WEBVTT

METADATA
Video-Count: 1
Video-1: youtube.com/watch?v=-HBL2SH5Iuc

NOTE
MEETING SECTIONS:

Part 1 (Video ID: -HBL2SH5Iuc):
- 00:00:05: Meeting Called to Order and Roll Call
- 00:01:09: B1 Business Zone Ordinance and Pipeline Opposition Letter
- 00:04:40: Approval of May 4th Meeting Minutes
- 00:05:30: Motion to Open Floor for Public Comment
- 00:05:47: Public Comment: Linda Powell on Northeast Supply Enhancement Project
- 00:17:30: Correspondence: Wetlands Interpretation and Duke Farms Presentation
- 00:20:40: Site Plan Review: Judy Rosier Deck Variance
- 00:28:59: Site Plan Review: Ralph Street Subdivision Variance
- 00:33:55: Site Plan Review: Habitat for Humanity Kas Street
- 00:55:06: Home Energy Assessment Outreach Grant Discussion
- 01:08:17: Motion to Recommend Energy Assessment Grant to Council
- 01:09:04: Committee Reports: Film Screening and Shade Tree Ordinance
- 01:18:59: Discussion: Asbestos City Film and Manville Flooding
- 01:23:30: Old Business: Various Updates and Status
- 01:27:01: Old Business: Rodgress Plaza Pedestrian Access
- 01:35:14: Onyx Warehouse Application Dead and Future Land Use
- 01:37:42: Council Meeting Discussion and Motion to Adjourn


Part: 1

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This meeting of the Franklin Hatchup Environmental Commission is called pursuant to the provisions of the open public meetings law. This meeting of May 18th, 2026 was included in the list of meetings noticed sent advertising newspapers posted on the B board in the

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mun building posted on the mun website and remained continuously posted as required notice under the statute. position. A copy of this notice is and has been available to the public and is on file in the office of the municipal clerk. >> Good job. Okay.

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>> Okay. Then we'll do a roll call. Okay. Is that next? Yes, it is. And roll call. Okay. Walter >> here. >> Easy. Not here yet. Ted Chase >> here. Stan >> here. >> Arnold >> Maria she not here. Ellen

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>> present. >> Vicki >> here. and me. >> I'm here. Okay, that done over here. Oh, report from the environmental to come, Mr. Chair. Just a couple things just to catch everybody up

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to date. Um, there's been a new ordinance uh that passed its B1 um first reading at the town council this week. Little last week. >> Yeah. >> Easy. It just came. She's right. >> Oh, good. Okay. Good. Anyway, the new

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ordinance regulating the B1 business zone was passed on first reading by the township council. Deliberations are now underway to determine what tweaks might be needed. A meeting was held this morning by Councilman uh Councilwoman Uden to review the proposed ordinance

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and discuss what was possible or not. The proposal limits warehouses to 150,000 square ft. The original proposal, I remember, was limiting to 400,000. So this is a move in that direction. It imposes setbacks on and the tree plantings. Bans data centers on

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environmental grounds, power and water usage. It also bans new warehouses which are more than a mile from the exits or entrances to 287. This proposal has been reviewed by legal counsel and said to be enforceable.

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Surface percentage was held at 60%. So the readiness is required for all warehouses, not just those over 100,000. Um yeah, I added that in. So that's that's what's going on. That was just this morning at 11 till 1:00. Kiki and I

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were there. Mike was took part. Um there was people from some of that run and uh some people can kind of walk and David I think is from uh Renaissance and Ke um >> yeah I think that's about everybody.

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Yeah. Oh and Ben Cordon who is the president of one of the homeowner associations at Canal Walk. So and so the people that wrote this thing Kiki you were part of that >> the whole committee. Yes. >> Yeah the committee. Yeah. So, um, so

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that's and and as Mike Osini said, he was there also for us. Uh, the sooner this is done and improved, the sooner we can stop anybody who's thinking about putting application in. That's that's the that's the hurry. You know, it is a driving force. I know there are other

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things other people would like to see done as well, traffic and such, but it's not part of this ordinance, but it can be done elsewhere and we'll work on that as well. So, so that's one thing. And then Linda Powell is here. Um, she sent

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around a draft of a letter that we she'd like us to send to the new governor opposing the pipeline. Is that what it is about? >> I'd like you to do sign on to the letter. >> I'll sign on to the letter. >> We're going to send it all together.

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>> Everyone is signing on. >> Is that going to require a motion? probably later make a motion to uh for the environmental commission to sign on as a signing to add our name to this letter that Linda's going as remarks.

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>> I guess we can all in favor >> let's let's write we we're getting close to public comment. >> Okay. In fact, um I want to stand still. Okay. So then we have approval of the May 4th minutes.

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>> Anybody have any changes or edits? >> No. Ted, you've done a good job. >> Thank you, Ted. >> You have anything, you know, unfinished sentences in the notes or anything like that? It was It

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was a good It was a good meeting. It did move quick. >> I just have a first from Walter. I don't have a second on note. >> Oh, okay. Oh, second. >> Second. >> Second. Arnold's second. >> Um,

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first is there. Okay. So, now we're up to public comment. >> Did we vote on it? >> We vote on the on the letter >> on the minutes. He said >> on the minutes. Oh, all approve the minutes. >> Favor. >> Everybody nods. Yes. >> Yes. >> Okay. Done.

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The capital. Okay. I brought one home. Okay. So, we done approval of the minutes. Then we need a motion to open the floor for public comment. >> So, move. >> Second. All in favor? I >> I >> Hi. Some of you know me, not all of you

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do. My name's Linda Powell. And just about this time, 10 years ago, I found out about a project called the Northeast by Enhancement Project called and um tech can tell you all about it. Uh a lot of people wrote, you know, my

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first draft that I sent out, >> what's the name of the project? >> It's Northeast Supply Enhancement Project. Um, if you look at this letter, it explains basically what um, it includes a gas powered gas

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compressor station, the most polluting type in Franklin on Route 27 right by the Big Buddha right behind that. Um, and a new section of pipeline under Ritton Bay or New York Harbor. It's also part through Old Bridge and Fairville,

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which I didn't put in. If I put in everything everyone wanted to me, it would I could have made it into a doctoral dissertation. Um because you know just the health impacts alone could have been a book. Um and a new section

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of pipeline um that offers no benefit offering no benefit to New Jersey. So basically um this time since Hokll had made a deal with Trump, the the New York um New York State

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Department of Environmental Conservation had passed the water permits which were denied two or three times before. I lost track. I know I think the last time was 2018 and 2019. That's right, Ched. I

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know your memories better than mine. um and Murphy just followed suit with whatever New York was doing. So this time he did the same thing even though basically the the project has not substantially changed since it came out

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um in 2017 to the first part of their application came out to NJ. The one part that we hadn't dealt with previously because it wasn't an issue was the Tidelands Resource Council. I

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don't know if anyone was on that call um on May 6th, but we had I believe 43 people speaking against the project with very, you know, wellthoughtout, detailed factual comments and two people from

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like manufacturing groups that said things like, well, if we we don't have this project, then our our um you know, electricity bills are going to go up. And um a couple weeks ago, I think it was the end of April when there

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was uh I think it was Cheryl's first ask the governor, I had gotten on and asked a question. It was a it was like a a quarter of the question that I had prepared about Nessie. That's what we call it, the Nessie project. And um her

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answer showed that either she was misinformed or illinformed about the project. So, you know, um it ended up that the title and resource council passed this and one of the things I had mentioned which I added um to to the

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letter was about poor treat. And what I did was I looked up the material safety da d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d da sheet and I basically quoted the material safety data sheet and it was obvious that people from Tidland's council had never heard of this before. So when they came back from the

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executive session, they asked uh Representative Williams, William Transco is the fossil fuel giant that's um behind this project. Um if it was safe and I believe um they said something

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like, "Well, it's natural." Well, so is arsenic >> and lead and mercury. Um, so we, you know, and they came out and they passed it unanimously and they said the the rationale was because FK and NJ

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had passed it. Nothing to do with what would actually happen to the tidelands with their permission of this pipeline, this pipeline. Um, so basically, you know, uh we're we're

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we're going to get all the pollution from the compressor station. Um which believe me impacts every system in the body. I've researched this. Um although I lost a

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lot of my articles because my hard drive crashed and I lost a lot of stuff. It was during the pandemic. And um you know, one of the things that's always mentioned is the cause of premature death. So basically, you know, besides polluting the water and the air

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and you know, all of us, that's how we get it. And in terms of um the bay, as you know, there's been decades of work trying to clean up the bay from the height of pollution in the 70s. And

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these toxins have now settled underneath the seabed. And all this will be dug up, okay? And then um you know resuspended into the water. And the other thing was I was not aware

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of um at the beginning of this cuz we were more focused on the compressor station where like clean ocean action and all the shore people and even all the shore towns by the way signed resolutions against even all the Republican towns. And um of course we

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were one of the first to sign signing a resolution against this project and we probably did it a few times. So basically I'll read you that one sentence or maybe two sentences. It says Williams Transcola plans to release 3.2 million gallons of seawater treated with

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Core Treat 15316. The manufacturer's data set safety sheet describes core treat as a chemical toxic to humans and other life forms and states quote the product should not be allowed to enter drains, water courses

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or the soil. End quote. So basically this is our last ditch effort. Um we've been asking people to call the governor and to write the governor. Um and I guess people have been doing that and I you know I've been doing that

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myself. Um, I know what she said on the radio program. She said, "This is clean gas. It's not frack gas," which of course it is. And she said, "And we need, we're still using, I think she said 63%, I forget the number exactly.

