Uh so this is the April 13th uh meeting of the special meeting of the spe special town council meeting and financial oversight committee meeting. Um and there's a caveat I'm supposed to say
when we're recording it or >> yeah just that it's being recorded by Hellcat and if there's anyone in the audience which there isn't if they could identify themselves. >> What was that? >> Jim is in the audience. >> Oh okay. What's that? >> If someone was recording.
>> Okay. >> Oh, Jim Leen's in the audience. >> Thank you very much. So, I will call the meeting to order at 3:33. And first order of business is to review and approve the minutes of our 48
meeting. And uh thank you for sending them out in advance. Uh Jackie. Um >> I make a motion to approve the minutes of 4826. >> Okay. Second. >> Uh I would I would have just two discussions. Uh one
refer we refer to attachment A, budget attachment A. Would people know what that is? Uh just not sure. >> When it gets posted on the website, it'll be on >> and is it posted yet on the website or >> until we approve it? Well, the M she's
going to attach it to the minutes. The draft budget should be on the website already. >> So, you will attach that at Okay. Thank you. And uh the only thing I can remember is that we kind of talked about perhaps having the schools come in on April 27th,
but we can confirm that. >> Yeah, that that that actually would be their preference. Uh obviously, but I spoken to a couple of them and that would be the preference. That Monday >> Monday the 27th. Yeah, that that would be their preference if that's okay with you. >> No. And that's uh then and with those
questions, I'm fine with it as it is. Um do I hear? We've got a motion and a second. All in favor, please say I. >> I. I. >> I. >> All opposed. All right. Minutes carry. Uh schedule of
So, how how will we do the minutes as we go forward? Well, I think Miss Sullivan's wonderful. I don't think there's any discussion. Chair >> Jackie, you're here because it's a uh uh special town town council meeting, too. >> Yes. >> All right. And so, it would be all right
if you kept taking the minutes. >> I figured out how to do it on Zoom AI. So, hopefully this helps her out. >> Oh, yeah. >> Yeah. >> We were pass the hat. >> Yes. >> So, this is such a relief to everybody. Sure. >> I just said that we were ready to pass
the hat as an incentive. >> Okay. Well, that was that was very good. >> Thank you, Jackie. >> Council, do you mind if I entertain a motion for the council to approve its >> Yes. I'm sorry. Go right ahead. Yes. >> Motion. >> So moved. >> Second.
>> Thank you, Ralph and Marilyn. Any other discussion? Seeing none, all those in favor, please say I. >> I. Opposed. >> There's Anna. >> Jim. >> Yeah. Thank you. >> Yeah. Uh so schedule of meeting dates, we talked about them and Jackie was kind
enough to uh work with the Pleasant View and Merrily here to pin down uh times and and times and uh and meeting we would be meeting here uh for our meetings. The only change from our
discussion was that we needed to start at 3:30 versus 3 because of uh conflicts with the room. So, uh I think um invitations were sent out. So, uh you probably have seen this before, but I
just wanted to double check that we're all okay with that. >> And that on that 10th, Mr. Chair, May 7th, we are starting at 4:30 that day. That's the only difference. >> That is correct. That's the uh if necessary date >> and then so the four meetings in between
are at 3:30 instead of 3. >> Yes. Yes. >> Okay. Uh next uh Tom was kind enough to uh send out the follow-ups on the four items that we had um raised questions about and uh I thank you for that Tom.
>> Thanks Kim. Um, so I'll open it up to committee members about questions. I I did have one maybe with the positions of need. So these are needs within the uh
town that if the budget had if you had had room in the budget, you would have look to try to fill. Yeah, these are sort of operational deficiencies that we've sort of um identified that if there were an
opportunity to get them in the budget, not that's not necessarily in that order, but not not necessarily in that order. Um those would be positions that we think we uh could could get some good value out of for sure. >> And so that would be uh were we able to
do that this year, but also subsequent years. >> Oh, yeah. Yeah. and and and a couple of those maybe all of them were in my head last year and maybe yeah it's just a question of >> time comes definitely >> yeah we we'll fill the holes with who we got until we can uh spread out a little
bit yeah >> I I just have one comment on that so um Tom won't be surprised by this but if we were be so fortunate to have a part-time zoning enforcement officer I would ask that the majority of their time be
designated to evening hours. >> Yeah. >> With sometime obviously office hours which would be during the day. But I often hear that they are unable to identify a zoning violation because
after hours and they're unable to get to certain violations because it's after hours. So I just want to make it as productive and efficient as possible. So I just give that as a suggestion and you do with it you can c what you can.
>> Thank you. That is a suggestion that has been made and uh I think that's probably a direction we would prefer to go in. >> And I just have one more thing. So when you sent out the policies, thank you very very much. And as someone that's not been in involved with this as
everyone else, >> that's actually very very proud of our town. >> That's nice. the policies that you've put into place and then to actually see the numbers >> and how the goals have been attained and gone beyond
very nice to see the policies followed and how they're you know how they're followed and and the success that you've had. So congratulations to all of you. >> Thanks. >> A lot obviously a lot of that has to do with him. Um, but I've said it in a
bunch of council meetings as well. Yeah, >> if if the council is also not on board with our operational policies, we can't do it either. So, it really is a huge team effort and the fact that we're following these and having such success doing it. I appreciate you saying that, Russ.
>> And just the one that really, you know, popped out at me was the OPED funding. Uh, Jim Brick will know that appropriations pushed for that many years ago. And just to see it continued being put in was spectacular. So well done. >> Thank you.
>> I also want to compliment Tom. I think Kathy and I should feel grateful that one of our graduates can write this. WELL, >> KATHY, >> WELL, I I would like to be on the record to say that when Tom was in my English class, he was a very good writer for an
eighth grader. >> I still am a very good writer for an eighth grader. Okay. Um, >> so the net school spending, uh, that is the historical of the amount that the town is paying, not the not not the
minimum amount that the town that the state requires. Correct. >> Okay. So, we're running we're running uh actually it's gone down a little bit from over the years, but roughly 2/3 60% to 2/3 of the budget when it's all said and
done. >> Any comments on that? >> Do we have bigger communities that we look at for things like that? >> Uh not officially. Uh it's a function of just the operation. Uh the state has a
uh net school spending requirement and they sort of crunch all this data every year which is why we have uh all of our line items in our utility budget because they need to know what schools are spending as opposed to the town. And um we sort of look at what our net school
spending is compared to some of our surrounding communities to see where we are. But most communities of our size and and uh you know the the the stress that we would put on education would be up around the 130 130% of that net
school spending number. >> Uh that that that's fairly uh fairly reasonable I would think. Again this is a calculation that we only do for the school because the state requires it >> right. we would also have some sort of
or could have some sort of you know every department uses all the other departments in the same fashion, right? So, uh it's just a a we have the data so we we kind of look at it to see where we're at. >> So, the state doesn't uh produce reports
by for all towns in terms of its net school spending versus Okay. So, one could look at >> Yep. Are we >> They're all They're all there. >> Just a local >> Yep. Those two tabs. Well, not tabs, the two pages that has the chart and then the required spending, the net school
spending. That's part of a spreadsheet that if you go on to Desi, >> okay, >> you can pick each individual town and it'll give you the same exact information for everyone. >> And I'm sorry, I I'm not sure I understood what the 130% >> was. I'm sorry that that's our we're required to spend this much. We spend
>> 130 30% over. >> Yes. >> Yeah. All right. And when you have looked at area communities or at least communities that have primarily the same amount of population, >> do you find that it's similar or
drastically different? >> Uh fairly similar. Uh I think like for instance, I think Long Meadows number is is north of 130. Um, and I think it's hard to say, but Wilberham, the regional is right around the same, but they have a different sort of calculation. Yeah, I
mean that it's not uh it's it's pretty average, pretty pretty common. >> At least it hasn't been changing much. >> Well, I again, I think we've been just trying to make sure we're doing everything efficiently, right? Um, >> all right. Uh, next item was Santic
Valley. And I know Russ, you had you >> I have a couple questions when we get to that if unless you want to do it now. >> Um I don't see why not. >> Yep. >> So in the notes >> under can't remember what page, but it
says you put 3% a year >> away% >> you make an additional 3% contribution. Is that two >> not a contribution? So over the past couple years, I mean since I've started here, so few years, um, Scantic Valley,
I think one year they did absolutely no increase and they subsidized the entire increase and then the next year it was like half of half of the increase. And we're watching all of these get subsidized and at some point we're going
to see a 20 30% increase. So rather than reduce our budgets down to what they told us, we put a 3 to 6% cushion into the budget so that next year when we needed to set the budget for health insurance, it would only be a 6%
increase versus a 12% increase to our actual budget. That money in turn rolled back into the general fund and became part of free cash. >> So the employees were not contributing to that. these typically general fund dollars that went in to that.
