--------- Good evening and welcome to the special meeting of the town council and school committee on August 12th, 2025 at 5:00 pm. I'll call the town council meeting to order and I'll ask that the school committee chair Thank you, Mr. President. I will call the um school committee meeting to order as well. 5:00.
Thank you. Then I would ask that we stand for the pledge of allegiance flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
I'm gonna ask we take a quick moment of silence to reflect on all of the events. Thank you. In accordance with Mass General Law, this meeting is being recorded by ELCAT. And if there's anyone else in the audience, if identify yourselves. Seeing none, uh, our first
order of business is to approve under Massachusetts General Law, Chapter 268A, section 23B3, an exemption for Kathy Hill to participate in the process for school committee vacancy. Moved. Motion has a second.
Second. Motion's been made and seconded. Is there any further discussion? Seeing none, all those Oh, it's a roll call since Kathy's remote. Jenny, yes. Don, yes. Ralph, yes. Marilyn, yes. Tammy, yes. Um, Anna. Yes. Then it's up to you if you
do you need us to move on that forward? No, actually we need to. Okay. Y great motion passes. Okay. Our first order and only order of business for the special meeting is to fill the vacancy per the town charter
for the school. And so just as a quick recap for the public, there was a vacancy on the school committee. And so within 30 days of that vacancy, both the town council and the school committee members have to
meet to fill that vacancy with someone. And so we've sent out um an advertisement both in the reminder on the town's Facebook page and the town website uh seeking applicants for the position. and we received five letters of interest. Once those were were
received, we will now hold interviews this evening with each of the candidates. Each candidate will have approximately 10 minutes during which time they can provide a brief overview about themselves and their background. A few questions will be asked of them and then at the end we'll hopefully have
about 10 minutes to deliberate and nominate and appoint someone to fill that vacancy. Does anyone have any questions on the process? Okay, see none. We'll start with our first candidate, Kathy Hood.
Good evening. Good evening. So, just as a quick reminder, uh each candidate will have about 10 minutes and we'll start with a brief two-minute introduction that you can take to introduce yourself to the council and provide any background about yourself
that you wish to convey to all of us. and then we'll ask a series of three to five questions and then we'll close. Okay. All right. My name is Kathy Hood. I'm a lifelong resident of East Lang Meadow and a graduate of East Long Meadow High School. Actually, 50 years
next year. So, um I've been a teacher in education for 37 years, 32 of which were at in Birchland Park Middle School here in East Son Meadow. Um most of you sitting around the table know me as just the teacher but I did do a lot of other
variety of roles or carried a lot of variety of roles while I was there. I was the department chair um for 20 plus years. Sometimes it was just grades 6 through eight. Other years it the toward the end of my career it went from 6 to 12. Um primarily creating the budget,
making sure the money spent, uh developing curriculum were the biggest things that I did. There was a short period of time where um I wrote grants for the town of East Lang Meadow that was federal monies. I worked very closely with assistant superintendent at
the time, Terry Oligars. Uh we'd configure the great the grants. We'd make sure we stayed in within the parameters. We'd spend out the money. Some of the money was for paid for uh salaries for teachers. Others were supplies, programs, etc. Um, I was the
vice president and grievance chairperson of the East Long Meadow Education Association for 20 plus years. I also was on the contract negotiation team for 20 plus years negotiating contracts with the school committee um representing
unit A which is teacher union and unit E which was peer professionals. Um I sat on the principal um advisory council which was at that time the sight base level leadership team at Berson Park. Um I truly was blessed with a career in
East Long Meadow. That brought me great joy. And in June I was humbled to be inducted into the East Long Meadow Educator Hall of Fame. Um presently I also sit on the East Long Meadow High School athletic hall of fame committee and have been on it since the inception.
And so our main purpose is to induct outstanding athletes that graduated from East Long Meadow High School. So if you've been in the high school anywhere near the uh gymnasium, you'll see our plaques on the wall. That's the end of uh the show of our hard work that we do.
Uh I'm an active member in the St. Michael's Church and presently I do sit on a subcommittee of the town council. Why I would be interested in this? People say you're crazy. No. Um, I'm retired now and I have more time. Um,
I'm a doer and a hard worker. I'm committed to this community. Um, I love East Lang Meadow. Um, my 37 years in education and all the other things that I did besides being the teacher I feel provide me with the skills that I can
offer something to the roles and responsibilities of being on the school committee. Great. Thank you for your introduction and we can move to the questions. Thank you for being here Kathy. Um I'll start with the first question. What do you see as the core purpose of a public
school system and what the primary what is the primary responsibility of a school committee and that purpose? The okay primary responsibility of a school committee is to create policies
that they're followed to hire and fire superintendent um to evaluate our education programs. Um so what was the first part of your question? Speak to what you see as the core purpose of a public school system.
So public school system has to be holistic for every student that might come through the doors. Um and the role of the school committee is to make sure that that happens that we create a safe environment for kids. um
that we show inclusivity with our students. Um and I mean it it kind of you know the school committee sits up here but all that gets filtered down to where the grind happens in a classroom.
So besides the other things that they do but that would be one of them. Great. Yeah. Hi Kathy. Hi. Um, how would you approach making
decisions in areas where your personal values or biases may conflict with the values of the broader community? Well, I'm sorry, the broader school community. Uh, are you asking me like if I didn't
agree with the decision or No, I know in in fairness, you know, we all have certain values that we, you know, that we strive to keep. Maybe those values are in agreement with
others. Maybe they're they're not. And so the idea would be, you know, how would you approach decisions in areas where your personal values or biases may conflict with the values of the broader
school community? Well, you shouldn't be bringing your personal values in there if it's for the good of the child sitting in front of you or the betterment of the community. So, I guess I wouldn't tangle with I
don't know if I would even need to share my personal values if it's for the broader people that we're talking about. Is that is that what the question's asking? It's kind of confusing in a way like are we talking about one student? We talking about all the students or you know when
you're making decisions you can't bring in your personal values. You have to look at what is the decision that we're making. What do we want the outcome to look like? And the decision or why are we making this decision for the betterment of whom? Is it for the
student? Is it for a school person just one school? Is it for a group of people? Um so yeah I mean you know as a teacher none of that ever cover I never ever even went there. you know, you your
personal values are your personal values that you were taught through your family or whatever. Like I used to say to my kids all the time, you're you're not born prejudiced. Something it's a learned behavior. And so anything like
that stays out. You know, it's for the benefit of the good of the population. Thank you. Great. Thank you. Hello. How are you doing? I'm good. Um so my question um based on so the school committee can face a lot
of pressures from interest groups or wider political debates and even difficult budget constraints. So how would you prepare yourself to um make informed decisions or issues um that you're not necessarily expert in? Yeah, that's a good question. Thank you.
I'm one of those people that I know I stay in my lane. So, when I don't understand something, I ask a ton of questions, try to talk to a lot of people. Um, when we're talking just finances,
uh, yeah. Um, well, you know, you have to start with the needs of each building. Um, because not each building's unique and they don't necessarily have the same needs. So, you have to kind of start down there and
work your budget up from there. I mean, we just had a not a good year budget-wise, and I worry about what the future brings. I was in East Long Meadow when I'm going to say it was like 2004 when we was the
last rift I think we had and we lost 17 positions. So, you know, when we're looking forward to a budget, you what you lost trying to get it back. So, you know, you need to get the stakeholders at the table, find out what are the
needs so that students aren't at risk now are going to go without something, you know, when we start cutting programs. Um that's always a you know a thing that always bothered me like you know we didn't cut that this year but
you know like we cut music say and there's a student that could be sitting in front of you and that's the only less they actually love and like you know what I mean it just how do we keep everybody happy and give them give each child what they need and meet them where they're at.
It sounds like my um V sound is coming in and out. Can you hear me? Yes. Yes. Okay. Thank you. Uh Kathy, I have the next question and that is as you likely know that Superintendent Smith is uh retiring at the end of this upcoming
school year in June of 2026, which uh begs the responsibility of the school committee to conduct a professional search for uh his replacement. So the question is this, what qualities would you look for in a
new superintendent? Well, I would like to see the new superintendent have already done several leadership roles. Um, it would be great to see teacher,
you know, come up through the ranks that way, but that doesn't always happen. Um, someone who is well trained, has a lot of experience is big for me. That's the biggest thing. Um
I'd also like to see well we're building a new high school. So whoever comes in just because it the doors open, you know, fall of 2026 that that's not a done building project. I sat on the Birchland Park one. Those that paperwork goes on for another two years. So maybe
somebody that has an idea of what to do with that. Um you know, just their background. I'm glad to hear we're going to use a some kind of a help to to look for whoever may be replacing Gordon Smith.
You know, it's it's I would be very interested in what their leadership was, you know, multiple things that they have been in charge of or people, groups of people. um and having some kind of, you know,
strong decision making can have a relationship with the school committee that has a relationship with our town council. Um maybe even the people that represent East Slung Meadow in our, you know, state government that can help us, you know, find money or whatever's out
there, you know, that can reach out and get us what what we might need here. Great. Thank you. Yeah. Well, Kathy, thank you. You've come to the end of the uh interview process. On behalf of the school committee and the town council, certainly thank you for
your interest and your participation. As you know, there are five people that have uh shown interest. We are ecstatic about that. We are not ecstatic that we only get to pick one. I'm sure all five will be, you know, worthy of a selection. I I would encourage all applicants to continue their volunteer
efforts. I know you already do in many aspects. So, thank you for that. And um either way, however it goes tonight, okay, we'll carry on together. All right. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank all of you for all your hard work. I do appreciate it. And if we wait for the transition, our
next candidate will be Katie Freeman. anymore. Good evening everybody. Hello. Thank you for coming. Thank you for having me. As a quick recap of the process, we have about 10 minutes for each interview. You'll have the first two minutes to offer any remarks that you wish to
inform us about your background. um anything uh related to you and then we'll start with a series of three or four questions and then we will wrap up the interview. Okay. Uh so just to introduce myself, my name is Katie Freeman. Um I've been a
resident of East Long Meadow since 2020. I moved here August 2020. Um I am going into my 23rd year as a teacher in the Springfield public schools. I've taught grades six through 12 um at large schools, small schools, and I've taught
pullout classes, advanced IB classes. Um so I have a very broad educational knowledge. Um I'm also the mother of two boys uh that are in the East Meadow schools. My uh youngest is a student at Metobrook. My oldest son is a student at
Mapleshade. Uh, also one of my children's on an IEP, so I've dealt with the special education system and what parents go through with getting IEPs. And so I've been on the parent side of that, but I've also sat through many, many an IEP meeting as a teacher. Um, I
I wrote some things down, so um, so I said I'm a dedicated community member. I'm a parent of two children that are currently enrolled in our schools. I'm an experienced educator and leader. I have a unique combination of firsthand experience, professional expertise, and a deep commitment to ensuring that every student receives an excellent education.
My perspective allows me to balance fiscal responsibility, equity, and long-term strategic planning that best serve our student, staff, and our community. The three things that mo are most concerning to me are fiscal responsibility and how that is going to impact our students, equity, inclusion,
and access for all of our students, and strategic planning for the future of the Eastong Meadow Schools. Um I am also I've been very involved in the schools as a member of the PTO. Um currently I'm the president of the um PTO at Mapleshade and I'm the vice president of
the PTO at Metobrook. Uh I think as a parent I have sort of a unique perspective that not just my educational background but also I sort of see what's going on with my own children in the schools. Um I am very involved in sort of making a connection with the
community and talking to different parents. I am involved in various activities through the PTO. Um that gives me that sort of community connection that I really would like to build on and make sure that we have a lot of community input in the decisions we're making on the school committee. I have sat in many a meeting and talked
with many parents who decisions are made and we we sort of all talk and we're like where was our input on this decision that was made? So, I would like to really um increase community involvement in decisions the school committee makes. Great. Thank you.
Hi Katie, thank you for being here. Um the first question is what do you see as the core purpose of a public school system and what is the primary responsibility a school system plays in that core purpose? The core purpose of a school system is
to educate every single student that we have. It is very different in you know private schools they can they can choose the students that are coming to them. We don't choose the students that we are getting but is our responsibility to educate every student. The whether it's
uh diversity, equity, inclusion are very important and I want to make sure that every child in East Long Meadow is given the same opportunities to succeed as any other child and that all of our schools are given the same opportunity to give
children the ability to succeed. Great. Hi Katie. Hello. Um, how would you approach making decisions in areas where your personal values or biases may conflict with the values of the broader school community?
I think it's most important and I I do this as a teacher. Sometimes you have to take your own perspective out of things and look at it as for the what's the common good, right? what is going to benefit the majority of people that the decision is going to impact. And I
think, you know, I think about that as a parent. I think about that as a taxpayer. I think about that as a teacher that the decisions we're making are going to have an impact on all of those people. There there are people that, you know, uh live in East Long Meadow that decisions are made financially about the schools and they
don't have children enrolled in the schools and they have one view of things. there are, you know, people who don't currently have children in the schools and when we make decisions that are long-term, it's going to have a different impact depending on what your own perspective is. So, I think sometimes you have to remove yourself
from the situation a little bit and look at it. But I also think it's important that when it comes to your own morals and values that you do go back to those things sometimes and sort of say like are we making a decision that is a financial decision but maybe you know
morally it's not something that we want to you know to lean into and that sometimes you have to make decisions with your head but sometimes your heart is also going to be involved in making those decisions. Thank you. Right. Hello, Kathy. Oh, is it Kathy?
Katie. Katie, I apologize. It's all right. Yeah, bad eyes, please. It happens all the time. So, my question, um, the school committee can face a lot of pressure from interest groups, um, wider political debates and difficult, um, budget constraints. So, the question is, how would you prepare yourself to make
informed decisions um, on issues that you may not have expertise in? I I think really seeking out the information. I'm I'm a history teacher. Research is like my thing. So, um, I think seeking out the information in order to make an informed decision is
important. And that's again where I talked about getting community input and really reaching out to the community and finding out what people really want and what people are thinking is really important when we make decisions. That just making decisions with, you know, five people talking in a room is not
necessarily the best way to make decisions. That we do need to figure out what is going on in the outside community and what people are looking for. So, I think it's research and also collecting information from the community. Perfect. Thanks, Katie. I have the next question. Um,
it's okay. You don't have you don't have to turn around. Um, as you probably are aware, uh, Gordon Smith will be retiring at the end of this next school year, which will, uh, require the school committee to undertake a
professional search to hire a new superintendent. So, um, that said, what qualities would you look for in a new superintendent? Oh, there's so many. Um I think the first one is that they have a strong uh
background in teaching. For me, I think too many times we have a lot of people who step into the role of leadership positions where they don't necessarily have the expertise in the background. And when you're in front of students, especially postco, I think things have changed and we really need somebody who
whether they were in the classroom or very actively engaged in what's going on with education currently is important. I think it's important that they have a strong knowledge of union issues and negotiating contracts. And I think that that's going to be something that we
really have to be concerned with is that um times are changing and attracting and keeping the best teachers is important especially when we have um budget constraints. And so I think that that's important. And I also think that they
need to be a a true leader. I've I've always believed in sort of the idea of like servant leadership that the leader is really there to make sure that they're doing all the things necessary for the people below them to do their jobs to the best of their ability. Um so if it's I don't want sort of a top down
telling everybody what to do. I really want it to be um more I mean obviously they would be making the decisions but making sure they're making the decisions that are for the best of the entire community and not just um you know as a
as a power as a power grab. And so I think really finding somebody that wants to work with the community, wants to work with the teachers, wants to work with parents and the broader community is really important. Thank you. Welcome. Thank you.
