##VIDEO ID:0zvLVInLLEc## January 21st 2025 is called to order at 7:00 p.m. Madam clerk we're going to do the Pledge of Allegiance followed by S of meditation followed by Pledge of [Music] Allegiance I pledge allegiance to the flag United States of America to the stands na indivisible Justice thank you very much can I please have a roll call please roll call Sher Nickerson here Vice chair Martin present member bbom present member LF Ward member Winters present also present for the record is Janisha Kobe Village clerk chrisa Village manager and in um place of uh attor G attorney elberg you have a quorum thank you very much appreciate that do I have a motion to approve the agenda moved by council person L War do I have a second second second by vice mayor Martin all in favor say I I I oppos say nay hearing none do I have approve of the minutes motion to approve so moved move by vice mayor Martin do I have a second a second second by council person bbon all in favor say I I oppos say nay hearing none first thing we're going to do before we get to the actual agenda items um we're going to have a special small presentation from my friends from Miami water keeper um manager Lou and I have been working on this along with the council so uh we're going through we're talking about you know coming getting funding and things like that to um make eleral Village Hall a more sustainable more resilient uh more environmental Hub all right come on to the front you two these are some of the ideas okay no problem how are you how are you doing how are you doing Madame Co you know of miy water keeper miy water keeper we all know them a great organization and always doing wonderful work for the environment the floor is yours thank you so much mayor thank you very much uh for allowing me a couple minutes to speak tonight uh welcome to all the residents because that's really why I'm here um I work with Miami water keeper we're a local nonprofit We Do water quality monitoring we have youth education engagement programs we do a lot of policy work and we have some funding for a green infrastructure accelerator project and what that means is we have some resources that we think we can help you with um which is our some designs around the Village Hall to increase resiliency so to hold storm water to clean water to add more nature could be a green Blue Roof could be pervious Pavement in the parking lot we have some designs this is all free under our EPA Grant and what we really want is a lot of Resident input so we came we did a community engagement um event a few weeks ago we also have a survey online and we just really wanted your help to spread the word to tell residents that there's still time to offer additional input to tell us how you're using the land around Village Hall how you would like to use it so we can incorporate all that feedback into this design the goal is to use the design to then attract some grant funding to do implementation in the future so that's really all I had to say so yeah so we really want to hear your ideas um uh manager Lou and myself we had wonderful ideas when we had our first meeting even um permeable permeable uh uh the permeable parking lot things like that just to kind of like we got permeable driveway coming up soon permeable parking lot and things like that um to help out with you know drainage stuff like their driveway um and so we we we had so many ideas like that that helps out with the environment helps out with flooding helps out with drainage um but you know us up here you know we're just five minds and we have wonderful residents out there who also have wonderful ideas so we really want you guys to stop by that table on your way out tonight and you know sign up and uh so that you can go on the website and you can say hey I have an idea what about this what do we add this what do we add this and things like that so they're communicating we also have a gift card so anybody that fills up the survey and my mayor's going to put it on the website right it's not too late please give us all your feedback reach out with any questions and we're happy to give away some gift cards to encourage that all right they're right there if you look right behind you you see they even have um a couple posters up that kind of show like what they're going to be like talking about and doing so stop stop they have cookies I see cookies right there on the table they have cookies they have all type of stuff so they have gift cards cook is a party tonight in the planning and zoning committee meeting um so stop by there at that table on the way out you all all right we appreciate it thank you man thank you so much appreciate it all right moving forward making the village more sustainable more resilient more environmentally friendly moving on um to the agenda items you guys agenda item the first agenda item G1 456 Northeast 88 Street um Madam Clerk I believe that with our attorney we have to have everybody stand up and swear them men so anyone for anything tonight that's going to be talking on behalf of any of the items um either yay or nay or whatever uh stand up put your your right hand up and the attorney will swear you in because you will be speaking or for the record so oh yes if you think you're going to be talking about these things if you are you know you're going to be talking about these things you might be talking about these items all right please raise your right hand do you swear or affirm the testimony about to give is the truth and nothing but the truth so help you God all right thank you please be seated all right looks good okay can I please have um Miss Hammond from the cordino group come up um for the 456 Northeast 88 Street I believe you guys have a presentation and um Miss ham can you go to the other uh oh yeah the other one cuz you guys can go up and uh and hook your uh hook it up go yeah go ahead go ahead do your thing my brother [Music] yeah no problem thank you very much appreciate it worked a minute ago we'll get it up it's all good you yeah it's showing just the home screen mayor while um they're getting their presentation I can do yeah yeah let's say that real quick um I just wanted to let everybody know that um we have a new system for advertising for um posting um a a poster on your site this is um if you're approved tonight at the planning board there's another meeting that you're going to need to come to that's um The Village commission meeting or council meeting um that and that will be um you need to advertise for that with a poster in your front yard so what we're asking you to do is come back tomorrow or maybe the next day and um pick the pick up this form this poster will be filled out for you and it will have the your address on it the date of the meeting and um you post this in your front yard before um the council meeting yes so anybody who passed tonight this is the Comm committee level so if you pass it the committee level you also didn't have to pass the finally at the council level which would be a council meeting this is a committee meeting um if you do pass tonight you do have to go before the full Council um at the full council meeting and therefore between now if you pass tonight at the committee level then then um Miss ham is going to stay after late with me and if you pass she's going to fill out those uh boards for you and then for the council meeting and and we'll let you guys know when that is um you know later once you talk to the um the Consultants at the council meeting then you will prior to the council me you'll have to put that out in front of your yard you have to put that out like you have to put in front of your yard as an advertisement so that people we know that your property is coming up for the council meeting okay that's all we're trying to say all right so if you pass tonight hopefully you know everybody you know is doing good you guys are pass tonight if you pass tonight um just make sure that you know that you have to come back uh sometime this week to pick up your uh pick up your board there all right all right you guys appreciate it um for 456 Northeast ADH I'm gonna go to you guys in a second just um Miss Sam just introduce the item for us thank you yes yes this um our applicant tonight is um Marcus Leone and he's requesting a variance for a driveway that's located in the Swale but it's larger than permitted by the code and his property is 456 Northeast 88th Street um this this person has installed a 26 wide driveway approach in the sale and they're seeking an after theact variance which um after Thea means that they did not do this with the building permit and then um they were cited by code and they were found not to comply and they're coming back to see if they could have a relief from the code requirement of a 12T wide approach um their driveway right now is about 14 ft wider than what would be allowed by the code um the granting of this variance is found um reviewed by um staff um based on the the criteria that we review variances and we're we're recommending a denial based on the fact that we don't um find that this is in harmony with the general intent and purpose of our zoning code that concludes my presentation thank you all right thank you Miss hams I appreciate it uh Miss Le only I believe you guys have a couple slides you want to go through yeah uh well first of all I'd like to thank you Mr Mayor for all of your help and assistance with this you've been a great asset and the entire Council we've been before you before I want to say thank you for the time in the past that was uh looked favorably upon you can kind of see we actually finished this big project with the garage conversion which was voted for um as the group was just mentioning yes we're seeking a variance after the fact uh for our driveway and uh our presentation's more centered around the fact that people on our street residents of elportal we have a very unique situation especially on ad8 Street the reason we put this extra parking space in is I I don't know a better way to say it but there's basically no other way to increase the parking capacity on a house where there is no allowance in the code the code has no flexibility on paper so to the cordino group's Point yes you're correct uh we're not in general harmony with the code but the code in and of itself has flaws and my point here is not to seek something extraordinary but to allow for us to keep our property intact to keep our property safe free of mud and um you know luckily we just found out that the streets have been rearranged and I think that's going to provide some relief in the future future but in the meantime uh the residents of elportal need a parking solution and I'm a very firm believer that people in 2025 uh generally don't have one car and what the code allows for is basically one car or two cars stacked which if any of you go to work or have kids I'm sure that's not a convenient option so this was pulled directly from our current zoning code um d detailing what's approved and right now basically our house has no garage we were permitted to do a garage enclosure we're permitted to do one 12T approach so yes we did pour the extra space um but the thing that I find to be a bit counterintuitive and if not contradictory is the fact that the code contradicts itself in in terms of what we're allowed to do right so we're not allowed to park on the grass we're not allowed to park on any unpaved portion am I am I interpreting that correctly yes right so if you go around and look at our neighborhood there's inconsistencies there's kind of a free-for-all in terms of what is allowed for parking um if we go back to what we did we matched the aesthetic of our current our old driveway extended it out so now we have two spots but to go back to the code and the reason I think that I'm here and I there's a lot of people with construction projects coming up in this neighborhood these are going to be multi-million dollar homes I know the code will address this once it's done and I again appreciate the efforts of the council for doing that but in the meantime what we're looking at is I don't know multiple multi-million dollar homes that are going to be forced to have a 12-ft approach on a driveway I don't know about you guys but I'm in the real estate business and not a lot of people buying two or three million doll homes have one car so they have families they they have people that come to their house the things that necessitate multiple cars coming in and out so I think this is not just important for us but important for the future of the village to be very considerate of this and uh thoughtful so summary of the issues that the way we see it um lack of code flexibility is leading to damage I know we have a couple people that live on 88 street that are here um our swales are destroyed we have a unique situation on our street I know that Council Council I'm sorry councilman Winters you have unique situation in Sherwood Forest the streets are narrow I'm curious if anybody on the council do you know how wide our street is on 88th Street you at it right yeah okay you know so our Street's 14 ft wide um that's not wide enough for anything it's it's wide enough for one car which luckily and I don't know when is the implementation of that uh Street plan do we know yeah it's not for a while we're still in so not for a while we're going to be in a situation where on my street on 88th Street all the residents are now having to contend with UPS trucks Amazon trucks FedEx trucks delivery trucks uh cars that pass each other it's extremely unsafe for anybody who has kids it's extremely unsafe for me and uh our neighbors who have dogs who are walking and generally uh not advisable in my opinion but you know we have to work with what we have and you know I'm again grateful that the streets are going to be moved around um again that my second point is that the current code does not allow for really any modifications except for a variance which it did spell out in the code that there's variance options allowed at the discretion of the council um and because of that what we have now are a lot of our neighbors are parking on dirt and they're parking on uh rocks and they're parking on mud um and I'm we actually put together a group of photos for you guys to take a look at of some of the damage and cars and uh rocks and mud that that are on the street so again this is I we we copied and pasted the Miami Dade Street design guidelines for uh the county and you we should be looking at a 20 to 25 4ot wide Street I know that's not how the village was built back in 1937 when it was founded but you know we have what we have so right now we're in a a dangerous situation on the street in a situation where if there's any two cars passing um they're going to run over your Swale so you guys know the cost of grasses it's not cheap to have to keep replacing that uh this was our house today actually we just put all new grass in just a couple months ago um and that's our lawn it's now mud again which I don't love and I'm sure that my neighbors on 88th Street also don't love so um we compiled a couple more photos this is kind of the current state of our swes which is only relevant in the fact that I think that additional parking is a much better option than letting the grass turn to mud and get destroyed and um for the rest of this I'm going to turn it over to my lovely wife hello real fast I'm going to go back to this so these were photos that were sent to us by our neighbors uh these ones I went out and took myself but this one was sent to our neighbor so you see all these trucks having to park on her long over here over here and basically just blocking the whole thing right this is damage caused to one of our neighbors cars who a car was going up on the sale and hit her own car and so when it comes to this the problem is when we're parking on a sale it's not uniform and there is also no distinguished concrete parking so you you know when you have concrete parking you say okay I'm not going to hit that but when you're on a sale cars can be at different angles and things like that so this individual had their car hit on their soil so also what we're coming to is we all know that our city floods it's not a secret we all know but the problem is flooding causes mud and causes disease so this was actually taken from Florida Health in Miami Dade shows I mean we all know mosquitoes standing water causes mosquitoes causes diseases and specifically there's diseases that can also affect children elderly and our blued animals and peacocks in this city um we do have a high population of children and we have a high population of elderly so these individuals are at high risk for these diseases listed right here so another point and I you brought up is that these channels add well greatly do help with the flooding and the drainage that happens on our property happens to everyone but also on our property there's been times before this where I would have to walk out to my car wearing something like this and imagine having to roll my pants up to my knees and walk Barefoot holding my heels in the hand to get to my car so this has greatly helped with the drainage and you know if this is approved we plan on this side actually kind of digging these channels a little bit deeper because these were the original channels they were not as deep as these and filling them in with more rocks to help with the drainage but of course we wanted to go through this before we spent the money to do all of that lastly emergency situations so when there's an emergency situation with a kid with a loved one with anybody right you're not going to be honey can you please move your car I know you can't breathe but like we got to get you to the hospital it's just doesn't make sense and so personally for me I have health issues and eventually we do want to have a child because of my health issues I'm already going to be labeled high risk so I don't want something happening to me and then he can't find my keys because they're in my gym bag he has to figure something out because in that you know in these medical emergencies time is precious it can be between your loved one living or dying and with that said thank you very much thank you adults our just uh Miss Le just say your name for the record your first and last name I'm Katherine Leone all right Miss Katherine Leone I'm going to go to the council in a second and then after I go to the council I'll go to if anybody in the um audience has anything to say but before I go to the council I just want to say really quickly that um first of all thank you for doing uh the driveway the way that you did it because it does make it permeable and does like you know help out with the drain drainage and the flooding um the the the picture though doesn't even do it justice uh when I went to that property and I've gone by that properly a few times um you know doing my flyer packets and things like that and handing things out it fits aesthetically perfectly with the property um it doesn't take away from it it doesn't look bad it doesn't look like you know Gody or horrible um it actually makes it propably look very very good and you know Elber we're just in this like unique situation which I think um you know a lot of other places uh don't have you know when I tell people that you know we were established in 1937 they're like 1937 wow like we didn't know you guys were that old but part of that problem being established that old and um you know having the code and stuff like that is that back then um in 1937 even going into the 1950s and even in the early 1960s most people had one car right things have changed but our properties our Cod hasn't changed to be up to date to the way Society has changed which is a huge issue so yeah people nowadays have at least two cars minimum you know if not a third car you know there's a lot of people and this is even before you get you know children and teenagers and stuff like that you know a lot of people might have two cars and one SUV a lot of people might have a car SUV and like a um a classic car they're working on to restore right these are just like the realities of society nowadays so I just think that um we really need to like kind of modernize oursel with the realities of society you know while still maintaining the culture of Elbert and like the you know the Aesthetics of eler to but when I pass through and pass by that property that property fits the Aesthetics um perfectly and it looks really really good and and I really appreciate the the drainage aspect can I add one thing uh you know we we bought this house uh five years ago so this is our fifth year in elportal uh we intend to raise our children here in the future and we we made a pretty significant investment already in the home added solar panels uh completely modernized the the interior and quite frankly had to fix a lot of issues that when it was sold to us with plumbing and stuff so you we're here long term uh we intend to make this our home for quite some time and um you know again I appreciate everybody listening and I hope that this makes sense because there's a lot of I I think elportal is really in this phase where we're growing up and um I think the village is going to be the really really hot neighborhood for a lot of families and a lot of young people moving here and I think that's really important to keep in mind because we have a room full of Builders and developers and people wanting to invest a lot of money here and I think some of the things that are being proposed to modernize the code and some of the stuff that we're talking about here are vital to not just increasing the tax base but modernizing the neighborhood and bringing it into the 21st century so with that being said thank you for your time I really appreciate it no I appreciate you I'm about to go to the council but and it's interesting because um I remember when I when I spoke to you all like I had no idea speaking to you you like you know longterm and you guys have been here how long have you guys lived here so far uh we we bought the house 5 years ago 5 years ago look at that but for for a while um one side of the house didn't have Plumbing because of the previous owner how things were set up and um you know so that's that's a whole another story we'll talk about that yeah we'll talk about that so we're going to talk about that another time but for you guys to to spend all the money that we spoke about for you guys to fix that um and and still remain and stay here is a wonderful thing uh anybody from the committee questions or comments yes I do have a go ahead uh what was the reason why you guys did not seek the variance prior to completing the work um I I didn't know I I didn't well honestly I didn't know that we needed it and I made um I had my concrete contractor do it while they were building because the soil was turning into mud and it seemed like a a good idea I got permits for everything else spent money on the part that gives me pause because I know you you mentioned that you did a full garage conversion I'm just wondering