everything that All right. Good morning, everyone. We're going to call the meeting to order. Today is Monday, May 5th, 2025. It is 9:00 a.m. All council members are present. Town manager, town attorney, town clerk, if you'll please rise for the invocation followed by the pledge of allegiance.
We thank you for being with us here today. As we begin this meeting, let us take a moment to express our gratitude for the opportunity to serve this community. We are thankful for the people of Fort Myers Beach, its residents, its visitors, and all who contribute to make our island special.
May we approach today's discussions with respect, understanding, and a shared commitment to making decisions that benefit everyone. Let us be grateful for the chance to work together for a better future for our town. Amen. Amence to the flag of the United States
of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Next is the approval of the final agenda. We have a couple of changes. Um, town attorney has informed me
that the item D under public hearing, the lean reduction, has been resolved. So, we will be we'll be pulling that. And there has been a request to move item E, the request for rehearing and reconsideration of denial of appeal
213191 for Wijon Terrace. Moving that up to item A uh for the sake of time. If there's no objections to that, I have no issues with it. Anyone consent? Okay. Is there any other changes anyone
would like to make to the agenda? See none. Is there a motion to approve the final agenda as amended? So move. Second. Motion by councelor King. Seconded by councelor Saffer. Any further discussion? All those in favor signify by saying I. I. Opposed. That
motion carries unanimously. Next is public comment. Madam cler. I have one excuse me. I have one signed up. Uh, Chris Mero. Morning, Chris. Good morning. My name is Chris Mastero. Um, I'm a full-time resident, 923 Third
Street, business owner as well. Um, today I'm torn. I'm torn because as a member of the business community, I understand this. I understand our need for commercial development and tourism to return to our island. I understand we
re we need to revitalize parts of our town. As a resident, I'm concerned. I'm concerned about all these large-scale projects. I'm concerned about our infrastructure. I'm concerned about traffic. I'm concerned about quality of
life with big commercial intrusion. We're at a time where our island is extremely divided. Council, it's your job to bring us back together. Your job is not a rubber stamp of approval. Your job is to protect our greatest asset, which is the sun in the
sand. I think most residents understand that things are different and buildings will change, but people are upset there has not been a fight for a middle ground, no compromise. Residents feel like they have not been heard. It's been
just a big yes to move development forward. Recent surveys by town staff overwhelmingly show that our appetite hasn't changed. Residents don't really want to see mid-rise and high-rise buildings on the island. I hope you all begin to listen. At the end of the day,
we all want the same thing. Remember what brought you here. What made you say, "That island is where I want to live. Let's rebuild that. We all want our town rebuilt, but what's going to keep us unique? What's going to keep us a fun,
funky beach town? How are we going to keep that small town feel we all desire? You all have a hard job, but there's a middle ground somewhere and I think we could get there. Thank you, Chris. That's all I have signed up. Is there anyone else that' like to speak in public comment?
Leah, come on up. Jesus Christ. Good morning, Leah Greg, Bonita Street. Um, I want to thank Nancy, our town attorney, for providing excellent training last month on the code of ethics, the sunshine law, voting
conflicts, public records law to committee members and anyone who really wants to watch it. I thought it was superb. I learned a great deal. So, thank you, Nancy. And Nancy made it very very clear that when something is being voted on, you must be free of potential bias or prejudice. You have to attend
the meeting with an open mind. You have to listen to the testimony that's given and the documents that are presented and nothing more. Right? So there's the Growth Management Act. It's old, but that's in place. and and Nancy, correct me if I'm wrong, but it requires local governments to apply their land
development codes consistently to each different development to ensure approvals or denials are based on the established rules and standards and not arbitrarily. This consistency is crucial to ensure the approval or the denial decisions that you make are made fairly,
transparently, in accordance with the rules and policies of the town and state. So many say that every development is different and they are. But the process for approval or denial must be consistent just like the process was when you guys interviewed uh the town manager candidates, right? There
were five candidates, all different, all different backgrounds, but you asked them all the same questions. You had to do that to keep the process fair and consistent. So if the process for approval or denial must be consistent, I just I can't understand for the life of me why the LPA would deny Seagate at
according to staff is at a 1.6 six far and numerous deviations. But then they unanimously approved Moss at a twofar, eight deviations plus a land use change from a residential conservation, correct? That's the name of our
neighborhood to commercial. Is that consistent? This area is not a downtown. It's not in the downtown. It's um it it may I thought it was in the downtown area, but it's not. It's residential conservation. But yet the LPA, you know, some of the reasons they gave and that
they denied Seagate in Time the Times Square project was because, and I quote, "What is being asked for is inconsistent with the comp plan." But they approved Ma, who whose asks are also not consistent with the a comp plan, including wanting to change the entire neighborhood and the highest FAR that
I've heard so far to date at a 2.0, twice that of Margaritavville. Margaritavville is a one, Moss is a two. Again, the LPA unanimously approved it. And why would an LPA member say a rooftop bar presented during the Times Square project was an amenity because
possibly it blocked his view, but the rooftop bar at Moss Marina is a public benefit and and the and factor that into his decision to approve or deny one over the other. Is this consistent? Especially when the rooftop bar at Moss that he looked at as a benefit is
hovering directly down into my and my neighbors yards. It's not a benefit to us. it's a detriment. So I ask you in closing, please be free of potential bias or prejudice and apply the land development code consistently to all developments to ensure the approvals or
denials are based on established rules and standards and not arbitrarily. Thank you much. Thank you. Is there anyone else who'd like to speak in public comment? Seeing none, we'll close public comment. Uh local achievements and recognitions,
Mr. King. Um, yeah, I um I'll start. It probably should go later under uh council member items, but um I I need to get this out of my way. Uh in right in light of a current event, uh it's been weighing on my heart and my head. And so
I'll be making breaking news today. I'd like to recognize my lovely wife, Chris. Today is our 35th wedding anniversary. I've gotten older, but Chris remains as young and beautiful as always. Chris, thanks for being my best friend and the love of my life. I love trying to make you laugh at least once a
day, and your smile sates my soul. I'll be uh quoting our buddy Bill Withers here when I say, "When I look at you, the world's all right with me. When I look at you, I know it's going to be a lovely day. In spite of the fools we must suffer." Thank you for letting us
live our best lives. I love you, Chris. Hard to top that. Happy anniversary. Thank you. Anything else, John? That's it. Thank you. I am not following a Bill Withers quote, but that's beautiful. Yeah, congratulations. It's cheaper card.
Um, I'm good. Congratulations. Happy anniversary. Edward be something like I do get married on Cinco de Mayo, but uh congrat nobody celebrated it in 1990. Congratulations. Now I have nothing in
the interest of time. Yeah, in the sake of time I will I will forego anything I ahead for this week. Uh advisory committees and items, reports and appointments. We have Dave Nesbomb from MURF and Chris King from the Anchorage Advisory Committee. Dave, good morning counselor, staff. Dave
Nusbomb, chairman of the MURF committee. Just a very brief report on the last two MURF meetings. We were compressed because of timing, so we were only about three weeks apart. At the April 10th MURF meeting, in response to several
requests of residents and with the help of staff, we reviewed the ownership and depth situation of the numerous canals facing the Backbay. Ownership and financial responsibility of the canals
is all over the board with some owners homeowners associations having control of the canal, others are independently owned by the property owner and some are controlled by the town. It's a very
mixed bag. Determining who will pay for the dredging of the canals is a much bigger issue and that is the question. After
much discussion regarding the complexity and financing of the project, the committee voted five to two to recommend to the town council that they need to re research funding
mechanisms to dredge the canals to their correct depth. Recognizing the importance and economic benefit and environmental improvement of the canals, a special property tax may be required
and applied to all of the canal owners regardless of ownership. And it's by and large we kicked it back to the council because it's beyond our pay grade. After reviewing the dune planting
plan presented by staff leaison Chad Chutz, the committee voted to unanimous unanimously support the plan. Artist Kim Goins was a recipient of the April Murf Award for her new mural at the Fort
Myers Beach Library for capturing the spirit of our location with her beautiful sea mural. At our May MURF meeting, the committee reorganized recognized the growing population of Australian pines across
the empty lots throughout the island. Australian pines, Brazilian peppers, and other category one invasive plants are gaining a foothold that increase their presence and also increase removal costs
when they are finally taken out. The committee voted unanimously to ask the town to remind all property owners to please identify and remove these plants from their lots before they establish an even greater
foothold. After a several year hiatus due to Ian, we have asked staff to post nomination papers for the Mayor John Mhalland Stewardship Award. Stewardship is a voluntary conservation
of natural habitat and wildlife by concerned citizens. Any individual, business or organization which promotes awareness, education and preservation of our community's n natural resources is a
candidate for the award. The award is named after Fort Myers Beach Mayor John Mhalland. Any individual may nominate a candidate. The MURF committee will review the candidates and make recommendations to the town council. So,
we invite all of the citizens, property owners, anyone who wishes to nominate someone, please uh go to the town site. I just asked it to be posted, so it might be take a day or two, but uh the
application is there. The committee acknowledged the work done by Chad Chutz on the beach renourishment project. He got a round of applause and a well done elder boy even though we're
not quite over the hill yet. Finally, the friends of the Little Eststerero Finally, the Friends of Little Eststerero Island 501c3 nonprofit received the May Murf award for their providing new signs which were
destroyed by the last storm storm and replaced by the Friends um at at no cost to the town. So, that's my report. Are there any questions? Scott, any questions for Dave? No, sir.
Okay. No, it's great. Thank you. Yep. I just Dave, just briefly, I I think you your resolution deserves a uh your resolution about the canals deserves a response from our town manager or Frankie on because I think the town's been working on that and I think maybe
an update on the funding potential for the canals because that seems to be delaying the tougher conversations if if that funding is not available. Do you want to just kind of give an update as to where we are with that? I know you've been searching uh We've been searching high and low. Uh at the moment, there's
a couple of programs that are out, but they're closed temporarily until Washington can take a closer look at them uh through the Department of Interior uh which was sent down to the state uh that should hopefully reopen by the end of the year for at least uh through D and places like that to apply
through. Uh we're hoping anyway. And then also um there was one through the US Coast Guard that allowed navigable channels. Uh it's kind of farfetched, but it's worth into and we're waiting for it to be downloaded and sent to us. So, that's kind of where we sit on those
two. Thank you. Maybe maybe this would be a task for Murf Murf to help take up if you haven't done it already to look at other jurisdictions to see what kind of canal mitigation programs they have in place and the funding that they used. It' help alleviate staff a little bit to narrow
down the search, if you will, if that's something that council feels that the MURF could could conquer. I know there's several out there. Santa obviously one has their own how they do it might be interesting to look at and I know there's other ones throughout the state um is next door so there would be
another one yeah instead of re reinventing the wheel maybe take a look and see what they do and how would it implement into what we need here certainly John um nothing but thanks Dave well I would just maybe those signs they're right at the entrance on the beach to the critical wildlife area is
that right that is correct okay that's just what I want clarify they're Beautiful, brand new, beautiful signs. Hopefully able to withstand the next 20 years of storms. Very good. Thanks, Dave. Thank you, Chris.
Good morning, esteemed council and town staff. I'm Chris Rel King, chair of the Anchorage Advisory Committee. And before I start my report, I just want to say on the canal issue that seems to be kind of a crossover between the AAC and MURF because it has to do with the
navigability of waterways. So I think it might be a joint project that we're both kind of working on there from the environmental aspect us from the navigability and safety. So just throwing that out there. Sounds like you just gave yourself an assignment. Well, we've been working on it. I mean, we've
been talking about it probably for a year and a half. So, um, on behalf of my fellow committee members, which include vice chair Sam Lurri, and committee members Ted Lawill, John Wesley Nash, Ed Skunover, Jennifer Rusk, and Ron Fleming, I'm pleased to present a recap
of our recent activities. I sent you all a copy of my cruisers appreciation day recap. I'm just going to go through a bit of that because it's long and then I would get accused of taking too much time. So, um, thanks to the council and staff for your approval to actually hold
this 14th cruisers appreciation day celebration. It was held on Sunday, April 7th. No, April 27th. Sorry, missed a little number there. Um, I've been doing events for some 40 years in my professional capacity and usually
something goes ary on the day of the event, but actually nothing needed to be fixed with this one. It just logistically worked very well and that is thanks to the really great work that our committee did in addition to all of the help that we got from Nancy and other town staff members. Certainly
Curtis Ledwick, our harbor master, and his staff were tremendous. So, I thank everybody for that. What was great about this event is it was different um in that it had been held previously and it was really a very sort of small event
hund held underneath the Matanzas pass bridge and it was really voter specific and we wanted to make sure that we kept the spirit of that because we wanted it to be voter first. The event is all about celebrating and recognizing the voters who use our moing field throughout the year and the way that we
did it this year was different. We expanded the scope. We not only celebrated the voters and made sure that they were recognized, but we also brought nonprofits together. And that is really thanks to the great work of Jennifer. She has a great connection to all of the nonprofits. Uh we initially
said, "Let's do three." We ended up with 19. So um everybody wanted to be a part of it. And I think that was what was the win-win about all of this. We had such great support from the nonprofits. They all wanted to be there. And even though we may have not had as many people in
the public and I guess you know that's sort of due to it being a little later in the season. Um we're going to think about moving it up next year a couple of three weeks but the people who came were very engaged and the nonprofits were engaged in talking to each other and the voters were talking to each other and
the way that we had it set up under the tiki at Snug gave people the ability to sit with each other and learn from each other. So we're just really pleased about how the event went. I just want to read a few um stats and recognize some of the people who made this possible. Um
monetary contributions. We received $3550 from Florida Marine Contracting and Recovery from Beach Talk Radio, Ed Skoonover, Sam Lurie, Kathy, and John Wesley Nash. Um our expenses were
$1972.64. So to date, we have remaining $1,577.36. So none of the none of the costs are coming to the town. We've been able to cover all of that. We had the following participating nonprofits. Captains for Clean Water,
Coast Guard Auxiliary Crow, Eststerero Island Garden Club, the Fort Myers Beach Chamber of Commerce, Fort Myers Beach Community Foundation, Fort Myers Beach Fire Department Safety, Fort Myers Beach Women's Club, Friends of Lovers Key, Friends of Matanza Pass Preserve and Astero Bay Buddies, Friends of the
Library, Friends of the Moundhouse, Keepley County, Beautiful, Marine Environmental Resource Task Force, Native Plant Society, Osteigo Bay Foundation, Pod Protectors, Turtle Time, and Yacht Harbor Club, And then we also had a bunch of inkind sponsors who
provided prizes for our drawing. We had friends of Lovers Key, Margaritavville, FMB Woman's Club, Matanzas Inn, Pety's Upper Deck, Wahoo Willies, SOB, Nervous Nelly's, The Islander, The Whale, Sandy Bottom, Station 31, Island Carts,
Diamond Head, Pink Shell, Key Rust Express, Estero Bay Buddies, Lighthouse, Yucatan, Snookbite Community Foundation, Friends of the Library, Friends of the Moundhouse, Island Pancake House, and Captains for Clean Water. So, I want to thank everybody for their support. Um,
like I said, it was just pretty much overwhelming. Nobody turned us down when we asked them to support. Thanks also to Beach Talk Radio for being not only a monetary sponsor, but helping us on site with all of our AV. Um, and last, I
think that's all of the things that I wanted to say about that. Um, our next order of business, we're trying to reconcile all of the responsibilities of the Anchorage Advisory Committee. We have a couple of ordinances. We have a Mantanza mooring field plan and our
responsibilities don't seem to be tracking in all of those different documents. So, we're just taking a look at what is out there and what we think going forward might make sense for the Anchorage Advisory Committee. So, I would suggest that within the next couple of months, you'll see something coming before you that would outline
what we think our responsibility should be in the future. Um, and last but not least, I just want to thank all of you for everything that you do, for supporting our community, for all of the hours that you put in, for listening to everybody's voices, and making the best decisions
you can based on what you think are the needs of the community. So, thank you very much. Any questions? Thanks, Grace. Scott, any questions? No, that was fantastic event. Beautiful weather. Um, next year probably a little bit earlier. Yep. Right after Easter. Easter's early next year, so we're going to move it up.
No, it was a wonderful event. Thank you, Karen. Unfortunately, I was out of town, but I heard that it was amazing. Um, and I'm just really excited that the whole county up to the state with captains for clean water, everyone
was so involved with it. So, hats off to all of you for that planning. That was excellent. Kim, you know, as a leazison to this committee, I wish I could claim some credit for this, but the only thing I could claim credit for is that I had a front row seat to see the hard work that this advisory committee put in. All of
them, everybody put in a lot of time. These things just don't happen. So, great job to you and and to the rest of the committee. Thanks, Jim, for your support. John, I I will just kind of echo what others have said. It was a great day. Uh it was a privilege to watch this
committee work together so well in setting up uh taking care of things and then uh breaking it all down as well. Curtis and his staff did an excellent job. Uh the best part for me was listening to the voters talk about how much uh they appreciate Fort Myers Beach
and uh that's one of the things that early on hit me about the Anchorage Advisory Committee is it's also a front door. the moing fields are front door to uh our town for voters and putting on the best face. Uh you've done a great job and I appreciate it. Thank you.
Thank you. Yeah, and we're looking forward to next year expanding the recognition, expanding the number of voters, maybe having some sort of a voter panel. Um but interviewing the voters was a lot of fun. I mean, a guy from Canada who's been down here for months and they're just great people.
Yeah, it was great to hear some of the stories from the people. And Vice Mayor, I think you do deserve a little bit of credit. You stood there that entire day and I'm sure all the questions that were being asked you revolved around the Anchorage Advisory Committee. You were being talked to quite often. So pretty important.
So you deserve just as much credit, but everybody was working very hard and it was great event. Thanks. Thanks so much. Appreciate it. All right. We now have a presentation of the wave mitigation wall from Elizabeth Fountain. There she is. Welcome back.
So, good morning, council. Thanks again for the opportunity to to be here this morning and um do a presentation to you about our recommendations for uh mitigation strategies for um mitigating wave action and associated with storm
surge events and and storms affecting the the island. Elizabeth, can you pull that mic up just a little bit? Is that better? Yeah. Hello. There we go. As a way of introductions, um my name is Elizabeth Fountain, senior vice president at J.R. Evans Engineering.
Over 24 years experience in Southwest Florida and the coastal communities providing um civil engineering services, uh flood plane management, consultation services, and coastal engineering services. Um I have with me today Austin Wise. He's also a professional engineer
with our firm and has a master's degree in coastal engineering and he's been focused on um specializing in coastal hazard analysis and modeling hydrodnamics uh design of coastal structures. As a firm we are a locally
uh founded firm. Um we started in astero Florida so pretty close to Fort Myers Beach and we provide professional services um as I mentioned with flood plane management, coastal engineering, civil engineering services with a real focus on on water resource type
projects. So the goals of our presentation today is number one, we're going to demonstrate how certain strategies can um reduce wave energy and potential impacts to the upland properties. Number two, we're going to highlight some of
the co- benefits, you know, private and public benefits which are very important um to the island. We're going to showcase several real world examples um within the state of Florida and a couple that are very local to the community. Um and then we're going to collaborate to
determine some key factors on how the town maybe could move forward with um initiating some initiatives with this effort. So for background and context, we just want to go through some key points of data associated with the
coastal hazards that face um Fort Myers Beach. I think we're all too familiar with what what's been happening in the past. Um especially since Hurricane Ian, Helen and Milton and the problem is that the disturbance of the storm is outpacing their their ability to recover
in time. We're just not just kept they the frequency kept hitting us too hard or too fast and the island wasn't able to recover as it has been maybe in previous um years. So historically we have low low dune elevations. uh we
don't have the high dunes that are in existence like on the um northeast coast of Florida near St. Augustine and Palm Beach County. Um so we don't have the benefit of that level of protection. Um and the FEMA the flood maps indicate
that the basically the whole island is inundated by coastal flood plane. Dang it. So distinctions of coastal flooding that it's different. on your rainfall and your runoff events and your river and flooding events. It comes with a a a new level of um of hazards.
It's based on the tidal conditions. It's based on storm surge levels. It's associated with major storm events that are coming in to the to the Gulf. And it's really associated with wind driven waves. And how the how FEMA defines those coastal high hazard zones that are
mapped is based on how the waves are propagating across the island. The wave heights d detine the level of the flood plane or flood zone. And the wave energy determines if you're in a a really coastal high hazard zone or a less
moderate or less risky zone. So, I'm going to turn the presentation over to Austin. He's going to go through some specific data points related to the frequency of storms. Morning, Austin. Good morning. Uh thank you for having me here and and allowing
us to speak on this. Um so to start with sea level rise, uh currently the data shows that we're seeing about a foot of rise over the course of a 100 years. Um there's the potential that that accelerates uh maybe decelerates, but
that's the data that we're looking at right now. Um that increase in sea level rise of course leads to higher storm surge elevations. Um if your baseline is higher than your storm surge in the end, your still water elevation is going to be higher. Um and that leads to just
greater flooding. Um that leads to if you have a a taller column of water coming across the island, then you have the potential for larger waves. And those waves waves um especially according to FEMA's maps are what really
dictates the amount of damage not just from something being soaked but from the energy that's attacking your structures uh your foundations and things like that. All right, so some more background. Um, of course we're all pretty familiar with the storms,
especially of late. Um, so just a little bit about it. In the last 120 years or so, I went through some records. Um, it's nothing new. You know, we're we're seeing some increases in the size of storms. We're seeing
increases in sea level. Um, I wouldn't necessarily say the data represents we're getting more storms, but the intensity I think is the data showing it it's a greater intensity. And uh, a big note that I
wanted to to add here is these are historic storms within 50 milesi of Fort Myers Beach. Uh, the two surge events that we had last year, Pelen and Milton, didn't pass within 50 miles of Fort Myers Beach. So that speaks to the
intensity of those storms. Being farther away, you're still seeing some pretty great effects. Um, and the size of those storms. The size carries a pretty big uh implication for the the level of storm surge that you see. Uh, as I was saying, the size is a
big factor. Um, uh, I think the pictures kind of speak for themselves. You know, you have Hurricane Charlie. I had the luxury of looking that one in the eye when I was about six years old. Um, and then we have Hurricane Ian, which, you
know, a lot more people were able to look that one in the eye. Uh, it's a pretty big storm. And Hurricane Andrew came through in 1992. Irma came through relatively similar path. Uh, you can see in the picture, it's it's quite large compared
to that. Um, these are just a couple examples. Um, I wouldn't say all of the examples out there are this drastic, but I think the peach the pictures provide a good explanation. So, these are surge levels
in the past, really since the data has been taken in 1965. You'll notice that most of the highest surge levels are in the last few years. Um, you have a few here and there in
1974, [Music] 1988. Uh, but then you get into the the 20 2010s, 2020s, and you're seeing some pretty significant surges. Um, it it's no secret to anybody here, but I wanted
to highlight the data itself. And I'll turn it back over to Elizabeth. Thanks, Austin. And as we talk about uh mitigation strategies, we have to understand that we also need to work in the regulatory framework um that's associated with the beach or Fort Myers,
the town of Fort Myers. So, there's federal guidance on from FEMA on analyzing wave over topping, uh wave runup, and so whatever we do, we need to make sure that we're not exceeding those those thresholds. Um, number two, we
have to worry about the local, state, and federal um, regulatory agencies that we're working in. And there's several jurisdictions on the island. Um, I'm sure you're familiar with Florida Department of Environmental Protection's coastal construction control line boundary. And there's actually two
boundaries. There's the current one, which is set back, you know, closer, more inland, uh, pretty much follows Astero Boulevard for most of the island. And then there's our original line, which is also referred to as our setback line. Um, and we also have to consider
um, Puma has their own dune delineation on the island. So, now I'm going to turn over to Austin. He's going to talk about the the strategies involved and then we're going to highlight some uh, real world examples of those strategies. All right. So, the town currently has a
program in place that it's uh to nourish the beach and to maintain the sand on the beach. Um, I think the town does a great job at that already. Um, I think there are some opportunities where we
can uh support that and to benefit it. Um, so I just wanted to make that note before going into some of those mechanisms. Um the first is wave attenion attenuation and storm surge. Uh the idea here with a wave mitigation
wall isn't necessarily to stop the surge. Um to do that I I don't think it would really make sense for the town to try to stop the surge. It it gets quite high and the solutions to that I don't think would be
favorable to to anybody. Um what we do want to do is make the town more resilient, help the town to be more resilient. uh the businesses, the homes, really everybody that's here um provide a level of protection from the wave action that causes that structural
damage. Um so by putting a barrier in front of uh along the beach, in front of anything that you want to protect, you mitigate that wave action, you can break down some of those waves. And uh in the end, the intention is to reduce uh that
structural damage that you see to to your local businesses, to your bigger businesses, and to your private homes. Um the the first level of defense is obviously your doom. Um the intention of the wall would be to support the doom,
not to replace the level of protection that it already provides. Um and maybe even work together with it to provide synergistic benefits. and we can dive a little more into that. Um the design and implementation when it
comes to the dune itself would be the grass dune plannings that uh have already been discussed. Um maybe some sand fencing, sacri sacrificial burns. U there's been some new research on methods for planting
um within the last year or two. So uh it's it's new to me as well. um coming out of the coastal solutions department at the University of Florida that really show ways that uh the dune vegetation can benefit itself and accelerate its
growth. Um, and then I think the first step to doing any of this is to put together some typ typical cross-section profiles of the shoreline and where a solution could be placed and and what that solution would look like relative to
your 100-year storm events and including surge levels and wave action. All right. So apart from dunes, uh the rigid structural element would be uh a revetment or a system of revetment and wave dissipation retaining wall. Um
and this isn't necessarily a big wall that's going to get in the way of your view. Um it's not going to be something that can't be integrated into the character of the town already. Um you'll see in some of the examples that we provide that it can really be integrated in a way that speaks to the character
and the spirit of the town. um while also pro providing some public safety benefits and and just aesthetic benefits as well. Um while that wallet is there and it might be integrated nicely, it's there to serve a purpose and that purpose is
to mitigate the the wave action. Um so really I think the best way to do that is to incorporate a wall that's designed to withstand 100-year storm conditions at a minimum. um that will uh provide the opportunity to uh to make
some changes to flood maps um wi which really uh changes the level of regulation that you're facing in some of those areas. It allows for some greater resiliency for the town to bounce back quicker. Uh but it also in the storm event reduces uh the risk that you face.
So the the retaining wall and the revetment the revetment could be buried. So, it's not like your the beach would be uh having unless it unless the folks at the town wanted it to uh some big rocks, you know, out in front of the wall that those could be buried in place
with uh with the dune enhancement that's already going on. Um so, there's a lot of different design factors that that could come into concept, but uh this is the solution that we think would help to mitigate that wave action.
Austin, before you move on. Yeah. So, the revetment and the wall displacement retaining wall, could either of those or do they work in conjunction like if we wanted to have a bike path or a walk path similar to Clear Water Beach, that would be number two versus number one or would they work in conjunction with each
other? I think that it would be best to make them work in conjunction with each other. Um, obviously it would come down to plenty of different factors. um like the cost and and the way that it would be designed, the space that you have to do those things, but I think the best
case is a revetment and a retaining wall in conjunction with each other. And that wall does provide a good barrier where you can set aside this the space for pedestrian areas and uh some of those public spaces that I think you're referencing. Okay.
Um, and in the end, uh, the combination of the rigid structure and the dune element that's already in place is a a hybrid solution. It's a natural and nature-based feature. Um, this is a general cross-section. It's not necessarily a plan that's uh already in
motion. It's just to give an idea of what that could look like or something that it could resemble. Um, of course on the back side of that feature, you're not necessarily going to have natural areas in every location. You're going to have your pedestrian spaces. You'll have
a Sarah Boulevard in the homes and businesses that are in place. Um, but the future is meant to protect those and that's what this hybrid solution is meant to do. And I'll turn it back over.
Go through the the benefits. um to the public and private stakeholders. Obviously, for the public sector, as as Austin mentioned, it's really about u protecting public infrastructure, your roadways, um public facilities. It also
is in an effort to reduce emergency cost and cost with um recovery. And you know, we are hopeful that it would be able to translate into um town facilities being able to come back online quicker um if there's less
damage. Yeah. Not to pin you down anything, but the insurance premium reduction in the past, do you have a percentage roughly that that would correlate to for property owners? So, based on um our previous experience,
we we've helped numerous properties. um if they change if they reduce their their risk that's mapped on FEMA's map, they've been able to save um you know 30 to 50% of premium. Wow.
Oh, that's huge. So that's based based on our experience. Okay. To date. Elizabeth, while you're on that topic, it's my understanding based upon the M&P testimony that you gave a few weeks ago that you all have been employed by uh London Bay on the outrigger project. Is
that correct? That's correct. So, if you were to put a wave wall uh on abuing the the the outrigger project, it would have I'm asking, would it have additional benefits for those neighbors who live across the stereo as well for those neighborhoods? Yes, sir. Explain
how that works. it it would actually reduce um you know there's actual science behind this. We we actually do an analysis to demonstrate that the wave heights are lower with the wall than without the wall and that propagates landward past the outrigger property you
know p you know on the other side of steroard. So the same would hold true for time square. Yes sir. And the properties on the other side. Yes sir. Okay. Thank you. and and we've just for additional info, we've done many of these projects and um not
only do have we had to go through FEMA's review and it's pretty they they scrutinize it pretty well and we have to demonstrate that we're not going to cause any adverse impacts um to adjacent properties and we look at you know the structure itself needs to be designed to
withstand all the anticipated conditions with that 100red-year event. Um, and we've had to even do like angled wave attack. So, not just a head-on wave attack to a wall, but you know, from angled direction just to make sure that
the adjacent properties next door are going to be in a safe spot. And I'll state the obvious, but I assume it's fair to say that those the more folks who participate in the wave wall and the longer it is, the more effective it would be. Yes, sir. Would be. Thank you. You're welcome. So, as we mentioned,
there's there's an opportunity for um insurance premium reduction. Also, um there's an opportunity to be able to change the risk level that's mapped on the FEMA map. Um so, that would be for instance going from a zone VE, which is the high velocity zone to a to the next lowest zone, which would be an AE zone,
still coastal A. Uh however, it allows for more flexibility in what could be done um as far as um on those ground level uses. So with the proper dry flood proofing, they would still have to comply with, you know, afforded building code and um the standards for flood
resistant construction, but it does provide some additional flexibility. Private sector, many of the same benefits for the private sector as well. Obviously, property value preservation is is another key factor. Reduce damage from storms.
Um, one of the side benefits of having a wave mitigation wall is that it would um reduce the amount or the I guess the frequency of the sand transport getting to those upland properties. Um, so I know a lot of people were dealing with a
lot of sand overwash sand coming into their properties and their pools and having to dig all that out and put it back on the beach. Um, this mechanism would help reduce the frequency of that. And then um environmental there's some
environmental and social co- benefits especially with the the June enhancements and the hybrid solution those living shoreline um measures would help support the birds and the turtles and all those those
wildlife um species that um are on the beach itself. And then for recreational aesthetic values, we talked about it with um with Austin's portion of the presentation, there's an opportunity for enhanced beach access, uh pedestrian corridors,
and things of that nature. Okay, we're going to go into some real world examples. I'll turn it over to Austin. All right, so the the first example we have here is over by Miami. It's B Harbor Beach. This is a very robust system. Um, this would be limited
to spaces where you have the space and the buyin to incorporate some of these larger plant species and and dune enhancements. Um, I don't know if it necessarily fits the ideal for Fort Myers Beach, but it
is something that I wanted to show to make sure that uh that all those options are are considered. And uh I think that it it makes for a very nice uh complete beachfront. Um the the dune enhancement with the vegetation, the vegetation can
also serve to break uh wave energy and to dissipate wave energy. So while there is uh a more nature-based feature involved, um it does come with some real modelable uh data that can support that this is breaking down uh wave action and
wave energy and protecting those upland properties. All right. Um this is one in Fort Lauderdale Beach. Uh this I believe was somewhat of a pioneer project. I don't know that this wall was initially designed uh for the purpose of wave
mitigation but the FEMA study has been has been done since this wall has been uh built and the V zone actually follows very closely to that wall location and so most things landward of the wall uh I
didn't look so in depth to say that all properties landward of the wall uh are in an a zone but most if not all of those properties are in an Azone. Um and and this is a wall that wasn't necessarily designed for that purpose. It was designed more to create a barrier
between the pedestrian walkway and the beachfront. Um but it does in the end serve that purpose and it integrates very well into the public landscape, uh the walkway. It serves as a resting spot for pedestrians,
beachgoers, anybody that uses the space. So, uh, moving to the west coast to the Gulf Coast, we're looking at Clearwater Beach, Florida. This is the property of the Hyatt Resort in the Windham Grand. Windom Grand is just to the north of the Hyatt. And, um, this wall, which is, um,
shown in this second picture, uh, street view was designed for wave mitigation purposes. So, it does it is a, um, sheet pile constructed wall. So most of it's buried below grade and it does have concrete cap that has been designed to
create a seating area for the people for the people that are enjoying the prominade area in front of um the Hyatt in that commercial space. And that that wall actually allowed um activation of that commercial space
behind it um to be in place. Without it, the property would have been in a V zone and that commercial space would not be allowed. So they do have flood proofing that goes um on that storefront during the time of a incoming storm. Um and um
it fared very well during the latest round of storms including Helen which hit pretty pretty hard up in the Clear Water area. This is another example of Hollywood uh beach, Florida. Again, they have a wall similar to um Fort
Lauderdale. It kind of it's a border between the n the open beach area and then their pedestrian use and uh roadway area, but serves the the same purpose. And then another one that's
pretty local just down the the beach from the town is Dina Beach at the north end of Little Hickory Island. Um and actually we've represented those three condominium properties on that island. Um Dolphin Way Seascape and Bonita Beach
Club. Each of them have done uh a wall improvement project. There is an existing buried uh wall that defi delineates between their upland condominium area and the open beach. And that wall has been there
since the mid 1980s. and it's a concrete panel that goes down about 10 feet below grade. And what we've done is added a structural cap to those walls that to that wall um with the latest more recent one being completed as of last week for
for Bonita Beach Club and they actually did a continuous cap uh three and a half foot tall. There's a sidewalk that is parallels it on the upland side and um right now the the rock is being completed being placed on the seawward
of that wall and sand will go over top of it and then plantings doing plantings. So it'll be a complete system. Um the wall just it is continuous but it does have uh drain pipe holes through it through the structure itself. So it allows the
hydrostatic relief of if water gets behind it. So it's allowed to drain. Um and all that goes into the design as um as we go through that process. So for cost, maintenance and
funding uh cost for the wave mitigation walls, it it varies pretty wildly based on the system itself and the components. Um for the Bonita Beach one, that that cost was around the $500 per linear foot
mark. But again, that was a three and a half foot cap extension, structural cap extension, but it did include the the rock and the sand and then plantings. Um, but on the I would say on the higher end, it's closer to that thousand if
you're doing a a brand new full wall and you have other system elements with it. So, it will vary. The sand, um, it's approximately about $65 a cubic yard. plants. I'm sure there's an economy of scale if you you
know for ordering in a bulk quantity. Um but there per unit per plant price is around six to 12 depending on what type of plant you get. For maintenance obviously there would be inspections required routinely to make sure
um those elements are are holding up well. I will say that the walls on Bonita Beach on Hickory Island, um the ones that were completed before Ian, they survived, Ian. So, I think it's a pretty good testament to to that design of that structure. I'm sorry, the walls
survived or the walls survived. How did the condos survive? They're elevated. Um but there was you could definitely see um where there was a wall improvement compared to where there wasn't. you could see a difference in the level of
um destruction destruction sediment, you know, like like there was less material removed from behind the wall with the improvement than there was without the improvement. So, and there was less scarring on the on the columns that supported the elevated floor with the
wall improvement. Okay. Yeah. because everybody that goes south from here usually goes through Hickory Island obviously, but they don't go to the northern part as much to. So you saw the destruction at places like the Egret and and things like that. So yes. Yes. And
and um I think some of the other condominium properties are wanting to do similar things to what Bonita Beach and Seascape and Dolphin Way have done. Um and then the you know the the wall extension for Dolphin Way and Secape, they weren't um They were like around the two foot level. They weren't as high
as the three and a half foot. Obviously, the higher you go, the more more protection you're going to get, the more mitigation of that wave action is going to happen. Um, so I would have I would have had to thought if it were been a little higher, it would have been less even less. Great. Thank you. Thank you.
