Uh, welcome to the city commission meeting. >> The date is Thursday, October 23rd, 2025. The time is 6 pm. Uh, please join us for a invocation or a moment of silence and a
pledge of allegiance led by Commissioner George's body. Take a moment of silent prayer. Thank you. Please join me in the pledge. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation
under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. I call the order. Um Christina's uh proper notice and quorum uh been given. >> Yes, Mayor Hawkins.
>> Okay. Thank you. Uh agenda update Tom. >> Uh yes. Uh mayor, the um items 2531, 2532, and 2533. Uh the uh the applicant has requested
that uh those be moved I believe to uh the second meeting in November. Uh and uh we are asking you to take action um to move those items uh because they were advertised for this evening. Uh so if
you could uh take action to move those to November 20th uh at the applicant's request, we'd appreciate it. I move that those items be moved to the November 20th meeting. >> Second. >> Okay, it's been move and promptly
second. Roll call. >> Commissioner Asody. >> I. >> Vice Mayor Ashcraft. >> I. >> Commissioner Holland. >> Hi. >> Commissioner Lee. >> I. >> Mayor Hawkins. >> I. >> Okay. >> That is it as far as updates. >> Thank you, Tom. Uh, next we have approval of minutes. Approval of
September 18th, 2025 city commission work workshop. Uh September 29th, 2025 workshop and September 29th, 2025 city commission special meeting impact fees. >> Okay. >> Second.
>> That's been moved and properly. Second. Roll call, please. >> Commissioner Asbody. >> I. >> Vice Mayor Ashcraft, >> I. >> Commissioner Holland. >> Hi. >> Commissioner Lee, >> I. Mayor Hawkins. >> Hi. >> Okay. Next up, we have presentations.
>> Yes. If we could ask uh Joby to come on up. Uh also Rick and Greg if you could come up as well and we'll uh head down. >> Yeah, let's all go down. >> Yeah. Okay. It's Joby. Okay. Joby.
>> Me, too. Sure. This is u this is a sad time for the city of Houston. Uh but a great time for Joey. uh after 27 years of being a faithful uh
employee, uh he's decided that he would rather do something else with his life. Uh Joby, um I think it goes without saying how much you mean to the city. Uh you're the man
that we can call no matter what. On the weekends, I called him. Don't get worried. I'm not calling any But on the weekends, I called him and he's answered the call and he's given me direction and and I appreciate that. But
on behalf of the city of Eustace, uh we'd like to give Joy a commendation on his retirement. Whereas Joseph Jones has been employed by the city of Houston since March 12th, 1998 and will be retiring as deputy
director of public public works on October 16, 2025. And whereas during his employment in the public work department, he served the people of the city of Houston, its city officials and the city commission in
efficient and tireless manner and with honesty, integrity and dedication and whereas he will be forever remembered by the officials and the city commissioners of city of Eustace, Florida. Now therefore in recognition of
his service, the city of US, Florida does hereby wish to express appreciation to Joseph Jones on his behalf and on behalf of the citizens and officials of the city of Houston, Florida for his faithful service as an employee of the
city. signed and sealed on his 30th day of September 2025. Mayor Joe, we got the clock for you. Hopefully, it doesn't have an alarm because you've had many mornings waking up
probably 5:00 come in here every day for the last 27 years and something we can do. Jesse, thank you for your time. >> You know, I've been around for a good while. This city would not have operated
without you. We love you. We thank you and you still might get a phone call. Mr. Jones, thank you so much for sharing with us all these years. This is a better city because of his dedication
and all that you have done for it. Thank you so much. >> I would like to express my gratitude for your being here and being a all the time. I especially thank you because I know um and carry on while he's gone. So,
thank you for all of your service. And you told me you might come back for one more day. Thank you for for what you've done up here and for the 10 12 years I've been around the city. All I hear is your name.
George, you are the guy speeding down. You're the guy who gets it done. And thank you for that. And last but not least, >> yeah, thank you Joby for everything. Um, you know, you got to call to get it done
and I was amazed that you kept on picking up the phone when I called. Very and and I apologize because not often enough did I call just to say, "Hey, Joby, how are things going?" When I was calling, it was usually because it was a problem or something needed to be
done and you kept picking up the phone. Before we start, can we have his wife come up? >> Okay. All right. >> She's coming. >> I think that, you know, she she devoted 27 years
42 years. >> Thank you. Thank you. Okay, next up we have uh fire department meritorious award. Uh Chief, >> yes. >> Thank you. And uh Joby, thanks for all
you do for public safety over the years. We're really going to miss you. You are the guy that uh chief of police and myself called all the time for help. I don't know, man. It's going to be a tough one. You're a hard one to replace. Now, with that, uh tonight we have a pretty special award. Um the fire
service, we always train for the worst case scenarios, the whatifs and the things. And then, uh one day, uh June 29th of this year, we had a a really really bad call. Um we had an incident with a child and it was a uh it was it
was a critical call. Um I guess I'll just tell you what it is. a a a young child was playing with a handgun. It went off. Um he he was critically injured. Uh every this is one of those opportunities for everybody to shine and everybody did. The parents did the right
thing. The neighbors came out and helped 911. Uh the fire system worked, the EMS system worked, the helicop just everything fell into place. It was such a it was such a a great event that uh uh the child actually walked out of the
hospital. Okay. So, when you when you hear this, understand that everybody's here to celebrate this because this is uh this is truly a miracle. And it took a lot of people to do it. We're doing we're giving out some awards today, not just to the Eustace firefighters that were there, but also the Lake County
firefighters because this was this was bigger than just us. Okay. So, uh, as I call the names out, the officers, if if you're here, come up front for me. And also, uh, you're self deploying. That's great. >> Yes.
>> These are our uh, >> these are our friends from the hospital, uh, Sunny and Julie. They work uh, they work a lot with us. They do a lot of training with us. They're also part of the chief's group, and they're connected with our our ALS and paramedic program. So, uh, they they were on the receiving
end of us with the with the child and they they did the other part after we got him there. So, it took it took all these people. So, uh, also I didn't include the dispatchers because also there's dispatchers in this. Uh, Lieutenant Bour, I don't believe he's here today. Lieutenant Pekin, could you
come up please? Uh, uh, Senior Engineer Baitman, can you come up please? Engineer Rimes, he is not here today. Firefighter Mensia is not here today. Firefighter Anderson, could you come up, please? And that's from the Eustace Fire Department was on the call. In the Lake
County, we have fire, fire battalion chief Robert Figot. I do not believe he's here today. Uh, battalion chief Steven Wheeler, not here. Uh, firefighter EMT Rtor. No, I I know some of them are here
because they're back there. Uh, EMT Daniel James. There we go. And then we have firefighter paramedic Josh Kibler. Is he here? >> Hey guys. >> So I just I just want to also point out uh some of these
uh some of these are not necessarily paramedics. These are EMTs. We do have a couple of paramedic students in here uh that are are learning to be paramedics. But everybody had a part in this. Um I I was not on the call. Uh my deputy chief and my captain were mitigating things
around in the background, but they were working a terrible incident. Uh the outcome, like I said, was uh phenomenal. And I don't know if some of you remember a couple of a month or so ago, the police chief brought some people in and and gave them award. Those were the people that were the neighbors that
actually helped. Okay. Uh in the fire service, what we do is we wait for the outcome and the person has to leave the hospital to get the life-saving award. So in this case, the child walked out of the hospital, which is fantastic. Correct. And that's kind of why we want
to recognize. Now, I'm giving my guys a uniform. Thank you for all you do. Please >> good evening. I'm Sonia Weissop. I'm the EMS coordinator for Palmer Trauma Center and this is >> Hi, Julie Brian Palmer. >> Um, all the stars aligned due to the
great quality and passionate care and the training that these men and women do really made a outcome. in this this child's life. Uh you know, being flown all the way from this area all the way downtown to us in Orlando. Um everything that they do really made a true difference in this child's outcome. It
starts in the beginning with the dispatcher. Um and then the crews that arrive on scene and everything they do. So we should be extremely proud of of all the services in Lake County, including the city of Eustace. They have a great protocol set up through the medical director's office. Everything's great. So again, we thank you guys very
much for this and Julie has a challenge claim for all of you. And I'd like to get a the picture with you guys. >> Yeah, absolutely. That's what this is about. I'll make sure Thank you.
>> Thank you. Thank you. >> Thank you, sir. >> Yeah. >> Tell you violator. >> Thank you, gentlemen. >> Congrats. Congrats. Congrats. >> Thank you, sir. And I wasn't longwinded.
>> That's impressive, Chief. >> He's trying to get to >> Exactly. >> Okay. Next up, uh we have the events department, City of Eustace, Sensational Awards. >> So again, uh several years in a row, uh
the events department has brought home the proverbial bacon. um by bringing home bling from the uh Florida Festivals and Events Association. Uh that is the uh association that recognizes uh event
holders in uh the state of Florida. And so I would like to ask uh Sherry, our new director of events and communications to introduce the team. >> Hello. Good afternoon. >> Afternoon. >> I'd like to call up Carl Sanger, our
events manager, please. Christine Juay, vendor and community relations coordinator. Anne Hesop, our new event coordinator, and Tegan Faren, our event aid. We've got some new faces, but I wanted to give them a round of
applause. They've done an amazing job. Couldn't ask for a better team. They're amazing. Well done, team. And this year uh we received six first place awards, one second place award, and one third place award. And so uh I
think uh this is more first place awards than we've uh received in the past. >> Oh, great job. >> Yeah. seems to take >> great job. Great job. >> On the table, it's up to you.
>> I just like to say to uh to Sherry, if I hear from one more person from the city of Tavar's upset about us hiring you, I might have to get on protective custody. But >> and it happened in Michigan, too, while we were there. Oh, they they were
complaining to us and there was some threats me, but we're okay. >> Oh my goodness. >> Um, just let them know we ain't scared. >> I'm very happy here in Eustace. You have nothing to worry about. Thank you so much for having me. >> Thank you. >> Okay. Uh, next up, uh,
Chief Chief Capri, could you come up, please? Um yesterday we had the opportunity to travel to Fort Meyers uh for the uh accreditation of the uh our guys the city of Eustus
police department and chief >> got reacredititation process back in August from the commission of of water law enforcement accreditation. They do every three years. This is our fourth cycle. So, prior to me coming here, they had two cycles where they got superior ratings. The last few years, we had
superior ratings and uh 187 give or take points through 100% compliance. They were extremely happy with the way the police department is being run. They introduced the citizens, people in the community, extremely happy. And uh I'm just proud to bring this home. the hard
work of the men and women of use police department and the commission and the mayor and they were very impressed that the mayor and the city manager drove down there to be there for this award. So it shows buy in by the community. Hey, we got a great police department. We got a great community. We're going to keep getting better and better and
better and in three years we'll get excelsier status and I'm just really proud. I'm proud, you know, we have a great team here. So thank you. >> Yeah. No, thank you chief. you know, while we were down there, you know, we had the opportunity to to to talk to
quite a few people. Uh, this guy right here, everyone knows him. Um, he's he's respected in the field and we're fortunate enough to have you and and I appreciate it. >> I think that that what you what you've
achieved, I think it shows. So, I really appreciate that. So, thank just block out the negative stuff and keep plugging along and uh you know do the right thing always and >> okay >> keep moving on a perfect we're pretty damn close. >> All right. >> Okay. Next up uh we have um audience to
be heard. Tom, do you have any cards? >> Uh I do. I have uh a card from Daniel Deanzo, but I also uh Daniel, I wanted to let you know you submitted cards for items 7.1, 7.2, 7.3, and 7.4. We do not
uh generally do audience to be heard under uh other business. >> Sure. >> And so, um I know I have uh uh three cards for you, uh but uh come on up. Uh, and please as you you come up uh uh
please state your name. I'm sure Daniel you're pro at this. Uh state your name uh your city or county resident. >> Sure. My name is Daniel Devonanzo. I am not a city resident. I am a city business operator of several businesses.
