I'm applying for sorry I think I'm sorry. Okay, we're recording now. >> Um, >> congratulations. >> Couldn't do enough to pay us. >> Okay, we're going to open the meeting.
How about 532? >> Okay, sounds close. >> Sounds good. >> That's what I have. You might watch his own time for change. Uh did you take a look at the minutes of last meeting? If you want to look those over, if you have another copy right
there, Traffic [Applause] some of the council meetings uh meetings, committee meetings, they they will issue a um it the right way. We'll see the uh
sometimes they just pop up and say wave the minutes reading which is I'm wearing some of the things that the old people do. So, [Applause] [Applause]
Somebody's ready. You can't finish reading them or you want to approve them. Any question here? Most like both proof. Sure. >> Okay. Thank you.
Okay. Um, as per usual, we will start with Gail. Let them >> perfect. I will try to keep it uh short and sweet. You should all have a copy of uh Gail's update in front of you. um several attachments tonight that we'll
go over, but starting on uh page one, project one, the runway reconstruction. The final item that was outstanding as part of the project was the 18B survey project. Um so that is now complete. All payments have been made. Um and we're
going to remove the project from the update moving forward. Um the wildlife hazard site visit actually goes on to page two. Um final report was distributed to FA Masot
airport on the 4th of September. Um thank you again Isabelle and Jim for your input um throughout that process and you know moving that along. The FAA closeout was subsequently submitted on 12th of September and final mass DOT payment requests were submitted on the
22nd of September. Um so once you know the airport the city receives the final payments from FAA and from MassOT and Gail has been paid on our invoices for the project we can fully close this out and remove it from the update. So that project went um once it got going went
uh pretty quickly and and smoothly. So, no actions of the commission at this time. Um, any questions from anyone? >> How much uh was there a published version like the one for with all the pictures on it
here? And how much variation was there from >> So any um I I mean I can't off the top of my head tell you, but but the um uh gez I would I would have to look at it. Um but but all of the all of the
correspondence and all of the um changes were summarized in a revision matrix that was included with all of the iterations of the reports. If you are missing any of those documents, I would be happy to send them to you again. Just >> Well, I bet the draft version is what
this one is. And I was going to say if you can email me a final version. >> Yeah, I can email fine. >> Yeah, I can send it to you again. I know um everybody who was involved in the process was included in that email. So on September 4th, but I will send that again. No problem.
>> I just wanted to make sure I didn't see it, but could be me. >> Yeah. No, let me let me resend it. And uh >> Yep. I'll send that again >> because then I can forward it. Sometimes the I forward some of these things to the Not everybody has a computer that
they can look at it on, but some of the guys that do I forward it to >> Okay. Yeah, that's no problem. I'll make sure that you get it. Um I'll send that I'll send it uh tomorrow morning. So, if you don't get it, just just uh bug me, but you should get it. Um
let's see. Um environmental assessment and instruction analysis. Really, the update portion is on page three. Um so the airport and their associates uh w were informed by the FAA um that
they're actually changing the scope of the project a little bit. Um there have been a bunch of rule changes with the new administration that's come in and um so so some of the requirements have become uh less stringent. So
effectively, we're still going to be reviewing your fence project and your tree clearing easement project under uh the FAA rules, but it'll just be um less stringent of a review. So with the full
environmental assessment, what happens is um you have to send a draft to the FAA, they do revisions, you have to do a public meeting and you know, get it all out, take public comments. What we're doing is we're removing the public uh review process which will save the
airport, FAA, everybody some money on the project. And then there won't be as many rounds of review. So, a lot less back and forth. Um it's a shorter document. We still need to do the same research type of components that would be required if we did the full environmental assessment. Um so those
things the research part really doesn't change because you still have to show uh you know show that how these different projects will or will not impact the environment. Um but anyway so we're >> operations um also instead of the
environ well also the environment operations at the airport. So these trees over here I see that the fence would go along that. Yes. >> Yes. So, they would have to cut down all those trees and then put up a fence.
>> That's correct. Um, so that they're two Yeah. two kind of separate projects, but we'll talk about the fence, you know, in just a minute. Um, but the fence line effectively when you look at the plan that we provided, we've shown the fence line. Um, you have, remember we talked
in the master plan about all the imaginary protected surfaces around the airport. So immediately surrounding the runway, you have your primary surface where effectively you can't have anything obstructing or penetrating a
surface that's the same elevation as the runway all the way around. Um unless it's like fixed by function, so a sign or a light or what have you. And then um coming off the side, so you have your runway here and your primary surfaces around it. Well, coming up and off the
sides of the runway is your transitional surface. and that is a 7:1 slope. I know it's a lot of information, but we've put made sure that the fence is not going to be penetrating that. So, the reason that the fence is located beyond the tree
line is because we have to make sure that it's outside of that transitional surface. I just wanted to mention if that impacts that in any way at some point in the future we may have the
Greater Boston Soaring Club uh operating out of here and they have already talked about um maybe taking down some of those trees. >> Yeah.
>> Okay. Well, glad operations because they like grass more than it causes less damage. >> Some of their wingspans are 70 feet wide and they for the operations they would like to actually taxi and then have another glider possibly land at the same
time because when they lose lift they have to land immediately. So they they've already asked me uh could those trees be taken down. So that was my question. If >> they were going to be taken down anyway because of the fence at some point.
>> Yeah, they they um they if you move forward with the fence project then you know those trees between basically where the fence line need to start and then you know kind of 10 ft on either side is like your clearance area um for the fence. So we make sure that that was cleared on both sides of the fence.
