--------- is if you made it i will call to order the Wednesday April 9th 2025 bean water conservation commission meeting at 6:00 in attendance is Elizabeth Stoen Thomas O'Brien and Megan
Logan jason Gumper and Willerman are not present first order of business is to approve the minutes from the 326 2025 meeting anybody have a chance to look at them yes any questions comments i will entertain a motion to
approve said minutes so moved second all those in favor i Great right next up is an RDA 2025-01 amendment to request for determination of applicability at 199 Densow Road assessor's parcel ID
10-12-2 whether the area and activities depicted are subject to the Wetlands Protection Act and or local bylaw and whether the boundaries of resource areas depicted are accurately delineated applicant is live crossing LLC 118 Brook Haven Drive East L Mass 01028 so
um we just gave the wrong determination when we approved this the last meeting um if you want to look at the staff comments it should have been a negative four not a negative three we just we did the bottom one they basically mean the same thing um just one says it's the
area of work is a buffer zone and negative4 says it's not right and it was it was not yeah so you the positive I think that was your call yeah but positive 2B uh is still incorrect about because we didn't they didn't flag
the wetlands right um there was yeah the minor difference between negative3 and so what is the the protocol reopen it and then yeah re reopen it and then motion to amend the negative3 to make it
then I make a motion to reopen the request for determination of applicability RDA 2025-01 second in favor I I so I'll make a motion for a negative -4 termination
I'm to amend to amend to a negative -4 determination on RDA 2025-01 do I have a second second all those in favor i have to physically close the to close this
yes yes okay okay so I'll make a motion to close the public portion of the meeting for RDA 2025 to 01 second all in favor i I Next on to project monitoring first is enforcement order 2025 to 01
stream alteration at 633 to 759 Summers Road how are you if you guys can just state your name and address for the record that'd be great you want to go no no okay got to state it just write it and then
if you can write it down that'd be awesome you guys want this or leave it here you can leave it there yeah in case anyone wants any other things appreciate it so um want to introduce yourself i'm Ryan Preventure i live at 554 Summers
Road near the Apple Place okay great jim Habberin 346 Pioners Drive great and um which one is the owner of the property in the Okay great um did this did all of this make sense like what we sent you
and what we're asking for i think he's a little confused by it um Okay hey Ryan ryan help him kind of navigate in regard to your letter um I guess there's just a bunch of confusion
for both of us okay when we were talking about putting up the temporary agricultural building for his sheep we were dealing with the building department we found a placement that worked for him we put it there because of the uh previous access that he had to at least walk if he had to because his
rightway is blocked by the gas company the gas company owns that gate that's that crossing for him to be able to get in to feed his animals okay so this was a secondary the primary one they have a rightaway to it so it's blocked you know
40 50% of the time he's got cars or brush from the electrical company clearing the lines and stuff like that so he put the building in relation to where he had at least a walking path to get across this low topography and get to the other side to get to the building if he had to if it was blocked okay and
um we he he was over there removing it shoveling it while we were building the uh we were building the structure i helped him build the structure with a friend of mine and uh I said "We'll help you." I had grabbed three friends we got the thing out of there and put the same thing that was in front of it cuz I
talked to a couple friends that are familiar with drainage and we got the same exact diameter pipes in front of it and put them after it and there was only one before we put two side by side like the ones 800 ft upstream would you say if it's
considered a stream now or stream it's it's a drainage but it probably qualifies as intermittent stream okay so we put the same thing 800 ft away as what was up in front of it so we wouldn't have any problems with keeping up with the flow or anything like that
then we built it up with gravel so he could at least get his truck in there to back up to throw the feed off over the fence to the sheep and I have a kind of a presentation if I don't know who should hand it to kind of navigate through the photos sure to see how all this unfolded and excuse us uh for
you're you're fine you're good for uh Lack of tuxedos yeah it's like lack of knowledge lack of everything okay okay lack the tuxedos oh yeah that too we supposed to I didn't know how to present ourselves you're fine no we're
two guys look totally fine people part of it okay you want to explain any of that so what's the So what what's the first one is this is this the one that's up so that's the um Okay I'll just You're fine you're good this is this is pipe one that
was falling apart and he was walking across it i was walking across I had Kelly Ferdet there artisian well there we were throwing stuff across it like that um and then we said this isn't going to be you know structurally sound for him to be bringing feed in and out of did this go from would this go from
like the road across is that what what this is no no no it I'm just trying to picture it in my head the drainage got it okay the drainage ditch is 45 ft off the road yes so it's I know it's still in the jur town's right away yeah yeah um but
it's 45 ft in and it goes this way so it goes along 83 this way so that's the way the pipe is you'll see the next photo got it okay so then we put those two 24s in because upstream are the same exact um pipes so we want to keep up you know
similarity and flow or whatever like that okay we put in some waddle stab stabilization uh because a friend of ours we had no clue like he came over and helped us kind of map it all out to put them in and stuff like that
and I have a photo of the ones that are in front of it if you want to see it at the drainage that's 800 feet up you replicated it i did oh replicated it so this here is a photo of the gas companies right away um I could show
Alex too okay this is the gas company right away 800 ft um and this is during a this is during the downpour a couple days ago we took the photo oh yeah yeah i have so many photos of it bone dry um but obviously with the rain we had long
meadows yeah and um you know it stops there's no like river in front of it if you walk up up it it's just it comes from the road it comes from Bernie's property and then they have that sheep path or cow path that goes under the road that used to be there when their sheep actually were on
the property that they are on now so there's a tunnel underneath there for the sheep to walk back and forth for the tunnels to walk back and forth that's for this thing but that's the that's what it looks like now um and he's been just coming in to this
gated area passing the feed over opening the gate and yep feeding animals the concern by putting the building there was Jim's not a spring chicken and if something happens to him and there's some you know he's 800 feet away from a gate system that the fire department has
to help him out they can't get to him they won't even be able to make the swing to turn because the gate goes like this and the land goes like this but that's why we put the building in relation to that access so this is infants and eager for the
last care and safety of the animals yeah that's all the property he's doing is he's far he's using it for his sheep that's it there's no land and just portions of this his drainage ditch
are already covered up the 800 ft in front of it are the same exact thing we did a better job i mean there's fabric in there there's erosion control the other one's just like two pipes pllopped in the mud that the gas company drives over trying to compare where that's where
this is so it's the same it's just a picture of this it's a picture of it it's just before the um it must have yeah yeah we took we took pictures when we had to go inspect it yeah well he farmer brain thinks that the burlap sacks were
helpful by putting rocks in a burlap sack to help them from I don't know if you have pictures of the burlap sacks there i think we we noticed them when we went by one yeah so we removed all that that's just plastic obviously it's not environmental friendly so we got rid of all that and broke the rocks out that's
was redstone he was just doing it to think that making a retaining wall the affordable way lots of redstone in my yard if you ever need any thank you you might need some that's pretty funny it was Why oh I live on the old Corey i don't But I don't know i
mean it worked you know and it but it just didn't it didn't look appealing to the eye and that's why I think it drew a lot of attention obviously but in any event we thought the confusion of as on ourselves we completely thought when we were doing this with that we were doing the right thing we had no intention of
like we're hiding from you guys you know we didn't think that it was a a big deal cuz it was bone dry when we did it and then obviously when it rains Yeah and then I got a letter from you guys in regards to some trees that were taken down of a property that I just bought and they weren't they were taken down by
an electrical company and I'm like we both got the letter at the same time i said I got one too yeah i know yeah and then it's like to that one that was and that was just because we got the call from concern so we have to look into that property is not doing anything either i'm not doing anything with that just going to stay the way it is you
guys pull that cover out of there yes where is that now it's on the property that was probably placed by a farmer 100 years ago well the bean was it Bean that owned it oh pond pond owned that property i know but there were sheep
there the sheep and there was cattle there's everything over there there's a cattle pass under are you familiar with the road the way that the cattle pass it's kind of cool i didn't know there was one cattle i heard about it i just It's really cool if you walk it you see the cattle pass that goes
from Bernie's big mebrook farm and it goes right to his Oh that must have been under HUD mr hut uh what's his Yeah he must had it then it's really clever who did they I don't know built it if anybody ever makes that side of if it if doesn't become farm one day it's
nice for the animals here that's That's going to stay a farm hans Hans is going to stay a farm no I know i know i'm saying if if Bernie ever went to get animals I mean they they'd have an access to go back and forth well keeps them safe too i think they even have electricity under
there light right in the middle of the road yeah underneath oh that's funny that's why that ditch is so low is because the that the the the uh cattle crossing underneath underneath had to be because you know six six feet so they
had to go down oh that makes sense i didn't know that i That makes sense yeah because if it was a just a little thro or something it would have been just this far off the ground you know yeah absolutely oh I know what you're saying they had to dig it out and then they
animals actually used to go up that uh which I called it was a drainage ditch up through like that right underneath right into the thing i like it you thinking Tom well I'm thinking that well the the right thing to do that
ship is sailed would have come before us and asked permission but I'm tend to be a friend of the farmer and it looks like you guys did a decent job it's there for entrance and egress to the to the agricultural
activity going on there and in the interest of safety if fire police ever had to get in there if that structure ever caught fire god forbid you know animals or humans needed to be rescued it would certainly serve that
purpose I I think you know you put some seed down and get that stabilized that's my personal feelings It's not it's not harming anything i don't know what the rest of the board feels about it like I said navigating through this was completely on our our end we should have if we knew the process we would have