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I'm not good with some details um of our energy comes from gas, but we're not getting any of this gas." And the other thing that I wanted to mention is that the the name of the company who's the sole um

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customer for this gas is called National Grid. And I think that some people think when they hear that the gas is going to National Grid, they think it's going to energy grid. National Grid is a European

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company. Okay. which also happens to own a LNG depot in Brooklyn. So, you can imagine what they're doing. And then the other thing, which is not in this letter, but I did hear it when I was at the rally in Trenton um a couple weeks

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ago, I think it was on May 7th. I know that cuz it was my husband's birthday. Um, one of one of the people and it was from a Guardian article said that the fossil fuel companies since the war in Iran have been making $30,000 an hour profit.

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So, you know, anyway, that's not in here, but um, so we're asking as many organizations and individuals as possible to sign on to this. Hopefully with my lack of typing skills, I'll be

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able to copy and paste all the names in and try to get this out by by the end of the week. >> And I added I added in the back u you have an MSDS for what chemical?

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>> What? You have the MSDS material safety. >> I don't have it. I looked it up online. I read read through it. >> It's for what chemical. It's >> called core treat. C O R R T R E A T. Let me find the number. 15316.

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And it's used to line the pipes so they don't corrode as fast. Although frack the chemicals of frack are known to corrode pipelines faster than usual. This our part of the most of

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the pipeline is was built in the 60s. Figure out how old it is. >> Actually better living through chemistry. >> I'm going to email this to the governor. That's what I'm >> We're going to email one letter um and a lot hopefully a lot of names

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and organizations. I already had a list going. Would it be worthwhile you sort of start off with referencing your last chat with her last week? That may trigger some memories with the governor. >> Well, that was the the um demonstration

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of capital was for the um what what used to be called the the climate super fund act which is now called um um polluters polluters pay. >> Yeah. or more affordable,

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make this place for more affordable energy or something like that. I didn't bring the bill numbers with me, but those are bills that um they're trying to get in front of the the full legislature and there's been some hold up there. I know uh Senator Smith, who's

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my senator, well probably yours, too. Um had said to me that he wanted it to be the first thing out the first first day of the meeting and he didn't get to do that. So he's still trying. He has I think 18 sponsors in the assembly and I

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forget how many in the Senate. >> Senator Smith is a chemist. He has a degree in chemistry and being an attorney. I love talking to him. Anyway, I will I will leave you to >> but

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send me the list. >> Okay. >> Email me the list and um I'll add you guys. Thank you very much. >> Thank you. >> Thank you for all the awareness >> to put in my mail and ballot box. >> You've dedicated your

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pretty much your last 10 years to this. >> Yeah. Really? Well, a chunk of it, right, Chad? >> Thank you so much. >> Thank you. >> Thank you very much. >> Yeah, I I didn't add everything you said, but I did add some words here and

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there. >> Yeah, I know. If everybody added something, it would get >> Yeah, it was it was getting that way, but it's going to be in an email, so it won't all look like >> Thank you. You do great work. We love you.

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>> Thank you so much. you and good work. >> Well, you have any comments? >> Oh, does anyone have any questions? I'm sorry. >> Thank you. >> The uh motion to close to the public.

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>> All in favor? I >> Okay. Um there was one letter of correspondence which is not here but it was a a request by a developer for a l letter of interpretation uh wetlands and

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such for 200 Franklin Square Drive. Franklin Square Drive is where I spent 1987 to 2003. It is at the end of it's on day Davidson Avenue. There's a thing 11 100 Franklin is at the corner of Davidson and

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Franklin's square drive and 200 is in the back. It's a fourstory building. Um was the headquarters for Philips Lighting for North America and for a while for South America has a hel. >> So but there is a stream behind it and

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uh look like the drawing look like the retention plant but it's been empty. Phillips left about four years ago and I heard there's some medical people had moved in there but I don't know what's going on but obviously somebody wants to

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do something so it was the usual engineering stuff asking for the letter of interpretation. So that was the the total correspondence. >> Uh yes I think there was uh oh yes I had one one piece of correspondence that

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came in from Lindsay Brewbaker. Um she's a community-led conservation coordinator for Duke Farms and she wanted to know if we would be interested in having her and her colleague Craig Chase um come to one of our meetings to present about the connecting habitat

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across New Jersey tool um which is basically a habitat based approach to planning and land conservation. We've used it here, we've discussed it here before the open space committee. So I did tell her we are some somewhat familiar with it but they still would

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like to come and do a presentation maybe. So I wanted to know is it are you guys interested in that? Yeah. >> Do you want me to see if they can come to either meeting in June or >> Okay. >> I was going to tell them if they have a certain amount of time to >> I usually try to tell people they have

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like 15 minutes or so. Um you know so but I can put it on the agenda at least so that I have a spot. >> I like multimedia if she can do that. I'm sure they will. Yeah, I'm sure Lindsay Brew Baker can come either Well, really anytime she can come. I guess

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it's fine. In the next few meetings, >> you you know what our schedule is and you'll find something that works. >> All right. So, that I think was it for correspondence. >> What was the name of the person? >> Uh Lindsay and the last name is Brew

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Baker. B R U Baker. Spelling is >> Yeah, there you go. And she is from Duke Farms. Duke >> Farm Community Gardens at Duke Farm. >> Yes. Yep. Okay. That was all the correspondence.

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>> Okay. So then what the site plans? >> All right. I have mine on the map already. If you don't mind if I start. >> Do you know crack chase? Present. I'm just writing. >> Chase is his first name.

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>> Is that so? >> I think it is. Yeah. I think I said Craig Chase, but I think it's Chase. Craig, it looks like. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. You're right. >> Save plan memo. Okay. Here we go. All right. So, I'll start with mine. EZ has

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one and Ted has one this time around. Um, so the first one, I'll show you the map where it is. It's this piece of property right here, this house. So, as you can see, it's a narrow lot. Um, the name of the applicant is Judy

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Rosier. Uh, it's at 1661 Amwell Road. And what they are looking to do is to put in a ground level composite deck in the rear of the yard off the existing residence. It'll be about 418 square ft. Um, in addition,

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they want to add 195 square ft of new pavers from the residence to the deck. Um, they need a variance for the sideyard requirements because, as you can see, this is a pre-existing non-conforming lot. And as you can see, it's very narrow. So, meeting the

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sideyard requirement is very difficult. Um, this is the existing residence right here. I can bring up the they just submitted a very basic architectural plan, but it looks like basically the pavers will come off of I guess within this area and the deck is actually kind

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of in the yard area over here. So, the only real requirement they need is um the variance for the sideyard. >> So, the deck is not attached to the house. No, I'll show you the um let me show you the

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>> in what units? >> So they are let me just get this real quick. >> They are 15 feet is required and they would only have five feet. >> Oh, okay. >> Yeah. Let me get the um

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planning or zoning. Uh this is zoning. Okay. I'll show you. It's a very simple um sketch that they put in, but it kind of helps to see it. Okay. So, see you can kind of they didn't

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really submit anything that great, but you can kind of see here the deck is So, you see this round structure here is where do I map it? Oh, here it is. is this round structure here >> just for reference. Bless you.

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>> Thank you. >> So, it'll be this deck area over here and this is the pavers. So, the pavers will come off the back of the house and you'll walk on some pavers until you get to 418 square ft of deck. The problem is right here is only 5 ft and it's

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supposed to be 15 ft. >> Is this going to hamper their impervious coverage number? So they don't know they're still under the required amount of imperous coverage. When I went through and did all the mapping and looked, my recommendations were that

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pvious pavers should be used for the pavers that they're, you know, proposing. Anyway, um if they don't use pvious pavers for whatever reason, this would be a perfect place to use pvious pavers. That was a lot of P's in a row to hear that. I was like, this is a perfect

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place to use pvious pavers. Um Yeah. Um, if they don't want to do that for some reason, we can tell them maybe a small rain garden to deal with the imper the extra impervious coverage, although they are below the allowable limit.

