all right we'll call the meeting order on behalf of the Planning Commission i' like to welcome our residents and viewers to this regular meeting of March 11th 2025 on tonight's agenda we have three discussion items before we get into those we have one housekeeping item and that would be the minutes from our
February 11th regular meeting are there any additions or corrections to those minutes if not is there a motion I'll make a motion have a motion for approval is there a second second motion second all in favor say I I I minutes are approved I mention we have three
discussion items um they're listed on the agenda with the commission's permission I'd like to um just modify the agenda and we'll move 4.1 to the end so that the uh applicant has time to arrive and be part of the discussion is that acceptable all right don't
acceptable with staff yes sir all right then we'll move on to the second one which is the Vermillion Commons fifth edition final plat Tony you're going to take this I am thank you Mr chair commission members before you the this evening is the final plat for vermillian Commons fifth
edition uh lenar is the applicant and they are seeking review and approval of the final clat for set fifth edition um the Edition is located to the southeast of the vermillon comm's fourth edition and just uh to the west of the intersection of Denmark Avenue and 220th
Street West as shown on the location map up on the screen the red area is the uh portion that is being requested to be final platted this evening the plat itself consists of 66 town home lots spread over 7.25 acres of
land it is consistent with the approved preliminary plat um the preliminary plat also contains 67 single family Lots uh these single family lots were final platted as the fourth edition of vermillian Commons last year the
property is zoned R3 which is our medium density residential zoning district and it's part of a planned unit development again which was approved last year uh the Pud does allow for uh some deviations for the town home specific
area um specifically private streets within the R3 Zone and reduce width of of the private streets typically those are at 26 ft um what was approved with the PE is to reduce that down to 24 ft uh the final plat does contain 12
outlots those outlots are labeled a through L outlot A contains the private road or roads uh which service the uh development and the REM remaining outlots consist of common area that surrounds the town home units uh these areas will remain under control of the
HOA as as well as ownership of the HOA uh this is the plat showing the uh layout of the town home lots and the private streets as far as transportation and parking access for this uh addition will
come from two access points along 218 Street West the first one would be on the north side of the development and the second near the southwest corner um as I had previously mentioned all streets within the fifth edition are private and we'll have a with to 24 ft
temporary access is shown extending from Rose Drive which is that Main North South Road through the uh Town Home Development out to 220th Street West this will provide a secondary emergency access for both the fourth and fifth editions um as 218 Street in the town
home uh development directly to the east um they will not be constructing 218th Street um connecting into the fourth and fifth edition we had this discussion with the fourth edition because of the gas pipelines that run
through that property and one of those pipelines is set to be decommissioned within a year or two and it's just not cost effective right now for them to put in a street just to have it ripped up in a year to do that work um so this uh
additional um access um will help with um providing a secondary or emergency access for the fourth and fifth editions uh code requires that 132 off street parking spaces be provided with the fifth edition that is two parking
stalls per town home dwelling um each town home unit will have a double car garage uh as well as additional parking uh provided on the driveway Additionally the developer is providing uh 26 off Street visitor
parking uh spaces um throughout the uh addition as well so they're well in advance of um Meeting those requirements as far as Parks trails and sidewalks uh acre and a half parcel was needed to the city with a fourth edition
uh this is Outlaw a of Vermillion Commons fourth uh this met the park dedication requirement for the entire preliminary plat which does include the fifth edition um so with that no additional Park dedication or cash and Li will be required with this uh particular final
plat and then as far as the sidewalk uh there's there's a 5ft sidewalk that will be provided in the fourth edition specifically on the south and east side of 28 18th Street essentially adjacent to this development uh which will service the town home
units the engineering department has reviewed uh the ran Comm fifth edition final plat and recommend approval upon satisfaction of all engineering comments related to the construction plans for grading and utilities as well as a developer entering into a development
contract with the city and and security fees and cost paid so with that I'll stand for any questions Tony before we ask the applicant developer to come up here can you just explain to the commission
um process or progress of uh 220th Street being uh asphalted and and you know 218 is going to tie into it someday and it's going to be a pretty important intersection yep um our city engineer has been working with uh Eureka Township
it is a town Line Road so half of the road is in the township um we are working with them um to uh pave the road it'll likely be a rural section and also put utilities um specifically water for looping of our system in that
RightWay um I believe they are going out for uh final construction drawings here relatively soon so then anticipation it should be happening relatively soon as far as the work out there okay and the length of it will be to the end of this development then I
believe that is correct okay thank you very much anything else from the commission yet for staff if not Mr trosy do you have anything to add to the staff report no I feel far away though yeah I come on up closer you're always so you're always so shy and quiet so please
join us no one's ever called me quiet I know I nothing add I don't think he has anything to add all right we'll start and I I suspect you're going to have questions cuz I have a couple for you but so if you stay available Comm teski
uh yeah no I think this looks good um I just had questions about the the pipeline and and finishing it out but I don't have questions now that you cleared it up because you reminded me that we had talked about this at length so thank you commissioner winshuttle I got none that was part of my question so
