[Music] Heat. Heat. [Music] [Music] I'm calling tonight's meeting of the family planning board to order. Today is
July 8th 8th, 2025 and we are meeting at FA Town Hall. My name is John Dulie and I am currently the chair of the planning board. And before we begin, I would like to remind
everyone that this is a public meeting and is being conducted in accordance with the Massachusetts open meeting law. Please take a moment to silence your mobile devices or any electronics that could uh have an interruption here.
Anyone wishing to speak should come to the podium, wait to be recognized by the chair, and state their name for the record before making remarks. We encourage respectful and constructive dialogue during public comment periods.
Thank you. We now proceed to to the first item on the agenda, which is public comment. If anyone wishes to speak about something that's not on the agenda this evening, please come to the podium, state your name, and share with us what you'd like to
talk about. Seeing no no one come to the podium, we'll begin the uh the meeting this evening. So uh first on our agenda would be the minutes. Has uh everyone review the minutes.
Tom, you okay with me? Yes, I am. I make a motion. Yeah, Mr. Chairman, motion to approve the minutes as presented of June 24th, 20 24th, 2025. Second. All in favor? I I unanimous.
The uh second item on our agenda is the uh covenant release request or uh we have two properties, 187 Central Avenue subdivision plan and we have two Lewis Street dependent
subdivision plan. And both of these are not going to be heard this evening because we have not received the referral back from the engineering and the referral would uh give us an idea of uh what the bond should be if they if
we're going to release this. So second uh we have um Edward Moritz and Tom Reed. Absolutely. for 961. Correct? Uhuh. At Water Drive.
This is the withdrawal. Requested withdrawal. This one right here. Nope. Nope. Nope. Right here. Right here. Wait for the right agenda. July 3rd, 2025 from the fulfillment
planning board regarding the 23 Atwater Drive accessory dwelling unit planning board application withdrawal. Dear board members, recent changes to our estate planning have eliminated the need for rental income to help support us as my
wife and I get older. We are 74 and 70 and we're concerned about the future, but that is no longer an issue. Therefore, we are requesting that our accessory dwelling unit application be withdrawn without prejudice. I apologize
if this has put an unnecessary burden on you all. Sincerely, Ed Morris, 23 Atwater Drive, Filman. Thank you, Tom. Thank you. Because we need a motion for this. Sure. Yep. So, I move that we accept the
applicant's um request to withdraw without prejudice. Thank you. And a second, please. Second. Thank you. All in favor? I I unanimous.
So, next on our agenda is a planning board decision. The applicant is Donald Lun site plan review application to construct a detach accessory dwelling at 34 Overlook Drive. I think we have a decision on that
proposed decision. Someone in red, Tom. Tom's going to Overlook Drive. Yeah, I can do that. Draft 7825. Motion that the planning board votes to
approve the application of Donald Lun for the construction of a detached one-bedroom accessory dwelling unit located at 34 Overlook Circle under section 240-12.2 Two, site plan review of the zoning
bylaw with the following findings and conditions. Findings. The applicant is proposing to construct a detached one-bedroom accessory dwelling unit on the property. The principal dwelling is currently four bedrooms, which means the
total bedroom count for the property with the ADU will be five bedrooms. The accessory dwelling unit proposed at 832 square ft will be 37% of the principal dwelling which complies with section
240-9.1 C 5 of the zoning bylaw. The site plan shows room for parking for both the principal dwelling and the accessory dwelling unit. Therefore, complying with section 249.1C
and 240-14.1E of the zoning bylaw, respectively. Comments made by the abuters during the board's public meeting were not in objection to this project. Pursuant to section 240-12.2 two of the zoning bylaw. This site plan
review decision shall lapse three years from the date whole page there. Oh, behind here. Yep. Excuse me. The board finds that the information provided by the applicant conforms to all of the requirements of sections 240-9.1
and 240-12.2 of the zoning bylaw conditions. The plan shall be constructed as approved. Any changes shall be reviewed by the planning board to determine if a modification of this decision is
necessary. Two, the applicant shall install dry wells, rain garden, or other storm water infiltration measures for the new roof area. The project must not direct any storm water runoff to public property,
abutters, or public right away. Three, any connections or alterations to public utilities would require permission from the appropriate town department. Four, construction of this project shall follow the town's in quotes soil erosion
and sediment control standard conditions. End quote. Five, the applicant shall see the engineering division for address assignment for the new building prior to applying for a building permit. Upon completion of
construction, the applicant shall post the address for this building per section 99-1 of the town code. Six, the project shall meet all applicable standards set forth in the building code
as determined by the building to commissioner. Seven, rental periods shall be not less than six months and weekly or by more monthly rentals in parentheses so-called summer rentals are
expressly prohibited. Eight. Pursuant to section 240-12.2 of the zoning bylaw, this site plan review decision shall lapse three years from the date it is granted if
substantial use thereof has not sooner commenced except for good cause. Nine, the applicant shall contact the assessor's office for an inspection of the ADU prior to certificate of
occupancy. in 10. The applicant shall obtain the required rental registrations from the health department prior to renting the a second. Any discussion? All in favor? I.
Unanimous. I I have a question for the town planner. Is it the state's intention and our intention to eliminate this process we just did and we're not going to do this anymore and the building inspector will take this role over no more site plan? I thought I heard you mention that at one
of our last meetings. So, is that the way we're going? So, it's not going to be us anymore and it'll just be the building inspector and we won't do these anymore. Not necessarily. So, it's not the state's intention. I thought I I misunderstood you. I thought yeah it was just a suggestion from the planning staff but if the board is not
comfortable Okay. That means we get to discuss it sometime another time. Sorry. Yes. Okay. Oh wait too. A time and a place. Yeah. Likely next meeting. Okay. Good. Sorry to hold you up.
That's okay. Thank you. Uh next applicant is GHD Inc. site plan review application to construct a 1,334T municipal wastewater lift station at 632 Ticket Highway. And uh Tom, we have a
proposed decision for that also. Please, sir, draft on 7825. Motion that the planning board votes to approve the application of GHD Incorporated for the construction of a
municipal wastewater lift station located at 632 Ticket Highway under section 240-12.2 slight site plan review of the zoning bylaw with the following findings and conditions.
Findings. The applicant is proposing to construct a 1,334 square foot municip municipal wastewater lift station with associated infrastructure and parking. Specifically, the proposed structure and
infrastructure components will be located on a 39,000 plus or minus square foot area on the northern end of the 20 acre property closest to Brickill Road. This proposed lift station is a vital
component of the Great Pond phase 1 sewer project anticipated to serve approximately 600 parcels on the northeast east portion of the Marav Vista and Ticket Path Peninsul Peninsulas.
The wastewater flow from the phased one area will be conveyed by this new lift station and the new force mains to the town's existing main wastewater treatment facility on blacksmith shop road where it will be treated and
discharged to the town's existing open sand beds. The site plan shows four parking spaces for the proposed lift station. As the proposed use is not listed in the minimum parking requirements table under
240-14.1E, the building commissioner has determined the proposed number of parking spaces is adequate for the proposed use. The board is granting the following waiverss requested by the applicant. Number one, 240-12.2e.
2 E 2I access and circulation requirements to allow a driveway to exceed 24 ft in width at the street line. Number two, 240-14.3B landscape plan required to not require a
landscaping plan submission. Number three, 240-14.3D5. Landscape performance standards. Street trees do not require the installation of street trees. Number four, 240-14.3D8.
Landscape performance standards. parking lot interiors to not require vegetated islands within paved areas behind the street setback and number five 300-15K site plan contents
screening lighting fences walls and signs do not require screening surfacing including ground cover lighting fence fences, walls, and signs. Although the although there were
comments made during the board's public meeting, the board has determined that the applicant has adequately addressed the issues raised. The board finds that the information provided by the applicant conforms to all of the requirements of section 240-
12.2 of the zoning bylaw. Conditions. Number one, the plan shall be constructed as approved. Any changes shall be reviewed by the planning board to determine if a modification of this decision is necessary. Number two, the
project must not direct any storm water runoff to public property of butters or public right of way. Number three, any connections or alterations to public utilities would require permission from
the appropriate town department. Number four, construction of this project shall follow the town's in parentheses soil erosion and sediment control standard conditions or quote and now end quote there. A plan shall be submitted
to the DPW engineering division in compliance with the town's soil erosion and sediment control standard conditions before any site work is started. And number five, the applicant shall see the engineering division for address assignment for the
new building prior to applying for a building permit. Upon completion of construction, the applicant shall post the address for this facility per section 99-1, a fixing of legible numbers required.
