No, Dennis, can you hear us now? He can hear you. He just Yes. Okay. Yeah. The Fington Burough needs to be on muted, not the individual mics on the computers. All right, you're good. Thank you. Now we'll call to order the Tuesday May 13
2025 uh meeting of the planning boards zone of adjustment of Flemington B. Please rise as you are able to flag. I pledge algiance to the flag of the United States of America to the republic
for which it stands one nation indivisible with liberty and justice for all. Right. to say this. This in person and virtual meeting is called assurance to the provision of the open public meetings act. Both adequate and electronic notice of this inerson and
virtual meeting has been provided by way of publication in the Hamilton and county democrat and career newspapers on or about January 23rd 2025 and January 19th 2025. In addition, notice of the meeting was posted on the door of the Burough Flemington Municipal Building located at 38 Park Avenue and any
handicap accessible entrances there too. posted on the municipal website, provided to the municipal clerk, and distributed to all persons of any requesting call. This meeting is being recorded with both audio and video and may be recast. This meeting is a judicial proceeding. Any questions or
comments must be limited to the issues that are relevant to what the board may legally consider and mutual a decision and decorum appropriate to a judicial hearing must be maintained at all times. Thank you. Can we have the roll call, please? Oh, we have to play Carla. We
don't actually because she was appointed that the council doesn't hire the planning board secretary two different things. Well, I'm sorry. So, this is official now. She's not filling in. She's temporary. That's what the resolution said last night. Yeah. Okay. All right. So, then
let's make a motion in a second to uh appoint Carla as our temporary board secretary. Do we need to do will call first or we could do that before? But let's do call first. Just so we know who's doing
anything. Mayor Cara. Yes. Councilwoman Fisaro here. Mr. Campion here. Miss Gin here. Miss Wetszman here. Miss Wingle here. Mr. Sch here. Mr.
Shangle. Schlanganger here. Uh Mr. Dashner excused. Mr. Eckle here. Mr. Han here. Attorney Kinski here, engineer clerico here, planner McManis here, and engineer Troutman is excused. Thank you.
So, do we want do you want to do an amend the agenda and do this first off the bat before we start the regular agenda? Um, we can do it however we'd like. Um, but let's since it's hers, let's get that out of the way. We do have another amendment that we'll make to address that ordinance, but it sent
out to you. Should we do both at once? That's what I'm thinking. Yeah. So, let's make a motion, a second. We're going to amend the agenda to put in place of item one a resolution appointing Carla uh Connor. Yes. All right. Carla Connor as our temporary
board secretary. Um I need a motion on that and a second. I'm going to move you. I hope they'll slower a little slower. I'm planning for it. All right. So, we're going to we're going to amend it to put that as number
one. And we will amend uh to put under uh let's do prior to the completeness and public hearing um the board's uh review of ordinance number 2025-13 for uh consistency with the
master plan. Motion Swingle, second Whitesman call. Okay. So, I start with Whitesmith. Swingle. Swingle went first. Okay. Miss Swingle. Yes. Miss Whitesman. Yes. Mayor Carara. Yes. Councilwoman
Fisara. Yes. Mr. Cambian. Yes. Yes. Mr. Sh. Yes. Destiny. Then we need to vote. Wait, he's mute. He's coming back.
Are we Mr. Schlunger? Looks like he's got mic issues. We'll come back to uh Mr. Yes. Yes. He's back now. Yes. Oh, we only take Okay.
Oh, attorney vote. You don't get a vote. Okay. No, right. They're professionals all differently told him to cancel. All right. Perfect. Thank you. So that is one.
New item two is public comments, which is a period for public comments of items that are not currently on the agenda. Um, is there anybody in person or online? If you're online, please use the raise hand feature to let us know you may want to make a comment. I don't
actually have anybody. There's nobody online. The panelists, right? Correct. There's nobody in the room. So, seeing none, we will move swiftly on to new item three, which is mayor comments, please. I have a few. Thank you. Um, number one, I want to thank Carla for
offering to do this. Um, uh, we'll see. She's she's giving it a try. This is um she may call. So um be nice. We'll make sure that doesn't happen.
We try to secretary. Um number two, now the budget did pass last night on uh the council. So I would um respectfully ask the chair to start the bylaws committee um you know because I think they're you
know for me they're both major issues. One is that the environmental commission does not have an official place on the agenda and they are statutory by state law and I think that they should have position just like HPC does. And number
two, possibly in my older age even more important that we start last testimony does not start after 9:30 p.m. so that we can end by 10. So um township does that and I know that Mr. champion, you
know, has a a pretty hard stop at 10:00 because he gets up so early to be here in the morning and I think it just would be a kindler and gentler planning board if we don't go till 11, 12 or 1 in the morning as we had in the past. So, uh I
would like to see that reconvene or convene a new committee to address especially those two issues. And then um finally I did have a conversation with George Malone in Liberty Village today. Um you know he's getting his financing I
think is now in order and uh he did have a big sit down with Bobico this morning. Um he brought Bob has other things to like possibly address the planning board, but he did bring up to me that one of the things that was in the planning board
resolution that he agreed to was um there's a fence that is to go around the Lone Eagle property on his side of the property uh where there's going to be the town houses. And of course, he removed one of them so it wouldn't be so close to the building. And there were supposed to be
large shrubs on both sides of the fence. Um, reportedly the owner of Lone Eagle has requested not to have shrubs on his side of the fence because he wants to get more seating in there. And um, Eagle presented to me that he is more than
happy to purchase and have plant plant those um, other shrubs anywhere that the burrow, Macampia, whoever would like. um just not there and he really doesn't want to come back to the planning board and have to reopen a hearing and everything else on it. So I'm laying at
your feet as a messenger. Um so that's it. Okay. Um I I'll leave it to the professionals to tell us how we resol how we can incorporate that effectively do that. Well, one thing
that came up today, they did mention and I had I didn't bring the resolution with me, but apparently the resolution, if I recall them saying it correctly, is that the resolution says there the offense and there be shrubs on both sides of the fence. So, you may have to amend the well to car. You may have to amend the
resolution because that but everybody thinks it's a great idea. The resolution says what it says, right? So, it would technically be an amendment to condition, which we've done many times before. Okay. There's a procedure for doing that and that's when we need something from the owner of Lag saying
that he's okay with that change. I mean because not that they're the ones that did you hear them requested so we start having a big long conversation about it. What I would suggest is have the applicant's attorney write us a letter
asking what it is that they're looking for and then we could start delving into what we may need, what we may not need and let's get that to start and that that will serve that purpose then if they'll be clear and then I can then I can talk directly with him as to what we may need or what the board may need or
if you want to come, you know, however it is. Bob, do you want to do that and ask George for that or you want me to just give George a call and tell him? Whatever you want. I'll I'll just call or something and yes, we will start the process of the committees um and feed those two
things. I've got a list for that committee as well of ideas while move forward. And um I also want to thank Carla um for um volunteering to step in on a temporary basis because it certainly helped me sleep the night. I was even my husband was comment I was
getting a little crazy. It was a lot trying to do my full-time job this and keep make sure everything regulatory was being done. Um, and she's really helped me a lot over the last few years. We've got things online now. We're I'm like putting things on the website. I'm like, we're getting there. Um, it's been a big
help for us to then transition into whichever way it goes. So, I thank you greatly from my mental health. Um, okay. Was that Can I move on to Yes. All right. Let's move on to item new item four, council comments then, please. I have no comments. I think we
fleshed them all out. Okay. Budget has passed and um Excellent. That moves us forward. That moves this this body forward. Um I'm presuming because nobody said otherwise, but can I just get clarification that when you said budget passed, was that was it the planning board budget passed as I submitted it?
It was a budget. Yes. And so a comment that I made yesterday evening is that there is this ad hoc planning zoning thing going on. I don't have any details around it. The last I heard it has not been sent to
kind of Mattis. Um but I did advise that in the council meeting and any billing that has occurred professional use is to come back to the council because you did an excellent job of pulling the budget in this year. So thank you. You're welcome. Yeah. and we'll just move along
doing our job and um along doing a great job with all excellent thank you. All right, let's move on to new item five um HPC comics. Dennis, uh we had a HPC meeting on April 16th and we approved an
addition of a rear stairway at 126 Main Street. Um, and the only other thing I have is just a reminder, we have our historic house tours on Saturday, June 21st from 11:00 to 5:00. If anyone's interested in volunteering, you get a
free ticket. If interested, let me know at dshow sbis historic flemington.com. Thank you. Thank you. Um, new item six, professional reports. So, you know, we have one for sure, but
let's one I'm going to start with Beth then. I don't have You're first on my list. You don't have to pass it right along. All right. So, McManus, do you have a report for us? I have I have two reports actually. Oh, I only forwarded one. So, well, no, no, I have one that I'm one
that was not given in advance. Um, so, and that is on affordable housing. I want to review the uh outline with the board which I'll I can make handouts or not make handouts but I have handouts that I can give to folks. And then the other one is I want to address the spice factory project. Right. And the
inspection. Okay. Um sit back. Okay. Here we go. So, um I went out to the spice factory property to take a look at the site because they're they're nearing the time of uh they think being eligible for a
TCL. So I wanted to go out and confirm that the the building and the site aspects that I'm in my jurisdiction as opposed to Bob's and that's for phase one. Phase one, yes, correct. Phase two is literally not started. That's the new building. So um there are a handful of issues. Uh
some of these I think are more important than others, but I'll but I'll run through all of those with the board. Um so first there are a variety of site improvements. I'm going to def defer to Bob. Um and so I'm not going to get involved. I might note that there's a 88 ramp, but I'm I'm not going to insert myself as to whether that's correct.
