All right, we're live. >> Good afternoon, good evening. Please rise for the pledge of allegiance and please remain standing for the invocation by Pastor Mike Williams of the Shades of Worship Church. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the
republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. May we bow our heads, please. Father, in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, we thank you, Lord God, just for this awesome day you've blessed us to see.
Thank you, Lord God, for keeping us and watching over us, Lord. And we just ask right now that as this uh meeting goes forward, Lord God, that you'll just bless council, Father God, and all those who are involved. Yes, Lord God, that every decision that is made, let it be to the benefit of everyone, Father God, in this wonderful township of
Gloucester. And we are just truly grateful to be here. We thank you. We just thank you for all of your wonderful blessings in Jesus name. Amen. >> Thank you. Good evening. This regular meeting of the township council is being held in accordance with the schedule of the meetings of the township council
established and adopted by the township council which schedule designated the time and date and place of this meeting. Adequate public notice of this meeting has been provided pursuant to the provisions of the open public meetings act. We are using an electronic amplifying recording device in order to attain a clear and audible record and
request all those that wish to speak be recognized and state your name and address directly into the microphone. The recording device to be solely utilized by the township clerk's office for the preparation minutes and shall be the official record of the township council meetings. Madam clerk, may the roll call, please. >> Mr. Mong >> here.
>> Mrs. Alrexel >> here. Mrs. Grace Love >> here. Mr. Nash >> here. >> Mrs. Walters here. Mr. Castro >> here. >> Mr. Mcado >> present. Mr. Hutcherson >> present. >> Mr. Cartis >> here. >> Chief Manazi >> here. >> Mr. McIll >> here. >> Miss Weiss >> here. >> Mrs. Eric
>> here. >> We'll now have our first public comment period. This is for agenda items only. Uh each individual of the public can speak up to three minutes. There's 15 minutes allocated for this public portion. It's for agenda items only. If
you wish to speak on the budget, there is a separate hearing for that. Would anyone like to speak during the public comment? First public comment. Seeing none, we'll put first public comment. Proclamation supporting the 2026 click or ticket seat
belt mobilization grant May 18th through May 31st, 2026. Whereas there were 228 motor vehicle fatalities in New Jersey in 2024 with 35 people being unrestrained and one in
four being between the ages of 21 and 30. And whereas many motor vehicle occupants killed in traffic crashes were not wearing a seat belt. And whereas use of a seat belt remains the most effective way to avoid death or serious injury in a motor vehicle crash. And
whereas the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration estimates that 91.2% 2% of motorists use a seat belt with 14,955 lives saved by safety belt usage nationally in 2017.
Whereas the state of New Jersey will participate in the nationwide click or ticket seat belt mobilization from May 18th through May 31st, 2026 in an effort to raise awareness and increase seat belt usage through a combination of high visibility enforcement and public
education. And whereas the division of highway safety traffic safety has set a goal of further increasing the seat belt usage rate in New Jersey from the current level of 95% which is above the national average. And whereas a further
increase in seat belt usage in New Jersey will save lives on our roadways. Therefore, be it resolved that David R. Mayor, mayor of the township of Gloucester and Orlando Marcato Council President do hereby bribe proclaim the township of Gloucester support for the
clicketet or ticket seat belt mobilization both locally and nationally from May 18th through May 31st 2026 and pledge to increase awareness of the mobilization and benefits of seat belt use.
Thank you, Madam Clerk. Wave the reading and accept the minutes of the regular meeting April 13, 2026 and regular meeting April 27th, 2026. May I have a motion, please? >> I'll make that motion. >> Second >> on the question. Roll call, please. >> Mr. Manon, >> yes.
>> Mrs. Albreight Troxler. >> Yes. >> Mrs. Grace Love. >> Yes. On April 13th, 27th. >> Thank you, Mr. Nash. >> Yes. on April 13th and abstaining on April 27th as well. >> Mrs. Walters, >> yes. >> Mr. Castro,
>> yes. >> Mr. Marcato, >> yes. >> Next is our consent agenda. Any council member like to have any item removed from the consent agenda, please speak up. Hearing none, I entertain a motion to accept the consent agenda as presented. >> I'll make that motion.
>> Second. >> Thank you. On the question, roll call, please. >> Mr. Minion. >> Yes. Mrs. Aubry Troxel. >> Yes. >> Mrs. Grace Love. >> Yes. >> Mr. Nash, >> yes. >> Mrs. Walters, >> yes. >> Mr. Castro, >> yes. >> Mr. Marcato, >> yes.
>> Resolution 182, resolution of the township council of the township of Glouster authorizing the township clerk to read the 2026 township budget by title only. >> May I have a motion? I'll make that motion. >> Second >> on the question. Roll call, please.
>> Mr. Minion. >> Yes. >> Mrs. Albert Droxel. Yes, >> Mrs. Grace Love. >> Yes, >> Mr. Nash. >> Yes, >> Mrs. Walters. >> Yes, >> Mr. Castro. >> Yes, >> Mr. Marcato. >> Yes. >> Resolution 173, resolution to amend the 2026 budget of the township of Glouester
County of Camden, state of New Jersey. Whereas the local municipal budget for the year 2026 was approved on approved on the 13th day of April, 2026. Whereas the public hearing on said budget has been held and advertised.
And whereas it is the desire to amend said approved budget which will be advertised on May 14th, 2026. And a public hearing on the amendment will be held on May 27th, 2026. Now therefore, be it resolved by the
township council of the town of Glouester County of Camden that the following amendments to the approved budget of 2026 be made. General revenues. Six. Amount to be raised by taxation for support of municipal budget. A local tax for
municipal purposes including reserve for uncollected taxes. Sheet 11 from 69,94,263.85 to 69,47,378.80. Total amount to be raised by taxation for supportive municipal budget sheet 11
from 69,94,263.85 to69,47,378.80 80 seven total general revenues sheet 11 from 90,334,7269 to89,837,84164 general appropriations 8F judgments
sheet 19 from 0 to $5,500 H1 total general appropriations for municipal within cap sheet 19 from 73,230,78 to 73,236,28
F judgments sheet 28 from $500,000 to zero H2 total general appropriations for municipal purposes excluded sheet 28 from $16,56,497
$7.51 to $15,556,49751. O total general appropriations excluded from cap sheet 29 from $16,56,49751 to $15,556,49751. L subtotal general appropriations items
H1 and O sheet 29 from 89,287,2551 to 88,792,7551. M res reserve for uncollected taxes sheet 29 from1,47,5218 to1,45,136.13 9 total general appropriation sheet 29
from 90,34,7269 to 89,837,84164 H1 total General appropriations for municipal within cap sheet 30 from 73,230,78 to $73,236,28. F judgments
sheet 30 from 500,000 to zero. M res reserve for uncollected taxes sheet 30 from 1,47,5218 to1,45,136.13 9 total general appropriation sheet 30 from 90,334,7269
to 89,837,84164. Be it further resolved that this certified copy of this resolution be filed forth with in the office of the director of government services for certification of the local municipal budget. So amended.
>> We're required by the state to read that resolution to amend the budget out loud. So sound there's a lot of numbers in there. So that's why our clerk read that. Uh before we go to a motion or a second, there is a public hearing that's required.
uh and we will open up the public hearing. There's unlimited time. Each speaker may speak uh for five minutes and then we'll go to the next speaker and once we've gone through all the speakers uh that individual or individuals can speak again uh but again it's unlimited time for this portion for
a public hearing. Would anyone like to speak on Excuse me? >> I have to make a motion to open the public hearing. Okay. >> Second. >> Okay. All right. I make a motion to uh open a public hearing. >> Motion. >> I'll make that motion. >> There a second.
>> Second on the question. Roll call, please. >> Mr. Mo, >> yes. >> Mrs. Alreight Troxel. >> Yes. >> Mrs. Grace Love? >> Yes. >> Mr. Nash? >> Yes. >> Mrs. Walters? >> Yes. >> Mr. Castro? >> Yes. >> Mr. Marcato? >> Yes. So, at the conclusion of the hearing, we're going to need a motion
for 173 and then we'll go to 183. >> You got it. >> Would anyone like to speak on this matter? Mr. Podor? Good evening, council. Ray Pyador from the historic village of Ariel. >> Good evening. Good evening >> once again. Um, as we approach uh
another budget and another increase and again I'd like to constantly remind the people of Glosser Township while addressing my council that on an even number year we managed to increase taxes and on odd number years we managed to hold the line and if I didn't know any
better and I think I've asked this of Mr. partisan others. Why is it that you can do your job so well uh on the odd number of years besides the fact that it's an election um and not be able to do that hit us with these double-digit increases? Um at the last meeting you
had mentioned uh you had taken out a line item of judgments uh in the amount of $500,000 uh to reduce the increase. Could you please explain to the people of Gloucester Township what judgments is? Because I know when you look at it, you
either think it's money you're putting aside for either litigation or lawsuits or judgments could be from a higher power which would have made you do a much better budget than this. Could you please explain judgments, please? >> Well, that's a matter of >> No, we disc we at the end of
>> That's fine. Yeah, I forgot. We don't at the end. >> You don't talk to us. I forgot. >> Okay. >> You have been here before, Mr. Pador. You're aware of >> I've been here for years when the mayor used to be here and we had a dialogue and it was a really positive thing even though it got ugly. It was the actually
your free right to speak to us as well and answer us because quite frankly that was something I would address too with this budget. The fact that we stand here and the people lost your town should pour their hearts out. And if you remember 2016 and 18, this lady that was sitting in that seat, that little lady
that could not turn her air condition on on a 96 degree day and you still voted yes to increase the budget. And people come up here and pour their hearts out. And you don't want to have a dialogue anymore. And yet for 45 minutes, they'll tell you the hardship that they're
incurring because of what you're doing again. And you managed to answer all their questions in three and a half minutes. I'm sorry. Let me correct myself. You address what they've said in three and a half minutes and the word salad that you present at the end of what we ask. You
don't answer questions. You give us this candy cane good ship lollipop stuff that doesn't explain to people why you're doing to them again what you've been doing. And that would bring me to the point reminding the the seniors of our township.
Property tax freeze in New Jersey is a fallacy. the more lost your township you guys raise our taxes. The more money that seniors on a fixed income need to find new money to pay you and then they wait for the state to reimburse them the amount from where their property tax
amount was frozen to where you've increased it to. And some people don't have that money to put out. Seniors on a fixed income don't have that money to put out because you raise taxes and then wait for the state and of the things that you're looking at and decreasing.
And I didn't catch all the numbers. I appreciate you truly I do reading all those numbers out. But all that still comes to the fact that once again um you held the line last year, you're doing it again. That's a lot of consecutive every
other year property taxes. And as Mr. Cartis has indicated to us, well, you go around other townships, you look and see they're doing the same thing. No the hell they're not. No, they're not. Cherry Hill Wallup their people one time
and they managed to stay afloat for a good number of years not raising taxes. Vorhees other towns like ours don't do to their people what you're doing to us. And the bottom line is that it's not going to get any better. Okay?
Listen, I don't like to see you guys up there. I'd rather see some new faces that really do listen to the people and don't want to don't want to go down this road anymore. You're eventually going to tax the hardworking people out of Gloucester Township. You're going to tax
the seniors out of Gloucester Township. And we're sure we're sure that there's going to be somebody that wants to buy our house because we get phone calls and things in our our mailbox all the time saying they want our house. We like Gluster Township. We like it a lot. It's
just getting ridiculously expensive to live here. I know that you won't vote no. I know that you nobody will even give it a second thought. Maybe you'll have one stand out to put on a dog and pony show that somebody will say no. But this will pass and you will do this to
us again. But start thinking about the people that you're affecting because one day somebody's going to do it to someone you care about. Thank you. >> Thank you. Is there anyone else? >> Mr. Sweet. No. >> Good evening, council. Sam Street from
Ariel. >> Good evening. >> I I stand up here all the time and some of these people that may come up are going to ask for cuts in the budget. And you get asked all the time, what do you want to cut? What do you want to cut? If we're if you're going to balance
the budget, we have to cut something. I I've never said we need to cut anything. All right? Simple budgeting 101. Figure out what your expenses are and figure out how to pay for them. And in a municipal build, municipal entity, you
can do it by taxes, fines, permits, fees, licenses, grants, all of the above. If you overstate your expenses what they should be, you are creating an expense that doesn't exist. And if you
understate your income that's coming in, then you're creating that deficit. So if you're saying just for argument sake, we're going to make it simple. $50 million is the expenses of all of Glosser Township. I know it's not, but I'm just making it simple. And we raised $50 million. And
of that 50 million, 10 million is our fines, our permits, our licenses, our grants. That means we have to have $40 million in taxes. If that $10 million you decide to lower down to 5 million, even though you know you're getting 10 million, now you have to raise taxes up
to 45 million. You're creating a false error, if you want to call it that. You're creating a false deficit does doesn't exist. And I stand up here every budget season and bring it to your attention and you guys don't do a thing
about it. And I gone through this budget preparation worksheet. For example, I will say it again. Uniform construction costs codes, that's the permits for people to build in this township. And we know all the buildings
that are going up. The average for the last three years has been $1.1 million. Actually, it's been $1,151,321.77. And for some reason, what's being budgeted in 2026 is $900,000.
Why? Why are we budgeting $251,000 less than what we've actually gotten the last three years? And we know that you guys are authorizing all these buildings to come in. So, those permits are going to go up. Pools,
the pool fees the last three years has averaged $122,000, but yet Mr. Cartis is a is budgeting $90,000. That creates a $30,000 deficit. Why? Most of the pool fees are probably
already paid in. We have that number. And I've asked that question repeatedly and I get, "Oh, well, yeah, we'll get to you, Mr. street and nobody ever answers it, right? So, I kind of went through the revenue sheet and came up with we're
a million dollars underbudgeting our income. A million dollars that we're not accounting for. And that doesn't take into account that the the biggest one is tax abatements, basically our pilot. That number is an exact number. But yet,
Mr. Cardis who traditionally over always over always over always over always over always over always over always over always over always over always over always understates that and I've proven that in the past because we did that in the in the citizens budget. He's saying that the payment in le of taxes pilot is $900,000. In the past it's 432,72438
836,000 back in 25 507 it was it's going up and up and up but yet 900,000 he traditionally undershoots that by about $200,000. So there's a million dollars now that
we're not accounting for in income that we could use to basically create that def lower that deficit that we need to do expenses. All right, we have an I have an email here that says that salaries and wages
3.5%. Increase. You guys say that 80% of the budget is already accounted for because of contracts, um, union unions, whatever. and 3.5% is the salary and wages. Well, your
salaries and wages, I can go line by line and maybe I will because I'm running out of time and when I come back up, but you've over basically not saying people don't deserve raises, they do. But you've overextended your
but not over you've overstated your budget by $929,000 for salaries and wages. because I took what I did was I took 2025 did the 3.5% increase and then said what's on the budget. So the business
admin wages the budget should if I look >> I'm sorry I interrupt you but we're calling if you do come back please reference the pages that >> Sure. >> Yeah. It would just be helpful me to follow reference every page. Thank you. >> Anyone else? Mr. Brown Jared you'll be
after. David Brown, Malberry Station. Welcome to the neighborhood Orlando. Um, I came last year, we talked about the revenue from uh the Prime Outlets, sell marijuana and
everything. And I got the numbers back from y'all. It comes to around $5 million a year that's new to the township. and yet we're getting a property tax increase like we're getting. Where did
that money go? I know certain people in the township got like a 80% pay raise. I mean, it's kind of crazy. And a bunch of us veterans go to the veterans office there that the new office and we all get
the same answer. Go to Cam County College, talk to Mr. Gallagher. What was that for? if the answer is going to be go talk to Mr. Gallagher at Camden County College. So to me that's wasted money when you look at that
and I have a hard time looking at a 13% pay raise. Um company I work for. We went two years without a contract. They signed a three-year contract last year. That means our contracts ended this year. We
got a 2% pay raise this year. They're looking to give us a 1.5 and here we're looking at 10% or 13% pay raise. Even God only commands 10% of your gross profit. Y'all are going higher than what
God wants. I don't know if that is because y'all were hoping that we'd sell the MUA and that would take care of all this problem. Is it bad budgeting?
overspending. Who's in charge of the overspending and the bad budgeting? That's what needs to be looked at. I mean, we're thinking one thing knowing that
another thing is going to happen. I'm at my base salary is $65,000 a year at my job. my property tax. Last last November, I got a call from my mortgage company.