>> Yeah. >> What is Scantex current reserve? >> I I don't know what that number is right at this point in time. Um I I mean I can get it for you, but I I don't have that. >> What was your question, Russ? I didn't
>> What was Valley's what >> reserve? They have a trust and you spend it down and you should have a reserve. I mean, they had anticipated that their reserves would basically be depleted if we continued to do this, >> but every year they've been coming in
better than anticipated. So, we've never gotten to that point. This I think this was the point that they were looking at. They didn't want to use any more than they did because of that concern. >> So, help. So, I do a lot of this work
for 15 other communities, so I I have some experience in it. Mhm. >> So you put the calculated rate was like 18% something in the forming sense. >> I think it was 17% >> 17. Yeah. Yeah. >> But you finally got it down to was it 14
>> 11 >> 11.2 that was with that was with the subsid >> that was with the >> Yeah. Yeah. Okay. >> And it's not really scantic subsidizing. You're subsidizing. >> Well it's like two layers of >> members of the trust, right? Yeah.
And then the other thing on the sheet I noticed that uh in 26 it went down 2.9 million. The year before it went down 2 almost 2.7. >> Mhm. >> So those are reserves being drawn down by the trust to make you to make the
trust whole for the year. >> They're they're being drawn down to subsidize that increase for us. Yes. >> I I want to say the number that sits in my head is about 5.9 is what they want to have. >> Yeah. in their reserve and with these
drawdowns that's what they anticipated they they would be able to hold on to. So it wasn't like they were drawing down beyond what their anticipated um target was. >> And you did say they got rid of GLPS for >> they did. >> Yeah.
>> So have you given some consideration of going back to the unions and adjusting their contribution rates? Uh, you mean the 7030 >> split? Yeah. >> Yeah. Uh, yeah. No. Uh, I only say that
because, uh, 7030 is actually poor. Uh, we're we're on the lower side of that. Most everybody is at 7525 or above. Um, that benefit is is is less than most communities.
Oh, >> so uh I mean Russ has done a great job of asking these questions, but I was stunned by the substantial amount of the deficits that uh Santic Valley. So you were saying, Kim, they're still making surpluses from year to year. Is that why
it's just not like totally falling out? Uh but I would be curious as to what the reserve what the reserve amount would be. Uh, and this kind of seems to be masking the issue, which if once we get to a 5.9, what are we
talking about for year increases that aren't aren't masked by subsidy? >> Uh, that's a good question. >> Yeah, 18% increase. Uh, no, this is there there's speculation that we've sort of plateaued
and with the removal of the GLPs that that things will kind of get back to to normal. But again, that's we have to estimate this stuff and we get the numbers when we get the numbers. >> And I I'm sorry, I'm a GOP
uh >> weight loss drug. Yeah. >> Oh. Oh, Zenac and Yeah. Gold, right? Okay. So, so we we we're probably looking at well over 10% 15% on a on a
ongoing basis. >> Uh if if >> maybe I'd hope not. Like I said, I think they they the the thought is that we've we've plateaued and this increase won't be this >> see the enormous increase. It'll still be the same amount of money for your health insurance,
>> but we'd be back to like a 4% increase every year. >> And does this cover Current employees and retirees. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> In total. >> Yep. And retirees flip to 5050 after
they're eligible for Medicare. >> So the number that we sustain is just going to keep going up. >> Yeah. I mean, we we sort of budget for adding 30 new people a year. Like we don't we don't know how many people are going to come on. We don't know how many people are going to come off. So we try
to make a make a best guess based on our historicals on what >> I can now understand why my employer cut this uh cut this benefit >> many years ago >> that 3 to 6% that you put away you put it into a fund how much do you have in
that >> so we don't put it into a fund it just rolls into free cash so it's part of the free cash number at the end of the year >> so technically then Just technically the town council could expend that for
something other than health insurance. Yes. >> Yes, they could. But it also allows us to keep the budget kind of growing slowly as opposed to all of a sudden next year having to look for
20% for health insurance because that budget's already been accounted for in the previous year. we're just increasing onto it >> and and we're only allowed that certain increase every year, right? So, if we're if we're not getting there and then we
get the 20%, there goes every other increase for every other line item in the budget. >> Thank you. Uh, next was the U ambulance and the calls and the >> I don't know if this answered the
question or not. >> Well done. >> Yeah, the chiefs sort of tried to weigh in as best they could and there's a whole other Westcom element, right? The the dispatchers have their own set of protocols as well. So, uh, yeah, if there's any other uh clarifications or
I'd be happy to >> questions from the committee. Just a couple of things that so the the engine ladder is there is there a reason it's the ladder is that in case there has to be external access to something >> so pro yes but also like everything else
everything needs to be exercised. So even if it it does not necessarily call for the ladder if the ladder hasn't moved in a certain amount of time >> then that's the vehicle that goes out >> to to make sure it's moving. And I was just making to make sure I understood
the the the fire chief said. So if an ambulance and a and a ladder truck are go to the same place, it's just reported as one call, >> right? >> All right. It's just if the police go as well, then they report it as >> then they'll Yes, it'll be a call for them.
>> All right. Uh I think that Yes. Go ahead. So I just wanted to follow up last our last meeting I asked about this uh page two of 52 cap summary >> the best estimated 2027
and so the second >> down page you want to know >> two of 52 >> com said 32 of 52 >> um it says combined over fart to the far right 2
32%. >> Yep. >> So that's school and that's everything. >> That's that's all of it. >> That's all of it. So the total budget is proposed. >> And then the next line down is 1.54 town departments. >> That's general general town
administration, governance, police, fire, DPW, all all the then I go all the way down to the bottom total school three. Now I guess the question I had asked and I I don't recall I don't recall your answer. I don't or I
don't recall you giving an answer. >> Okay. >> Your philosophy >> the philosophy >> behind that going up three and for all intents and purposes the the general town going down 1.54 that's a 4 and a.5% spread. So what's
your what's your philosophy on that? So again, the one the negative 1.54 is a little misleading because we took the money out of the fire, right? So we took $400,000 out of that and sort of put, you know, when we did the fire and the ambulance.
