Okay, go ahead. >> To order, please disable flag of the United States of America >> to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with
liberty and justice for all. Meeting as pursuing the provisions of the open public meetings law this meeting of June 22nd, 2026 was included in a list of meetings. It will be sent to the community on January 5, 2026. Posted on the bulletin board hall and
that date remain continuously posted as required. In addition, a copy of this notice is enhanced and available to the public and is on file rice >> here. Vice President Inglehart >> here.
>> Councilwoman Visaro. Councilwoman Herbert >> here. Councilman Levit >> here. >> Council President Parker >> here. >> Mayor Har >> here. >> All right. We have the work session for the capital budget first. Um I don't know. We tell we told Jerry to comment
later, right? >> Well, he said 6:30. >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> All right. So, we're gonna bring on uh >> Phil >> Bill and my champion and anybody else from DPW that is there >> and um
Mike and Josh. I'm assuming this is you. >> No, this might be >> Is Josh on? Why can't I promote him? because he's on the phone.
>> He should be able to be. >> It doesn't say uh >> look allowed to talk. >> Yeah, maybe with the phone. Josh, I'm going to allow you to talk. >> Okay. Okay. >> It's me.
>> Yep. Okay. It's Josh. >> Okay. We can hear you like I can. Right. Um, council had questions for you guys on the capital budget requests. So, I'm going to let council ask. And Trent, you want to start? >> No.
>> Um, Beth, would you like to go? >> Tony, you have your notes. >> I don't I don't have them pulled up this, >> right? We don't have that. We don't have the list in front of us. That's the problem. >> But the budget thing that we had done, that's what we need. Hold on.
>> You're copying capitalized it. I thought they had their own last time. >> So So listen, I I I can actually start. So So for both you, Josh, you and Ken. Um Josh, if you want to go first, it's
fine. So here here's what I I'm interested in learning. So, we see what you guys your wish list, so to speak, which I'm I'm not sure that I understand the wish list, but what projects are currently going on
right now that needs to be finished before you do anything else? What What are the What are the projects that are happening to date? Right now >> the projects that are happening right now for water is the only thing that I'm aware of is
that the engineers are working on the lead service line and the PAS treatment. >> Okay. And and how long has that been going on? Do you know? I mean I think well of course question you know how
long has that be going on when do you anticipate that being completed >> completed? I don't know. It's got to be done uh the lead service line I believe the date that it has to be done by according to
the state is 2030 >> and the ephos they've been going back and forth with the final date. I'm not positive because it's changed several times on when it has to be done. Um, but that the latest I got from them is the
end of this week or early next week, we should have the treatment train design to make sure it's all going to work with what we have. Once they have that in place and everything, then they're going to work on if any of the
buildings needed to be made bigger or anything like that. Gosh, that was extended by the federal government to 2031 completion for small treatment plans like ours. >> Okay.
>> If if I may add, uh July 2nd, we'll be opening bids for the water main replacement on Shields A in the township, Pennsylvania A in the township.
I'm sorry. That's for That's for what? Say that again. >> For the water main replacement. >> Is that different than what Josh is talking about? >> Uh, well, that will happen this year, sir.
>> Right. But is that a part of the project that Josh is talking about? >> No. That's left that's left over from when we were doing the tank job that was going to be with the tank job which is been the tank itself has been done.
>> Okay. So, so what's remaining to be done when I when I ask about projects that have not been completed that are in progress that would be this water main replacement. >> Correct. >> Okay. Is there anything else underwater?
>> Not that I can think of. No. >> No sir. >> Okay. And then for this assets management um um and uh the skater replacement, what exactly is the assets management and skater replacement?
>> So the skater replacement, we have money in an old USDA loan that does not need to be capital anymore. Um, we did find money and that is one of the things we're allowed to use it for the asset management. Go ahead. I'm sorry, Tony.
>> Sorry. So, this 160 we don't need does not need to be in the capital. We don't need to budget for this. >> Nope. Nope. That could come out. >> Interesting. Okay. Now, okay. So, the asset management, what is that? >> Asset management. A few years ago, the
state of New Jersey came up with this thing we had to do. It's been it it's actually a while ago, but they implemented it a few years ago. So, the burrow water utility had to go through and list everything that we have when
how long it lasts from like screws and bolts up to big equipment. And then with that, there's a formula. When you run the formula for what we have, they were suggesting that everybody put that amount of money away a year so that if
you had those things go bad, the things that need to be replaced, they're they're basically trying to make you save and make you budget. That was their their So we took that formula, we plugged it in, and that was the number we came up with. So the 300
>> for our system. >> So the $300. >> Yes. >> Okay. So is is that $300,000 year over year? >> It's supposed to be. Yes. Now that does not take into account any loans that you
have and stuff that we're spending money on with loans. So you can kind of subtract out of that for the state purposes. >> I'm sorry. So it's for things that we're not uh that we're not anticipating. >> It's a reserve schedule. >> Okay. So
>> those covers the life of objects we put away every year. So when things break, we have the money set aside. It's a reserve schedule like you would do for a building, >> right? So >> but that's up to us in terms of it's $300,000 or it's $100,000 or it's $200,000. I'm just trying to understand
what who who I I understand you ran this formula but that formula doesn't correct be the word of whatever it could be whatever we want it to be correct. >> So yes and no. So yes it can always be whatever you want it to be as far as
what they came up with with the asset management plan when we plugged everything that we have in. Now, take this with a grain of salt because they're telling you that let's say our well pump is supposed to last 5 years. >> We all know it could go sooner or we
could get 10 years, maybe even if we're lucky, 15 years. But according to their formula, that was the number that was when we plugged everything in and we said that was what they recommended putting away a year so that if these things went at their anticipated time,
you would be able to replace them. >> Sorry, just to be clear, we're not spending the $300,000 immediately on anything. It's for savings. >> Correct. >> We are going to bond to save. >> That's what I'm That's what I'm confused. You're saying exactly where I'm coming
from and $160,000 which we don't need to even be in here >> then. >> Correct. >> That so I don't get far. >> Why would I do that? Exactly. >> So basically the state is just telling you they want you to do $300,000 of
improvements a year. So if we do a bond ordinance like we did, you know, a couple years ago for a million dollars or we have that grant that we got to do $1.2 $2 million, you know, that's four years worth of this 300,000 that would count, you know, towards that. So, it's
just they're that's what they're basically telling you you should do every year is 300,000 of improvements at a minimum. >> Correct. >> Okay. But that's but is that to be bonded or is that just to be set into reserve? because we do have
>> that was >> that was always the question whether or not it should be a capital thing or whether or not it should just be a regular budgetary item line item that was the always the question they never answered that they don't really my
understanding they're not worried about where it's coming from just so that we're aware that this year let's say 10 things came up for their life expectancy So if all 10 of those things failed on their life expectancy failure, then we
would need somewhere around that amount to replace everything, >> right? But we should know what we do expect this year. So what do we expect to to need to do that we that isn't already like a project that's bonded for
being bonded for? >> Do we have 300 understand what you're saying that we're expecting to do this year? uh not at this time that I'm aware of. But this this is like I said this is for everything in our whole system when when it comes to everything
the problem I have with this and Bill you can help me out if if you can. So this includes everything. So some of our O andM regular stuff that we buy. So if if a sodium pump goes bad, that's a
four, five, $600 item. If that goes bad, we buy it. So some of this stuff is already coming out of O andM. >> Does that make sense? >> Yeah. This probably, >> right? So the 300,000 should probably have been put towards the regular
budget. The issue we have is some of these things will last more than what is it 15 year or five years then you can go to capital. >> Correct. >> Yeah. So that's the thing like when you replace a well pump that's supposed to last more than 5 years. So that could be a capital purchase
but some of the smaller stuff may only last 3 years or that's the life expectancy. It might go longer but that's the life expectancy of it. >> So here's the question. So this whole asset management thing is very tough for me because what we're trying to do to appease the state and what the state
like there's not a lot of guidance on how to break it down other than the formula of this is what you would need a year. >> Fair enough. So here's my question. How obviously this is not the first year you're doing. How much money is in that reserve at this point?
>> Because >> I don't know if there's any. Is there any bill? >> We haven't been putting it in reserve. We've been basically doing ordinances as needed. So, it's, you know, we haven't been setting aside 300,000 or anything. I think we have maybe like a h 100,000
in an ordinance that was for general maintenance improvements. >> So, >> so basically, we've been we've been putting it in capital and then if you guys are okay with it, when we actually needed it, that's when we would go correct, Bill, and then get it.
>> And the majority I mean, the reason The reason why is because we've been getting a lot of grants to do these things. So, we haven't had to put it actually in the the budget to fund it because we got the grants. >> So, this is just an purposes. We're not actually going to put a bond out for no
reason that we don't actively need, right? >> Not correct. Not unless something came up that all of a sudden we needed to, you know, do a major improvement. And that's why we put it in the budget as um something that is a potential project.
So it gives you the ability if you had to you could borrow that 300,000 but it doesn't mean you have to. >> So So here So here's what I get and correct me if I'm wrong. So the truck replacement and the pickup truck is what
you really need this year. Correct. >> Correct. Correct. We don't we don't need to really worry about this year. Correct. >> Correct. In the past, what's happened was, and if I'm wrong, Bill, correct me. In
the past, my understanding was it was put into capital. Just so you guys were aware that that's there. That's what that's for. And then, let's say two weeks from now, a well, a pump fails and we have to spend 15 $20,000 to replace
it. That's when I would get Bill, give Bill the price of what it would be to replace, and then that's when we would bond or whatever for that amount. Or if we were really unlucky and we had multiple things go wrong and it cost more, we would add them all up and then do it that way. Correct, Bill?
>> Correct. >> Bill, would that work for you? >> For me, yes, >> that's okay with me if we continue. Yeah, >> you're good. And Bill, just to I'm sorry, can you refresh my memory? I know we talked about this last time. It
didn't stick in my brain. Um, what is the distinction between the capital fund that we put money into every year and bonding for these things? So capital fund with the capital improvement fund is money that you raise
in the budget as as a line item called capital improvement fund which gets moved over to the capital account as a um an amount that can build up to either fully fund a project or to be the down
payment 5% of a project. So >> yes, so because our utilities, our two utilities are self-liquidating, meaning they generate enough revenue through their um you know sales of the uh the water and stuff and the sewer
department. Um they are not required to have 5% down payment. Um so that's why they don't have like bigger um capital improvement funds than they currently do. I think uh it's you know I don't know I have the number off the top of my
head but that we've been building up the general capital improvement fund because the general improvements are required to have 5% down payments. >> Okay. So in the case of water the truck replacement and the pickup truck if I do my math right is adding up to 255 right?
>> Um and so uh am I hearing that there's not 255 in the water capital fund? There is not. No. >> Got it. How much is there in that fund? >> I don't have that number, but I think it's it's under probably 50,000.
>> Okay. >> So, the point of it is it's 255 we need to worry about, >> correct? >> And not the 7:15, >> which is why I do this exercise. >> Yeah. Great. Okay. So, we've got a clear
picture on water now. That was so helpful. Thank you so much. >> Yeah, Josh, that was great. Thank you. >> Excuse me. >> We're not done with the water yet. >> Okay, go ahead. >> On the Shields A Pennsylvania AB water
replacement bid opening July 2nd, it be remaining USDA funds. If the bids come in higher than the remaining funds,
we will have to fund the rest if we choose to do both projects or council can decide just to do one of the projects this year. Next year, bid it out again.
Numbers come in right, do that project. Okay. So, that kind of makes sense to me. So, the point of it is is we don't know what we don't know. So, the the quotes are coming in when when are >> July 2nd.