definitely uh executed perfectly moment um because it's the conservation side is just one of the other issue um this was brought to the attention to our attention from uh Felix and the DPW
um because that's a town right away um there's issues with technically that would become like the responsibility of the DPW to maintain um so I think you also need to talk to Felix the DPW um because if We want we like if there's
some agreement that you come up with to keep it there then that's when it would be ideal for you to decide how you want if you want it to stay as well how you want to stabilize the site felix that's fine um but if we make him stabilize the site
and then Felix says it has to come out that's a waste of your time and money um so I would I would say you want to talk to Felix before we move forward right away they have in there legally which one where's your rightway legally to get onto your It's the gas companies
that the gas company blocks the right i've gone there to work multiple times to help him and so is the volunteer firefighters help him out that he knows from the golf course that he used to own they try to get in and there's five or six electrical trucks and gas company trucks lined up in front of his gate and he can't get in he can't get in so he's
crawling across the little thing that was there and he can't get to the he can't get to the farm so he doesn't even have a way to get in they have the right away in front of him and he's asked them to move and they're all staged up with their downriggers down or whatever their chipping brush and they're not going to move for him so what do you think Alex
if he gets Felix's blessing have him apply for determination of applicability yeah uh or we can resolve the enforcement order by just having him do what you feel is adequate um mitigation for the construction so stabilize the
site if that's just going to be plantings right yeah if we just and that would that would all the is to restore the area so if we just say that is that our our recommendation would be that just you know stabilize that top of it
and then as long as Felix is fine with it then we're then we would resolve the but before we give him any updates or anything like that I think it would be better if you address the talk to Felix first i mean and then see where that lands so we kind of know what to do
right sure that makes sense i mean I think we're all pretty much after talking to you guys and seeing the pictures and hearing the whole story I think we're okay with this as it is and I mean it's a very crazy process to try to navigate we totally get that um so I mean once you hear from Felix and can
talk to him I just would let Alex know and then we can do like an official vote and then resolve it and Yeah okay that sounds good pretty good i appreciate it yeah i appreciate realize this uh the rightway now you own that property with
the where the power lines are coming through so they took it away from you they have the right away you can speak Jim if you want yeah i own a 35 acres all the way up to the cond from the first house all the way through it's probably like 1500 ft of frontage there
and uh I planted the uh my uh my hut there further away from the gas lines uh for a couple reasons uh one of them uh it always smells over there along the gas lines and I didn't want any type of fumes going to my uh my
hut that I I put there and then uh over the uh last couple of you know uh months or so actually it was last year I wanted to put a entrance way right next to the hut just in case there's some sort of
fire or they need to get in right away because then they would have to go all the way down the street 800 ft and try to work its way act through the gate right then and there uh you could just hook up a hose and just blow water on the structure if you had to that was one of the reasons why I wanted and he put
water he had the well drilled by Artisian well in town and he there was no shortcuts here for money spent no I spent a good uh amount of money on all of that stuff uh it's going to be a farm it's not going to be any type of development or anything like that so farm is going to be a farm straight
through i don't even think there'll be a house there maybe another barn down the line but uh I and and the animals are there to keep everything cut down and it's just uh just just something that's almost like a hobby in a way like it do you need these back can we keep these
you can keep them if it helps you guys should we keep these with the help okay yeah we'll keep them with the file often i appreciate you guys time what do you think the appropriate amount of time before they come back next meeting or two meeting i think it just depends on how quickly you can get with Felix so
can I have one more question yeah of course if we um I don't know if this is even a possibility if the responsibility was delegated back to us is there a way to have that in writing where Jim m if we if if he had something to say about it if we maintain that it was clean or
whatever is if would that be a rationale to have if Casey has anything negative to say about it like if they were concerned about Felix let Felix know that you guys would take care of it yeah like I mean I think that's fine if you are offering to take care of it i think it just that conversation would feel like have to take place so I think he's
assuming that because it's technically their right of way that they would take care of it okay they may say no you can take care of it that's I think that's just the conversation why is it there right away i can I so on that road it's
100 ft from the center of the road so like you know how like in Okay so it's 100 ft from the center of the road okay yeah so it's like kind of like in Long Meadow how like it's technically if a resident were to like break a piece of sidewalk we kind of had that conversation last meeting it would be their responsibility to fix it so um but
it but it's a piece of town property so if you were to build a covert there and the DP it would become the town yeah but you still have to shovel it if it's your if it's on your It's so weird it's so weird that's basically it's such a Yeah that's tough for you guys that you guys got a hard job um
it's strange all right you know what I mean that's a wild amount of frontage i know i've never heard of 100 feet that's what it is something I have bigger for that because that's all on my property because I know where a property line is
all that work was done on my property it wasn't He had Le put all the stakes in and that the whole thing was surveyed 45 ft inward surveyed but it's still town property because it's could right away yeah i don't know weird i just want to have access to get in feed his animals
totally makes sense feed the animals absolutely yeah from Felix here an email from February 5th right away is 100 ft so from the white fog line is 41 ft oh he measured from the white fog line that's what Yeah that's what he said oh that's pretty accurate because it's like
40 we measured 45 so four feet up so that's about Yeah so definitely I think start with Felix then yeah okay let Alex know when you talk to him and then we can put you on the agenda for Yes absolutely sounds excellent guys we have to do anything with this or stay nope okay appreciate
it all thank you stay for Ryan did you want to stay for the next one just so Oh am I involved in that is that the brown meadow one yes okay let's do it all right next is the voice order 2025-02 is that this one resource area alteration assessors partial ID number
6-12A128A number so we got a call from a homeowner saying that trees were cleared and the road looked like it had been like the road looked like had been cleared recently so we had to go take a look that's why you got a letter so need to know what you're doing we So I just owning owning the
property now i followed his He had fireman stakes on the on the road that he built that I don't know they did it in the '9s i have pictures of sewer line and stuff okay so I just took the bucket and drove down it with the the leaves and debris no trees were taken down the electric company took the trees down and
I just drove down it turned around i looked I saw them outside that's Ralphie guy ralphie used to do masonry there's the neighbor and I said "Oh I knew Ralph he passed away." So I knew Ralph he was a great guy got back in the machine turned around i said "Nothing's happened here no building." Turned the machine around drove right back up how about the
Hood's property that Ralph Ralph Hood yeah yeah he was a mason right he was yeah he passed away right yeah yeah i He used to work for Adam Oliver a good friend of mine he used to do all his mason work and I used to be there on site when he was doing any great guy but so because you drove by with a bucket they I cleared I drove
down the road turned back down it but now understanding that but that road was there forever it was Yeah a pre-existing one of that property as a kid yeah yeah neil and they've been there for a while it's just fresh tires that's all yeah i
graduated Ralphie they had a fort back there did they wait that was Neil's dad's property the fort she have too i don't know what he was doing during the day yeah I if you were hanging out with Ralphie you were
okay um so do you So just stay out of the area is that where kind of that or I mean I think if you're going to ever do anything with it or build anything you would just need to do is it an is it an RDA depends on what it is what is what it is you're you're going to do it you just give Alex a call and tell him "Hey
I what I'm thinking of." Yeah and we didn't know the road was there but yeah it understood it looks like we built the road but it was already it just cleared the debris off and now it looks like it needs to be covered in debris again to be noted totally fine got to be still there too maybe you can
find the fort what you say oh the fort yeah find it yeah awesome you're all We needed to know that was it very good appreciate your time thank you so much you guys have a good one thank you talking soon thank you
okay so last is executive order 2025 to zero for dumping into the brook at 406 to 436 North Main Street where is that 4046 it's uh South Plaza oh that one but where we left off with that was we were looking to see if we could issue
enforcement orders to the businesses yeah I did look into that we can do that okay um but if we're going to go that route we need to do proof to go like there's clear proof that it's the businesses that are dumping into the puzzic but we need to actually single out specific businesses so we'd have to
go back and do a more thorough site visit oh and find trash relative to Yeah just with each business can we fire somebody to do that you got a sleeping bag you can No I'm being serious i was thinking that that's going to that would be a brutal cleanup even to get
volunteers it's almost like a It's a really it's a it's a safety issue you have to put people down the hill it's tied off and then bring stuff up by rope or the voice they can earn a badge so I mean the uh the original option was to
go after the LLC that owns the whole plaza to make sure that I think that's the best way to go but we can entertain going after the like the individual businesses responsible didn't you reach out to LLC and got no response no no no i haven't reached out to them
i think that's going to be quicker go to the owner what do you guys think i mean I just say go off to the LLC because they seem like a responsible landlord i mean it's it's a pretty decent plaza but that that trash has been going on that's been going on for
30 years or better right so every store has their own dumpster yep correct and they're all lined up next to each other all on the back there's some that are a little bit further down than others summer clothes like it's pretty much all next to each
other i mean is it just plain devil's advocate here can the trash blow out is that what's happening or are they full not being picked up maybe a few things are blowing out but this if you look at these pictures this is dumping it's all the It's all the It's probably blowing