Um, maintenance on on your dune and your beach nourishment. Obviously, you have to we strongly believe in in um maintaining that. It's a vital vital part of um protection of the beach and dune. And
then monitoring um Austin's got has some input on some innovative ideas for for monitoring that he can share with you if you would like to talk to him about that. Um funding, we've identified several potential sources of funding. Obviously, there's the local funding um
special districts that you have in place. State of Florida, there's the resilient grant, resilient Florida grant program, um which I know that the the town's already being um has been awarded one for storm water and um there's the beaches funding program and I've
provided hyperlinks to each of those um resources for additional um input. On the federal level, there's the US Army Corps of Engineers shore protection program, which um I think you're already being funded through the beach nourishment and enhancement
um activities. And then there's public assistance as well for recommendations and next steps. Um, you know, as as Austin mentioned, um, really the the
recommended activity is is going to be a hybrid approach, but we think, you know, doing um a revetment and a vertical structure or com combination of that is really a key key mitigation strategy for
the for the island. we recommend that you may want to look at doing a a pilot project for maybe a specific area on the island. Um, obviously identifying the stakeholders and getting their initial engagement. So, it's I think
it's really critical for you to get public input and comment about what what are priorities for them and what would they want to see if this project moves forward. next steps identify potential locations
to look at um the potential implementation more closely. I mean that could be done through initiating a due diligence study um to develop those concepts and maybe you know there are going to be different I believe there will be different strategies for different parts of the island because it
it changes as you go south obviously the beach gets wider by hundreds of feet you have different conditions you have different surge levels um so it could be a different could be like a set of different strategies or details for
portions of the of the identify or evaluate those funding opportunities um in more detail and establish the channels for stakeholder engagement such as doing um direct resident surveys um having a place where people
can reply online with with public comments. Um utilizing your social media partners to solicit that public comment and input. So with that we'll close and open for discussion and questions. There's a
question for you. Yes sir. You talk about a pilot program potentially. First thing that popped in my mind was Newton Park. Right. There is already a concrete wall there that was very much exposed after Ian. Yes. How does that work? Does it work in conjunction with that or would you have to replace that with the
mitigation wall depending on where it would have to lay out in accordance with the dunes? How does how would that work? depends on the on the condition of that wall. Um I don't know if it's been looked at by a structural engineer, but we always would if there's something
existing, we always look to see, you know, what it was originally designed to, what it's made of, if is it strong enough to hold on to additional uh structural connection and and and can it survive those wave forces that we
identified? If it can't, then it would have to be something considered not usable. We'd have to do like a brand new one maybe behind it or in front of it. Um but you could work you could integrate it with like um Austin mentioned a revetment or a June
enhancement extension of the Dune enhancement right there or revetment may be the biggest maybe the best um activity. You look like you wanted to add something. Yeah. Um so that existing wall depending on the condition that
it's in um we may be able to model it in a failed state and and in that failed state if it's not able to be certified it may also provide some uh benefit to the design of a new wall. So they could
still work in tandem even if the wall is not necessarily uh in a state that it would survive the 100redyear storm. um that you'd have to really look at the specifics of it, but there are ways to to incorporate it. Yes. It's pretty much
like a seaw wall essentially and there's a lot of that down the island is buried under the sand. Yes. And a lot of those walls weren't designed well I don't I'm not going to say that but typically they're not designed for those types of forces wave forces the hydrodnamic
forces. um you know the difference between seaw walls and what we're talking about is seaw walls are usually designed for the hydrostatic like increase in water levels not necessarily breaking waves on on it. So Scott, questions? Yes, I I have two. The first
one, can you in our M&P meeting, you went through the process of how you you've got the flood flood maps changed. Can you go over that process and with with time frames as well? Yes. So, um, when doing a a project that involves a
flood map revision, we would first initiate what's called a conditional letter of map revision. It's a clo C L O M R and we do an analysis to show pre-RO conditions versus post project conditions. Um it's a coastal analysis.
So it's we run we take FEMA's model and we run the scenario um with the improvement. Then we send that that technical analysis and report and we propose mapping to FEMA for their review and approval. The clo result is you get
a a documentation from FEMA that says they accept the proposed project, they accept the proposed map revisions when that project is implemented. That process typically takes roughly six to eight months. A FEMA has 90 days to review every time
you submit. So, uh we try to shorten the amount of back and forth, but there's usually at least one or two rounds of of questions to answer. Then once the project is implemented and you have the asbuilt data and you confirm that it meets the calmer conditions, then you submit what we call
a follow-up asbuilt letter of map revision to FEMA. Um that really formalizes the map change to them and provides them the asbuilt data and doing the clo should streamline the followup as built lmer phase and that that lmer
phase takes about three to four months. But then there's you know the result of that lmer is that you get a document from FEMA that says the maps you know it's an issuance date basically an issuance document they've approved
um on a technical basis the map change. Now there'll be a gap in time between the issue date and the effective date and that gives time for uh FEMA to do their own public notice process. They'll put a couple um notices in the newspaper that run two weeks and then there's 90
days of a waiting period for them to you know if anybody has any comments um they can send them in but they they don't uh for someone to contest the map change they has to do another analysis just like what we did. So in
my 15 years of doing these I've never had anyone do that. So none of them have ever been appealed. Um so then the maps become effective, the map change become effective on that date that FEMA sets.
Okay. So that's great. That my my second question is how can you go over the CCL or you have to be at the CCL to when you So for example our time square area it's I mean it's right there. Yes. Can you go over the CCL or
no? The uh original one, the setback line. Yeah, the 78. We have been able to um in Bonita and I think it depends on what the department call the department of environmental protection calls the active beach. Um I've had
conversations with solar Jackson on this um and they've allowed certain uh I know for being a beach the structure is already there. Um and it's it's cword the
CCL. Um it's just it's a conversation that we would have to have with D. So that would that would increase the time a little bit because you're now you've got D. You probably have some town get involved too, right?
Yeah. And I think it really depends on what they call as as the delineation of like the line of construction um where they define where the active beach. Yeah. So in in theory you could if if you get
enough approval you could go with that that line. If yeah if you if the if FD would be okay with that. Okay. Um obviously they're doing a hybrid approach is probably
um more acceptable to them. And I know that I know that um marine marine turtles are also a concern. So FWC would probably be involved if we get too close, you know, to the to the more open beach area. So we just have to be careful of that.
Okay, thank you. That's all I have. Um, so a question because obviously I mean I think it along with Newton Park I think one of the primary places that we'd be looking at would be Times Square
and there is a lot of movement now on development or planning and people coming in with their ideas. Is this something, you know, because we wouldn't want to prolong this, but is it something that can be
um worked on simultaneously with building projects and that kind of thing? I know you mentioned outrigger, but I think in our M&P you also mentioned that the three 7-Elevens you were working with on the beach as well as the Neptune. Yes. Um to get their
walls in place. So, how do how would that work with Times Square if that was one of their right locations? The obviously the design can can be done in tandem with their
planning. Um, and I'm just trying to think out loud here. uh we've done permitting simultaneously as we're going through the commer process. Um obviously you want to make
sure that uh I think I think FEMA's probably the driving the critical path on it if you're trying to achieve a map change. Um it can be worked you can integrate it
with the design and permitting um at this at the state level and the local level. Um but the map change is really dependent on whatever ele that structural element is. It usually I use I usually when I do these I I make that
independent of like the site development work. Um, I want the map change to be solely dependent on like the wave mitigation wall. That's usually the easiest way to handle that. That way you're not you're not waiting on the final design and
development plans for um the site development or or the actual structure itself of a building. To me, it would almost make more sense to if you're going if the goal is to get a map adjustment to allow you to move into a different zone
to have that in place. Yeah. For for development. I mean that would open up the opportunity for you to be able to do so much more. Yeah. On the seawward or the landward side of that that mitigation wall. I always encourage to do that you know you know start the the way mitigation wall and that change
ahead of time well in advance if you go in for your detailed like design and permitting for the other other agencies. Um and we do this um a little bit of background. We do this
uh throughout the state of Florida. We have several ongoing projects right now even from a doing from single family properties to doing uh larger more resort type properties. Um and we do
clrs can be applied to all kinds of projects even you know like land development projects where they're actually making changes to upland portions of you know inland portions of the of the county. Um, we're doing clovers ahead of time so that FEMA recognizes the flood plane is going to
be changing based on new new development. So, thank you. Vice Mayor, you just just wanted to focus a minute on obviously there's significant resilience benefits here, but potentially for our island, we
wrestle with congestion and so it potentially could also add an additional transportation corridor for our island, which would be tremendous. And if we so if we expanded this concept to broaden it to other parts of the island as well, has it been your experience that that that communities can use local impact
fees as well to help fund it? PDC money. Oh, and also our new impact fees that were that will come into place in a few months. Is that has that ever been or a Nancy maybe that's a Nancy question but is would that would would the impact fees that are coming down the
pike for Fort Myers Beach would would it be eligible to to expend those on something like this wave wall and if it particularly if it includes a transportation corridor I think it could um I think it could however I would
defer to the study and uh as part of the study uh ra um parameters I would go ahead and ask that question so that way you have um information upon which we could move forward with. Okay, very good. That's all I have. Thank you.
Thank you, John. I'm not sure if this is a fair question to ask or not, but uh at $1,000 per linear foot, uh obviously you talk about how it'd be uh the wall would be insurance on a 100 foot property wouldn't take you very long to get a return investment, right? Yeah. property
wouldn't take you very long to get a return on your investment, right? Yeah. And like on the Bina Beach Club property, that was a 650 long linear foot long of improvement. So pretty substantial, I think. Um and and like I said, the cost was close to the $500 per
linear foot for that three three and a half foot wall cap extension, but it was structural. It had reinforcement, hefty reinforcement. Did it have any, to the vice mayor's point, did it have any um pedestrian mitigation factors in there? There was already an existing walkway um
that's on the landward side of it. Um it was a continuous walkway that could be used. So it was um it was already integrated into it. They just improved the wall barrier to protect it more.
Austin maybe I don't know who would be the the next steps for the town of Fort Myers Beach if we I would assume just listening to my fellow counselors that this is something we would certainly want to pursue further. I don't want to speak out of line but I think as soon as possible. Yeah. You know it's something that I think is very beneficial that I
think a lot more people I know we struggled with the sand dunes to get everybody to sign on but this to me would be as a property owner an absolute no-brainer to want to participate in for the protection of your property and those behind you. I mean, this is an islandwide thing. I think that could really make a difference. To your knowledge, has there ever been a barrier
island in Florida that has done an entire island system like this? No, not to my knowledge. Do you know it probably does on the east coast? Um, I don't know that an entire barrier island. There's some natural areas where
maybe it didn't make sense to do something like that, but there are some very extensive projects that have been done uh up and down the east coast and I think some on the west coast, too. So, going off in Texas, too, there's the
Galveastston wall. Yeah, there there's one in Texas and one along the Mississippi coast is like 20some miles. Um, and it's It's not the nicest looking. Um, it was it was done about a hundred years ago,
but uh, it gets the job done. It serves a purpose. Right. Right. And that was something that was initiated by the US Army Corps of Engineers at the time. And say this moves forward and you obviously have some property owners that may not want to be involved in it for whatever reason. How do you integrate that?
Obviously, you know, the clear water one, you could see how it would ramp down to the beach. I mean, I assume that would be something in your design that you would take into consideration for if we couldn't have a continual thing down the beach. Great question. And we know there's been some questions about well what if not every property owner wants
to do wants to participate and our answer to that is like it is okay because um we purposely like just like with the clear water one we would have breaks in the wall and to allow for drainage flow patterns and
public access to continue. Um so and actually it's it's a good thing to have those breaks and and clear water the the ends actually overlap to provide those gaps and to the wave it doesn't see any change as the
wave is approaching um it just sees one one barrier um so it's not a concern a real concern to us if um there are gaps it's probably a benefit to help maintain that surface water flow and you would just design
around that based on the knowledge you get yes so what do you need from us as next So, um I think one of our recommendations was if you wanted to initiate like a due diligence study, we would be happy to participate in that. I think we are um
on the continuing services contract already. So, we wouldn't have to RFP this. No, sir. Uh they were one of the firms that was already vetted a professional services contract that we did uh in 2024. And what would be the cost of a study? Rough guess.
Uh it depends on, you know, if we want to look at this islandwide or if we're want to focus on a certain area. Well, let's find out. What do you guys think? What do you think, John? Bigger the more the better. More the better. I'd like to have a variety of options. Yeah. Okay. Karen, I agree with
the variety, but for me it would be the whole island. Okay, Scott. It would be the whole island, but I think we need to do a test like either Newton Park, Times Square. Times Square could be huge. Could I could I suggest that we put together some options and
come back? Great. Yeah, I think the Times Square part of it, obviously, there would have to be county involvement, which I think we could reach out to them and or you can I'm sure you do work with the county as well. Yes, we could get that provided the most play management support. So, so again, back to the rough cost. Do you
think would be for the study? Um, I won't hold you to it. Trap unless it goes way over. Deal or no deal? No deal. Well, I'm just asking because I funding wise, is this something that we could get through, you
know, in in the planning, Frankie? Is this something that could come out of the the CDBGR funding for planning? Is it some funding? Where would we get the funding for this this study would be my question. So, currently we have a a islandwide planning grant that we got through the CDBGR that we just vetted
and uh we have a firm on place that do long range forecasting. We can look to see if we can implement their U project into the long-term forecasting on that. And as far as other areas of the CDBGR that's already been granted out, so we can't amend that at the moment. Uh but
we do have some options coming up here for Hela and Milton that we can possibly access. But could some so for Newton Park specifically could some of the funding that's already been allocated to the reconstruction of Newton Park? Yes. That give us at least an idea. Yes. So there's there's an avenue to be able to
get funding for this. You Elizabeth clearly does not want to answer my question as far as cost. So smart girl. And yeah, I would rather I'd rather be able to um nail it down and get it back to you. Beg for forgiveness. Yes. [Laughter]
Okay. So, you just need consent from the council to direct staff to to work with you and scope to prepare a scope. Scope to bring back scope. Yes. I'll consent to that, Jim. Consent, John. Yes, sir. Karen. Absolutely, Scott. 100%. All right. Perfect. Thank
you very much. Thank you for your time. Thank you. Thank you, Austin. Thank you. Great. Thank you. All right. Next is the approval of the minutes from a special town council meeting April 18th, 2025. Is there a motion to approve the minutes? So moved.
Motion by councelor King. Second. Second by councelor Woodson. Any further discussion. All those in favor signify by saying I. I opposed. Hearing none. That motion carries unanimously. Next is the consent agenda. We have one, two,
three, four, five states of emergencies for our favorite storms over the last two and a half years. Is there a motion to uh approve the consent agenda? So moved. Motion by councelor Safford. Second. Seconded by councelor Woodson. Any further discussion? Yes, mayor. Ian
is set to expire June 13th. Ian is Ian is June 13th. Okay. As far as the state as far as the state's concerned unless it's extended. Okay. Any further discussion? All those in favor signify
by saying I. I. I. opposed. Hearing none, that motion carries unanimously. We do not have any items removed from the consent agenda. That brings us to our public hearings. Would anybody like a quick brief 10-minute recess before we start those? Awesome. Okay, we'll take a
brief 10-minute recess. Come back at 10:30. All right, we're going to call the meeting back to order. It is 10:30. We moved up item B in our public hearings. Do you Nancy, do you want to go through the this now or do you want to do the
public hearing first? Um, I would like to just do a very quick overview. Um, and the burden is actually on the property owner, the uh appellant. So I will defer to them for their presentation. Um but this is a request
for rehearing and reconsideration of your denial of the appeal of uh 213191 Wigan Terrace. Um this was a matter that was before you at your last meeting and um unfortunately there was
uh some mixup on the noticing. Uh the question was asked during the meeting whether or not uh notice had been provided to the appellant who was not present at that meeting. Uh we determined that there was just um it was an oversight on our part. We had
numerous staff members involved in the process. Um and it's an unfortunate situation that occurred. um they did file a reharing and uh their attorney is present today and will provide argument as to the why uh the
reharing is needed. I believe as I mentioned at the last hearing um we did have also some issues um in that the um there was a mixup on the scheduling our building official was not able to be present um and it was an appeal of his
decision. um we would like the opportunity to um present the town's uh information to you as part of that appeal which we did not do at the last meeting. Um and also we had a couple
issues with our um agenda packet. Um the reasons for the agenda packet mixup is um as I mentioned at the last meeting uh there was a change in process from an administrative uh not an administrative from a review before the Lee County
Board of Adjustment and Appeals to the uh town special magistrate. And that change occurred over a couple months in the fall. And at the same time we were processing some um code enforcement violations.
um involving the same uh property owner uh for a different property and so there was just a little bit of a mixup going back back and forth on that. So I hope um I am not opposed to this rehering. I want to go ahead and put that on the
record. I think it's the correct thing to do simply because uh whatever your decision is um will most likely be subject to an appeal and the record I don't think would support um a um denial of the reharing. And so
with that said, mayor, if I may, I'd like to go ahead and defer to the appellants attorney and let him um present his request. Absolutely. Come on up. [Music] Good morning. Good morning. Well said.
Uh, Robert Hartzell, Hartzel EP, PA counselors. Uh, this is an this is a motion for a rehearing. U, council set it up very well. Uh, we filed this back in November of 2024 of a an agenda. So
when we file as attorneys, when we file documents, we send send council a copy as a courtesy. I think we sent the clerk a copy. Everything was filed with the city. We didn't receive anything back and we asked several times. Obviously,
it was a mixup. Um we're here to set everything straight and get that rehearing. Um the the cases I just want to be clear for the record the cases are Coral Reef Nurseries and the Jennings case that say we have to get actual notice uh in an
administrative appeal and a quasi judicial uh component like we're doing today. Uh the court of due process is the right uh right to be heard and noticed. Uh this is a Yerby and Currillin case.
And I'm gonna I'm going to stop there because I I was going to move forward with something else, but I talked the council. We're going to do that if the rehearing is granted. If you have any questions, I'll I'll respond. Scott, any questions for Mr. Hartz? None at this time. Woodson? Nothing. Vice Mayor, I
just have a parliamentary inquiry for our town attorney. Is this just the request for a rehearing or we were, if granted, will we have the rehering this morning? No, we would not have the rehearing this morning. I think a tenative date that had been identified
is uh May the 19th. Um moving forward. Thank you, Councelor King. Any questions? Nothing at this time. I do not have any either. Mayor, we do have the um attorney present for the property owner who is the party at interest um
the uh re recipient of the building appeal of the building permit which is the subject of the appeal. So it would be appropriate to provide him an opportunity to u make testimony. Okay. Thank you, Mr. Thank you. Mr. B.
Thank you. And good morning, Robert. For the record, attorney. Um, it's hard for me to argue when your attorney's telling you that you need to set it for a reharing. But I will say this is getting to be a habit. You missed the council meeting the first time. You sent it back to the LPA. Now he missed this. It seems
like if you're interested, ought to follow up and ask when the date's going to be or set the date. We had no problem negotiating the May 19th date. Um, so again, we're opposed to the denial, but in light of what your attorneys told you, I'd be a fool to tell you to deny
the request to reset it. Thank you. All right. Thank you, Mr. Hartzell. You have anything else you want to add? And just to clear the record, we tried on several occasions to follow up with the city to find out the exact date of
the hearing and um I'm not one to miss hearings. Thank you. Thank you. Any further discussion from councel? If not, I will make a motion based on the recommendation from our attorney to request uh to grant the request for the rehearing and reconsideration of denial
of the appeal of 213191 Wijon Terrace. Uh that's an administrative appeal of building permit number 24233-23477 from April 21st 2025. It was agenda item uh 12B construction of a swimming pool tool pool pursuant to town code section 34-93.
second to Yes. I believe we cleared the uh May 19th hearing a date uh with the parties and they're both present today. So there should be no no issue with that to be
heard on May 19th at 9:00 a.m. Yes. Any further discussion? I'm an I. Councelor Kane. Hi. Vice Mayor. Hi. Councelor Woodson. I councelor Saffford. Uh motion carries unanimously. The next two items on our
agenda are public hearings for review of various land use requests for the benefit of the public. Please be aware that these items are quasi judicial in nature. Our attorney will further explain. Thank you, mayor. So these two items um these are quasi judicial in nature. And what does that mean? It
means that our public hearings on these two items are going to comply with procedural requirements that have been established in Florida law and in our land development code. So a quasi judicial proceeding is going to be less formal than a proceeding before circuit
court, but it is going to be more formal than the remainder of our meeting. And we will follow basic standards of due process that requires the uh delivery of certain notices, the application of the correct standards, and your decisions to be made on competent substantial
evidence that is presented to you either in written documents or through oral testimony. As the town council, your responsibility is to evaluate the testimony and the information for each item and draw a conclusion regarding
whether the criteria in the land development code or in state law as may be applicable has been satisfied. Pure speculation or mere opinion not based on competent facts cannot be legally considered by you in evaluating an
agenda item. Testimony by professionals who are qualified as experts in a particular area has been considered to be competent evidence by Florida courts as well as testimony by neighbors and residents who have fact-based
information such as minutes, surveys, engineering reports or testimony that is based on their personal knowledge and belief. The town's council's decision is final. If a decision of approval is not obtained or if the tie vote results from
a motion to approve or motion to deny, then the matter being considered is denied unless the majority of the council members pres present and voting agree by motion before the next agenda item is called to take alternative action in lie of the denial.
If the uh town council decides to deny an application or request, the reason for the denial should be stated in the motion. The denial must not be based on a determination of public support or public opposition to an application.
The reason for the denial cannot be arbitrary, discriminatory or unreasonable and should be based on the lack of competent and substantial evidence in support of the required criteria. So any denial is a denial with
prejudice unless otherwise stated. If the town council, if you intend to speak, uh members in the public, please keep this in mind. uh when you come forward, please state your name clearly for the record whether or not you have been sworn in and your
qualifications or your interest in the matter. So for purposes of efficiency and expediting today's uh meeting before uh we need to go ahead and dispose of a few matters, I first need to ask the town clerk, were the agenda items
properly advertised pursuant to our land development code? Uh yes, they were. Thank you. And also at this time, if any council member has a conflict of interest that would prohibit them for voting on any of these two items, please
disclose that at this time so we can uh be assured that we have a quorum present for review of the item. Councelor Safford, I do not have any issues. Councelor Woodson, I do not. Vice Mayor Adhalt, not. Councelor Kane, no conflicts. And I do not have any as
well. Thank you. Um, so at this time I would ask if there was anyone present in the audience, uh, including the applicant, property owner, and staff who intends to provide testimony today in either of the two quasi judicial hearings. If you would please stand,
raise your right hand, and be sworn in by the town clerk. Yes, that's the first, but then there's three. No, good to go. Correct. Okay. Um, do you swear or affirm that
the testimony that you're about to give is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? All right. All right. So, may I go ahead and clarify for the record, you do have an additional public hearing uh for a smallcale amendment, and it's kind of I
still haven't quite figured it out, but the Florida case law says that that is legislative in nature um and not quasi judicial. So that one has a little bit different robust um conver uh discussion. Um and um it is however as a
small scale amendment. It's only limited to a specific parcel which is one of the criteria for determining whether or not an item is um quasi judicial. But moving on clarification yes uh so Mr. Mayor um I think it's
the ball's in your court now. Okay, this agenda item is a first reading and public hearing on proposed ordinance 25-07. If approved at first reading, a second reading and final adoption hearing will be scheduled for May 19th, 2025 at 9:00 a.m. at 9:00 a.m. or
another time identified by town council. This is an ordinance of the town of Fort Myers Beach, Florida, approving approving with conditions or denying a reszone reszoning of property located at 10113rd Street, Fort Myers Beach, Florida. Strap number 24-46-23-W3-0000202.000060 from downtown
to residential plan development RPD with three deviations. Number one, request to apply property development regulations for the downtown zoning district rather than the residential multif family standards in section 34-943 requiring use of the RM
development regulations. Number two, reduction of the required five foot sideyard setbacks to allow for development on the eastern property line. And number three, requesting a floor area ratio F of 1.7, an increase over the 1.0 F allowed in section
34-675 C3 providing for clarifications uh as necessary providing for conflicts of law, scrier's error severability, and providing for an effective date. Uh Jason Smallley has been qualified as an expert already by this town council and based on his education and experience has been accepted as an expert in the
field of land use planning and development in the town of Fort Myers Beach. Are there any other individuals who would like to be qualified as an expert witness on behalf of the applicant at this time that hasn't already? Mayor, could you just clarify that the title I'm
sorry uh this is ordinance 257? That's what I read. That's what I for 1011 Thirdrd Street. For 1011 Thr Street. Correct. Okay. So, you have we good now? Yes, we're good. Okay. U has the property owner applicant
seen a copy of the agenda backup materials from staff? Yes. Yes. He said yes. Okay. Take it away. Exparte. Oh, yes. I'm sorry. Thanks for catching. Exparte communication. If any town council member has had any exparte
communication to disclose, please let let us know the subject discussed and the identity of the person, group or entity with whom the communication took place and correspondence that you received or observations made of the site. Safford, I'm very familiar with the property. Um, and I also had about a
fivem minute conversation with Mr. Markman. All right, Woodson. Um, I know the property. I pass it every day and I have had no conversation. Okay, vice mayor. None. Councelor K. None that I recall. I've
been by the property obviously many times, but I've had no communication. Good morning, councelor, staff. My name is Jason Smoly. I'm with your planning and zoning department. Uh before you today is a request for a reszoning to a residential plan development at 1011
Third Street. Contained within that are three individual requests for deviations to the RPD. Uh the the previous uh the site previous to the storm contained as far as staff
can tell a 4unit structure uh roughly at ground floor. The uh structure was largely damaged and taken away during the storm and this is for the redevelopment of that property. Uh it exists right now in the downtown zoning
district uh directly adjacent to the Matanis bridge. rightway and the uh town's parking lot underneath the Matanis Bridge. Uh the request the request before you is for the redevelopment of three stories. That's
one story at ground level and two habitable stories above it. Uh the applicants are requesting deviations in furtherance of that. Uh I will go through those briefly and then the applicant can have an opportunity to go through their presentation. Uh the the
first request is for a change as was mentioned by the mayor. Uh the change allows would allow them to um to uh excuse me, rather than develop under the RM zoning district for RPDs as is
called for in the code, they're requesting a a different underlying zoning district. Uh that has a few changes to it. uh some that arguably are to the benefit of the applicant, some
that are arguably a net uh detriment to them, but they requested to change the the underlying zoning. So, there will be some uh changes there as far as the baseline of what they would be allowed to do. So, for instance, uh the request for the change in setbacks if they were
under the RM zoning district, they would have more um normal setbacks you would see on a single family home. Uh under the downtown zoning district, they have a standard uh five- foot setback. So the deviation will be set from the five five
uh five foot setback as opposed to a 6 and 1/2 uh 7 and 1/2 or 10 foot setback as you would see on u uh single family lots around the island. The second request that they are asking for is for a uh deviation to the side setback. This
is roughly the eastern setback that is directly adjacent to the parking lot and to the bridge right ofway. They are asking for a reduction from the 5- foot that would be allowable under downtown to go to a zero foot setback. Uh they have made the point that there is
already an existing right-of-way strip that separates the parking from the uh from the lot in question. uh that will continue to exist, but what they've requested is that the building be allowed to go uh to functionally zero feet right on the property line on just
the eastern side. The last deviation that they've requested is to excuse me is to increase the F. Uh currently the F for that zone uh and that area directly within that zone would be one zero. Uh they have designed a building that under
today's uh codes has an F of roughly 1.61. 61. They're asking for a little bit of additional wiggle room uh to go to 1.7 to make it even. Um and that is the design that you've generally seen today in the package. Uh what they're
proposing would be an increase, but uh staff recognizes that's generally in line with the development that's occurring elsewhere in the downtown zoning district. Uh staff is here for any other questions or clarifications that you may need. Otherwise, the applicant's representative is here as well. Councelor King, any questions for
Jason? Not current this time. Vice Mayor, none. Councelor Woodson, none. Counc you you had mentioned Jason that there was a detriment to on their behalf. What what would that detriment be? Uh so some of some of the setbacks
and the uh F quite honestly is lower in the zone in the zone that they're going to. So they are asking for a deviation to go in higher. But the point is if they had uh taken the RM zoning district uh they would have a slightly higher
floor on their F. It comes out in the wash. They're asking for what they need right now, but that's just one of the things to take into consideration. While their setbacks may have reduced if they go into the zone that they're requesting, their F is also reduced. So,
little little there's a lot of moving parts involved in there, but they're asking in the CPD for what they want and what they need to to build it. Thank you. That clarifies it. You meant RPD, right? I'm sorry. Yes, an RPD. Let me make sure the record's clear. Indeed.
Residential plan development as opposed to a commercial plan development. I don't have any questions at the time, Jason. Thanks. Would the applicant like to come up and proceed with their Morning Matt.
My name is Matt Noble. I do represent George. Um the couple of things I want to point out, uh thank you Jason. He pointed out a lot of what I was going to say. Uh but one thing
the property immediately adjacent to the site has a approved FAR of 1.8. So the 1.7 is totally character in character with the area.
Um this is a downtown piece of property. It was designed consistent with the downtown zoning district. Um there's differences in the RRM
versus downtown. You know, the downtown assumes buildings are going to be right together. There's going to be minimal landscaping separating them. Uh part of the benefit that we're offering is better water management with the
site. And if I could answer any questions, I'd be more than happy to. Councelor Saffford. No, I'm familiar with the site. Councelor Woodson, when you say water management, because I know that's a flooding site. It is. What does that mean exactly? Uh there's going to
be uh behind inside of the unit there will be area to put uh detention a detention pond also as well as uh vaulting as well. Okay. Thank you,
Vice Mayor. No. Uh councelor K. No. Um, Matt, you said so the drainage that you're talking about, that's to sustain or that's to hold your own water from your own property, right? That's correct. And then are you okay with the staff recommendations if with the staff conditions upon recommendation or the
staff's recommendations of conditions upon approval? Yes. Knew I'd get it there eventually. All right. Thank you, Mayor. I have one minor comment. Don't leave yet. Um, have you been qualified as an expert before the town council?
uh before council. I know it was at LPA. I I don't know. I mean, can you go ahead and state your uh qualifications, which I know are quite lengthy, and um it allow them the opportunity to vote. Yeah, it it uh caught me by surprise at
LPA. Um I and I should have said I've been qualified as an expert in quite a few court proceedings at uh various courts in Florida. uh as well as jurisdictions. I have been a practicing planner
um over 40 years now. Um I was trained in the Netherlands. So I really appreciated the conversation you had earlier about the wave wall. Um yeah, I think it's overdue. You
know, pro protect your assets. You know that that was the Dutch. I went and worked on the boulders for them as a college kid, you know, and it really opened my eyes on how they manage water. And I'm kind of getting off track, but yeah, I've been qualified as an expert
in planning, land use, zoning, comprehensive planning, uh even transportation, but I don't because I there's some transportation folks there. Uh kind of special transportation stuff, you know. Mr. May I move approval of his qualifications as
an expert? Second. Seconded by councelor Safford. Any further discussion? All those in favor signify by saying I. I. Opposed. Hearing none. That motion carried unanimously. Thank you. Thank you. Next. Are there any members of the public who wish to comment on this matter? If so, please come forward to
the podium and identify yourself. Provide your address and whether you were sworn in. Is there anyone that would like to speak in public comment on this hearing? Seeing none, we'll close public comments. Are there any additional comments, rebuttal, or closing statements from the applicant? Matt, are
you good? Good. Sure. Okay. All right. I will now close the public hearing and request discussion or a motion from town council to approve. Approve with conditions, deny with reasons, or a continuence to a time certain. Discussion.
Not. Is there someone that would like to make a motion? I'll move ordinance 25-07 REZ2024275 at 1013rd Street. Are you basing that on the staff recommendation and their conditions that are attached to it? Yes, I will. Thank you for ask. I
will second that motion. Any further discussion? Councelor Kane. I vice mayor I. Councelor Woodson I counc. Motion carries unanimously to the second hearing. Next is this is an agenda item and the
item is a first reading of public hearing on proposed ordinance 25-05 commonly four. Uh it says 05 online. Oh here it says 04. So we get it right. It says five in the packet online but it's
04. So just to clarify um the first item that we would like uh review of is the actual reszoning of the property. Oh I jumped. I'm sorry to CPD and the second item is that smallcale comprehensive plan. You know the numbers.
It's my error. I I clicked on the wrong one. Okay. It is correct online. I'm sorry. Okay. Thank you. Human error. If you'd like to refer to my paper copy forest. So, um mayor the way we we're trying to make some uh improvements to
your agenda over time. Uh the first part of the agenda is in italic and that is just kind of setting the stage of what we're doing and where we hope to go. Um and then the actual ordinance title is in uh capital letters. Okay. Not that I
don't enjoy reading all of this. Would you do I need to read the first part in italics or do I not? You don't. But again, it kind of tells everybody where what's going on. So I should hit for transparency. All right. No,
that's fine. I have no problem. I just I don't even know why I asked that question. Want some water? Yeah. Right. This agenda item is a first reading of public hearing on proporous ordinance 25-04, commonly referred to as the Arches commercial plan development. If approved at first reading, a second
reading and final adoption hearing will be scheduled for June 2nd, 2025 at 9:00 am after adoption of the comprehensive plan amendment proposed in ordinance 25-05 or at another time as identified by town council. This is an ordinance of
the town of Fort Myers Beach, Florida, approving approving with conditions or denying the reszoning of 4.98 acres of property more specifically described here in from commercial marina two parcels reser residential conversation convers conservation five parcels
commercial office one parcel and downtown two parcels to a commercial plan development CPD zoning to allow a mixeduse development including 263 lodging units, commercial retail space and public open space. More specifically
described as 436, 441, 445, 450 Harbor Court, 435, and 438 Bonita Street, 935, and 939 Third Street, and 401 Old San Carlos Boulevard. Also identified as the strap numbers follow the following strap
numbers 24-46-23-W3-000027.0000 0000 24-26-23-W3-000026.0000204-46-23-W3-003B.020 0 2-46-23-W3-0030B.0194-46-23-W3-0030C006 019024-46-23-W3-0030C.0060 2-46-23-W3-0030C.004-46-23-w3-0030A.01104-46-23-W3-00308.0030 [Music] 0030 2-46-23-W3-00308.0020 and
24-46-23-W3-00308.0010 0010 Fort Myers Beach, including deviations for height, setbacks, hotel units, parking, landscape, and access, providing for clarifications as necessary, providing for conflicts of law, scrier's errors, severability, and providing for an effective date. If any
town council member has had any exparte communication to disclose, please let us know the subject discussed and the identity of the person, group, or entity with whom the communication took place and correspondence that you received or observations made of the site. Councelor Sager, I had a Zoom call with Mr.
Freeland and the neighborhood company last week. Um, I've received several emails both in favor and against. And I had a site visit with one of the neighbors, Mr. Monster, last week. Council Woodson.
