All right. That was Yeah. First row is off. >> Good. Okay. It's 7:05. I call tonight's meeting to order. Roll call. Listen.
Okay. Okay. Hello. >> Yes. >> Am I on? Hello. >> It's It's on, but you turn the mic off. >> Um, okay. Bennett >> here. >> Leosa >> here.
>> Millie. Sasso here. Mara >> here. >> Waki here. >> Matthews >> here. Please rise and join us in the pledge of allegiance. to the flag of
the standy justice for all. >> Adequate notice of this meeting has been provided by the annual schedule of regular meetings. Herefore adopted and posted on the public bulletin board at the municipal building, emailed to the Herald News, the record, the Gazette, and all persons who have requested the
mailing of such since November 19, 2024. Approval of minutes. Have approval of the minutes for the regular meeting of November 17th, 2025. So moved. >> Sasso second. >> Motion by Scar. Second by Sasso. Any discussion? Roll call. >> WKI.
>> Yes. >> Skiara. >> Yes. >> Sasso. Yes. >> Leosa. >> Yes. >> Bennett. >> Yes. >> Matthews. >> Yes. >> Motion carries. >> Public comment. I'll now open the meeting to the public for agenda items. If you wish to be heard, step forward to the microphone. State your name.
Seeing none, I entertain a motion to close the public portion of the meeting. So move >> second by Bennett, second by Sierra. All in favor? I. >> Motion carries. Adoption of ordinances. Uh the first ordinance 2376-25 is being postponed until the next
meeting. Um that needs to be reviewed by the planning board and last night's planning board meeting was cancelled due to lack of power. >> Yeah, >> you can't make that one up. >> I was at >> Yeah. So, moving on to ordinance number 2377-25.
>> Can I just uh Oh, can I just jump in for one minute? Uh, so the ordinance will not be readvertised or published in any other way, it'll be carried to our next meeting. So, there'll be no further notice. So, if anybody from the public wishes to speak
as to this ordinance, you're on notice right now that come back in 2 weeks. >> You got it. Thank you. >> Water utility bond ordinance number 2377-25. Water utility bond ordinance provided for the water system infrastructure
improvements including specifically replacement of the water manes in and about Gothal Hill Road in and by the burrow of Horththornne and any county of Bake New Jersey appropriating $860,000 therefore authorizing the issuance of bonds and notes of the bureau for the
financing in the same in the amount of $860,000. And now open meeting to the public. If anyone desires to be heard regarding this ordinance, please raise your hand, come forward to the microphone to be recognized. Seeing no one, I entertain a motion the public hearing on this ordinance be closed. That it be resolved this
ordinance was posted on the public bulletin board on which public notices are customarily posted published in the record and made available on the burough website and available to the public. Now therefore, be it resolved this ordinance be adopted and the clerk is authorized to advertise the same according to law.
You have a motion. Motion second by WKEI. Second by Skira. >> Any discussion? >> Roll call. >> Skiara. >> Yes. >> Sasso. Yes. Millie. >> Oh. Still absent. >> Leosa. >> Yes.
>> Bennett. >> Yes. >> Matthews. >> Yes. >> Motion carries. >> Capital ordinance number 2378-25. In orders to authorize the renovation of the bathrooms at the Horththorn Memorial Pool, including purchase of materials and payment of the labor and contracting
costs in the Burrow of Fortnake, state of New Jersey, and to appropriate the sum of $100,000 from the general capital surplus fund of the burrow of Fortning to the public. Anyone desires to be heard regarding this ordinance, come forward to the microphone and state your
name. Seeing no one, I entertain a motion that the public hearing on this ordinance be closed and that it be resolved. This ordinance was posted on the public bulletin board on which public notices are customarily posted, published in the record and made available on the burough website and available to the public. Now
therefore, be it resolved this ordinance be adopted and the clerk is authorized to advertise the same according to law. Have a motion. So move by Bennett, second by WKI. Any discussion? Joe, would you like the old pictures? >> No, no, I'm good.
I didn't think you did. >> Roll call. >> Bennett, >> yes. >> Leosa, >> yes. >> Sasso, yes. >> Skiara, >> yes. >> Waki, >> yes. >> Matthews, >> yes. >> Motion carries. >> Old business. Joe will start your way. >> I wish Dominic was here to hear this. I
have no old and I have no new. >> Whoa. I got to talk about something. Michael, I have nothing. Thanks. >> Uh, just two things. Um, one is the 8acre Woods, the observation platform.
The mayor and I have been talking and uh working with DPW and we're going to proceed with uh rebuilding that platform. Um, the DPW will be doing that over the winter. Um, so it'll be financed by the Environmental
Commission. Um, so we're it's in the works. It will be done hopefully over the winter and we'll start over in the spring and um hopefully um it will not get destroyed again. Um so >> well the tree cameras will take care of that
>> hopefully. Um I definitely want to do that but it just the message if you see something say something. I mean it just seems uh unusually pecular that that damage was done and nobody heard anything. It was pretty substantial of
what was done and how it was uh destroyed. So I just want to make that point and let everyone know that we are going to go and uh repair those that platform. The second piece is I want to talk about three Ronson on Gothal Road.