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>> Um, and I also said maybe some buffering, although it's going to be hard because they already have a limited space of 5 ft. But I mean, they're going to be, you can see on the map, they're going to that deck is going to be I mean, the next neighbor's house is right here and their backyard is right here.

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>> Can you zoom out for a moment? >> Yeah. >> Well, this is going to go to the is going to the zoning board. >> This is at the zoning board. Yeah. >> And the zoning board is going to make comments on the setback or the side setback or whatever. And they'll probably comment on on um buffering.

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>> They will. Yes. But we can we have in the past, you know, requested buffering. It's just going to be difficult here. Not saying that we can't do it, but the use of pvious pavers I think is a no-brainer. >> Yes. >> There's more room once you're beyond the fence behind the house,

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>> right? >> So they they could use some of their land for a buffer. >> Yeah. >> This uh the area where kind of stars work. >> This is Amwell for your reference. See

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this run goes starts somewhere here and goes back. Although no no because this is this is the school. I think this room is here. That's right. Okay. >> So that was the only comment I had. Everybody good with that? Or any questions? You

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>> think it's made of wood or >> uh it's made of composite? Let me see what they said it was made of. I want to say it was called composite. Composite just has So it's like not wood. It's that like uh plasticky kind of

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>> Oh, there's a T. >> Oh, it's called TX. >> Yeah, TX. >> It's like Is it made of wood or >> No, it's not. I'll show you a picture. It's TX. It's called It's basically what people use for their decking cuz it lasts forever. You never have to stain

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it. >> Um >> Yeah. So, it looks like for example, like it looks like this. So it looks like wood but it's not. It's like this plastic composite >> because it will make microplastic. >> Yeah, it's microplastics and recycled

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wood. So both it's a mixture of wood. >> It's eco-friendly. >> It is supposed to be eco-friendly. >> It is. That is what it's like. Yeah, it's >> not taking any trees to make the deck. >> Okay. Extremely expensive. >> It is.

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>> Is it like one would be instead of the deck or for the space between the house and the deck. >> For the space between the house and the deck >> is one solid sheet or or it's planks. It could certainly leave a space, you know, to allow water.

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>> It's just like it's just like a deck. >> Yeah, >> it's just like a deck. >> It doesn't look like it's far off the ground. At least when they look look at the drawing. >> All right. >> Does it have spacers in between that allows water to seep through? Yeah, they usually

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>> they usually do because this is like how it kind of looks. Let me look at their >> I mean it's it's very hard to tell. >> That was not the purpose of the drawing. >> Yeah. >> Now what surprises me is that they already

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have uh quite a bit of outdoor space. I don't know how big the house is. >> Wait. Why they want to do it there is what you mean? >> Right. >> I'm assuming just because of the proximity of the house. Was that your building? That's supposed >> just to be close to the house. Yeah.

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Yeah. Cuz you're right cuz they could go way further back. Yep. >> Yeah. >> It looks like your um sand just you know they're installing a nonwoven ge geoexile filtration fabric beneath the entire deck.

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>> I'd love to grill that underneath. >> So I guess there is something there. Nonwoven geoexile filtration fabric. So that'll go beneath the whole deck. Yeah. >> Okay. So, it implies that water may goes through it. Yeah.

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>> Correct. Yeah. >> Any other questions on that one? >> Ezy, you want to head over to yours? >> Sure. >> Okay. Let me get the map up. >> 420. Do you have maps in here? You have >> I just have a No, I just have the plan, but can you pull up the map? I Yes. Didn't get a chance to look at the map.

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>> 426 Ralph Street. All right. Um, let me get this out. >> This is an identical um uh >> Oh, you're under planning, right? Yours is planning board >> asking for a C2 variance and again on, you know, the the front lotage uh

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>> 426 Ralph Street, right? >> So, the big property lot, we want to subdivide it into three different sections. there's already an existing house on on the property. Uh they're going to just divide that whole property into three parts and construct two

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single family unit dwellings on each of those lots. And the third lot already has the existing property. So that's >> is it this and this? I'm sorry. This one, this one, and this here. >> Yes. The house. Yes. >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> So it's this two and it's this two

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>> on each side of the house. >> Yes. >> Got it. Okay, that makes sense. All right. Do you want me to pull the plans up? >> All they're asking for is a C2 variance. If you can look at my word document, it has everything in it. >> Yeah. Okay. >> He's subdividing with one intention. Two more houses.

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>> Two more houses. >> So, it's going to need more um utilities in they're doing all that water. >> Exactly. And that, you know, the the little arch is where all the utilities and uh you know, public maintenance will go into. Um they are asking can you

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slide up a little bit in terms of the variance and if you can make it bigger I can't read I'm so sorry. >> Oh you're okay. >> Yeah. >> So they are asking for a variance where you know the minimum uh requirements are 75 ft for lot one and they are proposing

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50 ft and the other one in terms of the square effective square area it's required is 55 x 55 they're proposing a 50 x 55. So some variances are required. The justification they give is that all properties in that neighborhood follow the same pattern. They have all asked

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for variance of that space because of the the nature of the property. Yes, it's already built in there. >> In doing so, they're going to cut down trees and they have given a very detailed plan of replacement. They're going to replace 13 trees on top top left. Yes.

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>> How many trees are being cut? They've >> given the whole list over there of what they're cutting. If it's not clear there, is it clear? >> Uh yeah, for the most part. So it says um total replacement required. So they're replacing 13 trees. Oh, trees removed.

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>> And they give them based on calipers. I think the first um uh first lot is 4 + 3 + 10. I think that's the order, >> right? Yeah. >> Yes. >> 13 number removed.

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>> Yeah. And then they're doing a doing a calculation for whatever the rumor. So they've done the math correctly. It looks like the math is correct and they they're planting even native species. So which is okay in terms all I'm recommending is plant more trees if they can if they have if the area permits

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plant more um have street lights to be LED based and u construction time to be during non-destructive hours. That's it. Got it. >> Okay. Makes sense. Anyone have any other questions

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on that one? It's just a subdivision basically then. Okay. >> All right. >> It's a very narrow lot though. >> Very. Where's the map? I mean very. Yeah. >> Do they say how big the houses are going to be? >> Yes. In the in the plans they've given.

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If you open if you open one of the plans >> cuz the existing house looks quite large. >> Huh. the existing house. >> So the property is going to be divided into 10,000K. 15,000K and 15,000. So 15,000K is the actual existing lot for the existing property. And the the other two are

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going to be 10,000K and 15,000K square ft. >> Okay. >> Where's the size? Is it in here? You're saying >> go up. No, in in in the on the website. Sorry. >> Oh, on the website. Okay. Yeah. >> Link number two. If I'm down.

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>> Yeah. the 15. Just open one of those. I think it's one of those which show the houses. >> Oh yeah. >> Uh where does it say the actual >> shotgun house? >> 2643. >> Two stories. Yeah.

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>> Yeah. Two stories. 2600 roughly. >> That doesn't look too >> any other questions on this one. Rentals? >> No, they all rent out. Yes, of course. >> All right. Okay. So, that one's done. So, then Ted,

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we have yours, which is Habitat for Humanity. And you're under zoning, I think. Correct. >> Yeah. Zoning below. >> Zoning. I have your sheet. >> Kas Street, the corner of Camp Street, which is

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>> 29 Cas Street. All right. >> Okay. Let me just get this in the map. 29 Kasa Street, Somerset. Okay. >> They're all super narrow, right?

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>> Okay. All right. >> Now, we going to put >> just what you have. >> Oh, it's 11 out to four people in. So, this one over here. The one on the on the left as well. Okay. So, it's these

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two these two lots. All right. You want me to put up your sheet? Okay. Here we go. >> Basically, well, they want to build a small ranch house, and I'm sure they want to keep the cost as low as possible. Uh there

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are two trees at the side, sort of a double tree at the side, two towards Kent Street which are to be retained and two on the property line on

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the other side which are to be retained because they're right on the property line. They couldn't take them down. >> Okay. And there's one behind which is actually I think in the township right ofway on Kent Street. But there is one tree

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which would be in front of the proposed house which they say they have to remove >> and I I would simply ask them, do you really have to >> Right. Right. Right. And then yeah. >> So you're talking about this tree up

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here. >> Um >> and this new tree over here. >> Um the one closest to Kasa Street, which is that one. Yeah, that's the one that's proposed to be removed. >> Okay.

