that if they're going to have fruit and vegetables on that property, we want to make sure there's no contamination. So there should be some report for us the residents to look at to have that peace of mind that is is
in fact proper uh uh taking care of the property. So that's my question. I'm just is there a review? I mean is there a report? There's there's no there's no restrictions on the property based on the purchase you know based on the phase one. Did you do a phase have to do a
phase two? We we actually pulled a building permits Tom K 265 Milbrook Drive East Long Meadow. We actually have pulled a permit to do the removal. We actually even had fire department there where they thought there was an oil tank and it actually
was the septic tank. Um we we did do a lot. We also had de there uh when we to move the home. Not to belabor it, but great answers, but the problem is is the land
contaminated be because of the fact it was a farm at one time and there was chemicals being used. So, I I'm I'm not the developer. Yeah. Um but I have been involved in more than enough real estate deals throughout the
course of my career. And if the property was contaminated, I would imagine they probably would have walked away from the deal. That's just based upon experience. Uh but then again, it's their money and not mine. So, uh there. Okay. Uh also in the project uh
narrative, it was submitted to the town. Can you tell us what will be sold to the customers in the barn besides the sales of the produce from this farm? Good question. This goes back to what John was referring to pertaining to being a farm.
Uh it's my understanding that u they can in fact sell items that come from other farms in Massachusetts. That's the 15%. Yeah. So the question is would you be selling alcohol from another farm that's developed another farm? That's a question.
Well, I I I think we're a little premature here on exactly what we're going to sell. There is a list on the website that we did put together. So everybody could click on and take a look at what our first runs would be of items that would be sold at the farm stand. welcome to go on to hawkland.farm. In addition to that, we're still working
through the business plan on every item that we're going to offer. So, I think at this point, we're really here for a site plan review and not a product list. Good. So, the juryy's still out. Uh, also on the plan, it indicates the kind
of li livestock from other local farms will be brought into the site. So my question is what type of animals are they talking about and where would these animals be housed? Dead animals that would be served potentially cattle.
So um I didn't catch all of that and I caught a a hint of sarcasm there. So are are we talking you're not going to have any livestock? No, we're no livestock. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Well, it said livestock. I didn't know.
Okay. You were talking about dead purposes purposes in I'm sure farmer John could attest to this. Livestock in the state of Massachusetts is also considered these. Okay. Thanks.
That's all I have. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Okay. Should we recess now for 15 minutes? You can look at the diagrams. I'm sure you'd be happy to answer people's questions. Um, and could you, um,
there are down the hallway so we can the other. So, um, can we give up as many of these management plans if you want to review the management plan? Okay, got it. Uh, case SP-20225-06,
request for amendment to an existing special permit SP-2022-07 to extend the hours of operation for the restaurant business at 520 North uh Main Street, Cesler's parcel ID 2B-82-1 located in the business zoning district,
applicant Hershma Singh. Sorry, five. No, close. Uh, 520 North Main Street, East Long Meadow, Mass 01028. Sorry on the name. going. So Rob, just want to set set us up here. Yeah, sure. Let me close the door first out there. You should close that door, please.
Right there behind you. Thank you. Uh so uh this is Harshman Singh. He is the owner of Motu Indian Cuisine or kitchens. Indian kitchen on North Main Street. Um he is um currently operating under existing special permit that was awarded
to him in 2022 for a takeout Indian restaurant. Uh he is approaching the board to amend his existing permit in order to extend his hours of operation. I believe 9:00 p.m. is the latest you're currently going. You're trying to go until midnight 7 days a week. Am I correct on that? And he wishes to discuss that with you
as a possible option to consider. So I'll make a motion to open the public hearing. Second. Any discussion hearing? None. All in favor say I. I. I. Floor is yours. Figure one. Um yeah. What would you like to hear?
So, um, you want to go from 9 to 12. Y, um, so give us the reasoning behind that. Um, I specifically like to know and then from Rob the feedback from any town departments about this. So, why don't you start with that?