dumpers wind stuff beside the dumpster wind that's been ongoing for one time yeah there's illegal dumping for certain going on back there oh yeah because there's a back people driving back there yeah so it's it's all of the above
so I wonder if because there is illegal dumping that's not connected to the stores if we should go after the LLC first i think we should go after them to clean it up anyway it's their respon how much where's their property and back there they own on the own pretty much
right up to the bank it's really close like really close it's an old construction um '7s you know uh it's there wasn't much if you remember there wasn't much for things like tires or old furniture back there so it's definitely not not
much is being contributed from like people from town just dumping back there like it's there's a few things I think that were back there but most majority looks like it's the businesses but something to consider when you're thinking about who you want to issue an enforcement order to is um you know if
you issue something to a specific business who's to say that the next tenant that goes in there doesn't do the same thing so we should so the LLC is I think I think the LLC just I was also thinking LLC because I would assume that
they are in charge of the waste removal schedule right i'm assuming each individual in business will contract with a with a dumpster company they'll have their own schedules we looked at them they're not all the same and they have their names on them
but they're not like the same so it's not like they're I mean you know there could be contracts in there i don't think it includes ways to remove that's the best way because that's on that's on the individual individual businesses just looking at the dumpsters and the types of dumpsters and like the companies of
the dumpsters they're not all the same yeah I say we try the LLC Alex see what we can do um do you would you all like to look at the attachment for the last page it should have the date and see what you think about the dates and the and the
attachment in general like something different in there oh this one the May the May 14th what's today today's the 9th April so give the time to get to them and I think May 14th is a fair date don't
you and then the 28th is the That's a little over a month five days it's a simple I mean like you said it's not dangerous it's steep but it's a simple process not asking to plant
anything no we're just asking to clean it up the mess yeah they um was it was it mowed down there or no drip it doesn't look it's on the picture doesn't look like it's crazy
yeah the brooks right at the base of the Yeah it's not like it's just leaves it's all like leaves and brush i know we used to have I don't think there's any grass we used to have brush fires there story that was riffraff long time
ago in Jesus essentially the last page it's asking that on the 14th submit a plan doesn't need like doesn't need to be like a GIS plan like a plan of action to clean up the Y and I also added in here uh that
it they have some plan on how to futureward a change in dumpster schedules or and or monitoring of some kind yeah if you don't want that in there you know no I think that needs to be in there i mean I don't if you guys do I think that needs to be in there
I think it's a good idea to have but we still don't really know if it's their under their control right i mean what if it is just a bunch of people who live a couple streets over who think it's a great place to go right i mean Liz and I looked and it was pretty clear
it was a simil it was similar in nature to what was in the dumpsters yeah um so at least majority okay there might be some dumping which I think that happens a lot around here but majority of the trash was and they have cameras do they have they have cameras back i didn't see
but if it's illegal dumping then it's up to the LLC to contact Yeah the police for cameras and monitor everything out of a store this is everything out of a store yeah the the I mean this is all like boxes of stuff from the dollar store and there's pet beds from the pet
store which is kind of gross if they just bump them out there but you know okay yeah I think those dates are fair we need to vote on that uh yeah we'll need to vote on it okay everybody
I will make a motion to approve the dates in the draft enforcement order for dumping into the book at 46436 North Main Street u that Alex provided to be sent to the LLC that
owns the plaza second second all in favor all right and then last is just any um any other business we got uh well we will need to sign and for this
um the only other thing is um trying to work with the attorney because she sent like a very brief like guide on what if we want to have a new owner purchase the property okay her transfer
but she didn't get very specific and she might need to entertain or what documents I need to draft oh okay so I'm hopeful to try to get it on for the next agenda um but that would be April next meeting um but it might it
might wait it depends on how but I will get all of that together and then we can discuss and see how you feel okay time that works wait signature sheets i'll make a motion to close the meeting are you made the motion uh second
all those in favor so moved all in favor i a step Part: 2
like to call the meeting order Uh this is a joint meeting of the town council's financial oversight committee and also a uh a meeting a special meeting of the town council So I will call
the the financial oversight committee meeting to order and I'll defer to Connor to Thank you Chair Call the town council meeting to order since we have more than three counselors attendance Um our first order of business is to review
the fine minutes that U Kathy Hill took uh for of our 4225 meeting Um and are there any um comments changes suggestions to be uh
noted If there are none I would entertain a motion to approve the 42 uh 25 uh meeting minutes So moved Uh second there second All right Any other discussion here Yep Point of information
or question Who's taking them today Don are you no Very good question Are you volunteering Don I'm not No I can I I can do I can't do this one because I'm traveling Thursday through
Tuesday but I can do the next week but I'll volunteer for next week Okay I'll do the week after Oh wow Okay we're lining up Who's doing I will Okay Don I thought it's vice chair You got to pass Okay Thank you Don You're welcome Thank
you Kathy You're welcome Uh I think we need the vote All in favor please say I I I Any opposed Uh minutes are approved I'm doing that Another just a housekeeping item Um terms of our last meeting before we provide our
recommendations to the town council Um we didn't settle on a meeting in May Um and I did check with the uh with the council on aging Uh Tuesday was not available Wednesday was not available So
it was either Monday uh the 5th or uh the 8th And I thought that Connor you had mentioned you would like to get them a week before uh the town council's meeting um on the week of the 12th So
what does the uh Monday the 5th sound like to people for our kind of final wrap up to provide the recommendations to the town council Sound So we'll do that and I'll confirm that with the council on aging to start at
the same time I might be I might be 15 minutes late coming from work Okay All right Thanks for my party Well that's true Okay Hey listen So this is one of the two u meeting dates that the conservation commission is also
scheduled in this room at 6:00 p.m So my guess is we're probably going to have to wrap up by about quarter 6 So we do have a hard hard date next week We can like go on till who cares you know midnight But
this time we see our faces Jeff Uh so our first assignment was to kind of go through pages 13 through 17 So I would say let's try to get there Uh we'll be mindful of the time Hopefully
you would get through that and come back uh to the other items on the uh agenda depending on what kind of time we have So we have I would say let's we'll give ourselves we'll see where we are to like 5:15
um because we do need to kind of think about next week and if we have to might defer some of this to next week as well Uh let's uh start with that unless anyone has anything else that they'd
like to bring up First as we review um we're going to go in order and check off and if no one has any questions on everything anything will we then come back to and then like we used to at town
meeting someone has a question on whatever and then we go back and we discuss or are we doing taking it as we go along just for expediency's sake Um anybody any have any brothers about that
I like the recommendation The recommendation being kind of go through if we have any questions and then go back and do that Saying we we go through it all before we do that or as we go we
if we don't stop when there's a question or mark when there's a question and come back Is that mark when there's a question and come back Yeah that goes by tell me question right yeah tell me yeah so I will confess there's a number of them where um I
don't have a major issue with the budget but I do have some questions that I just you know wasn't quite sure about some of the items not a real problem with the overall budget of of the department but just was curious about some things so
I'm I'm probably going to be a gnat in some of that Um apologize We have this morning Yes Uh so I'm going to pull out the other part the second part of this
because I was kind of using them in tandem Oh that kind of helpful Although let's say that so the MU the MUNS doesn't have the original budget It just it can only use I assume you can only use one one current year budget So you
have to use the one that's approved Would that Yeah there's specific reports that can be run in Munice If you want historicals you're only going to see revised budget If you don't want historical original although the pros and this we're comparing it to the original
budget this it's comparing it to the revised budget So the live the live budget right So the percentages and things don't quite Yeah They're not perfect right Yeah And a lot of the smaller departments like the percentages
there you have to look at dollar amounts because one huge percentage could be 300 Oh yeah I will So let's we'll start with uh we'll start with town council Um any questions The only question I had is the town
council the travel training and expense budget Did that go to the town clerk's budget No we just opted to remove it from What's that We just opted to remove it Okay Because it looked like they added travel and stuff to their budget
They did And so I was wondering whether that's because it came from this budget No it did not I can answer that other question right now unless you want to wait Sure No go ahead Come up We We had several well two departments anyway Yeah that were uh sharing hotel rooms on
their trips which I had to put a kaibos on Uh maybe obvious reasons but certainly legal reasons Uh so that's why those budgets ticked up We bought another hotel room if two people were on a trip
Makes sense So no questions on town council All right Town manager Questions on town manager Hearing none we'll put an okay there for now Reserve fund
transfer I just uh had a dumb question I wasn't sure what classification study meant Sure So uh we have an ongoing wage and classification study for our non-union personnel Um and anticipating
some fluctuation in salary Uh certainly for this budget Uh this is sort of a estimate of what that impact is going to be on all the other budgets Meaning that's across every single budget and this budget we can move the money into
But important to budget for it so that we're not adding it after we approve a budget and then next year having to fill that hole with a budget Right So we're planning for increase in salary ahead of
time so that it's in the budget So this isn't actually a study per se This is the impact of study the the the estimated the expected impact of that study So it's a placeholder Correct Uh
rather than try to put that in all the budgets without really knowing what that impact is going to be Um and this is another one of those funky ones that doesn't have a balance So the the percentage increase looks weird Mhm Cuz it's only at whatever the live munus
number is at right now But that 35,000 was an estimated impact for the was there 40 of the employees 40 close to 40 of the employees that that could be impacted by the study I think the way it's going we're
