Okay, thank you all for coming to our environmental commission meeting. Um, just going to call this meeting to order. This is a regular meeting of the environment commission of the bureau of fair haven. In accordance with the provisions of the open public meetings
act, public meetings may be held in person or by means of communication equipment to include streaming services and other online meeting platforms. This meeting is being held in person and through Zoom meeting platform being broadcast from Burough Hall 748 meeting uh River Road, Bare Haven, New Jersey.
Public participation for this meeting on November 12th, 2025 is available by call and phone number or through Zoom. Members of the public will be on mute until it's time for questions comments which will be announced at that time. The public has the opportunity to
question comment by phone or through Zoom by the raise hand button and will be called on at the appropriate time. Notice of the meeting was sent to the Asbury Park Press, the Two River Times, and the Star Ledger on January 31st, 2025, posted on the Burough website, the bulletin board of the municipal
building, and has remained continuously lifted as required under the statute. With adequate notice having been given, the Environmental Commission secretary is directed to include the statement in the minutes of the meeting. Please stand for the pledge of >> allegiance
to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all. Is it Kelly Flanigan uh present? Anna Antonin
>> present. >> William Dorner >> present. >> Susan Globus >> present. >> Jesse Murray absent. John Pelanetti >> present. >> Gary Patterson >> present. >> John Peters >> present. >> Also present. Burough secretary Christy
Larson. You have a quorum. Great. Thank you Christy. Um did you everyone get a chance to see the minutes for them from our last meeting September 10th? Can I get a motion to approve the minutes?
Yeah, I Okay, minutes are approved. Um, we'll begin with new business and that includes Marter Park. Um, we are very fortunate to have two members of the public that have um expressed some
concerns with the um the management plan of of Larter Park. And I would like to welcome Sam Lee right there and her husband Gavin to come and um express their concerns.
We're trying to work on getting the video that they had sent to us earlier in September up so everybody can see um the extent of the concerns with Marter >> Park. And as you guys know, I think, you know, we've always talked about the bee
spraying, the ground bees in Winter Park. This is that area. They're directly across from it, right on Fair Haven Road. And um >> I believe it's this is all related, right? And so having a better management plan like holistic plan can perhaps help
alleviate both these concerns, the spraying for the bees and also just the uh the care of those trees and this park area as well. >> Everything would have been set by the October expire October.
>> Really? Yeah, she said expired October 29th. >> So difficulty and um well I can >> apologies while I start. I have a brain injury that has affected my speech.
into the dry summer yet. >> Okay. So um mowing takes place often within 7 days but it's at least every seven days. Um it's using the big mowing machine.
Um the mowing is pretty much uniform across the whole area of the park. I can't talk to the back but that's kind of like the Mojave Desert back there. So, I wouldn't thought they're mowing there, but the
rest of the space is all being mowed the same way. Um, mowing takes place right up against trees, over tree roots. Um, mowing is fairly wood ching. You can go over there after the mowing has taken
place and you can see where the machine has turned so it digs up the soil. Um, that's pretty visible to the eye. Um, trees are used as boomerangs. Uh, by which I mean that a tree will have
repeated pass rounds under it back and forth, back and forth, back and forth. So, not only is a tree often moan right up against, but it will have that repeatedly. um law the grass is moan in extreme heat
but I can't imagine there's been much more growth and you've kind of seen the places where it's very dusty um the area I would say from the front of the wall where you go into the park
down that little strip where there's some new trees all the way under the holl around the eress into the park as you come from little silver in a sense that little eras there um where the bee issue
is is all pretty much churned up and remodeed and remodeed and remodeed. um areas around up against uh Rowan's home there. Uh it's pretty much mowed even though there's nothing to mow
>> and that's kind of what's being done. Um it's causing you can see the dust. Um that's pretty much wheaty. Um it's causing a lot of soil erosion. It's creating habitat for the bees that then
need to be sprayed. Um it's not a way uh I think to treat what is a park that is actually really prominent in the lives most fair haven nights. If you have kids you know where
Macarter Park is a lot of really key events in people's lives taking take place in and around Carter Park. Postcoid, the park has seen a real surge of of residents use. People want to use the
park. They're teaching their kids to cycle in the park. They're walking their dogs, doing their healthy exercise in the park. Um, it's actually really lovely. We now have the farmers market in the park. However, care at the park
is pretty much what you see on that video. And uh it's very sad and I don't think it's fiscally responsible. I don't think it's ecologically responsible and it's a waste of what could be a really amazing
resource for the town. I think if it was had a vision many years ago, John may remember I was on Shay Tree for about 10 years. Um, and
back then the part was really struggling and that's now a good 20 years ago and it's never really seemed to have a vision apart from obviously it's the school playing field and that's important but the whole of that area
around it has never really as I said had some sort of sense of what's its purpose as a passive park um what it could be I guess in a sense that's where we are and I think I
personally feel we're kind of at a tipping point by which I mean the more degradation of the park the harder it is to bring it back more energy that has to be used to bring it back the more money
that has to be used to bring it back um the more volunteering that will be have to be done to bring it back right every every month every year that this goes on. Uh, and I think that's a terrific shame because it's a gray space and so I
um we felt that we wanted to bring it to your attention cuz it doesn't seem to be on the radar of the people who are actually doing the work. Um, and also we feel we're happy to bring whatever
knowledge we have about native gardening, native plants, and also how to garden in a space that's basically right for visit park. And we started out with basically the same soil. And we have a garden
we're very proud of. U pretty much the same soil and the same sun conditions. Thank you. I from all of us it's thank you for bringing that to our attention too. It's oftenimes hard for us to keep
track who are right directly across from it. So of course you get that firsthand um witness of that. Um but it is related to what we've discussed here again that uh with the ground bees and that um and
the spray and I believe it's all connected the management of that park um maybe per and not every piece of that park has to be treated the same way. >> It's it's not all used for that. that area closer to where you are, closer to Fair Haven Road could be something or
should maybe maybe should be um less mowing. Um doing the no mo, you know, doesn't have to have the same type of structure or management than the playing field where the kids are. >> The maintenance system, correct?
>> Yep. >> Yeah. sounds like >> um because the zeroturn mowing against the trees like she was saying the boomerang needs obviously to minimize the amount of weed >> whacking >> but you know a a great question would be if
it could be airrated and seated yearly because that would help the grass be thicker then talk about a maintenance plan so that you know they don't go right up against that and get rid of that dusty the dust is what's you know that dusty layer is what's causing the
bees want to settle there. assuming um >> there there is a I mean just yeah there's a lot um and I don't know if anyone else has done some research and for the ground bees I wanted to add to what Sam said is that um >> uh our yard used to be grass when we
bought the house it was all grass none of that was there >> and through trial and a lot of error uh we gradually over the last 30 years breeded that space and in the last 10 years that's evolved to being almost
100% native. Um so we'd be very happy to lend what expertise we've been able to build up in trying to create say if we have the same soil um with plants that work if you want to take some of that and actually plant it in a way that is
going to be very low maintenance. People look at our yard and say it must be a lovely world. The reality is it's not. It gets cut down in March and other than that it mostly does its own thing. We too call out things that get a bit too aggressive like the golden rod you have
to keep in its place but other than that there's the thing that causes the most maintenance is the bit of grass we have in our front yard. >> Yeah. >> Um so we'd be you know if the town were open to trying to think about how to landscape some of that. We'd be happy to
do what we can to assist you with what expertise we've built up. um especially also with the deer pressure that we have which are there also in the park. So you have to choose carefully of things that will do well require minimum maintenance and and won't be chewed to pieces by the
deer. I think ecologically it's probably regarded as a woodland or what's called woodland edge but it's not being kept like woodland or woodland edge >> and one way to think about that might be
to introduce some more plants big plants >> like big big native shrubs that would and I'm not suggesting the whole thing the the aim would not be to create a second natural area, but to
strategically introduce trees that bushes that kind of do the thing that the trees need, which is >> more materials coming down, falling on the falling on the >> You're going to have to help me because my speaker is going to go falling on the soil, breaking down into the soil,
replenishing the soil. >> Then you'll get rid of the bees. If you look up how to retract the bees. >> Yes, >> the bee. We're actually doing everything to retract the bees by having >> and not mulching and not keeping the soil moist. >> Correct. >> I mean, I guess I would want to hear
from public works and talk to them about their maintenance procedures. The other problem is, and I'll be honest with you, unless the school board has changed its ways. They didn't send us any money. >> That always was a stick in my crawl because they used it extensively for a playground and I think it gets loved to
death. That's the problem. >> I think there's a part that's the kids do not use the playground. >> Well, I don't know. We don't know. But they know the bathroom. >> Well, it's close to the road. They don't >> This is the back. >> Right by the Marter Gate. >> Yeah. West.