>> Okay. >> So that that actually ends up being closer to three >> two. >> So when we start the budget, >> okay, >> that's the number the 3% is really where we that's like our high water mark, so to speak. if you two and a half percent
for for um for by regulation and then our our um new growth ends up being about 3%. So that's where we start. >> Okay. >> And 3% is number that we we try to make sure we're under.
>> Okay. Thanks. >> Yeah. So I think in that case you would see on the draft column for 2027 it was at three and when in your level one when you made the adjustments that's when it starts to flip there. >> Yeah. >> Okay. Um thank you uh Tom.
So, I'm thinking uh let's just deal with six and seven for a moment because then that'll leave us all the rest of our time to talk about budgets uh and determine schedule a review of other components of the budget. It's kind of
toying with that and um you know in the same vein where's my cheat sheet? you know, if we if we do the town departments uh today and if we can keep
going on, we can always look at the town general fund accounts as well. Um, and we've kind of reviewed the reserve policy at least in in terms of uh I don't know that there's a lot to talk about it. Uh I don't think there's too
much objection to it. If we looked at 423, our third meeting as uh looking at the capital plan, revolving funds, and enterprise funds, um >> Mhm. >> that would kind of cover most of the rest of the budget with the exception of
schools. >> And then if we used the schools, uh the 427 for the schools, whatever time in excess of that we had, we could wrap up whatever we didn't get to. >> Uh and then it would leave uh me
as any finalizations, but really to finalize our recommendations for the town for the town council. Does that >> make sense? >> Good plan. >> Did I Did I miss any major groups that we should be reviewing? >> Say capital plan, enterprise, and
revolving accounts. Correct. >> Yeah, that okay. >> Should be the bulk of it. Um and uh I will send out an invitation I assume to the chair and the superintendent uh >> about the uh meeting on 427. Okay. Then
at that point why don't we move to number go back to number five on the agenda review town department budgets. And >> I have a general question Mr. Chair. >> Yes sir. Um, Tommy Kim, when I was going through the budget line items on the
notes, I saw the term pretty consistently classification study. What do you mean by that, the classification study? So, that we did a the town did a uh wage and classification study for the um non-UN personnel. >> And so, there were some adjustments that
were made based on that. Most of them uh I think it was just a general note that sort of got added, right? But most didn't see any more of an increase than what was in the policy. >> Okay. >> Um there were a couple that uh were were not at the minimum of what what the
study came out with. So we had to do some large increases which I think you'll see. Uh they'll probably be pretty obvious, but for the most part that was just a note to to let everybody know what our new policy was. >> Okay. >> Good question, Rich. And and how often
is a classification study done? >> Kind of depends on the the economics of it, but 7 to 10 years you have to sort of >> So we're we're bearing the onetime adjustment costs in this year's budget, but we wouldn't anticipate that kind of adjustment
>> and carry forward for next year and the year after. And it's not uh it's not really a budget adjustment because we added money in the budget for these adjustments last year. My account uh when we get to it the the um reserve
fund we put money in that has now been sort of metriculated to the places it was supposed to go. We sort of estimated how much more we thought we were going to have to move some places. So the percentages will be different as that money got moved to a different line item, but the
amount of money is is the same as last year because we budgeted for it last year. >> And these are just at willill employees. >> Yep. >> So where where was the money that >> it was in the reserve fund? So if you look at uh the reserve fund line which
is >> it's right under town manager. >> It's right under town manager. >> Exactly. Yeah. >> So last year >> 35,000. >> Yeah. Last year the budget was 145,000 >> and now it's back down to 110 where it's historically been.
>> That 35,000 is in the other budgets >> cuz we moved it there this year. >> So that's what's absorbing some of that. Yeah. >> So, this is like that conversation we've had in past years where the the budget number looks the percentage looks
different. It's because we've revised budgets inside the budget, but the the computer program the computer program won't let you change. Munis won't let you change it. So the the percentage looks weird, but if you look at the revised budget, that's more appropriate
cuz the budget was res revised inside the year from after it was approved. >> Um, as we go through and it's almost time for your new software or something. >> There isn't one. as we uh go through this um why just
yell out if we you have a question that you want to and uh if you don't so town council budget >> looking good as usual >> anyway just for clarification what page are we on >> 16
>> I'm looking at 16 the one with the notes uh got Kathy >> y >> just a general question Before we get into that, I was at a town council meeting maybe within the last eight months or so uh for a for a planning board matter.
Town council discussed putting salaries >> um online >> online. Did you ever do that? >> It's been done >> under the transparency tab. >> And it continues to be updated as we >> make changes. >> Yeah.
Okay. Uh, town council questions on the town council budget. >> Can we get a raise? >> Town manager questions on the town manager budget. >> You're going to get a raise. >> And my question was the classification
study, so I don't have it now. Uh, reserve fund transfer. Uh, kind of explained that. Any questions on the reserve fund? >> No. accounting 6.54%
increase. Uh a lot of that is contract increases and classification study. Um any questions? >> Can I just ask a general question? >> And did anyone put did a department head put something in to reduce their budget
that you thought don't do that? Like >> I don't think so. >> No, not not usually a reduction. We don't see too many of those. >> No, >> no, no, no. >> You know, I So I, you know, I read the reminder and it says, you know, stern warning, put in this budget, you know,
request. >> Yeah. >> You know, just anything just pop out that you just said no and changed it. >> Nope. Okay. >> Not not not that not that way necessarily. uh they're they're they're still like this uh the one that we see the most is uh the one-time purchases
that don't make it into the capital plan like the 12 $13,000 varieties and that sort of messes with the budget. So, we try to find another way to make those one-time purchases rather than carrying them in the budget for the whole year. >> Okay. >> Uh any other questions regarding
accounting? >> No. All right. Uh assessors, any questions on assessors? >> Are we in a reassessment period? >> No. >> 28 uh 28 budget will carry that. And
again, it probably won't because we'll look at that as a one-time and we'll pay for that outside of operations. >> Okay. Uh treasure and collector got a lot of internal
shifting. >> Yep. >> Uh any questions on treasure collector? Okay. >> I I have to say that comments really help. >> Oh, they do. >> Very much so. >> Very much so. Otherwise, you would just be asking these every single time.