>> Cleared on both sides. >> Yeah. And it would be you know any of the trees leading you know up to the fence so you can get in there and everything else. >> Okay. I know the the probably a different question. Um, how many feet out from the grass is the
fence? >> Oh, do I have that on this plan? Unfortunately, I did not. >> Sorry to interrupt. >> No, no, you're fine. >> I see the fence there, but >> y would be, let's see, about >> 50 ft maybe. >> It's probably a bit more than that.
>> Well, that would be great if it is. >> No, it's got to be a lot more than that. Oh, from the end of the grass, not the end of the road. >> Oh, from the end of the grass that I We don't have a tree line on this plan, unfortunately. So, it's tough for me to tell. >> Yeah, it looks like it's superimposed
over a >> Yeah, there's a little bit of a background image, but yeah, we don't have we don't. >> All right. Well, just to be aware, they're already asking questions. >> It's a combination. This is probably the reason why I want to see the wetland
stuff cuz the wetlands over there. >> Okay. >> Um I got to look at all of it kind of all in one, you know, each step here because there's a lot of stuff that is um overlapping.
>> Well, it's a I mean it's a process kind of leads one thing to the next, right? >> So um so so again, yeah, I mean we can get any information, you know, on the fence line that that you need. That's no problem. Um, in terms of where that's, you know, how far that's located. Um,
>> and it's just a possibility. It's not a >> well, >> it's not a done deal that they would be coming here. They just they're looking into it. And so, >> that might be something that would uh >> concern them if those trees were too
close to the grass. Yeah, I don't think that's anything that we would explore as part of this project, but I mean we can certainly provide you with the information that if it would be a beneficial result, you know, from taking down those trees, we can get you that information. >> Um,
>> yeah, backic. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Backing up just a little bit. What's for the approach end of the runway? What is the slope? >> We we'll talk about that. Um yeah, when we get into the when we get into the obstruction study report, which we're
going to get into just a minute. >> Yeah. Yeah. So, we can we can actually dive into that. Um at any point we have um so we'll review the draft obstruction study report and then um after tonight, we'll we'll pass it on to FAA and Mass
DOT as well because they need to comment on it. and we'll review um the fence line plan and then get you know get your you know feedback and preferences on that. Um so yeah I will make a note here Isabelle to get you the number of
feet of between uh the runway and the fence. So I'll get you that number. I can do that in the morning. You're welcome. >> And the environmental assessment plays a role in that too because of the where
the wetland is and the wildlife and all that stuff are fence over the pond or you have to go around it that pond up there. You go it looks like a straight line for the fence, but there is a a pond out there.
So you probably on the other on the far side of the pond. That's why I said there's a lot >> which is good because all those trees will be clear. >> But I want to cuz that was done. I don't know how they did it the last time. >> Yeah.
>> Okay. >> Okay. Well, we'll get into that. You said the you want to finish the environmental assessment. >> Well, we can we can get into um we can get into the we can talk about the fence first and the obstructions first. I I don't I I don't care one way or the other. >> It's all kind of the same.
>> Yeah. Well, it's yeah, it's all it's all part of the same. Um, so so really just I guess we'll just jump into the fence so you can ask questions that you have. Um, the plan that you have in front of you is um really the option um if you
remember from your airport layout plan, we had the fence line going completely around and enclosing the airport um or the the airport operations area. And um so you know we know that obviously there
are wetlands out here that are shown and there are um you know the big thing that's coming into play too is you have what's called the priority habitat and so that is indicated by you see um the
hatched area and it's like the lines that the gray lines that go across this way towards the 36 end. So really it would be um probably pretty challenging to permit um a project that went through that area. Um and so the the option that
we're proposing is to basically cut the fence line off at that priority habitat area completely avoid any impacts on that end. Um because also I know based on conversations with Jim and um I think
yourself too, Isabelle, the deer seem to really be coming from the forested areas and not so much from the swamp. I know even when GZA was out here doing the delineation of the wetlands, they said it was extremely difficult to walk through that area. It took them much
much longer than they thought it was going to because you know just because of um you know how the terrain is out there. >> So they would leave the fence off at the end of the runway. >> Yeah. So and and we actually have done a similar um a similar thing um for another airport that had an
environmental there was actually a river um that prevented you know from going completely around the runway and closing the property. and they're they're um going I don't think they're constructing it yet, but it's been it was approved through an environmental assessment very
similar situation. They had a major wildlife issue when it was determined that even having the fencing partially around the airport and closing would be a benefit to the airport and to safety. So, um that's, you know, we're proposing basically constructing as much perimeter
fencing as we possibly can while avoiding those areas. And I know there are some, you know, wetland impacts that are shown here that we'll we'll certainly be um we'll certainly be addressing as we, you know, get into into the that what's called a CADX
categorically excluded um document. That's that kind of reduced um >> reduced review level. >> That's also good for tow planes with tow hooks to not have a fence at the end of the runway.
>> Okay. So, good job. >> The uh Yeah. How does the environmental do they consider a fence construction or do they have to have setbacks from
the environmental areas >> like in in mass? I think it's anything that comes within 200 ft of a wetland is has to have permission and they they will allow under down to 100 pretty
easily and then under 100. But I don't know if the feet from a true, you know, >> they they do, but the impact is pretty ins. That's what I'm saying. It's it to me if we could get the obstruction out of the
way, which is the hazard. um by carefully trimming and not upsetting too many things, but keeping the trim level down. Um I know they when the last time they did it, it was just all the way up to the
top of the hill and uh you can see it's still out there and the trees are getting very tall again. >> So I don't know how that h how they did it the last time. >> I think I ran across it. I saw it someplace along with the duffel bags and I'm clean it.
