##VIDEO ID:8s1Xqdlee1Y## everybody request to speak I just want to make sure everybody no no no we cannot donate no time oh so so when 
that Happ that is at the discretion that's at   discre of the count commission meeting at 
this particular for let me let me let me   set the record straight so you can hear from 
the horse's mouth by the way my name is horis   Jones so so you're hearing from the horse's mouth 
yes as she stated it's very very important that   you speak at this meeting at that you speak 
at this meeting the chairman and this board   they don't allocate time and minutes like that 
that that's at the discretion of the the other   board if they do that but this board does not 
but it's very very important that you speak   at this meeting if it proceeds to that level 
so I want to say that for anyone who want to   speak on any of the res zonings or or cases so 
do you have a time limit here yes ma'am we do   on how long we can the chairman will let you know 
that yes ma'am every three minutes three minutes on all right good morning everybody uh this meeting 
of the Escambia County planning board for October   29th 2024 is hereby called to order with 
six members present we do have a quorum   uh if you could just please put your 
phones on silent as not to disrupt   the meeting and if you could please 
stand and join me in the Pledge of Allegiance Al to the flag of 
the United States of America   the it stands Nation indivisible andice for all all right do we have proof of publication 
yes sir did the publication meet all legal   requirements yes sir I'll now entertain a motion 
to wave the reading of the legal advertisement   so moved second motion is second all those in 
favor please signify by raising your right hand   all those opposed motion carries the rezoning 
meeting minutes from the previous meeting dated   October 1st have been provided to the board are 
there any additions deletions or Corrections if   none I'll entertain a motion to accept the meeting 
minutes and thank you we got a motion do we have   a second second all those in favor please signify 
by raising your right hand all those opposed all   right motion carries the resoning hearing 
package for October 29th with findings of   fact have been provided to the board members I'll 
entertain a motion to accept the rezoning hearing   package with findings of fact and the legal 
advertisement into evidence do we have a motion Motion in a second all those in favor please 
signify by raising your right hand all those   opposed motion carries will the court 
reporter please swear and members of the staff all right and the board has previously 
qualified staff to offer expert testimony in   the area of land use and planning do any of 
the board members have questions regarding   qualifications and ability to offer expert 
testimony okay at this hearing the planning   board is acting under its authority to hear 
and make recommendations to the board of County   Commissioners on rezoning applications these 
hearings are Quasi judicial in nature and quasi   judicial hearings are like evidentiary hearings in 
a court of law however less formal all testimony   will be given under oath and anyone testifying 
before the planning board may be subject to cross examination all documents and Exhibits that 
the planning board considers will be entered   into evidence and made part of the record opinion 
testimony will be limited to experts and closing   arguments will be limited to the evidence in the 
record before making a decision the planning board   will consider the relevant testimony the exhibits 
entered into evidence and the law each individual   who wishes to address the planning board must 
complete a speaker request form and submit to   the planning clerk at the front of the room these 
forms are on the table in the back of the room   and you will not be allowed to speak until 
we receive a completed form please note that   only those individuals who are present and give 
testimony on the record at this hearing before   the planning board will be allowed to speak at the 
border County Commissioners no new evidence can   be presented at the BCC meeting therefore all 
testimony and evidence must be presented here   today the planning board will Rec will provide 
a recommendation for each resoning request to   the board County Commission which will review 
testimony documents and Exhibits consider the   closing arguments and make a final decision all 
Decisions by the BCC are final anyone who wishes   to seek judicial review of the decision of the BCC 
must do so in a court of competent jurisdiction   within 30 days of the date the board accounting 
commission approves or rejects the recommended   order of the planning board all written or 
oral Communications outside of this hearing   with the members of the planning board regarding 
matters under consideration today are considered   expart Communications expart Communications are 
presumed prejudicial under Florida law and must   be disclosed as provided in BCC resolution number 
96-13 as each case is heard I will ask that any   board member who has been involved in expart 
communication to please identify themselves and   describe the communication as required by section 
27.2 of the scambi County Land Development code   the planning board's recommendation to the BCC 
shall include consideration of the following   approval conditions the applicant has the 
burden of presenting competent substantial   evidence to the planning board establishing that 
the requested zoning District would contribute   to a resort result in a logical and orderly 
development pattern the appropriate surrounding   area within which uses and conditions must be 
considered may vary with those uses and conditions   and is not necessarily the same area required 
for mailed notification a logical and orderly   pattern shall require demonstration of each of 
the following conditions condition a consistent   with the comprehensive plan that the proposed 
zoning is consistent with the future land use   flu category as prescribed in the Land Development 
code chapter 3 and with all other goals objectives   and policies of the comprehensive plan if the 
resoning is required to properly enact a proposed   flu map Amendment transmitted for state agency 
review the proposed zoning is consistent with   the proposed flu and conditional to its adoption 
B consistent with zoning District Provisions the   proposed zoning is consistent with the purpose 
and intent and with any other zoning establishment   Provisions prescribed by the proposed District in 
chapter 3 C compatible with the surroundings all   the permitt permitted uses of the proposed 
zoning not just those anticipated by the   rezoning applicant are compatible as defined 
in chapter six with the surrounding uses that   the uses of any surrounding undeveloped land be 
considered the permitted uses of the applicable   District compatibility is not considered with 
potential conditional uses or any non-conforming   or unapproved uses also in establishing the 
compatibility of a residential use there is no   additional burden to demonstrate the compatibility 
of specific residents or activities provided by   fair housing law D appropriate as spot zoning 
where the proposed zoning would establish or   reinforce a condition of spot zoning as defined in 
chapter 6 The isolated District would nevertheless   be transitional in character between the adjoining 
districts or the differences with those districts   would be minor or sufficiently Limited the 
extent of these mitigating characteristics   or conditions demonstrates an appropriate site 
specific balancing of interests between isolated   district and adjoining lands e appropriate 
with changed or changing conditions if the   land uses or development conditions within the 
area surrounding the property of resoning have   changed the changes are to such a degree and 
character that it is in the public interest   to allow New Uses density or intensity in the 
area through rezoning and the permitted uses   of the proposed District are appropriate and 
not premature for the area or likely to create   or contribute to sprawl at the beginning of each 
case as long as there are no objections from the   applicant we will allow staff to briefly present 
the location and Zoning maps and photos of the   property next we will hear from the applicant and 
any witnesses that they may wish to call on then   we will hear from staff and Witnesses they may 
wish to call and then we will hear from members of   the public who have filled out one of the speaker 
request forms in the back of the room there are   two cases to be heard today the first resoning 
application for consideration is case number z- 2024-the to medium MDR medium density residential 
district 10 dwelling units per acre as requested   by mayor Bush agent for house a prayer 
for all nations Incorporated the owner   members of the board have there been any expart 
communication between you the applicant of the   applicants agents attorneys or Witnesses with 
fellow planning board members or anyone from   the general public prior to this hearing have you 
visited the subject property also please disclose   if you are a relative of or business associate 
of the applicant or the applicant's agent no to   all no to all no no to all no to all no to all 
and no to all all right staff was notice of the   hearing sent to All interested parties yes sir and 
was notice of the hearing posted on the subject   property yes sir all right um May are you okay 
with them presenting the uh Aerials and pictures   first okay staff if you could please go through 
the maps and photographs for Cas e-22 24-16 good   morning board Caleb mccardy a paint planner for 
scambia County this is our location map showing Z 20241 our 500t radius zoning map showing the   current zoning of ldr our future L use 
designation of the property is mixu Suburban the property is currently 
vacant surrounded by some various   vacant land and subdivisions 
right behind the fairgrounds   this is an aerial photograph that 
actually shows the wetlands um around the area and this is a better view of the aial of the property in addition to another 
aerial there thank you this is   our advertisement our public hearing 
sign that was placed at Long bellw Avenue additionally this is looking north of the 
subject property along bellw this is looking South   across bellw from the subject property looking 
West along Long bellw Avenue this is looking   East along bellw towards Mobile Highway from 
the subject property we also put another public   hearing sign on Buckland drive to the north there 
this is looking South onto the rear of the subject   property looking at the adjacent property from 
the back side of Belleview on Buckland and this   is looking East from the back side of the subject 
property and this is also looking East from the   back side of the property and this is looking 
North from the rear of the subject property um   at the cisac along Buckland that concludes our 
maps and photography for this case all right   thank you um at this time uh mayth I'll have you 
come forward Ward um we don't need to have you   sworn in as you are a lawyer representing your 
client uh but would you please State your full   name and address for the record yes um Meredith 
Bush 125 East in tendencia Pensacola Florida   32502 and did you receive a copy of the resoning 
hearing package and the findings of facts yes   and you do understand that you have the burden 
of providing by substantial competent evidence   that the proposed resoning is consistent with the 
comprehensive plan furthers the goals objectives   and policies of the comprehensive plan and is not 
in conflict with any portion of the County's Land   Development code yes all right go ahead um good 
morning members of the board I appreciate your   time today so you may recall seeing this um file 
before you a couple months ago back in August I   believe August 6th um at which point in time 
you recommended approval to the board of County   Commissioners the board of County Commissioners 
remanded the case back to you for consideration   related to storm water concerns um I can go 
through the findings again however the findings   and staff's findings haven't changed since last 
meeting staff recommends approval um and we still   have presented the same information that we've met 
all the requirements of the criteria um to allay   some of the fears of the neighborhood um I would 
remind everyone that apartments are not allowed   in MDR so if you grant the MDR our resoning 
requests the kind of rumor going around this   is going to be some kind of apartment complex is 
is simply not the case um but also in response to   the board of County Commissioner's directives 
our engineer who's present and can speak today   met with joy Blackman the County engineer and has 
met with Matt Skipper the County Drainage engineer   and we're in a position to work together in a 
collaborative effort to improve the storm water   in the area around the subdivision and in the 
existing subdivisions um those specifics would be   determined during the design process um there is 
a pre-application that has been submitted but one   solution could be a combination of the existing 
storm water pond that's in the Westerly sub   neighboring subdivision with our newly designed 
storm water pond so there's you know the idea that   the storm water ponds would be combined that 
would provide additional storm water storage   theyby reducing storm water discharge to the Bell 
viw Avenue right away um the County engineer also   discussed a project that's in the works I 
believe it's in the design phase um which is   the expansion of the Hogan Road stormw water pond 
so there are um proposed projects and there is a   proposed remedy that would help alleviate some 
of the existing storm water concerns while this   is not a direct criteria to Grant the resoning 
the Bor County Commissioners did remand it back   on this on this basis so um I'm happy to go back 
through the findings of fact if that's what you   would desire otherwise I would have Mr Fitzpatrick 
our engineer come speak to the storm water to um   issues and whatever the will of the board is 
board do you have any questions for Meredith   or would you like to hear from the engineer that 
she's brought here today I would like to hear from   the engineer and if uh when the engineer speaking 
could we have the wetlands map put up on the board all right and I'll just um have you please 
State your full name and address for the   record and have you be sworn in please I'm David 
Fitzpatrick uh 10250 North POF Fox Street it's my office I do all right please proceed uh uh a couple weeks 
ago month ago I met with joy Blackman the County   engineer and we talked about just you know what's 
going on in that neighborhood or that area and   mainly the problem from what I heard from her is 
the areas south of the project are experiencing   storm water issues they are working the county 
is on Solutions and expansions of existing storm   water ponds down there uh we talked about trying 
to maybe enlarge the stormw water pond on the   property to the west of us and kind of included 
in our design um that would help alleviate some   of the discharge to Belleview Avenue uh since 
all these things were designed and improved   our subdivision will be held to a 100-year storm 
design criteria and um all the others are designed   with 25-year that took effect in 2014 so so it 
is going to make for a larger storm water Pond   and um should alleviate some of the issues 
on Belleview Avenue okay uh anybody have any questions David have you done any um have you 
done any additional research like do you have   any grade have you shot grade yet and done 
like a survey is there any of that done no   sir we haven't yeah hadn't made it that far 
just curious the county has a a sort of a   contour map that we use that shows the property 
falling from the north to the south towards bellw so where's the holding Pond for 
the neighborhood to the West right in   the Southeast corner of the subdivision 
right where the cursor is there there's   a small storm waterer Pond right there 
and so y'all's thought is to expand that   one into y'alls and is that kind of 
what the idea was yes sir okay thank you will you explain to the board and myself 
the public what's the difference in um cine   storm water for 25 year flood and 100 Year 
fire storm um a 25e storm is somewhere I   can't remember exactly but somewhere around 
eight or 10 inches a day for a 24-hour period   that's the most you'll get in the 24-hour 
period for a 25e storm a 100-year storm is   over 13 inches in one day so we're required to 
use that um that method nowadays to to uh to   make sure the ponds are larger than what 
the older ponds are so it's quite a bit larger there any further questions okay thank you very much Marth do 
you have anything else at this time Walker oh   excuse me yeah I'd recommend that the board 
either vote to uh have Mr Fitzpatrick as an   expert uh or not in that uh field Mr chair 
I make motion that we accept as testimony   as expert second I would recommend that 
Mr Fitzpatrick explain his credentials   experience prior to a vote that's the 
chair's discretion yeah I'll good uh   I've been a civil engineer in Pensacola born 
and raised here since uh probably about the   late 90s so been doing civil engineering work 
since that time and probably done hundreds of   projects in scambia County just by itself 
Since U since the late 90s in your PE yes sir and just to add and staff do concur staff 
has we have worked with David on many other   projects with the certification and the the the 
County engineer has well so he has submitted   many projects with this scaming County even 
before I got here they was here I'm old do we   need need anything from on our side of things 