Um you know that was um a difficult project. I was involved in that as the environmental commission chair testifying many many times in front of the zoning board with those developers. Um we really pushed very hard on that property. It was already designated as a
planned unit development. So they had the uh authority to do multiple housing on there. That was a zoning for the last 20some years. We didn't really change it. Um, so when I came on to the council, we did get sued by Fair Housing
and by a developer with uh 204 Wag and three restaurants and they came together and we really negotiated really tough and hard of how how many units and you know I just want to refresh the where we are. So that agreement we had 116
units with 17 affordable housing. Um and also those homes on Brock Heisen has septic systems and I was very concerned about those septic systems being uh disrupted from the construction of that
that property and luckily um through negotiations the developer has agreed to put that sewer line on that side of the property. So in the event that those homeowners on Brock Heisen, if they have to get a new septic system, they don't
have to. They can hook up into that into that line. So I think that's a benefit for that because you know septic systems, they do fail. But and there's also an 85 ft buffer from Ger Road to those homes. And I read today's article
and I noticed that actually they're building 114 units but they are keeping the 17 units affordable which is key to our share of Horththornne. So actually the developer can develop less units. So
that's the positive. But we really worked hard, the prior administration and this council and I came on, we really worked hard on getting those numbers down for the units per acre and we fulfilled our round three housing. Unfortunately,
we are in round four for the next 10 years and we are in battles with the developer and fair housing again and we're doing everything we can to get those unit numbers down because we do not want the multi- density in Horththornne. We're a small town. We
don't have much property. So, I just want to be clear. This is not something that I personally wanted for three months in that property. That's 6 acres of property. um fought that very hard. Um but in the end, the developers did
win, but we were able to knock down those units cuz it was going to be a lot more units and there was previous developers that wanted to do a lot more on that property which did not happen. So, um just everyone have patience. The trees will be replaced. Um there is a
tree plan and about native plants that was all part of it. Shade tree was involved in that. Um so you know it is what it is. Um but we are going to fight round four. Thank you. >> Frank, can I ask a question? >> Sure.
>> Um it really is proposed to Councilwoman Leosa. I know she was an intricral part of uh this project specifically. A big concern I know she had early on was about the water runoff. And if you could address that because I know that's back
out there in the ether now. if you can just share some of the things that the developers require to do um that you're aware of, I appreciate it. >> Thank you. Um yeah, storm water and the steep slopes uh very severe on that property. Um they are complying with the
storm water regulations. Uh they have to and what water is on that property they have to minimize it going off. So it's the pre-construction minus the post construction. Um, and they have the plans in the building department and the
engineer will be overseeing that storm water system that's going in there. That is a windy road. Um, they're going to do they're we're going to hold them to to the plans and I'm going to hold the engineers to make sure that they comply with those engineering
specs and comply with the New Jersey storm water rags as well as our rags, too. So, um, >> you introduce stronger regs. Yes. Yes. >> From 50% to 70% or whatever the containment number is. >> And I didn't mean to put you on the spot. >> That's okay. Now, I'm very passionate
about storm water. >> But, uh, I also understood that they have to they have to actually contain the water runoff also on their own property. There's a am I right? >> Right. They have to take care of their property, their storm water on their property. They can't displace it to the
neighbors on Brock Heisen or um >> GLE. >> Goffel What's the other little lane? >> Lac. Thank you. Um, Councilwoman Saza, um, so the water they have to manage what they have on their property pre and then post construction.
>> Thank you. >> You're welcome. Appreciate it. >> Bruce Melie. >> Yes. Um, thank you, Councilwoman Leosa. I think we all feel very passionately about this mandate and um, I'd like to
just add a few extra pearls to what um, Councilwoman Leosa said. um that project is comprised of multiple lots. So if somebody is, you know, looking at the public record and assuming that it's one lot and looking at one price, it's comprised of multiple lots. It was for
sale for many years and it morphed into this behemoth that none of us were very pleased with. When a prop when a developer takes the town to court because they want what they want, we lose any say. So this is not something that anybody was happy with. And thanks
to the intellect of uh Councilman Leosa and certainly the hard work of of the administration and and council, the only real say that we had was the storm water runoff at at a certain point. So um it's it's a that was part of the third round affordable housing.
Um it is very frustrating for all towns, but the only one we care about is ours, right? Um the question I wanted to ask of um counselor um bring us up to speed um with this fourth round that came out um
which is absolutely um I keep using the word criminal because it change they changed the rules they put this hor the numbers that they brought out to all the municipalities were not possible and it's really very stressful for the town. So, I know that Horththornne joined with
the 29 town coalition lawsuit. Um, we are a part of that. We're fighting back tooth and nails and um I want our residents to know all that information. We have spoken about it at previous council meetings. Um, but I don't think we can speak about it enough to educate our residents. So, I would just ask our
counselor to please bring us up to speed um with that lawsuit and any other information that you have, please. >> I'm I'm happy to do so. I have uh actually save me from putting it in my report anyway because I do have a lot of affordable housing information to go
forward with. Let me first address something on the site that uh Councilwoman Leosa spoke spoke of. None of us, you know, were all too thrilled to see that property in its current state. And while many of the trees on
that site we can all agree and acknowledge were dead, dying, or didn't belong there, a lot of them did. And to see it in its current state is disheartening. It's disheartening because the people who are advocates for housing
really don't care about the impact on the environment. Not at all. um that the affordable housing is so important that it's okay to denude a property, strip it down um and overbuild.