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>> That the one up there is the one that I think is in the right way. >> It looks like it is. >> It appears to be quite a large tree. It does. >> And then there's what seems to be a sort of a double tree. >> Yeah. Here >> in between. No, there there's those over

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there on that. >> Oh, here. Yeah, you're right. >> Yeah. So, they really are keeping most of the trees. Not that there are a lot, but >> Okay. >> And they're proposing a a stone

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driveway, which of >> Oh, yeah. the cheapest thing they can do for a driveby. Um, I always remember Ellen Richie. Probably nobody here would be has been

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around long enough to remember Ellen Richie, but she was director of planning in the late 90s and for the next decade. And I won't go into what happened, but uh she once remarked that a stone

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driveway is to be considered impervious surface because you could pave it over in one day. >> It's an interesting concept. >> So wouldn't you have to first get permits to put the uh pavement?

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>> No, it would be nice if they could do pvious pavement. I'm sure they will beg off on the basis of cost. >> I'm sure. Well, we can recommend it. Yeah, >> why not? >> Yeah. >> The the stone a stone driveway

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as long as it's remains that is >> somewhat pvious go down between. that the point of the pvious pavement is that you have then an area a level of stone underneath it that

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serves as essentially as a reservoir >> right >> for the rain that comes in and that's the expense >> well the pvious pavement itself but that's the difference between a real pvious pavement setup which then

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can hold some water and release it gradually. And a stone driveway because the ground underneath is not necessarily very pvious. >> Correct. Yeah, you're right. >> How large would the stones be? Don't they come in different sizes?

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>> Oh, I don't know. I don't think they say that. >> Ter, can you go back to the trees, please? >> Yeah. >> Just what they look like. >> Did I go too far? Oh, yeah. Okay, there we go. >> Yeah. So, the big one in the upper right, the really with the

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>> Yeah. >> Um, is that one being taken down? >> That one is to be retained. It, you see, it is squarely on the property line. >> Yeah. >> So, to take it out would require the

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agreement of the neighboring property owner. >> It really is. Yeah. >> There's no real reason to take it out. It would be behind the >> Wow. It uh it renders the roof of the house solar unfriendly. >> Yeah.

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>> Interesting. >> Depending on the direction of the sun, >> this is north, right? So, it's >> it would allow um sun in the afternoon. But, um >> my concern was uh how big is that? You

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know, is it you know, cuz it looks really big there? It does. Is this considered, you know, could that be considered a historic tree? Um, depending on the size. >> Oh, >> but if they're not taking it down, it shouldn't matter. But

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>> say anything about it diameter. >> Yeah, >> I don't. So, it looks Oh, here we go. 38. I was going to say I was going to guess 40 based on It looks like this smaller tree inside of it is 18 and the one this big one is 38. >> Wow. Oh, that's a mature tree.

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>> And the one they're taking out is this one, right, Ted? >> No, the lower the lower one. >> Okay. And that's you got a 6 foot something or other happening here and 16 ft, which is still, you know, >> that is a huge tree. >> I would just comment in on it saying

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that just to we want to be assured that that big tree is not removed. >> That's a lot of canopy that is uh would be lost. >> Yeah, >> absolutely. I like it. Yes. >> It's It's hard for me to imagine how it will not be affected

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because it seems to me that the house now in in the diagram on the right side, where would that big tree be exactly? >> Difficult to tell. >> Huh. >> If we can place the tree. >> Looks like it's here.

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Yeah. So about there, >> which means that it has to go both of them. >> It is. It's here. Right on the >> This is the This is a wall. >> That's the foundation. >> So this is No, it doesn't have to. Yes. Okay. >> Right. Okay.

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>> Remember this is a singlestory house, >> correct? >> Probably most of the tree canopy will be above the house there. >> Right. So it's right there. >> It's on the side. So maybe a little annoyed putting it on the leaf.

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>> So what kind of a tree is it? >> Did it say what kind of a tree it was, Ted? Do you remember? >> I don't know. >> Can you zoom in on this? >> So is it? >> Oh yes. Just give me one second. I just want to see if in the notes they say anything about the tree.

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>> Caniferous. Deciduous. >> Um >> I would say it's uh deciduous with that kind of >> ridiculous. I don't want to, you know, >> I don't see it in his notes about the tree, but we can look at it now. Where do you want me to zoom into? Oh, wait. Hang on. I'm sorry, Kiki. One more second.

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>> Okay, take your time. >> You do Ctrl F and then P and it will find it. >> Um, potentially, but maybe not because depends on the >> No, it's not there. >> I don't think they have any notes about the trees, but

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>> if the text is a picture, then >> sure. Jeez. Oh, here's something about the stone, though. Length of construction exits on sloping roaded. Length of stone required. Coarse grain. I know. Okay, that doesn't really give us much there. Dust control trench. Oh,

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here's the stone driveway detail, which is again they just show you like this. This is basically it's a 2 in thick >> 2 in thick stone. >> Stone. >> Uh, >> so they are stone pavers. >> They're stone pavers. Oh,

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>> okay. Oh, here we go. Trees to be protected. Tree protection fencing to be installed where shown. Uh, snow fence to be installed. 4ft high snow fence with post driven into ground

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every 6 ft. >> Why would they protect the >> Maybe that tree? Because it's going to be near where the construction is. They're going to >> a lot of times they'll put um equipment underneath the trees, heavy equipment.

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>> Yeah. So that's probably compact the soil under the tree and that can kill the tree. >> I think the there was something there I think that specifically tells them not to put any equipment under the tree. Well, that's why you put the fences

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around it >> cuz even though you say that, the workers >> don't even think about doing it. >> No. No. >> Now, what did you want me to zoom into, Kiki? If you could just go up to the um to the satellite. Uh >> Oh, sure.

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>> picture. >> And then it's a little tough with these lot lines. I can uh >> look. Yeah, I can if I do it I notice if I go out of this um

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we just can't have the lot lines on there at the same time but it's basically that property. >> Okay. >> Yeah, >> it's still a little blurry. >> We're looking for above. So the trees would be >> I mean that's on the

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>> if you go to Google Maps would it be better? >> I don't >> probably not. Usually Google Maps is less clear, but this is just because I think we're zooming in so far. So, I mean, if you zoom a little further out, you can kind of see it a little bit better. This is

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Kent. Kent Street and this is how do you say it? >> Cass, >> what is the number? 29. >> Uh um hold on. It is okay. Let me go back

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to Ted's thing here. It is 29. Yep. And this is a Habitat for Humanity house. Keep in mind, too. >> All right. Any other questions on that or comments? >> That was really the only thing I had.

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>> Do we know the distance between the the foundation of the house and the those trees, the big tree? What would be the distance? Uh, I don't know. But let's see. Hold on. Let me get >> I mean, for such a big tree, the root

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extended like >> how big is the root is as big as the >> All right, I'll go to Google. All right, hang on. Give me one sec. I'm just got to find a measurement for her >> because that big of a tree. The roots extend way up. Yep.

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>> So, >> so how far from the tree to this you're saying? >> Yeah. the distance between the foundation of the house and the big tree because for that size of a tree the underground rates have to extend

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>> correct >> like dozens of feet. >> Yes. uh in the perimeter all around. And I'm wondering whether building the foundations will disturb the roots, which means that the tree

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could eventually um just die if their roots are >> there's no Oh, it looks like it's about 8 and 12 interfere with some of the roots, but >> I think it's 8 and 1/2 ft. It looks like >> only >> we're at the tree experts >> part of the total. Would the roots some

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of the roots be disturbed? Clearly >> probably a lot. >> Sometimes there's contact inhibition where you know a growing like a root hits a wall it can't go anywhere. It'll just it'll decide to go in a different way and then the the rest of the roots will make up for it. It's amazing how

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plants >> but I think the point that Kiki is making is when they do the foundation they'll probably be cutting >> right. Yeah. >> Roots. Well, if they don't cut the primary, >> right? They cut the primary, the tree is

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dead. >> Yeah. Right. >> It's a better. Yes. So, >> so although they're not cutting it down now, I'm wondering about the long-term health of the tree. Me, too. >> If the roots are start botany is

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floating up. I mean, yeah, the house is basically proposed like under this tree for the most part. And so, yeah. >> That's a beauty. >> It's gorgeous. All right. So, we definitely want to put a note in there that I'm going to add to

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this large back. Save the trees. >> Well, it's good that they're they're proposing the fence around the tree. >> Yes. Yeah. But how how far out is the fence going to be from the trunk?

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>> Isn't there a sort of rule of thumb that the roots will extend as far out as the drip line of the tree? >> That's what Yeah, that's what I thought >> there is. >> I think you you're going to lose the last foot maybe of the roots. Mhm.

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>> on that side. But that only just part of one side of >> Oh, you said pvious pvious um paver. Did you say use pvious pavement or whatever for the stone drive?

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>> I'd say it would be light, but we assume you're trying to keep the cost down. >> Branches of that tree are very very low. They will have to chop many of them. I was just going to say where you have in parentheses there root structure, you

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should also have canopy. >> Okay, let me just enter what already just said root structure canopy. >> Okay, let's go back here. I'm going to put this guy here. Right.

