[music] Heat. [music] Heat. >> [music] >> Okay, good evening and welcome to the December 3rd, 2025 meeting of the Falma Conservation Commission. This meeting is being held virtually via the Zoom uh video conference and is also being broadcast
by FCTV on channel cable channel 9. As this meeting is being recorded by Zoom and broadcast by FCTV, please be cognizant of what you say, how you say it, and what can be seen and heard in your background.
Um, we have a full compliment tonight. Like I said, Courtney's going to be a few minutes late, but um thank you all for your dedication. Um I'd like to remind the commissioners that for commenting uh I will call on each of you in turn. So please refrain from speaking
over each other. Also, all votes are done by roll call. So when I call your name, please state your name and your vote for the record, even if you've made the motion or seconded. Um to our public attendees, at any time during this
meeting, you may enter any comment or questions via the chat function at the appropriate time, they will be read into the record. Uh if an attend if as an attendee you'd like to participate in a particular hearing, let us know via the chat function. Then at the appropriate
time, you will be promoted into the hearing as a participant. When you are selected, uh you must have your video enabled, be succinct, respectful of others. Uh public comments will be limited to three minutes each. [snorts]
Regarding IDAS, under a request for determination of applicability, the applicant is asking the commission to determine if the if the provisions of the Massachusetts Wetland Protection Act and or the Falmouth Wetlands bylaw apply
to their proposed project. A negative determination is that the provision of the act and/or the bylaw do not apply. Therefore, the project may proceed as proposed. AO positive determination means the provisions of the act and or
the bylaws do in fact apply and or may require some conditions. Therefore, the project would require a notice of intent application. So, as an applicant, you want to hear a negative determination. Uh for the benefit of anybody waiting for a particular hearing tonight and so
that you're not waiting unnecessarily, the following hearings are expected to be continued. Um, uh, Fport Condo Owners Association. Um,
KFN Hillside Nominee Trust at 24 Willis Lane, 20 Nicholls Road, East Valmouth. Um, and also there's a request for continuance on under an amendment to existing what is the conditions and that
is 151 Ticket Path. Um, so we will not be hearing those tonight and they will be continued to a future date. Um, all right. So, first up on the agenda is to vote
the minutes of November 12th, 2025. Anyone have a chance to read them? >> I did, Mr. Chairman. I move your approval. Patton >> Driscoll second. >> Thank you, Steve. Thank you, Ron Driscoll. Um, any additions? Any other
comments on the minutes of November 12th? Uh, hearing none, I'm going to call a roll. Uh, Ron >> B and I. >> Oh, okay. Ronnie,
>> sorry. >> I know Courtney wasn't here and I skipped. Sorry about that. >> Out of space. Out of space. [laughter] Steve >> Patton I >> thank you Dave >> K I
>> Bill >> Duffy I >> Jim >> McGrath I >> and Robins is an I. All right that's um unanimous the next thing on the agenda here is um the November 17th
2025 minutes. Mr. >> Chairman I'd move the approval of those minutes. Patton just a second. >> Thank you, Steve. Thank you, Ron. We have a motion and a second to approve
the minutes of November 17, 2025. Any other comments or questions by the commission? Okay. Hearing none, I will call the role. Um Steve >> Pat and I >> Ron >> Chrisai >> Ronnie
your microphone give me a thumbs up Ronnie thank you Dave >> t I >> Bill >> Duffy I >> Jim >> breath I >> Jim Robbins is I so that's unanimous on
accepting the uh November 17th minutes. Okay. First up, uh, is a request for a continuence for a a contest. Yeah. Request for a continuence for a determination of applicability.
Uh, Andrea Monontton 103 Racing Beach A Farm Falmouth, Mass for permission to install mitigation and restoration plantings in accordance with mass DP number 2532
47. Uh, Alyssa, >> the applicant has requested a continuence until December 17th. >> Somebody move that. >> So move, Mr. Chairman. >> Thank you, Steve. >> Chris, a second. >> Thank you, Ron. So, we have a motion, a
second to continue 103 Racing Beach A till December 17th. Um, I will call any comments or questions on that. Hearing none, I will call a roll. Steve, >> I saw him. Ron Driscoll
>> Driscoll I >> Ronnie >> Bman I >> Dave >> Penti >> Bill >> Duffy I >> and Jim >> McGrath I >> and Robins is an eyes unanimous to continue to December 17th.
Okay. Request for a continuence under a notice of intent. And the first one up here is Falmouth Pork Condominium Owners Care of Rudy Hunter Falmouth Port Drive
across from units 278 through 292 Falmouth Mass for permission to raise and regrade the roadway and install drainage improvement. Ben. Yes, Mr. Chairman.
This one is continued is the 17th. >> Yeah. December 17th. >> Can I get you? >> Yeah. Driscoll. So moved. >> Thank you, Ron. How about a second from Dave Kent? >> Oh, I second it. >> All right. Thank you. So, we have a
motion in a second to continue until we say the date was at >> 17th. That's the 17th. >> Okay. So, I'm going to go ahead and call a roll. Um
Steve. >> Well, Mr. Chairman, I have to abstain. >> Oh, okay. No problem. And then Ryan Driscoll >> I >> Bill >> Duffy I >> and Jim >> McGrath
>> Robins is denied to continue the um Donald 75. Okay. Next up is uh the next request for a um continuence is
Bahad Naji KFN Hillside nominee trust 24 Willis Lane Farmouth Massion to conduct dune and beach nourishment again. >> Yes, Mr. Chairman, the applicant has requested a continuence until December 10th.
>> So move Driscoll. >> Thank you, Ron. Okay. Second. >> Thank you, Dave. So, we have a motion to second. Any other comments or questions on 24 Wills Lane? Hearing none, I will call a roll. Steve
I >> Briscoll >> Driscoll. I >> Dave >> Kent. I >> Bill Duffy. >> I >> and Jim >> McGrath. I >> So that's
uh next up is Karen Nichols Road East Farm Mass install a four fiber roll array and to install restoration planting agend. >> Yes, Mr. Chairman. The applicant has requested continuence until December 10th.
>> So moved, Driscoll. >> Thank you, Ron. >> 10. Second. >> Thank you, Dave. We have a motion, a second to continue to the 10th on 20 Nichols Road. Any other comments or questions from the board? Hearing none,
I will call a roll. Steve >> Patton I >> Driscoll I >> Ronnie >> I gave >> H >> I >> Bill >> Duffy I >> McGrath I
>> and Robins is an I. So that's unanimous that continue 20 Nickels Road till the 10th. Uh request for a continuence to amend an existing order of conditions. Constance Ryan 151 Ticket Path Fments
request to amend the order of conditions for MASH DP number 254780 to redesign the proposed revetment extension in core fiber roll array. >> Yes, Mr. Chairman, the applicant has
requested a continuence until December 10th. So move Driscoll 10 second. Thanks Dave. We have a motion a second to continue this um
order conditions to um All right. So we'll go ahead and call a roll. Steve >> Patton I >> Ron >> Iman I hate. Bill >> Duffy I >> Jim
>> Breath I >> and Robbins is an I unanimous to continue. Um okay request for determination of applicability. Andrea Monton 103. This one has been already continued. Sorry about that.
Next is um Paul Triowitz. I hope I got that right. Tram construction 88 Eel River Road found with mass for permission to construct a garage dorma. Alyssa >> staff recommends a negative two under
the state and bylaw. Resource areas are not confirmed and this project solely takes place in an AE flood zone. >> So move patent. >> Thank you Steve. >> Thank you Ron. So we have a motion in a second to accept staff's recommendation
on 88 river. Any other comments or questions by the commissioners? Seeing none, I will call the role. Um Steve >> Patton I. >> Ron I. >> Runny >> Bman I. >> Dave
>> Kent I. >> No >> Duffy I. >> Jim >> McGrath I. >> Jim Robbins is an I. Unanimous um to accept staff's recommendation. All right. This um Cron Cronin sorry Cronin Realy
Trust 23 North Barnes Pond Road Bmouth Mass permission to install restoration plantings in accordance with Mass D25-646. Alyssa >> staff recommends a positive four under the state and a positive five under the
bylaw. Resource area boundaries are not confirmed and I can elaborate. >> Please do. Um, so this project came before us during a COC request. This is a 40-year-old order that the property um owner was trying to close out in order
to sell. In evaluating the property, we were able to close one order. This one was left open as part of the required buffer um is missing. At some point, it was removed and what is existing has
been um cut heavily over the years. Um there's a lot of sucker growth on the existing trees there that we think once were healthy mature canopy trees. Um so part of the reason this property didn't receive compliance is that needs to be
restored. The staff recommended in July that the um representatives file a notice of intent. That's typically how you review restoration projects. Um there are a couple other uh smaller issues on the property such as some unpermitted tree removal. We would like
to see some of the trees go back. Um, a couple other small things such as drainage on the property that needs to be addressed in an area of salt marsh that um had part of the float stored on it. So, we're hoping to observe it rebounding. If it doesn't, that area
would need to be restored. Um, at this time, an RDA has been filed. Um considering the scope of work and the um decision-m of this board in the past, the staff is recommending a positive. Um we do have representatives of the
project here tonight. The staff's recommendation at this point would be to um listen to their brief presentation, continue the hearing so we can send you over all of the application materials, uh receive permission for you all to visit the site and regroup in a week or
two um to give your decision. >> Okay, see Mr. Wall there, so I'm going to turn the floor over to you, Brian. >> Thank you. Uh good evening, Mr. Chairman, members of the commission. Um Brian Wall for the applicant Cronin
Realy Trust uh owner of the property at 23 North Bournes Pond Road. Also with me tonight is Lynn Hamlin from Hamlin Consulting. I can't see if she's been promoted or not, but um Lynn is here to also address the RDA.
>> There's a message there, J. >> No, I know. I just promoted her. Brian and Russ. >> Okay. Thank you. And Mr. Chairman, I know this is an RDA, so I'm I'm not going to be lengthy. if I could just have a minute or two to explain the background. So, on behalf of the applicant, Lynn and I have filed an RDA
proposing to plant 610 square ft of native trees and shrubs. The planting will take place within land subject to coastal storm flowage, the buffer zone to a coastal bank, and the buffer zone to salt marsh. By way of background, I
think it's important for the commission to understand where we're coming from. The property at issue was owned by Neil and Kathleen Cronin. Mr. Cronin passed away in 2016 [clears throat] and Mrs. Cronin passed away in October
of 2024. So, the property isn't a trust, but essentially it's the heirs of Mr. and Mrs. Cronin um that have now taken over the property. And what they are doing is they're trying to sell the house and they currently have a buyer that's been waiting for this to be resolved. But when the property was put
on the market and council was hired, it was discovered, as Alyssa said in her presentation, that there were several open orders of conditions, most of them dating back, or all of them dating back to the 1980s. Two of those have been resolved. Um, I've only been involved rather recently,
but Ms. Tamlin has been representing the applicant and the issues with two of the orders we understand have been resolved but there remains an issue with obtaining compliance with the third order which dates back to 1984. This particular order has a condition
that requires there to be a 25 foot naturally ve vegetated buffer extending landward from the 3-FFT contour which I think is the top of the coastal bank. As Alyssa said, sometime since 1984, a
16 a 610 square foot area in the 25- foot buffer was altered. And this area now needs to be planted in order for the property owner to obtain compliance. And hence, that's why we're before you with this RDA. This RDA is seeking permission
or a determination of non-applicability in order to proceed with planting the 610 square ft. Lynn Hamlin has provided a plan proposing the planting which I can put up on the screen if the commission would like me to do that. We felt that the RDA was an appropriate way
to move forward because of the dimminimous nature of what we're seeking to do and also because it's beneficial to the family in the sense that it's the quickest and also most economical way to obtain this needed permission and then once the planting is done we can come
back and request compliance and hence we think there's a a negative -2 is warranted. That's not just my opinion. I have submitted a letter to the commission explaining the basis of our request. So, under the state regulations, planting native species in
the buffer zone is considered to be what's called a quote minor activity that is not subject to regulation. So, no permit whatsoever is needed for this under the act. And [clears throat] similarly, under Fmouth regulations, planting in the buffer zone is
considered to be quote a moderate activity that is presumed not likely to have a significant or cumulative effect on the resource areas. So again, given the dimminimous nature of what we're seeking to do, given the way that this
is treated under the regulations and given that the family is trying to sell this house uh to a buyer that's waiting for this to be resolved, we thought this was an appropriate way to go forward and we're asking the commission to make a negative determination.
We have discussed this with staff. We've reviewed the staff report and we are aware as Alyssa said that staff is recommending a notice of intent and we just have a respectful disagreement. We don't think a full notice of intent is necessary to plant 610 square ft.
Staff suggests that planting the that an NOI is needed so that there can be conditions regarding the planting. Again, we just respectfully disagree given the small nature of the activity proposed. There's also a suggestion that there should be a condition against
unpermitted cutting on the bank and in the buffer zone. But again, I would suggest to the commission that the background regulations already prohibit that this is all a no disturb zone A. So no cutting is permitted to begin with.
So given given these circumstances and given that we're simply trying to help this family sell this house, we're asking the commission to consider giving a negative two on this RDA. Lynn is here on the screen. She can discuss the planting plan itself and answer any of
the questions the commission may have regarding the details. >> Okay, Lynn, you're got the floor. You're muted, Lynn. >> Sorry, Lynn has raced from the Haritch
Conservation Commission to get on screen, so she's she only arrived home a few minutes before. There she goes. >> There we go. Sorry, I'm You're one of the few commissions that still do Zoom. I'm out of practice. Um, okay. Lynn Hamlin from Hamlin
Consulting. I I'll be brief. I just wanted to go over the planting plan um with you. So, as directed by your staff, I went to the site and inventoried the woody vegetation that is currently growing on the coastal bank in in the
undisturbed buffer. And there's quite a lot of species out there. I would respectfully disagree with the characterization of the age of the trees that is out there that are out there and the cutting. None of the um trunk sizes are substantial. They're relatively
small, which would indicate to me that they're fairly young. um vegetation out there are um majority of oak trees and what will comprise the overstory are eight white oaks, three black oaks and
five scarlet oaks. There's also a couple of black cherries that allowed to um grow to their full maturity will create a substantial overstory. The substory will be comprised of an existing um very robust scrubbo community and a service
berry. There's also um a cedar tree out there, one red cedar tree. So I took that existing inventory and my plan strategy was to augment it to create diversity. So the tree species I added were additional red cedars which are
very appropriate for the area to add more evergreen component to it. and then 31 different native species of shrubs. I know that the staff um has a problem with a couple of my species. I I that
can be done or revised with consultation with the staff. I chose species I thought was appropriate, but I'm not stuck on them. If staff prefers other species, that's fine with me. Um all work is to be done by hand. um were stating that they can mobilize the
material to the site with a small skid steer, but the actual digging is to be done by hand. Um what's out there now is Cape Cod lawn, but I think that's a very generous term. It's um barely even Cape Cod lawn. So, what we would do is remove
the grass around each individual planting um and allow the grass to grow between them. I try to put things in clusters. So between the clusters would allow that natural vegetation to grow undisturbed. Um it would be necessary to install some temporary irrigation to
ensure that these um shrub species and tree species get established. Um and then my note regarding invasive species removal, that is a boilerplate note. I put in all my vegetation plans. It's more appropriate for sites that are
denuted or scraped clean and then you put the native vegetation on top. I don't anticipate much um inc incursion of invasive species because it's all pretty well vegetated. Um
let's see. Um I think that's it. I'll try to keep it short while we um answer some questions if you have them. Hey, do you have a plan with you, Lyn? You could put up on the screen there. >> I think Brian's probably >> I I do have it. Mr. Chairman, with your
permission, if I could share my screen. >> Did I succeed in putting that up? >> You did. >> Yes, you did. Brian, >> good. A lot of practice. >> I think it's missing some notes, but that's the basic. >> It's because I've zoomed in. I'm sorry. I can >> That's That's probably Oh, there you go.
Okay, >> that's better. >> Let me know if I can um help orientate anybody to this plan. >> Okay. Um so, >> so again, this is the first time the commission seeing this. They don't really know what the property looks like
to be oriented exactly, but from what you can see there, the the colored dots are the proposed plantings and the water is to the bottom of the plan. >> Okay. I I had included individual packets for each commission member when I filed this. Apparently, they didn't
get them. >> Yeah. No. >> Yeah. That that's not how we process the RDAs. We had mentioned that to Brian the other day. These are all reviewed at the staff level. Um so they they were not distributed. >> They will be distributed now, Lynn, when the board we we we are going to continue
this. The board is going to have the opportunity to go out there and do a full review like they do notice of intents and then as Alyssa said, we'll regroup in about a week or two. and the commission can render their decision. Um, if the commission is all set, Lynn, can you sh stop sharing?
>> I'm not sharing. >> That's me. >> Oh, Brian, sorry. >> I will do that. >> Board members all set. All >> I have a question. >> Good. >> I I have a question. >> Thank you, Dave. >> Um, I [clears throat] don't see the the home or the the building on that plan.