Well, Katie, this is the end of uh the review process. Uh on behalf of the rest of the school committee and the town council members, thank you uh for your interest. Know we have five uh people who are interested, which is great news uh to see people wanting to be involved. However, it's a difficult decision
because we only get to pick one today. I would encourage you, as I would everyone else, to continue with your efforts, volunteer. I know you said PTO and we're very thankful that you continue to work at that aspect, too. Thank you so much for coming tonight. Thank you very much for having me. Thank you. I told you. Yeah.
They don't. I'm sorry. All right. That's funny. So verbal. Mhm. Hello. Hi. Good evening. Hi. Sit right here. Yep. Yes, absolutely.
Well, my name is Natalie Jurgantis for those of you that don't know me. Um, I am a lifelong resident of Esau Meadow, proud graduate of our public schools. I'm also a parent. I have a daughter who's going to first grade this year and
my son will be entering kindergarten next year. Professionally, I've worked as a physician assistant in the emergency room in urgent care for the past 12 years. I'm interested in joining the school committee because I want to give my kids
and other students the same strong education that I had while also addressing the modern challenges that we face today with social media. Great. Thank you for the introduction.
Okay, that's the first question. The question is do you see as the core purpose of a public school system and what is the primary responsibility that core purpose? Okay. So
the primary responsibility of the school committee I would see it I would say would be like um shaping the school's policy overseeing the budget I think it's like we hire and something
with the superintendent and uh making sure the district like making sure the district aligns with it like the smart goals that ESTO has as far as other thing that you said was what
um how do you see the um school committee what role does the school committee kind of play in that greater core purpose? So I think the school committee plays a vital role in well our public schools are one and um
like with the spark goals with the whole child like just making sure that the well budget goes to allocating all the resources to the student but making sure each student gets everything in everything they need to be successful to
thrive to graduate as like a responsible citizen be resilient Um, like I attribute my public education here in Esau Meadow, me being a PA, to the strong school system that it was then, which it still is, but
Hi, um, how would you approach making decisions in areas where your personal values or biases may conflict with the values of the broader school community.
I think the the first thing I would do would be to listen to everyone involved. Um, gather all the facts, ask questions,
um, keeping keeping the students in mind, like keeping the students in at center, like they're the shared goal. Like that's the purpose. Even if we disagree on something in the end, we all have common ground with the students being the center.
Thank you. Hello, Kathy. I mean, Natalie, I'm I'm lost today. I was in PD. No. So my question is um so the school committee um can face a lot of pressures
um from interest groups and wider political debates and and some difficult budget constraints. So how would you prepare yourself um to make informed decisions on issues that you may not necessarily be an expert in? No, they gave me the long question.
Wait, so what would the disagreement part or So it it would be like how would you make decisions or how would you make informed decisions with all those other factors coming at you? Um debates or you know other other pressure or stuff like that on issues that you may not
necessarily have expertise in. Well, I think like kind of going back to what I just said or like even in the emergency room like we have to make tough decisions all the time and I think the first thing that you have to do is just kind of look at the entire picture listen to
everything everyone involves like and again I would go back to like the common theme of like the students are at the interest of our heart and the public schools and that's where we have to find common pounds. Great. Thank you,
Natalie. Hi. Uh, I'm the voice behind the curtain like in Oz. The voice. I'm like, um, as you are probably aware, Gordon Smith will be retiring at the end of this school year and the, uh, school
committee will be undertaking, uh, a professional search to, uh, find a replacement. Um, what qualities would you look for in a new superintendent? Um, that's good question. Let me think
here. Uh so I mean as far as like a superintendent I first would look wanted to look into their background like their education like prior experience. Um thinking as far as like
whether they are I guess I would just looking for all the qualifications education wise and what would they be willing to like contribute to our district? What are what are their plans with the school? Um I know like if
it's going to be next year just mean in general Massachusetts just went through the Senate with like the bell to bell school law. So next for 2026 they're thinking of implementing implementing like a bell-to bell. So if that was the case I think the superintendent would have a big say in something like that.
Thank you. Great. Well, Kenya, Natalie, we've come to the end of the questionings. Um, behalf of the rest of the school committee and the town council members, thank you so much for your interest and for coming tonight. As you know, had five people uh put their names forward
and we are quite grateful for that. Um, it will be difficult to pick one of the five and as I'm doing with everyone else, I certainly would encourage you to stay involved with the schools uh at any level that you're able to. Great. Okay. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you.
Thank you. Hey. Hi. Just the quick uh recap on the process. We'll give you two minutes at the beginning to introduce yourself and provide an introduction and then we'll have four questions for you.
Yours. Great. Uh I'm Carrie Tarzabski. Um I have children who've been through the school system. I'm excited about this opportunity because I said to some of you earlier, I've had a lot of evening commitments and pacing kids around with sports and now I have the time to
actually dedicate to the school committee. Um, I've my whole professional career has been in education. I started off as a high school English teacher in a neighboring town. Um, and then moved into educational leadership um, at the college level primarily helping students transition successfully from high school
to college. Um, I just finished my PhD at UMass where my research was on supporting neurode divergent learners. So, I bring some experience um about what it's like to move from uh IDEIDA to ADA and um I have children who also have
been on IEPs. Um so, that piece is important to me. Um as an administrator, I've worked for institutions that have had significant budget deficits, 10 million to 12 million budget deficits. And so, I've had to make be part of decision-m around finances. I was a
college administrator in COVID. So I had to make a lot of decisions around crisis management and policy decisions that weren't always wellreceived but were necessary decisions. So I have you know that experience. I've I've led different committees. I've been part of cross
collaborative committees and so I I bring that experience as well. Um, and I think for me in the role, I I'm very student centered and I think making decisions that are data informed with the students in mind, but also having worked with staff, um, I think it's
important to think about, it's sort of like, you know, on the airplane, you have to put your own oxygen mask on first before you can um, put them on your children. So, I think it's also important to think about how we're making decisions around supporting the staff so that they can create amazing
experience um, for our children. Great. Thank you. First question. What do you see as the purpose of a public school system and what is the primary responsibility a place in that
core purpose? Yeah, I mean we want to create a great educational experience for our children that's relevant that's going to help them to move on to the next phase whether it's college or work um or again supporting students with disabilities to be able to um have uh a
great life after school. Um I think school committee is you know it's about transparent communication about how decisions have been made and being response responsive to your constituents and um being informed about what's going
on with DESIE and policy as you're reviewing policy and um having knowledge of finance and budget management and again you know you're this is a year hiring a new superintendent so having a sense of what's needed from our staff as
well. So, um it's important role. Yeah. Hi. Hi. Um how would you approach making decisions in areas where your personal values or biases may conflict with the values of the broader school community?
Yeah. I mean, I've been in roles where I've had to make, you know, difficult decisions. And um I think for me it's about um listening and understanding and having the data in front of you um that supports the decision and then being
really transparent and open in your communication. I think that helps in terms of how decisions are received um and you know you're in a particular role and the focus is on a particular thing which is to create a great learning environment for our children. And so
like that's the basis for the decision. How is this gonna improve or benefit the students and staff? Thank you. Hello. Um hi. So my question is um the school committee can face um strong pressures
from interest groups, wider political debates and difficult budget constraints. Um how would you prepare yourself to make informed decisions on issues that you may not an expert at? Yeah, I mean I think you can't you're never going to know everything about everything and so you know what's coming
to you ahead of time hopefully and you have time to having just done a PhD you have time to dig around and do some research and get familiar um with state um policies and um for me I would want to read as much as I could about the subject to try to be as informed as I
could but also be open and aware of what I don't know. Great, Carrie. I have the uh next question. Um, as you alluded to this in your answer to
question number one, um, Gordon Smith will be retiring at the end of this school year. So, the school committee will have to prepare for a professional search to find a suitable replacement.
What qualities would you look for in a new superintendent? Yeah. Um well, it's an important role and I think first I'd look to see about lenture and professional experience. Um as I said, I think it's important to have someone who is a strong
communicator. Um who has strategic leadership and vision. Um I think presence is important. Being presence in the schools, understanding what the day-to-day experience is like for the folks that you're making these important decisions for. Um, you know, it's
interesting times. I think if someone has some experience with crisis management, um, obviously some budgetary experience, stuff development. I mean, it's it's a big job. There's lots of pieces that they hopefully will have some experience with, but I would I
would want to make sure that they've had enough time and tenure in in the school system that have a sense of what the day-to-day is like and to be able to do the work. Um, and a working knowledge of the state, you know, Desi and what's going on in the state.
Good. Thank you very much. Well, Carrie, we've come to the end of our questioning. On behalf of the members and the town council members, thank you uh for your interest in coming tonight and answering our our questions. Um, as you know, there are five people that have showed
interest. We are very happy to see that interest. Uh it's good for the town of E Sal to have so many um allqualified individuals. Uh as I do for everyone else, I would encourage you to continue to volunteer and help out as much as you can as a district and uh we'll let folks know as soon as we can.
Thank you so much for coming. Thank you. Thank you. Good evening. Hello. Just as a quick recap on the process, we'll have about 10 minutes and you'll have the first two minutes that you can provide an introduction and some background on yourself. Okay.
And then we'll have four questions from the school committee and the council. Okay. Perfect. Uh well, first and foremost, thank you for I know that I am the last one, so it's a little repetitive here, but uh thank you for considering my uh my letter and for um
for I think you have a great pool of candidates and out of all of them that I I know personally um whoever you pick, I think the board will be well served. I think anybody who is stepping into this role is already going to be um really
having that a mix of valuing volunteerism and serving our community and passion for East Log Meadow as well as um educational and um education knowledge and um sorry
experience. But um I think that I I have a mix of all of those from serving on other community boards from the library and um helping around town to being engaged with the PTO direct classroom experience as a former teacher serving
on um as a room parent. I but I believe what really sets me apart for this role is combining my professional skills with my pastoral and community care skills that come from serving the most vulnerable in our community. That through that experience from serving those people, I have a heightened
awareness of what people are facing and an increased ability to kind of see those needs with and respond with empathy and compassion. and that certainly applies to their academic needs as well as a holistic family approach. In terms of serving on the
board, uh it allows me to approach and see families all across a socioeconomic, academic, and cultural differences that East Long Meadow does have and properly advocate on behalf um in a measured and balanced way. As a former teacher, I
recognize the needs of our teachers to furnish their own classroom supply closets, use high quality curriculum, and to see the whole student as an individual person. As a mom, I of an advanced child, I recognize the need for
better programming for our gifted students in town. And on the flip side, as a former foster parent of a high special needs student, I that really required um special care, I recognize the need for passionate staff members
and advocacy from the whole team. As a room parent and PTO member, I certainly recognize our needs for a pair of professionals and aids helping with individual needs in the classroom um and classroom management, but also for collaboration between families and teachers. Um, as a nonprofit CEO, I
recognize for the needs of the budgets to be reasonable and balanced and to stay within those parameters. And as a pastor to many hurting people in our community, I recognize the needs for our schools to be safe places for our children and staff members. Um, I'm passionate about joining the school
board to be able to make sure all of those needs are being addressed. Um, and one of the voices of our community is all of the voices of our community are being heard and valued. So, thank you. section.
Well, thank you. First question, the question is, what do you see as the core purpose of a public school system and what's the primary responsibility a school committee plays? Yeah. Um core purpose of the whole education
system public school. So I think first to provide a quality education that's setting up the success for the students future um but not minimizing their current needs. So not negating that in order for them to have a successful
future that they need to be able to learn. And so in order to learn in that moment their needs need to be met where they're at now. So for example if a student goes to school hungry they're not going to be able to learn. So in order to you know have a successful day
those physical needs to be able to be met before the education monks need. So the school has to be able to um see the whole student. So see that their their future self but also their current struggles and where they're at right now. And so the role of the school is to
see predict where they can go and dream with them for their future but also be realistic of here's where you're struggling right now. Um, hi Michelle. Hi. How would you approach making decisions
in areas where your personal values or biases may conflict with the values of the broader school community? Yeah, great question. Um, I have a high priority of listening and I think that when we can slow down and
listen first and listen to everyone's um, so if we're coming to a approach a problem or to tackle an issue, listening to all sides to be slow to react and think about um, long-term rather than
reactionary planning um, can usually help negate some of those hot tempers or slow down my own maybe biased thinking or my own prejudice. When I hear someone's individual story, when I
listen to their life experiences, when I hear where they're coming from, it's no longer uh my own preconceived notions, but I actually have a a face to go with that story and a reality to go with that truth and be able to blend in um both of
those things. So think through things logically and put aside what I am bringing to the table and examine um everybody's input and be be a listener before a um contributor. Thank you.
All righty. So my question is um so the school committee can face strong pressures from interest groups or wider political debates and difficult budget constraints. So the question is how would you prepare yourself to be informed um about these decisions on especially on issues that you may not be expert in?
Yeah. Um well first I think the internet has a wealth of information. Uh, and I think that we have to be willing to acknowledge that we don't have all of the information ourselves and so willing to learn and to do research and um, and
acknowledge where you're getting your information from first, but then be willing to um, kind of step out of that comfort and asking, you know, other, you know, maybe reaching out to other towns or other um, co-c collaborators
opinions. and um understanding uh that they have more knowledge or more information than maybe we're bringing to the table and um humbling ourselves in order to ask for help to to gain that insight when coming
to that. Perfect. Thank you. Hi Michelle, I have the next question. Um, you're probably aware that uh, Superintendent Smith will be retiring at the end of this upcoming school year,
which will then require the school committee to undertake a a professional search for um, a successor. What my question is, what qualities would you look for in a new
superintendent? So, as a former teacher, uh, a superintendent is someone that I have thought about quite a bit. Um, and as a did not work in East Long Meadow, so on this, I worked in a in a different district in Massachusetts. Um,
I I was able to examine this and seeing some good qualities and some bad qualities in that superintendent. Um I I think positive qualities is a lifelong learner. Someone that is willing to think out of the box. Um be a problem solver. Um be able to see the whole
student and the whole family, not just the academic needs, but again addressing the entire family situation that's happening. Understanding that their school and their school um whole body is a community and treating it like that. that the classroom is a safe space
because it is created that way. It's not just automatic that there there has to be from top down um policies put in place to allow that physical safety and mental safety in order to allow everyone in there to flourish um integrity and
social emotional intelligence and willing to keep expanding and um changing the way that things are done. Just because education and classrooms were operated in one way doesn't mean that they have to continue to be that way. And some of our best success
stories or most um empowering educational movies that we might watch or because teachers were willing to take risks or principles were willing to, you know, um advanced certain out of the box thinking. And so finding a superintendent that's willing to take
risks and willing to take chances on certain ways of doing things. um is what I would look for. Thank you. Thank you. Well, Michelle, we've come to the end of the interview. Uh on behalf of the rest of the school committee members and the
town council members, we all want to say thank you for coming uh and giving us uh some of your time. As you know, there are five people and you alluded to this at the very beginning and I would concur with you that any of the five um would certainly fit right in. So, uh again, thank you uh for coming tonight.
