Good evening everyone. Welcome to the special meeting of the Hamilton Board of Education for April 30th, 2026. I'll read the open public meeting statement. The New Jersey Open Public Means Law is enacted to ensure the right of the public to have advanced notice of and to attend any meetings of public bodies of which their interests may be discussed
or acted upon. In accordance with the provisions of this act, the Hamilton Board of Education has caused notice of this meeting to be published by posting the date, time, purpose, and place thereof on the Hamilton School District's website under current legal notices and posted on authorized premises, ensuring compliance with 48
hour online notice requirement. This notice has been maintained on the website archive for at least one week. We'll have a roll call. >> Mr. Spinado, >> here. >> Mr. Kuya >> here. >> Mr. Dphano >> here. Miss Donio >> here.
>> Miss Bon >> here. >> Mr. Alo >> here. >> Miss Hunter >> here. >> Mr. Pa >> here. >> Miss Scola >> here. >> Mr. Thomas is expected. >> Yeah. >> Mr. Lions >> here. >> And uh Mr. Adonio >> here.
>> Okay. Flag salute. >> To the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God. indivisible with liberty and justice for all. >> Okay. >> All right. Purpose of the meeting, as I
said, is the special meeting to discuss and adopt our 2026 2022 budget. So, I'll turn the meeting over to Mr. Ramsey who he'll discuss the budget. >> Thank you, Mr. Lions. Uh, as you know,
Hamilton School District has a very rich history for providing a world-class education at a fiscally responsible and conservative manner. So, it's certainly an honor and a privilege for me to present the 2026
2027 school budget for the Hamilton public school system. Before I begin, I want to thank JC Martino, our supervisor of technology, for helping me put tonight's presentation together. I also want to
thank Terry Weekes, our business administrator, Margie Crawford, our assistant business administrator, my administrative team, and the entire board of education, you know, for your input as well. So
without further ado, uh here's the budget presentation. Before I start with the budget presentation, I want to start with the mission of the Hamilton Public School District. And the mission is in partnership with the community
to provide educational opportunities that inspire students to achieve their full academic, social, and civic potential as they meet the expectations of the New Jersey student learning standards at all grade
levels. That's the goal. You know that's the goal of the administration of the teachers of the entire community. That's the expectation from the parents members of our board of education. Uh, I
am blessed to work with 11 board members that represent their constituents and do an incredible job and spend a lot of time and effort ensuring that the children of Folsam, Waterford, and
Hamilton receive a top-notch education. So, I thank you for that. who we are. Um, obviously the Hamilton School District is a prek to 12 district providing education from students from
preschool up through 12th grade. We're lucky to have the students from the Falsam School District attend our high school, grades 9 through 12 for kids that go to Falsam Elementary School. And we're fortunate as well to have the students from Waterford
Township join us in seventh grade at Hamilton Middle School through 12th grade and graduate from Hamilton High School. We have four buildings, four schools in the Hamilton School District. We have our early childhood education center,
grades preK through grade 1. In that building, we have the Warney Soy Junior Elementary School with grades two through five. We have the Hamilton Middle School with grades 6 through 8.
And we have Hamilton High School educating students in grades 9 through 12. Uh we are an interd district school choice program and we service 226 students that are it's a state funded
program with school choice in-house services that we provide our custodial staff our maintenance staff our transportation department service our technology our security and various other student services that
we're extremely proud of and we do it in a very cost effective manner. If you take a look at the population in the Hamilton school district, you can see the population is very steady. Uh two years ago we had 32 uh 3,254
students in the school district. This year we have 3,240 students in the school districts, a difference of 14 students. So, our student population is very steady and very stable. And you could see right now
there's 516 students in the early childhood education center. There's 678 students in the Warren Soy Elementary School. Uh just under 800 students in Hamilton Middle School and Hamilton High
School has 1,260 students. a further breakdown. Uh we're beautifully diverse. Uh you can take a look, we have over 2,000 white students that attend our school. Uh just under
900 Hispanic students, 156 African-American students. You go down the line, one uh American Indian, Alaskan Native, 25 Asian, uh one Native
Hawaiian Pacific Islander, and 79 students who identify two or more races. That's who we are. At a closer look, we have more males that attend the Hamilton School District than females by about a 100red. We have
1,50063 female students. We have 1,676 male students. But the other two uh bits of information are very important as well. We have 1,500 economically disadvantaged students.