Time limit for compliance. Number six, the project shall meet all applicable standards set forth in the building code as determined by the building commissioner. Number seven, pursuant to
section 240-12.2 of the zoning bylaw, this site plan review decision shall lapse 3 years from the date it is granted if substantial use thereof has not sooner commenced except for good cause. And number eight,
the contractor shall obtain an approved driveway permit and post any required bond with the engineering division before the start of construction. Second. Uh any discussion? Thank you.
None. Okay. All in favor? I I unanimous. Thank you. And then next on our agenda is a continuation of a public hearing for Amir Sminkowitz
to special permit application to modify the October 5th, 2011 special permit in the December 14th, 2016 special permit modification to allow the construction of a second 5,400 ft one-story storage
building with adjacent roofed open storage area for landscaping and non-aggricultural use to be built on 961 Sandwich Road and to allow the redivision of 955 and 961 Sandwich Road
into lot 2C 7.35 acres and lot 2D 11.36 acres with a portion of lot 2D having width 40 ft for the applicant Good evening. Uh for your record, I'm Bob Ament. I represent the applicant. At
the last hearing, there were a couple of open items. Uh one, the chairman asked that the parking uh spaces be shown on a plan. And the plan submitted dated June 23 showed the 26 designated spaces at
961 Sandwich Road. And in correspondence, I pointed out that there's many other uh places available for parking, but we actually showed the 26 designated spaces. There were also questions about drainage. There was still some open
issues with the uh engineering division. Uh we have, we think, addressed those. Um and calculations meeting the uh town standards have been submitted and uh reviewed and a plan showing the uh uh
more dra drainage details have uh been submitted. The town planner was uh uh kind enough to share with me um the draft decision uh which I've reviewed. It seems perfectly fine uh to um to us.
We will be submitting one additional plan simply putting a note that's was put on the drainage plan. He wanted it on the site plan as well. So, we'll be doing that. Um um probably as early as tomorrow.
Any questions? Any questions? Thank you. We do have a draft decision, please. Mr. here. Just as a reminder, it's still a public hearing. So,
that's right. Any anyone from the public wish to uh speak on this matter? No. Then close a hearing and yeah, if I may, just one more item for the record. Uh, attorney um missed this,
but it's the um marine and environmental services. They provided a positive referral. Um the applicant met with them on the 16th of June and the MEES has no issues with the plans as presented. All right. Thank you.
You're welcome. So yes, you can if there's no other input, close the hearing and then if you're ready, you can read the motion into the record. I move that the hearing be closed. All in favor? I I
Okay. Draft dated 7825. Motion. The planning board vote to approve the application of Greener Image Landscaping, Inc. to modify a special permit under sections 240-6.1B, 240-11.2B4,
2B4 240-12.1 and 240-14.1 LB5 I'm sorry L5B of the zoning bylaw to allow for the construction of a second 5400 square f foot storage building with
an adjacent roofed storage area ravel parking in the front yard and to allow the redivvision of 955 and 961 Sandwich Road into lot 2C and lot 2D with a
portion of lot 2D having a width of 40 ft as allowed by the December 14th, 2016 special permit decision with the following findings and conditions. Findings specific to 240-6.1B
of the zoning bylaw. The planning board finds that the property located at 955, 961, and 981 Sandwich Road is not located in a water resource protection overlay district, and that both parcels
are currently zoned for agricultural use and operating as a commercial nursery. The planning board also finds that number one such other uses non-aggricultural had previously been accessory to the commercial nursery
operations. Number two, the existing structures, parking and storage areas and other physical characteristics of the lots are suitable for the proposed uses. Number three, the lots contain a minimum
five acres based on assessor information. Number four, the bylaw requires that a front yard setback shall be a minimum of 75 ft while the side and rear yard
setbacks shall be a minimum of 50 feet. However, the board finds the lesser setback of 30 feet for the storage building depicted on the current plan acceptable as the applicant currently owns lot 2D and any future owner of said
lot will be on notice of the existence of the commercial nursery. And number five, the planning board finds that the activities including traffic between the subject premises and Sandwich Road will
not have an adverse impact on the neighborhood and that the construction width and grades of Sandwich Road are sufficient for safe travel to the site by the vehicles to be stored. Vehicles exiting the site will use curb cuts as
depicted on detailed plans subject to condition number one below. Findings specific to 240-11.2B4 of the zoning bylaw. The planning board finds that the redivision of 955 and 961 Sandwich Road
into lot 2C and lot 2D with a portion of lot 2D having a width of 40 ft is acceptable considering the topographic characteristic is characteristics and use of the site findings specific to 240-12.1
of the zoning bylaw. The board finds that the information provided by the applicant conforms to all the requirements of section 240-12.1E of the zoning bylaw. Conditions number one, the plan shall be constructed as
approved. Any changes shall be reviewed by the planning board to determine if a modification of this decision is necessary. Number two, the list of equipment, vehicles, and materials storage to be allowed on site shall be as represented
on the inventory list dated April 4th, 2025 that was submitted with the special permit application and attached here too. Number three, except as modified here, the conditions of approval of the
board's decision dated October 4th, 2011 and December 14th, 2016 remain in full force in effect. Number four, pursuant to section 240-12.1L of the zoning bylaw of this special that
this special permit shall lapse 3 years from the date it is granted if a substantial use thereof has not sooner commenced except for good cause shown or in the case of a permit for construction. If the construction has
not begun by the date except for good cause shown. Second. Thank you. Any discussion? Uh Bob mentioned that there was something else that uh was going to be added other condition or sorry I I don't I don't remember. Do you
have something that wanted to be added? I appreciate the hearing is closed, but I think that some significant paragraphs of at least the proposed decision I reviewed this afternoon uh were not read. When they were sent to me, they were in a lighter print. Um but they
don't seem to have been printed uh in whatever you've read. Um, and they include uh a number of your customary conditions and important language such as the planning board determines the application to be in harmony with the general purpose and intent of the chapter. In any case, I'd be happy to
give you what I have which there are several paragraphs you didn't read. So yeah, just for clarity sake, the reason they do that, the board wanted to try and create these readings of the draft u motion, they wanted to create
brevity. Um so there's certain sections of the decision that uh we highlight for them to read specifically, but it to attorney's point, that section might be worthwhile to read into the record. What you're saying is that the decision
itself will include additional language from what was read. Correct. Fine with me. All right. So, I was asking, but we can start from the beginning. Sounds good. I think it's a point worth making to the people who are here that as Jed pointed
out, these are shortened decisions so that the highlights are brought out. But if you want to see the full decision, you can always see it online or go into the planning office to see it. Correct. Well said. Okay. So, is is Mr. Almond's concerns
contained in Yeah. Yes. Yes. is. Yeah. The one he brought out was um in harmony with Okay. Thank you. Anything else, Paul? No, that was it. Anyone else have any questions or comments?
So, we have a motion. It's been second. Mhm. All in favor? I I unanimous. Thank you. Uh so the next hearing this evening is um a hearing that I'm going to recuse myself from.
So yeah, I'm ready to take over. Okay. Thank you. The chairman does this when there's a potential conflict of interest that it could potentially even in the furthest reaches be considered a conflict of
interest. Madam vice chair, um the clerk has the reading of the so please read it. Okay. So this was published in the newspaper. The date was June 27th, 2025 and 38 abutters were sent notice by
regular mail. Please state your name. Uh good evening. For the record, Tim Santos from Merill Engineers and Land Surveyors representing the applicant. Uh the property is located at 428 Carrot Shop Road. Um the applicant is proposing
to develop the existing vacant lot at 428 Carrot Shop Road with a proposed five lot plan residential development. Um the existing lot is shown here on the town GIS highlighted in green. It's an 8.9 acre lot on the
southern side of carriage shop that is surrounded mostly by residential properties except for this property right here that is a townowned open space. Um the existing parcel is located in the agricultural a zoning district
bay coastal pond overlay district and the wildlife corridor overlay district. So, I'm going to jump over here to proposed plan to go through a few things with you. Could you speak up, please?