>> Estimated cost is 1.9 million. Hopefully, it comes in under that. >> Okay. So, it's it's it's if it comes in higher than 1.9 million, we need to be concerned. Is that correct? That's what we need to decision. A decision will
have to be made whether we bond out for the rest to complete both projects or just do one this year and one the following year. I'm not a big proponent of bonding anything here, but that's just um
>> so Bill um is that what um what Mike just described is that represented anywhere on the the cover sheet of the capital projects workbook >> that that wouldn't be on there because that was a project that was done u uh
funded a couple years ago. We talked about that during the regular budget. >> Yeah. >> This this particular project because it's associated with the well up on the hill, right? >> Yeah. So, that's where it gets confusing
when they cross years. I mean, you're still kind of finishing a project from a few years ago, so it's not going to show up in this year's budget. >> But that's goes back to my question. What are we do? What is being done now? What what projects are happening right
now? That's that's really is the question. So this is one of the projects that's happening right now. >> Correct. >> Correct. >> That's what I'm trying to understand is what how many projects are out there that are not completed? That's what I
think the constant needs to know. >> That may not be that may not be part of this particular capital, right? uh uh projects list, >> but because because you're going to run because to your point, we may run into a
snag where the if it's a higher than $1.9 million, then we need to be concerned about it. But we know that this is a project that's going on. I'm just trying to get a heads up on what projects are out there and what the potential impact, financial impact will
be to the girl for this year. That's all I'm trying to find out. So it it yeah it would be helpful a helpful exercise then to review the list of existing ongoing projects out of
capital that um and and identify aside from the Shields Avenue water main replacement are there other projects where it's possible that we could come up against an unexpected expense this year? >> Exactly. That's exactly right. That's
all I'm trying to get down to. >> Any anything else underwater? >> I have one question. >> Yeah, please. When we when we do these bonds, right? Like I know certain things in our our budget are expected to be paid for out of the revenues that the water utility gets bill, right?
>> All of it. These are being paid out of water utility. >> All of all of these >> 100%. >> Yeah. Okay. I just wanted to make sure. >> So, is there anything else in water? >> Not that I can think of. Tony. >> Okay. Mike, are you good with water?
>> Yes, sir. >> So, then thank thanks again, Josh. This was extremely helpful. I really appreciate feedback. >> Well, before I'm sorry, Brandon, did you have any questions for Josh? >> No. >> Susan, did you not for
>> So, now let's move over to sewer. Let's move over to Sue. Thank you. >> So, um, really, come on. Let's not do Let's not do this today, Marcia. Let's not do this. We're both up here at the same time in >> an orderly way, please.
>> That is fine. >> The members ask questions about these budgets. >> So, that's fine. Okay. So, let me keep moving on. The sewer. So, um, and just so that you know, I think I told you this so that everybody knows, I
did I was at a governor's function last week and I did run into um the lieutenant governor and couple of other people and they are they told me to send this information on the RMUTA to
them. Um, so hopefully we can get a um we'll get you an audience that you can talk to them. So I I just wanted to let everybody know that I'm following up on this whole thing with RGI. Okay. So, uh,
Ken, what on this list is needs to happen this year? number. Well, the road garage repairs is something we've been doing the last few years. Rather than doing a big bond out, we've been doing these small capital
improvements. Last year, we did paint and windows, paint on one of the building and windows. This year, we wanted to do the other two buildings to paint that are there and some insulation. the um
the 20-year sewer replacement plan, the big number is similar to what Josh is saying. 10 years ago, that was a 30-year replacement plan. We have been relatively successful in replacing about
over 30% of the infrastructure in the last really 20 years. So, what was a 30-year plan is now a 20-year plan. This is one of those numbers that it generally hasn't been taken out of capital. It gets wrapped into these larger replacement projects.
The Flemington wet weather facility implemented plan is tied in with those discussions on the future of the wet weather facility helping us fund that future solution that is needed this year.
The EPA money is more about trying to end the acco than fund the project itself. This is the money I'm requesting to fight the administrative consent order, not the money needed to actually
pay for what they want done. >> The is uh like legal fees and that kind of thing. >> Yeah. >> Got it. the Flemington wet weather facility tank repair. That is a D mandate to make
repairs at the wet weather facility because the permit is in question right now. That hasn't been enforced. So, we are required to pay 80% of all improvements to the wet weather facility. It's kind of in a holding pattern. I do not believe it's going to
come in this year that that facility will be settled, but it seemed foolish to pull it just in case it was. Be aware that this is a real a real bill that will come down the line once whatever is
decided with the wet weather facility is decided. >> So, so Ken, I'm sorry. Let me just stop you right there for a second. Um I just so this this wet weather facility whole thing is because RU RMUTA is actually
pushing back on some things as well, right? And so we don't really see that's coming to fruition in 2026. It'll probably come into fruition in 2027 if at all. Correct. >> Correct. >> Yeah. >> Okay. And then on the 310 that goes back
to what Josh was saying on the asset management track asset management thing is that that sewer replacement plan is something that really should not be in in this and and something that we would be bonding for. It should just come out of Apple. That's what you're proposing.
Correct. >> Correct. >> Okay. Just want to make sure. And then on the um wet weather facility implementation plan, can you just explain a little bit more about that, please? >> There was six potential options with the
wet weather facility based on what comes out of the legal fight RTMUA has with the D. Now, those six plans, we've kind of talked internally about what's best for Flemington is to keep the facility
in operation the way it is and try and beat the permits. So, this money is spent trying to enforce that or going to a different plan if it's lost on the legal side. So again, there's there's
six different options with some pretty big price tags, but this is money used to study which one is best. We're going to continue with the fight that we have right now until we can't we can't fight that fight anymore.
>> Okay. >> Just for clarification, the EPA and the Flemington wet weather facility, that's two different things, correct? >> Correct. Yeah. The EPA is the administrative consent order. The wet weather facility is the D and the permit
issue with the D with the weather facility. >> Okay. This is the permit thing. Okay. >> Got it. >> Thank you. All right. And then the aerial flyover and GIS conversion. >> The last flyover Flemington did was from
2007. So at that time you flew a plane, you took a picture, a very detailed picture of Flemington. It's been a lot of construction changes since then to now. The hotel, Stangle Road, Senior Center, all a lot of development. We do
a lot of engineering inhouse. That flyover gives us the ability to do our own updates much much more accurately than going to the engineer every time we need something surveyed. We can basically drop our own points in the map and not need the engineers by doing
this. That would benefit all three departments, sir. That would be storm water. >> Water and sewer. >> What? >> It's going to close if we don't >> if we just
>> I was like, >> okay. So, so that that sounds like we're spending money to save money on engineering fees, right? And and and improving accuracy. >> Promise you'll save money. >> Got it. Um Okay. So, so what I'm seeing
then is the the sewer replacement plan is this is money we're supposed to be setting aside, not something that we would bond without having mortgage to do to attach to it yet. Right. >> Correct. >> The wet weather facility if we should
happen to get through all the rigomearroll this year, we want to make sure we're prepared to bond for that. >> Correct. >> Right. Okay. So then the other things add up to like $119,000. Do we have at least some of that in
capital improvement funds that so we wouldn't have to bond for it? >> 144. >> I think we have about 25,000 in their capital improvement fund. >> Got it. >> Yeah, your your math is probably better.
>> No, no, I think you may have missed missed the number. That's all. See where you >> Okay. Um, I think that's all my questions on sewer. Anyone else questions on sewer? >> Go ahead.
>> No, >> yeah, I'm sorry to do this to you guys. Can you guys do ex do for the for the record and for anybody that's listening or is in the room, can you just explain in layman's terms the weather facility
issue because I don't necessarily know if everybody understands that as far as just >> you know we've heard it a million times but the general public maybe hasn't. >> Not all of us have heard it a million times. I was going to ask another time but yes I would very much like to know the answer to that. They explained it in
our meeting. >> I I know they did, but where this is specific to this, you know, this I think it might be helpful just to go over it again if you don't mind. >> Sure. >> Thank you. >> The Flemington wet weather facility.
>> You bring it to a good level. So >> Okay. >> Go ahead, Ken. Sorry, I didn't mean to talk over you. The Flemington wet weather facility is located behind Hunter Central. It's a sewer plant that only operates when we
receive large amounts of rainwater or flows that exceed 1.35 million gallons a day. The plant is owned and operated by RTMUA, but Flemington pays 80% of the cost of the operation. 100% of Flemington sewers flow goes
through it. The problem we're having right now is that the DP's permit, which gets renewed every 5 years for this facility, has implemented new treatment standards that the facility cannot meet.
The RTMUA is currently battling legally with the D to try and mitigate those new treatment standards. Um, this is big because it's not. It's being treated as if it's
a fully operational sewer plant. It's not. It's a facility that only runs when it rains, which is basically the equivalent of 10 to 13 times a year. By not running all the time, you cannot average down the samples taken, which is
what most sewer plants do. You get one bad hit, you take a bunch more hits, you average it down, you're okay. This facility can't do that because it runs once. You take a sample, you get a bad hit, you're hurt. Beyond that, the s the
limits that they set were incredibly stringent, very, very difficult for any facility to hit to actually make, especially one that does not run all the time. So we fingers crossed RTMUA is doing
everything in their power. We're offering all the support we can to them to win this battle. But it it's a real concern on what the future of that facility is. That's an overview of it. >> That's that's a perfect summary. Thank
you. The a couple questions related to that again more for just to un the public to understand. Does does the Raritton Townships go through that facility as well?
>> 20% of the Flemington service area goes through that facility, which they they're responsible for 270,000 gallons of the flow that goes through that. We're responsible for 1.08 MGD. So, it's an 8020 split. 80% us, 20% them of the
total flow that's allowed to go through the facility. That's the RTMUAB facility, not the wet weather facility. >> No, this is just the wet weather facility. Their main plant is 3.8 MGD. The wet weather facility is 1.35 MGD.
And um I don't expect you necessarily to know this answer, but how many other municipalities maybe a guess in the state have this type of facility versus like a
full-time facility? >> Zero. >> Why? Like why why are we the only ones? >> There are other facilities in the country. This facility is completely unique to Flemington.
This is Flemington's sewer plant from 1970. When RTMUA built their fully operational sewer plant, they took this facility completely offline. RTMUA really never calculated the true
flows coming from Flemington when it rained. Every time it rained in 1970, they were knocking the new plant offline. This facility, it was decided to put back online to protect the main plant when these heavy rain events
happened until Flemington gets its INI issues, influent infiltration under control. So every 5 years since that permit has been created in 1970, it has failed in the eyes of the D. It's been
fought and brought back. What's different now is the EPA's involvement. It's made it much difficult for us to continue to operate that facility. With global climate change, these facilities are popping up more and more frequently throughout the country. DP is a tough
tough environmental state. They don't like any kind of change. They don't have a box for the wet weather facility. They treat it like a fully operational sewer plant. It is not a fully operational sewer plant. That in again as a fly over
that's in a nutshell what's going on with that facility. >> Um the Yeah. Um the the state versus the feds. Um, can you give me an idea of I know
that we don't know and we've been fighting this for a long time and how long have we really geared up when I say we, I mean I mean the the RTMUA um talking to both the state and the
feds and which one is the more difficult entity to deal I I can only speak from my interactions. So the EPA is much much harder of an much much harder of an organization to
deal with than the D. And the D is not easy, >> right? >> The EPA is a much much tougher fight. >> Thank you. >> Yes. Thank you. Andrew, any questions? >> Uh no, no questions. I know we we uh
reviewed this quite a bit when I was on public works so very familiar with it. Thank you, >> Ken. Mike Rose. Anybody have any questions for Mike? Susan, sorry, I was tailing out this.
So, I guess just an overarching question because these are all relatively small dollar amounts, right? >> Um, Bill, is this this is just things that aren't can't be covered by the capital improvement fund. Seems like a pretty small dollar amount to borrow out for. >> I agree.
>> Well, we could. I mean, if you wanted to fully fund it, we could um with the capital improvement fund. It's just uh you I don't know I don't know what you other projects you have that we you know because we're required a 5% down payment for any large project. So if you're
planning on anything bigger we would have to have percentage down payment. >> Well there's the sally port that's going out for bid for the for the design. It's not even for the project. is to design the
project and engineer it. So, there's that. We'll get that back, >> right? >> Well, >> yeah, the well. So, can you give us an estimate, Bill? And I don't mean like right here on the spot, but just as a
followup, of what the potential 5% down payment would look like for those, so we know whether we have room or not. Yeah, it's not a problem. >> Awesome. >> What's in our what's in our current fund
for that? It's like the dollar amount. >> Um, again, I don't have the number with me, but I think it was a little over 400,000. >> Yeah, >> I know we used a lot of it when we bought the >> fire truck. 300,000 given was by
Governor Murphy at my request and then there's about 100,000 that we've gotten from the county. So that's the all for the sally port. The well has 1.2 million in it from Malinowski.