None. Uh, I haven't heard any concerns on the open go. Uh, every department approved it from their end with no comments. Uh, nothing from police or fire, nothing from board of health. Everything seems to be in order. Um, the applicant's been very compliant with us. Uh, there was one thing about the
benches and outdoor dining, but it turns out it's not outdoor dining per the building commissioner because he's not actively serving customers at those picnic tables. He's using the picnic tables as a place for customers to take their food after the purchase inside to sit on the property and enjoy the food
without getting any table service, which is allowed because we don't prohibit that. Okay. Yeah. Um, yeah. Uh the reasoning behind it is just to uh increase hours, increase sales. Um the business go I think um we see our
especially during the summer time our uh come from during the winter it'll be from 5 to 7 when we're really busy and during the summer it's 7 to 9 and that's when we're closing up shop. That's when we're um ready to leave and that's when everyone's usually coming in. So, um,
seeing that that's kind of the flow of orders, we're trying to push it back a little bit. Um, and then just generally living in the area, everything closes at 9:00. Um, and your only options are really like Taco Bell or McDonald's or something in that realm. And I feel like
if people had the option to eat something a little bit better, it would be better. Um, so that's kind of our general reasoning there. We don't plan on keeping the full menu past 9. I believe that will be the same. Uh we plan on keeping a reduced menu towards
the end of the night to where it's just very simple things in and out. Um our liquor license is extended to 11. Um but we are not planning to have that be a part of the late night menu. The late night menu is mainly just our best
sellers. Um and to keep like a reduced staff on on hand to okay take care of that. So I just want to remind everyone so you need four affirmative votes to amend the special permit. They unfortunately Mr. Fonica
was not able to be here this evening. So you have the the right to if you so choose to do the hearing and then delay the vote until we have a full board which would be in almost three weeks. It would be uh
first Tuesday in August. Yep. The first Tuesday in August is August uh 5th. Yeah. Okay. All set. Yeah. Do you wanna No. Okay. So, if you want to step back, we'll ask if there's anyone in the audience who'd like to be heard on this
matter. Please step forward. Can we both come up or just one? Sure. Sure. Come on. I'm Jim Wland, 538 Parker Street. You smile. And I am Paige Ler and I am at 14 Lombard. I bought the property there. Yep.
Can you start off? Sure. Um the the idea of having this restaurant or food service place open till midnight abuing a residential property I think is a little a little late. You have
families there, you know. um in uh September of 20 of 2023 when he was asked to, you know, extend his hours and get the liquor license and they asked him if he was going to have any outside dining, he said no. And there is outside, you know, they have
picnic tables out there and that at at a takeout place, you you were genuinely want people to come and leave. Come and leave. But now they're hanging, you know, he wants them to hang out there. And
this, you know, that at midnight, you know, you really kids are going to bed, people are trying to go to sleep, and it's right next to a residential area. You're going to have people coming and going till midnight. And I mean, he's encouraging this, which is great for, you know, his family, but we have to think of everybody's family, not just
his. Um, there's multiple there's there's no other business like this in town that stays open that late. There's no need to be open that late. and and any of those other businesses that aren't even open that late don't even abut residential properties.
So I think that this is not a very good idea for the community. Do you want to add? I do. I just I like I had said too like for us it's you know that's our home. I understand that you're saying there's you know no part that says that they
can't have outdoor seating. It's it's less than 15 feet from my property. Um they do multiple um like events throughout the week. Their first event that they did, the first night of um the picnic tables, they did like a street
food night, they had two different people come and sit and bring alcohol from their car and sit at the um picnic tables, which we have video of. You know, we have supported them from the very beginning. My husband and I, we both eat there multiple times a month. We have young kids, like we're busy, so
it's great. Um, we never, you know, attested even their liquor license, nothing. This to me is just a violation of our property. You know, our quality of life has already changed with them being open till 9:00. I have a six-year-old and a 9-year-old. You know, when they're out in the parking lot and
their doors are slamming or they're out there and customers are talking, my kids wake up. to have them be, you know, 15 ft or from our house is is just I feel like a violation with the picnic tables if you'd like to.
I I know exactly where that is, you know, and and like I said, I've been supportive of them. I'm not saying that I don't think I just think he's naming McDonald's and Taco Bell. What is that bringing? I work for a living. I wake up in the morning. My kids go to school. So, I'm not going and getting takeout at
11:00 at night or 12:00 at night. We don't have any drive-throughs and so we're proud of that's what I'm saying. So like who's getting you know when we had said too like when he first opened they had taken the seating from like 30 to 33 or 30 to
35 and he brought it down to 20 to 25 because he said he was primarily takeout. So why would you need people to take up your spots to go sit on the lawn? I when we read what he had said about um he wants to limit people from sitting on the lawn or trash. No one in
the two years that they have been there have ever sat on the lawn. Not one person. Um and for talking about trash, we pick up the trash or if he has bi-weekly um lawn service, they pick up the trash.
They have never picked up the trash on the sideline. I I just for me and for my family's quality of life, we've lived there for 13 years. This is just a huge violation for us. Like I said, you know, when you're eating dinner outside your
window and people are saying like, "Oh my god, I saw you in your dining room last night." We've learned to live with that. But to have them be 15 feet from my property. It's scary. You know, they they did two nights and they had multiple people out there till almost 9:00. My kids are in bed at 8:00. You
know, they're waking up. Who's out there? They hear voices. It's it's scary. and and also half of their parking lot faces the house. So when these people are leaving at whatever you know 9:00 it's a little late but that's fine. I mean that's
that's that's doable. But 10 11 12:00 at night they're going to be starting their cars. Their headlights are going to be going into the kids' bedrooms into the house. They're going to be slamming doors. They're going to be saying hi, you know, goodbye and high fives and and it's going to be loud. And it's not only us. It's the people across the street.