My uh they sold me I'm $2,200 below escrow. Come to find out, tax office sent my property taxes were $8,000 a year to them. They were 9,300. So now I'm my escrow is way off. They
said, "Here's your two options. you can give us $2,200 and your house payment only goes up $110 a month or we'll just put it in your house payment and it'll go up over $350 a month.
So, I had to borrow money from my kids to do the 2200 so I could keep my house payment at $100 over. I've been here 14 years. My mortgages went up over $400 a month.
Some people in this township have gotten bigger pay raises than I make a year. There's the problem. That needs to stop. When you have people in the township making more money than a senator and a
congressman of the United States, that's where the buck needs to stop because nobody's job is that worth that much. Not in this small township. Thank you. >> Thank you, Mr. Brown.
>> Jared. >> Uh, thank you. Uh Jared Thomas from Blackwood. Um I'm not uh nearly as proficient at like accounting as some other folks are, so I'm making educated guesses here. Just hoping to get clarification on things I don't understand. Uh I
apologize. I don't know which page this is in the budget. It's in one of the first couple pages uh that was available online, but it didn't have a sheet number associated with it. Um, I'm going to make reference to it, but I think like there's maybe a better page
elsewhere in the budget. I'm just trying to understand with the surplus for 2026, it's listed as being 4.5 million and 2025 was 11.5 million. So, that's a $7 million change. I'm trying to understand
what that uh indicates. Um with regards to uh the line for local revenue, uh that number is increasing to 10.3 million down um from 5.5 million, which is about $4.8 million in increase. And
then later on there's a uh reduction in state and federal grants from uh from five 5.1 million in 2025 down to 282,000 give or take. And so it ends up being like those numbers balance out. My
question is is those uh first of all with the surplus reducing can somebody please help me understand why uh that changed and what that means with the change in uh local and state and federal grants like why are they almost exactly
the same? Is that um indicative of alternative sources of income or just a different way to account for the same things? Um, let me see. With regards also to the reduction in federal grants, state and
federal grants, you know, on the national level, we've been seeing the federal government withhold uh congressional funding um to states uh and I'm curious if that is something that is impacting us in this indirect
way uh in this budget. like we were expecting $5 million in external grant funding and we're not getting it that we even though we might be uh entitled to it. Um my family and our synagogue um we
have a uh security um uh committee that we have that we run and somebody is responsible for securing grant funding. Um it has been a nightmare to get that, you know, from the federal government. And I'm just curious if that's something
that the township is dealing with. Um you know, it we eventually got it. It only was, you know, 10 months late. So as a the result of this was that our entire synagogue started having to contribute directly to uh security
funding for the entire congregation. Um on On sheet number three, there is um an item on the right side called levy c levy cap bank applied. I'm trying to understand what that is. I
believe my just from Google I think that this is to do with like for previous years that we did not have a tax increase that there's apparently like some latitude for um tax increase to cover things uh beyond the mand uh
maximum 2% for exclusion items. So I wanted to confirm which years were utilized for that levy cap bank. And then the second thing I wanted to understand on that same sheet was the allowable health insurance costs. They
went up 3.2 million this year. Last year was 1.3 million. So over just two-year period we had a health insurance increase of 4 a.5 million. And again looking at things happening on the federal level, are we experiencing um
significant cost increases due to cutbacks in uh uh federal entitlement programs like social security, Medicaid, etc. that you know may have used to provide additional supplemental funding for things like that. Um just last thing
I wanted to talk about was you know I don't support slashing wages. I am curious are there specific employees which uh may be receiving excessive raises i.e. meaning more than 10% for some reason or another. Um and then my
last thing is like I would encourage everybody whose employer is not giving them a raise to challenge them on that because your employer is responsible for keeping you um employed in a way that doesn't make you uh broke. If you don't
get a cost increase that you just got a pay cut year by year and I would remind uh everybody go please find another place to work. Maybe that's not a good employer for you. Thank you. >> Thank you Mr. Cars. I hope you took some of those notes down.
>> I did try to follow. Okay. Is there anyone else? >> Yes sir. >> Good evening. >> Good evening. >> My name is Jerry Roach. I live in Blackwood. Good evening. >> Um, I just want to ask you a question.
Uh, I used to work for the school districts of Washington Township. I was a journeyman electrician there. My question is the new townships, the new houses being built by the shop, right?
I'm looking forward and I'm seeing these people here are concerned about their taxes. To me, they have no clue. This is just the beginning of it. And why am I saying that? Because the people who are going to be moving in
are going to have kids and those kids are going to be going to worse schools. I paid an escro shortage for three years in a row because of us. It's going to happen again because they're going to have to build new schools to accommodate
these children. And that's fine. Everybody's equal to an education. But we all have to eat. We all have to eat. And my question is, I was hit three times.
Twice on a motorcycle and once in a brand new RAV on a corner of choose landing and a black horse pipe that bottlenecks. You talk about wearing a seat belt. That is the most dangerous corner or one
of the most dangerous corners in Worester Township. I know that the township has to have an insurance policy and nothing is being done on that corner because I was told I was told that
that's a county and a state road. And the officer said to me, "Well, who's going to pay for it?" Okay. And that's a major concern because it's hard to get out of my area now and they're not even built yet.
And the other thing I wonder if you can straighten this out because I'm hearing rumors and I don't like rumors. I like the truth. So I'm going to ask you. I'm hearing that American Water doesn't need our township. If they
condemn our sewage, that they don't need to come out for a vote, they can just do what they want with it with American Water. And American Water, I know of them, they're being sued 15,
20 times a month. They don't care. They just want to do what they want to do. So, can you answer that question? Is that rumor true? I would like to know maybe from you. >> We respond after the the hearing, sir.
>> Okay. Well, thank you for your time. I do appreciate it. >> Thank you, Mr. Roio. >> Is there anyone else like to speak that's not spoken yet? Miss Gentilly. Hello everyone. Nancy Kelly, Gentilly Blackwood. Hello. Um, thank you all for coming tonight.
>> Um, I wasn't going to speak on the budget. I had another topic to talk about, but um, >> hearing someone speak about electricity bills and them going up and talking about the elderly population. Um, there's a family that I take care of, an elderly family that I speak to every
once in a while down in Ariel. um older budget conscious old family um I had to pay their electricity bill. It hurts. They are an unseen population. They don't go to unforgotten haven or
food banks that where they collect the data. It's a population that nobody sees and they're not being serviced. They're not getting help other than neighbors helping neighbors running to the grocery store and getting them things. someone helping with their electricity bill or
you know what, someone needs a ride to the doctors because they don't have a working car. So, this little old family that still lives in the historic village of Ill uh Ariel needs a little bit of help, but they're forgotten.
So, an electricity bill they the electricity bill that they can't afford comes down to do I pay my property taxes, but they have to pay it in full because sadly we can't count on what someone said earlier. You can't count on that refund, the budget, um the
rebate, the New Jersey stay, whatever it is that you want to call it, the the handout back to you. That's your taxes that you've already paid. they have to wait for it. They shouldn't even be paying it in the first place. They shouldn't have to budget to pay
extra and wait to get it back. So, this budget is really hurting people that don't come here. So, I I wasn't going to speak, but I speaking to someone in the back, they have to come up with the extra to wait to get their own tax money back. So,
I don't know. It's it's I know I can tell you talking. I budget my family budget and I do a darn good job of it and I don't go over it. I don't have debt. I pay my mortgage in 10 years. I don't have a car loan. I don't buy anything that I can't afford
twice. A rule of thumb, if I can't pay it in cash times two, then I don't buy it. I save it and I wait unless it's a house. So I don't know maybe I don't know have a
conscious people. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Is there anyone else would like to speak? Dad's not spoken. Yes. Miss Janice in the back. >> Okay. >> Janice um from Glenn Oaks right around here. Just I just had to write a couple
just a couple. Can you have your last name? Just >> Fizzer. >> Fizzer. Okay. >> Yes. >> Um before proposing any additional tax increases, has the township fully accounted for the increased tax revenue from all these rising home assessments um and all these residential buildings
that are being built all over this township. >> We we respond afterwards. I'm sorry. You could ask all your questions. We'll respond after. >> Okay. Yeah. just saying about the infrastructure like with between EMS, the police force, everything with all with all this residentials that are
being built all over Closer Township. Um, you know, was that all taken all into consideration? So, you can ask me at the end. And just one other note, uh, again, I'm a senior citizen, my first year, uh, that I just
retired. Um, and you know, when I came here, I'm from Philadelphia. came here 30 years ago and I was paying um $3,500 property taxes, which was great. I was coming from the city, but you know, schools were good around here. I had
relatives here. That's why we picked Worcester Township. Now I'm paying 9,200 and now I'm 66 years old. And and it's, you know, hopefully all the stay acts stay the same and Trenton doesn't change anything. I think
um it would be horrible if she changes that. I think, you know, we've put in our dues here. We pay a lot of taxes. I'm really nervous of my future here. Um to pay that much money, um and we're trying to, you know, want to stay in our
home. We like our street. We like our neighbors. Um I have relatives actually moved over here, um but, you know, because of the area. But um I I just again as a senior citizen I'm very nervous about my future here. I think
this this increase is really high. Um and and again as other people have said it it has been where the mayor will say no new taxes and we're like thank God but then the next year we're slammed. And I've been here meeting I've always come to these meetings and I've been
here in the past where it was packed in here. But the frustration part and I see it online. You know, there's a lot of social media going around in Gera Township. The people are frustrated. They feel like they come here and can speak like I'm going to speak, but it doesn't matter. And I've already heard
it from some people saying, "Why do we go? It doesn't matter because it's just always passed." And and that's what happened even last time. It just passed. Um again, I remember years ago the mayor used to be here. Um, and I think these are good meetings, then he should be
here. If he said no new taxes and here we are and now we have like a huge 13% tax increase. They need to really look at the people in the township. These are pushing us out and it's sad. Like I said, my son can't even buy ass here.
It's unaffordable. I mean, the the assessments are like huge, >> you know, and it's a sin. I can't get him out of my house and I want him to get him out of my house, but I get it. I'm like, just keep saving, you know, to trying and find something or you're
going to have to go to another um maybe over to Glster County or something because Camden County is really out of control. Thank you. >> Thank you, Miss President. Is there anyone else like to speak that's not spoken yet? Mr. Tweet.
>> I just got to grab >> I'll wait till you come back because you're the one that's writing down the questions. >> Right. So to go back to understating revenue. Oh, by the way, Sam Street from Ariel. So fees and permits, which is on page 136 to 138 of the budget prep prep
worksheet. The average for the past three years 352,22567. 25 was $332,000. So why are we budgeting $325,000? It's been going up every year all the fees and the permits that this township
is charging and yet we're taking the average and coming in below. We're even coming in below than what was charged last year. Cannabis fees. Mr. Brown said something about $5 million if I if I'm correct.
from. >> So according to 2025, we collected $232,75282. We're budgeting $25,000, $27,000 less. Why Why are we budgeting less than what we're actually collecting? Are the cannabis shops
picking up and moving elsewhere? No. where one pops up every every other day and there are lines out the door and they're making money and we're making money off of it in the fees. So why are we budgeting less? All right, cannabis fees by the way is one page
138. Municipal pool fees which I reiter reiterated $122,000 253,024 pe pools are going out out the yin-yang to build them in our houses. So people are joining the pools, but yet we're
budgeting $90,000 when the last two years was 122. Cable TV fees, and I asked this before, our cable TV fees in 2025 221,918. In 2024, 230,118.
In 2023, 238,71. We are budgeting 200,500. a $29,746 difference. Why? And I can go down the list and that and keep going down. Municipal court fe fines.
The average for the past three years, $351,69921. That's on page 138 as well. We're budgeting $330,000. That's a $22,000 difference. I can show this line. I can email it to
every one of you if you like, but total is about a million dollars that we are under budgeting on fees and income. That's a million dollars that we're saying that this township isn't making. And I I will be the first one to admit
that I don't know half the stuff that Mr. Cartis knows. So those numbers can be a lot tighter, which will actually lower our taxes. And not once did I say let's cut something. It's called budgeting 101. If we go to
back to the salaries and wages and I don't understand this one salaries and wages are total 31,100 or 31,141,000. >> Can you give us a page, sir?
>> Uh well it's all pages. It's pages 1, three, five, seven. It's business admin way. It's all the way >> off the worksheet. >> Yes. Off the budget prep worksheet. >> Okay. But what I don't understand is social security. If you if you multiply the social security, which is 7.65,
which is what the township has to match, it comes out to be two 2.4 mill well 2,453,476.25. But yet we're budgeting $2,700,000. So, we're overbudgeting an expense that is actually a calculated expense by
246,52375. And I know my numbers off because Mr. Hutchinson makes more than Social Security, the the top of Social Security. I'm not taking anything away from that. I'm just saying that you make more than that. So, therefore, you're capped. All right? And I'm certain
certain other people make more than that. I believe public works director makes more than that. All right? Again, I'm not saying we need to cut their salaries, but that number, $246,000, it's an exact number. Why are we budging $2.7 million, a nice round number? It's
budgeting 101. We're over overstating expenses, which creates a deficit. And nobody answers that question. I'm out of time. So, okay. If I can make if I can make a request, >> if anybody else wants to speak, let them
all speak and I'll speak at the end. So, because I have a whole list of things. >> No, we're going to continue and see who wants to speak. >> Of course, because you want to break the momentum. >> Anyone else would like to speak on this matter? Yes, Miss Higgins. Hey, they may be here for the wrong reason.
