##VIDEO ID:fK0irJsNhZc## yeah first they bought me a new G so this meeting has been properly advertised and posted in accordance with public law 75 chapter 231 which is the open public meetings act or the sunshine roll call Mayor and Petty Here Clark here Dash here doy here Galloway here Heist here pessie here pener here Timbers here right here number four on our agenda is the mayor's presentations okay welcome everyone actually something down not going um as a small City we're limited with limited staff and resources at cor City depends heavily on volunteers we have a Volunteer Fire Department volunteer coaches boards and organizations all who freely give their time and talents to make our city a better place tonight I wanted to present two exceptional volunteers Gary hes and Bush Kinsley the key to the city for outstanding volunteerism service and commitment to a city I would also like to thank their wives one of them here tonight but thank you to their wives for allowing them to do what they do in supporting their efforts so buty and Gary can com on this side see first Gary and Butchie are lifelong residents who love a haror city and use their numerous skills to better the city not surprisingly they are past recipients of the citizen of year they always pick up the phone when I call and never say no when they're asked to help despite their busy personal and professional life I really don't know what I would do without them I mean that I could be here all evening name naming the many projects they have done both individually and together over the years but for the sake of time I will only name a few Gary is an electrician by trade he has worked on many street light projects to make sure all the street lights in town are installed and working he ensures that egg haror city is a priority with the electric company during storms and electrical outages and for needed repairs he also has taken the lead on numerous projects in the city such as the demolition of the original tax Sports additions to the kaboon playground that's on bucko Avenue and he maintains and cares for the Crusaders field and the playground year long Gary is a member of many local organizations and serves on many but is a car of my trade he rebuilt dugouts at uhre and repaired several stands also K he engineered laid out and helped build Kaboom playground he has been an offici member of the fire department since he was 18 but was pretty much at the firehouse with his dad helping out long before then my husband said as a child um apparently as the fire chief he supports and helps coordinate all the community events with his members including the Citywide cleanup ping events banners on phad Cedar Creek Championship creates and Santa on fire Chuck at the tree Lake when I call his standard answer is we'll get it done Gary and fie are both humble guys who avoid seeking recognition but as mayor I cannot allow that individual play gie must be recognized for their contributions and it is my privilege and honor to do so thank you both so much for your Vol and service I do not know what I this do without you guys so without further Ado to Gary one more again I've lived in the city all my life and uh I really got involved kind of through kyre through Bush he got me on the board of kyre with George Mor off and George basically was our leader and I learned a lot at kre through all the people that are on the board with us and George and then I moved on to when I retired you know to assisting with the light projects and various projects throughout the city I'm retired now so I do have time and I just feel that everybody if you just take a little isue to do something in the city if everybody just did a little something it makes a big difference in the city no matter what it is whether you volunteer at the food pantry if you volunteer at Crusaders there's so many places to volunteer and so many things to you do a Roose cleanup or a little clean up in your own turret or alley or whatever there's so many things to do but each and every one of us should tried to do something it would be a benefit to the city G and BR let us know what locks they open up the yeah okay number five on the agenda uh no stranger to aover City Dr Ruffin uh has a presentation for us uh about a proposed Redevelopment of the St Nicholas school property Chicago AB want people at home to be able to see it you L on to zoom and then you could share your screen that way the people I don't have anyone watching I have no I'm saying people on so if you go on if you log if you go to our website could he put He put yes just can can you move the camera like you did a minute ago if I'm gonna show it here good okay good evening Madame mayor council president a members of the city council distinguish guest uh thank you so much for joining us tonight my name is Dr lar Deen I am a uh a practitioner uh I have a practice in lwood and I am an associate professor at ston University and the chair of the doctor of nursing practice program um I'm pleased to present to you the paradise and I have with me tonight my attorney George Waz and my engineer um and so we um have been working uh diligently to uh to Wi to you this project uh we have been um under contract for a little bit uh we originally thought we would be uh doing something like a uh a a some apartments we came we talked to the council and um we listen and we change our plans we change our plans multiple times and now we come up with this assisted living facility we believe uh this is going to be a great plan for the city and uh this is a 104 units uh assisted living facility um so our goal is to originally we were thinking about uh keeping the uh the man building and add the two side buildings however when we talk to uh a to builders uh they tell us and and our engineer that it might be best to uh to build a new building but keep the face of the current building with the face of the current building with the steps and the front poles at and with set we will we will have the uh we will honor the community by with keeping something that is really dear uh to the community so we have the uh the different units uh with 104 units uh the size are listed here uh 58 units will be 396 Square ft 30 units will be at uh 448 12 units will be 476 three units will be 490 and one unit will be uh 53 so now this information is based on the drawing architect did uh based on keeping the uh the current building because trying to fit uh uh those units in what was there so that's how we come up with these uh with these numbers and uh this is this is something that will create about 40 to 45 full-time jobs in the City and we think this is really significant so this is the side view uh this is the back view and uh this is what we have here you can see uh in blue is the current building and in yellow is the two uh addition uh to the current build and of course uh you see what parking will look like so okay this is the uh the third floor this is a uh uh the 3D version of that the second floor uh the first floor okay and uh this is the basement so the so we will bring a number of alides into the into the basement uh for example you can see we're going to have a have a pool a swimming pool we have the director's offices will be in the basement we will have a gym uh pingpong WS uh we have pool tables uh the employee lounge will be there there is a a barber shop uh we have loading areas doctor's offices the Main Kitchen we plan to leave it where it is and the main dining room is the uh the uh the area next to the kitchen the way it is currently uh we're going to have an everyday Cafe uh right there by the kitchen uh we have a security room laundry we have a chapel we have a large conference womb and a theater in the basement in the library so um this is going to be uh really a a beautiful project the swimming pool uh side the size of the area where the pool will be is 1,120 sare Ft the gym is 750 square ft the theater is uh 980 and the conference womb is 950 Square ft so um in a nor shell this is the project and I want you to know that our go goal is uh to really serve uh the community and we've already uh decided that 10% of our Revenue okay we know we we 10% of our Revenue will be um will be there set aside to support Community initiatives such as the youth sport program churches Sen works and other humanitarian programs in the city so we we believe that this is something that's going to really serve the community well so we here to answer any questions you have my my attorney here and my engineer is here and we should be able to answer any questions you have thank you I have a question yes can you give us a definition of what assisted living is there's many different forms of Assisted Living so can you give us a definition of what this form or is it going to be multiple forms of assisted living within this um unit very good so so this assisted living is go is for any individual who requires some types of assistance for example let's say um a single father um or or a widow um can no longer take care of all the activities of daily and want to place to to to stay like a beautiful place a hotel style place where the laundry can be done food is prepared this would be the place for um let's say someone start to forget so actually we thinking about having a Memory Care UN in there as well people they start forgetting they can't remember to take their medications but they are functional they are not ready for um for a home placement that would be a place for them does that answer question yes thank you and this is very different from a nursing home this is not a nursing home and it's not a group home facility it's not a group home facility and you anticipate there'll be seniors there to like is mainly seniors yeah yes mainly seniors and also non seniors who required some assistance and there are people who live in assisted living facilities who do not really require any nursing assistance um where these people they take the they some of them can still drive they take uh they can take their medications but um actually one person I just admitted into a uh an assisted living facility um I mean he is uh 85 years old never cook his wife always cook and his wife passed away and U the daughter lives out of state he not really take him out of so the assisted living facility comes very hand so um he has his his private room and the uh the facility uh you know takes care of his of his laundry and and his meals and he still drives okay and um yeah he can drive to go to the doctor's office or come to the facility can see him so he's vibrating the community but he doesn't have to worry about where his meals are coming from and who's going to clean his clothes so what you're saying is these people are free to come and go and uh function in the community or wherever and when they're there there's people there to watch over them to make sure that their needs are taken exactly yes and one thing that you said that when we talked to you the last time you showed us this um you were going to keep the main building the way it is but you're saying just going to use the face of it yes we we talked about that and we wanted we wanted to do that uh with the many Builders we talked to uh they told us that uh there are many unknowns we although we know that our engineer went in there and check the checked the buildings but at the end of the day it's a 100 years old building so a we have to take about the next 100 years so that's that's the type of communications we have with then but we think probably even keeping the face and where they can really uh put some good walls behind the the face might be uh something we can do I have a question yes um it's significantly different than other presentations youve given yes um so uh my question would be um is this going to be run by a for-profit business or for a n or by a nonprofit it is for profit okay yeah we are for profit okay very good yes what is the criteria to move um from the one facility to move to a nursing facility what would initiate them moving out moving moving out of if the person cannot um is someone who is getting sick very very frequently and requires a lot of nursing care more than what uh we can offer there would would need to move to a nursing home in the in the uh assisted living facility um the uh we we will not have nurses to be doing like wound care uh nurses to Al there will be there will be a nursing director that's a requirement by by the State and uh we will have a some medical assistants we will have um a few nurses but it they will be supervising these patients more than providing nursing care so that's that's the main difference but someone who really needs a lot of Nursing Care uh uh would need to go into a nursing home that would be different from the Assisted Living thank you following up on her question question I think the last time we talked you said there was different levels of care you could provide in here yes so they could start out very functional yes and get to a point where not exactly yeah if they get to a point where they are not functional but uh still still doesn't really require a lot of a lot of medical care okay so they can they can stay there the same way they could stay in their homes if they have the means they have the people to to care for them but when it gets to a point where they require a lot of Nursing Care uh that wouldn't be the place for them I have another question about the exterior you were talking the last time you had said there would be a gazebo on the one side and you would have it fixed up a certain way on the side I can't really see so um you have so form here [Music] here okay so this is what this is what this is going to look like so we have some green space okay be like green space uh W and you have the parking we have we have plants so this is what we take that's going to look like right now so there won't actually be outdoor area for them like seating area or anything like that for the people at the facility there will be at this point in time the green area is not clearly defined so we're just trying to move this a little further down the road and the next step will be the finance commission and so there will be amentities in involved in sitting areas uh maybe Recreation that sort of thing but I don't want to confuse find commission