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>> So, if you look at the street view here, this is the tree we were talking about. M right. >> And the branches if you if you go >> just go over the roof. >> Yeah, they they are very very low. These branches. >> How do I find this? How do I do this?

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This is the one thing. Uh are we looking at the right spot? >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> Doing it correctly. >> To the left. Go to the left. >> Yeah. Yeah, >> that's it. >> Can you move one more >> to the left? >> Yes.

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>> There. I wake up. >> I think I went down the street. >> Yeah, this is this is the property. Yeah. >> Oh, you're elsewhere. Where is it? >> I went I went somewhere else. Yeah. No.

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>> Where's the property? Okay, hang on. Got to look at it again. >> Question is where are you on castle? >> I know that's the problem once you get like turned around. >> Yeah. >> 29. I'm going to go here. >> This.

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>> Sorry, S. Give me one second. Hit this. >> Yeah. >> Perfect. Okay. Up. Perfect. >> Oh, so that's what I'm talking about. The branches here are so low. >> Oh, they are. Yeah. >> So, so they will have to chop some of the >> Y definitely.

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>> And so this is the tree that will go. >> That's the tree that they they will go. We should at least ask them if they can. It It doesn't appear to be within the footprint of the house.

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So, >> I It's hard to tell. >> It would be much more bothered by the construction of the house than the the tree there at the back. >> But it's a tall tree. >> And look at the look at the width of that trunk.

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>> Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. It's visually right >> it's like twice the width of the one on the left there. >> Mhm. >> Yep. >> At least >> closer to >> H. Yeah. That's

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>> And these uh this is uh they look kind of dead here. These >> Oh, these Yeah, this like shrubbery. >> Yeah, the trees here. Maybe we can shade it out. >> If you actually look from the other street, you can see that the trees are

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kind of dead. >> Yeah, >> it might be fall >> and the leaves are starting to turn. >> This was September. Yeah, >> but it is small area for >> this probably shouldn't be cared on the soil.

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>> Got it. All right. We will we will send those comments in. That's the only three we have. >> Yep. Okay. >> That was interesting. >> A lot of narrow lots in town. >> What' you say?

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>> A lot of narrow lots. >> I know. That was interesting that all three were like that. Yeah. the when when the initial subdivisions were done like in in the 1920s they did create these very narrow lots it's

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almost impossible but nowadays it would be impossible to put a house on one of those lots although there are a few onen home street okay

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>> but usually Really, it's more if you had enough money, you'd buy two or three lots because the >> they're all R40 owned. So, I presume R40s. They were R40 own. They're all in the residential zone.

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>> Well, this area was probably R7. >> I didn't check with >> So, we're up to new business. So, so they will not have issues with the uh distance from the property 15 ft. >> Um, the C2 variance was for what, Ted?

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I'm sorry. Was it for the >> I'm talking about the most recent because it's very small and so they also subject to the 15 ft distance from the property line, right? >> I believe so. Oh, you were right. This is R seven. So, let me see. Um,

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let me see here. Yeah, I think they need a variance for the frontage on Kasuk Street. >> I think it was just the frontage. Yeah. So, no, they're okay. >> Properties and >> they're all right. Yep. It's just the frontage. >> Is it because of the different zoning?

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>> Yes, this is R seven. Um, what Teds was in. Mine was in R20. Yep. I just want to see what they need real quick. Uh, okay. Okay. So, they needed two variants. Yeah. The front yard uh required 50 ft because it's a corner

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lot. That's the other thing. I'm sorry, required 90 ft because it's a corner lot and they're proposing 50 ft. Um also, the minimum lot area is 5,000 square ft. I'm sorry. They're proposing 5,000 ft. The minimum lot area is 9,000 square ft.

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>> Big difference. But since it's an isolated lot, there's nothing they can do to increase the size of the lot. >> Nothing. Yeah. All righty. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> So, up to um that completes site plans

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new business whole energy home energy assessment solutions outreach grant. Sustainable Jersey. So, I got a call from sustainable Jersey um last week and because we participated in the residential energy outreach campaign

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where we were, you know, we were giving out the light bulbs and we got the tablecloth and all that and we were like the website were promoting how to conserve energy and save money in your home, the residential tract. Um they're now pushing another program through PSENG and we're eligible for it because

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we've done phase one basically. Um the way it works is that uh PSENG has hired a subcontractor called JPI. Um and what they do is they first identify neighborhoods where uh

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promoting a whole home energy assessment would be you know really with equity in mind. So this subconsultant is charged with finding the neighborhoods in the township that are most in need of saving money, conserving energy, improving air quality and the environment. Um JPI will

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then uh let us know what those neighborhoods are. They have a template letter that we basically put together signed by the mayor and we basically say, "Hey, there's an opportunity for a whole home energy assessment." It's basically like doing an energy audit on your home. It looks at all the systems

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in the home. It looks at the structure. It looks at um tree canopy. It looks at everything in your home, not just a quick, you know, look. Um after the letter goes out about a week or two later, people from JPI will go actually and begin canvasing those neighborhoods.

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Um so people basically they get the letter and then someone shows up to their house and says, "Hey, we're working for PSENG in Franklin Township. Are you interested in a whole home energy assessment?" Um if the person says yes, they then get set up with Honeywell who actually does the whole

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home energy assessment. Um, in most cases it is free. However, in some cases it can be between $99 and $150. Um, so there's two ways to approach this. We either, you know, if someone's interested, they can pay that. If there

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is a charge, they pay that. It's a lot cheaper than it would be to do another, right? Or we can apply for an outreach grant of up to $5,000. And we can then basically there's a pro there's a process to go through with the RFP

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purchasing process, but we can basically reimburse people for who sign up. Um, we have to go through, like I said, the purchasing process to begin with. They have to pay upfront, but we then can reimburse them with grant money. Monontlair did that. Um,

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>> so it's kind of up to 50 house houses. >> Yes, basically. Yeah. Yep. that we could reimburse if everyone got charged. The only thing we have to do in this situation is we basically coordinate with the mayor to get the letter signed.

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The council obviously would have to approve the program. Basically, it's us sending out a letter and then if we want to reimburse people, going through the process of applying for a grant, which I've been told is very simple, and going through the purchasing process with the township, which and it's not uh it's

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nothing on Franklin that I say this, but going through the purchasing process is going to be hard, but not impossible. It'll be okay. It happens. we basically have to, you know, hire, I guess, put an RFP out that's very specific and that allows us to reimburse

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the contractor directly or residents directly in which they have to submit paperwork and pay first and all that. So, um it's a process, >> but it does allow people to have this whole home energy assessment. It also gets us 20 sustainable jersey points,

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which is really big. So you said that uh they have some um uh mapping that map out the the the township and they will visit only certain sections that are uh disadvantaged

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>> that are yes that are mostly disadvantaged. So they will and the contractor will do that >> district or do we know where it could >> we don't know where they I'm sure we could probably figure it out based on the work we've done from our local health assessment and our energy plan,

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>> but >> east of Franklin Boulevard, >> right? >> Most likely. Yeah, >> it's it's a little different from what we've been getting from public service and canal walk. >> Um they I signed up for one. I've got it done

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already. Uh they do an assessment, look at the heating, the air conditioning, um the ventilation, um thermostat, and and how much insulation is up in the attic. And um they do a thing and they come up

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with new train HV HVAC system, new hot water heater, the whole thing. >> And um the bill, there's no charge for the audit. And then um if you sign up um

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in my case the bill came to $20,000 to do all this public uh the state pays $5,500 to public service. So now we're down to $15,000 >> which I pay out over 10 years with no interest. >> Right? That's the direct install

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program. So yes, that is a different program that actually focuses on putting the appliances in. And they've done that already. This is really identifying what needs to be done and giving those options. And there might be some free or lowcost options that can actually be done, but it's not going to be big HVAC

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systems or anything like that. >> Yeah. And some people don't need the hot water he or they can't do the hot water heater, you know, and this kind of thing. And people are just going after it because you can't get it done for that much money and get I mean train is

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top quality. My son-in-law went over the contract. The hot water heater was set for a sixyear contract and a warranty. And my son-in-law said, "Get the 10-year one." >> And they did that. They just put a no label on the on the hot water heater. Didn't change the water heater. They

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just changed the warranty. >> But also what that did because I have the worry-free contract. Public service said I could eliminate the worry-free for a few years on the on the the furnace and this and that. And that took $70 about $55 off to 128. And now only

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seven now that they put they put a lot of insulation in the attic. >> So now there should be some reduction in electric bill which will further >> reduce my layout >> and people signing up one after the other. >> I'm sure. Yeah, I'm sure.