That's just not part of my expertise. Um, but additionally, there are uh some concerns that I raised and I spoke with their I spoke with their uh effective engineer today. So, I have a little bit of update compared to what was uh in the memo that I had written. So, first
behind the the side of the all my comments are related to the Spice Factory building itself, not the not the um the Legend Salon, much less the the building that's not yet constructed. So, behind the the building, the Spice Factory building and a little bit off to the side, they had done some site
improvements. There's a large area large areas that are missing grass and more importantly missing the the the hay that they they put down to try to get the seating going. Um I identified that. I understand, I didn't get a chance to double check, but I understand that's actually been corrected already. They
put the receding uh hay back down and add grass seed. So, I think think that should be on its way. Um, additionally, on the site plans, there was a row of uh shrubs basically along the boundary between the spice factory and the Herman Cath apartments. That's the three-story
apartments right there. Those shrubs are not there. I think what actually happened is they were shown on the plan as existing even though they may not have been but the reality is they're on the plans and so they're going to go forward and replace those um along the
front of the building. If folks recall, the project was the building was originally and then the project was originally proposed to have commercial on the first floor and then during the course of the application they lost their tenant and the first floor was converted to residential use either
units or amenity space and basically there was uh there was a missed landscape plan that should have been provided during the course of the hearing uh because at one point they were showing what was existing shrubs
along the front of the building and then they submitted a revised site design for the front of that building that uh changed the way the walkways were proposed or were existing rather to reflect the fact that it was no longer individual commercial spaces. What should have happened was there should
have been a supplementary landscape plan that went with that and there just wasn't. So, the plans I think uh are questionable as to whether or not it should be showing the shrubs that were existing versus uh you know a revised landscape plan. What I've
said is you need to put shrubs in this area because at a minimum I have the I have the original plans that show the existing shrubs and also this is um this is not technical but it's ugly. So, let's add some plants. Uh and they've agreed to to provide that. I'm expecting
a revised landscape plan to show those. Did we maybe did some disconnect happen because the phase two? Was it like in the phase two that because wasn't there supposed to be some sort of little pocket park? I seem to remember on these plans. So, and I think that's what happened. It
was just it was a mid application change of use, mid application of application change of of site plan and the the landscape plan that should have been submitted just it just fell through the cracks. Um but it's clearly in need of
plantings. They're blank mulch beds right now. So they're going to provide those and they're going to submit to a landscape plan that shows that. Okay. Um, I identified there are a variety of dead trees and shrubs throughout the parking lot, but I will say all of those piles are going to be removed as part of
phase two. And so my recommendation is that there be no replacement of those uh dead plants until assuming phase two starts now. So it's or soon. So as soon as it starts within six months, uncomfortable with the dead tree sitting there until the demolition. Yeah, it
makes sense to do it. If phase two were going to start in several years from now, I think I would have a different recommendation. But the representation and I think what we can enforce is based upon beginning phase two about six months after completion of phase one. Oh, so they have given you a date for that too. Yeah, it's it's unofficial.
It's on the phone. But that's the expectation. But they came to you. That's good. Y um and then the remaining items are building related. So starting with maybe the less complicated folks remember there are these canopies uh over the windows. The
canopies are not looking great right now. Uh a lot of them are ripped or somehow broken, you know, have mold on them. So I've identified those as something that ought to be replaced. Although it's not specifically relevant to the resolution, it just seems it
seems appropriate given the nature of the application. They've indicated that they're going to do that. Um, and that was perhaps planned anyways, but that they're they're going to replace those. Um, the roof equipment, if you recall, they came back in for this field change and
they showed us a detail that was proposed to screen the equipment so that you would stand on the streets, look up, you really wouldn't see it, maybe a little bit through the screening. um just in the way the detail they submitted was it was a 6 in of solid
material then 3 in of air essentially and then 6 in of solid material to allow pass air to pass through. What got installed is closer to uh 6 in of air and 3 in of solid material and six inches of air. Um and so I raised that
as a concern because frankly it means spring is just much less effective for folks that might have driven by. can see it through. Especially when the lights behind it, you can see everything. So, my uh expectation is that they're going to be
able to fix that. They're going to amend the screening, but admittedly they need to talk to their structural engineer to make sure that the wind blow is not going to be a problem. But my expectation, not my certainty, my expectation that will be addressed. And then the last item, right? Yeah. The last item is still about the upper
stories of this building. So, we've got the three existing Spice Factory stories, the brick, and then they did the two stories of addition with the uh the uh the top story being a little smaller than the uh the the horse story
rather. And so, what the renderings had intended was the fourth story would be sort of like a yellowish like a yellow brick color and then the top story would be a lighter gray. What has been constructed is the fourth
story is gray and then the top story is almost like a cream color, very light yellow. And um my personal opinion is that it just doesn't look great. Um not only does it not look great, but more importantly, it's inconsistent with the plans that
the board approved. So I I flagged that as well. I've talked to their engineer. I think that this can be I think that the top story can be fixed. Uh I think it could be fixed with a little bit of paint quite frankly. Um their proposal
overall is to uh fix the roof screen which I'm hopeful that the structure mirror will not uh indicate as a problem that they will paint the upper story uh a grayish color consistent with the rendering and for
their canopy replacement they proposed to do in black. And so I think the the end result of this project could be something that is perhaps better coordinated than it was before the planning board in from a color perspective where you've got the brick
building, black canopies, uh gray upper story and uh gray top story, maybe not the same color gray, but somewhere in that family. All and then the building will have these black windows along with black canopies. And I think that that
will look very nice on the project. That's my current thinking. Um but to be clear to date, what's officially happened is I issued this memo. Um John Tilson, your construction official, uh has seen it, has reached out. He's going to ask for my opinion about if we wanted
a TCO, much less a CO, can be issued for the building. Um, I'm in ongoing discussions with our engineer and ultimately what I'm hoping to get from him is a proposed response that addresses each of these items. Um, in in
my opinion, the proposed color change for which would just be the fourth story, which was originally planned for that yellow color and would be gray instead. Um, I think that the that one change could result in a nicer looking building.
Um, and so that's the that's the update on Spice Factory. Um, I'm hoping to get a response from these folks inside next week. I think they're pretty motivated because they really want their their CO, right? Um, their temporary CO more likely.
Um, and and so hopefully this project will will be beautiful and the first the first building, the Spice Factory building will be open pretty soon um or at least occupied. Uh and then the course will begin phase two. Um and
that's thank you. Yeah, it just came to me so apologies for not but in that same wealth location I forwarded something on to you about some somebody worrying about the signage. So I guess what I can
ask you is because there is a resolution for what used the old right now it's Bank of America. the resolution compliance on there. We can check their signage as to the resolution, right? And then that Yes. Is
that something we can we can follow up on next meeting? Yes. Thank you. Yes, definitely. Okay. I'm sorry to sound a little bit strange, but Beth understands what I mean. Um, okay. And then the affordable housing. Well, are there any other questions? Any questions on Beth's
report? Any concerns about Sorry to interject. I just remember like with the red awnings that we kind of liked the red at one point because we wanted them to feel a little more homage to what it was. So I just am curious as to like if you're happy
because I remember us having that discussion because at one point they had changed it completely and we didn't like that. So to that point what what I think you're referring to is we we asked them the for their first proposal for phase two was completely different for the
original phase two that was that was given. And so we said we want you to do something on phase two that more closely matches phase one. So that doesn't necessar that didn't mean that we said that they had to keep the red on phase one. We were just saying that phase two
had to more close to match. They completely taken out the whole awning look. They didn't match. So I think I could be correct if I'm right that even if they changed the black one. Our our request was that it the two buildings kind of match or sort of look like they
are in the same family cuz their first proposal if you remember and that's why we were happy with that. I think that's what you remember right. Yes. Okay. Yeah. So we'll keep an eye on that phase two basically correct. Yeah. So, one of the things I also want to ask them for because I'd like to not have this
discussion about the phase 2 building um is I think that this is also an opportunity to confirm any color changes, any concerns about the phase 2 building. Let's just get this done at once, right? Um because the the the project is I mean it shares parking.
