Okay, welcome. I call our meeting order and as always I will start with the public participation at town of Hatfield select board meetings. The Hatfield Select Board welcomes everyone to its meetings and to all public meetings of the town of Hatfield. All regular and special meetings of the boards and
committees of the town of Hatfield shall be open to the public and shall conform to the open meeting law. Executive sessions are closed to the public and will be held only prescribed by the statutes of Commonwealth of Massachusetts. It is important to recognize that the open meeting law
affords the opportunity to listen to the proceedings but not necessarily participate during meetings of the select board. An attempt will be made to find a balance between hearing from members of the community and conducting the required business of the Hatfield select board. for the public's
information. This meeting is being recorded. Under announcements, uh I announce with great sadness the passing of our building inspector, Kyle Scott, who recently passed away. Kyle's been uh the town building inspector
since I believe 2014. He was well respected with all the different contractors and he worked well with all the contractors in the area. So, uh, my condolences and I believe the board's condolences to Kyle's family and we're
we're sorry for his passing. It's it's sad to start a meeting that way, but uh, he was a good guy. So, I don't know if anybody else wants to make any comments on that or announcement. >> Just had a great relationship with him and he was a fantastic building inspector and a good person in general.
So, very sad to see him pass. >> He will be missed. >> He will be missed. Uh >> and on the other hand, Andrew did have a new child. So I mean, >> congratulations. >> Congratulations.
>> Okay. Uh is anybody Let's see. Those are the announcements. Anybody here for public forum? >> John is again under public forum. We can't respond to anything because it's unless it's on the agenda.
John P, chair of the commission like to tell people to beware of farm equipment be on the road. There's already farmers land everything. We have a sled for member that has been collecting sap. You know the traffic on these roads are very
you say dangerous sometimes. So please be aware of the equipment, the people, the personnel around them. Again uh you don't want to have emergency services going out. We signed to anybody horse horses being ridden or
or you know headed off with people walking. Please be safe out there. Thank you very much. Is anybody else here for public forum? If not, we're going to have a change on our agenda. We're going to go with Zephr
behavior first. So, if Zephr would come up, please uh introduce yourself. uh provide your names and and the purpose of being here this evening. >> Awesome. Well, my name is Rachel Paul and I'm joined by Oriana Visidlo. Um and
we're from Zephr Behavioral Healthcare, which is right across the street here. And essentially, we're just kind of seeking permission from the town of Hatfield to host a short parade on Main Street. Um the parade is going to be a part of our autism acceptance festival, which is celebrating 5 years of Zephr
behavioral healthcare. Um, and so the parade would be on April 25th, and uh, we're kind of asking for Main Street to be closed, a short portion of Main Street between 145, um, and 2:30. And essentially, it would start, um, in
Zephr's parking lot, which is behind the Hatfield General Store, and then just kind of end at the Hatfield um, pavilion on Billings Way. >> Um, this was something that was also approved back in 2023, and it was a very successful event that was hosted. Um the
police chief and fire department back then were involved in it and it was a great time. Um they have been invited again this year. Overall, we feel like this is a really great opportunity for families and children with autism to be able to come together in the community
and gain access to um resources provided and we would really appreciate the town's approval to host this parade. >> Wonderful. The only question I have is the police chief been discussed in this and Ed and while they're a little short staffed right now wants to make sure
they can make this work. So >> I I thank you guys for all you do. I I personally have no issue with you having a small parade and having your event. I don't know. >> I have no issue with that. Thanks. Great. >> Went off without a hitch last time. So >> So I guess we'll put that into a motion.
I believe we need a motion on that. >> Is it a motion or just a permit? >> You can make the motion to to approve it and then we'll record it and should be fine. >> Okay. Hi. I'll make a motion to approve Zephr behavior request for a small parade down Main Street, April 25th from
1:45 till 2:30. >> Motion made. Second. >> Motion seconded. Any discussion? All in favor? >> Motion carries. Okay, you're all set. Thank you. >> Thank you very much. Appreciate it. >> Okay. >> And we're still going out of order. So,
uh, Yui wanted to go with >> What did you want want to go next? So, let's talk about the health insurance next if that's all right. >> Okay, we'll go with the health insurance. Uh, we have anybody here for health insurance? >> Yeah, I'll I'll I'll tee it up uh quickly. Um, and then I know we have some folks here who are are willing to
answer questions um that the board has and I try to give the the board as much background as possible on what's going on. But, uh we have um as a lot of people know who've been following these meetings uh seen large increases in our healthcare costs. We're currently insured through the Hampshire County
Group Insurance Trust. our employees receive uh insurance through Blue Cross Blue Shield. Uh last year uh there was a 20% increase scheduled uh in rates uh followed by a mid-year increase in October of an additional 20%. So uh if you look at our overall healthcare
costs, they have increased significantly from around $700,000 in our budget to next year's planned amount is is around close to um $1.35 million. So we've seen large increases in healthcare costs. Uh while our members are happy with the
healthcare through Blue Cross, we those costs have have led us to look for other options. We had a long discussion earlier this year about potentially moving to the group insurance commission through the state. We also looked at quotes through the Maya. Um we've also continued to be stay uh involved with the Hampshire County Group Insurance
Trust to to to help uh um try to see if there's changes that can be made in the trust. Um we found that the leadership uh uh much improved in the trust this year and and there's been good things happening there. We did also receive a proposal this year uh for a self-insured
model um through uh brokers at Fernrock Benefits Consultants and this came in you know somewhat uh recently um but it was shared with our insurance advisory committee and shared with our public employee committee our PEC uh and we've been uh reviewing this as it would uh
involve only a 7 and a half% increase in in rates this year versus the 12.5% that was approved through the Hampshire County Group Insurance Trust. Also, the Hampshire County Group Insurance Trust um will be moving to having deductibles and higher co-pays. Deductibles will be
$250 per individual, $500 per family plan, and then um increased deductibles, most notably on specialists, which would move from $35 to $60, and a number of other uh inpatient deductible uh copay increases as well. So, I've made the
board aware of the proposal from Fern Rock as well as, you know, uh, updated them on everything going on with the trust. We do have representatives here tonight from both the trust and from Fernrock Benefits Consultants should the board have questions. The deadline for
deciding to exit the trust is April 1st, and we've been proceeding by looking at different options. Uh, but it's looked like the best move would be to to continue with the trust. Um, at this time we do have this other proposal um that you know is is worth considering
and I've you know made the board aware of how this proposal works but I do want to give you time to either ask any questions or allow either a short presentation or or bullet points from uh Fernrock if that's helpful and from the trust as well. But I I do want the town to know that we did form an advisory
committee and maybe you can explain a little bit about the advisory committee and what they've they've been recommending to the town. >> That's correct. Yeah, the insurance advisory committee is required by by state law uh to review any changes to insurance especially if there's plan
design changes. So this group was formed this year. We we did not have one in the past. um and they will continue to weigh in on any potential changes to um uh plan design. The potential move to a new insurer as long as there's no plan
design changes is uh only a decision of the select board. Uh but any plan design changes need to be reviewed by the AAC and then approved by the PEC uh rather than by the select board. What uh we're considering right now is potential um uh
change in carrier and change in in who our insurance is received from uh rather than a change in plan design. Um the IA reviewed this potential move uh to a self-insured model through firm rock and
we had I'd say a split uh in in the reviewers of uh which direction they advise going in. Um, I'd say around three uh were to to Fern Rock. About four were thinking of staying with the uh Hanford County Group Insurance Trust
and one uh said they could really go either way. Uh and we have a couple of those members here tonight who can definitely speak if they'd like to to discuss more about the IA's discussions. >> Yes. But I and also I mean if if I guess
the options we were talking earlier if you stay with the present plan you can always change next year. If you uh move to this plan once you move off of of the plan you're presently on then it's
probably no going back. And if you move to GIC it's probably uh another option right? So, it's still trying to figure out which direction is the best direction cuz the costs have keep increasing on health insurance for
everybody and it's been a national national issue. So, I I know that the board has been looking at this and looking at different options. So, I don't know if they're looking at something that's cheaper or what if the
advisory board's even split on this too, right? I mean, your advisory board isn't 100% behind one plan or another. Correct. There basically >> Yes, there were different um because there's different pros and cons of of each plan. Uh I I think that that came
to the forefront. There's, you know, a different insurer that we'd have to move to if we went to the self-insured route. And I think that that was a concern for some folks. Um you know, a change can be difficult. And um you know there's also some considerations that if we were to move uh runoff costs with the trust
would be the responsibility of the town and those could be significant. So we're still trying to decide if it would be worth it to make this change. You know it looks like um through the self-insured model that on paper you'd be saving because we've moving to 7 and a half% increases over this year rather
than 12 and a half% increases. It could save around $50,000 over the next year. Um which is significant for our budget. Um but at the same time those runoff costs could be large as well. So we need to consider that. >> So I mean you we have a cut off date. We
have to know this by right. >> We do need to make our decision by you would make it tonight. >> By tonight I'll let my colleagues weigh in on their opinions. >> I I agree with what you said. Um,
I don't think we necessarily we if we leave the Hampshire County Group Insurance Trust. It's very unlikely we will get back into it, at least at the rate that we're paying. So, um, I do like I would like to explore this more. I just think that
unfortunately we need some more time to be able to look into it. Um, because those runoff costs could be could be substantial. But there's also years that we could see large gains returned back to the town as well. Um,
so there's definitely a a cost benefit that we should review, but I don't think we're going to have time to do that in the next 20 minutes. >> No, I I agree 100%. I think that, you know, saving $50,000 is very nice, but if we have any runoffs from the
insurance, then we've lost that gamble. >> Yeah. and Blue Cross is a the health insurance that the employees have right now is really really good, I think. And I I I'd rather not take a chance of losing that that excellent service that
you get from Blue Cross right now. >> So you you if I'm hearing you guys correctly, for this coming year, you'd like to stay with what there is. >> I think >> what is what's the contract length for the for the trust? Is it just yearbyear? >> It would be an additional year. Y.
>> So, have another opportunity to >> Yeah. I mean, I personally I'd like to talk to a couple other towns that have moved to uh more of a self-insured direction, especially if another town of our size um with potential,
you know, the same financial constraints that we have and find out how it's working for them. Are they seeing, you know, 3 years of cost savings and then maybe one year where you have some some additional expenses that kind of even stuff out? Where does stuff land with
that and how can we better financially plan for it? Um, you know, certainly we can't keep seeing 20 40% increases yeartoear through the trust and I don't think that any town that's part of the trust will continue to tolerate that either. So, um,
>> and the problem being we're on a time time limit and this third option just came up. Uh, and we really had no time to even review it. Just some discussion on it. Correct. >> I do I like the structure of it that if there is cost savings at the end of the
year, that's then returned back to the town. Correct. like >> if if it would help. Would you like to hear from the the broker who who presented this at least for a short presentation or just little information? >> That's f I mean if my colleagues are entertain it. Yeah.
>> Yeah. And then we can let the the trust give us a quick update on on where they're at. So uh Anthony Lively from uh uh from Rock Benefits Consulting, would would you like to to give a quick update? >> Absolutely. Yeah. I'm going to attempt to share my screen here too if I can. Unfortunat un unfortunately they uh they
can't see it uh here in the room. I don't know John if they can see it at no on YouTube. No. So so if the screen is helpful for you please do it. I can see it. Um and we'll we'll record it here but yeah go ahead. >> Absolutely. Absolutely. So thanks for having me. Uh Anthony Lively um president co-founder of Burn Roth
Benefit Consultants. Um you know again I I'll I'll just you know I'll run through through the 10,000 foot view explain a little bit about what we came up with. Um, but first off, I'd just like to thank thank you all for, you know, spending some time and and donating a
lot of time to your community. Um, I I'm sure you probably don't get thanked enough. Uh, I I spent a lot of my free time uh as chair of my my my small town of Shirley Mass finance committee and and I know um there's not a lot of thank yous thrown around. So, thank you for for doing everything you do for your
community. Um, I'm sure you don't hear it enough. Um, so I'll jump right in. Um, a little bit about Burnrock. Um we're basically 100% mass municipal focused um consulting firm uh for municipalities.
Um we have over 100 uh years combined u municipal experience. I've been in this industry for the last 16 years. Um we are a newer firm uh but again um our our roots uh date back uh over almost 30
years um into into this business and and and have has worked with collectively over 200 municipalities. Um and I I can go into more detail on that, but suffice to say this is what we do and we're very passionate and we feel
that in the municipal sector um it's difficult to find uh levers to pull that can benefit u employees and and the community um and uh save on costs. And that's what we we try to do um with the way that we structured these plans. Um,
and I think I'll jump right in by saying, you know, you guys aren't alone with seeing un unsustainable cost increases, um, crazy uh, system complexity, um, pharmacy cost pressure, difficulty with transparency. I know, you know, that's, you know, that that's
something that's come up amongst trust members um, and and others uh, and fully insured arrangements. Um, so that's something we're seeing across the board. Um, and I have I think Andrew has a packet that we put together, but the >> and the board just current enough that
they they have that premise. >> Um, the current structure we have um is is similar to the captive structure that we we we presented to you as self-insured. Um, but there's some differences and I and I want to spend a little bit of time highlighting that.
Um, so we've we've been in the joint purchase group space for a very long time. um our COO, her father started um uh I think it was nine of the 11 joint purchase groups across the state um and uh her firm supported uh nine of those.