probably going to ask questions along Seems to be flowing because as you ask questions it triggers more questions So that's fine Um so I apologize I I we agreed on a methodology We blew it out of the water
So So we could do it the other way I know that I'm fine with it because I now it's triggering questions Um the placeholder answered my question and the classification study encompassed it is
finished It's not it's on it's ongoing It's ongoing We started this last year or it's been in talks for a while Yes Finish my memory Had done one years like 16 17 to 8 to 10 years you should right too
long ago right And so we had some money set aside for this and we used that money to to pay for the the study Okay And you Sorry I'm cutting out Nope Go Um do you know what towns
where So it'll be like yeah it's it's a whole comprehensive process in that they're going to certainly look at similar positions in town but it's also the whole job description So if two positions in another town are doing what
one person in our town is doing it will be weighted differently right and so if you if you look around at job descriptions in other communities there's like a grade and a scale We don't have anything We're we're sort of we had this conversation last year We're
sort of subjectively kind of paying our people in advertising positions based on what we think the market's at This will provide a grade and scale and step for everyone that's not in a union contract
So just providing a little more structure to what we're doing because right now it's it's sort of subjective and we're we don't have there's not always logic in the decision- making which is not fun for anyone
Chair go ahead Tom does this affect all town employees No What what officers are you talking non-UN personnel which is our department heads and then sort of what we would call like mid managers is most of the positions that are outside
of a union body Thank you Yeah So unless the discussion gets out of hand and I'll I'll rein it in if it does go ahead and ask okay you can ask a question Uh compromise to our methodology I do have ones that I don't
have questions on and I can tell you which ones are and then we can just go back to the ones that I have the questions on How does that sound All right Any other questions on the reserve fund
transfer None Okay Accounting Is do we lo did we lose positions in that department He says reduced part-time salaries No there was there I have a part-time person but they were
just budgeted for like 30 hours a week but they only work about 20 So I reduced the budget for them Okay So they're still on board but they're at a reduced rate Yes Thank you Reduced hours Reduced hours So but the and the combined the combined combination of it Kim it still comes out
to a 5% increase in staffing Yeah So one of the employees I'm currently down an employee So when I hire for that employee it'll most likely have to be at the rate that I was paying the person who was in that position And then the person who
replaced another employee um that I had lost um is getting paid more than that employee was getting paid So it does go up a little bit more than what you'd expect the 2 and 1 half to 3% Just because of the people that are filling those positions now There are different steps So you're
you're budgeting it with the anticipation that it's going to do that Um the person that I have currently is moving into the other position And so I know what she's going to get paid and then I left the position that I need to fill at what it's currently being
paid into that If you have to hire at a higher rate will it go beyond 5% And that's with the anticipated new rate Well okay That's what I thought but I didn't get that Yeah what Kim said there because that general theme probably on a
number of these it looked like 5% was in the full-time staff increases coming out at that level and I was just curious what's driving that um the that's the the contract the the step and the cola that's because of the yeah because of the union contracts because not only do
they get a cola there is a step increase in between everybody's position as they move Okay Well that was my question Assessors I have a question Um the explanation that the reeval revaluation contract was
reduced by 25,000 Is that because we're done with the reval or this is one of the off years right So it's it's considerably less I think our
our new uh contract uh the the price is considerably less than we've been paying So this had one of my 5% questions So I guess that's a moot point at this thing Yeah
Is is the GIS software represented in the IT budget because that 10,000 Dian's the the one that says that moved out of assessing Yes it is now Yes And in the IT budget right Thank you
Yep We were flumxed how we missed that one last year since we moved all the other software out and missed that one Well some of them were being charged to other accounts not particular the one that we targeted last year So Oh right It was a different line item So as you
can tell these these object codes are all like the same description And the software one was what 5310 Yes probably 5310 And Dian's was in like a professional others 5307 My favorite one the bucket professional technical
other uh and so we missed it So that's just a move from last year when we moved all the software into it We we missed that one or one mistake Uh treasure
treasure collector I had a different kind of question on this one because these the salaries are down Uh and I was kind of curious are are the number of employees down or this one Uh most of it is going
to have to do with uh people not positions And we had someone retire that was had been here for a very long time And so when we filled their spot naturally they were coming in at a much smaller just step Good news Just want to
make sure Yeah The the accounting one was was sort of similar too There there was two units the professional unit and the clerical unit It was like a weird move that ended up being more than it normally would have It sometimes it works out the other way
Okay Uh legal services I had no questions You don't see anything looming that you need to No we we No I think we're good We we kind of chatted about that last night I think we're in a good place in terms of staff
knowledge where uh we're not needing as much legal and there were a couple of crazy things that happened year one that kind of got us out of control but I think we're back down to a a level where we can sort of maintain this human resources
questions So I was just a little curious Uh again don't want to look a gift horse in the mouth but no change between the current budget and the new budget and full-time staff salaries
They also had a similar um situation where they somebody had left who was making um a considerable amount more than the person replacing them All right Good Good other questions anybody
is I'm sorry to seem and and to confess and I'm so out of touch but the new department head is us on board and outstanding that again that was sort of my my point to make last night about the legal budget is having somebody in HR
that knows what knows what the rules and laws are has really helped that other budget because I'm calling our lawyer because I I didn't know right And so now we have somebody there that has the knowledge to not have to call the lawyer all the time
Other questions Uh information technology What's What do you mean by 13.4,000 on telephones Uh this was a a function of a couple moves The there was I think our existing
phone system is out of date and rather than update or upgrade all our phones we went to Zoom phones uh which was some of an increase but in the long run would end up saving us money not buying new hardware like the phones Uh so everybody
will have a a it it'll almost work like a cell phone kind of thing where everybody has their own phone number for their desk phone and we can message without doing the extensions and this that and the other thing and it winds up being cheaper Wow Yeah it's it's pretty
cool Amazing I I have to give Ryan credit He seems to stay up on all this stuff Nobody better Can you Zoom phone What the heck is that Can you elaborate on the um increased
salary to contract 5,259 Yeah Do you mean the repair contract Uh the repair comm seems No it's under it Yeah It increase uh salary to contract
in the green right Yes Just the the contract It's just the number the amount that went up because of the contract for salaries So it's a contractual obligation Yeah Yeah Yeah Right It's just the wording It was a little bit different than it was on the Tim
Shorthand Sorry You know so I I did have a question on it I mean it looked like Ryan's never used part-time part- timerrs at least in the recent past and this is the first year he's begun Is that something new for him
He we always had a seasonal employee and I don't know if he had that in a different line item Is that I might have had it in a temporary temporary classification but he still has a temporary employee Okay So he has two temporaries and then one part-time
which is a new new category for him Right Oh so he didn't have it in there before Right Right Is there a historical for that the I know the summer ones were
uh dedicated to overhauling you know all the machines come back in and they do all of their preventative maintenance Yep And they were for maybe six weeks interns Correct So the part-time employee uh
Yeah He did not have that part-time employee last year right But there's a part-time So it's a full-time employee He works part-time for wreck and part-time for IT doc So my guess is he put it on that line
Oh and then we moved it into the fulltime He he does show in his organizational chart Uh a summer technician who Yeah I think that's the seasonal one right Yeah typically he hires someone to like Kathy was saying there's an unbelievable
amount of work in the July August month to get ready for the school year Yeah And so he usually gets somebody in there I feel like other questions for information technology last year halfway through the year that's why it didn't show up in the beginning then it carried
on to this year All right then we're going to make a note and I'm just going to double check and make sure that that's what happened Okay So we're all clear You'll get back to us at the next meeting Yep That's the part-time salary line item for it Yeah
Yep Let's just as well double check right Uh next is uh town council clerk other than my 5% question I and the uh the hotels I that was it for me Yeah
they had a hotel one Uh I did have the the professional other which was uh pretty much nothing And last year the 800 there was $800 in the budget It's now budgeted at $6,000
Yep That's the um what's that or king contract or whatever So there's there's a couple of things that move the the vault maintenance Uh one year uh treasure collector pays for it and one year clerk pays for it So that that flops around Well that's a
crappy budgeting Why aren't they each paying 500 But okay Why don't you just Why don't you just split it 5050 and have it We should No maybe we should do that As I'm saying it out loud it sounds silly Um no it's not
So um the king was a thousand of it And then the um GC earlier when I told you I didn't know what it stood for It's general code Um so for the bylaw changes there's another $5,000 in there for um any of those bylaw changes I had no idea
what King was What is King of the Vault The vault I'm pretty sure Yeah Yeah King is um the records management right Oh right which um CPA had paid some of it and to restore all the
records associates or something like that at the time I think it was King Yeah something like that We had a quick question from the notetaker who's getting hand cramps I can't read my writing so who knows what the um I just say general general
discussion ensued You know that's the best one um changed format multiple times Uh okay You were talking about splitting the budget rather than going one year Who was the other what was the other Treasure collector and and clerk because they share that vault Yep That
makes sense now Y Okay another one So what are we up to One and a half mistakes Do we get a full mistake for that I think we should I think we should probably change that I mean I think that's just it's not really a mistake It's just you know it's the way we've always done it As a budgeter I