to show proof other than the testimony we were   just given it's the chair's discretion but 
not necessarily okay all right any further questions all right we've got a motion 
in a second um make David a uh expert   witness yes and I would clarify what 
exactly Mr Fitzpatrick is an expert in   make a motion based on his testimony 
and that he be accepted as an expert witness that good I'll second all right got a 
motion a second all those in favor please signify   by raising your right hand motion carries 
all right um anything else Meredith no this   time okay all right uh staff will go into your 
presentation if you will yes so um our findings   um we confirmed our findings from the previous 
hearing U nothing's changed from our findings   we found that the request for the resoning still 
met all criteria for the resoning um and that's   essentially it we can go back through the findings 
if you like but we did find it still meets the criteria all right is there any questions 
for staff from any the board members um   when we've got something like this where it's been 
remanded on storm water issues and we've already   approved this agreeing with staff's findings 
previously and uh in agreement agreeance with the applicant I'm a little confused as to what we're 
looking for here today or that maybe the board   is looking different um today than than what 
previously happened in August if I may looking   to the packet they wanted us to review criteria 
e so if my recommendation would be to just if   we could go over criteria e again to certainly 
and um refresh your memories that's absolutely   correct um criteria e um deals with appropriate 
for changed or change changing conditions um and   the board County Commissioners reprimand it 
back specifically based upon that criteria um   from our findings we show that the land uses are 
development conditions when the area surrounding   the properties have not changed and that the 
development within the area has remained low   to medium density residential and with the 
request for MDR the potential uses densities   and intensities Allowed by that district will 
be compatible with the existing surrounding   development patterns the proposed amendment 
would not create contribute to Urban spraw these are the same findings that you had before 
I think the packet has not changed other than   the updated pictures is that a correct statement 
that is correct yes okay thank you if you will   remind the board what's the highest um intensity 
use of MDR that is allowed in the code it is   single family residential very similar to what 
is z right now U no mobile homes no Apartments   um those particular thing the primary 
difference is allowance of the density   per acre okay and the highest use of ldr 
is yes single family residential at four   dwelling units per acre um the MDR request is 
single family dwellings at 10 dwelling units per acre all right any further 
questions for staff at this time all right um at this time we'll move into 
comments from the public and again if you would   like to speak on this case um make sure we 
got a a form filled out they're in the back   of the room we do need one a separate one for 
each each case that we hear so um just wanted   to give you a heads up and then again if you'd 
like to speak at the board of County Commission   meeting when they see this again you do have to 
speak here today so um all right at this time   uh we'll start taking testimony um and if you 
will just make sure to please State your full   name and address for the record and be sworn 
in um as you come up so first we've got David Gibson David Gibson 608 Yellow 
Rose Drive Pensacola Florida 32526 I do uh good morning gentlemen thank you for your 
time uh this opportunity to speak um where that   drainage Pond is I live right to the left of 
that right in that Cur second curb there so I   know a lot about what's going on um we this 
that's the Rosemont subdivision there it's   U Zachary Estates on one side the property 
that we're discussing on the right side and   what has happened is we have a tremendous 
water problem there um I have some pictures   that I'd like to enter in as evidence if we 
could do that all right if we can pause his   time real quick board um the speaker has 
asked to submit into evidence pictures of   uh I assume flooding issues that occur in the 
area uh if this is something that y'all would   like to accept into evidence to to look at 
we can certainly entertain that motion and   I believe we can look at the photos before we 
make that decision is that correct board how   would you like to proceed I think the we're 
supposed to ask you know these are pictures   you've taken I've taken and you've printed them 
off and they these are from your you correct yes sir I'll make a motion to at least 
review the the pictures for now okay   well we'll look at them real quick 
and then make a decision yes sir appreciate it sir do you have a date of the photo um this 
was right after the most recent no sorry these   were the most recent pictures and this was um 
well let me take that back we've had a couple   of floods since these pictures but these were 
from the hurricane that took place the like two   days after the hurri came so to clarify this is on 
Yellow Rose Drive Yellow Rose Drive okay right in   front of my house right next to the catchment 
pond all right and this is the detention pond   on the Southeastern corner correct correct just 
to clarify and again just one more clarification   what we're seeing is the road is is is swamped 
it's swamped okay and that's after about uh uh   a day well about a day and a half actually of 
water going down after the hurricane hurricane Sally Sally all right board um and we've had other floods 
since then but this is but if you'll noticed   the car there that tried crossing the gentleman's 
or their neighbors yes sir let me get let's like   get this make decision up here what we like to do 
with these before we proceed um board is there any   action that like to be taken and whether or not 
to put this in evidence or not two things I mean   we don't have a date stamp so that's one thing 
you know we can't and especially if it's taken   into evidence and then on top of it all yeah it 
shows the subject property there but it's not the   ROI it's all really the southern neighborhood as 
much as I want to take that in I'm not comfortable   taking that in um myself I'm kind of an agreement 
I think it it I I like the pictures but I think   it needs dates and I think it needs direction 
that we're looking you know we can't really   tell where this is on any adjacent property so 
I don't know that it would be good evidence to accept I'm the opposite it it 
tells the story but it's not a   I mean again we don't know where it is 
so I I'm I'm okay taking it um but it's not but he doesn't have that so I don't have it so 
um yeah I'm me I'm I'm I'm good taking it because   it's it's does definitely show that there's 
water in the thing and I I guess my opinion   is you would almost welcome a development to 
the to the east that will clean up the water   so it's actually would be information that would 
propose that the development to the east would   be a good thing because they're going to clean 
up the water that's shedding into their their   houses or their roads I'm good with it as well I 
have a question for staff is that a dry Pond I'm   uncertain myself um the engineer may be able 
to reference that David you know if it's a   dry I think it's supposed to be a dry okay the 
picture and this is the thing and and and if I   may we need to we need to be clear because 
these things has the potential to be to to   has the potential to be challenged um that um you 
stated that you stated that this happened after   Hurricane Sally yes hurricane Sally so you know 
that was a substantial reain event and and and   basically all of scam count was really inated 
by a great deal of rainfall during that period   so so so we do want to we do want to make make 
qualifies this type of evidence that basically   that okay not not to negate it please not to 
negate it at all because it occurred but we   do want to state that was after a substantial 
hurricane with a was a lot of rain was in so   here's I'll accept a motion if we've got one and 
we can vote on whether or not to accept this or   not uh I would ask if you do make a motion that 
it's that we accept the witness's testimony uh   under oath that it was after Hurricane Sally 
with the date um and that he is being truthful   with his location of where these pictures are 
so or else we'll just continue to move on and   and and let him finish his timeout I go ahe 
go ahead I'd like to make a motion to accept   it uh with uh based on the witnesses testimony 
I'll check okay we've got a motion in a second   to accept this into evidence is there any further 
discussion on on that if there is not all those in   favor of accepting this into evidence please 
signify by raising your right hand all those opposed take that as a we'll accept it 4 to2 is 
that correct gentlemen okay uh We've accepted this   in Evans we'll start your time back up and you may 
continue thank you uh the top picture if you'll   notice the car that's there that tried driving 
across the gentleman's or their neighbors uh yard   uh got stuck uh that's quite frequently happening 
there uh also the bottom one uh is uh oh let me go   back to the top one I'm sorry uh that's about 3T 
of water uh the uh in the deepest spot there um in   the bottom one you can see that the uh water is 
draining into the catchment pond from the ditch   uh it's not uh the ditch is not or the Pond's not 
dip uh dumping into the ditch that's been part of   the problem uh there and it U and so the water 
is the big issue for us uh when Zachary Estates   was built on the uh far west side of of our 
subdivision uh there was no um uh consideration   of water we have water being dumped into our 
um uh subdivision uh We've complained about it   the county says that there's no easement anything 
that they can do between the two uh subdivisions   uh We've complained about other issues with the 
the field uh the county had an easement they came   in and have kept that easement cut which is cut 
down on some uh burglaries that have been uh took   place in our neighborhood a lot of our homes were 
uh burglarized and so the ditch is is one of the   big problems when the county filled it in to put 
sidewalks they diverted all the water to the north   side of Belleview and uh and part of the problem 
there too is I and I I want to ask the the staff   and the engineer did you do a a perk test of the 
the uh uh the ground there because there is a uh   about a 3 foot well like about a twoot layer clay 
layer there in fact there uh in the bottom corner   or the um to the east of the property that's 
a pond which is an Old Clay Pit that was mined   and there's about a a 2ft clay layer that is there 
that keeps the water from perking down and that's   another issue that has been created there and 
so uh and then Belleview is a two lane road uh   it has become a main Thorofare we have tractor 
trailer trucks 10 to 12 times a day coming down   through there uh making a shortcut so they don't 
have to go down to softly field and come around   and um uh and I know y'all can address that uh 
it's a traffic issue that we need to uh take up   with another committee and um but um I'm glad 
to hear thank you for the clarification that   it's um uh it's uh going to be remain consistent 
there'll be no Apartments going in there yes sir   I'll just let you wrap up real quick okay and uh 
that's basically um but we support I supported the   church uh I was uh all for them going in there it 
was a real contentious before y'all were probably   on the board and I supported the church wanted 
them to go in there and they uh and um in fact   one of the Commissioners talked to me afterwards 
uh about that so uh that's it thank you thank you   board um just to clarify earlier statement there 
was a question about the actual Pond itself is   dedicated as a public retention Pond um engineer 
may be able to speak more but Retention Ponds are   designed to hold water um for my understanding 
negative let me can I address that real quick   please yeah the uh the pond uh does Perk but they 
had to come back in I moved into the neighborhood   in 2000 and the pond was not perking uh when it 
uh finally dried up enough that they could get uh   equipment in there they dug it down past the clay 
uh and you can see it when it's dry uh there you   can see where they dug down to make it to where 
it would perk but it's not big enough especially   since we're having back flow out of the ditch 
into the the uh Pond and uh in this development   if if they're going to have the same problem if 
that something's not done with that ditch thank   you and if I may and if I may I know you may have 
many many many questions but we do want to State   again again that from the record we want to be 
clear that with the DRC process if this proceeds   this these things will be evaluated extremely 
carefully and closely by our engineering team   Mr Mr Fitzpatrick already basically talked about 
see already had discussions on that particular   issue let me let me please let me finish but 
I just don't want people to understand that   understand that there is if it's approved 
there's another process where all of his   the gentleman perk test all those things will 
have to come doing that process and the county   can even require more enhanced standards more 
than the minimum with with these areas that   has the potential that of flooding so so these 
things if it proceeds they Dev will be evaluated   during that site plan VI process thoroughly and 
completely so quick question kale before we get   into more public here we're talking about this 
Pond this Pond would is it dedicated from that   subdivision development to a scambia county the 
one that Rose Yellow Rose Drive is so a public but   is it for that specific subdivision because I'm 
not seeing how at least I'm not seen from these   pictures and from Google Street View on the plat 
which consist of Rosewood yellow rose and those   subject roads that pond was dedicated as a public 
Pond within that plot okay cuz what I'm seeing is   I'm just doing a quick Google you know search or 
not search but you know street view and I'm seeing   how public right way is draining into this pond so 
um there may have been a redesign I mean I'm just   looking from the pictures that they Supply looking 
from this I'm just trying to understand a little   better how that subdivision is working with that 
pond I mean that's kind of my question here on   that one Absolut so so to clarify it is a wet Pond 
dedicated on the on the plat done way back when um   it was a public retention Pond now again to attest 
to the residents of there there may have been a   redesign or something at a later date but it was 
dedicated as a public retention Pond and there   were and there were a different set of Standards 
we want to be clear there was a different set of   standards that were utilized back then again the 
county has higher and more enhanced standards   now that they will be evaluated at doing and at 
that process what was the date of the dedication February 1995 yeah all right our next 
speaker is kadji Hurst if you please   come forward state your name and address 
for the record um be sworn in and we'll   start your time my name is Kadija Hurst I 
live on 6016 yellow Roose Drive H Florida 32526 do you that the testimony to I do um 
I would like to kind of piggyback off my   neighbor's testimony I love two doors to his 
right um specifically we have had drainage   problems that look exactly like that picture 
in off hurricane season um in January the 2nd   of January 2017 not apologize I don't have photos 
but if I'm telling the truth I have those photos   where I could present from J ar ar 2nd 2017 and 
December 1st 2018 which as we know is outside of   the hurricane season as it ends November 30th um 
so it's not just post hurricane that we get that   much drainage that much rain and actually if you 
were to go down Mobile Highway just if you were to   turn from Mobile Highway to B you would start to 
see the drainage in the the retentions on the side   of the road as I approach my house I already know 
that I may not be able to enter my neighborhood   if I'm driving in my Chevy twoo sedon because the 
water is just too high I've literally had to park   at a neighbor in Zachary State's house just to 
walk to my house because the flood is not going   to do anything but total my vehicle um so that is 
one of my main concerns um is is this a premature   plan because I did actually see the plans to 
create drainage that flows down should we like   at least see if that will improve our situation 
um I saw that they were trying to make ditches   larger um I just have concerns there and then as 
far as the two-lane highway I just 80 more people   I don't know if this is the right committee but 
that just seems like a lot more visitors down the   road where we already have people flying through 
and the two to three speed bumps is supposed to be   our problem solution to that and it just doesn't 
doesn't seem like it quite is enough um as far   as Community growth we do have three story tow 
houses just around the corner at the edge of bellw   and Mobile Highway that are being built along with 
construction on the other side of the road where I   just wonder if this is going to be problematic for 
us as far as creating more congestion in our area um and do we have the schools 
I know we said at the time that   schools were at were not at capacity 
but we haven't included all this new   uh construction would that still 
accommodate that without causing concerns thank you thank you all right 