Damn, I appreciate Thank you. Head flap. Yeah. Good luck is right. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. We have now concluded the five interviews.
The downside is now is the difficult uh choice of going through each of them and making a decision. Um I think the process for this if everyone's agreeable to it is we'll have some time if anyone wants to share any particular thoughts
that they out to them and then we could do either just a nomination and vote or we could have each person make a you know nomination
on someone that they liked and then whomever got the most likes at the end will make the formal vote to nominate and appoint. Yes. Preference on the procedure.
Um I I I anticipate that we may be able to come to one motion but I think if we have some discussion maybe that will change but should we head in that direction perhaps? Sure we can head in the discussion. So through the chair. Sure. So my thought is is we go around the room and
basically say who our number one pick would be. Obviously if there's six people that have said the same name then we make a motion to nominate that person. Um but my fear is if we nominate
one person to begin with it it pretty much pushes everything towards that person. Yeah. And I I would say that we uh open conversation to all first before the nomination is made as with my point. Yep. Great.
Does anyone want to kick off the discussion? Antonella does. All right, I'll kick it off. I have all my notes. Um, I thought all of the candidates did a really great job. Um, I was really
impressed with how they all answered question four about qualities of a superintendent. So, I do feel like people are paying attention and it's something that I think our community is
is really thinking about because it is a really big decision um and could really impact our schools depending on who we we put in there. Um I think that Natalie stood out to me. um
she spoke about putting the students first in a lot of her answers and that's that's basically I mean that's the number one factor that I also think of when I'm basing any of our decisions
on any of this of the school department. Um so William Well, now I know what the Wizard of Oz felt like when I was on the other side of here. It is. So, it it and I do appreciate the work
you guys did. Um because it it seemed like a lot. Um for me, I was I was torn. I was torn between um two of the candidates. Um I thought again, they all did well. I thought they all answered the questions well. And you know, and these are some
difficult questions. Um, for for me it was it was it was Katie. Um, I loved her answers. I loved her takeaway about education and students and and the common good. Um, but I won't but I won't deny that Natalie really, you know, she kind of
struck a core with me and it could have been the educational side, but just being able to to reel off a lot a lot of the um a lot of the thoughts about what we were doing and how we were doing it. I'm sorry. I'm off today. I'm really off and I need to keep my glasses on.
Carrie, she was the one that had the doctor the doctoral student. She was able just to list off her um you know her educ expertise, the transportation, the debt. She talked about density. She talked about management. She even started leaning into the question about number four even before we asked. Um I
think she might have been the only one that talked about lure um and some budget and budget constraints. I I just that just kind of really those two are my top two. I'm not sure, but those are my top 10. Great. Any thoughts?
This is the worst part. I awful. Um I think all five of these women are highly competent individuals. Yes. Um William, I happen to have the same two individuals as my two standouts,
Katie and Carrie. I think um Katie's background um she spoke a lot about her background in education, but she has seen um you know she has perspective from several different vantage points. Um I liked Car's and I also liked her um
answer specifically about working with um with our union um specifically our teachers union. Car's answers, um, I thought they were really all-encompassing and really showed how much she values the whole child. Um, the the way that she spoke about her
willingness to, um, research um, also stood out to me. So, those um, stood out as my top anything, Anna? Oh, well, I mean, if you want to save to last, I don't know if you wanted to go last. I can save to last.
Sure. Yeah. Um I think I was my two standouts would be Carrie. She Oh gosh. She's PhD. Yes. Okay. Want to make sure I'm saying the right name. And also Natalie. I think Carrie I I think the way I'm looking at
it is the four of you kind of have the teacher kind of role covered. And I feel like when I'm looking at Carrie or Natalie, Natalie is a PA, so she's totally has different perspective than you guys um
than current committee going. Um and then if you wanted to kind of stick with more of a teacher educational uh background, then I think Carrie did amazing. So I think I think what you guys are looking for or what we're all looking
for might might be what helps me make my decision. like are we looking for a different perspective or are we kind of sticking with the I don't want to say same old perspective but like you know same kind of general area that's
for me to answer your question I thought you were saying second to last I certainly can I was trying to answer question okay it's I think it's important to have a working knowledge from the get-go of this process to some extent because they're going to be asked to jump right
in and the term And um so I would personally value more experience and knowledge about education than an outsider being an outsider that I am. So I don't know if that helps your answer.
It wasn't really a question. I was just saying my topic and you should have told me to stop it early on. But anyway, but that's that's my thought process. Understood. So yep. I'll save myself to
last so I don't bias anyway debate anything I say. Okay. Um when I look at the makeup of the current school committee, you know, it's like the makeup of the council. We
each bring different different gifts and talents to the table. And I think an important feature of a committee is balance. Um, we would like to see individuals bring different perspectives
to the process. Um, everybody that came here this evening can do the job. If you're smart, if you're interested, you read, you study, you can do the job. You don't have to have a PhD or college education. Really, you can do the job. And so I look at what how the committee
will benefit by any um decision going forward. Hey, I don't dispute anything anybody said. I have two choices, too. And my first choice is Kathy Hood. And the reason why I zero in on Kathy is
um she's given a great deal of her time and talent to this community for a long time and she knows the district. There isn't anyone on the school committee that has, in fact, I don't remember the last time someone's been on the school
committee who actually worked within the district. We have educators outside of the district bringing important pieces of information to the table, but not within the district. She knows she knows East Long Meadow. She knows
school department. She knows the the issues that have come up before us over time. She's also retired, so she's seasoned. And I think that brings a different perspective to and I would say that because I'm seasoned, but she brings a different perspective to the
process. Um I as far as Carrie, um all the wonderful things we've said about her, I absolutely agree with. Um so those would be my my two choices. That's it. Thank you, Marilyn. Ralph,
um I'm going to agree quite a bit with Marilyn. Um I think all the candidates did a fantastic job and um whoever is chosen will do a great job. Um you know, I was leaning towards Kathy Hood. I like the
fact that she's retired and will be able to dedicate a lot of time because, as you know, um being on the school committee takes a lot of time. um she has a lot of knowledge within the schools. Um she's dealt with stuff, so
she knows from a teacher's perspective, um what she would like to see, uh the school committee, um be able to um help out with. Um but I will say, uh Carrie did a absolute blowout job on the
interview. Uh her answers were pristine. Um her knowledge was incredible. Um, those would be the two that I would be uh trying to choose in between and but like I said, I think anyone we choose will do a great job.
I was really happy to see that I feel we got an increase of candidates and I think that's good to have more choices and whatnot. Um, I think like what everybody said, I think the all five are more than qualified to jump right on the school committee. I think we have a
unique situation too compared to past appointments that we've done because we have the superintendent search, we have obviously the budget um and then we're going to have a new school soon enough um that's going to be opening up. So I thinking about this, you know, trying to
determine, you know, what does the committee have currently and maybe what is it lacking or what it could leverage and have in those type of discussions and things that are going to come up. So, to me, I um you know, I'm I was going back and forth between Kathy Hood
and Carrie. Um I thought Carrie did a really good job on the interview. Um I had I remember Miss Hood from when I was in Berlin Park Middle School, but she was a teacher. She I'm not sure, Connor. She might have been your teacher as well. Um and you know, we have a really
good set. I mean, I like I love pretty much all of my teachers through the Son Public School System. We have a really great group of teachers. I know, you know, I think things have probably changed since me and Connor have been there. Um, but I think it I think having that experience of being from the
district, I think is an important asset on top of that educator perspective as well. Um, I did like that Carrie came from a sort of different perspective of education, that collegiate level, because we're gonna, you know, high school is a lot about preparing most of
those students. a lot of them will go to community college or full four-year college or maybe a doctoral degree or something of their own. Um, so having that uh experience is also an asset. Um, but I I was really impressed I think with all five of them because they all
had slightly different u backgrounds even if majority of them weren't. So yeah. um echoing pretty much everybody in this room has already said. Um you know, I guess my two uh top two I I was kind of
looking at similarly looking at different perspectives. Um Natalie kind of fit that tea to me in terms of just a different discipline, different perspective coming to the school committee, but I also thought Carrie was head and shoulders um a little bit above everybody else in terms of her responses. So those would be the two
that I'm kind of looking at. Great. Thanks, Jim. Kathy or Kathy both Kathy trying to shut me out. Um I'm I won't be redundant because I would simply be uh echoing all of your
introductions. Uh there were two who stood out to me. Uh very much so Carrie um but also uh Kathy. um she understands the culture of the
the district and she understands the culture of the town. She's grown up and grown through through both of those and I think uh given the fact that she's retired uh and has the time to put
forward to it um would be an asset. She's very measured in her thinking. um she's not easily um incited to, you know, be off the handle. And I'm not suggesting
any of the others are, but I'm I'm speaking about I what I think are her strengths, and she knows she's lived it. She knows what the district needs going forward, the school district. Thank you, Kathy.
She liked it. Did you keep a tally? Yeah, I did. Yeah. So, I think some consensus is evolving, right? Probably down to two, I would say. Did two pop up? We are. Yeah. What are those two?
Is there four? Okay. Yeah. If we go by numbers so far before you and I share our opinion, we're at Carrie with the most consensus and Kathy Hood with the second most. Right. So, I think we're there. We're
close to that. Yep. So, I would just leave it at that for now. If you wanted to add Yeah, I'll share my thoughts, too. Um, I agree with everyone that I would be happy with any of the candidates that we interviewed. I think they'll all do a
great job. Um, I think the about a different direction, I had three that were kind of top of my mind. I agreed with Kathy Hood and that she's grown up here and been part of the district. um definitely has a lot of experience
within Esau Meadow. I liked Katie as well in part because some of the answers she gave around history and doing some research and getting involved and figuring out things that she may not be as familiar with. But then certainly Carrie had a lot of great answers and I
think she has a broad experience in a bunch of different areas that will probably be beneficial to the school committee over the next year looking for a superintendent because there's a lot of areas that you'll want to find out about the candidates and I think she's had some experience in each of them to
know how to ask some of those questions. Agreed. Yeah, you gonna talk too. Yeah. No, I mean I I I agree with a lot of So tell us. No, I I mean I I if you want
my uh opinion, I think Carrie um answered uh most thoroughly with the most understanding of what we are looking uh at in the future, an understanding of budgets, policy, desi, schools, higher
education. Um again, all all of them. We could pick any of them. I know that work well with them. Um but um that would be my my response. Great. So now the tough part is a motion.
Well, well, what were the what were the We had two. Why don't we had 10 people say Carrie's name? Okay. We had she probably
Kathy Hood's name, two for Katie, three for Natalie, and no one for through the chair. Maybe it would be Yeah, mostly because who that preference between those final two candidates won't be.
No, it was you were determining it by this. Oh, so that's what who it is comes in votes to those um you know some of you mentioned other candidates right so you may choose you know Kathy instead
of Carrie so my suggestion would be we basically go through and say who would your final vote I would say we make a motion and vote on it and either majority or won't so if I make a motion to nominate Kathy
Hood um the problem comes in is then then you're choosing to vote against someone. I would rather see you go around and if there's six if there's someone that gets if there's still 10 to you know I think potentially we could come to consensus pretty quick here I mean I think we're
already there no it said 10 can we entertain a motion would you entertain that now when you want to move I would make Ralph what point of information Ralph has a he already moved that's what I started with
yeah I said I make a motion that we nominate Kathy Hood I thought you were phrasing it as a question. Sorry, I didn't apologize. Yeah. So, I don't think there's a question on the floor yet. Did you make a motion? Yeah,
that was my mo I I make a motion that we nominate Kathy Hood for the position. Second that. Motion has been made and seconded. Is there any further discussion? It is a roll call vote. Kathy. Uh Kathy Hood.
No. Yeah. Yes. I'm sorry. Yes. I should have said it either. Yes. Don. Yes. Ralph. Yes. Marilyn. Yes. I am a No. No. Hannah. No. Greg. No. No. No.
One, two, three, four, five, six. Okay. So, I don't think we have enough there. Okay. Is there another motion? make a motion to nominate uh Carrie Parker.
Motion has been made a carry. Is there any further discussion? Seeing no further discussion. Kathy, no. Jim, yes. John, yes. Ralph, yes. Marilyn, yes. I'm a yes. Anna,
yes. Greg, yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Mr. Mr. President, I will change my answer to yes in the spirit of professional consensus. Thank you.
Motion passes. Thank you all. He's still here. She's still here. Yes, they're outside. So, we'll let them. Would you like them? No, we don't have to bring them all. We're going to No, we'll do it after we done. So, if the school committee would like
to make a motion to adjurnn I have a motion to adjurnn, please. Second. Motion made by William, second by Amy. Any other discussion? All in favor say I. I. Those opposed name. Motion carries four to zero. Thank you all council members. Appreciate your time and your efforts.
Thank you. Thank you. There a motion to adjourn the special town council meeting. So move. So move. Seconded. Any further discussion? Seeing none. Kathy. Yes. Yes. John. Yes.
Yes. I'm a yes. And this is a little of that thing. B1. Part: 2
Good evening and welcome to the regular town council meeting of August 12th, 2025 at 6 PM. It is now actually 6:22 p.m. I will call the meeting to order and ask that we stand for the pledge of allegiance. >> I pledge allegiance to the flag of the
United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. And I would ask that we take a brief moment of silence to reflect on the events going on both near and abroad.
Thank you. In accordance with Mass General Law, this meeting is being recorded by LCAT. And if there's anyone else in the audience recording, if you could identify yourself. Seeing none public comments. Anyone in the audience that wishes to give public comments?
I see no one physically and no one's raising their hand on Zoom. So, we will continue council comments. Do any counselors have a comment this evening? >> I just want to say great job uh kind of running another special meeting like this. I know we did this last year, so
um I thought it was, you know, executed. >> Thank you. Yeah, it's funny how we uh went like eight years of the council's tenure having never had to do it and now we've now twice. >> Yes, ma'am. I'd just like to say um the
procedure you put together was very well done and I appreciate it. It uh made life a lot easier. Thank you. >> Absolutely. >> Thank you all. And just for the public audience, if especially if you're watching remotely and weren't attendance the last hour, uh
the we had a joint meeting with the school committee and the town council to fill the school committee vacancy and Carrie Jarzabski was nominated and appointed as the U. My council comment um would just be
to say thank you to the health department for a successful hazardous waste day a few weeks ago. I participated in that and finally got rid of a lot of stuff we've been collecting for 20 years. So, >> but it was nice to have something like that that you could safely get rid of that and it was very easy and
convenient. So, thank you to them. >> Uh town manager report. >> Hi Tom. >> Hey, good evening. You guys are in like mid stride right now. Um so yeah, good evening. Um uh as usual, uh first we'll start with um
attached find uh project reports for the weeks of June 30th, July 7th, July 14th, July 21st, and July 28th uh for the high school and natiatorum. Uh obviously uh week to week uh when you see the
progress it's it's really staggering and sort of a testament uh how much hard work is going on uh in a given week on on site especially when you stack up five reports like this and see what's happening over more than a month. Um
so uh in a few short weeks uh we'll we'll let the final year of classes will begin at East Salto High School. We'll call it the swan song uh for for a building that has educated students of Islam Meadow since uh the 1961.