So uh couple of things you know I still am very pro- Eustace. Some positive things coming. I've got some things in the work uh works that I'm pretty excited about. But I I will tell you I I really struggled for the last two months
and I I try and I love that we start on a very positive note, but tonight I do have to address a few things. Um, specifically, I was a little taken back by, and since they're not going to be discussed later because they're other business, um, the
request, the staff proposal that Tom Corino receive a raise in kind of 5% that the rest of the Eustace employees did. First of all, proportionally, if you took the average of what the other employees make and what their increase
is, it's substantially less. Second, I uh I was a little upset. He lists they listed, by the way, this is a staff report. Claremont, Leburg, Mount Dor, and Tavveris what the city managers make. So, it it looks like, well, you
know, we're a little underweighted here, and you know, we want to keep a city manager. Well, you know what I did? I looked up their revenue and I looked up their population and proportionally, Tom, you're overpaid. >> You're overpaid. And I think considering
the number of years he's been here and the things we've gone uh through recently, I think it's actually time to potentially look in the future for making a change because unless something is dramatically going to change on relearning the curve here, uh it it's
not working. And I and I could make I could make uh comments about things even recently when you look at the increase in impact fees uh for construction of new single family homes. And what was the comment? uh we were a little behind the ball there on that. So now we're
going to have this substantial increase which I can assure you is going to discourage people. The next thing I want to talk about is 7.2 through SE 7.4. And if you'll notice at the bottom of all those, it says city attorney, city attorney, city attorney. Uh I think it's
time considering the amount of interaction I've had uh with the city and legal representation here and the amount of time you have. Let me tell you this meter spins. I've looked at other communities. I've actually called a few. I actually think it's time for the city
of Eucus to hire an onboard legal uh professional on board which means no no other you know uh possible agenda or conflicts or we have uh other persons that we're representing or our our
client our the company that we're associated with because you know our attorney is associated with Bowen and Stroth that there's no conflicts of interest. we've got somebody on staff. And now when I hear Tom say, "Well, let's get the attorney." Or I hear uh one of the commissioners say, "Let's get
the attorney." We don't have to get set up a meeting. Get the attorney at the meeting. By the way, the meter's running. Then the attorney's got to go back for a review. The meter's running. Then we set up another uh meeting to hear what the attorney comes up with. The meter's running. Then we go back for
an uh documents that have to be reviewed by the city commission. The meter's running. And does anybody here know how much we're paying our attorney? So, I think it's time to realistically, and these three agenda items, I'm not going to have a chance to talk about them. You
need to really understand what's going on here because I went into I went into the backup for the meeting tonight. There is nothing that in any way represents what what is the specific purpose of 7.2, 7.3, and
7.4 for because I I have I have a good idea what it is ultimately and I'm going to tell you that is not the community that we are in here. That's not the community that just gave those awards out. >> Thank you.
>> Anyone else? >> Uh I have several cards for the time of the item. Uh but that's it for audience to be heard. >> Okay. Is there anyone else in the audience that has anything that they would like to address? Okay, seeing none. Okay. Uh, next on we
go to the consent agenda. There anything anyone wants pulled? >> Mr. Mayor, I move approval of the consent agenda. >> Okay, it's been moved and properly second. Roll call, please. >> Commissioner Ozbody, >> I. >> Vice Mayor Ashcraft,
>> I. >> Commissioner Holland, >> I. >> Commissioner Lee, >> I. >> Mayor Hawkins, >> hi. Okay. And next up, we have ordinance. >> Yep. >> Madame attorney. >> First, we have resolution number 25-75.
A resolution by the city commission of the city of Eustace, Florida, approving a promisory note to document interfund financing from the city's general fund to the Eustace downtown and east town redevelopment agency, authorizing execution of said note, and providing
for an effective date. Miss Carr. Hello again. We just had this conversation a little bit ago. Um, as you know, on August 7th, uh, we had a workshop with the CRA board to discuss, um, the remaining balance in the balloon payment on our CRA loan for the three
lots downtown, otherwise known as the Waterman site. And you were given two options. And within each of those options, you had some variables, but it was either external financing or internal financing. and staff was given the direction to go with internal
financing using the same rate that the loan we had just paid off uh was at. So that's what we've done. We've prepared an agreement with an amortization schedule and payment dates uh with terms. And this this allows a lot more flexibility for the city with that
property. We own it. We can sell it at any time without any red tape. Um, and this is just a formally adopting that that loan agreement between the CRA and the general fund. >> Okay. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Make a motion to Oh, >> excuse me.
>> No. Any questions from commission? >> No. >> Would anyone in the audience like to comment on resolution number 25-75? Seeing none, we will close public input. Mr. Mayor, >> I'm done. >> We'll make a motion. Yeah. Now, can I
make the motion? >> Yes. I close public input. >> Sorry. I'd like to make a motion to approve 6.125-75. >> Second. >> Okay. It's been moved and properly second. Roll call, please. >> Commissioner Ozbody. >> I.
>> Vice Mayor Ashcraft. >> I. >> Commissioner Holland. >> I. >> Commissioner Lee. >> I. >> Mayor Hawkins. >> I. >> Next we have resolution number 25-83. A resolution of the city commission of the city of Eustus, Florida, approving a preliminary subdivision plat for
Tealwood Estates subdivision 2025S03, a 61 lot town home single family residential subdivision on approximately 8.44 acres of property located on the north side of Orange Avenue east of Glover Street and west of Cardinal
Street. Alternate key numbers 121-5013 1215544 one94828 1215536 and 12150005 Mr. Richardson >> um before you tonight is a request from
the applicant to a accept the preliminary plan for Tealwood Estates. Uh the owner is Baseline Specialty Construction. Uh David Klutz is the engineer for the project. Again, it's approximately or is 61 lots on 8.44
acres. Uh with attached single family as the concept. Um the property again is about 8.44 acres. Um town home lots are designed at 22 by90s to 22x 100s. Um the density
comes out uh net density at 7.23 um units per acre. Um there's approximately 42% um open space provided. Um the minimum would be 25%. Uh they have provided 1.1 acres worth of
dog park, walking paths, passive park. Um as well as based on conversations that we have with most town home projects at the DRC level, there's always the issue with what happens when somebody happens to have a baby shower, guests over, no place for parking. They
They've accommodated for addition an additional 32 spaces for guest parking beyond the parking in the driveways or trying to park on street and find other ways other places to park. Um application was submitted uh in July or
beginning of July. First DRC meeting was at the end of July. Applicants submitted revised plans middle of August. Uh the second DRC was held on September 9th. At that September 9th meeting, there were a few technical issues, callouts for pipe
typology and so on, which are covered under the final engineering and construction plans. Therefore, DRC did find the plan technically sufficient on the September 9th. Um, general location and aerial of where the property is located.
Uh, Orange Avenue in between Glover and Cardinal. Um overall kind of the development things that are going on in the area. To the north we have uh existing apartments, the sheriff's sleep maintenance. Um I believe some of our fleet maintenance is also up in that
area. Um to the west we have apartments, church office. There's some home offices that are up and down along there that whether they're operating right now or not dig into them, but they do have sign frames out and so on. Um and then to the
east we have some existing commercial parcels as well as the early learning center. Um generalized layout or this is the layout uh is one of the sheets from the preliminary subdivision flat. Uh 61 lots uh set back a little bit off from Orange
Avenue. Um basically the development taking place in the middle section of the assembled properties. Um, I just I kind of quartered this out or thirded it out a little bit so that you could actually see the dimensions if you wanted to take a look at um what they
have planned. Um, they have done some attempt to make some staggering on the placement of the town homes on the properties. This is a representation. Obviously, building permits will determine what they actually will wind up building.
Um, typical lot 22 by 90 to 100. Um, setbacks at 20 feet. Uh, rear setbacks actually rear setback should be at 15, not 10. Preliminary subdivision plan. This is where we are
in the process. So basically um this becomes the step that comes to you for your okay. Um based on tech technical sufficiency, staff is recommending that the
commission consider approval of preliminary subdivision plan for um tealwood estates subdivision. >> Any questions for Mr. Richardson? >> Do they have parks or cut lots or walking areas? >> That's what I was going to ask.
>> Yep. Let's uh actually if I go to the Well, Nope, that doesn't help. Let's go back to those the 30 sections though. So there the hatched area um kind of on the curve is a pavilion.
There isn't necessarily a top block provided. Um, and as you see can see the it's it's a kind of a cross-hatching area on the plan is the park area or what they're considering to be park area which ties in a mulched walking trail
that kind of wraps down and around as well as connecting into the sidewalk system. >> Are you talking about up there where it says track two, Jeff? >> Uh, is really bad. Yes, track two is one of the park areas. Mhm. >> That's that's more of the people park
area. Um I believe that's like a gazebo pavilion type thing that's out on there. Um and then the walking trails kind of wrap down in and around between the existing properties and homes and the homes that are being platted or will be
platted. Um I wanted to back up one actually I didn't include it because of the way I sectioned these out. I sectioned them out as lots. The dog park is actually down closer to Orange Avenue on the western most property. That will be the western entrance to property.
>> Any other questions? >> No. >> Okay. Would anyone in the audience like to speak on resolution number 25-83? >> Okay. Seeing none, I'll close public input. I'll give it back to you, Mr. Mayor. >> Okay. Thank you. Okay. Um,
can I get a motion for approval >> for discussion? >> Make a motion for approval. >> Second. >> Okay. All right. >> What do you want to discuss? Is there an issue that you think
>> I I would just like to see something more kid-friendly, especially in that area um that's going to that's that's in an area where you've got some apartments across the street with a lot of children already. And I know I I just think we need to have something a little bit more
kid-friendly in that area. I I know there's parks there, but I think it needs to be more of a dedicated for children I I agree with uh with Mr. Holland as well, Commissioner Holland. I think we can do a little better. >> That's a lot of town houses with, you
know, not as much to accommodate the kids. So, you're going to have more kids. A lot more kids. >> Definitely. >> We've got a lot of >> Can you please speak up a little bit? We can't hear you at all. what your conversations are.
>> You can move up close and we'll speak louder. >> So, yeah, I think we we we've got uh some more work to be done on this and I'm concerned about the infrastructure support. I'm concerned about um
keeping things balanced. So, you know, um we've been down this road before. We don't have we don't have anything in our code for a tot lot or a certain playground size.
I wish we did, but we've never done it. And I'm not sure we can even can can now with Senate Bill 180. So, and I agree with you. I agree. I totally agree with that many with that many units. We there needs to be more
playground. But the reality is they don't really have to do it. and we can ask them and see if they'd be willing to. >> Okay. >> Yes, sir. >> All right. >> I'm with the developer. >> Okay.
>> I'm David Klutz, project. >> Okay. >> All right. Mr. KL >> and I I'm I do have cards from the applicant um that was listed as if needed. So, we do have cards from them to speak. >> Okay. Sure. And no, we're we're hearing
everything you're saying and we're not against I think every every project we've done, we end up with a top pot in it and and we've got plenty of space to put put some of that in there and >> you know we're we're asking for preliminary plat not construction plan
and we can definitely I think come forward with that in the construction plans for you guys and staff to make sure that >> okay >> um how many bedrooms are in those condos. >> Anything else?
>> Um, madam attorney, help me with this. How do we how do we how do we hold him to that because it's not in our code. >> We'd have to take him on his word. It's a verbal representation as you've stated. Um, we really can't deny the petition if it complies with what we
have in in our code. Um, essentially if there's nothing like a public safety hazard here or a specific violation of our code, we really it's more of a ministerial thing at this point. Um, but they have heard what has been said and
have verbally agreed to do that. >> Okay. And so why didn't he get administrative approval? Why is he >> Gary? You're right. Because of Senate Bill 182, our hands are going to be tied on this. >> Exactly. >> So,
all right. Okay. Um remove uh movement. Second vote. >> Commissioner Asbody. >> No. >> Vice Mayor Ashcraft. >> I. >> Commissioner Holland. >> Hi. >> Commissioner Lee. Hi,
>> Mayor Hawkins. >> Hi. >> All right. I need the >> Thank you. Okay. For uh first reading, we have ordinance number 25-37, an ordinance of the city commission of the city of Eustace Lake County,
Florida, creating chapter 14 entitled animals and fowl and adding article 2 entitled residential backyard chickens program and creating section 115-11.8 eight of the land development regulations entitled backyard chickens program standards. Providing for
legislative findings and intent, establishing definitions, providing for permit requirements, providing for standards of care, providing for enforcement and penalties, providing for program review and automatic continuation, providing for severability, providing for conflict, providing for codification, and
providing for an effective date. Okay. So, um, we've all know we had this coming tonight. Um, we have an ordinance before you, and the purpose of the ordinance, um, as it's laid out, is to establish a two-year pilot program that
would allow backyard handkeeping on single family lots. This will promote sustainability, education, and food resilience while protecting neighborhood standards. This also creates clear permitting, training, and enforcement systems to ensure accountability. The
participation for this program would be limited to 15 properties citywide during the pilot and eggs that are produced are meant only for personal household consumption not for commercial sale or distribution. This is uh the legal foundation on which
we have uh prepared the ordinance before you supported in our constitutional as well as our statutory authority. Um including recognition that this is really not u interfering at all with the right to farm act because this is not an
agricultural ordinance and it also aligns with several policies in the city's comprehensive plan. the program overview. Um the duration right now will be a two-year pilot. Now, if everything goes well, the idea would be that it would automatically continue
without need for the commission to take action unless the commission chooses to repeal it or to amend it. The scope is up to 15 permits citywide. That can also be changed uh depending on the feedback you get by resolution to increase the
amount of participants. Eligibility is going to be only for single family homes. The uh training that is required will be the UF um/IFFAS chicken keeping course requirement which
Tom um and actually all of us including Commissioner Hasbati did. Uh the number of hens is going to be up to three. No roosters. Eggs again are for personal consumption only. Sale and distribution are prohibited. Setbacks would be for five feet from property lines and 20
feet from adjacent homes. There are other specifics as to the actual structure um that would need to be conformed with as well. The standards are to make sure it's clean and humane treatment of these animals. Uh order control to avoid nuisances and keep it
street screened from street view. So these would only be allowed in the backyard of the property. Cannot be in the front or on the sides if it's visible from the street. the um safeguards and enforcement. This is going to be permit based with an
annual renewal. Um so the individual would have to first apply submit. We'll have all that paperwork ready and we'll present it to you as well through a resolution. the uh permit would only be for that year and then you would have to
renew it just so that we can ensure things are being kept in the the same way that we need them to according to what the ordinance provides for. If there were a violation, we have graduated penalties. Initially, they would get a warning. Then we would have a $100 fine that would then there's a
subsequent violation, $250 fine. Um and then ultimate ultimately revocation. the inspections um they're going to be allowed upon verified complaint um that would be through code enforcement and if there is a refusal of the homeowner to
allow inspection the permit will be immediately suspended and that's a condition of the permit application the city manager would be able to suspend permits if there's um you know a health crisis whether it's through USDA
FTACS there's bird flu um some kind of issue that could affect the health. You would have the authority to suspend it as well as resume it once the dangers um have been have subscided and due process would be afforded to the
applicants because where notice will be provided and um they'll give they'll be given an opportunity to cure their violations before their permit is revoked except for substantial violations and these would be the most egregious types. Those are also outlaid in the ordinance.
