But you know, he's maybe 74. Yeah. One heck of a coach. Yeah. His brother too, Jimmy was good. the whereabouts they said they know where they're going to start or
stop I told the people they asked request a speech. Well, it's 9:00. We'll call the meeting to order and stand for the pledge. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the
republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Anybody have anything to add to the agenda? I'll make a motion to approve the agenda.
I'll second it, Mr. Chair. Motion agenda. Any discussion? All in favor of motion signify by saying I. I. Opposed. The meeting minutes were sent out. Mr. Chair, I'll make a motion to approve the July 1st
meeting minutes. Second motion and a second to approve the minutes. Any discussion? All in favor of motion signal by saying I opposed carried.
Warrants were done. If it doesn't, let me know. I can Thank you. Mr. Chair, I'll make a motion to pay the bills. Second. Got a motion and a second to pay the bills. Any discussion on any of them?
All in favor of the motion signify by saying I. I opposed. Morning. All right. Hey Pat up on County Road 10 there cuz there's a lot of parsnip up on down north Ash we've seen it.
Yep. We're working on it. Yeah. Our spray truck was down for about a week and a half. So y I just I just uh take care of a place north of town there. Yep. We had some major motor issues with the truck. So,
Oh, you do? Yeah. Well, we got it fixed now. So, Okay. What was wrong? Uh, we lost all fuel pressure. The fuel rail system something. Yeah. Like a fuel shut off or what? Did he fix? I have no clue.
You got her going now though? Yep. Oh, okay. You want to go first? You want me to go first? Sure. All right. Uh, commissioners, as you can see, I gave you guys our capital plan here of our equipment. Um, every other day we rotate between a truck and a road grader
as our major equipment purchases. Um, I went out and got three different quotes. Uh, two from RDO and one from Ziggler. Um, the lowest being 315,627. 23 cents to trade in. Uh, the middle at
340,396 and 3 and the highest one at 340 515 and 3 cents. Uh the difference between the bottom two is one has six wheel drive, one is your regular two, four-wheel drive,
whatever you want to call it. I guess there's your tandem drive. So they were both John Deere. Yep. Them were both John Deere. John Deere was uh lower in price significantly this year than CAT. I don't know what the reasoning is, but
yeah. Was it like 25,000? Oh, yeah. It's about that. 35. Yeah. 25,000. Yep. So, but um I would go with the recommendation of going with the six wheel drive. It's a, you know, it's not the cheapest bit, but it would be more
useful to us. Um the six wheel drive really helps us out on the roads in the winter time. It's 772. Yep. The 772P. Yep. So, and then yeah, as you can see here, I
got the one yellow one highlighted. Which one's going to get replaced? It'll be the Ashby Road greater. They're giving us like 95,000 for that. Um, something like that. It depends on, you know, John Deere. Yeah, John Deere's giving us 98,000
where I think Cat was giving us 115,000. Okay. So, we have the six wheel and B drive. Do we have similar gators with six wheel drive? Yes, we have. two 672 models. They're this a little
bit smaller motor size. Um which one is in um elbow care and one is in Herman, but we know how they perform. Yep. Yep. And you can shut it off and on. So it's just use it when you need it. So you don't wear out tires as much. But yeah,
it's oil branded up front wheels. Yep. And they that there's a better market for that blade as a six-wheel drive than just regular drive in the back or resale value. Yes. For trade in valley
expected delivery is I'm assuming they got to build it. Do they got to build it yet? Um it will be the first part of the year. January, February, somewhere in there. So it sounds like their build times are getting a little bit faster. Um but then it sounds like
when you go to get the snowplow equipment, that's falling a little bit farther behind, too. So, they're going to be when they are, right? Yep. And you're getting joysticks with the steering wheel. Yep. The the John Deers have the joysticks in the steering wheel. So, you can use either one. Okay.
So, some of the guys like to use the steering wheel compared to the joysticks. How are we sitting now with the cat versus John Deere? Uh, this if this will be our fourth John Deere and we only have one cat left. after this one. After this one. Yep. Hoffman will be the
only one that's got a cat or greater left. And that's just strictly due to the pricing every time John Deere comes in and beats him up. So So your spreadsheet shows just one unit 2026. So you anticipate that being your
only major request? Uh yeah, my only major request that I want to pre-order, you know, I don't need to order a truck or nothing. I mean, we'll have pickups, stuff like that, but yeah. Yep. This is the only thing that I have to order so we can get it within this year.
So, you'll be sure Jamie knows the price though and expected. Yeah. And that won't come out until we receive it, right? Yep. This is just the order where there's no money down this this she has cash when the time Yep. Yep. Yep. I'll make sure of it.
I'll make a motion to go with the recommendation of whichever one that was the I didn't pull it up. 772 PP that one the John Deere second that a motion and a second to purchase the
greater. Any more discussion? All in favor of the motion signify by saying I. I oppos. Carried. Thanks, guys. Okay. The first item I have is the contract final for Cas 6 or Berwin
Avenue down in Herman. Believe this was in 2018 project or no, I'm way off. Maybe 2023 if that. 2022 I think it was started started. Yeah. You know, there was some significant a significant chain order on
it. I know and right when I started and then we've been taking a little time to try to get the grass growing, but I think we got that all situated with the people down there. So, uh, what's left is just a final acceptance by the board and to make final payment. Uh, the final
payment is $5,868.94. So, I would look for a motion from the board to accept the contract and make final payment. So, move, Mr. Chair. I'll second that. I've got a question for is that the 1% then what's left? Okay.
It's just retainage and and the storm water tiling behind the curb and all that. That's working. So, standing around down there. Y. Okay. I haven't been there when there's been a real big rain, but I Yeah. Haven't heard nothing.
That would happen. Probably not going to handle a really big rain, but it'll eventually get the water out of the water standing in the streets. Yeah, the catch bas. Yeah. So, that
completed says 106.11%. Is the 6.11 the extra in the Yeah, those were the extras that that would be the change orders. So, 6% over the Y, which is not that. No, typically you'd
want to see 10% or less in projects. So, any more discussion? We have uh all in favor of the motion signify by saying I. I post carried. The next item I have is a resolution for
a speed zone study request. I uh received a petition from about uh signed by about about 30 people. I live down by Casaten, the new road that we just paved. Starting from Casatu and heading north about a mile. Uh they
believe that the speeds are a little high right there. It is kind of a residential area. They would like us to take a look at it and see if the speed limit should be lowered there. Uh this resolution is uh in order to initiate that uh with speed speed studies. Those
are done by Minnesota Department of Transportation. So if the board would like them to study it, all we got to do is pass a resolution and I would forward it on to the state and have a discussion in meetings with them and then they would do a study to see if they should
implement a speed zone in that area. So if you want you can uh I'd be just looking for approval of this resolution and I will get it to mind for the speed zone study. I didn't I didn't hear Matt. Did uh did were there citizens down there that were
requesting this or Yeah, I received a petition signed by about 30 people that live down in that area. Okay. So we're just looking at uh Cass 10 and heading north about Ohio. Yeah. Pretty much to that search charge area that was an issue. What is the the speed limit there now?
55. That's state speed limit. Yep. That's too fast. It's not not posted there. So, it's 55. So, right. They would like to see it lowered. What that ends up being is will be determined by whatever mid study comes up.
Was a recommendation from the committee. I'll make that motion. Mr. Chair, I'll second it. Motion and second. Any more discussion? All in favor of motion signify by saying I. I. Oppose. Good.
Senator Westerm and I testified on creating the legislation in October 54. They wanted to keep we wanted to keep 54 at 60. Oh yeah. And if it it would went back to revert back to 55. So that's how that all went all the way back. You know,
that did kind of throw me off when I drove on to the swap lot and 17 there 60. Yeah. So that's why that all come about or otherwise it wouldn't have been a
possibility. But that the metros are grumbling about it. Well, if they did a study and they said that that's the speed it should be it shouldn't change based on jurisdiction. Yes, I agree. I just jump ahead. See
this? I think I know where you are. Where do you have all these? They were sitting over there. He was sitting in his back carrying them around. No, they were sitting there. So I decided to back
I understand my We got plugged in and 40 was the lead on weed to 54. They want to keep it at 10 that reverted back to 55 to 30.
Is that forward? No, I mean 55. It's a 55. It can be 60. I don't know. It was allowed 56 now what the state's going to do.
But it should be on this on that one. It should be slower. Oh yeah. At least they lost in the two big ambulance deputies. I don't I don't know what went on, but I was I was at the fairgrounds. I didn't see but
county and went through town lights and siren flew over. I don't know what the hell was around. You know, okay. type deal. I seen one shortly after that one of our pickup was
I don't know and then I don't know I wasn't I didn't go up to that again I don't know I don't think you could have caught her byind Are you ready?