how you were not aware of the fact that you would probably need a variance to double the size of of that well I'm not going to sit here and lie to you it was in the middle of a construction project and uh I think he saw the opportunity to do it saw the opportunity the concrete person being there and at the time during Co it was very hard to get people to come out so it's kind of like opportunity presented itself at the time and maybe partly ignorance but you know like I'm an attorney and I know ignorance is not a could you you yeah no I'm I'm not I'm not here to make that argument I'm just I'm just telling you the truth I no I'm an attorney as well I appreciate the honesty in you saying that and I'm definitely not against modernization I just think that this type of ad hoc modernization is something um that may set a precedent that we may not be willing to deal with I guess we can all perceive an issue and we can all just unilaterally make our own decisions as to how to solve that issue but I don't think that that's conducive to um creating a communal plan that helps us move together in one steady focused manner so you know I get what you're saying as far as the issues present I think the way that you've chosen to solve it gives me pause um but I leave the floor to councilman herbal for his question so how you doing um so raised by an attorney not an attorney uh I'm a wage earner so I come from the kitchens and waiting tables for most of my life 25 years in Hospitality almost all of it fine dining here in Miami I've been telling the council for more than two years there is a tsunami of attorneys headed for this Village of course they'll buy a $2 and3 million home if they can only Park two cars in it because they're doing it because they're overextended on debt they can't afford the larger Lots in Miami Shores and they're going to just do whatever they want and ask the council for the variance after the fact so you just explained in extraordinary detail our permitting process our code and then on this issue magically there's no understanding that you know exactly what the strategy was it'll be fine this is extremely frustrating I just want the council to understand that this is going to be the rule not the exception of almost anything that we're going to see in the coming years people will pay $2 and3 million if you have no parking do you know know why if you're in real estate it's a very simple answer it's the elevation it's the elevation your house is technically worthless no matter how recently it was built it's the land and its elevation that has the value I even with the most newest Construction in this neighborhood it's still only the land that holds that value because of the elevation and so I'm also not going to I have four I have four kids I I'm not going to entertain bringing the need for this to the level of life and death um it's further evidence from my point of view that you know you shouldn't have done it I agree with the mayor it's a nice job it looks nice I'm not sold that it helps with the flooding but as long as it hasn't made it worse then that would be a win because technically anytime anybody puts in a structure like that in their sale it's going to increase the flooding in the street and then for the neighboring properties that go sideways and then wherever the street allows it to so I'm extremely frustrated with this application specifically because I have two knowledgeable knowing people who blatantly and clearly are just relying on it's a bully tactic it's passive aggressive bully tactic I I I don't have too much patience to not just call it out like that and I'm I'm I'm extremely frustrated that that uh I'm not surprised not even in the least I've been telling the council for two years this is exactly what's coming this is going to be the rule not the exception and if we decline the variance tonight what is your next course of action so is it to sue the village for keeping the driveway so let's first start off with addressing your comments about the and the microphone please the addressing your also I'm sorry state your name for the record because then for the minutes Leon again um understand your frustration towards you know the code and what people are doing and I mean we are equally just frustrated I can't tell you our intentions at the time of doing that I think it's unfair to say that we are trying to bully people and harass them cuz we are here we have been working for almost 2 years to do this after the fact said it's a passive aggressive bully tactic is what I said bully tactic yes that is not our intention at all and it's somewhat unfair to say what we were intending at that time because that is not what we are intending so I can tell you what we were intending was exactly what we presented today I cannot talk to you on the ignorance of the subject I don't know honestly you know this is my husband he made the decision but we're here today we've been trying for two years two years to get this variance after the fact and we've been told okay codee's going to come up cod's going to come up and as we go through the city we see other individuals with you know parking spaces and things that are not in compliance but we were the ones who were you know given the violation and so now we're working after the fact working very very hard after the fact to make it right and that's why we're here today to make this right in front of you and in front of everybody else and if you want this to be a lesson to everybody we can tell you hey don't do it because you're going to have to go through this process and it has not been enjoy Varian process I I will not treat it as an opportunity I'm not opportunistic that way to teach anybody a lesson in those types of actions are never productive to begin with and a variance process will simply only consider your specific properties unique need for this variance as in what is the unique requirement that this variance is needed to be granted and so right now the only need to Grant this variance is simply because the thing is already there and this is going to be catastrophic Ric for the future of this Village if this is the if this is the don't you think that the current situation and with the FL catastrophic I mean in the village of elport the parking situation on our Street's catastrophic the the mud is catastrophic the people's cars getting run into is catastrophic the the inflexibility of this code the fact that I I know that it's it's got to be redone I think that the the fact that I had to come to a variance hearing for a garage en Clos and for a driveway speaks to the infle so you haven't lived in Miami long enough to know that almost everybody who does garage enclosures does it that's not up to code and it causes massive problems for the resale of the house the eventual value of the property and so if we don't pay attention to garage enclosures I'm sorry isn't that a building department issue to determine the structural integrity and worthiness of of a garage conversion as opposed to so that's step one so that's step one step two is the facade itself and does it fit in with the uh with what we're trying to accomplish in the village so me personally on this de have said multiple times if we do not protect the uniqueness of this Village then in the future property values will be at the mercy of the rest of the county as the rest of the county goes through C cyclical dips and Rises and by maintaining the uniqueness of this Village specifically that uh insulates us from those dips and allows the property values of the village longterm long term to be maintained and upheld against what the what is happening in the rest of the county so uh for example we don't allow zero lot construction uh in alportel you have to have green space on your on your lot and so if you drive through uh Coconut Grove right now I mean I'm sure the houses are very nice on the inside but it is not enjoyable to drive through Coconut Grove right now or even walk through Coconut Grove right now it's it looks like a it looks like a developers nightmare to be perfectly honest in terms of like the the the what's happening and I I use Coconut Grove frequently as an example of this um and yeah that's some of the most expensive price per square foot real estate in the city and I I own a appraisal company so we I I deal with this stuff as the development rolls North from bua Vista all the way up to 125th because of the elevation in the next 10 to 15 years everyone from bra a Vista put a little further up to like say 47th okay all the way up to 125th all right are going to outpace low Li coconut Groves square footage the geography of M day county is changing right in front of our face on the beach you're going to have all those single family homes raised and you're going to get three story palaces built on stilts nobody's going anywhere and so I understand all of the arguments but my point is that of all the permitting you pulled on that property the plumbing as you just like you gutted it you redid the house you increase the value of the property right and that's what you're I did what my part as a homeowner was I increased the value of my property I'm not ask you're not asking I I I will I will acknowledge that we're not not asking for some massive uh crazy uh exception to the rules here right I mean that's that's not what the thing is the the issue is this is a variance process and the only way that I'm going to vote Yes on a variance is if there is a distinctly unique need for that variance for that very specific property and so um I'll let every I'll let the audience and everyone El talk but but that's that's where I'm at that's where I'm at all right I'm go to move on to the next council person um committee person um I just want to say Committee Member I just want to say really quickly you guys we have to also keep in mind um the flooding when it comes to because 88 is so uh thin it is a thin Street are the concrete Paths of the additional driveway permeable we we have to keep in the grooves and the drainage do we have any evidence to say that the addition of this extra driveway space has either contributed to the increase or decrease of flood water specifically in front of the property as well as to the neighbors it's there that argument my neighbor swes are mud I understand like I said I I I walk on your street like several times a week you know that my neighbor house is mud yes I do right yes I guess my question is what would you rather have do park on the grass and destroy the grass if we have guests come over if we have a child if we have things like that we can't turn back the hands of time we understand we made a mistake and we're here today to ask you basically for forgiveness of that mistake so if this is not approv ask for forgiveness not from permission I understand I'm sorry can you speak closer to the mic thank you Le okay you don't have to talk that's fine but looking at where would we park we would destroy destroy we parked on the grass it was destroyed we had to replace it three different times so yes you are absolutely right we should have asked for permission I do not not know why I you know we were in the midst of construction I have no idea this was not done with any any ill intent at all let's just make that very clear this was done with strictly to fix the problem of tearing up that yard the mud the water all of the things I did not know that I needed a evidentiary expert here today to talk about the waters you know I can say my personal opinion it has been better because on that design alone we would if you had come to us with that design as a before you built it and said we need a variance this is what we'd like to do and here's the reasons why simply because the design we would have denied it because I'm looking at it and it will contribute to water going into the street where it cannot drain on your property and will move to stre you an expert in this subject I mean clearly well I mean I've been doing variances on this for eight years we have the same qualifications in regards to how the water is going to pull on this subject today we have you and I have the same qualifications on that subject so again we are here with no ill intent we are here asking you yes we know we made a mistake we're asking you to approve this today the way it is for the reasons we presented it and again we had no ill intent these accusations of intent personally I feel are not appropriate we're not trying to bully when we're not trying to harm anybody we're just trying to do this simply here and what we presented today yeah before I move on to the next Committee Member um I just want all of us to kind of keep in mind uh the alternative I do agree with um everything that's been set up here as far as you know things were done early wish we they would have been done um in the correct process but we have to keep in mind about what's the alternative right so when we just saw like the image of how their property looks today when you know it's it's still we're still in the SE season where it's not raining as much the rain kind of started up a little bit this week but um we're going to be going into the rainy season pretty soon and when you start to have these huge tire marks and things in your in your lawn with the rainy season with sitting water with like they said mosquitoes with all these different things and with eler tow not looking good I walk the village all the time homes that have the front yards where people park in front of the front yards it looks horrible it makes the house look cheap it looks terrible so this here aesthetically looks much better than the homes that I pass where people are parking in the swell it looks horrible so agreed I just want to you know keep glad they didn't run it all the way up to the house I mean it does look nice I agree I like the green that's not the issue and think about the alternative that's all um who else from the council wants to speak council person life forward what's your last name Leon Mr is Leon it's just said it's a policy I got it there both of you are very intelligent both of you have demonstrated that you didn't just do it just because you thought you could get away with it we got it okay but it's done it's done very nicely I I live on 88th Terrace so you know where I am yes ma'am the issue is is if everybody just decided to do it first without doing it right we'd be run over the council would look like we're just letting things happen it's not the case I hear you I really do you weren't trying to do anything wrong you weren't attempting to get away with something something you weren't doing that the fact is but you did all we're asking is that what you said tonight does not justify it it's just it's just wrong but it's done now the answer the question now is what do we do about it do we ask you to tear it all up what what is the legal ramification what is the legal ramification for what you have done and how you can keep it cuz we could be here all night talking about what happened we know what happened we want the remedy and that it does not happen to anyone else it's not on the book that you can just build anytime anything anyway and it does look nice what I say I'm right around the corner from you yes Ma so it just shouldn't have been like that and I'm listening to you all you're both educated people whatever the incentive was is still wrong now we have to decide how it's going to stand enough talking we know you didn't mean to be um rude you weren trying to do something wrong but your property really does look good come on now I'm right around the corner we we're we're doing everything to make our property nicer and honestly we love elportal I even dragged my parents here they're in the audience they bought a house on 90th Street I mean we do love it closer to us yeah it's um but you don't have to explain I'm just simply telling you we know we see it but we don't need all these people in here to do the same thing because you got away with it no we need to be able to say the code does not say do it however you want the code says we have the provisions for how to do these things I agree I Y um um thank you very much I have a comment course I should have known that was your mom I saw her taking video I would do the same for my sons I probably will be she doesn't get to see me at work but I guess she gets to see me here she's she's proud very cute uh welcome I do have a question for scarlet um if you could I I also am not a permeability expert but I'm hoping you have some guidance on this which is more permeable the grass iteration of this property or the one with the concrete selles and the channels in the center yeah that's an easy answer obviously the grass is going to allow water to go through okay so so so we've made it less permeable than it was previously correct and there has been much talk um for a while now about um issues with permeability and flooding and the increase appearance of concrete slabs like this and driveways kind of making the problem worse as it relates to flooding in the village um so that's one of the things that I'm thinking about when I'm analyzing the situation and in addition to that uh the IR isn't lost on me that you guys enclosed the garage and then now are talking about issues with a parking um well the garage couldn't fit a modern vehicle okay yeah it it wouldn't it couldn't I mean maybe like a Mini Cooper but I don't fit inside a Mini Cooper so I don't think I'd be able to do that but the garage was the size it was I'm assuming when you purchased the property or did it it was whatever size was built in 1950 question mark whenever the house was built so it was built for a different era okay but when you purchased it in 20120 it was what it was it was existing okay um so all of those things when I think about it when I consider what we are trying to accomplish and where we're trying to move and what we've spoken about as it relates to a comprehensive plan on the types of driveways we're considering the types of building materials we're going to allow I think that this is completely counter to what it is that we've contemplated and I know that it is it is present and it is here I think to your question councilwoman light foot Ward the remedy would be for them to remove it or portion of it uh to make it comply with the code would that be the remedy correct so if we did say no we were not granting the variance tonight that would be the result so I just want to be clear on what it is that will happen um with either route if we say yes the variance is granted then they will keep it as it is um and I think we will be sending a very interesting message to others who choose to proceed in this way um or if we say that we're not granting the variance the remedy is that they would have to come into compliance uh and that's the end of my comment I can um I can I can tell you that with like how our yard is when we did not have this the water would just pull and create massive amounts of mud so yes the grass would absorb but we receive I think I put on there 5.6 in of rain um on average from I forgot what months but a lot of rain the ground literally can absorb that much amount of rain so it does create mud it tears up the grass to be honest like like the it's not healthy happy looking grass it's overwatered it's dead and it's muddy so I understand you know from Cod perspective from aesthetic perspective things like that that you know it is nice seeing that green space there and the grass of course grass is what more absorbent than concrete but in this scenario there's just too much water there's too much of it no matter what we do even when we had it there was too there was too much of it and when we did have that garage it still not fix the problem like if we could hypothetically fit a car in there which we really couldn't it was very small it still would not necessarily fix that that problem that we still have today and I mean if you're looking at the driveway some of you have been by the house it fits about three cars comfortably not like 5 10 15 we're not trying to be like Dural or hiia where it's just basically all concrete I like the birds I like the yard I like the trees living here we used to live in Midtown and the joke is we used to live in Midtown and I always told him I want to wake up to like happy birds I'm tired of this traffic things like that and so we move here and then we hear the peacocks screaming screaming and he's like well you wanted happy little birds and I was like he's like you didn't specify what birds so you know like I understand I love nature things like that but we just like you know councilwoman said here we have this issue at hand any you talk about setting a president to others to do this let me tell you when everyone asks us about this we say actually don't do it it has we have spent two years trying to rectify this putting so much time and effort to make it right if anyone ever came up and asked us should we do this we're going to tell them no don't do it get get the variants first do what you have to do so that that being said I don't know how much president it would make or how much influence it would make on other other people in the city but we're not going around telling people to do it we're telling them the opposite yeah let me jump in then I'm going to go back to the council I think we have one more council person didn't speak I'm going see if wants to speak um to to the point about uh you know doing it and setting precedence or doing it and and kind of doing it in a way where they were trying to get away with it I think if that was the case then they would have done all of their permits like that correct me if I'm wrong um but don't you guys have open permits now and this is like the last thing you guys have left before you guys close out yeah the entirety of this project is being held up over this uh which was a quar million dollar addition to the home okay and and and you pull permits for everything else correct yes okay so if you guys were the type of people that were trying to get away with it why would you pull permits for everything but pick this one thing not to pull permits for if you the type of person that had that wanted to get away with everything then maybe you wouldn't pull permits for half of it or all of it even but why would it be like we're going to pull permits for everything everything everything everything everything but then just just one thing you're not going to pull a permit for no the council remembers we put together a pretty lengthy presentation for the garage conversion we spend an extra thousand just on renderings to prove that the aesthetic would be symmetrical and show that you know again we're trying to start a family we're doing this so we don't run into these issues with cars we have an extra room for you know her future office so we could turn one room into a baby room I don't need to go through all of that again but no we were not trying to permit that entire job just to skip out on a driveway that was certainly not my intention um I I know the mayor's trying to