>> No. >> I know who they're here. >> Good evening, Julia Higgins. Ariel, >> good evening. >> I just want to reiterate what I said from a a couple weeks ago
about I'm a senior. I'm retired. Waited until I was debtree to retire. Uh, I own my home. I own my old car. And like all of you, the seniors are subject to
everything going up. Homeowners insurance, car insurance, taxes going up. Um, it's just difficult on us seniors because we don't have that income from when we were working. Um,
some are fortunate to have little pensions or big pensions, but there's social security and we all know that was just never meant to exist on. So it
if for anything you could ever decide to like squeeze that budget, like go over it with a fine tooth comb to see where you could make
um changes that that would help us. Um the New Jersey stay, I just received that check on Monday. taxes were due May 1st. I wait until the
10th to pay them. Um, that money is a help, but it comes after the taxes are due. And that was $2,100 for me. And as I said before, I don't want to have to go into
retirement savings to be paying my taxes. I just I just don't. Um, we're living longer. Um, it it it it's not what I meant that retirement to be for.
Oh, yeah. I have all this all this money in a retirement account, which I don't, but I don't want to be using it on property taxes. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Thank you, Miss Higgins. Anyone else would like to speak as I spoken,
Mr. Sweet. Again, I'm going to state the obvious. If you overstate expenses on a budget, not once have you heard me say, "Let's cut cut salaries. Let's cut this, let's cut that." I'm not about cutting. I'm about budgeting.
All right. Proper budgeting. You've got the business admin wages. Page one. 2025 was 181,46440. A 3.5% increase
makes it 187,815. We are budgeting 1945. That's an increase of $6,684.35. again. Why? And I can go down this list and you know with everybody I just don't but the total comes out to
be $929,61555. And then you've got the $246,000 error I'm going to call it on social security. That brings it up to be almost slightly less than 1.2 million of overstating expenses.
1.2 2 million of overstating expenses, 1 million of understating income. That's $2.2 million that doesn't need to be raised. This budgetary prep worksheet is our 144
pages long. And I kind of went through it. It's not my job, but you know, I kind of went through it to look at things. page 44, group insurance prescriptions. Now, I realize they're going up,
but last year 1,498,092, I'm sorry, uh was 1,263,125. The the 1.4 million close to 1.5 million is a 5-year average. If you take the three-year average, because I know
people like to say more recent, it's 1,62,3122. We're budgeting $1.8 million. That's $197,698.78 more. Police dues and subscriptions
48. I'm not about defunding the police or anything. I'm just going about budget. I'm not worrying about cutting All right. And I can't state that enough because every time I come up here, someone wants to say, "What do you want to cut?" "Oh, you want to cut that?" We're not cutting. It's budgeting 101.
It's simple budgeting 101. And I don't understand why we can't do it. And you guys net did not answer me the last time I was up here. So, I'm I'm asking again, but getting back to that on page 48. Police dues and subscriptions
in 2025 was $8,294. The five-year average is n $9,828 with the three-year average being 11,226. We are budgeting $13,000. So if you take the three years, that's a
$1,773.97. Granted, in the grand scheme of things, that's that's a you know, it's like peeing in the ocean. All right, but how many of those other $1,773 items do we have? If you go down to police training, which is on page 49,
the three-year average, $148,56906, we're budgeting $170,000. That's $21,000 more than we spent last year. It's a new training. >> Is there is it >> I'm sorry. What was that figure again? Well, how much from the previous year? >> The previous year.
>> You're wrong. >> I'm sorry. You're right. I'm sorry. 162 151. that the three-year average was 148569. All right, but we're budgeting $170,000. So, we're going up by $8,000, but 21,000 over the last three years.
Snow removal, one of my favorites. We're budgeting. >> Can you give me a page, please? >> Sure. It's page 64. I'll wait till you get there. >> Go ahead. >> Okay. Now I realize that in 2026 we had
huge snow but that was the in 2025 58,000 we we paid 299,830 we're budgeting 150,000 which is 7,000 more than our 6,656
more than our previous three-year average. We haven't had a snow like that in 10 years but yet we're taking advantage of that and upping that. Uh, I'm going to go back to I skipped over police community. I'm out of time.
>> Is there anyone else let Mr. Powdor >> again? Council Ray Powdor from Ariel. Um, something just occurred to me while Mr. Sweet was speaking. Couple of years ago or last year, I do remember our township. uh you guys fell about $2 or3
million short on the uh employee and uh the employee insurance as you self assure. Um I believe you mentioned there was a cat catastrophic medical event that happened uh that was not discussed or could not be discussed. Um, back then
we asked you um if you had a catastrophic coverage and uh if it would cover events such as that when you self-insure. And I remember asking Mr. Cartis on several occasions, what's the threshold?
And um I don't know if he shrugged his shoulders or said something. It was hard to make out. He was back from the microphone all three times we asked that. Um, I would love to know that this council and the administration finally found out what that catastrophic
threshold is because if memory serves me right, because we were so short, you guys did what you did best. You went and borrowed more money to cover that and you borrowed for that catastrophic event. Still never telling the public what that threshold was and where it
would kick in. Never did get that answer. I'd be thrilled to know that you guys know that because you guys have subcommittee meetings about the the budget and I um I always hear um how well it went praised. I I I know I get
tired of saying this, but the good ship lollipop song just keeps ringing in my mind when you guys praise each other for a great job and your due diligence and hard work that you do, but it still ends up like this. Um, so if you would be so kind, a specific answer to what that
medical threshold is for catastrophic, when it would kick in and when the taxpayers will have to stop paying for the money that you borrow on that because every time you borrow money, um, there's somebody that makes a great commission on it and there's somebody that makes fees on it. Everybody gets
paid when you guys borrow money and, uh, that hurts us. So, I'm looking forward to probably one answer that you'll actually answer at the end of this term. You'll either say yes, you know, and say that amount, or no, you'll shrug like Mr. Cartis did. Thank you.
>> Thank you. Yes. >> I just have a question. Danny Paris. Um, >> how are you, Paris? >> You all have full-time jobs, right? Most of you. I know you're not going to answer me, but you have full-time jobs, right? Like Chief Manassi's full-time
job is the chief, but you all have other full-time jobs. So, you get you get coverage, full full coverage from a full-time job, and you get coverage, health insurance for a part-time job. You don't have to shake your heads no or
yes, but I worked full-time and I got coverage for my full-time job, but I also worked a part-time job and I couldn't get full-time coverage and I couldn't get any kind of coverage for my part-time job when I worked all my life. I'm 72 now and I'm still working
because I'm a senior and and I'm have health issues and I have to work. But I worked since I've been almost 12 years of age. And when I worked my full-time job, I got covered all so all of my health benefits
and all of my and I my social security is very good, thank God, because I worked all my life, sometimes three jobs. I had to raise my own kids, three kids by myself. So you get you get health benefits for this job. That's Well, I
What are we talking about then? I thought you said that they're getting benefits. Oh, I I'm understanding you're getting benefits. >> No. >> Why do I wait? Why were we fighting about >> Miss Paris? Okay. He's addressing. >> I'm just curious. Okay. >> I thought you were getting benefits. I'm
sorry, but you're getting social security for this job, too. >> I don't understand. So, you're getting you're just getting a salary for this job. No, no benefits. Health benefits because I'm getting confused between the health benefits and the salaries. >> I'll address it at the end, but yes.
>> Thank you. Anyone else would like to speak that's not spoken yet? Miss Gentilla, you'd like to go again? >> Hi Nancy Gentilly again. Um just want to quote a couple flyers that I got from um
in the USPS. So, several of you run um ran with um the mayor running for reelection and your face and other things were on the flyers that went out. And quote, it said, "In these challenging times, I've
made afford affordability my top priority by working to bring the cost of daily life down for Gloucester Township residents, families, and seniors." That's a quote. Another flyer that went out, ensuring working families, seniors,
vets, and young people can afford GT. Another quote that several of you ran on the ticket with mayor. I believe that every resident deserves to live in a community that's not only safe but also affordable. When families can afford to stay in their homes, feel secure in our
community, our our community thrives. These are the things that were told to us and we believed and everyone knows that you were reelected. We feel that we're now being lied to. Also coming on to another flyer that was
sent to us that it had to do with the electricity rebates that were going to happen. Um and Mr. uh Marcato, we spoke at council meetings about this about the 15 immediate 15% that was going back to
us. That was not true. These electricity bills are ridiculous and that's why people can't afford them. So when someone says get another job, get a better paying job, some people can't because the employers have to pay higher electricity bills. So the employees are
not able to get a raise. So once again, we are told that these outrageous bills will be affordable because a guaranteed immediate 15% is going to happen. That was not true. So I'm just incredibly disappointed and
that's probably the most difficult thing I have to say and I hope that you listen to us and listen to every other person out here that's feeling just disappointed. Thank you. There anyone else would like to speak?
>> You got raise your hands, Sam. Okay, >> I'm not done. >> Come on up. So, police community relations page 51. 2025 21,000 59451 21,28588
and 24 and 21,4429. So an average of the last three years 21,42823 budgeting $25,000. One of my favorite ones is the Glosser Township Wreck Building Equipment.
The last five years it's been zero. Nothing has been spent. >> You give me a page that >> uh page 77. All right. Nothing was spent and yet we're budgeting $2,000. Again, it's $2,000. Whoop-dedah.
All right. But 1,700 up top, 3500. So I I picked one, two, three, four, five, six. I picked 14 items. Sanitation residential, page 72. Police building contract prof B. I don't even know what that is. Page 75. Public
buildings repairs 75. Public buildings BW profit supplies, page 76. Public buildings, BW Prof building repairs, also page 76. And then Glasser Township Wreck Building Repairs 77. Now, I'm sure
that a lot of these repairs have also been put on the capital budget, and we we know all that about the double borrowing or the early borrowing and all of that, but those 14 items, the difference of a three-year average
we're budgeting is 917,08. So, just for the quick math that we did, I've got $1.2 million on salaries, wages, and social security. I've got $917,000 there. So that's $2.1 million. And I've got a million dollars of income that's
being unaccounted for. That's $3.1 million. Now, not once have I said, "Let's cut the program." I can't reiterate that and state that enough. Not about cutting. Let's do budgeting properly. And it's not being done for whatever
reason. Whether you want to manip you call it manipulation, whether you want to call it having a surplus so that way we don't have to raise our taxes on the election years, whatever you want to call it, it's not being done properly. It hasn't been been done properly for years. And I've been up here, as my
father says, shouting at clouds because I get looks all around and I get Mr. Marcato says, "Oh, it's only it's not 14% on the total taxes. It's 14% on the municipal taxes. Your other taxes are county and everything else and all that." It's still a 14% increase or a
13% increase that we're we're looking at when we don't need to look at it because if we do the budgeting properly, if it's 14 items, there are more than 14 items on here. I've got probably 72 stickies,
right? You know who should be doing this? You guys, Mr. Carter should be doing this. One of the things I operate I oped everybody's email from council going to Mr. Cartis and asking about the budget. I asked for emails, text messages and phone logs from every one
of the council members to go into Mr. Cartis and the mayor's office and Miss Ret and back and forth and I got a whole bunch of emails and I went through them. Would anybody care to ask how many questions were asked on the budget?
from council members. Would the audience like to know? Would the audience be surprised that one person texted Mr. Cartis and said, "I have questions." And Mr. Cart, I don't know who it was because I couldn't see it. It was blocked out. One person texted Mr. Cartis and said, "I have
questions." And he said, "Call me." One person. There's seven of you sitting up there. Okay? Doesn't matter who it was. All right. One person, one text, no emails. The mayor didn't even ask you any
questions. Our mayor, who's supposed to be afford the champion of affordability, who ran a campaign 15 years ago on taxes are too high. Cindy Ral Hatton is raising our taxes. We can't afford to
live here. 15 years ago, we I can pull the video up. You know who the the uh business administrator was back then? It was Mr. Cartis. Mr. Cartis was in charge of an administration that raised taxes for four straight years. And then M. David
Mayor wins election based on the fact that we're being taxed out the wazoo back then. And he keeps the business administrator on. The same person who's responsible for it. And now our mayor is ignoring it.
And you guys are too. Okay. Thank you, Mr. Sweet. Anyone else would like to speak that's not spoken yet. >> This >> So, >> yes, there is a public portion for a whole topic. I've seen you here before. That's why
landscaping, right? Yes. Anyone else like to speak on this matter that has not spoken yet? Mr. Sweet. So you guys sit up here one you don't engage anymore except Orlando President Marcato engaged me when I made a mistake
and he jumped at was very quick to make point out that I made a mistake which I acknowledge I did and I corrected that mistake but he's ignoring all the other facts. You guys sit up here and say well we're one of you. Well if you're one of you then why aren't you looking at this
right? I've been up here for 10 years. Budgeting 101. It's simple budgeting. I will be more than happy to sit down with Mr. Cartis and go over the budget. If he has a reason why we're under budgeting when construction fees are $1.2 million
and we're budgeting only 900,000, are we not going to be constructing anymore? Well, we know that's that's not happening. Cannabis. Why? We we built cannabis. we get $232,000 and yet we're budgeting $200,000. Why is
there is there a reason and why are we over again? I can't reiterate this and a shame on you guys for just signing away voting yes on this budget without looking into it. I looked into 14 items, $917,000.
There are more than 14 items here. There's probably God knows how many. And some some go down, but not not by $917,000. I'm sure that if we went through this, we could probably find another $2 million, which would then taxes might go
up a little bit, but not 13%. All right. I prepared the citizens budget 21, 22, and 23. Put it out there on the internet. I know Mr. Carter says he has issues with it,
but I looked at what the budget was, what we budgeted, myself and uh Mr. Heimball, another Gloucester Township president. We put that together. We put it out there and our budget that we put together was half a percent off two
years in a row from the actual expenditures. And we don't know what Mr. Cartis knows, but we sat down, we came up. Well, no. We we have this. We're going to account for this thing. We sat down with that and we were a half a
percent off. Think about that. Two gentlemen, two residents, a half a percent off from the actual amount. Mr. Cartis was over 10% off both of those years because of the budgeting 101. And I'm not saying Mr. Cartis doesn't know
how to do his job. He absolutely knows how to do his job. He does it way too well because he does this every year. and council, you are my elected officials, so I am up here begging you to hold off on the budget. And I know
there's an email here that says, "Oh god, if we don't turn it in on time, we're going to get fined." That was the one me the mayor said, "This is a problem. Could be a problem for us." That was it. Not the fact that we're raising 13%. Didn't even
DIDN'T EVEN CROSS HIS MIND OR IF IT DID, HE DIDN'T PUT IT IN AN email or a text message or anything. So, the seven of you up there need to take a good look at this budget and just take your time and vote no
right now and sit down and actually look at it. Why are we raising things and not once again I'm going to say it again. I didn't say a word cut. I did not say we need to cut public works. We need to cut this. We need to cut that. I have stood up here for years
and I know you listen to me because on the capital budget we're not borrowing for weed whackers anymore. All right. For three years I stood up here and asked about weed whackers and now we don't. And so you listen. You listen because lawnmowers are not being
borrowed for. So, you do listen a little bit, but when it comes to this 13%, you guys need to to look into it more. And the fact that nobody looked into it, you can sit there and say that you're one of us, but you're not.