our next speaker I've got Edward and   Jacqueline linning um if you'd both like 
to speak if I could just get a form from   both of you or for just one of you 
and if you'll just state your name   and address for the record and be sworn in 
lenning and it's 501 B Avenue Pensa Florida 32526 yes I do um as you can tell we're right 
there at the South the little blue house we   look directly at this property we've looked at 
it for the last however many years um as the   previous neighborhood said about the congestion 
going on both between Belleview and softly on   both sides of us on mobile and what is the other 
highway right there they've got new um tow houses   Apartments they're building some over near the 
elementary school and those are main highways   you know they've got a little bit more room they 
don't have homes right across the street you know   it's a quiet community we've got near what 7/ 
t0 of an acre with our property and currently   trying to sell it my mom was living there we 
moved her so it's one that we're working on   okay right now as y'all were saying with the 
zoning it's already four homes per acre which   should be adequate for a subdivision as such if 
you look at the neighboring subdivisions along   with their water why do you need 10 homes per 
acre up to that's like 200 homes in a 20 acre   spot and then that's not even allowing Belleview 
Avenue has we have a sewer there the sewer line we   pay will that not make the sewer harder worked 
or need improving on I think we're one of the   only homes that are on the sewer perhaps at that 
area of the private homes we've spoke with other   neighbors that are also you know disappointed 
because we're concerned like yall had said no   apartments and it'd be single family homes okay 
how is our property value going to go when you've   got that many single family homes are they going 
to be th000 square foot homes 1500 square foot   homes will there be any minimum will they be 
twostory single story like how you know we   don't see the necessity of the difference in the 
zoning if you know right now it's allowable to   put an adequate subdivision if that's where y'all 
are really going why increase it to that many you   know we just don't all the extra like the other 
neighborhood said with the traffic people already   go through there there's speed bumps sometime you 
see people come flying over the speed bumps and   do aerial Dukes of Hazard things but you know if 
we've got that many more people and then to the   construction okay we're trying to sell how is 
that construction how long will that take for   the construction to complete itself before we 
have to sit on our property to sell it because   nobody wants to buy a home when you're sitting 
there looking at 20 acres of construction per se   and I know I'm short on time but I know a lot of 
the neighbors might not be here but they're very   disappointed because it's a quiet neighborhood 
where you walk your dogs and your kids up and   down the road where you don't get that a lot like 
further over toward Michigan and and stuff like   that affect the value of our house yeah we're 
concerned with our value of our home also to   you know because we moved my mama closer anyway 
thank you very much all right our next speaker   is uh don Tinker if you please come forward state 
your name and address for the record and be sworn in Don Tinker 6050 Yellow Rose 
Drive here in Pensacola 32526 do I do good morning I'm not too accustomed to public 
speaking but anyhow um you know this zoning was   made on and decision was laid out when they uh 
the House of Prayer of all Nations acquired this   property they knew what they were acquiring 
and things and they came out they looked at   the property and said hey this is a great place 
where we can build our church and uh flourish   and uh I actually have a card from one of the 
gentleman that attends that church he gave me   that day as they approached and looked at the 
property they said yeah we envisioned soccer   fields and things like that and uh it would be 
good for your community and uh so far it's sat   vacant I've been at that uh residence for 27 years 
and I've seen a lot of uh things that happen and   I can test to all the the flooding issues and 
things one of my neighbors who can't be here   cuz she's leading a homeschool uh classroom uh 
lives in uh my neighborhood uh Rosewood and butts   up against Zachary Estates well unfortunately 
it doesn't take much of a rain to uh create a   flooding problem in her backyard and uh because 
there's no easement there just as David had said   um it's left to the individual Property Owners 
to deal with it now also within Rosewood all   the other neighbors have the same problem clay bed 
right underneath their little sawed grass standing   water and if you go and drive in our Rosewood 
subdivision you can see the dirt staining all   along the curbside everywhere you go in there 
it it exists and it and we're not opposed to   um development by no means but certainly density 
compounds problems and issues that are not seen   and decisions that were made previous to you 
members of the board and things I don't see a   need and do not understand no matter how much you 
explain with aerial photographs single snapshot   photos of that property on how it's going to 
be different it would be one thing if someone   walked out there with us grabbed some neighbors 
and said hey show me demonstrate to me or let me   understand what your existing problems are and as 
far as burglaries we were at one time the highest   area per capita of burglaries and I lead our 
um Neighborhood Watch program and brought it   a long ways uh just to alleviate that that 
property like I said I'm not opposed to it   being developed but the dens is an issue and 
i' certainly appreciate some real you know   on the ground look at the problems issues and 
concerns of all of us that live in that area I   did have one more thing if I could just make it 
quick yes sir all right the Belleview Elementary   and Belleview Middle School share a parking 
lot morning drop off and afternoon pickup is   always a traffic issue when it comes to bellw 
Avenue and Mobile Highway and like David said   as well uh heavy vehicle traffic is being routed 
off of uh Blue Angel to come down Belleview to   hit Mobile Highway and avoid softly fi thank 
you very much thank you our next speaker is   Larry fedman if you'll please come forward state 
your name and address for the record and be sworn in Larry fedman 4971 bellw Avenue I do okay big issue we just bought this home 
a couple of years ago we've lived there and   water issue is a big problem sewer system 
isn't large enough we get a heavy you get   a rain of two inches you can't flush your toilet 
you can't handle the water through there you're   going to put in all brand new sewer system 
bigger you know I mean I couldn't believe it   I could had to Glass Neighbors what's going on 
I can't even flush my toilet because it rained   you know and then in the mornings um I found 
out from one person I talked to he said well   one issue we have he said every you noce you 
don't have any water pressure in the morning   at the sink and I said yeah I says I thought 
it was something wrong and with the plumbing   and stuff start checking into that now and the 
well out there apparently from what I'm told   from other neighbors isn't large enough so the 
water pressure is down in the morning but then   then the middle of the day when everybody's 
gone showers are done they're out the water   pressure comes back up you know and now you're 
going to add all this across the street from   my house and they can't handle it you know you 
can to dig up all the sewers and cost all that   more money to replace all that so we can you know 
have water pressure and stuff and drain flush our   toilet when it rains you guys don't care and 
you know you don't check with people and it's   ridiculous and I bought that cuz it looked like 
a very nice neighborhood it is nice traffic is   terrible you add that much more traffic on there 
I get accidents right on the corner of malun and   bellev where I live every day almost people just 
run that stop sign they don't care all these kids   school buses and stuff come down through there 
you're just adding so much more traffic and you   know I just don't see where it's a necess Neary 
not that kind of home housing to put in there   so that's my what I've got to say about it thank 
you very much our next speaker is um Mary kopka   probably butchered that I apologize uh if you 
please come forward state your name and address   for the record and be sworn in my name is Mary 
kopa I live at 6248 moldun Road penscola 32526 I do before you start my three minutes I've 
got handouts because three minutes will not   cover everything I have to say so I put it 
in writing you want to accept it or not uh   board we would you like to take um the written 
testimony we'll take a look at it staff if we can while we're reviewing this could 
you please pull up criteria e again um um attorney I got a question I want to be I 
want to I always want to protect the record with   these proceedings attorney um um she has presented 
written evidence a written her written testimony   now um to to make sure to preserve the record if 
the board so desire to to take this in as evidence   at the Nick just trying to make sure she's clear 
understand so we can always be clear that if she   does not verbalize her statements here at the 
BCC meeting can she say what she did not say   at the BCC meeting because it has been submitted 
as evidence I want to because we got transcripts   that that that we being that are being taken I'm 
always on the account of preserving the record for   these matters sometime if it go to court that it 
won't be thrown out afraid of so yeah no no I just   want to be clear for y'all just to make sure that 
she's clear to preserve her record as well so yes   we want the Commissioners to see the evidence one 
second one second I'd say it all but I only have   three minutes so you know what are you supposed 
to do I so I wrote it all down I I I just want to   make sure that the attorney to be clear it's the 
board's discretion whether to accept or reject the   written communication you want me to sign it I'll 
sign it so once it's the board's discretion uh to   accept it if it becomes part of the evidentiary 
record I would say that it could be presented   at the BCC meeting because it's part of the 
evident evidentiary record uh however I would caution the board to accept written 
Communications uh typically it would   be uh a summarization of the points made in 
that that the testimony would be provided   uh rather than accepting straight written 
Communications for opinion testimony that   is okay though is this the testimony you'd 
like to give and speak to whether or not you   got the time or not if you had a half an hour as 
this what you would like to say that's part of   it I'd like to address what was addressed today 
too so here's Here's my thought um part point one   which is the drainage is definitely what everybody 
else has been talking about the TR the traffic the   schools the security and the parks and Open Spaces 
are not our preview so I in my opinion I would   say read what you have to say on the drainage we 
don't have to take the the written thing because   only thing that matters is is actually what the 
um board accounting Commissioners remanded back   to us was for is the drainage the rest of it 
is um not in our preview to discuss okay so   that's how that's what my opinion is forward no 
sir that's traffic actually it get that usually   gets taken care of after our we're not allowed 
to really consider that in in today's hearing   unfortunately can we pull the Criterion up on 
the screen for everyone too so board Reed has   made a suggestion that if we um have Miss canop 
go through the drainage issues which has been   remanded back to the uh planning board from the 
County Commission uh that that would be maybe the   best use of time here and then adding on um any 
other evidence you'd like to give as well [Music] um I don't think we have to make a 
motion if we're not going to accept it   um Bo i' just like to offer up that uh criteria 
e does it does if you look at the last statement   there that will will a resoning contribute 
to sprawl and I think sprawl is a product   of traffic it's a product of what happens to our 
schools I have Max build out once again it would   be nice to see the numbers the impact on our 
schools of Max buildout with the new zoning   and I I give that traffic has put their their uh 
their assessment in here but again criteria e will   this contribute to sprawl with a a rezoning 
so I I think these other even though the the   the County Commissioners specifically address 
drainage I think it's within our purview to to   to look at the other issues as well that the that 
concern the citizens I.E traffic impact on our schools all right we need some direction 
here or we're going to we're going to move on I recommend if this is her her statement and   writing that she has a three minutes 
get through what you can get through like that idea I think just conceptualize it 
the same thing you would with the board of   County Commissioners because I'll tell you that 
when this goes up there you're going to have   your three minutes to talk too same thing here 
I me remember you know you have the ability to   communicate with your County Commissioners at 
any time doesn't have to just be at the County   Commission meeting so you can email this to 
them you can have a conversation with them   this is doesn't have to be you know submitted 
into the record for anything other than just   over here sir sir please laer ma'am if 
uh if I can if you're okay with it read   through this if you're getting close to 
time and you haven't gotten quite all the   way through it I'm going to let you keep going 
okay okay but he brought up a good thing if you   send all this to the county commissioner 
is that exp parte no ma'am okay no ma'am okay is that good with you all right let's on 
your mark go you got it Chris Chris I want to be   hold on for a minute I want to be clear because I 
think Mr M Mr Reed asked a good question do during   the rezoning processes do they have the right 
during the resoning to send information to the   commissioner doing in after the planning board it 
is is that in in sync with the qu judicial rules   I want to be clear because we we got to we got to 
preserve the record and got to make sure we follow   by and I hear what you're saying Horus but to me 
this is nothing to do with actually the parcel   that is going to be reson this is their community 
that they're having issues with and they've had   issues with this community for a long time for 
drainage and sewage and traffic has nothing to   do per se with what the zoning is this is just a 
a place for them to voice their concerns but this   is something I think they've been dealing with 
the county for a long time and if you know I I I   feel we want to change the density sir enough um 
the the ability for y'all to communicate to your   uh your staff your County Commissioners and stuff 
on issues like this that have been going on for   years I think you all should be be doing that 
on a regular basis knocking on the doors as   much as you possibly can so that's my opinion 
of what yall next next step there has nothing   to do with this zoning and if you keep it out of 
this zoning that's the key you have the ability   to talk to them as as much as you want to but 
if you start bringing into the zoning now we   getting into rules and laws and stuff of that 
that you cannot talk about unless you're in a   quasi judicial meeting such as this and the board 
of County Commissioners so if that makes sense   y'all read between the lines what y'all need 
to do communicate with your your your County   Commissioners don't talk about the zoning I'd 
like to clarify a point uh i' advise the board   and the public for that matter to uh review 
resolution number r 96-13 uh which governs uh   exp parte Communications over pending matters uh 
that uh defines expart communication and I'll go   ahead and read it verbatim for the purpose of 
this resolution an expart communication means   an oral or written communication or presentation 
of fact or evidence to one or more quasi judicial   decision makers made outside of the public hearing 
by a party witness or advocate so that would be   related information related to the zoning matter 
coming before the board would qualifies as expart   communication uh the public can always contact 
their Commissioners any expart communication   received by quas quasi judicial decision makers 
would have to be disclosed and it's presumed   non-prejudicial if it's disclosed uh there so 
it does not bar citizens rights to contact quasi   judicial decision makers uh they always have that 
right to do so but that information would have to   be disclosed if it is received and viewed by the 
Quasi judicial decision maker okay so here's what   I'm going to give advice to everybody here and 
then I'm we're let you speak okay you've been   up here for a minute if you want to talk to your 
county commissioner about this go ahead it's up   to them to make a decision on if they're going 
to disclose if it was prejudicial or not um and   that's not on you that's not on us that's on them 
to make that decision so if you got an issue with   something let it be known Reach Out contact them 
and at that point it's on them okay all right if   you go ahead and we'll let you give your testimony 
go all right so one of the things I wanted to   bring up real quick parks and Open Spaces that's a 
Florida State Grant thing I can't apply for it but   anybody in a county position that does this stuff 
can and I'm I'm angry at the church because they   lied it's like oh we're going to have a church 