help but and I this isn't a trial and and I I'm happy to attract anything that sounded accusatory but I mean to answer to answer his question very succinctly is the reason is is because that was the issue that was identified that wasn't going to be permitted so so I mean it's I mean I understand the reasoning that the mayor's making but it just it just reinforces my position from where I'm sitting yeah may but I would say a variance is one thing um that everybody tonight is here for pretty much um either site plan or variance so I think they would have went the variance route you know if they they wanted to but go ahead council person Winters thank you so much thank you Mr and Mrs Leone uh for your detailed and thoughtful presentation regarding your variance requests for 456 so Northeast 88th Street um your home is beautiful it's a beautiful addition in the north side of Sherwood Forest and uh the improvements you made clearly demonstrate care and effort that you've invested in the community um council person lightford Ward did raise valid concerns about the driveway being installed without permit um while the permitting process is important I believe it's equally critical to consider the content so many driveways in elportal exceed the current codes with limitations including my own my own driveway is 30 fet wide my house also is 1930 in preate cell portel I am not redoing my driveway because I will have to go back to code and I'm leaving at 30 ft um for anyone observing the prevailance of why driveways it would be reasonable to assume such designs are permissible if you look around alportel and I can understand why you thought it was allowed um coun uh council person Darry Martin also mentioned potential flooding concerns with your driveway uh it is important to note that your property is in flood zone X an area considered to have minimal flood risk additionally your driveway is permeable uh which further mitigates any potential impact in drainage these facts make it unlikely that your driveway would contribute to flooding issues though it does sound like it's contributing to mudding issues not having it U yes sir yes that's correct it's uh disgusting and uh if you look at what happened to our lawn this week this is full of water and I drove and I could say the same for a lot of my neighbors there's a house that just sold down the street on 88th it's $2 something million dollar you know what there's suas it's mud the whole thing is mud it's full of water and it's full of mud every single day that other house that sold on the corner brand new beautiful one the new residence they lovely couple they moved into the neighborhood I would say you know 15 20% of that Swale is now also turned into mud and every person that's here tonight I've gone to their property and I I want to give everyone a valid chance and I drove to your property and I parked there and if you did not have that extra spot I would have been parking on the Swale in the grass or I would have been parking the street which is not narrow it's too narrow to even fit two cars so I use that parking spot to actually visit your house um but Council perent alurn has expressed concerns about the potential precedent set by approving this variance respectfully I believe the situation highlights a more urgent need to update our outdated code which does not reflect the realities of life in uportal today medic many citizens have already expressed a desire for driveways that accommodate modern households with multiple Vehicles as chair of the code enforcement committee I'm actively working to address these concerns and modernize the code to better align with the needs of our community this is why we're going to be having a toal Town Hall soon to even talk about this and what the actual people in this this neighborhood actually need so asking the Leones to tear up the driveway now would impose unnecessary financial hardship especially considering that the code May soon change in their favor it would not be fair to punish them for something that could be compliant within a year or so furthermore their driveways addresses practical issues unique to 88th Street including including the narrow roadway damage swailes and challenges posed by delivery vehicles their design is thoughtful functional enhances the overall appearance of the property uh the case underscores the need for balance and Forward Thinking code enforcement that supports residents while preserving the character of elportal thank you Mr Miss Leone for your thoughtful presentation thank you councilman wners we appreciate it thank you very much any other questions or comments from the council hearing none um anybody from the audience want to come up and say anything about this case I'm sorry just hold on hold on hold on hold on just say your name and address for the record as well how you doing my name is Diego Castro I live in 150 87th um all right I've never met this lovely couple I for a different reason for different uh neighbors um but I I wanted to throw a question out here that um Mr Charles uh um mentioned was we keep sticking to a code that was bound for I don't know how many years back uh and I'm a young couple we're also planning on a family soon enough and um we're unlucky to only have one car today but we're also planning on getting a second car so my question would be is if we're planning on variances on a code that no longer applies to most of the families in this in the village why why don't we vote on changing the code in order for this not to be a variance instead of you know I I I couldn't even see the pictures I'm sure they're beautiful and they're take a look all right perfect um we drive through a lot of these uh streets we walk we do sorry for the phrase but house porting you know cuz we get ideas off of Everybody um and this is just the reality of Modern Life um we we live in a in a city that's you know sprawling uh we're very happy to be here but if if we ever got to this point not because of flooding or whatever other reason in at home but just because we wanted to park say my parents when they come visit or a second car or any other absolutely Fair Reon reason because 87th is you know it's flooded with traffic and fairly fast you know I wouldn't have thought that I needed a variance to a code I would just start you know like it's just put a you know somewhere to park the car now and we haven't done anything to our house we've it's from 1947 uh it's pretty old U and I do agree my my car doesn't fit in the garage today so um and I have a small SUV um so it's just a question for the council in general I I I don't mean to cause any you know issues it's just why do we keep living by a code that no longer applies to most of the citizens in the village why don't we try to work the code in order to work for the people that do live in the village while trying to maintain you know the essence of the actual Village you know uh instead of working on variances thank you thank you very much appreciate that um back in August uh manager Lou and myself we put $120,000 into updating the code look M Lou was gonna say it and I started talking she turned her mic off because she already knows we on the same page we put $120,000 back in August to update the code over two years 60,000 60,000 60 this year 60 next year um uh council person winter is the new code enforcement chair and um you know I think some of his vision correct me from WR council person Winters is is to try to move to make the code more residential friendly and that's part of the reason why manager Al and I put the $120,000 into the code passed by the council thank you all of you up there um because we wanted to modernize the code and so that's that's the purpose so we're all working together to get that done Mr Mayor if I could also answer his question I'll stick to 30 seconds or less here so so this particular code that we're talking about is technically modernized the reason for the refusal to allow the development of SES specifically for parking is twofold the first is flood mitigation so if you drive through the neighborhood anywhere that somebody has an asphalt sale when it rains you will find standing water in front of their property as well as in front of the neighbors anywhere you have an asphalt sale this is not an asphalt sale okay I acknowledge that you design this with thought I agree with council person Winters and his assessment of the the the thought that went into getting the work done so um the second is that there is an absolute intention to not have a situation where every property in the village is uh with a frontage of vehicles um those two have been discussed for years on this Council those are the two reasons those are the specific two reasons um why this Still Remains a variance for people to accomplish as opposed to being fully allowed in the code thank you very may may I add a few things mayor Nickerson and to the gentleman who asked the question the village has um determined that we are up updating the code it it does cost a lot of money and it's also a very laborous um Endeavor that's why it's going to take two years so I know that what's before you tonight is immediate but the code won't be changing for quite some time until those um meetings are had there are Community forums that are actually I'm I'm scheduling them right now with our urban planners um there'll be meeting with members of the council um the mayor as Planning and Zoning chair um so there's a lot happening but it's not here presently and I think that's why there is a disconnect but understand we also did a um a resilient streets master plan as to a way to address our narrow streets um we and and also the flooding issues um that are also kind of covered in that and uh one or two things that will be looked at uh with the code amendments will be um swell material you know what you can plant there's some areas that can't grow saw we understand that so we're trying to work with you and people aren't being cited we not having sod in the grass right now or or in the swell right now in fact no you know you can kind of relax on that for areas that aren't able to grow um sod uh and swelled areas however that's not blanket for everybody so we'll we're addressing that in these code amendments that will be coming up but um and another thing is also um the um the approach uh when there are two car garages but only a single um lane or a small um uh driveway um that's another item that is on the uh code amendments list but that is all coming it's just that we we have a code in front of us right now where other people have gone about it the right way or you know gone through the whole variance process or gone through uh just permitting and had to settle for the smaller one because that's what the code allowed so I just wanted to offer that but just know those meetings are coming and we do hope that everybody will participate and just one more thing 30 seconds uh the reason why it takes so long is because the code should be thoughtful the process that the manager is outlining um takes into consideration different needs of different areas different viewpoints of stakeholders and it also incorporates professionals who tell us um about the trends and forecasts for this community which is actually in a very precarious place so we do need to pay close attention to issues like flooding and the materials that are used it takes a while to create a good plan the goal is to make it such that it not only contemplates how we live today but how we will be living tens 20 years from now um and the issue with just having individuals pick their own Solutions is that maybe those might not be the best solutions for us as a body which we are a community it's the village so we are taking our time to vet all avenues and create a comprehensive plan which is why when people do take uh their initiative to find those um ad hoc Solutions it gives us pause uh because the village is working so diligently to come up with the code that is good for all of us in the village thank you very much Madam vice mayor appreciate it um anybody else from the Council on that particular item that gentleman raised otherwise I'm going to ask for other comments from the audience good okay say your name address for the record good evening J rero 225 North 8 uh6 Street I know the Leon's family uh being doggy parent par we walk around a lot I've been one of the oldest residents here 20 years plus in elportal I have seen this community change over and over I have participated in committees I have been part of Council meetings all the time I have requested changes to code enforcement I understand that we don't have the budget because we're a small village and it takes time to get it done I don't don't think based on what they have explained that they knew that a variance was needed for the driveway they did pull permits for everything else so why should we penalize them now I walked the neighborhood I've seen their house before they bought it I've seen their house during construction I see it now it is a gem I love it thank you we worked really hard for it now the garage that they had worthless the garage that I have is worthless my cyber truck doesn't even fit in my driveway I have to park it somewhere else I have a smaller SUV doesn't even fit in the driveway so when I did my driveway when I did my windows 20 years ago I was involved in asking and so I found out that I needed a variance and I got it but one thing I do want to show and have people be aware new residents are coming in they're very busy professionals whether they work at home or in office our website does not specify for new residents that talk to the city for permits or for variants this is something that if you're going to apply a code you need to let people know that we have restrictions okay the fence remember when we had the issue about the fencing it took six years to get it passed and today we even have people trying to go beyond that which I'm not in favor of putting a fence in the front of the property so just want to give you my two cents and keep it at 3 minutes goodbye thank you you very much Jr um any anyone else from the uh from the audience you guys good okay seeing none oh oh come on come on now come on now how you doing good uh I'm not going to talk long I I came here to support them say your name and address oh I'm sorry Edna Edelman 301 Northeast 88 street thank you um so when we moved in you know we have a corner property and we spent a fortune uh redoing the sad uh on the sale and about a week later AT&T drove up um and tore up all the new sad they had to be towed off my swell um so when I looked at at what they did I was like wow wow I want to do that not to the sell just to to have a driveway where the delivery trucks can park um 88 Street as you've heard a thousand times is very narrow there you can park on the street if you park on the street no one else can get by um so everyone parks on our soil um so I I know we're belaboring this sorry closer to the mic but I think what they did is lovely it looks really nice to your point it looks a lot nicer than all the cars parked on the Swale it looks nicer than the rocks that everyone has um and I mean the flooding you know my sale died uh between the delivery trucks and all the rain the grass died and I'm not replacing it so now I have mud and weeds um all around my house um so I hope that this variance passes thank you thank you very much anyone else uh from the audience say your name and address for the record please I'm totally unprepared for what I'm going say I'm Kim Leon I live on 286 Northeast 90th Street um I have personally walked around the neighborhood multiple times with my dogs their dogs and looked at all the gravel that's not uniformly enforced so they would allow permeable area in front of their house to deal with the soil drainage issues I think uh we've lost our Focus we need to come to a conclusion about this um they're trying to better the neighborhood they work pretty hard I personally know Katherine who runs her Law Firm was trying to supervise the construction of the house he's trying to run his business this is the first home they've owned and they really tried to do their best to comply with NE the neighborhood thank you very much well say thanks Mom not just as your mom see guys not every variance gets their mom to come out and speak in support of them good stuff only no for to people only no for to um is there anybody else from the audience you can't after Mom you got to come good now yeah seriously mom mom mom hit it out the park now you got to come right um seeing hearing none I'm going to go back to the audience I mean go back to the council um do I have any last questions or comments about this yes sorry I'll keep it till a minute here um I was hoping that a neighbor would step up and uh you know from the Block and say something so I do actually know Edna um and um uh you know Lucy so I'm not as not as well yeah yeah so I usually see Ed social functions without luc's awesome yeah and so um uh however um I was hoping that there would be a neighbor who would um stand up and speak and um appreciate everything she had to say um because one of my concerns is for your neighbors I mean really truly um uh and so keeping it to a minute here I'll just say this Mr Mayor um I believe that one of the keys to maintaining property values in the village going forward for the next 20 to 30 years is kind of an atmosphere of exclusivity and what I mean by that is for example there should be no contract work done on weekends at all in this Village it should be exclusive to Mondays and Fridays Mondays through Fridays and in fact I personally believe it should be 9 to5 UM and that would be very uh uh lots of contractors would have to work around that but they would have to work around that we would be the exclusive Village we would be the ones maintaining the quality of life for the residents in addition to that along the vein of the primary concern which for me is the actual argument here the the winning argument from your from your side is the delivery vehicles um it is an absolute problem um it is a danger uh you have now now you've got me invested in the kind of life and death argument because a moving Mass like that making an un you know uh these guys are wild right right unpredict unhinged out there on roads unpredictable behaviors unpredictable parking yes exactly so I in the vein of exclusivity I would like to see The Village have an ordinance that says uh you know FedEx UPS basically the US Postal Service would be the only one allowed to bring a vehical into the village everyone else would have to stay on Second Avenue or somewhere else and walk the village and we have the police force that can uh provide the security necessary to ensure that those uh delivery drivers would be safe on foot the packages would be safe once delivered etc etc but for me that's the winning argument because I know exactly what Edna is saying um I understood it as you were saying it too um and for me that is the compelling argument that you have these absolute massive Vehicles weighing you know three four five tons six tons they're BR it right and they make they make sudden unpredictable movements now you've got you know I mean everything from dogs and cats to small children at risk now so so absolutely so especially on 88th from Park drive all the way down um you know that's that 88th Street is actually so you guys know is actually the inspiration for um PL Serbia um and then once I talked to W about that I'm very excited about their Urban streets uh design 88 was the like the key to all of that of this is why we need oneway streets in elport yeah well I was very excited when councilman winners came by and told me I had no idea I know that the mayor had told me that it was in the works we're ways off yet but it is listen any reprieve in the the plan is done the plan is done oh we saw yeah it's very exciting I think it'll be a big change thank you for your comments there any any other questions or comments from the council or from the committee go ahead council person lifeward call a question counc n for Ward what do you want to um what do you want to call the question for the for the motion do you want to call you want to make a motion call the question for the motion yeah do you want to make the motion counc person life award you 4 456 Northeast 88th Street yes I want to call the question let's vote okay we're going to vote is are you making the motion though motion is that um what do we call it when um the variance approving the variance approve it we can do that are we all are we all Okay we okay just to go and do that yes yeah call a question for the variant in favor of what they've already done I like people having their chance I'll second the motion we have a motion we have a second Madam clerk may please get roll call please roll call member light foot Ward yes member Winters approve yes yes member bbom bu had no bottle of wine yes Vice chair Martin no chair Nickerson yes motion passes 4 to one can I say something real quick everybody we love you all and thank you everybody even the no but I'm going to remember that but thank you I know um I think truly this is a special place and I think to your point councilman herbal this Village is the future of Miami dat I think this is a really special place I tell everybody when they're looking for a place to live that they should try to find a house here but none of them can afford it because it's unbelievable now but I think to your point I think that this this is a really special Village and I not just the peacocks and not just the narrow roads and the mud but the rest of it the neighbors here and everybody that lives here I've never had such an enjoyable experience living in a neighborhood uh yes and I owe you a bottle of wine but um I just want to say thanks and I think that you know with this in mind I think that the this Village got to think about the future and I know that I can I can see it very clearly now that you guys are thinking about that and considering that and I think that there's a lot of in this audience and I can see all of their big boards and their presentations we're in the construction business too I mean it's uh it's a cool thing to see from when we moved here 5 years ago to what it is now I mean I had a homeless guy living next to me in that abandoned house yeah we know and now we have interior designers it's amazing thank you all I really appreciate it and um appreciate your consideration as well thank you thank you very much so just a reminder come back tomorrow for your sign and you have to go to one more meeting no problem gladly I will be here and stop by and see my Miami water keeper family on the way out all right appreciate it you guys yes you guys take care Mr Miss Leone um let's move right on to the next agenda item you guys we're going to agenda item 44 Northeast 88 Street new single family resident 44 Northeast 88 Street may I please have the applicants up yeah yeah bring bring it on up to the front so everybody can see it no