And if they move and elderly people buy the house, it's going to be for them. You know, it's it's not just for us. It's for the community. It it's a a takeout food at 10, 11, 12:00 at night is non-existent. That now we know what's going to happen. He he has a liquor
license until 9:00 and excuse me, 11. Oh, it is 11. Yeah. It's approved until 11 even though they're open by the town council. Yeah, by the time when somebody else was that in the original original
meeting. The only reason for this meeting to exist is because during that you guys realized the special permit did not also include that but did approve the liquor license to go to 11 because uh the town council did have no problems with that. Okay. Like I said and and I and I I've
had absolutely no problem. We support them. We go there. I'm happy to have this still keep running, but to me it's it's horrible for my family and to so who's controlling that they're not the first night they brought liquor from their car. A girl went inside to go try
to purchase food and she stuffed it in her purse and then went inside got food. Then they had other people who came people purchased food from the restaurant and then brought their own food from the car for their kids. So, it's just
just one at a time, please. I have a comment after this. Yeah. Okay. Go ahead, Rob. Go ahead. Well, I was going to say a compromise here could be you just make a condition that nobody can sit in the chairs past a certain hour. You're allowed to do that. But what's going to stop that? And what's going to stop it? So, so
basically the way it works is, so if he doesn't comply with this special permit, so if you set a condition where it says past 9 p.m. or past 9:00 p.m., nobody can use tables outside. If there's a violation and you report it to the building commissioner, we can re shut it. And I understand that, but I don't want
it to be back in like that. And I understand what you're saying. I truly do. But I'm eating dinner in my dining room and they're 15 feet from my house. That's the only way you can legally kind of fix this issue. No. What do you mean? So if you were to
So I just keep complaining. So if you He's going to comply with it if we But they didn't comply with it because because it wasn't a state rule before. That's the thing. There wasn't a rule before saying that you're not allowed to sit outside past a certain hour. So if you pull that rule into place, he's probably going to follow.
So what stops this from be like like for my property? What protects us from our property? Like can you imagine and I understand you guys have a job to do. I to I do. And I understand he has a business and he wants to build it. I I understand that. How is there if there's no rule in place, what is to have
privacy for my home? I'm literally eating dinner and I hear people's conversation. I hear them. They're running around. They're bringing their own liquor. What? How do you know who these people are and how they're going to behave when they're leaving? Who is going to monitor that? Well, I I So, you rais a very valid
point. People don't follow rules. They already didn't. Well, people in general don't follow rules, right? Is is the biggest issue. He could have signs saying no sitting outside and people might do it. He says you can't bring liquor in and he might not be there and they bring liquor in. I mean,
it's then we waste what's the police department's time and we waste police department. There is a zoning there is a zoning enforcement officer. So we this board has actually revoked special permits
where businesses did not operate in the manner in which they said they would or the conditions in which we put on them and they've closed. So I can think of three in my eight years that have actually had their special permits revoked for violations.
But that's not what we're trying to do. We want to avoid that. Trying to do that. I know. So, okay, it's making a family like Okay. What if um and I don't know if he would
even agree to this, but um I would just like a chance to respond. Yeah. Yep. Yep. You you will, but but we're not going to get into a he said, she said. We already have gotten we already a bunch of things that did not happen. Okay. Stop. Stop.
Stop. We're trying. Stop. So, and I have no idea whether you would even agree to something like this, but I'm just throwing it out there. Aren't there, excuse my being so old that I am, but aren't there like food delivery services that operate um until certain
times? And so what if we said, "Okay, you can leave your kitchen open until 11:30, 12:00, but it can only be by food delivery drivers and no one for that. Hold on. Hold on. Please, I I listened to every word you
said. I know. I'm sorry. I'm frustrated to us." So that way there would not be any people coming into the premises, sitting down, then leaving or sitting on a, you know, picnic table outside kind
of deal. I mean, I'm just throwing that out there as a potential. So, but okay. So, would you like an opportunity to respond? Okay, please come up. So, uh, a lot of things were claimed. Uh
maybe five people have sat at those picnic tables over the three weeks that we had them. We had two pieces of trash in that trash bag. Uh no liquor, no anything in that realm. Um the picnic tables were not 15 ft from her house.
They are a clear 25 ft. Um property that was a they were put up we were we talked to Rob. We talked to Will. Yep. Uh we got their complaints. we fixed and did everything we need to do in that. We
haven't gone through and reput the tables back out after we got the violation notice. Um so all of that is separate from what I am asking which is hours. Uh tables exist for three months. My restaurant
exists for all 12. I need all the hours to keep the restaurant running. It is not uh my job to take care of their kids and when they go to sleep and how they go to sleep. Okay. But it is get into that. But but that's what we've made it about
when it really we have no noise complaints. We have um no one dining outside at 9:00 p.m. We barely have anyone dining inside at 9:00 p.m. It's all takeout. We're 80% takeout. I can show you the numbers. Uh, and yes, that is exactly what we proposed to do, which
is just a Door Dash kitchen after 9:00, which is the late night menu. It is just a grab-and-go restaurant. That's what it has been. These tables were just a nice addition. I just wanted to give people a place to sit. We have had people who just sit on the grass, some of the trash since they are clearly our trash picker
upper. Um, but we have trash cans outside as well with those picnic tables. We have taken every precaution. We have also spoke to them a year before. I asked him directly. You said you were putting a bench. Uh, please don't interrupt. Uh, we put out That's exactly what we
did. Uh, we put out tables. We spoke to them clearly. He just asked keep it away from the window and put a trash can outside. We did the exact thing that he asked for. Um, the tables are irrelevant to what I am asking. I'm not asking for outdoor
dining. I'm not asking for people to be drinking alcohol. That's also illegal. You cannot bring alcohol from the restaurant outside. We don't serve it that way. When they order it and they say they want to sit outside, we've had two people tell them to go and order alcohols. That's how we handle it.