thank you so so the recreation that's there now not Recreation but the green space that's there now behind the building do you anticipate that will be the same amount or look like they're going to take some of that take okay all right so the score on the impervious coverage which is a big part of the pine lands application is that we're about 2,000 square ft short of what's imp prvious coverage there now so we're pretty much filled up as far as what the outdoor recreation will look like we haven't defined yet but there will be some minimum seating areas uh maybe some outdoor Gaines that sort of thing um but at this point in time that has not been formed but is fully planned to be something and I'm sorry that we're not offering the details of that at this point in time but we just want to try and move on with the Pinelands commission which will not be looking at that sort of thing unless of course we put you know large Pavilion and things of that nature out there and our understanding is this is a permitted use because of medical it would be under zoning a conditionally permitted use we don't meet all the conditions so honestly we would need to seek a de variance from youram sport we're not meeting all the conditions uh because we don't need blot area and and several other things regarding this but this is one of the better uses that can ever be done on this site plunked in the middle of a residential neighborhood so that's why we want to move forward with this but it will require some cooperation the land use board in terms probably a d variance and some other variance really to do what is a permitted use but conditionally permitted use which means there are conditions bu quite need how would you rate traffic in I'm glad you asked that if you notice the parking areas we have they comply with a residential site Improvement standards which does cover a uh assisted living facility there's not much parking there because there's not much needed so it does comply with all the parking required which means as any kind of development you could propose on this site whether it's apartments or or single family houses you know spread out this will provide less on off and on-site traffic coming in and out than any other application or proposal that has been brought for this site in the past what is the total of residents again fac 104 tot4 rooms yes rooms okay and and what are the parking spaces just s of curiosity2 52 I think2 which believe it or not the residential sight Improvement standards the state governs this believes is Enough Five per unit right well it's that plus the the uh the uh St staff and which is more than enough for that again that seems a little light but Assistant Living typically have a lot of residents that are drivers also but it does have some yes but visitors visitors and residents that's still drive um in terms of uh the employment 40 to 45 jobs that this is going to generate um do you guys have an idea of a percentage of how much of those employees uh you would prefer to be a Carver City residents we have not decided that but um uh we will be an equal opportunity employee and uh you know anyone can go ahead and apply uh when it's time when the time comes okay but we uh we really would would like people from the city uh to to get involved to apply for to our jobs and then they won't need a parking place they just walk they won't to work go to work um would you be willing to have like a a local job fair if you could have a job suddenly which we can yes we can do that okay yes any other questions anybody from the audience any questions for is this gonna Encompass all the property from Camp to qualus makes that takes that whole area yes yes say is there any age restriction no age no age restriction the the only things that um uh you have to uh I mean you you have to uh require the assistance by a doctor by doctor anybody else from the audience Steph they going to be have kitchen XS in them or they'll they won't be able to cook in their room no they cannot cook in their WS there will be um well there will be a little kitchen with um a little um they can have a little fridge a little sink um cabinets but no stove um I believe they can have a little microwave but but no sto yeah so your intentions are never to make it to become like a an efficiency apartment oh no [Music] is there a possibility that some of them could be two people in a room like a husband wife yeah yes they are F yes already I mean you see advertised on TV these different places where these couples go and they live and they have their dinners like maravia house isn't that one of them where it's an assisted living and um they go and they live there because they have some type of a need but they can still travel they can still do their thing and then they come back there so it's on the it's on the same preference as that yes and I personally think it's a wonderful idea and I think it would be a benefit to the K thank in my if you're looking at St Louis the church is still there and that big grass field is still there and the building is behind that is so that grass area is still there yes next to the church yes okay okay sorry Chicago Chicago Chicago Chicago nin terol I just have a question for councilman r you live across the street like still I mean listen I think it's a beautiful building I think it's it's it just to me it just does not fit that Community like it's I don't know I mean it's just I I build group homes okay up and down pretty much Jersey I mean we do proping Management Group hes which is almost similar to what this is at a little bit a higher level when we go in and build these houses we make the group homes fit in that Community where it would be like using like overiding something to blend that neighborhood together so it doesn't look like somebody just took a mar home and cled it into to a resident area I mean I think it's a beautiful building I think it's a good idea I just don't think it fits to be honest with you well one of the things you said you were going to keep the same yeah but that's the one front door in the steps I mean match they they said to match the rest of the building to to that right or you change that no that that is correct so the front facade with the columns and the would be kept right but all the way around the building all the way around the building would be kept in the same character as was there now and one of the things the site um cuz that picture that you guys had up there looked like modern sighting and it didn't look anything actually um well I the last time we met I think one I don't want to see big building standing there all the time so so we talk to to architect and um the architect came up with with this but I mean we are still flexible but uh that specific comment about a big building steing there that's why no no I understand that but I mean my thing is more character to the building to fit the neighborhood okay for like if you're like like we do a lot of building in like historic areas where you got to when you go in there and build you got to bring that house back to basically look exactly how it was prior to what it completely agree with that and in this case we have the elephant in the room being the existing building is there oh yeah 100% so we can renovate the building which is probably not the best idea for and enlarge it for making this project work but the replacing there is but the elephant in the room is still that we have this huge building that has to be that has to come down or be renovated which adds a huge cost to both process right and so it's either this m or and the other thing is I mean that parking lot right there is like right in front of my house the the right side how many feet is how how many feet is the green area there okay um I I couldn't tell you without you know getting SC so but it's it's significant so the impervious coverage proposed is a little bit less than there now not a lot a little but the elephant in the room like I said before the building is there and that produces a cost that is huge in whether you teari down or you renovate either way it's a burden to begin with and it's there to begin with what do we do and we looked at the alternative of putting single family houses in here we looked at Alternatives between single family houses saving the building turning into perance either way Mr Ruffin wasn't going to be able to afford to do it without losing a lot of money it's just the nature of the Beast that we're dealing with that it takes a lot 104 units in order to make this thing turn a profit for him make a viable project in in the community that adds to everybody's benefit and again it's a project that doesn't generate traffic and activity such as an apartment building or even single family houses would have it's much less so it's it's morphed into this through the process of coming back to the city over and over again with different processes and this is the one I believe as a professional planner an engineer will actually work for everybody involved if I if I could just say um first of all I appreciate all your hard work with this I've following this project from the from the original and uh the St Nicholas school has been empty for many many years um it's right in my neighborhood I live on the same street um and I I appreciate the fact that you're willing to do something to to renovate that building and and make it viable again I'm happy that you're using the facade I would have been happier if you could use more of it but I totally understand that that that it's may not be cost effective so again I'm in favor of it I appreciate all your hard work thank you anybody else so um this is Tracy can I ask a question comments just thank you thank you I think our next step is probably let this sink in a little bit uh and then maybe revisit it um maybe at our next meeting well he has to what is it March you have to make settlement um yes we have to we have to move on uh with settlement uh but we want to be clear where we stand okay with that well we we could uh R to poll the council here take a a vote on whether you like the idea or not like the idea to move forward you want a resolution yeah off the resolution yeah make a resolution that we uh we support this project sir second I'll second okay a motion has been made in second that we support Dr Ruffin and his group on this project uh roll call Clark yes Dash yes doy yes Galloway yes Heist yes hessie yes Keener yes Timbers yes right undecided okay so PA motion passes all was all fa thank you I one suggestion would be right I notic on side you have a row of trees thank you can go big enough trees to cover this whole side so when he looks at his door he's not looking at a bilding he's going to look at certainly we can we have not gone to the point of apply for site plan approval so that's why I'm undecided I mean until I can see a full sight plan and what's exactly what's going on well this invol going back to I I know Ste I know flowering trees Mason go go for all of that you want flowering no no I those those trees from s go because I have no trees in my house and I go to clean those leaves up they can go have it question for question for our attorney we do everything proper there yeah okay I'm TR olution yes okay thank you very much for the presentation and your interest in this back what a basket that was that's that Greening that was there that became the basketball so basically like if this was you say this is St n okay number number six on our agenda is approve the minutes of January 2nd and the minutes of January 9th We Ready the minutes from January 2nd at last meeting I thought we did I thought we did so did we do that did we approve the minutes of the reorder yeah you have it on here but wer ready so this com about the what comments okay yeah we could say that okay this is for both uh January 2nd and January 9th is there a motion motion second motion made in second in all in favor opposed motion passes um number seven uh public comment on any of our agenda items so this is where somebody can make a comment was there another question about the presentation somebody had online online had a question oh okay yeah had a question is kind of wild and crazy a little outside the box but and maybe it's way too late to even consider this but would it be possible to make the footprint the footprint of the building smaller and build up a fourth floor to help maybe meet the pin lands restrictions on the green area and maybe make things look a little different just a wild and crazy idea well I would the way I would answer that is this is going to the land use board next so that could be a comment that could be made at that meeting and a suggestion yeah so I'll reach out engineer to convey that as a possibility but right that would probably require additional relief for height in excess of what the ordinance allows but yeah I don't think it's going to be any higher than what's there uh not with what they just proposed but if they were to add if they were to shrink the footprint and add a fourth floor then it would grow another 15 feet or something yeah I don't I don't know how that would be that would be a big big building yeah like a written Bird right in front of your house would they be going to the meeting on the 18th of February it won't be ready for that okay thanks does that answer your question yeah thank you okay thank you anybody else okay number eight on our agenda is mayor's report I really don't have anything since we've had so many meetings but um Ryan will talk about the one thing that I was going to bring up about um elect charging so I'll just defer to Ryan good job okay thank you um let's just go right down the list for Safety Committee uh councilwoman H yeah we had a safety committee meeting um this past week and uh John diino our risk manager discussed the need to update appraisals values for the city's buildings and the importance of riskmanagement preent preventative measures he also addressed ongoing issues the need for regular physical assessments for the police force and the importance of proper protocols for addressing building fires and managing liability for public facilities lastly he discussed the possibility of online training modules for lifeguards and the need for ethics training and that's all I have