commissioner snowback I'm good thank you commissioner Berg uh just one quick question I know at a previous meeting there were some residents here that had questions around dust and Road mitigation what the construction was going on I assume that was all I I think
we had a discussion about that I think they had some questions about added uh landscaping and screening right right I believe lenar has been in contact with them I believe Steve trosy lenar it's great to be here without a coat on so the neighbor to the immediate
southeast of Vermillion commins fifth edition was concerned about visual disruption so lenar is financing a solid fence for her so we're going to pick that up and okay she's going to pick the color the schedule her own
contractor we're going to write the check okay so she seems to be very pleased with that and we're we're happy we found a solution as far as noise and dust General engineering and construction best practices there was nothing specific to this
addition but whatever happened on the previous editions of Vermillion Commons would probably happen here as well okay thank you that's all I had any okay good and and Steve we appreciate that you know I know Miss I I remember the young lady um I'm glad you worked with her I mean
that's something we required or left it up to to you to work with and I appreciate you doing that could you give us a little timing of the of this phase and and what your plans are yes so we've got some more earth work to do
in fourth edition we were delayed due to some trout stream environmental issues so we're going to come in and put 218th in and then our hope hope is to build fourth and fifth editions at the same
time I don't know what the cards May hold there the town homes here will be the exact same as the rest of the Vermilion Commons addition I think we all know they're doing well we're we're we're happy were moving on this quickly as far as
timing you know what our development folks that are out in the field are they hit it hard starting last week so it's going to be expedited but I don't have a specific date for you okay other than as soon as possible and just as a reminder
of the commission and to the viewers you know it's a fifth edition the first four or three that I'm familiar with the fourth one's going to be starting have went well um sounds like the products being received well by um people of the community and people from outside the community you know my concerns were
again um the residents existing residents the one you call it the southeast you know right next door to the fifth and then the road getting done and getting done to the extent to the end of the uh development so somebody else in the future doesn't
have to pick that up so I appreciate that I don't have any other questions I appreciate it um all right let's look at this this is a um final plat so Tony um this is going to be a
recommendation to our city council so with that is there a motion motion to approve we have a motion for a favorable recommendation to our city council Tony's listed it with two contingencies is there a second a second have a motion and second call the
r please windsh yes tesy yes Rody yes snowback yes bird yes all right so our first applicant's not here yet so we're going to keep going in order then um this one is the Harris property concept plan and
again it's uh lonard is proposing this there with me while I get this set up here all right uh yes thank you uh this is a concept plan uh submitted by lenar for uh the
property generally uh known as the Harris property uh this property is located directly south of the Mystic metal subdivision uh and is shown in red here um on this location map um you can see Mystic Meadows is directly north with
Park View ponds and 195th Street um north of that as well so you have the railroad tracks uh that are adjacent to the east the property consists of two Parcels of land totaling just over 153
Acres the parcels were annexed in 2022 as part of the incorporation of Empire Township as a city the parcels contain approximately 20 acres of w land and 3 acres of flood plane uh due to the North Creek
tributary uh this is a copy of the uh concept set plan um we've gone through a couple different iterations of this to get to this point um just with discussions with the applicant um over time on various um
components of the plan itself um the plan shows a total of 297 297 single family lots uh the Lots range in width from 55 ft up to 75 ft uh the breakdown of those lots uh for 55t
wide Lots there's 163 for the 65t wide Lots uh shown 129 and there are five that are 75t wide lots and those are lots that are actually located within the Shoreland uh
area a lot area vary from 7,100 Ft up to 8,400 the setbacks are uh the standard setbacks for our R1 R2 District that would be front yard setback of 20 ft side and rear of 6
ft uh as I had mentioned five of the lots are shown in the Shoreland of uh Middle Creek tributary these five lots are required to have a minimum lot width of 75 ft per code um and impervious surface coverage of these Lots may not exceed 25% lot area now that's
impervious surface coverage so that includes everything from driveway to anything that does not let water go directly into the ground it's different than our building coverage requirement um that you typically see um with our
site plans or things like that so want to make you aware of that so but that is a contingency of being in the Shoreland as far as comprehensive plan and Zoning the properties are zoned and comprehensively guided as agricultural
currently resona the properties too likely an R2 low medium density residential would be required the development would also have be processed as a PUD uh in order to address the 55t wide Lots typically our R2 District
allows a minimum of 60 foot wide lot so there's that deviation there comprehensive plan Amendment would be required as well and would include uh basically three items land use guidance change from agricultural to low medium density residential incorporate the
properties within the Metropolitan urban service area or Musa and place the properties within a develop staging time frame of 2020 to 2030 parks and trails uh 9.7 acre Park is shown in the northwest corner of the concept plan the park location and size
has been found acceptable acceptable by the city's Park and Recreation Commission uh they actually reviewed and discussed that at their last meeting uh in February uh Trails for the county Greenway are shown along the eastern boundary of the site adjacent to the railroad
as well as bisecting the center portion of the the development going east and west the city is currently working with Dakota County and a preferred alignment uh for those Trails uh the location of those Trails will likely shift or could shift uh based on conversations that are