And the impact on our infrastructure and on our you know the beauty of our hill doesn't matter when it comes to affordable housing. Uh it's a sad state and it's something that disappoints me
as an attorney because our Supreme Court said it's a constitutional mandate which you and I council president know is not in the constitution but they said so otherwise. Um so we are you know we made the best of the situation we could at
that site. At the end of the day it is a quality builder. Our engineer, John Yakimick, is riding herd over them to make sure they're doing it right to make sure there was they actually went to a double silk fence because we were so
concerned about the runoff of the mud. Um, every day of the week, John's office is involved in that project. So, we have eyes on it and they have escrow posted, which is good, too. So, it will not be at the taxpayers's cost. It'll be at the
developer's cost. Um, as to the question you asked, um, the lawsuit that was filed by Montil and we joined at 29 towns at the state level, it was dismissed because it frankly was not a good state court
action. The issues um, that exist in the state court, and I'm not going to get into all the details, would not really allow for a state court action. and everybody kind of knew that going in. But the federal case continues. There was an application filed to dismiss the
federal case and the attorneys in our case, and I was part of a large meeting on this, decided, no, we're going to go forward and and amp it up and file for injective relief to stop the application
of all of the affordable housing regulations. um a certification was provided to us. The mayor signed it and it was submitted in support of that application. So we are fighting against those regulations
in the Montville lawsuit. And finally we have our own um matter. Friday I have another hearing with a judge who will consider this. We are really reaching the point where we're very close to
resolution with fair share housing. Our biggest concern is the proposed development at the one Washington site remains more than we find acceptable for that site. They have proposed a number
of units with insufficient parking with insufficient setback with insufficient circulation. John Sabbo and I have worked very hard to point out all the flaws in their plans. Um, you can't just pick a number and say that's the number
of units we want on the site. It has to work on the site. So, we'll continue to do that and if the developer does come forward with a plan that we find we can work with and live with, we'll bring it to you, but not sooner. Um, and we will
continue to battle that. I know Lori had some affordable housing stuff, too. Um, so everybody's got some affordable housing tonight. >> Thank you. >> You want to share yours? >> Um, if I if I may, please. Um, getting
receiving a lot of phone calls regarding the affordable housing units and how to sign up for them and etc. So, um, for those calling, I'm going to start taking names. So, I'll take their name and their information. Um, it is far off into the future, maybe
a year away, but I um will take your name and your information when that program is ready and the applications are available. I will reach out to everybody that um I've put on the list and direct them to the application and
all that stuff. So, if you call and ask about it, I will accommodate >> what I know at the moment. If you're done, >> I have a quick question. Can you just remind us how it worked with uh 204?
>> Um, >> how many applications were there? And was it like a a lottery type of situation? >> It's a lottery type situation. Um, >> and wasn't there like an abundance of applications? >> A thousand. >> A thousand applications or how many units for what? For 15 units.
>> 11. >> For 11 units, was it 17? I think it was that one was 17 was 17, but there was over a thousand applications. >> That's what I thought. That's why I wanted to point that out that I remember
it was in pure >> pure lottery and no preferences. Um, one of the things that that we're not allowed is a preference for the people who live here. Um, not allowed preferences for uh seniors, not allowed
preferences for veterans, not allowed preferences for the disabled, nothing. Nobody >> completely arbitrary now. >> Completely. >> Well, it's dictated by your income. >> I mean, you have to fall within the income and then >> Exactly. There's different categories.
So depending how they're going to designate those units, um very low, low, moderate, that's where that's how it how it goes is there's a bracket. There's there'll be a I think the 20 26 um income levels are out and posted. So
there's a criteria, but unfortunately, as Michael says, no preference to even Hawthorne, Pate County, anybody across the state. >> So just I just want to make this point. Thank you for that information. Absolutely. So we have three um we have
204 Wag that hadund was it 18 total >> 117 >> 117 total units for 17 affordable housing >> we there I'm trying to make is here is that >> those are true numbers
>> right so the state is pushing for affordable housing for 10% of the whole development the same thing's going to happen here at Ray Ronson >> you're going to have about 10%. It's about 10% or so. >> It's It runs at 15. >> So, this really has nothing to do with
affordable housing. This has to do with a developer making money and knowing that he has to he has to, you know, abide by the state requirements for Philly. I don't want anybody anybody to be under any other circumstances of knowing what's going on. This is actually what's going on. Let's stop
pretending. One the the two biggest faults I've ever had with the the Supreme Court's decision were one where they found a constitutional mandate where it didn't exist and two they anointed the builders as the water carriers for the poor that they thought
builders will be the people who will help those who are disadvantaged in finding housing. builders are interested in profit, >> right? >> Nothing else. And the Supreme Court somehow determined if we give builders
these extra credits in bonus, we'll solve the affordable housing problem. Well, the truth is the last numbers that came out according to the state was we need 90,000 units of affordable housing. Um, we're going to develop 34 of them
here. Um, it's it's it's sad. they'd say and what it does to um local resources is is really a shame. Well, well, well, there's a difference and I think we all have to be honest with each other between affordable housing, which I don't think anybody is against having
affordable housing, but now you're how it affects our community is it's overdevelopment because these these developments that they're putting in are nothing like what's happening in Hawthorne and we have to be honest about it. And I think there's a that's why a lot of people are upset about this. It's
just very sad that we we're kind of backed in the corner. We don't have a backout to this. Thank you. I just want to add two things that 90,000 units of affordable housing within the state that are needed really means >> 900,000
no more than that because actual units constructed it's 10 the 90,000 is the 10% now it's 20% >> so now it's it's >> so mathematically right so Horththornne having a 400 unit >> hill that we were handed for 10 the next
10 is 4,000 units built. They told us we have to do. It's not 400 units built. It's 400 affordable housing units, which equates to 4,000 units built. None of which is possible. We simply don't have it. No one's against affordable housing,
but the reality, again, I appreciate you breaking it down. Two things I want to highlight yet again, is just that we it's just not possible. We don't have the space. The reality as at previous meetings, um, Mr. Mr. Pasqual has annunciated the reality of what Horth
can actually do is 23 which still equates to 230 built units. I just want to clarify that that's the reality of what that means. Yes, there's other components to it. You can rehab to you know a property to get to that 23.
There are other ingredients thankfully. The other part that I wanted to annunciate which um our clerk can is the process and the decision-m the lottery doesn't happen within the town. It doesn't happen from the builder. It's an outside company. If you don't mind, would you just explain that to our residents?
>> Absolutely. Um outside agency, Piaza and Associates who handled um Royal Quarters on Royal Avenue and uh 204 Wagra properties. So, this is um what they do and they're the experts at it. Um it's a
big undertaking um but obviously we help and we help with the marketing. um and the applications and um those people I help those who need to do it by paper that can't do it online.