Um, I have had a couple of calls. Um, I had an in-person meeting with Mr. Freeland and the group yes or last week. Um I've met with a number of neighbors on the street. I was on a site call at
Chris Mero's home and I live in the neighborhood. I think that's it. Vice Mayor, I uh I visited Chris Mero who lives next to the property uh at his home. Uh and I also spoke and had a meeting with the
applicant and the neighborhood group. I've received emails both pro and con and I think that covers it. Uh, councelor King. Uh, I too have met with the applicant. I met with a couple of the neighbors over this long period in
process and have received uh emails for and against. I also last week met with the neighborhood group and the applicant to go over the project. I did meet uh at Christmas's property to look at the address. I also have received uh emails
in favor and opposing and I spent a significant amount of time walking around the neighborhood. So, Mayor, um we do have the property owner present with their council um at this time. If there's any questions that you would like to ask um the town council
regarding their exparte disclosures, this would be appropriate. No, we don't have any questions. And while you're there, um, did you have have you seen a copy of the backup agenda materials? Uh, for the record, Megan Strahorn, I'm an attorney with, uh, Strayhorn and Person
Mullica here on behalf of the applicant and property corner. We have received the staff's report and agenda backup and have reviewed it prior to today. So, um, are there experts present that will be testifying today? Yes, Mr. Dup. We have three experts that will be testifying
here today. For our certified planning from the neighborhood company, we have Ken Ken Gallander and Patrick Vaness, both of which have testified before you on several different occasions and have been deemed experts um expert certified planners. For transportation analysis, we do have Ted Trice from TR
Transportation who's also testified before you all and has been previously been deemed an expert. So, we would ask that those three individuals be deemed experts in their respective fields. and council. We also have our town staff who will be providing testimony as as
experts to you regarding this matter. Okay. So, you covered most of it. Yeah. Judith, good morning. Uh Judith Frankle with community development. Um so, as you heard, there's two applications before
you today. the commercial plan development as well as the comprehensive plan amendment. Um, if I may, I'm going to give you a brief overview of of what we're what the process is and and um kind of the breakdown of what we're going to look at today. Um, the
comprehensive plan is the long-term long range kind of bird's eye view of what you're um expecting in the town is terms of um growth and development. Um the comprehensive plan is is an element that's required by the state of Florida,
helps the state um determine their own long range planning um and is required of all municipalities and um counties within the state of Florida. Um in order to um uh propose the
development, in order to um implement the development that you're seeing, the applicant needs that comprehensive plan amendment as well as uh positive outcome for the commercial plan development because what we would be doing is
altering the long range plan for the town um by changing the underlying future land use. So even So, you're going to see the two things um a little bit out of order. You're going to see the uh commercial planned development first, and I'm not using their
abbreviations just so we're clear. They're pretty um close. Um so, you can see what is actually being proposed to see whether or not the um the amendment to the comp plan actually would make sense. So, we felt it was important for you to see what the proposal is first
and vote on that first. Um, and then the comprehensive plan amendment second. Although, just to be clear, the um the commercial plan development could not move forward if the comp plan amendment is not also um accepted and and approved
and moved forward. Do you have any questions about that process? Okay. So any approval, if I can just add uh any approval of the CPD would require would be subject to approval of the comp plan amendment
and should be added in the motion should that be the way it goes. That condition should be in there. Yes. Okay. So starting with the commercial plan development and in presenting this we're going to kind of assume the
proposed um comp plan amendment um regulation because it's going to the um what it asks in terms of criteria is whether or not it's compliant with the comp plan. So the proposal as presented is not compliant with the comp plan as
is but would be compliant with the proposed amendment to the comp plan. So J, let me ask you just a quick question for those out there that may be asking this question. Why are we doing it this way versus going through the amendment to the comp plan first and then hearing the CP?
Right. Well, we wanted you to be able to see what that change would look like. We um didn't feel it was appropriate to show you the the comp plan amendment, although I can briefly summarize it for you if you like. Um but to you would
have to to see the comp plan amendment and then vote on that without seeing what actually is proposed to happen there. Um we felt it made sense for you all to see what the applicant is proposing to do with the the um property once it would be amended. I appreciate
appreciate the clarification just so people out there listening understood. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Um so this is a comprehensive uh commercial commercial planned development for 450
Harbor Court, 445 Harbor Court, 441 Harbor Court, 436 Harbor Court, 435 Bonita Street, 438 Bonita Street, 935 Third Street, 939 Third Street, and 401 San Carlos Boulevard. So there's 10
parcels here. When we get to the comp plan amendment, it's a a little bit different, but in terms of the CPD that would be created, the resoning, there's 10 parcels. Um, two of those parcels are the commercial marina zoning. Um, uh,
five of them are in the residential conservation district, one is in the commercial office district, and two are in the downtown zoning. Um, just for clarity, when when I'm when staff is talking about downtown, we're referring to the downtown zoning district. There
is a kind of a wider area that people generally refer to as the downtown area. Um, but when staff is talking about it, we're talking about the actual zoned area for downtown. Um, so it's approximately 4.98 acres.
Um, and as I've noted, there is a comprehensive plan amendment that goes along with this project. Um, at the April 8th LPA meeting, the LPA voted unanimously to recommend approval with conditions of the um, requested CPD. The
LPA did recommend some um, uh, changes to the proposed staff's proposed conditions um, which mainly have to do with the hours of operation on site. Um, and I'll go through the conditions later. Um, the applicant has also made
some minor changes to their um, proposal which I'm sure that they will go over with you. Um, again, including the hours of operation, which is recommended by the LPA. Um, some of their their parking um, request is a little bit different and the um, night controlled access to
their property. Um, in reviewing the project, I'm going to hit on some highlights. Um, the density for the site. Um, this is a issue that comes up frequently in doing
these CPDs. The proposed request is for 263 lodging units. Uh, which is reached through an equivalency factor of 9.1. Um, this is the same equivalency factor that was utilized by Margaritavville Development. Um, and Uh
staff considers the downtown core area um which is again the zoned downtown area is considered the nucleus of the commercial and tourist activities on the island and is identified as an appropriate area for higher densities and intensities. Um uh floor area ratio or
F. The development would also be subject to F. Um the comprehensive plan would allow with a with the proposed change to the comprehensive plan, it would allow an F of up to 2.5
um floor area ratio. The um land development code section 34-645 allows for a maximum floor area ratio of 1.2 in the commercial resort, which is what we're um the code calls us
to compare it to. Um when you're doing a CPD, regardless of where it's located, the code asks you to compare what's being proposed to the commercial resort zoning district. Um that's a point when we're working on the land development code that we may
want to consider. It's the point that Matt Noble brought up also that um in his um proposal was not allowed to consider the actual zoning at the downtown. He had to consider general residential um even though it's in the downtown. So
um in the commercial resort it's 1.2 is what is allowed. Um but within the um downtown district you're allowed up to 1.8. So what's being requested here is uh a
2.0 um F which you can see is closer to the downtown and less than what would be allowed under the pedestrian commercial future land use um height. The proposed project is requesting buildings that will vary in height between one and seven stories
with a maximum zoned height of 81 ft. Uh it's important to clarify zoned height is the height above base flood elevation. So the height from grade will be um taller and closer to 102 feet um measured from grade. Um one of the
closest uh tall buildings is the Marina Village at Snug Harbor which is a six-story condominium with um height from grade of about 71 feet. Um allowing the additional height through the plan development process
does allow for narrower buildings with greater separation and greater setbacks from adjacent properties. Um I don't know if you recall when this was first conceived of um last year it was a fairly different project and so what you see now are several buildings that are
are separated out so they're not it's not one large volume of structure um on site. Um, in terms of neighborhood compatibility, the proposed development is compatible with the uses found along
Old San Carlos Boulevard. Um, the resort visitors would be in close proximity to the downtown area and would have to walk through the district to access uh the beach. Although the application has not been evaluated for economic impact, it is likely to have a positive economic
benefit on the shops and restaurants in the downtown district. The increased density of visitors is most appropriate in a downtown district um to support a variety of amenities in the area. Um however, the existing marina zoning
creates a buffer between the higher impact downtown and the lower density residential districts. Elimination of that buffer between intense commercial and residential could increase conflict. um uses that create additional noise in residential neighborhoods have been of
particular concern to the town of Fort Myers Beach in the past. Evaluation of the proposed outdoor music and coop areas, which is something the LPA did consider at their hearing. Um along with vehicular circulation is needed to ensure the nearby homes are not
negatively impacted by the proposed development. Um uh the comments that I've heard from the public are generally in that range. They're concerned about uh noise, sound carrying um and vehicles being on residential streets um at an
increased volume than what they're seeing currently. There are eight deviations um uh mostly staff didn't really have a um an issue with many of them. The first
one, I'll go through them one by one for you. Um, deviation one from land development code 34-3, which requires properties in the commercial resort district to have a minimum lot width of 100 ft and a
minimum lot depth of 100 ft. This deviation would allow for a minimum lot width of 80 feet or a minimum lot depth of 80 feet depending on the development's frontage. Um, this is mainly um specifically for the properties that are on Old San Carlos
and Third Street. The applicant's going to go over specifically for the uses happening there. Um, but this is these are existing um plats. Um, and those are existing
non-conforming. Deviation two from land development code section 34-645B and table 343 to allow a maximum floor area of 1.2. We talked about this um a little bit earlier. So this would
allow them to get to the um F of two um which is again below what it would be allowed under the pedestrian commercial um comp plan amendment. Judith before you go on just pointing for clarification for the F then I'll
ask the applicant the same thing. Just clarify that what I'm about to ask you is true. The FD being calculated does not include the three stories of parking proposed underneath say the main building and the other buildings or does it include the parking? So that's one of their
deviations. No, it I am I'm reading it as it the F does not include the parking below base flood elevation in the F calculation. I apologize. We've done lot of pages. Yeah.
Right. So there they are not asking for a deviation for the parking levels. So it does the 2.0 does include the parking levels. Yes. As far as intensity. Yes. Okay. Yes. And again, I'll ask that. I just wanted to make sure. Yes. Okay. So,
a number of these proposals we've seen recently, they're asking for a deviation to exclude the parking, but they have not asked for that in this case. Okay. Thank you. Um, okay. The deviation for where are we? Okay. the the application for the
comp plan amendment would have to be approved, but the applicant is proposing several elements to support their request for the increased size as well as the increased um height allowed. Um and they've listed those I'm not going to read through them right now, but they've listed those benefits and I'm
sure they're going to go over those with you. Uh most notable being the public Bayside Prominade area at Linear Park and Memorial Garden. Uh, deviation three, land development code section 34-1803A1, which allows the conversion
of dwelling units to hotel motel guest units per established equivalency. Um, that's what I mentioned previously. A deviation would allow for equivalency of 9.1 to get them to the maximum 263 guest units allowed.
Um, again, that's relying on the the comp plan amendment. Um and the applicant is also um proposing significant uh benefits. Um and staff feels that density in this location if
compliant with the comprehensive plan would be appropriate um uh and necessary for the downtown area. Deviation four from land development code note one of table 10-9 requires a
solid wall not less than six feet in height with the landscaping to be placed on the adjacent property side of the wall. Um typically we require that so that the the viewable the neighbor facing side of the wall is landscaped to be
more attractive. In this case, most of the neighbors have their own fencing along there. So, it doesn't make a lot of sense to have a um one fence, some landscaping, and then a wall because nobody's really going to be looking at any of that landscaping. So, what
they're asking to do is to move that um that boundary to the um to the property line and put the landscaping within their own property instead of being outward facing. Um they're also requesting um a
decorative fence instead of the um wall. Um most yeah as I said most resident properties have fences at their boundaries. Um so it would not necessarily uh provide a benefit this um code section provide a benefit to the
immediate neighbors. Um the deviation also promotes um security of the site um and thereby also the neighboring um residential areas. Um uh however some immediate neighbors may prefer a solid wall instead of a fence. There is
currently a six-foot wall that runs along the rear yards of the homes on third and bonita streets. Um so that's something to consider whether that existing wall should be um either allowed to remain or be reconstructed.
Deviation five, land development code section 26-77B, which states that new or expanded seaw walls are not allowed along natural water bodies in order to allow the existing boat ramp to replaced by a seaw wall. There is where they're
proposing the um water ferry terminal or or stop. There's um a boat ramp there um and that would just be filling that in and continuing the seaw wall. Our code doesn't allow it, but this deviation would allow them to have a continuous
seaw wall and better protect the property. Uh, deviation six, land development code table 34-3 requires properties in the commercial resort zoning district to have a minimum height set at 30 feet um and three stories to
allow a maximum building zoned height of 81 ft for the resort. uh maximum building heights will be in compliance with the approved master concept plan. You can see from the the narrative in the master concept plan which um which buildings will be at which
height. Um the applicant is proposing several elements um to support their request of increased height. Deviation seven from land development code table 34-3 which states the
property setbacks in a CPD zoning district shall be the same for commercial resort zoning to allow adjusted building setback lines within the resort track and adjusted side setbacks and build two lines for the buildings located with the old San
Carlos tract as outlined um in the uh uh packet um and which you can see on their master concept plan. Uh the deviation allows for a more cohesive urban streetscape along Old San Carlos Boulevard and greater open space along
the linear park and prominade areas. So the building is set back from the um single family homes um 30 to 50 feet in in different places to have a a buffering effect in those homes. um and
the land development code um requires it closer and farther in some places. So this is to provide um greater separation of uses. Deviation 8 um deviation from land development code section
34-2020 requiring parking regulations to allow a parking reduction of 50% in accordance with land development code section 34-676A1. Um, uh, staff disagreed with the applicant here in this case slightly,
although they have changed their ask since LPA. Um, they did a calculation where they realized they could have uh more retail space than they previously thought that they could have. Um, and so that would factor into the calculation
of parking, these auxiliary accessory uses. Um so they are no longer requesting to have uh shared parking or commercial parking at this time. Um uh staff felt that a reduction of 33%
would place it more closely in line with the um downtown the neighboring downtown properties. Um so they're asking for 50% um and staff felt that a 33% reduction would be more in line. Um but they are
uh fairly close um with their their ability there. And one of the conditions that we added um which you may want to um consider is the ability for them to do a
parking study. Um to my knowledge, nobody in the downtown has done a parking study yet. Um and one that would be good information for the town to have about how much of the parking is actually getting utilized by the resort. Um but if they came back, the parking
study came back and they said, you know, they had x number of spots that were empty the majority of the time once the the um resort was in full operation that they could come back and then ask for um commercial or shared parking at that time. So, it's kind of leaving the the
door open for that if that's amendable to council. Um, it would also be really interesting, I think, for the town to see what that parking study would look like because we we talk a lot about parking, but we don't have hard numbers um on, you know,
the actual use of all these um parking elements for some of these new projects being proposed. Okay, so that's deviation 8. I'm not going to go through all the findings and considerations right now, conclusions right now. Um, I
I'll do that at the end, but I did want to get to the um the recommendations um just so you have an understanding of where that recommendation comes from. Um staff found that the CPD with deviations did not meet the criteria set
forth um and recommended denial of the application. And that's mainly because of the um expected um infiltration into the neighborhood. um with the uh marina use, the marina in existence, it provides
that barrier. It was not a high intense industrial use, it was kind of lowcale and provided um a separation between a more intense downtown and then the lower intensity single family neighborhoods in the Bonita um Harbor and Third Street
area as well as across the canal in the uh Matanzis Court area. Um so this creates a more intense use which has the potential for um uh negative um uh impacts in terms of sound um and also uh
vehicle infiltration in the uh single family neighbor. Okay. Okay. Any questions? Councelor King, any questions for Judith this time? Not at this time. Vice Mayor, not at this time. Council, not right now. I'm good for
right now, but I will I'll have some questions, I'm sure, but I'm good. Okay, the applicant is here. Come on up. Thank you. Good morning. Again, for the record, my name is Megan Strayhorn. I do believe we have a PowerPoint if we could
get that pulled up possible. There we go. Uh, for the record, Megan Strayhorn. I'm an attorney with Strayhorn and Person Mullica here. On behalf of the applicant, in addition to the expert witnesses previously identified to you all, we also have the owner owners uh here present. We do have Mr. Ben Freelon
who is also present with us. We're going to try and keep this presentation as uh brief as possible. There was a very indepth thorough um LPA hearing on this matter. Uh we are very pleased to announce that we come to you today with a unanimous recommendation of
approval uh for both of these um issues. But as Judith has indicated, we will be starting with our commercial plan development request. So this does include roughly about five acres, which is 10 parcels located. The parcels start to begin at
the northwest corner of uh Third Street and Old San Carlos and extends north towards the Bayfront. There are the two uh requests before you today. So I want to pull up this aerial. This is the outline of all 10 of the parcels which are being subject to this
commercial plan development. The underlining zoning mixed zoning there's a residential conservative marina um as well as downtown and office. So we are requesting to include all 10 of these parcels and reszone them as uh the commercial plan
development because we are kind of putting the cart before the So you you speak we're doing the resoning before we do address the comprehensive plan amendment. We are asking you all to assume for purpose of this presentation and argument that this map has been
adopted and that these parcels are now redesated as pedestrian commercial. So as you're listening to the competent substantial evidence, it's does this CPD fit within the boundaries and is it consistent with the pedestrian commercial um future land use designation?
As a bit of background for this project as a whole, uh the redesign redevelopment of the marina began shortly after hurricane Ian. There was a number although this particular development was not presented. The idea and concept to redevelop those parcels
as a marina resort began shortly after park and em. There were multiple uh meetings, public meetings,formational meetings, gathering public information, support, comments, criticism. All of those have been taken into consideration. I think it's safe to say
the old plan has been quashed and it has been replaced with this new plan responding directly to that public comment and concerns. We have had the LPA hearing last month. Uh it was very thorough and for purpose of today, Mr.
Vaness will be focusing not not so much on what was different from 2024 to today, but really what has changed within the last 30 days and really highlighting those uh differences for you all. We do ask that the LPA hearing from last
month and April of of this year be included into this record as well as uh this PowerPoint presentation and every public comment that you guys have received thus far that Amy our clerk the clerk has been so fabulous in in sending out. That covers quite a bit. Um can we
have a vote on that just for purposes of the record? Absolutely. Is there a motion? A motion to include all the items that she identified as part of the record for this hearing. So moved. Motion by councelor Woodson. Second.
Seconded by Vice Mayor Adhalt. Any further discussion? All those in favor signify by saying I. I. Opposed. The motion carries unanimously. Thank you. And and thank and thank you R of attorney for for help clarifying the record. I do want to point out that the public notice was sent out uh advertised both for the LPA hearing as well as this
that that date indicates the the date for the LPA. There are two I believe this has really been addressed um by Miss Stupich previously. So right now we are in our quasi judicial item which is more due
pro due process rights than under the legislative item which will be uh coming up shortly. So, right now we get to get into the the nuts and bolts, the nitty-gritty details of what does this actual proposed development look like? What are the public benefits that are being proposed? And later, we'll get
into that broader scope of the question of does redesating seven of those 10 parcels, does that fit within the intent of our comprehensive plan and fit within the elements contained therein? I'm going to skip some of this. So, we I will turn it over to Mr. Ven asked to
discuss the uh CPD request. We are requesting to reszone the parcels which are pre which are currently zoned as Marina residential conservative office and downtown to the commercial plan development. Starting my clock. All right.
Good morning. U for the record, my name is Patrick Vaness. I'm a certified planner with the neighborhood company. It's a pleasure to be here today to talk about the Arches Bayfront Resort.
Um, had a great intro by both staff, uh, town attorney and also our attorney, Megan. So, uh, I'm going to do my very best to keep this brief. Uh, what I'm going to focus on today is the changes
that we've made since the LPA meeting. Uh we're going to quickly go through the renderings for the uh benefit of the public that may not have seen what is being proposed and then we'll talk about public benefits. Uh we have met with uh all of you and uh we are aware that
you've listened to the LPA hearing as you saw there we went through a great amount of detail. A that was to set a very detailed record um but also to really explain why we had made all our decision our our design decisions and
how we had reworked that entire site. So with that said, I'm not going to belabor that and go over that again. I'm just going to jump right into it. Um so when we went to the LPA, uh we were asked to make a few changes and we um agreed to
make those changes. So I'll go through those one by one. Uh the first one was we were proposing a joint a trolley tram stop with a ride hailing stop. Um that would have been located uh along Arch's
way towards the back of the um building A. We'll we'll look at what building A is, but uh where we've got an open air market. Um the LPA asked us to find another location. They wanted uh keep it as far uh as possible from
the neighborhood along Third Street. So, we agreed to do that. We've relocated the tram and trolley stop in front of the bodega at the very corner of Third and Old St. Carlos. Also, we separated the ride hailing um stop and we put that
near the entrance of the public prominade close to the um water u taxi ferry. uh terminal, Patrick. So, that drop off spot will be on Third or on Old St. Carlos on Third and we'll we'll show
you. I've got a a plan depicting where that is. Okay. My but my question is going to be more about how does the tram turn around to get out of there without going into the residential. It would go through uh the new arches way and then exit back out onto San Carlos. Okay.
Correct. Um also we we discussed um uh landscape and buffering along the canal right by building E where there is a pool a private pool associated with
building E being proposed. We were asked to enhance that buffer. We agreed to do so. Uh condition language in your packet specifies that the trees that are going to be planted there are going to be at least 12 feet in height. mature trees
right at planting. Also, we are adding a continuous hedge row. Um that hedge will be planted at a minimum of four feet maintained at a minimum of five feet. Um right now we are planning on clucas. Um reason for clucios is as you all know
they grow very quickly, very thick and they provide this opaque uh shielding uh for the property. Um we also discussed um amplified sound
and hours of operation. Just want to clarify that when it comes to the sunset deck um we agreed that the sunset deck would only have ambient music. Uh we prohibit any kind of live music and that
ambient ambient music would be uh limited from the hours of 7:00 a.m. to 900 p.m. Um with regards to the pool deck associated with building E. Uh same thing, ambient music only. Live music is prohibited.
Um the hours the limitations with ambient music are from 10:00 a.m. until 1 after hour sunset. And there was also discussion about um alcohol uh sales associated with that pool deck area that
is prohibited. Um however um people that are guests of that building E at uh ground level within their lobby area, they can grab a drink there and have a drink by the pool, but no sales by the deck.
Um staff touched upon the public parking that was not a request from the LPA. I need to spend a little time to to clarify this. So as we went back and after we we we looked at making some
changes uh and preparing for this presentation, one of the things that we we we realized and that was an error on our part is the way we calculated our parking. Um, we were identifying 15,000
square feet of commercial that was going to be purely public commercial uh like the bodega building, the market, um the the restaurant open to the general public and then we have commercial that is accessory or ancillary to the resort.
The portion that is accessory and ancillary to the resort, we had uh we hadn't calculated everything we had there. uh it doesn't change our calculation in the packet with with the total square footage that we have. It doesn't change our F. We had just missed
some of that commercial square footage in our parking calculations. So the difference is when we did our parking calcs, we showed the total required. We applied a 50% reduction. Uh that's one of our de deviations. and we had wound
up with an excess or or overflow of 96 parking spaces. Um, in reconfiguring our calculations, correcting that error, we wind up with an overflow of 45 parking spaces. 38 of those would be within the
parking garage and seven of those would be on street parking along Arches Way. Uh again we uh it does not affect our total commercial square footage and our F. It's a correction in our parking
table. Um so these uh this is uh the master concept plan that has been revised. Uh the areas the ovals in red identify some of those changes. So the largest oval on the right side of the screen shows you the intersection of
third and old San Carlos that is our building A that will house the Bodega uh Arches restaurant and the open air market. As you can see along the street uh previously we had on street parking
there. The largest area is for the tram or trolley pickup and drop off. We have kept the golf cart parking and previously we had on street parking there and that's been relocated along Arch's way. Um the ride hailing stop
again was co-mingled with that trolley stop. We have separated those uh and that uh smaller oval by the ferry terminal is where that stop would be. Um and then on the left side of the screen
is where we have building E. uh the outdoor pool deck and the buffer along the canal and that uh buffer has been enhanced. Moving on. Um when we went to the LPA, while it wasn't a a condition
that they applied to us or um anything regulatory in nature, they did ask us to look into drainage. Um some of the neighbors uh talked about uh this idea that uh there might be ways to improve current conditions. So we
reviewed the tetratech drainage report for the town. Uh we had discussions with staff and we are amanable to providing a um an outfall for the town through the subject property. Um, if council so
pleases, we can work with staff and add that condition to the final ordinance, uh, that would be before you at, uh, final hearing. So, uh, what I'm going to do now is I'm just going to quickly jump Patrick on on that issue because we had had some
concern about the drainage on I was just curious, Frankie. Could you shed a little light on on what the town already has planned for that area to try to provide some remediation and how this might help? And so if you go back about eight years or so um that
had gone through that area and they had done work previous um since then Tetc has did a master plan I think shortly before hurricane Ian which contributed to what we have now is tier one um and in that they identified areas like Third
Street um and then through the whole downtown underneath the Matanzas Bridge where we're we had some previous problems in the last year of possible areas that could be gone back to an enlarged. Um, so what we've looking at here is probably a bigger can in the
ground, a bigger box, and also a bigger tube with outfall going out to the canal uh to accommodate a greater flow of water. So, so this project, this project aside, is had the town finished third street or is it still part of a is going
to be a big point for me that I want to hammer home to make sure that it's getting alleviated. Yeah. And we will be happy address that. Um so next phase of uh my presentation is to quickly walk you through the renderings that we developed. Uh this slide shows uh
conditions pre Ian and subject property um moving forward. This is a key map um an illustrative master plan. I'm not going to go through all the details of the plans, but the only thing I do want to point out just for reference purposes as I go through the renderings, uh,
starting on the east side, which is the right of the screen, corner of uh, third and old San Carlos, we have five buildings and the buildings are identified as building A through E. A, B, C,DE, E. Uh, E being uh, all the way
um, along the canal. So when I go through the the renderings, I I will call out the buildings as A through E. Um so next few slides kind of show you perspective from the water of the entire um resort. Uh what we're trying
to show here is that the marina use is remaining. It's going to be an expanded rec recreational marina. Uh we have on the left side a uh brand new u ferry terminal uh for ferry and water taxi.
The overall resort we've broken up the massing uh and we created this gradient in height and also in uh massing and intensity of use from more intense closer to the down to less intense as we
go towards the canal. Also, we believe we have a beautiful architecture that is co coastal in nature. Also, um kind of denotes a higherend resort uh with uh nice classic architecture and uh some
splashes of color. Um this is uh just a slightly higher u aerial. Um few things to point out. The prominade as you can see the idea was to create a very active prominade with uh that meanders along the bayfront. Um we have increased the
height of that. Uh also uh you see that the guest experience for the hotel resort uh are on uh an upper deck. We wanted to separate the guest experience from the general public experience. Uh however, restaurants and and uh sunset
deck as mentioned in our LPA presentation will be open to the public. But um we we find that having a proven that is one uh even level is going to ensure the that people have the the visitors have a better experience and
also I think it really helps the businesses along that prominade succeed. Um we're starting here at building 8, corner of Third Street and Old San Carlos. Uh this building um will be
housing right on the corner in that uh teal uh bluish color is going to be the bodega on the ground. As you can see, we've continued the arches pattern restaurant above with some outdoor seating. And towards the back, we have
the open air market which will be uh both uh for um food products and also for arts and crafts and we expect that local businesses will be located within that area. Um as pointed out, we used to
have on street parking right in front of the bodega. This would be our trolley stop and we've relocated that on street parking along Arch's way. You see the corner of Arch's way here leading to the property. Uh so this is uh building um
B. Uh this is the grand entrance. Sorry Patrick interrupting again. Could you go back one more slide? I just want I just that entrance is now changed based on your red circles that you had before. Right. This is not an accurate depiction of how that entrance is going to be. It looks that was more 90 degree turn
versus a Yeah, it's slightly angled and you see that on on the uh master concept plan which would increase that buffer on the other side. Exactly. That's why we did it. We we angled it slightly to create uh greater buffering to the adjacent residential property. Patrick, could since you're on that slide, could
you just spend a second and just talk about your vision for the bodega versus the market versus the restaurant? You know, I'm happy to do so, but then everybody's telling me I promise it won't count against you to tell me quickly. So, take as much time as you need. So the
vision obviously the bodig is to create a a commercial entity that is more than just a a far a corner store that provides only pharmaceutical products or only goods and goods that you can use at the beach or or you
know sunduries. But the idea is to to make it a true bodega like you see in in some some cities where you have little food in there. you have pharmaceutical products. Um you have anything you need for the beach. So when someone comes to
downtown, if they decide to do so and they don't want to leave our downtown, they've got everything they need uh right there and it's going to be complimentary to the resort but also complimentary to all the other lodging in the downtown area. Um, obviously the
restaurant, um, this is a, uh, restaurant that is, uh, associated with the resort, but open to the general public. Uh, it's going to be lively. Uh, we've got that, uh, kind of a Key West, old Florida architecture to it.
Inviting, great place to do some people watching, and as you can see, a back deck area over the market, um, which is open air. and then just elaborate a little bit on the on the market concept. The market concept um obviously we we we
thought that there used to be a parking lot back there. It was going to be an a great parking lot. We didn't think it was a a great window to invite people into the resort. Uh also we thought that it's kind of a harsh environment. uh and we
said how about we we change that and and make it inviting, make it interesting and provide a public benefit. So, uh the market is going to it's going to be kind of a social gathering place the way I see it. Uh it's going to be a bunch of
local vendors in there also. So, I think it it's going to create a great interaction between locals and visitors and uh it's also going to help local businesses. Thank you. Okay. So, a few things I want to point
out here is we have created a new roadway uh dedicated for this project, Arches Way. So, we are funneling all the traffic to the front of that resort. Um, as we explained also at the LPA meeting,
we felt that the um the entrance to the resort was a little underwhelming. We wanted to create a greater sense of arrival. Um, so that's why you have kind of the uh Port Kosher area with some valet parking and we're funneling all
traffic um through the front of the property and all the parking is under the buildings and you can go internally from building to building. Also, we have separated uh we have a a separate access point just for back of the house um
deliveries, that type of thing. And that is on the uh far right side of the screen. So, where you've got the awnings, those would be entrances and exits to the parking garage. And the very far right um is that service uh
area. Um this is a rendering of the linear park and memorial garden. Again, when we set out to make changes and improve um the conditions uh with regards to compatibility with the
neighbors, we wanted to increase the separation from the neighbors. We wanted to add more vegetation, more buffering, more separation. At the same time, we we we were thinking of how do we make make it an inviting place, something
interesting. Uh, and we thought of this passive linear park and also um just, you know, with with my uh my experience living in the Keys and um what they have at Mallalerie Square with uh kind of
this memorial garden with different bus and they they talk about the history of Key West and development of Key West. I thought we could do something similar, provide some historical historical background about the island, but also commemorate um Hurricane Ian and all the
efforts that we have gone through as a community to rebuild. So, we think it's a it's a great addition um to the project. It's it's an improvement to just a simple buffer. Also want to point out that
um the the residential lots that were purchased by the Freelands um that abut the marina uh most most of that area is dedicated to this uh linear park and
memorial garden and is being used to create that buffering and that separation from neighbors. Patrick, just before you go on, just so we're kind of covering it as we go, just so I can put it out there for my fellow to understand where I'll be coming from when I bring up some questions later, which again, this is part of what we had talked about
last week. The concern that I have, and I thought the LPA did an excellent job of hammering out a lot of things, but I think there was two areas that really got missed, and it's nothing against the LPA. Um, the phasing was one that didn't get covered a lot, at least that I can remember, and then the obviously the infrastructure conversation wasn't
covered very well. The concerns that I have for my fellow counselors with this is although it looks beautiful and everything looks is is great. If you look at the phasing aspect that you're proposing, this is the last phase to be done. So this could be potentially a decade from now before anyone actually
gets to use this public benefit which is concerning for me because this and this is just my background. This is going to be used as a commercial driving easement for construction as you're phasing out should that be the way that this goes. So just for future discussion, I just
wanted to put it out there that I'm going to bring this up again for my fellow council to understand where I'm coming from and why I'm bringing it up. Understood. Thank you. Um now we are um along the the um public prominade.
Um what we see in the foreground is that ferry water taxi terminal. The architectural inspiration uh for that building was a ship's lantern. and continuing the nautical coastal feel. Uh what you see uh behind that are
buildings A and B uh B and C. I mean, Patrick, and yes, and again, I I promise this won't count against your time or you won't be criticized, but if we could just pause a minute on the water terminal. I'm very intrigued by that. I think a lot of people on the island are intrigued by it. And I wonder if I if I
could if I could have the applicant come up a second. I'd like to ask the applicant their vision, not just for the water ferry terminal, which is great, but for the broader concept of a water ferry on Fort Myers Beach, and see if we can get that vision codified into the CPD agreement. So, if it's okay if to to
maybe yield to the applicant on that, because I I'm interested in his broader vision for the terminal, how how it would be utilized. Yeah, Ben can give you some details. Thank you. Can still say good morning, Ben. We can still say good morning. How are you? Glad to be here. Um, so the vision with
the water uh ferry terminal, we one is a big investment. So we're building a substantial uh terminal to be kind of the anchor of the operation and we're going to be the one supporting that operation. So um obviously we're all going into some unknown waters so to
speak with what the demand's going to be, seasonality. So we're going to commit to that term, you know, the water fairy running. uh we just like some flexibility on the times a year, how often, the frequency, some of these things are to be determined, but uh we I think we received over 1,200 um surveys,
what they wanted in the water fairy. So we have a really good feel what the public is looking for and we even had outside interest from operators in other cities in Florida that run successful um water fairies. So we'll either have a third party that we're responsible to to
bring in or we'll operate it oursel. I I think that's pretty big news. So So you envision as part of this vision and and this this development is not just providing the ferry, but actually either operating or or having someone operate a water ferry then for the island and for the surrounding area potentially. Yes.
Is that fair? Yeah. We just need some flexibility on um what that frequency and all those things are yet to be determined. But yes, we're going to be responsible for that. I don't want to be overly prescriptive for the reasons that you stated because it I don't want to stifle innovation, but at the same time,
would you be comfortable codifying into the CPD that the water fury at a minimum starts assuming you can reach an agreement with the marina that it stops somewhere on the south end some somewhere on Mid Island, stop at the moundhouse, and then at your your your facility? Again, sky's is the limit. If you want to do more, that's great, but
just the minimum of running a fair and I won't see, you know, obviously we start during season, see how that goes. You can set the hours. I'm not trying to be prescriptive, but I think people would be encouraged to know that not only are you building this beautiful waterfall, but you'll see see to have actually
having a water ferry operate at least initially uh in its infancy uh with those four stops and maybe more and however you decide to run. I don't want to I don't have any problem with the um the commitment. It's just the flexibility. So, I can't make another marina say we can stop there and I can't
tell you I've had meetings with them already. Everybody's interested participating. Um, so I don't think we're going to have any problem, but I can't make someone participate. Totally understand that. And with that with that proviso, if we could Patrick work your magic and just put something in about
making sure that the assuming there's willingness with the local marinas that we serve the south end, stop, mid island, and then moundhouse, I'd like to include as well. I think it I think quite honestly it could double the attendance at the moundhouse, especially on a rainy day or a cloudy day. So, uh, I I just think that's a really
intriguing piece of your puzzle that I don't think was fully extrapolated on in the LP. So, I appreciate hearing that. Yeah, no problem. Before you run up and just because it was one of my notes about how do you codify some of the public benefit benefits you have listed, this was one of them that caught my attention. How do you codify that as
opposed to a ferry? Well, that could be open-ended, right? So, at least it sounds to me like your willingness to with some flexibility. I agree. I don't you don't need to have pinned every single detail down. But in your mind, do you see this ferry if you operate it as a pay as you go ferry or would be a free amenity to those that want to use it?