Safety Committee meetings will be as needed okay our next committee report would be from uh councilman doy for Public Works uh tomorrow is the deadline for applications for the public works superintendent position full-time uh we're going to have a public works committee meeting on Monday to review uh those applications and also other public work Works items uh Jerry barberio or um part-time temporary Public Works supervisor is here and he can I ask him if he could just give a quick overview of activities at the public works department thank you councilman Doby um so as everyone knows it's snows every 3 to 5 days and that's annoying but that's life U but we're dealing with it as best we can um the cold temperatures are definitely a challenge uh but we also dealt with that as best we could during this holiday weekend um it looks like we're getting a break and we looks like we're getting maybe in the 40s which is balmy and warm and so I'm hoping that um we can move into some other things that I wanted to do at Public Works which was um do some basic uh chaina safety class um things of that nature and maybe take down a couple of smaller trees that I know are on the list um so those are the things that we're looking to do other than that it's just business as usual thank you thank you any questions any questions for other works thank you Mr doy uh code enforcement councilwoman hessie uh code enforcement the meeting took place yesterday we um gathered with the um with the code enforcement uh department and with that we we went over rental inspections proactive trash initiatives and a White Horse Pike initiative the committee would like to work on later this year we explained our concerns and solutions listened to theirs and found Common Grounds on most issues our next meeting will be Friday February 4th 6:30 via Zoom only thank you thank you uh next committee would be property uh councilwoman Gallow uh parks and playgrounds uh couple things we met with um on Zoom the committee met with uh Dave from the campground and um when there were a couple things he had a couple concerns one being the uh The Pavilion I guess uh he never got the memo that the ticket prices were raised and something happened where he felt like got Mis Miss screwed up with some prices so he's asking that we can do basically he actually just text me yesterday we can come up with an answer and that's up to committee what you guys want to do but um if we can do 50% basically which is the $5 tickets rather than the $10 ticket for the badg for when he rents Y for the guests that come yes the 50 up to 50 a maximum of 50 I thought he said 10 no that's what it was he wants 50% I mean they he wants to see if we can knock it cut it in half 50% which is oh I got and he will he will provide the wristbands right up to 50 cuz we had issue we had an issue last year we got scammed yes it was actually cheaper for her this person Bas he rented the cavilon and even used the cavilon just got the discounted Lake raises and just went right to the beach yeah so he was asking I mean that's something up to the committee that's completely up to you I mean you guys wait until the next parks and playground Mee that's completely up to you guys or we can make a decision T night and I can send him a text I mean I don't I can weigh in I feel that that's reasonable that's what I I mean that's how I feel but that's up to you know whatever you guys want do now you guys can wait s sit on it whatever you guys want to do is there a recommendation move it move it yeah I make a recommendation that we go the uh basically for when he runs the Pavilion out uh basically the L bagg is will be $5 up to 50 maximum of 50 Le leaving the cost of the Pavilion the same yes was it 250 I think so that's a motion yes okay is there a second yeah does that have to be put into a form of an ordinance for Revis the ordinance I don't know we have an ordinance and the the um badges always allowed for a differentiation in price a range in prices at least it used to because years ago the Crusader would come for a dollar right churches could come for a dollar so there's a range of prices but I guess Jody probably better be resol I think we updated prices by resolution we the ordinance but we made it so be so we didn't have to update the ordinance every time right and and just so you know him offering those discounted tickets the money goes directly to us yeah it come to us it's not like it's going to him and he sells more Pavilion wrestles and we do get50 % of that I believe so we're talking about the big Pavilion so if he rents that out and he has 50 guests be5 for his guest typically 10 yeah he he feels it's going to add more I guess get more looks at that pillion more draws but he wants to get it up on the website I guess soon as possible so he can advertise it whatever the case okay we have a motion is there a second second hold oh sorry oh I was going to say if that's the recommendation from the committee I can be the resolution for the next for the next meeting that can be voted all by CH so if you want to do it that way does whatever is the right way just so I can let them know that I know he wants to get the ball moving so he can get adver he get it up on his website prior to that uh the next meeting is February what 13 13 I I think councilman can can um let let let them know that it's going to the recommendation Parks commit will be taking action okay that's I just want make sure the resolution clearly encompasses everything that that Council and committee want to his number okay so that's the recommendation but we're not GNA take action on that yeah I mean I'd rather do it the right way that way don't come back to okay vot you can vote but I think I think it would be easier or if I just present if I just have the resolution for everybody to vote on next time I hear the recommendation from the committee and we'll we'll turn it into a quick resolution so everybody and we'll put that on the agenda next all right that work all right one other thing um C uh nette brought up about uh the peace Pilgrim uh Bridge um and I mean she showed us pictures at the uh the parks playgrounds I mean it's it's in bad shape far as the Landscaping wi but she had reached out to the county already and put a word in there so hopefully she'll get contact with somebody and somebody I'll contact her back to see exactly what we can do to uh dress that up a little bit which bridge this one right bridges in the park one where the creek comes in one where the creek comes into the park and there's another bridge where it leaves the park those two I would like to see those two hardscaped so that will that broken concrete could come out of there and it would be a lot safer and it would beautify the park of course well since it's a bridge I'm figuring that's has it to do with the county campia Street and so nette if you want to write up what your concerns are and just send it to me in an email I'll call the county and I talked to Jerry dollar morning sometimes if the mayor calls the county also Chang in the open space tax program and they are now including um maintenance uh however I was told that it's only for County Parks so I said well you know we would like to work with the county to get this done it's unsightly and it's unsafe especially if you know kids should go up there it's worse in the winter time because you can see all broken concrete and everything so he said that he would send the uh Public Works through out there to look at it and report back to him and we'll see where we can go from that but I was encouraged by the conversation and um you know we might have to apply for a grant somewhere to help fund it but we'll do what we have to do okay anything else okay uh next on the list here is license ordinance any activity on that Carl uh well we we had a brief meeting with the uh and and Jerry were discussing uh changes to our ordinance as far our code as far as uh free removal and replacement uh we're also uh discussing the possibility of doing an ordinance for snow removal um at this point we we have a draft for uh the tree removal replacement uh but we will be working with our Municipal attorney on U on both board since we might be able to present something at the next meeting pre on the agenda Carl did you get did you get my recommendations that I emailed to you uh I did I haven't had I would like those considered for the tree no for other things many many other things while we're with you uh is there any report from the land use boort uh all we had was a re so there's nothing to report on that okay councilwoman Clark you have any school board nothing to report thank you okay uh anything with eron hoopin there there was no meeting not open uh hopefully after the next meeting there'll be something to report okay and we did something different this year we have a lake committee which is separate from the parks and playgrounds committee uh is there anything to report on that nothing to report okay I can rep yeah I'm in the process of revising The Aquatic Facility plan and we are going to have a meeting soon at City Hall to discuss path forward the badges will be believe it or not it's right around the corner and we did reach out to past employees to see if they want to return so yes yeah the emails emails been sent to the Past employees to see if they want to return so we know where we are hiring CU that's got start in the next month we have to know so okay thank you and Meg I did see some activity with the jff a representative something with John recently where was there a meeting or was he just here gathering information he was here Gathering but we do have a meeting in February just the the with the um department heads okay we go over different okay good uh and on finance there's been a lot of activity uh one and I talked about it at the last meeting that we've had uh a formal meeting of the committee but there's been also other meetings that have popped up because of different things happening so I guess the biggest thing right now is we're trying to organize uh a meeting of the property owners along the one in2 200 blocks of Philadelphia Avenue and um hopefully we have that sooner than later to talk about the future of of those two blocks and what can be done there and I would welcome the Redevelopment commit uh EDC to be part of that if if you so choose and uh we'd love to have you there and talk together about it and uh I'll be reaching out to different people to try to organize that meeting uh tentatively right now it looks like it might have to be either mid February or for mid-march I don't want to do it mid-march if we don't have to but the sooner the better and uh hopefully we can get that together that's all I have for that uh the next thing on our agenda is Chief of Police oh I'm sorry sustainable yeah I'm sorry um property your property and sustainable sustainable jism yes um the uh tree ordinance that we've been talking about for the past year or so is on the agenda tonight for introduction um the green team will have a meeting next Tuesday at 6 pm here at City Hall and on Zoom uh it's January 28th and we'll be talking about uh how this ordinance came to be uh so if anybody's interested in learning more about the ordinance before the public hearing uh in a couple weeks they they should attend that meeting uh if anybody has anything here uh for the newsletter please get it to me me ASAP I don't have much time to get it done this week coming up so um and then uh the other thing that I wanted to mention was that Dave Resource Group completed the um tree inventory and they inspected 3,26 trees uh in the city property proper and on New York Avenue leading into Cedar Creek High School and we also included the trees that line the beach at the lake um they found 65 moderate risk trees and two high risk trees and 1,000 vacant planting sites where we can add new trees uh we're waiting to hear if we can use Grant funds to uh immediately remove those high-risk trees and if we're allowed to do so we'll take them down right away and also um they will be providing us with something called treekeeper a software program that will be used by the codee enforcement department and the arborist and anybody who else who's interested in learning about it will be setting up a uh training session at um at convenient time for everybody uh that should take a couple weeks to complete and that's it so and then the other one thing that uh we did with the assistance of the marget green team was to create some flyers for the plastic pollution ordinance that we passed last year and we'll be putting them in the code enforcement department for um to be included in the package uh that is picked up for building permits so we're getting those printed up and through Cody they do an excellent job if anybody needs printing done definitely see Cody and it's very very inexpensive so that's all I have okay thank you uh rotary I just have one thing the last last uh meeting the P preter scholarship was prevented um and it was held at Crossroads it went to Drew broch of Cedar Creek High School um the scholarship is in memory of Joe prer um I don't know if anyone's familiar with him but um he used to live here in a harber city he was a rotarian and um an a Harbor City businessman um and he also lived in a Harbor City um I just wanted to um let everybody know and um the next meeting will be next Tuesday 1:28 at 5:30 Mill Street po all I have and I just want to give H councilman Dash you have anything to add to the reports any no how about uh councilwoman ice no sir okay thank you uh Chief report she's on Zoom okay hello everybody can you hear me yes yep all right great um so in the last two weeks we have had two fraud cases uh two reports of sexual assaults four thefts five motor vehicle accidents 24 traffic stops 19 summons is issued um we've had two arrests other incidents four business alarms one residential alarm 52 crime prevention activities three domestics 15 EMS incidents nine firearms ID applications one followup 136 property checks 12 public service calls in terms of things that we've done over the last few weeks um we've tried to avoid um the snow and ice uh on the 15th we had a community cares event in licken park the picol provides hot meals Church By The Bay comes into town um and