Um quick fiber update uh only because we had a meeting uh last week. I'm updating there's not much to update. We're we're very very close with our we've been waiting for make ready work estimates from the utility companies which uh are
almost done uh to the point where a bunch of the batches have already been reviewed by Westfield uh and questioned certain things that were listed as needed to be done that uh they disagreed with and upon further inspection they
came off that estimate because there was a mistake made one way or the other. So, uh we're we're really close to to having those completed uh probably the end of this month or early September. Um and then um we'll get to uh work on a sort
of a rollout plan. Um you know, based on uh those those estimates and what the project cost is going to be. uh we'll we'll have it phased out so that we can start to build and start to collect some
revenue as we continue to build. Um uh I recently sent a letter of support on behalf uh of the town for House Bill 2330 um an act relative to regional equity. Um, this legis legislation would reform the governance of the Springfield Water
and Sewer Commission, who uh we get our water from and send our sewer to, uh, and ensure the voices of all rateayers and communities are finally heard. Uh, some key reforms would be shared governance, uh, creation of an advisory board of local chief executives of the
communities that Springfield Water and Sewer uh, serves, um, and transparency and public accountability. Um, so thank you to uh Rap Aaron Saunders uh 7th Hampton District, Michael J. Finn of the sixth Hampton District, Mike Connelly of
26th Middle Sack District, and Kelly Peas of the fourth Hampton District for sponsoring this legislation. Um, and obviously there'll be updates and we'll see where that goes. Um, the town recently employed the services of uh human resources Services
Incorporated to uh perform a comp compensation and classification study. um undertaking uh was shaped by our collective interest in understanding and comparing existing compensation to surrounding municipal labor market um and ensuring our own internal equity. Um
import this is an important step to evaluate our compensation program to ensure we can effectively attract and uh more aptly retain our highc caliber talent. Um, we expect the final report and imple implementation plan in the
coming days, which we do now have. Um, and Audra and Rebecca and I are sort of sifting through that now and we'll have some sort of plan. Um, obviously we put some money in the budget for uh in in
advance of what we thought was coming from this. Um so but we'll have that conversation before any before we implement um probably this September. It looks like September is going to be busy already. Uh as it usually is.
Uh August 5th, the Esau Metal Fire and Police Department hosted a public safety open house uh at the fire station. Uh you I had mentioned this last meeting, you know, because of the high school construction and uh the the traditional national night out uh kind of got uh
lessened to just an open house at the fire station. Uh food and games, demonstrations. Uh the event was really well attended. Um thanks to uh Westcom Regional Dispatch who was there as well. Uh the Hampton County Sheriff's Office.
um Massachusetts Department of Fire Services and the state fire marshal John Davin. Uh the health department recently conducted the aformentioned hazardous waste day uh on July 19th at the fire station. Uh Trident Environmental Group
disposed of waste from 138 residents uh consisting of everything from propane tanks to lithium batteries and some mystery liquids that I dropped off uh from my late uncle's garage. Uh the next event uh due to demand uh is
already scheduled, but it's August 22nd of 2026. Um, and I real these are hard to uh schedule. Um, there a lot of planning actually goes into the event. It's not sort of an openhouse drive-thru. Uh,
there has to be enough staff on site to collect registrance. Um, and that's why we required you to sign up before the event. Um, so they have to get an idea of how much equipment they're going to need to take, how many cars are going to
show up. Um, so, uh, but I just want to remind everybody that we do have the ongoing, uh, relationship with, uh, NEDT in Westfield. Um, all you have to do is show that you are resident of Esau Meadow and you can drop everything off
there in the same fashion. Um, so, um, we have some upcoming events. Uh, coffee with the town manager, September 3rd. Um, the little E. Uh, September 5th here at 10:00 a.m. at the COA. They do a
little biggie. Uh, they call it the Little Eye. Uh, it's been really, uh, popular the last couple years. So, uh, that's, uh, September 5th again at 10:00 a.m. Another recycling event, uh, September 13th. This one got moved to Birchland. They had it at the high
school last year. Obviously, we're we're moving it to Birchland uh, because of the construction. Uh, this is more bulk waste kind of stuff. A lot of the things that um have um I didn't have a flyer. Tammy uh emailed it to me right before
the meeting. So, I'll get that we'll get that out posted. That's uh not till September 13th. Um there'll be some uh monetary contribution on some of the items similar to our uh our uh transfer station. uh celebrate EL September 277th
at 10 am at center field. Um that's always pretty well attended. Check that out. Um and October Fest again uh October 18th at noon at Brown Farm. I think this is our third annual. Um always a very well attended event up at
Brown Farm. So that's my report for the evening, but I'm happy to answer any questions about anything I mentioned or did not. >> Thank you, Tom. Yep. I have any questions? >> Okay. None. Communications
correspondence and announcements. Uh the first was just from the health department. They had put out a press release on July 29th uh just saying that West Nile virus found in East Long Meadow as well as some other communities in Western and Central Mass. Um so just
be cognizant of that. There are some things you can do to protect yourself, but there's more information on the town website and also mass.gov. of if you're interested then I had also attended um an MMA webinar last week uh with some municipal
legal updates uh from summer 2025. There were a few different things. Some was related to like land court rulings around tax title takings and calculation of interest which I am sure that our collector and treasurer will more than
happily uh follow that. There was some of interest to us though. Uh cannabis law and policy was heavily discussed especially around that social and equity component. That was one of the reasons that we couldn't
get the ballot question on um this past June. There's also a number of rules that municipalities actually have to follow when they do want to enable it even after it's allowed within their community. So something newer that I at
least I didn't know about was that you have to post all of the information on your town website. All of the rules, regulations, forms, etc. all has to be on one page that an applicant could go through and follow. You can't just have everything scattered around, which was news to me.
Um, but then there were also some new topics around delivery and social consumption since those have been recently allowed at the state level. Um, so something interesting if we were to allow it to consider how that impacts. Then there was also some discussion
around um ADU bylaws especially now that the state had finalized their regulations or almost completely finalized them. Um and so the attorney general's office has been rejecting a lot at least in part of the language that had been submitted to
them if not outright rejecting the entire bylaw that communities have been uh enacting. There was uh some helpful information though that you can't enforce parking requirements if it says like at least one. That's in violation
of the new regulations that they've put out. And you also can't be more restrictive than your other residential zones as well. That was most of what I talked about. There were a lot more details about some of that and places we could find some more information, but stuff that I'm
sure will be in the forefront of our mind when we get to those topics over the coming months. And then our next uh communication was the digital equity plan. I don't know you or Rebecca.
>> Yeah, Rebecca certainly uh I know and I'm not supposed to fumble through stuff. It was informational, but um I'll let Rebecca take over. >> Hi Rebecca. >> Thank you. Um so we had applied last
year for a digital equity planning grant and we were assigned through Massachusetts Broadband Institute uh consultant and the consultant worked with us over the past year and about 15 or so community stakeholders to develop this digital equity plan. Um the main
motivation for going after the grant was to help um the town figure out how to most effectively transition residents onto the m municipal fiber system because we expect that there will be a learning curve there. Um but as we started digging into the plan u many
more uh features to work on emerged. So at the back of the report that they created there's an action plan. Um we're presently um going after our first implementation grant um and it's all about increasing um digital digital
literacy um device access and of course access to affordable and reliable um internet. Uh I don't know if anyone had a chance to go through the report already, but if you did and wanted to ask questions, I'm I'm of course happy to answer them. Otherwise, you can shoot
me an email and we could talk it over that way. >> Great. Does anyone have any questions at this time? >> Just a comment. >> Sure. >> Um, they did a great job on it. There is a ton of information in it. Um, I actually only got through about half of
it and um I I was very impressed with uh all the different statistics and all and a lot of things I would have never thought about. So, >> yeah. And I'll just also point out um one thing that emerged that was also like a bit unforeseen. It's starting to
what do I want to say? Reconfigure or fortify the relationship that we have with the housing authority because that is a population um or the housing authority is serving a population that's a little bit different than the the rest of the community. And so we're able to um do some interviews there and find out
what their needs were and um hopefully create some more programming and access for um those residents of our town. Great. >> Yeah, I would echo the sentiment too that that was well put together and very thorough. So, thank you for your hard work and the committee's work on
>> Yeah. >> Thanks. >> Great. Thank you. >> Oh, sorry. >> Sorry, Kathy. >> Bye. >> I I'm babbling away and I'm muted. I I Rebecca, I just wanted to echo uh my uh
interest uh or pleasure when I read that report as Ralph said that not only um are there things that we need to know moving forward, but there was things in there I hadn't considered before and and one of them was what you said that there
is a hidden gem here in in the housing authority in that population who very much wants to be, you know, computer savvy a and have access. So to me that's a unintended benefit and I
think the report was nicely done. >> Thank you. >> Great. Thank you Kathy. >> We have no public hearings this evening. So, under orders of the day, licensing matters. Our first is to approve a change of manager for AMG Retail
One LLC doing business as Atlantis Fresh Market. >> Good evening. >> Good evening. >> Alexander Hogan representing AMG Retail um One LLC doing business as Atlantis Fresh Market at 227 Shaker Road here in
East Long Meadow. This is a uh application for change of manager for Miss Rebecca Dempsey. She has been um the current liquor license manager over in Springfield. So, she's got ample experience. She's been doing that since 2021, I believe. Um so, just the
managers are switching locations. Um Miss Dempsey will be working approximately 55 hours per week. Um and is tips certified, so we're available for any questions you might have. >> Great. Does anyone have any questions?
>> Have there ever been any issues with serving the, you know, purchasing alcohol or having it there at at the Atlantis? I mean, >> uh, at this particular location, not that I'm aware of. >> Thank you. >> Yeah. >> Great. If there's no other questions,
I'll entertain a motion. >> So, move second. Uh, >> do we need quick? >> Yeah. Oh, >> make a motion to approve the change of manager application from AMG Retail 1
LLC D uh L LLC DBA Atlantis Fresh Market 227 Shaker Road from Stacy according to Rebecca Dempsey. >> Second. >> Motion's been made and seconded. Is there any further discussion? >> Seeing none, Jim? >> Yes. >> Kenna, yes. >> Amy, yes. Marilyn, >> yes. >> Ralph, yes. >> John, >> yes.
>> And Kathy, >> yes. >> Motion passes. Thank you so much. >> Thank you. Thank you. Have a good night. >> Congrats. >> Thanks. >> Next, we have approval of a one-day liquor license for a wedding at the Norcross House.
>> I make a motion to approve a one-day liquor license for Kimberly Wilson for a wedding at the Norcross House, 89 Maple Street for August 30th, 2025, 4 to 10 p.m. >> Second. >> Motion's been made and seconded. Is there any further discussion? Seeing
none. Jim, >> yes. Anna, >> yes. >> I'm Yes. Marilyn, >> yes. Ralph, >> yes. John, yes. And Kathy, >> yes. >> Motion passes. Then we have another one-day liquor license for the St. Michael Players. >> Excuse me, Connor. >> Oh, sure.
>> There's an error on the agenda. It should not be handbook bingo. It should be handbag bingo. >> Handbag >> fun. >> Yeah. >> Oh, yeah. That's way more fun. >> I apologize. >> Okay. Or the St. Michael's Player for
Handbag Bingo. >> I make a motion to approve a one-day liquor license for St. Michael's Players, 53 Summers Road for handbag bingo for September 6, 2025, 5 to 10 p.m. >> Second.
>> Motion's been made and seconded. Is there any further discussion? Seeing none, Jim, >> yes. >> Anna, yes. Yes. >> Yes. Ralph, >> yes. >> John, yes. And Kathy, >> yes. Motion passes. Okay, next under financial matters we
have the fiscal year 25 endear report. >> There can't be any questions of the straight report. >> Um well I I said it uh last month in my report so I'll start with uh big thanks
to the whole finance department. Uh this is a lot of work closing the the year um chasing down invoices and incumbrances and um you know obviously thanks to all our department heads who do a great job also. But uh compiling all this uh and
putting in the uh in this form so we can see it all broken down the way that we can discuss it. Uh I just want to say thanks to the to the whole department because they they they really do an amazing job. Um, so, uh, as usual, Kim has every
piece of information you could possibly want on a spreadsheet. Um, to the point that we can't understand it. I think she does that on purpose. Um, >> sorry, sorry, sorry. >> There there are there are wonderful
explanations which uh we've talked about in in in the past year. uh you know obviously we do it during the budget too when there's that uh change in the numbers this is the reason for it this is the amount um and so obviously uh
there's the transfers uh the turnbacks and then the explanation for that turnback um you know most of them were were uh salary turnbacks uh we had a lot of um new hires we had a lot of
vacancies for a number of time and obviously everybody's budget is based on sort of full staff for a full year. Um and so uh a lot of those uh the I think the biggest one um
was probably health insurance again which was considerably lower than the turn back last year because uh we we sort of changed that number and dialed it back a little bit. Um and and again uh yes it it seems like a large sum of
money but we we are estimating conservatively that uh the everyone that we hire or most of the people that we hire will take the insurance and and we really have to we have to plan for that um because we offer it. Um and then um
you know I don't know if anybody had any particular questions. Um the turnback number uh in total um is $2.5 million or or just over that um which again is sort of a a testament of fiscal spending um
and not spending money just because it's in the budget uh for the most part. Um and and the spots that look like we could do a little more work, those notes are and that's why Kim put the FI26 budget all the way to the right that we
have sort of lessened those budgets based on if we're seeing a trend over year to year that this we're just budgeting too much. We've tried to remedy that in years to come. Um I don't know if anybody has any specific questions if you want to go through
every account. Uh, I don't know how you want to handle the um it would be a lot easier if Kim wasn't on vacation. She would just take it over. But um I I whatever your pleasure is, I'm happy to go through the whole thing if you want. >> Um >> if it's all right with you, maybe I
could just quickly read the email that she sent to you and I just to give a brief summary and then if there's we can go from there. Um so she had sent when she provided the spreadsheet to us um that incumbrances
are up 263,000 in fiscal year 25 compared with FY25. Feel like that might be a mistake. Uh contributing factors are the $55,000 settlement in the town manager budget, 17,000 in legal fees, the 193,000
increase in incumbrances for the school likely related to special education, and 95,000 in DPW incumbrances that were paid July 3rd shortly after year end. Turnbacks have been reduced in fiscal year 25 compared with FY24
by 338,000. This is primarily due to a reduction of 550,000 in health insurance turnbacks resulting from reducing the budget in FY25 to fall more in line with actuals a budgeting process utilized in FY26 as
well. In addition to the reduction in turnbacks, FY26 budgets were reviewed detail compared to historicals and 300,000 in reductions were made which are detailed on the bottom of the attached spreadsheet. Many of the turnbacks are related to department head
positions that were vacant or filled at a lower than budgeted salary and overtime and when billill payments not made in the police department. The DPW continues to have higher turnbacks, but we did make FY26 budget reductions for their departments to combat this
>> and and again the the DPW reasoning the same as last year, which was they've had a difficult time getting to full staff. And so that not only impacts the salary line item, but all the materials aren't getting used because there's nobody to do the work.