>> Um, it's it's significantly far away. I can we can include it. I was zoomed in on it. Actually, I submitted a site plan maybe um also. So, I gave as part of my application a full site plan which shows the whole property, the building, the dock, um everything. And then this was
just a supplemental plan to that. [clears throat] >> Okay. I see. >> So, you could focus in on this and I didn't have to make it tiny. >> I see. Thanks. >> Like Alyssa says, Dave, she normally don't give those out. So, >> Okay. >> An RDA. Um
Yes, Jen. I see you. Yep. >> Um just a few points um to the commission. Um the trees that are out there have been, as Alyssa stated, very heavily managed. They are not going to grow up into their full and mature form. They are going to grow up into shrub,
big large shrubs because they've got multiple multiple leaders and sprouts coming out of the trunk. Um if the board approves this, we cannot condition it. It does not address the damage to the salt marsh for a float that's been
installed. And it also does not address the trees that were removed. And they they were the trees that are there, they may be young because the trees that were removed, I mean, they were removed. The trees would be much older and much larger had they not been removed. You
can clearly see the area was forested in an aerial. Um, and I do have I I I do disagree that the the the trees that are out there that have been managed and that have multiple leaders and sprouts
and will grow into a full and mature um shade tree. They just won't. Um, but that said, again, we'll give the commission the opportunity to go out. We'll submit um all the plans, the packets that Lyn has submitted to the
board for review. You can go out, make your own determination, come back and let the staff know what you would like to do. Um, do you want to do that in one week or would you like two weeks? Mr. Chairman, >> I
can we can that be accomplished in a week? >> Can if that's up to the board. I mean, usually we do it in a week so the board can go out there, but if the board needs more time, just let us know. >> Right, Dave? I I see >> I I I had one question, Jennifer. And uh is it important to impro to approval
that these trees do grow up to be uh uh forget the term we used uh what's the term you use for for the tall trees? I forgot the term >> full and mature form >> canopy tree. Is it is it important that these to for approval uh to for these to to grow up
to to be full of mature trees or could they be >> I mean when they grow I mean they're going to grow as multi-tered um like large shrubs they are going to present more of a of a of a view issue for any
um future homeowner. I mean they're not going to be able they were not going to be a single trunk tree growing up. They're they're growing out from the base with multiple leaders and >> I'm just trying to figure out if if you consider that we should consider that to be to be a problem or is that okay?
>> It it is going to be a problem. >> Why is that a problem? >> It's not like it's not like it was 40 years ago. It's not it's not getting back to the the original. Right. That's the reason. Okay. That's what I wanted to know. Thanks. >> So So Lynn, I have one concern. I I know
this that they're pushing because there's the house is under agreement, but if if if even in a week this got approved, how could you plant it before the house um how could you plant the project before
the house uh was sold? It it would the the Brian should probably address this more, but having spoken to everybody since last spring, once they have an agreement that the commission will approve this, the buyers are willing to to move forward.
>> And and I could add to that, Mr. Chairman, the lender for the buyer is aware that there's an open order of conditions, and that's kind of like kryptonite to the lender. It just doesn't want to touch it. So if we have this resolved even though it's
[clears throat] not done that the transaction can go forward. >> But it would have to be followed up on in that case. >> Oh. Oh. AB absolutely. And if I could just reorientate the commission too. What's that issue here is the proposal
is planting 610 square feet of native plants in a buffer zone. And we're suggesting that that is such a minor activity that you can determine that the bylaw does not apply a negative determination. There still is another chapter to come. We have the property
has to come before you for compliance in in order to close that order. And until that happens, the property owner is subject to possible enforcement. So our goal is to hopefully get a negative determination, allow this sale to be done. the the property the owners are
going to have a hold back for the plantings. The plantings will be done in the spring and the new owner will come to you for compliance and then the commission gets compliance with this 1984 order. >> Okay, listen. >> That's on the staff to to to monitor,
Mr. Chairman. You have no you have no um uh ability to condition the RDA that says the plants have to go in this spring. Um, this office is very busy. We do not have time to to monitor every RDA that's out there. Um, I do have a
concern with that. >> Okay. Thank you, Jen. Alyssa, I saw you had your hand up. Sorry. >> Yeah. No, and just to note that this only is proposing to address the missing plantings on site. This does not address the majority of the remaining um
compliance issues. Um, staff does have concerns with the planting plan and the site was not staked. So if you would like to visit the site, I think perhaps a twoe continues would be best so that the property lines, buffer zones, proposed planting areas, everything you usually see can be properly staked for
your review. And I now that Brian has explained, I understand how the the sale process will proceed going forward. Um, you know, we've been answering questions about this process since March on how to address the COC, how to get a site plan.
We've responded the first couple days of July. It could have been planted by now. So, we understand, but I think plantings in the spring is a definite must. Thank you. >> I' I'd like to address a couple of things if if it's appropriate.
>> Go ahead, Lyn. Make it quick though. I got the rest of the commission. >> Yes, I will. So, um I received an email from Alyssa on September 23rd because we went was very um expanded conversations and it wasn't until the end of September that we were
in agreement that the only outstanding issue on this site was the 25- foot buffer restoration. Um, regarding the trees, whether they grow to their mature form, um, we do this a lot and then I could also include in my plan. You can
have an arborist go prune these trees to get a leader. If you're very concerned about them having their original form, then that's something that can be accomplished. And it's much better done with trees that are established, that are used to that environment. They're on the coast. They're hearty. They're
healthy. I also repeat that I disagree that that's has been some pruning. I don't think it's been too egregious. Um and then we've also and Brian might better address this that we before in order to close out orders have constructed a
letter of agreement. So it gives the commission assurityity that these plants would survive can be monitored. You can put a number of factors in a letter of agreement and that can be recorded against the deed as well to give the commission assurityity that the project
will go forward and will be successful in the normal term that our notice of intent would cover. >> Thank you. >> Just one quick thing, Mr. Chairman. The this letter of assurityity was never mentioned to us and it has not been
vetted or approved by your council. And again, yes, an arborist could take care of the trees, which would be conditioned under an order of conditions to restore the buffer. You know, you can't condition an RDA.
So, it's all we're wishful thinking that the new owners are going to come and spend all this money to to hire an arborist to prune these trees back because they've been damaged. So anyway, um I think a two-e continuence to have the site stake, the
commission to go out, you do your full evaluation. I don't think there's much more to say at this point, Mr. Chairman. >> All right, Jen. Any anyone else from the commission? Anyone got any comments? Any questions? >> Okay. So, um
>> I'm not going to be here in two weeks, so it would either have to be a week or a first of the year. If the board has technical questions, I I will be at the hearing on the 17th, but I'm a little reluctant to go forward
without Lynn if there's technical questions. And there I suppose there might be after you go see the site. >> Permission has been granted to go to the site. Um, and I don't want to open up a can of worms again, but I just would suggest to that there's another process
coming, compliance. We're just proposing the planting right now. Um, so at the commission's discretion, either the 17th or into January, >> Brian, if you don't want to go forward without Lynn and I I, you know, got
>> I don't want to go forward without Lynn, I kind of take back what I said because if the staff and commission members go out to the property and then they have questions, >> I'm not capable of answering technical questions. >> Absolutely. Okay. So, why don't we continue this to January 7th? That's our
next available unfortunately. >> So, are you available on that day? >> That's fine. Thank you. >> Okay, we'll do January 7th then. >> Okay. >> At the request of the applicant, we can continue this hearing to January 7th. Driscoll. >> Thank you. >> Second.
>> Thank you, Phil. Um, any other comments or questions from the commission? Hearing none, I'm going to go ahead and call a role to continue to What was the date again? 7th, Jen? >> January 7th. >> January 7th, Mr. Chairman. >> So, um, I'm going to go ahead and call
the role to continue until January 7th. >> Steve and I, >> Ronnie, >> I Ronnie and I, >> I got sorry, Ron, >> you got me. You baited me
tonight. Um Dave, >> you can call me Davey. I [laughter] >> Bill >> Duffy I >> Jim >> McGrath I >> and Robins is an I. So it's unanimous to continue until January 7th. Thank you.
>> Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you, members. Thank you, staff. >> Happy new year. Nice to meet you. >> Happy new year, Brian. Good night, Len. All right, that was 234. Okay, so next up is um this is still
under the IDAS. Here is uh Melissa Hall 121 Alanav Fmouth Mass for permission to install a new title 5 sewage disposal system. Melissa >> staff recommends a negative two under the state and bylaw. Resource area boundaries are not confirmed and this project solely takes place in an AE
flood zone. >> Piscoll so moved. Second. >> We have a a motion and a second to accept staff's recommendations. Any other comments, questions by the commission? Hearing? None. I'll call a
roll. Um Steve >> Patton I >> Ron >> Frisco I >> Bill >> Dy and Rob. >> Robin. Somebody
okay it's unanimous accept staff's recommendation. Next up is Salt Pond Areas Bird Sanctuaries Inc. Care of Katherine Taylor Swift Street Fouth Mass uh
map/parcel ID is 24A-11-00002-00004 with permission to repair an existing seaw wall. Melissa Staff recommends a negative three under the state and a negative -2 under the bylaw. Resource area boundaries are not confirmed.
>> So move Driscoll and second. >> Thank you. We have a motion and a second to accept staff's recommendations for zero swift street. Any other comments, questions by the board? Hearing none, I will call a role. Steve
>> Pen. >> Ron. >> Fiscal. I >> I >> Steve I >> Bill >> Duffy I >> Jim >> McGrath I >> and Robins is an I. So it's unanimous to accept staff's recommendation on zero
Swiss. Um next up is um Scott Masili 28 Oak Grove A Both Mass for permission to raise and rebuild an existing single family dwelling. install a new title 5 sewage disposal system and
conduct regrading. Uh Melissa, >> this application has been withdrawn without prejudice. >> Right. So we don't need a motion to accept a withdrawal, do we, Jen? >> Nope. >> No. >> Okay. So we move on to the next one.
facility again 47 Om road found with mass for permission to install a new title five sewage disposal system >> staff recommends a negative three under the state and a negative -2 under the bylaw resource area boundaries are not confirmed >> so move Driscoll
>> and second >> thank you tocept staff's recommendation on 47 OM road any other comments questions by the hearing none. Call the roll. >> One,
>> I >> Duffy I >> gra I >> and Robbins is an I. So we unanimous acceptation 47 road. Next up is M. Michael and Mary Develin, three Boston Street with Mass
for permission to construct a roof deck. >> Staff recommends a negative three under the state and a negative two under the bylaw. Resource area boundaries are not confirmed. >> So move Driscoll and second.
>> Thank you. Uh Ron, we [clears throat] have a motion in a second to accept staff's recommendation on Boston Street. Any other comments or questions by the board? Hearing none, I'll call the role. Steve >> Madden I. >> Ron,
>> I can't I >> Bill >> Duffy I. >> Jim >> McGrath I >> and Robbins is an I. So it's unanimous to accept staff's recommendation in Boston Street. Uh, next up is
Margaret Gria Jwitten Jr. Trustees Zero Panzan Road thmouth mass for permission to extend an existing blood wall. Alyssa >> staff recommends a negative3 under the state and negative2 under the bylaw.
Resource area boundaries are not confirmed. >> So move and second. I got a motion and a second to um accept staff's recommendation. Any other comments or questions by the board?
Hearing none. >> Question. Who's who owns the property? Is it is what's the name of the trust? >> That's just trustees, right? >> Just says >> I mean there are trustees. I just don't think the name of the trust was actually
put on the application. >> Okay. Is that gonna I don't Is that going to make a difference, Jen? We have an existing This is There's a There's existing orders on this, right? But it's on 174,
>> correct? >> And this is tied to 174, >> correct? It's one contiguous wall. >> Okay. And this is just the piece in between. >> Correct. All right. Guess we accept the trustees on this.
>> Yeah. >> All right. Any other comments or questions? >> Sorry. >> And I get a motion. >> Motion a second. Motion to second staff recommendation. Um,
so no other comments or questions. I will call a role. Steve, >> Iris I >> Dave, >> can I build
>> Ian? Robins is denied unanimous to accept staff zero pending approach. Next up is Karen and Richard Noise trustees 237 Menot Roadmouth Mass for permission to construct
additions enclose an existing breezeway and install dry wells. Jen I sorry Elissa >> staff recommends a negative two under the state and bylaw resource area boundaries are not confirmed and this project solely takes place in an AE flood zone.
>> So move Chris >> Bowman second. >> Thank you Ron. Thank you, Ronnie. We have a motion and a second to accept staff's recommendations for 237R. Um, any other comments or questions from the commissioners? Hearing none, I will call the role.
Steve, >> Patton, I >> Duffy I >> McGrath I >> Robins is an I. It's unanimously accept staff's recommendations 237 road. Next
up is um Laura Li Lauren S. Petite 22 Anchor Lane Mass for permission to construct a two-story garage. Alyssa >> staff recommends a negative two under the state and bylaw. Resource area boundaries are not confirmed and this project solely takes place in an AE
flood zone. So move Driscoll second. >> Thank you Ron. Thank you, Ronnie. Um, so we have a motion and a second to accept accept staff's recommendations. Are there any comments or questions by the board? Hearing none, I will call the
role. Steve, >> I >> Dave I don't >> I >> Robbins is an I. It's uh unanimous that accept staff's recommendations
recommendation on 22 anchor lane. All right. Um continued requests for a determination of applicability. Sylvia Bartell 174 Austera Road found with Mass for permission to install a
new title 5 sewage disposal system. Alissa staff recommends a negative three under the state and a negative two under the bylaw. Resource area boundaries are not confirmed. So moved. Driscoll second. We have a motion and second to accept staff's recommendations. Any other comments or
questions by the board? >> Hearing none, I will call the role. Steve >> I >> can I. >> Um Bill >> Duffy I >> Jim >> McGrath I >> and Robbins is an I. So, it's unanimous
to accept staff's recommendations for 174 road. Next up is request for a hearing under a notice of intent. All hearings of the Fmouth Conservation Commission will be held simultaneously under the authorities of Massachusetts
Welllanding Protection Act and the Fal bylaw. Although a single decision in the commission is issued, it represents a separate decision under each authority. And first up tonight, we have Thomas Turner,
Chapaquo Association. >> Excuse me, Mr. Chairman. We were going to take 202 Edgewater out um drive out of um >> out of order. You're absolutely >> out of order so that Chuck Martinsson could join us. Thank you again for reminding me.
>> Not a problem. Mike Burcili. Uh, okay. There's Chuck. Um, Maya has informed me that the Fererals, the applicants would like to be promoted. So, I'm promoting uh Michael and Marne Ferrell. And I also am
promoting Pam Nubert from Megalodon. Correct, Mike? >> Yep. And she's there. >> Okay. Yep, she's here. >> All right. So, let me read that in. Michael and and Marne Ferrell 202 Edgewater Drive East LLC 202 Edgewater
Drive Eastb Mass for permission to construct a dock. Thank you, Jen, for reminding. >> Not a problem. And just to recap, this is being taken out of order because the board specifically wanted to hear from the town shellfish warden, Chuck
Martinsson, who is joining us tonight. Um um the board had asked um Chuck to answer a series of questions which he has done which we sent to you. We sent to Mike. Um and so Chuck is here because
the the board specifically wanted to to ask him some questions. So Chuck is here to answer any of the questions. To remind the board, this is the dock with the two um if you may conflicting shellfish surveys. One was done that
trip the density. Another was done several months later and did not trip the density. Uh so Mr. Chairman, Chuck is here to answer any questions um as requested by the board. >> All right, Jen. Thank you very much.
Chuck, thank you for joining us this evening. >> My pleasure. Thank you. >> So, questions for uh Chuck while we got him up here. >> I know there were questions. Were they all answered by the email? Was everybody
satisfied with that? >> I can go over the questions the board wanted. I think Dave, you wanted to talk to to Officer Martinsson. um um and asked that he be one of the questions the board has was the area in
front of 202 Edgewater Drive closed or open when the two ver surveys were completed. I'm looking at my questions and not Chuck's answers. So, give me one moment and I can bring them up. Um Martinson, where are you?