I also worked at that firm the firm uh in one capacity another um and have been around this space for a long time and we've studied it and and essentially the trust is operating in what we call 1.0 model and essentially that means that everything goes into a pool, everybody
shares first dollar coverage. Um, and the board sets the rates, the surplus stays with the trust. Um, we've kind of developed this captive structure. Um, we do have multiple communities that I think Andrew has talked to that are are part of this now um with similar
programs, but essentially um it pools risk still u but at a higher level at your higher claims. Um the employer still pays monthly level premium. Uh it goes into the cap's insurance pool and into your own for benefit of account. Um
and you as an employer choose cost control levers and ways to um reduce cost. And when I say that there's a lot of things that I can point to, but we'll get into that, you know, shortly. And I'll try to keep this brief. The other thing, and I think somebody mentioned it, um is surplus stays with attributed
to the community. So that's an important structure uh a structural difference. Um another a couple points uh under the captive structure that we're proposing is full payments transparency um uh custom cost control strategies and the next thing I'm going to get into is
a multi-level risk protection and I think that's a key difference. So we're showing you a rate um at the seven and a half% uh that Andrew mentioned. Um but included in that the protections are much different um than what you're
seeing uh in your current arrangement. Um you right now have what's called specific stop-loss insurance. Um and that's covers each individual and I believe that level is at $400,000 in claims. So that's a rather large number. Um but that's currently how it's
structured and you're part of a big trust and you have that. Um this proposal also includes another type of stop-loss coverage that's called aggregate coverage. Um, and that aggregate coverage essentially covers you as things run run away. So, it could
be a lot of claims, not just large claims. So, it's it's individual caps and then it's an overall cap essentially is an easy way to to um explain it. And what this helps to do is set up an employer like yourself. This program is
built for smaller employers to be able to have month level monthly premiums for both the employee and the employer. So when we put this together, we we we've we've built this in a in a in a different way that enables you to have all the advantages of the trust where
you have your risk is spread out um between uh I think it's 296 employers um over 45,000 members, but you're pulling at the stop-loss level, at the higher claim level, not at dollar one coverage. So that helps avoid some of the issues
that we see around transparency and decision-m etc. and helps you to be able to be nimble to make changes. Um, and then again, I have another slide that um that talks about this really well, but basically what we do is with the aggregate
coverage is when we build your rates, a reinsurer decides what they expect your claims to be. And then at 25% above that, they they have what's called an aggregate attachment point. And I know I'm getting really far in the weeds, but I think it's important for you guys to
understand the differences between what you have in front of you. And that's where we set the rates at that 125 um uh percent attachment point. So, what does that mean? It means that you're you're going to have level rates for a 12-month
period. Whereas with the current structure, you're going off a projected rate that is developed by the consultant. That's what they do. that's their job. This is projected by the reinsurance carrier and backed up um
with aggregate insurance coverage. So you fund to max. So that's how it it it differs. Um and I think that's a huge advantage because it gives you a much more secure financial structure um that backs this up. And again, as a smaller employer, again, you guys aren't a huge
trust. Um it gives you the the the the backing, but also the potential for surplus, etc. Um, so again, I I jumped into the weeds pretty far there. Um, but the reason I wanted to do that is just to explain the difference. And I think everybody's seen last year there was a
large midyear rate increase with this program. We we're we're building at that max cost structure. Um, so that doesn't happen. Um, so again, um, you know, there there's a lot to discuss here, but I think, um, it's just it's fair to, you know, kind of explain a little bit about
the differences and and the advantages to both structures. Um, there's a lot that we do with this plan. Um, but the main goal is we help members to better manage their health and and have programs and tools available to for them
to do that. And I can go through a ton of information on this, but like again there's diabetes care of me never, you know, takes part in that. Um they're they get their medications for free. Um and the reason why we do that is because if somebody's adherent with those
programs instead of a 2% cost increase per year, um that you know you're looking at a 15% for somebody that's unmanaged. So there's a lot of programs second opinion service uh free telea medicine all all these things that we do as part of this that really help to get members the care they need and make sure
they're able to get it which helps reduce costs overall. Um and we do spend a lot of time with the high cost claims and making sure that we're getting pharmacy in the way best way possible. Um people are getting the care they need. Um and again typically if somebody
engages in one of these programs their costs go down. Um, so it's a really um it's really kind of our focus um in the way that we do things. Um, and I I'll I'll just run through the quote that we put together. So again, one of the key
differences between the option that we put together and what's on table from the trust and I think everybody pointed to it is the plan design. We believe that's the last cost control measure um that we like to use. It's certainly a tool that we do use, but we feel that there's other things that we're able to
do. So, we we proposed this um with no plan design changes for the employees um in terms of co-pays, deductibles, things like that. Um it is based upon using the Harvard Pilgrim network um and United Network um outside of Maine, New
Hampshire uh and uh Massachusetts. So it's hard filled locally and then people can use the United um and EPO plan um which is it's on an EPO chassis instead of HMO chassis means that members under this plan do not need to get referrals. Um so again it is um a
very member-driven plan um and um the rates set forth um that that you know Andrew mentioned are um are are you know again it's it's structured in a much different way financially. Um, is there any questions so far? Um, and again,
I'll wrap up pretty shortly here, but I just wanted to kind of address kind of the key differences. I I will say, you know, I'll stop there and I have a few points to add, but um, >> any questions? >> I have a couple. Um,
so I your current proposal has no plan change in it. Um, but with the trust, we're moving to a two, we would have to move to a $25,500 deductible. So, is it safe
to assume that if you included a two a plan change in that to move to a deductible that we would see even greater savings? >> So, we're comparing apples to apples. >> Um, I I do think you would see a a small savings. I would say that that would be
the last lever that we would take um in terms of changes. We we would prefer not to do that. And the reason is is because we want to um help members to better manage their health. And anything we can do to remove those barriers, we do. And and and the loads, the rate when you
look at the max detachment point with a with an actuary um is minimal. You're talking a point or two. So the savings isn't as good. And and I'll and I'll give you the reason that I fully believe that and and what we see is typically two to 3% of claimments in any given
year and they could be different are driving um about 50% of your your spend. So if we add a $250 or $500 deductible, that's not going to really change that that much, but it may change somebody that's going to get a screening or something like that. So plan design is
again the last thing we like to change. We feel like we can better procure uh medications. We can put in chronic care management programs that help members to be healthy and save uh more money doing that and and we can prove that by what the stop-loss carriers actually give us
for discounting for those programs. Um much more than plan design changes. But again, to your point, we can certainly this is your program. Um it's it's administered by Health Plans Inc. They're um a fully uh they're part of 32 Harbor Pilgrim. Um, but they're fully
customizable, so we can um we can design the plan uh in in any way you see fit. >> The other question I have is that we currently receive a discount for paying in full. Um, and we have Right. >> That's for um Hampshire County retirement. >> Oh, this.
>> Yeah, we get the we get the same thing. We do we do the same thing for our retirement and then I think we do the same thing for our PNC. We pay that in advance as well in Shirley. Same thing. >> That's all I got. No, I'm good. We have a time crunch
here. We have a full agenda and we have the finance committee coming in. So, I don't think we have much more time for discussion on this topic. >> Want to quickly allow for anything from the the trust for insurance trust? It's up to you. I mean, right now I'm I'm saying because of this new new option
that came up, we we still don't know a lot about it except what we're being presented. Mhm. >> And it just seems if we have to make a decision tonight, it just seems to me it makes more sense to stay with what we got and then during the remainder of the
year continue the advisory commission to look at this and come up with uh review this and re review everything and then we'll have more information for the next next year because we're under the time
crunch basically. I don't see >> I I would tend to agree and same thing if we see an an increase from the trust outside of what they're already projecting like another mid-year increase I cannot imagine that we would
stay. >> I have a hand raised from Marielle and Collerwood of the Mass Teachers Association. Would you like to allow her to speak or would you like to move on? Well, I mean I I wish we had more time for this topic because we have a full agenda, but I mean I'm willing if if my
colleagues want to move in the other direction, that's fine with me. But I I mean and you're if we were to vote right now, which direction would you say we need to go in? >> You going to go with the cost savings? >> I'm on the fence. I mean, I could be
persuaded. I mean, I think Greg likes the Blue Cross Blue Shield that he presently has, right? And so he he's not and I don't know if you're aware of this new plan. >> Yeah. >> As much as I could be, I just read it today.
>> I mean, it's I I I know the intent of this plan is to save money, but we we're just getting everything >> I'm okay with tonight. It's like, are we guaranteed the savings? And I mean, is it what it really is? I mean, I I don't
know. And we did have an advisory commission to help guide us through this process. And they're divided on two plans. And I don't know if they even reviewed this. >> They they would have reviewed this. This this is the the other proposal they were considering. And there were some members
who you know did feel strongly about moving that direction and others who felt strongly about staying with the trust. So it was >> it's a difficult decision. They were divided. >> So right now would you say the advisory commission wants this plan? >> I would say the advisory committee
weighed more towards staying with the trust. The the town's pec the public employee committee uh uh was more strongly towards uh the self-insured model through Fern Rock. It's somewhat different membership. >> So, we have since we have to make a
decision tonight. Uh, do you require any more information? >> I don't. >> Okay. I mean, do you feel you can vote right now on on this?
>> Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Sure. We probably don't have to do anything unless we're moving. >> That's right. You would only make a motion if you intended to move. So I mean I am in the middle here. So I'm I
I like to go with the majority of the advisory commission. The majority of the advisory commission wanted this this new plan that we're talking about or they want >> the advisory committee I would say uh
would would say to to stay with the Hanford County Group Insurance Trust. >> Okay. So, the PEC, the public employee committee, which represents our unionized workforce, um was strongly in favor of of Fern Rock, the the um the self-insured model.
>> And the advantage of that is if we stay with the present plan, they can always we can always change next year, right? >> That's correct. >> Yeah. >> We have the ability to change in the future >> and that and that during this next year, we would have more time they would have
more time to review Yep. all three. you have more time to to research whatever else you'd like. Yep. >> Okay. So, I as as we talked earlier today, I that's I'll stick with that decision. >> So, I'm not going to get Well, I want to stick with staying with what we have and
then I still recommend the advisory commission to keep meeting and reviewing the insurance so we get more information. That's that's where I'm coming from. I don't know where I know you're looking at cost savings. So, you're looking at towards this. Is that
what you're saying? >> I would say that I would lean more heavily towards this the Fern Rock self-insured model. >> Okay. And you're leaning which way? >> I saying where we were. I think it's too much of a gamble to to switch for $50,000 and take the chance that we get
some runoff. We might end up as far as the town is concerned. >> We We might We might end up Hold on a second. Hold on. >> Hey, hold on. >> Sorry. Just one second. Um he he'll be right back. >> Hold on. I I just think that after, you know, after saving the $50,000, if
there's runoff and we have to pay more than $50,000 for the town, we'll have to eat that up. The town will not save any money. And I think it's kind of a gamble. I I don't want to take that kind of gamble. >> You want the response from Anthony or would you rather not? >> Go ahead, Anthony.
>> Yeah, I I just wanted to just point out one thing and I again I do appreciate the consideration. I know there's time constraints here. Um, I just want to point out that I think, you know, there is a $50,000 savings, but I think the financial structure is is with the
aggregate coverage. Um, that helps with alleviating the the idea of a mid-year rate increase, and I know that was a major budgetary impact for you guys last year and a lot of other communities. So, I think again and the runoff certainly consideration. Um, but I I do believe
the town does have some money on deposit for that. I know most communities do. Um, so again, just couple things food for thought, but when you're considering the delta, also consider that um that this is a this includes more protection than the current trust option. Um, and
and again, I'll stop there. I appreciate you letting me pipe in. >> I think that was also that was probably my biggest concern is that the trust can say we're only they're only raising us 12% now, but like last year was 20 and then an additional 20. What's going to happen in June this year?
>> Yeah. and and you know, so that's the reason that I'm probably leaning more towards this this news source, but I just don't have a lot of trust left in the trust.
>> Yeah. >> So, uh, we we got to move this along. We have to make a decision. I am I'm gonna I'm gonna stay with stay with Hampshire County and then next year if things
change we we switch out. I mean for now because I >> it sounds like that's what you guys are both more comfortable with. This isn't a hill that I'm going to die on. So >> this Yeah. Well, this this is this it sounds like a good deal also, but I mean I just found out about it today. I would like to talk, like I said, to some other
smaller communities that have moved to this and seen >> um at least get some data back on. >> Yeah, that'll give >> what was their risk. I I do like the two different between the aggregate stop-loss and well the specific stop loss. I think it does offer us a lot of protections, but I would like to see
some data from some other towns as well. >> Perfect. So, we >> keep investigating it. We'll have time to investigate that the next year and keep the advisory committee together to help us investigate. So,
>> I do have one last super fast question. >> Okay. >> And Andrew, you might be able to answer this. If there is a mid-season rate increase with the trust, are we allowed to drop mid-contract and explore another option like this? >> I believe it would be difficult to do so. Um, we really are, you know, insured
through the trust throughout the year, but we we can always discuss what that would look like. >> Okay. >> All right. So, we're staying where we're at. >> So, thank you everybody for um there's a lot of people on this call right now. I appreciate your your interest in this and following along and and folks for
the information. Anthony, thank you very much. And from from the trust, Danielle and Mariana, thank you for being on. Um, and we'll continue to to follow this and keep the board closely apprised of what's happening. Thank you so much for your time and consideration. I really appreciate the audience and um everybody from the
town's been great and I appreciate them um looking at other options for their community. Appreciate you guys. Take care. >> Thank you. >> So, would you like to make an emotion? >> I don't think we need one. >> Yeah, nothing's needed if you're staying with the trust. >> We don't need a motion, right? >> Yep. >> We can leave it the way it is.
>> All right. So, as we've been skipping around, I'd like to go to uh the consent agenda, the approval of the minutes before we move any further. I don't forget. >> All right. I'll make a motion to approve the March 10th, 2026 meeting.
>> Second. >> Motion made. Motion seconded. Any discussion? All in favor? Motion carries. Okay. Um, fire chief is here, so we'll go with him next. We'll move to the South County EMS response. I believe
that's what our fire chief wants to discuss. >> Yes. And I wanted to make sure we discussed this as well since we hinted at this in the the meeting when we went over the the fire chief's budget. We have received this letter from South County EMS u discussing how we will be
build u $350 uh per response from uh South County um when they respond to uh the town when we do not have coverage. So chief, I don't know if you want to take it from here. Uh Andrew is the one that added this to the agenda. Um I know
that the discussion was if we wanted to have a discussion with South County. Um this conversation's kind of been going on with South County for a number of months. I know Chief Sparks from South County met with his board of overseers um from the three communities. And it
sounds like based on the letter, they've done their due diligence and if anybody saw the article in the recorder or the gazette, um, you know, they they ran the numbers and this is what it is. So, I think it was really whether or not the town was trying to negotiate with them to see if they would lower that price.
Um, from my standpoint, I believe that they probably have already done their due diligence and that price is what they're going to offer. I don't foresee it going down if we were going to try to negotiate with them. >> Okay. Well, it is what it is, right?
>> I believe that's to be the case. I mean, it we could ask as a community, but I just my gut feeling is is that that is probably the number that they've come up with over the last 8 to 10 months as this has kind of stretched out a little bit and the more more that they had been
coming here. >> I don't foresee it changing. No. >> Is this going to be some sort of contract that we have with them? >> I believe there will be an agreement once once it goes through just says that this is exactly what it is for that price.
>> Yeah. >> Yeah. I mean, >> that's where we are. >> To me, I thought, you know, we potentially had the option to try to say, would you prefer just a a flat fee or something instead? We could calculate an average and then, you know, there's less administrative cost that way. They they might want that. Um or we could try
to counter with a lower fee. We could do something else. But I I think it's a chief saying most likely there's not going to be a lot of wiggle room on this. And uh you know it is it is fair in a lot of ways if they'd want to charge for it. Um in the first year of this uh since we we didn't really know this was uh coming at least in this form
until now. We believe we can cover most of this through our our ambulance trust fund and and we can also add some budget to this. Um but we'll need to scramble to to come up with a way to pay these fees. So it'll count uh it'll cost around $65,000 a year. >> All right.