So, the proposed plan is before you right now. What we're proposing to do is construct a new roadway to service five lots ranging in size from 21,714 square ft to 63,453
square ft. The lot frontages range from 60 linear feet to 168 linear feet. All five lots are greater than the 10,000 square foot minimum and the 50 foot lot frontage minimum for planned
residential development. Uh the length of the road is approximately 775 linear feet long and we are requesting a waiver to increase the length of the road above the 500 foot length that is typically required by the town. The
proposed roadway, drainage, and utilities will be constructed in accordance with the town design standards. We are proposing a sidewalk within this development as well. Um, it was a referral that I received today from the uh town engineer and if
this project were to move forward to the definitive stages, we would address any concerns that might be in that referral as well as the other referrals that are online. Uh the applicant is proposing to construct single family homes on the lot. All the lots will be served by town water as well as on-site sewage disposal
systems. The applicant is also proposing to incorporate denitrification systems into each lot in order to improve the water quality from these new homes. As part of the open uh as part of the plan residential
development, the applicant is proposing uh 4.4 4 acres of open space that basically start at carriage shop road follow along the eastern property line and then wraps back around to the
western property line to the road layout. This open space does touch the town owned open space and we feel it's a benefit because it will increase the contiguous open space that the town currently owns. So that that's kind of
basically the project in a nutshell. If the board has any questions for myself or the applicant, we'd be more than happy to address them. Does anybody on the board have any questions or comments at this point?
It's brand new in front of us. So I have a question. Jed, do you can you give us an example where we waved the 500 foot thing on a subdivision in in the past? Uh, let's see. Recent examples
would be the central a subdivision 187 central Lav. I believe you waved the 500 foot uh requirement there. Wasn't that just a like 20 ft? it was but still um beyond that nothing that's come before nothing that's come before
you since I've been here. Um however in the past you have done it um not necessarily maybe this composition on the board but the planning board said it in the past um in several situations. I just can't give you the exact locations off the top of my head. I know Caitlyn Hills Drive
I particularly remember requiring it in lots of them too. I don't remember. And I've been on the board a long time and Pat's been on longer than I. Yeah, I'm getting pretty gray. Much greater than you, even though it doesn't look like it. But I I Is it important that we do this? I mean,
this was it was proposed that it was a life safety issue, right? That if u you know, the street got blocked off and it's so long that you're trapping people there. And we I know Timothy Borne Cartway, we made them put in a a roadway. I mean, that's why
Drooie's not sitting here because he had to do it to uh do it on his lots. There was a a street that was put in. Yeah, there was a loop. The loop that was put in and a gate and a Nox box and a fire department. There's all these requirements that at some time
we thought it was important. I'm not arguing it, but when do we change? what what's going you know Jim you're right we have turned things down for this this is a 225 ft ask and that's half again the length
of our requirement for the roadway and I don't know I'd love to have some research done to see whether we've allowed that that's really what I'm asking you show us other It's not it's not a dimminimous in my opinion. Sure. Yeah. I will point out that you know the fire department did provide a referral.
They didn't have any issue mention any issue with the with the length of the roadway. They just looked at the you know the um horizontal and vertical clearance for access. I have spoken to the fire department in the past. Doesn't
appear to me that the 500 ft is a major issue anymore. um they feel confident to be able to get through when they need to. Um but I could certainly check back with them just to make you Yeah, I mean if they they waved it off. I mean that's I thought they were the ones that were requiring it. So
I mean that's that was their issue. Well, if it's not a major issue anymore, I'd like to know why it's not. Do they have more powerful squirts or what? Right. Hoses are longer, trucks can get where they couldn't before, etc., etc. I'd like to know why in this town that
are longer than 500 ft. I know, but that's before the bylook. I know. I know. Yeah. So, we I think I'm glad you brought that up, Jim, because I think we need to have an understanding of how we want to proceed in the future, and we may wish to change the bylaw. We want to
allow long. Well, I think the biggest thing is whether there's a hammerhead or rotary at the end, uh, you know, culde-sac at the end, uh, some way for, uh, emergency vehicles to turn around. That's that's always seems to be the issue.
No, there's another issue too though, Bob, that we brought up and that is if something happened that the residents couldn't get out if if it were blocked up at the entrance and let's say we had a wildfire in there, which you
happens. It seems it would be analogous to the to when exits from any residence, you have two ways to get out. I would suppose that would be the original thinking. I didn't think it was a fire department thing, but I'd be interested to know is there any other way to fit five houses
on this narrow lot? We did do um so some thought process definitely went into this in regard to the length of the road, the size of the lots, um the open space. Um, so what we were trying to do is create smaller lots
with smaller houses versus these giant lots with the mega houses because the applicant and myself believe that this town is definitely in need of for sale homes, smaller homes, smaller houses. Um, so that's kind of where the thought
process went in. I've been working in found previously at homes in McGrath. I was partners with Mike McGrath for many years. So, I've done a lot of subdivisions within this town and I believe back in the day it really was the fire department thing um and the
number of hydrants. You know, this subdivision we would be putting a hydrant at the end and you're probably going to end up with a hydrant in the middle because of the length between hydrants. So, this is going to be a full radius paved turnaround so the fire trucks can get around, emergency
vehicles can get around, DPW trucks can plow, curbside pickup. So it'll be a full cave radius in accordance with the town standards. So that was our thought process. Smaller lots, smaller houses for the new. Are you thinking that will bring the price down on the houses and make
Well, I mean, if you're selling a lot that's 2 acres, you're more than likely going to be building a house that's 5 6,000 square ft. Yeah. If you're selling a lot that's 20,000 square feet, you're probably building a house that's say 2,800 ft. And again, I'm not the applicant, so you'd have to
talk with him to see what he's specifically building. But that was kind of the thought process that we started with this proposal that's before you tonight. Just to give you a little background on where it came from.
Anybody else on the board? Y. Yeah. I just have a a not a concern, a question. This is a five lot subdivision. The first four lots are 21,000 square ft. The fourth lot is encroached by the culde-sac. I'm curious
why you didn't make all four of those identical and put the culde-sac on the last lot which is three times bigger. More value less street cost money to put a street in. Reason that's a financial it's just a it's just the way that the
applicant was looking to develop the parcel. It's a lot cheaper to have a shorter street. I mean part of the development I'm asking a question to the applicant. Okay. Please not interrupt. Part of the uh plan residential development is you can only have so many
lots than than an open space. So we had the first we had the open space three lots then we got an open space parcel. Then the next two lots came together. Um with that fourth and fifth lot on the culdeac you're going to have narrow entrances. So, we kind of you have that little I'll
call it a gooseseneck for lack of better terms. You have that little hockey stick that gets you out to the bigger open space. Um, you know, could that 60,000 foot lot be smaller? Yes. I can't stand here and say no, but that's what the applicant was looking for.
Uh, the other question is, do you have access to the open space at the end of lot? So, the open space will be donated to the town. That's the applicant's goal. I don't see access on the drawing. That's all. I have a question in our
I thought in our cluster zoning when we did this that the open space and I've done a lot of these that the open space was owned by everybody in the neighborhood and that's why there was really the right size. This is like new zoning. you know, giving it to the town
takes away all the other ones that I've been involved in. The open and I see them all over town. The open spaces collectively owned by everybody in the neighborhood. Right. The homeowners association. Homeowners association. Right. Right. I mean I mean I love what they're trying to do and make smaller lots and
everything, but it sounds like it's a new zoning article. And is this this is a cluster development, right? It is. Yes. This is your plan residential development. I don't recall if there's an option to donate it to the town. I'm that's something that we'll have to work out with the applicant. Um
but the default setting typically is as you're describing is that the homeowners association maintains ownership of the open space and maintenance responsibilities, whatever that might might occur. It appears to be a very clever use of that zoning.