No, it be it'd have to be funded somehow. So be pay as you go. So in the other cities they have day passes, they have seasonal passes, annual passes for residents that are a lot cheaper. So you know um and then you have obviously um you know day passes for tourists would be a little bit more expensive. And I
think we did that in the survey. So it'd be similar to what you see in Fort Lauderdale, Miami, Tampa, Tampa and that type of operation. Would you be open to in that cotification some sort of discount for locals obviously during season? I could see this potentially being used quite often if especially if
you've got fish tail involved, right? Yeah. I mean, uh, again, how do you put that in writing? Is it a percentage of we don't know what yet? I mean, so I would think that would be the easiest. Just as long as you're open to the discussion, I guess. Yeah. Well, I said there will be annual passes for residents that are discounted. It's easy
to put in. Perfect. Yeah. Thanks, man. Well, we thought that might come up. So, we have drafted the condition and I'll jump right to it and we can always come back. So um what this condition reads is upon completion of the ferry terminal the
applicant will establish and operate and in parentheses directly or via third party a ferry system that at a minimum will operate during season December through April and provide a minimum of three stops. These stops would include
the Arches Resort, the moundhouse pending appropriate docking provided by the town and a stop on the south end of the island. Continued operation of the ferry will be contingent upon financial feasibility. So um we think that is um a
good starting point. It is a solid commitment. Uh keep in mind on top of that um the the terminal is a multi multi-m million dollar you know brick and mortar investment and as Ben explained is they want to make sure that
there's a ferry to go along with that fairy terminal. So uh significant investment significant commitment we can change the wording if if so desired but I think it does provide a a good uh commitment good starting point for discussion. I think another town
property that I would be interested in at least exploring is the one that the town owns down off Escalita. There's not a dock there obviously that there would have to be something, but you know, Fishtail's quite a ways away from Island's End, so people that would want to take advantage of the ferry could potentially have that opportunity down
the road. I'm not saying right away, but something to look at. Yeah. And and I think as Ben mentioned, um we're all keeping our fingers crossed. Um we're we're all thinking this will be a great success and if it is a great success there will be more stops and uh more
participants also. Yeah. Operative operative word at a minimum. I just at a minimum and I just don't think this was fleshed out uh at the prior hearing that you guys had this vision of actually operating a ferry which I think is very encouraging. Yeah. And and and as some of you may know there there was
discussion by other potential operators and uh again more than happy to to work with those folks if it gets off the ground, but if it doesn't, u this would be a guarantee that uh the Arches uh resort would would
lead the way and do this and and I guess and I don't want to again be overly prescriptive, but I had envisioned Snookbite being in there as well, but assuming they're interested, it sounds like you've had conversations. I just said south of the island because again there's been nothing worked out with them. I got it. Uh, I think we we need to keep that flexibility, but yes, they
would be a great partner. Okay, very good. Thank you. Just keep in mind every stop adds more time. It takes you an hour to get from No, absolutely true. But I just I want to make sure we get those key parts of the island. Yeah. Judith, what do you got? Sorry, just to interject. Um, Nancy and I have had this
discussion not specifically about the ferry, but about things that um items that belong inside the the CPD, which is a resoning, and those conditions as opposed to things that may belong in separate outside agreement with the town. Um I think this may fall into that
category of an outside agreement. Um well certainly appropriate in general would not really be appropriate in the CPD. Um but I will say to Patrick's point is that they are making that investment in the physical infrastructure and if they wanted to use that say for some reason this didn't
work out or they somebody changed their minds that they would have to come back for a CPD amendment to use that facility for something else. So they are committing to using it for that purpose and that we will see um with the the result with the master concept plan when they come. Judith, I hear you procedurally and I'm comfortable
procedurally accomplishing this however we need to accomplish it. But I do think it's important for the public to know that that this this project doesn't just include a water ferry terminal. It it includes a desire to operate a water ferry. And I think I think that
additional illustration through Patrick's language would be helpful somewhere written down somewhere wherever Nancy feels it's best or you I mean I I'm comfortable with that procedurally. I just want to make sure it gets codified somewhere so that people know that hey this this isn't
just a waterf that's significant in and of itself but they're actually going to be responsible for operating at least in a in a minimum X and then hopefully Y as things progress on the island. Yes. Does that make sense? Yep. Absolutely. If I could jump in there too, the procedure, I understand what you're saying about
the CPD and how it doesn't necessarily need in there, but if it's something that gets codified outside the CPD, how does it have any teeth as far as the requirement to be able to do what they're they're recommending they're willing to do? So, because the CPD, the purpose of
having that master concept plan in there is that when they they're going to come in for a development order, which is going to have additional plans. We're going to look at their drainage, you know, a whole number of things that we're not looking at now. Um, and at that time, what we're, you know, you wouldn't be able to move forward with
the development order if they were missing elements of what they're presenting to you now in terms of the physicality of what what's happening on site. um that's our our you know our our teeth um that they're what they're proposing to do matches what they're
proposing now in their um construction plans and in their development plans. The operational things that go into the CPD um are intended to be things that that code compliance can enforce with a visual inspection. So hours of operation
you can clearly see they're open, they're closed, the noise level is at this or or at that. some of these other operational um items um they don't fit neatly because we don't have any way to enforce them with zoning or with the code compliance. So that's those are the
two enforcement mechanisms we have through the the the CPD and then the following development order. Um as terms of outside operation, I'm going to look to Yes. So outside operations would be in the form of a separate um agreement and then whatever contractual remedies
you have available to you to enforce um we would be going down that route similar to other contracts that you have. Um there was also some discussion about possibly having um the memorandum of understanding um and also possibly a
declaration of covenants restrictions and easements. Um we seem to be running in uh a number of these with these larger projects. Um but I uh basically uh Judith and I we did have an extensive
uh conversation about this. It it is not appropriate to put it in the CPD itself um because it doesn't specifically relate to uh to that and then also the enforcement side of it through code enforcement. Um so we do think that
there is a way to accomplish it. We're just looking right now at the best um vehicle to do that. I personally kind of like the declaration of covenants and restrictions. I know Megan uh doesn't really like that option, but that um
that is something for us to consider in this particular situation because it is operational. My thought process would be more that it would be some type of agreement. But Megan is here to Megan Strahorn for the record. Uh I have been speaking with Miss Dupurch about this
vehicle of a document. Um and so we can include this. There are a handful of other conditions included in this um proposed ordinance that would be included in separate agreements uh whatever vehicle that may be. So what we are hopeful with is continue to work
with staff from this point on and to have that agreement um in front of you all today. Not today, but in front of you all in the June 2nd hearing. That way we can look at everything together and have everything executed simultaneously. There might be some just off the top of my head there
might be some agreements. We were have been talking about drainage. That's going to have to be more of a development phase um because there's so many um fine-tuned details that go into drainage plans with your development orders and whatnot. But certainly the
items that have been proposed and listed in the proposed ordinance we're going to bring back uh in front of you guys on June 2nd. And I appreciate that. And I I I my my purpose is there is a there is a compliance piece to it. But my purpose is also
to to give a little encouragement to our friends on the south end in January, February, and March who'd like to visit the North End and can't because of congestion issues. And and I thought that was a really when I talked with the applicant the other day and he
referenced his vision, I I thought that was really encouraging. So I I I say I this is all positive in nature because we've been talking about a water for for a long time and somebody's actually going to do it and that's encouraging to me. So I this is really not just
compliance correct which is a piece of it but it's also encouraging to to folks who have been challenged for a long time particularly during season. So thank you completely understand. I just have one more comment to add that um it is not uncommon in large projects to have
related documents that are not part of the specific zoning approval. It is not an improper deviation from any type of procedure that you have. Whatever whatever works for the good of the order. Yeah. Because each project is different and evaluated based on the
facts um and conditions of the of the property itself. So it it is not uh again it's not out of the normal process and procedure to to have agreements that are separate that will that whole colloquy will not count against your time Patrick.
Okay. Um just moving on. Um just want to point out the uh ferry terminal that we uh depict here. Um the intent is to have uh in that ferry terminal have a some kind of a cafe place where people can grab something to eat, something to
drink before they hop on to the ferry or water taxi. In there we would have the ticketing and also some office space for the ferry operations. Um what you see here is a a closeup of that uh ferry terminal area. That's the
building that is set closest to the water again for easy access uh to the the docking area. Uh what you see in the background is the meandering uh prominade with trees uh and landscaping throughout. And at the base of buildings
uh B and C, you see outdoor seating for a restaurant right along that prominad. Um, as you go further, we're at about midpoint of the prominade between uh building uh C that you see on the left
side and this is building D. Um, as we explained during the LPA uh presentation, the initial uh design that that was put together for this project contained a chapel that we really like that idea, that concept. We borrowed
that idea. We brought it forward and we included that clock tower as a central f focal point to the project. It's uh it's about dead center along that prominade. What you see a little bit on the left is is also where there would be some green
space with uh the splash pad for kids. Um and we envision possibly like an ice cream shop or something right next to that splash pad. the commercial at the bottom of this plaza would be relegated to um the marine store and a boers
lounge. Um also what we want to point out is you see the plaza gets wider in those areas again uh attractively uh landscaped and um inviting for uh public
and guests in the hotel. Um, next exhibit is up on the um chapel uh deck area. Uh, the idea is that that area could be used for wedding reception but other types of events. Uh, the
building completely surrounds that area and buffers the neighboring residential from any of the events that may happen there. Also, the orientation of the chapel is towards the opening that back bay where you've got the best views. Um, so we we
think that would be a spectacular uh spot for uh receptions and and for the guests to hang out. Um, as we go further down the prominade, we see the canal on the right side. This is building E. Building E is
the smallest uh building, also the uh shortest building. there is no commercial associated with um that building. Again, this idea of creating this gradient in activity. So, the idea is this is a quieter part of the
prominade. You do have great views from that corner, but um the idea is to to to have fewer guests and no commercial there. The prominade used to wrap around uh the canal. We've eliminated that. We
made that a private area for guests of building E only. And this is an area where we've uh agreed to put the enhanced landscaping. I apologize. We have not had time to update that rendering, but the idea would be that
those trees would be mature at planting and we would have that continuous hedro along the boundary boundary of the canal. Right. Correct. And then would it wrap around to the back as well? It would ra all the way to the back of the property. Thank you. Um this area just
on that P on that just for discussion again. Put it out there for my fellow counselors. I'm sure you saw the emails. There's concerned residents on that for this building specifically. Yeah. About potentially limiting the height to what residential height would be along that canal that abuts the two neighborhoods.
So I'll want to discuss that at some point. Okay. Um this slide shows you an aerial view from Third Street. Um few things important to note is um how we broke up the massing, created these separate
buildings. Again um gradient in height, gradient in intensity. Um at the forefront of the image, you see the uh significant uh landscaping uh separation buffering from adjacent properties. Um, also that is where we've
got the uh linear park and memorial garden. And we also have uh detailed information about limiting access to those areas uh in the evening and also reducing any vehicular access uh through those local streets. Sorry to interrupt
again. I know I'm throwing a lot out there, but I figured if I put it out now, gives everybody time to noodle it a little bit. Yeah. As we talked about last week in our meeting, an issue for me with this area and I'm sure with the local residents at least that I've talked to, not so much as as much as it is traffic going in, it's traffic coming
out. Yeah. And again, going back to the phasing issue, you know, how are you going to regulate construction vehicles should it get it should it get passed as proposed? How are you going to over the next however many years it takes to build this out? How are you going to limit construction traffic through that residential neighborhood with this being
open? I understand being able to get through. And maybe this has something to do with the fire department needing access that way. I don't know. Um, but those two accesses right there really gives me pause when it comes to construction vehicles and those leaving the resort uh when they're leaving
building E. We we um we can certainly discuss that in more detail, but um quick answer is uh construction access will be through the resort. Um we'll not be using local streets. Um what we had there um and the way it was done
designed initially and we are open to suggestions was to have um a sign saying no through traffic or or really uh limiting and trying to prevent any uh traffic along Bonita and Harbor Court
directing everything along Archesway. Um, and we were providing the turnarounds um, at the end of those streets in case someone wanted to visit the neighborhood or someone just got confused and drove down there instead of people back in into uh, private
properties driveways, they could turn around and get back out. Um, Mayor Allers did bring up in our conversation this idea of when people leave the parking garage, yes, they can drive all the way through to the front, but potentially they could exit onto those
local streets. One of the um the the the recommendations or ideas that u the mayor brought up was to gate the property to prevent that from happening. We also know that at least one of the residents in uh that neighborhood suggested that. We are open to that idea
and should council want us to gate the property um we would be uh happy to oblige it. Yeah. The other concern is that you know we all have been in an Uber and and a lift and I can just see well I'm over there in building E. Don't drop me off over here. Go down here and
pull in there drop me off in front of my building and then turn around. So it's just increased traffic in a neighborhood I think is is something that has to be addressed. We would we would be happy to get that and shut that off. Um we we do have to keep emergency access. I think you guys understand that. But having a
gate there is not a problem. Um this is a view from Harbor Court. Again, um some of the things we we want to point out is that direct access to the waterfront. Um greater uh
viewshed and separation between the buildings uh for those view corridors. Next slide here is a view from the bridge. What you see at the forefront is um Marina Village as mentioned from a
height comparison standpoint. Six stories uh approximately 71 72 feet in height. Uh what we see in the background is the arches with the tallest buildings closest to Marina Village and downtown.
And our buildings go from um building A, which is seven and five stories. It drops down to five stories closest to the residential neighborhood. Uh then we have six stories and five stories going all the way to building E. Uh from a
comparison standpoint, our maximum zone height is um 81 feet and our maximum our total actual height from grade uh the top of the roof is 102 feet. Um that
differential with um Marina Village is due to the multiple reasons. One, it's one extra story. B, base flood elevation built at very different times. Base flood elevation uh is higher today. Uh three,
um interior building heights for all the rooms, uh taller building heights. And lastly, we've got uh slanted architectural roofs. I we think that's an important component to making the resort attractive. metal roofs, slanted
roofs, architectural detail, um, is is important to this project. So, that kind of gives you that differential of plus or minus 30 feet compared to Marina Village. So, you're 81 ft. You already covered the 30t over Marina Village. 30
the 81 ft that's from base flood elevation. So, that's including the parking, right? The three stories of parking and building. It's BF plus three. And in our first building, um, parking will actually be
within that envelope. Mhm. U, and so the numbers off. Yeah, I I get and and and one thing to mention is for buildings B and C, there's three levels of parking and then uh the hotel on top.
Uh, building D, we have two levels of parking and building E, one level of parking. Um and and while we're on the parking subject, um uh if you recall what I discussed in
the LPA presentation is we used to have a a big parking garage and at least from our standpoint, we didn't think that was very attractive. We thought that was a bit of a a harsh facade and we think we've got a much better design in distributing that parking throughout the
entire resort under those buildings. So, um, that's it from a a rendering standpoint. Be happy to go back and look at those in more detail with you if you've got questions. Um, I'll move on to the public benefits. Uh, I I do have a question and maybe the applicant might be best to address this. I just am
curious as the applicant's vision for the Flag Hotel, whether it be one, will there be multiple? What will the I think there's 15,000 ft commercial space proposed. What's the vision? I know it's very premature, but what's your vision for that commercial space just to let the public get a sense of what you're
where you're headed? Thanks for the question. Yeah, we see this at 263 rooms um to be a single operator of the resort and the majority of the operations related to I think Patrick talked earlier about the parking measurement differential and that's kind of where we
separated the outside the resort um retail space. So I think that what's that number 19 Uh so just to clarify for the record, Patrick Vaness, um the 15,000 um that you saw was what we
considered kind of open to the general public. Um but we have a total of 25500. That would be both general public and accessory uh commercial to the resort space. And and I think that uh as
discussed uh we envision a whole mix of commercial, dining, entertainment, retail. Again, the details of what tenants will have is not been defined. But the vision is really to have that mix and create this this uh this
attraction this this place that people want to be and and and and they they have a variety of different commercial to keep them entertained to to keep it interesting. Does that does that cover everything? It it does. Did you have anything you
wanted to add to that? No, I think it's a nice blend of one hotel operator, resort operator, and then you'll have just smaller local businesses around in that outside space. Okay, thank you. This way. All right, so um public
benefits, I'm not going to go through all the benefits again. Um what what's important though is to note that we have a very uh complete basket of benefits. We believe that all these benefits put together um more than justify the
request that is before you for the CPD. Um some of the ones that I want to highlight are in green. Uh the bayfront prominade u very big benefit consistent with the comp plan of opening up uh the bay to the public. Um the enhanced uh
view sheds and view corridors. Again, I I highlight that because that's part of our comp plan. Um when we talk about public benefit and uh providing those benefits to justify um additional height and additional
density, that's what the comp plan talks about. Um the creation of a cohesive downtown with two dynamic bookends. Um we've got Times Square. We are very hopeful that Times Square uh comes back
to its former glory and this would be another bookend that would be very complimentary and would tie the entire downtown together. Um the shuttle service again this is a public benefit that has not been provided by anybody else so far. Um the applicant is
committing to do so providing shuttle service for employees and guests. um the continued and expanded recreational marina use. We know that the uh marina use is important to this community. We're adding a few things that are
highlighted in green. We are going to have dedicated slips for fishing, ecour, and sunset charters. Again, providing the ability for guests and residents to go out in the water and really experience the water. Um, we're going to have a dedicated pickup and drop off
dockage area for um, local voters. If you got family or friends in town, you want to drop them off, pick them up later, uh, you can do so. We're going to have some slips uh, relegated to some day docking again for local voters. Patrick, before you move on, I want to
touch on a couple of those you highlighted in green. And so, there are a few things in here that I'd like to see whatever document you're referring to. Docu Nancy, between you and Megan, that obviously doesn't have to be in the CPD, but I would like to see the one the DRA program. I know
we've talked about it a lot, but there's really nothing that's just a word right at this point. There's nothing in there quantifiable to say this is what that means. This is you. I think there needs to be something more than that. Just more than a bullet point of this is a public benefit. Um, another one that is
the imple implementation of park once initiative. Although that sounds great on paper, if there's one thing we've learned about the Margaritavville Resort, they still have to get there. Yeah. And during peak times of check-in between two and five, I think we can all admit Crescent Street gets blocked
pretty heavily in trying to check in. I would I would be willing to bet that that would be the same down over San Carlos into Arches Way to be able to get in there. I'm just saying it's just something although I agree once they're parked, they will walk around, but they still have to get there, right? And that
that congestion gives me pause a little bit, which ties me into kind of the um where did it go? The shuttle service for employees and guests. I agree that there's nothing that I've seen yet for guest shuttles, but Pink Shell does their their shuttling of their people in. Margaritavville shuttles their
people in. In reading that, did I understand it right that the shuttle service would only be during season for employees and guests, or would it be year round for employees and then seasonal for guests? Uh I I think it was in season. That's the intent was initially. Uh the exact details haven't
been worked out. Like because I think it works very well for Pink Shell as far as keeping 30 plus 40 plus cars a day from coming onto the island where they shuttle them in from. So just if I could interrupt for a second just to continue on that for guests shuttle service from
where to where? Uh it the for the guests would be from the airport. Okay. uh to the to the island and also stopping by the Pine Ridge terminal there and that would be where employees would go to park and and get on the shuttle. All right. Thank you.
Sorry to interrupt. No, that's good. I have a couple questions and clarifications, too. Um because a lot of the emails that we received, I I think there's a misconception and it's not outlined in green. And that's why I want to bring it up that there are going to
be fueling service fueling docks as part of the marina which I keep hearing that from people that there's not going to be but there is going to be the fuel service. We've had that question from multiple people. Um Ben's got to work out with his engineer exactly where it's
going to be located by the dentist that keep that fueling service for sure. So from the marina standpoint, the real change is there's not going to be boat barns anymore. or there's not going to be boat storage per se, but the actual operating of a marina will continue.
Yes, the recreational component will continue. It will be expanded and we'll touch upon the boat barns and the the commercial and industrial nature of that use. So, the other question too, and I know we talked a lot about it in the
beginning, but that bayfront walkway. Yes. connecting everything from Moss Marine down through Matanzas. Is that still in the works? Because I don't see that anywhere. Um I'll let Ben address
that. Uh he he's had discussions with um our neighbors and uh I think he may have some news associated with that. But yes, the the idea is uh as much as we can, we want to extend that prominade and if
other uh properties can tie in, we'd love to see that. Right behind you, Ben Freeland. Um so we've had conversations. Marina, it's really complicated down there if you haven't looked at the property lines. So the the building, I don't know if you
could take the picture back up, but Marina Village is owned by 1300 weekly time share folks. So, and that's just in their little footprint. So, they own the pool and that building and the little health facility in the parking lot. Snug
uh Snug Harbor, Nervous Nellies, and Wahoo Willies is owned by a separate property owner and that wraps around that building and goes to the Bayfront. So, it's really hard to negotiate with 1300 property owners when we have nothing to until this is approved, I can't really go to their board and say,
"Here's what I can do to trade you out of that pool." And so we've had conversations. I think there's interest, but we really don't have anything to negotiate with. And then um access with the current property owner um of Snug Harbor and their operators are definitely open to opening up that that
walkway. But the pool's kind of the hot spot. So we'd have to replace that, give them access to our pool or different things, but until I can tell them where the pool is, what it would be, um it's hard to negotiate. So, but it is still in the works. It's in the works. We'd like to do it. I can't really commit to
it because again I don't I don't have control of that. Okay. All right. Thank you. Okay. So, going back to the benefits and and just address uh comments um by by Mayor Allers
um the um some of those well we've taken every public benefit that we've identified here and we created a document of commitments and conditions. We have reflected all these
public benefits through a condition and a commitment that is the document that our attorney is working out with uh the town attorney. Some of it may remain in the ordinance. Some of it might just be referenced to maybe anou or another
agreement. Um, one of the things that I wanted to point out is I think it's important that at least in the ordinance, uh, while we may have a separate agreement that all the conditions be identified in there because I know we want to be 100%
transparent. Uh, a lot of times the residents will go back years later and look at an ordinance and say, uh, it's not there. How did that condition disappear or that promise disappear? So, I think it's important that we keep it in the ordinance, but it may say, "Please refer to this other agreement,
and that's what our what the attorneys are working at now." And I and I don't I agree with you on that part. The the concern that I have with, you know, we can go back and forth on what is an amenity and what is public benefit all day long. What's concerning, I shouldn't say
concerning to me, but what is important to me is that you're asking for a significant ask from from the town and from the council. Those those benefits should be significant in relation to that ask. I'm not a we'll continue to I've commented on certain things that I
think are substantially that need to be included in the public benefits in order for it to make sense. Um but again and when you read read through it your um the staff recommendations and your justification
um to the increase that you're asking for you only return both of you only refer to two things two items specifically two items and there's a difference in reading between what your your justification is and what your reasoning is behind those two and those
two specific things are the Bayfront Proomenade and in the linear park. Both of you on every single deviation refer to those two things as the public benefits. You don't go under the grand list and and just and that's where my concern comes in. In our narrative, we
are very detailed in the narrative both for the CPD and both for the comp plan amendment. We we say that our request is 100% justified by all the benefits, the basket of benefit. staff does refer to the two main ones like you discussed. We
refer to the entire basket of benefits. And that's why we've also taken those and put those into conditions and commitments. Well, you've made again, we could go through it and read it out loud if you'd want, but you do refer to those two main ones just like the staff does as the main public benefits. My concern
is those two main public benefits that both the staff and you refer to, there's no idea of when those are going to be completed. So, the two main public benefits of this list that you've pointed out and our staff has pointed out could be a decade from now before it
actually becomes a public benefit. So, then we could get into amenities and all of that. I just want to have that discussion here before we get to the vote. So, should this move forward, we have a little bit more clarification on what that's going to look like if that in fact is the only two main benefits that move forward. Understood. Well, ju
just to clarify if our narratives are not um clear enough, all these benefits that are before you today are the justification for the ask. We believe that this entire basket of benefits. Um you guys can discern how much weight you
want to give to each of those. But again, we believe that the weight generated from that entire basket fully justifies the request. And and just to add um I think it goes way beyond the
linear park and the public prominadon. Um I think the the ferry the terminal and the ferry service is huge. For example, so um in my mind it's it's not just limited to to two of those. It's the entire basket presented to you. Um,
also I'd like to to touch upon since we're clarifying, can I just for the poor folks watching when we say participation in the DRA program, that acronym is pretty unique to Fort Myers Beach. So DRA is don't rent a car and it doesn't mean you can't rent a car. It means you provide incentives to your
customers if they don't rent a car. Yeah. Just wanted to clarify in case somebody was listening that they may not be familiar with that acronym. Yeah. And in the condition that that we have in the application, we actually provide detail of what that entails. Could you just elaborate just just curiosity? Well, it's it's both an education
component uh meaning that when people call the hotel or go to the hotel website, there is discussion about the island wanting to limit the number of cars and and to mitigate for the traffic and explaining that we have other
options, other mobility options, that the downtown is very walkable, that we have bicycles for the guests, that they can rent uh golf carts. Um but also there is a um an incentive, a monetary
incentive from either discount at resorts or other vendors in town to uh incentivize them to take an Uber, take a lift instead of driving their vehicles. So it's it's outlined in our condition.
Again, we'd be happy to carry that forward in in a separate agreement as needed, but it is it is defined in there. Um, just to touch upon the park once initiative and I think Mayor Allers, your concern about uh queuing
up is definitely something that we've looked at and what we've done is we've intentionally uh designed a new road providing access to this resort. So, this new road is a significant piece of
property. It's it's a lot of dollars associated with building that roadway, but what that does is it takes those vehicles off the road and allows for very long queuing, which again, if you're up against a public street, um
traffic backs up onto that public street, whereas this, if there's any kind of backup, it'll be within the resort on Archesway. Um, just to keep going through those, I'm going to touch upon the ones that are highlighted in green. The Linear Park, Memorial Garden, the open air
market. Um, folks, that's another great one to me. Um, the why it's so important to me is is I look at this as a public benefit. It's going to be a social gathering place. That that's an example of as planners how we create a sense of
place. It's that's interesting. It's a something where you create human interaction, create interest, and also you encourage and you create benefits for local vendors. Um the dedicated
downtown trolley ride hailing stop again uh promoting walkability, promoting alternative modes of transportation and um also what we've got on there is the significant positive economic impact. Again, we understand
that this is not uh one of your criteria for approval or denial of a project, but we've outlined those uh economic impacts in our packet in our LPA presentation. And uh again, I think this is the most
significant um project that has come before you to date. Could you explain the improved water conditions for me, please? Uh so um a lot of the existing development on our island including this marina uh was
developed at a time where you didn't have to go through the uh water management district permitting process. Um we are not exempt from that. We are going to have to go through that process and we are going to have to manage uh our water and treat our water before
it's released. Uh again, right now it's just uh sheet flow off the property with with no management of that water. Uh moving forward, we'll have to go through all that permitting and demonstrate that we are managing our water. Patrick, before you hit that clicker, uh just
because on June 3rd, the Lee County uh school board will be determining the future of our school. I think it's important for anyone who might be watching from the school board or their staff uh at the school district just to explain what you're offering and and and that's now become a a a a insert if you
will and a very important one in every proposal that's come before us as of late. Would you just elaborate briefly on that as a parent of children at the beach school? I I am happy to do so and I am happy to come back to this council at a different time to talk about um the
challenges we are facing with the elementary school and uh school board upcoming decision. Um, but what this is is, um, and I think it's already being done by other existing resorts on the island, is working with staff to explain
to them that, um, if you work on this island, um, you can send, uh, your kid to the elementary school, and again, you don't even have to work on the island, but if you if you're already here and you're driving or or taking transit to the island, you can bring your child.
There's before care, there's after care. Uh also some of these employers are creating flexible working schedule to coordinate with start and um leave time at the at the at at the school and also it's an education process uh through
their HR departments of we've got this great um beach school um low number of students with a great teacher to student ratio. We are increasing those numbers and what we've seen is um the school attend the the
enrollment in the school was devastated through Ian and um the demographers for Lee counties projected that we may never go back to those numbers or it would take years and years to increase those
numbers. Um before Hilton and um Helen, we had significantly increased uh those numbers and um you know, thanks for Margaritavville for sending a lot of uh those kids to our school and also some
of your own staff are also sending their kids to that school and that's great and I think we've got a bright future and we're happy to support the school. Beautiful. Thank you. Okay. So, um going to go quickly through those, but some of the key points that
I, uh brought up at the LPA hearing, um just going to hit them real quick without providing a lot of detail, but um number one is uh we truly believe that this will be the key redevelopment catalyst for the downtown and uh the
rebuild after the storms. Uh we think it'll be a flagship project signaling that FMB is back on the map and thriving. Um from a compatibility and design aspect, we've looked at every aspect of design. We looked at enhancing
and improving compatibility requirements, buffer separation, landscaping, all that stuff. And I think we've enhanced it in in every way possible. Um number three, outstanding public benefits. Again, the basket of
benefits being provided uh justify the ask. And what's important to note is that some of those benefits are creative and proactive um solutions and benefits that we haven't seen from other projects to date. Uh also these benefits are
significant monetary investment um on behalf of the applicant. Um, before you move on from that though, just just to touch on that, I agree it's a significant monetary investment, but so is the neighboring neighborhood that you're asking for them to to be okay with you developing this. They've
invested serious monetary, you know, as well as as and I think that everybody is kind of on board with project being here. Um, it's just, you know, you're asking for a substantial ask, right? They're asking for 80% of the property that you have to go from the less the
least intense dense use to the most intense dense use and 20% of it is in a confir conservation area. So 80% of your property is the marina. Correct. Can we just can we clarify that? Um
marina is an industrial use. Okay. Industrial uses are the most intense uses on the island. The comp plan clearly states that industrial uses on this island will not be allowed other
than marina. So again to me um when when you go through planning school planning 101 there's a hierarchy of uses and um that that most intense
category is your industrial use. Marina project in my mind is an intense use and and I bring that up to argue with you. I'm just bringing up as a conversation point as we move forward with the hearing to understand that you know a substantial ask to me should be rewarded
with a substantial public benefit. I don't know that we're there yet. I think we probably can get there with some discussion. However, I think it's important to note that that you are asking for and I don't know of any maybe Judith can of any other property on the island commercial property that is at a 2.0 F. That's a substantial ask in a
residential neighborhood. So, as we go forward, I've kind of laid out some of the groundwork of things I'd like to discuss to hopefully make those benefits offset some of that ask because if this does move forward, um I want to make sure it's the best project, not just for you and the town, but for the people that have to live with it every single
day. And I think it's a it's a good good kind of segue to point out that um th those residential lots that were purchased by the Freeland family are mostly reg relegated probably 80% of
those lots and those were not cheap lots those were very expensive lots I bet they were that are being used for buffering landscaping separation from u the owners uh the the residential owners close by. So yes, there's been a great effort,
great investment, and again, I I I will keep reiterating that I I fully believe that um this basket of benefits is unsurpassed and that um it justifies the request and and and you know, happy to
you know, happy to to agree to disagree with folks. Um last point, we think this is the right project in the right place. Uh the downtown core is meant for our most intense and active uses. Um also this
location uh is a good location to minimize potential transportation impacts because it is so close to the bridge on and off the bridge quickly. and also it will promote uh walkability and the park one once initiative. Um, so
with that said, uh, before I leave you, I just want to reiterate something that I discussed at the LPA meeting in your comp plan. Uh, in our comp plan, we have a community design
element and we have a core area vision for our downtown. Uh, I encourage everybody to go read it. It's about a page and a half. Uh, it talks about the entire downtown. Uh but when it comes to old St. Carlos and and what we all
consider the core downtown area, uh I just want to re read those two quotes. Uh it says, "On the bay side, tree shaded plazas surround the expanded marina which hosts vessels from excursion boats to water taxis to commercial fishing boats bringing fresh
seafood to sell from scattered kiosk." Then it says, "The corner at Third Street has become a focal point midway between Time Square and the Bayside with corner stores providing a variety of goods and services." Folks, I think we
hit it on the head. Look, we we've got the landscape plazas, the recreational marina use will be expanded. We will provide slips for excursion boats, water taxis. We will have a market with kiosk um
providing uh allowing the sale of local goods. Um the corner of Third Street and Old San Carlos will be a focal point. We're going to have that great building with a bodega with the restaurant with the market and we'll be
providing a good uh variety of goods and services. So um I think we've nailed it. Um I think it's completely consistent with v this vision. Yes, we are building in a different reality nowadays. The
buildings will probably be bigger but much stronger and better than what we have. Um but we are consistent with that u vision. So with that said, in my professional planning opinion, the
proposed CPD is consistent with the comprehensive plan as we are requesting to be amended and it meets or exceeds all LDC requirements including the decision-making criteria
uh based on our expert testimony uh from the entire team um and the evidence that we've submitted all the written documents that are part of the packet. We respectfully request approval for the proposed CPD. We know there are a bunch
of questions and uh deliberation and we stand uh ready to answer any of those questions and address those issues. Thank you before you run off. Patrick, good job. 29 minutes and 29 seconds. Is that including Jim's Yeah, right.
interlude or my 800 questions yet. John, you any questions for Patrick before he walks away? Not any questions? No. Jim, I I I have no questions at this time. Maybe after public comment. Okay. I'll hold till after public comment.
I'll hold as well. Hard to believe, but I will. Thanks, Patrick. You want to? So, mayor, we we do have um food available when you're ready to break if you're going to take a break today. I prefer to keep powering on as
long as everybody's okay with it. We got some traction now. All right, let's go. All right, Judith, do you want to come up or do we want to go to public comment first? Public comment. Yeah, I think let's take public comment and then we can come back to Judith because we've got a long list
of things that you at least we can get through public comment then maybe we can take a short break. But um public comment, Madam Clerk. Yep. I have uh Marilyn Anderson and following Marilyn will be Chris Merrell. Good afternoon. Good afternoon. Uh
Marilyn Anderson, 929 Third Street, and I have been sworn in. So, my house is the little yellow house that will be at the corner of Archesway and Third Street if this project is approved. I'm here today to sorry, I'm here today to ask you to
address a few items that would negatively impact me and my neighbors if not addressed. First, um, for the drainage today, the storm water flows from my neighbor's property, like across the back property to storm drain on Moss Marine property.
There's an agreement in place that Moss Marine maintains that water management system. So, draining drainage for my neighboring properties, especially in the back of the house, but also on Third Street, must be considered in their drainage plan. Probably my biggest concern is the
noise. So, the rooftop restaurant on building A will be right next door to my house. It should have the same music limitations and should apply to building A as the building B rooftop. So, please consider limiting the building A rooftop music to ambient music permitted 7:00
a.m. to 9:00 p.m. like my bedroom windows will literally be within feet of that rooftop restaurant and the music should be ending by 9:00 and ambient music as well. Also along the rooftop restaurant on building A, um there should be some
sort of a privacy screen or like a wood privacy fence along the Archesway wall there. Um to help with sound so that and so that I don't have people standing um on that rooftop in building A looking down
onto my pool area. I previously sent an email um that should be in your packets with a diagram of what I'm referring to there. I have one copy here as well. Um, building B, it's way too big and way too close to the residential houses on
Third Street. It was originally going to be a parking ramp. Now there's parking garage plus hotel rooms all looking right down on my pool area plus the sun sund deck on the top. Um, if anything, if that sund deck railing could be pushed back, so people can't just stand
up there and look like straight down on my pool area. And then the parking garage, um, if it could be enclosed on the backside to help with the noise of the cars, you know, locking and locking and the alarms going off. As far as the masonary wall
deviation they're asking for today, there's a 6ft masonary wall, which provides a lot of privacy and helps with noise. The Arches project should be required to keep or build a new masonary wall along all adjacent properties, especially along Arches Way. A six-foot
privacy fence can blow down at storms and it doesn't really help with sound. The Arches Way road, the angle of the road appears to be only a few feet from my property, especially on that back corner like where my pool is. Um, and it doesn't allow for the 30- foot
buffer with a 10t of planting they claim as the minimum setback on this project. So, I I have some serious concerns about having the main entrance um right next to my property line there. Um, so I'll just wrap up with please thinking about having the amplified music next door to
your house. Um, especially as you're trying to sleep at night, um, sitting around your pool. So, if you could consider that um, the ambient till 9:00 p.m. Thank you. Thank you, ma'am. Chris Mero and after Chris will be Philip Teal.
Good afternoon, Chris. Hello again, everyone. Chris Mastero, 923rd Street. Um, I have been sworn in as well. I would like to provide a document um to you all and hopefully into the record as well. I had sent this previously to the
Freelands um regarding storm drain behind our property. So, um when the Freelands purchased Moss Marina, um it wasn't it didn't include the boat sheds that are in that are behind our homes. it was more towards the canal on that
side. Um and then the the freelands filed a development order in the 80s before the town incorporated with the county to expand the marina and build those boat sheds um behind our homes. Um during that time the neighborhood was up
in arms just like um today about traffic, about drainage, about all the same issues that still 30 over 30 years later haven't been haven't really been addressed. Um, this letter here, there's a copy for
everyone and I've sent it to them before states that um, you know, a big concern was this is such a low part of the neighbor part of the island and neighborhood is building those boat sheds stopped the sheet flow
of water from our homes to the back bay. So building those those boat barns basically be started a flooding issue for our properties. Um Moss Marina or the Freelands George Freeland in ' 85
um as the letter before you states says that they will install storm drainage and they will maintain them in perpetuity. Um to this day the freelands haven't maintained them. I every other year have paid out of my own pocket to to clean those drains. I've asked them
to, they said no. Um, and then the town I've gotten the town every other year to to clean them as well. So, thanks thanks town staff for that. Um, today the proposal as well, these drains are eliminated. That that's very frustrating
to me, especially when I sent this letter to the Freelands saying, "Y'all said you'd keep these drains. These drains are for our homes." Now, they have said they will address drainage on Third Street. um this isn't Third Street. This is our
backyards. This is the property line between our yards and um and their property. So, I I do ask that this this be considered. Um some of my biggest concerns is noise as well. Um in the LPA hearing, they said that the sunset deck
was not publicly accessible, that it would just be limited to resort guests. Today's hearing, they're saying the sunset deck is open to the public. The sunset deck has a bar. The sunset deck um doesn't have a buffer against our our
homes. I've asked them to put low plantings along the railing of the sunset deck so it doesn't become the pier that people are all lined up against watching the beautiful sunset. Um that will be in our looking down overshadowing our backyard. Um so
there's a couple things there that I do wish you to do ask that you consider. Um, they're asking for an extension of downtown. They're asking for an extension of Old St. Carlos. Old St. Carlos closes at 10 p.m. It shuts down at 10 p.m. It's quiet at 10 p.m. We're
we're we're so close to a residential neighborhood because of that. And here today we have proposals where the sunset deck is open and operation operational until midnight and um and other properties neighboring um
residential bordering residential homes is open till midnight. So again little things that I ask you to consider. I've reached out to them and said just just give us a little bit more buffer. I I think they're all reasonable requests. Thank you. Um thank you Philip
Teal. Mr. Teal. Uh, this is the last of one I have signed up for. This is from Mr. Teal coming around. Okay. My name's Philip Teal. I live in 431 Harbor Court. I bought that place in
95 30 years. I I we are concerned about the entrance going into the project from Harbor Court and Bonita Street. I talked to all my neighbors on the
streets, to everyone on Harbor Court and some on Bonita Street, and everyone agreed that we did not want to have dead-end streets on those streets. And it could be done very easily not to have deadend streets. The way they have it
set up right now, they have it where you go into it on a dead end street and you have to go inside of their project to turn around and come back out again. I want to say I've had a marina for 50 years. I just retired from a marina bigger than Moss Marines. So I'm
familiar with property and stuff like that. Anyway, so talking to all the neighbors, there's no way you're going to be able to get a truck like a garbage truck, UPS truck, anybody to go into that property, make a U-turn inside of
that property, and come back out. And if you do allow them to do that, everybody and her brothers are going to come down that road down Third Street and go into those two properties and go into the projects rather than going through. So there's going to be all kinds of people
going in and out 24 hours a day, seven days a week, and it's going to go down Third Street. And we're familiar with that from when Moss Marine had the big M, how they just tear down those streets, you know, they just there's no way you can control it. So we need to keep them
from if we take a road and we put it from Bonita Street to connect it to Harbor Court, we can make a roundabout. So there would you wouldn't even have to go into the Marina's property into Moss Marine Arch's property. You just go to
their connect the two streets go street back to Harbor Court back out or vice versa. Now, now with the town owns Bonita Street and Harbor Court the end of those two streets, are we going to give them
to the project? No. I talked to Jason Smiles and he said they shouldn't do that. We could take that property and we could take square footage between the end of those two streets. I can show you on here what I'm talking about.
