i like the brain brings that silver route you got going on Looks nice All right Good morning It's March 27th 2025 9:07 a.m My name is Nikki Pal HR director We are meeting with AAFF for a continued bargaining session Eric Gilmore public safety Travis Tomkins public safety James Lloyd HR Josh Hunter 4131 Justin Mark 4131 Nick Grrey 4131
and Christie from the county attorney's office All right Uh we closed the last session with one of two options You guys were going to let me know if I needed to get with legal and have some language drafted or you guys were going to let me know about a date audit I've not heard from your team so balls in your court today membership Uh so we took it back to to the membership and and talked quite a bit First it's appreciate the effort of everything going into this right
getting this scale is something we've been really trying to secure um for over a decade now and the importance of an actual scale Um so really appreciate the efforts of getting that back to us Um as we all I think we all can agree there's some inherent issues and fundamental problems with implementation of this style but this is what we got It's a good foundation to work off and build out of and I think we recognize that but a lot of our membership also recognizes that those inherent problems right so out of that we
uh we got some language to pass on on the wage rate basically just kind of securing you know the spirit of the scale so to speak So we you know the outpacing and things like that we've discussed and talked about Uh so I'll pass this across and see what you guys think about it This has the me too stuff
Anywhere that So the only thing I can say on this language is the intent was to move to the corresponding step
not the percentage I would have to recalculate this out and it's probably going to be more than the 1.7 So no the implementation is as it sits right As the but if you as you say as you meet your step going forward right Because if some somebody gets a a 2% in October it's going to move them up if the scale doesn't move with it or they're kind of one of those anomalies in between It's just make guaranteeing that that longevity step that this is built off right So if say they're sitting between a a step for some reason it just guarantees them when
they hit that step they either go to that rate or they get the percentage whichever's higher right That's not how it was calculated So that means I have to recalculate for implementation wasn't calculated It was calculated at the flat rate You move up into the flat rate Understand that for the implementation of it right You go to that flat rate Mhm Okay That yes we we're not saying that's changing We're just saying if you reach your we go to this at implements and then you hit say you're at year six and then year seven comes along Then if for
some reason you're at $16 even that's in between right Going to the 1659 wouldn't be that 5% So it's just saying that that person at that year mark right and 5% is a lot more than 59 cents That way that would require in terms of implementation correct Just in terms of implementation is what you're referring to right Right I'm talking about after implementation when you're you're hangups that have very first line Yes I think the way because I'm going to have to
I can't answer this today I'm gonna have to take this back to budget and explain to them what this means over the next three years Did you cost that over the Did you cost this over the next three years already Yeah I did a three year even with the just I did a three-year for them for their purposes for without any consideration given to an MSBU If there is no MSBU what does this cost for three years that you calculated the steps as people move through for those three years
I it sounds to me like you're part of your hang up here is the way that first line is worded that your interpretation would require you uh to to implement like rather than putting them in the scale it would be scale plus percentage potentially for certain people and and that's not the intent there was originally calculated Sure Right So the the intent is to utilize your your scale in order to place people appropriately in the scale as as what you initially presented
Our understanding or our hope was to this the spirit of this scale is is based on tenure with the county as a whole Right Uh that was a a difficult thing for us to address in terms of with the membership because the reality is do the the structure of the scale the implemented way everything plays out essentially a scale is being on is on the table that no one would be eligible for be beyond implementation moves So by by allowing as the tenure rolls around and and again
utilizing the spirit of you hit an anniversary day you receive that percentage That's that's what our intent is for this this language to reflect So if we need to address that language or or come to terms about how how to reach that interpretation that that's the goal here So if it's you know rewarding some things that's fine That was the overall objective here I think with the way that my calculation was done it was if you get there and you're already there that's it You're capped out which you saw uh we had 11 people capped out uh for implementation But if
you moved up you would move into to these but it was not based on moving by a percentage It was just an amount in a table Um and that those tables are the same that any other county has Now sometimes they do move their table and that would be an intent in future That was not what was calculated So that's all I'm telling you today I have to take this back If this is your proposal I have to in the last session you said you didn't have a cause for projected out beyond
implementation So I'm not sure I did not say that Pretty sure because I'm pretty sure we asked what the overall cost of the plan was and you weren't able to provide it at that at that point in time you asked for something different that I had not calculated but Okay I think we're talking about a very few people that actually fit that category right It it I mean we're talking a handful It can't affect the I I understand 100% what you're saying I don't speak for budget Budget is not in