It doesn't seem to contradict anything that's said in the zoning. And yet the homeowners don't have access under your thinking to the open space which was the whole point of having the this kind of a thing. And it appears to be a way to get as many houses as possible on a narrow
lot and then not pay taxes on the rest of the lot. I call that clever. Yeah. I I think that the representation was the fact that there's open space currently owned by the town that's contiguous to this uh site. And so the
thinking was that it would be a nice donation to the town. Whether or not that can actually happen is a whole another uh question. So, um, at current what you what's before you is whether or not, um, it's meeting the spirit of the
plan res planned residential development bylaw, which in my opinion it is. Paul, you could I just My question isn't who who owns it or what it is. My question is, is there access to the open space at the end of the lot?
That's what I was asking. Not who owns it or anything like that. I understand access as far as like public access. I'm I'm just trying to understand what specific access you're asking. Is it going to be open to the public? Is it just Well, if if it's donated to the town,
it's however the town would be using it. Okay. If it was not donated to the town, it would remain open space as part of the homeowners association. Would those homeowners have access? Everybody would.
Yes. down those narrow corridors. It I believe they're 40 feet wide. I 20t wide. I'm sorry. I can't see what this is. Down. Yes. Down this car to here and this corridor here.
It would be a walking path. I just want to say I'm not against this. This is just I've sat in meeting after meeting. We we've turned people down and made them do it a different way. And I've looked at all kinds of land in the past and said, "Well, you can't have anything more than a 500 street. It won't get by the planning board. You've got to do these things." I thought those
were rules. This could be great. We could build more land. I really like the idea. I don't want to be against it, but is this really just an interpretation? I'd like you to No. So, you in your subdivision regulations, you have the ability uh for
an applicant to request a waiver of any of your regulation rules. So, it's really just a policy that we had, right? It's up to the board to determine whether or not you want to grant those waiverss. So, the applicant can ask for them. It's up to you to decide whether or not you want to grant them.
Okay. I I don't mean to come across as against this, but I just have sat in meeting after meeting and looked at I know John Dulie probably wished he could have done uh what is it? U path uh the path in Yeah, I know what you're talking about.
I I born Timothy Bourne Cartwway and the construction of a gate and the fire department and a knockbox and we we've made people jump through hoops that we're just not doing anymore. I'm okay with it. I just want to understand is that what that's what we're doing as a board collectively. We know longer need
to do that. But we did it for a long time. So yeah, and and and I would the guidance I would say uh is to rely on the referrals from town departments. If they indicate that they don't have a problem with the length of the roadway, then you know those are the working
professionals that will end up serving that roadway. And I'll make one more comment. Over my years here, I've seen that professional opinion change depending on who's sitting in those positions quite a bit and I'm okay with it, but I'm just I just don't want to get I want to explain what my thoughts were on it. and not
everybody remembers it, but well, I have just a comment because on this this is essentially flat property and if a firetruck had to get someplace, they just go through. They don't have a cliff that they have to jump off of or something like that. This is just flat
and they can go where they need to go if they have to. But it still doesn't if the residents are blocked in here by say a wildfire up here in the open space, which we're becoming more and more aware
of with the drought conditions all over the place. Um, it could be a problem. I'm just throwing something else that we have to think about. It may be that the fire department has no problem because yeah, they can turn around there just fine.
Oh, and and uh any others that have come before us, those applicants had the opportunity to ask for waiverss as well. They did. And if they did and we turned it down, there had to be some reason why we turned it down. Mhm. Charlotte,
I think we should be thinking about the large number of narrow lots that are very, very deep in town and that this is indeed a very clever way to get more houses on a narrow lot and it's likely to be setting a pattern.
So, John Jim's comment, this is like new zoning. I agree with that. It is like new zoning. It's the zoning that we want. It sounds like we have the ability to do it. I didn't realize it was discretionary. I thought it we I remember it being a pretty firm rule.
It's a rule unless we wave it. Well, then we can which is different from being discretionary. You can wave it. So, our choice is do we wish to wave it or not. Okay, I'm going to stop opposing it. I like the idea. I just was bringing it up because I thought I had to do it because
it's my memory. I didn't want to just ignore all these other decisions we made. We should think about it. We've been talking about adding density to the town, how to add density. And one way is to say on all these narrow lots that are deep, just make a long road, ask for a
waiver, and pack in a lot of houses. Density. Is this the way you want to do it? Because that's what you're looking at right there. I think you have to weigh that, Charlotte, though, with safety, too. The topography might be amenable here.
Grass. It's very long. Mhm. I mean, just just some thought too that if the road was 500 and there was no open space here and that rear lot went all the way back, you know, the applicant could build a
house way back there and have a 300 foot driveway. So, I mean, that's some of the thought process that went into this. I mean, I could just keep listing these little things off, but I don't want to waste your time. Um it wasn't we didn't just say hey we're trying to beat this
it's within the rag it says 500 square sorry 500 linear feet or if the board feels it's a benefit to the town they can wave it so that's why I'm asking we our thought process was smaller lots smaller houses that's a benefit to the
town open space that's a benefit to the town so that's why we're here tonight Charlotte it's true it is a benefit to the I'm not saying that it's not. I'm saying it's a new way to use land that we hadn't looked at before because the original thinking in creating these planned
residential developments was really to create a great deal of open space around clustered housing so that the housing takes up less of it so that everybody gets appreciation of the openness, the view, the recreational use of the land, just the beauty of it. This the beauty
is way at the back. It's great to have open land, but it's hidden open land. So, it's just it's a a completely different use of planned residential development than what was anticipated. It doesn't make it wrong. It's just different. And I think that we should
think about the difference and do we want to set this pattern or do we want to keep the cluster aspect so that you could have a roadway that circles around too, which you could do if you clustered it. Oh, this No, this
is a cluster though. Yeah, this this meets the cluster that I I believe this plan closer together, though. You don't have to look at this. It's really just I'm going to be quiet. I'm okay with it. I I just had a different memory of way we did things and it looks like people
have made the decision to do it another way and I'm okay with it. Oh, just Charlie. I'm assuming these people have come because they wish to comment. Oh, I know they do. Oh, well, we're finished. Okay. If we're finished, can No, I before you open up to public, just can the applicant say something?
Seeing that we sure that's part of our presentation. But Bob, you have something else you want to say? I just that uh I think as long as we have the uh boards or the uh entities that are involved in these like fire department and engineering, I'm I'm willing to go with them. I mean,
we we seek uh professional input on these and uh I don't want to be an engineer and I don't want to be a fireman. So, I think I know what you're saying. I'm not arguing. Yeah. Oh, I know. So, we were we were elected to exercise our
discretion over these things. That's what we're here for, not to say, "Oh, no. The engineer said it." Well, too bad. Okay. I'd like to have the applicant talk to us, please. and then we'll go to the public and your comments and questions.
Good evening, Joan Junada. U I have been working on this now for over a year and we had a lot of thoughts how different things talked to some of the neighbors um and we start thinking when I purchased the property we had a plan for
three lots. That's how I purpos was a a a first uh uh uh plan done by the seller with the three lots and the lots was almost three acres each so two and a half acres. So I
came and sat with uh uh the board couple of people in here and I talked to them and uh team and I had a discuss and we had a couple of different ideas to do a a 40B or and all those things and I totally kind of walk away from that
because uh then was pro was a idea to uh make this the donation like you said the the donation was the first lot to be a open space and the last part of the partial to be a open space doesn't
really matter to to to me if is town on or is the neighborhood on just to make things better. So when I look at this by when I read everything by right with a 500 linear feet road I can put three lots in there and there will be two plus
acres. So when I have when we had this idea to create more lots me uh financially like what uh uh Mr. Fox it doesn't really make a lot of sense for as a develop like I because I'm donating
land to to the neighborhood or putting more roads so and create one more lot. It's like a it's a balance. It doesn't really make a big difference because the road costs a lot of money. Utilities cost a lot of money. So I'm getting one lot and then was a point to me to say
just do a small lots because that's what town need to. So I said I you know I live in Walkway. I'm going to keep a bigger lot for my own for my family and I can build a for my a less lot for for my family and then we build houses for
smaller houses to make sure everybody is happy because it's when you build a when you have a lot for two and a half acres or two two acres it's very expensive and then you got to build a big house to support that. So, and that's what the whole thought uh pretty much. Uh, and I
got a email from Joe Jose Costa, a neighbor that to, you know, say it was a great idea. You know, I don't know any other the neighbors. I talked to somebody early on on he called my office and asked me and I called back and I said, I really don't know yet. So,
couple of month and a half ago, two months. So we decide we set some people in this room and it was those ideas to create a smaller lot to supply more a smaller houses for people and that's what we we thought about and thank you for
Did I understand you to say you are going to build your family house on the two acre lot? Yes. Yes. Yeah. So you would plan to live there too? Yes, I am. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. Okay. Now, I'm going to call on the public. If you have any comments
or questions, please go up to the podium and state your name so that we all know who you are. Hello, my name is Bob Baker. I live at 40 Crosswinds Way. I don't know how to use any of this stuff, but I'm one of these. I'm this lot, right?