>> Um so there's a one one page simple questions of your income. >> You either qualify or you don't and then you're then given the full application and it goes in a lottery and you might
qualify. Um the units will be broken down again by category, low, very low, moderate. Um and then they um have a um virtual drawing, random drawing online
of all the applications that went in and pull out numbers. I'm sure it's, you know, you help the residents. everyone is trying to apply as much as you can, but I just want the residents to know that this is the company that handles from central Jersey up to North Jersey
all of these projects. It's not just Horththornne. Um it's a system that Lori is very um schooled at helping you with, but Horththornne has nothing to do with the decision- making. So, if you're not happy, we're not happy either, but we
have nothing to do with that decision-making process. I just wanted to clarify. I'm sure we'll do it over and over again, but it's an outside agency that does this for many, many, many towns throughout New Jersey. So, and and honestly, um
those that are seeking um these types of units are familiar with the process. It's not their first application, but um you know, they're sticking in there. You know, we all want to win Powerball, so we stick in there. >> Sure. It's got to be in a twin. But
yeah, it's it's sadly a game of chance. >> I thank you so much. >> Do all we can. Thank you. >> Any new business, Henry? >> No. Thank you, >> Bruce. >> No, sir. >> Reena, >> not tonight. >> Michael, >> no new business.
>> No new business. >> And I know the year. >> Okay, maybe streaming it. >> Show the video. We will turn to the admin agenda presented by Mayor Lane. >> Thank you, Mr. President. >> Nope.
>> This Friday night is the Chamber of Commerce Santa Parade at 6:00 p.m. followed by the Burrow Tree Lighting at approximately 6:45 p.m. Our entertainment this year will be Willie Wilson, members of the Hawthorne High School Dance and Theater School.
Wilbertton Avenue will be closed so that Santa can meet the children. There will be hot cocoa, cookies, ginger tea, all generosity donated by Remax and Bagel Express and Food Universe. All the
food trucks from GU Grill will be offering dogs and burgers for purchase. The Chocolate Box and Boy's Hogies will also be open. Let's celebrate the holidays together. Please take notice that leaves that
accumulate on the storm water grates block the flow of runoff increasing flooding and now with the cold weather a chance of ice. We would appreciate your assistance in keeping the storm water gates
clear of leaves. The toys for tot box will remain in the lobby at Burrow Hall until next Friday. Hawthorne is always so generous and I thank you all in advance for all the toys that you've donated. This weekend, Hawthorne High
School Theater presents Random Girls. Opening night is Friday at 7:30 with performances on sat Saturday and Sunday. There are so many events happening in December. I am going to refer to our website and my weekly letter for future
details. Many of you have asked about the Santa Run. Take that place on Saturday, December 20th at 2 p.m. And details can be found on the Haworth Fire Department Facebook page and on my Friday letter.
That's all that I have. I'm going to turn it over to our attorney, Michael Pasqu. >> Thank you. I did not ask about the Santa run in case because I thought running might have been involved. You go walk. I wasn't going to do it. Um, couple quick things. Obviously, we spoke at length
about affordable housing, so I'll spare you from further talk about affordable housing. Um, on your agenda tonight is a uh resolution. If Eric's going to report on this while I am u beating him to it,
we're we went out to bid for the uh acceptance of our recyclable materials. The bids were received. There were two bids. Um, there appeared to be some kind of infirmity in our bid process because one of the bids came back with numbers
and the other a formula which may or may not have yielded numbers. And there was some real concerns about how the bid was constructed and whether or not um it was properly bid. based on all of the
questions that were raised um in the process and our concern that we really weren't going to necessarily get a real ability to compare apples and apples. Uh it's my strong recommendation
that you reject all those bids tonight or both those bids. Uh we can go out to bid again. Right, Eric? and um hopefully we'll clean up whatever there may have been or whatever confusion. But the fact
is our goal is to create a fair playing field and get the best price we can for the residents. I'm not sure we did either in this process. So I again recommend voting in favor of the resolution rejecting all bids. Uh second
thing is I was in court Monday uh in the matter of Phil Spo versus Burough of Hawthorne. Um first I'll report that our attorneys assigned through the CHIF filed a motion for summary judgement
dismissing his complaint against us. The judge granted that motion. The judge found that Hawthorne at all times acted pursuant to court order that Hawthorne had the right to enter his property to remove rubbish from his front yard uh
because Judge Abdahi in Prospect Park authorized that and the court said the burrow is completely immune from lawsuit because it had a judicial order. So good news is his case against us was
dismissed. The better news is our case against him was not. So I will be um we had a preliminary conference with the judge on Monday. He set a firm trial date of January 13th. It was our hope to
get the property cleaned up before Christmas. Unfortunately, that would not be accommodated by this court schedule, but January 13th will be a trial date. At that time, I'll be appearing with um Mr. Marston, members of our police
department, uh, and whoever else we need to bring as witnesses with a plethora of pictures depicting the junkyard that is his property with a request that be we be allowed to go in there, clean it up,
and be allowed to place a lean on his property for that expense. Uh, it's just time this has to be brought to a head. And I was very uh very happy that Judge Delsardo gave us a pretty short turnaround in fairness about 30 days
from now. We will be trying that case. So if you want to show up, it'll be at uh 77 Hamilton Street in Patterson. Uh it should be fun. That mayor concludes my report. >> Thank you, Michael. And now turn it over
to our engineer, Joe Burn. >> Thank you, Mayor. uh the 2425 road program uh that includes streets such as uh 4th Avenue, Ethel, Annette, Woodland, Highest Drive, McKinley. Uh paving for the project has
been completed. Uh striping and signage is expected to be completed uh today. Um and DLS is set to complete remaining inlet work within the project limits this week and has been provided a punch list of remaining items to address
this week as well. Uh the 2425 local aid project uh which includes Hawthorne, Westervelt, Northwatch on Grand View. Uh paving for Northwatch on Grand View is expected to be completed this week. Uh paving of Westervelt has been moved to
the spring in order to complete the lead s the lead service line removal uh prior to paving so we don't start ripping up newly paved streets. and the paving of Hawthorne A has been moved to next spring in order for PSENG to complete
their gas line work. Uh the paving activities could affect the installation of the new main and the service lines. So um the Lafayette Streetcape Base 3 project, the uh red airport grade concrete as requested by PSENG has been
placed where the two conduits cross in the intersection of Garfield and Lafayette. Uh we're currently awaiting PSCG's approval, so powering the lights can proceed. Uh PSENG should be taking a look at it this week. Uh PSENG gas main service line project.