problem problem no problem got any water around here any water around yes honey you got water around here got water all right you guys um this is for 44 Northeast 88 Street um we're going to start off with uh Miss Hammond's kind of give us the background on yes um this applicant is requesting a site plan approval for new construction of a new home at 44th Northeast 88th Street the site is approximately 8,100 ft in in size and is currently contains a single family home built in 1919 the proposed residential use is permitted and the proposed home is to be two stories and will be a total of 4,944 Ft with six bedrooms and 6 and 1 half bathrooms a two-car garage and a covered rear Terrace um the home was reviewed under the development standards of the code and found to be consistent and they're not requesting any variances um the proposed design um well it's contemporary in architectural style and varies a little bit from the traditional Styles found in the older homes in the village the proportions and scale of the residents are compatible with with other neighborhood homes um approval is recommended for this new construction and just um to remind you this came before you at the last planning board meeting and I believe there there were a few minor comments and it was asked to be deferred for um the applicant to bring back some more information of spec specifity of design and materials and things such as that so that's what they're here before you tonight and they wanted to just clarify some of your questions thank you thank you very much um you kind of heard the background we're going to go to the council um questions and comments for either the applicant or just in general the floor is open to you guys um I guess my only question is uh what if any uh changes have been made to any design we playing since we last uh spoke well hi U my name is Joshua roas U what was the address again uh 4 44 Northeast 88th Street and uh we have uh updated a little bit of of the facade we made it look like the current house how is see it now instead of like being all like like the interior house in closing all like rectangular we made it like more could be linear in a way and we also had like the the Jingles on the on the front like just F like this instead of like just a flat roof on the front the oh yeah yeah mayor yeah counc person life for so it is the same as we have in our it's pretty much the same sorry I just have a question for the clerk real quick um so these images that are presented now are the same that arrived in our email packet the same okay the same one hopefully this time cuz last night wasn't I just wanted him to show it to you for better visual yeah it's bigger it's and um I know he said like six bedroom but I I talked to one of the investors and he's thinking of moving in here CU he liked it so much and the bottom the bottom the bedroom in the first floor is going to be turned into a studio instead of a bedroom as it stay like it stays on the plant so then once you have your certificate of occupancy what will be the number of bathrooms and bedrooms um um well it's considered a bedroom because it has a closet and a bathroom Okay so it will still be a six bedroom it'll be still a six bedroom but terms exactly okay any objections from pz are there any objections to pnz I would like to say something but but I I want to know before we start talking okay there were no objection there were no outright objections when was first presented there were a few suggestions of how to improve there were no there were no outright objections yeah anybody else from the council from the committee yeah uh so I I went to visit the site and um I will say the existing structure with the outdated design boxy appearance gousy witchers does not align with the character or Charm of the surrounding neighborhood while it served this purpose in the past it's clear that A change is necessary to bring it in line with community's evolving identity your proposal to replace it with a new design that respects the neighborhood while avoiding direct replication of nearby homes reflects thoughtful and conscious conscientious approach uh the new design strikes a balance between maintaining compatibility with the area and creating something unique that adds value to the streetscape this is precisely the type of development that enhances our community it not only revitalizes the property itself but also strengthens the aesthetic and cultural fabric of ortel thank you for taking the time energy and resources for this project you're welcome my final comment before it gets away from me is the co the coconut trees the two coconut trees oh yeah just please be thoughtful just please be thoughtful about where those go that's all I'm saying uh if you're looking at the picture it's just a reference um the render who no I was actually just looking at the text that there's going to be two coconut trees planted and my first thought was okay where so cuz U cuz I have I have 13 25 to 30 to 40ft Palms in my yard and they drop cherries not coconuts and so in my mind I'm like oh I wish I had coconuts cuz they'd be so much easier to pick up but then on the other hand I've got another neighbor with coconut trees and is Swale but people will come and steal his coconuts basically um and so I just while we're here I just want to mention be thoughtful about where you place those two coconut yeah they look like they're inside so like within the properties anybody else from the committee yes counc P life reward I noticed in the uh information that it says remove and rebuild a larger a larger twostory residential house I'm on it okay with that in mind was there any objection to pnz I didn't hear you say anything objection no um there was not objection it was just a you wanted to see it again another pass at it I think and and so you deferred it to the next meeting and that's why we're here you going to live in it or you just going to build it uh she's going to live in it live it that's a big house you going to live in it just you you have three kids you have three k okay thank you very much coun life for war anybody else from the uh Committee hearing seeing none anybody from the audience have anything that they want to say about this particular project hearing hearing seeing none um back to the committee do I have a motion to approve so move move by council person light foot Ward do I have a second second second by vice mayor Martin Madam clerk may I please have roll call please roll call member Winters yes member life foot Ward yes member bbom yes Vice chair Martin yes chair Nickerson yes motion passes 5 To None very good thank you very much congratulations um thank you thank you thank you if if if I if I don't have any objections um I would like to ask for you know you guys are good you guys he's like oh he's like he's like the mayor's going to pull a rug from under us right away no we have we have uh individual here she she has she is the original uh G6 for the fence her her her children are here with her and they're falling asleep and so if if there's no objection do I have a motion to move G6 up to the new G3 can I have a motion for that you guys so moov moved by uh vice mayor Martin second by Council council person light foot Ward all in favor say I I all the post say nay hearing none so the new G3 will be the fence uh 149 Northeast 89 87th Street 149 Northeast 87th Street Miss Hammond all right we're moving to 149 Northeast 87th Street can I please have the applicant up here also clear out yes the individual who just got approved remember that you guys have to come back for another meeting also stopped by my um water my Miami water keeper uh table on the way out all right we sleep okay we sleepy here we go Miss Hammond's uh Miss ham Euro okay the applicant Miss Adriana Arun is requesting an after Thea variance for her fence in the front yard setback at um at the property located at 149 Northeast 87th Street there were request is to remedy the code violation um for this existing fence along the front property line the primary justification is the fence is needed as a barrier to protect the home from some criminal activities that had been occurring on the property and the applicant had listed several of those instances in her letter and also um if you recall she was here at the last planning board meeting and spoke to some of those instances as well um just um for to let you know the code does not allow fences on the property in the front yard unless made of certain approved materials and limited to 4T and approved by a variance the existing fence does not comply with this materials or the height this um fence as it is requested is a 6ft high fence and they're asking for a variance for that height and also the the materials and to be located on the front property Lane thank you very much appreciate that Miss Hammond um questions and comments from the committee I'll jump in um so this one's also a little bit frustrating um uh I remember seeing the video of the kids on the bikes who had entered the property and that video is interesting to me because it demonstrated how when the Gate of the fence is open people have access to that property and then no one can see that they're on your property any longer those kids are completely I mean uh people passing by in the street in cars like it it I mean once they were inside your property I was watching the video I thought they were your kids and then at the meeting learned no those no those were the kids who were going to steal shoes off the porch and they were saying that they were going to take things off the porch right um and because I for me watching that video the behavior of those kids was clearly uh like I mean I would have taken notice like from a block away like what are these guys doing because um they were you know they're in the middle of the street they're you know doing all these things but once they got onto your property nobody outside your property had any idea that they were there it was only you um and so so I understand uh acutely like I have four kids one of them is five you know um so I understand uh uh to an excessive degree um the the desire to have this fence I get it I completely get it I have concerns with the design as I said you have a situation where now people can be on the property without there being any Witnesses essentially um uh and beyond that I mean we have gone around and around on this for years and there just would not have been any path whatsoever to have had this approved even in a variance process before it was built so without you know uh putting uh you know U I don't know I'm trying to think of the phrase of um suspend I'm trying to eliminate suspense is what I'm trying to get at some little Tongue Tied getting there but I'm trying to eliminate the suspense and just tell you outright as point blank as I possibly can but my personal uh calculation is and trying to figure out what we should do here so um similarly to the other after Thea variance I don't know that it would be fair um to just dismissively say no it's got to regardless of what it costs you regardless of what the time involved it's got to come out like that that's you know um but on the other hand we do need to get to a finalized agreement here on what's going to happen and uh I just want to eliminate this suspense and just let you know that if this had come to us through a regular variance process um I cannot see how this would have been approved at all like this is explicitly prohibited in this Village and to be honest studies that were done showed that the village is safer when we have frontages that are not enclosed because um uh you have neighbors who were then able to um essentially provide additional coverage of the property in terms of just eyeballs or maybe have a ring camera whatever it is um having an uncovered Frontage uh is was clearly presented to us as a village that would be safer as opposed to if all the properties were allowed to button up basically um and there was several reasons for that not the least of which was access to uh Witnesses which is its own deterrent for criminal Behavior because in an environment where you have you know a like uh eight foot fence with with no line of sight through it right like a completely um uh oblique uh side there uh it would be um as soon as someone would scale that fence or be in the property there's nobody outside the property who has any idea that there's somebody on the property that shouldn't be there and for me looking at that video I that was like a clear evidentiary case of of uh the intention almost like backfiring a little bit to your point this is Adriana ranguren 149 Northeast 87 Street um I shared other videos that video the fence was open it was not closed it was open because we had our son's birthday and we were like blocks away and when I saw The Ring um notice then I ran home and the as you can see the fence the whole where where the car comes in it was open it was not closed and even being open nobody can see it unless you know our neor neighbors know that that's those are not our kids but the most important one was the one that I shared the several ones that I shared without a fence and it was the cars breaking in um one of the um a a a men that he walked on the backyard he opened the door of our backyard and at 2:00 a.m. in the morning he was hiding in in the backyard because there were helicopters looking for that man and he was on our backyard with without offense and also we have had another situation that I shared all that time that we met that was another car breaking to one of our neighbors he had a loaded gun in his car so that person grabbed the loaded gun he stole it and then he went after to our house as well and I mean other other neighbors they don't have um fences but I cannot see it you know I'm maybe I'm inside of my house and having a fence does not mean also the design it has like 50% it's just like in the middle and then you can see you can see everything from up and then the bottom you can see feet you can see head you just cover this part pretty much and like I was saying and the purpose of our fence it was because of all those situations we didn't feel safe and we understand that you know portal has a historic and um you know way of seeing the the village of being open and green our house has green space more than 25% in front and the coradino group even they they gave um you know recommendation for approval because it's placed in a good place um it has green and then the pro the purpose is just for safety to keep safe our family that we have had several situations and the main purpose of having your home is to feel safe and that's how I want to feel and how my kids want you know they want to feel they feel safer we have my husband works at night and he travels and I'm by myself with my kids and with now having it it's a whole it's a different story for me being alone at home for two weeks maybe when he travels or at night so that is the purpose why we're here the material is an approved material that you know the last time it was said that it wasn't but then after reviewing it with Kimberly it is an approv material the situation here is that same as our first neighbors you know they we are growing it's a it's a it's a village that is changing and then I have we have seen other houses that they have fences last time we also spoke I was told that we there were no fences in in the area and we drove with our kids around the entire weekends and their fences so we are not the only ones that are you know that think that this is an important measure for their safety their right of you know having privacy or the right for for being safe in your house and that's the right that we want to have and that's why we're presented I shared different videos and um we shared our our story so we appreciate your time for this yeah thank you very much I appreciate it um I'm going to go to the uh continue with the committee um I think safety is something that I think is Paramount um in any Community I think safety is something that you know before anything else safety is number one right because before permeability before drainage before SE the sewer I mean we could talk about SE the sewer all day but if you feel like people are coming up to your door and you're alone for weeks at a time with two little boys you don't care about flooding that's that's that like that that goes down on the priority list I think number one for all of our residents in eleral I want you all to feel safe that's number one um we can talk about and maybe somebody else from the count from the committee might bring up you know the or whatever um but I think as far as safety um safety is something that I think is Paramount just as a resident I think that's number one as a resident so um and who else from the committee I have a question I I remember this from the last Planning and Zoning meeting um and something you said just kind of uh made me think the so the material is an approved material we were concerned about I know the material and the height so now is the height the only concern um this is new news to me I didn't I had not have that conversation with Kimberly um so that no she did not pass that information on to me but um so I I would I would trust so according to you the material and according to your knowledge as you last analyzed this issue the material and the height are issues yeah that that was what we had before you last time and and I believe that Adriana is pointing out that there was an update she had a conversation with Kimberly actually I I asked the mayor because I couldn't see it on the website to share the agenda uh and then here on page number which number is this one page 405 of the coradino uh report it says exceeds exceeds 4 Ines in height but constructed of allowed materials aluminium so the material was right after our first uh meeting then we went and we did our homework and then it was it is there it says constructed of allowed materials and I know the mayor does his research so Mr Mayor this is correct so the only issues that so I remember we highlighted all of these issues and then you were going to I suppose go back and talk to your contractor and explore different options as to how this could be changed so that it was at least more in compliance than not have you made any changes to the plan or are we just looking at the fence as it existed before so you're not changing anything so we told you the height was a problem the placement was a problem the material was a problem and you haven't changed the height you haven't changed the placement but you have found out that the material is one that is allowed right yes we didn't want to make any changes because we want to go as you know the route that it is oh not not make any changes I I miss said that but um explore different plans or different options that were available to you well the the height is going to be challenging to cut it without incurring in more expenses okay you know this already putting a fence was a you know like a a financial burden for us so if we try to cut it then it's it's going to be more expensive I get that I have two boys as well I know they're pretty active and they need to be enclosed sometimes yeah I mean the the as as we were saying our main point is safety I mean they they do you think your contractor would be interested and remedying let's say we prescribe a remedy for this tonight that'll allows you to keep a fence right maybe not this fence but a fence the contractor who put you in this position I remember this from the last conversation is he someone that you think would be interested in remedying this situation with I mean because uh in my mind I mean so just understand from our P just speak for myself from my perspective sitting up here there are certain responsibilities I have to the residents and there are certain responsibilities I do not have and so um and it's not to be harsh or or cold or anything like that but really your issue continues this is what I saying last time your issue is really with a contractor I mean you know it sounds like you sought out a professional sought advice and the advice you got was not right for this Village so so um uh you know the fence looks nice uh so I have every reason to think that the person who did the work you know does good work I'm a little concerned with how fast you were saying the fence went up that's a little bit concerning about how fast that was able to be accomplished um just in terms of quality of construction um but it's been up for how long now a year a year okay so you've been through one full hurricane season we've been through a few good squalls and things like that have you had it like is it is it is it Loose is it wobbly is it okay um so so if we are able to arrive at any kind of a remedy tonight I mean I I see your contractor as being part of the solution in terms of yes you know hey as a favor for not suing you to do this for free like help me out okay okay um and uh you know it's not um not coming from a place of of you know judgment or punishment or anything like that is just what can we allow understanding that whatever our decision is tonight will have consequences for you one way or the other so um so un bearing that responsibility is also something that weighs heavily for me personally um uh we'll see what we can figure out here thank you very much uh council person member her bomb anybody else from the committee yes sir yes Mr Mayor counc Winters thank you Juan Adriana AR uh arangan yes um for speaking with us today in Sharing experience um it was wonderful to meet you the other day it was a lovely House of visit it's nice to meet your boys finally which one's seven and which one's nine you're seven and you're nine and who plays soccer um I want to take this opportunity to address uh your situation and respond to the concerns raised by the council members here uh first and foremost I want to acknowledge the challenging and dangerous circumstances your family has faced the incidents you described armed trespassers individuals hiding on your property other safety threats are alarming and unacceptable no family should live in fear for their safety and your decision to install fence is a reflection of your commitment to protect your loved ones uh council person bbom expressed concerns that the fence could make your property less secure suggesting that individuals could scale it and remain unnoticed um I understand this perspective and I believe there's one important reality is that without a fence trps can just walk onto the property unimpeded the fence serves as a powerful deterrent making it's significantly less likely that someone would attempt to trespass Additionally you use security cameras correct yes so that also ensures your property remains monitored while whether with a fence or without a fence uh but your less likely to have someone walk on your property with a fence there uh this is um a comment regarding visibility in your property for neighborhood neighbors and government authorities uh while the visibility might provide