Take this is Third Street coming in going to Harbor Court Urbanita Beach. We could take the end of this property that is owned by Moss by the town and exchange that for a stretch of property
going across here and that would it would be just about the same square footage. Or if they wanted to go all the way across to the channel, they could, but just so enough we can come in, go back around and go back out again. And they could put a fence up, put a gate here on the end of each property so
nobody can go in there because right now if they do, everybody's going to come in there. And if garbage trucks, utilities, everybody comes in with bigger equipment trucks, they're not going to be able to go in, turn around, and come back in. They can do like they're doing now, make their loop, come right back out, type of a thing. So, all
right. Thank you, Phil. That's it. That's all I have signed up. Is there anyone else that would like to speak to Leah? Hi Leah Greg Bonita Street. So you know Tom Torus I I appreciate what he said at the uh last LPA meeting uh during their
last meeting. He stated that statistics can tell any story you want and I can't agree with that more. Data can be manipulated to make anything look viable. So this comment is spoton. So here's just a a simple example of how data can be manipulated to tell a story.
Judith said that the current F density maximum in a in a residential neighborhood is 1.2. So if Moss Marina built their development in that residential neighborhood right now, they're too far or their density, it it would be it would be
literally double than than what they are allowed. Everyone is concerned that density and height, you know, is an issue for all these developments. And again, if this land development wasn't changed and they had to adhere to a 1.2 FAR, which is the max for a residential neighborhood, that'd be almost double it
and you guys would have tossed it right out. So again, the reasoning the residential neighborhood that is not the downtown area, it's not considered a downtown area to a residential commercial neighborhood will now make the Moss Marinas too far look completely
viable and acceptable because instead of comparing it to a 1.2 far max for a residential neighborhood, it'll now be compared to a 2.5 far max for a commercial, making them look like they're coming in after the FAR. But the neighborhood doesn't change. So by the
simplest land use zone change, the destiny allowed in that area because that area hasn't changed. Just the zoning will change will literally double than what it's supposed to be now as a current residential neighborhood. So that's a huge ask and it doesn't even
include the eight deviations and the reduction of 50% in parking. The public benefit should be equally as huge. Dan, I agree with you said what you said and right now I don't see them that they are. Patrick said this project will create a cohesive downtown with two
dynamic bookends as a public benefit. He's actually selling you that one of their biggest deviation requests. Changing the neighborhood from residential to commercial is going to be a public benefit because now it's going to join, you know, the cohesive downtown area. That area is not considered
downtown. It will once you change the zoning change, but it's not right now. So again, he's pitching you that a benefit is actually, you know, a benefit to them. Patrick also said this is consistent with the comp plan. If it was, why in the world would you have to
ask for a land use change, totally changing a neighborhood from residential to commercial? And why would you have to ask for eight deviations? How I don't even understand how that statement could be made. Uh, every public benefit offered from what I've seen is an amenity or a revenue generator. Again,
being sold to you as a public benefit. You have the power. You hold the cards to determine if their basket of benefits, as Patrick said, really justifies this huge request. Please, please, please negotiate. Just four key points. Drainage is key. I think we all
agreed to that. Gates at the entrance. You know, people are going to be using these entrances back and forth. If this was going by your house, would you really want that? This can be simply changed. They've even said, they're willing to put in a gate. So, I ask you to put in a gate. And the last thing, the rooftop bar, again, that's not a
public benefit for me. It's literally looking right down into my neighborhood. So, just ask for some minor changes. Just negotiate. All we need is a little bit. We're almost there because I know these guys are willing to compromise. Okay. Thank you, thank you. Anyone else like to speak? Public
comment. Bill, you want to go first and see you hiding behind the pole there? Yeah, I guess I'll hide behind a pole. Makes two of us. So, um, yeah, there's, you know, I like the way the project looks generally, but I think there's Oh, sorry. Dera
Boulevard. I've been sworn in. Um, so I like the way the project looks, but these, but this this, you know, the comprehensive plan is very clear. no commercial intrusion into residential areas. It was said, it was stated in the original plan. It was reiterated in the modifications from the plan. When you're
taking residential lots and you're turning them into commercial properties, that is the definition of a commercial intrusion into residential areas. And then the areas that are not converted are now a budding a big um commercial lot. I think that when the um when the staff said that right now it doesn't it
doesn't come conform to the comprehensive plan, but if we change a comprehensive plan, it will. It's kind of like me saying I'm on a very very strict diet and I'm compliant but I modified it to include pizza. So I think that it's you know the the statement itself shows is really not consistent
with the comprehensive plan. The other thing is really concerning is the phasing. There's six phases of this project and through all the five phases that area that's supposed to be a buffer is going to be a road for construction and with there's no timeline on it. You're talking six phases with no
timeline. This could go on for decades. Think of what happened at Bay Beach Lane when that uh when the London Bay Tower went up. It was decades after it was originally proposed. So without a timeline um you know the one of the options I see you can do is instead of if this is really going to be a open thing with no timeline and a bunch of
phases, just permit one phase at a time. There's no reason to permit all the phases now. um when you can do one phase and then down the road if they're going to do another one, then you're not binding a future council to the decision that you made that may have decades worth of transitions. I've also been
told by somebody who uh who works in the vacation rental business right now. They're having people leave because of the chaos on the island because the because of all the construction, all things are going on. Now, the downtown is going to be that way for literally decades with this project. So, I think timing and the scope of this project and
the phasing to me causes a lot of concerns. It's going to be a long disruption for downtown. It's going to be a long time before we really see any kind of, you know, benefit from it. And one more thing with things like the ferry, um, you it could be a public
benefit. They commit to it regardless of the finances, but they're saying they're only going to do it as long as it's financially feasible, as long as it's making the money. To me, that becomes an amenity and not a public benefit. public benefit could have some expense to it and then includes a commitment to run it even if it's not um even if it's not
making you the money that you think you need. So, thank you. Thanks, Bill. Can I ask you to put your address on the record as well? I heard Boulevard, but I didn't hear that. 358 80 Boulevard. I'll look for the birthday card now. It's probably not good morning any
longer, but uh hello uh mayor, vice mayor, and and counselors and uh town team. Tom Torerson 301 Plural Circle on our island's commercial rebuild on it. Speaking specifically to
the uh development side, there's a lot of I want what U TPFB got and more. But I want to give less or or in times in some cases I want to give nothing. The Arches project um I have to
really applaud him. Uh I have some um recollection familiarity with uh having to go back and retool and uh I think it was a really good thing for the island and I think what uh the Freelands have done is is a really good thing for the
island as well. um they've been at this for over a year now and and uh really have worked the process and and worked the system in a way that I believe it's it's supposed to be worked for for something this complex and and something of of this scale. It's
a very unique project. It's it's a very unique location. There's there is a bounding public benefit that I see. Uh the developers are credible. They've been there. Um they will deliver. um they are asking for more than what
Margarita Margaritavville got in terms of height and density. But if they commit to more I I well maybe I should say it this way. I I think you can almost touch the finish line and and ring the bell. But um I'd hope that we're not maybe quite there
yet and that there's just a little bit of wood to chop here. Um, I think that uh maybe there's some I hope maybe I shouldn't say I think, but I hope that there's some things that uh aren't too um painful um to impose um on the
project to help further mitigate the the neighborhood impact and and then also um the other one is the phasing and u I really just got into that over the weekend, but uh um I too have concerns about a long duration for this project.
It's a big project. Um, it it's really big and it's it's it's it's a a generational project for the island for sure. Um, it's very it's very impressive. By the way, Ben, it's it's it's it's really impressive the the amount of thought and work that has gone
into this. but thinking through um how how it could possibly be um fewer phases or or a timeline established as to u um completing the project. Um lastly, I
just want to again applaud the the process. I think this is the way it's supposed to work. I applaud the LPA. I applaud you as the council. I applaud the the the the town team and uh the Freelands um and their development team. So, thank you for your time. Thank you.
Anyone else? Couple more back there. A couple more. Darn. Hi. Uh, Robin Atwood, 735 Matanza Court. So, I'm across the canal, though. Um, I'm still very concerned about thinking that any amount of landscaping
and trees is going to make the noise. not carry across that canal. It's on the water. It's just going to carry. Um I do appreciate the try. Um I am very concerned still that this is residential
property that my family has owned for 30 plus years. We are used to quiet evenings in a quiet neighborhood, not a party and a pool and screaming and all the things that go with a commercial in
a commercial area. Um, that's not the life that we bought into down here. Not not at all. Um, it was zoned residential. I I still feel very strongly it should stay residential and if they're going to do something that it still only get that residential hype.
Um, these people are going to be looking in to our lives because we all live on that water side of our homes if we have water. Um, that's where we are at doing our thing. I couldn't tell you anything that out on that road because I'm I'm
not out there. I don't look at that. But I am out there on that deck and on that water all the time. And I don't want all those strangers peeking in on my life. I mean, God knows what they might see, right? So, I I really would like that to
be as less as less people as possible and a lower height helps bring that in. It is residential. Again, that is what we bought into. This is going to affect our property values, everything in our lives. And my father is 85 years old.
I'm not sure he'll the next several years of his life are going to be just pounding and and trucks and it's it's not going to be a pleasant life right there. So, uh anyway, I I hope you consider all those things and uh listen
to what what the people are asking for. Thank you. Thank you, Tim. Good afternoon, council. Um, there are a lot of adjectives. You state your name for the record. I'm sorry. Tim Shadel and don't live on the island any longer,
but I own 103 105 107 Bayar Drive. Um, there's a lot of adjectives that can be used to describe this project, and mentioned two of them, impressive and unique and you know beautiful and
amazing but there are also others that can be other words to describe as massive, intensive and inappropriate. Something we're going to be losing on this marina if this project is allowed to go forward is a real marina.
There's only a handful of them and another one will be coming before you soon. fishtail. We don't know what any of them have planned, but many or all of them could have this same type project planned. And if if Jason, if you could
please put up those slides, please. If you would look at what is there now or was there pre Ian, you'll see five large dry boat storage buildings. And the only person that I've heard really
mention it today is council member Woodson. But those buildings house a lot of votes. And if you look at the wet slips, there are a lot of wet slips. If you
could please go to the next slide of what they propose. Now there are no dry slips. There are very few I mean there is no uh dry boat storage and there is very few wet
slips and it really concerns me that this island this island was a fishing island. It was based on water or sports and you know I used to own a boat and a wave don't anymore but I stored them in
dry uh storage on the island and we're going to lose that. It's zoned marina. I believe it should be a marina because I'm afraid that soon we're not going to have any marinas. We're going to have lots of resorts and beautiful massive tall
uh buildings. And I just I worry that we're going to lose a lot of what this town was based on. And there are a lot of people that are going to be very disappointed to lose those dry uh storage units and the
wet slips. And uh I think that vice mayor had a good good idea about using impact fees for the uh the the wave wall that
we were talking about earlier, the wave mitigation wall. um the island really uh we really could use it and it would be beneficial for a lot of different reasons and those b those impact fees could really go towards that and I think
that'd be a good idea. Thank you Tim. Thank you. Anyone else like to speak during public comment? Seeing none, we'll close public comment. Do you want to do your rebuttal now or do you want to wait a brief
break? We can um we can address a couple issues now. Okay. Megan Straler for the record. We heard a couple of of public comments. I just want to touch on a couple of them
briefly before we get into the details regarding the drainage. This is really more of a development order concept. We've we hear the concerns about the drainage. We're aware of them. Um we've an engineer will be on it will be putting together a drainage plan. It
will be in compliance with the land development code and with South Florida Water Management District. But outside of that there's not too much details or promises or or anything that we can get into right now other than there will be a drainage plan. Um, as far as there's
some I don't know if I would say conflicting comments or concerns, but we did hear about the concern about the Third Street in Bonita and Harbor Court. Um, whether to cut off those turnarounds, have them connected, gate access. One request that we, the
applicant, would would ask of you all is to kind of ponder what you all would like to see for that Third Street and Bonita and Harbor Court. If you all say that you would like to see it gated, we can do so. Uh, one of the concerns, and I'm sure M. Patrick can explain, one of
the concerns is we thought that if it was gated, then you're going to have individuals who entered that street on accident per you utilizing the residential driveways um to turn around. Um, that those are a couple of the points. Patrick, what else did you want
to add? Um, for the record, Patrick Vaness, um, like I could touch upon a few issues. Uh, drainage is one of them, and I think we've we've had a chance to talk to you individually about drainage. There there's a long history associated with
drainage in that area. Um, if you go to your Tetrate Tech report, there are very clear elevations as part of that report. Unfortunately, Moss Marina is the high point of that entire neighborhood and it
doesn't she flowed towards the back bay. It actually flows towards Third Street. So, um, and my understanding in in talking to, uh, our client, uh, the Freelands, um, their father
George had indeed agreed to put some, uh, drainage in some of the, uh, properties, including Mr. Mero's property. Unfortunately because of the elevations there is not
um a positive outflow. The water just by gravity cannot reach to the back bay. Uh again we have um committed to providing an outfall as may be needed by the town. However the
issue isn't very that simple. It's not just about creating an outfall. The natural terrain drains towards Third Street. If we are going to pump anything towards the back bay or the canal where the applicant owns property, it's going to have to be
pumped. So again, this is not a simple uh there's a back drain in my backyard and we can solve the problem that way. I think it will take a concerted effort by the town to address this from a technical standpoint, but we are
interested in doing our part. If there's an easement that's required for a drainage outfall, we are willing to do so. Um, when it comes to um the comp plan amendment, um, if we
could pull up the comp plan uh, presentation, I do want to make a few points associated with that. Um, first of all, we have the opportunity and throughout Florida, throughout all the jurisdictions in Florida, applicants
can ask for a change in the comp plan. Um, while a lot of people want to believe that the comp plan is static and should never be changed, that is simply inaccurate. uh we have state statutes that call for
a review of the comp plan on a regular basis in a 5 to sevenyear period and that the comp plan should be changed on a regular basis to address changing conditions. So we are perfectly within our right to
ask for this comp plan amendment. And what we have to demonstrate is that the comp plan amendment that we are asking for is consistent with the intent and the vision of what is being proposed. So I I just quickly want to touch upon
that. So, um, there was also mention of the, uh, Big M casino. So, when the comp plan was put together and the town incorporated, there was discussion with
the Freeland family about extending the pedestrian commercial onto their property. It was a commercial marina and it made logical sense. However, they ran the big M casino from that property and a lot of people didn't like the big M
casino. So, they were concerned that if they changed their future land use category in any way, it might jeopardize that use. So, that is why they the discussions did not go any further and that was not included.
Um, but what I do want to point out is if you look at what is considered our downtown, it is a logical geographic extension of pedestrian commercial. Again, planning concepts dictate that you look at existing conditions on the
ground. You look at logical boundaries for districts. It ties it together. Then there's always the concern of well is that going to lead to proliferation and further extension of that district. It's
a natural peninsula with natural boundaries that limit further expansion. Also really want to point out that a commercial marina is considered an industrial use. It has coexisted with
the neighbors for years with very little conflict. There have been some issues that have come up through the years as as discussed, but they've co coexisted. Um, what we are requesting is a project that we
believe would be a great asset to this community and that we've done everything we could to mitigate any potential impacts. And we've done that through limiting the uses, the development standards, the buffering, and all the
commitments and conditions that are included as part of this. Um, so when it comes to this idea that the comp plan should not be amended and that we are inconsistent with the comp plan because currently it is not shown as pedestrian
commercial, that just is inaccurate. That's not how land use works. we have the opportunity to request this change and again we are consistent with the intent and the vision for that area it
makes logical sense to extend it. Um so I think we I've got some other uh notes that I've taken but I think we'll probably go into those little details um as we get it further into the
discussion. Um my general feel is those are minor details that we can certainly address but from uh a big picture issue comp plan drainage and um conditions um I think we have
addressed those and provided s significant mitigation and also significant public benefit to justify this. Well, Patrick, before you run off again, respectfully agree to disagree on one part of it, and that's the drainage part.
You're I'll go back to you're asking for substantial substantial change in what has been there for decades. To me, that substantial request should come with a substantial public benefit. I don't think any of your listed public benefits
are substantial in respects to drainage and the impact it's going to have on that neighborhood. I'm going to be pushing very hard that that get addressed. You have to do it for your property. You have to mitigate your own water. But we have had a constant, including you have had a constant issue in that
neighborhood with flooding. To me, a substantial public benefit would be to alleviate that for a neighborhood who is going to have to live with this development should get approved for decades through the building process and thereafter. You heard the public
testimony. The main thing out of every single person's mouth was drainage. We know that as a town, you know that as a neighbor, I think we need to at least the other things I agree some of those things can be worked out that are very minor that we've discussed before and have been brought up here. That to me is
a huge substantial thing that needs to be addressed in order for me to try to keep I think the project's beautiful. I think everything's great. Think there needs to be something built there. But if you can address a major known problem for a residential neighborhood that's
going to be dealing with something that they have never had to deal with because of your substantial request, I don't think that's farfetched to do. And and my response and I understand that my response to that is um it's my understanding that the town has tried to get an easement from some of those
neighbors to drain towards the canal uh on that side of Third Street and no one's been willing to do it. We So then why wouldn't you step up and be the one that does it? We have agreed to provide an outfall on your property that you've said slopes to the back bay
already and and so where does that leave everybody that abuts you that's going to continue to flood. So we are going to manage our own water which you're required to do. Everything else exactly everything else is an existing condition and drainage of the roadways is a town
responsibility. Um so what we are doing is we are providing the ability for an outfall which doesn't exist. The rest of the maintenance and the management of that water is a town responsibility. By all means if the town wants to put a
pump station and send it through our outfall location, we are happy to comply and we are providing it which is above and beyond what any of the neighbor in that comm community has been willing to do. So from from the standpoint of where
does the water go? We are contributing and helping. I'm just saying that keep in mind that the solution isn't that easy. There will we'll need some pumps to address that and that is a responsibility of the public works
um side of this town. I won't disagree with the point, but the point of a public benefit is to be a town public benefit. That would be a significant town public benefit, not just a neighborhood. Would you agree with that if you were to address that
situation? Should it be? Yes. But there's there's a long list of other things we could tag on, you know, that would be public benefits. But we've presented a basket. We don't think this one we don't believe that there's a a true nexus between roadway drainage and
our project, but there is an ability to provide an outfall on our property associated with our property, and we are willing to do so. Well, again, I don't want to keep belaboring it, but I'm just trying to get this out there so that my fellow council members know where I'm coming from as we continue to discuss
this throughout the rest of the hearing. the traffic. I don't know that there's going to be a good solution to that. I think even the residents understand that whether you have a gate, you don't have a gate, people are going to inherently drive down that road. We all know it. The neighborhood knows it. That's not something I don't think there's a magic
fix for to the drainage. We both know that there is a fix for it. We both know it can be done. Yes. Is it work? Yes. Does it cost money? Yes. But it's something that can be addressed and would be a significant town and public benefit that I think you
can address with the help of the town. Maybe it can be addressed. Controlling somebody who's coming in in the middle of the day in their car, I don't know, short of blocking off that entire neighborhood, how you're going to keep them from driving down that road. Doesn't mean we can't and we won't try to mitigate it. But that drainage thing
is very very huge for the town, for that neighborhood, and for me to to make this go to the next step, which I certainly want to do, but I want you to help me get to that. Yes, that's that's what I'm trying to get at. I guess I I don't understand. Maybe some someone can help me, maybe someone from staff. Our
understanding is their biggest hurdle is having a drainage outfall and we are providing that. So I feel that we are responsive and we are providing that solution. That's the biggest hurdle and we we've agreed to do
so. So I I I think I I don't fully understand what's being asked of us, but but I think our discussions with staff is we want a um we want a drainage outfall and we are willing to provide that. I think you know echo Dan's
sentiment. I'm I'm kind of in that camp too, Patrick. I I want this situation resolved sooner rather than later. I don't want to wait 10 years for that street not to flood. So I I think it if we can all work together to come up with a solution for that
drainage program and you guys are the are the the biggest bulk of that. I mean that's I I think that's what we're asking for here is not to ignore it, not to just say, "Hey, we'll give you an outfall, but to help us find a solution, working with staff, working with Tetra Tech, working with everyone to find a
solution." I think that that would help I don't now I don't know how you can codify that but I I mean well that's what I'm asking is help us understand what that solution is in that we've we've asked and what we've been told is what we what we'd like from you guys is
an outfall and we said bingo we are willing to provide that. So, so again, we just need to understand what what that could look like and what would be expected from the applicant. We
don't even understand it. I Well, if you want, I will elaborate. I've elaborated with you in our private meeting, but I will do it in this meeting if you that's what you're requesting. There are two properties that are available on Third Street that could work. As you testified earlier, you are the high point. your
water drains towards the Backbay, does not drain towards the Third Street Canal. Those potentially could solve several issues that I've brought up along the way. Those two properties could potentially, one of the two could potentially solve the drainage issue that we have as far as the easement and
that neighborhood draining. And it could solve the potential never seeing the end of when that public park linear park is going to be completed because it is in the final phase and it's going it could potentially without benchmarks could potentially be a decade if you want to look at Matanza's CPD that just got
extended for another five years. It's an approval that has gone nowhere. This not saying that it would I freelance have been here for four decades or longer. I trustly that they're the best partners we could have for that property. However, if you just look at Matanza's CPD, it got expanded for five years.
There's pro there's no end in sight in that. Is that CPD never going to get developed? So, what we're talking about here is trying to create something that eliminates phases, which I think is detrimental to this whole project. Fixes a drainage issue and provides a park that you could potentially put the money
from that you're going to use as your construction easement linear park to something that could fix an outfall issue. It can fix the drainage issue in that neighborhood and it could fix a lineal park that people could as a town including your guests enjoy immediately
versus potentially 5 years, 10 years or never. So that would be my envision on how to try to fix this issue. That would be a significant public benefit that would move the needle quite off quite quite far for me because that solves a lot of the issues that we've heard from the
residents, from town staff and at least mine. I we haven't had a chance to excuse me hear from the the fellow counselors yet, but that's something to throw out there to discuss. And I think I think I'd be remiss if I if I don't address this.
Um, I I think that we at one point should go to recess and I want to con I want to have a conversation with my team,
but this project is given and is given and starting to negotiate little bits and pieces at the last hour like this to me is not I I don't think it's consistent with
the spirit of how CPDs should be assessed. Um we have provided our basket. Uh again, if we're going to take another benefit on, should we remove
another one? Do you want us to start removing the ferry, for example? Do you want So, so again, I I don't understand this last hour. Let's ask for a little more. Let's let's let's try to get more out of the developer. We think what we
have provided is a very significant benefit. I think it justifies um what we're asking for. Uh we are fine with you weighing it the way that you guys want to weigh it individually, but again there's certain
things that we can and we cannot do that those properties along Third Street are privately owned. We do not own those properties. We can't be asked to do something that is not on our property. I'm also assuming that some of
those ne th those properties have neighbors and those neighbors may not be happy about a park being in there. More so more so is the linear park that we are providing is fully within the
property boundary of this resort. It's going to be managed. It's going to be completely confined within our boundary and we are directing all our traffic, all our guest experience through that
resort. The idea is to minimize intrusion into the neighborhood. And by putting a park along Third Street, you are now encouraging people to go through that neighborhood to go to a park where you have residential on both sides. But you know what won't go through that
park? dump trucks, front end loaders, backup beers, back hoes, dirt, people peeing in the bushes. That won't happen in all the construction is going to be limited to our property, just like any other commercial project on this island. And just like any other
residential project, when I reserve my home, uh I I'm not supposed to use my neighbor's property. Same thing here. it would be relegated to this property. Um, we are not going to be using Bonita Road
or Harbor or Third Street for construction access. So, again, help me understand what we're trying to get at here because because I'm a little confused. Well, maybe you're right. This is probably a good time for a break.
Yeah, we've thrown a lot of information out there that obviously you probably want to discuss. I'm sure my council members are getting hungry. Fellow council members are getting hungry. Could I just a quick quick nonsequator question just to clarify the record. One of the public comments referenced that the number of wet slips would uh
decline. I thought you were actually increasing the number. That's an increase. Uh I think we're around 55 and we're going to 75. That's what I thought. I just wanted to make sure I understood that for the record. Thank you. I'm sure you've got several of those small ones that we can discuss. Yeah. And and before we leave also just if we're talking about marinas, I I do
want to provide this policy for you again in your comp plan. Again, if we're going to put any weight into the rules, let's
really look at the rules. Okay, so under this policy, I want to point to the very last line. Okay. So, there's a a history under that policy that explains why that policy is in place. And it talks about
Lee County and Lee County reszoning some of those properties, all the marinas on this island to Marina. And if you look what's highlighted in green, the purpose of resoning was to protect their rights, the marina's
rights to rebuild and expand and to prevent their conversion to nonwater dependent uses without a public hearing. Again, the idea wasn't to to protect that use for everybody else on the island. It was to protect the rights of
the marina owner. And as I mentioned, this marina owner is now coming before you to change their zoning. But again, the marina policy was not there to ensure that the general public will
have marinas in perpetuity. Thank you. All right. Thanks, Patrick. We'll take a How long a break? 15 minutes. There's food in the other trailer. What time is one for? We'll we'll break till 2 o'clock. How's that? Going to be
enough time for every back on. All right, we'll call this meeting back to order. It is 207. Where do we leave off? Should we go to Megan? Would you like to continue on or Patrick or would you like us to
Absolutely. So, we heard a couple of concerns and complaints. It's obvious that the the drainage is a primary focus uh for you. We would ask that the town staff be coordinated or directed to work with us. We can bring it back, talk with
them to see if we can figure out something. Um you know, these public benefits that we are providing and that the the comprehensive plan and the code requires that has to be reasonably related to the development. If they if that nexus is not drawn or is not
connected then they can be start to be considered what are called exactions which are not lawful uh in the state of Florida. So we are trying to make sure that we are providing as much public benefits as humanly possible that are reasonably related to our property.
Fixing the drainage on our property yes but fixing the drainage period um becomes a little dicey. Not to say that we're not willing to work with staff and work with public works to figure out if there's something that we can do. So, allow us to take that back to the
drawing board and we can maybe come forward at the second hearing uh with more information about the drainage. Can you help me to understand though why if there's drainage on a neighbor's property that was put in by Moss Marina, why that wouldn't be consistent? My my
understanding is that the the poor drainage of Third Street and somebody who's much more knowledge knowledgeable than me, please correct me if I'm wrong, a lot of the drainage that's on Third Street is due to the town infrastructure itself, not necessarily from Moss Marina
property. Um once Moss Marina becomes developed, we will have our own drainage plan. It will be consistent with the south it'll have have to go through South Florida Water Management District. They have their own criteria that they look at of making sure that your water stays on your property. It is, you know,
retained, treated, and outfall. Yeah. But what I'm referring to is what I heard a a resident say is there's uh drains that were put on his property that he's even had to maintain that were lost. That's not necessarily true. There those drains are on their property, but
they've built the wall leeward of it. So the the drains are actually on Moss' property, but the fence is on on Moss's side. My my understanding, and for the record, Patrick Vaness, my understanding, and uh this is is coming from my conversations
with Ben Freeland, is it was done at a time where the town had not explored the technicalities of this. There was no drainage master plan. Um, it was someone at the town that had asked George Freeland to maybe put in those drainage
and to try to direct the water towards the back bay. It was a good idea, but in practice, it just did not work. The elevations and there was no you couldn't um to get the right uh slope to get the
water to the canal. By the time you slope it far enough, you're hitting water. So there is no positive outfall. So that's the problem. They gave it a shot. They were doing their best at the time with limited information. It just technically doesn't work.
Patrick, made me think of a question. Yeah. Is your expertise in drainage or is what you're saying just your opinion? As I mentioned, I am relaying that from my conversation with Ben Freeland. And again, it's it's not my expertise. Your expertise is not in drainage. Exactly.
Maybe we need to have someone who has an expertise and that's why we are more than happy to talk to your staff and see if there is a potential viable solution. I just want to make sure that we're not
my interpretation or your testimony not being an expert is not an interpretation of what exactly how water drains or isn't draining and where is it cooling or not cooling. We need to get an expert to look at that. Well, of course. Then there will be an engineer that's going to be designing all of this drainage for
for the development. I mean, we have to have that anyway. So, we hear a concern. We hear that that area needs assistance with the drainage. Mr. Freeland has agreed to provide an area for the outfall or the pipe for the outfall. Um, if there are additional requests coming
from the town, allow us to work with town staff to figure out what those additional requests are and if we are able to address that. Regarding the drainage um for the phasing, there was a couple of comments pertaining to the concern about the
last, you know, the last sixth phase pertains to installing that linear. Could I stop you since we did we went quickly through the uh uh PowerPoint which was which was fine because we watched the LPA meeting, but would you just give a little refresher course on
the phasing just so we all are talking from the same singing from the same himnil here? or anybody anybody whatever whoever's best if you've got it that's fine you talk fast that's good I am fast the court
reporters faster than Ken, I love I love Ken. You're a fast talker here. There are six phases. Well, well, we're looking for a slide. I'll I'll just briefly uh review the six phases that are being proposed. So, phase one is the building a Let's see if there's a
concept plan if this is going to work. Did it turn off? Maybe building the phase one is building A. Clicker is not working. Okay, sorry. Building A is uh which is
fronting the old San Carlos and Third Street to include the Bedadega corner store restaurant outdoor market and the third street improvements and the portion of Archesway. That's phase one. Phase two here you go is the reconfiguration of the Marina basin. When you say phase one, is it then you
have some dates that you're ranging or there's not dates included in here right now. Um, this is also during the recess. Uh, we were looking at the phasing and and we noticed internally, hey, we might need to be rearranging some of this or
combining. So, one of our requests was going to be allow us to go back, talk with Mr. work as a team and finesse this sixth phasing approach to bring back to the second hearing. But I can certainly go through just for the public that's watching when you when you when you
think about just broad dates, do you have a can you give a general? Um, we don't have any dates right now. Jimmy, in all fairness to the applicant, I mean, it's going to be based on market conditions, financing, and everything else. I mean, well, I appreciate that. I'm I'm asking the applicant if you had
We do not have any data. I'm not being critical. I'm just asking. So, you don't you don't you don't envision any particular timeline? No, not at this point. And I and I think um council brings up a good point about if it was up to the developer, everything would be done at once. But that's the cheapest,
quickest, easiest way to address it. However, due to market conditions, due to, you know, right, I I appreciate that. But usually when you reference phases, sometimes there's usually some goals at least connected to them. So, I'm I'm just asking. It doesn't sound like that there's we have not we have
not included that. So that's something we can consider moving forward. Right now it's just the very fundamental. So it's a it's a financing piece. You're going to finance it in phases. Is that is that more of an applicant question? That would be more of an applicant question, but usually these are financed
um you know all together at once. It's just the it's just the construction. So there might be phases to that. I think I just contradicted myself. That's okay. Let me ask Ben if just could you help us just understand what when you when when we you were using the term phasing. Is
it is it a construction dynamic for you? Is it a financing dynamic? Just walk us through because conceptually in your head it's for flexibility based on all those conditions. So there's a lot of things in the market we don't control. So it gives you the ability to put phases in as you move through. I think
we can consolidate some of those phases because really you're not we think we can probably get it down to three or four phases and then that would probably make it simpler. So, um, and I think and maybe coordinate it where the, uh, the buffer gets built maybe with those phases and doesn't have to be the last
phase. So, I think we're finding some ways we can change those. Those were just put in for flexibility. I'm just trying to understand for the unknown right now, you know, capital markets, uh, government issues, uh, you know, all the things that could pop up that we're
we're in the midst of today. I understand that's the reason for it. So, um I don't think there was any, uh intelligent construction program for that. Gotcha. I think we can clean it up and simplify some concerns here. Gotcha. Thank you. Ben, before you run off, just since
we're on the phasing part of it, I want I'd rather ask you directly. Have you sit down and come back up? I certainly am sympathetic to market and how, you know, flexibility and we talked in our meeting about flexibility. I totally understand that. What do you say to the residents though and the rest of the
community that the uncertainty, you know, I use the word benchmark, the uncertainty of if I have no doubt that you know, you're a good operator and I've seen your projects. I know exactly what you guys do. It's not a question of if you're going to do it. Um the when to me it it if I'm a homeowner in that
neighborhood, what can you tell me that's going to alleviate my concerns that it could be 10 years, it could be 15 years, we could be like um the tanzas that's sitting there with nothing ever coming out of the ground, but yet it's been approved. Um how can you comfort me as a as a neighbor if I'm asking you
with these phasing? Well, we're there operating today and you know, we would continue to operate as a going concern as we are now and as the market finds its way, we get through this process. I mean, if I want to expedite this, we're still a few years out from anything
breaking ground if we were on the fast track. So, um, but we'll still be a good neighbor. We'll be operating as a a full service marina and as this project works through, we're going to be, you know, part and parcel of the neighborhood as we've always have been. So, um, you know, we want to get to it as quick as
possible. There's no advantage of us staying, um, kind of in limbo. You know, we've been there for a couple years and so our goal is to go as fast as possible, but we do need some coordination with the market and, um, to to come with us at the timeline. So, um, I don't think there's any advantage of
us sitting on our heels and waiting. Otherwise, I would rebuild a marina. It'd be a lot quicker, right? So, um, our incentive is to move as quick as the market's ready to cooperate with us. So, all right. Does that hand answer your question? It does. I mean, I still have
concerns with the phasing part of it. No benchmarking attached to that phasing. I'm not I'm not objective to the phasing. I I liked hearing that you're willing to maybe downsize the amount. Yeah, I think we could group them and then it would be more substantive as as we go. Substantive. I don't know the
word. Yeah, I just have a concern. Yeah, substantial as we go through. Yeah, I just have a concern that this I don't want this to progress for 10, 15, 20 years, you know, because the market goes up or goes down and then, you know, something happens to us, you know, but
to have a project like this move forward and the investment we've already made and we're going to be making as we move forward, um, we we we do need our partners to come along uh come along with us. So, Okay. Thanks, Ben. Would you still like me to run through
how Yeah, I'm good. Okay. Thank you. Excellent. Um, do you want to touch on on a couple of the smaller things that were brought up that you know, maybe if counselors have an issue with some some smaller things that we heard in in public comment?