Um, and Chuck said September 14th through the uh September 14, 2024 and the May 2023rd May 2025. Uh, September 14th was closed. Uh, May
3rd, 2025 was closed, but it closed May 21st of 2025. I think one of the questions that he may be able to la elaborate a little bit more on for the board. One of your questions was can cohogs move after
being disturbed by the first survey. The second survey only showed about half the amount as the first. Chuck's answers were juvenile cohogs can have some horizontal mobility with their foot. However, this is more common with
younger animals. More mature animals are normally not as mobile horizontally. They tend to be subject to outside forces or influences. Um, another question the board had, would the nearby Cape Cod Oyster Grant affect the area in front of 202
Edgewater by naturally propagating the area? Um, answer. The farm primarily produces oysters. There would be no more or no less influence than any other similar bottom in that area. Your fourth question,
um, is there a significant current in that area that would disturb the cohogs or wash them away? Um, there is a current north south which runs by the nearby Bayside Beach and I would estimate the max current to be 30 three, excuse me, three knots or less. And then
excuse me, the last question the board had is if the commission were to require a third survey, what amount of time should pass? 6 months, one year, 2 years. And the answer was the longer time period would generally allow for more recruitment under ideal
circumstances. However, we are not operating in a vacuum. There may be many variables at play such as future commercial or harvest recreation. So those are the questions. the board had. Um,
and Chuck is here to answer or elaborate on any additional questions or elaborate on the ones he had. Thank you. >> All right. I see. Um, Bill, you got your hand up. >> Yeah. Um, thanks for coming, Chuck. So, from what I understand, September 14th,
they tripped the trigger and May 3rd, they did not. Um, just really quickly, Chuck, um, I know it was closed in September 14th. How long was the the bed closed before that survey was done? >> The, uh, the area closes generally May
1st. Um, which is a which is a state closure. It's actually not a town closure. Um, and I obviously did confirm that with our area biologist, Mike Blanco, that uh none of that had been changed or there weren't any discrepancies there. Um, I spoke with
Mike at the Division Marine Fisheries approximately a week ago. Um, he confirmed that and uh, Yep. So, that is a state closure. Uh, that's an annual closure. >> When is it open to fishing? Um, >> that Let me just go back to my notes on
that. It opens um, hang on one moment. believe that opens. [clears throat] One moment here, please. Believe that area opens uh um >> November 1st
generally, unless it's held later. >> Okay. So just from my timeline, so it would have opened on November 1st, 2024 and been allowed to be fished until May 1st, 2025, where it's closed again until November. >> Uh it would yeah, there would be a
winter time frame that it would be open. Um it is possible it could have been December. Sometimes there are holdbacks, which are uh town holdbacks. I'd have to go back and check on the actual town hold back to see if there was a hold back, but there would be a period of time um within that time frame where it
would have been opened. >> Right. So, the survey in May 3rd was done literally two days after it was closed for fished for months. Okay. >> Yeah, correct. It was um that that uh
that closure happened the last day of April and then May 1st the closure actually triggered. So, Excellent. Thanks, John. >> Yes, sir. >> Thanks, Bill. Dave, I see you have your hand up. >> Well, I guess the question for me is um I I don't really understand what's
what's seems like there could be different reasons why for the drop between the first one and the second one. We've been told in a previous meeting that actually taking the the sample can cause disruption and maybe that would cause the second um to be lower. There could be natural movement
or natural or fishing. Uh, I'm just trying to get a handle on um is the drop we saw explainable or normal? And uh because I think it's important for the the commission to know what's the running rate going to be going forward and we have two different measurements
so it's hard to tell. >> Sure. um the as far as um kind of acute information that I have about surveys that have been done and then follow-up surveys and what there is there for shellfish afterward. Um you know I haven't done any we haven't published
any literature on that. We haven't done a lot of survey work on that. Um, obviously we do know, you know, there's some an anecdotal information I can give you that certainly when shellfish are pulled up um if they're thrown back down uh onto the substrate on the bottom,
there can be some level of mobility. Um, as I said, generally a little bit more with the smaller animals, with juvenile animals than with adults. Um, you know, potentially could the animals have gone in and been swept down or swept away a
little bit because of a a current? is a possibility. Um, but it's really tough to it's tough to really put your finger on it. Um, it would be um, you know, I could we could list another a number of possibilities which could or could not
be plausible, but I it's near impossible to to put your finger on one specific um, you know, kind of um, uh, set of circumstances that could have been the one that of why it went one way or the other. Is is it reasonable for me to ask
if you were um advising the commission uh what number we should use, first, second, or something in the middle or >> I mean it's Yeah, I don't I I you know, it's >> it's a I would at this point really not
be comfortable with >> maybe maybe it can't be done. Okay. Maybe >> right. Yep. >> It's too it's too unknown to to make a confident answer. It sounds like >> Yes. Yep. Correct. >> That's fine. >> Yep. >> Thank you. Sure. >> Anyone else for uh Chuck while we got
him here? >> All right. Everybody satisfied with um the responses we got as far as the shellfish part went. >> I'd like to Chuck go because I know he's on he's on his off time. So, >> thank you, Chuck. >> Thank you.
>> Yeah. Thanks a lot, Chuck. Really appreciate it. >> Okay. Were there any questions from the proponent? I don't know if they had any that uh >> they have their hand up. Mr. Chairman, >> I'd be happy to answer any questions they had as well, just to provide, you know, kind of equal access to to the background uh for them as well. So,
>> all right. Oh, okay. Mike, go ahead, Michael and Mar. >> Okay. Yeah. Can you hear me? >> Yep. >> Yeah. Um I know that um Pam Nubber is here from Megalodon. She's calling in from um the Middle East, I believe. So,
it's very early there. Can we promote her? Is she >> Mr. Farrell? I tried to promote her twice and it declined, but I can try again. Oops. I saw her. I tried to promote her right away. >> It's 3:00 a.m. in the morning, so she tried to um she was up early.
>> I'm getting no response, Mr. Frell. >> That's okay. I can get her on speaker phone. We had a backup plan because she did try yesterday and she had some problems. Um, uh, that's fine. I I you know what? I don't know if now's the time for me to, uh, make a a statement or I should
probably wait for Pam. One second. Sorry about that. All right, baby. I'll talk to you later. Okay. Bye. Love you. >> Sorry about this. Thank you for your patience.
We thought She had texted that she was on there. You want to try to get her and I can Sorry. >> Hello. you have reached Pam New7479. >> Yeah, we'll keep trying. Sorry about that. I know that she she was uh she was
on and um you know she's calling from the Middle East so she had some technical difficulties >> and she definitely had some comments um after we I think she watched the last hearing and um so she had some things to
say. I I think uh one of it too that we found um if you take both of the surveys and you look and you um see the areas where uh there's actually nine shellfish that were in areas that weren't there in
the first one. So as far as movement like those were added into the equation that hadn't been there before. So that kind of I think would be important to kind of take into consideration as well. um you know the ones we keep kind of
focusing on the ones that weren't found the second time um but there were nine additional ones that were found in areas that weren't there before. So um she kind of stressed in a in an email to us that um
you know there's value in having repeated results for scientific understanding. shellfish can increase or decrease in abundance depending on sediment, water quality conditions um and by general movement. Uh and they
noted during the survey and that is in the conclusion that uh the sediment was black and had the distinct smell of hydrogen sulfide indicating hypoxic and inoxic sediments. Um so her conclusions
both times for on our project was that um it would not um affect uh our project does not affect affect shellfish habits um in in either
scenario. So, uh >> I can read I actually have her her uh recommendation after the first survey, the one that failed. And this is what she said. She said, "Based on observations made during the shellfish
survey, the town of Felmouth FWR 10.34 shellfish thresholds for cohogs were exceeded by less than 1/ half a cohog per 9 ft squared. There were no cohogs found within the center line of the proposed project. Area B had no shellfish observed. This project will
not affect water circulation, will not cause changes in the distribution of sediment grain size, will not affect freshwater inflow and/or productivity of plants, and will have no significant negative impact to water quality. The sediment within the surveyed footprint was observed to have high organic
content consisting of black inexic silt with a majority of stations in area A having the distinct hydrogen sulfur odor. These conditions observed are indicative of utrification and are providing suboptimal habitat for shellfish and and after that megalodon
environmental recommended that the project receive an order of com uh conditions. Now after that initial survey narrowly missed um you know we we met with Michael and Michael noted that even a minimal exceedence rarely receives approval. So following his
suggestion we consulted with our full team including Pam and Darren. Megalodon advised us that we should check the shellfish abundances again because there is value in having repeated results for scientific understanding. Um, and that's why we did the other one. And I know
that it's not uncommon that people present um the survey that passes and sometimes they don't and they wait until they do. Um, and in this case um, we obviously presented the one that did. Another thing I just wanted to point out
is I think context matters here a little bit. There are where we are, there are 25 consecutive docks to the north of us. I could take a baseball and throw it to the north and hit a dock. And then I could turn around and throw it uh a baseball to the south and hit a dock. So
25 consecutive docks to the north, six or seven docks to the south, ending less than um 2.2 miles away. And a new dock is being built across the river diagonally from our um area. >> Yeah. I actually I mean we have a Google
Earth p picture and within.7 miles there are 50 docks in our area. So it's a heavy boating community. Um and like we stated earlier and Pam noted earlier in her conclusions, it's just it's not a
it's not a shellfish habitat. I think um our project, you know, would not would not affect that at all. >> And I just last thing I I I think, you know, we we're committed members of the community. You know, this project directly supports FAMAS economy through
our work with Michael and Pam and any local builder who may construct our modest dock. Um we think that the facts overwhelmingly support approval of this project. you know, the requirement is um that we that that we have a successful
um survey, which which we did, and we we uh respectfully ask for your approval so that we can move forward. >> Okay. Thanks, Mike. Uh Chuck, >> yes. Uh thank you. I I just I just wanted to give any opportunities uh to the family uh proponents if they had any
questions. It sounds like they don't have any specific questions for me, so I'm going to be jumping off. So, I just want to say thank you. >> Not yet. >> Thank you very much, Chuck. >> Thank you very much, Chuck. We appreciate it. >> Thank you. >> Go. >> Yeah. Just um just a comment on the
survey. I was just curious um for the scientific integrity of it. Why wasn't it done a year later at the same time? It just seems a little different that it was done two days after a full season of fishing. >> Yeah. If you see what the skeptic is,
the skeptic in me is um and if you want repeatable results in science, you do it the same time. >> Yeah, I I actually have an answer to that. Oh, sorry. I I actually have an answer to that. Um and uh so we were it
was busy season for us. We're accountants. Kind of crazy. Uh we tabled this because it was less than a half of a cohog that we didn't meet the threshold. So we're like what do we do? Tabled it out of the blue. I think it
was in February our contractor texted me. I have the text actually showed it to Megalodon and um it said hey you know Fmouth regulations might be changing. If you guys are going to apply for a dock um you might want to consider moving it
up before July 1st. So that prompted a whole another round of discussions with Mike, our engineer, and also Megalodon. So at that point, we started thinking, what's what's best to do? And I'm like, what's the earliest you can get out
here? Obviously, Pam is overseas a lot. Um, so the first available time was that May um time frame. Um, I know Jen said in the prior meeting, "Yeah, you could have just asked me, you know, if these regulations uh were going to affect
anything." Um, but we just we didn't we didn't go that route. We just went with, "Okay, let's try to get this in before July 1st, have another test done, see what that has in store for us, and see if we can get this application going." We also, um, it's a rented property. um
we have renters there. So, we have to plan for the season. We don't want to disrupt anyone that's there. So, um we knew it would be busy. We wanted to kind of get all this done before, uh the busy season of the summer. So, that was our first big rental season. So, there was a
little bit of urgency there. We weren't thinking timing of anything of effects of anything. We just we wanted to get it done. like I said that July 1 supposed supposed deadline from our contractor and then also the busy rental season. So,
>> and and also Pam, you know, Pam's, you know, she's a PhD and um I'm sure you guys know that and in marine biology and you know, she um she was okay with us doing it at that at that time. And as
far as I know, the requirement is um you know, one successful survey. I it's that that that's my understanding. It's that that we met we we met the requirement um even though we had two and just to point
it out I know in talking with with um Pam and uh Michael that there are other projects that requ that you know that do multiple surveys and uh we you know when when it passes that's the that's the one you use.
>> Oh that's interesting Mr. Frell. Thank you. >> All right. Anyone else? Jen, >> um quick question. Miss Frell, when was that text to you sent and who was it text from?
>> Um the text was from um our contractor Pete Langan. >> Oh, I know him well from your property. And when was the text sent? >> He's a great guy. >> Um let's see. Then I sent it I want to say February 19th. I have February here.
Okay. February time frame. When regulations change, Mr. and Mrs. Frell, there has to be a very public process that it goes through. There's no way the regulations would have changed from February to July. They have to be promulgated. They have to go through public hearings. They have to be um
referenced in the paper. There's a 60-day comment period. We need to address the comments we received. It goes back out to comment. So, it never would have happened in that time frame. I have one other question. Mr. Frell, you stated the second survey was done after consultation with your project
team which included Mr. Burcelli. Correct. >> That's correct. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Welcome. >> That's all I have. Mr. Chairman, >> Ronnie, >> I have a real problem with this. If we didn't have the anonymous call this, we wouldn't even be sitting here right now.
And I do not think they should have another test. How I don't know what what the cost might go. What was the cost of that? >> The the first one was uh $5,000 and the second one I believe was 3500. So it it is very expensive >> and then all the engineering costs that
to date. >> Yeah, that's I I I just think we should just move forward with this. I just totally disagree what's going on right now. That's my feeling. >> Hey Ronnie, uh Mike Bell, I haven't heard from you tonight. Unusual.
I'm ready to talk when everyone else is done. And this isn't my area of expertise, but I will I would like to say something at this moment. [clears throat] Jen just made some comments that suggested that maybe there was some um
unethical things that occurred. She basically cross-examined my client, asked specifically who on the project team advised them. I will say this, and I've said it before, check the record. When shellfish surveys are done and
performed and they exceed the thresholds, I always say that's unfortunate. You should consider doing another survey in the future. Perhaps things will change. That's what I said and I said it at the last hearing. So
any suggestion of that I've done anything that was not appropriate I take umbrage with. >> Okay Mike >> I have nothing else to say. We can do shellfish surveys over and over and over again. If we do another shellfish survey
and it's over. We could say well we'd like to do another one in six months after that. And it can go on and on and on. These are random sampling events. >> They are different every time. And it's unfortunate that the people
that performed the shelfish survey, wrote the report aren't here to speak to you. That's all I have. >> Hey, Mike. Anyone else got anything? >> Alyssa, where you
you all set? >> I don't have anything to add. Thank you. >> You're done. Are you done, Jen? >> Yeah. >> All right. What's your pleasure?
>> I'd like to make a motion to pass and move forward. >> So, you want to close the hearing, Ron? Is that what >> I do? >> Yeah. Close the hearing, take it under advisement. >> Okay. We have a motion by Ronnie, to take to um close the hearing, take it
under advisement. We have a second by Ron Driscoll. Um, anything else from the boards? Anything else from uh Mr. and Mrs. Farrell? >> Um, I just wanted to get back to Jen on
her question. Uh, it was February 18th that we got the text from our contractor [clears throat] and he states there are some new FEMA regulations that are in the works. Um, and a Falmouth conservation are also going through some changes and I believe
some of them go into effect on July 1st. Okay. >> Unfortunately, your contractor was wrong, Miss Farrell. But anyway, we're moving forward. >> We have a motion in a second. So, we're going to move this. >> Can I ask one more question? I'm sorry. Can I ask one more question?
>> Oh, this this I'm a little confused on this issue. Can we do we take multiple ones and then if one is right, we we go with that? I mean, the last meeting I asked about this and I heard that we really did have an experience with with multiple uh multiple surveys and now I
>> we've never been aware of multiple surveys before Dave. If a survey has tripped and another one is done that the commission was not provided the information >> but I hear in today's meeting that if there are multiples and there's one that's good, we go with it. I don't know if that's true. That kind
>> we've never been faced with this situation before, Dave. So, it's really going to be up to the commission. >> That's my point. It doesn't seem to jive with the the two statements from last time. And >> perhaps I can add some clarity, Mr. Chairman, if I could. >> Yeah, go ahead, Mike.
>> The original shelfish survey was done, I forget the date, several many months ago. It exceeded the threshold. The client was advised they would not regardless of what the substrate was.
It's this board's uh um purview to look at densities and if you exceed the density of one per 9 square ft, you do not approve a dock. The client was advised to reconsider doing a survey in
the future. Things might change. Uh that's exactly what they did. an anonymous source >> the whole anonymous I I don't take an this is my opinion I don't give any credence to anonymous sources I I really don't
>> well it may not but what's happened is the anonymous source has triggered this investigation and now the investigation megalodon was forthright and brought out the fact that there were two shellfish surveys because they were honest
Now we're being u scrutinized beyond uh what is uh appropriate. >> Fair enough. >> Mr. Chairman, just to clarify, >> right?
>> Just to clarify to the board, the anonymous source did not that did not trigger Officer Martinsson's investigation. Officer Martinsson received information beyond the anonymous source and we all
know the board doesn't want to deal with it. So just throw that out. >> Well, what is the information? Why can't we know what to say? >> You needed to ask Mr. Martinsson that information. >> He should have said something then. >> Yeah, someone's going to Someone's going to make >> I'm calling this I'm calling this vote. We have a We have >> Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
>> A motion and a second on the floor. Enough. So, I'm going to call a roll. Everybody's all set. Yep. >> On the commission. Right. Okay. I'm going to go ahead and call a roll. Um this is the um is to close the hearing
and take it under advisement. And >> so first up is uh Steve >> P. I >> Okay. Ron Driscoll I. >> Ronnie Bowman. >> Bowman. I
>> Dave Kent. Can't I? >> Bill Duffy. >> Duffy. No. >> Jim McGrath. I >> and Robins is an I. So, we've got um six
in favor and one against. This hearing is closed and we'll take it under advisement. >> Thank you very much. Thank you all. Good night. All right, I go back to U Thomas Turner. Right, we got that. This one was moved
out. Good chuck. Very good. So, we're going back to uh Thomas Turner, Chapoy Associates, Zero Chapoy Road, Fmouth, Mass. Uh, map parcel ID is 24600800 0 for permission.
>> Mr. Chairman, bear with me. I'm having trouble getting Mike back into attendees and then promoting. I don't know what this is doing. Alyssa, can you say if you can put Mike into attendees? Do you have that ability? You're
co-host, right? >> Who? Mike Boselli. Yeah, he's still in the panel. >> Still see him, man. [clears throat] I see him. >> Yeah, I know. I can't I can't seem to get him back into attendee attendees. >> Just hold on. His screen is frozen. There you go. >> Oh, >> there he is. >> You got it.