It's clearly part of the same trend. The buildings should be coordinated and complimentary to one another and they don't need to be mirror images but um they should just be complimentary. So I see this as an opportunity to make sure that happens and to hopefully just have the conversation once. Yeah. So it's
less time for us, less time for them. Let's get the right idea. Thank you. Anybody else have any questions back on that? Not seeing anybody raising any hands. Do we move on to affordable housing, please? Okay, it looks like we got
props. I don't know if she's reaching like Well, don't get too excited. It's just a memo. Good stuff. Um, so this is it's three pages, but I have to say you guys are you guys are in such good shape. It's
unbelievable. You're my town for all this stuff. Can we have that in mind? Yes. All the web page flash. We are the easiest town. officially that's going on my new copies
or you have enough one more show. No, I I have more copies here. I just one more. Oh, well. All right. So, I'm going to buzz through the first couple of pages. The stuff is so straightforward. Um, and there
there's actually very little decision- making for the force. That's let me just start there. You are in such good shape because what I'm doing for most of my towns is having discussions about what new sites and that's just not a discussion that we need to have. So, the burrow's got uh four components of it
affordable housing obligation. Rehabilitation, that number is 74, pretty high, but your third round rehabilitation number was 68. So it's not too different than what we've seen recently. Your first and second rounds which go from uh 1993 through or 1987
through 1999 that number is 38 fully satisfied. Your third round which is from 1999 through 2025 it's eight plus fully satisfied. And then your fourth round which is what we're doing now from 2025 through 2035 that's 25. And that's
also going to be fully satisfied. So um on the first page you see those numbers and then you see how and a little bit into the second page how we satisfied these first and second rounds. So I I can get into this if you'd like but the the bottom line is the bureau took a
vacant land adjustment early in its uh in its second round actually and it basically said at that time hey we don't have enough vacant and developable land so they did the adjustments. There's a lot of rules associated with that, but I have to say it sort of
doesn't matter because you ultimately over the years fully satisfied that 34 38 unit first and second round obligation. So even though you took the vacant land adjustment, the relevancy for today is basically nothing. Um and it's fully satisfied with the
variety of projects that you can see listed here. Um all of which are constructed except for the Union Hotel and that is under construction. for your third round. Um, you're fully satisfied, but if you look at the table on page two, you see a project crossed
out and one below that's it atalicized. And so what's happened is when I did your third round plan and satisfied that 8 unit obligation, one of the units I used was for the Luster Dodger Blues project. And for those of you wondering,
well, which one is that exactly? It hasn't been constructed and it was approved. Maybe I I I'm not sure maybe 15 years ago at this point I was nervous about putting it in your third round plan. Let me put it that way. And now 10 eight years later it's still not constructed. Do we have the
same on section two cut glass? Don't we have the same situation there? You do, but they are they are um it's two things. one that's a project or that's a site that still remains uh undeveloped
and clearly available for development unlike the Luster Dr. Blue site which was uh I think an addition to an existing building. Okay. Um so there's that but the other component that I think is relevant is uh this is part of what's referred to as your unmet need in
your prior your first and second rounds. And so it has a lower standard associated with it. The fact that it wasn't yet completed is of much less I don't want to say zero but is of much
less concern. If the worst case scenario on that is we go through the approval process and the court says well that project has not happened yet so we don't want to give you credit for it. in which case I'm gonna say fine, we're gonna backfill it with surplus credits that I'm going to get to at the end of this
discussion. And then when it does come to fruition, if if and when it does come to fruition and it includes a portfol, right? So it's not it's not a fatal flaw by any stretch. The Luster Dogs of Blooms, this is satisfying our 8 minute
third run obligation. So, uh, projects satisfying our actual obligation or the RDP associated with that vac adjustment, those need to be real. It needs to be certain and definitely going to happen essentially. But that project really just doesn't have that going forward.
It's very uncertain at best. But that said, we've got a ton of surplus credits. So, I brought two of the credits from the spice factory back into the third round. And we're done. Third round is done. and everything is either constructed or under construction which is fantastic and so as we get to the
fourth round I just want to highlight the bottom number that's surplus. So when you say well not worry if if we lose cut glass that's why we have so much surplus that we can pull from what's not on this is on hope Avenue
there is a um I'm not sure my champion may know if it's Easter Seals or who runs it. It's Easter Seals mayor. Easter Seals. So it had burned down. It had I believe four or five men in there living there. um
burned down and it was rebuilt for even larger occupancy and that should reflect because they count. Yeah, I will uh I will follow up about that. I'm It's right next to the DPW building on Hope Avenue. Okay, that would be great. And I also
don't see on here we also have the other house on Broad Street that's living that Anderson house. Yeah, I have that one in there. Okay. Um, but I'll add Easter Seals. There's no as long as I just need to make sure they've got affordability controlled
or but I'll work with them to figure out if we can credit. I don't see why. Yeah. Um, but really, you know, a lot of this high density housing cap and Cardinal was sold by the prior administration. It's us needing so much color that we
had this that huge huge huge lo and they kept saying to the audience, "No, we don't. No, we don't." And here it is in writing. No, we don't. Yes, sir. Right. I mean, I have to say your obligation is so favorable, you know. Um, I think we're the only spot in the county that's
required. Yeah, that's probably true. That's probably true. But American townships is so massive, it's going to really impact grow. Absolutely. Yeah. A lot of these suburban municipalities are really going through it right now as they try to find enough sites and
mechanisms to to meet the obligation. And it's also question of water and sewage. Yep. In that and that will no doubt be an issue for us for the state. Yeah. And for us because you've got the D saying to the
RTMUA, you can't expand. And you've got the DCA saying to township, you must build all this stuff. Yeah. And uh well, I I don't want to solve their work. No, but we're the only municipal. It left
the RTN. It serves three bridges Fington ever and we are the only municipality that has capacity. So where are they going to get their capacity from? So on on a technical thing on your report,
sorry, I know we have a massive surplus, but I think it should be minus one because you on section three, you added in the satisfactory for two instead of one because you need to take one of I know it's just it'll have to be corrected for the
final plan anyway. So I appreciate that. Um, so we have 63. So we're using and the things that you don't see on this are some of our redevelopment projects that are in flux like Cardinal and Captiva. So to the extent that they come to fruition if they include affordable housing, we'll
take credit for them later. But it's great that those projects are in flux and we don't need them at this time. We need this obligation. Maybe we have an issue in 10 years from now for the fifth round, but we can cross their but they're still obligated to have them if they're going to do Yeah. The
redevelopment plans require an affordable housing. We have an ordinance on the year that requires 20%. Yeah. And that's why we're in such good shor this goes from us. This needs to go officially from us or does this go from
council this? So um uh I want to review one one last aspect of your plan first and then we'll get into procedural. So the final component of the obligation is your rehabilitation number. It's 74 and the this is the one thing for decision
making. The uh rules require that your rehabilitation program your solving of that obligation in include sale and rented units but there's no set percentage. It's just you simply have to have a program that is open to rental
units. The way that it was addressed in the third round was we participate in county programs. They have a homeowner improvement program or if you're a low and moderate income household, you can apply to them for let's say a new a new roof on your home. Um county programs across the
state do not uh are do not work with rental units. It's just simply an aspect of the funding that they're using. And so what Plington did, like a lot of other towns, we set up a municipal rental program so that if you were a landlord and you needed to be room for
your your tenants that were low and moderate, you could apply through the county or excuse me for the municipal program and receive a grant or or a loan for that. And so that option remains for the burough. We can create that program. We can fund that program, etc. What we
could do in the alternative is we could take some of your surplus rental units and put that towards your rehabilitation obligation because the rules permit you to use typical or new affordable housing units to meet your rehabilitation obligation if towns are so inclined.