Sure. So, some of the smaller items that were discussed, you know, I've hear some of the privacy privacy screen requests on some of the sunset rooftop decks. Um, this act, the third street access on Bonita and Harbor Court, uh, whether
it's a gate or or what have you. I think what would be most helpful to us, the applicant, is for you as a council, to make a unified kind of guidance or decision as to what you would like to see. um
because if we're trying to appease everybody, there's some conflict within those requests. So, we are open. We want to make small changes. So, if you all could kind of make a deciding motion as to what you want to see. Do you want to see the gates? Do you want to see a
privacy here or a privacy there? We can then go back, work it out with a master console plan and see what what could fix. So, that would be our request is to essentially have more guidance from you all. Well, maybe let's just run through that then since you know some of the smaller things if everybody's okay with it. One of the suggestions that was
brought up over the sunset terrace was having an exter an extra buffer between the railing and the people being able to just lean over the railing. Um, a suggestion was brought up, you know, it could be just planters that doesn't block the view, but it's essentially keeps people from, and I know that's not
something that needs to be in the CPD, but it could be something through this external agreement that you've been talking about, operational agreement, whatever you want to call it, to allow that extra buffer so that people aren't standing on the railing looking down into people's backyards. You're going to go find the
picture. I'm trying to see if there's a there should be a concept on that. It's kind of hard to see, but we'll have to because I agree with Ben. In our meeting, we talked about this and it's an operational thing. Totally understand that. Why wouldn't they want to do it? But just to be able to kind of codify it a little bit that it would be in an
agreement that this would be something that would prevent people from leaning over that railing on that Sunset Terrace to be able to look into those neighboring properties would be something I'd be interested in seeing. So, mayor, would you be okay if we could creatively come up with some wording to actually put that in the CPD because I
think that that relates to the landscaping of the project. And so, yeah, that may be again when these things come up, we have to figure out does it go in the CPD or does it go somewhere else? Well, I'll follow your guidance as to where you feel it's most beneficial. Thank you. No, I agree that
that would be in the uh commercial plan development. It would be it would be depicted on the master concept plan as well. So, what I'm hearing is a request for some sort of an additional buffer by the Sunset Terrace so that people aren't leaning over the side. That's That's
what I heard. Did you me hear anything? Yeah, I heard the same thing. Same thing. That makes sense. Okay. Along the landscaping lines, though, I I I don't know if I heard it today, but I did hear it from a neighbor that, you know, if if you plant what you picture, then I think
people are going to be okay with that. And if you can just maximize the landscaping, that would be a good buffer as well. Okay. One one issue that was brought up that we haven't discussed yet is is the is
the different terraces with the different times of music. I I think it'd be much e easier to have each terrace has the same deal and that's fine. There was a quite a bit of discussion at LPA about
um the coop at the building E the sensitive terrace and building B. So we are if you would like to go through that I I don't know what the answer is but I I think one unified hey didn't we red didn't you reduce it to
900 p.m. I I don't mind reducing. I just with those one terrace has one deal, one terrace has another deal. It's it's wouldn't seem that whether you're on the water or or behind you that neighbors are neighbors. So you should have one I agree and I I'm not trying to throttle
everything back. I just want, you know, we can can agree on one one time. It's it's it's easier for code enforcement, too. I I understand. I think the the the logic or the theory behind having these different times and different hours is really um as Mr. Veness was was
indicating the gradient of intensity density. So trying to keep you know the hub of action if you will in the center while also making sure that building E which is overlooking the canal is not a loud party zone necessarily.
Um, if you want to make them mute, if I did Ben Freeland, um, I would request 900 PM because of the the the hour after sunset in the winter at 7:00, right? That's 6:30. If you want to make him unified, I would recommend that. I'm fine with that. So, what about the
midnight part of it? That that that gives me a little angst, too. It's, you know, living on the water, we know you can hear two miles away people's conversations. Well, especially when one of the neighbors had a concern that uh old San Carlos basically they said shuts down at
10 o'clock and you'll be going till midnight. Um for the record, Patrick Vaness, um I I think what we did um what we were trying to do is really look at the individual terraces and how they're
being used and where they are geographically on the project. and we were trying to cater the the limitations associated with that. So obviously between buildings B and C that's the mode that's the
um the the the the the centralized activity for the hotel guests. You're going to have um a restaurant there uh that's going to be overlooking that deck. There's also going to be a uh a
bar um outdoor bar there. Again, this is designed and pushed towards the waterfront um and towards downtown um there's buildings there to buffer
things. So, we we thought that area should have a separate time uh because conditions are different, the buffering is different. Same thing with the um the events chapel in the building. Building was designed completely to buffer that
activity from the neighborhood. So again we had uh different times associated with that completely understand that building is along the canal and uh we were fine with limitations associated with that. Um and then building A, we
kind of looked at that building similar to other um restaurants and entertainment venues along Old St. Carlos that are open till later. Um so personally, my my experience of
going out downtown, I I've been out for drinks past 10 on a regular basis. So, I I certainly do understand this idea of limiting things and being uh respectful of of the concerns from the neighbors, but again, we we we spend a lot of time,
a lot of thought behind it. I think what I would prefer is that we look at at what we've outlined and we spend time also with staff going back and forth on those and and I think a lot of thought was put into it. So, um, again, uh, I
know you'll have your own opinions and we are willing to listen, but that's why we we've got differing times. Go ahead, Karen. Can I address this um diagram that was given to us by Mr. Teal? So, this is about creating a
roundabout within the neighborhood. Um, and the ends of these streets, I don't know if you guys had a chance to look at this, but the ends of these streets all the way up here are actually still owned by the
town. So, so in in my mind, it would have to be a coordination between Arch's Bayfront and the town to actually make this even possible. And I don't know what all is
involved with that. At the very minimum, I would like to see gates, not keeping those streets open and having a turnaround within Arches, but at the very minimum, a gate at the end of Bonita, a gate at the end of Harbor
Court that ex, you know, basically says this is not a through street. and even signage at the front of Third Street uh Fold San Carlos that basically says not a through street, no exit, whatever the
proper verbiage is. Um but this this whole piece of this by creating this internal culde-sac on the neighborhood side, I think has to be something that works together with
Arches and the town. Correct. Okay. So, that's something that we can look at before June 2nd. So, you're saying you you'd be in support of creating that through street? Well,
I'm me personally, I don't see the benefit of creating this through street, but I want to find out from the powers that be of how this would possibly work and what benefits there might be. That's why I say at a very minimum for me it's
like block this off. Don't let through streets occur and have signage at the front. But if I'm missing something, that's what the town experts and all that can tell me. The other thing was talked about is and
and I'm assuming Dan when you talked about um looking at empty lots that you were talking about the one at the beginning of Third Street the 900 something 910 or 9 where it's across
it's mainly across at the beginning it's up for sale. Is that the open lot you were talking about? There's one there. Yes. I don't know what the exact number is. I don't either, but it's next to the big the White House that's for sale. Yes, it's to the be to the east of that. Yes. Okay.
So, I mean, I'm speaking as a resident here. I don't know that I want to have a park there because I don't want to bring all the people from Arches over to a park in our neighborhood. I mean, there
gives no benefit to that if we're closing off Harbor Court and Bonita Street and then we're opening up a park so that people can walk over. So, I say I don't want to consider that one at
all. But that's just my opinion. Well, the park wasn't the main focus. The main focus was drainage of your neighborhood. And I get that, but I think and I'm no drainage expert and neither is Patrick. So, you know, having someone look, does it make is it
beneficial to do it? Let an expert tell us, right? But there could also be an easement to whoever purchases that and not create a park there. Well, so far there's been no one in your neighborhood willing to give an
easement. I know it's you're you're you're speaking of someone might give an easement. and not well I know that but I'm also the other option was to create create a pumping station to pump it the right direction.
So where are you going to put the pump? You don't want it in your neighborhood. I didn't say I didn't want it in the neighborhood. I'm just saying a pump station to put it somewhere wherever it may be. I don't know how far in it has to go. Again, I'm not a drainage expert either, but these are things that have
to be answered. But to actually create a park on Third Street would not be a solution. I don't think that's all I got. Okay, we can have a difference of opinion. That's fine. I just the the point of me
bringing that up was to, you know, there's no end in sight as to when that public benefit, quote unquote, public benefit of a linear park is ever going to come to fruition. And if you're living in that neighborhood and that's being sold as a public benefit or if you live in the town as in a whole and
that's being sold as a public benefit, are you and I even going to be alive to see that public benefit or will someone's kids be able to see it? That that was more of the concern and it being used as a construction easement to be able to drive through there for the next decade at least to build these
projects out in phases. That was that's my bigger concern. Yeah. And the drive-thru, I think I had also addressed with them that it was not going to be a construction drive-thru on the residential streets. It was going to come in. No, it's going to go where the park is. So, it's going to be right in
everybody's backyard. It's not going to come through your front yard. It's going to go through your backyard where the linear park is that they they've testified that's what they plan on using for their construction entrance to build this out in phases. That's that's a major concern for me, especially if you
live along those along the back side there. I get that. And if and if one of the deviations is to not have a solid concrete wall to break down that dust and break down everything else, that's a concern for me. You know, just a a a kousa hedge and you know, a decorative fence doesn't block the amount of
construction traffic that you're considering to go through there. So, those are the things and I don't want to say small things because they're significant. my understanding as far as cost and design, but those are things that if it can help mitigate if this proposal moves forward for these residents, I think we should at least at
least discuss it. No, I agree. And I think they're going to come back with that. Correct. You said yes, we would prefer guidance from you all kind of let us go back as a team discuss internally and then we come back from the sec for the second hearing, we can
have some solidified game plans and if something doesn't work, we can explain. Listen, we looked at this and Here's what we found. But that would be our request. So for the sake of expediting this conversation because we could go back and forth back a thousand times perhaps we perhaps we do one item at a
time starting with the gates. We haven't even talked about the gates yet. So let's talk about the gates at the entrance of the two streets, Bonita and and Harbor Court. How does the council feel about having that gated? My initial concern was not the traffic also going
in, but the traffic coming out. Being that that anybody could get in any one of those buildings, get in their car, and exit out into that neighborhood. Does it make sense to gate that off? Is there a bigger concern that people are going to turn around in driveways? I don't know how you're going to mitigate traffic, overflow traffic driving down
that street no matter what you do, but is there a way does gating it make sense to keep traffic from from coming out? Scott, what are your thoughts? My initial thought was uh to gate it,
but I'm this road is intriguing. I I mean I just don't know. I I know we're playing deal or no deal, but um I I I haven't given enough thought. I mean,
you're you're in that neighborhood. I would I would What? Well, and I understand what Mr. Teal is saying about if you created an internal culde-sac on the neighborhood side, that also helps with, you know, our own
residential garbage trucks and everything else so they don't have to go down a street and back out and then go down another street and back out. And where do they turn around? Because those streets are narrow. Well, it it's my understanding that all the services are going to be coming in from Snug Harbor,
right? Yes. So there would be no need for garbage trucks to go down these streets and turn residential. They have no place to turn deliveries. Oh, I see what you're saying. I thought you were talking about for the No, residential. Got it. There's no place for them to turn around. It's
strictly from that. I mean, see, that's that that's when it that was kind of my aha moment because whomever's at the end of that street, I think Miss Mr. Teal is. Yeah. I mean, he's going to have people constantly turn around his driveway and
clean garbage trucks, right? I see you. And FedEx trucks. So, there could be an option to do both so that that culde-sac truly remains neighborhood and you still have the gates that they can't go in and out
of of Arches that way through our streets. Yeah, just a thought that we would for the record Ken Galer neighborhood company. Sorry about that. Are you drainage expert enough?
But uh in relation to this access harbor bonita is utilizing the gate system, but that would be further interior is thinking this big picture. we would bring back a revised plan and then utilizing what they call hammerhead turn
turnarounds. So it's basically you come in and it gives you a three-point ability to then come back out. So you'd have the gate system that would provide the restrictive coming and going, but if somebody was to go down,
they would utilize the hammerhead system uh turnaround driveways then to come back down through harbor. So that's something that we're wanting to bring back to you. And so that's an idea and we just wanted to Yeah, that's that's a
good idea. So the one thing with road we're going to have to drain it. We're going to have to to decide where the so we could integrate it through the landscape are adding a road is you just add a road
on the road complicated you build a road they will exactly that's our not that I'm a transportation we came with them well I would get I would hope I would think that's your hope for Arch's way you build a road they will come and that's where our design is integrating let's
bring those people down utilizing the proper signage uh to restrict neighborhood only no through street et well if you can come back with some sort of plan for the we can certainly do that would that would be great it kind of help us too um I want to I want to
change my pat made a good point I I'd ask that all um hours be unified that's that's after hearing Pat that's probably not a good idea especially on the back end but I I'm
still questioning this midnight closing. Yeah, I'm not a big fan of that because, you know, midnight turns into one o'clock by the time Well, I mean, if if you look at uh there's I'm not going to say whom there there's a place that has later hours and
it's it's like a nightclub in Miami some nights with bad singing. Really bad singing. Really bad singing. It's like a cat against a wall. Deputy cat scratch fever. So, we I think we've got some direction
as far as the gates and an idea. Just to clar, we'd like that direction that you're okay with us bringing back that. Yes, absolutely. But I I I'm still having a hard time with midnight closing up there. I think it should be consistent with the other
businesses in that area. I support I would support the view with that. Jim, I I'm I don't know exactly what are we talking about closing? Are we talking about amplified music? We talking about
ambient music. It says the hours of operation on page This is the rooftop. Yeah, the rooftop. All of them. I think I think it my understanding was wanting everything to be consistent. No, no, I I backtracked
that. Backtracking that. Yeah. So, focusing on the locations of the cop, the music, the noise. No, the hours oper I'm more concerned with the hours of operation. I we we can drill down later and decide when the music is, but the
um on page 197 hours commercial restaurant open 7 a.m. to midnight. Pool deck buildings BNC till midnight. I think that's a little late in my opinion. I don't want to be old
stodgy guy, but but you will. I will be. So what is your recommendation? Uh probably 10 for sure noise at n for sure noise at 9 but operation till 10. I don't know very
many restaurants down in that area that sir I mean how how late is so s open right now until 10 10 is it what's what is the the rule downtown? What can businesses be opened on old St. Carlos? Because we're seeing times till midnight, one in the morning
for Yucatan and other. So what? Yeah. So I don't Frankie, how about we we get that information? Can we be consistent with what? How about that? I'm agreeable. What's consistent with
whatever the rule is, that's fine. Well, the the issue the issue, Ben, that I have with being consistent, not that I'm not open to discussing that, but being consistent with what Old San Carlos is. You've got some things that are very close to residential neighborhoods as
opposed to where Old San Carlos is. That could have an effect on their quality of life. There's I think we're only talking about the ones that aren't next to our residential. We've already limited the cafe or the sunset deck and we've limited the canal. We're talking about
the other part of the resort. Yeah. BNC says 7 a.m. to midnight. The pool deck on BNC. Yeah. That's that's on the bay side. That's not on the residential side. And they're screened by the buildings. That's the one by the chapel. So the sunset deck is the one that that
that one's still midnight. That's already limited, right? Yeah. Well, it still says in here that it's midnight. It says the hours of operation are 7N till midnight. Ambient music is permitted from 7 a.m. to 9, but the hours of reduce the music. Yes. So that only ambient music is allowed on the
sunset deck. Ambient music is permitted from 7 a.m. to 9:00 p.m. And I think what you're trying to say, Scott, is on the sunset deck specifically. Well, if so, there's one deck that fa that's by the chapel that faces the back bay. Correct. I'm okay
with that being open because there's that's the events chip out there. That's that's their events thing. You can't close down a wedding at 9 or 10 o'clock. What I'm talking about is that restaurant right there on the corner of Old San Carlos in that deck overlooking Third Street. So, building A and
building B. I understand what what you're saying. I just want to look at our renderings. We we have two decks um that are fronting the bay and I think those two decks in my mind
would have um later operation hours. So what you see here, okay, the the midpoint between buildings B and C is the pool deck and the main restaurant for the for the hotel is right on that
deck. So that's one deck. It's it's facing towards the bay. Yeah. And my understanding is that's the hub of activity and that's where I would see that being open later. But what deck is facing third street? That's the sunset
deck on top. That's in building. So if you Let's go to Okay. So if you look to the right. Yeah. Yeah. That's Yes. That's the one that we've we've limited um the ambient sound associated with that one, but that's
still open till midnight. Uh hours of operation till midnight right now. Ambient sound off at what time? 9:00. Um and then the other thing I want to clarify is that the events deck where
the chapel is, same thing. This is completely surrounded by building. Yeah, that's fine. I'm fine with that one. That one. So, I think what we're talking about is the sunset deck and the pool deck. And we've we've limited the ambient sound and hours of operation,
but again, we understand that those would be different. And we are open to to that discussion for sure. We would like to keep the events deck and the main deck by the the main restaurant open till 12. This is just for weddings.
my not just for weddings, but look, my my my preference things close early here, but I know I know if you have a late sunset and you go to dinner after sunset, I've I've walked out of restaurants at at 11 at night on a regular basis. It might be the French
heritage. I like to go to dinner late, but but I think it just provides a little flexibility, a little leeway, especially when people are on vacation. They like to dine later. Uh but but again, you know, like a lot of these restaurants and I'm curious to see what
the regulations are on Old St. Carlos. I think they have the opportunity to open later, but it's just that the market dictates that it when things are quiet, you send your people home, you don't stay open, and things things tend to close relatively early, but they have the opportunity to open later. But maybe
we can have direction on that. Mayor, I think Tom has some information on the on. So, our ordinances follow the Florida state statutes. Tom, Thomas Yazo, emergency services director, Fort Myers Beach. Our ordinances follow the
statutes that Florida regulates with alcoholic beverages. They're from 7 o'clock in the morning till 2:00 a.m. What we do, we've restricted the back with our noise ordinances. So, our noise and ordinances are in effect before the 2 am. So, they can be open serving till
2 am according to the Florida statute and our ordinances would follow that on anywhere on the island. On the island, it's article, it's chapter 4, article 2, section 4-9. But there's nothing in that statute that
says you can't be more restrictive. Is there? We would have to change our ordinances to to accommodate being more restrictive. Do you agree with that, Nancy? Um, currently our ordinance is not restrictive. Is that what you're saying? Correct. Yes, we would have to change
our ordinances then. To the time. Yes. So then we've done that. But then perhaps changing the wording within this would be to coincide with town ordinances versus I mean if we're regulated by state statute that we have to do something our town ordinance
would have to follow that state statute or be more restrictive or be more restrictive. Right. Okay. That was my question. So you can be more restrictive on a local ordinance or the state statute. Scott, this is your thing. Is it is it
one of your things? something. It's not It's not a deal breaker. It's trying to be good to have these guys be good neighbors, but it sounds like maybe, you know, I don't want to speak for Patrick or Ben, but maybe these two areas, it sounds like you're open to at least the discussion of limiting the the hours at
those two locations are open. Yeah. Well, I can clarify. I think we got on this when we were talking about the backside of the Bodega restaurant that's up there. Okay. I'm willing to restrict the outside uh deck to the same restrictions we have
with the sunset deck with ambient music and yeah the other part of the restaurant that's facing third street I would like to be normal and the other two decks that are on the bay that we discussed in buildings B and C I believe that's a good compromise. All right.
Does that make sense? Yes, sir. And we'll clarify that so we get it right. But if we get the gist, all the decks, open decks that are facing the residential neighborhoods would have the same restriction that we've already agreed. And anything anything facing old St. Carlos for the bay on the canal like
will be the town ordinance. And if you guys change the ordinance, well, I still have concerns with the the two that face the neighborhoods or the three that face the neighborhood. Right now it says you can be open till midnight, but ambient use music stops at 9. Are are you saying you want to keep it at midnight or are
you willing to move it back to 10 o'clock for those that face not the one that faces the bay that Patrick talked about and not the one that faces Old San Carlos Boulevard but the three that overlook you know I'm trying to think as an operator
now what would you to um what do you think they're going to be doing up there doing like dancing in the dark? I don't know what they're going to be Well, I don't know. I think this is Well, this is this is I mean this is this is just trying to alleviate some of the concerns that the
residents, right? But I mean if you're up there having cocktails and finish up your night, is that a problem if there's no music and you like it's wrapping up? Karen, you live there. I mean, asking Karen, I'm just trying to I guess I don't operate bars
consistently, so I'm trying to think through if I ran that operation, what I would need or or I guess we could push them to the other Well, I I've I've never been to a bar, but I know that today I I know that, you know, there
seems to be a rush for last call, especially places that close. So, even though you may close at 10 o'clock, you could be there till 11 anyway. I can we make it 11? Does that sound fair? You know, my biggest thing is the ones that face the houses, whether so it's
Third Street, that type of thing. I mean, we all Yeah, we all know how loud people get, the later it gets. They've been drinking and they have another drink and and fine if it it's 11 o'clock or 10 o'clock or whatever it is, but
they're going to be loud. Yeah. and we'll have three other venues we can move them to. So, I think we'll be good with the 10. Okay. Yeah. My my other question, if I'm still on the floor, go with it the the val the
parking in the garage. Is it I've heard valet I've had some residents say that it's not all valet. Which which is it for clarification? Um
asking about the parking. Is it all valet? Some valet? No valet? At this point, valet service would be offered. However, our calculations did not provide more parking spaces by stacking.
Um I didn't ask about stacking. I'm saying in in the parking garage, are we going to have It's going to be It's going to be both uh self park and valley both. What if you just went to straight valet to eliminate that potential of anybody driving out of those parking
garages and then down the streets? I I I like the idea of the gate. I thought that was a good suggestion. And and also just to clarify so you guys understand, the only place they could leave is at the
harbor court uh entrance exit. Okay. The other one, it's when you go from buildings B and C to building D. That's second floor elevated and no one can get out there. They have to go down and go
to Harbor Court to get out. for harbor court is the only way someone that's driving their their own car could access. But I think the idea of the the gate that you suggested I think is is a great idea. Um at when we talked one-on-one we were thinking more of
people going in not people going out and with the understanding of that concern the gate makes a lot of sense to us. So if they if you had the gate then at Harbor Court Yeah. where and they came out of the parking garage, where would they end up exiting?
Well, what what we want is we want everybody to drive through the resort and exit on Arch's way. On Arch's way in Old San Carlos. Yes. Okay. So, if you had the gates up there, there would be nobody coming out of the correct into
the neighborhood. Correct. Okay. So, then how would I suppose it all works out through technology as far as fire and rescue getting in uh fire and rescue. Yeah, they their own access. I think we if we combine that with the uh hammerheads that we talked
about. So for other vehicles, you know, obviously fire trucks, we talked about how they they can just drive over the linear park area where it would be stabilized subgrade. Um and we've run that by them, so they're okay with that.
Uh, but for any other vehicles, if we did the the little hammerhead, that would allow for a three-point turn, people can get back in. I think residents should have their own little access code to get through and just walk through a residential gate. Here we go. We have a residential walkway. I'll let
Ben handle that one. Zip lines, whatever. With spikes on the other side. What do you want me to give? Uh, last thing, have had several emails asking if if not on your resort
owned restaurants. Um, maybe having a local discount. Hollow Margaritavville. I understand that if somebody's renting space from you, they can't do that. But put that in consideration. Patrick, and specifically the 25%
discount as I've been reading. I I don't want to speak for Ben here, but here's a general suggestion. We have a chamber of commerce. When I lived in Key West, is there a question? There was a local cart and I would say
98% of the business participated in that program. It was it was through the chamber. You showed that you were a local with driver's license or or bills and you got your locals card and most establishments on the island honor that
locals card because there was a benefit to cater to those patrons because we have an offseason and you want to keep those locals happy. So this comes up all the time. It's kind of an awkward thing to deal with. I I I
love this idea of just let's get a vocals car going throughout the island. The difficulty with that's going to be we have a lot of independent businesses that are going to be there. I I wouldn't I didn't ask I didn't ask for for those businesses. I understand they they've got their profit
margin. Again, how we regulate it? I I mean No. Okay. It's one of those things. I think it sounds easy and then how do you enforce it? I mean, I had a lot of emails. I I promised I'd ask the question. What's the discount that the other ones are offering and how
how is it? I guess the question would be, do you have any intention of operating any of these bars or restaurants or is it all going to be third party vendors? No, you have the resort that's going to have a majority of them that we talked earlier about the ancillary. So I don't want to speak for councelor Safford but I guess what he's getting at is are you amable to offering
the same type of discount that Margaritavville has at 25% on their they control their their but under the control of what you have in your resort whatever you're going to operate in there allowing that same discount any limitation is
it if they have if they have happy hour of course you don't you know double dip on it but just again how do what how do I train. What do I So, they come in with a license and say, "I've got a live on St. Carlos Island." Then they
get the You go register at the front desk. You get it on your wallet. It's on your phone. Just show them. And it doesn't apply to hotel lodging. It doesn't apply just stores and bar restaurants type thing. But food. Yep. It includes food, but it doesn't
far as I'm I I don't think it involves lodging. No, it's not lodging. It's not retail. It is retail. It is for the It is for It's in their store. Yeah. Oh, in their store. In their store. But it's limited of you. You You can't bring a group of 20 people and get the discount. It's It's limited to You got to show
your ID. 90% of the time. I never remember using I won't I don't I mean this is so vague. I mean, so no, what we would like to do is we'll go back and this is a not a new concept. It's been addressed on for some of the prior projects. I can't remember.
How's that? I I can't remember off the top of my head how it was addressed in for example the Neptune and and other things like that. Would you allow us to go back see exactly what's included in those um resonings and then Sure. Yeah. Again, this is not deal or no deal island. It's it's uh if you sure if you
like it. No, I'm just I got a bunch of emails. I I promise my constituents I'd ask the question. So, no. and I appreciate it and thank you for letting us to go and look back and we'll see what has been consistently done. But believe it or not, that's all I have for
now. Karen, I'm good for now. Everything's been covered so far. John, I agree it's been covered. Okay. I didn't say I was up and Yeah, I'm good for now. We
could hear from from staff now. if you're still awake with us. I know it's been a it's been a long day. Again, Judith Frankle with Community Development. Uh I'm going to walk you through the findings and conclusions. I did want to point out one thing in the
discussion about um the ends of Bonita and Harbor. The actual roadway on those streets is something like 20 feet wide, but the right of way is actually quite wider. um on the portion of the roadway that um comes into their property, that
roadway could be widened. I think it's about 50 feet. And that would accommodate more um turnaround on their property, of a culde-sac type thing. But the the the tea turnaround that that Ken was talking about, I think could maybe be accommodated with a combination of the existing rightway and then maybe a
little bit of their their property as well. So, I think it's something that could be um worked out um because the other option would be to the town could vacate that portion of the property and and turn it over to the um the property
owner if the town wanted to. Um okay, so I'm going to go through the findings and conclusions. Land Development Code section 34-85B and C and 34-2162 sets forth the required
considerations and findings for approval of a resoning. 34-85B. Uh, the town council shall consider the following whenever applicable. One, whether there exists an error or ambiguity which must be corrected. No errors or ambiguities
exist. Two, whether there exists change or changing conditions which make approval of the request appropriate. The site as exists is damaged and in need of repair or redevelopment due to the destruction by Hurricane Ian. Three, the impact of a proposed change on the
intent of this chapter. The proposed change will not have an impact on the intent of this chapter, the land development code. The CPD reszone will allow the redevelopment of the damaged moss marina structures and adjoining properties. Four, the testimony of any
applicant uh which you've heard today. Five, the recommendation of staff and the local planning agency which you've also uh heard. Six is testimony of the public who have spoken here and at LPA. Seven, whether the request is consistent with the goals, objectives,
policies, and intent and with the densities, intensities, and general uses as set forth in the Fort Myers Beach comprehensive plan. So again, it's currently not consistent with the comprehensive plan. We're going to talk about that in the second part um uh a
little bit later, but it would be compatible with the proposed change to the comp plan that they are um applying for requesting. Eight, whether the request meets or exceeds all performance and locationational standards set forth for the proposed use. The proposed
development will be required to meet performance standards set forth in 34-2031 and 34-2032. Um it's also important to note that some of those those performance um standards um will include review by the
Southwest Florida Water Management District. So some of the drainage concerns will be brought up um at that time of development order. The that's a required part of the process because the site is over an acre in size, it has to be reviewed by that um outside state
agency. Um and they will be required to maintain all of their storm water on site. Uh which not a drainage expert, but um is likely not happening now. The site is almost 100% um impervious and
they are adding some pvious space to it. It is likely they will have to do some underground infrastructure in addition to that um in order to to meet those standards. But we'll see those drainage plans um at the time of development
order. I understand that part I fully understand Southwest Florida Management District is going to make sure that they maintain and drain their own water. It's what effect are they going to have on the already suffering neighborhood
with what as it pertains to this project with drainage right which I don't think would fall under Southwest Florida management correct that's where a third party for me a third party input from someone that is a drainage expert could opine on
yeah so in terms of the standards all of our reviewers are reviewing this site specifically not necessarily drainage that's happening elsewhere. So, we did have um a reviewer from Tetac look at the project and that's what they've noted. One that this
is going to go to the Southwest Florida um water management district and that they probably are likely going to have some underground storage of for water retention um because of the site, but that'll be reviewed at that time. So, just to let you know that, you
know, there is a process for that and it may potentially improve things for the neighborhood because if, as the applicant said, the site, the subject site is draining because of the elevation into the neighborhood, that should be alleviated,
but not what you're talking about is something separate, the actual um issues that are occurring on the in the neighborhood. Okay. Um, nine, whether urban services are or will be available and adequate to serve a proposed land use change. Urban
services exist in this location. Whether the request will protect, conserve, or preserve environmentally critical areas and natural resources. The proposed redevelopment is located on a previously developed site which does not contain any environmentally critical areas or natural
resources. 11. whether the request will be compatible with existing or planned uses and not cause damage, hazard, nuisance, or other detriment to persons or property. The request is compatible with existing or known planned commercial and civic uses to the
subject civic uses adjacent to the subject redevelopment and will not cause damage, hazard, nuisance, or other detriment to the commercial or civic property uses of Fort Myers Beach. It is less clear whether the proposed development will cause nuisance to the
abuing single family residences. The property was previously a working marina without buffers and adequate landscaping and the proposed development will create additional open space and buffering to enhance the visual aesthetics of the area. 12. whether the location of the
request places an undue burden upon existing transportation or other services and facilities and will be served by streets with the capacity to carry traffic generated by the the development. The location of the proposed development immediately adjacent to the Matanis Pass Bridge and
the old San Carlos downtown area will contain any traffic impacts to the vicinity of the development. The addition of 236 lodging units will likely impact the flow of traffic in the downtown area through guests arrival and departures. Once guests are parked,
there would not be a need to move their vehicle until departure unless they have a planned excursion as the beaches, restaurants, bars, and other amenities would be easily accessible on foot. Um staff has concerns regarding the sufficiency of the parking provided for commercial shared parking lot. Um, and
if you want, I can talk about parking later. Um, and then 13 for planned development resonings. We're going to see 216, uh, section 216 in a second. Uh, land development code section 34-85C. Before granting any resoning, the town council shall find that the
requested zoning district complies with one, the Fort Myers Beach Comprehensive Plan, as discussed as does not currently, but would comply with the proposed uh, amendment to the comprehensive plan. Two, this chapter, the proposed uses comply with this
chapter and except in regards to the deviations. Three, any other applicable town ordinances or codes. The proposed request complies with town ordinances or or codes except in regards to the deviations for land development resoning
C34-216. Land development code 34-216A2. The recommendation made to the town council must be supported by the guidelines set forth in 3485 which you just heard. In addition, the findings must address whether the following criteria can be satisfied. A the
proposed use or mix of uses is appropriate in the subject location. The proposed mix of uses lodging commercial restaurant is appropriate in this location in general. However, the cop area of building E and the request for ambient noise at that location may create a nuisance for the
single family home across the canal. Um staff's original recommendation to the LPA was to remove the COP entirely from that area. Um but the LPA worked with the applicant to adjust that to allow
COP. Um and I'll get to that when we get to the conditions B. sufficient sufficient safeguards to the public interest are provided by the recommended special conditions to the concept plan or by other applicable regulations. The linear park buffer bayfront public access access view
corridors from the neighborhood separation between buildings acts as safeguards to the public interest. The applicant is proposing signage to reduce resort vehicles for accessing the neighborhood. The abuing single family neighborhood may be impacted by noise
and increased traffic. C. All recommended special conditions are reasonably related to the impact on the public's interest created by or expected from the proposed development. All recommended conditions are related to the public's interest. D.
The proposed use meets all specific requirements of the comprehensive plan that are relevant to the requested plan development such as the following. Uh the CPA application to amend the future land use category must be approved prior to the approval of the CPT application in order to comply with
the comprehensive plan. Land Development Code section 34-216A4 um requires that the local planning agency recommendation must approve, approve with modification or reject each requested deviation based on the finding.
Each item enhances the achievement of the objectives of the planned development. Um staff concurs except for deviation eight which is the one where they're asking for a reduction in the parking requirement. B. The general intent of the chapter to protect the public
health, safety, and welfare will be preserved and promoted. Uh staff concurs. Each deviation operates to the benefit or at least not to the detriment of the public interest. Staff concurs. Uh each deviation is consistent with The Fort Myers Beach comprehensive plan plan
as previously stated is not uh in compliance now but would be with the um comp plan amendment that's proposed. Um okay and then we going to get on to recommendations. I did want to um uh and
and the recommended conditions of approval. Um I did want to add a couple things. Um uh council asked earlier about the comparison in F. Um most of the CPDs that we've seen recently and
development agreements, they've excluded their parking from that um F calculation. So with Neptune, for example, um they have a 1.48 F, but that excludes two levels of
parking. So it would it's going to be higher. I don't know exactly what that number is, but we could find that out for potentially for second reading. What would this one be without parking? I don't know. But that's a question to ask the the applicant. So, right now they're including the the the parking,
but it would be, you know, and it depends on whether they ask because in in um in building B, I think they have three levels of parking and it drops down. So if they were only asking for F, they were asking for a reduction in F for just this part below base flood. Um
we've seen different things. Um but in considering F, it's not an applesto apples comparison because other people have been given different deviations from that. Um okay. Oh, and uh I did want to bring
up with with phasing um unless the council feels different, the the intent of phasing in in my discussion with the applicant was really to explain how they were going to operate their construction schedule. Um I would still expect to see
the development order for the property as a whole come in and then they could do their their permitting, you know, on an individual basis, but we would still need to see the development order for the whole property. Um, I was initially concerned about the um, construction
traffic because that can really, you know, those large trucks can really damage the streets. They can provide a um, nuisance. A lot of those properties are um, short-term rentals. So, people going to be there during the day if they're, you know, renting on vacation and having those construction trucks
come through. So requiring them to to bring their construction checks through the property um we felt was kind of a benefit to the residents. So if that's something you would like looked at differently, we can certainly do that. Uh but I just wanted to make a a note of
that. Um, okay. I'm going to go through the recommended conditions and if I get to one where I'm we've decided to change things or I haven't heard it correctly, uh, let me know. Um, before you move on with
the phasing, I mean, I would like to should this go forward, I'd like at the second reading to know what your recommendations would be as far as phasing or doing it all at once or benchmarks if it is phased. you're the expert, so I would rely on
your your input as far as what you've seen in the past, what makes sense, what would make sense with this. Yeah. So, again, from my perspective in thinking about a reasonzoning, it's it's the the
rules that govern the the property. What we're talking about in terms of construction kind of in my mind falls outside the scope of a reasonzoning and maybe would fall into this agreement. um that would be separate. I mean, from a town perspective, we want them to build
it as quickly as they possibly can, right? Because then there's less of a a nuisance. Construction is always loud. There's no way to to build quietly, right? Um so the quicker they can do it, the benefit for the town. I don't know that it makes sense
to try to limit the phases. Um I've seen that in other in um the CPD that was done for the lighthouse um they originally had multiple phases and then they came back and had to get an amendment to that because they they
didn't work out the way that they expected to because of hurricanes and I don't know other factors. So I wouldn't want to limit them and say okay you're going to do phase one to three here and then it just it's going to require them to come back multiple times to us. Um, I
think maybe getting them to to figure out what that that end point is. I don't know. We're asking the question, can they operate portions of this independently? Because in my mind, if the whole place is under construction, they can't open anything. So, if they're
going to break it into pieces, it would have to be, you know, it would make in my mind make the most sense of what operational. Maybe they can operate the the old San Carlos um uh property that could easily be independent, right? But then maybe
buildings B and C are together and they can operate that without the rest of it. Um I'm I'm not sure. I would, you know, and I'm I'm not a construction expert, but I would think that the we wouldn't want to, you know, delay them where then they would have to come
back for um asks if they couldn't meet certain deadlines. Um okay. So in thinking about the conditions for the um the ordinance um what I put in the
staff report first is an agreement must be established for elements not accounted for on the master concept plan or in the conditions of the ordinance. Um the applicant shall work with the town attorney to draft an agreement. And so I've listed some of those elements here, we could certainly list everything
that they provided in their document. Um, but again for thinking about enforcing this, the two ways that really at staff level we have of enforcing is requiring these elements at the time of development order or permitting um
because we're tying that to to uh permissions that the town is giving. So like for the um the taxi the water taxi terminal I can physically see that they've included that in part of their plan. They've listed it on their development order and we can see that they're making you know
uh um construction documents for that. Um and then with code compliance it's easy to see okay it's after 10 o'clock and they're still operating. Okay that's a violation those things. some of the other things that have to do with the real operation of it. Um certainly
planning and zoning wouldn't get involved in those and I don't know that um uh code compliance would either. So thinking about that as a separate agreement and what would be the um the the mechanisms for that is kind of outside the scope of planning and
zoning. Um, I did want to mention because I heard about the the importance of the water taxi and certainly that's something that the town council has talked about on other occasions. I would change suggest changing the language to say you want an
inner island taxi. So, there are other um fairies that go to that could go to other islands, other places. You know, if you want something specifically here that goes along the island and doesn't Judith Judith, I don't know if you saw,
but Patrick actually had some suggested language. Yeah. So, it's not a it's not a taxi, it's a ferry. It's a big difference. They could have a taxi in addition to the ferry, but we want a ferry. different different concept but but I think Patrick's got some language that looked pretty good that'll help you
I think give you some direction on that but I don't think it covered what your concern is ferry could ferry could take you to Cape Coral no but it references south end of the island it references moundhouse it references I mean it's it's in the language yes well that's a language they provided today so we would
could include some of that I mean obviously like they said they have to get those other property owners to agree to what Yeah, they didn't say that. This is just a regional goal. So, so they're going to find someone on the south end. That could be snookbite. It could be it could be fishtail, could be both. It's
up to them. Could it definitely needs to be Moundhouse. So, those are those are the minimum amount of spots. They can have a lot more. God bless them if they do. That's that's the language that's hopefully will be added, you know, whatever Nancy needs procedurally, but
but that was just added today and hopefully that'll be before us on second reading. Right. Is that what you're thinking? Yes. Yeah. So, obviously they could have other kinds of Absolutely. The SKI sky is the limit on the fair. The town's goal is mainly to have the inner they just want to have it set a
minimum standard which is their goal anyways. Yes. Okay. Um the other thing that hasn't come up is uh public access to the property. Um there is one of the diagrams looking at
that the night access. Um it's not in the conditions, but it might be something to think about with talking we've talked a lot about hours of operation. Um the night controlled access um the latest I heard from the applicant is that they you know want to
close off the property at midnight. So the the um the restaurants if the restaurants close at midnight then the access to the um the Bayront prominade and the linear park would all close at midnight. Um, so we could add that in. Um, we didn't
discuss that at LPA, so I wanted to make sure to to point that out here. Um, okay. Development conditions. The owner will provide an accessible stabilized surface for the area between Harbor Court and Bonita Street for emergency personnel and
vehicles. Um, this is something that is necessary for fire um, and rescue operations. Uh the master concept plan init indicates access points on Harbor Court and Bonita Street provide for emergency limited access only. Limited access is
intended to allow vehicles to have un who have unintentionally driven down Harbor Court or Bonita Street to temporarily access the property. Um I think what we're talking about today is creating a a gate after that um
potential T-turn so we can adjust that before second reading. Um, all walkover pedestrian bridges will be constructed at the height to permit fire and other emergency vehicles to pass underneath. Night controlled access will be a system of gated sections with
keypad or scanning capabilities to only allow employees, current registered owners, guests of the property, and emergency personnel to enter exit the property from these locations during the night. Um, here we've noted one hour after sunset.