Almost half, you know, of the students that attend our school district will get free or reduced lunch. We have 521 students with disabilities. It's about 15 or 16% of the population.
When you put together a budget, there's a lot of things that you need to take into consideration. First and foremost, you want to maintain your academics. You want to provide outstanding professional development for your
faculty and staff. You want to invest in instructional technology where you can. And certainly the curriculum is always changing. You want to keep up with the state standards and adjustments are always being made. On top of that, you
got to take into consideration the contractual obligations. uh you have staff salaries, you have health benefits that are constantly rising. On top of that, you know,
there's other union agreements. And last but not least, there's ongoing maintenance. You have facility repairs. Your facilities need to be repaired. You have operational supplies to make your district run smoothly each and every
day. School safety and security is extremely important. The one thing I take pride in in Hamilton is we've already saved the taxpayers over $500,000 through attrition. What am I talking
about? We have people retiring from the Hamilton School District. Everybody's not being replaced. We eliminated an administrative position, a couple of teaching positions, a couple of aid positions. We're restructuring our
attendance officer position. And with all of those subtle changes, we were able to save the taxpayers over $500,000 just from doing that and not having any impact on the quality of the education
that we're providing to our students. the proposed budget, we're just under $72 million. That high graph up there that you can look at, uh 46% of that proposed budget,
actually it's 45. My eyesight's not as good. 45% comes from state aid. 27.4% comes from the local tax levy. 19.7% of that money, 19.7%
of that $72 million comes from tuition from Waterford and Folsam combined. And you could see, you know, some of the reserves and fund balances and extraordinary aid, you know, that make up a much smaller portion of the
revenues. How's the money being spent? You know, that's important. You can see the majority of the money is spent on instruction as it should be. You should be spending the majority of money educating students in the
classroom instruction. 21% of that money is for benefits. And you could go down the line. uh 5% is spent on transportation, 8.7% is spent on facilities,
and 6.1% of that budget is spent on administrative cost. And I'm also proud to report that the administrative cost in the Hamilton School District is well below the state average. You can take a look at the last four
years. of our general funds. And I'm just going to concentrate on 2025 to 2026. And we had a increase in state aid, which we're extremely thankful for, 5.3%.
local tax. We're looking at a 2.9% increase there. And I'll explain that in greater detail as I move through the presentation. Tuition is up 14.6%. Fund balance reserve up 26.8%.
Miscellaneous incumbences up 54%. It's from $122,000 up to $188,000 and combined revenue as a whole up 7.8%. Those numbers are there for everyone to
see. Taking a look at some of the different accounts, uh we have our maintenance reserve balance at $2.3 million. We have a capital reserve at $2.2
million, an excess surplus of $4.5 million. Here's the history of our state aid allocations over the years. When
2021, 2022, 2023, Hamilton was receiving equalization aid. We were getting very large sums of money from the state and that equalization aid, $3.2 million, $3.7 million, $2.4
million. But something happened in 2024. That aid dropped to $133,000. And something happened last year. We lost $427,000 in aid.
But this year, uh, with new governor, we were lucky to get an increase of $1.6 million in aid, which is terrific. uh when you consider the rising cost of electricity, the rising cost of gas, the
rising cost of health care, the rising cost of salaries, you know, the 1.6 million in state aid doesn't quite cover it all, and I'll explain that a little deeper. Uh a visual about the uh budget in
Hamilton. Uh federal aid counts for very little of our budget, about 1%. Uh local funds 54.7% and state aid, as I already stated earlier, 45.2%.