ongoing with the county uh we actually just met with them again today to talk about another portion of this uh not specifically here but uh south of here for that Greenway as far as transportation is concerned
plan shows the extension of both Delwood Avenue and Deerbrook path uh south from Mystic M neighborhood into the proposed development uh Diamond path will need to be extended South and connect to this development uh staff is suggesting that the northernmost and southernmost East
West uh Road connect to Diamond path um specifically this is require or staff is going to recommend that um B based on um if you just do the north one the north connection um you still have a potential
of cutting off basically that southern half of that development um it would be very difficult um the way this property is located it provides some challenges from a
transportation Network circulation even emergency service standpoint um so that's something that we'll certainly have to work with lenar on um if this moves forward so the action is requested this evening is to review and provide feedback to
staff and the developer regarding the attached concept plan so I'll move it back to that all right thank you Tony Mr try anything to add to this one Steve try lenar thank you um
I'm hoping this can just kind of be an open dialogue I think that'll be best for certainly me just talk through the issues I do want to start out by saying we have put a lot of thought into this we did meet with the Parks Commission there were some members of the public at that
meeting so we've tried to take in their feedback and we understand it's a very challenging site there's a pipeline there's a creek there's a river there's required bike trail from Dakota County there's some topographic challenges so
I'm sharing all that to say the site looks a little unique the way it's broken up but unfortunately that's the way it has to go with the unique characteristics of the site so we're happy to be here with this project with
the new community so with that I'd open it up for questions all right bill you want to start sure where to begin um looking at it you know a traffic
standpoint you know and I I think Tony and staffa brought up a good point that diamond path has to be connected to this development somehow um you know you look at deer Brook Path it's a wide road to
begin with and then you know from where dead ends there North is a wide Street wider than normal and where your development starts it starts to narrow so there's a concern there of the
traffic the number of vehicles going in and out of there and looking at this map if if unless I'm missing something so to the east they would basically have to go south and then hit some of these
culdesac streets to get to go back North to Deerbrook is that they would they would have to go basically through the entire neighborhood to get out that's that was also one of the reasons why staff was looking at that s
that southern road connection as well um because again the only way you're going to get that very Eastern portion or Southern portion um you know even from an emergency services standpoint if either one of
those you know roads to the north are blocked how do you get in and out it is a concern so if you're looking at you know Deerbrook path just north of where this
development would start there's that it's a path there now but looking at this it looks like it's going to be a connector road to the east of this development it could potentially it could potentially be why doesn't that just get developed
within this it is a separate property owner who at this point has no interest in selling property we did reach out to them to acquire the land and they said no even that small
portion correct and you know I guess looking at face value what I'm looking at here there certainly is concerns on traffic in in and out um that's my biggest take from it um because I just you
know you you take this development all the way in and you only have right you know one way in and one way out maybe an additional South Street but I feel like somehow there should be a exit on the east side through that development or
that other land area there likely won't be any access out to the east just just because of the railroad um unless you build a a bridge bridge or something yeah and that certainly just isn't sure
feasible from a land um amount of land it would take to do that um as well as approval from the the railroad to to do that so if you if you live on this Far Eastern Edge though your only way in and out is down
Deerbrook and then through that whole cue all those cu the saxs and streets correct and again that's why I was looking at staff is looking at that very Southern access connecting out to Diamond path as
well and again that's that's still a long route to get out but yeah well even that the further furthest furthest East Northeast part there where it literally dead ends
mhm you know then you look at that as a public safety issue there you know as far as fire trucks and stuff getting there how are they ever going to get turned around a police you know you know it's almost like you know like we've done in other developments as you you know you vacate two or three of
those lots just to make it a a turnaround at the very least a call the saac I'll have more questions I'm sure but we can move on I'm you know I think we're all right I mean typically what we would see with you know that where it um
basically terminates that area you're referring toh um typically what we do is they they either put in a temporary called the saac or temporary hammer heads until that connects up to the to
the north typically but is that property is that property or going to give you would you would do that you would have to do that on your own property unless you're able to get an easement from the property to the North so likelihood two of those lot two or three of those lots
may be temporarily a turnaround until yeah until it goes through right right here if there's an opportunity to dig into the second access to Diamond path i' I'd welcome that conversation there are some Financial challenges
and land ownership challenges in doing that so when we when you feel it's appropriate chair i' I'd like to get into that if possible is this is the land to the west of the Park
area there's nothing with that as of now the owners are just leaving no that's all owned by the Murphy family okay and as of right now I don't know that they've expressed any immediate interest in development I think they'd be willing to listen and
entertain a conversation but I don't know that they've expressed you know dire interest in development right now so realistically there's no way to get a road connected to Diamond path because we'd be going through their property