Yeah. Um so we have um posted internally for environmental services department uh two positions the director and the assistant um they were internal postings and they have closed now and so I'm coming to the board asking um being that
this was an internal for a department position if you would like the the director position to be interviewed by the full board or if you'd like it to be interviewed by uh myself and then the retired the soon to be retired director
just looking for some direction from the board the personnel committee Ashley asked and it normally a department had the full board would interview wouldn't we do that when we kind of selected Reed to get trained in as I
don't know the answer that's why we're here there is only one applicant and I know in the past when it's been a department head if there's been more than one we've interviewed we've not had an internal um department head advertisement. So that's why I'm just looking for direction as far as how the board wants
to proceed. But would you say there are circumstances that would say justify or lead us to a change from normaly in other words as precedence wise explain that a little bit
well this position well for internally we haven't had an internal department head position so this is new this is a new situation um other department heads have been advertised outside um and we've gotten more than
on. So then they've been, you know, interviewed here. So this would be nothing we've ever experienced. So well, we haven't experienced and we hired, you know, probably a year ago. We hired the individual with kind of the
understanding that they he would be taking over, right? So that that's where I don't know if we need to do the full board interview. I'm perfectly fine with it if we do. We just that's not it's deviating from what we've done in the past. So we need to
come here and ask. Did the personnel committee weigh in on it or what is we said we said come here and ask because it it's whatever this board wants to do but we that's fine.
What would you recommend Ashley? I don't have a recommendation. My thought is we we've already been through this. We had the intent of that individual taking us over. So
that's my thought, but I'm fine if we want to do an interview. I guess my thought would be I think either way you do it potential outcome very likely would be the same when you have one applicant. So for that reason I would say we should probably just have
the not your recommendation but what's on your HR and the forward. Great. Yep. Based on that that's what I would think. Do you need a motion Mr. Chair? Sure. Make that motion.
I have a motion. We get a second. Well, I'm indifferent on the process, so I'll second that motion. Any more discussion? If not, all in favor of the motion signify by saying I. Oppos. Thank you.
You ready? Um, just come in today with kind of an update where things are at. Um, we've been through, you know, we had Heather come in and do some cleaning prior to the jury trial. Um, I think that went pretty well. She got through the
courtroom. Um, all in the commons areas. Everything's pretty well got wiped down. Um, she went through every light fixture, cleaned every light globe. Um, it looks
pretty pretty good in there. Um, we did experiment with some lighting in the main floor if you happen to go through there. Um, just testing out some different bulbs. Uh there's been some complaints how dark it is down on the ground level.
The bulbs make a difference. We have to look at look and aesthetics and all those things to to go along with it. But um it's it was one option to see about getting it brighter down on the main level as opposed to adding something
that's not historic to the building. So, um, we're still working on that kind of a experimenting process, but if you get a chance to look, there's some different bulbs on the main level of the courthouse. Um, they did have uh Peterson sheet
metal came through and kind of walked me through like the HVAC system at the courthouse, the LEC. Um, there was some issues LEC wise with temperature. Um, we did, um, find that
there was one unit that was running 24/7, sucking outside air temperature into the building. Um, just tweaked that a little bit. And then they also were able to swap some filters
out and and made there was a a unit in the foyer that was not working properly. So, um I don't know if John looks seems to be working good at this point. Yeah. Yeah, we went through the unit.
Okay. So, um that seems to be in better shape. Um I did get a call this Go ahead. So, this you said this unit that was running is that something that's humidity is manual.
Is that supposed to be turned on or off or how does autoated? It was automated. So, it was programmed u because the building is 24/7. It was running 247 to bring basically it was a fresh air um air exchange unit. So, it was sucking whatever the outside air temperature and
humidity was. It was bringing that into every room in the building as is um 20 but it was running 24/7. So when Peterson was there, the controls guy, I asked, "Does that, you know, does that need to run 24/7? Do we I mean,
basically that's saying there's never any exchange of air. You know, the doors never open. There's no flow of air whatsoever. That brings in fresh air from outside, but that doesn't necessarily have to you don't need to have fresh air coming in every
second of every day. So, um, what we did was we we chose a morning hours, like a 5 to 8 setting instead of a 247 setting on it, just to see how that would work, um, as far as bringing some fresh air in
during the cooler hours of the day versus during the middle of the afternoon when it's 95 and humid. That's what they were getting in pumped into their rooms as well as their So, it was kind of working overtime to compensate for the fresh air that was coming in. So, so you're exchanging three hours a day
now, right? Just as a just to see how it goes. So, um, and it's just a it's an automated setting. So, if they decide they want to go back to 24/7, it's a couple clicks of a button and it can be back to that. But, at this point, there
there really isn't need to exchange air 24/7 with as much as that building is gone in and out of. Um, make a difference, John. Well, there there's been, like my would say, there was an address. It's called the ECU.
Um, so it was it wasn't in fact purposely set to run 24/7 because of the new building just to continually bring and then, you know, get the smells of the new building and everything out. Um yeah, in conversation with PS and
Ellington, who's responsible for that unit, um they said setting it back to a couple hours in the morning, um is fine at this point. Uh so yeah, so with the adjustment of the ECU and then working through the two other heat pump issues,
one in the lobby and and uh one downstairs in the mechanical room, it looks like the system's pretty much balanced now. and has made considerable quickness as far as the humidity in there and and everything keeping up as it should. So, I think we're on the
right track. So, they did they take you in the basement of the of the courthouse and look over the geothermal that's you know the circulating motors and things like that whether kind of a schedule he just went through the controls piece of it. Um that uh that part will come a
little bit later. There was just an inspection done in I believe that inspection was done in May. So, um they will be back out later this summer and we'll go through that hopefully. Um
yeah, so we had that conversation. So, at this point, everything appears to be running how it's supposed to be running. So, we know there's a grease cert, you know. So it's, you know, they're 15 years old, so they've they've done a lot of Yeah. movement of water and
right circulating and things like that. So that's, you know, I don't know what the maintenance is on it. Once a year, maybe. Yeah. There. And there's a So this building currently has a service plan. Um, it's a three-year plan, goes through
2028. It was just started in in April or May of this year, or is continued, I should say, in April or May of this year. Um we have talked with I know John talked at Ellson's about doing one for the LEC also um Peterson sheet metal
that does the controls for this building or for the courthouse and they they also said they could give a a service plan estimate for the buildings. So um we'll just look at that and see how that goes just to keep everything running
smoothly. So yeah, we've got is it a Monday, right? 21st I think it is. Yeah. So um next Monday we've got a a guy Dave from Alex's coming over to look at everything um to give us a a price
for a you know quarterly inspection which will include you know changing all filters, looking at all the heat pumps, ECU, everything else, working the PSM. Um, so they'll be out to do a a walk through just to give everybody an idea
of what that price would be and what that contract question. Uh, so would these potential vendors compl contracts satisfy our need for a boiler house? No. Could they?
Uh, well, I mean, they may have somebody on in in house that has that credential. We haven't we haven't checked into that piece of it yet. Um so a couple we do have some interviews this week. One does have a boilers license. So you know
that's promising that you know somebody with with those credentials is applying. Um we haven't gone through that process yet. So we'll see how that goes. But um the other side is there are some individuals in the community that hold those licenses that potentially could we could contract with just to have you
know somebody that's in that you know can take care of that piece. And then the other option would be somebody could go and take that test and and basically get the license for for us. So you do have multiple options, right? Yep. So, uh, working through that
and like I we're we're kind of waiting to see how the interview process goes. It doesn't, you know, we don't if I don't have to go take a test to get a license, I I won't do that. But, I mean, it's a possibility, too. So, um, yeah. So, that's kind of where that piece is
at. Hopefully this week we'll know more. Um the highway department, the interns have been up to mow and trim and they've done a great job for us. So we really appreciate their help helping keep the grass cut and they were there for a
whole afternoon and pulled a bunch of weeds around the courthouse and and uh really did a great job. So we appreciate them coming. So um the LEC project should be he planned to be there today to clean up. He had some receding in a spot. He was going to
leave some seed for the where the logs sat. They they sat too long. Uh there was a miscommunication on that piece. I I assumed he was pulling them. He thought we were pulling them. That was a miscommunication there. So, we'll get those lines receded and and uh Heath
planned to come right before Fleaf Fest to do the first cutting on it and then um we can move forward with that that process. So, um, but hopefully today he'll come back to clean up those logs and and, uh, kind of finish up the
seating portion of that project. Uh, jury trial seems to be going pretty smooth at this point. So, they're supposed to be wrapping up with prosecution yesterday or today and then doing defense. This point, we haven't
heard that it's going to go longer than Friday, but it could. So, um, but it's been pretty quiet on the other two levels. I mean, you probably wouldn't know if you were in there that there was a bunch of stuff going on
upstairs. So, that part's been good. Um, other than that, we're looking at we just had sprinkler inspections just came through last week. They did let me know that our five-year inspections for this building, the courthouse, and the
highway are due. So, they were going to get me a quote on that. I don't know where that is at in the budget piece, but um the yearly inspections were done, but there's a five-year inspection as well where they have to flush some things out or and do some other pieces.