Um the gas service lines continue to be installed on Hawthorne Avenue from Washington to division and bless you. and uh installed along uh Keith Court from Hawthorne Avenue to the dead end of
the same road. Uh Gothal Hill emergency water man. Uh the work has been completed and final the final payment will be put in shortly. Uh the peach tree rehabilitation project. Um a pre-construction meeting was held
Tuesday of last week. The contractor will begin submission of submitts and shop drawings. Uh the first mill should be the SED utilization plan that will be reviewed by our office and uploaded to the NGI bank portal. Uh the Hawthorne Heights private
development uh tree removal has been completed and survey points have been marked out for inlet installation. The contractor has been made aware to stay diligent with regards to soil erosion control and silt fencing and has been installed for the plans
and Wagar fields two and three the bleacher improvements. Uh the project's complete maintenance bond is expected uh was expected yesterday. Uh our office is following up just to confirm that was received. Um and once our review is
complete of the same uh we will recommend final payment and release of the retainage. And that concludes my report. >> Thank you. And now I'll turn it over to our administrator, Eric Mau. >> Uh thank you, mayor. As I reported at last meeting, uh, bids have been
advertised for a 5-year contract for curbside collection of solid waste, recyclables, yard waste, and leaves to take effect April 1st. I've scheduled an optional pre-bid conference for prospective biders on December 11th. Bids are due on January 21st. Uh bids
have also been advertised to be received on December 18th for a 2-year contract for replacement and disposal of PAS treatment media to be used as needed over the 2 years. The 2025 fall tree planting contract is approximately 75%
complete. With any luck, you will have have a resolution on your December 17th agenda for a new antenna lease for the Long View tank. And before the end of this month, I intend to have completed a preliminary review and summary of the 2026 budget,
identifying challenges, but also possible actions to meet those challenges, which will be shared with the mayor, the next administrator, and eventually the finance committee. Unfortunately, the biggest unknown will still be the dollar amount for curbside collection, um the curbside collection
contract that I mentioned earlier. I apologize for my report uh being relatively short tonight and I can make up for it next meeting. Thank you. >> Thank you, Eric. Um at this time, Mr. President, I'll answer any questions
that the council may have. >> Joe question. >> Okay. >> Much going on at home. No. >> All right. Uh, I I did have two more questions related to affordable housing that I thought about, but since we were we were talking about old business, new
business really wasn't the right area. So, thank you, Council President, for allowing us to >> We went off the curb there a while, but >> we did, but thank you for allowing us to do that. It was an important uh subject matter. So, the two things I I'm curious that I don't have the answers to is what
is the cost of the affordable housing unit comparing to the typical unit? Do we know that? I know we had I know we talked about it once before >> the cost in other words how we assess it. >> No, no, no, no. The the owner of the of
the property is, you know, is now going to have like what does a normal unit go for in comparison to what the affordable housing units go for? >> It's hard to say cuz these are all rentals. >> It all varies. So what they do is they they it's they'll have one market rental different
like different kitchen cabinets different different amenities of that nature in the low income housing they have a lower grade >> right no I I I understood that I just didn't know what what what would the normal if you had to average it out what
would the average rent would be market okay so on the rentals it depends as lawyer saying there's three different categories There's just low, there's very low, there's low, there's moderate. >> Okay. >> Um, the very low, last I recall, the
rental was 6700. I hate to do that 67 thing, by the way. But, um, you know, it's a kid thing. The, uh, 6 or 700 8 under $800 a month. >> Okay. Um as you get to low income it
hovers around a,000 moderate 112 somewhere in that range >> and the market was >> market rates well I think in one project they were 2500 and for one bedroom right >> you probably won't qualify Mike >> that's not what I was asking for
Councilman Bennett but thank you for your >> your your unsolicited advice towards this um the the question I have again this is just curios capacity. Um, if somebody who has an affordable housing unit moves,
>> does the developer have to maintain that? How does that usually it's restricted? >> Yeah. Okay. I wasn't that's why I was asking you restrict all of them because there have been instances of people going >> see somebody in raising. >> Yeah. The whole thing. So, um, you have
to go you go right back to the lottery, um, where you actually draw a name for the next in line. >> Okay. >> So, >> thank you. What? >> While we're while we're talking about that, I just wanted to ask you a question, Michael, because in the past uh in another uh community where I
worked, they had low and moderate income, and I believe there was a a a law, not a law, but a requirement that the town had to maintain them for 20 years, and then after the 20 years, then
those units were turned back over to the town for market rate. >> Uh different. Those are purchases. >> Yeah, different towns have different uh results. We we are for instance deed restricting for 30 years. So at the end of 30 years they become market rate
units. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Any other questions? >> I I think I think that >> if I may um I'll be happy to email you I'll email all of you the 2026 breakdown the structure cuz it goes by county. It
also um goes by the number of people in the unit too to determine the the price >> the pricing. >> Okay. >> Income, number of occupants, um the size, studio, one bedroom, two
bedrooms, da da da. >> Okay. >> Thank you. >> You got it. >> Can I ask a question? >> Yes. About affordable housing. >> Yes. You're going to have question >> real quick. So if we do these developers
just say, "All right, I'm going to do for senior housing like the county just did like senior housing, affordable housing, can you as a developer just say this is going to be senior housing and I'm only going to take senior housings when they go to the lottery. Can you
like designate that solely for that?" Yeah, there is such a thing as senior only housing of a percentage, not all of your >> Oh, you can't do all. >> No, percentage of your affordable housing in the town as a whole can be
restricted to senior. There is you can restrict the whole thing, but it doesn't count towards your value. We're just designating that area as a senior unit, >> but not necessarily affordable senior unit, right? The whole property can be 55 and older if you will, but only a portion will be towards your
>> right. But I think what the council president is saying too is you can build as much senior housing as you want, but only uh 50 25% can be limited as affordable. >> Affordable. You can also do things um and would sometimes have considered
veterans housing where you not only limit the housing based upon a dollar figure but also limit that to veterans. That becomes a little diceier in the affordable housing realm, but some towns have done that and it's gone by as
approved. So >> um we we do look at these options for senior housing, veterans housing and the like because that that is uh >> you know >> there's a need >> there is there is in North Halen we're doing a number to I'm also the attorney
in North Halen for this. We're I'm just doing this to keep it going for uh Thank you very much Michael. >> Yeah we're doing uh several group homes for developmentally disabled persons. Um, but again, they do count towards your affordable housing count. So,
there's a lot of ways of addressing it. >> Bruce, any questions other than housing? >> Oh, no. >> I just But all right. Oh, can one property have a combination of senior and >> you can mix and match any way you wish. It's like ganimals.