>> And who am I bringing over? >> Um I've got it. >> Okay. >> I'm a promo. Mr. Chairman, I'm sorry. Are you done reading that? >> No, I'm not done. >> Oh, sorry. >> Well, okay. Let me just finish reading this. for permission to reconstruct a roadway and revetment, replace the
timber bulkhead with sheep piling, add a cap to the sheet piling, reconfigure beach access, and conduct doom nourishments. All right, we're looking for Michael Sally, John Ramsey
or Jeremy Packet. Okay, so John Ramsey from Sustainable Coastal Solutions is up as well as Jeremy Packard. Hello, Jeremy. I haven't seen you in a while. From FA Engineering is up to present
their project. Same to you, John. I haven't seen you in a while either. How are you both? >> I'm doing just fine. Is everybody hear do everybody can hear me? Okay. And I I think I'm just going to go right to sharing a screen if that's okay. >> That's fine. make my life a little easier. So, I can
pull this off. Is that up there? >> It is. >> Okay. Um, so I I just want to do a quick presentation. I think it's easier uh for a project like this to to go through this uh this way. Um, so this is to reconstruct the the bulkhead along Chapo
Road. So, this is the private section of road. We're doing this for the Chapoite Associates. Um we're trying to rebuild the bulkhead and revetment. Um and I'll go through some of the reasoning that we're we're uh doing to try to improve resiliency in that area. Um as well as
to try to uh uh change the provide resiliency to the dune at the north end as well and change the access to the beach uh in that area. Uh so just a a quick thing on project history uh for uh people who aren't familiar uh in what's happened in that
area. Um obviously the town is is uh had some issues there with the beach eroding in front of the seaw wall. Um this is the area just north of there and they are also having similar problems uh with the beach uh be disappearing over time from just coastal erosion long term. Uh
the wall was or the revetment was built around the 1960s. Um over time uh the uh beach that was in front of that revetment had become eroded. uh and I would point out that the original um work and work that has been done on this
revetment in the past uh have always had the revetment above the um mean high water. So it really is only required in order of conditions. Um now with the beach having basically disappeared uh is certainly at high tide we're in a
situation where we're going to be applying for chapter 91 water quality and army corps permit as well. Um so we do have uh over time we have had some evidence of armor move stone movement and so one of the things we want to make sure is we have the ability to uh
restore this revetment and then um you know especially in 22 and 23 during those December storms they had quite a bit of overwash uh during those two December storm events and so one of the things that we're trying to do is actually improve the resiliency um and
try to reduce the amount of scour they're having. We are starting to get holes um forming underneath the roadway. And uh right now in this section, unlike the town section, we're not backed by a concrete seaw wall. We actually have a
wood bulkhead um that is buried and that is well beyond its design life and portions of have rotted out and are starting to lose some sediment from underneath the road. So I just give a a quick uh historical look. This is 1968. You can see the nice
wide beach out in front of of this area. Uh as well as fewer houses obviously. Um over time going to 1935, you can see how the beach narrows and all these pictures you see that the revetment was already in place. Um but then also going forward to now, you can obviously see that that
revetment uh you can see the the water staining on it and obviously the the water now goes up to about halfway up the revetment um during at high tide. So that's what the situation we're dealing with and so we're just trying to address some of that going forward.
Uh down in the ground, this is what it looks like. Um the picture on the top left is just showing some of the stones that have uh come out of the the revetment. Uh you don't see a lot of this except when we lose the beach, especially in the winter months. Uh this
year we've actually had a nice wide beach over the summer, which is great. Uh but we do have a tendency to uh have a a beach that is narrowed over time. At the north end there's a uh a return on the revetment. It's basically a dune up in that area. Um and there is definitely
certainly some end effect now wrapping around and that area has become eroded. You see that on the bottom left um looking from north to south that's the picture on the right. This just gives you an idea what the revetment looks like. Um, obviously the revetment when you take a look at a picture like this looks like it's in pretty good shape,
but if as we go along we see areas where where we've had some sink holes start forming. Uh, not nearly as bad as the town uh, and certainly picture at the end, the town is going through that process of trying to get out to bid so they can uh, do the repairs down in that southern section so they can get the
road back open to the two lanes. U, so what we're proposing is along a length of 670 ft. Um, and we're looking at putting a um a sheet pile wall uh to replace the bulkhead, the wood bulkhead
behind in the same place. Uh, and then adding a 32-in cap, a concrete cap to reduce the wave over topping. Uh, in front of that, we would be re reconstructing the revetment in the exact same footprint. We would not be going any further seawward than the existing revetment, and it would
basically be at the same slope. Uh so what we're really looking to do is uh add additional uh wave over topping ability so that we can reduce the amount of of uh potential damage and undermining of the roadway. Uh through
that uh concrete cap we have scuppers. The scuppers will be at space at 6 feet. Uh so it allows the roadway to drain as well. Um so the other thing is we planning on relocating the access stairs. There's an access stairway off the parking lot at
the north end uh that goes directly down the face of the rottetment. Uh we'll be moving that uh hopefully to the north end so that it does not um drop down into the intertital zone but rather drops onto that beach um that is just to the uh to the north there where we have
a dry beach at at high tide. And then uh in order to make sure that we have the same contiguous level of short of flood protection as the uh concrete cap, we're actually proposing due nourishment about 70 cubic yards at
the north end uh to bring that elevation up to about 14. This this uh the uh top of the the protection we're looking at is about 13 and a half for the the um stone cap. So that would be wrapping around the north end. And so it make
sure that we're basically protecting this entire area up to an elevation of 14. I would point out from the FEMA uh flood zone that we are still not going to be protecting from the 100red-year storm. It's really not pragmatic to do that in this case. Uh the road is is relatively low. Um and obviously
Butler's Bay gets extremely high storm surge. So we are not uh really have the ability to protect to that level. But what we are trying to do is reduce potential damage from uh you know typical winter storms and obviously as the sea level rises uh to protect even
from minor storms as time goes on. And uh a last statement there is also within this we would also be uh resurfacing the road again just to to make sure that any minor drainage uh certainly uh we want to make sure that is that the scuppers are effective and
be able to drain the road properly. Uh obviously the roads had some settlement over time over the years so we uh the resurfacing would be necessary. Uh just from a plan view uh again you guys have the plans I it's kind of hard
to see at this scale. Um but the uh the dune is this the small feature up the north end that dune enhancement and the walkway um would also be uh shifted back here. So this is a moi mat um rolled out
seasonally and that would be have um sand fence on either side of it so people would not be wandering into the dune. Um and then the staircase would be down the face of the revetment. Uh there was an error in my narrative um where we had talked about a stone staircase. Um
it it has actually been changed to wood that was at the the client's request. It's something they they feel that they can maintain more easily. Uh but that is is something we're originally thinking of building a stone staircase into the into the revetment, but the the client decided to go with wood. I think from a standpoint of of uh longevity. It's uh
you know the the stone would have lasted longer, especially on the but the wood is is certainly a lot cheaper to replace if they if they need to make any modifications. Um and I'll talk a little bit more about staircase in in a minute. Uh these are just the cross-sections. Uh
I should say that cross-section AA is through the dune section which would be the top one and then cross-section B BB is is through the the um uh revetment in in front of the roadway. And so the the
top cross-section is is just that cross-section of of the revetment. And I will say that the sheet pile is not going to be extend into that dune area at the north end. The sheet pile ends at the end of pavement. Uh so we are not proposing to have the sheep pile behind the revetment going up into that dune
area. Uh we're just proposing to replace the the existing revetment in kind. Um and then have an elevated dune behind that to provide the flood protection up at that north end. Um, and then further south, uh, you'd see the cross-section
that I showed before with the, um, revetment, uh, sheet pile driven in behind it and then the, u concrete cap, 32-in concrete cap on top of that to reduce wave over topping. Uh, resource areas. Um, obviously we we
are impacting uh, uh, resource areas in a, you know, potentially significant manner. We're trying to keep that uh these uh impacts uh as minor as we can. Uh there certainly coastal beach and coastal dune in this area. The entire area is uh a barrier beach.
Um and the existing revetment is classified as a um coastal bank. It's as I said we're we're restoring or or replacing 670 ft of revetment. Um and then the entire project area is in land
sub coast storm flowage. We are certainly within the flood zone. Um and so including the roadway that's 32,000 square ft. Um and so you you get an idea of the the level resources areas we are impacting. One thing I will point out about coastal beach that is really
temporary impacts uh having to do with just the excavation required to place the tow. uh the material would be um after the the tow stones are replaced, the beach material would be put over in the same form on top of the structure so that the any coastal beach impacts are
temporary. Uh so I'm not going to go into this in great detail. Uh but I did want to at least touch on on the resource areas a little bit more. As I just mentioned about the coastal beach resource area, it is um just a temporary impact. Um the
existing revet mint is considered a coastal bank. Um we are actually in the the concept of of 310 CMR and and the the wetland bylaws. We're certainly improving the flood resiliency here. So we're looking at this as an improvement
to the the coastal beat uh coastal bank flood protection uh with that 32-in concrete cap. And the same goes for the coastal dune at the north end. uh by elevating the dune uh we're providing additional uh flood protection. Uh we
also believe that it's a good idea uh to move the the access the the access to of the beach uh rather than having it go down the face of the revetment uh into the water at high tide. of moving that access with uh u this uh pedestrian
walkway, sand fencing and uh vegetation on the dune um to the the backside there and and allowing that access to go across that that dune area to the north. Um and again this is all subject land
subject to coastal storm flowage. Um but again uh we are doing our best to improve the the flood protection of this area. uh to the extent that we can. Um one of the problems that we run into obviously is under the the uh bylaw if
we're in a VE zone, which we are, um you know, we need to consider a two-ft elevation per 100 years uh into the project design, it is really something that is uh not possible. similar to the the town roadway further south. Um we
are uh kind of um pinned by our our elevation to not really be able to increase the the elevation of the road which without having massive impacts to resource areas. Um and so you know we are sort of stuck with the elevation
that we have of the roadway. Uh so any improvements we can do are are going to be kind of pragmatic within within our ability. Um, and so it's hard for us to uh, you know, again, do shore protection to a level that is going to withstand
the impacts from a 100red-year storm today, let alone uh, something uh, going in the future with 2 ft of sea level rise. Um, so again, it's really the intent to just improve the situation the best we can. Um so that's what what we
went with uh a uh again a cap a concrete cap that is approximately is 32 in. It will change a little bit depending on the elevation of the roadway. Um but it's it is going to be a 32-in concrete cap that is that is going to um provide
basically a level of protection up to the height of a of a typical guard rail. Um so that's that's where we're at as as far as what we can accomplish. Uh, some questions came up and I want to make sure that I address uh, all of the staff's comments. U, one of the
questions had to do with staging area. I'd like to point out the staging area that we're planning on using is is there's a parking area right at the north end and we're planning to use that as our staging area. I would also like to point out that as the contractor's moving along building the revetment, um it's likely that some of the material
would be stored on the road where the equipment is sitting uh as they're as they're working down. And so it it will be um a situation where we would be closing a lane or the road as we're moving along uh constructing this revetment.
Uh, but I also like to point out, so this a little more of a closeup. Uh, you can see the the dune uh that we're proposing uh connects in with the with the end of the project, end of the uh the cap and wraps around uh to make sure that we have contiguous basically 14t
elevation protection going through there. And this walkway would uh it would basically go over the the top of that. This is is up at uh 15 16 feet in this area where we'd be coming off and then down and over the uh 14 foot dune.
Um and then again I'll talk about the stairs in a second just uh because questions came up about that as well. Um so this is just a a photo of the parking area just so you can get kind of the the scale. There is quite a bit of room there for lay down of of equipment and material. Uh so uh we're not really
concerned that we're going to be uh strapped for space as far as having a staging area that is up on a paved surface. Um so just a a quick on the wood stairs. We're planning on doing something similar to what the wood stairs are now. Um where there'll be a platform at the
top and then piles at the bottom and the stringers going all the way uh connecting the two. So there's actually no um connection of the staircase to the revet bin itself. Uh so it be a again a platform at the top you know with piles
and then a uh uh piles at the bottom and then stringers attaching the two. And if you go out and look at the staircase that's that's the way it is now. Uh even though it looks like there's piles that are on uh on top of that revetment those are actually not that's actually not sitting on the revetment. It's kind of
can levered over. And this is uh what it looks like from the other end. Uh and so this this uh up here is there's no pile here. Um that is actually the bottom of that is actually attached right to the right to the side of the stringer. So that's what we're
planning on doing. So we're not uh it makes it easier to replace if anything happens to it. But again uh you know in this picture you know the beach looks nice and wide today. Uh but this is even you know gets wet at high tide. If we move it around the corner we're up at about a foot and a half above the annual
high tide line. Uh so that uh staircase should be much more uh able to survive uh any of these storms. And again, it's also tucked around the north side. So a lot of the storms that we get this area that are creating the biggest waves are coming from the south anyways. So that would be a more
protected area as well. Uh so I just wanted to touch on the other staff comments as well as the letter that we got from DMF. Um so there was a a comment about refueling, making sure we're not doing it on site. Uh we we are planning doing re refueling and staging area, but we uh in accordance
with the DMF letter and any recommendation from the the commission uh you know we would look at at making sure we have adequate adequate containment and cleanup material uh to make sure that we're minimizing any potential impacts, but we would be uh asking for permission to try to um have
refueling done to the staging area. Uh obviously we would uh work outside the time of year restriction for horseshoe crab which is May 1st to July 31st according to DMF. Um so that's that's not an issue whatsoever and we won't would not store any armor stones on the
beach. Um one of the things that was in the letter uh indicated not storing them in the intertital zone. Uh obviously, you know, the revetment's in the inner title zone. So we we may be storing some rocks on the revetment itself, but we would not be putting any stones uh within any anywhere outside the
footprint of the existing revetment. Um so the other thing is there's uh any time we're down on the beach, we're not working uh when the water is up. We would only be working when the when they're in on the dry beach. So uh that
uh is something that the DMF asked for as well. Um question about the dune enhancement. Um you know it was asked whether dune nourishment or uh dune restoration. It is dune nourishment. I mean we are building a new dune there. Um just elevating the the existing dune.
Um and the the quantity is 68 cubic yards. Uh and then about planting we certainly uh would be planting that. Right now the dune is planted up there. Uh it looks like it's it's probably about an 18inch center. Um we would uh certainly work with the conservation
agent to refine the planning plan and certainly meet whatever requirements are there. Uh but we would plan on certainly planting that dune once it's built. Um and then uh the construction access uh we're not planning on doing construction
access through the dune at the north. We'd be doing it down the face of the revetment. So as we're uh deconstructing the revetment, that would be the the access. So we're we're not proposing any access going to the to the north of the project. Um the only work that would be being done in that existing dune area up
there would be the the the dune nourishment itself. Um and then there was a question about barges. We were not planning on using any barges or any inwater equipment. So this would all be being done from the land. Um and then the the question about scuppers. I think they answered that, but we're planning
on every six feet along the concrete cap uh to make sure there's adequate drainage of the roadway uh both during rainstorms and with any wave over topping. And with that, I'd love to open it to questions and I can leave the presentation up if you prefer or I can take it down.
>> Um would you take it down, John? >> Yeah. >> Did you have I'm sorry, Jen. Did you have something? >> It's okay, Mr. Chairman. John, can you put it back up real quick and go [laughter] to Sorry. and go to the to the slide you had showing the staging
area. >> Yes. Okay. >> That one. >> Okay. Right there. So, >> you're saying that you're not going to have any equipment on the dune itself. How are you going to do that revetment
if the pavement stops? So you're going to have to bring the machine onto that dune area. Correct. >> We I mean we would do that from that part of it would would likely be we'd either be in the footprint of the revetment working back or on the beach itself. So we would but we're trying >> on the beach itself.
>> Yeah. So yeah. So we're Yeah. >> Do you have enough room on the beach? How are you going to get down on the beach? >> Well, we're going to get down on the beach from from the revetment face. So I mean and so basically we're going to be taking the revetment apart. So, you know,
>> uh, so we've talked with, uh, >> uh, who was the contractor? We talked with, uh, >> Dale Briggs. >> Yeah, Dale Briggs. So, Dale Briggs has looked at this and that's the way he's planning on on on doing this. So, that's was actually taking the revetment apart
as we're moving and uh, actually being able to do much of the work from the top, but also maybe needing to have some access down at the base. Is he going to build a sand ramp over the revetment to get his equipment down? >> He's either partially possibly partially sand ramp and partially uh with the with
the material he's bringing in to re build a revetment under layer, etc. that he can that he can use and reuse as he as he moves along. >> Oh, I see. >> That man is low enough you could kind of just drive right off or close to it. Drive right off the roadway itself. And
so he'll dismantle >> we're aware [laughter] that road right and uh Yeah. H h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h h hince the concrete cap uh the same height as a as a guardrail. Um but you know, he'll he'll dismantle those stones and and rearrange them a bit to allow himself to drive right off and then likely go at an angle rather
than going straight down the revetment. You know, build himself an angle uh you know to get >> build himself a road. Got it. Got it. Right. You he'll build himself a road, get down there, go around that corner, rebuild it back. Yep. And and keep it keep in mind that that corner when you get to is is
dry beach at all all phases of the tide when you when you get to the end there to the the north end. >> Okay. >> Okay. So a lot of our my questions John a lot of our questions are focused more on the dune and not on the the revetment
or the wall or anything like that. We know it has to happen. Um it's going to tie into the towns. It's going to offer better protection of the road. um the cap not only for coastal resiliency. I'm really surprised nobody's driven right off that road
>> in all the years that I've been in Falmouth. So um >> you know I have actually no concerns about the rebetment. We we were more focused excuse me on the dune um the the the two access stair point.
So there's two still you're proposing two access stairs. >> No, we're going to remove we're going to remove the stair on the front side. the the the existing stair is going to be gone. >> Okay. So, that's going to be gone. And you're only going to do the one that's attached to the the path through the dune that you have the MOI mat on.