well again unless you obtain an easement from them to do so which we have they've committed to selling us the required land for both The Collector right of way and a construction easement one
connection through their property just one correct that Northern one correct yeah you know then you add that the park in there with you know with people coming and going to that and I believe Steve are is there a
traffic study being currently done as part of this correct so due to the size of the community state law requires an environmental assessment study on it which includes environmental study state historic preservation study traffic
study Etc so that's going to be a required document that will funnel from the city then up through the state of Minnesota and back down before we have permission to put a shovel in the ground so traffic will be a major component of that traffic study will be and I would
be certainly interested to see what that data shows you know and and coming from somebody that lives in the neighborhood um you know from a city perspective too I think it's important that the residents out there know what's going on
because there were these cameras on polls and people had no clue what they were the city didn't know so somewhere in between the miscommunication certainly raised red flags for people living out there we do
have a traffic subc consultant that is doing the necessary research I don't know the specifics on how they do their analysis just had them attached to the stop signs okay and they were decent sized poles you know you could look at it and see there was a camera sticking
out it okay but I'm just from the perspective of the community and letting people know what's going on and that the development is you know in the early stages and um that there are cameras out there you know are certainly something they'd like to
know that's it for now thank you you opportunity again Phil if you need to Kristal how about you um yeah so much like commissioner winshuttle I have some concerns around transportation and just the access to and from the development um considering the density and quantity
of homes in the area um so that's one of my bigger concerns um a lot of that area is wetland off to the east is that correct today I mean there's a significant amount corre right there is and so are we adding fill to okay not to
the what not to the what okay and then they'll be slab on grade type of homes or I can't answer that okay we're it's too early in the process there will be a mix there'll be a mix sizes price ranges garage stalls
Etc um and then my other question is with regard to the railroad and and the homes is there any sound additional sound proofing um added to these homes when they're built so a sound study as part of the
EA study that is being analyzed right now can I interrupt you there because uh North Creek buts up to the railroad further north and in hindsight I think the commission could have
required a burm or some kind of sound there is a burm out there it's not overly right I mean the residents that live up against it just isn't sufficient enough so I think if this proceeds Christa I think if you could remember that I think that might be something
good cuz you don't know who the people will be but they will need something I mean I the residents out in North Creek they certainly hear it and unfortunately the the the trains idle they sit and idle in that location and so they're loud okay um and I think in hindsight
that would have been smarter but you will hear it um so I'm just wondering about that and then oh my other question was um the studies the traffic studies do you know when they'll be completed no okay that's it what are they looking for
in the traffic study do you know as far as is it just counting vehicles or is it types of vehicles speeds so all of the above so in the you know engineering manuals that those
folks have when they do their analysis they've done studies that say each type of home generates or attracts a certain number of vehicular trips per home per day am p.m noon time all of the above and so what they do is
they say 297 homes is going to generate X trips in the morning X trips in the evening X trips on the weekend Etc and then they figure out based on the road layout within that community and what's
existing in the neighborhood how are those trips those Vehicles going to get out into the community to the larger Community Target grocery shopping School Etc so what the end result of the traffic study is is essentially how
heavily are each intersections going to be traveled at specific times during the day so you know the goal is you don't want a 25 car back up at a stop sign and the traffic study will analyze that and
say hey if you have it you need to move this or add another intersection or something like that so it's really driven by the number of homes in a community that's the main driver of all the data so with that study are they studying 195th and Deerbrook that
connection point they would be studying every intersection there was a camera there was a camera there okay um so completely different question now those five homes that have shoreline what can you define that a
little bit cuz I know we've we've dealt in our community with water bodies of water and people building beaches and things of that nature so can you just help me understand what that means Shoreland is the the beaches and whatnot that are
around the storm water ponds do not have a Shoreland because it's not a water of the state right um in this instance the Shoreland is typically I think it's a 300 foot buffer if you will um from the various
tributaries that we have um within the the community um and five of the Lots happen to fall within that we have a a zoning ordinance for Shoreland and that's where we get into the um minimum lot width the total impervious coverage
those type of things those standards then become in place if they they are to develop in that area okay very good that's it there'll be another opportunity for you if you have any Mitch how about you just interested the
ponds are those existing ponds or will some of those be created as storm water ponds they will all be created okay um and then the reasoning for going down to 55t Lots what was the background on that you guys have any background I think they're just looking to get a
variety of Home types within the development then um one last question is what was the Parkson Rex discussion about with was it the placement of the land or amount of land mainly the placement of
the land um that was the biggest uh concern um if you don't know the city did a master plan for the Mystic Meadows Park back in 2006 I believe it was or 2008 one of the
two um for a larger Community Park um that would service this entire area um that plan is it's outdated now um and I believe that uh the park and