the room today What you're presenting today would have to be recalculated That's okay That's it How long was that I don't know I have not been able to sit down and do the calculations needed for my upcoming bargaining session with another union I can do it as quickly as I can I already have the table built but it's having to go
one by one into the table of the people So what they've asked for is so our previous table see if I have our proposal here real quickly so that I can explain it Our previous table had years of service and rates with capouts Okay what they're
asking for is percentages and you go to that or if you're already there you get 2% So that was not built into this This was built with the flat rates and the caps This is not built with a cap meaning if they're already there they get two they still get 2% or they get 5% or they get whatever So my three-year analysis that I gave to Stephen hey there's no MSBU This is the cost now is going to change based on their presentation today So I have to redo
that analysis All right Is there anything else we can talk about Everything's kind of I mean I've got 10 and 19 but you guys already have those I do have the language for 10 um if you want it but I think I already gave 19 last time I'm going to take 10 and 19 Yeah like like I said it it's obviously we take these things back just like you guys do and have discussions about it And that was one prevailing uh concern from the body was while
there's it's this is a a little bit different way to approach the you going to a scale Um but it's it's a you a unique way It's creative way and it like I said establishes a foundation but they're they're offering us a scale that by by default really doesn't have much benefit other than the initial implementation side Uh when the spirit of a longevity scale is to provide those rewards or however you want to phrase them those those increases for the time they've served with the
scambi county Uh so you know you kind of look at like what's what's the point you know should we restructure this or basically y'all don't want people to cop out So that's that's what I got here and I can redo those calculations and that's easy enough Let me ask you this Take me some time Let me ask you this And we're talking about redoing calculations and everything We talked about the apparent issues and problems with the implementation of it like this If we've got to go redo calculations I think maybe we should just go ahead and explore time and grade with this Um
if we're going to like I said we're talking about calculations I know you said we can go to UKG and pull those times I already know that those times are in UKG for the promotion times So I I knowing the feedback from membership that this wasn't kind of accepted we're going to have to go back and renegotiate and look at numbers and everything else I feel a strong portion of our membership and now be a minority but a very we're talking about senior guys that this this really hurt them Okay
because it compresses the right really bad So if we're going to go back and and talk about calculations and do time and grade I I think we need to look to explore time and grade and and we need to make it meaningful Like I said the the lieutenants and officers up have been compressed from the bottom up Right Back 15 years ago we were talking almost a 50% difference If they can commit camp to that I'll commit an employee to that We'll get those dates together and we'll redo a scale based on time grade Okay I I think uh looking at can we look at both options since we're going that
way or I mean because I don't think have to look at anything Yeah No And I I want to work to to get this I'd have to look at anything that we can Yeah It I mean they'll be successful We understand that the hurdles you have right You only have so much to to implement We feel like we've defined the a gap that exists in terms of comp you know compare waste comparisons right Unfortunately to bridge that gap the implementation cost is is going to be too much to bear for right now right So how do how
do we make a move towards that Um and again while this is a little bit unorthodox it does provide some unique opportunities in terms of setting that foundation up for the future and and we put an incredible amount of work in trying to because it at face value the general member does looks at this and they don't really understand that So trying to say hey this is working collaboratively This is where we want to go and what we're trying to get to it it starts you know kind of come around but it is obviously contingent on some some factors there Um some of which are completely out
of our control and your control You know they go to upstairs Um so we all get that right Um grade is we we've all kicked this horse till his is dead right That's the goal That's the ultimate goal Um the our concern was the the what was available in terms of implementation cost jumping straight to time and grade may come off not intentionally but may come off as not very meaningful to our majority of our members and that so that was a concern Um so yeah I mean I know it's a lot
of work We appreciate you guys being open to that looking at it We're happy Like I said we're happy to outline I I don't think you guys offered this with the with the intent I apologize but I don't think you guys offered this with the intent Um like any kind of malicious intent to oh here's a scale that none of you are going to qualify for additional steps It it's unfortunately you had to put the rates in there And then the intent truly was if the MSBU passes we move the scale accordingly um we can't say what what's going to happen in the future We don't know what's going