Okay. Where where the culdeac is. Yeah, that's me. All right. And um I received the the letter dated 627. I went and got a plot plan uh which I will admit is challenging to read. The print is rather
small, but it did raise a lot of questions. Um I did have some questions on the lot size and that it was explained to me that the lot size was sort of okay because of the open space toward the back. Um I question whether there are any
restrictions on the open space. Um you know can they put in a playground? Can it come boat storage? What can it what can open space be? As far as the donation is concerned the town I came from we always turned them down because pretty much to me it's useless land for
the town and it just comes off the tax rule. So I don't understand what the advantage of donating the land to the town. Um, I think I can understand the plan and and the uh the people who buy
whatever houses there are here own that land. I can understand that. But I don't see any advant. It's an advantage to the owner. I don't see any advantage to the town to to, you know, it just comes off the tax rule. Um, the size of the houses was mentioned 2,800 square feet. Do you
have any say in that or is that just what somebody says here and then they can do whatever they want? it. I mean, I I don't know how this all works. I've testified in many hearings over my lifetime. This is the first one in a planning board, but um
we don't we can't control the size of the house except by the sideline lot coverage ratio coverage. I got it. Okay. So, that has some that has some restriction coverage. We're already in place. Okay. Um so, um there's no rendering of any pictures of the type of houses. That
doesn't come at all. Okay. All right. Um the the land all shows circles. Um is that a is that what the house has to be or is that just just those It shows that a house can be put on that lot?
Okay. All right. Um I have a question on the space question on the 75. Is is that the is that normally it's 100 foot for a lot but for a cluster it's 75. Correct. So that meets the bylaw. So it's a requirement to show that there's a 100 75 foot circle. If it wasn't a cluster,
they'd have to show a 100 foot circle. So, it's something we see all the time. Okay. Um, I was curious about the space. I can't really read this that well. The space between the road and the property line of all of us that live on Crosswinds Way. Um, how much space is
there between the road and our property line? I believe he said it was 20 feet. Okay. Well, then I have a question because at the back of my land I have a 50 foot wildlife corridor which limits what I
can do with that whole piece of land that abuts this. So I'm wondering why do I have or wouldn't they have a wildlife carter on the other side of I mean if my land's here's the wildlife. Wouldn't that be wild? I don't understand why I
would have one and this other land right next to me wouldn't have one. That doesn't show up here and that would impact where the road goes. Now, I'm not exactly sure what the wildlife carter is, but I was told many years ago that I have some restrictions like I couldn't
build on it or if I wanted to put in a fence, for example, I couldn't put in a stockade fence. Like if I if I hate this development, I can't put in a stockade fence because I have a wildlife carter. I can put in a post and rail because then animals can get, you know, through it and over it, but I can't put in a
stockade. So, I have restrictions on this land. So, I'm wondering why I have this wildlife carter and the abuing land would not have that wildlife corer. Um, should answer that. Yeah, I know. Jen, do you know the answer to that? So the answer is because this is a
preliminary plan stage, the consultation with the um marine and environmental services has not occurred yet. That will occur during the definitive plan. So think of this as your draft paper. Okay. Um and the final draft they'll have to go before or they'll have to consult
with me on that wildlife corridor. Okay. Um I did see something about underground utilities. Um was I right on that? I didn't see the word gas in there. Is that is that not in there? I mean, I thought it's
We should ask the applicant on the uh utilities. Well, I I just know that I bought land with underground utilities only to discover 2/3 through the building that there was no gas and then I I had to pay for a gas line to come 1,000 ft. And
again, this that all of the utility information will come forward in the definitive plan uh stage. This this think of this stage as more of is the plan as proposed acceptable to the board so that the applicant knows they should
pursue the next stage. Okay. I did have a question but I think it was answered tonight. All of these houses will have denitrification systems. I have one also. All right. Um, I I did find the culde-sac turnaround and access kind of interesting because
the street I live on is a culde-sac and we have no way out and that was approved by a planning board in 2004 and you know I mean you go in I mean any culde-sac is a dead end so isn't it I mean you because you were talking about you know access out but
there is no other access out it's pretty good size but the trash trucks invariably drive on lawn I mean there's a big circle there, which I know. Um, but the trash trucks try or they have to go and then back up and they come or they go on the lawn.
It's not easy for them to do it. So, I don't know what a fire engine would do. Although I have had a fire engine at my house once or twice, but I never saw how they came around the circle. Um, but anyway, so that was I guess that pretty much are my comments. Um,
thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Do you wish to answer some of his questions that he brought up? Can we can you bring up the GIS map and show the neighborhood lot? Sounds like he's got uh
you know because he he's talking about a budding lot. Sounds like there might be an example of where we let a right next door right next door. That's what I wanted. He was describing that we did this I wasn't on the board in 2004. Right. So I I believe this is Mr. Baker's lot.
And how long is that? Yeah, that's way more than 500 ft. Yeah, I measured it. It's approximately 850. Okay. Yeah. So, I I knew I was on board. You've got plenty of I knew we had some Well, I just wonder why we stopped doing it and we did it for a while and it probably related to an individual that
had a decision on it. Wasn't me and I just followed it. Now, now there's right an example right next door. We've given a waiver. Yeah. That's what I thought I was hearing. Do you want me to leave this one up or do you want the other one? No, I just I just thought I heard a waiver there and I did.
We live on a 2,000 foot road. It's dead end. There have been a few problems now and then, but they are all over the place. Yeah. And culde-sacs have been a standard uh diameter and
trash the trash trucks always have a tough time. I'm all in favor of it. I just for for 10 years we didn't do it. I just Yep. Anybody else? Yes, sir. I'm Ron Birdie. Um, I own uh from
Municas Madness. Uh we rent to the funny farm that owns all the virtually all the property that buts this one except on this side
on the east side I guess. Um we have horses, pigs, and chickens right on that property line. with that's
been existing for permitted by the town years ago. The uh board of health in their um permitting for the stables and the and
the um paddics require 50 ft from our paddics, our line. Our paddics are up to the line. So it would be from our line to any buildings that are going to be built.
This um looks under the the code um section 24127A. Um, they require no no less than 25 ft from the perimeter of the entire lot to
the to the property line or of the from the from the perimeter of the entire property to the back of the um of the of the uh of the of the plot for the house. So,
what I would require and request would be that the board and has the board has a discretion to increase that to um whatever it wants, I guess. But I I'm requesting that it be increased to 50
feet from 25 be to comply with the board of health rulings on the on the stables that are existing. Um the other thing is
um we would want for sure some kind of of fencing, substantial fencing to keep any kids or anybody else off our property because horses are big and they
move fast and you you don't want you don't want kids to be able to get on the property. Having said that, this is also a a wildlife um habitat um as defined on the town
maps. The entire property is except the part up by the houses up by the road is listed as um unrestricted. The rest of the entire property is shown as a migration area.