>> That's it. No more. >> Anything else, Mayor? >> Yes, I do. Just one just one other thing that Councilwoman Leosa said. the the damage that was done at the 8acre woods. These were not young kids. These were
adults. Uh cuz the boulders that they did as far as breaking the entire decking down were huge. You you had to you had to be of a strong upper body in order to pick
these rocks up and and throw them down. And as as uh the council woman said, I don't know how anybody did not hear them. Uh but we are going to uh take uh additional action and uh for security
and uh hopefully that uh if that's the case, I already went over it with the police and uh we will u you know they they will be rebuilt uh and also other types of security that we're going to uh install.
I have nothing else. Mr. President, >> can I please have a motion to record the administrative agenda? >> So moved. >> Motion by Skier, second by Leosa. All in favor? I. >> Motion carries. Resolutions. So we have consent agenda MR4-25. R180-25
to R182-25. M4-25 is the install of a handicap space at block 53, lot 4. R180-25 is a chapter 159 budget insertion, the 2025 2026
municipal alliance grant. R181-25 is a 2026 annual council meeting schedule. And R182-15 is to reject bids for the marketing uh of recyclables for 2026 contract. Have a motion.
>> So move second. >> Motion by Bennett, second by Leosa. Any discussion? call. >> Waki, >> yes. >> Skiara, >> yes. >> Sasso, yes. Leosa, >> yes. Bennett, >> yes. >> Matthews, >> yes. >> Motion carries.
>> Reports of special counsel committees. We'll start with you, Miss Sasso. >> Okay. I have notes. Only a couple. One second. the
my want me to start the other way. >> Yeah, lost my paper. >> All right, Joe, we'll start your way. >> Just a reminder, the Hawthorne Fire Department companies one and three are selling Christmas trees at the pool lot. And I was wondering, mayor, if you wanted to make a comment about the uh
house fire. >> Sure. Thank you, Councilman. Um last week we had a uh very very bad house fire on Gel Road uh between Walbertton and Diamond Bridge. Um the
fire started it's a it's it was the oldest home in Hawthorne uh built in 200 years ago and um it started on one side of the house. Um not 100% sure how but it did start there. Um and um it just
spread through the house. It's a two family house and it's it spread through and with the construction uh most likely being balloon frame uh went right up the walls inside the walls and right up out
of the roof. Uh accolades to all the fire departments, ambulance corps, police departments, sheriff's officers who all were there uh putting out the fire, controlling the traffic and everything.
And it was uh it it was a shame because the uh one of the uh tenants there was a person who is in charge of our historic society in North and u I know that there was a lot of uh memorabilia that she had
there and it was uh you know it's a shame. I don't know the extent if anything was salvageable, but uh you know I I haven't had a chance to talk with her, but I'm going to give her a call and and just see what uh what if anything had and how we can help her. Um
I don't know the gentleman who was on the other side of the house, but uh I know he I don't think he was hurt at all. Uh but uh the the the fire department just did a fantastic job. They got there like within no time, but at that time it
was already through the roof. And um you know, like I said, they we had Horththornne, we had Glenrock, we had Prospect Park. Um we had uh several other other uh I think Hilden was there.