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>> Our houses a lot of our houses are 20 years old. >> Correct. Yeah. >> And the insulation is different. they this stuff is getting toward the end of their rated life anyway, you know. Yeah. So, um the timing is >> this one they're paying for the audit, but there's no mention of what it's

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going to cost to do the upgrades from what the audit might find, >> right? Yeah, it's that's true. This is really more of, you know, for them to do this in our township, they need support in order to really do this. Um I am a little concerned about the cost you know

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asking people to sign up although it is not a lot compared to what it could be. >> So yeah one way of communicating is what would the price be normally and tell them hey this is I don't know 70% discount 80 or something substantial.

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So, you know, at least as a sales pitch, do you know how much would be normal assistant? >> I don't. No, but I can ask her for sure. I'm sure whatever if we go forward with it, whatever letter goes out to the neighborhoods, I'm sure it has that number in it. Yeah. >> We should be transparent. >> Yeah. Y

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>> they did they originally came through and did a lighting audit and gave everybody free light bulbs. >> Yes. Yeah. >> That we did also. >> Mhm. >> So, uh >> so we don't have to do this. It is available though if we want to do it.

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>> It's it's worth doing it. It my guess is this is the precursor of maybe something like Oxford where once they get all these audits and see what needs to be done >> the people say but I don't have how we going to do this. >> So we'll look. >> Do we have an idea how many people

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participated in the phase one of the program? So >> well the phase one of our of our program was really just you know developing that website and putting it up. I don't know how many people actually >> So, we didn't even track the success. >> Well, Sustainable Jersey tracks how many

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visitors are to the website, but I don't know how many >> Still not. >> Yeah, I don't know. They they might know. I can ask them, but they know how many people came to the website and I guess looked at certain things. >> With this program, we can track it

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because uh it is actual visit, >> right? And sign up. Yeah. If they sign up. Yep. Is this only for single family homes? I mean, I know Canal Walk is a planned community and you have single family

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homes, but what about >> We have We have town houses with a common wall and then we have apartments. We own the apartment. You know, >> I'm wondering when I live in a condo. Yeah. It's like, you know, would that be good for my building which has 16 units?

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>> Yeah. So, I believe it's 16 units and under is what it is. So, it's like condos, you know, town houses, duplexes, single family homes. >> They could address I mean, I have a there are 136 units in my community and the largest buildings are 16. Most are

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eight. Um, so it's like Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> That could be interesting. >> So, do we want to move forward with it? Do you want me to try and get more research on it? Um, I just had a meeting with our regular reps. I would in general be in support because

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>> yeah I think it's worth worth seeing where we are. >> Okay. >> I'm I'm not exactly clear what >> it's interesting >> we would be required to do. The only thing we would be required to do only requirement would be to get an approval from us from the and then from the

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township council and send a letter out from the mayor to the communities that are identified basically saying we support this program. These people coming to your neighborhoods are actual people. We vetted them. We vetted the program. >> Yes. We optionally can apply for the

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$5,000 grant and use that to reimburse people who sign up if there's a charge associated with we don't have to do that, but we can do that. >> Well, it's when you say we, it's essentially the township has to write the RFP proposal and go do that. So I

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mean we are pretty much asking township to uh >> to do it. Yeah. >> To do it. >> Yeah. And who identifies uh the people the households that qualify? >> The sub consultant for PSEG they're called JPI. >> Okay.

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>> And then Honeywell actually performs the whole home energy assessment if someone signs up >> and they have some sort of formula that for someone it'll be free for someone it will be 99 to 150. Am I clear in

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understanding that this targets um households of a certain low income? >> Yeah. So most likely households that are in disadvantaged areas, economically distressed areas. Yes. Social um the um overburdened communities that are

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identified by D. So yes, those >> in service to the community. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. We should >> go ahead. don't like the fact that they don't talk about how the necessary work would actually be funded.

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>> That's what I was getting to at the end. Yeah. >> Right. Yes. That I that is where it it leaves off. And I think from that point forward, that's where like how Paul is doing the direct install, some of the um recommendations from the assessment

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might be like you qualify for the direct install program. still you have to put up some money or you can do it over time but it'll give you that. Some will be lowcost initiatives. There might be rebates available and and it'll identify all of that for the person who signs up.

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>> But besides helping the community, this is all about lowering the usage of of energy. >> It's it's always investment. So investment we need to have the education to the people that you >> they're working with public service.

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This is and so public service has on your bill the society benefits charge and that's where a lot of this money comes from. >> We've been paying for it for years. >> It look it's a little number but there's a lot of people

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>> and it adds up for from you know >> let's go for it. >> Yeah. >> All right. So we do need a motion to forward the recommendation to council that we that we proceed with this. We need to correct the exact wording of the thing now or you know what it is. We just say >> basically the motion would be that we

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recommend um using the whole home energy assessment solution grant through sustainable Jersey. Um we recommend that the council approves that and that a letter be sent out. >> That's the writing of the motion. >> So I move that we recommend

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>> what I said. >> That's the motion what she said. >> Yeah. Second. >> Be a formal. >> All in favor? >> I >> Okay. >> All right.

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>> This is this is good stuff. I mean, >> yeah, it's worth doing. >> Okay, that takes care of whole energy assessment committee reports. >> Do we have any committee reports? >> Maria sent one thing in uh right before the meeting. She couldn't be here

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tonight. Um, but she said, this is from Mrs. Holtzer, sixth grade literacy special educator at Samson G. Smith, and she had written to Maria. Um, May is a busy month for us and then concerts. The fall would be much better to partner to

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host this event. So, what event was does anyone know what event film screening >> the film screening? So, they would rather do it in the fall. has been emailing back and forth with her and copies and been copying me on email, >> but she'd rather do it in the fall. So, that's the update on that film screen.

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>> What film is this? I forget. >> Uh, it is let's see multiple choice. >> Multiple choice. Okay. Yeah. Yeah, I remember the name Choice. >> Yeah, it's um it's about education and

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it has also um green components to it. Yep. That's the only update from uh >> Okay. What was the name of the person who sent the letter? >> Mrs. Holtzer. Let me I think it's Cara. I just closed it. Um it's Holt. Just put

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Mrs. Holtzer. H O L Z E R. >> Okay, good. Samson J. Smith. >> Yes. >> Sixth grade teacher. >> Uh she's in charge of um sustainable Jersey for schools. >> That's excellent.

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get the kids when they're young. >> Okay. Um hot topics. Uh >> if I could we could go back to committee reports. Just something shade tree. >> Oh, good. >> So shade tree has been trying to get um couple of things changed in the

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ordinance. Um, one, I'm sure you've heard of this, that they went 10 years without changing the price of a replacement tree. If a if a um company could not plant a tree, they have to do a contribution to the tree fund. It went

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for 10 years where it was $30. They were supposed to review it every year and make changes to it. So, finally after 10 years, they changed it and they upped it from $30 to $300, which is more in line. So, they're supposed to review it every year. So, it's been 3 years now and they

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still haven't reviewed it again. >> So, we're still trying to get them to change that in the ordinance. >> Um, second thing is that in the ordinance, if I remember correctly, I think a tree is defined as

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4 in in diameter at 3 feet from the ground or at or breast height. I like 3 ft from the ground better because people were different their breast height. >> Um, so we want to get it uh instead of 4 in,

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it should be 2 and 1/2 in because when they plant a tree, they're allowed to plant 2 and 1/2 in trees. Mhm. >> So when they're planting 2 and 1/2 in trees as replacements, by definition, by

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the ordinance definition, they're not really trees. >> Right. Right. >> So also I believe when they're evaluating what trees, how many trees are they going to be taken down, if they're going by the definition of a

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tree, if it's below 4 in, they're not taking anything below uh 4 in into account. It should be two and a half inches. >> So, we're trying to get those changes in the ordinance made and the the

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three the price of the tree $300 adding on, you know, who knows price could drop, but probably not. >> But we've been trying to get that done for three years and this is more recent with the definition of a tree. Trying to get that chance. >> How you define a tree? Exactly.

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>> Yeah. Arnold, in this new um that we're we had meeting this morning about the new ordinance, there's a whole section about what trees should be used and that kind of thing with the deciduous section B1 under on the B1 re requirement.

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There's a about um uh such trees at least 6 feet height, 3 years old, planted on 2 and 12 in caliper. Yeah, at least 2 and 12 inch caliper 6 feet in height. Trees shall be spaced six to 8 ft on center entire. So it's whole big

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section on on trees. >> Say that about the replacement trees. It says >> No, it's new. Well, when you're doing when you're doing a warehouse. >> Yeah, these would be replacement trees. >> And what you said something about 2 and 12 in.