Now, um the standards would be that this uh just to be fully compliant with the humane care and cruelty prevention of the chickens. You cannot slaughter, you cannot abandon them or have unsanitary conditions. This will require humane
maintenance, enclosure, and feeding. So, we want to make sure that they're protected from predators and um properly cared for so that they're not trespassing into other property owners um to avoid issues
and the um composting would be limited. Burial is not allowed on site. The program would be evaluated um and would be continued as follows. So the the metrics would be we have the number of permits and that are issued, how many
renewals we get, any verified complaints and enforcement actions that code enforcement takes. We'd have staff hours um and administrative costs that we'd be keeping track of as well and the community benefit and compliance data that would be provided by staff. The
program would continue automatically unless it's repealed or amended after a two-year review. The staff report would be due 90 days prior to the expiration to summarize the participation as well as the results of the program to keep the commission apprised. The features is that um we would like to
encourage courtesy neighbor notification as an option for transparency. That would be part of the form they fill out. It's not required, but of course we like to respect our neighbors, so we do encourage letting them know. um that way they're not surprised. The uh public
permit log would be maintained by the clerk's office so we know exactly who has permits. Five verified complaints uh by code enforcement would result in a sooner review, quicker review. Um that would be within if we get five within 12 months, then we would have to come
before you and let you know what what the complaints are and how we've been handling those. So this is going to be datadriven oversight and that way it's going to ensure accountability for the performance of the program. Now the benefits to the city, it encourages responsible sustainable
living practices, promotes education and self-sufficiency, ensures that the eggs are for personal use only, maintains neighborhood compatibility and humane care standards, and provides for enforceable oversight and transparency. uh fiscal and administrative summary.
The fee would be a initial application would be $75 and then the renewal would be 25. This is a limited scope just to ensure that we cover some of the um administration costs associated and then we'll we'll keep track to see if that's
um comparable to what staff is doing based on the performance. There will be no business impact again. It's only personal use and the city supports sustainability. So that would actually further that as well as education goals.
All right. The uh pilot program gives residents a structured opportunity to engage in sustainable living responsible humanely and uh in balance with our neighbors. It supports personal food resilience and education while ensuring compliance, accountability, and transparency under Florida law. The
recommendation from staff is approval of ordinance 25-37 on first reading establishing the residential backyard chickens pilot program. >> Are there any questions for me from the commission? >> I have a lot of questions. >> A lot.
>> Yes. Um first of all, I guess I will say that I am in disagreement with this. I'd stated it from the very beginning how I felt about it and I keep hearing education for whom? Um, you're talking about I
haven't heard any requirements for a structure or enclosure for that. I'm concerned about the health benefits. Uh, also I would hate to I know the size of my lawn in the back and in the front and I think about most of the homes pretty
much are that size and then you have to to to deal with your neighbor having the chickens and so in close proximity they bring around the the rodents, raccoons, snakes, all of those are attracted to
those um types of in um enclosures and chickens and all of that. I have a real concern um for health reasons. I also think that it's adding extra to code enforcement. One more thing they have to do um when
they have so much to deal with now. Um I even something about protecting the neighborhood and sustainability. Well, I it's different. I if it was a community garden, I could see it. But chickens, I just think um that we're we're bringing
on something we're going to really regret eventually. And I think if you have a really large lawn or if you live a little bit out outside the city, have no problems with. I think it's a it's it's something that people can do. But with the smaller lawns and and another
thing that I have noticed, I know people who have chickens, and you know what? Even though you say they aren't supposed to sell them, they do. and who's going to monitor that? And it does happen um that they have too many and they do sell them and who's going to monitor that? So, I have an issue with it. I disagree
with it, but that's my what I have to say about it. >> But there I think we probably should talk about that HOA rules. >> Yeah, I was trying to just give a an overview because all of the details are
in the ordinance which was published and is in the packet. Um so all of the questions that uh well maybe not all of them but um some of them you know are are your personal stance. Uh as far as the location um we have an entire
section on the ordinance. I'm push I'm going to pull it up that basically discusses what the parameters are for the structures. Um, but I'll just go back up to the top and kind of go through. Um, okay. So, we had, um, this was all part of the presentation that we did a
while back just as far as what we wanted to include in there. So, um, again, this is strictly going to be for single family homes. Not every home is going to qualify. And um I'll get to that for um we have over on page
one uh well let's see page 80 on the agenda but it's the second page of the ordinance starting um then on page three it talks about what would be the substantial violations that would result in your permit being taken away from you right away. uh for instance if they if
you're slaughtering the hands uh if you're refusing inspection like we talked about if you're abandoning your hands etc. The training course uh is there as well as the um clarification which is part of
the application that will be notorized by the applicant and includes that if they're not the owner of the property if they're renting they'll need owner consent. They're going to have to provide a scaled site plan showing the law boundaries where the coupe run
location is going to be as well as the setbacks affidavit authorizing the city for inspection on property and they're going to agree to hold the city harmless um with this agreement if they fail to comply with a permit and
there's some issue uh involving the chickens. There's an acknowledgement that HOA covenants, deed restrictions or lease terms supersede city approval. We are not going to be going through lease agreements or or public records or anything like that. That is the responsibility of the applicant. Hence
the requirement for indemnification. Um the affidavit will also confirm that they're submitting accurate information and we will put in there the courtesy notice to the neighbors if they choose to do that. They'll be able to check off a box. It's not required, but if they
do, we actually will have a notice that they can use um and we can also mail a notice uh a city mail notice to adjacent property owners as part of the application. So, inspections will be required. The
eligible properties um they have to have sufficient room. Uh so it will be at the discretion of the development services department to deny a permit if the size of the lot, the structure placement, the setbacks relative to the neighboring
homes are likely to create a nuisance uh to address exactly that concern because there's not every every single family law is going to be able to make that accommodation. Um, now if that denial occurs, the applicant can always come um
to back to the city and appeal it to the city manager and if the city manager concurs, bring it to the city commission and that will be the final approval. Uh, I'm sorry, the final decision as to whether that permit will be allowed. >> So, we have a lot of staff time um that would be that would go into that. And do
they like dogs and cats have to have um shots and all? Is there any medical uh requirements um to make sure that they're healthy or that they're taken care of if something if they're ill? >> That is the responsibility of the applicant to ensure that they're
properly caring for the hens >> that's in the >> and that's that's in there and it will be it's it's part of the application. >> Um again, this is we're we're doing it that's why the $75 fee comes in. Um so that staff they have to come with everything prepared. staff is just going
to check that what they've submitted is correct and essentially issue a permit. The code enforcement would only get called out if there's a a nuisance or some kind of disturbance or thing something along that um you know that line that would require them to go out
and verify. That's where we're going to keep metrics to see whether $75 makes sense, whether we need to adjust that. That's really the only way is to is to get that information and see how the the program works. Um, >> right now we have a a fee for people um
to Don't we have a fee established? It was like $200 or $700 or something like that. >> No, this is $75. >> No, the before we have an established >> Well, that was for the conditional use. >> Yeah. Yeah, it's a different pro. This
is this is more of an accessory use um because we're establishing the program. So, but we'll have to see kind of how how how it goes um you know with time and and we can always adjust you know fines if there's some kind of of of issue with
a particular applicant. We have the suspension. Um let's see. Um you know, we deal with um a lot of what what the enforcement guidelines would be. And as
far as animal control, for instance, if there is a killing of a hen by a domestic dog or cat, that's not by itself going to deem that animal a dangerous animal because again, we learned that hens um they have to have their wings clipped otherwise they can
fly and they can go into another neighboring property and if there's a a dog out in the backyard or a cat and they get into an argument and the other one wins, it's really not a situation that we're going to, you know, punish
the other property owner and their um their domestic animal for. Um so we have the administrative review. Again, if we're if we have five verified complaints from code enforcement within that first 12 months, we'll come back for you and let you know where things stand. Um we'll keep track of this the
staff time to really give you the information you need to see if you need to make any adjustments to the program. Um you know, as as things go. If not, you'll hear um just basically a report from staff 90 days before the two-year expiration and then they'll just kind of proceed.
The other component here, you know, if there is a a health advisory that is related to the poultry health, then we'll also not only notify the the applicants that have active permits, but we will also put it
on our website. And once they give the clear, we'll also notify them and put it on the website that they're back in effect. And as far as the standards, um that's what that's what uh we're putting in the LDRs. You're going to have the
the number of of hands in there. Again, the education component here is um actually discussed on page six of the ordinance, page 84 of the agenda. Uh because one of the things we covered was incubation and hatching.
So if a family wishes to go through that process with their children for, you know, to hatch the the eggs and go through that fun experience. We've had it at the library. A lot of um people have interest in that. So we wanted to
include it in there. However, if they happen to end up with a rooster, they need to uh part ways with it and and make arrangements um to take it elsewhere. They hatch eggs and they have allowed three chickens, three hens, >> right? So if they get >> they're going to have more eggs. I mean
more more chicken, right? If if they have if they go through a egg hatching process >> and they have the little baby chickens. So they are going to have maybe if they have three or four or five that hatches, then they got they have more than three chickens. >> They can only keep three. So if they
hatch more than three, then they have to get rid of the rest. Um, you know, >> if I could jump in there, if it if you don't mind, just to to clarify, correct me. We sat through a class online. >> Uh, Sasha, Tom, um, and and Eric from
code enforcement and I think development services, but if you don't have a rooster, you're never going to hatch an egg. So, that's >> But she mentioned that they might want to do this with their children, go through education, >> but they can't have a rooster. So, if they have a roost, if they if they hatch an egg, somebody needs to go see a
family attorney because somebody got fertilized outside of where they're supposed to be. So, there's no roosters. >> They could do >> I think we're talking about the same thing. >> Do artificial insemination. Okay. >> Well, the eggs come they come
fertilized. I believe you'd have to buy them that way. So, if they want to go through the experiment of, you know, incubation and hatching, they can do that at home. they sell the, you know, the light lamps and all of that. But if I think at like 20, between 22 to 24
weeks, 20 to 24 weeks, that's when you can tell the the the gender of the um of the chick. And then that's if it turns out that it's a rooster, they're going to have to part ways with it because they're not allowed. So that's what I meant.