Do you own that property? Yep. Yeah. Okay. Okay. But so you just mentioned that it's primarily a takeout business. Yep. And you don't have any customers really past 9. So I mean you're close at 9, but it slows down at 9. It seems like that I
believe customers up until 9. Okay. But so we're trying to extend that. Okay. Do is there any aside from the McDonald's and the Taco Bell, which is I believe would be a completely separate category from where you are. Is there anything that shows that you would have enough business that makes sense to stay
open for an additional three hours? This is this is a very sleepy town. I mean, I'm just saying I don't not many around midnight snacks. We're right on the border. So we're not just And we're a Door Dash restaurant. So our orders go from not just East Long Meadow, they go to Summers, they go to
Enfield, they go to Springfield, they go to West Springfield, Westfield, like they go pretty far. So it may not be applicable to them that anything past 9:00 is food, but for someone who works 8:00 a.m. to 9:00 p.m., I am looking for food after 9:00.
So is the goal in this? So I think what you said was that you're looking for after 9:00 to be takeout only, right? Which is why I brought up the reduced menu in the beginning. It will be a late night menu. It's a smaller menu and it's on Door Dash. It's on our website. Uh it's for pickup. It's for delivery.
Nobody inside, nobody outside. Not really. We're not. We're looking for a reduced staff, which is again what I stated in the beginning. Uh we're looking to just keep a small menu and keep the restaurant open for a little bit longer. A lot of clarification. Okay. Also make those conditions of the permit too, Mr. Chair. I just want to remind
that questions. They are answered. Pete, do you have questions, Mr. Punderson? Well, I have my own thoughts on it. Um, my thoughts are keep it at 9:00 during the week and 11 o'clock on the weekends.
So, I'm not ready to vote on it this evening. I'd like to just give it some more thought. I don't know how others might feel. Well, we need at least four to vote. Right. So, I'd like to have Bill here as well. Oh, I would like to uh see if there's a
motion to continue this to our next meeting. So, which is August August 5th at 6 p.m. and it would be exactly at 6 p.m. Um, you know, Rob, I'd love for you to meet with the parties and see what's possible. Don't be alarmed.
I just want to make it clear, too. I was not saying that by any means they were serving alcohol outside at all. I I got you. I just want that to be clear. I'm not saying they're doing anything wrong in that. So it's on TV. Okay. So right and we all rewatch it before our next meeting that we do.
Yeah. I will not be here for that meeting but it's possible. Well, no. I'd like people saying Croy into that. Yeah. I just think that at 12:00 at night some bad things happen around that time that
usually don't happen, you know, before then. Maybe like 11 o'clock is probably a a better hour than 12:00. but I don't see the need for extension during the week. He himself even said that he doesn't really have the business for it. Um, and the neighbors seem to
have a threshold that works for around 9:00. I said nothing about there not being business. So, do um Mr. Penderson made a motion to continue to the next meeting. Do I have a second? Second. Do we have any further discussion on the motion?
Hearing none. All in favor say I. I. I. I think we need to think about this. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for your time. So, can I have a motion to um bring back into
I'm going to keep session tomorrow. Move. Okay. Good. Second. Okay. All right. Um so, we've had a few minutes to uh so the public meeting is still the public hearing is still open. Um could you announce which public
hearing, please? Rob, can you just pay site 2025-02, 896 Summers Road? So, I'm going to bring it back to the board. So, does the board have any questions on just on the specific issues before we
get into a general discussion? I have one. Okay. Well, if they're going to go for a permit, let's say they're going to have 200 people there, they think. So, they're going to have a need to put some people outside and they're also going to have a need for, I would imagine, some
sort of structure to house these people under, which would be a temporary tent or something like that. So, do they have enough room for those extra people plus the extra parking? So, you uh you faded in and out about halfway through.