>> Correct. >> Okay. So, through the dune, the board usually just allows a 4ft wide path. Um so, the MOI mat would have to be cut um to fit within that. >> Yep. >> Okay. Um the there was some language in
there about ADA compliance. There's no ADA compliance when you get to that staircase. I mean, they're ADA compliant for the the the path, but then they have no way to get down the stairs. So, it's it's really not for it's not
true ADA access >> and it doesn't have to be because this is a private road. So, it's not we do we don't have that issue. Um, I think that people, you know, when when we were talking to the residents, they were concerned about uh you know, Some of
them are a little bit elderly and they just want to make sure that they can get down the stairs. That's one of the reasons why they push back on the on the stone stairs. They, you know, were afraid of falling and slipping and they'd rather fall in wood than stone. I I So, you know, we don't blame them.
>> I I got that. So, you know, we went through a lot of that. So, but I think that they want it just to to make sure that they are not having to climb up and over things and and so we worked with the elevations to make it, you know, pretty relatively level path to get to the top of the stairs. And if that's as
far as they can get, then that's that's where we're at. >> Okay. Okay. So, we got the stairs, we got the dune. Obviously, you're going to have compatible sand. You'll plant it in accordance with order of conditions.
We've figured out where your staging is. There is no barge. That's great because I don't know where you would have come out of [laughter] because you're not coming out of West Falmouth. That's for sure. We had one project do that and town's not going to be allowing
the use of that boat ramp anymore for uh Revetman projects. That's for sure. Um >> I don't think I'd ever propose that ramp for revetment. [laughter] >> Sorry. >> You'd be surprised, John. Um,
sand. You're going to work within the time of year restriction and work in the dry sand only. Yeah, I think really our our question is more focused on like what what are you doing to the dune? Why are you doing it
to the dune since the dune is fairly stable right now? So, you're just bringing up that elevation. >> We're bringing up that elevation. It really is that area that that we're going, you know, building the dune on is really just that flat kind of that flat area that you see up there with that's, you know, kind of got a little bit of
struggling beachrass, but it's it's certainly been planted. Um, but, you know, I think, yeah, bringing the elevation up so it's more contiguous with the with the higher part of the dune that's further north, I think, is is probably going to work better. But at the same time, we want to make sure that we're tying in with that elevation of our cap so that the water just doesn't
flood in at that end. >> Okay. Okay. That makes that makes more sense. Russell, did that agree with you? I know you and I were talking about that today. >> Okay. >> Yep. >> Okay, perfect. Um, that's all I have. I
mean, we knew this was coming, John. It's ties in with the rest of the road project. I mean, I've been with you every step of the way as we've marched down that road. So, >> yeah, >> we were eventually going to come to the end. [laughter] >> Well, I don't know. I I got a feeling
the town's going to have to work all this stuff back. [laughter] All right, we'll see. >> Great. That's all I have, Mr. Chairman. >> Thank you, John. Uh Alyssa, do you have anything? >> Uh nothing at this time. Thank you. >> Um first up, Steve,
>> you're you're muted, Steve. >> Steve, you're muted. >> That's why my battery is running low. Okay. Um, I don't have any additional questions. The site wasn't marked. We flagged three other projects for not being marked, but
um, everybody understood where the project was, I'm sure. So, that really wasn't the issue, but it's just technicality. I think this has to be done. I appreciate this community doing this work. I I I do. So, I'm all for it.
Thank you, Steve. Ron Driscoll, >> I think it's a great project. I know the details take a long time to put together. The question, how does this match up with the the work that Falmouth did? >> Um, I I will say that this is providing better flood protection than what the town is proposing. Um, you know, the
town is really struggling with financially to try to make that work. They they were uh we did talk about a concrete cap for that, but right now they just they really want to get the road open um and get things repaired for now. But I think at some point I think they will as kind of alluded to to Jen
that I think they may be chasing that the elevation that we're providing back south because I think they're going to need it. >> All right. So this is you're doing more work than than Felmouth has done and they're going to have to try and catch up if they want to keep the road open eventually. Part of the resiliency
projects. All right. Thank you. That's all. >> Thanks, Ron. Ronnie, >> yeah, it's been an ongoing problem down there, that's for sure. Um, definitely needs to get done. I think you got a good plan in place. Um, the town probably has to step it up, but I definitely the funding is an issue
there, but I've seen a lot of erosion down on their end in the past. So, I think bringing the height up a little bit if you could on the on the north end's a good idea. So, good luck with it. >> Y, thanks for Dave. >> Hey, John. Can you tell me a little more
about uh with up there where the dune starts, the the the cement cap stops, right? Um and I guess the the the raised dune is going to help with flood. Is that is that correct? Is >> that's correct. I I I should say there's a slight return. There's about a 10 foot
return on the on the seaw wall cap that runs back um along the edge of the parking lot and and so that's where the dune is going to connect in. So it's so so we don't have a weak spot. And so yeah, so the so the dune is going to be about six inches higher than the cap of the seaw wall.
>> Even higher. >> Yeah. Yeah. Right. Right at the revetment. Will it climb up to that in as it goes further inland? It's not going to be that high right at the revetment, is it? >> It's going to be it's going to be right up against the at that point. It's going to be right up against the cap at the end. So So the cap wraps around at the
end of the you know, so uh when you get to the north end of the parking area. >> Yeah. the cap wraps back 10 feet at >> to the east. >> And then so that's where the the dune is going to connect into that, you know,
that uh that return on on the uh the cap >> kind of act like a retaining wall for it kind of. Is that what you're getting at? >> Yes. So it's going to Yeah. So it's going to hold the the dune right up against the cap. So So you there's obviously there's going to have to be a grading up of about six inches pretty quickly there, but but yeah. So that so
the the the dune elevation can basically run right up against >> and I guess I'm still a little unclear on on the overall reason to need to have that higher dune. >> Uh so what we're looking to do is so you know one of the one of the things that we um are trying to make sure of is is
that we're not creating a weak spot in the the flood protection. So if everything is about the same elevation, we're good shape. If we're going about six inches higher for a dune, you know, the dune is obviously much more roadable than than the concrete cap. So, we want to make sure we have a little bit of extra buffer
>> there. A little >> a little bit of extra elevation buffer. >> Can you guys hear me? Okay. Am I >> Mhm. >> Okay. Um, so yeah. So, just trying to get in a little bit of of extra volume and elevation buffer there so that we can uh make sure that we don't have have
to repair that dune constantly if we are getting more storms uh in the future as as time goes on. So, it's it seems to me sand's not cold not going to hold up very well to a storm, is it? Going to just wash away. It >> But because that's on the north end, um, you know, and most of the storms we get
are from the south, yeah, it's it's much much more likely to to withstand uh the environment. >> Thank you. Thank you. >> No problem. >> All right. Thanks, Dave. Bill, >> I have no questions, Mr. Chairman. >> Thank you, Jim.
>> About uh Yes. Uh John about how long will this project take? >> That's a really good question. Um so that one of one of the things that we are in the process of is is we you know we need to get our permits in place but you know this is something that they need to raise money for to make this
happen. So the project certainly can be done easily in one season but it's it's debatable whether they are going to be able to get all the money together to do all of this at once. So that's that's one of the things that we're going to, you know, that they're going to have to deal with as far as finances go. But I
but you know, the the scale of the project is easy to do within one season. >> Yeah, having uh having lived there the last six months, I I can attest to it certainly is needed. >> Good luck. >> Thank you.
>> Thanks, Jim. All right. Um, Jen, do we have we got enough to close this? >> If the board doesn't have any additional questions, yes. I mean, all the questions from the staff were answered. Again, our main concerns, we've been
doing this this entire road length. Our main concerns were more what were what was going on with that dune area. Um, >> I think that's >> So, yeah, we're going to do one staircase wood. We'll reduce the the path to four feet. They'll have to cut
the moi mat. We'll get it planted. And as far as the revetment and the p the sheeting go, I mean again, we've done this this entire length of road. This section does need to be done. >> All right.
>> What's your pleasure? >> Driscoll >> Duffy second. >> Thank you very much. We have a motion and a second to close it here and take it under advisement. Is there any more comments or questions from the board? Hearing none. Jen, anything in chat in regards to this?
>> Nothing in regards to this hearing, Mr. Chairman. >> Thank you. So, I'm going to call the role. Um, Steve, >> Patton, I Ron >> Disclly, >> Ronnie,
>> Bman, I, >> Steve, >> Pente, >> Bill, >> Duffy, I, >> Jim, >> Grath, I, >> and Robins is an I. So unanimous the hearing is closed and take it under advisement. >> Thank you very much. >> Appreciate it.
>> Thanks John. That's very helpful. >> Thank you John. Thank you Jeremy. Nice to see you both again. >> Take care. >> Happy holidays. >> You too. >> All right. The next three in a row there
are all continued and we're going to 436 Acapesca Road. Um, Peter and Jennifer Herren, 436 Acapesca Road, found with Mass permission to install a vinyl sheet pile.
Uh, Jen. >> Yes, Mr. Chairman. I am promoting Jake Krookie from Capen Islands Engineering to pro uh present his projects. >> Hey, good evening, Jake. All right,
start my video. Here I am. >> There you are, Jake. >> There you are, Jake. >> There you are. >> Technology is uh it's our friend. Um, okay. So, uh, good evening. Uh, for the record, my name is Jake Furky. I'm professional land surveyor with Caven
Islands Engineering representing Peter Harren for a project on Aapesc Road. We've filed notice of intent application to repair an existing uh sheet pile bulkhead, a wood p bulkhead and we understand that a D number has not been
issued. Uh and we are hoping that you'll allow us to complete this presentation tonight and tonight and then uh vote at uh a successive hearing once that number has been issued um without additional representation from our office. This is
a fairly uh straightforward project. We don't really expect um a lot of issues here. Um and with your permission, I would like to share my screen. >> Please do. Okay. You should now be able to see uh to see my screen. This is a uh this is a
property. If you see this locust map on the the southerntherly end of Aapesca Road near where Manant Road crosses Green Pond, um the uh the the plan here is north is to the left. Um so this uh
this [clears throat] this is a developed parcel. Um the surrounding resources on this include land under the ocean and land containing shellfish of Green Pond itself. Then there is a salt marsh uh on the northerly end of the property and
then some additional salt marsh behind this sheet pile bulkhead and extending further south and then there is a coastal bank uh there's a rip wrap and then a bank above it leading to the upland portion of the lot. Uh this also
is in the uh the flood zone AE15 and AE12 and the limwall line is that uh the transition from AE15 to AE12. Uh this is a 30,000ish square foot
property uh which has an existing uh rip wrap and dock and bulkhead and those items are currently in the process of being permitted through chapter 91. They've been in existence for a long time, but the the permit was never
completed. That has been submitted to the state, and we're just waiting for final approval on that. Um, now what we're doing is we're proposing to uh remove and replace the the um well, not
remove, but to uh to to place some existing vinyl, new vinyl in front of this existing timber retaining wall here. Um that timber retaining wall will remain in place uh because we feel like that is the least impactful uh thing to
do considering there is a a substantial and healthy salt marsh directly behind that sheet pile wall. The existing bulkhead will be cut flush with the adjacent grade once the new vinyl is installed and all gaps between the
proposed bulkhead and the existing will be filled with clean compatible sand. Um, this this bulkhead is in really poor condition, particularly in this area by the dock. The boards uh are failing. There's holes through it. Um, and it is
really uh it's it's it's going downhill fast. Um, and the the the wall here provides a nice amount of protection uh to to the upland portion of the lot and the client is interested in retaining that protection.
It also affords some protection to this to this piece of the salt marsh itself. Um, I'll address the the staff comments that we received. Uh, the first staff comment is uh related to what I alluded to that the D number hasn't hasn't been
issued. This project was unfortunately erroneously filed under MASHP instead of Falmouth and a MASHP D number was issued but since this is not in MASHP uh we're waiting for a corrected file number to be issued and hopefully this uh that
will happen soon. Uh staff uh requests a pre-construction meeting to review the limit of work. Uh that's totally expected and very reasonable in a situation like this. uh staff requests nonCCA treated materials be used. We did
note on our plan that uh non-leing wood preservatives would be used and obviously CCA is is not going to be on the list of things that we're proposing for this project. And the last comment uh was in relation to the benefit of this work. um the the bulkhead is
failing and the client really wants to repair it and um and and have it, you know, look good and perform its function for, you know, a long time into the future. Um this this bulkhead provides protection to the upland portion of the
lot, but it also provides additional protection to this intervening salt marsh uh here. uh and there was a question of what would happen if uh if the bulkhead was removed and we believe that the salt marsh would would erode
away. There's there's no salt marsh on the north side of this dock here and um there is significant and healthy salt marsh behind the bulkhead and so the bulkhead is really protecting that that piece of salt marsh there. Um, we
believe that this project uh complies with the found wetland bylaw and is consistent with previously approved projects. At this point, I'll stop sharing my screen and be happy to answer any questions. >> All right, Jake. Thank you, Jen. Jake, that bulkhead, does it go
perpendicular like under the dock from like the revetment up to where we can see on the plan >> the the the bulkhead? >> It No, it does not. It ends ends where Yeah, it's open on the side and so the
the the sea flushes through there. >> The sea flushes through there. Okay. Um >> on the on the north side, right? >> Correct. Yeah. Under the dock. Yeah. >> Under the dock and on the on the other side. Does it connect to the to the revetment at all? >> Does it connect to the revetment? Um I
can let me I can share my screen again and give you a a zoom in here. >> Yeah. My context. >> Um the this it ends um it ends right you know
like halfway. let's say to the to the to the revetment. It ends right here. Um and just sort of in the middle of the salt marsh once it gets high enough upland and then mean high water extends out from there. >> Okay. Is it currently losing elevation
the salt marsh? uh over here uh this the salt marsh is eroding and I think that that's at least partially due to the holes which are punching through this portion of the bulkhead in this area >> and then is there any uh plan in that
area to plant salt marsh plugs to kind of help the salt marsh if the if the whole if the the idea is to protect the salt marsh are we going to be adding some salt marsh plugs in that area um to
enhance the existing salt marsh. >> That is not something that we're currently proposing, but I I don't think the client would be opposed to it. >> So, it could be conditioned to to enhance that area of salt marsh. >> Yes. And I I mean I I think that
>> they don't use that area currently, do they? >> Uh no, they don't they don't use it. Uh we have a there's a there's an RDA which has been approved to uh to provide the required access steps on this side. There there are no current access steps
there but uh for uh chapter 91 requirements a set of steps will be installed on the south side of the pier. Um and uh but but currently the access is all on the north side. >> Okay. Okay. It just we usually don't see
I don't think I've ever seen a project that's like with maybe one other one with a salt marsh behind an actual revetment. >> So I'm interested to see what DP's
technical comments were. Do you know if they had any technical comments when they issued the number erroneously to MASHP? Uh I don't um I don't know. They they I I think that they commented that uh that
it that it needed to be uh addressed by chapter 91, but uh it it has been addressed at chapter 91 and we're just waiting still. >> Okay. Okay. Again, it's like you're you're kind of pinching that salt marsh in between
this revment this revment. We replace the exist. I mean this bulkhead and this rev that meant we replace the existing bulkhead. The water's still going to get behind there.
>> Yeah. I mean no no changes in elevation behind the bulkhead are, you know, proposed or being done. It's just the the thing is falling down and it looks like hell. And um the client just purchased the property and is looking to
to to to rectify the situation. >> And I'm assuming if we remove it, it would erode away much faster because sea level is rising much faster. >> Definitely. >> It's an interesting one, Jake. It really is. And you're not raising the elevation
of the top of that. It's going to be at set at the same elevation it is right now. Forgive me if you've already stated that. >> Uh let's see. Um let's see. We're saying that the uh
the top of the wall is at uh elevation 2.2. Uh the proposed wall is at 2.2. Um I uh I don't know uh specifically Raul did
all of the design and engineering work on this. Uh I don't know if it is the same. I assume it is similar. >> Can you provide us that information while we wait for the D number? You can send us a quick email.
>> Uh oh, I I take that back. Uh it is it is taller. Uh, as you can see, uh, oh, you you don't you you can't see my screen. Um, >> oh yeah. >> Uh, let's see. Uh, yes. So, this this uh
here what you're seeing is the uh the existing bulkhead cross-section. Um it and it uh it's the top of the existing is at elevation 1.5 and the proposed is at elevation 2.2. So
it is uh uh six seven in higher 8 in higher. >> And I think >> say that again. >> Why is it higher? Why is it six to seven inches higher? to uh account for continued sea level
rise. It's the the the current elevation. Um the extreme high tide is is is right at the top of the wall. Um and and the and so the the new design provides some resiliency against that
over topping. >> Okay. >> Yeah, I see it. >> Yeah. Okay. Thank you, Jake. >> Yes, >> that's all I have, Mr. chairman. >> Thank you. >> Uh Elissa, >> no comments. Thank you. >> Okay. Um Ron Driscoll,
>> no comments other than that was a pretty scary set of stairs going down to the dock. >> Good luck with it. Thanks. [laughter] >> Ronnie, >> no comment. >> All set. >> Y I'm all good.
>> No comments. >> Steve, >> no comment. Thank you. >> So Jim, we're looking at a continuence for the um DMF and DB D. >> Correct. We don't have DMF or DEP.