>> Yeah. >> Right by Marter Gate. That along Fair Haven Road. >> That's Bicycle Park, too. >> But it's not they >> used to be and the children were allowed to pretty much run all over the park. That has not been the case certainly postco
they're very much kept >> kind of correct you know kept under supervision in that very key area and that's fine >> that's that's just fine but I do I do have to concur with John that it is it
is >> a financial reality that the school has the advantage of the park which would have a No, it's again it's just a question of it's being loved to death to some degree and you got to talk about how you manage
a high use area. >> I think that there's a difference between the high use upper area where the kids go after school. This area has more of a natural feel to it. Um it's it's under love to be honest with you. Like
none of the kids really run around there. >> I don't know. Maybe I mean part of it is these are pretty mature oaks there, right? You're talking about the southern southern >> you have holl. No, this is like the >> holl are pretty brutal, too, to the ground. I mean, they're they do their thing, but being an evergreen, they have >> Yeah, they have a very heavy dense
canopy. >> But I I think talking to DPW, because just if you've noticed in the past week, um there's a whole mulch of leaves right around the base of eight eight trees that were strategically put there. >> Okay. >> By must be DBW, I see.
>> Holly trees. DBW cuz that is at least a step in the right >> indicated that it's more than >> DPW did see these videos. We did share them with Chris York and he passed them on to Nick Pensky and DPW did see these. Um I do think that they would be open to this. It would be
>> easier for them. >> Yeah, sure. >> Um I do I don't see why not. It's just a small, you know, area that we can try with perhaps. I don't know uh what we'd be allowed to plant or if we'd alter that, but I do think some more native
shrubberies like adding into that, especially around some of the base of those trees would help prevent some of the kids riding their bikes. Now, I know some of the kids ride their bikes very close to those things. I mean, we don't even have to get that creative. We had an incredible service berry native
service berry house right there >> which serves >> I think an uphill battle that you're going to have to that the group is is you're fighting bees with bees they're actively trying to kill the bees there and if the thought of bringing more bees
in their in the mind is like well we're bringing pollinators which would attract bees that might be something that we'd have to educate a little more deeply because they're spraying Yeah, they're spraying for unfortunately trying to kill bees there. I'm all for pollinators. I think that that's going
to be something that we're going to have to get really like clear on that these aren't, you know, they're just coming to pollinate. They're not going to, you know, >> I mean, you have oaks in there and how many how many wildlife I mean there
there's over 500 species that oaks support. Yeah. So, I mean, the bees are there, right? >> Right. in there's an alternative ground cover something short and so they don't have to mow it and it doesn't get
too long and you can put that under and around trees and >> I mean so there's you can plant plants like still we got a lot of that in your yard it grows under pine trees >> so it grows in the the worst conditions in our yard
>> and the deer don't eat it too much >> um there are other types of bigast that we have It's a real th but it it copes with those sorts of conditions. Um you could use grass. It's so like little blue stem. It's not a very tall grass.
Um and in the area where the bees are, you could probably buy $500 worth of fl plants and plant it up in that area. might have irrigated the first here and then those plants are incredibly drought tolerant and you either just leave them
or you could weed whack them in March and just that's it. Um, so it's about trying to put the right arm in the right place um to help you sort of manage it. But there are some very tough conditions like you mentioned underneath the holly is
>> about as worse as you just forget. I don't know anything that grows up. And again, if you have a solution on that, I my wife would love to know because you have, you know, when you have a big tree, >> they have a massive root system and they're and they're, you know, trying to get all the water they can get their hands on and it's hard, especially when there's no light, minimal
>> wood chips. Like if you let the leaves break down for the winter, they just put wood chips in and put a big circle around each of these trees and they wouldn't have to get close to them. And right which we just break down and make the soil >> holly leaves will take decades. I they
they seem to last forever. >> The what? >> Holly leaves are like indestructible. Then >> staff do do we know what the status is of the playground? The J law playground. >> Um
so if that I don't know if it's still happening. Um, I think it's great that the bureau is willing to in I mean it's it's a substantial amount. I mean, it's a good grant, but it's a substantial amount of money that the bureau will be investing
um I think maybe with the schools in the park. So, maybe I don't know if that's happening soon, but maybe this could be like a larger overhaul, right? like putting in the new playground, putting in new landscaping, like kind of tie it
all in together so it seems less uh so it kind of blends more, you know, and and seems like a larger collaborative project between the schools and the burrow. I know that that historically that park has always been kind of it's been tricky because the
school uses it but the burough owns it but maybe this would be an opportunity for like a big collaborative kind of effort to overhaul the park, >> right? >> Um too, right? >> Yeah.
>> Okay, we can find out about that. Um and also >> I know about that. >> You know about that? Great. The plan is that uh once school gets out in June, they will start with the new equipment for the and have it complete before
school does again. >> So they so the grant is going through I don't know if there were any issues and are they taking are they do they have to remove any vegetation or trees or anything to put the equipment in or >> No, but there's going to be additional fencing and maybe some greenery along
where the new equipment is going. >> Right. I know that they had talked about using that as that enclosure using greenery instead. So, that would be a great thing to make sure that it's native and easy to >> um manage.
>> We can only have native plants in that. >> Yeah. >> And and that doesn't have to be a crunchy granola choice, >> right? in that there are plenty of well-
tested cultivars somewhere now like Mount Cuba has now great information on you know three or four year tested cultivars which is in other words selections of natives that will have characteristics that make it good for
different places. So, you know, there are resources out there. So, in other words, it doesn't have to be presented to people in as a way that this isn't going to be understandable for them.
>> There can be plenty of aesthetic enjoyment in the park. That's more my thing than maybe Gabbits. Um, and there can be what I call cues for care, which is people don't have to feel
because it's natives, it's not cared for. And so there's, you know, there is, I think, a way to have a selection of natives that can still be really really attractive people and they'll they'll enjoy them
and they'll understand them. >> And the school just recently redid their front yard too. >> Yeah. last job. >> Joe, one other thing on main hills that we surprise people is that we hardly ever irrigate our yard. There's no
irrigation system. It's only if we've had incredibly hot temperatures for an extended period of time do we ever water our yard. >> And that's because we pick the plants and we learn from which plants can hack it. And because I I can't be bothered to
look after something that is going to need a lot of care. So they became self- selecting. There's some things that could cope with that sort of condition. Um so that's so so that's a sort of it doesn't have to be a lot of work if you're savvy about what you pick.
>> Sure. >> Great. Well um I think perhap right uh try to get a meeting with TPW. We'd love to talk to you guys and have you be, you know, involved or or if there hopefully we can get some types of if we have
permission to maybe we can come up with some suggestions >> um and and some things that might help um that area and see what the burrow um would be open to. >> Can I just say I don't think the staff can be enjoying working like that. No,
>> in the height of it, the guys are fully masked with a ventilator >> running around. I can't imagine that >> the loving >> having to do what they're doing. >> Can you when you meet with them get push for a more like we need a bigger view of
what these maintenance plans look like. This isn't a baseball diamond. So that shouldn't be applied that it shouldn't be a oneizefits-all. If we could get really I mean there are like 15 open spaces compared even for the whole >> every open space has should have its own
maintenance plan. Maybe we start to push them for that information so that we can help get ahead of things like this. >> Maybe we can have um Nick come to one of >> Yeah. and just outline it. Pull up Marter Pond. This is what we're doing. Pull up Marter Park. This is what we're doing. And then we can say like here's a
group of people who have a who are really and Caroline and everyone. I mean this whole group like they would be a good point of reference for how to maintain each open space as we continue to accumulate them as well. >> Yes. >> Let's get ahead of this,
>> right? >> Almost like a best practices too, right? Like a guideline um >> of what we want to do. Yeah. >> Yeah. Like on the mowing it like are they empowered to say like do we don't need to mow, >> right? >> Yeah. Right. Like who can make that
decision? It doesn't have to happen. have to do it every Wednesday. >> It's such a timesaver for them. Yeah. >> But they're, you know, put it towards the the middle of grading fields that actually does need that. >> Right. Okay. That could be something we
could um I think that really beneficial as we're come up with some kind of general overarching principles or values that we might have >> that and then get I think we should pretty I think we should get pretty granular. I mean I think you can I think we can advise them on what the best
practices are as a commission say like this is not working for this this could work for here but you can't apply it to the same it can't be cross >> right where like every park doesn't need the same >> exactly >> to that degree like soccer fields compared to a passive park that you walk
through >> the other thing that if people aren't familiar with is this very heavily eroded area is in the water system straight into fourth creek. >> Yes, we will. >> So that water and all the dust is
running also straight off into the two slooes and then into fourth creek >> which is then another >> and the and the bee killers are going into there. >> Yeah. So that's another piece of the puzzle in that you're putting that soil into fourth creek which already has its own issues.
>> Yes. And that's on our agenda today. So um Okay. Well, thank you very much for for coming today. >> Thank you for listening. I >> appreciate it. >> Took me several years to finally say to someone, I don't think this is okay.