to happen in the future That was the intent of the build of the scale and how it was calculated We absolutely understand that and and what we're discussing today because of that unknown is to try to provide some some security and insurance to to our membership So I can do the second calculation but I can tell you it's going to be more than you know what I had already costed out And then I will assign an employee in my department to work directly with camp and uh we'll make it a priority
next week to try to get that done Can can I ask you John Nikki if you you ran this out you said for for 3 years That was that your projection and and that would have been associated when you ran that out Did you include across the board or did you just run it based off of what's in this scale in terms of longevity increases I I'm trying to understand what the unknown factor would be Is it the board increases that may or may not I assume a 3% each year Okay I assume Okay and
and members hitting their mark moving correct So in that assumption they're hitting the 3% everybody's capping would earn my table just moves them automatically So were you applying to again just trying to understand where you were going with it You were applying the 3% to the chart itself Okay So basically like the input number for this scale because everything's bas going to be based off an input number of the the starting fireman rate So is that number adjust everything in the scale adjust with it Correct Yes Okay And on my spreadsheet right now with Travis
I'm trying to pull [Music] back because that is much smaller Right That's fine Let's let's explore Let's we got two those two options those routes right You know explore what this looks like But I think if we're going to go back and explore things I really think our membership would really like to look at a time and grade implementation Um we understand it fit It's got to fit in that that line of budget right We understand that And uh if
we can get to that time and grade I really think uh a lot more of our membership would would be and and it's the right way to implement this Okay Like I said this was what was on the table These were kind of the terms that the membership said "Hey we can agree to this right now but if we're back at the table we'd like to see." Okay no problem Uh let me be up front Just not said that There's a lot of wolves out the door Understand with the city right now I mean we're battling
with the city They for whatever reason they think we owe them $2 million right out of the general fund WF's come to the table with their right now It's for the city I don't think there's an I don't know what the appetite of the board is The appetite some is I know what my appetite is is I don't owe you anything because my loyalty is to this organization to and to our employees But it is a true board's really getting beat up Really a lot of pressure on them right now But
um I have a meeting Friday morning with some folks from the city and their play is well you're going to get a bunch of tip fees out of this demolition Maybe not You can take you can take your CD anywhere you want to take it We're going to give it to us But even if we get timid fees that money has to stay in the waste services account It's kind of like saying you're going to hey you're going to make some extra uh gas tax money off the the dump trucks running around That's kind of a silly argument I can't take waste the enterprise account The
money has to stay there I can't reimburse the general's fund out of that money So to me that's a moot point And plus you're going to take out six months of my airspace Why do you think I owe you $2 million Right I mean that's just it's just and the city and the city's got money in the CRA perhaps got money plenty of money They want Can I ask you something I mean we're I'm getting a little off here but it's it's to the point Um there was a recent story run about the what few billion collected in uh tourism in Pensacola Was that is that like
through TDT I mean what is that It's TDT money Okay Is is I mean public safety is related to tourism Is there a way to access that or you know that we don't fit that I I'm trying to put a part when they say there's two billion with a B That's Yeah TDC has grown We were collecting 16 million a year We're roughly at 24 million a year Yes sir So we're pretty healthy in tourism dollars
as we move forward Well talking about the seem like a pretty healthy request for not that it's unwarranted but the General Chappie memorialized That's another That's another fight Yes Yes Oh we understand that Yeah So I have no idea where that's going Well I I get and I know we're crutch for time to get you know something on the table and get people taken care of And with that said like I said you weren't here but I really appreciate the the work that's been done put into
this and come something that is meaningful Right Sure Um and likewise and I would commit to Nikki and and you know pull our resources that way we can maybe get something in the next couple weeks and get back to the table and try to get this hammered out Um I don't know if maybe you got some dates coming up that we can go ahead and get done or if you want to have uh I'll get uh Nasha to reach out to you because I mean honestly I think I could compile the information we need if you know like I said talking with camp or or getting I think Chief Booth is very wellversed
in in teles staff and helping pull those things and I can do a lot of the leg work to help with that time and grade while you're looking at this option and I can get that time of grade going if if that's something that helps you out quite a bit Okay So okay All right Thank you guys man Um I got we got the other options I mean quite honestly if we sign the day it doesn't really matter because we still got wages open right U I think some of it's contingent upon where we land with wages So we'll just hold on to those
uh those other articles the holidays and the hours of work Um and then we'll get back to set We'll get back to work and see where we land All right sounds good All right thank you No problem Y'all be safe out there Appreciate it Thank you