would hate to have to explain that every other one year I'm a superstar in the next hitter Yeah Uh elections So I I didn't anybody have any questions on elections The the the major
election thing was we've been budgeting for a primary election since the charter and we've never had one So instead of budgeting for it every year we're not going to budget for it every year Um that's why that's down 58% or whatever
it is Um how much would it cost you if you had a primary [Music] election 15,000 15 I think there were 15 something like that 15 in election Yeah it's about 15,000 Find out when we have a primary someday Someday if we have too
many counselors seeing counselor sponsor school committee sponsor Yep Two What is it Three times as many as seats I'd have to I I I should double more than double more than double Yeah
Which we Yeah We haven't had So I understand what you're saying that you're not going to budget for it but were it to happen you'll just do it free cash transfer So some sort of either the reserve or a transfer and and I think
this is this is sort of the we were talking about this with Dian's budget the valuation since we brought it up these part these spikes in the budgets No they we don't have to budget for and then bring it back down We should pay for a one-time expense and then keep budgeting right It throws everything out
of whack So that I would I would look at that the same way If we got that we're going to pay for it anyway but why budget for it Because that's just cutting into everything else we need to do right So so this year more than most years we've been trying not to budget for these one-time blips that are coming
back Makes sense So this said a current year actual of like 28,000 and so there there was we just haven't had primaries in in a long time This
this year was light Last year was enormous Yeah Uh and so we we've never had a local primary Excuse me Let me make sure that that's clear Never had a local primary Not that Jeanie could remember but maybe there was one at some
point Long time ago Council the very first one The first one we had 32 Oh yeah So yes there was definitely a primary That's more than double right Yeah Okay If that's the case then I I guess I don't have any objection to that
Okay Planning zoning conservation So this is uh I'll just jump the question Uh if you look at the revised budget uh this is actually the proposed budget is actually less than the revised budget this year And we had
moved half of their 40% of the building clerk into planning So that that's the difference in adding the 40% of an employee uh and that person is now being paid by we had done that transfer
already Uh so so this year the FY26 budget will have this in there now Uh but it looks like when you compare it to the budget it's a 10% increase It's actually not All right Not sure I completely followed
that I guess so When we started the budget process last year building had a building clerk and a an and an admin The building clerk because of the workload in planning we
decided that that building clerk could also work for planning an office space Yes So that 40% of a person wasn't budgeted last year and now is budgeted in planning But if you look at the
revised budget since we already changed the money it's it's already factored in Right So if you look at the 2026 projection compared to the revised budget it's actually less That's why it's high versus the original Correct Not versus revised Okay Yeah So that's
already how we exist right The money got transferred in there halfway through the year It just went from planning's budget to uh no transfer from building to planning Yeah Okay Questions Police department
What's a retirement What retirement bonus reduced ink category So they have a contractual uh stipulation that if they retire more than a or if they give notice more than a year in advance they get a they get a
payment uh which we're calling a uh compensated absence thing like all when we pay out when someone leaves that got moved out of the budget and we'll get paid out of that and that makes sense for us because that allows us to send somebody to police training and all
Right And and these things the timing of which are really difficult And even when we have good planning typically don't get somebody in like within a week right It's always 3 months later Um so that's why that incentive is in the contract
Yeah Tom can you clarify for me the Quinn bill still exists I thought that was out of The Quinn bill exists uh but is not being paid for by the Commonwealth anymore Yeah Yeah Oh So it's there's a surprise Yeah So that's
that 278 which Yes Correct Wow Amazing Yeah It's been for quite a while Quite a while Quite a while Yeah So the the 10.9% increase in the Quinn bill expense is
that just the expense is going up or the number of people taking advantage of it is going up No and the new contract negotiation So if you were hired before a certain date the town was paying your full Quinn bill and after that you got
the half And so the last contract because more than our half of our police department wasn't happy with their Quinn bill Uh they negotiated a percentage increase for the people hired after that date which wasn't all the way
to the 25 And they did it over two years so that we wouldn't feel the impact of it all at once So half of it got increased last year and then half this year and then everyone's up to speed So after next year it'll just be smooth
It'll it'll just be whatever their cola increases Okay Yep And was that a something also going on with the longevity as well or same same idea The the the contract terms were
were changed and and everyone's been in the police department longer Uh so that that line item as we get people to stay which is good uh we'll all continue to get paid out more And you settle we
settled the contract last year right Yes after the fiscal after the budget was approved That's why they revised budget correct included that uh questions about the police department
budget Uh fire department the 18,000 uh reduction in general expenses maintenance and supplies That's just seems like a lot Or you would make the uh assumption that
there there would that was maybe overbudgeted Yeah Okay Yep And and again we most of the expense budgets we'll spend a lot of time with because the the salaries are sort of contract especially buyer like it
but if we're looking at historical data they're not spending up to that budgeted amount in three years then it's time to to bring that down and and that was Paul's submitt I believe with taking taking those expenses out we didn't even
do that right y so Paul Paul did is something he got the message on his way out the door Tom um all moving on Chris Peach moved up Yeah If we hired a position have we filled Chris Beach's price We have not we do not have a
deputy as of right now Gain in salaries with both those positions being given to younger staff members Uh be budget less Yes Okay That's all I get So is that why I mean again the
full-time salaries are again this one is against the the current revised budget but I think it's the it is the same isn't it Uh it's not the
same Yeah it's it is the same Uh it's down 1.6% but for FY26 So the okay full-time salaries is actually decrease Uh well it would be a couple things
right uh like Rich was just saying but we also have uh new firefighters on right so the so if somebody moved on similar to the other spots we we have somebody started Is that what you're Yeah All right
I think there was also Didn't we move some um some of the salary money into the stipend account I think that might account for a little bit of it Um Oh the contractual Yeah So there are stipens that get paid out and
I believe trying to look for it I think we moved those stipens into the stipen line item as opposed to being in the salary line item so that it was more in line with what was happening um in the fire department as well So I think if you look at the detail I think
the stipens go up I'm not on your page typing is weird Kim in the immunist report because it there's nothing historically and then it shows 62716 So it's a 0% increase because there's nothing to base it
against It's just moved from another line item into the actual line item it should have always been in Right So we were paying those stipens out of the full-time salary last year Then because that's not accurate we moved it into the stipened
line item And that's the decrease in that or part of the decrease in that line item is that 62 whatever Yeah Because like if you were to look in the um police department they have a stipen line item and they've always separated their stipens for some reason I don't know but we've never done that in the
fire department So we did it this year to make it comparable and so we could see the difference between what was being paid out in stipens and what was being paid out in salaries and stipend in the department is equates to what what is a stipend and a fire department I'd have to look through specifically we'd have to look through the contract
but it's those are written the criteria would be in the contract Yeah that's okay We can we'll we can clarify that next time too And education went up like 25% 10,000
bucks You have any idea what uh people new people need to be educated No no no So so they have similar to the Quinn bill uh depending on their level of education they also get this is the this
is the price of having newer people that are now needing to become more educated No no no uh depending on your education level as a firefighter EMT you get a bump in pay And so people are
continually getting degrees and therefore we have to pay more for more educated staff That that's a contractual obligation as well Hey Tom looking at the figures for overtime for both the police and fire Um is that coming out of
the town or is that being paid by the tree service that hires the detail for a police officer No that's our that's our overtime salary line item So if they work for a like a detail that's all paid
by the contractor We have the um revolving fund revolving fund for for details So the 404,000 overtime for the police is paid by the town or coming in on overtime and I'm sorry I don't mean to
be a wise guy Somebody said No no Yeah Right If you're back filling shifts or you have to come in or stay late or Yeah Yeah Okay Thank you And it's gotten a lot better than Yeah Oh yeah I remember I remember way back when Yes So things overall have are improving Yep And just
a kind of a broadbased question Um I know that when we are advertising for new positions especially at department head level um are you finding that um our salaries are realistic Again
we're going back to kind of salary study or that we're putting it out there and then when we actually negotiate it ends up being higher So a retirement isn't quite the bonus that people may think it
is or is it departmentally depends on supply and demand I guess I would say uh truthfully that it's all over the place Okay Yeah it kind of it kind of it depends on the situation And it depends on the uh department or field uh or
timing Uh for whatever reason uh for the most part we seem to nail it down But then we have these outlier years or positions or whatever that it's hard to it's hard to grasp And that again the reasoning for having a system where we
can tuck everybody in Then there's no question You just print out the sheet and put out the and this is what we pay Right Right Because this because we've looked around and these are their job This is their job description This is what they do and this is what they
should be paid and and you got to fit in this bucket So it is all over the place And that that's sort of why we're looking for for a little structure Other questions on the fire department uh building department and you answered my question
already because of the 5.5% units Uh questions on the building department All right we got one page down All right it is 443 Meadow dispatch Oh my god You got to be
kidding me I was shocked by this Bless you God bless you This is our first year in full payment So that was my question is are we have we reached our Okay Uh that's not to say we won't
see increases in Westcom budget Nothing like the look at this size of increase Yep This is our full impact this point So we have no choice Uh yeah it's our assessment This is the letter we get