>> You're really not. If you vote yes on this, again, I can't not I'm flabbergasted that there was not one email from any council member to Mr. Cartis. Hey, let's sit down. We all passed in the hallway. We all talked. We don't have text messages. Nobody texted
them. One person, one person texted. The mayor didn't even ask a question of it. THE MAYOR, HOW IS THAT POSSIBLE? How can you guys justify that? And I I would like answers these questions before we vote. You guys vote.
Why are we over overstating expenses? Why are we understating income? In 2020, you guys raised taxes COVID 9.9%. No other township in the area raised taxes and you guys said you had to.
>> Thank you, Mr. Sweet. Anyone else would like to speak? Has not spoken. >> Yes, ma'am. My name is Sylvia Henny. I'm from Blackwood. I was here for the last meeting and I held myself back from talking. I understand all these seniors
got an issue with the taxes and all, but it's not just about the seniors. It's everybody in the township that has problems. I'm a single mom of a son that's disabled. And you keep raising taxes. We can't afford this. No one can. And then you
say, "Oh, well, come to Gloucester Township to live. You have nice parks, but no one no kids are playing on them. So, we're wasting money. Why are we wasting money? You all are sitting up here. Why can't you just look at the budget? This gentleman has brought so
much to you guys and no response. That's horrible. There's no respect. And you're supposed to give respect to get respect, but I don't see it coming from you guys. None of you are speaking up. I understand we don't go back and forth, which is
ridiculous. You wait till the end and then at the end, Miss Mcotti, you you answer some questions. I see you taking notes and everything, but we're not getting a response from anybody. You guys were put in these positions
and you do nothing. It's horrible. >> Is there anyone else like to speak? Mr. Brown. >> Mine's going to be quick. Um, talking about 10 10 13 15% property tax increase. I work for the federal
government. My pay increase is based on national average. That's why I had a 1.4% 4% pay raise and a 1.5% pay raise, 2% pay raise. Cost of
living in New Jersey sucks. If you work for the federal government, it's terrible. All we can try to do is try to hope to retire and get out of this state. I mean, I talked to one person on the
council board a few years back and I talked to him about the taxes. His response was, "I'm retiring soon and I'm moving to Florida." That is an issue. Yes, veterans get a $250 deduction from their property
taxes. That was started in 1980. We haven't had an increase since. I know I talked to Cody Miller who said that. Is it Cody Miller? Okay. I talked to him. I wanted to make sure I had his
name right. and he said they're they're trying to pass a bill to get that more in line for the disabled vets and the vets. That was a year and a half ago. So I talked to him again a couple of months ago. He said, "Well, it takes a long
time to get that through. How long did it take to get it through to get all this money for the illegal immigrants to get uh people to uh lawyers for them? took a little little pin from Governor
Cheryl. What's more important, the homeless vets or the illegal immigrants? The vets haven't had an increase on the property tax increase in over 40 years.
I'm pretty sure back in 1980, property taxes were nowhere near what they are now. I moved here 14 years ago, my property taxes were 6,800. Now they're 9,600. And we're talking about another 10 15%
increase just from the municipality. And we know the school is going to have one because they want to raise their budget $4 million. Then you got the fire department. I have no problem with fire department. I think we should pass around like Gloucester
County and Glboro does. Um, they send out a letter for donations every year. I think it should be done here because I'm pretty sure you have a lot of people that would donate to them. That could probably keep our taxes down on that.
But when you're looking more at illegals getting more stuff than the homeless vets, there's a problem. And what is this 13 15% property tax increase going to help when you keep spending and throwing money at problems
that never get solved? I know we budgeted uh I know we were talking about when the neighborhood next to my neighbor next to my neighborhood across from Man Mullen came in, they were looking at possibility of a hundred students that would be going to the
schools. How many did we get? Five. It wasn't what we thought. Wasn't what we planned, but we threw money at it. Stop throwing money at it and actually
budgeting to what it is. Thank you. Is there anyone else like to speak that's not spoken? Mr. Sweet. I actually do have a question uh that I might require an answer. I thought veterans in Glosser Township, if they
were in a combat zone, did not pay taxes at all. >> 100% combat. >> Okay. Is that correct? Okay. Thank you. Um
2020 you guys raised taxes during COVID. No other township around here raised taxes at that time. In 2021, some did. You guys 2020 is an odd year. I'll go to Mr. Polydoro saying that every odd year
you guys raise taxes or every even year you raise taxes. So again though, I'm going to go back to I did the same thing every year with this budget. All right. I know some of you said you've gone line by line, but there's no
proof that you've gone line by line. There's no email. There's no text message. Phone conversation. Yeah, I can't. But there's no log that you called Mr. Cartis to talk to him. So did you drive here to talk to Mr. Martis and made no effort to document it, knowing
damn well that I was going to ask M. Mr. Marti, you made fun of me last time if I was in your house and that I didn't know that you were talking. All right. Um, I operate again emails on the capital budgets. capital budget. That's a whole different
ballgame, too, which comes into play because the capital budget by borrowing, you guys are increasing taxes because in case council members don't know, and I'm going to assume that you don't know, but by raising
debt and paying that off, you're raising taxes. Bottom line. and all this borrowing that we're doing and we're over borrowing. I proved that back in 21 that we
overborrow by a third of what we bonded. We bonded $36 million and we overborrow because I took the time over a two-year period and opered the crap out of everything on the capital budget. Little bit here, a little bit there.
All in all, put a spreadsheet together and you borrow you bonded $36 million. You only needed which means you borrowed that. You only needed to borrow 24 million. That's $12 million that you over borrowed. Prove that. What's the cost of that?
Well, $12 million, 10% fee to write the bond. That's $1.2 million interest. If you say 4% is $480,000 for the next 10 years. That's $4.8
million plus 1.2. That's $6 million that council and the mayor and Mr. Cartis have cost this township. And that's debt that we had to pay back. And you're going to say, well, we used the money elsewhere, but you overborrowed it.
You've proven time and time again that if a emergency comes up, the the health insurance that's come up where you had that $3 million like that, no problem. Let's borrow it. Oh, we need a million dollars here. Let's slash this number here and let's make this here. You've
had no problem doing that. No problem borrowing money. We proven that you can borrow money at the drop of a hat. So, why don't we borrow the money as we need it? Why do we have to overborrow? I I have my thoughts on that. All right.
Who's buying the bonds? Can't find that out. I'm sure sure way I know who's buying the bonds and who's getting rich off of it. There's a reason that it's called the machine. And you guys are facilitating that. And by over and by doing the taxes and then
you're forcing borrowing and it's just a snowball and keeps going down and down and down or you want to call it taxes up and up and up. Since this mayor has taken office, taxes have gone up 125%. And I know some of you were not here,
but you're here now. And you guys can take the time to look at this. 14 items, $929,000 overstated on expenses on 14 items. Revenue a million dollars. And that's not knowing what the payment the pilot program is. Payment in le of taxes.
don't know that and I know for a fact that Mr. Carter always lowballs at. So just by this analysis, $3 million. What are we short? Six, seven million
that we're raising taxes. 3 million big chunk of that. That 13% now goes almost in half. And I'm sure that there's other ways to do it. It's budgeting 101. And I did, and I'm repeating myself again. I never said the word cut.
not cutting services because we have premium services, Mr. Marcato. We do, but so do other townships and I'm not want to cut the services. I just want to budget properly. >> Thank you, Mr. Sweet. Does anyone else like to speak?
Seeing none, well, I'm going to call a fivem minute recess. I have to go to restroom if anyone wants to take a do a fivem minute recess. That's right. Just I don't see
I'm an older gentleman now. >> Very old. I wouldn't put it together. I'm killing her. Kill her. >> Yeah, I'm piss. I'm killing like a blanket.
Okay, good. We'll resume the meeting. Uh any Mr. Sweet? Go ahead, sir. I fully expect you guys to just pass this budget through um 100%. And I know I'm up here, as my
father would say, shouting at clouds. And for those of you that may not know what that means, it means you're a cloud's going to do what a cloud wants to do, and you have no say in it. And if you shout at it, it may go left, it may go right, but it's going to go wherever it wants to go, and it doesn't matter.
And that's what I feel like I'm up here saying, but this work should have been done by you guys. 100% should have been done. It wasn't done. Proven that. You can sit there and say that you did.
You can sit there and say that you're one of us. But you you're about to pass a budget. And not once, again, I had to reiterate this because somehow my words always get twisted. Never once did I say cut anything.
It's talking about budgeting. Making sure that we have enough money to pay for the stuff that we need. And if we're overbudgeting expenses because we I'll come back here next year after we get this and go over what what was budgeted and come up and I'll I'll bet
you we'll be uh 10% off because we're always 10% off. That's a minimum. All right. Two guys, two township residents took it upon themselves for three straight years and we were half a percent off and we don't know half the
stuff you guys know. And then you want to sit there and tell us that we're we were wrong. We have issues with it and it's not done this way. But yet it is done that way. It's budgeting 101. It's what I do. And taxes do go down elsewhere. I see it
all the time. Taxes may go up, but not 125% over 10 years or 15 years. That's ridiculous. It's absolutely ridiculous. And you guys have the ability to hold the line. Ask the questions. You want to be one of us,
then ask the questions. You guys took an oath. You stand up here on January when there's a reorg meeting and you sit there and say what whatever it is, but the oath is to work for the benefit of the township. Not for some
person, not for some puppet master, but for the benefit of the township and the township residents. You were voted on. I didn't vote for you guys, but you're my elected officials. So, I have to come to you and beg and plead and come up with
numbers that you guys should have done. So, again, when you're going to vote on this budget, think about what we said. All right, I put in a lot of time. Not that not that you guys care, but I came up with $3 million not knowing half the
stuff that is known. And again, think about that. $3 million was caught and not one of you asked a question about it. So, I would suggest maybe going back to the drawing board if you really want to
be one of us and think about it and not not approve this budget. That's all I have. Thank you. >> Is there anyone else like to speak? >> Have a motion to close the public hearing. >> I'll make that motion. Is there a
second? >> Second. >> Roll call, please. >> Mr. Minion, >> yes. >> Mrs. Alrexel, >> yes. >> Mrs. Grace Love, >> yes. >> Mr. Nash, >> yes. >> Mrs. Walters, >> yes. >> Mr. Castro, >> yes. >> Mr. Marcato, >> yes. To close close the public hearing.
Uh, okay. Okay, I'm going to attempt to address all the speakers here and if any council member we I have to comment on the public hearing. Okay, she's trying to keep me straight here. Okay,
thank you N. But yeah, uh the if any council member would like to chime in or respond to it or if they have any questions, I'm going to rely also on Mr. Cartis and our CFO, Mrs. Erit, uh to help answer these questions. So, Mr. Podoro uh made some comments. I guess
he's left for the evening talking about uh even in odd years uh but he asked a question about the budget what takes place. He asked a question about a judgment and if there's a possible litigation and lawsuit. Now I'm not sure how much uh we can divulge Mr. Cartis
and Mr. Hutchinson our township solicitor about that but there is something possibly pending. >> Correct. And we had that originally in the budget and we had to pull that out at the direction of the state of New Jersey. Is that correct? >> Okay.
>> So that is a possible litigation uh lawsuit uh that we cannot speak of at this time. Uh Mr. uh came up eight times to the podium and I'm I'm going to go in order here. Uh Mr.
uh it stated that we were creating a false deficit. This is the first time he came up and he never said to cut anything and he reiterated that each time he came up that he never said to cut anything. U
and he talked about uniform construction codes and the pool fees. Is there any um Mrs. Erit or or Mr. cars a reason why uh for example $122,000 was the previous year but we had $90,000 budget for pool fees. Is there any thought process
behind that? I know that the recreation supervisors uh work very closely with you on on those uh pool fees and and and what's coming in, but >> so so contrary to what Mr. is saying, this is a responsible budget. It's it's
built with with regard to the safety, health, and welfare of the citizens of Gloucester Township. The mayor and >> Miss can't hear you. >> I You're saying you don't Please don't
shout. Miss Paris, please don't shout out. Please. >> The mayor and and the CFL, myself, uh, and, uh, Miss Mrs. Jeffy met and went over this budget. The budget was a lot
higher than the 17 and a half cents when we first started going through this budget. Um I hear Mr. and Mr. was given the information he requested back on May 11th. He's had 16 days 16 days to
contact me, to email me, to call me. He sends opas. He does things like that to try to get information off of text messages and emails, but not once has he called me to sit down and go over any of
these numbers. I don't believe his numbers that he put together responsible. I don't believe that his calculations of a half a percent being within are accurate. And again, I do not recommend that you take a a budget, a
revenue budget line item and take it to an irresponsible level and max it out and then and then put a budget together based on maxing out every single revenue. That would be foolish. And that's one of the regards that we gave when we were looking at this budget to
be responsible. And he says he didn't do anything. He didn't do any cuts on expenditures, but I heard him time and time again going through this budget, page by page, and suggesting that you should cut 2,000 here, 5,000 there. This is a $90 million budget. A $90 million
budget. And he's saying he's at 2.5 or $3 million. I do not I do not buy that at all. >> Do you have a response to to the pool thing? Are you able to provide that? >> The pool revenues? I don't have those numbers in front of me. No, I don't.
Okay. Uh the uh he had indicated to that um there was about $1 million of underbudgeting on our revenue in regard to the tax abatement. Well, the tax abatement is calculated
and I I want to defer to the CFO Christy Eric, but it's calculated based on the uh realized taxes and the um the uh uh reserve for uh
uncollected taxes. Am I correct, Christie? >> No. The t tax abatements are new businesses that come in town and they have a fiveyear abatement. First year is zero, second year's 30%, third year is 50%.
70 and then 90% and then they fall off. So where you see the the fluctuation in that number, it's because they start at zero and then by year five they're at 90%. So you have businesses that are coming on and off. >> Is that what you
>> throughout the year? >> The cated that it was understated. That's not you're not talking about tax abatements. You're talking about the tax. >> The comment that was that was understated. >> I misunderstood the question. The abatements are calculated based on the
information provided by the tax assessor and that and the tax assessor knows exactly what the value is of each property and and it's 15th of the amount and on after five years it goes to 100%
ratable. The municipality collects 95% of that levy that that levy that's uh in our case is zero 10 30 50 70 90 then 100 but the the he goes
back I'm going back to this question that he believes that it is understated >> and I said it's not it's calculated based on what the what we're going to actually receive >> last year we budgeted it I think it like 800,000 and we got we didn't even we
didn't even get what we budgeted for. We got less. Okay. >> So, that number is a real estate number >> and that's because someone did not someone did not pay >> my dog. Someone did not pay that was assessed a
letter >> a letter indicating that you are going to pay this amount for your tax. Okay. >> And the threat then is that you'll become just a regular ratable and they will lose that advantage. >> Okay. U
then he also indicated that uh the budget at this point, this is the first time he spoke, that was overstated by $900,000. Um then we got to Mr. Brown Mr. Brown uh who uh talked about the tax revenue that
comes in from the premium outlets and uh the cannabis dispensaries and asked where did it go? Um I off the top of my head uh for taxes that we collect. So cannabis is probably
under $250,000 for this past year. >> Um >> I don't have the exact number but it's about 250. Last year we collected $232,002. >> I do follow that. >> So I'm not sure where the $5 million number came from, but we only collect 2%
of the revenues are collecting >> crime out. >> Mr. Brown, so we have premiums that pay a certain amount. They are the largest taxpayer in >> our general taxation. Yeah. >> It's not part not an abatement
>> that abatement. No, no, no. We're on a different subject. We're talking Mr. Mr. Brown just made that comment about $5 million. Um, no, it's not close to that. >> Mr. Sweet's numbers. >> U, and then he also made a comment that there >> Mr. Brown, Mr. You can't shout out Mr. Brown.