Uh and we had the sheriff's department there helping our police and helping, you know, control the crowd that was there. And uh it was uh it was a shame. It it was it it uh it was probably one of the worst fires that I can ever
remember in Horththornne in a long long time. Um but uh the firefighters of everybody who was there from different different communities and especially our community just did a fantastic job. I mean they they went
inside the house, attacked the fire inside the house. Uh, and then they eventually had to get out because the floors were getting a little uh shaky and we just uh the the the fire chief, Chief Sparanza, ordered everybody out
just so nobody could get hurt. Uh, and this way um you know they everybody got out and uh and then they they had a difficult time with with hooking up the u our our ladder truck. Uh, one reason was because they had high tension wires
right in front of the house going all the way up and down Gothal Road. Uh, but then they finally were able to uh work a a a situation where they were able to put the ladder up uh and instead of just shooting it crossways, they shot it down
because they were way above the high voltage wires. So, uh, you know, they they just uh they they did a great job. the chimneys on both sides of the house were were so weak they both they caved in and some of them some of the bricks
went went outside. Um the the the pictures were unbelievable um that I've seen and it's just uh it's a shame. It's a tragedy because number one, it was the oldest house in Hawthorne and number two, the the people who live there now
are displaced and uh you know, we we we probably lost a lot of memorabilia from uh Hawthorne and any other uh memorabilia that she had from, I'll say, the Civil War or the the
Revolutionary War or or or with everything like that. uh cuz she was a very uh avid uh collector and history buff. So uh thanks Joe for reminding me. Uh and uh you know the uh the lucky
thing is that nobody got hurt. The residents weren't hurt and um you know everybody uh everybody went home safe. The ambulance corps was there. uh Glenn Rocks Ambulance Corps, Midland Park's Ambulance Corps, uh and and everyone
just just did a fantastic job. They really did. Everybody listened to their officers as far as orders were concerned. There was no hollering and yelling. Everybody just got there, did their job, and um you know, just did a fantastic job. So, I just want to say
I'm very proud of of everybody who was there that fought the fire. >> I just want to say thank you for always being there. >> You're welcome, Joe. Um, thank you, mayor, for that report. Um, well, I have two reports. I'll be quick
as, uh, I can. Uh, the audience committee met, uh, earlier this week. Uh, we discussed some of the following issues. Um, one of the things that we talked about was, uh, changing uh, the court appearance required on tickets. uh where we specifically felt certain
tickets can be just payable at the at the window. Fine can be paid at the window. We also additionally discussed some fines. Uh we did the traffic already previous years but certain property maintenance and things like
that. Um so we we discussed the uh the actual uh fines on certain tickets. Um uh we also had a discussion about installing some solar powered lighted stop signs on certain intersections
throughout. Um and this is including Fab Avenue being one of them. Uh there was uh we're ongoing looking the the police and the administration are looking at uh everything to to look at public safety. Um we had also a discussion about uh
bike helmets for ebikes, scooters and the like and it's something that we're going to be moving forward with the city has uh in you know infinite wisdom has sold and it's you know in doing something. So we're going ahead and going to get going on that and we had an
initial discussion about illegal basement um you know that's table for another time uh right now. Um, and you know that's going to get more. Unfortunately, the mayor had it run out, so he wasn't able to be there for that part. And I know that was important for you. So, we'll address that again. Um,
so that that's the owners committee. We also had this carriage uh committee last night in the dark because because of the transformer that blew uh we all decided to stay, use our flashlights on our phones, put them on a table, and we
continue the meeting on. We not like the planning board that wasn't able to do that. Well, ours needs to be recorded. Our Yeah, needs to be recorded. That's what they tell everybody. Now, we didn't have any batteries. >> But anyway, we plowed through and um we
had what our discussion was about the post uh a post meeting about the event that happened um that we had on October 4th, the things that we like that we want to continue on, the things that maybe we want to adjust and adapt moving forward. Um, and we all agree that we
have to we have to meet more frequently uh to try to see what we can um there's more people that want to be part of the committee and we're very excited about what we have going on for future events. And this concludes my reports. >> Yeah.
>> Um just an update. Mayor and I went to the sustainable Jersey lunchon. We received our fifth time uh silver certification. So, we'll do a presentation in January. Um, and I'll hand back the plaque for the town. Um, so we're good for 3 years. Apparently,
next year they're they're taking a pause and they're re-evaluating the entire program. So, there will be no certifications next year. So, ours we're qu 3 years, so it doesn't really matter to us. We'll just have to see what they
do next. So, stay tuned. Thank you. Bruce Henry. >> Yes. The um board of education had their meeting and um they would like me to announce that on December 17th at Roosevelt School they are having their
trips marketplace event from 6:30 to 8:30 where the all fifth graders from town are selling their wares. It's a cash only event and I tell you it's really adorable. everything they're selling that has been made by their own hands and I encourage everybody to go
and um help the children fund their banks and support their creativity. It's really a nice event. Um and I'm pleased to share with you that um board of education trustee Jenner Trout um and myself, she's our council leas. I am um
our board of education um liaison. um we've committed to meeting monthly to keep each other a breast of what's happening on both DASes and to uh bridge a nice open line of communication and working together um ongoing in the future. I I look forward to working with her. Um also I'd like to announce that
mayor and council are sponsor sponsoring a holiday home decorating contest. Um the flower will go out this Friday with mayor's newsletter and um I'm sorry it's December 18th. I made an error. Traps,
but the at Roosevelt school, forgive me, Thursday, December 18th. I just got corrected. So, moving forward, the holiday home decorating contest sponsored by mayor and council is going to be ongoing throughout the month. The
winners will be visited on December 23rd. It's ward specific. There will be four wards as we have throughout our town. Each ward council person and a resident will be your judges. There'll be an online um free registration app that you can log on register your house
and voting as well. All will be um available for uh viewing on Friday with Mirror's newsletter and it'll be on the B website. I'm excited for that. I think it'll be great for everybody to participate. So get your lights on everybody. Thank you very much. That's all I have to report.
>> Okay. Last night's planning war meeting as I mentioned before has been uh was cancelled and all events uh that were scheduled to be heard will be postponed until the 16th their next regular meeting. Chamber of Commerce Santa is this Friday night. They'll be lining up
on Freeland at 5:30 and the Chamber's company of the year dinner is on January 30th. This year's honores are Angelina's Deli and Salon TG. And that's all I have to report.
>> Mr. President, may I ask No, I just want to say one thing. At the last meeting, we had an older lady come and ask about uh uh what what can we do in the town to spark it up, get get uh get it going and
get some energy. Well, we had a meeting in our in my office uh and I asked uh the new president of the chamber of commerce and Marie Sasso, council woman to be there uh with myself and I invited the the lovely lady who was who was here
and Ellen and we had a great meeting and uh actually uh Ann Marie uh accolades to you because you and the lady took it over and uh from what I'm hearing they're doing great things and that's
what mayor be doing a lot of a lot of good things uh in the burrow. >> Thank you. >> She will get props. Absolutely. She's terrific. We're going to do a lot of great things together. So, thank you for that, mayor. >> Okay. Uh we have no correspondence, but
we have bills. Get a motion to approve the bills and forward them to the treasurer for payment. So, move motion by Sierra, second by Leosa. Any discussion? Roll call. Bennett, >> yes. >> Leosa,
>> yes. Sasso, yes. Skiara, yes. Wii stand on the fire department, yes. And all others. >> Matthews, >> yes. Motion carries. >> Comment and open the meeting to the public. Anyone desires to be heard, please raise your hand, come forward to the microphone. State your name, sir. Thank you very much. I'm Jack.