>> And that's all already in the capital improvement fund. >> That's in the bank. >> That's what's in the bank. >> That's what's in the bank. The salt is estimated to be about all in. I mean right now it's just the dead design which is going to be about 200,000. So
5% of that and then the design the build out is probably going to be about 800,000 if we do it this year. Uh and it is a requirement by the department of correction to get it done before we do anything else with that building. Um and then the well is
estimated at 1.7 million right now. So that's another half a million that we don't have. But we'd have to put down 5% of the entire amount. Bill, >> mayor, that that does not include the easements we need.
>> Correct. So, the money that's in the bank now is really truly it's basically a locket. There's should not be wiggle room. Correct. >> There is no wig or any of that grants for direct projects.
>> Okay. So, I'm sorry. Can you just explain to me the difference between in the capital improvement fund and in the bank? >> Well, I mean, it's It's it's and it's but we have the money. It's not we have we actually have cash for those projects. It's not leftover
bonds that are just like floating out there as >> and it's tax >> as money that was in a bond, but not not that we spent it and we didn't take that money. This is actual money. >> The $300,000 from Governor Murphy and the money from the county cabinet as
checks. It's actual money. It's not a promisory over we took a line of credit like a bond is a line of credit so you spend it you're paying interest on it but it's not there's they'll find like little bits and pieces left over from other bonds like like the water right
you mentioned so but bill in addition to um things like this being in the capital fund bank account we put money away from in every budget to the capital improvement Um, so what is there above
and beyond that 1.6 million currently in the capital improvement fund that's not dedicated to something specific? >> Well, so for I I I will get you that number, but I got to give me like uh 45 minutes and I'll get it to you. Um, but
it's the 1.2 million and the 300,000 are both grants, so that's why they're handled differently than the capital improvement fund. So, they're actually in the grant fund and we I don't think we did the 1.2 million yet because we haven't done that project, but we'll put
that in the grant fund once, >> okay, >> we're ready to go with it. The 300,000 we already inputed that. So, what those actually run through the budget through the uh into the grant fund. So, that that's kind of a different pod of money,
but yes, those m those are ready to spend without us having to borrow anything. So, if I'm doing my math right, mayor, um I'm hearing there's a there's
another 800k in addition to what we already have to do the sally port and there's an estimated half million dollars above what we already have for the well. So, there's we have 400,000 towards the salt. Yeah. the ent the our
architect's estimate to get bid documents done. So the project hasn't been designed or engineered >> and the scope of the bid that went out on the street is to include the documents so we can have everything and
then we can put it out to bid right and that's we'll know what that project's going to actually cost. >> Okay. The estimate from our architect two years ago was that all these documents are going to run aboutund,000. That was two years ago. So let's call it
200,000. So we still have 200,000. But then if the project comes in at it's going to cost us 800,000 to build it. We need another 600,000. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Um and and then did I get the math right on the Sally Port? got or sorry the well
>> the well so the well was estimated in 2022 when Mayor Driver applied for that money the well portion of that application was $1.2 $2 million from the well and that was what we were awarded. But since then
with costs and everything else going up, our engineer estimated that same project at 1.7 million, not counting as Mike said the ements for the lines. >> Got it. >> Talk about that.
>> Okay. under all kinds of stuff and identification. >> So, Bill, here's my question to you. >> So, here's the question. So, I'm I'm looking at the numbers that you gave us on this capital projects in a little bit. Um, and if we look at just the 125
and then that that Mike is asking for and then we scratch everything else out, I get the I get like 754,000. So the I just want to make sure that that's correct because what I'm looking
at is the 120 for the police, 30 for the rescue squad, 23 for fire department, 175 for the library, 125 for Mike's project, and then if we take out the 300 and the 160 from um
Josh's, that leaves us with 255. And then if we take out from Ken the 310 300 um then that leaves us with the 25 for 52 and 40 and that gives us 144
>> correct. >> Okay. So here's the question. So that that number changes drastically than this 1.8 that was originally 1.896 896 I think it is around that that was that's
originally proposed on this that that was pushed that that that you wanted that somebody wanted us to push through but the bottom line is it's really not that it's really the 754,000 and so with the 754,000
is that something that can come out of the capital project or is that something that we need to bond uh you don't have enough to to fully fund that. You would have to bond at least a portion of it. Plus, um the library, we have to get a a true figure
for the elevator. >> Oh, this is not a true figure. >> Well, that's what they gave me initially, but it's probably going to be, you know, maybe 250, 300. Oh, >> that's I'm I They got a I don't know that they ever got a quote. You know,
that was an estimate they got, but just uh you know, I've done a couple elevators and I know you can't replace an elevator for 175,000. >> Yeah, I think we even talked about that. It's not close. >> So, we need another $100,000 >> to put in this. So, then let's just say
this is going to be 88 um 854, I'm sorry, 854. So, how much of that do we would we need to bond if we wanted to um to do these projects? Because it's certainly the number is certainly not $1.8 million.
That's my point. It's not that high that we would bond. >> It's okay. >> It's more like $800,000 or $850,000. >> Correct. And so, how much of that would we have to bond? That's really the question.
I would I would say you probably would have to bond about um 600,000 of it. >> Okay. >> Because I don't think you want to wipe out your capital improvement fund completely. >> So I think what would be helpful for for
me and I'm just speaking for me and you guys can weigh in on this. I think if if this sheet can be cleaned up um on what what is the reality at this point and then um what your recommendation is for
bonding. I think that versus taking it out of what we have. Um I think that would be helpful >> based on the feedback that you've gotten tonight. >> Yes. >> Okay.
>> Thank you. Mike, >> do you want to add anything else? >> I do not. Mayor >> Josh. >> No, I'm good. >> Anybody up here have any final questions
for my Josh? >> All right. Thank you, gentlemen. >> Thank you guys for your help. >> You're up. Okay. >> What's that? >> 37. >> We'll take a break in the
>> How's everybody doing? >> Good. >> I'm trying to wet outside. >> Yeah, >> I didn't plan that drive. >> All right.
So, um, what I did is I sent the mayor my, uh, just so we're talking about the same proposal, the original proposal. Then I created a, uh, three-year, uh, plan just so we know what type of direction we need to go into as far as
what the police department needs to be. So, >> is this the one that you forwarded at 2 o'clock today? probably >> the one that I got at 111. >> Thank you. >> I didn't get a chance to look. >> Go ahead. Been a been a little busy with the >> No, it's fine. I just want to make sure
I was looking at the right one. >> The original one uh uh the the 26 budget proposal, capital proposal I I did like I remember the original, but um that's the one with the the patrol cars, the
police officers camera. Um I did make changes with the patrol rifles which go into detail about um the less lethal uh the impact shotgun. Uh I asked for two uh speed signs and uh
these new message boards. Um they're actually more portable. They're not like trailers. You set up like a uh almost like it will go an easel port on there. So, it it'll be uh communications for
like sidewalks or or events that are happening. >> What prevents them from falling over? >> That's how well they're made. They're they're it's a pretty tight easel with a a battery component, everything. Um they're kind of new, but they're they would definitely help with
communication. So, certain things from the fence uh to uh to we're doing police action or something >> you're proposing. I was really surprised to see this burden a cop a year. >> Yeah.
>> Is that because of the population increase in Flemington? >> Part part of it is um there it's it's a it's a two two-part reason for for us to start a police officer. It's about 10 months between the academy
and the field training. Um for them to come offline by themselves and then to learn the job and learn that the the the skills that are you know are functioning operational by themselves. It's an individual thing for additional 12 to 24
months be really efficient at at their job being able to handle calls being able to make decisions without checking with somebody. Um because nobody it's it's it's a high stress, high impact, quick decision job and it really builds
up the confidence to do that. Takes a little bit of time. Uh one uh the additional officer is for the expansion of what's happening. What we're seeing in policing, what we're seeing is a lot of um calls that require uh not just one
officer anymore. There's two officers. >> What kind of calls are those? uh mental health, uh motor vehicle crashes, domestic violence, anytime where you're dealing with a lot of people or a group of people, investigations,
everything outside of basic calls for service and uh traffic stops now just about require two officers if not for work purposes, just for officer safety. Obviously, you can't handle it domestic with
two or more people by yourself or past the pace. Um, mental health calls are another one. You just don't know what this person's going to do because you like to have that second officer there and and it's almost a requirement
to have that person there. So, some sort of backup. Um, and the uh the other reason I'm suggesting it now is because in the next four years we're going to see a 30% loss of the department with I know for a fact that you know I have
probably another three or four years in. >> I'm sorry. Say that again. >> 30 30 you're going to have a 30% attrition over the next four years. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> From retirements. >> From retirements. Well, there's eligibility and out of those out of
those six, I know for a fact they they're probably not going to work past 25. >> So that's six officers in four years are going to leave. >> Yeah. >> But are you sure our six are going to go or is it going to be >> there's three that I I know for >> there's three. The other three I don't know if they'll stay past the 25 year
mark. I mean I stay past the 25 year mark. I'm going obviously the 30-year mark, but um that's a that's a you know such a decision where I don't want to see us expose once they hit that goal. >> So the pop every year isn't necessarily
to build up the course. It's >> tougher attrition. >> A little bit of both. Yeah. Yeah. And the the direction that you you you want to take the department because there will be a need for them and it'll be a smoother need. I mean, in the last I'm
gonna say eight months, like since maybe Thanksgiving, I thought it was just holiday traffic. I have endless complaints now about traffic. Endless complaints and it started right around the holidays and I thought, "Oh, this is the holidays." But it hasn't stopped.
>> Has not at all. and and you know and that's part you know the the the increase look at the projects that we have coming or what um planning board is approved and where we're going more people more calls for service and the other uh
point of this which I don't think people realize outside the burrow is that uh level of service you get you know if you ever resided in another area where um it's a larger scale area Um, you don't get that, you know, within 5 to 10
minutes an officer's knocking on your door, if not less. Um, uh, you don't get that, uh, level of service that some of these guys provide as far as your abilities and skills, as far as an EMT and really handling the situation and
taking control over it. Um, you know, no matter what crisis you're in, it's never quick enough, right, at the end of the day. But if you you ever move into a location, and I've been into locations, and we've all been there, been on vacation or whatever. Um, you know, uh,
recently I went up upstate New York. I didn't need the police, but it sure is in my head to be like, "Wow, you know, how far are they coming?" You know, but, uh, so you get used to that level of service and then if you start eating away at that, you're not going to get
that. Obviously, that's going to come up to you guys of, you know, where are the cops? Where are they? You know, we see it now with the guys running around phone call to call. You know, everybody has an expectation. Why should Bur where they at? I haven't seen anything. They
look like they're just driving. >> So, okay. So, I'm just I'm a little bit confused. I I didn't I'm sorry, but I didn't even get a chance. I didn't know this existed. I didn't last time I checked my email was at noon. um
um access to Peter but um the replacement I get the nutrition I get so that's one to one so that's six are you so is it six and then above the six that's what I'm trying to understand
>> I'm saying you probably will need to bump up the squads to uh four officers >> so you need 10 you need uh yeah >> 10 to the >> 10 at this point. So six would be for
replacing. >> Yeah. >> And then four would be an addition to that. But >> but the question would really be is it is it six this year or is it so over the last can I ask them ask my question please
I'll let you ask your question. So here's my question please. Can I ask my question? Thank you very much. So my point of it is is that is this going to start two years from now? Next year, two years from now on the four edition, not on the
six, on the four edition. When does that start? >> I I think we definitely would need one more sooner than later, but then we can assess the situation, which I I see the direction it's going. You're we're definitely going to need the officers. So I think if you start that in 27 28
where you start getting the the additional officers to cover that. >> Um >> so is that one per year for the next four years for that four? >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> And then uh you know as far as the replacement officers just working them
in to where and speaking with them and finding out what people's uh expectation is, what what is their desire. You know, nobody wants to show their hand. I I'm not going to show my hand either about what my exit date is just for the fact that I don't really truly know my exit
date. We all have personal goals and objectives, but if to have a good conversation with somebody who is going to exit and if they give us enough notice, >> you know, right now, uh, Councilman Parker and I said we can think of three names right out the gate and and those
those dates are going to come upon us very >> in two years. That's in two years. >> That's in two years. Correct. And um >> so that's in 2028. >> 2028. Yeah. Yep. So >> So if you hired one in 27 and one in 28, you lose three.
>> So you're down one. You hire one in 29, you don't lose anybody. Then you're even. >> Then we're even. >> Then you hire one in 30 and you don't lose anybody. And you're one up, right? And so you're trying to get to current level plus four over the next 10 years. >> Exactly.