>> So just for the record, it would be ambulance revenue, not ambulance trust. >> Yep. Ambulance revenue. >> All right. >> Well, thanks for the update. Appreciate it. >> So we'll plan to respond to the chief with just a we understand this is the case and we'll
>> Yeah, that sounds fine. >> Andrew, you know that with that that was not in the original budget proposal. So that will be >> an addendum just as the funding source as we move forward. >> Yep. >> Okay. Thank you. >> I'm gonna stay out of order and Steve,
since you're here, I'll bring you in next uh with community preservation because the finance committee is at 6:30. So I don't want you to have to wait too long. Uh we thank community preservation
committee chair for being here this evening. What we request is having committees come forward so they can tell the town what they're up to, what what they're looking forward to at town meeting, what they're going to be presenting, and sort of an update on
what they've been doing. So thank you for being here and I'll hand it over to you Steve. >> Okay. Thank you. Thanks for having us. Um so there were 15 applications that were reviewed between November 10th and
February 24th and the um seven that were uh moved forward for consideration for Warren and uh town meeting were um supplemental funding for the church steeple uh rehabilitation including the
town clock that involved it was a um written by uh the town administrator with the details provided by Mark Gelot. It had gone uh under $3,000 over for the increased scaffolding rental and the price of the gold paint. Of course, the
town owns the clock. Um the uh steeple was actually the um original uh project for the community preservation um act uh funding from the town because it's considered um uh a uh icon and you can
do that even though the quid proquo really is just the the visual percept of the steeple but it's an important structure in the town and and was so approved. The second was um a housing production plan. Um the last plan was
2015. Absent a plan, the town's at risk for uh an unfriendly 40B coming in. And um this was um something that maybe could have been produced in house um in a perfect situation which never with
staffing can occur or it seems to occur. So, they're still I believe uh waiting on Isabelle Jagger, assistant town planner, and Andrew Lavine are waiting on um uh an eco help me Andrew. Eco. >> Yeah, the uh the states uh eco onetop
grants uh the planning assistance grants that we have applied for for this assistance. So, if we receive that, then shouldn't need the CPA funds, but if we don't, be very helpful. So, as a safeguarding measure, we approved $40,000 at the request in case um a
grant fails to come through. um the school street park restoration. Um that was a an important project and there is need to uh refurbish and we had a comprehensive uh explanation of the
project by uh our new DPW director uh with a couple requests to have an option one or option two for the playgrounds who um have the final decision be in the recreation commission's uh uh you know
under their purview. We had as our committee preferred uh option two and then the only additional change was a request to have for accessibility uh purposes um one of the uh swing sets
become a a blue quote blue bucket swing. Um the um there's a seven Elm Street uh a property owned by Michael Bartlett um was um ate up a lot of time. the town
other than um the town since since the inception in 2006 of the Community Preservation Act has not been successful in generating um a lot of housing projects. In fact, none was ever approved on town floor. So this this
frankly ate up um a lot of time and a lengthy well um rendered motion um done primarily by Isabelle but with Joerger assistant town planner with Andrew's
input and my input uh was introduced into the minutes verbatim which will cover a lot of the uh needed safeguards when you're doing this early money, quote, early money for um an affordable housing project is is done. Community
preservation act money is used. The town right now is at 2.7% for affordable housing. And um the project was amended to be an 8 unit uh uh apartment with two of the units. So 25%
um at 80% AMI and being two out of eight or 25% lets you allows a community to check off on its subsidized housing count the eight units. Um, so that would help us with um the h affordable housing
stock in fact and the appearance that we're starting to do something about this. Um, the Cutter Farm Museum uh roof and siding replacement was money appropriated last year. There was a grant that looked attractive. So the
appropriation for last year was um with the understanding um that the town administrator would do the work to um look for another grant. In the process of doing that and speaking with uh consultant, I believe that was what
happened. Angie, you found out that the money there originally wasn't going to be enough. Um there was a follow through. You're waiting to hear on the grant I >> Yep. And um so this would be a metal roof that the historic commission has has
decided is um historically correct for uh a barn, a tobacco barn, and that'd be siding. And of course, John Peas is on um the CPC committee and has a lot of information about this, but that was also approved. Two projects came in
late. Um, one was for a APR contribution for the Glanca farm, half of which or a portion of which is in weight, a portion in Hatfield, and that was approved. And then uh with the Brian N Brian Nicholas, you know, spearheading the day pond
restoration uh project very skillfully, um you couldn't they the inland dredging project uh grant uh wasn't received that that that um whole animal that whole um inland
dredging program ended. uh the uh dredging came in more and another about $28,000 was requested. At this point kind of the CPC felt well the town's all in on this. We've got to finish it off
and it was approved. Um and so those are the seven that were approved for this year. >> Well, thanks for that. My only question is uh some questions I get from the residents in town. We still have some projects that were approved, but they've
never been done. What happens with those projects? There's uh the bridge uh walkway and there's the pickle ball court and I think those I don't know if there's any others that are that never
got accomplished. So every year by I think September 1st, we have to do this CPC3 report which takes us back historically to 2006. And of course those off the top of my head too are the famous ones. Um
from Bob Wagner to John Wils to myself and I'm putting Carrie on the spot, but hopefully maybe she'll be the new chair in the fall. Um um I'm really putting her as we got this on camera. >> On camera. >> Everybody in Hatfield just saw the look on my face.
>> All right. Um it it's come up a lot through Michael Bartlett who had to resign this year because he couldn't both be on the committee and spearhead his own uh application. Uh but Carrie, independent of Michael's suggestions, asked the same good questions. How do we
turn them? We need to have a process and decide perhaps with the town administrator andor select board how we formally return those monies pickle ball bridge uh and also how we procedurally um end them. So that there's some
guidance uh from the community preservation coalition. Andrew and I have spoken with Stuart Sagenor independent of one another and in concert and that's part of the administrative funds of the community preservation um committee's expenditures
is to be able to access that technical support. There's a few different options. So that's one of the things we need to do. And perhaps in if we were to revise the application process a little bit, ask people for reports every six months or so. So there's a little bit
more of a a timeline accountability built in. There never really has. It's always been uh something we wanted to get to next time. And frankly, we this year had trouble achieving quorum, let alone getting to some of this extra work. In fact, some of the statutory
required positions are um planning and um a uh rec commission representative, a conservation commission, historic commission, um and housing. And for the majority of this cycle, we didn't have any of those
folks. Carrie has nicely come on, was thinking of wreck, but we needed housing. And then Amy Novak has now been attending for historic. Um Mike McGrath was replaced by for the Tom moderator position and the select board position
is Kathine Chia Veroli. So it's for at times it was really John Peas, Michael Bartlett and myself and Katherine which doesn't make for quorum. So it was been difficult frankly. Um so that's really great question. it's an extra type of
work and amount of work and uh we'd have to kind of roll up our sleeves and do that and have some more guidance. >> Now the the other piece now going to housing um we we've been working on a housing trust, >> right? >> So I I believe Andrew's had some
discussion with you guys on the housing trust. Uh >> he did. There was a fund for h affordable housing trust request for $100,000. the technical stickler is that that trust has to exist as a well-formed uh correctly constituted trust and then
money can go into it. You can't do a supplanting of funds into a non-extant trust. That's clear from the statute. >> But if we were to form a trust, you'd be supportive of having that entity. >> No, in principle, we supported 100% it's a chicken and egg matter. >> In part, >> in grand discussion of that, in grand
discussion of it, it was if the trust was in in existence already. >> Yeah. it wouldn't have been a conversation that was tabled and it was only the the application was tabled because of the fact that it's not in place. >> The cart was very much before the horse day for sure. Um and the advantage to having a trust like that in part is you
know you talked about the difficulty in reviewing that application for affordable housing. If an entity like the affordable housing trust had folks who were trained and were specialized in these sorts of applications, they could be the entity that's then reviewing those sorts of applications like that in the future. >> Yeah. as as part of the motion for the
community for the affordable housing project, um a uh an amount of $10,000 was put in so that an affordable housing consultant also frequently um a type of thing
utilized by a community preservation committee because we all lacked and we at the time we knew we were lacking the expertise even if you pulled all the the big brains of the town. This has not been done before in town. We need
someone. It's a very tight technical area. We all needed help. So, that would be another benefit. And then uh of of us going ahead with an affordable housing project and then if we can then do the funding into a trust um we'll be really
uh financially and technically in a better position as a town. >> Okay. And the last question I get from towns people is how much money is in CPC and how is it broken down? I know like some of the money's been put aside for projects that are undone.
>> Some money was put in for housing. How how is that broken down now? >> Well, that's a good question. And uh when Bob Wagner was chair uh John Wils was treasurer and we haven't had that.
I've I've frankly I've been chair and clerk this year and I've been getting um some facts and figures at times through Lori Peicard who Pecard who's been a big big help to the committee. Um those numbers I can only answer at a course
level. At the town meeting last year we had uh around $2.9 million. Um and um you can't we've never robbed whatever was hund 100% of the housing money that we had. We still have all of
that because you can't ever rob Peter to pay Paul. On the town floor meeting last year, someone uh a fine question, I'm sure a good faith question. When Dave Pawn came up said, "Well, how much the person wasn't for they how much have you spent on housing?" And I tried to
explain that this is not in competition with housing. Yes, it's a good it's a good point that we haven't done anything in housing, but we've never stolen from the housing account. >> Um I will say this that we're in the top seven municipalities in the Commonwealth for the match.
>> Yeah, I know that question will probably be coming up again at town meetings. >> We'll have a little more homework done maybe by then. >> And I I I want to sort of cut this short because I know we got finance and stuff coming. it. They're already here. We're running over five minutes now. Do you
have anything else to add? And then I'll let my colleagues, my colleagues have any questions. >> I do not. >> Do you have anything? >> I just have one thing to express as we get to town floor with these articles and stuff. The town's people really need to get and understand that we need to be
doing affordable housing in this town. It is a process that we are well behind the eight-ball on and we need to do it because it's the step that this town needs to take action on and you can right now we have a ability to have a known resident who wants to do something
really good for this town and if the right steps are taken and we do it the right way it's going to be an excellent addition to this town and the first step for that to happen. So, I can't express that enough because I know we can get to town floor and have people that just may not want to hear it, but it's time.
>> I I agree with you. That's why we Andrew's been looking in that housing. >> I 100% my opportunity to give my little plug on it before we get to town floor and I'll give my plug again that night, too. But it's, you know, if people are concerned about it, we have plenty of meetings that they can come and sit on, too. So,
>> that's it. >> Good. >> Good. Good. >> Good. >> We're good. Hey, thank you for coming. We appreciate it. Thanks, Steve. >> Thank you. >> Thanks, sir. >> And we're going to move to let's see, let's see. We got might as well move to
finance and start doing our budgets, right? Yeah. So, >> okay, finance, come on on board and take your seats and >> seat. So, we um >> we'll just have Dave here tonight from finance. So, finance won't deliberate. We won't have an actual meeting of the
finance committee, but uh the finance committee did already receive the presentation from schools. So, you'll get to get caught up in that. I'll follow up with finance after and we'll also talk about scheduling another joint meeting because I think uh we can get more into the budget as soon as I would
argue next week. So, >> and after this presentation, we will continue our meeting with the rest of our agenda because we still have many items to get to. Okay, >> we'll get through it. They're not not so bad.
They have copies. >> This is this one. >> Looks like we have two copies of this. >> So, no, we don't have that. >> I'll go make copies. >> You guys can keep going. >> So, would you like to start with um schools?
>> That's fine. >> Sure. Great. So counter Christie, Adam, we're ready in time. >> Thank you. >> Same one. >> It should It's updated. >> Update. >> It's on glossy paper.
a nicer one. Okay. >> It's just what was in the printer. Can you give one to Marlo? We definitely have. >> But we have one for you, too. >> Perfect. >> And there should still be one left for David because it's updated. >> Well, thank you for being here this
evening. >> Thank you for having us. Thank you. Okay, I guess we'll turn it over to the schools and do your presentation and hopefully I don't know John's got this on. You don't you don't you don't have that
>> but we're going to speak to it. I think >> that you're going to speak to it. So that's >> all right. >> All right. Well, thank you for having us tonight. Um we're here to present our um our FY27 budget as you know. Um so we can we can dive right in. Um so I want
to start with kind of an acknowledgement of what we've been able to um do as a small as a small district. Um that really has high outcomes for our students. Um again with the with the support of the of the town. Um so I just
like to highlight some things that we've had going on in the district and and at Smith Academy. Um right now we have uh all said and done we have 83 different courses available at Smith uh which includes nine advanced placement courses. uh three concurrent enrollment
courses, which is an exciting new development this week or this year, sorry, where um students can take college level courses at Smith Academy on our schedule taught by our teachers and get credit for those >> for free. >> For free. >> Well,
yeah, if they if they want credit, they can. But um the the other um piece now that we have embedded which we had we had talked for a number of years about through a pace grant um but now it's well well established is computer science which is part of our general
curriculum now. Every student that comes through Smith Academy has computer science as part of what um what they get. Um they get it as part of the core curriculum, sixth through 9th grade, and then they can go on to do uh elective courses, AP courses, and we're hoping
next year to add another college level course uh in computer science. Um at this point, 70% of our juniors and seniors are currently enrolled in at least one college level course. um which that low that rate jumps to 80% uh when
you factor in AP courses just as a a point of comparison um that is about 20% just below 20% on average uh in the state of high school uh eligible high school students in a school um take part
in a dual enrollment or concurrent enrollment college level course. Um so 70 to 80% compared to 20%. It's pretty darn good. Uh likewise, we have 20% of our students um have been achieving the seal of biiteracy, which means that they
uh they're able to perform at a a fluent level um in two languages at the time of graduation. That's and huge thanks um to Angie Barnoski, our Spanish teacher, uh for doing that. The state average for a school is 5 to 7%. Um so again, we're
having good outcomes with our students. Uh just a couple students to highlight here, Anna Tudtol and Ian Gazowski. Um recently Anna was named the attorney general for student government day. Um she came in second in a statewide essay uh and speech contest. Um that that
brought students from throughout the Commonwealth together. Uh Ian played second saxs in the all state band last year. Um so we have we have some accomplished students that are coming out of Smith Academy. Uh we are able to provide 33 academic elective options.
So, um, things where students aren't necessarily required to take those courses, but they can choose to do so. We have 32 different X blocks that we will we can offer, um, which those are kind of our clubs, um, that are embedded within the school day. We provide international service trips, cultural,
language trips, um, and then annual field trips for enrichment for our students um, across the across the grade levels. Currently we have sports offerings which are um they exceed the precoid offerings which is is fantastic. This year we've
been able to field both uh subverarsity both softball and baseball teams for the first time since I've been there and since pre-COVID as well which is which is fantastic. Um, we have more than 50% of our students take advantage of our sports offerings
at Smith, which is a an extremely high percentage of students who are able to able to participate. Uh, this includes middle school, JV, and varsity teams. At Hatfield Elementary, we continue to support the arts, music, PE, steam in uh
that's science, technology, engineering, arts, and math for those of you who don't know. uh and banned for older students. Uh and we have field trips that are supported by a very robust and outstanding PTA at the elementary school. Uh and for the first time since 2015,
uh on a year-to-year basis, uh we have we have our enrollment has has gone up a little bit. Um and particularly this um this is the case at Smith Academy. We're comparing 7 through 12, not just because we have sixth grade in the building now. uh where we've seen um more students
this year than last year, which is a nice trend that we'd like to see continue. Um currently we have uh choice applications that are coming in daily. Uh they are stronger this year than they've been um even last year when we had a kind of a coordinated marketing
effort. Um they're stronger this year than they were last year. Right now we have 34 applications that have already been received for next year. 13 of those uh have said yes, we are definitely coming and filled out enrollment paperwork to um to accept their slots. Uh eight of those 13 are at Smith
Academy. So people are want to wanting to come. Um in terms of financials, that that increase in school choice represents about a $65,000 uh increase to our bottom line that we can anticipate as a floor right now for next
year. Um so that that brings us to to next year. What we're looking for um we're having success. Uh we also recognize that we have seen shifts in local student population. Um and and you know what we're looking for next year is is
essentially level funding. We're not asking for anything. Um, we built a budget this year that looks to downsize classes where it's appropriate. Um, and consolidate classes where it's appropriate with a goal of minimizing
any impact on what we're able to offer offer students. That has has got us to a place where we're meeting with the success. Um the um it does anticipate a slight increase to state funding which we're we
we can increase anticipate yeartoear. The things that that maintains that we're able to maintain with a level service sorry excuse me level funded budget uh includes two innovation pathways at Smith Academy which were new this year which we started. One is um
adventure leadership we're calling it um and the the other is u mental health a mental health innovation pathway. Uh it preserves the Vermont State University concurrent enrollment program which has been really successful and hopes to add two new cl new offerings for next year.
It preserves our AP offerings. Uh, and something that I'm particularly proud proud about um even when I having conversations with the community and with with the the tough conversations quite frankly with the staff um and teachers at both buildings is it preserves things like sports, music, the
arts, um specialty programs at AS. I think those things, if you if you've seen the news in surrounding areas and surrounding districts and surrounding towns, um Hatfield's not the only place that's looking that that's uh facing some some budget challenges next year.