So, they were going to get that quote to me as far as when that can be done and how much that but they are required. So, I'm assuming that we'll go forward with that, but I'll let you know when I get those pieces. Um,
I think that is all I had on my list for right now. Any questions of me on that? Question obviously in the news there's stuff from Texas from Grand County standpoint. Would you
say that on our public awareness just our overall ement emergency management standpoint are we prepared for an anticipated event in your estimation? Properly prepared?
I would say, you know, I think my predecessor left a lot of things that were good in place, but as far as going door to door to say who, you know, it's kind of like you can do everything and you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make them drink
type of a deal. So, um, I think all the steps have been taken for Grant County to be prepared for an event. Um, does everybody listen to that? I can't promise you that that happens, but um I would say yes. You know, as far as Grant
County is concerned, as far as each individual, I would say there's no way to do it. But but from our from our aspect, yes, I I believe my predecessor did a great job of planning and preparing and and I can ask her a
lot of questions, too, if I need to. So, that's what I would tell you. Thank you. Mhm. Just like that got you back on track. I think the last time there was to that magnitude we had what like a 6 in rain and I don't know if you were around back
then but you know the tunnel was you know we had sewers that were inundated backed up. Yeah. We were by emergency bypassing and pumping out of basement and pumping out of manholes and all kinds of stuff you know. So you just got to take one day at a time. Yep.
How do you prepare for something like that? You don't. Luckily, we don't have any major, you know, Red River's not flowing through time or anything like that. So, for the most part, we're in pretty good shape here, but you just never know. You know, ours could be a tornado that takes out
two towns or something like that. That would be devastating, but Mhm. Okay. All right. Thank you. the gap. Oh, shoot. Yes. One other piece. Sorry, I totally spaced that one out. Um
Heather's been covering um during this trial period. Now, um we do have interviews this week. Um I believe just about every applicant we had said it would they would give a twoe notice at their job they're currently at. So, I guess the question would be would the
board be um in favor of potentially working with Heather to get, you know, a couple more days a week through the end of this month just to get us to that uh when we we have a hire a new hire in place. Um I I asked if she was
interested in it. She said she would be. Um we haven't really talked details on, you know, I would guess it would be back to the two or three hours a couple times a week or something like that. just to cover floors and restrooms and and
public areas. I guess I'm just looking for if I should pursue that or if you want to see a contract first or the difficult piece here would be is that it's the next two weeks and and you don't meet again till
after that period. So I would make the motion to have facility maintenance continue getting the courthouse clean through August 5th. That's our next board meeting. I'll second that. More discussion.
All in favor motion take I thank you. Thanks, Dina. Greg, bring you back on. We used up all your time, Greg. Sorry. It's all right. I'm good with that. Good
morning, gentlemen. So, uh, as you can see on the agenda, uh, we do have a conversation continuing with our solid waste program. So today's uh conversation revolves around those uh mandatory lakeshore assessment routes we
have in the county. We've been talking about uh you know changing things up a little bit uh trying to make it a little more fair and equitable and one of the first steps in doing that then is going to be uh having the folks out on our
lakeshore routes um go to dumpsters canisters I should say 65gallon canisters is what we've been talking about. So um this will be the first step in that process of uh trying to go to a more volume based garbage system and
it'll also hopefully in the long run simplify how we do billing and all that. So today's request is is uh to uh to allow uh our office to request that Anger
Bretson purchase approximately 400 of those carts that uh we would have uh the clients out on those routes start using in January. So So now you're talking about the mandatory routes, correct? You referenced Lakeshore. It's not
Lakeshore necessarily, is it? Uh, primarily it's all the lakes. Those are the mandatory Lakeshore routes that do not have canisters currently. They all just throw as many bags as they want out onto the curb. Right. They that coincides with Lake Shore. Yes. Oh, I didn't.
Yes. I'm sorry. Yes. Yep. All of those 99%. There's maybe a few that bleed off that right aren't on the lake, but for the most part, it's every one of those mandatory. Exactly. Yep. Those guys are uh allowed to put whatever they want out and then compress and picks it up.
And the discussion would be the three sizes or we uh at this point I believe we've uh talked about one 65gallon canister 65. Yep. Yep. That's kind of the standard size. Yep. And then there are they direct built through ingrets in them?
Uh no. So what we would do, so that's that's one little piece of the conversation though. At least for this first year, if we were to purchase or have ingrets and purchase those, then they would bill back $2 a month to the customer, but then we would assess that onto those taxes.
Okay? Right. So that $2 fee then for next year, Chad would put on the tax roles to cover that cost. Okay? So then we would reimburse Inger Brits on that $2 a month for those 400 canisters. Okay. But right now, Greg,
the uh who builds them now? Uh, currently those folks just receive a bill on their taxes once a year. Okay. Yep. Is there any place in Grant County where Young Brits in the building? Uh, yes. On the on the non-mandatory routes. Okay. But on these mandatory routes, I
got it right here now. They can throw up 50 bags of garbage and you got to pick them up for that x amount of dollars. Yep. Yeah. and probably I serve on that committee and and I'm one of them, right? it's really not fair and then and
so moving move in this direction it would right it's the right thing to do right and that's what we're try and you know and it it we're just like we said we got three goals make it fair volume based and simplify the building at the end of the day that's what we're trying to get to but there's a lot of moving
parts that that that need to happen before we can really streamline it all so we're trying to take baby steps and this would be that first baby step so the folks folks that um already put their garbage in dumpsters and the commercial businesses
right on the on the mandatory lakes shore routes wouldn't be affected. So, Point Comfort, Sandy Point, those folks would not those those folks wouldn't be required to to change anything, right? At least as far as needing a canister. I have to think of Bridges, you know,
like it because it was going to be quicker for them. They don't have to jump in and out of a truck. Yes. Yeah. The efficiency would be built. Yeah. There's a lot of that going on too. Yeah. And you know, we did talk about trying then moving forward to uh host a couple of at least one public forum. So
we're shooting for I believe August 12th. I think we talked about that last time. So we'll hold that here in Elbow Lake. Uh we have a reddrafted a really good letter to put out. So, everyone who's u potentially impacted by this
going to a dumpster, excuse me, canister will be getting a letter and told what's going on so they can come to the meeting or, you know, call and ask what's up, that kind of thing, right? So, we're just trying to be transparent.
But I I really think this is a good first step move or good move for the to move forward. So what we would be doing then is authorizing Ingaen to go out and purchase those 400 plus um canisters because there's a three or
four month lead to get those like we talked before. So if we were to do that now then we would have a window there to to try to get this going at least the volume part for those routes in January. There'll be a little details to work on. Would pay for those gas?
Yes, they would. they would own them and they would rent them to us for that one year for two bucks a piece. And then in 26 or 27 the potential then would be that billing could potentially go straight to the land owner from into Bretson.
Two bucks a month. Two bucks a month. Correct. Yes. How much are they? I believe they're about 90 bucks a piece. I think that's kind of the one going rate. Yep. So, you know, it would it would be a pretty big expense up front if we were
to purchase them, right? And I think they buy them by the semi. So, it would you know, you're you're talking 90 time 700, whatever the heck that is, right? That's quite a bit of money. So, so Mr.
shall build and store the carts for the vendor for the rout. Okay, we have a motion. We need a second. Second. Any more discussion? Not. All in favor of the motion signify by saying I.
I. Oppos. Thanks, Tina. Um the temporary cannabis committee has been meeting and we're making really good progress on uh finalizing our
ordinance, but an important step to the process the committee thought would to hold a public hearing with conjunction with a county board meeting so we can allow the public to come and give any feedback um or you know ask questions or whatever
that might look like. And so I'm here today to um request the board if you would be willing to um have a public hearing, you know, following a county board meeting. Um and we could do it the next one. It would give us enough time
to publish the public meeting notice in the paper um to provide the public to come ask questions about the ordinance. Well, I think that's a good idea uh to have that public hearing so that we can get this all in motion going.
Yeah. And it's in it's consistent with other ordinances where we we have a public hearing to allow people to come um and talk and it's just in dra, you know, nothing's been approved yet. Um, so it's an opportunity to hear and possibly provide feedback that could, you know, provide some revisions or
things that haven't been thought about by the the temporary committee. Yeah, it's we're it's it's not urgent, but we do need to move forward with the pro process of of getting this ordinance done um to be consistent with what the
state is looking at. So, what about the surrounding counties? How far are they on some of those? Some have already finished the process and have approved ordinances in place already. Okay. Did he say something?
Yes. Some of the surrounding counties. I was just going to say that we would then know the townships and the cities what they decided by this hearing. Some of them. Yeah. Most of them meet right away. Most townships have their meetings the first part of August.
It might we might not have everybody's responses by then, which is which is okay. Um they all the townships and cities have gotten um the delegation letter sent out. And when I sent that out, I did put the uh appropriate
commissioner with those townships and cities so they know that they can reach out to you to ask questions. Um, and I also put in there that Ken and Dwight are on the the temporary committee, so they might have a little bit more information. Um, and so I they've all
been informed and the purpose of that is for them to let the county know if they plan to have their own ordinance or if they will choose to be under the county ordinance. Do we need a motion for that public hearing? Set the date.