>> So, so just to let you know what we're proposing here is um 10 ft of clearance on either side of a fence line or really 10 ft, you know, beyond that fence line. So, you have >> clean it. >> She doesn't make it. >> Y >> that's
>> that's what I was hoping for. >> Yeah. Inside the fence is not clear cut. >> Yes. No, we we can make anything that becomes designated airport property. I believe >> we can do basically whatever we want
for the most part as far as cleaning clearing obstructions and trees and stuff like that. >> Well, you still have to buy, >> but then the environmental stuff does apply some. >> It does, >> but I think that there's permitting that you can get. I don't know exactly how
that works. >> No, there definitely is. And Jackie, correct me if I'm wrong. There's not a significant amount of wetland impact as a result of this proposed fence. >> It's 8,400 uh square ft, which includes the fence itself and any tree clearing on either side of the fence. So 8,400
square ft total wetland impacts. That's not including buffer. That's just the wetland. >> Yeah. Cuz my way of thinking, too, would be to just try and get the airport designated property as far up the hill as I can. Even You own all
>> and I'm sorry >> inside the fence. >> I'm not following airport designated property. All of your property is designated for airport use unless otherwise no >> right but we can't use it for airport
stuff because it's not clearable habitable and wetland. I mean, it's just everything we've talked about for >> ever has been. >> Yeah. >> So, it's just not usable as >> Yeah. It's not, you know, I mean, I
granted the up the hill is not usable right now, but it's a great source for future expansion. And I don't know. >> Understood. I think it's important when we're we're talking about these projects. We just, you know, I
understand that things impact other things, but let's just try to stay focused on the fence plan and do, you know, kind of one step at a time. Um, if there will be an overall benefit to the airport, um, to to having that fence line here, that's wonderful. I mean,
that's that's all you can hope for, right? Um, but really the the justification for this fence is the wildlife. Um, so we'll confirm when we um we talk to the FAA that the wildlife hazard site visit report should provide
that justification that you need, but we'll confirm that when we meet with the FAA in a couple weeks. Um but anyway, so the so the fence line really um I I think it's it's shown as close to the airport environment as it
can be with being outside of those protected surfaces and everything and then um as far from the you know the wetland impacts as as as you can be as well. So, um, you know, it's kind of for a straight fence line, the best case
scenario probably here. Um, so I don't know if there's any other questions, concerns, or if um you all feel comfortable moving forward with um basically evaluating the um
evaluating the environmental, you know, diving in more um to the environmental impacts and selecting this as the preferred option. Um, you know, again, as opposed to doing a full perimeter fence, which I think would be pretty
cumbersome. >> Yeah. I Well, it's purpose of one talking about a river. >> And uh, you know, it's impossible. You can't put a fence in the river. >> No. And you can't put a fence in the safety area either.
>> So, it's pretty challenging. Um, so if um yeah, if you if you um if we need a do we need a formal vote on this or just concurrence or >> guys?
So just to you know accept moving forward with this fence option as um part of the what's called documented categorical exclusion um which is the the essentially the environmental assessment project component.
>> What do you guys think? >> I think we got to go forward. >> Yeah, we're good. We can go forward. >> Good. Okay, we are Yes. That was great. Isabelle, you think this is this one makes the most sense?
>> Yes. Fencing on either end. Yes. >> Yeah. But it's lower. Uh hopefully that's not a problem. Yeah. Down there. No fencing. You're not going to wander through the swamp to swim through the swamp. >> I mean, that's a pretty good start. You
can get partial perimeter fencing with the exception of the 36 end. And if the deer still becomes an issue and you notice that it's like more prevalent, then maybe you do a phase two fencing project. >> Okay, sounds good.
>> Thank you very much. Um, just in the interest of time, let's move forward with uh to the draft obstruction study report, the larger of the documents. Um, I won't go through line by line, but I'll just let you know, um, you know, a lot of the information in the
introduction is a duplicate of what we've already talked about of the master plan, just the justification for doing the project. Um, and then explaining the different protected approach surfaces, um, which you'll see on page three there
are a couple different diagrams. So effectively those are the dimensions of your uh a visual approach surface and then we're providing an option for a nonrecision approach surface as well. So we'll hope to go through those tonight and then have you select which options
you'd like to do. Um so I guess just talking a little bit about the impacts of trees and the approaches. there's a lot of of different uh ways that they can affect the airport in terms of obviously their
safety issues. Uh that's, you know, the big obvious one. Um but you're also you have to think about things like your grant assurances. So every single time the city signs um a grant with the FAA, you sign on to a bunch of grant requirements and some of those grant
requirements include safety and removal of hazards from your from your protected surfaces. So, by leaving these hazards in place, you're actually not in compliance with those grant assurances that the city has signed. Um, you also
run the risk if you leave them in place for a great length of time, um, of even potentially having to have a displaced threshold on an runway that you're, you know, you're already at the 3,000 ft. And I think reducing your runway length any further, I don't think would be a
very good benefit to anyone. Um so so those are really the three major things and major impacts um of leaving the trees unressed. So when we're talking about a visual approach surface or when you look at the approach plates it's
like the circling approaches. Um this is your minimum level of clearance that FA would consider to be satisfactory and conant. So this is the bare minimum you need to be focusing on clearing the trees in these surfaces. Um when we're talking about the non-precision
approach, you get a little bit more um you know, you can start to qualify for for different um approach categories and when you're, you know, so when you're when you're landing, you can, you know, have different it'll be compatible with different equipment and you'll know that those surfaces are clear. They're a lot
more stringent than the visual. Um so that would be considered kind of the little bit of a step up and um above what is required but might provide some additional benefit to the airport. Um so just to get into what's out there if we
actually flip to the plans. Um I'll just start with figure three. This is the runway 18 end and this is your visual approach surface. So again the minimum requirement. Um, and you'll see that
any um any tree that's actually penetrating that surface is in red and then anything that's within 10 ft of that approach surface is within blue. So, um, you know, we have listed here also you have,
let's see. Yeah. So, everything's, you know, relatively close in. And I know there's some terrain and things like that out that way. Um and then it's a um let's see. So that's
on your 18 end. And then we have the step off of the um non-precision requirements and that's on figure 4. So you can see um that encompasses a lot more obstructions. There are things um
even on the other side of Route Two there. >> Oh my god. >> Um because it's non precision >> because it's not a precision. Yeah, exactly. >> And the surface starts 200 ft from the end of the runway versus right at the runway threshold for the minimum.