sets up rack racks of clothing quite a few folks came and got clothing for the Colder Weather that's coming um New Jersey courts is also there when we do these events to help out with expungements or other court related issues uh we did have a student travel plan audit um mayor J Petty and and Ryan mcgallen were there at the community school where we did an assessment of areas in town to improve walking areas for students and pedestrians in general um the mayor and Ryan can add anything to that if they need to um Municipal Alliance meeting was also held that I attended where we talked about preventive measures that we can use funding for at the schools and throughout the community um attended a county Chief's meeting and uh yesterday I watched the E Fleet webinar um I did do that councilwoman Galloway it was quite lengthy and very science heavy um but that's all we've had over the last few weeks like I said we've been trying to avoid snow and ice um and trying to help people stay safe in these cold conditions Ryan are you going to talk about the safe are the a travel plan or you want me to mention the the travel plan is uh something that we ask the school to do it gives us a really good position on getting grants for Safe Streets to school and also uh sidewalk improvements as you are aware if you live on Liverpool Avenue we can't cover all the sidewalks with the grants that we have the grants we get for the roads right now so this will help any roads that aren't done on the next Road hopefully the next few roads we'll be able to apply for Grants to finish all the sidewalks so it gives us what like 25 points on the application we have a travel plan yeah they rate applications on 100 point scale and you get 25 points if their current School travel plan so the general advice from D has been if you don't have a school travel plan probably don't spend an application because you're not going to score Road um so yeah it helps it's a couple $1,000 um grants that they give out you know three three and $400,000 range was the last one we got but that was almost 10 years ago so um yeah having an updated tool travel plan will definitely help get some more money and be able to do sidewalks crosswalks um SM thingss to help increase for so those of you on Buffalo Avenue the four and 500 blocks four and 500 blocks don't stress we're looking out for you any questions for the chief none okay uh CFL J no uh City cart nothing nothing uh I want to thank our engineer for providing us with a engineer's written report status report so ran sure no problem I'll go through um so the AR great green project uh we bid and awarded it uh we actually had a preconstruction meeting earlier this morning um the discussion sort of centered around making sure it was done before the food truck festival in August um the only concerns they had were Landscaping other than that everything should should be well done well before then um so that that will probably break ground within the next month or so uh Liverpool Avenue the 100 300 blocks all that work is complete we're just trying to get project close out and get final reimbursement from dot uh we've actually been successful I think we've closed out three or four open projects um in in the state's online system uh which is very difficult to navigate but I think we're we're finally making progress there um as the mayored earlier Buffalo Avenue the four and 500 blocks uh we've been working on the design uh we've been done for a little bit we finally were able to uh review the sidewalk limits um and we'll be sending that in for the PSD submission which is the last step for your authorized to go out to bid um Al mentioned we're not going to do all of the sidewalks we're going to do the tripping hazards the sections where it's missing um you know places that are issues but the entire length of Buffalo Avenue from us rout3 to the to the uh sprag school was identified as a high priority travel route on the last travel plan so we anticipate that it will be the same this time so that will be one of the primary corridors that we can apply for sidewalk replacement money and crosswalk enhancements and all that so rather than dedicate you know money we didn't get to cover whole project in for 500 blocks to that those improvements um you know we're going to do what we have to now and then we'll Circle back with an application once we have the school travel um for the lake and Campground Ada improvements again the city has $400,000 do improvements there uh the application was submitted to the pilin commission we're really just waiting to see how they view the approach that we took um excuse me one second can everybody hear him yeah in the back okay okay say no good one um so the the oblation Alliance commission we're just waiting for their interpretation um we also made application to L electric for uh the new service for the 50 amp services for campsites um there's like 402 or 43 sites that all have 30 amp Services now um we're looking to do about a dozen maybe 10 50 amp Services um to to some of those sites and that will actually make the other the other 30 amp Services work better um and then you know we'll have a higher aage service we can provide right not to cut you up but do you know an idea when that might be happening because that was another question I met the RO I don't um he had asked about some of it's going to depend on the feedback from Atlantic Electric U okay there's a current Transformer we need another one um I know they you're allowed to add another transform the pole you can do it to three technically but a lot of times when you approach the demand that we're going to be at they want you to go to ground pad Mount Transformer on ground um so the cost shair the design all that sort of revolves around the feedback we're going to get so Ryan you have the electric guy right back there what good put upgrade poet well that's upgrade they got a 37 put a 50 put 100 put a 167 they can put plenty for 50 amp service so there well it's 10 50 amp Services there's a 400 KVA transformer now I believe it is so our request will be to add another one on the other side of the port and that would be the cheapest option we thought it would have a 400 KV po so it's it the biggest they put is a 167 so I'm not an electrical engineer I was just trying to to relay but uh it's whatever the Transformer is it was sufficient for 400 amp service spoke um so that's that's the current pull mount Transformer our idea is to add another identical one on the other side of the pole our understanding is that that would be allowed um so we're trying to avoid the ground Mount Transformer but you know how so um yes I'll they go I have no doubt yeah and then we'd have to run underground from there so um yeah no that's kind of what I was saying it's really going to that really dictates how long the project is going to take in the direction that we go um but yeah I I'll be reaching out don't worry um the next is the the next uh Ada Improvement grant that we got it's for City Hall uh we're working on the design now uh we'll be replacing the desk that you're all leading on right now uh and the trim piece along the top there add an ADA ramp on the side so for access to the D upgrading the bathrooms upating all the service counters um because none of them are the Ada height or width um so we're working on the design of that now uh we're hoping to be able to vid that in the spring um it'll be a couple months to go through design and and all that Ryan you were just talking about this room here yes is there any chance that we could turn this counter sideways because it's everything's crammed right in here is there any way or is that would that be way too I'm not sure understand you mean like move the whole day somewhere di that way is there any way it would give us it would give us more anything but I so I mean the the grant purpose was to upgrade what you have just to make it ada8 compliant so we have to modify the desktop that you have to provide access because there's not a clear space between approximately where May's elbow is and the wall so once we have to modify it we can replace that whole thing and justify that under the Grant I don't know that we can relocate the whole thing yeah I don't know and see what they would you know what they would fund but what I don't want to do is proceed with something that is later determined is not eligible and then you guys are on the hook for whatever the cost is we certainly won't let that happen you're going to try to extend it a little bit on each side just make a divot right didn't we talk about Yeah you sort of have to clip the corner like about a foot or so of the corner where it sticks out the desk your read on that needs to to go but it could be a little longer on both sides right yeah yeah we can extend it in one way and ter so you're going to lose it here and yeah exactly you need so much clear space between the wall and the the rail there yeah the railings are not 8 comping there's lots of issues um but yeah so that's that's what that project addresses um next Atlantic Aven improvements phas three and four um we're still trying to get through permitting unfortunately the project is taken us right through Wetlands Wetlands buffers which always complicates our permitting efforts so actually uh numbers 23 and 24 on the agenda are to request extensions for grants um so that we can continue to work through the process and and try to get them out to bid uh New Orleans avue 7 division we finally got a phone call from the pine commission that advised that we will get our final approval for that project in March um so once that happens we'll be able to file the subdivision set the property Corners um and then the city can receed as you wish I believe you'd have to auction them if you wanted to sell them um the ibank storm water project our survey crews are out there um one or two Crews every day uh we started on sort of the Northwest side of the city we're working our way down um again just to refresh everybody you guys are getting what is effectively a $3 million Grant we expect to be able to do two and a half to $2.6 million is RO construction um and then the grant actually covers design and inspection costs as well so it's a zeroc cross project to get a whole lot of Sol fil this um last couple things are on page two uh kyre improvements uh we prepared the base plan I think shared that Mee or so ago uh so now we have to put an request to the finance commission for a pre- application meeting to review the issues that they're going to have uh tennis court pickleball court we didn't do the design or anything like that but I've been sort of assisting along uh the contractor is talking about Paving I think next week 40s um doing the grading and the base Paving and then they'll come back probably in March or so to do qu Paving um and then strip pain all that stuff uh Brown Redevelopment areas the only update at this point is that we're still waiting for a formal notice from DP um we can't really do anything until we have that um but once that happens there'll be L investigated W will be put proposal in front of the city and they would be funded through that Pro uh and then two more things that are not on here um one is an agenda item to release of the performance bond for the WWA project um performance bond just covers the installation of improvements it's there in case the developer goes under and never makes those impr ments uh so the city has sufficient funds to cover and build the sidewalks and do the landscape perimeter Landscaping things like that um all that work is done there's some dead trees or some other issues that need to be addressed but those are all what would be considered maintenance Bond issues so our recommendation is to release the performance bond uh contingent upon receipt of a maintenance bond for 9,814 which is 15% of the original performance bond which is what is allowable by state law um and then the last thing is something that came in today uh Meg received information from the county that said that they would they had received up to a million Grant to install EV Chargers and that there were certain criteria that needed to be met um and that one of the the locations that they selected was the city's Transit Hub so that was a location that we were looking to fund or or find funding for Chargers anyway um if they do it uh they'll use their their funding you'll have an inter local agreement for to maintain them um so and then you could take some of your funding and shift it to one of the other desirable locations um so I I think it's a win-win we don't have a ton of information at the moment um you know some details to sorted out but I do think it would helpful be helpful for Council to express um an interest in in accepting that funding and participating accounting um if you so choose um I have a question um the EV charging grant that we got 128,000 was for public EV charg ing stations uh we're also considering and and the chief attended the webinar yesterday regarding purchasing EVS for the police department so we're going to need some kind a level two charging station here at City Hall right could they work that into their Grant so yeah their their Grant had very specific requirements um one of them was to be near public transportation so the transit Hub lot uh fit their criteria like you know perfect ESS they mentioned AB right they potential locations um sort of along the railroad tracks okay so um but again then you have the opportunity to reallocate to utilize that funding public EV chargers at the municipal building would certainly be eligible for the funding that the city has so while they may not be in the back lot in police lot they could be on the public facing side of well do we want to give up space is here for EV charging that because you know orig that's what came to quote I showed him has the fun there like by the door so that way code enforcement would be because that was our original intent was really to get code enforcement yeah so that's where he looked at to it's not really really taking up the bot per say yeah I mean some someone could still park there and are they going to do the installations and all that or are they just providing fund no they were going to do everything they were going to