some sense of community oversight is crucial to recognize the Fourth Amendment to the Bill of Rights which protects your right to privacy and shields you from unreasonable searches this includes curtilage around your property the decision to safeguard your home with a fence is as your right as a homeowner and I stand by your family to protect it and I do believe the Bill of Rights of the United States is more powerful than our code here and our code is outdated I also want to commend you for the quality of the fence um council person Martin confirmed it was constructed with approved materials demonstrating that you took care to ensure it met safety aesthetic standards and I would like to see what council department Hermon has in mind for having the um person who installed it uh change anything or fix something I want to hear more um as where was I um while the priting process was not followed which is a problem the outcome does reflects your intent to do things correctly and your responsibly under the circumstances uh one Adriana uh your actions were driven by necessity and I support your right to feel safe in your home every person should be able to feel safe in their home I hope this conversation serves as a reminder to all the uh people here in elportal and anyone here that we have to ensure that every family in our community feels protected and supported um thank you for trusting us on the council thank you thank thank you very much council person Winters uh anybody else from the council Committee hearing none um anybody from the audience about this particular come on up go over there say your name and address for the record all right hey uh I'm George Alvarez I live on 165 talking to the mic me please I live at 165 Northwest 88 Street uh I'm um got you guys seem like such nice people and I I just have to kind of air my opinion about fences in the front of yards there there are a few in Al Pell and they were granted variances no doubt guys God knows how many decades ago uh couple doors down from you on the on the Alley of 87th got that grand old property looks like a looks like it belongs in Bordeaux they have a fence have no idea how that was allowed where it is but I just think it's uh if we want to talk Aesthetics we want to talk height the three-foot white picket fence I don't know some stylish fences but and look I'm sorry that you guys it sounds like an inordinate amount of crime or attempted crime has somehow gone right to your address these things happen as as life on Earth has has told us it happens but I think six- foot fences on the front of yards throughout El prel is no longer elpel I think that's starts to feel you said something about those houses in Coconut Grove everything starts to feel very secluded uh I I've also read studies about that that safety is not gained by those kind of fences safety is gained by awareness of neighbors forgive me I'm a little I'm a little nervous I don't like talking in front of people and there's a whole lot of them here you're doing great I'm pretty for I'm pretty sure that my real voice is at least one octave lower than what I sound like right right now um listen I just I hope that there's a good compromise I hope that your safety or your feelings of safety can be achieved I just think the the couple of fences that I you know I've see these exter these concrete exterior kind of pony walls uh I've seen some some less than 6ft fences here and there but I mean n 98 90 I mean it's probably more than 99% of the houses in alel don't have that now I don't live in Sherwood Forest kind of wish I did but I think the rest of us in Al Pell have just the same right to the charm that Sherwood Forest has and I I I I know Sherwood Forest has a little different kind of scope to you know who you talk to but I um I think it's it's not ideal for us to give variances uh for whatever reason to these tall fences the my my neighbors who have got fences and choose to do so for privacy and security presumably bad dog in one case I mean their six foot fence starts way back from their property line it starts in line with the front edges of their house it it it secures the two sides on on their house you know what I'm saying right that achieves safety that achieves privacy it may not achieve the extra I don't know 400 500 square feet that somebody may choose to have for their own feelings or their own aesthetic but I do think that um we have a larger consider ation to the rest of the community and we start seeing those big fences in the front of el pel we're not going to like it so my two cents I I hope you guys come to a nice compromise so thanks thank you very much I appreciate it um we have somebody else there and to and also to add to his point while one of our neighbors uh comes up uh we know our neighbors and that's why we have some neighbors supporting us I had one other neighbor she had a little boy so she had to leave um but we know them and the problem is our street it also great thank you for bringing that up we have a house next to our house is abandon and there's an alley and you know there is like a gray area we also have like a bus stop that a lot of people that they don't leave that they go maybe to school to work or something there're they're there's just a lot of food traffic that they're not really neighbors so we know our neighbors and we have our neighbor here that she's here to support us all right my name is how are you uh Alina Balano I live in 25th 87th Street I've been in El Portal for eight years now um I love it and I know that we are different from other communities and I love that um I don't know if a fence changed that in my sense I respect your opinion um his house is even elevated so you can still see the house if that's what we want I know the fence change what you see um but also papers on a drivew change what we see and we pre-approved before and I think it's okay I think we can go um knowing that things change uh the era change uh um but I think this is not mud this is security I had problems before in my house um they steal things from my car many times um some people want wanted to get in when my son was alone he's a teenager I called the police my son went to my backyard and he went into the roof leaving my dog inside I was not home I was having dinner I have cameras um I we couldn't catch uh because one the ring was with no battery because it changed a lot but my son he was 15 years old looking at someone in the two people in the front trying to get in and he went outside and he called the police himself and I was super afraid I am super afraid it's not that I live with fear because maybe I have a strong personality and I come from Argentina where insecurity is normal but um I respect and it's not nice to live in fear and they asked me many times to pick up their package from the door so I can keep it because people steal their packages too um I have a little wall in my porch which people don't see my packages but their door is right in front and you can see the living room uh when you're passing by so um I just say that I live in the neighbor I'm in the same street and I like the fence thank you thank you thank you very much I appreciate it come on up yeah and also regarding the packages well Diego comes up um as you can see our request for the variance we never said about packages because we want to focus on our priority which is safety for our family hello I'm still Diego Castro and I still live in 150th 87th uh I'm uh literally their front door neighbor um the reason we met now thinking about this uh was because police showed up to their house maybe two or three months right before uh right after we moved in um and they were away on vacation or something something so the police wasn't answering like they weren't getting an answer from the police um so I showed up that they know they asked me do you know these people I was like no but I can try to get get a hold of them we shared a chat and um and we did eventually uh we I left them a note as well letting them know that the police had been there because their alarm had been triggered by somebody trying to intrude their house all right so um that raised a little bit of my ner I do not have children as I've already mentioned but um it it we do live in one of the most transited uh streets in the whole neighborhood um it it's not um it's not the same feeling as 88th I I wish I could live the same way as in you know um in the forest or on 88th um but we don't we don't we live in the most Transit one that doesn't even have sidewalks Etc so uh to comment on the visibility of of the house um I've seen these two kids for The Last 5 Years um I've seen them go out with their jerseys I've seen them um play with their soccer balls and I can still see them through the higher side of the fence and uh we have the opportunity to say hello to each other every single day or every other day um I think we've actually um I've run into the major where he was there I was coming back from a run and then um councilman Charles as well um it's just because we we share um not only the street but we share sort of the same concerns about life um they have two children um they've had people breaking into their house they've tried to break into our house as well I didn't know that this would eventually happen so I never saved the video so the people trying to actually open up my car um but if if that would have added or helped in any way I would have brought it here um I think their house is beautiful I think it's been beautiful since I moved in and I think it's the aesthetic of it the fence matches their gutters it matches their garage color I I think it's a it's a beautiful house um and again we do live next to a abandoned uh multif family uh building um not only from this beautiful Baux looking house as well that's also abandoned but uh there there's a lot of people that linger around that area and um again the Bus St Etc so I I feel that um in this case a variance instead of a of a regular rule would certainly apply because it is a special occasion now um they they we've shared this stor so we again we have a chat in the in the in the street and I I believe that there their safety is Paramount to any aesthetic you know it's um it is more important for them to be saved their children to be saved than for um you know uh for for anything to do the Aesthetics of a street that for right now we've we fought you know on the speed of the traffic which we appreciate the police they they've done a great job on pulling people over um they're they're they're doing that but um also the foot traffic the the the regular traffic that goes through there it does expose our homes more so than you know 88th or 89th etc etc so I just wanted to throw that in there and and say that I do like the fence I I I don't necessarily need one I don't feel that way uh but I've never had somebody hide in my backyard with the same circumstance but that's my my grand assault thank you thank you very much um anybody else from the yeah on say and you'll be next after name and address for the record uh yeah still Marcus Leone still 456 Northeast 88 Street um the story you told made me remember three separate instances that happened to my house and then I liked what councilman wyers said about the right to privacy and the right to security but when we first moved in um a man a young man came to our front door trying to break into our home got caught on ring camera police came news came I had to run out in the middle of the night with a shotgun in my hand trying to see what was going on cuz my wife woke me up it's terrifying um we've had our cars burglarized I've had a watch stolen my wife's wallet uh cards stolen all of this to say that I think that the individual's right to privacy and Security in this neighborhood is your decision and I've driven by your house and I think 87th much like 88th Street prevents a presents a very unique situation because you receive the brunt of the traffic you will now and you will in the future and you receive all most of the pedestrian traffic MH I think that that's that warrants a little bit of special consideration and I think that especially with two young kids you know we're we're not we don't have kids yet but we will in the future I mean I think that trumps anything if that what's that's what makes you feel safe I think that's a pretty important consideration for the council to make and I know that if I was in that situation you know luckily we have a gigantic dog that you know I think it would be fun if somebody came to the house but to let them uh experience yes you you met Luke he's wonderful he's big he's a very big boy but short of that uh I just want to voice my support for you guys I know the community did the same for me so whatever you guys need feel safe short of a turet or something I hope the council considers that favorably so we appreciate it thank you Miss Leone see your name and address please for the record hi U my name is JP Cunningham I also live on 87th Street um I'm at 129 uh Northeast 87 Street I actually uh when I was born we lived uh in those abandoned uh multif family homes on uh 87 street so I've been here since you know forever um uh I'm very sorry for what's happening to your family and stuff like that and uh I can't really speak as to that individual um uh situ situation um but I'd like to address the larger context uh having lived here all my life um so I'm also ashamed to admit that this is my very first council meeting uh like I'm just just now starting to you know get involved and and such um we live right down the street we were very surp surprised to see that off fence was was there um we were like wow they allow that now uh we we just thought that was like a like a big no you know uh you know we've known about this for years um we also uh me and my wife you know our front yard if you guys have been you know uh in front of our house we have you know one of the biggest front yards in the neighborhood and we kind of think that that's our safety you know what I mean we we think like if people want to come do something to our house they have to cross the gauntlet and we have all the nosy neighbors in in the neighborhood you know what I mean so for us that is a point of safety uh you know I've I've my next door neighbor she's been my neighbor since I was you know four years old and she views everything that goes on um another thing is that what if you know what if everybody just starts building a fence you know what I mean like I'm pretty sure what attracted most of the people who have moved here in the past like 15 20 years it wasn't all the fences you know what I mean uh I really uh I I don't think that this neighborhood would be what it is with all those fences we've all driven in surrounded neighborhoods where every front yard a fence and we usually Drive pretty fast through those neighborhoods because those aren't safe neighborhoods you know what I mean so uh I I understand and I and I hope some sort of reasonable compromise can can be made but if we do start allowing that for everyone it's not going to be the same neighborhood at all you know what I mean and it's not going to be the open neighborhood that everybody wants to invest and you know buy three you know $3 million houses and all that stuff you know whether you're for that or not but this neighborhood will not be the the welcoming neighborhood that it is if everybody starts building fences um and that's it that's my piece thanks thank you very much I appreciate that anybody else from the audience no hearing none um councel or committee yeah just quickly I'll start a timer on myself um I know okay you're good you're good well I'm just trying to be respectful we got lots to cover here tonight so okay so uh so quickly um I see a unique need in this application I see it okay um and then I acknowledge that technically what we're talking about in terms of specifically the transient pedestrian traffic that's specifically what we're talking about is the transient pedestrian traffic I ride the nine bus fairly frequently actually down uh into downtown um so in the mornings it's you know uh professionals nurses things like this you know kind of showing up at the bus stop between you know eight and 10 in the morning um but it's that late night traffic um it's people want there are people who will Wander from North Beach Miami Beach and they will walk 79 Street and then they'll keep walking and keep walking they'll make it over the Little River and then they'll get to Second Avenue and look North and look South and decide to walk in one of those directions right so I don't put it uh past the realm of normal activity that you'd have completely transient completely stranger uh people you know encountering that bus stop specifically right there Northeast Second Avenue in general uh people trying to Traverse North once they hit the canal system it could be frustrated for someone who's been on foot for the entire day the entire week the entire month so uh 87th looks like a AC okay I know Miami Avenue is that way so they're trying to get to Miami Avenue right so now we have the entire Street of 87 Street with the unique need for fences in the front of the property so I'm trying to imagine what 87 Street looks like with Fen is lining the entire property so I'll just say that final points um Saving Grace is one the design it's a nice looking fence it is set back if this was anywhere close to the street this would not even be a discussion we would have had you taking that fence down at the last meeting immediately I'll just say that so so I you know as far as the material and placement and design I mean it's a great looking fence and it's in a good spot and it it works now comes the issue of why do we prohibit such fences why would we do that and that is because of a absolute comprehensive study uh town halls and everything else that brought us to the conclusion that for the overall longterm health of the village that we would not allow Frontage closures specifically you know fences right and so that's where we are right now so I acknowledge a unique need from what we're talking about here tonight I acknowledge that we're talking about a reasonable design okay so now I got to figure everything El out I'll leave you with this and it's the very single worst suggestion I've ever made it's I'm in my seventh Year by the end I'll be at eight years I misspoke earlier but in the seven years um this will be the single worst suggestion that I've ever made okay so in terms of uh keeping the fence with no uh with no conditions whatsoever um outside of this one in my mind I'm like we'll just put a lean on the house and then the lean will be removed when you take down the fence basically right um and then you enjoy the fence as long as you're living in the house and then when it comes time to sell it you take down the fence lean disappears no problem right so in my mind that is one of the only workable Solutions I've arrived at as we've been talking about this to let you just keep the fence in my mind that's where I'm at now I don't think that's a really good suggestion because that would require an unbelievable amount of faith on your part that that the village is going to do right by that agreement right um I won't be here when I'll just tell you guys all this is my last uh term in office it will be eight years by the time I'm done and so um um uh so I I that's why I'm saying I won't be here when it comes time for you to sell that house so regardless of whatever let's say we're best friends and you trust me implicitly what does that have to do with anything when we get to that time so um I'll let everybody else speak but right now my mind I'm trying to figure out how to make this painless I'm also trying to figure out how to honor my responsibility of village and then and additionally just consider us first starting with what is the best for everyone here specifically you right and then consider what might be best for everybody else but this is your application and I I am considering your needs in this above uh anybody else is so thank you very much anybody else from the committee um ju just a quick comment I I remember the conversation that we had last time and all of those arguments that I put forward remain um but I do love the fact that I didn't have to restate very much of it because the gentleman in the back did so I do think that there's a reason why we have been vehemently against having fences in the frontage especially fences of that height I do think that um of course I I value safety and I do value individuals um feelings of safety as it relates to the way that they can enjoy their property but I also take some guidance from the neighbors around who say that they don't feel that they need offense for for security reasons um and I do think that there's variability as far as comfort is concerned um I did view those videos that you sent um and I I definitely understand that uh in experience it and viewing it are two different things but there wasn't very much that I saw that made me say that um that offence of that height was necessarily obviated I do think that the research studies that are out there that uh the gentleman from the audience so kindly um referred to and as we have all on this body have read um have shown that there are certain things that do impact safety there are certain things that impact the perception of safety as it relates to a community I think everybody uh can agree that there's some discussion around whether or not fences actually um project the the opposite project a a village that is unsafe that someh somehow everyone needs to kind of wall themselves into these small little enclaves um so all of those reasons that have been stated before uh in your last meeting I think they still stand for me I do still agree with councilman herbal that your contractor should have told you this um and I think in the last meeting we suggested that you contact that contractor and see what remedies were available to you as far as him helping you uh remediate this issue uh hopefully you've done that uh but for me the analysis hasn't changed as to why we continue to say that it is very important to make sure that we do not have these extremely tall fences in the front of the property that is my opinion I know there might be other people on the council that do not share that opinion but one thing I always want to do is make you 100% clear where I stand so I asked you that question before as far as what has changed because I wanted to know whether or not my analysis on the situation um needed to be reworked around any new information thank you for sharing with me about the materials used but I do think the placement and the height um still pose very real issues for me as it relates to um granting the variance on my end thank you very much uh vice mayor Martin any other questions or comments from the council yes sir Mr Mayor go ahead so the residents that have come up I want to thank you for actually taking time to speak on behalf whether for or against each person here tonight is