So, uh, it's sort of a a double-edged sword there. But, uh, again, we did make, uh, significant, um, adjustments to those budgets in FY26 so that we're not, again, this is that delicate balance of making sure we have enough money to operate the town, but
not overt taxing the community for a whole year. Um, so again, we we tweak it from year to year. We're watching the trends. We make adjustments as we need to make them. And sort of this is and again, we're hoping that this number
while we can tweak it to a nice happy medium is is always turning back something because that means we're not spending when we shouldn't be. Um, and that's something that we've sort of instilled in everyone that we're only
spending money on what we need, >> right? We're not spending on money on what we want. Um, and so that that hopefully we continue to turn back from a budget. So, we're not we don't have to spend everything we budget for if we
don't actually need to. And if we continue to uh get grants at the clip we're getting them, uh we're always going to save our budget from what what we budgeted for.
>> Does anyone have any specific questions? >> Um I I just one Connor please. So the the uh turnbacks if I I assume I understand this correctly will now revert into the general fund and or not
general fund the free cash and get certified in the fall. >> Correct. >> Okay. Uh the second question is um it sounds to me like an unfortunate theme uh or a struggle for Bruce Fenny to um
always have a full complement of workers to get the job done. Um is there a factor that can be uh pointed to? Are the salaries competitive enough which if
the answer is no obviously that means that has to be reviewed or is it just the nature of the workforce right now or >> things that we can't control? I would say a little of both, Kath. Uh mainly in
the building facilities division. Uh and that is because it's impossible for us to pay for instance a plumber what a plumber would make. >> Correct. Correct. Right. Right. >> Um so that I use that
I use that example because we don't have a plumber and we haven't for a year and a half. Um, and so it is difficult to not budget for a position that if we did get one, we'd need and we'd have plenty of work to do. Um, so that hole has been
there now for a a budget cycle and a half. Um, >> as well as the materials to do the work. >> And that and that's an unfortunate situation that I'm sure more than not municipalities are backed into. But when
it comes to necessary plumbing inspections and such, do you have to reach out to adjoining commi communities to get a helping hand or >> Well, so we we still have we have our plumbing inspector on staff.
>> Yeah. So that's distinctly different than an in-house plumber. Yes, I get that. And I think uh like I I or you would do at your house if there's certain plumbing things that you might be able to go to Rocky's and do our building facility staff and our
>> does that right? >> Yeah. They can do some of that stuff and then uh we would just hire a contractor for for a job that we couldn't handle in house. >> Gotcha. Does that make sense? >> It does. It's absolutely does. I was just curious about it's a tough
situation for small towns to be in. >> Well, right and some some positions tougher than others. I think uh you know I would say plumber electrician would be those those two would be um they're they're difficult to to fill
specifically. >> Correct. Thank you. >> Yep. >> A couple questions. >> Um so one is just a comment. I I know um other towns are having issues as far as getting um some trades people, plumbers,
electricians. Um and I know a few of them have decided to outsource it basically and have like uh three uh companies on hand that they've vetted that that basically can do contract work. And we may have to switch to that
if we can't find someone to work full-time. and and that conversation is is upon us at this point. Uh it's similar to what we we don't really have a HVAC deck on staff. You know, in a perfect world, that would be a position that we would add. So, we have to do
that. We have to have people on on sort of standby for us that we sort of pull off. >> Um >> Um No, Ralph, if you're still working, go ahead. >> My question, um under the town manager, the 55,000 Was that?
>> Yes. The legal. Yeah, >> that that was the legal. I thought that >> Yes. >> Just out of free cash and not out of your department. >> We can't pay bills out of free cash. It has to get transferred into something. >> Okay. Well, that makes sense then.
>> Yes, it does. >> Yes. Um and the only other thing I would say is the turnback looked very similar to last year. A few hundred thousand different. Um, like I said, I I commend the departments. Um, I know, um, I
believe our department turned back what, 32 cents. Uh, the town clerk, every penny helps. >> That's cutting like a postage stamp in half. >> That's Jackie. Again, some departments run extremely
lean and we have to be cognizant that you know what, there's going to be sometimes that departments aren't going to have the funding that we need to transfer in. Um, but when there's a department that, you know, was hoping to add on this software, that software like it, and they weren't able to, and
they're able to turn the money back, um, it doesn't mean that we're not going to fund them next year or fund them at a lower rate. Um, I mean, we appreciate, you know, them doing everything they can. So, >> yeah, it's a collective effort and it's
it's it's running great. >> So, if I can extend it, I'll be Ralph Jr. tonight. Um just just trying to think outside the box. Could if another local town we're in the same boat we are
trying to hire uh a trades person that's going to beg a 100 to 120,000 salary. Could we co-mploy? Could we cost share with a a Hamen or a Wilberham if is that
a scenario worth pursuing or are there inherent drawbacks? >> Yep. Yeah. No. Uh that that conversation I dare say is already being had uh with a different position that I just found about the this morning. Uh I think we're going to start to see a lot of uh
departments head the way that we head headed for Westcom, for instance. Uh there's there's a lot more regionalization on everyone's mind. Costs are up. Um and even the the governor and some of these the municipal
empowerment act has sort of earmarked some particular departments that are uh are are having a hard time filling uh allowing these departments to become regionalized that perhaps weren't before. So yes, uh that conversation
will is and is going to be had in the future for sure. >> Good. Thank you. >> Yep. Any other questions? And I just want to commend Kim and her team as well for putting together all that information. It was, as you said, a lot
of detail. Yeah, >> always. Okay. Next, under financial matters, we had approving the ratification of firefighters local 2426 contract. >> Turn it over to you, Tom, if you want to
provide a brief update on how those negotiations turned out. >> Yeah. So, um the uh Well, let me just pull this up here. Um yeah, so we um started negotiations
back in uh December or January, I believe, with um the fire department union um myself, Rebecca, Chief Peacher, uh and um Audra uh as well as Chris French, who's the
union president. Um Jim, geez, I can't remember anybody's name now. Um, well, I guess um now I'm embarrassed. Sorry, Jim. Uh, we we had
uh very good negotiations. I think uh we I guess I'm going to get in trouble for saying this, but uh left the lawyers out of the room um and had a uh productive conversation about uh the town of Esau
Meadow and the town of Esau Meadow Fire Department and what both parties could do to help both succeed. Um and this uh negotiation uh was I mean just outstanding uh in terms of
uh give and take from both sides in terms of what could be done uh to make everyone happy. Uh the the fire department union uh voted to ratify this uh last month unanimously. Um and we
felt the same on our side of the table. Um this was a fantastic uh negotiation. Um it's sort of a testament to the character of um the men and women of the East Meadow Fire Department. Um and and
I'm I'm happy to present it to you. Um like I said, has my full blessing as well as everybody else on our negotiating team. Uh and it was eventually looked over by the lawyers and it's all good. Um, and so, uh, Jim
Goldrich, sorry Jim, I'm so mad right now. Brody Allen, um, and Christian Santaneloo. Uh so um again uh if you have any questions about the specifics um
you know we we the the highlights are um we brought the colas back down to 2% which is sort of an effort to um get in line with where where our non-UN staff is. Um and that will be an effort. Uh
COLA is not uh necessarily anything other than a cost of living adjustment and in my mind it should be the same for everyone. Um so uh there were some uh changes to their pay structure that got them in line with surrounding communities. Uh we
were lacking in that area. Um and the biggest of which um was the introduction of four lieutenant positions, one for each shift. Currently we have four groups uh with a captain and an acting captain when need be. Um this is this
rank structure is more in line with a department of our size so that we have two officers on each shift. um and uh sort of extending um the operation um from an official standpoint. Um so
like I said um the contract was was negotiated very well by both sides and uh you know like I said I I I appreciate your blessing on on signing it on behalf of the town >> and I think just for everyone's awareness based off of what we had um
discussed. So tonight we would authorize the tech manager to sign the ratification, but knowing that once free cash is certified sometime in September, so it'll probably be the first meeting in October or so, >> we would then have to make a free cash
transfer to fund the balance out of >> correct >> contract, which I think for total fire you had said was $48,675 and ambulance was 14,771, >> right?
>> Yep. And and uh again seeing that front-loaded number, the the negotiations sort of spun to we'll have less of a increase in year two than we sort of would have had with the existing contract if if you catch my
drift. Um, so there's a little bit of a bump in in the year one because of the new positions and then uh we'll we'll sort of level out to where we would have been with the existing contract. So >> any questions?
>> So did we actually receive a copy of the contract because I couldn't find it anywhere. >> No, we will >> thought it was part of the packet. >> Red line is a clean copy. What? The >> red line in the clean copy should have been sent to you. >> No,
>> I did. I see it. No, >> there's nothing in here and I'm trying to ratify it as presented and I'm like I must have just missed it. >> No, you didn't miss it. >> No, you didn't. >> I just sent you the the email and not
the attachments. >> I don't even think I saw >> I got 15 attachments, but none of them had to do with >> Yeah, I don't think there was nothing in the middle either. contract for the firing. >> Yeah, I think you're right. >> First,
>> I think Jamie's always >> Oh, I thought you meant it was a first. I was correct. I I truthfully I have no issues ratifying it based on the discussion we just had um >> the numbers >> and the numbers.
>> Yeah. And if it's any confidence, I did read through the red line and there really wasn't, aside from what Tom said, the positions. There were a couple wording changes like removing professional in front of firefighters to be inclusive of the people on the ambulance and so
forth, but really wasn't much else. So, I also think recently, didn't we um on the police department side um made sure there was a sergeant on um each shift? And I think that's what you were just saying here. We
>> Yeah, from an operational >> from an operational point of view. So we've already done it with them. It makes sense with >> I sent it and I apologize for that. I missed that. >> Any other questions? >> Okay. If there's none, I'll entertain a
motion. I will make a motion to authorize the town manager to sign the ratification of the agreement for firefighters local 2426 as presented. >> Second. >> Motion's been made and seconded and thirded. Any further discussion?
>> Seeing none, Kathy? >> Yes. >> John, >> yes. >> Yes. >> Marilyn, >> yes. >> I'm a yes. Anna, >> yes. >> And Jim, >> yes. >> Motion passes. Thank you, Tom. >> Thank you. >> And thank you to the firefighter. Yeah, >> everyone in the fire station for their
assistance on that. Next, we have approval of minutes. >> Motion. >> Make a motion to approve the July 8, 2025 open session minutes. >> I second that. >> Motion's been made and seconded. Any further discussion? Seeing none, Kathy?
>> Yes. >> John, >> yes. >> Ralph, >> yes. >> Marilyn, >> yes. >> I'm a yes. Anna, >> yes. >> And yes, >> motion passes. Thank you. Okay. Old business. We have a discussion with Christina about recreational marijuana ballot
question. >> August. >> I know. >> It was so over. >> I know. >> Seriously, Jeff isn't here. is doing cheerleading and football drop offs and >> is um listening, but I am um here for
both of us to see um where we kind of stand on having this put on the ballot for next year and if there's any other processes we have to do to make sure that it's smooth uh for next year. >> Great. Well, thank you for coming again. I know it's flown by. I know we've all
had a busy summer. Uh, so I did some research and just to recap, the last time we discussed this was at our May 13th meeting, which is hard to believe how long ago that was. Um, we started off the discussion at that meeting with a consensus to gather signatures and
submit it as a new citizen petition for a new ballot question for the June 2nd, 2026 ballot and election. Um but then as the discussion progressed um there was a question about
could the council just put the question on the ballot without having to gather new signatures as a yes no question. Um but then the voters would still have the opportunity to weigh in on the discussion. Um, so unless Jeie has
something further or different, we didn't seek legal opinion on the topic yet without consensus from the council whether we should proceed with that. But from my research as the council, we could put any sort of
non-binding public opinion question we want on the ballot as a yes no. But even if folks voted no or yes, it doesn't mean that the council would have to follow that same uh voter response for whatever bylaw
change we would entertain. There's so many different rules about putting binding measures on the ballot and I'm personally unclear about whether this sort of marijuana question whether we could just jump the process since it
was originally a citizen petition or if it has to follow the citizen petition process because there's all sorts of rules in mass general law chapter 43 about what we can and can't do around that. like we can do that
binding questionwise when we did things like the debt exclusion for the high school because that's expressly carved out in the lane for the legislative body to do that. But it's not so clear to me not being a lawyer whether we can do that for things
that don't have an exact path in state law. So as I see it, we have three choices. we could either just do it given that the legal advice back in May was that we actually didn't have to put
it on the ballot, but the council as a consensus wanted it on the ballot to gauge public interest. We could just do it as a non-binding question knowing that we would want to follow whatever the public's interest was, but we don't have to necessarily figure out
what the path to make it a binding question is. We could try to go down the path of binding question, but we would have to seek legal counsel and figure out what that might entail. Or we could go back and say, "Sorry,
follow the citizen petition process and gather all the required signatures and then there's no question about what the council could or couldn't do." Those are the three avenues I came up with, but I'm open to whichever way we
wish uh to suggest. >> So, if we did um requested them to receive the signatures to put it on the ballot, Genie, how many signatures is requ >> if it was the same process as last time? the 500
>> 50 at first then it has to be in proper form and that's what they did the first time and our attorney said it was not in proper form because of so many reasons >> ultimately so after the 50 then they
have to get another 50 is it >> the first 10 signers have to go out and get >> 50 more >> 50 more at least so it's >> 10 so it' be 500 Oh, each each of the
>> signers they'd be part of a >> and ultimately it comes up to 500 signatures. Um, having gone out and gotten signatures, even getting 50 to get on the ballot can be daunting. Um,
>> does that legislature that you just reviewed change any of that? >> I'm not sure. There was so much to that chap. >> My head was spinning when you were talking about it. >> The details and everything in Mass General law. There's so many exceptions
that I wasn't sure what things fell into. Um I don't want to make it more complicated for >> right >> Christina, especially if it ended up being like 500 signatures when you compound everything. So, if everyone was
okay with it, I'm okay with it being a non-binding question, knowing that we would probably follow whatever the interest of the voters were anyway. >> Sure. What was the um how many signatures did you gather? Was it was it just the 50?
>> It was 52 cuz we were trying to rush and get it because we liked so quickly. Um so, we were able to get those. I mean I, you know, we have 10 months, so I'm sure we, you know, it was needed, we could that process moving. That's why I wanted
to just make sure we were keeping the temperature so we would have the time to make sure um we could follow whatever process was. >> My my thought would be, you know, I think there's obviously an effort and people in the town have already signed something to that effect. 50, you know,
50 people. It's not, you know, it's not like 10 people or something. I think it's, you know, a decent crowd. Um, there's clearly some interest in, you know, relooking at this issue. I think a non-binding might be maybe the most cleanest because people would still have
an opportunity, >> you know, if they wanted to continue the status quo and not change the process. and it would give us if if the town does decide to change course then, you know, we would be able to construct, you know,
a a pretty thorough bylaw as would be needed. Um whereas I I' I'd have to look into it more, but I feel like the binding it I would hate for a situation where and we just had this a few weeks ago where if it's not written, I think in a way if it's confusing and we but we
have to write it in such a way, I'd be concerned. whereas I get the sense maybe non-binding there's certain rules that aren't there compared to a binding resolution. So I think clearly there's some interest in it. We might have different opinions on whether we would
want to actually see it happen, but I think you know I want to at least get the public's perspective. Like I would definitely I would not want to do this um you know just just with us. I want to get that nonbinding, you know, but I I'd be also open to a
binding process as well, depending on what the rest of you guys feel. And I think a part that I left out mistakenly was um I think part of the reason why our charter said that the any ballot question had to have the bylaw language
in that proper form was because when things are a binding question unlike the council being the one to adopt things even though we may still go through the process ourselves that binding question makes that bylaw language immediately in effect. Whereas with the non-binding
question, we would still have the opportunity to tailor that specific bylaw language if there's parts that are inconsistent or maybe need some tweaks and we would still get that public opinion that we would have gotten from a binding question.