orchestrate um the entire design construction everything and then in a local agreement where they would maintain it just on the city's property and will it be on the train station side or on the they went in that yeah exactly where we were planning on it right they sent three potential options two of them were in the municipal parking lot another was on the Atlantic Avenue stalls I that won't work cuz that's us trans property um so it would be in the parking lot you know in that first row uh as close to the transation as you get in the and do you know the source of their funding uh I email was it was up to a million see oh was a long email um it's through FH FH FW ha I think they put that backward supposed speak fhwa Federal Highway Administration um yeah so they apparently the the state received a $10 million Federal Highway Grant Atlanta County was an early supporter they were one of the first five counties to support it so um essentially they were one of the first ones in line to receive the Grant on the city C right Co so I can forward sub like I said this came in like a couple hours ago so I would think for the police department we get EVS back there you wouldn't need a charging station you could just have a lug in yeah you need power you need but I'm saying you don't need credit card station where people would have to buy it yeah it's a different thing I mean to be frank I have an EV and I installed a 60 amp charger house well you would have at your house yeah but even with those um you know it still checks to charge from empty to full is five hours at least yeah so um yeah there's there's different levels the level one would be just plugging into an outlet you take weeks to charge I'm not saying a regular out say yeah right so a 240 volt 50 or 60 amp service you can charge in like I said four or five hours the level three Chargers the DC fast Chargers those are the ones you can charge in 20 30 minutes but we attended that webinar yesterday and one of the presenters was um he's retired now but he worked for New York City Police Department and he said they've been using hybrids since 200 yeah two and they've saved millions and millions of dollars on gas and at and and the vehicles themselves last a lot longer than a a gas powered vehicle yeah City or I'm sorry the city of Atlantic City has had numerous EV police cruisers for years and they're using um the Ford mock whatever Brian you had talked about the maintenance and that they would take care of the maintenance is that for there' be anal agreement where they would build it it would be Theirs to maintain Theirs to everything it just be your proper so do you think we should do a resolution of support that yeah I was going to ask that I think it would be helpful to support yeah just is there a motion to do that I'll make that motion motion made second questions and that all in favor I oppos motion passes okay they'll come up with an inter interlocal for that yeah there's a lot of steps between be now and actually have an e charging session but um I think expressing interest in participating with the county is today when I critical First Step he said something about the contact with the city to attend ex said that they're going to start some meetings on webinars yeah okay number 14 on our agenda is a City attorney report um I had a question for Ryan I'm sorry Ryan um our last meeting last year 2024 we had two um properties that we tabled um because we needed more information on them um one was Philadelphia Avenue the guy who has the business he wanted to buy the Lots behind him and then there was another one Meg do you remember who they were there were two of them we toted to to sell property yeah they want there were two City properties and one was on Hamburg yes and it's part of the current Redevelopment agreement with h Jonathan saer who's doing the movie production studio so without communicating with him and getting him to agree okay so there's no there's I was worried that we tabled them and we never bought him back and we left these sure resident hanging so you said a retention Pond is on the property was the retention on the property that was the other one yeah so the only possibility there would be to subdivide and then turn over another portion you're not allowed to transfer a storm Water Management Facility to another entity all right so did anything come of those like were the residents told that we could not do this we weren't doing this or George F was notified about the property and the other resident on as okay I just wanted to make sure because I know we tabled it but I never it never came back for you know anything so that's why I just wanted to ask because it was in my notes okay thank you of course anything else no unless there any questions thank you sure okay uh City attorney no okay uh number 15 on our agenda is the resolution authorizing the 2025 neighborhood preservation program implementation plan going to say that clearly a roll motion oh I'm sorry motion uh motion second second motion been made in seconded all Ro Clark yes Dash yes doy yes Galloway yes Heist yes pessie yes P yes timers yes right yes a resolution for the budget appropriation Reserve transfers motion second motion made seconded questions uh broll call Clark yes Dash yes doy yes Galloway yes Heist yes pessie yes hner yes Timbers yes right yes number 17 is resolution approving vacation time payouts for the AC corpor City Police Department make a motion second motion been made and seconded questions see none call Clark yes stash yes doy yes Galloway yes Heist yes pessie yes Keener yes Timbers yes right yes okay a resolution to release performance bond of $ 65,535 and establish a maintenance bond for 9,814 195 for J&J Development Group group in the WWA project is there a motion make a motion second motion made in second questions this is what Ryan just talked about do yes gway yes Heist yes hessie yes Keener yes Timber yes great yes okay number 19 is renew the lease with the Firehouse Pub second you have a question I have a question yeah is the city named as additional insured for that I don't know they provide us with insurance yes so we are covered yeah okay how long been a long time make a motion motion made second second okay motion made second roll call Clark yes Dash yes doy yes Galloway yes Heist yes pessie yes pener yes Timbers yes right yes okay res number 20 resolution to refund the payment due to lean sold in error for chew unpaid property taxes December 18 2007 lock 22.07-cu 29 I sent the explanation that Laur sent does anyone need further I little bit yeah you're gon have to explain this one again because I I got one explanation sorry which thing oh okay so apparently back in 2007 a municipal lean was issued the property actually at some point from 2005 to 2006 got the tax map something got messed up so it really is city-owned property but it was listed as I think a knower there was really no owner so we really don't issue aan or Municipal property obviously so we're just now that it's been discovered we'll have the the tax M and the tax function software will be corrected we need to refund the lean holders that should not have been able to purchase the lean in the first place so it's two separate leaners there's two lean holders the one lean holder in 2007 bought it and he's been paying subsequence since then but for some reason stopped doing that so Laura said he was been older gentleman we don't know if something happened or not so we'll have to get in touch with them anyway to get you the refund um but someone knew purchased the lean at this year's tax sale and then I guess they I don't TR of remember I think the guy contacted us about something and that's when bar and the assessor and um I think someone fromb realized that it was actually City so this reverts back to the city then become city property again already it city property should it's like the time the Bungalow was put on the tax out right yeah okay is there a motion for motion second motion made second roll call Clark yes Dash yes doy yes Gallow yes Heist yes hessie yes Keener yes timers yes right yes motion passes number 21 refund for the same situation for Tobin in the amount of there is no motion so moved second Ro Clark yes Dash yes doy yes Galloway yes he yes hessie yes keer yes Timbers yes right yes okay accepting the state number 22 accepting the state of New Jersey Department of Community Affairs affordable housing obligations for 2025 to 2035 is there a motion I'll make a motion second okay questions on a motion no I just like to say that it was our present need is 61 units and our prospective need is nine units so that's the affordable housing we'd have to provide perod roll call please yes Clark yes Dash yes doy yes Galloway yes he yes hessie yes keer yes timers yes right yes motion passes um resolution number 23 requesting a Time extension for the fiscal 22 New Jersey do Safe Streets to Transit Grant make that motion motion made second second questions all in favor I oppos I have it motion passes number 25 I mean 24 resolution requesting a Time extension also New Jersey for 2023 NJ do Safe Streets to Transit motion s second motion remain second all in favor I opposed motion passes uh number 25 resolution sustainable a corver city Green Team advisory committee a motion second questions on the motion I just I wanted to say this just does uh appoint the members of the uh committee for the for the year okay all right all in favor I oppos motion passed uh number 26 resolution appointing the attorney for the Aver City municipal land use board uh Carol goloff for the year 2025 some moved second motion made in second questions roll call Clark yes Dash yes doy yes Galloway yes Heist yes pessy yes keer yes Kimbers yes right yes Okay resolution number 27 appointing the engineer for the a haror City municipal land use board for 2025 Remington and Vernick motion I make that motion second motion M second questions roll call Clark yes stash yes doy yes Galloway yes Heist yes tassy yes hener yes Timbers yes right yes number 28 a resolution appointing the planner for the a corber City municipal land use board for the year 2025 Remington and Vernick motion I make a motion second motion made in second questions roll call Clark yes Das yes doy yes Galloway yes Heist yes hessie yes Keener yes timers yes right yes he number 29 introduce ordinance number two 2025 amending the general code of the city of a harbor chapter 23 5 streets and sidewalks and adding article seven titled tree removal and replacement I have some questions okay I'll make that motion yeah let's do that first motion second I'll second okay motion main second questions uh section uh first of all I'd like to I'd like to thank councilwoman Galloway and the green team for their hard work and protecting the environment I want to make it clear that I support the protection of the street trees and the trees on public land I men those that worked hard to get the two grants totaling $1.8 million my several questions are here section 23543 and the fees it states there's a $25 permit fee to code enforcement to apply to remove a tree if code officials determine an Isa certified or is needed there's $125 fee charg is that fee on top of the 25 making 150 yes okay so what factors will be used by code official to determine if the arbor is needed well um they'll look at the tree it's it's dead they'll say it's dead you could take it down and there would be no further action but if if it's questionable we'll pull in the arborist we need to pay the arborist his fee so that they will have to pay you know pass through the city to pay so will code enforcement have additional training yes and will they be compensated for this additional work compensated for it yeah be part of their regular duties so this is going to be additional additional responsibilities of Code Enforcement okay um why does the taxpayer have to pay the arborous when the city of aor city has receed a $1.8 million tree Grant because there's limited funds in there for his salary so okay uh let move on so Street trees will be require replacement of trees with a dph of 2.5 or pay $500 per Tree non- Street trees which own private property will require a dph $1.5 or $400 why are we charging people to remove trees on their own property they bear the expense and removal which can be very expensive this will add approximately $525 or more to the homeowner's expense uh why are we charging residents to replace Street trees considering the city has removed many Street trees wait a minute I'm still talking why are we charging residents to replace Street trees considering the city has removed many Street trees with without replacing them those that were replaced were done so at no cost of the homeowner uh when the sugar maple in my house was damaged by road work I paid over $2,000 for remove the tree and restored the area given the fact that the city has acquired $1.8 million from taxpayers to support the important work of the egg har City Urban Forest tress fund I believe we should wave permit fees and Wave replacement costs for Street trees and minor own business when it comes to privately owned trees on private property the financial bird and some of the home MERS could be overwhelming I I would that what your question I had many long was a long one well the the part about mind our own business I don't disagree with you on that however there is a d requirement for us to pass this uh ordinance and you know the city would would have to decide how we enforce it does the D set the set the fees uh that's a good question no well the fees were set because when we did our two prior tree projects okay the average cost of the trees was $400 okay so that's the fee that we put in there now you have to understand that if somebody wants to take down a tree on their property if it's over 12 Ines they will replace that tree with a tree of 1.5 in caliber which they could pick up at Home Depot for for like 80 bucks and plant it themselves and then they're done if they don't want to plant on their property they could find another location to plant that tree say on a neighbor's property or a relative or perhaps in a park if we have spaces where they can plant and they can they can plant that little tree there or if they don't want to do either of those