and all these open spaces and parks and tennis   courts and soccer fields and that's not they 
want money that's what it's all about I want   parks and Open Spaces um drainage no I don't live 
within 500 feet of that property i' probably live   501 ft from it down moldun road but I get all 
the wash down moldun Road I have a business on   moldun road I keep the drive dirt I don't want 
asphalt on that drive it makes it really hot   we repair lawnmowers I have people who try to 
drive their lawn Wars off their truck and fall   over it's easier landing on dirt than asphalt and 
from the north here comes the water and it washes   away my dirt and I've had the drainage pipes 
the the county put in exposed because all the   dirt washed away the back of my property which is 
right near Hogan's pit floods every time it rains   it doesn't take preh hurricane you might think it 
does from listening to these other people but it   it doesn't it's really all hard rain my back 
property floods right near Hogan pit but you   know what Hogan Pit's up there my property's here 
so where does the water go not in the pit it goes   in my backyard so I don't have any access to my 
back everything's up front um so the drainage is   really horrific and I I traffic's horrific I 
don't have much more to say except what's on   there uh parks in Open Spaces I like my hudel 
I like my squirrels my little rabbits my baby   bunnies that are wild I think that supposing and 
guessing that this building won't affect draining   AG that's why BOS sent this back here because he's 
walked that area he's been there after it's rained   he knows the area and he's really concerned and 
although in the the meeting here initially Mr   Jones says oh sometimes developments help drainage 
in the board of County Commissioners meeting   they asked an engineer and they and the engineer 
said we can't guarantee that that it's not going   to flood even worse when you build that much when 
you put that much concrete jungle and already you   know there's a drainage Pond not sufficient I 
just think that we need our park and open space   thank you thank you very much thank you all 
right Andrew bler uh you please come forward   state your name and address for the record and 
be sworn in Andrew BL 6101 my displace Pensacola Florida I do I also want to be swanning as a 
submatic expert of how dumb County engineer   is and y'all look like six intelligent 
people people whatever and I know it   got remanded back to y'all so if you can 
do right now certify me as a subject mtic expert and what exactly sir 
the intelligence of engineering and the flooding in BW a Avenue 
Hogan's pit um Zachary Estates   Rosewood Estates Tanglewood EST States Amber Ridge he says that they're all 100-year ponds now 
but how come Amber Ridge how come Tanglewood how   come um Buckland drive those 100-year ponds ain't 
working how come we spent millions and millions of   dollars on three projects on Godwin Lane so I'm a 
subject M expert I want to be certified okay I'm   10 times better than any engineer we can't do 
that and we don't want to waste your time your   talk your clock is ticking we don't want to waste 
the time with this please continue your statement   well y'all waited the the signing pictures and 
stuff I want to be certified as a submatic expert   I didn't have a motion to do that so this time 
we'll continue yall look like six intelligent people what you don't like my 
trump hat what's wrong with y'all okay well here's this thing this guy from Baton 
Louisiana if he wants to have 200 houses in 20   acres he can do that in Baton Rouge Louisiana 
as a matter of fact I mean why don't he make a   burm all the way around his house or whatever and 
put the 200 units in his house in his front yard   or his backyard he doesn't have to come here 
how much money does the county spend just with   Rosewood how much money do we spend on that 
fixing that holding Pond how much money did   we spend on fixing Zachary Estates for holding 
ponds how much money we spend how much money   would you um Barefoot Estates how much money 
we spend on fixing that holding Pond how about   Tanglewood we had three storm waterer projects on 
Godwin Lane for Tanglewood we had another project for Amber Ridge we had another project on Godwin 
Lane for the other thing and we still got I got   pictures right here you want pictures of on the 
holding Pond there on Buckland drive or water   is still full County engineering is supposed 
to have been fixing that I took it today the   Pond's full I've got to work order I've got a 
work order to um Roose Department to to fix it   or whatever um where's where's our County engineer 
representative do we have one oh my God you're the   County engineer representative all Mr don't think 
so address up here please we don't have a County   engineer repres so we got flooding we've got 
flooding flooding flooding flooding from Godwin   Lane coming all the way down onto onto bellw 
Avenue we've got flooding from Zachary States   comes down BW Avenue the the thank you ECUA thank 
you the ECUA storm sir manhole covers get blown   off Jaclyn Rogers if you please come forward state 
your name and address for the record and be sworn in good morning gentlemen my name is 
Jacqueline Rogers my address is 142 Ridgeway cement I do I wasn't going to speak on this but 
I just want to say that you guys are giving out   this criteria in the beginning that we have to 
speak to you are again leaving out the bottom   part of section 2 d7.2 LDC zoning map and text 
amendments this is a zoning map Amendment it's   changing it's a reason zoning it says here clearly 
and this is why Mr rushing I believe is incorrect   when he says you guys cannot consider this other 
information it says board action this is number   five so you have all those criteria and then 
there's something about mobile homes which why   they stuck that in there at that point I'm not 
sure then it says board action if the reviewing   board and this is you and I'll show you this 
is you finds from the record of the hearing   that the applicant has presented competent 
substantial evidence establishing the required   conditions that is the applicant has met all the 
criteria the board shall then consider you have   a job after that whether maintaining the current 
zoning which in this their case is ldr will serve   a greater public interest then it says the board 
shall recommend approval of the resoning request   to the BCC so they are talking about you the 
planning board because you're recommending it   to the BCC if the board again the planning board 
finds that no New Uses or density or intensity of   use of the proposed zoning will likely diminish 
quality of life those are quality of life issues   that she was talking about reduce property values 
yes you have to have proof for that confer special   benefit on the subject property to the detriment 
of the community as a whole or create other   adverse impacts that's flooding flooding is an 
adverse impact that you must consider even if   the applicant meets all the other criteria you 
and the board must cons consider this you cannot   pass this responsibility off to the BCC it's 
talking about you it's saying if you're going to   recommend approval to the BCC to the detriment of 
the community as a whole or create other adverse   impacts upon surrounding properties more than the 
uses density or intensity of the current zoning   so if up zoning at MDR is going to make more 
adverse impacts you guys aren't supposed to be   approving it you're the planning board and while 
you're not responsible for the infrastructure   you can demand from this staff more competent and 
substantial evidence that this recurrent flooding   is addressed there's very boiler prate every time 
I come to these meetings they boiler plate and I   know you've been asking for more um Mr ingwell 
more documentation that's what you all should be   requiring that you must consider these things even 
after they meet all the criteria thank [Applause] you all right uh next speaker is Mark 
krod if you please come forward state   your name and address for the record and be sworn in hey good morning my name is Mark 
krod 1500 vert Lane Kenton Florida 32533 I do uh it it it seems to me like the 
board recognizes that there are problems in   this General vicinity you know whatever it is 
if it's traffic or or flooding or combination   of things and referring back to the uh approval 
conditions uh the item e says that uh you have   to determine that it is in the public interest 
to allow the new density I'm I'm cut a few words   out of there but that's that's you know 
what it says in item e which may be why   it was remed back to you kind of as Jacqueline 
was talking about a minute ago that you know   you all have to consider whether this requested 
change makes good sense whether it serves the   public interest or is contrary to the public and 
if it doesn't serve the public interest then you   don't you don't approve it is is how I take it uh 
I don't see with the problems that exist right now   that have existed apparently for many years and 
still haven't been addressed I don't understand   what logic would approve take an empty field 
that is zoned to allow uh four units per acre   and say oh you can have 10 units per acre that 
doesn't seem to be in the public interest seems   like it would be public interest to get some of 
these issues addressed probably before any goes   on but in in in that field but uh you lay the 
groundwork for for unease and discontent in   the entire neighborhood when you grant additional 
rights to folks when the the rights of the people   who live there are being trampled on as it is 
and so anyway I yield the rest of my time thank you thank you uh Chris cerb if you 
will please come forward state your   name and address for the record and be sworn in still in the Z Chris curb um 
5999 Somerset Drive P Florida 32526 truth and nothing 
but the truth that's what I spit all right uh I'd like to 
be sworn in as expert witness   I worked 25 years in the scami county I know 
the storm water area I know the Basin studies   I I know what the County's doing on the storm 
water out here I know the new codes coming in um   so uh I'd like to be sworn in as expert witness 
testimony I think his history that we can allow that Chris uh further credentials   degree I have a civil engineering degree from 
uh Auburn University I work 25 years in the   storm Mar in the engineering department first 
11 I did development review pretty much storm   water and subdivision regulations worked 
seven years doing Capital Improvements and   the last seven years before I lost my job here 
um I was the storm War engineering manager um   actually prepared a lot of the budgets that will 
eventually dress the flooding in this area but   uh that just requires money while previously 
working for the county did you ever testify   as an expert witness many times I've been 
court on different things code enforcement   on different things actually was in a federal 
um case as an expert witness uh for Bristol   Park uh subdivision class action lawsuit where the 
Neighbors in there flooded and they International Paper i' like to make a motion to accept him as a 
expert witness second any discussion you still uh   is your uh engineering license still active I 
do not have a professional engineering license   and one reason and one reason only well there's 
actually a couple of reasons but I never will   have a politician tell me to design and seal 
something that I'm not comfortable with which   that's happened in this building before the other 
fact is I never did take never did pass the test so any further questions I would advise that the 
board considered him an expert you would decide   on what exactly he's an expert in in the motion 
dorm water I'll find my motion then to accept him   as an expert witness based on his experience 
with storm water management and engineering all right does the second still stand stand all 
right any further discussion all those in favor   please signify by raising your right hand all 
right motion carries Chris please go ahead thank   you I really didn't prepare for this uh thanks 
Andrew for giving me a call this morning but uh   so I'll do it uh on the cuff I'm good at doing 
that August 28th the uh professional advisor   committee had a meeting uh to discuss uh rile 
data used in storm water designs something I've   been harping on for the last three and a half 
years in January area y'all will be uh probably   hearing that uh testimony or that uh code change 
in the design standard manual um I don't have a   schedule yet but I think that's uh plan that way 
um there was testimony in here I I guess from   horse that you know we're we're using a 100-year 
design storm are we I submit to you that we're not we're using 1979 rain po data and the 
difference is 2.76 in if you're at the Pensacola   Airport uh rainfall gauge and two inches at if at 
J rainfall gadge up there well you multiply that   over a big large area and you get a lot of water 
that's not accommodated uh I David Fitz spctor   here he said this one's one of his um I asked 
him was he going to use Excuse me never well he   has a professional engineering license so I asked 
him was he going to use no outlas 14 for uh his   storm water design he says probably but he's not 
required to because the code hadn't been changed   yet that's a big problem um section 2- 7.2 in 
the LDC just as Jacqueline said earlier public   interest there is a lot of flooding in this area I 
can attest to it I've been out there the County's   even got a project project that they're working 
on um actually met with a County engineer just   a little bit I can't remember the actual date but 
uh we were going over uh it's called the the Velma   SLE field moldun uh project it's actually on their 
website it's quite expensive uh storm water system   that's been I think they've been looking at this 
study for I don't know 5 years now four years they   were looking at it before I left the county and 
uh the number one uh project that they're going   to try to go after will be a d resilience Grant 
and uh they're going to be expanding the uh Hogan   pit and putting drainage on uh biew Avenue the 
problem is it doesn't exist now the capacity the   drainage system on biew Avenue is underc capacity 
as attested by these folks saying it floods all   the time in that area and you are a planning 
board that's respon not responsible for the   infrastructure but I'm telling you the capacity 
is not there for storm water at this time it will   be in the future thank you thanks Chris approve 
so all right that was the end of our speakers   for this case um board members do you have any 
questions uh for the applicant staff or members of   the public I have uh just one question you based 
off of Chris's testimony he said the he says that   the law is going the uh the uh rules are going 
to change in January um for storm water and my   assumption is this is November is um building out 
this this uh subdivision will probably be within   the new laws so that would be a benefit for the 
community correct Chris it's the data of approval   uh of the preliminary PL or construction plans 
um whatever codes in it in effect at the time is   what will apply all those sub divisions around 
there Zachary EST States I think you mentioned   that one for one Rosewood they're based off 25- 
year storm water designs not a 100e they didn't   change that criteria until 2015 but the criteria 
has now changed and the pack has changed it for   a 100 Year based off of no Atlas 14 rainfall data 
which is dated 2012 that doesn't even include INE   April 2014 hurricane Sally that won't be coming 
out until wasn't it in 2023 last year there was   a bad blood then that won't even come out to 
2026 to be up to date and current that's based   off Congressional floods act and precept act so 
uh Noah is still working on getting our rainfall   data to a point where we can use it but we're 
still using 1979 I mean come on I'm 50 years old so any other questions I don't have any anybody else 
I have a question kind of related from   I have a question kind of related to Chris 
for David is that possible for Fitzpatrick   the engineer yeah David what is this this if 
you design this what code are you going by   today we're required to go by the code that's 
present today if we if we don't design it till   next year then it it might be adopted in January 
if it is we use Atlas 14 what are you doing right   now currently right now we're using the code is 
today it's not the atlas 14 is it 2020 I'm trying   to remember it's it's the the same rainfall 
data curves that we've had for years and   years and years it's just it's gone to the 100e 
storm Now versus it was 25 year in 2014 gotcha any further questions if I may add 
something here the 1979 rainfall data   that both the scami county and C resar county 
is using has been archived by dot it's marked   clearly across there on their website do 
not use in design yet we're still using it any uh further questions yeah 
I'm going to allow Meredith sir please Meredith um yes very briefly just 
to address some of the citizens comments   um there's been a lot of talk of 200 units while 
I understand the board can't um you know base your   resoning decision on the actual proposed use by 
the applicant I would like to point out that um   the density anticipated on this site and 
there's a pre-application that's been filed   would be 4.47 units per acre so not Max build 
out of 10 it would be 4.47 so slightly over   the four allowed in ldr um as far as quality 
of life and flooding issues all the testimony   you've heard today really relates to flooding 
problems in the adjacent neighborhood um what   you've heard the expert testimony has been that 