>> No, that's good. I wish more would. Yes. Um it's good to hear every everyone else's. We all have a voice and we all care deeply about our open spaces. So, it's really important to hear that. Thank you for sharing. Um okay, so we're going to move on to current business.
um sustainable jersey application update. Um as you guys know, we were awarded silver certification. U few of members of the green team in the EC will be attending the sustainable jersey lunchon to receive the award next Tuesday down in Atlantic City. We were
also awarded Fair Haven was awarded the collaboration award for 2024. um highlighting the work from the esttoary team that um also incorporated the creative team, the historic association of fair haven, the fair
haven business association, the green team, the between the walk and the art show at bysentennial hall and the walk downtown um sustainable Jersey thought this was an excellent example how collaborating in a community and
highlighting the the uh cultural and history of Fair Haven and many of the businesses of Fair Haven as well. So that will be awarded um next week and we just want to applaud the the esttoary efforts and the historic assoc all the people here that wear so many different
hats, the business association, you're all in here as well. So this is everybody that that particular >> can just Yeah. Thank you to you guys for that. I know it's a ton of work and I know you guys work very hard. So really kudos to everybody. That was really impressive.
>> Thank you. Um definitely a team effort and glad we got in by the deadline right to the finish like midnight and we got it in and it just paid dividends. So that's great. We have three three years to before the next one. Oh, and I have to say thank you to
Christy Larson because she was critical all the tree commission and the environmental commission getting all those actions in. So, thank you Christie. We could have done it without you. Um, okay. So, moving on to Fourth Creek and Navas River update. As you
guys know from the last meeting, um there were some alarming numbers coming out of Fourth Creek and the uh pro putting the uh area between Baton Road and um
where Fourth Creek empties into the NSync River was on suspended for shell fishing on probation there because of the numbers that we're learning. We've had the DP um test again, Fourth Creek on River
Road, the mouth of Fourth Creek, River Road, Shrewsbury Yacht Club. Um and also Shersbury River Yach Club as well. These four locations almost consecutively every every week. Um numbers are improving which is great. Um but they're
still they're still not they're they are improving. They're getting down. Levels have really improved. But this is something that's got to be ongoing and it's really important I believe for residents for the EC to understand what this means, right? And what these values
are and what the health of the river is. And I think there's a disconnect between people who um are working at this level and everyday residents as as well. Um I spoke with Chris York, our burough administrator. I was asking if there's
possibility of having QR codes down at every access point where these water um areas are where people go to use the water that can link to actual real life data to find out what the health of the river is. Um he's open to that for sure.
He also said we can get it out in newsletters or the focus to educate people about our water health and our and our river health not just in St. river but also for the creek which is behind you know in our residential areas as well. Um Robin, do you have um do you
want to give a a update from the map? just you know Sworn and I were talking this morning because we go out on Wednesday mornings and we and um we you know do the monitoring and I think that what SW uh you know what DOA is really
desiring there's a lot of um focus on fair haven the nav because of the way the watershed deposits so we get a lot of what's going on and it might have to with upstream.
But um the coordination between the burrow testing where the burrow um whatever concerns that you have and you're trying to the the council is trying to you know um figure out or
remedy to its residents that coordination would really needs to happen with COA. >> Your numbers need to Yeah. that that was a disconnect. But I also think that um
uh what we noticed this morning um was that there's a stench at the pond in the Fair Haven Natural Area >> a stench. Yeah. >> You know, like at that drain.
>> And so that was an area that was tested that used to be uh early on they started to test there. and we're sworn is considering retesting that. So I don't know it's been a sensitive area. Um also
the on the regular there is testing now um we monitor right in front of um 917 that is not being taken away. We will continue to monitor there. >> We run into people all the time because we we work with vests in the morning and
people are very curious. So your idea about you know getting out to the public they're always wondering how is the water quality and when you you know when um you know clean ocean action reports the data that doesn't come down to lay
terms people don't understand. So I think it would be helpful if we did get um you know word out how how can people find out about the the health of the >> you you almost think of it like a fire danger right you have the different
colors it's like what is the health of the river >> green yellow orange red >> purple there was a huge slick right across from the yacht club we take a sample right across the river there was a huge slick which is the drain from the
road. >> Yeah, that's the >> And if I see that, I just think vegetation would help to clean that up. >> We, you know, um I see, you know, but again, um the monitoring is just an
advisement. So, it really does fall on the burrow and how you might, you know, take measures to ch to remedy, >> right? And so, I mean, Chris was very open. I said, you know, I'd love to get more people to know about it, you know,
to educate folks about what the health of the river is. They might just go out there and not even it won't even, you know, they don't understand and also where it's coming from. So, that could be something you said it would be helpful to, you know, he be supportive and making signs with QR codes that can
take you right to live data, the weekly reports up there. But the question would be of whether you know what data is on there right I know there's clean ocean action is collecting some data and then the D is collecting other data right and so having that
>> that work together collaborate and then also right having like a level indicator we're at you know it's like the air quality right we're in a a yellow right now or we're in a green we're good >> um and we can even do it for Fourth Creek as well right
>> because you know people don't realize Yeah, I mean the questions it just continued to mount. >> Um you know the idea when we had our meeting uh um couple weeks ago um the idea that it's oh well you know from
June till September the r the levels rise the people you know numbers rise so high that you know it's just the summer. Well, really, should we just have all the kids in the river and we we know that these numbers are rising? I don't
know. I think we can do better than that. >> Agree. >> And the other thing that Clean Ocean ash brings to the table, Swarma, is that um what I learned at that meeting is that the D really focuses on those the the
ecoli members, right? The the state for shellfish harvesting. Yes. Whereas Clean Ocean action also looks at the edracus levels and that's where is it really safe for humans to be in the water and you know the the burrow cannot make that determination because they're not
guarded beaches so they can't tell us whether it's safe or not but if you're taking the numbers from clean ocean action that has the edge for caucus in it then that will you know once the public understands what those numbers are indicating it gives them a much better picture of you know do I want
myself or my kids in the water right now versus is it safe for shale fish, right? >> Yeah, >> agree. >> We talked about signage at that meeting. >> That's something that he might want to consider. >> I agree. >> Yeah. Can we help? I mean, can we work
on that? He was just saying he could aggregate the data into a single >> what the data what the data is and where where what the data is that you want and where it comes from. I can aggregate it into into a page myself >> that can convert into a want live
updates though you can do that >> so that it turns live and it's just one one mirror >> okay so then we can put like if it's between this range it turns the color right or this range okay >> we can even put the key on the bottom and the data
>> perfect is is riots a part of this conversation I mean I'm just wondering they have these camps is it something that should be right and I think that should be every organization, yach club, river rats, all the things that you know people,
residents that on every access point, the boat ramp, the river like this is >> those the level and I think this should be important for >> right I mean like people parents to know too if my my kid I had a friend who was
doing rivers this year and was like my kids had bowel issues for a very long time you know upset stomach Um the numbers were skyrocketed this this summer in some areas and you know you don't know if that's related. It could be but those kids are tipping over
in those boats all the time. You know they're swimming in that river. Um so I think it's just and then that awareness creates change creates people acting upon it and understanding that everybody plays a part. >> Yeah. you know,
>> um that we can do better and it's not just and the fish are dead and the fish kills and that smells and you see it. If you know when you don't see it, it's not always 100%. >> So, um Robin, that might be great to like connect with >> the Clean Ocean Action crew and that.
And then John, if you want to take that on literally all I need to know is >> what it is you want, where to get it from, and that's an easy >> great >> just create a dashboard. let you work with it and you can get the D numbers too, Robin. >> Yes.
>> Okay. Yeah, perfect. >> That would be awesome. >> Then we can, you know, really like push that out. >> I mean, I text your residents. Yeah. And Jesse when I need to know if my kids can walk around, right? >> Like we live right there when they want to walk on them. >> But imagine if you could just be like,
"Let me go to see what the level is today before >> because then it could be something that we could, like you said, educate the whole community." And my kid says he wants to go play by the river. I go, "Hold on a second." Okay, good. >> I mean, that's anyone who has a slip in their backyard should want to look at it. Anyone who lives close to the river
should want to look at it. >> Right. >> And and then River rides can say, "Yeah, today's the day that I think we sail." >> You know, >> it's also that piece that, oh, there's a big rainstorm coming and maybe I should pick up the dog poop in my yard >> because I live near the creek. So, the
You know what I'm saying? Like there's all different pieces of an educational piece that >> you can start pushing out there as well. >> Sure. >> You don't want to move the needle because they'll be able to see >> No, but that would be great. That would be really helpful. I question about the
the stench of the pond and the natural area >> like do things like this get reported to the natural area committee. We know there's a sewer pipe under the financial area and there has been times that we've had to reach out Yeah. the sewer authority because people smelled
>> and o um is happening now. >> I don't know. Now who noticed the stair? >> No, I did. >> You did a tour and I I led some people here. >> Did you call the burrow? >> I reporter had sworn this morning. Okay. >> And she said that that used to be a site
where they monitored it >> so that she would check it out. But follow up on that. >> If you if you reach out to Chris York, you might be able to reach out to Brian Bill because he's tested that a couple times. >> Okay. >> Um and Brian Richmond, you know, maybe
they both can just be notified of that. Yeah. >> That there is >> if there is an odor like the borrow should notify the sewer authority. >> Yeah. Tom's member of the board of sewer authority. Absolutely. reach out to them and >> um they should respond and again that's one of the advantages of being a member.