rec commission will likely do an update to that plan um basically it uh was to account for I think 40 acres of land in total um 20 coming from this this uh the Harris
property and 20 coming from the Murphy property um the park in recommission is fine taking less land um than that because if we went any more we would actually have to purchase land um in
order to accommodate that what's being shown here is consistent with what we would be requiring for part dedication um so really it boiled down to the location and that was the biggest discussion last month with the park and wreck commission was the
location um and this is the location that the the parking Rec commission ultimately wanted and lenar has agreed to it at this time so is it partly due to the location next to the pre-existing Community is that why that's a where
they we looking at well it's that and we can still acquire additional land when the Murphy property to the West develops so you can still have a larger Park albeit probably not as large as originally envisioned with that master
plan from their mid 2000s well thank you appreciate it Andy yeah I think along with the traffic questions my questions are really around the construction
timing when it comes to that what I mean is are all the construction equipment coming down Deerbrook or is the plan to build an Access Road off off of diamond path prior to prior to construction of those properties it would be the ladder
okay you know at the beginning as they begin to construct Diamond path in the connection there may be some Vehicles down Deerbrook but after the connection is made out to Diamond path we would sign that no
construction traffic whatsoever I think that would be something for me want to see pretty well put in place before any construction began just to limit the amount of construction traffic coming down deer Brook right very busy
residential street okay that's that's all I had Derk all right um Steve I'm gonna have one comment then one question and then I'll let you get into what you wanted to talk to the commission about but my my
comment is geared more towards I'm glad you're want to develop it but you know sometimes development could and should occur naturally so that it's kind of contiguous and you got good traffic flow
and not concerns you you heard some or most of the Commissioners have a little bit of issue with traffic and you know the inability to build roads because there's another parcel there that I know you don't own and and I know you've worked with them but sometimes it
becomes an issue um so then my question is and you you run the numbers and and you got a lot of people that you work with that run the numbers is this project feasible with all the road work that you're looking to do is it feasible with all the road work
yeah yes it is okay cuz I mean it's uh it seems like quite a bit just to get it and you know I mean you're going out and everything else but that's that's something you guys got to do I just when you started looking at when I started looking at all the roads got to be I go
man there's quite a bit and you're going through other properties and all that and you know to me again back to my first comment is that you know if it would be built if the development would happen to the property to the West which you know you referred to as a Murphy
that would make this so much easier you know that then then I think the commission wouldn't have some of the issues that you're hearing tonight but I know you want to get into your your comments on what you've been working on and how you've been working through
it well thank you thank you for the honest feedback here we were expecting some of this if we could acquire the Murphy property tomorrow we'd do it so it's not a matter of not wanting it or a financial issue we would like it and and
the owner's aware of that they've been working with our acquisition folks on the right of way and things like that so I'm not necessarily privy to all those discussions I'm a a city guy not a land acquisition so forgive me for not all the
details we could only develop what's for sale and this property happens to be for sale with a willing seller we would like the Murphy property we'd like the property to the north we'd like the property to the South we would
take it all if it was available on the market unfortunately it's not so we need to progress through the challenges of the location of this site so when it comes to the access to Diamond path on a property that we do
not control there's a couple issues at play that are really important financially the first is it it's General good practice to not build a road and just leave it there and say all right we're done because then the next developer comes in and says
free Road the land owner says my property just increased by 20% cuz now I have better access so the folks that are smarter than me and the attorneys come up with ways to say all right we will front the money to build the road and then there's either a reimbursement as
the property sells or we have a first right of refusal or some other mix of options that I just don't know right now and so lenar wouldn't be building the road and then walking away there would be some sort of tie in with the hope to
acquire that land as soon as possible POS that's the goal here the owner knows it it's not a secret when it comes to a secondary access to the South there's a couple more issues that are more challenging the first is we have been given the right to
develop one collector Road out to Diamond path so D that collector is about 1,200 linear feet about $1,000 a linear foot to build plus the land acquisition cost of doing that so just the one East West Road Connections about
a million and a half bucks give or take plus you have to build Diamond path so if you want a secondary road to the South which will be built when it's developed hopefully sooner rather than later you'd have to acquire another
right of access from the property owner which we don't have you'd have to you know about another million and a half dollars that would go onto this community so that's about $6,800 per home just for another road
the price would increase plus whatever the cost of the diamond path extension is so the little swoop you can see the yellow dash line kind of swoops up north to connect into that drive that's there that's good because it connects
into it'll make a full intersection but also it shortens the need to build Diamond path no one's going to use it until it connects all the way down to the South so if you have another connection all the way on the south side to Diamond path you're really talking
about millions and millions and millions of dollars of infrastructure cost that the project simply can't support I think there's things that lenar would be willing to talk through with with staff and the the leaders here