this will improve those conditions either through   joining the storm water Pond or through other um 
avenues that the county is currently funding and   designing to to rectify some of those flooding 
issues so I would just remind the board that   um you have received competent substantial 
evidence both in our submission and in the   staff's findings that we've met all five criteria 
um the staff's findings related to criteria e did   not change today um that we have met that IIA 
E I don't believe anything you've heard from   the neighbors um changes that or Rises to 
the level of competent substantial evidence   to change that finding and we would just ask for 
your approval does anyone have any questions for Meredith um any questions for staff from the board um think how to ask this um have you seen or is there a way in which 
um a planning board decision can be made that   includes storm water mitigation 
um that's contingent upon the the rezoning so the board is asked by the LDC 
to consider the criteria in 2-7 B4 those   are the criteria that have to be stuck 
to uh there are certain conditions which   arguably relate to storm water uh but the 
decision has to be based on the established criteria say it disapproval I mean   I understand I appreciate everyone coming out to 
speak on this and I see where all right all right   I appreciate everyone coming out and speaking on 
this one here but there seems to be a consistent   theme you know we're talking about every other 
partiel and County Road technically around this   site not this actual site we're talking about the 
change of use in this and that's what our board's   here to do is follow this Criterion to change 
of use for this specific property but everyone   has talked about specifically over and over 
again about existing flooding issues in their   own respective subdivisions and this is where 
I would imply this is where that your elected   officials and your development services people are 
the ones to talk to in regards to these issues we   have multiple layers of local government that are 
here for this and this area I understand is prone   to this we've been shown that it's prone to this 
for this specific site though I don't think think   to say that this is from a rezoning standpoint 
alone not the improvements that would be coming   from a development Review Committee perspective 
this site on its own right now is not contributing   that I can say to this and I just implore everyone 
in this area and I I'm looking at every single   one of these neighboring developments and I keep 
seeing one consistent thing is the scambia county   is the one who maintains the roads and maintains 
the storm water infrastructure in the respective   subdivisions I implore you to speak with your 
elected representatives in the regards to this   matter but once again by the Criterion that we're 
doing on this one here and I would also implore   after the fact to go to the development review 
committees and voice your concerns for that but   on this one for the criteria that we have I think 
our hands are kind of held tight taking the money   and run so excuse me I everyone's gotten a chance 
to speak you given your testimony I so yeah she's   the applicant of the property so I'm done I'm 
not we're done okay so um board members are   there any comments or questions for the applicant 
or staff still if not then we'll continue to move   on with um accepting a motion um for what we'd 
like to do here we do at the County Commission again all right I'm going to ask one last 
question the County Commission put this   back to us to De to further I guess fles out 
storm water issues in regards the Criterion e and I guess my my question is what's the 
anticipation on how to take care of that issue for   them other than I mean we sit here and if we're 
going to vote like we did a couple months ago that   doesn't really fix anything up from their end of 
the table that I would assume that they wanted us   to look at so this board provides a recommendation 
to the board of County Commissioners uh   importantly the evidentiary record is uh added 
today so the testimony of the citizens as well as   the experts are now part of the record for which 
the board of County Commissioners to review and   consider uh that evidence that was presented 
but your recommendation is a recommendation   to the board of County Commissioners for the final 
decision who will review that evidence evidentiary record make a recommendation dis approval until 
they fix the problem I make a recommendation to   uh move Z 2024 -11 for approval second is there 
any discussion on the motion all right if none   then I will uh entertain a or I will all those in 
favor of the motion please signify by raising your   right hand all those opposed the motion carries 
4 to one with one person off the Das all right um we move on to our next case the next resoning 
application for consideration is case number z-20 24-20 which requests rezoning of 810 
Neil Road from low density residential   district four dwelling units per acre to 
commercial District 25 dwelling units per   acre as requested by Meredith Bush agent 
for 29 and Neil Development LLC the owner one second board as we let everybody clear out so all right members of the board have there 
been any experte communication between you the   applicant of the applicant's agent attorney or 
Witnesses fellow planning board members or any   one of the general public prior to this hearing 
have you visited the subject property please   also disclose if you are a relative or business 
associate of the applicant or the applicant's   agent agent um no to all no to all no to all no 
to all no to all we'll get one more in here we're   going through xart communication uh on case z-20 
24-20 no to all all right staff was hearing of the   was notice of the hearing sent to All interested 
parties yes sir and was noticed that the hearing   posted on the subject property yes sir great um 
Meredith are you okay with us going through the   Aerials and photographs all right staff if you 
could please go through that good morning Allison   Lindsay urban planner development services so this 
is the location map showing the location on Neil   this is the zoning map showing the current ldr 
zoning and this is the future land use showing   mix suburban and this is the existing land use 
of the property and this is an aerial view of   the subject property and surrounding and this 
is the notice of the public hearing sign that   was posted on Neil Road this is looking West 
along Neil Road this is looking East along Neil   looking North under the subject property looking 
South across Neil Road and that's the maps and photography all right thank than you um mirfield 
please come forward um and then did you receive   copy of the resoning hearing package and finding 
facts for this case yes and you understand you've   got the burden of providing uh substantial 
evidence that this is not in conflict with any   portion of the County's Land Development code yes 
all right please go ahead um thank you I'll just   walk through the criteria Meredith Bush 125 East 
intendencia Pensacola 32502 so as to Criterion a   consistent with a comprehensive plan the proposed 
amendment is consistent with the intent and   purpose of the future land use category of mixed 
use Suburban Criterion B consistent with zoning   District Provisions the proposed amendment 
to commercial is consistent with the intent   and purpose of the Land Development code the 
commercial District establishes appropriate areas   and land use regulations for General commercial 
activities especially the retailing of Commodities   and services the primary intent of the district is 
to allow more diverse and intense commercial uses   than the neighborhood commercial allowed within 
mixed use districts to maintain compatibility   with the surrounding uses all commercial 
operations within the commercial District   are limited to the confines of buildings and 
not allowed to produce undesirable effects on   surrounding property to retain adequate area for 
commercial activities new and expanded residential   development within district is limited um actually 
that's is consistent with the commercial future   langes category which this is mus so that 
doesn't apply as to criteria C compatible   with surroundings the proposed amendment is 
compatible with surrounding existing uses in   the area within the 1500t radius the applicant 
has identified properties owned ldr ldm and hcli   to ensure additional compatibility with existing 
adjacent uses if the amendment is approved further   review and evaluation through the development 
Review Committee process may be necessary as   to Criterion D appropriate of spot zoning the 
amendment request if granted would create spot   zoning despite being a case of spot zoning the 
proposed commercial designation demonstrates a   strategic and coherent approach to development the 
introduction of new commercial zoning in this area   would technically create a case of spot zoning 
as it would establish a distinct zoning District   that differs from the surrounding ldr and hcli 
zones however this spot zoning is appropriate   because it functions as a critical transitional 
buffer between the hli and ldr contrasting land   uses by placing commercial zonings between the ldr 
and hdli zones it helps to mitigate the potential   negative impacts of industrial activities on the 
adjacent residential neighborhoods the commercial   Zone provides a gradual shift and land use 
intensity reducing conflict such as noise   traffic and visual disturbances while offering 
nearby residents convenient access to services and   amenities this transition enhances the overall 
compatibility of the area and promotes a more   harmonious development pattern this zoning 
adjustment also maximizes the potential for   economic growth in the region and as to Criterion 
e appropriate with changed or changing conditions   based on the existing uses and intensity 
intensities and the zoning District allowances   the proposed amendment would not create urban 
sprawl and would be compatible with existing   development it is in the public interest to allow 
commercial zoning the proposed resoning will   contribute to a logical and orderly development 
pattern um one thing that's not included in those   findings if you go back to the existing zoning 
map um the parcel is actually being combined and   that we're just waiting on the property appraiser 
to um if you go to the the zoning map sorry there   you go with that hcli parcel so that will all 
be one unit um it's just not combined yet in   GIS and I'm happy to take any questions staff does 
recommend approval we're in agreement with staff's findings so if it's combined it'll be a 
split property it would be a split Zone   parcel correct okay um we couldn't go to hcli 
because the future land use category um is Mu can you call it put up the future to land use so then how did the other partiel 
get to be what's going to happen   to the one that is currently hli so 
I believe that's part of an opt out um in which um you have allowed the hcli 
zoning in mus because the um in intent   more intense industrial uses are limited by 
that mus category but there is a provision   in the code that um that states that hdli 
zoning is not preferred in the mus C it's   just in the industrial commercial future land 
use category so when we discussed this with   staff um whether to go hcli or commercial they 
felt that the lower intensity commercial would   be a buffer in transitional um zoning District 
between the two U the neighboring residential   so yes board to confirm what the applicant um 
the resoning criteria of acli um dictates that   heavy commercial light industrial zoning may be 
established by resoning only within the mixed use   urban commercial or industrial future land use 
so it wasn't available to reone to hli due to   the future mix use Suburban land use but the 
opt out pre-existed that and help me help me   with the opt out because this I believe this 
was um the Robertson Robertson's property one   the first opt out correct yes that was his his 
was the first but this was not his this was not   his okay when when did this opt out what was 21 
I believe okay 21 but we can check for the actual date yes sir it's 21 and is there plans to 
when you combine this when they combine them   does that mean that this parcel will also 
be an opt out parcel too give me give me   some history on on like combining and what that 
means to you know this parcel so they're not in   the sector plan because they were opted out so 
it when they are combined you still will have   hli in the commercial um and because the mixu 
Suburban is the future land use the mix use I mean   the um heavy commercial light industrial because 
the mixu it's mixu Suburban that does um sever if   you will the use of the heavier industrial 
uses in the hli if it's mixed use Suburban there any other questions 
for the applicant at this time all right okay we'll go ahead and turn it 
over to staff okay so the rezoning um   800 Neil Road from ldr to commercial for the 
criteria a consistency with Comprehensive plan   the proposed amendment to commercial is consistent 
with the future land use of mixed use Suburban um   the intent is to promote new infield development 
in already developed areas and to be resourceful   with existing Transportation networks utilities 
and governmental services this resoning request   to commercial will accomplish these directives 
by creating the possibility for retail sales and   services that will provide daily Necessities to 
Residents within a short walk or drive time the   development plan is supported by the future 
land use 1.5.1 which was created to encourage   Redevelopment and underutilized properties 
and to maximize development densities and   intensities consistency with the 
Land Development code on criteria B the schema County Land Development code it 
offers Direction when analyzing compatibility   when a new use is introduced section 3- 1.6 
compatibility contains criteria that describe   describe New non-residential Uses in relation 
to existing residential uses section 31.6 B   states that such criterias are created to allow 
for residential and non-residential uses to be   located in close proximity to each other other 
items of the compatibility may be required such   as Landscaping buffering and screening to protect 
the lower intensity uses from commercial use the   commercial District creates appropriate areas 
and regulations for General commercial activities   especially the retailing of Commodities and 
services the 5.0 plus or minus acre property   will be combined with the 8.76 plus or minus acre 
parcel it's on the corner of Neel and Highway 29   satisfying the location criteria changing the 
zoning from ldr to commercial would allow for   commercial operations along Highway 29 that 
would benefit the residents in the area and   reduce vehicle trips and congestion within 
a walkable or short drive distance criteria   compatible with surrounding uses the proposed 
amendment would be compatible with surrounding   existing residential uses in the area after a 
site visit within the 500t area the majority   of the surrounding land uses are ldr and hli 
the requested commercial zoning district is   appropriate for General commercial activities 
such as retail sales and services requiring   all of the the uses to be in the confines of a 
building the the proposed request to commercial   will be a trans transition between the ldr and 
the hli resulting in a long-term compatibility   with existing residential uses without conflict 
criteria D appropriate with spot zoning it would   establish spot zoning um as there are no other 
commercially zoned properties in the area the   intersection of Neil Road and Highway 29 is an 
appropriate location for commercial development   to serve the residential neighborhood allowing 
cohesiveness between residential and Comm Comm   commercial aspects of the area criteria e 
approved with change conditions the land   uses or development conditions within the 
subject area surrounding the property they   are changing there is a new subdivision Enclave 
at bellara located on the adjacent parcel to the   north the subject parcel will be joined with 
this hcli property along Highway 29 making   it a corner lot the area along Neil Road has 
residential family single family residential lots   the request for commercial and the potential 
uses Allowed by the commercial District would   be compatible with the existing surrounding 
residential development patterns and that   concludes staff's findings or 
do we have any questions for staff all right um at this time we'll move on 
to members of the public who'd like to speak   um please note that we base our decisions on the 
approval conditions and exceptions in section 2-   7.2 of the Land Development code and note that 
only those who are speaking here today will be   able to speak at the subsequent Board of County 
commission's hearing and if you got a form filled   out which it looks like you all do based on the 
crowd so we will go ahead and start with uh Sharon   curn if you'll please come forward and state 
your name and address for the record and be sworn in I'm Sharon C 1100 Ridgeway 32533 I do all right well first of all whenever 
she's giving all those things she's talking about   how great it is for the residents um I'm one of 
those residents and I do do not feel that way in   fact I'd love for you to put the view of Neil 
Road up there because whenever I bought right   there when you turn off of Highway 29 you get a 
beautiful country road lots of green overhanging   trees lots of shade it is a dead end Road my 
neighborhood is at the end of it this is nothing   commercial about this road or this property when 
I was looking over the findings um I was looking   at the the the things that it said proximity to 