>> Mr. >> Mr. Brown, if you give me a second, I'll take a look at the email I sent you. >> Okay, because you have it, but it wasn't the we the cannabis did not raise more than $234,000. It was it was three or four different
businesses. >> Okay. So, uh and then he also indicated there was 80% increase in salary. >> I'm not sure who that individual is. If you want to identify, excuse me, >> 66,000 120,000 >> not in this past budget
>> and then solicitors increase. >> I make a year. So there is no 80% increase in this budget for any individual. As we continue the veterans office uh uh and that people referring to Mr. Gallagher at the Kingdom County
office uh Mr. Car try to follow up on that and and see I I don't know the inner workings of the veterans office and um the referral service that they have there. Uh perhaps we could follow up and provide some information to uh Mr. Brown.
Um, I was concerned that you received, Mr. Brown, the wrong tax information. You indicated that your escrow uh was short of $2,200 and the tax office sent the wrong amount to your mortgage company. Uh, later on when we're offline
and not here, let's talk about that and and find out because that's not something that should happen. Okay. Uh, Mr. Thomas uh talked about the difference in the surplus amount from the 26 to the the 25 to the 26 uh
budget. Is that something that you can address, Mr. Carson? M Miss Herrer, >> I believe a big portion of that would have been the reverse appeals. Uh am I correct, Mrs. Eric? >> No. >> All right. Can you explain reverse appeals for so layman's terms for folks? >> Yeah. So reverse appeals um there are
some expert uh individuals in the state and we've engaged uh a couple of those that have the ability to look at large pro large properties ma mainly commercial exclusively commercial uh
some of them industrial and what they do is they're able to determine and it can also be apartments they're able to determine if that entity that owns that building uh went out for a renewal on
their mortgage. And by doing that, they have to state a value. The higher the value they state, the more money they get for their mortgage. Just like your properties, if you want you want your assessed value to be when that that assessor comes out to look at the
appraiser comes out to look at your property, you want that value to be higher. And sometimes you need that in order to qualify for the loan. So what happens is we have hired these experts that can get in and find out what what they what they put the stated their
value at. Yet meantime they're stating the value to us and they're saying well it's sometimes 10520 million less than what they sought that mortgage for. So when they go to court, a judge will take that into account and will make a
determination that you are not paying your fair share of taxes and therefore based on what you told the bank, the financing uh uh institution about how you wanted to borrow all this money.
That's information that's factual and we can use that to fight and get a higher a higher assessed value and therefore get more money for the residents of Gloucester Township. And we did that several years in a row. And after a while, you can't continue to just do
that because you run out of I don't want to say targets, but they are targets because they're doing something wrong. They're they're they're saying that their value is a lot less than it actually is. And it's hard for us to prove that without these experts. And I know I'm going I'm drawn out with this,
but it's a lot of money. >> Okay. Um the Mr. Thomas had always asked about also asked about how state and local grants uh have changed or there's been a decrease in them. Um
Mr. Thomas Triad Associates uh does a lot of our work does most of our work for uh securing grants from us from um f state and federal and and and local uh grants. Uh the ple for example Jake's place Jake's playground some
recreational grants uh the police department secured some of their grants on their own. Um I'm not sure and miss maybe you can comment on this Mr. cars, have we seen a decrease in in funding from uh state and federal grants?
>> I I don't think you're getting any federal money. What you get is is grants that are offset by projects like DOT grants, things of that nature. The state of New Jersey has a knack for not increasing state aid. And when they do,
it's usually a very nominal amount. Maybe 200,000, maybe 150,000. Uh we get, I believe, 5.5 million or 5.6 million each year, Chrissy. Is that correct? >> And that has remained flat. >> That has remained flat
>> for over a decade. >> Correct. There there there is some talk right now about reinstituting the energy tax receipts, but I don't think that's going anywhere. So, I think we're stuck at that 5.6. And that that 5.6 is really
not a lot of money for us coming from the state. >> Okay. >> Uh >> we also insert grants throughout the year. So, there's resolutions done after the budget's adopted. >> Those are the chapter 159. >> Chapter 159 resolutions and is an insertion into the budget. So if a grant
comes to to us throughout the year, we can do a chapter 159 resolution and insert it into the budget. So you're comparing something from a whole year of grants that was received to something there may be grants that we get, you know, in a month, two months, three
months from now that we're not aware of right now when we're putting the budget together. So that number will change at December 31st. that grant number will be a lot higher than what it is right now because we do in we insert grants throughout the year.
>> Okay. Uh and Mr. Thomas also talked about u the allowable health insurance and indicated $3.2 million. U so um statewide the the New Jersey state health benefits plan. It's my
understanding that they had an increase of approximately 35% Um, our increase was significantly high. We're self-funded. I know there was talk about an aggregate attachment point, and that's what it's called when you're self-funded. It's it's a it's a number
where the excess insurance kicks in when all the claims are added up. Um, very rarely do you hit that. But, but that being said, we had a rough year, too. We had a we had a tremendous amount of claims. A lot of them are the GLP1s.
Um those are those are are killing everybody. Um and we're feeling it too. I mean those those drugs are extremely expensive. >> Okay. Uh Mr. Rochio uh he he left for the evening um indicated that uh the new
houses and Shopright u uh that these students are going to need to go to schools. Uh the I work for the Glossera Township Public School District and the enrollment for the Glosser Township Public School District for the last uh
decade or so has remained in the 64 6500 student range. There has not been an increase in enrollment. What you do see is that there's different needs of the students that are coming into the school district whether whether it's special education uh and and other needs that um
have basically uh their budget has increased because of of those different needs of of different students that are coming into our school district but the enrollment numbers remain the same. uh the Choose Landing Road, Black Horse
Pike, um with that intersection, uh yes, Choose Landing Road is a it's a county road and Black Horse Pike is a state road. >> Uh so those things have to go through those entities if we're looking to make any changes and that would be facilitated through the police department. Uh Mr. Rochio asked a
question about American Water and possibly condemning uh our uh sewer that we have here. As you know, we have a sewer uh department. Uh no longer the MUA, but it's the sewer department. Everything flows the same. Uh the quarterly cost is the same. Uh and the
same people that uh worked for the MUA work for the sewer utility department. There have been no conversations here with any council member about American Water condemning our sewer. So, that is my response to Mr. Virtue and the response to everybody that's here uh in
addressing that rumor. uh Miss Gentilly came up and spoke about uh helping a resident or a friend uh family down in the southern part of our town uh with their electric bill and and the concerns about expenses that take place and and
caring for that family and thank you for your concern for for that family and sharing that with us. Uh, Miss Fizzer uh uh talked about um cost here and then the moving and ho how much uh when she first came here um 30 years ago um Philadelphia and then in retirement and
how it's impacting her um and she wants her son to get out of the house. She loves him but she wants him to get out of the house and um but there are I'm glad you brought up rising assessments and Mr. Carter shared that with me. There are conversations that take place that are not always via email or phone
or text. Sometimes people talk to each other and Mr. Cars had informed me that our assessments and and maybe uh the CFO could also comment have gone up. There was a percentage that you provided me. You recall that conversation? Our
overall assessments for uh the township. >> Yes. So, >> okay. That's a delay. I don't. Yeah, but I'm trying to think in terms of that that dollar figure. I think the dollar figure is is around $30 million. So,
what that what that did was and you know, people have calculated what the tax what the percentage on the local tax increase is exclusive of the open space. So, on the local it came out to be right around 14%.
Um and and and so when you factor in the increase in the ratables at 30 million 30 or 35 million it it brings that that increase down from 14% to 13.25%. So so it does it does reduce that.
>> Okay. Um Mr. second time up at the podium uh discuss fees and permits and question why are they coming in below uh based on the average that he had for previous three years. Is that something that you can address with the CFO?
>> Well, we're we're anticipating what those revenues are and Mr. Sweet clearly wants to go to the maximum on every single one of those revenues. And I will tell you, if you submit a budget to the state and you maximize all your revenues, they're going to question that when it when it goes up there for review
in order to get approval to adopt and then if you finish the year out and you fall short on those, then they're definitely going to be questioned in subsequent budgets. You're not you're not encouraged to go to the maximum. You're allowed. It's permissible, but
you are not encouraged to do that. >> And if we do that, does that affect our bond rating? It could it could because it could it could create an overexpenditure of appropriations which then creates a deferred charge which has to be raised in the subsequent year's budget and that is a big problem with
the rating agencies. >> Okay. Uh Mr. Sweet also asked about the I guess he felt the underbudgeting of the of cannabis which was discussed earlier um and made the statement that every other day they're opening up in our township. That's false.
Uh then Mr. Sweet came up a third time to the podium and he discussed the pool fees again and the cable television fees. Those cable television fees that's negotiated uh between uh the carrier which is Xfinity Comcast. Um those fees
>> they're negotiated they're calculated and given to us. >> Yeah, it's a percentage of I believe it's a percentage of how many people pay in the town. And now a lot of people streaming stuff and not really doing podcast. So, the the numbers
are gonna probably start to go down because more people are streaming. So, we're not getting that revenue anymore. >> Okay. Uh and he at that point indicated that uh our fees and income are at $1
million that they're underfunded. Uh and then he spoke about that our social security is over budgeted. Um do you want to respond to that? I'm gonna allow Christie because we we did have a brief conversation about >> Okay. >> So, um, so I know
>> what is going on with that. >> Why don't Why don't we just lay it on the podium? There we go. All right. Thank you. >> So, the I know Mr. We took what the salaries were in the budget and
>> times that by a percentage, but there are other salaries that are paid that are not in the budget. There's salaries in capital budget. There's salaries in our open space budget. There is salaries, which is probably a big portion. The police officers do um outside employment work. We get
reimbursed for the for the time from a contractor hour for hour, but we were paying the uh the fight there's cost. So even if you looked at last year's budget, what we budgeted, we came in, we didn't budget
enough. So it's probably going to be the same way. So there's other things that are paid that aren't in the budget that are in different items throughout the in different areas. >> Okay. Thank you. Thank you for the explanation. Uh Miss Higgins came up and discussed about the
difficulties and seniors and and they don't have the income to match this type of increase that we're having here. And um NJ stay and and receiving her check which does not line up when taxes are due. Uh Mr. came up for his fourth time
and he again reiterated he's not talking about cutting things um and indicated that we are $1.2 million in overstating uh the budget and then $1 million understating it. Uh he addressed
prescriptions that there's $187,000 more uh and you touched upon it a little bit Mr. hardest whether it is here or in the school district or in the private sector. Uh healthc care coverage has gone through the roof. A lot of that is
attributed to GLP1's weight loss medication um which does have benefits for folks that use that. Um but that for this budget over $3 million for the local school district $4 million increase on uh health insurance.
>> And might I comment quickly uh when Chris Christie put together chapter 78 back in I believe it's 2009 2010. We followed the letter of the law on chapter 78. We have not
wavered one bit in all of the contracts that we negotiated since then. They're still held to year four of chapter 78. Some some entities uh have seen it
advantageous for some reason to give the employees a break and reduce that to year two or year one. And some of them actually took it out completely. >> Let's pause for a second. For those that are not aware, chapter 78 is what uh the employee uh along with the township or
the municipality or whatever entity pays towards health insurance. >> Yes. And it's a significant cost. The more you make, the more you pay. >> So if you're you're tier four, for example, and you're making over $125,000, you are paying about 35% of your health insurance.
>> That is correct. So you could be paying for family coverage, you could be paying somewhere around $22,000. So, uh, what we're seeing is as health insurance keeps going up, whatever raises we give to the employee gets
eaten up by the chapter 78 contribution. >> Okay? >> I mean, boohoo. But guess what? That's a reality. You know, they're not getting that three and a half% that people think they're getting. >> Okay? Uh, Mr. Paloro asked about the
catastrophic threshold coverage. So Tom, uh, the dollar amount was it it was $4 million, correct? >> So yes, >> Mer, it was $4 million when we had Yes, it was $4 million. We had to go we had to go out on the bond. Uh, that was due
to uh catastrophic claims uh because we are self-funded uh that were made for our employees here in our in our township that service our our residents. >> And what's important, it's multiple >> multiple. Yes. So is there um and not to
put you on the spot, is there a cat catastrophic threshold coverage? What is that? >> Yeah. So when you you're self-insured, there are two uh limits that you look at hitting on your insurance. You have excess insurance just in case you have a
bad year. And the way it works is each individual like you you're you're the you're insured and you have a family. So you have three children and a wife. Each individual has an SIR limit. And this in this case right now I believe it's about
335,000. So everything under 335,000 the township is responsible for. If an individual, God forbid, a child gets sick and goes over that 335, the excess insurance then kicks in and covers that. There's also
what's called the aggregate attachment point. That's all the cumulative claims that everybody has. And that's where we got in trouble because all those we were getting a lot of claims, but they weren't hitting that huge point. And I
don't know what that number is. It's somewhere in the vicinity of 12 million or 13 million. And we've only hit it once. We hit it, I think, in 2001 or 2002. So, so it's very rare that that's going to happen and that the insurance
is going to kick in and give you back money. And in that particular year that we went up for the emergency, we weren't getting anything back and we were in the hole for $4 million. >> Thank you. Uh Miss Paris had uh made a statement that she believes everybody
here has a full-time job besides uh council. No, that's incorrect. people who are retired. Um, and that we receive health insurance for part-time. No, we never receive health insurance at all.