>> Thank you so much. >> Yeah, no problem. Um so the coups uh and the runs they have to be in the rear yard at least 5 feet. We have um from the property lines 20 from any residential dwelling on an adjacent lot and must be screened from street view. We have um we can do a hybrid setback
which is allowed for in the ordinance. If the development services director depending on the property, right, he can he can require up to 15 ft from the property line, 15 ft 50 ft from wells, uh storm water facilities or other water bodies. That's you know again case by
case really affording looking at if that particular property is is adequate for it. And uh coupe runs cannot exceed 100 square f feet in area or 6 ft in height. And um hens must have at least four square ft of space in the coupe and five square feet in the run. The structures
must be ventilated, covered, predator resistant, constructed of welded um hardware cloth or the equivalent and chicken wire is prohibited. So that's meant to protect them from the predators. Sanitation is covered there. um you know they are supposed to make
sure that the feed is uh well first maintained in clean condition free from any objectionable odor. What does that mean? If it if we can smell it for more than 15 consecutive minutes within 1 hour then we have a problem. So that's
how we're going to have a an odor nuisance come through. Um the feed has to be stored in rodent proof containers to avoid attracting other animals. Manure cannot collect. So they they have to really be good about cleaning out the coupe. Um compost is permitted only in
enclosed bins. 20 ft from 20 feet from the property line. Uh we burial is not allowed. So we have all of that included in there. Um and they have to comply with all of the health regulations.
um they have to dispose humanely of their hens if um whether they need to rehome them, transfer them to another lawful permade. Maybe someone only has one or two or one of theirs died and they want to give up one of their hands,
they can do that, too. Um or so they can surrender it to a facility that would accept poultries. They can't be abandoned. They can't be surrendered to a government agency that doesn't accept them. So they can't just drop them off, you know, wherever um they would like. And
um the the coups and runs cannot be located anywhere where there's a platter of utility or drainage easement, FEMA floodway, or a required landscape buffer. Electrical or plumbing services require separate permit. So like all of all of these things are going to be looked at when the applicant comes.
So um also storm securing, that's a new one. So we um if there's a declared wind event or hurricanes, they must secure the coupoops and runs or relocate the hands to prevent hazards or escape. And um you know, we did our best to
encompass as much of the parameters that are out there while still making this a possibility for the residents. um and you know preserving um enforcement as well as health standards and trying to
reduce as much of staff time as possible. So >> thank you. >> Yes, of course. >> Any other questions? >> No. >> Okay. Would anyone in the audience like
to ask me a question on this? >> Uh if you could just come up to the podium. >> Pam, please. >> Pam. Did we have our discussion yet before public speaks? Did we close after? Okay. Thank you. >> Good evening, mayor, commissioners. Pam
Rivas. I'm a resident of the city of Eustace and I just wanted to list some um I feel like Eustus is a little behind on some things and we're trying to get ahead of the ball game, but this is another area where we're behind. In Lake County, Claremont, Leburg, Mascot,
Manila, Mount Dora, Umatillaa, and Howy in the Hills all have chicken ordinances. In Semino County, LA, Longwood, Sanford, Winter Springs in Orange County, Orlando, Winter Garden, Winter Park, Matland, and then if you want to go into the larger cities, Jacksonville, Miami, Tampa, Orlando,
Tallahassee, and if you want to go even further, New York, Los Angeles, Chicago, chickens are not a problem. They're not. And they people are doing them everywhere. And I feel like this is just another area where you could stay behind or we can move forward. Our residents
are asking for it and there's already chickens in the city and my question would be how many calls is code enforcement getting on that. It doesn't seem like it's a problem. Thank you. >> Thank you. Anyone else like to comment?
>> Mr. Deanzo, >> I'm going to start the timer for you. >> No. 15 permits, three three hens. That's 45 chickens. I cannot believe that we're going to spend this. >> Yes.
>> Okay. Oh, it didn't work. What happened? >> There we go. Okay, but you're good. Anyone else wishing to speak on this? >> Oh, sit down. >> Probably gonna shock everybody. Um Karen
Loop Smith's resident resident for the city of Eustace. >> Where do I know your name from? >> Yeah, I know. I don't know what. But as most of you know, I've been No, no chickens, please. No chickens, please. We have chickens. Listening to Sasha
present this ordinance. It's well written. She's got all kinds of things in there to govern this. Um, we have our rooster on the corners. We have It's It's something that I think it's time
for us to move forward on. Residents have asked for it. Personally, I don't want chickens, but we have bunnies. We have cats. Maybe the cats can help with some of the chickens.
But um >> if again this is a well-written proposal ordinance. >> Thank you. >> I really appreciate listening limiting it to 15 residences. >> That'll give us a really good idea. So
>> I'm in favor of this. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Oh, what? Anyone else? No. Okay. >> Okay. I'll close public input and Mr. Mayor, I'll give it back to you for discussion.
>> You want to say something? >> No, I was going to say this. This is just a pilot program. We could, you know, this is just an ordinance for the pilot program so we can learn if this is going to work or not. We have all this time to figure out will it work, will it
work. Um, so I think it's I think Karen's right. It's well written. It's very comprehensive. >> Very comprehensive. >> And it's a pilot program. So, if we have a lot of problems with it, it's up to us to say we're going to continue on or not. We say we're doing a year, right?
>> It's a two-year pilot program. >> Two year. >> And yeah. Um if there again, if there five verified complaints within the first year, first 12 months or within 12 months in any period, >> then we'll come back to you. Uh we staff will come back with that information and
check. If you wanted a of course a status report in the interim, you're welcome to um bring it up at any point and then we'll get staff prepared to give you that information. But the intent is to have it very data driven so that you have the information at the same time, not overwhelm staff but also
allow for the program. >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> Right. Okay. Anything anyone else? >> I'll just say a couple little things if I could please. Um, we put a lot of time into this even as a commission aside
from uh the attorney and city manager and everything and and we put a lot of thought into it and listening to um former mayor Loop Smith, we I think the staff did a fantastic job and and of putting it all together. There is a
balance here. There is an educational factor and I have the utmost respect uh for Commissioner Lee as an educational um professional and and there is a lot of it. I spend my time at the uh fair
each year and there is a lot of education going on with it and there are kids that are just lighting up with these uh animals that they've brought up through that. There is a lot of education. We joke about this a little bit, but there is there's a lot of
greatness. It teaches discipline. It teaches uh all those things and we see it in the awards. Our city won uh our a resident of our city won an award, a first place award during uh the last the last thing. So that that's that's important. Uh we've limited and and I
think it was the mayor, I might be wrong, who wanted it reduced in a time and we stopped it at two years to review. Um and uh I I I think this is a a great thing. The training is extensive. I took the training uh with the rest of some of the staff and and
city. And uh much to what uh Pam said, and just for the record, Pam is my wife, um is that uh it's time to dip our toes in the water a little bit, see what we got, and if it doesn't work, get rid of it. There's there's no reservation to
that. Education is a factor of it. and um and and and I'm and I'm favorable to it. Do do we require the applicants to take that class? >> Yes, >> absolutely. >> All right. Okay. All right. Uh that's
it. Okay. Let's take a Can I get a motion? >> Make a motion to approve ordinance 2537. >> Second. >> It's been moved and properly second. Uh roll call, please. >> Commissioner Obotti. I >> Vice Mayor Ashcraft. >> Hi.
>> Commissioner Holland. >> Nay. >> Commissioner Lee. >> Nay. >> Mayor Hawkins. >> I I I have to say I was a nay uh until Karen came up. So um
>> Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. >> It wasn't you. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> That's it for this component. >> Uh we're going to take five minutes. come back at 7:20. The time is 7:20. We're back in session.
Uh, next up is other business 7.1. Tom or is it Karen? Karen. >> Hello. >> Hello. Can >> you uh we completed Tom's evaluation process with um the commissioners and I
presented the staff report and um the the um let me see here. Let me get the staff report. Um it is um we are suggesting that Tom received the same raise that the other employees
received which was 5% of the annual evaluation plus $1,000 on top of the the annual salary. >> Okay. >> Okay. I do have the I did list the um the the
city manager salaries for Claremont, Leburg, Mount Dora, and Taris and that's of as of October 1st. >> Okay. Thank you, K. >> Okay. Commissioners, Mike,
>> I have uh spoken with Tom privately. He knows the way I feel. He knows um he knows the areas that that need some some challenge and some improvements. Um you know, we put him in a position. We
need to support him, try to get him there. Um and um I am okay with a raise as long as it does not exceed >> what everyone else >> what everybody else is getting and that's the way we've always operated. >> Okay.
I've spoken with um Tom and had my um evaluation with him. >> Thank you, Gary. >> Um same here. I mean, Tom and I uh spoke for well over an hour. Um I know I know
Tom I know Tom works I know Tom works hard, but uh I do agree with uh Michael. We we have some challenges and we have to find a way to get some things done and at this point on where Eustace is I
I I feel Tom Tom is very well compensated and I probably would not be in favor of a 5% raise. >> Okay, George. Well, I uh I met with Tom and with uh HR
for a couple hours and uh went through quite a few quite a few things and uh let me comment first. I I pulled the staff report and I did a little research
myself and and I think some people hit on it a little earlier. Um we have 25,000 people in the city. We operate with a budget of about and please some of these numbers I got off of uh Google and they they're they're the best in 10.
Uh but we have a budget of roughly 25 million and an overall budget I think roughly uh in the low 100s. Um, and uh when you compare that to some of the other some of the other uh people that
we're using in this comparison, I'm concerned that the pool we picked from might skew one or another way. And an example is um Leburg has a $40 million general
budget and a $251 million overall. I'm sorry, that's the salary in a uh uh huge hundred and some million dollar uh $233 million budget.
$233 million overall budget and a general budget of 40 40 million based on what I got. Same thing with Claremont. 252 million. Um,
so we have to play with the monies that we have. And then I looked at experience. We have a uh a city manager with some limited experience roughly three and a half years
um as a city manager compared to 33 years, 29 years, and 27 years in what the staff pulled. So, just to make my comment, I don't know that we're comparing apples
to apples. Um, I um have some concerns of being financially uh responsible and everything and I and I just don't see
myself being able to vote for really almost any increase at all. Uh I think he's of uh being compensated. I think he is trying. Uh I know he said at the meeting here that he's made some
mistakes and he can do better. And uh I I I like Tom. Uh I like his family. Um I think he's he's uh uh off to a start. He's at the early stages of his career
and we can't compare that to 33, 29, and 27 when we look at pay. Experience pays. So, are you in favor of a >> the a raise? >> With all due respect, I thought we were having a discussion. I' I'd like to finish. >> Well, yeah. Yeah, you can finish, but
>> Thank you. >> I don't want a dissertation. >> Um, with all due respect, I I'd like to finish, please. So, you have to look at all of those when you're looking at somebody and and where they are and
comparing those things. We're not we're probably not in a position where it would be financially responsible um to uh to do uh certainly not to do any 5% or whatnot increase or really plus
the thousand thousand would be about a five and a half. So um I gave Tom a lot of stuff and I asked him to get back to me with his thoughts on it. U that hasn't happened yet. Um it was probably a little short notice in his defense.
He's got a lot going on. Uh but uh I uh I did do that and uh perhaps an option is to uh revisit this in a shorter period of time than a year and and see where we're at. But at this point um I'm limited in
in if any uh is appropriate based on hard numbers and not emotion. based on emotion, I think his family and him are are are just a pleasure to be around. >> Okay. Thank you. All right. Okay. Um I
as well sat down with Tom uh and and Karen and uh and I gave him input as well. Um, I I I hear that there are challenges, but I don't think that anyone that comes to these city commission meetings can
say that some of the challenges don't fall on this commission because we haven't given uh direction like we should. Um, and when there are issues, Tom has owned up to it. Uh I can think of a couple of
times Tom has saved us from uh situations where the likelihood of us getting sued down the line uh would have come up and Tom said no. Um,
I think that um what we're paying him uh is good and I think the job that he's doing is great and I think that he should get what everyone else gets. Uh
so I'm in favor of the race. Uh, one of the things that I I I have to say about Tom is I think that um I think that as opposed to chaos, uh, you know, and and making things
happen, he thinks things through and and I appreciate that. Uh, there's no knee-jerk derk reaction. Um there were times when there were things that this commission was ready to do and and he said slow it slow it down. So I
appreciate that. Uh so I'm in favor of 5% uh plus $1,000. >> Mayor, I think you said something. You you kind of hit the nail on the head. Tom is only as good. Miranda's only as good and so is this city staff as the
five of us. And when we're not on a page and we're given mixed signals up here, it makes it hard for them to operate. Are there improvements that need to be done? Absolutely. But we got to look at our
own mess before we can, you know, so I'm with Okay. >> Okay. Uh, do we take a vote on this? >> Okay. There has to be a consensus. We're talking like Tom tonight here. Does Tom have anything to say about it?