>> Another another great idea, Ken. >> Thank you. They're coded in everything. >> I I I guess I will ask the question just because I'm a pain in the neck as a question, but given what I've read in the reminder about the issues at the
police department, have we done any type of audit to make sure that everybody is paid what they're supposed to be paid? >> Yes. >> Okay. that that is on a schedule now in HR and it obviously happens with all new employ new new hires the whole bit. So
that that not just that department any other department that would have something like that that would there would be an audit schedule for all of that moving forward. >> Thanks. >> Yep. >> Uh legal services
>> I I was surprised to see that there would be a decrease there in a world of litigation. Yes. Uh yeah, we we've been the the decreases if you look at the we're we're assessing an um um a
treasure collector. >> Uh we have most of our sort of processes in place that don't really require a lot of work from the legal team. >> And so uh a couple years ago, I grabbed all the legal accounts that these used to be carried in the individual
department's budgets. I didn't want anybody having access to an attorney without me knowing about it. So, uh that came here and we just haven't been using those accounts and I don't think historically they did in their uh when they were in their accounts either. So, we've just dropped that number down that
from 10,000 to 5,000 for both of those. >> Any other questions on legal services? Uh human resources This was one of those bigger jumps based on the the classification study. Yeah. >> Right. And what the increase uh the
5,000 increase for national search for new hires that is that like a new new thing that you're Yes. >> initiating? >> Yep. Uh and the reason is uh we have uh historically only been doing background checks in Massachusetts and
uh a lot of our employees live in Connecticut. Um, and so we've sort of expanded this to for a full background check with with our new employees. >> So it's not actually recruiting, it's background checks, >> right? So So we can search more than the
Massachusetts database, which, you know, kind of makes sense since we're on the border. >> And so that'll be an ongoing >> Yep. >> cost. Okay. Any other questions? So this department had quite a
substantial adjustment due to the classification study >> and that >> yeah it wasn't uh necessarily unseen. I think that was one of the big ones we expected to jump in when we budgeted that extra money last year before the results of that came out. We just have a
a young HR department. >> And I don't mean that by the people in it. I mean, we've only had HR for six or seven years now, and we're we're just starting to get up to this point where uh we have a lot of we're doing a lot of things that that everyone does, but we
just are just getting there. >> Uh any other questions on human resources? Okay. Uh information technology. >> Just an interesting question. What is a COA COA bridge one? What the hell is that? Council of Aging Bridge
Intelligent. >> Do you remember? >> Yes. >> Okay. >> Very. >> No. Uh the phone. So when somebody calls in, they have uh the the AI either respond to them or text them back to let them know if the center's open or what
programs or whatever. So >> yeah. >> So this is specifically for council on a >> correct. We're we're we'll sort of see what what other benefits there are to that >> in the program across the board. >> Bridge AI. What is that? >> It's just the name of the the software. >> All right.
>> Thank you. >> And all of the software across departments was moved into it so that he could better manage um all of the different departments possibly using the same software. So that's why you're seeing COA in there. So Jim, if we could just while we're on
it. So one of the hopeful additional positions in it, do you want to explain a little bit about that request? >> Yeah. Uh again, the not so much the age of the department like I was talking about HR, the the technology boom has
been crazy in the last 5 years in particular. Uh they're just they're swamped. They're ticketed all day. Um, in fact, when we looked for places to move everybody when they were moving the school, it doesn't need anywhere to go because nobody ever sits at their desk.
Um, they they're just they're they're straight out. Um, and they could benefit from another uh supervisory sort of position for sure. That's sort of how all our other departments are structured. Uh, there's a department
head and a deputy. Uh, and so it makes it makes sense. The the workload I don't think is going to get any lighter for it anytime soon. >> So it's more matter of giving Ryan as the director some relief, not
necessarily the people are going out to the >> It would it would it would be probably in in numerous areas, right? Like yes, there's that that relief on the top where you have somebody else sort of doing that high level stuff, but just
another more boots on the ground um in that department from from a work work output standpoint would be helpful. >> Does does his budget include the maintenance contracts or is that somewhere else? >> Maintenance of what? >> Software blah blah blah.
>> Yeah, that's all. It's all got everything. Um, I'm pleased to see it's only a 3%. >> Yeah. No, that was uh I was when when the number when I'm waiting for the numbers to come in, this is one that I'm always amazed both ways whether it's low or high. It's
hard to tell from any given year what's going to happen. >> And again, we're beholden to these Googles and Munis and really So you you said it be Ralph. I think you just said change the software. Everybody has their complaints with Munis, but there's
really there's only a couple other options and nobody knows that. And so to change everybody like everybody a fullscale change on accounting software is a is tremendous roll out. >> I remember when Ununice was rolled in.
>> Yeah. >> And it's not I mean we have looked at other options we've um but they're very very pricey like even compared to Nunas. >> Yeah. So, where is the town on rolling out or in AI and what it can do for your
functions? >> Yes, >> no comment. >> I work My company has 22,000 employees. Everyone has access to AI. >> We currently have 70% participation in 6
months. Now, I know it's different. It's >> 70% participation on what? in AI use of AI. >> Wow. >> But when you when you say access to AI, what specifically are you just talking >> Claude to use? >> Okay. So like similar to chat GPT
>> that's one model. Yeah. >> Okay. >> Yeah. And you know it's been in place six months and you know we're a transactional business. So I mean you know police might use it for investigations and fire. I don't know what they would use it for, but I don't
know how it would Well, I guess the question is just very very basic. Have you at least started looking? Are you aware of other communities that have started looking actually implementing? And so where might you be in the whole
time frame? So at the beginning stages, obviously Council on Aging has their thing, but um in terms of a townwide, so almost every other email I get from MMA is a webinar on AI. >> Yeah.
>> Right. And so I think actually Lynn Simmons and Long Meadow hosted one like last month. >> Um we we know we're going to have to integrate and this is just where we're headed. So, we've we've been talking about this both at the human resource
level and at the upper management level about what we're going to have to have some sort of policy and then Ryan's going to have to we have a secure network. So, we can't just be allowing share sharing of information like that. So, uh it's there's a lot of hoops to
jump through when it comes to AI and a municipality. >> Um but yes, we're having the conversations. I just don't I couldn't even tell you what the timeline is, >> perfectly honest. >> But I I I don't You're right. There's no reason for us not to be looking into it because >> But you haven't put your head in the
hole. You're you're looking. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Okay. If I can just add to that, I recall at either when the schools were before us for other things or or I watched it in one of their um meetings that um
obviously because students are very adept at software uses particularly now with the advent of AI that they too are struggling to create reasonable parameters for how AI can be used
responsibly by staff and students. So, everybody's >> wrestling with it. >> Just as you know, I'm in the legal department of my company. We don't use AI >> because we often have found that it's not correct all correct all the time,
but other transactional nature of our business, it's used on a daily basis, saving time. Yeah, >> I would say that that's probably the one time the kind of the situations where people in the accounting department have tried to use AI and the information that
they get that is related to like mass general law is typically not correct. >> I know. >> So >> that's why we don't use it. >> Like I think it's good to use as a tool to maybe rewrite something like if you're rewriting a motion or rewriting a policy or something like that, but I think in terms of investigative it's not
there yet. >> Yeah. It's not going to be for everybody. >> Yeah, >> I understand. But just the fact that you're it's on your radar screen is a positive thing. >> Thank you, Jim. >> Jim. >> Yep. No, good question. >> Quick question on the IT budget back back to actually the IT the $5,000
reduction in salary. Was that because we brought someone a new person in and they were paid a little bit less or that's in black in the notes. >> Say it says salaries. 5,000 reduction in other salaries. I was just curious if
that's just it brought >> Oh, the other salaries is the um um the interns. >> Oh, yeah. Yeah, it was >> interns. >> Yeah. >> Yep. >> That answers it.
>> The one question I >> That's good. The one question I have about it, um, even though it's good that the software cost hasn't increased, you know, a ton this year, could we get a list of what all the different software products and
how much each one of them costs the town? >> Absolutely. >> Is there still discussion of fiber optics or is that kind of gone by the boards? uh for the town >> still still a discussion >> soon.
>> It is. >> All right. Other questions on information technology. >> Moving on uh to town council town and council clerk's office. No.