Um and uh in a number of number of surrounding towns, the first things to go are things like arts, things like sports, um things that quite frankly add tremendously to our schools and to our community. Um, and so through everyone I
talked with, they the the the conversation has been the same. Please preserve the things that make our make our schools um as vibrant as they are, which are the arts, the extras, the extracurriculars, the sports, um things that bring people together.
Uh this maintains a star classroom at the elementary school, which saves us considerably on out of district tuition rates. Uh it includes the negotiated COLA for staff increases. Um and We'll we'll talk about this in more depth later. It includes more than a million
dollars in special education out of district tuition and transportation costs. Those costs have increased significantly over the years. We'll talk about that in a bit. Um that being said, we will need to, you know, we will need to be right sizing next year. We'll be we'll need to be
making cuts. Um so, uh to to do that, we're anticipating cuts to uh grades where we have fewer students. So, um, we have fewer kind kindergarteners that we're anticipating next year and fewer first graders. Um, we're able to
consolidate some of the core classes at Smith Academy. So, rather than eliminating elective courses, we can consolidate some of those core classes and they may be bigger, uh, but we'll still be able to to provide those classes and some of those electives that
um that that are that are vibrant. Um there is a possibility that we'll have a reduction of a few electives. Although I think what we're anticipating is some of those electives being run as halfyear courses. Um kind of a bridged versions rather than fully year courses. So
students will still get um get those opportunities. Uh and as I said, some class sizes will be slightly larger. Um and I say that with a little asterisk, slightly larger for Heatfield. Um, but I I think still on the small side
comparatively. Um, all in all all said and done, we're anticipating reductions of uh 5.5 full-time equivalent employees for next year from both schools. Um, so all total across both schools, five and a half um employees with an estimated
savings, as you can see, of $426,850. It's worth noting that that as Connor mentioned, other towns, our neighboring T school districts are also having these kind of cuts. You've probably followed along in the Gazette like we have. Um, our cuts are a smaller portion of our
total budget than what I've seen from any other district. So, I read about Sunderlands the other day and the number of cuts they're looking at just for their elementary are pretty close to what we're looking at districtwide. So, the fact that we were able to to do an
override several years ago really set us up to continue successfully. It's not quite it's not going to be fun or easy, but it's not as bad as what some of our neighbors are experiencing. >> Yeah. And I think it seems like almost every day you have there's a new article
with a a neighboring town, neighboring district um and kind of just the the astronomical um choices that they're having having to face. Um and we're we're fortunate that we're able to um you know take this as a you know kind of catch our breath sort of year. Um in
terms of budget um one one place that's important to note is we have a shift in in spending. Um we have as I mentioned before our out of district clo costs are um up fairly significantly. Um look to be like they may be up about half a
million dollars in the FY26 budget. Um that being said, that's that's included within this budget that we've presented. Um what's not included are potential wild cards that we don't know about um because you never know what what you don't know. Um so there is always a
potential for additional tuition placements. So those are out of district um placements that where we have a student uh whose needs we can't meet in district and we need to send them to a an approved um school uh for for those
needs to be met. Um this year we budgeted 126,000 and change higher than the previous year. um and we had to add uh 258,000 and change
uh to that overage because of those cost increases. Um we did that through school choice reserves which we're able to cover. Um we won't have those reserves next year. Um so if we have unanticipated out of district placements that that come to us
um we will need to to figure that out. We we we have we have um we budgeted for a rainy day. We we kept those in the reserve and it rained. Um and so that that's where that's where we were this year. Uh the the good news is that some
of those costs come back to us through what's called circuit breaker um or school choice claiming. So um we're we're able to able to recoup some of those costs. Um what we also don't know is the changing landscape of federal funding. Um, so right now we have
$168,000 that um, we've planned to and accounted for in our budget, which is about just under 2% of our budget um, from federal funding. We don't anticipate those sources going away. Um, but it's always always a wild card. Um, it also assumes that the state will
continue the free lunch program and that I I think that's we're pretty safe in saying that. Um but again should they decide not to um we we would you know that's a that's a card. Um as we go to the the next page uh you can
see what we have uh in terms of of staffing for near near level services. Um you can see what we've you know what we've done the last couple of years uh where we've kind of added where we've where we've dropped or consolidated. Um, and you can see in FY27 our our teachers
and license licensed staff uh is going from 53 and a half um down to 48 FTE. So, as Connor mentioned, one of the things that's driving our cost increases is really about special education. And
so this was the conversation we had a year ago was to come in and say our special education costs are disproportionately climbing. And this that story really continues. So the chart on page six gives you a sense of here's where those costs are. So the
purple is just the total from the prior year and the gold on top of that shows you what the increase is. And so in FY22, we had a $100,000 increase. Same in 23, same in 24 roughly. And then in
fiscal 25, it jumped and it grew 21%. Last year we budgeted for it to grow 25% and it came in over that. So that was where we supplemented with school choice funds and we're projecting based on the population we
know about that next year our special education costs will be an additional 21% higher. So that's that 21% is a $503,000 cost increasing over this year. So as we
watch where our budget is going up, it's really all about special ed. again, not different than our neighboring districts from what we're reading. Um, if you want to dig into what that really amounts to on page seven, we kind of talk about the multiple factors that contribute to that
is really predominantly about the out of district costs. And so, as Connor mentioned, sometimes we have students that their deans are beyond the capacity of our public school to help them. And so those students and this is law um require different services and those
have outofd tuition costs frequently that also includes transportation to those programs because they're they're not local so we provide the transportation as well. Um the current average per student cost for
tuition and transportation is $133,000 per student right now. Um, we have one case that the transportation actually costs more than the tuition. Um, it's if someone was looking for a new business enterprise, they I suggest they take a look at
transportation options, uh, because there's clearly not enough supply. So, um, tuition rates are a piece of what that change is. Um, the state allowance for tuition increases had a particular hike in FY24. They allowed it
to go up 14%. But every year the tuition rates are climbing far greater than the 2 and a.5% increase we can ask from taxpayers. Um the last eight years the increase has been 4.2%. But we have schools that are
they find ways to have other opportunities to increase costs beyond that. So we're typically seeing things beyond 7% a year. Um, we mapped out tuition rates for um, White Oak School, which is our most modest out of district
placement program, and they've increased their cost, their tuition costs 70% over the last eight years, which is amounts to $27,000 for a single student in the course of that student's tenure in their school. Um, in FY22, one of the other
things that really has changed in FY22, the majority of our out ofd district placements were actually contained, were able to go to specialized programs in other public school districts. And um, we've done the same. So, we have a STAR program because we had a population of
students that had very similar needs. so we could pull them together, hire appropriate staff, develop appropriate curriculum for them and and save on out of district costs while still meeting their needs. Um, but based on the population we have and the programs
available in neighboring districts, that's not available anymore. And so while those were still expensive, they were less expensive than the other um programs. And so that's an impact to our tuition rates as well. the number of students that require out of district
support is also a factor when we look at climbing rates. Um so when you consider it $133 per student, even one student is pretty impactful on a small district like us. Over the past nine years, we've averaged seven out of district
placements in a year. We currently have nine. Um, from a budgetary standpoint, one of the sort of silver linings is those students are disproportionately Smith Academy AED students and several of them will be graduating in the next couple of years.
So, we're likely to see that number come back down. Um, the cost difference between a mild year and a high need year is around $760,000. So, it's a really big swing when you go up a few students, particularly with the
rising costs. So, you can see there, if we have just five students, that looks like it's, you know, 574,000. If we had 10 students, it's over a million3. Um, and just to note because I think this comes up sometimes, all student
services, whether it's an out ofd district placement or special student services provided within a district, so student services provided by an individualized education plan, an IEP, anything in that realm, those costs, if it's a choice student, all of those
costs are met by their sending town. So if someone was asking like, well, if you've got a bunch of choice students, you're driving our costs up. Nope. We get a 100% of that back. Um we don't get 100% of it back if it's a local student.
So if it's a local student, um the formula is after the first $52,000 that we spend, the state reimbures up to 75% of those costs if they fully fund the circuit breaker program. And some years the state has not fully funded the
circuit breaker program. So if at 133,000 after the 52 was spent, that's I think by my quick math without a calculator is 81,000. And if we got back the portion of that, we're looking at getting back about 60 61,000 for every
133. So it's a portion of it back and those funds come back to us the following year. So, when Connor talked about increased state aid, part of what we're forecasting is we had such high needs come in this year, we'll get some of that money back next year and that's
going to help offset what would be hard to make up any other way. >> Um, can I just like to share something too that you know we we had talked about this not being a Hatfield specific problem. This is statewide. Um it frankly it's nationwide but but focusing
on our state it's affecting municipalities from Cape Cod to the Birkers um and everyone in between. It doesn't matter if they're um rural, urban, wealthy, poor. Um every m municipality is having the same
conversation. Um and and part of that is political advocacy at the state level. Uh is is trying to put the pressure on our state lawmakers to look at the funding formula and where it's working and where it's falling short. And this is um what what everyone is saying is this is
one place where it's falling short. The current formula um as is um assumes a 4% um 4% of students in a district will have special education needs. Um that's not true anywhere. Um I think the
average is around 25 to 28%. Um and so that's you know just just one way that that the formula is is currently failing schools. Um, so there's a lot of momentum right now at the state level to look at that, to look at the how the
formula works, to look at where, you know, what the actual needs are. Um, that being said, I'm not holding my breath that that that it's going to, you know, going to going to change anytime soon. Um, but there seems to be more momentum in more um more voices from
more places advocating for that for for a change um than there has been previously. So, which is work we can all do to help support, but it to Connor's point isn't likely to impact next year's correct um
revenue coming back to us. We've taken a look to try and best understand as we think about looking for ways to be good advocates to understand what port what lever is most impacting those cost rise. So on page eight, this is a really messy chart, but I think it helps you kind of
get a visual at what is driving the change. So the big purple bars you see, that's the overall special education costs, um, which is more than a third of our budget at this point. Um, the number of IEPs is a blue line going across the
top and that looks at student services that are met within the district. So those are part of our everyday costs. That looks like at the number of IEP IEPs within the district and you can see it bounces around a little bit, but it's relatively level. It doesn't match the
cost curve. The number of out of district placements kind of has, again, we talked about there's sort of that eb and the flow and you could see in FY19 we had eight, it came down to five and 23, now we're back up to nine. Again,
that curve doesn't match the overall shift. Um, but what does look like it matches the overall shift is the two examples we've given for out of district tuition costs. So you can see costs for White Oak and Hec Academy and and
they're just that sort of st same steady climb. So that's probably the biggest factor. Um, but all of them have some contribution particularly as we have more student needs. So that's what is dynamic in our budget this year and
that's the reason why we're going to need to make some some trimming of the budget trimming of needs and services within the rest of the um services we provide. Which brings us just to a quick reminder of what our overall ask is and
that is for town to fund schools with $6,275,066 for FY27. That is a difference of 0 from FY26. And it it isn't that we wouldn't be able to use additional funds. We certainly
could employ them to good needs, but we respect the rest of town needs and we're we're part of the team and because we have additional state funding coming back in and we can tighten our belts and particularly we have a few
grades where the just general population is smaller. The population right behind them is not. So it's not a trend. um COVID era births were a little lower, but there's preschoolers in abundance in a year. So, there's 27 three year olds
right on their heels ready to come in. Um so, but this year we can do this. Um choice and other grants uh you can see are going to be up. So, it's the total budget, not the town portion, but the
total budget is um 3.6% 6% higher than what we came in for FY26. It's relatively flat once you adjust for what we added in October from CH school choice funds to cover additional special
ed needs. Um so as we mentioned because we don't have the reserves to help offset wildcard sort of any sort of big changing needs. We really wanted to talk with finance and the select board about
how we manage for sort of unforeseen costs. The last many years, thanks to the override and trying to be pretty fiscally responsible, we've managed to weather sort of changes without having to come and say we need help. And we're
just recognizing that for FY27, we aren't going to be in a position to take care of that without raising our hands. So, um, there are a couple of different ways that we could manage for that. Um, one of the things we a hat tip to Andrew for finding and helping educate us on
the special education reserve funds. So, there is a there is a mechanism that exists um thanks to the state laws that we could create a reserve fund that would require both the school committee and the select board to vote to move
monies out of that reserve fund into the school budget. But it would be one place that we could set aside some funding that if we didn't use it could roll over. It would be a fund that if the school budget had funds at the end of the year that it didn't use that we
might be able to continue to fund that rollover that reserve budget through that. Um so that's one possibility. the that particular um reserve fund it it requires that the balance can't exceed
2% of the annual net school spending. So in FY27 that 2% would be 173,970 like so it's not a huge chunk of money. Um but if a single student we needed to
have a single student go out of district that could be another 130,000. So it it kind of fits within that need. Um and it gives some visibility which I think the school committee really enjoys the fact that it's like if we need to do that you as the select board would also have
visibility to that. Um so it would be a way that you could set aside some funds if there was a rainy day that wouldn't become necessarily part of the school budget until we all said, "Yep, we need to move those funds." And if we didn't need them, they could sit there and and
stay put until we did. um should that happen. So um when we spoke with finance committee, there are other ways we could accomplish this. Uh I think we just want to make sure that we're having the conversation about it now and having a plan for it because what we would like
to avoid is if we have something happen in October, November, December because sometimes placement needs change that we don't hit that and need a special town meeting because we have one kid whose educational needs are changing. Um, so we're looking to avoid that that there's
something built in. There's a way to meet those needs if they if that happens. So we are happy to take questions. Thank you for listening to us babble on about special education costs. We know that not everybody lives that the way we do. Um, but that's what so
we're we're not asking for more, but we're telling you heads up. See, I don't know if the we haven't had a conversation on trying to move funds and I know presently we we sort of are able to move funds in financial reserve. We
sometimes move money into a stabilization account. Uh I'm not sure if we're legally allowed to set up a another account in any way where each year we take some free cash or something if that's to put into a reserve or not.