Okay. Can you repeat that? I'm wondering if say they've had to go to get a special one night permit for alcohol and a over capacity crowd of say 200 people. Yep. That means that there's going to be too
many people to put inside the building. Yep. So that would mean in my mind that they've also got a a tent of some sort for the people to go under and get services of food or whatever it may be. Yeah. So my question is if they if they do that do they have room for the
additional parking? So that was answered. So they have vacant correct me if I'm wrong Mr. Shitso they out of the formal parking area they do have a field in which they could park additional vehicles
and still if they had to get a tent they could still have a tent there. Yes. Okay cool. Okay. So before we vote on this, there are a number of waiver requests. So you go to page eight. Mr. Chair, there's
action items there at the for look at and address. Yep. On page eight. So the first uh request was the storm water report. Rob, do you give the audience exactly what that means? Yeah. So, basically the um applicant is
requesting a waiver from the uh requirement for item submission for site plan review a storm water report um as well as a traffic study. Uh so the applicant per the zoning bylaw article 9 does have the right to request a waiver. It is up to the board whether or not
they wish to approve or deny such requests. Um, storm water report is one of those requests that is technically required, but as I mentioned, they could request a waiver. Okay. Why don't you just keep going down that list? Sure. And the other item is the traffic
study. Um, the only thing the applicant gave us was kind of one piece of a traffic study, which is the trip count generated from the site and the proposed use, which they are claiming is agriculture. Um that does relate to site plan review because it relates to traffic and um the other item after that
is the surfacing requirements for paved parking areas. Um that specific section is um section 5.6 of chapter 450 of subsection B 2C. Um they require patuminous asphalt concrete surface. The applicant is replacing it with a
permeable gravel with the additive um don't name the specific material polyave. Um then lastly um section 9.4 of subsection 11 pertains to the requirement to submit signage design for site planner view. The applicant is
requesting a waiver from that because they have not yet designed their sign and we'll do so later on which is usually done through the building department anyways. So before we act on these items, after people have had the opportunity to review the plans, traffic
mitigation, the pictures of of what they plan to plant, are there any further questions by anybody? Okay. So hearing none. Okay. Going back to an arborite situation we
dealt with a while ago. Just I want looking for clarification because these are the screening arborites which ones they're going to be because there's two very different species. Ones that grow the snail space and ones that go very fast. So we could do the American arborite which grows fast. Yeah. Thank you. Make sure that's
Thank you, Mr. Dlesio. Yes. I just want to uh clear up a an understanding that you had mentioned that no parking off site on a public way. You can make recommendations, but it's up to the town council to
approve it. Yes. Okay. The rec the the the past issue that I referenced was the sighting of the high school. Yeah, I I'm familiar with that. Okay. So, I just want to make sure that uh
even you'll have recommendations going forward and then it's uh moves on to the next level of authorization. I I absolutely will be making a recommendation ask the board to make a recommendation to the town council that there be no parking along route or along
83 and that there be no parking on Anley. So, and the posting language is up to the town council after approval. Yes. Hours and stuff like that. Okay. Um Yeah. And then as far as for the for the
events which require um an alcoholic license, the town council is the decider of how long those events can last. Does that answer your question? Or are youing normal operating hours?
I'm looking at um well I just heard the last applicant go before you not applicant but the last issue go before you and is hours of operation under your uh purview at this time with this site uh plan. So the last item that was just in front
of us while they were out looking at plans and so forth that that was a special permit and this is this is a site plan. Two completely different things. Okay. on a special permit we can put conditions like that on. Yeah. But also
you can um as per site plan review you are allowed to make a condition about the off street parking being banned. Oh great. In relation to the usage of this site good because it relates to traffic and as well as site design. Thank you for the clarification. No problem. Okay. So if there's
Okay. But Yep. Hours of operation is not something that you guys deal with at this time at this level at all on the site plan. No, because you're not governing the use itself and how it operates. Um, it has to be something that's related to the overall layout of the site. So, they
can't govern hours of operation on when they can be open and when they close. That's out of the question altogether for this specific project. Okay. I'm going to ask for a motion to close public hearing. Okay. Sure. I just didn't get up before, but
uh my name is Mark Guthrie. and a butter on the uh on the long side, if you will, the back side. Um just procedurally, um let's say uh a fence doesn't come up for myself and John in the back. Uh noise and all that other stuff,
whatever. What What are the much like Mr. Delicio, I think, hit last time. What is our recourse? What does that process look like if now we say, you know what, they are good neighbors, but there's times that we just feel like we need to communicate something. if they're just going for these special events to go meet with the East Lo
Police Department, that's not where we're invited. You know, those type of things on if you can kind of just generally hit that, that'd be great for I think all of us. Thank you. Okay, so um for land use issues, there is a zoning enforcement officer for the
town. His name is William Kathleen. Goes by Will Catholine. Um fairly new town employee since maybe February or March of this year. Yep. I will tell you he has been extremely diligent when violations have been brought to his
attention. So land use issues, zoning issues would go to him. Noise issues would go to the police department. Any issues associated with their extra events. So, you know, just as a
reference, if they did a wedding or they did a, you know, something and you felt that there was too much noise and there wasn't enough control by the police officers that they were bringing in to do all of that, that is then a town council issue because the town council
issue is going to want to hear that. So, the next time they come before them for a one-day liquor license, they will have heard from you on what the complaints are, and they may require additional conditions to be met before the next event can take place. Um,
that's an event bye-vent basis, too. Event bye-vent basis. That's one point responsive to that. Okay. Um so the the traffic management plan which we've been discussing and I believe would be likely be a condition
does have in it not only police and fire but a notification and best contact information for all the owners of the email addresses. So they would have notice and they would have a point of contact for any questions etc.