it makes a big difference when we hear from the residents and they tell us exactly how they feel and I know we had both people that were for you people that were against you um so I'm going to start here by thanking Diego Marcus and JB for sharing their perspectives um each of your contributions reflect the thoughtfulness and diversity of opinions in our community and I want to respond to some of these comments directly Diego I appreciate you bringing up the incident when the police were called and the family was not home but on vacation it highlights the very real need for an additional security measures I also value your observations about the fence's design the fact that it was constructed with a visible top section shows that the the family are were mindful of the fence's impact for the neighborhood uh prioritizing safety um you're right 87th street is a main artery in albertal which brings both benefit and unique challenges this makes it all the more critical for families like their angin did I get it right this time no okay to have a sense of security in their own home uh Marcus thank you for your support and for sharing your own experience uh criminals on your property are an unfortunate reminder of the safety concerns we all face uh your agreement with the importance of privacy and security is a powerful endorsement of this family and their right to protect their home it's hardening it's hardening to hear that you feel the same way and I appreciate your recognition of my earlier comments on the issue uh JB I hear your concerns brother and I want to talk about the broader implications of allowing fences in the neighborhood your point points about nosy neighbors being a form of safety is well taken um as Community vigilance can indeed help deter crime uh we must balance that with the individual rights of our residents uh their individual situation is a prime example of why such a balance is necessary because they face threats to their safety that go beyond what nosy neighbors can address um and the question of why if what if if they build a fence what if every everyone starts building a fence I think it's important to note that not every family in alport toal has the same safety concerns as this family this case is unique and deserves consideration within that context that said I agree that we must maintain the character of our neighborhood and any changes should be made thoughtfully and within the framework of the Community Values and going through the correct way with the government um I'd also like to address um council person about a prior town hall meeting about those fences which happened 8 years ago how 6 years ago uh the decision reflects the commitment to preserving the character of alal and it's clear that the the family's case presents unique circumstances um so the suggestion of a to place a lean on the property is very inventive um allowing the fence to remain until the house is sold and requiring the removal of the fence at that time in order to remove the lean it's an interesting idea um I have concerns about how such a solution might complicate things for the family in the future a lean could create Financial or logistical challenges during the sale it might set a precedent that could be difficult to manage in similar situations uh I believe that we should focus on a solution that prioritizes this family safety in respect their immediate needs while introducing uh future burdens um the situ ation highlights an opportunity to revisit our codes which we've already spoken about tonight in earlier conversations to ensure that they are both modern and reflective of what our residents desire and need uh security and privacy are fundamental rights and we must find a way to protect them without compromising the unique charm and investment value of this Village thank you again thank you thank you very much uh council person win anybody else from the committee yeah never miss an opportunity when talking about crime to remind everybody that if you feed shelter clothe and educate every single human being to age 26 you don't get your car broken into at 3: in the morning I grew up in an extremely conservative family and I've heard the arguments of self- responsibility and not wanting to pay for anybody else's things but I have found specifically through managing restaurants honestly I've managed a lot of uh young Petty criminals to be perfectly honest and and many of those cases um if they had had just a few more resources in their youth they would not be finding themselves wandering the streets at 3: in the morning uh or engaging in violent criminal activity um and so um I just always want to remind everybody that as a global Community if we simply take care of people then we don't have all the drama and specifically for managing restaurants for 25 years there is nothing more expensive than drama it is is the single most expensive thing that exists anywhere in the universe drama is the most expensive so um uh having said all of that um uh all points taken and I did say publicly that was the worst idea I ever had he did you're absolutely right I like it though all right thank you thank you very much anybody else from the council no um do I have a motion to approve the variance as is I motion to approve the variance do I have a second that I'm just curious come on now you got a vote am I the only is my lean suggestion the only suggestion for remedy uh from the days does anybody uh at all have any other suggestions for remedy out side of strict like just strictly approval on the variance I'm just curious I mean I I'll I'll name three other options if if we're not there yet yeah Council personent I I would suggest that you speak with the city attorney's office before going or the village attorney's office before imposing that remedy into explore to see if that's possible well to be perfectly honest I don't intend to uh pursue that remedy honestly um so so uh I I really just use the uh example of that possibility as um I wanted to illustrate one my willingness to find a solution in all of this two um to establish that it's going to be incredibly difficult for us to get to just a strict approval on this and three maybe to um uh I don't know um demonstrate a need for perhaps even more imaginative Solutions than the one I mentioned so there was um some levity to the suggestion I will say that I try not to be too uh light up here on the deas because you know we're this is business um but there was quite a bit of levity to the suggestion sure not uh council person irom I appreciate that actually that's not a terrible suggestion but it is it's not it's not it's not terrible but I would like to know more would like to know more about it it's too much risk for the homeowner to assume which I mean go back to restaurants again assume nothing ever um it's too much risk I I mean as my own suggestion I acknowledge that it's simply too much risk from the homeowner stake to put that amount of faith in the village I mean let's say they wanted to to take out a home uh a home equity loan uh to do another Improvement they're going to be denied the home equity loan because there's a lean on the property so I mean right there you're already at um a a denial of um pleasure out of the property uh in the event that they would want to get a loan that they're going to be denied for because of my uh insane suggestion thank you yeah I hear you I hear you my there's a motion is there a second um I I haven't got to that I I hear you I hear you I I still think that sometimes it seems like sometimes there's things that come up and then we don't really dive deep to understand them and to understand how far we can take them or if we can or if we can't or the legal ramifications well what I'm looking for is what I'm looking for is a promiser what I'm looking for is a promissary agreement that that fence comes down before a new homeowner it comes into a grandfathered fence that's out of cod that I mean that's I mean I don't know I'm trying TR some way and find a solution which is what I'm understand which is what I'm understanding which is what I'm saying that I'm actually giving you prophecy here council person Ur I'm saying that it's not so far when you were saying it was ridiculous when you said it when I kind of heard and broke it down within my mind I said well it's something that maybe we should ask the attorney about because it may be something in the future that may come back up so I would like to kind of know once and for all is this something that is completely out of the realm or is this something that possibly could be in the realm because if it comes up beginning the future I want to already have the answers to it I think a lot of times things that things come up to us and we kind of like throw things out there but we don't really go after them and then they'll come back up a year later or two years later and we still don't have a definite answer or or it's not defined to us so that's the only thing I'm kind of thinking like it might not be a terrible idea um with that being said is there a second for the original I like giving people their chances I will second the motion yeah wait all right so we have to do a roll call council person Winters yes no yes so it was motioned by winter second by bbom roll call member Winters yes yes member Lightfoot Ward I'm still trying to figure it out go further go further no we have to it's V yeah we have to vote all I have to vote right now she's asking if she can vote last no oh she wants to vote last no the the chair votes last mhm can she wants to vote second to last then the vice chair votes second to last all right so we we the way member Winters yes member bbom not in the present State I vote no member light foot Ward I want to be last cannot be last the chair the not only the chair is last the vice chair is second and last the way we vote is we vote with the newest member and then we vote um by alphabetical order that's how we I'm still next yes you are I I I let one slide before you but you're next no this time okay because you made me vote when I didn't want to vote you have your own vote anyways um Vice chair Martin no Sharon Nickerson yes motion fails all right I'd like to make another motion um I'd like to make a motion to or or or do I it has to have a motion yeah it has to be from somebody else I wanted to ask if somebody would make a motion I'm thinking that um I may want to explore what uh Council irom said further not only for this situation but just for future knowledge um so can I get a motion from somebody to have this come back to the next planning and zoning committee meeting why because I want to explore what uh not only what what council person Urban was talking about but I also want to explore what kind of came up before as far as how far because I was looking at the fence and I the family experiencing any citation uh activity presently from code enforcement specifically is this costing you money in terms of Code Enforcement citations um since for example the last time we deferred to this meeting have you experienced any Financial um penalties whatsoever from the village while this has been being sorted out no okay that's question I have yeah I also want to I was looking at the thank you very much council person I was also looking at the um fence and kind of like the way it's it's made and I really want to know um and talk to you know not only the homeowner but I want to see as as far as how far they could cut it down um with that possibility also because I was looking at how it was how it's created and how it's set up and it seems like she could only go down but so far it seemed like that because there's a big bulk part like a little bit further down like at the top there's like a top part and then there's like a extra top part and the extra top part is not like really like solid so maybe she can cut off that extra top part and go down to where like that bulk part is and um I don't know may I want her to speak to maybe her uh her contractor to see if that's able to be done because it seems like that's something that she might be able to handle and do really uh easily so I would like a motion from one of you guys to table this to the next meeting for those because of those two uh situations yeah if the family's not experiencing additional financial hardship from the village you know um while we go through this deferment process then I would be happy to move that uh this item be deferred to the next planning and zoning committee meeting I said second it um I have a roll call on the deferment Madam clerk roll call member winter yes member lifefood Ward yes member bbal yes Vice chair Martin yes chair Nickerson yes motion passes 5 to n okay we'll be in touch with you okay thank you very much thank you for your time and suggestions thank you um the next one we're moving back up to the new G4 you guys take care have a good night take care all right byebye bye bye welcome back now I sent you an email about russing Pelican too all right you guys the next one we're going to the new G4 this is the uh we have two separate uh Parcels 176 Northwest 88 Street we're going to take them one at a time um well this what we can do we can hear about both of them and we'll vote on them one at a time what about that that's fine is that good so um if we can have an applicant come up over here yeah spread your put one here and put one over here and go ahead uh Miss Hammond uh 176 Northwest 88th Street um to the two different Parcels let me ask you this Miss ham the two different Parcels actually just go ahead just go ahead and begin I got you I think I know the answers our applicant tonight is 88th Street homes LLC and they're requesting site plan approval for the construction of new residences at 176 Northwest 88th Street at the time at today's date um there are actually two Parcels because they have very recently been divided um however they still share the same address so there's parcel a at 176 Northwest 88 Street and there's parcel B um the site um for each home is 9,800 ft and is currently um one of the properties currently has a single family home on it the other one is vacant um the this each parcel um as I said were recently created by dividing one larger lot into two legally conforming lots and um prop and the residential use is allowed in this zoning set area um the proposed homes um are two stories and they're just slightly different in overall size of square footage and there are four bedroom and three bath houses with with two car garages and covered Terra um looking at the development standards they they do meet the development standards and not requesting variances and the proposed design is rather contemporary but um it does fit in to proportion and scale in this residential area and staff is recommending approval for both of these homes thank you very much Miss hamers I appreciate it um Council the council questions and comments back up hearing seeing none we will yes oh we do okay can we see the designs please that are on the boards this is a tear down old and do a new right councelor whenever you guys get a chance just Jump On In thank you for uh presenting these designs here um taking the time to show them to us um I appreciate the effort that you put towards the project and willingness to share it with us um I apologize I wasn't able to meet with you in person this weekend when I came to the house site um I have talked with some of your neighbors and they have shared a few concerns about the modern design and the compatability with the character of the area um our zoning guidelines you emphasize consistency and compatibility and well understanding the VIS your vision and respect your rights as a property owner I'd like to explore if there's other uh versions or different ideas to incorporate elements that better blend in with the surrounding neighborhood um I I I recognize the modern designs have been approved a few places in eleral but we've seen a lot of backlash when they got approved from residents and in this case I I think you guys have done a a a good job is trying to get a certain direction but I'm I'd like to hear your thoughts on why you went this way and how you feel it fits with elportal and the houses around it you introduce yourself my name is Patty Hernandez and I'm one of the owners of AD Street homes this is Scott kitchen also part owner of 8 Street homes and the architect question okay um so that's a pretty heavy uh way to start here um I would say that we've put a lot of consideration into the design um uh starting with uh preserving as as as as much of the uh vegetation as possible um we we uh we we laid this out in in a way that's linear as you can see um as a way to preserve the specimen trees um we felt like uh we were actually excited about what we saw when driving through the neighborhoods early on and that there were there was precedent in in many cases uh with a lot of the elements that we're using such as the low pitch roof um we feel it's like a vernacular modern if you will um and when we met previously with this Council we were asked not not to have like a cookie cutter like um you know repli rep replica of one another so we we uh we put a lot of time and effort into arriving um at what you're at what we're presenting here today and we're we're confident that it's uh they're both homes that will nourish families and and and and serve as bettering the neighborhood and the community so I I I want to just quickly ask um Planning and Zoning on part H with consistency and compatibility um what made you uh come to your decision on that I would say um they kept within they're not requesting variances um they there is again um as the architect said um some elements of the design that are already existing and some of the the Legacy Homes if you would call them um they they did a good job of mimicking um some of those aspects of the design are there other homes and and I know that there are a lot of different styles in the village so that you know kind of L lends itself to to opening um up to some contemporary designs that that still respect um the size and scale um I think that that that goes a long way to compatibility in an existing neighborhood and also I I believe um you're going to be doing your best to um respect the site um as far as nature and the trees and yeah preservation of trees is very important here in alportel not trying to cause any blowback here I'm just I I wanted to um really investigate or see that everything was investigated towards it because when I drove down the street and I visit your contractors this weekend I I didn't see I know El portel has some but that street I didn't see anything else similar to this um I I just want to know you know where it's at and if if it's if there's any possibility that it can be altered at all to meet more of what's we see in alel is we have to obviously look at what the rest of the citizens are going to say and how they're and we have to represent them and I did have neighbors contct cont me um about the property and that's the only reason I'm I'm saying this and and they they were privy to our designs yes they they said they were extremely modern which you know it doesn't mean it's a bad thing but it's they they they didn't want it so modern but this is the first we hear of any of that feedback which is why we're curious about specific we nine months into this now yeah yeah did well I'm very happy that you guys got approved to split the lot I was there to vote on it to split I I think you should build two houses there and I'm I'm total agreeing with it uh is there anyone in the audience here that wanted to say something well I'll move um after the council speaks okay then I'll move to the audience like I do sorry about that no you're good you're good no problem if I could uh okay if I could just take a couple more um uh observations or or um um attributes to the to the pro to the project and the design how we've designed it um we all know uh you know the lot coverage uh is important um uh we we're we intentionally uh stayed you know more than double the distance from any any side yard um intentionally um and by by developing this in a linear sense we're we're able to have very nice um private pool deck and and garden that that that the uh the eventual homeowner ERS would uh be able to benefit from um uh additionally uh the U the lock coverage is we're well under the maximum when including not just the footprint but the the driveway uh we have a concrete block uh Turf block uh driveway which is 40% permeable um we're taking every possible measure to make this as efficient and As Nice of a development as possible okay just wanted to mention that mayor okay so um welcome thank you for being here yeah go ahead absolutely Dr Le word if you'd like to El pel is a very El pel is a very unique City and all I see here is Spar y'all know what Spar is sure you do you remember the the the yeah Star Trek this is spark we are not spark we are a small village trying to stay a small village this is like I'm going to take this and run with it and my 37 years in in the village and all the beauty the natural beauty that we have comes in as a 3,31 year that will definitely make an imp impact on not only our taxes but also how we keep up our our um homes I'm 37 years in this Village and I stayed because it is a village it is not downtown it is not a farm it is not trying to do something in the wilderness this is going to look like oh if they could do it we'll do it too and El pel will never be El pel again in the in into my thoughts just doesn't match with the village so um uh so I only have two concerns um my first concern is simply about the roof line of the garage in terms of when I look at the design I I feel like the garage is is missing some sort of relief silhouette whatever you want to call it I don't have the the architecture of ulary but you know what I'm talking about the crown of the garage right that's parcel um well both Parcels um and then I will I have only one other concern and that is I am not afraid of modern architecture um there is modern architecture that exists in the village presently um and there will be new modern architecture showing up I know of one new construction it's modern architecture that's absolutely happening in Sherwood Forest um I actually find both of these properties to be uh quite unique and interesting I was glad to see that the height wasn't crazy I was glad to see that the mass wasn't crazy I was glad to see um the consideration of the setbacks and maintaining those those things my concern is actually the two properties right next to each other that's actually my concern um because it it I I have a concern that it would look like I know it's only two properties but if they are so congruent in design it looks like a many subdivision at that point it it becomes clear that a developer put these two properties here and I actually think that either one of these would be I mean I'll just say would be a great addition to the Village of Ville portal I do think that the garage needs some um some sort of uh addition