I mean, I'm I we haven't had the conversation yet. So, >> yeah, this this is this is something kind of new to us as a concept and it's our first time, you know, talking about it here, but certainly we have time before town meeting when we'd have to establish a fund like this. would also require a vote of the the school
committee. But the nice thing about it is that, you know, it's a it's a reserve account and in order to take money out of it would have to require a vote both of the select board and the and the um school committee. And you know, without it, it's hard to think of of many other
mechanisms for getting money mid year. There's the finance reserve fund. There's school choice funds. There's not much else besides building it into the budget, which isn't ideal because then that's money that you might not even need and then you make your budget $100,000 higher. So, I don't I don't
know if there's any other thoughts, but it it could be an elegant solution and we could talk about either taking some money from our regular reserve fund and putting it towards this. There's some other funds that are out there that we could potentially pull from and put it into or free cash or something else. But we, you know, we'll have to see what
what our line of request looks like and if it's something that we could potentially do, but it's it's a decent solution. >> Yeah. Because I know when the fall comes, somebody moves into town or somebody has special needs and and that really throws a
budget way up. >> In an ideal world, we would have >> enough to cover, let's say, one out of district placement in that in in that in that fund. >> Oh, yeah. in in an ideal world or or a little bit higher >> reserve fund could cover but it that may not be we you know when we finance met
with the schools uh it may not happen overnight. Maybe it's a it takes a couple of years to get that number there >> even though it would be great if we could do it right away but uh like you said maybe maybe over the course of the next couple years we could look to put
some money there and and like Christy says if there's a little extra left at the end could that be slid into that account as well. you know, if there's 20,000 or 30,000 or something left at the end of the school year when you've paid all the bills instead of it reverting back to the town and becoming
free cash, um that could possibly go, you know, with as a with a vote of everybody to go into there. >> Um so, in concept, it's a great I think it's a great idea and I think the finance committee agrees it's a great idea to have that money because it would stay there. It's not going to have to be, you know, it's not like it would
convert to free cash at the end of the year. It would stay there. It would be that that fin that sort of savings account just in case. >> I guess that's more of a Tom Mullen question or legal uh to see what's allowable. I mean, we we have to know
what we're allowed to do and what's legally >> I don't think we're advocating for that one in particular. I think we're advocating for collectively. Let's find a place to set some aside in case we have a need. And I think whatever way
you all are collectively comfortable for doing that, we would happily support. >> And I think just just important importantly with this kind of fund, this would never be part of our budget. We wouldn't go into a you know a budget planning process and say, "Oh, hey, we
have this hundred whatever thousand dollars in this reserve fund. We can plan on using that." that wouldn't be part that would it would strictly be for oh no um we you know we had an un you know unexpected special education related cost that came up um we need to
work collaboratively with the with the select board to um to cover it and this gives us that opportunity to do it. It also feels more respectful of the student's privacy should the need arise because that way you don't have to go to the whole town to beg for additional funds to meet a student's legally
required needs as it can just be done in the relative private confines of the select board and the school committee. I I understand and that's one of the reasons we we increased the finance uh fund a couple years ago in case there was an emergency and we because we go
into the stabilization takes twothirds of the town to vote to take money out. So in other these other accounts we can actually approach it differently. So, but that's I guess we'll look into it
and try to see if we what we are legally allowed to do because it makes sort of sense. It takes some free cash put in there. If if you don't need it, it's still there. It's not spent. But if you need it, then you don't have to wait a whole cycle to go to town meeting and
and get some more money if the need arises, >> I suppose. And I don't know you guys have any questions? >> I have lots. Um, so you in your packet on page four,
it outlines that your reductions are coming from 5.5 full-time equivalent um positions. I can understand if you don't necessarily want to list what those are at this time, but one of the questions I have um is what does how
does that impact the benefits for the town of Hatfield in terms of health insurance, retirement contributions? Are we actually cutting five and a half full-time people? Um or are you just reducing hours, but they're still technically full-time employees or
>> Yeah. No, we're cut we're cutting cutting positions. >> Okay. As far as benefits go, um a couple of them are on health insurance, so it would reduce our health insurance slightly. >> Okay. Um, and then the other thing that
I would like to see personally, um, the 168,000 that you have planned for federal funding that is currently in the budget, which is 1.9% of it, I think, um, should take a look at trying to fund that yourself through whether it's
additional cuts or where you need to find it. And that'll do twofold things. I think it would give you a buffer of at least giving you one more position if you do have another special education requirement with an additional $30,000 buffer as well. Um but also if that
federal funding doesn't land where it is where what's anticipated, we're not coming back to the town's people for u additional funding later. >> I I hear the the thoughtfulness in that. Um just to share some statewide
perspective because we talked with colleagues in other committees around the state because everyone's dealing with these same issues. Um there was a lot of concern a year ago about this funding going away and I don't hear that
concern anymore. So while we're paying attention to it, um it doesn't sound like it's as likely. It's pretty the federal dollars that we get are very enshrined. Um because it's really all
IDEIDA stuff, isn't it? It's >> those earmarked for specific programs. >> They're very earmarked. They're very enshrined in federal law. >> Again, they're not just general money that you can put into >> No. And they're not programs that are the most likely thing to be cut. So, we've heard about those programs getting
shifted to other federal agencies, but not them going away. Um, I would personally be concerned about trying to make another 168,000 in cuts because at that point, we would be t we would not be talking about near-level services. We
would be talking about some pretty significant other cuts. >> Yeah. >> That would impact students very directly. Um, so we've been scalpel like in these cuts. Um, so that we really worked hard to not impact students. Um,
and by that not impact our potential for growth because right now to Connor's point, we're we're one of the districts who can still claim that we have arts programs and music for elementary kids and we have neighboring school districts who are looking at cutting all of that
or cutting all of their sports programs. And so when we're able to maintain that, we're able to maintain kids coming in from other districts and we have quite the momentum going on that front where we have families who are talking to other families in their hometowns where
those cuts are happening and they're coming droves might be a little exaggeration, but they're coming family load by family load back to Hatfield and bringing their neighbors the following year from other towns because we're able to keep programs So, I'm it worries me
to cut much more because we kind of cut off that opportunity when we do it. >> I guess that kind of brings me to my next point. Um, in the chart that you provided, it doesn't line up with the staffing and student levels that you reported to us earlier this year.
>> Staffing student. Okay. Can you be specific? Which chart are you talking about? >> So, in the new pack, it would be page five. So the teacher licensed staff, we went back, Connor and I counted up payroll year on year when we went back and
adjusted for this because there had been a little bit of shifting. I don't think it was the previous administration. We didn't have the school committee didn't have insight. We took the numbers they gave us. So when we previously looked at this, it was a little bit different. Um,
but we've gone back and adjusted this these numbers to be as accurate as we know them. >> So from December 15th to now, >> which are you looking at FY27 or FY26? >> 26 in the report that you provided to us. >> Okay. So what was the number in the
December report? >> Uh, it says the total headcount is 95. >> Is that that's probably combining a couple of things, right? So I haven't added these up. It adds up to 86.5. >> I'll take a look at it and come back in
writing, Luke, because I don't want to misspeak, but it certainly wouldn't be malicious. >> No. And and also the like the student population numbers are different in this versus the report that you had given to us. >> Yeah. So, so we these are more accurate.
We have um students do come and go. We accept school choice up um in in the middle of the year as well. So we have a a deadline of December 15th for applications to start after um Christmas break. So these were we we did go through and adjust those to be accurate
as to current um not you know not previously because those those would those numbers would have reflected previous numbers from the fall >> and when we reported in in December I'm pretty sure we used the October 1 numbers that we reported into Desi >> but Desi does take a look at at the end
of the year as well. So, we're trying to just keep timely. >> I guess the concern that I have and a lot of towns people have as well is that seems like we have a very large amount of staff for the student population size that we have. And when you look at the
trajectory of the enrollment, it is consider it's steadily continued to decline. It it h this is our first year we're up. We're glad to be up. Um and we're glad to be able to have robust programming. So
it it takes a number of steps to do that and we're and we're cutting positions based on the number of the enrollment but understanding that it isn't a the trajectory doesn't necessarily continue. So yes, there are fewer kindergarteners
this year and fewer kindergarteners next year but the following year we anticipate the number of kindergarteners based on census data to double. So, it it's not necessarily a continuing trend.
The population decline has been a 20-year issue. Yes. Right. >> I think I mean, I'm just speaking from a lot of residents that have reached out to us is that a lot of these class sizes, elementary through the high school, are
so small that they really could be single classroom sizes. So are >> I understand, you know, no one wants to slash positions, but at some point there has to be a level of reasoning here that we can't have a class of 11 kids split
into two into two classroom sessions. It just doesn't make financial sense to >> and so you'll see next year where the cuts are are where we have we don't have enough kids to make two classrooms. So districtwide, our average current class
size is 22, but we have we have classes of 31, 30, 29, 27. We have a few anomalous small class sizes that get talked about a lot and I appreciate that those are
very small and that's why at Smith Academy, we're going to be able to consolidate some of that core classwork. Um, >> and for for our exceptionally small class, we've already done that. I mean, that that happened this year and last year as well for that class. >> So, we've been making those cuts, we had
one preschool instead of two when there were fewer preschoolers. Um, and when the preschool numbers went back up, we were able to add another teacher back in. Um, so there has been some shifting all this time and we're going to face a challenge at the elementary school as
next year's kindergarten and first graders, which are smaller cohorts based on just population size, that they will be one class instead of two because it doesn't make sense to have two for that number. And they will likely be one class going all the way through the system because there won't be room to
grow with anywhere because we would never add an extra classroom just for choice kids because we wouldn't know we could make it work. >> So there are grades that have 50 to 60 people in them.
>> No. in. >> But you just said there's some classes that are 27 each. >> Grade level has 27 >> grades, not classes. Okay. >> Correct. >> Okay. >> Not classrooms per se. Right. So there
are classrooms that are 15 each. And that's truthfully at various grade levels that's our goal is to have 15 kids in a classroom. >> I guess the question then becomes is it is it sustainable for the tax base of the town? is our is that and that's what our responsibility is as well as making
sure the kids get a good education is making sure that we're doing our financial duty to the taxpayers of you. >> Sure. >> And so we really need to take a look at it. These class sizes are already small. They meet they're far below what the state standard is.
>> So what is your definition of sustainability? If if the trajectory of the enrollment is continuing to decline and with the exception of this year, we've continued to add staffing positions, it doesn't
make it financially responsible. >> So the other way we we monitor our f our fiscal responsibility is looking at state averages. So you will find the percentage of Hatfield's education spending year, we come in at 50% of
Hatfield's tax base. That's the state average. If we look at per pupil spending, we're below the state average. So we're in the 48th percentile because we've been we have been slowly ratcheting that up intentionally because we we had cut back so many programs. And
so when we look at neighboring districts and we look at what our costs are on a per student base, we're competitive. Um we're not, you know, we take a look every year to see what the costs would be if we shifted
things. So if we tuitioned out all of our secondary students and kept an elementary school, we've done the math on that and it would cost the town more everywhere we've looked. um particularly because we wouldn't
count on them taking our out of district student costs on. So um for example, if we took all of our 7th through 12th graders and merged them in to Hadley's costs, um we would look
based on today's population numbers, we'd be spending an additional $3,000. So relatively flat. and that assumes they picked up all of our out ofdist tuition costs. That's not likely to happen because those students wouldn't be going there. So, we would still be
holding those costs. And if that was the case, we would be looking at I think it's around an additional $460,000 would be the difference. So, our municipal school district running is saving us money relative to sending them
out. Hadley was the most cost comparable. um we looked at Frontier and that would be higher in the tune in the tune of hundreds of thousands. >> I think that is something though that a lot of residents are strongly asking for for a third party review of though um
because the there's always been the conversation of Hadley's struggling with a lot of the same problems of making Smith Academy middle school or elementary school Hadley would be the upper classes or whatever the arrangement might be. And so when you start adding some of those things in
there's a lot of questions that people have with it. So, I think that's a conversation for another time that we don't need to get into right now. Um, but you referenced the uh per student spending and where we average out with that. I think a lot of
things that people are looking at is what is our student to faculty ratio which is extremely high um or low I would say. So when you start to consider that um there are definitely some areas that I think that we need to review and I
think that while we offer a lot of robust programming, I think that there is some areas where some additional cuts can be made and I think we can find some more money and um
you know I I would like to see some reserves put back in like some funds put back into these reserves. reserves that were once fairly healthy that have since had to be paid down and I think that should be built into your budget and that's my opinion. >> So I just I think it's a misnomer to
think there have been a lot of reserves in a school budget in Hatfield. >> Well to go from 238 to zero is a pretty substantial number. >> We had a rainy day for sure, right? >> But but truthfully that 230 was
>> fortunate that we had it. It's not something we historically have had, >> but it doesn't mean it can't be something that we can project for the future. >> Not I don't think we're projecting that. And I think part of not projecting having those funds is coming in. Last
year, we came in and asked for 2.5% increase. We didn't ask for more. This year, we're not asking for anything more. And part of the result of that is we're not looking at having having a rainy day fund. We could come back and say, "Hey, we'd like to increase two and
a half percent along with the what the town can ask for and we could then put that aside for a rainy day." That would be another way to solve having some funding. >> And I think just just to to get back to your point about sustainability for a
second is um you know, you're right, we have some some classes that are are smaller. Um, abs, absolutely part of what makes Smith Academy sustainable right now because truthfully, when you're talking about future cuts or or deeper cuts, that's where they that's
where they would hit. We can't can't go go deeper at the elementary school. Um, and part of the part of what has made Smith Academy sustainable to the level that it is right now has been our school choice, students coming in for a school choice. Um, and part of what is
attracting students is those robust programs. So, so sure could we cut a uh an elect an elective, two electives, three electives, four electives? We could and we could reduce teachers to point8 or point 6. Um at that point those teachers would probably leave and
go elsewhere um because no one would would want to stay for that. Um and also the students who are attracted um and who who may be here for you know for those reasons because they're able to get those classes that offering um in a
in a intimate environment that that they would not get elsewhere um they would leave too and so with them would leave their their that funding. So whether it's our resident students choicing elsewhere because of that and we lose funding there or where the current
school choice students saying, "Oh, well, might as well go back to my home district because I'm going to get the same thing there." Um, we lose that funding, too. that I I I just would caution trying to cut your way to sustainability because as soon as you start cutting
below a certain level, which we've frankly we've done a um what I think is a is a a very thorough job of finding places where where we can cut um and and once you start going past that level, your your efforts may be in vain because when you try to cut to sustainability,
you cut the very programs that are truly seeking to to to make the district more sustainable. >> I can understand your point. I I really truly can. Um but again, just looking at the trajectory of the way things have gone
>> and with enrollment declining and employment increasing the efforts, I I genuinely understand them. I come from a family of educators. I teach in a multiple different settings as well and I really truly
understand what you're saying and I sympathize with it. But at some point it's the tax base of Hatfield has to be able to support this and I feel like we're already at that crux of that. >> I looking at our the number of staff that
we've had over the past like where we've been this year in the past two years and what we're projecting for next year. I don't look at that as a giant increase. So the one place we did have a big increase was in ESPs and the majority of that increase was really about adding um
registered behavior technicians which we had previously had to outsource because we couldn't find them and the cost for that was quite high and so we increased our staffing to offset cost. So, we saved money by going from 16 and a half
to 22. Um, but we saved a ton of money in the process. >> I guess the problem that like I have with the charts and a lot of the data that we've gotten back in previous years though is the the accuracy of it. Um,
you know, 20 FY24, FY25, we have very round student numbers. are not I have a hard time believing that those are the actual enrollments to either a zero or a five versus in 26 we actually have real data but then again when we look at the
staffing levels and I compare it to the reports that you have submitted to me previously the numbers that you're submitting on this sheet don't match the numbers that you have previously submitted in the other reports so how how are we to believe that the other staffing numbers that are down below in
this chart chart are accurate either. >> So we can go back and look at that and I'm happy to report back. >> But this goes back to my point that that is the n those that's the data that we need to be able to actually accurately observe trends, right? So whether it's student enrollment or staffing levels,
>> we need that data so that the in the tax base of Hatfield and ultimately the select board finance school committee can work together to be able to try to create a path that's sustainable here because it's not currently >> student data you can always go back and check it yourself on desi
>> and it doesn't line up with what you have here. So it doesn't for this year because we're giving you up tothe- moment numbers with enrollment changes that are happening versus desi lags a bit because we report when it reports back. So
>> but the desi numbers for FY25 and 24 if you go back and desi don't line up with this report. >> I'll take a look because that surprises me but I'll take a look. >> Anything else? >> Nope. Any question? No. >> Well, thank you for coming. I appreciate
it. John, we're going to take five and come right back. Okay, we're back. Uh, as we continue, I guess we can go with capital planning next. >> We'll we'll move right ahead because Christiey's still here and David, I know she doesn't want to stay here all night.