we tried to avoid Crossing that wetland in the northeast corner that kind of the L-shaped Wetland that was brought up earlier you can't get permission to fill in a wetland for a residential Community you can't do it it it's just not even an
option right so we need to design our communities to avoid that as best as possible that's why we have one very small Crossing in the far Southeast corner of that L-shaped wetland in order to access some of those
homes on the northeast side I think that we could build in another segment of road from the yellow off of Deerbrook straight East to those orange Lots so can you see the mouse yeah so kind of in
this general area here potentially that would be an option that we could certainly consider to get access there in Li of a second Road out to Diamond path our hope is
that the Murphy parcel will be developed or acquired by us prior to that Northeast quadrant being developed that would be the last phase to be developed this is a very large community we can't build 297 Homes at one time so this will
be a multi-year multiphase project we would obviously start in the upper leftand corner where access and infrastructure is available and then as the market allows or demand increases for it we would go south and then we would swing back up East to the little
Island area in the upper right another item is the two pipelines that cross best practice is to cross those at as close to a 90° angle is possible the pipeline companies don't really like any
work any grading any additional cover any disturbance on their easements so it is quite a challenge we've got a project in your neighbor Lakeville we've been working for seven or eight months to get approval from the pipeline company to build a road across it so it is quite a
challenge so we're trying to minimize Crossings there as much as we can there's also two County required bike trails I'm I don't remember who brought up the issue about separation from the railroad but that is a great comment and
it's something that the Parks Commission brought up so we actually moved the rear of all those lots along the railroad track 100 ft to the West just to give a little bit more separation and the county said great we can put a bike trail in there so it has been thought
about if there needs to be more landscaping or BMS that's certainly something our Engineers can take a look at but we agree it's you know we want a nice quality of life for the purchasers who live there the pond locations that were
referenced those are just best guesses as of right now we just completed the Wetland delineation and that's at the the review authorities now the Wetland deline actually tells us specifically where the wetlands begin and end that way we have
a nice solid line on a map of where we can build and where we cannot build so that was just wrapped up I have a note about the traffic study I actually have a meeting with the team tomorrow I'll get a Best guess I will email Tony and he can disperse that information as
necessary on when that will be done so we can get it in your hands but I do want to remind you that there is a public review process public notice is it goes to the city council here and then it goes back to the city council here so the the state has really set up
these EA processes to have a lot of public interaction and public engagement it it will not slip by it it it can't slip by let's see those were my talking points here
any other questions I could address for you I I just got a a couple more and then I'll ask the other Commissioners um Tony other than the 55 ft lot what other PUD accommodations would this development be looking at um it might be a little too early to
tell um some of that would likely be fleshed out during the preliminary plat and PUD um as of right now the only thing I could really see would be the the lot size okay so how far down would Diamond
path be con constructed um well again it depends on ultimately what we require um if there's only one um access I'm sure Lenard would only build it to that first intersection yeah or just south of that first intersection but
well it's kind of premature to ask and Steve I understand your concern um sometimes things are just premature that's that's why I'm telling you that's why we're we're struggling here a little bit um and I know roads cost a lot of money I really do um that's why I ask you the
feasibility of this because I didn't know how far Diamond path was going to be constructed or are easements going to be obtained or are they already obtained he have they do have easements for um that Northern P the road out to Diamond path but Diamond path what what's the
status of that the easements and everything else uh going south South yeah um I think they they have the portion that connects into that first East West Road that's it then no nothing further so
that would be my understanding okay um what's your timing Steve for this project what what's your timing on this because I know you wished that you had more time to negotiate with other property owners in the area that is a good question something I
was thinking about in the car on the way here we probably wouldn't move dirt until 26 at the very earliest and this is a multi-month effort to move dirt out
there for the mass grading so I would think 27 would be when the first pipes go in the ground now that's that's a guess as we sit here I'd have to talk to the construction folks okay so give you some time and and my concern is this is that
you know we got residents to the north that um are going to have some issues with this are going to want to know about it and you know we're bringing in something that we're saying well we're not sure yet and then we got our city council that deserves you know a plan that's put
in front of them that isn't a question maybe I'll leave it at that you know and just that the the roads are there for a good Transportation plan and um so you know we got a couple other entities to consider here it's you know the commission is one certainly but it's our
residents and it's our city council that that ultimately will see this and and do the final approval for it at some point that's why I ask you the timing we have some time so I'm going to go back to the commission members do anything else come up to you no no I'll just again reiterate I
think you need another Street connecting to Diamond path you know I I don't think it's safety wise and feasible with all these development to the east not to have something further to the South um you know if you have it the way
it is now Deerbrook pass is going to be a it's going to be like a highway it's going to be a it's going to be that's one way in and one way out and people aren't going to go forther west out of this development to drive they're going to go right up and down Deerbrook so I'm worried about speeds up and down deer