Most towns don't, but because it's it's you just simply participate in a program most of the time. But for the rental component, that's something that some towns do because creating the municipal rental program can be can be expensive. It can be a headache for towns. Um, and
so given the surplus the town has, I think that this is a very much legitimate option and it it's think it is the path of least resistance and I so I guess I'm ultimately I am recommending that path. One of the other reasons why
I'm recommending it is the rates of participation by landlords in a rehabilitation program are extraordinarily low because it comes with a deed restriction. You know, so they take the money for say the new roof and then they're obligated to keep their rents low for the next 10 years, minimum
of 10 years. And so uh and then I think that's furthermore in a town like Flemington. Now you guys have a very high rental percentage but most of your rental units are in very few uh a huge number of very large projects or significantly sized projects. landlords
in let's say the garden apartment complex is taking advantage of a rehabilitation program are I'm sure it's happened somewhere but I can't tell you a single town where a landlord has taken advantage of that because because they don't want to do the deconstruction for 10 years for the
reasons for all the reasons that we can understand it's less revenue um and so I think that the municipal program it could be put in place but the likelihood of getting any substantial number of rental units to participate is very low given that we have this surplus, it
seems to me it's an easy opportunity to eliminate the need to create that program and to fund that program. So that's that is my recommendation, but that is I mean I'm having to make any other changes in here, but in terms of the decision that I need from the burrow, that's that's really it. How
would you like to address your rehabilitation program? Do you want to couple county participation with rental units that are already in the bank, so to speak, or do you want to create a municipal rental program in order to supplement that? We have 59 available.
How many available? 63. Okay. That's that's about the Easter house, too. Exactly. Yeah. Exactly. Which I think has five or seven. So we might be closer to uh 70 70 units of surplus. And
how many do we need for the rehabilitation? It's 74 total, but you don't need to fully satisfy that because participation in the county program will satisfy. So how far are we short on? So there's no I can't tell you that I need
25% of your rehab obligation to be met with rental. It's typically it typically it's done as part of a settlement agreement which is not the context that we have here. But when that was the case it was the number of rental units a town might put towards its rehabilitation
program would either be 25% because that 25% relates to the fourth round or the third round, second round, etc. and it was just applied um sort of unprinciply but it was a number that towns could grasp to in the rules or it might have
been based upon their rental component in their community. So if you had uh you know 15% rental units in your community maybe you put 15% of rental units towards your rehabilitation obligation. So you're suggesting 19 rest would be
satisfied by Yeah. So I'm saying we have I think 66ish% rental housing in the town. It doesn't make sense to me that we would put 66% of your rehabilitation obligation as rental units for new construction. I think it makes sense that we rely upon the 25% rental
obligation because I can point to the nexus in the rules and I think it's passable. I think there's no set percentage and so the municipality should have some flexibility on that and you know I don't mean to be flippant
about this but at the end of the day if the port gets freeze the response is fine we'll create a municipal program or I'll pull more more surplus units and we'll be done but there's no there's no opportunity here that I see for a
developer to leverage the burrow over any of these decisions whether it has to do with the what you're trying to avoid. Yeah, exactly. Whether it's about the cut glass site or the rehabilitation obligation, the goal here is make sure that the burrow has control over its
zoning and control over how it's going to meet its affordable housing obligation. And I think that there's nothing in here that endangers that. Just to be clear, we're currently at just under 64% 64%. Okay. renting rental rent renting versus
uh single family homes and after the Spice Factory and the Union Hotel Project are open balanced by 117 units at Liberty Village, we will topping 70% rental. And to put that in perspective,
Jersey City is at 61%. It's really out of balance. And our tax assessor said we should be around 25% max down. It's kind of like this in a rural community. 25 not more than 30% and we are currently at over 63% heading
towards 70. Maybe should want to join with us and then I can share in the rental question. So, so are there any questions about the the outline? I want to talk about procedure dates and things like that, but are
there any questions about that? Is that so? Yes. Yeah. So, what I need is um for the planning board to adopt housing plan, which I'm going to write for you guys very soon. Um, and just so
I understand, we still need that even though we already have all of our Okay, that's where I was confused. So, our plan as it currently exists has already provided for and we've approved more than we need, but we still need to go through that whole plan. That's part of
the master plan. Yes. Is that the time to address things like what was put in in 2022 to tear down all the twostory buildings on Main Street, put in four-story rental apartments? No. Um, we could do that as a subsequent land use element amendment. This is just a
housing land amendment. Um, yeah. One, two. We need to do a one for this reason. And we have a deadline, too. So, we really kind of want to zone focus on what we're back. What's the deadline? Yeah. So, June 30th. And so, I need to be adopted. Yeah. Adoption and submitted by June 30th. But essentially, when do
you think, Beth? I know you're really busy. Yeah. When do you think you're gonna very easy towns, very easy plan? They only have to do so. So, yeah, it does. We only have that one meeting in June. We need a public hearing and we
need at least 10 days notice, which means we need 15 days notice for the newspapities and all that stuff. So, your meeting is on. We can't get an extension on this. Don't get me started. A lot of towns tried and failed and the
court just doesn't see the need for it apparently. Oh, is it coming from the court? Okay. 24th comments on it. Yes. For what? Third and 24th. I do have both on my calendar. Whether we're canceling the third or
we're concerned about the third out of the quorum with it being 4th of July. That's okay. I think the resolution because we did it as a resolution. I'll have it on Well, I have it the they go in my calendar based on the resolution. Right. So, okay. So,
I've got 24 and 24. So, so this is just so the public hearing can the public hearing be held the same night as the adoption because it's just resolution. So, it's on the 24th. Yeah. which gives you plenty of time to do the advertising and
or whoever. Okay, I vote for that. Yeah, because that sounds good. So, yeah. So, we're going to do the opening hearing on the 24th. Planning board, you guys will presumably adopt it. Um will work to have the resolution done that night.
Now, the only thing Let's Let's think back a little bit though. Mhm. So this was my question to you because the people are looking at it differently. The committee, the governing body then has to review draft ordinances and furtherance of the land use element. Are
we going to have any? And if we are then we may have to do June 3rd because the committee the mayor and council won't have a meeting after the 24th. So I don't So no, I don't have any draft ordinances because we're not creating zoning. Okay. the only draft ordinance I I to be honest I haven't decided if I'm
going to but one I don't think I need council approval of a draft ordinance not that there's not value to having people look at it and make sure they're this is where there's a lot of discussion because some some are saying some affordable housing attorneys which I am you know I know about it but it's
not my lead area saying the council must review any draft ordinances not necessarily introduce but review Some are saying they actually have to introduce. Some are saying we don't have to do anything. So that's where I just want to get a little clarity in case we
need to bump that up to June 3rd. So the ch just the the background is we have a new fair housing act that was put into law in March of last year and it is very poorly written quite honestly. It is full of uh things that are inconsistent
with the municipal land use law and with practice um and just language that is unclear. And then to add to that, the court issued a directive which was intended to provide procedures for how this process would work. And the
directive was inconsistent with the Fair Housing Act. And uh I'll just leave it at that inconsistent with the Fair Housing Act. And so that's part of where this confusion is coming from. Y um I mean my recommendation has been if there are ordinances, which doesn't seem like we have here, it's just introduce it.
But then that way you're covering all your bases and as long as you do that before the 30th it has to be a special meeting and so be it. Have to be adopted. Yeah. And so but I think that fortunately for you guys this is less of
an issue because I'm not proposing any new zoning. The only ordinance I will be updating for you is your affordable housing ordinance that regulates how affordable units are administered. However, I can't do that either because
we have um the uniform housing affordability control rules which is like the book of what rules municipalities follow for administering their units that was amended in December last year. Um however, they are going to
be proposing new rules uh anytime now uh at some point and then they'll go through the typical rule making process. And so I don't know what to write. It just become very simple. I don't know what to write. Um it's just absurd. And then on
top of that, just to to add to the chaos, we also have a set of draft rules that were issued by DCA that regulates other aspects of the affordable housing like the trust fund and some other aspects. Uh those are drafted and those will not be adopted. So
there's that. Um we should be okay. We we barely meet the obligation. Well, and that's like thank God you guys are in such a great position. This is much more, you know, these uh uncertainties are much more problematic for a lot of other towns, but for you guys, you know, you're in pretty good shape. So, um you don't have
a meeting the 30th, right? No, I'm not saying you don't have Do you have a meeting on the 23rd? Yes. Okay. Um and the second presumably. Yes. The whatever the second Monday. Yes. So, I can do the uh we can do the hearing on the 3 and
then that would give the governing body the opportunity to review the plan. Um I don't I don't Another aspect. Sorry. I'm sorry. No, it's mortal. That's what I'm saying.