>> Yep. And Jim, you were asking about um you were asking about the slope. So both of these surfaces the slope is 20 to one. Yeah, I saw that in one of the charts, too. >> Yeah. >> So, it's a lot. Wow, there's a lot on both.
>> Yeah. Yep. >> There's a ton. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> I mean, you got to ask yourself, is there is a nonprecision approach like something that's needed here? like desperately needed here. >> Yeah. >> Well, we have the non-precision approach
from the north and then we have one the circling approach from the west. >> And so where I'm going with it, Jackie, if you don't mind me stepping in, is that, you know, I'm looking at figure four, which is the non-precision approach in the runway 18 end. So, in order to
qualify for federal funding to do the tree clearing to to get yourself into a position for a nonprecision approach, you're going to have to acquire navigation easements over all the parcels that are underneath that approach surface that have trees. And
you're going to, you know, spend first of all get the easement, spend the money for the easements, and then then you would qualify for federal fund to actually do the tree clearing to satisfy that approach service. So really the question becomes does the city number one have the funding for it? Do you have
the stomach to go after? I don't know how many ements 14. So if you >> 14 navigation easements, you know what I'm saying? >> If you turn to page four, all the impacts are are listed. So you'll have it'll show you the number of easements that are needed for each of these options and then it'll show you uh the
different cost breakdowns. Um you know and again keep in mind these are planning level cost estimates. you would have to go through a whole scoping process to really determine um what the cost would be, but this is a pretty good ballpark if
you were to approach if you were to approach the city. So business of business. >> Yeah. >> So >> yeah, >> a lot of reasons you have to get >> Yeah. It is. And just to give you a
little perspective, when uh when Pittsburgh did it several years back to before they did the reconstruction of their runway, we acquired 34 navigation easements um between the two different approaches. So, it was a lot. >> Yeah.
>> Um and and just, you know, to to put this out there as well, there is an existing easement off the runway 18N that is in place. that's listed on your exhibit A property map. Um it's it's actually could be outlined here better,
but in on the plan it's outlined in a green dash. However, um what I would say about that is I dug into the easement. I actually read the full easement and it's not entirely clear where it begins. So it's
what's shown on here is an approximation of where that easement exists. So, part of potentially an easement project that you would want to do is also have a surveyor go out and actually survey where you have rights to clear. Um, and
then that would give you a better sense of do you need to expand an easement over one parcel? Do you have the rights you need? It's just really difficult for us to tell at this point in time because we don't have um you know we don't have a survey plan of exactly where those
boundaries are. But there are some rights with the visual option that you may have um to reduce the cost a little bit. But what I would like to show is worst case scenario. Let's say that that easement is kind of null void because
things have changed because uh requirements have changed. This is your worst case scenario. If you had to acquire five airspace easements over these parcels, this is really what you're looking at here. Um, >> where would the funding come from
getting those? >> So, the FAA will pay um 90% of project costs typically. Um, but right now for fiscal year 2026, they're paying 95%. So, you would have only a cost of 2.5%
to the city. So, this is, you know, the the funding year that we're going into actually starts today. Um, starts the federal fiscal year. Um, it's really a good opportunity if you're looking to do a type of a project like this to get,
you know, a reduced cost to the city. Um, >> now, who does the negotiating with the land owners? >> We do. Yep. So you would contract with you would contract with your you know your consultant who's Gail Associates. We would go through the typical uh
scoping process that we usually have um and we would do you know we have to do the um you have to survey all the parcels. You have to coordinate with the property owners. You have to get um an appraisal for each of the parcels. You have to have a review appraiser come out and review those appraisals to make sure
that they jive. Uh you have to hire an attorney to draft up all the paperwork. And then Gail would deal individually with each property owner and negotiate um the price. It's a good deal about >> the I mean I don't know how amenable the
neighborhood would be for something like that. I mean, that's the other the factor to consider is like the community relations. Like, do they I don't know if these neighbors are like if they would view that as an intrusion or if they'd be amendable to fair market value for the navigation. >> We never had a problem on the north end.
That's where uh yeah, I was looking at that that that uh green line with the proposed one was in place for obstruction uh easement area that uh you think that was that Jim Level that lived
off the end up here? >> Yeah. Yeah. >> That's his property. I think >> it was. Yeah. >> Yeah. And that's why that easement was probably there. I don't know if it transfers. >> Yeah. So that's why that's why you get the easement is because you'll have
perpetual rights. And the reason the FAA requires you to get an easement over um a parcel rather than just like a tree clearing agreement is when they clear the trees and they pay to clear the trees. They want to know that you have rights to go go back there and always be
maintaining it. So that's the other thing to consider. Yeah, that looks like it was probably the um >> and on the other side of to um I put dollars of donuts at the south end
whale by Kendall Pond is uh some of that's owned by mank how big this one is. Yeah, I think it's a pretty good size lot >> because that's the back way into PA. >> Yeah.