based on the budget that again I'm I I'm on the board So we we vote on a budget and this is the budget and then this is our assessment based on call volume And you feel that it is operating How how how satisfied are you with the the
uh we're we we've been scuffling for for for a little little bit here We have a a new interim director installed Uh the building's about to come online I feel like we're about to punch through Uh it's a great organization Uh the partnerships are great the people are
great that we're just we're we're just right there Uh Regional Dispatch works Uh and we're I think we're about to really see the the impact of that decision Um I obviously we've seen it in the budget already but uh I think uh
when when other communities start coming on and this this new building is set to be built out for multiple more communities and at that point we could see this assessment come down I was on I don't know whether it was this committee
or whatever when when the projections were made for our town just doing it ourselves and it was kind of staggering the the amount of work that would have been involved and and so it's yeah we're we're we're right
there the the we the couple there's a couple more communities that need to get built out and then I think it it'll be it'll be clear sailing soon Um new building is very exciting obviously So any other questions on Yeah Oh sorry Go
ahead Connor Yeah Um I mean I know there's some question about like when the actual timeline will be when the new building is fully up occupied but has there been any other communities that have actually expressed interest or is it just a hope that once a new building
is up and running that someone will reach out Yeah we we've had uh I guess I would say unofficially We've had multiple conversations Um I I guess I don't have anything concrete to say and so I won't uh but um like I said on once
you see the impact to the community when it when it when water does find its level I think we'll we're going to start to get a lot of communities start to come on board and and the state is really really really supportive of this regional dispatch uh and to the point
that that most of the funding for this is coming from state 911 So um I I guess that's all I'll say Yeah So just a quick uh question Beck before we started the
regionalization our dispatch that was out of our police station wasn't their budget just over 400,000 Yeah So even even with this being at 100% It's still a huge savings in
comparison and we had the grants for five years I think it was So so if you add all of that up we've saved plus the headache of having to operate it Yeah you stamp it Excellent Good information
Um highway questions I had one Um reduce 20 grand in vehicle repairs Is that due to we have newer vehicles and no longer have to repair or was it just were we overbudgeting for
vehicle repairs I think a little bit of both Um that was a I'd have to look back at the historical It's also has to do with best new vehicles Well the preventative maintenance that goes on at at DPW has
helped the fleet insane I mean insanely in the last just in the last five years Um so we don't have to do as much full repairs We're just maintaining our fleet
Um that that's for sure Okay Shows Yeah Yeah Definitely shows What about t-shirts Is that those bright neon yellow shirts or is that don't
And on the high the very last statement Is that a t-shirt That was a departmental request increase And I think that the new contract the the the the a lotment of t-shirts for for the guys that they all wear we like that
they all wear the same thing and they're high vi green and so they're it's in the it's in the budget Yeah I think they were running out Daryl keeps them in a big box in the back and they were running out You want one Rich I might want it Who doesn't Any other questions on
highway Okay uh building facilities the contractual services or contracted services down by 29,000 Yep Uh I don't what was the exact reasoning for that I mean I know a lot of these
line items had they were based on historicals They were just overbudgeted quite a bit But let me see if there's something specific Yeah the and again we we had this we had this issue last year and unfortunately we're probably going to
level out here at some point when Bruce has a staff in this division but we've struggling to find and keep people in the building facilities division I think we've advertised for a plumber for over a year now
Um and so we we need to look into that Go ahead Yeah Yeah No it was just if you look at all the line items it was just 5,000 from here 5,000 from there because they just were overbudgeted based on historicals And so that's in green So that was our
conversation with DPW saying you know we're not hitting these numbers And again a lot of it has to do with there's nobody there to do the work So we're trying we don't want to cut the whole thing if he does hire everybody next year and we got no money to buy
things and build things but we're trying to find a spot where uh where it can level itself I suppose But uh yeah we again this historical data if if we're not spending up to it we're not budgeting it anymore And if we need to
buy something or do something deal with it then we'll deal with it But we we we can't overbudget it we're too we're on the razor's edge and we can't keep overbudgeting because or just in case or if this happens Um got to start dialing
back And we did look at by department who was turning back money every single year and and there was a good amount coming back from highway and um I think from utilities So we looked at that as well So question may um the new uh building
net we have that doesn't go under building facilities at all because that's under going to call it its own enterprise but I know it's not enterprise revolving funding a building revolving that's all completely separate correct I guess I would add the caveat that John
is the uh building maintenance supervisor so he's taking the calls Right But he his salary is not in the 382 budget It's only here Okay Right So yeah So there is yeah some there's some overlap If I mean if if Bruce has to or
Yeah If I have to deal with something I'm not putting a day's worth of my salary in on the 382 books Buy more buildings We have to keep a time sheet There is a 382 has its own budget and it's all in that account
Okay Uh any other questions on building facilities Uh snow and ice Talk about a contingency budget Hey as you go leaving it where it is Any issues with that
Okay Town and school utilities questions get you dropped No How do we Yeah there was a I think there was a couple of lines that that Bruce was able to take some money out but th this is so volatile Uh you know we're locked in on
rates but the usage is always all over the place depending on the weather Uh we're going to take a full look at this next year You can imagine what the electric bill at the high school is going to be next year Um and so obviously the gas bill will come down in
kind two but um this is going to we're we're looking at a deeper dive into our utilities at this point and uh we are a municipal light plant now So uh I think there's a few more uh opportunities open to us So
we're we're sort of checking all that stuff I had mentioned last night about aggregation but that that doesn't really have to do with this account necessarily But uh we have those rates locked in for I think one the the one of the energy ones is through March and the electric
one is through next November So we don't have to worry about the fluctuation of rates that we had uh a few years ago or a couple years ago Uh it's just the usage uh that we kind of throw our hands up at But but this number seems to be
reasonable for for this year But um yeah we I think Bruce had a couple that he that he pulled some just from a historical standpoint but other than that questions uh trash collection
disposal like we're step through this fiscal year Uh contracts expire in 27 and 30 The hauling one Uh this is where this gets fun We're trying to line these up So the hauling contract is good through 27 Mhm
But our uh the recycling is good through 30 but our um disposal one which is where our hauler brings the trash is up June 30th which we're about to sign June 30th of June So we just got the Tammy just got those
numbers yesterday They're sort of in line with what we've budgeted There's no no real surprise there So uh not a thing but we're going to do a two-year deal So then we can line up hauling and disposal Um the recycling will be what it is But
um we'll have the disposal and hauling contracts on the same year That's it So is the note incorrect that it's up on 63027 Half of it Oh that I'm sorry That should
just say that should say hauling Hauling is up 6:30 27 Well 27 would be another the end of another coming into fiscal 26 right Y and this is at the end of fiscal 27
right So that's two years right Yeah Okay Yes Well you said this year No no Okay There's two parts of the hauling You have to have a understand Okay So I just Yeah sorry I knew that was
confusing That contract is up this year We're going to do a two-year to line up with this one that ends on the 630 27 collection is 630 26 No no
25 25 The waste collection bringing together Alling is alling is through 27 Disposal is up this June right Okay 25 disposal When we say um disposal it's
waste collection Correct That's what we mean by that What is up this but there's two parts of picking up the trash right That's what we got You have somebody that picks it up from the curb and then we have to pay to dump it somewhere That's another contract
You good No escalate You will very clear calling 6:30 Okay sir All right I can't wait to line them all up regardless of the contract expiration dates Oh you are the states Very well Chair does anyone have an issue with the uh
FY26 budget of the uh trash collection disposal No If not let's move on and waste collection And now we we've got to on to waste collection and disposal This is the transfer station budget Okay All
right Okay Through 327 of 124740 and then the 26 projection I mean we're not even through the year and you're projecting 10,000 less It it
sounds like I mean I'm assuming the rest of this year we're still going to have another 20,000 or whatever So we'll be at 134 by the end of this year How are we thinking next year is
going to be even cheaper Look at that You mean why did we reduce it or why didn't we increase Reasonable question Yeah it is a great question And I'm sure when we listen and our actuals when we end this year are going to
be probably if I look at it 140 or more is that I wasn't it's the one after DPW and after the trash collection before health Somebody messed that up I asked to slap those Page 40 in the mus We're going to
work on it Yeah All right So current year actuals are 124 Prior to that they were much much lower 89 78 89 and I'm not sure
unless there's a maybe a one time Yeah that's what I'm wondering We'll check with Yeah we're going to have to look at We'll check with Bruce on that So we'll get back to us next meeting Uh okay And I I have a feeling that these current year actuals are
possibly pulling in the encumbrance because it's exactly 110,000 So that there it is may be the issue but I'll look at it No that would that's that's definitely that's definitely what it would be because it's always the same person the same company
right Mhm So so basically Bruce would encumber the entire amount which makes it look like we've spent the whole thing so that in accounting when a bill comes in he just signs the invoice and we already have a PO and it and it just goes and then we
just roll the rest of it back that was encumbered and not spent He would encumber it this Yeah like the utility Yeah the utility bills He encumbers the entire amount Jul July 2nd just so it's you can just keep paying bills So
operationally it's easy but MUN doesn't differentiate between how much we're going to spend So that's why we came down because of the actuals for the last two years not what the looks like the actual is in Munich I guess that is consistent I'm looking at town and
school utilities and the actual so 327 is a million639 and your bud and then the budget is a million634 So yeah the the most of them just get encumbered right away that there's a lot of a lot of that