To set the date. I I'll make that motion. Was it the 12th? Um the fifth. Oh crap. The fifth is their next meeting. The fifth is the next meeting. Yeah. Okay. I'll make the motion then that we
have a public hearing after after our August 5th commissioner meeting on the marijuana cannabis ordinance. Second. have a motion in a second. Any more discussion on that? There's there's just a lot of little
things in this new law that the states came with that that need to be addressed. This ordinance is going to do it, but it's a there's a lot of lot of things in there that you normally wouldn't think about if you're just a normal out of the loop
citizen. So, we need to have this done. Okay. All in favor of the motion signify by saying I. I post. Committee updates. Budget and finance committee. Continuing on meeting with departments.
Okay. Building committee. Not anything with that. We haven't met in a while. No, but M gives us a pretty good update here. So, it's moving forward. Personnel committee. We haven't met in a while.
No. Highway Committee been here. Highway committee. Okay. So, the highway they finished uh the crosswalk painting. Uh you've probably seen them going
around the county doing that. Um they've finished the while they're on their second round of top cut mowing of the ditches. They rented an excavator digging out frost boils and regraveling on some of the trouble spot. Uh
county road 43 in Wendle is ongoing. We'll be finishing up some odds and ends over the next couple weeks in anticipation of paving at the end of the month. And then uh on the trunk highway 55, they're working on widening and
raising the highway while the water levels have been too high to put the culvert in yet. Hoping to install culverts next week if heavy rains stay away. uh culverts on cash highway 54 south of town here and two for the ditch
project have been installed. Uh the plan is uh uh paving tomorrow or Thursday out there. So then on County Road 34 by Pine Ridge Park, the western box culvert has been installed currently working on the
eastern uh culprit. So, they've been busy getting that stuff done. And uh other items received a couple the highway said they've received a couple
options for cash highway 5 and uh through Highway 55 intersection in Hoffman and then the highway committee will be reviewing those items if everybody's need. So that's the highway department but a committee update. Mr. Chair, let's
go back to the personnel if we can. We did hear a presentation from Integrity about paid family medical leave act. Yeah. Yeah. Um public safety team somewhere. We're going to get
information to Justin when the trial's done to get working on new city contracts. Did we have anything else for an update? No. No. We just we need to get going on
the on the contract so we can get it to the cities. Yep. Before they start their budgeting, which I'm sure they've already started, but somebody has. Yeah. solid waste for any
I think updated us in our prior discussion strategic planning committee meeting end of the month public health in public health we met yesterday um things are going
pretty smoothly uh Um they did uh talk about this new website that they got involved with it for people finding emotional depression problems. Uh but they fired it up in May there and
like 750 people had gone on to that website from the area for you know looking at it. out of that there was like 15 or 13 people I think that said they needed help right now and and then of course then there's
services that pop up on there. So out of those, you know, with that website there, I think that's a great deal because we all know that people fight depression and I've seen it a lot of that in the 31
years of policing here. So, and uh so that it was a $12,000 investment. Somebody asked if the board meeting is it worth it. Yeah, we we said if it helps one person, $12,000 is nothing because uh we run into these situations
every every year. Those five counties are people fighting depression and some of them take their own lives and you can help one person out, it's worth it. So, that that was a good good thing to see yesterday. So other than that, we're
they're doing okay. We're just kind of they were talking about that family medical leave, which is totally confusing to me, but uh you know, all the all the other organizations are talking about that, too. So, we'll see how that all pans out.
So, that's my report from there. Okay, that's it for the committee updates. Tina, do you have our autograph sheet for the bills? No. Okay.
Now we'll uh any more business for the commissioner meeting? We'll adjourn at uh 9:57 and we'll go into a work session. Okay. For the the work session for
today, it's uh it's just a discussion. There'll be no action. Um there'll be a handout by uh HR update by HR.
If you want to you want to speak you'll get five minutes. Uh keep in mind how union negotiations work. We work and what can and can't be discussed without representation for union groups.
And when all employees have had a chance to speak, we can do a question and answer for that. And uh the next steps the options are support the process following the appeal process use
personnel committee as always have in the past. Um if the process has changed what does that look like and any action motion have to be brought back to the next board meeting August
5th. Any questions? Hey Ashley. Um so I'll go over kind of our timeline of you know we started and where we're at and now that's part of your packet there. So September 3rd uh commissioners
approved option five of the DBA proposal which would be you know the full package job description the you know wages all of that. So, it was the full package from DDA. Uh, September 5th, we had a kickoff meeting with DDA. First down
committee did. September 6th, all job descriptions, union contracts, titles, and grades were submitted to DDA and spreadsheets with employee information. Uh, September 30th, meeting with DDA to discuss the PAQs. October 2nd, an email was sent out to all department heads with the PAQ template to share with
their staff. Um, and so then in red is what the email was. October 16th, the deadline to submit the completed PAQs to HR. Uh October 22nd, PAQs were sent to the personnel committee. October 30th, personnel committee met to review the
PAQs. They did that on the 30th and the 31st. November 5th, the personnel company met with the department head that requested discuss. November 12th, personnel with the VA to discuss the PAQ structure and process. Uh November 18th, a phone call with the
DA to discuss the PAQ. November 19th, personnel committee with met with county auditor to discuss edits. November 20th, we gathered um surrounding counties wages to compare. January 16th, the personnel committee met with the DDA to
review plan. And then DDA continues to collect data for surrounding counties there to call 2026 data. March 17th, personnel with DDA. March 21st, county received completed job descriptions.
Uh, April 25th, meeting with DDA. May 8th, meeting with DDA to discuss department head presentation. June 4th, the department head meeting. Uh, DDA, we did an overview of the development of the job study, benchmarks, and discussion of the new structure. Job descriptions were sent out to all department heads with a deadline of June
11th to review. That same day, job descriptions had missing information that we had that department heads and um personnel committee had found. job job descriptions were sent out to department heads to review to make those corrections. Uh June 6th through June 11th, job descriptions collected from
department heads were forward to the personnel committee to review and then on to DDA. Uh June 11th through the 16th, DDA reviewed and revised job descriptions. June 17th, DDA uh to represent the wage to the board. and
June 26, an email um the wage scale, the DDA PowerPoint presentation, position analysis, and updated description to department heads to share with their staff. And again, that draft is as well of what was sent. Uh June 27th, an email
was sent to the department heads informing them of the appeals process. The email indicated the request to appeal. The information was Wednesday the 2nd. Uh June 2nd, the request to appeal was due. If requested, HR are sent out the appeal information.
Um then July 11 10th, an email was sent out to all employees regarding the appeal process. If decided to allow and it was decided to allow employees to appeal both the grade and the job description. July 15th, department heads um today is
the deadline for the appeals for um to get the employees appeals to their um department heads to review and the department heads have a deadline of today to get their appeals to HR. The department heads have three weeks to review their employees appeals. So
August 5th is the deadline for that. Um and so that was sent out. Um that's the timeline of kind of where we started, where we're at now. Um and so the information that was sent out to our employees was the wage study um or the the board approved wage scale, the
PowerPoint, the position analysis which was explained that um it was determined by the current market values found in the study when looking at the benchmarks if a classification that was not on the spreadsheet. It was because there were less than three counties that certification to BDA to all positions
were classified based on data collected BDA's classification formula EQs that were submitted as well as market trends. Um and so that was an email that was sent out. So that's where we are today.
just a question make sure I heard that sentence or statement when you said less than three what what did you say there so on the position analysis what JD explained to me is that when they go and collect data from other counties um if they receive
less than three counties they're not comparing to the county so they're going off the PBPAQ list in the data market trends if they that didn't occur though there were some Yep So, the ones that were not on the position analysis that
didn't they didn't receive enough data from other counties doesn't mean they weren't classified. It's just they didn't have that information to compare to. Um, the county treasurer, assistant county attorney, assistant environmental services administrator, investigator, license bureau director, dispatch records supervisor, office manager,
account tech, dispatch l and 911 coordinator, heavy equipment operator, cadet, and recycling attendant. Those were the ones that were not on the position analysis but were classified. So I just explained why they weren't on that spreadsheet that you have anything else, Ashley?
Okay. Um, anybody wants to uh talk? They can go ahead. Somebody can start. So, what I got five minutes? Yeah. Okay. So one of the things that came up
uh with the new wda is it was presented to us that we had a wage scale and also a new grade. Something missing from it is the points um that have always been taken in consideration by making the decision the
steps for the job title. U we've been told that that's proprietary to DDA so it cannot be released. Um, I got a problem with that because that's part of the decision that is being made when it comes to where we fall on grades and steps.
Now, if in fact it is proprietary, then how is it that employees of this county have it regardless of their position um and cannot release it? So,
that to us as a group is an issue. Um, I took it upon myself to look at the 32 positions uh studied in in a in the study and find that 10 of the positions within the county go backwards
and pay it physically lose pay uh with grade and steps. And then overall when it comes to all the positions within Grant County um the sheriff's office uh combined uh loses
the most as far as when it comes to uh where we fall for increases and um our chief deputy position is the uh biggest loser.