>> So, there's there's a possibility that we can not have it be super supportive. How what's the difference between page three and four as far as one's
>> So, three is your three is your visual approach surface. >> Okay. So, the surface starts right at the runway end and goes 20 to one. It's a much uh skinnier surface that's 250 uh ft wide at the starting point.
>> Um >> two markers, two dotted lines on each. >> Yep. So, so the the dotted lines on either side, that's a good point. I should have pointed this out before. The dotted lines on either side are a 50-foot buffer. So when we when we
negotiate an easement um it is it is standard practice to also negotiate a 50-foot buffer on the easement because suppose you have a tree that's right on the edge of the approach surface or
right on the other side of the approach surface but the the branches are encroaching into the approach surface. You want to make sure you have the rights to take that tree. So that's why you put theif the 50 foot buffer zone in there as well. >> Okay. >> Yeah. So that's just an added layer of
protection um to make sure that you have the rights that you need if you're going through this whole process. um you know and then um you know moving on to the the runway 36 and the last two figures it's um you know the same the
same surface dimensions and the same starting points and everything um you know you can see that the the obstructions that you have on figure five they go pretty far out um
>> Wow. >> Yeah. I mean, I know there's a hill there, too. Correct. Um, >> is that the sand pit way up there? >> Yeah, there's a sand pit out there. Um, >> I I did [Music]
>> Yeah. Yeah. I have uh approached I haven't talked to him yet, but I did put in a request to the town manager uh in Hobbitston because he uh they're working on a housing development in the
Santa area. I'm not sure if it's this one or another one. And it goes along with the one that's over by the PA on the other end is another housing development. And uh I just want to make sure that they know that they're on the
approach end of each of the runway. And >> I want to stab it right now. I started, you know, whenever I see something like that, I always >> Are they within any of these areas that we have? >> I would say that sand and if it's that sand pit. >> Yeah.
>> Cuz you you may want to kindly request that they impose uh >> restrictions or navigation easement before they develop them and sell them. that we don't have to go through the exercise of purchasing this stuff >> and doing this exercise that we're doing
now that you're going to ultimately need. >> Yes. >> Yep. >> Yeah. The uh because the this is a bigger area than I had thought, but if you stand down there
and look out, you uh I'm trying to figure out what's right off the end of that. We run into wetland problems now there. >> You could you could have you could have shrubs there, you know, low lowlying type of type of shrubs. I mean, that
stuff grows up pretty pretty quickly. Um, >> it could be anything. Could be could be cattails that literally grow to a certain height that that got that >> I don't know. The red area is, you know, the ground does come up out there and I
think it's probably through the swamp. That red area is the hill. I don't know. There might be some trees on it, but the one over on the other side where the large area off the 36 is the hill. >> Yeah. Yeah. And so, um, just directing
your attention, if you flip one page back to page five, these are the tables, um, that show you all the different impacts. So, you, you know, square footage of everything's on here. It's, you know, I think the important part is the numbers, the cost estimate. That's really what, um, is probably the driver
for everybody here. So, um >> cuz I know uh a couple of the pilots would love to have an even a precision approach, but that would even be lower. >> Oh god, that would be >> I mean, you have to buy the
you have to put in a uh you'd have to do a lot of landscaping. You need some like system, >> but I I you know, I find it kind of unusual cuz you see some of the airports near the cities and stuff like that.
It's crazy. Yeah. >> Yeah. Um >> but so be it. And I know it's a lot of information to digest and you know we've been talking about this for you know quite some time getting actual actual instruction
information um so that you can really have an understanding of what is out there um what the impacts will be if you do not um at least do the minimum um but I'd be happy to take any questions um concerns
hoping that um you know we can we can just like we did with the fence maybe talk about the preferred options because these do ultimately the purpose of this project is to evaluate it from an environmental standpoint. So we need to do that um that documented.
>> I think there's going to be mediation with the environmental and safety. I think it's going to come down to the fact that um
hopefully they will allow us to cut trees down. >> They they will for tree clearing. They definitely will. We we've permitted a lot of tree clearing within environmental habitats including vernal pools, significant vernal pools. We've done it on Cape Cod which is a sole
source aquifer. So for a safety project, for transportation, federal aviation, we we've been successful in doing that. I'm not saying that it doesn't come without its challenges, but >> yeah, >> because that's whenever I know I look at it from the way people when they have to
build houses and stuff like that, the challenges that go through um by everybody basically. Housing's usually Yeah. when when we start introducing federal requirements for air
navigation and the FAA um requiring that this be done that usually >> it usually gives you a leg to stand on. Um >> and obviously you know you look at things like management >> things like that. So >> yeah. >> Okay.