It's it's a nightmare. So, we're in such a rush like everything has to be done. I don't understand why. It's almost like we should have found an extension. Yeah. Um but I'm not sour about it. No. Um it just had no life in the past six months. In addition, so you know this talks is
talked about as we need to submit our plan by June 30th. And that is true, but the the more nuanced requirement is that we adopt the plan by June 30th and we submit it to the program the court within 48 hours of adoption. So as we
think about what is possible for council participation, it has to be either before within 48 hours or after the fact as a supplemental sub. Yes. After the fact of your your meeting. So we could
do the meeting on the 3, but I need it submitted by the Fed. Alternatively, we could do the meeting on the Oh, I see. let them review it and then do the full adoption of our planning board resolution. So it's not 48 hours from
the 30th. No, based on our action. It's based on Yeah. Like they've already received I there's a town that submitted that adopted a plan they've already submitted. Okay. But that's like we do a public hearing and then we do the resolution at the next meeting anyway. Wouldn't that match with that
plan? Yeah. No, it's the the night of action. The action. Yeah. Yeah. And that I mean, listen, it's very simple because this isn't a this isn't a So, tonight we're going to go through the ordinance. I've already prepared that resolution and we'll amend it to add whatever recommendations for consistency you guys
may have or none or whatever the case may be. So, I mean, it's doable. We can do that. It's not like we have a public hearing on an application. It's a completely different. So, so why can't you, Beth, get us get on the schedule for the 23rd of June and just present it to the
council? Send it to them ahead of time. So they can do whatever they're going to do with it. 24th. I'm fine with that. Right. Um yeah, I think that works. You know, we give you guys the opportunity to review things in advance. If you're going to be reviewing
in advance, I might stick a couple resolutions before you um which are I don't feel that strongly about, but if I have a council opportunity, I don't see not to. I think the reality is what's going to happen in a lot of towns is municipalities planners are rushing
to get the plans done so that we can get the bare minimum submitted to the court and there's going to be follow-up work that occurs over the next couple months for like the odds and ends that just couldn't get gathered or resolutions that couldn't get done and adopted in advance and there'll be supplemental
submissions. Um and so it but if we can avoid that by um by me appearing at your name on the uh 23rd because then we've got all our covered. You got the draft ordinance reviewed. You've got the public hearing. You got everything done
48 hours. We'd have to have the resolution ready to go that night. Well, again, that's fine. And point of order just for us. I I hope this doesn't happen. I will not be in the country. So Jeff will be able to sign it because you just have to put Jeffwood. Yeah. Good.
Good. Good. All right. So 24th be the public hearing. Yep. So, I'll do council on the 23rd. We'll talk about housing and what's in the plan. I'll be at the be here the following night. We'll do the public hearing on it. I'll ask you guys to adopt it. If you're comfortable with
it, we will. And then it'll get submitted to the program within 48 hours. We'll work on the notice and not let anybody cancel their vacations, but let's just make sure that half of the board aren't missing on that date. At least we have at least a
vacation. me I would be here but um everybody else is yeah let me be really clear I need folks to at least call in and I need a quorum that night this is not if there's going to be an issue with that coming ahead we want to keep track
on that all right anybody any other questions for Beth on that on the process or anything. I think we've gone through all but excellent is it to add in I was going to ask and
don't worry ask um to talk about the art and I believe you've been leazing with that. So would it be appropriate to add it in there for her to talk about that since we're running it? Yeah. All right. Well, I'm just like let's throw it in there.
Was that all right? do whatever you want. No, I just jump in. Yes, Anna, you have you have to let everybody know what Yeah, I know. It's like my first time. I'm so sorry, everybody. I don't know. I
did write things down kind of my child. Yes. And then my child on me. Um so, uh the art committee met on the 7th of last week on Wednesday, I believe that was. And essentially, uh, Beth was kind enough to come in and present to
us, um, the artwork for the courthouse square, uh, which is essentially, uh, a mosaic on the ground that's pretty much adjacent from where the courthouse is or like Barkley's, that area. Um, and yeah,
so I did email you just an image of a precursor to necessarily because we are still waiting for a couple adjustments back from uh Keith or um but essentially we approved of it. Um, so it's really just a simple image
of the courthouse with uh Flemington, New Jersey um and a circle boundary or border. Um, yeah, and it's just pretty simple, I would say, but simple but classic. Um, that's really what we agreed on and thought would be best for
that. But that is what we approved of and we just wanted to present it to you guys as a courtesy to give you a heads up on just what we're doing. When the final rendering comes out, you can share that. We'll share that with you as well. Yeah. So, I did send it to you if you wanted to share that or not.
No, no, it's not. So, it's going to be very similar to that, but again, once we get to final, we can definitely share that with you guys just to show you what we agreed upon. And this is going Oh, yeah. Like say the open space court comes off main street.
Yes. What's What did you do? What's the approximate kind of size of this? You said it's a mosaic. Yes. 8t wide. Eight feet diameter. Yes. Okay. So, yeah. I mean, again, trying to keep it simple. We discussed a couple other images, but once we thought about how
big it would be, we didn't want it to be too busy. Um, so yeah, just keeping it simple and classic. And then, yeah, I don't know. The other things we discussed was a a new member who we're still waiting to get in contact with. Uh, there are some more potential projects to maybe be coming
in, but we just haven't gotten applications for them yet. So, we're just hearay. Um, and then we did have one project that fell through, but we were uh of the benefit to hear that they really enjoy our application process. So that was nice.
So Robin never responded anybody. Not I don't think so. No. Yeah. Not yet. I know that Tony was trying to reach out to her further. Um, but we have not heard when she was not unfortunately. She was pretty excited. Well, she welcomed you, right?
So that was it. That was our first kind of or not our first but our second we had. Yeah. It was Yeah. Because once since it's been created this it's it's an own and so we haven't heard. Yeah. And we're really more into like one application's come in. Yeah.
We're still waiting for some more to come in hopefully. Okay. Good. Good. We see some more art in town. We have a lot of art and artists in town. So good to see that. Thank you. Is that good? Okay. Um I will as we're on professional
report um do you have anything other than what we Yeah, just to follow up on Liberty bill and state about three weeks ago they submitted their first set of files revisions to comply with our comments and releases of the approval. We're like
95% through that review. They did contact us. they they need to make some further modifications to the plan based on groundwater conditions that they're finding based on the storm water rule. So they're they're they're eliminating one basin. They're modifying the height
of one of the basins on Brown Street. That's requiring them to make some other modifications for the connection that they just saw drainage on Brown Street. And they had to make a modification to the last basin out on Route 12 on the east side of um whatever they call that street that comes out. I forget the name
of the street. So, we had a meeting, they had a meeting this morning just for them to explain to us what the changes are. The result of that, u rather than us issue our report based on the plans we had, they're going to make the modifications
to the plans they have, submit it back, and we'll incorporate any further comments we have into one setup. They felt going back and forth, they felt that was the most efficient way uh to do it. Now, those plans are also out to your office and to Jay. I don't know that he would have much well I don't even sure what comments you would have
but uh so that's that's where they are in in the process. Did they say when new plans might be coming? No. Well, assume they had they have copies of what they were going to change. Okay. All right. Yeah. Um and there's a few other glitches they have
to deal with uh in that, but they're that's basically where they are in the process. I just see that there's conversation happening. Um, Mr. Chapman's not here, so I presume he doesn't have a um report. So, thank you. We'll move on to new item seven,
which is approval of the minutes for basically the last two meetings. Um, we're going to have to catch up on these. Um, and actually the main thing I'm waiting for is because I pulled together minutes. You did two meetings. Yeah. But it was missing the uh Nova
that I thought conflict council said he wanted to write but he send me check. He did his email. Yeah, I did see his email. Um we got the resolution which we're moving on to. But yeah, if he could provide that or if he
wants me to just do what I did with the rest of it. I basically sat thing and typed it in while I was doing some other things. Um, so cross fingers, we'll have three sets of minutes to look at because if they're okay with you, we're just going
to ask them. So that would be the 25th of March, the 8th of April, and then the tonight. So look forward to that. If you need to fall asleep to those, you can read. Um, so much fun. Um, okay. uh new item
which is another reason why I'm so glad that Sorry, you're gonna be busy. I'll present some chocolate around tomorrow through it. Um but as you see as we don't have the last two then you know got a bit um okay sorry item eight then let's move
on to this resolution 202508 Nova the memorial light of the decision taken March 25th um we that it distributed that right yeah I thought I wrote it down I I tried to I
think I believe that's correct that's the people voted on it and allowed to vote on the more on the resolution. We already incorporated um conflict council I said they didn't need to come to save us money. Um we already incorporated a comment that came in before the meeting
and that's the latest one incorporates that comment. Um, so I'm I'm not presuming there aren't any of comments because you're at liberty to make comments now and he will then adjust the resolution accordingly if we need to or we can so motion to
um to take that vote to memorialize it as it is at the moment. Anybody have anything they needed to raise on that resolution? And only people who voted in favor of the action taken can vote. But the favor of the action taken was the
denial. Correct. Is that correct? So now my list is incorrect then. Is it? Yeah. Oh, it's because it was a 4 to3 vote. Yeah. I I Sorry, you went there. I'm looking at you. I just wanted to make sure that since it's not here, there's only the people that And anyway, Mr. Dasha is not here anyway. Everyone's
going to have to remember which way they voted. Yeah. Who voted basically who voted the same way as me? Um you. Yeah. Melissa and No, I voted. voted no. Oh jeez. Yeah. Do you
remember what you voted? You voted yes. So you're not eligible. Sorry. Done. I voted no. You voted no. So you're in. I voted no. So that's there's only those three of us then because then that means Dennis and the motion was to deny. Correct. No, the
motion was to That's important. I just want to make sure. Yeah. So who So who can vote? Gifin, Swiggle, Echo, and that's it. Yeah. The people the people that voted because it was 43 in favor of the action tape.