I I don't know if Tom do >> I I think my role in this is is to listen. >> Yes. >> Okay. Um >> there should be a consensus on the um on the raise if that's being proposed. I do I one thing I would like to mention
though uh Commissioner Asbody mentioned um the um the peers that we've compared against um I don't know what the uh experience as city managers are at those other jurisdictions. Um for example, I
know Al Miner at Leburg has been a city manager for a very long time. I think John Drew has as well. Um Vince Sandersfeld at Mount Dora is new to to uh being city manager and I think Claremont's city manager is also brand new as a city manager. So I don't know
uh again I know uh Al Miner and John Drury have been city managers for a very long time. I'm not sure about the other jurisdictions. >> Yeah. You know, one of the things that that I have to say is uh I don't know and and this is not to uh minimize, you
know, what the other uh cities are doing, but we have a lot of stuff going on. These three blocks have consumed us for the last four years, >> 23 years. >> Well, yeah. Yeah, they have consumed us.
And this guy has been in the weeds. um you know following our direction uh our direction our misdirection uh you know trying to make things happen and I think to penalize him because we don't
know excuse expression what the hell we're doing half the time I I I just you know I just have a problem with it but but that's just me all right we have to have a consensus >> yes >> okay
>> oh Tom wants to I >> don't go against what I just said. >> Well, I mean, so it it it appears there are differing opinions on compensation moving forward. Um, so I hesitate to
bring this up. Um, but um, one thing that we had talked about as far as the budget process was a vehicle allowance. Uh, that amount has been the same since at least 2015. uh that was uh the amount in Ron's
contract previously since at least 2015. Uh and so I had uh as part of the budget process had requested uh $200 additional per month. Uh again, I know it sounds like we have um differing opinions on
moving forward. Uh but I did um I had that's something I had brought up as part of the budget process. >> Okay. Thank you, Tom. Yeah, you know, there's something that bothers me about this process. Everybody has spoken to Tom. If there's something, an area where he needs to
grow, where he needs to be better, where he needs to improve, then um I think that we should encourage that or give some direction as to how to go about doing it. But um and you know it just seems like we're all we all have our
reasons for what why we're thinking what we're thinking but um we don't know from each other from day to day what we're all thinking at the same time. Is there a certain area? Is there something pending? Is there something that's very very necessary? um a Tomy's direction
and and I I think that we could do a better job of how we as a group if there's some area that's really really really necessary needing some some some uh improvement in then that should be the direction. But it's just sort of willy-nilly how we do things and we
don't really know um what we're what your concern is, my concern or anybody else's. And so it it makes him to me he has no defined um areas that he's he's superseding in or that he needs to do
improve improve in. And how how does he determine which direction to go? >> I I think Go ahead, Joe. >> In my in my um sit down with Tom just and I hopefully you guys did something similar to it. U I sat I went through
every issue of my concern. uh and I told him what I thought and then I told him how I thought he could improve in it and what I what my thoughts were and why. Um unfortunately we didn't have much of an exchange. Uh we had some very limited
conversation. I was expecting to have an exchange but uh the HR director said this is normally where you just share your thoughts and that's it. I think I got Tom a little bit, but um
I did it, you know, with with with what with what it is and and uh the the the reason we as a commission don't run this city. we choose, in my opinion and in my
understanding to hire and fire the city manager and um and city attorney. I told Tom in in our in our talks, I told him I said we are a strong city manager
and one of the things is he is leading us. He is our leader. He's our CEO in the charter says specifically our CEO and we give him direction on things. So things have to fall on somebody and and I appreciate you taking responsibility
for all the disasters, but it's not you. It's the manager that has to carry it and the experience is a factor. I think Tom will get there, but we have to keep it in proportion with with with the pay. Well, the other thing if Gary feels
really strongly that he needs to do this in this area, you come and you feel strongly about another area. Willie comes, he's got another area, where which direction does he go? You know, because if we're passionate about it and he's dealing with five commissioners,
how does he know if each one of us have Okay, Tom, this is what I require, what I want. Then >> it may be contrary to what I want. >> That's what I'm saying. So, how does he know which way to go? How do we fix it? How >> That's a I got a I got a suggestion. I'm just one of five, but if you're saying
that we need better communication and that we've done a bad job on communication, I I I don't necessarily agree disagree with you that maybe we have. So, maybe perhaps we consider tableabling this and having a workshop
and sit with Tom and exchange all of our concerns. >> Sorry. >> So that we can we can make this town better. we can make the city better. We can have transparency that we're that we'd like. >> I think that Go ahead. Give your answer. But no, but we but we did that. That's why we had the evaluation. That's why I
think all of us have I believe had a sit down with him. >> So then that's your answer we've all given him. >> I mean we've we we've we've we've done that. I think we all spent considerable amount of time and it was really I mean for me it was really good. I believe really good constructive criticism. I'm
not a I'm not above a raise. I'm just not at 5%. But you only need three. >> You only need three people. >> Yeah, you you can get you can pull, you know, each each commissioner and if there's a a variation from that, if you
want to do a different percentage, you can consider that as well. >> My vote is what we gave everybody else on the city staff. Okay, >> Gary. >> I mean, mine's mine's less. Mine would be two two and a half. Emily,
>> I I just think there's too much confusion. I would go with what we have with everybody else. >> But but I I I want you guys to hear what I'm saying. You're not You're evaluating him, but we each are telling him something different, and it's not fair
to to I give him my marching artist, you give him yours, you give him yours. Five of us, and we don't know what each one is saying. I think and you're absolutely right and I think that the for us that we need to learn is the consensus is
what the majority rules and if we all say this is what we'd like then that's what happens and we can't get pissed out excuse the expression when it doesn't fall the way we want it to fall. So >> unfortunately it goes back to city manager Matt
>> count to three and commission arms, >> you know. >> But Mike, I don't think that's a a fair analysis. >> Unfortunately, Tom's got to funnel everything that he hears from us, he's got to funnel it through. >> And he's and unfortunately he can't come
back to me and said, "This is what George thinks." >> Sure. And he never has with with >> And he doesn't. >> Yeah. But what I'm saying is when you do city manager math, what you really do say is I don't need to hear what Michael Hanel has to say about this. If he's on the down side of a 3-2, I think we
should all be together trying >> George. I don't think that's what happens with our city manager. He listens to every one of us. Then he's got to take what he thinks he can blend with three people and bring it back to us. >> I agree with, you know, we're just going to have we're going to have to deal with it. I'm not sitting through another
workshop on this type mess. We as a commission since the first of the year have dropped kicked cans down the road. We need to make decisions and move forward finally as a commission. And if we don't start, I'm walking out the
door. I'm not sitting here >> and not making any decisions anymore. We're going to make decisions. We're going to move us forward. If not, it's not worth it to us. Why are we wasting our time? >> Exactly. >> Because our voters put us here to do that. Excuse me.
>> Because the voters asked us to come. >> The voters have asked us to get work done for them. We're not. We're delaying things and we're delaying things and we're delaying things with workshops. We don't get back to it. It's time to go to work. And if we can't do it at a commission meeting, we all need to walk
out of here. Let the voters of us vote in a new commission. It's happened in our ha past history where a whole commission walked out of here. >> And we probably ought to happen again sometime soon if we're not careful. >> We need a new evaluation process.
>> That's what that's what we need because doing it this way causes too much confusion. Look what where we are now, you know. And maybe there should be a criteria that we want to rate him on. Everybody give him a rating and it's done. But it's not. >> Okay. Five.
>> What we're giving everybody else >> five. >> Um I did a review in the point score and I thought that's what we look at and uh my score was at one. >> Okay. And you were two and a half and I'm in five. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> That's all you need.
>> Is that five plus a,000? >> Is that five plus a,000? >> Yes. >> Okay. >> Five plus a,000 what everyone else gets. >> Yes. >> Okay. All right. Five plus a,000. Now the uh the car allowance
>> that's in the budget. >> Was that in the budget? >> We already we already approved it. >> That was all right. >> Okay. Thank you, Karen. >> Thank you. >> Okay, Mr. Mayor. I have a few items for discussion tonight.
Um that's the following three items. Let's see. You want to go ahead and start with the first one? 7.2, >> please. Um thanks. So we uh had previously um spoken about some property at a recent meeting. Um vice mayor
brought it this up about having some lots possibly donated for for use of of building homes, helping certain um nonprofits and things like that. So, what we're looking for tonight is just a kind of a discussion on a policy
direction on how the city would like to handle the sale or transfer of surplus city-owned residential lots. No decision is being made tonight. We're just looking for direction so that we can bring something back to you. So basically the purpose of the discussion is so that we can establish a consistent
policy for the sale or transfer of surplus residential lots looking at both CRA and nonCRA properties since there are different um requirements uh for CRA properties looking to ensure long-term community
benefit and preventing speculative resale and to maintain affordability. So tonight staff and when I say staff I'm also including myself because I prepared this. Um we're seeking commission uh commission direction on
what key safeguards and time frames you would like to see. This is uh the legal and policy framework. Um so we of course have statutes that allow authority of disposition of surplus property. Um, CRA
property can be transferred, but it must align with our redevelopment plan. And, um, the constitution does prohibit gift of public funds, which would essentially also be transferring property. Um, and it does allow for enforceable
restrictions to ensure compliance. So, that's where I'm kind of headed as far as giving you the options of what restrictions we should we can look at. The best practice would be of course u adopt a uniform policy that supports transparency, fairness and defensibility and makes it easy for not only the
public but also staff to uh deal with the requests. So the benefits of adopting a policy ensuring uniformity and fairness across transactions provides transparency and public confidence. Protects the city and CRA investments align with state housing and
one second redevelopment um best practices and reduces administrative burden through standard templates. So here are some of the safeguards I'll go with you um over. So we have the mechanism purpose the length the legal
stren uh strength as well as staff effort. So reverter clause the purpose of that would be that if they do not comply with whether it's occupancy or development within a certain time frame the property would revert back to the city. Um this is high legal strength
five stars and the staff effort would be moderate on this one. We can also look at deed deed restrictions that would limit resale and require occupancy for a certain amount of time. Um, and that's a
fourstar legal strength and it's low staff effort. We have performance mortgages. These are compliance tied to payment um or performance also. Uh for instance, you there are some cities like Jacksonville, they have they mortgage
the property, but it's a forgivable mortgage that if you comply with the certain um you know development parameters, occupancy requirements and resale um limits, then the mortgage gets forgiven. And so that that is a lean on
the property, but it's a way to to kind of keep tabs on it. And um this also applies to if if we were to sell a property nonc for instance but uh just a surplus property at a very low discount
or you know the appraisal comes in and we're trying to basically provide an encouragement or subsidy in by giving such a discount. Then um this would also be a way to tie payment whether it's to the taxes or any kind of restriction
that the city's looking for that would be in the best interest for that particular um effort that performance mortgages are um five stars in legal strength and moderate staff effort. We also have the right of first refusal
where the city could repurchase the property. The legal strength here is a bit lower. It's on three star. Um it's low staff effort because that is part of either the deed or we put, you know, we put that in um as a condition right on on
public record. So they'll know most of these will also be on there. But um they would have to come to us in order to sell the property and then we would have to buy it back. But then the the benefit here is depending on the amount um we don't know what the market will do. we
how do we set that restriction depending on when it happens. So there's that will require a little bit more finessing. Now the bottom ground lease or a community land trust, these are for long-term community control properties. These are like very strategic uh projects. Um
they're high legal strength, but there's a lot of effort for staff. So in looking at these um kind of made a recommendation based on I think we're uh from our last discussion and and
where what staff can do. Um so the direction here would be to one um look at preferred protective mechanisms whether it's reverbered restriction right first refusal preferred time frames for development and resale restrictions and whether we'll to apply different standards for CRA and nonCRA
lots and then with the direction given tonight we'll prepare a draft policy resolution for your consideration at a future meeting. The recommended policy is to have a tiered approach. Um, this would balance protection and staff manageability for
nonCRA lots. We could look at deed restrictions. Um, the recommendation what's often done is about 5 years for resale. So, you cannot sell the property for 5 years and you have to occupy owner occupied for that time period. We can
incorporate a writer first refusal at that point if they wanted to sell and we wanted to get that back. And um so that's essentially a five-year restriction. The CRA lots would work better with a reverter um or
performance-based mortgage. That way um it's more to ensure a compliance with our plan, the CRA plan. Um we could also have a deed restriction in there um based on building time and occupancy. Normally, if the lot is given for um
homeowner occupancy, 24 months is plenty of time to get the home built >> and uh coed and ready for occupancy. And then that individual would also be um held to occupy the property for at least five year for 5 years. Um, and then if
they were to try to sell at that point, then we could have a deed restriction in there that this would be affordable housing if we chose to do that or the use or purpose of that particular lot would continue, but then um we would be able to bring it back if they failed to
comply with the restrictions. So, this is essentially the the recommendation based on where um the city lots are and staff is. >> Okay. So, um, so as a mortgage professional, I know some of these are
going to be really hard to get a a a mortgage for. Um, you have any experience in with that? >> Most most of these houses will have a >> will have will have a mortgage after after they're built. So,
>> these would be uh so these mortgages, the performance ones would be uh subordinate mortgages, >> okay? but they would just be a lean on the property. So, they can't just dispose of it without us being involved. And I think the the goal is to make sure that the city is informed of what's going on
with the properties as >> you know, you don't want to dispose of something and >> it's gone, they flip it and then um they go and sell it in the private market. So it wouldn't we would be taking a um a secondary position to allow for the bank
to have a primary in in that instance um to allow for them to get financing. Do you have any other thoughts commissioner? And and again this is just a discussion >> right >> um >> trying to
>> so what I would be recommending is this right? So, we um we want to coordinate for CRA properties that anything we do is consistent with the plan. We would have a draft surplus property resolution, a property policy resolution
that complies with the Florida statute. We'd bring it back to you for consideration and that in that we would develop standardized templates. So, you could look at what a deed restriction um would be. the reverter if we do that with the par the mortgage that um we
discussed earlier um kind of building in those parameters but we're really looking at are we going to do a fiveyear the restrictions are we looking at five years and if we're good with the 24 months for building um the lot for occupancy so it's it's still
a work in progress but and I'm and I'm happy to build more on it but it's just to kind of give you an idea of what the enforcement mechanisms would be and um by developing templates that are satisfactory to all of you, then it would make it um definitely easier for staff just to have that to work off of.