>> Any questions on that budget? >> Nope. >> All right. Uh elections. >> We have three this year, Miss Sullivan. >> Yes, we do. >> Ah, >> town, state, >> town, and state. >> State.
>> So, I wasn't quite sure I understood that. Rely on FC free cash for two slash4year elections. So, this is a more of a philosophical question. Uh, because the >> is it >> the election budget goes all over the
place. Every two years, every four years. Um, it's it's been our thought that when we get to like every five years, the assessor's budget jumps $50,000 because we do our full assessment. And so rather than put
that in the budget curve, which is so tight that we would pay for some of these things out of free cash, it's it's, you know, tax money that we can just use to do what we're calling a one-time expense that happens every two years, which is where sort of the the
logic breaks down a little. But um last year we took out uh I think we've been budgeting for a preliminary election for the local election for 10 years and we only had the one. So we kind of got that out of their thinking. If we ended up with a preliminary
election for one of our elections, we'd have to pay for it from free cash. So again, uh this is our way of taking the the up and down out of the budget and just leaving our election in there and whatever year, whatever expenses
happen, depending on how many elections we have that year, we just make a free cash transfer to pay for them. Uh that's how this got submitted. Um obviously open to discussion. >> Uh go ahead, Marilyn. >> Well, I just have a quick question. Is there would there be any benefit or has anyone talked about
uh pseudo reserve fund? Put some money in the the election budget reserve knowing that in two years it may be more. I mean just put some money aside so that when it's time to add it into the budget, you already have it. It's just in an account somewhere.
>> You mean like a >> reserve B, reserve C, whatever. Reserve election. >> Uh we Yeah, we >> complicated. >> No, it's not. We we could certainly do that, but I I would think for the amount of money that we're talking, we could just use the free cash account because our policy is good and our balance is
healthy that >> it would just be easy to just pull from free rather than set up the accounting to create an an account. Although, >> right. Okay. >> It would make sense that it was labeled for elections when we pulled it out of there, right? But, uh I think it would just be easier to to make a free cash.
Okay. kind of my discussion with that 3 to 6% you're putting away for future health insurance increase >> future right >> so it's in that account you can't >> you know it's only >> only used for that that period >> I mean you could do you know you could
do that either way >> who knows who's going to be on the town council and you know if you put it aside in that specific account it's only going to be used for that period >> right and the and the real intention with that is just to not have the big
increase. >> Yeah. >> Put it aside and it's only used for >> used for that. >> Can I ask what a typical election cost? >> They like 16. >> Yeah. >> Like 16,000,000 per election.
>> Yeah. >> Uh obviously >> four years you have two additional, right? >> Y >> and every two years. >> Two years you Yeah. There there's one every an additional one every two and then the fourth year >> on the presidential year. >> Yeah. Then you have the early voting
which adds up, you know. >> Yeah. Well, that that's certainly been a a strain on this account with all the parameters of elections in Massachusetts that are everywhere really. But >> so I I understand what you're doing and I kind of agree with it. Although I like
>> that's where we're at. Kind of agree. like uh Russ's idea about the reserve for some of the bigger ones like the health insurance and I I wonder whether that would apply to the you know the reassessment every 3 years as well depending on how substantial that that
is cuz then you could at least just if you had a place to put it so it didn't get disappear you could you could still stabilize your budget but but not have to rely on the one time each time grabbing it out of free cash but So
>> yeah, but like for the assessment one, like it's not there in the budget this year. So when we have to put it in, where where are we taking it from? >> Well, >> where how are we building that account? >> You would somehow have to fund a
reserve, fund a some kind of syncing fund or whatever. Well, we're we are funding that reserve and free cash whenever we roll back anything and then we just use that money to >> I think another way to kind of look at it before you switched your form of government
>> when we had a board of select men and town meeting there was always a motion for those items. There was always a motion for your assessment and it was every 5 years there would be just one motion that was read at town meeting that said, "Hey, it's going to be $50,000. We're going to use free cash or we're going to raise and appropriate
it." it was always really outside of the budget and there were a few things that were kind of done that way. Elections would have been done that way. Um, celebration funds were done that way and all of these things. When you when we kind of switched over to this form of
government, they just started rolling into the budgets. One of the issues that we saw with that was when it was rolled into the budget, it would roll from year to year to year and never get closed out. So all of a sudden you had 50, 100, 150,000 sitting in a general fund PO that shouldn't have been there. So
that's why we, you know, one of the reasons for saying let's just remove it out of the budget. But I feel like you're getting the same impact by doing it this way. It was always going to come from free cash or it was going to come from raise and appropriate right outside of the budget. It's just we're kind of doing it with a different mechanism, I
guess. And you know, I mean, we can do these things where we create, you know, 53 and a half accounts, but they're part of your bylaw. So, every time you want to create one of those accounts, >> change your bylaw, you have to add them into the bylaw, and then every year, town council then has to vote. It's a
lot of >> administrative work for not a lot of return, I guess. Are there any other thoughts questions about >> So what I was going to say is one of the things that we've done over the last five eight years is we had all these
little accounts for all these little things and we've tried to wipe out most of those and get them centralized into one budget because we had money just sitting in these little accounts that you just didn't even know where they were. beautifification account and this
and that and it was like >> yeah I mean over the past three years I think I've closed out between 250 to 400,000 every year of >> really >> just old accounts. Yeah. >> Well said, Kim. >> All right. Thank you. The only thought I
have on it is I think for like the ones that hard to predict like is there going to be a you know town primary or something like those make total sense to not be in the budget just paid out of free cash or something if it comes out.
But to me like if if we know that every 2 years we need to budget for something to me that should be part of the budget. I don't think we should try to like work around funding that separately because that's a known occurrence. >> Yeah. No, again, the the the logic is
sound until until you look at it from the other way and you're like, you know, this is going to happen, >> but it's there's an impact to the budget sort of cycle when you try to carry it every year. >> Yeah. Yeah. And I mean I get >> if you don't
>> I get it makes it a little variable, but even just from like a public transparency perspective, it would be really hard for anyone in the public to see that well it wasn't in the budget, but we're still doing it. Where did that come from? True. >> We know where it came from, but they wouldn't know that. >> Yeah. >> Well, until the appropriation,
>> right? >> Other comments on the elections? uh planning, zoning, con conservation. >> Well, difficult department to deal with. >> I heard the chick. It'd be really
difficult. Make a change here. >> What is CMF zoning grant? >> What is CMF? >> Uh community mitigation funds from the casino. >> All right. Is that coming from the the
>> that was our >> the grant to this budget >> that there was uh we used money there was a town share sort of thing. >> So anything in blue over there is just showing you the difference between why the original budget increased in the
revised budget. So 6,000 was transferred over from the reserve fund into that account to cover the town's portion. It was transferred into the zoning grant >> in the in the 26 budget.