So, >> yeah, I'll do it. >> Okay, sounds good. So, um I just gave you the the narrative um piece that we're going to go over, but I just want to point out that you also have the like the Excel spreadsheet which gives you
the five-year plan. Um at least at this point what we know. Uh so uh some of these numbers are have been pulled out of the out of the sky or some of them are placeholders but at least it's some ideas as to what some of the departments
are looking at down the road for the next five years. Uh doesn't mean that that's going to happen or whatever but at least it's on the table for discussion um and that kind of stuff. So, but the the crux of tonight is really to look at the the narrative
piece that that we got first and the other thing I should before we even get started, I want to thank our the committee. Um I represent the finance committee on the capital planning. Ed's our um select board representative. Christiey's our school committee
representative. And then Mike Cahill is our one at large. We still have an atlarge position open. So, if anybody's interested in doing some service to the town and and being part of a committee, it's a it's not a heavy lift. It's uh four or five meetings usually December, January, February, and possibly early
March. Uh but it's a an important role that we that we play. Uh so, uh you have in front of you, um sort of how we've broken it down. And last year, we put this together for the first time. Christy did a really great job of putting this Google doc together. The
first part is are are what are called what we call townf funed projects. Um and as you see on the left hand side, we've sort of given it a priority of a must, a should, a nice, or a defer, which you won't see till the very end. But uh uh these are all projects that we
feel are that that would be would be funded either by free cash, by some sort of a debt exclusion, a lease or a borrow outside of department budgets. So, the first one is um the fire department ambulance. Uh there's a change to the
radio spec specs that are uh that are out there that are being going on this summer will be happening. And if we don't make this change, the fire department, the ambulance won't be able to talk to anybody else, including the hospital and all that kind of stuff uh
because of the frequency change that that's gone on. So, it's not a huge ask. It's only $12,500. Um, our recommendation is to take that out of free cash and uh and and take care of it that way. Um, and obviously
that's a that's a must project because we don't really want to not be able to be able to communicate with everybody once once that change is is all in and has been made. Um, our new highway our new DPW directors asked for a number of
different things here that we have on our on our list. Um, one of the big one of the big problems we have right now is with our sidewalk plow. It's old. It's decrepit. It's hard to get parts for. And um, and it's only used for a few months during the year obviously when
there's snow. Um, Marlo was looking to to find to buy a mini loader which could uh replace that, do our sidewalks. And we also have a number of attachments that the town already owns that would be able to be used on this uh loader as
well. And then it could be a 12 months of the year usage versus a four or five months of the year usage um and get a lot more work done in other projects. So um it's something we could either fund through a free cash or do or do through a lease program um however we decide as
we go down down the road. The next two on the list here are are smaller purchases. they don't really meet the $10,000 minimum. But Marlo wanted to talk about these and and look at possibly um he either put funding them through three free cash or possibly out of his own budget depending on what he
might have left over for for funds at the end of the year. Uh a guardrail mower uh instead of sending the kids out with the weed whackers um and spend them spending hours and hours and hours doing that. He's looking at saving 100 to 200
staff hours of of of work out there to keep our guard rails cleaned up. We already have the I don't know if we've received it yet, but I know we have a the sidearm mower that's is it is it here yet? Do we know? >> Over the railing.
>> Okay. So, it's on its way. It's been ordered that we or that we approved last year. So, this would would complete sort of our our program to to keep things cleaned up at all all around town as far as the guardrails are concerned. Um, and then a a small purchase for a debris
loader which would be um attached to to a truck with a big box on the back to pick up all the leaves and things like that in the spring, in the fall, possibly even in the spring. Right now, they're loading them into pickup trucks, covering them over with tarps and driving back and forth to the to wherever they're dumping them. and and
it's an awful lot of time, effort, energy that doesn't need to happen. Again, this would be another one that would save money um where he might be able to uh to the some of the summer help stays on a little bit longer than probably they they could or should and we might save a couple of weeks worth of
pay on some of that for for a very small uh cost of a little under $5,000. Personally, I'm not sure why we don't we don't already own one of these, but uh it's certainly something that we probably should have. Um, there's also a I guess there's been some
concern about the fire department apparatus bay that people have found parts of shingles in the parking lot or whatever. And so, uh, we have a price to to replace that with asphalt shingles at 35,000 or metal um at at 68,000. Again,
it's one of those uh things that we we maybe do this year, maybe do next year. would be nice or should, but I don't think there's any active leaks that we know of at this point in that uh building. >> Two courses on it. >> It's got two courses on it now. So, going to have to take some time to strip
it. We did get we did get quotes from Florence Roofing to for both of these projects uh for both of those uh materials. Um and then of course, one this has been on the on the capital plan for a number of years is to replace the the fire chief's vehicle. It's uh it is 10 years
old. Um even though it the mileage doesn't seem like it's that high, it does run a lot more standing still sometimes than it does uh driving around. Uh so if it's at a scene, it's going to be there. It's going to be running. Um,
and if we were to we were to go for a new one of those, which is being recommended by our uh DPW director as well, um, that we'd be replacing that annual cost for a lease from about just about $19,600.
Um, couple of other things that were put in. Uh our town administrator is looking at some point to do some upgrades of security here around the town hall, whether it be cameras, some entry uh security things where you might have a a a badge or a a card that would and then
we could keep track of who's in and out of the building, especially a lot of things at night. Um again, he's requested $75,000 to possibly do something like that. And then Marlo has also asked for um maybe this summer or this late this summer when we're doing
uh the the school parking lots, the stuff that we've already approved with with our override last year to also also do the the DPW yard which is in pretty bad shape as well. Um again, that's another $190,000 uh expense. So those would be townf
funed kinds of projects that we've that we've got on there. Um, the next page has the chapter 90 or state and state grant funding. >> Uh, these would be projects that wouldn't necessarily Yeah, >> I just have a real quick question on funed stuff. Um,
>> I could add it go through and add it up, but >> do you have a total of what the free cash ask is on this versus what we have in free cash? >> Yeah, at the I think if you look at the >> Oh, fantastic. >> The bottom of page three, you'll see that.
>> Yeah. All right. Perfect. Thanks. >> Christiey's quite very efficient at stuff like that. >> Like it. >> So, >> uh, so the the next one is the, like I said, is the chapter 90 and grant funding. Um, obviously every year we get chapter 90 money to do streets and
roads. Last year it was just a little over 400,000. Um, you know, so we're anticipating somewhere in that neighborhood hopefully. >> I got an update. >> You got an update? What do you got? >> Yeah, that's a three-year deal with the increase in chapter 90. I believe it came in at 410. I don't have it in front of me. Okay.
>> But same as last year. All right. >> So that's changed. >> All right. So that'll be we'll have a little bit more there. Um and he's also has uh you've hired a company called Beta to do some uh monitoring of our streets and roads and we're going to use
that that uh report to decide where we go next with this month. Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. Uh so it may we're not we're not exactly sure where that'll be, but that's what the plan is. >> Yeah, we have a few roads in mind.
Obviously the winter we had some roads really showed some wear in just one winter it happens. Yeah. So >> yeah, >> but we will have a paving program even if the beta isn't complete, which I'll bring it to the board and whatnot. As far as the roads, >> we also have a a grant um out there
through Mass DOT to do some reconstruction of Straits Road, the the non-paved part um for $670,000. And hopefully sometime in April, we'll we'll hear about that. Uh that'll either be a go with the grant
money or it'll be put back on the back burner till uh another day. Uh so if it comes through, that'll be great. If it doesn't, then we'll just have to keep trying. And then the last piece is uh doing some an upgrade at the Ferry Street pump
station. Now, is that the one that we know we didn't get? >> Yes. >> Okay. So, this is on here, but we just received word that the the grant for the $350,000 it did not come through. Yeah. So, um
so that is on hold until we look at other funding sources. Correct. I got to take a look, but I think this is it was actually an upgrade of King Street. All the internal workings on it. >> Um and we didn't get the grant. >> It was Ferry and King maybe. >> Fair and King was the generator's project. >> Yes. Yeah. Which we're we're out to
>> We're out to bid on. Yeah. >> But it's either Ferry or King. >> Yeah. If I went back, I could find it. I'm pretty sure it's Fair Street that was put in for >> That's where we are on the on the grant funded stuff. And then the last page would be CPA grants or department budget
expenditures. Um the first one uh was a was a CPA grant that I put in along with Andrew about replacing the tile in the front hall here of the town hall. Um it went
to CPA and as you heard tonight they did not fund this. Um, there were some questions about whether they got all the information or they didn't get all the information and uh we initially went in with to have a
uh like a luxury vinyl tile put down and then they said that wasn't really uh historically correct. So, we went back with a grant that would be maple flooring like you see all over this building here. Um, but the big key
is that there's asbestous in those tiles and there's asbestous in the mastic that's holding those tiles down. So, um, I was in touch with the historical commission because that was one of the requests also of the CPA that the historical commission weigh in as to
whether or not maple flooring is appropriate. And uh I did get some responses back from them and uh they haven't had a meeting to decide for sure, but it the the consensus from what I've heard back from them is that the maple flooring
would be historically correct to be putting to put down out in that area versus another kind of uh vinyl or whatever that is. Okay. The unfortunate part about it is they will not cons reconsider this grant for this year. Um,
>> so I depending on how the select board feels about that, whether we go forward with doing the project on our own with free cash and then maybe trying to get the money. I don't know if Andrew and I have kicked it around. I don't know if
we can ask them for the money next year and get it back, but probably not. But it's if we're worried about the fact that that there are asbestous tiles, then we probably need to think about moving forward with the project. Um, and as you heard also tonight, the School Street playground was funded by
CPA. They didn't approve that. So, that will be going forward. Um, the other one is to to think about the we've had this walking path at Smith Academy that has got started and sort of
is in the middle of being done but not done. Um, and there's a lot of issues with the way that it's proceeded so far. On top of the fact that we're waiting for the day pond stuff to be done before we figure out what goes next,
but there's also some fairly significant slopes out there that we might need some ADA compliance kinds of uh, checks on. Also, the conservation commission because how close can we get to the day pond? Are you still on conservation? >> I am. Yeah.
>> Okay. How close can we get to the pod with any kind of a path like that using those kinds of materials? We'd have to get some sort of a ruling there, >> right? You it needs to require a full permit. I met with >> Yeah. the folks out there. But the other thought was is
while they're there doing the Smith Academy parking lot, could we at least get the path from the parking lot out to the field hockey field behind the back stop? That one piece done with asphalt. It would make it easier for all the
folks that have to walk out there. A lot of grandparents and things that that walk out there to to watch games. would be much easier obviously access for the ambulance or whoever who might need to get out to that field. Um it would cost about uh $50,000 to get that done. Uh it
was we've requested it through CPA but has not been approved. Um so we're still waiting on that. >> Yeah. The 50,000 covers the roadway in to the back stop and the the walking path to where it ends installed.
>> Yeah. So we can Oh yeah. Yeah. That's right. was broken down. I forget what it was. >> Oh, that's right. It was like 27,000 I think to get out behind the back stop. >> Yeah. >> So, that's another area where we can talk about.
But you also can see here at the bottom the the breakdown of the town funding the the sort of the musts only is are only 72,500. The shoulds add up to 236 if we do the metal roof on the fire department bay.
Uh, and uh, the nicest are 265. All projects are 573, although I we do have more free cash than that available, but I don't think we're going to be looking at spending that kind of money this year
out of free cash by the time we >> take care of a lot of other budgetary things that we need to take care of. But maybe some of the smaller projects as we get going into the final numbers uh for the budget that we can we can get those done. Your last page is also a just a
summary list of the the musts at the top, the shoulds and the and the nice it's uh just gives you a little little quick summary of what's happening. Christy, anything you want to add? I mean my appreciation for that committee and just to highlight that the
school department is so thankful for all of the capital improvements that are happening in FY26 and that we had zero requests for FY27. So we appreciate what we got. We didn't ask for more. Um we are looking at solar
roofing is on our like immediate terms what's coming next. So once the elementary school roof is replaced, um we're getting that teed up to have solar panels. So that was part of the spec for that roof so that we can start saving on our electric costs, but that's not
that's not there quite yet. >> That would probably be a request next year. And the other the other one is possibly the the bleachers in the gym, depending on where that goes. >> We're looking for that without a capital request if at all possible, but our
bleachers are having some issues with some of the some of the electric motors that move them in and out. So, >> any questions? >> I do want to thank David Christy and Mike Kill. David did an you guys did an
exceptional job on capital planning this year and I appreciate it. It's good fun committee to work with. >> I ask one quick question, Christie. Was there any consideration of trying to move forward on the solar sooner because of the IRA tax credits on on solar?
>> We may come back with that request, but I don't think anybody's got the information yet. >> Is anyone able to have a meeting with the the solar folks who reached out? >> I don't think that has happened yet. >> That's fine. >> So, um but can answer that. >> It's started like we've kicked it off in
case we can find a way to pull it forward. >> Yeah. Um, and we're not to name thankfully. So, we may come back with a a late breaking request based on >> Do we know what the lift is for that? Like a even an estimate >> for $4 to $500,000.
>> But there's IRA credits that maybe could get you, I say, at least a third of that back potentially. And then the other thing on on my mind is is that and we don't have to consider this, but we may come under budget enough on the roof and
boiler project that we'll have money that hasn't been allocated towards projects uh but was uh set aside for um this debt exclusion. If we wanted to, we could go to the ballot and ask to have some of those funds remain on a debt exclusion and go towards another
project, whether that's for the paving at the DPW or potentially for this uh rooftop solar. Um, if we come in under budget enough, and part of that depends on where the the paving projects come in on, we're about to see costs go up, I assume for
>> all sorts of paving, which is great. >> Surprisingly, the price of blacktop has not moved >> really. It is still the same as last year. >> Huh. >> Yeah. Chapter 90 >> in the private sector at this point at this moment. >> Yeah, chapter 90 will be a large escalation if it doesn't come back down after the fact. But
>> um I know that it'll probably be a question of some residents. The solar potential solar project is it a lease program or is it an ownership program? >> You rather do ownership, >> right? I would agree with that. >> So that we can be knowledgeable. I think everyone based on the deal that Smithy's
group has, we would far prefer to own it. I I personally would agree with that, >> especially as the tax credits become, >> right? That'd be great. Cool. >> Cool. >> All set. >> Okay. New. Yes. Thank you very much, David and Christie. Appreciate it.