And then essentially as a request come through and it's approved by commission, you know, which restriction you want to enforce for this one and they'll already have that. >> Okay. >> Thoughts, questions?
>> Questions? No, it's an improvement over what happened in the past where people are still sitting on those lots and nothing's ever been built on them >> and they're just holding on to them and I I think this is >> I'm still >> very much needed. I I I totally agree with you on that, but I'm still
>> If you'd like, Vice Mayor, if you wanted to be the point, if the commission is okay with it for you to be the point person since you have the real estate experience for us to work on on >> what that looks like and then bring it back to you just like we did the chicken ordinance >> uh with Commissioner Ozbody >> because I'm worried I'm worried about
how some of these will might be a challenge for for some of the loan programs out there with subordinate mortgages. And so yes, I would I mean I'll be more than happy to to help with the >> Thanks Gary. >> Y >> okay so
do we have uh consensus to kind of >> Yes. >> work on on that and then I can work with the vice mayor as the point person. >> Definitely. >> Okay. Great. >> All right. The next one. >> The next two. >> Yes.
>> Aren't we governed by the state of Florida? >> Uh yes we are. Yeah. >> Yes, we are. >> A lot of things were covered by the state of Florida. Um and and and these are quicker. I just uh to be to be frank given uh what transpired with the
discussion on the developer one-on-one meetings, I um in considering the process um speaking with uh the administration, speaking with the mayor, the idea is to bring to you for discussion certain items before
we just put them on the agenda to avoid um you know what happened. So whether it's to comply with the law or not, I mean sometimes we won't go through this because we're I'll be preparing ordinances that are just absolutely required and there's not anything really to discuss, but this is more to give you
information of what's coming or what you'll you'll be expected to see. I don't I mean I don't expect that you'll say no to these. Um, but you could >> I I had a I looked at 119. It It's just wordy. >> I know. I have a presentation.
>> Yeah. Yeah. And so it just seems to me I need to know more. I feel better knowing more about >> Yeah. >> why we would have to do this particular thing. >> Yes. Well, it I have I have some more information. Ready?
Okay. So, um, this is the public records exemption request form and procedures. C, >> can I add one thing? I I I wanted to follow up on what Michael said. Everything Everything in here is already been
dictated by the legislature and the legislature has gone over it and over it and over it consistently and I think they do a great job. and for us to create uh anything else other than that with where our city is and the things
that we need to do. Um I I I I don't I don't know where this is coming from. I don't really understand that. I have not had a chance to look at these Senate bills and read all this. Uh but you know
>> I I I would like >> yeah I would like to see us >> um give us more opportunity for me to do some research and do some stuff on this. I'd like to see us uh table this for now. I'd like I'd move >> it's a discussion item. There's no there's no decision being made.
>> I would table to move to discuss to uh table the discussion till at least I can get a chance to read some of the stuff myself and understand it. Uh even though I don't really I agree with with uh um Michael um
>> well the issue is you know we have this is meant this is supported by Florida state law and um we don't have policies in place for certain items and this is also to provide guidance not only for >> so >> for staff and the public. So, I would
like to table this for now and give me a chance to do some research and perhaps I don't want to say this because I don't want to get Michael mad at me. Perhaps a workshop on it or table, but I I need I'm happy with what the legislature has done. Uh I think they do a great job and at this point I I can't I'm not prepared
to go through and and deal with this now. So, I would make a um suggestion, a move, a motion. I don't know what it is to table this 7.3 and 7.4 Is is it are these sorry are these are were you done George?
>> Yeah. Are are these new laws? >> There's an expansion of um Senate Bill 268. So the >> 7.3. >> Okay. >> It's it's if I may at least go through the presentation and then you can choose to discuss. >> I would I would I'm moving I have a a a
move or a word forward to table this and Mr. Mr. Mayor, I'd like to be heard on that or I'd like you to pull the uh commission. >> Okay. Uh I'm polling. Um Mike, >> I'm good with tableabling it because I
think state law supersedes everything. >> I say I like I say, I didn't have really a chance to really dive into this as well. And >> um there's a lot of things I'd like to understand first. So yeah, I'm I'm I'm I would like to table it, too.
Emily, >> I was overwhelmed when I looked at 119. So, I I uh I'd like to, you know, us to deep dive. >> I will be frank. This is for the benefit of staff as because they they don't have
a form that they can work off of to read off what the exemptions are. And this bill expands a family member. >> Mr. Mayor, we we put out and I think you did a polling um
>> give us a chance to to re look at this >> as we've asked and as we voted. >> Please continue what you were saying session. the bill expanded to family members to be able to come to the city and say, "I'm married to or I am the daughter of or the son of a police
officer um anyone that works for the city and I would like my information to be protected from disclosure. It's not something that um you know previously was allowed and that involves
disclosure of daycare locations and uh personal data." So >> you're talking about 7.3 right now. >> Yes. That's the whole point of presenting this is because um staff when they come to request they have to do it. There has to be a form that they can
fill out and say I qualify based on the fact that I you know my father or my husband or you know whomever works for the city and I would like my information exempted. So it's really to protect the individuals as they come in. There's
there's nothing Um it's it's completely consistent with what 268 is. It just expanded the protections and it's to enable uh you know the clerk when she gets a request to have a form that they can fill out
and comply and she can confirm that the exemption because it is very lengthy which exemption applies to this individual. It would facilitate that greatly. Right now we do not have form. >> I mean do other do other Municipalities
have a form. >> Yes, they do. >> So, why are we so far behind getting this one? >> It just this is a a new thing and now because of what happened with >> like I said, we the the agenda came out really late on Friday. I mean, really late. Um, and I tried to look into this.
Um, it's a lot of I mean, it's a lot of legal a lot of legal stuff. And I mean, I I would just like to have a little bit more time to look at it first. That's all I'm saying. All right. Uh, we have What did you say, Henry?
>> I I I was overwhelmed with it, too. I'd like to >> uh >> I'm okay with it coming back in two weeks. >> I was going to say, dude, are you good for two weeks? Is two weeks enough time? >> Depends on what we find in there. I would like to table it for now. Let us
look at it and we'll see. Agree to bring it back. >> Bring it back in two weeks. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Same for 7.4. >> Yes, >> Mr. Mr. Mayor, I don't know that that might be uh sufficient. Could we ask uh can we table the uh commission
we need to probably take some time probably meet with uh attorney and and get some understanding of all this so that we can do a diligent >> I think two weeks is enough times. >> Okay. >> But in two weeks you'd like me to bring this back for presentation. >> Yes.
>> Back under discussion. >> Discussion please. Okay. And 7.4 as well. I'm sorry. >> And 7.4 we're talking about >> including that in there, too. Okay.
>> Okay. >> Okay. All right. Okay. Next up, future agenda items. Uh Mike, >> congratulations to the fire department. What a great presentation tonight. Uh Chief Capri, congratulations to our police department. Both of those
agencies are some of the best in Central Florida. And I appreciate the hard work that the uh both chiefs are doing and the command staffs at both of those organizations. Just outstanding. Everywhere I go, I'm proud. Um every
League of Cities meeting that I step into, I hear about your organizations and I'm very proud of that. So, thank you so much. Halloween's coming up. Please watch out for our kids. Make sure that they stay safe. I know that Sam has
a uh program coming up. Uh is it this this Saturday, Sam? >> 6 to >> 6 to 9. >> 6 to9 out at Carver Park. >> Yes. >> Excellent. And I think Chief Capri probably wants to talk about um our officer that we uh retired officer that
we lost. So I'd give him some time to do that if that's okay. Are you handle it? >> Okay. >> Yeah, I'll call him up. >> That's all I've got. Mayor. >> Okay, Emily. I don't have anything right now, but I will say that it seems like wherever there are awards or wherever you city of
Eustace is mentioned that we bring back hardware and everybody knows who we are and I'm proud of that. >> Okay. All right. Thank you, Gary. >> Um, yeah, a couple things. Um, you know, speaking of of the agenda being really
late on Friday and we've all had this discussion now about not not having is there And I'm just is there a way to get the agenda out on Thursday instead of Friday? And the reason being when we get it on Friday, we can't staff's already
gone. They're gone for the weekend. And it it is I mean, we do lose we do lose a day trying to, you know, trying to get, you know, these answers once, you know, we help probably maybe solve some of these things. It's just an idea. It's um it's, you know, we really only have
three days, three business days >> to before the meetings. >> Okay. We'll have Tom address that. >> Okay. >> Okay. Anything else? >> Yeah. And um I'd like I'd like to just have a discussion on um commissioners going to conferences.
Um I am going to one next week. Um it's not a conference that that we're all going to any other conferences this year. So, I'd like to go to this conference and then be reimbursed for some of the travel,
but Tom Tom suggested I had to pull the commission um um for that. I I just chose to go to this conference as opposed to the other conferences that we've had already this year. The money's been budgeted for commissioners to go to conferences. I'm just choosing to go to
this city. It's the one in the one in Japan, the the southeastern southeastern states Japanese association conference. Uh we're meeting with some companies that are interested in the county. >> How much are you thinking that entails
of roughly a range? >> Um I I mean I don't have an exact figure. Um >> what's in the budget? >> I I Tom Tom would have to help me on that. >> What's in the budget, Tom? So, the um the travel that we budget for each commissioner includes the uh annual
League of Cities Conference uh which we budget uh I believe $2,000 per commissioner for that and then the um the legislative days uh the League of Cities Tallahassee trip uh which I think we budget at $1,500 per commissioner. Uh
we do also budget for Florida Redevelopment Association, but that's in the CRA budget versus the the others I mentioned are in the general fund commission budget. And then we budget for uh various uh chamber breakfasts uh
and various other uh smaller and more local events. So, uh, definitely $3,500 per commissioner and then some smaller amounts >> designated, >> I'm sorry, >> it's designated for those particular
>> it the uh it is in a larger travel and predium line item, but the sub items say League of Cities and Tallahassee. Um, so that's it appears in the budget in those sublines. And then we we also uh budget for
various like uh um the sheriff's gayla and uh we budget for other um events. Uh again smaller amounts for various events. >> Um some more comments. Uh Mr. Mayor.
>> Uh yeah. >> I mean this >> 3500 or or whatever. It'll not be that much. >> Okay. It won't be that much, but whatever that was what allocated for his travel. I didn't go I don't think anybody went to the last one uh the last
week or something. Whatever that was. >> Uh that was the Florida Re Association. >> This is just my thought. If anybody, any one of these commissioners and really even staff that might be even Miranda or Tom or Al want
to go travel across the country through another time zone to try to find something that helps this city. That's a small price to pay. We're dishing out $85,000 move money for this
guy, 35,000 to do this, 20,000 to match this stuff. We got a vice mayor of our town who's willing to go across the country and wave our flag no matter what. I'm a big economic
development guy. I can't What's the the squeeze worth the juice? Um I'm I'm I'm okay with it. I I won't go. I'm not interested in going because it's just too much too far my time and
everything, but I I'm I'm okay with 3500 or all the things that we do in a $25 million operating budget and it's budgeted in. I'm I'm I'm all for it and I really I thank you for going. >> Well, I mean, we we all have our initiatives. >> We do. >> And you know, we all have certain things
that were and economic development for me is one is top is top of my list right now. So, if the money's already there, I'm not asking for more money. I'm just asking for the money that's already there that I haven't used for any of the other conferences.