Uh, the for those who are not aware, we do receive a salary as council president pay I get $8,200. Council vice president gets $8,100 and everyone else receives $7,900. That $7,900. So that is um the salaries,
but there is no coverage uh health insurance coverage and never was any coverage. I've been on here for 22 years and never received any type of health insurance coverage. >> So um Miss Gentilly came up and spoke uh read some flyers that were passed out during the campaign season uh last year
literature. Uh folks in the audience heard that. Uh but then they also talked about the electricity rebates. Mr. Carter, is that something that we could follow up and have a conversation with and see where that's at? Okay. Maybe workshop or
upcoming meeting. Uh Mr. Sweet came up for his fifth time and talked about that we have to budget properly and that perhaps there's some manipulation that's taking place uh and probably to create a surplus. Uh but
then he got into the Oprah request and uh I'm going to state again as I stated at the last meeting uh Mr. Swede uh there are conversations that take place not always on an email or a text
message. Uh there people pick up the phone or people c speak to people in person. Uh so there's a lot of assumptions that Mr. tweet made about people not having conversations with the township administrator. Uh there was a
subcommittee that met with uh Mr. Cartis and the CFO uh I believe it was a Tuesday evening. Mr. Mone >> believe it was either May 5th or May the 6th. >> Okay. That Mr. Mone uh Mr. Nash and Miss uh Albreight Troxel met with Mr. Cartis
to go over the budget and have and had some questions prior to this budget being releasing. Mr. Carson and I had several uh conversations. U so I don't know if you can opra a conversation that took place on the phone. Uh you could try uh but there are conversations that
take place and unfortunately Mr. you make a lot of assumptions that are incorrect. Uh Mr. came up again for a sixth time and talked about his budget and the citizens budget. Um, not a lot of people know about that citizens budget, but he
and along with another individual that no longer resides in our town put a budget together and uh proposed it and indicated that their budget was probably a better budget than what our CFO and what our township business administrator put together. Uh, and once again stated
that uh the budget is overstating and understating certain items. Uh, Miss my Valley book neighbor, Miss Sophie, Sophie, what's your first name? Silia, >> Silia, I'm sorry. Sorry. Completely got it wrong. Okay. Uh talked about um basic
comments about affordability uh and and kids in our playground. Uh on a sunny day, if you pulled up here at Veterans Park, that that park is pretty full. And and
uh as you well know as as you well know those that you know sometimes we had well we had a million dollar increase in uh million dollars for a snow removal and for a community such as Valleybrook players place one there was a special assessment for snow removal
and in addition to that HOA fees were increased. So, >> there there are there's there's costs going up everywhere. Unfortunately, uh Mr. Brown uh who left for the evening, Mr. Brown brought up that um
the federal government and uh taking care of undocumented individuals rather than homeless vets. Uh Mr. came up for a seventh time and talked about uh in 2020 when the taxes were raised during COVID.
Uh that particular year we dispense with not having a capital budget. Uh what's included in our capital budget are improvements to our roads, our sidewalks, uh purchases to um for example, we purchase vehicles each year
for the police department, uh any type of equipment that they need, public works, those things. uh we did not have a capital budget that year due to uh co but yeah unfortunately we had an increase that year so that is correct uh Mr. came up for his eighth time and
talked about shouting out the clouds and explained that um and has indicated that he has proven that none of the members here of council have had conversations with Mr. Cart he has proven that um and unfortunately Mr. Uh, that's a lot of
hyperbole from you. >> I think the question was, did you drive here? And the answer to that is yes. >> Excuse me. >> The answer was, did you drive here? >> My answer is yes. >> Drive here >> for the to talk to Mr. Carter. >> Okay. Okay. Yes.
>> In person. A lot of >> I called on myself and met with him personally oneonone. >> So I I guess so. Um, so that that concludes my responses uh to the comments.
>> There was a you >> that missed one. Okay. >> There was a question. >> Miss Paris, I'm having a hard time hearing because you're chattering there. Could you could you >> Well, I'm having a hard time hearing because >> Thank you. Go ahead. >> I just wanted to know there was one
question that um Mr. Thomas had asked that I had a response. I think you just missed. Um he had asked about the levy. >> Levy. Yes. Okay. >> Um the levy cap applied and he asked if it was from previous years banked and what year they were banked from. So I
just wanted to answer that question for you. Um so the answer to that is yes. It was from previous years that was not used. Um and it was from 2023. Uh we used 2,872,014. And from 2025 1,251
1 million25,359. And if you uh I know you were looking at the budget online, it's on sheet 3B if you wanted to look at those numbers. >> That was the only thing that I kind of Mr. Sui again and again and again and
again in many years over borrowing over borrowing over borrowing. I don't like to make the comparison of Glouster Township with any other township because I live in this township. I love this township and I'm going to stay in this township. But if I had to make the comparison, I have to look at the size,
budget, uh the the employees, uh the the the many things that compose uh a relationship that that indicates similarity and that would be Cherry Hill. So when I look at Cherry Hill, as
Mr. I'm sure knows since he's a CPA. Um the way that you look and determine and the state makes you do this and put this on your website. It's one of the first things that you calculate is your annual debt statement. And they want to
know what the percentage is of the average of the last three years equalized valuations are as Mr. I'm sure knows. And so when that's calculated for us this past year, we had net debt of
1.012%. Now we could be the highest. The highest would be 3%. Is it three and a half percent? >> Three and a half%. >> Three and a half% of that number. So that would be debt of almost $216
million. But our debt is 73 million. I looked at Cherry Hill. That same calculation for Cherry Hill where we're at 1.012%. Cherry Hill is at 1.03%.
So something's going on over Cherry Hill because they must be over borrowing too because their numbers the same as ours. Not sure why that's happening, but I thought it was important and germanine to this this discussion. >> And I can add to that. I do work in
Cherry Hill and they had to make 74 um teacher cuts. Um >> I think everybody in New Jerseyy's struggling right now. >> It's been tough. It's been tough and they had to raise taxes as well. >> And Mr. Sweet also made a comment about
buying GT bonds to it sounded like an insinuation that either council, the mayor, or somebody was buying the bonds. I'm sure Mr. Sweden knows. again, he's a CPA, that the bonds are sold in increments of $5,000. They are sold on
Wall Street and they are sold to investment firms. They are sold to pension funds. They they are sold to they they they're purchased throughout the world and they're considered to be very low risk with a guaranteed return.
I don't know of anybody who went and bought a Glouester Township bond for $5,000. I certainly did not. So, I don't think any of you did either. That's it. >> Thank you. Okay. So, we're resolution 2605-173.
Uh we had our public hearing. I need a motion, a first and a second. Uh and then we can vote. So, I have a motion on 173. >> I'll make that motion. >> Second. >> And this is a resolution to amend the 2026 budget of the township of Gloucester County of Kansas City, New Jersey. Roll call, please. >> Mr. Minion.
>> Yes. >> Mrs. Albreight Troxel. >> Yes. >> Mrs. Grace Love. >> Yes. >> Mr. Nash, >> yes to amend. >> Mrs. Walters, >> yes. >> Mr. Castro, >> yes to amendment. >> Mr. Marcato, >> yes. And that was to amend resolution 265-183, resolution the township council of the
township of Gloucester County of Kansas City, New Jersey, adopting the 2026 calendar year budget as amended. May I have a motion, please? Make that motion. >> Second. >> On the question, roll call, please. >> Mr. Mo, >> yes. >> Mrs. Albert Troxel,
>> yes. Mrs. Grace Love. >> Yes. Mr. Nash. >> Yes. Can I make a comment? >> Yeah, absolutely. >> Okay. So, um, like Sam mentioned, and as some of you may know, may not, going to make some clarifications because it's it was new to me when I first joined
council as well. So, we're looking at about a 14% tax increase that is being applied to 32% of your taxes. So, if you pay $10,000 of taxes, it's $3,200 will be increased by the 14%. On average, you're looking at about a
$300 to $400 increase per year. 25 to $33 per month. Now, I hate taxes.$25, $30, $40 a month, still expensive, but taking into cons consideration today's environment, gas prices. Just today, I
filled up my daughter's car. I easily paid more than $40 today for gas than I did a year ago. uh take in consideration the in the uh increase in our health insurance, uh gas prices for the police cars, public
works, trash trash collection prices, everything's going up. So to see a $30 increase per month on average, I feel as if it's a um it's a it's a sound budget. I think Chrissy and Tom did a great job with it. As much as taxes stink, we hate
them, we're paying them as well. Um it I think it's something that we have to deal with. But with that being said, my request to council going future looking to the future, let's maybe take this into consideration throughout the year
looking forward 2027 and let's see what we can do to potentially eliminate this or alleviate these types of increases in the future because as of now all we could do is look to the future and that's what I'm asking council to do. I vote yes. Mrs. Walters.
>> Yes. Mr. Castro. >> Yes. And I agree with everything what Mr. Nash said. >> Mr. Marcato. >> Uh before I comment, there are a $3 million increase in this budget
attributed to health insurance and a $1 million increase due to snow removal. If those things did not happen, we're not having this conversation. It's not a double-digit increase. There would have been an increase. Uh costs rise every
year. We have contractual obligations. Uh we're living in a time where unfortunately u costs are going up and it is uh we try our best to minimize it.
And if you're going to pay these amount of taxes, you have to get something in return. make you feel that you are receiving something of quality and value from the township and but Mr. Sweet uh
I don't have a problem Mr. Sweet going through the budget and scrutinizing it and I wish more people took the time to do that and and take a look at it. Uh comments made by him makes you think
Iron sharpens iron. And I do appreciate the time and effort that he took in going through the budget, but bringing up $1,700 in police dues doesn't change the $90 million budget. I
understand with understating and overstating a budget, but two factors, $3 million increase in health insurance and a $1 million uh snow removal cost that no one had anticipated. Those are the things that are driving
this budget, unfortunately. Um, with that, I vote yes. GTE gov access, we did not receive any gtegov access emails. We'll now open up the second public comment. The public participation for any item that you wish
to speak upon. Uh each speaker is entitled to five minutes and there's 30 minutes total for this period. I understand these folks have been waiting. So Miss Gentilli and Mr. Sweet after followed by Mr. Por and Miss
Paris. So that's five. Okay. >> Absolutely. So, we got we'll take you you two the couple. Okay. Followed by uh Mr. Gentilly, Mr. Sweet, uh Mr. Paloro, and Miss Paris. >> I want to put this back because I can't
There you go. >> All right. Those are the pictures of our yard. So, um, >> can we have your your name, please? >> Yes. Um, I'm Cheryl Player and this my husband, Jeff Player from, uh, Ariel. And uh you'll see the pictures of our
gardens. Beautiful, healing, eco-friendly, notable garden experts, including the top ranks of the Philadelphia Multicultural Society, have acclaimed the excellence of our garden architecture and gardens. Our gardens
have brought joy and hope, balance, and recovery to many. Jeff as a Camden County master gardener and master builder and myself as a dedicated ICU RN for many many years. Enjoy our gardens
to restore us spiritually and brings us wholeness. We hope you enjoy these photos. Take your time perusing to see each one. On October 23, 2023, Jeff and I stood in front of this
council to report to you the multiple abuses of code enforcement officials Gene Martinez and Tony Guaa, resulting from their collaboration with our white supremac supremacist neighbor in racial
bias attacks and promoted by them under the color of law. So code officials Gene Martinez and Tony Ga had collaborated with our white supremacist neighbor and under the color of law wrote frivolous
multiple frivolous violations. This council this council and solicit solicitor's office promised us a followup and an investigation neither of which occurred. We're still waiting. Dozens of frivolous complaints developed
in a collaboration between Gene Martinez and our neighbor Tormentor were dismissed along the way by the prosecutor and the judge as invalid. So those frivolous uh violations were uh adjudicated and were dismissed uh by the
judge and the prosecutor. G Martinez has misused his office and the resources of this township to punish us. His obsession with us is quite disturbing. Gene Martinez and Tony Rivera continued their abuse of office
to this day. Frequent slow drivebys, parking their code car in front of our property for a long time, surveilling us, surveilling our property, watching us do yard work. Any attempts to communicate with Gene Martinez are met
with the darkest stairs and rolling up his window. Neighbors have expressed their concern of similar encounters with them when they question his takeouts of our property. Code's lingering presence in this neighborhood scares them. The
hate speech of our white supremacist neighbor has taken root and weeds of hostility and aggression have grown in him. Our psychologist neighbor, the other neighbor, summed up that Gene Martinez actions and words demonstrate a
self-appointed hero. And now we are the villains. The county prosecutor's office was so disturbed by the evidence presented and the confrontational, their words, not mine, Gestapo style raids. They directed Gloucester Township
Eternal Affairs to investigate and take action to discontinue the abuse of power. immediately within a day for uh the G. Martinez and Tony Goa returned and escalated into yet another fully ramped up raid with aggression and
retaliation in their faces and action. shooting photos of anything and everything unefficient expedition of our property. Trespassing neighbors yards, climbing over fences, straining their bodies, contorting themselves to squeeze
to squeeze through little tiny holes to take skewed pictures of our property. These all resulted in frivolous violations and yet we have this emotional and stressful pain. We also notified attorney Colamir. I see that um
Mr. Hutchinson is here now and Marian Coyle of the solicitor's office to investigate codes abuses. Unfortunately, they said that they would follow up, but we never got an answer. We feel that this is an evasion tactic on their part.
So, the Camden County prosecutor and the state attorney general have been monitoring this ongoing harassment. The offices of Congressman Donald Norcross and Commissioner Jeffrey Nasher also have been updated. We they have repeat repeatedly appeal to the mayor and to
the township to stop this. This month this month, my birthday, Asian month, nurses week um uh Mother's Day. Good timing. Gene Martinez, May 5th, 2026. Slowly drove by as we were planting
flowers and trimming trees. The increasingly frequency has been disturbing. Gene Martinez apparently saw our cameras and returned. >> Mr. Player, >> they had did Okay, you finish. You finish.
>> The contempt was obvious and unabated. He came saw us working in the yard. He took pictures because he's been doing this more and more frequently and neighbors have been recording their uncon their concerns. He then came back
and staked us out for a long period of time just staring at us with contempt. We approached him and asked him what was the problem, what was wrong. He refused to answer us. He went, closed his window, sat there for another long
period of time watching us, and then Tony Gua shows up and they did a full ice raid. They just started ransacking our property, going all over, going down the sidelines. I'm going to show you some pictures of our property. I'm going
to show you pictures of our neighbor property climbing over trash bags and neighboring properties, weasling behind sheds, peering through the things trying to find a bad shot like the one they used when we were doing last May.
Anybody knows planters and gardeners in May, they got the garden. They ignored all code violations in the rest of the neighborhood. They uh Yes. And so it appears he
they're just obsessed with us. They got rattled up by a racist neighbor. They just kept on attacking. They continue to be weaponized. And that's not something code officials are going to do. I'm a
lifelong construction person. I know how code officials This is the worst qualified code official I ever met. He came out of the police force with no training. and his method is to control and dominate. He misused the lit tree
laws and he told all kinds of rights to our neighbor and gave her free reign to damage and destroy our park. >> I hope I'm okay to go this far. >> Going to show you.
>> You look at these pictures. See this art? Gene Martinez and our racist neighbor destroyed, absolutely destroyed, citing it as some kind of illegal fence. They told us we had to cut down everything in our front
lawn or post a bond, shy bond, because we're interfering with utility. I'm in construction. I know where every utility on our property is. Okay? In fact, I help the 811 people when they come out
to get the stuff they missed. Okay. >> Beautiful. >> You see this cherry tree here? A gift from the Japanese garden to Japanese government to PHS which gifted it to me
for the volunteer worker. He actively participated to help our neighbor destroy it. And we were held at bay by cops by the misqued New Jersey tree law, which they were given copies of that tree law. >> Okay,
>> it's done. No, >> this is the community of standards that apparently we don't uphold. Okay, we have no complaints about our neighbors. They have budget problems. Not everybody's a race gardener. >> Those are the neighbors.
>> Okay, these are our neighboring properties. >> They really they trampled over them. They trampled through foot high weeded lots so they could sight us for violations. >> They are out of control.