>> Yeah. Because then it's also unclear to me even if we took it a step further, even if the binding question process happened, if we then found we wanted to revise part of that, not to prohibit it again, but maybe there's certain rules or changes we wanted to make. Well,
since the whole thing was enacted as a binding question, is that totally off limits to the council in the future as far as edits? And from the med history of marijuana legalization in the state, the medical marijuana ballot question that was passed, I think in 2012, the
legisl they had to go back to the legislature to fix it because there was problems in that. And obviously the voters implemented that specific um medical marijuana bill. So they had to go back and you know adjust things.
So my only thought on this is if it's a non-binding question then and let's say it passes then it falls onto the council and the planning board to create the language.
>> If it's a binding question it will be created ahead of time in explicit form to be adopted. Um and at what time frame? I mean, yeah, we can say yes, it's our intent to follow a
non-binding question, but it could be two, three, five years, could be three months. Um, >> we could try to even if we did non-binding either in conjunction with or just at the same time try to craft language in
anticipation of that to have something in the process. >> Much of that been done by uh attorney had passed it so or he said it with the final edits it would be in form. So I guess you guys could kind of take that
and craft it um how you wanted it. just needed that sex social equity um part in there. So I think if you guys wanted to put in effect and kind of edit it so it made sense how you wanted it then you could and just sure the attorney would be you know >> so a lot of it's already been crafted
and could just >> Yeah. So hopefully >> by >> if we did that after the June 2nd election we could start the first readings and public hearings with the planning board. And I mean given the summer months, it may take a
little bit of time to get through that, but hopefully by the end of the summer, early September, it would be solidified if we went that route. >> I I think in this situation with this topic that it's probably best to get the
nonbinding. >> Well, non-binding, but the um the resident's take on it before we spend time, energy, money. So maybe we start with the non-binding and then if it's a go then exactly and I don't think Christine's going to let us forget about
it. So you know last thing you know going like five years out. >> Good thing is if we have a commitment to it you know there's two seats up next year on the council. So presumably there's going to be at least a folks that are talking about it here will probably be here you know come next
August. Just a thought, can we do it in a way where the bylaw draft would be ready so we can actually present that to the voters as in addition to the non-binding question. Here's what the bylaw would actually look like.
>> I think I think a non-binding question is a yes or no question. >> I don't know that we could put like bylaw language on there without it sounding like it's a binding question. We might be able to put something on the town website. The more information as to what we're talking about, but
I >> think to keep it the most simple is the more information you give people, the more conflicts they get. Ironically, >> that information on the website certainly would be helpful. >> Yeah. >> And we could always share it too if it's on a certain site and they want to
gather more information. We can say, you know, go to the town's website. provides, you know, any changes or information so they can educate themselves before, you know, the ballot. >> Yeah. And then from your perspective, while you wouldn't have to worry then about trying to get 500 or more signatures, it would still be in your
interest, of course, to get people to be informed about the topic and show up on election day >> because it's the vote that counts at the end no matter how many people are saying yes or no. So, >> so is that the general consensus we want
to move forward with? >> Yes. >> Okay, sounds good to me. Thank you all. >> All right, >> thank you. >> Good one. >> You too. >> Okay, next we had an update on paving
projects. So, I know we had a not too long ago, but longer than a couple months ago, we had approved uh some free cash, I believe, for Tom to have the pavement management report updated. The last time
we did it was somewhere around 2016 or 2017, if my memory serves me right. I remember reading that report many of times on the capital committee. Um, so I don't want to steal all the thunder. if Tom wants to dive into a
summary of the report or >> Yeah. Uh well, quite frankly, I'm still digesting it. I did meet with Bruce um this afternoon just to kind of briefly um look over it. Obviously, uh when I
sent it to you on Thursday or Friday, whenever that was, um that was literally when we received it. Um, so, uh, you know, there's not a a whole surprise a whole many bunch of surprises in there. Uh, obviously the condition of
our roadways has decreased since 2016. Um, you know, to the tune of whatever a $30 million backlog of pavement. Uh, again, um, from I think 17, the last report had
$17 million. Now, that's a function of our roads getting worse and prices >> us >> costs going up. So, um we Mark and Bruce and I are are set to meet uh next week
to sort of solidify a plan moving forward here with this new information. Again, went from a 76 to a 69. Um, and again, we we certainly as a town didn't do anything from a funding standpoint to
hit these numbers. And and again, it's going to be very difficult for us to come up with a plan of $2.6 million a year or whatever it is to get up to 80, uh, you know, from 69. Um, but I think we can certainly there's things in here.
Um, there's new technologies, there's new treatments. I think um Mark and Bruce have been doing a great job of late. Um instead of our old school sort of mill and overlay, which which you know is nice for a few years on the
surface um then you end up out on Westwood again 10 years later. Um which we are now. Now that's a new um relatively new. It's been around for a while, but we haven't done much of this. And that's cold in place recycling,
which is uh recycling the entire pavement base and putting it back down all in one, right? And so the difficulty with that uh treatment is um there is a mix design. So they have to do the cores
um and figure out what's there so that they know what to add to that mix to put it back down so it's a good base. Um, so Westwood I I I mean I did paving for a while. Everyone's calling, "Oh, Westwood's great. That doesn't even have a surface course on it yet. That's just
the base course that got recycled and put back down." Um, so >> and they love it. >> And they love it. >> Yep. So the Westwood's a whole other story, but so um, you know, we we still have to digest all this new information.
uh all it's really going to do is um sort of set us in a direction for what's next. Right? This this is what these plans do. I think I'll probably have some sort of recommendation uh for capital again, but I think I'd
like to get away from our uh you know like dollar amount thrown into an account and put actual projects on the with actual dollar amounts. Um there's certainly a lot of I think we really have to stick with our next couple year
plan which is uh heavy heavily trafficked roadways that could use some improvement right now uh next year on the docket and they've already done the core sampling for Pleasant Street which is why it's been closed and the gas company's doing their work because
they've been instructed uh as every few years we give them our pavement list or upcoming projects and say you you need to get your work done now before we pave just like Maple Street, just like everywhere we go. Um, so Pleasant will
be next year. Um, and again, I'd like to finish Parker Street. Uh, we had started that a few years ago and we haven't really got back to that. And, uh, Metobrook Road has been on the agenda for for a while. Um, and that's in really rough shape. This is in all in
concert with Route 83, uh, Prospect, um, and ob obviously our huge plans for North Main Street. Um, so we have quite a few things happening right now and I I'd venture a guess if we did if we did this report again in two years, we'd be
at a 72 and not a 69. Um, that's the sort of impact that th those mass DOT roadways are going to have on our entire system. Um but uh as was a goal last year for me that we sort of were waiting for this report to get not to make
excuses but we need to start uh really making an effort to if we can't do the 2.6 we got to get to 1.8 or 2.1 or something um to get us headed back in the right direction here. Um and again
we'll continue to um do our complete streets and our tip projects and um you know keep asking uh DOT to chip in when they can. Um uh there was one other bit of good news.
We last I last last meeting I think uh we approved or you approved the chapter 90 funding at 92,000 which was up considerably from >> our normal but we also have an
additional supplemental uh from the fair share act of $245,000 and change. So uh I'm waiting for that letter so I can put it to you for for a vote to accept that as well. But uh our FY26 aortionment is now something like
$1.2 million. Um which is almost double what we usually get. Um so um that that's really exciting that the that the state has sort of listened to all the communities in the Commonwealth. Um again, these numbers don't mean much
except for uh everyone's around a low 70. Like that is an average. um we're we're not like ridiculously bad. Um but again, we need some help when we can get it, but we also have to start to make a
commitment here about putting pay paying for our roadways. Um and again, there's a lot that goes into it, and again, I'm not I'm not trying to make excuses. Um but we have our uh water asset management plan matrix, sewer asset
management plan matrix, storm water asset management plan and our pavement which is now updated. And we can't go paving roads that are set to have a water mane replacement in two years. So we have to really make sure all these things are working together so that we
don't have a situation where we're digging up a road that we just paid. That that obviously doesn't look good for anyone. So, um, once we digest this new information, um, again, like I said, Pleasant has already
been started for next year and the fact that we're we're pulling those pavement cores to see what we're dealing with and what that mix design is going to look like and that cost of the project I couldn't even give you right now plus or minus $100,000 because a lot of it sort
of depends on that pavement mix and what gets put back down. Um but I will have that uh estimate for Pleasant Street probably in September and certainly for Capitol because um when in all likelihood this 1.4 or 1.2 whatever we
have um plus what we have in the bank right now from other aortionments for roadway. Um, we should be able to do Pleasant Street with no problem and probably add another portion of one of these roadways that it makes sense to do uh uh sort of like a preventative
maintenance or a structural improvement um that could sort of better this whole plan. Um so so that's sort of where where we're at um paving wise. Um all obviously all that stuff's underway that I mentioned a few months ago. Uh,
Westwood obviously under construction right now. I think Mark is dealing with some numbers for Harkness and um is that Anthony the street behind Big Y and Ta something like this. Thanks. Um, so
there there are a couple things in the hopper now, but I think with the updated information, uh, now we can start to see, uh, where these things are going to fall with the maintenance and how much those maintenance treatments cost and we can start to sort of fit these into the plan a little bit better.
I'm sure Ralph got through the whole report. >> Scanning through it, right? >> Yeah, I will. my takeaways from it. I mean, one, I loved the amount of detail and information that was there. I read through every word and it was uh nice to
see how much was in there. Um, I guess some summary information just for the benefit of one in the public following along. So, our town has 101 miles of roadway and our average pavement condition index, which is PCI, right now
in 2025 is 69, but as Tom said, back in 2017 it was 76. Um, the backlog of work if we were to do absolutely everything right this second is 30,85,000, which is obviously un unattainable. Uh
but just to maintain our current PCI of 69 would require an investment of $1.6 million each year. That wouldn't improve the condition overall of the roadways. That would just keep our score the same, >> right?
>> But then I thought it was interesting. I think the old reports touched on it a little, but not as much as the newer one did. some of the other ways of doing things instead of just like you said the well we wait till the road gets really bad
and then we spend $10 million to it and we only get two roads done in town a year. Um so it could be an interesting way to like you said mix in some of the preventative maintenance that is significantly cheaper and if we could
make some of those repavement jobs last longer than deteriorating that could be beneficial. And again, I I I'll just say that this was something that one of my shortcomings when I was in that position, but Mark with Bruce's support
has really I mean, we've already put a treatment on Maple Street, which we paved four years ago. That is something that this town never would have done for for decades. Um once it got paved, that was that, right? Um so I I think I think we're on to something here in terms of
long-term maintenance of our roadways. it's just going to take sort of an influx of a big move to get, you know, if you if we really want to improve this number. Um, we're we're going to have to do something big at some point like when
we stop borrowing money for a high school, something like that. But I think to that end, we obviously not enough to do a ton of things. But knowing how much we've turned back last year and now this year, there is an opportunity
this upcoming year to use some free cash if we thought it appropriate to do some of these projects, even if it's just do all of the maintenance so things stop getting worse. >> Well, I mean, it really can't be stressed uh that the the added money in
this budget from the Commonwealth. Um, this is something people have been screaming about since 2003, which was the last time they changed this formula. And, um, it's nice to see that the voices were heard and this was the
additional funding was added to this. Um, so so this is a a good a step in the right direction in terms of um, sort of state aid, if you will. I guess the only other thing I saw too, which was one of the questions I asked you the other day, was um the cost
figure and knowing that that's kind of like the all-in projected cost for that stretch of roadway that we see in each of the table recommendations. At least I had always thought, you know, because a lot of the projects we had done in the past were getting close to that million dollars a mile threshold
that some of them aren't actually that expensive anymore depending on the proposed treatment. So that could mean that depending on how we slice and dice things, maybe we could get more done. But it's finding the right puzzle piece order, >> right? And and it and it's a little
tricky, too, because you're using those numbers to come up with these segments of roadway that have been paved at different times, right? But if you only pave 200 feet, you're not getting that price from a contractor. >> It's not going to come out and pay 200 feet for that price, right? So it you
have to sort of plan it out so that you're doing a couple of these things even if they're different costs in different condition you still do it right >> right because that you're going to get the more tonnage right that you you get the lower the price per ton is going to
be from the contractor so there is a lot that goes into it um and so I think Bruce and Mark have have us headed in the right direction the new data is certainly going to help us sort of execute a better plan moving forward.
>> Any questions? >> Just a quick comment. I think I like the part and I think I'm understanding this correctly. The benefit. So obviously the benefit 447 that's a high benefit, >> right? >> So I like how it's rated that way. So
you're kind of looking at this not only cost, but like what's the benefit in it for the town, >> right? You know what I mean? I I I thought that was >> No. And and I a lot goes into a lot goes into what they're what they're getting after here. And also a lot goes into the
reason that that number is there is because that is bringing down the road score unnecessarily. >> Right. >> Right. You can do this much and all of a sudden it's a big impact. People are going to notice this. >> Right.
back in time like does the report contemplate the grant money that we're getting for like Summers Road and North Main Street? >> So it wouldn't it would be a snapshot in time, right? So it it wouldn't this is what I was saying about the the score
would be higher if we did this next year when all those things are paved, right? So it doesn't it can't forecast what we're going to do because we haven't done it and that's not really >> so data >> like the 30 million is actually not 30 million. >> That's that's really what I'm kind kind
of asking. So I'm looking at Summers Road. It says, you know, >> million >> base rehab $1 million. You can almost take that out of the report at this point. So it's really not 30 million, it's 29 million, >> right? Well, and again I I guess I would say that's sort of I don't know how many segments they have Summers Road in.
Probably a bunch, right? six or seven. >> So that will probably go a long way into, you know, they know what they're seeing when they look at a road, too. And so they may not do base rehab everywhere. They may do mill and overlay. They may
do base rehab in some of the spots that overlap, right? So it won't be apples to apples, but it'll be close. So it's a good point. All those numbers on Summers Road are are pretty much going to go away with the exception of >> 1.7 million >> right with another conversation with EOT
what they deem is what they want to do. Now we have this and we can say well I don't really want you to mill and overlay that. We just had a pavement survey done and it says we need base rehab and this is why we did all that >> work ahead of time so that DOT wouldn't
have to do it. So now when we say, "Hey, we want you to do this base here, like we had this thing. We already saved you $68,000 by doing all these structures already." They say, "All right, that sounds good. This this is this is the conversation we're having with them."