a traffic generator there's no traffic generator   there's no businesses on the west side of highway 
29 from the Paper Mill North there's nothing it   talks about infill development it says that it 
needs to be in an area where already established   non-residential uses it's all single family 
homes there's nothing commercial nothing that's   non-residential about this area it also talks 
about not aing to a single family residential   zoning District there's a neighborhood it's 
going to but right next to neighborhoods it's   right across the street from housing um it says it 
should benefit residents um we did it move out to   the country to walk to businesses an outing for 
us is to get dressed up and go to Waffle House   across from Tate high school we if we want to buy 
groceries we have the grocery advantage we have a   wind Dixie in fact wind Dixie had to move further 
south to get the business that they wanted right   now old wind Dixie is a gym um businesses at the 
corner of Mogi Road and Highway 29 they don't make   it right now every day when I drive north I see 
a pot leaf wave at me because no other business   could make it there um whenever you're thinking 
about these I think that you need to think about   perspective what some person might want they might 
want to live in walking distance they might want   to have a grocery store that's close by but you 
don't move north of Kingsville road if you want   those things we don't want those things where 
we live we don't want to live near Commercial   properties this is a rural area um we have we have 
the grocery stores we have the things that we need   um I was thinking that if I want to buy something 
if I want to get like a trailer to to haul cows   or something like that I I'm going to go to 
robertdale I'm going to go we don't we don't have   that mindset that you're thinking we don't want 
those things close by and then I'm saying that   I don't think that the criteria were met and if 
you disagree with me I think you need to go back   and you need to look at number five board action 
the board shall then consider will maintaining   the current zoning will serve a greater public 
interest we're not just asking to go from um for a   four dwellings per acre you're asking for 25 units 
of commercial and that's a lot thank you thank you   uh next speaker is Mark kod if you'll please come 
forward and state your name and address for the record hey good morning again my name is 
Mark krod 1500 vert Lane cantonement Florida 32533 go ahead okay uh uh just several 
kind of random comments about about this   resoning one of the things is that one of 
the one of the key topics is that it'll   provide a buffer well actually there the 
current zoning is the buffer what the what   the applicant is asking for is to upzone an 
area five acres to provide a buffer to Other   Well it it already exists as what single 
family home whatever that existing zoning is they're not talking about down zoning the light 
industrial stuff along 29 to be commercial they   want to keep that but have a split partiel 
zoning W split zoning parcel I I don't know   how that would ever end up working out we have a 
commercial parking lot but an industrial facility   you know I'm not sure how that would work out 
I don't understand how uh you know taking Tak   another property upzoning that and saying oh 
well that's a buffer it it's it it it may look   like a buffer on paper but in reality it's it's 
it's it's not a buffer it's eliminating buffer   what's there now buffers everything else 
that's around it you change what you can   do on that piece you've changed what buffer 
characteristics already exists uh there's   mentioned about uh making the change would provide 
for infill this as the previous testimony said   this is pretty isolated location it's not 
infilling this is a vacant lot that hey   this would be a great site for blah it it's not 
infilling anything um as far as spot zoning uh it   it it it says that the the impact should be minor 
or sufficiently or sufficiently limited well going   from single family residents to commercial use I 
don't I don't see that as minor or sufficiently   limited that that's fairly uh fairly fairly 
large impact um and uh just one thing for one   thing that's been a concern for many many years is 
the the zoning classifications in the county and   this goes probably back before all of your time 
most of the county was up zoned if you look at   the if you look at the photographs you look at the 
current land uses it's not four units per acre the   zoning that's applied to it retrofitted to it is 
four units per acre but that's not what exists on   on the ground so I'd ask you to keep that in mind 
and maybe the county needs to come up with more   realistic uh maybe rural density residential of 
one acre one unit per acre or half or one one unit   per two acres something like that thank you very 
much thank you thank you all right next we've got   Michelle Cerone uh pH please come forward state 
your name and address for the record and be sworn in my name is Michelle Cerrone 
1380 Ridgeway cantonement Florida I do um I moved to this area over 20 
years ago and it's where we raised our children   and we have a barn two and a half acres and had 
chickens um this is just going home is something   that is just relaxing and I oppose three zoning 
from ldr to commercial um it's an extreme change   it's not compatible with the surroundings we have 
houses is closer to Highway 29 that are armed   bigger property Lots than four per acre like the 
gentleman mentioned and um this is an area that we   go on walks and it's not something like the lady 
mentioned earlier we didn't move to this area to   go shopping we went to this area to be our Haven 
our place that we can relax and and it's just been   a wonderful place to live and I believe that this 
resoning will be having adverse effects on our   neighborhood um like I mentioned maybe um it is 
a nice area for walks we even have wild peacocks   at the end of the road it's pretty amazing um 
just having that um how would that happen with   a commercial how would they like wild peacocks in 
their parking lot with that's not something that   is something that would be good and I just really 
um oppose this and thank you for your time thank   you jacine Rogers if you please come forward 
uh state your name and address for the record   and I think we've gotten you sworn in already 
so you're good to go I won't lie again um my   name is I don't have to swear jackwell and Rogers 
1420 Ridgeway cantonement and if I could have you   guys switched to the one before that I think this 
one right there okay so if you take a look at   that real quick you can see these are the single 
family homes they're generally large lot there is   a church there also the first one on the end and 
I won't go into the history of the sector plan   um Meredith uh advocated it as the county attorney 
for the planning board and or for the county and I   oppose these and absolutely it could have gone to 
hli because that's what this one did it went went   just to hcli I had to go to Tallahassee to stop 
it from being heavy industrial but that's another   story commercial zoning the primary intent this is 
what she has in her application the primary intent   of this district is to allow more diverse and 
intense commercial uses why would you want intense   commercial uses you're talking about a rezoning 
from four dwelling units to 25 dwelling units   how is that transitional that's not transitional 
how why is she not asking for low density mixed   juuse that is a commercial allowance there this is 
inappropriate these poor people here one of them   is fighting cancer couldn't come today they live 
there in country homes and you're going to put a   parking lot Apartments you cannot know what it is 
she can tell you what it is today it is not zoned   together so you have to look at it separately 
it is spot zoning there's no commercial anywhere   around there there will be no buffering because 
the neighborhood that they mentioned that's going   in down there has no buffering they went right 
to the property line tore down all the trees   there will be lighting and visual impact to the 
people across the street those are those adverse   uh impacts that you guys have to consider even 
if you think they met the criteria but I don't   think they did uh road infrastructure is bad you 
can see from the picture that the first Speaker   showed there's no shoulders there's nothing 
to up Zone to 25 dwelling units breaker she   put on her application on page 17 this is 
infill development does that look like City   infill it says appropriate in urbanized areas 
where infrastructure structure is sufficient   infrastructure is not sufficient this is not 
urbanized we have horses we have farm animals um   I'm going fast I'm not trying to be sound mean I'm 
going trying to go fast so I hit everything with   my three minutes so um the staff said this was 
infill development this is not an urban area this   is not INF Phil there will be no buffering they 
tell you this they tell you you can address these   concerns at development review but do you know 
that initial application is not a public meeting   they do not let you attend the initial application 
so you can show up at the final application that's   all they let you show up for you can request 
emails and sift through those this is spot   zoning again um and the changing conditions she's 
right there are changing conditions you just opted   all those properties out and let bellat Tera put a 
bunch of homes in so now there's more residential   more reason why you shouldn't allow commercial 
25 dwelling units per acre across the street from   these people and this map doesn't show but there's 
houses right there too that's residential this   is not compatible you should deny it and then you 
go back to the thing that I talked about with the   other group and I'm finishing with this statement 
this will have adverse impacts and even if you   think they did meet the criteria which I believe 
they didn't you have to consider the adverse   impacts this is not a throughway the location 
criteria the only reason why she's saying they're   joining it is because this is not an arterial 
road so she's going to say well it's fronted   to Highway 29 but it's not it's it's a deadend 
road that goes to a couple of neighborhoods thank   you thanks Jacqueline all right uh that's the 
last of our speakers that we had for this uh board   members do you have any questions for the any 
the applicant staff or any of the members of the public could staff elaborate on 
their findings for criteria e   just give a little bit more detail 
on how they came to that those findings so I said D didn't i d i 
I meant D I'm sorry D okay oh okay   okay for the spot zoning okay 
um so let's see wait where am I at so we did say that it would uh 
establish spot zoning um because   they're asking for commercial and there 
is no other commercial um Zone properties   in the area so even though there may be u a 
commercial use in the area the zoning is not commercial I mean then you it looks like you 
qualify your statement oh so um basically the   intersection of Neil Road in 29 um when they 
because they did have a um application for   combination um that we really thought was going 
to be edited on the map by today but um so that   the intersection it is a good what the county is 
hoping that all the major intersections you would   have all your commercial at intersections where 
it doesn't intrude into a a neighborhood so when   these being combined it's now a corner lot which 
which fits the locational criteria that doesn't   intrude into a neighborhood or subdivision 
um but with these two these two properties   even though one's going to be commercial 
one's going to be heavy commercial light   industrial um you won't be able to do the heavier 
industrial you'll kind of you'll be stuck with the   heavy commercial versus the industrial um but 
it it does is spot as the definition because   it's not a joining or adjacent to Parcels that 
are already Zone commercial and though it has   been stated the packet before us today still 
represents two lots that have not been joined   therefore the con the lot by the applicant for 
today is not at the intersection of Neil and 29   and so the criteria being appropriate if spot 
zoning we've agreed it does create spot zoning   there's no commercial on any side of it the 
question is is it appropriate your qualifying   statement of um the intersection of Neil Road 
and Highway 29 is an appropriate location for   commercial development to service the residential 
yes in spirit that's true in letter by the packet   we have in front of us this parcel is not at that 
intersection well after I spoke to um one of the   property appraiser um staff um he basically 
said that he had done all the paperwork and   The Rock Tech has the I think if Rock Tech is 
still doing our maps that that they do it once   a month so basically the property appraiser has 
combined the parcel it just doesn't show on the   the um information that's in our current packet 
because it was done prior to the finalization by   the property appraiser to combine them we we do 
to attest for General development process in the   county run into this a lot um it may be 6 months 
before the tax records updated um you know we   consider it once we sign off on it and process the 
request um the applicant would then take it down   to the property appraiser have it appropriately 
filed um if we were to hold up things sometimes   um you know specifically ially says it's a 
property appraiser process typically says that   it shouldn't hold up your building permit process 
and things such as that so we do run into this   fairly common so you're saying it has been applied 
and approved it's just not on the map yes correct   okay so at this point in time it is combined 
parcel all in all legal senses okay thank you if you'd like to please come just make 
it make it quick once you combine them   then it butts up to a neighborhood SM 
that to a residential area thank you all right board members um any further questions 
or clarification you need before actions taken   on this resoning case Meredith do you have 
anything else thank you Reed no I would just   uh remind the board that you're looking at the 
competent substantial evidence presented by both   our submission and County staff um while the 
testimony of the neighbors you know indicates   concerns for what might be it doesn't rise to 
the level of competent substantial evidence   that there truly would be any adverse impacts 
um it it does create a buffer um between the   hcli and the ldr zoning commercial is a lower 
intensity zoning than the hcli um and it is   Frontage to Highway 29 we would just ask that 
you um Grant the resoning request or recommend approval all right board members we have anything else um or I'll 
now accept a motion one way or the other yes jackn Rogers I thought the staff was trying to 
get away from split Zone Parcels so that happened   when we redid the Land Development code and 
the zoning and combined and we have a lot of   problems with split Zone Parcels now this would 
be creating a split bone if you're going to go   with the thing oh it's already approved with 
there's no proof in the record and this is a   quasa Judicial hearing so you if if you are to 
believe that way then you are purposely creating   a split Zone parcel only because hcli would never 
never never get approved and and that's a problem   so please consider that you are creating more 
problems you are the planning board and we're   trying to get away from split Zone Parcels thank 
you thank you so the parcel is already split zoned   I mean it's it's combined as one parcel it's 
just split zones ldr to hcli versus commercial   to hli in testimony of staff that 
it's been approved and is a parcel is evidence all right anyone want to take a stab at it Walker what is their what's the long-term 
plan maybe this a Merith question what what is   the intent with this property long term so my 
understanding from the um applicant is that it   would be a grocery store to serve that that part 
of town I'll just remind the board members that   that should not be part of your consideration 
on how we vote or don't vote on this issue but and and for what it's worth the 
store would front on 29 and um the   majority of it be on that hcli parcel but the rest   of the property would would need to be 
commercial to get the square footage question of the access I don't know if I get your 
point because I'm probably in agree with where you   with you where the the access should be um and 
shouldn't be for something like this but again   I just don't want us to go down that road too far 
um since we've already started getting off on the   turning lane with it a little bit so yeah this is 
getting a weird realm especially this combination   causing a split zoning and that's already done 
fully let me ask you that you know the because   I know when you go to do that with the property 
appr appraiser they ask for a sign off from the   planning representative or someone from that 
or this county or city so staff has signed off   on staff has signed off on the combination 
and and just to follow follow up with the   the split Zone Parcels specific to section 31-3 
um of the Land Development code section D split   Parcels the LDC does address it it specifically 
says does adopted zoning districts and future   Lane use categories are parcel based but their 
boundaries are not prohibited from dividing a   parcel for Parcels split by these boundaries 
including overlay District boundaries only   that portion of a parcel within a district 
or category is subject to its requirements   where our zoning District boundary divides a 