>> Yeah, that was part of the 26 budget. So the the problem is a a lot of time when you and here we go. Let's get the explanation of the original budget and the revised budget. So the original budget that's gets gets voted for um by
town council is the budget that we always try to compare to because you want to see what h you know what we're increasing compared to that original approved budget. But things roll into that original budget to become the revised budget such as incumbrances from the prior year and they really inflate
your revised budget. And you don't really want to compare to the revised budget with all those prior year expenses in it because then you're going to inflate your current, you know, your next year's budget with all those kind of inflated numbers. So, what I try to show you on here is this is your
original budget, but these blue explanations, if there's a big change between the original budget and the revised budget from last year, that explains to you why that was. >> So, it was just that we used $6,000.26 out of the reserve fund. It rolled into that budget to cover the town's portion
of that grant. >> So it was actually a town cost, not a town benefit. >> It would have been a town cost. So a much bigger benefit from the grant, but that was our portion. >> Questions? Any other questions on
planning, zoning, conservation? So, just one quick, if you go back to the numbers, the numbers are like uh 7,400, but it says 6,000 was a reserve transfer. So, that >> so the additional would have been an incumbrance that rolled through from the
prior year just as >> uh police department 2.08% increase. Quinn bill. >> So obviously the state doesn't kick in anymore. Y >> the Quinn bill is basically um in the
contract and it's strictly the town doing >> um so was that a negotiated increase in the Quinn bill the 35,000? >> Yes. >> In addition to that um originally the Quinn bill was set up that whatever the
town offered the state would match. So, did the entire amount become our responsibility? >> Yes. >> Yep. >> I didn't vote for it when I was on the board of selectment. >> Now, that's a contract. That's a
contractual >> pretty standard obligation. >> Pretty standard. Yep. There we are. >> The 15 to 20% BA. Is that bargaining agreement? >> Uh, bachelors. B. >> Oh, bachelors. Okay. So if I get a bachelor's, my salary
would go up 15 to 20%. >> That's the the educational incentive. >> Yes. >> Wow. They're contract. >> Wow. >> Teachers >> for for an officer, let's say a six-year patrolman,
what's the percentage add-on to their salary for bachelors? And then what's the percentage add-on for the for the Quinn bills? So, so this is the the sort of getting everybody to the same place, right? There's a before and after
date. >> If if you were hired here, it's 25, 20, and 10. >> If you're hired after, you only got half of that because the state stopped paying, >> right? >> And so now the the rest of the unit has
bargained up to that point. They didn't get to 25. They just got to 15 to 20. But the rest of the unit, you got h half the guys or half of the officers are up here and the other half are down here. So they're just trying to get up to where everybody else is.
>> So essentual wage >> if you have a bachelor's degree. And so the town council votes on the approval of the union contracts,
>> uh, the appropriation of the contract. >> So after the contract is basically negotiated and done, we're told that it's going to work up this amount. >> Yeah. >> But are there not, and this is all union contracts, I'm not picking on the
police. So, are there not discussions with the town council, with the town manager about where you want to go on this on these collective bargaining agreements? >> Are you giving >> Not at the moment. There hasn't
>> Are you giving direction? Are you giving direction? I know he may not he or she may not always get to what they want, but are you not giving direction, >> Connor? As president, you Yeah. And implicitly,
>> you know, >> it's definitely an area for opportunity on both sides of the equation. It's often not something that we see have enough information about until it's too late. >> That sounds like an AI answer.
>> It was very well done. Yeah, >> but I don't understand that. >> Not enough information until it's too late. What exactly does that mean? >> Well, it's never too late, right? The the >> Well, he just said until it's too late. >> Well, there doesn't have to be a
positive vote. And if there's not a positive vote, then I have to go back to the negotiation table. That's all. >> It's never written in stone until it's voted on. >> We don't have to approve it. >> You have share responsibility to negotiate. Correct. As a town manager, right?
>> Okay. Yeah. But I'm sure he takes some advice and counsel counsel. >> Well, again, I would and certainly do. >> Uh we're we're we're negotiating in good faith to keep everybody >> fairly where they should be, right?
People deserve to be rewarded and compensated for their work. >> No doubt. >> They also have to realize that we have a big picture budget to worry about. >> No doubt. >> This contract isn't the only one. Right. This is how >> That's why I said I'm not honest on the police. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah.
>> Okay. Thanks. >> Other questions on the police department budget? >> Okay. >> Are we are we fully staffed there, Tom? >> Uh yes. >> Okay. >> Uh
we >> we don't have any vacancies. >> Nope. Uh I believe it was just filled. Uh, somebody will be going to the academy >> soon. >> Soon. >> Okay. >> Yes.
>> Okay. We'll move on to our next page. Fire department minus 11% and this has to do with the ambulance fund or >> Yeah. Yep. This is that sort of reorganization of cost and uh revenue.
Yeah. >> And and the 56,000 free cash transfer that was assumed. Is there is there budget negotiations coming up in 2017? >> They happened uh in 20 last year. >> So
>> that was the increase to fiscal 26 >> for the budget. >> What is IOD? Injured on duty. >> Injured on duty. >> Duty. Oh, >> okay. >> Say that again. >> Injured on duty. >> Injured on duty. >> Thank you. >> You're asking. >> Start writing things out.
>> Yeah. A lot of anagrams. Acronyms. What are they? >> Acronyms. Damn it. >> Sorry. See what I did? You called me a good writer and I said anagrams. >> Initialisms. >> Sometimes they're initialisms. Good point.
>> Other qu questions on the fire department. >> A general question. How many um collective bar agreements do we have step increases in? >> I know the teachers teachers I know all that but town side >> almost almost all of them have some sort
of escalator whether that's um positional uh meaning >> I'm talking years of service steps. >> Oh >> in the teachers contract you year two to three you get a step increase. three to four, you get a step increase >> plus your negotiated
>> contractual agreement, >> right? >> So, how many of those do we have on the town side? >> How many steps are in each contract or how many contracts have steps? >> How many contracts have steps? >> Oh, and what is the basic percentage of increase for for steps or
>> two and a half? >> Two and a half. It's about two and a half. >> So, if they negotiate at 3%, >> many people are really getting 5 and a half%. >> Right. >> Yes. If they're still on the scale. >> If they're still on the scale. >> And do we know the percentage of people
still on scale versus offscale? >> Wow. Russ, a lot of heavyhitting questions. >> Good question. >> I mean, that's what drives the retirement cost down the road. >> Yep. >> I figured I'd ask. >> As I said, I'm opinion.
>> Still on the steps. Probably 80% are still on the scale. um they had done uh at well for instance I I think the town hall employees had done a study 8 years ago to sort of get their scale
set up where where it should be. Um >> so yeah I mean most everybody's still on there um and then yeah after you get off the scale it's just the cost of living adjustment that's negotiated. >> Thank you.
So it's the step increase plus the annual increase. >> Yeah. >> So we're still we're still doing we're still kind of over >> some of them are are sort of annual. A lot of them are um
you know fire departments two to fouryear uh there's a uh three steps at DPW but then you have uh skilled worker foreman uh operator there there's a lot of different it's not like steps like
everybody just gets this increase every year. It all kind of depends on the the contracts are all have their own nuances on how they award. >> Yes, they do. Then when you go >> different percentages at different times, >> you love spreadsheets. >> And then I I noticed one of the
comments. So So offscale, we still have longevity payments in some of those. >> Yep. >> Yep. >> So when all is said and done, if there's if the overall cost of living is 3%, general salary increase, let's say, is 3%.