the school does a lot of incumbrances uh right up to the to the line uh a lot of departments that are paying a bill consistent bill to the same vendor not looking for another three months worth of expenses to add on top of those It's
already It's already been So the actuals aren't actual The actuals are not actual Yeah Oh they're live So the 124 is most likely what we're going to spend total What It's not actually spent We so that number was
budgeted at whatever 110 or 90 and we've only been spending 70 or 80 and so we took 20 out of it but I will double check it We can double check but that that's exactly why is because we encumbered and I would assume this year would probably be less considering we
sounds like machinations waste oil disposal because they're still not accepting it Correct Okay that's a town council That was a good question Ralph I do have Let's move on to Sorry Connor Yeah Um
was there a consideration um with the waste collection for the transfer station to increase any fees for that This we did look at that Um I think we decided even if we doubled it it would it wouldn't offset this
budget And I don't think anybody had any appetite to go past that conversation So uh it's still kind of a uh goodwill gesture to the community to pay for it out of the general fund and it only cost you 50 bucks to
go So we did we did look at it Uh I think we would we can have the conversation I think we if we wanted to have a real impact What was the What was the It was only like 32 $31,000 for for
revenue for dump passes which I thought it was more but that's all that's all it was So if we doubled it we would certainly eat up a little more of this budget but I think to ask people to go from 50 to 200 say in one year to have a real impact uh
that that's sort of when I stopped having the conversation with myself But again we'll keep using our permutation word there There there's plenty of ways to to look at this The most of the impact I get about the dump is that people are thankful that it only costs 50 bucks and they go once and it
basically pays for itself But um that is an operation that we've looked at to try to run like an actual transfer station and and like make money Uh and that's something that we could look into further But uh after looking at the the
revenue stream for the actual permits uh that I didn't want I didn't I didn't think raising it triple in one year was going to make even a little bit of an impact anyway So we took 20,000 out of the budget But uh that was as far as the
conversation went But we did look I'm willing to have a further conversation for sure I think we should But yeah Speak up I'm just being quiet A side note is if you raise too
much or dumping on the side about the community and then our DPW is going to have to spend more time cleaning up what people would normally have brought to the transfer station Um I remember this conversation with Springfield years ago They claimed East Lome was dumping in
their town So no I think I hear what you're saying If you But if you make it too too expensive I think folks may not use it Yeah certainly not want to go buy the dump pass Yeah absolutely But I do think $50 for the entire year is extremely
reasonable Yeah Considering I know what it cost me just to dump one load somewhere So Well and now everybody knows how much it cost to run it Yeah So and the amount has done the same for and the and the amount has been the same So that maybe
yeah we had looked at some other revenue sources that had been stagnant for a while and and sort of bumped them up a smaller amount but um you know that's certainly an option to to to look at that So it's uh it's
504 and uh we're not far from getting to I I mean I think all we have to do is get to where the schools start Y um and let's see what we can do I I don't propose that we rush and not discuss
whatever we need to discuss on these Um but as I say we'll we'll see where we are maybe at 520 and uh it' be nice to get through the whole town department The town part Yes If possible Yeah Uh so we'll we'll move on to the health
department And of course I had my 5% I at the top I can see Other than that uh questions on the health department Any questions All right No questions on the health
department Uh council on aging questions on a council on aging Um is the hotel Yeah So my only question again was u if I average the full-time and the part-time together
I come up with a 5.8% 8% increase So I wasn't quite sure how that was working Sounds amazing Or if I I mean if I add them together I'm flipping Jim Sorry
Yeah Not full of their detail position nurse you know for health and for library What did you take the full-time was I think it was no and what full-time and part-time
the full-time decreased by 1.3% Correct Right But the part-time increased by 74 almost 75% The reason for that one last year they had asked for a grant a person who was funded by a grant to be included in their full-time
salaries when we reduced it because it wasn't granted We took it out of the wrong line item So I believe it came out of part-time when it should have came out of full-time So we actually just did a transfer to correct that
So that's why they show up on here as like one being down so much and one being up so much Well no and that's why I added them together Kim Okay And then you come up with 5.8 5.8 question There's there's a shared
position for a nurse between Council on Aging and was it the health department Okay Where is that split Well is it where is it in this budget Is under under part-time
Is that what we did Position but it's split Yeah No And we had this issue last year with our split position is in the full time but it's half of it's in one budget half in your notation it it says a 6% increase in salaries It
does And everyone in here is on a step So I could go I'm going to have to go back look at what their steps were last year what their steps are this year because I assume So what you're thinking is it's all part of the step and it's part of the contractual obligations of
the contracts but I'll double check it Now is this the first year Tom that this has been in place The the shared position No No Oh she's in this budget too All right
Okay Yeah Wondering if we were if we had enough need in this community to you know to support that position Yeah I mean uh I haven't neither department head has said anything uh certainly bad
or uh that that they don't need it to me at this point Um I know there was a lot of documenting as we were getting out of COVID and that kind of thing I just didn't know where that stood Okay just something to maybe
consider look into Okay Thinking that might not be as busy as we thought it would be Hopefully we're a lot healthier as a community That's right Any other questions on Council on Aging We'll
check that Jim All right Thanks Veteran services I didn't have any questions on veteran services public library just my 5% touchdown Other than that yeah 6.2 this time Jim
What's 6.2 Oh yeah 8.3 Yeah A bunch of them together Uh I did that Do they have a revolving account Library Library Library because don't they collect money for fines and such
Library I believe They collect money Those go into the general fund Those in the general fund The fines do but they also have Are you talking about like friends of library They have their own revolving Oh they do Okay Yeah Well they're they're separate
of 503 Oh yeah It's like a booklet club You make federal right February does get a state grant They do have a a grant fund that they can rely on for certain things and then the friends help them outside of it but that's not in our books
What is RTLS quit What Oh what 5270 Yes looking at So that's the um that's the copier line item Yeah So rental easy to tell
it's our new um copier contract So those numbers were sort of moved around Uh I know everybody's budget It's such an it's not it's not intuitive questions on the public library
uh recreation department had a question pop into my head We were talking about copers and I know it's a work in progress I'm assuming and I hate using network um that in the past we talk about um trying to create
uniformity across town departments and having um leases from one company and all across the spectrum I'm seeing different leases Are they same company across the spectrum or are we working towards that or have we decided that
wouldn't work Everybody is under this current contract Okay And the pricing is based on whatever machine you have and actually how what your estimated usage of that machine is So pages get counted Uh whoever is using the most we they we publicly shame them No I'm just kidding
We again there's a counter on who's using what And if you're sharing equipment with another department whoever's usage is wherever it is is paying more or less of the bill So these numbers are all estimated based on the
usage of the machine I mean based on data obviously but which is great Yeah So we yeah this was this was quite the undertaking by uh Mr Quimby uh everybody is now on this copier contract and there's no uh you
know I don't have my own laser printer in my office or anything like that right everybody's on the contract uh recreation department so the only other thing again the note in here says 6% increase in salaries I
guess my question is and I think last year We kind of talked about it a little bit and I I thought it was some of of a catchup adjustment kind of year but is this something where you're going to be looking at this I mean this is this what's structurally built in to your
contracts a 5 to 6% increase in full salaries That 6% that was requested was actually one one person in there was 2 and a half% higher than they should have been So that was something that we caught in that process and reduced it So I don't think they're at they shouldn't
be at 6% at this point 5.2 Oh 5.2 So 5% is what you're what you're it's going to live with union until the union contract So they're they're they're all the union most of the unions the the clerical and
professional union uh which everybody in Wreck is in is scheduled on steps and they're two and a half And so whatever they negotiate for a cost of living adjustment is added to that Yeah Because you got to be at least one and a half 2% higher than the norm in the private
sector I would think per for what Per year Yeah Yeah Well and then obviously way lower from a private to public Not as much anymore Yeah Well and again I think that's something that's got to
come out in negotiations now Obviously we can't afford I don't think you're I don't think you're giving up as much as you you used to And your benefits are Yeah way better Of course No And I think these are all things that come out in the negotiation I don't think Hey because I mean if you you've got that
engine you're you're just you got an engine Yeah Yeah No it's unsustainable And these are the contracts unsustainable and they're going to have to start getting changed And so if you're on this step scale um I mean particularly when we get to that end of
this page where you talk about the insurance benefits and Yeah No you're you're exactly right And this this is we're we're going to have to start coming back down to the 2% cost of living adjustment for everyone It
just it's not sustainable Whatever the numbers are out in the universe uh we can't pay them So um this is this is where we're headed So uh any other questions on recreation
uh celebrations and historical Okay Uh PVPC assessment questions Okay Um retirement of debt Yes One
general question Yes Tom and um M Collins Um as a citizen now we've gone through the whole town department budgets Am I going to feel any impact of these cuts if I want to go to the accounting office for the function or assesses town managers office the town
clerks Am I going to feel some pain if I need something done some service done How do you see the there's no change in service even with all these cuts No And I I I I guess I'd say we didn't really make any cuts We're still at a level service Any any adjustments to the
number were based on historical data and just not budgeting up to that line item anymore Um I don't anticipate any any blip in service at all Thank you Yep So we are through the town department We haven't gone through the
debt Uh we haven't gone through the inference and pensions but did you want to take any action on these accounts What's the appetite of the group
Well I think part of the question is do we want and then I'll let's put it on the agenda for next next meeting and then I'll throw it out that um we go through quickly with no questions and we