It's very confusing. Whoever people voted to deny it. Correct. Yes. Correct. Because that's ultimately what happened. Well, the motion was to It's okay. But the action was to deny. So the people they voted against the motion, but the action that was taken
was the denial. So, the people that voted that way, there was only three of us eligible to vote there. Yeah, that's fine. Me, Elissa, we want that. And it doesn't matter.
But that's so eligible to vote in this case. Oh, which is good because all the people excellent. Um, so in that case, if none of us who are eligible to vote have any
comments on the resolution itself, um, motioned? Nobody yet. Melissa Swingle just motioned and seconded and I'm the only. So, as a vote yes, we just vote yes.
It's a vote. Yes. So, Miss Swingle. Yes. Mr. Min. Yes. This is what I'm drinking. Right. That's done. That's like It's like it's a technicality at this point, isn't it? Right. Let's move on to new
item nine which is a review of ordinance 2025 13 of council right which was can you introduce what it was please K for us so that I don't make a mess of it sure yeah it's very simple um it's basically just a change in the uh tree
replacement cost that would be provided to the burrow in the event that an applicant was not going to replant a tree but is going to give money to the burrow in order for that tree to be planted somewhere else. What happened to the distillery one? We
did that last. Oh, we did. Okay. Sorry. So, it went from You got So, this is 900 the tree. It's like an increased cost effective. Correct. And and it hasn't been increased since 2005. So, it's been 20
years over. So, yeah, it's pretty simple. Well, it's nothing more than opportunity to get a treat. So, no changes to the process. It's just basically the cost of the treat. Yeah, that's literally the only cross out and the only anything. So,
this is you know your role here is to determine whether it is not substantially inconsistent with the master plan. Um, so our um master plan doesn't address uh the painting for trees. So it's
certainly not inconsistent in any stretch. There is language in the master plan uh supporting trees in general and their importance around the burrow. So I think that this is not inconsistent with the master plan if at all.
Perfect. Anybody have any questions on that question opinion on that? I don't I'm happy with that. Can I get a motion to approve the resolution with no comments? Uh, no comments, no recommendations.
Yes. Okay. So, I need a motion in a second to adopt a resolution finding that ordinance 2025-13 is not substantially inconsistent with the Burough's master plan and there are no recommendations to
confirm. I got your back. Justin and Hannah and who? Hannah White. I'm gonna call you Mr. Justin. Makes it easier. Misman. Yes. Uh
Mar and she vote. Yes. Councilwoman Fisara. Yes. Mr. Campion. Yes. Gen. Yes. Miss Whitesman. Do I call her again? No. Okay. Miss Wangle. Yes. Mr. SH. Yes.
Mr. D. Mr. Echo. Yes. Mr. H. Mr. H. Okay. The resolution was that was emailed. Just make sure the file has Yeah, we have to find out what they are. I got to put that one in. And I also have to put this resolution in. So,
we'll find out what the last number is for our resolution for the one I added that to for NOVA. Did you add that for NOVA? It's 08. Okay. So, then this one we just did will be 09. It was application 01 and it was resolution 08. Okay. So, this making a
little Well, this one that we just adopted will be 09. Carla, I'll put in the votes and numbers. It's a lot because all the ones we did with the dates of the meetings, all
those things they all we did like five. Right. Right. Excellent. Let's move on to item 10 which is officially listed as completeness and then public JLunication 2025 three. So the completeness part to
the I'm going to let Mr. Clerk go through this and we'll run this completeness this completeness part should be relatively quick. We did, if you remember, already do a completeness hearing for the vast majority of I think you did a review identified a few items
as being incomplete, a few items as being temporary waiverss. The applicants made a resubmission the report I wrote as of May 7th again went through all the trial information the updated information we received basically as summarized on page two that the four the
five items that were either incomplete or temporary wa now been all have now all been addressed so you can my recommendation if you deem it completely right um can I get a motion and a second to do
such a So that's Swingle and Whitesmith to um deem this application complete application 20253 complete. Okay. Call the RO on that please. Miss Watson. Yes.
Sorrow. Yes. Mr. Campion. Yes. Yes. Uh Mr. Yes. Mr. Yes. Thank you. All right. So then um we open the public Yeah. open the public hearing for
Jal application 20253. Yep. I'm just going to say for the record that uh notice has been completed. Um and the board has jurisdiction to act on this matter. Thank you. Oh go to Thank you. My name
is um Robin Wright. I'm an attorney with Lanza and Lanza and I uh represent Jay Mestru Inc. the owner of 35 Main Street um uh block 17 lot 11. Um I have Joe Mestru with me. He's the owner of the
corporation and um we're here for a minor site plan approval. Um uh Mr. Mr basically wants to add a fourth apartment to this mixeduse property. Um he went to the zoning officer for a permit and was told he had
to get site plan approval um for change of use. Basically there's a conference room that he's changing into an apartment. This is in the DB zone. It's a permitted use. Um there's no variances needed. Um the um uh there's ample
parking. Um and so I'm going to uh without further ado, I'm going to uh ask that Mr. Mr be sworn in as a witness. testimony I'm about to give this board. Thank you. Thank you. And the only exhibits I would
have with the um uh the minor site plan and the architectural plan which were already submitted. Uh so I don't know if they need to be marked as exhibits or uh no mark as exhibit A1 the application and all supporting documentation and A2 will be the proof of publication and
proof of mail. Um yeah, Cara, um this is a minor site plan. Um uh your ordinance doesn't provide for uh it's minor site plan without variances. So pursuant to our discussion, we um Oh, I thought you had elected No, we we
didn't notice for this because um it's uh it's a minor site plan um approvable as of right without a variance uh requirement because we do have some pre-existing non-conforming conditions. Okay. um uh we we had discussed that at the last uh hearing and um because this
application doesn't exacerbate or worsen any of those nonconformities. It doesn't affect them. Um and I I cite a case I believe um it's it's not required to have variances. Um I I thought we had discussed just out
of a case. Um that's what I thought you were going to do, but if you decided otherwise then then that's fine. Okay. All right. Thank you. Um so um Mr. MrUru um you're the owner of 30 uh your company is the owner of 35 Main Street correct and you're the sole
owner company and could you describe the building a little bit at 35 Main Street? So it's basically um it's commercial space on the ground floor which was my printing company which prints out
for I guess about 28 years on Main Street. The second floor has two apartments um as well as this conference room. So if you can envision it was apartment number two, one and this conference room
on the second level and on the third level is one apartment. Okay, so I had three apartments and then this conference room. So the conference room is basically dead vacant space now. It's on the second floor.
um seems like a a great opportunity to turn it into a a nice rental unit and it's a permitted use there. So, um that's that was the impetus for putting an apartment there. It currently has in this conference room, it has a
kitchenet and a bathroom already. So, it was kind of the again the uh the catalyst for wanting to make this an apartment and to add revenue stream to the building and also give a quality uh rental unit for the downtown. And Mr.
Stroll, the the bottom space, the ground floor of the space is um formerly print and now it's vacant. Correct. Correct. And you're trying to find a tenant for this space, correct? Yes, actively it's listed with KA Banker. Um it's been
vacant since about last May. Um we've had a few inquiries, a couple close things. Um nothing yet, but we're looking for a good, you know, retail client andor permitted use on this on the main floor. And so your your intention is to lease it for permitted
use. Um but you're not going to lease it to an office space, correct? That's that's correct. and and ask and pursuant to the ordinance to the burough's ordinance, it wouldn't generate an off street parking requirement for a permitted use office space. Correct. That's correct. And you haven't added
any floor space to this developed it. And you've owned it since what day? I I owned it since 2003. Okay. And you were um you leased space in there before that, correct? Yeah, I I moved down to that space in 1996 and I was a renter
there for seven years and then bought the building from the that was current. And um you're not proposing any changes uh to the building the outside of the building, correct? Not at all. This is just interior
within the same walls. Um you have um um parking to the rear of the building, correct? Yes. And the parking is shown on the the site plan that we submitted. And
um there's about uh I think 27 parking well you have a shared parking agreement with um with the owner of Shakers Cafe. Correct. That's correct. Yes. Okay. And um that was submitted with our application documents. Correct. Yes.