But the one thing I want everybody to take notice of is the state average per pupil in New Jersey is $21,000. That's the state average per pupil. In Hamington, our per pupil cost is
$17,000 $899 worth more than $3,000 below the state average for per pupil cost Manhattan. There's 72 like school districts in New
Jersey, similar to Hamilton district factor B school district similar to ours. We are the 13th lowest spending school district out of 72 schools. The 13th lowest. So there's my math is
right. There's 60 69 schools that spend more than us that are similar to us. This is an interesting uh comparison. Tuition in Atlantic County per pupil
cost in Atlantic County. Hamilton has the cheapest per pupil cost in the county. God bless you. at $17,899. You could go through this and see what every other school district in Atlantic
County charges. And what do we get for that? The best reading and writing scores on the NJ GPA in Atlantic County and the top or second to the top math scores in the NJ GPA on the 11th grade assessment. So the taxpayers are getting
an amazing education for what we're spending. There other school districts as well. Atlantic City for pupil expenditures $28,000 a year. We're doing a lot more
with less at 17 and change. What is adequacy? You know, adequacy is what the state says you should be spending on education. That's their recommendation. Their recommendation is that the
Hamilton School District is about $10 million below adequacy. That's what the state says. Like, we believe differently. We know what we could get done with less. You know, we're $10 million below what the state says we
could be charging. You know, I'm proud of that fact. We're below adequacy and our teachers and our students and our administrators and supervisors are doing a terrific job. >> Participation in programs to minimize
cost. We're always cognizant how can we keep the money cost down. We participate in the Atlantic Cape May business officials joint insurance fund for all insurance. try to get the best insurance rates that we could possibly find.
Agreement with the town for our SRO for our school resource officers. Cooperative pricing agreements with local school districts when we're purchasing items. We, you know, get into that cooperative pricing so you get the
best, you know, prices that can be offered. Um, great program as well. The current tax rate in Hamilton is 1.451. That is the current tax rate, 1.451. The proposed tax rate in this school
budget is 1.481. And I'll explain what that means. It's approximately a 3% increase and it includes debt service as well. What does it mean in Hamilton? The
average home in Hamilton is assessed at $363,000. That's the average home for approximately a little less than $9 a month. $8 and change every month. You know, that would be the impact on the
property taxes in town, about $8 and change per month to get some of the best test scores in Atlantic County and to also have some of the most cost effective per pupil expenditures in
Atlantic County. Do we have any questions from any of the board members? Thank you. So, I actually do have a question tonight. Sure. >> Um, I guess on the second page of the posted budget, um, I guess where it shows I'm going
down to I've actually got the print out. I'm sorry. I guess when it discusses uh we're Hamilton's anticipating a $2.4 million increase in local revenue which includes mainly the Hamilton Township
tax levy and tuition. What is waterford tuition's increase? Because it looks like our tuition increase is making up about 65% of this total increase. So, how does that how does that play out
exactly? >> You want to see this? >> So, in these numbers, remember there's also numbers. Okay. Is it on? >> It's on. Okay. So, it's not just Fam. I mean, Woodford's numbers, it's also
Folsome. And Folsome also received a significant increase because they underestimated their students. >> Okay. >> So, I'd have to actually break that down for you. Um, but what you're seeing is that yes, the 12 million to the 14
million increase about a little less than $2 million is coming between Folsome Woodford of the uh entire increase. So that's I don't know what that percentage is but I don't I didn't wasn't prepared with those numbers but I could tell you what
Woodford's percent is separately but not right now. >> But not right now. >> Yes. >> Um have we can I have that back? Sorry have another question. >> I guess under So you'll get me those numbers. >> I can get those numbers.
>> That'd be great. Um and then I'll send this back over to you in a second too. Uh just so you can I guess under the um expenditure expenditures for special education instruction looks like it's anticipated to increase 1.4 million which represents a 30% increase in
instructional costs. However, projected increase in special education student is only going up by three. >> So there's a clarification uh how it was budgeted in on 20
2526 that was done by the prior business administrator and it's actually a correction. >> It's absolutely >> a correction. So it's not an increase in staffing, it's a reallocation of or staffing should be appropriately budgeted. >> Reallocation of staff.
>> Okay. Because I actually I believe we've decreased staffing. >> Okay. All right. Those other numbers will get me. Thanks. >> Okay, other questions about the budget. Okay,
we can go to board member comment. I know we just met two weeks ago, but if anybody has anything they wish to report on or discuss, just keep the high sign here. Okay, seeing none, we'll move into the first of the two public portion two uh public
comment opportunity periods. Anybody that wishes to address the board, you'll have a chance right now and then another chance at the end of the meeting before we close. Come on up to the podium, give us your name and address and you can speak to the board. >> Okay. >> Thank you.