I looked at this property when we bought ours and at that time there was a whole bunch of wildlife corridors across this property. I can't prove it. I can't find it. And I don't know where
it it disappeared off the town maps. I have no idea. I can't find the wildlife corridors themselves. I don't know if they've been voted out in the last 20 years or what. I have no idea. Bay raid. The point is because of
the um wildlife um migration area, it does require that the um department of um natural resources be
advised of this project and they need to approve it. Um and it there's a 35day approval period for them and um and any open space if there's an open space that
is defined in the project as I understand section C of 249 93A um it does require that there be a permanent conservation easement or
restriction on that property. Um, I don't know what happens when you give it when you give it to the town and I don't I don't know if the this plan is going to require them to give to the
town or or what. Um, [Applause] the housing the houses um uh are pretty dense on this small piece of property. um as a as a as a
as a um resident of the town of Balmouth. I've been here a long time. I graduated from Lawrence High School. So, I've been I've been here for Lawrence High School. Um so, um I remember when all of these
um zoning laws were put in place. I remember when the Cape Cod Commission was put in place and all of that was done, these these these zoning areas were done to try and
reduce the the the the growth of the town because they knew back then that our resources are extremely limited and they didn't want a sign up on Felmouth saying, you know, with permanent water
restrict restrictions now, right? The one on 28 is because we can't supply enough water. We're putting sewer system without fall off of Nazka point because we can't do a
deal with sewer and the traffic is crazy in Felmouth. So, putting this kind of density on a on a on a wild acre lot, I as a as a citizen of Felmouth, I'm
concerned. Other than that, um Oh, yeah. He talked about putting fencing all the way up. That's kind of a double-edged double-edged sword here because the the um
the wild acre area um should be left um pretty much open because of the wildlife so they can move. We we do have electric fences up for our horses, but the deer routinely come onto our property. So, in
fact, we noticed the uh there was a deer grazing next to our cows on the other property the other day with the same kind of fencing. So, I'm I'm not I'm I know we're not interfering with the wildlife.
That's all I have to say. Thank you. Melissa Party. I run the Funny Farm, own it. Um, I just want to point out we're not just like a couple horses. We have uh 12 horses there right now and two cattle. One of them's pregnant and I
don't I don't know how to work this either, but uh my cow barn sits right about there and she is loud. Uh my arena's right about here and it's dusty. all of the paddics load dust that direction and um concerned about the the
people that move into those houses complaining about the horses that have already been there. Um and again, we have pigs and uh we try to be respectful and but they're pigs and they do make noise and they can get smelly. Um and my cow is loud and and the horses um who
have been there. And the way we have it set up, all of our our staples are on this property line here, near that property line, and then the paddics run right behind it on the line. So, I just want to make sure that
it's brought to attention that it's a potential problem for the people that are going to be buying those houses. Do you have chickens as well with roosters? Yes. Yes, we have at least four roosters right now. What's that? Crack of dawn. Yes. Oh, they start early. and my cow with her little barn right there. I can
hear it from my house up on the road. So, it's gonna be loud for those houses right there. Thank you. Does anybody else wish to comment? I've got copies of this for you guys. Thank you. If you could pass them around. That's
one thing. There are a few topics I wanted to mention. So, I'm Amy Vickers. Um, I'm on the agricultural commission for the town of Felmouth. I'm not here representing the town of Felmouth. I'm actually in a butter. So, my property is here.
This one right here. Um, and I can attest that I hear her animals from here, which I love. I absolutely love hearing the animals, but they are very loud. Which one is yours? Um, I'm way over here. Like, she's way over there, but I'm way
over here, and I hear the animals, so it's loud. That's number one. But also, oh, actually, before I leave them out, the two properties, neither of those people could be here. So um as you turn
on the crosswinds way on the left the first one and the second one those both have horse those both I think the first one had up to six horses the second one had two horses so that's eight horses and to make sure that their grand that stable
is grandfathered in for anything that someone is going to buy a house you can think about like the beach path situation like that you know I could list because we see that with agricultural commission where it comes forest and people getting upset that they've moved into a property that is an
agriculture. Oh, Jim is pointing out. Yeah. By the microphone because it's being broadcast so those who are watching us tonight can't hear. Everyone who listens you just so so making sure that that everybody gets grandfathered in on both sides
because that's how many horses. We have 12 right now. 12. So then eight on the other side. So that's a lot of horses. That's 20 horses that those situations need to be grandfathered in so the responsibility is not put on those owners to have to jump through hoops when a development in
the middle says you're too loud, you're too smelly, you're too everything. Um because if I'm hearing them way over here, you know, there's not a lot of people that will move into that situation and want to be in the middle of that. I mean, there are some, but you know, making sure that waivers are
signed, making sure that you guys don't become, you know, you're getting calls every day. The Department of Health is getting calls every day because that's cumbersome on the town. That's not something that anybody wants to deal with, but making sure that everybody is protected in that scenario. Um, so that
was the one thing and those are the measurements with the board of health. Um, so those would all have to be waved. um those would all have to be addressed for every single stable and every single situation. So that that was my number one topic. My second one is so when
crosswinds way when the permission was put in for that those last two lots right there I believe it was in February 2000 oh gosh 2004 um February 4th 2004 those last two lots where those houses were built were denied. That was
supposed to be open space. Six months later, those houses are put those permission for those houses is granted. And so that's I pulled up the paperwork on the town records that show that that's my concern with the open space is in six months is something going to change that's going to say, "Oh, well,
this is no longer open space. Here's two more houses." So making sure that that is a conservation easement because he was right as far as like how that has to be done for open space that is donated in perpetuity an actual conservation
easement not just a open space because there's a lot of those in town that have definitely been developed over time um because I come across them all the time. So that was point two. The third one is, and if you're looking at the map, let's
see. So, the triangle parcel right there. So, there are two barn owl um nests that have been there for over 10 years. At the back of the green parcel, where the open space is, which I think is fabulous. I love open space. There's actually a great horned owl nest in one
of the large white ponds. It's also been there for about 10 years. Um, but through my property, through the golf course where the ponds are, well, there's actually some a little pond back up in here. That is the corridor to the other pond where all of the turtles go. Um, so I saw one this morning. I saw one
yesterday. I saw one three days ago. That is their path. So that's why those wildlife corridors are there. So putting up a stockade fence that doesn't allow access for all of those turtles and all the bullfrogs and all of the endangered salamanders, that's a problem. I mean,
my my I I I like that part. I like the wild. I like to not cut that off because if we divert them to the road, they're just going to get smashed. Um and that's just not very nice. So, trying to come up with something that everybody can live with, that everybody that can work
with, that's that's not, you know, cut and dry. It's definitely lots of moving parts, but I they were here longer than we've been here, so I think that really deserves some consideration. Any questions?
Anybody? So, that was a lot. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Is there anyone else who wishes to speak? Tim, again, Tim Santos from Maryland Engineers for the Record. There's this fence thing that keeps coming up. We're
not proposing any fence. So, I'm not sure where that came from. I don't believe I said there was a proposed fence. No, it was one of the abutas who said if he didn't want to see the new development, he couldn't put up a fence.
That's where it came from. I just want to make sure that we're not proposing any fence. Yeah. Well, think it came out in his discussion that he would like to have a substantial fence put there so that no child I trampled by.
I didn't hear that. Okay. I'm just saying we're not there is currently there is no no fence being proposed on this plan. Okay. Okay. Anyone else any comments?