>> But only hiring one year. You're not two retire and only one is hired. You're not proposing to hire two. You just want to keep that steady one a year. >> Yeah. I'm also I would like to see that too in the initial phase, but start
getting ahead of it of the of the uh of the officers that are >> But you only are saying one for next year. >> I would say one for next year to see how um >> does that mean that mean hiring in 2027 or hiring in 2026? Having the person operational by uh this
time in 2027 would be fantastic. >> So having a person operational by June of 2027 would you have to hire them in 2026 >> like in September like in three months >> to get
>> uh I would say comfortably like we did with the last hire if we can get the confirmation for a an academy class for January 2027. and put them in uh that would give us
all the way till September to have them trained and then >> they're not in our operational budget. >> No. >> Okay. >> Yeah. Yeah. Don't Okay. >> Yeah. I'm just saying for 2027 to get that person uh and maybe would be fortunate enough to get somebody who is
PTC trained. >> That's what I was going to ask you because it depends on how they come in, right? Because if they come in that puts us trained at that they don't have to go through that case right ahead of the game by six months.
>> So it's between three and nine months. >> Yeah. Depending >> depending on who you get what you get. >> I will say that's difficult. Um a lot of a lot of departments are leaning towards going back to you know the 30-year practice of actually sending somebody to the academy. Regardless,
uh, they're just it's hard to find people. It's hard to find good law. >> Yeah. I mean, um, I think we did very well with the the last four, five that we brought aboard. >> You have a question. >> What is PTC? >> Police training commission.
>> Okay. What can you just explain? >> That is the oversight of um, uh, all officers are licensed now. So, they can control the license. They control everything about um what training they is initially or what training you need be police officer to maintain that
licensing. So they oversee it. They're a big agency. >> How does that fit in with getting someone who can be faster to >> that's already licensed? That means they've already worked somewhere or they already possess that uh certification. >> Okay.
>> So they've been through the academy with some other >> correct. You got it. Does does former military also apply to PTC? >> No. >> Even if they're MPs? >> No. Yeah. >> Even if they're MPs? >> Yeah, they won't get the state certification.
>> Some states do, but New Jersey is definitely not one of >> So interesting that you would think, but they just even with corrections now, it's it's starting to be questionable. of whether that you can bring a correction officer over and put them right in them in like we did with a
couple of the guys where we waved them. >> So remind me how much is a training cost? What is training cost? One of those >> itself isn't a high expense. It's probably about I think they're charging now formies around $2 to $3,000 to get them through
the six months. And then then there's the equipment cost which is probably it's probably about $5,000 to get them $,000 for any new officer >> equipment and academy fees and then obviously >> and our the sound pay I was minusing
>> outside the sal. Yeah. >> Yeah. I was doing that outside the sal. Yes. >> Okay. >> Yeah. So that you know that's that's my thoughts of why I'm asking for it or bringing it in front of you to kind of put it in your head of you know this is
why it takes so long. Uh it's not an easy flip anymore to to get somebody in and uh you know to to put somebody out there um you want to make sure you're fair to them and fair to the officers they work with because uh you just don't
know what situation they're coming across and you want to make sure they're adapt enough to manage it. Jerry, the signs that you're putting in for, are they the signs like saying, you know, road closure parade coming up or what about the >> They're the They're like the trailer
sign just on a smaller scale. >> What about the little um your speed sign? >> Yeah, I have um those are the the shield 12 radar speed signs. >> Okay. >> Those are the ones. Those are fantastic. >> You said you have two of them in >> I have two of them in there. And this is
this is the style print out that we've done recently. I only wrote two copies, but I'll start them then. >> They do the same kind that we have now where they have to be attached to a >> No, these are these are where the officer has the ability or somebody has
the ability to put them on a post like an existing post. >> Yeah. So, it's not like we have to call out for a mark have DPW put. So, it could be moved. >> It could be moved and it could be moved uh just about anywhere. Okay. that there's a post >> but that's the type of uh results that
we get >> since I sure since I did not um get a chance to read this what other technological advances are you asking for in this >> this year in your strategic plan
>> um body cameras >> okay >> um next year um we're we're hitting our mark with our body cameras we had them for about five years and what happens is the warranty >> is that for next year for That's for next year. Okay. Um what happens is the
um the body camera warranty no longer exists. So if we have a damaged issue or or problem with it, we'll have to buy the body camera outright. >> And they run about $3,600. And within that period from this point to where we
got them, we've sent 14 cameras out for repairs. um either from battery issues, from being overcharged. Everybody is obviously hyper sensitive about making sure their their cameras charged up. >> So, we're doing what you probably should
be doing, which we all do with our cell phone is to make sure it's charged constantly plugging it as far as keeping it charged because you certainly don't want to have that die at the most >> crucial. Absolutely. >> So, what what is the cost of us when you
have to repair a camera? What does that cost >> right now? Under warranty, nothing. >> Okay. But if it's out of warranty, >> it would be $3,600. >> Oh, I'm sorry. I missed that. So, it's $3,600 out of warranty. And how much is a camera? >> Uh they uh for the whole for the whole
department, it's a next year I got a price for $73,000. That's $18,000 in the first year. And uh from year two to five is uh 139. That's subscriptions. That's it's like a subscription and that would cover the uh
cover um the warranty and obviously the equipment the the software. This is with the company that we currently used and have used for about I want to say 10 years now if not longer. >> So let me I'm sorry let me just go back again
this but so between this >> you're proposing this for next year. >> That that's this year. >> Oh this is this year. Yeah. >> Okay. And how much is this? that is going to be $8,300 for two signs. >> Um,
and so for next year it would be an officer and the body cam and what else? >> And I would like to um update our our our handguns. We've had them for
>> You update handguns? >> Yes. Yeah. >> You've had those guns >> that would be six years on them. >> So the the attorney general office re recommends every five years. Um, so what
we're what I'm proposing is I have a an kind of a a deal in place to where our old guns will be purchased and credit given. >> Excellent. >> For the new weapons, then we get the new weapons.
>> That was going to be my next question. >> So when they're so when they're purchased, they come back. >> So someone's purchasing them from us. So, you are >> the Yeah, the money comes back to uh offset the cost of the the hand.
>> This I mean I'm I'm extremely stupid and I have no no problem saying that. I had no idea that you would resell a gun. >> Yeah. >> I had no idea. I mean, this is an education. >> I have um this year I have that in for our rifers. Um,
I'm requesting uh $7,900 to uh trade in six submachine guns for eight rifles. And um and that would cycle the submachine guns out. They we've had those for 15 years. So
they're well past the the the point of probably time to move on to a different >> Okay. What about your vehicles? I just constantly replace a vehicle every year for patrol. Um that's just to give you
that u cycle of not having to replace large groups of vehicles because with anything if you know if you say oh let's skip a year you know two years we'll buy you three well and 10 years you're going to have to buy three again you know. >> Well we seem to have every year there
seems to be some issue you know whether it's an accident or a >> major repair. So it ends up being one car a year for some reason. >> It's just not predicted what the reason is. >> But it's one car a year. Just one. You're not trying to do more. >> No, no, no. Just one. If we can if we
can continue with that one car a year has worked for a year. Is that like 81,000? That's the 81,000. >> We did do a couple of cars two years ago because that practice stopped. Doing one car a year for decades >> and stopped for a couple of years. It kind of bottlenecked a little bit
>> and then we were behind and so we did a couple cutters a couple of years ago and we're back on the one car. >> That's right. We're back on cycle with that. >> It's a predictable budget. >> It is. >> Can you Can I go back to the the the We skipped over the the rifle. Can I just
go back go back to that for a minute? >> The difference between the submachine guns and the rifles. And like I said, I don't know much about arms, so I'm just curious. Um is it a um a recommended trend that they they move from one to
the other and more importantly does the officers need training with the new training and does that come with the price? >> Definitely. Um what we have rifles now we have rifles and subg guns. So what I'm proposing is the to >> eliminate the subg guns.
>> So we won't have to train with that platform anymore. We'll just be doing handguns and rifles. and you found that that you just feel that's the most practical way to do it. >> Yeah. >> So, we actually would save the money on the the the training for the sub. >> Correct. >> Does the prosecutors search? Do they
have squat squatting? Do they have subs? >> They uh do not. They carry labels. >> What what's why I'm just curious? >> We did it for um cost effectiveness >> years ago um and for ammunition
ammunition costs and for purchasing. Uh the subg guns were firing the same round as our handguns, >> but also I mean the prosecutor's office doesn't have them and their squad team comes in. We couldn't use them anyway. >> No. No. There uh everything you touch in with anything nowadays it's
certification qualification. So um an officer would be assigned that rifle and if given or put in a position to where they need to uh be the person on the rifle that they're certified, qualified with that rifle that they're carrying. Um because it it does it does get that
detailed to where they have to have the weapon that they qualify. Even though you know there's 20 different hands that's their assigned weapon that's what they qualify for. >> I mean Jerry training
>> is training paid for by like they said free training like because I don't see training in here at all. >> Training I I going to go off of is what we have built into the uh into the budget. >> Yeah. Yeah, the operating budget. I I didn't ask for any additional because at this
point um we're just functioning on on that or andor it's uh low cost or free usually now obviously with the the five new officers a lot of that training that they are getting as far as alcohol tests
SSTs anything drunk driving related and and for their level it's it's kind of included it's uh it's great training through either the uh uh through u a lot of his traffic association. Uh
Ruckers does some great stuff with uh motor vehicle as far as uh accident investigation different levels and uh you know county does a lot of great stuff with uh CIT and uh basically
our MAS training which is use of force um pursuit and domestic violence. So, a lot of that training is incorporated. The the training that we were talking about before was those extra supervisory
classes. And >> I guess that's where I was going. Yeah. >> Because you and I had this discussion and I do think that's important >> especially if as you're bringing new people. >> Absolutely. As we transition those folks will need to go to those same style
class. >> So, is that >> that would be something >> that's above and beyond, isn't it? >> What's that? Isn't that above and beyond what they offer what they offered? >> I know that I know that >> the stuff that we paid for. Yeah. >> Right. That that's something that you would need to pay for. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. So, I'm going to encourage you to
look at that because that's really really important. >> Um my concern is that I'm seeing like overall 10 new people coming in in a period of >> Yeah. Five years. today. Do you think that people your your your
lieutenants and your sergeants 1,0001% need to go for u? >> Yeah. And I I would I would suggest that um you know as we look at look at these guys and you know keep them obviously the lieutenants and the sergeants that we have currently up to date but we'd
have to let's really start focusing on that middle range officer that's going to obviously I would assume advance the how we have >> you were listening of course. >> Thank you. >> Always you made my day. You were listening. Good for you. Um the only
other thing I want to ask I just want to clarify real quick. Yeah. And that is is that in 2027 2028 we went through the offices and you but it looks like you're bringing in two new offices each of those. >> Uh that's wishful.
>> Oh that's your hope. Oh okay. I'm sorry. I'm sorry because I kept going. Wait a minute. >> Ask for the world except >> No, no, no. I get it. I get it. That's why you do it. Okay. So you're saying hire one and two. One. >> Yeah. Okay. >> But what it would really flip is in 2028
because you would definitely have to hire people. Yeah. Right. By then, you know, people will have a little bit more information and know where what direction people are going to go in their life. >> And and and it's, you know, it's easy to say now like, oh man, you know, soon as I hit this point in my life, I'm out of
here. I'm going to change my life. And then, you know, once you get there, you're like, well, okay, >> am I really ready to >> But again, we know three at least. >> Yeah. Right. And so that's in 2028. >> I would put money on it. >> So then my my point of it is in 2028.