Poor wording when it comes to the amount of money that that position would now lose with the new study uh without much of an explanation when it comes to it. I understand that there's uh comparisons
with the counties are um in our opinion, in my opinion as well, kind of a lot of whack uh when it comes to um using those as comparisons. And so that's a request from from the group. Um I believe that some of you
have been giving uh what I had prepared, what Jen had prepared when it came through. some of the information and we also learned too that a lot of the information that we're
sitting here reviewing was never uh given to or the commissioners were not aware of it my understanding. So that raises the question is how are we making decisions on the process of accepting wage scales grades and steps when the
commissioners were not aware of the steps and graves presented. Can I ask you a question, John? Yes, sir. Okay. This point, you got to bring me along on that and you talk about primary information. Help me out with that comment.
So, the last study that that was done by the county. Um, one of the things presented to us is called the Grand County Title and Grade. and that that study each grade and position is is
given a point system and those points are then based off of you know what your title is and where your grade falls. It's our understanding that DDA also have the title and grades point system but according
to what we've been told that's proprietary and cannot be released or are reviewing also the understanding that the points are part of you know how the grades are determined and where they fall. So
without the point system for us to look at how can we agree that a step in a grade on the new through DDA is even accurate. So that's that's a question that that we have.
So let me interrupt again. if you would. What's our explanation for that? It's a recommendation from DDA. DDA would have to explain that. Yeah. Okay. But there's got to be more. I I think he raises something that is important. What's the answer to that?
Well, part of the part of the issue is and and I know that we have to look at we can talk about the person. We've been told that time and time again. We can talk about the person. you got to look at the the position and I guess it is what it
is when it comes to that. Okay. Um but if we're being told that we as employees cannot see the points that is proprietary to DDA and the only
persons that have access to those points are the negotiating committee and the personnel committee. How does that how does that make any sense? Because it just so happens that some of those people on those committees
are also employees of Grant County minus the board members, okay? But they're also employees of Grant County, okay? It happens to be that you know some of those positions one sees a a a bigger increase in steps
and again the position sees an increase in a grade in steps. Okay, we understand that. But if we're talking about fairness as far as looking at a point system and trying to come up with a reasoning behind what has been presented to us so
far, then how is it okay that those committee members who also are employees minus the board members have access to the points if it's proprietary to a DDA. We want to see the points the union
groups I and I can't speak for the union. I'm not in the the unions want to see those films. They want to see the full study. They want to understand how it is that DDA came to the point in which we're all at right now. And you know, as you can see, there's a number
of people in this room, um, employees of this county who are concerned about how this study has been done and where it's going because there's a considerable amount of money that's being lost to higher up positions within this county, but there's also higher up positions and
titles in the county that gain significantly. So we're you know when we talk about transparency need that's what you know I think all of us as a group the concerned um are
asking for that's all that's what I have really anything to say or well we got to have an Sir, we can't just sit here and disr Well, it's open for discussion or at least have a discussion.
That's and I understand there's no decision to be made today. I understand that was put on laid out there to begin with, but it's just it just was a bad feeling. So if I may,
so if you commence the hire like a DDA David and it addresses the physicians and obviously the salary piece, would the outcome be different if we
didn't do it? In other words, is this process beneficial to independently to each of us? Because I think everyone got an opport this phe or whatever that acronym everybody got an opportunity
because of the opportunity. Do we collectively feel that it is better or worse or would we would we be better never doing that piece? I think the general consensus is the PAQs
um turned out worse. Um there was a lot of things he accused that were not considered in um at the end I don't believe per
position. Um I know that Chen has got some but additional information regarding that things that were never taken into consideration and again not only for positions within my office countywide. Um and some of you do have that sheet
that uh prepared as far as the gains and losses and and employees and the departments. So, um yeah, I I think the the PAQs were not available to the people with
the county because parts of those PAQs were not taken into consideration. Jennifer could explain that more. Just for instance, our public safety telecommunicators, we um gave them a PA of job description.
It came back completely different. It actually matched one of the 13 counties that um I don't I think the personnel committee chose the 13 counties. I don't even think it went to the board. Um but they
actually took one of the 13 counties. um PAQs from their dispatch job descriptions and use that. Well, we are completely different than that county. And so that was that was our new PAQ and that was wrong. So obviously we
appealed it again because our telecommunicators do a lot more than just regular dispatch in other counties. So once again, Mr. If it if it's flawed
and these are professional, how did we get here? Right. I'm not trying to put anyone on the spot because this is the work session and I feel that communication is really good. How did we get here? Who's who should
answer to the administr room? I wasn't in the room. So, we're at the stage, right, of appealing our PAQs. Okay. I mean, that's where we're at. I realize the weight
scale was released, but we don't have a PAQ done to collect all of our points. So, if the PAQ changes through the appeal process, that grade may change, right? That we don't know that final until we get through the appeal process.
I have a question, Mr. Chair. On the appeal process, who looks at the appeal? Who does that when when the employees like uh I think today or something, they have to have that help done or something to their
department head? But who who reviews the appeals and who makes the decision? This one should come up for this one's okay or who who does that? So the process right now is that all um employee PAQs must be into the department head today.
The department heads have to be into HR today. They have three weeks. August 5th is a deadline for all PAQs to be in. At that point the personnel committee will look and also will send a DDA. DDA will look at that because they have to factor in all the information that was sent in to put into their system to look at that
to to come to determination if there is an adjustment. Okay. So then that well how could we at this point how could we even trust PDA when uh as the example our our dispatchers you know they pull a PAQ from a from a county
that chosen by the personnel committee and submit that as the grade and pay scale for our dispatchers here then how can we even trust to put any of that back in PDA's hand for them to make a decision on whether that position should
be lowered or raised in scale grade because they they've already taken information that that individual specific employee has provided in the PAQ saying this is what I do or this is what
we do as a dispatcher and then P then EDA says no you no you don't this is what you do based on this county who has no idea what we're doing here and then submits it how can we move forward
trusting ing that DGA is going to give the appropriate answer to the job description and the and the duties specific for that job. When we got our job descriptions from them, there were so many mistakes on it. So, we said
there's mistakes. We'll fix them and send them back in and we'll fix them again. Still come back with mistakes. Well, they have all of our information. Should not be right the first time. should not be accurate. So looks really they have the prior job
des if a job didn't change why I mean we asked the employee in this PAQ process why are we why did it get screwed up? Well, I I think I think it, you know,
it may be understandable. You know, you've got two different, you know, the last place that did any job studies was was Springstead, right? You got two different two different entities. Now, that Springst
totally different company, DDA. So, they may look at things differently. So, part of that in a sense is understandable. they may have a different form to look at or or you know so again that's possibly
understandable but you know so much of the frustration has come when when we were able to listen in on one of the Zoom meetings where where Mark was presenting um you know the question came
up when the numbers came out as the grades and scales is well you know gez Mark you know people are going backwards. People are actually losing money. And we're not talking, you know, a couple cents, you know, some people are losing, you know, $5 an hour on pay.
And the exact comment was, "Nobody's going backwards. Nobody's losing pay." That's what DDA said. I don't know what numbers they're looking at. I'm not I'm not sitting here fighting for my position or for my my scale. Um
I'm speaking for I guess Kelly as a whole as our my office goes to like I said because we are the bottom of the list out of all the employers in Grant County. They're the top loser when it
comes to the chief deputy pay and um I know everybody they don't give us room from various departments all have the same concerns. So I got another question Troy. You said that we're in the appeals process.
That's each individual can do an appeal. That'd be accurate. So, are they appealing what I'm hearing that DDA did, which could be flawed, what I'm hearing, or are they appealing what their job
desertion was and what they submitted on the PHAQ? Because obviously there's a gap. Do we have to close the gap before you can have a legitimate appeal? There's two different forms that I had sent out when we decided to do appeal, the grade, and the job description. So there's one that is the classification,
which is the grade and job description, and there's a form that's just the job description. So if there's discrepancies or something that's not accurate, they could put in that appeal of what they feel needs to be changed or looked at. Um, as far as the grade, the classification, they can explain why
they feel that their grade is not accurate and explain that process. So the PQ, the questionnaire, that that information is then pulled in the form of the job description. So you ask me which one I mean really you're appealing bulbits
the PAQ is like underneath the job description that's how they you get there but if I if took a respective employee and if their job didn't change significantly which I think in a lot of cases they probably did right we're still a county
of 6325 whatever it is their jobs probably didn't change so why Did that change? I feel like we're kind of chasing our tail here a little bit. And so are we
appealing something that shouldn't even have changed and we're kind of putting it in the hands of the employee. I I'm mixed up. I'm sorry. Safety telecommunicator are dispatch. We're records clerks too.