Now, >> and then >> that's an excellent point that that there we have a lot of work about to happen that is going to take this down considerably, >> right? And not just cost, but then when you look at that condition index score
and you see some of those segments of some of these roads that will be paved in the the coming months that if those road segments now go to 100 of the score, well, the overall average hopefully should rise a little bit. >> Yep. I think if you if you look at um if
you look at the map with the colors, um the the difficult thing to probably stomach, if you will, especially for the public, is most of those are the side streets, >> right? >> And it's going to be difficult to make
the investment when we're in such a low traffic area. Um and and that's um that's been the difficulty for well, let's call it ever. Um and and that's something that we're going to have to
we're going to have to have conversations about and and conversely the public is going to have to uh be a little patient with our when we get a chance to get to side streets compared to Summers Road and Parker Street and this is just how it's going to be. Um,
and we'll have to wait for water main projects to happen and then we'll come and pave at that point, right? Um, >> but with that idea too, I think this was something Ralph had brought up in capital a couple years ago. Maybe there's ways we need to reook and I
don't even know if we can legally do it based off of the structure of the enterprise funds. But if we're going to do a water and sewer project and dig it up, can we tax some of the repaving costs onto the rates that >> and I would be lying if we haven't had that conversation a bunch of times
already. Uh yeah, I mean again we're we're we're shifting the cost >> right >> to the same people in a different fund. Um but um the the it's a good thought and the reason we keep having the
conversation is you you've seen what the we make the gas company do for instance after they do it. They don't pave their trench. They pave more than their trench. And so it's not ridiculous for us to ask the water department to do the same. Um there we could this could be a
policy shift. Uh the previous town I worked for a million years ago, if you did a trench above a certain length, you had to do curb to curb replacement. That's not outlandish. Um and it doesn't necessarily kill a project for a utility
company. Um, so these are things that uh we're having the conversations about and and uh thinking about implementing any way we can uh to sort of help with our pavement um restoration.
>> Great. Any other thoughts or questions? >> Lots of information in here. >> Yeah, I'm sure we'll be talking about it again. >> Yes. No, I I would assume that we we will September's busy enough. We might as well have an update in September. >> We'll make that up.
>> Well, it's tough to talk to residents when someone says, "Hey, my street's listed as one of the worst in town." >> Right. >> And you have to explain to them, like you said, well, it's a culde-sac and two of you use it. Whereas, you know, 10
points down is a a side street that 400 people use a day. Um, which one do you do? >> Right. >> Tough conversations. And the other hard part about that too is sometimes people will point to surrounding communities and I'm sure they do some of their
streets correctly too, but sometimes you see the same towns repaving the same street every five or 10 years because they're doing the cheapo skim coat that doesn't last forever and it's like well a lot of times we've been doing it the right way and it lasts a long time when we do it. It's just expensive and you
can't do as many of those as frequently. >> Yeah. that Maple Street for example, we we had to bank a whole year of chapter 90 and put two years together just to do it the right way. Um and that and it's frustrating and obviously the cost of things and no stranger to anyone when
they try to do anything when you say that it's expensive to pave. Everyone knows that. I don't want to keep using it as an excuse though. We we we will we have the information now and we will come up with a better plan to sort of get this headed in a different
direction. I do think looking forwards though if Prospect Street is done, Summers Road's done, Westwood is done, it's going to alleviate >> Pleasant next year. >> That's very, very noticeable. >> And us, >> very noticeable
saying we don't do anything. Well, there's a lot of stuff. North Main Street, Pleasant Street, those are a lot of main roads and a lot of a lot of length of road that that'll get done. So, >> we're going to move in the right direction. But I do agree. Um, we'll
have to take a close look this year on capital projects and see if we can't get some extra in there. >> Great. Thank you, Tom. >> Thank you. >> Okay. Next, under new business, we had saying the review and recontification of
the zoning bylaws from the Barrett Planning Group was someone will Downey that is guest. Okay. >> We've already done our
>> Yeah, I was gonna say. >> Hi. Can everyone see me? >> Do it. >> Yes, we can. >> Hi. Thank you. Sorry, I needed to have my my permissions changed to a panelist. Um, so first of all, hello everyone. Thank you for having us tonight. My name is Will Downey. I am a senior planner
with Barrett Planning Group. Um I'm joined here tonight by uh my colleague uh Bob Mitchell who some of you might know he's been planning for a while. Um I he he will he will chime in if if and when he can. But um my our our purpose
here tonight is we just want to introduce the council a little bit to the work that we're doing with the uh with the planning department. And we have a couple of questions for all of you to help us understand where the council's head is. Oh, and there's Bob as I promised um on where the council's at and kind of just uh plum plum you for
a little bit of information as well if that makes sense for everyone. So, I'd like to first just for a little bit of an overview, I'd like to direct your attention to the uh handout that we provided for everyone, which is titled East Long Meadow Comprehensive Zoning Review. Um, I I know you've all probably
seen this. I know you've all been here for a long time, so I don't want to walk through this point by point unless you would like to. But this outlines, as we responded to in the town's request for quotes, the work that will be involved as part of this. Essentially, we are going to be doing a comprehensive review
of the town zoning bylaw, particularly looking for ways that there are things that could be improved. Um any ways that over time contradictions have entered into it, any ways that you know as time goes on you are you have fallen out of compliance with state law or other laws
like that. And other ways just to make your zoning ways to make your zoning bylaw a little bit more user friendly, a little bit easier to use and highlight any ways that the needs of the community can be better accounted for in the zoning bylaw. And so that will be the focus of the first deliverable that
comes from this work which is a diagnostic which will identify those areas things like that and then working with the director of planning and the bylaw review committee um we will begin to take the recommendations from that
diagnostic into any forms of recommended zoning changes that we would submit to uh that we submit to the town in our final report. And the final report would include the revised and the complete diagnostic along with a summary
of all the public events that will be happening over the course of this project along with any of those red line and recommended zoning zoning amendments for the planning board and ultimately yourselves and town meeting um to bring. And as those are the deliverables and
this will also be supported by a public engagement. We the original RFP asked for two community meetings. The first of which would introduce the project and present on the result uh would introduce the project to the public and the state and stakeholders in town. The second
would present the findings from the diagnostic and the recommendations to kind of introduce that to the public, follow up on that and get some sense of where the public's at in relation to our recommendations. And we will also be meeting at least twice with the bylaw review subcommittee. um first to present
them with the findings of the diagnostic and again to present the findings and recommendations. So it's a mix of both working with town bodies that work that work with the bylaw and the general public to get a sense of where people are at get input get input and have an
opportunity for the public to share their thoughts on this. Um where we're at right now is we are in the middle of the diagnostic review and we are also meeting with various what we like to call stakeholders which are people that have been uh with input from the from
the planning department. Um people that have that are familiar with the town's bylaws working under them. people that are familiar with some of the needs of the community to help us understand essentially what's going right with the town's bylaw, what's going wrong, and areas that they that people that work
with this all the time have seen maybe needs for improvement or ways that things could be uh could be handled differently. And so that's where we are right now. Um, I know that was a little bit of a fast overview, but um, I'm uh, as my first kind of question, I'm happy
to answer any Bob and I are happy to answer any questions that the council might have relating to the overall project or anything as identified in the in the scope handout. >> Yeah. Well, I just wanted to add one thing. Um,
>> the process going forward will have kind of two tracks that overlap. So, one of the tracks is the organization of the bylaw, the numbering of the bylaw, the language, grammar, punctuation,
conflicting language. Um, are things located in the right sections or are they scattered all over the place? Um, do we are there sections of the bylaw, subsections of the bylaw that are in conflict with state law or state court decisions?
um kind of quote unquote not so substantial issues although you know they're substantial issues. The parallel track and again these overlap is as we go through this we hear uh from all the towns that we work with while section
6.2 two, whatever that section is doesn't work and nobody has a nobody can easily understand. It really needs to be reread. That's a substantive issue. Or we're missing an entire topic that we want to put into the violin. That's a
substantive issue. So we will develop a list of the substantive issues as we go along and we'll work with the town um for them the town folks to put their
uh ideas on the substantiveness and then okay what are the priorities of the substantiveness can we do I mean you know I don't know if there's three substantive topics and then all of the recartification we could probably do that under the budget but if there's 30
substantive issues that's not going to happen under the budget. So there's a prioritization that goes through this as well. And that's kind of how you end up at the end with a bylaw that's organizationally
well put together, easier to navigate, easier to find things, easier to understand, uh, correct English grammatical punctuation, language, as well as substantive changes that the town's looking to.
>> That's it. That's all. That's it. >> Yeah. No, it's if you break it down by checklist, it's actually only three or four checks on that checklist. Um >> um but yeah, so I guess uh uh with with with Bob's clarification, extra detail,
does does the council have any questions for us before we kind of uh pick a little bit of your brain? No questions from me, but I do have some thoughts based off of the questions you provided earlier, but feel free to move on to
>> Sure. Um, so I guess my first question would be um from from the council's perspective, what if any are the broad zoning issues in the town of East Long Meadow? Problems, priority areas, things like that. What are the broad what are kind
of from your perspective the zoning issues that you're hearing and seeing? Ralph. >> No, I was just thinking we have lots of wonderful bylaws written, but if you don't enforce them, they're not going to do anything for us. And that's a huge
issue is enforcement, but that's not a that's not something that you can control. But clearly, that's what I see. Well, >> actually, if I can jump in, I think it is something that you can control. Um, >> we need bylaws that are written clearly
and concisely so that they can be enforced. Um, there's certain ones in here that you read and even if you've been doing this for 20 years, you still shake your head and say exactly what did we mean when we wrote that, >> right? And
>> with a turnover of counselors and planning board members, sometimes you lose the original reason for why that bylaw was written. >> Great point. >> And if they don't ask, you know, someone from the past, they have no clue and
they look at it and go, "Well, this was dumb." Um, well, it wasn't. It was written for a specific purpose. >> Um, >> like keeping cars out of sight with a blue tarp. There are always reasons why every section of a bylaw was put there.
>> But like I said, over time, these the minor ones, small sections, >> people lose track of why and who and what for. But if you dig back far enough, somebody knows, oh, that's because somebody wanted to do something in some property that we didn't want
them to do. That's >> true. You know, those kinds of things. So, um, we'll probably do some of that digging in these long metal, too. >> Drive. >> Absolutely. >> And sometimes it is helpful just, uh, to have the question asked because, you
know, sometimes you run into something and it's, well, well, it takes someone coming from the outside to say, well, why do you do it this way? Because that's just always been the way we've done it sometimes. So I think sometimes that's some of the value ad we ask there too where you know we see all the time there'll be a way that something is written in a bylaw and it takes someone
asking why do you do it that way to kind of to you know kind of uh open up that door of kind of different possibilities. >> Um anything else on that question? Oh sorry. Go ahead. Yeah, I mean I I guess I don't know when
you would want me to respond necessarily because a lot of I think the five questions you had uh sent to us earlier >> I didn't necessarily put my answers all in one thought per each question. They
kind of all blend AC across them. Um >> Well, go ahead. I mean just let us thinking. Yeah, >> I think as you mentioned from the outset kind of with that first tract, I think a big one for me is like conformance to
state federal law, regulations, court decisions, and even just consistency within our own bylaws, especially around definitions and how things are described one way but a different way somewhere else. Um, there's a lot of ambiguity or
things that are just outdated and maybe they could be applied in the past, but not in 2025. >> Yeah. Um, I think another big topic is housing for me and at least evaluating ways that we could allow different kinds of
housing choices in town, even beyond ADUs being sort of forced at the the state level, but just other kinds of housing choice. Um, >> I think a big topic for me is we're the amount of buildable land that East Long Meadow has compared to some other
surrounding communities is dwindling. And I would hate to see us turn into say Long Meadow that has basically no developable land left and therefore they're pretty capped at what they can do in their budget. I'd like to see us be a bit smarter about being more dense
with the remaining land that we have so we're not constricting our growth that's going to happen no matter what we do zoning wise. And then some other random specific examples that I don't necessarily know what I would change about them, but I just know that there's some problems
with them. Um, >> is like our sign bylaw. I think it's overly broad and restrictive, especially in the sense that it doesn't allow you to do murals. And I think forms of artwork should be permitted, but >> I don't know how to make that without saying you can't put a billboard into
town either. >> Everything's assigned, >> right? >> Based on our definition, >> right? And then I do think >> on purpose I would imagine. >> Yes. >> And then I do think we should at least even if nothing changes re-evaluate the discussion around drive-throughs. I know
it was the big topic during COVID when it was a lot of contradiction that well the banks can do it but I can't do it for the pharmacy >> and I can't do it when I'm going to Dunkin Donuts. Um and then some other topics. I guess
they're just more questions that I have. Or are some of our zoning bylaws, like you said, too complicated or verbose and no one really understands what they mean? Um, do we have too many zones or not enough zones? Um, do other towns
have things laid out differently and are they better or are they just different for the sake of being different? And then I know our zoning bylaws also sort of prevent anything that's not explicitly listed,
>> but I think it's hard for a community to predict the future in order to allow some of those things in a thoughtful way. So what other things do our bylaws not allow that we should consider that maybe you've had some experience with seeing elsewhere?
>> Sure. That makes sense. And this is >> and then it probably goes with my first point, but language modernization, like I'm sure some of the ways we describe things are >> maybe a bit outdated in their terminology.
>> I I would just point out something that stuck in my mind when I was reading your bylaw. You have language in here about an institution for feeble people. I think that's probably been in your bylaw for many decades. Obviously that word's not been used for a very very long time
but it's in your mind. >> So those are the things you have to look >> all understand it. >> So that was >> thinking of going through questions you have provided in no particular order.