The general average amount of increase for a town employee is going to be in excess of 3%. >> It's going to be 5 and a half%. >> Yeah. I mean, no, nobody's like right now, I think the biggest jump for any of the contracts is five. >> Um, I think you've brought that up in in
subsequent years on the >> previous year. >> Yeah. Um but we've we've been sort of imploring everyone that um you know we just did the wage and class study which went to down to a 2% cola. It's not necessarily in line with the times and
the economy right now but we're all struggling and we've been negotiating this cola down to two um uh trying to let everybody understand that >> that's two in addition to step increase. Oh, yeah. So, contracts, uh, everybody
has these contracts, right? They're they're there's this stuff that's in them, and they're in all of them. And all the police departments have the Quinn bill in it, and all the officers that aren't on the Quinn bill. >> So, there's not any movement among municipalities to try to make
adjustments to the whole step concept. >> That would be a large undertaking. >> It would be more than what could be done by one town. >> Yes. So, so whoever starts this trend will inevitably lose some employees immediately to towns that offer the benefits that we don't offer anymore.
>> Um, >> I think Connor just mentioned transparency. So, when the teachers claim, oh, we only got a 3%. Well, 80% of you really got 5 and a half%. Just full trans. >> Well, my numbers weren't necessarily on the school side, but
>> but as an example, and no offense to anybody, they negotiated it. Yeah. >> Are there questions on the fire department, >> building department >> question? >> Yes. >> Um Tom, it's skipping over dispatches. Building department, highway, building
facilities, that all under the DPW. >> So starting at highway is all DPW. >> Okay. >> Except for trash collection. So those ones got numbered weird. So trash is actually uh administered by the health department. That's curbside. And the waste collection is DPW. That's the
transfer station. >> Okay. >> The building department, that's the inspector. >> Yep. >> Yeah. So, so there's a the building facilities is DPW. This this next one, building department is the is the building department, >> of course. >> Questions? >> All right. >> Uh, one question.
>> Yeah, sure. >> Um, knowing that our building commissioner, we now have a vacancy, do you expect that the salary would increase or stay the same or decrease? Uh, it's probably going to go up, but I don't I don't know. Uh, we'll have to do
some interviews and see what um that that's a hard one to fill. It was a hard one last time. It was a hard one before that. >> Um, and again, with our robust uh zoning enforcement uh that that that position has to take
care of, it it's not just the building inspector. It's not even close to just the building inspector. Um that's a there's a lot to do there. So um >> which brings up the question if we are fortunate enough to have a part-time zoning enforcement officer y
>> what happens to the building commissioner's >> you know salary based on the fact that that those duties are now no longer >> or hers. >> Interesting point. They still would be because he would still be the zoning enforcement officer or they would just be
>> another employee that could go do the inspections. They'd still have to write the letters and stamp the letters and make the determination >> unless you change the bylaw. >> Unless we change the bylaw also. >> We could make Ralph the enforcement arm. >> No, thank you.
>> That sounds all right. I >> hope for that. >> I do. >> You'd get us in shape. >> I think Ralph and Russ would be the dynamic duo. >> Oh, no. Thank you. >> RNR RNR Enterprises. There you go. >> Building department looks good. Next.
Next. >> Okay. Any other questions on building department? Uh we'll move on to dispatch. >> A general comment on DPW over the winter. Kudos to them. >> Really? >> Oh, they did a nice job. >> It was a really hard winter. They did a nice job.
>> Yeah, it was a lot going on. >> Yeah. So on the dispatch, >> yeah, >> um including sheriff, >> meaning the sheriff's department now being part of Westcom or meaning what are we talking about?
>> So the sheriff's department, it was a contractual member of Westcom, meaning they had contributed last year to pick up some of their dispatch. uh they want to join the organization
and so when they do this money that they will be putting into the organization will sort of help with our cost >> help with our cost. >> However, I'm sure you've seen in the news that the sheriff um >> treasure >> bud budget is like kind of in flux and
they're talking about some cuts. So, uh, this may be a line item that moves a little bit depending on, uh, what that impact is. I think, uh, the sheriff will still need dispatch. Uh, and they're already set up at Westcom. So, in all likelihood, uh, that will stay, but
there there's a potential that our, uh, our share to Westcom may change a little bit based on whatever happens with the sheriff moving forward. >> And is West looking to continue expansion? Is there anyone else in the pipeline or
>> uh we we have been having quite a few meetings uh with with different organizations? Um I I don't want to say too too much, but >> but I'm assuming the new facility >> Yes, >> easily take on additional if we meet. >> Yeah, I think there there's room for
Yeah. up to another eight 10 organizations in that building in that facility. The second floor of the building, only the left side of it is really staffed and has equipment. The whole second half still >> there's a ton a ton a huge opportunity
for communities to join that organization >> and it's really come a long way. >> Glad to see it. >> Yeah. >> Got in when we >> uh any other questions on the dispatch budget? Uh, we'll move on to DPW
Highway. >> I wasn't sure I understood 60,000 removed one over budgeted position. >> Yeah, the the way their salary sheets work, it just lists like multiple laborers or multiple and there was just one too many in there. >> Oh, okay.
>> But we caught it. >> Thank you. >> Good pickup. Did we catch it after we approved the last budget? >> No, it was something they >> something they added into their request. So, it was a decrease from their request.
>> So, 1.16% increase. Any questions? >> Nope. >> Right. Building facilities and uh 3.31% increase. that realistic increase with the cost of
gas and electric going through the roofs. >> Uh we like to think they're all realistic uh estimations. Russ, >> I know what I mean. >> What you mean separate? >> Well, uh the facilities division, as you
know, has had its um difficulties funded uh excuse me, finding people to fill the positions that we budget for. and therefore not spending their budget on the supplies that we give them because there's nobody there to do the work.
>> We finally hired a plumber, which is good news. That position was posted for something like 20 months. Um so that's exciting. Um no, most of this is just sort of um increases to
whatever whatever we've been doing. >> Um >> so I was specifically referring to like utilities. Oh, not in this. >> Oh, yeah. Oh, that's a whole other conversation. >> Another line item. Yeah. >> Well, can we jump to that, Jim? >> All right.
>> We're almost there cuz Sorry, Jim. >> Snow and ice. >> Take the lead. >> Other questions on building facilities? >> Okay. Snow and ice. Any questions on snow and ice? >> So, that's just one that we just keep it just to keep it. And we know like this
past year. I I know that was not anywhere close to covering it. >> Oh, we're at over a half a million was the cost. >> Yeah, we're 430 in the red. >> A little under half a million. >> Yeah, but plus the budget. >> Oh, yeah. Yeah.
>> Yeah. Plus the budget. >> Plus the budget. >> I think we're around 550. >> I thought you were saying what we were over budget. So that is that. >> So that's going to be added on to this >> the taxes for the current >> for this FY27, right?
>> Go ahead. >> Oh, no. We'll typically use we'll transfer money over probably from health insurance because we will have um we should have enough money in the health insurance budget to cover the deficit for Snow. Nice.
>> Oh, there's the third quarter update tomorrow night. We're done here. agenda. >> But what I will say is that typically what Eastong Meadow has always done is they've relied on their health insurance budget to cover their snow and ice
deficits. It has always been the case like you know a lot of towns will just raise it on their recap but we have not done that. We have not added it to the tax rate for the following year. We've relied on money that we already taxed um everybody on. So, >> and that looks like will be the
projection this year. >> Yeah. >> All right. >> So, under snow and ice, if I remember right, there's something in state law where if you increase your budget and then you don't use it the next year, you can't um go up or something there. There was something in
>> Now that you say it that way, I can't remember what it really >> I know there's you're better off underbudgeting than >> budgeting, right? Right. >> Yes, >> that is correct. And you can't reduce your >> basically fills the salt shed. >> Yeah. Right.