parcel that is 10 acres or less in size and   not in a ploted residential subdivision the 
zoning District of the larger portion may be   applied um and the rest of the stuff wouldn't be 
applicable but it's it's not prohibited it happens   in being on the planning board you know some of 
these older parts of towns we see that from time   to time um but it's not necessarily prohibited 
I get that's not prohibited but I thought that   a scambia County's kind of Doctrine recently was 
kind of fix that issue so that they weren't just   hanging out there right that kind of goes counter 
to what we've been fixing take one last comment   here from the public and then what that what that 
just pointed out to me was that the zoning of the   larger parcel could be applied then to the smaller 
parcel only in certain situations I don't believe   that would apply for this why would it not apply 
what what are the situations I you that's that's   part of the problem you start it's it's a shell 
game thank you can you can you reread the 10 acres   or less portion where where a zoning District 
boundary divides a parcel that is 10 acres or   less in size and not a part of a plaed residential 
subdivision the zoning District of the larger   portion may be applied to the entire parcel if 
requested by the Parc parcel owner consistent with   the applicable flute so this is going to be this 
is going to be 133 Acres as a combin so now we're   over it and it wouldn't apply so split Z wouldn't 
it wouldn't uh just assume the other one so now   we actually would have a split zoning no matter 
what is that a correct statement right yes and   and further says consistent with the acable flu 
I think that's what we're running to you couldn't   apply the acli to the entirety of due to the mixed 
use Suburban future land use designation so we   we we won't ever be arri be able to arrive there 
based upon that criteria and the applicable flu so yeah okay I'd like to make 
a motion all righty z202 24-20 based on staff's in initial findings for   criteria D in discounting 
their qualification I recommend disapproval do I have a second for the motion this is a hard one I'm on the fence really 
on this one I want I want to Second just for the   just for the vote purposes um because I'm want to 
see I I'm still in conjury with this one um I I   don't like it going to commercial but I understand 
the the need for it um but it's this is this is   this this does everything that we're not normally 
doing which is creating spot zoning extreme spot   zoning um but there's a need for it because of 
the the front parcel that's now combined so I'm   I'm I'm going to proove uh second all right so 
we got a second uh for discussion is there any discussion I'll do tail in a read over there 
I it just feels like we're walking ourselves   on a spot zoning situation on the fact when 
that parcel's separate if with combination I   don't love the fact that we're getting into a 
split zoning I know it's allow but we've been   trying to clean that up for a while here 
so uh it's automatically it's still going   to be a split zoning because it's already 
I know I get that I get that but I'm just   saying is is we still got that scenario kind 
of paining over there um not in love with that is there a consideration for hdmu 
would it would it feel the [Music] same results that you're looking for 
I believe the issue with hdmu was the   square footage allowed um would not have been 
sufficient there was discussion of creating a   parcel 10 acres or less I mean there there 
may be another Avenue you know that will   require other maneuvering to to accomplish 
this um but the simplest and easiest you know   path of leas resistance was the commercial 
zoning but I don't believe hdmu would work all right if there's no further discussion then 
we'll go ahead and take the vote um the motion   was uh to not approve the resoning so all in 
favor of the motion please raise your right hand I'll opposed all right Mo the resoning is um 
fails by 5 to one all right um that is the last   case we had today for the rezoning meeting so 
we will adjourn that and move on to the regular   meeting the meeting of the esami County planning 
board for October 29th 2024 is hereby called to   order with six members we do have a quorum did 
we have proof of publication yes sir did the   publication meet all legal requirements yes sir 
the chair will entertain a motion to wave the   reading of the legal advertisement so moved we 
have a second second all those in favor please   signify by raising your right hand all those 
opposed motion carries 5 to Z read um off the Das   the planning board meeting minutes for September 
10th 2024 have been provided to the board I'll   entertain a motion to accept the planning board 
meeting minutes into evidence do we have a motion   moved do we have a second second all those in 
favor please signify by raising your right hand   motion carries 5 to zero with read off the dis 
uh the planning board hearing package for October   29th 2024 has previously been provided to the 
board members I'll entertain a motion to accept   the planning board hearing package and legal 
advertisement into evidence do we have a motion   so moved do we have a second second all those in 
favor please signify by raising your right hand   all those opposed motion carries five to zero with 
read off the Das all right um we've only got one   hearing to public hearing today it's an opt 
out application for consideration case number   OSP d224 d02 which requests removing 100 block 
Harvest Hill Road from the Midwest sector plan and   assigning assigning a future land use category 
from conservation neighborhood Jack Branch to   mus mixed use Suburban as requested by Meredith 
Bush agent for Chase por Pichu the owner um this   is uh property size 1.79 plus or minus acres and 
again from conservation neighborhood to mixed use Suburban I think that's it so um at this time do 
we have uh photographs of this subject property that we can run through so this is the optout OSP 20242 this is a 
location showing it on um Harvest Hill on uh how   29 in Harvest Hill this is the zoning map showing 
the current zoning and this is the future Lage map   showing the current um conservation neighborhood 
and then this is the proposed future land use uh   requesting the mixed use suburban and this is 
the just a detailed uh specific map for the   sector plan showing the property in the sector 
plan is conservation neighborhood and this is   the jacked branch in the outline this is the 
jacked Branch area and this is a development uh   program the acreage map for the 1.79 and this 
is the flood zone map and this is an aerial   map of the site this was the public hearing 
sign that was posted on U Harvest Hill in 29   this is looking at the subject property from 
Harvest Hill and this is looking east of long   Harvest till um the property is on the right I 
was facing Highway 29 and this is looking south   from the north entrance of the Harvest Hill in 
Highway 29 this is looking East along Highway 29   from Harvest Hill across 29 this is looking South 
along Harvest Hill Hill Road the backside and this   is a public hearing sign that was also posted at 
the Harvest Hill on the southern entrance this is   looking North from that Harvest Hill in 29 and 
then looking e East along 29 from the subject   property and this is looking south from the 
southern entrance of Harvest Hill looking at   the neighbor neighboring property on the south 
side of Harvest Hill in 29 looking West down   Harvest Hill from 29 and this is looking North 
along the Harvest Hill Road or on the back side   look this is on Harvest Hill uh looking toward 
uh looking East along toward how 29 and that's   the maps and photography thank you uh Meredith 
if you'd like to come forward and run us through your side of this yes thank you very much Meredith 
Bush 125 East in tendencia so I will go through   the sector plan criteria um the subject property 
is not located in a Wellhead protection area there   were no historical resources detected on the 
subject property there are no Wetlands on the   subject property the property is located 
within the Jax Branch drainage basin the   property is located within the flood zone X the 
soils indicated on site include porch Sandy LOM   and malus Sandy Loom as far as traffic goes 
the subject properties are located to the   west of US Highway 29 fdot provides an annual 
average daily traffic count along this portion   of Highway 29 of 25,000 trips all area roadways 
have capacity to support the requested change   in the future land use category sanitary sewer 
and water ECUA is the area water provider once   a project is proposed and application submitted 
to the county such proposal shall identify any   other providers and determine whether septic 
service or available sewer connection will be   utilized any proposed development will received 
approval through the site plan review process   ECUA will provide sanitary sewer if applicable 
the proposed amendment is not expected to create   capacity problems for ECUA as far as Wetland and 
drainage any necessary storm water management will   be provided in accordance with scambia County and 
Northwest Florida Management District regulations   the storm water system will be designed for 
a 100-year storm event again there are no   Wetlands on site and it's flood zone X Solid Waste 
Solid Waste will be collected by ECA for disposal   in this gamy County landfill which has adequate 
existing and projected capacity parks recreation   and open space if required the development review 
process will address the preservation of open   space the applicant understands that a detailed 
review is required through the county site plan   approval and development Review Committee 
processes School assignments the current   School assignments for this location for the 2024 
2025 school year are Jim Allen Elementary Ransom   Middle and Tate High any increase in density 
may or may not have an impact on the student   population projections any proposed development 
will adhere to the site plan review process um   need and benefit there's an identified land use 
need particular to the scope in function of the   comprehensive plan for which the amendment is 
clearly warranted the proposed amendment applies   contemporary planning principles engineering 
standards and other professional practices to   provide an effective and efficient remedy for the 
identified land use problem or need and then as   far as applicable comprehensive plan objectives 
and policies there are I believe 40 five which I   won't Bore You by listing all but 45 comprehensive 
plan Provisions listed in our submission um which   apply to this proposal parcel size and aggregate 
of other opt outs the subject property is 1.7 947   Acres the property represents 0.021 97 % of 
the existing development acreage of 8,168 22   Acres described in the sector plan total acreage 
of the Jax Branch daap designated conservation   neighborhood is 2359 Acres withdrawal of the 
applicants 17947 Acres will result in a 0.076   78% decrease in developable acres as of the time 
of this application the total acreage opted out   of the SE sector plan is 442.19 Acres underlying 
zoning and compatibility with daap the existing   Parcels are currently zoned heavy commercial 
light industrial the requested flu categor is mus the daap land use for the surrounding 
Parcels is conservation neighborhood based on the   residential guidelines language the conservation 
Neighborhood Land Use is designed to allow   clustered subdivision of De detached housing 
with a maximum density of three dwelling units   per net acre the mus future land use category 
will restrict the most intense hcli development   any proposed development may be further made 
compatible through buffering and screening   requirements of the DRC process consistency of 
the requested flu with the underlying zoning the   requested mus flu category will be consistent 
with the underlying zoning uses densities   and intensities Allowed by the hcli being use 
dependent the prior future land use designation   of this parcel was mus and lost development 
rights prior to the adoption of the M Midwest   SE scambia sector plan the parcel was owned gbd 
the parcel was effectively down zoned by the   adoption of the sector plan and a copy of those 
gbd um District regulations was included in our submission uh staff is in support of the request 
and we agree with their findings and Analysis any   questions for that I have a quick question the 
uh the current owner did not lose any did not   lose any development rights is that correct well 
they did so it was previously gbd so the current   owner did purchased this property after that took 
place is that correct you may be correct I'm I'm   not certain that's the one the I'd have to look 
at the deed but you may if if you're if it's ACC   that they um bought it within the 
sector plan then yes but the parcel   was down yeah I I in the packet I believe 
the deed is dated uh 2022 then yes you're correct any further questions for the applicant 
if not staff will turn it over to you okay so this   is the application that the they are requesting 
to remove a parcel from the sector plan and the   Jack Branch detailed um specific area plan um and 
it's is located on Harvest Hill Road um and the   applicant is also requesting that the board 
County Commissioners assigned a future land   use of mix use suburban and based on the public 
records the scambi County Property Appraisal are   partial is currently vacant and the current 
underlying zoning is hli the existing land   use derived from the adopted U daap final land 
use plan identifies it under the conservation neighborhood for um sanitary sewer the Emerald 
Coast utilities has a 12in force main located   um adjacent to the property within the rideway of 
Highway 29 and solid waste um the any development   request for will have to be reviewed and reviewed 
and approved through the uh development review   site plan for potable water poble water area is 
supplied by Emerald Coast utilities who verified   availability by letter A conceptual poble water 
distribution system was developed it's based on   the analysis and is available um in figure 
4.03 of the daap the stormw management the   um Amendment itself for opting out it will not 
rely on storm water requirements or calculations   um and based on the original analysis in 
the Des set for storm water in the area   um of the sector plan the 
storm waterer system would   be developed as a regional system and would 
Encompass multiple areas of development for um tra uh for the traffic access and streets um 
the Midwest sector plan Transportation analysis   there was one conducted on different roadways and 
segments evaluating U existing facil facilities   and and uh travel characteristics as well well 
as the potential impacts and Road capacities um   needed for a 5-year buildout plan the review 
of the area shows that various Transportation   improvements are planned near the daap including 
capacity expansions and Highway 29 the property   uh is located on the west side of highway 29 along 
Harvest Hill Road and again any future development   proposed would be required to have a formal 
sumal review and approval through the site plan   Recreation and open space um the mixed use 
Suburban L use category allows for retail sales   services and um Recreation as permitted uses the 
county does not have a level of service standards   for recreation but any development um could 
create usable accessible and open space that   would contribute to the overall interconnectivity 
of a development for the public schools based on   the public schools scam County the assigned 
schools as was mentioned is Jim Allen Ransom   and Tate the school district provided a courtesy 
review which demonstrates capacity wouldn't be   exceeded using the calculations for residential 
development on the 1.76 plus or minus Acres once   plans are submitted this will be reviewed and if 
the need arises there may be adjustment made to   the school zone boundaries to balance the capacity 
among the schools and the well heads um it was   said this was not in a Wellhead protection area 
historical sites um the applicant did provide   documentation stating there was no previously 
recorded historical resources within this parcel   the natural um environment as stated in the sector 
plan the natural resources it contains significant   Wetlands that are regulated by the state federal 
and local governments and the final design was   to avoid and minimize Wetland impacts to 
the greatest extent possible there are no   hydric soils on the site and when a project 
is submitted an environmental study will be necessary for um comp plan requirements the 
comprehensive the components of the sector   plan include aspects such as Community design 
environmental analysis Transportation guidance and   economic development principles the land use plan 
in the development program provides a specific   data with development program calculations and 
assigns permissible densities and intensities   for the various uses the parcel is north of well 
Line Road in the Jack Branch daap with access   via the Harvest Hill it's in the conservation 
neighborhood if approve the request removal of   the partial for the sector plan would not create 
a fragmented desap so the applicant's partial is   approximately 1.79 plus or minus acres and it's 
located in the Jack Branch desap at has under   JB 52 based on the calculations um the data from 
section 2.02 the document the total developable   Acres on the entire site for the sector plan 
is 86180 the applicants partiel represents uh   02 of the existing developable Acres so this is 
the 13th um opt out that's been submitted um to   in process by county and the U approval that the 