>> It's really >> four new officers, not just two. It'll be four because you're replacing three and then you want to bring an additional one. >> Yeah. To be four. And >> that's in mind. We'd have that uh you
know, however, what part of the year they go out and their salary and everything built into the budget. Boom. one 27 one in 28 and they leave 28 >> then yeah >> one 29 or two >> okay I just think you got to like I I'm
the only thing I'm saying is I would encourage you to go back that again >> okay >> because I think the council just needs to be realistic in terms of >> so there's no shock factor because we don't know it's going to be sitting in the beats in two years or whatever the
case may be >> that's why I wanted to bring it in front of you guys >> show you Right? Because hopefully what will happen is that this is given to the next set of councils so that they know exactly what the background is and they understand that this is this is how this
was formulated what is going and that's why I like strategic plans going to be able to hand this off. Okay. >> Anybody else have any questions for Jerry? Yes, please. >> I just have three very simple questions. George, how many cars >> like in use? Not ones that we just sit
in front of. >> They they all But they all are in use. Um we currently I believe it's up to uh six cars. How many offic Yes. And have we ever used
>> we sorry >> have we ever used >> Yes. I don't want to say it too loud or >> knock on wood. >> Uh so a a quick question on the uh beet
>> recognizer sign. Thanks. Um you had an official name for them I've forgotten already. um is the the the vendor this all traffic solutions do they present data on how um the relative
effectiveness of different styles of those signs because I've seen a number of different styles. There's one in particular that I personally have felt very effective. Um and I'm curious whether there I'm I'm guessing it costs
a little bit more. I'm guessing we don't have that kind right now. >> We don't have that kind right now and and I'm I will let you guess. Um I'm I would be curious to see if the effectiveness of it is there's data behind it saying it's worth the extra
money. What kind do you think I'm talking about? >> I think it's one by song. >> No, it's the one that gives you a smiley face. I'm all about working with psychology and um and I've actually read I it's
been a long time since I've read it. I would be really curious to see the frowny face and smiley face. >> I haven't seen one recently in this area. >> Is it a stop? >> No, has a stop.
>> You guys, I took a picture for you guys. This is a Speed limit is 25. Your speed is 27. You get down under to 25 or under and you get a smiley face. You're over
I saw them in South Carolina over that great. Okay. So then my last question and um coming back to the the new officer and the plan um it sounds like this is essentially it's it's a succession planning strategy, right? Yeah.
>> Um so the the folks that that may retire over the next few years um it do you have a good handle on the the folks who are already here and their growth into those roles?
>> Yeah. Yeah. For the most part. I mean there uh there is a gap. Um we did lose officers that were at the 10 year mark. So eventually somebody is going to uh once you have a good group of people that are in sort of in the upper middle
management we're talking guys that are like 10 to 15 years on >> and then and then from 10 below that's where that group of five people are all under the you know under three years. So
you you really also got to educate them. They got to realize that you know they're going to have to learn a little quicker. They're going to have to move a little faster to make up the gap as far as those middle middle guys. And you know right now it's a threeman squad and and it's an honor
and privilege to kind of be a middle guy like you know a lot of it could potentially fall on you. you know the supervisors off you're the officer in charge of OIC which carries some serious responsibility you know right now
what we're doing if a somebody under three years is a middle guy um you know we have this form they call lieutenant most of the sergeants are like even if I'm off give me a call you know that to make sure that there is success and no
failures but you can't have any problems with any type of question about should I or what should I do in this situation and you know situations get money as money as water you know like you just it just starts it's never
clean these things always happen when you know you least expect you know we can be like oh yeah nothing's going to happen on uh Christmas day everybody's happy life's good that's not you know that's the that's the day that it comes
Yes. >> I'm sorry. I just have a followup question on this. Um, is there a potential case where someone pretty senior um, leaves sooner than we might expect and soon the the middle are ready to to
grow where we might want to bring in someone. >> A few of them that are playing a lottery >> that we might need to bring in someone who's more experienced. >> Um, that that wouldn't work out too well. A lot of it is based on uh seniority and and ranking within a
department. Um I think we'd be pretty pretty good, but um you don't you you are correct. You just never know what's going to happen. I mean good or bad something might happen to where they they might need to
not be able to to do this job anymore. So, it's something that we do have to keep an eye on. And um I know I can I can only do so much as far as jocking shifts and making sure, you know, it's it's as even as possible can, but that
situation did arrive, we'd have to look and see what need to do to make sure we put the right people in the right position. Scary thought. So, >> thank you. Anything else? I do, but I'm looking at the time, so I don't know if
we uh if we go more than three minutes. >> Start at the beginning. >> I know. I didn't know if like there's a trigger at seven or anything. >> Okay, great. Um so, Terry, a couple things I want to go back to. One of the things that um that the mayor said, right at the beginning where we were
talking about traffic and that one of the things that you need is more police officers can deal with traffic and frankly speeding is also kind of part of part parcel of that, I think. Right. Um, so, uh, question for you, and this is
more of an opinion than anything else, is, um, the mayor said she's getting, you know, so many more calls, right, than it since Christmas, it hasn't stopped. Um, but it is do what do you think is the cause
of that? Because like at least locally in the our square mile, we have four projects that are, you know, new uh construction. Two of which are literally not even, you know, going vertical yet. One of them's only been
renting for a few weeks and the spice factory is, >> you know, starting to fill up. I don't even necessarily know how many people are in there yet. It couldn't be that many. So if what do you think is the cause of the traffic specifically over the last 6 months that's increased?
>> Uh the only other thing I can think of is that there's a lot of projects countywide as far as other municipalities. So people are cutting through >> have brought in a lot of people quickly. Um you know the the Willows in Bron Township for example and then I know
there's a couple complexes in writing a couple complexes Clinton Township that weren't there. you know, like there's large groups of buildings, apartment buildings that weren't there. I mean, you look at uh Enclave and uh uh I forget what the other the original
apartment complex next to Health Quest was. Those those are pretty large complexes. I don't know if you guys over by Hellquest was and I think those are pretty much full. >> So, one behind it is totally I think they're both full. >> Yeah, I think it might be 90 something%
full. one 97% >> one behind it 100% >> and I think that just from my perspective that other one is larger than at least >> one in the back it >> um so I think a lot of that is is the volume of just the area and the draw and
>> I think it's people avoiding 31 and using city >> uh I I don't know anymore because now with that second lane it goes pretty smooth in that you know obviously though as soon as you get past what close to Highland Avenue, you know, and and
underneath the railroad crossing, it chokes back up again. >> Right. >> So maybe when they dualize the rest of 31, >> that's going to be done soon, right? >> You're talking. >> They're going to start it soon, but I think it's at least a year. >> When I say done, I mean, yes, started. But the the
>> I think it's still a couple of years away, but it should help alleviate >> traffic. And I don't think people are getting through town as quick as they used to. I mean, that's why you see the traffic as the circle, you know, is a big bottleneck because even if you stay on 31 and you want to go to route 12 to
go to 523 or wherever, >> you know, you've got the yield sign when you come on. Yeah. >> And it becomes, you know, you can that's a bad yield area because you can sit there for a while because all that traffic comes in. >> So, I think a lot of people want to avoid that too. >> Yeah.
>> You know, I think that 523 heading towards stop and it's insane. Busy, too. I mean, I also I see a lot more traffic um coming down Church Street to Main Street traffic light and then taking the left onto Main Street. Like they're on
31 and then they get off before the C4 is split that 31 the 22 31. >> You can't blame them. >> No, because that that's a that's a show there. I'm going to two and I want to go 12. >> But it also it also makes sense why you
would have so many accidents >> in the circles because people don't know how to take circles especially if there's a visitor. >> Y >> circles are you know that's a Jersey thing really. Um >> you get outside of Jersey you don't see circles right >> and we have three of them in a lot. So,
so the the bottom line is is that you so for me when you say traffic, right? This is just how my mind works because I understand traffic. Um I really think it is people are trying to find a different way to get from
point A to point B and so they're looking at back roads >> and so the back roads become traffic. Like for instance, if you go here to Hillsboro, >> right? You don't go down 202, you go the back rows and down the back rows at a certain time are backed all the way up,
right? Because it's still better than getting on 202 a lot of people. So I I think when you're talking about traffic, it's more of a shortcut. >> Yeah, I think you're right. >> As far as the I don't mean to get in trouble, but as far as the the the through traffic, people that aren't
stopping and doing things because we actually also have more people stopping and doing things, too. So that's a correct thing of course. >> But so I like I I like the way your budget includes the traffic >> um uh >> speed
and and I do want to mention I I just wanted to thank you for adding the two message signs because I know that's something that you have expressed to us and struggled with and that I only have one sign and I need it in three different places. So I'm hoping that helps you. I'm glad that you I I want to
thank you for addressing that. Two. Are two um speed signs enough? >> That's what I was going to ask. Are you sure that's enough? >> We'd love to see more. >> We We have currently two more, but I I'll be definitely willing to take more. You know, >> well, I mean, I would rather you ask for more and get less than ask for less and
get out. >> Take six. >> But my point of it is that if you're moving signs, is that really And that's what is that really going to be effective as opposed to having something that's permanent people get used to seeing? Right. because if you move it
then it no longer is right. That's just the way it works. >> The good thing about these they they're um they're capable of doing both direction now too. So before we had to flip it, you know, like going door >> um but and we always with the complaint we try to get a sign over there. So if
we can get a you know quarter that would be >> I would think that you a couple more. I would start off with four and maybe it's me but I would start off with four. So again, my concern is people will do well as long it is repetitive and they see it
all the time. >> Once they don't see it, you go back to old habits and that just that I mean it's just how people are. That's how you know they what's what they say with traffic enforcement in general. You know, uh two weeks they'll change their habits, but then they'll go back to the old ways. They go back to the so it's
constant game of checks that we move around. So the more resources we have out there that's you know more areas we can focus in. I have one more question. Again, it's right at from the beginning. Um, >> mental health services. I know there was
an incident over the weekend and it's um it mental health I I can I'm I'm hearing the struggle not just from your department but from other departments as well that work with you uh like uh enforcement, you know, it starts as one
thing and becomes another. Correct. Yeah. >> Um, senior services and and and um young people's mental health. >> Is there besides more officers, is there anything you could recommend that might help your department? because it just
kind of on my mind specifically about um you know >> it's hard because you know like >> constantly with mental health we end up dealing with the same person probably multiple times a week multiple times a day depending on what their mindset
their crisis is uh until unfortunately till the hospital does a little bit more or or somebody intervenes a little bit harder but for us on a on a response level. It's just very time consuming as like,
you know, we show up. We're there until uh the crisis team from the hospital shows up and then then we're there to watch that and we know I'll have a guy tied up on a call anywhere from an hour and a half to three hours just so this
crisis team can try to convince this person to go up and get additional help. So to that point, I know that there's a lot of talk u whether it's small municipalities for big cities with
health with um with um to work along with police so that when you have that call they're immediately going out with you. That's is that something that's happening positioning to? >> Yeah, it it's happening. Um the hospital
expanded its hours to just about 247 now. Um you know, somebody will come out, a crisis worker, but the crisis worker then looks at the officer and it's like, can you hang around? >> And yeah, I don't blame them, >> you know, because now we're in their house, right? You know, >> so that's why that's where the officer
ends up staying. And so it is it is happening. Yeah, that is definitely happening now. I'm sure they'll tell you they need more people, which probably is true. >> Um because, you know, it's the crisises are are insane. But we even get them,
you know, we've had a few that come in and, you know, they're sitting in lobby and it's a little more easier to manage because, you know, we're not in their in their environment. So, we know as far as weapons and safety, you know, they don't have something readily available. Then
you hear the stories of you know, officers get injured and or killed in the line of duty due to, you know, that that's interesting that you say that the other thing was walking down the street, a woman approached
and I knew, you know, you just know something's not right. Knew something's not right. And I was on my way to my house and I detourred. It's like >> follow better not go there. >> Yeah. Um, I mean, I was able to diffuse it in a whole bit, but I but it it's I'm
just thinking if it were another person. I worry about high school kids and those types of kids walking down the street and someone like that just kind of follows them like you hear about it, you know. >> Um, yeah. Okay. I don't want to delay the point. I just I'm just hoping that
>> I I just get little concern with the younger people walking up and down Main Street and There are some of those people. But yeah. Yeah. >> Anything else for Jerry? Anybody? >> No. Thank you. If not, thank you. >> I'll be here at the end.
>> Thanks, too. >> Uh, yeah. >> All right. You're a very small number. >> Yeah. Hopefully email today. >> Yeah. It was pretty simple. >> Yeah. I have questions for fire
department. >> What you need? >> Uh well, our request this year for our capital fund is similar to last year. Um a slight increase. I think went from 20 to 23,000 for PPE. Um that is just short
of what it costs to to upgrade firefighters. So that be that uh just graduated. Um so that stuff's it's ordered either way. either coming out of our operations budget or hope come out of this field budget. Um I'm hoping uh
finalizing the application for the county grant um to hopefully offset that cost um and get some additional equipment for our guys. Um I if if we're able to offset that cost, I would use that money towards um
SCBA bottles. Those run about 12 to $1,400 a piece. Um, so to start >> what the bottles inside >> uh the SCBA bottles, they're uh they they're they go into packs, the air packs that we wear. Um, so those those are those cylinders that you see.