>> No problem. >> Hi, good evening. My name is uh Billy McDermad. I'm uh from Two Road out in Waterford. I attended last night's meeting out in Waterford. And Miss Hunter, I really appreciate your your questions just now. I guess I have a question. Um, and it's
probably better to give you a little bit of context so that you understand where the question's coming from. Last night, myself, my good friends, uh, we attended the meeting and our situation after watching your presentation seems to be a little bit more dire than it is in
Hamilton. Uh we were told last night that we're going to see our property taxes go up by the maximum allowable number. Uh and in return for that investment, we're going to lose 34 positions, a very essential school nurse in one of our buildings, beloved
curriculum programs like STEAM. And when we asked why, we were told by our board that the primary, if not principal reason, was the increase in tuition from Hamilton. I guess stepping back for a moment, um
it may very well be that the rise in tuition is justified and a good investment for our students and for our children. But what we were told by our board and Miss Hunter, tell me if any of this is wrong. Uh but what we were told by our board was that um the formula
that is used to calculate the tuition is what our board has been asking for from this board and this board has refused to give the formula to our board. >> Can I you know what? Yeah, I'm going to I'm going to address. >> Can I just finish real quick? >> Finish finish your make your points and
then I'm happy to answer. >> Listen, I I to be clear, I don't take a position on this. I I have no idea what is or isn't true. I I'm just relaying what our board told us last night, which is >> variables that go into the formula are important to the end number, which makes
sense. >> They've told us that they've been asking for the numbers and have not gotten the numbers. And so really, I just came here tonight to ask, can you share the numbers? Because apparently, and we have a board member here, which is why it was
even more confusing, at least to me, that this was an issue. It doesn't seem like it is an issue, but I guess what I want to know is, can we have the numbers so that we can in our town say, "Okay, here's what you came up with. This is why it's worth it." Um, or why perhaps
it's not. We should take it up to the uh educational commissioner, whatever the case may be. It seems like a very silly dispute in my opinion. and I'm just curious if you could help us out and show us the numbers. That's all. >> Sure. >> So, I appreciate your question. Thank
you. Certainly, I would lead off by saying, you know, we we broadly value our relationships with Waterford and Falsome for, you know, in the send receive situation. Um, so to answer your question, the numbers have been provided, the methodology has been
provided. Uh it's been transmitted at several levels at the between the superintendents, between the BAS, most recently between the board solicitors. Uh the public the formula and the inputs that go into the formula are a matter of public record. Uh anyone from the Waterford Township Board of Education
could have gotten that information before your meeting. We've provided that information. Again, I'm just, you know, I'm giving you an answer because you asked me a question and I appreciate your question because if I were in your shoes, I'd ask it, too. Um, so you know, I would I would offer that our board is
a model of transparency. We we we share everything with anybody. We answer open requests. We do all the things. So I don't know where the disconnect is and believe me, I am just as shocked as you are. I watched that meeting. Um, I'm disappointed in a lot of things about it, but the information's been provided.
So I'm happy to Sorry, one more thing. Sure. I'm happy to. We can have someone take your information after the meeting here in a few minutes and I'll email you. We'll email you exactly what's been provided so you can see for yourself. >> Can you email me what's been provided to? >> Sure. >> That would be great because you guys are
saying it's been sent and while we have the formula and we understand the formula, we are asking for the specific numbers that input to the formula to come up with the final calculations. Email it to me. Please sure do so because our solicitor is telling me we
don't have it. My superintendent is telling me we don't have it. Our board administrator is telling me we don't have it and as is the board president. So email it to me. >> Sure. You could have you could have also asked Mr. Ramsey, Mrs. Weekes, or anyone else before tonight for the information,
but it's fine. I will make sure that you get it. You can have the same conversations >> everybody else got. You're right. We have had conversations and you had a lot to say at your own board meeting last night, which I certainly didn't appreciate, but we'll talk about it after the fact that open session. >> I'm not here to litigate what goes on at the board meeting in Waterford. I'm here
for the kids in Hamilton. So, sir, I appreciate you coming in and I'm sorry for what you're going through. Rest assured, I'll get get you the information you need as well as what Mrs. Hunter asked for. >> I really appreciate that. I want to thank you. >> Leave my information. Who should I give my information to? I'm sorry.
>> Um, you will just speak to the the board secretary. She's sitting right over there to my left to your right. Just give her your information and we'll get that handled for you. >> Appreciate it. Thank you all. >> Thank you. >> Okay. Anyone else from the public? All right. We'll close the public portion.