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The buffer zone shall contain plantings of shrubs and trees installed in such tight manner and spacing provide a dense year- round screen in the following manner. Shrubs shall be at least 3 ft in height. A planting such type would be at least 6 feet in height um and after 3

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years and planted 3t on center. Deciduous trees shall be at least 2 and 1/2 in caliber at planting and evergreen trees shall be at least 6 feet in height. Trees shall be spaced six to eight feet on center. Entire width and length of paper shall be planted with

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trees and shrubs. Ratio trees to shrubs should be at least two trees for every shrub. >> So again 2 and 1/2 in caliber the whole >> diameter diameter is the same as caliber, but I'm going to get to that. >> Um so basically they're planting a tree

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that by definition is not a tree >> because the definition in the ordinance says 4 in or more. Yeah. >> The other thing is in some places in the ordinance they call it a caliper. In some places they call a diameter. Um

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which basically the same thing. Um so they should be consistent and a caliper can be the diameter diameter. A caliper can also be a piece of equipment that measures diameter. >> So they should be consistent and use the

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same term where there's diameter which I like. Yes. >> Or caliber. >> Diameter seems to be a word that, you know, people more frequently know. >> So, I would rather see them use the word diameter throughout the ordinance instead of going back and forth between

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>> diameters. >> Yeah. There's a whole section about styles and textures and all that stuff, driveways, but when you're checked, right, you know, it's in here. They also differentiate in the ordinance I believe in replacement trees of I'm not 100%

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sure about this between deciduous trees and conifer trees. >> Right. Yeah. That that that paragraph was deciduous. >> Deciduous or conifer? >> No, it doesn't say conifer at all. >> Not that deciduous specific. That's just

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for the ordinance for the B. The >> BI. >> Well, if you're doing an ordinance for the BI zone, how would the or would is that as >> they probably took the design standards and the tree replacement standards from

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the tree >> the tree replacement? >> They were just talking about BI. They're not talking about the whole order. >> No, correct. Yeah. So the deciduous trees shall be at least 2 and 12 in caliber at planting. >> Yeah. >> And evergreen trees should be at least 6

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feet in height. >> Yeah. That's why I'm saying there's a different >> there's a whole slew of >> different definition between you know how they determine what's a trait. >> But >> as for the definition of a trait again I repeat

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>> if it's less than 4 in it's not a trait. >> Yeah. No, that's what it says. Okay, that's one of the >> Okay. So, what do you recommend as a general uh definition? 2 and 1/2 in or 4 in? >> 2 and 1/2 in,

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>> which is what they're doing here. >> Because because the replacement trees >> are 2 and 1/2 in. If you're allowed to put a 2 and 1/2 in tree in, well, then that's a tree. >> So, should be defined as 2 and 1/2 in or more.

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>> Or more. That's it. from the base >> or can you require the replacement trees to be 4 in or more? >> Muchough 4 in would be extremely expensive. >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> Got it.

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>> So the the two 2 and 12 in would get you a $300 tree. >> Well, I mean years ago. Yes. More or less. >> To see what it is now. We've been waiting for 3 years for them to update it. >> And that's the engineer. I believe it's the engineering department that

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>> that is it said it states in the ordinance that the engineering department is supposed to review that every year >> and make it change accordingly whether it's >> price go up or down or keep it the same.

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>> If they're looking at inflation factors over the last three years from 300 you might go to three and a quarter say 325 in that ballpark. >> Could be more than that. >> Yeah. this year make a difference. >> A lot of it has a lot of it has to do

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with um or some of it has to do with um uh what trees are available >> um you know whether there was a drought during the you know during a certain season and how many trees are available and the fewer trees that are available the higher the cost of the trees.

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>> So there's there's several factors that raises the price of a tree. >> Okay. >> Yeah. Before we move on to old business, I want to go back to the to the movie to the film that Maria was talking about uh

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the multiple choice um for educational purposes. I don't know if the committee is aware or have seen the film um asbestos city which is Manville.

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>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Discussed it before. I have seen it. I I happened to see it. It's a 2020 documentary >> made by a filmmaker who's a resident of Manville.

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>> And although it's called Asbesto City, uh the first half of it talks about the uh the flooding, >> right? >> Excuse me. The second part talks about the the factory that was the main man

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>> named after. >> Right. and uh which after many many years I mean it employed pretty much the entire town the town was created because of the factory >> and um until people started reporting uh

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cases of meatiloma >> right >> and I I was just I just wanted I know Maria is not here but she's the one that does the educational I think this particular film I highly recommend it both for uh local history M

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>> as well as awareness about flooding uh because we always think oh it's happening in somewhere in in New Orleans or outside but it's really happening it's a you know in this particular case next door uh but also uh the impact of

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of um you know industry and the health of the residents and the workers. So I don't know if she has considered showing it but I just want to recommend it. >> We we went through the exercise uh I think it was 2 years ago when the film

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was new. >> Um uh what was exactly I think we we reached out they didn't respond. >> They did not respond. >> They didn't respond. And then uh the screening was in Manville High School or middle school. >> Yes. And we we like published that.

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Yeah. And >> okay, >> whoever wanted to go did and I was there and I was not much impressed. Um, couple of things. One, there was a profanity in the film. >> Was there? >> Yes. And so I would not want to

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recommend it for general audience. >> Uh, and second, it seemed to be kind of with the political twist. Ah >> it it was uh >> it was featuring the mayor >> even president

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there wasunityity against Biden at that time and >> Oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh I remember now. Okay yeah >> what's the name of the film? >> Asto city. >> Asbesto city. >> Asto city. Yeah. >> Yeah, we did consider it though because

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we the same thing. Um and I think we did put something up like about the screening in Manville just so that people who want to go but yeah we didn't actually screen it for that reason. Yeah. >> I see. Okay. Okay. Yeah. As long as

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>> it's it's been made aware, you know, the members have been made aware. The opportunity for the topic is wonderful because the way how we describe is exactly what I would expect from it >> but but it had a twist that was unhealthy and uh and the profoundity was

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absolutely unnecessary. >> Oh really? Um and uh also there was a complaint about this decision of the state that bailed out one side of the river >> and allowed u the flooding to the to to

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Manville essentially. They so to speak sacrifice >> uh the town and >> and they did not make any attempt to uh understand why the state did it. They were just looking from their perspective

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that we are the cit residents of Manville and we and were entitled for protection you know because they uh they offered bailout that the state would buy the houses but people started putting money into raising the houses like

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>> which you know um >> it's it's a whole >> Yeah. It's it's it can become a political issue. I know what you're talking about. Okay. Yeah, we can move on. >> Yeah, >> we'll move on to old resistance.

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>> Um, do we just run through it? So, I did get a response from Rejuan. Is that how you say >> that they're interested in being on the commissioner ameritus committee? So, slowly but surely I'm getting more responses. So, eventually soon I'll be able to put together a committee. >> Okay. >> Um

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the uh the what's in the packaging for the light bulbs. Uh, some of the light bulbs there's like a quantity issue with them. So, some of them are in um and they're at DPW, so I have to go pick them up. So, we can start working on the light bulbs, the amber light bulbs that

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we ordered. >> Uh, some of them are some of what we need is there at DPW, so I can go pick it up. >> Um, the brochures that we ordered are in from the Somerset County Print Shop, so I'll go pick them up either tomorrow or um, Wednesday.

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What else? Uh, I met with Steven Dah, the recreation director, and Mark Healey, the planning director, about the open space and recreation plan. So, we have a plan of attack of how we're going to move forward with it. Steven is going to put together a survey for recreation,

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which he's required to do. And he said we can enter some questions in there about open space, preserves, you know, what type of uh land preservation we should be looking at, how are they used? So, we're going to formulate those questions. While that's going on, I'm gonna go through and basically put

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together the outline of the document in like a very detailed fashion. Um, and then Mark said hopefully in a month. So, basically in two months we hope to have like the first meeting on it, although that might be a little tight. So, we're going to try we're going to do our

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darnest basically. >> Um, >> we'll have that stuff for September day to give away like many light bulbs in the past tonight. >> The light bulbs we'll definitely have for Franklin Day. Yes. And the brochures. The brochures arrive. I just got to pick them up. >> We We still have a good half of box,

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maybe more of the nightlights >> cuz we gave out a bunch at the school, but we still have have a good number. >> Nice. >> Oh, I said relief blower ordinance. I don't have any update on that. >> I was just going to say if we could just put in the in the minutes that we're wondering what the status of the

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>> Okay. I can ask view of the ordinance of the proposed ordinance is >> I know that it's supposed to go through some committees first whether it's >> I'll ask and you would know better you know what committee it would go through >> it goes to the planning board

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>> planning board >> doesn't go through any kind of um council committee before it goes to the planning board >> well but I'm sure it would go through council committees before it's introduced Mhm. >> to the planning board. >> Yeah.