Yes. And uh there's a total of 27 parking spaces, right, for both properties, correct? Yeah, it's a shared use. We can share the maintenance cost of the parking lot, whether it's salulting, snowplowing, um ceiling,
striping, what have you. And um the agreement provides that three uses, three of the spaces are exclusively for the use of lot 12, which is where the Shapers Cafe building is. Correct. Correct. And it also provides that six of the spaces are exclusively for the
use of 35 Main Street. Correct. That's correct. And the rest of the spaces are shared. Correct. Yes. For the agreement. Yeah. So um so except for those three spaces which are exclusively for takers, you your tenants have access to the
remain spaces, correct? Yes. Yes. Um, and I think we might we uh the residential site improvement standards would apply to this uh application and we determined that um there are two spaces required for
each department and none required for the bottom space as long as we comply with the ordinance and so there's more than eight spaces that are available. Absolutely. Absolutely. Um and there's no issues with the parking to the rear of the building. Correct. example.
Absolutely. Yes, sir. Um I want to address um and and you you retain Jeff Ler as your architect and he's going to prepare more detailed floor plans. Correct? Yeah. He's done an initial floor plan um which has been submitted and you know once this is approved then
the next step would be the construction piece of that. Okay. And and you're going to take all permits that are required or construction permit of course. Um referring to Mr. Clerico's letter. Uh Mr. Clico preped a letter I think on May 7th. Um item number five,
he he said that um additional detail uh relating to the striping and the AVA space to the rear of the building should be provided. Do you have any problems with providing additional detail uh that Mr. Clark was seeking? No, not at all. U we're going to reseal and uh shrink the
parking lot and whoever we contract with at that time I would get it. a drawing to for you to review. That's needed. And um could you could you also discuss how uh how trash is handled on the site?
Yes. So, there's two um there's two pads in the parking lot for the um trash and recycling pickup. They're directly across from each other. One set is for the Shaker property. One is for uh the 35 Main
Street property, which is mine. They are they're located where they are to best utilize the parking lot so that because they don't take up as much space as a parking space, it allows for
incoming traffic to pass through the parking lot without being encroached by a parking spot. So they are strategically placed where they are for that reason. Um so that's you know why why they are placed where they are. Uh they're also
They're easily accessible for the tenants, both the commercial and the residential tenants. Um, it's very important for the garbage and recycling company to be able to pull in there and get to them easily. So, that's another reason they're there.
Um, the dumpsters are locked and secured. Um, as far as that goes and that's pretty much what I can say about the garbage. And it's on lot 12, correct? But uh
yeah, both sets aren't on lot 12, but it is a shared use lot. So, yes. And uh you said you first started leasing property around 1996 or 196 1996. That was the Print uh Yeah, Print
moved in there 1996. Okay. And um th those dumpsters have been there ever since then. Okay. And prior to that, probably. Okay. Okay. So, it's been there for about 30 years at least. Almost 30 years. Yes. Just under with with no issues. Correct.
Um um I have uh no further questions for the witness. Okay. Yeah, we usually go to our professionals first. So, um and um um Bob, would you have any questions for this? No, they they will address
basically the the only comments I had. They are going to restripe. Actually, it looks from the plan. They're actually moving the striping somewhat from what it was least represented. The striping is out there is pretty much faded in to start with. So, the suggestion of resealing would just be a practical matter. And as the applicant indicated,
they're going to do that and then uh restripe um restype spaces. Um the issue of the dumpsters, I just and they just confirmed that the the dumpsters are on the dumpster pads and the dumpsters are on the joint property. Um but there's apparently an arrangement a lot of that
occur occur. So um and it's clearly uh inner um there's a clearly currently documented uh inner access and parking arrangements they have between the two properties. So the back of this property has the I believe it's listed anyways
it's a burrow alley that goes out to uh up street um and um and it connects with the joint county parking lot. So there's a lot of interconnection between the parking lots behind those buildings. I don't have any
qu further questions. I have no questions. I I just had one question about the trash and they answered that during testimony. Excellent. Just two. Um I didn't see a copy of the parking agreement. Oh yeah, I do have a copy of that. And is there a specific arrangement for the dumpsters
and the trash pickup and all that stuff? or something in writing or that's just um No, I don't believe that's in with that agreement. It's just kind of like I don't know how else you would say. It just adopted where they were at. It's never been an issue and it's worked
great. And you share the cost of pickup. They pay for their shaker pays for their they use for public services. Okay. And I have recycling and garbage on my pad and mine is LMR pickup. So, two different companies. No. Uh yeah, the
the agreement doesn't address. It's just an understanding. Yeah, I don't have one. I mean, if you can ultimately tell me you want to, but I just want to see look at the termination. We can make that. Thank you so much. Yeah, we'll mark this um I guess it was one of the submitted items. I just Yeah, we submitted it with the um
was it okay with the title documents? It was a packet of easements and Yeah, that's probably Yeah, those are the only questions I have. the board can go ahead. All right. So, anybody on the board with any questions? I'll go from I'll start with
Mr. Jason. Mr. Have any questions? Uh, yeah, just a couple comments. Um, so the existing uh floor plan has a break room, correct? Yeah. um that's getting moved to the adjacent wall creating a kitchen there. Is that going to be electric or gas?
So, where the where the kitchen's going to go where it's proposed? Um that hasn't been decided yet. Okay. Because I haven't gotten that far with Mr. Gleer. Okay. Um is there a preference there? I'm thinking electric.
Electric would be great. I'm thinking electric as well for the um the HVAC as well. Y in my mind. Fantastic. So that's fine by me. Um the bathroom up there consists of a powder room right now. It's being expanded into a full bath.
Correct. With a shower. Yes. How is that stairway being uh reloc? I see the entrance to the storage room is being closed off. the shower spitting at the end there. Toilet's moving over to the
side and the sink is being put there and that's going to be all um ADA compliant. Um again, I haven't gone that far with Jeff. Um okay, there's not stairwell. Yeah, there's a stairwell
there. No way. There's elevator back. That's right. Those are my only uh those are my only two. Okay. Thank you uh for looking around at the
outside of the building from the second floor where I fell off and they got on fire. Seems silly and people get down. I was trying to see. So there's there's plenty of windows in this conference room. There's probably I don't know eight across that.
And then outside of those windows is a flat roof that's probably maybe from here to there. Why wide and then there's a stairwell that can get they can access so everybody on the second floor can get out. Yes, absolutely. Okay. That was a concern.
My other question is you said that the garbage is locked in your tenants and have keys for it. Yes. No, it's um I'm sorry. It's um combination. They have Yes. Okay. No, it's locked so that no one Oh, no. I get it.
Yeah, I was just more concerned about like fire CP a little bit. But yeah, is there no fire report debt or that? Well, they have to they have to comply with all construction and zoning codes anyways and codes. So, that that law gets swept up by that. our construction
office will will not issue a certificate of occupancy without right that's not our job to pick no right I just like when do we ever see a fire often times mainly when when access for a fire truck or we already have that
and if there is any change that needs to happen to the building in order for it to comply we may see them again but hopefully right okay no otherwise that's covered but she among us if we don't ask questions that nothing wrong with need
to make anybody feel they couldn't. I'm just saying it does get covered. They have to comply. It's part of our resolution. We have that on the resolution comply with the old state and local. Hey,
good. Awesome. Nice to hear. Let's go online. Mr. Show, I have no questions. Thank you. Great. And then Mr. can be last but not least. No, pretty straightforward here.
Okay, great. And D was online because I'm looking at screen. Sorry. No, I don't have any questions. Okay, great. And and I don't have any questions, you know. No question. Can I just make a comment about fire in that building? Sure. Um comments on this place where
it's a historyless where the Shaker Cafe is there was an alley and one car was wide and on the other side of that alley was Blair's apartment building and in 1968 that burn that
wooden building three stories high burned to the ground and text building fire company just hosed it down but that all blocked and it it had no damage to it. So, I'm
not worried personally. Oh, it was a historic fire. Mrs. Blair died in that fire. I' I've heard a little about that, but I didn't know that detail. All tens came out safely. Wow. There we go. Yay. That's a good thing.
Glad to hear that. Um, all right. So, is that all of your witnesses? Yeah, just Mr. Mr. It's just adding an apartment building uh an apartment to an existing multi-use uh you know building with a residential on top commercial on the
bottom. It serves the the interest of Mr. Mr obviously but also of the burrow which I think wants residences to walk you know people to walk around and you know patronize the businesses on main streets. Um, so I would ask for approval
of the site plan. Just before you do your final final word, I'll say, is anybody in the public have any questions for this witness and his application? I didn't say that. I don't see anybody with a raised hand online. And I don't see anybody in the public gallery.
Questions, comments, anything. Any question? Yeah, we might as well do questions and comments for everybody at this point. This is such a small simple one. Anything? You can do anything at this point now before we close out the final statement.