Every one of them 50% of their job is records clerking. they took from a different county. It's almost the exact same job description of just public safety telemeter. When I showed it to
one of ours, they said, "So, I don't have to do all these other jobs anymore?" And I'm like, "No, no, you do. I don't know why that job description says that you don't." But, I mean, it took away half of their jobs. So, who's
going to do that? I mean, it it was absolutely wrong. And for the hours we spent on those PAQs, that's just trend. It's almost like the job descriptions were copied and pasted from somewhere
else, not even looked at before they got sent to us. I also want to add that 13 counties that were chosen. I don't think DVA is taking into effect that Some of these counties
um they offer incentive like incentive pay or retention pay. Um some of these I I can speak on behalf of law enforcement. Um some of these counties that were chosen received5 to $10,000
for deputy retention. Um dispatch received $10,000 and I think a twoyear span. Um DDA is not taking into effect. they just call them up and say, "Hey, what's your top wage of disposition and that's what they take, but they don't take into effect
like maybe they're receiving since these are lower counties lower paid counties that were chosen. I don't think they're taking into effect like the benefits that they are receiving, they may receive a lot more in health insurance. They may receive more on call time. Um,
it's not based off of 2080 hours. Our deputies don't work 280 hours. We work 143 hours more at the same rate. I mean, I don't I don't think they're taking into effect everything that these counties are offering. There's more
benefits that these counties are offering because they have a lower wage. So I that's that was an appeal on every one of our positions out of Grant County. I want to go back to when John was
talking about the point system and we don't have the points. We can't see them. So there's three guys here that were all separate classified. They're all different job descriptions. They were all different grades before. Now they all got looped into one grade.
That's they're all going to get paid the same now. The same the same. Okay. You know, now it's so there's different responsibilities and different roles that each one of them do. But do I agree they should all get paid the exact same? No, I don't think that's
right either. So I think there's there's something missing there. They're not looking at it properly. So I got a question actually in the form committee. Would you say their intent
was to have this outcome? Well, was this DDA DDA's plan? I I just can't believe that this board and and our perspective people purposely have got us here. I don't you got to defend yourself because I'm
hearing what I'm hearing and I just it's kind of concerning. So is this DDA's strategy or was it all works? So, this is DDA's project, you know, so we gave them the information that they needed and that they that they requested
they go through their process, right? So, there are some questions that I had received that I asked EDA because Mark couldn't be here. I wanted him to be online to talk um but he was in another county. So, some of the questions that we did that I was asked is why did the min and max for some of the positions in
the county decrease? his response that he said I could share as DDA conducted an extensive market study using comparison counties agreed upon by the board to determine what the market pays for your positions. When DDA was evaluating the positions using a jet system and placing them into the grade,
he made sure that looked at for all jobs in the county that the county was paying competitively compared to the market. Unfortunately, that meant that some positions were were paid highly competitively did see a decrease in their minimum and max. This does not mean that the employee losses loses any
actual pay, just the potential earnings in the future could be reduced. If the county would like to ensure that everyone sees an increase in their min and max, we can provide a structure that would accomplish this, but it could cost it would cost several hundred thousands of dollars above the current cost modeling. The second question that I
asked him to answer was, why the question is, why is my grade different? I used to be in the same grade grade as another job. like if someone's looking at the the grid. Um DDA uses our proprietary check system to evaluate positions. This this system examines a
job from seven different factors and is more comprehensive and inclusive than other evaluation systems. The number of grades within the county is also changing. So it is really a completely different way of managing compensation that what was used before. As a result,
comparisons against the previous structure would be difficult. So those are some of the the questions that you know we had received and I wanted to get an answer from him. Of course he couldn't be here today. Um and so that was his explanation on that. So
everybody aware of the jet system. Should we tell these people what it is? So the jet system is the DDA scent. I can read it off to you. Qualifications, decision making, problem solving, relationships, effort, mental
and physical, hazard, and environment. So somebody applied those seven items to you people. So we should talk about that. I just don't know how you can pick a grade when you don't like if you're
going off of our job descriptions and the PAQs, how do you even choose a grade if you don't even have the job description even close to it, right? Like it's so far off. One of my biggest concerns with this
study is that it was bad data that put bad in bad comes out. Um my review of it u looking at the pure counties that were used some of one of which was Kdison County which is right right next to Canada.
It's three and a half hour drive from here. Um and counties were put in our peer group that shouldn't have been in there. It didn't match. It only matched some of them only matched 40% of what DDA's criteria was
for creating a peer group. We lose deputies constantly and have for many many years to Douglas Ottertale Alec and Fergus P. And while some of the
reasons may change, but there's always a general one. You guys aren't competitive. you're not paying me. I can go there, change my uniform and do the exact same job for a heck of a lot more money. Now, when I
look at the criteria that was used to create the peer group, Ottertale and Douglas hit four out of the five criteria that we used were 80%. However, they were not used in this study. Like I said, other counties with a 40% match
rate were used. This in turn leads to bad data which in turn leads to a failure rate of the study of approximately 50%. In my opinion that if the study has failed I mean if we were in grade school
50% is an apple. This the study in general has a failure rate which in turn gives us all bad data all bad job descriptions. In my opinion, this study was a failure.
I was born and raised in Kinson County. It's not representative grant. I can tell you that. Well, the question raised the question of who is who is the one who is responsible for picking those counties to
compare to Grant. I don't think it was board. Correct. I can't answer that. State. No. PDA picked. I mean, VA picked Hitson County is on there. Yeah. Because they're five below us in population.
Yeah, you're right. You just can't go off population. You got to look at individual descriptions for those county employees and judge off of that versus population. Well, if my job went by population and I only served county, I don't I serve I
have customers coming from Douglas, Otterale, Stevens, Co. I have customers coming from Ramsey and Henipin County just for driver's test just for driver's testing, time transfers, tapping, everything. So if you're going to judge my office just by Grant County,
it's you can't I don't service just Grant County. I service Grant County and a lot of surrounding counts and a lot of the offices in mind. You have private offices. You have city-owned. You have county owned. You
have stateowned. Yeah. You know, I mean, I'm a county owned office, but they're privately owned ones. Morris is privately owned. We have cityowned ones. You have stateowned ones.
It's a variety. Well, Mr. Chair, I received an email that that kind of paints a quite a picture here, and I'd like to read this a little bit. I think the board needs to take a deeper look of the hierarchy of the wage study done by ADA. I find it hard to believe that the duties of the
sheriff are less than that of the coordinator. The auditor or the duties of the auditor are the same as the HR director. There are several positions that top pay grade 13 hourly rate was reduced. In the spirit of attracting and
retaining staff, this seems to fall short of the objective. So, I think it's important to probably recognize that the people involved necessarily didn't do this on purpose. I
don't know that we should throw anybody individually under the bus. Is that maybe DDA this process is flawed. I troubled that we have July 15th as a deadline and why we're there is irregardless but we have some issues in
the room that I think need be resolved and how we get there I think we should try to focus on an outcome that's positive and productive and
and so we can move forward and have some semblance agreement cuz it doesn't feel that appear that we have that now and um it's just too bad EDA wasn't here to represent themselves
because I think they have some answering to do but it's a it's a third of your employees are actually going backwards that's a lot and if you want to retain employees I just don't think this should
go forward a third. That's a lot of people and a lot of them are permanent. My question is why do we spend the money to hire these agencies when I think our county is capable of doing it themselves? Figure out how we should get our races or where it should be at, what
they should say. They know us better than anybody without an entity that is a third party. Yeah. The to say that this needs to be here or there or that gets to be other counties do it.
Most other counties I talked to use DDA. Mr. Chair, I got So, okay. So, we're sitting here today discussing this, which is good. So, but we need to see how this appeal process works out
and we need to see how the DDA takes a look at those appeals and redo this for what they come with. And then my question is when they finally come with what they finally come with,
what can the board do about it if we disagree with some of that stuff? and we say no, this is going to go into a higher step or or what can we do? It's uh that's my question here because uh you know I just we just need to see what
what they're going to come with before we can do anything else as far as I'm concerned. So we've already seen what they come with though. No, when they when they look at the appeal, there's going to be some recategorizing I would think on appeal.