Brook when you've got that many cars um I agree with the addition may I make a comment to that thank you thank you right now there are no connections to the west from Diamond path there are no connections to the south from Diamond path so whether you had one connection
or two connections every single vehicle is going north so they're all going to end up at the very same spot until Diamond path is connected through I'm assuming a city project to the South until that happens every car whether it's us or it's another
developer will have to go north on diamond path yeah and I'm fine I'm fine with that whole development to the South going out to Diamond path if you don't have a road to the South going out to Diamond path they're all going to go north on
Deerbrook so you're only one you know easement and feeder street to Diamond path is is the dotted yellow whereas the development further south all those cars are going to go in all those houses and even to the east you don't have you have
a dead end you know up to Deerbrook there you don't have any way onto that land so everything is going to go to Deerbrook North unless you have a street to the South for that development to go all to Diamond path which I think would be
ideal and I get you know the Land part of it uh you know the owner's not selling or whatever the case but you know if I I feel like if you can make the the connection to Diamond path from the development on the northwest side
you should be able to work something out to get to the South may I ask is the concern right now the location of the connection or the quantity of connections well I would say the quantity of connections you know this
whole development from Deerbrook East you have one way in and that's going to be Deerbrook you know there's nothing to the South or to the West besides this yellow dotted line and that's only going to you know
this dotted line to Diamond that's only going to take this you know small portion of properties those people potentially to go to Diamond I don't you know I to be honest I see all those cars going Deerbrook
North anyways or 195th to Diamond but um you know again the big concern is just the amount of houses and potential traffic even to the Far East they're going to hit diamond or they're going to hit dear Brook and that's going to be it may I approach
that yeah I I know others yeah you're good so I think some of the concern may may come from the fact that this goes up and then goes at an angle to connect into Deer Brook if this area went up
here and there was a jog in Deer Brook so that you have to turns to go up there that's something we would absolutely consider I I see your point of coming up going this way and then taking a left maybe
we drive everything that way and have another jog coming in here to make it more challenging for people that want to or or yeah could you potentially where Deerbrook comes South and comes to that
first intersection to the West could you make that I guess I I guess I don't know what you could do but if you could make that the the traffic there goes straight west and then have Deerbrook almost connect up to Delwood or even you get what I'm
trying to say there so if you come South on Deerbrook and you got that your first intersection you know you can go west out to Diamond path potentially if you could keep it that way and almost close
it off but yet take Delwood and connect it you know so like you said the cars have to go to the West out of that kind of so a c a sack at the end of Deerbrook that wouldn't be a bad idea
that like right at that first yeah that first interchange Phil what if they went so you've got the dotted yellow line right if you go to the next uh the orange section directly south yep and make that
your connection out to Diamond path you're going to drive a lot more of the people in the southwest section of the map and especially the East section they're going to be a lot more likely I would think to go out to Diamond path at that point if you connected that versus
the one directly north is a cost prohibited is that going to be your answer that that's what I was just going to ask this one right there correct in of this one yep cost wise right I understand that the cost of building road but just a
thought right because it's really that Northwest section that is going to take advantage of the path out to Diamond path right everybody else is going to drive up to Deerbrook that's an option that we will strong ly
investigate Diamond path I is it a major collector it's a collector yes a collector it's our understanding the city of Farmington doesn't necessarily do Road cost sharing but if if there's a
conversation to be had with that to help extend the Street South to connect up to the to the orange area y absolutely we we'd love that conversation and even you know not even just from a road design but even just a
traffic uh safety yeah you know deer Brook's a straight Street and this street is about as straight as you can get the whole way down so if you you know it's almost better to have some sort of Jaun in the road or roundabout or something to
prevent these cars from just opening it up on the whole street right I will say we won't want to have a CU toac at dear book cuz that defeats the purpose of getting people in and out of the subdivision yeah maybe not a
culdesac but some sort of I don't know just ideas being thrown out and and I Steve I think you've heard a number of ideas where you can take it back to your your design engineers and mentioned to
him about our conversation that right at this point there's a some concern on traffic flow and and if they have any ideas or options to remedy it I think you've heard enough and work with you know staff and yeah I know there's conversations on the financing of
extending and all that we don't get involved with that um but there're ones that have to be had um so I don't know it's you know this is the concept I I we always asked the Commissioners and you asked when you got up here give me all your thoughts
and you heard them I mean so and I I don't know I can talk about this all day but this whole development to the very East Side so you literally have to go to the furthest south part of
this development oh yeah to get out get out all the way just to get out all the way that doesn't make any sense and he did talk about possibil that road on the north for the wetlands but yeah I don't know I feel like something you would have to I guess I wouldn't want to live back you're still you're still putting
them on Deerbrook then though if they do that road so yeah it depends on the design of how there's concern and I just us looking at it you know um I'm certainly not experts like your people but um we have issues we'll leave it at
