water. for March 9, 2026. Time is a little after 5:00. Um, this is the call to order. And next we'll do a flag salute, please. to the stands one
indivisibley for all >> u Paula um may we have a reading of the sunshine law >> notice that this meeting was published in accordance with the open public meetings act >> all right there'll be uh no new business started after 11:30 p.m.
>> 10:30 >> 10:30 p.m. Thank you very much, Paul. Uh, may I have a roll call, please? >> Mrs. Mr. Noita, Mrs. >> Mr. Morelli, >> here. >> Mr.
>> Here, >> Mr. Murphy >> here. >> Mr. Cury >> here. >> Mosco here. Mrs. Gilmore >> here. >> Mr. Hen, Mr. M >> here, >> Mr. Porto, and Mr.
>> Yes, here. Um, we have a number of absences tonight surprisingly, but I still think we have a quorum. Do we? >> Yes. >> Okay. >> All right. First uh matter on the items for business is a uh discussion if further discussion is necessary on the
2025 Hannesport joint land use board annual report. You all reme will remember that we distributed that um actually two meetings ago >> and um asked anybody uh who had an idea
for things that we might look into for amending um the land use code uh to uh make a mental note of that and keep it for tonight. So, um, if
anybody has any comments, um, I have one myself that I just developed this afternoon, actually. Uh, but if anybody has any comments, um, please, you know, speak up, let me hear them, and then we can incorporate them
into, uh, a bullet point and add it to the, uh, to the, uh, resolution. Right now, the resolution says nothing. I have one. I don't know what this
consists of, but I'd like to see us not be so accepting of relinquishing a walkway. We've done we've done a couple variances to people submitting permits that we
kind of let them off the hook where we could have got the walkway here and they could have did it five years ago, seven years ago. Not that it would have completed the thing, but I just think that that's an opportunity
for us to create a walkable path from point A to point B. And once again, I don't know. I know here we reference to that,
you know, maybe one of the examples was trucking on 3 It was a gravel front and there's no separation from the street to the building. Whereas if we made them have a curve and
sidewalk in that section, you know, when my kids are sitting here, it gives us complete walkway down maybe 38. Okay. Um,
how Scott, any thoughts or um about how to put that into a bullet point to go into the resolution? >> Well, the um the annual report is more about ordinance changes that we're looking for. So, while I totally agree
in the right location, our ordinance already requires that. So, I from a general discussion. >> Yeah, it's important to keep that dialogue, but I don't think it needs to.
Bob, any thoughts here on that? >> Yeah, but it's a good comment. It's a good comment that should go into the minutes as um and we have this little extended discussion about this. So, it'll be emphasized in the minutes as such.
>> Yeah, we required We and we all kind of agreed. Maybe you weren't there but was up there. We said moving forward as a board we all agreed sidewalks all the time and there may be certain places where it really is not your
work. I guess part of it is so manywhere and that answervel I think this has done. Well, I agree. We should have got off the hook on that one. I think that's what started the conversation.
>> Yeah, you but like Perry project, you all agreed, you know, why make that guy said people was rights and there's ever something more meaningful or something
we have sidewalk or if someone does something that they are required to everywhere. They simply asked us to do sometimes being someone like four single family houses and I do the
cost to do that. And that's a hard one and where the board's request as much as you can because $100,000 and I think we all see it. We drive home from work and we see the car in front of us
as much as they should be texting or not. >> Okay. Um the thought I had was really came off the premeating meeting we had today. We're talking about issues of um
front yard backyard setbacks and issues of fencing in dedicated buffer areas. Um so to encapsulate that into a short bullet point, I would think that
maybe it is worthwhile looking at that. down the line to see if we need to rewrite some of our definitions. questions. So probably 18 years ago. So I said to
that question >> well yeah I I think a prime example was the discussion we had this afternoon. Um, and so that made me think that maybe this is
>> we ought to revisit uh problematic definitions. >> Just and just leave it at that because that's across the whole board and that starts running
issues and we come up and check It's in pretty good shape. And I know it's just What? To reduce the distance so that the that would eliminate then that would eliminate the the need
maybe for them to come before the board. Yeah. >> And then So the one thing in a lot of water communities are let basis.
>> I would agree at least. Yes. I'm not saying we have to >> the only one that we had last year Mr. >> A totally different situation. >> What you just pointed out, which is now
the last house. But his all of a sudden his view went to a white and he paid a lot and now his view of the lake went from all the way across.