Great. >> They also provide that. >> Perfect. Great. >> Can I just ask is that the sewer line that runs under fourth creek to the pumping station? I believe so. >> Four. >> Now when the numbers up this summer,
they had tested the natural area, Marter, Hendrickson, Knights of Columbus, Fourth Creek, all the Fourth Creek. And they there was an issue uh in that area. It was higher numbers
um and they were trying to wean it out. So they've been they've been testing all these recently, but I think they would be nice to know. Obviously, they'd love to know that. >> Oh, there's enough. >> Okay. >> I mean, there is a sewer in the wetland at the back of our property and our
neighbors property. Kind of amazed because we had to work over the sewer line. The feeder lines were from our house. >> So, I have the sewer map and yeah, there's a sewer that goes right underneath >> Yes. >> B Creek and by the side of Fourth Creek.
>> Right. Correct. And I guess you go and there's also a hell of a lot of deer in the back. >> Lot of deer. Yes. Um so I don't know what has happened because they checked all that. They they checked the sewer lines too to make sure there were no leaks, but numbers have gone down um in
Ford Creek. It was at on October 22nd it was up to 7,800. Um and last this week um November 5th it was down to 290. So, I'm not >> What's considered?
>> I don't >> I have those numbers. Um, it was it's still not great. >> Um, but going down is going to put
>> I don't sleep. >> No. Now, >> again, there's a whole different level between shellfish and swimming. Yes. And we're pl I believe we're plenty usually plenty good. Again, you got to remember you have per example they pump straw sewage into the bay every time it rains
in Jersey City. And I can give you a list of all. But the reality is if it's a rain event, it can cause an uptick. But it's still below as far as I know it's swimmable. It's just not shellfishable, >> right? >> And that's a big it's a it's a very very brutal metric they use for shellfish to
try and be as careful as possible. >> Yeah. You want to be below 200. >> Um, >> personally, >> no, for the shellfish, >> right? >> Um, oh, actually, no. For shellfish, you don't want anything above 100. I'm sorry. Right. >> So, shellfish, it's restricted from 31
to 163. Over 163 is prohibited. So, now we are at 290, but we want to um but then again, remember shellfish is because a lot of it is eating raw. >> Yeah. You know, right? So, it's not. >> No, but what about swimming? They have swimming numbers. >> Um, what is the swimming number? for the
fire >> enter caucus >> or the the feal for do you know what the swimming numbers are >> I don't know but in a in August the nights at Columbus was at 15,000 so 298
>> uh for river and fourth creek isn't that you know we're in that direction >> were they able to determine why it was so >> no >> well again it was we had one in red bank where they punched through They punched through a sewer mane I
think and dump we're dumping it into the >> into the storm water. And so you know these things happen if somebody does that and then you get an eye pick. It could be someone leaking. >> It could or it could be you know dogs or deer or a den of foxes. It could be any of that stuff as well. Um
so I think that would be great as just um Robin if you'll make sure you let B know about that sewage. you can talk with John and work on that. I think that >> I'm here. >> Okay, perfect. Um, okay. Any other questions on the uh fourth grade nink
river? We are going to move ahead with the living shoreline grant. Try to take this quick. um living grant. Um this there's a grant by the the uh given
out for the state of New Jersey, New Jersey Department of Environmental Protection for um including wet like blue um projects for climate like and um carbon sequestration. So
it's in living shorelines. We are trying to apply for this for 21 Fair Haven Road and Normandy. Um Chris, Nick and Rich have been speaking with we we had a meeting with ALS now they has started speaking with Stevens Institute who also
helped us with our Normandy project. >> Um the Stevens is trying to come out for a site visit um in the next week or two. We're waiting to hear from them. We're hoping to have them give an a concept
plan that would be used for both uh for 21 Fair Haven Road and to update the plan for Normandy as well. Um and then see if ALS can then help us write the grant. Um and then there's another Green
Acres funding grant that's uh coming up in February too that we might be applying for as well that that Chris Burke wants to apply for. But the good thing is that Stevens, who's very versed in this and has worked with us before on our waterfront projects, um is hoping to come out uh for a site visit and come up
with a concept plan. >> Is 21 Fairy even Road? >> It is not. And right now it's a bulkhead. It is and it might not even be a good site for a a living shoreline. It might need to be a constructed living
tour line or a different type or a partial >> like Victory Park. >> Um, is that that's not even a living shoring. That's just beach to >> That's beach. Yeah. I'm not sure, but it would um they only looked at it from satellite and where it is because of its
proximity to the yacht works. >> Okay. >> Um, and because it dredge right there too, it there's a lot of different complications with it. Um, so it I I don't it will not be most likely not be a complete living tour line. It might just be a partial or some kind of
constructed tour line. Um, but everybody on 21 wants to keep it passive. They love the they want to incorporate living tour in any, you know, potential that's possible. So that's a good step, too.
Um, and then of course trying to up re um update our plans on duty. Mhm. Um, so I think it is a good step in the right direction getting them back on board. So we'll keep you posted on that. Um, and
Jesse's been at those meetings and she's been very helpful um, with all her time off too that she's had. >> Hopefully it's closed tonight, right? Right. I know. >> Yeah, you too. All your time.
>> Um, okay. Any other questions about living grant? >> Um I'm sure they know this but there's also the crant consortium because they worked on the original plan as well grant they might have they're up in I think they're upstating
they might be able to help out help out with that. Okay. Thanks. Okay. Um All right. So moving on to the education series. This is a collaboration that we are hoping to have with the green team. um and she dpw
um other different entities as well. We want to create three different um workshops or events where residents can come and learn about um different important topics pertaining to our town and to the environment. We've um
reached out to Ruckers um in terms we wanted to do the first one with storm water. We've reached out to two uh Chrisa and Holly Demorro from Ruckers. We're still waiting to hear their availability on dates. They're very busy at the moment. We also um thanks to Bonnie, she put me in touch
with a Marapore watershed ambassador um a a gentleman from that graduate from RFH that's now a local um he's our watershed ambassador for Watershed 12, which is our wershed. and he's um pulled
he's he's here to be a resource for any environmental groups put on workshops, presentations, help install rain gardens, be part of planting. So we reached out I reached out to him this morning hope to hear from him as well.
Um the idea is we are trying to um work also with DPW the new storm water ordinance and regulations educate people about the watershed right all about Fourth Creek and the Navis River and what's going on and how they can how you can help. Um if you notice too from the
last big water storm um was it last week I could not pick up I could not go down Third Street to pick up my kids from school. had to go around because Third Street was flooded by the Columbus Club. Um the awareness of keeping storm drains
clear and free of leaf litter, debris, everybody can play their part. Um I think I must have just with my foot raed like seven um storm drains clear that afternoon. Um but just, you know, maybe
creating this awareness and even maybe just adopt a storm drain, right? did some different programs like this. >> We scoped um North Creek for the Mart on Outfall. Have we scoped it? >> Yes, >> it's clear.
>> Uh >> recently get the sewer guard to come over and do it. >> Yeah, but this was at the bottom. There were literally uh there were two DPW workers working to just clear the storm drains on the bottom of Third Street. >> No, I understand. I'm just saying for
the McQuari pond has been an issue and again volume you might want to have the scope take a look at it see what we got >> wasn't it it was scoped or something >> was it scoped >> the past year >> it's okay >> or two I thought it was >> it has like the the in the super target
I watched it other towns and as soon as I saw them doing it other towns I'm like hey >> get over here let's get over here >> um >> stuff I'm happy to ask >> but you know so that that it's just and that was even very rare. There were people that were clear trying to clear away the leaf litter. It's just it's
tricky this time of year when you had all the leaves and the debris. >> So I was on a panel on um national emergencies down in Washington at National Academy of Sciences and I had actually the other panel member was from Vermont and what the problem is the intensity of the storms has been going up in terms of total rainfall. So they
might have had a six foot, you know, uh you know um bridge underpass or whatever. Now being an eight and a 10 foot up there in Vermont because they hit these massive events and you know they had a huge problem and it was what was it? It was barren flooded massively. So you know the culverts are just not up to the task and maybe we have to take a
look at that. >> Yeah. >> The event is quick and it's a lot of you have trouble. >> What are they doing? Do they offer any >> Well, it's interesting because you know for them I mean it's interesting they have a minimum number of crossroads across Vermont and really what they should be thinking about this is my opinion because you're investing capital
right? You don't want to just harden the assets that you have. Improve the culverts in the areas that are that are weak. But you also may want to talk about having alternative routing because if you if you have a single corridor that's like that like loop 100 across like everything, >> it's really problematic because it's
hard to make it absolutely hard. >> But it's never going to fail and if it does fail and you have to have redundancy. >> So, you know, they're they're trying to figure out what to do next. But again, the events are becoming more intense and they're getting higher volumes than they used to. >> Sure. So maybe the same thing here. I
mean it might be of a much smaller scale, right? But maybe just maybe the um you know the culver is just not enough or the the the you know the outlets just not enough to handle the quick water as well. >> Yeah, that was quick. Um and a lot of
water is short. Um so we're hoping to also educate people about how to keep it on your solar flow, keep it on your property, what you can do about that as well. Um, and then another one I was talking with
Sarah Fischelle, who's our um, member of the climate citizen climate coalition, trying to get either in January or March um, about solar um, and solar energy um, and how residents and households can
save um, on energy and trying to get like a panel with somebody from Sebrite solar, somebody from community solar. So when then somebody from the utility company if you can't put solar or you're not optimal for that or you can't get
into a community solar next saying you is what are the options that the utility company provides for renewals and and energy or for rebates or incentives to do in your home. So just kind of I we were talking about how people might not know where to get started with that and
so this might be just a good way to be like okay I wanted to learn more and actually having um experts and uh from these in this industry there to ask questions and answer questions. I am no expert but I would love if we can
incorporate leaving the leaves >> for the fireflies. I think that that's a fun, easy way to encourage people to just not clean up when it's spring cleaning. >> Leave it for a little while longer. Just slip that in there right before that
happens. >> Um because it's it's like an immediate return on your investment. >> I know that there's three I've been looking at just a few of the group there. They can put something together offering up your time, but I think it would be fun especially at null. >> Yes. And I wonder, you know, and
obviously too with talk about education, like if there is tips from the from the DC green team, right? Like spring cleaning tips and fall winter. Like I know the garden club puts this out, but if you think about it in a different um
in a more of ecological and environment like you're helping protect all the this is the reason why, right? Um, and then it also goes back to the initial conversation about this maintenance plan that DPW rolls out. Like if we can align with public works on when they're
picking up leaves. We talked about this last year. If it could be just a little bit later so that we have the time. >> So those are kind of they're all tying together. Like we can't tell people to leave them and then they're there for so long that it becomes an issue. But if we can kind of right if we can start to
have the conversations now about adopted the leaf and brush schedule at the council meeting the other night so it was just last year. >> You must have missed that one. >> But this is where right I mean we've talked about this in the past right the leaf and brush and trying to get it all connected and correlated. And so if we
all were on a >> same vision. Yeah. >> Right. Same guiding principles like all over our like >> you know So I I almost wonder if that could also be a side panel or like side commit, you know, if people wanted to kind of work
and think about what are some of these critical calendar times that we want to, you know, to start those conversations earlier so they don't miss. Yes, Carol, >> I have a question. Does the burrow leave the leaves? Like I remember two years
ago Dragon Pest the Grassy null and watching the DPW leaf blow like on the grass >> where the signs are on river. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Well, they did just leave them at the border. They left a bunch of them. >> They did. And I love that.