>> Last time we met you >> and now they're ignoring what the judge said. >> The council on the advice of the prosecutor, we came to you because apparently he has no control over him. And they said the
town solicitor would be the one to investigate and control. >> After we met. Yes. And now he doesn't even accept the judge's decisions. He's decided to go after the same stuff again
even though he was ruled against time and time. Unfortunately, it caused great emotional tour. I'm sorry. One more thing. >> Okay. thing cost us a fortune financially. Okay. And they just come in
and have that with bullying. Okay. And this is not America. >> It's racial. They're racial. >> Thank you. I'll respond after we've done our public hearing. Okay. >> Okay. >> Uh Miss Chentelli, >> I guess I ask that the commitment of
council made us last time gets followed up on. >> Okay. because we're living a nightmare in New Jersey in Gloucester Township. >> Okay, Miss Gentilly. >> Thank you. >> Thank you.
>> Hello again, Nancy Gentilly Blackwood. Um, my first EGOV was um, April 26 for uh, the April 27th council meeting. Then I sent another one following up with Mr. Orlando um on 511 and then now here
today. Um just want to talk about the restoring comments on Glosser Township official Facebook page. Um I understand that you clarified with your public comments regarding misinformation, hostile exchanges, and unably comments
on social media. Um there's those concerns are a little bit different. So you have moderation and then completely disabling all public interaction. Um Mr. Hutcherson allows public comments on his Facebook page,
your official Facebook page, as well as our governor, um Mr. Narcross, um many, many, many entities. And a few of you here have actually used our Glosser Township Talk site to make comments or had asked people to make comments or
asked them, I believe, Mr. Nash, you asked someone to see if they could maybe host something at Harmony Hall and that you were going to organize it. And then um Miss Troxel, you commented about a halfway house in your neighborhood.
I believe you also commented about u a police watch and something else I can't remember. Um assistance that someone needed about snow removal that you were unable to help them. So, you participate in other sites, but you don't allow the public to participate in the actual Gloucester Township Facebook page. And
they were um turned off last year. So, if we have it respectfully and there's moderation and there's rules, why can't we restore? It's a First Amendment right? And Miss Troxel mentioned at the last meeting at the very end for comments, you said that
you like free speech, the first amendment. So, I'm sure all of us up here do. So if we can just restore them. So it would go back to um asking you said that you would open it up to a talk among council members.
So if we can go ahead and do that and >> we did no one responded. >> No one here has >> no one responded. >> Not a single person here has a comment on that. >> No one respond. >> I'll repeat what I said last week. I also agree that I think that it's not the right place to have an open forum.
Last year, there was some events that were posted on the Facebook page and there were some nasty comments, right? And I and I know as a resident if I'm going on there for information, it's not it's not the space to see political complaints or or rhetoric. >> Tom, can you pause the clock because
we're responding, but just pause and then we'll So I >> Thank you. However, um with a moderator on that page, you have rules and guidelines and profanity is not permitted. Just like on other private Facebook groups, there's moderators and we've done it before. There have been 14
comments, but you only see two. So, we've done it in the past. So, I don't know why we can't turn that around and do it again. >> I mean, it it's it's a it would be a fabulous opportunity when guess what? um trash is going to be late or um we have
a row closure or uh someone posted is something going to be postponed for the rain day of the movies. No one was able to ask that on the Facebook page. Listen to me. The
Facebook page. So, no one was able to ask that on Facebook for Glosser Township site. So, everyone is asking on the public's sites. Why couldn't someone just quick do a little, hey, cluster towns, were you going to have it? And then your moderator could respond. But no,
everybody's hitting everybody up. Is it going to happen? Is it going to happen? Over two hours later was it posted that it was postponed to the next day at a different location. You know, there's a wonderful opportunity to communicate with the residents. Um, also speaking about communicating with the residents from
from from February to November, um, on the official Gloucester Township page, there was four mentions about coffee, 19 about the art festival, one about Boy Scouts, four about Gabriel's Tavern, two on Easter, two with council recognition, five on 5K, two field dreams, two on
trash and court, three with the shred day, business breakfast, seven farmers market, three villies were one, the garden, the Earth Day, Bingo was one Baseball was one. Police got a shout out four times. Uh, Chamber of Commerce got one. Mother's Day got one. Movies got
two. Businesses, camps, church, and preschools got 23. Guess what? Guess what was missing? Not a single post about a council meeting, a redevelopment meeting, or a zoning meeting. I believe
that you are creating a narrative to show the warm and fuzzy. The good shift lollipop was mentioned. Please inform all the residents about all the things that going on. Not just a blip on the sign on the Blackhorse Pike or a blip. I know I got >> Thank you, Mr. Natelli.
>> Change your mind. Someone talk about it. Don't just zip it. >> Uh Mr. Sweet. >> Sam Street from Ariel. Um, when I say overborrowing, I I want to be clear. Uh, I'm not saying that
we're overborrowing by the amount that we're borrowing. What I'm saying is we're borrowing $200,000 or I'm sorry, $450,000 for roofs over a 5year period and only spend 200,000 of
it. That's what I mean by over borrowing. Not saying that the 73 million isn't warranted. Well, sort of am because I don't think we needed to borrow $73 million because some of the items were never done. So, when I say overborrow,
we're borrowing for items that are we're not getting to $450,000 for a roof of the municipal building to be fixed in 20 starting in 19 20 not 20 21 22 23 24 and
then only spent $200,000. And that was the Mr. Nash comment where he said to me, he goes, "Mr. street. You're not a roofer. You don't know how how much a roof costs. I wasn't complaining about the cost of the roof. I was complaining that we borrowed $450,000 and only spent $200,000.
And there's constant amount. There's so many other instances of that where we borrow an amount and we we do not spend the entire amount. We borrow it's always it's been about a third. And I prove that. That's what I mean by
overborrowing just to be clear. >> Thank you. Um I'm not done. >> I just thank >> Okay. Um did you to Miss on clarification? Did you say that there's wages on the capital project budget? >> We'll answer that at the end.
>> Okay. Um, which leads me then to I would like to go back to the back and forth that we had because in that a specific example because if she answers that question and I have another follow-up question with it, I have to
wait two weeks to get that answer. I understand why you took away that right, but I think it needs to be reinstituted. Um, I never was rude to you guys. I've only shown
respect on here. I've had You may think because I just >> I'm sorry. I apologize. >> But that's a whopper, but go ahead. Continue. >> Okay. >> Um, >> that's ridiculous. >> Please continue. >> Okay. So disrespectful. >> Let's not shout out. All right. You want
to talk about disrespect? >> Yeah. Disrespectful. >> Okay. >> Please continue. >> Okay. um the comments that were made, some of those comments were uh I I get it. But as our elected officials, part of my
part of that job is to understand that you're going to be questioned. And if we if you don't like being questioned, then you shouldn't take the job. And as far as there was no insinuation that council was buying bonds, my
insinuation is that I'll come right out and say it that George and Norcross's shell companies are buying the bonds and that that we're purposely over borrowing so that way he gets the interest. Totally legal. All of that is absolutely 100% legal. It's
immoral that we're over borrowing by $12 million on a capital project. All right. and not spending it or spending it elsewhere and not being told where it's being spent. Okay? Wasn't insinuating that council was doing that at all. So I if you would like to know where my
thoughts are, please ask next time instead of making an assumption like that. And then finally, Mr. Cartis, you state that it's poor to go right up to against to what the what the amount is that yes, the state will allow you to do
that, but they don't recommend it. Well, the state will also allow you, as you've pointed out several times, will allow you for anything that has a fiveyear or more useful life to put in the capital project. This also includes a counterfeit money a counterfeit money
machine that recognizes counterfeits, which was I believe $450. So, just because you can't quote say the state recommen doesn't re will allow you to do it, but doesn't recommend it. Well, the state will allow you but doesn't recommend it on the other things. So you can't pick and choose.
And then Mr. Marcato um with respect to your comment of um I'm insinuating um in this day and age lot of people communicate via email, via text, via uh
phone conversations. And yes, I can't tape a phone conversation, but I can go to the co call call logs and there was no call log. All right. So I can that I can make an assumption on. Am I making a large jump? Maybe so, but not one email asking a question. I find
that hard to believe. >> And I'd like you to reinstitute the policy of back and forth if possible. >> Thank you, >> Mr. Palorum. Good evening once again, council. Ray Polydor from the historical village of Ariel. I really uh you guys made me
smile with the outburst which I determined to be a dialogue. It was great to watch. Thank you for starting it off, Mr. Nash. So, after you've gone down the path of raising our taxes again, um does Gloucester Township still
participate in the expedited tax sale? And if so, um I believe that you guys find it very beneficial to uh have that expedited tax sale and hurry up and get that revenue. It looks good for you. But
on the other end of that tax sale are the people that you made suffer that fell behind. And uh as a young lady uh pointed out earlier and and I stand corrected, it's not just seniors. Everybody's hurting. Single parents are hurting. Um, and when you have these
expedited tax sale, now you owe the tax and somebody buys that lean and now you got to take care of that, which may put you further behind. Um, maybe take another look at that and maybe find a stroke of leniency rather than uh
ramming it uh in a quick uh fashion to get them on the tax sale. Um, when all else fails, uh, you mentioned, uh, that, uh, Sam and another former resident doesn't live here no more. Well, that former resident that doesn't live here has a name. His name is Pete Heimboy put
a lot of time with Mr. uh, uh, Suite into putting these budgets together. And when you say he's a former resident that does not live here anymore, I wonder why. Just saying. Um, you uh, I guess you kind of answered the question of the
threshold. uh and uh how health care costs are going up and um I would like you to address if I'm not mistaken I have not heard any change um the glossery tachip employees uh you know they deserve good benefits
and the wages going where they are but um do you still do employee out-ofpocket co-pay reimbursements? Uh, is the township still doing the thing with employees where when they have the out-of- pocket co-pay, it's actually coming out of our pocket when we
reimburse them. We don't have anybody paying our out-of- pocket uh expenses for health care. Uh, I pay almost $1,300 a month for my healthcare coverage for just me. My wife has her own thing and uh my co-pays are astronomical.
Uh, Mr. Roshio had um he called it a rumor uh about the American water coming in and taking uh over our sewer system. He won't have to. As I mentioned at the last meeting, you will sell our sewer
within 18 months. You will sell our sewer and you will drive our bills up. I mentioned the last meeting and there's no way you can deny it because what'll happen is it'll come back to haunt you when you do. But the problem is you'll do it, we'll pay for it, and I told you
so doesn't work with you guys because you keep raising taxes and we've told you so before. Um, take it to the bank. We know you'll sell our sewer. Um, last but not least, I have uh something that I would like to see what my council knows, and I'd be very impressed if you
do have answers for me. Uh my understanding is that we have a Cooper University healthc care G Glouster Township campus coming to our town soon. My understanding is that and this is just by the flyer that is put
out by the invite for folks to join them. A $300 million 184 square foot multispecial facility coming to Gloucester Township. If that's so, has that gone before the planning board? Has it gone before the zoning board? Is
anybody talking about it? Um, I'm sure the person that heads this Cooper program, he's already made out like a bandit in the farm property he bought and then sold to uh Simon Priests where we now have the Premium Outlet Mall. We'd like to know where this is going,
what the process is going to be, and the input uh that the t the township residents will have. Uh there's a meeting on that uh that looks like it's uh being hosted by Mr. Norcross and Governor uh Mike Shrill uh at the Premier Outlet Drive on uh Wednesday,
June 3rd at 11:00 a.m. But I'd be thrilled to know what you guys know about it. And if that's something you want or don't want and which way you on it, I personally, if this is going to be a hospital, not only would I love to see a hospital come to Gloucester Township
because everyone in our township that has to go to Washington Township knows that if you're going there at 8:00 at night, you better call your work for the next day. You'll be there all day long. We could use it. Uh so hospital would be great. I'd like to see uh paramedic unit in the southern end of town because if I
have a heart attack in aerial um I don't stand a chance if I need to be intubated uh by a paramedic which we the EMTs can't do. Thank you. Thank you for your time. >> And Miss Paris is our last speaker of the evening. >> Stay here.
>> A couple things. Um, you broke two of your own rules. So, I'd like to have the same uh courtesy back to myself. Uh, you gave the one person 10 minutes, so I'd like to have 10 minutes. I have No, I haven't been here um for a while. You
gave the first people 10 minutes. And also, you gave somebody the ability to talk and you answered. So, you broke two rules of your of your meetings. So, I would like to ask a couple things. First of all, I asked you way back and now that there's another Jewish person here
tonight, I wanted to talk to him afterwards about getting the Jewish rabbi here to do um the opening ceremony. So, I'll ask him. Secondly, I'd like to have October, since we have uh Puerto Rican month, we have uh Black
History Month, we have um all these different months. I'd like to have uh October be Jewish history month because of uh it's the holiest month of the year and I would like to make a comment to have that of Jewish history month. So
maybe you can uh make that for October, which I know it's uh breast breast cancer month and everything else, but I'd like to make a comment on that. Secondly, um Mr. Hutchinson, I I uh took your advice and went to your office and
went to see uh Jennifer for uh Senator Paul Morardi and I have got no answers from me and said that they said it would take 3 months to a year to answer me. and you have a a corrupt landlord in this township and he's also gotten
corrupt uh codes and and violation and all types of things passed through your country uh your your uh township through Jim Gallagher I think his name is am I right is he your codes person you'll answer me afterwards I guess he was very
very arrogant when I called him but Mr. uh Punite Klaw who owns SDK Milbridge has done about 10 different violations that I've contacted the Courier Post, Channel 10, Channel 6, Channel 3, Fox
News, and it'll be all over. Gloucester Township is going to be out there, but not in a good way and not a not in a good way at all because you guys don't look at your apartment landlords. This man has charged every single 850
apartment units $31 a month for sewer for I've been there the last 11 years and because my father passed away, my son, one of my sons got killed in and decapitated in a car accident because my mother's in hospice at 95 years of age. My father-in-law just passed away and
because I'm just diagnosed with a lot of medical issues that I don't feel well. I have been fighting for 850 residents right now because we've been charged something called rub. Does anybody know what rub is? No. Mr. Carter, do you know
what rub is? Anybody? >> Who's in construction here? Who's Anybody know what rub is? Well, this man and you guys let him go away with it. Who who works with Mr. Gallagher? Who works who who works with him? Who f Who is his boss?