>> Yep. And also also you know another thing and I know we've talked about it in the capital improvement planning meetings and stuff like that is um keep in mind so we'll go through this you know environmental process and then you also should think about your vegetation
management plan and that will kind of pave the way for making your local permitting um a lot easier. So so it should be um you know we should we should plan for that as well. Um, so that's included in the overall cost
estimate here, um, as one of the line line items, but I I would hope maybe to talk about um, your your preferred option in terms of would you like to on each runway end, would you like to us to evaluate from an environmental
standpoint the visual or the non-precision and go with either one? My recommendation would be to evaluate the nonprecision approach um because it's a lot easier to back off and say we're
going to go with the less stringent option when you actually apply it. So you could evaluate the non-precision option as part of this environmental assessment, but then ultimately maybe when you get down the road to actually doing a project and doing the easements
and what have you, um you know, you you could reduce what you're looking for, you could reduce it to the visual. So um I don't know, Matt, if you have any uh concerns or >> No, I think that I mean that makes sense from from an EA perspective. Um that
that's one way to look at it. Then you have your capital improvement program, your CIP, which is you when's their meeting? >> Their meeting is two weeks from today. I'm sure. >> So two weeks from today, you're probably going to want to have a better plan in place as to whether or not you're going to go for a navigation easements that
you can do future tree clearing. And like I said, whether or not the city has the funds and the stomach to go after multiple aggregation easements for non-recision approaches versus going after easements and tree clearing to maintain just your existing conditions
and basic requirements. >> That's great. And that's >> so I guess I guess to keep the conversation focused to what we need for the environmental analysis. Um, can can I request a discussion or confirmation
so we can move forward with the environmental piece of whether you'd like the visual evaluated or the non-precision? >> I personally I think we should go for the non-precision approach because of the moisture in here and then back off.
It's going to be easy to back off than it is to >> Yeah. >> But yeah, it's always easier to cut >> if you Yeah. negotiate. >> Yeah. What? Yeah. >> That way if you decide to, you know, if you evaluate the visual right now in terms of your environmental assessment
or your really CDEX, um, >> you'd have to and then you decide you want to do the non-precision, you'd have to go back out and redo your CADX document to, you know, to evaluate that. So, um, >> which I wouldn't want to see happen.
>> Yeah. the from 1/8 standpoint it's not bad. It's the 136 approach. It's much more expensive by considerable amount >> and a lot more.
It's uh >> a lot more. Yeah, >> it's a lot more terrain. >> Yeah. >> Who knows? Maybe we'll trigger somebody to do tree harvesting firewood. Yeah, they could always expand that sandbank that hill might not be there in
a couple years. >> Yeah. Yeah, >> that's true. >> Well, to a point when the environmental people get a hold of it, they don't want you moving any dirt, but >> it'll be their problem, not ours. >> No further. They took the whole side of
the hill down. >> Oh, yeah. >> But, uh, yeah, >> probably. But there's a lot uh yeah, like you said, a lot of information, >> right? And I think from a from a practical standpoint, I mean, you
certainly have some time with the obstruction piece to, you know, to look at it and and digest it and ask any questions. Um, but would you feel comfortable moving forward with evaluating the non-precision for each of those runways from an environmental
standpoint? >> I I would say yes regarding precision. Like we said, it's easier to back off. Pretty hard to negotiate with people and then go go back and say, "Oh, well, we need more, >> especially the environmentalists and the
feds." Yeah. Oh, yeah. For sure. >> Yeah. Okay. So, um, my plan moving forward is we'll take the, um, defense project that we talked about and we'll take the two non-precision options for each runway
end and we'll start pro uh, processing those and putting those into the categorically excluded documented CADX um, report. So, you'll see that, you know, coming up u some point um, the next several meetings probably. Um and
then um what I'll do also is I will forward the draft obstruction study report to FA MACOT just so that they can review and comment and let us know any you know concerns they have or see. Um any questions, comments, anything about
this project? Um okay. >> Okay. Um last and last piece of information um that I have is the airport's capital improvement planning meeting is going to be held virtually. Um Jim Isabelle I I believe you were
both included on um the invite from Joe. >> Good. Okay. Um, so the MASOTCIP I provided a copy of the letter just for you know uh just for your information.
Um, right right now there are placeholder projects in here that we talked about last year. They have wildlife fencing, snow removal equipment building and land acquisition. Um given the discussion that we've had this evening,
our recommendation would be to uh kind of re-evaluate the priorities here in the CIP and maybe place a 2026 project as um you know acquisition of the easements and then also maybe your u
vegetation management plan. Um, and then you could do your phase one tree clearing, which would be the design. You could probably do you could probably do your VMP and the permitting, too, but might be good to get it done early. And then 2028, um, you know, put
your tree clearing actually in there. Um, and again, the the CIPs change from year to year. You have, you know, opportunity to, you know, negotiate and think about those things. I know Jim, you mentioned, >> so you want to want to you going to hold up on the fence or
>> what would be what's you guys' priority? I mean, I think the I think the FAA is probably going to make you clear those trees at some point or they're going to threaten to displace your thresholds, >> right? >> Um, if the fence can hold off a little bit longer, then it would make sense to
get easements, do design bid peritting for tree clearing, do tree clearing, then fence. I would like to see the tree clearing. I just don't know how the city is going to have get the local share. You know, that takes a lot of effort.
>> It does. That's always >> to to prove it and they've got a lot of other things on their minds. You know, >> um if um if you I know Jim, you had mentioned um you know, talking to them
about the budget and things like that. If you need assistance in terms of providing the background information, the justification, anything like that, um, you know, be happy, we'd be happy to to assist you, um, in any way to, you know, give them whatever information and
is value to, um, whatever information that they need. >> Local share on the million-doll project. >> Um, you know, >> yeah, >> that is. And uh it's just it takes a lot of planning for them to come up with that.
>> I don't just don't know how um >> I think there's um a lot of different avenues that I don't know anything about and I think that the uh because we're kind of caught between a
rock and place. In other words, we need more hangers. >> Mhm. We need a a uh equipment building. >> I know. >> You know,
>> if I pieces interrupt if I That's a good segue into if we get the great Boston soaring club here. They have as much as 40 uh flights a day on some days. Now, would extra traffic improve our FA
funding? Well, >> not not um >> not to the level. Yeah. Not to the level that would increase the funding amount. Yeah. It's okay. >> Where where the where I see the biggest problem is is the
>> here again our ability to generate some income somehow. And the having the sorting club here would definitely be an entertainment factor would allow for you know the food trucks and all the party animals that seems to be the phase of
everything. Every weekend there's a party going on somewhere and so you know it's just how do we get move both of them ahead but not close the airport because of trees
growing. Um, I I've got to look back. I think there's something in one of the I've talked to a couple of people and we have local companies who do that. A company that does that and they did it the last time. >> Mhm.