to the silhouette just to it looks like as I look at it it just seems like it stands apart from the rest of the structure and that is purely um uh subjective right um that's simply my opinion um and so my concern is not so much with the design itself it I actually think the design from a modern architecture point of view does have a lot of features that actually do fit with elportal and with some modern architecture that's already here and it's a better example of modern architecture that fits with El portel than a couple of modern architecture properties that I could point to in the village right we fully agree yeah and so so my only remaining concern at that point becomes simply the fact that they have a mirroring effect when they're side by side and it interrupts in my opinion the oh that's nice to I mean the next thought is like I said I know it's only two properties but it has a subdivision feel to it when there when there's such mirrored designs so those are my only two concerns could I could I um yeah speak to that please so previously when we we need the mic on on this particular parcel you you you might remember um that some of the council uh people were here the the first time we met we actually had um on on this facade here on parcel a the um the the roof Bas essentially uh pitching on top of the garage now it's pulled a little bit forward just by virtue of the of the layout of the floor plan but it was it was more of just like a Gable on on this particular one and you know we we kind of modify that a little bit but I think it was the last time we met we we presented this and it was we were showered with approval well received okay um if we were to amend this and bring back the uh the Gable on the on the front of this one would that help differentiate between the two sides I mean the you know the two properties adjacent to each other I don't know because the mass of the properties overall is so mirrored I understand that the I understand that if you take the silhouette they're very different Silhouettes I see that you know one has more of a a it stands tall the other one is more subdued I completely see that they are two different roof lines they are two different floor like I see that but the masses of the of the structures are clearly mirrored um in terms of in terms of the just footprint and um and uh facade like the the the frontage right right they look like mirrors um properties like so that that literally is my largest concern that we would want to see um I'm glad I'm very I'm so glad that this is not a maxed out um Mass example with a 25- foot wall with no windows like I'm so glad that this is not like any my fear of modern architecture in terms of when I hear it that it's coming in is like Okay um like you know uh how much of a cube is this thing going to be right and none of that is really present in this with the exception of the garage I will say but um but what I'm trying what I'm what I'm I I really actually think uh both of these designs I I personally think they actually do work well with elportal I can see you know I've learned over the years to not rely too much on the rendition and use a little more imagination so I can see some vegetation growth in I can I and I greatly appreciate the the consciousness of in maintaining Green Space within and and going above and beyond what you had like what you the requirements were for the setback spe specifically on the side so my only remaining concern like honestly I I mean I understand that my com my complain about the garage is subjective like I get it like it's my opinion right so I'm not even really feeling that I would compel you to change the design I'm simply saying I have a concern that the garage looks like it's a separate piece from the rest of the house that's my only comment on it right my true concern lies in the two properties together um being like kind of a mirrored image of each other where it's just so and I'm sure that as an architect like you know this is your signature right and so you want people to make that connection that these are both like that's not the intent so but in my mind I'm sitting there thinking you know one when we have a lot a large lot like that first concern is someone's going to build an absolute monstrosity second concern is that someone's going to break up that lot turn it into two properties and that those properties are going to be cookie cutters what like the whole concept of cookie cutter is not so much in the design it's simply that it's one and then another it's the identical nature of the two as opposed to what when I think of cookie cutter I think of those first suburbs that were built you know so um uh so you think of a specific like two-story design and like I understand the concern it was presented in the initial meeting and that is why we came up with two sotin I see I do see that they I mean like I said both of these properties in my opinion are are great honestly um my only concern my biggest concern I will say is that with the two of them together now it it like it it it's like a distraction as you're walking down the street that like you're like oh I like it they it it really draws your attention as opposed to like let you just continue to be in the environment kind of I don't know if I'm explaining it right and I you know I don't know how much of a concern it'll rise to be we'll find out in voting but but those are my two only concerns okay okay so if I can just speak I know it's getting late guys um the the another attribute to the design that was that we felt was important to the neighborhood was to bring it down to scale at at at the front of the house okay this is why we have the two-story only towards the back and happens to be the the the private realm where the bedrooms are okay um so when you're when you're actually in front of that house and either house and you're looking you you don't even get a sense for the two story Beyond because it's a very shallow pitch roof you're only experiencing the scale of the front Y which is um congruent with the rest of the streets yeah in fact the email that I have with the designs in it and then now with image in the email it's a little bit more elevated and in this it's a little bit more we kind of like uh you know a little higher so I had to do a double take to see if it was the same design still put the camera up high so you could see the back you wouldn't see it otherwise you see you understand I remember that from our last discussion okay and I I believe that if we were to bring back the Gable on the on the parcel a that that would be enough of a different you know difference yeah um we could even study maybe the materials bit more so they're not so similar MH we have similar materials but different color different orientation so if you would be if you would be open for those type of amendments we would we would be happy to make them well I mean to be perfectly honest um uh you know as we go through this over the years and and um look at you know different variances I mean uh I mean at at a certain there's only certain things I me I again I only speak for myself not not the other Council persons but you know there's only so many things that could that uh we can really vote against to say it like that right um and so I'm not I'm not of a mood to to to require you to do something that's not required basically right so like I said I understand that basically my my two comments and then the one that really is a concern for me are are still at the end of the day subjective like I I I just I completely get that so um there you go thank you very much council person anybody else from the council yes sir Mr Mayor go ahead um so the these properties are in the right direction we're not like saying they're you know totally off Bas because it's it's not just a big rectangular house it's it has pitches it has roof it has everything there um but you guys are going to be selling these other people you're not planning on living in them correct so as you know a resident of elportal and I know the plans for elportal is to keep planting oak trees you want to keep being trees toity the USA and we keep seeing these trees go out and we want to go further west and we want to see that I'm look at parcel B and I see this roof that is sloping that if any leaves go anywhere near it it they all basically fill in the middle of the roof and I can think of that poor person who's going to live there how how are those leaves is going to naturally fall off the roof if there's let's say an oak tree plan there in the future or something else as we continue to grow the trees here uh rainwater would would move the leaves it's at a 2 to 12 pitch okay and we have an oversiz uh cricket if you will at the at where they where they funnel okay there it's would be redirected out to the sides I think you underestimate it even at an 812 pitch it would still have trouble uh falling off you need if it's going straight down into the center and it's going to create like a mound I've seen this happen on other houses and we're not saying we're at this point now because you actually don't have as much foilage in your yard as other properties do you you do have some and you're respecting it and you're you're keeping it there but I'm looking at the future of elportal here and as we plant more trees I'm thinking wow that thing is going to basically collect collect collect the tree leaves are going to Decay the acid from Le are going to uh burn into the metal roof eventually decaying it and causing it to go bad early um I'm I'm wondering if there is any other options or ideas that you had regarding that or was it like something you really were strong about because I know you're the architect and this is like an art you you do a great job you you work with what you're working with it's your baby in the end is there something else that you were thinking we well first of all we feel the the mature the trees the specimen trees are already present on the property um that's what dictated the footprint okay uh and so we didn't feel that we would put that type of tree so close to the uh to that to that roof Additionally the the height of the roof in in the back um you know it's it's a single it's a single slope coming coming all the way down um with any wind or rain it it will move it will move the leaves if there was a tree in fact that was going to to to shed its leaves um then the owner would have the the you know the the ability to cut back the tree if needed if that was actually a concern but I think it's it's a it's a the roof is unique yes um but I think it would perform just like any other roof uh because again there's no flat portion on that roof the the Scupper is literally 20 ft wide it's the full width of the of the of the uh of the roof so there's a valley just like any other um conventional roof would have anybody else from the council hearing seeing none anybody from the audience about this particular item come up say we we'll start with uh we'll start with him back there you want to come first you're you're all right you go first his hand went up but it's all good just say your name and address for good evening Federico saata 156 Northwest 39 Street El Portal and I'm a proud resident of El Portal thank you for everybody for tonight elportal doesn't have an specific architecture there's vernacular architecture there's art Decor Through The Years every generation has built a house an architecture that is representative of the time we're in the modern times we're contemporary architecture this is what is being built today what the trades now how to build today if you look at nor Miami Avenue between 89 and 90 there're two modern houses that are just like each other they're mirror versions they only have different colors and different materials but the architecture is the same they went to a nor they went to an extent at least to change the pitches of the roof the foot and the fat and the colors so I think modern architecture actually complements the variety of architecture that we have here in elport thank you thank you very much thank you very good thank you um sir your say your name address for the record uh George Alvarez 165 Northwest 88 Street you're making me talk again in front of people you did a wonderful job the first time you're doing um there are no such houses like this like like this house in in scope design size style at all on the street on any of the adjacent streets either I mean I I forget who said what about this being somehow congruent to the neighborhood it it couldn't be less the case you know don't take it personally guys you guys seem like very nice people and and there's a lot to like about these houses they're they're they look lovely but these are you know renderings these are drawings and I would argue with uh F fed Federico there is an architecture to eleral and it's the architecture that has been established largely to the great great majority of this community with a few exceptions I believe you live in you're on 89th Street you live in one of the houses the the El pel has been established over the years by being El prel bmer properties originally a petroleum company in the 1930s put up so many of the houses east of Northeast Second Avenue all the way to Horseman and then on the other side of Horseman there is a sty not love it may not be nearly as cool as as this is um and there's a lot to like about this but I just for us to somehow contend that this is at all like anything else in the neighborhood would would be false is it cool yeah maybe but every house on that block with the exception of one of them is anywhere between 1,00 and 1250 Square ft not including garages very few people have pools uh there's one person on 89th who who put up a kind of Veranda uh but that's not square footage of living I mean these houses are one is correct me if I'm wrong guys 3100 3200 and the other's like 3,400 Square fet they're smaller uh it's 2700 and 2600 conditioned conditioned space so the the um with the garage is 3,000 total all right well I I think that the gar the garage counts for overall half the garage does so the the adjusted is 3,000 each about 3,000 foot each W okay mhm I would say that the the overall impact of these houses per I mean think about it as like a there's the horizontal feeling that you get right and people are allowed to build up to 5 feet away from the side Sidelines up to 5et around inexplicably from the back I think that's the most ridiculous and short-sighted thing in in in the world of drainage which I know little about and you guys probably know a lot more about and then we're adding the concrete slab construction a septic tank in the front yard like concrete slab of that size even if it's not livable size is going to have an impact on I mean talk about swes with mud and and and and driveway issues there's going to be you know unless there's like real care taken about the drainage and I'm certainly open to that possibility uh there's going to be a river up and down and already very narrow 88th Street that's the theme of this this uh this this meeting but can I speak to that sure sure sure yeah the driveways are in full conformance with the code they're 12 ft wide one of which is a block uh Turf block which is 40% permeable which is more than most driveways I'm sure in the neighbor neighborhood so we're not creating an issue or we're not furthering the problem with drainage so you know just to let you know okay you know on that on that point okay understood but I would I would what would you propose instead of what we're doing on the driveway well what I would say is that nobody else has that big of a driveway on that street how big are the driveways I don't know they're usually about the size of one the width of one car this is and people do tands or they got the little donut in the Swale in which people you know put so I I you know I only took a look at your plans recently you guys have lived with them you know for however long since you purchased the house um but I've lived in this neighborhood for very very very long time so I I I take issu with the presumption that these houses would would would be congruent with the rest of then with the rest of the definitely the rest of this the the the the the the the blocks or the adjacent blocks and I don't think with El pel either and I I do think that we start putting up 3,000 give or take s foot houses in a neighborhood of 1100 and 1200 foot houses we are going to see changes they might be cooler changes but they're also going to be I mean we're going to be looking at a you know who knows what the regulatory thing thing is going to look like we're going to have uh we're going to have interest rates going up I I didn't realize that all the lumber comes from Canada that' be on you guys I guess but I mean who knows like these are going to be expensive expensive houses and I you know I I lived for a few years away from in Los Angeles I'll just say Los Angeles I didn't want to say it in case there's an anti- California bias here but there's tons and tons of neighborhoods with modern houses built by developers these two houses I'm sorry guys that's an identical footprint they are inverted just like the ones that feder Rico mention it Exist Elsewhere I would have voted against those houses had I you know we're not refuting that it's a mirror we were told that the front the front would need to be different from one another so that they're not identical twins and so that's the way we we proceeded well I mean they're identical twins inverted with two different roofs I mean like that's it's a commendable job that you guys tried to do I would suggest that that more needs to be done uh I only have so much footing I only have so much sway I like the fact that you're keeping the trees that's cool but let's be honest you couldn't build those houses where the trees are anyway cuz they're in the Swale they're in the front Corners there's an existing house in the middle of what are these two lots that's not that's not completely true um you it could have been a square footprint and we could have taken out a lot more specimen trees by having a just pure coincidence maybe but by having this longer footprint we were able to preserve most we have to relocate and replace two of them okay um um but it does actually work out for the property and for the preservation of the trees the footprints that you see well the really tall one Palm sapadilla no not the sapadilla but the really tall palm tree on the east side of the property excellent coconuts get them while they're good Marilyn used to give me some some of those coconuts when I would walk by I I I I I don't know what to say you know like there there's there's really just not a lot of congruence in fact there there is none yes people are putting aluminum roofs on their houses because they are so much cheaper whether or not they look good they're doing it anyway we don't have any say they're doing it some houses they look better than others they're not they're not actually cheaper but it's you know 40-year warranty for for the home homeowners that move in there they're going to have a better roof that's that's why we we go with it yeah well I mean you know what to be honest they look so much better on your designs than they do on like bmer properties you know three bedroom one bath special of 1100 square ft not all of them there's always exceptions look I I uh I never saw a sign about the plat split when that happens I never saw a sign about these houses until uh I saw signs of work happening and then I saw Marilyn and the former owner and she told me you you know what was the sign goes up after this approval meeting if they get approved and they go to the next council meeting you get approved that's when the sign goes up and also the that whole entire uh activity is also very new uh extremely new within the last two months so that's that's that's quick so I feel like I can forgive myself for not being on top of it because things are quick but look I'm going to beat a dead horse here um I'm concerned about the neighborhood and where we go when we keep on allowing mutations to what is El pel wish I lived in Sherwood Forest because I'd be insulated from the future a future that I may not be able to afford when there are $3 million I know you're you're your target number is less than that but it is unprecedented for that street and in fact I think it's unprecedented for all but one house West of Miami Avenue so I'm concerned about that I'm concerned about how it looks very different from the rest of the neighborhood I'm concerned with the the feeling of a twostory house of certain amount of width and I mean they didn't maximize and I you know I props to you guys for that but it is going to feel very big those houses are going to feel dominating to the properties that they are on which in turn will be dominating to the feeling of the rest of the street with no other houses anywhere remotely like that so I'm concerned about that I'm concerned about septic tanks in the in the front next to the Swale I'm concerned about drainage in general but I will defer to smarter drainage people where's Caleb Brown where's that guy we need him so I'm I'm I'm concerned about about all of those things I I wish I wish bmer properties had put up a few you know houses and you know back then there there was some degree of modernism so that at least it would be precedented but the theme is is wrong the the house that's on uh what was it 44 88th Street I mean at least that's next to another gargantuan house and there's only one of them but this is going to be two of very very very similar houses even if they are cool I'll shut up well thank you no thank you very much appreciate it is there anybody else from the audience no all right hearing none going back to the council are there any last comments or questions from the council yes sir go ahead uh thank you for those comments um and uh bringing certain things to be aware um I would like to see some changes to the designs um and I I I want to make a motion to defer this to the next meeting so we don't have to vote it down this way we can work together and try and make your dream come true so this is a motion to defer this to the next Planning and Zoning do I have a second with that motion second second by uh motion by council person winter second by uh council person Lightfoot Ward um Madam cerman please have a roll call on the deferent motion roll call member Winters yes member lifefood Ward yes member bbal yes chair Nickerson yes motion passes 4 To None all right thank you very much we'll see you again we we'll be in contact with you and uh and the the members will be in contact with you to kind of get a sense of you know the direction we want to go in this all right thank you very much you guys the next one is I think the new G6 which is for 8 Northeast 90th Street addition 48 noreast 90th Street okay yeah you're after this you're next my brother you're next I know what's up oh we have the motion to vote yeah um um council person Winters uh uh can you make a motion