There'll be a second opportunity. Let's go to the agenda. We're going to go to finance items number one through number three. I'll entertain a motion. >> Motion. Mr. Koya first. Second. Mr. P. Second.
Roll call. Yes. >> No. Yeah, you got to read them. Go ahead. Just so the reference >> just so the record is complete and then let me read out the numbers that are actually will be adopted at this time. >> Yes. So, uh the general fund budget the
um total expenditures is 71,996208. The special revenue budget is 55,148086 and the debt service budget expenditures is 2,115733 for a grand total school district budget for the 2627 school year of
79,279,260,27. The anticipated revenues from the various sources um local sources comes to 57 million on the grant budget for 740754 leaving taxes to be raised with the general fund of 19,823855
and debt service of 1,695418 for a grand total of 20 mill1519,273. >> Okay, we also have a couple items. Um, we are amending this budget, right? Are we amending this budget? >> We are. >> Yes. So, I I'm just going to read the amendment. So, from the budget that was
proposed, we are um amending um this budget to include uh $250,000 for um in the capital um projects line of uh 1200400450.
Those will be used for land improvements and the offsetting revenue will be a reduction or source a reduction in for the deposit to capital reserve which is now 550,000 instead of uh 700,000.
Um that'll also include a deposit of 300 uh 3,800 for the um anticipated interest. We also have a withdrawal from capital reserve for debt service. That's uh $158,110.
The other portion of the um funds for the um land improvements is a reduction. Originally, we anticipated $110,000 deposit to maintenance reserve. Instead, we'll just be doing 10,000 plus the
interest of $2,500. Additionally, our healthcare costs have gone up significantly. So, uh, the adjustment for healthcare was 2,473,241. That's additional, um, most of that's going to bank cap. We have an adjustment
for enrollment of 29,472. Of those adjustments, we're going to be utilizing just $200,000 um, of bank cap. And I think that's basically it. >> Good. >> Yes. Thank you.
>> Okay. Any other questions on the budget? >> As amended. >> As amended. >> Uh, M. Mr. Koya, you agree to the amended budget? >> Yes. >> Amend your motion, Mr. Fia. Okay, get that squared away. [clears throat] >> We'll have the roll call. >> Mr. Fonado, >> yes. >> Mr. Koya,
>> yes. >> Mr. Dphano, >> yes. >> Mr. Donio, >> no. I'm voting no to the budget this year. Our district >> Mio, you'll have an opportunity. You can vote yes or no. You can give public. You can give a narrative after. It's no problem. Okay. Yeah, we could do that.
>> Yeah, let's do it. >> Mrs. Fallon, >> yes. >> Mrs. Geraldo, >> yes. >> Mrs. Hunter, >> no. >> Mr. Player, >> yes. >> Missola, >> yes. >> Uh, Mr. Lions, >> yes. Motion carried. Next, we're going
to go to personnel. >> Can I make my You can. Thank you. Uh, thank you, Mr. Lions. So, I'm voting no to the budget this year. Our district received a 5.34% increase in funding in state aid as Mr.
Ramsey discussed. That's about $1.6 million increase. Um earlier this week, the town announced a 2.7 cent increase in taxes. So with our 2.95 is what I had, but Mr. Ramsey, you made um mention
of the 2.9 cent increase, I think it will be a burden to our taxpayers. Uh not to mention any county increases. I think right now people are struggling. Um costs continue to increase. We all have seen that whether it be fuel costs,
electric costs. Um and so I just think that this is an increase that we don't need at this time given that you talked about we have money in our reserve. We have a million $4.5 million excess reserve and I just don't think that it's
in the best interest of our taxpayers. >> Okay. >> What do you propose as an alternative? What's your proposal for a budget >> and to make up for the $2 million increase in health insurance? What's your >> how do you how do you plan on compensating for all that?