>> Okay. >> We have still the building Andrew. I guess you can update on the building inspector and the accountant. >> So, um, a couple things here. So, I I did send a message around to see if there'd be potential interest in having
another meeting uh next week. I know we originally scheduled for April 21st. If we could do next week instead, that would give us an opportunity to kind of get ahead of some of these budget questions just in case we had anything we wanted to go to the ballot. I don't anticipate an override at this time, but I think um that or the debt exclusion
thing I just brought up if we wanted to to get ourselves in position to really discuss those things. Um, so I've asked the finance committee chair if there'd be availability for next week so we can coordinate that together. But the other thing I would like to do next week if
we're up for it, um, would be to, uh, we have an alternate building inspector right now. Uh, he is willing to serve as an interim building inspector since we currently do not have a full-time building inspector. Um, I think the
discussion with him has been to pay at a similar scale to what the uh, building inspector currently receives, but to go to 19 hours a week rather than uh, right now our building inspector is at 33. Looking at the the workload so far, it feels like that at least at a provisional basis, we could start at a
19-hour a week position. We could potentially even try that for next year um, full-time. So, right now the the budget line for if if you want to look at the the budget book, we had originally budgeted for building inspector um inspectional services at I
believe 65,000 for salary. That could potentially come down to closer to 40,000 if we do the the part-time >> at that pay scale that that we're discussing. Um, and I I believe that with the assistance that's going towards kind of the background research on
zoning, so the building inspector would remain the zoning enforcement officer, but we have, you know, more support coming from the planning office, um, and from the planning board. We have, you know, an online system that's working really well for for tracking things, and we're getting more support from the
administrative assistant on, you know, secretarial work. I think with all of those supports, 19 hours is probably more reasonable and we can do that at least for now. Um there is interest in that position from a couple people from what I hear. Um but so far we're I'm
happy with the um the uh the alternate who who we've been working with. So I'd recommend make appointing him as the interim and then we post a position for um for longer term if that's of interest. >> That makes that makes sense to me. Yeah. Um, just getting back to what you're
saying, the meeting next week, it'd be mostly just financial. >> We'd be talking budget. Okay. >> Yeah. And this one appointment for Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Is uh the alternate given any sort of like timeline on how long he's okay with do acting as the interim? Is it a
month-long thing? Is it a three-monthlong thing? >> Very comfortable with with 30 days, but also is interested in the position for longer. >> Okay. >> Which is great. >> That is great. >> Yeah. So, it gives us time to post and interview some folks if you'd like. I mean, for for the longer term
appointment, I would think you'd like to do interviews and >> Yeah. >> Yeah. know people, but >> um the alternate that I'm I'm I'd be recommending is Wally Merrick. Um he's uh he works in West Hampton as well, and he's he's also a builder in his own
right. Um but he he's interested at least definitely in the interim and potentially longer term, which would be great. Okay. And when we appointed him assistant, he also came very highly recommended from Kyle as well. >> He did. >> Yep. Yeah. We uh Yeah. So, he's currently serving as the alternate has
been able to step in and approve really anything that we need, but to get him to do more hours, I think we'd want to approve it at the right pay scale and everything else. >> So, um that would bring down the professional salaries line for next year if we do go in that direction, which I'd
recommend. Um, we can also, you know, think about that ourselves and kind of see what the the work is looking like. We can nail that number down for real when we get a little closer to town meeting. Um, I don't think the rest of the budget changes too much between admin office supplies, Mrs. Travel, used
membership. Um, that should all stay pretty consistent, but I'll look if there's any room for that. It's just a real question about the salary >> and the number of hours. And then the other line that I want to make sure I discussed with you um which I don't think I have yet is accounting. Um and
this is a slight change as well. Um we had looked at some potential options for um either bringing staff on site. Uh right now the recommendation would be uh to work with our consultant here again um
CBiz. Um what Sophie had heard about other communities doing that I think would be a really good fit for us as well is CBiz has been filling the function for us in accounts payable essentially entering all of the information from our uh warrants into the online system. So we're paying a
decent amount for consulting services just to poke numbers in to a computer. Um and that's something we can bring in house. So, what we'd like to do is bring that in-house to one of our um part-time staff who's already, you know, here and has the capacity to to be doing that
work. Um, and that would reduce our contract with CBIZ from $102,000 to $87,000. So, that's some savings for us and we wouldn't be using consultant time to do this kind of entry entry uh data entry work. >> So, I I'd like to move in that
direction. We have a proposal from them and I think that's what we'll do and continue to look for other options for accounting as well. Um there is some are some advantages to if we could find the right person to work in house that'd be great. Um but you know we I I think this would would help us at least in the
short term. So that's accounting and then um overall budget picture speaking of our accountants I did meet with them this week just to take you know the initial work that I have which was to take all of the requests that we have put them into a budget spreadsheet and then match
that with the early estimates right now on state assessments and uh local receipts and everything else to kind of look at what our budget picture looks like. And that's really without doing a ton of cuts or a ton of of of uh looking at supplemental sources or anything else. Um, that's just to match up
everything that that we have in our budget worksheet to what the accountants are going to use to to double check that as we talked about last year. So, it shows a deficit right now, which makes sense because we haven't really gone through making cuts or or trying to rightsize things entirely. Um, and that deficit's around $500,000, which is
large. Um but uh my what my goal is is to bring that down considerably by the next time we meet uh next week and have a plan for you of of where we would find uh to bridge the rest of that deficit. So I think by cuts alone we can cut around half of that and then we'd look
at um whether we want to use any free cash supplement this year or make changes in in some other other things. Does that include the $300,000 that we need to fund as well >> from what from that money that we had talked about that we also needed to
allocate from last year? >> It would include that. >> So that 500 includes that >> includes any deficit from last year. Yeah, for sure. >> Good. >> Yeah. When I talk about being in the whole like most of it is from what we talked about last year, >> right? So that it's I just wanted to make sure that's not additional on top. >> No, no, it's really it's not really
anything we didn't know about with the exception of the early estimates from the state on some uh local assessments for both charter and school choice are larger than last year, a lot larger than last year, which is unfortunate. So we'll we'll see those could change
potentially, but uh we need to budget for, you know, the the the whole size that they're showing. >> Okay. So that's kind of where we're at at the moment, but I think we have the opportunity to cut down further >> and we're ready to move to topic one.
>> There we go. >> Time. >> I think I still need Did Did you hear anything from from Sean about But >> we're we're open I think Monday, Tuesday Wednesday. >> Oh, great. Um can we do Tuesday night from this group? Yes. What's
>> the seventh? Uh, >> yeah. >> The Yeah, it's 5:30 on the the 7th. >> Yep. >> John, you want to come? Great. >> Sure. We have a room. And I think we'll plan to do upstairs. We can >> Can we compromise and say six? Because I
know Daryl sometimes. >> Yeah, let's do six. >> It's better for him at 6:30, but if we compromise at 6, then >> Yep. >> Yeah, that's fine. >> So, that's instead of the 21st. >> Yes. >> Yep. We're going to plan on not having to meet on the on the 21st. >> Really?
Uh, is that it over ambitious? >> Yeah, I would say so. >> My thought is if we can do the the the 7th and the 14th and then the 28th, we should be okay. >> Oh. Oh, I I was anticipating skipping
the 14th and then meeting the 24th. >> No, I think we'd like to do the 7th, 14th, and 28th. >> Okay. All right, then. I'm good with that. Sorry. >> Perfect. No, no, no, no. We need three meetings, but uh if we do the the 7th, 14th, and 21st, I think we're okay.
>> 7th, 14th. So 7th, 14th, and 28th. >> Yes. Plan on that. The other meeting, the 14th and the 28th, staying at 5:30. >> Yes. Okay. And then finance would join us at 6:30. Great.
Great. So, let's go back to um one topic one. So, this is a request from the police department. As I I'm sure you're aware um we do have a little less staff at the moment u because of the retirement of uh Sergeant
Michael Johnson. Um we um where is my It's fine. So the request that came in um was because uh the um the chief and lieutenant uh Lieutenant Phillips already had vacation
time and time off planned and um Andrew Montz or patrolman would have planned to take time off um when it could be covered by Sergeant Johnson. Um without uh Sergeant Johnson here,
um Andrew Monz isn't going to be able to take time off and uh rather than him losing that time, which you know was unanticipated that this would happen uh because of the the sudden retirement. Question is if he could buy back two weeks of vacation time, um the the chief
has it in his budget that he can cover that. it wouldn't be an extra expense for the town and it wouldn't create an additional liability for more vacation time hanging out there if we just let him carry it over instead. So, it would be a one-time buyback. It's not something we typically do, but because of the stenuating circumstances here of
the the staffing issues and other folks already having time off, there just really practically isn't time for him to take he'd like to buy back those two weeks. So, he'd be paid out for two weeks of vacation rather than taking them. >> Any questions? >> So, he Yeah. So, he's getting paid out for them and not rolling it.
>> He wouldn't roll it over. He would just get paid. >> I'm good with it. >> Out of the chief's budget. >> Yep. >> I'm fine with it. >> Good with that. >> Okay. >> Okay. Since uh again, because it's extenduating circumstances because over the years we've gone through this with
COVID and we've encouraged everybody to make sure they take their vacation. Yeah. >> Because everybody needs a vacation. But I can understand because of the situation they're in, it's a possibility. We've made exceptions with other departments due to things like that. So,
>> so I think we just would want a motion to allow um Andrew Montz to to be paid for two weeks of vacation time. >> We'll make a motion to approve the request from Andrew Mottz to be paid his vacation time.
>> Second. >> Motion made. Motion seconded. Any discussion? All in favor? I. >> Motion carries. >> Thank you all. >> Okay. Topic five, IT vendor selection. >> Um, I think this is also something that uh if we have time of the meeting of the
seventh, we we can uh follow up on this more then, but um I really just wanted to see I I feel like I have it down to two finalists. Want to see if anyone here wanted to be involved in in interviews for the vendors or if you would like to just go with my recommendation next time we meet.
>> You can go with I I think you can go with your recommendation. >> Great. Well, then I'll put together a formal memo for your review and then we'll >> have objections. >> Great. Okay, >> perfect. All right, that's easy. >> Um, >> contract with MDM Engineering for
Hatfield Elementary School roof. >> Yep. So, this was discussed last time when we signed the uh the notice to proceed or the um notice of award. Uh everything's been going well with them. I don't know if Marlo has anything to add because he's been been talking with the project manager in my absence, but >> you had a kickoff meeting with them, I
Yeah, we had a kickoff on the 23rd. Uh part of my update. >> Yep. >> Um we're moving ahead. Um we were what, four weeks out at the time for project start. Um just a quick note on it, uh received a phone call last Thursday and
if we didn't give an answer for the color of the shingles, by 2 p.m. they were going up 12%. So that's your fuel increase for asphalt shingles. So we got under the gun. We we decided on Peter gray. So
>> it's beautiful. >> It look great. >> Yeah. >> And all that to say, you know, we can recommend signing this contract. The firm's been, you know, responsive so far. Um price is great and uh again, we we have a good good uh we have good
reputation with our designer and our project manager. So >> this contract require well three signatures. >> Yep. You each uh sign it and we'll write your names underneath. So, the um >> I just need a motion. >> The only question I have with it is that it's not filled out about substantial completion timelines on at least in the
packet that we have. Maybe there it is. But clearly, it's something that we need to make sure is dialed in. >> Yep. Um that should be in the supplemental doc that's in it's in the uh bid um documents. So, it's there. Um so, refer
to that, but we can I'll make sure that it's it's referenced. >> Yeah, it has a whole called out article here. So, I think we should make sure that's filled in. But, >> okay, we'll take care of that. >> Other than that, looks good. >> Great. And clearly, our timeline is very well defined on this. You we need to have everything completed by the president.
>> So, we still need a motion, right? >> Still need a motion on this or no? >> I don't think so. >> You can make a motion. >> I think a motion to approve the contract with MDM Engineering. >> I'll make a motion to approve the contract with MDM Engineering for the Howfield Elementary School roof. >> Second.
>> Motion made. Motion seconded. Any discussion? All in favor? >> I. >> Motion carries. So, we'll be able to sign that one. All right. Decoration of surplus property, fire department radios, DP DW vehicles, and
sweeper. >> Chief, do you want to speak to this? So, for my part, this would be just the remaining uh portables and a couple of mobile radios that we had taken out of the truck back in 2022 um when we had gotten the AFG grant and
also some town funding to replace all of our radios within the fire department. Uh I chose to hold on to them in case, you know, something one of the new ones broke. We still had communications, but we're now going on four years of them sitting out in the end bay in storage.
they're really of no use to us anymore at this point. So, it was to declare them surplus. My hope would be is to possibly offer them up to another department in the area um because there are some departments that have little to no communications equipment and then if not then they they hold very little
value as you see in the note there um to try to put them. we can go to municip bid and then if they did not receive any bids to dispose of at that point. Their old technology most of them are now uh anywhere between I think 16 and 24
years old for the most part on the portables and the mobiles are probably sitting at around between 14 and uh 18 years of age. >> Wow. >> Just going back to the the ambulance one is so the ambulance radio that you have
to replace now is only four years old. No, no, no. Well, that one was from 2020 when the ambulance came in. >> So, it's six years old. It >> is six years old. >> And it it is no longer going to be compliant. Is not P25 compliant, which
is the new radio standard, not with the new phase. They're going to phase two later this year. So, that was it for these radios. Just >> kind these aren't of any benefit to for you guys for town vehicles, right? So, you could have a your own radio channel
to communicate or >> I would say no. >> Okay. All right. Good enough. >> I mean, they clearly don't hold very much value at all. So, >> we can't use them. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. They're they're good for little things here and there and
>> but with what we already have in town, it's they're really no use for us anymore. >> I'll entertain a motion. I know. >> I'll make a motion to declare the fire department radios as surplus. >> Second. >> As indicated on this list, right?
>> Yes. As indicated on the list provided. >> Okay. Um motion made. >> Second. >> Motion seconded. Any discussion? >> No. >> All in favor? >> I. >> Motion carries. DPW surplus. >> You uh have to vote individually or all
five? >> We'll do all five. >> Okay. Um I hopefully it's pretty self-explanatory. The the first two the sewer and water trucks were the were the ones that were just replaced and we received um they really don't have any
value to us. They need a ton of work. So um looking to declare them um the other one is an F350 that I believe is the one sitting out in the yard with no bed on it when I arrived. Um and that thing
needs a ton of work. uh it's not worth investing in. Uh frame troubles, so on and so forth. Uh with 126,000 on it. Um the 99 International dump truck, although we haven't received the hook truck yet, I figured I'd put it on the
list now. So, this particular truck has a slide in sander that we do gravel roads with, and it also doubles to salt the roads if we lose one of our main salt trucks. Um, it's definitely got a frame problem. So, I just wanted to get
it um surplus now. So, when it if winter is over, we can go ahead and surplus it. Um, the sweeper um that is an extremely old sweeper. It doesn't have a centerline broom. It's just got a gutter broom and a rear broom. Uh, and honestly
needs a ton of money put into it um in order to make it roadw worthy and dependable for us. Um I talked it over with um the highway superintendent and dealing with sweeping in my last communities. Um
if we need, you know, a major amount of sweeping done, it's relatively cheap at the end of the day to contract it rather than with a small crew put someone out there for a week or whatnot. Um and we do have other small brooms that go on our equipment in case there's a spill and and whatnot in town, we can come
clean it up. So, um it this also helps um free up a little more space in the in the in the back the back building as we call it. So, I will have more to come. Probably smaller stuff and whatnot, but I figured we get going on the larger
vehicles first. Any questions? >> Nope. >> Then I'll entertain a motion. >> I'll make a motion to declare the five items listed as surplus. >> Second motion made second. Any discussion? All in favor? Motion
carries. Okay. >> Okay. Item eight, the department of fishing game acquisition of 7 acres of wildlife. So to give people sort of an idea is near the old airport
sort of behind Shimmeras. The fishing game already has a section of land that is under their jurisdiction. So there's a I don't know if John can see it.
There's a little piece of land that was 7.7 acres that's inside that that they're going to uh acquire. And it seems to me this is purelyformational for us, but I just want to make sure this is in your packet. So, so you can see it and this
way we're making it known to the public as well. Uh it doesn't appear that there's anything we need to do. They just want to inform us and >> we can also plan on what that will do to to taxes which are already pretty negligible on this piece. >> Um but it looks like it would take one
small parcel currently owned by the Duda irrevocable land trust and bring it into the rest of the reserve. So, looks fine. And also if people in town are interested on where the fishing game owns property in town, you can go to the
Massachusetts Gov site, the fishing game site, and they do have uh maps of of a couple other part parcels in town that is under their jurisdiction for fishing or hunting. So uh some people may not be
aware of that. All right. So, appointments and resignations is next. Topic nine. >> You have two resignations tonight. Um, I'll let uh Marlo speak to the first one. >> Uh, yes. U Mr. I want to thank Mr.
Zakitis. Uh, especially for this winter. The whole crew uh did an outstanding job. Very dependable. Um, he's decided to take a a position with another entity. Um, his last day is Friday. I'll make a motion to accept uh Mr.
Zakitis's resignation. >> Second. >> Motion made. Motion seconded. Any discussion? All in favor? >> I. >> Motion carries. And >> I'll reach out to arrange an exit interview with him. Yes. >> Make sure we talk.