Um, but that could potentially be midnight if we want to make it the same for all properties. Staff had some concerns about the linear park because there's a would be a sixoot fence on one side and then the parking garage on the other side that it kind of creates a
canyon and it would be kind of unsafe um in the dark. Um, by by gating it off, you know, it would prevent people who weren't supposed to be there from being there. Um, access to the Arches Resort through
easement number 200080033 2365 on First Street. Should be limited to vehic vehicular travel. Um, that's the um easement. It goes through a parking lot essentially. Um, staff had
some concerns about uh pedestrians walking through there, but the easement right now is for vehicular access. the property owner doesn't own that or have control over that. Um, so we would prefer that pedestrians are discouraged from using it. I mean, obviously you
can't prevent everything, but it's not lighted. There's no pedestrian pathway there. So, um, uh, we would like it limited to vehicular travel. Uh a detailed landscaping plan showing the location and type of plantings must
be provided with the development order application. All landscaping materials will be native varieties/f Florida friendly species. Um along the western boundary canal adjacent to building E uh guest pool deck, a minimum 5 foot wide buffer will be provided. This buffer
will provide a minimum of five trees per 100 linear feet at a minimum of 12 feet tall at time of planting and a continuous opaque clucia hedge. Hedging must be provided at at least 4 feet at time of planting along the canal adjacent to building E and maintained at
a minimum of 5t high. So that'll provide a thick hedge with the tree um uh canopy above it. Vehicular access to the resort will be directed to Arch's Way and local traffic
only, no through street, no through traffic signage will be placed immediate west of the intersection of third and arches way to be to minimize uh vehicular trips within that neighborhood. Ride hailing spot must be separate spot uh from the Wii trans stop
location um which they have provided now in the master concept plan. The ride hailing spot must be located to reduce potential impact on residential neighbors and be provided with lighting for safety. Location of the transit stop must be coordinated with liran. Uh maximum allowed commercial
space is 25,500 square ft. And then we have the operational conditions. Okay. So staff is recommending to not permit the commercial parking lot. They are asking for that. Um they have reduced the
number of spots in that commercial parking. Um but they are still requesting it. Um staff's suggestion was to initially not permit the commercial parking, the shared parking and to require them to do this uh parking
study. And so that's what I've put into the conditions. But if you're um uh would like to approve the commercial parking as they've proposed it, then we would strike that condition. Are you looking for some direction now
or are you looking is this behind the mark? Is this behind the market in the bodega? No. So integrated with their parking. Um so what they've requested is a 50% reduction in their required parking for the site. Um
and in doing so they're they're very close to uh they're actually less than now because they've increased the um the retail square footage. So um they're providing
um 50 they're they're proposing to provide 50% of the required parking and then by their calculation they have 45 with that 50% reduction they have 45 extra spaces. When we went to LPA they
had 96 extra spaces with that 40 50% reduction. staff felt that a 33% reduction was really more in keeping with what's allowed elsewhere in the area that's more comparable. Um, and if they
were with the number they had now, with the number they have now with the increased retail space, they're um have less parking than you would need for that 33% reduction. they have enough
parking to meet the 50% reduction that they're proposing. Um so my suggestion was is if you would like to um allow them that 50% reduction to approve that deviation to al to not
approve the commercial parking at this time but leave the door open where they could do a parking study to show they do have extra parking. So it would be after the um the property was open fully operational and then they would have somebody come and do a study where they can tell you how many spots are open.
Obviously we'd have to do it during you know peak season. So that's my recommendation. You can so what happens if they do a parking study and comes back that they don't have enough parking then we would not permit them to have a commercial parking lot.
And then what what's the repercussion of them? What's the practical effect of that? They wouldn't have commercial parking. They would still have parking for their resort. It's already built, right? So, what what happens from a practical standpoint if
they're denied commercial? The study would show that they do not have capacity to have an additional use in the parking. So, what's called for in the code is parking for the resort, right? For the the hotel rooms and for
the retail. Um, so from a practical Just in sort of lay terms, it would be less parking for people that wanted to come over and visit their shops and restaurants. Is that what you're saying? If they didn't, they were disallowed commercial parking. So, if we did not permit them to have
the this commercial what our code calls shared parking, they would still have parking for their resort. Um, typically hotel resorts these days charge, you know, $20 a night or something like that for a parking spot. So that would still
be part of their operations, right? But they wouldn't be allowed to have public parking where you put a sign out front and you say there's there's public. That's what I just what I asked. So So if somebody's visiting just to go have a bite to eat and it's not a guest at the hotel, then that's where they would be
impacted. Is that what you're saying? They there would not be public parking for somebody who's not immediately using the facility. But they do maintain that it's, you know, they're implementing the park once it is in the But they couldn't even offer it to downtown. They couldn't even offer it if they didn't have that commercial designation. Right. Yes. Ones
if they had open spots, they they wouldn't be allowed to offer it. How would you enforce it? But if they did the parking study, then it would show that they had open spots and then they could do it. Okay. New York. I just hate to give these these these transportation studies, these traffic
studies, these parking studies. It's a we're all in the wrong business. Yep. Because they they all get done and they get put on a shelf and and I just I actually think the parking study would be highly informative. Um and I would really like to do a parking study at some of these other resorts because our
code requires a certain amount of parking. If we find out that that's not the right amount of parking for a hotel, that would be very informative for everybody. Well, I I think if you were to ask the owners of the Margaritavville Resort, they would tell you they're probably grossly underparked, even though they
have enough parking for their their building. My fear is this is going to be the same problem. You're going to have more people coming there to frequent the establishments if it's approved. You're not going to have enough parking to meet the demand. That's a bigger concern for
me than whether it's 45 96. Neither one of them sounds sufficient enough for the scale of property that's being proposed. How do you address that? You're in your your wheelhouse. I mean, I think for when we're talking about
the the hotel, the actual lodging units, right? You you have to you don't have to expect, but the the logical expectation is that there's one spot per unit. Um the other uses happening right people
can there's there's public parking there's commercial parking in the adjacent neighborhoods which people could use. I also expect that people who are parked at other resorts will come to this resort. I'm I'm less concerned about those uh ancillary uses, the um
you know, the restaurants and and the shops and all of that because it's going to somebody even if you're coming from elsewhere in town, you're going to come, you're going to find your parking spot and then you're going to walk around to all the you know, different um options. Well, my concern is they're going to
come to try to find parking at this parking spot and not going to go somewhere else and then if it's full, they're going to go back out onto the road and try to find it somewhere else. That's the concern that I have. But sounds like you have a path forward. Well, and by not allowing public parking
at this time, you're you know, they're not going to advertise it that way. And so you're you're going to get fewer of those, you know, people coming and turning around in theory. In theory. Okay.
Okay. Hours of operation. The Arches Gateway. Oh, I did want to clarify one thing because this come up with other projects. Amplified music, anything through a speaker. So there's two kinds in my mind of amplified music. There's
ambient music, which is background music, but it's it's pre-recorded either from a radio station or a CD or whatever. It's pre-recorded music is the ambient music intended for background. And then there's live music, which is obviously you have performers there
live. So, when talking about amplified, amplified is anything through a speaker. You know, the only other option would be somebody with an, you know, an acoustic guitar singing without a microphone, which is unlikely. Um,
so keep that in mind when we're going to talk about the hours of operation and the music. Um, the Arches Gateway Restaurant and rooftop deck at the corner of San Carlos Boulevard and Third Street will operate 7:00 a.m. to midnight. Amplified sound, so could be
live or not live, will be oriented away from adjacent residential properties. Um, and then what I have is that the outside deck would only be open until 10 p.m. So for food and drink and uh music,
the outside deck will close at 10 p.m. That's what I I heard in the discussion. So good. Um sunset deck. Hours of operation 7:00 a.m. until 1000 p.m. is what I heard. Only ambient music is
allowed on the sunset deck. So can be amplified, but pre-recorded background music. My definition of amplified might be a little bit to me. Amplified is any speaker that requires power. So if you have to plug your speaker into a power,
that would be an amplified sound. If you have just a speaker on the wall that has low voltage speaker wiring going that comes from a radio or comes from something other than a direct speaker like someone would plug into for with a guitar. To me, that's that's amplified music because you need power to amplify
the sound. Whereas the speaker, at least in my mind, that's how it's I've always looked at it. So if I want to have my radio on and just my little 6 by9 speakers that are coming from a little radio or they're Bluetooth speakers that are coming from your phone, I don't consider that amplified music. Okay.
Maybe I'm seeing it different. It would be helpful to have a definition of that because um I don't know the specifics. they probably don't know the specifics of how many speakers they're going to have and where they're going to be, but they probably have more than one um speaker
system going. Um if you're equating and usually an amplified speaker is meant to be very loud and project from wherever that sound is coming from to hit everybody in the back. Whereas non-amplified in my mind would be the speakers that would be strategically
placed around your landscape so that you get even low volume sound. Okay. Everywhere you're at. So you're equating the amplified music with the live music. Yes. Okay. That's different than what I had understood. Okay. Well, that's my under
that's the way I look at. Okay. And I'm just But if that's it's good to have a definition. So if that's the definition we're going to use, that's fine. And use it because I mean ambient music is background music. Amplified music is
loud decimal driven in your face music. And you can still in the description that I just laid out in my mind, ambient music can still be louder than the noise ordinance allows, but you still have the noise ordinance. Oh, yeah. You can turn up non-amplified speakers pretty dang
loud. Trust me, I've been in trouble for before. Oh, you can you shouldn't. You should. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. I'm not saying you should. I'm just I I wanted to make it clear that it's not saying that you can't The noise ordinance would still supersede whether it was amplified or not, whether or not it was too loud. Got
it. That's what I was trying to get at. Okay. So, for the Okay, for So, for going back to the Arches Gateway, it says amplified sound all all sound because they may have some
that's ambient and some that's amplified. Is this confusing everybody? Well, everybody have a different understanding. sound oriented. You can go to the urban dictionary and look up what the definition is. Yes. And Tom is not here.
He's the one that really needs to have a good understanding based on what is ambient versus amplified. You need a microphone. So from a code perspective, it's not really it's not
really plainly uh plainly uh written down for us in our code. So it really has to do with decibel level. So they don't break it down uh there's broken down by how the sound travels and that goes through state statute, but it's mostly by decibel. So to give you a
clear description between the two, I can't do that right now without more research. I'm sorry. Apologies. No, I clarified it. It does. It does define it. Yes, but the problem is it's it's defined,
but it's not clear because we have no no cases that back that up yet. So, I would say I need more research before I give you a definitive answer. Well, yeah, I guess. So, just for your sake, Jude, but if I've got my serious radio playing at the sunset deck in this case after 9:00,
am I going to get a code violation for having amplified music? Do you do you want to issue a code violation? Well, no. like I would think if it's I guess my point is if it's within the noise ordinance specification
as far as decel levels it wouldn't warrant having a code violation right unless you further restrict it here. So if you say all music has to end at 9 p.m. even though it may be within the decibel levels they would still get a code violation limit that I yeah I'm
agreeing I agree with that. Okay we far enough down the rabbit hole yet? Okay, let me go back to the sunset deck. Hours of operation 7 am to 10 p.m. Only ambient music is allowed on the sunset deck. Ambient music is
permitted from 7:00 a.m. to 9:00 p.m. Those are the hours. Yes. Okay. Amplified sound will be oriented away from adjacent residential properties. Live music is not permitted at this location. commercial plaza uh restaurants along
Bayfront Prominade 7 a.m. to midnight. Pool deck buildings B and C 7 a.m. to midnight. Pool deck building E 7 a.m. to 900 p.m. and ambient music only from 10:00 a.m. until 1 hour after
sunset. Amplified sound will be oriented away from adjacent residential properties. No alcohol sales will take place outdoors on the pool deck at building E. Live music is not permitted at this location. Outdoor deck area by the events chapel and reception hall in
building D is 7:00 a.m. to midnight. Um, and the only other addition is the access to the property as a whole, the whole prominade. I would suggest midnight at least to the prominade because the restaurants are going to be
open until midnight. But the applicant didn't tell you what their plan is for that. Yeah, I suppose it's the discussion we should have. Didn't talk about the prominade yet. Ben, you want to come up? What are your intentions for the proomenade as
far as ambient music or amplified music? Is that what you're ask? Or hours of operation? No, I was just think hours in operation in general. If you look at their their um proposed access to the property, those open um the linear park,
the public prominade, they are going to have um restricted access after a certain hour, but I didn't hear what hour that was going to be. Um I think it makes sense if the restaurants are open till midnight that it should be open until midnight in certain areas.
Um I think for just general security of the what they're, you know, why they want to have it controlled to the site. Uh for the record, Megan's Treyhorn. So, uh we are hearing concerns of directing directly answering a question pertaining
to kind of the the hours for Bayside Prominade and the linear park. The linear park since it is um really directly contiguous to that those residential neighborhoods, we're fine with a sunset to an hour or sunrise to
an hour after sunset for that portion. However, the Bayside Prominent does include some of that chapel area which is uh has the midnight. So, we'd ask for that to be open until midnight, the prominant area. Well, since you're up here, one other
thing that I knew there was something I wanted to ask about that was brought up during public comment and was brought up I brought up earlier is that building E. the concern you sounds like you're going to do some buffering there, but there's also a concern about residential building height versus the proposed
building height. I would ask that you take a look at that. I don't expect you to agree or not agree should this go forward to the second reading. Okay. Um at least know that if it goes forward, my guess is it's probably going to go forward to the next reading, but um it certainly be a
question I'll be asking at the second reading if it goes to a second reading. Understood. Anything else? John? No. Jim? No. Karen? Nope. Scott? Nope. Anything
for I almost called you Sarah. Sorry, Judith. Would you like to hear the definition of ambient for? Sure. Let it rip. Can you do that over a microphone that's amplified? So what it says is ambient noise the all-encompensate all-encompensing noise
associated with a given environment being usually a composite of sound from many sources near and far. Well, well that's clearly stated. Clear it right up. A name for your new barb. The ambient bar.
That cleared it all up. That cleared it all up. All right. I got to go back that way. If you're playing ambient music, you say, "Hey, this is the ambient music bar." We got everybody got their two cents in so far that we Okay. Is it I've got to
read my last line here. I will now close the public hearing and request a discussion or a motion from the town council to approve, approve with conditions or deny with reasons or in a continuence to a time certain. Is there a discussion and or a motion?
Well, I'll start the discussion then since nobody else wants to. I uh using your terminology, Patrick, your your basket basket of of uh benefits. I will agree it's a basket. Um, however, I feel that there's several
holes in that basket currently that are being um damned or channeled by amenities masking as public benefits. That being said, I'm willing to support at least taking this to a second reading
to allow you more time to uh replay what we've discussed today, relisten to some of the concerns. Um, but without filling some of those holes with some putty, for lack of a better term, um, it's going to be hard for me to approve this at the next
hearing. But I'm willing to at least let it go to the second reading for, uh, for further discussion. Any other discussion? Vice Mayor, I will uh, I will just say this.
uh people that have come before us, not necessarily literally, but preceded us, both at the town and the county level, uh have done an excellent job of of
democratizing the beaches of Fort Myers Beach. And and I mean that in the way that we have a 30ome Jeff's gone. I think it's 30ome beach access points that really allow the public the residents to utilize our
beautiful beaches and have access. I think as somebody who lived on the Gulf side prior to Ian and now lives on the bay side, uh there are there are equal uh advantages and beauty of of of seeing the Bayside. And I think this project uh
particularly the the the bayside prominade does a very nice job with its uh with its in terms of democratizing the bay. Watching the bay and the marine activity is a is a phenomenal thing and and it's very limited. Uh we have one we
have beautiful Bayside Park, but it's relatively small and there's some wonderful restaurants uh on the bay, but it's very difficult for the average person on this island to have access to that bayfront. And the the Moss Marine property is some of the most beautiful
property in terms of having a bayfront view and to see that opened up to the public uh I think is a is a tremendous incalculable uh public benefit. And I I commend them for their patience. I commend them for coming back with a with
a more modest proposal and uh and and and obviously there's a litany of other issues with respect to public benefit, but I think that conceptually is the largest public benefit. I'm particularly intrigued about the water ferry. Uh I think that could be uh transformative uh
for our friends and neighbors on the mid island and south end particularly during season to season to not only be able to enjoy the the benefits of the north end but also uh it it does reduce the need to go and spend our dollars uh uh at in
Bonita Springs or Naples uh or or Asterero and allows us to support our local businesses and also do it in a in a relatively pleasant Hey, we've talked about adding a couple stops would add length to the journey. It would, but at the same time, being on a boat, watching
the sunset, having a cool beverage versus sitting on in traffic for an hour and a half on a sterile boulevard, that's a pretty good trade-off. So, uh, for those reasons and others, I I I do support, uh, this proposal. I think the LPA's done a nice job. I think the
council's done a nice job of making some amendments and conditions and I appreciate the the applicant being open to those and and uh so therefore I'll be supporting this and and I'm happy to make a motion unless my colleagues have some things they want to say first.
Uh councelor Kane I'm ready for a motion. Well, I just want to say I know that we have a handful of things that we need to discuss if this moves forward, and I think it will. I hope it does. Um, and I
think we can get to a good ending of this. I mean, what has happened so far from the original plan that was presented at LPA to where we are now is night and day. And I think
you've taken every consideration. You've listened to everything. There's been tons of conversation. Um there's been a lot of back and forth and I commend all of you for that. Excuse me. Um so I definitely
am in support of this. I live in the neighborhood. I think what you're trying to do to make it reasonable and accepting for the neighborhood is great. Um, so I would be ready for a motion as
well. Counc, I'll echo that as well. Hey, what did Aristotle say? Patience is bitter, but fruit is sweet. Depends on the fruit. Go ahead, Mr. Vice Mayor. Well, Mr. Mayor, with the with the assistance of our town attorney, I will do the easy
part and move move passage of ordinance 25-04, Arches Resort CPD. And Nancy, help me fill in the second reading for you. Move it to second reading. Um, on do we have a date? On June 2nd. June
2nd, subject to subject to the conditions um that have been identified in our staff report and the adoption of the uh comprehensive plan amendment proposed in ordinance 25-04 at the time of approval as so eloquently
stated by our town attorney. I'll second. We got a motion by Vice Mayor Adder Halt, a second by councelor Woodson. discussion. I just want to add a little bit. I didn't go too far into depth, but my hesitation does not stem from Ben, you or your family. You've
been here for a long time. You've been great operators. I think what you're trying to do there is is uh very powerful. Um I I support something there. I think we're close. I respect your property rights there, but I also respect the property rights of those surrounding the neighborhood. I think
over the next month as you discuss this with your team, my hope is that you'll be able to come back with something that's a little bit closer for me to be able to help alleviate some of the concerns that your neighbors have to allow you to be able to be some build something profitable that will will fit into the neighborhood. Um, you guys have
been more than willing to go back to the drawing board has been stated and and listen to all the complaints and all the suggestions. I have no doubt that you won't do it again this time and I'm looking forward to seeing what comes out of it on June 2nd. With that, is there any other discussion? Vice Mayor Hul I. Councelor
Woodson I. Councelor Safford. Hi. Uh, Councelor King. Hi. And I'm an I as well. That motion carries unanimously. We'll see you on June 2nd. Oh, wait. We got another one. Another item. That's right. We'll see you at 351. All right. The next agenda item is an is
the agenda item is the first reading of public hearing on proposed ordinance 25-05 commonly referred to as the Arches Development Project small-scale comprehensive plan amendment. If approved at first reading, a second reading will be scheduled for June 2nd, 2025 at 9:00 a.m. prior to adoption of
ordinance 25-04 or at any other time identified by town council. This is an ordinance of the town of Fort Myers Beach, Florida, amending the town, Fort Myers Beach, adopted future land use map dated January 1st, 1999, containing the town's
comprehensive plan for properties located at 450, 445, 441, and 436 Harbor Court, 435, and 438 Bonita Street, Fort Myers Beach, Florida. Also identified as strap numbers 24-46-23-W3-000027.0000
000024-26-23-W3-000026.0000204-46-23-W3-0030B. 020 0 2-46-23-W3-0030B.0194-46-23-W3-0030C.0060 0060 24-46-23-W3-0030 C.00004 and 24-46-23-W3-0030A.0000 00 or 0110 Fort Myers Beach amending the
future land use map for these parcels from mixed residential four parcels and marina two parcels to pedestrian commercial providing for clarifications as necessary providing for conflicts of law scriveners errors severability and providing for an effective date. So
council, this is uh legislative in nature. So this one will be adopted um pursuant to some standards that are in your code as well as um whatever uh other comments might be made.
Okay. Judith Judith Frankle from community development um Freeland Florida Holdings LLC owner of the subject property and the neighborhood company applicant for the owner are requesting comprehensive plan future land use map amendment. The
amendment requests a change of 3.53 acres of marina future land use known as Moss Marina and one acre of mixed residential future land use to pedestrian commercial. There are no proposed text amendments to the
comprehensive plan. Um, three of the parcels that we discussed under the previous application are already pedestrian commercial and do not require a comp plan amendment. That's why there's fewer addresses here. Um, on April 8th, 2025, the LPA voted
unanimously to recommend approval of this comprehensive plan amendment. Um, in discussing this, I'm going to give you a little bit of background on the two existing future land uses. Um the first primary one being the marina future land use um
which allows a maximum floor area ratio or FAR of 1.5 and no density is listed in the comprehensive plan for the marina future land use. Um as you can imagine it restricts the land use to things related to um marinas, boats, cruise
ships um pretty much anything relating to boating um dry boat storage. sales, rentals of boats and supplies and boat repair all would be included in this um land use category. Um and much very
little else would be permitted. Um the mixed residential future land use which are mainly the the properties that are on Bonita and Harbor um which fall into um allow for a maximum floor area ratio F of 1.5. Um it is important to note
that our that's in the comprehensive plan. Our land development code actually looks at single family homes by uh building coverage. So it's 40% um so uh in practicality maybe less than
1.5 for single family house houses. Um and typically allows a density of six dwelling units per acre. Um although there is a platted overlay which could allow up to 10 dwelling units per acre for legally existing dwelling units. The single acre that is currently
future land use mixed residential um appears to have contained a mix of single family and two dwelling units prior to Hurricane Ian. Um, the combined marina and mixed residential parcels would allow could allow up to a total of
295,990 square ft of floor area um through a CPD. That's at the maximum uh F. The proposed change to pedestrian commercial could allow for a total of 493,317 square feet of area again
through a CPD. This is an increase of almost 200,000 square ft of development potential. Um when considering neighborhood compatibility, um the comprehensive plan refers to this area as the north end in one section and the
core area in another section. Um the north end is described as uh the north end of the island retains its residential and resort identity. Um so both uses are uh potentially considered. The 1999 comprehensive plan
does not provide a vision or plan for this part of the core area. Um provided in the staff reports are map excerpts from the comprehensive plan. So you can see part of this area is in um core area
and part is what's called north end [Music] um the pattern of the platted overlay districts on both the east and west side of the pedestrian commercial districts creates a buffer between the higher impact of downtown and the lower density
residential districts. Um this is pretty typical. I know that the comprehensive plan had to take into account what was already existing in terms of land uses and kind of work that into the plan. Um when the comp plan was created, it wasn't a blank slate. They had to work
with the existing zoning and land uses that were already um present. Um okay. Um, in looking at the overall impacts of the future land use change, um, I did suggest considering um, that
since the comprehensive plan was approved in 1999, there have been changes in marine operators. The comprehensive plan identified four marinas. Island Bay Marina was destroyed by Hurricane Ian and has not yet been rebuilt. The Snookbite Marina appears to
now be located at the former what the comp plan called the Mid Island Marina location. Uh and Fishtail Marina remains at the original location. Uh neither of the remaining marinas are located in close proximity to the downtown area. Uh
although the proposed CPD would increase wet slips, the dry dock storage and servicing of boats would no longer be present. So uh I'm going to go to the findings and conclusions. Okay. Okay. Um, land development code section
34-92 states the proposals to amend the future land use map must meet comprehensive plan policy 4C10 which is the intensity and density levels allowed by the future land use map may be increased through formal amendments to this plan if such
increases are clearly in the public interest not just in the private interest of a petitioning land owner. Petitions from land owners will be accepted annually and the town council may accept applications more frequently at its sole discretion. Um the town council must
make a decision based on whether the proposed comprehensive plan amendment is in the best interest as the quotation marks the public interest of the town of Fort Myers Beach. Um and I'm going to go over a few segments that I um suggest
including in your decision-making process. The marina future land use category limits the uses and therefore the potential economic impact of the land. Policy 4B7 marina in the comprehensive plan is designed to provide water access
to the water bodies around Fort Myers Beach. Um all marina uses listed in 4B7 which is marina are permitted in pedestrian commercial. Um although they are not proposed in the application for
CBD. the the CPD the um uh there are wet slips with the dry dock storage is going away in that proposal. Uh Fort Myers Beach is an island. Both visual and physical access to the water is an important component.
Uh the changes in the future land use car category will not necessarily limit the access to the water. It will be a different kind of access. Let me ask you a question on that one before you move on because I've always wondered this about the marina zoning
district. Why wouldn't it make more sense to adjust what is allowable within the marina zoning district versus forcing someone to come in and go from a less dense or no density to the maximum density? Wouldn't it make more sense
through the comp plan as we're going through it to adjust the marina designation and what the scheduled uses could be as far as density and intensity? So that would be a different kind of amendment. Um but that would impact not just this property, it would
impact all of the marina. Um and so I think there's a different would be a different conversation that we're having. Um this is a small scale. I'm not off the top of my head, but I think there would be a bigger discussion to talk about. What would you, if this is
small scale, what would you consider a large scale? Well, this is um I think what you're trying to characterize it as is a text amendment. Yes. Yes. This is a just a this is changing the map designation of the future land use category that it's
currently um categorized as. I think you kind of answered my question. Yeah. And the thing to keep in mind is is it changes the u the entitlements for the property. So by limiting the in what you're allowed to do, you're going to get a certain thing.
So if the in the creation of the comp plan, the goal was to have specific marina uses by identifying them as a future land use of marina, that's all you're going to get, right? If you open it up to more potential, then you may
get other things. So, it depends on what your your goal is for the property. With the pedestrian commercial land use, you could still have a marina. You could still have dry dock. You could still have that servicing, right? But you're also giving the potential of having a
2.5 F, which is a very large scale building, right? Especially on property. That that's where my that's where my concern comes in. Or is it does it make sense? And maybe I'm just out in left field on this, but to me, you know, mixed use and marina kind of go hand in
hand, right? You go talked about Key West and you go down to Key West, it's all surrounded by mixed use in the marina area down there. So it to me that makes sense. It just and I see what you're saying. You're allowing then more stuff by right, but you have the ability then to control or not force someone to
go this route and ask for a different complete zoning district to the highest most use designation that we have. This would provide maybe some people that are in a marina to keep it more of a dry storage type marina and allow them to
have some sort of mixeduse residential or or commercial on that property. That's what I was kind of getting at as far as if we're going to go through this comp plan amendment, does it make sense to look at that to try to not try try try to mitigate the few that are left on the island to keep dry storage because
we've heard that's an important thing for a place surrounded all by water. Just something to think about. Well, we are going to be talking about the comp plan in future meetings. This is not the it just to me this if that would have been in place we maybe
wouldn't be where we're at with this conversation. Maybe we would have been but it I think it might have alleviated some of the deviation requests. It might have really you know they could have still maybe asked for more outside of that but it wouldn't have gone from zero to maximum.
Anyway, continue. Uh, in the coastal management element, um, the section on land use conflicts notes, in few cases, marinas are completely surrounded by residential dwellings and the only access only road access is by residential street, thus
limiting future expansion potential to protect other existing uses. So, this is the comp plan saying they don't expect there to be other uses proposed because there is only residential street access to these properties and that would limit um the marinas from becoming other
things. But the CPD that you've seen is proposing their own street within the development to access their property. Um policy future land use 1B7 pedestrian commercial states that the commercial activities must contribute to the
pedestrianoriented public realm. The proposed map amendment would allow further development to contribute to this goal for old San Carlos and Time Square. Any new development in this area will be required to be pedestrian oriented. As you see on that prominade level, they've brought things down to
the ground level to be more pedestrian um oriented. The land use category of pedestrian commercial also encourages a mix of uses to contribute to the vibrancy of the area. Uh objective 3D, Time Square, is to stimulate the revitalization of the
downtown core area near Time Square as a nucleus of commercial and tourist activities. Um the proposed enlargement of the pedestrian commercial future land use would increase the number of available land uses permitted at the site. As stated by the applicant, the
old San Carlos Boulevard commercial corridor will benefit from the expansion of the pedestrian commercial designation and a redevelopment project on the bay will complement the recently completed Margaritaville resort and the proposed redevelopment of Time Square on the Gulf side.
Um, however, the proposed future land use map amendment will increase the potential for nuisance issues for the surrounding single family homes. Issues of noise, traffic, visitor guest vehicles, delivery service, sanitation vehicles, view obstruction, general
congestion can be associated with significant increases in commercial and lodging activities. Uh, these concerns are addressed in the companion CPD application, which you heard earlier. uh and the town council must determine the thoroughess of those mitigating measures
as proposed in the CBD application. Um staff has reviewed the requests for the comprehensive plan amendment and found that the comprehensive plan amendment request does not meet the requirements set forth in section
34-92 and comprehensive plan policy 4C10. Therefore, staff recommends denial of CPA 2023 0152, a request for a comprehensive plan amendment to change 3.53 acres of marina future land use and 1 acre of
mixed residential future land use to a pedestrian commercial future land use. However, if the town council finds that the concurrent CPD application for this area adequately adequately demonstrates that the proposed development is, and I
put in quotation marks, clearly in the public interest, not just in the private interest of a petitioning landowner, approval could be granted. Uh, approval of CPA 2023 0152 would be recommended if the
CBD application is found by the town council to sufficiently address policy 4C10. Did I not hear you read one paragraph of this or did I am I mistaken there where it says staff finds the request to the amended. Did you read that? I didn't read that. Is there a reason why you
didn't? Why time? Well, but that one it's a very powerful statement that you said and and and I'm I'm curious as to why you were so strong in your wording in that section. So, I'll read it if you'd like or you can read it. I'll read it to you. Okay. Staff finds that the
request to amend the future land use map uh to change 3.53 acres of marina and 1 acre of mixed residential to pedestrian commercial future land use is not clearly in the public interest. Creating additional commercial land adjacent to the existing downtown does not
necessarily provide a benefit to the town and will result in traffic and noise impacts to nearby residential uses through the elimination of the buffer between the intense commercial district and the neighborhood which could increase conflict. Additionally, the
area lacks sufficient pedestrian and bicycle infrastructure to support the proposed amendment which will increase density and intensity. So, I mean, that's a pretty powerful little piece of wording that you didn't read, and I'm curious as to why you were
I mean, that's pretty what you said there is pretty pretty poignant, but yet you didn't read it and and now you read it. But what what led you to those those very compelling words? So, in considering a comp plan
amendment, um, you're thinking about the long-term vision of the town. It's more than just a resoning that fits into the already agreed upon comp plan amendment, the the agreed upon comp
plan. The residents that are there were there with this expectation of the comp plan being I mean maybe they read the comp plan, maybe they didn't, but you you there is that expectation of this is what the town is going to move forward
with. Um, uh, anybody can bring an amendment to anything at any time. You know, the state law allows for that. And in certain cases, there's things that come up, you know, that the town couldn't foresee. The town did not foresee Hurricane Ian, right? Uh, and
and what kind of changes that would bring to the island. So, there's things that that happen. um the change in the land use has an impact on that residential neighborhood. Um and
so for me in reviewing it where it says clear public interest, it's not clear there is a a an an impact on that neighborhood. Now what I said when I get to the recommendation is is if you feel that the CPD has
accounted for that and they have mitigated what those uh issues can be um as you heard people are what people are concerned about then it would make sense to approve it if you feel like all of those issues have been resolved and and
mitigated. Um but this does have an impact on the long-term growth of the town. um as you said, what other marinas may see out there as a possibility. Um but
in this specific area, um you know, it depends on what you're trying to encourage that residential area. The zoning is residential conservation and the intent there was to
conserve those residences, right? Number of those houses were lost during the storm. some of them decided to sell. Um, so there's changing conditions. Um, I don't know if I'm No, I I I just you you
you covered what I wanted what Well, you ease what I was trying to ask you. You answered what I was trying to to find out. you're unclear, but through the discussion today at the next second reading potentially you can we could circle back on this because I would like
to know if your wording would be softened based on the discussion that we had at today's hearing and the subsequent hearing that we're going to have on June 2nd to see if your wording would stay the same or if it would change. Okay, fair enough. Um,
yeah. I mean, I would also be listening to see what the how the residents uh feel. I'm sure. Yeah. I mean, I think that's all encompassing as as to why you made your recommendation. I mean, and the the neighborhood just south, there's a lot of short-term, my understanding, a lot of short-term
rentals, but on the other side of the canal, it's, you know, they're restricted there. They can only rent out monthly. Um, and that's one of the things that one of the the residents said at at town LPA is that like well now it's going to change how he looks at
that property. Um and if the town wants to keep and encourage single family residential, this is going to have an impact there potentially. Okay. Questions for Judith? John? No. Mayor, nothing.