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>> And then it goes to the planning board between the the first reading and the second reading. >> Oh, okay. Okay. >> Of course, the planning board meeting for this week has been cancelled because they had no business. So,

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>> uh, we might have spent it discussing this ordinance. >> Yeah. >> I haven't got anything back yet. Now, when it was sent, it was one of the first things I think that we ever sent once Councilman Singh came in. So, he's probably working on it. So, I will follow up.

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>> Sure. He's almost >> Yeah, but I will follow up with him. >> Well, I think we're just about at the end of the thing. We could >> open the uh >> Wait, go ahead. >> I was just hoping for all business.

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um regarding um the Rodgress Plaza and uh what started as a um uh inquiry regarding the fans and and the series run area. Um so um I

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I sent email to um Orsini Mike Corsini >> Mini >> and uh he responded and there were two parts to it. One was that uh who owns actually the area. So I was looking into the map. It looks like that actually

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township owns the the the area that is subject of the cut through. uh was looking into the map that you have. Um and um and then he he said that uh it's it's a matter of liability because uh if

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you put the sidewalk there uh now you are liable if something happens to people. Uh so it's better not to do anything. Um or uh technically it should be maybe

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closed the fence uh but then you would he said that if if people made a hole in the fence that they will still find a way through they will damage the fence again. >> So uh but he uh suggested just

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live and let live u is this my interpretation correct? He he felt that he also felt it was private property. That's what he was making that point that if we're private property, we have no right doing anything on it. >> Well, I was just going to ask who owns the fence.

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>> I don't know. >> What kind of fence? >> It it appears to me that uh I I don't know for sure. I was just looking at the satellite image and at the property designation. Uh so it appears that it's uh it's the

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whole area of the wooded area which I believe is assigned to the township. >> Yes, we'd have to look at the actual survey like the meets and bounds to see what where exactly it is. But that is true. If we make improvements to it,

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then we are we could become liable. Right now it's people basically trespassing you know on our property. So, >> and that leaves the question if it is the property private property of the other not the township,

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>> was there a requirement at some point for them to put up that fence? >> And if it was a requirement for them to put up the fence, >> Yeah. >> then it's a requirement for them to maintain that structure. >> Yeah. We'd have to look at how the site was developed, like go back and look at

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the resolution of approval. Yeah. So once we can figure out exactly what's what. Yeah. >> But my my in my main point was that uh we should support pedestrian transportation versus car transportation. And if if uh people can

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walk to shopping, we should not ban them. We should rather support them. >> Uh it it improves air quality. It improves fitness. It improves congestion. So there is a whole list. And if people are taking the chance and

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walking through area which is not maintained poses some hazard when the area is wet it's very slippery um and obviously um they are willing to take a risk if if we

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or whoever owns it puts uh uh pavers or whatever it will be much safer. there is no risk for liability and uh we um provide service to people that are expecting while eliminating or

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or keeping the vehicular traffic low supporting pedestrian traffic and u the other thing is that when the fence is open uh the wildlife also goes through

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which I'm not expert about uh wildlife like deer But I found the deers in that area. Uh if if we put the if we raise the fence back in, uh the wildlife cannot go through. >> Yeah.

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>> So, uh I would rather keep the walkway. It's natural for wildlife and it's natural for for local residents. >> And again, I'm I'm kind of 90% certain that it's actually township property. >> I can look into it and see if I can

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figure out Yeah. what the ownership is and cuz yeah, if we can pay that's step one. >> If you need any additional photos from me, I will be happy to supply. >> Okay, perfect. >> Okay, I have it on my to-do list. >> It actually takes me back

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10 15 years um uh in Union County when there was a lot of illegal dumping. A favorite place to do illegal dumping is along railroad tracks because a lot of time it's behind buildings. So it's not on the railroad tracks but adjacent to them. And the question was they asked of

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the railroad companies how come there aren't there are fences only in some places but not in other places. And they said if we put up if we put up fences um

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we could become liable. >> We're more liable if we're putting up fences if somebody goes over the fences or >> if they climb it. Yeah. >> They climb it. If somebody gets hit by a train or something. >> It's true. >> It is true.

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>> What are you saying? That they don't want to put their fence or >> No, they didn't want to. >> They They don't want to put up fences. >> It increases their liability. >> Yeah. >> People trying to go over and getting hurt. >> Yeah. >> And if there is no fence, it's >> it's also extremely expensive. Think of

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a fence all traffic all along. And if they put it up in some places but not in others. Yeah. >> Why didn't you put it here? And that's where the person >> right >> hit by a train. So now you're liable because you put it everywhere else but right here. >> Yeah. >> And how are those guys going to get on

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trains and ride along and travel the country? >> Yeah. True. >> I didn't want to call them bless. No, >> I would say that actually from getgo it was a wrong design that they didn't make the p pedestrian walkthrough >> because it's it's a it's a it's a

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multi-unit building area where you have lots of people and right next to it is a is a shopping area. >> Yeah. >> I mean it should have been there. >> It just makes lots of sense. One of the historical photos when I was looking into the street view you can check it now is actually shopping carts are

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abandoned right before uh uh the side the road ends so that because people didn't want to take the shopping carts across the wooded area >> right >> so and and further down is a person holding two bags and walking in that

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direction which means that clearly it is being used >> maybe Maybe the the business is you know how you go to shop right or stop and shop in the parking lot there's an area where you can return the >> shopping carts and at the end of the day somebody from the shop right takes them

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up to the building. >> Mhm. >> So put one of those things areas for people to put the shopping carts so that they're not all over the place or pushed down. So if there's a place for them to actually return the shopping carts >> Yeah. >> makes it easier for the businesses to

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you know stop and shop or shop. to pick them up. >> Plus, they would be motivated because they are inviting the uh resident, local residents to make shopping there. >> Yeah. >> A lot of people don't put their carts in those accumulation places. It drives me

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nuts. >> Well, let's look and see what the ownership is. I'll see what I can find out. I might have to like do some digging, but yeah, I'll see what we can find out. >> Very good. Okay. Just before I do, I just wanted to mention the thing we learned this morning. Maybe um the Onyx

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warehouse that we had approved a while ago. We looked at it. Uh, Somerset Run told us the people from some Somerset Run said that application is dead because Somerset Woods that owns the property that needed to be changed to

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make truck access into that area by Shopright um won't give up the land. And in that way, the trucks have no access to the site, >> right? >> And what's left on that site is the skeleton of a warehouse and an old house that's just sitting there. It's a

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skeleton of a retail shopping center. That's what it is. Exactly. Right. Right. Exactly. >> Exactly. That was >> But that that that was the result of somebody from Somerset Run knocking on the doors of Somerset Woods and saying, "Hey, look what's happening." And they

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got an attorney. And I don't know if they did any surveys, but evidently, >> well, there's something about a unknown as to whether the nursing home owned part of that property also. That's that's that's where that's where it came in. The first part, you can't make the

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left turn with trucks where you got Wells Fargo on this side, Shopright on that side. That's a private road and you need an easement to get that to get a truck 18 wheeler through there. They shop right the easement. Their trucks all go around the back of a shop right

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to load up most of them. >> So the question is what will be the future of that piece of land? Yes. because um it's >> and who owns it, who owns the majority of that property.

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>> Um uh because it's a perfect location for being across from the nursing rehab center, nursing home. Um >> to to to make something like a small park or something that's more

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>> conducive to to a >> Yeah. multiuse. >> That's what we >> quality of life. >> Yeah, >> there may there may be a avenue to pursue that. We we we're going to explore that. >> Okay. >> And I want to confirm that it's really

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dead. >> Anyway, uh I would like to entertain a motion to open the floor. >> Before you do that, I have a question. >> What was this meeting that you were at today? >> Oh, the review of the new um ordinance. Shepherd had a bunch of us from this

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ward to go over the ordinance and look at what has been proposed from the first reading and um make our suggestions. >> So it was basically uh for the B9 warehouse. >> Yes. >> No, no, no. It was not about B9, >> the whole zone,

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>> the zone, >> the B1 zone >> and how that might be managed, you know, and >> so something that Sheepa put this together for the second for the second >> for the second award. Yeah. >> My guess is maybe the other councilmen

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are doing exactly the same thing. I don't they may not I mean she doesn't have all of B1. I don't think I think the the because some some B >> it's actually business

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of course that is not within one mile of the entrance to so you can't build any new houses >> right >> and it's been pretty well built up right now >> but there's still a lot of trees on Veronica when you make the turn from Hamilton and go up

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>> Yeah the There's a lot of wet land there. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> So, >> now there's a the proposal was approved for a warehouse back there with the access from Clyde Road.

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>> Yes. >> That I don't think has ever been built. >> And there was there was talk about warehouse on Bennett's Lane also that comes around to Veronica. >> I remember looking at those. We spent time on those. So, so now

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motion to open. >> No comments. >> No comments. Motion to close the floor. >> So move. >> So move. >> Okay. Motion to adjurnn. So move. Thank you.