Anybody? None. We will move the final statement. I almost made it. I just I approachation. Okay. So then we need a motion to close the public hearing. A
second. There's no echo. Nicole closing the public. Yes. Mr. Yes. Mayor Car. Yes. Mr. Campion. Yes.
Yes. Miss. Yes. Miss Swingle. Yes. Mr. Yes. Mr. Justin. Yes. Mr. Sorry. Um, all right. So, now it's our official board discussion time. So, I'm going to
ask if there's any discussion needs to be had for what um what we need to write our motion for this. I'm sensing there may not be much discussion needed. So, if it helps, I can say the applicant is applying for
minor site plan approval to do what they described to the board. Um, I would recommend there's been testimony that there's been absolutely and not going to be any external changes to the building or the property. Um, but there are some pre-existing nonconformities. So, I think we should wrap that in to this um
and and grant the variances from those pre-existing nonconformities. Specifically, that's lot width. Minimum lot width is 45 feet. They're at 22.17. Uh minimum front yard setback, they're at 25 ft. Uh they're 25 ft
required. They're at 2.1 2.41. Um and maximum impervious surface is 75%. They're currently at 99.15. Um conditions that the board may want to consider are standard conditions that they're bound by all testimony and
documents submitted. Um they testify that they have a dumpster arrangement with the adjacent property owner and that it works fine. Um compliance with any additional comments in the board reports, compliance with all state and local permitting and the approval
requirements. Uh keep the escrow um and any fees current. And the only thing that I would suggest um I saw that in the parking agreement it says that it is recorded. So anybody that will uh own these properties going forward, it will
come up in title. It is applicable to successors and assigns going forward. But there is a provision where it can be amended based on agreement between the parties. So I would just say that um if that parking agreement is ever amended um and provides for less than the
parking spaces that you're currently providing for, then you have to let the board know that. Um and then they may ask you to just come back in and testify as to the parking arrangements. And it probably doesn't matter on the front yard setback, but there was a alter provision in the ordinance that says 25
or match the adjoining and they match the join. Again, we're not going into the weeds on variances, but they may not need that one. You could just add wooden in that they match the That's why I didn't do it because I
wasn't sure. But it's okay. Yeah, just to cover that those two bases that way. And I um I just uh the changes are insubstantial from a zoning perspective where non-conforming structures expanded in the addition. we're not even expanding a non-conforming structure,
but if we're not adding to the pre-existing conformity um that you know the uh according to Sherman versus Burrow Harvey Cedar zoning board of adjustment uh you know there's there's no need for um a variance where we're simply doing something that is permitted
in the I'm actually doing it for him. So he's got in writing that these were granted. So if you go to sell and someone's wondering and at least it's it's there. So, I totally agree with you, but since it's before us, you might as well put it on there. It'll help you. I appreciate you. Yeah, I appreciate
that, too. Thank you. I'll get it bel then, can I get a motion? Do that second yes vote is to um deem it approved. Sorry, Miss Winkle. Yes. Miss Westman,
yes. Mayor Carol, yes. Counciloman Core, yes. Mr. Campion, yes. Gen. Yes. Mr. Yes. Mr. Trust. Thank you.
Um, Mr. Eckle. Yes. Stop there. Thank you. Congratulations. Thank you. Thank you everyone. Joe, I've known you for 30 years. I always said it was natural. Is it not natural? It's natural. And I'm sorry. I said it wrong. It's It's been mashful forever as far as
concerned, but there was there was an O at some point and it was mashful. That comes from It's commonly spelled the wrong way. Silent, but we didn't get it right.
It's fine. It's gone. It was It was It was pretty beat up. Very beat up. Sorry. Thank you very much. Appreciate it. Thank you. Thank you. All right, moving on. 11 is chair it. Um, yes. And I'm a
little calmer this week, as you see. Um, I put newsletter in here because I have a deadline. What's my deadline? 23rd. It's coming up. 23rd. You can put a piece in the magazine that came out. And I I didn't achieve the deadline last
time because you see how much gray it Yeah. Um but I'm going to try and put something in if anybody has any urgent ideas of what we want to put in. Otherwise, I'll just write a piece and say how wonderful we all are and what wonderful work we're all doing and what we're planning. I'll work something out.
If anybody has any ideas, send them to me. Fair enough. If I write anything technical, I'm going to send it to you ladies to make sure I don't say anything correct because I don't ever want to say anything correct. Apologies my cousin's J. I have two
cousins and one's Jason. So the J just came off my house. What I did I want to add into chair items. Oh, I will confirm committees will restart as per the mayor's request. Thank you to our budget being passed. We will do the rules and
regulations one you recommended and um also um the signage review committee. I did ask in the interim on the QT um planner McManus to she wrote a report. So now what what I will do this
week is I will send that out to that committee for them to review her report. She's wrote a very encompassing report about what the issues may be and what we can consider and that will be our kit point for that and we'll get that moving. Just throwing that out there. Yeah.
Um so then last on my list Mr. Schlanger went to his official training and passed officially trained up to be on planet and I because for some of us it's been quite a while since we did training
and and some of us didn't get to do in person training. I asked question. That was a bad my I said she didn't I said didn't recognize it but she thought he was Jason. I can't believe you got to do it in
person. It was great. I mean doing it in person I really I did it was very long but I did it first in and out so the first time I did it it was in person and it was really worthwhile in the second time very worthwhile for someone who doesn't have the experience on planning
board and they're all new planning board members there I mean it was really bene 7:30 to 3:30 or whatever it was but um it was fantastic I mean, we got, you know, pretty much got an overall
view of what the planning board didn't. I'm just so glad they're back in person, you know, differentiate between the planning board and the zoning board, right? Teaching. Yeah, we did it at um Ren Valley. It was part of Somerset
County's um symposium, land use symposium. They made this as part of it. And uh I mean the location was great. It was very easy, great, really nice. I'm just glad it's back in person because that comfortable, a good format. It was a very good range of speakers and the
format went, you know, good. Very consistent. So, very good feedback. Yeah. Wonderful. I really enjoyed it. Learned a lot. And if you have any suggestions for how to do things better, please. Oh my
god. Really call me. Um, please let us know. I'm glad you I am glad you got to I'm so happy. It's better because you interact with other people. You get a feel for a little more low is going to be doing all the rules. Correct. You can confirm.
That was really really great. I'm going to be so glad. Thank you for letting us know about that. Anybody has any questions about how to run book contact. That's gonna be like forever. The bad thing is
so person my grandma like there's only three. I have two cousins. That's it. That was it. That was my life. That was three grandchildren. But I spent my life being called Jason because that was because there was Jason, Ian, and Karen. And I was grandma not Jason. So I guess
I'm so sorry. I've passed that on now. Exactly. Is that the only one we're required to take? Yeah, that's it. continuing education. You were trained for life and also there were there were copies um Carlo left us these are copies of the
planner came in those are great I would definitely take here's what you can look here's what I want you to project to to like going to work on is we're going to try and beat this Mr. Julius Lober Jr. has become the longest serving planning
board member in New Jersey he's been serving for 63 years for the Franklin Lakes, New Jersey. He's been chairman for 18 years, vice chairman for 27 years, and a member for the mango. Oh, he's I work for Franklin Lakes, one
of my clients. Oh, so you know. Yeah. So, he'll sit on the board. He'll be like, "Oh, I remember when we approved that and now it's coming back in for redevelopment, right, 50 years later." Wow. And like remember before they approved the other one before he uses
your do you remember this growing up? Yes I do. I was like okay to write down everything he knows and that's the that's pre-existing you know whatever he says is the Jules doesn't know it. You're in trouble. Nobody can get anything past. Oh my gosh. That's
hysterical. Well, just beat the master. So, that's just our goal. That's our goal. Less than one year in 62 to go. There we go. There we go. My house anyway. Does anybody have anything else they want to raise?
All right. So, let's move on to new item 12, which is the bills. Woohoo. We have got organized enough to do the bills. These are the bills I believe from everything from when we last did
builds today. So, we've got on. So, can I have a motion? Those were in I think I sent them yesterday. Um, so we had a day with them, but they're also here if anybody wants to flick through. Um, so can I get a motion to audit the bills,
please? Second. Well, we got to call on that one. Yeah, that's money. It's not, but Well, goal coal on that one, please. I didn't know what you were saying. I
know what it was in the bill. I'm missing. See, I'm gonna say Shelinger. Sorry. Yes. Almost there. Mayor Carol. Yes. Councilwoman Fisara. Yes. Mr. Campion. Yes. Biff. Yes,
Mr. Show. Yes. All right. Thank you. Item 13. We need No, we do not need. So, all right. Can I get a motion to adjourn? Excellent. All in favor?
Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you very much. My husband wants