things then they would pay $400 to the city's trust fund which we're setting up to so how are we spending 1.8 million I understand that we're paying the speaking okay the $400 would go into a trust fund dedicated simple strictly for Street trees or tree the tree program and at this point we have funding to do planting but when that Grant expires we need to keep the tree PR program going so these funds will re establish a fund that we can use so the taxpayers don't have to pay for the so so let me repeat my question then so I I understand we're paying the arbor um money to count the trees and the set to software and so forth um what is the the balance of the 1.8 million that's a lot of money that's a lot of trees if you're assuming that's a tree they $400 a piece to put in well they C they're going to cost us a lot more than $400 to put in and why is that because they're expensive they're more expensive than somebody going to Home Depot put in a tree depends on the species of the tree the size of the tree we're required to by by our ordinances to put Street trees in that have a higher caliber or wider caliber so it's it's a bigger tree so it costs more money than what a homeowner could put in well the trees that the trees that were replaced on the street trees that were replaced last time weren't they four or500 hours A tree yeah that was happen five six years ago I don't think it was five or six years ago well our first tree Grant was in I think 2016 I think it was a couple years ago when we were had one in 2016 and then we had one around 2018 or 2019 well I was on Council happened so9 it's not just the cost of the tree though it's the labor labor staking so so again if we're gonna if we're gonna if we're gonna tax our residents by additional fees required for permits this is it it is because if if a if a resident has to pay $125 plus $25 for a permit that is a tax so my question is can't we wave those fees for the taxpayers well I I think well it's not a tax I got a question it's not a tax it's a fee it's actually the same thing in this you have we have to have our code enforcement people go out and look at the tree how do we how do we come you're not you're not paying them additional to do it so it's not costing the city additional you're taking them away from doing another job that was that's why I asked are we are we that's why we have to charge a fee to help pay there there's hopefully going to be an extra person in Code Enforcement soon so hopefully that'll cover that issue however I think there's some I don't agree with any of it nette knows that but unfortunately we have to pass something through the D because ms4 you want to talk about that I still got a question the these trees that you PL are these the ones that the roots go straight down they don't go out correct yeah I'm not talking about roots of trees okay well that's the whole thing that we had pass we had passed that a while ago that any new trees that we be planting that the roots grow down because it's an ordinance in Ocean City when we build a house you have par I guess they're called par trees or whatever they're called The Roots have to go down so it's not damaging the sidewalk well there is a tree list a recommended tree list and the state is requiring this ordinance because they want to see more native trees plant planted so we have a list that was prepared we also have a secondary list of banned tree species that cannot be planted got and you know this is this is something that was that were being made to do it has really nothing to do with the grant it's they from the D and the pine lands commission it was approved this ordinance is being sent to every municipality in the state to they all some towns have their ordinances already in place which is acceptable but if they don't this is the recommended ordinance we made a lot of adjustments to make it very lenient for our our residents because every me every Committee Member said you know we don't want to burden that our residents or our our property owners because you know they're already tapped out so we cut these Replacements down to practically nothing I mean the most that they if they took down a humongous tree that's on their property they'd have to replace it with free trees the original ordinance had like five so we cut that back we cut the fees back we we cut the caliper of the tree back so that they could get an in inexpensive tree and we did a lot to make it you know more palatable for the resident I would I would add to that and ask the City attorney to comment on the exemptions that are in that ordinance also there are exemptions for certain trees and the condition corank yeah and U looking you know we're in a lot of different municipalities and this is a common conversation between um Council committee members but um this as as Council stated This Woman This ordinance is being dictated by DP as part of the overall C management system for the state of New Jersey um everybody has the same questions in regards to private property D lists um a limited number of exceptions uh all those exceptions are captured in this ordinance um and when you try to deviate from those exceptions ultimately this ordinance what's approved has to go to D and I've seen many instances with DP will reject the ordinance and stif back the council to be more online with the exceptions some of the exceptions the big one um if it's a dead or danger to structures on the order structures on the property um it comes down without any rep replacement um requirements including cost to uh to the homeowner um and then there there's other exceptions but um that's really the one that that applies the most to Res prop so yeah this this ordinance has got a lot of questions it's got a lot of push back um but D is as of right now is standing by it quite frankly most municipalities have passed this last year um we supposed to be May yeah and um I know that uh Council has been working on trying to get it to the port it was um the most acceptable to um to the residents and uh this is what this is what this year so but you're look your hands you tied a little bit or a lot of it because um it does have to be submitted to D and D will kind of Big Brother you on this if they don't like what you put for they're going to rejected that well the councilman Dash's question how flexible are we with the fee the number of the fee the 400 400 yeah you have flexibility there so would would the committee recommend or U maybe consider lowering that Fe a little bit how about even with the the 25 for code to come out and look at it like say okay we charge 25 for food to come out and look at it but once they go and they plant a tree and they spend $80 on a tree why can't we give them their $25 back they went and they got the tree they did what they were supposed to do so now why are we charging them in you know I mean they put the tree in give them their $25 back we have some families that can't afford groceries every week they're going to the food pantries in town to to feed their kids and we're charging them $25 to be told you have to take that tree down and then you have to replace it with a tree no less than $80 so why can't we say okay once you put that $80 tree and we're going to refund you that $25 and I know it's paperwork and I apologize girls I I get that part of it but like we're nickel and diming our residents to the point where you know how many of our kids are already on free lunch you know fre I'd also like to remind you that over 60% of the homes in AER City are non-owner occupied and our rental properties so so who pays that the rent the owners or the well because this was an big argument with the snow removal who goes out and shovels the sidewalks the the tenants or the homeowners that was you know well I think the property owners are responsible for their properties them they're some of them are very unkempt as it is now but there are but there are many homes in an harer City that are owned by the residents that live there yeah there are many there are many seniors that live in our community they live in their home that own the property that's me uh that that pay high taxes pay increasing increasing uh fees for everything right so that's why I'm I'm always going to fight for uh reducing any extra charges that we're going to burden any of our residents with well do you you remember what is it last year perhaps the year before we changed our ordinances to add administrative fees for the code enforcement department to go out and do inspections how much was that thing yeah like $125 this is $25 it's $25 plus it's 125 if the arus has to go out yeah they could hire Their Own no and that's not what the that's not what the ordinance says yeah you read read the read the well I will read it again were those there's a lot in there were those administrative fees and I'm just asking for for knowledge and um clarification to go out to rental properties for the homeowners for like cosos is that what that administrative fee was I don't remember exactly which that actually was for overuse of of Municipal Services 250 that is that I don't think that's I don't think that's what referring to that I believe it is it was for the actual inspections of the properties well the question here is about the trees and yeah um are we going to stick with that 400 or can that be modified that's the way you know it was introduced so I mean we haven't voted to introduce it yet but no I mean we worked on this for over a year we did that and motion at the committee meeting everybody was in agreement to introduce the ordinance well not all of us are on that committee so well your prerogative speak now this this is my this is why I have the questions I think one of your other questions Steve was about the street trees and the residents are not re as far as I know are not responsible to cut those down that would be the city but the city is responsible to replant a tree which will cost us a lot more money than what a resident could pay I think that's what the point um so once this ordinance is adoped the city will be responsible for Street trees right right now the city is not responsible for the street trees because the city in the 19 mid 1990s abolished its shade tree committee so ever since then it's been on the residents to take care of those Street trees which are over a 100 years old I had to take down two trees cost me a couple thousand dollars me too so this will solve that problem and for residents they won't have to take down the trees they could call us and tell us our tree is dropping branches could you send somebody out we'll go out and look at it if the arborist degrees that that tree should come down the city will take that tree down and relief the homeowner or the property owner of the responsibility for that tree okay so just to clarify all the street tree costs will not be born by any of the homeowners no no right now it'll be taken care of by the that's why you have the form by the Home money but the cost to actually have have the treat come down okay so that goes back to my initial why are we charging res to have a a street tree inspected that the city's going to be responsible for taking down and then replacing I don't believe we are we're not if someone tree we and we go inspect it that's on us because we're we're responsible for it they're not paying for the street that's what I just heard what is what is it is it the street trees on someone's property not really their property city property city property so and that that case if a tree has to come down and be inspected by an orborous then that's that's a city expense yes City so the only one one on their personal property the trees that we're talking about here are we have to send our Arbus to their property right we have to pay him to go there and and which most of the issues that we're going to have are Street trees yes yeah well you know but once this ordanance is adopted if the tree is has Cal of 12 in or greater they're going to have to get a permit we have to keep track of trees we have to make sure that those trees are replaced that's that's what the $25 is for yeah and I I think that and I kind of agree that that 400 fee kind of looks like a big chunk that's deter it to take him down trees I I understand don't take them down so it's a syntax basically pretty much yeah yeah that's not right also it's it states any person requesting the removal of a street tree as defined as a as a tree removal or any non-re Street tree shall submit a tree removal application to the tree board through city code enforcement so are the fees waved or not waved if it's a p trade who treat it appears to me that they're not waved I think not a street City expense yeah I think read that again Steve any person requesting the removal of a street tree as defined as a tree removal with a dph of 2.5 in or more or any non Street tray with a dph of 12 Ines or more on the property shall submit a tree removal application to the tree board through the city code enforcement department no tree shall be removed until the code enforcement department or the city's Isa certified Arbor has reviewed to improve the removal which means if I'm reading this correctly if you have a tree in front of your house it's a street tree and you feel it needs to be taken down I had one in front of my house it was it was dying it was breaking off pieces on my neighbor's car um you have to pay the $25 to city code enforcement and then if city code enforcement decides that the certified Arbor is required then it's another $125 and to be honest with you if I was code enforcement myself I would refer everything to the city Arbor because why would I take that responsibility who's on the tree board we have to app so I would say that be clarified on there that it's not that's a mistake can we there is no to clarify that there is no Fe associated with so should this be Ted until it's written correctly I think I think you introduce that's when you talking application process regulated activities SE section A item one yes should should read any person requesting removal of a no it's got a St that's what I just wrote I mean I just read that well don't there's no rush to do this tonight is there when does so we could we could table is that you can introduce it hearing if you when's it it