>> And I remember asking when I saw them and Dave Carl saying, "Yeah, I'm trying to leave some." It's a balance because people get, you know, like why always leave there? But >> but they seemed like they get used to it. >> Yeah. seeing the leaves around the trees and that would be great.
>> Maybe we go put a sign. We can't put a sign. >> We should put like look what we're doing. These leaves are reading mulch and helping protect this tree right there. Right.
>> Have you been following the council meetings the past couple years? >> John I have not been to the council meeting in 5 years. Do yourself a favor in 15 years. Thank you. Thank you. I've been free from Guantanamo
following the council >> as I as I haven't chosen to follow the council meeting. Is it not possible to have an information board >> at the other entrance to Marta Park
which is that first entrance which a lot of people walk >> by similar to the nature trail. Yes, that explains what is going on. >> And it's less as thine >> as a information board.
>> Just like one of the literature, >> however you wish to provide either. >> Yeah. >> I mean one there's one at the natural area which is like a a place to provide information. If you had something with the similar aesthetic at that entrance,
>> you could then provide people with the information sign. >> Yeah. >> Right. >> That's a great idea. >> But there is something to like modeling the expected behavior, >> right? No, you're right. of modeling. But that's where I say if we've met with
the DPW and talked about this like management plan or maintenance plan that includes everything, not just the open spaces, but also the burough properties, right? And so afraid of people complaining about police because that's an opportunity to say, "No, we're doing that on purpose." >> And and I do believe Nick and um Dave,
they they're get it. They understand. Um you know, it's just a matter of getting the burrow, you know, the rest of it. >> Yeah. And it's pretty trivial. Like, sorry. No, that's not the general that's not the overarching >> like ethos that we're golfing for. >> So, you can complain all you want about
a few leaves, but that's not But I do think that they're amendable to it. I mean, we've been planting natives on the River Road Quarter and they're incredibly supportive of it. So I think there some financial savings financing
and then the last education series we're thinking so we can make that you know uh we're also going to do something with invasives so maybe we'll reach out with natural area as well and kind of collabor and shade tree and collaborate on that. Um we'll move on to administrative items because I know we
have quite a bit to cover here. meeting dates um for 2026. We're going to stick with is it a uh let's vote on sticking with the Wednesday this um second Wednesday of each month. >> Okay.
>> Okay. There are some conflicts though that Christie came to mind brought to our my attention. There is um what was it Christie? Wednesday, February 11th. >> Yes. Council's moving to that date
because of the um the school February break Monday, Tuesday. So they took the Wednesday, so we can move to the third Wednesday. >> So we'll move to Wednesday, February 18th. Is that okay? Hold on. My name's >> the third Wednesday. >> My number is not on Wednesday.
>> There was a February, >> but she kept them off Wednesdays. So >> I don't know. Okay. I don't even know where it went. Do you have that um do you have that? Can you put that calendar right up on the screen so that everyone can see that?
>> Oh, sure. >> There were three dates. It was in February, April, and November to move to the third Wednesday. And then again, we'd have our August recess will not happen. So, that is what we're planning to
do. So, if if everyone can see that um and if we're in agreement, we vote on that. Is that right, Chrissy? >> Or all in favor for the 2026 EC meeting dates? >> So,
okay. >> All right. We're good. That works. Thank you, Christine. >> We're still going to do 7:30. Does that work for everyone? 7:30. Yep. 7:30 third or second Wednesday except for those three months.
Okay. Um 2025 EC budget review. We still have with everything that was taken out um we still have substantial amount of money in our budget. Um
it with our expenses this year were our environmental dues to Anjac um and etc. Love where we live day signs and documents and banners and the sustainable Jersey lunchon registrations. With all those expenses, we still have
about 3,500 currently in our total. Um, we are hoping to get the ERRI a couple hard copies bound for the library of town as well as the school libraries. Um, I would like to get your approval to
spend um I don't we don't know exactly what that price will be now, but we need to approve our expenditures for the remainder of this year because it needs to be um we need to submit that to Nancy before our next December meeting. So, I
would like to make a motion to um approve spending say no more than $400. I can't imagine >> I put $800 and up to 10 copies and you decided it because you might find like I
would think you should have one for council. It would be useful for them to have >> this the old school libraries that's two RFH that's three. >> Okay. and a couple floating around and you might find that the cost of doing a few extra is not it's not linear I think. I mean it's gonna be like if you
do 10 and bind them it's probably >> not much more than doing one I would think effort set up. >> Yeah. >> And it's we leave it up to your discretion. >> Okay. Is that I'll make that as emotional. >> Great. Up to $800.
>> Up to $800 and up to 10 copies. >> Perfect. >> You decide. >> Maybe you want one for Christmas. Yeah. I I I you know it's one of those things I I like a paper. I'm sorry. I'm old school like Greg Wilson, you know, because there's no way I can't I can't find the same experience.
>> If one commissioner again, you know, I mean, the money if it looks like it's not too much money, maybe get one like a nice bount for the library and then get a few of these. I think it's great to have because a lot of great work went into it and beautiful photos,
right? >> So, if you give it to the committee people, >> it might be your Christmas gift. I mean, if we have some money, >> why not? >> Can we increase? >> Yes. >> Um I I think we should be able the >> the preliminary I did look at some
online. We called our printers that we usually do and they can only do the spiral and I I think a hard bound for the library. >> That's the biggest. >> Can we Yeah, it's 50 pages, but you know, I I don't know if there's much because a spiral gives you a little more flexibility. >> Do you want me because I made it in
Canva. I can go to Canva. They they are really cheap to print. >> I was gonna say, don't they have I mean because you can do a hard cover photo book. Yeah. So, >> but I don't know if it's within our Don't we have to like get a >> You need to get a purchase. But they can be if not yet.
>> I can do that. >> Yeah, >> I'll get because it's really cheap. >> It's a mine like that actually lays flat and a small document. It doesn't open well. I find if it's bound, it's kind of >> it's like a chunk. I'll get a few prices. Okay. The professor spends his
days, >> right? But I'm just thinking about the library when kids want something a little bit more. >> Thank you. Yeah. And and thank you to Anna and Susan and Jesse for their meticulous edits and their work and their photos that you guys put into it.
It really is a beautiful piece um resource for the for the town. >> Is that enough money? $800 to be additional. >> I think so. Sure. should be um other budgetary items. Um
there are some areas in town that we can do some plantings. Um the new range pocket park is pretty lackluster on uh plantings. I spoke with uh Chris York
earlier today asking for the potential of if we were to purchase some plants um some grasses area. If you notice I don't know if you guys have been over to the new range. Um it's kind of a hill of grass that goes to rocks that go
straight to a drain which grows right into the river. >> Um so it doesn't do much to help sell the flow of all that cheap water coming off of Graange Avenue. um he thinks aesthetically a few natives or grasses or you know fantians would
work really well in that or he thinks it would contribute to the look of it. Um November is a great time to plant. >> November is kind of free time. There's a lot of good deals too for so uh if we wanted to make this a
collaboration with the green team >> with the easy you know we can put some of these planting the the money towards that and maybe we go out there and >> you know do a little community service well >> perfect we could do it with the girl
scouts as well give back right um so if we had $800 let's just say for the you know 3500 Um, what are we how much would plants I'm looking towards my expert plan?