>> Um Jake, how long do you think it's going to take to get at least both of those in two weeks? One week? Uh yeah, I I I can't speak for the for the state of Massachusetts, but I can't uh I I I
can't honestly imagine that they're particularly fast. Uh the >> uh I I guess um I would prefer it to be uh two weeks because I have a different hearing which I will need to be
attending then anyway. And >> okay, >> I don't I don't expect much discussion, but that makes sense to me. >> Okay, so December 17th. >> Yes. >> Okay, you got it. >> Hey, can I get a motion to continue
until December 17th? >> Yeah, I'm so moved. Driscoll >> second, Duffy. >> Thank you, Bill. We a motion, a second to continue this hearing till December 17th. Any other comments or questions from the board? Jen, was there anything
in the chat you need to be aware of? >> Nothing in the chat regarding this project, Mr. Chairman. >> Very good. So, we have a motion to second and I'm going to go ahead and call the role. Uh Steve >> Patton I
>> Chris I [snorts] >> Bill >> Duffy I >> Jim >> McGrath I >> and Robins is unanimous continue until December. >> Thank you Jake. >> Certain way.
>> Thank you. >> All right. >> Hi Jake. >> Thanks Jake. >> I'm the next one also. Oh, yeah. That's right. You are. Sorry. >> All right. David, >> Mr. Chairman, can you repeat that? On my
end, we're very, very garb and I'm not quite sure that was caught in the record. >> Okay. The whole thing. You missed the whole thing. >> Marissa Weise and David from 26 Buzzards
Bay A Woods Hole Mass for permission to construct an addition and install mitigation plantings. >> Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And Jake Fricky Capen Islands Engineering continues to
be with us this evening. Uh once again, uh good evening. For the record, my name is Jake Fricky. I'm professional land surveyor with Cape and Islands Engineering, and I'm representing Marissa and David Weidman Weiss and David Freeman for a project on Buzzards
Bay Avenue in F in Woods Hole. Uh we've uh filed notice of intent application, which does have a D file number 255118 to construct a small addition and install the associated mitigation plantings. And with your permission
chairman I would like to share my screen. >> Please do. [clears throat] >> All right. Which are you seeing my whole screen or just part of it? >> Half of it. Like part of it. So, is that any better?
>> No. >> The top. >> We're just seeing the north part of the compass. >> Let's see. And now you can see my whole screen. [laughter] All right, one more try here. What the hell?
Okay, I think that is uh that's what we wanted. Sorry about that. Uh so this is uh this is a project um which is being proposed on a developed parcel along Buzzards Bay
Avenue just um a few houses north of Quisit A. The surrounding resources include a uh bordering vegetated wetland uh just to the west off of the lot, a a coastal bank that runs up the the
westerly half of the lot and land subject to coastal storm flu which includes the AE13 and AE15 down here and then the whole developed portion of the lot is in uh zone X. This project uh is on proposed on a
parcel that it contains about 15,700 square feet. Uh the existing development on the lot includes a dwelling and the associated walls, walkways, lawn, and a title 5 septic system. Um and as I said,
this stuff is this is all on the easterly portion of the lot as the westerly portion of the lot is is entirely coastal bank. Um the proposed work is is focused on the northerly side of the house. Uh and it is to remove the
existing small deck and uh storage. It's a unit which is attached to the building and the rinse station and uh some walls and steps and to remove the concrete walkway out front. And
uh and then to instru install a new sort of reformatted uh addition and deck with rinse station and some uh some hardscape walls on uh and steps in this vicinity here.
Uh we're showing a limit of work which encompasses this uh northerly portion of the lot and runs out into Spring Street. Uh and then around this way we're also showing uh one dry well as required to catch the runoff from this new uh this
new work here. This uh this work results in an increase in imperous areas in the FWR 10.18A zone of 73 square ft and a decrease in imperous areas and FWRB zone
of 29 square ft. uh we're showing a 900 or 197 square feet of mitigation in this area here uh to compensate for that proposed work. Uh this mitigation is uh is landward of
a former limit of work line from a 1995 order of conditions which uh which I'll zoom in a little bit so that you can see which runs across the lot in this area. Um so uh I will address the the staff
comments that we received on November 26th. Uh there is a request to remove the fifth mitigation planting note um which which is uh to that the plants are to be maintained in good health and replaced
as needed for three growing seasons. Uh obviously the intent is that these plants are to be maintained in perpetuity not just for three growing seasons. Uh and that's uh we can we can do that on a on a revised plan. Uh staff also
notes that the HVAC platform shown here um in addition to a freestanding AC unit which is right here uh were installed without conservation approval and will need to be mitigated for uh we've prepared some calculations for these two
items and uh if we add in the additional square footage in the A and B zone associated with that it brings uh the total required mitigation area up to 276 square ft from 197. Um, this mitigation
area can be partially fit in to the north of the existing proposed area here and then the remainder of it tucked up into this corner right here. Um these locations are basically the only
available places outside of 10 feet from the existing structures that are within the Azone uh on the lot. Um and and those mitigation areas that additional square footage and the AC unit here uh
can be added to the updated plan as well. Uh staff has asked uh some questions about uh about an existing private hedge uh that is that exists up in this area sort of underneath the the bearing and distance
line that's sort of out in the road and does come across the property line a little bit. It's about 13 ft long. Um, and the intention is for that hedge to remain in its entirety uh through this project uh as it provides a a very nice
privacy screen from the neighbors that are directly across Spring Street. Um that that hedge again can be can be added to a final plan. It but it is about right there. Um and the last comment is uh in relation to the
clearing outside of this limit of work line here um from the 1995 order of conditions. uh and the the the client does indeed have a raspberry garden uh which is on the bank in this area and uh we would just like to better understand
uh staff's uh comment on that area and uh I would also like to note that the field crew located something in this area that they thought might have been grapes but upon further discussion with the contractor and uh site visits I
think that that was actually porcelain berry and is not actually uh any kind of a development and it's just got porcelain berry growing all over it. Uh just like much of uh much of the rest of this slope going both north and south.
Um we believe that uh this project complies with Felmouth wetland bylaw and is consistent with previously approved projects. While there are some minor changes that are required to this plan to meet staff comments, we hope that this hearing can be closed tonight with the understanding that an updated plan
showing these changes um as noted will can be submitted prior to the vote. Um and and if uh if you would like, I have a draft copy of the plan which identifies that larger area of mitigation in in these two zones and shows the actual location of that uh
hedge. So without further ado, I will stop sharing my screen. All right. Thank you, Jake. Uh, Jen, >> yes, Jake. Uh, we met out there several months ago. It's a pretty tight site. Um, so I'm kind of concerned where you're going to add the mitigation for
that platform. I mean, we were struggling to find areas for mitigation for the proposed project. Um, so we're going to have to go out back out there and evaluate the the these these new areas.
um for mitigation. Um as far as more information on what we mean about the bank, I'm going to kick that over to Alyssa cuz she's the one that did the deep dive into this property. There's, you know, you you know the his excuse me, the history of
the project. The board does not or the history of the property. Um so Alyssa can offer a little bit more insight on that. And um I think that's all I have. How much more mitigation are you going
to have to put in there for that for that platform? >> The the total the total increase is about uh 80 square feet. >> In mitigation or 80 square feet. Yeah. In mitigation. >> In in mitigation. Yeah. >> Okay.
>> And yeah, it's 80 square feet on top of what was proposed. uh what was it goes from 197 to 276. >> Okay. And we were struggling with the 197 to get it in there. So,
>> as I as I indicated, I've got a I've got a sketch of it showing how I'm how I'm showing it if you want to see it. >> Um I don't think it's necessary right now. We'll have to continue this so we can go out and evaluate those planting areas. Usually, if it was just all lawn,
I rarely wouldn't have an issue. we just add the mitigation on. But because this site we were struggling so um you know it was difficult in the field then uh I we need to go back and evaluate it. Um
but I'm going to kick the other your other question about more information about what we mean on the bank over to Alyssa if you don't mind Mr. Chairman. >> Please do Alyssa. >> Go. >> Yeah. So I mean Jake, we gave you all the information that we had on that. Um, the board doesn't entirely know what I'm
talking about at this moment. So, during the interim, I can certainly send you over our previous plans. Um, when the house was constructed in 95, there were some issues with the limit of work. Um, there was a certain buffer that was to be [snorts] maintained and it didn't
look like it was. We also have a record on file from an enforcement in 2015. We don't have a lot of information. I'm not sure where some of the the word documents went. Um but it referred to unpermitted clearing again behind the home. Um we also received a draft plan
in the beginning of this year from the contractor when they were asking questions about the property like Canada edition actually be approved here and that edge of clearing was very similar to the '90s edge of clearing. Um that's not what's being shown on the plan in
front of you. Um it looks like that area is nearly completely invaded. um it's just an herbaceous layer. So, it doesn't appear that any trees or shrubs that are woody were ever installed in the area in accordance with the restoration that was
required over the years. Um you know, the staff has to kind of keep their hands tied on this where it was a requirement. It wasn't done. It should be done. At the end of the day, the area is entirely invaded. um if they were to go in and replant it, you know, conduct
invasive species removal, it is entirely surrounded by more invasives. So, um it would be up to the commission if they would want to require that and I can give you all the information to make that decision. >> All right.
Thank you, Elissa. Questions from the board. Uh let's start with Ronnie Borman. It's definitely tight around there. I can I can see where Jen's going with the mitigation, but if you got something, Jake, that you think will fit in there. Um,
other than that, I think, uh, it's a go if the staff's good, >> Ron. Thank you. Uh Dave, >> the big question to me seems to be that uh the area down the slope behind the house that was never acted on as it should have been years ago. I don't know
if the if the commission should uh take that as a serious issue. I mean the mitigation things Ryan just mentioned, you know, that seems all doable everything, but that area there seems like a big question mark to me. I have no idea if we should take that seriously or not. You know, guys might down the hill. You
know what I'm saying? years ago they didn't do what they were supposed to do, right? >> Guess I'll leave it there. I didn't really answer my question, but uh >> it doesn't appear that they did. Dave, >> I just wonder how seriously should we take that.
That's a question for the commission. And it is >> well >> you said Bill I mean Dave >> I guess but I've left it with a question haven't I? You know >> just to elaborate you know the buffer is part of the order of conditions on the
project. So if the property would ever like compliance having that buffer intact was a condition. Um so you know that when we look at these we just do a whole property review try to figure out if there's been you know any violations over the years. um make sure we're not double counting things that we have in
the past. Um so it's kind of just bringing this to light and the commission can kind of determine once I give you more information perhaps going back out there taking a look at it. Um >> um what should be done with the area?
>> I guess I'll say one more thing. It seems like the issues around the current project are are very doable. you know, I mean, it's what they're what they want to do, they can do. The mitigation they're going to propose, they could do that. I guess it's the old issue. I don't know if we can we could we treat
them separately. I mean, I I don't I don't see any reason to stop the project that they want to they want to build. >> Yep. >> I I don't think I don't see why you couldn't take them separately. >> It seemed like very separate issues to
me. I think >> I would I wouldn't want to stop the project is my point. >> Okay, >> I'm definitely done. >> Bill Coffee. Yeah, I didn't know whether it was I was actually going to suggest
what Alyssa said, just getting a little bit more information on that and then seeing a little bit more on the actual expedit mitigation that Jake was talking about. Um I don't know. I think you know like he said he was back here in 2 weeks be
worth continuing it till then real quick just so we could take a look get a little bit more information and then you know if if it turns out okay it shouldn't be along here that'd be my sort of recommendation to this one
>> I would I would agree with that all right Jim um Uh Dave brings up some good points. Um um the project itself seemed relatively straightforward. It's the historic that
uh is an issue. >> I'm not sure either. >> Yeah, the project itself is straightforward. You're right. >> Ron Driscoll. >> Yeah, I'm all set. Thanks. I think everybody's covered it. >> All right. So I it sounds like
continuence to me. Um so that can go out and evaluate the the proposed mitigation. Um Jake, uh what's the 17th looking like, Jenna? It sounds like that's getting full now, isn't it? >> Yeah.
>> We have great stamina. She she has big trust in us. >> Um >> it's the last one before Christmas, so you got to make sure it's super exciting. [laughter] You you're here already for it, right, Jake? >> Oh, yes.
>> You get three that night. >> No, I mean we we have to advertise the 17th tomorrow and there's not much on the agenda. So, >> okay. >> So, I move that the request of the applicant we have a continuence till 12:17. Driscoll,
>> I'll second that. Duffy to continue till the 17th. Any other comments or questions from the commission? Jen, is there anything in the chat? >> Not pertaining to this project, Mr. Chairman. >> Anywhere. Um, I'm going to go ahead and
call a roll. Steve >> Ben, >> Driscoll, >> I can't hear you. Almond eye, >> eye, >> duffy eye, >> grass eye. >> So, we're unanimous. I saw Ronnie put
his thumb up. So, >> okay. So, Jake, we'll see you on the seventh. >> Sounds good. Thank you all. Have a good evening. Have a nice night. >> Night, Jake. >> Night, Jake. >> Good night.
Well, next we got a request to amend an existing order of conditions. Michael Day family, West Falmouth Trust, Falmouth 17, Low Way, Falmouth, West Falmouth, Mass. Request to amend order
of conditions for DP25-4774 to restore the coastal bank, remove an unpermitted retaining wall and conduct in space invasive species removal and restoration. Jen. >> Um,
yes, Mr. Chairman. Hang on. I accidentally promoted mic up. Alyssa, can you move poor Mike back into attendees, please? Oh, wait. He's still in attendees. Why do I see him on our screen?
>> Something like something happened. >> I have no idea. >> I don't know what just happened. I see Mike in >> I don't see Mike. >> I see Mike in my name. >> I see his name, but then I see him in the attendees and I can't see him in
panelists. >> I think we're good. But I think he's in attendance. >> Yeah, he's muted. He'll be fine. >> Do you see Maria? >> We see Maria. We see you, Tom. >> We see a screen. We hear you. We don't see you. I just see a background. >> I know. Where am I? [laughter]
>> We can hear you. >> Oh, let's see. >> Mr. Chairman, Tom Bunker, BSS Design, and Maria Hickey, Maria Hickey Landscapes Associates. >> Very good, Tom. >> Yep. Hello. As introduced, I'm Tom Bunker with BSS
Design, professional land surveyor and I have Maria Hickey here also. Um, I'm her I'm her tech guy right now. I'll try to be her tech guy if I can find the drawing.
Um, [clears throat] one second here. the plan. This is a uh we're here to uh amend the order conditions. Um this this plan the the uh
contractors went a little wild on the construction and they uh basically they they uh on the on the approved plan the original plan we had there was an area of coastal bank that was to remain intact with all the vegetation on it. Um
but it did get cleared. Uh excessive clearing and grading was done on the site and so now we are here. I'll show you the screen if I can u share it. I can share it if you'll allow me to and uh we'll show you. I'll put the screen
up and I'll let Maria do the talking. How's that? >> Sounds good. >> All righty. I'm so disappointed my face is not on the screen. [laughter] >> Yeah. Really? What's >> right? I mean like I did my hair and makeup for nothing. Okay. Well, [laughter] >> you're disappointed.
>> I know some of you already know me. For those of you that do not, I am Maria Hickeyi from Maria Hickey Associates Landscapes and I had the pleasure of um working with Tom Bunker on this project. Uh we are trying to bring the property
into compliance and requesting your permission to do so. Uh there's an area which we identified as what we call the red zone which um I don't know if you can see my clicker I'm outlining it but if you went out in
the the field it's the area which includes um where the contractor who was building the house cleared and he was not supposed to. So, we're asking for permission to go in and first of all um
reestablish the grade to what it originally was. Um he altered it. So, we're going to fix that. And as staff has re requested and we're happy to do so before any planting is done, we will have them come on site to verify the
grades to make sure they've done everything correctly. Uh the areas shown in yellow on the plan are voluntary invasive species habitat restoration areas that we're asking for permission to include. And the reason why is in
these yellow areas there are locust trees. And for those of you that don't study trees for a living, um the best way to describe a locust tree is a thug in the neighborhood.
It has roots that will grow laterally just under the surface of the soil. Um, and the roots will go as far as the height of the tree. So, they can go up to 75 100 ft. And along that route, you
have trees that will pop up. They're called um seedlings and grow into more trees. And the problem with locust trees is that they affix nitrogen into the soil. um and it makes it an incompatible pH or
soil mix for your native shrubs to grow. >> And therefore, especially when you have a project that you're trying to um not just plant and grow native shrubs, you want them to thrive. You want to reestablish habitat value with flowering
and burying shrubs. And you don't want to have to keep planting everything every year because it can't survive all the nitrogen being um affixed into the soil from the locust. So when you have locust trees, you and they're not
native, you want to remove them and their associated roots um because we want to have our native shrubs not only survive, but we want them to thrive. And this isn't just an incompatible mix. And the locust will take the nutrients out
of the soil that your native shrubs need. They compete for sunlight, for water, etc., etc., etc. Um, this project borders well the property, there's a section of it that borders the Shining
Sea bike path. Um, and there are locusts on our client's land that if we do not remove them, we'll have an issue with those roots going onto the asphalt of the bike path and potentially causing it to buckle. Similar to the problem, um,
over on Oyster Pond and Elm Road, uh, where you have bamboo doing the same thing. Um, so I went and I met with um Marty Podle at the DPW per conservation's request to ask permission for us to remove and replace these areas
bordering um the bike path with native shrubs and restore that whole area. So it will prevent any damage to the bike path. And they were quite happy to hear about that. Jen, I and Alyssa, I did forward
you the email that they sent to me. I don't know if they sent one to you, so I just wanted to cover my tracks and all aspects. Some of the other things that we need to do to bring the property into compliance is to remove a retaining wall that the um builder
installed that shouldn't be there that's coming out. We'll rectify the grade. There's a big section of Japanese knotweed that's in here. Um, which is a very bad invasive vine that again will contaminate the area and keep spreading.