So we just have to pay attention. >> Yes. >> All right. Um >> another One quick comment. If you reduce the setback, you lose control over landscape.
>> I think the pools pose a unique safety concern. And so my view on it would be we get so few of them nowadays that I'm perfectly happy
to take the time to deal with it and to make sure that it's right for for safety for setback for landscaping issues for for all the issues that pop up with pool and every pool application spawns a bunch of
issues. >> Appreciate the feedback. All right. Anything else on this issue or can we move on? >> All right. We'll save the um the resolution for the resolution section of the meeting, but we'll go on to
ask Scott if he would address the um what I'll call the AH3 zoning district creation, which is item 6B on our agenda.
Um there is a proposed ordinance that would create a zoning district for um affordable housing. Um and it really is a companion to the discussion we're going to have in 6C. But Scott, if you
could u give us a snapshot of the issue and the question that the board has to ask. >> I'll do a brief over. So this all has to do with our affordable housing. We have some members.
>> I think everybody I think everybody except Mike on the board was here and maybe he was too when we when we when we did the the fair share housing uh plan fourth round element. >> So that was >> and we and Leah Leah Fury was here to
give us >> December right >> was very recently in December. It was dated in June. I didn't know she >> was >> dated June 2025. >> I was not here
understanding what happened. >> March 2024, Governor Murphy signed in Fairous. We did oursoped Part of the implementation requirements of that process is to adopt the
ordinances to effect or Paul was intimately involved with these but are there any elements of these
ordinances that are inconsistent with these directly out of the master plan requirements plan. They are absolutely consistent. There's
nothing inconsistent. >> So the so the question is is the is the proposed resolution consistent with the uh adopted master plan? That really goes for >> I I just for general information I have
one more thing. Within the last 10 days, the US Supreme Court rejected um the appeal of a couple of towns in Bergen County, which was sort of the last ditch effort to stop this. Uh they
didn't accept the case for review. they rejected in effect. So the New New Jersey Supreme Court's decisions and the legislation is effective and has to be followed. >> Yeah, I was part of those coalition
meetings. They were held almost weekly. Um and you know presented all of municipalities throughout the state who have an obligation. There's about 64 by the way that do not there's three in county that do not have statuto
obligations. any kind of affordable housing for the statute for the law. Um, but Mr. Gillespie, our attorney, reviewed everything and made a recommendation that not participate in that lawsuit and
also found that there would probably ultimately come to that decision with no support from the Supreme Court. Um, but in terms of the uh resolution before you um and the township's ordinance 264.
Again, it was part of our housing element and fair share plan, which the board approved in June of 2025. Um, more specifically, it's on page 42. Um, it talks specifically about block 24.02, lot 12.04, which is Martin Highway and
Mount Holly bypass. And Paula emailed all of you the support for that, which is the color version. What you have in front of you is printed black and white, which is a little to see. Um, but it just describes where this lot block are
so you have an idea of location. Um, and again, the board did approve the housing fair and it is part of the master. So the ordinance for this will be presented to the governing body tomorrow night should the board find it to be
compant. So this is and our master plan is really an amalgam of our land use plan and all of the plans together most recent of which is the element
that's really housed as an element of some of The other elements include our open space plan, farmland preservation. It could include um connect like uh
pedestrian connectivity. Um there's tons of different elements, traffic plans, what else? Open space, land use. >> So I understand
I just question would you say that we're moving at 100 miles hour say still >> we're moving at the same speed as hopefully most municipalities in the state because we all have to follow
we're all due by March 15th. I can talk more about round three being 100 miles an hour to catch up because the township was not compliant with round three until two years before it expired and that was a 25 year compliance period. The did not
have round three compliance until the 23rd year, 24th year. >> I think the question is, are we moving these ordinances through? >> No. So, so now we're facing, >> right? They show up with plans and sayines
their responsibility to provide their housing. I want to build over >> market rate with 20% affordable. >> So these deadlines are making it all happen
>> but we are ahead of the game for us. We're a little bit ahead because we adopted our ordin our housing element in fair share but there are towns who are just now doing that are doing everything right now whereas I would say we're in a good position because we're finalizing
site control identifying sites that that we've put in our plan for fourth round. We're in addition to that we've updated our chapter 44 affordable housing ordinance which is also before us tonight. We have two other things that we uh things that the governing body is
adopting tomorrow night or resolutions. One is our uh fair share plan which um dictates our expenditures and our revenues. We have to have a plan in place or I'm sorry, our spending plan as well as like affordability assistance
manuals and um another affordability uh program. So those are the last three things that we have to by law in order to meet that March 15th deadline have adopted. impact services. >> That would be I think your answer would
be found in the housing element fair plan. All that's in there. every single project that we proposed and has been adopted and approved are outlined in this plan and it's also on the website. If you didn't get a copy of this, it's on the township. So, I can of course we
can provide you with a copy of it. I can provide every but I think everybody got a copy of it. It's online um if you Google it on the web page if you want it right away electronically. Otherwise, we can certainly make copies of it. I mean, it's part of that being.