>> And believe it or not, I think I probably do it in a week. I mean, it's really amazing. And they actually paid us some money. Well, and if you have an avenue for doing that, you know, outside of AIP funding, again, all of these projects that we're doing are assuming
that you're using that FAA funding, which has all of these, you know, stipulations, requirements, and things like that. So, I mean, if >> I don't I don't know if it was done outside of it or not. That's the part I'm trying to find out now >> because uh it was a long time ago,
almost 20 20 years. >> Yeah. Well, the other thing is if the FAA has paid money to clear trees on any of these properties, which I I don't know what the history >> they have, I think, because that's where that easement went came from. >> Okay.
>> Because a gentleman who lived there had a plane. >> He kept it there and taxied it up the road to bring it. >> And so it uh Yeah. >> Yeah. They will not pay to clear previously cleared areas, but there are
other avenues. um for that as well. So I know um I know MAST has contributed funding in the past to um clearing areas that were >> will we mention this to them in the capital improvement meeting? >> Absolutely. >> Okay.
>> They'll they'll have to do >> they'll have a copy of this report um already. So hopefully the folks at the FAA will have had an opportunity to at least peek at it um and have an understanding of what's out there. Uh
same thing with Mass DOT. So um yeah, they'll be aware of >> I have Yeah. And it's there are a lot coming down the road. >> Yep. I don't know if any of it's going to make it, but as far as
aviation in general and uh so it's going to be interesting. Okay. >> Um that's all I have for this evening. Just think about that capital improvement plan meeting coming up in a couple weeks. Um yeah, I think there's plenty of information and we'll have a
great discussion then. Um but of course reach out to me at any point in time with any questions, concerns that you have. Um otherwise I'll move forward as we discussed and uh I am available for >> Okay. >> Very good.
>> Thank you all for your time. >> Well, thank you. Very informative. >> Yeah, it's uh >> we appreciate the input. It's uh definitely a lot of
>> quite the eye opener. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Especially when it's it's going to be required. >> Oh yeah. Well, sooner or later we're going to have to growing. We have to do something. >> True. >> And you know, the city hasn't been
preparing for that because they're not >> Well, I guess we need to put the city on notice. Well, that's what I've been trying to do whenever I talk to anybody. But >> well, this report will be once we finalize it, which I wouldn't imagine
it'll take too long for, you know, FAA mass to review, you know, >> four plans and four pages. >> Um, so, so hopefully, you know, once that's finalized, I would certainly, >> you know, Okay. >> I I mean, I would, I would approach the city as soon as possible and let them
know that you have trees. >> Yeah. Okay. >> Well, that's what you don't worry about it. >> I wanted Yeah. Well, you know, I that's why I was waiting for this to come out. >> Yeah. >> Because it's the only thing I can say this is our problem. This is what we've estimated and what we're going to do.
>> Yeah. And it's it's on paper. It's all outlined. It's >> That's exactly what I need. Facts. >> Yeah. >> And you should invite some of the city councils whoever oversees the airport to these meetings so they can >> They have been they have
Pastor Isabelle has invited several and I >> who oversees the airport which commissions >> um >> welfare >> mostly public welfare committee I think but it's like the uh
one that's it's the finance committee is a little bit >> they rotate they they're different >> but they uh cops just cops We >> did both times.
>> Can I go? >> Yes. Go ahead. >> Okay. I repaired the automatic gate. The loops on the asphalt had a nick in them and they were sporadically working both on the inside and the outside. >> Uh there's the invoice that uh you guys
approved last month to have repaired. It's been repaired. And uh the price was $2,700. >> How much? >> $2,700. that was taken out of the um the repair and maintenance uh budget which is 4875.
Um also, so that's done. It had they they used a asphalt cutter, cut out all the wires and all the loops, pulled out the old wires, put in new wires, reattached them, and puts sort of like a rubber cement type thing over the top of
it. And it works. It works fine. So, we shouldn't have any more problems with it. It should work. >> It wasn't going to get better by itself. >> No, it wasn't. It had to be done. And um we've lubricated the chain which was very dry and that needed to be done. >> Yeah. I I done it a couple of times, but
I had >> Yeah. The yearly maintenance of the fire extinguishers has been completed. And I bought one new fire extinguisher for the exterior of number 10 outside down there so the tenants can have access to it if needed. It's closer than some of the other ones
>> with a case. >> Sorry. >> With a case to protect it from >> Well, they wanted $500 for a case. So, it's like a it's a um it's a plastic insulated thing that goes around it.
>> I wasn't going to pay $500 for for this is the bill was from North Central and Templeton. $282. That's paid. Uh the year a maintenance on the fuel tank and system has been completed. Um
and um everything is working properly. He did all his normal system checks, uh tank checks, sign checks. He comes in here and checks the control system. Everything's working fine. The only
thing that wasn't working that I had told him about was the sump up in the back. The diaphragm had all calcified. Um, and that hadn't been replaced for probably three years. And so I had him replace it. I bought a new one which was like 125.
>> Where's the old one? >> I don't know where the old one is. Uh, he said those only last for a couple of years and we scraped it out and cleaned it and lubricated it multiple times. >> I can do it in about an hour.