No, we do not. Okay. Megan. Good afternoon, Mayor Council. For the record, my name is Megan Strahorn. I'm an attorney for the applicant and property owner here. Um, there is Oh, let me just double check
something. Okay. Sorry. Sometimes I have to double check to see which presentation is up on the screen because they look they look identical. Um, so here with us today, we do have our team. I will introduce everyone um just for the matter of record. For our expert witnesses, we do have Ken Gallander and
Patrick Vaness from the Neighborhood Company. They've both previously testified in front of you all today on numerous occasions and have been previously deemed experts in their respective field. So, I'd ask that they be deemed an expert here today as well. And we also have Mr. Ben Freeland on
behalf of the property as the property owner. Some background. So, you heard the commercial plan development which was first. This is the com uh the comprehensive plan amendment. We're going to try and keep it brief. We got into all the nitty-gritty details with
the first agenda item. This is more of a broad scope wide lens review. Um this comprehensive plan amendment has gone before the LPA on two prior occasions. So, the first occasion was in April of
2024 when LPA recommended a denial. uh the primary one of the big criticisms and concerns uh in 2024 was it was very difficult to understand how to adopt a comprehensive plan amendment without
also seeing the proposed development. So that's why we handled and addressed these matters here before you today in the manner of which we did. So now that we have the CPD under our belt, we can focus on the comp the comprehensive plan amendment. This second time around we
had unanimous a recommendation of approval moving into this hearing and staff has issued a recommending a denial. So for the CPA this is legislative in nature. Um it is much more policy focused. It is much more
does this redesignation fit within the vision of your comprehensive plan within the intent of the comprehensive plan and does it work with the other elements contained in your comprehensive plan? it and we've already talked about the quasi judicial uh we still need the
applications the competent substantial evidence. So everything that we have submitted that Mr. Vaness and Mr. Gallander have prepared u would be entered into the record as well as this uh presentation. This was also part of many
many many many public community meetings prior to that LPA hearing in April of 2024. Um we Mr. Fre had received a substantial community feedback and he went back to the drawing board and that's the presentation that you heard
today and now we are asking for the final request. Now just to remind everybody this only pertains to seven of the 10 parcels because two three of which are already designated pedestrian commercial. So requesting to um redesate seven of those 10 parcels into the
pedestrian commercial future land use category. Without further ado, I I told Mr. Mass to keep it brief, but it's on you guys to to hold up to that. Good afternoon. Uh, for the record, my name is Patrick Vass, certified planner
with the neighborhood company. Yes, that's what I was telling Megan. I'm I'm like, you know, I'm not going to take responsibility for this. Um, we did go along, but I got thick skin, but I'm not taking that one for the team, guys. Just letting you know. But uh I I'm trying to
remind myself this is a great day. We've got a great project. It's Cinco de Mayo. It's beautiful outside and I feel just like you guys right now. Energy is not great, but I I keep reminding me that we've got a great project here. And um
I'll keep it brief, but there's a few things I need to touch upon. Um as you know this is the subject property. Um as discussed briefly before this is the map change. I do want to
highlight uh this idea of what the marina future land use category is or isn't. Um, I have to respectfully disagree with my fellow
planner that um, Marina is not a buffer for residential. Um, it is considered an industrial use. Yes, they've been good neighbors. They've coexisted with that neighborhood through the years, but I
think it it just uh creates incorrect incorrect optics as soon as we label a marina use as a buffer to the residential property. Um, with regards to um, consistency with the comp plan, um,
as I mentioned previously, when the comp plan was being put together, when the, uh, town was formed, there was consideration to extending the pedestrian commercial to that area. Again, um, the owners of the property did not want to consider that. They were
concerned about the big M casino use and they were afraid that might affect uh what they currently had as a as a property right. Um so there's always been consideration of that extension in that area.
Um with regards to consistency with the downtown core vision, we've been through that. Uh I think if you look at that vision and you compare that to what is being proposed, it is very consistent. It it it again as as your staff
mentioned there is a vision that is created a long-term vision through a comp plan and things change over time but what we are doing is we are working towards that vision and implementing that vision. So again hey this is a great day guys we're getting there.
Um and uh with regards to um the overall pedestrian uh commercial fusial land use category, it allows a plethora of uses and it does allow an F of up to 2.5. However, concurrent to this application,
you have a CPD that significantly limits things. So the CPD limits the F to a 2.0. uh by approving these concurrently. That's our limit. We can't go about that. The only way we could go about
that is going back through this entire process all over again. And I'm sure Ben has had enough for his lifetime. Um also you've got safeguards in the CPD. You got conditions, you got limitations, you got uh uses identified in there. Um so
again, while the future land use category is more permissive, the CPD is restrictive. Uh there was a question asked previously about what our F would be without the parking. Don't hold me to it. I will come back with an exact
number for the next hearing. I did some quick planner math and if you ask engineers they they always tell us that we shouldn't be doing math as planners but um we would be at a lot closer to 1.5 or less than 1.5
uh rather than the two um we've talked about the vision I'll skip through that um I went through the slide earlier on I'm not going to reiterate it but the same comments apply
I do want to talk about um marina uses allowing um pedestrian commercial allowing for marina uses and I I really liked what um Mr. Adult said with regards to democrat
democratizing democratizing um the waterfront. Um, what we'd like to point out is the marina today is a private marina and that means it services a few hundred people and that's
the access that is providing the benefit is provided to those that own a boat and uh lease space for their boat. What this is going to do is it's going to open up the waterfront and now we're going to have thousands of people that will have
uh enjoyment of that public waterfront. So I think that is a great benefit. Um so with that said uh we have a plethora of uh supporting documents in the packet um talking about various
policies and how we are consistent with the comp plan consistent with the intent and the vision. So, based on my professional planning opinion, um I truly believe that this request is consistent with the comp plan and based on our testimony and the evidence
provided, we respectfully request that you approve this proposed comp plan amendment. Thank you, Scott. Questions for Patrick? I do not. Karen, well, it's not really a question, but a statement, if you will.
Um, I'm the proverbial notetaker and I went back to notes that I took on April 16th of 24 when this came in the first time and I questioned the pedestrian commercial and it was verified by Sarah
Propes at that time that Fishtail is currently an already zoned commercial pedestrian. So, in my mind, this takes two of our three marinas and puts them in alignment with commercial pedestrian.
I'm not sure what um snook snookbite is at the I have no idea, but it was confirmed at that meeting that Fishtail is commercial pedestrian with a far 2.5. I thought Fishtail was in Santini zoning, which is still a 2.5, but no,
Sarah looked it up at cuz I asked the question that you can either confirm or deny. Yeah, I did. I thought it was in I thought it I could be wrong, but you took the notes. I took the notes because I asked the question, but the end result is the same. I think Santini is the only other one that is a 2.5, right? But to
date really no other even even in our approved residential or resident approved um projects that we have nobody's even come close to 2.5 I think the highest has
been maybe this one 2.0 Oh, but I mean it's allowable. Let's put it that way. And then two of the three two of the three would of our marinas would now be commercial pedestrian. That's
disappoint. I'll go back to my current meetings currents. Vice Mayor questions. I would just I would just say to the applicant, I do appreciate you combining the CPD with the comp plan amendment today. I think it's been very helpful and very fruitful and uh I don't I don't have any
additional questions. Uh John, none. You have covered most of mine. So, as of right now, all right, we'll open up for public comment. Any of you like to come up for public comment?
Good afternoon, Chris. Good afternoon again. morning, whatever it is. Good day. Um, thank you all for um your time today and listening to to residents and and trying
to work with um Ben and the team to find some middle ground here. Ben and your team, thank you for also listening to residents and getting us to a closer point on a project to be acceptable. Chris, can you state your name for the
record? Chris, 923 Third Street. I have I just wanted to bring this up. I don't want to be a dead force, but I think the um CPD application didn't visualize this well. on page 447 of your packet um of
in the CPA portion um you'll see an existing land survey of the of the property um that's being developed in our adjacent properties. Um all these little dots all over the survey map are
our ground elevation. So on our properties you can see on residential properties you can see on on residential properties. You can see our grade elevation averages 3
feet, 2 and 1/2 ft, 2 feet. It's pretty it's pretty low. Um, however, on the marina side of the wall, you'll see their their land averages 4 feet, 4 and a half, and and and and around there.
So, when the marina was built, they added 2 ft of grading into their land. And you'll also see where the concrete wall is, um, which is the bordering wall between their property and us. And you'll also see that there are storm
drains on their side of the property on our side of the wall. That's kind of what I'm trying to get at is Ben, I I appreciate you listening and you saying you'll provide an outfall um to the town and and to try and alleviate drainage,
but you've provided drains. We need more than an outfall. We need drains. Um and you're grading you're I'm I'm almost positive you'll be bringing in more fill on your site. Um, and again, I just think they stated in the past, we have a
letter from them saying these drains were installed for residents. They will be maintained in perpetuity. And we're seeing a project where they're being removed. And this, I think, just this survey shows that a little bit better. shows how low our residential properties
are and how high the marina is and why those drains were put in in that location on the marina property on our side of on our side of the wall. Um, so I just asked I want to there's not really a public forum to bring this. We have three minutes to put it out there.
I know it's doesn't really fall under the CPA request, but here here you can see there's drainage issues in our backyards that need to be be addressed. Thank you. Thank you, Chris. Anyone else like to speak? Leah,
hello again. Leah Greg, Bonita Street. So, you know, he made a good point, Chris, as far as the neighborhood. So, I know I asked Judith, have you been there yet? I've asked Judith, I've actually invited Judith to come to the neighborhood and check it out because when I spoke to her a few weeks ago, I asked and she said she never was. I don't know if all you have been, Karen.
I know you live there, but I would highly recommend, you know, you you check that neighborhood out because it's hard to visualize what our concerns are unless you really kind of understand that particular neighborhood. And and Patrick, just a quick question, but isn't the point of a of a hearing to
negotiate? I'm glad to have a better you're happier now. So, it was said that everyone will drive through the resort to enter and exit, but then it was said that there will be a hammerhead turnaround, which is new, that will allow people to enter and exit from the resort from Harbor Court or Bonita
Street. So, I'm really confused on that. I'm not sure which one it is. We could talk about that later, but I appreciate the effort to add do not enter signs in our neighborhood, but do you really think signs are going to deter anyone once they know they can access the resort via Bonita Street and Harbor
Court? We know people don't adhere to signs. Look at the lighted crosswalk, especially the one up by Margaritavville. It literally screams, "Wait, wait. Hands up. Don't walk." And people still walk when it's not their turn. So to say signs are going to eliminate people coming down that
neighborhood, it's just it's a it's not going to work. Again, once people know that that gate is available to access and exit the resort, there'll be no stopping them. And if you allow any public access, any at all, other than perhaps EMS, the traffic on these streets will increase exponentially and
it will be a safety risk. And again, you'll understand that if you see how narrow the streets are. These people are going to drop people off. They're going to turn around and they're going to fly back out to try to get in line to get in the main entrance. Um like many deadend streets on our islands, the trash and recycle trucks for residents, they back
in and they pull out. They do this on my streets in Matt Lachete. trucks do not turn around in my driveway. So, the subjective comment that was made that trash trucks will have to turn around in neighbors driveways is simply not true. Lee County trash and recycle, they're accustomed to operating this way. Many
islands have deadend streets. The they're very narrow. They back in, they pull out. It's never an issue. And keep in mind, one more thing. Anita uh the LPA chair, she asked for and Ben agreed to reduce the music again from amplified to ambient on the rooftop bar directly over
top of the homes on the one side of Bonita Street and third. Ben also agreed to move the bar from the outside to the inside, but I'm not sure if this is still happening. So hopefully we can make that happen. And lastly, Patrick said the drainage will fall on the town because this is important. If you've ever driven down third when it rains,
Karen, I'm sure there's your little car. I'm sure sometimes you can't even make it down there. you're going to have to turn around because it's just too deep. It's happened. Yeah, I bet it's happened to me, too. And I have a little SUV. So, so again, you know, it'll fall on the town. Now, keep in mind the current drainage we've all learned we have is flat. So, drainage is a big concern and
a huge expense, and we don't have the millions needed to add drainage in that neighborhood. Don't mean any disrespect, but unfortunately, I know you talked to uh about the uh CBD grant. There's no money left. We didn't ask for drainage. We didn't ask for any kind of storm water management like Bonita did who got
21 mil, Fort Meyers who got 15 mil. Cape Coral who got 10 and Lee that got 11. I'm just saying we need to figure out how we're going to pay for this drainage because if they're not going to and it's going to be put on us, you need to understand there's no money really available and if there is, please share. Thank you. Thank you much. Have a great
day. It's been a long one. Anyone else with public comment? Seeing none, we'll close public comment. bring it back to the council for discussion or motion. And just point of clarity, Fishtail is in Santini zoning district
and then and to answer uh the only marina that would be left after it would be the commercial marina which is Snook. It's zone CM. Is that correct? Is that Yeah. So I did I did check and confirm that council Woodson is correct.
Um the only maps are future land use um uh marina would be snook bite behind Publix. Um the fish tail is under future land use is pedestrian commercial. Um and it's its zoning is even marina. So
for for this property this future land use marina the zoning is marina and the same for bite but not for fish tail. Yeah it's so future land use but it is zoned. anti curry zoning map. Yes. It's not even zoning marina. Yeah.
Right. So, we're both right and we're both wrong. Does that make you feel better? No, it doesn't. That may be crazy. It has nothing to do with anything, but All right. Further discussion or is there a
motion? I will now close the public hearing and request a discussion or a motion from town council to approve. to approve with conditions or deny with reasons or a continuence to a time certain. Any further discussion? Again, I will start for the
same reasons I mentioned in the previous hearing. I will support this going to the second reading. See where it goes from there. Anyone want to make a motion? I'll move ordinance
25-05, comprehensive plan, smallcale amendment to a second reading scheduled for June 2nd, 2025 at 9:00 am. Anything else I need, Nancy? Um, consistent with u based on um the findings of fact that
made that was made by the planner and the testimony from um the applicants planner. I will accept that. Thank you. All right, got a motion by councelor King. Is there a second? Second. Seconded by councelor Woodson. Any
further discussion? Councelor King. I. Councelor Woodson. I. Councelor Sav. I. Vice Mayville. I. And I'm as well. That motion carries unanimously. We'll see you on the second. All right. Next is our administrative agenda. The first item is a resolution
of the town council of the town of Fort Myers Beach, Florida, approving and authorizing the town manage to execute change order number one to contract ITV-23-18-UT between the town of Fort Myers Beach and Andrew Sitework LLC,
increasing the contract amount by $757,545 41 and providing for an effective date. Frankie? Yes. So, basically what we're doing here is we're adding some space. How are you? State your name. My name is Frankie Trapic and I'm the community development
director for the town of Fort Myers Beach. Um, basically what we're doing here is we're adding some streets. Um, they're right there handling that portion of town. It uh made sense as they went and looked and it was on future expansion for tier one. So, we're
doing a couple of streets that were added. um our Gulf Island Drive, Bayside Road, Coral Road, Dolphin Land, and um Coina, is it Kina? Coina Coina Dolphin land lane lane. Sorry, just land on the
blue sheet. Um so those are going to be added uh to the current work. Uh just also a reminder that we're already about a year ahead of schedule uh with that tier one expansion. As you can see on the far south side of town, they started going and doing overlays of the areas
that were tore up. Um, we're slowly getting there. All right. And then do you want to explain the funding a little bit or would you like me to read through the where the town's portion of the funding is coming from? This is going to be coming from our fund,
our enterprise fund. And then also uh moving forward, we're having ongoing discussions with Angie Brewer who manages our our CRS our CRF loans through the state and that'll be coming up next week here.
Is it budgeted or we're looking find these funds elsewhere? The town's portion insurance. it was through insurance funds that we we actually had that in there. Uh the ability to do that, but what we're trying to do is as long as we're in an area, not to come
back there four years from now and say, gosh, we have to have a a tier 2 or whatever we're going to call it. They're mobilized. They're right there. They're going to take these streets and do it and they can. So, based on their economies of skill, since they're already there, it's going to cost us less. Correct. Longer. Yep. They're
already mobilized. Um they have some equipment and parts uh right along the stereo down the road and uh they felt that they could use a lot of that in that area. Well, that'd be great. Any other questions, John? Questions for
Frankie? They've been answered. Vice Mayor Councelor Woodson? Nope. Councelor Safford, I move that we pass resolution 25-121, tier one, change order number one. Got a
motion by councelor Safford, seconded by councelor King. Any further discussion? Safford. Hi. Councelor King. Hi. Vice Mayo. Hi. Councelor Woodson. Hi. And I'm an I as well. That motion carries unanimously. Next is a resolution of the town of Fort
Myers Beach, Florida, approving and authorizing the mayor to sign an employment agreement between the town and William McCanny to serve as the town manager in accord ordinance with the terms and conditions contained in the employment agreement attached as exhibited a as exhibit A to the resolution providing for conflicts,
severability, and an effective date. Karen, do you want to since you were the negotiator, would you like to Sure. Um, so I really want to thank Tisa for all of her input and help on this as
well as Nancy. Um, we were able to come to decision. Uh, we did go back and forth on a couple of items. Um, which I think the negotiations turned out well and in alignment. But basically what we have is um, you want me to go through
just the highlights of it? Sure. I' I'd be interested to hear what the back and forths were, too. Okay. Um, well, there was a back and forth on salary, uh, which we hadn't even gotten the offer out yet, but Will had come back. We asked him for bullet points as to
what was important to him. Um, and we had a different salary in mind. He had a totally different salary in mind. And we did negotiate to the 200,000. um which quite honestly when you look at market, you look at market in the area,
it's actually under market. Um not by much, but it certainly is in the ballpark. Um we had negotiations on the relocation and temp housing. Um we originally had that at
18,000. based on the estimates that he is receiving to move his household and that type of thing. They're 30,000 and upwards. Um so we did amend that with RO
and temp housousing to 22500 reimbursement. Um and he is going to get us copies of documents that will substantiate those costs. um benefits. He will go with the town's
normal benefit structure. Um we pay 100% of the employees and 50% of the spouse. Um the pension plan, the town contributes 10% per year. That's insurance, correct? That's his insurance.
Um medical, dental, that type of thing. um pension plan. The town contributes 10%. At this level, um the employee can contribute in his own funds up to 20%. What we did add was a five-year vesting
schedule. A vesting schedule means that of the town's money that gets deposited in this pension account that it vests over five years at 20% per year. So if
he leaves at year two, his vesting schedule is then only at 40% of the town's money. That's all he he would always get to take 100% of his own contributions, but it's 20% of the of
the town's contributions per year. So at the end of two years, it would only be 40%. At the end of five years, it would be 100% of the contribution. And you do this to promote longevity.
Um, we've asked for in case of a resignation, we have agreed upon 120 days written notice. We saw how long this took to find um our desired candidate and it's a long process. So,
uh, 120 days written notice with the resignation. All of this was agreed to um by will with a start date of May 19th. And then there was one other one. There was I know we had advertised we didn't
advertise or did we advertise it specifically that they have to live on island or was it open? No, it is. It was open. Yes. The council decided to change it to being open depending upon the individual. Okay. But I thought we have in the agreement that Do you have it in
the agreement that he would move on? Lisa, you need to be on the microphone. Yeah. So, sorry. I don't know if this is working either. Do you have one that's We did agree that it is on island in the final document in
the final employment agreement. He is going to be living on island. Yes. Tis Alivera for the record, human resources director. It was originally posted that that was a negotiable um item whether they would live the town manager would live on the island or not. However,
William McA has agreed to live on the island. Okay. Anything else? I think you covered it all. Well, I think that's it. Any discussion? Uh, councelor King. Uh, just thank you to all those involved um for
all your hard work in putting this together. Vice Mayor, tremendous process, tremendous outcome. Thanks to all as well who were involved in that process. Council Safford, I look forward to them starting on May 19th. Excited. All
right. With that, is there someone that would like to make a motion? I I will make the motion to approve resolution 25-145 approving the town manager employment agreement as negotiated between our
staff council liaison Woodson and our new potentially new town manager Mr. McKenna second. Sorry, Will, if you're listening. Got a mo. It's been a long day. Got a
motion and a second. Any further discussion? I'm an I. Councelor King. Hi. Vice Adhole. Hi. Councelor Wson. Hi. And councelor Safford. Hi. All right. Motion carries unanimously. Congratulations, Will. Looking forward to unanimously.
Unanimously. Unanimally. Unanimously approved. We're looking forward to seeing you and your wife uh become new residents. Next. Wow, that didn't take long to get an alert out. Good job.
I don't know what that meant, but we'll go to final public comment. Well, welcomes the new town manager. Oh, well. Oh, she's sitting back there. She's waiting to hit send. I'm still sitting. I think it hit send before we finished voting, but I could be wrong. You're lucky I didn't mess up any more words
that have been out before the final uh final public comment. Anyone wish to speak? There's no one here. So, we close public comment. Tom manager items. Thank you, mayor. Um losing my voice, but don't forget your individual meetings with Dr. Chris.
Uh strategic planning on Wednesday and Thursday strategic of this week. Um, want to just pat staff on the back and, you know, give some kudos for the great work they did with the NFIP process recently and we got it in there, you know,
uh, about two weeks ahead of time with their deadline and we got, uh, you know, taken off probation as of November 18th. Of course, I hope that we might have some elected officials that maybe work behind the scenes at the at the federal level to get that done quicker, but uh there also be an audit that will come up
to get back in the CRS program in good standing. So, a lot of work to still be done, but staff is is on top of that. Um, as as just mentioned, uh, Mr. McA will be here on May 19th. at that day I will step into a support role for those
last two weeks of my agreement. Um and and you know sit here, let him have the seat and still be here to support him during the meeting should anything come up related but he will take charge. Uh that'll be his first day and I I you can't have two two bosses. So I'll be
stepping to the background and working at his disposal at that point for those final two weeks. Um, and the last thing, there's no M&P meeting in May. Okay. So, I have one question, Yandandy. So when Will
McKenna comes say McKenna McKenna McKenna when he um is there going to be uh time set up like orientation if you will with all the different departments with council members that type of thing. Well, we've
already done one with staff. Uh, this last week we had a teams meeting and he was part of that and they went through projects and we started that process. We've been I've been part of the process the whole time just to make sure that it was just a smooth transition as you directed uh me to do. But yes, there'll
be time for that. That first week I'm going to try to get him plugged in to as many things. There's an event that comes up with the Florida League of Cities, Southwest Florida, Southwest Florida League of Cities that that we're going to plug him into to go with you. Um, I won't participate in some of those things. I'll let him do what he's
supposed to do. We will have I I assume your regular meetings that week, but that'll be something that we will continue to discuss to let you guys sit one-on-one with him or the staff, however we want to do it, just to make sure that everybody feels galvanized and they everybody understands, you know,
the roles we're all playing. We have already shared that with him at great length. I believe it was last Wednesday or Thursday. We had that meeting and it lasted a couple hours. He was he had some some questions. Not a lot, but some questions. So, we'll let that perk a little bit and we'll invite him back in
probably toward the end of this next week or the first of the next week to do it again just to bring up more information. But, we can set some things up. We'll work through Tracy to get some of those things set up with you and with Mr. McKenna.
McKenna. McKenna. See a McKenna. Yay. So William Stafford Stafford Stafford and Mc Anything else? Stafford. No, that's it. All right. Ums
um just for clarification. So, um our meeting on the 19th, I only asked this because we have several public hearings. Um who is going to be sitting in Andy's chair? Is it you or It's the new town at new town manager. The new one. Yeah. He swear he's being sworn in and he he'll
be I'll call you down here. He'll be here. Okay. What What do we have? We have several public hearings that day. So, we just need to make sure that he's adequately briefed. We'll plug you into him. Yeah. Okay. Um first of all, I just want to thank you
all for your patience. I know that um some of these quasi judicial um hearings that we've been having um they get quite long um because what we're trying to do is to put information into the record in the event there's an appeal. There's no
additional testimony that comes forward. It's all based on what is said and what is in your agenda material. So, it's very lengthy. However, in the event there's an appeal, it really gives us a leg up in trying to defend your decision
with whatever you make. Um, also I just wanted to get a little feedback. You had the uh reasonzoning today and a related um smallcale amendment. Did you like that order to see the resoning first and then the amendment or do you want us to
flip it? We could flip them and do the amendment first and then do the CPD, but usually the CPD has much more detail and that was the issue that the LPA had with that particular proposal. So, should we continue to come forward in this order?
Absolutely. Because I'm afraid that I doubt will happen, but you you always run the risk of changing a flu and then not approving the CPD and you open yourself up for a big can of worms. So, I think this was done correctly. Okay. Thank you. Just wanted that feedback.
Um, other than that, I don't have anything else to share with you this meeting. Well, since we're on it, I will ask you um I've been asked to have you uh give your opinion or not even opinion, explain the facts of the case with the Lola as far as um whether
they're being fine, whether not being fine, the rule of the magistrate. So, if you could just Sure. cover that as so it clears the out there so everybody understand. So, it's basically just a little status update. Um, bas uh I believe it was back in January. Um, we
had our uh evidentiary hearing and uh the magistrate did uh render an opinion uh issued an order um basically finding that they were in violation, gave them a compliance date of March the 1st. um
within their 30-day period, they chose to appeal that decision to the circuit court. Uh the process there is um there's I believe it's 70 days uh to get all the records filed. Um and then um a
appellent brief is filed uh which was just filed I believe last week or week before. We have 30 days to respond to that and we are in the process of drafting our arguments and presenting our brief. In the meantime, in a uh
typical code enforcement hearing, after the notice of violation is issued, after there is an order rendered, um after a compliance date is identified, uh code will go out and inspect the property. And if the property remains in violation
just as Lola is, a hearing would be held to basically find that they are not in compliance and request that any fine that had been opposed in the order would be certified as a lean. That is the typical process. However, in the event
of an appeal, um we are pretty much stopped from moving forward in that process. In the event that um assuming that we prevail in the appeal um we would then be able to begin
that process and go and request a certification of the fine. Um but in the meantime the fine would continue to acrue. However, we would not be able to enforce that uh collection of the fine. We do have a hearing coming up on u May
the 16th and we will be providing a status report to um the special magistrate. So just to clarify what you said. So there's a lot of Legal Beagle stuff in there. Not too bad. No. But what you said was that the fines are acrewing.
However, they're not collectible. They're not collectible, but they are acrewing depending on the outcome of the appeals court. Correct. Okay. I think you made it as clear as clear can be. I I try my hardest. That should end any confusion.
Hopefully. Hopefully. All right. Anything else? No, sir. All right. Council member items and reports. Counc. Yes. Uh, we had spoken a couple months ago about perhaps putting some 10-minute max parking downtown. I know the Nick is
is going to open very soon. And I I keep getting a lot of requests from the the restaurants down there about Door Dash or people just want to run in and get a you know their to- go order. Um can we
make some traction on trying to let's choose two two parking spots and let's try it for a couple months in offseason. Of course you can you guys show tell us which parking spots that we it just gets us out of the you know hot water with something. Don't put it in front of my
business. Don't put it in front of my business. That type of thing. I can tell you where I know. Put it out there. Okay. Now, yeah. Yeah. Right. Right next to the liquor store. Right. The first two spots next to Harbor House. Wouldn't it I mean, wouldn't Wouldn't it make more sense to put it under the bridge
where there's more parking available as opposed to Sure. Or you said, "Put me on the spot." Now, you see why we didn't put it out there. Right now, there's two different ways to go. So, give us one way. We'll do them both. We don't want to make that decision because it's not going to make everybody happy. Well, do we have to wait two
weeks till May 19th or can we just give direction now? I think yes, it's a public meeting. Well, I I would like to for the summer have two Door Dash or, you know, 10-minute max
spots, let's say, right next to Harbor House under the bridge. So, that would request a different signage. So, I mean, What would how do you see it working in your end? We would have to create different signage to accommodate that. I'll be very clear and just to be fair,
it's not going to be enforceable. If somebody leaves it there, I'd have to have somebody chalk the tire, sit with the tire for 10 minutes to see if they're coming or going. So, just understand that those spots are if they get filled up because they may somebody just park there and go to the bar because we don't know and can't define who's doing what with Door Dash and
everything else. So there would have to be there would have to be some more thought process put to the enforcement part of it. It's ultimately up to you, but you know definitely if you give me guidance on where you want it, I'll just get the new signage that will accommodate it. Well,
I'm kind of one of the things that was on my piggybacks as to what you're saying. Where did we leave? I know we had conversations about the parking passes, resident parking passes being able to be used in other areas besides just underneath the bridge. Could
someone refresh my memory as to did we ever make changes to that to allow it if we did? What was you did not. You you came up to an accommodation for the summer months off season to allow it on any of the town parking spots through the through the summer offseason months,
but there was never a change that allowed that to be the normal. And that's again that's there's no ordinance change to that. It's just really what you'd like to see happen. And didn't we do that through the the notification or the parking pass?
The parking pass. Parking pass on our windshield. Correct. Correct. Okay. Well, there's been some people out there that have come up and asked about is it possible to make that a year- round thing where the parking pass can be open to obviously they're willing to pay more
money for the pass to make it a year round pass that they could use not just outside of season but even during season they could use it. Maybe it's something needs to go to an MMP to discuss but I think that's a council decision. I think it's a council you want to do it. Yeah. You can decide that's what you'd like to
do going forward and give direction and we will follow that direction. Sir, I think piggybacking on this, I I would think we should seriously consider what we did last year to help help the businesses down there because the it it
got slow really fast and I would hate to, you know, let these guys struggle even a couple weeks if we can maybe get ahead of the curve. want to get your your guys' input, but you're talking about for the the residential
pass to be able to use it outside of just under the bridge. Is that what you're referring to? Oh, I support it. I'm just I'm even willing to support allowing it year round, not just outside of season. Again, at a different, you know, the different cost. So far, people I've talked to are not opposed to paying
more to allow the flexibility to be able to park in other areas. You know, it'd be nice to know how many residential parking passes we have actually we actually sell. We But in the meantime, piggybacking on what we did last year. I'm okay with
with doing that. I can get you that number. I don't have it right off hand right now because system. But yeah, I can have that for you. But we could give you direction if it's consensus to go ahead and allow that. Yes, sir. Now that we're out of season, how about this? Why don't you and I or you and the mayor go
down, see if we can pick out a couple spots, maybe talk to a couple of business owners. Let's see what works best. I'm I'm perfectly fine with you. That's for the door. I'll I'll I'll take the ball in. Yes, sir. But that's that's for the Door Dash 10 minute, right? But what
about for all the resident part? I say we open that up right now. I do too. Yeah, I'm totally in agreement with that. How about you two? It's fine. It's so loud down here. That's it. That's it. That's it. Andy keep Andy keeps talking to me. So, all
right. What else you got, Scott? That's it. Happy Cinco de Mayo, Felicia K. So, I just want to keep it on the radar because I know how things move so quickly. Um, we do have the end of
September coming up and we do have the motor home and RVs and everything else that will be suspended. um at the end of September. And so I don't think we've heard anything about
SB250 being extended to date there. I haven't seen anything come across, but I really think that we need to continue to revisit this. What do we want to do? I think we need to make our decision known sooner than later because right
now it is five months away. Five months away. True. Four months away. Four months away. It is four months away. You say potato ice. So I just want to keep that in the forefront. So can we bring it up at the
next meeting or an MMP? I mean M&P would be better, I think, just to discuss it. Well, there's not going to be an MMP. Yeah, we don't have an M&P until I think we've given a lot of direction as to where you know, memory serves me correctly. the direction has been the
three-year anniversary is kind of that deadline unless there was some changes to Senate Bill 250. I would feel comfortable bringing it forward as a would be an ordinance or resolution, whatever you think it needs whatever it's required to be, let's put it that
way, so that we can get the decision out there one way or another for people to be able to make plans. Well, the only thing you'd have to do because it sunsets, you don't have to do anything. It would just sunset. But I think but you need to get the word out. you know, you don't need to vote on it some setting. It's already in the ordinance.
Correct. I I need to go back and look at it. Um then you need parts of SB250 have been codified into state statute and so that's going to really override any type of um extending of it. Um I was talking about the the trailers and the permits
for part temporary use temporary use trailer. Residential or commercial? Residential. resial already taken care of with FEMA but Right. Right. So the residential ones I believe there's um actual codification of that um specific
provision. So I'll look at it again. So could we have that as not an M&P but an actual agenda item to look at and then because what I don't want to happen is all of a sudden we're in the July break. Now we're in August and people still don't know for sure if they're going to
have to move their trailers and get off their land basically um by September 28th. And I really want people to be very very clear. So we put on put on the 19th. Yes. It's two weeks.
It's an ordinance. So it's two re it would be two reads if they wanted to extend it or change it in some way or would be only one or is it just one? Yeah, if it is by ordinance. However, um if they're not changing anything, nothing has to be done. Just it's I I
need to look at this because um FEMA told us that we would not be issuing any more of those permits. that was one of the issues that we had um subsequent I think in July after the first report came out um and we committed to that. So
I need to do a little bit more of a comprehensive review um but I'll bring you an update for sure um on the 19th and if there's any action you can take then I'll try to tee it up for that as well. Sounds good. Perfect. Great. Anything else Karen? Nope. That's
it. Vice Mayor, just real briefly, I think we've talked about this before, but just to kind of as a reminder, since we don't have an M&P this month, I wonder if the following M&P next month, if everybody would still be interested in having the former Century Link fiber, which is now the Quantum Fiber, which is
owned by Lumen Technologies. Is there have you guys have you guys in your all your work run into anybody from that entity? That's It's changed a couple of times. We've got a name now. Oh, we got a got a new name. Just somebody could come in and give us an overview about what they're doing. Tracy, if you'll make a note of that, that'd be great.
That's all I've got. Thank you. I get a lot of questions about that. Thank you, Council King. I have nothing. The only thing I have it it kind of stems off what we talked about today for a future MMP whenever we can get it on there. We we tal we're seeing a lot more of the
Uber and Lyft drop offs and we've all seen them where they're dropping off in places they're not supposed to be dropping off. Would it make sense to look at on Third Street, we have those five or six parking spots there that are either the last to fill up during season or don't
fill up at all? To me, that's an easy on, easy off centrallylo area to be able to drop people off to be able to go to where they need to go and get back in and get back off the island without blocking up to boulevard. So, if there's someone else that would like I'd like to
add that for discussion for that just that section there is our designated like a ride share location like our ride share location pickup and drop off area that we can pin people can can easily go there and know where they're supposed to third street under the bridge under the just
out from under the bridge. It's Yes, sir. Right at just before the stop sign at Crescent. Yep. There's like five or six. There's six. Yeah. That was part of a an old agreement space that we had with a property owner there. So, we opened that up, but we did put some signs up on Third Street already. We can
increase we can increase that as well. Uh, you and I had had a conversation I conversation with the boss about uh doing that ride share at the end of third closer to Old San Carlos and then over by Northero as well, but we can add more. Well, no, either I don't think we
need multiple. I think one is enough, but on Third Street, if we've got those sections that we could use, it's worth looking at. It's a good location. Is that Rick and Ray's old property? Uh well, yeah, it's just past um where uh
uh Lo's place was. It's just a hotel. Yeah. Well, what used to be there on the corner yet? Okay. That section, but you're saying there's a section closer to Old St. Carlos that we have closer to so is what we we looked at initially to have some signs put up there. Um I know that's in process. PW had to get some
locates. Yeah. Get some locates, get new posts put in and we already had we had the signs made up for me. I think it would make more sense to have it closer to Crescent for the drop off, but I'm okay to have the discussion of either one. It's open. Whatever you'd like to do, we could do it down there as well. I
just they want to come in and pull in and pull right back out. So, we'd have to reline part of that space down there because right now it's lined for uh just vertical parking. So, if you're going to we'd have to open part of that up and then move it over. So, either way, it doesn't My wife's going to kill me
because she loves the parking. I should have probably discussed it with her first. It would have been a smart move in your window. So, is everybody okay with discussing that? Sure. We need to bring sounds good. That's all I got. One thing. Yes, sir. Um, Mother's Day is coming up
Sunday. Happy Mother's Day to all the mothers and those of us who are without our mother. Happy Mother's Day. So, wait a minute, Annie. Is this your last meeting then? Kind of. Sort of officially. Not not I'll be here, but I'll be at Will's disposal at that point. I thought we can say something
nice about you at that point. I let you not. All right. Please come in the same way. Wait, so we can say something nasty about you? Okay. Go out the same way I came in. Just no fanf fair. Come in. Go out. Yeah, but I never got I never got my boot back from
Never mind. Touche. Move to got a motion to adjurnn. All those in favor signify.