>> Not even that anymore. >> Well, yeah, I know. I >> I think the bigger thing is you can't reduce your budget and then um raise it on your tax rate. So, if you were to increase this to the point that you ever wanted to reduce it, then you
>> lose that option. Yeah. >> Same thing, just different way of saying >> Y. >> Any other questions on snow and ice? >> Okay. Uh, town and school utilities. Here we are, Russ. >> Here we are. >> There you go, Russ. >> That's the question. Is this a is this a
realistic >> projection? >> Uh, I think you'll find historically, uh, yes and no. >> Um, you know, a few years ago, we had I mean, prices went out of control and we there was nothing we could do. M >> so just like every account we try to use
our uh historical data to figure it out. Now this year uh we have a new building coming online. >> Mhm. >> Uh that's going to increase the electricity usage uh $600,000.
um which we are planning on sort of subsidizing uh with with our rebates from grid from an all-electric building, which will be nice. And we'll sort of slowly let that bill get onto the uh onto the taxes um
lesser than it would have, right? But um yeah, we're we look at all the data. We're trying to um you know use some of our partnerships um to get better data uh you know we have contracts with um we have a solar
contract we have some contracts with um consultants uh that try to get us these prices that don't move too much. So, the usage uh I think we pretty much know what building what buildings are going to use at this point, but if it's way
hotter or way cooler, those numbers get blown out. So, it it's a difficult one to try to hit. We've been rolling back a lot from this account. So, we are trying to tighten it up and we are sort of looking at other options. Um,
but yeah, I mean, yes, all that to say, yeah, we think this is going to look pretty good with with an extra amount of money from this reserve account that the council set up where this rebate money will go to that will sort of lessen the
blow of the increase of the school into the budget. >> This is the energy stabilization fund that's noted. >> Yeah, that's correct. >> Right. because it is kind of astounding to see the 13% decrease when you got the high school coming on and >> yes increase
>> right and and that's because we we expect that money to come from a different source instead of raising in in the taxes >> I think that makes sense from a usage perspective but like all of the
diesel and gas that we use like now that things have changed in the last two months are we thinking that we could be spending many more thousands of dollars next year >> on all the utilities put together. >> No, just like gas and diesel for all the trucks and police cruisers.
>> Um, we don't we don't we don't see the the hit that you and I see at the pump. Like we we've order we've we've procured gasoline for months through LPVEC um that we use all year. And so there's really not much of a a fluctuation
there. And so whatever whatever the the gas prices are going to be, we we've already got that set, >> right? >> So you've got contracts. >> Yeah. I mean the the most of the buildings now um we we'll have some our
gas contract runs out in I think October. Uh which will >> energy >> negotiate again and get sort of set pricing that we're we're not going to get too many surprises from. We we've really been um
>> concentrating a lot on this utility account and talking with consultants because this is something that uh you really have to be good at to be good at. Um and we don't really have anybody that is good at this on staff in terms of we
can see what our historical usage is and try to hit that number and then it's multiplication, right? But um to to find the trends and purchase 18 months out so that you have a sort of a flat curve. Um these are things that we're working
through and all of our existing contracts uh are coming up this fall. So we're going to really dive into what this looks like moving forward. Both electric and gas. >> So Jim, the energy stabilization fund,
how much did we just put into that? >> We haven't yet. We created the account. >> Okay. >> We get the first rebate check from grid in July of 1.2 million. >> But didn't did the town just uh council just create that? I thought we funded.
>> We didn't put it. There was no appropriation. >> Just created it. >> Just created it. There was no appropriation yet. When when we get the money, >> there will need to be something >> eventually for that. >> Yes. you. So once that money gets deposited, then you'll do an appropriation
for the fiscal 27 budget for the >> And what was the thought process? Do we have a number? >> Yeah. >> 3 340 >> 380 >> 380 >> 380. >> So that 380,000
would go towards the energy on top of uh 1.4, >> right? And >> y >> actually almost >> 800,000 >> correct >> for town utilities. >> Correct. So the the decrease like you said is a little bit misleading because
there will be another 400,000 put into this account after the fiscal year starts. And so the thought is with that amount of money the increase will not be seen in any given year. We'll sort of feather it in. So 3 years from now. So
this year's appropriation would be 380 and then depending on prices, next year would be 280. >> So you won't use all of that. >> Yeah. >> At the at the same time, >> we can we can spread it out so that the increase of the budget is not a big huge impact.
>> Um I have to leave at five. I apologize. Um and so I just want to maybe wrap up a little bit. We have reviewed uh all of page uh 16 is it? And starting
with town council and I would say down to snow and ice. Um and I don't li I didn't note any questions that needed further followup. Nope. Would people feel comfortable in
voting to approve the recommended budgets for those items that run town council through snow and ice utilities because I think we're having kind of a discussion and maybe we want to absorb that.
>> I make a motion to approve the budgets for town snow and ice. Second. >> Uh is there any discussion? Hearing none. Uh all in favor please say I. >> I. >> I. Uh any oppose please say nay. Okay.
>> So Mr. Chair we'll pick up from town school utilities. >> Yes. What I would suggest is our first order of business uh next meeting will be to finish off uh these items and perhaps uh also review the um
>> the well there's there's the other items here of um generally retirement of debt compensation insurance. Yeah, >> there's not that many though. >> No. Uh so we'll start there and then our
our next order of business will be capital plan and if we have to push over to our our next meeting with the reserves and the enterprise funds we can do that. Does that make sense for everybody? Sure. >> Um and I will uh put out an invite to uh
the chair of the school committee and the superintendent for for April 27th. We'll have them come in first. >> Got it. And Right. And any anything else we should with that Ro go ahead. >> And also to Pam Blair considering she
brings all the numbers. >> Oh, sure. I just kind of assumed uh >> she'll get the message >> her along. >> I didn't want to, you know, you usually just go to the >> I served on this committee two years
ago. I believe Ralph appointed me to it. Yes, it was two years ago. And I remember getting from the school department just pages and pages pages of quite honestly numbers that meant absolutely nothing to me. So um I'm wondering
are they do they prepare narratives? Are they how how does it come? Is it just I know you I know they want a number and fit but get a better understanding of >> Yeah, they they usually provide us with
with a bit of a narrative. They're they're not it's not just all numbers for us. We have sort of qualitative sort of conversations about why why why this particular amount of money. >> Does that mean something? Um, yeah. I
mean, I can certainly uh give you whatever I have that they gave us. >> You could do it sooner rather than later. >> And I could do it sooner rather than later. Um, and I can also uh ask the school how they want to present their information and if they can get it to
you in a reasonable amount of time. >> All right. Thank you. Good question. Last year they uh updated they changed the way they had given it to us so it wasn't just a bunch of numbers and it was a lot >> very it was very um straightforward
>> I'd like to see it right >> uh anything else we need to talk about this afternoon if not I would entertain a motion to adjurnn >> so moved >> and is there a second >> second >> uh and any other discussion hearing none
this has to be a roll call Does it? Oh, it doesn't. There's no here. >> Excellent. Uh, all in favor, please say I. >> I. >> I. Any opposed? >> All right. We are now adjourned. >> I make a motion to adjourn the town council special meeting. >> Seconded.
>> Made and seconded. Any further discussion? Seeing none, all those in favor, please say I. >> I. >> Any opposed? Journ. Great.