>> And $400 for two plots that we just put in um in front of the dental office and um this is a big you know what she's talking about both sides like the path goes down both sides >> but but they are going to be they they
did we're going to recede the the grass earlier uh next year. So I don't think the whole thing with regular breast. >> Yeah. That's what you know. >> Really? >> Yeah. >> Why would you do that?
>> I'm just telling what I heard. >> Beautiful switch. It It's gorgeous and low maintenance. It's also down. It's a waterfront property. Water. So
>> would we say >> that's just >> up to two grand? >> Yeah. >> Is there any objections? Is there anything else that you think using money? >> I would rather use it and lose. >> Yeah. And Kelly, can we get in there and
say like don't spend money on grass on regular green bermita grass? What a different visual 700 for anxiet >> whatever the QR codes or whatever you need
kind of seed first. >> Yeah. Right. Anything that's more you know three to one or >> Yeah. That's it. >> Have you seen that picture?
>> Yeah. and doesn't look very appealing aesthetically. >> Flowing right out into you put it up if I send it to you. >> Yeah, sure. >> This isn't going to serve much purpose. >> No, they're going to have to mow that.
>> Yeah. >> That's what that's >> not falling in the river. >> That's all I'm worried about. >> If the bulkhead was falling in the river, that would have been a bad day. So I guess walk is not falling. Great. >> Not that I know for the next five years
because of >> um I'm just thinking going back to our strategic plan. Our mission is not to plant fair haven. And so if I'm not objecting to this, but if we can go back
to our priorities, which was educating the public, if we could also set aside some money to hold some public programming about the kinds of plants we're planning and why we're planting and whatever we need to do to
communicate to people what we're doing. >> Obviously, this could be a demonstration project. That could be it could be >> which we've done before. The rain gardens stuff have been demonstrations. >> Can you use the money this year to book somebody for next year?
>> That's the problem. And so that's why Susan were coming up with um tight in timeline. Um we were hoping to use this money to bring Ruckers. Um Jesse and I reached out in November and I haven't. >> You mean for this November?
>> Yes. The master gardeners are they need to do this kind of work. They need to do their volunteerism and they're very educated. >> Oh, but we >> they don't they don't charge. >> They don't charge, right? >> Um is this something that we can
collaborate with? >> Yeah, I know. >> Yes. >> Have you if you've got large areas to do? Have you considered buying pot plants? >> Yeah. Because you can buy about 30 deep plug plants for about $180. Typically
that's retail. You'll probably buy wholesale. >> Yeah. >> Um I buy plants from my company isol plants that buys allows you to buy from wholesalers. >> So you can buy a lot of plants that way pretty inexpensively
>> if you have a large areas. The other thing that I mean we have we've I'm replanting the bit of Fourth Creek on my property because I've been trying to get rid of the invasives. I um I winter sewed a whole lot of seeds last year. So
I I probably grew hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of dollars of plants for 30 bucks worth of seeds >> in milk cartons outside over the winter time. We just potted along and so I'm
I'm going to use that to to plant things up there. But that's another way. >> Yeah. >> But almost no money to get large amounts of plant material if you know what you >> That's good. And even um utilizing the schools to
>> Yeah, it's a fun project. I mean it's a >> it's kind of intuitive. We grew the customer following your plan. What like what what Susan >> No, I know. So Susan, so the thing is I know it's about education and we wanted
to use some of this money to get an educ to get an expert come talk to us about storm water, talk to us about this stuff. Um, I am happy to kind of we can utilize some of that money to get some expert people to talk about why it's
important. Look at this now. What's wrong with this picture? How can we improve it and how this also benefits storm water? Because that's essentially what we're trying to do. >> We're not just planning for the sake of planning aesthetically. It also is form function. If you look at the picture
right there, >> this is our waterfront park. >> Really? That's range. >> That's great. >> Yes, it's very And apparently I did say they had to redo take out the railing because it wasn't properly put in by the
stairs and then they redid it. I haven't This is the one Bonnie sent to me. >> Um and then there's a bulkhead where in front of that >> it's a vertical bulkhead. It's about 15 foot drop there. >> Yeah. So that's just the reality. >> And is there a fence? Like I haven't I mean there was when I took a picture but
that was a while. >> So you're just going right off that brick at the end of the don't take your blood. You know it's one of those things. Yeah. >> You're not supposed to go on it again. >> Don't walk.
>> But um that just doesn't seem like it has much more any habitat >> purpose. Yeah. >> So, um that's why Chris New York was saying that we can utilize it and almost make it a teaching point. >> It was a challenge. It's a challenge
because >> it was always been a steep ball. I don't know how old it is. Yeah. >> So, Susan, going back, are you >> hoping that I mean, what where would you like to see this money go towards? I know we're not trying to plan
all fair haven. >> Yeah, I don't think we have the money to do that. I think that we need to re refer to our strategic plan and our priorities and apply the budget to our priorities in that order. Otherwise, we're just kind of throwing spitballs at
walls. >> And if we if we plant a garden, and I'm not suggesting that we don't do that. Um, I really think our most one of the most beneficial things we can do is educate the public. And we talk about educating the public, but we don't
really have any mechanisms in place to do that. And even if it's hosting something fun, a party with education with slides, I don't know. I'm just throwing things out. I really think that communication about um the things that
we all know and cherish would that would be money well well spent. So I just throw that out for consideration. >> I agree. >> Yeah. Can we can we table a vote on the
graange money? But here's my point. Can we persuade DPW to instead of planting grass just use the money that they would have done for for sod or whatever seeds to put a more natural grass there, then that's that's off of our plate. But
>> this doesn't have to be on our plate. >> No, but I'm just saying like I I think that that seems like it's within their purview and not ours. >> No, you're right. and and it does, but I the issue that we have is that we have to vote on what we're using this budget now or what is that? >> Can we vote on Can we Can we put up a
vote for educational >> resources? >> Resources, what do you is that too broad? And we could do some print resources or maybe some video before the >> both initiative >> educational programming and um dates and
content TBD >> but we're putting the signs out here delivered before the end of the year. >> That's what I mean month and a half. >> So I can't believe I'm gonna say this out loud and I'm not trying to be
difficult. Would we ever consider an educational sign there to talking about the river and the river health or the the anything river related kind of I I get the impression that they like that our
sign the the green team sign is is liked >> something like that off to the side so it's not blocking the view just in keeping with the educational part of it that might provide some educational um points on the river the river health
kind of two birds with one stone >> but that's a lot >> get it approved >> you have to get it approved by the council >> so Kelly could I suggest for purpose of you have to submit a budget is you have a you have we talked about doing four
programs and so one per each season and you have the topics for them what you don't have nailed down are the speakers so you can assume their attendant costs to each of those programs. So, the budget would be allocated to four
educational programs over the course of the year. These are the topics. And I mean, we may we may be renting a hall. We don't know what we're going to have to do to do that. So, that might be a way to approach your budget.
>> We understand completely and I think that's the fiscally responsible thing to do. But the the problem is Susan, this money needs to be spent by December. We need to vote on it now. We have to but we have to when do we have to let Nancy like when do we have to spend >> the cut off for POS will be like the
first week of December before your next meeting. >> Yeah. Before our next meeting is when we have to have all purchase orders into Nancy otherwise it's gone. So that's why we're just trying to figure out a >> a way to to what we can do with this.
>> Last year it it always tends to happen. How much >> I'm wondering why we're the timing of this. It just feels really rushed. So, um, >> yeah, >> the budgeting process. >> Is it use it or lose it? >> It's use it or lose it. We we didn't
have a meeting last meeting with lack of quorum last month. Um, we've been trying to lock down um presenters and have a fee. Uh, we have not been able to do that. It's just, you know, I ask Chrissy
when the in this January one are they going to get an allocation soon we get an allocation in the budget can they program stuff in January till the budget's finalized or no >> probably >> yeah because I mean that's the other reality is we should probably make a decision now for next year so we have a
we have a plan of action so we don't wait till this time in September to be spending money >> so that would just be my suggestion is continue to think about the ideas we want and then >> January one rolls around you can put another request question, >> right? >> Would you want to spend the 2700 to improve that area?
>> Yeah, I would do that and I would do that. Do you just do that before you have >> 2700? How much do we have? 35. >> That's it. 27 towards video. >> I would I would suggest also you up to
$400 if you want to buy materials like literature or stuff like that or information. I got some information to make the library >> right >> that would be interesting to have for people resources everything together pick a few resources that might be
useful to donate to the library that's idea >> include right expand the environment like the naturally make library resource for want to have information about things like you know
there's good information that's a great idea I would have suggest what you could do as a home or anything. >> Okay. What is it? >> I I recommend that we spend up to $400
on on resources donate to the library. So we increase the amount of environmental books on environmental too. We share basically could be anything about, you know, green planting, native plants, you know, >> guide. Some people come in and get a native plant guide.