>> So, the one thing the one thing I will say is um has done such a good job over the years getting bonus credits for a lot of those. So over the next 10 years
additional over time or 17 of those are senior units at the project >> which has already been approved. >> Do we get to capture them now? >> Yeah.
>> Supportive housing and rental. Some of the numbers municipalities So we so the state used mapping from 2020 to determine one of the many factors that
they used to come up with respective needs. Uh we fought that because we did our vacant property analysis and was able to show that a lot of the vacant properties that they have have now since been built on. We had a lot of growth
between 2020 and 2023 2024. Um so we objected and we were able to present and fair share actually accepted it. We had a I forget what the reduction number was but it was a significant number to get it lower than 77 I think was our original number. in the like
unfortunately the builder association intervened and sued a threatened lawsuit to all of the towns who were successful in reducing their numbers which fair share accepted. Um so as a result of that and
unfortunately I think that procedurally they were allowed to intervene inappropriately. um they didn't really follow the judicial process that was outlined in the law. Uh but they were allowed they were show deference and um we wound up
having to settle because the cost to litigate to fight against the builders association far exceeded um cost benefit wasn't there. So we wound up settling and we only were able to reduce by three. But we still fought. A lot of towns didn't fight at all. They
just accepted their number and moved on. We still at least that effort tried but again um the builder association fought to keep those units intact so that obviously >> but but I'll add what the town has done
in in conjunction with dealing with our assigned number is to find acceptable sites in town for that. For instance,
IKO, which is the short name for that multi-acre wedge across from Wolfington's and across from the the veterinarian office on 38. And then tonight, we're going to take another triangle or
wedge of property over on the bypass. um which uh when we're going to use it to create hopefully the AH3 zone so that that can be a location for housing as well.
And so we the the importance of that is that we've tried to put the affordable housing in the right places in town that benefit the affordable housing and the people who live there and also
also benefit the town. location. What we're doing We're not going to go We did a lot of work. >> It's a good argument. Um, but I think you have to look at the individual pieces of land that were used. In this
case, Hitco and Triangle on bypass. Um, and the 38 >> We also have an awful lot of business that are So they're not filling those places because people are shopping more online.
>> Well, to me it looks like >> and they'd rather go they're opening businesses in warehouses because it's less expensive. >> Yeah. But there's no draw. to do so.
>> But it isn't because of lack of trying. I know business people who have tried very hard. We've talked about this in a little bit. One of the great things about the economic know the warehouse.
office. So there is always a lot of commercial and there's already l So, one of the things that we talked about and it's resial zone, It's a res next to
it is an R2 zone. Is it R2 or R1? >> Well, that particular lot is zoned I but it's adjacent to R2. >> Um, so it is a compat that particular lot is bound to be compatible and their site
suitability for it. U but I do I understand suitable site um it's developable and it's approvable. So those are the markers that have been checked off for this particular site. But you know what Scott was referring to, we did have a commercial proposal
that it would was not palatable. It was would have been a nightmare. We would have received a lot of grief over that particular year. >> There's been a sale sign on that property for years. >> It's been vacant with a billboard. >> That property has been Yeah.
>> since it was carved out. >> Yeah. >> Since the bypass isolated it, >> right? >> And which >> it was created by the New Jersey Department of Transportation when they decided to draw the line for the bypass through there and they left that little piece that used to be connected to the
farmland or what was once farmland on the other side which is now that warehouse. So the fin I think the final note I'll I'll make on this is when you look around town there are not there's not a
lot of developable land surprising think so um and certainly not a lot of large acreage development land you could say well the other side of Route 38 there is frankly most of that is already carved up into
lots and um and so it's not like 100 acres of farmland anymore in one spot. That doesn't really exist in town. And it's hard to find places um to that that you could zone for the
affordable housing. And we're and while you do have the Route 38 Carter, you know, we've been trying all over the years, we've been trying all kinds of creative things to get businesses in there. And little by little, you know, the diner comes back after being closed.