Okay. So, since this is just a preliminary subdivision plan, we have no action right now. Is there a time that you want to
So you can uh request that we put together a motion for you. Sounds Well, you have a member with a question. So I don't think we're ready for a motion. No, I don't think we are either. We're not even close. It's only a preliminary plan. So if they
come back with the definitive, let's start over again when we do the definitive plan. Right. I rather thought this is just a how do you do here's who we are and this is what we're thinking about doing tonight. It's like a slippery slope. Yeah. And nothing. Think of it more as recommendations for
the applicant moving forward. So you issue a decision that says, you know, we approve this preliminary plan as presented. However, here are some recommendations for when you file your definitive plan. Some of those might be um consider a shorter roadway. If you're
concerned about the length of the roadway, consult with marine and environmental services because we heard a lot about wildlife corridors, those types of things. Yeah. No, I don't think we're ready for any kind of a decision like that, Jed. Okay. I Yeah. No, I I want to see some of that information. Yeah. I want to see some of the
information. I want to be able to discuss it in greater fullness with the board to So, again, it's just the preliminary stage. So all you're doing is just giving the applicant um sort of the ability to move forward with a
definitive plan application which will essentially mirror what's um being presented here unless you have concerns about what um is being presented. At that point, you get into the fine bless you. You get into the fine grain details
about the utilities, about the wildlife, about um any of the regulations uh and whether or not they meet them or don't meet them. So, you get into that at the next stage. Jim, I'd like you to bring up uh
what we are required of the wildlife carters. I I I know it doesn't always apply to small little developments or I mean, but that was that toss that term was tossed around a lot of testimony, but I'd like to know what the actual requirements are for what the what the
town says, not just what Summer's opinion is on it. So, yeah. So, so as part of the definitive plan application, as soon as that's filed with the planning board and filed with the planning department, we issue the plan set to the marine
environmental services divisions, which is formerly known as the department of natural resources. Um, they have just like the fire department, they have an opportunity to comment and provide a referral. What we would what we would recommend as part of this motion for the
preliminary stage is that the applicant meet with environmental services before they even file the definitive plan so that they get a sense for what they're looking for and it meets their requirements before they even submit it. That's what it was getting. Yeah. Charlotte, the way this is organized now for
permitting this kind of a project, any project, has been so turned into a series of special hearings by special boards who have a narrow responsibility. So that the opportunity to look at it as a whole, to consider a question of whether or not the land can actually
take this kind of a burden across the whole town never quite comes up. And it really should. And it seems that the only board that might potentially have that responsibility would be the planning board. And to think about that when the town was originally zoned,
residential, agricultural, and so forth, there was a lot of thinking that went into that and preserving the agricultural nature of a good deal of the land dealt with protecting the burden on the whole land. Here we're seeing a new use of agricultural land to
add greater density than probably was ever anticipated and there's an example of it beside it around it. But the one that's being proposed now is much more dense than any of those that are around it. So I think that we ought to step back and really have a conversation
about if this is an agricultural zone, was this foreseen, should that be thought about? And I think that it should. And do we really want to see this pattern of a way to use a narrow strip of land to get the the economic benefit of four or five
houses and then have the owner have the open land behind them? I think it's it's allowable. I see no way to prevent it under the restrictions of our specialized zoning, but I think we ought to look at it for what it is and think about it. I'd like to have the planning board have
a more more wholesome discussion before we ever got to the point of asking our staff to put something together for a recommendation that then would go to the final plan. I I think there are a lot of things that were
brought up tonight that we haven't thought about, we didn't know about that I would like to have a greater discussion about as a board before we ever put a blessing on something with oh, you got to look at this, you got to look at that, right?
because I don't think I don't think it's ethical for us to have this many questions, including those that were brought up tonight by the residents in the area to say, "Oh, go ahead and we'll work it out somehow." That's a lot of
expenditure that's put into a final plan. And I don't think it's ethical for us to do that kind of thing. So, thank you. Thank you. Yes, sir.
Um, two questions. Um, if the land is the open spaces to be given to the town, does that have to be voted in at town meeting? Yes. Yes. Has to be accepted? Yes. Town meeting would have to vote to accept that land. All right. My second
question is as as an auter what's on the agenda of all your meetings. Well, so tonight that I just just want to know what I need to do. Sure. So tonight the planning board will it sounds like continue the matter to a date certain. They'll give you the date of when the applicant is set to appear
again. Okay. So your notice is being here tonight. Okay. Thank you. Just one more thing on the plan. Um there is a fairly vague there's there's an area
here defined as a um drainage area off the off the um culdeac. And it's unclear what that's draining. Is it just a culdeac or is that going to be the draining for but where the water
for the for the culver sack and that road gets drained too? Um and the reason I'm asking that is I know that's a fairly low area. So if there's a lot of water put to that area is going to come onto my land because of
the terrain the way the terrain is in that area. So, if if we could just also on your list of things to look at, if you could look at that drainage area and find out the extent of of what's going to be drained and how much water and under
what conditions, that kind of thing. That's always a requirement in our decision that there be no runoff onto surrounding properties. Okay. Like I just know that's a really low area there that uh it used to be the 100redyear storm. Is it still really really heavy? It's actually 25
year 25 year. Okay. So any rain that occurs that's a 25 year storm has to be capable of being received by that drainage basin with nothing going onto any surrounding properties. Okay. So there'll be a requirement of
some kind of u crush stone or the trench or it's it's within the plans for building it. Okay. This is not included in the site. No, this is a preliminary. So Okay. Thank you. We wouldn't have gotten into that detail. And this is also what we're discussing now is a lot of this is
really new territory for us to be considering. Madam Chair, if I may, just a point of clarification. So, um, as you'll notice in the staff report from the engineering division, this project is likely going to be disturbing more than an acre of land. That means it's a storm water
management permit. So, I'm incorrect. Our regulations for subdivisions is a 25-y year storm, but because in this situation they're required to get that management permit, you'll be looking at more of a hundred-year storm. Okay. So, more stringent regulations for that.
Okay. Okay. And if I may, one more item. Mhm. Um so your regulations say within 45 days of submitt of the application the board has to uh essentially issue a decision and notify the clerk of the
decision. 45 days if you look on the agenda is July 21st. So just at a minimum we'll be asking the applicant for an extension because your next meeting is July 22nd. But I if I may just make a recommendation that because
the wildlife corridor is so sensitive and so predominant in that area that you may want to consider continuing if the applicant's willing to the 22nd and in the meantime asking them to consult with marine environmental services and see whether or not
that wildlife corridor is going to prevent or create issues with developing the subdivision plan because to your point it is an expensive endeavor. So it would be best to figure out what the issues are beforehand. I think we need to have both things. I think their ears were wide open tonight
as to the comments made by the utters and the questions asked by the planning board. So I think they were listening quite intently. Um and I would pay heed to these things that were brought up and yes I see absolutely no reason not to
consult with other entities at this point. Yeah. just particularly the wildlife corridors simply because of the fact that it does cover the entire site. So and then we would need an extension because our alternative is turning it down. Correct.
So we need Are there questions also about the agricultural rules? Yeah. Well, that's all part of what they hopefully were listening to the setbacks the re agriculture. They should be consulting with them also. Mhm. Yeah. I I'm fairly certain although I I
will consult with others um on this fact. You know, Felmouth is a right to farm community. So, I don't think although I'm not an expert in it, but I don't think there's any standing for future residents coming in and claiming that there's an issue related to farming
and animal uh raising of animals because we've declared the town has declared that it is a right to farm community and therefore they're protected already. But I can confirm all that for the next meeting. Yeah, that's why we need a next meeting and it's why we need an extension given
to us for time. It's not a problem. Great. One more comment. I believe there's a hundred parcels like this in towns. Mhm. On agricultural land. Oh, no. All over. All over. Everywhere.
But they are all distinct. They all haven't been developed in the past since we put in the 500 ft. And we're going to change that. Well, we may or we may not. I'm just pointing it out. There's a ton of them. And they may all have their I think it's a great idea. I think Charlotte's right. It's very creative. I'd like to see it happen.
No, no. I said it was clever. Clever is a notch down. Clever idea. And we need the housing, too. I mean, that's really They're We're now putting uh We not We're not advocating right now,
Jim. Uh Paul, yeah, I'm not suggesting it, but I would like to go out and look at this site. I'm not suggesting a site re visit, but I would like to go out and look at the site for the next meeting. Yeah. And if you could print out that thing, it'll be easier to find it because the Yeah.
locus is not very It's not very good. Hate to bring it up. Great. Thank you. So, we need from the applicant an extension and we need a date certain to bring it up. July 22nd is your next meeting date.
Okay. Do you want to bring it up on the 22nd to discuss? Yeah. We need to extend the deadline then. Correct. Right. We do because otherwise we just turn it down. We'd have to Well, I So you you have the option of turning it down tonight.
Tonight. I know. Um, however, if you don't take action, uh, it could be constru constructive approval, which again, all that does is shorten the window of time for the applica for the board to weigh in on a definitive plan because when they file a
preliminary and a definitive, there's a consolidated time timeline. I won't get into the details, but that's the implication. So, may we have your your approval tonight for an extension? I'll request uh a continuence and I'll
sign the extension. I we don't have an issue with that, but you know, you're giving us two weeks to meet with the Department of Natural Resources and you might see another continuence request if they can't meet with us. I I just don't want anybody to think that we're just trying to push things out because
clearly we want to be able to answer all the above concerns. and have the board get that warm and fuzzy feeling so we can move on to and it's also summer and we know what happens during summer. I'm well aware of that. I mean you can you can continue if if the
applicant wants you can continue them to the 12th of August too. It's I'm I'm away for two weeks and that's one of the weeks. So it sounds like you're not happy anymore. So, so I'll I'll go with the 22nd and hopefully I apologize if we need to continue it longer, we'll
not do it during your vacation time. Vacation. Okay. I really thank all of you for your responsiveness tonight and your thoughtfulness and your comments. Thank you for coming. Okay,
Jed, are you going to email me the I will. All right. Yeah. Perfect. I didn't know if you had it. That's all. I'll be Thank you for your time. Can you print out that jour? I couldn't find it. Okay. All done for tonight. Thank you all for listening.