>> Um, you know, how green green for your home. >> There's there's lots of really good, you know, books from hardcore >> to >> I think the easily adaptive green knowledge that's available to
homeowners. >> Yeah. >> To do the best you know, stewardship that they can. >> Susan, do you agree with that, too? >> Yes. Um, yeah, I gave them a list of books. I I think their book budget is adequate, but it's a it's a great gesture. So, why don't we go ahead and
do that? Yeah, >> I think any way we can spend the money by educating the public, we'll that will serve us well in addition to the planting. >> This is just >> Okay. Um, >> two votes or one?
>> Yes. Question. Just one more quick suggestion back to the pollinator sign. Um, could someone take a look at it? It could a little bit of money be set aside to reinforce that post. Bonnie was suggesting maybe putting metal around it. I don't know. The post looked pretty
bad to me. I don't know if it needs to be replaced or not cuz it's been cut into with the wacky work, too. >> So, just it might cost a little money to reinforce it just so it doesn't fall over. Yeah.
>> Okay. So, um, vote for up to $800 we got for the ERRI for 10 copies. >> Um, so out of the 2,700 that's left, we'll say, let's just say you said 400 for resources.
>> I mean, you want to get six or eight items. >> That's down to 2,300. We want some money available for the post. Just I would recommend you get that publish post problem. >> I'm sure they might be able to do it. So
$2,300 for plant dance. >> And what about educational materials that align with that? Correct. That planting >> tied in >> tied in as that educational the planting and education. Yeah. >> In our mind speaker.
>> Perfect. >> Does that work Susan? Yeah. Overall >> is the planting location identified. President >> motion to approve. And >> the environmental commission is okay to just do what they want there.
>> We will get that. Um we will talk to if that's approved to to press your work. He did say he said >> he was in approval of it >> and we'll talk to DBW2 as like a gift you know shade tree just gift planted those five trees on community center
that look great. Right. Okay. So, this is just a way of creating um educational and also aesthetically and for you know adding to the form of the the function of that area as well. >> So,
>> Kelly, is there are there any funds needed for the QR codes for the signs you were talking about for the water quality? um that I'm sure there would be, but that would probably be a I don't know if that would get done within the time
frame of December 1st year. >> I don't think might be a tough turnaround. >> Can I make a suggestion about that? Just use yardage signs temporarily, see if they work >> and then if you like it, then convert it perfect. Okay.
So, $2,300 and then put what? Yard signs. >> $200. >> Yeah. >> 100 $100. >> $100 >> going once over the place. Not what I thought. Okay. Right. And then 2,200
>> for 45 >> plans, education, speaker, whatever we can fit in by the end of the year. >> Okay. >> All right. Make a motion. Do you have that? >> I already made a motion.
>> Second. >> What I have done that up to What do you have? You're just gonna make that 2300 total. >> We were gonna do 2,200 for plants education speaker, 100 for the yard signs, 400 resources for the fair.
>> All the way to 2,300 for the green. >> No, we actually >> the lines are different. Sorry. >> Yep. We took $100 off of that. >> 2200 400 for the library and 100. >> Perfect. >> Um
And that would be in collaboration with the green team and natural area she treat whoever wants to get involved with that. Girl Scouts um the Nwood green team would be a great fun >> and this has to be done like in the next couple
>> everything needs to be purchased. Yeah. By before Thanksgiving >> um >> green team update. Is there anything else about green team update? Anybody from the green team wants to include >> Stephanie Robin? Anything with green
team you want to include that we didn't cover? >> No. >> No. Okay. Okay. Planning board update Anna. Log along. Committees are being formed. Bur stipulation, open space, all of that sort of stuff. We meet next week. Um we
have a we've hired a consultant agency consulting agency to drive it. So um yeah that's all these committees going to be asked and put on the survey. >> Yeah. >> When does that happen? I'm not positive,
but all of the all of the like burrow appointed committees weigh in on on that because I think that's really important that the survey that goes out to the town residents is handled properly and ask the right
questions and I keep thinking of the open space. Yeah, I will say that having this group drive it is a better option than it coming from within because they are just way more
they have way more um knowledge, prior knowledge to doing this. It's not like we're like kind of fumbling through it in the dark. They know who to ask, how to get it out there. So, I think it was a good decision to to hire them.
>> Okay. and council update. Councilman um Le Barbara is not here, but I did want to give you guys an update. If you were not aware, our DPW has the help bin, which is um the clothing donation bin,
and we receive revenue from that as well. So, it was put in there in June, um which was fantastic. Um, and since June, we've collected over 2,577
pounds of clothing or linen or towels, sheets, stuffed animals, whatever it collects. And we have generated $180.39 of revenue profit to our >> a win-win. So, um I do think we could do
better and I'm hoping if we could collaborate with the green team on and the town >> coming up with some social media post getting it out there that did you know you can donate your socks with holes in it and they can get recycled or whatever
else your ratty drags anything. Um or anything that doesn't fit you anymore. They they will take everything and they'll kind of thrift it or donate it or they'll shred it up and make it into seat upholsteries kind of thing.
>> Uh the revenue I great question I don't know where the revenue goes >> the general >> to the green to the planting fund >> to the library right >> the library is about 20% of its goal to
renovation. So, um, >> get that out there as well. >> 20%, right? >> 20% of their $150,000 that they want to generate. They're already >> well needed. I think they've been running since 1963.
>> Okay. Um, any public comments? >> Yes. Susan, what? So, I was looking for the erri on the burough website and I couldn't >> You won't find it there because I just finished it.
>> I had I had a few edits that we had to make. Um I just sent it to Christine two nights ago. So now >> is there going to be a link? >> There will be a link >> fine >> to download it. Yeah. As a PDF
>> that lives there. Okay. So, because I'm still looking for the contaminated sites list, it's mentioned at the end. It's supposed to be a link and when it was up there before, it didn't work as a link.
>> The current this ERRI you found on >> when you had it up up on the website. >> Oh, okay. Yeah, it's all going to be it's going to be replaced because I had to make some more changes to it. So, once it's up, it'll have links. That was actually one of the changes was to include physical links and everything.
>> Okay. And so is this going to go back up on the burl website? >> Okay. >> Yes. >> Any other public comments? >> Just one thought. Um I think the slow the flow idea is interesting. I was
going to put together some uh images about different opportunities. Like one question is like everybody wants to keep their yard and we talk about you know so so sanitary and clean and really in some cases it's actually not the best thing right like a clean gutter is probably not the best thing for the environment
right if it has like weeds growing it and stuff it's actually probably helping slow down flow of water and debris along the edge which is what we want and again same thing with discharge you know and I don't know how all our burough ordinances >> really encourage those you know uses so
I You should take a look at it. I'll I'll put together a few items. >> Okay. >> Um, great. And I will also send you um two years ago we did this on the faux input. >> Do we do we have we looked at the ordinances in the town? >> Yeah, there was a new storm water
ordinance that is just being proposed right now >> and being worked on. >> Um, you know, you should also speak to Brit. >> Yes, I will. Um and part of the new storm water ordinance is that they have to do education on it too. >> Really? >> Yes. In order to be compliant and so
that's why he's trying to work with us to get this water. >> Could you do a talk on that? >> We are trying to Oh, on this tree and the importance of the canopy. >> I mean we could do these talks with not
having experts like with us just being experts and breaking that down and telling people what they can do. Um I have a couple dates already open um for the new community center. We were hoping to do it in November or December just getting >> right
>> this we could do it with different um commissions in town and groups that are into it if we wanted to. Um, >> I'd be very happy to do a talk with you on native plants in your garden, where to find good choices, what the deer
doesn't eat, >> right? >> Um, through painful experience. >> Yeah. >> Um, I'd be very happy to do that if you're interested. >> Thank you. I wonder if like a panel too, you know, um, >> breaking it down. Why don't you want to
put some thoughts together, John, for that? And, um, like I said, we could easily schedule that. Our intent was to try to do something in November, December as well too and get people and we could break it down into smaller segments and that just be part of the
storm water or a like um education series just in itself where you could talk about native plants. You can talk about rain gardens or rain barrels um >> new ideas for a new year. >> Yeah, there you go. I love it. All right.
>> I'm a specialist in naming. That's what I do. Do I name the papers? >> What about new ideas for a new year? >> We're talking more like >> holiday, you know. I don't know. >> Get on the trolley. Go to the place.
Get on the shovel. >> There's a plan to stop on the trolley for small Saturday. >> Okay. Any other um >> real quick? >> Yes, >> Christiey's email had a deer inventory
attached to it. >> Yes, we really What's the next uh >> I saw they had some recommendations, but they were really just >> they were well there were recommendations about how to measure the problem, right? >> And I'm like that's not our
>> right. For two more Yeah. Two more years of figuring out like if we put a fence around here. >> Yeah. When you figure out how much killer kill. >> So it's it's more like a >> So that needed >> I had this in my front yard the other day.