I think it would be better to to do it next week Yeah Oh yeah absolutely We have some things that we'll clarify got action items as well I've got it down but I think we'll be able to move quickly next week Uh questions on the retirement on on
debt Yeah I I'm confused that when I look at this um see different different the figures are different I was so proud of myself that I was you looked at the I did a reconciliation Yeah Yeah But you have to
like put the numbers together It's terribly confusing for me I'm trying to go through and figure out where every match up at all No there So it wasn't me Then part of the part of the reason for this is that the school has um their
portion of debt the town has their portion of debt and then all of the um uh enterprise funds have their portion Everybody pays a different portion of debt I tried to break out on that long sheet that you're looking at I tried to
pull the debt out of the departments to give you different percentages of increase that you're not going to see on those munus reports because when you look at the debt included with everything else it looks like everything's going up by an exorbitant amount because your excluded debt is
also in here So you're not going to be able to look at that munis report and say this is exactly where it is in these other reports But there is a little reconciliation page in there that shows you all the debt It looks like uh what
page What page is that Um it was actually right after the right after all these Okay It has it highlights in yellow Oh I see Yeah 47 So that kind of shows you all the different buckets of debt and where they are in those mun
reports Thank you I thought it was me I couldn't figure it out Yeah No I I'm I would like to get her finance I would love to get munus to be a little bit more clear So that's something we'll be working on this year to we can see it better
Um so it's 520 Um any other questions on the debt the uh workers cut the insurance This is really where your crunch is Yep It's
really awesome uh anyway still at an estimate for I think the note for the explanation here uh should say an 8% increase that that that was the number we held we don't have actuals yet uh I met
with our insurance provider last week uh I expect to have them shortly but you seem to think that probably going to be right around five to six to eight something somewhere in there So so that's our 8%
conserate and again this will be one that we will talk about a lot with a huge increase next year bringing a $200 million facility online So we just have to sort of keep that in our with
workers No no no The property liability insurance when we bring the high school up This is liability and property Sorry The other one Yep Both on top I'm sorry Yeah So that should say property and liability right And it just
says liability Yeah we can make it say that We can make it say that Munice Sure That would be more descriptive It would be And that would the liability would go out for a while because we also have to cover obviously not only putting up the
building but taking correct these increases are speculation Nope Excuse me Just for workers comp and liability Yes I'm sorry Okay The rest of the insurance and benefits we have actuals now Employee health Okay
Yep That those are all actuals Thank you So the health insurance is is a good estimate at 9.65 Yep That is a that is more than an estimate That's the number plus what we've decided the budget based on
uh Scannic Valley has been softening the blow on this on these increases by using their retained earnings which as we're having this conversation about using free cash for your operating budget is not sustainable and at some point we're
going to have to pay this enormity of an increase And so even though they've said 4% we're just like we did last year when it was 0% and we budgeted at 4 and a half This year it's at four and we're budgeting at nine and a half or whatever
it is What does 30 add-ons mean Uh Tom assuming 30 people coming on Oh add-on meaning a person adds on to the group And and again all we can do is look at historical data and figure out how what we think That's just an estimate of what
we think we're going to gain And is that health insurance for current employees or we do we pay still insurance for uh retirees We do And and in retirement contributions do you only pay that for current employees
Correct That's correct I mean it's it has actually kind of staggering I don't think I've ever looked at it that before Or maybe it was never like what kind of format because when you look at it and you
exclude the schools for the moment I mean the total town excluding schools is like [Music] 3664% of that is this stuff Yeah All right And and and when you think about that it's
uh and and we're 56% Well 86% of the increase is this stuff Yep It's unbelievable So 1.4 million is coming from this you know 16 million and our 20 million is you've budgeted basically a
net $216,000 increase Like wow Yeah And and if this continues like next year are we going to do six seven eight nine% again and again
and again I mean you're going to get we're going to get squeezed out of again if we're lucky That's why we're budgeting more than we necessarily need to this year because we are going to have to make up that difference Squeeze is going to get Oh yeah I mean I don't
know what kind of consultants are available or whatever but I mean the size of that number and the extent of the increase and the impact that it has on us and will have on uh on us I don't
know whether there's people out there that can work with us to there there is and we kind of went through this exercise a little bit last year Everybody had we had a smaller increase than like the GIC is at 14 and change A
couple other places were at 15 16 So it doesn't matter who you go to Yeah This is what everybody's seeing And go ahead Just a couple things Consultant I look back uh in 2023 uh when Mary McN
was town manager We did ask her to investigate y the consultant and that was going to run back then about 2530 grand Um also historically scanic valley has subsidized I believe
I'm sketchy and I'm going in a way back machine here but I think we hit the that cliff at one point and we had to jump it Yeah Um and again I'll throw it out because I throw it out every time Maybe we change the metrics
of um I realize uh in um contract negotiations that's going to be a huge one I know health insurance hits you where it hurts and you must have it by law and just as a
human I won't say right but it's compassionate So my thought would be uh could we protect and grandfather those who are in and new hires maybe we don't pay at x% but they take at another
percent this happening um in private industry and I think as private go public eventually is going to have to because we know that that was always the thing if you had a public job you had fantastic benefits your salary was
usually considerably lower and you had um some job security due to the um union um contracts but um again I keep hearing the word unsustainable Um and I know we're all facing it Um so
I guess maybe it's time to think outside of the box a little bit Yeah No and I think uh the other one on there is the the retirement contribution and it used to be 9% We're at 11% I think we're going to see the at some point it's that's unsustainable and people are
going to go to the 13% of their check is now going to go to retirement because we're not going to have enough money to pay question about the health insurance for retirees the premium is 50/50 correct 50 split and for current
employees it is 30 and 70 so that somewhat of what you're alluding to Don that in future negotiations maybe that 3070's got to shift a little more nobody
wants to hear that or even I mean I cutting biting my nose despite my face here But the 50/50 I mean maybe that I mean somewhere those ratios have to be looked at because if you could shift
them a little bit then all employees have a stake in it and so you're not just targeting a certain group and saying oh well you get to be at 3070 but the rest of us are going to be at So
versus new hires coming on because you won't get enough new hires in relationship to the full payroll to make us it would take a lot a big enough bite in in that number years for
that for the new folk to to make an impact So it's 5:30 I figure we're going to wind up probably have people coming in on us shortly So I figure probably a quarter or six is probably the end of our
effective meeting time but um schools uh there was the munice and there was the school budget um did notice a lot of increase in tuition uh expense at least it seemed to
me like 600700,000 must be special education I said wow um like a lot to me But uh in terms of how one reviews that uh any thoughts on how you might want to approach that I
mean I know in the past we've asked for detail and then we've we've looked at it we've had the schools come in How would you like to adapt it Tommy alluded to the fact that that would be helpful if we had the superintendent come in He could pretty
much perform the same role that Mr Christensen performed as town manager and and Pam Blair the assistant because Yeah exactly She a wealth of knowledge Can you do that without inviting the
committee Yeah I'm not sure Is that politically correct or the chair could attend is it unofficial The song is unofficial We asked we had a list of questions last year and we got a lot of information up
front which truncated the conversation All right Um so why why don't we do this You want to maybe see if they might be available um meeting of 4:23 When is is that school vacation Yes
school vacation I think they got a school full school vacation on I mean Gordon would be would be working unless they took a vacation Unless they took that week Yeah they'd be working Yeah Well I could check
They might be If we do it so today's the what The 9th So the 16th we could take some time to prepare for some questions and have them come on the 23rd That's what I was thinking Yeah But that that way there we could kind of prepare some questions talk about them
on the 16th and then uh you know provide them for the 23rd So part of our homework for this week would be agenda we have questions for the schools to bring with us on the 16th
Does that sound through the chair Should we we're coming close to quarter six Should we make our agenda for the next meeting Well that's what I I'm just looking at what I what Don and I had kind of like uh put together I think at this point uh we do our follow up on the budgets that
we reviewed and vote Uh we get the follow-ups from Tom on a couple of questions that we're going to get clarified Um we go through the capital projects plans Um we we do the reserve policy and the
sources and uses We may have a little bit more discussion on the insurance and retirement because it's a big deal But uh I would say uh we spend some time getting our our questions ready for the
for the schools And I would say we do that before we deal with the insurance and whatnot because that's that's not something that's going to be solved with this budget cycle So
uh and that would kind of be basically probably about as much as we're going to accomplish the thoughts That sounds good Right Um anything else And we know who's taking our
minutes so we're all set now Um maybe I'll try AI and see You laugh I know Well you know doesn't Zoom take minutes AI function that takes minutes
I read everything Enterprise fund must be time frame No no I didn't actually I I don't even have it on our on my agenda Ralph Um I Yeah it's one of those things that
um see where we are here Schools resolve other matters budget items Well actually if we get through town budgets through the capital
projects all we've got left is meeting with the schools Probably do it there All right Thanks for bringing it up Anything else All 13 motion to
adjurnn So move second Okay All in favor please say I Okay Uh jeez did I forget to do that I got second Yeah I thought so I did second He beat you to the punch Yeah Yeah Was
quiet Other any other discussion hearing None All in favor please say I I and then I'll entertain a motion to adjurnn the council meeting So moved Second Any other discussion All those in favor please say I I Any opposed You're
adjourned Thank you Thank you all