So that's Rob. Did I miss anything that you can think of for the waiverss or just No, just for the uh the contacts for the town. Uh I think you pretty much hit everything, Mr. Chair, that I am thinking of. Okay.
All right. Last one. Drive the uh this thing. Um right here they have the uh arbor vites go about halfway down. um from our backyard. We're still going
to have a sighteline of this building. Is there any way they could put a stockade either on this side or this side of the um crab apple trees? I don't care which one really. Um well, it's the green, the light green. Those are
trees. Yes. But and how many feet of trees between his property line and the stockade fence that you're putting around the building? one of the trees on the subject property and there's also some trees near the shed and also on the other the general
property. Yeah. And the existing trees are 20 feet. Yeah. So they're about uh Yeah. But they're basically see through the sun right now from our backyard.
Um so they don't block any view or noise. the the crap the the apple trees here which are probably not going to be for human consumption anyway. They're not in that good shape.
Um so for I mean we what we need we're looking for is like a stockade from here to here either on this side we've got 15 to 20 feet to these crab apple to these trees then we can either go on this side or the other side of it.
Okay. All right. If there's no one else, um, do I have a motion to close the public hearing? I'll move. Do I have a second? Second. Second. Motion made and second. Any discussion on closing the public hearing? Hearing
none. All in favor say I. I. Okay. So, we're going to do the following. We're going to go through each waiver and then we're going to uh seek conditions that are allowable by the planning board. So, we're not done yet.
So, the first um waiver request is the storm water report. Any discussion on that? If not, do I have a motion to allow the waiver? So, moved. Do I have a second? Second.
Do I have any discussion? Hearing none. All in favor say I. I. I. I'm going to skip the traffic study for a second. And then I'm going to go to the waiver request for the surfacing requirements.
So, um, do I have a motion to, and I'm making an affirmative motion because that's what's required under the law. So, uh, do I have a motion to allow the waiver on the surfacing requirements? So, moved. Do I have a second? Second.
Do I hear any discussion? Hearing none. All in favor say I. I. Pete. I. Okay. The third is the waiver request on the signage. We heard from um we heard that
that they are not ready to do that and it isn't it is an issue that is approved by the building inspectorzoning enforcement officer. So do we have a waiver on that? It's a move. Have a second. Second. Okay. Motion made. Second. Any
discussion on that request? Hearing none. All in favor say I. I. I. And then on the issue of the traffic study. Do I have a a motion to allow the waiver on the traffic study?
So moved. Do I have a second? I'll second. Yeah. Motion made and second. Any discussion? Okay. On this matter. Okay. Hearing none. Uh all in favor say I. I. I.
Okay. With respect to conditions. So um the following I don't believe there would be any opposition from this board. So we are going to request that there be posted signs on Aley uh
for at least the first 200 feet. um that there be absolutely no parking on the main thoroughfare. Um so let's start with those two. So do I have a motion to approve th that condition or those conditions?
I got a question. Yes, sir. You do that 200 feet that's going to be in front of our house. We have family or friends parking. Okay. 300 ft. No, he's asking about if they're there and then they have to park.
Oh, good point. Okay. Is not that big is enough to hold. So, you know, it's so I I realize this is difficult because no one has faith in anybody these days, but you know, the mitigation plan that they developed, you
know, they have to give notification to the abuters on the larger events on the day-to-day operations has 61 parking spots, which I would I don't see it on a day. So they have to notify you of that. Um
Mr. Chair, um can I say one thing about the first condition you proposed? So the second one's totally fine. Banning off streetet parking in relation to this use or the use of the land, but doing it for Anley Drive when it's not connected to the property is going to be
we'd have to make that a recommendation to the town. But I think making it as a condition to the permit is going to be tricky. So, I think one thing you could do as a board vote after this to recommend that memo be sent to the town council requesting that so they can go ahead and hear it
before them and and make that an item that they discuss at one of their meetings. Yeah, just I mean for the big events permanence being there but on a permanent basis. Okay, good point. Thank you. Bury signs right.
Yeah. So on respect to route 83 motion to approve as that as a condition. Could you um repeat the condition please? Just no parking signs on Route 83 at all times. No parking. Yep. At all. Yeah. Yep. Second. No parking. Okay. Any discussion on that? Hearing
none. All in favor say I. I. Okay. So um hours of trash pickup is Yeah. So we have done this on other site plans. Question. Sorry, I just have a quick question. So, just to be clear on the Hanes League, what do we decide on the park? So, it's going to be when you go and um
for your extraordinary events, I'll call them the extraordinary events. Um it's it would be a condition of the town council to put on those and and you could put up temporary signs. Yeah. To do that. I mean, it's kind of like, you know, during the Fourth of
July, I live, you know, for the parade. I live in a neighborhood. They come by and they put up temporary no parking signs, you know, some something like that. And that's within the purview of the town council, not this board. Just make that clear. Okay. Um, trash pickup hours. Trash pickup hours. So, we have done
this in the past. Um, so I mean, you say you're going to do it Monday through Friday, not on weekends. So, um, we'd like to put a probably a further restriction that it be done between the hours of 8:00 a.m. and 6:00 p.m.