>> That's a 10 pointer. That's a 10point. They came up my driveway. >> Yeah. >> You know, >> so I did I did speak to Chris Gorg today. The that report was mandatory as a first step to enter the VP. the DP um
the deer project team is just they're waiting to get notice that if they've signed off on the report yet for Haven to then make recommendations whether it's control hunt whether it's something else so that's just we're still waiting on it
who's going to make recommendations the D >> their dear dear product >> dear management team >> their dear product team is part of the the based on Sherry's report based on >> does that cost us any money or did it give a grand paper,
>> right? >> But my point is, yeah, it doesn't really advance us in terms of managing just said, yeah, this is how you could measure the problem. Okay, we know there's a problem, >> you know. Um, one of the members on the shade tree must had I think an insight.
She said, well, I know it seems stupid to fence off an area because of course if you fence it off, it will regrow, right? We know that's going to happen. But does that make a point a visual actual example to other people that do not want to get rid of deer?
>> Does it actually prove the point and say this is why we're saying that you know when you don't have deer there this is what happens. It grows back influable. >> I don't I don't know if that's I thought >> maybe their logic but I just didn't like the fact that they think we should spend
money >> that's where I got unhappy >> area. Yeah. And just one thing like when we from the natural area committee think about what our options are you like one of them is going to have to be fencing
in that area. Um the the path forward to have a hunt and have it every year does not seem easy. So we have to consider other options. Um one of the options is what's happening now is that the forest
has been failed much. So, and we also talked about, you know, we're doing it, but if Bronson and Lil aren't doing it, do we know if they are pursuing similar paths with the D >> so that it's not just us killing off the
deer and then the deer all come from our neighboring >> Well, I can speak to that also. The mayor did talk to other towns. >> Rumson is not overly concerned about their problem because they have hunting on private land, >> right? They have people come in because they you have to have more than two acres and so for some of those bigger
states they have people that come in and do hunting, >> right? And hunting is legal in fair even too. We just have >> we just don't have a limited place. >> I also don't have as many. >> Another way to think about it is it's obviously in front of our house a public
safety issue. Uh you can't have people coming down the road at the speed they are with 10 or 20 deer in the road. Um and you can't have deer going into the school park and then being shed out into
oncoming traffic. It's honestly uh we we had it's honestly amazing that there hasn't been >> serious traffic accidents. So, I appreciate that we may well be concerned about what it does to the natural area, but it actually is a it it's a question
for public safety hazard. And >> you know, I >> people may feel different ways about the notion of eating meat, killing meat, hunting, all of that. But you're actually looking at a real public safety issue on road at least with the deer, >> right?
>> And we're talking big animals. I I agree with John. You know, when I have something that looks more like uh Yellowstone in my backyard with deers fighting each other, you know, >> at you and stamping their feet at you, which is a little alarming. >> Yeah. When you have that kind of size
animal going back and forth across Fair Haven Road, then you have public safety issue whether they're eating stuff or not. >> And are we clear on what the process is? Because the state came and presented to the burough council last year, right?
Yeah. And they explained that what they recommend in this case is a hunt. Um I didn't know that they were requiring that study. I thought that was something that the brow council was asking for. >> I think this was for the grant that in
order and if I'm correct or speaking on it, I think in order to get the grant that we actually have there's a protocol in place. You got to have the formal report and then then they come back with the recommendations and then you can >> grant for what? >> The grant was for the
>> Oh, the grant was for the >> dear stud. >> Okay. >> It paid for that report. >> Okay. But is that all part of the actual process that like in order to do this? I'm asking you because I don't >> I've got the same feeling that the town want you know >> I think the town
>> came in told us this is what you should do but >> you know people >> the public are like well you know people come in here and say there's not a lot of there's not a deer problem you know so you had to pay get a grant >> to prove that there really isn't you
know like a outside >> you know impartial opinion >> I agree I that's where we're at. >> And so then, right, we could follow up to see what what the next steps are. I don't know. And I do believe that it's something that's um larger than the EC2.
You know, the natural area should be involved in this. Uh you know, like other police traffic, you know, safety as well. Um >> yeah, I mean, we walked around with the D. I don't know if you were there, right? And um I think
>> the police were there, right? >> I believe so. Chief of McGovern. >> Yeah, he he was there. >> Um I wasn't on the walk, but the numbers that they came back and then they estimated based on that was alarming. >> Yeah. And that's how this inventory starts off like about how
>> obvious it is. >> Yeah. >> But then the recommendation is just the >> Well, that's what I do understanding. >> But but that's a good point that it can prove to the >> naysayers that are it's >> I don't know how you do a safety study. I mean, we've done a damage study,
right? of the area, but I don't know how you >> like an infrared study of the deer crossing the roads that you know I mean they crossing them during the day now. It doesn't even thing they're walking around the streets constantly. >> I think it's just because the speed
limits are so low that there's not as many there's not as many as well they grew up here. They know how to cross the street. That's the reality of >> the deer people when they came they said these deer were born here. They live here.
They live both ways. >> That's it. They know how to cross road. They're good. >> Um but we could follow up with what is in process like the next steps >> and um you know, maybe there's town. >> We can spend a couple more years talking about this, but nothing's going to
change until we have a hunt because it's just going to keep getting worse and worse and worse >> or until we're forced to fence it. You're not the That's one of the things when I read the report, I was kicked off. I said, you know, fence for a deer is eight or 10 foot high fence.
>> That's not a It's not a five foot chain link fence. It's It's an 8ft fence. And I'm like, yeah, let's spend some money on that. I mean, it's >> reality. >> Yeah. We if we fence in the woods like the bird sanctuary the natural
yards. >> No, but you have to fence it in and then shoot everybody inside because you're going to have to get them all out before you fence, right? >> Because if there's anybody in there, they're going to extend it. I mean, you're going to have to clear the house before you fence. I mean, this is going to be a real I
>> interesting because we have several people that feed them in town and they they're to discourage feeding them. And um there's a study that says if they are fed porn etc they have more babies. >> So that you know it is really something that should be discouraged
>> by the feeding of the deer. Do not feed the wildlife. >> Don't worry they're eating my wife. >> Well the it's all part of storm water too. It's the reason why you know geese droppings in our ponds really elevates the uh the amount you
know the quality. um deer having a lot of deer and the fecal colony form from that deer really impacts our water health and our water quality as well too. So I do believe that everything is connected. I think it's awareness problem. It's an education problem and I
think we could easily draw that connection for residents. >> I mean fencing is not it's like Jurassic Park. You're not going to make it work because you're going to have to have a gate to get in there. I'm assuming you're going to have a gate and God's on there. Somebody's going to leave the gate >> and next thing you know all the deer will come back and then you're gonna
have to have a ground pl >> to get all the deer back out from outside >> just as something to think about like in Honda Park the arborina fenced in there Um, >> keep Chissy and Susan.
>> Yeah. >> Susan is >> um, yeah, this is a change of subject, but it seems like since we were awarded that silver certification, it would be a good time to follow up with the business community. And I know you got um those
those stickers. So I just wanted to inquire what the plan was to acknowledge the leaders in the business community for their help in the certification process and to publicize that as we put on our form that we would
>> Yes. Um and the the green team did meet before this meeting at 7:15. Um so spoke with Jesse or Jenny about that. Um and getting a person from the green team to help with that. Um, but yeah, you're
right. Especially since we were awarded and we can thank them for their participation in it because they did play a big role in it. I think that's a great thing to highlight. Um, >> are there stickers that we made? >> I have Christine Winn made the stickers and the brochures that we have to hand
them out to. >> Nice to have them up before the holidays. >> Yes, before the holidays throw. So, >> so is is someone in charge of that? because I probably have some information they need about people who signed up. So
maybe we could >> assign somebody to take the lead and get it done. >> I will speak to Jenny again too. I think there could be a great opportunity for like a leazison to the Fair Haven Business Association and the green team
to go with that um and thank them for the for their participation to help us with that award. And we can do it before the holiday store. Small. >> Yeah, small. We can do that. I have those stuff
>> ready to give to people. >> You can put it on um social media. >> Anybody want to help out with social media? >> Anybody have any um >> kids that or sons, daughters that are looking for volunteer hours? What do you
need done for social media? >> Um, just to help with posts and to help with getting some of this information out, if we are planning events, if we are highlighting different things like leaves that are around those trees or different things like that.
>> And what is it? It goes to focus focus or it's an independent. >> It could be both. We are looking to try to help with our media content like on the website. Bettanian's always looking for stuff that we can have. Ideally, we'd love to have a page where you can go as a
in my yard. How can I plant native plants? What are good? What have been working? Different things like that, like as a resource guide. That's one part. But also looking for highlighting upcoming events um or businesses that are being green or different things that are go that are a
little bit more uh real time. But if there's anybody that has students in their household looking for community service hours or that wants to intern or volunteer >> I could I could ask Manda firehouse. She
already does it from firehouse. I'll see if she'll do as nonpaid. >> Yeah. Yeah. She's a stickler for punishment. So we'll just >> make her volunteer to volunteer. >> I'm able to do that,
>> you know. But if anybody has any known enough kids that want to get involved, we are always looking for opportunities to get the youth involved and this is a great way to they're very versed at this.
>> Um any other questions, comments? >> A motion to return. >> Okay. This meeting is pleasure. Susan >> half million.