>> No that was very helpful. Anyone have >> So, I'll I'll jump in real quick. Uh you've already heard it from me. Um but there's certain things like our districts. Um you know, we have uh a
business district, a commercial district, industrial district. Um I see in other towns where they have uh business one and business two and they identify it. Um, I'm not sure if that makes more sense rather than having a
business in a commercial and people not knowing where to look. Um, I think it's uh a lot to do with organization of our uh bylaws. Um, I mean, certain things pop out at me like we have a golf recreation district, which sounds
wonderful, but a golf course is not required in that district. Um, that doesn't seem to make sense to me. um uh you know the little things like that that as you read and the more you read
the more come out um >> thank you Ralph >> the other if I can other thing we're talking about is a center town district >> and I just don't know in this process where getting something like that in
would happen. Um, I mean the center town district could be out 6 months a year. It could happen quickly. We're not sure. Um, so like I said, it's something that as we're looking at the zoning, we have to
consider that we do want something like that. Mhm. And I believe, correct me if I'm wrong, Rebecca, we had just recently applied for and received a different grant or set of grants related to the development of some of that center town district stuff. So, it may not
necessarily be for this particular activity to incorporate that, but at least know that there's considerations around changing that and how that might blend in with the overall review that you're doing. Mhm. >> Yeah. One of the things we, you know,
we've already started on is what else is going on related to the zoning bylaw in the town, Senate Town District. >> It usually comes up, >> you know, what what's just been adopted by the town and why. >> Um, so we need to understand that and
timelines and what's the intent in doing this or doing that and what how does that fit in well or doesn't fit in with what we're doing. And like you just said, that might be sort of a a future phase because, >> you know, you're going to be working on
it longer than this project will be going on. >> Yeah. But I will also say in in specifically to the to the center town district, we are working very closely with the director of planning on on that and he's keeping us in and he's keeping us informed on his progress on that as well. So, so while while that might not
be a part of the process, we will definitely be taking that into consideration in the work in the work we're doing and that that's something coming down the pipeline. >> Great. And I'll just add that if that um if number of substantive issues turns out to be rather small, you know, we
could potentially utilize um this consultants group to um review whatever we're coming up with at whatever, you know, phase of development we're at. Um, but if there's a longer list of substantive issues, um, it'll probably stay off until, um, and and we'll just
work through the normal course of planning board and town council. Um, I still think getting some input will be helpful in terms of like best practices or considerations. Um, but depending on how many things you want to look at substantively may decide whether or not
we're going to include um, more or less comprehensive look at the center town district in in this review. Mhm. >> Great. >> Any other thoughts? >> So, just um as I'm I'm looking through one of the thoughts that we had that um
actually it's been years since it came up um was big box stores retail and that we actually adopted a a specific bylaw to limit the size of retail space based on the fact that we didn't want a Home Depot or a Lowe's in town. Um, you'll
also find, like I said, the no drive-thrus. Um, that was based on the fact that a McDonald's wanted to come in and the town was more concerned about all the trash from people driving through the drive-thru and dumping it on the road on the way through.
>> Um, so that's that gives a little uh history as far as for the drive-throughs. So, it's for consumable items. >> What we tried to base it on is food items. So, Burger Kings, Wendy's, uh McDonald's,
they're not u most of their uh business is done through the drive-thru, and if they can't put a drive-thru in, >> they don't come here. And that's been worn out. And um obviously, we don't have any. So, the bylaw worked, but the
thought process is now, well, is that outdated? Um do we want something like that? Um, >> Chick-fil-A maybe. >> I think, yeah, I I mean, we might have to make a car. >> Um, I I agree with a lot of what kind
especially on housing. Um, I think, you know, we're getting to a point where when a lot of these bylaws were created, we had just so much more land. And it's just the reality is we're going to have less and less and less of it as time goes by. And we were more farming community than like a long meadow. So
we're, you know, getting closer to the point where sort of Long Meadow already is. Um, not like a specific proposal, but I think realizing how quickly technolog is changing with AI, with different types of vehicles. I was in a
driverless vehicle for the first time a few weeks ago um, in Texas. So like trying to I think maybe not have specific proposals but try to account for things that are coming up in the future that are going to be affecting our you know community whether it's like
you know we were talking about drones you know what what's going to happen with maybe delivering things via drones do we as a community I know obviously federal government state government would have rules around that but as a municipality here would we have certain rules around that so just being mindful
of those big changes is that I think are going to happen really fast. I mean, not in the few next few weeks or few months, but you know, five, 10 years or less down the road. Um, and being mindful of that, of those changes. >> Yeah. Some of that also catching up uh
while you're looking to the future. I don't know if I haven't seen yet, but you know, does Longman have uh regulations for electric vehicle chargers? Um that's something that's getting adapted all over the place now
by towns because they're coming and uh and so different uses that we've all seen pop up in the last five years from you know engineering technology and all that that nobody ever heard of before. Uh it's play it's catchup time.
>> Um so >> u and then and then trying to put our you know procrastinate our hats on and peer into the future. Um, >> we'll take a shot at it and see what other towns are doing and, you know,
maybe present some options. >> Yeah. Any other questions? >> I could go on for hours, >> but you're gonna come see me special. So >> only final question I would have is what do you see as the the timeline for the
the meetings or the deliverables that you'll have? Is that something that's going to be like next few weeks, next few months? Um just to get a general idea of when our participation may be required. Um so I can say at least for the first
deliverable we're hoping to get that done in the next in the next few weeks and from uh from there for the other for the public engagement and things we're working uh working to get those to get those set up and those will be following the next couple of uh you know next couple months from there. A lot of a lot
of the the um a lot of the as you can see from the handout a lot of the public engagement is tied to having the diagnostic done. So once we're confident in that that'll kind of set up scheduling some of those. So hopefully in ne we're talking uh next couple of months for a lot of these for a lot of
these things but some of them will you know extend over into the future >> busy >> I believe the first community meeting is 10 of these scheduled for September 18th >> oh thank you Bob I'd forgotten about that >> Thursday night be a Thursday evening
I believe early evening probably but uh we'll have more information on that once we that's all confirmed and and the the the guy the um the audit of the bylaw will be done a couple like Will just said a couple weeks before
that. So >> great. Well, thank you both. >> Sure. Um >> can I ask one question? I want to go back to something um uh on about the when you this is kind of parallel when
you said well you prohibited drive-ins so you haven't any fast food restaurants because they don't want to come in but you also mentioned about the limitation on retail size and I wondered if anybody has any knowledge indication uh concern that
that might have prevented some businesses from coming in that weren't big box stores, you know, Home Depot and Walmart, but might have been somewhat larger than what your limitation is, if
you've had any kind of reaction along those lines. So, I'll jump in. Not to my knowledge, I was on the planning board for five years and my whole time on it, um, we didn't have any, uh, large facility like that
because it would had to have been exceptionally large. And I think one of our main things was we were looking at traffic conditions, right? >> Especially along North Main Street and how much traffic a large facility like that would uh would be able to handle.
And uh I mean we've already got two large grocery stores and to take a big box store or something really large and put it behind it uh would have been very very difficult on the town. >> Yeah. I was more asking not for a big
box store but for a smaller much smaller store than a big box but just slightly larger than what your limitation is now or somewhat larger because there's you know there's small retailers and there's medium-siz retailers and there's big big
box retailers and you know um it's always like you didn't get any drive-in fast food restaurants which maybe people are a supporter But it you know what what is the business atmosphere and is the town looking for
increasing businesses at all or what kind of businesses is the town looking to draw to town to provide jobs and increase tax revenue. I think that's a that kind of underlies some of the decisions that gets made on what gets
put into or taken out of a zoning bylaw. Um we um I think a lot of the issues have to do with the way our bylaws are currently written. Retail is not allowed in the industrial garden park which is
you know has larger parcels. Most of these uses are located along Shaker Road, North Main Street, and they're limited to how much space to be able to invite something larger than we have, but not as much as a big box store. We
also lost a lawsuit with Lowe's back a number of years ago. I don't know if anybody remembers that, but Lowe's was supposed to go behind the Stop and Shop in that area. And when when the plans
were underway for the lows coming in, there was some real um discussion about restructuring North Main Street and the >> the area approaching it. And then due to a technicality in terms of filing, East
Law Meadow had the wrong date that Lowe's had. So ultimately Lowe's was the courts gave them the permission to come to that area. However, there was no deal in place to change the infrastructure.
So we couldn't handle it based on what we have right now. So that's a little history. >> Sure. No, thank you. That that type of history means really means a lot to us in kind of our work and understanding where some of these bylaws come from and
some of this some of this work. Yeah. Okay. Um, and I think th this one I I think I think the the council's already touched a little bit on this, but just to make sure we're we're we're we're not missing anything, what what do you hear is working with
the town's current zoning bylaw and what is not working? And as an addendum to that, is there anything that you hear that you think as members of this community or as people that um, you know, represent this community, are there things that are missing from the current zoning bylaw?
Um, I'm not sure how to say this, but a concern I have about how things are evolving, and maybe it's a generational thing. I've been around for a while, and I know how our bylaws have protected us. And yet, CO changed things. you know,
the town has been receptive to um allowing certain uses in the residential zone that were never allowed before. Under certain circumstances, which works in some areas, but other areas it's not enforced and it doesn't work. And I see
I mentioned this one other time that I see a change in our residential zones in a way that we're we're not just residential. And I don't know if that's important or a concern for the younger generations. I hate to date myself, but
we've always looked, you know, taken pride in the fact that Islam Meadow um established the different zones um for for good reason. And now we're, you know, things are changing and maybe that's not a huge deal anymore, but
that's something that I don't want to see us lose our neighborhoods and our ability for um families to enjoy their property without having to deal with nuisance issues next door, that kind of thing.
>> Got it. Okay. Thank you. >> That's helpful. That's a good point. Thanks. >> Yeah. Can I >> Yeah, we'll say in the state. Oh, please go ahead. >> Um, so one issue that seems to keep popping up is agriculture. Um, we have a
lot of um homeowners with 10, 15, 20,000 square foot parcels that want to keep uh farm animals, whether it be chickens, ducks, and stuff. And we've sort of always allowed that without without maybe the bylaw exactly saying that we
could do it. Um, And I think that's something that we really need to look into and create, at least in my opinion, the ability to allow this um without opening a floodgate um
>> it's a hard situation. We want farming in our town. We want people to be able to do this stuff, but we also don't want nuisance. Um, >> it goes it goes back to the the number one problem that I think >> most people would echo Marilyn's
sentiment is it's hard to enforce your bylaw when nobody knows what to enforce. >> Absolutely. No, that makes a lot that that is an an excellent other thing for us to kind of understand. So, thank you for that.
Um, anything else kind of on that question or should I move to the next? >> Next is good. >> Sure. Um, so are there any uses or types of activities that the council has heard um
that the community wants or needs but are not being well supported by the current zoning bylaw? >> We have a restriction. And I believe we have a restriction in our bylaw for larger um facilities, you know, um for
um amusement or rec recreational. Mhm. >> If there was some way we could have a bylaw that would address I mean we see uses coming out now where you it's a where you have soccer fields you have indoor sports it becomes a whole complex
and I don't our bylaw supports such a use at the moment >> um we want to keep out the stadiums and hippodromes and that kind of stuff. So where is the blend where we could perhaps invite something like that? And I would think that the industrial garden
park is the only place where we could put it um because of the where the available land is. Just a thought. >> Good point. >> It's a great point. >> That's I will um for for that I can specifically say I know one of my
colleagues is actually helped the town out on the Cape with something similar. So that's something that we can absolutely I can I can touch base with her on that specifically too. >> But if we have a bylaw like that, it might invite >> a person. I mean, obviously someone has
to own the property and and go that way, but at least if we we create it, it might invite it. >> Sure. And I'm not necessarily sure what what uses I'd be looking for, but I know
obviously postco we like yeah there's still some retail in town but we have a lot of office space and some of it has turned into like medical like offices and such and those are still occupied but like just the
actual people going to an office like there's a lot of vacant space like that >> in town. Maybe not the entire building, but parts of those buildings are vacant. And I wonder what else could be allowed to not have so much wasted space.
>> Sure. >> Yeah, that makes that makes a lot of sense. Um, anyone else have anything on that or um I would be I would be happy to run into my last question because I know there's someone else after us as well, so I don't want to take up too much of the
council's time. >> Sure. Go. >> Perfect. So, what are and I I think some of this is starting to come out in our earlier questions, but what are the council's priorities for the zoning bylaw? And do any of you have any
specific concerns or areas of critical importance related to the east long metal bylaw that we should be keeping in mind as we're as we're doing this? I think for me this summation is probably maybe more than some others on the
council. I'm definitely open to to change in some different things, but by no means am I necessarily saying let's put skyscrapers in town or anything. It's like how do we find balance between some different things and >> knowing that we're a suburb that's going
to keep growing but not >> be so restrictive that nothing looks different 20 years from now either. >> Sure. I think allowing growth in a smart way that doesn't inadvertently
shackle us to not being able to grow in the manner where we need to continue supporting the community. you know, having these services available to the public. >> Um, and and just having bylaws that are easy to read, easy to comprehend for most folks and not being, I think,
unnecessarily, >> even if that wasn't obviously the intent, you know, that's not the intention when it's being written. Um, but having clear-cut, you know, things where government is not tries to be not as intrusive as it needs to be.
Any other thoughts? >> I'm all set. >> Just really quick, I like the fact that we have site plan review and special permit. I like the fact that we have appointed officials on our planning board um who ultimately make the
decision uh who hear directly from citizens of our town um >> with a unique uh perspective. most of them have been residents for years and years and um and I think that gives us a better ability to understand what the
public wants and I'd hate to see something like that uh superseded um by just department heads having uh so much authority that they can override them. >> Sure. >> Support that. Absolutely.
Great. >> Anything else? >> Okay. Well, thank you very much. >> Thank you very much. This has been very informative. >> Yeah. Thank you all very much. And please um you know, normally this would be the point where I hand out my card, but unfortunately we're virtually, but
um please the plan director knows how to find us. Please feel free to get our contact from him if uh if you if if you have any questions or want to follow up on any of this. Great. Thank you so much. >> Thank you very much for your time. Okay. Next under new business, we have
approving Mass General Law Chapter 268A section 20D exemption for Lin Booth for a position of receptionist at the East Law Meadow Housing Authority. There a motion. >> Make a motion to approve the Massachusetts General Law 268A section
20D exemption for booth position of receptionist resignment housing authority. >> Second. >> Motion's been made and seconded. Is there any further discussion? Seeing none. Jim, >> yes. >> Yes. >> Emmy, yes. Marilyn, >> yes. >> Ralph, >> yes. >> And John, >> yes. >> Passes.
>> She's She's in the audience. >> Hi, Lynn. >> Thank you, Lynn. >> Okay. Next, under new business, we have reviewing the executive session minutes for release. So, I had gone through the spreadsheet of all of them that we had in the past that hadn't previously been
released. um and put together my recommendations after reading all of those minutes. Um so if there's no questions or comments, I'll entertain a motion. >> I make a motion to approve the recommendations relative to the release
of executive sessionments as presented. >> I'll second that. >> Motion's been made and seconded. Is there any further discussion? Seeing none, Jim, >> yes. >> Dana, >> yes. >> I'm a yes. Marilyn, >> yes. >> Ralph, >> yes. >> John, >> yes. And the motion passes.
Thank you. Let's see action items for next meeting. >> I don't think there's any >> there really there's nothing impending. Um right after of course our first meeting on September 9th is the September 11th candle light vigil at the
fire department. As usual, um we tentatively had legislative updates September 23rd, but knowing the legislator schedules, that'll probably push into sometime in October or November again. Um so, as of now, there's nothing like immediately on the
docket that I know of unless some of these other discussions we've had tonight resurface with some more info. >> I'm sure I'll have a full agenda for you. >> I'm sure. Yes, >> it's quite a ways out. Um but I think it's worth noting that the um EA grant
that you approved last month um Spec Dempsey is doing that reconceptualization of the center town and they'll be doing their presentation of deliverables on September 30th, Tuesday night in the auditorium.
Um, part of that grant also requires a local match and we're matching that with signs. And so I'll be leaving a book on Tuesdays at noon with lunch provided um
at the library on Jeff Beth's book, Walk City. And then the library is hosting its own like book discussion group on the 24th. >> Great. Thank you, Rebecca. >> Homework in advance. the speaker come to second.
>> Thank you. Unless anyone has anything else, I'll entertain a motion to adjurnn. Still moved. >> Second. >> Motion's been made and seconded to adjurnn. Any other discussion? Seeing none say I. >> All in favor, please say I. >> Post very
happy 22. Later.