Who lets him get Who lets apartment landlords get away with things? You guys, who who checks on apartments in this township? Okay, nobody's going to answer me. Okay. Well, I I want the answer because I need him because I want to give it to all the
newspapers and the TV stations. Okay. and also a radio station I'm going to be on because for the last 11 years this man has had one meter and in front of the 850 units and has charged every single apartment what he feels like
apartment what he feels like charging for gas and hot water. He takes every apartment and he decides what he wants to charge. I can't live with heat and I can't live and I can't live with heat. I don't have the gas on. I'm in the second
floor because I can't breathe. Okay? I have four lung masses. All right? And I cannot breathe. So what happens is that I don't have my heat on all winter long. And then October, my father-in-law died. I didn't wasn't home from October to
November when they decide to open up a luxury amenities place where Jim Gallagher o okayed a big huge gas range thing. Six big gas ranges. Okay. With bricks and concrete,
four feet away from a playground. He passed a code permit where kids can run from the playground into this concrete and the gas ranges with nothing blocking it so these kids can get hurt or burned. There's a playground. I called Mr. Gallagher about this
situation and he said, "Who are you?" I said, I'm I'm helping and I'm leading this with 850 units of people, seniors, uh, single families, everything. And now these kids are going to get burnt or hurt. And let me tell you something about this. So he said to me, "Well,
mind your own business. I'm not going to talk to you." I said, "Who's your boss?" There's no boss. I'm the boss. This guy passed this. This code guy, Jim Gallagher. Okay. Now, Mr. P. >> Excuse me. >> I'm sorry, Miss Paris. Oh, I'm going to get another five minutes just like that.
>> I'm sorry your time is up. >> No, it's not up. >> I'm sorry your time is up. >> I live in this township and you going to >> We'll close the public hearing. Okay. So, we're going to address the players. >> Um, Mr. and Mrs. Player, >> we received I received an email from you
and that email. >> That email I will forward to our township solicitor uh to follow up for that. Um, and could you and um Mrs. Coyle follow up? >> We're going to find out.
>> The the players had sent an email to me as well uh documenting some of the information that they presented here today. Uh I do recall when they were here back in in 2023. Uh is it possible that your office can resume uh this conversation with the players and also
speak to to you spend it to this lister as well and also Miss Coral who may be familiar with that and and and get to the bottom of this. U the code enforcement individuals they fall underneath the department of community development u and also I guess uh loop
in the director in there as well. Okay. Uh, Miss Gentilly had comments regarding um the >> Okay. >> Maryann Coral who's his assistant parallegal and also the code uh excuse me the director of community development
uh Mr. >> Belli Belli >> Belli. Okay. Uh Miss Gentily had comments uh talking about her ego that she had said about the participation of uh Facebook and having comments enabled
again on our website. I've commented on it. We asked my colleagues on council if they wanted to have a discussion about it that was not brought up. I asked that again on the dis. Uh and and Mr. Chill, you referenced a a
a Facebook page. Um and the things that are said on that particular Facebook page, there is no monitoring of those pages. People post things, rumors, innuendos, things that are false. And if individuals, residents
from our community want communication, we talked about the ways that they can communicate with the township and the information that's provided to them. In addition to that, Nixel, if there is something that is happening in our community, people can sign up for that. They receive that information. They can contact the different offices. They can
email, call, uh they could chat. I had to check to make sure is our uh recycling or excuse me, our trash going to be picked up, is it a delay? And I got a response back. So there are ways to communicate. I stand by my opinion on on that. But again, this is an
administrative function through uh the administration and they chose not to have comments enabled on the Facebook page. Uh Mr. um uh u explained his thoughts on on over borrowing and and clarify that he did pose a question.
Miss Eric, Miss Eric, do you do you recall the the question? I put an email or a call. >> Okay. >> Um so there are salaries in capital if they're doing something in capital in nature uh like
uh fixing like like a roads or I don't know Tom wants to help me. No, we we budget items not only that uh outside contractors are going to do, but also jobs that we can do inhouse. And
she's correct. We can repair roads, we can repair curbing, we install curbing, we do work in the building here, we can install carpet, we can fix things um and and not so much fix things, but like HVAC work, uh we can run wiring. We do
things like that. So when those projects take place and they're charged against the capital because that's where we budgeted that money then then the the FICA is charged against the budget. >> Okay. Thank you. Uh
then he made a comment about um a possible individual purchasing bonds. Be careful. You can make comments that you're not aware of. I that's just resident to resident. be careful about the comments that you make if you don't have evidence to support it. Uh Mr.
Paloro uh talked about expedite tax sale, accelerated tax sale, >> correct? >> That is called an accelerated tax sale. Uh that accelerated tax sale takes place uh late November, early December. >> It takes place right before uh the end
of the year. So it's typically December 28th, 29th. >> And there is no turning back on that. That is once you do the accelerated tax sale, uh if you were to go back, you would be then subject to we we collect
now 99.99 or 98% of the tax levy. Um if you were to go back to a sale that occurs after the close of the fiscal year, you then have to estimate what your what your collection will be. I would tell you
your collection will probably be somewhere around 95 96. So that 4% of the entire levy, not our levy, not our 31% of the entire levy would would and I don't have that number here right now at this point, but I'm sure it's a huge
number. You then have to budget for that 4% that you don't collect. So you would have to put in this budget an appropriation of approximately $8 million because you're not going to collect that money. So you once you did the accelerated sound, a lot of
municipalities did it. Once you do that, there's no turning back. >> Okay. Uh Mr. Per also asked about if we still have out-ofpocket reimbursements. Um >> there are negotiated in the contracts. There's what's called FSA cards. So they
get a uh if they qualify for it and they're taking the benefits and they get a card. It's for the entire family. It has $500 on it and it has to be a a legitimate bonafide reimbursement for
medical type issue. And so they can use that card for deductibles or they can use that card to also buy drugs that they have to pay for. You can use it for some drugs that are over the counter. Um
but it does have its limitations. Now is that across the board for all our employees? Because I know when Mr. Podor first brought this up years ago. Um he keyed in on the employees at the MUA and uh and attended a meeting uh at the MUA
to uh express his displeasure that they were receiving uh co-pay reimbursements. So is this across the board? Uh I don't know that the MUA employees, the ones that are in Teamsters 500 have that
benefit. I don't think they do. uh but someone when it was an authority decided to be very generous in my opinion and reduce them from a year four chapter 78 to year two chapter 78. >> Okay.
>> So that was a change that they do have. >> Okay. Uh and he asked regarding uh Cooper Hospital and the medical facility uh that they are uh possibly developing. uh at the site I believe across from the
Chick-fil-A adjacent to the premium outlet um and Mr. Palo referenced the farmland and uh for those who are not aware yes Mr. Paloro. I'll say it again. We were bringing about $4,500 in farmland assessed taxes for that
property. But now there's over $4 million coming in in premium outlets. Uh in addition to that, if there's a facility there with Cooper Hospital, uh that would be a ratable uh for the township. So, uh, there is an event
that's taking place June 3rd, uh, a ceremony and, uh, Cooper Hospital and also the governor will be in attendance and I'm sure my colleagues at council, uh, will be in attendance with the mayor. Um, so as far as planning board and zoning, has anything come across?
Uh, Miss Mrs. Alrexle is our planning board member. Anything that's come yet before you? >> Okay. So, uh, and then Miss Paris, who's no longer here, um, she had in previous means asked to have a Jewish rabbi included. I had reached out when her
initial request was made to Deacon Ken Carpinelli, who oversees our ministerium. Uh, there is a group of uh, faith leaders here that meet regularly with the mayor and he is responsible for putting the schedule together for those that are participating, offering prayer.
And I was going to if uh they're not able to uh find a rabbi, I would more than welcome to have Miss Paris lead uh our council meeting with prayer if she chooses to do so. Um she had asked comments about possibly uh recognizing
those of the Jewish faithful and Jewish history month and that's something that we can discuss and then brought up issues regarding a corrupt landlord. Uh she indicated again people should be very careful about the comments that are made here in public um regarding the where she lives in the SDK apartments.
Um she had asked about who Jim Gallagher is. Jim Gallagher is the construction official for the township. Um maybe we could follow over Mr. Gallagher and get some context. Um some sometimes some of the things that Mrs. Paris presents to us may not be uh factual.
>> Yeah. and he so >> and I would say that if she was here >> he's a he's a division of the department of community development as you know but he also reports to the uh bureau of regulatory affairs which is a division of DCA >> the state correct >> yes
>> so um we'll see what he knows about that if you can follow up with him and make him aware of the comments that were made this evening >> okay with that uh polling of directors >> Mr. Herson. >> Uh just that the uh governor's uh budget
proposal was to um reduce the income limits from $500,000 to $250,000 uh for the property tax relief program NJT stay. Um she had also made a second request, it's my understanding, to
reduce the overall benefit from a cap of 6,500 to 4,000. I will say that um the legislature has the budget right now and we're um we're going to be reporting back shortly. It's my intention to keep
the 6500 cap in place and the 250,000 the the reduction at 250,000. I can live with that. >> Mr. Cartis, >> nothing to report. >> Chief Man, >> nothing. Thank you. >> Mr. Miguel, >> nothing to add. Thank you. Miss Weiss,
>> Mrs. Eric, >> Mr. Mo, >> uh, this Monday, our Memorial Day services were wonderfully done by our veterans, our police officers, and our special police officers. Kudos to all who participated. It was it was a great event. I was really curious to see uh
what Miss Paris was talking about. I thought she had the answer to what she was speaking about when she said rub. I wasn't sure where she was going with that, but uh, everybody have a great night and a great week. Thank you, >> Mrs. Albert Troxel. Well, it was a great Veterans Day in Gloucester Township. The police did an excellent job as usual and
all of public works did a great job, too. Um, and the specials were there and special police officers and everybody did an excellent job because there was not one error in the whole program. And we started at 7:30 in the morning and I
didn't get home until 2 o'clock in the afternoon. and I went home with a smile, feeling very good about Glouester Township and how we all worked together to make that day really special, especially for all of our veterans and our um the families of the veterans,
too. Uh I want you to understand that it's a living budget. Budgets move. They don't stay stationary. And I think you want a couple of you understand that. But I hope tonight when you listen to everybody speak, especially Tom Cartis,
that you understand that our budget is much different than just your household budget. We have to follow a lot of rules and regulations and guidelines. And if we don't, we get punished by the state or the feds, and we never want that to happen. So, I'm happy that we have Tom
Cartis, and thank you for all your hard work and and his assistant there. She does a great job, too, because they keep us out of trouble. Uh, I'm a I'm a senior citizen. I have a fixed income. I don't have a You can see how much I make
here. It's a lot of stress, but but it's a a job where I think and hope that we can help other people. But that living budget is really important to remember. It's not just a firm budget with fixed figures because those figures can change
as situations change. And please understand that I'm not happy about our our increase. And I don't think any of us up here are happy about the increase. But when we look around at everything else, I just got a an electric bill for $7,993
and almost fell on the floor. Of course, they accidentally put the decimal point in two different places. the wrong place and sent me a corrected bill for $79.93 two days later. I also signed up quite a while ago to
get that discount from the electric company. Uh that was I think last year and I did get a deduction in my electric. So I hope you all look for that and uh go to your um your bill. There's something on your bill. Call them and ask them about it. They'll help
you. And thank you. And as far as the um the Japanese garden, I I thought it was lovely and I hope that uh everything gets resolved with you. I I feel bad that you have so much stress about it. My husband was a master gardener and uh we have a lot of flowers and gardens
too. So I understand. But uh good luck to you and I hope that we can help you up here with that. >> It's been I understand >> for a long period of time. Thank you and thank you all for coming.
>> Mrs. Grace Love, the budget is always a tough one for me because it affects everyone in town. Um, I typically look at
the big budget departments like our police department, our recreation, our public works. not always like Mr. Swede looking at, you know, digging the little details of the small items that could
add up. Um, thank you for those those comments, but I want to say this as a resident of Gloucester Township for since 1987. Um, I moved here for safety. I moved
here to uh most of us can go to a Wawa 2 o'clock in the morning and feel safe. Um we don't have to worry like some other towns may have to worry and that costs
that that is part of the community that we live in and that uh we all benefit from that and raising taxes is a part of that. I kind of focus in on revenues as I've asked many questions about revenues because I was hoping that that would
offset some of the um the debt that we have to occur. Um but I know that there's departments that I will never touch. I'm very a big fan of our police department. I lived in probably one of the toughest communities in Gloucester
Township and all the residents around that that lived in single homes were afraid of that small community. And I've watched this department and all of those departments come in and make that neighborhood safe and made everyone else
feel safe around them. So there's it's a very difficult thing for me to even consider, you know, cutting in, you know, the police department or the recreation department or public works, our streets department. All these departments have had significant impact
on the entire Gloster Township to keep us safe, to keep our children in healthy schools, to keep our families thriving in Gloucester Township. I'm single. My kids are grown, but I still live here because I know it's a great town to live
in. Um, but it's it's always going to be difficult and I I hear you. I hear everyone here. Um, but we have to make hard decisions and you know, sometimes I feel like I'm
on the fence with things, but I I know that once I make that vote, I know I'm doing the driving in the best interest of Glouster Township. So, I do want to thank everybody for coming out and we're always here to continue to
support the community. >> Mr. Nash, >> thanks for everyone for coming out. >> Mrs. Walters. >> Um, I want to thank everybody for coming to the Memorial Day. Um, it was a great day to celebrate um those um that lives were taken. Thank you to the police
department for the um excellent um driveage um directions so we all all got there safe. Um so I just thank public works for setting up and being there. Um the budget is very difficult. Um, like I
said before last time, I work many jobs. I pay the bills. I have kids. Um, but it's something we have to do. I trust in Mr. Cartis and assistant to make those choices. That's his expertise. We always have there's always room to to
see what's needed next year, what's not needed, what works out. It's always it's back and forth. It's not just set standards. Um, but I want to um thank you again for doing that and putting together what I do. Please don't assume that you know
what I do. Um, you don't know who I talk to, where I talk to them, how I talk to them. So, don't ever assume that I'm not doing my part. When you come up here, I listen to everybody. I thank um, Miss Gentilly for coming up and saying about
social media. Yes. if they want to put the um the public notices on there, I'm fine for that. But for me to go and comment on things, I'm not a a good resource for that or to put something up. I don't have the time to do that or, you know, the availability to do that on
a constant basis. But when you come up here, I give the respect. I listen to what you say. I hear what you say. I take into consideration. Disrespect was what I got last week. Nobody saw what happened in the back except for some people up here and some
things that I did see on Facebook. So the disrespect it is there. I'm not giving it to Al, but it's there and I did see it and it's not appreciative when I sit up here for hours going over listening. So please just respect one another.
That's all I ask. Thank everybody for coming. Have a great week and have a great week, Mr. Castra, >> I want to say thank you to everyone up here. It's been a very tough month doing
what we have to do, even for Mr. Cartis to take the time to sit down with some of us individually to go over things. >> I appreciate that. Um, and for those that are down there as well, Chief, awesome job, uh, helping out the veterans to, uh, remember those that
sacrificed so that we can be where we are at and have where we are at so we can have democracy. Um, Miss Er, thank you so much for putting your time in as well for this budget. I know it was not easy. um being on one side of being a
union representative for 18 years, sitting on one side of the aisle and now being on the other side of the aisle. You see both sides. There's two sides to labor management and it's never easy. It's never easy. That being said, thank you everyone for
coming out. Thank you for your comments. Mr. Sweet, thank you for your time. Miss Gentilli as well. Miss Higgins, Jerry, I hate to call y'all the cherry people, the cherry blossom people, but the players. Thank you so much as well,
>> Mr. Marcato. >> Thank you for coming out this evening, everyone. Thank you for your comments. I entertain a motion to adjurnn. >> Motion. >> Is there a second? All those in favor? Have a great evening everyone.