So, we're taking out what doesn't belong, taking out the associated stumps. Uh, we'll add new soil back in to provide uh essential nutrients for our shrubs to grow. And then we're going to
replant the whole site. Um, and it's not a paint by number, but as you can see on the planting plan, I have different shapes and symbols and colors. Uh, but we're adding in quite a few uh, trees, lots of native shrubs. So, I'm trying to
create some vertical diversity with an understory. Right now, there's not an understory other than invasive really bad things. Um, like I said, the Japanese knotweed, bittersweet, porcelain berry, the typical types of
things that you find on Cape Cod. Um, and so we respectfully ask permission of the board to um, consider this worthwhile project and allow us to bring the property into compliance and do invasive species/habitat
restoration of our voluntary areas as shown in yellow. I would be happy to answer any questions that you may have. >> All right, Maria. Thank you. >> Thank you, Maria. >> You'd stop sharing. I think
>> Thank you, Tom. I'm not good at my technology. I can't even get my face to show up on the screen. Sorry. [laughter] >> I'll take that down now. Okay, there. >> Okay. >> All right. >> So, we're going to need a progress plan
during this. So, when the bank is regraded to its original original slope, Tom, you're going to have to go back out there and survey it before Maria starts planting so we can make sure that it's actually graded correctly. >> Okay.
>> Okay. >> Jen, we can also install um grade stakes and mark them. And I actually have a laser um like it's an engineering toy. Tom knows what I'm talking about. That you can shoot the grid and it shows you. It goes beep beep beep beep and then it,
you know, tells you where you're supposed to be. >> Okay. Well, Tom, >> I'd love to show you that. I love show and tell. [laughter] >> Great. U but Tom's going to go out and do a plan before you start planting. >> Um so we can be >> doubly sure. >> Yep.
>> Not with just beep beep beep that you know the grades are correct. And then um Tom, can you put that plan back up? >> No. >> Thank you, Tom. >> Maria, >> yes. >> Where are you talking about on the
state's property that you talked to Jer uh to that you talked to Martin about? What do you plan on doing on that slope? >> Okay. So, we're not touching anything on the slope. Just the area where the yellow is. It's on our client's
property. And just what the concern was, um, when I pull on the root of the locust, it may disrupt some of the soil. And if that's
so, will, you know, fix that and plant shrubs and I'd be absolutely happy to have Jeremiah or Marty and conservation staff out to show them if that happens. >> I'm just trying to be pre preemptive. >> No, I get it. So, you're not So, just to
clarify, you're not touching anything on the state property unless it's in inadvertently damaged or compromised by the removal of the locust
trees on your client's property. >> Correct, >> Tom? >> Yes. Is that back lot line staked? >> Not currently, I don't think. >> Okay. >> Actually, if I was out there today, they would
>> we're going to have to make sure that backlock line, Tom, is staked >> before you go in. >> And so, you're not going to touch any of the locusts on that slope. >> Correct. >> Okay. >> And that's all, Mr. Chair.
>> Yeah. And to add to that, Marty said if there was one that needed to be removed, there's a form on their site that they have to have a hearing if there's a tree on the on the um townland. We already had that
conversation. Uh but he didn't see he went out, we did a site visit. He didn't see anything that would be a problem. >> Okay. I might have So we spoke with Jeremiah. >> Yeah. >> At 3:30 this afternoon. Maria. >> Yeah.
>> Um, so we might have parks oversight when you're that close to that plot line. >> Sure. >> Okay. >> Welcome it. Thank you. I'm sorry [clears throat] about my dogs barking. >> We don't hear it. Okay. Thank you. >> That's all, Mr. Chairman.
>> Thank you, Jen. Alyssa, >> no comments. Thank you. >> All right, commissioners. Uh, let's start with Dave this time. Dave Kent, >> I just have one question for Maria. Maria, how do you remove the the uh the
roots of of locust trees? >> Um, so it's a mechanical extraction and when you um lift the stump and I I would love if you want to come out and watch when we do it. It's pretty fascinating. It's kind of like lift lifting up pasta
out of a pot when you've cooked it. [laughter] >> So So this they they pull out with the stump. >> Yes. >> Wow. Interesting. >> Because um Dave, they're not deep in the soil. They're right there under the surface. >> Oh, right. Huh. Interesting. >> Yeah, it's it's crazy to see how long um
they are. >> Kind of mindboggling. >> That's all I got. Thanks. >> Thank you, Dave. >> Thanks, Dave. Bill, >> I got nothing. Just I like the lesson. I' I've got a lot of locusts on my property. Have the exact opposite. I
love them. They're giant. give me a lot of shade, >> right? [laughter] >> I don't know why anybody want to remove them, but I get it. But that's cool. Thank you. >> All right. Thanks. So, Jim, >> no questions, Chair.
>> Uh, Steve, >> yeah, I agree with Bill and the Locust. I heated my home for years with them, but uh those were ugly. [snorts] [clears throat] >> Ron, all said, thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Ronnie, >> uh, was the grade cut or are you adding to it? Are you adding or cutting the grade on the bank? >> I believe, uh, it varies. You know, we're going to have all the grade stakes put in. If you want to take
a look before we get started. >> No, as long as the staff's good. I was just wondering what >> Yeah, we're going to remove there's a retaining wall that was put in. It's one story high. It's like one small block, like a twoft block. Um, >> well well presented, Maria,
>> thank you. >> Good luck. >> All right, Jen, are there You need anything else, Jen? Or are you satisfied with the >> No. Uh, we were only going to ask for uh
continuence and an additional plan if Marie was going to be working on the state property, but she has assured us she will not be working on the state property. So, I don't think we need any additional information at this time. Just know, Maria, regrade, get Tom out there to do it. And before you go near
that back property line, make sure, Tom, that it's staked >> and that um we're going to have parks oversight out there for you. Okay? >> Just so you don't have to stop and call Martin and get him out there. So, >> we already cleared that with Jeremiah
and he's fine with that. So, that'll be all written up in an order of conditions. >> Martin's in trouble. I have his cell phone number, [laughter] >> so I'll keep them in. Um, if I could just add one thing real quick, too. I just wanted to answer um or speak to um
a couple of you guys had brought up things about loving the locust trees. They have the strongest wood on the village green and a bunch of houses around Fmouth that are real old. You'll find locust trees down in the basement actually holding the house up. Um, but
the problem is when we're trying to grow native shrubs because they affix nitrogen into the soil, it's an incompatible soil like it's burning the roots of the native shrubs. It's too much nitrogen. Um, so that's the only
reason why we have to remove them when we're needing to plant native shrubs. Are you chasing and going down a rabbit hole trying to keep something alive that can't survive? >> Thank you, All right. Um, anything in the chat,
Jen? >> Nothing in the chat regarding this project, Mr. Chair? >> So, we're making a motion to uh >> make a motion uh to issue order conditions as discussed. >> Bman second. >> No, you you guys are going to close the
hearing and take it under advisement and then we will vote the order of conditions. >> But we did we did discuss a lot of the conditions that are going to be voted. So, I can understand the confusion, >> man. He's trying. [snorts] Thanks God, Bill. That's You'll get it. You'll get it.
>> And I'll make sure that I have my camera working for December 17th because I'll be with Jake at one of the hearings. So, uh, thank you all for your patience and appreciate your, um, listening and taking into consideration this worthwhile project.
>> All right. Great. Okay. Motion, a second to close the hearing and take it under advisement. Bill, >> do I have a second from Dave Kent? Is that who I heard? >> Yes. >> We have a motion and a second to close it here and take it under advisement.
Go ahead and call the roll. >> Patton I >> Ronnie >> Roman I >> Duffy I >> breath I That's unanimous to close it here and take it under advisement. Thank you.
>> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Night. >> All right. Next up, u well, this one is actually been continued. 151 has already been continued. Uh, next is
um Anthony. Is it Vanie or Vinnie? >> Vinie, >> I believe. Okay. Anthony Aini Jr. and Elaine Aini 42 Scrubet Drive. He's found with mass unlimited reconstruction of a deck of
the deck, enlargement of the patio, installation of retaining features and clearing within conservation. >> I didn't hear you, Mr. Chair, but I can start explaining the project here. One second. Uh, you >> want me to try to bring him in?
>> Yeah, try to bring Mike in because he he's appearing on my screen. And uh, promote to panelists. >> He's coming. >> Okay. >> And I'll promote Mr. Raveni as well. >> Yeah, I think Mr. Aini wants to come in as well.
>> There we go. >> Um, so we have opened this um, enforcement before. So, the quorum is everyone except Jim. Um, let's see. I think we last spoke in
October. Um, as we noted, there was some unpermitted work on the property. Uh, some expansions of hardscape, moving closer, some removal of vegetation. Uh, staff has met with the property owner
and Mike to, um, discuss the concerns out there. And Mike has been working on a plan um to address these. Uh staff has reviewed a draft plan which I think Mike you're sharing tonight um to show the
commission. Uh we have received advice from town council that going forward enforcements of this magnitude. We are um recommending to the commission when it comes time to close to require the filing of a notice of intent to allow us the ability to condition the work on
properties like this. Um though we certainly appreciate Mr. Vinie working with us throughout the process. Um so what the staff is recommending at this time is to uh listen to Mike's presentation when he shows you the draft plan. Um with Mr. Rabini's permission,
we would recommend that the commission continue the hearing so you can go to the site, see what we're working with, um, and at the subsequent hearing, close it, and require through an enforcement order that a notice of intent is filed to remedy the concerns.
Thank you. >> All right. Thank you, Alyssa. Mike, [clears throat] welcome back. >> Thank you, Mr. Chairman, members of the commission. Mike Borelli. For the record, I represent Anthony Aini. I'm going to share my screen and give you an
update on where we are. What I'm sharing with you first. Oh, by the way, uh Tony Aini might want to speak if he is he in the audience, Jen? >> No, I think we promoted him up. I just
saw him. >> Oh, okay. >> Hang on. I um Yeah, Mr. Aini is here, Mike. Okay, good. Um, what I'm sharing with you first is a plan that you reviewed and approved under an RDA that allowed for
certain improvements to the property. I share this with you to give you a little reference. Um, the existing house, existing deck, a a lowprofile um railroad tie
wall that I'm tracing. You can see in red the top of the coastal bank and there's a stairway down from a flat area that was u um for the most part bark mulch and maybe a few scattered flag stone.
Some stairs coming around the house. This is a walk out meaning the front yard the basement level walks out at at grade on the back side because the lot slopes. all of the lots along Scrubnak slope down and most of them have a um a
bulkhead sheep pile bulkhead and most of them have docks. So there's a coastal bank and I've shown that in red. This house was built a long time ago before there were such rules uh as minimum uh
setbacks from coastal banks. Um so uh construction commenced and then something troubling happened. Um work was uh done in outside spaces were expanded.
By that I mean patios were built. Um this uh landscape timber wall um became a stone wall and it shifted seawward. So I'm going to now share with you a plan with some color on it and
existing conditions and some other colors that you're probably wondering what what I'm even doing. But uh I just this is sort of preliminary concept to start to dialogue with the goal being that we're going to file a notice of intent to cure the problems. So, this is
the current existing conditions plan, and I've got some reference points on here. In red, which I've now highlighted and overlaid in green, was where that landscape uh railroad tie timber
um wall was. And I'm also showing with X's through it because it needs to be removed a new wall that went seawward of the old existing timber wall and it was built
um out of stone. Uh beautiful wall and you're going to see that in a minute. Um, there were some changes made on the sides to improve this the access stairs around both ends, this end and also this
end. The deck was uh rebuilt and expanded. The orange part is uh highlighting a portion that was expanded beyond what existed that I'm also showing with this double
line in red. So, the deck got bigger um and closer, which it can't be closer because it's already closer. It was already closer than you would allow. So, your regulations don't allow you to expand closer to the top of a coastal
bank if you're already too close. There's a part of the deck over here that was expanded. This little rectangle. Now, that didn't go closer, but it expanded. So it would have required mitigation.
So um going to show you some photos now to give you some perspective. And I I understand that um I believe the goal is that we would ask for a continuence to the 17th. At that meeting, after you've had a chance to
see the site, we'd be um instructed through the enforcement order to file a notice of intent to show uh the proposed remedies so that you could issue an order of conditions. So, I'm
going to show you the photos. Now, I've been delaying them because it's a shame. This is the patio and this is the wall that got expanded.
Um, I'm going to show you the wall. Here's the wall. This is a stone wall. I'm assuming it's a veneered concrete wall. It has a railing on the top. This wall moves seawward,
um, which you don't allow. This is a another look at the patio. This railing that you just saw is at the top of that wall. Uh for reference, the re the uh railroad tie wall was about where I'm tracing
with the arrow prior to this work being done. This this stairway in the deck up here is the part of the deck that I had shown highlighted in orange. You can see these
stairs. Those are the stairs in that photo right there. So, all of this patio, these stairs were um expansions without permission.
I have another view looking now from the other direction towards the stairs. And again, for reference, the older uh the old railroad tie wall was about where I'm tracing on this patio
right here. So, basically, this was all expanded. This is unfortunate. And the owner is um pretty reticent about it. Knows he
I don't know how else to say it. Screwed up. Um and has to fix it. So the fixing is going to be to basically try to recreate back to where the old timber wall used to be.
uh and remove all this. And it's going to have to be done by gaining access down these stairs. Um we might have to go around with a Bobcat or a skid stair machine and remove this stuff um a little bit at a time. We're going to
have to go on the other side and do the same thing. [snorts] It's going to be costly and timeconuming and difficult to do. So, um, what we're hoping to do though
was salvage at least some of the work that could have been approved and is could have been mitigated for. So, um, as part of the analysis, we're going to
inventory the common imperous surfaces and compare them to what the impervious surfaces used to be because we had that previous survey that I sh showed you um, back when it was like this.
And um if we have an opportunity and there's some things that you could have approved, if we provided [clears throat] mitigation, for instance, like this section of deck or perhaps some of the patio that used to be bark mulch, um we're going to try
to salvage some of those hardcapes. If not, they're going to get removed and reverted back to what they used to be, which was bark mulch. Um, we're hopeful that we can keep this stairway in this part of the wall that
was built because that was basically built in the same general location as the original stairs. If you look in red, there was a set of stairs that came down like that. And these were basically straightened out. Um, so we're hopeful
we can keep that. But all of this wall, I didn't put X's over here, but there's more of it over here. Has to come out. And all of this patio has to come out. It's just simply could never have been approved.
So, it's unfortunate this happened. My client uh is very upset and concerned and feels terribly about it, as you can imagine.
and [clears throat] we're going to do our best to fix it. And I guess you folks are going to go out and take a look on your own and um we're going to then advance a plan to take care of it. There's no real way to sugar coat any of
it. Uh this is it. It is what it is, as they say, and I'm going to try to do my best to try to help fix it. >> [clears throat] >> I'm happy to take questions. >> Mike, thank you, Mike.
Jen. >> Yeah, thank you, Mike. Um, as Alyssa said, we have met with Mr. Aini and Mike to go over everything. If we can get whatever we can get permitted for Mr. Aini, we will do it. Um, it might be tough, but we'll work
with Mike um to to try to get something. Um, so I spoke with Mike this afternoon. Um, as Alyssa said, council has recommended having um
the enforcements uh remedied through notices of intent. So, we've discussed a timeline. Um, we'll continue this out for two weeks. You're not that busy on the 17th. As I previously said, this will give the t the commission time to go out and uh
look at the site. Um if the commission thinks it might be helpful, Mike, would you be willing to share that draft plan with us that you just showed for so they have some sort of contacts when they go out there or are you >> happy to for what it's worth? It's
pretty rudimentary, but I I can Do you Are you suggesting I give you some copies? >> Yeah. Yeah, just yeah, if if the board would find that helpful. I I know you had expressed like you're like this is just my concept sketch, but it might
help them orient themselves since most of them haven't been to this site. >> Thank you. >> Um >> I can probably drop them off tomorrow. >> Okay, perfect. And then um two weeks gives the commission chance to
go out there so you know what you're voting on. And then we would vote um and like an enforcement order requiring Mr. Avini to file a notice of intent by a date certain which Mike and I have also discussed that date certain. Are you still comfortable with the dates we
discussed Mike? >> Uh yeah I think we talked about filing a notice by January. >> End of January. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> End of January. Yeah. >> Yeah. You said you said middle of January is too tight for you. >> Yeah. >> So, end of January.
>> Um, so that's what we have for the commission at this time, Mr. Chairman. >> Thanks, Alyssa. Do you have anything? >> Nothing else to add. Thank you. >> Um, we'll go to commissioner's questions,
uh, comments. Uh, we'll start with Bill this time. Yeah, I actually had one and it's more procedural. Jen, normally uh when we get an NOI, we go out and see. >> Why is so do we have to complete the
enforcement for that? Because then once the note of intents out, it's usually go back to the site and see again. >> So I don't know if we go once, we don't have to probably not going to have to go back out for the I just this is sort of just procedural.