>> Why haven't you gone to any of the other conferences? >> Mainly because of work. >> Okay. Emily, >> I guess I feel like we there's so much that we need to like when we go to the conferences, we're limited if if only
two of us go, if only three of us go as to the information we bring we we bring back. Ordinar in the past, we've all gone together, one take this area, one take this area, one take this area, and we all come back with the load of information. Um, I guess I have to ask,
you talk about economic benefits, but what is it really going to do for the city of Eustace, and I remember um the the idea of our sister city um that coming up too. And I I guess I'm just
wondering how beneficial or what what is it really going to do for us >> as compared to going to >> conferences and learning new things about the in the state of Florida? That's just the only question I have. That's what I'm I'm asking. >> How how beneficial were the other
conferences that we went to? >> We >> no every everyone else went to already this year. Yeah. How beneficial were >> I felt that they were the ones I went to and I didn't one at a time. one at a time. There's no way you can objectively say those those conferences were not that good for the city as opposed to
this conference is not that good. There's no objective measure whatsoever you can put on that. >> But I'm only stating what I got out of it and what I think that we when we go to those that we should go and we we learn new things. I don't know. You're telling actually when you said it, you
said I want to go to a conference and I hear a lot of things. I'm not I'm not Gary. I'm not opposing. I'm just asking questions. >> You know, I support I support everyone. I support everyone others initiative. I support American Bloom.
>> Willie, I support you with Panther Pride and and education. Michael, you you know, you're big on the cemetery right now. George, you're uh you know, UCF and and uh and Mega and you guys are going to st stand here and say I can't have a
little bit of money to go to help to help the city. I think what it is is we >> No, it's personal is what it's become. Yes, it has, Willie. It It is. It's become personal up here. And I tell you what, I am not the only one to seize it. It's personal.
>> I What I will say is we have no idea what you're talking about. >> Exactly. >> All you say is a conference. We don't know what you're doing. >> You went You went down to Fort Lauderdale with a chief. I don't know what I don't know what went on down there. >> It wasn't $3,500.
It's money that's already budgeted though. >> Emily, did you get reimbured for American and Bloom to go up there? >> No, I didn't get reimbured. >> You didn't get embarrassed for anything for the city? >> No, I did not. >> Now, I got my fair pay and I got my registration pay. But but Gary Gary,
here's the thing. Here's what's bothering me. When we you present something to us, but when we ask you questions, you get so defensive and you get so personal with it. That's the only reason why it's I'm being defensive. And
>> I think you got to go back to the >> Hold on. Let him finish, please. >> And And yeah, >> Gary, let me ask you something. >> That's fine. >> Why don't you just tell us what you're going for? >> That's what we need to know. You haven't told us yet. >> It's economic development. We're going
I'm going over there to meet with some companies. >> But isn't that Al's job? >> I think Al should go, too. And we should pay for that. >> Okay. Willie, just just just just pull. It's fine. I'm okay. I'm okay.
>> $3,500 to a commissioner's initiative to go do economic development across the other side of the country. >> I'm I'm thank you. >> If you wanted if you wanted an ant itinerary, I mean, if that that would have made a difference, I would have I would have had I would have had one I
would have had one prepared. >> When is this uh when is this event? It's um it's uh Monday and Tuesday of next week. >> I say we could do a workshop, but Michael. >> No, it's okay. Just >> George, if you keep throwing that
workshop crap at me, I'm here to here and I'm not going to stay. >> Everybody >> um come on. This this is about me right now. >> No, really. I mean, it's fine. I mean, everybody everybody has had their everyone's had their opinion, so it's fine. Let's just, you know, let's just
uh >> just just poll. What do you want to do in >> I am not going to comment. >> Okay, Mike. >> Truthfully, if we'd have known more about it, if if I'd have had further
advanced notice, I mean, this just didn't come up. I don't I don't personally at this point see where it benefits the people of this city. Um, I've got pe we've got people residents that can't afford to go across this the county line. So, no, I I'm not
in favor of it right now. If we'd have had more information, more planning time, we could have looked at it. >> Sorry. >> Um, yeah, I'm I'm I'm okay with it. I mean, if you guys want us uh if we can ask if you feel like it would be more informative to you, we can maybe ask
Gary to forward information on the on the event and the site and and all of that. Um, I just can't believe we're spending that much time over $3,500 on But, um, >> we spent time on list. So, >> have we then? Shame on us. I think
>> All right, let him finish. >> Yeah, go ahead. I I I think I hope you know I I had an I saw an example um with with us at the mega workplace where they reached out to a Czechoslovakian company that honestly I didn't think it was
anything worth our time and uh it's it's led to a a facility an office and now a um assembly and and whatever Opticon is going to be doing. So sometimes you knock on doors as a salesman. I mean Al,
how many people do you talk to before you get one person? It's not easy. So international is now favorable because of some of the trade stuff and everything. So yeah, I I'm I'm I'm fine with $3,500 for that. >> I want to say I just wanted to say that
I said this to to someone before. It's not what but how. And when we ask questions and we do this, I would I would hope that we as a commission can respond to each other in a way that we give information and do it in a not not
be so angry and and hostile about it. That's all I want to know. That's all I just ask questions and share with us. Let us know. I mean, but when it becomes a yelling contest and talking over anybody, we're not going to get anything done. So, I'm done with it. And I I I
conclude. I'm finished. I'm done. >> May I make a suggestion? >> I am passionate about it. Did you ask Didn't you tell us about this before? Um did you tune out already? Um didn't you tell us about this? >> No, that was that was about meeting with the general counsel in Miami. And I actually do have the uh I actually do
have the itinerary here if uh anybody wanted to see it. >> Sasha. >> Yeah. If I just want to make a suggestion if um since this is Monday, Tuesday that's coming up, right? um possibly consider looking at uh making an adjustment to the travel
policy. I mean our charter does have some restrictions on that, but we can if if with more information there is a finding of public benefit. There could be reimbursement and then just a reallocation of those funds as as reimbursement. >> I I notified Tom of this over over a
week over >> uh well it does have to be in public discussion. That's the issue that so you know, you'll go to the conference and then you can inform the commission of the public benefit and if they're all in agreement, we can do the reimbursement
component because we don't have um under the charter. I don't believe that there's a a way to just do essentially general travel like everything is either registration fees paid, there has to be a city business related because it is expending public funds. So, if we can
have this discussion again with more information and you have the commission on board, we can just do a reallocation of and do a budget amendment to to move that over and get you that um that reimbursement. I think it's just a matter of them needing more information. So, I think we can still
I'm just offering that as a a way to kind of get you >> there. Yeah, sure. >> Okay. >> All right. Anything else? >> Okay. >> We heard from everyone but you, Mr. Mayor. Oh, >> well, we're not done. >> Oh,
>> no. On the on the uh >> Oh, the travel done with >> Oh, you're done. Okay. You know, I um >> Yeah, I think I I'd want more information. Um you know, three days before.
It wasn't three days before. I I asked Tom about this. Tom, when did I email you about this? >> Uh early last week. >> Yes. But it but it has to be it has to be talked about in public. >> Yeah, that's that's the problem. >> We're in public now.
>> Okay. >> I can't email you directly. >> Go ahead. Sorry. I'm sorry. >> So, are we uh the the city attorney to to prepare something else? >> I hope it doesn't cost more. Okay. >> No, I'm okay. It's fine. >> It was a suggestion on how to handle
this for for the next meeting since it's coming up. Are you are you open to that >> to her suggestion? >> I mean, I don't I don't know why I have to be singled out to >> Oh my god. >> No. No. Really, honestly, that's what >> I'm going to tell you. I'm going to tell you this every time.
>> I respect I respect you. >> Go ahead. Go ahead. And then I'll tell you what I have to say. Go ahead. >> I respect you when when when you're talking. >> I I don't know why I'm the only commissioner up here that has to that has to ask for travel money. >> You know, I I
What what I will say is that every time, and don't take this the wrong way, every time that something goes against you, you play the victim, >> and you do. And it's not that case. It's is it's not the case. There's a certain way to do things.
Um so uh are you open to um uh what Sasha is saying >> just coming back after your trip and updating commission if if they find you know again just a discussion public benefit and then there could be a
readjustment to reimburse you. Okay. All right Tom. Oh I'm sorry Chief did you come up please talk about Phil Uh on o can you hear me? >> Yeah.
>> On October 18th, we lost uh a retired sergeant, Phil Leston. He passed away after a courageous battle with cancer. And uh Phil, we honored him here, I believe, a month and a half ago for our first annual um legacy award. >> And uh myself and Elena Pacik went to
his house on the 16th to talk to him because he went into hospice care. And uh it's pretty tough when you're sitting in somebody's house and they're asking you to plan your funeral, their funeral. And uh it was emotional. I usually don't get choked up on things, but it it
definitely hit me pretty hard. Uh I didn't think it would happen that fast. So he he asked for some things for his sendoff, his funeral, and I I gave him my word, and we're going to we're going to do that. So the funeral is going to be Monday, uh the 27th at
Harden Paulie at 10 o'clock. uh is the viewing. The viewing and then 11:00 will be a celebration of life there. Uh I don't know how long it's going to last. Uh Pastor Renee is officiating. The family requested her. Uh and then about hopefully well around noon or whatever.
I don't know what time we're done with the service. We're going to uh do a procession to the uh I don't know the name of this this the cemetery over here by uh if you go north on 19 >> Lakeside Memory Gardens. >> Lake what's it? >> Lakeside. Lakeside Memorial Gardens is where we'll have the uh he asked for uh
police officers and and fire to do the uh uh pawbearers. So, uh I just would like if the commission could show up. It's kind of important. Uh I mean, you know, funeral's a must. Weddings option. So, uh I really appreciate if if if you all show up and pay your respects if
you're in town. >> What time was that again? >> Uh 10 o'clock in the morning. It's it's it's on our Facebook page. >> Yeah. >> U please keep his family in your thoughts and prayers. Uh, I got to tell you, the the Eustace Police Department really stepped up. Uh, the retirees, everybody, uh, bringing food for the
family and, uh, it's tough. This job's tough as it is. And then, and then, you know, you retire and you get to what, get four years of your life to retire. You got to put up with all the stuff that you got to deal with and, uh, the pressures and the stress of the job. So, it's just uh, it just it just sucks. So,
uh, cancer sucks and I feel sorry for everybody that goes through that and I hope one day they find a cure for that disease. So, uh, thank you. >> Thanks. >> Thanks, Jon. >> Uh, yes. Uh, a couple of things. Uh, we, uh, have engaged
>> Hold on a minute, Tom. >> Sure, >> George. Um, I've I've had there's a little thing going around downtown with concern about parking and I'm getting some of the
business owners uh started one with one and now it's expanded to three or four and now five concerned about and this is probably a chief uh input thing concerned about people parking all day sometimes for days and days in front of
our businesses And it it's it's I can't tell you how many times I've come through town and then just said, "Let's go." Now, Mount Dora has got that reputation, unfortunately. But can we find a way to not have cars parked
there, especially by I have in my leases down there that no employee uh can park there to leave it open for customers. And uh we we haven't even grown the next big growth and we we're having that. So
it would be nice to listen to our businesses. I Daniel's here I guess. Uh I don't know if he has a thought on that but uh we talked once about it chief and you said something about parking for two hours or putting up signs. Somebody said I can't remember exactly. >> Let me chief and I are meeting with
people downtown tomorrow >> about this. So >> So thank you. I mean, I think the big challenge is that there's there's there's apartments and residents above all these all these uh all these storefronts >> and there's public parking though too for them. I've asked them and I have
apartment people and they need to park in in in the public parking. That's I mean that's going to be the real challenge is working from a VEO. >> I think one of the big problems and thank you for bringing it up George is that we have a lot of business owners that are parking u you know in in
customer parking spots and they're there all day. Uh so I had some people talk to me and the chief and I are going to meet with them tomorrow. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. What else? Um, I believe uh
>> I believe that yeah, Erin's thing is coming up. Um, I'll let you talk about that if if you'd like. Uh, it's still it still hurts um our community. >> You could still drive by there and you could see the skid marks and you could see the scraping and you could see where
he was hit and you could see all this. Not to get into the emotional side of it all, but uh it's it's it's something I've reached out to the family. I continue to I encourage my fellow commissioners. I'm sure they all have. I don't even think I have to say that we have that kind of goodhearted commissioners uh to keep doing that. But
um other than other than that, I I didn't plan on commenting about this, but today was a little bit more rougher than some of the previous days. But I
know we're all trying to do better and we're passionate about what we believe and I believe that every one of these commissioners up here have the cities in their heart and I challenge myself every meeting to try to be better and I think
we are and uh let's not lose the energy in there and and um and and carry forward to make useless and leave us better than it was when we came And that's all I have, Mr. Mayor. >> Thank you, George.