total optout sector plan aggregate Acres would be 45825 so the uh the original sector plan 
profile it identified the 15,000 Acres of   of land the availability of infrastructures and 
public services and the protection of Natural   Resources the calculations used to complete 
the maximum development scenario for the plan   uh they were specific and resulted in a balanced 
job to housing ratio changes to or the variations   of any original data used would hinder the 
balance of the viability of the uh sector plan goals so the the maximum the daap area 
would provide approximately 27,455 of 23,000 dwelling units the results of the job 
to employee residents ratio is 1.18 and it would   be noted that there is no single perfect ratio uh 
it's generally considered to be balanced if it has   a job to housing ratio of roughly 0.8 to 1.2 if 
this proposed amendment is approved the resulting   job to housing ratio is 1.26 and then the uh 
the existing Transportation infrastructure the   our TR traffic and transportation department did 
a a letter and we stated there are findings in   here that basically stated that there are 
paved shoulders it mentioned there um the   RightWay width is 200 ft and they talk 
about the Harvest Hill was um number of   lanes two pave shoulders no and they also 
stated that they had no capacity concerns   in the vicinity of the subject parcel 
connections to Harvest Hill is likely   required will likely require improvements to 
Harvest Hill potential improvements will be   vetted through the development review process 
um by esamia county and the Florida Department   of Transportation the underlying zoning and the 
compatibility with the surrounding daap land use   designation the existing partiel is currently 
zoned heavy commercial and light Industrial surrounding Parcels are zoned hli and 
ldr if removed from the sector plan um   and I listed the the following ranges of 
permitted uses are allowed and I won't go   over these it's just the everything 
that's allowed in the hli uh zoning District consistency of any requested future 
landage designation with the underlying Zone   so the requested mix use Suburban future 
land use it will be consistent with the   underlying zoning and uses and intensities 
allowed with the hli um and also keep in   mind that the mix Suburban does sever 
the heavy industrial uses from the hli zoning so before the uh adoption of the daap 
the 2020 future land use designation was a   A5 and with the adoption of the 2030 flu 
it was mixu suburban and that's why the   actual applicant is asking to go back to 
the mixu Suburban so before adopting the   Midwest sector plan the parcel was own gbd 
with the future land years of aa15 the gbd   district was intended to enhance specific 
segments of Highway 29 as a visually attract   and well planned business Community the 
old gbd zoning had limited intense uses   allowing C1 and C2 uses in a business type 
of development with extensive landscaping and   buffering standards with the adoption of the daap 
the commercial development rights for the partial   were decreased the adoption of the sector plan and 
the assignment of the conservation neighborhood   under the Deep um allowed a three maximum of 
three dwelling units per acre and according to   the historical document there appears to be no 
residential density allowed in the previous G   BD zoning if approved any future development 
associated with these Parcels will be evaluated   by the development Review Committee using the 
current zoning regulations and addressing and   minimizing any potential impacts of the proposed 
development uh could and could have any car could   have characterist any characteristics of the 
existing residential development if approved   the sector plan boundary map would be adjusted 
accordingly to reflect the removal of the partial   from the plan and then if approved the parcel 
would be assigned the future land use mix use   Suburban as requested and that's the staff's 
analysis board are there any questions for staff   at this time sorry Alison uh on the zoning map if 
we go to that are any of those Parcels opt outs you can you specify what you mean uh within 
the circle or any have that any of those been   opt outs uh of the previous 15 let's look 
at the no I'm talking a was that a thought   I think that's a let's look at a different 
map because that might be clearer because   the how about the the uh flu map maybe 
that'll yeah we have one that has a Dap I think so that one right there where the 
cursor is where the it's white it was   actually removed from the sector plan 
and then yes so anything that's white   over there was actually opted out anything 
white uh White west of 29 yes north of that partial that we just talked about so just a two on that thank you are there any 
further questions all right if not uh we've got   one speaker jacine Rogers if you'll come on up I 
think we've uh got your name and your address down   for today so we'll spare you that I might have 
forgot it but just I just want you to note that   this will be hli in mus but we couldn't have that 
before remember that's what they told you so this   is a comp plan Amendment which requires a sector 
plan opt out is a comprehensive plan Amendment   which requires competent data and Analysis yet 
if you look through this there's so much that is   deferred until later until the development review 
and you're not supposed to be changing the future   land use without this data and Analysis there's 
if you look at that one look at the map there's   all ldi um a conservation neighborhood they're 
not opted out they're three dwelling units per   acre they prevent commercial they have standards 
of that that are good for the neighborhood as you   PEC meal these pieces out you are creating 
incompatible you can't say well there might   be hcla zoning underneath they're not going to 
opt out there's a lot of homes over there if you   look at the aerial view you'll see this is very 
residential area so when you look at the analysis   they said okay well Highway 29 is but how about 
Harvest Hill that's a very small Road you saw the   pictures of it it's very country road so there's 
no side there's two lanes there's no shoulders   it's inadequate to go from three dwelling units 
breaker to 25 dwelling units breaker and the staff   did not show you competent substantial evidence 
that that that's planned it's not planned they   didn't say that um I'm going to go through my 
notes real quick uh the current owner bought it   in the sector plan so are we going to go back 
to the development rights when DeLuna came and   say you know we you know they have a property 
rights they can put whatever they want in there   he wants to put his shell dump there you know 
this is crazy when is a plan in Escambia County   a master plan an Olf master plan are you going 
to allow people in Bula to say well at one time   this property it was way before I bought it allow 
this no this is what planning is you cannot land   bank property and that's what this is happening 
it's not this is the 13th opt out ask the staff   how many have opted out of any other land use 
category besides conservation neighborhood the   answer will be none this was a bait and switch you 
spent a million dollars on this this same staff   maybe not these members scambia County took the 
data and Analysis to the state and said this is   where the conservation neighborhood area should be 
because look there's Wetlands nearby and it drains   into the Jack brand Basin but now all of a sudden 
that magically goes away now the staff is saying   oh there's no problem where is the Environmental 
review to change this it's not here they're going   to defer it into a closed process that these 
citizens can't get into unless you really really   really want to sift through emails there is no 
initial development review and I'll talk about   that later in public forum um the analysis talks 
about the the daap you talk about the daap as your   proof and but you're opting out of the daap in 
the analysis for portable water it talks about   the deap uh figures but you're you're opting out 
of that you're going up to 25 units per acre and   I don't believe there's a full analysis up to the 
maximum development and I've heard m Mr ringwell   ask and you guys are going to have to require the 
maximum the the the de the data and Analysis has   to be for what you are approving which is 25 
dwelling units per acre they can say they're   going to put whatever properties change hands you 
guys know that the develop the data and Analysis   is not there I could say more if you have any 
questions but it's getting old it's getting old we   don't we're not planning we're we're just you know 
unplan whenever we feel like it would have Dev ER s uh board if you did have questions 
for M Rogers we'll allow for that but   if there are none um we'll take questions 
for staff or the applicant still at this time and then there's none of that then I will 
accept a motion uh for this public hearing   I move to accept OSP 20242 all 
right I've got a motion on the   table um does that motion have 
a second second is there any discussion all right uh motion is to approve 
the opt out for case OSP 20242 with a second   no discussion all those in favor please 
signify by raising your right hand all   those opposed motion carries 5 to one all right 
do we have any other action items or discussion items no was that a no that's next I got you I'm with you 
Jacqueline if you want to come up uh for public form real quickly I I want to challenge any of 
you guys have you ever been to the development   review like have you ever gone to the meetings 
the initial development review have you gone to   that because it's not public you may have gone 
as a developer but have you gone as the public I   used to go I went with Teresa Blackwell before 
I've went another time but if you look on the   agenda now it says initial application is not 
open to the public so I want you guys to think   about that when you're telling people up here 
you can deal with the traffic you can deal with   this and development review no you can't because 
they're not letting know you can get the emails   you can do public records requests you can go try 
and go on my government online which I I have a   hard time figuring it out and I'm pretty handy 
with the computer so most people aren't going to   be able to do that what's the next process you 
have pre-application that's not even required   okay that's the first part so you might go to a 
pre-application and catch it but a lot of people   just skip that part because you don't have to do 
it initial application it's not a public meeting   what's the next meeting listed on the agenda 
because I post these on a scambia Citizens   watch what's the next one final you know by the 
time it gets to final application it's pretty   far down the road and like even the big sector 
plan opt out behind me I couldn't even follow it   because you know we have lives we have business 
you know busy schedules just like you guys it's   not public friendly you can't change that or you 
can you could suggest it talk to your commissioner   but please don't defer people to development 
review Because unless you've gone to it lately   I and staff's here they can verify is initial 
application process open to the public that meeting there's no meeting that's actually had we 
issue comments to the applicant right so there's   nothing so when would the public get involved in 
the development review process there's public that   sits in the preapp essentially but do you have to 
do a preapp to do a development you don't have to   but it's highly encouraged right but some people 
don't some development developments don't come   so how would somebody give input how would the 
citizens that are here when you guys say you can   give all this input at development review when 
would they do that if they don't go to preap I   would say in my experience then usually reach out 
to us via staff whether it's you know sitting down   with staff members and looking over the plans and 
seeing what's proposed and stuff so and they how   would they know to do that I'm just the process is 
not friendly it used to be open I don't know why   the initial application is no longer open where 
the public could hear about it so Jacqueline I   actually raised that same kind of concern recently 
with some of our elected officials and I will say   I agree with you there should be transparency on 
the DRC levels and honestly involving the public   with it is another layer just like when we did 
the notifications for certain developments you   know to planning but I do agree that that level 
should be more transparent and should have the   ability because every time we have people coming 
up to this board with comments and concerns that   are really geared for really the DRC process and 
not for this board so I will always say that and   that's why I always defer it but that's I agree 
no it needs to be more open and transparent then   and I think that's something that should happen 
soon and some people their concerns might go   away they might say oh look you addressed it 
that's fine you know so also I really would   ask you to go back and read that section with 
the five criteria go down past the mobile home   little part and go finish the that section and it 
does say that even if a developer meets all those   criterias if there criteria if it is has adverse 
impacts you guys are allowed to deny it and   you did today so I appreciate that um thank you 
very much I'll say to that Jacqueline and and J   youd speak too but um you know I brought that 
up a few months back I can't remember when and   I know that you have as well and and you know the 
I think we can all read up here and I read it the   same way you do um and we haven't been able 
to get an answer from staff on in my opinion   a real good good solid answer on how we are to 
utilize that in this process um and so it's kind   of just left up to us as board members how we 
utilize that in our argument or motion so uh   I do understand that and I mean to me it's plain 
as Day on on what it says um so anybody else can   comment on that if they'd like if if I could just 
ask that that handout be changed because it stops   right at you know the five criteria and then it 
doesn't put that in there so no one else knows   that and so that that they could speak to it I 
know we can all get up here and say our property   values have you know are diminished and that's 
not adequate because we have to have studies to   show that I understand that but there are some 
things that you guys it's a judgment call and   I appreciate the time that you guys put in it's 
a judgment call and you guys know in the County   Commission it's a judgment call you know sending 
it back and things like that so I don't know but   thank you for acknowledging that and I did see 
that meeting I do watch the meetings I have a   91y old mother so I it's takes me great pains 
to come here um this is my neighborhood I'm   not just being nosy I the two I spoke about today 
were my neighborhood so that's why I was here so thanks have you y public form just quick because 
I had to take the day off work to come and this   is the second meeting that I've attended I only 
have six days that I can take off so whenever we   um have something that we care about and and it 
happened a lot all of these properties are around   us I was over here in July for one um that's 
very near and dear to me and it's hard to get   to them at 8:30 in the morning I had to take the 
full day off I couldn't even take a half day off   um I had to have a substitute teacher I have to 
we have to as well right so we need but this is   well well yes and that's a that's a problem we it 
needs to be available to the public this is not   available to the public I mean there's a lot of 
people my neighborhood who care very much about   what's going on who can't make these meetings and 
I certainly can't make every single one of them   I mean I I have six days that's it what's your 
recommendation it needs to be done after work   people can't take off work I most people don't get 
paid you know and for me to take off work it's a   it's a big ordeal I'm a teacher I mean I have 20 
kids that have a substitute teacher today because   I had to come to this meeting um so and it's very 
arbitrary it's not like I mean it's like you have   to be there on this date so um I would I also 
would suggest being able to attend in a different   way I mean you can do court cases now via zoom 
and that sort of thing I I just think it needs   to be these are big decisions being made and um a 
lot of people seem to think if you're not here you   don't care and that's just not the truth so those 
are my thoughts all right thank you thank you   all right uh yes sir okay uh our next meeting is 
December 3D and I think that wraps it up can I   make an announcement uh this is my last board 
meeting sitting on this side I'd like to thank   commissioner BOS for appointing me my fellow board 
members we didn't always agree but I respect your   opinions and I've learned a lot from each and 
every one of you staff Allison's really happy   I'm leaving because all the questions I asked but 
I appreciate app the work that you all put in uh   whenever I had a question you'd have an answer 
so I I appreciate that the citizens for those of   you that show up and uh uh participate that's 
what it's all about so I think thank you all   uh I thank my wife and my daughter for putting up 
with the time I prep for this and Jesus Christ Our   Master planner so thank you thank you J you've 
done a great job and I think uh you know with   hate to see you go I know sometimes it's out of 
your hands but it's a loss to this board in this   community but um you've done a great job while 
sitting up here so all right we are adjourned