>> Yeah, it's procedural. I don't want the board to vote uh an enforcement order without seeing the site. So, um I don't think it's fair to the commission. I don't think it's fair to the uh to the to the property owner for you to vote no enforcement order without seeing the
site. Um like I said, I did talk to council. Um [clears throat] these are pretty um egregious violations of your rags. So her recommendation and how she would like
the board to proceed is to issue an enforcement order requiring a notice of intent by a date certain and then we proceed as we normally do on a notice of intent because then you're going to see the changes that Mike is going to propose, what he what may be able to be
kept, you know, what can be mitigated for. Um there is a lot that happened on this site. I don't know what we're going to be able to do, but if we can permit it, we will recommend it being permitted to the commission. Um,
>> you know, in the back of my head, I was like, why don't we just start with the notice of intent now since we already know that we're going to fix this with the notice of intent. So, like I said, it's procedural. So, that was sort of >> Yeah, >> we still learning what's going on here. >> You you've got one right now before you,
58 Westwood. they preemptively filed a notice to fix it. So, we're in the middle of both those hearings, but that the the the property owner chose to do that knowing it was going to be required anyway. Um, we were just kind of feeling these out on how council wanted them
done. >> All set, Bill. >> Okay. Um, Jim, >> no questions, Mr. Chairman. >> Thank you. Uh, Steve, >> no questions. Thank you. >> Ron,
>> all set. No thanks. No questions. Thanks, >> Ronnie. >> I'm good. >> I'm all set. >> All right. So, um, obviously we're going to continue this. Um, yeah, I I I I want to go out and see it
myself, so I'll hold any comments I have. Um, >> so I make a motion to continue this hearing to 12:17 so we can all see the property. >> Thank you, Ron. >> Second.
>> Okay. So, we have a motion, a second to continue this hearing until the 17th. That correct, Jen? 17th, right? >> Correct, Mr. Chair. >> 17th. Any other comments or questions from the commission? Okay. Hearing none, I'm
going to call a roll. Um, I'm sorry, Mr. Vini, did you have something to say? I I don't, you know, before we take the vote here, you kind of see where it's going, right? >> Oh, yeah. And I was kind of expecting that. I mean, I I I made a mistake, a
very large mistake, and I regret it, and we're going to do what we can to correct it. So, thank you for your time. >> Appreciate your cooperation. Thank you. Um, all right. So, I'm going to call the role. Steve >> Patton I >> Ron
>> Driscoll I >> Ronnie >> I >> Steve >> I >> Bill >> Duffy I >> McGrath I >> and Robins is a I so that's unanimous to continue until December 17th. Thank you
Mike and >> thank you. >> Thank you Mr. Aini. >> Thank you. >> All right. Next is Steven [snorts] August, 33 Oyster Shell Lane, East Mass. Unpermitted removal of mitigation plantings and unpermitted installation
of landscape within conservation jurisdiction. Jen, who do we got on this? >> Uh, well, could be either myself or Alyssa. I guess I'll jump in. Boards heard this. Oh, wait. Um, because this
has been going on so long and Courtney didn't show up tonight, we don't have a quorum. >> I thought he was going to be late, but he never. >> So, we did. >> So, I'm I'm sorry to say. >> Okay, Mike, we're going to have to move this for you. Um,
>> who's who is on the quorum? Uh, Jen, >> um, it's Courtney, Russ, Steve, and we asked Ron to read in because he only missed one of the hearings. Okay. Well, that's a problem. >> So, I'm I'm
>> So, we'll have to continue this out one. >> Mike, you want one week or two? >> Well, there's not a lot to really say. So, one week. I mean, we just we we know >> just giving you Yeah.
>> Yeah. And then we can't speak at all about anything because we don't have Yeah. Just push it out of a week then. >> Okay. Okay. We'll continue this. Um >> Sorry, Mike. Thanks. >> Sorry, Michael. Thanks. Um, so Mr. Chairman, we'll have to continue with
this out till December 10th. >> If I had waited all night for this, I would be a little bit bit upset, but since I was just on >> I'd be upset with Courtney. [laughter] >> You would you would cross with this, would you, Mike? >> All right. >> All right. Make a motion to continue
this hearing to 1210 to procedural situation. Driscoll. >> Thank you, Ron. Second, Duffy. >> Thank you. Okay. I Dr. Bill. All right. No other comments or questions because there is none. Um I'll call the roll.
Steve >> and I. >> Driscoll. >> I Bill Duffy. >> I Robin is an I to continue. Thank you, Mike. >> Thank you. Have a good night.
>> Good night, Mike. Night. All right. Then next up is uh Dave and Masi Bonds 38 Squibnocket Drive East Farmouth Mass unpermitted construction of retaining walls steps a patio
replacement of decking and alteration of a coastal bank. >> Yes, Mr. Chairman, I'm attempting to so Dave Mr. Barnes will be joining us
shortly. We'll wait until he is in. >> Okay, I see him. >> Okay. >> How's everybody doing tonight? >> Good. >> Good. Yeah. So, um, unfortunately, just
very, very similar to 42 squib knocket. Um, there were several retaining features, patios, fire pit constructed on this property and it's similar to the last one you saw. Um, much of that is is
moving closer. um it would not have been it simply would not have been permittable um under your regulations. Um I believe and Mr. Barnes can confirm he has had some difficulty um
uh retaining a engineer. Um Mr. Barnes, you have indicated that you have uh contracted with Farland Corp and they'll be coming out to the site shortly to do a survey. Is that correct?
>> Yeah, I sent you an email on that. >> Yeah. Okay, perfect. Just wanted to clarify that for the board. Um, so like um we don't unfortunately we don't have the um
we don't have the survey for the board to review now, but Bill, this is one of those cases where it's most likely going to be reviewed under that notice of intent process. So again, similar to 42
as your council has recommended, when the board issues or if you issue an enforcement order, it would be to file a notice of intent for corrective action by a date certain. >> Yeah. Um could I speak for myself, please, Jim?
>> Yep. Then Yep. One second, Mr. Barnes. Um so the recommendation would be continue it out two weeks. the board goes to see the site so that you have you're not voting in a vacuum and then um we proceed from there. >> Okay.
>> Um that's all I have for right now, Mr. Chairman. >> Alyssa, did you have anything? And then I'm going to go to you, Mr. Barnes. >> Nothing at this time. Thank you. >> Mr. Barnes, you got the floor. >> Okay. And I can share my screen, I suppose. >> Yep.
>> All right, folks. Um, I'll just, you know, [clears throat] um, I'm new to this. I don't go through this a lot. I'm not a waterfront property owner. Um, you know, before we bought this house in 2018, and this is what we bought at that time. Okay. I can
tell you that many [clears throat] of my neighbors are going through your process here. Um, I can tell you that. Um, well, let's just look at, you know, and I sent all this to Miss Lincoln. Um, so and I've talked to Miss Lincoln and
she's come out to the house and told me some things. Um, we bought this property um with this serious problem down here. Um, that bulkhead um was existing.
This was how it was existing. You can see the trees basic. So that middle tree fell in the water. Okay, that and that's what prompted me to use a contractor that my neighbor was using. All of these houses were built in the '9s with those
timber walls. Those timber walls there that are retaining walls um were I bought the house looking at and saying, "Yep, those need to be replaced." They were leaning and rotten. And so all of our neighbors have these walls. It's a steep slope from our house. and the
walls um you know serve to help erosion as we know. Um and although this issue here and let me just uh pan down here. You can see here and this is this is actually from realtor.com so you can go on there and see it. I'm not making this
up. You So as my mouse moves across here you can see how much erosion was going on there and that this this issue was serious. You can see um my mouse is moving across the line of a retaining wall right there. This one was back further. What we did is we replaced
these walls with one consistent one going all the way across. And then naturally we would, you know, in my mind, very naturally, we would just raise it up higher and put a patio in so we can have a place a place to sit in our backyard. And all of our neighbors
kind of that that that's the thought. Okay. So, um, there was no malice in any intent here and there was no understanding that, you know, this was some terrible thing. I can tell you I spent a quarter million
dollars on this. And, you know, I'm I can't imagine any of you care about that from what I've been hearing too much. Um, but um, I I'm a little hot because when I talked to Jen, she came out and basically she said, "Look, all this has got to go." I said, "Well, what if I
don't have the money to make it go and and do it all again?" She said, "We don't really care. Basically, we'll sue you." Um, and we'll sue you right away. And I said, "You know, there's a planting season coming up and that needs to happen by then." And, um, there was other, you know, just back and forth
that's been not friendly. Um, so I I started off by with a long-winded email about how I want to work. I'm sorry about this stuff, all this stuff. and I was told that that I'd get worked with. Yeah, we'll we'll work with you and we'll help you. Um comes out to the
site, looks at it, takes a picture beside a wall, the the wall that I'm telling you about. It's about, you know, um I don't know how how Thomas Lincoln is, but this thing is over four or five feet I and then goes out of it, doesn't say anything, calls the building department and they're coming after me
and I'm in hearings down there. So, that's not my impression of working with me. I know you folks have your rules and they're you're not going to bend them and all this and that, but several of my neighbors are going through things. You know, we're not millionaires over here. This isn't the waterfront property people that that have endless money.
None of us are. We're bluecollar, you know, hardworking people. And this is going to drain all my funds. So, I just want to start by saying I have been communicating preemptively, consistently since I got this letter. And I have been trying to get surveyors to come out to
the house. Nobody really seems to want this type of business around town. Um I couldn't get Mr. [clears throat] Borcelli to even return my call and I hope he's not on the screen or whatever, but and and and not just him to point him out, but it was company after company after company. So I'm down in uh
Fall River and I finally got somebody. I think they're coming out, but they tell me that they won't email me. They'll just show up. So I'm trying I'm going to spend the $4,000 to get a site survey to show you guys exactly what happened. I understand, you know, you have your rules. Um but but this um whole process
feels very punitive and it I felt the whole time like I'm some type of criminal and it's going to drain all my family savings and I don't know if that means anything to you all but um it's a really bad position that I'm in and I'm more vocal than my neighbors I think and
um so I just want to let you know the situation of the homes here and the retaining wall issue and and um I recognize you know we should have gone through the process to come come through you all. I did not know that. Um I talked to a contractor that was used
down the road and came over and explained to me that this is something we can do. And when the when that tree fell in the water, I had an emergency operation to take the tree out. And I said, "Let's go do this." And we did it. And um so I don't apologize for it
because I didn't know. Um, and hopefully um hopefully you folks can um help me in a financial sense. Um, because I'm not sure I I I don't know how I would afford to do what Jen wants me to do is hey, there's a planning season in the spring and I I don't really care if you don't have a quart million dollars. Tear it
down and put it back together is is tough. So that that's my piece and I'll shut up now. >> All right. So Jen, anything else? Um, Fallon Queenie, the conservation agent, was with me on the site and
witnessed and heard the entire conversation. I think Mr. Barnes is is is a little upset. I merely explained the process and the process does ask, you know, this is what the process is. He asked me if he could not meet the
timelines given by the commission. I said if those timelines weren't met that the matter would be turned over to our town council um and that the town council would then you know basically compel Mr. Barnes to
to um comply with that enforcement order. >> So I I'll just say >> the wall is over my head. We I I do work for the town Felmouth and um we did inform as Miss Queeny witnessed that we
informed Mr. Barnes that we were going to have to inform the building department. It is a structure. >> Uh and so that's what we did. We took the picture. We informed the building department. He's working with the building department then. >> Um that is how the conversation goes.
It's unfortunate that Mr. Barnes is painting it in a much more aggressive uh manner, but that is not how it went down. >> I just >> So, Mr. Chairman, I would suggest again, similar to 42 Squid Knocket, that the
board go out to the site, review it, and then we're going to have to proceed with an enforcement order if the board chooses to file a notice of intent to take corrective action. It's unfortunate, but several of the properties along Squid Knocket have done
work that simply cannot be permitted under your regulations, and you cannot allow it to remain. That is all. >> Yeah. One of the one of the big tragedies here is >> that again, he he can't claim ignorance
of the law, but you got a contractor that does work on the cape. He shows up. I mean, it [clears throat] that's that's the part that that I'm frustrated with is >> So, so I I Hey, Mr. Robbins, I I tried
to sue this guy. Okay. and I can't sue him because um you know I I could try and I paid $5,000 to start and then I find out there's an LLC game where they just clo pull the money out of the LLC and you you end up winning the lawsuit
but you don't get any money and you know this guy's not on the hook for anything and and that's part of it. That's definitely part of it. Um so look I I know it's spilled milk and I'm crying a little bit here. Um, I just >> Can we have permission? We would like to
get permission to go on your property. I mean, >> I I've been I've been open since day one. I I open with Miss Lincoln and and Fallon with open arms, but I'll say that it wasn't, you know, some we're working
with you type of thing at all. Um, and and that's unfortunate. So that that's what's got me in a different disposition is that I don't want to feel like some criminal in front of you all in front of my neighbors. I mean, I feel like, you know, we're we're all residents of
Falmouth. You trust me when I tell you my neighbors care about the environment. We care about the the the waterway. We care about the animal life. We love it. We're not trying to hurt anything. I I am struggling. I did ask Miss Lincoln, you know, exactly how we we are
negatively affecting the um environment in this way. So, you know, and I got, hey, the rules are the rules. She I said she said, you know, Dave, I get that question all the time and the rules are the rules. Well, you know, in in a in a in a sense that why don't in the spirit
of what we're trying to do here to to, you know, help the environment. I um the storm water runoff I understand but like is there flooding an issue in the ocean that that that um I'm just trying to connect the dots in my head by saying you're going to punitively
you know financially damage all these people and what you know if we go up the river I can tell you every one of my neighbors has a patio closer than mine. Um, one has a swimming pool on the edge of the thing. And I'm not I I understand
it was before this and that. Um, but you can see how it would lead somebody to um, understand that, hey, this is not something that's, you know, this is crazy. My wife's horrified. She says, every single one of these houses has a
patio closer than ours to the water. We went out a couple of feet and fixed something was failing and it's going to be like, "Nope, the rules are 50 feet. You went 48 and therefore it's $250,000 to you." I mean, if we look at this in a
common sense perspective, it's real hard to swallow, folks. >> Well, let let us have a look at it. Okay. Okay. I The commission has not looked at this. Okay. >> We trust staff. Staff works pretty damn hard and we do work with people. Well, I
I I >> kind of take exception to that because I know I've seen what happens. Okay. Been involved with it for a long time. And again, try to we try to work with people if they're willing to work with us. So, let let us let us get
>> you come to my house anytime. Um sir, anytime. >> All right. Fair enough. So, we need to continue this and we're going to need a plan at some point. Mr. Bonds needs you to push that company from Fall River.
>> Uh yeah, they're supposed to he told me he'll be out on the week of the 8th, >> which is next week. And he just said, you know, I'm just going to show up. And so, um I I I guess I'll get a plan at that point. And then I do have another
um it's a friend of the family who's going to help me overlay. He he says he can do an overlay for you all. And I guess that takes one plan and puts it over the other one and so you can see what the differences are in a 2D sense.
Um so um we'll we'll get that done and I'm going you know I'm trying to do it as fast as I can. >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> Very good. So, Jen, where what's the calendar look like to extend this to uh continue and then
so everybody can get a, you know, get a look at this? Go down and take a look at it. I mean, we could probably hit both of them while you're down there. 38. >> Yeah. >> Um, >> are you living there year round, Mr. Barnes? >> Yes, sir. >> Okay.
>> Yeah. And I think my neighbor on my other side is going through this, too. So maybe you could do a three for maybe there's more. I I don't know. >> Yeah. Um 17th is fine. Mr. Chairman, you're not that busy. >> All right. I hit a 17th a lot tonight. I
got a feeling it's going to be busy. >> I know it seems. >> Just keep all right. >> You're fine. >> Can I get a motion to you? Are you good, Mr. Bonds, at this point? >> Yes, sir. Thank you for hearing me >> out there and look and and and then that
plan is going to be essential to that next the next hearing. So, >> right >> something rolling anyway here. >> Okay, >> I make a motion to continue the continue this enforcement order until 12:17. >> Thank you, Ron.
>> I'll second that, Duffy. >> Okay. Any comments? Anyone, you know, before we continue this? Anyone got anything to say? Anyone? I can if the board wants I can pull up a quick near map
kind of show you. >> Ready to vote. >> Oh, okay. Steve's ready to vote. >> Thanks, Steve. Okay, so the commission's all set. Let's go ahead and call a roll. Um Steve >> Patton I. >> Ron I
>> Ronnie >> Bowman I. Dave >> I >> Duffy I >> Jim and Robins is an I. So we're continued till December 17th Mr. Barns and you'll be seeing us around. So
all righty good. Um anyone else got anything else tonight they can say? Friscoll. >> Yes. Mr. Chairman. >> Yes. We're looking for a volunteer to uh work
with the community preservation uh committee, a volunteer from this board. >> So, um I figure the new guys are the most likely to have a chance at um but it's an exciting opportunity and if you'd like to hear more about it uh
between now and next week, um we don't have to formally vote on it. You can simply volunteer. I believe. So if you're interested, I serve on it from another organization. >> I served on it, too. It was like it's it's actually a really good committee. I
You still meeting just once a month, Steve? >> Pretty much, you know, except when the applications come in. You get to give away money. >> I know. >> Nobody's mad at you then. >> Thanks, Steve. >> Steve, are you willing to talk with
anybody? So, if one of the commissioners wants to give you a call and chat, we can give them your I think they you guys all have the contact information, but >> we have permission to give you uh give your number out to your fellow commissioners if they choose to. >> If you come up,
>> if you happen to come up and take a look at familyport, you can come over, have a coffee. [snorts] >> Thank you, Steve. >> All right. So, I I need one more motion tonight. >> Roll second. >> Motion to adjourn. in a second. Robin by
>> Duffy. >> I want to keep going, guys. Come on. >> 3:31. Thank you all.