>> It's still not working. We have a new one for $125. So, he put that in and it's working fine. And now my arm is not broken from yanking on that. So, >> that's done. And uh that um I don't have
the bill for that yet, but we know approximately what it is because everywhere >> Yeah, cuz that's uh >> Yeah, we're getting we're getting low on our fuel. We have 1300 gallons left. Uh last month we
we sold $839 gallons of fuel and we made $4,668.4 which we are required to give to the city back to the city which I wish we could keep but they they take it and um the the month before was 600 and some
odd gallons. So if you want to take a look Andy's already seen it. >> Yeah. I thought that we had made arrangement for the city that we could keep the money from the fuel for our budget. >> It's in our No, it's in our budget for
the uh for from fuel has to go into the fuel account. >> Yeah. >> And we accumulated Kenny told me about it too. >> Yeah, we fuel money goes into the account and makes up for the
fluctuations in the price of fuel. >> Right. And we need, you know, about $15,000 to buy 3,000 gallons of fuel. And I would recommend that we, you know, in sometime in October, early November, get another 3,000 gallons because we'll
be getting low if we're on track to sell >> 6 or 800 gallons. Also in October, we'll be below our our point. >> It drops off pretty quickly. Um, over the years I haven't
felt like we should store. >> Yeah. And that shows the fee that the company takes and we give them the the net. >> So, we have signs over there preventing people from throwing their fuel on the ramp.
>> I I'm going to make something up. Maybe we can get a sign. >> You got a sign made? Yeah, we need a lot of science around. They don't they don't Most of them use the >> what's the Gatsby jack >> gates? Gats jack.
>> Just about everybody I know uses one to and dump it back in the tank cuz it filters out the water. >> They're dumping it on your apron right now. >> Huh? >> They're dumping it on your >> It might be a mistake. I'm sure there's a few comes out very fast and they may just
>> Yeah, most of it I've seen has been spillage. >> I don't think they purposely dump it on there, but I think a sign would be good. >> Yeah. >> What should it say? Don't dump any fuel. >> It should say you're incompetent bastard.
>> Not dump any fuel on our brand new ramp. No fuel is even. Wow. You're asking people to read. >> Yeah. >> Anyway, I was happy that we sold so much uh fuel. >> Quite a bit. Yeah, >> that's a lot.
>> It is for us. It's a bunch. >> Yeah. >> Is that because the gliders we hit? >> No, cuz the weather's been nice. Couple they've got some gallons for their pawnies, but we've had a lot from Sterling, uh, Crow Island. had some
Pittsburgh people come over. Had a lot of lot of activity lately. >> It was busy year yesterday. >> Yeah. And Saturday was busy. Yeah. It was just beautiful. >> Oh, yeah. It was gorgeous yesterday. >> Yeah. And um Yeah, we have we're
competitively priced. So, um [Music] somebody had hear all the way around the loop. He had the wrong pitch or something. Sounded like he was climbing constantly
till they cut it to come in. >> Yeah, they have um >> That's no big deal. It's just took us out of here about 8:00 last >> Yeah. Um Okay. And
that it as well? Yep. Yeah. I mean, wrap it up quickly since it's 207, but Yep. That's really basically it. I mean, we met a couple weeks ago, so you've already seen the Templeton Light. You saw that last time. Um, the Associates
got a bill. They got two invoices paid this month. And um what is it? Oh, QT pod. But I already talked about that last time. >> Oh, when they when they did the maintenance, they replace the filter. >> They Yes, they replace the filter
>> with ours. >> Yes, with ours. >> And we've got another one to >> Yes. >> Just in case we need to do it. >> Yep. >> Y good. Thank you. >> So, that's it. Uh it >> Okay. Um,
>> oh, and uh, we need to get Gail Associates contract in the works again. Yeah, I think that's with the council something instead of >> the purchasing department would like you to say yes and then we'll get the paperwork
together and then it has to go through the council >> because it's an excessive >> an excessive >> it's in excessive limit. >> Yes. It'll go five years. Is it three years? >> I don't know.
>> It's greater than three years. It has to go through >> here again. >> Well, I don't know what the last >> I'll send it over to you. I have it at the office. We'll take a look. >> Appreciate it. >> Okay. And then we can uh get that sent
out to the council if that's so over to the purchase. It takes a while because it has to be redone from scratch, he said, because of the grid in three years. So, it does >> I don't know. I would never never know.
>> Whatever the purchasing department does, that whole thing has to be red redone. >> We don't want to go through that. We don't have to. >> Yeah. Give me the the old I'll send it over >> just so I have I can read it and go. >> I'm sure I have the old RFQ that you
guys issued. So, I'll send you that as well. >> Okay. Anything you can >> keep me up to speed. >> Yeah, no worries. I can't break too fast. Okay. Um, other than that, anybody have anything else?
>> No, sir. >> Motion. >> Make a motion to adjourn. >> Second 6:42. >> Here we go. >> Anybody watching those Red Sox? Oh, yeah. >> Yeah. >> Last night. Little little nerve-racking
in. >> Yeah. Three straight singles. >> I almost gave up on them. Yeah. Same. >> Thank you all. >> Bye. Thank you very much. >> I'll get that sent over to you. >> Yeah. Send that down. You're going to send electronic. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. Email the personal email or the
gardener email. >> Well, I can work both of them. >> I'm going to send them both and you can >> either way. Sounds good. >> I'm having an argument with Mike. I don't know what >> I am means on my email, but I think it's
because it's got an old account through my service and uh just I mean I can shut this off anyway. I said to all of them.