They're um typically 15 to 30 year replacement cycles. Um, so we had replaced our air packs approximately five years ago. Um, those all came with uh cylinders. Um but to start a
replacement cycle similar to the patrol cars, right, where we're not don't want to replace them all at once, you know, replace um some models 5 years at a time um as often as we can. That way it's a little bit less of a hit on our budget. Um so
yeah, that's that's pretty much it. And I know we have equipment that is like at like at at its very end, right? And so we could have our fire our volunteers in the burrow going into a situational equipment that's faulty >> and could cause the harm. So I think
this is the the price of having a local fire department volunteer fire department. >> Any specific questions for us? >> Um really just for Bill confirming if I read this correctly this is already covered in the 2026 budget operating budget, right?
>> That you are correct. Yes. >> That's all I >> You're good. Thank you guys. >> Thank you Robbie. I appreciate it. >> So I think it's the regular regular agenda. Um
remembering things tonight. Um first of all, we're still short newsletter articles we've not gotten from all the departments and certainly not all the boards. Um Just wanted to thank the burrow for participating in the free
and uh um county for picking up all that overtime. Um I wanted to address the publicly two weeks ago. We talked about this $4.5 million grant, what happened to it. I
did respond to the council um regarding regarding it, but because it was such a robust discussion in public, I thought it really should be discussed in public here. Um, Mayor Driver did apply for $4.5 million
for a number of projects surrounding Peptiba and Cardinal that included um sewer and water improvements down the Avenue area, North Main Street, as well as the well that's supposed to help service all of those. And although it
was funded by Congress, it was not funded by President Biden. Um, he line item it and we got 1.2 2 million as I reported. Um I did announce that $1.2 million letter, but as I had no transition with the prior mayor, uh I
was not aware that it was supposed to be more than that. Nobody on council questioned it. So here we were years later trying to figure out what happened to money that we never uh we were awarded but never funded. Um, so now we have the funding request into Senator
Booker and Senator and Congressman Kaine for both OEM at 2 I believe it's 2.1 million and finishing this building for 1.6 million
um and we'll be expecting a letter on whether we get it or not or notice um in July. Um, what generally happens with all of these grants is that uh the mayor of the municipality gets a phone call saying, "Guess what? We're giving you $5
million or $4 million or $3 million." That comes from the congressional office. So, you know, the executive branch then doesn't have to give you all of it and they don't call it tell you that, you get an award. So, um, that's the status
on F45. we were awarded it by Congress. We did not receive it from the executive branch. Um I also just want to mention that on July 3, we want to be having a a meeting between now and afterwards uh reminding everybody about our fireworks and
thanking uh Mark Kane in advance for all the money that he's raised to produce that show. uh at Griffith um on July 3rd. Uh July 8th on Main Street, we'll be having a live reading uh by a
colonial reenactor of the Declaration of Independence, which happened in Hunter County 1st outside of Philadelphia on July 8th in 1776. Um main street is going to be closed from Katner to mine for about two hours
at around 2:00. The reading is the gentleman is supposed to be coming down with a horse and the reading is supposed to start at 2:30 and then around three and then um actor who goes by um Ned
Hector who is a historically correct revolutionary war hero free black man will be doing a speech on I believe liberty and then uh that all will be over over by four o'clock.
Um and um uh I also wanted to let everybody know that the hospital officially announced today uh contacting the mayors around the county um and they put out some small release but in case you didn't see
it they are finalizing an arrangement to partner up with Hackard Sack Meridian Hospital. Um they've been looking for a relationship with the bigger hospital for about a year, maybe longer now. Uh
and happy sack, but they're not. Um uh also just following up on I have a couple notes on things to follow up on. Empty boat building uh abandoned um abandoned property ordinance. Uh Council President Parker, you said you were going to follow up on that
>> and Chris and I have been in contact together with it. We're working on it. So it does not dismiss. >> That's fine. Um >> go ahead. >> Okay. I'm just following up. Uh redevelopment committee cardinal does have a scheduled meeting for uh the end
of this month. I'm still waiting to hear from Councilman Vice President Angelart regarding a choice of dates for the Captiva community meeting. Um so if you could get back to me as soon as possible so you can set that please. Sure. And I did send out a notification on Liberty
Village today for that redevelopment meeting. >> Um, and also regarding the insurance contract. >> Um, we were going to have the insurance be this. >> Oh, okay. Great. I wish I had known
because DPW and uh and public works public works and police wanted to come in for the presentation, but I did not know. So, okay, that's all that's what I got. Um, Councilwoman Fris. >> Oh, sure. Just two quick things. Um, Saturday, May 30th, we had a great
street clean up. I don't know if had discussed it at the last meeting, but every location was cleaned in advance of the um historic home tour and we had the assistance of a boy scout troop. So, great thanks to them. Um, and then just
real quick um more fire department our chief has put through for a very nice um request for money for our radios. Right. So, just to thank the fire department to thank you since you're here. We're
always finding ways to to put the oxygen mask on yourself. It's wonderful. And uh the other thing is I did contact our fire marshal today. still seeing a few issues to work through at the path and the fire department will be doing a walk
through of the hotel section tomorrow night. So hopefully you get where we need to be. That's it. >> Thank you. Uh first update, the uh long-awwaited share ordinance has been transmitted to the planning board and I assume that we'll be reviewing it at the
next meeting and then hopefully it will come over here for our potential passage. Uh number two, just want to say went to the um 250th grade of course that was great club event also a wonderful time on jobs always with our
volunteers. Um, may I already mentioned yes newsletter items very cold. Um, number four was uh I I spoke to a uh small business owner recently um who is
permitted to sell alcohol by the obvious >> um and they're they've gotten permission from them to sell it in their outdoor dining >> or alcohol alcohol or wine mostly wine. Um, and they're they've been given permission by the ABC to do
this along the uh on the sidewalk is where they're not dining area. The hour ordinances do not allow this. >> Um, and I want to see if at some point as a as governing body and council, we can uh >> find a workable solution to maybe modify
our ordinances to allow such plan some. >> So, I know Alli's going to be coming in with with those guys to talk about it um because it affects more than just Yeah. And and there's a number of restaurants that also Yes. And I think that's something we
weren't support. I feel that way for sure. >> Um >> I was going to address this in my my report as well, but from a planning board standpoint, I can uh follow up on that in a minute. >> You have four. >> Oh, one last thing. Uh, I did uh quickly
uh borrow a I noticed we didn't have one on the agenda, but I u borrowed a resolution from another municipality uh for team. We would care to pass one or recognize >> that was a
we did it. You ever do one last year? We did. >> I could have swear it was last year. >> No, we definitely we did definitely see something for you. >> That was it. >> Thank you, Councilman Herbert. >> Uh just echo the sentiments. Um thank
the county for the great parade we had here on June 14th. Um huge props to um the improvement district for putting on the Flemington Cup. Um, I cannot say enough good things about Ally and the huge team of staff she pulled together
um to to produce that event. It was really phenomenal. I hope everyone got a chance to go out and and uh savor the enthusiasm of the public. Um it was really exciting event and I appreciate them. And we also had a a pretty nice
turnout for the um D and N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N N NACP Junth event um over this past weekend. Um little else to report. I've got school board coming up this Wednesday and library um board coming up on Friday. Um, and I am
was excited to see in uh other announcements this week that Flemington and the Liberty Village development were selected for the governor's permitting dashboard pilot. Um, uh, if anyone here was responsible for getting us on that list. Um, I thank you. I'd be curious to
to see how we uh how we made it and um, look forward to seeing the results of it. Are you when you see the library board, are you gonna see if they've got an updated number from the eligible? >> So I could use some guidance on and Susan maybe this is something you can
help me with and like how they get to a updated number. I don't think we should need to hire an architect to do an estimate. Yeah, you and I so uh you know uh casually about it, but they need to
hire an architect so they can do an estimate for the um the work they can also just um reach out to um elevator vendors directly. I think it's
>> they have reached out directly to the elevator vendors, >> right? I I think I saw the estimate that I have seen was for a vendor themselves, but I mean like the actual um each each
company has their own manufacturer vendor. I think what you got was the service guy has as so there's a difference between those two. >> Um I can give you some names that they >> um So, but are they going to have to do
the architect sooner or later anyway? Yes, they are. I mean, but but the but the but like an Otus V an Otus ref can give them a ballpark, you know, pretty quickly. >> And they have an architect. >> Yeah. And they and they have an architect. That's why I said architect first because they have an architect.
And any architect would know it's it's going to be I think I mentioned before it's going to be between 250. >> We're going to have to pay the architect. >> Well, you're gonna have to pay the architect anyway to pay the design, you know, that run. So, okay. I just I don't know these things. I need to be educated. No. Yeah. Just a matter of
time. Yep. Anything else that >> I don't have anything. I'm just a couple things. Thank you for doing um step in for me for Junth. Um I was out of town
so I didn't get a chance to go to that. And I also missed the World Cup event which I was really sad about. But um some personal it things came into play. I will say that on the four 4.5 million I am still in contact with um other
people who are also going to help get that help us get that through. So I didn't drop it. I just wanted to let you know that that's it's still viable. Um and again I I went to a go the governor's reception u made some
contacts there because I really want them to help us with this. um RMTUA um a bit and a couple of other issues that I um wanted to address with him. So I'm actually going to be meeting with um
someone in the governor's office quite soon. So um I'll keep you guys. >> Yes. >> So a couple things. Um one just from the HPC because I know that we have a new
updated map. They were wondering if how we talked to about the map. >> Uh they were just asking as they just need to flip it out. Yeah. M >> Well, I have a machine that makes
anything that big. >> I don't know if they >> No, Ken does in the back, but I don't know how to use it. >> Yeah. So, >> you could ask. >> So, you just need copies of a big >> Well, they want to change that because apparently they updated it. >> Oh, the roads and everything.
>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, >> well, you wait until Ken does the aerial shot. We can get it from Ken. >> There's a there's a PDF. I mean they can go to Staples if they want to
>> account but you can go to Bass >> your your your planner has that digitally that the you know Beth and and McMahon Kyle Mcmanis have that digitally and it's also an exhibit within the
master plan. Um so when and I think I think there's a subcommittee that's already working on updating the master plan. So really that revised map should actually be added to the master plan at the time. It would be convenient since you're already updating it.
>> Are they specifically looking to just do that? >> So yeah, so all you have to do is get a print out. >> I will. I will. It's it's very simple. >> I'm asking they asked me to ask you
guys. >> Yeah. So, >> what else? >> That's an easy one. >> Um, other than that, no, nothing really. It's been a pretty uh uh slow week, I guess. Um, other than that, it's just congratulations to Ally and the team for
putting on the FIFA Fest. That was really, really well done. I know the the line went from like what was it? from the uh yes >> from the gate >> to buy the tickets all the way down to Nova where Bluefish Grill was to the
left of where the street >> road M Street. Yeah. So I went down pretty far down. I know it was like at least 1,900 tickets plus sold. So >> nice. >> That's almost like a festival. So yeah, >> just like >> I had I had tickets but I also had
eighth grade graduation. >> Oh yeah. You know, >> that was the conflict because there wasn't there was public graduations going on. They probably would have sold out, >> but they were think for 3,000 nine. >> Well, no, I was going to go beforehand for a couple hours, but then I was going to have to take a shower and hang out
and it was just too much. So, >> so I I watched it on TV honestly until I left and >> Well, I want to put this in in perspective. Our former director is now in Princeton. Not that I'm trying to
shoot shade, but if you Ally did this and had 1,900 people, >> I was going to say she had a month. >> Princeton barely had >> No, and there's probably more than Are you saying that?