was supposed to be done last year so we're already we're not in a rush to adopt it but so why don't we just to make sure we're all clear let's that a motion to table I make a motion to there a second second motion's been made and seconded to table all roll call CL yes Dash yes do G no he yes hessie yes H yes timers no right yes okay so one thing if I could just say about this that I know it's tabled but I didn't get a chance to really comment either but maybe a few things one of my concerns which I think you somebody addressed in email it might have been you or or Jerry if a homeowner is taking out trees to put on an addition or possibly put in a pool that in fact is an exemption also that's what my interpretation was no no because that would that would defeat the purpose no that's not no I think it is I do think it is it's not in the ordinance as written no I'm saying it should be in the ordinance because that really defeats the whole purpose of improving your home and increasing valuation for the city the fact that we really shouldn't even discuss it anymore well I didn't have my chance to say what I to say we got to get those questions answered and then make adjustments to the ordinance and then un you know bring it back to ordinance committee meeting and I had asked Ryan to talk about something but that didn't happen I mean there's a reason why the tree ordinance the state's making us do it if we don't do it there's consequences well there was there was more than one question here though so just get then I was interrupted well so it has to do with with ms4 yeah Municipal separate storm sewer system yeah which is federal requirement that D figures out a way to administer meet the federal Goins um so you are required to adopt some frein that meets some minimum requirements as Chris indicated um with limited exemptions um the form of that is pretty open but um I if just a it is pretty sad well we understand that we have to do this we just want to make sure all the questions are answered seemed like we didn't have all the answers you have other on from other towns that you that you work in they could share uh yeah yeah I'm sure we share I'm sure CH as well they could share yeah I mean most of the towns are stuck to the model but the like you said were flexible you could make the fees whatever you want at that point cor yes then we had a question about Street trees versus property trees so that's another thing and and the exemptions the exemptions are laid out in in the model ordinance I'm pretty sure one of them might have been I'm not making it up was that if you're going to put an addition on your house you shouldn't have to pay to cut the trees down because it defeats the purpose of doing for the city like double taxation yeah yeah happy to talk to you about it you get what I'm saying I did like I put in a $25,000 pool that's now taxable why would I have to pay to cut down tree the city's making more money on me putting in the addition or the pool then they are on the fee for the tree that makes no sense it's your property why are you paying somebody to take something down on your property that's my house you're not going to tell me I got to pay you you got to wait till number 32 public all right number 30 on the agenda is a bill list motion motion been made second questions on the bills Clark yes Dash yes doy yes gallway yes Heist yes hessie yeser yes Timbers yes right yes he we'll start with the mayor comment well I just want to comment I know we have to pass some sort of a tree ordinance I'm against the state in infringing on our private property I think it's a travesty that this is happening in the state of New Jersey I love trees just as much as the next guy does regardless of what some people might say and maybe literature that's been put out about me years past but I do love trees and I just don't think that anybody should tell you what you have to do on your own property amen and we don't have a choice about it we have to do it now and that's the sad part I'll be in collections okay um anything else please no go this side nothing at this time thank you okay at Heist council at Heist I just have a quick question um Jerry any word on our salt spreader I forgot to ask um earlier that's okay uh we do have one salt spreader that's what we used in the last storm it was the F800 which worked really well uh we're still waiting on the other one the newer truck and that salt spreader there a hydraulic issue that's significant so it's not repaired yet right thank you okay anything else that was it thank you but I think in the future we should move that Podium over it should be pushed up because you can't see can't see the person either take that that Row first row out and push it up yeah it was it was up but now it's back so okay um councilman Dash I have nothing thank you okay thank you councilman doie nothing nothing 10 well [Music] Timbers um I don't want to talk about the uh I want to talk about the tree ordinance because uh we had a committee and I thought I had express my personal sentiment about it uh so I'll just leave it with go Birds than C Roman hessie uh well as far as my sentiments on that um I understand why they're trying to do it and why they're replacing ing them putting them elsewhere but I also feel the same way that if I want to put trees in somewhere um I will and taking out the trees I feel um we've had a large tree taken out I can't even tell you Gary how big was that tree how many trees would I have had to put in to put that tree don't incriminate me you were watching them anyway um the other thing that I wanted to say on another note is um the mayor and I sat in on a Red Cross um meeting and uh it was it was pretty informative and they actually have um smoke detectors for free and they'll actually put them in for you there's a number that 1 800 do you 1 800 Red Cross they they do it everywhere okay well just in case people don't know like know they went door to door for a while on my remember them knocking on our well the the wi is the the wi is there the fire department they gave to us okay there we would like to yeah well I talked to them last time and I said um we wanted to maybe do something we canvas 90% of B Harbor City awesome two business well it's still going on and it's 1800 Red Cross I don't know Butchie if you're getting any more okay and um oh they also had one other thing which I thought was pretty interesting it's called a bed shaker has anybody ever heard of that it's pretty cool bed and it's yeah you yeah it's for people that are deaf and you actually still have to have a smoke alarm and they they work together you put it under your pillow or under your mattress and it shakes the bed so just a little something I thought was that's all I got okay thank you councilwoman Galloway yes I just wanted to congratulate um um Gary and Butch for getting the key to the city um and thank you for living John Kennedy's um dream which was ask not what your country can do for you ask what you can do for your country and if we would all live by that and do something for our city it would be a great City so congratulations thank you uh councilman right I know how to uh I would just have to go along with Carl and fly eagle fly they're going down we see him in the super don't go anywhere because we have to take a picture what do we have it's your turn you remember I think everybody heard Street Tre but I I I I don't see that the burden should be put on the homeowner or Tre of my property storms that are coming as everybody knows the storms are getting more violent more trees come down if anybody has a tree close to the house they want to get rid of them because of the haard and I worry about it all the time I got tree over there Boston Avenue that's been there probably 200 years R the backyard and I worry all the time that come down on the house with my son my daughter-in-law my grandson there but I can't C that's not even an arbor to look at it let Al get an arbor have to pay them to come over at one point in time on Boston Avenue we didn't even have ch as a homeowner they come in they said the trees were damaging all the sidewalks and curves they removed every tree on the whole state of us residents even had a say of that y now we're going back the other way and were're saying you have to replace the tree if you want to replace the street trees I say that's fine but I can't see where if I would have cut four or five trees that I feel are hazardous around my house that are going to fall or on my garage then I should have to replant those trees you we only got City Lots some lots are 40 foot 60 foot where we going where am I going to put the trees in are you know what I mean I have to put them on somebody else's PR property I think it's crazy one of the exemptions in the ordinance I know we're not supposed to talk about it but one of the exemptions in the ordinance is if if there's a tree on your property that is damaging your property it it can come down with no fee with it's an exemption to the ordinance I think Chris Chris Chris is say your name oh I'm sorry before you do that M our City attorney has something no I was just going to say the same thing the model the D provides an exemption for trees that that are either damaged or dangerous to the structure dangerous to the property structure to come down with no replacement or no that's that's one of the ex I agree I'm not I'm not arguing law just tell why should I have to come toity pay $150 tell somebody cont remove the tree why should I the DP know if I cut 10 trees down or fre trees down I should have to report to them it's a city tree that's fine but Tree on my private property I don't see where I have to pay all those fees let alone replace the tree on something that I feel is hazardous to have somebody have to come over and say oh yeah it's Hazard you can take it care I got enough common sense to know whether it's a I'm not I'm not arguing private property my private property I can be able to remove whatever tree I want to do without going through all that amen I agree if you took a call a har City I guarantee you res of a har City would all say the same thing does anybody in this room that would cost to take one at least alone the burden of the extra assessment that you're going to charge the top of that most people don't even have that money to 2000 take the one Str down it's it's crazy call you assemblyman and senat just to be clear to State issue we don't want to do it we have to do it that yes Brian you explain why we need an ms4 permit ms4 fines are real Atlantic City got $100,000 for various violations not this um but DP has the ability to leveles for this and they will do so how much that was not related to that there's other other issues but they can find you for yes they have capacity and um I believe they negotiated that I think negotiated down to that yeah J Petty quick question that and then you said do arbit report there was like a thousand some places that trees could be planted as homeowners this million dollars we're not going to be forced to put trees um in the city right away through this Grant on those Open Spaces right they're not going to be filled by the city they will be filled by the city we're going to attempt to fill that in front of my house let's just say the haror said there's three spots in front of my house you're just going to come there and plant trees that's right yeah I'm I'm against that yeah 100% I'll be cutting it down not your property I'll cut it down somebody cut it down weits exactly then the first to see if it's D or not New Orleans Aven you have three lots down there that are going to be subdivided in four there's probably a thousand trees in there what are you going you can't cut them down now I mean how what do that like for development too okay that will have to be covered in a separate ordinance in the developmental ordinance which is a sec SE separate ordinance that we're going to have to address because there's if you take down more than four trees on a property within two two years I mean like that's going to drive off the cost of a lot too like the person that buys a lot going have to pay extra money so I just think that's going to impede development like I asked that question and they said developers are paying those fees to the to communities all around the state and the reality is every every municipality is being forced to adopt these ordinances so developers feeling most places develop so once once this tree goes through then I'm gonna have well the trees will be planted with money that's in the grant what if the get it's going to be up to the city to design streets and when we do road projects we're we have money set aside per all my you don't have curves yeah yeah your irrigation too I'll with you on that and my curvs have totally been destroyed by trees by trees and ,000 I think if you're if you want to put trees in front of my house I think that you should replace my curve first and make it appropriate if plant the trees and then I'll take I don't want more trees there and have to place you got put two trees in front of but they have to be they have to be pair trees and my house then I'll take the trees well I don't want sidewalks just in future programs in future programs Road programs and things like that those those kind of things will be addressed is overstepping the ground as a private homeowner I park my cars there I don't have saple my cars okay I don't want Rees all over my cars when they fall day some trees are very dirty my gutters are fold from trees that are half a block away and these little whirly birds come off you know what I mean it's just trees some trees are damaging some people don't like them they're homeowner passes are 8, 8500 I think a year and it's just not right that you're making homeowners to do this Stu it's not right but it's not us like yeah it's the state it's not well then you gota you gotta modify for push push that push that state mandate to the Limit y yes to the very minimum that you have to do to satisfy the DP and do not go above and beyond that it's not fair the tax P well as of right now this was supposed to be past the middle of last year we just haven't done it so are we subject to a fine for that no not at the moment but April right Jerry they're coming coming