I don't know, maybe not. But if it isn't, then we'll know that. So, seems seems like I don't plan on filing an appeal for me personally, but uh seems like the appeal process is very
important here as the next step. And that can't, you know, I hear a lot of the employees here say that, you know, they we're comparing apples to pineapples. you just can't do that, you know. So, I think it's important for
appeals to list, you know, these are the counties that I was compared to these two are totally off face. I would recommend that you use this and this for my department. You know, for example, you know, some departments may be have
Ottertale County in their comparison. Well, if I used Ottertale County for mine, u you know, they would blow me away. I wouldn't want Ottertale County as my comparison. So, but using the same counties across rubber stamp across all
departments is not is not fair. So, but where you're at in the process, I think if your appeal, you know, in the dispatcher's case, if your appeal stated, you know, job description's wrong, here's why. Because it only accounts for 50% of my
job. Here's another county that is similar, more similar to Grant County. Maybe it's clear across the state. They all know, but maybe they're clerks to um you know, the records as well. Please use this county as a comparison for my
department. That's just a recommendation we've had. Write ship, if you will. If you know the highway department is getting off base and they're they don't feel that Kisonson County is a comparative example, you know, let them
put bonus on them and say, "Okay, well you tell me which county is similar is my two cents to respond to that. Rob, I would warn that I don't know that we we're going to have everybody's going to have different counties, right? So we're going to go find the ones that are paying the
highest. And if you're going to rep Douglas and Ottertale, you're going to have to show where we're comparing ourselves to them elsewhere cuz yes, we live next to Douglas and we live next to Ottertale, but they're not anywhere like as you referenced, you know, I I'm not going to sit here and
say it's an issue and tell you that they're much larger Douglas and Otter and in my office they are the competition. It breaks my heart over the years that my office has now become the stepping
stone office. We have lost so many people to those guys. They can go there, they take a big pay bump and I have a lot of friends that work in those departments and over the years jokingly they'll make comments to me about, hey, I got I see you got a new hire. Yeah, sure do. Oh, they turning out really
good. Like them. It's going to be awesome. Cool. Well, you got them ready for us to pick up yet. and then all a sudden they're gone. They are the number one competition for talent in this county. Um we I say our
county spends a tremendous amount of money training people. You know, there's a lot of post mandates that have to happen um post lure and unfortunately what happens is we'll spend the money on them, get their post
license up and running, get them through all the training, they get a couple of years on and they bounce and they're gone. And then we start the process over again. And our department keeps getting younger and younger and younger because of that. And right now
we're on trajectory to have to be a very a very young department. And approximately six years approximately six years all your old guys like me will be retired. And now we're going to have a lot of young guys. And that's a little that concerns me. We don't have that
experience because they're leaving. We don't recruit from Douglas. We don't recruit from Lauderdale. I've never once seen a dispatcher, a cop come from either of those colonies to come here because they never will. They just won't take that pay cut to do it.
You got something, Mr. Chair? Yeah. Like Kenny said, okay, when I was young in ' 86, when I started with the county, I could have left, okay, because there was better pay around. We all knew that. better facilities, you know, no on call
and but I I decided to stay. Langley stayed, comb stayed, Remington stayed. So, we're lucky for that. But, uh but these other counties, they do pull pull our resources. So, you know, but the bottom line is
that some decided to stay because they're, you know, yeah, we could have made more money other places, but uh we stayed and but but this is a problem where where we do lose our good personnel and uh you know, it's more and
more as time goes by that that are that are get trained in here that they they move on. So, yeah. So it's it's something we have to look at there. And within the last year or two, we were kind of neck and neck with the wages of
Ottertale and and Douglas. And now we're we're just with this new study, we're falling way below. Like I just I just I think this study is flawed in many ways. I like a buck and a half
including my longevity and 23 years. you had to talk about the appeals process. So I get a question in this process with DDA. Shouldn't we have the respective staff member agreed to the desript the job
description and not have somebody tell them what their job is? Wouldn't that Well, we we've already done these job descriptions. We've already given it to them. Why did they something completely different? Okay. I mean, to me, that's
the kind of the starting point, right? Well, our current job descriptions, you know, as they were asked, the first were submitted and they're telling us, no, that's not your job. Yeah, that's telling you that this is
what your job is. And so, that's what that kind of works. And then it's like, well, who are they to tell me what my job is here at Grant County? So, Mr. Chair, I got a question. Do we
agree with that? Yes or no? Why don't we answer that for these people? We agree with Do we agree that they told these people what their job was? That was correct. Yes or no?
Well, we're in the process of appealing those job descriptions, right? I understand that. We're not here. The board is not I understand, but I'm not and I'm not throwing anybody under. I'm saying, do we agree that they changed it? That got
us to the appeal process. And if we do agree that, why don't we go back to square one and say, don't take what they changed to try to appeal. take what they had or is it
well we did so the first round we got them back and there were many issues and I had my conversations and frustrations with DD as well and had conversations that they need to be changed so we sent the job descriptions back out to the department heads and the employees and
told them to look at them over add what you need to add and we'll send them back to DDA and then they added what is to my knowledge and I hadn't heard from any other department that there is was information that departments had
included that wasn't added in there um to what they had highlighted or edited what they wanted in there and so then those came back and were sent back out. Mr. Commissioners, I I got to get up to ash at 11 o'clock, but just before I leave, I want to thank you all for
listening to me today and the rest of us. I'd like to stay, but I'm going to be late already. So, thank you for your time. Thank you. This is Chad. Can you guys hear me? I would just like to add going back to the PAQs
when they were originally submitted to the personnel committee, those PAQs as written. Um, some of those were also edited by the personnel committee before they were
submitted. So that again raised the whole question. Who is deciding what what Pat's job is? DDA and personnel committee who's deciding what my job is. Anybody's
jobs if if personnel committee is making changes to the PAQs be I mean I I can't sit here and tell anybody what job is. I can't can I tell you what Tina's job is or
Ashley's or my job is or something? I can't. I don't know. So what what makes DDA say this is what your job is and what what makes the personnel
committee decide what individual's jobs are based on the information that employee submitted for the PAQs and then again showing your transparency if we don't even know what actually was sent to the DDA.
Because what in my mind what we spent hours on on the PAQs were getting sent to the DDA. But if things were changed and taken out, that's disheartening too because we should we should have gotten a copy of what was sent out that because
then we don't I mean it's flawed from the beginning in our eyes. That information Yep. So personnel committee met if there were any changes those changes were sent to the department heads to approve before they were sent to DBA. They done come back. So that's fine.
Yeah. Ashley, when was the the last wage study done with Springstead? What year was that? 2016. Okay. I don't remember anything, you know, that was disheartening in that study.
Oh, yeah. There was there I got in on the implementation part, not the actual EAQ and where we're at currently. It was just the implementation and yes, it was the same thing if you have job classifications that are on the top and
they're going down. It it was the same then and we could have told you back and we started this what September of last year that there would have been job classifications that were going down. Dwight, you were involved in how many? That's not uncommon that there's job classifications that go up and there's
job classifications that go down. I don't remember any of the feedback from the county employees that was to this degree though, but maybe you guys did. I I didn't ever on the personnel side of it. Well, there might be a difference with the classification versus
if a person's going to move forward. There's a difference. And I know that in question here amongst many of the coming boys is some are the the grade whether it went up or down and then others is obviously the wage
whether it went up or down. And the biggest question is you know why did some of the positions see such a minimal minimal increase? I mean we're talking like 18 versus as high as $10.95 an hour
increase. uh you know so it was a combination of many things the rate the wage and the steps just going back to what we said Bill you
know maybe the positions may have been questioned but u there's always been that fight that an employee is never going to go backwards in their wage And that seems to be one of the major
things here today as well. And as that indicated earlier, they all know that the unions are now involved in this and that's verified for too. So, Mr. chair would we got to give the
appeal process back the way he said do we need to identify him date to get that piece resolved because I think unless we get that piece resolved I don't know the comparison can't really
take the next step the first like Rob said if comparing apples to pineapples and these people know what their jobs But what do we do, Troy? What do you want?
Well, if I was sitting in one of those chairs, I would be able like to be able to stand up and explain that I my job really hasn't significantly changed. Here it is. Forget EDA. They can apply it to the
wage piece, but the job piece is wrong. this is what I do. That's what can be. But if so, if you're going to apply that the the job title or description to the
wage, it has to be comparable because the way it's sounding just the dispatchers, for example, half their job is not in the job description. So, they should they're not getting paid as much, but
then you get a higher another set of employees cover what they're not doing. It's in the old job description though. The new job descriptions, right? But I mean, if you're going to go off the old or the new job descriptions,
they're not accurate to begin with, right? We got to get them accurate. Say, they weren't all accurate. We came from We've been there. It's been there and done that. Yeah. Get it accurate. Yeah. Yeah, we went through the whole process to get them to what we thought
were accurate and they come and they change it to what they think is correct is not right. That doesn't show any trust in their system. And that's what I was saying. That's what we need to fix. But moving forward now, you have just
given everybody all of your employees because all of your employees received this. So onethird of your employees, they're upset and they're not going to trust anything that goes forward. And I think the morale is just this far. It it
has and I, you know, based on market values. Well, okay. And today's day, law enforcement, it's a very competitive. So if you're going to take DA's word, say, "Oh, I'm sorry. the deputies or
investigators, they're going to make a 17 cent on the top end. Like, what is that? That's not being competitive at all. And like I've told most of you, you will have a lawless county.
We don't want that. And you know, highways really affected. Have a county without a highway department. Yeah. It's not good. I mean, I just think we have to
I think we've shown that DDA has not done their job in the beginning and if we're going to continue to go with him, everyone's going to have they're going to put their guard up. You don't lose money going into a pace that he had.
Yeah. Well, you know, Jennifer and I both, you know, we attend a number of conferences through the year. uh Minnesota Sheriff's Association and you know always hot topics right now is uh jails department of corrections
and then it's also about detention recruitment. So it's a hot topics whether there a topic within uh a conference or afterwards or before a conference it's always a conversation piece and I know at the latest summer
conference that we both attended um again talk about retention and recruitment wages wage studies and the general consensus amongst many many offices sheriff's offices throughout the
state uh whose counties used TVA. Uh it was uh very very poor, very poor, not uh happy with the with decisions made by the D by DDA recommended not to utilize them.