Well, we appreciate you coming and being as involved as you are. Right there. Same street. Oh, right. It go it goes all the way from 28 all the way up to fresh pie. You shouldn't approve this. What was that? If you were listening, I assume
it. Yes. Thank you, Pat. Literally, we're still have a meeting. We still have a meeting going on. Please look what that would accessory department is going to do is already doing though. All right. Thank you. Thank you, Pat. You're quite welcome.
Also, I want to say for the record, I recused myself from this hearing, not because it's a fine residential development, and I've done those in the past. I recuse myself because I made an offer on this property before this applicant did.
So, I I felt it wouldn't be fair to me to sit on this hearing. So, that's the reason why I recuse myself. You're such a fair guy. Well, that's why I made the comment I did earlier. Well, I don't want any uh any concerns, right? But the street Timothy Born Cartwway, I
remember where you were even on the planning board. You had you're the one that I remember had to put in the gate, the fence, and the the road and build all that. I did, but that had nothing to do with the recusal this evening. No. No. So, the next thing on our agenda is the
planning department report. Uh thank you, Mr. Chairman. Um, so you know, it's bit of a broken record, but we are continuing to work on our zoning amendments. We met with town council and our new associate town council uh last
week and discussed some of the items that we previously discussed with you folks. So, we are thinking to Jim's question earlier about revisions to the ADU bylaw. One of those revisions might include removing the planning board as the spe as the site plan review granting
authority um and giving it entirely to the building commissioner. But again, just a discussion item. Um, part of the attorney general's um, response to our modifications to the ADU bylaw in November of 24 was indicating that we
need to allow ADUs by right in the business district because we allow single family homes in the business district. So therefore, we need to make an adjustment to the use table and now allow ADUs in that area. We're making small tweaks to the maximum building
height table. Um, so there's some confusing language in there that we want to try to eliminate. And then, um, uh, focusing on accessory structures. So, there's a pro, a prohibition currently, um, on having an ADU within a, um,
property or a lot that's over two acres in size. Um, and so we see that as an issue with the Affordable Homes Act. So, that's a a minor tweak that we want to make. So, we've got a handful of zoning amendments that we want to bring forward to the board, explain more in more
detail at your next meeting and then we are looking to potentially open the public hearings in early August. So, we may have a public hearing opening by August 12th depending on advertisement window. So, we're working hard on that. We met with the Cape Cod Commission
today about our um MR COD mixed residential commercial overlay district design guidelines. Um we're a little bit behind schedule by now. We were supposed to have a draft um guideline document, but we're sort of still in the phase of planning our um public workshop. So we
went over sort of the overarching themes for for that design guideline. Um so that's good. We've we've uh sort of uh continued work on that. And then the last update is, as you may have seen uh in the paper, we've been working really
hard on the town land u request for proposals. Uh we intend to have a public outreach workshop, if you will, or a meeting on July 23rd uh at the senior center where we essentially have the
draft RFPs out for the public to read, ask us questions about, provide us comments um so that we can provide that feedback to the select board later that month. And you know, um, all things going well, the select board being in a place to issue or approve us to issue
the RFPs, uh, as amended, um, in in any way that the public sees fit. So, we invite the public to come to July 23rd, senior center. I think we're, um, starting it at 6:00. There'll be a flyer um, in the next day or two distributed
to as many people as we can find. Um, so that's been a lot of work. We've been busy doing all of that uh for the past couple of weeks. So that is the planning department's report. Thank you. You're welcome.
Um any other committee reports? I I have uh uh two for the uh Cape Cod Commission. I want to make the uh the board and the public aware that we're having a second hearing uh Thursday at 5:00 Thursday this week. A Zoom hearing
for the uh Cape Cod Country Club for the solar array is being proposed. This will be our second hearing. And then also the Cape Cod Commission is going to present uh the for discussion the regional policy plan
um on July 30th at 5:00 at the Fland Public Library. I think both those uh are mentioned on our on our website for the planning board. John, would you say that again the dates that they're doing that? So, um, we're
going to have it on July 30th at 5:00 for the for discussion for the regional policy plan. They've been working on it for about a year now. We're pretty close to finalizing it. Is that on their website now, the plan?
It is. Yes. And on the 23rd, it is what did you say again? Senior center. Correct. That's the town owned land RFP review public meeting. And this week on the 10th, on Thursday
the 10th at 5:00, we're having a second hearing for the solar array at the Cape Cod Country Club proposed. And that's all I have for uh committee reports. Uh do we have any announcements?
Oh, future agenda items. I'm wondering what what is happening? Um we were going to do something about the dark sky thing and is is anything happening? So as part of that design guideline um
document for the Mr. district is going to be um in fact we talked about it today with them uh an expanded section on dark sky compliant lighting or lighting in general. So it's not just the shield that creates the dark dark
sky compliance but also the materials that make up the post, the style of the post, all of those things. So we hope to have some important information for the board to consider and utilize potentially in all of your projects.
because that will apply only to very limited areas in town. It will only apply to that. However, you have the ability to essentially use that information to ask applicants to consider that style when moving forward.
So, they'll be able to provide you some um characteristics and some examples of good-looking lighting that applicants can consider in their developments. That's a condition we could put on a site on a subdivision. It's not necessarily a condition, but you would
work with the applicant to make sure that they're aware of it and, you know, essentially ask them to do it and ask them to um promise to do it. Uh you could essentially put it in as a condition that the challenge is that you get into the details of street lighting
that really isn't present in your regulations. I mean, that's another thing that we're trying to bring forward is some amendments to your regulations to give you more detail and more meat to really provide to an applicant and say, "We really want to see this style." Right now, your regulations is sort of
they're a little wide open for subdivisions. It's good to have something. Yes. But it's better to have something that's widely applicable. Agreed. Agreed. So, it'll be a learning curve for for everybody. In fact, it won't be just lighting. It'll be landscaping, too. You know, we see a lot
of the uh comments from the board about increased landscaping and making things look better. The questions that we have is, you know, how what are some of the typical plant materials that the town would like to see? What which ones are drought tolerant? Which ones um are, you
know, best for this type of environment? Those types of questions we're asking the Cape Commission to sort of help us out with. So, as part of that design guideline effort, we've sort of got this side thing going where we're trying to give you guys a little bit more information that you can use when you're
reviewing site plan review applications and special permits. John, does the regional policy plan address lighting? I don't believe it does. Yeah, it's all the larger issues. It may
No, I don't believe it does. You could and the library on five o'clock. I'm going to be out of town on the 30th. Yes, Bob. And I keep bringing up transfer of development rights and I'm just
wondering looking at this project that was before us tonight. Um I could see that as a prime candidate for transferring those rights to some place where we really would like the density. Uh, and now that we've freed up some town land, uh, I wonder if our current
uh, transfer development rights bylaw would would work with that. Um, it's really tough. The the TDR bylaw is very difficult to use. Yeah. Um, you know, I'm I'm sure we can go into it in in a separate meeting, but, you know, the basic premise is, you
know, you're transferring the development rights, but then you have to put it into a subdivision. Yeah. And not every receiving property has the ability to make a subdivision. So it's well that that's why I'm I'm talking very what properties have been freed up and to look at those
just a thought wishful thinking we'll get there Bob we'll get there I promised I promised Paul Shiver pond and look it we got shiver pond so we're going to get there this is what three uh town plas
you go fishing off that platform We were last week. Yeah. Yeah. It's got a lot of turtles in it. Mhm. Yeah. It's fantastic. Yeah. Any other future agenda items? I make a motion we adjourn at this point. Not yet. Not yet. We have to address
general correspondence. We have nothing. We have nothing. So, uh, ne next meetings are July 22nd and August 12th. And now I will ask for a motion. So move
sitting here. No one second it. Second. I'll second it. All in favor? I [Music]