>> Uh Tom, >> yes. Uh we have engaged uh Dr. Levy. Um uh Dr. Levy was here, met with um a commissioner and um
members of the leadership team. Uh we need to schedule uh another visit uh where we can uh get with the uh commissioners that he has not met with uh one- on-one yet. And then we also um
Dr. Levy is traveling as we approach the Thanksgiving holiday. So we are not going to get a workshop in before Thanksgiving. Uh but I'm now working with him to identify a date uh in uh early December. So, I'll be um probably
sending a doodle poll out trying to get something set up for that. Uh but we need to before we can do that, we need to schedule the one-on-one sessions. So, I'll be working with you uh to get those scheduled. Um also, uh we are working
through a process uh with the state uh called the EAR or the evaluation and appraisal report. Uh that is a process where we uh take a look at evaluate and modify our comprehensive plan. Uh that has gotten more complicated with the uh
introduction of Senate Bill 180. And so we are working with uh consultants uh to move through that process. I bring it up because we are approaching some deadlines with the state on our ear, but at the same time, we're getting some
resistance from the not resistance, but we're running into delays because of Senate Bill 180. And so, I'm letting you know that uh we are working on it. We've engaged a consultant to help us through that process and I will be getting you more information because it may affect
our ability to approve some comprehensive plan amendments and annexations moving forward. And so more information to come on that. And then um the final thing uh I want to thank everyone for the time that they've put
into uh my performance evaluation. Uh I did get good information. Uh I will uh work on uh items that been have been identified uh by the commissioners and I I want to thank you because you um you
all serve a dual role. Uh well you serve many roles but specifically you serve a dual role in that you are an employer uh and you have to provide um benefits and salaries not just to me but to all of our employees. And so you're an
employer, but you're also a steward of taxpayer dollars. And so I just want you to know that I appreciate uh the um the complications of serving those dual roles and uh thank you for everything you do. And that's all I have.
>> Thank you, Tom. Thank you for what you do. >> Madam Attorney, >> yes, I have a few updates for you. uh first with the uh community center parcel with uh for the CR8's position. So we did get a revised uh title commitment.
Um it shows that the city does hold fe simple clear title to the property. It is no longer subject to any deed restrictions or or verter clauses um that were present in um you know prior
deeds but we were able to get the probate file and through that get that clearance um with the old republic title commitment. Um, so we are able to move forward with the existing legal description which is
the old legal description because the title insurer did recommend a new boundary survey which um for it to be accurate. We did look at some costs and um the they're they're pretty high. So um it's not required for closing. So the idea is for for us to be able to move
forward with this um we would recommend that the buyer the whoever ends up getting the property uh based on uh the city's determination would obtain and pay for their survey just to secure that they have exact delineations of of what
comes with that conveyance. Um that way it's uh they would be doing so so that they're protected because if they choose not to it's at their own risk. um they would resume any they would assume any liability if uh um there's any issues to title later on
um based on on the boundary survey. So, but this would save um an unnecessary expense for the city. So, I just wanted to um let you know about that. So that would be included in the publication um
to let them know that this is it's a concern but you know that's something that they would have to consider uh in making that proposal. Uh I know that we'll be doing the um notice of intent to dispose as well as the RFP. It'll have all of that that you know the
property description let them know about the survey um invitation for the proposals. They'll have to also indicate why their proposal serves public purpose and provide financial feasibility documentation. Um I think staff is uh working through the preparation of the
RFP and it just to make sure that everything goes out concurrently, but we would I believe the intention is to bring it to you so that you could see the contents of it and you're okay with what is going out um and you can see the full breath of what it is that we're requiring um for the applicants to
submit. And that way once it's out, you can also um then determine how you want to handle the process of evaluation, whether it's through a committee, whether you want to review all of them um depending on how many submissions we get, etc. But that's kind of where we
are now. >> Will that be done this year? >> Go ahead. >> Will that be done this year? >> We're just waiting on getting um the language ready. So, we'll probably be able to Tom, do you think maybe next >> We we've been working on it this whole
time and we are uh finalizing it right now. I mean, we could potentially have it on the agenda at the next meeting. >> Oh, cool. >> My my concern is we don't have a plan for our community center.
And I think that if we put it out there, that property will probably go quicker than uh any other property that we >> Well, we don't I mean, we don't have to we get we get solicitation, but we don't have to do any of them. >> Mhm.
>> Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's just I mean, and she's done some great work on this. Um >> but we have lost a little bit of time trying to figure out, you know, um and and do we really need to okay the advertising? I thought we already did that. >> I mean, I'm not going to understand all
the language in there. >> Okay. I I thought you wanted to be more invol I mean, I really >> I understand, but I'm just I mean, I'm just I'm just discussion. I mean, I'm not going to know all the language in the in the RFP. Do we need to >> We Yeah, generally they don't come
before commission, but um >> So, so the RFP explain that. I mean, what's our intent? Well, it's just an essentially we're putting out there that there's a notice of of
intent to dispose of public property and if someone is interested, they'd be submitting their proposal for how they want to develop that property to serve the public purpose of the city and um show a number of things, but essentially um also that they have financial
feasibility to do it, what kind of timing they're looking at. Um, so it's there's a lot of information that goes into it because you want to make sure that whatever project you end up choosing, if you choose to select one, and you don't necessarily have to, but um that that's actually a good fit for
the community, that that's going to be a a good disposal of the property. Um, we're not um, you know, because of the fact that it's it it is a CRA property, it's also a pretty um, good location. you know, there could be se a lot of
interest. Um, so it's >> so it's an RFP for projects. >> Yes. For them to submit proposals. Mhm. >> But we it's also um incumbent on the city and and for your evaluation to make sure again that the project is a good
fit that it's going to be uh completed within a reasonable time based on what they proposed that it's um uh financially feasible for it to act for it to not only get built but operate during for a certain amount of time. Um so there's a a lot to consider there. So
normally a committee is established when these come in and um kind of sort through if there's more than one and then uh that gets presented to you all and then you you you know we can't really sign a contract or anything for conveyance until there's
an evaluation of all of this because you have to make a finding that this this disposal of property would be in the city's best interest. And we and when we do that, we also have to talk about what how we're going to do without the community center. Yeah. Yeah. The transition part. We got to build that
into it also. >> I mean, that's something else we need to be planning on. >> Yeah. When they pick somebody, I guess, or top, whatever. >> Is it required by law to do an RFP for that property? >> You've asked this before. It's not required. It's an additional
>> um recommendation and I think the consensus was from commission to proceed with that protection. >> But not required by law. Okay. >> The the 30-day advertisement is required to be public 163.380. >> That's the minimum. But there's feas I
mean it's not going to be possible to gather all that information and do an evaluation of the financials and all of that in 30 days. That's just a time for people to respond and get their their data in. So that's a it'll all go out concurrently. So it just allows you to have more opportunity to get and and
kind of put you know give more notice to the public. What are we doing with the RF the unsolicited that we got? Are we >> they will be able to re to submit an application once um the notice of intent goes out. That's why given
>> so we won't we won't vote on that. We won't hear it. We won't >> the city's not obligated to respond. Um I believe you got got a copy of the letter. >> Yeah. >> That was submitted to um attorney ops on that. >> Um there's no >> no to respond. Okay. >> But they're welcome to apply. And I did
tell attorney Opsall that once we were ready to proceed because we were clearing up the title concern that came up um that I would let him know when that was going to be published so that his clients could submit an application as well.
>> Okay. So whenever somebody makes an unsolicited, we have no obligation to respond. >> No. >> Okay. >> Thank you. >> Okay. >> Anything else on that? So do you want it to come back to you? Because I think that's also something Tom would need to know. What exactly are you talking about?
>> The the the content of of what we're going to put out there, the notice and the RFP as far as what >> what all is going out. >> You're looking it over? >> Yes, I will be looking over. >> And you're looking it over? >> Yes.
I would like to see it just for transparency a copy of it so that if we could share anything in there and thoughts it will help us so that when the people do come forward she knows kind of a little idea that we we have an input and and uh and put it out there and I'd also like to know how it would
be advertised when where and when the when it would be uh opened up the uh responses and that it be done in public. >> Okay. So, well, we if if there's a
consensus to do that, then we would bring it back. Tom thinks we could have it ready by next meeting. >> Yeah, that would be the plan. >> We'll put it on later. Okay. >> All right. >> All right. The two more >> I have two more things to talk about. I know >> today I got to talk a lot. Um just a
quick update on the EV charging stations. I know you recall Ben um was here earlier. uh he submitted to us a draft um contract to to look over and I've I've looked at it. Um we're going to
need to revise it and negotiate it with him. So I I will be getting um some of my edits hopefully next week so we can bring it back to you as soon as possible. The way it's currently written um there's a lot of control for the vendor uh especially with termination
rights and it limits flexibility for the city. we don't have clear performance standards and I want to make sure that if they're going to have control they're servicing um the units quickly and so that the the public is essentially um you know getting the
benefit of us giving that exclusive location. Another aspect of it is it is an exclusivity agreement. So I would I would like to see it narrowed to the locations that he mentioned or where we actually have them so that we can also have the opportunity if we want to
expand to include um other providers in other locations if if we kind of limit the scope of that. So um yeah that's essentially where we are um with that. And my last update um is
huddle 44. You guys remember this one? Um so we have uh received notification that uh two of the nearby property owners did file a lawsuit with uh Lake County. They had reached out to our uh development services seeking an
appelllet process for the approval of resolution 2555 which was the one that granted approval of the site plan with the waiverss for the um I think it was the drive-thru and um the commercial project over on SR
44B. Uh so we do not have an appellet process for that because that is um when you make it that determination it's it's final. I mean it's made by the commission. So um we did correspond with the um the individual and advise him
that he would need to seek recourse with the court through a petition for rid of cersi which has been done. There's a time frame on that. um they went ahead and filed that and um what they're alleging is that the city did not comply with certain provisions of the land
development code. Um there are no damages being sought. It's essentially a review of the commission's decision. So the court has it's part of the process. Every time we get these uh requests sent, they do a review to see if there's compliance with um the requirements of
what the petition has as well as if >> should we be discussing this in the shade? I can provide an update to the commission this way, but I'm just letting you know strategy with them that they didn't ask for damages. So, you're saying >> it's public record. They filed this. So,
>> um I'm not discussing strategy. >> Uh in fact, I was actually going to say because it's pending litigation. Anything other I'm just giving you the information of what transpired. >> Uh so, the the petition has been reviewed. Um and it's uh the court
conducted that review. they've issued an order to show cause and it's so we will have 30 days to file a written response. We're getting ready to prepare all of that. Um we're coordinating to um also get a certified record which is part of it since it's more of like an appella procedure within the circuit court. Um
so that's where we are. So the next step is for us to just kind of prepare on on our end. Should there be a need of to really discuss legal strategy uh risk assessment or anything like that, I will certainly let you know. or if you choose to request um to have a closed session
to discuss it. Um I you know we're ob obviously open to that, but I just wanted to let you know that that lawsuit has been filed and we're going to respond to that to it on behalf of the city. >> That is all.
>> That's it. Okay. Uh tomorrow morning at 9:00. >> Yes. >> Okay. Tomorrow morning at 9:00 we have the groundbreaking. So just to remind you all about that. Okay. Uh I know we're trying to get out
of here. Uh the longer you work in public administration, the more you realize work is not about power, process, or praise. It's about stewardship in its purest form. The responsibility to care for something that would never belong to you. The
understanding that everything you manage will one day belong to someone else. and your name will not be attached to it. There's a cost to living in the space between duty and exhaustion. The workload is not only is not the only weight. The heavier piece is knowing
that no matter how carefully you plan, there will be noise, misinformation, anger, shifting priorities, and the chase for credit that turns serious work into a spectacle. People who last uh in what we do do not endure because they
stop caring. They endure because they learn that noise is not a measure of worth. The job is not to win every argument. The job is to keep the system honest. Let process outlast opinion and let truth outlast the narrative of the week. What we do is not about
controlling outcomes. It's about creating conditions where good outcomes remain possible. Management arranges what exists. Leadership shapes what might endure. The difference looks small on paper and enormous in practice. The
world may not remember the names of most of us. Functioning communities are the proof that someone cared enough to do the work well. Not perfectly, faithfully. The record shows up in small reductions of risk, in tighter handoffs
across departments, in fewer surprises, faster recoveries, and people who notice problems sooner and solve them closer to the source. We're what we're all we got. We got work to do. We got work to do for
the people. It's not about us. It's about them. Um, I, you know, George said, you know, it it was a tough day. I think that, you know, it was a little different, but I don't
think anyone walks away angry. Uh, we all know we got something to do. We got to be focused and we got to get it done. Let's stop playing and let's start working. Ajourned.