So, and that's not obviously our decision. That was decision back last year to to use something different. I don't know if it's it doesn't seem like they're too well uh well like here in the state of Minnesota.
John, did you send me email me which counters those were that decided not to use EDA to not use EDA? Why I said they used EDA? and we're not having Oh, I thought they heard you say that there was counties that decided not to.
After they got to a certain point, they stopped. I I think they're probably experiencing what what we're experiencing at this. So, on the salary piece, help me out, Ashley. and what you handed us a a salary study aside from the
descriptions. Let's forget that they're wrong in some cases. But on the low end, it was 3.5% increase on step. In the middle range, it was 3% and 2.5 and then the last was two. So,
and if I'm right, they would get that say within the middle seven years, they would get a 3% increase plus a cola if that was negotiated. Right. So, this this is the percentage in between steps. Yeah. So
it's I don't know if you do a wage if it's intended necessary for everybody's salary to go up this the steps in a sense do that with the cola or negotiations or whatever and so uh I guess
but I also don't think you know way study to go backwards so I hear that um but I still say we got to get the descriptions correct And so we're make sure we're applying it's not apples to the pineapples etc.
But the system is in place for everyone to get an increase. Actually took a decrease and that's something we got we got to look at the description side once you
apply the chart. It's not intended to I don't think DDA purposely tries to drive down the wage item. But if you're you're you're told you're going to get this last year because you got this new wage that comes out and at the end this is what you're supposed to
make and that's what you're working for and now you're going to take that away. I mean that doesn't make a lot of sense. And I and I get that maybe it shouldn't be where it's at, but
you shouldn't show 13 years old either. So then when you hit seven years, you basically are going to get the most out of the company that you're going to get. Like it's pretty hard to say retention. Oh, now you're going to only get 2%. Because you've been here for seven years. Like, well, we dedicated this
much time to you and now we're going to less. You have loyal employees that are staying here. How are you what are you going to do to to help them stay here? I know it's a process when you got to train in a new person
every every time you turn around. You know, you get somebody that's good and they leave and then you get the next person, they're good, they leave. The amount of time it takes me to train
a person doesn't just decrease the amount of time. So, I work for the sheriff's office. So, it doesn't just we're not just down a deputy. I'm also put at a loss during that time because I
can't stretch myself as far as I could go in my job because a lot of my focus is put on training that individual. So the extra services that I normally provide, the the above and beyond moments are now spent training that newer deputy and then you
know if I have to train somebody new in a year or two um that process is months in training and even then they're still new. They're still coming to me with questions. Again, this is Chad again. I'd like to
go back to the comment you made about everyone still going to receive an increase in a step. That is an inaccurate statement. Well, the chart no placement on the what he's saying is that placement on the chart from where
they are to where they would be placed. They would be there's one individual that's redlined. Oh, but I was just saying, Chad, that the the wages in the chart from up to it's got 13, there is an increase each year.
I don't know if I missed you, misunderstood me, or unless you're already off the chart. Look at the auditor's line item. I'm at step 13 in the current pay. The new wage scale says step 13 is a $2 or
$3 loss. Someone want to comment to chat? It is what it is. That's what it you know he's right. I think we could probably sit here all day and just have a little bit of discussion about it. Um, but I I think
that I think the the board or that realize that you know there's certainly uh an issue here that employee of the county has have raised
regarding concerns and guess the bottom line is they were just Everybody's asking for some reconsideration here and uh kind of working through the process waiting for these appeals to go through.
We seem to dev back having the open conversation work session study session so we can work through this as a group um instead of just handful of people making a decision for the entire county when it comes to employing. So,
anybody else got anything? Where are we at on the appeals? If if you don't have them in and you're not going to, make sure to let Ashley know. Don't just not get it in if you intend to, but you're not going to get it done. So, we know there, you know, the intent
is there, right? And just to let everybody know that you can appeal on the classification of the title, right? It's the appeal is the classification. So that's great and job description both. And I guess the department heads I think
we have a big job on our hands right now because we're trying to keep the burden. So that's a lot. That's a lot. So, have you received since today is the deadline, have there been a significant amount of appeals?
Um, a handful. I wouldn't say a lot, but I've received Yes. some. Well, it's just the department heads. So, department heads are to me today. Employees are to give their appeals to the department heads today. And then the department heads have three weeks to
review their staff's appeals until August 5th. And then the appeals get sent to DDA and DDA has 10 days to uh a response unless they would like an extension depending on how many appeals there are.
Okay. So the deadline for everything is at the 50 today. That is just for the department heads to get their appeals to me and the employees to get their appeals to their department heads to review. I think DDA celt by, you know, the dispatchers job description is that
screwed up. You know, sheriff and his team, they don't have visibility on every county in the state or across the country, if you will, on on those all those job descriptions. They have a responsibility, in my opinion, to come
back and say, "Oh, well, here's a county up in northeastern Minnesota that does pretty much exactly what you do. Maybe we should help them uh as a comparison rather than somebody that doesn't match, you know."
So, I think they should be helping as well to help match up Johnes. Well, Mr. Chair, I want to thank Tina and Ashley for actually putting something together for on the agenda here and so we had a work session so we
could actually, you know, air out some concerns and make sure everybody's voices are heard. So, you know, I I appreciate you guys putting this together. And I think it's important, you know, just just to, you know, retain employees and let you guys have your
voice because you everybody needs that regardless of your your hire department or sheriff or department head or whoever, right? So, it was good that we did this and I think it's I think something good can come from this. We
got to we got to take a deeper look into the into this thing. sold after the the appeals process and I guess we'll go from there. That's the next step, right? Mr. Chair, I got some.
Okay. I echo Bill statement there. Um, but I know a little bit about the sheriff's department in Grant County and it is unique how that office runs compared to other counties in the state because
dispatcher is not only a dispatcher, they're typing reports, they're filing uh, you know, reports, they're they're doing all sorts of things across the board. And if if if their job description just says that they were
they're just dispatchers who are vitally important, then that's not accurate and that's not not a good deal. So, um, it's just Grant County is a unique count and with law enforcement,
yeah, you probably aren't going to stop them all from moving just because you pay them because other counties, you don't have any on call. You're done. You you can you can uh go do what you want to. in Grant County, if the crap hits
the fan, they're calling off duty deputies to come in and help because there's you need to help. So that that's not going to change. And some people don't like to be on call. They don't like to be bothered when they're when they're off duty. They they don't want
their cell phone on. They don't want none of that on. And in big counties, you're fine. You can go do that. Not in Grand County. you know, the highway department, they helped us out so much when uh during these blizzard and road
conditions and hazard, you know, they they were always willing to come. It's unique. The bigger counties, I don't know how they run, you know, like the Henipans and the Ramsies with their they probably don't have the they have roads, but it's just different out here. And uh
but that's what makes Grant County good too and unique because we always work together. So So yeah, I'm not overly impressed with DDA. Um we'll just have to see how the appeal process goes and uh take a look at it
then. Um I'm not impressed that they changed job descriptions from this county at all. And uh I don't know if they did that with the highway department people too. I don't know, you know, I guess you guys seeing what they come back with,
but but anyway, uh that's my two cents, but we got to see what they're going to do. And uh yeah, I'd like to have that guy. I wish he would have been on today. It would have been kind of interesting here. You know, some some good questions would
have been answered. So, um but anyway, that's where I'm at. And then I the only other thing I got is like Chad's comment. He's been here like I don't know. He'd been here forever, I guess. But this chart is up to third step 13. So after that, if somebody had all of
that time in here, who determined what their pay rate just what we set is the colas and stuff goes on top of that. Okay. So anyway, that's my two,
but I do appreciate you guys' work. All of you. Anybody else got anything? There's been a lot of concerns going around and doing people doing stuff that's not in their job description because it's a liability, the county,
and stuff. So, if part of our jobs don't get into our job descriptions, can we just say, "Well, I don't have to do that because it's not in my description." That makes Frank County look bad. So, to me, if our job descriptions aren't
accurate, what we do and what we perform every day, even if it is going a little bit above to help somebody else, that makes Scratch County look bad. And that's not our intention. But to me, that's what DA is trying to
do by not putting our job into our job description from pleasing. So that's what we're fighting for is to get our job description right so we can do our jobs.
Anybody else? I just want to reiterate that the law enforcement just the atmosphere that we're all in. I mean, people coming out of schools can pick their jobs for however much money they want. So, for
DBA to classify all of law enforcement at a lower grade, I don't even know if that's possible because it's such a competitive market right now and to perceive people getting lower grades or even a 60 61% increase and that's that
doesn't even make sense. That's not that's not what's happening in Minnesota. Got a question. Did Stevens fill those two positions? Yes. Okay. Well, I think we heard you and we got to work to resolve it.
And it's just too bad that we we've spent probably a lot of money made this far to come to see that it's flawed. And going forward, I think a lot of us have
lost their trust. It's a least motivation to morale is why should we take that extra step to help the appreciation of
Anybody got anything else? We'll call her a day. Thank you. He saidward.