Okay. Monday through Friday. Monday through Friday. Yep. Do I have a motion on that? Moved. So second. Any discussion? Hearing none. All in favor say I. I. Okay. We're running down our list here. Uh
um there's some other uh proposed conditions too. Mr. Chair, did you want me to go through those? Please. Okay. So the first proposed condition addition to the other two that was just approved. And mind you, these are additional conditions on top of those standard ones we already applied to site plan review. Um so this first condition
is upon completion of construction the applicant shall reach out to the director of planning to coordinate a site visit. Purpose of the site visit is to ensure compliance with the approved site plans for this site plan review petition. The site plan this site visit shall occur no more than 6 months post construction and prior to issuance of a
certificate of occupancy. We did that for the last site plan review position we had and uh that's up for the board's discussion. You want me to go through the rest of list chair or do you want to go individually for one? So the next proposed additional condition is the traffic management plan
submitted with this petition shall be adhere to at all times. Any significant changes to the traffic management plan shall require an amendment to the site plan review approval is the discretion of the we can make that either director of planning or planning board to determine what is considered a significant change to the traffic management plan. Um the third proposed
additional condition is the installation of directional signs including exit only entrance only and arrows which can also be painted. um shall be installed in the parking lot area. Uh you already addressed the on street parking situation. And then lastly um if the
applicant is conducting an agricultural activity which is in compliance with an approved soil conservation plan prepared or approved by the United States Natural Resource Conservation Service. They shall provide an approved soil conservation plan when completed should be should the proponent not satisfy the
criteria of the storm water exemption agriculture. This issue will be brought up during a public meeting with the planning board in order to avoid non-compliance. That was a condition that was recommended by um Mark Burman, our assistant superintendent public works, and he was satisfied with the language of that condition. And
condition F cannot be included because it pertains to the apiary which is in Hampton. Right. And that's that's all I had. So I have a motion to approve those conditions. So moved. Do a second. Second. Any discussion? Hearing none. I do have a actually a quick one. So, if
there were changes made to their traffic management plan, would you want them to come to the planning board to discuss it or to director planning? Which would be a better option to determine whether or not they have to amend their site plan review approval? Did they start with you? They usually come to me first, but then I kick it off to the board if that's
what the board would want. Let's do it that way. Okay. I will change the language so it reflects that. Okay. Have a motion. It's been second. Any discussion? Hearing none. All in favor say I. I. I. Okay. Um, so for everybody, just as as a
recap, this has been a a tough one. Um, I applaud the developers. I think it, you know, it looks nice. Hopefully, it will be nice. I have trust in all three of you. I mean, you all run great
businesses and hopefully you'll continue to do so. You know, people have to have a leap of faith and I have faith that you'll do the right thing. So that's just me personally. Mr. Chair, I do want to say one thing you got to do prior to your decision on the petition is to approve or deny the
findings made for the standards of review. We'll get there. Okay. So I'll never get there. Okay. Um so it was so difficult because it's still not a done deal. I think as we've mentioned over and over and over again, there needs to be a determination
on um on the agricultural use and um Mr. Bernie made a very valid point. Um he does not believe it will comply, but the way the law is written, that determination will be made by the building inspector of the town. Um
we don't know exactly when he will be making that decision. Um I'm sure it'll be forthcoming. Um this is also part of you know there are several boards involved and several departments involved in this process.
So you know this planning board acted on land use issues. The conservation commission was involved in this. So they had a look at this project. Obviously the town council when there are extraordinary events and the traffic mitigation they will be involved in it
as well. the residents raise some very valid issues because it's I'm sure it's not a use that you might have envisioned when you bought property there. Uh but this happens a lot to us. Um so there are other, you know, opportunities to be
heard on this, you know, most notably with the town council specifically, you know, w with potential on on street parking and and the like. So, um, keep the faith, I guess, is is the best
thing to say on this as we move forward. So, uh, we do need to approve all the findings. Uh, do you want to give us the appropriate motion, Mr. Wila? Um, it's up to you whether or not you wish to just do it in block or if you want to go through each one. Do it in block. Do block. Okay. So, you as the board
will make the motion to approve the findings made for the site plan review standards for review as it pertains to this petition. A second or a motion. So, move. Second. Second. Any discussion? Hearing none. All in favor say I. I.
I. Okay, that's it. So, we're going to take a five minute recess. So, you have to actually not confuse further. You have to approve the site plan review petition. Oh, okay. Forgot about that. Go ahead. Do a motion.
Um, you make a motion to approve the site plan review petition site 2025-02. Do I have a motion to approve? Second. Any discussion? Hearing none. All in favor say I. With all the conditions.