>> I just wanted to follow up on the last meeting toward the end. The president mentioned that we should come in. I don't think the mic's on. >> Okay, now >> the light is green. Aha, there you go. >> There we are. So, I'm Jack 319 Van
Winkle. Um, at the last meeting, the president asked us to tune in again this meeting to hear about things that are in the works for making um Fairview a little safer. I just wanted to ask for an update on that. The update is nothing is defined but the ordinance
committee met. We met with the police department, the administration. Uh some ideas have been formulated and now they're going to be verified with uh traffic engineers to make sure that what we want to do is do approved. Um hopefully maybe next meeting, you know,
depending on if the traffic engineer gets back to us. I was hoping to have it for tonight. uh but we did meet and uh we're also not just looking for a solution for one area like the uh I think you mentioned we're also addressing McFarland also at
the same time >> any steep slope is really what we're looking at and uh don't know exactly uh what's going to be approved by the DOT or traffic engineer but um we have a formulated idea what
we've got to do >> I appreciate that thank If you got an update, my additional comment might be is it possible to include pedestrian safety as a part of those conversations? I know the state u invited all the towns to become involved in a zero fatality
project uh for the entire state. We are looking at pedestrian safety also. A lot of what we're talking about is also speed control as well. Not necessarily just stop because if you can get somebody to slow down, maybe then they will stop, but if you're not going slow, you're definitely not going to stop.
Yeah, we're all in this together. And the other thing too is we're the police are still out there giving a lot of takes out uh along with uh Northw. >> That's also good to hear. Thank you. >> We did also get in touch with the GPS
companies. Not the answer you want to hear, though. >> I sent them letters. I got all all of the all of the addresses, sent them an email cuz they don't have they don't have a phone. And um sorry to take it
away from them, sir. But uh they sent back and they said, uh, you know, we're not doing anything. We're leaving everything the way it is. >> Yeah. It's very unfortunate that they you told them it was a fatality and trying not to have that ever happen again. and they felt no need to change
the routes new weight lists. So if you want to contact Google Maps, uh Tom, uh ways uh Apple, go for it. That's the way to do it. >> We contacted all
contact all of them and and they all said we're not planning on changing your routes. It's very sad. >> A letter was sent by my office probably a month ago. >> And the police department also followed up too. Don't you send letters to I had a similar request by email and got a
note back that said if I wanted to do it I could do it myself. They would be happy to include but I we would need to submit specific street lists maybe even have the GPS coordinates for the beginning and end of the of those streets but it is possible to work with
the database that they rely on. Well, so, uh, I mean, our traffic lieutenant reached out and and specifically gave him weight limits and and routes space to keep on county roads. So, um, then they said, "No, >> who's that person in traffic?"
Lieutenant >> Lieutenant Macowski. >> Okay, maybe I should reach out to him. >> Uh, you could, but with proper uh avenues to reach out to administration. >> Okay, I'll be in touch with you, Mayor. Fine. Okay, thank you so much for the report. Appreciate you very much, ma'am.
148 North Wong. So, first of all, the truck thing is really not working. Still on my street every day. They're there. I've seen a police officer in parked in the past month, maybe twice.
So, it it's not good still. So the no left turns are not working. >> The left turn forget about now. I mean it's >> the coming mostly concerned. Yeah. >> And so that just not working. But so my main thing is with all these apartments,
the main thing I'm hearing from people is what about the school systems? Where are we going to put all these kids that are going to be in these apartments? >> Well, let me explain that to you. >> I mean the short version. All the studies that they've done in other developments, when you're charging
$3,500 a month, you're not really getting a lot of kids in those apartments, they said the amount for that project would be five five kids. In other department, other developments, as much as I hate to admit it, they
they've been pretty darn close. Now, Lafia Hills was a little bit different cuz that was a lower rent point and you that was for sale items and you did end up with a little bit more kids in there because it was a purchase item. Seems like if you charge enough in the rental unit, you scare the young family away
because they can't afford that and having a kid. >> Um, so I've seen the the things on Facebook talking about, you know, all the kids. >> Yeah. >> Based on history, they're not going to show up. >> Okay. >> I hope they don't. Yeah, we we've uh if
I could have cancelled too in North Taylor that I've been the planning board attorney 33 years all of those town houses that were built up there that the developers came and said there will be 10 kids, five kids, whatever. There are literally
49 school kids in 2,000 units of in North Hen just 49 kids. literally ran at the 5% off by one. Uh but it ran at the 5% they
predicted and Mayor George said the same thing. He said, "I didn't believe them when they said it." >> But it's the absolute truth. And so if you know the number of kids at 204 wag um you're just not getting them. >> Can I comment on this?
>> Sure. >> Um this was a concern of mine back when they built the Central Avenue. Uh I was on the schoolboard at the time and that was a pretty big development and I did a little research and the DOAS used something called the Ruckers study. So
Ruckers I guess formulated a study saying based on size of units and how many you're going to have it's going to allocate this many kids and I was you know I was suspect. I I you know I didn't believe it. Unfortunately it's true. And if you look at you look at the
high you look at the uh school district they did not have an influx of a population growth. Their population has been between 23 and 2500 for at least the last 10 years. >> That's great. >> So listen I I'm still I'm still
cautious. Every time I hear that I'm like it's not good. But I know in previous ones it hasn't been as bad as we thought it might have been. >> Not good. sucks. We should maybe put that out there to everybody's uh complaining. >> You're never going to stop that, but that's okay.
Expression. >> Okay. Have a motion to close the public uh portion. >> Motion by second by Leos. All in favor? >> Motion carries. The last council meeting of 2025 is Wednesday, December 17th at 7
p.m. Have a motion to adjurnn. by second by Skier. All in favor? I motion carries or journ. Oh, that will be his life. Yeah.