>> No, I'm just saying I I'm just It doesn't matter what the number is. I'm just saying then this is what we would have gotten if >> Yeah. >> So that's about it. >> Thank you. Um yeah, I want to add Ally
and her volunteers had less than a month to put that together. >> It was a a monumental task and they they really deserve every athlete. >> That's why she did. >> Okay. So, but we've all said it was a wonderful event. I really did en enjoy
it. Um, uh, so tomorrow is the tomorrow night there's a planning board meeting at 7 p.m. Same same location as you are now. If anybody wants to stop by and say hello, mayor and I will be there. Um,
uh, last week I was in I I got an invitation and I I don't honestly I don't know if anybody else on the council did because I I just showed up to the meeting. Um, but it was a I'm going to pull up my notes because I I want to get this straight. It was a
pre-diagnostic meeting >> with DOT >> with the DOT. Yeah. Um, and uh, there were the representatives there were both from the railroad end of the DOT and the so I really didn't know what I was walking into and the public relations
end of it. >> It was uh, specifically regarding Church Street, the end of Church Street that kind of butts into the back of Stangle Road that you know that that used to kind of go and swing behind the uh,
Libby Village site. Um, I was really just there to kind of listen and take in the comments. I I And this is probably more of a planning board issue at first, so I will present it more then. And Mike Campion and I um my camp was there and
he and I both uh said we'll we'll give a a more full report tomorrow night. Um but essentially the developer of the Liberty Village site and the owner of the railroad um
apparently has approached DOT to um the railroad segment of DOT to um consider shifting the existing railroad crossing from the east side what is already approved in the site plan the east side
of the Liberty Village, the main part of the Liberty Village area, the 111 for sale houses, uh, town houses to the end of Kirk Street, which is actually the the the master plan had always talked
about trying to extend either Fulper or Church across to >> as a road as a road, right, to um uh Stangle. But of course the um railroad crosses there and there's a federal program that basically encourages
municipalities to eliminate as many crossings as possible specifically with because you don't want cars and trains to interact. And of course our town has what four or five different um broad you know four four or five intersections.
One of course is on the state highway. we're not really we really don't regulate that but the others are on Broad Street and and um so Kain the owner of um the railroad and the developer of Liberty Village had this preliminary meeting apparently a
few weeks ago with the uh representative of DOT um whenever you're doing any type of improvements with the railroad the DOT reps have to come out so apparently that was the initial meeting that initial meeting apparently inspired this
meeting and that was the meeting that I was invited to. Um the proposal and again big picture here don't this is there's nothing like I said I was just there to kind of listen and I don't necessarily want to um
speculate as to whether this would even be realistic to go forward. Um but uh there would be as far as action items that we would we would need to take as a burrow there there would be some action items that we would be requested to take
specifically maybe letters of support for shifting the um the crossing from that west side of uh the main part of the Liberty Village project to the church street side. Now that's not
eliminating a crossing. That's just moving across, right? The road would extend to Stangle. The part that we would need to deal with as a council would be the implications of
of uh right ofways and uh with with the uh Romanowski building. >> Is anybody planning on presenting this either to the plan? >> Well, that's Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. So, like I said, I am we just happen to have this meeting prior to tomorrow, but like
I said, Mike and I are going to go into a little more detail tomorrow, but the ne the other thing I I I said to the developers, you would need to come in front of the planning board and have a lead site plan approval. So, that's another when I say action item, hold on. Say developer, you talking
>> George. George. >> George. George. >> Right now, Kane is looking for letters of both. But they're working together. >> Exactly. >> But but but George is the one who owns the site plan of >> understood both. >> It it would be an application for that.
They they jointly would put in an application for an extension of church and there would be some right-of-way requirements. There would be some um site like site plan reapprovals and that doesn't like I said that
doesn't eliminate the a crossing. that only shifts the crossing. The there the other crossing that would be affected is actually on uh Central Station Road. There's a second crossing there. >> Was George there? >> George was there as well.
>> Does did he understand he had to come back? Absolutely. >> So So just to give you some back, this is this is not the first time we said this story. This has been hold on. This has been going on for a year. >> Well, I should say that. No, no, wait, wait, wait. Everybody, if you recall
back in the fall, uh Keane did come in and and share a a site plan with us, right? But I don't necessarily know they >> This goes back beyond that. This goes back beyond that. >> Okay. >> So, yes, I was invited to that meeting. Obviously, I was out of town, so I couldn't go. So, I I I think I knew that
you were going to go. The bottom line is is that this is like a pie in the sky type of >> Yes, >> it really is. And so and so there are so many moving parces. I don't even know if this is actually realistic.
>> I completely agree, but I just want to report on the >> right. I don't know that it's even realistic. I don't even know if it's something the console would actually kind of like say, okay, well fine. We're going to write a letter and say yes, this is good. Um, so so I right now this
is so preliminary and so a pie in the sky that it was it it just it may not even be realistic. But however, the real reason for this is because Kane was trying to get a meeting with DOT to help
with another project >> and he needed I I'm just giving you the background. So, it's it's kind of merging, but it's but it's really not. >> So, Susan, does this does this impede if we don't do it, does this
whole plan, pie in the sky plan, impede George from finishing the project at all? >> No, not at all. Nothing to do with that. >> No, it really does. It's really, to be honest with you, it would be an add-on. It would be a nice to have by the >> time they got the right. It would be a nice to have, not a must have. I mean,
to be honest with you, the site the approved site plan for Liberty Village would really not be >> drastically affected. But off the top of my head, I said traffic study and site plan approval. I mean, right away. >> Um, and the the only other thing and and like I said, I really don't want to go
into too much detail, but I did want to report to my colleagues that I I attended this meeting. Um the the good part about it is with the exception of any type of soft costs related to lawyers and rightways and things like
that. Um the good part about it is is this is a federal program that would actually pay for the long-term goal of connecting >> right >> church to Stangle. So >> and there lies the >> we want to we want to listen. We want to
take it all in and and you know see if there's an opportunity >> was the turntable on talked about it all part of this. Well, it it was talked about in that the connectivity of that region as you know from being on planning board and Adrian
knows as well as being on planning board that um that successful business um uh corridor of Stangle would then be
um almost in support and um be um kind of infuse I think success in the area of uh more success into the area of
>> it actually around that. >> Yeah. >> Yes. It it actually stem actually stems around that. >> I'm sorry. Yes. Um no, we weren't saying anything would happen to turn table itself. Is that I'm sorry if I right
outside of turn. I know I know what you're asking. I'm trying to give you the answer. The answer is is that it stems around that. It's not it. Yes. So the the answer to your question is yes. >> Okay. >> Um and so the bottom line is is that that
>> DOT has some money that supported >> that's why right and that's why Kane is trying to get this opportunity. I think it expanded from what the original thing was >> to this that because that that's that
part of it is pretty new but the bottom line is is to it has to do with turntable. >> Yes. >> So anything else? The next steps might be they might be asking the planning board and the council for
>> letters of support or some sort of comp. >> Well, I I just >> I think we're way way I don't think this is going to be it's not going to happen. >> Right. Like I said, but I do feel an obligation to report that. >> What else you got? >> Um uh that is it. Okay. Yeah.
>> All right. We're up to public comment session. I have to warn anybody from the public online, raise your hand. Anybody here in the audience? Uh, you come up to the microphone, state your name, the address for the record. You have three minutes. Hey, Tony.
Name the address for the record, please. >> Yeah. Tony, 45 North Main Street in Plington. Uh, I was very, uh, I guess enthused to see the fact that the two uh, developments there on the north end, I guess, have basically been rained in.
And I just would want to ask a council like or even Susan like is there any sort of ideas about what's going to happen to those two properties in the near future as far as like let's just say >> so what >> reuse of the
>> one of them is privately owned which is the one the old store building that one is in the owner X redevelopers hands and um and then the the boy building is owned by the guy who owns Steeps. So he
had it on first refusal to that exeveloper. So the redevelopment committees for both those sites will be meeting um in a week uh or less to discuss the next steps on moving forward with whatever. But like I
said, that one property Steve may be desirous of, you know, getting into another agreement or having the bro to another agreement. um with a redeveloper, but the the old store building the red building on
the corner of Hopewell for North Main is owned by the former. So they have to look at it. >> In terms of the sections of each property that basically dilapidated and marked as hazardous, would there be any way that the burrow could have these
properties just you know demolition? not without eminent domain which could take years. The property maintenance um department does have a a regular uh they have a agreement with the landscape company to be able to on the one on the
on the uh the northern site >> the store >> right >> we have le on that property to make sure it's mowed and a landscape and snow >> because basically the properties are you know I don't know they're dangerous I don't know of themselves but you know you can have vagrants in there animals
in there >> uh it It definitely is a uh negative, >> you know, >> reflection and I'm just saying that, you know, all these properties are in this stage of what are we going to do? You know, who's going to, you know, who's going to bite the bullet here? Uh
there's no question in my grind that, you know, these properties should be tuned down. >> You know, I'm not comfortable talking about options in public. I mean, it's it's a council prerogative and an executive session discuss this because we could still end up with litigation on
these, you know, um we don't know. Um and it's also, you know, private property. So, um I'm just going to leave it with what I said. It's a commentary. You really don't have to answer your question.
>> One other question in terms of while we all, you know, have experienced probably another hot summer. I know I saw something today in France. They have a week of 104 degree temperatures and they were going into all all these sorts of, you know, things about keeping people
cool and this this and that. Uh we used to have a community pool, you know, in the bur and that sort of went to the planning board. >> It's it's on the on the planning board agenda. >> It was on the environmental commission last week, too. So, something great's happening.
>> They're looking at bringing that back on board very soon. for their site plan smarter. >> Yeah, >> they actually applied last year and then it was delayed a bit and now they're back. >> Okay, it's a couple moving forward. >> So, it's going to happen. >> I'll find time. Other than that, uh I
know just in the north end, I've been, you know, working with Adrian here, there seems to be I'm just going to use the term a lot of pollution on the north end. There's noise, there's trash, there's uh what you want to call scenic
pollution. Uh it really is in terms of my, you know, let's say if I wanted to sell my property, get out of Flemington, it really would be a hard sell. In other words, you know, I have a few rental properties in the area, but let's just say this. Back in April, first week of
April, maybe the chief comment on there was a raid directly behind my backyard where there were SWAT team members, heavily armed going into an apartment, I imagine, or as it turned out, a drug. So now I
had my dogs in the backyard. I was 20 yards from 20 heavily armed people and you know SWAT and this was in the days of ICE you know when ICE I mean if shots started to ring out
I had even gone out to this great going on and we're talking not through the flying chimber police it was done through the county prosecutors office >> well again this heavy weapons >> just I I have pictures and video >> but there's no way that the police could have told you about it >> well again I understand warned you about
it. >> But again, this is part and parcel of living on a north end. >> Not necessarily. I had a councilman arrested right in front of my house in 23. >> So, uh, police cars right outside my house and I don't live on the north end. I live in very far east end.
>> Now, I'm going to just ask the chief one thing in terms of noise pollution. have a lot of these vehicles with these mufflers, uh, you know, that just, you know, I have a house three doors down from me and I swear to God, the guy
waits for the light to change at the intersection to green so he can gun it out of his driveway and go right up Main Street. But there's got to be a half a dozen of these vehicles in and around Flemington and you can hear them. And
I'm saying to myself, well, what if another dozen people decided to be NASCAR drivers and, you know, opted for these mufflers, you know, aftermarket? I'm like, yeah, this this could get away from us here. You know, these motor
vehicle, but it's just something for the burrow to think about. Maybe an ordinance that, you know, you don't you don't go ving this thing at six o'clock in the morning as you go out, you know, to out to work or whatever. But you hear these vehicles all during the day. You
hear them in the afternoon. You hear them mid morning. And like I say, there has to be probably a good half dozen in in my general area that they're coming. >> What time does your neighbor leave in the morning and she's going to have a car sitting there waiting? >> Well, again, they they come up, you
know, North Main Street, you know, up the hill. what he has just said that he waits till the light changes so he get >> that's one person but there's others that >> No, I'm saying the chief can have somebody they can't have somebody after the fact, right? Well, >> we get these complaints about cars
revving high-speed engines a lot, but unless somebody gives us a make model or a license plate or an exact time of day that they're commuting every single day. And you just said your neighbor waits so he can rev out in the morning so the chief could be there and have a car there to get the guy.
>> Well, >> so you need to talk to him about that so you can do that. >> In essence, this is one specific, you know, individual. >> It's got to be an enforcable, >> but I'm just saying that overall it doesn't seem to be going to a place. In other words, like I said, imagine if
another dozen cars in Flemington have this option on their vehicles and they start. Now whether that's a state, you know, motor vehicle, I don't know. It's it's just sort of quality of life. It's just something that I'm going to mention. But again, the North End has a
lot, you know, a lot of things that just aren't appealing to me anymore. The traffic, these buildings, little Elvis, it it just seems like it's going the wrong way. And I just want to alert
council to them. I know we're busy in this area of town and that area in town, but when I when I say like, hey, listen, you know, that that that little Elvis building as I call it, it should be down. It shouldn't be up another 10 years while somebody debates about who
he's going to sell the property to. And I believe that's where government should step in and say, a planning board say they've got to come down. You know, the owners of the building have a responsibility and they should go down.