boys in this studio, whatever it is, comes in. >> Boot camp. Yeah, that's right. But so, you know, and across the street we get uh this the the equipment >> guy. Um so, you know, I think just have
to have patience. And remember all those lots on 38, they're really small commercial for commercial, they're all small. None. Nobody over there has for whatever reason gotten together and say, "Let's let's merge our lots and sell a bigger lot together and divide up the
profits." Every everyone wants their own little thief. That's the way it's been. >> Well, sure. Yeah. Wow, there's a lot of stuff going on around us. Why are we the Why can't we do something about the
>> Well, it begs the qu It begs the question. So the reason you guys are the whole is pure geography west. They've got a much larger people from the eastern part of the county to drive through
some of those other schools and restaurants and business. And the same with Mount I was going to say everything 387 And we do have lots identified in front of our industrial warehouses
that have been sitting vacant. There was property right in front of the Hannesport Commerce Center that was specifically targeted and earmarked and carved out like Scott was saying for commercial development. It has been vacant now for 5 years across the street in front of
Black Creek's two warehouses. Is a lot specifically earmarked and carved out by the town for commercial. We'll see how long it takes for that to get developed. And both of those developers were just going to leave that as undeveloped. >> And we said, "No, no, no. Please, let's
carve that off." We would like that as as we can continue to grow, you know, maybe you need some people. If you're doing a big shopping trip, people will go to
where you live harder and less retail. Amazon and all this creates investigation. >> It's a challenge, >> but you can't give up. >> Okay.
Question. >> Yes. >> Based on the minimum and maximum requirements for units that go into that lot. It's not a very big variances that we have to
>> that's what this ordinance does. This ordinance actually standards. >> So they would be able to come into the town with a application >> I will say >> hopefully but meet the meet the
requirements of the zoning. So in essence, you're creating the zoning for the I think they're similar, but it's all based on the lot, the beginning. after the development. That's new.
Is that a good example of that? And that one's kind of a good example because that was actually initially the subject of litigation and then ultimately there were I believe 39 town houses on that and then the developer
came to the town and said they are sort of a blended because it's right next to the highway so they are a little bit smaller and these these sites are going to be similar to that as possible
so we can get the housing up more unnecessarily But one of the things I will say the intent with all these affordable housing obligations is to have a state forcing us to rush them. A lot of
these ordinances are done based on their permeability. Sometimes building Sometimes there is some relief necessary. This is this is the town's best guess that >> there's no developer
>> kind of we're establishing site control or site we're establishing that we have site control >> I also candy shop or something decades ago Road. >> Oh, on HCO. No, that was indust. No, it
wasn't it wasn't a candy shop. It was >> far from a tool and die. >> Oh, okay. >> Tool and die business. >> I heard I don't even know if that's true or not true. >> Oh, we we we have them out there. >> Yeah, we own Hannesport Township owns
that site. Okay. We we we took ownership through foreclosure, tax foreclosure, right, back in the long time ago. So, we've we've received over a million dollars in HDSRF grant funding to do all of the due diligence testing.
>> We're at the point now where we're ready like >> somebody came in. >> It's right, but we're the HITO site was already approved by you guys a month ago. We're kind of digressing, but yeah, that that site we're we're also trying to acquire the neighboring
property so that we have enough land should there be such a high level of contamination, we can just cap that parking and maybe put the affordable housing units on the Dunmont property. Um, but with regards to this particular
property, I don't think there's a store, but Oh, but you'll be happy to know that we're requiring sidewalks. >> Oh, good. >> Couldn't wait to say that. >> Couldn't wait to tell you. All right. Um, if there's nothing else
anybody has to say, let me close the discussion period. Um, and I think, um, Paula, um, unless you have anything else to add,
um, I think we've sort of covered 6A, 6B and 6 C in one one set of discussions. I mean uh 6B is one ordinance which would be 20268 that carves out the AH3 zoning district
and um 6C um uh concludes that the u fair uh housing element and fair share plan
for the uh fourth iteration um is consistent with u the the master plan and we would recommend it to the township for adoption. So although we need to take two votes, I think we've
had one discussion that covers the waterfront unless there's any member that has any other questions and I'd like to set this up for a vote and conclude the matter. Two votes, two >> two votes, one for AH3 and one for the
um uh the housing housing element approval, >> the affordable housing ordinance. >> Yeah. So, let me just make sure I have AH3. Uh the resolution would be um 20268
uh to create a new zoning district to be known as the AH3 zoning district uh as set forth uh in uh the ordin resolution. Uh and the vote really is to say yes. uh
it is not inconsistent with the object objectives of the master plan and does uh and does not recommend any additions or modifications to the ordinance. So a yes vote would be to send it to uh the
town to become an ordinance. A no vote would be uh to oppose that. Uh, so can I have a um can I have a motion
uh to approve to grant a to issue a yes vote for uh resolution 2026-08 uh on a uh AH3 zone creating such a zone? >> Did I hear a motion? Motion.