>> We have the money in the excess reserve. >> Do you know what excess reserve is? >> I >> Why don't we let Mr. Fin, we have Mrs. Weeks. Go ahead. >> The excess reserve that you're seeing at $4 million is being utilized to support the 2627 budget. In addition, there's some additional funds being used for a
total of $5 million. That was in Mr. Ramsey's presentation. So, what what that uh excess fund balance is is um it's used for taxpayer relief. Um and it's like a it's a formula. The state allows you to keep 2% plus or minus
certain things, right? And so that came out of last year's budget, the 258 audit at 2425. And um once that audit's done, it forces you to use it in the subsequent year, which budget, which is because it comes out in January. It's a 2627. So that is
being utilized to support our budget this year. That'll plus a little bit more. >> Thank you. >> Welcome. >> Okay, Mr. Uh in good conscious, I could not vote for this proposed budget. This budget negatively in material impacts the ability of Waterford Township School
Board to educate its own students. This tuition calculation is excessive and unduly burdensome. And I've been advised that despite what I'm hearing here that Hamilton has failed to supply Waterford with the raw data which has been requested on multiple occasions since
the beginning of March. Um the increase was also without sufficient notice to Waterford and it's not acceptable accordingly. That is why my vote on this budget was no due to the unreasonable and staggering tuition rates charged to Waterford. Thank you.
>> Okay. Anybody else have anything? Or maybe we'll go to the rest of the agenda. Let's do that. I'll take a motion on personnel items 4 through 26. >> Motion. >> Mrs. Fallon. >> Second. >> Mrs. Skola. Just for the record, uh on
item number 10, exhibit F, page three. So go to item number 10 on the on the motion there. Exhibit F page number three that is being pulled at the administration's request. So
questions on that take a little >> Sorry. Do you need it? Okay. >> Okay. Mr. Baronado. Uh yes, I would stay in on number 16 and number 19. Thank you, Mr. Kuya. >> Yes,
>> Mr. Dphano. >> Yes, >> Mrs. Donio. >> Yes, >> Mrs. Fallon. >> Yes, >> Mrs. Geraldo. >> Yes. Abstain on number 16. >> 16. >> Yes, >> Mrs. Hunter. >> Yes. This Woodford items 6 through 26.
>> Mr. Pa. >> Yes. >> Mrs. Skola. >> Uh, yes. Abstain number 16 and 22, please. >> 26. >> 22. >> 22. Thank you. >> And Mr. Lions. >> Yes. With an abstension on 16.
Motion carry. >> Thank you. >> Next, we're going to go to program, students, and miscellaneous item number 27. I'll entertain a motion. >> So move. >> Mrs. Bernado, first >> second. >> Mrs. Hunter second. Roll call. >> Mrs. Baronado.
>> Yes. >> Mr. Kuya. >> Yes. >> Mr. Dphano. >> Yes. >> Mrs. Donio. >> Yes. >> Mrs. Fallon. >> Yes. Mrs. Geraldo, >> yes. >> Mrs. Hunter, >> yes. >> Mr. Fa, >> yes. >> Mrs. >> Yes. >> And Mr. W. >> Yes. Motion carried. We're going to We
have an addition that's not on your printed agenda. This will be item number 28. It's the at Mr. Ramsey the administration's request hiring of Tori Dame a on step one as an English teacher at Hampton High School and this is a
replacement position. >> So I'll entertain a motion on that. >> Second. Mr. Grata first, Mr. Koy is second. Again, this is a this is a >> English it's a high school English position replacement for an existing
teacher who retired. >> So, roll call. >> Mrs. Baronado, >> yes. >> Mr. Puya, >> yes. >> Mr. Dphano, >> yes. >> Mrs. Donio, >> yes. >> Mrs. Fallon, >> yes. >> Mrs. Geraldo, >> yes. >> Mrs. Hunter, >> yes. >> Mr. Poa, >> yes. >> Mrs. Skola, >> yes.
>> And Mr. Lions, >> yes. Motion carried. That takes us to the end of our items for this evening. This is the second opportunity for anybody in the public wishing to be heard. Step on up to the microphone, give us your name and address, talk to the board. Okay, seeing none, I'll
Mr. Thomas, apologize. >> First and foremost, I apologize. >> I I missed your beginning of that time. Is it possible Sorry. >> I'm sorry. >> No, I'm just saying I would like a copy.
That's a lot of good information. >> Yeah. I I don't know what I missed though, but yeah. >> Yeah. Can you send that to everybody on the board? >> Great. >> No problem. Okay. Very good. I'll take a motion to adjurnn. >> Motion. >> Mr. Cory first.
>> Second. >> Second. >> Mrs. Skull one, I guess. Second. All in favor? >> I >> post. Thanks everybody. We're journeying.