They're a hazard. They they offer nothing positive to the image of Flemington. And I can go on and on, but again, it's been too long. So, thank you very much. Anybody else from the public? >> I don't see anybody with their hands up. >> Anybody else here in the audience?
Seeing none, we have minutes to approve session June 8, 2026. Have a motion, please. >> Is there a second? Second. All in favor? >> I Uh, executive session June 8, 2026. Commission, please.
>> Second. >> Thank you. All in favor? >> Thank you. Consent agenda. >> Uh, resolution 202696, resolution authorizing a contract with Cargo Property LLC to avoid public safety
hazards at 8 remain lot 55, lot 17 and author of the export of the main property. Resolution 202697, resolution authorizing a contract with TGA Properties LLC to obey final safety hazards of 307 Highway 202 block 44 lot
6 and authorizing the tax collectors of property. Resolution 2026 111 resolution including a refund of the redemption tax sale certificate on block 21 lot 4. Resolution 202612 resolution including a refund the redemption tax sale
certificate on block 36 lot 9. Does anybody want any of these taken or vote? Seeing none, can I have a motion, please? >> Is there a second? Second. Roll call, please. Council, >> yes. >> Mr. President, >> yes.
>> Counciloman, >> yes. >> Councilwoman Harour, >> yes. Council, >> yes. >> Council President, >> yes. >> No. Introduction of ordinances. Public hearing ordinance 2026-12, an ordinance amending section chapter 7 A21, residential permit parking 24hour
municipal code to create a 24-hour residential permit parking zone with Park Avenue extension. Okay, I have a motion to open up this public hearing to the public. Is there a second? >> All in favor? I public hearing is now open to the public. Anybody wishing to speak to raise your hand if you're
online or come up to the microphone if they're not being none. Can I have a motion to close the public hearing to the public? >> Is there a second? >> Second. All in favor? >> I have a motion to adopt ordinance 2026-12.
Is there a second? >> Angel will second. >> Any discussion? >> Rolling. >> Yes. Council Vice President Englehart. >> Yes. >> Councilwoman Farar, >> yes. >> Councilwoman Herbert, >> yes. >> Councilman Lever, >> yes.
>> And Council President Clark, >> yes. >> Ordinance 2026-13, an ordinance amending 78 traffic schedules to remove a handicap parking spot on Spring Street. And have a motion to open up the ordinance to the public. >> Is there a second? >> Second. All in favor?
>> I now open the public hearing. Anybody from the publication to speak, please raise your hand online. Not you come to the microphone and statements for the record. Seeing that motion close ordinance 2026-13 >> I'm sorry.
>> We do. >> Oh, okay. Thank you for catching that. >> I think they were thinking we were on something else. >> Okay. Linda took the hand and down. >> All right. Thank you. >> They're here for something else. >> I have a motion to close the public.
>> Is there a second? >> All in favor? >> I have a motion to adopt ordinance 2026 move. Is there a second? >> Second. >> Discussion. >> Roll call, please.
Rise. >> Yes. >> Council vice president. >> Yes. Councilwoman Pasara. >> Yes. Council woman. Yes. >> Yes. >> And council president. >> Yes. >> You resolution 2026-113 resolution approving the purchase of the
2013 Ford interceptor utility via the Royal Emergency LLC not to be exceeded amount of $7,000. And a motion please move. >> There's a secondhart will second. >> Any discussion please Rice? >> Yes. Council Vice President.
>> Yes. >> Councilwoman Fara. >> Yes. >> Councilwoman Herbert. >> Yes. Love it. >> Yes. And council president. >> Yes. >> Resolution 114 resolution to renew and liquor license for the 2026 2027 license term. I have a motion please. >> Englehart will move.
>> Is there a second? >> Second. >> Any discussion? Roll call, please. Councilman Bryce. Yes. Council vice president. >> Yes. >> Councilwoman Fara. >> Yes. Council Herbert. >> Yes. Councilman Levit. >> Yes. >> Council President Parker. >> Yes.
>> Resolution 2026-15. Resolution approving Ros I'm sorry Jose Flores for admission to active membership of the state of New Jersey fires association motion. Is there a second >> discussion? Roll call. Councilman Rice.
>> Yes. >> Council vice president. >> Yes. >> Councilwoman Tosaro. >> Yes. Councilwoman Herbert. >> Yes. >> Council Leon Council President Parker. >> Yes. >> Resolution 2026-16. Transmission of the bro council with fun to retain Carl Conor as municipal clerk.
I have a motion please. >> Parker vote. >> Secondhart will second. >> Any discussion? Roll call please. Council. >> Yes. >> Council vice president. >> Yes. >> Council woman. >> Yes. >> Harvard. >> Yes. >> Love it.
>> Yes. >> Council president. >> Congratulations Carla. >> Who put that one? person. >> It's a pleasure. >> Let him know if you wanted me. >> Hold on. Number two. >> Wait, can
do his resolution? >> They hit the Junth. >> I was going to ask if we want to add that to amend the agenda. >> We'll move. >> Is there a second? Um, would that be 117? >> Yeah. >> Yes. >> Um, council Levit, would you please make
a motion to uh move resolution 2026117? >> Opposed. >> Is there a second? >> Uh, all in favor? >> You want to read it? Council about it. I mean, I can unless you guys don't trust me the contents of it. But
>> is it long? >> I don't know. >> You want to AI summarize it? Of course. >> It's it's a it's a resolution recognizing June 19th as Junth National Independence Day in the Burlington. Okay. >> And honoring it and goes through the district. >> Very good.
>> Very nice. Thank you. And I'd like to thank the township of I believe more politely borrowed it >> because we couldn't find the one that we passed for the last couple weeks. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Um all right. Public commentary number
two. Anybody from the public wishing to speak online? If you raise your hand. There we go. Can't see who that is. >> I'm just gonna allow him to talk. >> You got to unmute. >> Oh, we vote on that resolution. Oh, I'm sorry.
>> Uh, roll call, please. >> Councilman Rice, >> yes. >> Council Vice President, yes. >> Councilwoman Basaro, yes. >> Councilwoman Herbert, >> yes. >> Councilman Le, >> yes. Council President, >> thank you. Sorry about that. Thank you, Councilwoman. Public comment number two
online. >> You name your name and address for the record, please. >> Five Walters Lane. >> I'm sorry. What's the address? Five Walters Lane. >> Go ahead. You got the floor for three
minutes. >> Okay. So, I'm looking. So, ordinance 20 2614 was passed as is. >> No, we tabled it. >> Okay. Yeah, I missed I guess I got called out for a second. So, that's been tabled for further discussion.
>> Right. >> All right. Then I miss I missed that. Sorry. I had I had a sub. >> Well, it was tabled off the agenda. So, then updated agenda. Did you have it on there at all, Mr. Okay. So, that's still in discussion. All right. That's the only thing concerned with.
>> Okay. >> Is when that comes back up again. I know there was the previous discussion. I'm assuming you looked at that, too. The penalties and everything else. You do have an existing ordinance that covers violations for all ordinance
violations that has the $2,000 limit and the 90 days for prison. Also, 90 days for community service. That's in 3.7-3 which covers all ordinance violations. So that's already covered in the town's ordinances regarding violations and
those are limits. Those are maximum limits state set you know set by the state statute. So that's already existing on the bureau's books. But however you want to do that I thought that's something this didn't have. you know, it allows for community service besides imprisonment because I know that was a concern from the council the last
at the last meeting. So, we're just again we're looking to get this implemented as soon as possible. More instance happened over the weekend. Again, way beyond harassment.
So, okay. >> Thank you. So, where did we leave off on that? We left off on it. >> We were going to talk to Dave Giuliani. We were going to talk to Sergeant McN. And
>> and we were also I think there was a total unanimity about getting jail time out of that ordinance. >> Pleasure to the council at this point. You know, I mean, there is no although these homeowners are saying that our
board says we can tell people to we can find them for having stuff on the sidewalk. We really can't anywhere tell. So, um I mean we don't have the teeth to do that. So, um >> I think we should just think about a little bit.
>> Should we ask come back in and talk about it? >> I'd like to have um uh Dave come in. >> Yeah. talk. Yeah, I spoke with Dave about this after the last meeting. Um, I also went I also uh went back and forth
with I'm sure we I don't know if anybody else responded >> um to the >> You did really well >> to the um uh channel emails. Um but they both sent they both sent emails. a week. So, I responded to those and spoke to uh
uh uh Dave as well as our police officers as well as a couple of the other residents um that we didn't hear from. Um so, um yeah, I'd like to get their feedback, but I think in general, this my I I'm just speaking for myself, not not for everybody, obviously. In
general, I'd like to see it move forward. I think Dave will express the fact and so will I think the police that putting the something similar uh to what we've we presented last time on the books will be helpful to both the
property maintenance officer and the police department. So that's good. But I think everybody agrees the the um the >> imprisonment >> imprisonment is off the table. the imprisonment and up to whatever dollar amount is I just think that's just
>> and I think my only question of all of the things is um I don't know if we could I think we should make sure the wording is just right uh to kind of clarify I know that people putting stuff out on the curb is is is ugly but I also
don't necessarily want to over um I don't want to necessarily over uh >> we don't want to Yeah. So I So I think that's actually where I'd like Giuliani to >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I I do disagree. I agree about the prison thing, but I think the judge needs to scratch and
sort of >> I'm fine with that. >> I know. >> I don't know because this is just for me. I just >> I just haven't heard this from anyone else in the burl >> other than this one street. And I And I get it. I get it. And I understand how
aggravating it is. I think we've had been in this with Gary over this for the last several years. I I just think that that needs to be >> So, our next council meeting is July 20th. Um, Chief, can you make sure that Sergeant M is here? >> Definitely mark it down and make sure
he's available >> and you let Dave Julian know that you'd like him her too. And we can move that after work session in the beginning of the meeting and that's not a problem. >> Um, Yeah, >> if David's gonna be here.
>> Um, okay. Getting back to public comment. Anybody else from the public? >> Anybody else? >> Okay. Um, see, >> oh, wait, hold on. Who's this? >> Yeah. What's going on? >> Oh, it's early. Is your hand up because you want
to speak again or because you forgot to take your hand out? >> Okay, go ahead. >> Unmuted Tim Hurley because Yeah. What? So I understand now. So it'll be waiting till the July 20th, right, to have another discussion with the property
maintenance. So no action will be taken between now and another month at least. Correct. >> Right. We don't have a meeting until then. >> Right. So, okay, my concern again, is this keep happening? I've been calling the police in the last several weeks assuming something's going to
happen here. I can get back to calling the police on a regular basis, every day almost if we need to because we need to have something done before we have a problem, a serious problem. I said out there Saturday there were and with the parents
approval watching them they had their middle son from across the street throwing a heaving of basketball towards the houses heaving it. Not playing basketball throwing it underheaded as hard as he could towards the houses from the other
side of the street. That is not you know that's harassment. That's unsupervised mayhem. Well, you're welcome to come, you know, come to that meeting. It's a work session. You can speak about it under
public comment in advance and um at the end of meeting. >> Yeah. Yes. And you have my comments on the previous obstruction. And also I added some comments at the end just to clarify some things because what he had in there regarding you know even the garbage pales they're allowed to put
them on on the sidewalk. Well remember right now we're required to put them in the street. So >> we are required except for certain streets in the town black court street too narrow street >> right but I'm just saying look at that. I've made other comments on it but I'm just saying as long as it's clear we
just need to get this you know done something done. Like I said, we've been holding off on certain things just because hoping this was going to get done, but like I said, I've got other things that other priorities and other health issues, and
this is just making it worse. Thank you. All right. Anybody else from the public? >> No, I don't think so. >> Okay. Authorizing payment of bills in the amount of $360,9234. Have a motion, please. We'll move
>> okay vice president. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Harvard. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> President. >> Anything else? Anything else for Bo Hans? >> Yeah. He's going to stay on for a day.
>> Oh, he is. Okay. All right. Um Okay. And that's the end of the regular meeting where we have an executive session with two items. Public safety cameras and personnel QBA negotiations. Uh can I have a motion to uh enter into this executive session?
>> There second. >> All in favor? >> We'll take five. TV. >> I was about to say >> I don't say in favor I