>> Yes. >> Second. >> I'll second. >> All right. Roll call. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Mr. Mr. >> Mr. Murphy. >> Murphy. >> Yes. >> Mr. Mai.
>> Yes. >> Mr. M. >> Yes. All right. On the same general topic, we have resolution 20- 2026-09. um which states that this board has
determined uh that uh ordinance 2026-5 uh is not inconsistent with the objectives of the master plan and we do not recommend any additions or modifications to the ordinance. So in
other words, a yes vote would send this to township committee for adoption with our blessing. No vote would oppose that. So may I have a motion to adopt resolution 2026-09
as drafted? >> So move. >> Second. >> Roll call. >> Yes. >> Yes. Yes. All right. Let me just get my agenda
back. So, we have a couple of minutes of meetings um from a few months ago. Uh I'm dealing with item 7A on the agenda. Uh the meeting minutes of um November 6,
2025. Uh can I have a motion uh to approve those minutes as drafted? Second. >> Roll call. >> Murphy. >> Yes. >> Mr. >> Yes. >> Mr. Murphy. >> Yes.
>> Mrs. Gilmore. >> Yes. >> Mr. Mai. >> Yes. >> Mr. >> Yes. Next. I have a short set of minutes from December 3, 2025. Uh, and again, can I have a motion to
adopt these minutes as drafted? Say yes. >> Say it out loud. >> Yes. Okay. I I didn't I'm sorry. I didn't see your hand go. >> We have a We have a motion and a second, I believe. >> A second.
>> Roll call. >> Yes. >> Yes. Yes. All right. Now, on to resolutions. The first one is uh back to the topic we we talked about first this evening, and
that is um the uh the approval of the annual report uh to be amended by the two points that we agreed to to add in our earlier discussion tonight. Um do you have those, Paula? I thought it was just the
one points. >> Oh, we did decide the pools that we would not >> walkway >> and the walkway is already on there. So, it just the just the bullet point would be uh review and uh reassess definitional
information in the ordinance as necessary. So, um, can I have a motion to adopt the annual report with the amendment that we just discussed? This is this is resolution 2026-02.
>> All right. I have a motion. Second. >> Second. >> Thank you. Roll call. >> Mr. Mai. >> Yes. >> Mrs. Mr. >> Mr. Ry.
>> Yes. All right. Next, we have resolution 2026-07, which is um uh the Sha property over in um on Merry Way. you recall that was a warehouse
that um uh new occupants were taking over and modernizing and needed a couple of um a couple of changes and variances. Uh can I have a motion to approve that resolution as drafted? >> Motion.
>> Second. >> Second. >> Roll call, please. >> Mr. Ji, >> yes. >> Mr. C. Murphy. >> Yes. >> Mr. R. Murphy. Costco. >> Yes. >> Mrs. All right. All right. And then the last two
resolutions, 08 and09, we've already dealt with those, so I'll sign those after the meeting is over. Um, we do have some limited correspondence. If anybody wants to deal with any of them individually, please say so.
Otherwise, a motion to receive and file the correspondence would be in order. I'll make a motion to receive and file. >> Thank you. Second. >> I'll second. >> Roll call. >> Mrs. Gilmore. >> Yes. >> Mr.
>> Yes. >> Mr. Morelli. >> Yes. >> Mr. R. Murphy. >> Yes. >> Mr. C. Murphy. >> Yes. >> Miss Costco. >> Yes. >> Mr. Mai. >> Yes. >> And Mr. M. >> Yes. Um, next item on our agenda would be professional comments. Anything beyond what we've already heard from
either of you? Board comments. You mean you're exhausted? No comments. >> Too nice. No. There being no board comments, we'll move on to public comments. The record can reflect that
there are no members of the general public in attendance at this meeting at this time. All right. Uh motion to adjurnn would be in order. Second. >> All in favor?