for for parcel B also yes may make the motion to defer Part B as well second second all right so motion made by council person winter second by counc person life for war Madam clerk have roll call for part roll call member Winters yes member life foot Ward yes member bbom yes chair Nickerson yes motion passes 5 thank you very much Madam cler I forgot there's two two all right so the next one is 48 Northeast 90th Street Edition um Miss Hammond when you get an opportunity to give us the introduction please yes yes this applicant um that for this item is um Tanya Brinkley she is requesting site plan approval for construction of an addition to her existing Residence at 48 Northeast 90th Street the site is 10,000 ft lot and it currently contains a single family home built in 1926 that is 2,285 Ft the proposed residential use is still a permitted use in this District um the proposed home addition is to create two-story addition in the rear of the house adding about 2,000 square ft to the home for two new rooms and a covered Terrace below the rooms with the addition the home will be a little over 4,000 ft at 4,286 and it will have four bedrooms and 4 and a half bathrooms no changes are planned for the front of the house and the rear Edition will be consistent with the original 1920s architecture um no no variances are requested everything is to code and found to be consistent with the code the proposed design um is representative of sorry um sorry lost my my notes here um um staff does recommend approval for this um addition to this home and I also want to say that I find it very a very nice design yeah it's just an all right any questions or comments from the council so I want to first thank you for the thoughtful approach you took in designing this addition to your home um genuinely genuinely impressed with how you maintain the original character in charm of your house while seamlessly integrating the new addition I am one that is an approval of having larger homes because we have larger families now and it makes more sense but it it's clear that you put significant effort into preserving the unique character and identity of the property and you took in mind everything else in elportal um your design reflects the care and respects respect for our community's historic history and Aesthetics and it serves as a wonderful example of how new home new improvements can harmonize with existing structures on behalf of the council I would like to thank you for the work you did in creating this addition thank you very much anybody else from the council yes council person life forward I'm didto everything he said when I saw this what you want it I know the property but when I saw it you didn't change El protel and I'm talking about the one we just saw looking like Star Trek you kept the what we're not here because we um are looking for become Miami plus and El pel we're looking to preserve a a historic piece of property we are the smallest city in Miami day County how many people knew that we are the smallest city mdle e in Miami day County we are not trying to go out and be Star Trek and anything else we're trying to keep what makes this community the one that others look at and say you live in El protel I've been there we even had the the in the zoo something about the zoo or the parks they even use this as part of their their presentations they go to Liberty City they go to but then they come to El Pell say I didn't know this place existed listen I didn't know this place existed either but when I found it I bought it 37 years ago 37 years ago right I bought it this is what we want this is what we we want the things that are going to keep eler tell it means the port did I say that right El protel means no no El pel means um the what the gate it means the gate that's El pel and we I don't many of the residents think that we are doing what we're supposed to do as the council the council is making this what it is today we even have tourists come through and they're surprised that this little village which doesn't seem so little when you're in here this little village is still here in its own way not trying to take it apart and thriving and what and thriving that's right and driving so that that's my comment on on this and and I'm glad you didn't try to do anything that that that the last one did what he said what my colleague here said take it take it to heart okay because this is El pel and if you change it if you change it just trying to keep up with Star Trek you're going to lose an entire community that basically is going down in infamy can I tell you a small story you may my name is musadik Muhammad I brought that property probably I don't know maybe six or seven years ago my guy right here I live in Coconut Grove but I have to tell you when I bought that property 25 years ago yeah it's probably 10 times worth now we know war from more that's right but I specifically look for trees I specifically look for the I think it's called mid uh not mid it's called Mediterranean whatever the whatever that word was when they built houses in the 20s I look for a working fireplace I look for Florida Pine these are the things specifically that I look for I could have bought a house in Sherwood my wife didn't want to live on the the canal and it was too modern it was too modern when it was just flat she didn't want to do it so I knocked on the guys the lady the guy's door of that property I said you want to sell your house and I bought it in a week and I bought it that long time ago but I've been working with mild to design and I was telling her listen aesthetically I really want to be in 1920 if you go by that now I have a 1952 Lincoln all right that's sitting there like that's that's just my dream that's the way it is and I have to say that I've never been to one of these meetings but this is what Miami should look like with the individuals here that's making decisions on communities and I just applaud yall and I appreciate y'all it's kind of fascinating I mean I've been here a long time but it's kind of fascinating but this is what Miami should look like with people making decisions and coming together in community and I like the outputs and the inputs that people are having because they're concerned about the neighborhood right so just keep doing what yall doing but this is what this is what we prod this is what we're doing right here at this house that's right thank you thank you appreciate it thank you very much um any further questions or comments from the council Committee hearing seeing none any questions or comments from the audience about this particular property seeing hearing none any last questions or comments from the committee I'd like to make a motion to approve you I have a second second motion made by council person member Winters second by council person or member like foot Ward mad cler may please have a roll call please roll call um member Winters yes member lifefood Ward yes member bbal yes Shar erson yes motion passes for all right thank you very much thank you thank you very much appreciate it next we have uh the last G I think this is G 78 and N um three different site plans same property uh I'm going to have they setting up I'm going to have uh ready Miss Hammond's kind of go through all three of them okay and then we'll go from there all right we finally made it to the last one yes fin the last one last three I guess does let me one second Miss ham did um did everybody look at these in their packets do you guys have them they're shaking their heads yes yes everybody seen them okay will you guys mind if I I show the audience for a while real quick and then if you guys want to see it we'll turn it back in like a few minutes yeah is that good all right I want the audience to see it too can you guys turn those thank you [Music] [Music] appreciate right okay so our applicant for this application um three new home is sanctuary Ventures LLC they're requesting site plan approval um to construct three new residences um today each of these Lots share one address which 8750 Northeast 40th Avenue Road and they're designated as Lots 13 14 and 15 this they cons the site overall today consists of a total of 19,000 65 ft and is currently developed with one single family home that was built in the 1960s the existing plating includes these three lots as individual Parcels that have never historically been United but currently accommodate only one single family home the property appraiser has assigned only one folio number to all three of these lots and each of these Lots currently shares the same address the applicant seeks to demolish the one home and use the existing three lots to to build three separate dwellings and they are not requesting replatting because these lots have historically never been again United each resident is proposed each residence is proposed to be two stories and feature an open courtyard separating two sides of of the first level for lot 13 um it's will be a two-story home of 4,38 48 square ft the home will have four bedrooms and four and a half baths and two-car carport lot 14 is a two-story 2,469 ft house the home will have three bedrooms and three bathrooms and no garage or carport on light lot 15 again another two-story house 4,27 ft the home will have four bedrooms 4 and a half bathrooms and one carport um the the houses were reviewed under development standards and found to be consistent and they are not requesting variances and for that reason um the staff is recommending approval for construction of these three hes thank you all right thank you very much uh Council committee good evening how you doing good evening um so there's no variances currently associated with um I any of the three designs we talking about tonight is that right correct okay um assuming that these designs will be approved tonight do you anticipate any variance applications on either any of these three properties in the future no Varian okay um for example well for example like you know uh let's say let's say everything's approved you know as is tonight I'm talking about the addition of a a pool on this lot or um even just a different fencing between the uh properties um so primary variances that we experience are basically going to be driveway fence pool right uh rear set back side set backs these types of things so do you anticipate any um request for any type of a variance um for I for any of these three properties um assuming that they would be approved as is if approved as is we will not be requesting variances so I want to add just real quickly that um the approval tonight would also include the pool and the driveway and the these things have been reviewed all of that is within the cod in fact in an earlier version um they had some Hedges that wouldn't that we would have had to say we need a variance for this and they they removed them and said we want to go variance free okay and then with the size of these properties um uh well first let me ask you are you aware that the gentleman who lived in that house for a great number of years is known as the peacock whisperer no okay but they not it was the previous previous one or because I knew I know that there's there were two families the original person that built buil the house back in the 1960s and then there's another family that moved recently probably for the last 10 years if I remember correctly yeah I'm talking about the patriarch kind of of the I believe of the original original original no I got a sense that through investigations that he was a developer and when he built that house it was R Deco architecture the existing house so um as we look at that property we can step out the door and look at it right so as we look at this this prop properties um uh one I'm relieved that they were already separated just because it's um it's stressful to have lots separated because of the uncertainty of what's you know uh coming and then change is always upsetting right um so as we look at the we as we're about to look at these three properties tonight right when they are there uh uh the side setbacks of each property determines the proximity of each property one to the other so we we're looking at one that's going to be with the front facade to the South we're going to look at one with the front facade to the southeast and one with the facade front facad to the east is that correct am I am I picturing that correctly so lot uh 13 yeah it's the South looking property which is the one on the left okay the other two will look West East both together both together correct so then what kind of uh what kind of space is created what does the space look like between so the two will be together over here and the one over here like like this 10 10 ft 10 ft between 10t between two on the first level and the way what what we did to mitigate the massing was to take the second level and rotate so if you look I can see that in the so if you look at the front you only see the one level and all three are done that way is that correct the there's only there's only two Okay the third one which is in the one in the corner given the difficulty of the site is a not shape okay so 14 and 15 have uh the angle street that creates difficulty meeting the setbacks and also creating a property that doesn't is all Inc compassing that is fits within the setback that it's a minimum intrusion into the site in addition that we trying to preserve all the trees on the site especially the oak trees there's oldak trees that are mature okay and then the height of all three buildings is are the same at 226 is that right correct all three corre yeah okay um those are my only questions for now um I'd like to speak um Mr fedrico zata thank you for allowing me to visit your property uh this weekend I appreciate your willingness to show me around and discuss your plans in detail I do recall though that you were going to cancel the demolition on lot 15 and keep the original house and now I'm seeing that it's not what you told me we consider depending how the conversations go we may consider to keep the existing house in house and renovate that house does that house sit on a single lot single lot complies with all the set bags it doesn't look like it be possible wow that's really amazing okay it is it it it is actually has makes sense since they bought them three separately so it has a 10 foot it has a 10 foot setback from the east from the south property line okay and the current requirement for the setback is five so I I do know you've been here all meeting and you heard some of the criticisms earlier about modern houses we spoke about with other um people that came up for um vote and um these are even more modern than those houses um and I'm not trying to hurt the timeline or anything but there's a lot of questions that I have that I don't think are going to get answered tonight I went to your property with an arborist and the trees that you said were dying were not dying he said they were very healthy only one of them was really dying so This concerns me if we're going to tear down healthy 50-year-old oak trees in a beautiful property um and I'm in support of you building on the property and creating two other pieces of beautiful part of eleral that everyone's going to see com in but I do not think we're at this point because there's too many questions and I'd like to make a motion to defer this to the next council meeting after we work on this together to make it so we are in fact there are two very healthy trees and beautiful trees that we will be relocating within the site and this will be from permits from Miami day dur but you'll be moving a tree with a 26t canopy to a 16t area within 10 ft of a power line it's not going to be allowed with the arboris no one's going to allow that so we train that and we also going to work with a certified tree relocation company to and this is a long process while we go through the commission through through these meetings we're going to submit the application remember we still have to go for building permit that could take up to 8 months mhm Tre the tree is a process where we bring the canopy in carefully by a professional so that way when the tree is ready to be relocated and outside of the threee lines we will do so electrical lines to move this to the next meeting because I wanted to avoid saying that these trees that when they're moved are going to be butchered and basically they're never going to grow back the same way and I'm trying to save you the heartache of of us voting no because we're going to lose five beautiful oak trees here right on top of Sherwood Forest two two we are relocating um with all du respect I I spoke with a certifi a arborist we created the reports the the the the the arborist reports that you have and we also met with certified three relocation companies and there's only two the rest of the trees which there are plenty of them will be kept so face first first thing relocate this tree here relocate this tree here moving away from from it is right now thank you very much council person life for you're not done my brother counc person life for award do you have something you want to jump in of water you asked a question he hasn't answered it you asked a question about um she didn't answer it um ex what the existing house yeah the existing houses he you asked a question about the existing houses um Council for urban asked about the existing I said that he when we spoke on his property he told me that he was not tearing down the house in lot 15 and today he shows a representation that he is going to build it and so I'm a little confused I I didn't prepare for lot 15 because he told me that they I spent a lot of hours this weekend just going over everyone's houses and that one I did not look at because he told me he was not doing it we say I say May so depending on how the conversations go we may you may remove it yes we may remove it okay try to come up to an agreement and I think this is what we are proposing architecturally will be beneficial to the area we're not talking about foreign architecture 87th Street has modern architecture that has one prices that people when come visit me here at the portal can of ask kind of ask me it's like what is that house why it's so beautiful sitting on along 87 street that is covered by bines so and and what we are we investigated the architecture of the company try the of of El Portal and we propose something that is less intrusive instead of coping the O we are trying to complement and by the clean lines of our architecture is going to actually disappear within the existing trees that exist over there there today well so I I I did motion uh to defer this to the next meeting not even talking about the modern stylistic stuff that we motion to for other um there are questions that I can I can answer is I I did meet with a certified Arborist at your property we after your permission and I looked at the trees with him and he said that they he felt that they were healthy trees the ones you say you're going to remove so and this point between now and next zoning meeting I like to go with the City Arborist over there and I like to hear his professional opinion as well uh as as the trees because the last thing we need to do is remove healthy mature oak trees at the top of Sherwood Forest so the current trees the two trees that we are relocating are waiting um sitting sitting withing the buildable fruit breing So when you say keeping the trees that means that I will have no right or space to build a home not me not anybody that owns that property on lot um 13's tree deposition schedule you don't even have the tree that you said you're relocating there you put it in the tree mitigation guidelines but then you don't actually put it in the key so we have no idea where this tree is coming from it's not actually inside of the part of the plans so now we're getting very confused I'm going by what your word was you said one of those oak trees with the 26t pieces was going to go right next to the power lines at the back of lot 13 correct correct I'm I'm having some issues because there's some stuff missing from this as well there's it's not just one thing sorry chess again the modern the modern design which we've already talked about tonight the cutting down of mature oak trees inside of this sherard Forest Area and of course missing certain pieces on this uh application where the key is missing tree 13 from the other um lot 14 so it doesn't actually show that it's being transplanted you say it's transplanted in lot 14's designs so s plan is approved as it is and we can review 3 by3 as I'm the we are the owners of the three combined Lots so the process first phase like I said in I show is the relocation of the trees so we're going to relocate so by the time you approve that tree must and will be there on lot 13 okay we're also relocating to I really wanted to close this quickly before we created a sour taste about what's going on because I want you to succeed I'm going to make the motion again can we defer this to the next meeting do I have a second motions motions on the table do I have a second yeah that was second U uh motion made by uh council person winter second by council person um urbon Madam clerk for deferment are we deferring we I have doing one at a time I guess so we're starting with so we're starting with the first one um that's lot 13 that's lot 13 uh Madam CL pleas roll call for lot 13 to First roll call member Winters yes member life foot Ward member bbom no Sharon nerson uh yes motion passes 3 to one um what are we doing uh council person win with lot 14 can we defer that as well to the next planning zoning meeting I have a motion to defer do I have a second for deferment lot 14 second um council person light foot Ward mam clerk may please have a roll call deferment lot 14 roll call member Winters yes member Lightfoot Ward yes member bbom yes chair Nickerson yes motion passes forward we have a lot 15 council person Winters yes I motion to move lot 15 as well to uh next Zone meeting or be informed that they are not going to build before that meeting on that lot all right so we're going to move to um Next plan zoning meeting or if it's not going to be building that lot we'll be informed of that deferment lot 15 um I have a motion council person Winters where my second second council person light foot W member cler please have a roll call please roll call member Winters yes member lifefood Ward yes member bbom yes Shar Nickerson yes Mot passes forward n thank you very much appreciate that um we'll be in touch sir all right we'll be in touch um next we have uh good and Welfare if anybody wants us to come up and talk about anything at all doesn't have to be just things on this agenda here's your time come up and say your name and address for the record the floor is yours hearing and seeing none do I have a motion to adjourn so move by council person life reward do I have a second second by council person Winters all in favor say I I I all oppos say nay hearing none the planning is zoning committee meeting for January 21st 2025 is adjourned at 10:42 p.m.