With all the conditions. Yep. All the conditions. Yep. All in favor say I. I. Okay. You want to take a five or six minute recess? Sure. Yeah. All right. Um, under item five A, Mr. Clerk, uh,
ANR-2025-04, request to endorse, uh, yeah, try that again. Request to endorse plan of land reconfiguring two existing parcels into one new parcel at 286 Maple Street, parcel ID 6-128A-F
and 6-128-G, residents B zoning district. applicant Glenn Hasty, 45 Dear Park Drive, you saw Middle Mass 01028. The applicant here, they're not, Mr. Chair, but they sent me a summary and email, okay, to read to you. Uh, so this is the third
time this property has come up for an ANR, and they have the right to do that. Uh, this time they're going to combine the parcels back to the one parcel, uh, because they're currently in a variance hearing with the zoning board of appeals. Um, so it was suggested to them to to combine the parcels to move
forward with that public hearing. But in summary of what Mike Smith sent to me, who is the proponents surveyor, uh, with regards to the AR plan being submitted by Smith Associates on behalf of Brown Metal LLC, please note that the purpose of this plan is to combine parcels J and K on a previously endorsed and recorded
plan, which he references the specific book and page number 403, page 25, um, into one new parcel shown as parcel L on the plans that you have before you. The parcel is located in the residence B zoning district and meets all the dimensional requirements of that zoning
district and he wanted to thank you and that's pretty much all we have at the moment. Okay. So, what's in front of the ZBA? Uh it's a variance hearing on using the Maple Streets uh frontage as access because the Chestnut Street side is
unusable due to uh the presence of wetlands. So, you couldn't physically build a driveway to go over the wetlands. Okay. Yeah. Right. Do I have a motion to approve or to endorse the plan? So moved. I have a second. Second.
Any discussion? Hearing none. All in favor say I. I. Passes item. Mr. Clerk. Oh. All right. uh SP-20 2017-05 request to review applicability of
condition 9 of SP-20 2017-05 on recent proposed changes to cell phone antennas at 24 North Main Street. Applicant Elizabeth Glidden, Verizon, 20 Alexander Drive, Wingford, Connecticut 06 92.
I'm sorry. Okay, walk us through the record. My name is Liz Glidden. I'm uh senior engineer with Verizon Wireless. Uh we have some antennas on I think it's the Ace Rocky um Rocky Ace
hardware store and uh they have uh reached um they're they're aging out and we would like to replace those antennas with pretty much
the same antennas, same height, same size. Okay. Questions from anybody? Kind of routine. Simple. Any questions? No. Okay. All in favor of um
Do I make the motion for you, Mr. Chair? Sure. Uh so you approve um so you determine that site. Sorry. Yeah. You determine that the special permit does not have to be amended per the recent changes to the cell phone attendance brought to you by
the proponents. So moved. Second. Any discussion hearing? None. All in favor say I. I. I. I apologize. No problem. Great. So you'll send something over to the um building
permit. Sure. Yeah. Yeah. I can do that. Um, so you can start the building per process and I can. So, usually he'll reach out to me to see if there's anything further, but I can produce a letter to send to him. Okay, if that's what you want me to do, I can definitely do that. You could do that. And if you could just CC me on that in my email. So,
I will definitely come tomorrow. Great. Thank you all. You've done a very nice job, I have to say. So, good. I've been in planning for a long, long time. So, good job. I can say something off the record.
This board is like if you get it make it through the night only upsetting half of the people, you've done a good job. Great. Okay, now I'm back on now I'm back on the record though. Um I'm willing to delay the discussion on recreational vehicles until we have a full board so
we can put that off. So planning and community development director's report. Yeah, let me just find that real quick, Mr. chair. Uh my apologies going through my documents be really quick updates. So I have the next six meeting dates uh for
you to peruse. We have no scheduled public hearings at the moment aside from the public hearing that was continued to the next meeting August 5th. Uh no recent upcoming events that I know about to my knowledge. Uh just a few planning department updates. So our traffic pedestrian safety survey has officially
closed as of July 11th. This past Friday, we received about 321 online responses and we received an additional 35 physical copies. So, in total, we received 356 responses from residents of town. Uh, so
I'll be going through those reports and developing a uh report that I'm going to share with the public in the coming weeks. Um, comprehensive zone review and diagnostic. I met with Will Downey of Barrett Planning Group last week and gave him a driving tour of East Law
Meadow. I showed him all the properties that have been discussion, saw the zoning districts, and he's very familiar with the town. He's going to bring that knowledge back to the consultants so they can begin and continue with their work. And lastly, Alex Gregorov, who we both know formerly as our PCD
administrative assistant, is now our planning conservation coordinator. uh he is now fully staffing the conservation commission and he is able to perform site visits on behalf of the commission. Right. So he is moving up uh and he's going to provide a great service to our department and he is continuing to do
great work for us. We're very lucky to have him. Absolutely. So that's all I have Mr. Chair and thank you for the time. Yeah. And just I received a email yesterday from a resident uh just expressing her opinion uh about her
thoughts of the work we are doing. on kind of quality of life issues. She appreciates that. Um is not a fan of additional housing in the center and I just sent her a note thanking her for her comments and uh you know I
appreciated everything. So with that, do we have a motion to adjurnn? So moved. Do I have a second? Second. Any discussion on adjourning, Pete? Nope. Dinner's waiting. Okay. All in favor say I. I. Hi,
good to see everybody. Get well, Pete.