after us in April so when does Ryan submit the M report typically in June June 1 right got c yeah well Jody prepar I he gets an annual email with some questions yeah that's it a lot um there is a very uh informative presentation that put together yeah I I mean I think I'll share with all Council and and maybe we'll provide a hard copy review it I changed my email um but I mean it does explicitly say at minimum municipalities must adopt an ordinance that addresses both removal and replacement and it must apply to all lands of the municipality so public private otherwise yeah but it doesn't say you got to charge it does not there there's leverage there's things that you can do to adjust it um but you know municipalities can use existing ordinances if they meet minimum requir ams4 yours I do not believe does so you know to your point you can go through and figure out what the minimums are and how to meet them um but there is at least a requirement to address trees on both public and private property I mean just like you guys you have beautiful property there that they might put five trees in front of your house there iation I can't believe I can't believe if it's guys right away that's one thing property restur I'm cutting the stre on my property I'm cutting it down or anybody else is coming down I've been here 67 years and we've never had this issue trees no in City wanted the tree down in the RightWay always on the homeowner even though the trees are in the right way of the city because the city doesn't have the resource they don't have a bucket truck they don't have certified climbers gear chainsaws chaps believe you me there's a lot involved with trees down so I just don't feel you should put that burden on private property on the CZ it's hard enough to pay the bill let pay the additional well you know the um residents have had the responsibility for taking care of the street trees for since the 1990s it's like 25 years our trees are in such poor condition because of that because they haven't been maintained for 25 years and instead of maintaining them and trimming them and keeping them healthy so that they provide shade and habitat for wildlife and all the good things including helping our storm order system it just hasn't happened people just take them down that creates another problem called heat Islands we have streets that the whole street was stripped be of trees so that they could pave the road and there's not a there's on Cincinnati Avenue the 500 block there's two trees I told you two trees and that woman came to council and stood there and said not taking my trees down I just planted them they cost me $400 each to put in and the council president at the time let her keep those two trees well I guarantee you if you look at electric bills for that block they went up since all those trees came down and that's part of the environmental benefits of trees is that they help reduce heat if you put a a a reader on a tree on a street that doesn't have a tree and put one under under a tree you're going to see a 20° difference and our our ACU a workers go out there and they're picking up trash and it's 100 degrees for us it's 125 degrees for them so we need we need shade it's it's mandatory for us to exist I got solar M there's a lot of we're gonna have to start when we have our meeting next week every on Tuesday please come we're going to start from day the beginning which is the benefits of trees and we will learn all about the benefits of trees then we will go through the ms4 document that Ryan is discussing and has has on his computer now I have an extra copy if anybody wants it and we'll go through all this and explain it to the community why we need to adopt this ordinance uh you know the fees can be worked out I mean if you don't don't want to charge that's fine the city will have to pay the code enforcement people to do that part of the job take them away from other duties when we could help fund that department which is needs another employee at this point so I mean we can talk about all that but the the ordinance has to be adopted it will benefit the community in the long run and I hear a lot of people talk about oh well they lift sidewalks there's not a tree on Earth that won't lift your sidewalks and concrete was not meant to be permanent they that has a lifespan too so you'll see a lot of sidewalks that are cracked and broken and they blame it on the tree when actually it's just the weather the freezing the heat in the summer expanding and Contra you're a builder you know that that's what happens with trees in Fr of these houses that getos that the roots grow down so they don't grow out and lift up the concrete peer trees are an invasive species and our banned oh well I don't know call I know that's one of the that they next week Mr Foster please I change topics be quick Chris fost from the EDC it's come across our um emails and whatnot recently about trash cans that the EDC has that are in the Public Works building yeah I just answered that question did I think you did and I appreciate that I just want to make sure because they're important trash cans to us for our events also I know in the email came up of how we handle the trash and whatnot during the events so I just to be quick the mayor's helped us out to many years Mr do has helped us out those trash cans are lined on the street lined behind food trucks so that when we do an event the goal is at the end of the night all the trashes picked up volunteers guys in the back help us there's a lot of vol that are there at the very end so they're critical to us we just want to make sure that I know it's a dirty thing but just make that so you use those buckets and you put them on the street correct during the event and then what happens to them um we have a can that's in between The Old Firehouse there and the empty lot right from correct so the end of the night two of them one Rec not to have City trash cans full trash have to pay and have the burden go on the taxpayer and pay city workers to do that so at the end of the night we pick we empty all them we take all our can these cans um everything gets moved over that so how do you get how do you get the trash out of the the coder my kids would take the trash bags I'm I do it okay go ahead and kind to save you how do you get the trash out of the totter and into the dumpster it's all our volunteers you lift those things no we take the trash bag out of the trash can put it in the golf cart and go down okay so now now you don't his the polic those dirty nasty can and dump them in the dumpster but I think would it be easier to just use the wire frames and just up there's so much trash generated from that in the trucks so we're just trying to be as efficient as possible and big cans make the big difference I only I only asked that question because I saw them over there and I didn't know what you were doing with them and I thought maybe two because two of our properties that were in the MPP I think I sent that to you Karen um two of our properties I believe the firehouse I don't know if you have a recycling can there and you do have a recycling can there okay and the um Senior Center I'm not sure whether they have them and that's what I was just wondering putting it out there well we did have the waiting list too which me has I don't know I don't know if all the people got or not so we also had sent that letter out to everybody I think that goes back to 23 or whatever2 when that went out so we were just questioning if there's any that could be distributed people that who needed them in the zone and I know we but it sounds like a lot but we use we could use more actually so we start shortening them it's going to hurt us coming that's why we ask we don't just we don't just take we just have to answer to these people that want the totes that's all did every uh residential property in the NPP Zone get a toter and a recycle 80 so as NPP coordinator when I took over from Candace Negron I spent the first six months delivering trash cans every other week to everyone who Facebook me or call the city cler after 6 months there were no more requests the remaining were given to the EDC perfect and you need what's there and you don't want to correct give any of them up mayor I guess what you were saying you didn't know they were given to the well I know we had a waiting list and people were asking about it that's all well we're also talking about that in committee for trash just need a number that separate from from but it it was an NP conversation way back when all this happened and yeah I suggested it on the very first meeting that the MPP had back when what's his name was here Frank sorio Phil Phil for that zone and they did purchase them and I I assumed that they gave them out and then I saw this yeah 30 there not being used because we only got enough we only got enough for the people on that block everybody the second year Candace had gotten enough to the three and 400 block and that's why I had the 200 so the people on you're saying 400 didn't get them so how many are there now in the highway that's what I'm curious about so so we got to make sure those 30 stay there what you're asking other thing is we can move them no they don't have to be moved that's not Jer you know where they're at you yeah and they're they're there there's 30 of them there I haven't counted them but they're there okay they had snow on them who gave them to you again I don't know if you answered me so Candace had ordered them before I took over as MPP coordinator after the six months of me handing them out and no more requests were coming in the remaining 30 were given to the EVC to use on the events on the Avenue who that's my question but that would be you that would be you yeah okay all right that was discuss NP meeting yeah because there was there was no no one else wanted that and we were like what do we do as MPP property they had to stay in the district and the best use to stay in the district used for the event now now my question which I think you I had mentioned over at with my email the the ones that the city uses because we've always like we have I think he said there's four that are separate because I I didn't understand if they were mixed up with those or not because we do at the Pavilion occasionally we have need stuff for the cleanup we usually use like probably four or eight said there are four that are separate and then some for peace pgrm Park when we have the celebration whatever's in L you know you know what I'm saying like where are they mixed in with those because if they are we're going to have to buy new ones um that that's really the big question that well we can check to see how many are there and then make sure that they're not going anywhere and and there if there's extra maybe that those four she's talking about if they're there and if they're used for that I'll count them tomorrow morning or maybe there's some somewhere else that we don't know about can they be used for different um as long as they're not working you're not having the same day on the same day an event can they be used correct as long as they stay in you count them up and you make sure that they come back but they don't just you know W away property like the lift like the stage like all the stuff the MPP has purchased I have to show DCA that we have those things in inventory and that those things are used in the n PP District so you couldn't give them to City residents on Cincinnati Avenue or on Atlantic Avenue for but a borrow would be okay let me let me ask you a question after this this is the final year of the NPP Grant what happens to the equipment after that so after the mppp grant is finished yes say these trash cans are donated to the EDC to be used for future events on the Avenue the list ising as city property to be used on Philadelphia Avenue what about the lift I just be it can only be used on Philadelphia Avenue technically yes it can only in the district after the so that belongs to the EDC as well given to the city in thect now after the grant is over there's no one right Ting and watching where you're using it however at any point in time they can say those funds bought that lift it needs to be in city property can can our um Can Chris can you weigh in on this I mean take a look at it I'm not familiar enough with the issue Just sh the back yeah we asked about that when we bought the LI well it doesn't seem to be that difficult to figure out there's 30 there that you say are designated for and the city has given them to you um and you can use them and and and as Kim is saying maybe there's other events that they might want to use a couple of them to do we can't because unless it's on Philadelphia Avenue I'm saying keep it as city property I'm talking about now time when DCA said have the trash cans that be used for events Yep they're right here they're not going to come to peace Pilgrim day and say oh this is that can but they're gonna say where are my can that's all why can't we can they have a sign out at at public works like who takes them out all of that stuff just like sign it in and out whoever takes it so you know they stay in work that's why they be used at any I'm sorry I was just saying if they were used for a different event you know if they were used for a different event sign them out so that you know who had them in case they see walk away or something you know so in in the past the director of was an M St so he knew where the cans were at all times so it really wasn't an issue my question is where's our cans that's my question that's all we need to know where's our can he said there's four one Public Works property that are just so Jerry you'll take care of that but what kind of cans because we had recycle and trash I think it's we should have had like we should have had like even ones so I don't I don't know we'll just have to order more that's fine but I just want to know where our cans on because I'm sure know where they are coming up yeah Jerry's got a check just have to get that straightened out if we have to buy more cans we have to buy more cans it's not a problem just need to know I can also ask the other thing we can do is getc stickers you know yeah all right anybody else from the audience wish to be heard motion to adjourn all in favor picture