that and if you could um talk to staff and talk to your people I I guess if it comes back this way you're probably going to hear the same comments it's better for us to hear every minor comment or criticism yeah
right now than it is to start getting the engineers involved so this is this is quite helpful we'd rather hear bad news than no news uh and this is not bad news this is good news because now we have a better Direction on what the city wants to see I will
ask we put the Deerbrook Road in there that straight shot because it was our understanding that the transportation map wanted a North South Street all the way through the community if that has changed we'd be
welcome to take that out and I think that's a conversation we'll have to have with the staff right about that but just to summarize to make sure that I have my notes correct the amount of traffic onto Deerbrook path is a
concern the accessibility of the Northeast quadrant across the Wetland is a concern the ACT access to Diamond path for the southern half of the community is a concern I think there's answers out
there that we can find we just need to go dig for them and maybe you mentioned this and something Phil mentioned a couple times is all the traffic on the East and the South have to go all the way around it seems like a a long drive to get out of your subdivision maybe that was your second point I didn't
quite understand if it was that was the gist of a second point I even look at it just even from a public safety thing you know firet truck having to go all the way down around and then back up just to get to a house fire or you know medical
emergency something anything yeah we did offer to deed that whole quadrant to the city for Park purposes I think some of their comments were the same as your comments here it's great but how do we access it so now we
have looked at it a number of different ways and again we removed a crossing for that L-shaped Wetland simply because it's quite challenging through the environmental Regulators to cross a wetland if there is Direction and a mandate from the city to do that it's
possible but to do that voluntarily it's much more challenging so I think we have better Direction about that Crossing now anything else I do have one quick question if you don't mind on the northeast quadrant behind the yellow
houses in between the yellow and the red there's a it looks like a drawn out island is that something specific or is that drawn out Island so between the red dotted line and the yellow oh that's right here I'm wondering if that's not
uh some ponding that's just didn't get sh that's what I was wondering but I didn't okay that's what I was wondering thanks Tony Phil Christa anything else that you want to I mean you gave a lot of comments I think it's the work in progress that's you know yeah for sure
how about you we're dead set on the park being in the upper left hand quadrant that is the direction from the park and rre commission okay and what I guess out of the what were they what kind of Park any idea what they were going to do with no not yet they'll flush that out as
part of the the Master Plan update which will have neighborhood involvement and all of that yeah I was just wondering if you know if they had something in mind I no I mean right now the master plan shows I want to say handful of ball fields um and I don't know that that's the
direction that they'll go with the park so actually I know that's not the direction they'll go with the park so so what you're saying is it's going to be a splash bad or something that has yet to be determined
don't know pickle ball Phil all pickle ball yeah Steve do we believe you enough this has been good if if I may respectfully ask if there's any need to
haves or mandates you could think of please let me know now so we can incorporate that if not I've I've got a lot of notes yeah you you had some good when you replied I thought they were good comments
um me I'm not speaking for the commission I'm speaking for myself but I don't expect to see the same plat back when it continues is that fair to say y with the transportation and there were just to me there's enough concern by enough Commissioners to where if you brought the same thing in next week next month
next year it probably would not fly I gathered that okay I just want to make clear so understood yeah there work to be done so anything else from the commission no thank you than okay um thank you Steve uh thanks Sor was a long discussion but I think it was a good
discussion Tony you had something you wanted to do after the meeting um and our the applicant for our first discussion item rnl carriers is not with us yet do you want to try to give him another 1015 or do you just want what do you want to do with that item let's
continue on continue on explain that uh let's just if you're fine with it let's just go with the uh item with the item okay it it does something that that that I raised as a concern to me and that the
commission decided and in the past that if the applicant is not here and and that is within your right it is I know so I'm going to leave it up to the commission we can certainly discuss Arnel carriers it you know it is a site plan um site plan is uh commission
decision um doesn't go on so um what does the commission want to do do you want to discuss it tonight and and make a decision or do you want to continue to our next meeting I would say continue it to the next meeting
that's just my opinion being the new guy I would love the opportunity to have him here to discuss with it seems fair to me too fair fair you know we did it we've had a few in the past where you know it isn't fair to I mean again this is a commission
decision but it certainly is nice to have them the applicant here I know we've talked about it with staff and all that so is it going to put rnl in a bind I don't believe so okay all right then we will continue that um to our next regular meeting unless Tony we hear from
you that it's of urgent urgency to to deal with it okay absolutely all right thank you you need a motion on that or not really let's have a motion to continue it to the uh April regular meeting April 8th y all right is there a motion to continue uh the discussion on
the site plan for n rnl carriers motion there's a motion is there a second I'll second motion a second any more discussion if not call the rooll please tesy yes Rody yes snowback yes Berg yes wi yes all right thank you uh anything else from staff nothing as far as the
meeting is concerned anything else from the commission if not I'll remind our viewers and the commission our next regular meeting is April 8th and with that I'd look for a motion to adjourn a motion to adjourn we have a motion as there second all second motion a second all in favor say I I this commission is
aour thank you everybody