>> And then we also have resignation of Christian Wols, full-time firefighter. I don't know, Chief, if you want to say anything about this, but yeah. Uh, so Christian was only appointed to Hatfield back in September. Um, he just has another job opportunity that's a little bit closer to home. He lives in
Hardwick, Mass. So, it's a little bit of a drive. It's just an opportunity that he he couldn't pass up. Unfortunately, he had just graduated from the fire academy the week before he handed me his letter. Um, so he's gone as a full-timer. He does want to stay on as a
PDM member. He actually just signed up for a couple more shifts today. So, he's still going to be floating around, but he he's going to be leaving the full-time position. So, right now, um there's only the two of us working. >> At least we still have him for predium. So, that's that's not a bad thing, I guess.
>> Yep. And I signed off on some paperwork. He's actually going to be unless his job changes that. He was going to be starting paramedic school in the fall. >> Nice. >> On his own cost, not not on ours. >> Any questions? Nope.
>> No. Entertain a motion. I make a motion that we accept the resignation of Christian Lol as a full-time firefighter. >> Second. >> Motion made. Motion seconded. Any discussion? All in favor? >> Motion carries.
Okay. DPW report topic 10. >> You >> um the cooperative bid estimates for diesel, gasoline, and heating were sent to me. I had to fill out the surveys, sent them back. Um, a quick note on this
as far as what fuel prices are doing now. I mean, we know what heating oil has gone up to. Well, when we get those contracts back, we'll have an option to lock in or to um purchase at rack price, basically pump price. Um, so we'll wait
for those to come back. I don't expect to see them until the end of May, June maybe. Um so when those come back um we can decide on that piece. Uh had a couple of walkthroughs, couple assessments in the buildings. Uh we had an ADA assessment uh and an energy
audit, two separate uh assessments. Uh one was through uh PC PVPC which was the energy audit and a consulting firm of AICP uh for the AD assessment. And we're just waiting on the the reports for that. They went through all all the town
building. Um I've attached a a letter outlining a plan for the Elm Court building with an initial estimates. Uh if it would please the board, I'll get through the rest of my update and we can handle that last. >> Sure. >> As a point of discussion. >> Perfect.
>> Um we started our spring cleanup with the highway department. Uh plow damage. Uh hopefully the black top plant opens next week so we can get what potholes we have out there patched up permanently. Um, we prepared helped prepare the
fields for uh for spring sports. Um, they come along real nice. As a matter of fact, they were playing on the baseball diamond on my way over here. So, um, good work by the highway department uh, with the assistance uh, of the school department. Um, and the
highway department, I mean the highway superintendent and myself were discussing work schedule for upcoming projects and for the the summer construction. Uh we got a few projects that were on the back burner that we need to plan to do such as um couple of roads in the cemeteries, Main Street
Cemetery um and Brad Street Cemetery. So that's one of the bigger projects and we do have two or three catch basins we have to rebuild uh along with um numerous other items. Uh we've had 20 20 20 winter storm events. I hope we're
done. Um I attached an accounting report of where we're at. That's that's all our invoices. That's everything accounted for at this point. We're about $68,551 to the negative, which I think overall with 20 storm
events and they all fell on Fridays, weekends, and holidays for the most part. I think um overall we did a pretty good job with the budget. Um, >> commendable that we had a much more intense winter this year than last and
>> still fell $32,000 under what the overage was last year. So, you guys did a great job with that. So, good. >> A lot of them were long duration events. Even if they were five inches, they were long duration. So, >> and there was no sacrificing quality of the roads either. So, >> well, that was the thing. I I um I
insisted on providing what they've provided in the past and I I basically Hadfield wants a black black rose policy and that's what we did. We provided that. So um just last week a sinkhole developed in
in Maple Street um and we we dug it up on an emergency dig and it was an old decayed telephone pole that got cut off grade about four feet down. So, um, no infrastructure issues. Uh, Dayon, that that really is no change. I know they've
been removing some, um, some boards and and railroad ties out of there as far as their their lay down mats and whatnot, but it's probably still a little wet from for them to finish grading that up. Um, Hatfield Elementary School Boilers, um, they they are they have arrived.
They're at Adams Plumbing and they're due to be replaced during April vacation, uh, when the school is out of session. which I think is just a couple of weeks away. Um pavement management, there's really man management, there's really no change. I expect to hear from them any
day to start evaluating the roads. Um elementary school roof, we touched upon that and the increase on the shingles, but we we got underneath that. Uh un unpaid road grants, I haven't had we haven't heard anything on that as of yet. Uh vehicles, the hook truck is due
to be in in May time frame. I talked to the um the distributors last Thursday night. Uh facilities real quick. The fire suppression system was out of compliance in this building when it was inspected. Um so they came in last week,
brought us into compliance, NFPA compliance at the tune of about $5,000, just shy of it. They had to change a bunch of valves that were out of compliance for having issues. Um and then we also uh lost another pipe downstairs. Uh, good catch that somebody
just happened to go in the storage room up front right next to the the ladies room in COA and the carpet was wet. It was actually a steam line to the boiler system that sprung in the corner that was was kind of hidden. So, we got that in time. So, there was really no
significant water damage. That's great. Elcourt. Um I I sent you a memo and I also resent the proposals that uh I had sent last meeting. Um and I think it's important um you know I've heard so many things since I've come aboard last July
on this building and that property. Um, so I think I took a look at it as okay, you know, I know that um it wasn't I I guess it wasn't exactly um
as advertised. I mean, it all depends. I've heard so many rumors of what that building was going to be used for and what was supposed to go there. So, I decided I'll just take the the avenue that I'm going to put all that aside and and try and write the ship. what can we use the building for going forward?
You know, uh with myself taking a look at it. So, uh basically it's a 40 40x60 3ay garage. That's what we have there. Um it's a shell of a building. It has no utilities in it at this point. Um no
cement floor, dirt floor. Um, it did have some other utilities run to it, but I I want to I want to stress that going forward. Uh, for what I'm proposing to to make this this building weathertight and and good use to the to the town, um,
I have no intent at this at this point of that building being inhabited and needing water and insulation and all that. Uh, could it be a backup down the road? Sure. But um my util my my suggestion, my high opinion is uh we can
use the storage space for DPW equipment, rotate equipment out um that's not stuck outside throughout the seasons, winter equipment, so on and so forth. Um I feel that this building is a is a very good asset to the town. Um,
we could easily utilize all three bays in the DPW, but we also could could, you know, work work with you all and and other departments on affording a bay if it's needed. Um, again for town use. Um, I've attached the three quotes uh
for minimal electrical uh pouring the floor in an apron out front of the building. Um, and also uh garage door openers. Now, these are just three quotes. If if if this was to in the future be approved, we'd have to get the
three different quotes and all that. We may come in lower, but these were the ones that I got response from as far as electrical uh door door companies and concrete. So, it came to 56,570 for for that building to be buttoned up,
secured, lighting, and and usable. >> That's a total cost, >> excuse me, >> the total cost to do what you want to do >> for Yeah. And I attached the quotes for and they're broken down for the garage door openers. There's a small map with the minimal electrical give you extra
lot give us extra outlets in there. Um and safety lighting above the entry doors and the garage doors. Uh any excavation or installation of electrical to get to the building. Um we'll do that in house with the DPW. Um
and then pouring the floor which it's a 40x60 floor. What kind of equipment would you if if that building was done? What what type of equipment would be going in there? >> So, the other thing we we have talked about is one of the bays or a good half
a bay is to set some racks up and have um have some water repair have water repair parts there and some sewer repair parts. And one of the points to that is keeping all our repair equipment up on the the hill at the at the water plant.
um you get a water main break, it's you know under regulation, you got to get up and running uh as soon as possible. So a lot of our pipes here and in most communities you don't know the the OD the outer diameter diameter of those pipes until you dig them up and clean
them up and measure them. So uh most of the time it ends up with a trip on top of the hill to get the fittings you need to do the repair while everybody's waiting. Um, it's kind of like bringing bringing some of our equipment, emergency repair pieces and parts to a
more local location so that we can get to them a lot quicker. Um, but like we have the the summertime equipment, the the paving roller, uh, some of the winter equipment we can stall store there in the summer. Um, so like I said,
it will rotate out. Um, it'll always have a use for equipment that we're rotating out that's sitting outside now. any advantages to the town where I we're protecting our equipment a little bit better. >> Yeah. >> We're also have a area where our spare
parts are going to be and basically the way I see it if if we have a game plan which you've developed it makes sense to present it and see if the town want to pay for it or not. That's all. I mean, I think as long as we can go to town meeting with some kind
of game plan of what the use will be of the building, then the town can decide if they want to spend their money or not. >> Yeah. I'm sorry. >> Like the the other the big point for me is that it's completing the building back to what was originally voted on by
the town's people. It's putting it back to the storage building, which is what the town's people originally voted on. Uh it's not making it into anything that's different than that. It's just finally finishing the project. Last year, believe we were in um uh a finance
meeting and it was one of the things that was potentially recommended to finish. And the numbers last year, if I recall correctly, were even a little higher than this. So, >> I'd say it was more like $140,000 or maybe $100,000. >> I thought it was 120. Yeah. >> Yeah. So to be able to complete the
project for 56, >> but I think what that was was insulation and all that kind of stuff to make it habitable as you say, not >> right. >> Yeah. >> So it's a much I think it's a much smaller lift and it's making the building what the residents originally agreed to and there's clearly a need for
it. um you know the conversation of what actually goes up there if is a movement of town vehicles around if that's um something that we can explore. Um but I think for for an article for town
meeting I I would support moving this forward. >> I would support moving this forward and let the town decide now that there's a feasible game plan and that's my opinion. >> I agree. Let the town decide. let the town decide.
>> Okay. So, we'll move this forward as an article. >> I'll start building that into the free cash projections. I think that's where it would have to come from. >> That's a nice That's That was my second question I was going to ask if we could use free cash on it. >> I was also wondering if we could use
some of the debt excluded money for it. >> Oh, interesting. Um if I It's a kind of a small amount to to bond. Um um I think you I just think it would keep us a little bit more liquid in terms of not tapping into more of that
free cash. >> Yeah. Um let me ask about that and and see. It's just kind of a um >> I know it's a small number. >> It's a small number, but if we you know if we're asking for a series of things that we'd work into that exclusion piece. >> I think it's a small number for certain do it
>> an individual project but it's a fairly large number when you look at it in terms of what our free cash budget is. Yeah, I'd agree with that. Um, no, I'm I'm up for any creative solutions. So, >> and I didn't build any contingency. These were the straight up numbers >> from the the three quotes we got, you
know, that's why I'm hoping next week we can get narrow it down to what we have, you know, right? >> And and see what our budget is cuz >> it's still we're still wondering. So, >> y exactly. That's what we'll do next week. We'll have a good >> closer and closer to town meeting. We
got to get it down. I did fail to mention that, you know, obviously, uh, fire protection plays into a water man being down four hours as opposed to six or seven, too. Um, >> and D likes to be notified if a water man's down more than four hours. It's under regulation. So,
>> I think it's a good move. >> On this, I just want to touch on the potential of shifting vehicles around and who goes where and what the bays are used for. I don't know if we can set up a meeting with um whether like I I would volunteer to be
on it but like Marlo you both of them are both the police fire and COA. >> Yep. >> We can just have like a quick working group and discuss potential options and what could be amicable and what could be compromised on and then kind of come up with a plan with that.
>> One select board member to kind of spearhead that and report back to the group that kind of thing. >> Yeah. Well, we can't have more than one or else we'd have a forum. So, >> that sounds right. >> Unless we want to post it, which >> I think doing it outside of a meeting would be fine. Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Does that sound good? Have Luke do that? >> I'm fine with that. I don't know. Are
you fine? >> That's good. >> I'm fine with that. >> That'd be great. >> Yes. So, if we can get that set up fairly quickly, that'd be that'd be great. >> We'll get something together this week, that'd be great. Thanks. That sounds all right. Yeah. >> Perfect. >> Okay. What else?
>> Town administrator report. >> Yeah, I I think you've heard enough from me tonight to be honest. >> Um, no, no, I mean I I think Marlo, all the good stuff and I I just have one more thing to say on health insurance because that hasn't been discussed enough tonight.
>> So, as a reminder, um on the health Hampshire County Group Insurance Trust, um we'll need to start the process to negotiate with the PE on the um additions of the deductibles and the higher co-pays. So I will put that proposal together and uh send that to
them. Um that includes um the mitigation that we need to offer as a part of that. Um so we'll do it through the chapter uh 32B sections 21 through 23 process, but we can also see if you know we've been working with this PE pretty well. If we want to just reach an agreement and just
negotiate without having to go through that process, I'd be happy to do that with them too. So um I will be putting that together. send that out to PEC uh with your consensus here and we'll get that moving. That sounds good. >> Yeah. >> Great. All right. So, otherwise I um
don't have anything tonight. I think uh we've been through enough. So, um I'll just hit topic 12. This idea of a warrant article for Route Five expenses. I don't really have much to say on that besides that I think we should have one. Um, I'd like to just put instead of
upping our one-time legal and um and project management and um DPW professional services lines to to pay for anything that might come up as we deal with this Route 5 issue this year. I'd like to just have a small account put together and we can decide how much
money we think makes sense for that. But we'll just be clear with residents about what we're dealing with here and I think people will understand. It also allows us to track how much it is so that hopefully we can get it all paid back to us in the future. >> Right. The the purpose is to get it all paid back in the future. Hopefully
>> we'd like to do. >> Yes. So that's probably a smart thing to do is have that a warrant for that. >> Makes it easier to track. >> But we we need to explain to the taxpayers the purpose of it and and what we're doing. So that's the >> and that we think it's a reasonable
amount so we can discuss how much we think that should be. I mean, we should have the initial tie-in bond report covered for this year and initial legal expenses covered for this year, but legal expenses will be hefty next year for this project. >> And um if we budget for the geotech
piece um from that account, too, that could be helpful. I don't think we'll have a ton of invoices coming in for that until midmay anyway. So, um we can have that approved. So, I'm thinking it's somewhere between 50 and 75,000, but less would be nice. So we can figure
that out. >> Questions? >> No, I was just thinking it was going to be like double that, but >> Oh, I mean it really depends. I mean, the legal could be considerable. >> Yeah. So, >> that's kind of what I was thinking. >> But there it's already >> Yeah.
>> Uh any old Let's see. We do have old B. We do have uh >> Oh, we need Yeah, the unanticipated new business. Um >> uh anticipated new business. Perfect. >> We have a uh change of manager for the
Hatfield Rally House LLC. >> So, we just need a motion on this. >> This change of it's no change of manager. This is approving of their uh alcohol license that they've received. Yeah. >> So, they they uh were waiting for
approval from the ABCC for their um their license and that just has to be approved by us. >> Okay. Is it beer and wine or is it alcohol? >> Beer and wine. >> Beer and wine. >> So, >> I'll make a motion that we approve the
Hatfield Rally House LLC wine and malt license. >> Second. Motion made. Motion seconded. >> Uh, any discussion? All in favor? >> Motion carries. Okay.
>> Nice. >> All right. Any other thing before we move into executive session? >> No. Let's go behind closed doors. >> Okay. Let's see. Make a mo. Well, it doesn't have the
motion on here. It just says we have gone into executive session >> on mine. >> Yeah, same. I've got the one from last week if you'd like it. >> If you don't mind, it should be the same. All right. Thank you. Okay. Okay. I'll make a motion to go to an executive session with special counsel pursuant to
general law C 30A section 21A 3 to discuss strategy with respect to potential litigation arising from the route 5 infrastructure project and pursuant to general law C3A21A7
to comply with or act under the authority of any general or special law or federal ederal grant and aid requirements. Specifically, the public records law GLC 4S 726
discuss privilege communication from special counsel and not to return to regular session. >> Second. >> I have a second. Jorski I can I >> thank you John and have a good night.
Thank you.